View Full Version : Conrad Murray trial -Day three.
Soulmagent
09-29-2011, 09:59 AM
I went in seach on new links due to yesterdays links not working. I am hoping these will but I have no way to tell until the trial starts so if anyone has a link please add it ,one can never have to many.
Moble phone app download links for phone or other gadget trial veiwing.
http://www.myfoxphoenix.com/dpps/news/justice/conrad-murray-michael-jackson-doctor-trial-app_15219744
Link to link to live links. The link comes up at the start of the video feed.Until then I think most sites play rerun stuff and some change the URL so you might have to look over the pages to find the new url. I will double check to see if there is a direct once the trial starts and I get a chance to get online.
http://newstaar.com/watch-streaming-live-video-dr-conrad-murray-trial-in-michael-jackson-doctor-case-%e2%80%93-opening-statement-as-trial-begins-today/354326/
http://www.click2houston.com/video/29313639/index.html
http://www.cnn.com/video/
http://majicatl.com/videos/majicatl/watch-the-conrad-murray-michael-jackson-death-trial-here-live-stream/
weedemout
09-29-2011, 11:27 AM
Is there anywhere online to read each days court transcripts?
Thundar
09-29-2011, 11:42 AM
This one is working. No audio yet, but showing people arriving outside the courthouse.
http://www.cnn.com/video/flashLive/live.html?stream=1
Thundar
09-29-2011, 11:44 AM
Is there anywhere online to read each days court transcripts?
I saw on HLN last night that they have all the testimony archived online like they did for the Casey Anthony trial. I think it's hln.com/michaeljackson if I remember correctly, don't know if they have written transcripts or just video.
Thundar
09-29-2011, 11:47 AM
Here we go, Alberto Alverez is up.
Melanie
09-29-2011, 11:47 AM
http://www.tmz.com/
Good link and sound for the trial (no commercials).
I do like this judge :) After watching him the last couple of days, he runs a tight ship, and is SO clear and concise. I love the way he talks to the witnesses.
Mel
Thundar
09-29-2011, 11:51 AM
He was in charge of Logistics. At hotels, concerts, and shopping. For shopping he would go ahead and make sure the stores had whatever it was Michael might want, then he traveled with Michael when he went back to shop for whatever.
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 11:57 AM
http://www.tmz.com/
Good link and sound for the trial (no commercials).
I do like this judge :) After watching him the last couple of days, he runs a tight ship, and is SO clear and concise. I love the way he talks to the witnesses.
Mel
Great control and mannerisms.
Thundar
09-29-2011, 11:58 AM
House security was in charge of the oxygen tanks. Sometimes Dr. Murray came into the security trailer with empties and took full ones. I guess it wasn't just the children and chef that carried around the oxygen tanks. Now they are talking about the night before he died. At the practice arena. MJ had a green room there that this guy had to make sure was set at a certain temperature.
21merc7
09-29-2011, 12:00 PM
I don't like to say this, but Dr. Murray does not have a great demeanor. He really should not roll his eyes when the Judge is talking. He did that when the Judge was talking to the witness explaining when to answer and not to say uh-huh - un-unh.
Thundar
09-29-2011, 12:01 PM
MJ would arrive in a car, get into a golf cart, and go into his green room. The golf cart was left outside the green room in case MJ wanted to leave. The security and logistic guys had a break room at the arena to go to. When he dropped MJ off at the green room, he was posted at the back of the stage when MJ was rehearsing. The back of the stage was behind a garage door from which MJ entered and exited. This guy couldn't see much of the rehearsal because the garage door was shut. He went around and watched part of the rehearsal. Says that MJ was doing great that night in rehearsal.
Thundar
09-29-2011, 12:04 PM
He got MJ to the vehicle and then left prior to MJ leaving. Now describing the route they took that night. Told the principles vehicle about traffic so they didn't have to wait for traffic. They got to the house before MJ. DR. Murray was already at the house when the advance team got to the house.
Thundar
09-29-2011, 12:06 PM
MJs car got to the house, this guy opened the car door, had a short conversation with MJ. Said good night, carried in the stuff fans gave him, secured the door, and had a debriefing in security trailer. The ones who were relieved left. Alverez left at that time and went home.
Thundar
09-29-2011, 12:15 PM
Came back to work the 25th. Hung out in the security trailer. Witness looks like he is getting uncomfortable. Perhaps dreading the rest of this testimony?
Conversation about 12:18 phone call. Flurry of calls Michael Remeer(sp). Attempts to reach each other. First actual conversation Alverez was still inside the security tailer. Was told to get up and not cause a commotion and head to the front of the house. Showing picture of house (airial(sp) photo). Showing with pointer the route he took to the house. Went to front door of house. Still on the phone as he is walking.
Wow beautiful front doors with a fountain in the driveway. He reached out to open the front doors, but doors were locked. The nanny came to the front door and unlocked it. He could see othe individuals in the entryway. The nanny, Paris, Dr. Murray at the top of the stairs.
Now pictures of the entryway. Also beautiful.
Thundar
09-29-2011, 12:19 PM
The balcony where he saw Conrad Murray was a long ways from the bedroom. He had both hands on the railing leaning over. There was another security person, Kia Chase? So who was with MJ?
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 12:21 PM
The balcony where he saw Conrad Murray was a long ways from the bedroom. He had both hands on the railing leaning over. There was another security person, Kia Chase? So who was with MJ?
Kai was his chef and Michael was alone.....:cry:
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 12:26 PM
Here comes a bombshell.
Thundar
09-29-2011, 12:27 PM
Now showing top of stairs and pointing out how far Murray was from the bedroom. Showing diagram of top floor. Driving home how far Murray was from the bedroom. He believes the one room is Mr. Jackson's room. He had only been upstairs 2 times in six months to let the hairdresser up.
He was still on the phone with Williams?(Said by prosecutor) He is upstairs on the way to the bedroom. Murray said, Alberto come quick. So he did. He terminated his phone call with Michael Remeer but before the prosecutor said Williams.
Now in the bedroom.
weedemout
09-29-2011, 12:29 PM
why does it matter where he was when he got off the phone with Michael Williams?
That is why I hate court...too many stupid questions. it takes 60mins to describe something that happened in 60sec...
joe jones
09-29-2011, 12:33 PM
very damaging testimony, Dr Murray could called the chef or the nanny upstairs to call 911, and when this witness first saw Dr Murray he was not in the room with Michael he was outside on the balcony
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 12:34 PM
Paris and Prince right behind Alvarez :cry: :cry:
Thundar
09-29-2011, 12:34 PM
Picture of bedroom. What happened when you first walked in the room. He observed Murray giving chest compressions. Murray had just gone into the room in front of Alverez. MJ was on the far side of his bed, on the bed. Alverez remembered seeing MJ laying on the far side of the bed, on his back, hands extended out, palms up, eyes open, mouth open. MJs face was slightly towards the left looking at the foya(sp). Murray was using one hand for compressions. His left hand to be exact. Conrad Murray used his left hand to push down on his chest.
At some point did Conrad Murray indicate he should get an ambulance. Alverez says Murray did indicate they needed an ambulance. Paris and Prince then entered the room. Paris screamed out daddy....she was crying. MJ was in the same position, looking slightly towards Paris's location. Alverez then escorted the kids out of room. Told kids don't worry, we are taking care of things.
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 12:35 PM
Defendant is the one that called for Prince. :banghead:
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 12:36 PM
Here is that innocuous description again. :rolleyes:
BAD REACTION = DEAD PATIENT
weedemout
09-29-2011, 12:37 PM
what is this about a penis? I missed it.
ziggy
09-29-2011, 12:38 PM
Wow, an MD giving CPR with one hand while patient was on the bed.
Murray left Michael alone to summon staff and kids? But he couldn't take the time to call 911?
Thundar
09-29-2011, 12:38 PM
Ok I just learned something new about the condom catheter. But no heart monitor. But he had oxygen by nose. And an iv stand.
ziggy
09-29-2011, 12:39 PM
Witness observed some medical device on his penis with tubes. Questioning about whether other medical devices like blood pressure monitoring were observed...no.
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 12:39 PM
what is this about a penis? I missed it.
Condom catheter
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 12:40 PM
Wow, an MD giving CPR with one hand while patient was on the bed.
Murray left Michael alone to summon staff and kids? But he couldn't take the time to call 911?
NK
Wait until you hear testimony about just who and how many phone calls and texts defendant made that morning. SICKENING
joe jones
09-29-2011, 12:40 PM
what is this about a penis? I missed it.
he had a condom catheter attached to his penis, it would be used so that when he was sedated he did not wet the bed, but the urine is taken away via a tube to be collected and disposed of
if he was not being sedated then there would be no need to attach one
ziggy
09-29-2011, 12:40 PM
It was a condom catheter.
Thundar
09-29-2011, 12:42 PM
Now talking about picking up vials, this is before 911 was called or just before they got there?
Wise Old Owl
09-29-2011, 12:42 PM
It just upsets me so that a conviction will only put this incompetent, uncaring, clueless dolt of a doctor behind bars for 4 years.
JMHO
Thundar
09-29-2011, 12:45 PM
Now talking about taking a bag off the iv stand and putting it into the bag with the vials. Showing pictures of bedroom again. Showing where iv stand was.
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 12:46 PM
These are not the actions of an innocent man as he claims.
STAGING THE SCENE :puke:
HIDING THE EVIDENCE AND INVOLVING SOMEONE ELSE :rolleyes:
jmho
Wise Old Owl
09-29-2011, 12:47 PM
Now talking about taking a bag off the iv stand and putting it into the bag with the vials. Showing pictures of bedroom again. Showing where iv stand was.
I do beleive that the bag he was talking about taking off the IV stand contained the propofol. So, if MJ administered it himself - that means that he must have also hung that bag on the stand - impossible.
ziggy
09-29-2011, 12:47 PM
uh oh, witness removed an IV bag from an IV stand...on Murray's instruction.
Sure looks to me like Michael Jackson was being sedated with propofol IV; a little bit of an elaborate set up for a mere injection to induce sleep.
Wise Old Owl
09-29-2011, 12:50 PM
I want to hear just how much propofol LE found - mg-wise.
Murray ordered 155,000 mg's over the time period - but only administered 25 mgs that night - yea right. So where is the rest - how much was found - how much was missing or gone?
Thundar
09-29-2011, 12:51 PM
I have to go to lunch is a few minutes, Midwest here. Could someone please post about how or if anyone takes this stuff out of the bedroom? I will be back in an hour. Hopefully this will be on the tv during lunch.
Amity
09-29-2011, 12:51 PM
http://www.tmz.com/
Good link and sound for the trial (no commercials).
I do like this judge :) After watching him the last couple of days, he runs a tight ship, and is SO clear and concise. I love the way he talks to the witnesses.
Mel
Oh, I soooo agree with you!!!
There might be drama coming from the testimony ( Paris balled up crying on the floor, etc) but as for the players, there is no drama, no Show-Boating for the camera.
His Honor is clear, calm, precise and keeps things moving along at a good pace.
When His Honor interjects, it's quick, cut-n-dry questions to clarify a response and keep things moving.
What a total contradiction this case is compared to the Anthony case....I am impressed here!
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 12:52 PM
uh oh, witness removed an IV bag from an IV stand...on Murray's instruction.
Sure looks to me like Michael Jackson was being sedated with propofol IV; a little bit of an elaborate set up for a mere injection to induce sleep.
Propofol has to be administered with an IV pump continously. It can be used in injections but not the same result.
Wait until you hear about the empty bag of saline with an 100ml bottle of Propofol inside it with the rubber stopper slit. I believe that entire bottle of Propofol entered Michael at once. :cry: :cry:
Michael never stood a chance because defendant was on the phone yapping and texting with multiple women. :cry: :cry:
jmho
ziggy
09-29-2011, 12:54 PM
When witness removed saline bag from the IV stand, noticed a bottle inside of the bag!!!!
ziggy
09-29-2011, 12:55 PM
Witness was not asked to remove the other saline bag, the one that had no bottle inside it.
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 12:55 PM
Here is the 100ml bottle.....:puke:
Wise Old Owl
09-29-2011, 12:56 PM
WTH - WHO puts a bottle of any medication INSIDE a saline bag? wow
Thundar
09-29-2011, 12:59 PM
WTH - WHO puts a bottle of any medication INSIDE a saline bag? wow
How does one get a bottle inside a saline bag?
Talina
09-29-2011, 12:59 PM
Propofol has to be administered with an IV pump continously. It can be used in injections but not the same result.
Wait until you hear about the empty bag of saline with an 100ml bottle of Propofol inside it with the rubber stopper slit. I believe that entire bottle of Propofol entered Michael at once. :cry: :cry:
Michael never stood a chance because defendant was on the phone yapping and texting with multiple women. :cry: :cry:
jmho
How can a bottle be placed inside an IV bag? I have been sitting here trying to figure that out and I am at a loss.
21merc7
09-29-2011, 01:00 PM
This is some damning testimony. If the trial stopped here, I would have no further questions. I wonder what the defense is going to do with this?
P.S. can dr murray stop passing notes, that is not going to help him after all this
Wise Old Owl
09-29-2011, 01:01 PM
How does one get a bottle inside a saline bag?
Well, I would think you would have to slit the bag - probably at the top - at least enough to slide the bottle in. This is just such gross neglience - its hard to comprehend.
There ya go - a cut in the bag
Amity
09-29-2011, 01:01 PM
If I were on the jury, with no previous knowledge of the evidence, once I saw the pic of the saline bag WITH a bottle 'hidden' inside, THAT would be enough right there for me to convict.
As in........Stick a fork in Conrad, he's done. But, that's just me.
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 01:04 PM
Sorry everyone just got back over here.
There is the slit.... He cut the bag and also cut a hole in the rubber top to the Propofol..... very crude and deadly system.....
But I digress to Isabelle, RN who can explain much better.
Surely they will have medical experts who will testify.
SHOCKING
jmho
weedemout
09-29-2011, 01:05 PM
If I were on the jury, with no previous knowledge of the evidence, once I saw the pic of the saline bag WITH a bottle 'hidden' inside, THAT would be enough right there for me to convict.
As in........Stick a fork in Conrad, he's done. But, that's just me.
why would THAT be enough?
weedemout
09-29-2011, 01:07 PM
This Dr. gives me the creeps.
Wise Old Owl
09-29-2011, 01:09 PM
This Dr. gives me the creeps.
Me too! The look on his face most of the time. Anyone wanna make book on how long he lasts in prison? MJ has fans EVERYWHERE!!! JMHO (and only kidding about the betting)
octobermoon
09-29-2011, 01:09 PM
Is the defence going to say MJ slit the saline bag, put the white bottle in.....
That would take a bit of time I would think, and to then start the drip?? (just rambling
out loud here)
weedemout
09-29-2011, 01:10 PM
I don't know what it is. But he creeps me out. :(
21merc7
09-29-2011, 01:13 PM
I don't know what it is. But he creeps me out. :(
Thug is what I get.
That is a BIG bottle of propofol, omg!
21merc7
09-29-2011, 01:13 PM
You can't drink out of those bottles either, so that theory is moot.
Amity
09-29-2011, 01:14 PM
I give my Mom injections every day. I DO NOT deal with vials and rubber stoppers for any other reason so I am NOT expert on rubber stoppers but I'm thinking.....
The rubber stopper is meant for a needle, injection.
Once an actual slit is made in the rubber, from what I am holding in my hand right now (my Mom's med/vial/injectable) I would think that rubber stopper would stretch. Maybe not a lot of stretch but with my thumb on the rubber I can see how a slit opening could stretch easily allowing way too much medication to flow out, No?
I'm just thinking out loud so if anyone can explain why or why not, I'd appreciate it.
Wise Old Owl
09-29-2011, 01:15 PM
Thug is what I get.
That is a BIG bottle of propofol, omg!
I don't get "thug" - I get - and I absolutely abhor this word - but it is what it is - he's an idiot. By pure definition of the word - idiot.
JMO
2goaliemom
09-29-2011, 01:15 PM
This is a very good analysis of what a nurse anesthetist believes happened to Michael
http://sprocket-trials.blogspot.com/2011/01/dr-conrad-murrays-death-drip-explained.html
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 01:15 PM
I don't know what it is. But he creeps me out. :(
You are not alone weedemout.
Speaking for myself its a combination of his shenanigans in his personal life and then his professional life.
It boggles the mind when one thinks of exactly what he did to his only patient.
jmho
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 01:16 PM
15 minute break
Time to walk MR Max
Talina
09-29-2011, 01:16 PM
Dr. Murray really should get some advice from his attorneys about being more mindful of his facial expressions. He really looks mean to me and the looks he has when he is looking at the prosecutors is really hateful and mean, IMO.
Isabelle
09-29-2011, 01:25 PM
uh oh, witness removed an IV bag from an IV stand...on Murray's instruction.
Sure looks to me like Michael Jackson was being sedated with propofol IV; a little bit of an elaborate set up for a mere injection to induce sleep.
It would appear to anyone with a medical background that Dr. Murray administered Propofol by gravity flow. So dangerous that there are no words to describe it.
Conrad, it's OVER!
Isabelle
09-29-2011, 01:28 PM
This is a very good analysis of what a nurse anesthetist believes happened to Michael
http://sprocket-trials.blogspot.com/2011/01/dr-conrad-murrays-death-drip-explained.html
I read that a while back and the bottle in the bag boggled my mind, until I took it apart piece by piece. Then I understood what dr. Murray did. Got to give him credit for his improvisation. Unfortunately, it's over for Murray. There is no way on this earth the DT can counter this information.
Wise Old Owl
09-29-2011, 01:28 PM
Jean C on In Session - is on the phone - said she was just in the bathroom and there was security with a silver haired woman - confirmed to be Murray's mother. So, mama is there. Have to wonder just what she thinks.......
Isabelle
09-29-2011, 01:30 PM
I reallly want to know how much propofol was left in the bottle that was inside the bag. The bottle looks almost empty. If so, MJ probably received the entire bottle over a short period of time. With other drugs on board, death is a certainty!
Soulmagent
09-29-2011, 01:33 PM
Alright I missed Alveraz. I hated to ,did a quick scan of the thread and didnt see doctor Klein mention but I wanted to know if Alveraz had seen other medical people in or out of the house ?
He he ever seen the bedroom before? I will watch watch it later to catch up but there is like 5 hours left in court ..ugh.
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 01:37 PM
I reallly want to know how much propofol was left in the bottle that was inside the bag. The bottle looks almost empty. If so, MJ probably received the entire bottle over a short period of time. With other drugs on board, death is a certainty!
It was empty as possible with the gravity Isabelle.
It all went swooshing in at once.
DOWNRIGHT SICKENING to think about.......:cry: :cry:
I have been saying he should have been charged with 2nd degree since the beginning.
jmho
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 01:39 PM
Alright I missed Alveraz. I hated to ,did a quick scan of the thread and didnt see doctor Klein mention but I wanted to know if Alveraz had seen other medical people in or out of the house ?
He he ever seen the bedroom before? I will watch watch it later to catch up but there is like 5 hours left in court ..ugh.
No he did not Soul and has not been asked.
Its crystal clear what happened in that room and more testimony on the horizon that will strengthen that feeling.
jmho
Isabelle
09-29-2011, 01:42 PM
It was empty as possible with the gravity Isabelle.
It all went swooshing in at once.
DOWNRIGHT SICKENING to think about.......:cry: :cry:
I have been saying he should have been charged with 2nd degree since the beginning.
jmho
OMG! Really makes me sick.
I have refused to give patients IV antibiotics in the home without a pump to regulate the flow or an elastomeric system.
Soulmagent
09-29-2011, 01:42 PM
Evidence,
Peoples 31 , CD with recording of.911 phone call. Passing out transscript people 32 is a transcript of the recording being passed arround the court .
weedemout
09-29-2011, 01:43 PM
I like this judge. amazing.
Isabelle
09-29-2011, 01:44 PM
Propofol is supplied as 10 mg/ml. In a 100 ml bottle there is 1000 mg propofol. This sheds a lot of light on circumstances of MJ's death and Dr. Murray's guilt!
Isabelle
09-29-2011, 01:45 PM
Alvarez appears emotional as he relives the 911 call.
Cortne
09-29-2011, 01:46 PM
Alvarez appears emotional as he relives the 911 call.
Bless his heart. :(
~n/t~
09-29-2011, 01:46 PM
Alvarez emotional :(
Soulmagent
09-29-2011, 01:51 PM
He knew MJ was dead. He pulled it straight out of his leg!
Brown box on the bed clipped on bed not attached to MJ saw murray clip it on to MJ finger
(Alveraz said when they moved him to the bed? He just meant from the bed right?)
~n/t~
09-29-2011, 01:51 PM
What's the brown box he's referring to?
21merc7
09-29-2011, 01:52 PM
Read the article that described the theory of free flow, wow. Just wow. And this Dr. should have known better.
Also read this, published in November 2008:
http://www.anesthesia-analgesia.org/content/108/4/1182.full.pdf+html%22%20http://www.anesthesia-analgesia.org/content/108/4/1182.full.pdf+html
Scary to say the least.
This Mr. Alvarez has been really upset today, nervous, and on the verge of tears. At least it looks like a few employees cared about MJ and the children.
21merc7
09-29-2011, 01:53 PM
Sounds like this chord and finger attachment (to box?) is the vital signs monitor???
Soulmagent
09-29-2011, 01:54 PM
What's the brown box he's referring to?
Pilse oxgen sencor, Presented as evidence peoples 33.
Isabelle
09-29-2011, 01:54 PM
What's the brown box he's referring to?
Pulse oximeter. Measures oxygen in body, does not have any alarms in the event of a decrease of oxygen level as might be caused by apnea. This pulse ox would have to be constantly in view while attached to the patient.
AA said the brown box was clipped to the bed. I would venture a guess that the oxygen level of the bed would be '0'!
octobermoon
09-29-2011, 01:55 PM
I think it is a pulse ox. measures the saturation of the oxygen or maybe not???
Soulmagent
09-29-2011, 01:55 PM
Few day before june 25 he came and asked the security and asked for batterys.
Cortne
09-29-2011, 01:56 PM
What's the brown box he's referring to?
I might be wrong but I am thinking a pulse or oxygen thingy. Sorry I am not sure what I am talking about but that is what comes to mind. I guess he had it clipped to the bed and not his finger.
This is much worse than I had thought, much more emtional than I imagined as well. :(
Isabelle
09-29-2011, 01:56 PM
The pulse ox will give a heart rate along with an oxygen level, but it will not allow the caregiver to see if there are any abnormal heart rhythms that can be caused by certain drugs as a warning that there may be trouble.
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 01:56 PM
Just quoting myself since the list is growing.
These are not the actions of an innocent man as he claims.
STAGING THE SCENE :puke:
HIDING THE EVIDENCE AND INVOLVING SOMEONE ELSE :rolleyes:
jmho
Lets just pull that IV tubing out of Michael's leg. :rolleyes:
And pull the pulseoximeter out of the box and attach it to Michael's finger. :puke:
This makes my blood boil. :rant:
jmho
21merc7
09-29-2011, 01:59 PM
Few day before june 25 he came and asked the security and asked for batterys.
Why batteries and not electricity with battery backup? Why that specific time frame of June 25?
Isabelle
09-29-2011, 01:59 PM
Just quoting myself since the list is growing.
Lets just pull that IV tubing out of Michael's leg. :rolleyes:
And pull the pulseoximeter out of the box and attach it to Michael's finger. :puke:
This makes my blood boil. :rant:
jmho
Almost as good as a manager I worked for who told me to use broken equipment cause it looked good! This was in a recovery room of a hospital!
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 01:59 PM
The pulse ox will give a heart rate along with an oxygen level, but it will not allow the caregiver to see if there are any abnormal heart rhythms that can be caused by certain drugs as a warning that there may be trouble.
Absolutely and is surely not the only item used during major surgery which per the AR the amounts of Propofol in Michael were the same as someone under general anesthesia for a major surgery. :banghead:
jmho
Cortne
09-29-2011, 01:59 PM
Just quoting myself since the list is growing.
Lets just pull that IV tubing out of Michael's leg. :rolleyes:
And pull the pulseoximeter out of the box and attach it to Michael's finger. :puke:
This makes my blood boil. :rant:
jmho
Scream or cry or both.
I might have to be done for the day. Ok I think Im plain MAD.
weedemout
09-29-2011, 01:59 PM
I missed it. What did he say about mouth to mouth?
Isabelle
09-29-2011, 02:00 PM
Why batteries and not electricity with battery backup? Why that specific time frame of June 25?
Portable pulse oximeters like the one shown uses batteries. there is a machine that can be used that has a plug and a back up battery. The machine also has alarms that can be set for heart rate and oxygen limits. The one Murray used does not have this capacity.
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 02:01 PM
Scream or cry or both.
I might have to be done for the day. Ok I think Im plain MAD.
Its really hard to listen to this.
Isabelle
09-29-2011, 02:01 PM
Scream or cry or both.
I might have to be done for the day. Ok I think Im plain MAD.
As a medical professional, I have been MAD for quite some time. I would like Dr. Murray for 30 minutes in private.
Cortne
09-29-2011, 02:03 PM
Portable pulse oximeters like the one shown uses batteries. there is a machine that can be used that has a plug and a back up battery. The machine also has alarms that can be set for heart rate and oxygen limits. The one Murray used does not have this capacity.
Oh god. :banghead:
(you guys might think this is silly but I am def feeling that burning furious rage I felt when that circus was happening in OCFL)
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 02:03 PM
Portable pulse oximeters like the one shown uses batteries. there is a machine that can be used that has a plug and a back up battery. The machine also has alarms that can be set for heart rate and oxygen limits. The one Murray used does not have this capacity.
While he had no problem spending $3500 on lap dances he did not think so much of his medical equipment. :rolleyes:
More like "blue light specials". :rolleyes:
jmho
Isabelle
09-29-2011, 02:03 PM
Am sure expert witnesses will give the jury details on the propofol in the saline bag, gravity flow and the amount of propofol MJ would have received. Of course defense is gonna say michael opened the flow to make it run faster. I would never believe this in a million years.
21merc7
09-29-2011, 02:04 PM
I missed it. What did he say about mouth to mouth?
I think the dr told Alvarez "This is the first time I have done mouth to mouth, I have never done it before." But, my computer is doing something so some was bleeped out, maybe someone else has more accurate info and more of it.
Soulmagent
09-29-2011, 02:06 PM
Why batteries and not electricity with battery backup? Why that specific time frame of June 25?
It was to establish why Alveraz had seen it before. Murray needed batteries for it. I dont know why it was powered that way.
Btw I thought Alveraz was going to apear much meaner. The way yesterday the defence was Alveraz ,Alveraz ,Alveraz in their questions.
Wise Old Owl
09-29-2011, 02:06 PM
OMG - Murray told Alverez after MJ was pronounced that "he was hungry and hadn't eaten anything all day".
Just.No.Words.
Lexiintoronto
09-29-2011, 02:07 PM
I give my Mom injections every day. I DO NOT deal with vials and rubber stoppers for any other reason so I am NOT expert on rubber stoppers but I'm thinking.....
The rubber stopper is meant for a needle, injection.
Once an actual slit is made in the rubber, from what I am holding in my hand right now (my Mom's med/vial/injectable) I would think that rubber stopper would stretch. Maybe not a lot of stretch but with my thumb on the rubber I can see how a slit opening could stretch easily allowing way too much medication to flow out, No?
I'm just thinking out loud so if anyone can explain why or why not, I'd appreciate it.
(I'm a lab tech, I don't administer IVs, but I'm familiar with them)
If you were to simply puncture or slit a rubber-stopped vial, in theory little to none of the contents of the vial should come out. You would have to attach the slit vial to a tube or syringe in order to get the contents out.
IMO, Dr. Murray was using the IV bag simply as a very crude connecter to administer the propofol. It sounds as if he cut the saline bag, emptied the contents, cut a slit in the propofol vial, placed the vial in the empty saline bag, attaching the slit rubber vial to the IV tubing, allowing the propofol to run freely to the tubing into the IV ultimately inserted in MJ's leg. The saline bag also acted as a means to suspend the propofol and keep it connected to the IV pole.
Very crude, septic, dangerous. Just outrageous.
21merc7
09-29-2011, 02:10 PM
Wow, Alvarez asked to do paid interviews ONLY 9-10 times. Range of 500,000 to 200,000. The 200 thousand being National Enquirer. He said he did none of them.
21merc7
09-29-2011, 02:11 PM
Now defense is up for cross. Let's see how they do this.
Soulmagent
09-29-2011, 02:13 PM
Did the Prosecutors ask the other witness those questions about selling storys?
Isabelle
09-29-2011, 02:13 PM
Chernoff next, appears to have a pained expression on his face.
Isabelle
09-29-2011, 02:15 PM
Wow, Alvarez asked to do paid interviews ONLY 9-10 times. Range of 500,000 to 200,000. The 200 thousand being National Enquirer. He said he did none of them.
A real gentleman and a testament to the respect he had for Michael Jackson.
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 02:17 PM
A real gentleman and a testament to the respect he had for Michael Jackson.
Yes he is and here is EC to start the smear campaign.. grrrr
Isabelle
09-29-2011, 02:17 PM
Hey Chernoff, hey stupid, every IV bag has a nub coming from it! Stop wasting time!
Soulmagent
09-29-2011, 02:18 PM
Or LE told him not to discuss the case with anyone.
Or he is scared of something, could be any number of reasons really.
21merc7
09-29-2011, 02:20 PM
Defense is doing what defense does. However, these particular few questions are weak, as you are all describing, so I don't think there is much to discredit Alvarez' testimony on. We'll see. But so far, not working.
ETA: I have also noticed the gray haired attorney by Dr. Murray keeps looking at Murray during evidence showing, watching him closely and speculatively. I am not sure that attorney thinks Murray is innocent in any capacity, or maybe he is just looking at him to be sure he does not have an overt reaction.
Talina
09-29-2011, 02:20 PM
This questioning makes no sense to me. Is he defense atty trying to suggest that there are some IV bags with no "nub" at the point where tubing is attached? I'd like him to show one to us all.
OMG - here we go. Isn't it possible that you are confused about these events?
Isabelle
09-29-2011, 02:23 PM
I don't see Alvarez backing down. Given his lack of medical knowledge, he should not be expected to recall every detail even when initially questioned. Only a person familiar with medical equipment would be able to do that because they would know what to look for and would have picked-up that something was wrong immediately.
Lexiintoronto
09-29-2011, 02:27 PM
Did the Prosecutors ask the other witness those questions about selling storys?
Yes. He said he was approached by journalists approx 15-20 times, and offered 150 -500 thousand dollars. He declined.
The prosecutor aske the witness how MJ death impacted his life, specifically finacially, and he said that it financially ruined him. He went from working full-time with a great salary to working sporadically.
*~Aimee~*
09-29-2011, 02:28 PM
yea as a RN myself. This dr was so stupidly insane to be doing what he did. I agree with Nancy Grace he is under charged. Should be 1st degree. This is so sad and sickening. I pray this jury is better than Casey Anthony's. If only he could get more than just 4 freak'n years!
Cortne
09-29-2011, 02:30 PM
Defense is doing what defense does. However, these particular few questions are weak, as you are all describing, so I don't think there is much to discredit Alvarez' testimony on. We'll see. But so far, not working.
ETA: I have also noticed the gray haired attorney by Dr. Murray keeps looking at Murray during evidence showing, watching him closely and speculatively. I am not sure that attorney thinks Murray is innocent in any capacity, or maybe he is just looking at him to be sure he does not have an overt reaction.
He is def watching Dr Conrad closely. I too have been wondering about this.
Maybe hes an emotional man..NOT.
Soulmagent
09-29-2011, 02:31 PM
The defence lawyer is trying to push the phone call from 1218 to 1219. Um..how is that going to help because at 12 19 .30 pm Alveraz is at the bottom of the stairs with his eyes on Dr Murray. Already done with the phone call.
SAgal
09-29-2011, 02:35 PM
Oh no!!! Chernoff is writing on a tacky Flip Chart just like Baez.
Talina
09-29-2011, 02:37 PM
So...is this attorney going to say that it is Alvarez's responsibility and by inference his failure that 911 wasn't called instead of it being Dr. Murray's responsibility to have already called 911?
Soulmagent
09-29-2011, 02:40 PM
That must have been so awful. I bet he regrets telling them that.
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 02:40 PM
So...is this attorney going to say that it is Alvarez's responsibility and by inference his failure that 911 wasn't called instead of it being Dr. Murray's responsibility to have already called 911?
Its the ABC theory Talina.
ANYONE BUT CONRAD
jmho
Isabelle
09-29-2011, 02:42 PM
Chernoff is trying to catch AA in missing a tiny detail to show impaired memory. Problem is, he is gonna have to do this to EMT's also. It's not gonna work.
Judge, thrown the flip chart out. Its elementary school carp! Chernoff just needs a crutch1
*~Aimee~*
09-29-2011, 02:42 PM
Dr Murray should of called 911 when he walked in room instead of personal assistant. He is dumb......ugh hope they hang him
http://depts.washington.edu/learncpr/quickcpr.html
Check the victim for unresponsiveness. If the person is not responsive and not breathing or not breathing normally. Call 911 and return to the victim.
Soulmagent
09-29-2011, 02:42 PM
:twocents:
Maybe had they not held court in a closet ,everyone could see.
Thundar
09-29-2011, 02:43 PM
Well that little set too was strange. So did the defense just get spanked for the deceptive things written on the pad?
The witness looks really uncomfortable.
BetteDavisEyes
09-29-2011, 02:43 PM
I missed only a few minutes of Alvarez' testimony and find him to be a sincere and very credible witness. I don't think the jury will like watching the defense try to tear AA apart when he provided so many details of what was going on the morning that MJ died. jmo
Isabelle
09-29-2011, 02:44 PM
Is there a link to view videos of the trial? Am going to be away for half of today.
joe jones
09-29-2011, 02:45 PM
even if he testifies a little different on the details from earlier hearings, to get over that hurdle that he was offered 200 to 500 thousand dollars for media interviews and refused every cent even though he is financially wiped out from losing his job and the notoriety of him being the guy who was there when Michael Jackson died,
that bolsters his credibility no end, how many of us would be as principled,
Talina
09-29-2011, 02:45 PM
I'm beginning to wish that the Casey Anthony trial would have had this judge. No offense to HHJP, but this judge gives me the impression he would definitely not have tolerated Baez courtroom shenanigans at all. This judge has already put an end to the flip chart being written on by the DT.
Isabelle
09-29-2011, 02:45 PM
Dr Murray should of called 911 when he walked in room instead of personal assistant. He is dumb......ugh hope they hang him
I wanna know what Conrad was doing outside the room when Alvarez reached the landing? Long distance CPR????
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 02:46 PM
Is there a link to view videos of the trial? Am going to be away for half of today.
Here is one Isabelle and Soul posts them at the beginning of the daily for us.
http://abclocal.go.com/kabc/livenow?id=8366366
Thundar
09-29-2011, 02:46 PM
HLn.com has all the videos like they did for the Casey Anthony trial. I believe I heard them say last night it was under hln.com/michaeljackson. But it is on hln.com
Isabelle
09-29-2011, 02:46 PM
even if he testifies a little different on the details from earlier hearings, to get over that hurdle that he was offered 200 to 500 thousand dollars for media interviews and refused every cent even though he is financially wiped out from losing his job and the notoriety of him being the guy who was there when Michael Jackson died,
that bolsters his credibility no end, how many of us would be as principled,
Agreed. I often think of what has happened to the dancers who were rehearsing to perform This is It with Michael. It was a true chance of a lifetime for them. My heart breaks for them.
Isabelle
09-29-2011, 02:48 PM
Chernoff should have stayed in Texas!
Isabelle
09-29-2011, 02:49 PM
Stupid details! Cernoff go home! I don't think Cr. Murray has a very good representation in this case actually.
2goaliemom
09-29-2011, 02:50 PM
I read that a while back and the bottle in the bag boggled my mind, until I took it apart piece by piece. Then I understood what dr. Murray did. Got to give him credit for his improvisation. Unfortunately, it's over for Murray. There is no way on this earth the DT can counter this information.
When I read this for this first time, I was blown away. I don't have any medical knowledge and it took me a long time to understand how this worked. Murray sure was creative and very, very reckless. I hope you're right and this doctor is convicted. Although this defense team seems to have more scruples than the Baez defense, they are still way out in left field with their strategies. IMO this judge is extremely fair and looks like he is making sure both sides stay within the boundaries of the law--no games in his courtroom!
Lexiintoronto
09-29-2011, 02:50 PM
So...is this attorney going to say that it is Alvarez's responsibility and by inference his failure that 911 wasn't called instead of it being Dr. Murray's responsibility to have already called 911?
I think Dr. Murray claimed he didn't know the address, so he couldn't call 911.
:sigh:
Talina
09-29-2011, 02:51 PM
No matter how many times the DT tries to restate the witness testimony into something he'd rather it be, the witness keeps telling him, "no that is not what I said". This is not going well for the DT.
Thundar
09-29-2011, 02:53 PM
I think Dr. Murray claimed he didn't know the address, so he couldn't call 911.
:sigh:
Suppose he could have said, "Michael Jackson's home." And maybe 911 would have figured it out?
Talina
09-29-2011, 02:54 PM
Suppose he could have said, "Michael Jackson's home." And maybe 911 would have figured it out?
Exactly.
21merc7
09-29-2011, 02:57 PM
Dr. Murray did not know the address? He had been there since April? It was MJ's home and he didn't tell his baby mamma's? I don't think so.
I missed most of the cross by defense, work, but I know this is how it goes. I think Alvarez is being honest. The bit I did hear, Alvarez was being honest. No holes in the story to blast open, no twists or lies.
The autopsy clearly states what was in MJ's blood and body. It clearly states propofol and how much. The experts will discuss that and explain, hopefully clearly. As to what the jury will think, IDK, but it is clear that the Dr. was negligent and reckless, and after seeing that i.v. bag and size of bottle, I am shocked! Everyone else is just a witness to what happened AFTER MJ was dead, so I don't know how much their testimony matters. All that matters is the Dr. did one hand compressions on the bed after MJ had too much propofol and did not call 911 for some time.
Oh, and the huge and probably illegally purchased stash of propofol and other drugs the doc purchased from wherever. The bag and bottle, the monitor not being on MJ. The trying to grab all the evidence and hide it, then it was found. The Dr.s phone and text message leading up to and during the death.
The stash shows the Dr. was not trying to get MJ off anything too.
~n/t~
09-29-2011, 03:00 PM
even if he testifies a little different on the details from earlier hearings, to get over that hurdle that he was offered 200 to 500 thousand dollars for media interviews and refused every cent even though he is financially wiped out from losing his job and the notoriety of him being the guy who was there when Michael Jackson died,
that bolsters his credibility no end, how many of us would be as principled,
I think it shows a lot of respect for MJ and the judicial system and of course his credibility during testimony. After the trial, however, there is no doubt in my mind that he will accept any offers.
Did any of the other witnesses accept interviews?
vulture
09-29-2011, 03:05 PM
A couple of observations:
I believe Dr. Murray killed by accident, although an accident that his negligence caused - but the look on his face makes him look like he could kill on purpose!
If the Jackson family would help out Mr Alvarez financially in some way, my opinion of them would go up.
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 03:07 PM
I think Dr. Murray claimed he didn't know the address, so he couldn't call 911.
:sigh:
He claims that but will not work.
His beamer and Iphone have GPS.
Not to mention he sure knew how to get there from his g/f's home and the nightclubs. :rolleyes:
jmho
Soulmagent
09-29-2011, 03:17 PM
A couple of observations:
I believe Dr. Murray killed by accident, although an accident that his negligence caused - but the look on his face makes him look like he could kill on purpose!
If the Jackson family would help out Mr Alvarez financially in some way, my opinion of them would go up.
I would feel like they might have bought him . JMO. if they help him out now or have ever. He seems honest. Everyone was hiding "the secrets" of MJ. Including Alveraz.
EPfan
09-29-2011, 03:30 PM
So far, Dr. Murray appears to be guilty of negligent homicide. I don't believe this was MJ first experience with Profacal. I think the law should round up all the previous Dr.'s and find out if they administered this drug at home too. If so, they should be charged with some sort of crime. MJ was probably on way too much meds for a very long time. These Hollywood Dr.s need to learn how to say NO!!!!
Melanie
09-29-2011, 03:33 PM
A couple of observations:
I believe Dr. Murray killed by accident, although an accident that his negligence caused - but the look on his face makes him look like he could kill on purpose!
If the Jackson family would help out Mr Alvarez financially in some way, my opinion of them would go up.
After the watching this <unusual> person for the last few days, and hearing the witness testimony thus far, I've questioned myself in asking "did Dr. M kill MJ on purpose?"
The blatant disregard for human life is so apparent, I can't be the only one asking? The good Dr. had ordered enough "milk" to kill hundreds of people if he so desired. Just hook em up to a makeshift drip, put them to sleep without monitoring them with machines, or personally, and off you go to make your ever important phone calls.
Did Dr. M want MJ dead? Did someone else?
It's all very baffling to me....
MOO
Mel
Melanie
09-29-2011, 03:35 PM
He claims that but will not work.
His beamer and Iphone have GPS.
Not to mention he sure knew how to get there from his g/f's home and the nightclubs. :rolleyes:
jmho
Even if he didn't know the address, he surely knew the name of the street. That's one excuse I'm not buying...along with the rest of his porkie pies.
Mel
EPfan
09-29-2011, 03:36 PM
I would feel like they might have bought him . JMO. if they help him out now or have ever. He seems honest. Everyone was hiding "the secrets" of MJ. Including Alveraz.
I think some of the employees that were at MJ's home knew what was going on. Do you think for their testimony they are promised to not have any charges brought again them. Like accomplishes! To me, they should have alerted authorities about all this drug stuff, they surly knew something wasn't right about his weight, appearance, and welfare.
*~Aimee~*
09-29-2011, 03:40 PM
the dumb dr didn't even want to go on the ambulance and they had to make him because he was supposed to have more knowledge than emt's. This is so sad. I hope his career is over
EPfan
09-29-2011, 03:41 PM
Suppose he could have said, "Michael Jackson's home." And maybe 911 would have figured it out?
To know the location without the caller telling the operator it has to be a land line. The land line number is automately in the 911 system and when you call from it the 911 operator already knows your location. This isn't so with a call phone.
*~Aimee~*
09-29-2011, 03:42 PM
So far, Dr. Murray appears to be guilty of negligent homicide. I don't believe this was MJ first experience with Profacal. I think the law should round up all the previous Dr.'s and find out if they administered this drug at home too. If so, they should be charged with some sort of crime. MJ was probably on way too much meds for a very long time. These Hollywood Dr.s need to learn how to say NO!!!!
I so agree - because he called it his milk. All dr's need to be investigated.
*~Aimee~*
09-29-2011, 03:43 PM
To know the location without the caller telling the operator it has to be a land line. The land line number is automately in the 911 system and when you call from it the 911 operator already knows your location. This isn't so with a call phone.
I am sure there was a house phone in the place.
21merc7
09-29-2011, 03:44 PM
After the watching this <unusual> person for the last few days, and hearing the witness testimony thus far, I've questioned myself in asking "did Dr. M kill MJ on purpose?"
The blatant disregard for human life is so apparent, I can't be the only one asking? The good Dr. had ordered enough "milk" to kill hundreds of people if he so desired. Just hook em up to a makeshift drip, put them to sleep without monitoring them with machines, or personally, and off you go to make your ever important phone calls.
Did Dr. M want MJ dead? Did someone else?
It's all very baffling to me....
MOO
Mel
BBM
I have thought about the Dr being hired to make an "accident" happen. I don't have any reason for that other than my suspicious mind. (Sorry, not comparing MJ to Elvis with the drug use there.) I can see that happening though. What is 4 years in jail if you are secretly sitting on a few million and can go back home to an island or something to a greedy person? You know they will not put him in gen pop.
I really just think this Dr got his degree out of a crackerjack box, or was just acclaimed a doctor somewhere. Who on earth would really put themselves in this position, as a licensed doctor that may or may not have had issues in the past, and then rig something up, not have the equipment or attention span to make sure nothing happened? All along knowing something darn well could, and given MJ's age and history of use, most likely would? Just danged stupid! I see the idea of working for MJ and the idea of making money, but taking the cheap way around, and not doing the job right to begin with is beyond my comprehension.
Thundar
09-29-2011, 03:46 PM
To know the location without the caller telling the operator it has to be a land line. The land line number is automately in the 911 system and when you call from it the 911 operator already knows your location. This isn't so with a call phone.
I am kind of thinking that the 911 people could have figured out where to go after speaking with the Dr. for a few seconds. You know, if he would have dialed 911.
EPfan
09-29-2011, 03:47 PM
I am sure there was a house phone in the place.
I would think so too. I can't believe that with all the people that was there someone didn't pick up the phone and call. It almost seems that all the employees don't do anything without being told. Why would anybody have to be told to call 911, as soon as you knew somehting was up call!!!
EPfan
09-29-2011, 03:51 PM
I am kind of thinking that the 911 people could have figured out where to go after speaking with the Dr. for a few seconds. You know, if he would have dialed 911.
Yes, like don't think about it, just call 911 and then figure out how to get them to you. He surely knew how to get to the house from some main rd.
EPfan
09-29-2011, 03:52 PM
BBM
I have thought about the Dr being hired to make an "accident" happen. I don't have any reason for that other than my suspicious mind. (Sorry, not comparing MJ to Elvis with the drug use there.) I can see that happening though. What is 4 years in jail if you are secretly sitting on a few million and can go back home to an island or something to a greedy person? You know they will not put him in gen pop.
I really just think this Dr got his degree out of a crackerjack box, or was just acclaimed a doctor somewhere. Who on earth would really put themselves in this position, as a licensed doctor that may or may not have had issues in the past, and then rig something up, not have the equipment or attention span to make sure nothing happened? All along knowing something darn well could, and given MJ's age and history of use, most likely would? Just danged stupid! I see the idea of working for MJ and the idea of making money, but taking the cheap way around, and not doing the job right to begin with is beyond my comprehension.
Goodness!! I was thinking this but didn't want to post it. MJ's sister LaToya thinks Dr. Murray was the fall guy, but maybe he was just going to take the fall for money.
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 03:54 PM
After the watching this <unusual> person for the last few days, and hearing the witness testimony thus far, I've questioned myself in asking "did Dr. M kill MJ on purpose?"
The blatant disregard for human life is so apparent, I can't be the only one asking? The good Dr. had ordered enough "milk" to kill hundreds of people if he so desired. Just hook em up to a makeshift drip, put them to sleep without monitoring them with machines, or personally, and off you go to make your ever important phone calls.
Did Dr. M want MJ dead? Did someone else?
It's all very baffling to me....
MOO
Mel
It does tend to make someone think can anyone really be dumb as a box of rocks who holds a medical license or is there really something nefarious going on here.
jmho
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 03:55 PM
Even if he didn't know the address, he surely knew the name of the street. That's one excuse I'm not buying...along with the rest of his porkie pies.
Mel
Darn tooting he knew the name of the street ... :rolleyes:
jmho
Thundar
09-29-2011, 03:55 PM
Yes, like don't think about it, just call 911 and then figure out how to get them to you. He surely knew how to get to the house from some main rd.
Yesterday, I think it was yesterday, the security guy was asked if the police came to the gate would someone let them in, he answered no they would not get in without security or MJ okeying it so maybe an ambulance would not have gotten onto the property without the ok either. But I would think someone could have oked it while the Dr. hung over the balcony waiting for someone to come. Perhaps the Dr. should have told the personal assistant that it was more than a bad reaction thing going on. Then he could have called 911. But I don't think anyone was going to save MJ anyway, it was too late by the time the Dr. realized he wasn't breathing. My opinion only.
Melanie
09-29-2011, 03:56 PM
I would think so too. I can't believe that with all the people that was there someone didn't pick up the phone and call. It almost seems that all the employees don't do anything without being told. Why would anybody have to be told to call 911, as soon as you knew somehting was up call!!!
Purely speculating, but I won't be suprised when the DT asks "why didn't Paris or Prince call 911". You know, they were in the hall anyway, and they surely knew their own address.
Yup, that's it -- let's throw the kids under the bus too.
:banghead::banghead::banghead:
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 03:57 PM
To know the location without the caller telling the operator it has to be a land line. The land line number is automately in the 911 system and when you call from it the 911 operator already knows your location. This isn't so with a call phone.
Many cell phones have GPS but I know for a fact smart phones do which he had.
jmho
EPfan
09-29-2011, 03:58 PM
Yesterday, I think it was yesterday, the security guy was asked if the police came to the gate would someone let them in, he answered no they would not get in without security or MJ okeying it so maybe an ambulance would not have gotten onto the property without the ok either. But I would think someone could have oked it while the Dr. hung over the balcony waiting for someone to come. Perhaps the Dr. should have told the personal assistant that it was more than a bad reaction thing going on. Then he could have called 911. But I don't think anyone was going to save MJ anyway, it was too late by the time the Dr. realized he wasn't breathing. My opinion only.
I totally agree with you.
Melanie
09-29-2011, 03:59 PM
Is anyone watching live coverage on tmz? A plane just flew over the courthouse with a large picture of MJ and the banner read Latin America Demands Justice.
I guess a plane flew over earlier (didn't see it ) that read: God bless Dr. Murray - he is innocent.
I don't know who these folks are that think Dr. Feelgood is innocent? Based on what?
Yikes!
Mel
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 03:59 PM
I would think so too. I can't believe that with all the people that was there someone didn't pick up the phone and call. It almost seems that all the employees don't do anything without being told. Why would anybody have to be told to call 911, as soon as you knew somehting was up call!!!
How would anyone else know to call 911 when the defendant never told anyone Michael was in distress or dead?
He finally told Williams on the phone Michael had a BAD REACTION and to come quick...
The blame cannot be placed on anyone else except this defendant.
PERIOD.
jmho
Talina
09-29-2011, 04:00 PM
Yesterday, I think it was yesterday, the security guy was asked if the police came to the gate would someone let them in, he answered no they would not get in without security or MJ okeying it so maybe an ambulance would not have gotten onto the property without the ok either. But I would think someone could have oked it while the Dr. hung over the balcony waiting for someone to come. Perhaps the Dr. should have told the personal assistant that it was more than a bad reaction thing going on. Then he could have called 911. But I don't think anyone was going to save MJ anyway, it was too late by the time the Dr. realized he wasn't breathing. My opinion only.
BBM
I wouldn't be surprised if MJ was already beyond help by the time the dr got off his phone call and went back into the room. I believe he was likely already passed on when the dr first called MJ's personal assistant.
EPfan
09-29-2011, 04:01 PM
Many cell phones have GPS but I know for a fact smart phones do which he had.
jmho
ok, I have GPS on my phone. So, if I use it and call 911 they will know where I am? (Shows how I don't utilize my phone, or know how to use it!)
I'm not very high tech, my phone is smarter than I am!
21merc7
09-29-2011, 04:02 PM
Another little bugger, I am suspicious of is the doc asking for a 2nd doctor "in case he was tired." Come on. He knew he was hired to be up all night, every night for the duration of the tour. He was not hired to be up all day. Maybe the doctor still wanted some night time for his girlfriends, or maybe he wanted someone that really knew how to be a doctor, or maybe he wanted his own fall guy, IDK, but it seemed odd to refuse a nurse.
What cardiologist does not know CPR?
Melanie
09-29-2011, 04:03 PM
Yesterday, I think it was yesterday, the security guy was asked if the police came to the gate would someone let them in, he answered no they would not get in without security or MJ okeying it so maybe an ambulance would not have gotten onto the property without the ok either. But I would think someone could have oked it while the Dr. hung over the balcony waiting for someone to come. Perhaps the Dr. should have told the personal assistant that it was more than a bad reaction thing going on. Then he could have called 911. But I don't think anyone was going to save MJ anyway, it was too late by the time the Dr. realized he wasn't breathing. My opinion only.
I lived in a gated community, and there had to be a code for the fire department or emergency personnel to enter. I don't know if this applies to single family residents or not. I would imagine so...
MOO
Mel
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 04:03 PM
BBM
I wouldn't be surprised if MJ was already beyond help by the time the dr got off his phone call and went back into the room. I believe he was likely already passed on when the dr first called MJ's personal assistant.
He was dead way before defendant called anyone.
When his phone records come in it will be very clear then.
SHAMEFUL behavior yapping and texting multiple women at the same time.
jmho
KariKae
09-29-2011, 04:09 PM
Why does it matter how the IV room removed from leg? How does that indicate CM knew MJ was dead?
Melanie
09-29-2011, 04:09 PM
He was dead way before defendant called anyone. When his phone records come in it will be very clear then.
SHAMEFUL behavior yapping and texting multiple women at the same time.
jmho
I agree. There have been several anesthesiologists on NG, JVM, DRDREW, etc., who said the propofol would have killed him instantly without intubation due to the diazepams he had in his system before given the fatal dose.
Sure made sense to me. I've had 3 major surgeries, and given propofal each time -- and I always had to tell the doctor if I was on any meds (right down to the vitamins ingested).
MOO
Mel
EPfan
09-29-2011, 04:11 PM
How would anyone else know to call 911 when the defendant never told anyone Michael was in distress or dead?
He finally told Williams on the phone Michael had a BAD REACTION and to come quick...
The blame cannot be placed on anyone else except this defendant.
PERIOD.
jmho
I believe that he (Dr. Murray) is responsible but I also think this type of medication for sleep had been going on and wasn't a one time occurance. The people and employees around MJ, like security weren't deaf and dumb, they knew what was going on. Esp., if MJ was giving the orders as claimed. It is a sad situation and anyone that knew should have to be partly responsible. I have come to the conclusion that if you are hired by a star, you just get your big payday and keep you mouth shut, and your eyes closed.
Talina
09-29-2011, 04:12 PM
Okay...is Dr. Murray a cardiologist or not? I have heard it said on TV that he is and that he isn't. Which is it?
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 04:15 PM
I believe that he (Dr. Murray) is responsible but I also think this type of medication for sleep had been going on and wasn't a one time occurance. The people and employees around MJ, like security weren't deaf and dumb, they knew what was going on. Esp., if MJ was giving the orders as claimed. It is a sad situation and anyone that knew should have to be partly responsible. I have come to the conclusion that if you are hired by a star, you just get your big payday and keep you mouth shut, and your eyes closed.
We really have no idea if security or anyone else knew what was going on as this did take place in the defendant's bedroom. All the defendant had to do was tell someone to call 911 but he didn't. Of course by the time he came out of the room or called anyone Michael was dead.
I agree about people around stars but in this case this defendant failed his only patient miserably. Michael has paid with his life and it is time for defendant to face the music.
jmho
EPfan
09-29-2011, 04:18 PM
We really have no idea if security or anyone else knew what was going on as this did take place in the defendant's bedroom. All the defendant had to do was tell someone to call 911 but he didn't. Of course by the time he came out of the room or called anyone Michael was dead.
I agree about people around stars but in this case this defendant failed his only patient miserably. Michael has paid with his life and it is time for defendant to face the music.
jmho
agree
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 04:29 PM
Okay...is Dr. Murray a cardiologist or not? I have heard it said on TV that he is and that he isn't. Which is it?
He is a cardiologist but he is no longer board certified.
***
Everyone get your streams ready because court should resume anytime now.
21merc7
09-29-2011, 04:32 PM
While looking at the California Seal I thought I would remind everyone watching on tmz, don't click the links in the comments section over there. I don't think most would be work appropriate, could cause a virus. ;)
luckyme
09-29-2011, 04:33 PM
DR Murray had to of known MJ was already dead when he went into the room. Eyes were open and affixed. Thats why he wasnt even attempting at doing CPR the correct way. The evidence is very strong against Murray. Im trying to figure out what the defense is going to do! :waitasec: I beleive that MJ was an addicted person though and everyone knew it. moo!
21merc7
09-29-2011, 04:41 PM
Back with defense cross of Alvarez and the minute before the 911 call. Defense still trying to point out it could not have happened that way. Sigh.
Talina
09-29-2011, 04:42 PM
I wonder if I were to write down a list of what I do when I first get up in the morning, i.e. get coffee going, feed cat, go to b/r, wash face, brush teeth, etc. And then compared it to the time involved if I could impress the DT with how much I can get done half asleep in about 2 min.
21merc7
09-29-2011, 04:44 PM
Just trying to create "reasonable doubt". It is interesting, yet irritating, lol!
I can see where it is going, and would want a picky defense team too if I were in deep trouble.
Now they are talking about when they put MJ on the floor. I had to answer phone, but am guessing this happened before the 911 call also???
ETA: I think Alvarez said he is on the phone with 911 while lifting MJ. Someone correct me, I missed some things.
Melanie
09-29-2011, 04:51 PM
Back with defense cross of Alvarez and the minute before the 911 call. Defense still trying to point out it could not have happened that way. Sigh.
I'm not liking the defense either. I know they are trying to protect their client, but this is silly.
Dr. M placed MJ gently on the floor.
YOU yanked the catheter out of his leg. (me: I though the catheter was in his penis, and the IV was in his leg)?
Trying to make the witness look bad...:banghead:
Mel
Melanie
09-29-2011, 04:53 PM
Just trying to create "reasonable doubt". It is interesting, yet irritating, lol!
I can see where it is going, and would want a picky defense team too if I were in deep trouble.
Now they are talking about when they put MJ on the floor. I had to answer phone, but am guessing this happened before the 911 call also???
ETA: I think Alvarez said he is on the phone with 911 while lifting MJ. Someone correct me, I missed some things.
I always thought it was during the 911 call -- the operator found out MJ was on the bed and said to put him on the floor.
MOO
Mel
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 04:55 PM
JP has to tell EC cannot play 911 tape and question witness at the same time.
:floorlaugh:
Thundar
09-29-2011, 04:55 PM
I always thought it was during the 911 call -- the operator found out MJ was on the bed and said to put him on the floor.
MOO
Mel
They just played the start of the 911 call and the operator told them to put MJ on the floor.
weedemout
09-29-2011, 04:57 PM
this defense atty reminds me of a cross between al bundy and don from mad men.
octobermoon
09-29-2011, 04:57 PM
what just made the Judge angry? TIA :) *potty break, blushing LOL
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 04:59 PM
This Judge is the best and takes no junk in his court.
Someone just lost a phone and was escorted out. :floorlaugh:
Talina
09-29-2011, 05:21 PM
I'm not understanding what relevance Alvarez's financial issues or employment situation before or after MJ's death has anything to do with this trial. I can't figure out where the defense lawyer is headed with this line of questioning.
Talina
09-29-2011, 05:28 PM
Well..now I'm really confused. The DT cross of Alvarez was very uneventful, IMO.
octobermoon
09-29-2011, 05:30 PM
Well..now I'm really confused. The DT cross of Alvarez was very uneventful, IMO.
I am lost on this line of questioning too! Who cares who he worked for afterwards?
Talina
09-29-2011, 05:31 PM
Oh. My. Word. This recross is a bit ridiculous.
21merc7
09-29-2011, 05:33 PM
Well, that went nowhere.
Kai is up now.
Never getting to the EMT's today, no way.
octobermoon
09-29-2011, 05:33 PM
Kai Chase, the chef up next. fyi
octobermoon
09-29-2011, 05:34 PM
OT, but she is beautiful
21merc7
09-29-2011, 05:35 PM
Okay, the doc rolled his eyes again. That is making it very clear that he dislikes proper procedure and repeating it. :crazy:
21merc7
09-29-2011, 05:36 PM
OT, but she is beautiful
I agree, in fact all of them have been lovely. MJ had a staff that was nice to look at.
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 05:38 PM
I'm not understanding what relevance Alvarez's financial issues or employment situation before or after MJ's death has anything to do with this trial. I can't figure out where the defense lawyer is headed with this line of questioning.
Nothing.
Just the old reliable defense tactic to try to confuse the jury and blame anyone but their client. Just remember my ABC - ANYONE BUT CONRAD ;)
jmho
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 05:38 PM
I agree, in fact all of them have been lovely. MJ had a staff that was nice to look at.
Extremely professional to boot.
jmho
2goaliemom
09-29-2011, 05:45 PM
So far, Dr. Murray appears to be guilty of negligent homicide. I don't believe this was MJ first experience with Profacal. I think the law should round up all the previous Dr.'s and find out if they administered this drug at home too. If so, they should be charged with some sort of crime. MJ was probably on way too much meds for a very long time. These Hollywood Dr.s need to learn how to say NO!!!!
Although it wasn't Michael's first experience with Propofol, IMO it wasn't habitual until the last month of his life. MJ did not like to tour and put way too much stress on himself as a performer--he was the ultimate perfectionist. I believe that his overwhelming desire to make the 02 concerts the best performances of his life and the pressures he put on himself exacerbated his insomnia. The AG in CA did an investigation into all the docs involved with MJ--they did not bring charges.
Talina
09-29-2011, 05:45 PM
:floorlaugh: I guess it is my day to be confused. Now, I have no idea why the prosecution is asking the chef what type of food she cooked for Paris for her birthday. What possible relevance could that have to this trial?
weedemout
09-29-2011, 05:46 PM
how long was this chef employed there?
BetteDavisEyes
09-29-2011, 05:47 PM
In every other high profile trial that I've watched, I knew too much about the case to remain objective and would have recused myself as a potential juror because I had already formed an opinion about guilt or innocence. That does not apply here because I know very little about the circumstances other than what I learned in the early days following Michael Jackson's untimely death, and I didn't follow the case at all after the memorial service.
In many ways, it's refreshing to watch trial coverage through the eyes of a juror who is hearing the details of the case for the first time. I like the Judge very much, and I am confident that Dr. Murray will receive a fair trial. I never saw Michael Jackson perform in person but did admire his plethora of talents, particularly as a dancer.
Thundar
09-29-2011, 05:52 PM
how long was this chef employed there?
I believe she said April 2009 until June 2009. It seemed like none of them had been employed for much before April 2009. Is that when MJ and the children moved into that house?
MaryAnn
09-29-2011, 05:56 PM
We really have no idea if security or anyone else knew what was going on as this did take place in the defendant's bedroom. All the defendant had to do was tell someone to call 911 but he didn't. Of course by the time he came out of the room or called anyone Michael was dead.
I agree about people around stars but in this case this defendant failed his only patient miserably. Michael has paid with his life and it is time for defendant to face the music.
jmho
They might have been able to save him if they had called 911 immediately or had done CPR correctly. I had never agreed with Latoya but now I'm beginning to wonder if her theory is true. why did Dr M not call 911 immediately. I think there is really something fishy with that. I know he wanted to get rid of the evidence, but still he could have been picking everything up while the paramedics were working on MJ. Does anyone know how long it took between the time MJ lost consiousness and the paramedics finally arrived? Dr M did everything but call 911 and to not do CPR correctly is shocking!! Is it a conspiracy? They are making more money off of MJ dead.
weedemout
09-29-2011, 05:58 PM
Well remember he moved to bahrain after his trial. Also. he wasn't in this home that long. My friend owns this home and he is pissed because he cannot sell it. This trial is NOT helping. lol
weedemout
09-29-2011, 06:01 PM
I don't know what to think. But I do believe that MJ was dead as soon as all that bottle of propofal gushed into his veins so I don't think calling 911 would have helped. That's why I think the Dr didn't call 911. When he saw that bag and how all that dope was gone he knew MJ was dead.
Thundar
09-29-2011, 06:04 PM
Well remember he moved to bahrain after his trial. Also. he wasn't in this home that long. My friend owns this home and he is pissed because he cannot sell it. This trial is NOT helping. lol
I knew he moved to Bahrain in 2005 but where has he been since he came back to the US? He was here longer than April 2009 wasn't he?
I would think in California the notoriety would not make a difference to the house selling. But the address has been all over the news for two years every time MJs name is mentioned. It actually looks like a beautiful home.
weedemout
09-29-2011, 06:06 PM
you would think, but he said between it being on hollywood star maps as MJ's death place and this trial. He can't sell it.
MaryAnn
09-29-2011, 06:11 PM
I don't know what to think. But I do believe that MJ was dead as soon as all that bottle of propofal gushed into his veins so I don't think calling 911 would have helped. That's why I think the Dr didn't call 911. When he saw that bag and how all that dope was gone he knew MJ was dead.
I haven't been able to watch the trial since I'm at work. I've watched bits and pieces. I didn't know the whole bottle of propofal was gone. WOW! Maybe the IV broke. Regardless Dr M was being paid to watch Michael, not chat on his cell phone to his mistress
Melanie
09-29-2011, 06:11 PM
In every other high profile trial that I've watched, I knew too much about the case to remain objective and would have recused myself as a potential juror because I had already formed an opinion about guilt or innocence. That does not apply here because I know very little about the circumstances other than what I learned in the early days following Michael Jackson's untimely death, and I didn't follow the case at all after the memorial service.
In many ways, it's refreshing to watch trial coverage through the eyes of a juror who is hearing the details of the case for the first time. I like the Judge very much, and I am confident that Dr. Murray will receive a fair trial. I never saw Michael Jackson perform in person but did admire his plethora of talents, particularly as a dancer.
Me too. In the CFCMA trial, I believe I went in prolly knowing more than the judge did ;)
In this case, I didn't watch anything after that funeral either.
From what little I did hear, Dr. Feelgood is definitly guilty in my eyes. I'll have to wait until the defense puts on their case though - should be inneresting.
MOO
Mel
Thundar
09-29-2011, 06:14 PM
I haven't been able to watch the trial since I'm at work. I've watched bits and pieces. I didn't know the whole bottle of propofal was gone. WOW! Maybe the IV broke. Regardless Dr M was being paid to watch Michael, not chat on his cell phone to his mistress
The iv bag was split,the bottle of drugs stopper was cut and the bottle was put into the iv bag upside down. Either the iv solution was dumped and just the drugs ran through or some other strange thing happened. It was a makeshift thingy, very strange.
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 06:16 PM
I don't know what to think. But I do believe that MJ was dead as soon as all that bottle of propofal gushed into his veins so I don't think calling 911 would have helped. That's why I think the Dr didn't call 911. When he saw that bag and how all that dope was gone he knew MJ was dead.
Sadly he was dead way before defendant notified anyone. :cry:
MaryAnn
09-29-2011, 06:20 PM
I don't like to say this, but Dr. Murray does not have a great demeanor. He really should not roll his eyes when the Judge is talking. He did that when the Judge was talking to the witness explaining when to answer and not to say uh-huh - un-unh.
I'm sure he's completely petrified but he looks scary to me. He has the worst look on his face all the time! I can't imagine anyone wanting to date him. He supposedly had 3 girlfriends and a wife. Yikes... He has one scary looking face!! He looks mean!
weedemout
09-29-2011, 06:21 PM
Sadly he was dead way before defendant notified anyone. :cry:
right. who knows how long mj lay there dead while dude was on the phone.
joe jones
09-29-2011, 06:23 PM
why did the Dr want to get prince, surely he did not want his children to see there father unconscious most likely dead with his eyes open and fixed,
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 06:24 PM
why did the Dr want to get prince, surely he did not want his children to see there father unconscious most likely dead with his eyes open and fixed,
I has always been my belief the bedroom scene was staged and defendant wanted someone very close to Michael to see it. Someone much closer to Michael than security.
jmho
WillenFan21
09-29-2011, 06:28 PM
why did the Dr want to get prince, surely he did not want his children to see there father unconscious most likely dead with his eyes open and fixed,
I am wondering the same thing. Any normal person would have kept the kids out of the room not go and get them. My god....
Amity
09-29-2011, 06:29 PM
So far, from all the witnesses testifying, seems they all conducted themselves in a somewhat calm manner considering the circumstances.
Other than Paris crying and maybe Prince crying quietly, It was Good Ol' Doc M that fell apart and was frantic.
Imagine that......a Cardio Doc frantic when he finds his patient not breathing. What's wrong with that picture?! !
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 06:29 PM
I am wondering the same thing. Any normal person would have kept the kids out of the room not go and get them. My god....
Sure they would but this was someone who had staged a scene and was covering his behind.
jmho
WillenFan21
09-29-2011, 06:31 PM
Sure they would but this was someone who had staged a scene and was covering his behind.
jmho
Oh I know.
BOZGAL
09-29-2011, 06:31 PM
This is so heartbreaking.
Those poor children. :cry:
MaryAnn
09-29-2011, 06:32 PM
Oh, I soooo agree with you!!!
There might be drama coming from the testimony ( Paris balled up crying on the floor, etc) but as for the players, there is no drama, no Show-Boating for the camera.
His Honor is clear, calm, precise and keeps things moving along at a good pace.
When His Honor interjects, it's quick, cut-n-dry questions to clarify a response and keep things moving.
What a total contradiction this case is compared to the Anthony case....I am impressed here!
It was funny, Jean said on NG last night that these Jurors were actually taking notes, she said NOT like FCA's jurors. I live in Los Angeles so I was happy that people here at least take their Jury service serious!!
SAgal
09-29-2011, 06:33 PM
Okay...is Dr. Murray a cardiologist or not? I have heard it said on TV that he is and that he isn't. Which is it?
I found this biography on Conrad Murray:
http://www.biography.com/people/dr-conrad-murray-481814
Murray's educational credentials are outstanding -
He graduated magna cum laude from Texas Southern University.
He graduated from Meharry Medical with a degree in Pre-Medicine and Biology Science.
He completed additional training at The Mayo Clinic.
His Residency was completed at Loma Linda Medical Center in CA.
He studied at the University of Arizona on a Cardioloy Fellowship.
And worked for the Cardiology Fellowship Program at Sharp Memorial Hospital in San Diego.
It's shocking, IMO that - with all this training and education; Conrad Murray did not seem to know how to perform basic CPR?
Thundar
09-29-2011, 06:37 PM
I has always been my belief the bedroom scene was staged and defendant wanted someone very close to Michael to see it. Someone much closer to Michael than security.
jmho
I found this biography on Conrad Murray:
http://www.biography.com/people/dr-conrad-murray-481814
Murray's educational credentials are outstanding -
He graduated magna cum laude from Texas Southern University.
He graduated from Meharry Medical with a degree in Pre-Medicine and Biology Science.
He completed additional training at The Mayo Clinic.
His Residency was completed at Loma Linda Medical Center in CA.
He studied at the University of Arizona on a Cardioloy Fellowship.
And worked for the Cardiology Fellowship Program at Sharp Memorial Hospital in San Diego.
It's shocking, IMO that - with all this training and education; Conrad Murray did not seem to know how to perform basic CPR?
Or use the general monitoring devices that should be used when giving propefol(sp). It's befuddeling to say the least.
Cortne
09-29-2011, 06:38 PM
Love love love Kai Chase!!
joe jones
09-29-2011, 06:38 PM
I has always been my belief the bedroom scene was staged and defendant wanted someone very close to Michael to see it. Someone much closer to Michael than security.
jmho
I think if he staged it in any way he would have done it better, the first thing he should have done was move the IV in MJs leg to a place where it would have been more convenient for MJ to self administer
thus his story that MJ self administered would be slightly more feasible, as it is MJ had to have been a contortionist to have self administered the propofol and his body would not have then fell back into the repose position it was found it,
I do think he was way out of his depth with using propofol and all the other drugs MJ wanted, and he in his inexpereince gave MJ too much propofol and other drugs that caused his death
I think he was blinded by the money, the prestige of being MJs DR, being a part of the whole MJ circus as it moved to London for the comeback tour and he stopped being a professional ethical DR and began to do MJs bidding
as if he did not do MJs bidding MJ would hire a Dr who would,
and the idea that MJ agreed to be weaned off propofol just as he needed more not less sleep is ludicrous,
Cortne
09-29-2011, 06:40 PM
I agree 100 % JJ
weedemout
09-29-2011, 06:40 PM
It was funny, Jean said on NG last night that these Jurors were actually taking notes, she said NOT like FCA's jurors. I live in Los Angeles so I was happy that people here at least take their Jury service serious!!
This judge and lawyers are making Los Angeles look good. :rocker::woohoo:
Talina
09-29-2011, 06:43 PM
This judge is really keeping the witness testimony on track and making sure they don't wander off from the actual question. Can you imagine how he would have handled CA or GA or a few others in the Casey Anthony trial? A number of those witnesses seemed to be absolutely unable to just directly answer a question asked.
weedemout
09-29-2011, 06:46 PM
this defense atty is making los angeles look bad. lol. he's terrible.
Talina
09-29-2011, 06:52 PM
Okay, is it just me or does anyone else thing it odd that she goes right back to making lunch with MJ's doctor frantic, hollering for help. Sounds like a robot. IMO
If it were me, I don't think I could just then go about my normal routine without seeing what the heck was going on.
ETA: Aside from what seems odd behavior (as I state above) I find it abhorrent that the defense atty is trying to make it look bad on her for not doing anything else. He's trying to deflect responsibility off of his client on to every other witness so far. Not working with me.
Cortne
09-29-2011, 06:59 PM
Well that witness was interesting. In the panick nobody called 911. Amazing.
Of course a normal human being would think the DR already had called 911 being hes a friggin DR.
I will add I cannot perform CPR in a frantic situation. But I sure as hell can call 911. Might not be able to speak but I could manage to dial rescue.
~n/t~
09-29-2011, 07:08 PM
The chef was a total right off, imo. She scored no points if I was on the jury. Totally unbelievable reaction to the event. Saw the panic in Dr. Murray's, gets Prince and then goes back to cooking? WHAAAAT?
Your 15 minutes are up Ms. Chase. That was very sweet how much allegiance you have towards Michael Jackson but ummm.....oh nevermind. :innocent:
Oh and can someone help me out with the timeline because I'm totally lost. At 12:05 Dr. Murray comes down but head of security was at the bank at that time. Security and paramedics arrived at the same time according to Ms. Chase? :waitasec:
WillenFan21
09-29-2011, 07:09 PM
Murray KNEW that Michael was dead when he brought Prince in there. Jane just said the Michael's eyes were open in the room. I am thinking he brought Prince in there long enough so that the he could say that Prince was a witness in seeing his dad alive. So screwed up and I think that is exactly what it was he was doing bc once in there and long enough the doctor said to get them out they don't need to see their dad like this.
~n/t~
09-29-2011, 07:10 PM
Okay, is it just me or does anyone else thing it odd that she goes right back to making lunch with MJ's doctor frantic, hollering for help. Sounds like a robot. IMO
If it were me, I don't think I could just then go about my normal routine without seeing what the heck was going on.
ETA: Aside from what seems odd behavior (as I state above) I find it abhorrent that the defense atty is trying to make it look bad on her for not doing anything else. He's trying to deflect responsibility off of his client on to every other witness so far. Not working with me.
It worked for me. She was total right off.
~n/t~
09-29-2011, 07:14 PM
Murray KNEW that Michael was dead when he brought Prince in there. Jane just said the Michael's eyes were open in the room. I am thinking he brought Prince in there long enough so that the he could say that Prince was a witness in seeing his dad alive. So screwed up and I think that is exactly what it was he was doing bc once in there and long enough the doctor said to get them out they don't need to see their dad like this.
I think it interesting that the kids are being flown overseas. Not that I think they should testify but if Dr. Murray is to get a fair trial, I think Prince who saw his dad should testify.
Lexiintoronto
09-29-2011, 07:14 PM
The doctor rushes down and shouts at the cook to 'get security, get help, get Prince' and she gets the 12-year old Prince and goes back to work?!
There's something very 'down the rabbit hole' with this whole scene.
It seems like common sense was suspended.
I believe Dr. CM is entirely responsible, full stop. However, so many things are odd.
Talina
09-29-2011, 07:15 PM
It worked for me. She was total right off.
What I meant when I said the cross examining was not working for me was that I am still not falling for what appears to be the defense theme. Everyone else except Dr. Murray should have called 911.
As far as what the chef offered up as far as her testimony, nothing as far as I could see other than establishing that Dr. Murray came into the kitchen at a little after noon asking, among other things, for Prince. Which I find bizarre. What reasonable explanation can be offered explaining why he would ask for the patient's young teenage son?
~n/t~
09-29-2011, 07:17 PM
Oh and where was Paris when the chef went to get Prince? I thought Ms. Chase said the children were with the nanny when she went to get Prince. I thought head of security said Paris was curled up in a ball upstairs and he took the kids away to the nanny. Wouldn't anyone have stopped her from going up the stairs when all this was happening?
Something is not making any sense to me.
Inspector Gidget
09-29-2011, 07:18 PM
Okay, the doc rolled his eyes again. That is making it very clear that he dislikes proper procedure and repeating it. :crazy:
Rolling of eyes very disrespectful!I am sure the judge is watching his facial expressions.
~n/t~
09-29-2011, 07:18 PM
What I meant when I said the cross examining was not working for me was that I am still not falling for what appears to be the defense theme. Everyone else except Dr. Murray should have called 911.
As far as what the chef offered up as far as her testimony, nothing as far as I could see other than establishing that Dr. Murray came into the kitchen at a little after noon asking, among other things, for Prince. Which I find bizarre. What reasonable explanation can be offered explaining why he would ask for the patient's young teenage son?
They didn't have a land line. Did Dr. Murray have a cell phone? The chef did. In her pocket.
WillenFan21
09-29-2011, 07:22 PM
Oh and where was Paris when the chef went to get Prince? I thought Ms. Chase said the children were with the nanny when she went to get Prince. I thought head of security said Paris was curled up in a ball upstairs and he took the kids away to the nanny. Wouldn't anyone have stopped her from going up the stairs when all this was happening?
Something is not making any sense to me.
Paris followed Prince up there.
Talina
09-29-2011, 07:23 PM
They didn't have a land line. Did Dr. Murray have a cell phone? The chef did. In her pocket.
Sounds to me like everyone in that household had cell phones. As far as did the Dr.? You betcha he did. Any one of them could have called 911. However, I do believe that I would have assumed that the doctor would have made that important call before he went running around the household looking for children or security or calling anyone else.
This whole thing is just weird to me the more I hear the testimony.
~n/t~
09-29-2011, 07:24 PM
Paris followed Prince up there.
When was this testified to? I may have missed it during commercials. TIA
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