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Thread 1 (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=144581)
Thread 2 (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=145258)
ALSO - please remember, we do NOT sleuth minors, we do NOT post identifying information about minors, we do NOT name minors.
If a minor is a victim or has been publically named by LE as a perp, then their name may be used. In this particular case, the ONLY minor that may be identified by name is Max, because he was a victim. ALL other minors are OFF THE TABLE.
This is a strict rule and your cooperation is appreciated.
Thanks,
Salem
ETA: Further explanation on minor names. Even when quoting from MSM or other sources, if the minor is not the victim or the perp, we change the name to initials. We do NOT quote the name of the minor. This is to protect the minor. Please keep that in mind. Try to put yourself in the shoes of the parent of that minor. What would you think if your child's name was splattered all over the web.
Thanks Guys!
Paladine
07-27-2011, 04:11 PM
Movin' on up! Thread #4! Thanks, Fran...
Quester
07-27-2011, 04:13 PM
7/27 Shacknai Death Probe Comes Down to the Rope, the Party and the Reputation
... the deaths — and the revelations that he and his ex-wife frequently attracted the attention of law enforcement in the past — threaten to turn his reputation from grieving, inconsolable victim to ogre. Keeping the media in line will be Sitrick’s job No.1 until charges are brought or declined.
http://www.bnet.com/blog/drug-business/shacknai-death-probe-comes-down-to-the-rope-the-party-and-the-reputation/9243
arielilane
07-27-2011, 04:15 PM
Rebecca Nalepa’s Knots May Solve Case (http://news.lalate.com/2011/07/25/rebecca-nalepas-knots-may-solve-case/)
LOS ANGELES (LALATE) – Rebecca Nalepa was found with her hands and legs bound. Those knots may now solve her case, investigators told news today. Rebecca Nalepa (photos below) aka Rebecca Zahau was found with her arms still bound behind her back in one knot, and her feet bound with another knot. She was not hanging in a noose when she was found, even thought that is how Adam Shacknai (photo below) reportedly found her. As detailed on Sunday, most readers contend it would have been physically impossible for Rebecca Nalepa to get into a hanging state unless she utilized certain types of knots. Today, local investigators confirm much the same in a statement to news.
oceanblueeyes
07-27-2011, 04:25 PM
I haven't heard that the police have spoken with the media lately.
Has anyone else heard or read this before the above blog mentions it?
Thanks.
Quester
07-27-2011, 04:33 PM
7/27 The Hanging Question of Coronado
But here’s the thing: one of our trainers saw Jonah here two days after it happened, after Rebecca died. He was here at the gym by himself.
[warning: it's kind of a long slog; opinions by locals; enter at your own risk]
http://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2011/jul/27/citylights2-hanging-question-coronado/
nanny2five
07-27-2011, 04:35 PM
The head stabilization device has various pieces. The process starts with a thin "board" which is slid carefully under a potential neck injury patent's head. After the board is in place, the foam blocks (which are separate) are put into correct position stabilizing the head. After this, the straps are put on and tightened, so the head is stabilized and the neck will not move causing further spinal cord damage.
The board and the foam head pieces are not seen in this photo, but it appears that the blue strap is still lying on near the patient. Many of these straps and "devices" are disposable and would not be something that the EMTs would pick up and put back on the ambulance.
so it could be the straps to that device that we are seeing? thank you for that information, pensfan. i would not be surprised to find out it wasn't a scarf at all.
astrodreamer
07-27-2011, 04:41 PM
Where exactly is the spotlight on Jonah Shacknai? Check Shacknai's Forbes CEO bio. He is one of the principal designers of BigPharma' s rise to a $400 billion dollar industry, starting as a chief congressional aide in 1977-- (at the age of 20, if the bio is to be believed). He helped to design Bayh-Dole legislation, then was patent attorney for 30 major multinational pharmaceutical companies. Then followed his personal love, the sicko Nip/Tuck scene (evidence of multiple cosmetic surgeries right on his face). Current critiques of Big Pharma as a rogue industry might point to him. He knows where many of the bodies are buried and would be a crucial player if BigPharma execs were to be examined by Congress like the tobacco industry was. The bizarre nature of the girlfriend 's death has the earmarks of a warning killing. So does the clean nature of the crime scene. Amateur murderers leave lots of clues -- pros clean up. There's plenty of evidence of cover-up. Donating the child's organs in such a case. Really? The terse death certificates, whisking away of witnesses, etc.
Just a hunch.
arielilane
07-27-2011, 04:42 PM
Thanks Pensfan for posting the information on the "saver". Something to think about.
peace9274
07-27-2011, 04:56 PM
7/27 The Hanging Question of Coronado
But here’s the thing: one of our trainers saw Jonah here two days after it happened, after Rebecca died. He was here at the gym by himself.
[warning: it's kind of a long slog; opinions by locals; enter at your own risk]
http://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2011/jul/27/citylights2-hanging-question-coronado/
From Tom, an accountant:
"I don’t have a clue what happened in this case, but I’m guessing they were playing a [sex] game and it got out of hand."
*****
Mmmm I don't think any one of us here at WS has posted this theory! And I thought we had every theory covered!!!
lauriej
07-27-2011, 04:58 PM
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2011-07-27-mansion-woman-hang_n.htm
Woman's hanging investigated in Coronado, Calif.
--snipped--
Investigators with the San Diego Sheriff's Department, who are probing the suspicious death in Coronado this month, await toxicology results from Zahau's autopsy.
Sgt. Roy Frank of the department's homicide unit said, "We're still weeks out" from concluding whether Zahau committed suicide or was murdered.
Frank said his department has spoken with Zahau's family and has had 15 investigators working the case, along with additional forensic technicians and investigators from the California Department of Justice (http://content.usatoday.com/topics/topic/California+Department+of+Justice). He said the probe "is progressing well."
"It's real important to let that evidence come out first before we pass any judgment," Frank said.
Zahau's family has set up a charity fund in her memory for the benefit of orphans in her native country, at www.burma-orphans.com (http://www.burma-orphans.com/).
BrownRice
07-27-2011, 05:03 PM
Completely random, but every time I see the pic of RN/JS with the purple background it reminds me of a (very bad) prom picture. And they are wearing coordinating colors. Belch. I assume an office party or something. It looks like he has used too many injections of his drugs as well.
Another point - someone earlier mentioned bruises (rumors of) on MS. I'd be suspicious of a 6 year old boy who didn't have any bruises! Those come with play and having fun. Obviously, abuse is different, but most kids have bruises.
MsFacetious
07-27-2011, 05:09 PM
Apparently law enforcement HAS talked to the media....
From Tom, an accountant:
"I don’t have a clue what happened in this case, but I’m guessing they were playing a [sex] game and it got out of hand."
*****
Mmmm I don't think any one of us here at WS has posted this theory! And I thought we had every theory covered!!!
It has been discussed here, however that falls under an accident.
Law enforcement HAS ruled out an accident.
They specifically said they don't believe it was a sex game gone wrong. (I can't find that, but I know I saw it... anyone else?)
They said it was homicide or suicide, period.
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2011-07-27-mansion-woman-hang_n.htm
"I've really got an open mind," Frank said of Zahau's death. "It's either going to be suicide or homicide."
7/27 The Hanging Question of Coronado
But here’s the thing: one of our trainers saw Jonah here two days after it happened, after Rebecca died. He was here at the gym by himself.
[warning: it's kind of a long slog; opinions by locals; enter at your own risk]
http://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2011/jul/27/citylights2-hanging-question-coronado/
Did Rebecca have any belongings at the gym? Some people keep a locker there if they go frequently and she certainly went frequently.
Maybe Jonah went to get her things, just like her family did at the house? It would have been at about the same time that her family was getting the stuff at the house.
katydid23
07-27-2011, 05:14 PM
From Tom, an accountant:
"I don’t have a clue what happened in this case, but I’m guessing they were playing a [sex] game and it got out of hand."
*****
Mmmm I don't think any one of us here at WS has posted this theory! And I thought we had every theory covered!!!
But WHO would she be having these sex games with? I really doubt Max's dad was into intense sex that night, after spending the day watching his son, clinically dead, laying connected to tubes in intensive care. I really don't think he would be there having wild sex that night. imoo
Quester
07-27-2011, 05:20 PM
... snipped ...
Did Rebecca have any belongings at the gym? Some people keep a locker there if they go frequently and she certainly went frequently.
Maybe Jonah went to get her things, just like her family did at the house? It would have been at about the same time that her family was getting the stuff at the house.
My impression of this persons full statement is that he was implying that JS was working out alone two days after RN was found (Wed) - that would make it Fri and two days before MS' official death (Sun).
If so, someone may have seen whether or not he had any scratches, cuts, bruises on his hands, arms, face, etc.
jstwondering
07-27-2011, 05:30 PM
In this article,
http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/Rebecca-Zahaus-Family--126121118.html
Rebecca's sister said:
"Rebecca was very intelligent and achieved anything she set her mind on."
I'm not accusing the victim of anything, but as a jilted wife myself, I felt that the woman that my husband left me for was out to take my life. The first time I met her, before I knew that she was sleeping with my husband, she actually asked me to give her a tour of my house and borrowed my bikini to go in my jacuzzi with my 6 year old daughter. (I may add that no one else at the party went in the pool...) This also was "a very intelligent woman who achieved anything she set her mind on."
Where as I now tolerate this woman for my children's sake, I can totally see a less stable, jilted wife feeling she has motive to make RZ pay for taking her only child from her. Also, remember, RZ called Max her son according to the doggie daycare guy, and was preparing to throw a party in DS's former house.
I'm not saying this is OK, I'm just saying, it adds up to one believable motive.
Quester
07-27-2011, 05:35 PM
I’ll bet one posted image of the best dessert I can find that DS is and has been in a psych ward or psych facility beginning close to MS’ memorial (Tues 7/19).
Any takers?
Paladine
07-27-2011, 05:37 PM
7/27 The Hanging Question of Coronado
But here’s the thing: one of our trainers saw Jonah here two days after it happened, after Rebecca died. He was here at the gym by himself.
[warning: it's kind of a long slog; opinions by locals; enter at your own risk]
http://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2011/jul/27/citylights2-hanging-question-coronado/
FROM YOUR LINK..."ONE LITTLE BUNCH OF FLOWERS"...that's just too sad.
One little bunch of flowers had no name, but it was clearly addressed to Rebecca.
“It is the way you listened, the way you comforted, the way you related to my every heartache, my every victory, even my losses, you were a true friend.”
obmama
07-27-2011, 05:37 PM
I
Has anyone else heard or read this before the above blog mentions it?
Thanks.
Just today (don't remember where), I read a brief one-liner that investigators' focus was on the "knot". It seems we're getting more out of LA news, now that the local news is no longer camped in front of the mansion. I notice a lot of the AP news comes from LA.
jstwondering
07-27-2011, 05:38 PM
I’ll bet one posted image of the best dessert I can find that DS is and has been in a psych ward or psych facility beginning close to MS’ memorial (Tues 7/19).
Any takers?
Nope... I'd be right there also, if MS was my little boy.
Pensfan
07-27-2011, 05:46 PM
Rebecca Nalepa’s Knots May Solve Case (http://news.lalate.com/2011/07/25/rebecca-nalepas-knots-may-solve-case/)
LOS ANGELES (LALATE) – Rebecca Nalepa was found with her hands and legs bound. Those knots may now solve her case, investigators told news today. Rebecca Nalepa (photos below) aka Rebecca Zahau was found with her arms still bound behind her back in one knot, and her feet bound with another knot. She was not hanging in a noose when she was found, even thought that is how Adam Shacknai (photo below) reportedly found her. As detailed on Sunday, most readers contend it would have been physically impossible for Rebecca Nalepa to get into a hanging state unless she utilized certain types of knots. Today, local investigators confirm much the same in a statement to news.
Disturbingly, there are many suicide manual sites on the internet. It took me only a few seconds to find one site with precise instructions on how to tie slip knot noose for a short drop suicide hanging. RN could have read these sites. :( (I am intentionally not posting the reference link.)
Paladine
07-27-2011, 05:50 PM
Just today (don't remember where), I read a brief one-liner that investigators' focus was on the "knot". It seems we're getting more out of LA news, now that the local news is no longer camped in front of the mansion. I notice a lot of the AP news comes from LA.
I've read knot info for awhile, now...not sure if it came from police, but it has been out there. Maybe a retired detective, iirc...?
There was this 2 days ago from Radaronline:
“The investigation is still ongoing. Rebecca's toxicology report, and autopsy result are still pending. Cops are also looking very closely at the knots that were used in the chords that Rebecca was bound with,” another law enforcement source says.
Notice? "Chords"? ;)
Paladine
07-27-2011, 05:54 PM
Link to a pharma discussion forum on the deaths...interesting, imo...
Death at Shacknai's house....where was he?? - Cafepharma Message Boards
oceanblueeyes
07-27-2011, 05:58 PM
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2011-07-27-mansion-woman-hang_n.htm
Woman's hanging investigated in Coronado, Calif.
--snipped--
Investigators with the San Diego Sheriff's Department, who are probing the suspicious death in Coronado this month, await toxicology results from Zahau's autopsy.
Sgt. Roy Frank of the department's homicide unit said, "We're still weeks out" from concluding whether Zahau committed suicide or was murdered.
Frank said his department has spoken with Zahau's family and has had 15 investigators working the case, along with additional forensic technicians and investigators from the California Department of Justice (http://content.usatoday.com/topics/topic/California+Department+of+Justice). He said the probe "is progressing well."
"It's real important to let that evidence come out first before we pass any judgment," Frank said.
Zahau's family has set up a charity fund in her memory for the benefit of orphans in her native country, at www.burma-orphans.com (http://www.burma-orphans.com/).
The statement by police really tells me so far they just aren't seeing a homicide. Homicide would have the earmarkings at the scene, imo. It would not be consistent with a suicide. They would already know if it was possible for her to do this or not.
It sounds like they do think this is a suicide but want to wait until the full autopsy results are in. In the end they may think she was highly intoxicated at the time and may have done this compulsively without any planning.
IMO
Paladine
07-27-2011, 05:59 PM
Disturbingly, there are many suicide manual sites on the internet. It took me only a few seconds to find one site with precise instructions on how to tie slip knot noose for a short drop suicide hanging. RN could have read these sites. :( (I am intentionally not posting the reference link.)
On the one hand, for the suicide scenario to be plausible, in any fashion, imo, I must believe she was distraught...extremely distraught. Now, would it be SO important to this distraught, suicidal woman that her hands and feet be bound? That she have a seat and research HOW TO? I have a hard time swallowing that one, bud...but, maybe, its just me.
Honestly, I feel it's completely irrelevant...cause I THINK she will have many signs of struggle and wounds on her body...that were not self-inflicted. And, imo, the same person tied the knots.
shana
07-27-2011, 06:05 PM
From the article posted upthread and linked below:
Rebecca Nalepa (photos below) aka Rebecca Zahau was found with her arms still bound behind her back in one knot, and her feet bound with another knot. She was not hanging in a noose when she was found, even thought that is how Adam Shacknai (photo below) reportedly found her.
Have we seen mention of this before?
Rebecca Nalepa’s Knots May Solve Case (http://news.lalate.com/2011/07/25/rebecca-nalepas-knots-may-solve-case/)
shana
07-27-2011, 06:08 PM
But WHO would she be having these sex games with? I really doubt Max's dad was into intense sex that night, after spending the day watching his son, clinically dead, laying connected to tubes in intensive care. I really don't think he would be there having wild sex that night. imoo
The article references another Asian female (Tom's comments).
imo, Does.Not.Compute, for more than one reason
Quester
07-27-2011, 06:19 PM
Just had a wicked thought:
IF DS did this:
A jilted woman could hold two people responsible, the husband and the mistress, for the break-up of her marriage and family.
The jilted woman could also hold two people responsible for the untimely death of her child: the mistress (now girlfriend) who was caretaker at the time and the now ex-husband who brought the new girlfriend into all of their lives.
As elementary previously posted and which gave me immediate shivers:
Originally Posted by elementry
Perhaps notably, the spot at which this hanging was staged, at the end of the side wing, would be an ideal spot to be viewed from the master bedroom window. Either for JS to discover in horror; or for someone to witness an execution?
The jilted woman and mother of a now clinically dead child could have exacted revenge by the murder of RN and the pain slammed on the ex-husband by the discovery of the public, naked, humiliating, hanging display which was intended for him to have found.
Double-whammy!
jjenny
07-27-2011, 06:29 PM
From Tom, an accountant:
"I don’t have a clue what happened in this case, but I’m guessing they were playing a [sex] game and it got out of hand."
*****
Mmmm I don't think any one of us here at WS has posted this theory! And I thought we had every theory covered!!!
Seems to be rather extreme for a sex game. Hands and feet bound and hanging from the balcony? How can someone possibly survive in such a game?
obmama
07-27-2011, 06:37 PM
Disturbingly, there are many suicide manual sites on the internet. It took me only a few seconds to find one site with precise instructions on how to tie slip knot noose for a short drop suicide hanging. RN could have read these sites. :( (I am intentionally not posting the reference link.)
I thought the same. And, wondered if a computer, IPhone or other media device, was among the evidence taken. Searching 27 rooms, a small gadget could be missed.
MsFacetious
07-27-2011, 06:39 PM
My impression of this persons full statement is that he was implying that JS was working out alone two days after RN was found (Wed) - that would make it Fri and two days before MS' official death (Sun).
If so, someone may have seen whether or not he had any scratches, cuts, bruises on his hands, arms, face, etc.
I just wondered if the initial purpose was to get Rebecca's belongings.
Also, Max's sister posted R.I.P on FRIDAY.
As far as I'm concerned, that is the day he "died." I don't know if that is the day they donated his organs, or if that was Sunday... but his teenage sister knew Friday that her little brother was dead.
I think it is likely that Friday is when they knew he was dead and gave the doctor's the okay to donate the organs. Then it took till Sunday to coordinate the surgeries for the 3 patients who needed those organs.
If you have just made the decision to donate your little boy's organs... your girlfriend is now dead... and your other kids are states away... and you are a fitness fanatic?? I can see going to the gym as being an "escape" if you are capable of moving enough to get there.
Work out anger... frustration... anything.
Some people drink... some people smoke... some people self injure... some people are healthier and they work out.
obmama
07-27-2011, 06:43 PM
was found with her arms still bound behind her back in one knot, and her feet bound with another knot. She was not hanging in a noose when she was found, even thought that is how Adam Shacknai (photo below) reportedly found her.
I also read her arms were NOT bound after he cut her down at another news site. I don't know how credible these reports are, as they differ from the initial reports.
Paladine
07-27-2011, 06:46 PM
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Children or not, I would never want anyone to experience what I did interviewing with JS or regretfully working for this disgraceful company - ask anyone in the Phoenix area, especially local Psychiatrists who treat people from MRX, what they here from women here . . . All directed from JS. Amazing what money can do - Fool!
Gossip? Yes, but repeated by 3 different posters...
http://www.cafepharma.com/boards/showthread.php?t=470815&page=2
Quester
07-27-2011, 06:58 PM
I just wondered if the initial purpose was to get Rebecca's belongings.
Also, Max's sister posted R.I.P on FRIDAY.
As far as I'm concerned, that is the day he "died." I don't know if that is the day they donated his organs, or if that was Sunday... but his teenage sister knew Friday that her little brother was dead.
I think it is likely that Friday is when they knew he was dead and gave the doctor's the okay to donate the organs. Then it took till Sunday to coordinate the surgeries for the 3 patients who needed those organs.
If you have just made the decision to donate your little boy's organs... your girlfriend is now dead... and your other kids are states away... and you are a fitness fanatic?? I can see going to the gym as being an "escape" if you are capable of moving enough to get there.
Work out anger... frustration... anything.
Some people drink... some people smoke... some people self injure... some people are healthier and they work out.
Sorry, I must have misunderstood your original post. :seeya:
katydid23
07-27-2011, 07:01 PM
Just had a wicked thought:
IF DS did this:
A jilted woman could hold two people responsible, the husband and the mistress, for the break-up of her marriage and family.
The jilted woman could also hold two people responsible for the untimely death of her child: the mistress (now girlfriend) who was caretaker at the time and the now ex-husband who brought the new girlfriend into all of their lives.
The jilted woman and mother of a now clinically dead child could have exacted revenge by the murder of RN and the pain slammed on the ex-husband by the discovery of the public, naked, humiliating, hanging display which was intended for him to have found.
Double-whammy!
Not to mention the possibility of framing her ex for the murder.
Paladine
07-27-2011, 07:04 PM
Connections, a little history...I hope it doesn't bore too many of ya'll ;)
In 1978, Mr. McGreevey entered the night program at Georgetown Law School. He worked during the day at the United States Justice Department, reviewing tax appeals. And, he says, he spent every other waking moment hitting the books.
Jonah Shacknai, a classmate, said Mr. McGreevey always sat in the front row and was always ready with the answers. ''He was probably the equivalent of a computer nerd, but he was always pleasant -- jovial, self-effacing,'' he said.
Mr. Shacknai remembered one nightmarish professor who relished humiliating students but was fond of Mr. McGreevey because ''he was the only one who had the time and patience to master the minutiae of medieval property transfer rights.''
http://www.nytimes.com/2001/11/01/nyregion/political-rise-built-discipline-under-mcgreevey-s-self-deprecation-heart-true.html?pagewanted=3&src=pm
CuriousAmazon
07-27-2011, 07:07 PM
I just wondered if the initial purpose was to get Rebecca's belongings.
Also, Max's sister posted R.I.P on FRIDAY.
As far as I'm concerned, that is the day he "died." I don't know if that is the day they donated his organs, or if that was Sunday... but his teenage sister knew Friday that her little brother was dead.
I think it is likely that Friday is when they knew he was dead and gave the doctor's the okay to donate the organs. Then it took till Sunday to coordinate the surgeries for the 3 patients who needed those organs.
If you have just made the decision to donate your little boy's organs... your girlfriend is now dead... and your other kids are states away... and you are a fitness fanatic?? I can see going to the gym as being an "escape" if you are capable of moving enough to get there.
Work out anger... frustration... anything.
Some people drink... some people smoke... some people self injure... some people are healthier and they work out.
I've read the entire threads, just hoping that RZ's death is not swept under the carpet. In any case my two cents on MsFacetious's comment: I've learned that when it comes to handling these matters, especially involving a crisis like this with LE involved, a normal behavior in a human going through so much, can be pretty much anything. Some handle it better, some don't. Some workout, some can't do anything but stay in a shut up room, some want to be with family, some are even suicidal, some go about their daily lives, some completely change, etc.
With that said, I theorize she was murdered. If it was me, well I would never do that in the first place, but I would like to look my best when found. In Asian culture, she wouldn't have wanted her family to know she did this naked. No, even in Burma they are quite modest. Her family sounds old fashioned, even if she has become modernized since arriving in the US 10 years ago. She wouldn't want to do that to her family. And if she was distressed and actually contemplating this, she would IMO consider what this (in the nude) would do to her family. And I wouldn't go for the orange electrical cord in the garage. That stuff is difficult to work with, even for a strong woman.
IMO I feel like the police are trying to keep this stretched out in the hopes that interest wane and the media stops/drastically decreases its coverage. This is something they want to forget. So I worry that the truth may not come out of the investigation, but I do hope I'm wrong.
For RZ to mention to the doggy daycare guy that her daughter (GS) was hurt, is interesting. Makes me wonder if she was involved in the "accident." Not on purpose, but they may have been playing a game...and she was whisked out of there pretty quickly. Very convenient for a person who knew something was wrong... Anyway I do think the child's accident was purely that--an accident. I don't think RZ would hurt the child in any way and risk losing JS. My top POIs are: JS, DS, AS, or unknown professional hit man.
Okay, sorry for the long comment.
Paladine
07-27-2011, 07:10 PM
Read this old Art Buchwald piece, it mentions Art's run in with Jonah at a party, years ago...REALLY...it's worth the click, imo. ;)
to finish reading the article, you need to move UP a bit...for those who don't know how, you can move the bluish area on the article, on the far right, to move viewing area...if that made any sense. I tried.
http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=WQNbAAAAIBAJ&sjid=8k0NAAAAIBAJ&dq=jonah%20shacknai&pg=5050%2C1753321
i.b.nora
07-27-2011, 07:13 PM
Gossip? Yes, but repeated by 3 different posters...
http://www.cafepharma.com/boards/showthread.php?t=470815&page=2
Well, three separate posts each by someone identifying themself as 'anonymous'. Basically worthless information. No way for us to identify them as '3 different posters'.
CuriousAmazon
07-27-2011, 07:15 PM
Connections, a little history...I hope it doesn't bore too many of ya'll ;)
http://www.nytimes.com/2001/11/01/nyregion/political-rise-built-discipline-under-mcgreevey-s-self-deprecation-heart-true.html?pagewanted=3&src=pm
Thanks Paladine, I really enjoy reading all your comments on this case.
As for Georgetown, it's the most pretigious school in the Washington DC area. It's the Who's Who of politics, law, medical school, etc. Georgetown graduates have a particular bond and it can last throughout their lives. They will help one another out, etc. I've seen it personally. So to say he has connections, is an understatement! If he was smart, which I think he would consider himself, he would have already made phone calls.
Paladine
07-27-2011, 07:21 PM
I've read the entire threads, just hoping that RZ's death is not swept under the carpet. In any case my two cents on MsFacetious's comment: I've learned that when it comes to handling these matters, especially involving a crisis like this with LE involved, a normal behavior in a human going through so much, can be pretty much anything. Some handle it better, some don't. Some workout, some can't do anything but stay in a shut up room, some want to be with family, some are even suicidal, some go about their daily lives, some completely change, etc.
With that said, I theorize she was murdered. If it was me, well I would never do that in the first place, but I would like to look my best when found. In Asian culture, she wouldn't have wanted her family to know she did this naked. No, even in Burma they are quite modest. Her family sounds old fashioned, even if she has become modernized since arriving in the US 10 years ago. She wouldn't want to do that to her family. And if she was distressed and actually contemplating this, she would IMO consider what this (in the nude) would do to her family. And I wouldn't go for the orange electrical cord in the garage. That stuff is difficult to work with, even for a strong woman.
IMO I feel like the police are trying to keep this stretched out in the hopes that interest wane and the media stops/drastically decreases its coverage. This is something they want to forget. So I worry that the truth may not come out of the investigation, but I do hope I'm wrong.For RZ to mention to the doggy daycare guy that her daughter (GS) was hurt, is interesting. Makes me wonder if she was involved in the "accident." Not on purpose, but they may have been playing a game...and she was whisked out of there pretty quickly. Very convenient for a person who knew something was wrong... Anyway I do think the child's accident was purely that--an accident. I don't think RZ would hurt the child in any way and risk losing JS. My top POIs are: JS, DS, AS, or unknown professional hit man.
Okay, sorry for the long comment.
Thank you for your long comment. I agree with most of what you say...and you said it well.
RBBM: I, too, share your fear...I feel driven...like I did till Casey was charged, then...I could exhale (for what that's worth, now). With ANS I've never exhaled.
I feel like I should be doing more. And I will. We, as a public, are not powerless. Twitter, petitions, FB groups, etc shows us that. The Zahau family and the public need to make noise. This families just TOO connected, too rich, too political...feels a little like Natalie Holloway, to me...funny how some victims never leave ones mind.
pferrin
07-27-2011, 07:22 PM
I've read the entire threads, just hoping that RZ's death is not swept under the carpet. In any case my two cents on MsFacetious's comment: I've learned that when it comes to handling these matters, especially involving a crisis like this with LE involved, a normal behavior in a human going through so much, can be pretty much anything. Some handle it better, some don't. Some workout, some can't do anything but stay in a shut up room, some want to be with family, some are even suicidal, some go about their daily lives, some completely change, etc.
With that said, I theorize she was murdered. If it was me, well I would never do that in the first place, but I would like to look my best when found. In Asian culture, she wouldn't have wanted her family to know she did this naked. No, even in Burma they are quite modest. Her family sounds old fashioned, even if she has become modernized since arriving in the US 10 years ago. She wouldn't want to do that to her family. And if she was distressed and actually contemplating this, she would IMO consider what this (in the nude) would do to her family. And I wouldn't go for the orange electrical cord in the garage. That stuff is difficult to work with, even for a strong woman.
IMO I feel like the police are trying to keep this stretched out in the hopes that interest wane and the media stops/drastically decreases its coverage. This is something they want to forget. So I worry that the truth may not come out of the investigation, but I do hope I'm wrong.
For RZ to mention to the doggy daycare guy that her daughter (GS) was hurt, is interesting. Makes me wonder if she was involved in the "accident." Not on purpose, but they may have been playing a game...and she was whisked out of there pretty quickly. Very convenient for a person who knew something was wrong... Anyway I do think the child's accident was purely that--an accident. I don't think RZ would hurt the child in any way and risk losing JS. My top POIs are: JS, DS, AS, or unknown professional hit man.
Okay, sorry for the long comment.
Welcome CuriousAmazon..wonderful post..I agree with you on nudity and for the reasons you listed. I dont believe that GS was whisked away..I believe the police took RN and GS to the hopital where they met with JS..She had already seen a very terrifying event for a 13 year old. I believe her dad didnt want her to see anymore. The police brought them back to the house on ocean..and from there we dont hear anymore about GS till her facebook message. Again Welcome
scorekeeper
07-27-2011, 07:23 PM
I see you all have been busy......they had to open another thread!!
All the rumors are flying because LE has not released any information.
I'm afraid that the longer we don't hear anything, that LE is going to come out and say it was a suicide. From everything we have looked at here, I am not sure they will ever convince me of that....
I still say those in the running are: DS, AS (for JS), or a message from someone for JS.
I totally agree with previous poster that say DS may be hospitalized....kinda' hard to charge/question someone that is hospitalized for having a "breakdown". She definitely nows how/what to do.......RN was killed in anger and I know I would be angry if my son was injured while in my ex-husband's girlfriend's care; then she comes to the hospital...not to mention she was probably with my husband before we were divorce.....nothing like a woman scorned...and not to mention the great big loss to my income and my connection to my ex...........yep, DS is still top on my list.....either completing or paying for the horrendous act to be completed...
Okay, off my soapbox......yep, I'm speculating...
HOMICIDE
:welcome: to all the newbies!!!
jstwondering
07-27-2011, 07:25 PM
I thought the same. And, wondered if a computer, IPhone or other media device, was among the evidence taken. Searching 27 rooms, a small gadget could be missed.
Agreed... but if they haven't taken ALL the media devices belonging to the parents, uncle, and RZ, IMO, they aren't doing their job.
Linda7NJ
07-27-2011, 07:25 PM
Where exactly is the spotlight on Jonah Shacknai? Check Shacknai's Forbes CEO bio. He is one of the principal designers of BigPharma' s rise to a $400 billion dollar industry, starting as a chief congressional aide in 1977-- (at the age of 20, if the bio is to be believed). He helped to design Bayh-Dole legislation, then was patent attorney for 30 major multinational pharmaceutical companies. Then followed his personal love, the sicko Nip/Tuck scene (evidence of multiple cosmetic surgeries right on his face). Current critiques of Big Pharma as a rogue industry might point to him. He knows where many of the bodies are buried and would be a crucial player if BigPharma execs were to be examined by Congress like the tobacco industry was. The bizarre nature of the girlfriend 's death has the earmarks of a warning killing. So does the clean nature of the crime scene. Amateur murderers leave lots of clues -- pros clean up. There's plenty of evidence of cover-up. Donating the child's organs in such a case. Really? The terse death certificates, whisking away of witnesses, etc.
Just a hunch.
What's wrong w/ donating the child's organs and saving the lives of others? :waitasec: I really don't understand your distain, in this case, or any other, over organ donation
Paladine
07-27-2011, 07:26 PM
Thanks Paladine, I really enjoy reading all your comments on this case.
As for Georgetown, it's the most pretigious school in the Washington DC area. It's the Who's Who of politics, law, medical school, etc. Georgetown graduates have a particular bond and it can last throughout their lives. They will help one another out, etc. I've seen it personally. So to say he has connections, is an understatement! If he was smart, which I think he would consider himself, he would have already made phone calls.
Thank you for your kind words and the information. I'm in Timbuktou, Canada, so my knowledge of prestigious US school is wanting...;)
This just solidifies my belief SOMEONE needs to make noise. Time for someone to stand up, lose thier fear, and do the right thing: contact reputable media and do not get paid for it, imo. If this is a battle for coverup, there's no other choice, imo. If it were me...I'd pray I'd have the courage....because I could not live with the guilt.
Wendy101
07-27-2011, 07:26 PM
After I read all the senerios to date - I still think this was Dina who completley lost it after Max fell.
Morag
07-27-2011, 07:29 PM
Seems to be rather extreme for a sex game. Hands and feet bound and hanging from the balcony? How can someone possibly survive in such a game?
Many years ago, and I believe it was in Connecticut, there was a case of a woman who was dropped, nude, onto her head out of her bedroom window. Her husband was arrested for her murder. But during the course of the trial, the local paperboy took the stand. He said that he used to hide in the bushes during the early morning hours and watch the couple play sexy games with the wife hanging upside down (being held by the husband). The husband was acquitted.
PS I've told this story on websleuths before, and everyone was totally repulsed- sorry!
MsFacetious
07-27-2011, 07:32 PM
I have a hard time thinking that Jonah killed Rebecca as revenge for whatever happened to Max.
Simply because Jonah would be processing not only the death of his son, but the idea that the woman he loved had hurt him or neglected him.
He would have to process and accept that his son was dead, because this woman HE brought into his life had caused his death.
Then get angry enough about that to take revenge on that woman... all before his son is officially dead?
Dina? Would have just had to process "That B!$@# is the one that hurt my child? Where is she?!"
We've seen this type of scenario before, where the step parent was involved in the child's disappearance or death... and the parent has a harder time accepting it than the ex does.
It's human nature to not want to believe someone you brought into the picture, someone YOU love could be capable of this...
While if you already despise this woman for being with YOUR husband... it'd be a lot easier to believe she did this too.
Kyron Horman's family comes to mind. Desiree accepted Terri's possible involvement before Kaine did.
Adam? Men do weird things when they are left alone with a vulnerable woman... we don't know a whole lot about him.
Rebecca's ex husband Neil?
Did he even know about Max's accident when Rebecca died?
Did he know where the mansion was and that they were staying there at that time?
Would he have had the guts to try and get in, or would he have assumed there was massive security?
MizStery
07-27-2011, 07:32 PM
Read this old Art Buchwald piece, it mentions Art's run in with Jonah at a party, years ago...REALLY...it's worth the click, imo. ;)
to finish reading the article, you need to move UP a bit...for those who don't know how, you can move the bluish area on the article, on the far right, to move viewing area...if that made any sense. I tried.
http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=WQNbAAAAIBAJ&sjid=8k0NAAAAIBAJ&dq=jonah%20shacknai&pg=5050%2C1753321
Quoting JS,"See that beautiful girl over there I hear she goes crazy after 5 vodka tonics."
Question Art,"Why don't you go over and get to know her"? JS answer,'"They cut her off after 3,I would be wasting my time.":loser:
I got a chill reading this. That was probably the luckiest day of that girls life to be rejected by JS. I wonder if she ever read that society column and felt creepy knowing JS(especially now)
could be talking about her?Sounds like JS thought he was a real player.
gngr~snap
07-27-2011, 07:33 PM
7/27 The Hanging Question of Coronado
But here’s the thing: one of our trainers saw Jonah here two days after it happened, after Rebecca died. He was here at the gym by himself.
[warning: it's kind of a long slog; opinions by locals; enter at your own risk]
http://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2011/jul/27/citylights2-hanging-question-coronado/
TOM, an accountant.
What I heard was that there were two women, one of them naked and bound up. And it was another female who made the 911 call...
...Two asain women.
THIS may be just a rumor ^^^^
but it fits with my theory someone was still in the house.
I don't get why RN would call about the dog.
Was it someone else that called?
A man saying he was JS maybe?
JS was at the hospital his child brain dead.
can't imagine the dog would cross his mind
even if the dog did "cause the accident".
The dog didn't throw that child OVER the balcony
there was a carpeted landing! "down the stairs" was THAT far.
I also head about the ball and MS hit his head on the wall
WHAT wall? he'd have to be swinging on the chandalier
This happened when police responded to the 911 call for MS?
And the dog care guy said he was told
by RN that GS was injured too?
There was also a disturbance reported at DS's
house that Mon night as well?
Was this a hostage situation?
Was she kidnapped and brought to JS's house?
:eek:I also "heard" DS's witnessed BOTH "deaths" :waitasec:
The 911 calls have been sealed...
Sounds to me like the women were tied
up/maybe raped? and the male "aire" was killed.
Wasn't it reported two women were seen leaving in a police car after MS
was taken to the hospital?
Sounds like a "hit" to me.
But if this happened? why would RN call the dog care guy?
He said she was crying. Was she forced to call?
Is he sure it was RN? Was she seen by anyone that knew her
after the police left?
I have this creepy feeling she was still tied up the entire day
and was being hidden on the property.
Tortured and killed the next morning. no wonder GS was shipped off!
Do we know FOR SURE DS is even alive right now?
I hope someone knows where she is!
Paladine
07-27-2011, 07:34 PM
I see you all have been busy......they had to open another thread!!
All the rumors are flying because LE has not released any information.
I'm afraid that the longer we don't hear anything, that LE is going to come out and say it was a suicide. From everything we have looked at here, I am not sure they will ever convince me of that....
I still say those in the running are: DS, AS (for JS), or a message from someone for JS.
I totally agree with previous poster that say DS may be hospitalized....kinda' hard to charge/question someone that is hospitalized for having a "breakdown". She definitely nows how/what to do.......RN was killed in anger and I know I would be angry if my son was injured while in my ex-husband's girlfriend's care; then she comes to the hospital...not to mention she was probably with my husband before we were divorce.....nothing like a woman scorned...and not to mention the great big loss to my income and my connection to my ex...........yep, DS is still top on my list.....either completing or paying for the horrendous act to be completed...
Okay, off my soapbox......yep, I'm speculating...
HOMICIDE
:welcome: to all the newbies!!!
I hear you! And tend to agree...especially about the lawyer and Dina...makes perfect sense, imo..now, that's not to say Jonah and his co isn't trying to quiet this...and make it go away, imo.
~n/t~
07-27-2011, 07:39 PM
For those who believe DS is responsible.......
From previous reports, LE could not get a hold of her immediately following the accident. At some point, she was told and we assume she rushed to the hospital to be by her son's bedside. Some reports mention "holding vigil".
Do you honestly believe she would have left her dying son to go murder her ex husband's girlfriend?
I don't believe it for one second.
Paladine
07-27-2011, 07:41 PM
on jvm next
Paladine
07-27-2011, 07:41 PM
preview: shocking details on GF past...ugh.
BrownRice
07-27-2011, 07:43 PM
For those who believe DS is responsible.......
From previous reports, LE could not get a hold of her immediately following the accident. At some point, she was told and we assume she rushed to the hospital to be by her son's bedside. Some reports mention "holding vigil".
Do you honestly believe she would have left her dying son to go murder her ex husband's girlfriend?
I don't believe it for one second.
NO NO NO. NO don't believe it for a second either. Nor do I believe either of them (JS/DS) had the ability (or wherewithal) when MS was in the hospital DYING to contract a killer. Absurd.
jstwondering
07-27-2011, 07:44 PM
Thanks Paladine, I really enjoy reading all your comments on this case.
As for Georgetown, it's the most pretigious school in the Washington DC area. It's the Who's Who of politics, law, medical school, etc. Georgetown graduates have a particular bond and it can last throughout their lives. They will help one another out, etc. I've seen it personally. So to say he has connections, is an understatement! If he was smart, which I think he would consider himself, he would have already made phone calls.
BBM Wow, thanks to you and Paladine. I read way back several threads about his connections politically, but I'm just putting the implications of that together. So he's politically connected via Georgetown, has jobs connecting himself into the Big Pharma industry, does favors for and receives favors from both Big Government and Big Pharma, becomes a gazillionaire, and now donates money all over the place... And yet, I still wouldn't wish this on my worst enemy.
Paladine
07-27-2011, 07:45 PM
For those who believe DS is responsible.......
From previous reports, LE could not get a hold of her immediately following the accident. At some point, she was told and we assume she rushed to the hospital to be by her son's bedside. Some reports mention "holding vigil".
Do you honestly believe she would have left her dying son to go murder her ex husband's girlfriend?
I don't believe it for one second.
She had been at the hospital since Monday evening-ish, lets say...
Rebecca died Tuesday night, Wednesday morning...they lived near each other...I can see it. Especially if she knew there was likely no recovery for her son...
Where exactly is the spotlight on Jonah Shacknai? Check Shacknai's Forbes CEO bio. He is one of the principal designers of BigPharma' s rise to a $400 billion dollar industry, starting as a chief congressional aide in 1977-- (at the age of 20, if the bio is to be believed). He helped to design Bayh-Dole legislation, then was patent attorney for 30 major multinational pharmaceutical companies. Then followed his personal love, the sicko Nip/Tuck scene (evidence of multiple cosmetic surgeries right on his face). Current critiques of Big Pharma as a rogue industry might point to him. He knows where many of the bodies are buried and would be a crucial player if BigPharma execs were to be examined by Congress like the tobacco industry was. The bizarre nature of the girlfriend 's death has the earmarks of a warning killing. So does the clean nature of the crime scene. Amateur murderers leave lots of clues -- pros clean up. There's plenty of evidence of cover-up. Donating the child's organs in such a case. Really? The terse death certificates, whisking away of witnesses, etc.
Just a hunch.
Insightful post, thank you so much. BigPharma probably has a lot of skeletons in their closet.
Paladine
07-27-2011, 07:48 PM
JVM reporter says, source said: leaning to suicide??? Detectives learning about what the last 48 hours was like ( yet, her sister never spoke to police????) Reporter stresses she was a fitness buff...hence, hey, she could do this houdini act??? Man, this smells bad!
From the article posted upthread and linked below:
Rebecca Nalepa (photos below) aka Rebecca Zahau was found with her arms still bound behind her back in one knot, and her feet bound with another knot. She was not hanging in a noose when she was found, even thought that is how Adam Shacknai (photo below) reportedly found her.
Have we seen mention of this before?
Rebecca Nalepa’s Knots May Solve Case (http://news.lalate.com/2011/07/25/rebecca-nalepas-knots-may-solve-case/)
I haven't seen that on here ... but many of us started to wonder if she was hanging by her neck. So, maybe she was not hanging by her neck, not a noose but she was hogtied as one of the mods first brought up. UGH
Paladine
07-27-2011, 07:52 PM
The family should have asked for their own autopsy...
IMO
katydid23
07-27-2011, 07:53 PM
She had been at the hospital since Monday evening-ish, lets say...
Rebecca died Tuesday night, Wednesday morning...they lived near each other...I can see it. Especially if she knew there was likely no recovery for her son...
I don't think she could have gotten away with it. I am sure the cops were all over the hospital surveillance tapes and her cell ping movements and her cell records and witness testimony of her whereabouts. No way she could have slipped out of the hospital and gone to Spreckel Mansion without it being noticed.
Gossip? Yes, but repeated by 3 different posters...
http://www.cafepharma.com/boards/showthread.php?t=470815&page=2
Very interesting and so is this:
ALICE: I actually met him at the [Coronado city] council meeting. Because...when he came to Coronado, he wanted the Mills Act [which provides tax relief for historic homes, but also restricts what alterations you can make]. Then after he got the Mills Act, he wanted to change that whole wing on the house. And they denied him. He’s one of those...he’s got the greed syndrome. Not trustworthy. That’s what I thought at the meeting. Manipulative. This is a man who gets what he wants.
KELLY: He’s so powerful, everybody around him are yes-man people. And [if] his girlfriend let his little boy die on her watch, well, you know what?
ALICE: And all that injections and stuff, it’s got to poison your head. All that Restylane and the Botox.
He injected himself?
ALICE: Well, that’s what business he’s in.
I wouldn't doubt some of that stuff affects a person
Bonepile
07-27-2011, 08:10 PM
I wonder if the police seized Rebecca's cell phone, and computer, and iPad if she had any of these things? I also wonder if they searched her room or her personal belongings in the house if she had that too??
Paladine
07-27-2011, 08:12 PM
JS mom was "educator and therapist"...
http://www.nytimes.com/1999/05/25/classified/paid-notice-deaths-shacknai-selma.html
Wendy101
07-27-2011, 08:13 PM
Thank you for your kind words and the information. I'm in Timbuktou, Canada, so my knowledge of prestigious US school is wanting...;)
This just solidifies my belief SOMEONE needs to make noise. Time for someone to stand up, lose thier fear, and do the right thing: contact reputable media and do not get paid for it, imo. If this is a battle for coverup, there's no other choice, imo. If it were me...I'd pray I'd have the courage....because I could not live with the guilt.
BBM: :floorlaugh: .. I think I am your neighbour!:crazy:
Paladine
07-27-2011, 08:14 PM
I don't think she could have gotten away with it. I am sure the cops were all over the hospital surveillance tapes and her cell ping movements and her cell records and witness testimony of her whereabouts. No way she could have slipped out of the hospital and gone to Spreckel Mansion without it being noticed.
Last thing I heard, they were checking the the hospital tapes out...so, maybe the police aren't 100% sure, either, that they stayed at the hospital 24/7 for 2 days...
Paladine
07-27-2011, 08:15 PM
BBM: :floorlaugh: .. I think I am your neighbour!:crazy:
Lol...eh? ;)
jstwondering
07-27-2011, 08:22 PM
After watching the JVM segment today, and trying to find any new info, I am more convinced that the spin is in full effect. Haven't read the Newsweek article, but am pretty convinced that it's being written due to the urging of the PR firm.
In my humble opinion, I don't think JS murdered his girlfriend, I also think that MS's death was a complete accident, but there is obvious spin going on. No information is being let out, and they (JS, his company, and all the people in very high places) just want this to go away.
And if I hear another person explain what good shape the victim was in, so it is completely logical that she hung herself in this manner, I am going to barf. Just because someone CAN undress themself, bind themself, and hang themself, doesn't mean he/she DID undress themself, bind themself, and hang themself.
jjenny
07-27-2011, 08:59 PM
JVM reporter says, source said: leaning to suicide??? Detectives learning about what the last 48 hours was like ( yet, her sister never spoke to police????) Reporter stresses she was a fitness buff...hence, hey, she could do this houdini act??? Man, this smells bad!
Agreed. Why didn't detectives question the sister? We all know sister declared publicly she doesn't believe RN was suicidal and that the two of them were communicating shortly before RN was found dead. I don't like this one bit.
Rhyme & Reason
07-27-2011, 09:10 PM
After watching the JVM segment today, and trying to find any new info, I am more convinced that the spin is in full effect. Haven't read the Newsweek article, but am pretty convinced that it's being written due to the urging of the PR firm.
In my humble opinion, I don't think JS murdered his girlfriend, I also think that MS's death was a complete accident, but there is obvious spin going on. No information is being let out, and they (JS, his company, and all the people in very high places) just want this to go away.
And if I hear another person explain what good shape the victim was in, so it is completely logical that she hung herself in this manner, I am going to barf. Just because someone CAN undress themself, bind themself, and hang themself, doesn't mean he/she DID undress themself, bind themself, and hang themself.
I've been of the belief from day one, that no matter what, this (Rebecca's) death will be classified a suicide.
ETA: I believe MS death was an accident and will be ruled as such.
defense101
07-27-2011, 09:22 PM
After watching the JVM segment today, and trying to find any new info, I am more convinced that the spin is in full effect. Haven't read the Newsweek article, but am pretty convinced that it's being written due to the urging of the PR firm.
In my humble opinion, I don't think JS murdered his girlfriend, I also think that MS's death was a complete accident, but there is obvious spin going on. No information is being let out, and they (JS, his company, and all the people in very high places) just want this to go away.
And if I hear another person explain what good shape the victim was in, so it is completely logical that she hung herself in this manner, I am going to barf. Just because someone CAN undress themself, bind themself, and hang themself, doesn't mean he/she DID undress themself, bind themself, and hang themself. I watched that too, I was trying to find out who this guy was... anyone know what his name is? I checked for transcripts on JVM site but they aren't up yet.
gngr~snap
07-27-2011, 09:25 PM
JVM reporter says, source said: leaning to suicide??? Detectives learning about what the last 48 hours was like ( yet, her sister never spoke to police????) Reporter stresses she was a fitness buff...hence, hey, she could do this houdini act??? Man, this smells bad!
In the interim, he says, detectives are trying to “find out as much as we can about Rebecca and what was going on in her life at the time.”
Oddly, Zahau’s sister says that if that's true, they haven't asked her. “We aren’t in the loop with new developments,” says Mary Zahau-Loehner. “We haven’t had any official phone call telling us of our sister’s death.
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2011/07/27/jonah-shacknai-mansion-deaths-rebecca-zahau-incident-remains-mysterious.html (http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2011/07/27/jonah-shacknai-mansion-deaths-rebecca-zahau-incident-remains-mysterious.html)
In Arizona police reports obtained this week by ABC News Shacknai’s ex-wife Dina Shacknai said she was “scared of what he is capable of doing to me physically … and the lengths he would go to try to ‘destroy’ me.”
According to news reports Adam ‘cut down’ Rebecca’s body and called 911. The police arrived to find Rebecca’s nude body, ‘face down’, electrical cords used to bind her hands behind her back and her feet
According to a report from local CBS 8 affiliate, neighbors reported a ‘police disturbance’ at Dina Shacknai’s home on the day of Max’s accident. Missing from the report, when the ‘disturbance’ occurred? *** was this when police were trying to locate her? her car was home-they ran her tags... where was she?
She called about 4:40 pm,” he said. “She told me about the accident and said that her daughter was also injured
"It appears to be some type of a violent death, and I'm not going to compromise the integrity of the investigation by giving anything more than that at this time," San Diego County Sheriff's Dept. Capt. Tim Curran said
http://www.cbs8.com/story/15075598/questions-remain-after-deaths-of-coronado-mansion-owners-son-girlfriend?redirected=true
Investigators initially described the death as “violent” and “bizarre,” and forensics evidence is being processed (http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/Forensics-Key-in-Solving-Mansion-Mystery-125764328.html) before determining whether the death was criminal or a suicide.
*** ever hear of a violent/bizarre suicide?
notice they say "criminal here not homocide
Dina also submitted a two-page letter, describing Jonah as temperamental. She said the incident began over a disagreement with their child’s soiled bedding and that Jonah cursed at her in front of their child.*** sound familiar?
Source: Details Shed on Shacknai's Second Divorce | NBC San Diego (http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/125848813.html#ixzz1TMNSirZb)
“Importantly,” Shacknai wrote, "Dina has been treated medically for years for a bruising disorder, whereby the slightest contact with an object or other material causes bruises.
Shacknai,... , Dina physically assaulted him several times, once causing him a broken finger.
*** why is it that the only young women who "bruise easy" are the one beaten by their loving husbands?
oh and HE was the one being abused! THAT'S where the bruises came from!
guess that rules her out! DS would have been black and blue had she hurt anyone!
Paladine
07-27-2011, 09:39 PM
In the interim, he says, detectives are trying to “find out as much as we can about Rebecca and what was going on in her life at the time.”
Oddly, Zahau’s sister says that if that's true, they haven't asked her. “We aren’t in the loop with new developments,” says Mary Zahau-Loehner. “We haven’t had any official phone call telling us of our sister’s death.
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2011/07/27/jonah-shacknai-mansion-deaths-rebecca-zahau-incident-remains-mysterious.html
Could it get any more disrespectful??
Pegatha
07-27-2011, 09:40 PM
I don't believe it was suicide. Not sure what I think the whole story is, but suicide seems off to me based on what we know.
But, I have to put in my two cents regarding the dog phone call. When we rushed my daughter to the emergency room, and ended up being admitted to the hospital, one of the first things I did was call a friend to go get my dog and take her to the vet to be boarded. Even though my youngest daughter was still at the house with a relative, I did not want to have to worry about who was taking care of the dog. We didn't know how long we would be at the hospital and neither me or my husband wanted to leave to take care of our dog who we love like a member of our family.
So there are a lot of things about this story that bother me, but trying to get the dog to a daycare to be taken care of is one of the few things that actually makes sense to me.
Bonepile
07-27-2011, 09:43 PM
I think the authorities have made their minds up .. they are waiting for the "test results" to cement it in place.
scorekeeper
07-27-2011, 09:50 PM
I haven't seen that on here ... but many of us started to wonder if she was hanging by her neck. So, maybe she was not hanging by her neck, not a noose but she was hogtied as one of the mods first brought up. UGH
BBM
If she was hogtied, she couldn't have done that herself. Could she, eh? (for all my friends up north, LOL)
scorekeeper
07-27-2011, 09:53 PM
Could it get anymore disrespectful??
Yep, it started out disrepectful.......by not erecting a tent over her body and letting the young boys sit on the roof and gawk at her.......
Unbelieveable......totally :sick: :maddening:
sdcali
07-27-2011, 10:00 PM
For those who believe DS is responsible.......
From previous reports, LE could not get a hold of her immediately following the accident. At some point, she was told and we assume she rushed to the hospital to be by her son's bedside. Some reports mention "holding vigil".
Do you honestly believe she would have left her dying son to go murder her ex husband's girlfriend?
I don't believe it for one second.
If she were capable of doing this, I am pretty certain that the drs told them early on that their son was gone--well before it leaked to the public.
IMO,yes, she could have, if she believed that her son was gone. Having to watch him lie there, breathing by artificial means but not alive.
That is why LE was getting the videos from the hospital. To observe who left, when...when did they come back, what were they wearing? etc. Were they wearing something different?
If this is the scenario, I bet it was done out of rage--maybe she went home to shower, change clothes, sleep and being that they lived so near, she detoured and paid a visit to RN. Maybe it was not premeditated as a murder. It began as a confrontation, an emotional event and escalated and RN was killed. The hanging may have been a cover-up to what actually occurred. AS may have even been in on the cover up part of it.
Just me, theorizing....
gngr~snap
07-27-2011, 10:06 PM
If she were capable of doing this, I am pretty certain that the drs told them early on that their son was gone--well before it leaked to the public.
IMO,yes, she could have, if she believed that her son was gone. Having to watch him lie there, breathing by artificial means but not alive.
That is why LE was getting the videos from the hospital. To observe who left, when...when did they come back, what were they wearing? etc. Were they wearing something different?
If this is the scenario, I bet it was done out of rage--maybe she went home to shower, change clothes, sleep and being that they lived so near, she detoured and paid a visit to RN. Maybe it was not premeditated as a murder. It began as a confrontation, an emotional event and escalated and RN was killed. The hanging may have been a cover-up to what actually occurred. AS may have even been in on the cover up part of it.
Just me, theorizing....
Doesn't sound to me like RN did anything wrong. JS was the one that had a temper.
How old was MS, 6?
Dina also submitted a two-page letter, describing Jonah as temperamental. She said the incident began over a disagreement with their child’s soiled bedding and that Jonah cursed at her in front of their child.*** sound familiar?
Source: Details Shed on Shacknai's Second Divorce | NBC San Diego (http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/125848813.html#ixzz1TMNSirZb)
scorekeeper
07-27-2011, 10:09 PM
Over the last four years, Shacknai met with the city's Historic Resources Commission five times to discuss changes he wanted at the mansion.
They included replacing the original windows with French doors, and adding a master bedroom and a hydraulic roof. His request for the doors was granted eight months ago.
He came back again in May seeking changes to the guest house, caretakers quarters and the garage. Those were approved as well.
http://coronado.patch.com/articles/shacknai-renovation-plans-drew-opponents-in-coronado-not-enemies
hmmmmm
Lovejac
07-27-2011, 10:12 PM
Completely random, but every time I see the pic of RN/JS with the purple background it reminds me of a (very bad) prom picture. And they are wearing coordinating colors. Belch. I assume an office party or something. It looks like he has used too many injections of his drugs as well.
Another point - someone earlier mentioned bruises (rumors of) on MS. I'd be suspicious of a 6 year old boy who didn't have any bruises! Those come with play and having fun. Obviously, abuse is different, but most kids have bruises.
Amen about the bruises!
If someone took a look and my 5 yo twin boys, they would probably call DSS
Lawgirl
07-27-2011, 10:13 PM
I need to vent. LOL
OMG there has been so much speculation and theorizing that I am literally dizzy. I can't believe how interested I have become in this case -- and LE is not helping but not saying a word. I will say this: I do not believe this woman killed herself in this manner, and if LE comes back and says it was suicide then I will continue to NOT believe it. Had she done this - in the manner it is proposed - one would have to assume she had utter disdain and hate for herself. Naked, hands and feet bound -- it is utterly disgusting and vile. In my heart and soul, I do not believe she did this. I find it dishonorable to her to even consider this. For one, she was so classy, and cared so much for how she looked. Did she EVER take a bad photo? She looks like an angel in every photo I have seen.
I do not believe she became violent with herself, and killed herself in the most despicable manner, in the most inhumane manner.
What more can I say if the evidence is not clearly presented. I understand that is LE wants to do their job effectively in light of high profile nature of this case, and that they want to solidify their case. I respect that, and anxiously await the results.
A young, vibrant and beautiful woman is dead and someone needs to render an explanation and give her some honor. Let's hope for the best.
I've said it before and I'll say it again -- this is one sad case. Rest in peace Rebecca...Rest in peace baby Max...words could not describe what a beautiful child you were/are... precious.
Lovejac
07-27-2011, 10:15 PM
In this article,
http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/Rebecca-Zahaus-Family--126121118.html
Rebecca's sister said:
"Rebecca was very intelligent and achieved anything she set her mind on."
I'm not accusing the victim of anything, but as a jilted wife myself, I felt that the woman that my husband left me for was out to take my life. The first time I met her, before I knew that she was sleeping with my husband, she actually asked me to give her a tour of my house and borrowed my bikini to go in my jacuzzi with my 6 year old daughter. (I may add that no one else at the party went in the pool...) This also was "a very intelligent woman who achieved anything she set her mind on."
Where as I now tolerate this woman for my children's sake, I can totally see a less stable, jilted wife feeling she has motive to make RZ pay for taking her only child from her. Also, remember, RZ called Max her son according to the doggie daycare guy, and was preparing to throw a party in DS's former house.
I'm not saying this is OK, I'm just saying, it adds up to one believable motive.
Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned.
scorekeeper
07-27-2011, 10:16 PM
OMG there has been so much speculation and theorizing that I am literally dizzy. I can't believe how interested I have become in this case -- and LE is not helping but not saying a word. I will say this: I do not believe this woman killed herself in this manner, and if LE comes back and says it was suicide then I will continue to NOT believe it. Had she done this - in the manner it is proposed - one would have to assume she had utter disdain and hate for herself. Naked, hands and feet bound -- it is utterly disgusting and vile. In my heart and soul, I simply do not believe she did this. I find it dishonorable to her to even consider this.
Totally, totally agree, Lawgirl.
Well said!!
jjenny
07-27-2011, 10:16 PM
Add to this it was before the child was even declared dead. If she felt so guilty over the child's demise, why not wait at least until she knew there was no hope whatsoever? Wasn't the child scheduled for an MRI for an Wednesday morning?
Seems to be a bit premature to kill herself over it.
Of course it is so much easier to declare it a suicide-then police doesn't have to look for anyone.
:twocents:
jstwondering
07-27-2011, 10:17 PM
If she were capable of doing this, I am pretty certain that the drs told them early on that their son was gone--well before it leaked to the public.
IMO,yes, she could have, if she believed that her son was gone. Having to watch him lie there, breathing by artificial means but not alive.
That is why LE was getting the videos from the hospital. To observe who left, when...when did they come back, what were they wearing? etc. Were they wearing something different?
If this is the scenario, I bet it was done out of rage--maybe she went home to shower, change clothes, sleep and being that they lived so near, she detoured and paid a visit to RN. Maybe it was not premeditated as a murder. It began as a confrontation, an emotional event and escalated and RN was killed. The hanging may have been a cover-up to what actually occurred. AS may have even been in on the cover up part of it.
Just me, theorizing....
BBM I agree totally. Here's a portion of what wikipedia says about rage:
"A person in a state of rage may also lose much of his or her capacity for rational thought and reasoning, and may act, usually violently, on his or her impulses to the point that they may attack until they themselves have been incapacitated or the source of their rage has been destroyed."
Rage (emotion) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia@@AMEPARAM@@/wiki/File:47-aspetti_di_vita_quotidiana,ira,Taccuino_Sanitatis, _Casana.jpg" class="image"><img alt="" src="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/3c/47-aspetti_di_vita_quotidiana%2Cira%2CTaccuino_Sanita tis%2C_Casana.jpg/220px-47-aspetti_di_vita_quotidiana%2Cira%2CTaccuino_Sanita tis%2C_Casana.jpg"@@AMEPARAM@@commons/thumb/3/3c/47-aspetti_di_vita_quotidiana%2Cira%2CTaccuino_Sanita tis%2C_Casana.jpg/220px-47-aspetti_di_vita_quotidiana%2Cira%2CTaccuino_Sanita tis%2C_Casana.jpg
x_files
07-27-2011, 10:21 PM
Doesn't sound to me like RN did anything wrong. JS was the one that had a temper.
How old was MS, 6?
Dina also submitted a two-page letter, describing Jonah as temperamental. She said the incident began over a disagreement with their child’s soiled bedding and that Jonah cursed at her in front of their child.*** sound familiar?
Source: Details Shed on Shacknai's Second Divorce | NBC San Diego (http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/125848813.html#ixzz1TMNSirZb)
Maybe JS is an "eraser." Erasing things he finds an obstacle in his life? Or was filled with rage and threw his son down a flight of stairs and was worried she'd spill the truth?
Lawgirl
07-27-2011, 10:23 PM
Amen about the bruises!
If someone took a look and my 5 yo twin boys, they would probably call DSS
I have a young child who just started to walk, and so far in one week she got three bruises. Would I do anything to avoid that -- absolutely. She is the air that I breathe. Is it possible? Sadly no...I can't as much as I would want to. Children will hurt themselves - they have young immature minds and they don't think before they act.
x_files
07-27-2011, 10:23 PM
Add to this it was before the child was even declared dead. If she felt so guilty over the child's demise, why not wait at least until she knew there was no hope whatsoever? Wasn't the child scheduled for an MRI for an Wednesday morning?
Seems to be a bit premature to kill herself over it.
Of course it is so much easier to declare it a suicide-then police doesn't have to look for anyone.
:twocents:
I agree. Why not hold out for hope?
I do not buy it. I think she was murdered and the son was abused/killed in a fit of abuse/rage by the father.
A tiger doesn't change it's stripes. He has a violent past with both ex-wives.
Did he ever get treatment for his anger/rage issues?
Lawgirl
07-27-2011, 10:28 PM
BBM I agree totally. Here's a portion of what wikipedia says about rage:
"A person in a state of rage may also lose much of his or her capacity for rational thought and reasoning, and may act, usually violently, on his or her impulses to the point that they may attack until they themselves have been incapacitated or the source of their rage has been destroyed."
Rage (emotion) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rage_%28emotion%29)
I believe this! Ever had rage on the road because someone p*ssed you off so badly and been surprised just how angry you got at a total stranger? I have. The rational person stops and thinks Okay this is not worth it at all. Let me let it go - this is a total stranger who is a moron. Now...what about the person who had no reason to hold them back because everything they hold dear is now gone...there is no "this is not worth it" ...all there is left is my life no longer has any meaning because "you" took it all away. There is potential for unadulterated rage imo.
Lawgirl
07-27-2011, 10:31 PM
I agree. Why not hold out for hope?
I do not buy it. I think she was murdered and the son was abused/killed in a fit of abuse/rage by the father.
A tiger doesn't change it's stripes. He has a violent past with both ex-wives.
Did he ever get treatment for his anger/rage issues?
Hi xfiles, I completely do not feel that way about JS. I think he loved his son more than anything or even anyone in the world. I feel that his son meant the world to him. He appears like he is a real go getter in the business world -- also appears to me to be a womanizer -- his money enables him -- but as far as his child I don't think he abused him. I do not feel he ever would hurt Maxie or any of this children. This is my feeling from the limited information I've read, but I think I've read just as much as anyone... I've been so engrossed.
arielilane
07-27-2011, 10:37 PM
I need to vent. LOL
OMG there has been so much speculation and theorizing that I am literally dizzy. I can't believe how interested I have become in this case -- and LE is not helping but not saying a word. I will say this: I do not believe this woman killed herself in this manner, and if LE comes back and says it was suicide then I will continue to NOT believe it. Had she done this - in the manner it is proposed - one would have to assume she had utter disdain and hate for herself. Naked, hands and feet bound -- it is utterly disgusting and vile. In my heart and soul, I do not believe she did this. I find it dishonorable to her to even consider this. For one, she was so classy, and cared so much for how she looked. Did she EVER take a bad photo? She looks like an angel in every photo I have seen.
I do not believe she became violent with herself, and killed herself in the most despicable manner, in the most inhumane manner.
What more can I say if the evidence is not clearly presented. I understand that is LE wants to do their job effectively in light of high profile nature of this case, and that they want to solidify their case. I respect that, and anxiously await the results.
A young, vibrant and beautiful woman is dead and someone needs to render an explanation and give her some honor. Let's hope for the best.
I've said it before and I'll say it again -- this is one sad case. Rest in peace Rebecca... Well stated.
In life she cherished yourself and she would not have done that to herself in death no matter how horrible the situation.
jjenny
07-27-2011, 10:38 PM
Hi xfiles, I completely do not feel that way about JS. I think he loved his son more than anything or even anyone in the world. I feel that his son meant the world to him. He appears like he is a real go getter in the business world -- also appears to me to be a womanizer -- his money enables him -- but as far as his child I don't think he abused him. I do not feel he ever would hurt Maxie or any of this children. This is my feeling from the limited information I've read, but I think I've read just as much as anyone... I've been so engrossed.
I do agree-even his ex-wives seem to agree that whatever his behavior was as a husband, he was a devoted father. Which makes me curious as to how he would feel toward a g/f that was watching the child when the child had an accident.
x_files
07-27-2011, 10:44 PM
I think the authorities have made their minds up .. they are waiting for the "test results" to cement it in place.
I think JS has a lot of pull and power far more than the LE there. There will be a PR cover-up.
Lawgirl
07-27-2011, 10:44 PM
I do agree-even his ex-wives seem to agree that whatever his behavior was as a husband, he was a devoted father. Which makes me curious as to how he would feel toward a g/f that was watching the child when the child had an accident.
Well here we don't know the dynamics of the relationship between RN and the children. Did they hate her, but she tried to be nice all the time for JS's sake? Was there reason for him to believe she would bring harm to the child, or that she would be so negligent as to not care for him properly - watch him - and held her responsible. I always got the impression he was lose with his words -- if there was any abuse it was verbal. I don't read anything about physical abuse towards the women. Dina, well I can understand the drama that went on there. She blamed the dog for scratches, not Jonah. She felt he was going to leave her, was cheating on her and he probably told her some very nasty things...making any woman crazy. The fact that he told his first wife on their honey moon "this is a mistake" tells me he's egocentric - loose with his words - and maybe does not hold women in such high regard. His children - that's a whole other ball game -- his children mean the world to him. This is how i would profile him somewhat...
sdcali
07-27-2011, 10:45 PM
I started thinking about ES....nothing has been mentioned about him in all of this. Was he visiting in Coronado with his sister, GS at the mansion with their father when all of this occurred?
I found this photo and was intrigued. JS stares (almost sneering) at the camera. Everyone else seems engaged in the jovial celebration (ES Bar Mitzvah) except JS. He appears detached. Is it just me?
All of the kids are there. ES, GS, MS As well as Kim James and RN.
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10150141158806622.284813.120443706621#!/photo.php?fbid=10150141158871622&set=a.10150141158806622.284813.120443706621&type=1&theater
gngr~snap
07-27-2011, 10:46 PM
Maybe JS is an "eraser." Erasing things he finds an obstacle in his life? Or was filled with rage and threw his son down a flight of stairs and was worried she'd spill the truth?
Eliminate the witness before she talks. Arrange it asap.
While he is in the ICU with his dying son. ALIBI!!!
I'm not sure she would blame RN at all. She knew he was a threat
she was worried what he might do to destroy her. If she was a child psych... she knew what kids are capable off.
Ms Shacknai, a child psychologist
she said: 'Jonah is the CEO of a large pharmaceutical corporation. He is very clever and very powerful. ..'I feel scared of what he is capable of doing to me physically via the dog as well as the lengths he would try to go to "destroy" me in any way he was able to do so
He wrote: 'I have been assaulted physically several times by my wife, Dina Shacknai... I was treated for a broken finger as a consequence of one such assault.'
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2016550/Rebecca-Nalepas-lover-Jonah-Shacknai-violent-marriage-ex-wife-Dina.html#ixzz1TMcRTkUZ
who knows:waitasec:
jjenny
07-27-2011, 10:47 PM
Well here we don't know the dynamics of the relationship between RN and the children. Did they hate her, but she tried to be nice all the time for JS's sake? Was there reason for him to believe she would bring harm to the child, or that she would be so negligent as to not care for him properly - watch him - and held her responsible. I always got the impression he was lose with his words -- if there was any abuse it was verbal. I don't read anything about physical abuse towards the women. Dina, well I can understand the drama that went on there. She blamed the dog for scratches, not Jonah. She felt he was going to leave her, was cheating on her and he probably told her some very nasty things...making any woman crazy. The fact that he told his first wife on their honey moon "this is a mistake" tells me he's egocentric - loose with his words - and maybe does not hold women in such high regard. His children - that's a whole other ball game -- his children mean the world to him. This is how i would profile him somewhat...
I don't see any way RN would be abusive to the children. Because obviously if she did anything the first thing the child would do is to run to the father and complain. If she wanted to marry him, I bet she would try to be super nice to the kids.
Lawgirl
07-27-2011, 10:47 PM
For the record, DS has a history of rage.
I will let the link speak of the rage:
http://abcnews.go.com/US/coronado-mansion-mystery-15-detectives-zahaus-personal-trainer/story?id=14124073
Shacknai said his wife came at him and tried to choke him, according to the documents.
I believe it. I can see a woman attack her husband if it is really late at night - he reads a story to the baby - and then says "i'm going out now"...(probably going to see the mistress). I can see a woman going crazy and wanting to get physical with the husband.
Me? I would have said "don't let the door hit you in the back but listen buddy when you get back let's talk divorce -- so make time for me." :rocker:
x_files
07-27-2011, 10:47 PM
Hi xfiles, I completely do not feel that way about JS. I think he loved his son more than anything or even anyone in the world. I feel that his son meant the world to him. He appears like he is a real go getter in the business world -- also appears to me to be a womanizer -- his money enables him -- but as far as his child I don't think he abused him. I do not feel he ever would hurt Maxie or any of this children. This is my feeling from the limited information I've read, but I think I've read just as much as anyone... I've been so engrossed.
Maybe killed her in a fit of rage over neglecting (in his mind) his son?
Lawgirl
07-27-2011, 10:52 PM
I don't see any way RN would be abusive to the children. Because obviously if she did anything the first thing the child would do is to run to the father and complain. If she wanted to marry him, I bet she would try to be super nice to the kids.
Yes, I thing she was nice to them but were they nice to her? Every child has a hope that mommy and daddy will get back together...at least some do I think. Not suggesting either say because we don't know...
arielilane
07-27-2011, 10:54 PM
I believe it. I can see a woman attack her husband if it is really late at night - he reads a story to the baby - and then says "i'm going out now"...(probably going to see the mistress). I can see a woman going crazy and wanting to get physical with the husband.
Me? I would have said "don't let the door hit you in the back but listen buddy when you get back let's talk divorce -- so make time for me." :rocker:
LOL Rumor has it- the marriage didn't get off to a good start. He doesn't sound like marriage material.
Lawgirl
07-27-2011, 10:55 PM
I started thinking about ES....nothing has been mentioned about him in all of this. Was he visiting in Coronado with his sister, GS at the mansion with their father when all of this occurred?
I found this photo and was intrigued. JS stares (almost sneering) at the camera. Everyone else seems engaged in the jovial celebration (ES Bar Mitzvah) except JS. He appears detached. Is it just me?
All of the kids are there. ES, GS, MS As well as Kim James and RN.
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10150141158806622.284813.120443706621#!/photo.php?fbid=10150141158871622&set=a.10150141158806622.284813.120443706621&type=1&theater
Awww look at Max how cute and adorable...and the sister is soo pretty too! Rebecca was stunningly beautiful.
Lawgirl
07-27-2011, 10:56 PM
LOL Rumor has it- the marriage didn't get off to a good start. He doesn't sound like marriage material.
Very into himself naturally... lol
Lawgirl
07-27-2011, 10:57 PM
I am not going to unvelcro myself from this pc...ughf.
Good night all. Good sleuthing...keep up the good work. :rocker:
katydid23
07-27-2011, 11:00 PM
I need to vent. LOL
OMG there has been so much speculation and theorizing that I am literally dizzy. I can't believe how interested I have become in this case -- and LE is not helping but not saying a word. I will say this: I do not believe this woman killed herself in this manner, and if LE comes back and says it was suicide then I will continue to NOT believe it. Had she done this - in the manner it is proposed - one would have to assume she had utter disdain and hate for herself. Naked, hands and feet bound -- it is utterly disgusting and vile. In my heart and soul, I do not believe she did this. I find it dishonorable to her to even consider this. For one, she was so classy, and cared so much for how she looked. Did she EVER take a bad photo? She looks like an angel in every photo I have seen.
I do not believe she became violent with herself, and killed herself in the most despicable manner, in the most inhumane manner.
What more can I say if the evidence is not clearly presented. I understand that is LE wants to do their job effectively in light of high profile nature of this case, and that they want to solidify their case. I respect that, and anxiously await the results.
A young, vibrant and beautiful woman is dead and someone needs to render an explanation and give her some honor. Let's hope for the best.
I've said it before and I'll say it again -- this is one sad case. Rest in peace Rebecca...Rest in peace baby Max...words could not describe what a beautiful child you were/are... precious.
I agree with you. This particular type of suicide seems so out of kilter for this particular woman. I can see her wanting to possibly kill herself in this tragic situation. If she somehow felt responsible for this horrible tragedy, and if her life was crashing down around her, I can be convinced she might decide to kill herself. But not in this horribly ugly way, imo. I could even be convinced she might hang herself. But not naked, outside in the yard, using power chords. No Way, imo.
If she was in the bedroom wearing a nightgown or lingerie, after writing a note explaining her sense of guilt or her apologies, then I could buy the suicide. But this one does not feel right at all to me.
The weird thing is that it does not seem like either of Max's parents would have done this either, imo. Not so quickly. Max was still in the hospital. It is hard for me to believe they would use precious time that he was still 'alive' to commit a revenge murder. Why the big hurry?:
Sadly, one of the only things that does kind of make a little sense is the possibility that RN was angry that JS was possibly blaming her. She may have seen that coming, and set up and staged her suicide in a way to make it look like a murder as her final revenge . But only someone who truly knew her would know if that was possible.
x_files
07-27-2011, 11:22 PM
I agree with you. This particular type of suicide seems so out of kilter for this particular woman. I can see her wanting to possibly kill herself in this tragic situation. If she somehow felt responsible for this horrible tragedy, and if her life was crashing down around her, I can be convinced she might decide to kill herself. But not in this horribly ugly way, imo. I could even be convinced she might hang herself. But not naked, outside in the yard, using power chords. No Way, imo.
If she was in the bedroom wearing a nightgown or lingerie, after writing a note explaining her sense of guilt or her apologies, then I could buy the suicide. But this one does not feel right at all to me.
The weird thing is that it does not seem like either of Max's parents would have done this either, imo. Not so quickly. Max was still in the hospital. It is hard for me to believe they would use precious time that he was still 'alive' to commit a revenge murder. Why the big hurry?:
Sadly, one of the only things that does kind of make a little sense is the possibility that RN was angry that JS was possibly blaming her. She may have seen that coming, and set up and staged her suicide in a way to make it look like a murder as her final revenge . But only someone who truly knew her would know if that was possible.
Does JS believe she was suicidal? What did he say? I think he'd be the first to wonder what the heck happened to her? Wouldn't you?
It's very bizarre if he wasn't at least suspicious.
pferrin
07-27-2011, 11:28 PM
I just cant see where RN would get that angry at JS..nope. She was at the hospital monday, tuesday and was planning on going wednesday. .nope not suicide. If a woman gets that mad..she tears up his clothes..runs up the credit card..bleaches his underwear..and all his clothes till the best jeans in the world are completely ruined (Please don't ask how I know all this stuff..I just do!!!) Angry woman does not think suicide..she thinks revenge.
CuriousAmazon
07-27-2011, 11:29 PM
I found this photo and was intrigued. JS stares (almost sneering) at the camera. Everyone else seems engaged in the jovial celebration (ES Bar Mitzvah) except JS. He appears detached. Is it just me?
All of the kids are there. ES, GS, MS As well as Kim James and RN.
Thanx. That sent me searching & finding Neil's facebook page. Nice looking guy. Also saw a page where GS is running for school president. Of course none of this offers me any information other than I saw Neil had some Zahau family as his friends on FB.
jstwondering
07-27-2011, 11:29 PM
I believe it. I can see a woman attack her husband if it is really late at night - he reads a story to the baby - and then says "i'm going out now"...(probably going to see the mistress). I can see a woman going crazy and wanting to get physical with the husband.
Me? I would have said "don't let the door hit you in the back but listen buddy when you get back let's talk divorce -- so make time for me." :rocker:
Lawgirl, I love your style. Stay that way.
jstwondering
07-27-2011, 11:39 PM
I just cant see where RN would get that angry at JS..nope. She was at the hospital monday, tuesday and was planning on going wednesday. .nope not suicide. If a woman gets that mad..she tears up his clothes..runs up the credit card..bleaches his underwear..and all his clothes till the best jeans in the world are completely ruined (Please don't ask how I know all this stuff..I just do!!!) Angry woman does not think suicide..she thinks revenge.
:floorlaugh: ... buys porsche in the Oakland Raiders colors, because he HATES the Raiders, and drives down to super bowl with his tickets that were delivered to the house he was kicked out of by mistake....
CuriousAmazon
07-27-2011, 11:40 PM
Doesn't sound to me like RN did anything wrong. JS was the one that had a temper.
How old was MS, 6?
Dina also submitted a two-page letter, describing Jonah as temperamental. She said the incident began over a disagreement with their child’s soiled bedding and that Jonah cursed at her in front of their child.*** sound familiar?
Source: Details Shed on Shacknai's Second Divorce | NBC San Diego (http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/125848813.html#ixzz1TMNSirZb)
Police reports detailing a bitter end to Jonah Shacknai and his second wife’s marriage were released late Monday, one day after their 6-year-old son died in a San Diego hospital while the recent death of Shacknai’s girlfriend remains under investigation.
The documents, which catalog two incidents, include 16 photographs of mainly scratches and bruises submitted by Dina Shacknai, allegedly purported by their dog, according to a Paradise Valley Police Department report.
On Sunday, Max Shacknai passed away from injuries sustained July 11 when he fell down stairs at his father’s Coronado mansion. Max was an organ donor, and his organs went to three different recipients, a source close to the family told NBCSanDiego Tuesday.
Last Wednesday, two days after the boy’s fall, Jonah Shacknai’s girlfriend, Rebecca Zahau, 32, was found dead, hanging from a second-story balcony at the same Spreckels Mansion in Coronado.
Investigators initially described the death as “violent” and “bizarre,” and forensics evidence is being processed before determining whether the death was criminal or a suicide.
On Sept. 13, 2008, Jonah Shacknai reported to police that Dina attempted to choke her and that his attack-trained female German Shepherd became excited and came between the two. He blamed his wife’s behavior on prescription medications and alcohol, according to a supplemental report.
Dina called the same night, reporting a dog attack. On the following day, she told police the dog had injured her before while Jonah “makes little to no effort to stop the dog,” according to a report.
Dina also submitted a two-page letter, describing Jonah as temperamental. She said the incident began over a disagreement with their child’s soiled bedding and that Jonah cursed at her in front of their child.
He “physically intimidated” her, she wrote, by “coming very close to (her), ‘nose to nose,’” and continuing to insult and threaten" her with name-calling in a “menacing tone.” She added that her attempts to keep an arm’s distance from Jonah during the incident resulted in her hand moving from his chest to his throat.
“Although Jonah feels entitled to name call, push etc, when I attempt to set boundaries via my personal space, he then assumes the role of victim,” Dina wrote.
The married couple was estranged by Jan. 4, 2009, when a second incident was reported to police. Dina alleged Jonah elbowed her in the right breast area.
Weeks later, in a formal letter to Chief John Bennett of the Paradise Valley Police Department dated Jan. 26, Jonah wrote Dina previously filed “false and misleading reports” about bruises on her body stemming from contact with their dog.
“Importantly,” Shacknai wrote, "Dina has been treated medically for years for a bruising disorder, whereby the slightest contact with an object or other material causes bruises. This information can certainly be verified medically.”
Shacknai, the prominent founder and CEO of Medicis, a pharmaceutical company based in Scottsdale, Ariz., wrote that although never feeling physically endangered, Dina physically assaulted him several times, once causing him a broken finger.
He wrote that Dina threw herself at his car on Jan. 4 while he was attempting to drive away from the home. She screamed that he had no right to leave her or the house, Jonah wrote.
“At this point, Dina also began attempting to slap me, again screaming, “You cannot leave me!” Jonah wrote. “I was able to gently nudge her from the car and withdraw from the premises without further incident.”
No charges were filed in either incidents.
On Monday, shortly before 9:30 p.m., Dina and Jonah Shacknai released a joint statement:
While our marriage did not work out as either of us had hoped, it did produce a wonderful son, Max, whom both of us loved very much. His loss is unimaginable. These police reports are not reflective of the totality or the precise details of the events during a difficult time in our marriage that we worked through together. The release of the records as we grieve Max’s recent loss pains us greatly, and we request that the privacy of our family be respected. The unfortunate attention to these records is a distraction from the most important concern of honoring our beautiful son, who lives on in both of our hearts.
Source: Details Shed on Shacknai's Second Divorce | NBC San Diego
Source: Details Shed on Shacknai's Second Divorce | NBC San Diego
pferrin
07-27-2011, 11:47 PM
:floorlaugh: ... buys porsche in the Oakland Raiders colors, because he HATES the Raiders, and drives down to super bowl with his tickets that were delivered to the house he was kicked out of by mistake....
Yep I'd be lovin that Superbowl myself. Hotwires his toilet...calls attorney and lets them handle him. Puts an ad in want-ads..describing his shortcomings. :great:
nursebeeme
07-27-2011, 11:49 PM
I think the authorities have made their minds up .. they are waiting for the "test results" to cement it in place.
this disturbs me on many levels... they are most likely waiting on tox screen results (complete results)
so what then?
if they are negative what then?
this whole situation is NOT NORMAL imhoo~:twocents:
((anyone recall the link I posted about the brother in thread one... where he told his land lord he was going out on his boat and ended up in California??? what is up with thaatt????? sorry do not have a link.. it is in thread one... and it is from my recollection))
CuriousAmazon
07-27-2011, 11:51 PM
http://news.lalate.com/2011/07/15/rebecca-nalepa-rebecca-zahau-adam-shacknai-reported-hanging/
LOS ANGELES (LALATE) – The death of Rebecca Nalepa (photos below), aka Rebecca Zahau, has prompted questions of a homicide or suicide. But Rebecca Zahau’s family says there were no indications of a possible suicide just hours before when they spoke to her. Moreover, new details released to news suggest that it was highly unlikely Rebecca Zahau died of a suicide. Police have yet to report that her death is a criminal investigation. Police, however, do confirm two critical new developments to news concerning ropes and reactions.
As of midday Friday, there is still no criminal investigation. The home’s owner, Jonah Shacknai, CEO of Medicis Pharmaceuticals Corporation, was reportedly not at home at the time of the his girlfriend’s death. His brother, Adam Shacknai, was at home at the time.
Adam Shacknai was the first person to report Rebecca Zahau dead. But the condition in which Rebecca Zahau was found by Adam was reportedly different than the condition in which police found here.
First, the ropes in question are highly suspect. New reports indicate that Rebecca Zahau’s hands were bound, behind her back. How was she able to bound her hands and still hang herself? That remains unclear. But also bound were her feet together. Investigators report that Rebecca Zahau’s hands and feet were never bound together.
Second, the reaction to her death is peculiar. Adam Shacknai tells investigators he found her hanging in a balcony. He reportedly claims he cut her down during the hanging. But when police (and TV aerial camera crews) were on scene, Zahau was face down, ten feet below, on the lawn, with her feet still bound.
Then there all the other peculiar twists to the story. Locals tell news claims there was loud party in the mansion Tuesday evening. Officials say no one reported the party. Zahau was found dead Wednesday morning.
Rebecca Nalepa changed her name back to her maiden name, Rebecca Zahau, in May of this year.
What do investigators think of this death? First they say it’s one of the most peculiar they have seen in recent memory. San Diego Sheriff’s Capt. Tim Curran calls the death “bizarre”.
Second, they would not confirm if a criminal investigation is pending. But they say the manner in which she is suspicious. Third, they confirm that suicide victims often kill themselves in “bizarre” and “unique” ways.
But there are two other clues. Mary Zahau-Loehner, sister to Rebecca, says she spoke to her sister before before her death. She said her sister was fine and normal. Moreover, other family members, even Rebecca’s ex-husband, Neil Nalepa, said they spoke to her this week and said that she was completely content and carefree.
Adam reported her death with a 6:48 am 911 call Wednesday morning. When police responded to the Spreckels Mansion at 1043 Ocean Boulevard, Nalepa was already removed from her alleged hanging state and was face down.
nursebeeme
07-27-2011, 11:55 PM
this disturbs me on many levels... they are most likely waiting on tox screen results (complete results)
so what then?
if they are negative what then?
this whole situation is NOT NORMAL imhoo~:twocents:
((anyone recall the link I posted about the brother in thread one... where he told his land lord he was going out on his boat and ended up in California??? what is up with thaatt????? sorry do not have a link.. it is in thread one... and it is from my recollection))
hate to quote my own self... LOL.. but what if the results are positive? so what then as well??!!!!!! darn it.. this doesn't add up... and this whole case is tied to money.. LOTS OF MONEY... I hope Rebecca's family has the strength to see this thru and do their own independent autopsy if necessary. Something stinks here imhoo.
katydid23
07-27-2011, 11:57 PM
Police reports detailing a bitter end to Jonah Shacknai and his second wife’s marriage were released late Monday, one day after their 6-year-old son died in a San Diego hospital while the recent death of Shacknai’s girlfriend remains under investigation.
The documents, which catalog two incidents, include 16 photographs of mainly scratches and bruises submitted by Dina Shacknai, allegedly purported by their dog, according to a Paradise Valley Police Department report.
On Sunday, Max Shacknai passed away from injuries sustained July 11 when he fell down stairs at his father’s Coronado mansion. Max was an organ donor, and his organs went to three different recipients, a source close to the family told NBCSanDiego Tuesday.
Last Wednesday, two days after the boy’s fall, Jonah Shacknai’s girlfriend, Rebecca Zahau, 32, was found dead, hanging from a second-story balcony at the same Spreckels Mansion in Coronado.
Investigators initially described the death as “violent” and “bizarre,” and forensics evidence is being processed before determining whether the death was criminal or a suicide.
On Sept. 13, 2008, Jonah Shacknai reported to police that Dina attempted to choke her and that his attack-trained female German Shepherd became excited and came between the two. He blamed his wife’s behavior on prescription medications and alcohol, according to a supplemental report.
Dina called the same night, reporting a dog attack. On the following day, she told police the dog had injured her before while Jonah “makes little to no effort to stop the dog,” according to a report.
Dina also submitted a two-page letter, describing Jonah as temperamental. She said the incident began over a disagreement with their child’s soiled bedding and that Jonah cursed at her in front of their child.
He “physically intimidated” her, she wrote, by “coming very close to (her), ‘nose to nose,’” and continuing to insult and threaten" her with name-calling in a “menacing tone.” She added that her attempts to keep an arm’s distance from Jonah during the incident resulted in her hand moving from his chest to his throat.
“Although Jonah feels entitled to name call, push etc, when I attempt to set boundaries via my personal space, he then assumes the role of victim,” Dina wrote.
The married couple was estranged by Jan. 4, 2009, when a second incident was reported to police. Dina alleged Jonah elbowed her in the right breast area.
Weeks later, in a formal letter to Chief John Bennett of the Paradise Valley Police Department dated Jan. 26, Jonah wrote Dina previously filed “false and misleading reports” about bruises on her body stemming from contact with their dog.
“Importantly,” Shacknai wrote, "Dina has been treated medically for years for a bruising disorder, whereby the slightest contact with an object or other material causes bruises. This information can certainly be verified medically.”
Shacknai, the prominent founder and CEO of Medicis, a pharmaceutical company based in Scottsdale, Ariz., wrote that although never feeling physically endangered, Dina physically assaulted him several times, once causing him a broken finger.
He wrote that Dina threw herself at his car on Jan. 4 while he was attempting to drive away from the home. She screamed that he had no right to leave her or the house, Jonah wrote.
“At this point, Dina also began attempting to slap me, again screaming, “You cannot leave me!” Jonah wrote. “I was able to gently nudge her from the car and withdraw from the premises without further incident.”
No charges were filed in either incidents.
On Monday, shortly before 9:30 p.m., Dina and Jonah Shacknai released a joint statement:
While our marriage did not work out as either of us had hoped, it did produce a wonderful son, Max, whom both of us loved very much. His loss is unimaginable. These police reports are not reflective of the totality or the precise details of the events during a difficult time in our marriage that we worked through together. The release of the records as we grieve Max’s recent loss pains us greatly, and we request that the privacy of our family be respected. The unfortunate attention to these records is a distraction from the most important concern of honoring our beautiful son, who lives on in both of our hearts.
Source: Details Shed on Shacknai's Second Divorce | NBC San Diego
Source: Details Shed on Shacknai's Second Divorce | NBC San Diego
WOW. I am starting to lean more towards DS as being the hangman now.
Was the German Shepherd the dog that was boarded the day before the hanging?
We have a female German Shepherd. She is also very protective, and if my DH and I were going to be away from home for days I would be worried leaving her here if others were coming in and out. I would be concerned she might hurt some one.
pferrin
07-28-2011, 12:01 AM
I think the police are doing a criminal investigation. IMO they are just giving the criminal a little rope. The police are not giving HLN or any media the scoop..HLN distorts the truth consistenly..to bait folks into being on their show.
Do I think there have been some wrongdoings by the police in this case..you betcha. Not putting a tent over Rebecca..Not calling her family yet. If they were thinking suicide..I believe they would"ve called the family to find out her frame of mind. If they believe it is murder..they might not be calling.
cluciano63
07-28-2011, 12:04 AM
There is NO criminal investigtion at this point? Shouldn't that be happening anyway, just in case? It is never easy to go back and start one weeks later...
jstwondering
07-28-2011, 12:06 AM
this disturbs me on many levels... they are most likely waiting on tox screen results (complete results)
so what then?
if they are negative what then?
this whole situation is NOT NORMAL imhoo~:twocents:
((anyone recall the link I posted about the brother in thread one... where he told his land lord he was going out on his boat and ended up in California??? what is up with thaatt????? sorry do not have a link.. it is in thread one... and it is from my recollection))
Here you go:
Old 07-16-2011, 01:59 PM
nursebeeme's Avatar
nursebeeme nursebeeme is online now
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Join Date: May 2008
Location: US Army Officer Family~ Currently Michigan
Posts: 19,906
Wednesday morning, Shacknai's brother Adam Shacknai, a Memphian, told police he discovered Nalepa's naked body hanging from a balcony with her hands bound behind her back with electrical cord.
"Right now, I'm not going into details," said Capt. Tim Curran with the San Diego County Sheriff's Department. "I'm not going to compromise the integrity of the investigation."
--------
another snip
--------
Adam Shacknai lives in an apartment in Midtown Memphis. His leasing agent neighbor, Robert Sanders, said he last saw him a few days ago.
"He said that he was going to have to go back out on the tugboat company he works for," said Sanders.
Instead, Adam Shacknai ended up in San Diego in a guest house in his brother's mansion.
http://www.wmctv.com/story/15091608/...-diego-mansion
__________________
This bee my opinion
justice for Caylee Anthony
justbetweenus
07-28-2011, 12:07 AM
I agree with you. This particular type of suicide seems so out of kilter for this particular woman. I can see her wanting to possibly kill herself in this tragic situation. If she somehow felt responsible for this horrible tragedy, and if her life was crashing down around her, I can be convinced she might decide to kill herself. But not in this horribly ugly way, imo. I could even be convinced she might hang herself. But not naked, outside in the yard, using power chords. No Way, imo.
If she was in the bedroom wearing a nightgown or lingerie, after writing a note explaining her sense of guilt or her apologies, then I could buy the suicide. But this one does not feel right at all to me.
The weird thing is that it does not seem like either of Max's parents would have done this either, imo. Not so quickly. Max was still in the hospital. It is hard for me to believe they would use precious time that he was still 'alive' to commit a revenge murder. Why the big hurry?:
Sadly, one of the only things that does kind of make a little sense is the possibility that RN was angry that JS was possibly blaming her. She may have seen that coming, and set up and staged her suicide in a way to make it look like a murder as her final revenge . But only someone who truly knew her would know if that was possible.
BBM: I agree with you, and just wanted to make a comment, especially on the paragraph I bolded. I'm thinking, maybe someone very close and dear to Dina; maybe a family member, best friend, a confidant. Someone that knows everything about her, loves her dearly, and hates to see her in pain. They have been with her through it all.
This lady (Rebecca) perhaps to Dina took her husband, her home, and part of her life away from her. Now she was about to lose her only child, that was in the care of the woman who already took so much away from her, causing her much more pain and unbearable grief.
Could this friend take it in their own hands to get rid of her pain for good? And Dina had no idea because like you say, her precious time was being spent with dying son. Just a thought.
CuriousAmazon
07-28-2011, 12:09 AM
WOW. I am starting to lean more towards DS as being the hangman now.
Was the German Shepherd the dog that was boarded the day before the hanging?
We have a female German Shepherd. She is also very protective, and if my DH and I were going to be away from home for days I would be worried leaving her here if others were coming in and out. I would be concerned she might hurt some one.
I believe it was a Weimaraner.:beagle: Depending on the age of the dog, they are hyper and highstrong (sp?).
What I don't understand is, if she was at the hospital on Monday, the dog seemed to have been okay by him/herself for those few hours. And what kind of help is Adam providing? All I hear about him is he is staying in the guest house. So why can't he watch or take care of the dog?
Paladine
07-28-2011, 12:10 AM
I started thinking about ES....nothing has been mentioned about him in all of this. Was he visiting in Coronado with his sister, GS at the mansion with their father when all of this occurred?
I found this photo and was intrigued. JS stares (almost sneering) at the camera. Everyone else seems engaged in the jovial celebration (ES Bar Mitzvah) except JS. He appears detached. Is it just me?
All of the kids are there. ES, GS, MS As well as Kim James and RN.
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10150141158806622.284813.120443706621#!/photo.php?fbid=10150141158871622&set=a.10150141158806622.284813.120443706621&type=1&theater
GS is tagged in that photo too...body language is interesting, imo. Others are pointing at E, in an effort to promote the 'center of attention' theme, it seems, to me...but not GS. Check her out...and JS, he's not pointing either.
Rebeccas not tagged...
jjenny
07-28-2011, 12:10 AM
I do not understand the face down thing. Did the brother really place her face down? I would not want to place someone face down if I cut someone down from hanging. Presumably he cut her down because he believed she was still alive-so why place her face down if what is reported was correct?
justbetweenus
07-28-2011, 12:13 AM
Here you go:
Old 07-16-2011, 01:59 PM
nursebeeme's Avatar
nursebeeme nursebeeme is online now
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Join Date: May 2008
Location: US Army Officer Family~ Currently Michigan
Posts: 19,906
Wednesday morning, Shacknai's brother Adam Shacknai, a Memphian, told police he discovered Nalepa's naked body hanging from a balcony with her hands bound behind her back with electrical cord.
"Right now, I'm not going into details," said Capt. Tim Curran with the San Diego County Sheriff's Department. "I'm not going to compromise the integrity of the investigation."
--------
another snip
--------
Adam Shacknai lives in an apartment in Midtown Memphis. His leasing agent neighbor, Robert Sanders, said he last saw him a few days ago.
"He said that he was going to have to go back out on the tugboat company he works for," said Sanders.
Instead, Adam Shacknai ended up in San Diego in a guest house in his brother's mansion.
http://www.wmctv.com/story/15091608/...-diego-mansion
__________________
This bee my opinion
justice for Caylee Anthony
He could have mentioned these plans to the neighbour, then got the call about Max. I don't find this suspicious.
jstwondering
07-28-2011, 12:13 AM
WOW. I am starting to lean more towards DS as being the hangman now.
Was the German Shepherd the dog that was boarded the day before the hanging?
We have a female German Shepherd. She is also very protective, and if my DH and I were going to be away from home for days I would be worried leaving her here if others were coming in and out. I would be concerned she might hurt some one.
BBM - Nope, different dog. Dog that was boarded was a Weimaraner under 2 years old.
CuriousAmazon
07-28-2011, 12:14 AM
Another interesting article http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2011-07-27-mansion-woman-hang_n.htm, from USA Today.
Snippet: Zahau-Loehner, in one of several phone interviews in recent days, complained that she and other family members have not been given information by authorities about their sister's death. "We are out of the loop," she said.
Frank said his department has spoken with Zahau's family and has had 15 investigators working the case, along with additional forensic technicians and investigators from the California Department of Justice. He said the probe "is progressing well."
Paladine
07-28-2011, 12:21 AM
Another interesting article http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2011-07-27-mansion-woman-hang_n.htm, from USA Today.
Snippet: Zahau-Loehner, in one of several phone interviews in recent days, complained that she and other family members have not been given information by authorities about their sister's death. "We are out of the loop," she said.
Frank said his department has spoken with Zahau's family and has had 15 investigators working the case, along with additional forensic technicians and investigators from the California Department of Justice. He said the probe "is progressing well."
All together, now, "One of these things is not like the other..." It's THAT simple, imo.
Reporters? WHERE are the reporters?! Please, make some noise....
pferrin
07-28-2011, 12:26 AM
There is NO criminal investigtion at this point? Shouldn't that be happening anyway, just in case? It is never easy to go back and start one weeks later...
The police are going thru video tapes of hospital ..cell records, etc..I call that a criminal investigation. They have 15 detectives working on this case..I call that a criminal investigation. The media just loves to stir it up. The police arent gonna come out and say ..we are focusing on madame X..cause then ..it might be more difficult to gain info they need.
gngr~snap
07-28-2011, 12:26 AM
Yep I'd be lovin that Superbowl myself. Hotwires his toilet...calls attorney and lets them handle him. Puts an ad in want-ads..describing his shortcomings. :great:
Has a yard sale an innocently puts a for sale sign on the boat in the driveway
$5000 when it's worth $17000- lol
my girlfriend did this and paid her lawyer.
(technically it WAS hers) possesion 9/10ths and all.☺
Not sure I believe JS. I'm begining the think he's the kinda guy
that plays dirty. The type that will intimidate you but never leave a mark. Drove her to distraction maybe?
She WAS a child psychologist, makes me think she wouldn't
take the bait. Guess she did. Wonder what the first wife has said...
gngr~snap
07-28-2011, 12:29 AM
WOW. I am starting to lean more towards DS as being the hangman now.
Was the German Shepherd the dog that was boarded the day before the hanging?
We have a female German Shepherd. She is also very protective, and if my DH and I were going to be away from home for days I would be worried leaving her here if others were coming in and out. I would be concerned she might hurt some one.
I really think they were BOTH with MS standing vigil.
- I hope
IzzyBlanche
07-28-2011, 12:33 AM
I started thinking about ES....nothing has been mentioned about him in all of this. Was he visiting in Coronado with his sister, GS at the mansion with their father when all of this occurred?
I found this photo and was intrigued. JS stares (almost sneering) at the camera. Everyone else seems engaged in the jovial celebration (ES Bar Mitzvah) except JS. He appears detached. Is it just me?
All of the kids are there. ES, GS, MS As well as Kim James and RN.
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10150141158806622.284813.120443706621#!/photo.php?fbid=10150141158871622&set=a.10150141158806622.284813.120443706621&type=1&theater
I see what you are saying, but what I also see is that JS and Rebecca are the only ones looking at the camera. This seems to me like a pre-planned joke that everyone was in on but the two of them. "Psst, when they say cheese, everyone point to ES!"
This same sort of joke was played on me once which is why it seemed familiar.
Just an idea.
jjenny
07-28-2011, 12:34 AM
I see what you are saying, but what I also see is that JS and Rebecca are the only ones looking at the camera. This seems to me like a pre-planned joke that everyone was in on but the two of them. "Psst, when they say cheese, everyone point to ES!"
This same sort of joke was played on me once which is why it seemed familiar.
Just an idea.
Actually Rebecca is pointing at the boy.
Wendy101
07-28-2011, 12:35 AM
http://www.facebook.com/pages/RIP-Rebecca-Zahau/244749242210306?sk=wall
FB RIP Rebecca
pferrin
07-28-2011, 12:44 AM
I really think they were BOTH with MS standing vigil.
- I hope
I really can'tbelieve that the parents would be staying round the clock at the hospital. Even the best parents will take turns. My best friends baby boy was born with a liver disfunction. He has had to have 2 liver transplants.
She and her hubby have taken turns at the hospital. Even when he was critically ill and her hubby had to work in another town.she would goto ronald macdonald to rest a little and shower and eat. Noone can be there round the clock day after day. I'd bet ya they took turns.
IzzyBlanche
07-28-2011, 12:45 AM
Actually Rebecca is pointing at the boy.
Oh, you're right. I see that now. Thanks for the correction. So there's where my theory falls to the ground.
justbetweenus
07-28-2011, 12:51 AM
http://www.facebook.com/pages/RIP-Rebecca-Zahau/244749242210306?sk=wall
FB RIP Rebecca
Does anyone know who started this FB wall?
justbetweenus
07-28-2011, 01:02 AM
If she were capable of doing this, I am pretty certain that the drs told them early on that their son was gone--well before it leaked to the public.
IMO,yes, she could have, if she believed that her son was gone. Having to watch him lie there, breathing by artificial means but not alive.
That is why LE was getting the videos from the hospital. To observe who left, when...when did they come back, what were they wearing? etc. Were they wearing something different?
If this is the scenario, I bet it was done out of rage--maybe she went home to shower, change clothes, sleep and being that they lived so near, she detoured and paid a visit to RN. Maybe it was not premeditated as a murder. It began as a confrontation, an emotional event and escalated and RN was killed. The hanging may have been a cover-up to what actually occurred. AS may have even been in on the cover up part of it.
Just me, theorizing....
Although I tend to believe if Rebecca's death is a murder, and not suicide, I believe the answers will come from someone in Dina's circle. However, I do not believe she would do this herself. I think if she were to, she would take a gun and shoot her, and be done with it. JMO
gngr~snap
07-28-2011, 01:03 AM
I really can'tbelieve that the parents would be staying round the clock at the hospital. Even the best parents will take turns. My best friends baby boy was born with a liver disfunction. He has had to have 2 liver transplants.
She and her hubby have taken turns at the hospital. Even when he was critically ill and her hubby had to work in another town.she would goto ronald macdonald to rest a little and shower and eat. Noone can be there round the clock day after day. I'd bet ya they took turns.
I hear ya. I had a 26 wk premie under 2#
but when it's a traumatic brain injury that required
CPR and your child needs a respiartor to breathe, the child
you have had for 6 years who was full of life and all so sudden.
Dina is a DR/PhD she knew he might not make it.
I'm sure there was tremendous swelling in the brain.
Also there are other signs that someone is VERY LIKELY to
never recover. Like pupils that are fixed and dilated,
and do not respond to light. No gag reflex or plantar reflexes
Glasgow coma scale -*see attachment
here is some fyi☺
http://www.traumaticbraininjury.com/content/symptoms/glasgowcomascale.html
cluciano63
07-28-2011, 01:10 AM
I really can'tbelieve that the parents would be staying round the clock at the hospital. Even the best parents will take turns. My best friends baby boy was born with a liver disfunction. He has had to have 2 liver transplants.
She and her hubby have taken turns at the hospital. Even when he was critically ill and her hubby had to work in another town.she would goto ronald macdonald to rest a little and shower and eat. Noone can be there round the clock day after day. I'd bet ya they took turns.
Especially if there is so much bad blood between them, it would have become awkward even under those circumstances, IMO.
gngr~snap
07-28-2011, 01:22 AM
I'm not sure about California, but often ICU's will only allow 20 min per hour.
If DS was a well known psychologist around the area she may have had special
treatment. When something unexpected happens like that it is almost
impossible to get the parents to leave. I've see them NOT leave up to nine
days. Family members come to visit them during the time they can't see their child.
Trays are sent for the parent.
I has been said that JS did not go back to the home after MS accident, so he didn't go home
I don't know... if my kid is dying I don't think the petty cr@p with my husband
would really hit me til later.
Based on the time of the 911 call JS wasn't there, and DS was not able to be found for awhile. couldn't be a lot of finger pointing going on....
but you are right no telling what they did.
They did say RN was going to the hosp to se JS soo idk?
justbetweenus
07-28-2011, 01:24 AM
TOM, an accountant.
What I heard was that there were two women, one of them naked and bound up. And it was another female who made the 911 call...
...Two asain women.
THIS may be just a rumor ^^^^
but it fits with my theory someone was still in the house.
I don't get why RN would call about the dog.
Was it someone else that called?
A man saying he was JS maybe?
JS was at the hospital his child brain dead.
can't imagine the dog would cross his mind
even if the dog did "cause the accident".
The dog didn't throw that child OVER the balcony
there was a carpeted landing! "down the stairs" was THAT far.
I also head about the ball and MS hit his head on the wall
WHAT wall? he'd have to be swinging on the chandalier
This happened when police responded to the 911 call for MS?
And the dog care guy said he was told
by RN that GS was injured too?
There was also a disturbance reported at DS's
house that Mon night as well?
Was this a hostage situation?
Was she kidnapped and brought to JS's house?
:eek:I also "heard" DS's witnessed BOTH "deaths" :waitasec:
The 911 calls have been sealed...
Sounds to me like the women were tied
up/maybe raped? and the male "aire" was killed.
Wasn't it reported two women were seen leaving in a police car after MS
was taken to the hospital?
Sounds like a "hit" to me.
But if this happened? why would RN call the dog care guy?
He said she was crying. Was she forced to call?
Is he sure it was RN? Was she seen by anyone that knew her
after the police left?
I have this creepy feeling she was still tied up the entire day
and was being hidden on the property.
Tortured and killed the next morning. no wonder GS was shipped off!
Do we know FOR SURE DS is even alive right now?
I hope someone knows where she is!
Found this very interesting. Thanks gngr~snap.
Wendy101
07-28-2011, 01:25 AM
Does anyone know who started this FB wall?
I have no clue - I just found it... I wonder why there is only 19 people?? Is this story not hitting the news??
Dum-Dum Sucker
07-28-2011, 01:27 AM
GS is tagged in that photo too...body language is interesting, imo. Others are pointing at E, in an effort to promote the 'center of attention' theme, it seems, to me...but not GS. Check her out...and JS, he's not pointing either.
Rebeccas not tagged...
Either is Maxie.
IzzyBlanche
07-28-2011, 01:34 AM
I have a new theory that I think my gut came up with while I slept over the past couple weeks, and which eventually worked its way up to my conscious brain.
I decided to share it because why not, everyone else has one (a theory, I mean).
Preface: I have no doubt whatsoever that Rebecca's death was murder, not suicide. And I have a lot of trouble believing that JS or DS either personally killed her, or ordered her killed. An ordered death is neat, not messy like this one, as far as I know.
I understand the logic behind the theories of JS and/or DS being the culprit(s) out of rage for their son's death.
Yet I think about what people might do in a blinding rage. They might shoot someone, or stab them multiple times, beat them senseless, or even choke them to death with their bare hands. But they don't strip them naked.
Therefore the nudity--not to mention the bonds--to me suggests the emotional motive wasn't rage as much as humiliation. Humiliate someone by rendering them helpless by binding their arms and legs, either before or after stripping them nude. What could be more humiliating? Who among us hasn't had that nightmare of finding ourselves naked, and helpless to cover our nudity, in front of a group of people, or even just one significant person?
So I start to think, maybe this was a crime of opportunity. As has been stated multiple times, Coronado is essentially a small town. Maybe someone heard about Max's accident and surmised Rebecca would be home alone. Someone from the gym, the grocery store, the kennel, who knows.
That person rings the doorbell and when Rebecca answers, says he heard the awful news about Max and wanted to offer condolences. She is moved by this kindness and innocently invites him in for something to drink (I don't mean alcoholic), then he comes on to her, she's shocked and horrified over this unexpected development, and won't cooperate. So he strangles or otherwise kills her out of rage over her rejection, then sets up the nude hanging scenario to humiliate her in revenge.
Yes, I already see the holes in this theory, but I'm throwing it out anyway.
jstwondering
07-28-2011, 01:52 AM
I have a new theory that I think my gut came up with while I slept over the past couple weeks, and which eventually worked its way up to my conscious brain.
I decided to share it because why not, everyone else has one (a theory, I mean).
snipped by me
Dear Izzy, the reason I come to this forum is because I really appreciate others' thoughts and theories. They are so much more creative (a good thing) and thought out than anywhere else, especially considering what you get on NG or JVM.
Thanks for posting your theory.
justbetweenus
07-28-2011, 01:53 AM
I have a new theory that I think my gut came up with while I slept over the past couple weeks, and which eventually worked its way up to my conscious brain.
I decided to share it because why not, everyone else has one (a theory, I mean).
Preface: I have no doubt whatsoever that Rebecca's death was murder, not suicide. And I have a lot of trouble believing that JS or DS either personally killed her, or ordered her killed. An ordered death is neat, not messy like this one, as far as I know.
I understand the logic behind the theories of JS and/or DS being the culprit(s) out of rage for their son's death.
Yet I think about what people might do in a blinding rage. They might shoot someone, or stab them multiple times, beat them senseless, or even choke them to death with their bare hands. But they don't strip them naked.
Therefore the nudity--not to mention the bonds--to me suggests the emotional motive wasn't rage as much as humiliation. Humiliate someone by rendering them helpless by binding their arms and legs, either before or after stripping them nude. What could be more humiliating? Who among us hasn't had that nightmare of finding ourselves naked, and helpless to cover our nudity, in front of a group of people, or even just one significant person?
So I start to think, maybe this was a crime of opportunity. As has been stated multiple times, Coronado is essentially a small town. Maybe someone heard about Max's accident and surmised Rebecca would be home alone. Someone from the gym, the grocery store, the kennel, who knows.
That person rings the doorbell and when Rebecca answers, says he heard the awful news about Max and wanted to offer condolences. She is moved by this kindness and innocently invites him in for something to drink (I don't mean alcoholic), then he comes on to her, she's shocked and horrified over this unexpected development, and won't cooperate. So he strangles or otherwise kills her out of rage over her rejection, then sets up the nude hanging scenario to humiliate her in revenge.
Yes, I already see the holes in this theory, but I'm throwing it out anyway.
It's a good theory Izzy. One I enjoyed reading.:)
justbetweenus
07-28-2011, 01:55 AM
I have no clue - I just found it... I wonder why there is only 19 people?? Is this story not hitting the news??
I wonder....going to read again.
gngr~snap
07-28-2011, 02:52 AM
I have a new theory that I think my gut came up with while I slept over the past couple weeks, and which eventually worked its way up to my conscious brain.
I decided to share it because why not, everyone else has one (a theory, I mean).
Preface: I have no doubt whatsoever that Rebecca's death was murder, not suicide. And I have a lot of trouble believing that JS or DS either personally killed her, or ordered her killed. An ordered death is neat, not messy like this one, as far as I know.
I understand the logic behind the theories of JS and/or DS being the culprit(s) out of rage for their son's death.
Yet I think about what people might do in a blinding rage. They might shoot someone, or stab them multiple times, beat them senseless, or even choke them to death with their bare hands. But they don't strip them naked.
Therefore the nudity--not to mention the bonds--to me suggests the emotional motive wasn't rage as much as humiliation. Humiliate someone by rendering them helpless by binding their arms and legs, either before or after stripping them nude. What could be more humiliating? Who among us hasn't had that nightmare of finding ourselves naked, and helpless to cover our nudity, in front of a group of people, or even just one significant person?
So I start to think, maybe this was a crime of opportunity. As has been stated multiple times, Coronado is essentially a small town. Maybe someone heard about Max's accident and surmised Rebecca would be home alone. Someone from the gym, the grocery store, the kennel, who knows.
That person rings the doorbell and when Rebecca answers, says he heard the awful news about Max and wanted to offer condolences. She is moved by this kindness and innocently invites him in for something to drink (I don't mean alcoholic), then he comes on to her, she's shocked and horrified over this unexpected development, and won't cooperate. So he strangles or otherwise kills her out of rage over her rejection, then sets up the nude hanging scenario to humiliate her in revenge.
Yes, I already see the holes in this theory, but I'm throwing it out anyway.
Could be!
No telling who around there was watching her.- maybe knew GS was gone and JS at the hospital. Probably had no knowledge he brother was there was there as well.
pferrin
07-28-2011, 04:11 AM
apparently..this was posted in another blog ..by tom an accountant???
since it has already been brought here by another websleuther....I want to put my 2 pennies in about this. Yep I agree totally rumor.
""What I heard was that there were two women, one of them naked and bound up. And it was another female who made the 911 call...
...Two asain women.
THIS may be just a rumor ^^^^
but it fits with my theory someone was still in the house."
The police have stated that it was JS brother..not a female that called 911 on the morning Rebeccas body was discovered..My question is ...when we know that the police have Discussed AS as being the caller..then why even bring up this stuff? I am very confused.
If this was brought over to discuss the morning of Max accident..no one was bound at the home that mornin. I am very confused how this kind of thing fits in here. Please help..I want to be open minded about all posts..this on has me :banghead: tia
gngr~snap
07-28-2011, 04:48 AM
apparently..this was posted in another blog ..by tom an accountant???
since it has already been brought here by another websleuther....I want to put my 2 pennies in about this. Yep I agree totally rumor.
""What I heard was that there were two women, one of them naked and bound up. And it was another female who made the 911 call...
...Two asain women.
THIS may be just a rumor ^^^^
but it fits with my theory someone was still in the house."
The police have stated that it was JS brother..not a female that called 911 on the morning Rebeccas body was discovered..My question is ...when we know that the police have Discussed AS as being the caller..then why even bring up this stuff? I am very confused.
If this was brought over to discuss the morning of Max accident..no one was bound at the home that mornin. I am very confused how this kind of thing fits in here. Please help..I want to be open minded about all posts..this on has me :banghead: tia
No it was Monday the day 911 was called for Max they left in a police car. I'll find the link . brb
Bonepile
07-28-2011, 05:10 AM
Anyone consider that it was the brother that in a sudden vile fit of rage attacked Rebecca and strangled her?
I am supposing that he lied to his landlord and ended up in Ca. He does manual labor so I am guessing he could easily strangle, move and hang Rebecca. I am supposing that he might have "noticed" Rebecca in how many visits to that house over two/three years. Did JS tell him what a amazing woman Rebecca is? He might have "come on" to her and been rebuffed and then ... Was he the last to see her alive, and if so at what time? Is he the one who is fact was playing something loud? Why did he not leave her hanging? I doubt his getting her down had anything to do with "saving her life" or making her look "better". Would he be the one to think of hanging her with electrical cord?
Just some thoughts .. just some things that do not add up concerning him. Thanks for reading.
lauriej
07-28-2011, 05:20 AM
I have a new theory that I think my gut came up with while I slept over the past couple weeks, and which eventually worked its way up to my conscious brain.
---snipped---
So I start to think, maybe this was a crime of opportunity. As has been stated multiple times, Coronado is essentially a small town. Maybe someone heard about Max's accident and surmised Rebecca would be home alone. Someone from the gym, the grocery store, the kennel, who knows.
That person rings the doorbell and when Rebecca answers, says he heard the awful news about Max and wanted to offer condolences. She is moved by this kindness and innocently invites him in for something to drink (I don't mean alcoholic), then he comes on to her, she's shocked and horrified over this unexpected development, and won't cooperate. So he strangles or otherwise kills her out of rage over her rejection, then sets up the nude hanging scenario to humiliate her in revenge.
Yes, I already see the holes in this theory, but I'm throwing it out anyway.
---my daughter has a similar theory.
..hers involves the door-bell ( or lets himself in with a key----or knows the keypad code ) caller, as the brother, adamS.
..he comes "calling", knowing his brother JS is @ the hospital and won't be home-----he's been hanging around the last couple of days "supporting" his brother, but with nothing to do.
..he arrives after rebecca has spoken with her sister, and is getting ready for bed.
..finally---------HIS shot at rebecca! she totally turns him down.
..he strangles her------HAS to do something about those marks on her neck-----so ties the cord around her neck / fakes the suicide hanging.
.."finds her" ----cuts her down/attempts to revive her ( to account for the eventual discovery of his DNA on her body ).
..( yeah-------my daughter---CSI fanatic..)
askfornina
07-28-2011, 05:33 AM
if this is ruled a suicide, they had better give a darn good explanation.
Hooligan73
07-28-2011, 05:42 AM
if this is ruled a suicide, they had better give a darn good explanation.
If it's ruled a suicide, it's the most elaborate suicide that I've ever heard of.
gngr~snap
07-28-2011, 05:45 AM
apparently..this was posted in another blog ..by tom an accountant???
since it has already been brought here by another websleuther....I want to put my 2 pennies in about this. Yep I agree totally rumor.
""What I heard was that there were two women, one of them naked and bound up. And it was another female who made the 911 call...
...Two asain women.
THIS may be just a rumor ^^^^
but it fits with my theory someone was still in the house."
The police have stated that it was JS brother..not a female that called 911 on the morning Rebeccas body was discovered..My question is ...when we know that the police have Discussed AS as being the caller..then why even bring up this stuff? I am very confused.
If this was brought over to discuss the morning of Max accident..no one was bound at the home that mornin. I am very confused how this kind of thing fits in here. Please help..I want to be open minded about all posts..this on has me :banghead: tia
Zahau was at home with another woman, whom authorities won't identify, when Max fell down the stairs last Monday, Coronado Police Chief Louis
They seem to be going in the house interrogating some people," one neighbor told 10News. "Twenty minutes later, they brought two women put them in squad car [and] took them away."
http://www.10news.com/news/28534601/detail.html
Finally found it. I was questioning whetherthey were nude or not.
The record is sealed as is the 911 call.
It's unclear what happened to the women.
BrownRice
07-28-2011, 07:32 AM
I found this photo and was intrigued. JS stares (almost sneering) at the camera. Everyone else seems engaged in the jovial celebration (ES Bar Mitzvah) except JS. He appears detached. Is it just me?
I honestly think he can't move his face from his injectibles. It is frozen.
Bonepile
07-28-2011, 07:34 AM
I honestly think he can't move his face from his injectibles. It is frozen.
and that's NOT all that is "frozen" about him .. not by a long shot.
BrownRice
07-28-2011, 07:49 AM
http://www.facebook.com/pages/RIP-Rebecca-Zahau/244749242210306?sk=wall
FB RIP Rebecca
This doesn't look to be created by anybody close to her - just a random person. I can't imagine her friends/family posting to a public place like this. Furthermore, for info it discusses if her death is a suicide. If this was a legit site, they would have personal stuff for her info (about how sweet and kind she was), etc. She wouldn't be defined by her death.
peace9274
07-28-2011, 08:18 AM
This doesn't look to be created by anybody close to her - just a random person. I can't imagine her friends/family posting to a public place like this. Furthermore, for info it discusses if her death is a suicide. If this was a legit site, they would have personal stuff for her info (about how sweet and kind she was), etc. She wouldn't be defined by her death.
Too many gruesome words & comments posted
& with poor grammar & misspelled words.
I agree, it was not created by family or friends.
oceanblueeyes
07-28-2011, 08:21 AM
Yep, it started out disrepectful.......by not erecting a tent over her body and letting the young boys sit on the roof and gawk at her.......
Unbelieveable......totally :sick: :maddening:
What time of day was the SW finally issued?
LE could do nothing but stand by until then and wouldnt even be able to start their full investigation of the backyard area.
oceanblueeyes
07-28-2011, 08:24 AM
This doesn't look to be created by anybody close to her - just a random person. I can't imagine her friends/family posting to a public place like this. Furthermore, for info it discusses if her death is a suicide. If this was a legit site, they would have personal stuff for her info (about how sweet and kind she was), etc. She wouldn't be defined by her death.
I think you are right. Facebook now has become a spin off of message board posters who put these pages up.
I don't think these people even know Rebecca.
IMO
oceanblueeyes
07-28-2011, 08:27 AM
If it's ruled a suicide, it's the most elaborate suicide that I've ever heard of.
The experts will tell us that those who commit suicides can be very creative and dramatic.
IMO
scorekeeper
07-28-2011, 08:34 AM
http://www.lohud.com/article/20110728/NEWS03/107280366/Mystery-continues-death-Jonah-Shacknai-s-Calif-home?odyssey=mod%7Cnewswell%7Ctext%7CNews%7Cs
Frank said investigators are probing "victimology," or the actions and state of mind of Zahau before her death, and whether her death may have been related to the child's fall.
Nothing new.........article from JS and AS hometown.
oceanblueeyes
07-28-2011, 08:34 AM
---my daughter has a similar theory.
..hers involves the door-bell ( or lets himself in with a key----or knows the keypad code ) caller, as the brother, adamS.
..he comes "calling", knowing his brother JS is @ the hospital and won't be home-----he's been hanging around the last couple of days "supporting" his brother, but with nothing to do.
..he arrives after rebecca has spoken with her sister, and is getting ready for bed.
..finally---------HIS shot at rebecca! she totally turns him down.
..he strangles her------HAS to do something about those marks on her neck-----so ties the cord around her neck / fakes the suicide hanging.
.."finds her" ----cuts her down/attempts to revive her ( to account for the eventual discovery of his DNA on her body ).
..( yeah-------my daughter---CSI fanatic..)
Thats a very good scenario.
Although a ME can determine whether the victim was manually strangled versus being hung until death by a rope. The bruising would not be consistent with manual strangulation and hung by a rope off of a balcony.
The question I have is why would anyone stage a suicide to look more like a murder than a suicide?:waitasec:
scorekeeper
07-28-2011, 08:47 AM
What time of day was the SW finally issued?
LE could do nothing but stand by until then and wouldnt even be able to start their full investigation of the backyard area.
I don't care what time the SW was issued. They put up crime scene tape; why not put up a tent. I know it has been brought up that LE could do nothing until they received the search warrant, but it is still just so, so wrong to leave her there for display. I also understand that LE needs to do everything "by the book" so that evidence can be preserved and gathered correctly so that it doesn't get thrown out during trial. I truly do understand.
But, on a personal level, it was disrespectful. period.
Then the laws need to be changed. I would think Victim Advocates would be all over this.
Agree to disagree...:seeya:
~n/t~
07-28-2011, 08:50 AM
Thats a very good scenario.
Although a ME can determine whether the victim was manually strangled versus being hung until death by a rope. The bruising would not be consistent with manual strangulation and hung by a rope off of a balcony.
The question I have is why would anyone stage a suicide to look more like a murder than a suicide?:waitasec:
BBM....not sure I understand your question. Why do you think the suicide was staged to look like a murder? Didn't you post that the way she commit suicide is not uncommon? Not trying to pick on you....just trying to understand why you think it looks like a murder now versus early on in the case. (if I understood your post).
I guess it's sort of the same question Jeff Ashton asked at whatsherface's trial. Why would anyone stage an accident to look like a murder? It makes no sense.
In this case, I think it is what it is - a suicide
In the other case, I think it is what is - a murder
Lawgirl
07-28-2011, 09:14 AM
The weird thing is that it does not seem like either of Max's parents would have done this either, imo. Not so quickly. Max was still in the hospital. It is hard for me to believe they would use precious time that he was still 'alive' to commit a revenge murder. Why the big hurry?: her would know if that was possible.[/QUOTE]
I think it is possible because it was very late at night and because they probably already knew he was technically gone -- the anger was very fresh -- instant "snap"
Lawgirl
07-28-2011, 09:21 AM
[url]But there are two other clues. Mary Zahau-Loehner, sister to Rebecca, says she spoke to her sister before before her death. She said her sister was fine and normal. Moreover, other family members, even Rebecca’s ex-husband, Neil Nalepa, said they spoke to her this week and said that she was completely content and carefree.[/B]
Interesting. I wonder what they were talking about. Did he say anything good or bad other than I can't wrap my head around it? Does anyone know? Was it an amicable discussion or not? I read somewhere something about a credit card (probably having to do with her recent name change in May)? See what I mean...too many questions.
Content and carefree -- is this a good comment or a bad comment -- is it sarcastic or "I'm happy for her" comment.
Lawgirl
07-28-2011, 09:30 AM
I do not understand the face down thing. Did the brother really place her face down? I would not want to place someone face down if I cut someone down from hanging. Presumably he cut her down because he believed she was still alive-so why place her face down if what is reported was correct?
Maybe LE/forensics team were taking photos of the knots, the cords, which bound the hands and feet together.
jstwondering
07-28-2011, 09:37 AM
I honestly think he can't move his face from his injectibles. It is frozen.
Hahaha!
The doctor actually tells you that you shouldn't smile or drink from a straw for a day after getting the injections!
Also, the injections only last for a couple months, so one would have to keep getting injected to keep up initial results. It's very expensive, though.
Bonepile
07-28-2011, 09:45 AM
Of the six funeral homes in St. Joseph Missouri here is the obit from the Funeral Home that handled her remains and her service ... Including a VIDEO TRIBUTE ... http://www.meierhoffer.com/obituaries/rebecca-m-zahau-2/ ... and if that video does not bring you to tears nothing ever will. :(
IzzyBlanche
07-28-2011, 10:15 AM
Bonepile and lauriej:
The Adam scenario was my Theory B.
peace9274
07-28-2011, 10:18 AM
Of the six funeral homes in St. Joseph Missouri here is the obit from the Funeral Home that handled her remains and her service ... Including a VIDEO TRIBUTE ... http://www.meierhoffer.com/obituaries/rebecca-m-zahau-2/ ... and if that does not bring you to tears nothing ever will. :(
Very nice tribute of RN with lots of photos of her with friends & family.
Interesting, though, that there are no photos of her with JS or his children.....
unless I missed them.
oceanblueeyes
07-28-2011, 10:28 AM
I don't care what time the SW was issued. They put up crime scene tape; why not put up a tent. I know it has been brought up that LE could do nothing until they received the search warrant, but it is still just so, so wrong to leave her there for display. I also understand that LE needs to do everything "by the book" so that evidence can be preserved and gathered correctly so that it doesn't get thrown out during trial. I truly do understand.
But, on a personal level, it was disrespectful. period.
Then the laws need to be changed. I would think Victim Advocates would be all over this.
Agree to disagree...:seeya:
I do understand your outrage scorekeeper. I really do and I also agree on a personal level it affected me too.
But they put up the crime scene tape in front to keep anyone from coming on the grounds in front of the mansion or entering but then they have to wait on stand by for the search warrant to be asked for and signed off by a Judge and delivered back to LE who are at the mansion.. This does take time and they are not going to do anything to the scene before then and then have a possible suspect's lawyer come back and say they did not have permission to touch or doing anything because they had no official search warrant in place. Or have the homeowner accuse them of taking things without giving them an inventory list or even accusing LE of doing damage to the mansion.
I am sure Victim Advocates knows the procedures that LE must follow legally.
The law is never going to change on that. They must show a Judge there is probable cause to get a SW. That goes for this case and all others. Unfortunately Rebecca's body was part of the suicide or homicide scene and a victim's body is always considered as evidence.
IMO
Lawgirl
07-28-2011, 10:31 AM
[QUOTE=peace9274;6961490]Very nice tribute of RN with lots of photos of her with friends & family.
Interesting, though, that there are no photos of her with JS or his children.....
unless I missed them.[/QUOT
Wonderful tribute to Rebecca. In these photos, I saw a woman who was very loving, loved children, family and friends, was physically fit above the average person, she looked very strong even if she was a small frame - she even had vascularity and muscle definition in her arms which is not common unless you are devoted to fitness -- she was a people person -- she loved animls -- she loved all things beautiful.
Carrington
07-28-2011, 10:37 AM
Is there a write-up or only the video?
Looking for name and ages of siblings, to see if she did have a teenage sister.
IMO
shotzie
07-28-2011, 10:40 AM
What am I doing wrong I have the very first discussion on rebecca an then it is closed.I have been going thru each day to the closed to find the next continue, Is there a place at the top like Caylee's form was you can just click the next discussion? I know I am doing something wrong..open, close open close..DUH...Help..lol:floorlaugh:
Bonepile
07-28-2011, 10:41 AM
"Rebecca Mawaii Zahau, 32, Paradise Valley, Arizona, died Wednesday, July 13, 2011."
Interesting to note that she is listed as residing in Paradise Valley, Arizona and not California.
The video tribute speaks volumes about her and is one of the most beautiful tributes I have ever seen. May her family know comfort, love, peace, and understanding, and may Rebecca live in all our hearts forever.
And may justice prevail.
Bonepile
07-28-2011, 10:42 AM
Is there a write-up or only the video?
Looking for name and ages of siblings, to see if she did have a teenage sister.
IMO
I think only the video other than that one line about her with full name listed, her age, her place of residence and her death date. I am amazed at what the family was able to put together of photos tracing her life and in an order that the funeral home could assemble into a slide show, and if "a photo speaks a thousand words" we have learned a lot about Rebecca and her family.
Carrington
07-28-2011, 10:52 AM
What am I doing wrong I have the very first discussion on rebecca an then it is closed.I have been going thru each day to the closed to find the next continue, Is there a place at the top like Caylee's form was you can just click the next discussion? I know I am doing something wrong..open, close open close..DUH...Help..lol:floorlaugh:
Your not doing anything wrong.
One thread at a time for this case. I would think, depending on how LE rules, suicide or murder we may get a forum, if it gets more involved.
Suicide we are done, murder it goes on for the next 5 years or so........
IMO
Paladine
07-28-2011, 10:58 AM
You can only "tag" people that have a Facebook account. I just searched RN's name and the one person that came up states:
And as far as GS not pointing - I wonder if she was annoyed at her brother for getting all the attention? Did she have a Bat Mitzvah? ES's party was at the "W" Hotel with entertainment and lots of "wow"-factor. Teens can get moody about stuff like that....
Not true. You can write anyones name in and tag them, account or not; I've done it. It simply won't lead to a profile...it'll appear black instead of blue.
oceanblueeyes
07-28-2011, 11:02 AM
BBM....not sure I understand your question. Why do you think the suicide was staged to look like a murder? Didn't you post that the way she commit suicide is not uncommon? Not trying to pick on you....just trying to understand why you think it looks like a murder now versus early on in the case. (if I understood your post).
I guess it's sort of the same question Jeff Ashton asked at whatsherface's trial. Why would anyone stage an accident to look like a murder? It makes no sense.
In this case, I think it is what it is - a suicide
In the other case, I think it is what is - a murder
No, I didn't say it was common (like taking an overdose of drugs) but it does happen. Females do hang themselves.
What is rare is to do it publicly in a wide open area outside of a dwelling to be exposed to anyone and everyone who may come across the body. So if she had done these same things inside the mansion... like say for intstance......hanging from a light fixture or some overhead beam in a room somewhere then that would be more common, imo. Even being naked when doing so.
But by hanging herself over an outside balcony for everyone to see her naked and hung just seems more like what a murderer would do than a female that was wanting to hang herself. The ceilings in the mansion were certainly high enough to achieve that inside the home just by putting the rope around a light fixture and standing on a chair and pushing the chair out from under her with her feet.
So the exposure to the 'world' does seem more like a murder than a suicide. So if she was murdered why would they make the suicide look more like a murder than a suicide ? That is my point.
It is how she was found hanging from the outside balcony naked that makes many people think it was murder and the reason imo why LE says it was a violent and suspicious death.
imo
oceanblueeyes
07-28-2011, 11:12 AM
I think only the video other than that one line about her with full name listed, her age, her place of residence and her death date. I am amazed at what the family was able to put together of photos tracing her life and in an order that the funeral home could assemble into a slide show, and if "a photo speaks a thousand words" we have learned a lot about Rebecca and her family.
I am so glad that most of the funeral home are doing this now. I know they are in my area and every funeral I have been to lately they have the video playing on a large tv screens and have compiled 100s of photos of the deceased showing their lives. It is priceless to see how they have photos of the deceased from when they were a small child all the way until their deaths.
They give the family a copy of the video too and they can also play them if they visit the funeral home's website. Some are even videoing the entire funeral service now and that too is given to the families so they can go back and listen to the eulogies others gave during the services.
IMO
Police reports detailing a bitter end to Jonah Shacknai and his second wife’s marriage were released late Monday, one day after their 6-year-old son died in a San Diego hospital while the recent death of Shacknai’s girlfriend remains under investigation.
The documents, which catalog two incidents, include 16 photographs of mainly scratches and bruises submitted by Dina Shacknai, allegedly purported by their dog, according to a Paradise Valley Police Department report.
On Sunday, Max Shacknai passed away from injuries sustained July 11 when he fell down stairs at his father’s Coronado mansion. Max was an organ donor, and his organs went to three different recipients, a source close to the family told NBCSanDiego Tuesday.
Last Wednesday, two days after the boy’s fall, Jonah Shacknai’s girlfriend, Rebecca Zahau, 32, was found dead, hanging from a second-story balcony at the same Spreckels Mansion in Coronado.
Investigators initially described the death as “violent” and “bizarre,” and forensics evidence is being processed before determining whether the death was criminal or a suicide.
On Sept. 13, 2008, Jonah Shacknai reported to police that Dina attempted to choke her and that his attack-trained female German Shepherd became excited and came between the two. He blamed his wife’s behavior on prescription medications and alcohol, according to a supplemental report.
Dina called the same night, reporting a dog attack. On the following day, she told police the dog had injured her before while Jonah “makes little to no effort to stop the dog,” according to a report.
Dina also submitted a two-page letter, describing Jonah as temperamental. She said the incident began over a disagreement with their child’s soiled bedding and that Jonah cursed at her in front of their child.
He “physically intimidated” her, she wrote, by “coming very close to (her), ‘nose to nose,’” and continuing to insult and threaten" her with name-calling in a “menacing tone.” She added that her attempts to keep an arm’s distance from Jonah during the incident resulted in her hand moving from his chest to his throat.
“Although Jonah feels entitled to name call, push etc, when I attempt to set boundaries via my personal space, he then assumes the role of victim,” Dina wrote.
The married couple was estranged by Jan. 4, 2009, when a second incident was reported to police. Dina alleged Jonah elbowed her in the right breast area.
Weeks later, in a formal letter to Chief John Bennett of the Paradise Valley Police Department dated Jan. 26, Jonah wrote Dina previously filed “false and misleading reports” about bruises on her body stemming from contact with their dog.
“Importantly,” Shacknai wrote, "Dina has been treated medically for years for a bruising disorder, whereby the slightest contact with an object or other material causes bruises. This information can certainly be verified medically.”
Shacknai, the prominent founder and CEO of Medicis, a pharmaceutical company based in Scottsdale, Ariz., wrote that although never feeling physically endangered, Dina physically assaulted him several times, once causing him a broken finger.
He wrote that Dina threw herself at his car on Jan. 4 while he was attempting to drive away from the home. She screamed that he had no right to leave her or the house, Jonah wrote.
“At this point, Dina also began attempting to slap me, again screaming, “You cannot leave me!” Jonah wrote. “I was able to gently nudge her from the car and withdraw from the premises without further incident.”
No charges were filed in either incidents.
On Monday, shortly before 9:30 p.m., Dina and Jonah Shacknai released a joint statement:
While our marriage did not work out as either of us had hoped, it did produce a wonderful son, Max, whom both of us loved very much. His loss is unimaginable. These police reports are not reflective of the totality or the precise details of the events during a difficult time in our marriage that we worked through together. The release of the records as we grieve Max’s recent loss pains us greatly, and we request that the privacy of our family be respected. The unfortunate attention to these records is a distraction from the most important concern of honoring our beautiful son, who lives on in both of our hearts.
Source: Details Shed on Shacknai's Second Divorce | NBC San Diego
Source: Details Shed on Shacknai's Second Divorce | NBC San Diego
There's lots here to comment on, but the part in purple sounds made-up.
What's bothersome apart from the obvious physical abuse, is that someone HAS to be lying. Maybe both. Perhaps the two of them made amends and came to terms with all this, but I'm not quite believing that. Stormy relationship tend to have their periods of bonding also, but it's typically or overall still dysfunctional.
from the statement:
a difficult time in our marriage that we worked through together.
I say BS, they didn't work through a difficult time in their marriage, they got divorced and I imagine that was contentious or at least their problems were not resolved and then they got a divorce, so the statement is misleading. At the most, I'd say they separated and filed while still going at it. Whether things were 'ok' once they didn't live together is not working it out.
I believe it. I can see a woman attack her husband if it is really late at night - he reads a story to the baby - and then says "i'm going out now"...(probably going to see the mistress). I can see a woman going crazy and wanting to get physical with the husband.
Me? I would have said "don't let the door hit you in the back but listen buddy when you get back let's talk divorce -- so make time for me." :rocker:
Wasn't it Jonah claiming she said "You cannot leave me"? What if that is not what she said or she said "You cannot leave" or he just made it up to make her look neurotic/hysterical.
My point is that I don't think these people fought over Rebecca per se. Jonah could have been seeing others or someone else also. Maybe Dina was sick of him leaving everytime they had a fight. Some people do that. Or maybe he left because he knew he might get out of control or she would not stop. Hard to know what the dynamics are between the two of them.
celticthyme
07-28-2011, 11:32 AM
What a beautiful and loving tribute to Rebecca in the funeral video. After seeing this I am more convinced than ever she would be incapable of suicide, mostly because she loved life too much. There are so very few facts about this case, and I think $$ can buy a lot of silence!! Any other situation like this and reporters would be all over it. There has been a literal blackout on her death. Also a blackout on Dina, who is my prime suspect for this murder . . . motive? rage, revenge, anger. Maxxi was her last thread of connection to her former husband. My other thought is that she was dead before she was hung over the balcony, otherwise her head would be very discolored, which it is not in the photos. MOO
GS is tagged in that photo too...body language is interesting, imo. Others are pointing at E, in an effort to promote the 'center of attention' theme, it seems, to me...but not GS. Check her out...and JS, he's not pointing either.
Rebeccas not tagged...
I noticed this before, JS looks like he's posing as the center of attention or like it's a publicity pic - he's not looking at his son?
Wife #1 traded for a much younger model, interesting.
Carrington
07-28-2011, 11:36 AM
I take a stormy divorce as all about money.
He's trying to keep it and she's trying to get a fair shake.
It's about the bottom line at that point.
IMO
Hunnydolll
07-28-2011, 11:43 AM
Hello everyone! I am way behind - still in thread #3 but I notice a post by Pferrin re: police scanner from July 11. Has anyone listened to the police scanner from the 13th? I've pm'd pferrin to ask how to do it, but if anyone else knows how, please let me know! Thanks!!
oceanblueeyes
07-28-2011, 11:44 AM
There's lots here to comment on, but the part in purple sounds made-up.
What's bothersome apart from the obvious physical abuse, is that someone HAS to be lying. Maybe both. Perhaps the two of them made amends and came to terms with all this, but I'm not quite believing that. Stormy relationship tend to have their periods of bonding also, but it's typically or overall still dysfunctional.
from the statement:
I say BS, they didn't work through a difficult time in their marriage, they got divorced and I imagine that was contentious or at least their problems were not resolved and then they got a divorce, so the statement is misleading. At the most, I'd say they separated and filed while still going at it. Whether things were 'ok' once they didn't live together is not working it out.
I don't think it is strange that they worked through their problems. Not all exes seethe with continued anger against the other one and the ones that don't actually have a much healthier attitude imo especially when they have a child or children together. I have heard exes say.....we couldn't be husband and wife but we have learned to be friends now that we are no longer married to each other.
IMO, it is the worst mistake possible for any parents to keep their own vendettas going after a divorce. It is far better if they really love and care about their child's best interest that they lay their animosity for each other aside. If they do not it puts so much needless pressure on the children that have to put up with their parents still being 'at war.' Imo children hate to be caught up in their parents power control issues. It throws them in the middle of a tornado.
The best thing parents can do for their children is to set aside any differences and show their children they can be friends with their daddy or mommy. It leaves the child feeling at ease, loved by both and not having to worry about who they are to show they love and it cuts out the parent from downgrading the other parent too which will backfire on them one day when the child gets older.
So I certainly do think Jonah and Dina could have decide to do the right thing for Max and for themselves too since resentment and anger is just extra baggage that only affects everyone negatively anyway.
I doubt if they were still at odds with each other they would have homes right close to each other. I think they both showed Maxie that they didn't have to be spiteful to each other and showed him constantly that he was their number one priority and they werent about getting some petty revenge either, imo.
IMO
scorekeeper
07-28-2011, 11:46 AM
Very nice tribute of RN with lots of photos of her with friends & family.
Interesting, though, that there are no photos of her with JS or his children.....
unless I missed them.
Perhaps her family didn't have any......or perhaps they were asked not to include them
Very nice tribute of RN with lots of photos of her with friends & family.
Interesting, though, that there are no photos of her with JS or his children.....
unless I missed them.
I was just thinking the same thing.
Paladine
07-28-2011, 11:50 AM
I really can'tbelieve that the parents would be staying round the clock at the hospital. Even the best parents will take turns. My best friends baby boy was born with a liver disfunction. He has had to have 2 liver transplants.
She and her hubby have taken turns at the hospital. Even when he was critically ill and her hubby had to work in another town.she would goto ronald macdonald to rest a little and shower and eat. Noone can be there round the clock day after day. I'd bet ya they took turns.
I was alone in a big city with my husband in ICU for a high level spinal cord injury. It is very stressful by that bed. I did leave once a day, for a few hours, to wash, eat and rest...the nurses seriously encouraged it. Here, ICU nursing is 1 on 1, I knew he was well overseen while I was gone. He, too, was in a coma, they induced it so he wouldn't flail about. He was unconcious and breathing through a trach. He stayed that way for a month...many complications; ICU felt like my home. Finally, after 3 months in ICU, he was sent to the Neuro Observation Unit....for 1 more month, before rehab. I met many parents, sisters, husbands, loved ones visiting...and all of them seemed to leave at some point to eat, sleep and shower. You have to, imo...or you fall apart.
ETA: Although we do not know if Maxie suffered a SCI, I also recall that we were told the first 24-48 seem to tell the tale with spinal cord injury...
peace9274
07-28-2011, 11:50 AM
What a beautiful and loving tribute to Rebecca in the funeral video. After seeing this I am more convinced than ever she would be incapable of suicide, mostly because she loved life too much. There are so very few facts about this case, and I think $$ can buy a lot of silence!! Any other situation like this and reporters would be all over it. There has been a literal blackout on her death. Also a blackout on Dina, who is my prime suspect for this murder . . . motive? rage, revenge, anger. Maxxi was her last thread of connection to her former husband.
My other thought is that she was dead before she was hung over the balcony, otherwise her head would be very discolored, which it is not in the photos. MOO
BBM
I have said the very same thing a few times here.
If she were found close in time to when she was hanged, there
may not be much facial discoloration. But, it definitely looks as
though rigor mortis has set in, which means she was dead for awhile.
http://www.facebook.com/pages/RIP-Rebecca-Zahau/244749242210306?sk=wall
FB RIP Rebecca
Why does that page say "This Woman Was A Millionaire"
Evan's Mom
07-28-2011, 11:57 AM
and that's NOT all that is "frozen" about him .. not by a long shot.
This man is a victim of tragic circumstances. Why do you say that?
Although I tend to believe if Rebecca's death is a murder, and not suicide, I believe the answers will come from someone in Dina's circle. However, I do not believe she would do this herself. I think if she were to, she would take a gun and shoot her, and be done with it. JMO
Who is Dina's sister? Some article a while back (posted) said she was with Dina/at the hospital.
I don't at all believe both of them were there 24/7 in the first place. Secondly, I think they knew all hope was lost within a very short time of Max's fall, they were not sitting vigil.
scorekeeper
07-28-2011, 12:02 PM
I don't think it is strange that they worked through their problems. Not all exes seethe with continued anger against the other one and the ones that don't actually have a much healthier attitude imo especially when they have a child or children together. I have heard exes say.....we couldn't be husband and wife but we have learned to be friends now that we are no longer married to each other.
IMO, it is the worst mistake possible for any parents to keep their own vendettas going after a divorce. It is far better if they really love and care about their child's best interest that they lay their animosity for each other aside. If they do not it puts so much needless pressure on the children that have to put up with their parents still being 'at war.' Imo children hate to be caught up in their parents power control issues. It throws them in the middle of a tornado.
The best thing parents can do for their children is to set aside any differences and show their children they can be friends with their daddy or mommy. It leaves the child feeling at ease, loved by both and not having to worry about who they are to show they love and it cuts out the parent from downgrading the other parent too which will backfire on them one day when the child gets older.
So I certainly do think Jonah and Dina could have decide to do the right thing for Max and for themselves too since resentment and anger is just extra baggage that only affects everyone negatively anyway.
I doubt if they were still at odds with each other they would have homes right close to each other. I think they both showed Maxie that they didn't have to be spiteful to each other and showed him constantly that he was their number one priority and they wernet about getting some petty revenge either, imo.
IMO
Based on all the reports/information released, DS and JS fought like "cats and dogs". Nothing says they didn't continue this behavior, other than the joint statement concerning Maxie; which was mainly done for "damage control".
I can see you are a very kind hearted individual and truly believe that everyone is as "nice" as you are. The world is a better place because of you.
But, I am also a woman that my husband left me for my best friend (and yes we had unresolved issues that probably should have been better addressed) but that doesn't excuse them for their actions and what his cheating did to me and the 2 children..........angry, oh yeah, was and can still get angry at him at the drop of a hat.....but that's not here or there...And yes, I am civil to them in public and concerning the kids; and try real hard to keep my thoughts to myself and my friends and not with the kids...
Just saying, I haven't seen anything that says they are or were best friends after the divorce......and if it is "put out now"; it's all from the spin doctors...
I hope LE gives us some more information soon.....they left us with a "violent" and "bizarre" scene.....
I have never seen any suicide described as 'violent'
oceanblueeyes
07-28-2011, 12:02 PM
This man is a victim of tragic circumstances. Why do you say that?
I remember reading an article about a mom and dad who lost one of their sons to a vehicle accident. His brother was so upset when told about it that he sped to the scene and also had a tragic accident and was killed.
Then we hear quite regularly about someone traveling to a funeral of a loved one only to become victims in a tragic vehicle accident too.
So tragic circumstances sure do happen.
IMO
sdcali
07-28-2011, 12:03 PM
And as far as GS not pointing - I wonder if she was annoyed at her brother for getting all the attention? Did she have a Bat Mitzvah? ES's party was at the "W" Hotel with entertainment and lots of "wow"-factor. Teens can get moody about stuff like that....
I came across ES formspring account and he and his sister did not sound like they liked each other...pretty foul name calling for siblings. I know it could of been done in jest, but it seemed hostile.
I wonder if there is a jealousy issue. Mom dotes on ES and dad's favorite is GS. Dad is at the back of the photo--mom is right next to ES. In that photo, the older woman on the far left is also not pointing or smiling (Grandma?) and there is a another man to the right of RN that seems to be scowling and I can't tell if he is pointing or not.
oceanblueeyes
07-28-2011, 12:05 PM
Based on all the reports/information released, DS and JS fought like "cats and dogs". Nothing says they didn't continue this behavior, other than the joint statement concerning Maxie; which was mainly done for "damage control".
I can see you are a very kind hearted individual and truly believe that everyone is as "nice" as you are. The world is a better place because of you.
But, I am also a woman that my husband left me for my best friend (and yes we had unresolved issues that probably should have been better addressed) but that doesn't excuse them for their actions and what his cheating did to me and the 2 children..........angry, oh yeah, was and can still get angry at him at the drop of a hat.....but that's not here or there...
Just saying, I haven't seen anything that says they are or were best friends after the divorce......and if it is "put out now"; it's all from the spin doctors...
I hope LE gives us some more information soon.....they left us with a "violent" and "bizarre" scene.....
I have never seen any suicide described as 'violent'
The police said there had been no domestic calls in the past three years at either home.
I am a woman who was horribly abused by my first husband. Even landing me in IC for three weeks. He constantly asked me to forgive him. Finally I did and it was the best thing I have ever done for me and for my children. They knew if I could have it in my heart to forgive him then they could learn to forgive him too.
I or my husband of 28 years could call him right now and he would be here if we needed his help. He is not that man he once was and hasn't been in many years.
IMO
Quester
07-28-2011, 12:06 PM
I noticed this before, JS looks like he's posing as the center of attention or like it's a publicity pic - he's not looking at his son?
Wife #1 traded for a much younger model, interesting.
Jumping off your post:
And in that photo, is wife #2 included? Her son, MS is there.
I couldn't find her. Anyone?
<mod snip>
Paladine
07-28-2011, 12:09 PM
What a beautiful and loving tribute to Rebecca in the funeral video. After seeing this I am more convinced than ever she would be incapable of suicide, mostly because she loved life too much. There are so very few facts about this case, and I think $$ can buy a lot of silence!! Any other situation like this and reporters would be all over it. There has been a literal blackout on her death. Also a blackout on Dina, who is my prime suspect for this murder . . . motive? rage, revenge, anger. Maxxi was her last thread of connection to her former husband. My other thought is that she was dead before she was hung over the balcony, otherwise her head would be very discolored, which it is not in the photos. MOO
RBBM
Absolutely, imo...I PRAY the Family gets a second autopsy...
scorekeeper
07-28-2011, 12:15 PM
RBBM
Absolutely, imo...I PRAY the Family gets a second autopsy...
Hope so too. But wasn't she cremated, so they would have had to request that before RN's body/remains were released. They haven't mentioned their request in any of the reports....
Quester
07-28-2011, 12:23 PM
For someone who had the mastery to build a highly successful pharma company from scratch and who ascribed to feng shui, the importance of physical fitness, seemingly religious, etc, in his personal life, JS sure has created a lot of confusion (multiple marriages, children from different mothers), drama (alleged/rumored infidelity, police reports re: marital issues, abuse), and anger (messy, lengthy divorces and contested child custody) in his wake.
IF DS is responsible for RN’s demise, JS has most certainly played a very large role in causing the perfect storm.
Paladine
07-28-2011, 12:25 PM
Hope so too. But wasn't she cremated, so they would have had to request that before RN's body/remains were released. They haven't mentioned their request in any of the reports....
This is depressing...they probably just trusted the system to do it's job...imo.
scorekeeper
07-28-2011, 12:26 PM
I came across ES formspring account and he and his sister did not sound like they liked each other...pretty foul name calling for siblings. I know it could of been done in jest, but it seemed hostile.
I wonder if there is a jealousy issue. Mom dotes on ES and dad's favorite is GS. Dad is at the back of the photo--mom is right next to ES. In that photo, the older woman on the far left is also not pointing or smiling (Grandma?) and there is a another man to the right of RN that seems to be scowling and I can't tell if he is pointing or not.
Jealousy is pretty much a learned behavior. Produced from parents having or playing "favorites".
Makes you wonder about AS and JS; could AS have been jealous of JS...did JS want "AS" to make something of himself? Even though perhaps AS may be the happiest in the family....content with his simple life...
pferrin
07-28-2011, 12:37 PM
Zahau was at home with another woman, whom authorities won't identify, when Max fell down the stairs last Monday, Coronado Police Chief Louis
They seem to be going in the house interrogating some people," one neighbor told 10News. "Twenty minutes later, they brought two women put them in squad car [and] took them away."
http://www.10news.com/news/28534601/detail.html
Finally found it. I was questioning whetherthey were nude or not.
The record is sealed as is the 911 call.
It's unclear what happened to the women.
Thank you for answering...No one was bound that day..I listened to dispatch tapes for that time..I listed findings in last thread.
The 911 caller initially hysterical..gave addy of 1040 ocean not 1043
Dispatch sent fire rescue and police to home at 10:10am RN was doing cpr till rescue arrived
No one bound and no nudity.
Both females RN and GS were taken by police to hospital (am assuming sharps coronado)..since it has ER and is closest. JS had been called and beat them to hospital..the females met with JS there. By 11:00 am ..around that time. Maxie was transported to childrens hospital. no bound or nude women there either. JS followed rescue to childrens . RN and GS were taken by police back to home on ocean. I am positive GS was still freaking out..am sure her father did Not want her any more traumatized than she already was.
Need to add..the police went to ave g to notify dina many times between 10:10 anf 1:00..they called many phone numbers..no luck..I stopped listening at the 1:00 mark.
The only mention of a bound nude woman is rebeccas homicide(IMO). I really believe Tom the Accountant..drinks way too much scotch in the mornings..he has blurred all events into one. JMHO
I don't think it is strange that they worked through their problems. Not all exes seethe with continued anger against the other one and the ones that don't actually have a much healthier attitude imo especially when they have a child or children together. I have heard exes say.....we couldn't be husband and wife but we have learned to be friends now that we are no longer married to each other.
IMO, it is the worst mistake possible for any parents to keep their own vendettas going after a divorce. It is far better if they really love and care about their child's best interest that they lay their animosity for each other aside. If they do not it puts so much needless pressure on the children that have to put up with their parents still being 'at war.' Imo children hate to be caught up in their parents power control issues. It throws them in the middle of a tornado.
The best thing parents can do for their children is to set aside any differences and show their children they can be friends with their daddy or mommy. It leaves the child feeling at ease, loved by both and not having to worry about who they are to show they love and it cuts out the parent from downgrading the other parent too which will backfire on them one day when the child gets older.
So I certainly do think Jonah and Dina could have decide to do the right thing for Max and for themselves too since resentment and anger is just extra baggage that only affects everyone negatively anyway.
I doubt if they were still at odds with each other they would have homes right close to each other. I think they both showed Maxie that they didn't have to be spiteful to each other and showed him constantly that he was their number one priority and they werent about getting some petty revenge either, imo.
IMO
Ocean ... I agree with limitations. I have seen a lot of nasty divorces, but they don't get physically violent and involve that many police calls. I believe some of these calls were a year apart? I'd have to recheck.
I don't know about getting revenge on each other, but I think far more nasty divorces end because of space/distance and time spent together being the factor that keeps people from engaging with such anger. The $$ are also finally settled one way or the other. That and others coming into their lives (having said that, I never heard Dina had a new partner/significant other).
I think people who are so dysfunctional together that big harry shouting matches and physical violence recurs probably maintain feelings of love/hate relationship. The relationship doesn't get healthy just because you are split, it just calms down.
~n/t~
07-28-2011, 12:42 PM
I would like to see the photos the teens took, cause you know they did.
Maybe I don't want to see them, but they would be a lot clearer than what we are trying to work with.
IMO
The teens on the roof took photos? :eek:
sdcali
07-28-2011, 12:44 PM
Who is Dina's sister? Some article a while back (posted) said she was with Dina/at the hospital.
I don't at all believe both of them were there 24/7 in the first place. Secondly, I think they knew all hope was lost within a very short time of Max's fall, they were not sitting vigil.
Her name is Nina. I found an obit of their father in 2003 and it listed his two daughters, nina and dina and husbands and GS and ES (max was not born yet)
Jumping off your post:
And in that photo, is wife #2 included? Her son, MS is there.
I couldn't find her. Anyone?
<mod snip>
I wasn't sure if that dark, long haired woman on the left was her? Looks too young, but then again their product use+ is pretty apparent.
~n/t~
07-28-2011, 12:45 PM
No, I didn't say it was common (like taking an overdose of drugs) but it does happen. Females do hang themselves.
What is rare is to do it publicly in a wide open area outside of a dwelling to be exposed to anyone and everyone who may come across the body. So if she had done these same things inside the mansion... like say for intstance......hanging from a light fixture or some overhead beam in a room somewhere then that would be more common, imo. Even being naked when doing so.
But by hanging herself over an outside balcony for everyone to see her naked and hung just seems more like what a murderer would do than a female that was wanting to hang herself. The ceilings in the mansion were certainly high enough to achieve that inside the home just by putting the rope around a light fixture and standing on a chair and pushing the chair out from under her with her feet.
So the exposure to the 'world' does seem more like a murder than a suicide. So if she was murdered why would they make the suicide look more like a murder than a suicide ? That is my point.
It is how she was found hanging from the outside balcony naked that makes many people think it was murder and the reason imo why LE says it was a violent and suspicious death.
imo
ok gotcha! Thanks:seeya:
gngr~snap
07-28-2011, 12:48 PM
BBM
I have said the very same thing a few times here.
If she were found close in time to when she was hanged, there
may not be much facial discoloration. But, it definitely looks as
though rigor mortis has set in, which means she was dead for awhile.
You may be right. She may have been dead already.
Usually in suicide by hanging (where the airwat was cut off not allowing oxygen to the brain) you would only see black/dark hands and feet. Maybe a little discoloration around the mouth.
The blood is pulled by gravity.Their faces are still flesh tone.
Not that anyone wants to see but for those with a morbid curiosity...
about suicide by hanging *photos google it and go to images.
I have a link if anyone wants to see not photoshopped/fake pics.
(they are black and white):waitasec: I think
Black faces come from traumatic hangings where blood vessels or arteries are broken. This can happen due to jumping or the sheer weight of the person.
IMO she was murdered already dead before the staging was done.
She was hogtied, layed in the grass while a table was located, the rope was tied and toessed toward the ground in the dark. the french doors were shut. When trying to retrieve the rope from the balcony to set the scene the old table broke.- so 911 was called and told of the "intended" scenario as instructed by ?whomever? to get their payday.
The media HAD to say she commited suicide in the nude by hanging herself.
The mnasion did not have security cameras but it might have had a security system. Looks like a sign in the grass by the front door. If it was set that night
makes me think she knew her attacker. -well that and how violent police said it was.
Bonepile
07-28-2011, 12:51 PM
I have been checking the websites of the six St. Joseph Missouri funeral homes for this listing for days now and finally it appeared ... http://www.meierhoffer.com/obituaries/rebecca-m-zahau-2/ as noted earlier this morning ... Notice if you click her name under interments you get the following information:
Deceased: Rebecca M. Zahau
Funeral Home: Meierhoffer Funeral Home & Crematory
Interment Date: July 23, 2011
Reference #: 31,913
Cemetery: St. Joseph Memorial Park Cemetery
which lists the date of interment (last Saturday) and the home's reference number is the cemetery reference number as they run in sequence if buried at St. Joseph's Park, and also the cemetery where she is buried which is the same. She may have been cremated since they do provide that service.
This is a little more documentation than the obituary lists.
The police said there had been no domestic calls in the past three years at either home.
I am a woman who was horribly abused by my first husband. Even landing me in IC for three weeks. He constantly asked me to forgive him. Finally I did and it was the best thing I have ever done for me and for my children. They knew if I could have it in my heart to forgive him then they could learn to forgive him too.
I or my husband of 28 years could call him right now and he would be here if we needed his help. He is not that man he once was and hasn't been in many years.
IMO
Good for you ... but forgiveness doesn't mean you have to have further contact with someone (except maybe for kids). And, I do NOT think ex's have to be friends or even that it's typically a good idea. Or even friendly. Congenial and cooperative, yes. The kids need stability. Sometimes being too friendly with each other and not disengaging makes kids think you are getting back together also and confuses them. If they are old enough to know or remember the two of you having knock down drag out fights then becoming friends might make them think these these are normal.
Also, I believe there was a call in 2009 for the Shacknais. The 3 years was in Coronado not in Arizona.
Morag
07-28-2011, 12:56 PM
The thing that strikes me about the marital quarrelling and violence is that JS is over 50 years old. I can understand younger people acting this way, but a man well into middle age? I wonder what the age difference is between DS and JS?
askfornina
07-28-2011, 01:04 PM
i may be in the minority here but i really don't think the shacknai's (JS or DS) are involved. they supposedly have good alibis, and i really don't think there was enough time for them to process their son's (eventual) death plus plot a murder. i don't think it's fair to point to two people's relationship trouble to paint a picture of what kind of people they are. that is only a small snippet of their actual lives.
this thread seems to have a lot of assumptions in it, which i completely understand, and i don't want to belittle anyone's opinion. i understand the need to speculate, but i really don't think it's fair to paint ugly pictures just yet. hopefully we find out what really happened.
Just documenting a recent post.
http://phoenixfamilylawnews.com/2011/07/history-of-domestic-violence-alleged-between-jonah-shacknai-ex-wife.html
ex-wife filed domestic violence reports in 2008 and 2009
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2011-07-27-mansion-woman-hang_n.htm
police responded to two domestic disturbances in 2008 and 2009
http://abcnews.go.com/US/coronado-mansion-mystery-15-detectives-zahaus-personal-trainer/story?id=14124073
In January 2009, Dina Shacknai accused her husband of elbowing her in the breast
pferrin
07-28-2011, 01:08 PM
:tyou:For someone who had the mastery to build a highly successful pharma company from scratch and who ascribed to feng shui, the importance of physical fitness, seemingly religious, etc, in his personal life, JS sure has created a lot of confusion (multiple marriages, children from different mothers), drama (alleged/rumored infidelity, police reports re: marital issues, abuse), and anger (messy, lengthy divorces and contested child custody) in his wake.
IF DS is responsible for RN’s demise, JS has most certainly played a very large role in causing the perfect storm.
I do believe this was the perfect storm. Thanks for your insight.
i may be in the minority here but i really don't think the shacknai's (JS or DS) are involved. they supposedly have good alibis, and i really don't think there was enough time for them to process their son's (eventual) death plus plot a murder. i don't think it's fair to point to two people's relationship trouble to paint a picture of what kind of people they are. that is only a small snippet of their actual lives.
this thread seems to have a lot of assumptions in it, which i completely understand, and i don't want to belittle anyone's opinion. i understand the need to speculate, but i really don't think it's fair to paint ugly pictures just yet. hopefully we find out what really happened.
Their alibis have not been verified.
I disagree on the relationship problems - most people do not engage in this kind of behavior and have multiple calls to the police when they are having a rough spot in their marriage or ending the marriage. Their behavior is over the top and it seems they wasted precious police resources instead of even realizing they needed to split much earlier. A couple of things relate to the child also - the bed wetting argument between the two and the reading a story then leaving the house incident. These people got physical with each other. It's relevant.
Paladine
07-28-2011, 01:20 PM
Thank you for answering...No one was bound that day..I listened to dispatch tapes for that time..I listed findings in last thread.
The 911 caller initially hysterical..gave addy of 1040 ocean not 1043
Dispatch sent fire rescue and police to home at 10:10am RN was doing cpr till rescue arrived
No one bound and no nudity.
Both females RN and GS were taken by police to hospital (am assuming sharps coronado)..since it has ER and is closest. JS had been called and beat them to hospital..the females met with JS there. By 11:00 am ..around that time. Maxie was transported to childrens hospital. no bound or nude women there either. JS followed rescue to childrens . RN and GS were taken by police back to home on ocean. I am positive GS was still freaking out..am sure her father did Not want her any more traumatized than she already was.
Need to add..the police went to ave g to notify dina many times between 10:10 anf 1:00..they called many phone numbers..no luck..I stopped listening at the 1:00 mark.
The only mention of a bound nude woman is rebeccas homicide(IMO). I really believe Tom the Accountant..drinks way too much scotch in the mornings..he has blurred all events into one. JMHO
Gotta say, what great posts you write, pferrin. You research and put so much time into this, and THEN share all your info with us. THANKS. ALOT.
askfornina
07-28-2011, 01:22 PM
Their alibis have not been verified.
I disagree on the relationship problems - most people do not engage in this kind of behavior and have multiple calls to the police when they are having a rough spot in their marriage or ending the marriage. Their behavior is over the top and it seems they wasted precious police resources instead of even realizing they needed to split much earlier. A couple of things relate to the child also - the bed wetting argument between the two and the reading a story then leaving the house incident. These people got physical with each other. It's relevant.
hey, i'm not trying to discount anyone's opinion here. all i'm saying is we just don't know enough. their alibis have not been verified by US, none of us know if their alibis have been verified by LE.
i'm not saying it's irrelevant, i'm just saying just because two people fought each other, it doesn't mean one or both of them are murderers. i understand JS and DS are still plausible suspects, but i would really hate to see legitimately grieving people wrongly accused in the court of public opinion based on very little, no matter how ugly their past behavior had been.
i know all of you guys have the right to speculate and i hope i don't come off as rude or anything, and i enjoy reading all of your posts, i just wanted to state my opinion
gngr~snap
07-28-2011, 01:24 PM
Thank you for answering...No one was bound that day..I listened to dispatch tapes for that time..I listed findings in last thread.
The 911 caller initially hysterical..gave addy of 1040 ocean not 1043
Dispatch sent fire rescue and police to home at 10:10am RN was doing cpr till rescue arrived
No one bound and no nudity.
Both females RN and GS were taken by police to hospital (am assuming sharps coronado)..since it has ER and is closest. JS had been called and beat them to hospital..the females met with JS there. By 11:00 am ..around that time. Maxie was transported to childrens hospital. no bound or nude women there either. JS followed rescue to childrens . RN and GS were taken by police back to home on ocean. I am positive GS was still freaking out..am sure her father did Not want her any more traumatized than she already was.
Need to add..the police went to ave g to notify dina many times between 10:10 anf 1:00..they called many phone numbers..no luck..I stopped listening at the 1:00 mark.
The only mention of a bound nude woman is rebeccas homicide(IMO). I really believe Tom the Accountant..drinks way too much scotch in the mornings..he has blurred all events into one. JMHO lol! Thank you!
DS... I wonder where she was. Did you hear anything about her car being there and them running her plate?
Wasn't there a disturbance also reported at her house that same morning that MS was injured?
According to a report from local CBS 8 affiliate, neighbors reported a ‘police disturbance’ at Dina Shacknai’s home on the day of Max’s accident. Missing from the report, when the ‘disturbance’ occurred?
Back to July 11, the date of 6-yr-old Max Stacknai’s accident. Down the street, the location of Dina Stacknai’s home. Dina Stacknai, the estranged wife of Jonah Stacknai, mother of 6-yr-old Max.
According to a report from local CBS 8 affiliate, neighbors reported a ‘police disturbance’ at Dina Shacknai’s home on the day of Max’s accident. Missing from the report, when the ‘disturbance’ occurred?
Wed July 13 2001
***They found a woman “in distress” and called in paramedics to administer aid, but the woman was pronounced dead sounds like she was still alive to me.
The San Diego Sheriff’s Department said Tuesday that it is looking into the “possibility other people may have been staying inside the house” the night before Zahau died.”
The San Diego Sheriff’s Department said Tuesday that it is looking into the “possibility other people may have been staying inside the house” the night before Zahau died.”
http://www.uncoverage.net/2011/07/2-mysterious-deaths-at-millionaire-democrats-san-diego-home-raise-more-questions/#more-72154
Originally Posted by Quester http://www.websleuths.com/forums/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=6961966#post6961966)
For someone who had the mastery to build a highly successful pharma company from scratch and who ascribed to feng shui, the importance of physical fitness, seemingly religious, etc, in his personal life, JS sure has created a lot of confusion (multiple marriages, children from different mothers), drama (alleged/rumored infidelity, police reports re: marital issues, abuse), and anger (messy, lengthy divorces and contested child custody) in his wake.
IF DS is responsible for RN’s demise, JS has most certainly played a very large role in causing the perfect storm
Excellent post.
lol! Thank you!
DS... I wonder where she was. Did you hear anything about her car being there and them running her plate?
Wasn't there a disturbance also reported at her house that same morning that MS was injured?
According to a report from local CBS 8 affiliate, neighbors reported a ‘police disturbance’ at Dina Shacknai’s home on the day of Max’s accident. Missing from the report, when the ‘disturbance’ occurred?
<snip>
The San Diego Sheriff’s Department said Tuesday that it is looking into the “possibility other people may have been staying inside the house” the night before Zahau died.”
The San Diego Sheriff’s Department said Tuesday that it is looking into the “possibility other people may have been staying inside the house” the night before Zahau died.”
http://www.uncoverage.net/2011/07/2-mysterious-deaths-at-millionaire-democrats-san-diego-home-raise-more-questions/#more-72154
Thanks for bringing that up. Not sure if anything came up from the radio calls (earlier posts someone listened to).
Interesting also since those radio reports said they couldn't find DS for hours after Max's accident.
And "“possibility other people may have been staying inside the house” the night before Zahau died.” is also still an unknown, huh?
(we may have determined that 'in distress' is used until they verify the victim is dead no matter what the case)
pferrin
07-28-2011, 01:35 PM
I am one of 6 children..am the youngest..all have been adults for many years. My oldest brother and I went to yard sales a few weeks back. I found a great veggie knife for 25 cents. He drug us all over creation trying to find a better knife than I had found. Our rivalry runs deep..it will always be there. We have learned to enjoy it and make it game-
like.
He is the one that worked as an ME for years...so when I ask him questions about dying..he teases me about looking for the best way to off him. I love sibling rivalry.
I listened to all police calls for the nite of 12th and 13th for coronado and could not find anything about noise...except 1 call about 10:00 approx of 4 kids at spreckel park whooping it up. police sent kids home. I listened from 10:00pm calls to 3:30am calls. The only other call on beachside that I found was a vagrant at the 400 block of ocean..I think this was about 1:00am..cant remember exact time. I will verify today.
scorekeeper
07-28-2011, 01:42 PM
i may be in the minority here but i really don't think the shacknai's (JS or DS) are involved. they supposedly have good alibis, and i really don't think there was enough time for them to process their son's (eventual) death plus plot a murder. i don't think it's fair to point to two people's relationship trouble to paint a picture of what kind of people they are. that is only a small snippet of their actual lives.
this thread seems to have a lot of assumptions in it, which i completely understand, and i don't want to belittle anyone's opinion. i understand the need to speculate, but i really don't think it's fair to paint ugly pictures just yet. hopefully we find out what really happened.
askfornina,
Don't you just love WS? It is a great place to gather the facts (we all try to post MSM sites for our writings). The initial information released on the "accident" involving Maxie and the "death" of RN has left us with trying to "piece together" what may have happened. The only players we have so far are DS, AS and JS. There have been rumors of others possibly at the mansion, but not confirmed by LE. We know that there was a 13/14 year female there when Maxie had his accident but I don't think LE has confirm whom it was....
I believe we are all speculating......that's what we do here. We do not sleuth those that haven't been mentioned by MSM.
With any crime, the less LE shares, the more we speculate.
I so much enjoy reading everyone's opinions and theories, yours included!!:seeya:
pferrin
07-28-2011, 01:47 PM
lol! Thank you!
DS... I wonder where she was. Did you hear anything about her car being there and them running her plate?
Wasn't there a disturbance also reported at her house that same morning that MS was injured?
According to a report from local CBS 8 affiliate, neighbors reported a ‘police disturbance’ at Dina Shacknai’s home on the day of Max’s accident. Missing from the report, when the ‘disturbance’ occurred?
Back to July 11, the date of 6-yr-old Max Stacknai’s accident. Down the street, the location of Dina Stacknai’s home. Dina Stacknai, the estranged wife of Jonah Stacknai, mother of 6-yr-old Max.
According to a report from local CBS 8 affiliate, neighbors reported a ‘police disturbance’ at Dina Shacknai’s home on the day of Max’s accident. Missing from the report, when the ‘disturbance’ occurred?
Wed July 13 2001
***They found a woman “in distress” and called in paramedics to administer aid, but the woman was pronounced dead sounds like she was still alive to me.
The San Diego Sheriff’s Department said Tuesday that it is looking into the “possibility other people may have been staying inside the house” the night before Zahau died.”
The San Diego Sheriff’s Department said Tuesday that it is looking into the “possibility other people may have been staying inside the house” the night before Zahau died.”
http://www.uncoverage.net/2011/07/2-mysterious-deaths-at-millionaire-democrats-san-diego-home-raise-more-questions/#more-72154
Hey sugar..yes the police said her car was home and they did run her plates..they even asked neighbors. The disturbance..I believe..was the neighbors at JS house seeing the rescue pick up Maxie and then taking RN and GS to the ER behind the ambulance. The police never indicated a disturbance nor did dispatch. So if the neighbors said there was a disturbance to media ..IMO it was rescue and police there because of Maxies fall.Not 2 women fighting.
I have looked at hospitals on maps ..closest to JS home is about 10 blocks away..there is a golf course next to it. JS made it to hospital very quickly..so he was only a few blocks from hospital. all of this is very close..IMO
justbetweenus
07-28-2011, 01:49 PM
Of the six funeral homes in St. Joseph Missouri here is the obit from the Funeral Home that handled her remains and her service ... Including a VIDEO TRIBUTE ... http://www.meierhoffer.com/obituaries/rebecca-m-zahau-2/ ... and if that video does not bring you to tears nothing ever will. :(
That was very nice. Thanks for sharing. She did like her blue eyeshadow. Something made me think while watching the tribute, what if she was pregnant when she died. Just adding more rumour lol.
pferrin
07-28-2011, 01:51 PM
I need to add..childrens hospital is not that close to JS home on ocean..Maybe he stayed in a hotel by the hospital. I did this at times when hubby was ill.
gngr~snap
07-28-2011, 01:52 PM
Ms. Nalepa was originally born Myanmar, also known as Burma, and attended a Christian bible college in Austria, before emigrating to the United States. A friend confided to a reporter at KNSD-TV that, because of her religious beliefs, it is highly unlikely that Rebecca would commit suicide.
IMO no reason to "seal" an autopsy if suicide os the manner of death either.
It sounds to me like she was "hushed" which is a little obvious if max didn't "have an accident.
Calling the kennel does sound like maybe she and her dog were threatened?
So she boarded it for safety until tempers cooled?
I shall keep digging!
Where did max sleep Sunday night? At dad's house?
jstwondering
07-28-2011, 02:04 PM
I doubt if they were still at odds with each other they would have homes right close to each other. I think they both showed Maxie that they didn't have to be spiteful to each other and showed him constantly that he was their number one priority and they werent about getting some petty revenge either, imo.
IMO
snipped by me...
I think that they could have put their animosity behind them, and agree that this would have been the best thing for the little boy. But, in my opinion, there was probably still anger beneath the surface, and it could have just kept growing. I think they had houses close to each other so mom could be near MS when Dad had custody. What sometimes happens is that the child becomes the jilted parent's whole world, not because of his money, but because she genuinely loved her son.
I also think that DS is a jerk who has no respect for people once he is "done" with them. He was done with wife #2, and hence had "dismissed" her. This had to hurt tremendously, and although she could put these feelings of resentment aside when things were going ok, it would be very difficult to put it aside if her whole world just ended with the injury of her son.
scorekeeper
07-28-2011, 02:06 PM
July 11, 2011 - Maxie "accident"
July 13, 2011 - RN found
July 14, 2011 - RN autopsy complete
July 17, 2011 - announcement of Maxie's passing made
http://news.lalate.com/2011/07/15/rebecca-nalepa-case-sealed-rebecca-zahau-autopsy-completed/
While those results were completed, police officials tell news that no details of the case will be released to the news media. The entire case is tonight under seal.
“Unique”, “bizarre”, and “pretty suspicious” are among the words used by Tim Curran from S.D. County Sheriff’s Department in describing the death. But tonight, that same officers report that no details of the autopsy will be released to members of the news. Moreover, search warrants and similar matters remain under seal.
Today is two weeks since RN's autopsy. I can't find the quote but I thought that LE was putting a "rush" on toxicology and forensic evidence/reports. :banghead::banghead:
So, all we can do is speculate.
BBM - with words like that - leads me to HOMICIDE
lauriej
07-28-2011, 02:09 PM
http://www.10news.com/news/28689113/detail.html
Forensic Expert Discusses Coronado Death Investigation
--snipped----
The deaths that occurred at a Coronado mansion two weeks ago have not only grabbed the attention of San Diego but the attention of experts such as Dr. Werner Spitz.
Spitz, who was in San Diego to testify in another case, spoke with 10News about Max Shacknai's fall down the grand staircase at his father's mansion and the mysterious death of his father's girlfriend, Rebecca Zahau, two days later.
"You have to consider them as one incident…not one body, one occurrence… and solve it together," said Spitz.
"Could it be that the head injury was not from a fall?" said Spitz. "Perhaps this is all an argument where the dead person cannot talk. But you know, the dead person can talk by telling the medical examiner what really happened."
lauriej
07-28-2011, 02:13 PM
Wed July 13 2001
***They found a woman “in distress” and called in paramedics to administer aid, but the woman was pronounced dead sounds like she was still alive to me.
BBM
..At the press conf.Tim Curran of the sheriff's dept. announced that they found a woman who was deceased,it's my opinion that some news articles mistakenly heard 'distress' and went with that.
justbetweenus
07-28-2011, 02:18 PM
BBM
..At the press conf.Tim Curran of the sheriff's dept. announced that they found a woman who was deceased,it's my opinion that some news articles mistakenly heard 'distress' and went with that.
I agree with you. I took from Tim's words that she was deceased when found, but said they gave medical aid anyway, because it was routinely done.
Lawgirl
07-28-2011, 02:21 PM
:tyou:
I do believe this was the perfect storm. Thanks for your insight.
Great insight.
Quester
07-28-2011, 02:22 PM
[Continuing to pick at parts since we have no new info (except for pferrin’s fabulous sleuthing!)]
Despite the fact that the following quoted statement made by DS about JS is shockingly revealing about DS’ fear of JS, the statement is much more telling about DS’ perceptions with regard to JS.
IMO, it implies that DS views this ongoing tumultuous relationship as a battle of life and death.
[I know: dramatic, soap opera-ish but shreds of truth?]
"I feel scared of what he is capable of doing to me physically via the dog as well as the lengths he will go to try to destroy me in any way he was able to do so."
Article Posted: Jul 18, 2011 5:46 PM PDT Updated: Jul 19, 2011 5:39 PM PDT
http://www.cbs8.com/story/15103319/reports-allege-history-of-domestic-violence-in-shacknai-home?clienttype=printable
pferrin
07-28-2011, 02:22 PM
Wed July 13 2001
***They found a woman “in distress” and called in paramedics to administer aid, but the woman was pronounced dead sounds like she was still alive to me.
The police arrived first to scene..fire rescue came and she was deceased. Many times they will say in distress to describe scene. Hanging victim for example..Hubby was a paramedic (may he RIP)..if this woman was clinging to life or drawing a last breath..she would have been transported to hospital. She had to be completely dead for paramedics not to transport her..by that I mean cold..very cold.
AnaTeresa
07-28-2011, 02:25 PM
I know people are not too enamored with Dr. Spitz because of that trial-that-shall-not-be-named, but I got a chance to sit in on a conference call when the attorneys in my office consulted with him on a case not too long ago. He's very intelligent, although his manner of expressing himself can be confusing. I'd put a lot of stock in his opinion if he looked over medical/autopsy records for me.
He's got a point that you've got to look at everything together, although I don't think any of the talking heads can truly say unless they have access to all the medical records.
pferrin
07-28-2011, 02:26 PM
July 11, 2011 - Maxie "accident"
July 13, 2011 - RN found
July 14, 2011 - RN autopsy complete
July 17, 2011 - announcement of Maxie's passing made
http://news.lalate.com/2011/07/15/rebecca-nalepa-case-sealed-rebecca-zahau-autopsy-completed/
While those results were completed, police officials tell news that no details of the case will be released to the news media. The entire case is tonight under seal.
“Unique”, “bizarre”, and “pretty suspicious” are among the words used by Tim Curran from S.D. County Sheriff’s Department in describing the death. But tonight, that same officers report that no details of the autopsy will be released to members of the news. Moreover, search warrants and similar matters remain under seal.
Today is two weeks since RN's autopsy. I can't find the quote but I thought that LE was putting a "rush" on toxicology and forensic evidence/reports. :banghead::banghead:
So, all we can do is speculate.
BBM - with words like that - leads me to HOMICIDE
Hi scorekeeper..I agree with ya..I asked my brother why so long..tox reports take awhile even with a rush and he said that police sometimes want to let killer sweat. The more data they get now..the better off they will be once they arrest suspect.
scorekeeper
07-28-2011, 02:34 PM
http://www.10news.com/news/28689113/detail.html
Forensic Expert Discusses Coronado Death Investigation
--snipped----
The deaths that occurred at a Coronado mansion two weeks ago have not only grabbed the attention of San Diego but the attention of experts such as Dr. Werner Spitz.
Spitz, who was in San Diego to testify in another case, spoke with 10News about Max Shacknai's fall down the grand staircase at his father's mansion and the mysterious death of his father's girlfriend, Rebecca Zahau, two days later.
"You have to consider them as one incident…not one body, one occurrence… and solve it together," said Spitz.
"Could it be that the head injury was not from a fall?" said Spitz. "Perhaps this is all an argument where the dead person cannot talk. But you know, the dead person can talk by telling the medical examiner what really happened."
Oh, I really thought he would retire after his appearance in Florida........I'll leave it at that......:waitasec:
Quester
07-28-2011, 02:34 PM
http://www.10news.com/news/28689113/detail.html
Forensic Expert Discusses Coronado Death Investigation
--snipped----
The deaths that occurred at a Coronado mansion two weeks ago have not only grabbed the attention of San Diego but the attention of experts such as Dr. Werner Spitz.
Spitz, who was in San Diego to testify in another case, spoke with 10News about Max Shacknai's fall down the grand staircase at his father's mansion and the mysterious death of his father's girlfriend, Rebecca Zahau, two days later.
"You have to consider them as one incident…not one body, one occurrence… and solve it together," said Spitz.
"Could it be that the head injury was not from a fall?" said Spitz. "Perhaps this is all an argument where the dead person cannot talk. But you know, the dead person can talk by telling the medical examiner what really happened."
Hmmmmm ....... Is somebody already publicly setting up their defense?
Namely: Not guilty of murder due to temporary insanity as a result of RN having murdered the boy.
Paladine
07-28-2011, 02:42 PM
Their alibis have not been verified.
I disagree on the relationship problems - most people do not engage in this kind of behavior and have multiple calls to the police when they are having a rough spot in their marriage or ending the marriage. Their behavior is over the top and it seems they wasted precious police resources instead of even realizing they needed to split much earlier. A couple of things relate to the child also - the bed wetting argument between the two and the reading a story then leaving the house incident. These people got physical with each other. It's relevant.
Agreed, it's relevant, imo. The bedwetting argument really disturbed me as a Mom. What was that about? How do 2 people argue over a childs bedwetting? Did he blame her for not doing something? Did the child have bad nerves? Did someone expect perfection? May be a million other things but it sat funny with me...
scorekeeper
07-28-2011, 02:42 PM
Hi scorekeeper..I agree with ya..I asked my brother why so long..tox reports take awhile even with a rush and he said that police sometimes want to let killer sweat. The more data they get now..the better off they will be once they arrest suspect.
pferrin,
Love your brother!! :blushing: :loveyou:
score
(seriously, please tell him thanks!!)
askfornina
07-28-2011, 02:43 PM
Hmmmmm ....... Is somebody already publicly setting up their defense?
Namely: Not guilty of murder due to temporary insanity as a result of RN having murdered the boy.
hmm..not sure what you are suggesting with this post, could you elaborate?
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