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Lera213
10-21-2011, 01:54 AM
I think we are going to have to get all of us in a chat room to talk about this case soon. lol

LancelotLink
10-21-2011, 01:54 AM
Why wouldn't they pull the video just to prove she was where she said she was doing what she said she was doing and with whom? They aren't gonna just believe her right? No they verify.

From what I have heard, they found the receipt. To me, that means the info was never offered up. Why they went for video? Perhaps she tried to deny it was her purchase? I dunno. But, I have a feeling we will all know soon.

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 01:56 AM
Well, I don't know who did what with who behind who's barn but I know someone hasn't been honest and that lack of honesty has hampered the investigation into the disappearance of precious little Lisa.

Lisa is the only one who matters here. Not DB or her feeling and not JL and his feelings. Just Lisa.

These two adults need to get a grip and tell the truth now rather than latter. I believe the longer they wait the harder it will be on them. Their own actions are convicting them, not the the media and not public opinion. Their actions!

I don't know if they are quilty of anything more than Momma getting drunk and passing out. Probably hiding evidence too. jmo

I just hope and pray that DB's lies haven't cost Lisa her life, if she was still alive after that night.

moo

Lera213
10-21-2011, 01:56 AM
I was in chat room with other WS'ers during the entire CA trial and let me tell you, it was the best!

MyBelle
10-21-2011, 01:57 AM
Why wouldn't they pull the video just to prove she was where she said she was doing what she said she was doing and with whom? They aren't gonna just believe her right? No they verify.

Her receipt would verify the purchase of baby items. I doubt she told cops she bought a box of wine and that is why they pulled security video.

JMO

AngelWings444
10-21-2011, 01:57 AM
We don't JeannieC, all speculation since it was pointed out when DB bought the wine she paid for the wine separately from the wipes and baby food. The speculation is since she paid separately maybe it was because on food stamps or any other welfare system you cannot buy alcohol
Did DB pay for the wine separately? I didn't know that. I do know the food stamps and welfare is speculation, but I haven't heard the other items were purchased separate from the wine.

Can I buy a clue? :floorlaugh:

Lera213
10-21-2011, 01:58 AM
Well, I don't know who did what with who behind who's barn but I know someone hasn't been honest and that lack of honesty has hampered the investigation into the disappearance of precious little Lisa.

Lisa is the only one who matters here. Not DB or her feeling and not JL and his feelings. Just Lisa.

These two adults need to get a grip and tell the truth now rather than latter. I believe the longer they wait the harder it will be on them. Their own actions are convicting them, not the the media and not public opinion. Their actions!

I don't know if they are quilty of anything more than Momma getting drunk and passing out. Probably hiding evidence too. jmo

I just hope and pray that DB's lies haven't cost Lisa her life, if she was still alive after that night.

moo

BBM

All do respect and an honest question here. If you don't think the parents have been honest how can you believe she was even drunk? How do you pick and chose which statement she says is the truth and is not the truth? Curious

Dewey2Me1MoThyme
10-21-2011, 01:59 AM
D2M1MT,
humm where did you read that there's no need to look for this child? :waitasec:

I had quoted a post a couple pages back that said basically, all they need now is to find the body. i'll go back and see if I can find the one I quoted.

" Chris Texas: I believe that they have found all kinds of crucial evidence. They just need a body now. "

Lera213
10-21-2011, 01:59 AM
Did DB pay for the wine separately? I didn't know that. I do know the food stamps and welfare is speculation, but I haven't heard the other items were purchased separate from the wine.

Can I buy a clue? :floorlaugh:
Oh HECK! Now I'm not even sure of that....LOL

Look going with the flow sometimes...a bad habit of mine.

LancelotLink
10-21-2011, 02:00 AM
And, OT as it is, I don't know "Debs" so have no compunction to like or dislike. I am only trying to sleuth a very bizarre case that involves very bizarre and ever evolving, er changing stories.
And a search warrant was and should always be neccessary if we want the truth.

norest4thewicked
10-21-2011, 02:00 AM
People keep saying that the parents are being railroaded by LE and the media. Not a bit of my thoughts about DB and possibly JI being guilty in this is anything done by either LE or the media. It's all them. I supported them in the beginning. Their own words and their acting guilty is what changed my mind.

Jaxson
10-21-2011, 02:01 AM
That's the point. She never said she was at the grocery store and LE discovered it when they found the receipt on their initial search.


How do you know she didn't tell them. LE hasn't told us her story. Did Deborah say she hadn't told them?

Lera213
10-21-2011, 02:02 AM
What if the wine was the carrier of the cell phones...what if, when they left the house, they took that wine. LE cannot verify how much she drank because she took it with them when they left and LE didn't know about it the first night. Makes me wonder...again this is speculation as usual

AngelWings444
10-21-2011, 02:02 AM
Tell me, how can one call LE imcompetent if one doesn't live in that town and know them personally? kwim

I think CB was making a statement in general, not towards LE in this case. Kwim?

marge_rita
10-21-2011, 02:02 AM
Well, I don't know who did what with who behind who's barn but I know someone hasn't been honest and that lack of honesty has hampered the investigation into the disappearance of precious little Lisa.

Lisa is the only one who matters here. Not DB or her feeling and not JL and his feelings. Just Lisa.

These two adults need to get a grip and tell the truth now rather than latter. I believe the longer they wait the harder it will be on them. Their own actions are convicting them, not the the media and not public opinion. Their actions!

I don't know if they are quilty of anything more than Momma getting drunk and passing out. Probably hiding evidence too. jmo

I just hope and pray that DB's lies haven't cost Lisa her life, if she was still alive after that night.

moo


:gthanks:

MyBelle
10-21-2011, 02:03 AM
I dont live in the best area of my town and we have this store that got busted for letting people buy smokes with their food stamps, pay cell phone bills, and all sorts of shady stuff.. The hubby and I call it "the shady store" lol They have a old fashioned register so they can punch in any price they want...its crazy

I'm guessin they got busted because the State auditors took a look at their "old-fashioned" methods.

JMO

marge_rita
10-21-2011, 02:03 AM
I think CB was making a statement in general, not towards LE in this case. Kwim?

blushing.. ..Sorry Angel! I misunderstood.

KCMommie
10-21-2011, 02:03 AM
I personally don't think it has any thing to do with incompetence, per se. I think it has more to do with control by confusion. Oldest trick in the book. I don't think this was all media induced. I clearly see the sensationalism, however, a lot of the confusion started to come to a halt when the parents shut up. Their stories changed with each interviewer... which led to over half of the problem. While I do see that there was moments that I could give credit for the fact these were potentially highly traumatized parents... as the days rolled by, and the more they talked, the more confusion set in.

If it were my child I'd be on every station by press conference answering all questions, squelching all rumors unless instructed by LE that I should not. I don't care if it turned into a never-ending tennis match... That's my baby is the only thing that would be running through my head. NOTHING would take precedence.

I feel pretty confident that LE knows quite a bit more than we do. I think they most likely have enough evidence, but it may be circumstantial. I have felt quite a bit of patronizing going on.

I believe the Network paid this atty in lieu for the interviews and Mr. Talking-Bobble-head Joe atty and Wild Bill are in it as with every other case, sensationalism. Absolutely NO professionalism. Now, even they are maintaining that they are not saying these parents are innocent or guilty.

What I am being asked to believe is that....

A self admitted drunk kid, who takes "Anxiety" meds, that comes from a family of high dysfunction, who is known for her "attention seeking behaviors" which reportedly has a history of chaos and drama with others, and a history of poor decision making skill, is only 25 years old and two children from two fathers (not ending the first marriage prior to this current relationship), left her ill child COMPLETELY unattended for 9-10 hours. (No diaper change?), citing indignantly on NATIONAL TV that she has the "right to alcoholic adult time", showing NO remorse (believes her own lie) for the consequence of this irresponsible behavior (only on cue- not her fault, not her fault, not her fault!), and by temper-tantrum will not work with the very authorities that can help her poor child...

That she should not be considered a suspect?

LancelotLink
10-21-2011, 02:03 AM
BBM

All do respect and an honest question here. If you don't think the parents have been honest how can you believe she was even drunk? How do you pick and chose which statement she says is the truth and is not the truth? Curious

High priced lawyers know how to get you reasonable doubt really quickly. See how this has taken off, as if it had wings...all the talking heads are fairly peeing their pants over this unfit mother BS. Completely missing the mark. Only a few see this for what it is. Bless her heart, even JVM copped a clue...

Jaxson
10-21-2011, 02:04 AM
Her receipt would verify the purchase of baby items. I doubt she told cops she bought a box of wine and that is why they pulled security video.

JMO

The receipt wouldn't verify that Deborah bought anything. Only that items were purchased by someone. You DOUBT? how about a link because I hadn't heard any where that she didn't tell them.

AngelWings444
10-21-2011, 02:04 AM
Oh HECK! Now I'm not even sure of that....LOL

Look going with the flow sometimes...a bad habit of mine.

That bad habit becomes known as facts sometimes, like the rumored garage sale. LOL!! No worries. Glad to know I wasn't losing it again. This case is going by so fast but yet, nothing. :maddening:

LancelotLink
10-21-2011, 02:06 AM
I personally don't think it has any thing to do with incompetence, per se. I think it has more to do with control by confusion. Oldest trick in the book. I don't think this was all media induced. I clearly see the sensationalism, however, a lot of the confusion started to come to a halt when the parents shut up. Their stories changed with each interviewer... which led to over half of the problem. While I do see that there was moments that I could give credit for the fact these were potentially highly traumatized parents... as the days rolled by, and the more they talked, the more confusion set in.

If it were my child I'd be on every station by press conference answering all questions, squelching all rumors unless instructed by LE that I should not. I don't care if it turned into a never-ending tennis match... That's my baby is the only thing that would be running through my head. NOTHING would take precedence.

I feel pretty confident that LE knows quite a bit more than we do. I think they most likely have enough evidence, but it may be circumstantial. I have felt quite a bit of patronizing going on.

I believe the Network paid this atty in lieu for the interviews and Mr. Talking-Bobble-head Joe atty and Wild Bill are in it as with every other case, sensationalism. Absolutely NO professionalism. Now, even they are maintaining that they are not saying these parents are innocent or guilty.

What I am being asked to believe is that....

A self admitted drunk kid, who takes "Anxiety" meds, that comes from a family of high dysfunction, who is known for her "attention seeking behaviors" which reportedly has a history of chaos and drama with others, and a history of poor decision making skill, is only 25 years old and two children from two fathers (not ending the first marriage prior to this current relationship), left her ill child COMPLETELY unattended for 9-10 hours. (No diaper change?), citing indignantly on NATIONAL TV that she has the "right to alcoholic adult time", showing NO remorse (believes her own lie) for the consequence of this irresponsible behavior (only on cue- not her fault, not her fault, not her fault!), and by temper-tantrum will not work with the very authorities that can help her poor child...

That she should not be considered a suspect?

:clap: :clap: :clap:

Lera213
10-21-2011, 02:08 AM
That bad habit becomes known as facts sometimes, like the rumored garage sale. LOL!! No worries. Glad to know I wasn't losing it again. This case is going by so fast but yet, nothing. :maddening:

I didn't start the garage sale, I tried to dispel it as rumor.

Jaxson
10-21-2011, 02:10 AM
That bad habit becomes known as facts sometimes, like the rumored garage sale. LOL!! No worries. Glad to know I wasn't losing it again. This case is going by so fast but yet, nothing. :maddening:


Hey now , Nursebeeme is the one who posted the garage sale as fact and she is a mod. I so trusted her....lol

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 02:11 AM
BBM

All do respect and an honest question here. If you don't think the parents have been honest how can you believe she was even drunk? How do you pick and chose which statement she says is the truth and is not the truth? Curious

"I put Lisa down at 7:30. Checked on her at 10:30"

"No, I put Lisa down about 6:40 and didn't check on her."
"I got drunk and passed out, don't remember anything."


Ok which is true? Only one is true and one is a lie. Either way, she lied. Doesn't matter which I choose to believe, she hasn't been honest. moo

LancelotLink
10-21-2011, 02:12 AM
Did DB pay for the wine separately? I didn't know that. I do know the food stamps and welfare is speculation, but I haven't heard the other items were purchased separate from the wine.

Can I buy a clue? :floorlaugh:

I thought the cashier made the statement that the wine was purchased seperately. :waitasec:

AngelWings444
10-21-2011, 02:14 AM
I didn't start the garage sale, I tried to dispel it as rumor.
I know and thank you! I think we are all getting a little antsy to get answers/info in this case, and to bring little Lisa home. I applaud LE for keeping a tight lid on this case, hoping and praying they have information and release it soon! I want Lisa home NOW, one way or the other. I want the persons involved to be in jail, NOW!

I think this is something we all can agree on. :heartbeat:

KCMommie
10-21-2011, 02:14 AM
The receipt wouldn't verify that Deborah bought anything. Only that items were purchased by someone. You DOUBT? how about a link because I hadn't heard any where that she didn't tell them.

The police were aware of the receipt for the alcohol. I remember distinctly the media reporting that the Police were aware; how? I cannot answer. I do remember this statement being made somewhere.

I have a sneaking suspicion that's when she admitted to "blacking out" in questioning that would become a reason to shut up and lawyer up. According to NY Joe, that coincides with the time he states they started talking to him.

He's obviously not doing them any favors sending them on national TV to incriminate themselves...

LancelotLink
10-21-2011, 02:15 AM
"I put Lisa down at 7:30. Checked on her at 10:30"

"No, I put Lisa down about 6:40 and didn't check on her."
"I got drunk and passed out, don't remember anything."


Ok which is true? Only one is true and one is a lie. Either way, she lied. Doesn't matter which I choose to believe, she hasn't been honest. moo

ITA

Indeed. Now, imagine you are LE, trying to find this missing baby and you hear this on national TV. WTH??? Y-ea-h-, here is a really concerned parent....

MyBelle
10-21-2011, 02:16 AM
The receipt wouldn't verify that Deborah bought anything. Only that items were purchased by someone. You DOUBT? how about a link because I hadn't heard any where that she didn't tell them.

Why would a receipt be in her possession if she didn't purchase the items?

As I said, deductive reasoning is what I'm using to conclude DB didn't tell cops about the wine purchase. No link.

JMO

AngelWings444
10-21-2011, 02:16 AM
Hey now , Nursebeeme is the one who posted the garage sale as fact and she is a mod. I so trusted her....lol
Thanks for calling me out and getting me in trouble. Geez. Now Kimster will come in and zap me. I am toast. Nice knowing all of you. LOL!

Can I save myself and try to get back on topic? Search warrant anyone?

Lera213
10-21-2011, 02:17 AM
"I put Lisa down at 7:30. Checked on her at 10:30"

"No, I put Lisa down about 6:40 and didn't check on her."
"I got drunk and passed out, don't remember anything."


Ok which is true? Only one is true and one is a lie. Either way, she lied. Doesn't matter which I choose to believe, she hasn't been honest. moo

I agree she lied just wanted to know why you believe she actually was drunk. Is it because she said so and she bought it? If she lied on other things how can you be sure she isn't lying about other stuff or all of it. I just don't know how to pick in choose so my choice is not to believe anything she has said. Just wanted to know how you came to the conclusion to believe her statement she was drunk.

LancelotLink
10-21-2011, 02:17 AM
The police were aware of the receipt for the alcohol. I remember distinctly the media reporting that the Police were aware; how? I cannot answer. I do remember this statement being made somewhere.

I have a sneaking suspicion that's when she admitted to "blacking out" in questioning that would become a reason to shut up and lawyer up. According to NY Joe, that coincides with the time he states they started talking to him.

He's obviously not doing them any favors sending them on national TV to incriminate themselves...

No, he is not, but he sure as heck is helping them down the road with the whole reasonable doubt.

LancelotLink
10-21-2011, 02:20 AM
Search warrant....and I heard one of the reporters today from early on state something about them having a yard sale. Search warrant and I tried to see if the baby's room had carpet for Whisperer, but can only assume it did.

Jaxson
10-21-2011, 02:21 AM
Why would a receipt be in her possession if she didn't purchase the items?

As I said, deductive reasoning is what I'm using to conclude DB didn't tell cops about the wine purchase. No link.

JMO


Okay fair enough then. My deductive reasoning says LE asked her what she did that day. She gave them her story. They wanted proof. She gave them receipt for that portion of her time. They got video and verified it. Simple really. I guess it could go either way.

n4k
10-21-2011, 02:22 AM
Did DB pay for the wine separately? I didn't know that. I do know the food stamps and welfare is speculation, but I haven't heard the other items were purchased separate from the wine.

Can I buy a clue? :floorlaugh:
Angel, I was like you about the two receipt thing. I first read it here Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Interviews 10/17/2011 All interviews #2 a few nights ago. I'm sure further back in the thread it is mentioned with links? I'm not sure of the significance of two receipts, though.

RT51
10-21-2011, 02:22 AM
I admit if this was my situation, I would be a little like JI as I don't wear my emotions on my sleeve, (I would be an internal mess!) but I would certainly put forth the effort to find my child. I don't think I would interview but I would give statements begging for the return of my child. And I would most certainly work with LE to find my child! High profile lawyers, no, honest ones, yes. I would do whatever I could to aid in the rescue of my child! JMO

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 02:23 AM
I personally don't think it has any thing to do with incompetence, per se. I think it has more to do with control by confusion. Oldest trick in the book. I don't think this was all media induced. I clearly see the sensationalism, however, a lot of the confusion started to come to a halt when the parents shut up. Their stories changed with each interviewer... which led to over half of the problem. While I do see that there was moments that I could give credit for the fact these were potentially highly traumatized parents... as the days rolled by, and the more they talked, the more confusion set in.

If it were my child I'd be on every station by press conference answering all questions, squelching all rumors unless instructed by LE that I should not. I don't care if it turned into a never-ending tennis match... That's my baby is the only thing that would be running through my head. NOTHING would take precedence.

I feel pretty confident that LE knows quite a bit more than we do. I think they most likely have enough evidence, but it may be circumstantial. I have felt quite a bit of patronizing going on.

I believe the Network paid this atty in lieu for the interviews and Mr. Talking-Bobble-head Joe atty and Wild Bill are in it as with every other case, sensationalism. Absolutely NO professionalism. Now, even they are maintaining that they are not saying these parents are innocent or guilty.

What I am being asked to believe is that....

A self admitted drunk kid, who takes "Anxiety" meds, that comes from a family of high dysfunction, who is known for her "attention seeking behaviors" which reportedly has a history of chaos and drama with others, and a history of poor decision making skill, is only 25 years old and two children from two fathers (not ending the first marriage prior to this current relationship), left her ill child COMPLETELY unattended for 9-10 hours. (No diaper change?), citing indignantly on NATIONAL TV that she has the "right to alcoholic adult time", showing NO remorse (believes her own lie) for the consequence of this irresponsible behavior (only on cue- not her fault, not her fault, not her fault!), and by temper-tantrum will not work with the very authorities that can help her poor child...

That she should not be considered a suspect?

AMEN and pass the plate! :twocents::angel::boohoo::praying:
:singing:

MyBelle
10-21-2011, 02:26 AM
Okay fair enough then. My deductive reasoning says LE asked her what she did that day. She gave them her story. They wanted proof. She gave them receipt for that portion of her time. They got video and verified it. Simple really. I guess it could go either way.

DB admitted to the wine and also changed her timeline to 6:40 pm and said she never again checked on Lisa. That's not something she told LE in the beginning.

JMO

LancelotLink
10-21-2011, 02:26 AM
How do you know she didn't tell them. LE hasn't told us her story. Did Deborah say she hadn't told them?

Sorry, Deborah has squandered any credibility for me.

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 02:26 AM
Okay fair enough then. My deductive reasoning says LE asked her what she did that day. She gave them her story. They wanted proof. She gave them receipt for that portion of her time. They got video and verified it. Simple really. I guess it could go either way.

LE found the receipt during the first search and checked the video at the store. She didn't tell it. Check the media links. They have the story.

n4k
10-21-2011, 02:26 AM
I admit if this was my situation, I would be a little like JI as I don't wear my emotions on my sleeve, (I would be an internal mess!) but I would certainly put forth the effort to find my child. I don't think I would interview but I would give statements begging for the return of my child. And I would most certainly work with LE to find my child! High profile lawyers, no, honest ones, yes. I would do whatever I could to aid in the rescue of my child! JMO

I wonder if JI may be secretly working wit LE? Perhaps he suspects DB but is trying to keep lines of communication open? He just seems withdrawn from her to me.

RT51
10-21-2011, 02:28 AM
I wonder if JI may be secretly working wit LE? Perhaps he suspects DB but is trying to keep lines of communication open? He just seems withdrawn from her to me.

It is possible. Weren't they taken away seperately on Wednesday by a woman in a SUV?

Jaxson
10-21-2011, 02:30 AM
LE found the receipt during the first search and checked the video at the store. She didn't tell it. Check the media links. They have the story.


I heard the media the night LE asked for the video. They sensationalized it, (unidentified man and all that crap,and LE said not true) so I have some trouble with them. LE clarified the next day when the video was released to media. Le hasn't said she didn't tell them about it.

BaileyandBella
10-21-2011, 02:32 AM
I think the phones are long gone by now. :(

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 02:32 AM
I agree she lied just wanted to know why you believe she actually was drunk. Is it because she said so and she bought it? If she lied on other things how can you be sure she isn't lying about other stuff or all of it. I just don't know how to pick in choose so my choice is not to believe anything she has said. Just wanted to know how you came to the conclusion to believe her statement she was drunk.

It makes more sense to believe she was drunk and put the baby down at 6:40and never checked on her again than to believe she put her down at 6:40 and never checked on her again and wasn't drunk! Lisa was sick. She would have needed checked on, changed, maybe a bottle.

So she was either drunk and negligent or just negligent.

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 02:36 AM
I wonder if JI may be secretly working wit LE? Perhaps he suspects DB but is trying to keep lines of communication open? He just seems withdrawn from her to me.

In the interview where DB admitted to being drunk I notice she reached for his hand and he didn't budge to take her hand. The camera stayed there for a while and you could see she laid her hand on top of his but he didn't budge.

I don't believe he was involved and I do believe he is heartbroken beyond belief. Totally in shock.

MyBelle
10-21-2011, 02:37 AM
It makes more sense to believe she was drunk and put the baby down at 6:40and never checked on her again than to believe she put her down at 6:40 and never checked on her again and wasn't drunk! Lisa was sick. She would have needed checked on, changed, maybe a bottle.

So she was either drunk and negligent or just negligent.

The drunk aspect raises it to a class A felony imo. There is a receipt for the wine, her admission she was drunk. A neighbor also participated. That's quite a hurdle for a defense attorney to overcome.

JMO

RT51
10-21-2011, 02:38 AM
First of all, there is a difference between blacked out and passed out. I can't see where under 10 glasses of wine causes a black out. A black out is when you are still awake but don't remember what you did. Passed out is sound asleep.

So by her saying she blacked out, who knows what she did.

JMO

BaileyandBella
10-21-2011, 02:39 AM
Could DB be arrested solely on child neglect (drinking and blacking out)?

n4k
10-21-2011, 02:40 AM
In the interview where DB admitted to being drunk I notice she reached for his hand and he didn't budge to take her hand. The camera stayed there for a while and you could see she laid her hand on top of his but he didn't budge.

I don't believe he was involved and I do believe he is heartbroken beyond belief. Totally in shock.

Yes, I noticed that in a couple of the interviews. Only once did I see HIS hand on HER leg and in that case, her hand was on top so she may have moved it there. In all the others, it appeared that she was the only one doing the consoling/needing comfort.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 02:40 AM
It makes more sense to believe she was drunk and put the baby down at 6:40and never checked on her again than to believe she put her down at 6:40 and never checked on her again and wasn't drunk! Lisa was sick. She would have needed checked on, changed, maybe a bottle.

So she was either drunk and negligent or just negligent.

Thank you for answering and I'm not picking on you really I am not. Just trying to understand...Ok so how do you trust what anything she has said is true? We have no other confirmation other then what she has said.

This is why I chose not to believe anything she says.

We don't know her true timeline only what she has stated and LE has always said during their pressers is "The Parents state blah blah blah" see what I mean?

KCMommie
10-21-2011, 02:40 AM
No, he is not, but he sure as heck is helping them down the road with the whole reasonable doubt.

I FEAR this. I truly see a mentally ill, didn't have the correct upbringing defense coming into play here.

I don't see how. No one saw this in the Anthony case either. This child is GONE. GONE! The last person to see her is the very person who was supposed to protect and care for this child; instead she neglected her. No doubt charges are coming...I am glad they got a warrant. If a jury hears this I'll be ticked if our LE does not have this case LOCKED DOWN before they move I just hope and pray every night we find Lisa alive. Maybe someone who realized that Lisa wasn't getting the care she needed and will drop her off at a church somewhere. Statistically, I know the chances are slim.

I have no idea what has been done with this child and I am so angry I could spit. Ive been warned by local law enforcement that I need to keep a watchful eye. I haven't lived in this part of the metro for very long, but my child is afraid someone is going to "come steal him" already, and if you look at the Offender registry for the KC Metro area it looks as if someone has been playing in the dippin' dots. Since this started, I've found myself checking to see if our doors/windows are locked, considering better locks.

How DARE someone emotionally blackmail us to further a cover up? Molest the very thing we all need to be watchful of? Desensitize us by crying wolf. I live a couple of miles away. I pray to God this woman is not manipulating.. I have for two weeks. It's not looking good.If they did this, I cannot imagine how the public will react, especially in the wake of the Anthony trial.

AngelWings444
10-21-2011, 02:40 AM
Angel, I was like you about the two receipt thing. I first read it here Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Interviews 10/17/2011 All interviews #2 (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7245737&postcount=137) a few nights ago. I'm sure further back in the thread it is mentioned with links? I'm not sure of the significance of two receipts, though.

Thank you. I am not trying to dispute the receipt, the garage sale or anything else. The only reason I questioned 2 receipts is because I had not heard it before, and because someone stated the reason she paid separate is because DB is on welfare or foodstamps. We have no clue what is true or not. Even with DB's own statements, family statements, neighbors/friends, the MEDIA, we have no clue if they are the truth or lies. DB stated she failed a poly, who knows if that is true. Who know what time any of this happened, who, what, when, why? None of us know. The one thing we all know FOR SURE, is Baby Lisa is missing/gone. It's very sad and she needs to be found, the sooner, the better. For now, I am trusting LE and praying they know the answers or have been pointed in the right direction.

n4k
10-21-2011, 02:44 AM
First of all, there is a difference between blacked out and passed out. I can't see where under 10 glasses of wine causes a black out. A black out is when you are still awake but don't remember what you did. Passed out is sound asleep.

So by her saying she blacked out, who knows what she did.

JMO

I'm a big woman and I can pass out with half a glass of wine. As for blacked out versus passed out. Until this case, I never realized the difference and in my younger days, I did a lot of drinking and passing out. I'm sure I referred to it as "blacking out" because..well, that's what I did :D I'm not sure we can know exactly what DB intended to describe when she said she "blacked out." She may have just meant she fell asleep.

BaileyandBella
10-21-2011, 02:46 AM
Didn't a report come out that said a child this age (toddler, 11 months) has only been kidnapped ONCE ever!!!???

...and that baby kidnappings are always newborns?

Lera213
10-21-2011, 02:47 AM
Thank you. I am not trying to dispute the receipt, the garage sale or anything else. The only reason I questioned 2 receipts is because I had not heard it before, and because someone stated the reason she paid separate is because DB is on welfare or foodstamps. We have no clue what is true or not. Even with DB's own statements, family statements, neighbors/friends, the MEDIA, we have no clue if they are the truth or lies. DB stated she failed a poly, who knows if that is true. Who know what time any of this happened, who, what, when, why? None of us know. The one thing we all know FOR SURE, is Baby Lisa is missing/gone. It's very sad and she needs to be found, the sooner, the better. For now, I am trusting LE and praying they know the answers or have been pointed in the right direction.

Angle tonight on Bill O'Reilly on foxnews Megan Kelly was on. She summed up the case and hit everything. The one thing I first question she might have got wrong I soon remembered that on things like this MK is very careful in getting her facts straight and she would have spoken to someone in LE to verify a few things. She stated that the Mom said she failed and LE confirmed that she did. So that fact I think we can say is true.

HatesSociopaths
10-21-2011, 02:48 AM
The revelation that JI decided THAT DAY to work an extra electrical job at Starbucks is very interesting to me.

The timeline appears to have been changed because the neighbor indicated that she never saw the baby, IMO.

What happened during the day? Why did Jeremy suddenly and immediately want to work a graveyard type shift that he had never worked before?

It's also interesting that the store clerk said that the baby is often brought to the store. Not this time.

It would also be worth looking into if this run to the store to get BULK baby food was even needed. Did her cupboard already have baby food in it?

And once her cell phones are found, does her original cell phone actually have a speaker/microphone issue, or is it perfectly fine?

Who was on the other end of the alleged 2:38 phone call? Was it actually Jeremy and Debbie communicating about the cover-up?

Did Debbie kill Lisa during the day?

Maybe Jeremy came home at 3:20 to a grieving (faked) Debbie, saying that Lisa had died. She may have purposely poisoned Lisa with a cough syrup overdose but staged it as an accident to Jeremy. By the time he got home, Lisa was clearly dead. He then was pleaded with by Debbie that the best thing to do was to stage a kidnapping so that they wouldn't lose the boys. She told him that he should go work another job that night so that he would not be implicated (yeah right, that's why she let him discover she was missing - she knew reasonable doubt would be created about who did what).

MOO.

RT51
10-21-2011, 02:49 AM
I'm a big woman and I can pass out with half a glass of wine. As for blacked out versus passed out. Until this case, I never realized the difference and in my younger days, I did a lot of drinking and passing out. I'm sure I referred to it as "blacking out" because..well, that's what I did :D I'm not sure we can know exactly what DB intended to describe when she said she "blacked out." She may have just meant she fell asleep.

I guess I just have read too many excuses in crimes where the person said they blacked out and didn't realize what they did. I can drink wine very well. I've even been know to fall down, but I have never forgotten what I did or where I was. Maybe a little embarassed when I woke up in the morning, but never forgot things.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 02:49 AM
LDT that is...sorry...other then that I don't believe a word they say however when LE speaks they chose their words wisely after all they know it could possible come back in court. If they come out right and make a fact known, I'll believe it. The Mom/Dad no freaking way unless LE confirms it. MOO

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 02:51 AM
I FEAR this. I truly see a mentally ill, didn't have the correct upbringing defense coming into play here.

I don't see how. No one saw this in the Anthony case either. This child is GONE. GONE! The last person to see her is the very person who was supposed to protect and care for this child; instead she neglected her. No doubt charges are coming...I am glad they got a warrant. If a jury hears this I'll be ticked if our LE does not have this case LOCKED DOWN before they move I just hope and pray every night we find Lisa alive. Maybe someone who realized that Lisa wasn't getting the care she needed and will drop her off at a church somewhere. Statistically, I know the chances are slim.

I have no idea what has been done with this child and I am so angry I could spit. Ive been warned by local law enforcement that I need to keep a watchful eye. I haven't lived in this part of the metro for very long, but my child is afraid someone is going to "come steal him" already, and if you look at the Offender registry for the KC Metro area it looks as if someone has been playing in the dippin' dots. Since this started, I've found myself checking to see if our doors/windows are locked, considering better locks.

How DARE someone emotionally blackmail us to further a cover up? Molest the very thing we all need to be watchful of? Desensitize us by crying wolf. I live a couple of miles away. I pray to God this woman is not manipulating.. I have for two weeks. It's not looking good.If they did this, I cannot imagine how the public will react, especially in the wake of the Anthony trial.

I believe the Anthony trial has a large bearing on LE appearing to go overboard, as some have stated, in this case. No holes in their case, nothing left unturned. I believe they are being very thorough and making every effort to not only find Lisa but to build an airtight case against the perp. jmo

AngelWings444
10-21-2011, 02:52 AM
Angle tonight on Bill O'Reilly on foxnews Megan Kelly was on. She summed up the case and hit everything. The one thing I first question she might have got wrong I soon remembered that on things like this MK is very careful in getting her facts straight and she would have spoken to someone in LE to verify a few things. She stated that the Mom said she failed and LE confirmed that she did. So that fact I think we can say is true.

Mom said in an interview that police told her that she failed the polygraph. LE never confirmed she failed, only confirmed DB said she failed. That is my recollection. I could be wrong.

RT51
10-21-2011, 02:52 AM
The revelation that JI decided THAT DAY to work an extra electrical job at Starbucks is very interesting to me.

The timeline appears to have been changed because the neighbor indicated that she never saw the baby, IMO.

What happened during the day? Why did Jeremy suddenly and immediately want to work a graveyard type shift that he had never worked before?

Who was on the other end of the alleged 2:38 phone call? Was it actually Jeremy and Debbie communicating about the cover-up?

Did Debbie kill Lisa during the day?

Maybe Jeremy came home at 3:20 to a grieving (faked) Debbie, saying that Lisa had died. She may have purposely poisoned Lisa with a cough syrup overdose but staged it as an accident to Jeremy. By the time he got home, Lisa was clearly dead. He then was pleaded with by Debbie that the best thing to do was to stage a kidnapping so that they wouldn't lose the boys. She told him that he should go work another job that night so that he would not be implicated (yeah right, that's why she let him discover she was missing - she knew reasonable doubt would be created about who did what).

MOO.

Did JI even see her awake before he went to the other job? Maybe he thought she was asleep as that is what DB told him before she went to the store.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 02:54 AM
To me there is only a few facts that we can say is true they are:

Lisa is gone
Wine was bought by DB
DB failed the LDT

That is it

LancelotLink
10-21-2011, 02:54 AM
I FEAR this. I truly see a mentally ill, didn't have the correct upbringing defense coming into play here.

I don't see how. No one saw this in the Anthony case either. This child is GONE. GONE! The last person to see her is the very person who was supposed to protect and care for this child; instead she neglected her. No doubt charges are coming...I am glad they got a warrant. If a jury hears this I'll be ticked if our LE does not have this case LOCKED DOWN before they move I just hope and pray every night we find Lisa alive. Maybe someone who realized that Lisa wasn't getting the care she needed and will drop her off at a church somewhere. Statistically, I know the chances are slim.

I have no idea what has been done with this child and I am so angry I could spit. Ive been warned by local law enforcement that I need to keep a watchful eye. I haven't lived in this part of the metro for very long, but my child is afraid someone is going to "come steal him" already, and if you look at the Offender registry for the KC Metro area it looks as if someone has been playing in the dippin' dots. Since this started, I've found myself checking to see if our doors/windows are locked, considering better locks.

How DARE someone emotionally blackmail us to further a cover up? Molest the very thing we all need to be watchful of? Desensitize us by crying wolf. I live a couple of miles away. I pray to God this woman is not manipulating.. I have for two weeks. It's not looking good.If they did this, I cannot imagine how the public will react, especially in the wake of the Anthony trial.

They have already started with the defense. On Dr. Drew, he said he had spoken with a member of the family who said there was a history of abuse, achoholism, etc/ Now, keep in mind, he never said DB in particular, but the family has a history.

I feel the FBI knows what happened and the 17 hours yesterday was spent wisely. The fact that this story and the one fron Ft. Bragg are so simliar does not go unnoticed by me, so I can assure the FBI is on this.

The truth will come out soon.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 02:54 AM
Mom said in an interview that police told her that she failed the polygraph. LE never confirmed she failed, only confirmed DB said she failed. That is my recollection. I could be wrong.

right Megan Kelly said tonight that LE confirmed it. She would not state that unless she herself got that confirmation.

BaileyandBella
10-21-2011, 02:55 AM
Supposedly JI has an alibi that night (video). Has LE confirmed a with a boss that he was really working??

I am wondering if that was all staged now too...sigh.

KCMommie
10-21-2011, 02:56 AM
Thank you for answering and I'm not picking on you really I am not. Just trying to understand...Ok so how do you trust what anything she has said is true? We have no other confirmation other then what she has said.

This is why I chose not to believe anything she says.

We don't know her true timeline only what she has stated and LE has always said during their pressers is "The Parents state blah blah blah" see what I mean?

Actually, you have brought up a really good point! I'm thinking along those lines too. I have wondered if she is lying about drinking to build a defense.

I have no idea what happened! I put her to bed and checked on her and 'pouf' she was gone!

To

Yes, I know my story wasn't really believable but I was just trying to cover up that I was really drunk and I could be charged with neglect and endangerment...but... She's really missing -- go find her. I'll sit here and wait. REALLY?

What's next?

They never struck me as being that bright... but I guess that's the point. When you're normal, you can't figure out crazy.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 02:57 AM
Supposedly JI has an alibi that night (video). Has LE confirmed a with a boss that he was really working??

I am wondering if that was all staged now too...sigh.

nobody knows I heard also that there was video of him at work. We haven't seen it, LE hasn't stated such, I haven't heard that LE made the statement this to be or even where this information came from. It was stated by the media.

They didn't say LE said they have video.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 02:59 AM
Actually, you have brought up a really good point! I'm thinking along those lines too. I have wondered if she is lying about drinking to build a defense.

I have no idea what happened! I put her to bed and checked on her and 'pouf' she was gone!

To

Yes, I know my story wasn't really believable but I was just trying to cover up that I was really drunk and I could be charged with neglect and endangerment...but... She's really missing -- go find her. I'll sit here and wait. REALLY?

What's next?

They never struck me as being that bright... but I guess that's the point. When you're normal, you can't figure out crazy.
Thank you! I'm going to try and be careful when I make a comment about what she said...I'll say allegedly because I don't believe one word so far except the LDT statement.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 03:01 AM
I still think both of them is Guilty as sin! LOL

LancelotLink
10-21-2011, 03:02 AM
Could DB be arrested solely on child neglect (drinking and blacking out)?

Pfft. She wishes...

partyuv5
10-21-2011, 03:02 AM
I could not agree with you more!

While I get there are cases that have been misconstrued. [B]Statistically, it almost as rare as the boogieman walking in our houses and taking our children with no evidence or lead! Obviously, with the media attention here... that did seem to be a problem. So WHY would a MOTHER, A GOOD MOTHER, not want the HIGHLY TRAINED, but very competent PROFESSIONALS she NEEDS TO RELY ON that have THE BEST chance at locating HER MISSING CHILD, HER DAUGHTER to seek out, and follow up in the case?

I always find it interesting when someone has a fear of being arrested if they haven't done anything wrong to be arrested for...

Neglect and Child Endangerment is certainly better than a murder conviction. Reasonable doubt worked in the Anthony case...Even worse... never seeing your child again. IMVHO At what point does DB not understand the public can be much more forgiving of a horrible consequence of poor decision making skill in parenting, rather than someone who acts in manners that inhibit/interfere in the ability to help LE locate her daughter alive?

Unless I am mistaken, DB never even really talked to local media... she went straight to the top?

David Westerfield did it. Absolutely no evidence in the house that he took Danielle VanDam.

I'm not saying I think DB has no knowledge of what happened to LI. I'm just saying it is possible to not leave a shred of evidence.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 03:05 AM
DB's choice of words has been interesting like the "Adult time" to even have those words come of your tongue is just out there for me. I raised 4 boys, two were 10 months apart and I have never thought that, or said things like that. I have said to my husband, I need a few hours break but never like she has.

Are other's out there that used that term?

partyuv5
10-21-2011, 03:05 AM
If your child has legitimately been taken from you, YOU NEVER TELL POLICE YOU NEED A BREAK FROM THEIR QUESTIONS

Maybe if you needed to go to the potty :) :crazy:

AngelWings444
10-21-2011, 03:05 AM
nobody knows I heard also that there was video of him at work. We haven't seen it, LE hasn't stated such, I haven't heard that LE made the statement this to be or even where this information came from. It was stated by the media.

They didn't say LE said they have video.

MK is the media. DB is the person who said she failed the LDT. While I believe she did fail, nothing is 100% in this case. Until LE arrests someone, speaks the facts of the case, I don't trust anyone, except LE. LE has not stated this as fact. I applaud LE for keeping things close to the vest. I hope and pray it helps them bring Lisa home. Again, I believe she did fail but I have been wrong. :crazy:

Lera213
10-21-2011, 03:07 AM
Maybe if you needed to go to the potty :) :crazy:

:floorlaugh:

Lera213
10-21-2011, 03:10 AM
I would like when a case goes to trial that every state has sunshine laws to go into effect once the trial date is set. Then we can get lots of doc dumps.

KCMommie
10-21-2011, 03:10 AM
They have already started with the defense. On Dr. Drew, he said he had spoken with a member of the family who said there was a history of abuse, achoholism, etc/ Now, keep in mind, he never said DB in particular, but the family has a history.

I feel the FBI knows what happened and the 17 hours yesterday was spent wisely. The fact that this story and the one fron Ft. Bragg are so simliar does not go unnoticed by me, so I can assure the FBI is on this.

The truth will come out soon.

Oh the Ft. Bragg case stunned me. I don't believe in coincidences.

There has been a direct link to dysfunction in DB's immediate family.

Can ANYONE tell me WHY only her "cousin" is showing up in press conferences with them? Out of the entire family, why is HE the only one standing with them? What does he have to do with this? This is bugging me. Is there something I have missed?

Whisperer
10-21-2011, 03:12 AM
I think some states only make you report the income of the mother or "family unit" so if the parents are not married then if the father works they may not take his income into account, (even though they should if he is contributing financially to the child!) so legally the mother is a "single parent" without a marriage license.

Have no clue about MO though.

JMO

She is not a single mother, she is married to an Enlisted Army Serviceman who is/was stationed overseas. He has been providing for at least DB and his boy if not Lisa. Lisa is legally his. Unless there was a stipulation (which I doubt) the Army is taking care of most of the family, if not all of them. I don't know how she would be able to get any kind of public assistance. When it comes to the Government and their hand-outs, nothing should surprise me...but in this case, I will be shocked if she manages to pull off more money from the Govt.

n4k
10-21-2011, 03:15 AM
DB's choice of words has been interesting like the "Adult time" to even have those words come of your tongue is just out there for me. I raised 4 boys, two were 10 months apart and I have never thought that, or said things like that. I have said to my husband, I need a few hours break but never like she has.

Are other's out there that used that term?

I'm with you, Lera. I would feel nothing short of guilt if I said that, BUT yes, it is a common line with today's parents. I have nieces close to DB's age who are awesome parents, but I've heard both of them refer to, "adult time" as if it something earned weekly or after the kids are asleep. I think some of it comes from SAHM's who do not get a break from kids or "adult" conversation.

lauriej
10-21-2011, 03:15 AM
DB admitted to the wine and also changed her timeline to 6:40 pm and said she never again checked on Lisa. That's not something she told LE in the beginning.

JMO

..she changed it up again in the "people mag" article---saying that she did check on her once.

http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20537543,00.html

"She put Lisa down in her room around 6:40 p.m., she says. Only once more soon afterward did she check on Lisa, finding her standing in her crib before tucking her back in."

LancelotLink
10-21-2011, 03:17 AM
Oh the Ft. Bragg case stunned me. I don't believe in coincidences.

There has been a direct link to dysfunction in DB's immediate family.

Can ANYONE tell me WHY only her "cousin" is showing up in press conferences with them? Out of the entire family, why is HE the only one standing with them? What does he have to do with this? This is bugging me. Is there something I have missed?

Who knows? He's a Marine? He just got back from Iraq? We must believe him? Manipulation?

KCMommie
10-21-2011, 03:19 AM
David Westerfield did it. Absolutely no evidence in the house that he took Danielle VanDam.

I'm not saying I think DB has no knowledge of what happened to LI. I'm just saying it is possible to not leave a shred of evidence.

Absolutely. I'm not psychic nor am I an all knowing God. I am truly humble to the fact that the boogie-man DOES and CAN happen. Believe it or not, I still have left myself open to the idea that someone took this child! It would be foolish not to keep that possibility open until hard evidence is in. Right now, I simply do not believe the parents are forthcoming and I have to ask why. All sorts of scenarios can fit that.

Problem is, statistics, evidence, and actions from these parents don't match the story their feeding us. Or should I say, stories. :(

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 03:21 AM
She is not a single mother, she is married to an Enlisted Army Serviceman who is/was stationed overseas. He has been providing for at least DB and his boy if not Lisa. Lisa is legally his. Unless there was a stipulation (which I doubt) the Army is taking care of most of the family, if not all of them. I don't know how she would be able to get any kind of public assistance. When it comes to the Government and their hand-outs, nothing should surprise me...but in this case, I will be shocked if she manages to pull off more money from the Govt.

I would think with DB's husband being in the Army she would have PX priviledges. I wonder if there is a PX near them. I'm sure she has a military ID. That would save money on groceries, diapers, and a lot of other things. You can buy just about anything at the PX.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 03:21 AM
She is not a single mother, she is married to an Enlisted Army Serviceman who is/was stationed overseas. He has been providing for at least DB and his boy if not Lisa. Lisa is legally his. Unless there was a stipulation (which I doubt) the Army is taking care of most of the family, if not all of them. I don't know how she would be able to get any kind of public assistance. When it comes to the Government and their hand-outs, nothing should surprise me...but in this case, I will be shocked if she manages to pull off more money from the Govt.

My first husband of 5 years was Military, I was pregnant with my second child with him. He left me in the on base housing, no phone, no car, no money and no food. When I called the commander know what he said? He said, you are lucky to be in the house. Unless there is a court order telling him he has to pay child support he might not however if she continually contacted his first sgt and complained they would call that GI in and read him the right act and he would be paying that child support.

When I started the divorce proceedings from my first hub, he was ordered to pay only $200.00 a month of which I never got. I only lived with him for 2 years when we separated. I still had my ID card, but no longer living on base. He however was collecting the family BAQ (basic allowance for quarters/housing) which he wasn't suppose to. His commander never forced him to pay that child support even after I hounded his first shirt. Of course this was way back when in early 80's.

Hopefully this helps. Not every case is the same but it does happen.

Most that go through a separation might have a non legal agreement like....I'll pay you this much a month, but we cannot get divorced because I need that married status pay in order to afford to pay and give you and the kids more. The wife usually will agree...that is done a lot! No way would anyone question or even DFAS (finance office) unless someone ratted him out, or he did something to bring it to their attention.

Again, Not every case is the same!

Dewey2Me1MoThyme
10-21-2011, 03:22 AM
First of all, there is a difference between blacked out and passed out. I can't see where under 10 glasses of wine causes a black out. A black out is when you are still awake but don't remember what you did. Passed out is sound asleep.

So by her saying she blacked out, who knows what she did.

JMO

Personally speaking, I've used the terms blacked out and passed out interchangably in my own life. I had a long day at wortk and came home and blacked out" I don't drink, but even when I did many years ago, i would say either blacked out or passed out as the same thing.

lauriej
10-21-2011, 03:22 AM
I would like when a case goes to trial that every state has sunshine laws to go into effect once the trial date is set. Then we can get lots of doc dumps.

..every state does have " (government in the) sunshine law" ( transparency in government ) , they just vary state to state----florida being the most liberal.

..i wished we would at least get the 911 call in this case-----but apparently missouri law prevents us from even hearing that.

marge_rita
10-21-2011, 03:23 AM
Search warrant....and I heard one of the reporters today from early on state something about them having a yard sale. Search warrant and I tried to see if the baby's room had carpet for Whisperer, but can only assume it did.

In the picture of the baby's room that's here on several threads, you can clearly see either carpet or a large rug in the nursery under the crib.

partyuv5
10-21-2011, 03:23 AM
This is why LE wanted all the video's from media because they wanted to see them leaving the house with possession they took out of the house. They know they took the phones with them when they left the house. With DB statement of not going back to the house, LE knew those phones were not there anymore. They had to check just in case instead of them taking them, they hid them better. Now they have to review all raw video and my bet is all video of them leaving the house with items in hand. Then a search warrant will be performed at all places they stayed at, and they will know what to look for. My guess is a toy or stuffed animal they put those phones in when the left the house.

Why would DB/JI leave the phones hidden in the house? If in fact he/she (they) discarded Baby Lisa, wouldn't they get rid of the phones too? On a local news cast it was reported that she does follow cases of the missing and always assumed the family was guilty but has changed her mind since it has happened to her. (i can search for link but it will take me forever, someone back me here)

My thought on requesting video is to see inconsistancies, body language, wording...etc.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 03:26 AM
Why would DB/JI leave the phones hidden in the house? If in fact he/she (they) discarded Baby Lisa, wouldn't they get rid of the phones too? On a local news cast it was reported that she does follow cases of the missing and always assumed the family was guilty but has changed her mind since it has happened to her. (i can search for link but it will take me forever, someone back me here)

My thought on requesting video is to see inconsistancies, body language, wording...etc.

It could be that also, Partyuv5. I was thinking what if it was a last minute thing with the cell phones..they had to hide it as he was calling 911. Where would you hide it that LE wouldn't look? In liquid, wine...then when coast is clear you take it with you. That was my speculating one scenario mind thinking.

lauriej
10-21-2011, 03:27 AM
My first husband of 5 years was Military, I was pregnant with my second child with him. He left me in the on base housing, no phone, no car, no money and no food. When I called the commander know what he said? He said, you are lucky to be in the house. Unless there is a court order telling him he has to pay child support he might not however if she continually contacted his first sgt and complained they would call that GI in and read him the right act and he would be paying that child support.



..according to the file--he was ordered to pay child support.

Family Support--

BRADLEY , DEBORAH LEE , Petitioner
16722 E 5TH ST N
INDEPENDENCE, MO 64056
Year of Birth: 1986

BRADLEY , SEAN MICHAEL , Respondent
1715 S ASH AVE
INDEPENDENCE, MO 64052
Year of Birth: 1985


12/04/2009
Judgment Entered
Child support in the amount of $206.00 per month and medical support beginning 02-15-2009.

marge_rita
10-21-2011, 03:27 AM
It makes more sense to believe she was drunk and put the baby down at 6:40and never checked on her again than to believe she put her down at 6:40 and never checked on her again and wasn't drunk! Lisa was sick. She would have needed checked on, changed, maybe a bottle.

So she was either drunk and negligent or just negligent.

How many of us as parents of sick babies know all too well how babies do not sleep hours at a time when they have a runny, stuffy, nose, cold thing going on! I am appalled the baby was never checked on IF that's the case.

Or------- is mom lying about that too? Did the baby even have a cold?

Every time I see baby Lisa's picture I want to scream...where is this baby?
I think more forceful means, legal means by LE, need to used on D.

partyuv5
10-21-2011, 03:27 AM
Absolutely. I'm not psychic nor am I an all knowing God. I am truly humble to the fact that the boogie-man DOES and CAN happen. Believe it or not, I still have left myself open to the idea that someone took this child! It would be foolish not to keep that possibility open until hard evidence is in. Right now, I simply do not believe the parents are forthcoming and I have to ask why. All sorts of scenarios can fit that.

Problem is, statistics, evidence, and actions from these parents don't match the story their feeding us. Or should I say, stories. :(

I agree completely. Maybe I watch too much ID (Investigative Discovery Channel), but she/he (they) look more guilty by the day.

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 03:29 AM
DB and her brother either know what happened to Lisa or they both passed out or went to sleep. I don't know which but Lisa is gone and someone needs to start talking and telling the truth. If Lisa were my baby I'd do whatever I could to find her and so would every mother I know.

I just don't understand DB at all..............

LancelotLink
10-21-2011, 03:29 AM
Absolutely. I'm not psychic nor am I an all knowing God. I am truly humble to the fact that the boogie-man DOES and CAN happen. Believe it or not, I still have left myself open to the idea that someone took this child! It would be foolish not to keep that possibility open until hard evidence is in. Right now, I simply do not believe the parents are forthcoming and I have to ask why. All sorts of scenarios can fit that.

Problem is, statistics, evidence, and actions from these parents don't match the story their feeding us. Or should I say, stories. :(

And, LE was on Westerfield pretty quickly.

marge_rita
10-21-2011, 03:30 AM
In the interview where DB admitted to being drunk I notice she reached for his hand and he didn't budge to take her hand. The camera stayed there for a while and you could see she laid her hand on top of his but he didn't budge.

I don't believe he was involved and I do believe he is heartbroken beyond belief. Totally in shock.

He appears to be in shock. He didn't take D's hand in that clip and he didn't hug her when she hugged him on another vid clip. I think he's heartbroken too. I think he knows his wife did something to and with their baby.

imo

Lera213
10-21-2011, 03:31 AM
..according to the file--he was ordered to pay child support.

Family Support--

BRADLEY , DEBORAH LEE , Petitioner
16722 E 5TH ST N
INDEPENDENCE, MO 64056
Year of Birth: 1986

BRADLEY , SEAN MICHAEL , Respondent
1715 S ASH AVE
INDEPENDENCE, MO 64052
Year of Birth: 1985


12/04/2009
Judgment Entered
Child support in the amount of $206.00 per month and medical support beginning 02-15-2009.

OH thank you! Yeah then he isn't getting the extra pay. The kids do have an ID card for medical and I'm betting DB has a limited ID card so she can come on base to take the children to the hospital and shopping for them. Limited to hospital and PX/Commissary only. That is usually normal.

marge_rita
10-21-2011, 03:32 AM
Could DB be arrested solely on child neglect (drinking and blacking out)?

From what I've been told by a family member who's LE, yes.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 03:33 AM
How many of us as parents of sick babies know all too well how babies do not sleep hours at a time when they have a runny, stuffy, nose, cold thing going on! I am appalled the baby was never checked on IF that's the case.

Or------- is mom lying about that too? Did the baby even have a cold?

Every time I see baby Lisa's picture I want to scream...where is this baby?
I think more forceful means, legal means by LE, need to used on D.

Right on you know what I think? Baby Lisa was cutting her molars, she might have had a runny nose because of teething. Still we don't know, but at Lisa's age isn't that the age to start cutting molars? Found that answer: The two front teeth (central incisors) in the upper jaw erupt between the ages of eight and 13 months.
The lateral incisors, which are the teeth on each side of the central incisors, erupt in both the upper and lower jaws between the ages of eight and 16 months. The lower set tends to erupt before the upper set.

LancelotLink
10-21-2011, 03:33 AM
Personally speaking, I've used the terms blacked out and passed out interchangably in my own life. I had a long day at wortk and came home and blacked out" I don't drink, but even when I did many years ago, i would say either blacked out or passed out as the same thing.

The interview, this one in particular showed me her lying skills. She left the person questioning her with just enough info to infer the rest, then just went along with it. She can always say later she was taken out of context...

marge_rita
10-21-2011, 03:34 AM
I had quoted a post a couple pages back that said basically, all they need now is to find the body. i'll go back and see if I can find the one I quoted.

" Chris Texas: I believe that they have found all kinds of crucial evidence. They just need a body now. "

I apologize, I misread your post. :blushing:

partyuv5
10-21-2011, 03:41 AM
I FEAR this. I truly see a mentally ill, didn't have the correct upbringing defense coming into play here.

I don't see how. No one saw this in the Anthony case either. This child is GONE. GONE! The last person to see her is the very person who was supposed to protect and care for this child; instead she neglected her. No doubt charges are coming...I am glad they got a warrant. If a jury hears this I'll be ticked if our LE does not have this case LOCKED DOWN before they move I just hope and pray every night we find Lisa alive. Maybe someone who realized that Lisa wasn't getting the care she needed and will drop her off at a church somewhere. Statistically, I know the chances are slim.

I have no idea what has been done with this child and I am so angry I could spit. Ive been warned by local law enforcement that I need to keep a watchful eye. I haven't lived in this part of the metro for very long, but my child is afraid someone is going to "come steal him" already, and if you look at the Offender registry for the KC Metro area it looks as if someone has been playing in the dippin' dots. Since this started, I've found myself checking to see if our doors/windows are locked, considering better locks.

How DARE someone emotionally blackmail us to further a cover up? Molest the very thing we all need to be watchful of? Desensitize us by crying wolf. I live a couple of miles away. I pray to God this woman is not manipulating.. I have for two weeks. It's not looking good.If they did this, I cannot imagine how the public will react, especially in the wake of the Anthony trial.

I guess this makes us neighbors. I'm about 2 miles from the "site" also. I can say that "north" of the river has had petty or little crime until the last few years. It's sad that crime has migrated north to us. But something like this is never anything I would have ever expected.

I became a member here on websleuths during the Danielle VanDam case and at that time I really started checking the doors and windows. My kids (young teens then) laughed saying "oh mom it will never happen to us or here." Ah...they are much older now and get it! It can happen anywhere. Now they double check the locks!

KCMommie
10-21-2011, 03:42 AM
The interview, this one in particular showed me her lying skills. She left the person questioning her with just enough info to infer the rest, then just went along with it. She can always say later she was taken out of context...

I believe if you do a bit of research on the RED FLAGS of narcissism, you will see clearly how this manipulation works. If you are not already aware. That is when my gut kicked in. I initially believed her. Subconsciously, I think I detected these signs within a couple of days...it bothered me so I started looking things up for myself....

I'd like to see the various public interviews lined up one after another with all the networks combined. I did a bit of research on this and THAT's when I realized the confusion .... it's been downhill ever since.

KCMommie
10-21-2011, 03:48 AM
I guess this makes us neighbors. I'm about 2 miles from the "site" also. I can say that "north" of the river has had petty or little crime until the last few years. It's sad that crime has migrated north to us. But something like this is never anything I would have ever expected.

I became a member here on websleuths during the Danielle VanDam case and at that time I really started checking the doors and windows. My kids (young teens then) laughed saying "oh mom it will never happen to us or here." Ah...they are much older now and get it! It can happen anywhere. Now they double check the locks!

I've been in the Northland since 1986, prior to that Johnson Co, KS. Actually, I lived and family lives much further North, but still in the NKC district. This Winnatonka area has had it's problems even back then, but recently you are right... it's even worse. I know there are good people left in that area, but it seems the older generation is starting to pass away and it is just becoming worse. The problems South of the river are trickling North. Sad. :(

marge_rita
10-21-2011, 03:54 AM
Right on you know what I think? Baby Lisa was cutting her molars, she might have had a runny nose because of teething. Still we don't know, but at Lisa's age isn't that the age to start cutting molars? Found that answer: The two front teeth (central incisors) in the upper jaw erupt between the ages of eight and 13 months.
The lateral incisors, which are the teeth on each side of the central incisors, erupt in both the upper and lower jaws between the ages of eight and 16 months. The lower set tends to erupt before the upper set.

You are right!!!!!!!!

cluciano63
10-21-2011, 03:56 AM
And, LE was on Westerfield pretty quickly.

As in the recent case in Canada...the "boogie man" existed, but he was a suspect very quickly. In this case, LE can't seem to make their way away from the family home and the parents.

Whisperer
10-21-2011, 04:00 AM
We sure are getting schooled in the studies of Narcissism. The term wasn't used much till about ten years ago. It was never seen in clinics. If you're a narcissist, you're perfect, no need to see a shrink.

Everyone once in awhile they show up in a clinic but it is always in regard to a problem with somebody else that needs fixing.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 04:01 AM
So they did a 17 hour search with no leaks yet. Wonder if the parents seen getting picked up was to be taken to the lawyers office because lawyers had gone to DA to try and learn what LE has so far, or maybe they even went right to LE office and offered the family to sit down and talk to them. Knowing full well the lawyers won't let them answer any questions but rather in hopes to figure out what they have by the questions they ask so the lawyers can be prepared for responses. Would this scenario be close to being a good speculation?

Lera213
10-21-2011, 04:04 AM
We sure are getting schooled in the studies of Narcissism. The term wasn't used much till about ten years ago. It was never seen in clinics. If you're a narcissist, you're perfect, no need to see a shrink.

Everyone once in awhile they show up in a clinic but it is always in regard to a problem with somebody else that needs fixing.

You know I never really read up on it. I knew some but just read a website and OMG my older son who is 35 years old has too many on the list. He isn't violent..omg what do I do, he is an adult? Are all Narcissus dangerous or can some just be overly nauseating?

Whisperer
10-21-2011, 04:05 AM
Isn't it sad that lawyers can prevent a baby from being located...they always tell the perps, "Don't talk to LE".. pitiful.

In this country, why is this allowed? I think defense of people hiding information about a child missing; telling them not to talk to LE, and providing fake leads should be stopped.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 04:08 AM
Isn't it sad that lawyers can prevent a baby from being located...they always tell the perps, "Don't talk to LE".. pitiful.

In this country, why is this allowed? I think defense of people hiding information about a child missing; telling them not to talk to LE, and providing fake leads should be stopped.

my big beef is lawyers who say "Don't tell me if you did it, I don't want to know" Bugs me. What happened to seeking the truth no matter if your client is guilty as heck and tells you he is, even tells you where to locate the body. The attorney would have to inform police right? They don't want to be put in that position so they say Don't tell me.

I understand the law in not incriminating yourself but I think it has been taken to a whole new level over the past 30 years.

Whisperer
10-21-2011, 04:12 AM
You know I never really read up on it. I knew some but just read a website and OMG my older son who is 35 years old has too many on the list. He isn't violent..omg what do I do, he is an adult? Are all Narcissus dangerous or can some just be overly nauseating?

There is nothing wrong with having a healthy dose of narcissism. When it is pathological in nature is when to worry. Thankfully, that doesn't happen often. Like every other personality disorder, there are variant degrees. A regular narcissist is just something you learn to deal with over time. Don't worry.

The kind we discuss on this board are the ones that have Borderline or Sociopathic tendencies. Many of us have met many narcissists and even married them and don't know it. They even manage to be in politics (I'm biting my lip here). So don't think because your son has some of the symptoms that he is dangerous.

When you look at personality disorders and their signs, you will think almost everyone you know has a PD...LOL.

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 04:15 AM
So they did a 17 hour search with no leaks yet. Wonder if the parents seen getting picked up was to be taken to the lawyers office because lawyers had gone to DA to try and learn what LE has so far, or maybe they even went right to LE office and offered the family to sit down and talk to them. Knowing full well the lawyers won't let them answer any questions but rather in hopes to figure out what they have by the questions they ask so the lawyers can be prepared for responses. Would this scenario be close to being a good speculation?

Maybe they just needed some adult time............:floorlaugh:

Lera213
10-21-2011, 04:16 AM
well my son has the traits except he does have empathy I know that.

partyuv5
10-21-2011, 04:16 AM
It could be that also, Partyuv5. I was thinking what if it was a last minute thing with the cell phones..they had to hide it as he was calling 911. Where would you hide it that LE wouldn't look? In liquid, wine...then when coast is clear you take it with you. That was my speculating one scenario mind thinking.

Perhaps. But I don't think it have ever been stated on what phone the 911 call came from. I thought it was from a neighbors phone. I could be mistaken.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 04:17 AM
Maybe they just needed some adult time............:floorlaugh:

Touche!!!!!!!!

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 04:17 AM
You know I never really read up on it. I knew some but just read a website and OMG my older son who is 35 years old has too many on the list. He isn't violent..omg what do I do, he is an adult? Are all Narcissus dangerous or can some just be overly nauseating?

Are you trying to tell us your son makes you sick? Most are just totally self-absorbed.......

Whisperer
10-21-2011, 04:18 AM
well my son has the traits except he does have empathy I know that.

I have never known a narcissist to have empathy. You are way ahead of the game..

.....they don't even grasp the concept. I'm talking pathological..

Lera213
10-21-2011, 04:20 AM
Perhaps. But I don't think it have ever been stated on what phone the 911 call came from. I thought it was from a neighbors phone. I could be mistaken.

This is very confusing because from the first time this case broke I was following it and I know I heard or thought I heard JI state that he went to the neighbor but they didn't answer, he came back and that is when they realized he had his work phone in the pocket. Then later on down, no mention of going to the neighbor. It had to have been in one of the first few interviews after the first presser with them I think. I haven't gone back to watch because frankly, I cannot stomach to listen to them anymore.

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 04:22 AM
Perhaps. But I don't think it have ever been stated on what phone the 911 call came from. I thought it was from a neighbors phone. I could be mistaken.

I believe they said it was on hubby's work phone. I believe they did say someone ran to the neighbors first.

partyuv5
10-21-2011, 04:23 AM
And, LE was on Westerfield pretty quickly.

And thank LE. I remember seeing that lil girls smeared handprint on the cabinet next to that mosters bed in the RV. May he rot in the worst places along with scott peterson.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 04:24 AM
I have never known a narcissist to have empathy. You are way ahead of the game..

.....they don't even grasp the concept. I'm talking pathological..

So my son is just an ***Wipe...lol

Whisperer
10-21-2011, 04:24 AM
I'm wondering if it was jeremy that called home at 2:23am that fateful morning. Maybe he tried to call DB to tell her he was on his way...

LE is convinced the phone/s were near the house when that call came in.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 04:26 AM
I'm wondering if it was jeremy that called home at 2:23am that fateful morning. Maybe he tried to call DB to tell her he was on his way...

LE is convinced the phone/s were near the house when that call came in.

Good theory!

Whisperer
10-21-2011, 04:30 AM
Did they find the wine box in the trash or in the house when LE searched?

Lera213
10-21-2011, 04:32 AM
don't know, Whisperer, that hasn't been reported. LE keeping everything close to their chest. My guess would be if LE has nothing they might leak something to get more leads but they are not.

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 04:37 AM
I hope after all that has been searched and x-rayed and removed they have something. Some kind of evidence to tell what has happened to Lisa.

Donjeta
10-21-2011, 04:41 AM
DB's choice of words has been interesting like the "Adult time" to even have those words come of your tongue is just out there for me. I raised 4 boys, two were 10 months apart and I have never thought that, or said things like that. I have said to my husband, I need a few hours break but never like she has.

Are other's out there that used that term?

I think of the time spent taking care of my children and acting otherwise responsible as my adult time. If I got plastered to the point I don't know what I've done it would be more like a regression time.

partyuv5
10-21-2011, 04:42 AM
I'm wondering about the 2:30 am call. I think I have only heard rumors. Was there actually a call at that time? I also heard that there was a text at that time from the DBs brother saying "are you ready."

If this is true..how was this know within a few days of the case?

Whisperer
10-21-2011, 04:42 AM
I shared an office with someone who killed her children. This case is hard for me because of some similarities, so I am not sure if I can't be biased. This young woman was also meticulous and clearly had some issues, like histrionics...and later to be found she had Bi-polar and was in psychosis. The table cleaning was a prelude.

...but the thing is she threw everything in the trash. I mean everything that was left on the conference table, including inmate records, etc. She would grab records and make them into a ball and put them in the trash w/o a care.

When the children were reported missing, she claimed abduction. A few days later, she was arrested, and sure enough the children's remains were in the trash. I kept thinking that..only because that was her behavior and her M.O. on a daily basis. Once a perp is profiled, it is much easier to take a good guess due to the behavior and their comfort levels. She wanted everything clean, regardless of its importance. That table had to be immaculate. AS she was with the obsession with the table, she was the same with the two children. When she was done, they went in the trash. She committed suicide in her cell.

It is hard for me to separate this experience from DB. I should be able to do so, but it keeps haunting me. I guess if I didn't see how tidy Db kept that house, I wouldn't think of the experience that I had with my team member.

partyuv5
10-21-2011, 04:45 AM
I think of the time spent taking care of my children and acting otherwise responsible as my adult time. If I got plastered to the point I don't know what I've done it would be more like a regression time.

Agreed

Lera213
10-21-2011, 04:50 AM
I think of the time spent taking care of my children and acting otherwise responsible as my adult time. If I got plastered to the point I don't know what I've done it would be more like a regression time.

you use the term "Adult time" though?

Lera213
10-21-2011, 04:51 AM
I'm wondering about the 2:30 am call. I think I have only heard rumors. Was there actually a call at that time? I also heard that there was a text at that time from the DBs brother saying "are you ready."

If this is true..how was this know within a few days of the case?

It was asked by a reporter to LE and LE wouldn't comment.

The last part was posted on a comment portion below an article on a media website. If I recall the person who posted it had a screen name with the MB, Michael Bradley. No wait, I think I'm wrong, the MB screen name on the comment section said something else instead. It said something like there was more things taken then just Lisa. This was before the public knew about the cell phones too.

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 05:02 AM
We are just about to need a new thread. I hope and pray they find Lisa today and our next thread will be a good one. I just keep hoping and praying!

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 05:08 AM
Can I post an article on this thread? I'll do it and if its in the wrong place I'll remove it. How's that?

Lisa Irwin spotlight seekers may soon lose interest

http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/20/3219848/lisa-irwin-spotlight-seekers-may.html

Dewey2Me1MoThyme
10-21-2011, 05:19 AM
Can I post an article on this thread? I'll do it and if its in the wrong place I'll remove it. How's that?

Lisa Irwin spotlight seekers may soon lose interest

http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/20/3219848/lisa-irwin-spotlight-seekers-may.html

There's alot of truth there.

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 05:22 AM
There's alot of truth there.

Sad but true!

Donjeta
10-21-2011, 05:25 AM
Did DB pay for the wine separately? I didn't know that. I do know the food stamps and welfare is speculation, but I haven't heard the other items were purchased separate from the wine.

Can I buy a clue? :floorlaugh:

The cash clerk was on Nancy Grace and she said DB made two separate purchases. There is a thread about the show here somewhere.

Donjeta
10-21-2011, 05:36 AM
you use the term "Adult time" though?

Not in conversation. At least I don't think I have.

GourmetSoy
10-21-2011, 05:41 AM
"O’Brien, a law professor who briefly represented the couple during the Oct. 8 interview, said Bradley and Irwin’s strained relationship with police stems, in part, from investigators’ pursuit of them as suspects. Police also have not kept the family informed about the search for Lisa, which has been a strain on the family, he said."

“They read the newspaper to hear about progress in the investigation,” O’Brien said.

(snipped from later in article:......)

"The couple also receives five or six calls a day from investigators, said Short, who estimated that Bradley and Irwin each have spent about 40 hours answering police questions since Lisa disappeared."


If they are getting 5-6 calls a day from investigators then why aren't THEY asking questions about investigation progress? They are whining that investigators aren't keeping them informed but they talk to them 5-6 times per day? It says they "receive 5 or 6 calls" are the parents refusing to talk to them?




http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/20/3220223/baby-lisas-lawyers-say-police.html

~n/t~
10-21-2011, 05:42 AM
Can I post an article on this thread? I'll do it and if its in the wrong place I'll remove it. How's that?

Lisa Irwin spotlight seekers may soon lose interest

http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/20/3219848/lisa-irwin-spotlight-seekers-may.html

Thanks for posting that. This is so true. If the parents are truly innocent, I hope they realize this:


Kansas City’s police and community will be there for baby Lisa when the spotlight fades and the opportunists depart.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 05:43 AM
10:20 PM Oct 4 Look for that date in the comment section with the name ML no mb
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15611288/authorities-intensify-search-for-missing-baby?redirected=true

This was the first mention before anyone knew that something else was missing. We didn't know what the other missing thing was until later.

trying to locate the 2:30 now for you

~n/t~
10-21-2011, 05:52 AM
O’Brien, a law professor who briefly represented the couple during the Oct. 8 interview, said Bradley and Irwin’s strained relationship with police stems, in part, from investigators’ pursuit of them as suspects. Police also have not kept the family informed about the search for Lisa, which has been a strain on the family, he said.

“They read the newspaper to hear about progress in the investigation,” O’Brien said.

(snipped from later in article:......)

"The couple also receives five or six calls a day from investigators, said Short, who estimated that Bradley and Irwin each have spent about 40 hours answering police questions since Lisa disappeared."


If they are getting 5-6 calls a day from investigators then why aren't THEY asking questions about investigation progress? They are whining that investigators aren't keeping them informed but they talk to them 5-6 times per day? It says they "receive 5 or 6 calls" are the parents refusing to talk to them?




http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/20/3220223/baby-lisas-lawyers-say-police.html

Maybe they do ask. I know in other cases, family members get frustrated because LE doesn't tell them much.

At this point LE should be dealing with their attorney.

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 05:53 AM
"O’Brien, a law professor who briefly represented the couple during the Oct. 8 interview, said Bradley and Irwin’s strained relationship with police stems, in part, from investigators’ pursuit of them as suspects. Police also have not kept the family informed about the search for Lisa, which has been a strain on the family, he said."

“They read the newspaper to hear about progress in the investigation,” O’Brien said.

(snipped from later in article:......)

"The couple also receives five or six calls a day from investigators, said Short, who estimated that Bradley and Irwin each have spent about 40 hours answering police questions since Lisa disappeared."


If they are getting 5-6 calls a day from investigators then why aren't THEY asking questions about investigation progress? They are whining that investigators aren't keeping them informed but they talk to them 5-6 times per day? It says they "receive 5 or 6 calls" are the parents refusing to talk to them?




http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/20/3220223/baby-lisas-lawyers-say-police.html



They've spent 40 hours answering police questions. If they were working full time they would have spent 136 hours working. BIG DEAL! She's been gone for 17 days.

Are they out putting up posters, going to services, talking to people, searching and trying to find their daughter?

LE never tells the family everything. Just look at all the cases here on WS. I'm sure it is frustrating but that wouldn't stop me from doing everything I could do to find my little girl.

They need to think about her instead of themselves. Unless of course they already know the answers..................jmo

Lera213
10-21-2011, 06:05 AM
on the 2:30 call the search function isn't nice looking for numbers. LOL

I could only find this until I got frustrated and stopped.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - MO - AMBER ALERT: Lisa Irwin, 10 months, Kansas City, 4 Oct 2011 - #5

Lera213
10-21-2011, 06:13 AM
Short said she and the couple are weighing a request from police for a new interview with detectives and are considering the terms under which they might agree.

Read more: http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/20/3220223/baby-lisas-lawyers-say-police.html#ixzz1bPSzSy2khttp://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/20/3220223/baby-lisas-lawyers-say-police.html


I called it tonight. The lawyers are doing this only to learn what LE will ask them so they can get a clue in what evidence LE has on them!

If I were KC police I would arrest DB right now on charges of child neglect, child endangerment.

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 06:19 AM
http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/20/3220223/baby-lisas-lawyers-say-police.html


I called it tonight. The lawyers are doing this only to learn what LE will ask them so they can get a clue in what evidence LE has on them!

If I were KC police I would arrest DB right now on charges of child neglect, child endangerment.

This is beginning to sound like the Powells......do they want to be paid to talk to LE too? :banghead:

Lera213
10-21-2011, 06:20 AM
Too bad the DA cannot call LDB and JA to come in and give them some pointers. lol

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 06:21 AM
If JL has any sense he'll kick DB to the curb and start doing whatever it takes to find his little girl before DB takes him down with her.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 06:23 AM
innocence project? Really how do they know they are innocent, when Lisa hasn't even been found yet. This organisation started out with good intentions but of course big donations from groups I bet has now turned them into hungry attention seekers to get more dollars

Lera213
10-21-2011, 06:25 AM
JeannieC fix my post will you, my words are really coming out bad. I'm tired now.

Donjeta
10-21-2011, 06:28 AM
I think they're pulling these 40 hours out of their hat. Just on Tuesday on Today show it was only 13 hours per parent according to Tacopina.


Today's Friday. I suppose it's possible they've both spent 27 hours on the phone answering questions since Tuesday but I doubt it.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 06:29 AM
I think they're pulling these 40 hours out of their hat. Just on Tuesday on Today show it was only 13 hours per parent according to Tacopina.


Today's Friday. I suppose it's possible they've both spent 27 hours on the phone answering questions since Tuesday but I doubt it.

They are counting all the times DB and JI hung up too.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 06:30 AM
you know what, them coming out like this tells me, that they know LE has something big on them...maybe they know an arrest is coming quick and they want to try and persuade the jury pool quick.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 06:31 AM
LE maybe hit the mother load in the warrant search of the house!

GourmetSoy
10-21-2011, 06:32 AM
The family was particularly perplexed by the need for investigators to obtain a warrant to search the family home on Wednesday. Weeks ago, Short said, Bradley and Irwin gave police permission to do anything they wanted at the house.

Short said she was told that officers wanted to use “more invasive procedures” at the house. Media reports had investigators hauling off carpet and using a portable X-ray machine to study the walls.

“There was no reason to use the search warrants,” Short said. “The only reason they did it was to isolate (Bradley and Irwin) and present an image in the community that was unfair and inaccurate.”


http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/20/3220223/baby-lisas-lawyers-say-police.html#ixzz1bPXQuu2E

She knows full well why a search warrant was needed and is trying to twist it in the media.

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 06:32 AM
JeannieC fix my post will you, my words are really coming out bad. I'm tired now.

:floorlaugh:

Lera213
10-21-2011, 06:33 AM
“We’re talking about sitting down with our detectives separately … to learn the things that only the adults, only the parents of this child, might know,” Young said.

Read more: http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/20/3220223/baby-lisas-lawyers-say-police.html#ixzz1bPY7GYkeinteresting...wonder what those questions are?

Lera213
10-21-2011, 06:34 AM
Arrest soon me thinks!

GourmetSoy
10-21-2011, 06:36 AM
"Short said she and the couple are weighing a request from police for a new interview with detectives and are considering the terms under which they might agree."

http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/20/3220223/baby-lisas-lawyers-say-police.html#ixzz1bPYD8P5n

Weighing a request? Your daughter is missing now for 17 days and you have to weigh a request and consider terms under which you might agree?

Lera213
10-21-2011, 06:37 AM
We all know if LE didn't get a search warrant those lawyers would be screaming at the top of their lungs and throwing all evidence out when this goes to court.

~n/t~
10-21-2011, 06:38 AM
"Short said she and the couple are weighing a request from police for a new interview with detectives and are considering the terms under which they might agree."

http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/20/3220223/baby-lisas-lawyers-say-police.html#ixzz1bPYD8P5n

Weighing a request? Your daughter is missing now for 17 days and you have to weigh a request and consider terms under which you might agree?

Sounds like a possible plea deal to me.

GourmetSoy
10-21-2011, 06:39 AM
interesting...wonder what those questions are?

IMO, they want to sit down with them seperately to see if their stories match. I have yet to hear they have been talked to seperately, always been together as far as I know. I think that LE thinks JI knows more than he's said.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 06:40 AM
http://i935.photobucket.com/albums/ad195/graphicmix/Animations/Dexter%20S01E01%20Animated%20GIFs/Post%204%20of%204/Smile2.gif

Donjeta
10-21-2011, 06:40 AM
"Short said she and the couple are weighing a request from police for a new interview with detectives and are considering the terms under which they might agree."

http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/20/3220223/baby-lisas-lawyers-say-police.html#ixzz1bPYD8P5n

Weighing a request? Your daughter is missing now for 17 days and you have to weigh a request and consider terms under which you might agree?

Well it kinda gives the lie to Joe Tacopina saying the police need only say what they need and they shall receive (or words to that effect).

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 06:41 AM
"Short said she and the couple are weighing a request from police for a new interview with detectives and are considering the terms under which they might agree."

http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/20/3220223/baby-lisas-lawyers-say-police.html#ixzz1bPYD8P5n

Weighing a request? Your daughter is missing now for 17 days and you have to weigh a request and consider terms under which you might agree?

Exactly...........Powells all over again!

GourmetSoy
10-21-2011, 06:41 AM
Sounds like a possible plea deal to me.

I hadn't even considered that!

Lera213
10-21-2011, 06:41 AM
Sounds like a possible plea deal to me.

I think it is more like: They tell us where Lisa is and we won't go for the DP.

~n/t~
10-21-2011, 06:42 AM
Arrest soon me thinks!

Let's hope they have enough evidence before they do. Lisa hasn't been found yet.

GourmetSoy
10-21-2011, 06:43 AM
http://i935.photobucket.com/albums/ad195/graphicmix/Animations/Dexter%20S01E01%20Animated%20GIFs/Post%204%20of%204/Smile2.gif

Love Dexter:) Thx!

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 06:43 AM
Well it kinda gives the lie to Joe Tacopina saying the police need only say what they need and they shall receive (or words to that effect).

They are hurting themselves and not thinking about Lisa at all! Kinda makes you wonder why not!

Lera213
10-21-2011, 06:44 AM
Let's hope they have enough evidence before they do. Lisa hasn't been found yet.

They have enough to arrest her for Child endangerment and Child Neglect. She admitted she was drunk and possibly black out, and also last check on her was at 6:40 pm.

~n/t~
10-21-2011, 06:44 AM
I think it is more like: They tell us where Lisa is and we won't go for the DP.

LOL...that's what a plea deal is. The suspect (s) tell where the body is or confess and they make a deal. :)

Lera213
10-21-2011, 06:48 AM
Love Dexter:) Thx!

Found this one you can use for avatar.. click on picture and save to your pc

http://img246.imageshack.us/img246/4603/dexter1pl6.gif

Lera213
10-21-2011, 06:48 AM
LOL...that's what a plea deal is. The suspect (s) tell where the body is or confess and they make a deal. :)

Hush, I'm tired...LOL I knew that right after I typed it but too dang lazy to fix. Just go with it for me. :floorlaugh:

marge_rita
10-21-2011, 06:49 AM
]"Short said she and the couple are weighing a request from police for a new interview with detectives and are considering the terms under which they might agree[/B]."

http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/20/3220223/baby-lisas-lawyers-say-police.html#ixzz1bPYD8P5n

Weighing a request? Your daughter is missing now for 17 days and you have to weigh a request and consider terms under which you might agree?

bbm
OMG it's the Ramsey's part deux. :floorlaugh:

~n/t~
10-21-2011, 06:49 AM
They have enough to arrest her for Child endangerment and Child Neglect. She admitted she was drunk and possibly black out, and also last check on her was at 6:40 pm.

Yes possibly but arresting her for that can turn against them unless they find Lisa.

Cummings case, Skelton case.....all possibly involved with the disappearance of their children but are not charged with murder. Children still missing. None are talking.

GourmetSoy
10-21-2011, 06:50 AM
They have enough to arrest her for Child endangerment and Child Neglect. She admitted she was drunk and possibly black out, and also last check on her was at 6:40 pm.

I don't look for an arrest yet, at least not until the have time to go over any evidence they found in the search of the house. They are going to want as much as they can get. IMO.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 06:51 AM
not only are the criminals learning from past court crimes but so are the attorney's. Lets see if we combine the JB, CA, blah blah blah case then we will win. *rolls eyes* its making me ill.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 06:54 AM
My husband will have to handcuff me to my chair if a case like this ever happened in my hood for I would be on the sidewalk giving them all kinds of heck and getting arrested, but WS'ers would be getting a lot of pictures, well until I hit the slammer.

marge_rita
10-21-2011, 06:54 AM
Police spokesman Young responded that the last time the couple consented to an "unrestricted" interview was Oct. 8.
"What we need from them, and what we are not getting, is for them to sit down with our detectives and get answers to the questions we need answered," Young said.

Read more: http://www.kansas.com/2011/10/21/2070823/parents-lawyers-say-police-pushed.html#ixzz1bPdlSj23

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 06:56 AM
I believe if they could talk to the parents separately, JL would talk. I don't think DB ever will. JL is having a harder time with this and he knows even if she had lied to him he knows.

Lera213
10-21-2011, 06:56 AM
I hope DB is haunted every time she blinks, and I hope it eats her inside out.

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 07:00 AM
I hope DB is haunted every time she blinks, and I hope it eats her inside out.

I think JL is the weakest link, so to speak. He feels this more than DB. imo Get her away from him and he'll break. Crumble like a cracker, melt like ice cream, be putty in LE's hands............ :great::floorlaugh:

Lera213
10-21-2011, 07:00 AM
I think JL is the weakest link, so to speak. He feels this more than DB. imo Get her away from him and he'll break. Crumble like a cracker, melt like ice cream, be putty in LE's hands............ :great::floorlaugh:

Yeah body language experts have said he looks down a lot and that shows "Shame"

Lera213
10-21-2011, 07:02 AM
OT:

It is time for bed 7am...guess I wake up at 2pm. JeannieC, call me if something big happens, KK

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 07:06 AM
OT:

It is time for bed 7am...guess I wake up at 2pm. JeannieC, call me if something big happens, KK

I hope something does happen. I hope and pray they find Lisa today and I honestly hope she's alive but my hope is dwindling. The longer she is gone the less likely she is alive.

Where is this baby?

TobyWong*
10-21-2011, 07:18 AM
not only are the criminals learning from past court crimes but so are the attorney's. Lets see if we combine the JB, CA, blah blah blah case then we will win. *rolls eyes* its making me ill.

I know right?
I can't fathom trying to pull something like this off. I can't even imagine accidentaly harming my child and then make it look like an abduction.


I swear you can see the dollar signs spinning over the tops of their (& their lawyers) heads. And for me, I have to believe their whole family was sold on "oh poor mom had an accident and there's no fixin' what happened to Lisa buuutt.. we can turn this into a good thng, if you all just go along w/ us" Otherwise why are we not seeing any relative of Lisa's out there searching like a normal person does when a loved one goes missing? Why did they agree to do that thing w/ BS and put a poster up on the tree? They must talk amongst themselves. imo

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 07:23 AM
Poor little Lisa. She couldn't count on her Momma to keep her safe and she can't count on her Momma to help find her now. Or any of her family for that matter. Makes me sick!

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 07:26 AM
If these two are innocent I hope and pray they will put their own feelings aside and think of Lisa. Do whatever it takes to help find her. If they are quilty, I hope LE proves it beyond a shadow of a doubt.................moo

josie1986
10-21-2011, 07:30 AM
Poor little Lisa. She couldn't count on her Momma to keep her safe and she can't count on her Momma to help find her now. Or any of her family for that matter. Makes me sick!

ur mums the one person thats meant to be there no matter what,i just feel that this isn't the case here.

was there anything said if lisa was planned or just happened? i struggled for a week or 2 once my 2nd was born was just a big shock to my system but i would never had thought of hurting her or giving her away.i was lucky i had my family and friends to help me out plus there is help out there for anyone that feels like they are struggling JMO

JeannieC
10-21-2011, 07:39 AM
ur mums the one person thats meant to be there no matter what,i just feel that this isn't the case here.

was there anything said if lisa was planned or just happened? i struggled for a week or 2 once my 2nd was born was just a big shock to my system but i would never had thought of hurting her or giving her away.i was lucky i had my family and friends to help me out plus there is help out there for anyone that feels like they are struggling JMO

I don't think it has been mentioned whether Lisa was planned. I doubt it since they weren't married and Db was divorced. Just a guess on my part. I just hope JL opens up.

Db said this morning on the Today show that this has brought her and JL closer. I can see that if they are both innocent. If not it will break them apart. moo

~n/t~
10-21-2011, 08:02 AM
I don't think it has been mentioned whether Lisa was planned. I doubt it since they weren't married and Db was divorced. Just a guess on my part. I just hope JL opens up.

Db said this morning on the Today show that this has brought her and JL closer. I can see that if they are both innocent. If not it will break them apart. moo

Jeannie, do you mean JI? Jeremy? If not, who is JL?

Buterflytat
10-21-2011, 08:15 AM
I haven't followed this thread as much as the Aliayah thread; so correct me if I am wrong on any points. I noticed as other here have that DB seems to be controlling the interviews and she seems to talk for JL. I remember it being mentioned that DB said that she had watched these kind of cases before and that she thought the parents were involved as well; until it happened to them. What I don't understand is if you watched these programs, you would know that there are cameras everywhere; especially in stores. You would know that you would be on camera buying wine. Why wouldn't you tell LE from the beginning about that??? It almost seems as if she wanted them to catch her on camera; so she would have an excuse not to tell. In my opinion, I think she is using the wine and drinking to build some kind of defense. When was the last time anyone [B]besides[B] the parents saw baby Lisa???What mother would not check on her baby, even if she had a few drinks?? If she blacked out, how would she remember anything. There are too many questions and red flags. Also, when has anyone taken cell phones, when they have taken a child? I don't know of any case where that has happened.

Mountain_Kat
10-21-2011, 08:19 AM
The day LE got the warrant to search the house, they searched the wooded area off of N Brighton. Several WSers commented that they saw LE put something into a paper evidence bag at this search (I didn't see it, personally). The next day, when we heard about the search warrant for the house, many of us commented that LE must have found something in the woods the day before that lead them to get a warrant for the house.

In an abc news report, Brad Garrett remarked that LE must have found something recently that they took to a judge, in order for a judge to sign off on LE going back into the house.

I found that interesting.

ETA: 1:17 mark

http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-17-hour-search-family-home/story?id=14779537

cachmo
10-21-2011, 08:20 AM
Found this one you can use for avatar.. click on picture and save to your pc

http://img246.imageshack.us/img246/4603/dexter1pl6.gif

ok complete OT but how do you get a picture or avatar to WS. I hate being "faceless"

frankie069
10-21-2011, 08:33 AM
you use the term "Adult time" though?

I was a single parent for many years, I didnt get re-married until my children were really grown. So for like 10 years i did it by myself. I did have family to help me but I was really on my own (thanks to my dad who helped me a great deal) but I used to tell my kids at times, that "Mom needs some time to herself for a little while" and I would lock myself in my room if I had to a read or take a hot bath. On the rare occasion that I did go out and my oldest was of age to watch the other 2, I never went far from home and I always had a phone with me that they could contact me or even if I didnt the person I was with would have a phone and I would call and check on them.

How you have and how you handle this so called "adult time" is where you separate the parent from the non parent JMO. I mean dont get me wrong, there were times when I was with my first husband (the father of my children) that we would get drunk, on New Years Eve maybe (or a wedding, holiday party, always on special occasion, not just for the hell of it, we werent like that) but one of us would always stop drinking hours before we had to return to take care of the kids. And yes, we would take turns with this.

I dont know I just woke up and this whole thing upsets me. I wake up in the morning and keep hoping overnight they found Lisa and I am waking up to good news, and unfortunately good news now means finding a body so she can come home and we can proceed with prosecuting the person responsible. I hold out no hope that she is alive after all this time. I cannot see that being possible. Even if this was a kidnapping, with all the heat out there, the person would have gotten rid of this baby by now (sick bastards out there). I just wish someone would come clean and say where the heck this poor baby is.. PS.. A very Good Morning all...

essies
10-21-2011, 08:39 AM
ok complete OT but how do you get a picture or avatar to WS. I hate being "faceless"

Save your avatar to your computer and then click on your personal messages. That will take you to the page where on the left side you click on edit avatar. You can choose one from WS gallery or browse your computer for one. I find alot from photobucket that I save to my computer-happy hunting!!:seeya:

CarrieBean
10-21-2011, 08:47 AM
I see some of my posts from last night were taken way out of context.

I never stated I thought LE here is incompetent (the "professionals are not always competent" statement wasn't even referring to LE).

If anyone who responded wants to go back and figure it out, that's up to you, but I don't appreciate my words being twisted into something they're not.

Mamabear1963
10-21-2011, 09:03 AM
I have been reading, trying to catch up with this case...and with you all and I have noticed we are all feeling cagey...a bit frustrated with the situation. I feel we all need some type "adult" time to be able to come back refreshed and ready to look at things from a different perspective

nursebeeme
10-21-2011, 09:12 AM
Police executed a search warrant of the family home Wednesday. They have 10 days to make the findings public.

Read more: http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/news/region_missouri/northland/search-for-lisa-irwin-reaches-day-18#ixzz1bQFTCn9X

----------

Cazzie
10-21-2011, 09:17 AM
Police executed a search warrant of the family home Wednesday. They have 10 days to make the findings public.

Read more: http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/new...#ixzz1bQFTCn9X (http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/news/region_missouri/northland/search-for-lisa-irwin-reaches-day-18#ixzz1bQFTCn9X)
Any experts here that can tell us what kinds of tests take longer than 10 days?

From reading other cases, DNA tests on bones/fragments can take longer...altho some delays can be explained by backlogging at labs...yet sometimes cases can be "bumped" in priority, IINM...

Is this case likely to be "bumped" at the lab(s)?

TIA...

Sandfordfan
10-21-2011, 09:17 AM
I apologize if someone else has already posted this. But did anyone watch Michael Baden on Fox and Friends this am? His theory is that DB brought Lisa in bed with her and accidentally smothered her(due to drunkeness, of course). It's possible and happens with infants sometimes. But wouldn't Lisa have cried out first if her rather well padded mother rolled on top of her?

nursebeeme
10-21-2011, 09:19 AM
Any experts here that can tell us what kinds of tests take longer than 10 days?

From reading other cases, DNA tests on bones/fragments can take longer...altho some delays can be explained by backlogging at labs...yet sometimes cases can be "bumped" in priority, IINM...

Is this case likely to be "bumped" at the lab(s)?

TIA...

Missouri has a sunshine law
http://ago.mo.gov/sunshinelaw/sunshinelaw.htm

eta: it would most likely be the search warrant documents that would be released in ten days (unless they get a judge to seal it) MOO

kljohnson0458
10-21-2011, 09:21 AM
What if the police have found nothing of real evidentuary value and still wait the 10 days to tell us well, we didn't find anything? How would you feel?

nursebeeme
10-21-2011, 09:25 AM
What if the police have found nothing of real evidentuary value and still wait the 10 days to tell us well, we didn't find anything? How would you feel?

I don't believe we will know *what* they found (beit something or nothing) only the warrant information :twocents:

they could also go to a judge to ask for it to be sealed as well.. I guess time will tell:twocents:

Mountain_Kat
10-21-2011, 09:41 AM
I don't believe we will know *what* they found (beit something or nothing) only the warrant information :twocents:

they could also go to a judge to ask for it to be sealed as well.. I guess time will tell:twocents:

We won't know what they think about what they found, but we will know what LE took that they felt might be of interest in this case. Sometimes you can piece things together from that, and sometimes you can't. In the Zahra Baker case, for instance, I still don't know what that "little piece of plastic" LE took into evidence was, or how it related to anything. But I sure can tell you why they took a section of her bedroom wall and several cans of paint.

kljohnson0458
10-21-2011, 09:42 AM
I don't believe we will know *what* they found (beit something or nothing) only the warrant information :twocents:

they could also go to a judge to ask for it to be sealed as well.. I guess time will tell:twocents:

I hate to think that would be the outcome because then we'll all go batty. :crazy: There are awesome sleuthers here so if a SW copy becomes available we'll see it. :)

Codger
10-21-2011, 09:45 AM
I big part of me is glad that no information has leaked out about the search, even though I'm so eager to learn, I also know the more I don't know the better for a conviction and to find Lisa.

It just drives me nuts not to know. Its like watching a glass fall off the counter but you cannot catch it in time.

I totally agree, but it's driving me batspit! :banghead:

We can speculate + theorize til the cows come home, but we could surely be much more on point if we had a crumb or two. I'm rather amazed at how well LE has kept their yap shut, meaning no fool has leaked anything. 3 cheers to them for that! I'm going to cite them on my request for anti-anxiety meds. :crazy:

I ass-ume from the searches + re-searching some areas + what we've been shown to be their focus (who knows what else they're doing or where else they're looking), that they most certainly have some evidence, some of it being quite strong. I can't imagine they'd go about this in the manner they have, without such evidence. I also ass-ume some piece of this evidence was clear to them at the very beginning. Now which one of you fine ladies is going to butter up the Capt. Cutie as he's been tagged here? :innocent:

All the above, always, JMO + MOO.

zpz1
10-21-2011, 09:49 AM
In an interview, didn't the mother change her timeline and say that she saw the baby at 10:30-she went in the room and Lisa was standing in her crib so she laid her back down and covered her up? "If" something happened to the baby in the home, I just wonder if this has to do with anything (or will be used as an explanation/cover-story)... IMO

annalia
10-21-2011, 09:59 AM
I apologize if someone else has already posted this. But did anyone watch Michael Baden on Fox and Friends this am? His theory is that DB brought Lisa in bed with her and accidentally smothered her(due to drunkeness, of course). It's possible and happens with infants sometimes. But wouldn't Lisa have cried out first if her rather well padded mother rolled on top of her?

my bolding

It's a horrible thought but if Lisa was being smothered from DB's body she probably wasn't able to cry out.

JMHO

KCMommie
10-21-2011, 10:03 AM
KMBC just reported a man witnessed another man carrying a baby the night (4 am) Lisa went missing. He's shown in an interview there. I pray to GOD she's still alive.

http://www.kmbc.com/news/29547997/detail.html

Did anyone figure out why they discounted the woman's story about seeing a man walking down the street with a baby? Her husband told her to contact police and she felt regretful that she did not? I remember seeing footage of this.

LancelotLink
10-21-2011, 10:17 AM
The family was particularly perplexed by the need for investigators to obtain a warrant to search the family home on Wednesday. Weeks ago, Short said, Bradley and Irwin gave police permission to do anything they wanted at the house.

Short said she was told that officers wanted to use “more invasive procedures” at the house. Media reports had investigators hauling off carpet and using a portable X-ray machine to study the walls.

“There was no reason to use the search warrants,” Short said. “The only reason they did it was to isolate (Bradley and Irwin) and present an image in the community that was unfair and inaccurate.”


http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/20/3220223/baby-lisas-lawyers-say-police.html#ixzz1bPXQuu2E

She knows full well why a search warrant was needed and is trying to twist it in the media.

I agree. Sounds like LE is through playing their games.

Codger
10-21-2011, 10:59 AM
KMBC just reported a man witnessed another man carrying a baby the night (4 am) Lisa went missing. He's shown in an interview there. I pray to GOD she's still alive.

http://www.kmbc.com/news/29547997/detail.html

Did anyone figure out why they discounted the woman's story about seeing a man walking down the street with a baby? Her husband told her to contact police and she felt regretful that she did not? I remember seeing footage of this.
Interesting... can anyone please help the geographically challenged Codger + lead me to this area on the map with all the other searches + so forth marked? I tried, I really did, but I can't seem to pinpoint either street he mentioned, which I believe were Randolph + NE 48th? Is this near any of the other areas LE has looked at or searched thus far? TIA if anyone can help.

ETA - Here's the link for the map with the other areas marked. Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Maps and pictures of the area

New1
10-21-2011, 11:03 AM
I apologize if someone else has already posted this. But did anyone watch Michael Baden on Fox and Friends this am? His theory is that DB brought Lisa in bed with her and accidentally smothered her(due to drunkeness, of course). It's possible and happens with infants sometimes. But wouldn't Lisa have cried out first if her rather well padded mother rolled on top of her?

She might have, but if her mother was that drunk, it probably wouldn't wake her, especially if her cries were muffled by the weight of her mother's body. I guess it depends on what position the baby was sleeping in whether or not she could cry out loud enough to awaken her passed-out mother. I agree with this theory.

cachmo
10-21-2011, 11:08 AM
This is day 2 of no known searches (yet). Before the warrant to search the home was served they were searching daily and IMO searching hard. Now nothing. does this stick out to anyone else?

HatesSociopaths
10-21-2011, 11:10 AM
Defense attorneys sure are brazen. God forbid one of their children ever goes missing. LE has done an outstanding job. My guess is they have spent well over six figures on this investigation already. Hundreds of searchers parking their normal duties to look for Lisa. All because of one person refusing to own up to what was done. The negative karma this person is going to experience is severe to say the least.

nadjatheresa
10-21-2011, 11:11 AM
I apologize if someone else has already posted this. But did anyone watch Michael Baden on Fox and Friends this am? His theory is that DB brought Lisa in bed with her and accidentally smothered her(due to drunkeness, of course). It's possible and happens with infants sometimes. But wouldn't Lisa have cried out first if her rather well padded mother rolled on top of her?

Once in a hotel I heard infant screaming and screaming in next room. After 45 minutes I called front desk. Security came but nobody answered their knocks and calls so they finally entered with key. I watched from hall. A young mother who was morbidly obese was passed out on bed with her tiny baby beside her. The screams hadn't wakened her. Security had to shake her really hard to get her to wake. (At first I thought she was dead.) I left then so don't know what else happened.

Had she rolled over, the hotel woman could easily have suffocated her (screaming) baby.

Codger
10-21-2011, 11:11 AM
Link from KCMommie

http://www.kmbc.com/news/29547997/detail.html


"I was going south on 435, I exited on 48th Street, and I see a man who was walking up Randolph carrying a baby,"



I picked up the "NE" 48th from the reporter in the video clip, not sure if that makes a difference.

Cazzie
10-21-2011, 11:16 AM
Defense attorneys sure are brazen. God forbid one of their children ever goes missing. LE has done an outstanding job. My guess is they have spent well over six figures on this investigation already. Hundreds of searchers parking their normal duties to look for Lisa. All because of one person refusing to own up to what was done.
I hear you, but I think there are more than one person who knows.

Whether it be family/friend/acquaintance-oriented, extremely rare possibility of someone else, or witnesses.

You would think someone would want to claim the reward (if even the $100K reward is legit, I have my doubts). For all we know, there have been many trying to claim it, I guess. My jaded outlook does not exclude the possibility of the perp(s) trying to claim the reward, whether Lisa is alive or not.

I continue to have faith in LE, MBI (proper term?), SAR, and FBI...no particular order, LOL. ;)

HatesSociopaths
10-21-2011, 11:17 AM
James McKenna
sleep expert
It would be irresponsible for me to say there's no chance of your rolling over and crushing your baby if you sleep-share. Yet studies suggest that mothers and infants intuitively sense each other's presence in bed.

At the University of Notre Dame's Mother-Baby Behavioral Sleep Laboratory, our studies of breastfeeding mothers who sleep with their 2- to 4-month-olds reveal that both mothers and their babies are extremely sensitive throughout the night to each other's shifting position in the bed.

During my many years of studying sleep-sharing, I've never heard of a single instance in which, under safe conditions, it was proven that a mother suffocated her child. Notice that I said safe conditions: Babies can and do accidentally suffocate when one or both parents doesn't know a baby is in the bed, is drunk or desensitized by drugs, or is indifferent to the baby's presence. The smaller and younger the baby, the more possible it is that a rollover might occur, according to recent data.


http://www.babycenter.com/404_is-there-a-chance-ill-roll-over-and-crush-my-baby-if-we-shar_7759.bc

Codger
10-21-2011, 11:21 AM
Thank you! :great:
I was on the whole other side of town naturally. So, whomever put that dot on the map (it was probably there + I didn't see it in my fluster) THANK YOU!

Just K
10-21-2011, 11:30 AM
The house WAS roped off and treated as a crime scene for the entire first day or two. Much video to prove it.
There are a couple pictures of both DB & JI removing items from the home on October 5th. That would be Day 2
http://media.kansas.com/smedia/2011/10/05/23/21/119-vzhO2.SlMa.81.jpg
Image Info:
http://media.kansas.com/smedia/2011/10/05/23/21/119-vzhO2.SlMa.81.jpg

and one more from Oct 5th:
http://media.kansas.com/smedia/2011/10/05/23/22/800-1aGpgD.SlMa.81.jpg

Wendy101
10-21-2011, 11:35 AM
We’ve told them, if you need anything we can provide it,” Short said.How about Lisa... provide ALL answers to LE - pass the LTD - so that the LE can move on - but- NO - the MOther can not pass the LDT and she knows it - IF she is honest and wants to be cleared should would have re-peated the test - IMO


“There was no reason to use the search warrants,” Short said. “The only reason they did it was to isolate (Bradley and Irwin) and present an image in the community that was unfair and inaccurate.”
WTH? If Le found anything in the house that they can use as evidence in the courts, al the family would have to say is "they had no permission do go in our home and take anything" - LE would be standing there without a searchwarrant in hand - wouldn't that evidence be worth garbage...??



Short said she and the couple are weighing a request from police for a new interview with detectives and are considering the terms under which they might agreeHuh? I thought they were letting LE do anything they wanted to, that the parents are cooperating...



The couple also receives five or six calls a day from investigators, said Short, who estimated that Bradley and Irwin each have spent about 40 hours answering police questions since Lisa disappeared
Gawd, this makes me sick - poor them that they have spent about 40 hours talking to LE in the phone

Read more: http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/20/3220223/baby-lisas-lawyers-say-police.html#ixzz1bQlLofot

In da Middle
10-21-2011, 11:38 AM
There are a couple pictures of both DB & JI removing items from the home on October 5th. That would be Day 2
http://media.kansas.com/smedia/2011/10/05/23/21/119-vzhO2.SlMa.81.jpg
Image Info:
http://media.kansas.com/smedia/2011/10/05/23/21/119-vzhO2.SlMa.81.jpg

and one more from Oct 5th:
http://media.kansas.com/smedia/2011/10/05/23/22/800-1aGpgD.SlMa.81.jpg
The house was treated as a crime scene up until this point though. Nobody was allowed in or out and CSI did process it. They may have also had to show what they had, we dont know. I was just responding to why the detectives were entering without gloves. Prints had already been taken at this point so gloves on or off entering the door is moot.

Wendy101
10-21-2011, 11:46 AM
Just noticing a difference here in Terri HOrmans Lawyer, Steven Houze - who says NOTHING because Terri is not charged with anything for him to talk about...

And this one...

Short is criminal defense - her clients have no been charged with anything - isn't she kinda working way ahead of herself??

After reading the article above, I have no doubts that Lisa'a mother vanished her.... TY to Short for opening my eyes!

Cazzie
10-21-2011, 11:54 AM
We’ve told them, if you need anything we can provide it,” Short said.How about Lisa... provide ALL answers to LE - pass the LTD - so that the LE can move on - but- NO - the MOther can not pass the LDT and she knows it - IF she is honest and wants to be cleared should would have re-peated the test - IMO


“There was no reason to use the search warrants,” Short said. “The only reason they did it was to isolate (Bradley and Irwin) and present an image in the community that was unfair and inaccurate.”
WTH? If Le found anything in the house that they can use as evidence in the courts, al the family would have to say is "they had no permission do go in our home and take anything" - LE would be standing there without a searchwarrant in hand - wouldn't that evidence be worth garbage...??



Short said she and the couple are weighing a request from police for a new interview with detectives and are considering the terms under which they might agreeHuh? I thought they were letting LE do anything they wanted to, that the parents are cooperating...



The couple also receives five or six calls a day from investigators, said Short, who estimated that Bradley and Irwin each have spent about 40 hours answering police questions since Lisa disappeared
Gawd, this makes me sick - poor them that they have spent about 40 hours talking to LE in the phone

Read more: http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/20/3220223/baby-lisas-lawyers-say-police.html#ixzz1bQlLofot
40 hours vs. how many hundreds (thousands?) of hours of LE/FBI/taxpayer dollars?

How many hours have JI and DB spent on looking for/assisting those who are looking for Lisa (in addition to the 40 hours of questioning by LE)?

40 hours divided by 2 parents = 20 hours each (if it can be equally divided between them)...divided by 10 days now...equal 2 hours per day each. Even if it's 40 hours for each of them, read on.

Of course, we can only go by what is reported in MSM, and don't know what else they were doing. But an entire family on each side behind them, or even only on one side...that makes it much less than 2 hours per day each.

And you would think that whatever they are doing to find Lisa, they would want it reported in the media...to spread the word...to garner further support...to find Lisa.

Just saying...

SIGH.

:angel:

Wise Old Owl
10-21-2011, 11:56 AM
Any news on ANY searches going on today?

TIA

nursebeeme
10-21-2011, 12:04 PM
Any news on ANY searches going on today?

TIA

Graves with the fbi said this/re: witness sightings:


The woman said police have interviewed her four times and police say they are still looking into the possible sightings.

"That is something that we've followed up on," said Kansas City Police Department Sgt. Stacey Graves. "We've haven't discounted it and we have no reason to believe that they didn't see what they said that they saw."

Graves said investigators plan on continuing to follow up on tips and leads today.http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-eyewitnesses-convinced-sighting/story?id=14786129

I wouldn't be surprised to see activity between the house and the second witness sighting location

Wendy101
10-21-2011, 12:06 PM
Mike Thompson told ABC's "Good Morning America" that he was heading home on his motorcycle around 4:00 a.m. local time when he noticed the man, who was dressed in a T-shirt, on a street near the baby's home.

"[It was] 4 o'clock in the morning, 45 degrees, the baby don't have a blanket or coat or nothin', and this guy's walking down the street," Thompson said. "I thought it was kind of weird."

Thompson claimed the infant -- who was only wearing a diaper -- resembled Lisa and said that he would recognize the man if he saw him again.

He said he waited about a week to report the sighting to police because he did not immediately make the connection to the girl's disappearance.

Two other witnesses[/B[B]], who were not named, said they encountered a similar scene a few hours earlier."It was shocking because I couldn't imagine anybody outside walking with their baby in the cold like that with no clothes on," the female witness told ABC.

The woman and her husband reported the sighting to police that morning, and the female witness said she was interviewed four times since



Read more: [url]http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/1

AlmostGone
10-21-2011, 12:15 PM
There are a couple pictures of both DB & JI removing items from the home on October 5th. That would be Day 2
http://media.kansas.com/smedia/2011/10/05/23/21/119-vzhO2.SlMa.81.jpg
Image Info:
http://media.kansas.com/smedia/2011/10/05/23/21/119-vzhO2.SlMa.81.jpg

and one more from Oct 5th:
http://media.kansas.com/smedia/2011/10/05/23/22/800-1aGpgD.SlMa.81.jpg

I wonder if the LE plan on searching the home DB JI are in now? I think with family correct?

liz b.
10-21-2011, 12:16 PM
Mike Thompson told ABC's "Good Morning America" that he was heading home on his motorcycle around 4:00 a.m. local time when he noticed the man, who was dressed in a T-shirt, on a street near the baby's home.

"[It was] 4 o'clock in the morning, 45 degrees, the baby don't have a blanket or coat or nothin', and this guy's walking down the street," Thompson said. "I thought it was kind of weird."

Thompson claimed the infant -- who was only wearing a diaper -- resembled Lisa and said that he would recognize the man if he saw him again.

He said he waited about a week to report the sighting to police because he did not immediately make the connection to the girl's disappearance.

Two other witnesses[/B[B]], who were not named, said they encountered a similar scene a few hours earlier."It was shocking because I couldn't imagine anybody outside walking with their baby in the cold like that with no clothes on," the female witness told ABC.

The woman and her husband reported the sighting to police that morning, and the female witness said she was interviewed four times since



Read more: [url]http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/1

Sounds strange that this man was seen in the same area walking with a baby two hours apart,in the middle of the night ?

I wonder if the baby was alive ? The witnesses do not say they heard the baby crying..... MOO

sarx
10-21-2011, 12:18 PM
Do you ever feel like we should be on NG's payroll? Seriously, our topics shift and suddenly the exact same thing pops up on her FB headline, etc.

cluciano63
10-21-2011, 12:19 PM
Sounds strange that this man was seen in the same area walking with a baby two hours apart,in the middle of the night ?

I wonder if the baby was alive ? The witnesses do not say they heard the baby crying..... MOO

I was wondering the same thing...surely a kidnapper would not hang around the area for hours...also wondered if anyone heard a peep from this baby...

sarx
10-21-2011, 12:19 PM
Sounds strange that this man was seen in the same area walking with a baby two hours apart,in the middle of the night ?

I wonder if the baby was alive ? The witnesses do not say they heard the baby crying..... MOO

Or if it was some homeless man or 5150 walking with a doll. We've had that call out more than once.

~n/t~
10-21-2011, 12:19 PM
I apologize if someone else has already posted this. But did anyone watch Michael Baden on Fox and Friends this am? His theory is that DB brought Lisa in bed with her and accidentally smothered her(due to drunkeness, of course). It's possible and happens with infants sometimes. But wouldn't Lisa have cried out first if her rather well padded mother rolled on top of her?

I find it hard to believe an 11 month old would be smothered by a parent rolling over them. If she was smothered, it wasn't an accident, imo

AlmostGone
10-21-2011, 12:22 PM
Do you ever feel like we should be on NG's payroll? Seriously, our topics shift and suddenly the exact same thing pops up on her FB headline, etc.

YES I have and it happened alot with the Haleigh Cummings case...

liz b.
10-21-2011, 12:30 PM
I was wondering the same thing...surely a kidnapper would not hang around the area for hours...also wondered if anyone heard a peep from this baby...

Cluciano,
I think the baby the guy was carrying was Lisa...MOO And surely she would have been making noises of sme kind, from being outside.... I'm thinking the worst at this point...MOO

ETA : I do not believe that he kidnapped this child...MOO

cluciano63
10-21-2011, 12:33 PM
Cluciano,
I think the baby the guy was carrying was Lisa...MOO And surely she would have been making noises of sme kind, from being outside.... I'm thinking the worst at this point...MOO

ETA : I do not believe that he kidnapped this child...MOO

I have kind of thought from the first sighting that this man could be the accomplice of someone within the family...just a feeling. I have very mixed feelings in this case.

liz b.
10-21-2011, 12:33 PM
Or if it was some homeless man or 5150 walking with a doll. We've had that call out more than once.

I thought of a doll...but, that would be quite a large "doll", if it was Lisa ? Would all of the witnesses be mistaken, thinking a doll was a baby ? Who knows...

Rallihanna
10-21-2011, 12:35 PM
I'm sorry- I know this won't go over well. But I do think perhaps a guy helped "dispose" of her. Too many rumors out there exist that lead me to believe that some of them hold water. That Mom did something, or planned something... Wish I didn't feel this way. JMO

spamelope
10-21-2011, 12:44 PM
Why would DB/JI leave the phones hidden in the house? If in fact he/she (they) discarded Baby Lisa, wouldn't they get rid of the phones too? On a local news cast it was reported that she does follow cases of the missing and always assumed the family was guilty but has changed her mind since it has happened to her. (i can search for link but it will take me forever, someone back me here)

My thought on requesting video is to see inconsistancies, body language, wording...etc.

I think that our phones become kind of an extension of ourselves, with our pictures, music etc. stored on them. I don't think they want to get rid of them, just hide whatever is incriminating that's stored on the phone from LE. FWIW, I think the phones were hidden in the bird feeder....I do remember that statement as well.

jenbo1
10-21-2011, 12:46 PM
I have got to say that I find it really hard to believe that some guy would be walking down any street, in the middle of the night, carrying a dead baby out in the open, where any person passing by could see!

JMO.....

In da Middle
10-21-2011, 12:51 PM
Graves with the fbi said this/re: witness sightings:

http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-eyewitnesses-convinced-sighting/story?id=14786129

I wouldn't be surprised to see activity between the house and the second witness sighting location
I'm betting that quiktrip and the hotels at Parvin & Randolph are being pulled if they haven't been already.

norest4thewicked
10-21-2011, 12:54 PM
I have got to say that I find it really hard to believe that some guy would be walking down any street, in the middle of the night, carrying a dead baby out in the open, where any person passing by could see!

JMO.....

I think that the rumor is that he was carrying a baby, not a dead baby.

cluciano63
10-21-2011, 12:54 PM
I have got to say that I find it really hard to believe that some guy would be walking down any street, in the middle of the night, carrying a dead baby out in the open, where any person passing by could see!

JMO.....

I kind of find it hard to believe that anyone would be carrying a baby around at midnight and/or 4am in any condition...but if it happened, no one called LE at the time, or confronted the man, so there is no way of knowing the condition of the baby.

In da Middle
10-21-2011, 12:54 PM
He said he waited about a week to report the sighting to police because he did not immediately make the connection to the girl's disappearance.




Read more: [url]http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/1
SBM so at least this means that he probably let LE know last week of this. This could also be the reasons for more searches late last week. Just speculating here.

AmandaReckonwith
10-21-2011, 12:55 PM
Case archive album for Lisa Irwin:

http://s296.photobucket.com/albums/mm166/crankycrankerson/Lisa%20Irwin%20%20-MO-/

Just K
10-21-2011, 12:58 PM
I have got to say that I find it really hard to believe that some guy would be walking down any street, in the middle of the night, carrying a dead baby out in the open, where any person passing by could see!

JMO.....

Unless this is a fake abduction and everything that we have heard from the mother is a lie. She could have planned this and wants people to think that a man stole her baby. Perhaps she paid someone she knew and said make sure someone sees you with Lisa. She may know exactly where the baby is. And it certainly could have been a doll.

Then again, she may have accidentally killed or through neglect let the baby die and she called on someone to help her fake an abduction. Meanwhile she may have buried Lisa earlier in the day. Then set the cover up into motion. Alibi: Buy the biggest container of wine possible.