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Kimster
11-13-2011, 08:34 PM
We will be discussing baby Lisa tonight, so you don't want to miss it! I'll have the chat room open in about 15 minutes, aka 4:45 PST.

Click the link in my siggy line for directions. If that doesn't work (cuz I'm about to sign off the forum to get ready for the show), click on the link on the front page two times.

:seeya:

josie1986
11-13-2011, 08:38 PM
do u know what time that would be GMT? TIA

NotSoSherlock
11-13-2011, 08:54 PM
do u know what time that would be GMT? TIA

Based on timezoneconverter.com...

08:00:00 p.m. Monday November 14, 2011 in America/New_York converts to
01:00:00 a.m. Tuesday November 15, 2011 in GMT

Which is in about 5 minutes from when I post this.

ETA: There seems to be some confusion as to whether it is at 8:00pm Eastern or 9:00pm eastern. The blogtalk website says 8:00pm eastern.

winterrose
11-13-2011, 10:22 PM
Dang,can't sign into blogtalkradio,but I like this man,very informative.

Truthwillsetufree
11-13-2011, 10:31 PM
This has been the best show ever! So informative!!!!Thank Ya'll!

winterrose
11-13-2011, 10:36 PM
I wonder if we can talk about the info from the show.I need to go back and listen to it again.First time I heard about the dufflebag info.

Truthwillsetufree
11-13-2011, 10:38 PM
I wonder if we can talk about the info from the show.I need to go back and listen to it again.First time I heard about the dufflebag info.

Me too, very interesting!!! According to Rugan (sp) 3 other people reported this duffle bag hmmmmm.......

gliving
11-13-2011, 10:40 PM
Me too, very interesting!!! According to Rugan (sp) 3 other people reported this duffle bag hmmmmm.......

What duffle bag? Thanks!

Sparklin
11-13-2011, 10:40 PM
Awesome show tonight ~ thanks so much to our guests, our hostess and our awesome mods!!

yllek
11-13-2011, 10:45 PM
Great show Tricia, Kimster, Jim, and Ron...

ljs713
11-13-2011, 10:45 PM
Great show tonight. Very interesting and informative. Thanks Tricia and Kimster. Thanks to our specials guests tonight also Jim and Ron.

justbetweenus
11-13-2011, 10:47 PM
This was an awesome show! The only prob I had was wishing there was a small commercial break so I could go to the washroom. Couldn't leave my computer! Thank-you WS!

uvamerica
11-13-2011, 10:53 PM
Tonight's show :rocker: as usual !

can we talk about the content ? :D

Dr.Fessel
11-13-2011, 10:53 PM
What duffle bag? Thanks! Three people saw Phillip the brother leave Deb's house with a duffel bag.

Wise Old Owl
11-13-2011, 10:56 PM
Yes, I agree - GREAT show.

But, the blanket. Wish Spellman would follow up on the "where is Lisa's favorite blanket" question? DB did state in one of her interviews that Lisa would sleep with: her Barney, her Glow Worm and her "favorite" blanket. I want to know if DB and/or LE have accounted for Lisa's favorite blanket.

** As we all know now - Caylee's blanket (Winnie the Pooh") was found with her remains.**

So, I relaly want to know if the "Cars themed" blanket seized with the search warrant was Lisa's favorite blanket or is Lisa's favorite blanket MIA? Has it been accounted for?

This should be about the seach for Lisa - and, if she was disposed of with her favorite blanket - that would be VERY PERTINENT INFORMATION!!!

Just sayin..................

vlpate
11-13-2011, 10:59 PM
Three people saw Phillip the brother leave Deb's house with a duffel bag.

Hello Dr. Fessel - I know that was mentioned on the show - information I hadn't heard before. Do you know who the three people are?

Jaxson
11-13-2011, 11:01 PM
Three people saw Phillip the brother leave Deb's house with a duffel bag.


Do we know who the 3 were and what time they witnessed this?

On topic I found the radio show very confusing,(my first time) however I was just reading not listening (football is on, we mustn't disturb). Next time maybe I will be able to follow better

Dr.Fessel
11-13-2011, 11:01 PM
Hello Dr. Fessel - I know that was mentioned on the show - information I hadn't heard before. Do you know who the three people are?
No idea but I am going to listen to the show again.

DeAnn
11-13-2011, 11:01 PM
Is there a link to be able to listen to the show after the fact?

Thank you

Dr.Fessel
11-13-2011, 11:03 PM
Do we know who the 3 were and what time they witnessed this?

On topic I found the radio show very confusing,(my first time) however I was just reading not listening (football is on, we mustn't disturb). Next time maybe I will be able to follow better
They will post a recording of the show soon. Worth listening too. The chat gets nuts sometimes. LOL

mlc9852
11-13-2011, 11:06 PM
Do we know who the 3 were and what time they witnessed this?

On topic I found the radio show very confusing,(my first time) however I was just reading not listening (football is on, we mustn't disturb). Next time maybe I will be able to follow better


Ron said on his FB it was 10:30. My question is - what have the cops done with this info? Was PN asked about this when cops questioned him recently?

Dr.Fessel
11-13-2011, 11:08 PM
Is there a link to be able to listen to the show after the fact?

Thank you Here is the recording of the show. http://www.blogtalkradio.com/websleuths/2011/11/14/websleuths-radio-1

tehcloser
11-13-2011, 11:09 PM
Awesome show.......but my question about the duffle bag........why would they pass it out the window when all he would have had to do is leave from the back of the house with it or heck even out the front door???????????????

neese
11-13-2011, 11:15 PM
My pc was too slow to let me type in the chat room. But I could see what was being typed and this is the first time I've ever heard anything about a duffel bag??? What the Heck??

Sparklin
11-13-2011, 11:15 PM
Ron Rugen KansascityPi
A source has told me the PD have an eyewitness account that Debi's brother's car was in front of the house at 10:30p and Debi handed him a duffle bag. That source also says the believe the brother walked down the street during the night carrying a doll to throw people off.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/183570901718265/permalink/194605340614821/

bbm - I have never heard this. I thought Jim and Ron were both very informative regarding MW & her living arrangements, however, although Jim provided us with some other facts as he knows them, Ron shared rumours from 'sources'. His heart is in the right place, but even I, in Canada have heard rumours and innuendo that I have not seen posted and....wouldn't post until fact. All IMO

eta: IMO media would be all over that!! If it were true, LE def. knows about it and has the bag. Could have been his laundry for all anyone knows.

~n/t~
11-13-2011, 11:16 PM
Weren't the neighbours outside until 11:30? Didn't the brother go to the Police Station voluntarily to answer questions? Wouldn't they have asked him about a duffel bag if witnesses saw him carrying one?

This case with all its characters is becoming more and more bizarro. Now we have phantom witnesses.

tehcloser
11-13-2011, 11:18 PM
I'm sure if LE had heard the duffle bag story they DID ask him about it, but we would have no way of knowing that info. I'm sure they ask him a lot....................

3doglady
11-13-2011, 11:26 PM
Did PN wear a bald wig?

In da Middle
11-13-2011, 11:29 PM
Sure makes you wonder who the "source" was. Not exactly buying it if they can't even get more exact than that.

Sparklin
11-13-2011, 11:32 PM
Did PN wear a bald wig?

Exactly ~ not to mention IF there are verified accounts of that, why isn't PN in jail and DB hauled in to the station?

OMG, I just wen to the FB Lisa Irwin Amber Alert page (linked from Hinky) and really?? He is totally speculating, in his own words!! No different than us or Examiner blogs.

RANCH
11-13-2011, 11:34 PM
Ron was getting bombarded with questions,pple wanting him to add more info, maybe he decided to take it down. :waitasec:

I still have the pg open so I still have it.

Why would he take it down?

tehcloser
11-13-2011, 11:36 PM
The way I look at a lot of stuff like this is simply to make note of it, in this case of this rumor, a duffle bag. I am always amazed at the things that we only hear bits of coming out down the line. I don't believe duffle bag out the window for a second. On the other hand will I be surprised to find out there was a duffle bag involved? No.

uvamerica
11-13-2011, 11:37 PM
Why would he take it down?

That's a good question, the post is dated Oct.31st, so its been there for a while and he stated the same info on WS tonight. So..:waitasec:

gliving
11-13-2011, 11:39 PM
Me too, very interesting!!! According to Rugan (sp) 3 other people reported this duffle bag hmmmmm.......

Are you sure he said 3 other people? I only ask because on 710KCMO podcast Nov 5 he said there was MAYBE one possible witness who saw Deborah hand Phil a duffle bag. Maybe he found more witnesses since then.

http://www.710kcmo.com/Podcasts/TheRadioDish/tabid/1025/Default.aspx

NOV 5th podcast at about 20:05

RANCH
11-13-2011, 11:41 PM
Are you sure he said 3 other people? I only ask because on 710KCMO podcast Nov 5 he said there was MAYBE one possible witness who saw Deborah hand Phil a duffle bag. Maybe he found more witnesses since then.

http://www.710kcmo.com/Podcasts/TheRadioDish/tabid/1025/Default.aspx

NOV 5th podcast at about 20:05

Did he happen to state his source on that show?

~n/t~
11-13-2011, 11:43 PM
I'm sure if LE had heard the duffle bag story they DID ask him about it, but we would have no way of knowing that info. I'm sure they ask him a lot....................

I don't know how long they questioned him but it didn't seem to be very long, IIRC.

He was questioned AFTER the searches. Don't you think if this alleged duffel bag was crucial to this case and possibly finding Lisa, they would be out there looking for it as we speak?

I'm going to dismiss it as another rumour based on gossip from locals.

With all the possible suspects in this case, LE will need more than a police car. They'll need a bus.

SyraKelly
11-13-2011, 11:44 PM
OK.What hell was that all that all about??

gliving
11-13-2011, 11:46 PM
Did he happen to state his source on that show?

No, just a source who told him that maybe one possible witness saw it. I guess he's had time to find more witnesses? Because it would be a really big story if true.

tehcloser
11-13-2011, 11:46 PM
I don't know how long they questioned him but it didn't seem to be very long, IIRC.

He was questioned AFTER the searches. Don't you think if this alleged duffel bag was crucial to this case and possibly finding Lisa, they would be out there looking for it as we speak?

I'm going to dismiss it as another rumour based on gossip from locals.

With all the possible suspects in this case, LE will need more than a police car. They'll need a bus.

IMO I feel quite sure that was not the ONLY time LE has spoken with PN. That's just the only time media was there to film him leaving.......lol.

AngelWings444
11-13-2011, 11:48 PM
IMO I feel quite sure that was not the ONLY time LE has spoken with PN. That's just the only time media was there to film him leaving.......lol.
And, who knows if he has answered any questions? Just because he was interviewed, doesn't mean he cooperated.

~n/t~
11-13-2011, 11:51 PM
IMO I feel quite sure that was not the ONLY time LE has spoken with PN. That's just the only time media was there to film him leaving.......lol.

You may be right but the media were like fleas on a dog with the family early on. If the brother was hauled to the police station, we would've heard about it. No doubt in my mind.

I'm sure he was questioned and re questioned but nothing came out of it except a video of boxed wine adventure.:innocent: Hey, maybe he took home the leftover wine.

justbetweenus
11-13-2011, 11:52 PM
Me too, very interesting!!! According to Rugan (sp) 3 other people reported this duffle bag hmmmmm.......

Do you recall if when he said 3 people reported the duffle bag, if he meant 3 witnesses reported? Or 3 people reported it, as heard from others? I want to listen again but my pc is acting up tonight.

RANCH
11-13-2011, 11:59 PM
I thought that Jim Spellman did an excellent job of stating his sources of information on this show. If things were only speculation he made that clear to the listeners. When Ron the PI came on, I wasn't too impressed and turned the show off. I guess I should have left it on so I could of heard the duffel bag tale.

beach
11-14-2011, 12:00 AM
Please do not post Facebook links.

The only Facebook link that has been okay'd is MW's personal page. (See the Etiquette & Information sticky thread.)

To be clear, conversations viewed on any of the players or "Lisa Irwin" pages are not permitted to be brought over here for discussion.

:tyou:

Kimster
11-14-2011, 12:19 AM
Please do not post Facebook links.

The only Facebook link that has been okay'd is MW's personal page. (See the Etiquette & Information sticky thread.)

To be clear, conversations viewed on any of the players or "Lisa Irwin" pages are not permitted to be brought over here for discussion.

:tyou:

Thank you Beach!

It's okay to discuss what the guests talked about on the show, but please leave FB out of it. Just quote the guests on this thread. :kimsterwink:

winterrose
11-14-2011, 12:22 AM
Yeah,you guys,what were you thinking?:innocent::slap: JK It was so good to listen to two people in this case that aren't in it for something,just the facts and no spin.They gave alot of insight to this. I really wish they had been able to talk to Dane.

Kimster
11-14-2011, 12:26 AM
Based on timezoneconverter.com...

08:00:00 p.m. Monday November 14, 2011 in America/New_York converts to
01:00:00 a.m. Tuesday November 15, 2011 in GMT

Which is in about 5 minutes from when I post this.

ETA: There seems to be some confusion as to whether it is at 8:00pm Eastern or 9:00pm eastern. The blogtalk website says 8:00pm eastern.

It was 8PM EST. :doh: I wrote in typonese and had the wrong time on there.

:okay:

tehcloser
11-14-2011, 12:28 AM
I just posted the interview with the roommate that Ron talked to about Dane on the MSN thread.

winterrose
11-14-2011, 12:32 AM
Did anyone put up the video Ron made driving through the street,up past the dumpster area and towards MW's?It was very interesting.

RANCH
11-14-2011, 12:39 AM
This is why I wasn't impressed with ex-newsman now PI Ron Rugan. He goes after Bill Stanton by saying he researched his PI license in NY. He states that he went online and couldn't find a record but he wasn't sure if he did the search right. That was enough for me and I shut the show off. Maybe I'm being a bit hard on the guy, but that was kind of lame if you ask me.

w1df10wr
11-14-2011, 12:43 AM
Dear Mr. Rugan & Mr. Spellman, thank you for joining Tricia & Kimster on WebSleuths Radio. Its been a really good show from what I've heard so far.

iamnotagolem
11-14-2011, 12:50 AM
I didn't get to listen, so is the dufflel (how do you spell that?) bag rumor or are we able to discuss it now?

Kimster
11-14-2011, 12:55 AM
I didn't get to listen, so is the dufflel (how do you spell that?) bag rumor or are we able to discuss it now?

You can discuss what was said about it on the show on this thread, but I don't know that it's being considered fact so best not run with it on other threads at this point. :tyou:

RANCH
11-14-2011, 12:56 AM
I didn't get to listen, so is the dufflel (how do you spell that?) bag rumor or are we able to discuss it now?

I didn't listen to that part myself. From what I hear it's information from unnamed sources. I not sure that's the same as a rumor.

yllek
11-14-2011, 12:56 AM
Do you recall if when he said 3 people reported the duffle bag, if he meant 3 witnesses reported? Or 3 people reported it, as heard from others? I want to listen again but my pc is acting up tonight.

I listened to the show. I heard Mr. Ruegen say that he had heard about the brother and the duffel bag. But, he did not say that 3 people witnessed the brother taking a duffel bag from the house that night. He said someone told him about the duffel bag incident. When he reported it, he was told that 2 other people had reported the same story.

IMO, it could well be a rumor that got reported (wisely so, imo) to LE three different times. Glad to know people are reporting all tips! This one could be true, but it's nowhere near "verified" if we're going only off of Mr. Ruegen's account on WS radio. Interesting tid bit for the back burner though, imo...

MissFine
11-14-2011, 02:14 AM
Three people saw Phillip the brother leave Deb's house with a duffel bag.

the brother left with a duffle bag????????
???????????

Why hasn't that information been released? Could searchers walked passed a duffle bag whilst they looked for a baby? moo

yllek
11-14-2011, 03:10 AM
the brother left with a duffle bag????????
???????????

Why hasn't that information been released? Could searchers walked passed a duffle bag whilst they looked for a baby? moo

Okay, I just went and listened to this portion of the show. Here is what Ruegen said about the duffel bag:

1. He was told by someone who was involved in searching that someone may have seen Debbi's brother get a duffel bag from the house that night. He vaguely mentioned that somehow being related to the theory of a man walking around with a doll as a decoy.

2. He told a reporter about what this search source told him. The reporter asked an LEO. The LEO said that this reporter was the third person to ask him about the duffel bag, which Ruegen finds intriguing.

I don't think this amounts to 3 witnesses seeing the brother take a duffel bag from the house; not even one substantiated witness account in the story, as it was told (nor did Reugen claim otherwise). All second or third hand information and unverified at this time. JMO...

MissFine
11-14-2011, 03:14 AM
Okay, I just went and listened to this portion of the show. Here is what Ruegen said about the duffel bag:

1. He was told by someone who was involved in searching that someone may have seen Debbi's brother get a duffel bag from the house that night. He vaguely mentioned that somehow being related to the theory of a man walking around with a doll as a decoy.

2. He told a reporter about what this search source told him. The reporter asked an LEO. The LEO said that this reporter was the third person to ask him about the duffel bag, which Ruegen finds intriguing.

I don't think this amounts to 3 witnesses seeing the brother take a duffel bag from the house; not even one substantiated witness account in the story, as it was told (nor did Reugen claim otherwise). All second or third hand information and unverified at this time. JMO...

yllek,
Aha. The third person to ask about the duffle in no way means there were 3 witnesses. Thanks for clearing this up yllek.

dog.gone.cute
11-14-2011, 03:21 AM
Thank You all for the updates ... sounds like there were some "bombshells" ... :innocent:

While I understand this POSSIBLE "duffel bag" has NOT been verified, IMO ... "where there is smoke, there is fire" ...

And regarding PN ... he has been on my "radar" since the "wine run video" was released ...

:waitasec: I am surprised that PN hasn't "lawyered up" yet ... hmmm ... it's going to be interesting to see if he does ...

MOO MOO and MOO !

vlpate
11-14-2011, 09:20 AM
This is why I wasn't impressed with ex-newsman now PI Ron Rugan. He goes after Bill Stanton by saying he researched his PI license in NY. He states that he went online and couldn't find a record but he wasn't sure if he did the search right. That was enough for me and I shut the show off. Maybe I'm being a bit hard on the guy, but that was kind of lame if you ask me.

He said he KNEW he was not a PI with a license in MO and wasn't positive about NYC because all he could find was an unarmed guard license. I think the rest was a disclaimer in case he did miss something.

You missed a good show. I was astounded that Jim Spellman started out the update by calling Jeremy "Deborah's husband" - but by the end of the interview we got a lot of good information.

I was also surprised that Rugen doesn't know who Shane B. is. He said he's mostly been talking to Megan and those people. Sort of bothersome.

vlpate
11-14-2011, 09:27 AM
You can discuss what was said about it on the show on this thread, but I don't know that it's being considered fact so best not run with it on other threads at this point. :tyou:
IMO, what Jim said was mostly MSM fact except when he gave his "feelings" on the neighbors take on the Bradley/Irwins. I was taken aback when JS referred to Jeremy as DB's husband!

Good job last night Kimster!

Truthwillsetufree
11-14-2011, 09:48 AM
Okay, I just went and listened to this portion of the show. Here is what Ruegen said about the duffel bag:

1. He was told by someone who was involved in searching that someone may have seen Debbi's brother get a duffel bag from the house that night. He vaguely mentioned that somehow being related to the theory of a man walking around with a doll as a decoy.

2. He told a reporter about what this search source told him. The reporter asked an LEO. The LEO said that this reporter was the third person to ask him about the duffel bag, which Ruegen finds intriguing.

I don't think this amounts to 3 witnesses seeing the brother take a duffel bag from the house; not even one substantiated witness account in the story, as it was told (nor did Reugen claim otherwise). All second or third hand information and unverified at this time. JMO...

When you listen for the 2nd time about the dufflebag, it's not as big a "bombshell". He was just relaying information. Interesting none the less.

Truthwillsetufree
11-14-2011, 09:51 AM
Thank You all for the updates ... sounds like there were some "bombshells" ... :innocent:

While I understand this POSSIBLE "duffel bag" has NOT been verified, IMO ... "where there is smoke, there is fire" ...

And regarding PN ... he has been on my "radar" since the "wine run video" was released ...

:waitasec: I am surprised that PN hasn't "lawyered up" yet ... hmmm ... it's going to be interesting to see if he does ...

MOO MOO and MOO !

He may have and MSM just hasn't caught wind of it.....

Truthwillsetufree
11-14-2011, 09:55 AM
Could someone toss me a link to the chatroom so I can bookmark it. I looked all over the place last evening to go chat and couldn't find it. Some sleuther, can't find the chatroom:waitasec:

dog.gone.cute
11-14-2011, 10:02 AM
He may have and MSM just hasn't caught wind of it.....

Good point ... :waitasec: and he has never spoken to media ...

MOO ...

BetteDavisEyes
11-14-2011, 10:10 AM
On the few occasions when I've remembered to listen to the program, I can't hear what is being said due to static. Is there a transcript from the radio broadcast?

winterrose
11-14-2011, 10:20 AM
Ron was explaining about BS coming in and saying he was a PI and how real PIs there have to go through licensing and such.I totally understand where he's coming from,this is about a missing child and finding her,not publicity.Interesting to hear their views,or through their eyes on how everything changed when BS and JT came on the scene.

Sparklin
11-14-2011, 10:21 AM
He said he KNEW he was not a PI with a license in MO and wasn't positive about NYC because all he could find was an unarmed guard license. I think the rest was a disclaimer in case he did miss something.

You missed a good show. I was astounded that Jim Spellman started out the update by calling Jeremy "Deborah's husband" - but by the end of the interview we got a lot of good information.

I was also surprised that Rugen doesn't know who Shane B. is. He said he's mostly been talking to Megan and those people. Sort of bothersome.

bbm=really? They live as husband and wife. There are tons of people in their exact situation. Either they don't want to get married again so getting a divorce is no big deal and/or can't afford it. I was separated for 16 years before getting a divorce. In the meantime lived with and had a child etc...no one ever had an issue with us saying husband or wife. I'm astounded that this is an issue with some people really!

Cazzie
11-14-2011, 10:48 AM
bbm=really? They live as husband and wife. There are tons of people in their exact situation. Either they don't want to get married again so getting a divorce is no big deal and/or can't afford it. I was separated for 16 years before getting a divorce. In the meantime lived with and had a child etc...no one ever had an issue with us saying husband or wife. I'm astounded that this is an issue with some people really!
IMO, many wish to be factual, and many consider it to be a legal issue, especially (potentially) with regards to the children. It's possible there are several different legal concerns, perhaps complicated by legal custodial arrangements (or not).

IMO, most expect MSM to be factual. Perhaps JS just misspoke, but I was surprised by the error, as well.

DB is married to SBradley, thus he is her husband. DB/JI have been portrayed as "fiancees". She and JI can't get legally married until her current marriage is dissolved. The current marriage has been portrayed to be still on-going due to lack of finances to divorce.

I don't know what the common-law marriage law is in MO, but I'd be surprised if it allows for one partner to be legally married to someone else.

Some may also be concerned for the children's sake, regarding possible stigma about the living situation. I'm sure there are those that may feel judgmental about it, as well.

Sparklin
11-14-2011, 10:53 AM
IMO, many wish to be factual, and many consider it to be a legal issue, especially (potentially) with regards to the children. IMO, most expect MSM to be factual. Perhaps JS just misspoke, but I was surprised by the error, as well.

DB is married to SBradley, thus he is her husband. DB/JI have been portrayed as "fiancees". She and JI can't get legally married until her current marriage is dissolved. The current marriage has been portrayed to be still on-going due to lack of finances to divorce.

I don't know what the common-law marriage law is in MO, but I'd be surprised if it allows for one partner to be legally married to someone else.

Some may be concerned for the children's sake, regarding possible stigma about the living situation. I'm sure there are those that may feel judgmental about it, as well.

I see the MSM factual issue I guess - but it seems their situation is more the norm than not and I can't see any stigma about it. But that's just me. I try to live in the current era and adapt to the changing lifestyles :)

Kimster
11-14-2011, 10:58 AM
Could someone toss me a link to the chatroom so I can bookmark it. I looked all over the place last evening to go chat and couldn't find it. Some sleuther, can't find the chatroom:waitasec:

The chatroom only exists during the show and there isn't an archive. :(

curiousc
11-14-2011, 11:05 AM
The duffle bag story is interesting....but could be a rumour. However, I could see it being a possible scenario. It would be interesting to know if PN did come back after a time.

Cazzie
11-14-2011, 11:09 AM
I see the MSM factual issue I guess - but it seems their situation is more the norm than not and I can't see any stigma about it. But that's just me. I try to live in the current era and adapt to the changing lifestyles :)
There has been much discussion (and speculation) in Baby Lisa's forum about the potential legalities of the DB/JI "blended family", etc...maybe you haven't read it. :)

Despite "current era and changing lifestyles", I think it is very common to assume that a couple with children are legally married.

Especially since JS (CNN reporter) has earned much high regard here at WS (for his coverage of this case), it just surprised me (and others). I've heard him self-correct himself on camera/audio before, so I'm willing to accept that he misspoke and nobody "caught him on it" and spoke up about it.

iamnotagolem
11-14-2011, 11:20 AM
I'm very interested in this duffle bag story b/c this is not the first I've heard if it. I had read about it in the first few days after Lisa went missing. I was sure I'd read about it in MSM, but when I went back to look for details on it, it was gone and I haven't read anything else about it until now.

I still don't know how you convince your little brother to dispose of your daughter's body. The only thing I can think up is "go throw this bag in the river, do not look inside". But what about the cell phones? What about the phone call? How could it all fit together?

IMO, MOO,

Donjeta
11-14-2011, 11:37 AM
I'm confused about the teen they took DNA from early on. They're saying that she is a babysitter who had the garage code and they talked to her but that person didn't become a part of the case. But I thought it was a male teen??

Cher352
11-14-2011, 11:53 AM
Here is the recording of the show. http://www.blogtalkradio.com/websleuths/2011/11/14/websleuths-radio-1

Thanks for the link...I listened to it early this morning and was enjoyed it all.

Although a lot of what they said was already known in bits and pieces it was nice to hear them tell it without it being sliced and diced.

It was also enlightening to listen to Jim & Ron talk about MW and her housemates. They both agreed how far from the truth some of the bloggers and posters on the net have been in their speculating the lifestyle of those people. It made me feel a little embarrassed and ashamed for the people that do try to judge people from afar.

As to the duffle bag, it sounds like just a rumor to me at this point. Three people may have asked LE about it but I am sure LE gets a lot of questions once any rumor is thrown out there.

Cher352
11-14-2011, 12:00 PM
I'm confused about the teen they took DNA from early on. They're saying that she is a babysitter who had the garage code and they talked to her but that person didn't become a part of the case. But I thought it was a male teen??

I thought the same thing. At first I thought Jim made a mistake in using the pronoun "she" but he kept using it. I am glad now that WS is a place where teens are not allowed to be named as it seems so much of what was out there was all based on the wrong assumption of which teen it was.

Hopeful2
11-14-2011, 12:51 PM
since we are not to carry this info into other threads, can somebody give me a scenario- any scenario- where a mom would place her deceased baby into a duffle bag? I know FCA and S. Smith had deep psychological problems but have yet to hear that about DB. And i am totally off the fence as of yesterday, so i am not looking for a debate. Just interested in opinions. TIA

In da Middle
11-14-2011, 01:25 PM
The duffle bag story is interesting....but could be a rumour. However, I could see it being a possible scenario. It would be interesting to know if PN did come back after a time.
It seems like it almost would have to be rumor as during the timeframe for it have to happen, the girls were there together and even possible the other neighbor.

Donjeta
11-14-2011, 01:37 PM
since we are not to carry this info into other threads, can somebody give me a scenario- any scenario- where a mom would place her deceased baby into a duffle bag? I know FCA and S. Smith had deep psychological problems but have yet to hear that about DB. And i am totally off the fence as of yesterday, so i am not looking for a debate. Just interested in opinions. TIA

I don't know if I put any credence to the duffel bag story because it doesn't seem to be more than a rumor at the moment but what is the significance of the duffel bag to you? I don't think either FCA or S. Smith used a duffel bag. In the UID forum and Namus you see babies that were disposed of in coolers, plastic bags, metal recycling bins, diaper boxes, trash bags, suitcases... so a duffel bag wouldn't stand out to me as anything too odd. People seem to dispose of their babies in containers that are readily available, baby sized, hide the baby from view and possibly able to be weighted down (if they're going to put it in a body of water).

tehcloser
11-14-2011, 01:40 PM
What was said about someone showing someone else a photo? Does anyone remember right off? Jim was the one talking about this.

Cher352
11-14-2011, 01:48 PM
IIRC Jim said it was not LE that showed the photo of the neighbor's husband to MT and that fact alone could cause MT's testimonty to be useless or something to that effect.

tehcloser
11-14-2011, 01:51 PM
I wonder who it was?

curvecuti
11-14-2011, 01:57 PM
I wonder who it was?
I thought it was Gil Abeyta?

Cher352
11-14-2011, 02:01 PM
I thought it was Gil Abeyta?

Pretty sure without going back and listening again that it was him that showed the pic to MT.

Cazzie
11-14-2011, 02:06 PM
I thought it was Gil Abeyta?
Thank you! I was wracking my brain...I think you're right.

My initial reaction (to it not being shown to MT by LE), was "huh?!?!?" (becuz I'm eloquent like that). ;)

IMO, if the photo lineup wasn't shown to MT by LE, it was irresponsible MSM reporting/editting that definitely implied such.

tehcloser
11-14-2011, 02:07 PM
oh.....Thanks. Well that's another reason peeps should not insert themselves in a case. My heart breaks for Gil, but leave the witnesses aloneeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee.

Soulmagent
11-14-2011, 02:35 PM
I feel like anytime a child is reported missing that all incidents within 24 hours should be reveiwed as standerd investigative procedure. That dumpster fire would have came to light alot sooner.

I also understand Gil to be ex law enforcement and him showing the photo to the witness should not be allowed to be discredited on the investigative level ,(goal is to find Lisa) and should only became an issue in court. It wont be admissable ,but will the witness tip lead to the identy of a suspect? Yes. I see why Gil did what he did and I see why he did what he did. I think what Gil did was important in the case and did help the investigators but it wont help the DA.

There is always more to a case file then what ends up on the courts record and sometimes what gets left out can be more important than what is put into the court docs. JMO.

3doglady
11-14-2011, 02:46 PM
IIRC Jim said it was not LE that showed the photo of the neighbor's husband to MT and that fact alone could cause MT's testimonty to be useless or something to that effect.

So why the heck didn't LE show MT a lineup? He clearly stated he would recognize the man if he saw him. It seems that anything that may lead away from the parents, LE blows it off.

josie1986
11-14-2011, 03:09 PM
just listened to the broadcast,i love jim spellman.that was the first time ive listened and i just have to say what a brilliant show it was.

so supposidly PN was seen leaving the house with some sort if bag.......oh dear.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk

Hopeful2
11-14-2011, 03:10 PM
I don't know if I put any credence to the duffel bag story because it doesn't seem to be more than a rumor at the moment but what is the significance of the duffel bag to you? I don't think either FCA or S. Smith used a duffel bag. In the UID forum and Namus you see babies that were disposed of in coolers, plastic bags, metal recycling bins, diaper boxes, trash bags, suitcases... so a duffel bag wouldn't stand out to me as anything too odd. People seem to dispose of their babies in containers that are readily available, baby sized, hide the baby from view and possibly able to be weighted down (if they're going to put it in a body of water).
Thanks, Donjeta. I guess what i am asking and expressing very poorly, is for those of you who have been following these cases for some time- what profile would DB fit in if she turns out to be guilty? We havent heard much from those who knew her in her past besides allegedly being an attempted hubby stealer. And while her mom did die young, i just havent heard of things like we heard about FCS or S. Smith. Maybe i should grab a coffee and start over... :blushing:

Donjeta
11-14-2011, 03:23 PM
Thanks, Donjeta. I guess what i am asking and expressing very poorly, is for those of you who have been following these cases for some time- what profile would DB fit in if she turns out to be guilty? We havent heard much from those who knew her in her past besides allegedly being an attempted hubby stealer. And while her mom did die young, i just havent heard of things like we heard about FCS or S. Smith. Maybe i should grab a coffee and start over... :blushing:

Sorry, I misunderstood your question.
It might be a topic for another thread because her profile wasn't discussed on this radio show. Maybe the profile of moms who get too drunk and **** happens?

Mountain_Kat
11-14-2011, 04:06 PM
Great show, guys! :clap:

So, Gil Abeyta is the one who showed MT the pic of JB prior to MT identifying the guy for LE.

Geez. Way to tarnish a possible witness. :rolleyes:

Cazzie
11-14-2011, 04:26 PM
Great show, guys! :clap:

So, Gil Abeyta is the one who showed MT the pic of JB prior to MT identifying the guy for LE.

Geez. Way to tarnish a possible witness. :rolleyes:
This makes more sense; I don't recall exactly what the reporter(s) and MT said (about the photos) in the videos I've seen.

Awhile back, there was discussion here that speculated that it must have been Jersey's photo that MT had previously seen (since it had been reported that LE was going thru the area showing his photo to people), and then ID'd to LE from a photo lineup. Then a reporter (Jim Spellman?) repeatedly stated that the photo ID'd was not Jersey, but he declined to mention whose photo was ID'd.

Soulmagent
11-14-2011, 06:29 PM
Great show, guys! :clap:

So, Gil Abeyta is the one who showed MT the pic of JB prior to MT identifying the guy for LE.

Geez. Way to tarnish a possible witness. :rolleyes:

Or way to get a positive ID on a possible suspect...:waitasec:

The guy was on the news and had talked to LE before Gil showed him the photo. He said the he thought the guy was the handy man hanging out in the area. It makes no sence LE would call him tainted when he was saying it the whole time. He was the first person we heard the handyman story from wasnt he? IMO I think they what attention drawn off JT for whatever reason. I do not think they cleared him at all and thats why his girlfriend made the news. I would like to know what Jim meant when he said JT" pulled up in the yard " and his exs family were trying to keep him away because he had become abusive. What did he pull up in the yard in ? A car or a bike ? (just wondering)

When did Gill show him this photo because in an article MT said a reporter showed him a photo ,and it was within days of Baby lisa being reported missing and I am not sure when Gill became invovled.

annalia
11-14-2011, 06:41 PM
Or way to get a positive ID on a possible suspect...:waitasec:

The guy was on the news and had talked to LE before Gil showed him the photo. He said the he thought the guy was the handy man hanging out in the area. It makes no sence LE would call him tainted when he was saying it the whole time. He was the first person we heard the handyman story from wasnt he? IMO I think they what attention drawn off JT for whatever reason. I do not think they cleared him at all and thats why his girlfriend made the news. I would like to know what Jim meant when he said JT" pulled up in the yard " and his exs family were trying to keep him away because he had become abusive. What did he pull up in the yard in ? A car or a bike ? (just wondering)

When did Gill show him this photo because in an article MT said a reporter showed him a photo ,and it was within days of Baby lisa being reported missing and I am not sure when Gill became invovled.

Wait, who are we talking about? Wasn't the person identified, the one that Gil Abeyta was speaking of, not Jersey? :waitasec:

In da Middle
11-14-2011, 06:48 PM
Or way to get a positive ID on a possible suspect...:waitasec:

The guy was on the news and had talked to LE before Gil showed him the photo. He said the he thought the guy was the handy man hanging out in the area. It makes no sence LE would call him tainted when he was saying it the whole time. He was the first person we heard the handyman story from wasnt he? IMO I think they what attention drawn off JT for whatever reason. I do not think they cleared him at all and thats why his girlfriend made the news. I would like to know what Jim meant when he said JT" pulled up in the yard " and his exs family were trying to keep him away because he had become abusive. What did he pull up in the yard in ? A car or a bike ? (just wondering)

When did Gill show him this photo because in an article MT said a reporter showed him a photo ,and it was within days of Baby lisa being reported missing and I am not sure when Gill became invovled.This is what I remember also. The video is filming the reporter showing him a picture on a phone but not publicly identifying who he said it was. It was right after MT came to public light.

NotSoSherlock
11-14-2011, 06:50 PM
Or way to get a positive ID on a possible suspect...:waitasec:

The guy was on the news and had talked to LE before Gil showed him the photo. He said the he thought the guy was the handy man hanging out in the area. It makes no sence LE would call him tainted when he was saying it the whole time. He was the first person we heard the handyman story from wasnt he? IMO I think they what attention drawn off JT for whatever reason. I do not think they cleared him at all and thats why his girlfriend made the news. I would like to know what Jim meant when he said JT" pulled up in the yard " and his exs family were trying to keep him away because he had become abusive. What did he pull up in the yard in ? A car or a bike ? (just wondering)

When did Gill show him this photo because in an article MT said a reporter showed him a photo ,and it was within days of Baby lisa being reported missing and I am not sure when Gill became invovled.

BBM--I seem remember MW saying that he pulled up in a stolen minivan. Sorry, don't have a link, though.

NotSoSherlock
11-14-2011, 06:53 PM
This is what I remember also. The video is filming the reporter showing him a picture on a phone but not publicly identifying who he said it was. It was right after MT came to public light.

I want to say that was an ABC News reporter. (Dan Abrams? Was he ever on-location?)

Sparklin
11-14-2011, 07:14 PM
This is what I remember also. The video is filming the reporter showing him a picture on a phone but not publicly identifying who he said it was. It was right after MT came to public light.

Yes, that was Jim showing him the photo, but that was after he had already id'ed the guy in a 6 photo page with LE...the problem, I believe is that Gil had already showed JT the photo, which some then believe would be 'leading'.

iamnotagolem
11-14-2011, 07:39 PM
JS has done an amazing job with keeping tweets updated. He even went back and clarified stuff from the show and apologized for saying "husband". What a stand up guy.

In da Middle
11-14-2011, 07:40 PM
Yes, that was Jim showing him the photo, but that was after he had already id'ed the guy in a 6 photo page with LE...the problem, I believe is that Gil had already showed JT the photo, which some then believe would be 'leading'.
I can only hope that LE got the info first no matter who got to him first after that. It really doesn't matter to me who showed it to him asking who he thought it was if it was after LE. If LE didn't ( I am not saying they did or didn't) then that isn't good at all.

Sparklin
11-14-2011, 07:44 PM
I can only hope that LE got the info first no matter who got to him first after that. It really doesn't matter to me who showed it to him asking who he thought it was if it was after LE. If LE didn't ( I am not saying they did or didn't) then that isn't good at all.

Except I think Gil got to him first, then LE, then Jim :(

NotSoSherlock
11-14-2011, 07:59 PM
Here's a link to a video that shows (at about 2:45 into the video) an ABC News reporter showing a picture to MT.


http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/baby-lisa-police-interview-key-witness-14808369

The video is dated 10/25. I remember Jim Spellman showing a picture to MT as well but I thought it was about a week later.

gliving
11-14-2011, 08:06 PM
Except I think Gil got to him first, then LE, then Jim :(

I am so confused. I thought MT called LE first. So then LE does not show him a lineup? Then Gil shows him a photo of SB's husband and MT says that's the guy? How did Gil learn about MT?

Then why does MT describe the man he saw as having salt & pepper hair because that does not describe SB's husband?

"He said the man was standing under a streetlight about 30 feet away and appeared to have medium-length hair that was darker on top and slightly graying on the sides."

(Isabelle Zehnder reporting)

Can anyone help me out? TIA

hambirg
11-14-2011, 08:10 PM
I am so confused. I thought MT called LE first. So then LE does not show him a lineup? Then Gil shows him a photo of SB's husband and MT says that's the guy? How did Gil learn about MT?

Then why does MT describe the man he saw as having salt & pepper hair because that does not describe SB's husband?

"He said the man was standing under a streetlight about 30 feet away and appeared to have medium-length hair that was darker on top and slightly graying on the sides."

(Isabelle Zehnder reporting)

Can anyone help me out? TIA

I think your guess is as good as anyone's. I don't get it either. I think that is why we have to take the MT sighting with a grain of salt.

scmom
11-14-2011, 08:11 PM
MT waited a week before calling LE, which would have been the 11th or 12th of October. LE talked to him before any reports by the media were made public.
http://www.kmbc.com/news/29547997/detail.html#ixzz1bPtXUXIx

gliving
11-14-2011, 08:18 PM
MT waited a week before calling LE, which would have been the 11th or 12th of October. LE talked to him before any reports by the media were made public.

Thanks! So surely LE would ask MT to describe the man and baby he saw. I don't see how Gil going to MT later would discredit MT. MT had already given a statement to LE.

NotSoSherlock
11-14-2011, 08:19 PM
MT waited a week before calling LE, which would have been the 11th or 12th of October. LE talked to him before any reports by the media were made public.

What I have always wondered is if MT reported the sighting before or after the 100,000 dollar reward was offered. These two events occurred in the same time frame. Obviously, a large sum of money might cause some people to have ulterior motives.

All JMO.

Hopeful2
11-14-2011, 08:26 PM
What I have always wondered is if MT reported the sighting before or after the 100,000 dollar reward was offered. These two events occurred in the same time frame. Obviously, a large sum of money might cause some people to have ulterior motives.

All JMO.
except that he gave a different description from the husband/ wife sighting ("bald"). So how does one think they are eligible for the reward money by giving any old random description? Maybe because he also described a baby in only a diaper do you mean?

NotSoSherlock
11-14-2011, 08:29 PM
except that he gave a different description from the husband/ wife sighting ("bald"). So how does one think they are eligible for the reward money by giving any old random description? Maybe because he also described a baby in only a diaper do you mean?

Well, I guess I'm not really saying anything. Just thinking out loud, really.

Nixie
11-14-2011, 09:02 PM
Listened to the show and just found Jim Spellman's twitter and he is really great about answering questions with just the facts he knows. It is very helpful in cases like this!

iamnotagolem
11-14-2011, 09:07 PM
JS on MT's picking out lineup pic:

jimspellmancnn jim spellman
And to add a bit of clarity about MT and the photos. Gil took him photos first and he IDed a man as being the person he saw. GA then...

jimspellmancnn jim spellman
..brough this to Cyndy SHorts attention and CS took MT to the KCPD. They interviewed him fro 2 hours and did their own photo array...

jimspellmancnn jim spellman
And he again IDed the same guy. I got all this from MT, GA and CS. So, he did ID the man to LE but after he IDed him to Gil.

jimspellmancnn jim spellman
We arent sure how Gil conducted his photo array, but KCPD tells me that since Gil had already seen pictures his testimony is ruined.

jimspellmancnn jim spellman
I hope that clarifies MT and his photo ID. I hope this also explains why I haven't named this man , who i have met and am in contact with

jimspellmancnn jim spellman
and says he didn't have anything to do with this. The reason I have said that Jersey is not the man he IDed is because previous on air

jimspellmancnn jim spellman
discussions by others may have implied that and I wanted to be sure we were leaving anyone with the impression that were accusing Jersey

jimspellmancnn jim spellman
of that, especially since he wasnt the person IDed! If this is of any interest to any one feel free to Cut and paste over there.

Sparklin
11-14-2011, 09:25 PM
I am so confused. I thought MT called LE first. So then LE does not show him a lineup? Then Gil shows him a photo of SB's husband and MT says that's the guy? How did Gil learn about MT?

Then why does MT describe the man he saw as having salt & pepper hair because that does not describe SB's husband?

"He said the man was standing under a streetlight about 30 feet away and appeared to have medium-length hair that was darker on top and slightly graying on the sides."

(Isabelle Zehnder reporting)

Can anyone help me out? TIA


From Jim Spellman: I moved the order so it was clearer instead of bottom to top :)

jimspellmancnn jim spellman
And to add a bit of clarity about MT and the photos. Gil took him photos first and he IDed a man as being the person he saw. GA then...

jimspellmancnn jim spellman
..brough this to Cyndy SHorts attention and CS took MT to the KCPD. They interviewed him fro 2 hours and did their own photo array...
2 hours ago

jimspellmancnn jim spellman
And he again IDed the same guy. I got all this from MT, GA and CS. So, he did ID the man to LE but after he IDed him to Gil.
2 hours ago Favorite Retweet Reply

jimspellmancnn jim spellman
We arent sure how Gil conducted his photo array, but KCPD tells me that since Gil had already seen pictures his testimony is ruined.
2 hours ago

**Iamnotagolem, we were posting at the same time :)

gliving
11-14-2011, 09:41 PM
Thanks Sparklin and iamnotagolem!

Now, how did Gil know MT if MT hadn't even been to the police yet?

Soulmagent
11-14-2011, 09:51 PM
Except I think Gil got to him first, then LE, then Jim :(

How did Gil get to him first if he had already talked to LE before ever doing the first media interveiw? The very first desciption I saw from MT said the man had dark hair and appeared to be in his 30's ,I saw nothing of gray hair.

I dont really care about his court testimony at this point. What it hasnt done is ruin the investigation , so has there been any links on the stolen van?


Also if the rumor of the duffel bag is true ,Could Jersy and his ex be mistaken from DB and her brother ?

Nixie
11-14-2011, 09:57 PM
I think it is possible that every piece of information in this case, for some reason, just has to be confusing. Why would a person who knew anything about the law, well meaning or not, take it upon themselves to start showing witnesses pictures? This case is already so messed up with all the information out there, I am sure its reasons like this LE isn't talking about what they know. When a witness is tainted like this they can't help anymore, and even if they find out what happened, it doesn't do much good if they can't punish whoever is involved.

Truthwillsetufree
11-14-2011, 09:59 PM
since we are not to carry this info into other threads, can somebody give me a scenario- any scenario- where a mom would place her deceased baby into a duffle bag? I know FCA and S. Smith had deep psychological problems but have yet to hear that about DB. And i am totally off the fence as of yesterday, so i am not looking for a debate. Just interested in opinions. TIA

I don't recall that FICA has been diagnosed (publicly) with deep psychological problems.
In the begining of the Smith and Anthony case, by all accounts they were portrayed as good mothers. It took some time for the truth to come out. My opinion is, some people are just mean, cruel and selfish and their wants and needs come before that of their child or children.

NotSoSherlock
11-14-2011, 10:50 PM
How did Gil get to him first if he had already talked to LE before ever doing the first media interveiw? The very first desciption I saw from MT said the man had dark hair and appeared to be in his 30's ,I saw nothing of gray hair.

I dont really care about his court testimony at this point. What it hasnt done is ruin the investigation , so has there been any links on the stolen van?


Also if the rumor of the duffel bag is true ,Could Jersy and his ex be mistaken from DB and her brother ?

BBM

Megan Wright's FB Q&A page may be the only source for the stolen min van information. I'm pretty sure we can mention stuff on that page per the rules outlined in this thread:


MW Defends Herself on Facebook

Here's a quote from MW:



"The last time I talked to/saw Jersey was about a week after I ended the relationship. He walked up the street, tried to talk to me and I got inside as quickly as possible. He ended up being invited in and got into a fight with a friend of mine. He was thrown out of the house and I haven't heard from him since. I was told that he showed up about 4 or 5 days after Lisa went missing in [what happened to be] a stolen mini van. And in less time that I could be told that he was outside, fly up the stairs and get to the porch, he was gone."

Based on that quote it seems like this may be second-hand information to MW. That is, she didn't see Jersey or the mini van. She also doesn't mention how it was learned that the mini van was stolen. LE may have told her that at some later point, however.

Mods: Delete this post if I misunderstood that we could discuss the information that MW posted to her Q&A page.