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Kimster
07-07-2010, 11:42 AM
Those who have posted with me in other forums might know that I am intrigued by the body language and psyche of people involved in cases. Because we relaxed our sleuthing practices on TH yesterday, I'm looking forward to a discussion on TH's body language in the first presser.

Here's the link: http://www.kgw.com/video/featured-videos/Kyron-Horman-family-speaks-publicly-for-1st-time-96171744.html

Note: I was able to quickly go to Kyron's case calendar to find what I was looking for. If you haven't checked it out yet, Butterfly has been doing a great job keeping it up to date. Everyone is welcome to add to the calendar! Here's the link: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/calendar.php?s=&month=6&year=2010&do=&c=10

Kimster
07-07-2010, 11:44 AM
I have a lot of thoughts about TH's body language. The one thing that stuck out to me right away the first time I watched the presser was that she seemed to be "consoling" everyone rather than be upset about Kyron!

SleuthyMama
07-07-2010, 11:48 AM
Thanks, Kimster.

It was her body language at that first presser that set my mind into overdrive. There are some still photos from it that immediately made me think she was "fearful" more than anguished or upset.

There was also a moment where it appeared to me like she was sort of looking around, with her eyes only, as to the behavior on either side of her (Desiree and Tony on one side and Kaine on the other) and trying to mimic it.

That one pic where Kaine has his arm around her and her head is on his chest and she is looking upward...that is the one pic that has continued to haunt me since the beginning. It's like her face is saying "Oh please no, don't let anyone figure out that I had anything to do with this."

I can't explain why her facial expression says that to me. It just does.

Kimster
07-07-2010, 11:55 AM
Thanks, Kimster.

It was her body language at that first presser that set my mind into overdrive. There are some still photos from it that immediately made me think she was "fearful" more than anguished or upset.

There was also a moment where it appeared to me like she was sort of looking around, with her eyes only, as to the behavior on either side of her (Desiree and Tony on one side and Kaine on the other) and trying to mimic it.

That one pic where Kaine has his arm around her and her head is on his chest and she is looking upward...that is the one pic that has continued to haunt me since the beginning. It's like her face is saying "Oh please no, don't let anyone figure out that I had anything to do with this."

I can't explain why her facial expression says that to me. It just does.

Right around that time, her eyes were blinking a lot. We need to see what that might mean? I've never seen that before and wonder about that also.

gibby207
07-07-2010, 11:58 AM
When being consoled by her husband, she looked up and she seemed to me to be pleading for her husband to "believe her." She had pleading eyes to me. Also was the only one of the group who kept looking at everyone else so I was guessing she was monitoring their reactions, trying to copy.

PortlandMama
07-07-2010, 12:02 PM
I see some self soothing: arms crossed in front of stomach in a kind of hug, rubs one arm with her other hand/thumb while Kaine is speaking. I notice she doesn’t wipe her eyes, but does wipe her nose at one point, so to me she doesn’t appear to be trying hard to look like she’s weeping but may have some tears causing her nose to run. When Kaine returns from the podium, she opens her hands and moves into him as if she expects him to hug her, but he does not, so she is left awkwardly reaching for him and just as awkwardly putting her head on his shoulder. Painful to watch. When she side-hugs Desiree and looks up at her, that is pretty painful to watch too. I don’t think she is acting as though she is guilty (necessarily), but she does seem very self conscious. In all fairness, at the time it was quite clear already that the community’s suspicion was falling on her (comments on the local sites have been scary!), so she is probably second guessing how she is coming off, even if she has nothing to do with it. :twocents:

I think I’ve seen a longer version of this video somewhere, which includes the entry and exit?

dartemis
07-07-2010, 12:03 PM
I agree with the above posters. She kept looking at bio parents for clues on how she should behave. Nothing authentic was emanating from her. I also thought she was a bit over-the-top when she threw her arms around everyone's shoulders like a coach and then around Kaine's waist in a rather intimate "for-the-cameras" huggy moment. I briefly lost my children when they were little and there is no way I could have made those body movements. I felt weak, as though punched in the solar plexus and wanting to grab my stomach and double over. I notice Desiree had that kind of posture at the first presser...leaning a bit forward with her hand on her stomach. You are completely inside your own mind in that situation and unaware of other people around you. You are overtaken with a primal fear. As such, you're eyes would never dart around, rather, they would stare straight ahead or slightly downward...looking at nothing because the focus is inside your head. Your arms would be almost useless...they would certainly not have the strength to throw themselves around other people's shoulders or waists and you would absolutely not be cuddling-up with your hubby like you were at home on the couch watching a sad movie. You are completely alone in this kind of terror...you are living this horror, not watching it.

FaerieB
07-07-2010, 12:04 PM
Rewatching that video made me remember why I was suspicious of her from that moment on. I see her looking at the other family members and trying to mimic their reactions. I see her either 'trying too hard' to console others or guarding herself by crossing her arm in front of herself. To me, it shows 'consciousness of guilt.' JMO

captivagrl
07-07-2010, 12:04 PM
It looked to me like she was watching the others so she could copy their behavior.

matou
07-07-2010, 12:05 PM
When being consoled by her husband, she looked up and she seemed to me to be pleading for her husband to "believe her." She had pleading eyes to me. Also was the only one of the group who kept looking at everyone else so I was guessing she was monitoring their reactions, trying to copy.

Her upward looking eyes indicate fear to me but fear that she not be discovered. She looks clearly afraid but whether it has to do with fear for Kyron's safety is not clear to me.

pharmchick
07-07-2010, 12:06 PM
Right around that time, her eyes were blinking a lot. We need to see what that might mean? I've never seen that before and wonder about that also.


Found a really amazing article from the American Psychological Association about research into just that: Psychological Sleuths - Detecting Deception (http://www.apa.org/monitor/julaug04/detecting.aspx) (http://www.apa.org/monitor/julaug04/detecting.aspx)


They warn readers that detecting deception is an inexact science, but note an association between lying and increased pupil size, an indicator of tension and concentration. Second, they find that people listening to liars think they seem more nervous than truth-tellers, perhaps because their voices are pitched higher. And liars are more likely than truth-tellers to press their lips together. On the other hand, they note, liars don't appear to be more fidgety, nor do they blink more or have less-relaxed posture.

BBM. I don't know if this applies only to people who are telling lies, like during an interview or something, or people who are just practicing deceptive emotional practices... I'll have to go back and look at Terri's photos from the pressers to see if she's displaying any of the signs mentioned in the article.

Astrella613
07-07-2010, 12:15 PM
She looks like she has guilt. Kind of reminds me of a little kid that has done something wrong and wants to be hugged and consoled and told that everything is okay and she is still loved. At first I thought she could have guilt just because she was the last person to see him but now that we are finding out more things about her maybe it's more than that.

debs
07-07-2010, 12:15 PM
The woman looks sucker punched.

cypress
07-07-2010, 12:19 PM
Reading her body language at the time is tough for me, because if she is innocent, I can explain her body language by way of guilt for being the last parent to see Kyron alive. Who knows what may have been said to her prior to the press conference -- why didn't you walk Kyron to class, did you harm him, etc. And, if she is innocent, it would make sense that she was fearful or fidgety or overly comforting/helpful. Regardless of the outcome of this case, I think Terri is probably a fidgety and overly helpful person by nature, and so some of that may have bled through at the press conference.

Whenever I want to judge someone in this situation, I think of Ed Smart who I believed, at the time of Elizabeth Smart's abduction and up until the day she was found, was guilty as sin. His voice was high pitched, he was fidgety, his grief to me seemed insincere, the pubescent daughter disappeared from inside the home -- all the signs were there! I was obviously wrong.

WideOpen
07-07-2010, 12:26 PM
New here and appreciate all the time you all dedicate to Kyron and others.

I noticed that she does not look up to the audience like the other 3. Almsot on cue the 3 parents look up to acknowledge the community. She does seem uncomfortable.

heartfortruth
07-07-2010, 12:28 PM
I am so glad this topic was brought up; I had been wanting to say something about that day when TY and Kaine spoke and how TH came across to me. At the time , I did not have any idea that attention would soon focus on her but my eyes were drawn to her for some reason I can't explain and the one view that stuck with me is not on this particular video;it must be on the longer one that another poster mentioned. I'm going to go look for it because I want to see if it still strikes me the same way.
I would describe it , best I can , as a "furtive" look.......and it was just for a very short moment....anyone else know what I'm trying to say? :help:

If this is not an acceptable post PLEASE delete it fast. Thanks

WideOpen
07-07-2010, 12:34 PM
The arms crossed across her front being held still points to her trying to control her own body language. Interesting.

I am still on the fence~and being new I have a hard time believing any one could hurt a child.

shorty42404
07-07-2010, 12:34 PM
Right around that time, her eyes were blinking a lot. We need to see what that might mean? I've never seen that before and wonder about that also.

I don't know if this would help or if it's a legit source but I thought maybe some of you interested in reading body language might find it helpful:

http://www.positive-way.com/body.htm

Specifically the second paragraph about "the eyes communicate.."

Here's another link about body language:

http://www.blifaloo.com/info/lies.php

waltzingmatilda
07-07-2010, 12:37 PM
Great thread Kimster! I am glad to now have a discussion on this subject.

I noticed the difference in TH and DY's behavior at the first presser. My first thought was that she was consoling KH and DY because she was the last person seen with Kyron and felt a degree of guilt because of that fact. There was a look of panic in her eyes or something, she just seemed physically jittery, IMO.

I have re-watched the video a few times and I have zoned in on different nuances of her body language each time. She looks very much the outcast who is trying to ingratiate herself into the 'fold'. Her overall 'look' to me is one of......"Oh shizz!" It seemed to me as though she was preoccupied with her own thoughts the whole time but I won't speculate on what those thoughts could be.

Funny how I don't pick up on things til the second or third time I watch these presser vids.:waitasec:

wm

MOO

Emma Peel
07-07-2010, 12:38 PM
I feel like it's cheating to examine body language "after the fact" as my observations are now prejudiced.

It seems I rather failed the first go around. I just thought she was acting nervous and concerned about everyone else, and feeling just terrible that she didn't walk that child into his classroom that day. I also attributed her relative attentiveness to (okay don't mess up your screen now...) Terri being a "giver-type". :blushing:

LOL.

But it sure is interesting. :D

arielilane
07-07-2010, 12:44 PM
I have a lot of thoughts about TH's body language. The one thing that stuck out to me right away the first time I watched the presser was that she seemed to be "consoling" everyone rather than be upset about Kyron!


Thanks, Kimster.

It was her body language at that first presser that set my mind into overdrive. There are some still photos from it that immediately made me think she was "fearful" more than anguished or upset.

There was also a moment where it appeared to me like she was sort of looking around, with her eyes only, as to the behavior on either side of her (Desiree and Tony on one side and Kaine on the other) and trying to mimic it.

That one pic where Kaine has his arm around her and her head is on his chest and she is looking upward...that is the one pic that has continued to haunt me since the beginning. It's like her face is saying "Oh please no, don't let anyone figure out that I had anything to do with this."

I can't explain why her facial expression says that to me. It just does.


Right around that time, her eyes were blinking a lot. We need to see what that might mean? I've never seen that before and wonder about that also.


When being consoled by her husband, she looked up and she seemed to me to be pleading for her husband to "believe her." She had pleading eyes to me. Also was the only one of the group who kept looking at everyone else so I was guessing she was monitoring their reactions, trying to copy.

I have waited for this thread...I have noticed all of this. I too have noticed that she was in fear for yourself not for dear Kyron. Her body language speaks volumes to me. How very sad it was and still is to see her on the video.

PortlandMama
07-07-2010, 12:49 PM
Found a really amazing article from the American Psychological Association about research into just that: Psychological Sleuths - Detecting Deception (http://www.apa.org/monitor/julaug04/detecting.aspx) (http://www.apa.org/monitor/julaug04/detecting.aspx)



BBM. I don't know if this applies only to people who are telling lies, like during an interview or something, or people who are just practicing deceptive emotional practices... I'll have to go back and look at Terri's photos from the pressers to see if she's displaying any of the signs mentioned in the article.

Great article. Thank you. :cool:

Beatrice
07-07-2010, 01:05 PM
I consider myself a very good reader of people's words and actions.
In my opinion..Terri carries the answer to what happened to Kyron.
(I believe another is involved with her...Both were seeking a big money payoff)

From the first presser:

No tears from Terri
Not a word from Terri yet
Blank look, stare
Recalling another place & time
The deer in the headlights look
Feeling left out of things at presser
Holding Kaine like a child
Trying to shield her face/disappear

I believe it will come out that she has quite a past (and present)
with alcohol, drugs & emotional stability.
I see alot of Addictive/Obsessive Compulsive traits. She's trying to be the PERFECT wife, mom, etc. When she falls short, she lashes out in rage and use of alcohol/drugs. Her physical appearance tells me she abuses alcohol at this time. She may have been abused as a child & is repeating this pattern with her own children.

If it wasn't for the Sauvie Island cell pings...She would not be looked at this closely.

Again, just my opinion.

sherbetjello
07-07-2010, 01:12 PM
Those who have posted with me in other forums might know that I am intrigued by the body language and psyche of people involved in cases. Because we relaxed our sleuthing practices on TH yesterday, I'm looking forward to a discussion on TH's body language in the first presser.

Here's the link: http://www.kgw.com/video/featured-videos/Kyron-Horman-family-speaks-publicly-for-1st-time-96171744.html

Note: I was able to quickly go to Kyron's case calendar to find what I was looking for. If you haven't checked it out yet, Butterfly has been doing a great job keeping it up to date. Everyone is welcome to add to the calendar! Here's the link: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/calendar.php?s=&month=6&year=2010&do=&c=10

Things to take into consideration with body language:
1. mental conditions that could effect posture, ie. autism, aspergers, etc. etc.
2. irregular muscle mass and bone structure in the body (irregular, but normal. i.e. = bone spurs on feet, corns on feet.)
3. deterioration of muscle due to over extension.. i.e. body building, plastic surgery, etc. etc.

It is true that communication is done 90 % this way, but there are people that do have bad posture and facial expression because of other things going on/with the body.

Misfitdolly
07-07-2010, 01:15 PM
Thanks, Kimster.

It was her body language at that first presser that set my mind into overdrive. There are some still photos from it that immediately made me think she was "fearful" more than anguished or upset.

There was also a moment where it appeared to me like she was sort of looking around, with her eyes only, as to the behavior on either side of her (Desiree and Tony on one side and Kaine on the other) and trying to mimic it.

That one pic where Kaine has his arm around her and her head is on his chest and she is looking upward...that is the one pic that has continued to haunt me since the beginning. It's like her face is saying "Oh please no, don't let anyone figure out that I had anything to do with this."

I can't explain why her facial expression says that to me. It just does.

What stood out to me was at one point (perhaps the same point where you point out she is looking around) she had her eyes closed and appeared to be quietly sobbing, then she opened her eyes and looked around without a grimace on her face, then she closed her eyes again and went back to the sobbing/grimacing face. It was like a switch turning on/off

sherbetjello
07-07-2010, 01:15 PM
Also, I really hope that people are not confusing EMOTIONS with BODY LANGUAGE.

Here are some insightful "tips" and knowledge on "body language" and emotion:
---------------------------------------------
Facial feedback hypothesis
Display Rules
The hypothalamus
The pituitary gland and emission of hormones...
Mayo Clinic: Performance-enhancing drugs.. (speculation)
Steroids and Neurotransmission (speculation)
---------------------------------------------
LOT'S of things to take into consideration.
This is why lie-detectors do not work (fail, inconclusive) on some people. Their brains aren't "normal" in accordance with the ideal testing. You, her, him and everyone is subject to it. We ALL are not made the same, doesn't mean that our outward projection can (in fact, unfortunately it is) or should be used against us.

jnTexas
07-07-2010, 01:20 PM
In viewing the video to me Kaine was already distant to her. I feel she used the presser to get comfort from him in that hug. To me He felt it was a must do to keep things looking normal in the media.

Charlie09
07-07-2010, 01:37 PM
I see someone who appears to be devastated, overwhelmed, uncomfortable, and unsure of her place.

Aedrys
07-07-2010, 01:50 PM
I am glad for this thread, for I have not felt good about her since that first presser, and I thought maybe I was overreacting. She really did seem like the outcast there. While everyone else was grieving for Kyron, she seemed to be grieving more for herself. I also felt like she wasn't as genuine in her emotions as the rest of the parents were. I kept comparing her to Tony, and out of the two of them, I felt like he cared a heck of a lot more for Kyron than TH did.

I know I keep going back to it, but she reminds me of when Casey gets upset, and it's Casey being upset about herself, not about what happened to her child. They both are thinking of themselves and how this is going to affect them, not about the fact that a child is missing or a child's life has be taken or how a child being gone affects the whole family and community. It's all me, me, me in every emotion and in their body language.

I truly felt KH, DY, and TY were there for Kyron, worrying more about Kyron and his safety then themselves, and TH was only there for herself and how Kyron going missing affected her. She was almost acting like he was gone for good and never coming back, whereas the other three were more worried about him being missing and finding him, not him being gone forever.

It's almost as if she was putting on the "act" of being a parent who lost a child and was acting the way she thought a parent that lost a child was supposed to act insteading of really being a parent who lost a child. If she really cared about Kyron, her grief shouldn't be an act.

cypress
07-07-2010, 01:53 PM
I see someone who appears to be devastated, overwhelmed, uncomfortable, and unsure of her place.

BBM

This is what stands out to me more than anything else.

azmama
07-07-2010, 02:45 PM
This is a topic I have been waiting for, I never brought it up, because I thought maybe I sounded super cynical and uncaring because of my thoughts on her body language.

I saw someone who looked like she was feeling tremendous guilt, as if she had done something terrible, or felt terrible guilt (for maybe having seen him last). The look on her face was also soooo scared, she not only seemed to be the "consoler", but also was clearly consoling herself, in the arm rubbing etc.

She also reached for Kaine when he came back from speaking, which was uncomfortable to watch, because it didn't seem to me that he reciprocated, or even wanted too. I also thought it was akward when TY was returning from the podium, and since Kaine had just stepped away, it would (could) be very natural for Tony to step between the two women, to comfort them both, but there is that weird "dance" before he takes his place on the other side of DY. It seemed he felt akward about standing between them and chose the other side of his wife.


She looks like she has guilt. Kind of reminds me of a little kid that has done something wrong and wants to be hugged and consoled and told that everything is okay and she is still loved. At first I thought she could have guilt just because she was the last person to see him but now that we are finding out more things about her maybe it's more than that.

BBM that is exactly the look I saw.


I noticed the difference in TH and DY's behavior at the first presser. My first thought was that she was consoling KH and DY because she was the last person seen with Kyron and felt a degree of guilt because of that fact. There was a look of panic in her eyes or something, she just seemed physically jittery, IMO.

I have re-watched the video a few times and I have zoned in on different nuances of her body language each time. She looks very much the outcast who is trying to ingratiate herself into the 'fold'. Her overall 'look' to me is one of......"Oh shizz!" It seemed to me as though she was preoccupied with her own thoughts the whole time but I won't speculate on what those thoughts could be.

Respectfully snipped. This too!

I feel like she was trying very hard to be a part of the group, this could be for more than one reason. *I* personally feel VERY uncomfortable in front of any sort of audience, for any reason. I have depression/anxiety/ocd issues and I feel like I display some of these behaviors even when I am accepting a certificate in front of other school volunteers! lol
I know I do the arm rubbing (arms crossed in front and rubbing my own arms), looking at other people instead of the audience, congratulating others, making eye contact with them instead of the audience, I sometimes think about other things... I can't believe I just admitted that to anyone! I don't do it on purpose, but I think to try and calm myself, so I am not thinking about all of the people staring at me!

While I was VERY suspicious of this activity coming from her even from this first press conference, they could also be explained away with other explainations.

Astrella613
07-07-2010, 03:23 PM
The body language of the others was interesting also. It seemed like the other three didn't want to be up there with her. Even Kaine, though he gave her a hug, sure seemed like his heart wasn't in it. Maybe that's why it took so long for them to appear, they weren't sure she wasn't involved. That's how it looks to me anyway.

gardeness
07-07-2010, 03:41 PM
My impression was that her actions were a combination of feeling guilty that she didn't escort Kyron all the way to his classroom (and, I think Desiree blamed her for that, simply from the way D would not reciprocate the hug) and empathy towards her husband and Desiree in, if she was devastated by these events, how devastated must they feel? I saw her as mourning and trying to comfort others simultaneously.

nursebeeme
07-07-2010, 03:42 PM
Terri Horman's body language was very strange to me.

She was folded into D and patting her on the shoulder... consoling her. So strange... I mean Terri was the last to see the child and lived with him the most.. Terri did not seem upset.. rather just posing up there. Posed like a plastic doll as D cried her eyes out and clutched her gut in agony. And might I add that D seemed to not be receptive of her hugs and pats. She was pulled away toward her husband and was trying to retain her composure in front of the cameras but she actually was pulled into herself and trying not to touch Terri Horman. It was almost like she was sickened... like.. don't touch me...

moo.

gardeness
07-07-2010, 03:42 PM
The body language of the others was interesting also. It seemed like the other three didn't want to be up there with her. Even Kaine, though he gave her a hug, sure seemed like his heart wasn't in it. Maybe that's why it took so long for them to appear, they weren't sure she wasn't involved. That's how it looks to me anyway.

IMO, Tony had a weird smirk on his face off and on...

TrY
07-07-2010, 03:57 PM
TH looked like she was trying hard not to look at the audience or the cameras but she would furitively take a peek, IMO, so she could look look down or at KH and look "concerned".

The hug that she gave DY was so odd, and DY didn't acknowledge her, then TH gave her a look that was odd to me -- like she was saying with her body "Why are you crying?"

My impression is that TH feigned sadness at that first press conference that had TY, DY, and KH.

If TH really was the last person to see Kyron, why didn't she take the opportunity to speak at that press conference?

Emma Peel
07-07-2010, 04:05 PM
1st Family Presser.
What's the body language for:

"I haven't slept in 14 days and I don't think the medicine they gave me is working because I feel like a wounded zombie walking in a cloud, please just give me my baby and let's everybody go home."

Because, they all had some of that body language going on. IMO.

They were exhausted and devastated. I suppose I'm wondering, at that particular point in time what other body language matters... Plus those that spoke, were on script.

IMO, the only one that seemed ready to participate at that point, with a presser and such public/official business, seemed to be Tony.

nursebeeme
07-07-2010, 04:25 PM
does anyone have the link to the second family pressor?

RoseCityGal
07-07-2010, 05:05 PM
I am so glad this topic was brought up; I had been wanting to say something about that day when TY and Kaine spoke and how TH came across to me. At the time , I did not have any idea that attention would soon focus on her but my eyes were drawn to her for some reason I can't explain and the one view that stuck with me is not on this particular video;it must be on the longer one that another poster mentioned. I'm going to go look for it because I want to see if it still strikes me the same way.
I would describe it , best I can , as a "furtive" look.......and it was just for a very short moment....anyone else know what I'm trying to say? :help:

If this is not an acceptable post PLEASE delete it fast. Thanks

Yes, heart, I know EXACTLY what you're saying. That same look struck me like a lightning bolt. Your description of that very brief look as "furtive" is perfect. To me, it seemed as though she was play-acting a role, and then, just for a quick moment, looking up "out of role" to see if she needed to adjust her play-acting in any way.

Several of the news organizations captured the moment as a still photo, and it almost looked like a truly evil look when isolated that way.

Thanks for your post - Rose

nursebeeme
07-07-2010, 05:12 PM
TH looked like she was trying hard not to look at the audience or the cameras but she would furitively take a peek, IMO, so she could look look down or at KH and look "concerned".

The hug that she gave DY was so odd, and DY didn't acknowledge her, then TH gave her a look that was odd to me -- like she was saying with her body "Why are you crying?"

My impression is that TH feigned sadness at that first press conference that had TY, DY, and KH.

If TH really was the last person to see Kyron, why didn't she take the opportunity to speak at that press conference? EXACTLY! what is missing is what should have happened but didn't! Very telling!

Donjeta
07-07-2010, 05:14 PM
Other posters have said most of the things I wanted to say but I noticed this for the first time today:

Terri stands between KH and DY and leans into DY. But when KH steps up to speak TH straightens and steps away from DY. It's as if she hung on to DY to get farther away from her husband, and when he moved she didn't need to any more.

nervous_nellie
07-07-2010, 05:23 PM
i think that kh, dy & ty's body language in response to th is what is the most telling that there is a reason to be worried about th...moo and all that

nursebeeme
07-07-2010, 05:23 PM
http://blogs.wweek.com/news/2010/07/07/kyron-horman-update-rdsqrl-lists-enter-a-murderer-book-just-weeks-before-boys-disappearance/

picture in this article... notice the facial expressions and how they differ between the two women. D is scrunched up.. upset, crying... T's face is relaxed... no scrunching.. no upset.. fwiw

shorty42404
07-07-2010, 05:28 PM
Off topic kinda, but don't want to start a new thread unless it would be of importance..

What about the postings by TH under rdsqrl and other aliases (though I don't think they were confirmed that it was her), I really am not taking either side about if TH is innocent or not until I get more facts but, why would she waste her time with these postings when her stepson is missing? And why defend herself so much? If my child were missing and I was being accused of being involved with his/her disappearance, yes I would maybe defend myself a little I guess but I would want the focus to remain on my child and who really was behind it.

Also, based on some posts I've seen here recently, I kinda wonder if TH is posting on here as well but maybe I'm sleuthing too much.

Anyhow about her postings, just doesn't seem like normal behavior in this situation.

AnaTeresa
07-07-2010, 05:38 PM
This is why lie-detectors do not work (fail, inconclusive) on some people. Their brains aren't "normal" in accordance with the ideal testing. You, her, him and everyone is subject to it. We ALL are not made the same, doesn't mean that our outward projection can (in fact, unfortunately it is) or should be used against us.

Very true - it's why I take analysis of body language with a grain of salt. I don't react "normally" at all, either. I have difficulty maintaining eye contact, will often self-soothe with my arms defensively across my body, etc. This is even more pronounced if I'm in front of people - even when I'm only mildly anxious about the situation. I'm sure people would have a field day with my normal quirks, if they were put on display.

I think TH's body language could go either way - innocent and feeling incredible guilt over the situation, or guilt for something that occurred. Since I'm not an expert in the area, I'm going to refrain from coming to any conclusions about her, her mental state, or actions she may have committed from her body language.

shefner
07-07-2010, 06:12 PM
I can say that Terri definitely was the one whose behavior stood out during the 1st presser. My mother, who has followed criminal cases for years, called me on the phone after that conference was televised and said, "Something is wrong with this stepmother." I was not that familiar with this case at that time. I started following it closely shortly after that call.....

AbbieNormal
07-07-2010, 06:22 PM
I don't know if this would help or if it's a legit source but I thought maybe some of you interested in reading body language might find it helpful:

http://www.positive-way.com/body.htm

Specifically the second paragraph about "the eyes communicate.."

Here's another link about body language:

http://www.blifaloo.com/info/lies.php

I noticed she kept her eyes shut a lot in the first presser, and remembered a bod language expert saying when Haleigh went missing and Misty Cummings did her interview with her eyes tightly shut as she talked, that closed eyes are often a sign of deception. Reason being its easier to NOT look others in the eyes when you are lying or being deceptive.
I thought DY looked like she would have rather been embraced by Bigfoot than TH, she almost seemed repelled by TH's arm around her shoulder and after there was a shift of all of them onstage, TH must have notice DY's did NOT want to be touched/ embraced by TH because TH no longer put her arm around her, rather stood alongside he w/ her own arms crossed across her abdomen. I thought her arms crossed at her abdomen was a vanity thing rather than the "punched in the gut" (as another poster described above) look that DY had. Like Th knew she was on camera and wanted to hide that flab around her waistline. I think shes a total narcissist so the hiding of her imperfect waistline (specially standing next to a very trim DY) would fit into that, in my mind.
I agree she seemed to be taking her cues from the others around her, looking at everyone except straight ahead like the others were doing. I saw NOBODY else in the group of 4 but her looking at the other 3, only TH.

Seeing her body language was the first thing that made me feel she had something to do w/ Kyron being missing.

JMO

abbie

PortlandMama
07-07-2010, 06:52 PM
Off topic kinda, but don't want to start a new thread unless it would be of importance..

What about the postings by TH under rdsqrl and other aliases (though I don't think they were confirmed that it was her), I really am not taking either side about if TH is innocent or not until I get more facts but, why would she waste her time with these postings when her stepson is missing? And why defend herself so much? If my child were missing and I was being accused of being involved with his/her disappearance, yes I would maybe defend myself a little I guess but I would want the focus to remain on my child and who really was behind it.

Also, based on some posts I've seen here recently, I kinda wonder if TH is posting on here as well but maybe I'm sleuthing too much.

Anyhow about her postings, just doesn't seem like normal behavior in this situation.

I don't know. Seems like she's caught between a rock and a hard place. It sure wouldn't be my number-one priority, but I've seen others on this forum saying that if she were innocent, she'd be out there shouting it from the mountaintop. On the other hand, I think we also heard she was following KH's instructions to keep quiet. I would say what she has done is, in fact, defend herself "a little."

If she's guilty, I wish she'd make a strategic misstep, but she won't now unless she goes contrary to whatever her lawyer is advising her. If she's innocent, I hope LE has some other irons in the fire. :banghead:

TaylorJ4
07-07-2010, 06:57 PM
When I first saw her I was reminded of an abused woman-she seemed to be trying to hide from something. Now, with the latest info that has been released, I feel she was acting guilty

Charlie09
07-07-2010, 07:21 PM
If she's guilty, I wish she'd make a strategic misstep, but she won't now unless she goes contrary to whatever her lawyer is advising her. If she's innocent, I hope LE has some other irons in the fire. :banghead:

I just wanted to repeat this.....I totally agree.

Mylou
07-07-2010, 07:27 PM
I seen fear in her body language.
I tend to believe if she was able to have done everything the media and public has accused her of, Id expect her to stand straight and look people right in the eyes.
Especially if she is physco or something. Id even have expected her to have done interviews by now, and have spoken to the public by now.

mchris1024
07-07-2010, 08:09 PM
I seen fear in her body language.
I tend to believe if she was able to have done everything the media and public has accused her of, Id expect her to stand straight and look people right in the eyes.
Especially if she is physco or something. Id even have expected her to have done interviews by now, and have spoken to the public by now.

I have thought this for some time, her silence to me equals fear. If she was/is the crazy woman she is being painted by so many here I think she would be doing things differently. Something isn't right.

Calliope
07-07-2010, 08:13 PM
I seen fear in her body language.
I tend to believe if she was able to have done everything the media and public has accused her of, Id expect her to stand straight and look people right in the eyes.
Especially if she is physco or something. Id even have expected her to have done interviews by now, and have spoken to the public by now.

Fear of what? Or whom?

I agree with you; if she was this unfeeling sociopath and narcissist she's being made out to be, she'd be front and center.

Aedrys
07-07-2010, 08:13 PM
I seen fear in her body language.
I tend to believe if she was able to have done everything the media and public has accused her of, Id expect her to stand straight and look people right in the eyes.
Especially if she is physco or something. Id even have expected her to have done interviews by now, and have spoken to the public by now.

Not necessarily. She can be very afraid for herself and that she might not get away with this crime. I think she's more narcissist than anything else. She's very worried about going to jail for this. She's not afraid for Kyron or his whereabouts, just for herself and how much trouble she's in. She's already said enough through friends and not so anonymous postings. She's probably getting her story straight right now.

Who knows, maybe she thought this would remain a family thing only. Maybe she's surprised how far it's gone in the media. Even Casey has shown fear for herself at times. Also, I bet her lawyer has told her not to give interviews at this point. After a case like Casey's, I'm betting a lot lawyers are telling their clients to shut up and stay out of the media.

Calliope
07-07-2010, 08:15 PM
Not necessarily. She can be very afraid for herself and that she might not get away with this crime. I think she's more narcissist than anything else. She's very worried about going to jail for this. She's not afraid for Kyron or his whereabouts, just for herself and how much trouble she's in. She's already said enough through friends and not so anonymous postings. She's probably getting her story straight right now.

Who knows, maybe she thought this would remain a family thing only. Maybe she's surprised how far it's gone in the media. Even Casey has shown fear for herself at times. Also, I bet her lawyer has told her not to give interviews at this point. After a case like Casey's, I'm betting a lot lawyers are telling their clients to shut up and stay out of the media.

I'd hope that would have been standard defense practice long before that.

DeepThinker
07-07-2010, 08:24 PM
My body language would not probably not be normal under stress. As a matter of fact, I shut down. I don't talk, I don't look at anyone, I just sit and think of solutions. I don't enjoy having people around me when I'm upset, I like to deal with my stuff my way. But then, if you knew my life growing up, you would understand. Perhaps she reacts to stress and scrutiny in this way. Not saying it's right, just saying it is what it is. IMO JMO MOO

Mylou
07-07-2010, 08:30 PM
Not necessarily. She can be very afraid for herself and that she might not get away with this crime. I think she's more narcissist than anything else. She's very worried about going to jail for this. She's not afraid for Kyron or his whereabouts, just for herself and how much trouble she's in. She's already said enough through friends and not so anonymous postings. She's probably getting her story straight right now.

Who knows, maybe she thought this would remain a family thing only. Maybe she's surprised how far it's gone in the media. Even Casey has shown fear for herself at times. Also, I bet her lawyer has told her not to give interviews at this point. After a case like Casey's, I'm betting a lot lawyers are telling their clients to shut up and stay out of the media.

Personally I don't know anything about TH, how she thinks or anything else. Only what has been fed us through the media and others. I cannot assume she thinks or feels anything. Her body language to me looks like fear, fear of what I don't know, could be anything. Some people plainly feel guilty even if they did no wrong. I can't judge someone's thoughts without knowing anything about how they feel and I havent heard a word from her yet to even speculate on her feelings or her thoughts.
She may have been told to shut up before the PC for all I know.
My own mother used to tell me how I felt all my life, and she was always way off, it was more about how she felt or how she thought I should feel , but never what my feelings were.

Ada
07-07-2010, 08:39 PM
I wish they'd go ahead and either arrest her or exonerate her publicly .

Her body language was hinky to me from the first PC. I was still just lurking on this particular case at the time. Puffnstuff had her figured out right away though. Where is Puffnstuff, btw?

Something that occurred to me today is, what if she just really doesn't care about Kyron? What if her indifference is purely indifference, and not sign that she is the perp?

Kyron looks so much like DY, I have wondered if that had an effect on TH.

She seemed 'off' to me from the start but help us all if this woman is innocent.

Haeve
07-07-2010, 08:51 PM
1st Family Presser.
What's the body language for:

"I haven't slept in 14 days and I don't think the medicine they gave me is working because I feel like a wounded zombie walking in a cloud, please just give me my baby and let's everybody go home."

Because, they all had some of that body language going on. IMO.

They were exhausted and devastated. I suppose I'm wondering, at that particular point in time what other body language matters... Plus those that spoke, were on script.

IMO, the only one that seemed ready to participate at that point, with a presser and such public/official business, seemed to be Tony.

Excellent point about the sleeplessness, etc.

I would imagine Tony, being a police detective is better at "getting down to business" during a stressful situation.

BTW, here's a link to a new story about yesterday's PC in the Medford paper. It's probably been posted elsewhere, but I'm just now catching up since this morning. Seems like there's a few new tidbits in it.

http://www.mailtribune.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20100707/NEWS/7070321

arielilane
07-07-2010, 09:16 PM
I am glad for this thread, for I have not felt good about her since that first presser, and I thought maybe I was overreacting. She really did seem like the outcast there. While everyone else was grieving for Kyron, she seemed to be grieving more for herself. I also felt like she wasn't as genuine in her emotions as the rest of the parents were. I kept comparing her to Tony, and out of the two of them, I felt like he cared a heck of a lot more for Kyron than TH did.

I know I keep going back to it, but she reminds me of when Casey gets upset, and it's Casey being upset about herself, not about what happened to her child. They both are thinking of themselves and how this is going to affect them, not about the fact that a child is missing or a child's life has be taken or how a child being gone affects the whole family and community. It's all me, me, me in every emotion and in their body language.

I truly felt KH, DY, and TY were there for Kyron, worrying more about Kyron and his safety then themselves, and TH was only there for herself and how Kyron going missing affected her. She was almost acting like he was gone for good and never coming back, whereas the other three were more worried about him being missing and finding him, not him being gone forever.

It's almost as if she was putting on the "act" of being a parent who lost a child and was acting the way she thought a parent that lost a child was supposed to act insteading of really being a parent who lost a child. If she really cared about Kyron, her grief shouldn't be an act. Well said. Exactly my sentiments.

Beatrice
07-07-2010, 09:33 PM
Yes, Casey Anthony-esque.
Susan Smith-esque....
Etc., etc.

No tears from Terri.
Seems to be hiding from the cameras.
Not one word verbally...(Cant do a voice stress analysis?)

The change in her physical appearance says alot.

gibby207
07-07-2010, 09:37 PM
Well, I thought she was looking like she was "pleading" to her husband and checking out the others' reactions at the presser at that time then as I do now. I just wasn't able to speak of it then. :) I imagined myself in their shoes, and I'd be a zombie like the other 3. NOT like her. Just MOO, etc. LOL


I feel like it's cheating to examine body language "after the fact" as my observations are now prejudiced.

It seems I rather failed the first go around. I just thought she was acting nervous and concerned about everyone else, and feeling just terrible that she didn't walk that child into his classroom that day. I also attributed her relative attentiveness to (okay don't mess up your screen now...) Terri being a "giver-type". :blushing:

LOL.

But it sure is interesting. :D

cypress
07-07-2010, 09:38 PM
Excellent point about the sleeplessness, etc.

I would imagine Tony, being a police detective is better at "getting down to business" during a stressful situation.

BTW, here's a link to a new story about yesterday's PC in the Medford paper. It's probably been posted elsewhere, but I'm just now catching up since this morning. Seems like there's a few new tidbits in it.

http://www.mailtribune.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20100707/NEWS/7070321

This, from the above link, is especially interesting:

The Youngs called the press conference to reiterate their pleas for Kyron's stepmother, Terri Moulton Horman, to fully cooperate with Portland-area police and FBI officials.

"She has not contacted investigators to give a statement that could help bring Kyron home," Tony Young said.

So, is the basis for their continued assertion that she is not cooperating, based on her not confessing?

That's how I'm reading this.

butwhatif?
07-07-2010, 09:40 PM
Are we allowed to post sceenshots of Terri at the PC in reference to her body language?

ETA: since I don't see any mention of pics being off-limits in this thread , I'm going to go ahead and post the ones that stood out to me, along with my armchair analysis.

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c341/jazlynsmum1/kc%20PB/Kyron/terri.jpg

In this shot, desiree is holding her womb, while Terri is covering her body with one arm crossed over , clutching the other. IMO She is trying to 'protect' herself. It is a very closed off gesture.


http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c341/jazlynsmum1/kc%20PB/Kyron/kyronsfamilypc.jpg

This one IMO, is part 'poor me' but similar to the above in that she is sheilding her body, still with one arm covering herself.

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c341/jazlynsmum1/kc%20PB/Kyron/terrianddes.jpg

In this one, IMO while appearing to be supporting D, T's pelvis is pushed back, implying it is not a natural comfortable exchange.

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c341/jazlynsmum1/kc%20PB/Kyron/terroilookingatd-1.png

This one looks like T is thinking "OMG! What have I done? ....and do you already know what I've done?"
And look at how tense D looks with T's arm around her.

All JMO, and want to add it looks like T is dissociating at several points.

gardeness
07-07-2010, 09:58 PM
This, from the above link, is especially interesting:

The Youngs called the press conference to reiterate their pleas for Kyron's stepmother, Terri Moulton Horman, to fully cooperate with Portland-area police and FBI officials.

"She has not contacted investigators to give a statement that could help bring Kyron home," Tony Young said.

So, is the basis for their continued assertion that she is not cooperating, based on her not confessing?

That's how I'm reading this.

Thanks. Point made.

BetteDavisEyes
07-07-2010, 09:59 PM
I started reading this thread before noon today but had to shut down because our monitor was flashing like a strobe light. Brand new monitor now, so I will post my thoughts about Terri's body language in that first news conference. It bothered me that day, but I was too :redface: to start a thread or post about my feelings.

I'm 60, a mother and grandmother, so you might be a little surprised if I tell you that I thought that Terri's body language at the press conference reeked of sensuality. I've watched that video multiple times and still get the sense that TMH rubbed up against Kaine in an overtly sensual manner that seemed totally inappropriate under the circumstances. While she might have sought "physical" comfort in this stressful situation, this behavior was awkward and made me uncomfortable. I recognized that Terri was "looking up to Kaine" like a child seeking protection from harm, but she was also reminding him of their "intimate" relationship. jmo

TxLady2
07-07-2010, 10:24 PM
Very true - it's why I take analysis of body language with a grain of salt. I don't react "normally" at all, either. I have difficulty maintaining eye contact, will often self-soothe with my arms defensively across my body, etc. This is even more pronounced if I'm in front of people - even when I'm only mildly anxious about the situation. I'm sure people would have a field day with my normal quirks, if they were put on display.

I think TH's body language could go either way - innocent and feeling incredible guilt over the situation, or guilt for something that occurred. Since I'm not an expert in the area, I'm going to refrain from coming to any conclusions about her, her mental state, or actions she may have committed from her body language.

I'm glad you posted this. I have the same problem, and I'm sure if I were thrust into a similar situation, I would be pegged as guilty as heck and off my rocker to boot! My body language during stressful times is off the chart! And don't even try to read my facial expressions.... I had a co worker tell me once that I looked angry all the time, until I smile.
I am a stepmother, although mine are all grown now. I can imagine if anything had happened to one of them when they were kids, especially if they were in my care... I would have probably absconded to Mexico rather than face their mother!
I believe that Terri was just very uncomfortable, probably felt like a fifth wheel, and didn't know what to say or do in the presence of Kyron's mother... who looked like she wanted to faint one minute and slap the hell-O out of her the next. JMO.

Beatrice
07-07-2010, 10:28 PM
If Terri could fool Kaine....
She could fool anyone.

nurseratchett
07-08-2010, 12:10 AM
Well, I have to agree with the majority. Her body language is what convinced me she is the reason for Kyrons dissapearance. I was "put off" by her from the day after he went missing and her weird FB posting about not believing what was said in the media, however, once I watched that 1st presser, it confirmed "my" suspicions. I see her as a manipulative, narcissistic person with perhaps some mild borderline traits. She has been successful at getting an education, yet has made many bad choices in life. So, even though she knows what is "right", as far as the community at large, she doesn't seem to care that her bad choices impact others. Her body language is ALL about ME, ME ME.
The odd eye blinking, the brow being overly furrowed yet the lateral eye muscles do not show the same stress, the reluctance to look at audience, the odd gazing up at others as if seeking approval, etc. There is one particular area on the video when Tony is talking that Terri is leaning on Desirees shoulder, and Kaine attempts to reach over behind Terri to put a hand on Desirees shoulder, at this point, Terri appears extremely irritated, as if she is disgusted that Kaine is offering support to Terri. It it right between 2:35 and 2:40 on this video link.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7lhpnYOpF58&feature=related

She literally steps forward as Kaine reaches towards Desiree, and she looks PO'd. More than actually, she looks....well, "murderous" like she wants to scream, throw something, I don't know just wrong.

MOO....

Kitkat
07-08-2010, 01:13 AM
Well, I have to agree with the majority. Her body language is what convinced me she is the reason for Kyrons dissapearance. I was "put off" by her from the day after he went missing and her weird FB posting about not believing what was said in the media, however, once I watched that 1st presser, it confirmed "my" suspicions. I see her as a manipulative, narcissistic person with perhaps some mild borderline traits. She has been successful at getting an education, yet has made many bad choices in life. So, even though she knows what is "right", as far as the community at large, she doesn't seem to care that her bad choices impact others. Her body language is ALL about ME, ME ME.
The odd eye blinking, the brow being overly furrowed yet the lateral eye muscles do not show the same stress, the reluctance to look at audience, the odd gazing up at others as if seeking approval, etc. There is one particular area on the video when Tony is talking that Terri is leaning on Desirees shoulder, and Kaine attempts to reach over behind Terri to put a hand on Desirees shoulder, at this point, Terri appears extremely irritated, as if she is disgusted that Kaine is offering support to Terri. It it right between 2:35 and 2:40 on this video link.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7lhpnYOpF58&feature=related

She literally steps forward as Kaine reaches towards Desiree, and she looks PO'd. More than actually, she looks....well, "murderous" like she wants to scream, throw something, I don't know just wrong.

MOO....

Although I wouldn't say "murderous," I would say she looks distinctly put out, or irritated.

GOOD catch!

nurseratchett
07-08-2010, 01:30 AM
Although I wouldn't say "murderous," I would say she looks distinctly put out, or irritated.

GOOD catch!

TY...good word choice, it;s hot here today, and after 8 months of rain and cool temps, suddenly ramping up to 95 from 55 leaves my brain less than creative. Murderous is dramatic, but I had the hardest time selecting exactly what I thought that 'higgly wiggly lurch" embodied.

Hermit
07-08-2010, 01:47 AM
I agree with you Charlie09. This woman may or may not be involved in Kyron's disappearance. Only time and evidence will tell. One thing she is guilty of is having an affair with Kaine while DY was pregnant with Kyron. Standing next to the person whose husband you wound up stealing away, combined with all the stress of media attention, accusations, questioning and all fingers seemingly pointing at TH must have been awkard and terrifying to say the least.

brandi
07-08-2010, 01:48 AM
Well, I think that her lurching is due to surprise..her olive branch, arm-around-the shoulder of DY seemed like a deliberate move and then he broke her up by doing this maneuver. Put in her shoes, I'd be taken aback. I think its kind of natural...

mrsjonnob
07-08-2010, 01:51 AM
I think her body language could be the behavior of a person who is scared to death because they know that by being the last known person to have seen Kyron, she is the person most suspected of being involved.

I have been accused of things that I was completely innocent of, and yet, when on the hot seat, I am sure I appeared guilty because I am a horribly nervous person by nature. I imagine that a person trying to interpret my body language would peg me as guilty.

I am sure that Terri, even if totally innocent, feels a lot of guilt. Why didn't she stay longer? Walk him to class? Make sure the teacher understood when his dr. appt was? So many things she could have done differently that may have prevented his disappearance. Top it off with being the last known person to have seen him (which makes no sense to me because I have read that a classmate saw him after Terri was supposed to have left) and you can have a person who is 100% innocent of involvement but who feels terribly guilty nonetheless.

JMO

PortlandMama
07-08-2010, 02:03 AM
Well, I think that her lurching is due to surprise..her olive branch, arm-around-the shoulder of DY seemed like a deliberate move and then he broke her up by doing this maneuver. Put in her shoes, I'd be taken aback. I think its kind of natural...

Yeah. I actually thought her balance was just thrown off for a moment by his maneuvering behind her. They were all three pretty snug. It didn't register to me as annoyance even, maybe just surprise, as you say.

gibby207
07-08-2010, 02:08 AM
Are we allowed to post sceenshots of Terri at the PC in reference to her body language?

ETA: since I don't see any mention of pics being off-limits in this thread , I'm going to go ahead and post the ones that stood out to me, along with my armchair analysis.

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c341/jazlynsmum1/kc%20PB/Kyron/terri.jpg

In this shot, desiree is holding her womb, while Terri is covering her body with one arm crossed over , clutching the other. IMO She is trying to 'protect' herself. It is a very closed off gesture.


http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c341/jazlynsmum1/kc%20PB/Kyron/kyronsfamilypc.jpg

This one IMO, is part 'poor me' but similar to the above in that she is sheilding her body, still with one arm covering herself.

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c341/jazlynsmum1/kc%20PB/Kyron/terrianddes.jpg

In this one, IMO while appearing to be supporting D, T's pelvis is pushed back, implying it is not a natural comfortable exchange.

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c341/jazlynsmum1/kc%20PB/Kyron/terroilookingatd-1.png

This one looks like T is thinking "OMG! What have I done? ....and do you already know what I've done?"
And look at how tense D looks with T's arm around her.

All JMO, and want to add it looks like T is dissociating at several points.

Thank you for screen shots! I don't know how to do that... but I would like to add the same "OMG, What I have I done?" look to her eyes upon her husband. You purdy much nailed my thoughts on the event... Thanks!

DairyGirl
07-08-2010, 02:08 AM
When I first watched the press conference I was sure TH wasn't involved because at the time LE was placing others as seeing Kyron after she left. Since that time they have come out definitively as saying she was the last known to have seen Kyron. At the time I watched it I have to admit I thought she looked appropriately upset. The only thing off to me was when another poster pointed out a part when she looked up at Kaine and you could see her rolling her eyes. It's not on the video here but I could see that clearly. Maybe her contacts were bothering her, who knows. It just shows me that what you interpet is largely determined by your own beliefs.

cypress
07-08-2010, 02:14 AM
I just don't see Terri as standing out like a sore thumb, and I'm looking for it. I will say she seems to not know her place, but the fact is, she isn't Kyron's mother. It's an awkward situation, it's a horrific situation.

When the foursome first walk out, both DY and TY face the cameras and initially have their arms crossed over their bodies in an identical fashion. It's interesting because TY puts his arm around DY and she is totally non-responsive to his comfort. If DY isn't responsive to her husband's attempt at comfort, why would she respond to Terri's attempt? I also bet money that if Terri had not attempted to comfort Desiree as she stood there sobbing and barely holding it together, there would be analysis about how she lacked empathy thus confirming she is a sociopath. ;)

Later, when Kaine takes his turn at the mic, Terri is in a similar physical position as DY and TY were at the beginning of the presser. The pose is nearly identical, although Terri clamps her hand at her elbow as opposed to her wrist, as did DY and TY.

Terri patted TY on the back when he gave the initial statement from the family. She attempted to comfort DY. I honestly think she was going to move out of the way and allow KH to comfort DY when he initially put his arm around her (Desiree). She patted KH on the back when he took his turn at the mic. How is she making it all about her?

She does blink a lot, especially at the beginning of the presser. I don't know what that means in this context. Dry eyes? Nervous? A tic? Guilty as hell? Fear for her stepson who is missing?

butwhatif?
07-08-2010, 04:11 AM
Thank you for screen shots! I don't know how to do that... but I would like to add the same "OMG, What I have I done?" look to her eyes upon her husband. You purdy much nailed my thoughts on the event... Thanks!

OT:
For screenshots, I probably do it the most complicated way...but this is how I do it.
1. Open up a new word or open office document.
2.When your see then bit you want to capture,press "prtsc"(printscreen) on you keyboard.
3.Paste to the opened word document.
4. Right click the image in the doc and click on save graphic.( Store it where you'll be able to easily find it).
5. Go to photobucket and upload the screenshot you have saved.
6. You can resize, crop etc in photobucket.
7. Copy and paste 'image' link located under pic in PB to your WS post.

seekingjustice**
07-08-2010, 04:42 AM
Are we allowed to post sceenshots of Terri at the PC in reference to her body language?

ETA: since I don't see any mention of pics being off-limits in this thread , I'm going to go ahead and post the ones that stood out to me, along with my armchair analysis.

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c341/jazlynsmum1/kc%20PB/Kyron/terri.jpg

In this shot, desiree is holding her womb, while Terri is covering her body with one arm crossed over , clutching the other. IMO She is trying to 'protect' herself. It is a very closed off gesture.


http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c341/jazlynsmum1/kc%20PB/Kyron/kyronsfamilypc.jpg

This one IMO, is part 'poor me' but similar to the above in that she is sheilding her body, still with one arm covering herself.

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c341/jazlynsmum1/kc%20PB/Kyron/terrianddes.jpg

In this one, IMO while appearing to be supporting D, T's pelvis is pushed back, implying it is not a natural comfortable exchange.

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c341/jazlynsmum1/kc%20PB/Kyron/terroilookingatd-1.png

This one looks like T is thinking "OMG! What have I done? ....and do you already know what I've done?"
And look at how tense D looks with T's arm around her.
All JMO, and want to add it looks like T is dissociating at several points.

respectfully bbm - great interpretation. I also see Terri as thinking "OMG, I'm really sorry for what I did to you 'D' unfortunately, you weren't part of this, and I never wanted you to suffer, but I hope Kaine is suffering ..

PaulaF513
07-08-2010, 08:07 AM
I think her body language displays discomfortand fear and, as some have said, she appears to feel unconnected, not sure of her place. She seems to fairly constantly, seek KH's attention. He, on the other hand, seems totally indifferent to her. From the first time I saw them all together, his indifference to her struck me. I think he doesn't love her and I think she senses that. But she still seems to seek his approval??

I will add for fairness' sake that while body language tells something, the fact that we have never heard her voice or seen her speaking about the situation, a significant factor is missing. I am under the impression that she was not asked to speak, (by LE by KH ??). That sends the unmistakable silent message out there that she is not "family" enough and/or, that she is somehow responsible for the child's disappearance. That is powerful, especially when added to the repetitive "last person to see Kyron" that LE insists.

I am still on the fence about this fact because I do not understand why LE has discounted out of hand the statement of TP. You would think that if they had viable information of the boy's misinformation, they would at least publicize why his story is not credible.

brandi
07-08-2010, 02:53 PM
I think her body language displays discomfortand fear and, as some have said, she appears to feel unconnected, not sure of her place. She seems to fairly constantly, seek KH's attention. He, on the other hand, seems totally indifferent to her. From the first time I saw them all together, his indifference to her struck me. I think he doesn't love her and I think she senses that. But she still seems to seek his approval??

I will add for fairness' sake that while body language tells something, the fact that we have never heard her voice or seen her speaking about the situation, a significant factor is missing. I am under the impression that she was not asked to speak, (by LE by KH ??). That sends the unmistakable silent message out there that she is not "family" enough and/or, that she is somehow responsible for the child's disappearance. That is powerful, especially when added to the repetitive "last person to see Kyron" that LE insists.

I am still on the fence about this fact because I do not understand why LE has discounted out of hand the statement of TP. You would think that if they had viable information of the boy's misinformation, they would at least publicize why his story is not credible.

BBM

I am still stuck on TP's story too! I don't get why it's discounted. But i think we're not supposed to discuss it here d/t minor status, so I digress

Ms Suzanne
07-08-2010, 02:58 PM
I have said from the very beginning Terri's body language did not show enough emotion.But the more I see it she actually looks scared to death.I also said before I saw no emotion with Kaine.He never talks to Kyron really in any of his pressers.So I actually felt both body languages were a little strange.

xin
07-08-2010, 03:13 PM
BBM

[/B]I am still stuck on TP's story too! I don't get why it's discounted. But i think we're not supposed to discuss it here d/t minor status, so I digress

who's TP?

BetteDavisEyes
07-08-2010, 03:21 PM
who's TP?

Classmate of Kyron. Can't post names of minors.

xin
07-08-2010, 03:37 PM
Classmate of Kyron. Can't post names of minors.

Thanks. Wondered if it was The Principal.

So, maybe the kid who reported Kyron saying he was off to see the cool electic thing?

I still think the *cool electric* thing was something TH told K they were going to do, based really on nothing. But I have seen that TH did do a curriculum plan for the Bonneville Electric Plant, for whatever that's worth.

Haeve
07-08-2010, 03:48 PM
Thanks. Wondered if it was The Principal.

So, maybe the kid who reported Kyron saying he was off to see the cool electic thing?

I still think the *cool electric* thing was something TH told K they were going to do, based really on nothing. But I have seen that TH did do a curriculum plan for the Bonneville Electric Plant, for whatever that's worth.

Very interesting. Do you have a MSM source?

I personally don't think Bonneville had anything to do with Kyron's disappearance (too far away), unless a promised trip there was used as part of a ruse, but since it gets asked about a lot, I'll repeat the info about Bonneville:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bonneville_Dam

Click on the coordinates in the upper right of the Wikipedia article for a large selection of maps.

Bonneville is 40 miles east of Portland, and is the last hydroelectric dam on the lower Columbia River. I don't think there's anything comparable that is closer, just smaller dams for flood control, irrigation diversion, etc.