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Filly
04-08-2010, 10:27 PM
With a heavy heart I post this thread.

This little girl my heart breaks for. If we can't find women when we have 100 clues how can anyone figure out who this child is?

MPO this little girl has on a sweater/dress way too big for her. The arm holes are too big. Unlike the little girl with her eyes closed it seems this little girl wasn't immediately taken care of. No less loved, but her hair is unkempt. Maybe God forbid Alcala had her and didn't take care of such things?

I see and this is me......I see a bruise on her mouth left hand side. Both bottom and top going up to her lip. Obviously she has a band aid on her little finger which is trying to keep her hair out of her face. Her other hand? This photo is cropped.

Knowing Alcala slapped Robin so hard in the car he chipped some of her tetth it just makes me think maybe he slapped this child on her mouth to quiet her? I hope not. I see nothing innocent here. I see a child that looks not afraid, but almost dazed. She has bags under her eyes like she hasn't slept, and was maybe crying.

Who are you little girl? Please be alive and safe.


http://cnnnancygrace.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/00263.jpg

reasypeasy
04-08-2010, 10:46 PM
Obviously at some stage someone cared enough for her to put a bandaid on a boo-boo.

I wouldn't automatically assume it is 100% likely that she wasn't cared for just because she is wearing baggy clothes. Some kids who are on the autism spectrum (even if only mildly) have sensory issues and can't stand some types of physical sensations at various points on their body, such as neckline or underarms or waist. It can be very difficult to dress such a child in a socially acceptable manner, and often parents end up washing the same set of clothes every night. Of course searching for missing autistic kids from the 60's and 70's is unlikely to bring much joy, because back then there was less understanding amongst doctors, teachers etc about it being a spectrum of diagnoses that could include rather mild cases.

If she was a little autistic that might explain her curiously detatched expression despite all the apparent bruising on her face?

And she appears to be wearing that horrid lilac eyeshadow so many of Alcala's photos feature, as well as having some bruising.

Bargle
04-09-2010, 07:11 AM
Here's the picture.
http://cnnnancygrace.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/00263.jpg?w=500&h=732

Donjeta
04-09-2010, 07:32 AM
Was Alcala ever known to take off his victim's clothes and dress them up in outfits of his own choosing?

I wouldn't necessarily take her clothes as evidence of her being uncared for. The hem is a good length and neckhole isn't huge. The seam of the neckline looks a bit uneven and the shirt might be handsewn. Possibly a hand-me-down from her siblings and got a bit baggy for lots of wearing. Maybe a gift that wasn't a perfect fit to begin with. Sometimes parents and grandparents buy clothes for their children without the child being there to try it on first and it might not always be a perfect fit. Lots of possibilities. The hair is windblown but depending on the weather and the location it might not be a miracle.

However, I worry about her face, the apparent bruising. It looks like she could be in about to get a black eye too.

How old do you take her for?

Herding Cats
04-09-2010, 09:36 AM
Can I just mention that I'm not sure that's bruising you're seeing, but rather a child who's a bit dirty? She looks like a rough-and-tumble one (like I was), and she is none too clean elsewhere...so I'm thinking she just got some dirt on her face (if I'm seeing the same spot you're looking at). And she does look like she needs a good nap, but sometimes, it's hard to bring in a child for one when the play is good.

I am thinking she's about 4-5...

Best-
Herding Cats

Bargle
04-09-2010, 11:02 AM
Can I just mention that I'm not sure that's bruising you're seeing, but rather a child who's a bit dirty? She looks like a rough-and-tumble one (like I was), and she is none too clean elsewhere...so I'm thinking she just got some dirt on her face (if I'm seeing the same spot you're looking at). And she does look like she needs a good nap, but sometimes, it's hard to bring in a child for one when the play is good.

I am thinking she's about 4-5...

Best-
Herding Cats

Agreed. This may well have been her play clothes. Something her parents weren't worried about getting dirty or worn. The bruises might be from play, not anything Alcala did. I think she might be a year or 2 older, but I'm no great judge of child ages.

Billylee
04-09-2010, 12:28 PM
I'm thinking this might be a little boy. Long hair on boys was very popular in 60's and early 70's.

amandab
04-09-2010, 12:37 PM
Is that a hint of green shorts/pants/bottoms I see?

OnlineInstructor
04-09-2010, 02:06 PM
My take on this picture (I have three children):

Child is playing outside and has a dirty face. Children tend to get dirty around the mouth area. Saliva and dirt--you get the picture.

Child is wearing light-green shorts/pants.

Shirt may be a hand-me-down, therefore a bit too big. My children have plenty of those.

This could be a girl or a boy.

The position of the child's left hand bothers me. One thought, maybe this is a boy that is urinating? My son has been known to do this outside. :blushing:

Mr. E
04-09-2010, 03:31 PM
I posted before that I think that this child looks like missing child Kurt Newton:
http://www.find-missing-children.org/Posters/poster147.htm

However, I'm not convinced the yellow-shirted child is a boy...the way the child is holding its hand to brush away hair is very feminine to me.

I see a child who reminds me of myself as a kid: a bit grubby, wearing playclothes, face dirty from some recent snack. I don't see the bruises others have mentioned. It looks like a kid caught playing outside.

The comment about the placement of the child's hand, as if it is a boy urinating, made me feel compelled to post Kurt's poster again.

Wendy101
04-09-2010, 03:36 PM
I think the nose looks similar..

I posted before that I think that this child looks like missing child Kurt Newton:
http://www.find-missing-children.org/Posters/poster147.htm

However, I'm not convinced the yellow-shirted child is a boy...the way the child is holding its hand to brush away hair is very feminine to me.

I see a child who reminds me of myself as a kid: a bit grubby, wearing playclothes, face dirty from some recent snack. I don't see the bruises others have mentioned. It looks like a kid caught playing outside.

The comment about the placement of the child's hand, as if it is a boy urinating, made me feel compelled to post Kurt's poster again.

Wendy101
04-09-2010, 03:45 PM
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=1178&pictureid=10015http://www.websleuths.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=1178&pictureid=10016

this tip of the nose and the top lip??

OnlineInstructor
04-09-2010, 04:48 PM
I posted before that I think that this child looks like missing child Kurt Newton:
http://www.find-missing-children.org/Posters/poster147.htm

However, I'm not convinced the yellow-shirted child is a boy...the way the child is holding its hand to brush away hair is very feminine to me.

I see a child who reminds me of myself as a kid: a bit grubby, wearing playclothes, face dirty from some recent snack. I don't see the bruises others have mentioned. It looks like a kid caught playing outside.

The comment about the placement of the child's hand, as if it is a boy urinating, made me feel compelled to post Kurt's poster again.

His missing date doesn't fit the timeline for Alcala, due to incarceration.

carbuff
04-09-2010, 07:58 PM
If I remember correctly, that "horrid" lilac eyeshadow was in style in about 1973-74. She seems a bit young to be wearing eye shadow, though.

Her face looks young but that hand looks more like a second-grader's. Body shake is more like a five-year-old.

The clothes don't strike me as unusual -- play clothes, as somebody has pointed out. She looks like she might be tall and thin for her age, which might mean clothes that fit her lengthwise are too wide through the shoulders. My daughter had that problem when she was little.

I don't see bruises. Looks more like the remains of a chocolate ice cream bar. What I do notice that's odd is some kind of line on her cheek, along the cheekbone, on both sides. Like she's been wearing goggles for something?

Billylee
04-09-2010, 10:52 PM
His missing date doesn't fit the timeline for Alcala, due to incarceration.

Correct about the time line, however, for Kurt's sake, we should consider all possibilities. I think the pictures look a whole lot alike. The nose and lips to me are right on, just younger. The person (boy/girl) looks to me to be a least 5 maybe six YOA. If Kurt went missing when he was four, how do we know what he looked like when he was five or six?
I see something a little different about his right earlobe though, anyone else? A bit larger than normal? If we blow up the long haired picture can we see the earlobe? And then, if it could be Kurt, is that why someone let his hair grow, to cover the ear? Just thinkin' out loud.

carbuff
04-09-2010, 11:05 PM
This is probably way off in left field, but is this a childhood picture of the girl in the orange chair?

HockeyGirl
04-09-2010, 11:07 PM
The placement of the hand bothers me too.

I also see slight discoloration near her/his left arm not too far from the wrist.

Filly
04-10-2010, 11:32 AM
Firstly I want to say I in no way meant this little child was not loved. "Cared for" was the wrong choice of words. I'm a mother myself. I posted this immediately after looking at the little girl with her mouth open and eyes closed. I also thought if Alcala kept a child for a significant time he obviously wouldn't comb his or her hair or wash their face.

I took into consideration how kids faces get dirty playing. I was a kid myself. I took into consideration ice cream or candy. Why then is it only on one side of the child's mouth? If you look you can see something is also off with this baby dolls chin. Swollen. Again, after hearing how he hit Robin in the car in the mouth it made me think of this.

Child in the passenger seat. Her face would be the left side to the driver. Driver wants to shut the child up he backhands her. That would leave a bruise on your mouth up into your nose. I got backhanded enough as a kid to know where it hurts. Better known as "a smack in the mouth" by my mom. It's always to one side and ya get clipped clear up to the bottom of your nose.

Also I think the green and this is just me the green is the grass behind the child. Unfortunately I don't think this baby has on any bottoms. It's an ugly, evil thing to even fathom, but this is a man that murdered and mutilated children. I pray this baby was not one of them and I am wrong.

BTW, there is a little girl in a cold case that I thought looked exactly like this child. The timeline don't fit though. Also the child had curly hair. Very curly. Agree that it could also be a little boy, but I am thinking no.

Billylee
04-10-2010, 01:33 PM
On blowing up the picture, I don't think it can be Kurt, his eyes are listed as blue, and I'm pretty sure the unidentified child has brown eyes.

Filly
04-11-2010, 06:12 PM
Is that a hint of green shorts/pants/bottoms I see?

amandab, I do now see what you mean about the green shorts. I believe you are correct.

Meanwhile I spent hours last night looking at every missing person/child on so many sites and came up with nada. Maybe and I pray this is one of the people that has been identified as safe.

JoeFromLB
04-11-2010, 08:09 PM
I've wondered if this little one is the same blond-haired girl from a few years earlier. Could this be a family member (cousin or niece, perhaps?)

http://images.onset.freedom.com/ocregister/gallery/kz6ijm-kz6id30190.jpg

Donjeta
04-12-2010, 08:35 AM
What's that string in front of the little one's face?
A closer look here:
http://cnnnancygrace.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/01901.jpg

The person in the background is wearing blue shorts and a yellow top a bit like her: Girl with reddish hair and yellow top sitting in front of green wall. - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community
Probably just a coincidence because the arms look more tanned and I'm not sure the cut of the top is the same either. Just an observation.

brandi
04-12-2010, 09:22 AM
Looks like the person holding her up has a balloon string in their hand, probably.... M O O

carbuff
04-12-2010, 09:30 AM
Looks like the person holding her up has a balloon string in their hand, probably.... M O O

I agree -- the string is probably looped around the person's wrist. It seems to pass under the baby's underarm and drift upwards -- a balloon losing its helium will float slackly like that.

Billylee
04-14-2010, 01:24 PM
Someone mentioned that if this is a little boy, perhaps he was urinating by the location of his hand. I think you may be right, I just realized that's what's going on in this picture also:

http://cnnnancygrace.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/00841.jpg

Is this something that Alcala found "photo worthy"?

brandi
04-14-2010, 01:45 PM
Someone mentioned that if this is a little boy, perhaps he was urinating by the location of his hand. I think you may be right, I just realized that's what's going on in this picture also:

http://cnnnancygrace.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/00841.jpg

Is this something that Alcala found "photo worthy"?
To me, it looks like he is is just standing in an awkward position. You can see part of his hand, he looks too little to know to hold his P P to pee.
It also looks like all of the clothing is wet to me, as in, he's dripping from swimming...

Laece
04-14-2010, 01:46 PM
Someone mentioned that if this is a little boy, perhaps he was urinating by the location of his hand. I think you may be right, I just realized that's what's going on in this picture also:

http://cnnnancygrace.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/00841.jpg

Is this something that Alcala found "photo worthy"?

Not sure the younger boy in the pic you posted is urinating. It may be he was swimming in this outfit and water is dripping out to look like a urine stream, which happens to both boys and girls. Could also be he is wetting himself in the photo. As a former preschool teacher who has potty-trained hundreds, I've never seen a child this age stand up and hold himself to urinate.

Laece
04-14-2010, 02:00 PM
To me, it looks like he is is just standing in an awkward position. You can see part of his hand, he looks too little to know to hold his P P to pee.
It also looks like all of the clothing is wet to me, as in, he's dripping from swimming...

Not sure the younger boy in the pic you posted is urinating. It may be he was swimming in this outfit and water is dripping out to look like a urine stream, which happens to both boys and girls. Could also be he is wetting himself in the photo. As a former preschool teacher who has potty-trained hundreds, I've never seen a child this age stand up and hold himself to urinate.

Great minds and all that, lol.

Billylee
04-14-2010, 02:05 PM
To me, it looks like he is is just standing in an awkward position. You can see part of his hand, he looks too little to know to hold his P P to pee.
It also looks like all of the clothing is wet to me, as in, he's dripping from swimming...

Oh goodness, I'm not talking about the child in the diaper holding his PP and urinating! LOL Someone mentioned the picture this thread is about, the child in the yellow sweater here, if it is a boy, could be holding his PP and urinating and that's why the picture is cropped there. I'm just mentioning the little tyke (girl or boy) in the diaper looks as if he/she could be urinating also and wondering if that is something that somehow intrigued the photographer.

Laece
04-14-2010, 02:09 PM
Oh goodness, I'm not talking about the child in the diaper holding his PP and urinating! LOL Someone mentioned the picture this thread is about, the child in the yellow sweater here, if it is a boy, could be holding his PP and urinating and that's why the picture is cropped there. I'm just mentioning the little tyke (girl or boy) in the diaper looks as if he/she could be urinating also and wondering if that is something that somehow intrigued the photographer.

OH! LOL! Sorry for the confusion, then. :) No harm done!

dogperson
08-13-2010, 07:56 PM
This child just looks calm and relaxed to me, not like anything is wrong, with almost a little smile on the face. I think the smudges are just dirt & she/he is probably wearing playclothes which might be a little big because they maybe belonged to an older sibling. I don't know what to make of the left hand near the groin area. I originally assumed this was a girl but in looking more closely I'm not sure, I think I was going by the long hair. The shorts look green, which could also belong to a boy or girl but somehow the top looks more like an item of girl's clothing. This looks like an outfit I might have worn as a child in the late 70s, early 80s & I'm a girl.

punklove
08-13-2010, 10:01 PM
Can I just mention that I'm not sure that's bruising you're seeing, but rather a child who's a bit dirty? She looks like a rough-and-tumble one (like I was), and she is none too clean elsewhere...so I'm thinking she just got some dirt on her face (if I'm seeing the same spot you're looking at). And she does look like she needs a good nap, but sometimes, it's hard to bring in a child for one when the play is good.

I am thinking she's about 4-5...

Best-
Herding Cats

When I first saw this I thought that she must have had some chocolate ice cream or something and the area around her mouth was just dried ice cream..

Im still not sure about what it is on her face but thought Id share this - I took the photo of her in photoshop and clicked 'one step photo fix' which is a service they offer that 'fixes' the photo, this is used to make the photo as clear as possible.. Thats the only thing Ive done to her photo - Below.

http://i35.tinypic.com/21l94at.jpg

Sometimes I see things that arent there but with this photo it looks less like a dirty face, but who knows. Her facial expression doesnt look like one of a scared child (at least not to me).. I semi remember him giving some of this victims weed or some sort of drug, does anyone remember that?

Also, is that little mark on her left arm some sort of bug bite? Or is it a birth mark?

Around the bottom of her mouth and the corner is still kind of looks like it could be food.. but the area around and directly below her nose seems more like a bruise.

Im also unsure of whats going on with her lip - if you look at the corner of the left side of her mouth and directly below her mouth - it looks semi indented like a healed scar. The only type of scar (if it, in fact, a scar) was when a child fell off his bike and onto the pavement and had a tooth/teeth go through the lip.

Filly
08-19-2010, 03:21 AM
Punk Love, I just don't know. Thank you for doing that though with the photo.

There's something about this child's jaw line that looks way off to me. It may be the shadows? If it's not then the left side of her jaw is swollen.

Agree with you about around her nose. I hope we are wrong.

alllads
08-20-2010, 08:52 PM
This child looks very, very Danish to me.

dsntslp
08-20-2010, 09:15 PM
My grandson has been holding his own penis and standing on a bench at the toilet since he was two. FWIW

(Working strictly from memory when the pic's first came out) The background on this picture somehow reminds me of the same background as the blond woman standing outside pouting, almost in tears and defiant looking...blue dress I think, not sure.

I don't know why, all I see behind the lil' girl is green but could this be the womans child?

Also, fwiw, it appears to me she has been popped in the mouth also.

carbuff
08-20-2010, 09:16 PM
This child looks very, very Danish to me.

Some of the other photos were identified as having been taken in Denmark, so that's quite possible.

Filly
08-21-2010, 03:32 AM
Also, fwiw, it appears to me she has been popped in the mouth also.


Me too.

alllads
08-21-2010, 06:54 AM
Some of the other photos were identified as having been taken in Denmark, so that's quite possible.

Yes, I had read, and I feel strongly that this child is also Danish. I wonder if the two Danish women that have already been identified would recognize this child? If they had ever seen him/her with Alcala. I think this is more likely to be a little girl but it's hard to tell.

dsntslp
08-25-2010, 01:51 AM
I was wrong. This little girl can not belong to the lady in the blue dress. The lady in the dress has been found alive.

plait
01-30-2011, 11:25 AM
Here's the picture.
http://cnnnancygrace.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/00263.jpg?w=500&h=732

Honestly, the pics outdoors do not really bother me as much as those indoors. I just think this child was at the playground and RA took a pic of this child. Those look like play clothes, and she looks like she had been eating ice cream. I don't think she would be at the park without an adult.

Filly
01-31-2011, 12:01 AM
Why did I click on that photograph again?

I know I am the only one, but I still think this little girl was hurt.

What I see is a bruise on her left side from her nose down to her mouth. Then the same side a bruise from the left side of her lip.

The jaw maybe that is the lighting/shadows, but I think her jaw looks way off. JMO I thought this I believe even before reading more about what he did to Robin. He popped her in the jaw while he was driving. That would make it the left side of her face.

WildHuncher
02-01-2011, 10:45 PM
She seems to be smiling a little. Girls that age aren't very good at masking their emotions and don't try much, so she's probably OK at that point.

His interest in her was pure evil, but he probably couldn't do any more than take the picture.

norest4thewicked
02-01-2011, 11:04 PM
I personally think that ALL of the photos taken of people outside were pure trolling or trying to set himself up to LOOK like a professional in case he saw a woman he wanted to lure into his lair. The exception of this would be the back bend person and the other girl with short black hair that he was in the woods with. To me, the woods would still be a very intimate setting that he could do what he wanted in.

We have to remember that although this guy was an amateur photographer and he was also a serial killer, it didn't mean that every photo he took was of a victim. He probably took photos as a hobby long before he ever actually acted on his urge to kill. A lot of the people outside are more likely ones that he just came upon and took their photos for practice.

I think that even the Farrah Fawcett haired woman who looks downright PO'd in the first photo seemed to be mad that he was aiming a camera at her. It does look like he got one at least either before or after she decided she didn't want her picture taken.