View Full Version : Dr. Phil Show Nov.14th / 15th.
lauriej
11-14-2011, 05:29 AM
http://www.drphil.com/shows/ (http://www.drphil.com/shows/)
Monday - November 14, 2011
--snipped--
Was it suicide or foul play? On July 13, Rebecca Zahau, 32, was found dead in a historic California mansion owned by her boyfriend, Medicis Pharmaceuticals CEO Jonah Shacknai. Investigators say Shacknai’s brother found the woman nude, hanging from a second-story balcony off the guest room of the main house with her feet bound and hands tied behind her back....
---http://i1207.photobucket.com/albums/bb474/lauriejcampbell/drpmonday.jpg
The Mysterious Death of Rebecca Zahau---Monday.
Tuesday - November 15, 2011
--snipped--
New details of Rebecca Zahau’s death emerge: Was the scene staged to deceive the police into believing she committed suicide?
And, forensic pathologist Dr. Cyril Wecht — whose expertise was critical to the investigations of Anna Nicole Smith, JonBenet Ramsey and O.J. Simpson — reveals his findings after examining Zahau's exhumed remains. Does he think foul play was involved? Plus, Dr. Phil shares his conversation with San Diego County Sheriff Bill Gore. Is there enough new evidence to re-open the case?
---http://i1207.photobucket.com/albums/bb474/lauriejcampbell/drptuesday.jpg
Rebecca Zahau: The New Autopsy Results Revealed---Tuesday
coastal
11-14-2011, 11:18 AM
Thanks for the reminder, lauriej! And, thanks to (not a) Dr. Phil, we already have some new facts about Rebecca's death:
http://drphil.com/slideshows/slideshow/6576/?id=6576&showID=1731
>>>snip
Anne (Bremner) says that they are hoping to ask the Attorney General to launch an independent investigation to reexamine the evidence. “The fact is: This was a rush to judgment,” she explains. “This is a case [where] there is blood in the shower that wasn’t analyzed. There were footprints in the kitchen — not analyzed. There was underwear — not analyzed. There were blows to Becky’s head — not even considered. She has lividity — the medical condition caused when blood settles after death — in her back, not in her legs or feet usually caused from hanging. There was so much known to the sheriffs and not followed up on back then.” Anne says that computer analysis shows that someone was on the home computer after she was found dead. The setting in of rigor mortis doesn’t work into the timeline either, she explains.
<<<snip
I'm ashamed to admit I'm sitting on the edge of my chair, waiting for this show...
I do hope LE can and will explain their thought process in such a way that I can consider trusting their judgement - and their ethics - again.
Prayers for Rebecca and her loved ones.
Godspeed them peace.
Mrs. Holmes
11-14-2011, 11:35 AM
I can't watch I don't have cable or a TV. But the snippets alone on the Dr. Phil website are astounding.
Footprints in the kitchen, someone on the computer after she was dead, mixed DNA? What in the world will the SDSO say to this?
Mrs. Holmes
11-14-2011, 11:57 AM
There is an image on the Dr. Phil show website... Is this the text from AS to JS? Wow!
http://www.drphil.com/slideshows/slideshow/6575/?id=6575&showID=1731
AS
I got a girl.... hung herself.
It doesn't say who? But apparently JS doesn't call his brother to find out what girl?
Carpe Pacem
11-14-2011, 01:39 PM
Coastal and Mrs. Holmes, thank you so much for the above.
It puzzles me that our numbers have dwindled down to only a few (sometimes I'm the only member here).
Hoping hard for a new investigation!
There is an image on the Dr. Phil show website... Is this the text from AS to JS? Wow!
http://www.drphil.com/slideshows/slideshow/6575/?id=6575&showID=1731
AS
I got a girl.... hung herself.
It doesn't say who? But apparently JS doesn't call his brother to find out what girl?
Think this might be written audio of the 911 call, because of the stammer a, a. Jmo. Dr Phil isn't on here until late so if anyone has seen it can you please post any important details. Tia!!
lauriej
11-14-2011, 02:40 PM
There is an image on the Dr. Phil show website... Is this the text from AS to JS? Wow!
http://www.drphil.com/slideshows/slideshow/6575/?id=6575&showID=1731
AS
I got a girl.... hung herself.
It doesn't say who? But apparently JS doesn't call his brother to find out what girl?
..now why, if you see someone tied up /gagged and hanging , do you call 911 and say that she did this to herself?
..and to refer to rebecca as "a girl" instead of my brother's girlfriend..?
..i can't wait to hear the entire call.
stilettos
11-14-2011, 02:44 PM
I am disgusted at the SDSO shoddy "investigation" (epic fail) into this poor woman's death.
coastal
11-14-2011, 03:17 PM
Coastal and Mrs. Holmes, thank you so much for the above.
It puzzles me that our numbers have dwindled down to only a few (sometimes I'm the only member here).
Hoping hard for a new investigation!
It puzzles me too, Carpe Pacem. Sometimes I feel like everything has already been said, and said better, than I could do, so I don't post. I am reading, though, and trying to make some sense of the few facts we have.
I can't do it.
Yet.
Hoping with you...
lauriej
11-14-2011, 03:46 PM
I can't watch I don't have cable or a TV. But the snippets alone on the Dr. Phil website are astounding.
Footprints in the kitchen, someone on the computer after she was dead, mixed DNA? What in the world will the SDSO say to this?
..i don't get it on my TV either---this may help.
..the dr.phil show is coming on at this link "at 4 p.m." ( of course i'm not sure what time zone they're referring to......currently 'let's make a deal is on'.)
http://www.azwatch.tv/view/22658/
sundrop
11-14-2011, 03:48 PM
I thought Dr. Phil seemed skeptical
LaMer
11-14-2011, 03:57 PM
Does anyone know if Dr. Phil programs put up a transcript? Heard some of the show, then dangit a phone call!
From what I did hear, doesn't sound like Rebecca commited suicide.
Mrs. Holmes
11-14-2011, 04:07 PM
I thought Dr. Phil seemed skeptical
Yeah his "uncensored" video on the website seemed skpetical. He also came off as somewhat condescencing to me. His people don't seem to know how to do "real" research. He doesn't want to make any kind of stand one way or the other IMO. I wonder if he got a letter from JS's lawyers?
I wonder what tommorow's show will bring?
Bonepile
11-14-2011, 04:07 PM
Dr. Phil's shows are available in DVD format and once tomorrow's show (Tuesday) is over I will inquire as to is it available yet.
Bonepile
11-14-2011, 04:09 PM
Coastal and Mrs. Holmes, thank you so much for the above.
It puzzles me that our numbers have dwindled down to only a few (sometimes I'm the only member here).
Hoping hard for a new investigation!
But we are still here and we do make a difference. It is not the number of us that matter it is our thoughts, our prayers, and just standing here together.
Truthwillsetufree
11-14-2011, 04:13 PM
watching Dr. Phil now.......
http://www.azwatch.tv/view/22658/
lauriej
11-14-2011, 04:22 PM
watching Dr. Phil now.......
http://www.azwatch.tv/view/22658/
--watching it live as well.
--anne B.--someone went on her computer after she died
--sheriff gore told dr.phil that's wrong, it was accessed before her time of death
--did you catch what TIME the comp. was accessed ?? (my phone rang and i missed it if it was said.)
Truthwillsetufree
11-14-2011, 04:24 PM
So far the most intriguing thigs so far...
1. Balcony doors closed.
2. Rebeccas feet, according to sister, were filthy, not jsut dirty from dust on balcony but filthy and no dirty footprints on carpet.
3. Ladies underwear found in trash can in guest house not investigated.
4. Someone used Rebecca's computer after her death.
Back on.......
Truthwillsetufree
11-14-2011, 04:24 PM
--watching it live as well.
--anne B.--someone went on her computer after she died
--sheriff gore told dr.phil that's wrong, it was accessed before her time of death
--did you catch what TIME the comp. was accessed ?? (my phone rang and i missed it if it was said.)
I thought they said 3:02....could be wrong though...
coastal
11-14-2011, 04:29 PM
Appreciate you transcribing for us, Truthwillsetyoufree!
http://www.cosgan.de/images/midi/froehlich/a070.gifThanks!
Truthwillsetufree
11-14-2011, 04:32 PM
Appreciate you transcribing for us, Truthwillsetyoufree!
http://www.cosgan.de/images/midi/froehlich/a070.gifThanks!
Your welcome. I'm not very good at it though. I get to listening and forget to write. Next up a PI went to San Diego to do some investigating.
Truthwillsetufree
11-14-2011, 04:33 PM
Oh, there was a re-enactment of Rebecca tying hersrlf up and they used a punching bag to simulate her body and the bed moved feet not inches!
dizzychick
11-14-2011, 04:35 PM
Thank you for this thread. I was waiting for this show. I think it was delayed and wonder why. Was that the brother on the 911 call? This is the 1st time ive heard it. How did he know " SHE HUNG HERSELF"???? She was hung, true but how did he know SHE did it?
Also could someone have suffocated her and then hung her while holding the rope tight which made the bed only move inches as opposed to the test run where it flew across the room?
MURDER! IMO
Truthwillsetufree
11-14-2011, 04:42 PM
Ok, Additional footprints in house not analyzed, blood in shower not analyzed, underwear in guesthouse not analyzed.
Only 3 people DNA obtained from. Nina, Little Sister and Brother.
Jonah did not give sample DNA.
There are items with mixed DNA, gloves, knife and bedframe. not able to identify the mixed DNA.
Truthwillsetufree
11-14-2011, 04:50 PM
The PI went to San Diego, talked with neighbors and one set of neighbors state emphatically that they heard a woman scream, scream for help at 10:20 pm....
PI states this is a staged homicide, too elaborate. He also says if Rebecca had actually jumped from this height, with this rope she would have sustained more severe injuries.....
dizzychick
11-14-2011, 04:52 PM
Im so glad that PI got involved. I hope they catch the one/ones that did this ! and the one that hired them!
Where did that rope come from? Who bought it? There should be a recipt and most folks use a debit card or credit card. Was there a bill for this? Her bill? doubt it!
"This is so staged "the PI said is the understatement of the year!
sorrell skye
11-14-2011, 04:55 PM
The PI mentioned confirmation bias - he said LE only looked for evidence or information that confirmed the suicide scenario (paraphrasing).
This is what we here have been saying all along.
I missed the first part of the show - so a big TY for the transcriptions!
BTW - hi everyone! :seeya:
Truthwillsetufree
11-14-2011, 04:56 PM
The neighbors did not call 911 according to the PI because they only heard the one scream. PI also states LE suffers from confirmation bias. This is where they come up with their theory "suicide" and anything that differs from their theory is not looked at. Once LE's theory is in place, they are very reluctant to change it according to the PI.
sorrell skye
11-14-2011, 04:58 PM
I'm so grateful to Dr. Phil for covering this case. I'm looking forward to the 2nd segment tomorrow.
arielilane
11-14-2011, 05:03 PM
Thank you everyone for your posts. I'm looking forward to watching dr phil tonight (dvd from this morning). http://www.wuerziworld.de/Smilies/ah/ah7.gif
Truthwillsetufree
11-14-2011, 05:03 PM
That's it until tomorrow.....
MOO. I didn't need convincing, I have thought this was shoddy police work from the begining. The police chief has talked with Dr. Phil and assured Dr. Phil that if new evidence is presented he will re-open the case....oh really????? Considering that LE didn't look at the evidence they had right in front of them, I don't see why it is on the victim's family to have to bring forth new evidence.
I do pray for Peace for RZ and her loving family.
Truthwillsetufree
11-14-2011, 05:06 PM
FWIW...I didn't write down the PI's name but I like this guy. Tells it like it is, doesn't sugar coat it. When I envision a PI, it looks and talks like him.
sorrell skye
11-14-2011, 05:15 PM
FWIW...I didn't write down the PI's name but I like this guy. Tells it like it is, doesn't sugar coat it. When I envision a PI, it looks and talks like him.
The PI's name is Paul Ciolino.
I like him, too.
Here's his website:
http://www.pjcinvestigations.com/home.htm
ETA: Dan Rather gave him an endorsement as one of America's top 5 investigators.
Peazzzer
11-14-2011, 05:18 PM
Oh wow! Just as some have suspected all along! JS was above calling his brother back, trying to reach RZ when he received that text and was above having a DNA test? It is as they say-money talks, BS WALKS. Yes, I realize the situation w his son in the hosp., so my question is what time did RZ send her sister the text where she sounded hopeful towards the boy and being there for JS? Wow.
coastal
11-14-2011, 07:50 PM
Quote from Forensic Psychiatrist Mark Kalish:
"This isn't a suicide."
Wow. If I hadn't been reading everything I can find wrt Rebecca's death, I'd be thinking there isn't much evidence for either suicide or for murder.
I did miss some of the show, so maybe there was more.
Paraphrased, this comment from Sheriff Gore, via (not a) Dr. Phil:
...To date, no one has brought us new evidence to investigate...
Also paraphrased, Anne B.'s response:
...We will ask the CA Attorney General for a new investigation...
Wait. Why not take the questions back to Sheriff Gore, Anne, instead of jumping straight over his head to the AG? IANAL, but that seems to me like a great way to ensure Gore's office(rs) won't cooperate with a new investigation.:waitasec: Is the goal here a new and better investigation to determine who caused Rebecca's death, or an investigation into the SDSO's (clearly unsatisfactory) investigation? Because these are not the same thing at all!
Color me http://www.cosgan.de/images/midi/konfus/a035.gif confused as ever.
lauriej
11-14-2011, 07:51 PM
----------can't wait until we hear the entire 911 call.
..adam---"I've got a girl...she hung herself."
( dispatch asks if she's alive..)
..adam--- "Are you alive?" He responds to 911 "I don't think so."
--------------good grief!
dizzychick
11-14-2011, 08:02 PM
Does anyone know of any mental disorders in the man of the house? Like explosive disorder or the like? Just wondering
sundrop
11-14-2011, 08:33 PM
http://www.10news.com/news/29715783/detail.html?treets=sand&tml=sand_break&ts=T&tmi=sand_break_1_04540111142011
Mrs. Holmes
11-14-2011, 09:13 PM
http://www.10news.com/news/29715783/detail.html?treets=sand&tml=sand_break&ts=T&tmi=sand_break_1_04540111142011
That original story was written on Nov. 8th and updated. It has many errors. Not to mention that the results of the autopsy have not been aired yet and that there was no audience. Unbelievable. What is in the water in San Diego? NBC is just ignoring the whole thing because CBS is getting exclusives? This news coverage is disturbing.
Here is what CBS had to say.
http://www.760kfmb.com/story/16039227/dr-phil-airs-new-evidence-in-coronado-mansion-mystery
SophieRose
11-14-2011, 09:21 PM
Thanks for the reminder, lauriej! And, thanks to (not a) Dr. Phil, we already have some new facts about Rebecca's death:
http://drphil.com/slideshows/slideshow/6576/?id=6576&showID=1731
>>>snip
Anne (Bremner) says that they are hoping to ask the Attorney General to launch an independent investigation to reexamine the evidence. “The fact is: This was a rush to judgment,” she explains. “This is a case [where] there is blood in the shower that wasn’t analyzed. There were footprints in the kitchen — not analyzed. There was underwear — not analyzed. There were blows to Becky’s head — not even considered. She has lividity — the medical condition caused when blood settles after death — in her back, not in her legs or feet usually caused from hanging. There was so much known to the sheriffs and not followed up on back then.” Anne says that computer analysis shows that someone was on the home computer after she was found dead. The setting in of rigor mortis doesn’t work into the timeline either, she explains.
Why are they HOPING to ask the Attorney General to launch an independent investigation to reexamine evidence. You either ask or you don't. What's holding that back?
Only thing I can think is if a wrongful lawsuit is filed. JS request for a review refused, and if a complete reinvestigation is refused by DOJ, might not look good.
Mrs. Holmes
11-14-2011, 09:54 PM
Here is a very revealing quote from Dr. Phil
"You always have to consider that the family just doesn't want to accept that a family member has taken their own life," Dr. Phil said. "But in this case, I have to say, there is troubling evidence, both in terms of victimology and in terms of the actual scene and how it dovetails with the forensic findings from the forensic autopsy."
I feel quite confident Dr. CW 's results will find evidence of foul play. The PI's line about how the damage to RZ's neck should have been far more severe is telling.
SDSO can't be trusted to handle this case effectively as they are forced into a corner by their own actions. An independent investigation instigated by the AG's office is a must. Fresh brains, eyes and attitude to get to the bottom of this death.
branwynbreeze
11-14-2011, 09:57 PM
This case is unbelievable. SDPD can either reopen case or dig in their heels and look like fools.
JMO
Mrs. Holmes
11-14-2011, 10:08 PM
I think the SDSO's office needs to wake up and realize that AB is NEVER coming to you with the new evidence. You had your chance the first time and severely botched it.
This will go to the AG. I think thre SDSO's statements about not seeing the evidence are "rich" considering how long it took them to hand over a copy of the "closed" case file. SDSO I believe declined to have a member of their office attend the second autopsy and declined to participate in the show. This cash strapped family had to resort to pimping themselves on the Dr. Phil show to be able to afford financing their efforts to find justice. SDSO has completely snubbed this family and now cries foul they are not being involved. Ugh!
GutInstinct
11-14-2011, 10:13 PM
----------can't wait until we hear the entire 911 call.
..adam---"I've got a girl...she hung herself."
( dispatch asks if she's alive..)
..adam--- "Are you alive?" He responds to 911 "I don't think so."
--------------good grief!
has anyone done any good sleuthing on the brother?....something's up with that guy IMO
SophieRose
11-14-2011, 10:14 PM
The PI went to San Diego, talked with neighbors and one set of neighbors state emphatically that they heard a woman scream, scream for help at 10:20 pm....
PI states this is a staged homicide, too elaborate. He also says if Rebecca had actually jumped from this height, with this rope she would have sustained more severe injuries.....
10:20 pm is also the time the bicyclist describes a woman at the Spreckels mansion as he was passing by. Why didn't he mention a scream for help?
Mrs. Holmes
11-14-2011, 10:19 PM
Quote from Forensic Psychiatrist Mark Kalish:
"This isn't a suicide."
Wow. If I hadn't been reading everything I can find wrt Rebecca's death, I'd be thinking there isn't much evidence for either suicide or for murder.
I did miss some of the show, so maybe there was more.
Paraphrased, this comment from Sheriff Gore, via (not a) Dr. Phil:
...To date, no one has brought us new evidence to investigate...
Also paraphrased, Anne B.'s response:
...We will ask the CA Attorney General for a new investigation...
Wait. Why not take the questions back to Sheriff Gore, Anne, instead of jumping straight over his head to the AG? IANAL, but that seems to me like a great way to ensure Gore's office(rs) won't cooperate with a new investigation.:waitasec: Is the goal here a new and better investigation to determine who caused Rebecca's death, or an investigation into the SDSO's (clearly unsatisfactory) investigation? Because these are not the same thing at all!
Color me http://www.cosgan.de/images/midi/konfus/a035.gif confused as ever.
AB has to walk a careful line here for her clients. SDSO could see a lawsuit one day. By the end of the show tommorow I bet they will be begging to get the new evidence from AB to save their jobs. How embarassing for them but they put themselves there. They dug their heels in and now they look like fools. IMO.
Mrs. Holmes
11-14-2011, 10:22 PM
10:20 pm is also the time the bicyclist describes a woman at the Spreckels mansion as he was passing by. Why didn't he mention a scream for help?
I would think those times are aproximate, at the very least there could be a five minute discerphency either way.
Mrs. Holmes
11-14-2011, 10:44 PM
I just looked over Dr. WG's information. He seemed to be doing a good job and has some interesting findings. He got removed from the "inncer circle" not sure why. Here is a link to his findings.
http://www.drmauricegodwin.com/rebeccazahau.html
defense101
11-14-2011, 11:11 PM
----------can't wait until we hear the entire 911 call.
..adam---"I've got a girl...she hung herself."
( dispatch asks if she's alive..)
..adam--- "Are you alive?" He responds to 911 "I don't think so."
--------------good grief! I agree Lauriej, anyone who saw the original photos of Rebecca on the lawn that were not blurred could tell that she was definitely dead, but he who holds her cold body partially in rigor while he supposedly cuts her down carries her to the grass asks ARE YOU ALIVE??? Are you kidding me? Unfortunately that was the only thing new in the whole show, I hope tomorrow brings something new to us.
Oh my mistake there was the computer being used at 3:02, that's new. I wonder what it was used for? What webpages were accessed or what files were accessed? Did they do forensics on the computer?
jjenny
11-14-2011, 11:19 PM
Are you alive? Well at least AS wasn't asking RZ if she was dead.
:rolleyes:
defense101
11-14-2011, 11:44 PM
The Sheriff's department declined to respond to specific evidence aired on the Dr. Phil Show, but issued a statement saying:
To date, neither our detectives, nor the Medical Examiner's Office have been presented with any evidence from this second autopsy. If Dr. Wecht or Miss Bremner would like to share information they believe is pertinent with our investigators, we would be glad to meet with them, rather than hear their results on television presented as entertainment.
Hmmm I wonder why they haven't shared the information? Could it be that they know already what the sheriffs department would do with the information had it been shared prior to the show? IMO it would have been publicly discounted to get the jump on it being aired.
I also now know why I never watched Dr Phil before, incredibly condescending in my opinion.
Truthwillsetufree
11-14-2011, 11:58 PM
The Sheriff's department declined to respond to specific evidence aired on the Dr. Phil Show, but issued a statement saying:
To date, neither our detectives, nor the Medical Examiner's Office have been presented with any evidence from this second autopsy. If Dr. Wecht or Miss Bremner would like to share information they believe is pertinent with our investigators, we would be glad to meet with them, rather than hear their results on television presented as entertainment.
Hmmm I wonder why they haven't shared the information? Could it be that they know already what the sheriffs department would do with the information had it been shared prior to the show? IMO it would have been publicly discounted to get the jump on it being aired.
I also now know why I never watched Dr Phil before, incredibly condescending in my opinion.
BBM-Agree. The only reason I watched is because this is the avenue the family took to get their story to light and I wanted to know new information. Dr. Phil's commentary means nothing to me as he blew any credibility he had when he played host to the A's on his show. His opinions mean nothing to me.
Truthwillsetufree
11-15-2011, 12:01 AM
I think the SDSO's office needs to wake up and realize that AB is NEVER coming to you with the new evidence. You had your chance the first time and severely botched it.
This will go to the AG. I think thre SDSO's statements about not seeing the evidence are "rich" considering how long it took them to hand over a copy of the "closed" case file. SDSO I believe declined to have a member of their office attend the second autopsy and declined to participate in the show. This cash strapped family had to resort to pimping themselves on the Dr. Phil show to be able to afford financing their efforts to find justice. SDSO has completely snubbed this family and now cries foul they are not being involved. Ugh!
:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:
Truthwillsetufree
11-15-2011, 12:04 AM
10:20 pm is also the time the bicyclist describes a woman at the Spreckels mansion as he was passing by. Why didn't he mention a scream for help?
I certainly couldn't tell ya....Maybe he had ear phones in and didn't hear, lots of riders listen to their ipods as they are bicycling. I just don't know.
Truthwillsetufree
11-15-2011, 12:07 AM
AB has to walk a careful line here for her clients. SDSO could see a lawsuit one day. By the end of the show tommorow I bet they will be begging to get the new evidence from AB to save their jobs. How embarassing for them but they put themselves there. They dug their heels in and now they look like fools. IMO.
Just to clarify...SDSO looked like fools before now......just sayin'. JMO.
tvscum
11-15-2011, 12:23 AM
10:20 pm is also the time the bicyclist describes a woman at the Spreckels mansion as he was passing by. Why didn't he mention a scream for help?
I actually believe the PI mispoke when he said "10:20" and the screams were actually heard at 11:20pm.
dovebar
11-15-2011, 12:36 AM
The neighbor didn't call 911? I don't know how they can live with themselves. Did they think a person in distress should be able to repeat their cry for help? Be able to deliver a long soliloquoy? "Help, my boyfriend who is angry at me for his son's accident is tying me up and torturing me!"
Sadly, it reminds me a self-defense class I took where they said that if you are in trouble, you should try to scream, "Fire! Fire!" People respond to that.
Carpe Pacem
11-15-2011, 01:02 AM
Something makes me think Dr. Wecht's opinion will be either inconclusive or leaning toward murder. That's because Dr. P. gave out the contact info to make donations to the Zahau's effort for justice.
No reason to donate if not for more investigation, right?
Charlie09
11-15-2011, 01:30 AM
Coastal and Mrs. Holmes, thank you so much for the above.
It puzzles me that our numbers have dwindled down to only a few (sometimes I'm the only member here).
Hoping hard for a new investigation!
still here...reading, usually several days behind, but still checking.
Mrs. Holmes
11-15-2011, 09:35 AM
That original story was written on Nov. 8th and updated. It has many errors. Not to mention that the results of the autopsy have not been aired yet and that there was no audience. Unbelievable. What is in the water in San Diego? NBC is just ignoring the whole thing because CBS is getting exclusives? This news coverage is disturbing.
Here is what CBS had to say.
http://www.760kfmb.com/story/16039227/dr-phil-airs-new-evidence-in-coronado-mansion-mystery
I noted that his story was re-written today.
"Dr. Phil Finds Nothing New in Zahau Case"
http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/dr-phil-zahau-spreckels-suicide-133849803.html
Although there was plenty of new information brought to the publics' attention this story refused to outline them.
IWannaKnow
11-15-2011, 10:29 AM
Coastal and Mrs. Holmes, thank you so much for the above.
It puzzles me that our numbers have dwindled down to only a few (sometimes I'm the only member here).
Hoping hard for a new investigation!
Too many things about this case cannot be discussed (rumor, innuendo, unprovable, TOS etc), so that doesn't leave much to discuss IMO. Turns active posters into lurkers - in my case anyway. Very happy Rebecca is getting time and attention again and I don't really care who it is....Dr Phil or the Easter bunny. If they can provide answers I am happy to hear them.
peace9274
11-15-2011, 10:54 AM
Too many things about this case cannot be discussed (rumor, innuendo, unprovable, TOS etc), so that doesn't leave much to discuss IMO. Turns active posters into lurkers - in my case anyway. Very happy Rebecca is getting time and attention again and I don't really care who it is....Dr Phil or the Easter bunny. If they can provide answers I am happy to hear them.
I wanted to include and bold your last sentence... "Has this link been posted?"
But it wasn't included nor was the link... :waitasec:
Thank you for posting the link. I hadn't seen it. A good read!! :)
ETA: Well, it isn't there anymore in your post. I guess you removed it while I was writing my comments.
Is there a reason you deleted it? TIA
Mrs. Holmes
11-15-2011, 11:37 AM
"There are real inconsistencies which show there may have been foul play involved," McGraw said in an interview with 3TV Monday night.
http://www.azfamily.com/news/10/Zahau-family-speaks-with-Dr-Phil-on-results-of-new-autopsy-133848183.html
looking forward to today's show....
lauriej
11-15-2011, 12:34 PM
..there are quite a number of very interesting promo pieces to click around on for today's part 2 here:
http://drphil.com/shows/show/1737/
---Now empty and for sale, Paul says it's not likely he'll find any new evidence at the San Diego mansion.
“There’s no preservation of the scene at all,” Dr. Phil comments.
“It’s shot,” Paul agrees, noting that the death scene has been compromised by prospective buyers and people walking the grounds and taking pictures.
Paul also says that he spoke to a witness who claims to have seen a woman near the property on the night Rebecca died, and described that woman's behavior as "bizarre."
“It’s just astonishing. It’s a case that just cries out for answers,” Anne says, adding that “mixed DNA” was found under Rebecca's fingernails. “There’s a lot of work left to be done. There will be answers — I believe it.”
Truthwillsetufree
11-15-2011, 12:42 PM
The neighbor didn't call 911? I don't know how they can live with themselves. Did they think a person in distress should be able to repeat their cry for help? Be able to deliver a long soliloquoy? "Help, my boyfriend who is angry at me for his son's accident is tying me up and torturing me!"
Sadly, it reminds me a self-defense class I took where they said that if you are in trouble, you should try to scream, "Fire! Fire!" People respond to that.
True. I have instructed my girls since they were little that if they needed help to scream Fire! People are more inclined to run to you to help.
I would guess that these neighbors are heartsick that they didn't call 911. Hindsight is always 20/20.
wondering?
11-15-2011, 12:44 PM
A good show and some new info from Dr. Cyril Wecht and the case should be reopened.
Some how it just seems impossible that if Rebecca was so distraught to have considered suicide she would not have gone to all the trouble of all the tying up, the shirt in the mouth etc.
Interesting that Dr. Wecht said in all his experience, he has never seen a suicide by a woman who was nude. Said that just does not happen.
I feel so sorry for Rebecca's family to be going through this.
sdcali
11-15-2011, 12:49 PM
Still here, popping in to see if anything new has been posted and keeping my ears open here in San Diego...
MissJames
11-15-2011, 12:54 PM
True. I have instructed my girls since they were little that if they needed help to scream Fire! People are more inclined to run to you to help.
I would guess that these neighbors are heartsick that they didn't call 911. Hindsight is always 20/20.
A couple of weeks ago I joined friends of mine to help them with their daughter,who has severe autism ,while they trained for their service dog.
We shared a hotel suite that had separate bedrooms,LR and kitchen.
On the last night the child was just exhausted and at the end of her ability to cope.
She wanted something at bedtime and when she was told "no" she let out a blood curdling scream that seemed to go on forever.
Mom was able to quickly calm her ,but I was waiting for LE or someone from the hotel to come knocking at the door.
It never happened. If I was in a hotel and heard a child scream like that I would report it.I'd rather be wrong than find out later something had happened to the person.
peace9274
11-15-2011, 12:57 PM
True. I have instructed my girls since they were little that if they needed help to scream Fire! People are more inclined to run to you to help.
I would guess that these neighbors are heartsick that they didn't call 911. Hindsight is always 20/20.
And if you scream, "HELP-FIRE"... and even if no one comes to help... hopefully it'll cause them to at least call 911!
MissJames
11-15-2011, 01:14 PM
Forgive me ,since I haven't followed this case closely ,but do authorities know where the rope came from?
I don't believe Rebecca committed suicide,but Dr. Phil said something concerning Rebecca's state of mind earlier that week ,even that day, that would indicate she was not planning to commit suicide.
Our son committed an impulsive suicide .We know this because it was New Years Eve and he was making plans for that evening and for returning to school the following Monday.
He sat on his glasses earlier that week and that morning he asked my husband to get his glasses fixed when he ran some errands,because he needed them for school.
He also gave him a list of the fireworks he wanted for that night when his cousin ,who was his best friend ,came to spend the night.
Something happened in the following hours and he was gone .We kind of know some things ,but I don't want to put any blame on anyone because it involves young people . .Everyone left behind feels guilt .We all have the "what ifs". That's what happens with suicide,but in Rebecca's case,I just don't believe she did this. I don't even think it was meant to look like a suicide. There's somebody involved who is very sick. JMO
ETA: I shouldn't even use the term "put blame on someone" .No one is to blame. There is no way a teenager could imagine their words could trigger a suicide.
Morag
11-15-2011, 01:16 PM
Yelling 911, 911, 911 might also be more effective. People would then have no doubt about the best course of action.
coastal
11-15-2011, 01:18 PM
A couple of weeks ago I joined friends of mine to help them with their daughter,who has severe autism ,while they trained for their service dog.
We shared a hotel suite that had separate bedrooms,LR and kitchen.
On the last night the child was just exhausted and at the end of her ability to cope.
She wanted something at bedtime and when she was told "no" she let out a blood curdling scream that seemed to go on forever.
Mom was able to quickly calm her ,but I was waiting for LE or someone from the hotel to come knocking at the door.
It never happened. If I was in a hotel and heard a child scream like that I would report it.I'd rather be wrong than find out later something had happened to the person.
The thanks button just wasn't enough. My daughter has autism. I would rather explain her screams than have them ignored any day.
peace9274
11-15-2011, 02:04 PM
Forgive me ,since I haven't followed this case closely ,but do authorities know where the rope came from?
I don't believe Rebecca committed suicide,but Dr. Phil said something concerning Rebecca's state of mind earlier that week ,even that day, that would indicate she was not planning to commit suicide.
Our son committed an impulsive suicide .We know this because it was New Years Eve and he was making plans for that evening and for returning to school the following Monday.
He sat on his glasses earlier that week and that morning he asked my husband to get his glasses fixed when he ran some errands,because he needed them for school.
He also gave him a list of the fireworks he wanted for that night when his cousin ,who was his best friend ,came to spend the night.
Something happened in the following hours and he was gone .We kind of know some things ,but I don't want to put any blame on anyone because it involves young people . .Everyone left behind feels guilt .We all have the "what ifs". That's what happens with suicide,but in Rebecca's case,I just don't believe she did this. I don't even think it was meant to look like a suicide. There's somebody involved who is very sick. JMO
ETA: I shouldn't even use the term "put blame on someone" .No one is to blame. There is no way a teenager could imagine their words could trigger a suicide.
MissJames, :rose:
I am so sorry to read your comments about the loss of your son. It must be so hard for you not having him with you... and to think about the "what if"s.
Please know you are in my thoughts as I send you my deepest sympathy. :rose: I agree with you; I do not think Rebecca took her own life either.
sorrell skye
11-15-2011, 03:36 PM
still here...reading, usually several days behind, but still checking.
Me, too.
In every case I've followed, I've reached a point where I've run out of things to say (until there's a break in the case), but I still think about the victims every day and I still hope & pray for justice for them.
I also want to say that it's been a privilege and an honor to strive for justice for Rebecca & her family with all of you. In the past few weeks, I've been following a couple of other cases, but I've missed y'all.
:grouphug:
ETA: I plan on tuning into the Dr. Phil show - I'll try my best to give a play by play for those who are unable to watch.
lauriej
11-15-2011, 03:42 PM
---to watch online, the Dr.Phil show will be on here in 20 minutes ( 2 p.m. MST )
http://www.azwatch.tv/view/22658/
--CBS---livestream---
sorrell skye
11-15-2011, 04:01 PM
Here we go.
I can't wait to hear what Dr. Wecht has to say!
Dr. Phil is doing a recap of yesterday's show.
sorrell skye
11-15-2011, 04:04 PM
Mary talking about the difficult decision to exhume Rebecca's body.
sorrell skye
11-15-2011, 04:06 PM
Paul Ciolino talking about witness who saw the woman @ the mansion on the night of the 12th "acting bizarre" - looking in windows.
Bonepile
11-15-2011, 04:06 PM
Here are my notes (NOT direct quotes) from the show ...
Dr. Wecht:
1; four hemorrhages would cause concussion and with that amount of force render the person unconscious.
2. No injury to back of the neck just cartilage in front throat area. Cervical vertebrae not damaged as would be seen with body falling straight down.
3. In 3,000 suicide autopsies how do you bind your hands and your feet like this. It makes no sense.
4. Adhesive residue found on the body, but no tape present at scene.
5. In all of my autopsies (some 20,000) no woman has ever done this as fully described and in the nude.
6 A rush to judgement applies here. Why the hurry?
7. How could the authorities come to the suicide decision with what was known.
8. I cannot say with evidence I have seen it was a homicide, but I lean strongly to it being a homicide. It does not seem to be a suicide.
When asked what could cause these injuries to the head ...
A round smooth surface of an object or something fallen against caused these lacerations by force pressing down on the top of the head, lines of force from a blow. These type of forces could cause unconsciousness and that would explains how the rest was done.
Dr. Wecht when asked if he saw the case being re-opened said ...
Change the manner of death to undetermined. We have that category for cases like this. They need to declare it that and then go back and work at it. I am still leaning strongly to homicide.
Mary (Becky's sister) said ... Becky is a beautiful person inside and out. She would not hurt anybody including herself. I want the case to be re-opened and re-examined by an independent agency. We have lost trust in them.
sorrell skye
11-15-2011, 04:07 PM
AB said "mixed DNA in fingernail clippings"
Curious Me
11-15-2011, 04:16 PM
In the last text Rebecca sent to her sister, she said, "I need to be strong for Jonah". That was the true frame of mind of RZ that night, IMO. I still feel such sorrow for Rebecca and her family. I still believe she was murdered.
sorrell skye
11-15-2011, 04:20 PM
Mary doesn't believe that the deleted phone call to RZ's voicemail was made.
sorrell skye
11-15-2011, 04:34 PM
Dr. Wecht: "The autopsy was thorough. It's the findings that puzzle me..."
He agrees with the cause of death (asphyxiation) but not the manner of death...
Questioning the 4 subgaleal injuries to RZ's head
Neck injuries: no fractures of the cervical vertebrae
sorrell skye
11-15-2011, 04:38 PM
Lost my connection for a few minutes grrrr!
Dr. Wecht: questioning the bindings & the adhesive markings on her calves. Questions how RZ would have known how to tie the knots.
Can't recall a similar case.
He believes there was a rush to judgment.
sorrell skye
11-15-2011, 04:39 PM
Dr. Wecht leans very strongly toward a homicide and against a suicide.
sorrell skye
11-15-2011, 04:42 PM
Apologies for not being able to provide more details - I'm a slow typist, and it's difficult for me to listen & type @ the same time. I'm trying to post the pertinent gist of the statements that stand out to me.
sorrell skye
11-15-2011, 04:48 PM
Dr. Wecht: The manner of death needs to be changed to undetermined.
He says the case should be left open - an undetermined manner of death.
Dr. Wecht confirms that he leans toward homicide, not suicide.
sorrell skye
11-15-2011, 04:53 PM
Mary wants the case to be reopened & to be independently investigated. She has no trust in the SDCSD (paraphrasing). AB & PC agree.
elfie
11-15-2011, 04:57 PM
I didn't realize that her family didn't receive the news of Dr. Wecht's findings until taping the show. My heart so goes out to them. :hug: Such a senseless and tragic loss. Rebecca was a young, beautiful and vibrant woman, who had her whole life before her.
With Dr. Wecht's revelations today on the Dr. Phil show, I hope that a new and independent investigation will be undertaken.
peace9274
11-15-2011, 05:12 PM
Apologies for not being able to provide more details - I'm a slow typist, and it's difficult for me to listen & type @ the same time. I'm trying to post the pertinent gist of the statements that stand out to me.
You're doing great, sorrell skye! Thank you!! :)
AND thanks to Bonepile, too!!
sorrell skye
11-15-2011, 05:40 PM
I want to comment on the fingernail clippings.
I wondered awhile ago whether or not fingernail scrapings or clippings were collected. Based on Anne Bremner's statement on the Dr. Phil show, it appears that this procedure was performed @ some point, either by Dr. Lucas (1st autopsy) or by Dr. Wecht (2nd autopsy). If it was performed by Dr. Lucas during the 1st autopsy, that information wasn't included, for whatever reason, in the AR that was released to the public. I'm wondering if the mixed DNA from the fingernail clippings was found during the 1st autopsy or during the 2nd.
The mixed DNA beneath RZ's fingernails is concerning. The SDCSD claims there were no signs of a struggle. IMO, if there is mixed DNA (or any DNA besides RZ's, for that matter) beneath her fingernails, that is a sign of a possible struggle.
I wonder if the SDCSD examined JS, AS, DR, or NR for scratches in the immediate days following Rebecca's death? Based upon the other aspects of this case that weren't investigated, I'm inclined to believe they didn't.
LaMer
11-15-2011, 05:53 PM
Apologies for not being able to provide more details - I'm a slow typist, and it's difficult for me to listen & type @ the same time. I'm trying to post the pertinent gist of the statements that stand out to me.
sorrell skye, Thank You SO much for providng the info!!! Great job!
I was able to watch yesterday, but today something came up.
Thanks again! :yourock:
I hope DW's work will be enough to get the ball rolling and open the investigation!
There is no way I believe she hung herself.
I want to comment on the fingernail clippings.
I wondered awhile ago whether or not the ME took fingernail scrapings or clippings during the autopsy. Based on Anne Bremner's statement on the Dr. Phil show, it appears that this procedure was performed. For whatever reason, it wasn't included in the AR that was released to the public.
The mixed DNA beneath RZ's fingernails is concerning. The SDCSD claims there were no signs of a struggle. IMO, if there is mixed DNA (or any DNA besides RZ's, for that matter) beneath her fingernails, that is a sign of a possible struggle. If what Anne Bremner says is true about the mixed DNA in the fingernail clippings, it begs the question of how many people were directly involved in Rebecca's death.
I wonder if the SDCSD examined JS, AS, DR, or NR for scratches in the immediate days following Rebecca's death? Based upon the other aspects of this case that weren't investigated, I'm inclined to believe they didn't.
Thank you for all the updates Sorrel.
Interesting about the fingernail clippings... I know of at least one murder case where they claimed there wasn't anyone else's DNA under the fingernails so now I'm curious about what they typically find and whether or not something would come of DNA analysis of Rebecca's fingernail scrapping. Of course, I think the suspect DNA profile base should have been broadened.
sundrop
11-15-2011, 06:51 PM
Dr. Wecht believed so much in this case he would only commit to the undetermined ruling rather than homicide. This speaks volumes, or, he's scared to make a ruling of homicide and playing it safe? If the latter is true, then there's nothing in the just released police case files to confirm his findings.
Here are my notes (NOT direct quotes) from the show ...
Dr. Wecht:
1; four hemorrhages would cause concussion and with that amount of force render the person unconscious.
2. No injury to back of the neck just cartilage in front throat area. Cervical vertebrae not damaged as would be seen with body falling straight down.
3. In 3,000 suicide autopsies how do you bind your hands and your feet like this. It makes no sense.
4. Adhesive residue found on the body, but no tape present at scene.
5. In all of my autopsies (some 20,000) no woman has ever done this as fully described and in the nude.
6 A rush to judgement applies here. Why the hurry?
7. How could the authorities come to the suicide decision with what was known.
8. I cannot say with evidence I have seen it was a homicide, but I lean strongly to it being a homicide. It does not seem to be a suicide.
When asked what could cause these injuries to the head ...
A round smooth surface of an object or something fallen against caused these lacerations by force pressing down on the top of the head, lines of force from a blow. These type of forces could cause unconsciousness and that would explains how the rest was done.
Dr. Wecht when asked if he saw the case being re-opened said ...
Change the manner of death to undetermined. We have that category for cases like this. They need to declare it that and then go back and work at it. I am still leaning strongly to homicide.
Mary (Becky's sister) said ... Becky is a beautiful person inside and out. She would not hurt anybody including herself. I want the case to be re-opened and re-examined by an independent agency. We have lost trust in them.
Mrs. Holmes
11-15-2011, 07:12 PM
It was interesting to find out the head injuries were on the TOP of her head. I hope AB has been working for this past week in putting together a request to the AG to re-open the case. Dr. Wecht's findings and backing will signigicantly add to the strength of the request.
It is so frustrating to see so much evidence "gone" from the case because they did not leave the case open. The only person who benefited from the case being closed so quickly was JS who got to offload the crime scene.
x_files
11-15-2011, 07:48 PM
It was interesting to find out the head injuries were on the TOP of her head. I hope AB has been working for this past week in putting together a request to the AG to re-open the case. Dr. Wecht's findings and backing will signigicantly add to the strength of the request.
It is so frustrating to see so much evidence "gone" from the case because they did not leave the case open. The only person who benefited from the case being closed so quickly was JS who got to offload the crime scene.
This whole case stinks of a cover-up. The police dropped the ball out of fear of being sued by JS, or covered it up willing. Disturbing.
This week's news proves there can easily be cover-ups involving large groups of community embers with a mutual purpose ie. fame, money or loss of reputation. (Penn State Scandal)
I would love not to be jaded but, I believe it was homicide and they covered it up.
arielilane
11-15-2011, 08:21 PM
Thank you sorrell skye and bonepile.
I could kick myself for forgetting to set my dvd to record today's Dr. Phil.
This was mentioned before and is worth mentioning again.
Why would a man who just had dinner with RZ call her "girl". I find that cold and a detachment. Why didn't he state my brother's girlfriend? Better yet, by her name, Rebecca. Red flag. And that she hung herself. How does he know that???
LE didn't want to hurt their town's big wig? I don't blame the Z family for wanting an independent investigation.
Thank goodness Rebecca never married JS.
arielilane
11-15-2011, 08:26 PM
I recall the night Jon Benet was murdered there was a scream heard that night around midnight. No one called LE.
lauriej
11-15-2011, 08:40 PM
http://www.facebook.com/AnneMBremner
Anne Bremner - Facebook (http://www.facebook.com/AnneMBremner) wrote:I will be on Good Morning America tomorrow morning at seven am PT re the Rebecca Zahau case. What are our next steps? Should this case have been closed out as a suicide?
arielilane
11-15-2011, 08:47 PM
Forgive me ,since I haven't followed this case closely ,but do authorities know where the rope came from?
I don't believe Rebecca committed suicide,but Dr. Phil said something concerning Rebecca's state of mind earlier that week ,even that day, that would indicate she was not planning to commit suicide.
Our son committed an impulsive suicide .We know this because it was New Years Eve and he was making plans for that evening and for returning to school the following Monday.
He sat on his glasses earlier that week and that morning he asked my husband to get his glasses fixed when he ran some errands,because he needed them for school.
He also gave him a list of the fireworks he wanted for that night when his cousin ,who was his best friend ,came to spend the night.
Something happened in the following hours and he was gone .We kind of know some things ,but I don't want to put any blame on anyone because it involves young people . .Everyone left behind feels guilt .We all have the "what ifs". That's what happens with suicide,but in Rebecca's case,I just don't believe she did this. I don't even think it was meant to look like a suicide. There's somebody involved who is very sick. JMO
ETA: I shouldn't even use the term "put blame on someone" .No one is to blame. There is no way a teenager could imagine their words could trigger a suicide. Miss James, I am deeply sorry and want to express my condolences for the loss of your son. http://www.wuerziworld.de/Smilies/nt/nt1.gif
arielilane
11-15-2011, 08:50 PM
I'm attempting to get a copy of RZ's text message. Does anyone of a copy from yesterday's show? tia
cynic
11-15-2011, 08:55 PM
I'm attempting to get a copy of RZ's text message. Does anyone of a copy from yesterday's show? tia
The show is here:
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - The case for murder
arielilane
11-15-2011, 09:27 PM
Text message from RZ.
arielilane
11-15-2011, 09:35 PM
It was reported that RZ's computer was analyzed to see if she had been searching for ropes or how to commit suicide. There was no activity on her computer. Dr. Phil's show stated there was activity on the computer after her death.
defense101
11-15-2011, 10:24 PM
I wonder if the rounded object that Dr Wecht was talking about could be that dog bone that was in the bedroom photos?
defense101
11-15-2011, 11:12 PM
Adam says in the 911 phone call I'm doing chest compressions right now... really? First off he was on the phone, was he doing chest compressions with one hand? The photos of Rebecca cleary showed that her arms were still tied? behind her back, and if untied in rigor, so tell me how the heck did he do chest compressions with her on her side? IMO this was a staged 911 call.
sundrop
11-15-2011, 11:41 PM
San Diego Sheriff Bill Gore issued the following written statement at 7:12 p.m. on Tuesday, responding to the Dr. Phil Show series of reports:
After personally reviewing the two-part show by entertainment psychologist Phil
McGraw, Sheriff Bill Gore explained, "No new information has been provided by this second
autopsy." The case remains concluded.
"To date," Sheriff Gore said, "neither our detectives, nor the Medical Examiner's Office
have been presented with any new evidence from this examination. If Dr. Wecht, or Miss
Bremner would like to share information they believe is pertinent with our investigators, we
would be glad to meet with them, rather than hear their results on television, presented as
entertainment."
Sheriff Gore advised those who appeared on the "Dr. Phil" show altered and
misrepresented facts, as well as omitted pertinent details all together.
For example, the guests on the show referred to mixed DNA underneath Rebecca's fingernails. There were 13 samples taken from fingernails of both hands. Each of the samples was analyzed separately. In twelve of the samples, the DNA results were consistent with the presence of DNA from only one person.
The DNA types found in these samples matched the DNA of Rebecca Zahau. In one of the
samples, the results indicated the presence of DNA from at least two people. The majority of the DNA present was consistent with Rebecca's DNA. The amount of information obtained from the other contributor(s) was so minute; it was not possible to identify the source.
It is important to understand that small amounts of DNA can be transferred easily through
any number of ways including something as ethereal as a breath.
Their 'findings' that 'someone' had logged on to Rebecca's computer had already been
investigated by our detectives and it was simply determined to be an automatic computer update.
Further, Dr. Wecht did not reach out to the San Diego County Medical Examiner's Office
or the Sheriff's Office to attend the autopsy, as is normal protocol to establish and maintain a
clean chain of custody, should new evidence be found.
According to Sheriff Gore, "This is nothing more than sensationalism at its lowest point
and the family is only enduring more suffering from this insensitivity."
:banghead::banghead:
defense101
11-15-2011, 11:47 PM
http://www.760kfmb.com/story/16049618/pathologist-hanging-would-have-broken-zahaus-neck
After personally reviewing the two-part show by entertainment psychologist Phil McGraw, Sheriff Bill Gore explained, "No new information has been provided by this second autopsy." The case remains concluded.
Sheriff Gore advised those who appeared on the "Dr. Phil" show altered and misrepresented facts, as well as omitted pertinent details all together.
Hmm sounds like the SDSO doesn't it..
For example, the guests on the show referred to mixed DNA underneath Rebecca's fingernails. There were 13 samples taken from fingernails of both hands. Each of the samples was analyzed separately. In twelve of the samples, the DNA results were consistent with the presence of DNA from only one person.
The DNA types found in these samples matched the DNA of Rebecca Zahau. In one of the samples, the results indicated the presence of DNA from at least two people. The majority of the DNA present was consistent with Rebecca's DNA. The amount of information obtained from the other contributor(s) was so minute; it was not possible to identify the source.
Wasn't this the same as the house, no other dna other than Rebecca's? Hmmm.
It is important to understand that small amounts of DNA can be transferred easily through any number of ways including something as ethereal as a breath.
So does this mean someone was breathing on Rebecca's hands??? Ah maybe while they were tying her up possibly?
Their 'findings' that 'someone' had logged on to Rebecca's computer had already been investigated by our detectives and it was simply determined to be an automatic computer update.
So I assume the computer forensics would have been turned over to AB with the long awaited files?
Further, Dr. Wecht did not reach out to the San Diego County Medical Examiner's Office or the Sheriff's Office to attend the autopsy, as is normal protocol to establish and maintain a clean chain of custody, should new evidence be found.
Yes why not get the Sheriffs office who decided suicide from day one and then on day 57 iron clad, scientific no less, suicide involved, I mean honestly they are talking about Cyril Whect who has done thousands of criminal cases.
According to Sheriff Gore, "This is nothing more than sensationalism at its lowest point and the family is only enduring more suffering from this insensitivity."
I am so disgusted with this Sheriff, he as the nerve to call this nothing more than sensationalism, insensitivity? This Sheriff has been nothing but insensitive not only to the Zahau family, but to all the intelligent people in this world that see this as the crime it is. I sincerely hope but highly doubt the AG office will have an independent investigation done.
lauriej
11-16-2011, 01:03 AM
I wonder if the rounded object that Dr Wecht was talking about could be that dog bone that was in the bedroom photos?
..it sure seems to be consistant with the type of 'instrument' that could have caused those 4 subgaleal head injuries-----those dog chew toys are heavy duty!
..at the very least--------that dog toy should have been brought in on the S/W ( and wasn't ! ) which is beyond ridiculous, it was right there in the "suicide room".
Carpe Pacem
11-16-2011, 01:15 AM
LaurieJ, you're so right! That looks like a Kong dog bone to me. You never want to fumble one of those and drop it on your foot.
So the Sheriff seems to believe that Rebecca bonked herself on the head four times - hard!
Unbelievable.
lauriej
11-16-2011, 02:07 AM
..sheriff gore drives me crazy----he has, and still does, insist that if they bring "new" evidence ( he will vigourously! and passionately! ) pursue it..
..well-------what they have is not neccessarily brand spanking "new"----it's "old" evidence, that the SDSO never looked at ( at all, never mind vigourously! and passionately! ) in the 1st place.
..and that evidence doesn't count?
..i'm totally with mary ( and my heart goes OUT to her ) in not wanting the SDSO to even touch her sister's case anyway-----the trust is gone------and to have an independant investigation done from day one.
Rhyme & Reason
11-16-2011, 02:46 AM
I wonder if the rounded object that Dr Wecht was talking about could be that dog bone that was in the bedroom photos?
That's what I've been thinking. Those dog bones are solid and heavy.
Bonepile
11-16-2011, 04:02 AM
ABC news has picked up the story ....
http://abcnews.go.com/US/coronado-mansion-death-rebecca-zahau-knocked-unconscious/story?id=14955832#.TsN7vGCdhxg
ABC news has picked up the story ....
http://abcnews.go.com/US/coronado-mansion-death-rebecca-zahau-knocked-unconscious/story?id=14955832#.TsN7vGCdhxg
It seems the Sheriff is totally relying on the "no new evidence". That is a cop out when in September they did not reveal all they knew at the time. They know the longer one waits to investigate the more evidence is lost. They already lost evidence way before that press conference, e.g., the supposed phone message to Rebecca. They never requested Jonah or Dina's DNA. The coroner felt he did not have to explain the blunt force trauma by matching the actual wounds to something. They didn't say that it was unusual she didn't break her neck - surely there are some kind of statistics or estimates of that likelihood.
I still believe they called it a suicide so as to not have a case left open, not because they were protecting Jonah or Dinah, but because they knew they couldn't get a conviction or couldn't get one without expending enormous resources.
As Wecht said, at the very least they should have said the manner of death is undetermined. They did not explain Rebecca's injuries in any competent manner nor that goes with the crime scene so how can they claim it is determined at all, let alone a suicide that statistically is off the charts.
"New" evidence is a red herring. It doesn't matter if it's new or not when they seemingly made no attempt to fit everything together (crime scene and wound analysis), had extreme confirmation bias overlooking motivation/evidence, and did not investigate or confirm some key considerations (violent background and spying on each other with Jonah and Dina), Dina's hatred for Rebecca, the doctor claiming it was suffocation, when and what did doctors tell them about Max's condition, consciousness of guilt of any party).
And, give me a break on the total weirdness of the text Adam sent and, it sounds, what some of his claims were when finding her. I had really cut him some slack, but can't now.
Everything screams out that this is not a suicide, yet they will not even call it undetermined. STINKY and INEPT
Oh, and, by going to the news and cherry picking a couple of points they are playing the same media game they are accusing others of playing. Having failed to work with Rebecca's family and their lawyer, they are now claiming they are not including them. They are behaving like an abusive partner behaves - think about it.
I guess they don't realize that is not helping their image.
defense101
11-16-2011, 12:44 PM
..it sure seems to be consistant with the type of 'instrument' that could have caused those 4 subgaleal head injuries-----those dog chew toys are heavy duty!
..at the very least--------that dog toy should have been brought in on the S/W ( and wasn't ! ) which is beyond ridiculous, it was right there in the "suicide room". Exactly, they cherry picked the evidence that would point to suicide and I believe that the child protective services call to the hospital guided this investigation as well as ineptness and arrogance in believing everyone would swallow what they presented at the news conference and then just go away.
coastal
11-16-2011, 02:25 PM
Exactly, they cherry picked the evidence that would point to suicide and I believe that the child protective services call to the hospital guided this investigation as well as ineptness and arrogance in believing everyone would swallow what they presented at the news conference and then just go away.
It shouldn't matter what the doctor thought, or what CPS thought, or even what LE thought happened!
(Not directed at you defense101; I'm just mad with all "authority" right now!)
Terrichad
11-16-2011, 02:32 PM
Hi,
ABC news posted a follow up on the Dr. Phil show. The article isn't that interesting but when you look at all the comments poster (JKDFJ7) has posted on the ABC website, we are offered some very interesting possibly inside information. The poster talks about the little boys death and the days following the accident. If this persons information is correct it points away from suicide and more toward revenge. The poster is not in support of Rebecca and strongly tries to make a case for suicide.
Hi,
ABC news posted a follow up on the Dr. Phil show. The article isn't that interesting but when you look at all the comments poster (JKDFJ7) has posted on the ABC website, we are offered some very interesting possibly inside information. The poster talks about the little boys death and the days following the accident. If this persons information is correct it points away from suicide and more toward revenge. The poster is not in support of Rebecca and strongly tries to make a case for suicide.
Can you post a link? Tia
defense101
11-16-2011, 04:07 PM
Hi,
ABC news posted a follow up on the Dr. Phil show. The article isn't that interesting but when you look at all the comments poster (JKDFJ7) has posted on the ABC website, we are offered some very interesting possibly inside information. The poster talks about the little boys death and the days following the accident. If this persons information is correct it points away from suicide and more toward revenge. The poster is not in support of Rebecca and strongly tries to make a case for suicide.
Welcome to Websleuths Terrichad!!:party::welcome4::Banane14::Banane14:
MyBelle
11-16-2011, 04:35 PM
Hi,
ABC news posted a follow up on the Dr. Phil show. The article isn't that interesting but when you look at all the comments poster (JKDFJ7) has posted on the ABC website, we are offered some very interesting possibly inside information. The poster talks about the little boys death and the days following the accident. If this persons information is correct it points away from suicide and more toward revenge. The poster is not in support of Rebecca and strongly tries to make a case for suicide.
I doubt any poster has "inside information" that is unknown to police. The ME has already ruled the death a suicide. Revenge doesn't point to suicide and LE has said that they will reconsider if there is new information.
JMO
Terrichad
11-16-2011, 04:49 PM
I'm terrible on the computer, I can't figure out how to send a link.
The comments are interesting because if it is someone related to the Mother, maybe even a friend, it gives insight into what could have been going on in the background.
I had read that a witness (man waiting for his kids) saw a woman outside acting strange. This poster claims the woman was the aunt of the little boy, she went to the house to talk to Rebecca about details concerning the fall.
Sorry I can't post the link.
Terri
kathyn2
11-16-2011, 04:58 PM
To post a link all you have to do is go into your browser url window at the top where teh address to the page you are reading is on and copy it and then paste it on the new page where you want people to see a link.
I couldn't find that article or comments either but I did see 2 comments from that person from the article link that is posted. They are just someone that is blaming Rebecca. No inside info. There are alot of crazy people on forums. I have also read that the aunt (the mother's sister) went to the house that night. No explanation has ever come out as to whether she saw or talked to Rebecca. The police did such a shoddy job we will never know what happened in this case.
lauriej
11-16-2011, 05:32 PM
http://www.myfoxmemphis.com/dpps/news/san-diego-sheriff-wont-reopen-mansion-death-case-dpgapx-20111116-to_15981925?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
San Diego Sheriff Won't Reopen Mansion Death Case
The San Diego County sheriff says results of a second autopsy on a woman found hanging at a Coronado mansion won't convince him to reopen the case.
Gore's statement calls the show "nothing more than sensationalism at its lowest point" that caused the family more suffering.
( ummm, which family are you referring to sheriff? )
lauriej
11-16-2011, 05:33 PM
---anne bremner on GMA --nov.16th--
--there are 2 clips, you may have to get them from the bottom bar, they are titled:
'Dr. Phil' Coronado Autopsy: Mystery Solved?
Zahau family attorney discusses the family's reaction to the "Dr. Phil" episode.
03:15 | 11/16/2011
'Dr. Phil' Reveals Coronado Autopsy
A strange spectacle played out in a two part episode on the Mansion mystery.
02:20 | 11/16/2011
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/dr-phil ... on=1206833 (http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/dr-phil-coronado-mansion-autopsy-mystery-solved-zahau-14962711?tab=9482931§ion=1206833)
Mrs. Holmes
11-16-2011, 06:22 PM
"Are you alive?" AS's aggression in his speach bothers me. and then "I don't think so." his communication to the 911 operator. To me it comes off odd... no compassion just aggression in the "are you alive" part and then "I don't think so" is almost sarcastic.
People react so differently to emergencies so there is not much to judge here. If it were me I am sure you could here concern in my voice even if I scream the words are you alive... and then sadness when I say I don't think so....
And to identify her as a "girl".... not as a woman... I find it odd he did not identify her in some way... my brother's girlfriend... say her name Becky... at this point he has apparently cut her down...surely he most know who it is...
The aggression in his voice bothers me... angry aggression... it just doesn't sit right with me.
Terrichad
11-16-2011, 06:55 PM
http://abcnews.go.com/US/coronado-mansion-death-rebecca-zahau-knocked-unconscious/story?id=14955832&page=2#.TsRJsXJbU74
Hopefully this is will work. If you look at all the comments the poster made on all ABC stories they have some interesting information.
The aunt did talk to Rebecca but couldn't get a straight answer as to what happened.
The poster seems to have alot of against Asian women.
Question did Rebecca have a party with her health club friend the night before her death?
The poster seems to want to make a case for suicide but instead paints Rebecca in a pretty uncaring light. If she is uncaring why would she kill herself?
coastal
11-16-2011, 07:32 PM
http://abcnews.go.com/US/coronado-mansion-death-rebecca-zahau-knocked-unconscious/story?id=14955832&page=2#.TsRJsXJbU74
Hopefully this is will work. If you look at all the comments the poster made on all ABC stories they have some interesting information.
The aunt did talk to Rebecca but couldn't get a straight answer as to what happened.
The poster seems to have alot of against Asian women.
Question did Rebecca have a party with her health club friend the night before her death?
The poster seems to want to make a case for suicide but instead paints Rebecca in a pretty uncaring light. If she is uncaring why would she kill herself?
I followed your suggestion and checked out the other 17 posts by JKDFJ7, who is clearly delusional. However, I did find this gem, posted Sept 7:
They need to investigate little Max's death more thoroughly. It doesn't make sense. Then perhaps they can get answers to Rebecca's demise.
http://abcnews.go.com/site/comments?type=user&loginCode={0C35174E-613D-4739-9762-9EF45059AD23}#.TsRQsFbPyng
Strangely enough, I agree. I think clearing up the confusion surrounding Max's accident will lead LE to the motive for Rebecca's murder, and from there, straight to her killer. Even the San Diego Sheriff could solve this mystery then.
IMO
dovebar
11-16-2011, 10:49 PM
Have you ever heard of someone asking an unconscious person, "Are you alive?"
What people typically say is, "Wake up! wake up!" or "open your eyes! Can you open your eyes!"
Or as Mrs. Holmes suggested, since he clearly knew who she was, why wouldn't he say, "Becky! Becky!"
This PD is either incompetent or corrupt. Federal authorities need to be called in to investigate the cops.
Is it true that the idiotic neighbors who heard her screaming for her life didn't call 911 (like the Apple employees in the yoga store case?)? What is wrong with people?
CanManEh
11-17-2011, 01:16 AM
Does anyone have a link to the 911 phone call. ?
Curious Me
11-17-2011, 02:16 AM
There's a great deal of coverage on local news channels with the Sheriff's Dept and ME making lame excuses in response to the Dr. Phil Show. It's infuriating. Gore says they would have no reason to deem this suicide, blah, blah, blah. I can't believe the statement from ME saying three of the head lacerations were small like the size of a dime, and that Rebecca might not have had a headache from those (possible blows to her head, IMO) hemorrages. What? Who asked if Rebecca had a headache! She was murdered, IMO.
Curious Me
11-17-2011, 02:39 AM
Heard the 911 call on the news, but can't find which channel. I'd like to hear that several times. (withholding my opinion of what AS sounds like, but first impressions were not favorable, JMO)
Channel 8 news video Sheriff Defending...
http://www.cbs8.com/global/category.asp?c=155799
Sheriff Defends Agency's Investigation Of Zahau Death
http://www.10news.com/news/29790096/detail.html
coastal
11-17-2011, 02:52 AM
County officials defend mansion death probe
Nov. 16, 2011
Updated 6:58 p.m.
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/2011/nov/16/county-officials-defend-mansion-death-probe/
>>>snip
SAN DIEGO — After two days of having the thoroughness of their investigation into a Coronado mansion hanging death questioned on a national TV talk show, county sheriff’s and medical examiner’s officials Wednesday defended their findings...
<...>
...“It would be an incredible homicide — who would do that?” Gore said Wednesday. “Make it look like a suicide that looks like a homicide? This is a classic scientific case. We just http://www.cosgan.de/images/midi/figuren/a115.gif followed the science.”...
<...>
...Wecht questioned why Zahau’s neck wasn’t broken in the jolt from her fall. Dr. Jonathan Lucas, San Diego County’s deputy medical examiner who performed the original autopsy, said he wouldn’t expect such a fracture in a head-first drop. There were torn muscles in her neck, he said...
(article continues)
<<<snip
This is, what, press conference #3?
Who does that?
tvscum
11-17-2011, 03:45 AM
Streaming video of entire Sheriff Gore news conference, Oct. 16 (36 minutes):
http://www.cbs8.com/story/16061354/sheriff-responds-to-dr-phil-findings-new-details-revealed-in-coronado-mansion-death
Mrs. Holmes
11-17-2011, 09:08 AM
About the automatic updatin of the computer. My computer is on a standard setting. I have a common hp laptop from Wallmart (US I am canadian but live right on the border) and I have Windows 7 for home. My computer will only do an automatic updated if I am using the computer, it does not update even when it is in sleep mode. But SDSO doesn't bother to get into all that. No details just enough info to skip out of the accusation. Over and over again this is how this guy operates.
Also about the head first hanging I would think that "snap" when a fragile women's neck meets that kind of force head first would increase the chances of the neck breaking. She didn't gently ease head first into the tightning noose..... at least the way the SDSO version did not lead us to that.
AB and the Zahau family are certainly justified in NOT going to the SDSO as they are clearly only interested in defending their findings.
Blackspeare
11-17-2011, 04:38 PM
This is a most interesting case. Could someone tie themselves up before hanging themselves in the way surmised by the police? Yes, it is possible. First you would tie your feet together. Then you would slip the noose over your head, which is already tied to the balcony railing. Then you would tie your hands together in front of you using your teeth and then grab the tee shirt and use it as a gag. Because she was athletic she could slipped her tied hands over her feet and behind her. She then stood up and went over the balcony. The first question to ask is why would she go to all that trouble? The second question who would have a motive to kill her?
lauriej
11-17-2011, 04:43 PM
Does anyone have a link to the 911 phone call. ?
http://www.760kfmb.com/story/16039227/dr-phil-airs-new-evidence-in-coronado-mansion-mystery
-----------there are 2 short video clips at the above link.
..the snippet of the 911 call is heard about 20 seconds in on the shorter (2:30) clip titled:
"Dr. Phil airs new evidence in Coronado Mansion mystery".
POLICE DISPATCH: 911 emergency. What are you reporting?
ADAM SHACKNAI: I got a girl… hung herself.
POLICE DISPATCH: Is she alive?
ADAM SHACKNAI: Are you alive? I don't think so.
askfornina
11-17-2011, 04:52 PM
"Are you alive?" AS's aggression in his speach bothers me. and then "I don't think so." his communication to the 911 operator. To me it comes off odd... no compassion just aggression in the "are you alive" part and then "I don't think so" is almost sarcastic.
People react so differently to emergencies so there is not much to judge here. If it were me I am sure you could here concern in my voice even if I scream the words are you alive... and then sadness when I say I don't think so....
And to identify her as a "girl".... not as a woman... I find it odd he did not identify her in some way... my brother's girlfriend... say her name Becky... at this point he has apparently cut her down...surely he most know who it is...
The aggression in his voice bothers me... angry aggression... it just doesn't sit right with me.
bbm. i agree. when i first heard that, it gave me the creeps. yikes.
still following RZ's case, i hope justice is served soon!
CanManEh
11-17-2011, 05:46 PM
that just blows me away .do yu think he was trying to be a smart ass when they say is she alive and he asks her hey are you alive its almost like a sick joke at least thats sure how it sounds maybe iam reading into it or reading it wrong but that just seems like a smart ass remark ..
Bonepile
11-17-2011, 06:27 PM
Listening to that voice no emotion, no concern, flippant tone, sarcastic, demeaning. He cut her down he had to know her body was cold and stiff, and yet he asks. And the authorities can still call this a suicide? And the Shacknai family is blameless?
arielilane
11-17-2011, 06:27 PM
http://www.760kfmb.com/story/16039227/dr-phil-airs-new-evidence-in-coronado-mansion-mystery
-----------there are 2 short video clips at the above link.
..the snippet of the 911 call is heard about 20 seconds in on the shorter (2:30) clip titled:
"Dr. Phil airs new evidence in Coronado Mansion mystery".
POLICE DISPATCH: 911 emergency. What are you reporting?
ADAM SHACKNAI: I got a girl… hung herself.
POLICE DISPATCH: Is she alive?
ADAM SHACKNAI: Are you alive? I don't think so.
When the dispatcher asked "Is she alive", were they really meaning for him to ask the victim? AS handled that strangely...I wonder why? "Are you alive? I don't think so". How creepy and weird. just sayin....
arielilane
11-17-2011, 06:38 PM
San Diego Sheriff Bill Gore issued the following written statement at 7:12 p.m. on Tuesday, responding to the Dr. Phil Show series of reports:
After personally reviewing the two-part show by entertainment psychologist Phil
McGraw, Sheriff Bill Gore explained, "No new information has been provided by this second
autopsy." The case remains concluded.
"To date," Sheriff Gore said, "neither our detectives, nor the Medical Examiner's Office
have been presented with any new evidence from this examination. If Dr. Wecht, or Miss
Bremner would like to share information they believe is pertinent with our investigators, we
would be glad to meet with them, rather than hear their results on television, presented as
entertainment."
Sheriff Gore advised those who appeared on the "Dr. Phil" show altered and
misrepresented facts, as well as omitted pertinent details all together.
For example, the guests on the show referred to mixed DNA underneath Rebecca's fingernails. There were 13 samples taken from fingernails of both hands. Each of the samples was analyzed separately. In twelve of the samples, the DNA results were consistent with the presence of DNA from only one person.
The DNA types found in these samples matched the DNA of Rebecca Zahau. In one of the
samples, the results indicated the presence of DNA from at least two people. The majority of the DNA present was consistent with Rebecca's DNA. The amount of information obtained from the other contributor(s) was so minute; it was not possible to identify the source.
It is important to understand that small amounts of DNA can be transferred easily through
any number of ways including something as ethereal as a breath.
Their 'findings' that 'someone' had logged on to Rebecca's computer had already been
investigated by our detectives and it was simply determined to be an automatic computer update.
Further, Dr. Wecht did not reach out to the San Diego County Medical Examiner's Office
or the Sheriff's Office to attend the autopsy, as is normal protocol to establish and maintain a
clean chain of custody, should new evidence be found.
According to Sheriff Gore, "This is nothing more than sensationalism at its lowest point
and the family is only enduring more suffering from this insensitivity."
:banghead::banghead:How insulting can Gore continue to be? This is not entertainment. His investigation is laughable and insensitive. The Zahau family deserve better than this. Treat this family like you would want to be treated if you were wearing their shoes. End of story.
arielilane
11-17-2011, 06:42 PM
Listening to that voice no emotion, no concern, flippant tone, sarcastic, demeaning. He cut her down he had to know her body was cold and stiff, and yet he asks. And the authorities can still call this a suicide? And the Shacknai family is blameless?
And he had dinner with her earlier in the evening, the night before. Less than 11 or 12 hours later he finds her hanging and this is his reaction.
coastal
11-17-2011, 07:01 PM
Found this interesting local poll; no date on the page, but the first comment was "7 hours ago", so I'm guessing it's current:
http://www.signonsandiego.com/polls/2011/nov/do-you-think-all-questions-about-rebecca-zahaus-de/results/
Do you think all questions about Rebecca Zahau’s death now have been resolved?
Yes 23% 104 votes
No 76% 344 votes
arielilane
11-17-2011, 07:04 PM
http://abcnews.go.com/US/coronado-mansion-death-rebecca-zahau-knocked-unconscious/story?id=14955832&page=2#.TsRJsXJbU74
Hopefully this is will work. If you look at all the comments the poster made on all ABC stories they have some interesting information.
The aunt did talk to Rebecca but couldn't get a straight answer as to what happened.
The poster seems to have alot of against Asian women.
Question did Rebecca have a party with her health club friend the night before her death?
The poster seems to want to make a case for suicide but instead paints Rebecca in a pretty uncaring light. If she is uncaring why would she kill herself?Welcome to WS! Unfortunately, the comments tab isn't working for me. Bummer...
coastal
11-17-2011, 07:17 PM
Mixed DNA ‘all over’ Zahau death scene; some evidence not tested
Updated: Nov 17, 2011 12:47 PM PST
By David Gotfredson, Field Producer :rocker:
>>>snip
...In addition to the fingernail sample, unidentified DNA also was recovered from the rope used in Zahau's alleged hanging; a large knife used to the cut the rope; the bed frame to which the rope was tied; a door knob on the balcony door; and a pair of black gloves found on a table in the mansion, Grubb said.
"When you have a low-level mixture and it's so low that it's un-interpretable, it means that even if we have other subjects to compare, it's not going to be fruitful," said Grubb.
Because the amount of mixed DNA recovered was so minuscule, San Diego County Sheriff Bill Gore said it was unnecessary to collect DNA samples from Zahau's boyfriend, Arizona tycoon Jonah Shacknai, or Jonah's ex-wife, Dina Shacknai...
<...>
...Attorney Bremner said Jonah Shacknai is seen on hospital surveillance video on the night of Zahau's death, but Dina Shacknai is not.
Sheriff Gore confirmed as much during his news conference.
"We don't have her (Dina Shacknai) on surveillance tape," Gore confirmed. "Her position was determined thorough GPS triangulation on her cell phone, which put her in the vicinity of Rady Children's Hospital..."
http://www.cosgan.de/images/midi/figuren/a095.gif
(article continues)
<<<snip
I really like this reporter, David Gotfredson. He seems to be asking - and reporting - the hard questions, and his articles are balanced and thorough.
Nice job, Mr. G! Keep up the good work!
lauriej
11-17-2011, 07:20 PM
http://www.760kfmb.com/story/16068012/mixed-dna-all-over-zahau-death-scene-some-evidence-not-tested
Mixed DNA ‘all over’ Zahau death scene; some evidence not tested
--Nov.17/201---snipped--
http://i1207.photobucket.com/albums/bb474/lauriejcampbell/sheriffconferencenov16.jpg
--video-Sheriff's news Conference--Nov.17/2011
"It's a case that just cries out for answers and investigation. We have mixed DNA in her fingernails," the Seattle-based attorney said.
Sheriff's Crime Lab Director Michael Grubb did not dispute the presence of unidentifiable, mixed DNA at the Coronado scene.
"DNA can come to be on all sorts of surfaces; door knobs, any public surface can gain DNA from a number of people and it will reside there and may be picked up by someone else," said Grubb. "When you have a low-level mixture and it's so low that it's un-interpretable, it means that even if we have other subjects to compare, it's not going to be fruitful."
Because the amount of mixed DNA recovered was so minuscule, San Diego County Sheriff Bill Gore said it was unnecessary to collect DNA samples from Zahau's boyfriend, Arizona tycoon Jonah Shacknai, or Jonah's ex-wife, Dina Shacknai.
Sheriff Gore said it was not necessary to test the underwear, based on his department's investigation and statements made by Jonah Shacknai.
"In the case of the underwear, it was determined through investigators that Jonah Shacknai's daughter, Gabby, and her girlfriends had stayed in the guest house up to a week before," Gore said. "It did not appear to be relevant to our investigation and not everything we seize in a crime scene is eventually submitted for forensic examination."
Attorney Bremner said Jonah Shacknai is seen on hospital surveillance video on the night of Zahau's death, but Dina Shacknai is not.
Sheriff Gore confirmed as much during his news conference.
--more @ link--
lauriej
11-17-2011, 07:31 PM
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/2011/nov/17/death-in-coronado-the-sheriffs-case-for-suicide/
Death in Coronado: The sheriff’s case for suicide
By Jan Caldwell-------PR Director SDSO.
midnight, Nov. 17, 2011
As public affairs director for the San Diego County Sheriff’s Department, I find myself in a unique position with regard to the death investigations of Max Shacknai and Rebecca Zahau.
I watched detectives investigate the deaths with professionalism, expertise and respect. I’ve observed some media exploit these tragedies because, as one television producer explained, they present an opportunity to “spike our ratings".
While it is an unusual suicide, it would be a truly bizarre murder.
------she then goes on to give her explanation of the "suicide."
Curious Me
11-17-2011, 08:09 PM
http://www.760kfmb.com/story/16039227/dr-phil-airs-new-evidence-in-coronado-mansion-mystery
-----------there are 2 short video clips at the above link.
..the snippet of the 911 call is heard about 20 seconds in on the shorter (2:30) clip titled:
"Dr. Phil airs new evidence in Coronado Mansion mystery".
POLICE DISPATCH: 911 emergency. What are you reporting?
ADAM SHACKNAI: I got a girl… hung herself.
POLICE DISPATCH: Is she alive?
ADAM SHACKNAI: Are you alive? I don't think so.
I can't believe he could sound so cold and callous. He sounds like he thinks it's funny. His brother was losing his son, and now his brother's gf is dead. IMO, he sounds amused!
jjenny
11-17-2011, 10:41 PM
The only GPS triangulation of the cell phone is going to prove is where the phone was.
Not exactly "beyond the shadow of a doubt," is it?
dovebar
11-17-2011, 10:42 PM
I still want to know what movies JS and his ex used to watch.
Horror movies in which a murder is staged as a suicide?
This idea came from somewhere.
CanManEh
11-17-2011, 11:57 PM
do we know what her background is like korean or something like that maybe im wrong but isn't that a culture where they have such strong beliefs about what happens when you die and how they carry out a funeral . Iam just wondering if she was from such a background with these beliefs wouldn't it really be a slap in the face for one to comitt suicide and also doing it naked .
oceanblueeyes
11-18-2011, 08:27 AM
I have never thought this was a 'staged suicide' because it would have to be staged to look more like a homicide and that just makes no sense if it truly was a homicide but was suppose to look like a simple suicide.
If it was a staged suicide then there wouldn't have instantly been so many questions tending to make people think it was a homicide.
Imo, although unusual, I do think it was a suicide.
I don't think Rebecca's family knew what was really in her mind at the time all this was transpiring. A lot of time someone does not tell their family everything.
IMO
Mrs. Holmes
11-18-2011, 09:31 AM
I have never thought this was a 'staged suicide' because it would have to be staged to look more like a homicide and that just makes no sense if it truly was a homicide but was suppose to look like a simple suicide.
If it was a staged suicide then there wouldn't have instantly been so many questions tending to make people think it was a homicide.
Imo, although unusual, I do think it was a suicide.
I don't think Rebecca's family knew what was really in her mind at the time all this was transpiring. A lot of time someone does not tell their family everything.
IMO
I have always thought this was HOMOCIDE but made to look like someone other than JS did it in a rage. I believe she was tortured and then strangled when JS tried to find out the truth about what happened to his son. Once she was dead the brother AS helped stage the scene to look like murder. If the cops wanted to believe it was suicide all the better in the killer's mind. The message on the door is made to look like some outsider tried to kill both MS and RZ. While AS's initial 911 call says killed herself I feel the two of them fully expected the cops to think it was homocide, especially when they read the note on the door. No wonder JS is so PLEASED with the outcome.
oceanblueeyes
11-18-2011, 09:48 AM
I have always thought this was HOMOCIDE but made to look like someone other than JS did it in a rage. I believe she was tortured and then strangled when JS tried to find out the truth about what happened to his son. Once she was dead the brother AS helped stage the scene to look like murder. If the cops wanted to believe it was suicide all the better in the killer's mind. The message on the door is made to look like some outsider tried to kill both MS and RZ. While AS's initial 911 call says killed herself I feel the two of them fully expected the cops to think it was homocide, especially when they read the note on the door. No wonder JS is so PLEASED with the outcome.
I don't think there is any evidence that she was tortured. The small abrasions on her scalp were dime size and is very consistent with striking something as she went over head first. My husband has had worse hemorrhages when he struck his head on an open cabinet door he forgot to close.
Why would the Shacknai's want it to look like a murder?:waitasec: If it looked like a rage killing then that would point directly at JS, DS or AS so why would they want to implicate themselves?
Didn't Jonah Shacknai ask the AGs office to re-investigate the case? So I am not sure why you are saying he must be pleased.
The only one who may have staged the suicide to look like a homicide could have been Rebecca if she was wanting someone to take the blame for it.
Cell phone records and pings would show if any of these parties were in the vicinity of the mansion when they told LE they were elsewhere.
IMO
elfie
11-18-2011, 02:25 PM
Mixed DNA ‘all over’ Zahau death scene; some evidence not tested
Updated: Nov 17, 2011 12:47 PM PST
By David Gotfredson, Field Producer :rocker:
>>>snip
...In addition to the fingernail sample, unidentified DNA also was recovered from the rope used in Zahau's alleged hanging; a large knife used to the cut the rope; the bed frame to which the rope was tied; a door knob on the balcony door; and a pair of black gloves found on a table in the mansion, Grubb said.
"When you have a low-level mixture and it's so low that it's un-interpretable, it means that even if we have other subjects to compare, it's not going to be fruitful," said Grubb.
Because the amount of mixed DNA recovered was so minuscule, San Diego County Sheriff Bill Gore said it was unnecessary to collect DNA samples from Zahau's boyfriend, Arizona tycoon Jonah Shacknai, or Jonah's ex-wife, Dina Shacknai...
<...>
...Attorney Bremner said Jonah Shacknai is seen on hospital surveillance video on the night of Zahau's death, but Dina Shacknai is not.
Sheriff Gore confirmed as much during his news conference.
"We don't have her (Dina Shacknai) on surveillance tape," Gore confirmed. "Her position was determined thorough GPS triangulation on her cell phone, which put her in the vicinity of Rady Children's Hospital..."
http://www.cosgan.de/images/midi/figuren/a095.gif
(article continues)
<<<snip
I really like this reporter, David Gotfredson. He seems to be asking - and reporting - the hard questions, and his articles are balanced and thorough.
Nice job, Mr. G! Keep up the good work!
There are methods of amplifying minute amounts of dna, here is one:
Multiple displacement amplification - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
So why this wasn't attempted, one can only guess. Are any of the items still in police custody? If so, hopefully AB can have them retested.
Curious Me
11-18-2011, 02:26 PM
IMO, Rebecca didn't want to die, but was murdered. SDSO did not present anything real that points to RZ being suicidal. Just hours before she was murdered she texted her sister that she had to be strong for Jonah. Nothing points to Rebecca being at all suicidal. Remember, she still had hope, and MS was still alive. RZ spent her last day on earth carting people to and from the airport all day. JMO, somebody else ended her life and has gotten away with it!
I know it is shocking to think SDSO would cover or not look fully into this case to determine this as a homicide, but, IMO, that is exactly what it was. Who killed Rebecca?
elfie
11-18-2011, 02:32 PM
The only GPS triangulation of the cell phone is going to prove is where the phone was.
Not exactly "beyond the shadow of a doubt," is it?
Especially when there is some indication that her phone is not always with her considering the length of time it to contact her after Max's accident.
Mrs. Holmes
11-18-2011, 04:28 PM
Yes I see your point but there are other things to consider.
I don't think there is any evidence that she was tortured. The small abrasions on her scalp were dime size and is very consistent with striking something as she went over head first. My husband has had worse hemorrhages when he struck his head on an open cabinet door he forgot to close.
I believe, the four bumps on the top of her head did not break the skin. They bled under the skin and Dr. Wecht said they would have happened with a blunt round instrument.That would not be the railing.
Why would the Shacknai's want it to look like a murder?:waitasec: If it looked like a rage killing then that would point directly at JS, DS or AS so why would they want to implicate themselves?
I believe she was killed in a rage.... and then whoever did it did the best they could to disguise the killing and point to a stranger. It is very possible she was strangled with the t-shirt and then placed in the noose and lowered over the balcony. Dr. Wecht questions why her neck was not broken. That would be normal for that kind of drop in an actual hanging death. Also, RZ had all sorts of marks all over her back and back of her legs.... but not her arms... if she sustained those marks on the bushes below the balcony why in the world did her arms... that were tied behind her back not sustain marks?
Didn't Jonah Shacknai ask the AGs office to re-investigate the case? So I am not sure why you are saying he must be pleased.
Yes, JS did ask the AG for another look at the case BUT he did not bring fourth any evidence that would cause the AG to look at the case. Legally, what JS asked for would never be done. In fact any lawyer worth their salt would know the AG would immediately reject his request. The AG does not re-investigate to help people's emotions it has to be about evidence. It was a PR stunt IMO.
The only one who may have staged the suicide to look like a homicide could have been Rebecca if she was wanting someone to take the blame for it.
In my opinion it does not look like a staged suicide. It looked like murder by a stranger. It is confusing with only RZ's DNA showing up and the mixed DNA... as whoever was there had to get rid of their fingerprints. I think anything that could be done to take away from the actual murder was done. I find it chilling the message is in block letters similiar to the block letters JS uses in his companies brochures and in third person... JS spoke in third person in his last address to shareholders. Interesting that the " voice message" that supposedly triggered this violent and sudden suicide has NEVER been heard by anyone. SDLE took JS's word for it. I think RZ was already dead at the time that voicemail was deleted and it was the killer that deleted it. the knots... where in the world did RZ learn how to do this? But conveniently JS's brother AS knows how to do those and was as the house that night.
Cell phone records and pings would show if any of these parties were in the vicinity of the mansion when they told LE they were elsewhere.
Yes it would show where their phones were. I think RZ was killed right around the time of those screams well before midnight.
IMO
It is interesting to note that the first officer on the scene believed the death was a possible homocide and very suspicious..... it was only when the rest of LE became involed that they jumped to suicide.... this was because they KNEW RZ was being scrutinized for the death of MS... and this is why they jumped to suicide... they also had a grieving father and mother.... and it isn't easy to question them at a time like that and look at them a possible murderers. JS went along nicely with the suicide theory and added to the mix with a message he KNEW had been deleted.
Mrs. Holmes
11-18-2011, 04:57 PM
Something that Nina said that I found interesting. The local reporter asked her about her son. She brought her son with her to DS's place. Who was looking after her son at 10:30 a night when she went over to the mansion?
The fact that she had so many questions and was clearly suspicious of RZ is very telling. DS would have the same questions and would be pressing JS to get answers from RZ. It would be human nature for him to go back to the mansion and question RZ about the accident.... but he has a history of violence. I can not think of a stronger motive to kill some .... even by accident... than the death of your child. The fact that RZ was naked means it was someone known to her and that was intimate with her that could easily get in the house and get that close to her. IMO
Originally Posted by coastal http://www.websleuths.com/forums/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7362521#post7362521)
Mixed DNA ‘all over’ Zahau death scene; some evidence not tested
Updated: Nov 17, 2011 12:47 PM PST
By David Gotfredson, Field Producer :rocker:
>>>snip
...Attorney Bremner said Jonah Shacknai is seen on hospital surveillance video on the night of Zahau's death, but Dina Shacknai is not.
Sheriff Gore confirmed as much during his news conference.
"We don't have her (Dina Shacknai) on surveillance tape," Gore confirmed. "Her position was determined thorough GPS triangulation on her cell phone, which put her in the vicinity of Rady Children's Hospital..."
Oh, for cripe sake... so her CELL PHONE WAS AT THE HOSPITAL :crazy:
And for how many minutes did they get that triangulation for - like a few around 3 am?
coastal
11-18-2011, 07:13 PM
IMO, Rebecca didn't want to die, but was murdered. SDSO did not present anything real that points to RZ being suicidal. Just hours before she was murdered she texted her sister that she had to be strong for Jonah. Nothing points to Rebecca being at all suicidal. Remember, she still had hope, and MS was still alive. RZ spent her last day on earth carting people to and from the airport all day. JMO, somebody else ended her life and has gotten away with it!
I know it is shocking to think SDSO would cover or not look fully into this case to determine this as a homicide, but, IMO, that is exactly what it was. Who killed Rebecca?
I agree with everything you said here, Curious Me. IMO, Rebecca didn't kill herself. Had she died in any one of a dozen other ways, I would feel less certain of that, because I know how hopelessness feels and how big it can seem. But she didn't.
My guess for who killed her? Dina. She had the motive, the opportunity, and the means, IMO. I think she confronted Rebecca, lost her temper and her self control, and she took Rebecca's life in retaliation for Max's. I think she had been led to believe Rebecca was responsible for Max's injuries, probably by Jonah in addition to Max's doctor, neither of whom could explain the extent of Max's injuries without inserting some deliberate act as the likely cause, which meant Rebecca must be the guilty party.
I think Max's fall is the key. I suspect Jonah knows more about that than he was, and is, willing to admit to. Maybe Rebecca was keeping something from Dina and LE. If so, only Jonah can say what, and why, now.
Such a tragedy, all the way around. I'm sorry for them all.
ETA: retaliation - the act of retaliating; return of like for like; reprisal.
MOO
defense101
11-18-2011, 09:32 PM
Did anyone watch Erin Burnett Out Front tonight on CNN, I missed it, but I'm going to watch the second airing of it at 9:00, I noticed it on the tv while I was out having dinner. Anne Bremner and Sheriff Gore are on it, amazing now that people are stirred up he's out selling the suicide determination IMO
MNlady
11-18-2011, 09:43 PM
When the dispatcher asked "Is she alive", were they really meaning for him to ask the victim? AS handled that strangely...I wonder why? "Are you alive? I don't think so". How creepy and weird. just sayin....
My take on that is that he thought the dispatcher's question was stupid, so his voice got 'aggressive' directed toward the dispatcher when he said "are you alive?" and his "I don't think so" was sarcastic..toward the dispatcher. I actually don't think it's strange at all taken in that context. You just told someone this person has hung herself and they want to know if she's alive??? How likely is that??? I think I'd be ticked off too. :waitasec:
defense101
11-18-2011, 10:07 PM
My take on that is that he thought the dispatcher's question was stupid, so his voice got 'aggressive' directed toward the dispatcher when he said "are you alive?" and his "I don't think so" was sarcastic..toward the dispatcher. I actually don't think it's strange at all taken in that context. You just told someone this person has hung herself and they want to know if she's alive??? How likely is that??? I think I'd be ticked off too. :waitasec: I don't think he was ticked off and if he was it was because he was the patsy who had to make the 911 call IMO.
nanwv
11-18-2011, 10:08 PM
Finally! Keep slamming Rebecca, Gore
Anne Bremner
Someone accessed her computer from a SW Airlines account. ... someone also accessed her computer after she died. Shame on him for implying it was Rebecca. The potential suspect (and there are a few) also accessed porn on his own IPhone and masterbated to it before her body was "found". Gore is insulting a dead woman and her family by his ill-informed remarks.
19 minutes ago · Like
Anne Bremner
Sheriff Gore implied at a press conference that Becky looked at bondage porn on her computer. This is false. Someone accessed her computer from a SW Airlines account before she died and then did generally after she died. And a person of interest in the case viewed porn on his Iphone before "discovering" her body.
Like · · Share · 22 minutes ago ·
defense101
11-18-2011, 10:12 PM
I don't think there is any evidence that she was tortured. The small abrasions on her scalp were dime size and is very consistent with striking something as she went over head first. My husband has had worse hemorrhages when he struck his head on an open cabinet door he forgot to close.
Why would the Shacknai's want it to look like a murder?:waitasec: If it looked like a rage killing then that would point directly at JS, DS or AS so why would they want to implicate themselves?
Didn't Jonah Shacknai ask the AGs office to re-investigate the case? So I am not sure why you are saying he must be pleased.
The only one who may have staged the suicide to look like a homicide could have been Rebecca if she was wanting someone to take the blame for it.
Cell phone records and pings would show if any of these parties were in the vicinity of the mansion when they told LE they were elsewhere.
IMO That's the issue here Ocean, there were no abrasions on her head, the blood was beneath the skin but there were no abrasions. To me this means that whatever hit Rebecca's head was not the wrought iron or the stuccoed house, as Dr Wecht stated it was done by a rounded object that didn't break the skin.
Finally! Keep slamming Rebecca, Gore
Anne Bremner
Someone accessed her computer from a SW Airlines account. ... someone also accessed her computer after she died. Shame on him for implying it was Rebecca. The potential suspect (and there are a few) also accessed porn on his own IPhone and masterbated to it before her body was "found". Gore is insulting a dead woman and her family by his ill-informed remarks.
19 minutes ago · Like
Anne Bremner
Sheriff Gore implied at a press conference that Becky looked at bondage porn on her computer. This is false. Someone accessed her computer from a SW Airlines account before she died and then did generally after she died. And a person of interest in the case viewed porn on his Iphone before "discovering" her body.
Like · · Share · 22 minutes ago ·
Sounds like Adam Shacknai is the POI. That's really disgusting to fly from TN to CA to give support to his brother and while little Max is braindead in the ICU, Adam is masturbating! How gross!
nanwv
11-18-2011, 10:46 PM
Looks like somebody like Apple! Remember this . . .
"Someone stole Rebecca’s credit card, the charges are to the Apple Ipod store and a dating site called Zoomsk. Miss Zahau and Mr. Shacknai’s daughter had a very contentious relationship, terrible is a better word, her family has spoken about this at some length."
http://www.forbes.com/sites/shenegot...-mansion-case/
defense101
11-19-2011, 12:52 AM
I watched again the recent Gore press conference in regards to the Dr Phil show, I noticed that the ME states that Rebecca went down head first which is why her neck wasn't broken, yet he then states the bumps on the top her head were caused by the edge of the balcony, wouldn't that then mean that in order to get the bumps on the top of her head that Rebecca would have to have somersaulted into vertical drop position which then should have caused her neck to break as in a judicial hanging. As well he uses the word probably? Perhaps hit by the rope on the way down? Maybe when she was cut down bumped her head? REALLY? You are determining someones manner of death and you are using words like probably, maybe, perhaps?
Sheriff Gore: we assumed the blood in the shower was hers, through logical investigative work not through dna testing, we don't test every little thing we just don't do that. WOW! In a possible murder investigation you just don't do that?
Regarding Nina's lie detector test, he says that when we looked at the totality of the investigation we didn't see the need to have her take one. Then that would mean they decided that suicide was the manner of death very early on.
He said yes that Dina wasn't on the hospital video surveillance and that they determined her whereabouts by triangulation of the cell towers, but they didn't request those records until August 28th. So for a month and half while they knew she wasn't on the tapes they didn't request the records??? Didn't see the need to get her DNA or fingerprints even though they knew this? What were they investigating, nothing it seems. This just stinks to high heaven IMO
It also sounds like he tried to influence Dr Phil's direction of the show by speaking to him prior to the show being taped, which didn't work as he was suprised at the turn the show took. Shame shame shame on you!
You could also tell as the questions went on both the ME and Gore were getting nervous as if they hadn't expected such detailed questions. The reporter asking the majority of the question had Gore wiping his brow in what seemed like frustration. Good work on that reporters behalf, it doesn't look like Jonah's PR machine has been able to subdue this reporter.
http://www.760kfmb.com/story/16068012/mixed-dna-all-over-zahau-death-
jjenny
11-19-2011, 02:31 AM
What does AB mean by somebody accessed RZ's computer from SW airline account? Somebody accessed her computer from a different location? Somebody logged onto SW account while on her computer? I don't get it.
CanManEh
11-19-2011, 03:45 AM
One thing i was shaking my head at was when you see the bed post and tape measure . The bed only moved about what looks to be 6 too 8 inches when she jumped could you imagine the force when she came to a sudden stop. I know she was a smaller girl but all that force and it being tied off on the bed leg/pole theres no way she had jumped off it would have moved that bed across the room with all the sudden
jjenny
11-19-2011, 11:28 AM
How much more bizarre can this case get? Now they are saying she was on her period? Seems to me that a last thing a woman on her period would want to do is to hang herself naked and outside for everybody to see.
defense101
11-19-2011, 12:30 PM
How much more bizarre can this case get? Now they are saying she was on her period? Seems to me that a last thing a woman on her period would want to do is to hang herself naked and outside for everybody to see. I believe earlier the ME was not definitive about whether it was menstrual or spotting due to an IUD he said it could be either and now they are for sure she was on her period? This was enough of a reason not to test the blood in the shower? I think there were have been much more blood than was found on her leg is she was in her cycle IMO.
Blood was found on her inner thighs and the source was either menses or spotting due to an IUD (Intrauterine Device). There was no genital trauma. A small amount of blood was also noted on her big toes which appeared to be due to small scratches from the plants below the balcony.
http://www.cbs8.com/story/15406681/shacknai-sends-cease-and-desist-letter-to-zahau-family-attorney
lauriej
11-19-2011, 12:35 PM
http://www.thehinkymeter.com/2011/11/19/rebecca-zahau-case-gore-loses-the-plot/
Rebecca Zahau case: Gore loses the plot
Posted on November 19, 2011 (http://www.thehinkymeter.com/2011/11/19/rebecca-zahau-case-gore-loses-the-plot/) by Valhall (http://www.thehinkymeter.com/author/admin/)
lauriej
11-19-2011, 01:21 PM
One thing i was shaking my head at was when you see the bed post and tape measure . The bed only moved about what looks to be 6 too 8 inches when she jumped could you imagine the force when she came to a sudden stop. I know she was a smaller girl but all that force and it being tied off on the bed leg/pole theres no way she had jumped off it would have moved that bed across the room with all the sudden
cbs8 performed a re-enactment earlier -----their bed moved over 3 feet.
http://www.cbs8.com/story/15928565/news ... on-mystery (http://www.cbs8.com/story/15928565/news-8-reenacts-the-coronado-mansion-mystery)
-----http://i1207.photobucket.com/albums/bb474/lauriejcampbell/news8reenactment.jpg
Exclusive: News 8 reenacts the Coronado mansion mystery
http://www.cbs8.com/story/15940480/mans ... -questions (http://www.cbs8.com/story/15940480/mansion-mystery-news-8-reenactment-reveals-new-questions)
-----http://i1207.photobucket.com/albums/bb474/lauriejcampbell/reenactmentrevealsnewquestions.jpg
Mansion mystery: News 8 reenactment reveals new questions
--------SDSO response to reenactment---
News 8 informed the sheriff's department about our results. A spokesperson issued a statement saying:
Your test was invalidated from the beginning. Even if you had the exact bed frame, you don't know the exact mattress (and weight). You don't know what was on the mattress (if anything), and you don't have the same carpet, padding, and indentations made by this particular piece of furniture.
You cannot simulate the exact conditions of that particular night, and you don't know precisely how Rebecca went over the railing. While this suicide is unusual, it is not unprecedented and it would be an enigmatic homicide.
October
11-19-2011, 01:46 PM
Finally! Keep slamming Rebecca, Gore
Anne Bremner
Someone accessed her computer from a SW Airlines account. ... someone also accessed her computer after she died. Shame on him for implying it was Rebecca. The potential suspect (and there are a few) also accessed porn on his own IPhone and masterbated to it before her body was "found". Gore is insulting a dead woman and her family by his ill-informed remarks.
19 minutes ago · Like
Anne Bremner
Sheriff Gore implied at a press conference that Becky looked at bondage porn on her computer. This is false. Someone accessed her computer from a SW Airlines account before she died and then did generally after she died. And a person of interest in the case viewed porn on his Iphone before "discovering" her body.
Like · · Share · 22 minutes ago ·
BBM. Does this mean that Anne Bremner has Adam's cell phone records? This is the first I've hear of this. It has very disturbing implications.
lauriej
11-19-2011, 02:30 PM
BBM. Does this mean that Anne Bremner has Adam's cell phone records? This is the first I've hear of this. It has very disturbing implications.
---UNbelievably, as the last one to see rebecca alive, AND the person to find her dead---LE did not get adamS's phone records.
--anneB has adamS's interview with LE , i imagine this is the source of her info.
http://coronado.patch.com/articles/detectives-zahau-calm-not-despondent
Bremner said the investigative files contain some information that already has been released, such as autopsy reports and search warrants. Other materials include photos, DVD's, lab reports, surveillance footage, medical records and videotaped interviews of Adam Shacknai and Xena Zahau.
Bremner does not have the file on the boy's death, but said she will request it because she believes the cases are connected.
“I think they're connected. Let's look at everything, blue sky, open air,“ the Seattle-based lawyer said.
jjenny
11-19-2011, 02:40 PM
I believe earlier the ME was not definitive about whether it was menstrual or spotting due to an IUD he said it could be either and now they are for sure she was on her period? This was enough of a reason not to test the blood in the shower? I think there were have been much more blood than was found on her leg is she was in her cycle IMO.
Blood was found on her inner thighs and the source was either menses or spotting due to an IUD (Intrauterine Device). There was no genital trauma. A small amount of blood was also noted on her big toes which appeared to be due to small scratches from the plants below the balcony.
http://www.cbs8.com/story/15406681/shacknai-sends-cease-and-desist-letter-to-zahau-family-attorney
Yes, they are now saying this was menstrual blood and that's why they did not test blood in the shower.
Mrs. Holmes
11-19-2011, 04:01 PM
The stuff about the asian bondage porn being looked at on the mansion computer.... was this JS and RZ's previos habit? Did he initiate it to tie her up and then demand answers about what happened to MS? I keep thinking about the rope ends and if they were taped off... was this rope used before by them?
and AS admitting to masturbating to porn... WOW
BIZARRE... new investigation ASAP!!!
lauriej
11-19-2011, 04:35 PM
Something that Nina said that I found interesting. The local reporter asked her about her son. She brought her son with her to DS's place. Who was looking after her son at 10:30 a night when she went over to the mansion?
The fact that she had so many questions and was clearly suspicious of RZ is very telling. DS would have the same questions and would be pressing JS to get answers from RZ. It would be human nature for him to go back to the mansion and question RZ about the accident.... but he has a history of violence. I can not think of a stronger motive to kill some .... even by accident... than the death of your child. The fact that RZ was naked means it was someone known to her and that was intimate with her that could easily get in the house and get that close to her. IMO
..she said that a female friend of dina's was there from santa barbara, as well as a male friend that had come to town too and was staying at dina's also. (presumably dina's b/f markS.)
arielilane
11-19-2011, 04:46 PM
http://www.760kfmb.com/story/16068012/mixed-dna-all-over-zahau-death-scene-some-evidence-not-tested
Mixed DNA ‘all over’ Zahau death scene; some evidence not tested
--Nov.17/201---snipped--
http://i1207.photobucket.com/albums/bb474/lauriejcampbell/sheriffconferencenov16.jpg
--video-Sheriff's news Conference--Nov.17/2011
http://www.wuerziworld.de/Smilies/girl/gi2.gif
At the 13:25 mark Gore states:
This is a very unusual suicide . An incredible homicide. Who would do this, to make it look like a suicide and kind of make it look like a murder? It's not there, it's not logical.
So why did you iron clad it a suicide? Why not undetermined? Keep the investigation open...
"We knew where JS was." They already predetermined their findings. JS is boss man and ran the show... He is the new sheriff in town, I suppose? http://www.wuerziworld.de/Smilies/tr/tr11.gifhttp://www.wuerziworld.de/Smilies/mx2/mx20.gif
jjenny
11-19-2011, 11:31 PM
Somebody looked at Asian bondage porn on the computer. Wow. Her motive for suicide is supposed to be grief over supposed worsening of Max's condition, not "bondage anime."
"In a phone interview with News 8, Bremner confirmed that more than a dozen searches of sexual content – using terms like "raped, sexy Asian girls, and bondage anime" – were accessed on a computer the day before Zahau's death."
http://www.760kfmb.com/story/16083634/zahau-attorney-bondage-porn-found-on-coronado-mansion-computer
dovebar
11-20-2011, 02:10 AM
Accessed from SW Airlines?
Who was flying the day before, and who might have been able to access her account because they had been given her password, perhaps by her boyfriend?
Or do I misunderstand what Bremner is saying?
dovebar
11-20-2011, 02:20 AM
JS is not only CEO of Medicis, he is also a director of the Southwest Autism Research & Resource Center.
Will we find out that the "Southwest" account was not an airline account, but an email account linked to this group?
http://www.medicis.com/about/manage.asp
http://www.autismcenter.org/
Betty P
11-20-2011, 02:54 AM
Somebody looked at Asian bondage porn on the computer. Wow. Her motive for suicide is supposed to be grief over supposed worsening of Max's condition, not "bondage anime."
"In a phone interview with News 8, Bremner confirmed that more than a dozen searches of sexual content – using terms like "raped, sexy Asian girls, and bondage anime" – were accessed on a computer the day before Zahau's death."
http://www.760kfmb.com/story/16083634/zahau-attorney-bondage-porn-found-on-coronado-mansion-computer
According to the link, AS was looking at porn on his IPhone just before he discovered RZ
Bremner said Adam Shacknai claimed during a lie detector examination that he was viewing pornography on his iPhone just before he walked out of the mansion guest house and found Zahau hanging.
arielilane
11-20-2011, 08:26 AM
Huge information! Thanks for posting.
snipped/copied and pasted from the article:
Attorney Bremner said she is planning to submit evidence in the case to the California Attorney General in the next few weeks, which she hopes will lead to a new, independent investigation of Zahau's death.
curiousjo
11-20-2011, 01:44 PM
Somebody looked at Asian bondage porn on the computer. Wow. Her motive for suicide is supposed to be grief over supposed worsening of Max's condition, not "bondage anime."
"In a phone interview with News 8, Bremner confirmed that more than a dozen searches of sexual content – using terms like "raped, sexy Asian girls, and bondage anime" – were accessed on a computer the day before Zahau's death."
If this is true, then holy cow! Something is wrong. It will be interesting to find out which computer (desk top vs lap top) was used and TIME of use. There is no way that someone would do this kind of search prior to committing suicide. So, that leaves the brothers, the twins or someone else who entered the home that night. They may or may not have needed a password to log in since many people have their home computer set up for instant access without even entering a password. This opens the door to AS getting off on Asian porn and attempting rape... vs RZ catching AS looking at graphic site and feud broke out...vs JS came home for sex play...- in all scenerios things got violent. Doubt a woman would go to these sites, so the twins may be off the hook. However, they may be smart enough to set a decoy scene for murder by a male. Time and site of computer is critical.
In regards to someone accessing RZ computer after her death - that could be JS in search of answers. Again, the date would determine who was flying home to AZ - JS, DS, the physician friend who flew in to visit, etc (not sure if AS or DS twin flew to AZ). If not JS, then he must have given someone RZ password.
In the end, I still think the brothers are involved since the AS death text to JS, followed by no reply says foul play! And who looks at porn at 6 am?---If true that AS looking at porn prior to calling 911, then that is scary - he got off on tying her up and killing her. Wow!
JMO
Pacific2011
11-20-2011, 01:54 PM
JS is not only CEO of Medicis, he is also a director of the Southwest Autism Research & Resource Center.
Will we find out that the "Southwest" account was not an airline account, but an email account linked to this group?
http://www.medicis.com/about/manage.asp
http://www.autismcenter.org/
What a good idea! I posted your message on the Forensics/Computer Thread as well. . . .hope you don't mind.
Thanks for the idea!
stilettos
11-20-2011, 01:58 PM
This whole case stinks to high heaven. I am not in any way surprised with the porn info. I would be willing to lay serious money that JS and his bro both have history of porn access on computers and phones.
jjenny
11-20-2011, 05:16 PM
So a little boy was dying but somebody still found time to look at porn? Did LE even attempt to find out who it was looking at that porn? Also after it came out that underwear was found in the guest house, police started claiming they checked it and it was not RZ's. Now we find out they never tested it and just assumed it was not RZ's because JS's daughter was staying in the guest house prior.
Bonepile
11-20-2011, 06:29 PM
In regards to someone accessing RZ computer after her death - that could be JS in search of answers. Again, the date would determine who was flying home to AZ - JS, DS, the physician friend who flew in to visit, etc (not sure if AS or DS twin flew to AZ). If not JS, then he must have given someone RZ password. JMO
Or maybe someone was accessing in an attempt to try and remove the material accessed earlier. Just a thought.
IHAVENOCLUE
11-20-2011, 06:42 PM
But we are still here and we do make a difference. It is not the number of us that matter it is our thoughts, our prayers, and just standing here together.
I am new to this thread. And I am not a trained sleuth. But this case has sent up Red Flags for me ever since I heard that the cause of death was stated as suicide.
There are so many questions in my mind, and I haven't even followed it as closely as you all.
JMO
Mrs. Holmes
11-20-2011, 07:12 PM
SDLE they really jumped to conclusions about the time of death based on the deleted email. With the call not showing up on RZ's phone records but on JS's phone records. I would suggest he called RZ's voicemail from his phone and deleted a message. We don't know when that message was left or who left it. That means he lied as far as I am concerned. I think RZ was dead and JS may have been headed back to the hospital/hotel at that time. He remembers he left a voicemail and calls into the voicemail to delete it. If the phone was turned off at that point it would take you straight to voicemail you enter the code and get into the voicemail messages. I would like to know if the phone was on or off when it was found?
Mrs. Holmes
11-20-2011, 07:20 PM
About the blood... did LE actually test to determine if it was regular blood or menstrual blood?
I really want to know what time the computer searches were done? It is almost like it would have been done after she was accidentally killed in a rage.. and then it was looked up to help stage it as an intruder murder.... and the foolish cops... thought it was suicide.... because they thought she had likely killed MS.
Mrs. Holmes
11-20-2011, 07:22 PM
I found it odd that RZ's cell phone was on the floor. Did she try to reach for it to call for help at one point? I can see it lying on the bed or night table etc. but not be left on the floor.
SmoothOperator
11-20-2011, 08:54 PM
Adam Shacknai is repulsive!!! His disrespectful, smartazz comment of asking Becky's lifeless body, "are you alive?" and I don't care if he was being a smartazz to the dispatcher anyway you look at it the behavior is absolutely 100% inappropriate, uncalled for, and repulsive.. Now we hear Asian bondage porn was accessed prior to death.. And just so happens that Adam within literal feet of a bound, Asian woman dead is accessing porn on his iPhone to masturbate.. Immediately prior to "discovering RZ"..
This is an injustice amd someone should have Gore's head for what has happened and is continuing to happen regarding this case!!
I'm appalled.. But I guess those suicide believers feel that Becky was masturbating to Asian bondage porn immediately prior to killing herself?? Really?? Come on..
lauriej
11-20-2011, 09:03 PM
****REMINDER***** on NOW.
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/websleuths ... yril-wecht (http://www.blogtalkradio.com/websleuths/2011/11/21/baby-lisa-irwin-rebecca-zahau-dr-cyril-wecht)
Baby Lisa Irwin/ Rebecca Zahau/ Dr. Cyril Wecht/ 9 PM EST
--blog talk radio tonight-----November 20th/2011 @ above link.
branwynbreeze
11-20-2011, 09:14 PM
Somebody looked at Asian bondage porn on the computer. Wow. Her motive for suicide is supposed to be grief over supposed worsening of Max's condition, not "bondage anime."
"In a phone interview with News 8, Bremner confirmed that more than a dozen searches of sexual content – using terms like "raped, sexy Asian girls, and bondage anime" – were accessed on a computer the day before Zahau's death."
http://www.760kfmb.com/story/16083634/zahau-attorney-bondage-porn-found-on-coronado-mansion-computer
Dare I admit it? I was chatting with a guy I rent a house to last week, former porn star/director-who makes custom bondage gear and he told me that bondage/rape/snuff are huge money makers in the industry currently.
I also cannot believe that AS alibi was pleasuring himself. Seriously, if anyone else used that do you think LE would say Ok, he couldn't possibly be involved. Fat chance.
dovebar
11-20-2011, 10:28 PM
Dare I admit it? I was chatting with a guy I rent a house to last week, former porn star/director-who makes custom bondage gear and he told me that bondage/rape/snuff are huge money makers in the industry currently.
I also cannot believe that AS alibi was pleasuring himself. Seriously, if anyone else used that do you think LE would say Ok, he couldn't possibly be involved. Fat chance.
I'm sure they are huge money makers in that sick people who need to dominate and humiliate are obsessed, and no amount of getting what they think they want is enough.
Callie
11-20-2011, 10:40 PM
Coastal and Mrs. Holmes, thank you so much for the above.
It puzzles me that our numbers have dwindled down to only a few (sometimes I'm the only member here).
Hoping hard for a new investigation!
I'm here, Carpe Pacem, lol Big deal, huh? I've been busy lately and my puter has dragging a$$ and it drives me nuts.
Callie
11-20-2011, 11:01 PM
Adam says in the 911 phone call I'm doing chest compressions right now... really? First off he was on the phone, was he doing chest compressions with one hand? The photos of Rebecca cleary showed that her arms were still tied? behind her back, and if untied in rigor, so tell me how the heck did he do chest compressions with her on her side? IMO this was a staged 911 call.
Hi defense101,
PLUS: It was obviously too late. Her body was cold to the touch, she had rigor in her jaw and a congested face when the police arrived shortly after his 911 call. Adam couldn't tell? What a dumba$$ or liar.
Callie
11-20-2011, 11:14 PM
Welcome to Websleuths Terrichad!!:party::welcome4::Banane14::Banane14:
Welcome from me too, Terrichad!
Callie
11-20-2011, 11:21 PM
I followed your suggestion and checked out the other 17 posts by JKDFJ7, who is clearly delusional. However, I did find this gem, posted Sept 7:
They need to investigate little Max's death more thoroughly. It doesn't make sense. Then perhaps they can get answers to Rebecca's demise.
http://abcnews.go.com/site/comments?type=user&loginCode={0C35174E-613D-4739-9762-9EF45059AD23}#.TsRQsFbPyng
Strangely enough, I agree. I think clearing up the confusion surrounding Max's accident will lead LE to the motive for Rebecca's murder, and from there, straight to her killer. Even the San Diego Sheriff could solve this mystery then.
IMO
I SO agree with that, coastal. I've been saying that for awhile now.
sorrell skye
11-20-2011, 11:38 PM
Dare I admit it? I was chatting with a guy I rent a house to last week, former porn star/director-who makes custom bondage gear and he told me that bondage/rape/snuff are huge money makers in the industry currently.
I also cannot believe that AS alibi was pleasuring himself. Seriously, if anyone else used that do you think LE would say Ok, he couldn't possibly be involved. Fat chance.
I hope your renter isn't involved in rape or snuff films. Why was he talking to you about rape & snuff films? How did this conversation come up - I mean, it's not as if this is a typical conversation that occurs between a tenant & a landlord. Did you get the sense that he was bragging about how much money he's personally made filming rapes & murders? If you have the slightest suspicion, you should contact LE immediately & let them sort it out, because he's right - rape & snuff films are big money makers, and if he's involved in that, he needs to be investigated.
Callie
11-20-2011, 11:38 PM
What does AB mean by somebody accessed RZ's computer from SW airline account? Somebody accessed her computer from a different location? Somebody logged onto SW account while on her computer? I don't get it.
Yeah, I didn't hear anything about the SW thing either.
lauriej
11-21-2011, 12:03 AM
------the blogtalk from tonight...
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/websleuths ... yril-wecht (http://www.blogtalkradio.com/websleuths/2011/11/21/baby-lisa-irwin-rebecca-zahau-dr-cyril-wecht)
Blog Talk Radio - Websleuths Radio Show 11-20-11
..dr.wecht was the guest, as well as ----ta da!----WS"cynic".
------great stuff "cynic" !
branwynbreeze
11-21-2011, 12:04 AM
I hope your renter isn't involved in rape or snuff films. Why was he talking to you about rape & snuff films? How did this conversation come up - I mean, it's not as if this is a typical conversation that occurs between a tenant & a landlord. Did you get the sense that he was bragging about how much money he's personally made filming rapes & murders? If you have the slightest suspicion, you should contact LE immediately & let them sort it out.
I commented on some art in his bedroom which turned into discussing the fine line between freedom of speech and obscenity. I'm not saying his art was obscene, just something I wouldn't have in my house, bedroom or not and I was teasing him about it.
He is not involved with production company, which he told me is one of top grossing companies in industry and acts are simulated. He explained some of the special effects used. It was a quick chat and we moved on to what he was planning to do to house next, painting, decorating, ect. He's done some beautiful things around house, painting, his art work, ect.
If I felt there was any illegal activity going on in that house, believe me it would be dealt with quickly.
lauriej
11-21-2011, 12:12 AM
Yeah, I didn't hear anything about the SW thing either.
..family attorney anneB brought it up on her F/B..
http://www.facebook.com/AnneMBremner
Anne Bremner (http://www.facebook.com/AnneMBremner)
Someone accessed Rebecca Zahau's computer from SW Airlines before she died. Someone also accessed her computer after she died.
http://www.cbs8.com/story/16083634/zahau-attorney-bondage-porn-found-on-coronado-mansion-computer
--snipped--
In a phone interview with News 8, Bremner later confirmed that more than a dozen searches of sexual content – using terms like "raped, sexy Asian girls, and bondage anime" – were accessed on a computer the day before Zahau's death.
"It's important to the investigation because there is an image from anime, and its called bond anime and it shows an Asian women bound; at least her hands are bound behind her back," said the Seattle-based attorney.
Bremner said it was not Zahau who looked at the online content and suggested the computer may have been accessed by someone using an airline account.
Callie
11-21-2011, 12:14 AM
I have never thought this was a 'staged suicide' because it would have to be staged to look more like a homicide and that just makes no sense if it truly was a homicide but was suppose to look like a simple suicide.
If it was a staged suicide then there wouldn't have instantly been so many questions tending to make people think it was a homicide.
Imo, although unusual, I do think it was a suicide.
I don't think Rebecca's family knew what was really in her mind at the time all this was transpiring. A lot of time someone does not tell their family everything.
IMO
Hi ocean, Although there are many things that bother me, I have considered the suicide scenerio many times, flopping back and forth and on the fence.
If it was, I strongly believe she was pushed to it by the Shacknai camp. Epecially by Jonah.
Callie
11-21-2011, 12:28 AM
..family attorney anneB brought it up on her F/B..
http://www.facebook.com/AnneMBremner
Anne Bremner (http://www.facebook.com/AnneMBremner)
Someone accessed Rebecca Zahau's computer from SW Airlines before she died. Someone also accessed her computer after she died.
http://www.cbs8.com/story/16083634/zahau-attorney-bondage-porn-found-on-coronado-mansion-computer
--snipped--
In a phone interview with News 8, Bremner later confirmed that more than a dozen searches of sexual content – using terms like "raped, sexy Asian girls, and bondage anime" – were accessed on a computer the day before Zahau's death.
"It's important to the investigation because there is an image from anime, and its called bond anime and it shows an Asian women bound; at least her hands are bound behind her back," said the Seattle-based attorney.
Bremner said it was not Zahau who looked at the online content and suggested the computer may have been accessed by someone using an airline account.
Thanks a bunch, lauriej. I'll check it out.
dovebar
11-21-2011, 12:43 AM
Has Anne Bremner or anyone released the email address?
I'm seriously wondering if there's evidence that it was an airline account that accessed the computer, or whether people assume "Southwest" means airlines.
Callie
11-21-2011, 01:02 AM
Can anyone tell me how to get rid of that X at the bottom of my posts?
It bugs me:crazy:
Carpe Pacem
11-21-2011, 01:48 AM
Callie;7371368]I'm here, Carpe Pacem, lol Big deal, huh? I've been busy lately and my puter has dragging a$$ and it drives me nuts.
Happy to see you, Callie! My computer's the same - it's taking forever for WS pages to load and unload - sometimes I swear softly and give up
arielilane
11-22-2011, 10:09 AM
I have never thought this was a 'staged suicide' because it would have to be staged to look more like a homicide and that just makes no sense if it truly was a homicide but was suppose to look like a simple suicide.
If it was a staged suicide then there wouldn't have instantly been so many questions tending to make people think it was a homicide.
Imo, although unusual, I do think it was a suicide.
I don't think Rebecca's family knew what was really in her mind at the time all this was transpiring. A lot of time someone does not tell their family everything.
IMO I do think it is a homicide.http://www.wuerziworld.de/Smilies/mx2/mx20.gif
Callie
11-22-2011, 10:54 AM
Callie;7371368]I'm here, Carpe Pacem, lol Big deal, huh? I've been busy lately and my puter has dragging a$$ and it drives me nuts.
Happy to see you, Callie! My computer's the same - it's taking forever for WS pages to load and unload - sometimes I swear softly and give up
Hi Carpe Pacem,
Sometimes I want to take a sledge hammer to it. I got rid of some add-ons and that help some.
Callie
11-22-2011, 11:01 AM
Can anyone tell me how to get rid of that X at the bottom of my posts?
It bugs me:crazy:
I think I got it fixed. I don't see it now.
Pacific2011
11-22-2011, 11:38 AM
snipped:
I'm seriously wondering if there's evidence that it was an airline account that accessed the computer, or whether people assume "Southwest" means airlines.
I also wonder about that, and I appreciate your bringing the topic up again. . . .especially since you also pointed out that JS is a director of the Southwest Autism Center (not sure about the exact name) in AZ.
Is anyone sure the account was from Southwest Airlines? TIA.
Theforeigner
11-22-2011, 01:58 PM
In the vidoe, in this link,you can hear a short piece of Adam S's 911 call:
http://www.760kfmb.com/story/16083634/zahau-attorney-bondage-porn-found-on-coronado-mansion-computer
SunnieRN
12-11-2011, 08:17 PM
Thank you for all the updates Sorrel.
Interesting about the fingernail clippings... I know of at least one murder case where they claimed there wasn't anyone else's DNA under the fingernails so now I'm curious about what they typically find and whether or not something would come of DNA analysis of Rebecca's fingernail scrapping. Of course, I think the suspect DNA profile base should have been broadened.
I also wonder how thoroughly the DNA was collected and processed. With DNA present under Rebecca's nails, on the knife, in the black gloves, on the door handle etc., it seems to me that there could have been at least one viable sample processed. Amazing!!
Thank you sorrell skye and bonepile.
I could kick myself for forgetting to set my dvd to record today's Dr. Phil.
This was mentioned before and is worth mentioning again.
Why would a man who just had dinner with RZ call her "girl". I find that cold and a detachment. Why didn't he state my brother's girlfriend? Better yet, by her name, Rebecca. Red flag. And that she hung herself. How does he know that???
LE didn't want to hurt their town's big wig? I don't blame the Z family for wanting an independent investigation.
Thank goodness Rebecca never married JS.
Girl, kid, angry and hostile. I can certainly understand why the 911 call was not released at an earlier date. I question what else, or what context, turn, the rest of the 911 call made. What else could have taken place that could have been any worse than what has aleady been made known?
I doubt any poster has "inside information" that is unknown to police. The ME has already ruled the death a suicide. Revenge doesn't point to suicide and LE has said that they will reconsider if there is new information.
JMO
I beg to differ with your opinion as 'insiders' who have posted on Websleuths have stated that Dina posts on other sites. I woud say that Dina should be considered an insider.
Have you ever heard of someone asking an unconscious person, "Are you alive?"
What people typically say is, "Wake up! wake up!" or "open your eyes! Can you open your eyes!"
Or as Mrs. Holmes suggested, since he clearly knew who she was, why wouldn't he say, "Becky! Becky!"
This PD is either incompetent or corrupt. Federal authorities need to be called in to investigate the cops.
Is it true that the idiotic neighbors who heard her screaming for her life didn't call 911 (like the Apple employees in the yoga store case?)? What is wrong with people?
Agreed Dovebar and you make several good points within your post. I am sure if presented with the same scenario in the future, these neighbors would call 911. You know what they say about hindsight!!
About the automatic updatin of the computer. My computer is on a standard setting. I have a common hp laptop from Wallmart (US I am canadian but live right on the border) and I have Windows 7 for home. My computer will only do an automatic updated if I am using the computer, it does not update even when it is in sleep mode. But SDSO doesn't bother to get into all that. No details just enough info to skip out of the accusation. Over and over again this is how this guy operates.
Also about the head first hanging I would think that "snap" when a fragile women's neck meets that kind of force head first would increase the chances of the neck breaking. She didn't gently ease head first into the tightning noose..... at least the way the SDSO version did not lead us to that.
AB and the Zahau family are certainly justified in NOT going to the SDSO as they are clearly only interested in defending their findings.
You make a most excellent point! My computer works the same way. It doesn't update if off, or in a sleep mode setting.
This is a most interesting case. Could someone tie themselves up before hanging themselves in the way surmised by the police? Yes, it is possible. First you would tie your feet together. Then you would slip the noose over your head, which is already tied to the balcony railing. Then you would tie your hands together in front of you using your teeth and then grab the tee shirt and use it as a gag. Because she was athletic she could slipped her tied hands over her feet and behind her. She then stood up and went over the balcony. The first question to ask is why would she go to all that trouble? The second question who would have a motive to kill her?
But, a point we have been discussing for quite some time is, where are the footprints showing where Rebecca stood to tie the rope to the balcony railing?
When did she get the black paint on the rope around her neck or the t shirt around her neck, without also getting it on other spots, while tying the rope and shirt around her neck?
There are a lot of other questions as well, but those are for a start! ;-)
Hi defense101,
PLUS: It was obviously too late. Her body was cold to the touch, she had rigor in her jaw and a congested face when the police arrived shortly after his 911 call. Adam couldn't tell? What a dumba$$ or liar.
My vote, is liar. He lied to his landlord prior to leaving Memphis, and imho, the lies continued until he left Coronado. Heck, they are most likely continuing to this day.
Funny how he seems to have fallen off the face of the earth, isn't it?!
Kid, to describe his own nephew, supposedly the reason he was in Coronado. Girl to describe his brothers 32 year old significant other. "Are you alive?" I just wish she could have answered 'yes'!
Nice to see that he told the cpr tall tale from the beginning. Proves that Gore and his cronies know zilch about cpr and life saving measures.
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