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View Full Version : MO - Amber Alert: Lisa Irwin, 10 months, Kansas City, 4 october 2011 #14


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imamaze
10-10-2011, 10:51 PM
An AMBER Alert was issued for 10-month-old Lisa Irwin on Tuesday, October 4th after she was abducted from her crib during the early morning hours. As of today (Thursday), no suspects have been identified, and the AMBER Alert has been canceled.
Lisa is 10 months old. She has blue eyes and blonde hair. She is 30 inches tall and weighs between 26 and 30 pounds. Lisa was last seen wearing purple shorts and a purple shirt with white kittens on it.
Lisa is described as having two bottom teeth, a small bug bite under her left ear, a beauty mark on her right outer thigh and currently has a cold with a cough.

Anyone with information is asked to call 9-1-1, your local police agency, or the Kansas City TIPS Hotline at 816-474-8477.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-F3oMoIELBws/Toss1w7hJUI/AAAAAAAAGe8/joul1-4XxSk/s1600/irwinl.png

Thread #1
Thread #2
Thread #3
Thread #4 (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=150751&page=16)
Thread #5
Thread #6
Thread #7
Thread #8
Thread #9
Thread #10
Thread #11
Thread #12
Thread #13


Lisa Irwin Timeline (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=150977&highlight=lisa+irwin+timeline)


Please remember the rules. We are not sleuthing random people. Mom and Dad only. We are not talking about parentage or anything else regarding any of the children.
Follow MSM lead and don't accuse anyone not named in MSM as a suspect.
Do not post rumors from Facebook, blogs or other sources. If you can't link you cannot discuss.
No sleuthing minors, or "random people".

Please continue here...

belimom
10-10-2011, 10:54 PM
Thanks, Ima, and all the other mods... This case is moving at 2 threads a day - thanks for all the hard work!

passionflower
10-10-2011, 10:54 PM
Full moon is coming up, hope the moon beams find baby Lisa...........good nite all.

justbeachy
10-10-2011, 10:55 PM
:offtobed:

This seems like a good place for me to sign off for the evening. Good night, all.

katydid23
10-10-2011, 10:55 PM
So when is the last verified sighting of that sweet baby? The neighbor and her kid were supposedly over that early evening to watch a movie with the boys. Did she see the baby?

BeanE
10-10-2011, 10:56 PM
http://kctv.images.worldnow.com/images/564284_G.jpg

:blowkiss:

curiositycat
10-10-2011, 10:57 PM
So when is the last verified sighting of that sweet baby? The neighbor and her kid was supposedly over that early evening to watch a movie with the kids. Did she see the baby?
I would have thought they would have tried to interview the woman for some television show, either they have and she refuses, or ?????

marge_rita
10-10-2011, 10:57 PM
BeanE.s post from the last thread.

Wut?

“They probably may or might not have a suspect or could be looking for all that tape, all that footage that TV stations took to see whether or not someone is giving a consistent story,” Morrison said. “They could see whether or not their suspect might have been interviewed or might be in any of that footage, they might be looking at footage around the house or vigils.”

http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/new...#ixzz1aRAAKrnI

I've got a major case of the giggles over this one. Overtired.
__________________


:waitasec::floorlaugh:
boy that there could of been on hee haw a bizillion years ago. :floorlaugh:

marycarney
10-10-2011, 10:58 PM
So when is the last verified sighting of that sweet baby? The neighbor and her kid was supposedly over that early evening to watch a movie with the kids. Did she see the baby?

That's what I want to know, too. I have not even seen evidence that this neighbor exists or tells the same story.

matou
10-10-2011, 10:58 PM
So when is the last verified sighting of that sweet baby? The neighbor and her kid was supposedly over that early evening to watch a movie with the kids. Did she see the baby?

The teen who was tested for DNA was over that day.

That neighbor apparently was at the home the day Lisa vanished and knew the access code to the family's garage.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-teen-questioned-police-california-tip/story?id=14695496

frankie069
10-10-2011, 10:58 PM
I wish you all a good night and if I cant sleep like usual, I know just the place to come to now. Thanks again for having me and I certainly hope against hope that Little Lisa is found alive. I hope I am able to find you all again come tomorrow.. (I get lost easy)..

Night all..

marge_rita
10-10-2011, 11:00 PM
http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/5767573/Missing-child-case-baffles-US-police


Missing child case baffles US police



Suspicion almost always falls heavily on the parents, especially when it's young kids," Dr Finkelhor said.

"Fifteen hundred parents kill their kids every year, and that's heavily focused on the under one year of age category."

wfgodot
10-10-2011, 11:00 PM
If someone would like the fun! task of adding tags, my limit has been reached without room for these:

missouri river, non-barking black lab, north brighton townhomes, northland, pd spokesman darin snapp, searching drainage ditch, spokesperson ashley irwin, statement analysis, subpoena raw news footage, teen neighbor(s), three cell phones

raeann
10-10-2011, 11:00 PM
BeanE.s post from the last thread.



:waitasec::floorlaugh:
boy that there could of been on hee haw a bizillion years ago. :floorlaugh:

Yes.....there is a reason this person is referred to with the word "former" in front of his name......FORMER Attorney General.....FORMER Prosecutor......here is the wiki link I posted in the last thread.....


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_J._Morrison

HatesSociopaths
10-10-2011, 11:03 PM
My theory is that the baby was buried in the backyard of a family member.

chieftess
10-10-2011, 11:03 PM
Yes.....there is a reason this person is referred to with the word "former" in front of his name......FORMER Attorney General.....FORMER Prosecutor......here is the wiki link I posted in the last thread.....


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_J._Morrison

A career prosecutor, Morrison has personally argued nearly 100 jury trials including the complex murder cases of notorious serial killers Richard Grissom and John E. Robinson. Morrison continued to personally prosecute cases as Kansas Attorney General.

He also prosecuted some very high profile cases

norest4thewicked
10-10-2011, 11:04 PM
If someone would like the fun! task of adding tags, my limit has been reached without room for these:

missouri river, non-barking black lab, north brighton townhomes, northland, pd spokesman darin snapp, searching drainage ditch, spokesperson ashley irwin, statement analysis, subpoena raw news footage, teen neighbor(s), three cell phones

I would but I'm already doing 3 things at once...haha

gwenabob
10-10-2011, 11:04 PM
My theory is that the baby was buried in the backyard of a family member.

>shiver<

JBean
10-10-2011, 11:05 PM
heads up. I am putting a forum together right now and you will all be transported there in a bit.
Please be nice to each other!

raeann
10-10-2011, 11:07 PM
A career prosecutor, Morrison has personally argued nearly 100 jury trials including the complex murder cases of notorious serial killers Richard Grissom and John E. Robinson. Morrison continued to personally prosecute cases as Kansas Attorney General.

He also prosecuted some very high profile cases


yes.....some good work ruined by later behavior.....this is the part that caused the "former" labels

"Scandal and resignation

Extramarital affair
In December 2007 allegations surfaced that Morrison had an affair with an office administrator, Linda Carter, in the district attorney's office, that continued after he was elected Attorney General. Carter filed a sexual harassment claim with the EEOC alleging that Morrison pressured her to obtain sensitive information about Kline and several pending investigations at the district attorney's office. Morrison admitted to the infidelity, but denies any impropriety, sexual harassment, pressure to obtain sensitive information, or influence the course of an investigation."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_J._Morrison

askfornina
10-10-2011, 11:09 PM
heads up. I am putting a forum together right now and you will all be transported there in a bit.
Please be nice to each other!

thank you!!!! :seeya:

katydid23
10-10-2011, 11:09 PM
My theory is that the baby was buried in the backyard of a family member.

I HOPE you are wrong, but you could be right.

The only way I can think of that she would have been able to pull it off is if someone came over and took the baby from her home and disposed of her. It is just hard to imagine that someone would do that. Like i posted earlier, both my brothers love me very much,and my older brother has done HUGE favors for me over the years. But I cannot imagine calling him in the middle of the night and asking him to dispose of his dead niece. It takes a pretty intense brother/sister relationship for someone to do a morbid favor like that. imoo

Peliman
10-10-2011, 11:11 PM
Headed out for a day trip shortly but I have read the subpoena to the grand jury. I'm a former photojournalist/video editor for a news station in Savannah.

Just wanted to mention it's asking for raw footage (comes from the camera tape.) Raw footage is cut edited onto show tapes, the edited version is saved to a library. Raw video tapes are placed in a box in the photographers room, it is not supposed to be reused for 5-7 days. Then it's reused for other stories.

During a week it's not hard between 6 or 8 photographers shooting 5-8 tapes a day maybe of various news events or assignments. It's alot of digital tape and the tapes need reused until their trash or re-cycled with new tapes. I'd sometimes use 30 tapes for the morning show producer and morning news.

If LE request raw footage, it must be subpoenaed. Not that it's difficult if it still exist but it's alot of work finding and previewing every tape. Cross your fingers for what they want. I have a feeling the GJ was used to meet the legal requirement of subpeonia to stop the reusing of raw video tape. JMO

chieftess
10-10-2011, 11:11 PM
yes.....some good work ruined by later behavior.....this is the part that caused the "former" labels

"Scandal and resignation

Extramarital affair
In December 2007 allegations surfaced that Morrison had an affair with an office administrator, Linda Carter, in the district attorney's office, that continued after he was elected Attorney General. Carter filed a sexual harassment claim with the EEOC alleging that Morrison pressured her to obtain sensitive information about Kline and several pending investigations at the district attorney's office. Morrison admitted to the infidelity, but denies any impropriety, sexual harassment, pressure to obtain sensitive information, or influence the course of an investigation."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_J._Morrison

Yep, and unfortunately, he's not the first nor will he be the last to engage in career ending stupidity :)

Dr.Fessel
10-10-2011, 11:14 PM
Headed out for a day trip shortly but I have read the subpoena to the grand jury. I'm a former photojournalist/video editor for a news station in Savannah.

Just wanted to mention it's asking for raw footage (comes from the camera tape.) Raw footage is cut edited onto show tapes, the edited version is saved to a library. Raw video tapes are placed in a box in the photographers room, it is not supposed to be reused for 5-7 days. Then it's reused for other stories.

During a week it's not hard between 6 or 8 photographers shooting 5-8 tapes a day maybe of various news events or assignments. It's alot of digital tape and the tapes need reused until their trash or re-cycled with new tapes. I'd sometimes use 30 tapes for the morning show producer and morning news.

If LE request raw footage, it must be subpoenaed. Not that it's difficult if it still exist but it's alot of work finding and previewing every tape. Cross your fingers for what they want. I have a feeling the GJ was used to meet the legal requirement of subpeonia to stop the reusing of raw video tape. JMO

I love learning something new. Thank you!

Irish_Eyes
10-10-2011, 11:15 PM
My husband and I each have a son from our prior marriages/relationships. We got married in 2008 and last year we had a daughter, who is now 18 mos old. This case is just tearing me up.

JBean
10-10-2011, 11:16 PM
Lisa Irwin Missing! - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community <---- you are here

treeseeker
10-10-2011, 11:16 PM
Did anyone catch the news story about DB being on video buying a box of wine with an unknown man? Pic of said man was shown to neighbors - Fox4 reported, I missed some of it ETA: about 5 hours before DB said she put Lisa to bed, so about 5:30

Nana46
10-10-2011, 11:16 PM
BeanE.s post from the last thread.



:waitasec::floorlaugh:
boy that there could of been on hee haw a bizillion years ago. :floorlaugh:

Well I hope you all are happy. I have been on the now closed thread trying my darndest to reply to BeanE about that quote she posted and could not figure out why I had no quote button........ANYWHERE. Not a single post had the quote button and then it hit me....you dummy the thread has closed...now I am used to being left and keep refreshing until it sinks in what has happened but not tonight,LOL.....just overlook me I will be okay maybe!!!
And yes BeanE that was a 'wut' for sure!!!!!!!!!!!! I read that 4 times myself.

Dr.Fessel
10-10-2011, 11:18 PM
Did anyone catch the news story about DB being on video buying a box of wine with an unknown man? Pic of said man was shown to neighbors - Fox4 reported, I missed some of it ETA: about 5 hours before DB said she put Lisa to bed, so about 5:30
RuT RoH

askfornina
10-10-2011, 11:19 PM
Did anyone catch the news story about DB being on video buying a box of wine with an unknown man? Pic of said man was shown to neighbors - Fox4 reported, I missed some of it ETA: about 5 hours before DB said she put Lisa to bed, so about 5:30

yikes

marycarney
10-10-2011, 11:19 PM
Well I hope you all are happy. I have been on the now closed thread trying my darndest to reply to BeanE about that quote she posted and could not figure out why I had no quote button........ANYWHERE. Not a single post had the quote button and then it hit me....you dummy the thread has closed...now I am used to being left and keep refreshing until it sinks in what has happened but not tonight,LOL.....just overlook me I will be okay maybe!!!
And yes BeanE that was a 'wut' for sure!!!!!!!!!!!! I read that 4 times myself.

I am SO HAPPY to learn I am not the only one who has done this.......:seeya:

Emeralgem
10-10-2011, 11:19 PM
My theory is that the baby was buried in the backyard of a family member.

I readily admit I can't keep up and have missed tons of information concerning this case and most theories on what may have happened to Baby Lisa but may I ask WHY you seem to think she was buried in the backyard of a family member?

Wendy101
10-10-2011, 11:20 PM
Originally Posted by frankie069
This is where the story gets me. I thought the one son was in bed with her. didnt she, the mother state that to the police that she and her son and the new kitten fell asleep in bed together, Lisa was put in her room, she closed the door to the baby's room and her other son was in his bed. Then daddy comes home, see's lights on, thinks something is weird and says he goes to the boys rooms and see's them sleeping, then goes to his wife to ask her why the lights are on, she states she doesnt know, then they both go and check on Lisa and she is gone.. Ok.. that being said, who is lying about where the boys were sleeping because they both say something different and why wake your wife up before checking on the baby, does she not matter, you only check on the boys? Then you notice missing cell phones which you say caused a delay in calling the police, then the father says he called the police with his work phone that was in his pocket.. So what is it. This story has me spinning.. I could go on and on but I wont. There are way too many inconsistencies in this whole mess. I want to think they are innocent, I dont want to have them guilty already but its hard not to think that way, I think the Casey Anthony debacle has ruined me.. How I wish I would have known you all back then.


BBM: I always assumed Dad checked on the boys first because the lights were on because he figured they would be the ones up and perhaps fooling around at that hour....

sorrell skye
10-10-2011, 11:20 PM
We're getting a forum! :skip:

ETA: TY Mods!!!

ClueMeIn
10-10-2011, 11:20 PM
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#26 Today, 10:15 PM
Irish_Eyes
Registered User Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
Posts: 894

My husband and I each have a son from our prior marriages/relationships. We got married in 2008 and last year we had a daughter, who is now 18 mos old. This case is just tearing me up.


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#27 Today, 10:16 PM
JBean
WS Adminoderator Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Dana Point,CA
Posts: 14,406

Lisa Irwin Missing! - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community
Lisa Irwin Missing! - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community <---- you are here


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#28 Today, 10:16 PM
treeseeker
Registered User Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Heartland USA
Posts: 529

Did anyone catch the news story about DB being on video buying a box of wine with an unknown man? Pic of said man was shown to neighbors - Fox4 reported, I missed some of it ETA: about 5 hours before DB said she put Lisa to bed, so about 5:30

THIS! This would explain it all! Guy takes the baby, once she is passed out. JI knows, and is the reason for his attitude toward her. She cries because she knows what happened, and blames herself...as well she should.

belimom
10-10-2011, 11:20 PM
Did anyone catch the news story about DB being on video buying a box of wine with an unknown man? Pic of said man was shown to neighbors - Fox4 reported, I missed some of it ETA: about 5 hours before DB said she put Lisa to bed, so about 5:30

Depending on when dad went to work, he may not have left yet? :waitasec:

Cazzie
10-10-2011, 11:21 PM
Did anyone catch the news story about DB being on video buying a box of wine with an unknown man? Pic of said man was shown to neighbors - Fox4 reported, I missed some of it ETA: about 5 hours before DB said she put Lisa to bed, so about 5:30
You know what I'm going to ask...........do you have a link plz? :)

Dr.Fessel
10-10-2011, 11:21 PM
We're getting a forum! :skip:

WoW, Fast Case and Fast Forum? Any monkey on a unicycle video?:woohoo:

josh816
10-10-2011, 11:21 PM
yikes

http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-police-review-grocery-surveillance-deborah-bradley-20111010,0,3702048.story

treeseeker
10-10-2011, 11:22 PM
RuT RoH

I'm waiting to see if I heard it correctly. I think the report was, LE found a receipt for a purchase at a nearby grocery. They asked for video, saw DB and unknown man buying the wine.

BeanE
10-10-2011, 11:40 PM
Police Review Surveillance Video of Missing Baby's Mother

Video

Police found a receipt from the Festival Foods Store at I-35 & Chouteau during one of their searches. It gives investigators an idea of Lisa's mother, Deborah Bradley was doing hours before the child disappeared.

http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-police-review-grocery-surveillance-deborah-bradley-20111010,0,3702048.story?track=rss&utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+wdaf-news+%28FOX4KC+Local+News%29

krimekat
10-10-2011, 11:40 PM
Did anyone catch the news story about DB being on video buying a box of wine with an unknown man? Pic of said man was shown to neighbors - Fox4 reported, I missed some of it ETA: about 5 hours before DB said she put Lisa to bed, so about 5:30

would loved the link where this is reported . . . THANKS! 5 hours before Lisa went to bed . . .

Knox
10-10-2011, 11:42 PM
found it:

http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-police-review-grocery-surveillance-deborah-bradley-20111010,0,3702048.story

They bought a box of wine, paper plates and napkins.

No big deal...except that Lisa is missing. :(

Or if she had not told LE this little detail ...

JBean
10-10-2011, 11:43 PM
we have a whole forum to spread out in.

Please start breaking the convo into topic specific threads. The general discussion thread will remain open for a time-but will ultimately be closed for good.

Thanks and where is Lisa?

ClueMeIn
10-10-2011, 11:43 PM
Where is everyone?

Miziree
10-10-2011, 11:44 PM
Lisa Irwin Missing! - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community (http://websleuths.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=463) <---- you are here

:tyou:

ClueMeIn
10-10-2011, 11:44 PM
Can someone come get me? I'm lost? :(

Hallow
10-10-2011, 11:44 PM
That video makes me ill.

Cazzie
10-10-2011, 11:44 PM
Or if she had not told LE this little detail ...
Yep. Is this one of the "gaps"?

(I deleted my post since it was redundant...others posted the same link)

I was off looking for it while WS apparently had server issues...but it came back up pretty quickly! Thought maybe it had to be rebooted to complete Lisa's new forum...

Darcyline
10-10-2011, 11:45 PM
Didn't someone say days ago that they should be checking retail videos like that? Good thinking!

Unidentified? So...not JI? Who then? Was JI not at the house? He wouldn't be at work yet, right? **brain explode**

momtective
10-10-2011, 11:45 PM
Police Review Surveillance Video of Missing Baby's Mother

Video

Police found a receipt from the Festival Foods Store at I-35 & Chouteau during one of their searches. It gives investigators an idea of Lisa's mother, Deborah Bradley was doing hours before the child disappeared.

http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-police-review-grocery-surveillance-deborah-bradley-20111010,0,3702048.story?track=rss&utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+wdaf-news+%28FOX4KC+Local+News%29

:eek: :thud: :eek:

JBean
10-10-2011, 11:45 PM
Can someone come get me? I'm lost? :(
you are not lost! you are here:

Lisa Irwin Missing! - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

krimekat
10-10-2011, 11:45 PM
Can someone come get me? I'm lost? :(

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - MO - Amber Alert: Lisa Irwin, 10 months, Kansas City, 4 october 2011 #14

askfornina
10-10-2011, 11:45 PM
Or if she had not told LE this little detail ...

there is obviously no way of knowing. here's hoping the flow of information keeps at a steady pace!

curiositycat
10-10-2011, 11:45 PM
OMG this is big, now some of the truth is starting to come out. I wonder if JI knew about this?

marycarney
10-10-2011, 11:46 PM
Whiskey
Tango
Foxtrot

my_tee_mouse
10-10-2011, 11:47 PM
Heaven help me. First, I had to forego WS to do a stoopid paper I'd put off for days (while following Baby's Lisa's case), and the paper took me twice as long to do as it should have. THEN I FINALLY get finished, and I couldn't get on to WS. When I finally get on, I see Lisa's thread has been moved...panic attack! While hunting down the thread (now forum, I guess?) I literally held my breath and peeked out of one eye, afraid/hopeful of what colored words I might see in front of the thread title. Relieved I found ya'll. Relieved the "D" word isn't in front of the thread title, but really wishing the "F" word was!!!

From now on, no one is allowed to change parking spaces while I'm otherwise occupied. My heart can't take the anxiety.

eileenhawkeye
10-10-2011, 11:47 PM
So are we still going to have a general discussion thread or are we just going to create new topics for every aspect of the case we want to discuss?

krimekat
10-10-2011, 11:47 PM
OMG this is big, now some of the truth is starting to come out. I wonder if JI knew about this?

why is this huge? she went to the market 5 hrs before Lisa was put to bed . . .

curiositycat
10-10-2011, 11:47 PM
I got kicked out and had a bit of a time getting back in. I bet a few others did too

momtective
10-10-2011, 11:47 PM
Whiskey
Tango
Foxtrot

Ditto!

bammy
10-10-2011, 11:47 PM
Remember the tweet from earlier today about glass bottles being heard? Or is it too late and I'm going crazy?

Soulmagent
10-10-2011, 11:48 PM
OMG this is big, now some of the truth is starting to come out. I wonder if JI knew about this?

What did I miss?

ClueMeIn
10-10-2011, 11:48 PM
I'm found! I'm found! Thank you so much!

Now we need to find Ky, and Lisa, and all of our lost babies!

I wonder if DB was having an affair. I had a feeling she passed out, or would have woke up.

All for BOXED wine! ICK!

ClueMeIn
10-10-2011, 11:49 PM
bammy, boxed wine doesn't clang!

krimekat
10-10-2011, 11:49 PM
i'm found! I'm found! Thank you so much!

Now we need to find ky, and lisa, and all of our lost babies!

I wonder if db was having an affair. I had a feeling she passed out, or would have woke up.

All for boxed wine! Ick!

???

??

Wth? What's wrong with a box of wine?

curiositycat
10-10-2011, 11:49 PM
why is this huge? she went to the market 5 hrs before Lisa was put to bed . . .
And bought wine with an unidentified man. LE has been taking the picture through the neighborhood to see if neighbors recognize the man.

bammy
10-10-2011, 11:50 PM
But if MSM has it wrong again?

treeseeker
10-10-2011, 11:50 PM
My first question is, why didn't LE just ask DB who the man was?

jjenny
10-10-2011, 11:51 PM
Didn't someone say days ago that they should be checking retail videos like that? Good thinking!

Unidentified? So...not JI? Who then? Was JI not at the house? He wouldn't be at work yet, right? **brain explode**

Doesn't appear the man is the hubby since they said "unidentified."

jjenny
10-10-2011, 11:51 PM
My first question is, why didn't LE just ask DB who the man was?

How do you know they didn't?

Jaxson
10-10-2011, 11:51 PM
Remember the tweet from earlier today about glass bottles being heard? Or is it too late and I'm going crazy?


Well I read box of wine and thought of the cheap 'boxed' wine which wouldn't be bottles but I could be wrong maybe it was a case of bottled wine.

cluciano63
10-10-2011, 11:51 PM
And bought wine with an unidentified man. LE has been taking the picture through the neighborhood to see if neighbors recognize the man.

Do we know if that second part is true? She was with a man, not JI?

curiositycat
10-10-2011, 11:52 PM
What did I miss?

there is a survillance tape showing mom buying a box of wine at 5:30 pm with an unidentified man.
http://www.fox4kc.com/

partyuv5
10-10-2011, 11:52 PM
:eek: :thud: :eek:

During this newscast they also mentioned the family driving by the house and thanking the three girls that were relighting the candles from the vigil. One of the girls was my daughter.

curiositycat
10-10-2011, 11:52 PM
Do we know if that second part is true? She was with a man, not JI?
http://www.fox4kc.com/

ClueMeIn
10-10-2011, 11:52 PM
???

??

Wth?

Huh?

Jaxson
10-10-2011, 11:53 PM
I wonder if the video is hard to see...maybe a teenage boy?

JBean
10-10-2011, 11:53 PM
The surveillance video-the man and the box of wine - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

bring it over folks.

marycarney
10-10-2011, 11:54 PM
Slightly OT - can someone please explain to me the significance of this case getting it's own forum? Does it make it different in how I find the threads to read? Sorry - I am GREAT at taking care of ICU pediatric patients - not so good at much else :)

treeseeker
10-10-2011, 11:54 PM
How do you know they didn't?

News referred to him as unidentified, and they were showing the pic to other people to identify.

cluciano63
10-10-2011, 11:54 PM
Well.

Nana46
10-10-2011, 11:54 PM
I think I am blessed to have my little grandchildren tomorrow. Altho I can't check in here on the forum, each time I look into their little faces I will think about baby Lisa and pray she is found. You guys keep up the good work tomorrow and I will be thinking about you all.

cluciano63
10-10-2011, 11:54 PM
Slightly OT - can someone please explain to me the significance of this case getting it's own forum? Does it make it different in how I find the threads to read? Sorry - I am GREAT at taking care of ICU pediatric patients - not so good at much else :)

It is now under "Hot Cases" up towards the top...

~n/t~
10-10-2011, 11:55 PM
Where were Lisa and the boys when she was buying the wine?

grandmaj
10-10-2011, 11:55 PM
Could she have left the kids alone? While she went out?

That would sure mess up a poly. One question about did she drink that day, or did she go out. Lord.

jjenny
10-10-2011, 11:55 PM
News referred to him as unidentified, and they were showing the pic to other people to identify.

I think the photo they are showing is of the homeless man that is a "handyman" not the guy with the mother in the store.

marycarney
10-10-2011, 11:56 PM
Well I read box of wine and thought of the cheap 'boxed' wine which wouldn't be bottles but I could be wrong maybe it was a case of bottled wine.

Forgive my snarkiness, but if mom can afford a case of wine, perhaps the 'cannot afford a divorce' is less than truthful?

liz b.
10-10-2011, 11:56 PM
Did anyone catch the news story about DB being on video buying a box of wine with an unknown man? Pic of said man was shown to neighbors - Fox4 reported, I missed some of it ETA: about 5 hours before DB said she put Lisa to bed, so about 5:30

If she really put Lisa to bed at 7 :30. that would mean 5 hours before that time would be 2 :30pm in the afternoon ??? MOO

Knox
10-10-2011, 11:57 PM
bammy, boxed wine doesn't clang!

They could have been going through a comingle recycle bin which has glass bottles in it, while looking for a wine box.

grandmaj
10-10-2011, 11:58 PM
Peeps having your own forum will divide the subjects up. It is going to give us more portability in discussing certain topics to make the topics as they hit easier to follow instead of feeling you are a hamster on a wheel trying to chase round and round.

It is going to give us a better resource area.

And it will assist us in keeping all of the news in one place instead of searching for links over and over.

It takes a tad to get used to but you will..... You can follow the discussions that you want to.

Pacific2011
10-10-2011, 11:58 PM
snipped:[quote=ClueMeIn;7214801]
I wonder if DB was having an affair. I had a feeling she passed out, or would have woken up. [/ QUOTE]

I think so too!! And that may be why she can't remember anything about that night. MOO.

And is there a reference/link to breaking bottles in one of the recent threads?
TIA.

nursebeeme
10-10-2011, 11:58 PM
Whiskey
Tango
Foxtrot

wonder if the shopping trip on tape was before or after the children were watching a (paraphrased to follow because I cannot recall the phrasing) 'childlike video' with the neighbor in the bedroom?

---

I must add that her particular comment hit me as strange because unless it is a NEW video I know exactly what movie my kids are putting in their dvd player.. and if it is a new one.. well you hear about that too..

----

sorry my two cents :twocents:

Irish_Eyes
10-10-2011, 11:58 PM
I might have to come down off the fence soon....we shall see....

SO...just throwing it out there for y'all to poke holes in....If she was hanging out with a man and both she and the mystery man were in relationships with other people...

AND LE asked her for a detailed accounting of her day and she did not mention a trip to the grocery store....

AND she had the neighbor kid watch her kids while she went to the store...

AND LE only found that out when talking to the kid when canvassing the neighborhood....

AND....they now see she bought alcohol yet they did not find any alcohol in the house during their searches

I could see why LE might be suspicious.

MOO

Jacie Estes
10-10-2011, 11:59 PM
Well I hope you all are happy. I have been on the now closed thread trying my darndest to reply to BeanE about that quote she posted and could not figure out why I had no quote button........ANYWHERE. Not a single post had the quote button and then it hit me....you dummy the thread has closed...now I am used to being left and keep refreshing until it sinks in what has happened but not tonight,LOL.....just overlook me I will be okay maybe!!!
And yes BeanE that was a 'wut' for sure!!!!!!!!!!!! I read that 4 times myself.

:floorlaugh:

You're in hte right place now. I've done that too. When I saw the new forum info at the top I thought it was alien abduction until I saw JBeans post that we had been transported. Didn't feel a thing. :D

vlpate
10-11-2011, 12:00 AM
Did anyone catch the news story about DB being on video buying a box of wine with an unknown man? Pic of said man was shown to neighbors - Fox4 reported, I missed some of it ETA: about 5 hours before DB said she put Lisa to bed, so about 5:30

Is this new? Do you have a link? If true, then this could be big.

nursebeeme
10-11-2011, 12:00 AM
So are we still going to have a general discussion thread or are we just going to create new topics for every aspect of the case we want to discuss?

spread out..

makes info easier to find.

for example: if you find an article that is breaking news post it as a new thread/topic for discussion.. (for example teen neighbor questioned... we haven't heard much more on that so far but then if anything else comes of it we have a history of posts/thoughts/articles, etc).. hope that helps

sorrell skye
10-11-2011, 12:01 AM
WoW, Fast Case and Fast Forum? Any monkey on a unicycle video?:woohoo:

Not yet - but I expect to see a Dr. named Fessel on a pogo stick @ any minute. Look out, folks!

eileenhawkeye
10-11-2011, 12:02 AM
spread out..

makes info easier to find.

for example: if you find an article that is breaking news post it as a new thread/topic for discussion.. (for example teen neighbor questioned... we haven't heard much more on that so far but then if anything else comes of it we have a history of posts/thoughts/articles, etc).. hope that helps

Okay, 'cause I know that they still have a general discussion thread going in the Haleigh Cummings forum, so I wasn't sure if it would be the same for this case.

JBean
10-11-2011, 12:05 AM
bring it over folks

The surveillance video-the man and the box of wine - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

Dr.Fessel
10-11-2011, 12:05 AM
Slightly OT - can someone please explain to me the significance of this case getting it's own forum? Does it make it different in how I find the threads to read? Sorry - I am GREAT at taking care of ICU pediatric patients - not so good at much else :)

Book mark this link Lisa Irwin Missing! - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community or you can always go to quick links at the top of any page and click on today's post and find threads that way.

This helps in the long run and really helps with info like links and history.

Pensfan
10-11-2011, 12:05 AM
Is this new? Do you have a link? If true, then this could be big.
http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-police-review-grocery-surveillance-deborah-bradley-20111010,0,3702048.story

liz b.
10-11-2011, 12:08 AM
wonder if the shopping trip on tape was before or after the children were watching a (paraphrased to follow because I cannot recall the phrasing) 'childlike video' with the neighbor in the bedroom?

---

I must add that her particular comment hit me as strange because unless it is a NEW video I know exactly what movie my kids are putting in their dvd player.. and if it is a new one.. well you hear about that too..

----

sorry my two cents :twocents:

Nurse,
I'm fairly sure she refered to the kids' movie as a "fairytale ' movie...just saying... MOO

Ruby Slippers
10-11-2011, 12:13 AM
I tried to click on the link in this post "10-10 Crime Scene at house now" (paraphrase) and get my hands smacked, so to speak. Says I'm trying to access administrator "stuff". Please clue me in. I haven't the foggiest idea of what this meant. I just clicked on the link. Thx

partyuv5
10-11-2011, 12:15 AM
Here is a thought:

Maybe mom was drinking some wine and did not want to be interrupted and baby lisa woke up and was fussy from her cold so mom gave her too much cold medicine (perhaps Nyquil or something strong) and when she checked on her again she would not wake up and mom panicked and then the cover up happens.

grandmaj
10-11-2011, 12:18 AM
I tried to click on the link in this post "10-10 Crime Scene at house now" (paraphrase) and get my hands smacked, so to speak. Says I'm trying to access administrator "stuff". Please clue me in. I haven't the foggiest idea of what this meant. I just clicked on the link. Thx

No worries. We moved an old thread thinking it was a new news twitter. :) Realized it was from early today.

We are losing our marbles in this move. No worries.

sorrell skye
10-11-2011, 12:18 AM
Here's the thing: I have no doubt that during the many hours of interviews/questioning/interrogation that DB has spent with LE over the past week, that she was asked about her activities prior to baby Lisa going missing.

The fact that LE has subpoenaed this grocery store video tape (after finding a receipt) tells me that perhaps DB may not have been exactly forthcoming with LE regarding her activities earlier in the day.

liz b.
10-11-2011, 12:20 AM
But, if she was in the store at around 5 ;30, wouldn't Jeremy still be at home ? He would not have left for work at that time ?

The video also stated that she bought paper plates and napkins ? A picnic ?

But, that might mean that she had been drinking just before she bathed Lisa at around 7 :30 pm ? Oh noooo.... MOO

cluciano63
10-11-2011, 12:21 AM
This latest bit of news will bring more coverage, for better or worse...nothing like a bit of sensationalism to stir it up....JMO

partyuv5
10-11-2011, 12:22 AM
Here's the thing: I have no doubt that during the many hours of interviews/questioning/interrogation that DB has spent with LE over the past week, that she was asked about her activities prior to baby Lisa going missing.

The fact that LE has subpoenaed this grocery store video tape (after finding a receipt) tells me that perhaps DB may not have been exactly forthcoming with LE regarding her activities earlier in the day.

I believe the subpoena by the grand jury was for the news channel's videos and interviews with the parents and family. I think the video at Festival was handed over.

grandmaj
10-11-2011, 12:24 AM
OK they didn't get this story right. Mom said she put Lisa down with a bottle at 7:30pm. She was seen on this video at 5pm. That is 2.5 hours before she said she put Lisa down for the night. She then said she checked on her at 10:30 when she went to bed.

Canadian4
10-11-2011, 12:25 AM
I honestly did not know you could buy wine in a box.

SarahW
10-11-2011, 12:26 AM
Do we know if that second part is true? She was with a man, not JI?

Maybe this is the handyman. Maybe besides mending broken hearts, he helps carry heavy boxes ...

grandmaj
10-11-2011, 12:26 AM
This begs the question about Jeremy saying he gave police names of men cheating on their wives to check out? Which sounded strange when we first heard it?

Apples2Apples
10-11-2011, 12:27 AM
Oh no, oh no, oh no! This isn't looking good at all!

sorrell skye
10-11-2011, 12:28 AM
I believe the subpoena by the grand jury was for the news channel's videos and interviews with the parents and family. I think the video at Festival was handed over.

What then, is the explanation for LE seeking video from the grocery store - after finding a receipt?

Riddle me this: If DB has been open & honest with investigators regarding her activities before the baby's disappearance, why does LE need video from a grocery store that she visited earlier in the day?

MsDetective
10-11-2011, 12:30 AM
Or if she had not told LE this little detail ...

And some of their list of suspects where people who were cheating......right?

treeseeker
10-11-2011, 12:33 AM
What then, is the explanation for LE seeking video from the grocery store - after finding a receipt?

Riddle me this: If DB has been open & honest with investigators regarding her activities before, during, or after the baby's disappearance, why does LE need video from a grocery store that she visited earlier in the day?

Maybe, to firm up a timeline of Lisa's whereabouts? whether or not she was with one of her parents at this time? I dunno.

AngelWings444
10-11-2011, 12:39 AM
When I watched the video of the woman stating her hubby didn't want to be on camera, the one thing that really stood out is the zoom in on the window of the house where Lisa was taken. They zoomed in on it quite a few times. Wondering now, if compared to today's re-enactment video, there would be some major differences? Haven't compared, barely time to catch up here and have been looked out a few times.

Hoping they find Lisa safe and sound. It's not looking like that and it's breaking my heart. :-( Will never understand how anyone could harm a child! :furious:

JeannieC
10-11-2011, 12:40 AM
The unidentified man might be the handyman. Maybe she bought him a bottle of wine. Some women use paper plates everyday or at least for the children. I've known many who do that.

I wonder if LE was looking for empty wine bottles or boxes to see if he hung out around their house that night.

Jat

pinkfly
10-11-2011, 12:42 AM
This case has had too many twists and turns. I have to be suspicious when a mother cannot give straight forward answers to the people trying to locate her missing child. I have had a bad feeling about this case for a few days and not I feel dismally betrayed. Poor little Lisa. Where are you sweety?

gwenabob
10-11-2011, 12:42 AM
http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-police-review-grocery-surveillance-deborah-bradley-20111010,0,3702048.story

Erp. That might explain the "gaps" in time. She was passed out drunk? But wasn't dad home with her during this time? Was he drinking before he went to work?

New theories:

1. The "handyman" she was with took the baby. (purpose?)

2. She took the baby to bed with her accidentally rolled over on the baby while passed out, suffocating her, and mom and/or dad hid the body to cover up.

nursebeeme
10-11-2011, 12:46 AM
I honestly did not know you could buy wine in a box.

http://www.mediamarketing.ba/mat/dizajn/BiBox5L_Bijeli.jpg

just an example

JeannieC
10-11-2011, 12:50 AM
Erp. That might explain the "gaps" in time. She was passed out drunk? But wasn't dad home with her during this time? Was he drinking before he went to work?

New theories:

1. The "handyman" she was with took the baby. (purpose?)

2. She took the baby to bed with her accidentally rolled over on the baby while passed out, suffocating her, and mom and/or dad hid the body to cover up.

I've wondered if she took the baby to bed with her, the son was in bed with them too, maybe someone did roll on her. IF Lisa were drinking she might not have been aware of the baby in the bed. I don't want to accuse her but it could have been an accident.

moo

cluciano63
10-11-2011, 12:50 AM
I'm wondering if Mom has doubts about this man she bought the wine with...was he over at the house after dad went to work and is she suspicious of him, perhaps? And has held back the fact that he was there, maybe? Assuming she did not tell LE about this event (buying wine) there has to be a reason and trying to give her the benefit of the doubt...

pwilly
10-11-2011, 12:50 AM
Just wondering, right now the sunrise in kansas city missouri is at 7:20. I still can't figure out why it would take going into the house to realize all the lights were on when it was still dark outside.

Just K
10-11-2011, 12:52 AM
That's what I want to know, too. I have not even seen evidence that this neighbor exists or tells the same story.

LE may have interviewed her and asked her not to talk to the media about the details of the visit.

grandmaj
10-11-2011, 12:52 AM
The timeline is only as good as the person giving it to LE. I have never felt this timeline was accurate.

SarahW
10-11-2011, 12:53 AM
Erp. That might explain the "gaps" in time. She was passed out drunk? But wasn't dad home with her during this time? Was he drinking before he went to work?

New theories:

1. The "handyman" she was with took the baby. (purpose?)

2. She took the baby to bed with her accidentally rolled over on the baby while passed out, suffocating her, and mom and/or dad hid the body to cover up.

But where... They wouldn't have time.

Just K
10-11-2011, 12:55 AM
Just thought of another question:
When did the dog go outside and if he is an outside dog when did they go out back & feed him?

SarahW
10-11-2011, 12:57 AM
I still think there's the possibility of an innocent explanation for the store companion.

Still, I'm suddenly wondering if her cell phone had really been malfunctioning, or if that was just some excuse she made up for missed calls or failure to check in with JI.

cluciano63
10-11-2011, 12:59 AM
A lot depends on what time her husband went to work, and of course, who the man in the video is. And mostly, if she told LE about the wine store visit before they found out. JMO

cluciano63
10-11-2011, 01:00 AM
Just thought of another question:
When did the dog go outside and if he is an outside dog when did they go out back & feed him?

I believe husband said he is an outside dog (who doesn't bark) but did not mention feeding time. (I wish the outside dogs on my block didn't bark.)

my_tee_mouse
10-11-2011, 01:03 AM
I've wondered if she took the baby to bed with her, the son was in bed with them too, maybe someone did roll on her. IF Lisa were drinking she might not have been aware of the baby in the bed. I don't want to accuse her but it could have been an accident.

moo

But Lisa's not a newborn. She's a good-sized 10-month-old girl who could wiggle and squiggle and cry out. I'd think it would be hard (even for someone near-comatose) to roll over on her in such away that she couldn't react and be heard or felt reacting.

HatesSociopaths
10-11-2011, 01:03 AM
It looks like we are allowed to guess who was at the store with her so here you go: It was likely her brother Steve. I have so much to provide about him if he is ever named a person of interest. He lives 5 miles from her per last known address. Sorry if I have said too much here I am suppressing much more than this.

gwenabob
10-11-2011, 01:03 AM
I've wondered if she took the baby to bed with her, the son was in bed with them too, maybe someone did roll on her. IF Lisa were drinking she might not have been aware of the baby in the bed. I don't want to accuse her but it could have been an accident.

moo

And that would certainly be the kind of "accident" one would not want to 'fess up to.

my_tee_mouse
10-11-2011, 01:05 AM
The timeline is only as good as the person giving it to LE. I have never felt this timeline was accurate.
The bolded portion of this statement has been going through my head all day long.

jjenny
10-11-2011, 01:05 AM
But Lisa's not a newborn. She's a good-sized 10-month-old girl who could wiggle and squiggle and cry out. I'd think it would be hard (even for someone near-comatose) to roll over on her in such away that she couldn't react and be heard or felt reacting.

Yes, I agree. She is not a newborn it would be difficult to roll over on her.

flipflop
10-11-2011, 01:06 AM
I still think there's the possibility of an innocent explanation for the store companion.

Still, I'm suddenly wondering if her cell phone had really been malfunctioning, or if that was just some excuse she made up for missed calls or failure to check in with JI.

I am thinking....

1. This mystery man is someone who she is having an affair with, did she have a sitter at home, while she was with her possible bf? Broken cell phones are a good cover up for affairs.

2. The mystery man is a neighbour who gave her a ride to the store? She came home and drank lots of wine, passed out, left all the lights on and door unlocked, and this is why her story has holes in it as she would be embarrased to state that she was drunk or that she was too drunk to remember everything that she had done prior to the baby going missing.

JMO...

cluciano63
10-11-2011, 01:07 AM
IF an accident happened while a parent was intoxicated, you have your reason why a parent might actually cover up the child's death, IMO. Especially if they knew for sure the child was deceased, no chance of reviving. That at the least would be negligent homicide or manslaughter. JMO

my_tee_mouse
10-11-2011, 01:09 AM
I still think there's the possibility of an innocent explanation for the store companion.

Still, I'm suddenly wondering if her cell phone had really been malfunctioning, or if that was just some excuse she made up for missed calls or failure to check in with JI.
There very well could be an innocent explanation for the store visit and companion. Or the omission really has nothing to do with Lisa's disappearance, and the mother is merely trying to keep from letting the father know she was at the store with another man. BUT there's a lesson here for all of us: if we are EVER (Gawd forbid) put in a situation where we must be questioned by LE, even if we were outside jay-bird nekkid, howling at the moon when the event in question occurred...we'd best admit that we were outside jay-bird nekkid howling at the moon!

al66pine
10-11-2011, 01:10 AM
Sorrell sky (sp) post 117
"What then, is the explanation for LE seeking video from the grocery store - after finding a receipt?
"Riddle me this: If DB has been open & honest with investigators regarding her activities before the baby's disappearance, why does LE need video from a grocery store that she visited earlier in the day?"

I think you are saying indirectly (and I agree):
Appears in talking to LE, that Mom had been ---
--- less than open & honest re her timeline that day, and/or
--- unable/unwilling to fill all the little bitty time gaps.

.................................................. ..............................................
If receipt was just a "cash receipt" (no debit or credit card #, no preferred shopper #, etc.),
that LE found in Baby Lisa's home, LE w/investigate who made grocery purchase (w or w/out wine),
just to fill time gap, and/or to corroborate mom's timeline
(or perhaps dad's timeline, if he had told LE, he went to grocery).

If cash receipt, LE w/not know that either of the two of them made that purchase,
until verifying by surv. recording (or, as back in the day, talking to cashier, bagger, etc.)

LE seems to have hit a double, w. receipt showing
---wine purchase that day,
---mom accompanied (apparently) by man-other-than-Jeremy.
And if mom had omitted this errand from her timeline to LE, it was a triple play.

What could send the LE hitter to home base?
?Surv. recording of parking lot = Mom drinking wine, alone or w. that man?
Oops, carried away w. sports analogy.

Like folks above said, mom's lie-by-omission (if fact was omitted) c/be big issue.

If she omitted this errand from her timeline to LE, was it to hide from Dad or LE ---
---buying alcohol, as a $ waster?
---buying w. other man?
---poss leaving kids alone (if she did, & if dad h/not known)?,
---the box of wine being consumed or missing?
---her imbibing (if she did) poss contrib'g to death (if Lisa is no longer alive)?

grandmaj
10-11-2011, 01:10 AM
The dog conversation from the Judge Jeannie show is here.......

Father said dog would bark if anything out of order....... Mom didn't hear dog.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=150933&page=16

Just K
10-11-2011, 01:11 AM
http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-police-review-grocery-surveillance-deborah-bradley-20111010,0,3702048.story
The date on this story is today... so this certainly is a big RUT ROH for Mom. Also, the lead came from a receipt they found. After viewing the surveillance tape LE went back to search the Irwin backyard and then behind the house with the red shutters.

cluciano63
10-11-2011, 01:13 AM
I couldn't open any links the last little while...do we know what led LE to the store for the video?

Darcyline
10-11-2011, 01:15 AM
my-tee-mouse-I agree. It will be absolutely tragic to me if Mom and Dad are totally innocent, but a few white lies to cover up unflattering possibilities led LE to suspect or focus on them. I am not blaming the parents necessarily-I feel like I might have the same impulse.

Just K
10-11-2011, 01:15 AM
So if this grocery trip occured at 5:00 PM, who was watching the three kids?

krimekat
10-11-2011, 01:15 AM
I couldn't open any links the last little while...do we know what led LE to the store for the video?

a receipt was found

AngelWings444
10-11-2011, 01:15 AM
There is no way Baby Lisa could have been rolled over in bed and died by accident. She was 30 lbs. Too big for this to happen by anyone named in that bed. Baby Lisa was not an infant, even at infant stages, this would be very rare.

marge_rita
10-11-2011, 01:16 AM
My theory is that the baby was buried in the backyard of a family member.

Omgosh, I pray not.
Can you share how you came to your theory? tia


imo

Just K
10-11-2011, 01:17 AM
I couldn't open any links the last little while...do we know what led LE to the store for the video?

They found a receipt at the Irwin home...for IIRC, box wine & paper plates and such.

cluciano63
10-11-2011, 01:21 AM
This whole wine thing might explain why hubby seems to be keeping his distance from mom in the videos, at least to me. Maybe he knows or suspects about the other man, even if he did not know about whatever may have happened that evening. And might explain the remark about the baby being the link to them all, or however it was phrased. She might have been the reason they stayed together, IF there was an affair.

JMO and all supposition

It's pretty awful if this all comes out and has nothing to do with Lisa...talk about letting the focus go away from your missing child...

marge_rita
10-11-2011, 01:22 AM
Did anyone catch the news story about DB being on video buying a box of wine with an unknown man? Pic of said man was shown to neighbors - Fox4 reported, I missed some of it ETA: about 5 hours before DB said she put Lisa to bed, so about 5:30

hu? thud

JeannieC
10-11-2011, 01:24 AM
There very well could be an innocent explanation for the store visit and companion. Or the omission really has nothing to do with Lisa's disappearance, and the mother is merely trying to keep from letting the father know she was at the store with another man. BUT there's a lesson here for all of us: if we are EVER (Gawd forbid) put in a situation where we must be questioned by LE, even if we were outside jay-bird nekkid, howling at the moon when the event in question occurred...we'd best admit that we were outside jay-bird nekkid howling at the moon!

If I'm ever outside jay-bird nekkid, howling at the moon I'll swear its my twin sister! :floorlaugh:

marge_rita
10-11-2011, 01:24 AM
Well I hope you all are happy. I have been on the now closed thread trying my darndest to reply to BeanE about that quote she posted and could not figure out why I had no quote button........ANYWHERE. Not a single post had the quote button and then it hit me....you dummy the thread has closed...now I am used to being left and keep refreshing until it sinks in what has happened but not tonight,LOL.....just overlook me I will be okay maybe!!!
And yes BeanE that was a 'wut' for sure!!!!!!!!!!!! I read that 4 times myself.

Nana46--:floorlaugh: lololol Don't you hate that? :crazy:
I'm sorry I'm laughing, and yes I know the feeling.
I left to eat dinner and visit with my daughter. I came back, picked up where I left off and figured out I was an entire thread behind. :waitasec:


imo

LillieBelle
10-11-2011, 01:24 AM
A small box of wine has the equivilant of 5 small bottles of wine in it. The larger size has seven bottles! Sam's Club has a small box of Cabernet Sauvingnon for $7.00, and it's pretty decent...just fyi...

Ruby Slippers
10-11-2011, 01:25 AM
Bottom line: Seemingly suspicious behavior of teen in earlier raw footage can be observed if you Check out this video with on-site reporter (KCTV-4) John Pepitone on Chic Trib site:

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/wdaf-authorities-continue-search-for-missing-baby-20111005,0,7975319.story

Look for: At the 1:29 mark of the video, JI receives a hug from a male friend or relative and walks to a silver crew-cab pickup truck with a soda bottle in his right hand (Coke?). As JI gets into the back seat, passenger-side of the truck, notice the teen male in bright green hoodie, wearing sunglasses, hanging on the truck's driver's side back door. When the teen sees the cameras are on JI and thus on him, the teen boy appears to deliberately cover/shield his face with his right arm to avoid being on camera.

Why am I suggesting you go to the Chic Trib site:
I was researching media videos on the Jackson County TV-4 website. I checked about 10 (of 31 possible) videos, and all but one was accessible to view. This one titled:

"Police Take Search Door-to-door for missing 10-month-old" denied access with a warning that I did not have authority to access. I Googled this article title and found I could access on the Chicago Trib site.

I'm curious what you think of the teen behavior in this particular video and what you think about KCTV-4 viewers being denied access to this video given the subpoena for raw video footage? Could LE have required the News media to close off access to this?

Dr. Know?
10-11-2011, 01:26 AM
I just saw this video and my apologies if it's a repeat but there's no way anymore I can keep up with this case, have too much going on lately. Buying wine with a man 5 hours before Lisa went missing? hmmm What man I wonder. This is heating up. Hope Lisa is found.

Police Review Surveillance Video of Missing Baby's Mother

http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-police-review-grocery-surveillance-deborah-bradley-20111010,0,3702048.story

curiousc
10-11-2011, 01:28 AM
This whole wine thing might explain why hubby seems to be keeping his distance from mom in the videos, at least to me. Maybe he knows or suspects about the other man, even if he did not know about whatever may have happened that evening. And might explain the remark about the baby being the link to them all, or however it was phrased. She might have been the reason they stayed together, IF there was an affair.

JMO and all supposition

It's pretty awful if this all comes out and has nothing to do with Lisa...talk about letting the focus go away from your missing child...

OMG about the wine! As someone else said, thud!

JeannieC
10-11-2011, 01:28 AM
But Lisa's not a newborn. She's a good-sized 10-month-old girl who could wiggle and squiggle and cry out. I'd think it would be hard (even for someone near-comatose) to roll over on her in such away that she couldn't react and be heard or felt reacting.

IF mom was drunk? Think of the size of mom and the size of Lisa.

JBean
10-11-2011, 01:29 AM
I just saw this video and my apologies if it's a repeat but there's no way anymore I can keep up with this case, have too much going on lately. Buying wine with a man 5 hours before Lisa went missing? hmmm What man I wonder. This is heating up. Hope Lisa is found.

Police Review Surveillance Video of Missing Baby's Mother

http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-police-review-grocery-surveillance-deborah-bradley-20111010,0,3702048.story


Come on over doc
The surveillance video-the man and the box of wine - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

marge_rita
10-11-2011, 01:31 AM
I'm waiting to see if I heard it correctly. I think the report was, LE found a receipt for a purchase at a nearby grocery. They asked for video, saw DB and unknown man buying the wine.

Baby Lisa's mom is caught on tape buying wine (with a man that's not the man she lives with) 5 hours before she puts the SICK baby down for the night. :banghead:

Where was the baby and her half brothers while this wine buy was going on?

imo

cluciano63
10-11-2011, 01:32 AM
IF mom was drunk? Think of the size of mom and the size of Lisa.

I'm worried about that kitten if she rolled over...

marge_rita
10-11-2011, 01:36 AM
That video makes me ill.

Kind of makes me scratch my head.

The first day her live in mate works night shift and she's out buying wine...........with another man. What the heck happened to baby Lisa.


imo

mysteriew
10-11-2011, 01:37 AM
Bottom line: Seemingly suspicious behavior of teen in earlier raw footage can be observed if you Check out this video with on-site reporter (KCTV-4) John Pepitone on Chic Trib site:

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/wdaf-authorities-continue-search-for-missing-baby-20111005,0,7975319.story

Look for: At the 1:29 mark of the video, JI receives a hug from a male friend or relative and walks to a silver crew-cab pickup truck with a soda bottle in his right hand (Coke?). As JI gets into the back seat, passenger-side of the truck, notice the teen male in bright green hoodie, wearing sunglasses, hanging on the truck's driver's side back door. When the teen sees the cameras are on JI and thus on him, the teen boy appears to deliberately cover/shield his face with his right arm to avoid being on camera.

Why am I suggesting you go to the Chic Trib site:
I was researching media videos on the Jackson County TV-4 website. I checked about 10 (of 31 possible) videos, and all but one was accessible to view. This one titled:

"Police Take Search Door-to-door for missing 10-month-old" denied access with a warning that I did not have authority to access. I Googled this article title and found I could access on the Chicago Trib site.

I'm curious what you think of the teen behavior in this particular video and what you think about KCTV-4 viewers being denied access to this video given the subpoena for raw video footage? Could LE have required the News media to close off access to this?

Is that the one that LE subpoena'd? Maybe?

Just K
10-11-2011, 01:39 AM
They could have been going through a comingle recycle bin which has glass bottles in it, while looking for a wine box.

The BOX O' WINE might still be in the refrigerator or left out and unfinished. In the very first news footage DI can be seen, in front of the house, talking to what appears to be a newsperson. The recycle bins are right next to the front door. They aren't there anymore.

cluciano63
10-11-2011, 01:40 AM
If she was with this man in her home that evening and something happened to Lisa, even if she died of natural causes, this is the kind of setting in which I could see a parent opting for "kidnapping" vs. calling 911...these days drinking while caring for a young child is kind of frowned on, having a man there while hubby is at work doesn't help. She might panic.

Not telling LE about this excursion is a big problem, assuming she didn't, as it seems.

Wishbone
10-11-2011, 01:40 AM
Bottom line: Seemingly suspicious behavior of teen in earlier raw footage can be observed if you Check out this video with on-site reporter (KCTV-4) John Pepitone on Chic Trib site:

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/wdaf-authorities-continue-search-for-missing-baby-20111005,0,7975319.story

Look for: At the 1:29 mark of the video, JI receives a hug from a male friend or relative and walks to a silver crew-cab pickup truck with a soda bottle in his right hand (Coke?). As JI gets into the back seat, passenger-side of the truck, notice the teen male in bright green hoodie, wearing sunglasses, hanging on the truck's driver's side back door. When the teen sees the cameras are on JI and thus on him, the teen boy appears to deliberately cover/shield his face with his right arm to avoid being on camera.

Why am I suggesting you go to the Chic Trib site:
I was researching media videos on the Jackson County TV-4 website. I checked about 10 (of 31 possible) videos, and all but one was accessible to view. This one titled:

"Police Take Search Door-to-door for missing 10-month-old" denied access with a warning that I did not have authority to access. I Googled this article title and found I could access on the Chicago Trib site.

I'm curious what you think of the teen behavior in this particular video and what you think about KCTV-4 viewers being denied access to this video given the subpoena for raw video footage? Could LE have required the News media to close off access to this?



The teen did hide his face when he realized he was on camera. It appeared to me that he was talking to someone in the backseat on the driver side of the truck. Wonder who was sitting in that particular seat?

mysteriew
10-11-2011, 01:41 AM
Baby Lisa's mom is caught on tape buying wine (with a man that's not the man she lives with) 5 hours before she puts the SICK baby down for the night. :banghead:

Where was the baby and her half brothers while this wine buy was going on?

imo


According to DB's statements she put Lisa to bed at 7:30 pm. Which would be 2 hours after buying the wine. She said she went to bed at 10:30 pm which would be 5 hours after buying the wine.

marge_rita
10-11-2011, 01:45 AM
Didn't someone say days ago that they should be checking retail videos like that? Good thinking!

Unidentified? So...not JI? Who then? Was JI not at the house? He wouldn't be at work yet, right? **brain explode**
bbm

Me! A day ro so ago I posted that grocery store and 7/11 type store videos should be checked for a baby in a cart. Someone replied that the area was too large. Thank goodness LE found a reciept to a grocery store and they checked the video. It may not show baby Lisa but it shows what her mom was doing a few hours before Lisa disappeared.


imo

captivagrl
10-11-2011, 01:46 AM
OK, been busy and have not read through all theories yet, the more I thought about everything, mulled it over, off and on, I think there's a possibility that Mom knows baby Lisa's Dad is a third party. She's known it all along. Because there is a legal assumption that Mom's husband is the father it has to be rectified before she can marry her fiance. This requires a DNA test or for her boyfriend to testify in open court in front of a judge that he claims to be the father of Lisa. I'm not sure of the legality in their state, it may still require an official DNA test. If she knew that test was coming up, very soon, there's a motive to....stop that test from happening. Her whole world would fall apart IF her husband and fiance were not the biological parent of Lisa. Just a theory, as I said I haven't read through the thread so if someone else thought of this first, I agree.

marge_rita
10-11-2011, 01:47 AM
bammy, boxed wine doesn't clang!

:floorlaugh: another good point!

marge_rita
10-11-2011, 01:49 AM
My first question is, why didn't LE just ask DB who the man was?
Maybe LE did ask DB who he was. We just don't know what LE and DB have talked about. :)

imo

katydid23
10-11-2011, 01:49 AM
It looks like we are allowed to guess who was at the store with her so here you go: It was likely her brother Steve. I have so much to provide about him if he is ever named a person of interest. He lives 5 miles from her per last known address. Sorry if I have said too much here I am suppressing much more than this.

But cops are calling him an unidentified man.' And showing his picture to the neighbors. Wouldn't the cops already know who her brother was?

marge_rita
10-11-2011, 01:50 AM
Do we know if that second part is true? She was with a man, not JI?
:seeya:
According to the latest video news report, it's true.


imo

Wishbone
10-11-2011, 01:50 AM
OK, been busy and have not read through all theories yet, the more I thought about everything, mulled it over, off and on, I think there's a possibility that Mom knows baby Lisa's Dad is a third party. She's known it all along. Because there is a legal assumption that Mom's husband is the father it has to be rectified before she can marry her fiance. This requires a DNA test or for her boyfriend to testify in open court in front of a judge that he claims to be the father of Lisa. I'm not sure of the legality in their state, it may still require an official DNA test. If she knew that test was coming up, very soon, there's a motive to....stop that test from happening. Her whole world would fall apart IF her husband and fiance were not the biological parent of Lisa. Just a theory, as I said I haven't read through the thread so if someone else thought of this first, I agree.


wow, I hadn't even thought of that and just last night we were discussing all the various paternity issues. It certainly could be a motive to disappear little Lisa.

MyBelle
10-11-2011, 01:50 AM
The BOX O' WINE might still be in the refrigerator or left out and unfinished. In the very first news footage DI can be seen, in front of the house, talking to what appears to be a newsperson. The recycle bins are right next to the front door. They aren't there anymore.

I doubt the box of wine has been recovered from Irwin house.

I think it resides with whomever has Lisa and was intended for a "celebration." Unless it's been emptied, of course.

JMO

JeannieC
10-11-2011, 01:52 AM
OK, been busy and have not read through all theories yet, the more I thought about everything, mulled it over, off and on, I think there's a possibility that Mom knows baby Lisa's Dad is a third party. She's known it all along. Because there is a legal assumption that Mom's husband is the father it has to be rectified before she can marry her fiance. This requires a DNA test or for her boyfriend to testify in open court in front of a judge that he claims to be the father of Lisa. I'm not sure of the legality in their state, it may still require an official DNA test. If she knew that test was coming up, very soon, there's a motive to....stop that test from happening. Her whole world would fall apart IF her husband and fiance were not the biological parent of Lisa. Just a theory, as I said I haven't read through the thread so if someone else thought of this first, I agree.

So are you saying she did something to Lisa to hide that from her husband and her live-in boyfriend?

katydid23
10-11-2011, 01:53 AM
Baby Lisa's mom is caught on tape buying wine (with a man that's not the man she lives with) 5 hours before she puts the SICK baby down for the night. :banghead:

Where was the baby and her half brothers while this wine buy was going on?

imo

Since it was only 5:30, I think it is possible that Dad was at home with the kids. She may have given him an excuse about where she was going, OR maybe she told him the truth that she was going to the store.

But IF LE is really calling him a 'mystery man"--then she was not cooperating fully.

jjenny
10-11-2011, 01:53 AM
wow, I hadn't even thought of that and just last night we were discussing all the various paternity issues. It certainly could be a motive to disappear little Lisa.

That kind of plan doesn't make sense to me. How would she ever be able to "reappear" little Lisa?

krimekat
10-11-2011, 01:54 AM
But cops are calling him a 'mystery man.' And showing his picture to the neighbors. Wouldn't the cops already know who her brother was?

um, isn't the picture LE is showing around the neighborhood the "handyman" not the un-IDed male in the video from the market? Yeah, go ahead and speculate about WHO's on the video with Deborah . . . is it the "handyman" or the teen-neighbor or her brother (interesting comment)? OMG - it was Mr. Green in the Conservatory with the Rope!

Confusion, adding to it

cluciano63
10-11-2011, 01:55 AM
If LE is calling him a mystery man, she still isn't telling who he is, I guess.

thepinkdragon
10-11-2011, 01:56 AM
It looks like we are allowed to guess who was at the store with her so here you go: It was likely her brother Steve. I have so much to provide about him if he is ever named a person of interest. He lives 5 miles from her per last known address. Sorry if I have said too much here I am suppressing much more than this. Oh if only you could tell, lol. Anyhow a thought just hit me. Let's say it was her brother and let's also say that the text at 2:30 am was also her brother. Since it was supposedly said "I'm ready when you are" it COULD have been a delayed delivery on the text. I can't tell you how many times someone texts me and I either a)never get it or b) get it hours or even days after they sent it. Just a thought, if either above are true.

katydid23
10-11-2011, 01:56 AM
um, isn't the picture LE is showing around the neighborhood the "handyman" not the un-IDed male in the video from the market?

Confusion, adding to it

Oh---I thought I read that it was the man with the box-o-wine that was a mystery. My bad.

RT51
10-11-2011, 01:56 AM
First of all, I drink wine from a box. If you check it out, most brands in boxes are actually less alcohol then bottles. Just because she bought a box, does not mean she drank the whole thing. I think we are too quick to accuse sometimes. It was posted earlier too by a local that it could of been her brother, Steve, with her at the store.

I'm not saying she is innocent, but just because she went to the store and bought a box of wine, does not make her a murdererer. Also, if her husband worked until 4am, I would assume he left for work around 7 or 8pm. That means he was home when she went to the store.

I personally like the boxes as you can have a glass and it doesn't go stale like an open bottle does. A box can last a couple of weeks!

captivagrl
10-11-2011, 01:59 AM
So are you saying she did something to Lisa to hide that from her husband and her live-in boyfriend?

Her lifestyle is supported from military benefits from her husband and her boyfriend's employment. I haven't heard/read about another source. Just speculating, looking for motive.

MyBelle
10-11-2011, 02:00 AM
Oh---I thought I read that it was the man with the box-o-wine that was a mystery. My bad.

I think you are correct that the wine guy is a mystery. It hasn't been revealed to be one and the same as the "handyman" afaik.

JMO

marge_rita
10-11-2011, 02:00 AM
This begs the question about Jeremy saying he gave police names of men cheating on their wives to check out? Which sounded strange when we first heard it?

Sounds like J and D may be playing a dangerous of "IM calling you out"....

imo

JeannieC
10-11-2011, 02:01 AM
This mystery man could have been DB's brother. If it was at 5 pm JI was probably at home watching the children while they ran to the store. He might have stayed after JI went to work.

Lisa had a cold and a cough. Maybe one of them gave her a little wine to help her sleep and on top of cough medicine it was fatal. People do stupid things.

Then one of them took her away from the house. Would explain the man walking down the street with a baby. Faked the break-in.

moo

thepinkdragon
10-11-2011, 02:02 AM
Sounds like J and D may be playing a dangerous of "IM calling you out"....

imo

I thought he said women cheating on their husbands, which makes more sense in this case as well. <Runs off to find video and listen>

MyBelle
10-11-2011, 02:02 AM
Oh if only you could tell, lol. Anyhow a thought just hit me. Let's say it was her brother and let's also say that the text at 2:30 am was also her brother. Since it was supposedly said "I'm ready when you are" it COULD have been a delayed delivery on the text. I can't tell you how many times someone texts me and I either a)never get it or b) get it hours or even days after they sent it. Just a thought, if either above are true.

Doesn't LE know what her brother looks like? I believe they do.

jjenny
10-11-2011, 02:02 AM
Her lifestyle is supported from military benefits from her husband and her boyfriend's employment. I haven't heard/read about another source. Just speculating, looking for motive.

I am not sure where is this going? Her legal husband obviously knows he is not the bio dad of little Lisa, so why would she worry about his military benefits?

cluciano63
10-11-2011, 02:04 AM
The biggest problem (not to repeat myself) about the wine-buying at this stage is not telling LE. I am sure they were asked to go over their day, piece by piece, minute by minute. If LE had to find a receipt and then a video, I am guessing she left that out. Or maybe not, maybe they are just verifying her story?

thepinkdragon
10-11-2011, 02:04 AM
Doesn't LE know what her brother looks like? I beleive they do.

I'm sure they do but a lot of grocery store survelieance tapes aren't the highest of quality because they reuse them, so it could have had a grainy picture. It is possible they were able to make DB out because of her height, weight and hair but possibly the man pictured was hard to identify. JMO I did work in a grocery once and monitored the surveillance.

HatesSociopaths
10-11-2011, 02:04 AM
Oh if only you could tell, lol. Anyhow a thought just hit me. Let's say it was her brother and let's also say that the text at 2:30 am was also her brother. Since it was supposedly said "I'm ready when you are" it COULD have been a delayed delivery on the text. I can't tell you how many times someone texts me and I either a)never get it or b) get it hours or even days after they sent it. Just a thought, if either above are true.

Hopefully I can at least post this map without it violating TOS. The two locations are her brother's house and her house. Notice where the store is:

http://img692.imageshack.us/img692/802/mapsteveroute.jpg

jjenny
10-11-2011, 02:05 AM
First of all, I drink wine from a box. If you check it out, most brands in boxes are actually less alcohol then bottles. Just because she bought a box, does not mean she drank the whole thing. I think we are too quick to accuse sometimes. It was posted earlier too by a local that it could of been her brother, Steve, with her at the store.

I'm not saying she is innocent, but just because she went to the store and bought a box of wine, does not make her a murdererer. Also, if her husband worked until 4am, I would assume he left for work around 7 or 8pm. That means he was home when she went to the store.

I personally like the boxes as you can have a glass and it doesn't go stale like an open bottle does. A box can last a couple of weeks!

Your assumption of when the live in boyfriend went to work could be off. An electrician might work a 12 hour shift instead of an 8 hour shift, and as far as I know it has not been reported when he went for work.

RT51
10-11-2011, 02:05 AM
Sounds like J and D may be playing a dangerous of "IM calling you out"....

imo

I hope not. Why put an innocent child in the middle? Of course from what I have read on other cases, I'm not surprised. I am really in the middle right now. I hope it isn't the parent(s) but....

MyBelle
10-11-2011, 02:07 AM
I'm sure they do but a lot of grocery store survelieance tapes aren't the highest of quality because they reuse them, so it could have had a grainy picture. It is possible they were able to make DB out because of her height, weight and hair but possibly the man pictured was hard to identify. JMO I did work in a grocery once and monitored the surveillance.

I think it would be very easy for LE to ask the brother if he went to the store with her that day.

thepinkdragon
10-11-2011, 02:09 AM
I think it would be very easy for LE to ask the brother if he went to the store with her that day.

Perhaps they did. Maybe it was him, maybe they just aren't releasing it.

captivagrl
10-11-2011, 02:11 AM
I am not sure where is this going? Her legal husband obviously knows he is not the bio dad of little Lisa, so why would she worry about his military benefits?

She receives benefits for herself and the two children. They are legally married. Legally he is the presumed parent of Lisa. I don't know their arrangement, but they are not divorced and she benefits financially...insurance, PX shopping, etc. It was discussed by another poster a few treads back that was an expert in these matters, I am not.

RT51
10-11-2011, 02:11 AM
jjenny,

True, he might work a 12 hr shift because he is working at night and they want the job done. Just at a loss. These things should be known, but maybe they are, and we just don't know. LE did say his alibi is good. I think DB needs to come forward and be honest with a timeline instead of only giving an answer when something is discovered. Then again, we don't know what was said to LE during all those hours of questioning.

MyBelle
10-11-2011, 02:11 AM
Perhaps they did. Maybe it was him, maybe they just aren't releasing it.

Sorry, but I doubt LE would consider someone of whom they already confirmed an identity to be a "mystery man." I expect LE to release the actual video shortly and calls will start pouring in with an I.D.

JMO

krimekat
10-11-2011, 02:11 AM
Oh---I thought I read that it was the man with the box-o-wine that was a mystery. My bad.

LOL katy, that man is a mystery, too. I just don't think LE is taking his pic around (yet). They were showing a pic of the handyman seen prior to Lisa's disappearance but not seen since . . . confusing.

jjenny
10-11-2011, 02:12 AM
She receives benefits for herself and the two children. They are legally married. Legally he is the presumed parent of Lisa. I don't know their arrangement, but they are not divorced and she benefits financially...insurance, PX shopping, etc. It was discussed by another poster a few treads back that was an expert in these matters, I am not.

I know that the husband might be presumed the legal father, but he would know that he was not. The child doesn't have the same last name as the legal husband and they separated 4 years ago so clearly the fact that Lisa is not his daughter shouldn't be a surprise.

katydid23
10-11-2011, 02:13 AM
The biggest problem (not to repeat myself) about the wine-buying at this stage is not telling LE. I am sure they were asked to go over their day, piece by piece, minute by minute. If LE had to find a receipt and then a video, I am guessing she left that out. Or maybe not, maybe they are just verifying her story?

But IF they are referring to the guy with her as a 'mystery man'--then she must not have been entirely truthful with them.

marge_rita
10-11-2011, 02:13 AM
I thought he said women cheating on their husbands, which makes more sense in this case as well. <Runs off to find video and listen>

You're right thepinkdragon.

imo

katydid23
10-11-2011, 02:13 AM
I know that the husband might be presumed the legal father, but he would know that he was not. The child doesn't have the same last name as the legal husband and they separated 4 years ago so clearly the fact that Lisa is not his daughter shouldn't be a surprise.

Unless there was some reason to have doubts....?

iamnotagolem
10-11-2011, 02:14 AM
Her lifestyle is supported from military benefits from her husband and her boyfriend's employment. I haven't heard/read about another source. Just speculating, looking for motive.

Can you explain what you mean by the bold? I'm not being snarky, I'm just not understanding.

JeannieC
10-11-2011, 02:15 AM
I think whatever happened to Lisa was either an accident or an abduction and involved the homeless/handyman.

Maybe DB took him with her to the store and bought him some wine. Later he was drunk and came in the house. Took Lisa and now he's gone. Just because the neighbor had not seen him in a few days doesn't mean he wasn't still around.

katydid23
10-11-2011, 02:15 AM
LOL katy, that man is a mystery, too. I just don't think LE is taking his pic around (yet). They were showing a pic of the handyman seen prior to Lisa's disappearance but not seen since . . . confusing.

Oh Ok, thanks. I had a little wine, [ from a bottle, not a box] and am entirely confused after coming back to this thread after dinner tonight.

RT51
10-11-2011, 02:16 AM
So if the brother went with her to the store, the teen came over at some point, and then the neighbor and her child, DB had a very busy day.

I didn't mean to sound so snarky. I can remember times like these when my now ex worked nights, and I would get lonely with just the kids, and would invite a friend over for a couple of glasses of wine. Her child and mine would do what hers did and watch a movie. Didn't mean we got blotto, just relaxed while the kids were busy.

katydid23
10-11-2011, 02:17 AM
I think whatever happened to Lisa was either an accident or an abduction and involved the homeless/handyman.

Maybe DB took him with her to the store and bought him some wine. Later he was drunk and came in the house. Took Lisa and now he's gone. Just because the neighbor had not seen him in a few days doesn't mean he wasn't still around.

But wouldn't the mom have told LE if that were the case? Why would she cover and lie for a homeless handyman who took her baby?

marge_rita
10-11-2011, 02:17 AM
I hope not. Why put an innocent child in the middle? Of course from what I have read on other cases, I'm not surprised. I am really in the middle right now. I hope it isn't the parent(s) but....

hi and welcome. :seeya:

I hope with every fiber of my being that I am wrong. Remember when the list was commented on tho the bf said he had a list of women who had affairs...something close to that. It's an odd comment.


imo

MyBelle
10-11-2011, 02:17 AM
I think whatever happened to Lisa was either an accident or an abduction and involved the homeless/handyman.

Maybe DB took him with her to the store and bought him some wine. Later he was drunk and came in the house. Took Lisa and now he's gone. Just because the neighbor had not seen him in a few days doesn't mean he wasn't still around.

I don't know anybody who would load a homeless person into the car, drive him to a market, buy him wine and then just send him and the wine on his way. That makes no sense to me at all.

JMO

jjenny
10-11-2011, 02:18 AM
I don't know anybody who would load a homeless person into the car, drive him to a market, buy him wine and then just send him and the wine on his way. That makes no sense to me at all.

JMO

I don't know anyone like that either.

captivagrl
10-11-2011, 02:19 AM
I know that the husband might be presumed the legal father, but he would know that he was not. The child doesn't have the same last name as the legal husband and they separated 4 years ago so clearly the fact that Lisa is not his daughter shouldn't be a surprise.

Yes indeed he knows he is not Lisa's bio Dad. Sorry if I wasn't clear. My theory is he and the boyfriend are not bio Dads. When they have to change that legally there would be a DNA test. What is she going to do when EVERYONE finds out? Forget the humiliation......how will she support herself? Would everyone turn on her? Would she lose custody of her 6 yr old?

HatesSociopaths
10-11-2011, 02:20 AM
I think one of the bigger lies told by the couple is when Lisa was last seen (alive) by them. MOO.

A key way to possibly find out (according to my theory anyway) is when did Jeremy tell his boss he was going to work the night hours??? (Assuming it was JI idea, not the boss. Is there a boss?)

MOO.

captivagrl
10-11-2011, 02:24 AM
Can you explain what you mean by the bold? I'm not being snarky, I'm just not understanding.

No snark taken, but I didn't bold it. And btw, an expert on how military benefits are received was a few threads back. It was sooo informative. I didn't realize how it worked.

RT51
10-11-2011, 02:25 AM
I wish I didn't have such a bad feeling about this, but I fear Lisa is no longer with us. I always hope for the best but I am losing hope now.

JeannieC
10-11-2011, 02:25 AM
I don't know anybody who would load a homeless person into the car, drive him to a market, buy him wine and then just send him and the wine on his way. That makes no sense to me at all.

JMO

The neighbor said he was clean and did handyman work. If he has been in the neighborhood for a while they might have had him do work for them.

MyBelle
10-11-2011, 02:25 AM
I think one of the bigger lies told by the couple is when Lisa was last seen (alive) by them. MOO.

A key way to possibly find out (according to my theory anyway) is when did Jeremy tell his boss he was going to work the night hours??? (Assuming it was JI idea, not the boss. Is there a boss?)

MOO.

JI is an electrician. I doubt he decided what hours to work.

JMO

MyBelle
10-11-2011, 02:27 AM
The neighbor said he was clean and did handyman work.

And....why would DB or any woman decide to take a "clean" handyman to the store to buy wine? That makes no sense to me.

JMO

askfornina
10-11-2011, 02:28 AM
this grocery store news frustrates me, because i feel like it is becoming hard to separate what we actually KNOW with what can be assumed. i would like to know how the media got this information.

eta: i suppose this is the wrong thread. whoops! getting used to this forum thing. :)

krimekat
10-11-2011, 02:30 AM
JI is an electrician. I doubt he decided what hours to work.

JMO

read in prior posts that he was working on a new Starbucks that required them/contracting company to work at night to accommodate the commercial facility.

SmoothOperator
10-11-2011, 02:31 AM
Police found a receipt from the Festival Foods Store at I-35 & Chouteau during one of their searches. It gives investigators an idea of Lisa's mother, Deborah Bradley was doing hours before the child disappeared.

http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-poli...+Local+News%29


Still catching up and 2 pages back.. But after hearing mom and "another" man(not her hubby, not baby daddy) were seen on video purchasing wine earlier in the evening that Lisa "disappeared.. I had to remark that I guess we found out what it was that had momma so dead to the world, comatose sleeping the night her baby "disappeared"..

But now question is what happened in those hours prior with "another" man, enjoying some wine??? WoW oh WoW!! Wonder what daddy, Jeremy's got to say about this new revelation??(if infact it's new info to him??) who knows??

Back to reading 2 pages back to catch up!!

JeannieC
10-11-2011, 02:31 AM
this grocery store news frustrates me, because i feel like it is becoming hard to separate what we actually KNOW with what can be assumed. i would like to know how the media got this information.

eta: i suppose this is the wrong thread. whoops! getting used to this forum thing. :)

You're ok. This is the right forum. Keep talking!:woohoo:

MyBelle
10-11-2011, 02:32 AM
read in prior posts that he was working on a new Starbucks that required them/contracting company to work at night to accommodate the commercial facility.

Yes but I have yet to read anything that even suggests JI decided what hours he would work. I do not believe JI set his own hours and will continue to hold that opinion until there is a link to support he did.

JMO

RT51
10-11-2011, 02:33 AM
They really, really need to come clean with their timeline!

thepinkdragon
10-11-2011, 02:33 AM
Sorry, but I doubt LE would consider someone of whom they already confirmed an identity to be a "mystery man." I expect LE to release the actual video shortly and calls will start pouring in with an I.D.

JMO

I just re-watched the news story on this and it was said that a source from inside the grocery store said DB was seen with an unidentified man. It didn't say LE said that, which means that even if LE knew who it was the store employees are not at liberty to say IMO

JeannieC
10-11-2011, 02:34 AM
JI might already know this and that could explain why he seems somewhat distant with DB. moo

MyBelle
10-11-2011, 02:37 AM
I just re-watched the news story on this and it was said that a source from inside the grocery store said DB was seen with an unidentified man. It didn't LE said that, which means that even if LE knew who it was the store employees are not at liberty to say IMO

"Not at liberty to say." You can't be serious. It's a SECURITY video.

The news article I saw was clear that there was a video watched by LE.

JMO

Ruby Slippers
10-11-2011, 02:38 AM
It would make it easier to follow if we stick to names/initials. JI is the babys father, her dad. Calling him "the boyfriend" seems like some moral disapproval label. DB is a mother, carried that baby in her womb for 9 months. If there is a substance abuse issue, an affair, she's only 25 years old. I'm more than twice her age and when I think back to being a mom of 2 boys (ages 8 and 2) at the age of 25, I sure didn't have maturity, knowledge, self confidence, esteem.

Who can throw the first stone? Compassion for Lisa is strengthened by practicing compassion for these young parents whose lives will never ever be the same--whatever the outcome. So come on, folks. Ferret out facts, speculate scenarios, and ah he**, go back to talking about your pets. But let's give up the crucifixion. It's bloody and violent enough out there.

HatesSociopaths
10-11-2011, 02:38 AM
Whatever the situation is with JI's work, and if he asked to work that shift, I wouldn't take his word for it. LE has probably looked into this angle already.

captivagrl
10-11-2011, 02:40 AM
OK, been busy and have not read through all theories yet, the more I thought about everything, mulled it over, off and on, I think there's a possibility that Mom knows baby Lisa's Dad is a third party. She's known it all along. Because there is a legal assumption that Mom's husband is the father it has to be rectified before she can marry her fiance. This requires a DNA test or for her boyfriend to testify in open court in front of a judge that he claims to be the father of Lisa. I'm not sure of the legality in their state, it may still require an official DNA test. If she knew that test was coming up, very soon, there's a motive to....stop that test from happening. Her whole world would fall apart IF her husband and fiance were not the biological parent of Lisa. Just a theory, as I said I haven't read through the thread so if someone else thought of this first, I agree.

Pardon me :) for reposting my theory :) but, at least in this circumstance there's some hope that Mom passed this baby to a third party until she could sort out her life, figure out what to do next. I hope so.

RT51
10-11-2011, 02:40 AM
I'm sorry, but if I thought my spouse did anything to one of my children, I would be upfront about it. Loyalty can only go so far.

Sorry, after reading through 14 threads, I am starting to get a little annoyed with this family.

If it were my child missing, I would be turning over every "stone" so to speak to locate this child. And I feel the same way about the threads for that poor little girl in WV.

gwenabob
10-11-2011, 02:43 AM
There is no way Baby Lisa could have been rolled over in bed and died by accident. She was 30 lbs. Too big for this to happen by anyone named in that bed. Baby Lisa was not an infant, even at infant stages, this would be very rare.

Rare, yes. And yet it does happen. Granted the baby in this article was much younger, but it could happen.

http://www.wsaz.com/news/headlines/116353134.html

thepinkdragon
10-11-2011, 02:45 AM
"Not at liberty to say." You can't be serious. It's a SECURITY video.

The news article I saw was clear that there was a video watched by LE.

JMO

You are misunderstanding what I said. Yes I know LE watched the video but the reporter said a source from within the store told the news station DB was seen with an unidentified man. He did not quote LE as having said anything. If LE knows who it was they may have told the store employees NOT to reveal that.

Just K
10-11-2011, 02:46 AM
here it is:
http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-police-review-grocery-surveillance-deborah-bradley-20111010,0,3702048.story

marge_rita
10-11-2011, 02:46 AM
JI might already know this and that could explain why he seems somewhat distant with DB. moo

That's an excellent guess. Can you imagine if during questioning by LE, if J 1st heard about his gf and a mystery man buying wine? No wonder J looks like he's in shock.


imo

RT51
10-11-2011, 02:48 AM
gwenabob,

Yes, I know what you mean. I am a dispatcher at an airport who contracts out LEO from a nearby town. This happened not to long ago, when a father rolled over on his couch with a fairly newborn but I do think that a larger child would be different. JMO

marge_rita
10-11-2011, 02:48 AM
Pardon me :) for reposting my theory :) but, at least in this circumstance there's some hope that Mom passed this baby to a third party until she could sort out her life, figure out what to do next. I hope so.

That is one way that baby Lisa could still be alive and well. I pray that baby Lisa is with someone who is taking good care of her. Sadly my instincts are telling me that's not the case. \


imo

RT51
10-11-2011, 02:52 AM
:seeya:Good night all. Hopefully some good news is coming soon. Work tomorrow at the airport and due to the fact a full moon is coming Wednesday, the creatures will come out of the woodwork.

marlame
10-11-2011, 02:52 AM
You are misunderstanding what I said. Yes I know LE watched the video but the reporter said a source from within the store told the news station DB was seen with an unidentified man. He did not quote LE as having said anything. If LE knows who it was they may have told the store employees NOT to reveal that.

Or...Possibly, the store employee was unable to identify the man because they have no knowledge of who it was??? But, you can bet LE asked DB who the man is and LE nor DB has shared his identity with the media.

Inspector Gidget
10-11-2011, 02:55 AM
Or if she had not told LE this little detail ...

Oh my I hope it wasn't the teenager with her.That would just be grand.

cluciano63
10-11-2011, 02:57 AM
That is one way that baby Lisa could still be alive and well. I pray that baby Lisa is with someone who is taking good care of her. Sadly my instincts are telling me that's not the case. \


imo

Yeah, I think any arrangement to hide the baby to help mom out would have gone out the window when this became such a huge story and it looked like LE was looking at mom...the person on the other end wouldn't want criminal charges, IMO. I don't think they have somenoe holding Lisa at this point.

SmoothOperator
10-11-2011, 03:04 AM
Almost caught up.. Finally.. But have a question I'm desperate to know? Where and when did we find out that the alleged phone msg at 2:30am stated, "I'm ready when you are"?? This is first I've heard of this, anyone know where this detail was learned?? TIA

JeannieC
10-11-2011, 03:07 AM
Almost caught up.. Finally.. But have a question I'm desperate to know? Where and when did we find out that the alleged phone msg at 2:30am stated, "I'm ready when you are"?? This is first I've heard of this, anyone know where this detail was learned?? TIA

I haven't found that either. I'm not sure it has been validated. moo

thepinkdragon
10-11-2011, 03:07 AM
Almost caught up.. Finally.. But have a question I'm desperate to know? Where and when did we find out that the alleged phone msg at 2:30am stated, "I'm ready when you are"?? This is first I've heard of this, anyone know where this detail was learned?? TIA

It is alleged, not yet confirmed as far as I know. There is a local activist that leaked that information but again I don't think it was ever confirmed. When I used it in my post earlier it was a hypothetical.

thepinkdragon
10-11-2011, 03:14 AM
Ok, I'm out for the night. Like many of you I have been following this day in and day out since the beginning. I'm tired and getting frustrated by my posts getting misconstrued and I have a life I need to attend to as well. I pray that tomorrow (well today now) Baby Lisa is found safe. Nite all.