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bessie
12-28-2011, 03:18 PM
Please continue here.

Please remember that discussion of how this young girl ended up in that trailer is relevent to this case. The family is discussable to that end - but there is to be NO BASHING or TRASHING. We still do not know all the circumstances about why Aliahna was with this <modsnip>.

Also remember there is NO NAME CALLING, not even of the perp. I know that is difficult sometimes but we can do it.

Prayers for this little one, may she rest in peace and may her sisters find safety and be allowed to grow up. :(

MEDIA REFERENCE THREAD

Thread 1
Thread 2 (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7468775&posted=1#post7468775)


Salem

bam
12-28-2011, 03:23 PM
Anyone have a way to archive Iowa to see players and circumstances of abuse that Aliahna had experienced there? Could maybe this was the reason family moved away? So glad FBI is involved> I believe there is going to be alot of closets with skeletons if they research some computers>

TexasCharm
12-28-2011, 03:28 PM
Des Moines Register: 1 in 25 kids abused in Centerville

www.soc.iastate.edu/soc130sec1/ChildAbuse4.pdf

Sounds like a nice place to live ... eeek.


Looking into Iowa now ...........................

believe09
12-28-2011, 03:28 PM
http://www.wane.com/dpp/news/crime/autopsy-results-still-pending

Is there anything new regarding the autopsy results? I havent seen anything else but I have been offline this morning.

Columbo
12-28-2011, 03:31 PM
In the previous thread, neese wondered why there wasn't obvious blood in the trailer, and why a tracking dog wouldn't have picked up on it. That's something I've been wondering about, too. Dismembering must be extremely messy and difficult (I hate to type that or even think about it) so it seems like there would have been spatter or some kind of blood that MP would have failed to clean up, and the sheriff's crew would have noticed. Where did he do it?

Also in the previous thread, hollyblue mentioned how will they find out if she was sexually molested if her private parts are all hacked up (again, apologies...it's so sickening to say this). I wonder if he destroyed them on purpose because he wanted to make DNA identification more difficult? I bet they can retrieve DNA somehow, no matter what the condition of her body. Maybe from her underwear or clothing?

bam
12-28-2011, 03:32 PM
What's Aliahna's fathers last name?

lillygator
12-28-2011, 03:34 PM
What's Aliahna's fathers last name?

Maroney

sherbetjello
12-28-2011, 03:35 PM
What's Aliahna's fathers last name?

Maroney, it's in the media links thread.


Also, Believe09, they said the autopsy results will be released on/by friday via Nancy Grace last night

menmo
12-28-2011, 03:35 PM
I've definitely learned some things along the way reading here at Websleuths.
I had no idea that some convicted sex offender's only had to register for a certain time limit. Why?? I foolishly believed that once someone was convicted for the crime they stayed on the register for their lifetime, which I believe is how it should be.
I'm even more scared for all the children as there's no way to know! :(

Angelonline
12-28-2011, 03:36 PM
From reading all the articles I am beginning to think that sweet little Ali is now safe for the first time ever in her life.. How sad is that.. :(

TexasCharm
12-28-2011, 03:38 PM
I haven't found a connection to this family.

Wild@Heart
12-28-2011, 03:41 PM
I can't quote your entire post, Kat, and I want to.

This information on mom all of a sudden getting temporary paralysis has me under a thought: did Aliahna really have a medical diagnosis made by a professional?
All *speculation on my part.

I've had that question under my thumb all dang day.

I think that mom is oblivious to reality. This happens all the time to children raised in a dysfunctional enviroment. I think TS is a victim of her own reality, meaning she never learned how to be a reliable parent. We all have issues with exposure to dysfunction, but some people can never get away from the dysfunction long enough to see that the dysfunction is dysfunction.

Dysfunction - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Parents that expose their children to environments that are less then positive, love their children. It's not a matter of not loving enough, they simply have bad judgement. It brings me to Maslow's hierarchy of needs.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maslow's_hierarchy_of_needs

When you add other factors like drugs & Alcohol, sexual abuse, and abandonment, it magnifies the inability to meet basic needs. It's all about survival!

My opinion isn't that TS doesn't love her children, she simply didn't know how to mother. She practices what she learned, as we all do. If she would have had "good" people around her they could have taught her right from wrong, she could have been helped. Unfortunately every person around her are mentally sick...She never got out of the cycle.

I would bet my moral compass, she was abused in many ways as a child, at the hand of the people that "love" her the most. It is evident that her relationship with her father was obsessive. She loved him, perhaps in the wrong ways! I say this because she was willing to put her own children in a harmful environment to be with her father. The feeling of love is powerful and we all crave it, even if it is unhealthy. Most of us can recognize unhealthy love, people like TS can't.

She has tried to "survive" her entire life. At times, she probably didn't even have her basic needs met. She has searched her entire life for love and approval. Unfortunately she was in a dump looking for a treasure!

Of coarse this is simply my opinion!!:twocents:

not_my_kids
12-28-2011, 03:44 PM
In the previous thread, neese wondered why there wasn't obvious blood in the trailer, and why a tracking dog wouldn't have picked up on it. That's something I've been wondering about, too. Dismembering must be extremely messy and difficult (I hate to type that or even think about it) so it seems like there would have been spatter or some kind of blood that MP would have failed to clean up, and the sheriff's crew would have noticed. Where did he do it?

Also in the previous thread, hollyblue mentioned how will they find out if she was sexually molested if her private parts are all hacked up (again, apologies...it's so sickening to say this). I wonder if he destroyed them on purpose because he wanted to make DNA identification more difficult? I bet they can retrieve DNA somehow, no matter what the condition of her body. Maybe from her underwear or clothing?

Tracking dogs would not have picked up blood necessarily, but if cadaver dogs had been taken into the trailer, they would have picked up the scents of decomp, because it starts so soon after a person dies (within minutes, from my understanding). There are ways to tell if she was sexually abused, even if he took steps with her body to keep the evidence of that hidden. In most cases, there will still be semen in what they call the vaginal vault, as well as internal abrasions and cervical damage that can be determined to have occurred prior to the dismemberment. If there are scratches, bruising, or other genital damage, they will be able to tell when those occurred. Since she was already dead when he cut her up, there would be no healing to those wounds, but there would be scabbing and early signs of healing to injuries that were inflicted prior. They should be able to tell. I hope they can.

Dear God, that was a painful post to write.

lauriej
12-28-2011, 03:45 PM
There is a father (55) and son (20) in Centerville, Iowa that were sentenced on molestation charges earlier this year. One victim multiple times over the course of several years, and one "suspected of abusing a second minor just last year in his Centerville home."

I haven't found a connection to this family, but as it is connected to Centerville, Iowa - last year - and child abuse - I'll post the link. If it needs to be removed, sorry.


http://www.heartlandconnection.com/news/story.aspx?id=588537

--the article says that was a case of incest.

Wild@Heart
12-28-2011, 03:48 PM
I don't think mom suffers from munchausen's.

http://kidshealth.org/parent/system/ill/munchausen.html

Ladylub
12-28-2011, 03:49 PM
I have a feeling that the reason Aliahna feared the cops and felt bad for turning the 2 guys in was b/c of the views the family has of the RSO grandfather. I wonder how much did she know about her grandfathers disgusting criminal past and how the family feels about it as well. She sees good in all people sounds like it was a forced belief no way could a family with a RSO in it not explain that some people are just bad.

I have already had to explain bad people to my daughter when she had just turned 4. When Somer Thompson went missing she hid behind the chair ( she was supposed to be sleeping in her room) and then I see her head pop up tears in her eyes ask "how can someone hurt that pretty little girl mommy" Those words with her voice replay in my head every single time I hear about a child going missing.

Wise Old Owl
12-28-2011, 03:52 PM
In the previous thread, neese wondered why there wasn't obvious blood in the trailer, and why a tracking dog wouldn't have picked up on it. That's something I've been wondering about, too. Dismembering must be extremely messy and difficult (I hate to type that or even think about it) so it seems like there would have been spatter or some kind of blood that MP would have failed to clean up, and the sheriff's crew would have noticed. Where did he do it?

Also in the previous thread, hollyblue mentioned how will they find out if she was sexually molested if her private parts are all hacked up (again, apologies...it's so sickening to say this). I wonder if he destroyed them on purpose because he wanted to make DNA identification more difficult? I bet they can retrieve DNA somehow, no matter what the condition of her body. Maybe from her underwear or clothing?


It was reported that he put her in the freezer for a period of hours before he dismembered. If she was frozen - that helps with the mess. As for spatter - she was already dead - not much spatter as heart isn't beating and then being frozen - well, you get the idea.

Lord, that hurt to type.

TexasCharm
12-28-2011, 03:53 PM
--the article says that was a case of incest.

It states that the case 'involves' incest. I thought the first child, molested over the course of years, was probably related. The second child last year .. maybe not.

I probably shouldn't have posted the link until I made a connection.

Link removed .. carry on.

Columbo
12-28-2011, 03:54 PM
I've definitely learned some things along the way reading here at Websleuths.
I had no idea that some convicted sex offender's only had to register for a certain time limit. Why?? I foolishly believed that once someone was convicted for the crime they stayed on the register for their lifetime, which I believe is how it should be.
I'm even more scared for all the children as there's no way to know! :(

bolded by me.

I don't get it, either. Since child molesters are generally not capable of changing, they will always be a danger and should be registered for life!

tlcya
12-28-2011, 03:57 PM
How these three girls ended up in that trailer with MP is of great concern to me. I have never known anyone to have the flu so badly that they were unable to care for their children, and yet at the same time, this very ill person was not hospitalized.

I can certainy understand being ill and multiple children can be very tiring, on a good day. But in those instances where I have been so ill as to need someone's help, they watched my children for several hours so I could nap each day, or ran grocery errands for me, etc.

I am trying to imagine a circumstance where I am so ill with a flu as to be unable to care for my children, and yet not so ill as to need hospitalization, and further where the person I choose to have assist me by caring for my female children is a man I once expressed serious concerns about. :confused:

Further, I am trying to figure out if something I read on the now closed thread is true. Was there a male child or children who was not in the care of MP but rather still in the care of the very sick mom? Did I misread that info?

Because I can't imagine being so ill that my daughters are too much for me and are handed over to someone such as this, not for hours but DAYS and yet not so ill my son must be handed over as well?

Can someone make sense of this for me cause I am still just as confused as I was earlier.

mikeysmommom
12-28-2011, 04:00 PM
It was reported that he put her in the freezer for a period of hours before he dismembered. If she was frozen - that helps with the mess. As for spatter - she was already dead - not much spatter as heart isn't beating and then being frozen - well, you get the idea.

Lord, that hurt to type.

I am 52 and I never ever would have believed I would be posting and reading the HORRORS :furious:everyday that are happening to our children.Unbelievable :furious:

Bittiness39
12-28-2011, 04:01 PM
It was reported that he put her in the freezer for a period of hours before he dismembered. If she was frozen - that helps with the mess. As for spatter - she was already dead - not much spatter as heart isn't beating and then being frozen - well, you get the idea.

Lord, that hurt to type.

:( I know. :( I think Dr. Fessel is right (I think that was the poster that mentioned this).
1) How long would it take to freeze her body if it was put in there whole?
2) We know that when a body (already deceased) is frozen there would be little mess (meaning blood)
3) How long did it take to dismember her and place her in different bags?
4) Drive to the two locations?

The above hurt to type as well :( but the WHOLE process from murder to disposal took time. She had to have been in the freezer for hours...possibly even a day.

IMO, he knew he would have time to do all of those things because IMO those children were NOT being checked on by the family. He knew that he would have to dispose of most of her by Christmas Eve because SURELY the family would begin looking for her then.

I guess what I am saying is...it is hard for me to believe that Aliahna was just in the freezer (whole) for a few short hours. This leads me to believe that she might have been in there for at least a day, possibly more. JMO.

CCup
12-28-2011, 04:03 PM
What do we know about the possibility of there being boys in the family? Two? Are they mom's? Step-dad's? Their's together?

believe09
12-28-2011, 04:03 PM
Trying to stay caught up:

Is it confirmed that Pomodore is a convicted SO? Has it been confirmed somewhere that Aliahna did NOT have the diagnoses Mom related to the media and (presumably) LE?

Wild@Heart
12-28-2011, 04:04 PM
How these three girls ended up in that trailer with MP is of great concern to me. I have never known anyone to have the flu so badly that they were unable to care for their children, and yet at the same time, this very ill person was not hospitalized.

I can certainy understand being ill and multiple children can be very tiring, on a good day. But in those instances where I have been so ill as to need someone's help, they watched my children for several hours so I could nap each day, or ran grocery errands for me, etc.

I am trying to imagine a circumstance where I am so ill with a flu as to be unable to care for my children, and yet not so ill as to need hospitalization, and further where the person I choose to have assist me by caring for my female children is a man I once expressed serious concerns about. :confused:

Further, I am trying to figure out if something I read on the now closed thread is true. Was there a male child or children who was not in the care of MP but rather still in the care of the very sick mom? Did I misread that info?

Because I can't imagine being so ill that my daughters are too much for me and are handed over to someone such as this, not for hours but DAYS and yet not so ill my son must be handed over as well?

Can someone make sense of this for me cause I am still just as confused as I was earlier.

There is a family photo on TS's FB page. This photo includes; TS, AS, an older male child (maybe 10/11), AL, 2 - 6 year old girls, and the youngest child is a male 3/4 years old. There is also other pictures of an older female child that I believe to be TS's sisters daughter.

octobermoon
12-28-2011, 04:05 PM
And it wasn't like she was a single parent. Just because step dad worked nights, doesn't mean he couldn't handle the children. We aren't talking about newborn triplets FGS.

JMO

This is sickening.

Wise Old Owl
12-28-2011, 04:05 PM
He only drove to one location. The convien. store where he bought the cigar. The Sheriff on NG last night confirmed that that was the store and dumpster where he disposed of some. The head, hands and feet were in his freezer at the trailer. So, he only drove to one location - not 2.

I'm willing to bet the FBI involved are like a hornet's nest around there now. Not sure I want to hear about all that they find.

believe09
12-28-2011, 04:08 PM
Before we keep rolling along with the rumor of other children, I havent seen any media that indicates there were.

Anyone else?

mikeysmommom
12-28-2011, 04:08 PM
How these three girls ended up in that trailer with MP is of great concern to me. I have never known anyone to have the flu so badly that they were unable to care for their children, and yet at the same time, this very ill person was not hospitalized.

I can certainy understand being ill and multiple children can be very tiring, on a good day. But in those instances where I have been so ill as to need someone's help, they watched my children for several hours so I could nap each day, or ran grocery errands for me, etc.

I am trying to imagine a circumstance where I am so ill with a flu as to be unable to care for my children, and yet not so ill as to need hospitalization, and further where the person I choose to have assist me by caring for my female children is a man I once expressed serious concerns about. :confused:

Further, I am trying to figure out if something I read on the now closed thread is true. Was there a male child or children who was not in the care of MP but rather still in the care of the very sick mom? Did I misread that info?

Because I can't imagine being so ill that my daughters are too much for me and are handed over to someone such as this, not for hours but DAYS and yet not so ill my son must be handed over as well?

Can someone make sense of this for me cause I am still just as confused as I was earlier.

I agree 100%.................How this young girl and her 2 sisters ended up in that trailer is very relevant to this case.Over my cold dead body would this POS be anywhere near my children. I have a feeling when everything comes out,it will be horrendous.Just like the case on last weeks AMW:furious:.

Columbo
12-28-2011, 04:09 PM
It was reported that he put her in the freezer for a period of hours before he dismembered. If she was frozen - that helps with the mess. As for spatter - she was already dead - not much spatter as heart isn't beating and then being frozen - well, you get the idea.

Lord, that hurt to type.

It's hard to imagine that someone living in a trailer which appears as small as that one does would have room for a freezer large enough for a child's body. But I guess he must have one.....:(

krimekat
12-28-2011, 04:10 PM
Maroney, it's in the media links thread.

<<<respectfully snipped>>>

Also located IN - Aliahna Maroney Lemmon, MEDIA LINKS & TIMELINES, NO DISCUSSION thread

believe09
12-28-2011, 04:11 PM
And it wasn't like she was a single parent. Just because step dad worked nights, doesn't mean he couldn't handle the children. We aren't talking about newborn triplets FGS.

JMO

This is sickening.

Or, we have at least one special needs child who on the surface, if her diagnoses as related in the media are accurate, needed a lot of attention and she was likely a very difficult child to parent. Children with her profile, as I understand it, can be a challenge. If Mom is sick and step dad is bringing home the bacon, and there is a previously trusted caregiver willing to watch them and keep them entertained rather than housebound with a sick mom and possibly a sleep deprived step dad-why not take advantage of it?

I doubt Mom forsaw this. Or grandmom. No one thought this man would chop up one of the children clearly. JMVHO.

Wild@Heart
12-28-2011, 04:12 PM
The older male child may also be her sisters, possibly TS's Godson. The youngest could be her sister's as well. Her sister was hospitalized for a few weeks. Maybe TS was caring for her three children during that time. AL was her first born, so I don't think the oldest boy could be hers. There is also a photo of her sister and her sister's children, I think the other 3 are the same ones pictured with her sis. Hope that makes sense!!

Donjeta
12-28-2011, 04:12 PM
Trying to stay caught up:

Is it confirmed that Pomodore is a convicted SO? Has it been confirmed somewhere that Aliahna did NOT have the diagnoses Mom related to the media and (presumably) LE?

Her medical records would be protected under the privacy laws so we're imo not likely to have any other confirmation apart from what the family says.

I for one would like to know if the people making the ADHD diagnosis (if she has one) were aware of the abuse she had gone through (if she had been a victim prior to being diagnosed).

One of the exclusion criteria for ADHD is

The symptoms do not happen only during the course of a Pervasive Developmental Disorder, Schizophrenia, or other Psychotic Disorder. The symptoms are not better accounted for by another mental disorder (e.g. Mood Disorder, Anxiety Disorder, Dissociative Disorder, or a Personality Disorder).
The PTSD or other psychological consequences from the abuse might manifest themselves as ADHD like symptoms.
http://www.ritalindeath.com/ADHD-Criteria.htm

lonetraveler
12-28-2011, 04:14 PM
How these three girls ended up in that trailer with MP is of great concern to me. I have never known anyone to have the flu so badly that they were unable to care for their children, and yet at the same time, this very ill person was not hospitalized.

I can certainy understand being ill and multiple children can be very tiring, on a good day. But in those instances where I have been so ill as to need someone's help, they watched my children for several hours so I could nap each day, or ran grocery errands for me, etc.

I am trying to imagine a circumstance where I am so ill with a flu as to be unable to care for my children, and yet not so ill as to need hospitalization, and further where the person I choose to have assist me by caring for my female children is a man I once expressed serious concerns about. :confused:

Further, I am trying to figure out if something I read on the now closed thread is true. Was there a male child or children who was not in the care of MP but rather still in the care of the very sick mom? Did I misread that info?

Because I can't imagine being so ill that my daughters are too much for me and are handed over to someone such as this, not for hours but DAYS and yet not so ill my son must be handed over as well?

Can someone make sense of this for me cause I am still just as confused as I was earlier.

Your question is also one of my major questions. I have also read that another female child as well as two male children were at home with the "ill" mom. I hope that someone can confirm this information. It just doesn't make sense to send the children away who were old enough to help out. There is also info stating the the mother was busy playing computer games while she was so sick..........

Another major question I have is: How did Grandmother Story and the murderer get to be BFF?

and Why haven't we seen or heard from the Stepfather?

believe09
12-28-2011, 04:16 PM
Mom's list was pretty specific and we dont know if Aliahna had any previous abuse whatsoever, right? I am not trying to persuade anyone, but I dont think we can completely throw out the possibility that this was an act of fear and frustration by the babysitter. IMO. I still think this is more like a confrontation that went to far, she left the house and he creamed her on the steps.

The rest is souless. Actually, all of it seems souless. :(

believe09
12-28-2011, 04:17 PM
Her medical records can be reviewed by LE-a simple subpoena, and I am sure they have already gathered them.

mikeysmommom
12-28-2011, 04:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nana46 View Post
I swore I would not follow this case yet here I am
I just do not get it at all anymore. What is it gonna take to keep these precious children from dying and or being abused>?????????????
IMHO,It will never stop unless Parents/Step-Parents /Boyfriends/Girlfriends etc. stop handing over their children to abusers esp.KNOWN CHILD Molesters!!!!!
I am not bashing mom just speaking the truth IMO.Last week on AMW 2 sisters were handed over to a pedophile first from their Aunt ,who watched them when mom was in jail,then from mom when she got out.Mom is on the run.

My heart and sympathy are with the victims always.............IMHO that little angel and her siblings are the true victims..........Mom was okay with leaving 3 young children alone for days with a KNOWN CHILD Molester! If you put a CHILD in a lions cage,and they get eaten you would go to JAIL!
__________________Brought over.

believe09
12-28-2011, 04:18 PM
The older male child may also be her sisters, possibly TS's Godson. The youngest could be her sister's as well. Her sister was hospitalized for a few weeks. Maybe TS was caring for her three children during that time. AL was her first born, so I don't think the oldest boy could be hers. There is also a photo of her sister and her sister's children, I think the other 3 are the same ones pictured with her sis. Hope that makes sense!!


So there were other children in the Souder's home? Not just the three girls?

believe09
12-28-2011, 04:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nana46 View Post
I swore I would not follow this case yet here I am
I just do not get it at all anymore. What is it gonna take to keep these precious children from dying and or being abused>?????????????
IMHO,It will never stop unless Parents/Step-Parents /Boyfriends/Girlfriends etc. stop handing over their children to abusers esp.KNOWN CHILD Molesters!!!!!
I am not bashing mom just speaking the truth IMO.Last week on AMW 2 sisters were handed over to a pedophile first from their Aunt ,who watched them when mom was in jail,then from mom when she got out.Mom is on the run.

My heart and sympathy are with the victims always.............IMHO that little angel and her siblings are the true victims..........Mom was okay with leaving 3 young children alone for days with a KNOWN CHILD Molester! If you put a CHILD in a lions cage,and they get eaten you would go to JAIL!


__________________Brought over.

So Pomodore is a confirmed convicted child molester? I know, I am starting to sound like a broken record.

lauriej
12-28-2011, 04:20 PM
:( I know. :( I think Dr. Fessel is right (I think that was the poster that mentioned this).
1) How long would it take to freeze her body if it was put in there whole?
2) We know that when a body (already deceased) is frozen there would be little mess (meaning blood)
3) How long did it take to dismember her and place her in different bags?
4) Drive to the two locations?

The above hurt to type as well :( but the WHOLE process from murder to disposal took time. She had to have been in the freezer for hours...possibly even a day.

IMO, he knew he would have time to do all of those things because IMO those children were NOT being checked on by the family. He knew that he would have to dispose of most of her by Christmas Eve because SURELY the family would begin looking for her then.

I guess what I am saying is...it is hard for me to believe that Aliahna was just in the freezer (whole) for a few short hours. This leads me to believe that she might have been in there for at least a day, possibly more. JMO.

BBM

--according to the affadavit for probable cause

http://www.journalgazette.net/assets/pdf/JG1026141227.PDF

--"early morning hours" Thursday Dec.22nd, he killed her, placed body in the freezer

--"late evening hours of Thursday Dec.22nd and into the early morning hours" of Friday Dec.23rd, he dismembered the body w/ a hacksaw

so, that would have given him about 24 hrs. of "freezing time".

not_my_kids
12-28-2011, 04:20 PM
Mom's list was pretty specific and we dont know if Aliahna had any previous abuse whatsoever, right? I am not trying to persuade anyone, but I dont think we can completely throw out the possibility that this was an act of fear and frustration by the babysitter. IMO. I still think this is more like a confrontation that went to far, she left the house and he creamed her on the steps.

The rest is souless. Actually, all of it seems souless. :(

Aliahna was abused by two perps when her family lived in IA. According to statements made by her stepfather, that was the cause of her PTSD. She felt bad about getting the perps in that case in trouble, so she didn't tell right away. There is no proof that she was previously abused by MP, but as far as prior abuse, it was documented and both perpetrators were caught.

Patty G
12-28-2011, 04:20 PM
Trying to stay caught up:

Is it confirmed that Pomodore is a convicted SO? Has it been confirmed somewhere that Aliahna did NOT have the diagnoses Mom related to the media and (presumably) LE?

No, it has NOT been confirmed that Pulmadore is a RSO. Look at my posts to see what I have done so far to try and get information.

The original article out yesterday by a radio station indicated MP was a registered sex offender according to the Sheriff.

I emailed that radio station last night asking them where they got that info, etc., etc. The writer of the article is suppose to get back to me to clarify exactly what happened.

Today they reworded the article - http://www.goblueridge.net/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=14218

The Sheriff said Plumadore was found in what was the “Domestic Violence and Sex Offender Registry Verification” by warrant and sex offender check.

IMO, it appears LE went to a RSO to do a registered verification, and either MP was living there with a RSO, or took over a RSO apartment, of which, LE then ran a check on MP and the Indiana warrant showed up.

Hopefully the radio station will get back to me sometime today.

Donjeta
12-28-2011, 04:21 PM
Or, we have at least one special needs child who on the surface, if her diagnoses as related in the media are accurate, needed a lot of attention and she was likely a very difficult child to parent. Children with her profile, as I understand it, can be a challenge. If Mom is sick and step dad is bringing home the bacon, and there is a previously trusted caregiver willing to watch them and keep them entertained rather than housebound with a sick mom and possibly a sleep deprived step dad-why not take advantage of it?

I doubt Mom forsaw this. Or grandmom. No one thought this man would chop up one of the children clearly. JMVHO.

I do believe nobody foresaw that she would be chopped up but IMO parents who have already had at least one of their children abused at least twice should be able to foresee that bad things might happen if they've left unsupervised with a male caregiver associating with several RSO's.

I can understand being naive the first time.

bam
12-28-2011, 04:21 PM
I'm wondering the same thing since Grandmother lived in Jacksonville, Florida according to her FB.

Your question is also one of my major questions. I have also read that another female child as well as two male children were at home with the "ill" mom. I hope that someone can confirm this information. It just doesn't make sense to send the children away who were old enough to help out. There is also info stating the the mother was busy playing computer games while she was so sick..........

Another major question I have is: How did Grandmother Story and the murderer get to be BFF?

and Why haven't we seen or heard from the Stepfather?

gitana1
12-28-2011, 04:21 PM
Anyone have a way to archive Iowa to see players and circumstances of abuse that Aliahna had experienced there? Could maybe this was the reason family moved away? So glad FBI is involved> I believe there is going to be alot of closets with skeletons if they research some computers>

I have been busy with work. Can someone update me? Is there some new info on what happened to Aliahna to cause her PTSD?

redfish
12-28-2011, 04:22 PM
So there were other children in the Souder's home? Not just the three girls?

I do not have a link handy, but I read somewhere that Souder had 6 kids. We know 3 were with POS. I have never seen anything in MSN about the other 3.

MsFacetious
12-28-2011, 04:22 PM
I cannot believe I am even discussing this... so we are just going to talk about "objects."
Our fridge/freezer recently broke... so I have been thinking about and looking at them a lot recently.

What kind of fridge/freezer did he have?

If the freezer was on the top/fridge on the bottom... he could not have fit something 4 feet tall and 41 pounds in it.

If the freezer/fridge were side by side... ice maker or not... you COULD fit something 4 feet tall and 41lbs inside.
After removing everything, including the shelves from it.

However, after emptying it, removing the shelves and putting the contents somewhere...
How would you keep that freezer door shut with that weight behind it?

If he had a deep freeze (highly unlikely in a mobile home) that would easily hold something 4 feet tall and 41lbs...
We've actually seen much larger objects put in those for long periods of time.

The only probable way he put something 4 feet tall in his freezer is if he had a side by side.
What kind of fridge/freezer he had would help us to know how big the item(s) were that he stored in his freezer. :twocents:


:( I know. :( I think Dr. Fessel is right (I think that was the poster that mentioned this).
1) How long would it take to freeze her body if it was put in there whole?
2) We know that when a body (already deceased) is frozen there would be little mess (meaning blood)
3) How long did it take to dismember her and place her in different bags?
4) Drive to the two locations?

The above hurt to type as well :( but the WHOLE process from murder to disposal took time. She had to have been in the freezer for hours...possibly even a day.

IMO, he knew he would have time to do all of those things because IMO those children were NOT being checked on by the family. He knew that he would have to dispose of most of her by Christmas Eve because SURELY the family would begin looking for her then.

I guess what I am saying is...it is hard for me to believe that Aliahna was just in the freezer (whole) for a few short hours. This leads me to believe that she might have been in there for at least a day, possibly more. JMO.

SuziQ
12-28-2011, 04:22 PM
And it wasn't like she was a single parent. Just because step dad worked nights, doesn't mean he couldn't handle the children. We aren't talking about newborn triplets FGS.

JMO

This is sickening.

And apparently this only applied to the girls.

gitana1
12-28-2011, 04:23 PM
I have a feeling that the reason Aliahna feared the cops and felt bad for turning the 2 guys in was b/c of the views the family has of the RSO grandfather. I wonder how much did she know about her grandfathers disgusting criminal past and how the family feels about it as well. She sees good in all people sounds like it was a forced belief no way could a family with a RSO in it not explain that some people are just bad.

I have already had to explain bad people to my daughter when she had just turned 4. When Somer Thompson went missing she hid behind the chair ( she was supposed to be sleeping in her room) and then I see her head pop up tears in her eyes ask "how can someone hurt that pretty little girl mommy" Those words with her voice replay in my head every single time I hear about a child going missing.

BBM. What's this about? Can someone clue me in?

believe09
12-28-2011, 04:23 PM
Thank you to everyone filling in the brush strokes for a moderator who is very, very slow today. :)

not_my_kids
12-28-2011, 04:23 PM
So Pomodore is a confirmed convicted child molester? I know, I am starting to sound like a broken record.

If you believe the sheriff that said he was required to register in NC a few back years, he is not only a confirmed and convicted child molester, but a repeat offender as well. It's still the same source as yesterday.

It's quite possible that he was at that point a registered RSO, and his registration period simply expired. MOO. If his registration did just expire, the only way to prove what he is would be to find the original court records, which I have been looking for, but it's kind of hard not knowing where the alleged molestation occurred.

bam
12-28-2011, 04:25 PM
Look at post #42 above you on this page.

I have been busy with work. Can someone update me? Is there some new info on what happened to Aliahna to cause her PTSD?

krimekat
12-28-2011, 04:25 PM
New Oklahoma Law Softens Penalties For Public Urination (http://www.newson6.com/story/15930844/new-oklahoma-law-softens-penalties-for-public-urination?clienttype=printable)

Hundreds of sex offenders could be coming off the statewide (OK) registry because of changes to sex offender laws. Before November 1, people caught urinating in public had to register as sex offenders, but a new law is softening the penalty.

FYI . . . regarding registering as a Sex Offender. I remember when MO modified their law (due to arrests at Mardi Gras there were so many WOMEN on the registry raising red flags) & it was a HUGE ordeal to ensure the right people were removed from the dB !

Donjeta
12-28-2011, 04:26 PM
I have been busy with work. Can someone update me? Is there some new info on what happened to Aliahna to cause her PTSD?

Aliahna’s stepgrandfather said at a candlelight vigil Monday that the girl suffered from post-traumatic stress disorder brought by abuse she suffered on two different occasions last year in Iowa. Story said the people who were responsible were caught by police, but he had no other details.

He said Aliahna felt bad about telling on the men because she didn’t want them to get in trouble.

http://www.journalgazette.net/article/20111228/LOCAL07/312289983/1002/LOCAL

lauriej
12-28-2011, 04:26 PM
I have been busy with work. Can someone update me? Is there some new info on what happened to Aliahna to cause her PTSD?


http://www.journalgazette.net/article/2 ... 1002/LOCAL (http://www.journalgazette.net/article/20111228/LOCAL07/312289983/1002/LOCAL)
‘Silent Night’ vigil echoes with anguish
--snipped--

Aliahna’s stepgrandfather said at a candlelight vigil Monday that the girl suffered from post-traumatic stress disorder brought by abuse she suffered on two different occasions last year in Iowa. Story said the people who were responsible were caught by police, but he had no other details.


He said Aliahna felt bad about telling on the men because she didn’t want them to get in trouble. Aliahna also had a history of sleepwalking and vision and hearing problems and had attention-deficit hyperactive disorder, her family said.

MsFacetious
12-28-2011, 04:26 PM
Aliahna’s stepgrandfather said at a candlelight vigil Monday that the girl suffered from post-traumatic stress disorder brought by abuse she suffered on two different occasions last year in Iowa.

Story said the people who were responsible were caught by police, but he had no other details.

He said Aliahna felt bad about telling on the men because she didn’t want them to get in trouble. Aliahna also had a history of sleepwalking and vision and hearing problems and had attention-deficit hyperactive disorder, her family said.

http://www.journalgazette.net/article/20111228/LOCAL07/312289983/1002/LOCAL


Mom's list was pretty specific and we dont know if Aliahna had any previous abuse whatsoever, right? I am not trying to persuade anyone, but I dont think we can completely throw out the possibility that this was an act of fear and frustration by the babysitter. IMO. I still think this is more like a confrontation that went to far, she left the house and he creamed her on the steps.

The rest is souless. Actually, all of it seems souless. :(


I have been busy with work. Can someone update me? Is there some new info on what happened to Aliahna to cause her PTSD?

Bittiness39
12-28-2011, 04:26 PM
UMMMM...do the police have this laundry??????

According to neighbors Greg Shumaker and Mike Tulley, Plumadore had worked for Aliahna's grandfather, Jimmy Lemmon, a registered sex offender, who had emphysema and also lived in the mobile home park. Plumadore took care of him and in return lived in his home.

Jimmy Lemmon died Dec. 3, and Plumadore continued to live in his home. The neighbors said Plumadore's only source of income was donating plasma, and they were beginning to wonder how he'd pay the rent. They said that after Jimmy Lemmon died, Plumadore seemed depressed but lately seemed to be recovering. Shumaker and Tulley agreed there was nothing in Plumadore's behavior to indicate he would do such a thing.

“He was a friendly guy,” Tulley said.

They said the only unusual change in Plumadore's behavior was an increase in laundry. Shumaker said they washed his laundry for him, but on Friday he showed up with an extra load. Otherwise, he seemed fine.
http://www.fortwayne.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20111228/NEWS09/320097837

Ummmm...aren't these two people also on the WatchList? UHHH...where is this laundry?

lonetraveler
12-28-2011, 04:27 PM
It was reported that he put her in the freezer for a period of hours before he dismembered. If she was frozen - that helps with the mess. As for spatter - she was already dead - not much spatter as heart isn't beating and then being frozen - well, you get the idea.

Lord, that hurt to type.

As for the dismemberment and disposal you are correct in that there would be no splatter but he stated that he killed her on the steps/ramp right outside of his doorway. Beating someone in the head multiple times with a brick should have produced quite a bit of blood splatter. I'm thinking that he had to have attempted to clean up the area or investigators would have noticed it right off the bat.

lauriej
12-28-2011, 04:29 PM
I cannot believe I am even discussing this... so we are just going to talk about "objects."
Our fridge/freezer recently broke... so I have been thinking about and looking at them a lot recently.

What kind of fridge/freezer did he have?

If the freezer was on the top/fridge on the bottom... he could not have fit something 4 feet tall and 41 pounds in it.

If the freezer/fridge were side by side... ice maker or not... you COULD fit something 4 feet tall and 41lbs inside.
After removing everything, including the shelves from it.

However, after emptying it, removing the shelves and putting the contents somewhere...
How would you keep that freezer door shut with that weight behind it?

If he had a deep freeze (highly unlikely in a mobile home) that would easily hold something 4 feet tall and 41lbs...
We've actually seen much larger objects put in those for long periods of time.

The only probable way he put something 4 feet tall in his freezer is if he had a side by side.
What kind of fridge/freezer he had would help us to know how big the item(s) were that he stored in his freezer. :twocents:

--my aunt lived in a trailer at one time, she had a small apt. sized freezer in the back area. ( maybe 5 ft. wide X 2 ft. X 4 ft. deep or so.)

Wise Old Owl
12-28-2011, 04:31 PM
I cannot believe I am even discussing this... so we are just going to talk about "objects."
Our fridge/freezer recently broke... so I have been thinking about and looking at them a lot recently.

What kind of fridge/freezer did he have?

If the freezer was on the top/fridge on the bottom... he could not have fit something 4 feet tall and 41 pounds in it.

If the freezer/fridge were side by side... ice maker or not... you COULD fit something 4 feet tall and 41lbs inside.
After removing everything, including the shelves from it.

However, after emptying it, removing the shelves and putting the contents somewhere...
How would you keep that freezer door shut with that weight behind it?

If he had a deep freeze (highly unlikely in a mobile home) that would easily hold something 4 feet tall and 41lbs...
We've actually seen much larger objects put in those for long periods of time.

The only probable way he put something 4 feet tall in his freezer is if he had a side by side.
What kind of fridge/freezer he had would help us to know how big the item(s) were that he stored in his freezer. :twocents:

I was thinking more of a "bottom drawer" fridge - the kind with the freezer on the bottom. They were popular was back in the day - I had one in the 80's and that "drawer was huge (easily could have held her). They are also now bringing them back - with the freezer on the bottom.

There could have also been a "stand alone freezer" - maybe in a laundry room or even on a back porch.

JMHO

TexasCharm
12-28-2011, 04:33 PM
I cannot believe I am even discussing this... so we are just going to talk about "objects."
Our fridge/freezer recently broke... so I have been thinking about and looking at them a lot recently.

What kind of fridge/freezer did he have?

If the freezer was on the top/fridge on the bottom... he could not have fit something 4 feet tall and 41 pounds in it.

If the freezer/fridge were side by side... ice maker or not... you COULD fit something 4 feet tall and 41lbs inside.
After removing everything, including the shelves from it.

However, after emptying it, removing the shelves and putting the contents somewhere...
How would you keep that freezer door shut with that weight behind it?

If he had a deep freeze (highly unlikely in a mobile home) that would easily hold something 4 feet tall and 41lbs...
We've actually seen much larger objects put in those for long periods of time.

The only probable way he put something 4 feet tall in his freezer is if he had a side by side.
What kind of fridge/freezer he had would help us to know how big the item(s) were that he stored in his freezer. :twocents:


I don't know .. my kids could curl up in a ball about the size of a dinner plate! Exaggerating, of course, but she looks tiny. If he put her in a pillow case all curled up, I think he could stuff her in there.

Think of a little tiny 40 lb girl curled up in a chair .. not very big.

krimekat
12-28-2011, 04:33 PM
Before we keep rolling along with the rumor of other children, I havent seen any media that indicates there were.

Anyone else?

Same here . . . nothing in MSM just what was "suggested" via FB & comment sections of MSM.

(I have not included it in time line thread as well as MP being an RSO in the time line thread)

Patty G
12-28-2011, 04:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nana46 View Post
I swore I would not follow this case yet here I am
I just do not get it at all anymore. What is it gonna take to keep these precious children from dying and or being abused>?????????????
IMHO,It will never stop unless Parents/Step-Parents /Boyfriends/Girlfriends etc. stop handing over their children to abusers esp.KNOWN CHILD Molesters!!!!!
I am not bashing mom just speaking the truth IMO.Last week on AMW 2 sisters were handed over to a pedophile first from their Aunt ,who watched them when mom was in jail,then from mom when she got out.Mom is on the run.

My heart and sympathy are with the victims always.............IMHO that little angel and her siblings are the true victims..........Mom was okay with leaving 3 young children alone for days with a KNOWN CHILD Molester! If you put a CHILD in a lions cage,and they get eaten you would go to JAIL!
__________________Brought over.


BBM

There is nothing out there that MP is "known" child molester.

The radio station that had the article out yesterday clearly stating MP was a registered sex offender has reworded the article.

http://www.goblueridge.net/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=14218

If you read my posts, you will see that I have been trying to get the radio station to be more specific with regards to how MP was located.

It maybe as simple as MP rented a room, of which, perhaps a RSO once lived, or was living with a RSO, and LE stopped by to do a check on RSO and there was MP. They may have ran a background check on MP and found Indiana's warrant as being a fugitive and sent him back to Indiana.

The radio station is suppose to get back to me with more information from the Sheriff on how MP was located, etc., etc.

mikeysmommom
12-28-2011, 04:34 PM
Her medical records would be protected under the privacy laws so we're imo not likely to have any other confirmation apart from what the family says.

I for one would like to know if the people making the ADHD diagnosis (if she has one) were aware of the abuse she had gone through (if she had been a victim prior to being diagnosed).

One of the exclusion criteria for ADHD is

The PTSD or other psychological consequences from the abuse might manifest themselves as ADHD like symptoms.
http://www.ritalindeath.com/ADHD-Criteria.htm

My Grandson and older sis told of abuse, mom and POS BF changed it around after I had police and dyfus involved.Both kids all of a sudden mom says kids are horrible liars gets them diagnosed ADHD and put on meds till we stepped in and fought them on it.Easy for abusers to get over by blaming the kids saying the kids are liars.When in fact the abuse and not allowing children contact with both dads and grandparents after telling us about abuse, psychological consequences from it was the REAL reason manifest themselves as ADHD like symptoms.

lonetraveler
12-28-2011, 04:34 PM
UMMMM...do the police have this laundry??????

According to neighbors Greg Shumaker and Mike Tulley, Plumadore had worked for Aliahna's grandfather, Jimmy Lemmon, a registered sex offender, who had emphysema and also lived in the mobile home park. Plumadore took care of him and in return lived in his home.

Jimmy Lemmon died Dec. 3, and Plumadore continued to live in his home. The neighbors said Plumadore's only source of income was donating plasma, and they were beginning to wonder how he'd pay the rent. They said that after Jimmy Lemmon died, Plumadore seemed depressed but lately seemed to be recovering. Shumaker and Tulley agreed there was nothing in Plumadore's behavior to indicate he would do such a thing.

“He was a friendly guy,” Tulley said.

They said the only unusual change in Plumadore's behavior was an increase in laundry. Shumaker said they washed his laundry for him, but on Friday he showed up with an extra load. Otherwise, he seemed fine.
http://www.fortwayne.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20111228/NEWS09/320097837

Ummmm...aren't these two people also on the WatchList? UHHH...where is this laundry?

Well that information surely catches your eye. Surely if they noticed any blood stains on those clothes they would have immediately reported it to the investigators, right?

Wild@Heart
12-28-2011, 04:35 PM
So there were other children in the Souder's home? Not just the three girls?

I can't confirm that they were in the home during the time the three girls were at the "friends" home!

Bittiness39
12-28-2011, 04:35 PM
BBM

--according to the affadavit for probable cause

http://www.journalgazette.net/assets/pdf/JG1026141227.PDF

--"early morning hours" Thursday Dec.22nd, he killed her, placed body in the freezer

--"late evening hours of Thursday Dec.22nd and into the early morning hours" of Friday Dec.23rd, he dismembered the body w/ a hacksaw

so, that would have given him about 24 hrs. of "freezing time".

That makes sense. :(
It also makes me wonder if any of the family went over there to eyeball these kids during that week. That is 24 + hours where your child is sleeping at the home of a "friend." You live probably within yards of this guy's trailer. It sounds like very sketchy parenting to me. I see ZERO excusable reason (with the facts that we have at this point...more information will come out) why you can't check on your children in person daily. You live two doors down essentially. I can think of zero reason why not. NONE.

SuziQ
12-28-2011, 04:36 PM
Or, we have at least one special needs child who on the surface, if her diagnoses as related in the media are accurate, needed a lot of attention and she was likely a very difficult child to parent. Children with her profile, as I understand it, can be a challenge. If Mom is sick and step dad is bringing home the bacon, and there is a previously trusted caregiver willing to watch them and keep them entertained rather than housebound with a sick mom and possibly a sleep deprived step dad-why not take advantage of it?

I doubt Mom forsaw this. Or grandmom. No one thought this man would chop up one of the children clearly. JMVHO.

Mom may not have known someone would chop up her child, but she has a history of at least one child being placed in an unsafe situation that resulted in sex abuse. Then what does she do? Based on the reccommendations of sex offenders, she moves to a sex offender infested mobile home park and proceeds to let her children spend alot of time with a sex offender grandfather and his felon roomate. It's not a leap to suspect mom of bad parenting to the criminal extent. She willingly exposed her kids to danger. IMO, mom is not in the position to plea ignorance, lack of knowledge, or hindsight in this case.

redfish
12-28-2011, 04:37 PM
Well that information surely catches your eye. Surely if they noticed any blood stains on those clothes they would have immediately reported it to the investigators, right?

Right.

Bravo
12-28-2011, 04:37 PM
The fear little Aliahna had for getting the prior men in "trouble" seems to indicate she knew these men. If she didn't it would seem they had enough access to her to ingrain that fear into her.

Ladylub
12-28-2011, 04:37 PM
BBM. What's this about? Can someone clue me in?

Someone posted this link in the previous thread.
http://www.journalgazette.net/articl...983/1002/LOCAL

The step grandfather said was was abused by 2 men on different occasions in Iowa

gitana1
12-28-2011, 04:37 PM
Mom's list was pretty specific and we dont know if Aliahna had any previous abuse whatsoever, right? I am not trying to persuade anyone, but I dont think we can completely throw out the possibility that this was an act of fear and frustration by the babysitter. IMO. I still think this is more like a confrontation that went to far, she left the house and he creamed her on the steps.

The rest is souless. Actually, all of it seems souless. :(

Then there should be tons of blood on the steps. I don't think there was, though. What 40 year old, single man wants to take care of three little girls for a week solid? A felon who is a fugitive? Who just happened to have a very cozy relationship with an RSO? Also, his statements about Aliahna crying for her mother in the middle of the night - well, it could be just a case of sudden rage, but I don't get that sense yet. Because such a guy would have likely snapped at some time prior, during the week. And it appears no one heard a thing? No yelling? No build up to the murder? My sense is that he killed her to silence her because he was abusing her and didn't want to get caught.


Aliahna was abused by two perps when her family lived in IA. According to statements made by her stepfather, that was the cause of her PTSD. She felt bad about getting the perps in that case in trouble, so she didn't tell right away. There is no proof that she was previously abused by MP, but as far as prior abuse, it was documented and both perpetrators were caught.

Wow. This is horrible. This baby was molested not once, but TWICE? And then her family decides it's a good idea to move to a pedo park, next door to pedo grampa? And then she's given to a fugitive for a week? No wonder this child is dead. Her history makes the decisions of her family all the more appalling.

Donjeta
12-28-2011, 04:39 PM
UMMMM...do the police have this laundry??????

According to neighbors Greg Shumaker and Mike Tulley, Plumadore had worked for Aliahna's grandfather, Jimmy Lemmon, a registered sex offender, who had emphysema and also lived in the mobile home park. Plumadore took care of him and in return lived in his home.

Jimmy Lemmon died Dec. 3, and Plumadore continued to live in his home. The neighbors said Plumadore's only source of income was donating plasma, and they were beginning to wonder how he'd pay the rent. They said that after Jimmy Lemmon died, Plumadore seemed depressed but lately seemed to be recovering. Shumaker and Tulley agreed there was nothing in Plumadore's behavior to indicate he would do such a thing.

“He was a friendly guy,” Tulley said.

They said the only unusual change in Plumadore's behavior was an increase in laundry. Shumaker said they washed his laundry for him, but on Friday he showed up with an extra load. Otherwise, he seemed fine.
http://www.fortwayne.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20111228/NEWS09/320097837

Ummmm...aren't these two people also on the WatchList? UHHH...where is this laundry?


Well isn't that cosy, two RSOs washing a murderer's bloody rags for him.

I do hope these people have been thoroughly questioned because they seem to be such good friends.

Did MP leave the other girls alone in the trailer when he visited the RSOs to do his laundry or were they with him?

gitana1
12-28-2011, 04:40 PM
UMMMM...do the police have this laundry??????

According to neighbors Greg Shumaker and Mike Tulley, Plumadore had worked for Aliahna's grandfather, Jimmy Lemmon, a registered sex offender, who had emphysema and also lived in the mobile home park. Plumadore took care of him and in return lived in his home.

Jimmy Lemmon died Dec. 3, and Plumadore continued to live in his home. The neighbors said Plumadore's only source of income was donating plasma, and they were beginning to wonder how he'd pay the rent. They said that after Jimmy Lemmon died, Plumadore seemed depressed but lately seemed to be recovering. Shumaker and Tulley agreed there was nothing in Plumadore's behavior to indicate he would do such a thing.

“He was a friendly guy,” Tulley said.

They said the only unusual change in Plumadore's behavior was an increase in laundry. Shumaker said they washed his laundry for him, but on Friday he showed up with an extra load. Otherwise, he seemed fine.
http://www.fortwayne.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20111228/NEWS09/320097837

Ummmm...aren't these two people also on the WatchList? UHHH...where is this laundry?

Maybe he had extra laundry because he had three kids at his house.

tlcya
12-28-2011, 04:40 PM
as far as I know, MP was no RSO. Rather he was a parole violator who had been on the lamb for a warrant in FL having to do with assaulting an LEO. MP was introduced to Grandpa Lemmon (an RSO of child molesting variety) by neighbor/friend/previous prisonmate.

MP came to live with Grandpa Lemmom when his emphysima(sp?) got bad, to "help out".

It has been reported in MSM (statement from Step Grandpa Stone) that Aliahna was abused by two males in Iowa, who were subsequently jailed

krimekat
12-28-2011, 04:43 PM
So Pomodore is a confirmed convicted child molester? I know, I am starting to sound like a broken record.

Sorry for replication but

OMG - I think I just responded to another post regarding this (is it flying that fast). Plumadore was not an RSO, at least not in IN . . . Patty G was awaiting confirmation from "MSM" source that published the article reflecting Plumadore/perp was an RSO IIRC in NC 2007; however, I haven't seen confirmation except the ONE article (in Thread #2) which was an AM radio station in NC (I think the AP picked up on it last night but have only seen one article).

waiting for Patty G! I know she's doing the work (she is so awesome) :blowkiss:

lauriej
12-28-2011, 04:45 PM
That makes sense. :(
It also makes me wonder if any of the family went over there to eyeball these kids during that week. That is 24 + hours where your child is sleeping at the home of a "friend." You live probably within yards of this guy's trailer. It sounds like very sketchy parenting to me. I see ZERO excusable reason (with the facts that we have at this point...more information will come out) why you can't check on your children in person daily. You live two doors down essentially. I can think of zero reason why not. NONE.


--exactly.

--mom last saw them after school on tuesday, did she pack them each a bag to take over to "uncle mike's" ? ( or was she too ill with the flu to do even that? )

--these girls would have needed fresh clothes, pj's etc.

--and now knowing that mike only gets $$'s from donating plasma----what about food? wasn't she concerned about what they were being fed over there?

believe09
12-28-2011, 04:45 PM
This story get's worse and worse. I am having a hard time with temporary paralysis of mom. Maybe her ailment was more complicated and private. It is likely that LE has her medical records as well.

Bravo
12-28-2011, 04:46 PM
The extra laundry may have been to "rid" of whatever took place that whole week. This Park is sounding more and more like a Park of Horrors.

octobermoon
12-28-2011, 04:47 PM
Aliahna Lemmon's step-grandfather, David Story, said Wednesday that the Allen County Sheriff's Department and the FBI told family members not to talk to anyone about her death. He says they didn't give a reason.

Sheriff's Cpl. Jeremy Tinkel confirmed deputies asked the family not to talk to the media, saying it would protect the integrity of the case.

Link
http://www.courierpress.com/news/2011/dec/28/slain-indiana-girls-family-quiet-after-details-eme/

BetteDavisEyes
12-28-2011, 04:47 PM
Many thanks to those who are posting/discussing the grim and gruesome details of this sad case. I've tried to keep up, but the circumstances of little Aliahna's demise are beyond belief, and I'm having a difficult time reading about the tragic life that this vulnerable youngster endured. This lovely little girl is in a better place where she is safe from those who would seek to harm her. Be happy, dear Ali, as you dance and sing with the angels. jmo

SuziQ
12-28-2011, 04:49 PM
FWIW, If someone is not an RSO it does not mean they are not an SO. Most SO's never get caught and even if they are, it does not mean they are required to be registered as one.

IMO, MP will prove to be an SO. I'd bet my money on it.

mikeysmommom
12-28-2011, 04:49 PM
BBM

There is nothing out there that MP is "known" child molester.

The radio station that had the article out yesterday clearly stating MP was a registered sex offender has reworded the article.

http://www.goblueridge.net/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=14218

If you read my posts, you will see that I have been trying to get the radio station to be more specific with regards to how MP was located.

It maybe as simple as MP rented a room, of which, perhaps a RSO once lived, or was living with a RSO, and LE stopped by to do a check on RSO and there was MP. They may have ran a background check on MP and found Indiana's warrant as being a fugitive and sent him back to Indiana.

The radio station is suppose to get back to me with more information from the Sheriff on how MP was located, etc., etc.

The mom was worried about MP ,and even if he isn't grandfather was and quite a lot of other ones lived there.IMHO It qualifies as a LIONS DEN.

not_my_kids
12-28-2011, 04:51 PM
With all due respect, MP was together enough to kill, dismember, and freeze a nine year old girl. he was together enough to conduct interviews with the media only feet from where her frozen parts were sitting in a freezer. He was together enough to make sure he was caught on camera doing something besides killing said child.

I think he would have been together enough to destroy the clothing he wore while killing and dismembering her, instead of just thinking that washing it was enough, or he would have hidden it somewhere...I can't get a handle on this guy, but I think the extra laundry was likely just from having three little girls at the house, and there might still have been things of the grandfather's that needed to be washed.

krimekat
12-28-2011, 04:54 PM
as far as I know, MP was no RSO. Rather he was a parole violator who had been on the lamb for a warrant in FL having to do with assaulting an LEO. MP was introduced to Grandpa Lemmon (an RSO of child molesting variety) by neighbor/friend/previous prisonmate.

MP came to live with Grandpa Lemmom when his emphysima(sp?) got bad, to "help out".

It has been reported in MSM (statement from Step Grandpa Stone) that Aliahna was abused by two males in Iowa, who were subsequently jailed

woot woot & at the time in NC he was "on the lamb" (sic) for a warrant in" IN (but he did not assault LE, it was a municipal bus driver, but regardless)
and MP arrived in Ft Wayne to help in Aug 2011 (had been there on & off for ~ 4 yrs; what brought him to Ft Wayne in the 1st place? that trailer park?)
and MP was in Iowa (as per court records) the same time Tarah lived there (per City council records)

but in my humble opinion

http://tuduytichcuc.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/birdofafeather.jpg?w=280&h=280

We are so awesome (today :floorlaugh:) thank you, MODs

Patty G
12-28-2011, 04:55 PM
The mom was worried about MP ,and even if he isn't grandfather was and quite a lot of other ones lived there.IMHO It qualifies as a LIONS DEN.

I am 100% with you with regards to the mother knowing her own father was a RSO. I can't say anymore otherwise it will be known as "bashing the mother."

Kat
12-28-2011, 04:55 PM
My two cents. And IMHO and only JMHO.

About Mom's illness of reported flu and then the temp paralysis. I'm not bashing her, her appearance has nothing to do with any of this with the exception of what I am going to share below.

If IIRC she is 28 years old. When I saw a picture of her I was very surprised she was only that age. I'm not saying that because I'm harping on her, not at all---she looks and I say this without being judgemental just stating what I think---my age. I'm 50. She looks like a young woman with an illness of some sort. I wouldn't be surprised at all if she doesn't have some kind of illness. Speculation and JMHO.

ETA: by illness I'm not thinking a transient one like the flu, I'm thinking something long term.

Bravo
12-28-2011, 04:56 PM
With all due respect, MP was together enough to kill, dismember, and freeze a nine year old girl. he was together enough to conduct interviews with the media only feet from where her frozen parts were sitting in a freezer. He was together enough to make sure he was caught on camera doing something besides killing said child.

I think he would have been together enough to destroy the clothing he wore while killing and dismembering her, instead of just thinking that washing it was enough, or he would have hidden it somewhere...I can't get a handle on this guy, but I think the extra laundry was likely just from having three little girls at the house, and there might still have been things of the grandfather's that needed to be washed.

I agree. I cant help but wonder tho if the laundry was also to rid of what took place that whole week leading up to the murder. And i dont mean blood fluids.

Bittiness39
12-28-2011, 04:57 PM
--exactly.

--mom last saw them after school on tuesday, did she pack them each a bag to take over to "uncle mike's" ? ( or was she too ill with the flu to do even that? )

--these girls would have needed fresh clothes, pj's etc.

--and now knowing that mike only gets $$'s from donating plasma----what about food? wasn't she concerned about what they were being fed over there?

ITA! I do NOT buy that some "tragic and complicated" medical circumstance kept the mother of those children from laying eyes on them at least ONCE during the day or at night. She lived only a few yards (YARDS people....yards...not miles) away. There is no excuse.

A few yards away. :( No excuse. None. She had a phone. She was on FB all of the time. But when what should be the most important people in her life are staying with a "family friend" who "hangs" out a lot with child molesters...she can't walk or roll over there to check on her kids????????? I don't understand that at all. Step dad could have helped her during the day if she needed assistance. IT MAKES NO SENSE.

:furious:

mikeysmommom
12-28-2011, 04:57 PM
Many thanks to those who are posting/discussing the grim and gruesome details of this sad case. I've tried to keep up, but the circumstances of little Aliahna's demise are beyond belief, and I'm having a difficult time reading about the tragic life that this vulnerable youngster endured. This lovely little girl is in a better place where she is safe from those who would seek to harm her. Be happy, dear Ali, as you dance and sing with the angels. jmo

How sad is it that death is so much better for a child then being able to live a full life.:banghead::furious:

peeples
12-28-2011, 04:57 PM
FWIW, my friend lives in a single wide trailer and has a chest freezer next to the back door big enough that you could get a child in, if folded in half......
I'm thinking maybe the same was true with monster's trailer...

Patty G
12-28-2011, 04:58 PM
as far as I know, MP was no RSO. Rather he was a parole violator who had been on the lamb for a warrant in FL having to do with assaulting an LEO. MP was introduced to Grandpa Lemmon (an RSO of child molesting variety) by neighbor/friend/previous prisonmate.

MP came to live with Grandpa Lemmom when his emphysima(sp?) got bad, to "help out".

It has been reported in MSM (statement from Step Grandpa Stone) that Aliahna was abused by two males in Iowa, who were subsequently jailed

Actually MP was a fugitive from Indiana, because it was the Indiana warrant that caused NC LE to arrest him and eventually send him back to Indiana.

The issue at hand though is that there was a warrant from Florida and Indiana nor North Carolina picked up on the Florida warrant. :crazy:

Donjeta
12-28-2011, 04:58 PM
Well, Aliahna wouldn't need her pillow and blanket anymore so might as well wash them...
I get chills trying to get into the mindset of a guy who would kill, freeze and dismember a child and proceed to spend his day doing normal everyday laundry.

I don't know... I expect people to be somehow off kilter if they've dismembered someone but often they just go on like nothing happened.

Mindboggling.

SuziQ
12-28-2011, 04:59 PM
I agree. I cant help but wonder tho if the laundry was also to rid of what took place that whole week leading up to the murder. And i dont mean blood fluids.

I know this is where my mind went.

vlpate
12-28-2011, 04:59 PM
I've definitely learned some things along the way reading here at Websleuths.
I had no idea that some convicted sex offender's only had to register for a certain time limit. Why?? I foolishly believed that once someone was convicted for the crime they stayed on the register for their lifetime, which I believe is how it should be.
I'm even more scared for all the children as there's no way to know! :(

I've never heard of having to register for only 10 years. I found this:

http://criminaljustice.state.ny.us/nsor/risk_levels.htm

"The duration of registration for a registered sex offender was extended by Chapter 1 of the Laws of 2006.
This law was effective on January 18, 2006. Currently, a Level 1 offender who has not been designated a sexual predator, a sexually violent offender or a predicate sex offender must register for 20 years. A Level 1 offender who has been so designated, as well as all Level 2 and Level 3 offenders regardless of whether they have been so designated, must register for life.

Level 1 (low risk of repeat offense), or
Level 2 (moderate risk of repeat offense), or
Level 3 (high risk of repeat offense and a threat to public safety exists)."

tlcya
12-28-2011, 04:59 PM
'My little princess': Chilling Facebook photos of missing nine-year-old girl... posted by 'killer who beat her with a brick and cut up her body with hand saw'Michael Plumador, 39, was watching Aliahna Lemmon and her sisters on Friday when she disappeared
'Killer' befriended family through grandfather - also a sex offender

Has a criminal record in Florida and North Carolina that includes convictions for trespassing and assault
Rundown mobile home park in Fort Wayne a known haven for sex offenders

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2078733/Aliahna-Lemmon-9-dead-vanishing-trailer-park-known-sex-offenders.html#ixzz1hrhVeB3j

BBM things like this are not helping at ending the confusion about MP being a bad dude in general or an RSO in particular.

I think he is not an RSO for what its worth. I tend to think it is bad reporting.

Wild@Heart
12-28-2011, 05:00 PM
This is TS's FB status from October 20 at 8:11am via mobile, made me wonder if 6 kids live in the home...
Re-worded from original post!
well some darn bug hit our entire house, on way to drs with 5 out of 6 kids and zach sr. I hope we get this kicked in the ass, im already on antibiotics. :(

SuziQ
12-28-2011, 05:03 PM
I've never heard of having to register for only 10 years. I found this:

http://criminaljustice.state.ny.us/nsor/risk_levels.htm

"The duration of registration for a registered sex offender was extended by Chapter 1 of the Laws of 2006.
This law was effective on January 18, 2006. Currently, a Level 1 offender who has not been designated a sexual predator, a sexually violent offender or a predicate sex offender must register for 20 years. A Level 1 offender who has been so designated, as well as all Level 2 and Level 3 offenders regardless of whether they have been so designated, must register for life.

Level 1 (low risk of repeat offense), or
Level 2 (moderate risk of repeat offense), or
Level 3 (high risk of repeat offense and a threat to public safety exists)."

What's scary is you have level 1 offenders who are really level 3 because of a plea deal. And as others pointed out some are allowed to plea guilty in exchange for not having to register at all.

tehcloser
12-28-2011, 05:04 PM
This is TS's FB status from October 20 at 8:11am via mobile, made me wonder if 6 kids live in the home...
Re-worded from original post!
well some darn bug hit our entire house, on way to drs with 5 out of 6 kids and zach sr. I hope we get this kicked in the ass, im already on antibiotics. :(

And she has the flu and can't walk for some reason now........lot of sickness there huh?

SyraKelly
12-28-2011, 05:05 PM
I cannot believe I am even discussing this... so we are just going to talk about "objects."
Our fridge/freezer recently broke... so I have been thinking about and looking at them a lot recently.

What kind of fridge/freezer did he have?

If the freezer was on the top/fridge on the bottom... he could not have fit something 4 feet tall and 41 pounds in it.

If the freezer/fridge were side by side... ice maker or not... you COULD fit something 4 feet tall and 41lbs inside.
After removing everything, including the shelves from it.

However, after emptying it, removing the shelves and putting the contents somewhere...
How would you keep that freezer door shut with that weight behind it?

If he had a deep freeze (highly unlikely in a mobile home) that would easily hold something 4 feet tall and 41lbs...
We've actually seen much larger objects put in those for long periods of time.

The only probable way he put something 4 feet tall in his freezer is if he had a side by side.
What kind of fridge/freezer he had would help us to know how big the item(s) were that he stored in his freezer. :twocents:

I live in a mobile home right now and we have a deep freezer that would fit a child,its not giant,but its pretty big and we have a lot of room still in our kitchen.just thought I share that.

Wise Old Owl
12-28-2011, 05:05 PM
One thing we haven't heard about is drugs. I'm not trying to start any rumors - its just with acts this heinous and the reputation of the mobile home park - well, its a question that begs to be asked.

I was shocked the other day to read about Elisa Baker's drug charges and how they found like 50,000+ pills. Someone doing that many pills tends to be "out of their mind" and that allows for such horrors to be acted upon.

I'm just wondering here........................ that's all.

No rumors, just speculation.............


JMHO

BetteDavisEyes
12-28-2011, 05:05 PM
My two cents. And IMHO and only JMHO.

About Mom's illness of reported flu and then the temp paralysis. I'm not bashing her, her appearance has nothing to do with any of this with the exception of what I am going to share below.

If IIRC she is 28 years old. When I saw a picture of her I was very surprised she was only that age. I'm not saying that because I'm harping on her, not at all---she looks and I say this without being judgemental just stating what I think---my age. I'm 50. She looks like a young woman with an illness of some sort. I wouldn't be surprised at all if she doesn't have some kind of illness. Speculation and JMHO.

ETA: by illness I'm not thinking a transient one like the flu, I'm thinking something long term.

When I first saw a photo of TS, I thought that she was one of the Grandmothers. This 28-year-old is definitely not a well woman. TS seems to have no (or very few) teeth that can be a sign of chronic illness, among other reasons that may come up later in the case. jmo

peeples
12-28-2011, 05:06 PM
nancy grace web exclusive on Ana

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fu_NRJ9Gg78&feature=youtu.be

mikeysmommom
12-28-2011, 05:07 PM
Then there should be tons of blood on the steps. I don't think there was, though. What 40 year old, single man wants to take care of three little girls for a week solid? A felon who is a fugitive? Who just happened to have a very cozy relationship with an RSO? Also, his statements about Aliahna crying for her mother in the middle of the night - well, it could be just a case of sudden rage, but I don't get that sense yet. Because such a guy would have likely snapped at some time prior, during the week. And it appears no one heard a thing? No yelling? No build up to the murder? My sense is that he killed her to silence her because he was abusing her and didn't want to get caught.



Wow. This is horrible. This baby was molested not once, but TWICE? And then her family decides it's a good idea to move to a pedo park, next door to pedo grampa? And then she's given to a fugitive for a week? No wonder this child is dead. Her history makes the decisions of her family all the more appalling.

I agree 100% decisions of her family all the more appalling !Hopefully her death will save her 2 sisters from any more appalling decisions.

mikeysmommom
12-28-2011, 05:08 PM
When I first saw a photo of TS, I thought that she was one of the Grandmothers. This 28-year-old is definitely not a well woman. TS seems to have no (or very few) teeth that can be a sign of chronic illness, among other reasons that may come up later in the case. jmo

Drugs can also be a reason.

krimekat
12-28-2011, 05:08 PM
I've never heard of having to register for only 10 years. I found this:

http://criminaljustice.state.ny.us/nsor/risk_levels.htm

"The duration of registration for a registered sex offender was extended by Chapter 1 of the Laws of 2006.
This law was effective on January 18, 2006. Currently, a Level 1 offender who has not been designated a sexual predator, a sexually violent offender or a predicate sex offender must register for 20 years. A Level 1 offender who has been so designated, as well as all Level 2 and Level 3 offenders regardless of whether they have been so designated, must register for life.

Level 1 (low risk of repeat offense), or
Level 2 (moderate risk of repeat offense), or
Level 3 (high risk of repeat offense and a threat to public safety exists)."

Each State has it's own definitions & penalties for those convicted of sex crimes . . . until we as a Country -- and for that matter, the World -- do something about it, they will always fall through the cracks more often than not!

Nat'l Registry is a good start but there is so much more that COULD be done (if there was $$$ in it, I'd help).

IMHO only

madge
12-28-2011, 05:09 PM
I'm late to this thread again. I can't seem to find any of the Facebook pages for any of them. Any links around?

melissasmom
12-28-2011, 05:09 PM
Good afternoon, WS friends. I have been at work all day, I am trying to skim through the threads, but SO much posted since I was on last night. If anyone would be so kind, is there any new information? I was thinking about poor Aliahna all day at work, and I just think there is a whole background story we don't know about yet. I'm assuming that there has been no confirmation on the MP is a RSO that we heard from the radio station last night? TIA :)

gitana1
12-28-2011, 05:09 PM
FWIW, If someone is not an RSO it does not mean they are not an SO. Most SO's never get caught and even if they are, it does not mean they are required to be registered as one.

IMO, MP will prove to be an SO. I'd bet my money on it.

Me too. Come on. He was bosom buddies with an RSO. He was friendly with the lot of them in that park, it seems. Aliahna was a vulnerable, disabled child who had already been molested TWICE before. That's the kind of child who is vulnerable to even more abuse. And he murdered Aliahna. She's dead. After spending a week with him. Right before she was due to go back home.

It's not rocket science, IMO.

Donjeta
12-28-2011, 05:09 PM
'My little princess': Chilling Facebook photos of missing nine-year-old girl... posted by 'killer who beat her with a brick and cut up her body with hand saw'Michael Plumador, 39, was watching Aliahna Lemmon and her sisters on Friday when she disappeared
'Killer' befriended family through grandfather - also a sex offender

Has a criminal record in Florida and North Carolina that includes convictions for trespassing and assault
Rundown mobile home park in Fort Wayne a known haven for sex offenders

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2078733/Aliahna-Lemmon-9-dead-vanishing-trailer-park-known-sex-offenders.html#ixzz1hrhVeB3j

BBM things like this are not helping at ending the confusion about MP being a bad dude in general or an RSO in particular.

I think he is not an RSO for what its worth. I tend to think it is bad reporting.



Lemmon and Pulmadore pair knew each because they were both sex offenders and were in jail together.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2078733/Aliahna-Lemmon-9-dead-vanishing-trailer-park-known-sex-offenders.html#ixzz1hrjSVhao


Daily Mail reporters misunderstood the article with Greg Shumaker saying he and Aliahna's grandpa knew each other from being in jail together.

Bittiness39
12-28-2011, 05:11 PM
JMO but I think the generational dysfunction and failure within the family was like a funnel leading poor Aliahna straight to Michael P. I am only going by what has been reported. Again, we don't have all of the facts and we still may never. The FBI is involved...so...I hurt so much for these children. They need protection and help. Prayers and love.

krimekat
12-28-2011, 05:12 PM
This is TS's FB status from October 20 at 8:11am via mobile, made me wonder if 6 kids live in the home...
Re-worded from original post!
well some darn bug hit our entire house, on way to drs with 5 out of 6 kids and zach sr. I hope we get this kicked in the ass, im already on antibiotics. :(

that is one mean flu bug . . . antibiotics > 60 days ago & still sick? May be something else . . . but not to go off topic & please -- let's not go there

Sorry, just that is a LONG time to have any bug especially taking antibiotics.

Patty G
12-28-2011, 05:13 PM
nancy grace web exclusive on Ana

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fu_NRJ9Gg78&feature=youtu.be

This is a short clip from the full show from last night.

BetteDavisEyes
12-28-2011, 05:15 PM
Drugs can also be a reason.

I refrained from posting anything that even remotely suggested this, but, yes, that is what I meant by "reasons that might come up later". Heavy smoking can also cause gum disease and tooth loss. I've never smoked and have all of my own teeth. Both of my (younger) sisters have smoked like chimneys since junior high and have bridges/partials and periodontal disease. My teeth aren't perfect, but they're mine :D

Bittiness39
12-28-2011, 05:16 PM
I am only speculating on the illness/temporary paralysis...only speculating...my brother is a pathology assistant and he thinks that her symptoms sound like...

Lyme Disease

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0002296/

I know nothing. I have no facts. This is just what my brother mentioned to me. It is only speculation but it sounds very close to some of her symptoms.

madge
12-28-2011, 05:16 PM
<modsnip>.

Obvious she wasn't interested in taking care of her kids because the articles I've read states that the kids were with the murderer a LOT of the time.

Seems mom was too busy with Facebook and gaming to worry about the kids.

What a life for these children.

tehcloser
12-28-2011, 05:16 PM
I wish I knew how to start a fund to help this DM get herself and her children (do we know if they are both boys or if she has a boy and a girl?) out of that trailer park NOW. I know there was an MSM article somewhere that quoted her as saying she was moving out of there as soon as she can get her tax return.......

We all say that these 'moms' SHOUDL'VE done things ---- and in her case it appears that she wants to get her children out of that environment but just doesn't have the money to do it expeditiously.

I wonder how much money she would need?

I believe it was a neighbor that said she was moving, not the mom.


ETA, yep from your link:

"As she watched national news reports about Aliahna’s death late Tuesday, M******* decided she’ll move her family out after she gets money from her tax return."

2door73chevy
12-28-2011, 05:17 PM
ITA! I do NOT buy that some "tragic and complicated" medical circumstance kept the mother of those children from laying eyes on them at least ONCE during the day or at night. She lived only a few yards (YARDS people....yards...not miles) away. There is no excuse.

A few yards away. :( No excuse. None. She had a phone. She was on FB all of the time. But when what should be the most important people in her life are staying with a "family friend" who "hangs" out a lot with child molesters...she can't walk or roll over there to check on her kids????????? I don't understand that at all. Step dad could have helped her during the day if she needed assistance. IT MAKES NO SENSE.

:furious:

I can't get past this either and if she was "sick", why not send the current step-dad over? I hope the FBI are REALLY watching ALL these folks.:furious:

krimekat
12-28-2011, 05:18 PM
So not being snarky here but may I suggest for those in need of a refresher or add'l info (since this thread is rolling)

go to the MEDIA LINKS thread, please . . . I want to help answer ?s, but mostly I want to get info out in the MEDIA LINKS thread so we don't have 40 pages in 3 hrs (full of rumors/misinformation).

and feel free to add to (not duplicate or discuss) MEDIA LINKS thread -- we are so resourceful!

Respectfully :blowkiss:

hoppy
12-28-2011, 05:18 PM
I believe it was a neighbor that said she was moving, not the mom.

The NEIGHBOR is moving or that BM told the neighbor she was moving?

(just want to make sure I understand :) )

Bravo
12-28-2011, 05:20 PM
that is one mean flu bug . . . antibiotics > 60 days ago & still sick? May be something else . . . but not to go off topic & please -- let's not go there

Sorry, just that is a LONG time to have any bug especially taking antibiotics.

Yes especially when antiobiotics dont cure a virus. Then again she may have had some infection as a result of the flu but 60 days? Never heard of such a massive dose. Ever. Doubt they were even working anymore by Day 30 :maddening: Mom maybe spent more time gaming than researching WebMD :banghead:

Cubby
12-28-2011, 05:20 PM
I think that mom is oblivious to reality. This happens all the time to children raised in a dysfunctional enviroment. I think TS is a victim of her own reality, meaning she never learned how to be a reliable parent. We all have issues with exposure to dysfunction, but some people can never get away from the dysfunction long enough to see that the dysfunction is dysfunction.

Dysfunction - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dysfunction)

Parents that expose their children to environments that are less then positive, love their children. It's not a matter of not loving enough, they simply have bad judgement. It brings me to Maslow's hierarchy of needs.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maslow's_hierarchy_of_needs

When you add other factors like drugs & Alcohol, sexual abuse, and abandonment, it magnifies the inability to meet basic needs. It's all about survival!

My opinion isn't that TS doesn't love her children, she simply didn't know how to mother. She practices what she learned, as we all do. If she would have had "good" people around her they could have taught her right from wrong, she could have been helped. Unfortunately every person around her are mentally sick...She never got out of the cycle.

I would bet my moral compass, she was abused in many ways as a child, at the hand of the people that "love" her the most. It is evident that her relationship with her father was obsessive. She loved him, perhaps in the wrong ways! I say this because she was willing to put her own children in a harmful environment to be with her father. The feeling of love is powerful and we all crave it, even if it is unhealthy. Most of us can recognize unhealthy love, people like TS can't.

She has tried to "survive" her entire life. At times, she probably didn't even have her basic needs met. She has searched her entire life for love and approval. Unfortunately she was in a dump looking for a treasure!

Of coarse this is simply my opinion!!:twocents:


Not caught up, but I have to reply to this post. Respectfully, I have officially fallen off the fence of having any sympathy for this :cursing: .

There are PLENTY of people who suffer horrible abuses, many of whom have shared their experience here at WS, and become adults capable of escaping that cycle and ensuring their children escape that cycle.

Initially I thought Tarah and her family were victims of being groomed by this :cursing: MP. Which, I still believe they were.

However after learning Aliahna was the victim of abuse in Iowa which led to her PTSD, and the incubator didn't have a wake up call becoming super vigilant about protecting her children - that's all I needed to hear. Fool mom once, shame on the perp, fool the :cursing: twice, shame on the :cursing:.

http://www.journalgazette.net/article/20111228/LOCAL07/312289983/1002/LOCAL

Not only was Aliahna subject to ex con's, pedo's and convicted felons/absconders who were state hopping to avoid penalties, her incubator was hopping states to deliver her children to these dangerous abusive situations.

Aliahna and her siblings NEVER HAD A CHANCE. Every single family member they came in contact failed them and failed them miserably. And as others have posted, as horrific as the information we've learnt, I too think this is only the tip of the iceberg.

'Nuff said. If I add more, I'll be in a time out.

Back to reading and catching up on the thread.

lauriej
12-28-2011, 05:21 PM
--also, where were the girls supposed to sleep at "uncle mike's" ??

--grandma AmberS says it was the FLOOR.

--and this was a better idea than having them home in their own beds, shipped off to the neighbour , to sleep on the floor?


http://www.hlntv.com/video/2011/12/26/girl-vanishes-christmas-eve
--video w/ grandmaS and nancy grace--

--grandma: "when mike came back from getting the cigar-------the 2 younger girls were sleeping on the floor, ali was sleeping in her grandfather's chair w/ a blanket /and a body pillow---and mike lay down on the couch b/c he'd been up w/ her all night b/c she has "night fears"...and he was comforting her all night, so he was tired"....
"he lay on the couch, the 2 younger ones were watching TV, ali was sleeping in the chair".

tehcloser
12-28-2011, 05:21 PM
The NEIGHBOR is moving or that BM told the neighbor she was moving?

(just want to make sure I understand :) )


The NEIGHBOR is moving.

Chris_Texas
12-28-2011, 05:21 PM
Here are some of the things my mind keeps coming back to.

When mom gave her little girls to her pedophile-father’s best friend, she did so knowing that they would be sleeping on the floor (or in his stained chair) rather than in their own beds at home. She knew that she was granting him power over her daughters. Authority. Not to be crass, but she knew that thirty feet away undressing her daughters and giving them their evening baths. Again, she KNEW that this guy, this potential pedophile, might be undressing the same daughter that was already suffering from post traumatic stress from abuse she had suffered the twice year before.

She knew, because any functioning and sane adult would, that it would be potentially horrifying to the girl.

And though they were only about thirty feet away, close enough that she might easily hear them crying or perhaps screaming through the thin walls of her trailer, she didn’t walk over and check on them. She'd given them to Mike.

They spent the night there on Tuesday, but she didn't check on them Wednesday morning or evening. She didn't stop by to ask if there were any problems, or to see what they had done, or to discover if they were properly taken care of, if they had taken a bath and been fed. None of that. Nor did she check on Thursday morning, when her daughter was murdered. Or Thursday evening, when her daughter's corpse was being dismembered. Only on Friday night, after three days of not seeing the babies she dropped off thirty feet away, did she bother to check.

That's not an innocent mistake or an oversight. Adding too much sugar to your spouse's coffee is a mistake. Spooning in a few scoops of rat poison is not. Mistakes: I forgot my keys, I ran a red light, I forgot to feed my cat. Not mistakes: robbing a store, giving your little girls away.

And let’s not forget the invisible man here. I am talking, of course, about dad. Did he not notice or care that his three angels were nowhere to be seen? Dad, who, if he asked where they were at all, apparently also did not care that the pedo's-buddy next door now owned his children. Who, during the hours every day between work and sleep, had no questions or concerns strong enough to drive him to walk thirty feet to check on these three little girls.

And we are to believe this? It is ridiculous.

Not because it is something that no responsible parent would do, that goes without saying, but because it is behavior with no rational explanation whatsoever. They have offered no plausible reason why this man was given their children. None. Their claim is that the girls -- and only the girls -- needed to sleep elsewhere so they wouldn’t disturb dad who worked at night. How’s that again? It doesn’t even make sense.

Except it does make sense once you abandon the notion that this was all some innocent mistake. I believe that the only mistake here was that their daughter ended up dead -- I believe THAT'S the part they didn't expect. I believe this is why they initially defended Mike and blamed their daughter. I believe that they thought she had run away or was hiding, and they were setting it up so people wouldn't believe whatever she might say when found.

Again, these are the things that we know or can reasonably deduce happened. The question is what conclusions we draw from it.

I believe it is entirely possible that we are looking at a bigger crime involving more people than we know about so far. I think it is entirely possible that the other girls were also victims, and that it is also possible that the parents knew it when they gave Mike their kids. As horrific and evil and impossible as this is to imagine, it is easier to believe than the story we are currently being asked to accept.

Just my opinion of course. If someone, like the parent's for example, has a better explanation I would very much like to hear it.

gitana1
12-28-2011, 05:22 PM
Let me say something about the flu, though. It can serious enough that person cannot get out of bed or function at all. I was in bed once for two weeks. My whole family got it and none of us could help each other or ourselves. It was a dangerous situation.

A friend of mine got it last year and tried to cope as normal, with two kids and a husband. She did not ask for help and ended up hospitalized as a result.

I really do believe a person could have the flu to the degree that they cannot care for their children - cannot cook for them, do their laundry, make sure they are bathed, safe, not running wild outside.

HOWEVER...

The option is not to allow some unrelated man to care for the kids for a week in his home. Everyone here has come up with other options. He could have come over to cook and do laundry for her, sit down and eat with the kids, if he wanted to help so badly. Step-dad could have helped as well. If he works nights, that means he could have gotten their breakfast, made sure they were up and dressed, teeth brushed for the day, and dinner, baths and pjs on before he left for work.

Also, when I was that sick, I wasn't on the internet. I couldn't read, couldn't even watch t.v. I lay there in a horrific fog, sleeping and suffering when awake. If you are well enough to play on the internet, you are well enough to at the least, have your kids spend the night in their own beds, IMO.

But yes, there are flu strains that are that bad. Up to 100 million people died during the huge flu epidemic of 1918. It turned their bodies black with unabsorbed blood. Most flu viruses are not as bad but up to 500,000 people die from it every year.

madge
12-28-2011, 05:22 PM
I am only speculating on the illness/temporary paralysis...only speculating...my brother is a pathology assistant and he thinks that her symptoms sound like...

Lyme Disease

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0002296/

I know nothing. I have no facts. This is just what my brother mentioned to me. It is only speculation but it sounds very close to some of her symptoms.

My gut tells me there is absolutely nothing wrong with the woman.

The picture I saw of her she was puffing on a cigarette and most serious illness you'd stop smoking to further your healing.

Most likely, her "stories of illness" were just a way to get out of taking care of the kids.

How odd that she supposedly moved to that den of child molesters to take care of good ole daddy BUTTTTT daddy ended up with a live in to take care of him. Why did good ole mommy not move those kids out immediately on his death? I'm sure there was plenty of federal housing she could get.

I would venture to saw that Alianha was receiving SSI benefits and I'm sure mom would get something alloted to her by the government to "take care" of the child. I'd venture to say mommy was getting some kind of "disability" check as well.

Patty G
12-28-2011, 05:22 PM
Me too. Come on. He was bosom buddies with an RSO. He was friendly with the lot of them in that park, it seems. Aliahna was a vulnerable, disabled child who had already been molested TWICE before. That's the kind of child who is vulnerable to even more abuse. And he murdered Aliahna. She's dead. After spending a week with him. Right before she was due to go back home.

It's not rocket science, IMO.

We have heard Ali was abused, but so far haven't heard the word molested yet. I guess we are assuming she was molested, but do we really know that as fact.

hoppy
12-28-2011, 05:22 PM
I can't get past this either and if she was "sick", why not send the current step-dad over? I hope the FBI are REALLY watching ALL these folks.:furious:

...and she could be online but couldn't phone to speak to her girls for 1 minute each every day? Really? :furious:

mikeysmommom
12-28-2011, 05:25 PM
JMO but I think the generational dysfunction and failure within the family was like a funnel leading poor Aliahna straight to Michael P. I am only going by what has been reported. Again, we don't have all of the facts and we still may never. The FBI is involved...so...I hurt so much for these children. They need protection and help. Prayers and love.


TS is definitely older looking than her years. She's got what 5 kids at age 28??? Typical here for welfare generations who only know welfare and have kid after kid to keep a check and such. I'm sure that TS was collecting welfare, wic, food stamps, housing, heating assitance, medical, free cell phone ... I could go on.

Obvious she wasn't interested in taking care of her kids because the articles I've read states that the kids were with the murderer a LOT of the time.

Seems mom was too busy with Facebook and gaming to worry about the kids.

What a life for these children.

I agree also I would bet my last $ CPS was involved with this family.

hoppy
12-28-2011, 05:26 PM
The NEIGHBOR is moving.

Well, I hope that BM (the neighbor with the son who played with aliahna at the bus stop) and ANY OTHER FAMILIES WITH CHILDREN (especially young girls) are offered SOME KIND OF HELP to get out of there!

I also hope that child services, the police, anyone and everyone do something to help protect the remaining children living in that park!

gitana1
12-28-2011, 05:29 PM
that is one mean flu bug . . . antibiotics > 60 days ago & still sick? May be something else . . . but not to go off topic & please -- let's not go there

Sorry, just that is a LONG time to have any bug especially taking antibiotics.

Well, that bad flu I told you about that I had which laid me up for two weeks? I continued to have symptoms for six months. Off and on. It destroyed me. And sometimes it can turn into pneumonia, which is what happened to my friend who ended up in the hospital, poor thing.

krimekat
12-28-2011, 05:32 PM
um, tacky to "sleuth" the victims . . . just sayin'

I'm keeping track, too, of what is going on over in FB world but just not posting it

Remember - the Internet is forever

again, just sayin'

Bravo
12-28-2011, 05:32 PM
I totally understand that flu can be horrific. Having had the worst case i ever had a few years back. I was down a solid week. It was all i could do to get to the bathroom. I certainly know other than bathroom and hubby forcing fluids down me I could not have sat in a computer chair for more than 10 seconds. I totally understood after that flu why it can kill the elderly. Just sayin.....

not_my_kids
12-28-2011, 05:34 PM
that is one mean flu bug . . . antibiotics > 60 days ago & still sick? May be something else . . . but not to go off topic & please -- let's not go there

Sorry, just that is a LONG time to have any bug especially taking antibiotics.

(I tried to fix that quote, but it might be broken anyway when I post, so, if it is, my apologies.)
Anyway, I just thought I would jump off yours. I live a situation where this is possible. I noticed in the video of Tarah and her mother that her mouth looked sunken in. That is the only video I saw her in, so it was the only reference I had to go with. That leads me to believe that she possibly has dental problems, missing teeth, or she is supposed to have dentures that she didn't have in. If she is only missing some teeth, or still has them but they are in bad shape, that could lead to being on antibiotics quite often. I am, and it's all dental related. Like at least 10 days out of every month on Amoxil or penicillin.. I just need to have them pulled, but I digress.
We go through a lot of antibiotic prescriptions, and contributing to that is that we have 4 kids. They bring stuff in from school, or from a playdate at the mall, and I catch it, and then give it to at least one of the other kids, they catch it from me, and pass it on one of the guys, and unless I sterilize Everything in the house, the cycle will repeat, and the first one to bring it home will catch it again. To me, it is the one HUGE drawback to having a large family.
At least we know she took them to the doctor on a regular or as needed basis. I feel slightly better.

She would not have been prescribed antibiotics for the flu, anyway. The flu is a virus, and antibiotics cannot help a virus. No infection, no antibiotics.

gitana1
12-28-2011, 05:34 PM
We have heard Ali was abused, but so far haven't heard the word molested yet. I guess we are assuming she was molested, but do we really know that as fact.

Yes, but I think it's okay to read between the lines here. Kid was abused by two different men that she didn't want to "tell" on. Highly unlikely that two different men were physically abusing this child. I can see one, if it was dad or her step-father, but neither of them appear to be incarcerated for anything. They are active online.

tlcya
12-28-2011, 05:36 PM
While I may agree with your sentiments cubby I have refrained from posting as I had a post removed from the last thread in which I outlined my confusion at the decision making by the adults around this child. I did not name call or bash but did express shock at the circumstances which put these children in that trailer with MP.

I think that within a week, there will be more info available in the MSM that may allow for more leaway than is being given at this point by mods. :cow:

laniefi
12-28-2011, 05:36 PM
Guys - I had a BIL who used to live in this MHP.

It is called 2 things locally - "Pedo Park" and "Pill Park"....

BIL was involved in pills and I will just say he didn't have to go far for a fix.....

Dr.Fessel
12-28-2011, 05:36 PM
--also, where were the girls supposed to sleep at "uncle mike's" ??

--grandma AmberS says it was the FLOOR.

--and this was a better idea than having them home in their own beds, shipped off to the neighbour , to sleep on the floor?


http://www.hlntv.com/video/2011/12/26/girl-vanishes-christmas-eve
--video w/ grandmaS and nancy grace--

--grandma: "when mike came back from getting the cigar-------the 2 younger girls were sleeping on the floor, ali was sleeping in her grandfather's chair w/ a blanket /and a body pillow---and mike lay down on the couch b/c he'd been up w/ her all night b/c she has "night fears"...and he was comforting her all night, so he was tired"....
"he lay on the couch, the 2 younger ones were watching TV, ali was sleeping in the chair".


Night fears are not nightmares. It is the same thing as night terrors. A neighbors child use to have them. Horrible thing to watch.

http://kidshealth.org/parent/growth/sleep/terrors.html

BetteDavisEyes
12-28-2011, 05:36 PM
I don't like to discuss or speculate about peoples' health issues that should remain private, imo, but it's possible that TS has Lupus. I have known young women (late 20s/early 30s) who are afflicted with this sometimes disabling illness, especially when there is a family history of same. jmo

mikeysmommom
12-28-2011, 05:37 PM
um, tacky to "sleuth" the victims . . . just sayin'

I'm keeping track, too, of what is going on over in FB world but just not posting it

Remember - the Internet is forever

again, just sayin'


Remember - the Internet is forever...............So is Death.

lonetraveler
12-28-2011, 05:37 PM
I am only speculating on the illness/temporary paralysis...only speculating...my brother is a pathology assistant and he thinks that her symptoms sound like...

Lyme Disease

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0002296/

I know nothing. I have no facts. This is just what my brother mentioned to me. It is only speculation but it sounds very close to some of her symptoms.

What is even more confusing to me is that the mother's friends saying that she would be walking and over the paralysis in a couple of days???? What?

ClaireNC
12-28-2011, 05:38 PM
There is a family photo on TS's FB page. This photo includes; TS, AS, an older male child (maybe 10/11), AL, 2 - 6 year old girls, and the youngest child is a male 3/4 years old. There is also other pictures of an older female child that I believe to be TS's sisters daughter.

Is this FB picture the only place where the information about there being two male children is coming from? I have not seen it mentioned any place but here on WS. Maybe they are nephews? Has anybody confirmed that TS is the bio mother to any child other than Aliahna and her 6 year old half-sister.

Also just to try to lay out the family "tree"...
Is this right?
-DW is Aliahna's bio-father
-LM is the bio-father of TS's 6 year old daughter.
-AS is the bio-father of the other 6 year old girl that was at the trailer when AL was killed. TS is the step-mother in that case.

Chris_Texas
12-28-2011, 05:39 PM
One thing we haven't heard about is drugs. I'm not trying to start any rumors - its just with acts this heinous and the reputation of the mobile home park - well, its a question that begs to be asked.

I was shocked the other day to read about Elisa Baker's drug charges and how they found like 50,000+ pills. Someone doing that many pills tends to be "out of their mind" and that allows for such horrors to be acted upon.

I'm just wondering here........................ that's all.

No rumors, just speculation.............


JMHO

These things usually don't just happen in a vacuum, do they.

Dr.Fessel
12-28-2011, 05:39 PM
Night terrors have been noted in kids who are:

overtired or ill, stressed, or fatigued
taking a new medication
sleeping in a new environment or away from home
http://kidshealth.org/parent/growth/sleep/terrors.html#

Cubby
12-28-2011, 05:42 PM
BBM

There is nothing out there that MP is "known" child molester.

The radio station that had the article out yesterday clearly stating MP was a registered sex offender has reworded the article.

http://www.goblueridge.net/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=14218

If you read my posts, you will see that I have been trying to get the radio station to be more specific with regards to how MP was located.

It maybe as simple as MP rented a room, of which, perhaps a RSO once lived, or was living with a RSO, and LE stopped by to do a check on RSO and there was MP. They may have ran a background check on MP and found Indiana's warrant as being a fugitive and sent him back to Indiana.

The radio station is suppose to get back to me with more information from the Sheriff on how MP was located, etc., etc.


thank you Patty for all the hard work you're doing to clarify this issue with MP. You bring up a good point that MP could have been in a room/apt that had been occupied by a different RSO.

From the link you posted:

The Sheriff said Plumadore was found in what was the “Domestic Violence and Sex Offender Registry Verification” by warrant and sex offender check, and was here November 29th of 2007 to January 22nd 2008.


Another possibility, imo, could MP have had to register as a DV offender? It sounds like this list is for both DV and RSO's and doesn't mean they are both, but could be one or the other. At least that was my interpretation when the article was updated.

still catching up........

Bravo
12-28-2011, 05:43 PM
Perhaps there were not great Parenting role models for Mom but jeez no pass from me. We both worked full time when kids were young. Me the night shift so i was home to drive kids to/from school. Dad straight days. Allowed me home in the eve and weekends. Between the 2 kids they were involved in 7 sports/activities. We were there for all. Sick you worked around. I am just not buying what Mom is selling. That's what Parenting is or don't sign up for it. I cant even stomach these children were left with this guy. Not even Step Dad had the inclination to walk over and check on them? Beyond reprehensible. All of it. Heartbreaking what conditions children live in today.

Donjeta
12-28-2011, 05:44 PM
She wasn't having night terrors, she was in the freezer.

smittles
12-28-2011, 05:45 PM
Okay, I am trying to get caught up on all of this. I have 2 ?'s.

1. Was there any other adult living in the home other than TS and her husband? I swear I read this somewhere but can't find it now.

2. I also I saw mention of little boys living in the home, is this true and who do they belong to?

I really wish we knew what the mother was suffering from. I've heard the flu, do we know that for sure? Even if it is a really bad flu I have trouble wrapping my brain around that these most precious little girls were sent somewhere else for days. I can understand a few hours but not for days, all day. Plus, these weren't babies so the care involved isn't as demanding as if they were younger. Ali was old enough she could have grabbed some pop tarts or crackers out of a cabinet if they were hunger. I'm pretty sure there weren't any diaper changes. Also they would have all been sleeping when the step dad was working.

I am in no way bashing her, I am just really curious as to exactly why they were with this guy. I guess we might not ever have that answer.

tlcya
12-28-2011, 05:46 PM
a child with PTSD (per stepgrandpa Stone in MSM statements) from being abused might also suffer nightmares or night terrors.

A child stuck in the care of "uncle Mike" who is not acting so nice the last day or so might also have nightmares and call out for her mommy. Particularly one troubled by the foregoing paragraph :(

just saying.

ETA I know this story is simply the one MP told Gramma S, and a self serving one at that, but I can't help but wonder if there is some kernel of truth to the nightmares thing.

Patty G
12-28-2011, 05:47 PM
Yes, but I think it's okay to read between the lines here. Kid was abused by two different men that she didn't want to "tell" on. Highly unlikely that two different men were physically abusing this child. I can see one, if it was dad or her step-father, but neither of them appear to be incarcerated for anything. They are active online.

Hopefully more will come out regarding this "abuse" as I never read between the lines in cases.

I am sure we should be able to find something from last year involving a minor child and two adults.

Cubby
12-28-2011, 05:47 PM
My Grandson and older sis told of abuse, mom and POS BF changed it around after I had police and dyfus involved.Both kids all of a sudden mom says kids are horrible liars gets them diagnosed ADHD and put on meds till we stepped in and fought them on it.Easy for abusers to get over by blaming the kids saying the kids are liars.When in fact the abuse and not allowing children contact with both dads and grandparents after telling us about abuse, psychological consequences from it was the REAL reason manifest themselves as ADHD like symptoms.



Sadly, I find this a very real possibility in Aliahna's diagnosis.

I'm so sorry your grandchildren had to experience this mikeysmommom.

JMO

Chris_Texas
12-28-2011, 05:47 PM
When I first saw a photo of TS, I thought that she was one of the Grandmothers. This 28-year-old is definitely not a well woman. TS seems to have no (or very few) teeth that can be a sign of chronic illness, among other reasons that may come up later in the case. jmo

That was very subtle there, well stated :)

Bravo
12-28-2011, 05:47 PM
She wasn't having night terrors, she was in the freezer.

Yes as he was comforting her :banghead:

Cubby
12-28-2011, 05:50 PM
Mom may not have known someone would chop up her child, but she has a history of at least one child being placed in an unsafe situation that resulted in sex abuse. Then what does she do? Based on the reccommendations of sex offenders, she moves to a sex offender infested mobile home park and proceeds to let her children spend alot of time with a sex offender grandfather and his felon roomate. It's not a leap to suspect mom of bad parenting to the criminal extent. She willingly exposed her kids to danger. IMO, mom is not in the position to plea ignorance, lack of knowledge, or hindsight in this case.


:clap: :clap: :clap:

excellent post. I fully agree!

krimekat
12-28-2011, 05:52 PM
FYI

SpotCrime (http://spotcrime.com/in/fort+wayne) site where you can see crimes mapped to specific locations . . . .

and address of Northway Mobile Home Park is 9435 N Clinton Fort Wayne IN

hope this is okay to post

jjenny
12-28-2011, 05:52 PM
This child was abused by two different people before? All at 9 years old? And now she was violently murdered? Poor kid never had a chance. Was CPS ever involved in all of this?

Wild@Heart
12-28-2011, 05:54 PM
Not caught up, but I have to reply to this post. Respectfully, I have officially fallen off the fence of having any sympathy for this <modsnip>.

There are PLENTY of people who suffer horrible abuses, many of whom have shared their experience here at WS, and become adults capable of escaping that cycle and ensuring their children escape that cycle.

Aliahna and her siblings NEVER HAD A CHANCE. Every single family member they came in contact failed them and failed

Snipped for space!

I am not wrangling sympathy for the mothers poor judgement. I think her remaining children should be taken out of this environment!! I believe they will...JMO

I didn't want to air my dirty laundry to strangers, but, I was sexually abused beginning at age 3. If I hadn't been around people that brought this into perspective for me, I could very well of ended up with the lack of common sense and absent of morality as TS lacks. However, I was blessed with many events and privledges in my life such as, God and education!

These are some incredibly ignorant and evil individuals, most of all the mother for putting her children in this situation. It is unbelievable in fact! I just think we need to consider where she probably came from, she could be a victim of the very same violations her own children have been exposed to. She shouldn't have children, period! I do feel for her loss. She has a dead child because she failed to protect her most prescious gift. I don't support the mom, I am just trying to understand how a mother can allow this to happen. I hope you understand!!

Cubby
12-28-2011, 05:55 PM
This story get's worse and worse. I am having a hard time with temporary paralysis of mom. Maybe her ailment was more complicated and private. It is likely that LE has her medical records as well.


Respectfully, I took that MSM article with a very large dose of salt. The journalist, iirc with no name, seemed to have created an article based on no more than what was read on a public FB wall. There was nothing gleaned from that article that wasn't on FB. no vetting, no verification.

lazy crappy no vetting reporting imo and jmo.

melissasmom
12-28-2011, 05:55 PM
thank you Patty for all the hard work you're doing to clarify this issue with MP. You bring up a good point that MP could have been in a room/apt that had been occupied by a different RSO.

From the link you posted:

The Sheriff said Plumadore was found in what was the “Domestic Violence and Sex Offender Registry Verification” by warrant and sex offender check, and was here November 29th of 2007 to January 22nd 2008.


Another possibility, imo, could MP have had to register as a DV offender? It sounds like this list is for both DV and RSO's and doesn't mean they are both, but could be one or the other. At least that was my interpretation when the article was updated.

still catching up........

I want to say thanks to PattyG also for your work on this. I looked at the newly reworded article. MP did have the case in Iowa for DV, however it appeared to be dismissed due to lack of evidence. If it was dismissed I would imagine that he would not have to register? However he doesn't seem to have any other DV charges that anyone was able to locate.

Bittiness39
12-28-2011, 05:56 PM
Well the FBI is telling people not to speak to the media so as to protect the integrity of the investigation. So unless the media finds a something that we haven't already found, I don't think we will hear anything new...(save a few details here and there) until tomorrow with the medical examiner...:(

I am trying to find out more about Michael P. but it is the same stuff we already found.

mikeysmommom
12-28-2011, 05:57 PM
Not caught up, but I have to reply to this post. Respectfully, I have officially fallen off the fence of having any sympathy for this<modsnip>.

There are PLENTY of people who suffer horrible abuses, many of whom have shared their experience here at WS, and become adults capable of escaping that cycle and ensuring their children escape that cycle.

Initially I thought Tarah and her family were victims of being groomed by this POS MP. Which, I still believe they were.

However after learning Aliahna was the victim of abuse in Iowa which led to her PTSD, and the incubator didn't have a wake up call becoming super vigilant about protecting her children - that's all I needed to hear. Fool mom once, shame on the perp, fool the incubator twice, shame on the incubator.

http://www.journalgazette.net/article/20111228/LOCAL07/312289983/1002/LOCAL

Not only was Aliahna subject to ex con's, pedo's and convicted felons/absconders who were state hopping to avoid penalties, her incubator was hopping states to deliver her children to these dangerous abusive situations.

Aliahna and her siblings NEVER HAD A CHANCE. Every single family member they came in contact failed them and failed them miserably. And as others have posted, as horrific as the information we've learnt, I too think this is only the tip of the iceberg.

'Nuff said. If I add more, I'll be in a time out.

Back to reading and catching up on the thread.

Very well said!!!!

Chris_Texas
12-28-2011, 06:00 PM
We have heard Ali was abused, but so far haven't heard the word molested yet. I guess we are assuming she was molested, but do we really know that as fact.

No. Only through context. She was abused, if I understand it, twice, and by two different people she apparently felt close enough to that she felt bad about reporting them.

Other than sexual abuse I am not sure what else this could be.

Dr. Know?
12-28-2011, 06:00 PM
Could it be MP has a warrant in another state for a possible sex offense? That's why they found him via the registry? If he hasn't been charged yet and been sentenced, he isn't technically a SO yet.

Doesn't really matter, he surrounded himself with other pedofiles and criminals. Aliahna is gone and it won't bring her back if he is one or not.

The other children in the home should be taken at least until this home situation is investigated. Mom took her abused daughter to live in a pedo playground and on top of that, let's 3 daughters stay for a week with their late RSO grandfather's roomate. That's not good judgement. I hope the rumors on FB are true that they have been taken by CPS.

passionflower
12-28-2011, 06:02 PM
o/T just out of curiosity was Ans's home decorated for the holidays?
Were there gifts under the tree or was mom to sick and ?

Dr.Fessel
12-28-2011, 06:03 PM
It makes no sense to me the family was told by the sheriff not to talk about the case to not harm the integrity of it.

Cubby
12-28-2011, 06:03 PM
This is TS's FB status from October 20 at 8:11am via mobile, made me wonder if 6 kids live in the home...
Re-worded from original post!
well some darn bug hit our entire house, on way to drs with 5 out of 6 kids and zach sr. I hope we get this kicked in the ass, im already on antibiotics. :(


Thank you for finding this Kimb103. 5-6 kids in that house and it didn't raise an alarm for Tarah when MP was in interesting in baby sitting some but not all? :furious: Nor did it raise an alarm for her husband when this 39 yr old single male bachelor friend of pedo grandpa was interested in some of their children but not all?

Nuff said, or I will find myself with a WS paid vacation courtesy of the mods. :P

krimekat
12-28-2011, 06:03 PM
Is this FB picture the only place where the information about there being two male children is coming from? I have not seen it mentioned any place but here on WS. Maybe they are nephews? Has anybody confirmed that TS is the bio mother to any child other than Aliahna and her 6 year old half-sister.


don't know if anyone has responded to this query but No, this FB picture is not how the # of children TS/AS/RF/others was determined, at least for me. I know somewhere in thread #2 there is a discussion ONLY supported with FB & MSM comments (nothing MSM or LE or family spoken) . . . speculation ONLY

But earlier in the investigation, while everyone's FB walls were open it was easy to trace the "family-tree" or the Web of Ickiness. I'm sure we will find out soon enough.

There is the beginning of Cast of Characters over in the Media Thread

Patty G
12-28-2011, 06:06 PM
thank you Patty for all the hard work you're doing to clarify this issue with MP. You bring up a good point that MP could have been in a room/apt that had been occupied by a different RSO.

From the link you posted:

The Sheriff said Plumadore was found in what was the “Domestic Violence and Sex Offender Registry Verification” by warrant and sex offender check, and was here November 29th of 2007 to January 22nd 2008.


Another possibility, imo, could MP have had to register as a DV offender? It sounds like this list is for both DV and RSO's and doesn't mean they are both, but could be one or the other. At least that was my interpretation when the article was updated.

still catching up........

The warrant was for the auto theft and forgery charges, so I don't feel it was for a DV registry. I believe the anger management issues of hitting a bus driver was in Florida, and Florida was not in on this warrant.

Still patiently waiting to hear back from the radio station.

matou
12-28-2011, 06:09 PM
Sorry if this has already been answered but I have a few questions:

Who was taking care of the mother while she was sick with the flu. Now I'm hearing she is paralyzed from the waist down. Was she like this the whole time the perp was taking care of her girls? If she was paralyzed, I would guess that she needed help taking care of herself. Did this helper check in on the girls?

Did the girls have school in the last week before Christmas? In Ontario, the schools were running until Friday Dec 23rd. If so, did this "man" get the girls ready for school each day until the Friday morning?

tlcya
12-28-2011, 06:10 PM
all good questions matou

Bittiness39
12-28-2011, 06:11 PM
I would be curious to know if MP had a girlfriend(s)...it is odd to not hear from any family members of MP speak to the media. Usually, by this time, they'd have been tracked down. Not trying to sleuth his family. Not at all. It just seems like we would have heard from someone other than the ROS's living at Pedo Park.

Dr.Fessel
12-28-2011, 06:12 PM
The sheriff tells the family not to talk about the case but he goes on Nancy Grace? Not understanding this. How could the family hurt the case by talking? The freak has confessed.

jjenny
12-28-2011, 06:13 PM
Sorry if this has already been answered but I have a few questions:

Who was taking care of the mother while she was sick with the flu. Now I'm hearing she is paralyzed from the waist down. Was she like this the whole time the perp was taking care of her girls? If she was paralyzed, I would guess that she needed help taking care of herself. Did this helper check in on the girls?

Did the girls have school in the last week before Christmas? In Ontario, the schools were running until Friday Dec 23rd. If so, did this "man" get the girls ready for school each day until the Friday morning?

Her paralysis is described as temporary, so I am guessing it's a recent development-after the child was murdered. I believe the school is on break.

sherbetjello
12-28-2011, 06:13 PM
Well the FBI is telling people not to speak to the media so as to protect the integrity of the investigation..

I wonder if FBI said this before or after grandpa made his remark to the media about prior abuse. I ask this because media has a way of responding a day late, sometimes taking or adding for the headline. I realize that grandpas remarks were posted today cause I fell out of my chair reading it, so I am still left wondering why he threw that bit of information out regardless. FBI told them to stop talking.

Another question I have now, it's been stated by Fries last night on Nancy Grace the girls where with the monster for a week. What day did they get out of school, does anyone know? Did they literally hop off a bus and shuffle off to his home?

matou
12-28-2011, 06:14 PM
I'm going to guess that there will be preserved DNA (i.e. sperm) belonging to Michael Plumadore in the frozen packages, nicely preserved because he froze the evidence. If MORE than one pedo is involved in this crime, I will lose my mind.

krimekat
12-28-2011, 06:14 PM
FYI - fellow WSers

Some of the Ft Wayne & Indianapolis MSMs have FB walls . . . the stories they post on FB are the same as they post on the Website.

:silenced:

gitana1
12-28-2011, 06:15 PM
Hopefully more will come out regarding this "abuse" as I never read between the lines in cases.

I am sure we should be able to find something from last year involving a minor child and two adults.

I know you don't!

I'm not sure, though, that this will be that easy to find. It could have been two different incidents on separate occasions. And what has come out thus far about this case, I would not be surprised.

Donjeta
12-28-2011, 06:15 PM
http://www.shelbystar.com/articles/plumadore-60938-aliahna-told.html
http://www.shelbystar.com/articles/criminal-60944-county-record.html


Michael Len Plumadore, 39, lived in Grover and Kings Mountain during the early and mid-1990s, according to court documents.

On March 10, 1992, Plumadore was found guilty of causing injury to personal property and being intoxicated and disruptive. He was ordered to pay $150 for damages to a Kings Mountain Police car, Cleveland County court records state.

At the time of the charges, Plumadore had a listed address on the 900 block of Second Street in Kings Mountain. He lived on the 100 block of Ben Davis Road, Grover, when he faced three simple assault charges in 1996.

Court records show those charges were dismissed by the district attorney at the time.


FORT WAYNE, Ind. -- The man who confessed to bludgeoning a 9-year-old Indiana girl to death then dismembered her has tied to the Charlotte area.

An address search shows 39-year-old Michael Plumadore lived in several locations between Gastonia and Shelby. However, neighbors in the area said they never knew the man accused of murder.

PHOTOS: The case so far

According to Plumadore's Facebook page, he also went to school in Gastonia, at Hunter Huss High School.

melissasmom
12-28-2011, 06:17 PM
As I was thinking about Aliahna today, my thoughts then went to my own children, and to my sweet little granddaughter(she is 2). She is just the happiest little girl, and my daughter and her boyfriend are just wonderful parents all around. This got me to musing on my daughters' boyfriend.

This young man is the nicest, most gentle-natured guy you could ever meet. He also is what he himself calls "slow", but I think most people would say learning disabled. He had to take special education classes in school, and you can definitley tell when you speak to him that there is something "different" about him. (I am not trying to be offensive to those with disabilities, learning or otherwise, I'm just not that great with wording things sometimes, my apologies) Anyways, my daughter really has to be on the ball a lot with him, as he has a hard time remembering things. If he goes to the store, she has to make a list of exactly what she wants, or if she needs to have him pick up my granddaughter at day care, she has to give him a slip of paper with the time written down on it when he is supposed to pick her up, etc. Things of that nature. Sometimes she really gets exasperated with him.

This young man has had a very hard life. I won't go into details, but things were very rough for him. Then when you add in the LD, he has had to struggle. BUT he is the most wonderful father. He really does cherish his daughter. If we go to the park, he keeps an eagle eye on her. He is very careful about everything he does with her, from what she eats to where she goes. He does not even like like to use a firm tone with her, as he doesn't want to "hurt her feelings, because she is just little".

Sometimes, I hear people making excuses for other about their poor parenting, as in "well, they had a hard life", or "they aren't very smart, so how are they supposed to know". But then I see my granddaughters father. He is the essence of loving and protecting your child. So I say, if HE can be like this, even though he is not "smart", then there is no excuse for anyone else.

Just wanted to tell that story. Sorry it is so long :)

krimekat
12-28-2011, 06:18 PM
I want to say thanks to PattyG also for your work on this. I looked at the newly reworded article. MP did have the case in Iowa for DV, however it appeared to be dismissed due to lack of evidence. If it was dismissed I would imagine that he would not have to register? However he doesn't seem to have any other DV charges that anyone was able to locate.

and it does not fit the timeline . . . IA was in 2010; he was in NC in late 2007

Melanie
12-28-2011, 06:18 PM
This child was abused by two different people before? All at 9 years old? And now she was violently murdered? Poor kid never had a chance. Was CPS ever involved in all of this?

That's a very good question! If Alianah was abused before, how is she NOT monitored by CPS? And how in the heck did she get to live in a SO infested mobile home park?

I just can't believe the failure all around -- not only by mommy, but family, friends, and neighbors.

As I mentioned before, I hope someone (CPS or otherwise) is making sure there are NO children living at that park.

:banghead:

MOO

Mel

gitana1
12-28-2011, 06:19 PM
I wonder if FBI said this before or after grandpa made his remark to the media about prior abuse. I ask this because media has a way of responding a day late, sometimes taking or adding for the headline. I realize that grandpas remarks were posted today cause I fell out of my chair reading it, so I am still left wondering why he threw that bit of information out regardless. FBI told them to stop talking.

Another question I have now, it's been stated by Fries last night on Nancy Grace the girls where with the monster for a week. What day did they get out of school, does anyone know? Did they literally hop off a bus and shuffle off to his home?

They were told not to speak about the circumstances of Aliahna's death. Abuse occurring in an unrelated incident is different.

And I get why they want to control dissemination of info in this case related to Ali's murder. Charging documents have not yet been drawn up
and their investigation continues. They don't need everything out front and center before they have pieced it all together.

Melanie
12-28-2011, 06:22 PM
As I was thinking about Aliahna today, my thoughts then went to my own children, and to my sweet little granddaughter(she is 2). She is just the happiest little girl, and my daughter and her boyfriend are just wonderful parents all around. This got me to musing on my daughters' boyfriend.

This young man is the nicest, most gentle-natured guy you could ever meet. He also is what he himself calls "slow", but I think most people would say learning disabled. He had to take special education classes in school, and you can definitley tell when you speak to him that there is something "different" about him. (I am not trying to be offensive to those with disabilities, learning or otherwise, I'm just not that great with wording things sometimes, my apologies) Anyways, my daughter really has to be on the ball a lot with him, as he has a hard time remembering things. If he goes to the store, she has to make a list of exactly what she wants, or if she needs to have him pick up my granddaughter at day care, she has to give him a slip of paper with the time written down on it when he is supposed to pick her up, etc. Things of that nature. Sometimes she really gets exasperated with him.

This young man has had a very hard life. I won't go into details, but things were very rough for him. Then when you add in the LD, he has had to struggle. BUT he is the most wonderful father. He really does cherish his daughter. If we go to the park, he keeps an eagle eye on her. He is very careful about everything he does with her, from what she eats to where she goes. He does not even like like to use a firm tone with her, as he doesn't want to "hurt her feelings, because she is just little".

Sometimes, I hear people making excuses for other about their poor parenting, as in "well, they had a hard life", or "they aren't very smart, so how are they supposed to know". But then I see my granddaughters father. He is the essence of loving and protecting your child. So I say, if HE can be like this, even though he is not "smart", then there is no excuse for anyone else.

Just wanted to tell that story. Sorry it is so long :)

Thank you so much for sharing! Your grandaughter is a very lucky little girl!

Bittiness39
12-28-2011, 06:22 PM
I wonder if FBI said this before or after grandpa made his remark to the media about prior abuse. I ask this because media has a way of responding a day late, sometimes taking or adding for the headline. I realize that grandpas remarks were posted today cause I fell out of my chair reading it, so I am still left wondering why he threw that bit of information out regardless. FBI told them to stop talking.

My thought process on LE/FBI telling the family (possibly others) to stop speaking to the media:
1) FBI tends to do this
2) The FBI is involved because of all of the following or one or more:
a) The trailer park is crawling with RSO's
b) MP was a fugitive who had crossed state lines
c) The victim's family lived in Pedo Park for a couple of months--if there is something else going on like a child molestation/porn ring, perhaps, they can give LE and the FBI a ton of information...let's face it...mostly only Pedophiles are living there...they have been a "SOURCE" of information for the media...if the investigation leads to somewhere larger than MP...they could give information. If not...then the FBI doesn't want them to talk because they are looking at the family.

Just all rampant speculation on my part. Typically, LE wants people to talk. Especially, if they are suspected in something...the whole, "give them enough rope" theory...but telling them not to, I would suspect, means either there is something larger going on...or two, because of the already sketchy situation of the family allowing the three girls to live with the murderer for a week, LE fears that they might screw up the inevitable "trial"...because if he pleads NG and decides to go to trial, the Defense will fillet this family. Don't know...I am at a loss.

krimekat
12-28-2011, 06:23 PM
:bump:


Please continue here.

Please remember that discussion of how this young girl ended up in that trailer is relevent to this case. The family is discussable to that end - but there is to be NO BASHING or TRASHING. We still do not know all the circumstances about why Aliahna was with this <modsnip>.

Also remember there is NO NAME CALLING, not even of the perp. I know that is difficult sometimes but we can do it.

Prayers for this little one, may she rest in peace and may her sisters find safety and be allowed to grow up. :(

MEDIA REFERENCE THREAD (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7465866#post7465866)

Thread 1 (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=158315)
Thread 2 (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7468775&posted=1#post7468775)


Salem

we were doing such a good job being refrained . . . :innocent:

madge
12-28-2011, 06:23 PM
I can't find the murderers Facebook page. All I get is '''content unavailable" Has it been removed does anyone know? Who would have his password other than possibly Aliahna's mother.

Anyone who has links that could pm me,much appreciated. I would like to check some FB walls, etc. I had to reactivate my FB account just to do it.

cluciano63
12-28-2011, 06:24 PM
They were told not to speak about the circumstances of Aliahna's death. Abuse occurring in an unrelated incident is different.

And I get why they want to control dissemination of info in this case related to Ali's murder. Charging documents have not yet been drawn up
and their investigation continues. They don't need everything out front and center before they have pieced it all together.

Has LE said that they told the family not to speak?

sfbaynancydrew
12-28-2011, 06:25 PM
I really hope that this story, as creepy as it is unto itself, isn't the tip of the iceberg of a very dark situation.

Bearcat109
12-28-2011, 06:25 PM
I am speculating....

Maybe Aliahna was trying to protect her sisters and this is the motive for her muder. MP could have promised her that if she did not tell anyone about the abuse he would not hurt her sisters. Perhaps she caught him in the act. This thought just keeps going through my mind. I don't know at this time that there was any sexual abuse happening at all, but I think Aliahna would have protected her sisters at all costs especially knowing what she had previously gone through.

sherbetjello
12-28-2011, 06:26 PM
I can't find the murderers Facebook page. All I get is '''content unavailable" Has it been removed does anyone know? Who would have his password other than possibly Aliahna's mother.

Anyone who has links that could pm me,much appreciated. I would like to check some FB walls, etc. I had to reactivate my FB account just to do it.

His profile was removed from the site.

Dr. Know?
12-28-2011, 06:27 PM
I wonder if FBI said this before or after grandpa made his remark to the media about prior abuse. I ask this because media has a way of responding a day late, sometimes taking or adding for the headline. I realize that grandpas remarks were posted today cause I fell out of my chair reading it, so I am still left wondering why he threw that bit of information out regardless. FBI told them to stop talking.

Another question I have now, it's been stated by Fries last night on Nancy Grace the girls where with the monster for a week. What day did they get out of school, does anyone know? Did they literally hop off a bus and shuffle off to his home?

Aliahna's classmate said this and yes it was a planned stay with Uncle Mike. gah!

Mckee's daughter, Axxxx, says Aliahna told her about her winter break plans. "She told me she was going to a friend's house the last day of school before Christmas break."

http://www.indianasnewscenter.com/home/Missing-Juvenile-136180558.html?m=y&smobile=y

Melanie
12-28-2011, 06:27 PM
They were told not to speak about the circumstances of Aliahna's death. Abuse occurring in an unrelated incident is different.

And I get why they want to control dissemination of info in this case related to Ali's murder. Charging documents have not yet been drawn up
and their investigation continues. They don't need everything out front and center before they have pieced it all together.

I have yet to find a link wherein the FBI can put any american citizen under a gag order. If someone can find a link, that would be most appreciated.

They can encourage someone not to discuss the facts, but as far as I know, they cannot legally tell someone they cannot discuss a case such as this. Only a judge and a court of law can do that IMHO.

This discussion came into play in the aliayah lunsford case and how mommy said the FBI put her under a gag order. The fbi came out and said they never told her such a thing.

So me thinks the whole "fbi told me not to talk" is an easy excuse.

MOO

Mel

krimekat
12-28-2011, 06:27 PM
http://www.shelbystar.com/articles/plumadore-60938-aliahna-told.html
http://www.shelbystar.com/articles/criminal-60944-county-record.html

such an awesome find! will add to MPs record list in the Media Thread

believe09
12-28-2011, 06:28 PM
...and she could be online but couldn't phone to speak to her girls for 1 minute each every day? Really? :furious:

We dont know this to be true, respectfully. Clearly, imo, she called to check on them. We know on Friday, at least, she did not speak to the girls. She only spoke with MP. We can imagine that MP may have intentionally misled her in that conversation because he knew Aliahna had not disappeared. He knew exactly where she was.

tlcya
12-28-2011, 06:28 PM
http://www.wane.com/dpp/news/local/lemmons-cause-of-death-still-unknown

COD stil unknown. Awaiting microscopic and tox results which take longer.

Some details will not be released

believe09
12-28-2011, 06:30 PM
If Aliahna went to fwcs, their winter break began the afternoon of 12/21. You can find it on the calendar posted on the school website.

http://www.fwcs.k12.in.us/calendar/calendar.php

believe09
12-28-2011, 06:31 PM
http://www.wane.com/dpp/news/local/lemmons-cause-of-death-still-unknown

COD stil unknown. Awaiting microscopic and tox results which take longer.

Some details will not be released

If the COD is undetermined, does that mean it is not obvious that he bashed her head in with the brick? Or that they dont know if that killed her-I suppose he might have asphyxiated her. :(

tehcloser
12-28-2011, 06:32 PM
http://www.wane.com/dpp/news/local/lemmons-cause-of-death-still-unknown

COD stil unknown. Awaiting microscopic and tox results which take longer.

Some details will not be released

I hate to be graphic, but if he had hit her in the head several times with a brick and her death resulted from that, that would be fairly obvious right? But the article states....

FORT WAYNE, Ind. (WANE) – After the external examination of Aliahna Maroney-Lemmon’s remains was completed by the Allen County Coroner's Office Wednesday afternoon, the cause of her death is still undetermined.


So WTH did he do to this child???????????

Cubby
12-28-2011, 06:34 PM
While I may agree with your sentiments cubby I have refrained from posting as I had a post removed from the last thread in which I outlined my confusion at the decision making by the adults around this child. I did not name call or bash but did express shock at the circumstances which put these children in that trailer with MP.

I think that within a week, there will be more info available in the MSM that may allow for more leaway than is being given at this point by mods. :cow:


Point taken. I edited my post accordingly. I'll just add, I'm thankful for the smiley list here. In particular this one: :cursing:

matou
12-28-2011, 06:35 PM
Cause of death undetermined? So I guess the brick to the head didn't kill her. I thought he said he hit her multiple times in the head? I think he is full of ****.

octobermoon
12-28-2011, 06:35 PM
Aliahna Lemmon's step-grandfather, David Story, said Wednesday that the Allen County Sheriff's Department and the FBI told family members not to talk to anyone about her death. He says they didn't give a reason.

Sheriff's Cpl. Jeremy Tinkel confirmed deputies asked the family not to talk to the media, saying it would protect the integrity of the case.

Link
http://www.courierpress.com/news/201...r-details-eme/

smart blonde
12-28-2011, 06:35 PM
It was reported that he put her in the freezer for a period of hours before he dismembered. If she was frozen - that helps with the mess. As for spatter - she was already dead - not much spatter as heart isn't beating and then being frozen - well, you get the idea.

Lord, that hurt to type.

And, from one of the articles I read, he didn't 'just' dismember her and put parts of her in the freezer, he dismembered her frozen body and put parts of her in freezer bags, no telling how small the freezer bags may have been. What used to be a vaginal area may no longer exist.
Just pray he didn't have a garbage disposal.

He had time on his side, and extreme motivation to accomplish his task of destroying the incriminating evidence. Her body was that evidence.

In my mind/ my opinion only:

~ too much dope/drugs? (my unsubstantiated opinion)
~ the rape (as of yet, unsubstantiated)
~ the brick
~ the freezer
~ more dope?
~ the hacksaw
~ the bathtub?
~ freezer bags & freezer
~ clean up
~ more dope?
~ dumpster
~ cigar

Again, this entire post is just my opinion.

Personally, I believe she was murdered because he may have gotten 'carried away' while raping her, damaging her internally. She must have felt pure terror, staring up into the eyes of a human demon. I picture her crying, near hysterics from pain, shock, fear, and trying to get out the front door to get away from him. He easily caught up with her. He hit her in the head with the brick because he had to shut her up fast. Killing her may have aroused him all over again. This 'guy' is pure evil.

I swear, I could have told you he was a mean S.O.B. just by looking at his eyes in his FB profile pic. He puts on a facade, but when the evil comes through, it comes right through his pores.

He killed her to protect himself. He felt she was going to tell. Maybe involve an emergency room. Emergency rooms bring questions, the wrong answers bring police. He knew he had caused too much damage, and that he wouldn't be able to 'sweet-talk' it away. As he may have been able to sweet talk her mother and grandma in the past, but this time it was different, much more serious.

But, he enjoyed what he did to her.
If he hadn't been caught because of it, he would have looked back on her murder as one of the most exciting things he's ever done. He still may, even from prison. Especially from prison. This was an 'ultimate' experience for him. Raping a nine-year-old.

I believe he may have killed before~ but, no one he thought the authorities could tie to him directly.

Just thinking of that picture of him sitting next to what looks to be a crusty, semen-stained recliner. The stains that have a child's stuffed animal (a unicorn, of all things, such a symbol of purity) laying across them. He's calm and 'cool', being interviewed by the media. He knows her head is in his freezer, just a few feet away. How much you want to bet he was facing that freezer, and it was right over the reporter's shoulder?

~Why do they portray Hell as being so hot, when Evil, itself, is so cold.

tlcya
12-28-2011, 06:37 PM
If the COD is undetermined, does that mean it is not obvious that he bashed her head in with the brick? Or that they dont know if that killed her-I suppose he might have asphyxiated her. :(

I was confused by that as well. I think it means that they have not determined that things happened the way MP tells it based soley on the me autopsy of the remains. I am not sure if her dismemberment plus some of the remains being frozen may have hampered that determination.

It was my understanding that the head (so sorry little Aliahna, to type that) was found in MP's freezer, so you would think that they would be able to tell if blunt force tyrauma was indeed the COD.

:waitasec:

you got me believe. I am a bit puzzled to say the least.

Boss 302
12-28-2011, 06:38 PM
If Aliahna went to fwcs, their winter break began the afternoon of 12/21. You can find it on the calendar posted on the school website.

http://www.fwcs.k12.in.us/calendar/calendar.php

She attended a FWCS Holland Elementary

Bittiness39
12-28-2011, 06:39 PM
such an awesome find! will add to MPs record list in the Media Thread (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=158476)

These were an awesome find!
Out of abject curiousity, since it said he went to HG in Gastonia, NC...I went to their unsolved crimes page. I don't know when or how long he lived in Gastonia, or NC for that matter (on and off--and during which years)...but I had to share this...I get to an unsolved homicide of a police officer...and a "sketch" of the perp.

Okay...so the crime happened in 1996...but please check out the perp's sketch. I am not saying it is MP...or anything...but the crime is still unsolved....I can't imbed the sketch because I don't know how...

http://www.cityofgastonia.com/city_serv/police/investigation/PublicsHelpRequested.cfm

matou
12-28-2011, 06:39 PM
And, from one of the articles I read, he didn't 'just' dismember her and put parts of her in the freezer, he dismembered her frozen body and put parts of her in freezer bags, no telling how small the freezer bags may have been. What used to be a vaginal area may no longer exist.
Just pray he didn't have a garbage disposal.

He had time on his side, and extreme motivation to accomplish his task of destroying the incriminating evidence. Her body was that evidence.

In my mind/ my opinion only:

~ too much dope/drugs? (my unsubstantiated opinion)
~ the rape (as of yet, unsubstantiated)
~ the brick
~ the freezer
~ more dope?
~ the hacksaw
~ the bathtub?
~ freezer bags & freezer
~ clean up
~ more dope?
~ dumpster
~ cigar

Again, this entire post is just my opinion.

Personally, I believe she was murdered because he may have gotten 'carried away' while raping her, damaging her internally. She must have felt pure terror, staring up into the eyes of a human demon. I picture her crying, near hysterics from pain, shock, fear, and trying to get out the front door to get away from him. He easily caught up with her. He hit her in the head with the brick because he had to shut her up fast. Killing her may have aroused him all over again. This 'guy' is pure evil.

I swear, I could have told you he was a mean S.O.B. just by looking at his eyes in his FB profile pic. He puts on a facade, but when the evil comes through, it comes right through his pores.

He killed her to protect himself. He felt she was going to tell. Maybe involve an emergency room. Emergency rooms bring questions, the wrong answers bring police. He knew he had caused too much damage, and that he wouldn't be able to 'sweet-talk' it away. As he has been able to sweet talk her mother and grandma in the past, but this time it was different, much more serious.

But, he enjoyed what he did to her.
If he hadn't been caught because of it, he would have looked back on her murder as one of the most exciting things he's ever done. He still may, even from prison. This was an 'ultimate' experience for him. Raping a nine-year-old.

I believe he may have killed before~ but, no one he thought the authorities could tie to him directly.

Just thinking of that picture of him sitting next to what looks to be a crusty, semen-stained recliner. The stains that have a child's stuffed animal (a unicorn, of all things, such a symbol of purity) laying across them. He's calm and 'cool', being interviewed by the media. He knows her head is in his freezer, just a few feet away. How much you want to bet he was facing that freezer, and it was right over the reporter's shoulder?

~Why do they portray Hell as being so hot, when Evil, itself, is so cold.

The parts may still be there, in separated parts and in separate bags. The ME would be able to assemble and test these parts for evidence. What a sicko. He thought he was smart to freeze her first but he used baggies that can pick up prints and evidence and of course any evidence is frozen in there with her too.

Donjeta
12-28-2011, 06:39 PM
If Aliahna went to fwcs, their winter break began the afternoon of 12/21. You can find it on the calendar posted on the school website.

http://www.fwcs.k12.in.us/calendar/calendar.php

Aliahna was a third-grader at Holland Elementary in Fort Wayne Community Schools.
www.journalgazette.net/article/20111228/LOCAL07/312289983/1002/LOCAL

Mandy113
12-28-2011, 06:39 PM
I haven't been able to catch up on all the threads yet. To be honest, I'm not sure I'll be able to because I just get more upset the more I read. Count me in the group who can't give her mother a pass on this. She had a responsibility to care for, nurture and protect her child. At the least, she was negligent.

I read the posts about needing to change the laws to protect our children from pedophiles & to have tougher laws about where RSO's may live. Of course, I agree with all of you. But respectfully .... please tell me how we do that? Everytime this subject is brought up, the barrier to implementing real change are the rights of the RSO. How do we change laws so they are written to protect the rights of innocent children rather than convicted felons?

The death penalty? Good luck. If I recall correctly, the person responsible for Zahra Baker's horrific death is not facing the death penalty. Different states, I know.

End of rant. JMO.

I'm so sorry Aliahna. I will never forget you.

billisbobby
12-28-2011, 06:39 PM
Bravo's post from other thread. I think it's worthy of repeating.
Quote:


For me the fact that a child was expected to stand by a casket and smile for a photo opt at RSO Grandpa's Funeral is very telling. Who does that Now she is safe from anyone and everyone who failed her and hurt her in life.

You got that right Bravo. No one will ever hurt her again. imoo

krimekat
12-28-2011, 06:40 PM
That's a very good question! If Alianah was abused before, how is she NOT monitored by CPS? And how in the heck did she get to live in a SO infested mobile home park?

I just can't believe the failure all around -- not only by mommy, but family, friends, and neighbors.

As I mentioned before, I hope someone (CPS or otherwise) is making sure there are NO children living at that park.

:banghead:

MOO

Mel

nomadic lifestyle I assume States cannot (or do not) keep track . . . she's 9 yo, so that's, what, Third Grade? We know the family recently move to FW (we know MP returned Aug 2011, so when did TS/family?). We know Aliahna went to Kindergarten & First Grade in Iowa.

hoppy
12-28-2011, 06:40 PM
We dont know this to be true, respectfully. Clearly, imo, she called to check on them. We know on Friday, at least, she did not speak to the girls. She only spoke with MP. We can imagine that MP may have intentionally misled her in that conversation because he knew Aliahna had not disappeared. He knew exactly where she was.

You are right - for the first couple of days we don't know that this didn't happen. What we actually DO know is that she didn't speak with her on Thursday or Friday as the child was dead, in a freezer, or being dismembered.:furious: :furious: :furious:

I guess it's just me - but if I were sick in bed and my babies had to be elsewhere - it would only make me feel WORSE if I didn't at least get to speak with them each day - AT LEAST once. Being sick wouldn't stop me from missing them like crazy! Again - this is just me and I totally get that this isn't the case for all women who give birth. (and yes, I intentionally didn't say 'all mothers' because the word 'mother' should mean something more) YKWIM?

tlcya
12-28-2011, 06:43 PM
smart blond, your post made me shudder, not only for what this poor child may have endured, but for the sisters. Were they there at the trailer when he was doing the dismembering and placing peices in freezer bags????? What on earth did those children see/hear while in that trailer???

I pray they are being watched carefully and being interveiwed oh so gently by skilled professionals.

FGS, each time we get one of these cases, I think "well this - this right here, this is the lowest of the low, the worst of the worst."

And then I log onto WS the next day . . .

:shakehead:

beach
12-28-2011, 06:43 PM
This story get's worse and worse. I am having a hard time with temporary paralysis of mom. Maybe her ailment was more complicated and private. It is likely that LE has her medical records as well.




Respectfully, I took that MSM article with a very large dose of salt. The journalist, iirc with no name, seemed to have created an article based on no more than what was read on a public FB wall. There was nothing gleaned from that article that wasn't on FB. no vetting, no verification.

lazy crappy no vetting reporting imo and jmo.

I'm having a HUGE issue swallowing that one too.

And to top if off, I read 2 different MSM articles and both cited "friends" as the source of the paralysis story. Not trying to be hard-hearted here, but the truth is - a diagnosis by "friends" of temporary paralysis w/ disclaimers that she should be recovered in a few days??? Okaayyy...

I'll just say I don't doubt she is sick (at least with the flu or something...she looks rough), but I am taking that whole "temporary paralysis" diagnosis relayed by anonymous friends to some reporter needing a scoop with a BIG BOX of salt. I need to hear from somebody more credible than her "friends and family".

akashana
12-28-2011, 06:44 PM
Given that this poor child had been victimized not once, but twice before, by two different men who were charged with the crime, and given that her mother still allowed her to be alone in the company of another man, I am guessing that the mom herself was so clearly dysfunctional that she didn't respect the normal barriers that most mothers would. Knowing that her late father was a RSO, I have to wonder who were the victims of his crime. IS there any info out there on those crimes? I hate to add to the mother's pain, but can't help but be amazed at her lack of common sense regarding her children's safety. Could she herself have been molested? I realize that adults who were victimized as children often continue to have strong family bonds with their abusers, even allowing their children to be around them. I have a friend whose father molested her as a young girl, and she allows him to live in a camper trailer on her property wih her children and grandchildren all around. She claims he is "safe" now because he is blind. I disagree, but that's another story.

Donjeta
12-28-2011, 06:44 PM
Has LE said that they told the family not to speak?

Sheriff's Cpl. Jeremy Tinkel confirmed deputies asked the family not to talk to the media, saying it would protect the integrity of the case.
http://www.courierpress.com/news/2011/dec/28/slain-indiana-girls-family-quiet-after-details-eme/

gitana1
12-28-2011, 06:46 PM
Has LE said that they told the family not to speak?

Yes.


I have yet to find a link wherein the FBI can put any american citizen under a gag order. If someone can find a link, that would be most appreciated.

They can encourage someone not to discuss the facts, but as far as I know, they cannot legally tell someone they cannot discuss a case such as this. Only a judge and a court of law can do that IMHO.

This discussion came into play in the aliayah lunsford case and how mommy said the FBI put her under a gag order. The fbi came out and said they never told her such a thing.

So me thinks the whole "fbi told me not to talk" is an easy excuse.

MOO

Mel

LE confirmed they asked the family not to discuss the details of Aliahna's death. True, they cannot issue a gag order, but I'm sure the family wants to protect the integrity of the case against Plumadore as well... that is, at least most of them do.

believe09
12-28-2011, 06:46 PM
Respectfully, I dont think anyone of us is giving Mom a pass. Decisions were made that put Aliahna and her sisters in the hands of the man who ultimately killed Aliahna. Mom and family will live with that forever.

I dont think she did this willfully, and right now I think the man who killed her is the person who bears the responsibility for her death. I dont need to judge Mom, right now anyway, because I pray to God I never go through the hell she is going through.

gitana1
12-28-2011, 06:47 PM
Sheriff's Cpl. Jeremy Tinkel confirmed deputies asked the family not to talk to the media, saying it would protect the integrity of the case.http://www.wane.com/dpp/news/local/lemmon-family-quiet-after-details-emerge

Wild@Heart
12-28-2011, 06:48 PM
When a evil person confesses, who know want is fanasty or factual. He probably wouldn't tell LE that he molested her. He could have stuffed a sock in her mouth or put a pillow over her face while raping her. She could have died numerous ways. I'm sure with the amount of damage to this body, they are having a hard time determining the cause of death. JMO

Patty G
12-28-2011, 06:53 PM
Aliahna Lemmon's step-grandfather, David Story, said Wednesday that the Allen County Sheriff's Department and the FBI told family members not to talk to anyone about her death. He says they didn't give a reason.

Sheriff's Cpl. Jeremy Tinkel confirmed deputies asked the family not to talk to the media, saying it would protect the integrity of the case.

Link
http://www.courierpress.com/news/201...r-details-eme/

I couldn't get the above link to work and found another one.

http://www.courierpress.com/news/2011/dec/28/slain-indiana-girls-family-quiet-after-details-eme/

octobermoon
12-28-2011, 06:55 PM
And apparently this only applied to the girls.


I couldn't get the above link to work and found another one.

http://www.courierpress.com/news/2011/dec/28/slain-indiana-girls-family-quiet-after-details-eme/

Thank you Patty :)

I don't know how I manage to do that sometimes.

krimekat
12-28-2011, 06:56 PM
I can't find the XXXXX Facebook page. All I get is '''content unavailable" Has it been removed does anyone know? Who would have his password other than possibly Aliahna's mother.
<snipped>.

I am sure FBI disabled them . . .

Ailahna's FB account has been disabled, too

Bittiness39
12-28-2011, 06:56 PM
All three of the little girls could have been killed. As it stands right now, one died horrifically. And the other two could have seen unspeakable things. And it sounds from all that we could gleam from MSM, that not one family member laid eyes on any one of them since Tuesday.

For all we know, Aliahna could have been dead since Tuesday evening. If that is the case, I have to condemn. Forget not giving them a pass.

Kids aren't prizes in a crackerjack box. It is sad in today's society when I see infertile couples struggling to have children. Praying for a child. Praying for an organ donor for a sick child. Then you see someone with 5...where some can't have any or save the one they have...and they can't be bothered to walk 30 feet or roll 30 feet over to check on their welfare????

While my heart bleeds for the horrific tragedy the family is facing...this was IMO very preventable. As I mentioned before...the generational dysfunction and decision making of this family was like a funnel leading poor Aliahna right to MP's door. With bells on. I can pray for the family...but I am more concerned that this could happen to the other children. My two cents.

I pray for the victims. But my heart is with Aliahna.

KinderedSpirits
12-28-2011, 06:56 PM
And, from one of the articles I read, he didn't 'just' dismember her and put parts of her in the freezer, he dismembered her frozen body and put parts of her in freezer bags, no telling how small the freezer bags may have been. What used to be a vaginal area may no longer exist.
Just pray he didn't have a garbage disposal.

He had time on his side, and extreme motivation to accomplish his task of destroying the incriminating evidence. Her body was that evidence.

In my mind/ my opinion only:

~ too much dope/drugs? (my unsubstantiated opinion)
~ the rape (as of yet, unsubstantiated)
~ the brick
~ the freezer
~ more dope?
~ the hacksaw
~ the bathtub?
~ freezer bags & freezer
~ clean up
~ more dope?
~ dumpster
~ cigar

Again, this entire post is just my opinion.

Personally, I believe she was murdered because he may have gotten 'carried away' while raping her, damaging her internally. She must have felt pure terror, staring up into the eyes of a human demon. I picture her crying, near hysterics from pain, shock, fear, and trying to get out the front door to get away from him. He easily caught up with her. He hit her in the head with the brick because he had to shut her up fast. Killing her may have aroused him all over again. This 'guy' is pure evil.

I swear, I could have told you he was a mean S.O.B. just by looking at his eyes in his FB profile pic. He puts on a facade, but when the evil comes through, it comes right through his pores.

He killed her to protect himself. He felt she was going to tell. Maybe involve an emergency room. Emergency rooms bring questions, the wrong answers bring police. He knew he had caused too much damage, and that he wouldn't be able to 'sweet-talk' it away. As he may have been able to sweet talk her mother and grandma in the past, but this time it was different, much more serious.

But, he enjoyed what he did to her.
If he hadn't been caught because of it, he would have looked back on her murder as one of the most exciting things he's ever done. He still may, even from prison. Especially from prison. This was an 'ultimate' experience for him. Raping a nine-year-old.

I believe he may have killed before~ but, no one he thought the authorities could tie to him directly.

Just thinking of that picture of him sitting next to what looks to be a crusty, semen-stained recliner. The stains that have a child's stuffed animal (a unicorn, of all things, such a symbol of purity) laying across them. He's calm and 'cool', being interviewed by the media. He knows her head is in his freezer, just a few feet away. How much you want to bet he was facing that freezer, and it was right over the reporter's shoulder?

~Why do they portray Hell as being so hot, when Evil, itself, is so cold.

I am having a hard time believing the sisters did not see, or hear anything....unless they were drugged...MOO!!!!!

Dr.Fessel
12-28-2011, 06:56 PM
Has LE said that they told the family not to speak?

Yes, the Sheriff dept has admitted to telling the family not to talk about the case.

Aliahna Lemmon's step-grandfather, David Story, said Wednesday that the Allen County Sheriff's Department and the FBI told family members not to talk to anyone about her death. He says they didn't give a reason.

Sheriff's Cpl. Jeremy Tinkel confirmed deputies asked the family not to talk to the media, saying it would protect the integrity of the case.

http://www.wane.com/dpp/news/local/lemmon-family-quiet-after-details-emerge

gitana1
12-28-2011, 06:58 PM
Aliahna's classmate said this and yes it was a planned stay with Uncle Mike. gah!

Mckee's daughter, Amelia, says Aliahna told her about her winter break plans. "She told me she was going to a friend's house the last day of school before Christmas break."

http://www.indianasnewscenter.com/home/Missing-Juvenile-136180558.html?m=y&smobile=y

As I said before, I don't know that Aliahna was referring to MP. Most kids don't refer to adults as "friends". She could have had plans to play with a friend or spend the night but the adults in her life changed those plans.


Sounds like they "borrowed" a page from Lena Lunsford. She also swore the FBI told her family never to discuss her little ones case. Turns out thanks to her Aunt Vickie, that it was a big fat lie! jmo

Not really. In this case, they were asked not to talk about details of Aliahna's death. Only about her death. And Aliahna has been found. This is not a case of one family member lying to others to keep them from saying something that could incriminate that family member in the unsolved disappearance of a child. Here, LE has confirmed that they told the family not to release such details. And their reasoning makes sense to me.

believe09
12-28-2011, 06:59 PM
It makes no sense to me the family was told by the sheriff not to talk about the case to not harm the integrity of it.

It makes perfect sense to me. Small leaks lead to big leaks...such as COD, priors on MP...all kinds of things from the investigation.

not_my_kids
12-28-2011, 06:59 PM
I don't think so.

Link is in media links. The family said that LE asked them not to talk about the case, and LE confirmed that request.

Melanie
12-28-2011, 07:00 PM
Cause of death undetermined? So I guess the brick to the head didn't kill her. I thought he said he hit her multiple times in the head? I think he is full of ****.

Her head was in his freezer! If this poor child died from blunt force tramua, it would surely be evident.

Then again, he cut her up into pieces, so I wouldn't believe anything he said. I'm still convinced (IMHO) he dismembered her to cover up any sign of sexual abuse.

Just my opinion.

Mel

Cubby
12-28-2011, 07:01 PM
Snipped for space!

I am not wrangling sympathy for the mothers poor judgement. I think her remaining children should be taken out of this environment!! I believe they will...JMO

I didn't want to air my dirty laundry to strangers, but, I was sexually abused beginning at age 3. If I hadn't been around people that brought this into perspective for me, I could very well of ended up with the lack of common sense and absent of morality as TS lacks. However, I was blessed with many events and privledges in my life such as, God and education!

These are some incredibly ignorant and evil individuals, most of all the mother for putting her children in this situation. It is unbelievable in fact! I just think we need to consider where she probably came from, she could be a victim of the very same violations her own children have been exposed to. She shouldn't have children, period! I do feel for her loss. She has a dead child because she failed to protect her most prescious gift. I don't support the mom, I am just trying to understand how a mother can allow this to happen. I hope you understand!!



Kimb103, I am sorry for your experience and thankful you were able to break the cycle. I should have been more clear with my post stating I was using yours for a spring board.

I have considered where Tarah came from and what circumstances she may have came from. We each come to the table with our own circumstances.

What I fail to understand is how Tarah could knowingly and willingly have chosen to put her children in the same situation which she had previously knowing the repercussions and fear her children faced.

How does one look into the eyes of a child and see that kind of fear and KNOWINGLY place them in the same situation with different circumstances repeatedly?

We're talking about a woman who is too ill to care for her children, but can post updates about herself and her broken thumb on FB.

Why didn't CPS remove these children after the first incidents of abuse? and what measures were taken to reunify this family after at least once child suffered previous abuse not once, but twice?

JMO

suzyq211
12-28-2011, 07:02 PM
She wasn't having night terrors, she was in the freezer.

Right.

Chris_Texas
12-28-2011, 07:02 PM
As I was thinking about Aliahna today, my thoughts then went to my own children, and to my sweet little granddaughter(she is 2). She is just the happiest little girl, and my daughter and her boyfriend are just wonderful parents all around. This got me to musing on my daughters' boyfriend.

This young man is the nicest, most gentle-natured guy you could ever meet. He also is what he himself calls "slow", but I think most people would say learning disabled. He had to take special education classes in school, and you can definitley tell when you speak to him that there is something "different" about him. (I am not trying to be offensive to those with disabilities, learning or otherwise, I'm just not that great with wording things sometimes, my apologies) Anyways, my daughter really has to be on the ball a lot with him, as he has a hard time remembering things. If he goes to the store, she has to make a list of exactly what she wants, or if she needs to have him pick up my granddaughter at day care, she has to give him a slip of paper with the time written down on it when he is supposed to pick her up, etc. Things of that nature. Sometimes she really gets exasperated with him.

This young man has had a very hard life. I won't go into details, but things were very rough for him. Then when you add in the LD, he has had to struggle. BUT he is the most wonderful father. He really does cherish his daughter. If we go to the park, he keeps an eagle eye on her. He is very careful about everything he does with her, from what she eats to where she goes. He does not even like like to use a firm tone with her, as he doesn't want to "hurt her feelings, because she is just little".

Sometimes, I hear people making excuses for other about their poor parenting, as in "well, they had a hard life", or "they aren't very smart, so how are they supposed to know". But then I see my granddaughters father. He is the essence of loving and protecting your child. So I say, if HE can be like this, even though he is not "smart", then there is no excuse for anyone else.

Just wanted to tell that story. Sorry it is so long :)

Thanks were not enough. This guy might be "slow" but he is miles ahead of most of the parents I see.

I think a lot of people here have had a hard life and experienced some real horrors. I suspect that this is why most of us are here. I read the stories that some of our regular posters have shared with us, the pain and suffering and terror they have experienced, and I can only marvel at their courage while feeling grateful that they have chosen to share their perspective with us.

Anyway, thanks again.

Cubby
12-28-2011, 07:05 PM
I want to say thanks to PattyG also for your work on this. I looked at the newly reworded article. MP did have the case in Iowa for DV, however it appeared to be dismissed due to lack of evidence. If it was dismissed I would imagine that he would not have to register? However he doesn't seem to have any other DV charges that anyone was able to locate.


I had forgotten MP was in Iowa. Aliahna's previous abuse was in Iowa. Wondering if her previous abuser in IA was MP and he plead down?

Melanie
12-28-2011, 07:05 PM
It makes perfect sense to me. Small leaks lead to big leaks...such as COD, priors on MP...all kinds of things from the investigation.

But all that is gonna come anyway. All it takes is folks like us to sleuth like crazy on the main players. The Sherrif and FBI can tell people not to talk, but it's not a legal order. They can do so if they choose.

And to be quite honest, if my child was injured or worse by a perp, you couldn't keep my mouth shut. But that's just me.

Just my opinion.

Mel

Patty G
12-28-2011, 07:05 PM
The property managers have set up the Aliahna Lemmon Benefit Fund at Salin Bank. Donations are currently being accepted at all Salin Bank locations.

http://www.indianasnewscenter.com/news/local/Missing-Juvenile-136180558.html?awid=5442489726401957306-2855

not_my_kids
12-28-2011, 07:06 PM
These were an awesome find!
Out of abject curiousity, since it said he went to HG in Gastonia, NC...I went to their unsolved crimes page. I don't know when or how long he lived in Gastonia, or NC for that matter (on and off--and during which years)...but I had to share this...I get to an unsolved homicide of a police officer...and a "sketch" of the perp.

Okay...so the crime happened in 1996...but please check out the perp's sketch. I am not saying it is MP...or anything...but the crime is still unsolved....I can't imbed the sketch because I don't know how...

http://www.cityofgastonia.com/city_serv/police/investigation/PublicsHelpRequested.cfm


I don't think it is MP, as that guy was described as middle aged in 1996, and MP would have been 24/25 at that point in time. (I think, i suck at math.)

KinderedSpirits
12-28-2011, 07:09 PM
Here are some of the things my mind keeps coming back to.

When mom gave her little girls to her pedophile-father’s best friend, she did so knowing that they would be sleeping on the floor (or in his stained chair) rather than in their own beds at home. She knew that she was granting him power over her daughters. Authority. Not to be crass, but she knew that thirty feet away undressing her daughters and giving them their evening baths. Again, she KNEW that this guy, this potential pedophile, might be undressing the same daughter that was already suffering from post traumatic stress from abuse she had suffered the twice year before.

She knew, because any functioning and sane adult would, that it would be potentially horrifying to the girl.

And though they were only about thirty feet away, close enough that she might easily hear them crying or perhaps screaming through the thin walls of her trailer, she didn’t walk over and check on them. She'd given them to Mike.

They spent the night there on Tuesday, but she didn't check on them Wednesday morning or evening. She didn't stop by to ask if there were any problems, or to see what they had done, or to discover if they were properly taken care of, if they had taken a bath and been fed. None of that. Nor did she check on Thursday morning, when her daughter was murdered. Or Thursday evening, when her daughter's corpse was being dismembered. Only on Friday night, after three days of not seeing the babies she dropped off thirty feet away, did she bother to check.

That's not an innocent mistake or an oversight. Adding too much sugar to your spouse's coffee is a mistake. Spooning in a few scoops of rat poison is not. Mistakes: I forgot my keys, I ran a red light, I forgot to feed my cat. Not mistakes: robbing a store, giving your little girls away.

And let’s not forget the invisible man here. I am talking, of course, about dad. Did he not notice or care that his three angels were nowhere to be seen? Dad, who, if he asked where they were at all, apparently also did not care that the pedo's-buddy next door now owned his children. Who, during the hours every day between work and sleep, had no questions or concerns strong enough to drive him to walk thirty feet to check on these three little girls.

And we are to believe this? It is ridiculous.

Not because it is something that no responsible parent would do, that goes without saying, but because it is behavior with no rational explanation whatsoever. They have offered no plausible reason why this man was given their children. None. Their claim is that the girls -- and only the girls -- needed to sleep elsewhere so they wouldn’t disturb dad who worked at night. How’s that again? It doesn’t even make sense.

Except it does make sense once you abandon the notion that this was all some innocent mistake. I believe that the only mistake here was that their daughter ended up dead -- I believe THAT'S the part they didn't expect. I believe this is why they initially defended Mike and blamed their daughter. I believe that they thought she had run away or was hiding, and they were setting it up so people wouldn't believe whatever she might say when found.

Again, these are the things that we know or can reasonably deduce happened. The question is what conclusions we draw from it.

I believe it is entirely possible that we are looking at a bigger crime involving more people than we know about so far. I think it is entirely possible that the other girls were also victims, and that it is also possible that the parents knew it when they gave Mike their kids. As horrific and evil and impossible as this is to imagine, it is easier to believe than the story we are currently being asked to accept.

Just my opinion of course. If someone, like the parent's for example, has a better explanation I would very much like to hear it.

I wholeheartdly agree...thanks for taking the time to type my thoughts!!!
I would not be surprised if they were all involved in producing child porn. jMOO

believe09
12-28-2011, 07:09 PM
But all that is gonna come anyway. All it takes is folks like us to sleuth like crazy on the main players. The Sherrif and FBI can tell people not to talk, but it's not a legal order. They can do so if they choose.

And to be quite honest, if my child was injured or worse by a perp, you couldn't keep my mouth shut. But that's just me.

Just my opinion.

Mel

This would cause LE to cut you out of the investigation, unfortunately. If they cant trust you to give you briefs and not tip off perpetrators or potential suspects, they are going to shut you out.

For example-what if they were looking at a possible accomplice? And family ran to the media with that item?

krimekat
12-28-2011, 07:09 PM
Point taken. I edited my post accordingly. I'll just add, I'm thankful for the smiley list here. In particular this one: :cursing:

:floorlaugh: Cubby

We're all going to be using :cursing: :burn: :cursing: :hoppingmad: :cursing: :devil: :cursing: :steamed: :cursing: :deadhorse: :cursing: :rage: :shutup: :cursing:
:nerves: :hug: :grouphug:

before this is over . . . Thanks MODs, for keeping the threads "clean". I'd hate to think what Aliahna's siblings will read on the WWW someday day!

Dr.Fessel
12-28-2011, 07:10 PM
HAGERSTOWN, MD

HAGERSTOWN, MD - The nation has been following the tragic story of a missing nine-year-old Indiana girl who was found murdered and now her close friend in Hagerstown is coping with the loss.

On the first day of school at Winter Street Elementary, two little girls immediately became friends.

"We like to sing, we like to play guitar," says xxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxx, Aliahna's friend.

However, the friendship between the 9-year-old girls was cut short. When Aliahna Lemmon moved to Fort Wayne, Indiana the two kept in touch on Facebook and on the phone. That's when xxxxxxxxxx heard her friend had disappeared.

"Is she going to be okay? Is she going to be dead? Are they going to find her alive?" says Kymberley.

Tragically, those questions were soon answered when police discovered Aliahna's body.

http://your4state.com/fulltext/?nxd_id=228167

Chris_Texas
12-28-2011, 07:10 PM
We dont know this to be true, respectfully. Clearly, imo, she called to check on them. We know on Friday, at least, she did not speak to the girls. She only spoke with MP. We can imagine that MP may have intentionally misled her in that conversation because he knew Aliahna had not disappeared. He knew exactly where she was.

Right. We have no evidence that she did not call every day. We know she called Friday morning. We also know (I believe mom said this) that the last time she saw Aliahna was Tuesday afternoon, after school got out.

StephanieH
12-28-2011, 07:11 PM
I have a female cousin who was sexually abused by my grandfather AND her father. Her father also sold her to his friends. Her dad was prosecuted and spent time in prison for it. She went on to marry a nice man and have a daughter who was NOT sexually abused. Her brother, who was physically abused and witnessed the sexual abuse and prostitution of his sister, grew up to be an air traffic controller and married a woman who had three little girls. He is, by ALL accounts, a great dad to them. (They are all in college now). Yeah, you can't control the shakes you get as a child, but you CAN control what you do as an adult and a parent. My cousins WORKED at it...they got therapy and intervention and made damn sure they ended the cycle. So I am sorry that Tarah had a crappy childhood (and I am sure she did) Her childhood ended when she was entrusted with the soul of Ali and she was responsible to do everything in her power to protect her. The child was molested twice and killed by the time she was nine. I don't think she protected her very well.

believe09
12-28-2011, 07:11 PM
Chris, from your post:


They spent the night there on Tuesday, but she didn't check on them Wednesday morning or evening. She didn't stop by to ask if there were any problems, or to see what they had done, or to discover if they were properly taken care of, if they had taken a bath and been fed. None of that. Nor did she check on Thursday morning, when her daughter was murdered. Or Thursday evening, when her daughter's corpse was being dismembered. Only on Friday night, after three days of not seeing the babies she dropped off thirty feet away, did she bother to check.


How is this known? How do we know the girls didnt call her? How do we know step dad didnt stop by on his way to and from work?

krimekat
12-28-2011, 07:11 PM
They were told not to speak about the circumstances of Aliahna's death. Abuse occurring in an unrelated incident is different.

And I get why they want to control dissemination of info in this case related to Ali's murder. Charging documents have not yet been drawn up and their investigation continues. They don't need everything out front and center before they have pieced it all together.

:goodpost: yes! And then there is the trial . . .

akashana
12-28-2011, 07:12 PM
Kimb103, I am sorry for your experience and thankful you were able to break the cycle. I should have been more clear with my post stating I was using yours for a spring board.

I have considered where Tarah came from and what circumstances she may have came from. We each come to the table with our own circumstances.

What I fail to understand is how Tarah could knowingly and willingly have chosen to put her children in the same situation which she had previously knowing the repercussions and fear her children faced.

How does one look into the eyes of a child and see that kind of fear and KNOWINGLY place them in the same situation with different circumstances repeatedly?
We're talking about a woman who is too ill to care for her children, but can post updates about herself and her broken thumb on FB.

Why didn't CPS remove these children after the first incidents of abuse? and what measures were taken to reunify this family after at least once child suffered previous abuse not once, but twice?

JMO

MY BOLD

Beautiful post! This is exactly what I mean by T's apparent lack of reasonable boundaries. I think she herself was a victim of molestation at some point, if not by her RSO late father, then someone else. I've nothing to back this up, but it is my opinion that something like that could skew her perspective and make abuse/molestation something that just "happens sometime," i.e., that it's rather common in her world.

Ladylub
12-28-2011, 07:12 PM
I hate to be graphic, but if he had hit her in the head several times with a brick and her death resulted from that, that would be fairly obvious right? But the article states....

FORT WAYNE, Ind. (WANE) – After the external examination of Aliahna Maroney-Lemmon’s remains was completed by the Allen County Coroner's Office Wednesday afternoon, the cause of her death is still undetermined.


So WTH did he do to this child???????????

Maybe he thought the hit to the head killed her when it only knocked her out. They may also want to make sure that all test work come back that he did not drug her. No telling what caused her death. She was cut up and we do not know how bad he dismembered her. So Im sure they want to go over every single cut making sure that it was not what killed her.

hoppy
12-28-2011, 07:13 PM
The property managers have set up the Aliahna Lemmon Benefit Fund at Salin Bank. Donations are currently being accepted at all Salin Bank locations.

http://www.indianasnewscenter.com/news/local/Missing-Juvenile-136180558.html?awid=5442489726401957306-2855

Where is this money going? To WHOM is it going? All it says is that a 'benefit fund' has been set up ---- any other details out there?

not_my_kids
12-28-2011, 07:15 PM
Kimb103, I am sorry for your experience and thankful you were able to break the cycle. I should have been more clear with my post stating I was using yours for a spring board.

I have considered where Tarah came from and what circumstances she may have came from. We each come to the table with our own circumstances.

What I fail to understand is how Tarah could knowingly and willingly have chosen to put her children in the same situation which she had previously knowing the repercussions and fear her children faced.

How does one look into the eyes of a child and see that kind of fear and KNOWINGLY place them in the same situation with different circumstances repeatedly?

We're talking about a woman who is too ill to care for her children, but can post updates about herself and her broken thumb on FB.

Why didn't CPS remove these children after the first incidents of abuse? and what measures were taken to reunify this family after at least once child suffered previous abuse not once, but twice?

JMO

I thought the same thing, but then I took out all the assumptions, and simply read what was printed, as it was printed. That often helps me change my perspective.

I don't really know what happened the last time. It could have been a caregiver that abused her, it could have been someone at a school program, it could have been someone within the family, someone that was on a registry, someone that wasn't. The abuse itself could have been anything from emotional, to physical, to sexual. The perps could have abused her during the same incident, or seperately or they each could have abused her once, within the same short span of time, and in each case, they were both charged, one for the abuse, one for standing by and doing nothing.

CPS is supposed to get involved in cases where a child is in need of protection. If they did a preliminary investigation and found that the abuser was no longer able to access her, that she was fed and clothed, not being beaten, and recieving adequate mental and physical health care, that is where their responsibility ends.

A much as I want to crucify the mother, I am waiting for something more. And I have no doubt that there will be more, info will keep trickling out. This is far from over, IMO.