View Full Version : TN - Holly Bobo, 20, Darden, believed abducted 13 April 2011 - #13
Lera213
04-23-2011, 08:42 PM
Any new information yet?
iluvmua
04-23-2011, 08:44 PM
Any new information yet?
Not that I know of
s_finch
04-23-2011, 08:45 PM
Ya know, I've thought about that, and I've come to the conclusion that maybe LE doesn't want to clear anyone simply because of how tight the community is. For example, if they clear her brother, then people start asking about her bf, and if they don't clear him, then the suspicion of him gets even stronger. Works the other way too, if they clear the bf, but not the brother. And if both of them are cleared, then the perp may think they really are onto him, as an outsider to the family, whether they are or not, and if Holly is still alive, he may panic. At this point, it might be better to stick with, "Everyone's a suspect", because it makes it look like they know nothing. (And I hope that they actually know something.)
Good post!
Lera213
04-23-2011, 08:47 PM
You know if we had all the information LE had, we would find the guy and Holly. LOL
daisy.faithfull
04-23-2011, 08:51 PM
Ya know, I've thought about that, and I've come to the conclusion that maybe LE doesn't want to clear anyone simply because of how tight the community is. For example, if they clear her brother, then people start asking about her bf, and if they don't clear him, then the suspicion of him gets even stronger. Works the other way too, if they clear the bf, but not the brother. And if both of them are cleared, then the perp may think they really are onto him, as an outsider to the family, whether they are or not, and if Holly is still alive, he may panic. At this point, it might be better to stick with, "Everyone's a suspect", because it makes it look like they know nothing. (And I hope that they actually know something.)
Exactly. At this point LE doesn't appear to know if Holly is alive or dead. If she is alive and being held hostage if the kidnapper believes that LE is on to him Holly becomes even more of a liability and he could kill her.
s_finch
04-23-2011, 08:53 PM
me tooo! that money should go to helping pay for gas for the atvs searching bring in sar dogs all the search and rescue stufffff not a vacation
If they get Holly home im sure someone will send her on vacation!
Use that money to GET her home!!!!!
If mom is in shock, which I can't imagine her being otherwise, she probably wasn't even thinking along logical lines when she decided on how to appropriate the money. She was just thinking, "I have faith Holly will come home and I want to be able to show that tangibly and also do something extra special for her",,MOOOO
annalyzer
04-23-2011, 08:54 PM
I have to say that it seems very odd to me as well. Why not use the money for extra searchers and private dog handlers FIRST, maybe Private Investigators.
Then once she comes home you can figure out a way for her to go on a little vacation. I bet she would get plenty of offers from people offering her their beach house if she comes home safe.
I DO understand the Mom's hope that the money could be used to fund a nice vacation for her beautiful daughter. But she is putting the cart before the horse, imo.
BBM Yeah what i was going to say
Woe.be.gone
04-23-2011, 08:56 PM
OK the car and the phone. SARX thank you for saying your information is that it was a hunter's and cleared. I'm going to leave the last few posts but this is the end of this rumor please. And carrying scanner talk up into this thread is strictly forbidden.
BBM and snipped bm ~ Thank you for the above message. I didn't know that scanner talk was not allowed up here (I referenced it yesterday probably three or four threads back). I won't do it again. I've not encountered a case before where scanner was used so I was unaware - sorry.
Melanie
04-23-2011, 08:59 PM
If mom is in shock, which I can't imagine her being otherwise, she probably wasn't even thinking along logical lines when she decided on how to appropriate the money. She was just thinking, "I have faith Holly will come home and I want to be able to show that tangibly and also do something extra special for her",,MOOOO
Help me out here - did I just read mom bought a vacation with donation money? Yikes - I need to read the upthread.
MOO
Mel
scorekeeper
04-23-2011, 09:00 PM
I don't think that the statement that Holly was complying because she was threatened came from Clint. I think that it was speculation put out there by LE because while locals and people like ourselves would see that this is an abduction others would question that because she went willingly.
I do understand what you are saying about the importance of reporting what was seen. But I'm not sure if it was reported that Holly was, without a doubt, threatened to comply. I'll go see what I can find, but I think that it was reported that she may have been threatened to comply.
daisy...
Way To Go.......1,000 post...........sorry this is late!!
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s_finch
04-23-2011, 09:01 PM
Just imagine...by the time this is over that family will be wealthy on top of the wealth they already had.
If people dont think this is NUTS, I dont know what to think of people!!
Well think of this, by the time this is over, IF it's ever over, the money raised won't begin to pay for long term counseling for Holly. Did you know in-house therapy is $3000 to $5000 a day and that isn't for a swanky place. Out patient therapy starts at $100 an hour, but that's really low---and yes, I'm speaking from personal knowledge on this matter so I do know of what I speak. Not to mention regular medical costs which will be necessary.
And even though I've been in a psych center before and I'm a "people", I'm not nuts. :twocents:
DNeecie
04-23-2011, 09:01 PM
It just makes them look selfish and I don't think they realize it.
I think the money should be going back to the Vols who helped search for Holly.
I think people are going to be very upset if they find out that all that money is going to Holly to do whatever she pleases with it.
Oh, I agree about it going to the volunteers. I think $35,000(their goal) is a little over the top for what they are wanting it for. IMO
I'm just saying I don't think any of them are really thinking clearly. Sometimes it takes another person saying "maybe that's not really what it should go towards" to make you realize it's a little excessive. Really though, who is going to tell this woman, who is trying to say positive, that.
Melanie
04-23-2011, 09:03 PM
Also, I believe that people all over the country are buying the T-shirts.
It's very odd. I don't get it at all. I've never heard of a case where the family raises funds so that the money can go directly to the victim to do whatever they please with it.
I would understand if the money was going to a trust fund etc. , but for all of the money going to whatever the recipient wants to do with it is : :waitasec:
esp. since if she is found alive, she's going to need therapy of some sort for quit a while.
It just rubs me the wrong way, esp. in this economy.
Therapy = YES
A foundation for future victims of missing family members = YES
Funeral Costs (heaven forbid) = YES
Family Therapy = YES
Vacation = NO
No way, no how, should public funds be used for a vacation. I have no say in how the money is spent, but this is just another reason why I will never donate to funds like this.
This family should take a call from the Horman's in how to handle donation money. The tax penalties (if not used in an appropriate manner) can be as high as 33%.
MOO
Mel
s_finch
04-23-2011, 09:03 PM
Ok, I gotta say, I don't understand the vacation fund.
I know it's not, but in some ways it's like a runaway bribe.. "if you come home we'll give you a (fill in the blank).
And is there a heaven forbid contingency plan? What if she doesn't come home, where does the money go?
I thought about the contingency fund thing too, but then thought, "when would you draw the line that she's not coming home, a month, 6 months, a year???" I would imagine it would be the hardest thing to have to admit she's not coming home (this is theory only, am praying she comes home) and use the money for something else.
s_finch
04-23-2011, 09:05 PM
Not to mention all the food and things people have donated INTERNATIONALLY for this family and for this search. Churches in the area have donated thousands of dollars that is not showing up in the news articles...I think it is AMAZINGLY selfish that they could be thinking this way while so many are giving everything they can to help this family....
This is turning into a circus FAST.
I totally DISAGREE that is this turning into a circus. Have you ever had a child go missing, I have. It was only for three hours but it gave me a taste of the horror. Watching LE run the dogs, having the Sheriff ask the same questions over and over, seeing Game Management in the boat searching the lake, having people you don't even know come up and hug you and watching people running everywhere searching......it's totally surreal, and scary as hell. Don't judge this family until you've been in their shoes. This family isn't "thinking", you can't think when this happens. You can cry, become hysterical, shake uncontrollably and go into shock,,,,but "thinking" isn't what happens when your child goes missing.
Melanie
04-23-2011, 09:07 PM
Well think of this, by the time this is over, IF it's ever over, the money raised won't begin to pay for long term counseling for Holly. Did you know in-house therapy is $3000 to $5000 a day and that isn't for a swanky place. Out patient therapy starts at $100 an hour, but that's really low---and yes, I'm speaking from personal knowledge on this matter so I do know of what I speak. Not to mention regular medical costs which will be necessary.
And even though I've been in a psych center before and I'm a "people", I'm not nuts. :twocents:
You're right. My outpatient therapy was $200.00 an hour, and insurance picked up 50% for 10 visits a year. If/when Holly is found, every penny is going to be needed for long term therapy.
MOO
Mel
cluciano63
04-23-2011, 09:07 PM
I could see the 'your dog is injured' ruse as a possibility. But that does not explain why the guy was holding her close as they walked. To me the body language they described implies that the guy had a knife or a gun. imoo
I think she would break into a run if anyone said something had happened to her dog or another animal...not be walking along in a way that brother thinks she is with her boyfriend and police now think was showing fear for her life...
not_my_kids
04-23-2011, 09:08 PM
Help me out here - did I just read mom bought a vacation with donation money? Yikes - I need to read the upthread.
MOO
Mel
No, Not even close. What it is is that mom said that she wants the money collected from the tee shirt sales to be used for Holly, for a vacation or whatever she wants when she comes home. However, if you look back yesterday to the statements made, the owner/amanger/somebody of the flower shop that is selling the shirt said thay they hoped to raise enough to cover the reward ofered by the family. So what I think, personally, is that the family offered reward money that they didn't have, and the people of the town are hoping to cover that without the family having to mortgage or sell their home or other belongings, but also not letting those that may have info know that the reward cannot be covered at this time... MOO.
Trino
04-23-2011, 09:09 PM
Respectfully and totally DISAGREE that is this turning into a circus.
At last count, 2500 T-shirts had been sold at $12.00 = $30,000. That would be a heck of a vacation for anyone.
RoseRed
04-23-2011, 09:12 PM
Many of you have been around these cases a lot longer.
Have you ever seen one so tight to the vest? I just have to think there's a reason. They seem to be saying so little about it, just very strange.
Yes but the one most remembered is from OK and still not solved. Skyla Whitaker, & Taylor Placker murdered in OK.
cluciano63
04-23-2011, 09:13 PM
Yes but the one most remembered is from OK and still not solved. Skyla Whitaker, & Taylor Placker murdered in OK.
Kyron Horman...
Adrienne37
04-23-2011, 09:13 PM
If Holly turns out to be alive and they want to send her on vacation, I say more power to them and I don't think the people who have donated to this fund would feel any differently, heck, I'd be willing to donate to send all of them on vacation.
If Holly's not alive, then I'm sure her family will do whatever they feel is appropriate with this money.
If any of us aren't donating to the fund personally, then what business is it of ours where the money goes? If you feel uncomfortable donating money to a cause such as this, there is a simple solution to that problem, don't donate. If you support it, then by all means, donate.
~jmo~
daisy.faithfull
04-23-2011, 09:15 PM
daisy...
Way To Go.......1,000 post...........sorry this is late!!
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Thank you!
Does that mean that I get to make a special Websleuths Wish?
not_my_kids
04-23-2011, 09:15 PM
T-shirts bearing the favorite scripture of Holly's mother were sold for the Holly Bobo Fund.
The proceeds are not going to the reward fund, but to Holly herself.
D'Lynn Burton, a close family friend and neighbor, helped sell the shirts. "Her mother asked me. When Holly comes home, she wants her to have some money so she can go on a vacation, or just treat herself with anything she wants."
So far 2,500 shirts have been sold at $12 apiece.
http://www.wreg.com/news/wreg-bob-friday,0,1689775.story
BBM. Some money. That is not to say that every penny of this is going towards a vacation. MOO. And is also not a direct statement from the mother.
The shirt reads "Pray for Holly's Safe Return" on the back and has a pink ribbon on the front along with Bobo's name.
"We're going to print one thousand more t-shirts Thursday and hopefully we'll be able to continue this until we have sold enough to cover the reward the family has offered," said Steve Hinson of Amerawear.
http://www.wbbjtv.com/news/local/Bobo-T-shirts-Available-120334429.html
I think this statement is very telling of the real reason for the sales. They just don't want to come right out and say that they didn't have the money they offered. MOO.
s_finch
04-23-2011, 09:18 PM
At last count, 2500 T-shirts had been sold at $12.00 = $30,000. That would be a heck of a vacation for anyone.
Are the shirts being donated for free? If not, then half the amount of money that has come in.
The more I think about it, the more I'm wondering if "vacation" wasn't a word to use in place of "getting her emotionally stable again".
nursebeeme
04-23-2011, 09:18 PM
oh holy night..
where is Holly Bobo?
rant on... rant off.....
Woe.be.gone
04-23-2011, 09:20 PM
Here is what I do not get at all:
Why would you have people buy T-shirts that are not going towards the reward fund but instead all the money is going towards Holly herself?
Her mother said she wanted the donations from the T-shirts to go towards Holly so that when she gets back she can go on vacation or buy whatever she wants.
Yesterday when I read about this I thought that it was different too.
Then I thought to let the mom do what she has to do to get through this. She's hoping against all hope that her 'baby' will come home again.
She isn't hiding the purpose of the T-shirts so, if people want to buy them, what do we care? Poor woman is beside herself.
God bless her and I hope she can take a trip with her daughter soon.
Elphaba
04-23-2011, 09:22 PM
I think a vacation is wishful thinking... just a "thought" crutch to prop up what little bit of positive outlook that they have. Odds are against Holly, right now... searchers and LE know this, and privately the family knows. (or I should say "they have to know"... too many statistics out there that can't be ignored)
liltexans
04-23-2011, 09:24 PM
T-shirts bearing the favorite scripture of Holly's mother were sold for the Holly Bobo Fund.
The proceeds are not going to the reward fund, but to Holly herself.
D'Lynn Burton, a close family friend and neighbor, helped sell the shirts. "Her mother asked me. When Holly comes home, she wants her to have some money so she can go on a vacation, or just treat herself with anything she wants."
So far 2,500 shirts have been sold at $12 apiece.
http://www.wreg.com/news/wreg-bob-friday,0,1689775.story
BBM. Some money. That is not to say that every penny of this is going towards a vacation. MOO. And is also not a direct statement from the mother.
The shirt reads "Pray for Holly's Safe Return" on the back and has a pink ribbon on the front along with Bobo's name.
"We're going to print one thousand more t-shirts Thursday and hopefully we'll be able to continue this until we have sold enough to cover the reward the family has offered," said Steve Hinson of Amerawear.
http://www.wbbjtv.com/news/local/Bobo-T-shirts-Available-120334429.html
I think this statement is very telling of the real reason for the sales. They just don't want to come right out and say that they didn't have the money they offered. MOO.
The second link you posted says "The shirts range from $12 to $15 and are available at Parsons Florist in Parsons."
Are there 2 different "styles" (for lack of a better word) of shirts being sold? Do they both have the mother's favorite scripture on them?
Eileen730
04-23-2011, 09:29 PM
VA, S FLA, have you guys checked out the price of gas lately?? JK
heck yea here its $3.89
south west florida here!
Woe.be.gone
04-23-2011, 09:30 PM
I have so many windows open right now that I can't find the article about the t-shirts, but I remember it said that so far they have sold about 2,500 shirts at $12 a piece. Doing the math, that's $30,000.
I hope it was a misprint or misquote about wanting the money for Holly to use to take a vacation. Would a kidnapping survivor really want to take a vacation?
I'm not being facetious, that's a serious question.
ETA: Thank you, Ransom, for the link!
http://www.wreg.com/news/wreg-bob-friday,0,1689775.story
You have to subtract the original cost of the t-shirts and the printing though. That would surely be over half of the total taken in.
liltexans
04-23-2011, 09:31 PM
You have to subtract the original cost of the t-shirts and the printing though. That would surely be over half of the total taken in.
I am under the impression that the shirts are being donated, but if not, then that is very true.
Eileen730
04-23-2011, 09:32 PM
The second link you posted says "The shirts range from $12 to $15 and are available at Parsons Florist in Parsons."
Are there 2 different "styles" (for lack of a better word) of shirts being sold? Do they both have the mother's favorite scripture on them?
there is another one with a scripture on it i actually think someone posted it here a few pages back.
wfgodot
04-23-2011, 09:39 PM
there is another one with a scripture on it i actually think someone posted it here a few pages back.
Philippians 4:13
"I can do everything through Christ who strengthens me."
(depending on translation used)
Plumeria5
04-23-2011, 09:40 PM
Maybe this has been posted but I hadn't seen it and thought it gives a good idea of how the house sets back from the road. It was showing their house is under 24 hour surveillance.
http://twitpic.com/4ojdtg
liltexans
04-23-2011, 09:41 PM
Philippians 4:13
"I can do everything through Christ who strengthens me."
(depending on translation used)
Wow, I wonder if that has always been her favorite scripture because I just noticed it's 4:13 and Holly was abducted on 4-13.
Woe.be.gone
04-23-2011, 09:41 PM
I struggle with that. I would assume (and it can be a big assumption) that LE has more knowledge than has been made public, and some things involved may just take more time than we would like. I think most people get the idea that crimes are solved quickly because we see hour-long, fictionalized tv shows that have instant test results, instant this, instant that, etc. But in real life it can take a lot of old fashioned detective work, paper work, interviewing, etc.
LE also will want to keep some info under wraps to the public so suspects can be questioned about details that only he would know (that were not common knowledge) or in some cases to protect the family (in cases of sexual assault, sensationalized stuff etc).
The other big case I followed closely was like this. When the story broke it was HUGE. National news. Wild rumors. Only the bare bones of the story were made available by LE. A lot of what was stated did not make sense or seemed to contradict itself. After a couple weeks, the case went COLD as far as news and media went. NOTHING. Not a peep. Just rumors, more rumors, bizarre rumors, blah blah blah. Then, out of the blue (as far as the public was concerned), about one month after the crime, LE announced they had a suspect named, they put out a BOLO for him, and he was arrested that night.
Soooooo... IDK
I think in this case the lack of ANY news, details, statements is starting to have a negative effect on the case as far as public support goes. People have been busting their butts for over a week with NOTHING. Hope and faith and prayer will only go so far before the realities of life set in and folks settle back into their old daily routines. If LE needs public support they must find a way to keep the public's interest and focus levels up.
Do I 'know' you from the case at NIU (Toni K.)? I was almost certain that an acquaintance was responsible for her death but it turned out to be a local/a stranger. That's why I don't dare write down a theory because I'm learning that what seems obvious to me, is not always so.
Woe.be.gone
04-23-2011, 09:43 PM
Wow, I wonder if that has always been her favorite scripture because I just noticed it's 4:13 and Holly was abducted on 4-13.
Yikes, that's freaky.
That's one of the first scriptures I learned too - I have a hard time remembering the numbers though.
Capri
04-23-2011, 09:45 PM
Some photos of the case that I've been posting, feel free to add your own. Some of them I hadn't seen before, it's amazing the support the community has for Holly & family.
TN Holly Bobo case- pics only- no discussion - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community
heck yea here its $3.89
south west florida here!
4.19 - 4.39 for regular no. Cal Diesel last time 4.55 I understand it's headed for $7.
Eileen730
04-23-2011, 09:49 PM
Wow, I wonder if that has always been her favorite scripture because I just noticed it's 4:13 and Holly was abducted on 4-13.
Holy crud that eeeerieee
maybe she picked it cause of the numbers lol
iluvmua
04-23-2011, 09:50 PM
Help me out here - did I just read mom bought a vacation with donation money? Yikes - I need to read the upthread.
MOO
Mel
no, Mom wants to use all the money from the $12 T-shirts to go toward's Holly so she can go on a vacation or do whatever she wants with the money.
so far it is at $35,000
Leprikawn
04-23-2011, 09:52 PM
I sure hope LE is thinking outside the box and not focusing only on the area at hand. It seems to me that the people that do this type of stuff are usually located a couple of hundred miles away.......or even across state lines. Garrido comes to mind, and the guy that took Shawn Hornbeck.
SheWhoMustNotBeNamed
04-23-2011, 09:53 PM
Unless you have been verified as a psychiatrist, psychologist, or something similar, there is no need to discuss the type of therapy you think would be best for Holly... Let's focus on the important things here please.
not_my_kids
04-23-2011, 09:53 PM
The second link you posted says "The shirts range from $12 to $15 and are available at Parsons Florist in Parsons."
Are there 2 different "styles" (for lack of a better word) of shirts being sold? Do they both have the mother's favorite scripture on them?
As far as I know, only one. I posted a pic yesterday, last thread, they are black with pink ribbons and Holly's name on the front, the scripture on the back, if I recall right. The price difference likely depends on size.
redfish
04-23-2011, 09:55 PM
Okay... I was gonna let the topic go about the tee-shirts.... but since 3 pages have been devoted I gotta weigh in. MOO..... from the beginning of the sales they have been making it perfectly clear where the proceeds were going. Anyone who spent their money buying one knew where their money was going. What is wrong with that? If people purchasing these shirts were told it was for search and recovery then we could scream, I would think.
Woe.be.gone
04-23-2011, 09:55 PM
One thing I cannot get out of my head and it may just be LE blowing the details in their statements:
How can one observer, the only one to see all this report that he thought it was her boyfriend and that he didn't call 911 until after he saw the blood awhile later even after her being "led" to the woods AND
at the same time LE say "fear for her life"
Those two observations are entirely inconsistent unless they have a very good idea who the person was, and that she had the same idea and felt that he was a danger to her.
Only one person saw this go down. He didn't think it was a big deal at the time. Yet LE believes she feared for her life. Either they believe they and she knew/knows who it was or they haven't given us the whole deal on what the brother did actually see.
The thing I can't reconcile about the theory that someone had been threatening Holly though is that one would think her family would be aware of that to include her brother. All the more reason to make sure everything was ok when noticing her outside, early in the AM, with some camo guy.
Rallihanna
04-23-2011, 09:58 PM
Has their been the thought at all that she ran off? I know that's unlikely, but just wanted to ask. I was reading where people stated some of her belongings seemed to almost be "placed" and just had to ask the question.
liltexans
04-23-2011, 09:58 PM
As far as I know, only one. I posted a pic yesterday, last thread, they are black with pink ribbons and Holly's name on the front, the scripture on the back, if I recall right. The price difference likely depends on size.
Thanks! I missed a lot of yesterday's thread.
Black??
DNeecie
04-23-2011, 10:01 PM
I don't think this has been posted. I have been trying to keep up in here.
This just breaks my heart.
Tabitha Tuders' Family Feels Connected to Bobo Family
NASHVILLE, Tenn. -- A well known family that knows all too well what Holly Bobo's family is going through is helping in the Bobo case. The sister of Tabitha Tuders, who went missing eight years ago, is now helping search for the nursing student.
http://www.wsmv.com/news/27648698/detail.html
cluciano63
04-23-2011, 10:01 PM
I can't find the link right now, from last thread, but LE did say that after Sunday they would have to take the search "national" or something to that effect. So I don't think they are convinced she is nearby, they are considering other possibilities, but also it may mean they really have no leads to her location.
Even if they have a POI in mind, that may or may not be helpful in locating Holly. Unless they have or plan to interrogate him and he gives it up, it may be almost impossible to find her.
Here is the link
http://www.myfoxmemphis.com/dpp/news/tennessee/new-areas-searched-for-holly-bobo-apx-20110422
DNeecie
04-23-2011, 10:02 PM
They are talking about Holly on Geraldo at Large right now.
lillys
04-23-2011, 10:02 PM
Some photos of the case that I've been posting, feel free to add your own. Some of them I hadn't seen before, it's amazing the support the community has for Holly & family.
TN Holly Bobo case- pics only- no discussion - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=134234)
Capri,
A HUGE thank you for posting the pictures. Holly is such a beautiful woman. The picture taken at the vigil made me cry. Just a spectacular picture of the 'feeling' of community there and the concern for Holly. :gthanks::takeabow:
angeleleven
04-23-2011, 10:03 PM
Geraldo at Large is covering Holly again tonight.
lillys
04-23-2011, 10:05 PM
I can't find the link right now, from last thread, but LE did say that after Sunday they would have to take the search "national" or something to that effect. So I don't think they are convinced she is nearby, they are considering other possibilities, but also it may mean they really have no leads to her location.
Even if they have a POI in mind, that may or may not be helpful in locating Holly. Unless they have or plan to interrogate him and he gives it up, it may be almost impossible to find her.
You said and I thunk it...
Just now I decided that maybe....maybe LE doesn't have a clue where Holly is. That's why the search may go national. I hate the thoughts that she may never be found. But she could sadly be like Haleigh Cummings, Haley Dunn and many many other. :(
imoo
Soul125
04-23-2011, 10:10 PM
I can't find the link right now, from last thread, but LE did say that after Sunday they would have to take the search "national" or something to that effect. So I don't think they are convinced she is nearby, they are considering other possibilities, but also it may mean they really have no leads to her location.
Even if they have a POI in mind, that may or may not be helpful in locating Holly. Unless they have or plan to interrogate him and he gives it up, it may be almost impossible to find her.
I can't imagine a much tougher case for LE. With no crime scene really, what can they possibly have to go on really. Whoever did this probably had this planned carefully and didn't leave much behind to go on. I hate to say it also, but I think it is going to be almost impossible to find her unless LE has something concrete to go on. And I don't think they have anything much to go on at this point.
DNeecie
04-23-2011, 10:10 PM
From Geraldo at Large- Mark Furman says when he called TN (don't know what that means) The dogs did not scent anything around woods by Bobo's house. Don't know if that was TBI confirmed or not.
Eileen730
04-23-2011, 10:11 PM
That was very interesting!
Eileen730
04-23-2011, 10:12 PM
dont ya think someone needs to start ans some questions?
daisy.faithfull
04-23-2011, 10:13 PM
Geraldo at Large is covering Holly again tonight.
I just clicked over. It sounds like MF needs to have some things cleared up before he can clear Holly's brother. I missed what those things were.
G did mention that the dogs did not pick up Holly's scent beyond the property. That's disturbing.
Woe.be.gone
04-23-2011, 10:13 PM
The dog I have seen in a photo of Holly was some hairy Toto looking thing not really suitable for the yard and woods.
Hey, don't call that cutie patootie a 'thing'. :twocents:
Eileen730
04-23-2011, 10:14 PM
From Geraldo at Large- Mark Harman says when he called TN (don't know what that means) The dogs did not scent anything around woods by Bobo's house. Don't know if that was TBI confirmed or not.
Oh DNeecie lol its mark furman,,, i wish it was mark harmon!!!! LOL
he also said it hasnt been established that Holly was seen after 11 pm tues
Alot of questions!
daisy.faithfull
04-23-2011, 10:17 PM
Oh DNeecie lol its mark furman,,, i wish it was mark harmon!!!! LOL
he also said it hasnt been established that Holly was seen after 11 pm tues
Alot of questions!
I missed that. Wow! Wouldn't her parents be able to verify that?
Soul125
04-23-2011, 10:17 PM
I just clicked over. It sounds like MF needs to have some things cleared up before he can clear Holly's brother. I missed what those things were.
G did mention that the dogs did not pick up Holly's scent beyond the property. That's disturbing.
I was thinking the same thing. That leaves them with even less to go on when they appear to have nothing much to begin with. I would have thought the dogs would have picked up something going into the woods unless this guy had a vehicle very nearby. It doesn't seem likely that he would have taken her far on foot. I don't know the area at all, but it looks like some thick woods shown on video. I may have missed this but have they searched the bodies of water across from her house.
DNeecie
04-23-2011, 10:18 PM
Oh DNeecie lol its mark furman,,, i wish it was mark harmon!!!! LOL
he also said it hasnt been established that Holly was seen after 11 pm tues
Alot of questions!
:D Woops! Ha! Been staring at the computer too looooong today. lol
Eileen730
04-23-2011, 10:18 PM
I missed that. Wow! Wouldn't her parents be able to verify that?
We dont know that the parents saw her that morning! thats why they are questioning ....
sleuthan
04-23-2011, 10:18 PM
I just clicked over. It sounds like MF needs to have some things cleared up before he can clear Holly's brother. I missed what those things were.
G did mention that the dogs did not pick up Holly's scent beyond the property. That's disturbing.
well this will be the 3rd time Ive asked the question. but has anyone looked under the pool??
Eileen730
04-23-2011, 10:19 PM
:D Woops! Ha! Been staring at the computer too looooong today. lol
LOL i think we all have !
With You All Things Are Possible - Mark Willard
Eileen730
04-23-2011, 10:20 PM
well this will be the 3rd time Ive asked the question. but has anyone looked under the pool??
dont know but it seems to have a pool cover over it.
Can you imagine??????
ugh
Rallihanna
04-23-2011, 10:20 PM
well this will be the 3rd time Ive asked the question. but has anyone looked under the pool??
It was posted in one of the earlier threads that the pool was checked.
daisy.faithfull
04-23-2011, 10:21 PM
yes the dogs did not pick up her scent!
who saw her after 11 pm that night.
MF said he should have run into the woods after he saw the blood
And why does that person have more credibilty than Holly's parents?
Adrienne37
04-23-2011, 10:21 PM
Personally, myself, considering Mark Fuhrman's history, I take ANYTHING he says with a huge grain of salt.
~jmo~
fraudqueen
04-23-2011, 10:21 PM
I just watched the segment on Geraldo........the following are important issues they raised.....IMO
1-John Walsh said there is only a very slim chance Holly is alive.
2-John Walsh said it bothers him that the family will not speak in public again.
3-John Walsh said the perpetrator could be anywhere.
4- Walsh said everyone should be polygraphed to be ruled....starting with family and then moving to friends.
Mark Furman, who said he has spoken to the TBI himself said:
1-No dogs hit anywhere in the woodline for a scent.
2-He wants to know the last person to see Holly alive besides the brother, did the parents see her that morning or was it more like 8 or 9 hours before that anyone else saw her.
3-He wants to know why the scenario given by the brother has changed 3 times. He wants to know when the brother saw blood, even maybe an hour later, why after calling 911, did he NOT run in the direction through the woods no matter how long he would have to run. Geraldo then pleaded for the parents to call them to help set everything straight.
Then it was told the mother herself arranged to have the T-shirts made to give Holly a vacation when she returns.
another nosey mom
04-23-2011, 10:21 PM
I missed that. Wow! Wouldn't her parents be able to verify that?
I've been reading this on and off all day - not much new news, but when I hear about this, and no one verifying the time they last saw her - this makes me wonder even more, why a timeline has not been established for so many of the things that have been said ie. 911 calls, etc.
just more questions.... very few answers
Rallihanna
04-23-2011, 10:22 PM
It seems like the longer this goes on the less is known. Makes everyone question a lot of things.
dont ya think someone needs to start ans some questions?
Yep, I hope they're answering some now....
DNeecie
04-23-2011, 10:23 PM
well this will be the 3rd time Ive asked the question. but has anyone looked under the pool??
A poster on here is related to someone with TBI. That was one of the first things they did.
Lera213
04-23-2011, 10:23 PM
It was answered by MILofForensicSpecTBI who's DIL that is working this case that her DIL in fact looked under the cover. Not sure if she is verified or not but I believe her.
panthera
04-23-2011, 10:23 PM
I just clicked over. It sounds like MF needs to have some things cleared up before he can clear Holly's brother. I missed what those things were.
G did mention that the dogs did not pick up Holly's scent beyond the property. That's disturbing.
Her brother says he saw her walking into the woods, yet the dogs didn't pick up on her scent? :waitasec: I'm assuming these are trained scent dogs? :waitasec: Something is definitely wrong here! MOO
MILofForensicSpecTBI
04-23-2011, 10:24 PM
well this will be the 3rd time Ive asked the question. but has anyone looked under the pool??
Yes...my DIL was one of the forensic specialists at the crime scene. She personally wrestled the cover from the pool. Nothing was found.
Soul125
04-23-2011, 10:24 PM
What if there was no guy in camo?
Possibly, but what would that suggest? My brain isn't so fast these days. :waitasec:
Eileen730
04-23-2011, 10:26 PM
Yep, I hope they're answering some now....
I hope so too Mick i hope so tooo!
Wouldnt you do it to just clear yourself!
I would think thAT WOULD Be the first thing u would want to do.
Woe.be.gone
04-23-2011, 10:27 PM
Ok, I gotta say, I don't understand the vacation fund.
I know it's not, but in some ways it's like a runaway bribe.. "if you come home we'll give you a (fill in the blank).
And is there a heaven forbid contingency plan? What if she doesn't come home, where does the money go?
Funeral. :banghead:
fraudqueen
04-23-2011, 10:27 PM
I think we need to send Mark Furman to Tennessee, he'd break this case wide open. He's one of the best homicide detectives ever. MOO
s_finch
04-23-2011, 10:28 PM
I hope so too Mick i hope so tooo!
Wouldnt you do it to just clear yourself!
I would think thAT WOULD Be the first thing u would want to do.
We don't know that they haven't taken poly's. Just cuz LE hasn't released any poly results doesn't mean that none have been taken
Soul125
04-23-2011, 10:28 PM
Her brother says he saw her walking into the woods, yet the dogs didn't pick up on her scent? :waitasec: I'm assuming these are trained scent dogs? :waitasec: Something is definitely wrong here! MOO
Yeah, that is what doesn't add up to me also. There would almost have to be a scent trail if she walked into those woods. Something just doesn't seem right at this point.
Rallihanna
04-23-2011, 10:29 PM
Ok the dogs not picking up a scent is really bothering me. I don't know... I still can't shake the thought if what if she ran off ?
Ransom
04-23-2011, 10:30 PM
I just clicked over. It sounds like MF needs to have some things cleared up before he can clear Holly's brother. I missed what those things were.
G did mention that the dogs did not pick up Holly's scent beyond the property. That's disturbing.
What dogs were used? Tracking? Trailing? Makes a HUGE difference. IMO
lillys
04-23-2011, 10:31 PM
I can't imagine a much tougher case for LE. With no crime scene really, what can they possibly have to go on really. Whoever did this probably had this planned carefully and didn't leave much behind to go on. I hate to say it also, but I think it is going to be almost impossible to find her unless LE has something concrete to go on. And I don't think they have anything much to go on at this point.
I could sadly list hundreds of cases just like this.
Again, little Haleigh Cummings, Hailey Dunn, Brittanne Drexel, Kyron Horman, all disappeared leaving little to no evidence. :(
another nosey mom
04-23-2011, 10:31 PM
this may be a really stupid question
did Holly have her own car, and is it still in the driveway - was the trunk checked?
I haven't heard anything like - she was gone, but her car was still there ??
Lera213
04-23-2011, 10:32 PM
You know it could be the reporter speculating too because LE didn't confirm or deny. So the reporter suspects the dogs didn't. How many times have we witnessed the press get it wrong?
sleuthan
04-23-2011, 10:32 PM
Yes...my DIL was one of the forensic specialists at the crime scene. She personally wrestled the cover from the pool. Nothing was found.
Thank you that was bugging me!
So has it been confirmed about the dogs not picking up scent past residence?
daisy.faithfull
04-23-2011, 10:33 PM
I just watched the segment on Geraldo........the following are important issues they raised.....IMO
1-John Walsh said there is only a very slim chance Holly is alive.
2-John Walsh said it bothers him that the family will not speak in public again.
3-John Walsh said the perpetrator could be anywhere.
4- Walsh said everyone should be polygraphed to be ruled....starting with family and then moving to friends.
Mark Furman, who said he has spoken to the TBI himself said:
1-No dogs hit anywhere in the woodline for a scent.
2-He wants to know the last person to see Holly alive besides the brother, did the parents see her that morning or was it more like 8 or 9 hours before that anyone else saw her.
3-He wants to know why the scenario given by the brother has changed 3 times. He wants to know when the brother saw blood, even maybe an hour later, why after calling 911, did he NOT run in the direction through the woods no matter how long he would have to run. Geraldo then pleaded for the parents to call them to help set everything straight.
Then it was told the mother herself arranged to have the T-shirts made to give Holly a vacation when she returns.
Last week Marc Klaas was on Nancy Grace discussing Phylicia Barnes. He made the comment that in most cases like Phylicia's after the abduction they are raped and killed.
Not something anyone wants to think about, but sadly I think that Holly is no longer alive.
panthera
04-23-2011, 10:34 PM
What dogs were used? Tracking? Trailing? Makes a HUGE difference. IMO
That is exactly what I'm questioning first, before jumping to another conclusion. MOO
cluciano63
04-23-2011, 10:34 PM
I don't know if it is a good idea to take Mark Fuhrman as gospel, anymore than Nancy Grace. He may be experienced, but it is Fox and they do like drama...kind of like HLN to me.
Ransom
04-23-2011, 10:34 PM
You know it could be the reporter speculating too because LE didn't confirm or deny. So the reporter suspects the dogs didn't. How many times have we witnessed the press get it wrong?
14, 234,767 + or - a few. Good guess on my part. IMO
Ransom
04-23-2011, 10:36 PM
That is exactly what I'm questioning first, before jumping to another conclusion. MOO
Me too. Different dogs for each circumstance. Different handlers. LE vs private, etc. WE don't know and that was my "lame" attempt to make a point. Back to lurking.
vjlaw
04-23-2011, 10:37 PM
I didn't see Geraldo's show. Did Mark F. discuss the scream supposedly heard by the neighbor? Also, maybe the brother saw her walking toward the woods but maybe she never actually went into the woods. Just more unanswered questions. Was Mark in TN or did he say if he will go there?
Woe.be.gone
04-23-2011, 10:38 PM
Money is the root of all evil. ~ Just thought I throw this comment out here.:viking::praying::deadhorse::couch:
:up:This is the closest smilie I could find to represent Easter!:up:
Adrienne37
04-23-2011, 10:39 PM
Mark Fuhrman is a known liar so again I wouldn't take anything that comes out of his mouth as gospel.
~jmo~
daisy.faithfull
04-23-2011, 10:39 PM
Thank you that was bugging me!
So has it been confirmed about the dogs not picking up scent past residence?
I wonder if they had cadaver dogs out there.
I'm still not to suspicious of Holly's brother. I don't think that we have been given a clear enough account of what he said happened.
More importantly from what I understand there is just such a small window of time that the brother had to kill Holly, hide her somewhere and then plant the lunch box and duct tape (if that is related). But then again I don't think we know much about the timeline.
I hope that the brother didn't do it.
DNeecie
04-23-2011, 10:40 PM
I didn't see Geraldo's show. Did Mark F. discuss the scream supposedly heard by the neighbor? Also, maybe the brother saw her walking toward the woods but maybe she never actually went into the woods. Just more unanswered questions. Was Mark in TN or did he say if he will go there?
He was not in TN, he said he called and didn't say who he talked to. The scream wasn't discussed either.
No Ransom, it's a very good point. We really have to be careful getting hung up on the dog issue. LE tracking dogs are NOT the same as SAR trailing dogs. Again, like on so many cases that pop up on here you hear about how there was no scent past the house/property. HUH? Of course there was, she probably left the house daily to go somewhere, so there were plenty of trails. Now, they may very well have lost it and that could quite possibly be because she got in a car and these dogs had not trained for car trailing, because it is certainly a different beast. My long winded point is, they are just a tool, and they can be faulty for a variety of reasons. They are wonderful tools, but if you are not successful with one, then you try another and another until you either find the person or you get a consensus. And if you are using the wrong type of dog for the job, well all bets off.
Eileen730
04-23-2011, 10:42 PM
I don't know if it is a good idea to take Mark Fuhrman as gospel, anymore than Nancy Grace. He may be experienced, but it is Fox and they do like drama...kind of like HLN to me.
I like Mark Furman Fox news is a paycheck for him
With all of Nancy graces faults she sure does alot for missing ppl
John walsh said the same thing.
I dont think they are pointing fingers. They just want to rule these ppl out.
JMO
cluciano63
04-23-2011, 10:42 PM
Only one report used the word "flecks" of blood and I think it was radar online, via Nancy Grace, so again...grain of salt. LE said a "small amount."
Melanie
04-23-2011, 10:42 PM
May have been asked and answered - but did the brother take a LDT?
Thanks,
Mel
SheWhoMustNotBeNamed
04-23-2011, 10:43 PM
ENOUGH with the accusations and speculation of family member involvement!!! IT STOPS NOW. You have all been warned multiple times.
-It's fine to discuss the brother and anyone mentioned in the media and tied to this case. Its not ok to talk about him or anyone as a suspect or POI. No one has been named as such.
Might be a good time for some of you to review our rules here: Rules Etiquette & Information - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community
Wondergirl
04-23-2011, 10:43 PM
Forgive me if this has already been addressed, but, if I were LE I would be wondering about the males NOT in attendance at this vigil.
It looks like the whole town is there.
http://s3.amazonaws.com/twitpic/photos/large/281126427.jpg?AWSAccessKeyId=AKIAJF3XCCKACR3QDMOA&Expires=1303613818&Signature=qGAAGHGxFxDFHHCJsPTaYGIOsCo%3D
http://twitpic.com/4ndijf Will Nunley Twitter
s_finch
04-23-2011, 10:43 PM
Money is the root of all evil. ~ Just thought I throw this comment out here.:viking::praying::deadhorse::couch:
:up:This is the closest smilie I could find to represent Easter!:up:
Actually, the scripture 1 Timothy 6:10 "The love of money is the root of all evil" and I don't see the importance of that in this situation, I may be wrong and if I am will be the first to admit it.
cluciano63
04-23-2011, 10:43 PM
I like Mark Furman Fox news is a paycheck for him
With all of Nancy graces faults she sure does alot for missing ppl
John walsh said the same thing.
I dont think they are pointing fingers. They just want to rule these ppl out.
JMO
I don't think they are pointing fingers, but they are trying to get better ratings...Geraldo is a talk show, just like NG, not really news hour.
angeleleven
04-23-2011, 10:45 PM
I actually enjoy listening to Mark F.
Rallihanna
04-23-2011, 10:45 PM
I have a feeling whoever did this would attend the vigil don't you think? I mean if they're local they wouldn't want to stand out by not being there either...
daisy.faithfull
04-23-2011, 10:46 PM
No Ransom, it's a very good point. We really have to be careful getting hung up on the dog issue. LE tracking dogs are NOT the same as SAR trailing dogs. Again, like on so many cases that pop up on here you hear about how there was no scent past the house/property. HUH? Of course there was, she probably left the house daily to go somewhere, so there were plenty of trails. Now, they may very well have lost it and that could quite possibly be because she got in a car and these dogs had not trained for car trailing, because it is certainly a different beast. My long winded point is, they are just a tool, and they can be faulty for a variety of reasons. They are wonderful tools, but if you are not successful with one, then you try another and another until you either find the person or you get a consensus. And if you are using the wrong type of dog for the job, well all bets off.
In some ways then they are like lie detector tests, yet I thought that the dogs can be used in court, right?
Soul125
04-23-2011, 10:47 PM
I have a feeling whoever did this would attend the vigil don't you think? I mean if they're local they wouldn't want to stand out by not being there either...
I agree. I don't think whoever did this would want to draw attention to themselves by not attending. A local would want to blend in at this time especially. I think the person who did this is local. It seems very unlikely that a person not familiar with the area would just drive somewhere and take a person.
sleuthan
04-23-2011, 10:48 PM
Only one report used the word "flecks" of blood and I think it was radar online, via Nancy Grace, so again...grain of salt. LE said a "small amount."
even small amount think about what dried blood looks like. If it had been found inside the home than it would def stand out more but outside with so many outside elemets ints just not that easy to spot unless we are talking a bloody handprint or smeared blood again on color of contrast. The blood is something the LE would find after the fact but this small amount seems odd to spot that right away if youre not looking for it. of course we still know what a small amount is and how it was found but it has been bothering me that this blood was found so quickly by an untrained eye
Yes, dogs have been used in court (well, u know what I mean). But, thanks to some less than scrupulous handlers they have really taken a beating and get ripped apart more than ever now. Hence the importance to immaculate and detailed training and mission records.
cluciano63
04-23-2011, 10:49 PM
When LE says "local" I guess I was thinking local as in within the county or general area, not particularly Parsons, maybe. So it may well be someone who followed Holly to school, i.e. but not anyone who would be recognized by her friends or family.
not_my_kids
04-23-2011, 10:49 PM
I don't know if any of what's going on in my brain really makes sense even to me, but lately I've been spending a lot of time contemplating the perp and how he would have picked Holly, why he picked Holly and just generally who he is.
1. I think Holly's chances of being selected as a random victim of opportunity are about nil. Maybe the perp initially picking her at random to fixate on, but not just happening to drive past her house in the middle of nowhere, where you can't see the garage from the road, and deciding to wander up and see if there happened to be a pretty young woman around.
2. I don't think that Holly would have stayed silent to her parents and big brother if there were someone in her life that was making her uncomfortable. She would have told someone if she were threatened or felt she were being stalked or watched.
3. Holly herself is a low risk victim, that was taken in a high risk abduction. She was stable, not a real hard partier from what we have heard, did not seem to have a substance or gambling problem, typical college girl still living at her rural home with her family and seemingly, her older brother. She didn't seem to have a million boyfriends and seemed to prefer her church to any wild scene. Extremely low risk. However, her abduction was broad daylight, in a small community, at her home, with a potential witness and under circumstances where she was bound to be found missing pretty quickly, whether her brother was home or not. I'm having a hard time reconciling this part.
4. I think her abductor is a local, but not necessarily a long time local. Hunting seems to be a big pastime in just about any season in that part of TN. If he is an avid hunter or outdoorsman, it could have taken him only a couple of years to get the lay of the land and know those woods as well as anyone else that's lived there forever. If people that have lived there their whole lives are overwhelmed by the community response, I think he is as well.
5. I think the perp is a planner, likely someone that would be described as intense, a planner. In fact, I think he plans too much. I think he planned this out much more than he needed to, partly because he can't help himself, partly to make the whole scene fit his fantasy. His fantasy was to carry her off into the woods, or off into the sunset might be more how he sees it, even though it would have been much safer and smarter to just put her in the car, and either drive off with her or make her drive off somewhere. That way there would have been no crime scene at all, no blood, no car, no items left behind, and she might have gone a full 24 hours without being reported. Possibly longer if he could have made her call or text her family. But he didn't, he walked her across her backyard in daylight, and into the woods...
6. I think he has been involved in the search for two reasons, it's a small town where everyone is involved in the search, so it would look suspicious if he weren't a part of it, and because he likes the attention, even though no one knows it's him. He's not a genius, there were much smoother ways to pull this off, but every day that it goes on and every time that someone talks about how smart the perp is, he gets an ego boost. He's going to be reading the news, and buying the papers, but he's also going to be that guy on the search team that is glowing at the end of the day when everyone else is withering from heat and exhaustion.
That's not all of it, but I needed to clear my brain a little. As always, MOO.
Plumeria5
04-23-2011, 10:49 PM
With all the rainstorms, would the dogs be able to pick up a scent now? Or, is it being reported that the dogs never picked up a scent from the beginning?
Ransom
04-23-2011, 10:50 PM
No Ransom, it's a very good point. We really have to be careful getting hung up on the dog issue. LE tracking dogs are NOT the same as SAR trailing dogs. Again, like on so many cases that pop up on here you hear about how there was no scent past the house/property. HUH? Of course there was, she probably left the house daily to go somewhere, so there were plenty of trails. Now, they may very well have lost it and that could quite possibly be because she got in a car and these dogs had not trained for car trailing, because it is certainly a different beast. My long winded point is, they are just a tool, and they can be faulty for a variety of reasons. They are wonderful tools, but if you are not successful with one, then you try another and another until you either find the person or you get a consensus. And if you are using the wrong type of dog for the job, well all bets off.
I so agree. :clap:
Wondergirl
04-23-2011, 10:50 PM
I have a feeling whoever did this would attend the vigil don't you think? I mean if they're local they wouldn't want to stand out by not being there either...
Normally, I would agree with you on this. As in cases where a perp might attend the funeral of their victim etc.
But Holly being missing has her small hometown shaken to it's very foundation. LE will be severely scrutinizing all males that would possibly fit the profile, at events like these, and I do not actually feel that he would risk going there.
Therefore I have to stick with my original assesment, and look to someone who was strangely missing from the community event. Possibly someone who would "normally" attend such a gathering, or even one who would never.
Just 2 cents.
fraudqueen
04-23-2011, 10:51 PM
That's what I forgot. Mark Furman said they have the DNA of the blood back and they know who it belongs to but they are not releasing the information.
Unfortunately, we don't know any more now than the day poor Holly disappeared. It is all so very sad. IMO
sleuthan
04-23-2011, 10:51 PM
No Ransom, it's a very good point. We really have to be careful getting hung up on the dog issue. LE tracking dogs are NOT the same as SAR trailing dogs. Again, like on so many cases that pop up on here you hear about how there was no scent past the house/property. HUH? Of course there was, she probably left the house daily to go somewhere, so there were plenty of trails. Now, they may very well have lost it and that could quite possibly be because she got in a car and these dogs had not trained for car trailing, because it is certainly a different beast. My long winded point is, they are just a tool, and they can be faulty for a variety of reasons. They are wonderful tools, but if you are not successful with one, then you try another and another until you either find the person or you get a consensus. And if you are using the wrong type of dog for the job, well all bets off.
I agree but we are also talking about a bunch of other (everything) not making sense- this case makes everything suspect
panthera
04-23-2011, 10:51 PM
I agree. I don't think whoever did this would want to draw attention to themselves by not attending. A local would want to blend in at this time especially. I think the person who did this is local. It seems very unlikely that a person not familiar with the area would just drive somewhere and take a person.
I also agree and believe LE is often in attendance to observe whose behavior might stand out from the norm. MOO
daisy.faithfull
04-23-2011, 10:53 PM
Only one report used the word "flecks" of blood and I think it was radar online, via Nancy Grace, so again...grain of salt. LE said a "small amount."
It was OK magazine. Huge grain of salt!
When they first brought it up on the show Nancy's fill in called them on it, yet they still had the "flecks of blood" caption at the bottom of the screen. Nancy talked about them the next night too.
sleuthan
04-23-2011, 10:54 PM
It was OK magazine. Huge grain of salt!
When they first brought it up on the show Nancy's fill in called them on it, yet they still had the "flecks of blood" caption at the bottom of the screen. Nancy talked about them the next night too.
lol more like a ton of salt grains
Wondergirl
04-23-2011, 10:54 PM
The other thing is, if the blood found was actually the perp's, LE could possibly be discreetly obtaining DNA from any male's fitting the profile at events like the vigil etc. I don't know if the perp would risk that (if it is HIS blood).
Soul125
04-23-2011, 10:56 PM
That's what I forgot. Mark Furman said they have the DNA of the blood back and they know who it belongs to but they are not releasing the information.
Unfortunately, we don't know any more now than the day poor Holly disappeared. It is all so very sad. IMO
Sadly, I am beginning to wonder what direction this case is going to go in the upcoming days. I had high hopes at first, but now am beginning to wonder what is going to happen.
lillys
04-23-2011, 10:58 PM
I don't know if it is a good idea to take Mark Fuhrman as gospel, anymore than Nancy Grace. He may be experienced, but it is Fox and they do like drama...kind of like HLN to me.
Maybe we'll have confirmation soon from LE. I dont know what to believe.
not_my_kids
04-23-2011, 10:59 PM
Okay, if she wasn't seen by anyone after 11 the night before, including her parents, that would change my opinion of potential suspects. But I'll also be honest, I don't put a lot of stock in Geraldo's sources...that's just me though.
I will not agree that her brother should have run into the woods after seeing the blood. He should have done exactly what he did, IMO. Called 911, and stayed put. By the time he saw the blood, they were long gone.
panthera
04-23-2011, 11:00 PM
The other thing is, if the blood found was actually the perp's, LE could possibly be discreetly obtaining DNA from any male's fitting the profile at events like the vigil etc. I don't know if the perp would risk that (if it is HIS blood).
*If* the blood does belong to the perp, one question would have to be where did it come from - bloody nose, cut on the arm or hand, etc and is the injury still visible? It would seem whoever would have to be cut or injured in a manner that would cause blood loss to be on the ground in a short amount of time while he was abducting Holly. I am also curious what type of shoes Holly was wearing that morning since another logical origin for the blood could be a cut on her foot, although I would also think there would be more than a small amount since she was walking away into the woods. MOO
daisy7
04-23-2011, 11:01 PM
Okay, if she wasn't seen by anyone after 11 the night before, including her parents, that would change my opinion of potential suspects. But I'll also be honest, I don't put a lot of stock in Geraldo's sources...that's just me though.
I will not agree that her brother should have run into the woods after seeing the blood. He should have done exactly what he did, IMO. Called 911, and stayed put. By the time he saw the blood, they were long gone.
Do we have any confirmation that she wasn't seen by her parents after 11pm the night before she went missing?
We're going to watch 'Stary Night'......see ya'll later my friends. :)
Wondergirl
04-23-2011, 11:02 PM
I don't know if any of what's going on in my brain really makes sense even to me, but lately I've been spending a lot of time contemplating the perp and how he would have picked Holly, why he picked Holly and just generally who he is.
1. I think Holly's chances of being selected as a random victim of opportunity are about nil. Maybe the perp initially picking her at random to fixate on, but not just happening to drive past her house in the middle of nowhere, where you can't see the garage from the road, and deciding to wander up and see if there happened to be a pretty young woman around.
shortened for brevity
Great post, lots of good points.
BBM: The recent case of multiple murderer, former Colonel Russell Williams, did just what you suggest here as implausable.
He drove by his victims' house in a rural area, where her house was set far back from the road, witnessed her excercising in her window, spied on her (probably with night vision goggles and disguised in her back rural yard), and eventually broke in and took her. Not in the daytime, mind you, but it was very rural, he fixated on her beauty, and he hunted her.
His unusual tires left a track in the field beside her house, and LE detected those tires on his vehicle that fit the profile, 1 week later at a roadside check. He had gone to a car wash to vaccuum out evidence. FWIW
Eileen730
04-23-2011, 11:05 PM
Sadly, I am beginning to wonder what direction this case is going to go in the upcoming days. I had high hopes at first, but now am beginning to wonder what is going to happen.
Well it sure dosent seem very promising does it?
panthera
04-23-2011, 11:06 PM
Well it sure dosent seem very promising does it?
All we can do is pray for a miracle! :prayer:
Have a good night everyone, and Happy Easter!
daisy.faithfull
04-23-2011, 11:07 PM
Do we have any confirmation that she wasn't seen by her parents after 11pm the night before she went missing?
To my knowledge tonight's Geraldo At Large is the first time we have even heard anything about 11pm.
Personally, I'm waiting for a better source to confirm that.
I gotta go and finish getting things ready for Easter!
Happy Easter everyone! Hopefully we will wake tomorrow and Holly will be at home... :beats:
Ransom
04-23-2011, 11:07 PM
The other thing is, if the blood found was actually the perp's, LE could possibly be discreetly obtaining DNA from any male's fitting the profile at events like the vigil etc. I don't know if the perp would risk that (if it is HIS blood).
TN is only one of 24 states that takes DNA upon an arrest. THAT DNA is entered into the data base. The full PCR DNA takes longer than just a test for human blood. Let's give the TBI and LE time to figure this out. I have faith in them. I have no doubt the "family" have been told to zip it. They wait, just like "us". I respect that and SO appreciate their silence and not have to read garbage about the family members "body language", etc.
The other states need a "conviction" before DNA is taken. :( http://www.dnasaves.org/
JMO
not_my_kids
04-23-2011, 11:09 PM
Do we have any confirmation that she wasn't seen by her parents after 11pm the night before she went missing?
None whatsoever, was just going off what was posted via Geraldo and his, uh, ahem, *sources*.
Plumeria5
04-23-2011, 11:10 PM
With all the rainstorms, would the dogs be able to pick up a scent now? Or, is it being reported that the dogs never picked up a scent from the beginning?
Since no one replied I decided I would. To my own post! LOL.
http://www.vsrda.org/index.php/training/56-search-management/126-article-effective-use-of-dogs-sar-mgmt
charminglane
04-23-2011, 11:12 PM
Great post, lots of good points.
BBM: The recent case of multiple murderer, former Colonel Russell Williams, did just what you suggest here as implausable.
He drove by his victims' house in a rural area, where her house was set far back from the road, witnessed her excercising in her window, spied on her (probably with night vision goggles and disguised in her back rural yard), and eventually broke in and took her. Not in the daytime, mind you, but it was very rural, he fixated on her beauty, and he hunted her.
His unusual tires left a track in the field beside her house, and LE detected those tires on his vehicle that fit the profile, 1 week later at a roadside check. He had gone to a car wash to vaccuum out evidence. FWIW
Maybe the Colonel is a hero to someone?
norest4thewicked
04-23-2011, 11:18 PM
I wanted to say something that I've repeated from day one of this search and hopefully everyone will remember it. What LE knows or does not know, is for them to decide whether or not to release the information. I doubt very seriously that they have ANY concern whatsoever of what people are gossiping about on a forum on the Internet. What we hear from them is for a reason. They are entitled to keep quiet on this case and only release what they feel is vital information to be let out to the public. I sure wish that people would stop saying that they "owe" us any answers. They owe us nothing. I can almost certainly say that all they care about is bringing Holly home.
Sorry Daisy, popping in and out. I posted the weather for the days after, and not I can't quite remember, but if I recall correctly they haven't gotten any flooders, less than 2 inches since she went missing correct? I'd take those odds anyday.
DNeecie
04-23-2011, 11:29 PM
According to News Channel 5---
Searchers hope to have the entire local area searched by Sunday evening.
http://www.newschannel5.com/story/14503276/local-terrain-to-be-completely-covered-in-search-for-bobo
So they are definitely expanding after tomorrow.
Irish_Eyes
04-23-2011, 11:41 PM
Do we have any confirmation that she wasn't seen by her parents after 11pm the night before she went missing?
I honestly don't know if it matters. I think Geraldo would set his own mother up as a suspect if he thought he'd get more ratings that way, JMHO.
The brother saw her that morning. Maybe some people don't believe him. But the boyfriend got a text from her. Maybe some people think the perp could have sent that. But the neighbor heard her scream IN THE MORNING. So I think all these things taken together speak for themselves and show that it pretty much went down like we've heard...taken against her will from the driveway in the morning by an as of yet unknown person.
norest4thewicked
04-23-2011, 11:48 PM
Nite everyone! I am hoping for an Easter miracle and that Holly is brought home tomorrow! Everyone have a nice Easter!
3Boys' Mama
04-23-2011, 11:54 PM
Gosh, I'm quite shocked. Makes me wanna drive up there and search but it's 7 hrs away from me.
Am so thankful for these volunteers! Thank you for going there! Praying hard for Holly on this holiday weekend...wish I could help!
daisy7
04-24-2011, 12:07 AM
I honestly don't know if it matters. I think Geraldo would set his own mother up as a suspect if he thought he'd get more ratings that way, JMHO.
The brother saw her that morning. Maybe some people don't believe him. But the boyfriend got a text from her. Maybe some people think the perp could have sent that. But the neighbor heard her scream IN THE MORNING. So I think all these things taken together speak for themselves and show that it pretty much went down like we've heard...taken against her will from the driveway in the morning by an as of yet unknown person.
I must have missed about the text to the boyfriend. Can someone let me know about this? TIA!
mkay882
04-24-2011, 12:08 AM
It just makes them look selfish and I don't think they realize it.
I think the money should be going back to the Vols who helped search for Holly.
I think people are going to be very upset if they find out that all that money is going to Holly to do whatever she pleases with it.
Way behind trying to catch up, but
Speaking only for myself here, if I donate money, after expenses are whatever are paid, I don't care what they do with what's left.
When it leaves my hands it's theirs to do with what they please. MOO
concentric
04-24-2011, 12:09 AM
*If* the blood does belong to the perp, one question would have to be where did it come from - bloody nose, cut on the arm or hand, etc and is the injury still visible? It would seem whoever would have to be cut or injured in a manner that would cause blood loss to be on the ground in a short amount of time while he was abducting Holly. I am also curious what type of shoes Holly was wearing that morning since another logical origin for the blood could be a cut on her foot, although I would also think there would be more than a small amount since she was walking away into the woods. MOO
There are many cases wherein the assailant cuts himself with his own knife. His hand slips onto the blade.
Ransom
04-24-2011, 12:18 AM
I must have missed about the text to the boyfriend. Can someone let me know about this? TIA!
My very limited knowledge, it comes from Nancy Grace
http://nancygrace.blogs.cnn.com/2011/04/22/source-missing-nurse-holly-bobos-cell-pinged-after-abduction/
belimom
04-24-2011, 12:23 AM
Maybe the Colonel is a hero to someone?
Sorry but can you explain? I'm just popping back in here after being diverted to Phylicia Barnes' thread for awhile so maybe I missed something. :waitasec:
shefner
04-24-2011, 12:26 AM
Way behind trying to catch up, but
Speaking only for myself here, if I donate money, after expenses are whatever are paid, I don't care what they do with what's left.
When it leaves my hands it's theirs to do with what they please. MOO
From the recent articles I read, the T-shirts are being sold and all the proceeds are going to the "Holly Bobo Fund." Her mother told their neighbor she wanted to raise money so Holly could take a vacation or get anything she wants when she returns.
Some sites are saying that the money is going solely to the reward fund....others say part to reward, part to family...the other articles say its all for Holly.
I guess I just find it strange to be thinking in these terms at all. I had a son that was missing for 4 days about 7 years ago and it was mind-numbing. My obsession was finding him (which LE did)....not T-shirts or vacations. Not being harsh but just trying to understand.
Here is the link to the News 3 article saying the money is for Holly:
http://www.wreg.com/news/wreg-bob-friday,0,1689775.story
Oh...this whole new selling of the t-shirts for money does not sit well with me after reading some comments on various other sources/forums/facebook about money issues. I HATE to be skeptical, but IMO something just feels very odd about everything. Makes me sad.
not_my_kids
04-24-2011, 12:38 AM
Oh...this whole new selling of the t-shirts for money does not sit well with me after reading some comments on various other sources/forums/facebook about money issues. I HATE to be skeptical, but IMO something just feels very odd about everything. Makes me sad.
I would feel the same way...if her family were selling them. They aren't.
if the people of the community had been decieved about where the money was going. They haven't.
if we had heard anything suspicious from the family themselves. We haven't.
Moo and other appropriate farmyard noises.
charminglane
04-24-2011, 12:42 AM
Great post, lots of good points.
BBM: The recent case of multiple murderer, former Colonel Russell Williams, did just what you suggest here as implausable.
He drove by his victims' house in a rural area, where her house was set far back from the road, witnessed her excercising in her window, spied on her (probably with night vision goggles and disguised in her back rural yard), and eventually broke in and took her. Not in the daytime, mind you, but it was very rural, he fixated on her beauty, and he hunted her.
His unusual tires left a track in the field beside her house, and LE detected those tires on his vehicle that fit the profile, 1 week later at a roadside check. He had gone to a car wash to vaccuum out evidence. FWIW
Here it is.
maskedwoman
04-24-2011, 12:49 AM
Thank you for the warm welcome! The TBI has committed a lot of resources and people to this case. I'm amazed at their dedication and very proud of my DIL for the work she and her co-workers do. The media doesn't know everything that the investigation has uncovered. The TBI has a reason for keeping much of the information out of the media...I trust implicitly in their judgement.
You have every right to be proud. :) And thank you for confirming that. I have suspected as much, but it's nice to hear anyway. Although I have a headache from doing this: :banghead: , I take comfort in the fact that LE knows so much more than we realize (or usually give them credit for). Even in Florida, with their extensive sunshine laws, new information comes out about the Casey Anthony case all the time.
Plumeria5
04-24-2011, 12:50 AM
Holly's mom may be so emotionally distraught, in denial, and very likely medicated that she is not reacting or making decisions she might usually make.
I had read some comments under a news article that she was so unsteady on her feet that she had to be held up during a news conference but wasn't crying tears. I have heard an expression someone was "beyond tears" which may apply here.
maskedwoman
04-24-2011, 12:53 AM
Not sure why they are there, but Will Nunley reported it in his tweets. It makes me recall that Kyron's dad and stepmom had 24/7 police presence with them too initially. Perhaps it's SOP in cases like this? In case of a ransom demand or something else??
That makes a lot of sense. It may also allow them to observe the family dynamic up close and learn things that might take quite a while to surface in an interrogation room.
cluciano63
04-24-2011, 12:53 AM
This has been such an exhausting ten days following Holly's case, and yet nothing like what those in her town and family have endured. I wish I had more optimism, but tonight I keep thinking of the girl who stole my heart a few years ago, Amber DuBois, and the kind of monster who took her right off the street on the way to school...and what it took to catch him, the life of another beautiful girl. And Amber never would have been found, if the monster had not eventually led LE to where he buried her out in the desert.
CHARLISA
04-24-2011, 12:56 AM
I would feel the same way...if her family were selling them. They aren't.
if the people of the community had been decieved about where the money was going. They haven't.
if we had heard anything suspicious from the family themselves. We haven't.
Moo and other appropriate farmyard noises.
Also, we do not know (and it is none of our business) how much personal money the family has paid into the reward fund. For all we know, they had to get a personal loan, 2nd mortgage, etc., to help bring their loving daughter home. Perhaps this is a close friend's way of letting them have the money to refund them. Personally, I think this is very kind. As far as where the money goes they are getting, you have a choice buy a shirt or don't buy a shirt. No one is volunteering, preparing food, advertising, etc., to be reimbursed (as far as I know). If a volunteer has a problem with this, then they can bring it to the shirt seller's attention. Finally, it doesn't sound like Ms. Bobo asked the person(s) selling the shirts to do this for her, they just wanted to.
CHARLISA
04-24-2011, 01:01 AM
This has been such an exhausting ten days following Holly's case, and yet nothing like what those in her town and family have endured. I wish I had more optimism, but tonight I keep thinking of the girl who stole my heart a few years ago, Amber DuBois, and the kind of monster who took her right off the street on the way to school...and what it took to catch him, the life of another beautiful girl. And Amber never would have been found, if the monster had not eventually led LE to where he buried her out in the desert.
And the many times he broke probation and should have been back in jail and wasn't. He would have never been around to kill either of these girls. Also, Chelsey's parents took the death penalty off the table so Amber could be found.
maskedwoman
04-24-2011, 01:10 AM
That is very strange!? What to make of that? Any idea of when they were removed? Could LE have told him to do that? But don't know why...
My first impulse is to think LE has a more important things to do, but these days, you never know, lol. However, perhaps we shouldn't read too much into some of these things. He's under a lot of pressure for someone his age.
Ransom
04-24-2011, 01:12 AM
I just watched the segment on Geraldo........the following are important issues they raised.....IMO
1-John Walsh said there is only a very slim chance Holly is alive.
2-John Walsh said it bothers him that the family will not speak in public again.
3-John Walsh said the perpetrator could be anywhere.
4- Walsh said everyone should be polygraphed to be ruled....starting with family and then moving to friends.
Mark Furman, who said he has spoken to the TBI himself said:
1-No dogs hit anywhere in the woodline for a scent.
2-He wants to know the last person to see Holly alive besides the brother, did the parents see her that morning or was it more like 8 or 9 hours before that anyone else saw her.
3-He wants to know why the scenario given by the brother has changed 3 times. He wants to know when the brother saw blood, even maybe an hour later, why after calling 911, did he NOT run in the direction through the woods no matter how long he would have to run. Geraldo then pleaded for the parents to call them to help set everything straight.
Then it was told the mother herself arranged to have the T-shirts made to give Holly a vacation when she returns.
Since MF TALKED to TBI: they should have told him the answers. Guess not or he forgot or something to ask the TBI since he was talking to them and all that. lol.
SummerRaye
04-24-2011, 01:14 AM
I apologize if this question was asked and answered earlier....just been on my mind...
Did the neighbor say that they heard A scream? or did the neighbor hear multiple screams...
just been buggin me and it probably doesnt matter....
not_my_kids
04-24-2011, 01:19 AM
I apologize if this question was asked and answered earlier....just been on my mind...
Did the neighbor say that they heard A scream? or did the neighbor hear multiple screams...
just been buggin me and it probably doesnt matter....
I've only heard it described as a scream or the scream in the media reports, but that doesn't mean that it was only one. I do think if it were more than one more than a few seconds apart it would have been described as more than one, but with the media reporting on this case, we really can't be sure.
So, Mark is saying he was told that no dogs hit at/in the woodline? So what, he walked her across the lawn and then beamed her up? Sorry, clearly I need some sleep.
maskedwoman
04-24-2011, 01:22 AM
[/B]
BBM
Could very much be the "thrill of the hunt"..........
I'm sorry to be so dumb. I cannot figure out what BBM means. Can someone translate please? Thanks!
not_my_kids
04-24-2011, 01:24 AM
So, Mark is saying he was told that no dogs hit at/in the woodline? So what, he walked her across the lawn and then beamed her up? Sorry, clearly I need some sleep.
I didn't get to see Geraldo, not that I'm heartbroken, but did he say WHEN the dogs ddidn't hit? that day, the next, a week after? And, as always, what type of dogs, air scent, ground scent, cadaver? Sigh, i wish they'd start telling us what kind of dogs, just for clarity, in some of these reports, but sadly, I don't think many reporters know enough about the field to ask.
Trino
04-24-2011, 01:24 AM
T-Shirts
Selling T-shirts could be a six figure income for the Bobos. I don't know if they've thought this though, but this would also be taxable income. Additionally, there is a TN state tax on all clothing sold within TN.
Assuming they have a sharp attorney, and the money is put into Holly's name, this would still be taxable income for her. I don't see how it could be considered charity.
not_my_kids
04-24-2011, 01:26 AM
I'm sorry to be so dumb. I cannot figure out what BBM means. Can someone translate please? Thanks!
Bolded By Me. (To indicate that text in bold was emphasized by that poster instead of the one that originally wrote the article or qouted post.)
UBM is Underlined By Me, means the same thing.
Not a dumb question, I had to ask too.
cluciano63
04-24-2011, 01:26 AM
And the many times he broke probation and should have been back in jail and wasn't. He would have never been around to kill either of these girls. Also, Chelsey's parents took the death penalty off the table so Amber could be found.
I know all that, but also, LE would not have found Amber on their own...that is what scares me about some of these cases.
cluciano63
04-24-2011, 01:28 AM
I didn't get to see Geraldo, not that I'm heartbroken, but did he say WHEN the dogs ddidn't hit? that day, the next, a week after? And, as always, what type of dogs, air scent, ground scent, cadaver? Sigh, i wish they'd start telling us what kind of dogs, just for clarity, in some of these reports, but sadly, I don't think many reporters know enough about the field to ask.
Not that I know if MF is telling the truth, but he said this first sometime last week, shortly after she went missing.
not_my_kids
04-24-2011, 01:29 AM
T-Shirts
Selling T-shirts could be a six figure income for the Bobos. I don't know if they've thought this though, but this would also be taxable income. Additionally, there is a TN state tax on all clothing sold within TN.
Assuming they have a sharp attorney, and the money is put into Holly's name, this would still be taxable income for her. I don't see how it could be considered charity.
I'm sure if the Bobo's ever start selling tee shirts, that will be a consideration. As of right now, they aren't. Parson's Flowers is selling tee shirts on behalf of and to the benefit of Holly herself.
maskedwoman
04-24-2011, 01:32 AM
Not to mention all the food and things people have donated INTERNATIONALLY for this family and for this search. Churches in the area have donated thousands of dollars that is not showing up in the news articles...I think it is AMAZINGLY selfish that they could be thinking this way while so many are giving everything they can to help this family....
This is turning into a circus FAST.
I think we have quite a bit to go before we get to the circus. After following the Casey Anthony trial, my definition of circus changed forever. That case not only turned into a circus, the family were the ringmasters! :sick:
katydid23
04-24-2011, 01:34 AM
So, Mark is saying he was told that no dogs hit at/in the woodline? So what, he walked her across the lawn and then beamed her up? Sorry, clearly I need some sleep.
I saw that too. It seems kind of problematic because those dogs were brought in really fast. This was one of the fastest and biggest turnouts of LE I have seen in a missing person case. So it seems strange that no scent was followed, especially since one of the people were supposedly wounded and bleeding slightly. Seems very odd, imo.
I would feel the same way...if her family were selling them. They aren't.
if the people of the community had been decieved about where the money was going. They haven't.
if we had heard anything suspicious from the family themselves. We haven't.
Moo and other appropriate farmyard noises.
I thought I just read a couple pages back that her mom had something to do with it? Sorry, don't have a post to reference, posting from my phone right now.
maskedwoman
04-24-2011, 01:41 AM
At last count, 2500 T-shirts had been sold at $12.00 = $30,000. That would be a heck of a vacation for anyone.
Keep in mind, that I doubt those tshirts were donated. So there is a cost for the t-shirt and any printing done on it. I really doubt they are clearing the full purchase price for each shirt sold.
Irish_Eyes
04-24-2011, 01:42 AM
I was once married to a sociopath. He wasn't a killer or a rapist or anything, (most of them are not), but he was (is) a very violent person. It's not the first thing I throw out there when I meet someone, but I'm open about it in situations where I think it could help someone else. Living with it up close does give you a certain perspective, I think (as does lots of therapy)....
So these are my thoughts about the person who did this.
- He picked Holly because she's the kind of girl that other guys want: beautiful, smart, nice, talented, etc. It's also the kind of girl he thinks would never give him the time of day and that makes him pretty p.o.'d. It doesn't matter in his mind that she's not with him willingly, it just matters to him that he wanted her and he got her.
-I do believe that he was watching her, and that even that made him feel superior to her.....look how clever he was to be able to watch her undetected and look how inferior she was to him to just be going about her life with no clue he was there.
- I'm sure the camo was to be able to hide in the woods undetected, but I'm sure it also makes him feel powerful and manly to wear it.
-I think he has the best "toys" for whatever he's into....if it's cars, he's got the biggest pick-up, if it's guns, he's got the biggest gun with the most bells and whistles. At the same time, he probably has terrible credit because he lives above his means....if he wants something he can't not have it, even if he can't afford it.
- It wouldn't suprise me if he had tried to get a job in the past as police, fire, or EMS and was unsuccessful. He wants other men to see him as a "big man".
-Locally, when people discuss the case, I think he will probably belittle the way the police are handling the case. He will say he doesn't think they are doing the right things or enough things to bring Holly home. People will take his anger as concern for Holly when inside, he's laughing about how superior he is to LE.
Just my random thoughts for your late night reading....
redfish
04-24-2011, 01:49 AM
I really have read all the threads, but could someone refresh me regarding confirmation of Mark's statements about the dogs not hitting? I don't remember anyone confirming this. I discounted it long ago because I only heard it from him. Was this the same video or a more recent one? I know LE said there were dogs right away but didn't give any other information that I can recall. Thanks in advance!
evelyn24
04-24-2011, 01:53 AM
Mark Fuhrman is a known liar so again I wouldn't take anything that comes out of his mouth as gospel.
~jmo~
You think he lied about talking with TBI and the lack of Holly's scent around the woods and the brother's story changing three different times?
Irish_Eyes
04-24-2011, 01:58 AM
Did I read somewhere that LE thinks he's an avid hunter? Or am I just making that up? The reason I ask is that there are products hunters can use to disguise their scent so animals don't get spooked by them....I wonder how common it is for a hunter to use something like that or how well those work?
Had to go back and read. In the link in post 404 it says that holly's mom helped design the tshirts and a friend offered to sell them. Mom comments it's because she wants holly to have money for a vacation when she returns. Add to that on geraldo it was reported it was the moms idea to have shirts made. Who knows if that's credible or not?
In my heart I want to believe the family only has good intentions, but I can't help but think things seem a little odd. It's hard not to speculate when we've been given so little information.
Irish_Eyes
04-24-2011, 02:10 AM
I don't care how much money the family makes off the T-shirts. They get her face out there. I'm sure the mom and dad are not working and at some point will exhaust whatever vacation/sick time they have. I'm sure they'll have medical bills and therapy for years because of this, no matter what happens. I think the mom is saying Holly can use it to take a vacation when she gets home to try and stay positive. Internally, as a mom, I think she just wants to know that she has the money she needs to do whatever it takes to find Holly, whether that is hiring a private investigator or putting up a billboard, or anything else. If Holly comes home safe tomorrow I hope they do use it to take her on a vacation...they will need to because it will be a media frenzy. I don't think any good parent would look to profit off of this nightmare, but with everything they've been through, I don't care if they do. In fact, I'd feel better knowing that at least that one burden would be off of their shoulders.
cheko1
04-24-2011, 02:11 AM
I just thought of something about the ATV...apparently LE thinks that is how the perp abducted HB....Hubby & I are avid ATVers / we go every weekend. I've been bothered by something all along & something just wasn't right....tonight it came to me.
The perp would of had a horrid time putting HB on the wheeler & keeping her on it. If she was in the front of him she'd of been fighting him... I'm sure using any means she could think of / but mostly head butting him / kicking him etc he couldn't of driven fast because of the terrain & especially with her trying to get loose. She would never of hung on to him if she were in the back & done anything to fall off.
A second person had to of helped the perp.....to hold Holly on to get them to a car / then to drive the wheeler to a spot. There is no way the perp could of did it alone! ABSOLUTELY no way.
The driver of the wheeler would of had to of used both hands to drive it!
I just think the comment about the vacation is a little strange. Had she said the money was for resources to find her, I wouldn't find that strange at all. I suppose it's all semantics at this point.
I can't imagine what the family is going thru so I feel bad for feeling skeptical, but I can't shake the feeling. Trust me, I hope I'm wrong!
scorekeeper
04-24-2011, 02:19 AM
Did I read somewhere that LE thinks he's an avid hunter? Or am I just making that up? The reason I ask is that there are products hunters can use to disguise their scent so animals don't get spooked by them....I wonder how common it is for a hunter to use something like that or how well those work?
Irish,
Good point; I do believe they make such a scent; my brother is an avid hunter (but I can't call him now) and I know he uses all kinds of scents. I vaguely remember him saying something about a "coverup scent".
I know there are sleuthers on here that can better answer.......
here, I found this info.....interesting....
http://www.bowhunting.com/shopping/Departments/Scent-Eliminators.aspx?manufacturer=8432034e-ccb8-425e-821b-6d6f482b84be&sortorder=4&page=1
cluciano63
04-24-2011, 02:24 AM
I think LE just included ATV as one of the possible ways he could have removed her from the area. They probably ran across some ATV tracks, if they are so popular out there and are just considering all possibilities.
katydid23
04-24-2011, 02:24 AM
I just thought of something about the ATV...apparently LE thinks that is how the perp abducted HB....Hubby & I are avid ATVers / we go every weekend. I've been bothered by something all along & something just wasn't right....tonight it came to me.
The perp would of had a horrid time putting HB on the wheeler & keeping her on it. If she was in the front of him she'd of been fighting him... I'm sure using any means she could think of / but mostly head butting him / kicking him etc he couldn't of driven fast because of the terrain & especially with her trying to get loose. She would never of hung on to him if she were in the back & done anything to fall off.
A second person had to of helped the perp.....to hold Holly on to get them to a car / then to drive the wheeler to a spot. There is no way the perp could of did it alone! ABSOLUTELY no way.
The driver of the wheeler would of had to of used both hands to drive it!
AHHHH. I see your point. I have only ridden a few times but I can see exactly what you mean. We had 2 ATVs and 2 adults and 2 kids, and we tried all different ways of riding with a passenger. At one point our daughter got mad that no one would let her drive [ she was only 8] so she got kind of obstinate and wouldnt hold my waist tight. I was kind of struggling trying to hold her myself with one arm while trying unsuccessfully to steer with one hand. If she had been actively fighting me it would never have worked.
So tell me, if she was knocked out by ether or drugged, would there be any way to keep her on the ATV, with just one perp?
goldiegirl
04-24-2011, 02:29 AM
Quick question about the forum - I've been following the Holly Bobo threads closely, but with so many new posts it's hard to keep up. If I leave for a couple hours and come back, the thread I was looking at is closed. Other than going to the last thread where I commented, going to the last page of that thread and clicking on the link to the new thread and continuing to do that until I find the one that's open, is there a better way to locate the most recent thread? I'm sure there is, and I feel silly. Thank you so much : )
cheko1
04-24-2011, 02:33 AM
AHHHH. I see your point. I have only ridden a few times but I can see exactly what you mean. We had 2 ATVs and 2 adults and 2 kids, and we tried all different ways of riding with a passenger. At one point our daughter got mad that no one would let her drive [ she was only 8] so she got kind of obstinate and wouldnt hold my waist tight. I was kind of struggling trying to hold her myself with one arm while trying unsuccessfully to steer with one hand. If she had been actively fighting me it would never have worked.
So tell me, if she was knocked out by ether or drugged, would there be any way to keep her on the ATV, with just one perp?
Very doubtful because a limp body would be equally as hard. The perp would of had to tie her to to the ATV there isn't any holding places on them to tie a body. If he used duck tape on her legs / she couldn't sit on it....
scorekeeper
04-24-2011, 02:34 AM
Quick question about the forum - I've been following the Holly Bobo threads closely, but with so many new posts it's hard to keep up. If I leave for a couple hours and come back, the thread I was looking at is closed. Other than going to the last thread where I commented, going to the last page of that thread and clicking on the link to the new thread and continuing to do that until I find the one that's open, is there a better way to locate the most recent thread? I'm sure there is, and I feel silly. Thank you so much : )
Goldie,
Up on the top banner, click on NEW POSTS and scroll thru the threads until you find Holly's.....then click on the little blue arrow besides the last poster name....
that's what I do...i'm sure everyone does something different...
heck, don't feel silly........
Happy Easter,
score
scorekeeper
04-24-2011, 02:39 AM
Very doubtful because a limp body would be equally as hard. The perp would of had to tie her to to the ATV there isn't any holding places on them to tie a body. If he used duck tape on her legs / she couldn't sit on it....
My brother's atv has a rack on the back or front (sorry dont remember which, they may make both). This allows him to carry his deer out of the woods instead of dragging them a long distant.
And you just had to bring up that duct tape again......LOL...just kidding
I pray that Holly will be home for Easter Sunday
MissJames
04-24-2011, 02:43 AM
Did I read somewhere that LE thinks he's an avid hunter? Or am I just making that up? The reason I ask is that there are products hunters can use to disguise their scent so animals don't get spooked by them....I wonder how common it is for a hunter to use something like that or how well those work?
People are constantly shedding skin cells and that's how a tracking dog tracks. The wind may blow the cells off the direct path,but handlers know that and take it into account.Humidity or lack of it also plays a role in how long the trail can be located.Higher humidity gives you a bigger window of time to work in.
I'm not sure how the product you are describing works,but I would be very surprised if it was effective in throwing off tracking dogs. JMO
DNeecie
04-24-2011, 02:47 AM
I really have read all the threads, but could someone refresh me regarding confirmation of Mark's statements about the dogs not hitting? I don't remember anyone confirming this. I discounted it long ago because I only heard it from him. Was this the same video or a more recent one? I know LE said there were dogs right away but didn't give any other information that I can recall. Thanks in advance!
MF said he called Tn but did not say who he talked to. The dogs not hitting on a scent was part of his phone call apparently. Nothing officially confirmed.
cluciano63
04-24-2011, 03:00 AM
I am disappointed that AMW and John Walsh are still going with the "dragged" away, even eleven days later, when LE corrected the description within a day or so. I know it makes for better copy, and John W. does work for Fox, which loves the controversial. I really respect JW, but it bothers me that with a show and website that serves a vital purpose, they still have to go for the hyperbole. Obviously, this disappearance is dramatic enough not to require "padding."
(Personally, I do think that it is possible that Holly's brother used that term at some point, perhaps in the heat of a 911 call and then clarified later, but since LE clearly refuted it, responsible news sources should do the same, in my opinion.)
GoHard24
04-24-2011, 03:03 AM
-Locally, when people discuss the case, I think he will probably belittle the way the police are handling the case. He will say he doesn't think they are doing the right things or enough things to bring Holly home. People will take his anger as concern for Holly when inside, he's laughing about how superior he is to LE.
I can agree with most of what you said but I don't think he has much communication with others. I think he's probably a loner and gets by watching TV all day, hunting and fishing by himself, etc.
cluciano63
04-24-2011, 03:09 AM
I'd be shocked if this was a "team" crime. It totally fits the profile of a lone offender to me. But he may not be known enough in the community so that his absence, or presence, in searching or at vigils would be noticed or missed at all. Or he may be from the next town over, where locals to Holly's town would not know him. He probably paid a few visits to the woods by her house prior to taking her.
sdmike1974
04-24-2011, 03:17 AM
Quick question about the forum - I've been following the Holly Bobo threads closely, but with so many new posts it's hard to keep up. If I leave for a couple hours and come back, the thread I was looking at is closed. Other than going to the last thread where I commented, going to the last page of that thread and clicking on the link to the new thread and continuing to do that until I find the one that's open, is there a better way to locate the most recent thread? I'm sure there is, and I feel silly. Thank you so much : )
At the top of this webpage you will see the following link tree:
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community > Missing!! > Missing Forum Discussion
Simply click on Missing Forum Discussion.
Now scroll down until you see the link for the discussion with the highest number (currently #13).
It should look like this.
MsFacetious
04-24-2011, 03:39 AM
A thought that I had about the family in general. I am seeing similarities with the attitude here, to Elizabeth Smart's case.
I wonder if the thought process that Holly's mother is going through here, is at all similar to the one that Elizabeth's mother went through? I wonder if Holly's family has reviewed Elizabeth's return, especially since Holly was abducted?
If Holly's Mom believes she will be found and everything will go back to normal after a vacation... she may not believe her daughter will need therapy. She may believe Holly will be like Elizabeth. (Whether she knows about Elizabeth or not.)
Elizabeth Smart and her family say she has never had any type of therapy. She simply talked to her parents.
Elizabeth's family went on a vacation after Elizabeth returned.
Elizabeth's mother wanted her to avoid suffering any more trauma, by avoiding focusing on the pain. Her mother felt that Elizabeth had given her kidnappers enough of her time and should move on with her life.
Elizabeth's mother also said that she could dwell on this, or she could forget about it, put it behind her. Elizabeth chose to put it behind her.
Elizabeth is no longer sorry that this all happened to her.
Elizabeth was extremely religious. She said that was what got her through her 9 months in captivity.
When she returned, she simply returned to her normal life. She played her harp, she slept in her room that night. We saw the happy family pictures. She returned to school that following school year a few months later.
Elizabeth appears to have completely avoided PTSD... flashbacks... nightmares...
I so very much wish we could all be so lucky. :(
http://www.oprah.com/oprahshow/Elizabeth-Smart-John-Ramsey-The-Stories-that-Captured-the-Nation/2
http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2009/08/27/360-interview-ed-smart-and-his-daughter-elizabeth/
Sarahlou
04-24-2011, 04:49 AM
There's something quite strange about this case. A few things don't sit right with me, including the t shirt issue. We could possibly be in for a surprise when we find out what happened. JMO.
daisy.faithfull
04-24-2011, 05:32 AM
Real quick because I really need to get some sleep....
My brain won't shut off and I thought of another scenario about how this went down. Its probably bizare, but I thought that I might as well put it out there...
I've read that there is a problem with meth in Holly's town. Since often times meth is made out there in the woods, maybe speed freak noticed Holly that way.
DNeecie
04-24-2011, 07:27 AM
Couldn't find too much this morning.
Volunteers press on in search for Bobo
At the end of the article it says:
"We're not slowing down," Mehr said. "We may make a decision (on Sunday) about the rate of the search."
http://www.jacksonsun.com/article/20110424/NEWS25/104240321
annboleyn2011
04-24-2011, 07:55 AM
Maybe the dogs didn't pick up a scent at the woodline because she was never at the woodline.
Carla Lashelle
04-24-2011, 07:58 AM
Real quick because I really need to get some sleep....
My brain won't shut off and I thought of another scenario about how this went down. Its probably bizare, but I thought that I might as well put it out there...
I've read that there is a problem with meth in Holly's town. Since often times meth is made out there in the woods, maybe speed freak noticed Holly that way.
The county next to me (Polk County, FL) was for years the Meth Capital (so I guess it lost that honor?). At least down here Meth labs did not seem to be in the woods but were in cheap houses, trailers, apartments, etc. Somehow I dont see these toothless slackers having the capacity to plan this kidnapping. This took some effort and planning and pulling off a kidnapping like this really isnt the MO for the local junkies.
Carla Lashelle
04-24-2011, 07:59 AM
Maybe the dogs didn't pick up a scent at the woodline because she was never at the woodline.
LE has already stated clearly they know where Holly went into the woods (and aparently, based on that statement, she/he/they exited the woods).
annboleyn2011
04-24-2011, 07:59 AM
I am going to ask this anyway. Why do you think they are not releasing the 911 call?
The Farm
04-24-2011, 08:02 AM
Good Morning all,
I personally think they are not releasing the 911 call and other things is because they know something,,,,what that something is obviously we do not know.
LE is keeping this quiet for a reason.
Carla Lashelle
04-24-2011, 08:08 AM
I am going to ask this anyway. Why do you think they are not releasing the 911 call?
Could be a lot of reasons really. Could be state laws (Here in Florida we have the "Sunshine Law" that makes public access to such things much easier). There could be some details that LE does not want to be made known public. This could be factual detail or details of who actually made a call or when. IE if LE released a call from a person in a particular location that would indicate something happned toward that direction, etc. Who knows...
iluvmua
04-24-2011, 08:17 AM
Also, we do not know (and it is none of our business) how much personal money the family has paid into the reward fund. For all we know, they had to get a personal loan, 2nd mortgage, etc., to help bring their loving daughter home. Perhaps this is a close friend's way of letting them have the money to refund them. Personally, I think this is very kind. As far as where the money goes they are getting, you have a choice buy a shirt or don't buy a shirt. No one is volunteering, preparing food, advertising, etc., to be reimbursed (as far as I know). If a volunteer has a problem with this, then they can bring it to the shirt seller's attention. Finally, it doesn't sound like Ms. Bobo asked the person(s) selling the shirts to do this for her, they just wanted to.
Holly's mother asked for the shirts to be made so that the money could go to Holly herself to go on a vacation or so that Holly could buy whatever she wanted with it.
Holly's mother came up with the idea.
Carla Lashelle
04-24-2011, 08:26 AM
With the shirt thing... I don't have much of a problem with it. For one, its not public money, its private donations. So its not like your tax dollars. Aparently what the money MIGHT be used for is not secret so its not like a bait and switch where you think the money goes to one thing and then you find out its not. I see the mom's idea as noble and maybe a bit naive but well intentioned. She wants to do something so that her daughter can try to relax and just get away after all this is over. as to just accepting vacation offers well yeah you could do that but that cuts the mom out of the loop as to having something to do wtih her time and energy and its not the same feeling, I imagine. And its not like your $12 or whatever is a straight donation. You get a shirt. Whether they were donated or not doesnt matter. Where can you get a custom printed tee shirt for $12. So I dont see it as a rip off either like when you pledge $500 to PBS TV and get a pen set. I see the shirt idea as a well intentioned (but maybe not the most well thought out or described) idea to give the family somthing to do, to get the word out about Holly, to be able to present her with somethign the family did themselves in her absence (assuming she is found). There could even be a bit of denial behind it. As a way to mask the fears and doubts that the family has to be experiencing.
I still think too the aparent lack of progress in the case, the lack of real news, etc. makes people cranky and they start looking and picking at fringe details that are not really relevant to getting Holly home, which should be the first and foremost focus. If LE would throw out some more info, people would have something productive to work with again.
nervous_nellie
04-24-2011, 08:33 AM
Good Morning all,
I personally think they are not releasing the 911 call and other things is because they know something,,,,what that something is obviously we do not know.
LE is keeping this quiet for a reason.
i was thinking that due to the huge turn out of searchers they (le) wanted to avoid some kind of mob/mass hysteria type reaction?? but they couldnt have known how many were going to come and help search. an example of what le doesnt want is something like the hailey dunn case... huge mess...moo
iluvmua
04-24-2011, 08:34 AM
I'm not going to give my hard earned money just so someone who was abducted can go on vacation. I'm Sorry their daughter is missing, but how many other parents have done what Holly's mother is doing?
If they want to give Holly something special on their own if and when she comes home, that is fine but DO NOT ask people to contribute money just so your daughter can go on vacation and buy whatever she wants.
Something is incredibly off about this abduction.
nervous_nellie
04-24-2011, 08:37 AM
i dont really know what i think about the shirt business other than that if one of my loved ones was missing there would not be anything that i wouldnt do to raise money to find them and i wouldnt really care what the public thought about me or my efforts...kwim?
eta: hollys mom prolly doesnt read missing person cases like we do here at ws, so im sure the idea of the tshirts doesnt sound the same to her as it does some of us... i think she is desperate and this is one way for her to feel like she is doing something to find her daughter... and if it is the parsons florist actually selling them - then im not sure whats really going on with the donations... i really hate to judge the mom for one odd statement... idk...
The Farm
04-24-2011, 08:40 AM
i was thinking that due to the huge turn out of searchers they (le) wanted to avoid some kind of mob/mass hysteria type reaction?? but they couldnt have known how many were going to come and help search. an example of what le doesnt want is something like the hailey dunn case... huge mess...moo
nellie I love your little chick picture.
Well the search turn-outs have been big and steady and I think mostly people who are familiar with the area.
The one thing that I really don't get is they are "civilians" which if I were closer to TN and was a searcher (Would I be able to mentally handle if I found her not alive???)
Not everyone is capable of that, including me.
nervous_nellie
04-24-2011, 08:45 AM
nellie I love your little chick picture.
Well the search turn-outs have been big and steady and I think mostly people who are familiar with the area.
The one thing that I really don't get is they are "civilians" which if I were closer to TN and was a searcher (Would I be able to mentally handle if I found her not alive???)
Not everyone is capable of that, including me.
thanx :)
yeah, me either but if i were missing i hope someone would come looking for me... the 911 may have confusing and/or misleading info that would lead the average listener to an incorrect conclusion of some sort and creating even more troubles for le... thats all i can come up with... such as the caller stating that it appeared to be hollys bf taking her into the woods when in fact it really wasnt or they didnt know or didnt want to say that publicly yet if ever
Trino
04-24-2011, 09:13 AM
SNIPPED...
i dont really know what i think about the shirt business other than that if one of my loved ones was missing there would not be anything that i wouldnt do to raise money to find them and i wouldnt really care what the public thought about me or my efforts...kwim?...
But, this money is not going to find Holly. It's raising money so she can have a vacation when she comes home. This is not charity, and it's not a charitable contribution.
jadejazzkayla
04-24-2011, 09:19 AM
I'm not going to give my hard earned money just so someone who was abducted can go on vacation. I'm Sorry their daughter is missing, but how many other parents have done what Holly's mother is doing?
If they want to give Holly something special on their own if and when she comes home, that is fine but DO NOT ask people to contribute money just so your daughter can go on vacation and buy whatever she wants.
Something is incredibly off about this abduction.
holly's mom is selling t shirts that we can choose to buy or not. we are not under any obligation to do so. to each their own.
Adrienne37
04-24-2011, 09:19 AM
The solution to the problem that people have regarding purchasing a T-shirt for Holly to go on vacation if and when she returns is really simple, don't buy a T-shirt. If you aren't planning to buy a T-shirt, then it's really not our business what they do with the money.
~jmo~
Sarahlou
04-24-2011, 09:25 AM
Was Holly's car the only car parked at her house on the morning she was abducted? I couldn't remember if Clint also had a car or not.
cocomod
04-24-2011, 09:36 AM
I think that this case is sensational enough. I hate it when public personas try to sensationalize it more by speculating out loud about things that have been hashed over for many days now already.
Personally, I have a "gut" feeling that the family had nothing to do with this one. I am certainly no expert, but my "gut" has been right in many of the cases I have followed. In my opinion, I think that things that look "hinky" to others seems quite normal to me. I may be wrong since we have NOT been given exact information from the TBI, but I can imagine the following happening with her brother:
He wakes up in the morning and is still somewhat sleepy. He stretches, looks out the window, and sees Holly talking with her boyfriend. It barely registers to him as he is still a bit sleepy. He gets into the shower (or just gets dressed) and wakes up a bit. He walks outside (possibly 20 - 30 minutes have passed by now) and sees that Holly's car is still there. He calls for her and she doesn't answer. He walks around the car and notices the blood. All of a sudden - he remembers the guy talking to Holly! He can't register that she is in trouble yet, so he calls her cell and then her boyfriends cell to see where they are at. They boyfriend says that he is at work and has not been with her. He is now IMMEDIATELY alarmed as he recalls that the person with Holly had ahold of her arm as they were walking towards the woods; and he calls 911.
To me, when a person is just waking up in the morning, things may not completely register at first. He may not have even registered exactly what he saw until he was fully awake and alarmed by finding that the boyfriend was not with her that morning.
This is all my opinion, and I have watched many times where family is involved, but my "gut" instinct on this one is that this is a family in shock and in desperation. It was refreshing and very heart-breaking to me to see the news conference with the mom and dad. The mom was on the verge of collapse throughout the entire conference. The policeman had to basically carry her back to her car. This outpour of emotion seems genuine to me; unlike Billy Dunn who cannot shed a tear for her daughter. This family is also keeping it real and undramatized. The drama is coming outside of the family dynamic and not from the family themselves - unlike the Anthony's or Kiesha Abrahams mother. She hid behind sun glasses and moved out of her apartment the very day Kiesha was reported missing.
I also believe that the mother is likely beginning to feel desperate to be involved SOMEHOW in ANY way with the search for her daughter. There is just no handbook for her to follow. I wish that someone with knowledge would visit this family and help them through this terrible process as they wait for answers.
I too believe that LE may know more than they have told the public - I am betting on it. I believe that LE may also have hope that Holly is or was still alive and they are treading carefully so that the perp doesn't do something desperate and kill her. They must keep their info close to the vest to protect Holly. JMHO of course!
cocomod
04-24-2011, 09:37 AM
Happy Easter everyone!
I am praying very hard that LE is able to crack this one with a possitive outcome! I am praying for Holly and hoping that she WILL come home. I do NOT want to give up hope on her and I hope that others do not either!
nursebeeme
04-24-2011, 09:40 AM
http://www.wsmv.com/news/27651991/detail.html?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+wsmv%2FFFaX+%28WSMV.com+-+Nashville+News%29&utm_content=Google+Feedfetcher
sunrise easter service and balloon release for Holly
Chili Fries
04-24-2011, 09:44 AM
Elizabeth is no longer sorry that this all happened to her.
Elizabeth was extremely religious. She said that was what got her through her 9 months in captivity.
When she returned, she simply returned to her normal life. She played her harp, she slept in her room that night. We saw the happy family pictures. She returned to school that following school year a few months later.
Elizabeth appears to have completely avoided PTSD... flashbacks... nightmares...
I so very much wish we could all be so lucky. :(
I don't believe there are any miracles in these situations. I'm sure Elizabeth was deeply affected by her trauma, no matter what her and her family say in public. I don't mean to trivialize or diminish her strength at all but, as you imply, the difficulty comes with living with the aftermath day after day. Nobody can truly know what the traumatized person goes through, and there are probably many things Elizabeth experiences that she has not shared with anyone. I do very much understand her feeling of not being sorry it happened to her, she wouldn't be the person she is today if her life had taken another path. There is no other way once history is written.
tfrohning
04-24-2011, 09:52 AM
Do we know if Holly's family had a dog?
maskedwoman
04-24-2011, 10:03 AM
From Geraldo at Large- Mark Furman says when he called TN (don't know what that means) The dogs did not scent anything around woods by Bobo's house. Don't know if that was TBI confirmed or not.
I respect Mark Furman but he does not always get it right either. If the TBI won't even say what the blood analysis results were, I find it hard to believe they would tell a reporter that. Even if he did used to be LE. JMO, of course. :)
tfrohning
04-24-2011, 10:06 AM
I been looking for other missing persons... kids or adults where a Gov gave 50,000 for reward. I can't find any. I wonder what is Different in the reward money for Holly than others? It just a thought.
maskedwoman
04-24-2011, 10:20 AM
I've been reading this on and off all day - not much new news, but when I hear about this, and no one verifying the time they last saw her - this makes me wonder even more, why a timeline has not been established for so many of the things that have been said ie. 911 calls, etc.
just more questions.... very few answers
No offense intended but why do you think no timeline has been established? I'm confident they will have done that, since there are a great many well-trained professionals looking for her. Unless you mean, why they haven't told us what it is? We have the MIL of a TBI forensic examiner on here and she has told us they have good reasons for what they are doing.
Daisyjane
04-24-2011, 10:21 AM
According to this, it sounds like the T shirts are being sold to cover the family's portion of the reward money. Perhaps the 'vacation' is where any overage would be directed?
http://www.wbbjtv.com/news/local/Bobo-T-shirts-Available-120334429.html
"We're going to print one thousand more t-shirts Thursday and hopefully we'll be able to continue this until we have sold enough to cover the reward the family has offered," said Steve Hinson of Amerawear.
maskedwoman
04-24-2011, 10:24 AM
Her brother says he saw her walking into the woods, yet the dogs didn't pick up on her scent? :waitasec: I'm assuming these are trained scent dogs? :waitasec: Something is definitely wrong here! MOO
Assuming Mark's information is correct, I agree with you! I am just reluctant to run with what Mark says because so often the press is hugely wrong and they rarely bother to correct any of it.
maskedwoman
04-24-2011, 10:29 AM
14, 234,767 + or - a few. Good guess on my part. IMO
:floorlaugh:
AMEN to that! I remember firstr becoming acutely aware of that after Princess Diana died. People would get up their and talk quite confidently about this being thus and so. And later, it came out that it was no such thing. Did they say, we're correcting earlier reports? Noooo... they just started using the new information. Drove me crazy.
maskedwoman
04-24-2011, 10:34 AM
With all the rainstorms, would the dogs be able to pick up a scent now? Or, is it being reported that the dogs never picked up a scent from the beginning?
That is a very good question and one that has concerned me. We have had several very heavy rains, lots of wind, tornado warnings, tornadoes, etc., all across Tennessee. A few rains I would consider torrential downpours.
What that means for the dogs, I have no clue.
Meagain
04-24-2011, 10:35 AM
According to this, it sounds like the T shirts are being sold to cover the family's portion of the reward money. Perhaps the 'vacation' is where any overage would be directed?
http://www.wbbjtv.com/news/local/Bobo-T-shirts-Available-120334429.html
"We're going to print one thousand more t-shirts Thursday and hopefully we'll be able to continue this until we have sold enough to cover the reward the family has offered," said Steve Hinson of Amerawear.
"Any remaining money will go to the family"
Wow.
maskedwoman
04-24-2011, 10:38 AM
That's what I forgot. Mark Furman said they have the DNA of the blood back and they know who it belongs to but they are not releasing the information.
Unfortunately, we don't know any more now than the day poor Holly disappeared. It is all so very sad. IMO
Hmmm... if that report is accurate (big if in my book), it suggests that the blood is from someone for which there is a "known" sample.
evelyn24
04-24-2011, 10:55 AM
Assuming Mark's information is correct, I agree with you! I am just reluctant to run with what Mark says because so often the press is hugely wrong and they rarely bother to correct any of it.Mark said this about the dogs days ago on another show. I believe it. The searches do not seem like they've been directed by any concrete evidence or leads like a scent. That kind of backs up what he said he's been told..imo.
Quiche
04-24-2011, 10:55 AM
It's interesting to me that the brother didn't get a stranger vibe off the sight of his sister being escorted away-- he actually seemed to recognize and dismiss him. Imo, there is an instinct about strangers, especially in a scenario so out of place. I think this individual may be, subconsciously, known to CB. jmo
cheko1
04-24-2011, 10:56 AM
My brother's atv has a rack on the back or front (sorry dont remember which, they may make both). This allows him to carry his deer out of the woods instead of dragging them a long distant.
And you just had to bring up that duct tape again......LOL...just kidding
I pray that Holly will be home for Easter Sunday
They do have the racks.....a dead deer or game / is different then trying to carry off someone fighting for there lives!
evelyn24
04-24-2011, 10:59 AM
According to this, it sounds like the T shirts are being sold to cover the family's portion of the reward money. Perhaps the 'vacation' is where any overage would be directed?
http://www.wbbjtv.com/news/local/Bobo-T-shirts-Available-120334429.html
"We're going to print one thousand more t-shirts Thursday and hopefully we'll be able to continue this until we have sold enough to cover the reward the family has offered," said Steve Hinson of Amerawear.
I do believe there are two sets of shirts being sold.
http://www.wreg.com/news/wreg-bob-friday,0,1689775.story
Quiche
04-24-2011, 10:59 AM
They do have the racks.....a dead deer or game / is different then trying to carry off someone fighting for there lives!
Chloroform comes to mind... :(
cheko1
04-24-2011, 11:04 AM
I am going to ask this anyway. Why do you think they are not releasing the 911 call?
I think part of the reason its not been released is they mentioned the perps name who they think has her. JMO
The Farm
04-24-2011, 11:17 AM
I think part of the reason its not been released is they mentioned the perps name who they think has her. JMO
That is a strong possibility.
Trino
04-24-2011, 11:20 AM
The solution to the problem that people have regarding purchasing a T-shirt for Holly to go on vacation if and when she returns is really simple, don't buy a T-shirt. If you aren't planning to buy a T-shirt, then it's really not our business what they do with the money. ~jmo~
It's the perception...
This is the first case I've seen where money is not going toward a search or a reward.
another nosey mom
04-24-2011, 11:21 AM
No offense intended but why do you think no timeline has been established? I'm confident they will have done that, since there are a great many well-trained professionals looking for her. Unless you mean, why they haven't told us what it is? We have the MIL of a TBI forensic examiner on here and she has told us they have good reasons for what they are doing.
All I was saying is that in other missing persons cases, the timeline from when the last person that saw the missing person would be established and they would have a timeline of events published - maybe to try to refresh peoples minds if they were in the area at that time, etc.. jmo
liltexans
04-24-2011, 11:25 AM
I think part of the reason its not been released is they mentioned the perps name who they think has her. JMO
I agree with this possibility and I think there may be other details given by CB in the call that they don't want released.
The report in the media that the perp was holding or leading Holly by the arm may or may not be true, but if it is, I'm assuming he was holding her with one of his hands. What might he have had in his other hand? Maybe a weapon that CB saw?
I wouldn't run after someone with a gun or knife, but then again, I'm not a guy, so maybe I'd feel differently about that if I were.
MOO
Bradjenkins
04-24-2011, 11:28 AM
I think part of the reason its not been released is they mentioned the perps name who they think has her. JMO
If that's the case it seems they would be hoping that he still has Holly alive and that they might discover him and he would lead them to wherever he hid her?
The only problem I have with a scenario like this is that he might just slip away unnoticed and by the time his name finally does get released he would have been long gone by then.
However I tend to believe they just don't know due to some comments from the sheriff expressing frustration about where this is heading. Just my hunch.
Adrienne37
04-24-2011, 11:31 AM
It's the perception...
This is the first case I've seen where money is not going toward a search or a reward.
Not being snarky or rude, but the choice should be simple, don't purchase a T-shirt and you won't have to worry about where the money goes.
There is no rule book that a family has to follow when their child is missing. Often times, these families are damned if they do or damned if they don't in the public's eye and that's just plain wrong. The truth of the matter is that selling T-shirts in no way shape or form has any bearing on Holly being missing. I'm just so sad that her family is dealing with not only their precious daughter being missing but having to deal with constantly being scrutinized over their actions. Just like I said, it's a damned if you do or damned if you don't situation and it's certainly a position that I don't ever want to be in.
~jmo~
daisy.faithfull
04-24-2011, 11:33 AM
LE has already stated clearly they know where Holly went into the woods (and aparently, based on that statement, she/he/they exited the woods).
Happy Easter fellow Websleuthers!
There was an article that said that LE believed that Holly and the abductor were still in the woods because they were able to block all of the exits.
I can't find the article, but I know I saw it somewhere.
Off to go hide Easter eggs!:boing:
Jo in Calif
04-24-2011, 11:34 AM
My feelings and opinions about this case.
I don't think the brother had anything what so ever to do with the disappearance of his sister. He just by chance, and a good one at that, happened to look out the window, and see his sister going into the woods, with who he thought was her boyfriend. No red flags at that time, why would there be. Went outside later to see her car still there and blood on the ground, red flag, makes phone calls including 911.
As far as the T shirts go, Mom is involving herself in the recovery of her daughter, not sitting at home watching T.V. if the money is going towards the reward fund to cover what they offered, so be it. The rest of it to go to Holly, so be it, at least it's not going to be used for tats, a car for the brother, or to pay their bills.
I have gotten no feeling what so ever, that this family is anything but a normal loving involved with the community, church going family.
I'm sure they have been sleuthed on their records, haven't heard of drug arrests or anything negative.
I commend the family, friends and searchers for not going to the press and not compromising the the investigation, I'm sure as per LE requests.
There is a missing person here, the most important thing, is that she be found, hopefully safe.
cheko1
04-24-2011, 11:44 AM
Chloroform comes to mind... :(
Hubby & friends were trying to figure out how someone would of done it & its darn near impossible. Unless he did knock her out & put her in a bag...thing is she still had her books / cell & lunch with her. Unreal!!!!
If that is what happened!
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