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View Full Version : MO - AMBER ALERT: Lisa Irwin, 10 months, Kansas City, 4 Oct 2011 - #11



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KaylynnCouture
10-09-2011, 04:43 PM
An AMBER Alert was issued for 10-month-old Lisa Irwin on Tuesday, October 4th after she was abducted from her crib during the early morning hours. As of today (Sunday), no suspects have been identified, and the AMBER Alert has been canceled.

Lisa is 10 months old. She has blue eyes and blonde hair. She is 30 inches tall and weighs between 26 and 30 pounds. Lisa was last seen wearing purple shorts and a purple shirt with white kittens on it.
Lisa is described as having two bottom teeth, a small bug bite under her left ear, a beauty mark on her right outer thigh and currently has a cold with a cough.

Anyone with information is asked to call 9-1-1, your local police agency, or the Kansas City TIPS Hotline at 816-474-8477.

http://i56.tinypic.com/2190u8h.png

Previous Threads:
-Thread 1
-Thread 2
-Thread 3
-Thread 4
-Thread 5
-Thread 6
-Thread 7
-Thread 8
-Thread 9
-Thread 10



RULES:
-MSM (main-stream media) links ONLY. No rumors (including those from Facebook).

-If you cannot link, you cannot discuss.

-No sleuthing minors, or "random people". Parents only.

KaylynnCouture
10-09-2011, 04:44 PM
Sorry it took me so long to get this thread up. It takes forever to link those previous threads!

wfgodot
10-09-2011, 04:44 PM
Thanks, KaylynnCouture.

trillian
10-09-2011, 04:47 PM
Bringing this from the end of the last thread:

How was she transported???

Either abduction or parent crime.... there needed to be some form of transport for little Lisa to be removed from the home.

If she was deceased by one or both parents and didnt need a car seat, then there should be evidence in one of their cars (as well as near or in the home). Unless they did a really good job wrapping her, the dogs should pick it up. Otherwise, if it's the parents, then likely it was another car.

If an intruder took her and she is alive, it would have required a car seat. You cannot just drive around with a 10mo old loose in a car, unless you perhaps have an accomplice holding her sitting on the floor or something, or in back of a van. But I dont think you can do it alone and not draw attention. You either have a car seat or an accomplice, or risk looking strange to other cars. (you could put her in a trunk. but if you want to keep the baby, not likely)

You couldnt walk her out for sure, not for long anyway. Could you walk all the way to the river without being noticed?

I wonder if they have looked at people who recently bought car seats in the area? Or asked recent craigslist sellers of anyone suspicious who bought one.

What I am saying is basically, if she is alive, there is likely a carseat out there.

Any other ideas? (Sorry if this has already been brought up, I have read almost everything and didnt see it)

NancyA
10-09-2011, 04:48 PM
Just popping in to see if there are any new developments - a quick skim of the last few pages of the previous thread tells me there aren't. I have guests coming by pretty soon so will be out of touch for a few hours. Many thanks in advance to all those posters continuing to keep the threads and info flowing.

shefner
10-09-2011, 04:48 PM
Once again, to recognize how few non-family INFANT abductions there are, here are our statistics....

Since 1983 (almost 30 years), there have only been 278 INFANT abductions (babies in the first year of life). Of these, only 12 infants have not been recovered or located. Of the 278, almost half of these were newborn abductions from hospitals. So...as we look at 30 years, we can see how few non-family infant abductions there are.

ETA: I hate to say "only" 278 infant abductions....just 1 would be too many. But when you compare infant abductions to child abductions the numbers are very low.

marycarney
10-09-2011, 04:49 PM
Today is my one year anniversary of being a WS member- can I say what an interesting, stimulating and well-run forum this is? I work the overnight shift in a pediatric ICU, and children are my special calling in life.

PLEASE let this little one be found - whole, well-cared for and SOON.

pferrin
10-09-2011, 04:49 PM
kmartin..sorry you went thru that..get a pound puppy. they are so loyal and will protect you thru thick or thin. ...Not counting the love they give. I never regret having dogs...ever. They have protected me as a child and as an adult.

wfgodot
10-09-2011, 04:50 PM
Oh, also, I brought over all the tags from Thread #10, but I've about reached the max number I can post, so if we start talking about something really interesting, or a new person or place, please do a tag for it. Thanks!

captivagrl
10-09-2011, 04:50 PM
Is there a psychic thread regarding this case? If so, how do I get there? Thanks :)

Lavanda Dolce
10-09-2011, 04:50 PM
MsDetective, I believe she did. I recall she said her friends' child was four.

lauriej
10-09-2011, 04:52 PM
Wish they would have done more with tracking dogs ASAP in Lisa's case.

..they were using the dogs very early on..

http://www.globaltvbc.com/world/kansas+city+police+say+parents+of+missing+baby+co-operative+as+massive+search+moves+to+2nd+day/6442495610/story.html

On Wednesday, FBI agents with dogs searched the family's home, a light-green ranch-style home in a cozy neighbourhood along a winding street. An FBI spokeswoman acknowledged the agency was committing significant resources to the search, but declined to discuss why the agents entered the home or what they found.


http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/05/3190150/as-search-continues-parents-plead.html

More than 300 law enforcement officers have been involved in the search. Authorities have conducted three shoulder-to-shoulder searches in woods near the home and have deployed police dogs several times.

“Unfortunately, none of those have really led us anywhere,” Young said.
On Wednesday, FBI personnel in protective clothing gathered original scents from the house so they would have something for specially trained dogs to track. Those dogs started working late Wednesday morning, Young said.

KaylynnCouture
10-09-2011, 04:53 PM
Is there a psychic thread regarding this case? If so, how do I get there? Thanks :)

No, the Astrology forum closed back in July, I'm pretty sure.

grandmaj
10-09-2011, 04:56 PM
So besides re-enacting the window which was being either recorded or pictures taken by a detective from what I can see in the pics, did they do anything else? Anyone?

Lavanda Dolce
10-09-2011, 04:56 PM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15647944/police-again-questioning-missing
Video link of possible recreation.

cluciano63
10-09-2011, 04:57 PM
Lisa had to have been taken away from the house on foot (carried) at least initially, why no scent? Are dogs not helpful when leading from the home of the missing? Too many scents to follow from daily activities? I guess I always count on dogs too much but there seems to be a lot that can't be determined. (I know there is always the right kind of dog, right kind of training debate...) Anyway, JMO.

wfgodot
10-09-2011, 04:57 PM
So besides re-enacting the window which was being either recorded or pictures taken by a detective from what I can see in the pics, did they do anything else? Anyone?
I think that's all they did - the window/screen - but the media tagged it as "a re-creation" or whatever, making it sound more grand than it really was. Haven't seen anything in MSM that says if they did anything else.

KaylynnCouture
10-09-2011, 04:59 PM
Bringing these 2 media links over from the last thread..

Deborah Bradley Still Married to Another Man:
MO MO - AMBER ALERT: Lisa Irwin, 10 months, Kansas City, 4 Oct 2011 - #11 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

Family Hands Out Flyers To 80,000 Nascar Fans Today:
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5iGSz1aswEZC9FZcht_BxnjC3XtRQ?docId=e0b84fb36 4ed4281aa48dd80f9f7c774

Also, just so everyone knows, baby Lisa turns 11 months old on Tuesday.

KaylynnCouture
10-09-2011, 05:00 PM
Lisa had to have been taken away from the house on foot (carried) at least initially, why no scent? Are dogs not helpful when leading from the home of the missing? Too many scents to follow from daily activities? I guess I always count on dogs too much but there seems to be a lot that can't be determined. (I know there is always the right kind of dog, right kind of training debate...) Anyway, JMO.

I could be wrong but don't dogs trace scents on the ground? If baby Lisa was carried, not walking, her scent wouldn't be on the ground..

KellyConQueso
10-09-2011, 05:00 PM
I have trying to keep up with this thread but have a few questions that I hope someone can answer for me


Is there a military base within 100 miles of the Irwin household?
A few days back there was mention of a call made/received from one of the stolen phones after midnight. Has this been verified by LE?
Has anyone been verified as the person walking down the street with a baby that was seen by the neighbor?

kmartin96
10-09-2011, 05:01 PM
..they were using the dogs very early on..

http://www.globaltvbc.com/world/kansas+city+police+say+parents+of+missing+baby+co-operative+as+massive+search+moves+to+2nd+day/6442495610/story.html

On Wednesday, FBI agents with dogs searched the family's home, a light-green ranch-style home in a cozy neighbourhood along a winding street. An FBI spokeswoman acknowledged the agency was committing significant resources to the search, but declined to discuss why the agents entered the home or what they found.


http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/05/3190150/as-search-continues-parents-plead.html

More than 300 law enforcement officers have been involved in the search. Authorities have conducted three shoulder-to-shoulder searches in woods near the home and have deployed police dogs several times.

“Unfortunately, none of those have really led us anywhere,” Young said.
On Wednesday, FBI personnel in protective clothing gathered original scents from the house so they would have something for specially trained dogs to track. Those dogs started working late Wednesday morning, Young said.

Sorry, I should have said, WISH THEY WOULD HAVE HAD MORE SUCCESS WITH DOGS IN THE BEGINNING.....IN A SITUATION PERSONAL TO ME:

They brought a canine from the XXXX police department to come sniff and follow the person's scent. The canines showed that this person parked at the end of our street, hugged close to each house until it got to ours and went right into the backyard, to the slide, and to our window. Amazing that a dog can figure all of this out

Maybe the dogs alerted them to more than they are saying....but it seems to me in other cases, if the dogs DID pick up on a strangers scent, which direction the perp (and/or victim) headed, etc. LE will announce that. I recall that has happened in several missing person cases.

yllek
10-09-2011, 05:02 PM
So besides re-enacting the window which was being either recorded or pictures taken by a detective from what I can see in the pics, did they do anything else? Anyone?

Nothing that was announced. Jeremy's sister Ashley was at the speedway, reportedly to raise funds and get the word out about Lisa to 80k people. In the announcement about that, it was stated that Lisa's parents were absent from the event. I hope they spent the day with LE and there is investigative progress being made.

ETA: This is aside from the reports of LE interviewing the teen neighbor again earlier this morning.

StJohn
10-09-2011, 05:03 PM
Up to now, been lurking, hoping for a quick resolution :sigh:

Apologize if this has been posted already, but I haven't been able to catch up on all posts. Here is a link to DB's court case with SB showing she was awarded $206 per month child support and "medical support" beginning 2/15/09:

https://www.courts.mo.gov/casenet/cases/judgements.do

I assume medical support means insurance.

Among the many things that I find odd in this case, why has LE not asked JI to take a lie detector? He stated on his Friday Today show interview that he would take one, but hadn't been asked. Also, do we know for certain that DB failed the LD or did LE just tell her that to see what her reaction would be? I think LE may be allowing JI to feel overly confident just to see if he "slips up". JMO

IMO, I am far more suspicious of JI than DB. I can imagine a scenario where he may have feared DB might go back to her ex and take baby Lisa with her. He stages an abduction, with the cooperation of a family member, passing her off to someone in the middle of the night. Other than a scenario such as this, I have to say it must be a stranger abduction, even though I know statistics suggest this unlikely.

IAM
10-09-2011, 05:03 PM
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2047200/Lisa-Irwin-missing-Mother-Deborah-Bradley-married-man.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

Is her maiden named Bradley or her married name? I hear her also being called Debra Netts? His and her body language is odd in this pic, her leaning strangely into him but looks as if reserved, him with his hands in his pockets...

lauriej
10-09-2011, 05:03 PM
..in this clip that pattyG linked from the judge jeanine show-----deborah mentions that the neighbour and her 4 year old daughter were over that evening...the little girl was watching a movie in the boys bedroom with them.

..surely the neighbour saw lisa too? that would significantly narrow down the last sighting of her..by someone other than deborah.

http://video.foxnews.com/v/1208764392001/exclusive-parents-of-missing-baby-lisa-speak-out/?playlist_id=163706

wfgodot
10-09-2011, 05:04 PM
I have trying to keep up with this thread but have a few questions that I hope someone can answer for me


Is there a military base within 100 miles of the Irwin household?
A few days back there was mention of a call made/received from one of the stolen phones after midnight. Has this been verified by LE?
Has anyone been verified as the person walking down the street with a baby that was seen by the neighbor?

Good questions.

There's a KC-area military base: it's Richards-Gebaur AFB. Ft. Leavenworth is also right across the border, in Kansas.

Neither the "call" nor the neighbor's sighting has been verified by LE, I don't think.

captivagrl
10-09-2011, 05:04 PM
Someone did ask earlier today, but I missed the answer, who was the last non-family member to see Lisa? And when exactly was that? Did they really see her, or for instance assume she was asleep in her crib. Mom did state that she had a cold.

grandmaj
10-09-2011, 05:04 PM
In that video posted above it looks as though LE stood on some sort of small table. Like an outside table to hold drinks.

Jacie Estes
10-09-2011, 05:05 PM
So besides re-enacting the window which was being either recorded or pictures taken by a detective from what I can see in the pics, did they do anything else? Anyone?

Doesn't seem so; not exactly like watching paint dry but I did laugh a couple of times and wished we had audio.

chieftess
10-09-2011, 05:06 PM
Sorry, I should have said, WISH THEY WOULD HAVE HAD MORE SUCCESS WITH DOGS IN THE BEGINNING.....IN A SITUATION PERSONAL TO ME:

They brought a canine from the XXXX police department to come sniff and follow the person's scent. The canines showed that this person parked at the end of our street, hugged close to each house until it got to ours and went right into the backyard, to the slide, and to our window. Amazing that a dog can figure all of this out

Maybe the dogs alerted them to more than they are saying....but it seems to me in other cases, if the dogs DID pick up on a strangers scent, which direction the perp (and/or victim) headed, etc. LE will announce that. I recall that has happened in several missing person cases.

I don't really know anything about scent dogs, but where did they find the scent to follow? I thought normally it was clothing? Or were the dogs able to detect the scent from the window and follow it?

Inspector Gidget
10-09-2011, 05:06 PM
I wonder if those cell phones were in the burning dumpster.My Hinky is still leading directly to the mother.Too many things happened that night.Father's first night shift.Door is left unlocked.The lights are on and the dumpster is burning.Who was over to visit with the mom? and what is she not telling.Now we hear about the teenager being there.Was that mentioned in the beginning and why not?

Jacie Estes
10-09-2011, 05:08 PM
Lisa had to have been taken away from the house on foot (carried) at least initially, why no scent? Are dogs not helpful when leading from the home of the missing? Too many scents to follow from daily activities? I guess I always count on dogs too much but there seems to be a lot that can't be determined. (I know there is always the right kind of dog, right kind of training debate...) Anyway, JMO.

Perhaps the scents were people that were usual to the house. Not to get back into the 'DNA taken issue' but there may have been something found in a place where it may not have normally been. [I'll leave it right there for now]

Lavanda Dolce
10-09-2011, 05:08 PM
Doesn't seem so; not exactly like watching paint dry but I did laugh a couple of times and wished we had audio.

I believe the most recent article said they removed more items from the home. Hopefully a hard drive.

Lera213
10-09-2011, 05:09 PM
On media page on the second day a person by the name of MB posted a comment. I found it strange if this is her soon to be x husband if it was him to be posting and seemed to have knowledge of the case so soon.

KaylynnCouture
10-09-2011, 05:09 PM
I have trying to keep up with this thread but have a few questions that I hope someone can answer for me


Is there a military base within 100 miles of the Irwin household?
A few days back there was mention of a call made/received from one of the stolen phones after midnight. Has this been verified by LE?
Has anyone been verified as the person walking down the street with a baby that was seen by the neighbor?


The only military base within 100 miles is Fort Leavenworth, which is approx 30 miles from the Irwin home.

There's also an air force base, but I'm not sure what the name of it is, which is located about the same distance (30 miles).

KellyConQueso
10-09-2011, 05:09 PM
Lisa had to have been taken away from the house on foot (carried) at least initially, why no scent? Are dogs not helpful when leading from the home of the missing? Too many scents to follow from daily activities? I guess I always count on dogs too much but there seems to be a lot that can't be determined. (I know there is always the right kind of dog, right kind of training debate...) Anyway, JMO.

When we walk around, we are constantly shedding skin cells - that is what the dogs are sniffing. If she was carried out of the house in a duffel bag or wrapped in a freshly laundered blanket then maybe there just weren't enough skin cells for the the dogs to track. Also, the fact that she was freshly bathed might actually have hindered the dogs somewhat.

Lavanda Dolce
10-09-2011, 05:10 PM
I don't really know anything about scent dogs, but where did they find the scent to follow? I thought normally it was clothing? Or were the dogs able to detect the scent from the window and follow it?

For one everyone keeps mentioning if the baby was carried out a scent would not be able to be followed, however, remember...while hopes are to follow the scent of the child ...a stranger at the window scent could be picked up and followed...so why that didn't happen is another indicator that the person did not come in through or exit that window, in my opinion.

Dewey2Me1MoThyme
10-09-2011, 05:11 PM
I just came in from working on the house to grab a coffee and FoxNews was saying they had metal detectors being used in the yard again today. Sorry no link at this time.

kmartin96
10-09-2011, 05:11 PM
I don't really know anything about scent dogs, but where did they find the scent to follow? I thought normally it was clothing? Or were the dogs able to detect the scent from the window and follow it?

My understanding the scent was from the Little Tikes slide and the screen that had been pushed up. The dogs were able to track where the person had walked (along the houses) and also where the scent began/ended (car that would have been parked at the end of the block).

In Lisa's case, maybe the dogs didn't alert to a 'stranger scent'....because there was no stranger??

KaylynnCouture
10-09-2011, 05:11 PM
Someone did ask earlier today, but I missed the answer, who was the last non-family member to see Lisa? And when exactly was that? Did they really see her, or for instance assume she was asleep in her crib. Mom did state that she had a cold.

On October 2nd, there was a birthday party for Lisa's older brother where numerous friends/extended family members were there, and saw Lisa.

You can see pictures from the birthday party here: http://www.kctv5.com/slideshow?widgetid=37993

gliving
10-09-2011, 05:11 PM
Good questions.

There's a KC-area military base: it's Richards-Gebaur AFB.

Neither the "call" nor the neighbor's sighting has been verified by LE, I don't think.

We could add in Whiteman Air Force Base MO and stretch it for Fort Riley KS.

ETA Forbes Field Air Force Base Topeka KS

lauriej
10-09-2011, 05:12 PM
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2047200/Lisa-Irwin-missing-Mother-Deborah-Bradley-married-man.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

Is her maiden named Bradley or her married name? I hear her also being called Debra Netts? His and her body language is odd in this pic, her leaning strangely into him but looks as if reserved, him with his hands in his pockets...

..maiden name netz...married name bradley.

Celeste
10-09-2011, 05:12 PM
I have trying to keep up with this thread but have a few questions that I hope someone can answer for me


Is there a military base within 100 miles of the Irwin household?
A few days back there was mention of a call made/received from one of the stolen phones after midnight. Has this been verified by LE?
Has anyone been verified as the person walking down the street with a baby that was seen by the neighbor?


Your screen name is making me hungry.
Man, could I stand some chile con queso right about now.

mrye4709
10-09-2011, 05:13 PM
I have trying to keep up with this thread but have a few questions that I hope someone can answer for me


Is there a military base within 100 miles of the Irwin household?
A few days back there was mention of a call made/received from one of the stolen phones after midnight. Has this been verified by LE?
Has anyone been verified as the person walking down the street with a baby that was seen by the neighbor?


I think there is an Air Force base close, not sure.
The call or text seems to be a rumor so far.
Nothing came of the man carrying a baby.

kmartin96
10-09-2011, 05:14 PM
For one everyone keeps mentioning if the baby was carried out a scent would not be able to be followed, however, remember...while hopes are to follow the scent of the child ...a stranger at the window scent could be picked up and followed...so why that didn't happen is another indicator that the person did not come in through or exit that window, in my opinion.


Or, it could be an indicator that the scent was not from a stranger, but someone who belonged there.

luckyme
10-09-2011, 05:15 PM
Tomorrow will be 7 days! :(

chieftess
10-09-2011, 05:15 PM
For one everyone keeps mentioning if the baby was carried out a scent would not be able to be followed, however, remember...while hopes are to follow the scent of the child ...a stranger at the window scent could be picked up and followed...so why that didn't happen is another indicator that the person did not come in through or exit that window, in my opinion.
Thanks!
In using the case kmartin is referencing, that is what I was trying to put together in my head. If the dogs can pick up a strange scent, then why was none found outside baby Lisa's home.
Of course, that question has a couple of different answers.

lauriej
10-09-2011, 05:16 PM
On media page on the second day a person by the name of MB posted a comment. I found it strange if this is her soon to be x husband if it was him to be posting and seemed to have knowledge of the case so soon.

..the initials of the 'soon-to-be-X' are SB though. ..(their 5 year old son is MB.)

Snowbunny
10-09-2011, 05:16 PM
The only military base within 100 miles is Fort Leavenworth, which is approx 30 miles from the Irwin home.

There's also an air force base, but I'm not sure what the name of it is, which is located about the same distance (30 miles).

I believe the AFB is Whiteman AFB but I'm not sure if it is still open. I retired from the USAF back in 1994 so that was a long time ago and haven't kept up with things.

kmartin96
10-09-2011, 05:17 PM
Exactly!

norest4thewicked
10-09-2011, 05:18 PM
The only military base within 100 miles is Fort Leavenworth, which is approx 30 miles from the Irwin home.

There's also an air force base, but I'm not sure what the name of it is, which is located about the same distance (30 miles).

Whiteman AFB is less than 100 miles from KC.

Lavanda Dolce
10-09-2011, 05:18 PM
When we walk around, we are constantly shedding skin cells - that is what the dogs are sniffing. If she was carried out of the house in a duffel bag or wrapped in a freshly laundered blanket then maybe there just weren't enough skin cells for the the dogs to track. Also, the fact that she was freshly bathed might actually have hindered the dogs somewhat.

Depends on what kind of dog is used. If it is a cadaver dog they will find and follow scent of a deceased person. If the PD used strictly cadaver dogs (which is what most PD Departments use in cases as this) and the dog did not pick up a scent...that gives likely hope child is alive. If a dog that trails scents picking up one at the window and then follows it...that would give an indication of where the person went or how long the dog could track the scent. Again..at this point no scent was picked up for either.

JeannieC
10-09-2011, 05:18 PM
I have trying to keep up with this thread but have a few questions that I hope someone can answer for me


Is there a military base within 100 miles of the Irwin household?
Snipped


There are three military bases in Mo. Two are very close.




Air Force Bases
Whiteman AFB Johnson
Whiteman Air Force Base is operated by the Air Force Global Strike Command and located in Johnson Co...

Army Bases
Fort Leonard Wood Pulaski
Established in 1940, Fort Leonard Wood in Missouri was named after Major General Leonard Wood, best ...

Marine Bases
MC Mobilization Command Kansas City
The Marine Corps Mobilization Command serves as the main operations arm for the United States Marine...


http://militarybases.com/missouri/

Snowbunny
10-09-2011, 05:18 PM
Whiteman AFB is located 70 miles east-southeast of Kansas City.

norest4thewicked
10-09-2011, 05:20 PM
On media page on the second day a person by the name of MB posted a comment. I found it strange if this is her soon to be x husband if it was him to be posting and seemed to have knowledge of the case so soon.

Her ex-husbands initials are SB.

norest4thewicked
10-09-2011, 05:21 PM
There are three military bases in Mo. Two are very close.



http://militarybases.com/missouri/

Ft. Leavenworth in Kansas is the closest of them all...

panthera
10-09-2011, 05:21 PM
Good questions.

There's a KC-area military base: it's Richards-Gebaur AFB. Ft. Leavenworth is also right across the border, in Kansas.

Neither the "call" nor the neighbor's sighting has been verified by LE, I don't think.

On Judge Pirro's program last night, Capt. Young could not comment on the alleged phone call.

mrye4709
10-09-2011, 05:21 PM
You know, she is a little to old to pass off for a baby born while someone was deployed (even if deployed a year, they would have been 7 mths along), but what if a gf of a soldier is trying to get her bf back and claiming they have a child together? I know some military are due back within days, as my SIL is one of them. Possible?

Snowbunny
10-09-2011, 05:22 PM
KS is right there also and I believe they have military installations in that state as well.

neesaki
10-09-2011, 05:22 PM
http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/justic...list_id=163706

In this interview, watching DB, she breaks down when she mentions the computer room window left open, which seems like genuine guilt and regret. She also breaks down when they find Lisa isn't in her crib. I don't know, it appears real to me. I guess what I'm saying, is that her emotional reactions seem to be appropriate for what they have said happened, thus lending their story credibility. I'm beginning to think that JB is just very stoic and is very uncomfortable displaying emotions, especially on national TV. JMO

chieftess
10-09-2011, 05:23 PM
Does anyone know if SB is even stationed stateside? I would think a quick call from LE to his commanding officer could establish whether he could be a poi or not.

norest4thewicked
10-09-2011, 05:23 PM
You know, she is a little to old to pass off for a baby born while someone was deployed (even if deployed a year, they would have been 7 mths along), but what if a gf of a soldier is trying to get her bf back and claiming they have a child together? I know some military are due back within days, as my SIL is one of them. Possible?

I guess at this point, anything is possible...:(

krimekat
10-09-2011, 05:23 PM
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2047200/Lisa-Irwin-missing-Mother-Deborah-Bradley-married-man.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

Is her maiden named Bradley or her married name? I hear her also being called Debra Netts? His and her body language is odd in this pic, her leaning strangely into him but looks as if reserved, him with his hands in his pockets...

Netts = Deborah's father's last name

Kelly Faraday
10-09-2011, 05:23 PM
Sorry it took me so long to get this thread up. It takes forever to link those previous threads!


Hi KaylynnCouture,

Your baby girl (hope she wouldn't mind me calling her that!) is absolutely beautiful!!

Joining you in prayer that our little Lisa will somehow come safely home and get to be 4 yrs. old someday. Can you imagine how cute she will be?

Kelly

Lera213
10-09-2011, 05:23 PM
..the initials of the 'soon-to-be-X' are SB though. ..(their 5 year old son is MB.)

Yes but the soon to be x middle name starts with an "M" for all we know he goes by that name.

PlainJaneDoe
10-09-2011, 05:24 PM
Kaylynn, I think that dogs can follow a scent of someone who was riding in a car, so I would assume that it wouldn't matter if Lisa was being carried. If you like, I can try to find a link. For some reason I'm having trouble finding it at the moment.

KaylynnCouture
10-09-2011, 05:24 PM
You know, she is a little to old to pass off for a baby born while someone was deployed (even if deployed a year, they would have been 7 mths along), but what if a gf of a soldier is trying to get her bf back and claiming they have a child together? I know some military are due back within days, as my SIL is one of them. Possible?

Definitely possible, I think. I hope LE is looking into that aspect.

I hope your SIL has safe travels back home, and a major thanks for her service!

norest4thewicked
10-09-2011, 05:24 PM
Does anyone know if SB is even stationed stateside? I would think a quick call from LE to his commanding officer could establish whether he could be a poi or not.

I would think if he's not deployed, he would be at Ft Leavenworth...

cindysue
10-09-2011, 05:25 PM
Depends on what kind of dog is used. If it is a cadaver dog they will find and follow scent of a deceased person. If the PD used strictly cadaver dogs (which is what most PD Departments use in cases as this) and the dog did not pick up a scent...that gives likely hope child is alive. If a dog that trails scents picking up one at the window and then follows it...that would give an indication of where the person went or how long the dog could track the scent. Again..at this point no scent was picked up for either.

Well if the perp didnt use the window then there would be no scent also

~n/t~
10-09-2011, 05:25 PM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15647944/police-again-questioning-missing
Video link of possible recreation.

I wish they would've had the female cop try it. That cop is tall and husky from what I can tell.

gliving
10-09-2011, 05:25 PM
Whoa! forgot about Whiteman. Fort Riley is "a ways" but should be listed as area too. Good ones.

So...
Richards-Gebaur AFB
Whiteman AFB
Ft Leavenworth
Ft Riley

The Kansas Air National Guard is based at Topeka Forbes Field.

KaylynnCouture
10-09-2011, 05:26 PM
Hi KaylynnCouture,

Your baby girl (hope she wouldn't mind me calling her that!) is absolutely beautiful!!

Joining you in prayer that our little Lisa will somehow come safely home and get to be 4 yrs. old someday. Can you imagine how cute she will be?

Kelly

Thank you!! She turns 4 next Sunday, so I figured I would put it up all week in honor of her. She's an amazing kid.

And, I agree..I would love nothing more right now then to see baby Lisa home just in time to celebrate her 11 month birthday this Tuesday, and her 1 year birthday next month. She is a gorgeous little girl who has her whole life in front of her.

KellyConQueso
10-09-2011, 05:26 PM
The only military base within 100 miles is Fort Leavenworth, which is approx 30 miles from the Irwin home.

There's also an air force base, but I'm not sure what the name of it is, which is located about the same distance (30 miles).

OK - the reason I ask about a military connection is the possibility that this baby was stolen by a woman with a boyfriend in the military. This woman has been telling this serviceman that he is the father of her child that was born after he left for the Middle East. Now he's coming back and she is desperate for a baby to show him. Maybe she knew of baby Lisa because she works/worked at a local grocery store/dollar store/Wal-Mart.

This is one of the few scenarios that I can think of where the baby is being well cared for.

KaylynnCouture
10-09-2011, 05:26 PM
Netts = Deborah's father's last name

I think it's Netz.

laytonian
10-09-2011, 05:27 PM
Her ex-husbands initials are SB.

NOW we know why the grandparents have been so quiet.

He's not her ex.
Despite her claims of being "engaged", she's still married to her husband:

Source: Daily Mail (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2047200/Lisa-Irwin-missing-Mother-Deborah-Bradley-married-man.html?ito=feeds-newsxml).

Quote: "Kansas City parents Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin have talked about their engagement and wedding plans in interviews since their baby disappeared in Missouri on Monday ... Bradley and her husband Sean Bradley separated four years ago, but never got divorced, they say.
The family of Mr Bradley, who is currently away serving in the Army..."

So. She's living with (and has a child by) another man she's "planning a wedding" to, but didn't bother to divorce? Is she still drawing military benefits, like healthcare, commissary shopping, BX, base privileges? (I'd think that was immoral, because she's not entitled to them.)
Mr. Bradley's children would be entitled, but she'd only have access to certain things IF they were divorced.

KaylynnCouture
10-09-2011, 05:28 PM
OK - the reason I ask about a military connection is the possibility that this baby was stolen by a woman with a boyfriend in the military. This woman has been telling this serviceman that he is the father of her child that was born after he left for the Middle East. Now he's coming back and she is desperate for a baby to show him. Maybe she knew of baby Lisa because she works/worked at a local grocery store/dollar store/Wal-Mart.

This is one of the few scenarios that I can think of where the baby is being well cared for.

Back in the early days of this case breaking, a poster (I can't remember who now, sorry!) brought up this theory, and it's been in my head ever since. I think it's a long shot, but I've got my fingers crossed this is what happened because it would mean baby Lisa is ok.

Also...apparently Deborah is still married to her husband (who is not Lisa's father, and the man she's engaged to..) and he is in the army. Maybe it's possible that someone he works with knew of baby Lisa?

IAM
10-09-2011, 05:29 PM
The only way the father would have access to the child, long enough to wisk her away, without the mother being present would be if he went on night shift and new the mother was a sound sleeper. She was a stay at home mom. Now if the father for some reason: didn't belive he was the father, or believed he was the father and wanted out of relationship but wanted his daughter, or was in financial difficulty and hate to say this...but had insurance. Wouldn't changing to night shift be a great way to accomplish this? I would be looking into his family members (some at the party). Or be checking to see if he had a mistress. His behaviour is just baffling to me.

Inspector Gidget
10-09-2011, 05:29 PM
I know everybody acts different under stressful situations,that being said I still can't believe they turned their back on LE for awhile.It just tells me they have something to hide.I would be at the mercy of LE if my baby was missing.I found it strange they gave Deborah a poly and not Jeremy.LE knows something.

Jacie Estes
10-09-2011, 05:30 PM
The only military base within 100 miles is Fort Leavenworth, which is approx 30 miles from the Irwin home.

There's also an air force base, but I'm not sure what the name of it is, which is located about the same distance (30 miles).

Whiteman AFB?

KaylynnCouture
10-09-2011, 05:30 PM
Whiteman AFB?

Yes, thanks!

Celeste
10-09-2011, 05:30 PM
I'm not good at looking for this sort of thing, as I don't participate in it much myself, but has anyone detected much of an online presence for Mom? Did she participate in baby boards, social networks, stuff like that?

Snowbunny
10-09-2011, 05:31 PM
http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/justic...list_id=163706

In this interview, watching DB, she breaks down when she mentions the computer room window left open, which seems like genuine guilt and regret. She also breaks down when they find Lisa isn't in her crib. I don't know, it appears real to me. I guess what I'm saying, is that her emotional reactions seem to be appropriate for what they have said happened, thus lending their story credibility. I'm beginning to think that JB is just very stoic and is very uncomfortable displaying emotions, especially on national TV. JMO

The mother probably started crying at the mention of the window being left open because she probably feels guilty that without thinking she may have left her child in harms way by leaving that window open. That's a nature reaction.

wfgodot
10-09-2011, 05:31 PM
• Forbes Field, Topeka
• Whiteman AFB
• Ft Leavenworth
• Ft Riley

Quoting self, sorry. We think these are all within maybe 100 miles+/-

KaylynnCouture
10-09-2011, 05:31 PM
I'm not good at looking for this sort of thing, as I don't participate in it much myself, but has anyone detected much of an online presence for Mom? Did she participate in baby boards, social networks, stuff like that?

I could start looking around. With her having 3 possible alias's (Netz, Bradley and Irwin)..it might take some time.

Lera213
10-09-2011, 05:32 PM
NOW we know why the grandparents have been so quiet.

He's not her ex.
Despite her claims of being "engaged", she's still married to her husband:

Source: Daily Mail (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2047200/Lisa-Irwin-missing-Mother-Deborah-Bradley-married-man.html?ito=feeds-newsxml).

Quote: "Kansas City parents Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin have talked about their engagement and wedding plans in interviews since their baby disappeared in Missouri on Monday ... Bradley and her husband Sean Bradley separated four years ago, but never got divorced, they say.
The family of Mr Bradley, who is currently away serving in the Army..."

So. She's living with (and has a child by) another man she's "planning a wedding" to, but didn't bother to divorce? Is she still drawing military benefits, like healthcare, commissary shopping, BX, base privileges? (I'd think that was immoral, because she's not entitled to them.)If they have a kid together and in the divorce settlement he has to pay for medical then indeed those children would be on Tricare Prime health insurance and the kids would have id cards and allowed to shop at the BX and Commissary. The wife would have a limited ID so that she can shop for them.

Edit to add: The only thing she would lose with divorce is the SGLI if something happens to him, retirement benefits (he is too young for that) base housing (doh) and any alimony he is paying her.

neesaki
10-09-2011, 05:32 PM
You know, she is a little to old to pass off for a baby born while someone was deployed (even if deployed a year, they would have been 7 mths along), but what if a gf of a soldier is trying to get her bf back and claiming they have a child together? I know some military are due back within days, as my SIL is one of them. Possible?

Good idea, but because of DNA testing this ploy would not work.

mrye4709
10-09-2011, 05:32 PM
Definitely possible, I think. I hope LE is looking into that aspect.

I hope your SIL has safe travels back home, and a major thanks for her service!

Oh dear, perhaps I didn't use the right letters, lol. Son in law :crazy:
Who will get to meet his daughter for the first time :woohoo:

norest4thewicked
10-09-2011, 05:33 PM
Quoting self, sorry. We think these are all within maybe 100 miles+/-

Only Whiteman and Ft. Leavenworth would be that close.

luckyme
10-09-2011, 05:34 PM
Does anyone know if SB is even stationed stateside? I would think a quick call from LE to his commanding officer could establish whether he could be a poi or not.

Last i heard he was contacted and he hasnt seen DB for two years. I beleive it was on a news site early last week. I will try and find link.

MsFacetious
10-09-2011, 05:34 PM
Once again, to recognize how few non-family INFANT abductions there are, here are our statistics....

Since 1983 (almost 30 years), there have only been 278 INFANT abductions. Of these, only 12 infants have not be recovered or located. Of the 278, almost half of these were newborn abductions from hospitals. So...as we look at 30 years, we can see how few non-family infant abductions there are.

ETA: I hate to say "only" 278 infant abductions....just 1 would be too many. But when you compare infant abductions to child abductions the numbers are very low.

I don't think anyone really thinks Lisa was taken by a complete stranger. Someone who knew them somehow.


These are abduction by "Non family members, which is misleading... that means Not parents or legal guardians."
So grandparents, aunt, sister... if not the legal guardian would be included in "Non family members" by their definition.

http://www.missingkids.com/en_US/documents/InfantAbductionStats.pdf

Though really, Lisa would NOT be included in these statistics because she is 10 months old.

These statistics ONLY apply to 0 to 6 months old. If you add 7-12 months, how many more are there?

For the sake of discussion, when were these statistics updated?
Does this include 4 month old Ramy taken in May, in the middle of the night by her paternal Grandmother who'd only met her once?
Not a stranger but an identical scenario to Lisa, as far as the abduction went.
She also is a "non-family member" abduction and would be included, because she was not taken by a parent or guardian.

Does it include babies who were abducted as infants and found as adults recently? Or are they still among the "missing?"

Where do the completely unsolved cases fit in? Sabrina, 5 months old?
Where does she go? They don't list that year specifically... she doesn't appear to be there at all.
So perhaps they are only counting absolutely confirmed abductions caught on camera or with witnesses/violence and that is why the majority are from health care facilities?

I wonder how many more there are that are abducted from the home, that are not listed because someone decided the parents did it and the baby was never found?

http://www.missingkids.com/en_US/documents/InfantAbductionStats.pdf

Out of the 278 Newborn - 6 month old infants abducted by a non guardian/non parent...

112 of those were from the home.
No times, locations in the home or circumstances given.
33 included violence to the mother.
4 still missing.

38 were "other places" (not the home, or health care locations.)
10 included violence to the mother.
3 still missing.

Jacie Estes
10-09-2011, 05:35 PM
Whoa! forgot about Whiteman. Fort Riley is "a ways" but should be listed as area too. Good ones.

So...
Richards-Gebaur AFB
Whiteman AFB
Ft Leavenworth
Ft Riley

How did you miss the rattling windows? ;)

Snowbunny
10-09-2011, 05:35 PM
If these parents are not involved can you imagine what they are going through? Their child is missing which is bad enough and a lot of people include the police are pointing their fingers at them or at least the mother.

KaylynnCouture
10-09-2011, 05:35 PM
Oh dear, perhaps I didn't use the right letters, lol. Son in law :crazy:
Who will get to meet his daughter for the first time :woohoo:

No, I probably just misinterpreted it..SIL, in my brain, stands for "sister in law".

However, I'll reword it...MAJOR congrats and thanks to your son in law for his service, and how exciting that he'll get to meet his daughter for the first time!! :woohoo:

askfornina
10-09-2011, 05:36 PM
The mother probably started crying at the mention of the window being left open because she probably feels guilty that without thinking she may have left her child in harms way by leaving that window open. That's a nature reaction.

i agree. i feel like she is very genuine.

norest4thewicked
10-09-2011, 05:36 PM
Also, Richards-Gebaur Air Force Base is no longer in service. The city of Kansas City owns it now.

laytonian
10-09-2011, 05:36 PM
OK - the reason I ask about a military connection is the possibility that this baby was stolen by a woman with a boyfriend in the military. This woman has been telling this serviceman that he is the father of her child that was born after he left for the Middle East. Now he's coming back and she is desperate for a baby to show him. Maybe she knew of baby Lisa because she works/worked at a local grocery store/dollar store/Wal-Mart.

This is one of the few scenarios that I can think of where the baby is being well cared for.

I think Lisa's too old for that kind of scenario, which would require a nine-month pregnancy and then ten more months after the child's birth.

Army tours to Iraq/Afghanistan are normally 12 months, with some extended to 15.

Lavanda Dolce
10-09-2011, 05:36 PM
You know, she is a little to old to pass off for a baby born while someone was deployed (even if deployed a year, they would have been 7 mths along), but what if a gf of a soldier is trying to get her bf back and claiming they have a child together? I know some military are due back within days, as my SIL is one of them. Possible?

We think alike. I posted that the very day she went missing. I was trying to think of every possible scenario as to why someone would want an "older" baby as opposed to a newborn...that was the only thing that came to mind.

krimekat
10-09-2011, 05:36 PM
I think it's Netz.

sorry - just responding to a post . . .

KaylynnCouture
10-09-2011, 05:37 PM
Last i heard he was contacted and he hasnt seen DB for two years. I beleive it was on a news site early last week. I will try and find link.

According to http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2047200/Lisa-Irwin-missing-Mother-Deborah-Bradley-married-man.html they separated 4 years ago, and he is currently away serving in the Army.

SondraK
10-09-2011, 05:38 PM
Some men are just not programmed to cry. This does not mean they do not feel as deeply, only that their outward reactions are different.
I am not inclined to cry over sad situations, but more likely to be the strength and functioning one for those around me. However, just give me good news, and I become a crying, snotty, blubbering mess. Praise God we are all unique in our own way. We complement each other and it strengthens us.
I would love to respond to the news that Lisa is coming home, tears and all.

neesaki
10-09-2011, 05:38 PM
The mother probably started crying at the mention of the window being left open because she probably feels guilty that without thinking she may have left her child in harms way by leaving that window open. That's a nature reaction.

My sentiments as well, which seems to lend credibility to their story of what happened.

PlainJaneDoe
10-09-2011, 05:38 PM
They turned their back on LE, but were being paid for interviews (at least by ABC News who got that "exclusive").

Are you serious!? I knew I wasn't caught up on all of Lisa's threads. :(

wfgodot
10-09-2011, 05:39 PM
Also, Richards-Gebaur Air Force Base is no longer in service. The city of Kansas City owns it now.
You're right, closed in '94. Still a bit of a military presence around there, according to dear ol' Wiki. And Ft Riley's about 120 miles - close enough for government work!

norest4thewicked
10-09-2011, 05:39 PM
I think Lisa's too old for that kind of scenario, which would require a nine-month pregnancy and then ten more months after the child's birth.

Army tours to Iraq/Afghanistan are normally 12 months, with some extended to 15.

Also, how would she have explained not sending him photos of his child all this time?

luckyme
10-09-2011, 05:40 PM
According to http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2047200/Lisa-Irwin-missing-Mother-Deborah-Bradley-married-man.html they separated 4 years ago, and he is currently away serving in the Army.

Thank you! :seeya:

gliving
10-09-2011, 05:40 PM
Back in the early days of this case breaking, a poster (I can't remember who now, sorry!) brought up this theory, and it's been in my head ever since. I think it's a long shot, but I've got my fingers crossed this is what happened because it would mean baby Lisa is ok.

Also...apparently Deborah is still married to her husband (who is not Lisa's father, and the man she's engaged to..) and he is in the army. Maybe it's possible that someone he works with knew of baby Lisa?

I've held on to that idea also. Here's a poster with Lisa dressed as a boy. The caption says:

"Normally newborn babies are abducted and “passed off as their own.” In this case, because Baby Lisa is 10 months old, be aware of any military soldiers coming home to greet a girlfriend or wife with a child that may not be his. It may be Baby Lisa. Perhaps the abductor could not find an infant “in time.” Be aware of any families that have recently “adopted” a ten month – 1 year old child. Look closely at new neighbors with a baby as it could be Lisa. She is a bit bigger than most 10 month old children and could pass, in body size, for a child a bit older. "

http://thelostnmissing.blogspot.com/2011/10/lisa-irwin-abducted-baby-disguised-as.html?spref=tw

laytonian
10-09-2011, 05:40 PM
If they have a kid together and in the divorce settlement he has to pay for medical then indeed those children would be on Tricare Prime health insurance and the kids would have id cards and allowed to shop at the BX and Commissary. The wife would have a limited ID so that she can shop for them.

Edit to add: The only thing she would lose with divorce is the SGLI if something happens to him, retirement benefits (he is too young for that) base housing (doh) and any alimony he is paying her.

...but since they're not divorced (no settlement), she's able to get all the benefits she had when they were together.
I worked with the military for 27 years, and saw the game played in interesting ways. I also had divorced/separated wives working for me, and some were getting shares of the "separate rats" and housing allowances.

Lavanda Dolce
10-09-2011, 05:40 PM
I think Lisa's too old for that kind of scenario, which would require a nine-month pregnancy and then ten more months after the child's birth.

Army tours to Iraq/Afghanistan are normally 12 months, with some extended to 15.

It is possible. Doesn't mean he was deployed to either place. He could have been doing a 2-year stint in the Navy and broke it off with her and maybe she just "popped" it to him now that she had "his baby" with the hopes of getting him back. Anything is possible and a thousand scenarios that we can come up with for finding the mom guilty, or the dad guilty, or a neighbor, or an ex family, or a stranger abduction...etc. This case is going to need physical evidence such as the cell phone records, cell phones, fingerprints, dna, computer hard drive...or an actual lead to a person who has never had a baby and is now with one that looks like Lisa. There just has to be some physical evidence at this point. Or a confession if it ends up being within the family unit. So sad. I don't want this case to turn into a Madeline McCann.

~n/t~
10-09-2011, 05:41 PM
NOW we know why the grandparents have been so quiet.

He's not her ex.
Despite her claims of being "engaged", she's still married to her husband:

Source: Daily Mail (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2047200/Lisa-Irwin-missing-Mother-Deborah-Bradley-married-man.html?ito=feeds-newsxml).

Quote: "Kansas City parents Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin have talked about their engagement and wedding plans in interviews since their baby disappeared in Missouri on Monday ... Bradley and her husband Sean Bradley separated four years ago, but never got divorced, they say.
The family of Mr Bradley, who is currently away serving in the Army..."

So. She's living with (and has a child by) another man she's "planning a wedding" to, but didn't bother to divorce? Is she still drawing military benefits, like healthcare, commissary shopping, BX, base privileges? (I'd think that was immoral, because she's not entitled to them.)
Mr. Bradley's children would be entitled, but she'd only have access to certain things IF they were divorced.


paternal grandparents? I wasn't here most of the day but I just read an article a few minutes ago quoting the Irwin side of the family supporting mom.

I don't know family law in the USA but being separated 4 years and living with another man and having a child is not unusual up here. Some get quick divorces...others drag on for years for whatever reason. Financial issues, custody issues, etc.

Does the woman just wait around until the divorce is final to go on with her life? :waitasec:

Jacie Estes
10-09-2011, 05:41 PM
Also, Richards-Gebaur Air Force Base is no longer in service. The city of Kansas City owns it now.

Is that the downtown airport? Can't think of the highway[ Broadway Bridge?] now but we used to take it to go to El Ranchos on 9th. Is that still there? I LOVED that place. Salsa that makes your mouth numb.

Lavanda Dolce
10-09-2011, 05:42 PM
I've held on to that idea also. Here's a poster with Lisa dressed as a boy. The caption says:

"Normally newborn babies are abducted and “passed off as their own.” In this case, because Baby Lisa is 10 months old, be aware of any military soldiers coming home to greet a girlfriend or wife with a child that may not be his. It may be Baby Lisa. Perhaps the abductor could not find an infant “in time.” Be aware of any families that have recently “adopted” a ten month – 1 year old child. Look closely at new neighbors with a baby as it could be Lisa. She is a bit bigger than most 10 month old children and could pass, in body size, for a child a bit older. "

http://thelostnmissing.blogspot.com/2011/10/lisa-irwin-abducted-baby-disguised-as.html?spref=tw


My organization is who put that out.

Pensfan
10-09-2011, 05:43 PM
Deborah's and Jeremy's home is approx 1.5 miles from the huge Missouri River. Has LE started looking around the Missouri River?

http://maps.google.com/maps?client=safari&rls=en&q=kansas+city+,+mo+north+brighton+and+lister&oe=UTF-8&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hq=&hnear=0x87c0f9a07762e149:0x7a13f52e5f49ddc5,N+Brig hton+Ave+%26+N+Lister+Ave,+Kansas+City,+MO+64117&gl=us&ei=IRSSTp_jLpPF0AHGlYkR&sa=X&oi=geocode_result&ct=title&resnum=1&ved=0CB0Q8gEwAA

askfornina
10-09-2011, 05:43 PM
They turned their back on LE, but were being paid for interviews (at least by ABC News who got that "exclusive").

can i get more info on this? a source perhaps? TIA :)

wfgodot
10-09-2011, 05:44 PM
Deborah's and Jeremy's home is approx 1.5 miles from the huge Missouri River. Has LE started looking around the Missouri River?

http://maps.google.com/maps?client=safari&rls=en&q=kansas+city+,+mo+north+brighton+and+lister&oe=UTF-8&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hq=&hnear=0x87c0f9a07762e149:0x7a13f52e5f49ddc5,N+Brig hton+Ave+%26+N+Lister+Ave,+Kansas+City,+MO+64117&gl=us&ei=IRSSTp_jLpPF0AHGlYkR&sa=X&oi=geocode_result&ct=title&resnum=1&ved=0CB0Q8gEwAA

Not sure. I posed the question yesterday but got no response.

krimekat
10-09-2011, 05:44 PM
They turned their back on LE, but were being paid for interviews (at least by ABC News who got that "exclusive").

Where is a link that says they were PAID & how much - thanks!

mrye4709
10-09-2011, 05:44 PM
If these parents are not involved can you imagine what they are going through? Their child is missing which is bad enough and a lot of people include the police are pointing their fingers at them or at least the mother.

It is sad, but I understand the LE having to do that. I hope it is true that they are looking hard at IDI, also. It's just that this is happening so often and it is usually the parents. I think alot of people thought Breanns parents were guilty, too.

Inspector Gidget
10-09-2011, 05:44 PM
If these parents are not involved can you imagine what they are going through? Their child is missing which is bad enough and a lot of people include the police are pointing their fingers at them or at least the mother.

I wouldn't care who anyone pointed fingers at as long as they were trying to find my child.Lisa needs to be found,it is no time for game playing or hurt egos. Lisa is the victim,not them.They asked for help,they got it.

Lavanda Dolce
10-09-2011, 05:45 PM
paternal grandparents? I wasn't here most of the day but I just read an article a few minutes ago quoting the Irwin side of the family supporting mom.

I don't know family law in the USA but being separated 4 years and living with another man and having a child is not unusual up here. Some get quick divorces...others drag on for years for whatever reason. Financial issues, custody issues, etc.

Does the woman just wait around until the divorce is final to go on with her life? :waitasec:

Not sure if his child support is deducted from his military pay, but maybe they made a side deal that as long as he allowed her to stay on his ins. he would not have to pay child support considering she was recently pregnant and gave birth.

laytonian
10-09-2011, 05:45 PM
Are you serious!? I knew I wasn't caught up on all of Lisa's threads. :(

I'm serious. There's no way they're not being compensated for those "exclusive interviews" and ABC News's "exclusive peek inside the home".

This is obviously a poor family; someone's paying for those hotels and other "considerations".

KaylynnCouture
10-09-2011, 05:46 PM
I haven't heard anything about LE searching the Missouri River but I really hope they do.

SyraKelly
10-09-2011, 05:47 PM
I've held on to that idea also. Here's a poster with Lisa dressed as a boy. The caption says:

"Normally newborn babies are abducted and “passed off as their own.” In this case, because Baby Lisa is 10 months old, be aware of any military soldiers coming home to greet a girlfriend or wife with a child that may not be his. It may be Baby Lisa. Perhaps the abductor could not find an infant “in time.” Be aware of any families that have recently “adopted” a ten month – 1 year old child. Look closely at new neighbors with a baby as it could be Lisa. She is a bit bigger than most 10 month old children and could pass, in body size, for a child a bit older. "

http://thelostnmissing.blogspot.com/2011/10/lisa-irwin-abducted-baby-disguised-as.html?spref=tw

But if this has happened-I would think someone would have come forward already..its been 6 days! IDK..Thinkin out loud! I really wish this was the case though!!

Snowbunny
10-09-2011, 05:47 PM
Offutt AFB, NE, isn't but 2-1/2 hours away from Kansas City.

askfornina
10-09-2011, 05:47 PM
I wouldn't care who anyone pointed fingers at as long as they were trying to find my child.Lisa needs to be found,it is no time for game playing or hurt egos. Lisa is the victim,not them.They asked for help,they got it.

i haven't gotten a chance to see all the video interviews with the parents but as i recall the mother was saying almost exactly what you are saying there. (paraphrased) that she doesn't care what LE thinks or what anyone else thinks of her, she just wants the baby home and there are no hard feelings and she understands why LE is doing what they are doing. isn't that correct?

vasportsmom
10-09-2011, 05:47 PM
I knew it. I went to cook and now I am a thread behind. I was on page 20 of the old thread and look where we are now. I demand an audio option and would pay greatly for such. I read earlier where someone said their family was eating Birds Eye dinner or something, I am a big fan of cooking from scratch but my kids are about to be introduced to pizza delivery and boxed dinners.

ETA: Please let this end quick so I don't have to resort to desperate measures.

Lera213
10-09-2011, 05:47 PM
...but since they're not divorced (no settlement), she's able to get all the benefits she had when they were together.
I worked with the military for 27 years, and saw the game played in interesting ways. I also had divorced/separated wives working for me, and some were getting shares of the "separate rats" and housing allowances.

correct I was only addressing the issue if and when they got divorced. I am a retired E-9 spouse of 30 years in the Air Force and I worked for 15 years for Aafes as a supervisor.

*waves hello*

The separate rats depends on the divorce judgement. The Active Duty has to care for his dependent children in that provide shelter, medical and stuff. So if a divorce settlement a judge says he has to pay blah blah blah, then the GI can get partial rats.

chieftess
10-09-2011, 05:48 PM
Is that the downtown airport? Can't think of the highway[ Broadway Bridge?] now but we used to take it to go to El Ranchos on 9th. Is that still there? I LOVED that place. Salsa that makes your mouth numb.
The downtown airport is the Charles B. Wheeler Airport, Richards Gabauer is in the Grandview/Belton area.
Haven't ever been to El Ranchos, El Sombrero has always been my fave :)

sorrell skye
10-09-2011, 05:49 PM
Deborah's and Jeremy's home is approx 1.5 miles from the huge Missouri River. Has LE started looking around the Missouri River?

http://maps.google.com/maps?client=safari&rls=en&q=kansas+city+,+mo+north+brighton+and+lister&oe=UTF-8&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hq=&hnear=0x87c0f9a07762e149:0x7a13f52e5f49ddc5,N+Brig hton+Ave+%26+N+Lister+Ave,+Kansas+City,+MO+64117&gl=us&ei=IRSSTp_jLpPF0AHGlYkR&sa=X&oi=geocode_result&ct=title&resnum=1&ved=0CB0Q8gEwAA

Article from Oct. 4:

Kansas City Fire Department personnel, who already were out in department boats on a Missouri River training exercise, conducted a quick search of the north bank of the Missouri River, said department spokesman Joe Vitale.

Read more: http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/04/3187844/many-search-desperately-for-missing.html#ixzz1aK7tEMH5

AFAIK, that was the only search of the river.

vlpate
10-09-2011, 05:49 PM
I'm serious. There's no way they're not being compensated for those "exclusive interviews" and ABC News's "exclusive peek inside the home".
This is obviously a poor family; someone's paying for those hotels and other "considerations".

BBM
Really? How so?

~n/t~
10-09-2011, 05:50 PM
I'm serious. There's no way they're not being compensated for those "exclusive interviews" and ABC News's "exclusive peek inside the home".

This is obviously a poor family; someone's paying for those hotels and other "considerations".

Perhaps for the hotel accomodations but there is no proof they were paid for interviews.

KaylynnCouture
10-09-2011, 05:50 PM
Has this been posted yet?


"It appears the suspect entered/exited through a bedroom window," authorities said in a statement. "Evidence at the scene leads police to believe the child has been abducted."



snipped: http://articles.cnn.com/2011-10-08/us/us_missouri-missing-girl_1_missing-missouri-missouri-girl-police-station?_s=PM:US

gwenabob
10-09-2011, 05:51 PM
I'm serious. There's no way they're not being compensated for those "exclusive interviews" and ABC News's "exclusive peek inside the home".

This is obviously a poor family; someone's paying for those hotels and other "considerations".

I agree. There would be absolutely no benefit to give an "exclusive" interview to one news group if they were not being paid. You would think they would want each and every news outlet to have all the information. Why narrow your exposure unless you were getting something out of it? I have no doubt in my mind that they were paid, just like CA was paid for those photos at the beginning of her case.

If it were me, I would refuse any kind of exclusive deal because I would want *all* the media to have every tiny bit of information available so they could blast it to as large an audience as possible. I would worry about money later. If I were innocent, that is.

uvamerica
10-09-2011, 05:51 PM
Detectives return to Irwin home, recreate abduction http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/news/region_missouri/northland/detectives-back-at-irwin-home%2C-recreating-abduction#ixzz1aK6UFJv3

Renea
10-09-2011, 05:51 PM
Okay, I just watched last nights interview for the 3rd time today....

So, if my husband came home at 4am and the lights were on, door unlocked... He would just assume I fell asleep exhausted without securing the house... He wouldn't wake me up to ask me why I didn't turn off the lights,etc... he would just do it and then go to bed. What kind of husband wakes up his sleeping wife to ridicule her for something she (in his mind, at the time) failed to do?

In the interview they clearly state that they didn't realize Lisa was missing until after he woke her up about the lights being on, door open, ect.

Lavanda Dolce
10-09-2011, 05:51 PM
paternal grandparents? I wasn't here most of the day but I just read an article a few minutes ago quoting the Irwin side of the family supporting mom.

I don't know family law in the USA but being separated 4 years and living with another man and having a child is not unusual up here. Some get quick divorces...others drag on for years for whatever reason. Financial issues, custody issues, etc.

Does the woman just wait around until the divorce is final to go on with her life? :waitasec:

I honestly find the mom extremely sincere. I am going to look up what "eyes for lies" has to say about this case...just out of curiosity...because I am so mixed up with all the "it could be's" that I cannot formulate an opinion. My deep gut says the mom is innocent. It's the dad that I just am having a problem with.

wfgodot
10-09-2011, 05:51 PM
Article from Oct. 4:

Kansas City Fire Department personnel, who already were out in department boats on a Missouri River training exercise, conducted a quick search of the north bank of the Missouri River, said department spokesman Joe Vitale.

Read more: http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/04/3187844/many-search-desperately-for-missing.html#ixzz1aK7tEMH5
That's a vast river to have to search. LE, in fact, seems to search quickly - the landfill search was over before ya knew it, and the list of suspects provided by the parents seems to have been vetted and cleared awfully fast. Not sure how thorough a job they're doing. Tough job to do, I know, I know. But it does appear they decided on the parent(s) early on.

lauriej
10-09-2011, 05:51 PM
Deborah's and Jeremy's home is approx 1.5 miles from the huge Missouri River. Has LE started looking around the Missouri River?

http://maps.google.com/maps?client=safari&rls=en&q=kansas+city+,+mo+north+brighton+and+lister&oe=UTF-8&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hq=&hnear=0x87c0f9a07762e149:0x7a13f52e5f49ddc5,N+Brig hton+Ave+%26+N+Lister+Ave,+Kansas+City,+MO+64117&gl=us&ei=IRSSTp_jLpPF0AHGlYkR&sa=X&oi=geocode_result&ct=title&resnum=1&ved=0CB0Q8gEwAA

..they did initially-----i haven't heard mention of the river after that..

http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/04/3187844/many-search-desperately-for-missing.html

Kansas City Fire Department personnel, who already were out in department boats on a Missouri River training exercise, conducted a quick search of the north bank of the Missouri River, said department spokesman Joe Vitale.

Other firefighters used four lines to rappel down a steep, 100-foot embankment clogged with vegetation near Northeast 34th Terrace and North Myrtle Avenue. Firefighters dropped down, checked for the child and returned to the top, repeating the effort every 10 feet, according to Battalion Chief Randy Mullens.

“We have the crews specialized in rappelling. That is how we got involved,” Mullens said.

~n/t~
10-09-2011, 05:52 PM
Looking at the "birthday" photos which were taken not long ago, Lisa looks like a normal sized 10-11 month old baby to me. Not bigger in size at all.

krimekat
10-09-2011, 05:52 PM
I'm serious. There's no way they're not being compensated for those "exclusive interviews" and ABC News's "exclusive peek inside the home".

This is obviously a poor family; someone's paying for those hotels and other "considerations".

again, link please to substantiate your post. We all have opinions . . . but if you continue to post this info, please supply your source.

Lavanda Dolce
10-09-2011, 05:53 PM
Has this been posted yet?



snipped: http://articles.cnn.com/2011-10-08/us/us_missouri-missing-girl_1_missing-missouri-missouri-girl-police-station?_s=PM:US

That was an initial reporting by the media due to the conversations of the window screen bent in. Not sure that LE believes this now. It's possible...but not confirmed.

Pensfan
10-09-2011, 05:53 PM
I'm serious. There's no way they're not being compensated for those "exclusive interviews" and ABC News's "exclusive peek inside the home".

This is obviously a poor family; someone's paying for those hotels and other "considerations".
Nah, they are not being paid. They likely sold a really awesome photo of something like a dead snake which is apparently worth $15,000 (Roy Kronk). ;)

~n/t~
10-09-2011, 05:54 PM
I honestly find the mom extremely sincere. I am going to look up what "eyes for lies" has to say about this case...just out of curiosity...because I am so mixed up with all the "it could be's" that I cannot formulate an opinion. My deep gut says the mom is innocent. It's the dad that I just am having a problem with.

I was there this morning. She sees some of the same inconsistencies we do. The "we" versus the "I", etc.

o/t Interesting McCann video on her site as well.

lalalemon
10-09-2011, 05:54 PM
Where are you Beautiful Lisa? How can we possibly be on thread 11 and still have hardly anything to go on?

Lavanda Dolce
10-09-2011, 05:54 PM
Looking at the "birthday" photos which were taken not long ago, Lisa looks like a normal sized 10-11 month old baby to me. Not bigger in size at all.

I agree. My youngest was 26 lbs at 5 months old. He was huge. But he was also born at 22 1/2 inches long.

laytonian
10-09-2011, 05:55 PM
Not sure if his child support is deducted from his military pay, but maybe they made a side deal that as long as he allowed her to stay on his ins. he would not have to pay child support considering she was recently pregnant and gave birth.

If they're not divorced, there's no child support. But you're right, there's likely an informal deal -- and now that they're "famous", this will be scrutinized.

There's a basic dishonesty that bothers me here, that colors what else I believe about this case.

Since he's deployed overseas, there are benefits to the family/member over and above nondeployed status.
Source:
Combat Pay explanation (About.com) (http://usmilitary.about.com/od/militarypay/f/combatpay.htm)

Quote from above link:

So, let's take a married E-5, with six years of service, stationed at San Diego, CA:

Base Pay: $2,205.30
Housing Allowance: $1535
Food Allowance: $267.18
Family Separation Allowance: $250
Hazardous Duty Pay: $225
Hardship Duty Pay: $100
Total: $4,582.48 per month, or $54,989.76 per year, tax-free


It looks to me that there's more money available to the family, if they delay the divorce and make a deal, than if they divorce and he has to pay support.

wfgodot
10-09-2011, 05:55 PM
Has this been posted yet?
snipped: http://articles.cnn.com/2011-10-08/us/us_missouri-missing-girl_1_missing-missouri-missouri-girl-police-station?_s=PM:US
It certainly appears that LE thought they'd found other evidence of a kidnapper in addition to the window, doesn't it.

norest4thewicked
10-09-2011, 05:56 PM
Is that the downtown airport? Can't think of the highway[ Broadway Bridge?] now but we used to take it to go to El Ranchos on 9th. Is that still there? I LOVED that place. Salsa that makes your mouth numb.

Yes..that's the one, but the city owns it now. :)

uvamerica
10-09-2011, 05:56 PM
*snipped* Irwin also sold T-shirts for $15 with Lisa's face and kidnapping story on them. The money from the shirts is supposed to go to a reward fund, which has not been officially set up yet.


The family spokesperson did not return our phone calls. Ashley Irwin said neither Jeremy or Deborah were interested in talking.


http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/news/region_missouri/northland/detectives-back-at-irwin-home%2C-recreating-abduction#ixzz1aK6UFJv3


Where are the parents ?

Lavanda Dolce
10-09-2011, 05:56 PM
That's a vast river to have to search. LE, in fact, seems to search quickly - the landfill search was over before ya knew it, and the list of suspects provided by the parents seems to have been vetted and cleared awfully fast. Not sure how thorough a job they're doing. Tough job to do, I know, I know. But it does appear they decided on the parent(s) early on.

Bodies will sink. Sometimes it takes months to years before any of the earthly body may come up:( Lake searches are extremely difficult and depending on the murkiness of the water and the river currents...it is even very difficult for divers.

KaylynnCouture
10-09-2011, 05:57 PM
It certainly appears that LE thought they'd found other evidence of a kidnapper than just the window thing, doesn't it.

That's what I understood it to mean as well.

Miziree
10-09-2011, 05:57 PM
I agree. My youngest was 26 lbs at 5 months old. He was huge. But he was also born at 22 1/2 inches long.

:eek:

Lera213
10-09-2011, 05:58 PM
Oh come to think of it since this is a high profile case I bet you ten to one that the soon to be x will be getting his next LES showing he owes back BAH (basic housing Allowance)

grandmaj
10-09-2011, 05:58 PM
http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-lisa-irwin-no-new-clues-in-search-for-missing-baby-20111006,0,2371703.story

New Twists in Search for Baby Lisa
Family makes 'deal' with national media, won't talk to local news stations

wfgodot
10-09-2011, 06:00 PM
Bodies will sink. Sometimes it takes months to years before any of the earthly body may come up:( Lake searches are extremely difficult and depending on the murkiness of the water and the river currents...it is even very difficult for divers.
Yes, usually bodies put in the river in KC aren't found till they're downstream quite a ways. I remember in one case many years ago, this was true of a serial killer and his prostitute victims.

Snowbunny
10-09-2011, 06:00 PM
I wouldn't care who anyone pointed fingers at as long as they were trying to find my child.Lisa needs to be found,it is no time for game playing or hurt egos. Lisa is the victim,not them.They asked for help,they got it.

And if you look back you will see where Debbie says she doesn't blame LE. I was in LE for a number of years and did my share of interrogations so I know how the game is played, but sometimes that's what it takes to get answers as cruel as it may sound. From watching the interviews, the parents seem genuine to me and I haven't heard anything about their story changing either which would send up red flags for me. I'd like to know more about the neighbors who claimed at the very beginning seeing someone carrying Lisa down the street. My question to them would be why didn't they call the cops. I will give them credit for coming forward, but they should have called the cops in the very beginning.

ClueMeIn
10-09-2011, 06:01 PM
So what do you think?

Dad wants out of the relationship, so has someone steal the baby, or worse...

Hence the reason he said, "We have to find Lisa, as she is the link that holds us altogether." Meaning if they didn't have her, there would be no bond.

He could have done this even before waking Debbie up. He had appx half an hour. He had the time. He could have left the lights on, could have bent the screen, and could have stashed the phones.


Just a theory, but a good one, at that!

mrye4709
10-09-2011, 06:02 PM
Also, how would she have explained not sending him photos of his child all this time?

Possibly a friend from the neighborhood provided pics and helped get her? I know it sounds way out there, but who would have thought a little girl would be killed for getting on a pool ladder? (not that I believe that's all).

ClueMeIn
10-09-2011, 06:02 PM
He also had a car.

Maybe the police do suspect him, but are playing good cop with him, as not to show their cards.

ami
10-09-2011, 06:02 PM
I could be wrong but don't dogs trace scents on the ground? If baby Lisa was carried, not walking, her scent wouldn't be on the ground..

I remember the ones in the Laci Peterson case followed her scent down a highway where she [her body] was presumably driven while wrapped in a tarp.

PlainJaneDoe
10-09-2011, 06:02 PM
http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-lisa-irwin-no-new-clues-in-search-for-missing-baby-20111006,0,2371703.story

New Twists in Search for Baby Lisa
Family makes 'deal' with national media, won't talk to local news stations

Foiled again! Flash player!:maddening:

Lavanda Dolce
10-09-2011, 06:02 PM
*snipped* Irwin also sold T-shirts for $15 with Lisa's face and kidnapping story on them. The money from the shirts is supposed to go to a reward fund, which has not been officially set up yet.


The family spokesperson did not return our phone calls. Ashley Irwin said neither Jeremy or Deborah were interested in talking.


http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/news/region_missouri/northland/detectives-back-at-irwin-home%2C-recreating-abduction#ixzz1aK6UFJv3


Where are the parents ?

It is indeed very possible that they may have an exclusive with the network of Judge Jeanine....mom is a stay-at-home mother and dad I am sure is not in the frame of mind to go to work...so money needs to come into the home somehow...so I don't see anything wrong whatsoever in securing payment from an exclusive source so that parents can be free to look for their child, be available to PD and to provide for the other kids at home. It's also a means to get money to put up for a reward. I'm sure the family is going to have the bank trust (benefit trust fund) set up so that all donations can be deposited. Personal income could come from the exclusive rights money. I can tell you that no family would trade what this family is going through for any exclusive rights money from any network...so I do not frown upon any of it. (PS. Other media is still going to report on this because their income is derived by viewers and look at us? We are going to every news source possible to see if any updates...so no fears that an exclusive rights agreement is going to not give proper exposure.)

mentalsolstice
10-09-2011, 06:02 PM
I agree. There would be absolutely no benefit to give an "exclusive" interview to one news group if they were not being paid. You would think they would want each and every news outlet to have all the information. Why narrow your exposure unless you were getting something out of it? I have no doubt in my mind that they were paid, just like CA was paid for those photos at the beginning of her case.

If it were me, I would refuse any kind of exclusive deal because I would want *all* the media to have every tiny bit of information available so they could blast it to as large an audience as possible. I would worry about money later. If I were innocent, that is.

Not sure about the ABC exclusive peek into the home, however, they have otherwise been on a lot other networks. So they seem to have been spreading the word around. I'm not bothered by paid interviews...pins, fliers, etc. require some sort of upfront money, at least until you can start relying on donations. Additionally, Jeremy probably isn't working right now. Only time will tell if these two are also victims or if they're grifters or worse. It's too bad the Anthonys have given fund raising in a missing child case a bad name. And even if one or both parents are shown to be responsible for their baby's disappearance, the family members and friends who are raising money are most likely doing so with the best intentions of getting this child back.

laytonian
10-09-2011, 06:03 PM
again, link please to substantiate your post. We all have opinions . . . but if you continue to post this info, please supply your source.

It's a well-known fact, and how the system works on "hot" cases.

There will never be a formal announcement about "we paid for this interview", but when one network (ABC News) gets a major exclusive above all others, it's obvious that a "consideration" is in play.

ABC News gets "exclusives" at the same time the family isn't talking to the police.
Now, a reward is being announced by a family that obviously has few resources. That same family is staying in hotels.

Tuffy
10-09-2011, 06:03 PM
Not sure. I posed the question yesterday but got no response.

As far as searching the river, I would imagine that unless they have reason to suspect that she was there, they won't. The Missouri River near Kansas City is big, muddy, and fast moving. I think it would be tough to search.

This is a picture taken of the river near Westport, which is near Kansas City:

http://www.cocooceanresort.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/missouri-river-8-300x199.jpg

http://www.cocooceanresort.com/tag/door/

Renea
10-09-2011, 06:03 PM
Okay, I just watched last nights interview for the 3rd time today....

So, if my husband came home at 4am and the lights were on, door unlocked... He would just assume I fell asleep exhausted without securing the house... He wouldn't wake me up to ask me why I didn't turn off the lights,etc... he would just do it and then go to bed. What kind of husband wakes up his sleeping wife to ridicule her for something she (in his mind, at the time) failed to do?

In the interview they clearly state that they didn't realize Lisa was missing until after he woke her up about the lights being on, door open, ect.

In my mind... this cast some doubt on him... maybe he had something to do with it... and woke up Deborah... for the effect...

KaylynnCouture
10-09-2011, 06:03 PM
Foiled again! Flash player!:maddening:

Want me to type up a transcript for you?

In da Middle
10-09-2011, 06:04 PM
Not sure. I posed the question yesterday but got no response.
I think we can safely assume that at least this part of the river was looked at. The command post was just a few feet from the banks where they were unloading their atv's with reasonably easy access along both sides in the area.

Jacie Estes
10-09-2011, 06:04 PM
Has this been posted yet?



snipped: http://articles.cnn.com/2011-10-08/us/us_missouri-missing-girl_1_missing-missouri-missouri-girl-police-station?_s=PM:US

THANK YOU!

Now we can get beyond the 'mama drama' and I HOPE this baby will be found alive.

Inspector Gidget
10-09-2011, 06:04 PM
i haven't gotten a chance to see all the video interviews with the parents but as i recall the mother was saying almost exactly what you are saying there. (paraphrased) that she doesn't care what LE thinks or what anyone else thinks of her, she just wants the baby home and there are no hard feelings and she understands why LE is doing what they are doing. isn't that correct?

Yes now they are cooperating,but in the beginning,they stopped and went straight to the media.Then they realized the media couldn't do all the things LE can,like search the landfill.I am to assume their attorney told them to cooperate too MOO

Pensfan
10-09-2011, 06:04 PM
That was an initial reporting by the media due to the conversations of the window screen bent in. Not sure that LE believes this now. It's possible...but not confirmed.
A most recent local news does not state that LE believes the baby was abducted like that CNN article.
http://www.kmbc.com/news/29434269/detail.html

laytonian
10-09-2011, 06:05 PM
http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-lisa-irwin-no-new-clues-in-search-for-missing-baby-20111006,0,2371703.story

New Twists in Search for Baby Lisa
Family makes 'deal' with national media, won't talk to local news stations

Thank you for finding that; you turned it up quicker than I could.

kitkatbahr
10-09-2011, 06:05 PM
Okay, this has probably already been said/asked but I have been skipping around as the threads are moving so fast...

Anyway, is it possible the 6 year old turned on lights before going in to sleep with mom? Perhaps he went and looked for the kitten first and turned on the lights. Just a thought....

Lavanda Dolce
10-09-2011, 06:05 PM
He also had a car.

Maybe the police do suspect him, but are playing good cop with him, as not to show their cards.

Well I wish they would be more aggressive on that front. He needs a polygraph...he needs to have his interior of his car swiped for fingerprints in case the same person who broke into his car...is the one(s) who took Baby Lisa. So they need to get this done...just because he has an alibi and fits a timeline does not mean he is exempt from possibly being involved.

wfgodot
10-09-2011, 06:06 PM
As far as searching the river, I would imagine that unless they have reason to suspect that she was there, they won't. The Missouri River near Kansas City is big, muddy, and fast moving. I think it would be tough to search.

This is a picture taken of the river near Westport, which is near Kansas City:

http://www.cocooceanresort.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/missouri-river-8-300x199.jpg

http://www.cocooceanresort.com/tag/door/

Yep. They'd wait for the body to turn up downriver, if it ever would.

Lavanda Dolce
10-09-2011, 06:06 PM
Okay, this has probably already been said/asked but I have been skipping around as the threads are moving so fast...

Anyway, is it possible the 6 year old turned on lights before going in to sleep with mom? Perhaps he went and looked for the kitten first and turned on the lights. Just a thought....

Mom said he came to bed WITH her so probably not. Now, however, if the 8 year old got up and turned on all the lights to find kitty....that is a certain possibility.

SyraKelly
10-09-2011, 06:07 PM
It is indeed very possible that they may have an exclusive with the network of Judge Jeanine....mom is a stay-at-home mother and dad I am sure is not in the frame of mind to go to work...so money needs to come into the home somehow...so I don't see anything wrong whatsoever in securing payment from an exclusive source so that parents can be free to look for their child, be available to PD and to provide for the other kids at home. It's also a means to get money to put up for a reward. I'm sure the family is going to have the bank trust (benefit trust fund) set up so that all donations can be deposited. Personal income could come from the exclusive rights money. I can tell you that no family would trade what this family is going through for any exclusive rights money from any network...so I do not frown upon any of it. (PS. Other media is still going to report on this because their income is derived by viewers and look at us? We are going to every news source possible to see if any updates...so no fears that an exclusive rights agreement is going to not give proper exposure.)

Hi LD-My question would be-if the parents are getting this say payment and it turns out that someone in the house is involved-what happens to all that money that has been collected for shirts,interviews etc -just a question..not pointing fingers at anyone!

ladonna
10-09-2011, 06:07 PM
So what do you think?

Dad wants out of the relationship, so has someone steal the baby, or worse...

Hence the reason he said, "We have to find Lisa, as she is the link that holds us altogether." Meaning if they didn't have her, there would be no bond.

He could have done this even before waking Debbie up. He had appx half an hour. He had the time. He could have left the lights on, could have bent the screen, and could have stashed the phones.


Just a theory, but a good one, at that!

That was Debbie's quote, not the Dad's.

PlainJaneDoe
10-09-2011, 06:07 PM
I really don't know why the idea of a compensation for interviews bothers me. Everyone who has posted in support of the practice - what you wrote is totally logical IMO. I'm no more suspicious of the family because of it. It just bugs me, for some reason. :waitasec: I hope I didn't offend or show disrespect to anyone.

gliving
10-09-2011, 06:07 PM
Has this been posted yet?



snipped: http://articles.cnn.com/2011-10-08/us/us_missouri-missing-girl_1_missing-missouri-missouri-girl-police-station?_s=PM:US


Wow, that's new info from MSM.

"It appears the suspect entered/exited through a bedroom window," authorities said in a statement. "Evidence at the scene leads police to believe the child has been abducted."

Lavanda Dolce
10-09-2011, 06:08 PM
:eek:

Funny thing is Miziree, they said he was 20" at birth. It wasn't until the pediatrician saw him and said "NO WAY" and she re-measured him. 22 1/2 and of course a c-section:) They had to redo his birth certificate due to that mistake. Apparently it was a nurse in training who did the measuring and didnt bring his leg down far enough on the scale. LOL

wfgodot
10-09-2011, 06:08 PM
Okay, this has probably already been said/asked but I have been skipping around as the threads are moving so fast...

Anyway, is it possible the 6 year old turned on lights before going in to sleep with mom? Perhaps he went and looked for the kitten first and turned on the lights. Just a thought....
Yes, it was mentioned last thread, but it bears repeating as it could have happened that way, which would explain much.

Lera213
10-09-2011, 06:08 PM
My bet on the BAH and still married is that the soon to be x is using the extra BAH and pay to pay the child support. It is probably an agreement, if he doesn't get that then he won't be able to afford it. She probably agreed to not marry for a few years.

norest4thewicked
10-09-2011, 06:09 PM
As far as searching the river, I would imagine that unless they have reason to suspect that she was there, they won't. The Missouri River near Kansas City is big, muddy, and fast moving. I think it would be tough to search.

This is a picture taken of the river near Westport, which is near Kansas City:

http://www.cocooceanresort.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/missouri-river-8-300x199.jpg

http://www.cocooceanresort.com/tag/door/

Yep...they call it "The muddy MO"...

Lavanda Dolce
10-09-2011, 06:10 PM
Wow, that's new info from MSM.

"It appears the suspect entered/exited through a bedroom window," authorities said in a statement. "Evidence at the scene leads police to believe the child has been abducted."

I wonder how accurate this statement is "Investigators have searched about 300 homes and apartments in the area around the home. Lisa Irwin hasn't been seen since Monday night." Literally searched the homes? Went in and looked around? I think that would have hit the presses a long time ago...someone would have seen that happening and all news media would be reporting it. It's possible the person who wrote that meant to say "went around to 300 homes and apartments" to get statements, etc.

Dr.Fessel
10-09-2011, 06:11 PM
And if you look back you will see where Debbie says she doesn't blame LE. I was in LE for a number of years and did my share of interrogations so I know how the game is played, but sometimes that's what it takes to get answers as cruel as it may sound. From watching the interviews, the parents seem genuine to me and I haven't heard anything about their story changing either which would send up red flags for me. I'd like to know more about the neighbors who claimed at the very beginning seeing someone carrying Lisa down the street. My question to them would be why didn't they call the cops. I will give them credit for coming forward, but they should have called the cops in the very beginning. Right there with you my friend.:seeya:

~n/t~
10-09-2011, 06:11 PM
So what do you think?

Dad wants out of the relationship, so has someone steal the baby, or worse...

Hence the reason he said, "We have to find Lisa, as she is the link that holds us altogether." Meaning if they didn't have her, there would be no bond.

He could have done this even before waking Debbie up. He had appx half an hour. He had the time. He could have left the lights on, could have bent the screen, and could have stashed the phones.


Just a theory, but a good one, at that!

Mom was the one who said that not dad.

ClueMeIn
10-09-2011, 06:12 PM
Well I wish they would be more aggressive on that front. He needs a polygraph...he needs to have his interior of his car swiped for fingerprints in case the same person who broke into his car...is the one(s) who took Baby Lisa. So they need to get this done...just because he has an alibi and fits a timeline does not mean he is exempt from possibly being involved

Not sure he actually has a good alibi though. He still had that half hour window of opportunity, from the time he should have arrived home, until the time he woke Debbie up.

KaylynnCouture
10-09-2011, 06:12 PM
I wonder how accurate this statement is "Investigators have searched about 300 homes and apartments in the area around the home. Lisa Irwin hasn't been seen since Monday night." Literally searched the homes? Went in and looked around? I think that would have hit the presses a long time ago...someone would have seen that happening and all news media would be reporting it. It's possible the person who wrote that meant to say "went around to 300 homes and apartments" to get statements, etc.

LE said at the presser on Oct 5th that they did "knock and talks" with 300 homes AS WELL AS consensual searches of the homes (if the residents let them).

wfgodot
10-09-2011, 06:13 PM
Well I wish they would be more aggressive on that front. He needs a polygraph...he needs to have his interior of his car swiped for fingerprints in case the same person who broke into his car...is the one(s) who took Baby Lisa. So they need to get this done...just because he has an alibi and fits a timeline does not mean he is exempt from possibly being involved

Not sure he actually has a good alibi though. He still had that half hour window of opportunity, from the time he should have arrived home, until the time he woke Debbie up.
Is there a MSM link for that info, or was it in a video?

ClueMeIn
10-09-2011, 06:13 PM
~n/t~ I think they both said it! I remember hearing it more than once. I may be confused, I stayed up for hours waiting for her to come home last night. :(

grandmaj
10-09-2011, 06:13 PM
Wow, that's new info from MSM.

"It appears the suspect entered/exited through a bedroom window," authorities said in a statement. "Evidence at the scene leads police to believe the child has been abducted."

Gotta wonder if this is a rewrite of an old article from the very beginning. No one else is reporting that the police have connected any dots.

Renea
10-09-2011, 06:14 PM
In my mind... this cast some doubt on him... maybe he had something to do with it... and woke up Deborah... for the effect...

In the interview it they said.... Then he realized after he woke me up that he noticed the door to her bedroom was open so we went back there and she was gone....

Why didn't he look in the bedroom at the moment he noticed the door was open... why did he have to wake up Deborah before he did that?

Lera213
10-09-2011, 06:14 PM
So let me get this correct the statements were that he came home, saw the window, then lights on, door unlocked, checked rooms, wife gets up, they search, notice no phones, grabs a flash light, looks around outside, then he goes to neighbors house to call 911.

He gets home at 4am and 911 call was placed at 4:04 am correct? 4 minutes to do all that?

SyraKelly
10-09-2011, 06:14 PM
Gotta wonder if this is a rewrite of an old article from the very beginning. No one else is reporting that the police have connected any dots.

that is what I was thinking..this was said on wed-right

IAM
10-09-2011, 06:15 PM
The father's work vehicle's tires need to be checked for tread match anywhere close to that river. 1.5 miles could be very easily done in about 30 min. The father also needs to take a poly. It is odd he hasn't been asked to. Perhaps police want him to feel at ease and like he is not a suspect. He would be my number one suspect, her second.

Dr.Fessel
10-09-2011, 06:15 PM
I wonder how accurate this statement is "Investigators have searched about 300 homes and apartments in the area around the home. Lisa Irwin hasn't been seen since Monday night." Literally searched the homes? Went in and looked around? I think that would have hit the presses a long time ago...someone would have seen that happening and all news media would be reporting it. It's possible the person who wrote that meant to say "went around to 300 homes and apartments" to get statements, etc.

Searching the 300 homes has hit the presses. I saw a video of a lady who told how the police came in and searched her house looking in the closets and everything. I think it is pretty standard now in missing kids cases for LE to ask permission to search and ones that refuse get put on a list to talk to again.

They did it in the Somer Thompson case too.

mentalsolstice
10-09-2011, 06:15 PM
I really don't know why the idea of a compensation for interviews bothers me. Everyone who has posted in support of the practice - what you wrote is totally logical IMO. I'm no more suspicious of the family because of it. It just bugs me, for some reason. :waitasec: I hope I didn't offend or show disrespect to anyone.

Nah, you're good. Blame the Anthonys and some others.

panthera
10-09-2011, 06:15 PM
Has this been posted yet?



snipped: http://articles.cnn.com/2011-10-08/us/us_missouri-missing-girl_1_missing-missouri-missouri-girl-police-station?_s=PM:US

According to the floor plan shown on Judge Pirro's program last night, that window which LE was attempting to enter the house through today is not a bedroom window; it is the computer room. Now I am totally confused!

annalia
10-09-2011, 06:15 PM
I'm serious. There's no way they're not being compensated for those "exclusive interviews" and ABC News's "exclusive peek inside the home".

This is obviously a poor family; someone's paying for those hotels and other "considerations".

I thought their exculsive was supposed to be with Fox? :waitasec:

ClueMeIn
10-09-2011, 06:15 PM
Is there a MSM link for that info, or was it in a video?


I will look for the info. The 911 call was supposedly at 4:04 am, and he was home about 3:38 am? I have to look. My mind is officially boggled! :banghead:

KaylynnCouture
10-09-2011, 06:15 PM
Has the sex offender aspect been explored yet? I know it's rare that a sex offender would abduct a baby, but it's still something to consider.

Have the area sex offenders been questioned?

I just did a search and there's SEVERAL RSO's within a 2 mile radius.

SyraKelly
10-09-2011, 06:16 PM
The father's work vehicle's tires need to be checked for tread match anywhere close to that river. 1.5 miles could be very easily done in about 30 min. The father also needs to take a poly. It is odd he hasn't been asked to. Perhaps police want him to feel at ease and like he is not a suspect. He would be my number one suspect, her second.

tires on both cars!good catch!!

Mojen
10-09-2011, 06:16 PM
Is that the downtown airport? Can't think of the highway[ Broadway Bridge?] now but we used to take it to go to El Ranchos on 9th. Is that still there? I LOVED that place. Salsa that makes your mouth numb.

I am pretty sure Whiteman is off 71 Hwy. The downtown airport is down by the River Market.

If El Ranchos is the same as El Rancho in Westport, I agree! Love that place!

lauriej
10-09-2011, 06:17 PM
That was Debbie's quote, not the Dad's.

..here it says it was jeremy..

http://news.yahoo.com/police-tell-mom-missing-mo-baby-did-133301783.html

Bradley and Irwin, both dressed in jeans and sweatshirts, held hands and teared up several times during the 20-minute interview. They reiterated that their main focus "is to bring Lisa home."

"We need her. We have to have her. She's our link that ties everybody together," Irwin said.

wfgodot
10-09-2011, 06:17 PM
No matter when LE said that there was evidence of an abductor beyond just the window, it still should be valid - even if it proves an inconvenient truth and LE tries to disavow it.

Jacie Estes
10-09-2011, 06:17 PM
I agree. My youngest was 26 lbs at 5 months old. He was huge. But he was also born at 22 1/2 inches long.

My 'baby' was 9 1/2 lbs at birth, 21 inches, at 13 yo 6' 1". At the end of the pregnancy I was 105 lbs, started at 89 lbs. No wonder walking was so difficult. :)

Some babies are just bigger, must be those pre-natal vitamins.

Cher352
10-09-2011, 06:17 PM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15647944/police-again-questioning-missing


In that video posted above it looks as though LE stood on some sort of small table. Like an outside table to hold drinks.

The first attempt it looks like a satellite dish was used to me.

The second attempt where the guy hoist himself up and over through the window looks like he was scaping across that brick veneer pretty good. We saw them dust for prints earlier in the week but did LE check for fibers.

EllaMae
10-09-2011, 06:18 PM
So let me get this correct the statements were that he came home, saw the window, then lights on, door unlocked, checked rooms, wife gets up, they search, notice no phones, grabs a flash light, looks around outside, then he goes to neighbors house to call 911.

He gets home at 4am and 911 call was placed at 4:04 am correct? 4 minutes to do all that?



I think the 4 AM arrival time is approximate.

~n/t~
10-09-2011, 06:18 PM
Has this been posted yet?



snipped: http://articles.cnn.com/2011-10-08/us/us_missouri-missing-girl_1_missing-missouri-missouri-girl-police-station?_s=PM:US

This is very confusing because the "bedroom" window we see LE doing the reenacting of the crime scene is apparently not a bedroom window but a computer room. So what bedroom window are they referring to?


"It appears the suspect entered/exited through a bedroom window," authorities said in a statement. "Evidence at the scene leads police to believe the child has been abducted."

marge_rita
10-09-2011, 06:19 PM
*snipped* Irwin also sold T-shirts for $15 with Lisa's face and kidnapping story on them. The money from the shirts is supposed to go to a reward fund, which has not been officially set up yet.


The family spokesperson did not return our phone calls. Ashley Irwin said neither Jeremy or Deborah were interested in talking.


http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/news/region_missouri/northland/detectives-back-at-irwin-home%2C-recreating-abduction#ixzz1aK6UFJv3


Where are the parents ?

Yesterday the parents were resting. Maybe they're making phone calls or something like that.

Baby Lisa being gone almost a week makes me extremely sad.


imo

wfgodot
10-09-2011, 06:19 PM
Is there a MSM link for that info, or was it in a video?


I will look for the info. The 911 call was supposedly at 4:04 am, and he was home about 3:38 am? I have to look. My mind is officially boggled! :banghead:
Mine too. I think I sort of remember hearing something along that line in a video - but I can't be sure at this stage of the game, lol. I'll look for it too.

In da Middle
10-09-2011, 06:19 PM
That's a vast river to have to search. LE, in fact, seems to search quickly - the landfill search was over before ya knew it, and the list of suspects provided by the parents seems to have been vetted and cleared awfully fast. Not sure how thorough a job they're doing. Tough job to do, I know, I know. But it does appear they decided on the parent(s) early on.
Just because it isn't being reported doesn't mean it isn't being done. We didn't even know about the landfill searches until the 2nd or 3rd one had been done because nobody reported it.

Wishbone
10-09-2011, 06:20 PM
It certainly appears that LE thought they'd found other evidence of a kidnapper in addition to the window, doesn't it.



I wonder about the accuracy of this article
snipped
"It appears the suspect entered/exited through a bedroom window,"

I thought the window in question was the computer room window?

http://articles.cnn.com/2011-10-08/us/us_missouri-missing-girl_1_missing-missouri-missouri-girl-police-station?_s=PM:US

norest4thewicked
10-09-2011, 06:20 PM
Gotta wonder if this is a rewrite of an old article from the very beginning. No one else is reporting that the police have connected any dots.

That's exactly what I thought! That would be huge news if it was true...I don't think it is.

Jacie Estes
10-09-2011, 06:20 PM
I am pretty sure Whiteman is off 71 Hwy. The downtown airport is down by the River Market.

If El Ranchos is the same as El Rancho in Westport, I agree! Love that place!

BBM They were on 9th off of Broadway, we went there and Rosedale BBQ all the time. They may have moved.

panthera
10-09-2011, 06:20 PM
Okay, this has probably already been said/asked but I have been skipping around as the threads are moving so fast...

Anyway, is it possible the 6 year old turned on lights before going in to sleep with mom? Perhaps he went and looked for the kitten first and turned on the lights. Just a thought....

That makes a lot more sense than the intruder turning on "most of the lights".

KaylynnCouture
10-09-2011, 06:22 PM
That makes a lot more sense than the intruder turning on "most of the lights".

I completely agree. I think the 6yo turning on the lights on his way into his moms room is MUCH more likely, and then when the intruder came in the lights were already on.

Renea
10-09-2011, 06:22 PM
..here it says it was jeremy..

http://news.yahoo.com/police-tell-mom-missing-mo-baby-did-133301783.html

Bradley and Irwin, both dressed in jeans and sweatshirts, held hands and teared up several times during the 20-minute interview. They reiterated that their main focus "is to bring Lisa home."

"We need her. We have to have her. She's our link that ties everybody together," Irwin said.

I say the same thing about one of my daughters.... There is always someone who is the light of the family... maybe that is what he meant.

davehead21
10-09-2011, 06:22 PM
i haven't gotten a chance to see all the video interviews with the parents but as i recall the mother was saying almost exactly what you are saying there. (paraphrased) that she doesn't care what LE thinks or what anyone else thinks of her, she just wants the baby home and there are no hard feelings and she understands why LE is doing what they are doing. isn't that correct?

But then, that very evening, she and the baby's father quit speaking with the local media because they were making them look bad. :waitasec:

marge_rita
10-09-2011, 06:22 PM
THANK YOU!

Now we can get beyond the 'mama drama' and I HOPE this baby will be found alive.

That was posted last night too. I don't think this makes the parents less suspect. I think LE really just wants to keep communication with them open.


imo

norest4thewicked
10-09-2011, 06:22 PM
The father's work vehicle's tires need to be checked for tread match anywhere close to that river. 1.5 miles could be very easily done in about 30 min. The father also needs to take a poly. It is odd he hasn't been asked to. Perhaps police want him to feel at ease and like he is not a suspect. He would be my number one suspect, her second.

The only thing that we know wasn't done was a polygraph of the dad, and even that may have been done by now. We aren't privy to everything done in the case...

PlainJaneDoe
10-09-2011, 06:23 PM
Want me to type up a transcript for you?

Wow, if you have time that would be great!

gliving
10-09-2011, 06:23 PM
Has this been posted yet?



snipped: http://articles.cnn.com/2011-10-08/us/us_missouri-missing-girl_1_missing-missouri-missouri-girl-police-station?_s=PM:US


Gotta wonder if this is a rewrite of an old article from the very beginning. No one else is reporting that the police have connected any dots.

It very well could be rehash of an old article. Except I haven't seen it in any articles before. Does someone have a link to a early article that has LE saying evidence points to an abduction? TIA :)

KaylynnCouture
10-09-2011, 06:24 PM
What are the chances of us getting our own section for Lisa? It would be super helpful to have the timeline, news links, presser videos, etc. all stickied.

I'm more than willing to help out.

marge_rita
10-09-2011, 06:24 PM
A most recent local news does not state that LE believes the baby was abducted like that CNN article.
http://www.kmbc.com/news/29434269/detail.html

Maybe that's why the parents want to only deal with bigger news sources.:waitasec:

Thanks for posting that link!


imo

chieftess
10-09-2011, 06:25 PM
The father's work vehicle's tires need to be checked for tread match anywhere close to that river. 1.5 miles could be very easily done in about 30 min. The father also needs to take a poly. It is odd he hasn't been asked to. Perhaps police want him to feel at ease and like he is not a suspect. He would be my number one suspect, her second.

There are small paved access roads all along the river banks. Heaven forbid, that is what happened, there would be no need to pull off paved roads to get to the river.
I do think LE should poly the dad, I see no reason for them not to

Duke Fan4
10-09-2011, 06:26 PM
Maybe I am confused but I thought it had been determined that the window was not the point of entry.

lauriej
10-09-2011, 06:26 PM
So let me get this correct the statements were that he came home, saw the window, then lights on, door unlocked, checked rooms, wife gets up, they search, notice no phones, grabs a flash light, looks around outside, then he goes to neighbors house to call 911.

He gets home at 4am and 911 call was placed at 4:04 am correct? 4 minutes to do all that?

..he says he got home "around 4 a.m." (i've seen one article that even says 3:30 "or so").

..he said on the jeanineP show last night, that once they realized the cell phones were missing---------he reached into his pocket, and called 911 from his work cell phone.

sorrell skye
10-09-2011, 06:26 PM
Gotta wonder if this is a rewrite of an old article from the very beginning. No one else is reporting that the police have connected any dots.

I agree.

I think the article is cobbled together from various other articles. At the top of the article, it says By the CNN Wire Staff.

EllaMae
10-09-2011, 06:26 PM
..here it says it was jeremy..

http://news.yahoo.com/police-tell-mom-missing-mo-baby-did-133301783.html

Bradley and Irwin, both dressed in jeans and sweatshirts, held hands and teared up several times during the 20-minute interview. They reiterated that their main focus "is to bring Lisa home."

"We need her. We have to have her. She's our link that ties everybody together," Irwin said.



I thought he was speaking in terms of their blended family....sort of like...yours, mine and ours.

Lisa is the one family member related to everyone in the household.

marge_rita
10-09-2011, 06:27 PM
Wow, that's new info from MSM.

"It appears the suspect entered/exited through a bedroom window," authorities said in a statement. "Evidence at the scene leads police to believe the child has been abducted."

The article is dated 10/8 which was yesterday.I read a CNN article last night but not sure that this is it.

Maybe CNN updated the article today.


imo

mentalsolstice
10-09-2011, 06:27 PM
I wonder about the accuracy of this article
snipped
"It appears the suspect entered/exited through a bedroom window,"

I thought the window in question was the computer room window?

http://articles.cnn.com/2011-10-08/us/us_missouri-missing-girl_1_missing-missouri-missouri-girl-police-station?_s=PM:US

Possible explanation...the family calls it a computer room, but on the home's blueprints it's probably marked as a bedroom. I doubt there was such a thing as a personal computer when that house was built.

Wishbone
10-09-2011, 06:27 PM
So let me get this correct the statements were that he came home, saw the window, then lights on, door unlocked, checked rooms, wife gets up, they search, notice no phones, grabs a flash light, looks around outside, then he goes to neighbors house to call 911.

He gets home at 4am and 911 call was placed at 4:04 am correct? 4 minutes to do all that?


He took his work phone out of his pocket and then called 911

SyraKelly
10-09-2011, 06:27 PM
I just thought of something..If the child turned on the lights and the parents KNOW this is big issue for a lot of people..would 'nt you think they would mention it in one of their interviews that he did turn on the lights and not the kidnapper,but they are not correcting this,they are leaving it as the kidnapper did it and that is what makes their story sound not true-if they want their story to sound true,they need to correct this.if it is true the child turned on the lights! I m having a hard time posting my thoughts today..I think I will just read after this post-lol

belimom
10-09-2011, 06:27 PM
I completely agree. I think the 6yo turning on the lights on his way into his moms room is MUCH more likely, and then when the intruder came in the lights were already on.

That could be. But what I don't understand is what intruder what enter a brightly lit home? I really hate to keep looking at the parents but I just don't know where else to look right now. :(

norest4thewicked
10-09-2011, 06:28 PM
..he says he got home "around 4 a.m." (i've seen one article that even says 3:30 "or so").

..he said on the jeanineP show last night, that once they realized the cell phones were missing---------he reached into his pocket, and called 911 from his work cell phone.

I wonder where the info came from then that he was running through the neighborhood knocking on doors to use their phone?

~n/t~
10-09-2011, 06:28 PM
I completely agree. I think the 6yo turning on the lights on his way into his moms room is MUCH more likely, and then when the intruder came in the lights were already on.

Not directing this at you but wow....this kidnapper got all the lucky breaks didn't he/she? First night on the job for dad, mom left door unlocked, window left open , kid may have left lights on, dog didn't bark. Not only did he/she get a baby without anyone waking, 3 cellphones too. Wonder why they didn't grab more stuff on the way out the front door.

Wishbone
10-09-2011, 06:28 PM
Possible explanation...the family calls it a computer room, but on the home's blueprints it's probably marked as a bedroom. I doubt there was such a thing as a personal computer when that house was built.


On Judge Jeanine the mother said it was a living room that was now the computer room

Elley Mae
10-09-2011, 06:28 PM
Maybe I am confused but I thought it had been determined that the window was not the point of entry.

iirc Sgt Young said that in a video, but I've been lazy in looking for the link

In da Middle
10-09-2011, 06:28 PM
As far as searching the river, I would imagine that unless they have reason to suspect that she was there, they won't. The Missouri River near Kansas City is big, muddy, and fast moving. I think it would be tough to search.

This is a picture taken of the river near Westport, which is near Kansas City:

http://www.cocooceanresort.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/missouri-river-8-300x199.jpg

http://www.cocooceanresort.com/tag/door/

But Westport is NOT on the river! It is just north of 'The Plaza'.

wfgodot
10-09-2011, 06:29 PM
Just because it isn't being reported doesn't mean it isn't being done. We didn't even know about the landfill searches until the 2nd or 3rd one had been done because nobody reported it.
You're certainly right on the landfill thing - I had forgotten that one was said to have been done the first day. Good point, thanks.

However, I am not totally convinced that LE has worked aggressively on anything but the parents, once they decided mom did it.

norest4thewicked
10-09-2011, 06:29 PM
The article is dated 10/8 which was yesterday.I read a CNN article last night but not sure that this is it.

Maybe CNN updated the article today.


imo

And, maybe the CNN writer just took info from previous reports to make another "new" story...

Jacie Estes
10-09-2011, 06:30 PM
There are small paved access roads all along the river banks. Heaven forbid, that is what happened, there would be no need to pull off paved roads to get to the river.
I do think LE should poly the dad, I see no reason for them not to

They should check all of the casino's security cameras. I would imagine if anything had come up they would have reported it but best to check.

PlainJaneDoe
10-09-2011, 06:30 PM
That could be. But what I don't understand is what intruder what enter a brightly lit home? I really hate to keep looking at the parents but I just don't know where else to look right now. :(

I thought that having lights on was one of the crime fighter tips to deter intruders...

Lera213
10-09-2011, 06:30 PM
He took his work phone out of his pocket and then called 911

Yes he said after he went to the neighbors and he said nobody was there! On JP show last night!

So where is 4 am coming from, was that the normal scheduled time to get off but he got done earlier? Would like to know the answer to that because that would really shed light on why those lights were on. (pun intended)

wfgodot
10-09-2011, 06:30 PM
But Westport is NOT on the river! It is just north of 'The Plaza'.
And I've drank many beers there to prove it, lol. Good ol' Kelly's.

captivagrl
10-09-2011, 06:31 PM
In the interview it they said.... Then he realized after he woke me up that he noticed the door to her bedroom was open so we went back there and she was gone....

Why didn't he look in the bedroom at the moment he noticed the door was open... why did he have to wake up Deborah before he did that?

THAT and a whole bunch of other things just make me think that the home was staged and a "story" was rehearsed. An accident with that child sometime between the birthday party Sunday afternoon and sometime Tuesday morning is what keeps coming into my mind. I just think Mom knows more than she's saying....

Wishbone
10-09-2011, 06:31 PM
The article is dated 10/8 which was yesterday.I read a CNN article last night but not sure that this is it.

Maybe CNN updated the article today.


imo



and they did a lousy update, imo

kai
10-09-2011, 06:32 PM
I wonder how accurate this statement is "Investigators have searched about 300 homes and apartments in the area around the home. Lisa Irwin hasn't been seen since Monday night." Literally searched the homes? Went in and looked around? I think that would have hit the presses a long time ago...someone would have seen that happening and all news media would be reporting it. It's possible the person who wrote that meant to say "went around to 300 homes and apartments" to get statements, etc.

There was a news link a few days ago about a woman who woke up with an FBI agent looking in her bedroom closet. Her DH had let them in to look. I can also speak from reading in past cases that FBI will indeed search INSIDE of homes within a certain radius of where a crime may have been committed. Kayleah Wilson was a girl who disappeared and they did just this in the apartment homes around her. And that area has LOTS of apartments. One of the posters here at WS had a son living in those apartments and verified what FBI did at the time.

EllaMae
10-09-2011, 06:32 PM
I can't stand to think about that baby being in the river. I am not prepared to go there yet even though I realize it's a possibility.

She's such a precious little thing.

belimom
10-09-2011, 06:33 PM
I thought that having lights on was one of the crime fighter tips to deter intruders...

I know that when DH has been away on work or working late, I have been known to have every light in the house on...