View Full Version : WA~Jet pilot, Weldon "Marc" Gilbert has right to view child porn he created in jail
White Rain
11-03-2007, 09:29 PM
"Kids crying out for help and in pain..." :furious: :sick: :(
ATLANTA — A pilot from Washington state was arrested in Atlanta this week on charges he sexually assaulted at least 20 boys at his home over a six-year period and videotaped much of the abuse.
Police and FBI (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,307859,00.html#) agents arrested Weldon Marc Gilbert, 47, in Atlanta on Thursday and charged him with nine sex crimes, including child rape, child molestation and sexual exploitation of a minor. The Lake Tapps, Wash., resident and pilot for the United Parcel Service was in jail in Atlanta late Friday awaiting extradition to Washington.
Pierce County, Wash., sheriff's spokesman Ed Troyer said more charges are likely. Police are reviewing more than 100 videotapes and DVDs found at Gilbert's home, many of which contain "very disturbing graphic images," Troyer said.
"We just started looking through the tapes, and we've already seen 20 different victims," Troyer told The News Tribune in Tacoma, Wash. "Kids are crying out for help and in pain in some of the videos."
more at link http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,307859,00.html
Taximom
11-03-2007, 10:11 PM
:sick: :sick: :mad: :mad: :sick: :sick:
So how did he have access to all these boys? Must be a coach or something.
Taximom
11-03-2007, 10:13 PM
Smiling scum picture here:
http://www.11alive.com/news/article_news.aspx?storyid=105796
Taximom
11-03-2007, 10:14 PM
Troyer says police believe Gilbert would take the boys on helicopter rides and then get them intoxicated at his house before tying them down, beating them and performing sex acts on them with the video recorder rolling.
Investigators began looking into Gilbert on Tuesday after two men reported they suspected their younger brothers were being molested by Gilbert.
A alleged victim, now 18, told police he was molested by Gilbert beginning in 2001 after his father died. The teen also gave police a videotape this week showing Gilbert abusing the alleged victim's 12-year-old brother.
Troyer says Gilbert was in Atlanta for UPS training. (more at link above)
kylie
11-03-2007, 10:27 PM
Honestly, we have to make the punishment so bad and public that these guys will think twice.............
Taximom
11-03-2007, 10:47 PM
http://www.co.pierce.wa.us/xml/abtus/ourorg/pwu/airport/airportnov2003.pdf
Above link mentions "Marc Gilbert" as President of Spencer Aircraft in Puyallup, WA. According to topix forum posts people that went to school with him call him "Marc" and according the link below he was a millionaire.
http://www.komoradio.com/news/local/10991346.html
"He gave them alcohol. We don't know if there's drugs involved," said Troyer. "He had rooms specifically designated for this. He was an intelligent man. He was a wealthy man. He put all of those things together, and he was able to do what he needed to do to get what he wanted."
Investigators said the footage shows little boys crying out during the especially malicious attacks with his hands or an assortment of paddles. The beatings often left welts, bruises and cuts on the victims who were as young as 12 years old, detectives said.
"Sex abuse and some of the things that are in here are pretty heinous on their own, but (there is also) the
This is Spencer Aircraft's website:
http://www.spenceraircraft.com/
Taximom
11-03-2007, 10:51 PM
http://www.thenewstribune.com/front/topstories/story/194568.html
The alleged victim said Gilbert sometimes would give him money and that he’d accompanied the pilot on trips to Hong Kong, Thailand and Europe. He said he later discovered that Gilbert was videotaping the abuse, according to court documents.
The teenager provided detectives with a videotape this week that also shows Gilbert abusing the alleged victim’s brother, who turns 13 on Sunday, the affidavit states.
Detectives served a search warrant Wednesday at Gilbert’s home in the 2900 block of 211th Avenue East on Tapps Island.
They seized videotapes, DVDs, CDs, floppy disks, sex toys, paddles, blindfolds, ropes, bondage implements, camera gear, a computer and two handguns, according to court documents.
Authorities tracked Gilbert to Atlanta after learning that he had job-related training there.
He was in jail there late Friday awaiting extradition to Pierce County for arraignment, Troyer said.
Seattle attorney John Henry Browne said Friday that he’s been hired to represent Gilbert. Browne said he talked briefly to Gilbert by telephone and told him not to fight extradition.
“I advised him that the best thing for him to do is get back here and take care of this,” the attorney said.
He said he couldn’t offer much comment on the charges because he hadn’t had time to research them thoroughly.
Troyer asked any other alleged victims to come forward. “Our detectives want to know who they are,” he said.
Taximom
11-03-2007, 10:56 PM
A female neighbor said she saw lots of teenage boys come and go but she just thought they were friends of the two boys that lived there. :eek: I wonder who they are and what they've had to endure. (KOMO video at above link)
Taximom
11-03-2007, 11:10 PM
Myspace site that uses his email "tappsflyer @ aol.com"
http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendID=10826102
Not much there, but his age is listed as "37". Hmph.
Taximom
11-03-2007, 11:14 PM
LOL I'm talking to myself here. LOL
I'm reading about it now. :eek: :banghead: :eek: :banghead: :behindbar :behindbar :behindbar
Whatever happens to this guy is too good for him.
SeriouslySearching
11-03-2007, 11:49 PM
I can't talk...I am just gagging. Can't even read this thread.
Wrinkles
11-03-2007, 11:52 PM
I'm reading, Taximom. Just got a break to do so.
Off with this guy's "heads" as soon as possible!
W
CaliKid
11-04-2007, 12:03 AM
Honestly, we have to make the punishment so bad and public that these guys will think twice.............
Something like this deserves the DP.
Filly
11-04-2007, 10:26 AM
FREAK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!http://www.pilotbusiness.com/pilots.htmlListed as one of these business people.
believe09
11-04-2007, 12:09 PM
Please, please do not allow him to post bail...clearly he is a "flight risk" pun intended...I mean this guy is not alone in this-I bet there is a ring.
Filly
11-05-2007, 12:21 PM
Seems that Weldon Gilberrt's own mother found it odd her son was allowing young men to live with him. Denial much?http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2003994356_pilot05m.html
The appeal of having sex with children simply escapes me.
But even more baffling is finding any enjoyment in sex when the other person is screaming with pain. :confused:
IrishMist
11-05-2007, 02:25 PM
The appeal of having sex with children simply escapes me.
But even more baffling is finding any enjoyment in sex when the other person is screaming with pain. :confused:
Rape isn't the same as sex, and it is about power. I would imagine the person screaming in pain would just heighten the perpetrator's sense of power, and hence, his pleasure.
Filly
11-05-2007, 02:49 PM
The appeal of having sex with children simply escapes me.
But even more baffling is finding any enjoyment in sex when the other person is screaming with pain. :confused:
I so wish the appeal escaped every single freak that's out there hurting kids, Nova. Who knows what these people get out of it, but it's obvious they can't even begin to control their impulses. They all need to be locked up. First Offense. No questions. No bail. Nada. Imagine the horror for these children for the rest of their lives thanks to this freak.
Taximom
11-05-2007, 03:02 PM
This guy is just like John Wayne Gacy. He got enjoyment out of torturing his victims too. They have their own special category.
I hope there aren't any missing young boys where he's travelled or lived.
I feel sorry for his mom.
Filly
11-05-2007, 03:30 PM
This guy is just like John Wayne Gacy. He got enjoyment out of torturing his victims too. They have their own special category.
I hope there aren't any missing young boys where he's travelled or lived.
I feel sorry for his mom.
Heaven help us. That name "Gacy" alone is frightening. He's lived as far as I could see in Sumner, Pullman, Bonney Lake all in Washington. McMinnville, OR. Then in, Oxnard, Lake Arrowhead, and Burbank, California. No doubt this guy has been to places like Thailand and such. I mean a millionaire with an airplane, helicopter can go anywhere. You are kind to feel for his mom, Taxi Mom. I don't. Then again, how was she supposed to know. She's probably elderly obviously. Hopefully they'll get the rest of the freaks involved in this because these pedophiles with pornography they can't help but share it. All around poor impulse control.
I so wish the appeal escaped every single freak that's out there hurting kids, Nova. Who knows what these people get out of it, but it's obvious they can't even begin to control their impulses. They all need to be locked up. First Offense. No questions. No bail. Nada. Imagine the horror for these children for the rest of their lives thanks to this freak.
You'll get no argument from me.
Rape isn't the same as sex, and it is about power. I would imagine the person screaming in pain would just heighten the perpetrator's sense of power, and hence, his pleasure.
I'm sure you're right that the power and even outright sadism are the appeal, I'm just saying it's incomprehensible to me.
Rape obviously isn't the same as sex for most of us, IM. And I understand why the "rape is violence not sex" argument is an important political distinction, because somebody had to find a way to get juries to stop thinking of rape as a "sex act" between two participants and to start recognizing that rape is violently imposed on one person by another.
But in fact, and whether or not it's p.c. to say so, sex for most people involves a certain amount of play with dominance and submission. That's why we have centuries of art concerned with "seduction." (There was a movement in the 70s among radical feminists to construct perfectly egalitarian sex acts, with nobody "on top," both partners equally active, etc. I think most now admit it was not only awkward, but not very hot.)
Even acknowledging that much, however, I think most of us have a very deep instinct to comfort and console a child who cries out in pain. That someone would not only fail to comfort, but prolong the pain... It's hard to imagine he is of the same species as we (even though I know he is).
IrishMist
11-05-2007, 04:46 PM
I'm sure you're right that the power and even outright sadism are the appeal, I'm just saying it's incomprehensible to me.
Rape obviously isn't the same as sex for most of us, IM. And I understand why the "rape is violence not sex" argument is an important political distinction, because somebody had to find a way to get juries to stop thinking of rape as a "sex act" between two participants and to start recognizing that rape is violently imposed on one person by another.
But in fact, and whether or not it's p.c. to say so, sex for most people involves a certain amount of play with dominance and submission. That's why we have centuries of art concerned with "seduction." (There was a movement in the 70s among radical feminists to construct perfectly egalitarian sex acts, with nobody "on top," both partners equally active, etc. I think most now admit it was not only awkward, but not very hot.)
Even acknowledging that much, however, I think most of us have a very deep instinct to comfort and console a child who cries out in pain. That someone would not only fail to comfort, but prolong the pain... It's hard to imagine he is of the same species as we (even though I know he is).
I agree that it is an important political distinction, IMO, it is an important distinction, period. Not just in discussion, but also in the way everyday people think of it. One of the most important things that a child who has been raped needs to learn is that they are still a virgin. That they haven't had sex yet. To cope with it for what is was. A violent act that was perpetrated upon them.
It may seem a small matter- splitting hairs, if you will. But, again IMO, for a rape survivor, it's an important one. For the way people perceive rape and its survivors, it's important.
I don't mean to nit-pick you, Nova, it's a concept that I cannot let go by me without comment. Kind of like when people think the U.S. is a Democracy... I just have to jump in.
I agree that it is an important political distinction, IMO, it is an important distinction, period. Not just in discussion, but also in the way everyday people think of it. One of the most important things that a child who has been raped needs to learn is that they are still a virgin. That they haven't had sex yet. To cope with it for what is was. A violent act that was perpetrated upon them.
It may seem a small matter- splitting hairs, if you will. But, again IMO, for a rape survivor, it's an important one. For the way people perceive rape and its survivors, it's important.
I don't mean to nit-pick you, Nova, it's a concept that I cannot let go by me without comment. Kind of like when people think the U.S. is a Democracy... I just have to jump in.
I don't think you're nit-picking, IM. I agree the semantics are important to jurors and to victims. I wish we'd confine the whole concept of "virginity" to the dustbin of history along with chastity belts and corsets. But the idea that a rape victim is no longer a "virgin" is outrageous. (I'm talking to YOU, Ann Landers!)
But I'm not sure that defining power and sex as mutually exclusive helps us to understand rapists. Put another way, if a serially rapist or child molester engages in no other sexual activity, would you call him a virgin? And if so, how would that be helpful?
IrishMist
11-05-2007, 05:40 PM
I don't think you're nit-picking, IM. I agree the semantics are important to jurors and to victims. I wish we'd confine the whole concept of "virginity" to the dustbin of history along with chastity belts and corsets. But the idea that a rape victim is no longer a "virgin" is outrageous. (I'm talking to YOU, Ann Landers!)
But I'm not sure that defining power and sex as mutually exclusive helps us to understand rapists. Put another way, if a serially rapist or child molester engages in no other sexual activity, would you call him a virgin? And if so, how would that be helpful?
Well, now we'd be moving into an area that would be more up South City Mom's alley. I've never given much consideration to the rapist or molester, to be honest with you. I have learned from her that there are differences between pedophiles, so I guess we'd have to delve into the different types, and what drives them in order to answer your question.
And while the concept of "virginity" may be antiquated, it is still a milestone for most people, and part of their growing up.
Don't tell me Ann Landers thinks rape victims lose their virginity??? First I learn that Sean Connery is an idiot, and now I'm finding out that Ann Landers holds this ludicrous opinion?? What is this world coming to? :doh: :)
southcitymom
11-05-2007, 06:44 PM
Well, now we'd be moving into an area that would be more up South City Mom's alley. I've never given much consideration to the rapist or molester, to be honest with you. I have learned from her that there are differences between pedophiles, so I guess we'd have to delve into the different types, and what drives them in order to answer your question.
And while the concept of "virginity" may be antiquated, it is still a milestone for most people, and part of their growing up.
Don't tell me Ann Landers thinks rape victims lose their virginity??? First I learn that Sean Connery is an idiot, and now I'm finding out that Ann Landers holds this ludicrous opinion?? What is this world coming to? :doh: :)
You rang? LOL! But not at this topic.....
I would say that virginity must be "lost" willingly. That word would be my distinction for purposes of this discussion. I would assume that a rapist was willing to complete the sex act when they raped and so I would not consider them a virgin were rape the only type of non-solo sex they ever had.
Filly
11-05-2007, 07:02 PM
One of the most important things that a child who has been raped needs to learn is that they are still a virgin. That they haven't had sex yet. To cope with it for what is was. A violent act that was perpetrated upon them.
Great point, IM. However when living with that in secret until adulthood it's an entirely different scenario. The not even knowing what sex is as an act because you're so young wrecks havoc along the way. It effects every single relationship we ever have up the road. This is why it's so very important to teach our children that they don't have to respect every adult because they are authority figures. You're not comfortable then too bad some adult gets offended. It's such a fine line. This is why these horrendous acts horrify me. So many lives hurt and manipulated and twisted thanks to one person who can't control their impulses. Interesting I never was a person even questioned the virginity thing. I had no definition for it. It wasn't in my vocabulary. Hmmm, something to bring up in therapy. LOL Seriously!
IrishMist
11-05-2007, 07:16 PM
Great point, IM. However when living with that in secret until adulthood it's an entirely different scenario. The not even knowing what sex is as an act because you're so young wrecks havoc along the way. It effects every single relationship we ever have up the road. This is why it's so very important to teach our children that they don't have to respect every adult because they are authority figures. You're not comfortable then too bad some adult gets offended. It's such a fine line. This is why these horrendous acts horrify me. So many lives hurt and manipulated and twisted thanks to one person who can't control their impulses. Interesting I never was a person even questioned the virginity thing. I had no definition for it. It wasn't in my vocabulary. Hmmm, something to bring up in therapy. LOL Seriously!
Great post, Filly, and I agree.
It does have an effect on survivors and their relationships. That's why it's so important in my opinion for survivors to learn how to cope and thrive- despite what has been done to them.
And not having a definition is a problem, too. Not being able to tell what happened to you, because you don't have the words to explain what happened. Now they have dolls, and therapists, that's a step in the right direction, I think.
One thing I learned is that how it affects people can change throughout their lives. You might have a handle on it for a period of time, then something at some point in your life might trigger emotions. Not always the same trigger, not always the same emotions. Therapy at different stages of life isn't unusual.
The virginity thing is important thing, IMO. Like SCM said, it's when you first give yourself willingly. Too many survivors didn't learn that, and as a result have lived with unhealthy or un-enjoyable sex lives. Too many teens think their first time doesn't matter, because "I'm not a virgin anyway."
Well, now we'd be moving into an area that would be more up South City Mom's alley. I've never given much consideration to the rapist or molester, to be honest with you. I have learned from her that there are differences between pedophiles, so I guess we'd have to delve into the different types, and what drives them in order to answer your question.
And while the concept of "virginity" may be antiquated, it is still a milestone for most people, and part of their growing up.
Don't tell me Ann Landers thinks rape victims lose their virginity??? First I learn that Sean Connery is an idiot, and now I'm finding out that Ann Landers holds this ludicrous opinion?? What is this world coming to? :doh: :)
I may be confusing Ann with her sister, Dear Abby, who still publishes a column. But I read a column from one of them where she answered, no, a molested child is no longer a virgin and needs help to reconcile herself to that fact. I was furious! As far as I'm concerned, we might as well argue that a girl who gets bounced vigorously on a horse is "no longer a virgin"!
And you didn't know about Connery? Where have you been?
IrishMist
11-05-2007, 07:42 PM
I may be confusing Ann with her sister, Dear Abby, who still publishes a column. But I read a column from one of them where she answered, no, a molested child is no longer a virgin and needs help to reconcile herself to that fact. I was furious! As far as I'm concerned, we might as well argue that a girl who gets bounced vigorously on a horse is "no longer a virgin"!
And you didn't know about Connery? Where have you been?
That's what I've been wondering!! Apparently, under a rock or something. :loser:
...The virginity thing is important thing, IMO. Like SCM said, it's when you first give yourself willingly. Too many survivors didn't learn that, and as a result have lived with unhealthy or un-enjoyable sex lives. Too many teens think their first time doesn't matter, because "I'm not a virgin anyway."
I understand that you're saying the issue of "virginity" must be dealt with because it is an important concept in our culture.
But I hate the concept. "Not a virgin anyway" isn't a good reason to have sex, regardless of what your previous experiences may have been. And what could be worse than the notion that once you've "lost it," all future sexual encounters are somehow trivial and unimportant.
I have no problem with the idea that rape may be sex to the rapist even while it is most certainly NOT sex to the victim.
Because the "rape is violence not sex" mantra--at least when we're considering the psychology of the rapist--makes rape sound like a barroom brawl. I think we'll agree it is mostly not.
That's what I've been wondering!! Apparently, under a rock or something. :loser:
What did he do now? I thought his days of punching women were behind him.
IrishMist
11-05-2007, 07:48 PM
What did he do now? I thought his days of punching women were behind him.
I'm not sure that he's done anything new, it's just the first I've heard about it, when apparently, everyone BUT me knew! Sheesh. Sure seems like ONE of y'all could have told me...
:D :D
IrishMist
11-05-2007, 07:53 PM
I understand that you're saying the issue of "virginity" must be dealt with because it is an important concept in our culture.
But I hate the concept. "Not a virgin anyway" isn't a good reason to have sex, regardless of what your previous experiences may have been. And what could be worse than the notion that once you've "lost it," all future sexual encounters are somehow trivial and unimportant.
I have no problem with the idea that rape may be sex to the rapist even while it is most certainly NOT sex to the victim.
Because the "rape is violence not sex" mantra--at least when we're considering the psychology of the rapist--makes rape sound like a barroom brawl. I think we'll agree it is mostly not.
It's certainly not a good reason, but it's a common thought for children that have been raped. It stems from emotions, and emotions, by their very nature, are not always logical. I think it probably goes hand in hand with shame, humiliation, feeling worthless... so many other "normal" feelings a child that's been raped feels, and carries with them.
I'm not sure that he's done anything new, it's just the first I've heard about it, when apparently, everyone BUT me knew! Sheesh. Sure seems like ONE of y'all could have told me...
:D :D
Honey, I believe the "sometimes a woman needs a slap" interview was in the 1980s!
csds703
11-05-2007, 08:02 PM
I'm not sure that he's done anything new, it's just the first I've heard about it, when apparently, everyone BUT me knew! Sheesh. Sure seems like ONE of y'all could have told me...
:D :D
I didn't know this either. Where have we been?:doh:
IrishMist
11-05-2007, 08:09 PM
I didn't know this either. Where have we been?:doh:
:woohoo: I got back up!!
Knew I could count on you, CSDS! :blowkiss:
Sorry about the hijack of the hijack, people. :blushing: If anyone wants to post on topic now, I'll try to behave. :silenced:
csds703
11-05-2007, 08:36 PM
:woohoo: I got back up!!
Knew I could count on you, CSDS! :blowkiss:
Sorry about the hijack of the hijack, people. :blushing: If anyone wants to post on topic now, I'll try to behave. :silenced:
I'm not sure how to take that :waitasec:
Back on topic folks.
IrishMist
11-05-2007, 08:45 PM
I'm not sure how to take that :waitasec:
Back on topic folks.
I was just so happy to not be the only one to not know, that's all. I would have said it to just about anyone, but you and I tend to agree on so many things that it didn't surprise me that it was you.
Did that make ANY sense at all? :D
csds703
11-05-2007, 08:46 PM
I was just so happy to not be the only one to not know, that's all. I would have said it to just about anyone, but you and I tend to agree on so many things that it didn't surprise me that it was you.
Did that make ANY sense at all? :D
:blowkiss: :blowkiss:
southcitymom
11-05-2007, 08:59 PM
That's what I've been wondering!! Apparently, under a rock or something. :loser:
You're not the only one, Irish. I never knew that about Sean!
IrishMist
11-05-2007, 09:00 PM
Haha Nova. I'm not the only one that's been living under a rock. So there! :D
For SCM ---> :blowkiss:
CaliKid
11-05-2007, 09:01 PM
OT, but from Wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sean_Connery
In her autobiography My Nine Lives, as well as in subsequent interviews on radio and in print, Diane Cilento claimed that Connery had beaten her on several occasions - Connery vehemently denied the accusations.[15]
He caused an uproar in a December 1987 interview with Barbara Walters in which he said it was okay for a man to slap a woman with limited force, assuming that it was required to calm her down or "keep her in line".[16]
The interview with Walters referenced remarks Connery had made in a November 1965 interview with Playboy magazine on the set of Thunderball. In Vanity Fair in 1993 he said: "There are women who take it to the wire. That's what they are looking for, the ultimate confrontation. They want a smack."
You're not the only one, Irish. I never knew that about Sean!
:rolleyes: I've been thinking I need a hipper group of friends. This is why.
IrishMist
11-05-2007, 09:03 PM
:rolleyes: I've been thinking I need a hipper group of friends. This is why.
Yeah, well, you're stuck with us. Deal with it.
southcitymom
11-05-2007, 09:07 PM
I understand that you're saying the issue of "virginity" must be dealt with because it is an important concept in our culture.
But I hate the concept. "Not a virgin anyway" isn't a good reason to have sex, regardless of what your previous experiences may have been. And what could be worse than the notion that once you've "lost it," all future sexual encounters are somehow trivial and unimportant.
I have no problem with the idea that rape may be sex to the rapist even while it is most certainly NOT sex to the victim.
Because the "rape is violence not sex" mantra--at least when we're considering the psychology of the rapist--makes rape sound like a barroom brawl. I think we'll agree it is mostly not.
I agree whole-heartedly with what I highlighted!
There's the medical definition of virgin (hymen intact) as opposed to the cultural/emotional definition (has not willingly had sex). And don't even get me started if you throw non-penatrative lesbian sex into the mix - I mean what the heck's going on there with the V word?!
I also understand what Irish is saying - victims of sexual abuse have to have a meaningful landscape of language to describe and investigate their abuse on the road to healing from it. But still - I hate the virginity concept - especially how it is packaged and sold to females in our culture and world...but that's whole different thread.
IrishMist
11-05-2007, 09:35 PM
I agree whole-heartedly with what I highlighted!
There's the medical definition of virgin (hymen intact) as opposed to the cultural/emotional definition (has not willingly had sex). And don't even get me started if you throw non-penatrative lesbian sex into the mix - I mean what the heck's going on there with the V word?!
I also understand what Irish is saying - victims of sexual abuse have to have a meaningful landscape of language to describe and investigate their abuse on the road to healing from it. But still - I hate the virginity concept - especially how it is packaged and sold to females in our culture and world...but that's whole different thread.
I agree with what you're saying, SCM. And that would make an interesting thread. Now, whether or not the mods would like it... :D
White Rain, I'm sorry I hijacked.
southcitymom
11-05-2007, 10:11 PM
:rolleyes: I've been thinking I need a hipper group of friends. This is why.
There's no question that you do...but until then, you're stuck with the likes of us!
southcitymom
11-05-2007, 10:14 PM
Haha Nova. I'm not the only one that's been living under a rock. So there! :D
For SCM ---> :blowkiss:
Hey - my rock is cozy and warm and safe! Who'd wanna leave that? If I did, I might get slapped by the likes of Sean Connery: Double O Dufus.
IrishMist
11-05-2007, 10:32 PM
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Hey - my rock is cozy and warm and safe! Who'd wanna leave that? If I did, I might get slapped by the likes of Sean Connery: Double O Dufus.
There's no question that you do...but until then, you're stuck with the likes of us!
If ya'll were the hip group I deserve, you would have snapped back that you had lives in 1987, while I was watching Barbara Walters.
There. Now is that so hard? :blowkiss:
Monica Mouse
11-07-2007, 12:29 AM
Honestly, we have to make the punishment so bad and public that these guys will think twice.............
How about castration?
Filly
11-07-2007, 10:22 AM
How about castration?
Chemically or a big old scalpel don't even work. There's offenders who were castrated and then take hormone shots. They're right back out there. Often it leaves them frustrated as well and they progress to murder of the innocent. It's just astounding how many of these freaks are out there. Crimes against children such as these should be punishable by death.
believe09
11-07-2007, 02:47 PM
Chemically or a big old scalpel don't even work. There's offenders who were castrated and then take hormone shots. They're right back out there. Often it leaves them frustrated as well and they progress to murder of the innocent. It's just astounding how many of these freaks are out there. Crimes against children such as these should be punishable by death.
The only option is lobotomy and that is considered cruel and unusual.
The only option is lobotomy and that is considered cruel and unusual.
No, the only option is confinement, where the pedophile has no access to children. That may not be "perfect" justice, but it's the best we can do, morally.
IrishMist
11-07-2007, 04:13 PM
No, the only option is confinement, where the pedophile has no access to children. That may not be "perfect" justice, but it's the best we can do, morally.
I agree, Nova.
believe09
11-07-2007, 05:18 PM
No, the only option is confinement, where the pedophile has no access to children. That may not be "perfect" justice, but it's the best we can do, morally.
Don't misunderstand me Nova-I was being ironic. Yes, I think confinement is the answer until something comes along that will ensure a permanent cure.
Don't misunderstand me Nova-I was being ironic. Yes, I think confinement is the answer until something comes along that will ensure a permanent cure.
I'm very sorry, believe. I did misunderstand. There are a lot of strong feelings about crime and punishment here (and understandably so).
southcitymom
11-07-2007, 06:10 PM
I'm very sorry, believe. I did misunderstand. There are a lot of strong feelings about crime and punishment here (and understandably so).
We really need that tongue-in-cheek icon!!
colomom
11-07-2007, 06:21 PM
We really need that tongue-in-cheek icon!!
Just for you SCM http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y234/colomom/f_tongueincheek.gif
Filly
11-07-2007, 06:22 PM
I'm wondering if they still have this creep locked up? I bet he's lawyered up with all the loot he has.
southcitymom
11-07-2007, 06:42 PM
Just for you SCM http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y234/colomom/f_tongueincheek.gif
That's awesome, colomom!!!
southcitymom
11-07-2007, 06:44 PM
I'm wondering if they still have this creep locked up? I bet he's lawyered up with all the loot he has.
I'm sure that he has a lawyer. Even if he couldn't afford one, he would be appointed one.
I haven't heard anything about bond or being released, but as another poster mentioned, he is a pretty obvious flight risk. I would be very surprised - given that fact and the allegations made against him - if he were able to bond out.
Just for you SCM http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y234/colomom/f_tongueincheek.gif
SCM lives in Atlanta. She probably thinks your icon is chawin' tobaccy.
IrishMist
11-07-2007, 07:18 PM
Don't misunderstand me Nova-I was being ironic. Yes, I think confinement is the answer until something comes along that will ensure a permanent cure.
Sorry, Believe, I took your post seriously, too. I'm a lock 'em up and throw away the key person.
southcitymom
11-07-2007, 07:29 PM
SCM lives in Atlanta. She probably thinks your icon is chawin' tobaccy.
Or my pet cow chewing his cud!!!
Or my pet cow chewing his cud!!!
Don't get me started on Southerners and farm animals... :eek:
southcitymom
11-07-2007, 08:09 PM
Don't get me started on Southerners and farm animals... :eek:
I did go cow tipping once, but I was too drunk to be held acountable (and certainly too drunk to tip over a cow!)
Irish and I have even dirtier minds than that - can you guess what we thought colo's icon best described?
IrishMist
11-07-2007, 10:39 PM
I did go cow tipping once, but I was too drunk to be held acountable (and certainly too drunk to tip over a cow!)
Irish and I have even dirtier minds than that - can you guess what we thought colo's icon best described?
LOL!! Tattle tale :D :D
southcitymom
11-07-2007, 10:45 PM
LOL!! Tattle tale :D :D
I couldn't stop myself! :silenced: :silenced: :D
I did go cow tipping once, but I was too drunk to be held acountable (and certainly too drunk to tip over a cow!)....
You dear, sweet, naive girl! When I mentioned Southerners and farm animals, did you really think I meant cow-tipping?
southcitymom
11-08-2007, 04:02 PM
You dear, sweet, naive girl! When I mentioned Southerners and farm animals, did you really think I meant cow-tipping?
No - I was just trying to elevate the discussion! LOL! ( I know all about randy farmboys and longsuffering livestock....)
Filly
11-14-2007, 07:22 AM
Yeah, so this guy got lots of loot. Posted mucho bail. His lawyer said it will come to light that the films are showing guys that only "look young" but are consenting adults. Four more boys have come forward I read elsehwere. But the guy is very contrite about things he has done. Really?http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/339539_pilotporn14.html?source=mypi
Filly
11-21-2007, 08:51 PM
Here's a message we don't care how much money you have you can not be harming children. The rich pervert posted $1.5 million bail and walked regarding the State charges. The FBI then arested him. Grand jury indictment.http://www.thenewstribune.com/news/updates/story/210017.html
Taximom
11-22-2007, 12:28 AM
Thank God for the FBI! The one boy seemed to indicate he was 11 when the abuse started. Maybe this guy was careful enough about not putting minors on video?
Missizzy
07-13-2011, 04:47 PM
Whoa!! This is beyond belief. They sure are inventive, aren't they? I'd bet my lunch that Gilbert researched the law and figured that the best way to access these films was to act as his own attorney. My guess is that this creep thoroughly reviews these as he attempts to imprint them in his memory. Each viewing counts as yet another sexual assault, IMO.
http://www.katu.com/news/local/125454238.html
Accused sex offender allowed to watch child porn in jail
July 12, 2011
"A strange quirk in the law is allowing an accused child rapist to watch child pornography inside the Pierce County [WA] Jail. Marc Gilbert is accused of sexually assaulting young boys and videotaping the abuse. Under the law, defense attorneys are allowed to review material tied to the case. And because Gilbert has chosen to act as his own attorney, he has had unlimited access to the pornographic footage...."
and
"...Investigators seized from Gilbert's possession more than 100 DVDs containing 28 hours of pornographic footage. Some of the material was allegedly shot by the former jet pilot, and feature the young boys he's accused of luring to his home and exploiting.
and
"...We don't like it. We don't want to do it, but we have to follow the law. The fix here is to change the law," said Pierce County Prosecutor Mark Lindquist. To make sure no other inmates get a chance to see the pornography, Gilbert is made to review them in a separate room...."
More at link (plus video)
Missizzy
07-13-2011, 05:05 PM
Mr. Gilbert's being sued:
http://blog.thenewstribune.com/crime/2010/07/08/lake-tapps-pilot-accused-in-sex-case-also-faces-lawsuits-from-alleged-victims/#ixzz1S1MyqRQX
Lake Tapps pilot accused in sex case also faces lawsuits from alleged victims
July 8, 2010
"Another alleged victim of Weldon Marc Gilbert has filed a lawsuit against the millionaire Lake Tapps-area pilot accused of sexually assaulting boys. He's the 20th person - most of whom are alleged victims - to file civil actions against the 49-year-old Gilbert...."
and
"...R.M. claims Gilbert would come to his home without invitation, appear before R.M. without clothes on and videotape him in embarrassing and humiliating situations. R.M. is asking for unspecified damages for emotional distress, pain and suffering, medical expenses, lost wages and "a decrease in his ability to enjoy life," the claim states.
He's the latest victim to file suit against Gilbert, who's serving a 25-year federal sentence for sex crimes and faces more charges in Pierce County Superior Court. Nineteen others - 17 victims and the parents of two of the victims - have brought similar claims since 2007 and are asking for damages against Gilbert...."
and
Gilbert, a former UPS pilot, was arrested in October 2007 on child sex abuse crimes. Federal and state prosecutors have alleged Gilbert used money, the promise of flying lessons and other inducements to seduce more than a dozen boys and young men to take part in sex acts in his home, much of which he videotaped...."
more at link
NOTE: I just realized that we have an earlier thread on Gilbert. I've asked the mods to merge.
Missizzy
07-13-2011, 05:37 PM
Good Lord. I just read the earlier thread. Gilbert's arrest occurred when I was really ill and thus I must have missed it. I like to think I keep up on pedophile arrests in the Northwest. Gilbert's a monster, plain and simple. He tortured and terrorized young boys and now he's getting to watch those films over and over and over? That's literally sickening.
Being that Gilbert is said to have lived at one point in McMinnville, OR (suburb of Portland), I really have to wonder if he had some connection to the architect, Paul Pavlock, who was arrested and pleaded guilty last year to child porn. Pavlock was also quite well off and very bright. We have a thread on him:
Respected OR architect/professor faced with "far-reaching" child porn charges - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community
Another man who comes to mind is Tarquin Thomas, a British man living in San Francisco. He raped young boys and even adopted a little boy from Oregon for that purpose. I've since learned that Thomas had a remote vacation home in John Day, OR (way out in Eastern OR) where boys were seen to come and go. We have a thread on him too. Life in prison. I wonder if they're connected?
British man living in CA goes on trial for molesting OR foster son - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community
There's another extremely wealthy person in the NW who was caught with child porn in the last few years and immediately pleaded guilty. I can't come up with a name. I'll post when I find it.
Salem
07-13-2011, 10:12 PM
Bump.
Salem
Kimberlyd125
07-14-2011, 11:17 AM
Child rape suspect allowed to watch porn in jail
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/43745650/ns/us_news-crime_and_courts/
TACOMA, Wash. — A man accused of child sex crimes is being allowed to watch child pornography inside the Pierce County Jail in Tacoma, Wash.
Marc Gilbert, 50, is accused of sexually assaulting young boys and videotaping the abuse. Because he's chosen to act as his own attorney, he has unlimited access to that pornographic footage, which is considered evidence in the case.
Gilbert, who appears in several of the videos, was charged with child rape, child molestation and sexual exploitation of a minor in 2007, after the brother of two alleged victims called police, ABC News reported.
pinkfly
07-14-2011, 11:25 AM
Ugh...no real words fit this. I hope they can move his trial date up. Surely if he is convicted this will stop.....oh I suppose he will appeal.
Kimberlyd125
07-14-2011, 11:30 AM
The fact that they can't stop him is sick.
It's "evidence" for his case.
JenniferTx
07-14-2011, 11:43 AM
Truely disgusting! What is wrong with our judicial system? There is no way this should be allowed PERIOD!
JBounds
07-14-2011, 12:12 PM
He won't have that access in prison where he will be going for a long time.
This disgusts me and probably everyone else around him including the prosecutors and corrections staff. Ugh.
What is up with the private investigator he has? He'd better not be tailing the victims looking for "dirt" to try and damage their credibility...that would take the disgust factor to a whole new level!
nanny2five
07-15-2011, 09:51 PM
the victims ought to sue the state of washington for allowing their abuser to continue with their exploitation even while in jail. they might not win the case but it could very well help in getting the law changed so this cannot happen again. how horrible for the victims to know that the man who hurt them is still getting off on the tapes he made of their torture!
Missizzy
07-16-2011, 03:55 AM
Crime victims' advocacy groups are always looking for cases such as this to highlight just which laws need to be changed. My guess is that a change is already in the works. It takes a debacle such as this to shake some sense into legislators and the general public. We all know that if there's a loophole, a pedophile will find it.
Starfish
07-18-2011, 04:24 PM
Can someone please explain to me why this man is even entitled to a trial? Isn't a trial to decide guilt or innocence? They have hundreds of videos made by this man showing him tortuing & abusing these boys, there is no question he is guilty! Then he's allowed to defend himself, so he can view the movies he made because they're evidence and cross examine these poor victims???? Haven't the victims been through enough???? To say the laws are written for the criminals is an understatement!
I may have to give up my true crime hobby, I don't know how much more I can take. Perhaps we need to take another look at our constitution and the rights it gives to the people. It was written at a time when people had common sense and decency, that seems to no longer exist. It's truly sad when they have to put a law on the books that make it a felony to not report your child missing within 24 hours. And, because of this case, they will be writing more new laws so in the future freaks like this guy will not be able to view porn in jail. Sure, these new laws will be great, until a new loophole is discovered, but they do nothing for Caylee or the poor victims in this case.
The world just gets crazier & crazier everyday. I've always been facinated with true crime & found great joy in seeing these monsters pay for their crimes. But it seems more & more they go unpunished or they're let out because of over-crowding, only to repeat their crimes on more innocent people.
This case is simply appauling.
Missizzy
07-27-2011, 05:17 PM
An excellent commentary about why the people of Washington state need to demand that their legislators change this inane law NOW!!! I believe the addition of a single sentence of exception would do it.
http://www.theolympian.com/2011/07/27/1739057/law-must-be-changed-to-keep-pornography.html
Law must be changed to keep pornography from suspects
July 27, 2011
"State lawmakers must change a law that allows a suspected sex offender to view child pornography while incarcerated. This is one of those issues that defies common sense and enrages the public. Common sense says the state should not allow a man suspected of raping 20 young boys to view videos of the abuse while he’s in jail. The public’s outrage is perfectly understandable.
Weldon Marc Gilbert, 50, of Lake Tapps, is a former UPS pilot and millionaire businessman. He is charged in Pierce County Superior Court with 14 felonies, including multiple counts of child rape and child molestation and one count of possessing depictions of a minor engaged in sexually explicit conduct...."
and
"...Attorney John Henry Browne, who is on standby to assist Gilbert in the latest charges, says the pornography viewing issue is a constitutional matter. The state Supreme Court ruled in a 2007 case that any defendant acting as his own attorney is allowed to see all the state’s evidence against him. The tapes of a man having sex with the young boys is evidence in this case, so Gilbert has a constitutional right to view those tapes, Browne said. “People can have whatever opinions they want. The law says he’s allowed to do what he’s doing. And unless they want to change the Constitution, that’s not going to change..."
more at link
ETA: Has it ever been determined just how this man became a millionaire? I seriously doubt that all UPS pilots are millionaires and question why he would fly for them if he inherited family money. Was he transporting child porn or possibly even children for high end "clients"?
Donjeta
07-28-2011, 02:48 PM
What happens if a pedophile's lawyer is a creepy pervert? Is he allowed to go on possessing the child porn evidence in his files after the trial is over?
Missizzy
07-29-2011, 01:38 AM
You know, I've wondered the same thing. It floored me when I learned who all had copies of the transcripts of the interviews, the videos and full medical reports on my eight children who were raped. I know that we sure didn't get copies. Shockingly, because our children's rapist was a minor, the transcripts are not available to us...ever. I'll never forget being told by an attorney for the young man that I needed to be "mindful of his constitutional rights". This was after he was found guilty on 12 counts of Rape 1, Sodomy 1, and Child Sex Abuse 1. So, yes, I wonder who reads my children's private details and watches the videos of their disclosures and the medical exams all the time.
That's why we have advocacy groups for crime victims.
AnaTeresa
07-29-2011, 12:22 PM
What happens if a pedophile's lawyer is a creepy pervert? Is he allowed to go on possessing the child porn evidence in his files after the trial is over?
No, not really. I've encountered a little bit of this with my job - it may vary by state. Any child porn videos, we don't get copies of those here in the office. We have to go to the PD or prosecutor's office to review (with the client), for evidentiary identification purposes. Generally, you just view clips to prove it's the client in the tape, or to get an idea of the content. The attorneys don't watch the whole thing. The same goes for photos - we don't get those.
Transcrips of chats are a bit different. We get full transcripts when there's a cop on the other side of the screen, just to prove there's no entrapment. I've not worked on a case involving a real minor child online chatting yet, so I'm not sure if we get redacted transcripts or not. I'm guessing it's probably tightly regulated since it involves a child victim, rather than someone posing online.
Defendants DO get copies of all evidence that the state has against them, other than stuff marked "counsel only," which only may be reviewed by the defendant in the presence of his attorney. This varies by prosecutor - here in Ohio, there's no hard and fast rules about what is/isn't "counsel only" material. Generally, in pornography/enticement/importuning/etc. cases that I've seen, the explicit stuff has been noted "counsel only."
It's a difficult issue from a defense standpoint, because the attorney and client does need to see the evidence against the defendant before trial, so that they can challenege (if necessary) certain evidence. That said, examination of evidence generally ISN'T watching the whole thing. It would be difficult to craft a law which would prevent this without infringing upon defendants' evidentiary rights. It makes me feel sick to my stomach, what he's doing, but I'm having a hard time thinking of a good statutory construction. Ugh. Some people are just sick.
AnaTeresa
07-29-2011, 12:36 PM
You know, I've wondered the same thing. It floored me when I learned who all had copies of the transcripts of the interviews, the videos and full medical reports on my eight children who were raped. I know that we sure didn't get copies. Shockingly, because our children's rapist was a minor, the transcripts are not available to us...ever. I'll never forget being told by an attorney for the young man that I needed to be "mindful of his constitutional rights". This was after he was found guilty on 12 counts of Rape 1, Sodomy 1, and Child Sex Abuse 1. So, yes, I wonder who reads my children's private details and watches the videos of their disclosures and the medical exams all the time.
That's why we have advocacy groups for crime victims.
Missizzy, I understand completely your concerns about watching those videos and reading over the medical exams. From my perspective, almost everyone who deals in theses cases, from the attorneys on both sides, to law enforcement, to the judicial clerks - everyone reviews the materials for the case at hand, and then tries to put it out of your mind as quickly as you can. Cases like this really take a lot of compartmentalizing and depersonalizing for everyone involved. Everyone I have encountered so far is always disgusted by these types of cases. Files are also destroyed after ten years. I know there is always a risk, but from my experience, the people handling these cases try to put them out of their mind as quickly as possible. :twocents:
vBulletin® v3.8.1, Copyright ©2000-2013, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
0