Jonbenet Books...have You Read "all?"

[Blazeboy3]

http://www.comm.ucsb.edu/faculty/kellerma/trialkollectionns/ramsey.htm
Kellermann's Kollectionn of:
JONBENET RAMSEY TRIAL BOOKS
Last Updated 02/04/00


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hodges, Andrew G. (1998). A Mother Gone Bad: The Hidden Confession of JonBenet's Killer. Birmingham, AL: Village House Publishers.


Keene-Osborn, Sherry. (1997). Pretty Baby: The Life and Death of JonBenet Ramsey. ----: Ballantine Books.


McLean, Linda Edison. (1998). JonBenet's Mother: The Tragedy and the Truth. Parsons, WV : McClain Print. Co.


Schiller, Lawrence. (1999). Perfect Murder, Perfect Town: JonBenet and the City of Bouldert. New York: HarperCollins.


Singular, Stephen. (1999). Presumed Guilty: An Investigation into the JonBenet Ramsey Case, the Media, and the Culture of Pornography. Beverly Hills, CA: New Millennium Press.


Smith, Carlton. (1997). Death of a Little Princess: The Tragic Story of the Murder of JonBenet Ramsey. New York: St. Martin's Press.


Stobie, Jane Gray. (1999). JonBenet's Gift: A Miracle for the Millennium. Denver, CO: Blue Balloon Press.


Von Duyke, Eleanor (with Dwight Wallington). (1998). A Little Girl's Dream? A JonBenet Ramsey Story. Austin, TX: Windsor House Publishing.


Wecht, Cyril & Bosworth, Charles. (1998). Who Killed JonBenet Ramsey? New York: Onyx.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


See other kollectionns
FAMOUS TRIALS KOLLECTIONNS
TRIAL BACKGROUND KOLLECTIONNS



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



c1997, 1998, 1999, 2000 Kathy Kellermann

read them? YES OR NO?

[Blazeboy3]

Keene-Osborn, Sherry. (1997). Pretty Baby: The Life and Death of JonBenet Ramsey. ----: Ballantine Books.


AND THEN SHE DIES...GO FIGURE???

So what's in these "kollectionns" anyway?

The "(In-)Famous and Celebrity Trial" kollectionns provide scholarly, trade, mass, and sometimes even lurid reference entrees into the travails, tribulations, and trials of Rodney King, O.J. Simpson, Randy Weaver, David Koresh, Timothy McVeigh, the Unabomber, Patricia Hearst, Jean Harris, Susan Smith, JonBenet Ramsey, Joe Hunt, Eric & Lyle Menendez, the McMartin preschool, Jim Bakker (PTL Club), Allan Bakke, Sam Sheppard, Claus von Bulow, Bernhard Goetz, Mike Tyson, Jeffrey MacDonald, and Jeffrey Dahmer, among others.

The "Helpful Trial Background" kollectionns name, explain, scrutinize, analyze, deduce, and conclude scholarly, trade, mass, armchair and sometimes even factual information about trial advocacy, juries, communication, language, and media; openings, closings, questioning, witnesses, and testifying; attorneys, defendants, judges, police, and forensics; race, gender, domestic violence, and extremism; and legal reform, victim's rights, and the practice of law.



Why do you call these bibliographies "Kellermann's Kollectionns"?

John Farley, a professor of physics at the University of Nevada, Las Vegas, gave my first O.J. Simpson bibliography the name "Kellermann's Kollection". As you've probably figured out by now, my last name is Kellermann. My first name is Kathy. My symmetrical self, psychologically distressed and having a breakdown, decided it just had to spell kollectionn with two nn's. After an incredible amount of time and effort, a minor keystroke provided initial kollectionn the company it so badly had been wanting. Hence, Kellermann's Kollectionns. Not a gripping story, but at least a true one.



Why are you doing this?

I am a university professor. I was sick and mostly bedridden when O.J. flew the coop, going faster up the 405 at 40 m.p.h. than is normal during rush hour. (Of course, it helps to have a police escort.) Having nothing better to do, not being able easily to read, and not at all loath to admitting actually being intrigued, I gave myself "permission" (as if I had a choice!) to get addicted to O.J. TV.

Admittedly, I've always been addicted to matters legal. I study communication, specifically, persuasion, argumentation, and interpersonal interaction. I've looked at how people interrogate, evade, equivocate, retreat, attack, and avoid. Is it any wonder I became addicted to the O.J. case? What better way to pass the time than to watch people doing live what I normally have to cajole and coax participants to do in my research?

Seriously, the O.J. case was a perfect beginning -- no lack of books on the topic, no lack of just about anything on it. My addiction propelled me forward. When I could no longer remember which O.J. trial books I owned, had ordered, or had heard of, I started a list to stop me from buying books for the third time.

And from there it just grew. Pretty soon I felt compelled to have a complete list of O.J. trial books. And then the books with chapters or sections related to the O.J. trial were published. And then those darn masters' theses and doctoral dissertations, scholarly symposia, convention paper presentations, and journal articles appeared. And that didn't even begin to cover what had been in trade and other mass market publications, tabloids, and chain letters and cascading over the internet.

Always needing closure (hah! not yet even do I have that on the O.J. trial!), I forged ahead and expanded and expanded and expanded my O.J. list. And when the O.J. trial ended, my new project had already begun, for I had already "acquired" an interest in the next rich, famous, and heinous case.

Not being a strictly linear person, I "managed" to acquire interests in golden oldies as well as newsy newbies. And my friends didn't help matters any either: they kept asking questions of me as if I were the resident "expert" on (in-)famous and celebrity trials, whether I knew anything about them or not. So as not to disappoint them (!!), I sought knowledge from the tree of life: books, books, and more books; newspapers, newspapers, and more newspapers; and, TV, TV, and more TV.

Thank God for CourtTV. Thank God for the Internet news feed. Thank God for making me a trial junkie.



What do you get out of doing this?

Now that one I haven't figured out. No fame, no glory yet. CourtTV did once ask for the most recent update of the O.J. list. The outlook for bookstores locally, regionally, and nationally improved dramatically as I began buying and reading the books on the list. I have "met" a person I've never seen, conversed with a person I've never heard, and found another addicted soul in the person of John Farley, professor of physics at the University of Nevada, Las Vegas who so kindly initially named and now still mounts and provides these kollectionns. I've moved from not knowing how to spell HTML to being able to program in it directly. I've managed to amuse myself. That's good enough, after all, isn't it?



Can I use this material?

Absolutely. My intent was to addict others, but I also want to locate other addicts. Plus, the "outreach" potential of educating people about the law appeals to me. I developed the kollectionns on the nature, issues, people, events, and aspects of trials as part and parcel of my own interests in studying persuasion, argumentation, and interpersonal interaction in a "real-world" setting (well, at least it is its own real world!). I only ask that you credit John Farley for providing the web site and taking the time to mount all the files and myself (Kathy Kellermann) for compiling and maintaining the kollectionns, and provide the kollectionns' web site address, http://www.physics.unlv.edu/~farley/humor/K/index.htm, OR at http://alishaw.ucsb.edu/~kellerma/k/index.htm so that if others want to visit they might.




Thank you for your time. Cheers. Play around in the kollectionns. Enjoy. Send me citations, corrections, suggestions, comments and questions as you wish and have the time; my "signature" is affixed at the bottom of the page. I will add, fix, undertake, consider, and answer as fitting and I have anything to say.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


See other kollectionns
FAMOUS TRIALS KOLLECTIONNS
TRIAL BACKGROUND KOLLECTIONNS



http://63.147.65.175/news/jon021000.htm

[sissi]

Thanks ,I hadn't realized Keene/Osborne had written a book,and am going to "track it " down today. She was a pretty reliable source in those early days. :)

[Blazeboy3]

Originally posted by sissi
Thanks ,I hadn't realized Keene/Osborne had written a book,and am going to "track it " down today. She was a pretty reliable source in those early days. :)

Assuming she (being dead) is w/JonBenet, what are you're thoughts regarding future info...???

February 9, 2000
Sherry Keene-Osborn, Newsweek reporter who provided Ramsey coverage for the magazine, died this date at Lutheran Medical Center in Wheat Ridge as a result of lung problems. She was 54 at the time of her death.

http://207.36.4.219/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=41829#post41829

Journalist Keene-Osborn dies at 54
By Andy Vuong
Special to The Denver Post

Feb. 10 - Sherry Keene-Osborn, a journalist for Newsweek, died Wednesday at Lutheran Medical Center in Wheat Ridge as a result of severe lung disorders. She was 54.

[Blazeboy3]

http://voices.cla.umn.edu/authors/MCMILLANterry.html

[Blazeboy3]

What I do know deep down, although I keep it secretly secret, is that I am terrified at the thought of losing myself again wholeheartedly to any man, because it is so scary peeling off that protective sealant that's been guarding my heart, and letting somebody go inside and walk around, lie down, look around, and see all those red flags, especially when right next to your heart is your soul, and then inside that is the rest of your personality puzzle pieces and they're full of flaws and in your grown-up years you have just finally started to recognize them for what they are one by one...--How Stella Got Her Groove Back


IMHO...It's a good/read-watch-learning experience FWIW(for what it's worth these days (FWIWTD)!

[Sabrina]

I just heard that Cyril Wecht has a new book out called "Mortal Evidence" and that there is a chapter on Jon Benet. I just checked my local Branes and Noble and they said it will be in Nov1.
It is available thr Amazon though:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1591021340/qid=1066610808/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/002-8517648-2512010?v=glance&s=books

[ajt400]

Does it really matter how many and what books you have and don't have or have read or haven't? Most of all these books just contradict each other, because no one will really just look at the facts/evidence of the case unbiasly. Everyone has too many emotions and already have their minds set so they don't pay any attention to any possible evidence that may arise that doesn't agree with their theory-and tend to stick their fingers in their ears, much like a room of toddlers!

Until someone can come into this case with a fresh perspective that is going to look at all angles- I fear this case will not be solved!

[Blazeboy3]

Originally posted by ajt400
Does it really matter how many and what books you have and don't have or have read or haven't? Most of all these books just contradict each other, because no one will really just look at the facts/evidence of the case unbiasly. Everyone has too many emotions and already have their minds set so they don't pay any attention to any possible evidence that may arise that doesn't agree with their theory-and tend to stick their fingers in their ears, much like a room of toddlers!

Until someone can come into this case with a fresh perspective that is going to look at all angles- I fear this case will not be solved!

YEAH IT DOES MATTER (even though KIPPER on Nickolodeon says "NOTHING REALL MATTERS!"; IMHO...READ ALL BOOKS/Knowledge is Power (for JonBenet!)...
http://denver.rockymountainnews.com/extra/ramsey/0801rams1.shtml
And Ballard's daughter has questions: "She says, 'Her mommy didn't protect her; is my mommy going to protect me?"'

[Blazeboy3]

Originally posted by ajt400
Does it really matter how many and what books you have and don't have or have read or haven't? Most of all these books just contradict each other, because no one will really just look at the facts/evidence of the case unbiasly. Everyone has too many emotions and already have their minds set so they don't pay any attention to any possible evidence that may arise that doesn't agree with their theory-and tend to stick their fingers in their ears, much like a room of toddlers!

Until someone can come into this case with a fresh perspective that is going to look at all angles- I fear this case will not be solved!


Q:MATTER:;everything is "ENERGY?!right"; ENERGY FOLLOWS THOUGHT-Right(fact?)...read ... FYI what follows:
... THE LATEST BOOK: An Evening with JonBenet...A MUST READ!:Read & reread ...it's you you +yours advantage in future life!!!...!!!...

IMHO it's well worth the bucks (about $22):
http://www.booksamillion.com/ncom/books?id=2673330297677&pid=1413411088


One of the threads asked about a new book on JonBenet Ramsey. I am the author of that book. It's an attempt to do some radically new things in order to shift attention back to what should have remained the focus of this case: the sexual abuse of children and the permanent psychological damage done when one sexualize a child in the way children are sexualized by Child Beauty Pageants. I also want, from the start, to indicate another thing that makes my book distinctive. I will not make a penny from it. I have established a Trust so that all money due me from the book and from productions of the play it contains will be devoted to Organizations who work on behalf of sexually abused children. That said, let me briefly describe the book.. An Evening With JonBenet Ramsey begins with a full-length play, Cowboy's Sweetheart, which imagines the life of a sexually abused and murdered child as it might have evolved had she lived. The play explores her psyche, her experience, and her struggle to deal with the traumatic memories that haunt her. (It tries, in effect, to give JonBenet the life that was taken from here.) The play is followed by two essays. They involve extensive research and consider the JonBenet Ramsey case from a number of perspectives. The discussion includes a critique of the media and of the two theories that have been developed to solve the crime. Again, my effort is to move the discussion to a new level. My name, by the way, is Walter A. Davis and I am a Professor Emeritus in the English Department at The Ohio State University. Like so many of you I first become involved in this story when I first saw a video of JonBenet "performing" and found myself in tears: "How could anyone do that to a child?" I asked. The book is a response to the pain of that question. Those who want the book can get it at a 15% discount on paperback and a 10% discount on hardcover from Xlibris: Call 888-795-4274, ext.276 or order online at www.xlibris.com. Or, of course, from Amazon.com.
I look forward to your responses and as a new member, to making a contribution to your discussions. Warm regards, Walter A. Davis





Originally posted by walter davis
One of the threads asked about a new book on JonBenet Ramsey. I am the author of that book. It's an attempt to do some radically new things in order to shift attention back to what should have remained the focus of this case: the sexual abuse of children and the permanent psychological damage done when one sexualize a child in the way children are sexualized by Child Beauty Pageants. I also want, from the start, to indicate another thing that makes my book distinctive. I will not make a penny from it. I have established a Trust so that all money due me from the book and from productions of the play it contains will be devoted to Organizations who work on behalf of sexually abused children. That said, let me briefly describe the book.. An Evening With JonBenet Ramsey begins with a full-length play, Cowboy's Sweetheart, which imagines the life of a sexually abused and murdered child as it might have evolved had she lived. The play explores her psyche, her experience, and her struggle to deal with the traumatic memories that haunt her. (It tries, in effect, to give JonBenet the life that was taken from here.) The play is followed by two essays. They involve extensive research and consider the JonBenet Ramsey case from a number of perspectives. The discussion includes a critique of the media and of the two theories that have been developed to solve the crime. Again, my effort is to move the discussion to a new level. My name, by the way, is Walter A. Davis and I am a Professor Emeritus in the English Department at The Ohio State University. Like so many of you I first become involved in this story when I first saw a video of JonBenet "performing" and found myself in tears: "How could anyone do that to a child?" I asked. The book is a response to the pain of that question. Those who want the book can get it at a 15% discount on paperback and a 10% discount on hardcover from Xlibris: Call 888-795-4274, ext.276 or order online at www.xlibris.com. Or, of course, from Amazon.com.
I look forward to your responses and as a new member, to making a contribution to your discussions. Warm regards, Walter A. Davis

QuickQuote

[ajt400]

Knowledge equals power, but books are written by people and people have different opinions. Even text books in school lean one way or another. Reading the books doesn't matter--reading them and being able to step back and logically look at evidence does.

I am not very sure you are able to that blazeboy

[ajt400]

Also:

So in essence I should be able to read every Nancy Drew book available, and I will know more than investigators, right? Not so....

[Ivy]

Aren't child pageants part of Southern subculture? Patsy's family, who was from the South, seems to have been very "into" beauty pageants and didn't consider child beauty pageants any less delightful than any other kind of beauty pageant.

We will never know if JonBenet's psyche was, or would be, damaged by her participation in the pageants, but I don't believe John and Patsy considered that possibility for a minute. Nor do I believe they thought her stage makeup and elaborate costumes "sexualized" her or made her look like a pedophile's dream come true. I believe they loved JonBenet with all their hearts and would never have intentionally done anything to harm her.

I despise beauty pageants of any kind, especially child beauty pageants, but I don't think JonBenet's pageant participation had anything to do with her death. I think her death was unintentional, the result of a sexual exploration game she and Burke were playing that went horribly wrong. Siblings playing "doctor" doesn't require one of them to be a pageant star, and anyway, how often did Burke see JonBenet "tarted up"? I think her pageant participation is a red herring.

[ajt400]

I think it is just another reason for people to hate her parents

[Blazeboy3]

Originally posted by ajt400
Does it really matter how many and what books you have and don't have or have read or haven't? Most of all these books just contradict each other, because no one will really just look at the facts/evidence of the case unbiasly. Everyone has too many emotions and already have their minds set so they don't pay any attention to any possible evidence that may arise that doesn't agree with their theory-and tend to stick their fingers in their ears, much like a room of toddlers!

Until someone can come into this case with a fresh perspective that is going to look at all angles- I fear this case will not be solved!

You're so right and that's why you should read the latest book by W.A.Davis who tells YOU:AJ(one) WHY YOU'RE SO RIGHT IN YOUR THOUGHTS/POST...!!!:dontknow: :evil: :( :)

[Blazeboy3]

Originally posted by ajt400
Knowledge equals power, but books are written by people and people have different opinions. Even text books in school lean one way or another. Reading the books doesn't matter--reading them and being able to step back and logically look at evidence does.

I am not very sure you are able to that blazeboy

Ok, yes or no...have you read ALL BOOKS AND STEPPED BACK AND LOGICALLY LOOKED AT EVIDENCE??? YES OR NO??? TRUTHFULLY NOW>>>>!!!???

IMHO...you have now or else you wouldn't be posting such... What's your beef/goal here? ... ???Ok, so you will solve this murder on your own/with yours?

[Blazeboy3]

Originally posted by ajt400
I think it is just another reason for people to hate her parents

LOOKING FOR A JUSTIFICATION(WAY OUT?!~)>?:dontknow:

[Blazeboy3]

http://63.147.65.175/news/jon021000.htm

Keene-Osborn dies at 54 (PARTIAL POST FROM URL ABOVE)fyi

Her work with Newsweek spanned three decades. She covered major stories such as the JonBenet Ramsey murder case, the Columbine High School shootings and the Oklahoma City bombings

Please educate yourselves(yourself>?):?

[Blazeboy3]

Originally posted by ajt400
I think it is just another reason for people to hate her parents

ANYONE "CAN JUSTIFY ANYTHING":FACT! IMHO:GOAL:RISE ABOVE IT...!YOUR BETTER THAN THAT RIGHT???!!

[Blazeboy3]

Originally posted by Ivy
Aren't child pageants part of Southern subculture? Patsy's family, who was from the South, seems to have been very "into" beauty pageants and didn't consider child beauty pageants any less delightful than any other kind of beauty pageant.

We will never know if JonBenet's psyche was, or would be, damaged by her participation in the pageants, but I don't believe John and Patsy considered that possibility for a minute. Nor do I believe they thought her stage makeup and elaborate costumes "sexualized" her or made her look like a pedophile's dream come true. I believe they loved JonBenet with all their hearts and would never have intentionally done anything to harm her.

I despise beauty pageants of any kind, especially child beauty pageants, but I don't think JonBenet's pageant participation had anything to do with her death. I think her death was unintentional, the result of a sexual exploration game she and Burke were playing that went horribly wrong. Siblings playing "doctor" doesn't require one of them to be a pageant star, and anyway, how often did Burke see JonBenet "tarted up"? I think her pageant participation is a red herring.

What a safe way to deal w/trama (bad actions by others)...IMHO you can and should read ALL books available regarding "JonBenet!" FWIW...IMHO you can probably do so with "A WILL TO DO SO IN THE SAKE/NAME OF JONBENET!"!? Maybe not?

[Blazeboy3]

Originally posted by ajt400
Also:

So in essence I should be able to read every Nancy Drew book available, and I will know more than investigators, right? Not so....

You're FISHING/FOCUSED? REGARDING THE MURDER OF JONBENET?...ok,Hello, what page are you on in this book of JUSTICE FOR JONBENET????...YOU (I assume-silly me) are focused on the solution to the problem (JonBenet's murder) right? wrong?
:dontknow: :evil: :confused:

[ACandyRose]

One of our very own Internet posters has written a book named, "Journey Beyond Reason." Author is Peggy Lakin.

=====================================
http://www.ebookstand.com/m/peggylakin/

Paperback Price: $18.95
Download Price: $7.95 (Available formats for download: .PDF format)

"Be sure to check the correct box for paperback order or download."

About Our Book:

Journey Beyond Reason The murder of JonBenet Ramsey, Valerie Percy, and Matthew Margolies, along with thousand of other innocents, have left a great void in the lives of those who loved and cared about them. This void could never be filled, however, there might be hope for some resolve if their killer/s were to be found and brought to justice. I, and many others, do what we do because on an inherent desire to help the victims of crime and their families. Only those with something to hide would have anything to fear from such endeavors. I make no claims to insider information or expertise in any field. It is only through searching the internet and the writings of others that I have any information with which to work. As you find yourself becoming involved in this cyber world there will be cases that will truly haunt you, stick with you. I received this in an email from someone I have come to greatly respect and admire: ?My all time favorite high school teacher once said to me: ?The next best thing to knowing the answer is knowing where to find it.?? It boils down to this; if we do not know the answers, we have a tremendous resource available to us in our search. There is not always an obvious reason, for this search you must often journey beyond what is safe and comfortable, and into what might lie behind the public façade.
Number of pages:269

About the Author:

There is nothing extraordinary about me what so ever. I am just an average person, of average intelligence who through the internet has found others who share the same concerns. We all have the desire to help victims of crime. The internet has opened up a whole new world of interesting people with whom I can converse, share information and work with to try to help in any way we can those who have been touched by the horror of violent crime.

=====================================

You can find a preview "Journey Beyond Reason Preview" at the link below:

http://pub165.ezboard.com/fcrimeandjustice13552frm78.showMessage?topicID=2 51.topic

=====================================

When I wrote to the author yesterday (Oct 30th) as to when I could post the link, the author responded, "You can post the link anytime you wish. It is just necessary to let them know the book won't be shipped (as of today's date) for 2-3 weeks"

ACR

[Nehemiah]

Ivy, maybe I can shed some light onto Southern "sub" culture and beauty pageants, etc.

I have lived in the South my whole life. Growing up, I was in a few pageants. They are very very common here. I have three boys, so I never got into the pageant world beyond my high school days, although ALL of my friends who have girls participated.

I will say that I have been a pageant judge more than a few times. I tended to lean more toward the girls who were not so made-up and who looked their ages and not like mini-adults; however, I always judged with a panel and everyone had different views. I haven't judged in a few years but I did enjoy it and would do it again if invited.

Pageantry is a very big thing here. Less than an hour from my home is our state's preliminary to the Miss America pageant. It gets lots of air time and is always packed. I think it is totally cultural, just as other things are more cultural to the North, or East, or out West. I'm not trying to make a case for pageantry, but just imforming that that is how it is here.

I went out West twice this fall. Both times, I felt as if I looked like a hooker! People actually stared at me and I think it was what I was wearing. Where I live, I definitely don't look like a hooker. If the women I saw in the West came to visit here, people here would think they were very underdressed and plain. Are they? Not necessarily, but they may possibly be viewed as such here in the southern culture. I was interviewed this week by a reporter who traveled here from NYC. She came wearing jeans, a white shirt, boots, a backpack, no make up and her hair pulled into a low ponytail. Hear me, I am not dogging her for this...but I am saying that here in the South she was very underdressed to go into some of the places in which I took her. I am sure some people looked at her as not appearing to be professional.

:waitasec:
So, all this to say... the beauty pageant thing, Patsy's way of decorating her home, the fact that ST wrote she didn't like Boulder because she couldn't find lipstick, etc... are all cultural things to me.

I am glad you brought this up, Ivy. It's something I've wanted to express for a long time now but didn't find the opportunity.

[tipper]

And you expressed it well.

There are those in this country who think it aappropriate to pierce little girls (even babies) ears. I don't chose to do that with my daughter but I don't read anything malevolent into their doing it

[Nehemiah]

Thank you, Tipper. Last night I thought more about what I had posted, and hoped that it would not be taken wrong. I agree about the piercing of babies' ears as I wouldn't do that either, but I don't think that it is suggestive of anything, and could possibly even be considered cultural, also.

[Ivy]

Nehemia, thanks very much for giving us an insider's perspective of the pageant world in the South and for pointing out that there are cultural differences in fashion and home decorating between the South and other parts of the US. Patsy's flamboyancy may have been out of place in Boulder, just as JonBenet's participation in the pageants was, but knowing that Patsy grew up in the South and had Southern sensibilities, I don't consider her fashion/decorating sense or her entering JonBenet in pageants as signs of a personality disorder, or even remarkable.

When you were out West, did you happen by any ranchers' lawns decorated with cattle skulls? To me, such "lawn art" suggests Georgia O'Keef on crack, and I find it revolting, but I'm not a native Westerner and my sensibilities are different from many of theirs. Another thing...the children of a good friend of mine have participated in rodeos from the time they were five years old. Although I despise rodeos because I consider them a form of animal cruelty, rodeos are a part of Western culture, and most people I know find nothing wrong with them, nor do they find anything wrong with children participating in this dangerous "sport."

Tipper, good point about ear piercing.

[Nehemiah]

Ivy, good parallel of the rodeos. I know people here who are into rodeos, also, although it is certainly not as big as it would be out West.

No, I didn't notice the skulls but I was driving alone and was in foreign territory (to me) so I had to pretty much keep my eyes between the map and the road! I have seen pictures of those skulls before. Not my idea of yard art...but then again I know people who have pink flamingos in their yards. LOL

[ajt400]

I don't think the solving of this case is going to cme from reading books, no. Books are just the opnion of the writer (more often than not) even in a nn-fiction book, you have opinions being expressed. I think the solving of this case will come from a good investigation of the facts of evidence that I really don't think are all over the internet.

Besides, if one could solve murders by reading books alone, don't you think the Jack the Ripper's crime would have been solved by now?

What is your problem? Those posts were made like 3 weeks ago, have you just now seen them?

[Blazeboy3]

Originally posted by ajt400
I don't think the solving of this case is going to cme from reading books, no. Books are just the opnion of the writer (more often than not) even in a nn-fiction book, you have opinions being expressed. I think the solving of this case will come from a good investigation of the facts of evidence that I really don't think are all over the internet.

Besides, if one could solve murders by reading books alone, don't you think the Jack the Ripper's crime would have been solved by now?

What is your problem? Those posts were made like 3 weeks ago, have you just now seen them?

Ok, you're posting is noted by me... and IMHO you should read the book called "LIFE 101" for what it's worth and then we'll talk/post... :eek: :cool: :rolleyes: :bigthumb: :confused:

[Blazeboy3]

Originally posted by ajt400
Knowledge equals power, but books are written by people and people have different opinions. Even text books in school lean one way or another. Reading the books doesn't matter--reading them and being able to step back and logically look at evidence does.

I am not very sure you are able to that blazeboy

WHAT"S YOUR GOAL "HERE?" 3 weeks...what's it matter?!?!

So-ignore me;Ok, noted, but what does it matter...after reading ALL--you have "free will in your THINKING/THOUGHTS"right? ... or does SOMEONE-SOMETHING "CONTROL YOU/YOUR THINKING / THOUGHTS"?

[ajt400]

Exactly, one has freewill to take any opnion that they see in a work of fiction or non-fiction. You simply cannot take someones life for 6 years, when you don't even have a history of physocal abuse and assume that it happened. Then just assume what would have hapened had they grown up. The assumption is just someones opinion!
Did this author study actual live pageant contestants? Did he take what he wrote from other women who grew up in Pageants in America, or just from JonBenet's particular story?

How much reasearch really went into this book?

[ajt400]

FYI, I don't need to read a book on life, I simply live it.

I thought that's what everyone did.

[sissi]

The truth is not in any of the books!

The Ramsey's didn't kill their child,and no one is going to make that shoe fit....IMO

No pathology! Yes,people kill their children,but every single time,something was brewing.

IMO JMO

[ajt400]

Originally posted by sissi
The truth is not in any of the books!

The Ramsey's didn't kill their child,and no one is going to make that shoe fit....IMO

No pathology! Yes,people kill their children,but every single time,something was brewing.

IMO JMO

Exactly, I am not sure who did this crime, but the pathology simply must be there for either parents to commit! Sure, people kill their kids, we have come far too accustomed to it, but every case there was some sort of pathology there.

After 8 Years of the media being all over them, something would have come to light by now. Even the smallest tidbit! I simply is not there.....Even without sexual or physicological abuse, for someone just to snap--out of the blue--with no precursor to violence, then stage their child in a botched kidnapping-gone-bad scenario. Then be able to keep their stories straight for 8 years. All the while eluding not only the police, but the media as well? C'mon!

If the media can get info on our president, celebrities, etc., I am sure they cold dig up enough for the Ramsey's bones in their closet!

[Blazeboy3]

Originally posted by ACandyRose
One of our very own Internet posters has written a book named, "Journey Beyond Reason." Author is Peggy Lakin.

=====================================
http://www.ebookstand.com/m/peggylakin/

Paperback Price: $18.95
Download Price: $7.95 (Available formats for download: .PDF format)

"Be sure to check the correct box for paperback order or download."

About Our Book:

Journey Beyond Reason The murder of JonBenet Ramsey, Valerie Percy, and Matthew Margolies, along with thousand of other innocents, have left a great void in the lives of those who loved and cared about them. This void could never be filled, however, there might be hope for some resolve if their killer/s were to be found and brought to justice. I, and many others, do what we do because on an inherent desire to help the victims of crime and their families. Only those with something to hide would have anything to fear from such endeavors. I make no claims to insider information or expertise in any field. It is only through searching the internet and the writings of others that I have any information with which to work. As you find yourself becoming involved in this cyber world there will be cases that will truly haunt you, stick with you. I received this in an email from someone I have come to greatly respect and admire: ?My all time favorite high school teacher once said to me: ?The next best thing to knowing the answer is knowing where to find it.?? It boils down to this; if we do not know the answers, we have a tremendous resource available to us in our search. There is not always an obvious reason, for this search you must often journey beyond what is safe and comfortable, and into what might lie behind the public façade.
Number of pages:269

About the Author:

There is nothing extraordinary about me what so ever. I am just an average person, of average intelligence who through the internet has found others who share the same concerns. We all have the desire to help victims of crime. The internet has opened up a whole new world of interesting people with whom I can converse, share information and work with to try to help in any way we can those who have been touched by the horror of violent crime.

=====================================

You can find a preview "Journey Beyond Reason Preview" at the link below:

http://pub165.ezboard.com/fcrimeandjustice13552frm78.showMessage?topicID=2 51.topic

=====================================

When I wrote to the author yesterday (Oct 30th) as to when I could post the link, the author responded, "You can post the link anytime you wish. It is just necessary to let them know the book won't be shipped (as of today's date) for 2-3 weeks"

ACR

THANK YOU FOR THE INFO/URL!!!

[Blazeboy3]

Originally posted by ajt400
Exactly, one has freewill to take any opnion that they see in a work of fiction or non-fiction. You simply cannot take someones life for 6 years, when you don't even have a history of physocal abuse and assume that it happened. Then just assume what would have hapened had they grown up. The assumption is just someones opinion!
Did this author study actual live pageant contestants? Did he take what he wrote from other women who grew up in Pageants in America, or just from JonBenet's particular story?

How much reasearch really went into this book?

Ok, TRUTH:WHAT DOES IT MATTER? ... IF Patsy said TODAY that the book is an ABSOLUTE TRUTH OF WHAT HAPPENED...!!!??? what would you conclude/comprehend./say/feel/post ... ???..???

[Blazeboy3]

Originally posted by sissi
The truth is not in any of the books!

The Ramsey's didn't kill their child,and no one is going to make that shoe fit....IMO

No pathology! Yes,people kill their children,but every single time,something was brewing.

IMO JMO

Hey GOOD FOR YOU--Justify what YOU CAN LIFE WITH as "real."

[Blazeboy3]

Originally posted by ajt400
Exactly, I am not sure who did this crime, but the pathology simply must be there for either parents to commit! Sure, people kill their kids, we have come far too accustomed to it, but every case there was some sort of pathology there.

After 8 Years of the media being all over them, something would have come to light by now. Even the smallest tidbit! I simply is not there.....Even without sexual or physicological abuse, for someone just to snap--out of the blue--with no precursor to violence, then stage their child in a botched kidnapping-gone-bad scenario. Then be able to keep their stories straight for 8 years. All the while eluding not only the police, but the media as well? C'mon!

If the media can get info on our president, celebrities, etc., I am sure they cold dig up enough for the Ramsey's bones in their closet!

U M B R E L L A ...???!!!

[Blazeboy3]

J B R... I love it (see if you can see "as in initials)
John Bennet Ramsey
JonBenet Patricia Ramsey
Journey Beyond Reason
by Peggy Lakin

Journey Beyond Reason
by Peggy Lakin


LET US BEWARE/COMPREHEND: FACT: Everything Comes from Somewhere...???!!!

[ajt400]

Its' not going to be true, because it is fiction. If it were, say, Steve Thomas' book and PR said theat it was all true and confessed, I would be relieved because at least someone is being brought to justice. I know it sounds corny, but at least this little girl didn't scream to no one that night, her death wouldn't be in vain. (So to speak)

And, yes, umbrella of suspicion, but you cannot use a mere umbrella in a hurrican can you? We all know what would happen. It would be ripped to shreds! This media 'storm' has not been a simple summer shower, it has been a hurricane!

But, what in the world does the whole initials thing have to do with anything?

And, I am not sure of anyone else on this, but truth matters a great deal when concerning a child's vicious murder. You wouldn't want everyone confessing.....I thought truth was a vital point of interest. Do you not seek "the truth" behind the Ramsey's?
Okay you tell me, what does truth matter?

[Blazeboy3]

Originally posted by ajt400
Its' not going to be true, because it is fiction. If it were, say, Steve Thomas' book and PR said theat it was all true and confessed, I would be relieved because at least someone is being brought to justice. I know it sounds corny, but at least this little girl didn't scream to no one that night, her death wouldn't be in vain. (So to speak)

And, yes, umbrella of suspicion, but you cannot use a mere umbrella in a hurrican can you? We all know what would happen. It would be ripped to shreds! This media 'storm' has not been a simple summer shower, it has been a hurricane!

But, what in the world does the whole initials thing have to do with anything?

And, I am not sure of anyone else on this, but truth matters a great deal when concerning a child's vicious murder. You wouldn't want everyone confessing.....I thought truth was a vital point of interest.


What does truth matter? To who?

Read their (the Ramsey's book) and then post/vent (both copies hardback & paperback ... !!! ...!!!)... if you can afford to do so...???

[Blazeboy3]

Originally posted by sissi
The truth is not in any of the books!

The Ramsey's didn't kill their child,and no one is going to make that shoe fit....IMO

No pathology! Yes,people kill their children,but every single time,something was brewing.

IMO JMO

./no one is going to make that shoe fit....

You post the above...why? What's it worth to you?

[ajt400]

What is it worth for you to post?

[ajt400]

Also, truth in an investigation leads to who committed the crime and why. This shouldn't have to be explained...

[Blazeboy3]

YOUR BELIEF IS BECAUSE ... ??? Books? Which Ones/?

AND assuming you've ordered the latest book/ right?
http://www.vstore.com/cgi-bin/pagegen/vstorebooks/azamon/page.html?keywords=JonBenet&mode=search&file=/page/search/searchresultsv1.spl&catid=26307

[Blazeboy3]

Originally posted by ajt400
What is it worth for you to post?

NOTHING!

[Blazeboy3]

http://www.fetchbook.info/search_1413411088/tab_editions.html

[Blazeboy3]

IT"S SUCH A GOOD READ... by Walter Davis... buy it if you can...

http://www.fetchbook.info/search_1413411088/tab_editions.html

[Blazeboy3]

An Evening with JonBenet Ramsey
By Walter A. Davis
Paperback / Xlibris Corporation / September, 2003 / 1413411088
List Price $21.99 / Books Similar to An Evening with JonBenet Ramsey
See also at Amazon

[Blazeboy3]

Originally posted by ajt400
Also, truth in an investigation leads to who committed the crime and why. This shouldn't have to be explained...

IMHO>....YOU ARE SO RIGHT...IT SHOULD'NT HAVE TO BE EXPLAINED! ... it is what it is...see it for what it is...!!!

[Blazeboy3]

Originally posted by ajt400
What is it worth for you to post?

NOT A "THING!?!?" ... so now what (for JonBenet?!)...!?

[Blazeboy3]

Originally posted by ajt400
Exactly, I am not sure who did this crime, but the pathology simply must be there for either parents to commit! Sure, people kill their kids, we have come far too accustomed to it, but every case there was some sort of pathology there.

After 8 Years of the media being all over them, something would have come to light by now. Even the smallest tidbit! I simply is not there.....Even without sexual or physicological abuse, for someone just to snap--out of the blue--with no precursor to violence, then stage their child in a botched kidnapping-gone-bad scenario. Then be able to keep their stories straight for 8 years. All the while eluding not only the police, but the media as well? C'mon!

If the media can get info on our president, celebrities, etc., I am sure they cold dig up enough for the Ramsey's bones in their closet!

Talent? is that what this is about?....:( so sad if that is the main plot ... concern here???!!!...

[Blazeboy3]

Originally posted by ajt400
Also, truth in an investigation leads to who committed the crime and why. This shouldn't have to be explained...

Share w/us info: WHY OH WHY "shouldn't this have to be explained" WHY OH WHY?

ALL EARS...!!!

[ajt400]

I meant the concept of truth in an ivestigation should not have to be explained. I don't know if I just totally misread you when you spoke of truth, but I think people being truthful is very important to an investigation. I think that is what everyone on these forums want, whatever the truth may be.

[Blazeboy3]

Originally posted by ajt400
FYI, I don't need to read a book on life, I simply live it.

I thought that's what everyone did.

Ok I'm a few days late...blame it on my kids/teacher-converences-3schools! heeheelol; your posting/post--well said, now put your shoes on as the author:Davis...live it(as if JonBenet is speaking to you==from beyond(dead) personally)-what if?!
:p :p :p
IMHO; you thought that's what everyone did and IMHO so does Davis in his latest book...!!!...IMHO this is as close as one gets to the ABSOLUTE TRUTH REGARDING JONBENET'S LIFE/DEATH!" IMHO.
:( :) :o :rolleyes: :cool: :D :mad: :eek: ;) :nono: :dontknow::

For whatever it's worth...maybe just educating US here...??? FWIW(For What It'sWorth) I've 3 daughters and none of them to date has had a "women exam--if you know what I mean"; ages 16, 13, 11 ... FYI...in this big city of OMAHA! FYI: the 13 yr old had severe cramps and went to emergency and they DID NOT DO A PELVIC EXAM...THEY DID A C>A>T> scan(more $) but that does tell ya something don't ya think????!!!!cut al ong story short--she has ovarion cysts-3 that should go away by Dec2003...pray for her/us that they do...!!!; THANK YOU ALL!!!

[ajt400]

Hi Blaze, I thought that when a female turned 16---or if she is sexually active--she should have a pelvic exam? I did, of course I was all of the above.

I will pray for your daughter and your family, although I am not overly religious. My boyfriend has had tumors in his left hip since he was 9, they are benign, but he has to go to the doctor's every 3-4 years to make sure they are benign and not going to eventually become cancerous. That is an awful thing for a child to go through.

The good thing is that they made Dave a strong awesome person, (not that he wasn't to begin with) I am glad he is here with me today. I can just hope that this will make your daughter a strong woman....:bigthumb:

[ajt400]

The world needs more strong women anyhow...

[Maxi]

Our doc said the girls should have pelvics by the time they were 18, or earlier if they were sexually active. My youngest has been in treated with birth control pills for unopposed estrogen syndrome since she was 14. Even her gynecologist has never done a full pelvic. (Tho I guess she will now that my daughter is 18.) I don't quite understand why they don't, but I do know that they don't do it.

[ajt400]

I don't know, my doctor told me that it should be done at 16, or when sexually active. Who knows, I guess dr. knows best huh?

If they had known JBR was molested, would they have done a full pelvic? Just curious??

[Nehemiah]

Originally posted by ajt400
I don't know, my doctor told me that it should be done at 16, or when sexually active. Who knows, I guess dr. knows best huh?

If they had known JBR was molested, would they have done a full pelvic? Just curious??


One might say that I now work in the field of adolescent sexuality. It is recommended that any sexually active female, regardless of age, have a pelvic exam and be screened for sexually transmitted infections, or diseases.

If they had known that JBR had been molested, would they have done a full pelvic exam? Maybe not, but they should have. I have also worked for CPS in my state, and that was one of the duties I had--to investigate child abuse (sexual, physical, and emotional, etc...) which included a dr's exam. Of course "full pelvic exam" is qualified, depending upon the child's age and alleged abuse.

[Maxi]

I've read that they anesthetize, or at least sedate, pre-pubescent girls before doing complete pelvic exams.

[ajt400]

Originally posted by Blazeboy3
ok...whatever you have to do to get by...???!!!~~~Believe & justification are YOURS FOR THE TAKING???...!!!~~~

:) :nono: :mad: ;) :( :p :eek: :confused: :cool: :o :D :rolleyes: :bigthumb: :dontknow: :evil: :nono:

What does that mean, Blaze? I wrote that like a month ago.....It was simply a statement. Not justifying taking what you wish. The world does need more strong women. We seem to be the minority now.

[ajt400]

Originally posted by Blazeboy3
Don't Know...Was it a "GOOD" or BAD DOCTOR???///... There is SUCH A "THING:GOOD/BAD DOCTOR YA KNOW RIGHT???"""... Hello???...can you hear me know???!!!~~~:) :evil: :p :o :( :p

Yes, there is such a thing as a bad doctor, I know that. But I also believe that any girl that is sexually active should have a full pelvic exam and should be tested for STD's.

A recent poll said that around 75% of high school 15 year olds (female) have had sex. I was a part of that statisic when I was 15. The world we live in right now---girls should be more defensive of their bodies and what can happen to them. (Just my opinion)

[ajt400]

Originally posted by Blazeboy3
No...BUT "LET NO MAN PUT YOU UNDER...!!!"YA YA SISTERHOOD ... WATCH IT...it you dare/CAN????!!! :) :) :) :cool: :cool: :D :D :D

I will do you one better, I have read the book. I like it okay, I have not seen the movie, although I do like Ashley Judd.

[discod]

Which would you say were the best reads?? Ive read PMPT and the one the Forensic guy wrote but what else is good please?

[DeeDee249]

Which would you say were the best reads?? Ive read PMPT and the one the Forensic guy wrote but what else is good please?

Read Steve Thomas' book "JonBenet and the City of Boulder". He is the detective who, out of all of them, truly harbored no vendetta against the parents, but simply wanted justice for a little girl. He promised to go where the evidence led him. It led him to the parents. And for that, he gave up his career in law enforcement.

[discod]

Read Steve Thomas' book "JonBenet and the City of Boulder". He is the detective who, out of all of them, truly harbored no vendetta against the parents, but simply wanted justice for a little girl. He promised to go where the evidence led him. It led him to the parents. And for that, he gave up his career in law enforcement.

Thank you :)