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View Full Version : Terri Schiavo-Death by Starvation


alpharee
10-21-2003, 11:27 PM
I've been very moved by this story. Thank God Gov. Bush intervened!I can't believe a judge would order her to death by starvation! This judge needs to be removed!

Terri Schiavo is a brain-damaged woman whose husband has petitioned the courts to end her life by removal of her feeding tube. Her husband argues that she is in a persistent vegetative state, though her parents have been told by 12 doctors that she can improve with proper therapy. Mr. Schiavo, Terri's husband, began withholding nutrition and hydration shortly after winning $1.2 million on her behalf in a medical malpractice lawsuit. He has his OWN motives for this! SELFISH and I think this is MURDER! Bast%$#~ I'm outraged!

Today, October 21, 2003, the Florida Legislature and House passed bill 35E - Terri's Bill - into law.

This law allowed Florida's Governor, Jeb Bush, to issue an Executive Order allowing nutrition and hydration to be returned to the disabled Florida woman.

Terri had been without nutrition and hydration for more than 6 days.

She has been transported to Morton Plant Hospital in Clearwater. And is to be receiving proper attention immediately.


The whole story can be read here.
The Terri Schiavo Story (http://www.terrisfight.org/lead.htm)

alpharee
10-22-2003, 09:54 AM
http://www.cnn.com/2003/LAW/10/21/coma.woman/index.html

Old Broad
10-22-2003, 12:12 PM
I agree that starvation is a terrible way to end a life, but I have to agree with the husband that she would never wish to live like this. I've seen to many sad situations where the quality of live is so poor that no one would ever choose it. IMO most people have no idea what it would be like to survive like this for one year, much less thirteen.
One day there may be a kinder way to carry out a persons wishes when there's no hope for a real recovery.

miimaa
10-22-2003, 12:48 PM
Yes, it sounds horrible. My grandmother had terminal cancer and she died this way. The doctors removed food and water because she was never going to improve and keeping her alive was only prolonging her suffering. She was kept on morphine and slept most of the time. She never asked for anything - just wanted to rest. It is a terrible situation for a family to be in. Sadly though, there are times when the end is a blessing but it's hard to watch.

alpharee
10-22-2003, 03:43 PM
I agree this isn't a way to live but NOTHING has been done to try to improve Terri. NO therapy even after many doctors testified that she can improve. Her husband has made staements he wishes she was dead and some of the nurses have testified they think he has tried to kill her in the past by insulin. Lowering her blood sugar. He makes rude comments about wishing she would hurry up and die. He won't let her parents see her or try and get her help. He tends to get her trust fund if she is dead and I think thats what this man is after. How do we know it was her wish not to be on life support of any kind? It's his word. That's it. She had no will.

From personal experience, I know she could improve. My grandfather was in this same situation and with 3 years of therapy he now walks, talks and enjoys life. he's not the same as before his accident no but he's come a long ways. He can hold a conversation with you, play games, watch tv and understand anything you say. He can walk with assistance of a walker and has come a long way. They said he would always be a vegatable but he proved them all wrong. How do we know this couldn't happen with Terri unless she gets the treatments that she so deserves.
I still say the husband is after the $$$$$$. He doesn't care what Terri wants or he would have put her in some kind of therapy by now. It's been 10 years with nothing. He already has a new family with children. So why doesn't he just divorce Terri and let her family look after her? Because he wants that $$$$$!!

bluehawaii25
10-22-2003, 07:25 PM
I am in agreement with Alpharee. I have been to Terri's website and read all the info both pro/cons. I saw her dad/sister on two cable news shows a couple of nights ago describing how the family thinks it is even possible Terri is in this horrible state because of abuse from her husband. Medical records show they think it is possible he attempted to strangle her. He wants her dead, period, as soon as possible so she can never recover and name him as the culprit. He collected all that money in the medical malpractice suit and never even attempted to put her into rehabilitation to try to get her some help. Many doctors have testified for her parents that they think Terri would benefit from intensive rehab. It is very obvious to me that he wants her dead so he can collect the remaining money and finally marry his long-standing girlfriend. The media fails to report most of these facts and just states that the husband says that his wife told him she never wanted to be kept alive artificially. With NO living will this is just his word and nothing to back it up. I wish her husband would turn over custody to the parents and let them get Terri the help she needs. Unfortunately, I think the legal wrangling is just beginning. I feel Jeb Bush did the right thing!

alpharee
10-22-2003, 07:51 PM
Originally posted by bluehawaii25
I am in agreement with Alpharee. I have been to Terri's website and read all the info both pro/cons. I saw her dad/sister on two cable news shows a couple of nights ago describing how the family thinks it is even possible Terri is in this horrible state because of abuse from her husband. Medical records show they think it is possible he attempted to strangle her. He wants her dead, period, as soon as possible so she can never recover and name him as the culprit. He collected all that money in the medical malpractice suit and never even attempted to put her into rehabilitation to try to get her some help. Many doctors have testified for her parents that they think Terri would benefit from intensive rehab. It is very obvious to me that he wants her dead so he can collect the remaining money and finally marry his long-standing girlfriend. The media fails to report most of these facts and just states that the husband says that his wife told him she never wanted to be kept alive artificially. With NO living will this is just his word and nothing to back it up. I wish her husband would turn over custody to the parents and let them get Terri the help she needs. Unfortunately, I think the legal wrangling is just beginning. I feel Jeb Bush did the right thing!
You're right on the money bluehawaii25! From what I've read the family has been fighting this for 10 years. The husband states he has no life with Terri alive, the family says then divorce Terri and move on. That's exactly what he should do. But why won't he? because if he does that, he'll lose the $$$$$. From all I've read he treats her like CRAP! This coming from testimony of nurses, etc. He doesn't care about her, he wants the money and I thank God for Gov. Bush for coming to her aid. I hope that after all is done the family gets guardianship so Terri can get the right treatments she deserves.

alpharee
10-22-2003, 09:02 PM
I didn't know they had a thread in the Jury Room. More discussion there:

http://207.36.4.219/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1545

fifi
10-22-2003, 09:38 PM
This story is absolutely tragic...this woman could perhaps have come on immensely had she been allowed therapy. Her 'husband', in my opinion, is the cause of the whole thing. She had issues with her weight and was bulimic (her heart stopped due to a lack of potassium through persistent vomiting) and he liked to criticize her appearance at every opportunity....I never thought I would hear myself praising a member of the Bush family....

Old Broad
10-24-2003, 07:01 AM
What kind of improvement could anyone expect from someone who has been brain dead for 13 years?
This case has made it's way through the legal system for the last 10 years. IMO if the husband was guilty of all these things he never would have been able to remain the person to be calling the shots. As much as the parents have tried to stop things, they would have gotten guardianship a long time ago.

Money or no money, I feel for this shell of a woman who now has to endure her vegetative life because her parents won't see she lost her life years ago.

I do think this will get more people talking and discussing with their family about what their wishes would be, but I doubt that many will actually do the paperwork, because everyone wants to think it won't ever happen in their family. Sad thing is, it happens in families every day.

BirdieBoo
10-25-2003, 11:50 PM
She is NOT brain dead, I have seen videos of her behavior, and she is NOT brain dead for sure. I would like to recommend a book I think everyone should read called "the Diving Bell & The Butterfly"
which was written by a man who fluttered ot the entire book by fluttering his eyelash... the only muscle he could move.

alpharee
10-27-2003, 01:12 PM
Old Broad, I totally disagree w/you. She is NOT brain dead, she is NOT on life support she is ON food and water! She needs help to eat that is all! SO lets kill all the babies because they can't eat on their own! And yes she could LEARN but this crap of a husband she has won't let her have therapy. I KNOW she can improve. My grandfather 15 years ago was in accident. he was in exact same shape she is and he can walk, talk, eat, play games and have conversations, he's not 100% like he was but he enjoys life and we enjoy him

Casshew
10-27-2003, 01:25 PM
Her husband is on Larry King tonight 9:00pm EST

Cass...

Jeana (DP)
10-27-2003, 04:46 PM
I hope that everyone reading this considers signing a living will of their own - just in case something like this happens to you or yours!!

bluehawaii25
10-28-2003, 12:15 AM
Watched Larry King tonight with Michael Schiavo and attorney. Everything seemed so "scripted" to me. Just looking at the man makes my skin crawl. I think he is lying through his teeth about Terri. He says he is not going to get anymore money out of the trust and he is just doing this because he loves his wife and this is what she wanted. I don't believe that for a second. He obviously has a hatred towards her father with whom he hasn't spoken to in 10 years. I don't believe him that it was the father who wanted all the money from the malpractice settlement. I think Michael is in this completely for the money. From anything I have read in this case it sure doesn't sound to me like Michael has been providing her with any of this therapy he was talking about tonight. From listening to his attorney it doesn't sound like any of this is going to be ending anytime soon!

Old Broad
10-28-2003, 04:20 AM
I belive the husband. He has had to be in court so many times defending his actions so yes, what he said has been said over and over again.
I seriously doubt his lawyer would be on this show with him and saying things that are not true.
They had the things there to back up what was said such as the tests, exrays etc.

I particulary found it moving when he spoke of how the father said he would have limbs of her's cut off in order to keep her alive at all costs.

If what this husband was wanting to do was have her dead, I'm sure there could have been many many ways he could have done something to make that happen.
I was happy to see him also address so many of the false statements coming from the parents such as him choking her. There is no sign of this ever happening, there was no bruising on her throat etc.

I wish I knew how many people just in this country have made a living will

Maxi
10-28-2003, 10:52 AM
I cannot reconcile the image of the husband's lawyer and armed police stopping the priest from giving Terri a last communion with a loving husband.

This whole situation is sad and needs to stop. If Terri is really in a permanent vegetative state (a terrible label for a human!), she is not suffering. If she is not in that extreme state, then he could give reahb a try. If that goes against his principles, he could turn her guardianship (and the money) over to her parents. Since Terri had no living will, he is only guessing as to her wishes. He should let someone else who loves her guess for a while.

Old Broad
10-28-2003, 02:12 PM
The reason he won't "turn her over" to her parents is because of the father telling him to what extremes he'd go to for her to stay "alive" such as cutting off all her limbs if needed.
He knew because she said that she would not want to stay like this, that to her being in this condition is not a life worth living.

They brought up the example of people who on their own when suffering from cancer etc, who just on their own stop eating. No one force feeds them! They are ready to let go and they do so.
I wish we had someone here with experience at a hospice.

As for her never having therapy, that is not true. She had therapy, she also had speach therapy. Why do people want to believe everything that comes from the parents camp? It's not what their daughter wanted, to exist like this, it's the parents wanting. Does this mean that no matter what our wishes, someone else can come along and change it?

Jeana (DP)
10-28-2003, 04:25 PM
My mother had hospice care when she was almost at the end of her life due to cancer. They were wonderful and I still to this day make sure that a very large donation goes there way from me. What this case is about is money. The court/state needs to step in here and remove anyone with access to her money to be refrained from making any decisions whatsoever with regard to this woman - now! About a million dollars was awarded due to neglectful medical care about her eating disorder that was the cause of this state and they both want it. If the husband and the parents would just say that they remove themselves from any portion of the proceeds from that money, then I'd feel better about both of them.

alpharee
10-28-2003, 10:01 PM
Originally posted by Old Broad
The reason he won't "turn her over" to her parents is because of the father telling him to what extremes he'd go to for her to stay "alive" such as cutting off all her limbs if needed.
He knew because she said that she would not want to stay like this, that to her being in this condition is not a life worth living.

They brought up the example of people who on their own when suffering from cancer etc, who just on their own stop eating. No one force feeds them! They are ready to let go and they do so.
I wish we had someone here with experience at a hospice.

As for her never having therapy, that is not true. She had therapy, she also had speach therapy. Why do people want to believe everything that comes from the parents camp? It's not what their daughter wanted, to exist like this, it's the parents wanting. Does this mean that no matter what our wishes, someone else can come along and change it?

How do you know she didn't wanna live like this? Did she tell you?
all you have is the WORD of as husband whom in my opinion don't give a crap about her........NO one really knows what she would have wanted because there was no will. It's his word only.
I agree with DP. I think this money should be stripped from both....the husband nor the parents should get it. Have it where a 3rd party is in control of it and when she dies.....donate it to a charity...a good cause

CarolinaGirl
10-29-2003, 02:32 AM
My comments are not about this woman's domestic situation with her husband and parents. My comments are strictly regarding the feeding tube death issue ...

My mom died this way. She had terminal lung cancer. Four months after finding out about the cancer, she fell and broke her hip. She went into the hospital at this time and never returned home.

She had a feeding tube and the last week of her life, the doctors talked to us about removing her feeding tube. My sister, who was a nurse at the time, did not feel comfortable with that option at all. She said she had witnessed many situations where a family had removed a feeding tube. She said that the patient starves to death and it takes days, sometimes up to a week or more!

We didn't have to make the decision, thankfully. My mom made it for us. The next morning, when we got there, they told us she had thrashed around in the middle of the night and her hand caught the feeding tube. She pulled it out herself!

She took four days to die this way. It was hard watching it happen. I totally believe in human euthanasia, after experiencing this. I just don't agree with removing a feeding tube and allowing a person to die of starvation. If I were terminally ill and my last days were going to be death by starvation, I would much rather receive a lethal injection and end it quickly and painlessly.

ajt400
10-30-2003, 08:34 PM
This is unsually tragic and sad because of the method of death. I have seen videos of Terri, too, and she didn't look the way I expected her too after I had just heard about the case. She was smiling, looked like she was somewhat aware of what was going on around her. And now, who knows what she could be like with doctors saying she would be responsive to rehabilitation.

One would think if the husband really was being honest about his intentions and if he really loved his wife he would try to make it as easy as he possibly could. At least more humane, less painful.

:boohoo:

Old Broad
11-03-2003, 09:55 PM
The husband was not the only one who gave testimony about her wishes of not being kept alive, there were 3 people who heard her and testified.
There is not a large amount of money left, it has been spent throughout the years for her care so there is not a huge dollar amount for the husband to get.

IMO I think there are so many stories about people killing their spouse etc that we've become jaded, always thinking it has to be evil and suspicious.

ajt400
11-04-2003, 12:50 PM
Just wondering, about the money...

After 12 years of medical care, how much mone could he possibly get?

Amraann
11-05-2003, 12:04 PM
Being that over 1 million was just recently awarded to him I wonder if much of that jackpot was even used for Terri?
Possibly she had insurance or medicare coverage?
We are assuming the money was eaten up by medical bills but I really wonder how true that is.

I agree that starvation is a disgusting way to die and I to have seen video of Terri and dispute just how "brain dead" she is.
She does appear to be reactive to those around her.

I fail to see what harm it would come if Terri was permitted therapy?
The husband is saying he is doing this because the father will go to any lengths to keep Terri alive.
If it were my child I don't know if my actions would be to different.
I don't care if the father did say he would let Terri lose limbs to save her life... that has not become an issue yet so I don't understand why the husmand is fighting it.
IF that were an issue maybe then the fight would have some validity.
The husband can divorce her and probably some of the settlement was for his emotional distress so he can take that and go.
Why he insists of fighting only shows that this has become a battle of wills between the parents and him not about Terri.
And long ago stopped being about her. Its just those to families trying to prove the other wrong.

Jeana (DP)
11-05-2003, 12:13 PM
CarolinaGirl, I completely agree. I think it should be legal and it should be utilized. However, I think that it should only be done in cases where a living will has been signed and that it has been expressly stated in that living will.

alpharee
11-05-2003, 01:36 PM
Originally posted by Amraann
Being that over 1 million was just recently awarded to him I wonder if much of that jackpot was even used for Terri?
Possibly she had insurance or medicare coverage?
We are assuming the money was eaten up by medical bills but I really wonder how true that is.

I agree that starvation is a disgusting way to die and I to have seen video of Terri and dispute just how "brain dead" she is.
She does appear to be reactive to those around her.

I fail to see what harm it would come if Terri was permitted therapy?
The husband is saying he is doing this because the father will go to any lengths to keep Terri alive.
If it were my child I don't know if my actions would be to different.
I don't care if the father did say he would let Terri lose limbs to save her life... that has not become an issue yet so I don't understand why the husmand is fighting it.
IF that were an issue maybe then the fight would have some validity.
The husband can divorce her and probably some of the settlement was for his emotional distress so he can take that and go.
Why he insists of fighting only shows that this has become a battle of wills between the parents and him not about Terri.
And long ago stopped being about her. Its just those to families trying to prove the other wrong.
According to Terri's site. the husband has spent over 500K on lawyer fees fighting her parents to have her killed. (that came from Terri's trustfund)
The husband did receive a settlement from the courts for $300K for his mental anguish, etc when he sued and Terri was 1Millon. So he got $300K and she got 1 Mil. They say she only has $350K left. He has spent $500K on lawyers.

blueclouds
12-02-2003, 08:47 PM
This doesn't sound good. Guardian doesn't think Terri will improve


http://abcnews.go.com/wire/US/reuters20031202_555.html

blueclouds
12-05-2003, 11:23 PM
more info, parents ask to join defense with state

http://abcnews.go.com/wire/US/ap20031205_1972.html