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GiantPickle
06-10-2011, 03:07 PM
btw - i'm on the fence with this one. While I would love all evidence against ICA to be seen by the jury, I'm not so sure this is necessary...just bring Dr G back for a few more questions.

Mountain_Kat
06-10-2011, 03:07 PM
guys I just do not know about this evidence...it is prejudicial....I mean wow...sigh..i hope if it gets in it doesn't get overturned on appeal.

I don't think HHJP would do anything to jeopardize this case. If he's not sure whether he should allow it or not, I think he will err on the side of caution and say no.

I have faith in him.

egnarts
06-10-2011, 03:07 PM
Group prayer to allow HHJP the wisdom to make the right decision on allowing this evidence in, without causing any issues in allowance of later appeal based on said evidence.

shezcrafti
06-10-2011, 03:07 PM
Someone please correct me if I am mistaken, but isn't this type of computer-generated visual used in court cases all the time to illustrate evidence? Have I been watching too many movies?

KMouse
06-10-2011, 03:07 PM
I just discovered that a single piece of duct tape can cover both my mouth and nose, and I'm an adult.

I had to try too because of this. One normal width of duct tape covers my nostrils and my closed mouth. I can open my mouth to get the tape off but it would be difficult if the tape was pressed on and then there were more pieces applied.

The jury should be given a roll to check for themselves and then put it in the perspective of a child's nose & mouth and possibly being drugged first.

Linda7NJ
06-10-2011, 03:07 PM
Mason is almost as good as Jose for the states case. He did a GREAT job with Dr. G convincing the jurys beyond all doubt that Caylee didn't drown 100% of the time acciental drownings are reported to 911

SindyBill
06-10-2011, 03:08 PM
that and the fact he knows DR.G's testimony just put his client away for good!!

Can anyone give me a real brief synopsis of Dr. G's fantastic testimony? Had to go play with the kids and fix some snacks so I missed it! TY!

christee
06-10-2011, 03:08 PM
Isn't this technology used for identifying a Jane/John Doe? If they suspect who the person is they use a pic of the person to match with the skull? Kind of like face recognition technology?

ETA
Oops just saw shezcrafti beat me too it! :biggrin:

lishac23
06-10-2011, 03:08 PM
anyone have a picture of her watching that video/time lapse? she looked scary mad to me

I was on the fence about what lead to her emotional response yesterday but after seeing her clearly be able to watch her daughters skull photo...with the duct tape on it, and not shed a tear or show any emotion....tells me yesterday's theatrics were a bunch of bull poo.

darnudes
06-10-2011, 03:08 PM
Oh man. I think HHJP is considering it.

I wish they wouldn't let it in.

I hope they just make him testify without animation.

Animation has been used by both sides many times in all sorts of criminal cases, it isn't at all unusual. I think the Judge will allow it. I do think they should have been able to do some sort of generic presentation of Caylee though, once they had her dimensions, but I can see why they've done it with her photo so that there is no room for believing it's not possible.

Themis
06-10-2011, 03:09 PM
I don't think the video will be admitted, however I think the judge will allow Dr. Warren's testimony to the fact that based on his measurements the tape did in fact cover her nose and mouth
If that is what happens, then when JB cross examines, he is bound to dispute the measurements and then ... the door is opened for the video? Could happen.

Rebound
06-10-2011, 03:09 PM
If HHJP doesn't let this in, can the SA use BondJamesBond's analysis?

:woohoo:

wandering
06-10-2011, 03:09 PM
That's what I think too, and that night, they had the big fight and she left with Caylee, I bet she cried out for CA and it made ICA beyond mad.
ITA. KC made sure CA would never see that child again. When ICA was brought home after the car was retrieved, she told CA she'd have to get used to not seeing Caylee any more. You are spot on.

SindyBill
06-10-2011, 03:09 PM
I had to try too because of this. One normal width of duct tape covers my nostrils and my closed mouth. I can open my mouth to get the tape off but it would be difficult if the tape was pressed on and then there were more pieces applied.

The jury should be given a roll to check for themselves and then put it in the perspective of a child's nose & mouth and possibly being drugged first.

I just tried the same thing and it covered my mouth and nose as well! And that's lightly applying, not with force as I imagine Casey did.

QueenD
06-10-2011, 03:09 PM
Camera man on local 6 live stream is making me dizzy

Bittiness39
06-10-2011, 03:09 PM
If the judge decides it's better for it not to be used, I'm all for it as I would hate for it to be cause for appeal.

moo

IMO, the video will come in because it aids the jury. It is a visual tool for them to use in their deliberations. :truce:

Leila
06-10-2011, 03:09 PM
Bill Shaefer is familiar with the case that HHBP is now reviewing and he thinks the video will be allowed in.

Whisperer
06-10-2011, 03:09 PM
I wish they could have saved Dr G for the very last witness. What a one-two punch she was! Wow just doesn't seem like a big enough word..

mydailyopinions
06-10-2011, 03:09 PM
By the way, I do not think the SA is going back on how Caylee died and that they are trying to prove either or. The Chloroform could very well have been put onto something and taped over her mouth and nose. Both could have killed her.

BigFatMommyDog
06-10-2011, 03:10 PM
Aside from the obvious, I'm absolutely boggled that JB got up in front of the Judge and whined that he thought the state was going with chloroform as COD when Ashton did three pieces of tape routine at the now infamous "make it stop" hearing.

miabellamoure
06-10-2011, 03:10 PM
Please God...for Caylee, let JP do the right thing and allow this into evidence!:praying:

costalpilot
06-10-2011, 03:10 PM
I got a feeling it will not be allowed.

the testimony: in

the video: out

imo

pinkfly
06-10-2011, 03:10 PM
Can anyone give me a real brief synopsis of Dr. G's fantastic testimony? Had to go play with the kids and fix some snacks so I missed it! TY!

very brief is that accidents get reported and homicides get put in bags and hidden in fields.

Linda7NJ
06-10-2011, 03:10 PM
Jose cracks me up....don't know how old Caylee is in the picture.....she could have been "much older" or "younger" she wasn't even THREE YEARS OLD! How much older or younger could she have been????????:banghead:

Star12
06-10-2011, 03:10 PM
wish jb would leave the pool camera alone....

biggirl
06-10-2011, 03:10 PM
I would hope JBP would error on the side of caution. I would think this witness could just testify to his findings. WHy risk it??? JMHO

sleutherontheside
06-10-2011, 03:10 PM
Let's remember that the State has a theory and needs to present it.

Just as we expect JB to support his theory....he should expect the SA to do the same.

Jen38
06-10-2011, 03:11 PM
My opinion is that it is too prejudicial....I agree that the visual would be easier to understand, but if the pic is Caylee WITH Casey in the picture, I can also understand why the defense is spitting nails. I have very mixed feeling about this.

gitana1
06-10-2011, 03:11 PM
I don't find her comments exciting at all. Milk toast mild on this case. Yawn.

I agree. And her show could show so much, but instead it's random sound bites and video bites of random things, not necessarily of things that occurred that day. It's just not a show one watches for a real analysis of the proceedings.

This is making me sick.

Casey is just sitting there.

But she gets hysterical when the jury is in there.

She makes me physically ill.

Did she get ill again this morning? I didn't watch.

Oakley
06-10-2011, 03:11 PM
<respectfully snipped>

JB: we seem to find ourselves in a position of throwing anything at the wall and seeing what sticks.



So is Jose saying that the DT has been doing this b/c this is all they have to work with? IOW, cut us a break (and don't allow this?)

Seriously, I think that is what he is saying.

dog.gone.cute
06-10-2011, 03:11 PM
Someone please correct me if I am mistaken, but isn't this type of computer-generated visual used in court cases all the time to illustrate evidence? Have I been watching too many movies?

:rocker: YES ... it is being used more and more.

:waitasec: And no -- you have not been watching too many movies. I have seen these computer animations of skeleton bodies used in Forensic Files, 48 Hours ... shows like that ...

adb263
06-10-2011, 03:11 PM
Someone please correct me if I am mistaken, but isn't this type of computer-generated visual used in court cases all the time to illustrate evidence? Have I been watching too many movies?

I think the issue is with having the actual photo of Caylee. Other times they just use an artists rendering. I could be wrong. wouldn't be the first time!! lol

PMLsmom
06-10-2011, 03:11 PM
Our wonderful AZLawyer did this a long time ago...Respectfully quote:

Thread: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=90039&page=26

Post: #646 (with pic)

wandering
06-10-2011, 03:11 PM
I trust any decision Judge Perry makes, he's the boss and he knows best.Yes, he is making sure this possible conviction won't be overturned on appeal.

Dragonlady
06-10-2011, 03:11 PM
This is really just a visual aid for the jurors.
In many court cases they use visual aides and props, so this is nothing out of the ordinary, but what is different is who the defendant is and the possibility of the DP.

KathrynL
06-10-2011, 03:11 PM
This is making me sick.

Casey is just sitting there.

But she gets hysterical when the jury is in there.

She makes me physically ill.

She truly made my stomach roll this morning. I kept my eyes averted from the Casey Cam because I just couldn't stand to look at her one more second.

Camille
06-10-2011, 03:11 PM
Dr. G says "there is no child that should have duct tape on it's face after it died."

Watching recaps.

MissDiva
06-10-2011, 03:11 PM
I just tried the same thing and it covered my mouth and nose as well! And that's lightly applying, not with force as I imagine Casey did.

I just got this mental image of a bunch of WSers putting duct tape over their noses and mouths and cracked up.

Maybe Dr. Warren could try putting some duct tape over HIS face. I bet it'd still cover his nose and mouth, and he's a full-grown man.

SindyBill
06-10-2011, 03:11 PM
very brief is that accidents get reported and homicides get put in bags and hidden in fields.

TY, and yeah it really doesn't get any more simple than that, does it?

Soulmagent
06-10-2011, 03:11 PM
I hope the judge lets the animation in. The defense had made points about the duct tape not being on the left part of the skull.

I am sick over this.

It wont or rather shouldnt prove the tape waas placed before death. It is a theory. An educated theory but still a theory.

I feel the state is banking on emotions and opinions which cannot be proven. Right now ,with the experts not being able to provide anything concrete that proves Caseys murder her little girl Caylee.

And I know I am not in the popular opinion but this is bigger to me then Casey Anthony's trial. I know everyone is hoping for conviction and I was hoping for the state to prove she did,not for me to rely on my feelings on her quilt or innocent.

They had proved the body in the trunk. Beyond reasonable doubt.
This video cannot prove anything but what "could have happed" and everyone already knows it could have happened.
Before or after she might have drown in a pool.

illek46
06-10-2011, 03:12 PM
IMO, the video will come in because it aids the jury. It is a visual tool for them to use in their deliberations. :truce:

They could have just as easily have used a series of time lapse photos instead of an animation which IMHO is a bit over dramatic.

mydailyopinions
06-10-2011, 03:12 PM
I wish they could have saved Dr G for the very last witness. What a one-two punch she was..Wow! just doesn't seem like a big enough word..

I think Caylee will be the very last witness. They will play her video singing "you are my sunshine" to her grandpa...

And I believe this will be done on June 16th, the day she died, 3 years later.

adb263
06-10-2011, 03:12 PM
Wow...when they pan out and show more of the courtroom you can really see how BIG it is!! Very high ceilings!!

ami
06-10-2011, 03:12 PM
Animation has been used by both sides many times in all sorts of criminal cases, it isn't at all unusual. I think the Judge will allow it. I do think they should have been able to do some sort of generic presentation of Caylee though, once they had her dimensions, but I can see why they've done it with her photo so that there is no room for believing it's not possible.

I'm not uneasy because it's new technology or anything. I'm worried that the jurors by now have bonded with little Caylee, have been horrified and outraged at the things she and her body were put through. I'm just a little uneasy that they will be resentful of this animation, see it as coarse or somehow disrespectful to Caylee... and that they'll blame the Prosecution for having it made and showing it to them (more than the ICA for having committed the crime in the first place).

On the other hand, I can see how and why it would be powerful for the State.

I just don't know. I don't want to see it.

sleutherontheside
06-10-2011, 03:12 PM
CM and Judge Eaton chumming it up.

16361

Camille
06-10-2011, 03:12 PM
My opinion is that it is too prejudicial....I agree that the visual would be easier to understand, but if the pic is Caylee WITH Casey in the picture, I can also understand why the defense is spitting nails. I have very mixed feeling about this.

This is what I am thinking too.

magnolia
06-10-2011, 03:12 PM
Why do they need this? Just giving Casey grounds for her appeal. The jury has seen plenty of photos of the remains. They know what Caylee looked like alive. This just seems pushing it to shock rather then to aid in any scientific explanation.

Baez was actually making sense for once but he stayed true to his usual hypocrisy.

I am sure HHJP will make the right decision.

Serjen
06-10-2011, 03:13 PM
Bill Schaeffer said the case the judge is reviewing says that if evidence can help to illustrate findings, then they should be admitted in court. He said if Judge goes by that case, then he probably will let the picture into evidence. I don't think it will 'risk' anything...it will give jurors a visual image as to how the duct tape was placed, since Mason said it wasn't on the nose.

BigFatMommyDog
06-10-2011, 03:13 PM
All together now, sing "Send in the Clowns".... :innocent:

don't bother ;-)

wandering
06-10-2011, 03:13 PM
My personal opinion is this is going to sink her boat if the animated video is allowed in...is this brand new type of evidence being allowed in court or has it been done before in FL?



I don't know about FLA, but in the Michael Peterson case, the defense was allowed to show an animation video of their view of how the victim died. That was in North Carolina.

ami
06-10-2011, 03:13 PM
Wow...when they pan out and show more of the courtroom you can really see how BIG it is!! Very high ceilings!!

I was thinking that same thing ! After dealing with brief vertigo from the camera movement, lol.

yeknomaras
06-10-2011, 03:13 PM
I'm so behind today :( on such an important day of testimony. can't wait to watch the videos later!

sleutherontheside
06-10-2011, 03:14 PM
IMO the defense was counting on the chloroform being the argument by the SAO......they just got a big shock.

azscr4mbl3r
06-10-2011, 03:14 PM
Craziness JB don't you think an anthropologist can tell what age a LIVING child is? Do it over with the video of Caylee and G.Grandpa heck I could do it in 2 minutes with photoshop.

darnudes
06-10-2011, 03:14 PM
Am I going crazy? Weren't there 4 pieces of duct tape, 3 on Caylee's face and a single piece lying a few feet away?

Baez said there were only 3 pieces total and 1 of those pieces was a few feet away.

wandering
06-10-2011, 03:15 PM
I had to try too because of this. One normal width of duct tape covers my nostrils and my closed mouth. I can open my mouth to get the tape off but it would be difficult if the tape was pressed on and then there were more pieces applied.

The jury should be given a roll to check for themselves and then put it in the perspective of a child's nose & mouth and possibly being drugged first.The jury is not allowed to experiment.

SyraKelly
06-10-2011, 03:15 PM
TY, and yeah it really doesn't get any more simple than that, does it?

she really did a lot of damage to the DT today

LglNrs
06-10-2011, 03:15 PM
~Suspense galore on whether this evidence from Dr. Warren which is video superimposing the live-Caylee photo with the skull of little precious Caylee will come in to the trial...HHJBP "Shepardizing" (researching cases looking for appealable aspects) right now~

Soulmagent
06-10-2011, 03:15 PM
Dr. G says "there is no child that should have duct tape on it's face after it died."

Watching recaps.

I would have asked why do mortician glue eyes shut for veiwings.

tape would be unproffessional.

If I was CM.

suzihawk
06-10-2011, 03:15 PM
I'm on the fence as to whether it should be allowed in. If there's even one iota of it being prejudicial thus causing the verdict to be overturned then I say let it go. I think they have way more than enough evidence to get her convicted without it.

Lovejac
06-10-2011, 03:15 PM
If HHJP doesn't let this in, can the SA use BondJamesBond's analysis?

:woohoo:

BJB did an analysis with the duct tape and skull??

I thought I had seen all his stuff he did for this case!

Rebound
06-10-2011, 03:15 PM
QUOTE=SindyBill;6653822]I just tried the same thing and it covered my mouth and nose as well! And that's lightly applying, not with force as I imagine Casey did.[/QUOTE]

:gasp:

Please do not use force!

reeseeva
06-10-2011, 03:15 PM
In her post-mortem report, or do you mean today?

Today, I thought she said something about "No other reason for duct tape to be there" Observational, systematic studies..... Something like that!

Thanks, ZsaZsa

shezcrafti
06-10-2011, 03:15 PM
I think the issue is with having the actual photo of Caylee. Other times they just use an artists rendering. I could be wrong. wouldn't be the first time!! lol

I see. Thanks. Well, it seems to me they could just as easily illustrate this sort of thing using a child-sized crash test dummy, or at least a computer visual that showed a blank/neutral 3D model of a child w/ Caylee's known dimensions.

:twocents:

At any rate, I'm all for allowing in anything that would help the SA's case. I'm positive the DT will not put up a fair fight in theirs.

costalpilot
06-10-2011, 03:16 PM
I am sick over this.

It wont or rather shouldnt prove the tape waas placed before death. It is a theory. An educated theory but still a theory.

I feel the state is banking on emotions and opinions which cannot be proven. Right now ,with the experts not being able to provide anything concrete that proves Caseys murder her little girl Caylee.

And I know I am not in the popular opinion but this is bigger to me then Casey Anthony's trial. I know everyone is hoping for conviction and I was hoping for the state to prove she did,not for me to rely on my feelings on her quilt or innocent.

They had proved the body in the trunk. Beyond reasonable doubt.
This video cannot prove anything but what "could have happed" and everyone already knows it could have happened.
Before or after she might have drown in a pool.

not to worry

Quiche
06-10-2011, 03:16 PM
IMO the defense was counting on the chloroform being the argument by the SAO......they just got a big shock.

Yes, I think so too-- how pollyannaish could they be?

Camille
06-10-2011, 03:16 PM
I am sick over this.

It wont or rather shouldnt prove the tape waas placed before death. It is a theory. An educated theory but still a theory.

I feel the state is banking on emotions and opinions which cannot be proven. Right now ,with the experts not being able to provide anything concrete that proves Caseys murder her little girl Caylee.

And I know I am not in the popular opinion but this is bigger to me then Casey Anthony's trial. I know everyone is hoping for conviction and I was hoping for the state to prove she did,not for me to rely on my feelings on her quilt or innocent.

They had proved the body in the trunk. Beyond reasonable doubt.
This video cannot prove anything but what "could have happed" and everyone already knows it could have happened.
Before or after she might have drown in a pool.


Right now as it stands the defense is going to have to offer some reason for the duct tape to have been there, a reasonable reason for it to have been there and I honestly can't think of any reasonable reason why any person would put duct tape over the face, any part of the face, of a child that has accidentally drown or that is dead by any other means.

Linda7NJ
06-10-2011, 03:16 PM
JUdge is late comming back in....very odd

ZsaZsa
06-10-2011, 03:16 PM
I am sick over this.

It wont or rather shouldnt prove the tape waas placed before death. It is a theory. An educated theory but still a theory.

I feel the state is banking on emotions and opinions which cannot be proven. Right now ,with the experts not being able to provide anything concrete that proves Caseys murder her little girl Caylee.

And I know I am not in the popular opinion but this is bigger to me then Casey Anthony's trial. I know everyone is hoping for conviction and I was hoping for the state to prove she did,not for me to rely on my feelings on her quilt or innocent.

They had proved the body in the trunk. Beyond reasonable doubt.
This video cannot prove anything but what "could have happed" and everyone already knows it could have happened.
Before or after she might have drown in a pool.

The 'duct tape placed after death' excuse has already been tried in a Fla court and did not convince anyone. The Supreme court upheld that decision, so it's no longer a theory but a proven legal fact..

stilettos
06-10-2011, 03:16 PM
TY, and yeah it really doesn't get any more simple than that, does it?

I believe it is exactly this concise, clear, simple and logical testimony that will eventually convict ICA. Accidental Drowning victims do not end up bagged and thrown out for animals to ravage and they don't have duct tape with heart shaped stickers on their faces.

darnudes
06-10-2011, 03:16 PM
I would hope JBP would error on the side of caution. I would think this witness could just testify to his findings. WHy risk it??? JMHO


The judge will err on the side of the law - whoever has the case law to support their side will come out on top, but I know animation has been used before - maybe not in Florida though.

jane the dood
06-10-2011, 03:16 PM
Mason is almost as good as Jose for the states case. He did a GREAT job with Dr. G convincing the jurys beyond all doubt that Caylee didn't drown 100% of the time accidental drownings are reported to 911

:websleuther::rocker:

2door73chevy
06-10-2011, 03:17 PM
I have to leave, will some kind soul pm me and let me know if the video was admitted? TIA

BigFatMommyDog
06-10-2011, 03:17 PM
IMO the defense was counting on the chloroform being the argument by the SAO......they just got a big shock.

I agree, and I am absolutely dumbfounded. Shocked that they weren't anticipating this after the "make it stop" hearing

Boots-OK
06-10-2011, 03:17 PM
Quick legal question. Had DT seen this previously since it wasn't "evidence"?

Lovejac
06-10-2011, 03:17 PM
I would have asked why do mortician glue eyes shut for veiwings.

tape would be unproffesional

If I was CM.

for real??

I never knew that!

5stars
06-10-2011, 03:17 PM
Dr. G hit it home for me.

dog.gone.cute
06-10-2011, 03:17 PM
Dr. G says "there is no child that should have duct tape on it's face after it died."

Watching recaps.


:rocker: This statement by Dr. G just "blew" the DT's "opening statement" !

costalpilot
06-10-2011, 03:17 PM
I'm on the fence as to whether it should be allowed in. If there's even one iota of it being prejudicial thus causing the verdict to be overturned then I say let it go. I think they have way more than enough evidence to get her convicted without it.

thats exactly why hhjp is NOT gonna let the video in

Cubby
06-10-2011, 03:17 PM
Our wonderful AZLawyer did this a long time ago...Respectfully quote:

Thread: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=90039&page=26

Post: #646 (with pic)


I know this thread is flying, but just as an FYI.

To link directly to a post, click on the post number. It will open an individual page for a single post. Copy and paste link.

hth

strawberry
06-10-2011, 03:18 PM
I want it in just because 1. ICA is mad as a hornet about it and 2. I want to see how she reacts to it being played in court as opposed to how she glared at it in the proffer.

Jen38
06-10-2011, 03:18 PM
IMO the defense was counting on the chloroform being the argument by the SAO......they just got a big shock.


But LDB stated in her opening statement the SA's belief that duct tape was the murder weapon, didn't she?

Mountain_Kat
06-10-2011, 03:18 PM
I just got this mental image of a bunch of WSers putting duct tape over their noses and mouths and cracked up.

Maybe Dr. Warren could try putting some duct tape over HIS face. I bet it'd still cover his nose and mouth, and he's a full-grown man.

Hadn't thought of it before, but I am now.

Wonders if we have duct tape. :waitasec:

stilettos
06-10-2011, 03:18 PM
Not coming in.

costalpilot
06-10-2011, 03:18 PM
told ya

mimmy03
06-10-2011, 03:19 PM
I find it interesting how ICA dramatics only really seem to occur when the DA is questioning witnesses and not so much when the DT is cross-examining. It seems to me that she's just doing this to make herself look like the victim and for attention. She wants the jury to think poor me, the DA is 'attacking' me, blaming me for this...

Also, interesting how well her tissue is holding up for all the sobbing. Those are some pretty absorbent, long-lasting tissues.

SindyBill
06-10-2011, 03:19 PM
If HHJP finds case law to allow this in, then I don't see how she'd have room for appeal if it's backed by case law..help me?

kantoo
06-10-2011, 03:19 PM
sounds like it's going to be out because it's inflammatory?

SpringTxMom
06-10-2011, 03:19 PM
I'm sorry, I just don't believe the super imposed picture should be used. I've seen cases where they've taken a dye/cast of the skull then build up the soft tissue in order to identify remaiins of a Jane/John Doe. Couldn't this have been done with Caylee's skull, plus using the pictures to come up with a realistic model, then add the tape in the courtroom? Since the model would have been made out of clay instead of remains, it would be less gruesome.

stilettos
06-10-2011, 03:19 PM
told ya

You be right.

HOTNTX
06-10-2011, 03:20 PM
Uh Oh.....I don't think HHJP is going to allow it in.

strach304
06-10-2011, 03:20 PM
Had to step out, but why would the state need to show that one piece of tape could cover mouth and nose, when there were multiple pieces of duct tape used ? TIA for any clarification.

Each piece was 2inches in width, length ranged from 9.75" to 6.75" common sense told me in discovery with location it sure is. The visual would be nice but not necessary imo.

truckengirl
06-10-2011, 03:20 PM
Anyone else think the defense team sinks itself further almost everytime they cross examine a witness. Dr. G. was able to make the statements about 100% of drowning children have been reported during her many years of experience during the cross exam by CM.

KathrynL
06-10-2011, 03:20 PM
Sounds like His Honor will exclude as prejudicial. I'm okay with that, no one wants reversible error. I don't.

Mountain_Kat
06-10-2011, 03:20 PM
I think it's gonna get in! :eek:

NocturnalLady
06-10-2011, 03:20 PM
I'm glad it's not coming in. I don't want Casey to have any excuse for an appeal. (Although she will probably have an automatic one due to the penalty she will get.)

SyraKelly
06-10-2011, 03:20 PM
I'm sorry, I just don't believe the super imposed picture should be used. I've seen cases where they've taken a dye/cast of the skull then build up the soft tissue in order to identify remaiins of a Jane/John Doe. Couldn't this have been done with Caylee's skull, plus using the pictures to come up with a realistic model, then add the tape in the courtroom? Since the model would have been made out of clay instead of remains, it would be less gruesome.

I was thinking the same thing.I don't know why the SA did not do this!

LglNrs
06-10-2011, 03:20 PM
..."prejudicial vs probative"....too prejudicial...exclude...

NavySubMom
06-10-2011, 03:21 PM
I'm on the fence as to whether it should be allowed in. If there's even one iota of it being prejudicial thus causing the verdict to be overturned then I say let it go. I think they have way more than enough evidence to get her convicted without it.

I agree with you, IMO, MOO, etc.

JSR
06-10-2011, 03:21 PM
Not sure if I want this video in or not ... I'm on the fence.

ziggy
06-10-2011, 03:21 PM
I hope all the pundits who buy Casey's crying act in court will notice she watched video with the skull in it and showed nothing but anger. It's official now: it's all an act in front of the jury!

Tiki
06-10-2011, 03:21 PM
in or not-
i don't think SA needs it.
jmo

.

strach304
06-10-2011, 03:22 PM
I find it interesting how ICA dramatics only really seem to occur when the DA is questioning witnesses and not so much when the DT is cross-examining. It seems to me that she's just doing this to make herself look like the victim and for attention. She wants the jury to think poor me, the DA is 'attacking' me, blaming me for this...

Also, interesting how well her tissue is holding up for all the sobbing. Those are some pretty absorbent, long-lasting tissues.

I've noticed that too, good point!

shezcrafti
06-10-2011, 03:22 PM
I think it's coming in.

costalpilot
06-10-2011, 03:22 PM
hhjp is PROTECTING this trial

this verdict

he knows what is dangerous to a verdict

and he aintt going there

thank heavens

strawberry
06-10-2011, 03:22 PM
I hate it when she gets her way.

The Farm
06-10-2011, 03:22 PM
What ever happened to the gatorade bottle with the syringe of chloroform traces? Did they say anything about that found at the scene?

Drama Queen
06-10-2011, 03:22 PM
I think that it is coming in.

NocturnalLady
06-10-2011, 03:22 PM
HHJP going through the cases cited.

adb263
06-10-2011, 03:22 PM
Don't worry all!!! She will still fry even though this video may not make it in!! I trust in our Jurors. They are not stupid nor blind. The Jury will see the monster that we all see, and will blame no one but her for her actions.

Justice is coming ICA...can you hear it!!!!

strach304
06-10-2011, 03:22 PM
in or not-
i don't think SA needs it.
jmo

.

He said he can still testify without the visual so...we'll see.

wandering
06-10-2011, 03:22 PM
I just got this mental image of a bunch of WSers putting duct tape over their noses and mouths and cracked up.

Maybe Dr. Warren could try putting some duct tape over HIS face. I bet it'd still cover his nose and mouth, and he's a full-grown man.Actually, I was hoping they could demonstrate on JB. Lord knows someone needs to tape HIS mouth. :banghead:

costalpilot
06-10-2011, 03:22 PM
You be right.

even a blind hog can root out an acorn once in a while

grandmaj
06-10-2011, 03:23 PM
OK this Dr. is I am presuming, going to present his expert opinion that the nose structure was holding the tape up. But during decomposition as the cartilage broke away the tape no longer being sticky slipped down except for the hair portions which were still stuck. That is where I think we are going. And I can see this happening.

MelissaLee
06-10-2011, 03:23 PM
Sounds like HHJP is going to let in the vid (so far). Says the first case cited by the DT is not applicable to this case. He's discussing the second case cited by the DT.

NocturnalLady
06-10-2011, 03:23 PM
Why is JB standing during this?? Just curious if there is a reason of protocol.

Serjen
06-10-2011, 03:23 PM
But LDB stated in her opening statement the SA's belief that duct tape was the murder weapon, didn't she?

She did. They are saying the chloroform may have been used to knock her out, but the tape is what caused the suffocation...

strach304
06-10-2011, 03:23 PM
i hope all the pundits who buy casey's crying act in court will notice she watched video with the skull in it and showed nothing but anger. It's official now: It's all an act in front of the jury!

yes!!!

Whisperer
06-10-2011, 03:24 PM
I'm getting the impression this is like one of those three dimensional images we see on the show "Bones".

Marina2
06-10-2011, 03:24 PM
HHJP said it himself, "I care about convictions." Whatever his decision is, it will be the right one.

gitana1
06-10-2011, 03:24 PM
I know this thread is flying, but just as an FYI.

To link directly to a post, click on the post number. It will open an individual page for a single post. Copy and paste link.

hth

Thanks! I never knew how to do that.

GiantPickle
06-10-2011, 03:24 PM
why is JB standing?

Bittiness39
06-10-2011, 03:24 PM
even a blind hog can root out an acorn once in a while

LOL. Even a broken watch is right twice a day.

Camille
06-10-2011, 03:24 PM
Why is JB standing during this?? Just curious if there is a reason of protocol.


Waiting patiently to object?

Z-sleuth
06-10-2011, 03:24 PM
LOL...the first case JB cited held for the prosecution in the case and the evidence was allowed.

miabellamoure
06-10-2011, 03:24 PM
Actually, I was hoping they could demonstrate on JB. Lord knows someone needs to tape HIS mouth. :banghead:



:floorlaugh:

Cheewawa007
06-10-2011, 03:24 PM
I want it in just because 1. ICA is mad as a hornet about it and 2. I want to see how she reacts to it being played in court as opposed to how she glared at it in the proffer.

I couldn't agree more!

carole
06-10-2011, 03:24 PM
Why is JB standing during this?? Just curious if there is a reason of protocol.

He made the objection to the tape, he is waiting for judge to rule.

NocturnalLady
06-10-2011, 03:24 PM
So far the cases HHJP has gone through haven't been helpful in him making his decision.

dog.gone.cute
06-10-2011, 03:24 PM
I am hoping it comes in.

I think the Jury needs to see a "demonstration" of how the duct tape was wrapped around the head.

:cow:

greycoupon
06-10-2011, 03:24 PM
I'm glad it's not coming in. I don't want Casey to have any excuse for an appeal. (Although she will probably have an automatic one due to the penalty she will get.)

Exactly. I know she will have one but she doesn't need any ammo from the SA.

Appreciate HHJP researched this and the DT actually managed to cite the proper case law, (even if it did aid the SA as usual).

Sounds like the video is out which is GOOD for the state's case.

NavySubMom
06-10-2011, 03:24 PM
I think that it is coming in.

you may be right!

Azcrabcakes
06-10-2011, 03:24 PM
Did HHJP say "computerated generated?" How cute!

Quiche
06-10-2011, 03:25 PM
Ugh, HLN Newsmakers! I've been blinded! Please keep the updates coming, I'm all tensed up!

Mendara
06-10-2011, 03:25 PM
The cases cited had nothing to do with this one.

Serjen
06-10-2011, 03:25 PM
Looks like he'll let it in, if not they should use CASEY as a dummy to demonstrate tape placement. Then leave it there.

GiantPickle
06-10-2011, 03:25 PM
omg sounds like it is going in

FaerieB
06-10-2011, 03:25 PM
LOVE that HHJP keeps saying "Caylee Marie Anthony."

gitana1
06-10-2011, 03:25 PM
It's coming in.

Marina2
06-10-2011, 03:25 PM
I believe it's in.

Stella5
06-10-2011, 03:25 PM
I think it's coming in because the debate over where the duct tape was placed exactly... both prosecution & defense have both brought it up.

Azcrabcakes
06-10-2011, 03:25 PM
why is JB standing?

Tired of sitting? Bad back?

grandmaj
06-10-2011, 03:25 PM
oooooooooooo Both the defense and the State both made questions about the placement of the tape. So the State opened the door to this line of evidence.

SeaNymph
06-10-2011, 03:25 PM
its coming in...hear it in his voice

gibby207
06-10-2011, 03:25 PM
It's okay if this doesn't come in. They don't need it, BUT! I'm glad ICA saw it. :innocent:

Dr. Know?
06-10-2011, 03:25 PM
Sounds like it's in!

reeseeva
06-10-2011, 03:25 PM
This Judge has not lost 1 out of 8 Death Penalty cases on appeal.....I'm sure he doesn't want to loose this one.....

Mendara
06-10-2011, 03:25 PM
judge will let this in??? hmm

LglNrs
06-10-2011, 03:26 PM
~just gotta say that watching ICA'S face on fire, while she was being shown Caylee's skull transposed over her living, beautiful little face was worth this moment in trial~

mikeysmommom
06-10-2011, 03:26 PM
OMG HE is Letting it come in!!!!!!!YES!!!!

NocturnalLady
06-10-2011, 03:26 PM
Holy moley it's in!

Mendara
06-10-2011, 03:26 PM
judge letting it KC getting angry again

gibby207
06-10-2011, 03:26 PM
Well, I'll be damned......

pjmale
06-10-2011, 03:26 PM
It's in.

BigFatMommyDog
06-10-2011, 03:26 PM
The cases cited had nothing to do with this one.

my favorite part so far... and quite indicative of the general trial so far...

SleuthinCa
06-10-2011, 03:26 PM
She's about to start crying again.

stilettos
06-10-2011, 03:26 PM
Holy Toledo!

Themis
06-10-2011, 03:26 PM
He's going through the factors that influenced the court of appeal decisions. It's coming in.

Marina2
06-10-2011, 03:26 PM
Evidence in murder cases tends to be "Not so nice." HHJP

January.
06-10-2011, 03:26 PM
Wowwwww

Sleuth5
06-10-2011, 03:26 PM
Well, I know HHJBP is undoubtedly the right man to make this decision. If he feels its legally sustainable, I believe him. Don't forget -- eight DP convictions, none reversed on appeal. Ergo, it's in.

Ssejors
06-10-2011, 03:26 PM
wuwu~!!!!

HHJBP IS LETTING IT IN!!!!!

Broderick
06-10-2011, 03:26 PM
We are watching this Judges' mind work... fascinating.

Marple
06-10-2011, 03:26 PM
He's going to let it in, at least that's what it sounds like to me.

sleutherontheside
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
CM will regret ever making an issue of the tape not being in a certain position.

Prof
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
"highly relevant"

Mendara
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
it is highly relevant because it is suggested to be the murder weapon!

Mountain_Kat
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
BOOYA! Told ya!

christee
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
It's in?!

azscr4mbl3r
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
it think it is in!

UFO
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
Woah, he's gonna let it in!

==================================

MOO

shezcrafti
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
Bam. The video is allowed in.

HHJP says it is "highly relevant as to whether or not this duct tape was placed in a certain position."

Sorry, KC. Deal with it.

PGWodehouse
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
Go Judge!! Love me some Belvin Perry!!

Dragonlady
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
It's in!

HOTNTX
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
It's in!!!!

FaerieB
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
She's going to LOSE it!!

Serjen
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
Judge Perry thinks ICA is guilty, I'm sure of it. Let any evidence in that will prove it Judge!

adb263
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
WOW...Can't believe it is in!!!

We are watching you ICA!!!

ella971
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
Yes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

cityslick
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
He's letting it in. I respectfully disagree with the decision.

LglNrs
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
~Coming in~Wowwwwww

sleutherontheside
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
I called it...trier of fact.

carole
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Go HHJP!!

MissDiva
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
I am SO GLAD he went into all of that. I think it's going to go a long way to prevent appeals.

yeknomaras
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
WOW super pout from ICA

whiteangora
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
It's coming in.

DairyGirl
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
Maybe I am missing something? I don't see the point anyway. It has already been proven by DNA that it is Caylee. Is the skull being superimposed on a picture of her face to prove that it was her? Or is it to show the placement of the duct tape in relation to her face?

miabellamoure
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
doing a happy dance!:great:

JSR
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
Sounds like it's coming in.

Rebound
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
BJB did an analysis with the duct tape and skull??

I thought I had seen all his stuff he did for this case!

I was afraid someone would ask. I'm terrible at doing searches (which is why I don't post much, but I got giddy about this proffer).

BJB posted about the 4 pieces of duct tape, and with lots of measurements and analysis, had a very simple drawing of a face with the duct tape placed over it. He was speculating about the sequence of the placement of the tape over Caylee's face.

Sorry, I shouldn't have posted without a link.

PS--the tape covered eyes, nose and mouth.

Softail
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
Somebody sure is mad!

QueenD
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
Its in tape and testimony

stilettos
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
Well, I'll be damned......

Me too...stunned I am.

Bobbarita
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
Omg! Hhjp i love you! Caylee loves you!

Sun
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
It sure is going to be interesting to compare ICA's first viewing of the video, with how she acts when the video is shown with the jury present.

roseofsharon
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
Three alarm fire :woohoo:

smart blonde
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
The Judge is going to allow the Jury to see the animation!
I'm glad.

strawberry
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
I love the way he lays all his thinking out. I LOVE THIS!!

NocturnalLady
06-10-2011, 03:27 PM
Wowsers! HHJP said it's highly relevant.

Now giving limiting instructions.

MaryAnn
06-10-2011, 03:28 PM
Judge Perry wants Justice for Caylee!! Yahoo

MaraSleuth
06-10-2011, 03:28 PM
ICA shook her head when JP said witness can take stand. She knows this is going to put the last nail in her coffin. Booyah!

BigFatMommyDog
06-10-2011, 03:28 PM
wow wow wow wow - smmmmmackkkkk down!

ZsaZsa
06-10-2011, 03:28 PM
It is coming IN!
Bear in mind all you who are worried about the advisability as to whether it's risky to the SA -
HHJP has only been over ruled on ONE decision in his ENTIRE CAREER on the bench!

:great::great::great:

ahoyhoy
06-10-2011, 03:28 PM
Watch her face be different when it's shown!!! OMG! HHJP sees ALL, ICA!

Amster
06-10-2011, 03:28 PM
Backflips!! HAHAHA....ICA shaking her head, "no"....too bad, so sad, ICA

January.
06-10-2011, 03:28 PM
Start mustering up those tears for the jury, KC.

Broderick
06-10-2011, 03:28 PM
Justice prevails.

yeknomaras
06-10-2011, 03:28 PM
ICA shaking her head at HHJP's ruling!! OMG

Stella5
06-10-2011, 03:28 PM
Woohoo! It's "highly relevant" to determine where the duct tape was placed on Caylee Marie's face. YAY HHJP... you ROCK!!!

MEM2010
06-10-2011, 03:28 PM
It's in!!

Marina2
06-10-2011, 03:28 PM
It's in with a limiting instruction.

SuziQ
06-10-2011, 03:28 PM
This animation is based on actual and factual pictures. So it's not totally animation.

KathrynL
06-10-2011, 03:28 PM
Wow, looks like it's in after all. But I will trust that HHJP would not risk reversal, so I will trust this decision. Unfortunately, I will not be able to avoid watching the Casey Cam train wreck while it is being played. Limited instruction, good move. moo

MrsT
06-10-2011, 03:28 PM
WOOT!!! Go HHJP!

Lovejac
06-10-2011, 03:28 PM
HOLY guacamole! It is in!

Did someone get a screen shot of her face when he said that!?

Miaa
06-10-2011, 03:28 PM
hhjp is PROTECTING this trial

this verdict

he knows what is dangerous to a verdict

and he aintt going there

thank heavens
Yep CostalP,
HH Judge Perry knows exactly how to run and rule his courtroom. I think he will keep things on the straight and narrow.

ziggy
06-10-2011, 03:28 PM
Judge now doing his 403 analysis: my quick summary...
Consider the need for the evidence; the placement of duct tape in the location on her body has been at issue. The jury has already seen the skull by now. There is no blood, gore or anything of that nature. The Dr. has indicated it will assist him in his testimony.

Does the evidence suggest any emotional basis for a verdict? Unfortunately in homicide evidence is not so nice. In this case, the picture of Caylee and the superimposition of the skull does not suggest and emotional basis.

The placement of the duct tape is highly relevant; this is something for the trier of fact to determine.

Will permit the witness to testify and pursuant to the Pierce case the judge will give a limiting instruction to the jury!!!

It's in people.

LyndyLoo
06-10-2011, 03:28 PM
I just knew it!!! CM going on and on about that placement of the duct tape opened the door to this!!! Yeah!!!..DT did open the door for this animation..along with a limiting instruction..Good Job...Well thought out and reasoned...Too bad sooo sad DT aka CM and JB...:rocker:

jane the dood
06-10-2011, 03:28 PM
Wowzer. Look at ICA's Seriously Angry Face now.

Camille
06-10-2011, 03:28 PM
Whoa BOTH sides have discussed the relevance of the placement of the duct tape. If the DT hadn't of been arguing about it all along it wouldn't have been allowed because it wouldn't be needed.

Going in! With directions to the jury.


:great::woohoo:

HOTNTX
06-10-2011, 03:29 PM
She's going to LOSE it!!

She's already starting to put on her killer glare. Let's see how "sick" she gets when the jury watches her, watch the simulation.

I love that KC's day is going from bad to worse!

nursebeeme
06-10-2011, 03:29 PM
it is in... now time to compare the reactions that ICA has to it.

Eidetic
06-10-2011, 03:29 PM
Thank god.

liltexans
06-10-2011, 03:29 PM
Says wouldn't cause an emotional verdict and allows video Baez smiles and shakes head. #CaseyAnthony he says he still objects
by cfnews13casey via twitter at 2:28 PM

The jury is not in the courtroom at this time. George and Cindy have not been here all day. #caseyanthony
by biancamprieto via twitter at 2:28 PM

January.
06-10-2011, 03:29 PM
Dang look at her face. She's skeery.

NocturnalLady
06-10-2011, 03:29 PM
JB didn't even stand when it was his turn to talk. Sheesh at least be professional.

AvalonBlue
06-10-2011, 03:29 PM
JP is so thorough and I admire him so much for many reasons -- and, as to this point on the picture, I really respect him covering all the bases.

reeseeva
06-10-2011, 03:29 PM
Justice prevails.

Divine Intervention to have this Judge on this case!....

imawitch
06-10-2011, 03:29 PM
HLn to many commercials, can some one please give me a feed link ? thank u

momtective
06-10-2011, 03:29 PM
YAY! :woohoo:

CalifMomOf2
06-10-2011, 03:29 PM
Somebody is not happy..lets see if she hangs head low now after we all seen her watch it!

truckengirl
06-10-2011, 03:29 PM
Just wait she will cry and play sick while the jury is watching this video when she sat through it earlier with a very straight face.

NavySubMom
06-10-2011, 03:29 PM
It sure is going to be interesting to compare ICA's first viewing of the video, with how she acts when the video is shown with the jury present.

This will absolutely be MOST interesting. MOST interesting. IMO, MOO, etc.

Intermezzo
06-10-2011, 03:29 PM
Did I chose a good time to come back to my desk?

shezcrafti
06-10-2011, 03:29 PM
Maybe I am missing something? I don't see the point anyway. It has already been proven by DNA that it is Caylee. Is the skull being superimposed on a picture of her face to prove that it was her? Or is it to show the placement of the duct tape in relation to her face?

The DT is trying (ineffectively) to argue that the duct tape was placed around Caylee's head post-mortem and/or placed in a manner that was not completely covering both Caylee's mouth and nose. This video will help prove otherwise.

21merc7
06-10-2011, 03:29 PM
JB button, unbotton, button, unbotton

adb263
06-10-2011, 03:30 PM
JB...we still hold to our previous objections.

HHBP...K (of course you do)

Love the judge!!

Mendara
06-10-2011, 03:30 PM
It is in people. Brace yourselves.

stilettos
06-10-2011, 03:30 PM
I called it...trier of fact.

I gotta admit HHJP is a great Judge....his considerations and case studies cover his derriere for appeal. I just wonder if it will be overkill for the jury.

Themis
06-10-2011, 03:30 PM
I called it...trier of fact.
You did and HHJP laid the factual foundation for his decision; like special findings even though the counsel didn't ask for them. Excellent call. My hat is off to you.

dog.gone.cute
06-10-2011, 03:30 PM
:woohoo::woohoo:

It is IN !

TY :HHJP:

IfIMay
06-10-2011, 03:30 PM
It will be interesting to watch ICA "watch or not watch" reaction now that we've already seen her watch it.

gitana1
06-10-2011, 03:30 PM
I'll tell ya', when the DT moved to have JS recuse himself, they made the biggest mistake. This judge is making every effort to allow the state to make it's case and make it a solid one. And he is brilliant in his ability to make his ruling stick - to make it very, very hard to appeal successfully.

IMO, this judge wants a conviction and he's making sure the state can get one and that it won't be appealed. I love it.

SeaNymph
06-10-2011, 03:30 PM
Its in and she is NONE to happy about it...look at that glare at the JUDGE SITTING ON HER DP CASE...tell me that one couldnt wrap tape around Caylee's head and throw her away....that's pure evil right there we are looking at...

....and when did she develop the Cro-Magnon Man Forehead?

Oh, and NO ONE forget how she sat there and watched it - compare it to the show she is getting ready to put on for the jury.

MsFacetious
06-10-2011, 03:30 PM
Now I'm going to be mad that the jury can't see how Casey reacted when she saw it when they weren't in the room.

How much you all want to bet that she cries, or gets sick or otherwise reacts strongly when it's shown in front of the jury?

I will be physically ill.

I'm not eating until tomorrow. :sick:

ahoyhoy
06-10-2011, 03:30 PM
Florida---WHO decides punishment? Judge or Jury?
If the JUDGE alone does it, her behavior is gonna fry her, is why I'm asking. TIA!

Patience
06-10-2011, 03:30 PM
The animation is in apparently so we will be able to see if Casey's reaction will be any different in front of the jury.

Pattymarie
06-10-2011, 03:30 PM
JB, sit down, be quiet, lets move on

The Farm
06-10-2011, 03:30 PM
It's in!

ewwwww, they look like brother and sister.

Dragonlady
06-10-2011, 03:31 PM
ICA better act the same in front of the jury, complete with her that's "BS" comment