PDA

View Full Version : 2011.06.29 TRIAL Day Thirty-one (Afternoon Session)


Pages : 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 [14] 15 16 17

marie-chantal
06-29-2011, 04:50 PM
What about the loss of someone because of your own violent behavior.

Thank you! I was just thinking the same thing. This testimony is frustrating to listen to and irrelevant to this case, IMO.

Baznme
06-29-2011, 04:50 PM
SK's resume:

Univ. of Fla.

http://nursing.fsu.edu/Faculty-and-Administration/Faculty-and-Staff/Sally-Karioth-PhD-RN

Cherry Baby
06-29-2011, 04:50 PM
Please tell me the jury is hearing this.

Totally inappropriate testimony - should have been saved for the penalty phase if you ask me.

MissJames
06-29-2011, 04:50 PM
Please can someone tell me if the jury is present for this?

Unfortunately,yes.

deelytful1
06-29-2011, 04:50 PM
Behind every "overruled" I can hear HHJP saying "YOU wanted to GO there!!!"

Fluffy Puppy
06-29-2011, 04:50 PM
Ashton cross: in essence, everything is grieving behavior.

katydid23
06-29-2011, 04:50 PM
" Promiscuity may be taking it too far."

oh well, then Casey may change your mind.

greycoupon
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
MarkNeJame Mark NeJame
Find me 1 other person out of 6,000,000,000 in world who went boozin', stealin' screwin' and tattooin' after their child died. #caseyanthony
9 minutes ago

I have no doubt this has happened. She is right about grief reactions being very different. I don't think it's that common but it's not reasonable to say no one grieving would react like that. JA just pretty much pinned down that grief reactions can be just about ANYTHING so any behavior can be consistent with grief.

Donjeta
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
DS objects because there are no facts supporting this.

Good grief (no pun intended), where were the facts in the direct?

kantoo
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
DS objects "there's no facts to support this?"

whaaaat???????????? after all the HYPOTHETICALS

the seeker
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
ha..in other words, it doesnt matter what actions were seen, it will fit into someone's version of grief. Good GRIEF.

liltexans
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
Ashton asks about "interest in sex." Karioth says some patients think it can help with grief. #CaseyAnthony -jfell
by cfnews13casey via twitter at 3:50 PM

Juror #11 looks somewhat amused. #CaseyAnthony
by stevehelling via twitter at 3:50 PM

Ashton: Is promiscuity consistent with grief? Karioth: Maybe taking it too far. #caseyanthony
by oscaseyanthony via twitter at 3:49 PM

fifteen89
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
Can he show the blue dress pic and say "THIS is what you'd expect..." and re-read DS's hypothetical? Just so the jury sees the pic again and hears how dumb this sounds?

Coldpizza
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
WTH is ICA (fake) crying for now? What is the point supposed to be?

She is trying to portray herself as grieving and finally someone understands her

It's not working on anyone, anywhere, anyhow

NocturnalLady
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
Oh the witness said that "promiscuity is taking it too far". Maybe JA should ask her if it's normal to spend the whole day in bed with your boyfriend the day after your daughter dies.

sleutherontheside
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
I am laughing at the audacity of DCS objecting to ANYTHING at this point. She opened the door and rolled out the red carpet for this cross.

donnam
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
Boy KC is throwing daggers at JA

pinkfly
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
,....so what is inconsistent with grief.......

she can tell him what is inconsistent with healthy grief....no ....any grief....

Dragonlady
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
Any Dave Chappelle fans here? If so, remember the skit where he had that "Get to the POINT!" gadget, friggin hilarious! That's how she makes me feel. I cannot stand rambling and repeating... now talking about drunk moms, now about 'retail therapy.' aaarrggghh, get specific, lady, and RELATE THIS DIRECTLY to ICA, you know, that chick in the back who is up for the DEATH PENALTY!! Why is the DT letting her ramble on when it was clear from the get-go that she cannot handle open-ended questions without rambling. I feel SO sorry for the jury!!!!
Dave Chappelle fan here!
I'm envisioning the MJ/OJ/Baretta skits now to help me get past this debacle.

mikeysmommom
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
This is a travesty of Justice IMO I hope this woman sees Caylees decomposing face in her dreams every night!It amazes me how low some will sink for $$$$.What a LOS!

TraceyLeigh
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
BRILLIANT Cross.... period

Lovejac
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
Oh no he didn't :eek:

matou
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
Is there ANY behaviour that is INCONSISTENT with grief?

Amazing Ashton.

minazoe
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
look at casey...pouting now? the bad man is arguing with my expert!

nativeSFL
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
Is any behavior INconsistent with grief? GO JA!!

the seeker
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
Lol...she just said: I think promiscuity is taking it too far.

YA THINK?

liltexans
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
She says anything can happen for grief.
by Gabe Travers/WESH.com at 3:51 PM

stg
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
OMG.

This is totally unreal. ICA is putting on quite the show.

WHAT ABOUT CAYLEE??????????????? Why do you only cry when it concerns only you??? And you sit cold as stone when Caylee is mentioned??????

Psychopaths only cry for themselves. They don't have feelings for others. I was married to one for five years, and unfortunately, I have to keep in contact with her because we have two kids together. She is a nightmare to deal with.

barrysgirl
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
Please can someone tell me if the jury is present for this?

Yep, they've been there for every second :floorlaugh:

gxm
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
"Tell me anything that is inconsistent with grief." Go JA!

jamiect
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
RichardHornsby Richard Hornsby
Please, I never thought I would say this, BRING ON RIVER CRUZ, PLEASE!
22 seconds ago Favorite Retweet Reply

GracieLu
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
LOL, "tell me anything that is inconsistent with grief!"

marlap
06-29-2011, 04:51 PM
This is completely offensive to me!! I just want to scream! I AM the person this woman is describing! I did lose a child when I was 17 y/o! .. I had NO support from my family during those times and YES I struggle with issues from my past related to that to this day..but NOTHING like this woman is describing..almost the complete OPPOSITE..talk to me lady..you want to know what it's really like? TALK to ME!

Pondering....I am so so sorry for your loss! :rose:

Socprof
06-29-2011, 04:52 PM
JA asked great question, asking witness what acts are INCONSISTENT with grief. Excellent line of questioning that reveals that this woman is a not a qualified expert on grief.

GreenTeam
06-29-2011, 04:52 PM
JA doing great!

luckygirl
06-29-2011, 04:52 PM
Okay, so when I was ~21, my son's bio dad shook him so violently that my son eventually died from the results. I did some of these things, but really she's describing so many different behaviors and reactions that I'm just really finding this not only irrelevant but also a bit offensive. IMO

Yeah, this is pushing some buttons for me, that's for sure--almost fifteen years later I'm still a freaking mess...
my son's dad, you ask? His behavior indicated that he grieved the loss of his own freedom (prison) but not the loss of his child at his own hands...

Grr...this is so ....general and frustrating

From the bottom of my heart, I am so sorry for your loss.

Turnadot
06-29-2011, 04:52 PM
I think the State had better get their own grief councilor to overcome this one. I am surprised we haven't heard of one. They need to rebut this one.
What is there to rebut? It's anecdotal woo woo. Nothing to overcome.

Ashton's cross will shut this down. The State don't need to call their own grief expert to rebut a defense expert that's a train wreck.

Just cross and be done.

My opinions...

sleutherontheside
06-29-2011, 04:52 PM
IF Sally is smart....she'll cover JA's bases too.

pinkfly
06-29-2011, 04:52 PM
so it is either healthy or unhealthy grief response but every behavior is included

ahoyhoy
06-29-2011, 04:52 PM
See peeps? THIS is why HHJP let her testify....because he was going to allow JA the SAME leeway! I'm SURE he repeatedly warned the DT they were opening the door again, with a witness that is all over the place in her answers....for whatever reason. JMO

Trubie
06-29-2011, 04:52 PM
It seems like everyone I know has bi-polar. Its the new disorder of the day!

Huh? If you've ever been close to someone with a properly diagnosed mental disease, you certainly wouldn't say "it's the new disorder of the day". A bit insenstive IMHO.

cloud9
06-29-2011, 04:52 PM
Color me lost!:banghead:

Did she say way back that the living, grieving victims throw out the true victim's belongings, toys, etc.?

NocturnalLady
06-29-2011, 04:52 PM
Casey's tears seemed to have dried up some with JA doing his cross.

JA doing his level best to keep the witness on track and get some pertinent answers out of her.

angeleleven
06-29-2011, 04:52 PM
I love JA..He is so...so....so...GOOD!!

Debbie3223
06-29-2011, 04:52 PM
is the waterworks show over now that JA up?...

strawberry
06-29-2011, 04:52 PM
You know what happens when you ASSume! :giggle:

minazoe
06-29-2011, 04:52 PM
this woman seems very narcissistic to me..very grande....

ew.

GiantPickle
06-29-2011, 04:52 PM
Pathological grief response....???

sorrell skye
06-29-2011, 04:52 PM
"Pathological"!!! First time I agree with the witness.

GracieLu
06-29-2011, 04:52 PM
"everything is consistent with grief in your opinion." LOL

pjmale
06-29-2011, 04:52 PM
RichardHornsby Richard Hornsby
Please, I never thought I would say this, BRING ON RIVER CRUZ, PLEASE!
43 seconds ago

Donjeta
06-29-2011, 04:52 PM
No matter with which hypothetical counsel gave you, you would say it's consistent with grief because everything is consistent with grief in your opinion.

So she can't tell if a person is grieving or not.

MaryAnn
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
ICA getting mad now.

gelfie68
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
God Bless Richard Hornsby

ZsaZsa
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
Hmmm- my dictionary defines grief as -
Deep mental anguish such as resulting from bereavement.
I'm still waiting to see ICA's version of anguish...

liltexans
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
Ashton asks if there is anything not consistent with grief? "everything is consistent w/ grief?" she says it falls into categories.

by cfnews13casey via twitter at 3:52 PM

gibby207
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
ICA spittin daggers to Ashton WHOA.

sleutherontheside
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
OMG...is JA about to list KC's 31 days?

Camille
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
Go JA! Thank you!

jon_burrows
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
They finally found someone who makes ICA look normal.

IMO

kathyn2
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
I think Jeff is trying to show that with this lady anything goes. Her testimony is worthless because it doesn't show anything is inconsistent with grief.

Oakley
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
MarkNeJame Mark NeJame
So basically any emotion is consistent w grief. GOOD GRIEF!!!! #caseyanthony @vinniepolitan @issueswithjvm @bethkaras @drdrew @nancygracehln

Lovejac
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
So when my Dad died last summer after a long, torturous illness, my being happy would have been normal? Oh, ok. I could have spared my self so much, well, GRIEF.

:grouphug:

allycat1208
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
Only because Ashton must have such a big ego, I don't care to compliment him, but he is too good to be true as an attorney. He knows exactly what to say or ask on even the most difficult subjects.

jamiect
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
MarkNeJame Mark NeJame
So basically any emotion is consistent w grief. GOOD GRIEF!!!! #caseyanthony @vinniepolitan @issueswithjvm @bethkaras @drdrew @nancygracehln
2 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply

Donjeta
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
Did you run that loss inventory on ICA?

Yeah I thought so.

JBounds
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
I assume the jury doesn't believe this mumbo jumbo.

liltexans
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
Juror 11 jots something down here and there. No one else appears to be taking notes. #CaseyAnthony -jfell
by cfnews13casey via twitter at 3:53 PM

Jurors aren't taking notes. They are listening to the testimony #CaseyAnthony -jfell
by cfnews13casey via twitter at 3:52 PM

lonetraveler
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
Ashton totally ruined Casey's grieving time.

pinkfly
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
so this was another waste of time

JA is very smooth

just asked if she applied her test to this case and she told him she knows nothing about this case

MaraSleuth
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
"everything falls under grief" - exactly!

AnotherGladysKravitz
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
"I don't know the facts of this case."

sandangel
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
This woman is an expert? OMG!! I hardly see it. I do see her as an extremely phony individual, full of BS!!!!!!

mimmy03
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
again ICA in tears when DT questions witness, SA questions and ICA demeanor completely changes.

Quiche
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
I don't know the facts of this case. done

butwhatif?
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
So my question is, if grief and trauma from losing a child can cause one to behave inappropriately, including partying ,spending etc, why did the DT need to bother with the molestation claims?
Proves it's a spaghetti defense. IMO

the seeker
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
Bam!!!!!!!!

Zoe Bogart
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
Look at the evil, angry look Casey is giving to Ashton!

Bainbridge
06-29-2011, 04:53 PM
"I don't know the facts of this case." -- Sally Karioth.

Thank you, and goodnight!

matou
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
How can you tell real grief from any thing else? There is an inventory tool.

Was this tool used in this case?

I don't know the facts of this case.

goldleaf
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
SK's resume:

Univ. of Fla.

http://nursing.fsu.edu/Faculty-and-Administration/Faculty-and-Staff/Sally-Karioth-PhD-RN

As a University of Florida Gator, I am begging posters to note that she is a professor at Florida State University - she teaches at FSU not UF

People in this state take the difference very seriously!!! FSU is not UF, and it never will be!!!

tehcloser
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
That's it........I need teh Patron, but it's ok, I'm grieving - the loss of my sanity from listening to this.

katydid23
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
GOOOOOOOOO JEFF!

"EVERYTHING falls under your umbrella of grief then. No matter what we describe to you,it could be consistent with grief. "


wtiness: Well, yess......

cakegirl0905
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
Ha! This is hilarious! What a bunch of psychobabblemumbojumbo. She doesn't come off at all credible, she comes off as loony. WHERE does the DT find these people?

sorrell skye
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
Dr. K: "I don't know the facts of this case."

There it is.

barbtries
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
is this woman here to say that kc's reaction to having murdered her daughter is somehow within the range of normal or forgivable?

i can't turn the sound on at work. i hope someone responds though because i don't want to be really (oops) peeved without a reason.
sorry new to the board used to saying what i think...
why did the judge let her in?

TIA

Wholehearted
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
Bored? You could be grieving. Curiosity? Nope--grief!

NocturnalLady
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
JA pointing out that no matter what hypothetical the DT gave the witness she would say it was consistent with grief. The witness agrees that everything would be on that spectrum.

liltexans
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
Karioth says she was emailed several weeks ago
by Gabe Travers/WESH.com at 3:53 PM

Karioth: I dont know the facts of this case. #caseyanthony
by oscaseyanthony via twitter at 3:53 PM

#CaseyAnthony jurors really seem fascinated with this grief Dr. "Anything can happen when someone has great grief"
by abcashleigh via twitter at 3:53 PM

If sex is a way to deal with grief, could that be a way to explain #GeorgeAnthony's alleged affair? #CaseyAnthony
by stevehelling via twitter at 3:53 PM

Whaleshark
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
I. don't. know. the. facts. about. this. case.

No other questions.

Chilly Willy
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
"I don't know the facts of this case." That'll go over good with the jury. :banghead:

shellsbells
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
"Can you look at a set of actions and tell if someone is grieving?" Man, JA is clever!

Lovejac
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
OMG...is JA about to list KC's 31 days?

I sure hope so!

the seeker
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
Oh, he is burying her.......

pinkfly
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
so JB was sending out emails fishing for someone who would give testimony about ugly coping

outlandishone
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
she just said to JA she doesn't know the facts of this case lol!

GiantPickle
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
ICA angry

marie-chantal
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
She's talking about symptoms such as losing hair and fingernails due to grief. What about getting tattoos that say "the beautiful life"? Is that a symptom?

Ugh...let's wrap this up already.

allycat1208
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
Huh? If you've ever been close to someone with a properly diagnosed mental disease, you certainly wouldn't say "it's the new disorder of the day". A bit insenstive IMHO.

I'm really sorry...I didn't mean it that way!

Wise Old Owl
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
Please oh please Mr. Ashton - ask this woman how many of her clients, students, whoever she has interviewed have been the actual perpetrator of the crime - the crime being they actually killed the child. How would they grieve then?

Please oh please I want to know how many of these "people" she has counseled, interviewed, studied, whatever - that were actual perpetrators of the crime?

C'mon in inquiring minds want to know!

QuietStorm
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
I don't know the facts of this case. Really? Why are you testifying then?

NocturnalLady
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
The witness has just stated that she "does not know the facts of this case".

ShortPotato79
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
Wow Ashton, NEVER disappoints. Amazing.

Lanie
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
Thank God, I will be having a dental extraction directly after this...I am looking forward to it now.

You're having a dental extraction? You must be grieving a loss. I'm so sorry.:crazy::crazy::crazy:

liltexans
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
Ashton; when were you contacted about this case? Karioth: I got an email in June. I didn't know there was a trial. #caseyanthony
by oscaseyanthony via twitter at 3:54 PM

Karioth says she was first contacted in end of May beginning of June about this case. #CaseyAnthony -jfell
by cfnews13casey via twitter at 3:53 PM

JB Fletcher
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
JA is brilliant in his cross of this witness!!!

Fluffy Puppy
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
She was FIRST contacted by the DT after the trial started.

Tulessa
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
LMAO hubby just asked me where JB dug her up at. :floorlaugh:

monique
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
"I have the hiccups" is consistent with grief?

Socprof
06-29-2011, 04:54 PM
Psychopaths only cry for themselves. They don't have feelings for others. I was married to one for five years, and unfortunately, I have to keep in contact with her because we have two kids together. She is a nightmare to deal with.

I hope you have custody of your kids. My opinion only.

Witness just said she had no facts about this case...slurring her words to a great degree.

BetteDavisEyes
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
The histrionics make me very uncomfortable. I could not and would not trust this woman if I were on the jury.

sleutherontheside
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
JB said he just thought of this DURING TRIAL!!!!! CONTEMPT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

fifteen89
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
ruh roh.

Softail
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
She doesn't even know the facts of this case.

stg
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
Ohhh, she doesn't know the facts of this case. Whoops! I thought ICA was trying to dig a tunnel out of the courtroom when she was bending over after that for a second. Next witness!

Oakley
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
JudgeJeanine Jeanine Pirro
No matter what hypothetical defense counsel gives u- its consistent w grief, right? Everything is consistent w grief. WHAT? #caseyanthony

Blue Ridge
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
Go JA!!! ! ! ! !

liltexans
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
Ashton: When you walked in what facts had you been given? Karioth: None.

by oscaseyanthony via twitter at 3:54 PM

Kateyes
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
assume that this person finds low talkers annoying and perhaps disingenuous. Assume that this person finds DS' low voice and style of cross examination even more grating than CM' bullying style of cross examination. Assume that this person finds this eccentric witness to add nothing but speculation to today's testimony. Assume that this person (Kateyes) will reach for the Woodford Reserve Bourbon as soon as this trial adjourns for the day!!!

Maxamillion
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
This is my first post but have been reading at this site for days. This testimony about grief is making me crazy. My father and his friend molested me when I was very young and my father continued into my teens. I also lost a child that was my heart and soul. Never in anybodies wildest dreams did I behave in this manner. It makes me sick that they are making excuses for ICA.

Horace Finklestein
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
"I dunno the facts of this case." Oh ok...so why are you testifying again?

pinkfly
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
ICA is so disappointed to hear she was not being covered in London

strawberry
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
She knew none of the facts of the case but now she's saying she DID know who ICA was because she looked it up.

artbuc
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
I don't know the facts in this case. Ok....

PMLsmom
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
YES it was in London news...

Beyond Belief
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
She can't do this. Another waste of time by the defense, but I find her interesting.

ZsaZsa
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
Any grief, to my mind, has to include a profound sense of loss.
Nowhere in ICA's behavior do you see her feeling she has lost anything, in fact she views Caylee's death as a great relief, she has gained her freedom..

GeekyGirl
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
London doesn't have Google??

ButForFortune
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
I love retail therapy!

The Eunice Burns
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
:rocker: JA

:swish: "I don't know the facts of this case". "None".

MissJames
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
The jury must be wondering why she didn't interview ICA.

Donjeta
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
Did she just say that she looked it up and did not look it up?

liltexans
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
Karioth: When I got the email, I didnt know who the name was at first. She suggested ppl in Tallahassee. #caseyanthony
by oscaseyanthony via twitter at 3:54 PM

Karioth says this case isn't covered in London.
by cfnews13casey via twitter at 3:54 PM

NocturnalLady
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
Casey had a major fidget outburst when the witness admitted she knew nothing about this case and had been contacted AFTER the case was already in trial.

Chilly Willy
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
Casey should have skipped town and gone to hide out in London.

GiantPickle
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
don't we have someone from London on here?

Enola
06-29-2011, 04:55 PM
LIES! It has been in the national papers over here! That is how I got here.

grammieto5
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
sneaky sneaky JB AGAIN!!!!!

LglNrs
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
I got an email to do lunch at the DP trial of Casey (someone I never heard of) Anthony

flourish
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
From the bottom of my heart, I am so sorry for your loss.

Thank you. I know this is not about me and I'm not gonna hi-jack the thread, but I have to say this testimony has made me sob and weep worse than anything in this trial so far...even worse that Caylee's little playhouse...

because I DO know what it is like to experience loss after loss after loss (my mom died two months before my son and I lost a brother before that to suicide)

I'm sorry for the TMI, I'm just home alone and needed to share and know ya'll are safe to share with....this woman is making me crazy!

Thank goodness my grief counselor was so much better and reasonable than this woman.

I cannot believe she's even being allowed...I agree this is post-verdict, sentencing stuff.

monique
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
Go JA! :hero:

JBounds
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
I'm ready for the drama of Krystal Holloway already. I'm done with this grief counselor.

Pondering Mind
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
Pondering....I am so so sorry for your loss! :rose:

TY marlap..been long ago and I talk about it here often..one of the reasons I do is because it has been so helpful to do so..ESPECIALLY when you come from a family just like this woman's talking about! I got pregnant and within 3 weeks I was married and told to move to another city..out of sight out of mind. Can't have the neighbors thinking my family was anything other than perfect you know..OMG where did this woman get her research anyway...I really want to know! My son was not quite 11 mths old when he died of SIDS..my family doesn't talk about that either to this day!

Kat
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
She worked the susan smith trial.

marleysmom
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
Casey's getting mad....hmmm...is this consistent with grief?????

liltexans
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
Karioth: I was being asked to come and talk about gen. research about grief/loss and how it affects individuals. #caseyanthony
by oscaseyanthony via twitter at 3:56 PM

Karioth: London carried it not at all (she was living there when contacted via email). #caseyanthony
by oscaseyanthony via twitter at 3:55 PM

outlandishone
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
London did not carry this story at all. Ohhh Casey ain't gonna like that lol!

TiaM
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
Baez and ICA now angry that they're not considered celebrities in London. :loser: :loser:

ZsaZsa
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
ICA is so disappointed to hear she was not being covered in London

She is, but only in the gutter press..

Donjeta
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
She was asked to talk about general research about grief.

Has she talked about any research?

What'sThatClue
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
Anyone here from London? Was the case covered at all there?

strawberry
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
She worked the Susan Smith case!

matou
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
She worked on the Susam Smith case.

PGWodehouse
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
She testified at Susan Smith trial!

Patience
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
She claims this case was not covered in the UK, but did it not appear in the UK online news and does our Nail member not come from the Uk?

pinkfly
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
she has really settled down....I think she has some respect for JA

TUSK
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
if london didn't carry it, that will start kc crying again.

Justin Tyme
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
ICA sure looks ticked at JA

luv
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
http://i53.tinypic.com/nqr1gm.jpg

FaerieB
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
JudgeJeanine Jeanine Pirro
No matter what hypothetical defense counsel gives u- its consistent w grief, right? Everything is consistent w grief. WHAT? #caseyanthony

passionflower
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
1274 for CAYLEE

OH my she worked for SUSAN SMITH case!!!!

Boodles
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
ok lady, we know you hang in London....we're impressed.

Just K
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
JA has touched on this but this witness will not admit that all of these behaviors could be attributed to anything other than grief as well...say the behaviors of a sociopath, maybe?

JSR
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
YES! Good question JA!!!!!!

Wise Old Owl
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
Oh my - she worked the Susan Smith case.

sleutherontheside
06-29-2011, 04:56 PM
Somebody PLEASE tell me the date of the trial that JB said he just thought of the idea of a grief counselor.

nursebeeme
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
doh!!!! she testified for susan smith!!!!!!!!

azscr4mbl3r
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
Please can someone tell me if the jury is present for this?

ICA crying jury must be there... just a guess

liltexans
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
Ashton: Have you ever worked with ppl who murdered their children? Karioth: Yes. Susan Smith trial. #caseyanthony
by oscaseyanthony via twitter at 3:56 PM

Karioth worked on the Susan Smith case.
by Gabe Travers/WESH.com at 3:56 PM

Tipstaff
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
Something ICA not going to be happy about - she is not famous world wide.

Oakley
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
"Have you ever worked with women who've murdered their children?" JA

If looks could kill, JA would be dead from ICA's deathly glare.

Camille
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
JA is even making this testimony interesting.

angeldust
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
big fat liar sky news have reported on this case

Softail
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
I thought we have UK friends here that say this case is covered across the pond. :waitasec:

Wholehearted
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
She's skipping over the time period between the first email inquiry and when she got on the plane to come testify. She's also ignoring the fact that information exists online!

sandangel
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
and while in London she never looked up anything about this case on the internet...... yeah, right.

There ya go Ashton, he just asked if she has worked with anyone in a case of murder.

jon_burrows
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
She testified in the Susan Smith trial. :eek:

I hope one juror read the book Susan's husband wrote.

IMO

YooKay
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
It has been in the UK newspapers in the last few weeks!

ontariolynn13
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
Ohhh, she doesn't know the facts of this case. Whoops!

My god, what a big mistake you made Mr HB

I want to see the person put on our site the mickey mosue picture of do you like them square please, I need a good laugh!!
PLEASE

fifteen89
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
Yep, Casey. Go ahead and take the stand. It'll be ok. You'll be the star of the show.

liltexans
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
Karioth says she worked the Susan Smith case. She testified about people who have enormous amount of grief can't make distinction from ..
by cfnews13casey via twitter at 3:56 PM

caseyanthony is not crying anymore.
by oscaseyanthony via twitter at 3:56 PM

tehcloser
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
She googled.................bet on it.

Beyond Belief
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
good on the overule.

summerthyme
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
Mack truck alert!

TortillaChip
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
What? no tears, ICA? Why not? Just because its cross?

MsMaddie
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
If anything qualifies as "grief" then can the area of "grief" actually be considered an area of expertise?

Doesn't this go to the argument that JA made concerning allowing this witness to testify in the first place?

Everyone has experience with grief, thus all jurors have experience with grief, thus no so called "expert" testimony is necessary.

belle3
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
Sorry but my family was a family of deniers also, a cold family that didn't discuss ANYTHING..... and I am the opposite. So how come I didn't turn into someone like ICA?
Same here. deniers liars and manipulators, but I am not

SeaNymph
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
Jeff Ashton is brilliant - he got her to invoke the name of Susan Smith in this trial and now the DT wants to shut that circus down STAT.

Chilly Willy
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
Witness lets out a sigh and looks a bit huffy as the attys go to sidebar.

Whaleshark
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
whoop. there it is.

Horace Finklestein
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
I hope she loses credibility in her professional life over this. She is disgracing her profession. She should be before a board of inquiry.

Etiana
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
Okay Judge, I adore you again because you let her testify so that there would be no question as to how ridiculous this witness is in relationship to this case.

TexasDoll
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
Witness is visibly deflated as another sidebar is called. She literally sank into her chair.

NocturnalLady
06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
JA asks if she has ever worked with women who have murdered their child. She says yes she worked on the Susan Smith case!

donnam
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
Wow this lady gets really annoyed with sidebars LOL

Donjeta
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
Susan Smith trial...

She testified that people who have had an enormous amount of grief may be confused and choose to save their loved ones from the pain they're suffered.

gngr~snap
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
wow I think I'm grieving!... but I dunno who died???

re DQ ulous...

strawberry
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
Apparently she can even justify killing your kids if you don't want them to suffer!

Tipstaff
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
Ah Susan Smith. ICA is among friends.

Lovejac
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
Wow she testified in the Susan Smith case!

Darla
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
Jesus - she's knows nothing about this case. She lives in London. No wonder she sounds tipsy. She's on vacay. I really think she is enjoying the sunshine a bit too much. JMO

shellsbells
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
This is my first post but have been reading at this site for days. This testimony about grief is making me crazy. My father and his friend molested me when I was very young and my father continued into my teens. I also lost a child that was my heart and soul. Never in anybodies wildest dreams did I behave in this manner. It makes me sick that they are making excuses for ICA.

I am so sorry for what you went through. :grouphug: Thanks for joining us! The excuses are really infuriating, I know. :maddening:

Blue Ridge
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
Sidebar called.... witness appears irritated...

cakegirl0905
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
The set of ICA's mouth right now is interesting. Her lips pursed, her bottom lip and jaw jutting out. Ooohhhhheeeee is she ever mad!

Not such a great day in court, is it Casey?

liltexans
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
Their own grief compared to their children's. Ashton says -so to help explain why a mother may have murdered her children? Obj -sidebar
by cfnews13casey via twitter at 3:57 PM

wenwe4
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
add to hypothetical she is tiny in stature....pregnant father says it is athletic...Mother said sedentary, denied pregnancy until 8 months old....(missed alot)
assume her Father makes statement that she might still be alive...brother felt left out efforts look for child remains - brother angry not involved with child ....since the obvious pregnancy...assume she was followed..but she was not followed...(object HHBP go ahead and finish) given all this what effect that can have on grief of loss of child....Dr. says that was very complex...give me alittle leadway...helping family with lots support and usually coping mechanisms...make journey come out on the other side...I don't believe we resolve grief but we get thru it....culture dont air our linen for others to see...response to traumatic incident I would imagine how other people ...silence of the famiy are don't talk, don't feel, don't share often leave other people difficult to understand....Object - HHBP -just a second Dr...sustained as to other people...(kc crying) in hypothetical situations we can see denial is a great helper ...story can be changed a little bit...in these situations described here ...I could see typical for there to be no discussion or discussion look unusual or abhorrent or difficult to understand...lets add to hypothetical. during 31 days young mother leaves home goes out to bar get tattoo beautiful life...that type behavior and grief reactions...more than what you described more important to look @ behavior of what everyone did in those in 31 days ...seems very like other young adults they are reluctant grievers ...often say nothing happened. do risky behavior, do very thing their friend died from, retail therapy = acquire enough things make this go away.....look mad and sad response issue to grief...look @ adults limited exposure to world and inappropriate type behavior and responses I see risk taking...look like having great time spending money don't have,,get into trouble....berevement overload...someone act out after loss won't have anyone near them....loss is such a fine line betwen our job and children (object- sustain) how long does this type of behavior last? this type of behavior appearing normal fine - no change....appearing fine (object - overrule) ...always think normal and healthy grief and trauma ....grief loss but think about trauma years later someone asks this person to tell the story the story would sound the same and the behavior will not change....stuck on trauma...I have patients kept original grief responses for years and years...drinking, self medicating , little nest. not alot of people around....affect different...affective hysteria = their response to grief when come from environment without any healthy mechanisms...I have seen people lose a child and make arrangements to go to work next day and children go back to University and become hot shot student or very bad student...or don't want to talk about that...denial is what you tell self (object- sustain X2) all I have

JB up for Cross....
very sad....3 emotions sad, happy and mad....interest in sex...research that shows when you dont have rewards to make you feel better that makes you feel better (object- overrule) promiscuity is difficult to define...some folks who were very close find themselves doing things hadn't done in first 40 years ....anything on continuum for sex from frigid to over sex....object-overrule....I have had patients find sex will help them during their grief and later find that really wasnt helpful...can you give me anything inconsistent with grief? I can for healthy grief! NO ...anything inconsistent with grief...any type ...if you are not allowing me to say healthy responses and unhealthy resopnses require intervention...no matter whatever I tell you or hypothetical counsel gave you abhorrent grief responses need intervention - anything could happen when someone has a grief....if it is something abhorrent it is consistent with grief...everything is consistent with grief...everything with grief falls somewhere laong lines of healthy grief to abhorrent ....a certain person is at that time grieving...can you look @ set of actions and not know whether grief or loss...I have a tool use grief and loss system...I could read results I could say tell me about this specific thing....when first contact about this case...email in end of May beginning of June ...are you aware trial started trial started on May 23...no I didn't know trial started....email asking if I ever did expert witnessing about grief...when you walked in that door what facts about this case have you been given? none...I said at the time I got the email...I didnt know the name...I wrote and said there are people in Tallahassee do that work...I looked up name and said oh yes this had happened some time go....didn't research...when you walked thru door today what did you know about this case (object-overrule) asked to come to talk about general research and general loss...this case seemed to be about a young girl who lost a daughter...ever worked with women who kill their children...yes worked with Smith case...people who suffer grief maybe not the same way others grieve...that was for the Susan Smith trial who killed her children (object -sidebar)

Mohabi
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
I don't think the Dr. is very happy not having known anything at all about this case. She certainly looked more than a bit annoyed when this sidebar was called.

Trident
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
She worked the Susan Smith case!

Look where Susan is now.

robotdog
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
WHAMMO !!

JA sticking it to her.. go man go !

WholeLottaRosie
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
Hasn't the (London) Daily Mail covered this a fair amount? Don't we have members from England? What do you all say to the "absolutely no coverage in London?"

rose222
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
Gosh, how am I going to deal with not getting my daily Ashton fix once this trial is over?

Oakley
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
JudgeJeanine Jeanine Pirro
She knows nothing nothing nothing abt this case the facts or anything else. #caseyanthony

Tulessa
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
This is my first post but have been reading at this site for days. This testimony about grief is making me crazy. My father and his friend molested me when I was very young and my father continued into my teens. I also lost a child that was my heart and soul. Never in anybodies wildest dreams did I behave in this manner. It makes me sick that they are making excuses for ICA.

Hugs sweetheart. Been there done that.
ETA, never lost a child.

Concerned Papa
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
This woman lives 100 miles +/- from Orlando, FL and SHE HASN'T HEARD ANYTHING ABOUT THIS CASE?

I'm sorry, but that's a LIE!

MaraSleuth
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
Loving Ashton...what a smart lawyer.

stg
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
She knew none of the facts of the case but now she's saying she DID know who ICA was because she looked it up.

In a peer review journal, no doubt!

sherryk
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
Forgive me if this is in the wrong forum.. I am in Florida and we have a major afternoon rain storm my sattelite is out due to weather and has been for about 20 minutes.

Did they accept her as expert witness? Has direct examination began. I am trying to find direct link to court. I shouldnt rely on television and have a back up plan.

fifteen89
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
I wonder what parts this woman has played in musical theatre.......

belladonna
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
JA just tore her to shreds...GO JA....destroyed everything DS thought she was going to get sympathy from jury.....LOL....Susan SMith witness for defense...nice woman

the seeker
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
HA!!! She is saying that she doesnt know anything about the case or about ICA, so basically all her knowledge was NOT applied to this case AT ALL. Just blew the whole kittenkaboodle out of the water. NICE JOB JB....

matou
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
Baez got this witness who testified about a case of a woman who KILLED HER OWN KIDS AND LIED ABOUT IT. Nuff said.

Beyond Belief
06-29-2011, 04:58 PM
So where was the grief for SS for her loss of her children or a death prior to that.

Whisperer
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
I thought all witnesses and reports had to be submitted earlier in the year and that a strict deadline was imposed. Baez just solicited this one AFTER the trial started????

BiancaS
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
Well, now we know where they found her. She did so well for Susan Smith, I'm sure she will do equally well for ICA. OMG, insanity.

deelytful1
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
What's that McDs jingle? Bada bum baba "I'm LOVIN' IT!" :great:

imawitch
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
London doesn't have Google??

many of my clients are in the uk..after work is done, we often talk about the casey anthony trial, london is hip to this case, mo
several of my clients saw this case on sky tv..

that lady on the stand is full of it lol

Wholehearted
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
What were they thinking?! Bringing in an expert witness who testified in the Susan Smith case, just so the jury who could hear her name brought up in open court?

It's like the DT is trying to get her the needle.

mimmy03
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
me loving the witnesses connection to Susan Smith... another mother who murdered her children and made up a story about it. NICE!

yeknomaras
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
This woman lives 100 miles +/- from Orlando, FL and SHE HASN'T HEARD ANYTHING ABOUT THIS CASE?

I'm sorry, but that's a LIE!

she was living in London.

Firefly
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
Gosh, I think Casey is crying because this witness is going to hang her!!

Just K
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
This is not a case of a young girl who has lost a child. Again, this is a 25 year old woman whose child is dead, at the very least because of the neglect of the adults in her life. Then this mother let the child rot in a trash dump.

Talina
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
Wait..that is a felony murder case and she didn't say she testified in that case. She said she testified in ONE felony murder case and the Susan Smith case is not the one she said.:waitasec:

barrysgirl
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
doh!!!! she testified for susan smith!!!!!!!!

OMG! I'm sitting on my hands now for sure.

Azcrabcakes
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
This witness is a bit of a scofflaw herself!


Try these:
http://cvweb.clerk.leon.fl.us/process.asp?template=summary&addQuery=real_case.case_id='24065828'

http://cvweb.clerk.leon.fl.us/process.asp?template=summary&addQuery=real_case.case_id='40497245'

http://cvweb.clerk.leon.fl.us/process.asp?template=summary&addQuery=real_case.case_id='87015384'


(http://cvweb.clerk.leon.fl.us/process.asp?template=summary&addQuery=real_case.case_id='53072509')

Plaintiff in this one: http://cvweb.clerk.leon.fl.us/process.asp?template=summary&addQuery=real_case.case_id='76752907'

Debbie3223
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
:waiting:

FUN FACT: Roadrunner is a long-legged member of the cuckoo family found throughout the southern United States and northern Mexico.

London did not carry this story at all. Ohhh Casey ain't gonna like that lol!

lol..thats exactly what i thought...lol

Storm
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
http://i53.tinypic.com/nqr1gm.jpg

My heart breaks when I think of how many times Caylee must have seen that "hate" look:( ^i^

Horace Finklestein
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
So a publicity hound like this witness wasn't looking the case up online, etc? RIGHT!

tragco
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
Why do I ever worry when I know that JA is doing the cross. It's a wash, favorable testimony obliterated.

Lovejac
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
This is my first post but have been reading at this site for days. This testimony about grief is making me crazy. My father and his friend molested me when I was very young and my father continued into my teens. I also lost a child that was my heart and soul. Never in anybodies wildest dreams did I behave in this manner. It makes me sick that they are making excuses for ICA.

Welcome! You have come to the right place!

Prayers and love to you. :grouphug:

Socprof
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
Whoa! You go Jeff Ashton! Turning this truck right around, and this witness is too messed up to even catch on. And witness' admission that she knew NOTHING about this case when she walked into the courtroom today, should be startling and revealing to every juror. Witness is looking like a joke at this point.

TiaM
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
She worked the Susan Smith case!

Birds of a feather and all.

Another case that ICA pulled some of her story from.

Reality Orlando
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
This has been covered extensively in the Daily Mail...England! Didn't she say this wasn't covered in England:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2004778/Punches-thrown-outside-Casey-Anthony-trial-Florida-spectators-men-try-jump-line.html

stg
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
Forgive me if this is in the wrong forum.. I am in Florida and we have a major afternoon rain storm my sattelite is out due to weather and has been for about 20 minutes.

Did they accept her as expert witness? Has direct examination began. I am trying to find direct link to court. I shouldnt rely on television and have a back up plan.

JA is doing cross right now. Yes, she was accepted (Lord knows why) as an expert.

Fluffy Puppy
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
I think if Ashton and LDB had been prosecuting OJ's murder trial, he would have been convicted. Ashton ALWAYS gets to the core in cross examination.

Donjeta
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2007855/She-climb-pool-Casey-Anthonys-mother-tells-court-Caylee-drowned-herself.html

Daily Mail covers the trial.

BigFatMommyDog
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
ICA is sooooo pizzed right now

Cherry Baby
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
Oh wow! Susan Smith trial! So this lady is well aquainted with using the grief factor at trying to explain away people who kill their children.

At this point it's like she's saying, well ICA's skirts weren't short enough, therefore she has grief and has a reason to murder her toddler.

kaRN
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
I'm going to get my PhD in Grief. Nobody could ever question your thesis. It's all grief. Junk Science indeed.

Wise Old Owl
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
Did she interview Susan Smith? Huh? I wanna know.

Curious Me
06-29-2011, 04:59 PM
JA snacks on Dr. Sally. Did you see that? .:croc: