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SoSueMe
05-18-2012, 11:30 AM
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Gerard Bayden-Clay has been arrested and charged with the murder of Allison Bayden-Clay


Thread 1

Thread 2 (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=170913&page=46)
Thread 3 (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=171159&page=18)
Thread 4

Thread 5

Thread 6

Thread 7

Thread 8

Thread 9

Thread 10

Thread 11

Thread 12

Thread 13

Thread 14 (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=173624&page=37)
Thread 15

Thread 16

Thread 17

Thread 18

Thread 19

Thread 20

Thread 21 (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=8045871&posted=1#post8045871)
Thread 22

Thread 23

Thread 24

Thread 25

Thread 26

Thread 27

Thread 28

Thread 29

Thread 30

Thread 31 ( http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=177738)
Thread 32


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Kimster
05-22-2012, 10:05 AM
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Kimster
05-27-2012, 11:26 AM
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06-17-2012, 10:10 AM
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summer_breeze
07-08-2012, 05:10 PM
Allison Baden-Clay of Australia - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community



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jubillee
07-11-2012, 07:49 AM
:rocker:First

Rational
07-11-2012, 07:50 AM
First

Damn!!! Congratulations!!!:floorlaugh:

Blacklodge
07-11-2012, 08:11 AM
Third!

Timmy
07-11-2012, 08:13 AM
You big kids!

Bayside
07-11-2012, 08:15 AM
Today, 06:26 PM
Anemone
Registered User
*
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anemone
Correct, Bayside, I used to live in Boscombe Road.
Actually Bayside, I've just looked at google maps and it's number 57 Boscombe Road, it's right next to the church, the first on the right as you go up Boscombe Road. I used to walk there a lot years ago and don't remember the numbers. But it shares the back fence with the BC house.
__________________


All of this is MOO.


It says 61 on the letterbox

Timmy
07-11-2012, 08:18 AM
Hi Bayside
July 9 is 'done and dusted' and still the same tag line!

minni
07-11-2012, 08:22 AM
Hello blacklodge :D

minni
07-11-2012, 08:34 AM
Where is greggie?

linette
07-11-2012, 08:49 AM
Where is greggie?

I was wondering that, too??

possumheart
07-11-2012, 09:06 AM
:goodnight:

Makara
07-11-2012, 09:12 AM
:goodnight:

Night Possum, sweet dreams.

Timmy
07-11-2012, 09:18 AM
Time to hit the sack! Night all!

linette
07-11-2012, 09:20 AM
Time to hit the sack! Night all!

Same here... night! :)

summer_breeze
07-11-2012, 09:24 AM
Please take the avatar conversations to the Chit Chat and Banter thread!

Thank you!

Chit Chat and Banter - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

Woof
07-11-2012, 09:44 AM
How can we quote from a closed thread and bring it in here to continue? I wanted to comment on a couple of things.

Woof
07-11-2012, 09:47 AM
Anyway, this little doggie is here to confirm that yes, TM drives a Lexus, not a BMW.

And no, there's no way a church would bankroll BGC's defence, without a special meeting and a vote by members.

I think that was it.

summer_breeze
07-11-2012, 09:50 AM
How can we quote from a closed thread and bring it in here to continue? I wanted to comment on a couple of things.

Woof, if you click on the post number, right next to the alert button, this will bring up the URL (link) to the post. You can include the URL (link) in your post, then copy/paste from there.

summer_breeze
07-11-2012, 10:31 AM
As an additional reminder, please do not post about court proceedings, etc that are not public information. There is probably a reason the information is not public, and we need to respect this.

Especially with regard to the children and their welfare.

Thank you for understanding!
~Summer_Breeze

Bobbie Elliott
07-11-2012, 10:51 AM
Hello fellow insomniacs. The internet has done wonders for insomnia. Instead of tossing and turning, I reframe the situation and say to myself "Oh goody, more time to play on the internet!

Firesnake
07-11-2012, 11:39 AM
Morning Everyone..

For those that are interested there is an article on Allison in this weeks Woman's Day...
It is on page 38...
The title is Remembering Allison Baden-Clay. Don't let my friend's death be in vain...
It is a interview with a school friend...
It is more in relation to the Wear It Today For Allison on July 16 not info on the case...
And some beautiful memories of a wonderful friend and mother...
A lovely article I thought...

Mods.. Woman's Day is a weekly magazine published in Australia.. I dont have a link so hope this was ok to post..
All IMO

Blacklodge
07-11-2012, 03:23 PM
Hi Minni :)

Jaguar88
07-11-2012, 05:30 PM
Morning Everyone..

For those that are interested there is an article on Allison in this weeks Woman's Day...
It is on page 38...
The title is Remembering Allison Baden-Clay. Don't let my friend's death be in vain...
It is a interview with a school friend...
It is more in relation to the Wear It Today For Allison on July 16 not info on the case...
And some beautiful memories of a wonderful friend and mother...
A lovely article I thought...

Mods.. Woman's Day is a weekly magazine published in Australia.. I dont have a link so hope this was ok to post..
All IMO

There's also an article in Who, July 16 edition - page 13, 'A Town Rallies'. About the cricket match and upcoming golf day on 5th August

RumourSquasher
07-11-2012, 05:42 PM
Good morning all. Hey Ferris, only just got to see the image posted by you of Truter house and saw you had also identified the location back in thread 4 and again in thread 11. Thank you for posting that image and confirming the location. Agree with you, that most likely unrelated, could have come from teens walking down Rafting towards Moggill Rd heading for the bus stop. Not easy walking along that stretch but I have seen lots do it and wearing dark clothes making it dangerous.

Edited to say: maybe more likely teens having got off bus and walking home up Rafting given that it was Thursday late night shopping and older teens seem to like hanging out at the shops. Makes more sense than mid week party in my mind.

Maigret
07-11-2012, 06:15 PM
I'm behind here what is 'the wear it for Allison' day about? please :) it's ok found it - lovely idea but I always wear my new clothes :)

DrWatson
07-11-2012, 06:51 PM
Good morning all. Hey Ferris, only just got to see the image posted by you of Truter house and saw you had also identified the location back in thread 4 and again in thread 11. Thank you for posting that image and confirming the location. Agree with you, that most likely unrelated, could have come from teens walking down Rafting towards Moggill Rd heading for the bus stop. Not easy walking along that stretch but I have seen lots do it and wearing dark clothes making it dangerous.

Edited to say: maybe more likely teens having got off bus and walking home up Rafting given that it was Thursday late night shopping and older teens seem to like hanging out at the shops. Makes more sense than mid week party in my mind.

Morning troops :)

That all makes a lot of sense, especially being a Thursday night, as you say - late night shopping etc.

But in that case, I'm even more puzzled as to why the police had the "Hot Zone" centred down on Rees Way and Creekside Park.... they must have published that for a reason, but I'm not aware of anything else that would have pointed them to that area....

Busy day in the surgical world today, so I'll be checking in from time to time, but replying when I'm able, and only if I have something worthwhile to contribute.

Maigret
07-11-2012, 06:54 PM
Morning troops :)

That all makes a lot of sense, especially being a Thursday night, as you say - late night shopping etc.

But in that case, I'm even more puzzled as to why the police had the "Hot Zone" centred down on Rees Way and Creekside Park.... they must have published that for a reason, but I'm not aware of anything else that would have pointed them to that area....

Busy day in the surgical world today, so I'll be checking in from time to time, but replying when I'm able, and only if I have something worthwhile to contribute.

I thought the 'Hot Zone' had to do with where GBC said she went walking and also where her phone was narrowed to - I so hope they did find her phone

DrWatson
07-11-2012, 07:21 PM
I thought the 'Hot Zone' had to do with where GBC said she went walking and also where her phone was narrowed to - I so hope they did find her phone

No - they haven't found her phone as far as I know. Also, the phone signal before the battery died was always reported as triangulating somewhere in an area ranging from Pullenvale to Kenmore - an area way bigger than I thought was likely. My iPhone can locate me to within a couple of metres, even indoors with no satellite access.

Of course, they would have been locating the phone "from the other side", as it were - not using the phone's location abilities. Just triangulating the phone's signal. But even so, I have always been surprised that the area was so large.

Later, well after Allison was found, I seem to recall that they said a much narrowed down search area for her phone was within a 150m radius of their house. Which was also a puzzle (maybe they used GBC's "Find My iPhone" app to locate it??). And as I said - I'm pretty sure they still have not found it. I'm sure that if they did, it would give up a LOT of secrets......

LauraMars
07-11-2012, 07:27 PM
I wouldn't be surprised if the police have found the phone, and just haven't told the public. The police certainly stopped asking for people to keep an eye out for it, and mentions of the ongoing phone search stopped.

If it was within 150m of the house I'm sure they would have found it, and if it was hidden around there, another thing which doesn't look so good for GBC.

marlywings
07-11-2012, 07:40 PM
I wouldn't be surprised if the police have found the phone, and just haven't told the public. The police certainly stopped asking for people to keep an eye out for it, and mentions of the ongoing phone search stopped.

If it was within 150m of the house I'm sure they would have found it, and if it was hidden around there, another thing which doesn't look so good for GBC.

This was one of the last reports about the phone...

May 01, 2012

•Police are hopeful of finding her mobile phone after narrowing the location of the key missing item to an area spanning 150m

....& this following gives hope that police did find it....

As the Kholo Creek crews worked, fresh search teams were sent to scour the gardens of the Baden-Clays' two nearest neighbours looking for Allison's mobile phone.

It is understood search crews were told the iPhone would be found in an area believed to be near the two neighbours and the Baden-Clay property itself.

http://www.news.com.au/national/hope-turns-to-heartbreak-for-allison-baden-clays-family-after-body-found-at-kholo-creek/story-e6frfkvr-1226343535002

Liadan
07-11-2012, 07:43 PM
I agree LM - even if the QPS don't have her phone, which I think they are keeping this secret close to their chest. I would think the details from iCloud are pretty telling and her texts and emails would be accessbile from the server. I doubt they would have delayed putting that into motion from the moment she was reported missing.

I reckon they are being just as dilligent with immediate family phones as well. That is why things are taking a bit longer.

Not surprised that TM drives a Lexus, GBC probably did the wheeling and dealing with the same salesperson after he lost his. GBC had to get his fix of the Lexus how very very predictable. BTW Woof how did you get to confirm this tad of interesting info-does this mean she is back out of hiding?

squizzey1
07-11-2012, 07:50 PM
I agree LM - even if the QPS don't have her phone, which I think they are keeping this secret close to their chest. I would think the details from iCloud are pretty telling and her texts and emails would be accessbile from the server. I doubt they would have delayed putting that into motion from the moment she was reported missing.

I reckon they are being just as dilligent with immediate family phones as well. That is why things are taking a bit longer.

Not surprised that TM drives a Lexus, GBC probably did the wheeling and dealing with the same salesperson after he lost his. GBC had to get his fix of the Lexus how very very predictable. BTW Woof how did you get to confirm this tad of interesting info-does this mean she is back out of hiding?
i thought GBC had a lexus and sold it . i thought someone said that TM now has that car

Liadan
07-11-2012, 07:55 PM
Squizzey - wow so you think that TM bought GBC's Lexus off him?

That is EVEN more suspect - poor Allison!!!!

squizzey1
07-11-2012, 07:58 PM
Squizzey - wow so you think that TM bought GBC's Lexus off him?

That is EVEN more suspect - poor Allison!!!!
i am sure that was stated very clearly ages ago

Mountain Misst
07-11-2012, 07:59 PM
i thought GBC had a lexus and sold it . i thought someone said that TM now has that car

Is that part of a debt re-payment perhaps.

LauraMars
07-11-2012, 07:59 PM
i thought GBC had a lexus and sold it . i thought someone said that TM now has that car

squizzey I joked once that maybe TM bought his lexus, when I heard she had one, but it was just that, a joke.

Of course it's possible, but I don't even know if he ever actually owned his lexus, or if it was a lease car.

MOO

possumheart
07-11-2012, 07:59 PM
I wonder if TM and GBC used to meet here and take advantage of the facilities: Gymnasium, Parisian Arcade, Lexus Lounge and Boardroom ...
http://www.lexusofbrisbane.com.au/page/Find_your_Dealership/Lexus_of_Brisbane_-_Indooroopilly/ ???

LauraMars
07-11-2012, 08:01 PM
I agree LM - even if the QPS don't have her phone, which I think they are keeping this secret close to their chest. I would think the details from iCloud are pretty telling and her texts and emails would be accessbile from the server. I doubt they would have delayed putting that into motion from the moment she was reported missing.

I reckon they are being just as dilligent with immediate family phones as well. That is why things are taking a bit longer.

Not surprised that TM drives a Lexus, GBC probably did the wheeling and dealing with the same salesperson after he lost his. GBC had to get his fix of the Lexus how very very predictable. BTW Woof how did you get to confirm this tad of interesting info-does this mean she is back out of hiding?

What info are you referring to Liadan, in your last question to Woof? I think I have missed a few pages somewhere, sorry.

bearbear
07-11-2012, 08:11 PM
im wondering if police found allisons phone and that is some of the forensic info they are waiting for, they could have sent her phone away if it was damaged, for testing etc?

squizzey1
07-11-2012, 08:11 PM
squizzey I joked once that maybe TM bought his lexus, when I heard she had one, but it was just that, a joke.

Of course it's possible, but I don't even know if he ever actually owned his lexus, or if it was a lease car.

MOO
thanks LM but i thought someone with authority said that and i am sure he had the lexus before the captiva. my grandchildren were at school with the girls and their parents told me that the prado was ABC's and she nearly always drove it.

LauraMars
07-11-2012, 08:17 PM
Oh ok squizzey thanks, and yes I think he definitely had a lexus before the latter lease car.

squizzey1
07-11-2012, 08:25 PM
Oh ok squizzey thanks, and yes I think he definitely had a lexus before the latter lease car.
still wondereing whose car he pranged at Indro. did posters see that it was auctioned and brought some silly small amount something like 3 grand i think antway not much

Maigret
07-11-2012, 09:15 PM
im wondering if police found allisons phone and that is some of the forensic info they are waiting for, they could have sent her phone away if it was damaged, for testing etc?

good point lets hope so :)

Liadan
07-11-2012, 09:25 PM
Anyway, this little doggie is here to confirm that yes, TM drives a Lexus, not a BMW.

And no, there's no way a church would bankroll BGC's defence, without a special meeting and a vote by members.

I think that was it.


LM What info are you referring to Liadan, in your last question to Woof? I think I have missed a few pages somewhere, sorry.

I don't think you did miss any pages LM but I just thought from that quote above that Woof may have seen TM out and about in Brizzy again.

RumourSquasher
07-11-2012, 09:30 PM
Thought I had better clear this up real quick. TM did NOT buy GBC Lexus, she had hers ages ago and possibly before he did. Also IMO she was not in a position to be lending him money either.

DrWatson, re hot zone. I though it was something to do with phone triangulation but it is weird that the house is not actually in the hot zone. I know police were checking road side drains around the creek crossing there (was pictured in a CM report). Maybe they had other info that decided the zones. I believe they had a specific radius to search as regulation but still does not explain hot zone location.

Maigret
07-11-2012, 09:41 PM
LM What info are you referring to Liadan, in your last question to Woof? I think I have missed a few pages somewhere, sorry.

I don't think you did miss any pages LM but I just thought from that quote above that Woof may have seen TM out and about in Brizzy again.

Maybe once they locked GBC up and denied bail she would have felt as though she could come back, she would need to be working somewhere

squizzey1
07-11-2012, 09:44 PM
Thought I had better clear this up real quick. TM did NOT buy GBC Lexus, she had hers ages ago and possibly before he did. Also IMO she was not in a position to be lending him money either.

DrWatson, re hot zone. I though it was something to do with phone triangulation but it is weird that the house is not actually in the hot zone. I know police were checking road side drains around the creek crossing there (was pictured in a CM report). Maybe they had other info that decided the zones. I believe they had a specific radius to search as regulation but still does not explain hot zone location.
thanks for that it definately was mentioned yonks ago so that is clear now. but re tm lending him money didnt that come out in the finances that cops gave the court or was it just "busines acquantances " i was always under the imprssion { rightly or wrongly } that she lent him 190 or 200 grand and wondered where she would get that from, even though lightning jack said$290,000 is not a lot of money these days ????????

squizzey1
07-11-2012, 09:51 PM
Maybe once they locked GBC up and denied bail she would have felt as though she could come back, she would need to be working somewhere
particularly if she was only GBC mistress and had nothing to do either before or after the fact then she probably deserves a fair go. not that i condone for one minute the affair

Maigret
07-11-2012, 09:58 PM
particularly if she was only GBC mistress and had nothing to do either before or after the fact then she probably deserves a fair go. not that i condone for one minute the affair

me neither - but she does have a family to support

RumourSquasher
07-11-2012, 10:15 PM
thanks for that it definately was mentioned yonks ago so that is clear now. but re tm lending him money didnt that come out in the finances that cops gave the court or was it just "busines acquantances " i was always under the imprssion { rightly or wrongly } that she lent him 190 or 200 grand and wondered where she would get that from, even though lightning jack said$290,000 is not a lot of money these days ????????

Hi Squizzey, I only know what was in court docs from reports in MSM. There was $90k and $200k mentioned but neither was to TM - the names quoted were ex-business partners and IMO should be free of any suspicion of involvement. The 'gentleman's agreements' which from memory was stated as $275k have not been publicly itemised to my knowledge. From what I have heard on local grapevine those agreements were with three male friends who were asked to invest in the business. This is therefore heresay and as I have no idea who these individuals could be and do not like to speculate will leave it at that. Cheers.

squizzey1
07-11-2012, 10:29 PM
Hi Squizzey, I only know what was in court docs from reports in MSM. There was $90k and $200k mentioned but neither was to TM - the names quoted were ex-business partners and IMO should be free of any suspicion of involvement. The 'gentleman's agreements' which from memory was stated as $275k have not been publicly itemised to my knowledge. From what I have heard on local grapevine those agreements were with three male friends who were asked to invest in the business. This is therefore heresay and as I have no idea who these individuals could be and do not like to speculate will leave it at that. Cheers.
thanks for that spose we will find out one day. hey the good doc must be doing a heart transplant he's been off so long ha ha

Fuskier
07-11-2012, 10:35 PM
...

DrWatson, re hot zone. I though it was something to do with phone triangulation but it is weird that the house is not actually in the hot zone. I know police were checking road side drains around the creek crossing there (was pictured in a CM report). Maybe they had other info that decided the zones. I believe they had a specific radius to search as regulation but still does not explain hot zone location.

Just a quick contribution: Throughout the threads it has been alleged that the two cars (the smaller 4wd followed by the white larger 4wd) were spotted by different witnesses in 3 separate locations that night - along the Kholo Creek over a four hour period. Together with the triangulation of the phone - may have determined the search zone? My opinion only.

Gemini Girl
07-11-2012, 10:46 PM
thanks for that spose we will find out one day. hey the good doc must be doing a heart transplant he's been off so long ha ha

In that case, I hope he's not a little bit distracted by sluething thoughts!! lol

Kruger
07-11-2012, 11:07 PM
anyone have a link to or a copy of the waltons money begging email?

thanks in advance

Woof
07-11-2012, 11:15 PM
anyone have a link to or a copy of the waltons money begging email?

thanks in advance

The Facebook page Justice for ABC had a copy of it.

squizzey1
07-11-2012, 11:16 PM
anyone have a link to or a copy of the waltons money begging email?

thanks in advance
no sorry. marlywings could if she was on she is brilliant

McCoy
07-11-2012, 11:47 PM
Hi everyone,

This is my first post but I have been following all the discussion for quite a while and feel I know you well. I am a local (Brookfield) and feel very strongly about the case.

There seems to be a conflict between intent and action in Gerard wanting Allison to be found for insurance purposes, but supposedly hiding her in bushland where she wouldn’t be found (but luckily was due to the heavy rain).

My suggestion based on the personalities
1. Gerard intentionally does the deed as semi-planned, then realises it is harder to move Allison/work out what to do than he thought, rings NBC "Dad, dad, help we had an argument and I accidentally killed her!"
3. NBC rushes to help, takes over, and suggests the bushland where he thinks she won't be found
4. GBC goes along with this as he doesn’t want to tell NBC it was intentional even though he now realises she may not be found in a hurry and he may not cash in on insurance in a hurry.
2. When Allison is found due to rain he is semi-relieved as now he can ring insurance company and claim without telling his Father it was intentional.

Apparently psychopaths (it has been suggested on this forum that certain people resemble this mental state) are great at a big grandiose plan but forget about the small details or follow on plans (sounds like my boss actually).

It’s great to feel I am offiicial, I was looking around at the Cricket Day wondering which of you were from WS.

Gemini Girl
07-11-2012, 11:57 PM
Hi everyone,

This is my first post but I have been following all the discussion for quite a while and feel I know you well. I am a local (Brookfield) and feel very strongly about the case.

There seems to be a conflict between intent and action in Gerard wanting Allison to be found for insurance purposes, but supposedly hiding her in bushland where she wouldn’t be found (but luckily was due to the heavy rain).

My suggestion based on the personalities
1. Gerard intentionally does the deed as semi-planned, then realises it is harder to move Allison/work out what to do than he thought, rings NBC "Dad, dad, help we had an argument and I accidentally killed her!"
3. NBC rushes to help, takes over, and suggests the bushland where he thinks she won't be found
4. GBC goes along with this as he doesn’t want to tell NBC it was intentional even though he now realises she may not be found in a hurry and he may not cash in on insurance in a hurry.
2. When Allison is found due to rain he is semi-relieved as now he can ring insurance company and claim without telling his Father it was intentional.

Apparently psychopaths (it has been suggested on this forum that certain people resemble this mental state) are great at a big grandiose plan but forget about the small details or follow on plans (sounds like my boss actually).

It’s great to feel I am offiicial, I was looking around at the Cricket Day wondering which of you were from WS.


Welcome McCoy!

your hypothesis sounds plausible to me, though others do as well :dunno:

Just wondering, do you know any of the POI's personally, since you say you are a local?

Understand if you don't want to say.

JMO MOO

McCoy
07-12-2012, 12:05 AM
Have been at Happy Hour at Showground at same time as ABC and GBC (and observed behaviour) but never officially met them

DunnoZo
07-12-2012, 12:06 AM
anyone have a link to or a copy of the waltons money begging email?

thanks in advance
I found part, hope it helps. Thread 24, p/41 #1010

squizzey1
07-12-2012, 12:08 AM
Have been at Happy Hour at Showground at same time as ABC and GBC (and observed behaviour) but never officially met them
what do you mean behavior. they say he is a half smart up himself SOB. any comments

possumheart
07-12-2012, 12:11 AM
:welcome: McCoy.

McCoy
07-12-2012, 12:19 AM
Tried to be charming and charasmatic but IMO sleazy and shallow

Makara
07-12-2012, 12:19 AM
anyone have a link to or a copy of the waltons money begging email?

thanks in advance

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - ARREST!!! Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 -#24

Makara
07-12-2012, 12:26 AM
Have been at Happy Hour at Showground at same time as ABC and GBC (and observed behaviour) but never officially met them

Welcome McCoy. The happy hour at the showground has been mentioned in the Courier Mail and GBC was apparently known at Burger Man. :floorlaugh: Did he really cook burgers? :what: What was Allison's demeanor at these happy hour get-together's? Did she seem happy?

squizzey1
07-12-2012, 12:28 AM
Tried to be charming and charasmatic but IMO sleazy and shallow
thats what i was told too. did they look and behave like a normal couple

squizzey1
07-12-2012, 12:30 AM
Tried to be charming and charasmatic but IMO sleazy and shallow
is that from a males view or females view. i have been told that mainly by men

possumheart
07-12-2012, 12:33 AM
is that from a males view or females view. i have been told that mainly by men

I must admit my partner felt the same way, and he is a man.

Bayside
07-12-2012, 12:39 AM
The Facebook page Justice for ABC had a copy of it.

I think it would be a safe bet to say they have everything copied from here and aussiecrims lol.

jojo85
07-12-2012, 12:40 AM
I wouldn't be surprised if the police have found the phone, and just haven't told the public. The police certainly stopped asking for people to keep an eye out for it, and mentions of the ongoing phone search stopped.

If it was within 150m of the house I'm sure they would have found it, and if it was hidden around there, another thing which doesn't look so good for GBC.

Interestingly, there is a bush area opposite the church in Boscombe Rd that has been poisoned by council or sub-contractors in recent weeks. Workers have gradually started clearing the dead lantana (there's LOADS of it). HAve been wondering if police are hopeful of the iphone being found in there? It's not far from the house. But it's quite a long process to clear it all seeing it is a very dense bush area.

marlywings
07-12-2012, 12:42 AM
I deleted my post with pics of that email...made me feel sick looking at it so it's gone to the bin where it belongs...lol.

Curiousasacat
07-12-2012, 12:43 AM
OT

Fergie, I am so pleased you came back to posting. Not sure if I already said how disappointed I was with what happened to your daughter. I was really upset for you about that!

Thanks for coming back and answering re the driveway, I look forward to your future input as a local. ***Hugs***

McCoy
07-12-2012, 12:43 AM
I must admit my partner felt the same way, and he is a man.
I'm a female but not taken in by pseudocharmers

Bayside
07-12-2012, 12:46 AM
Hi everyone,

This is my first post but I have been following all the discussion for quite a while and feel I know you well. I am a local (Brookfield) and feel very strongly about the case.

There seems to be a conflict between intent and action in Gerard wanting Allison to be found for insurance purposes, but supposedly hiding her in bushland where she wouldn’t be found (but luckily was due to the heavy rain).

My suggestion based on the personalities
1. Gerard intentionally does the deed as semi-planned, then realises it is harder to move Allison/work out what to do than he thought, rings NBC "Dad, dad, help we had an argument and I accidentally killed her!"
3. NBC rushes to help, takes over, and suggests the bushland where he thinks she won't be found
4. GBC goes along with this as he doesn’t want to tell NBC it was intentional even though he now realises she may not be found in a hurry and he may not cash in on insurance in a hurry.
2. When Allison is found due to rain he is semi-relieved as now he can ring insurance company and claim without telling his Father it was intentional.

Apparently psychopaths (it has been suggested on this forum that certain people resemble this mental state) are great at a big grandiose plan but forget about the small details or follow on plans (sounds like my boss actually).

It’s great to feel I am offiicial, I was looking around at the Cricket Day wondering which of you were from WS.

Hi MCoy, welcome........ I think along the same lines as you do.

McCoy
07-12-2012, 12:47 AM
Welcome McCoy. The happy hour at the showground has been mentioned in the Courier Mail and GBC was apparently known at Burger Man. :floorlaugh: Did he really cook burgers? :what: What was Allison's demeanor at these happy hour get-together's? Did she seem happy?
I only noticed Allison as one of the Mums chatting, she always seemed friendly and pleasant, as none of this had happened then I wasn't really observing them closely, but yes he did cook on the BBQ sometimes and his manner annoyed me.

Gemini Girl
07-12-2012, 12:49 AM
Anyway, this little doggie is here to confirm that yes, TM drives a Lexus, not a BMW.

And no, there's no way a church would bankroll BGC's defence, without a special meeting and a vote by members.

I think that was it.

Woof, I have wondered more than once what the hierarchy of the Churches of Christ (with which I am not at all familiar BTW) feel about the Cranna's donation to GBC's possible bail and or defence.

Suspect they (like any church in such a situation) would not be at all happy about their organisation appearing to be giving tacit approval to such a donation.

There again, they cannot control the individual choices of members, and nor should they be able to.

Sorry, think I'm going in circles here folks!!

:shush:

At least I'm not talking to BP's picture about it!

JMO MOO

Bayside
07-12-2012, 12:50 AM
OT

Fergie, I am so pleased you came back to posting. Not sure if I already said how disappointed I was with what happened to your daughter. I was really upset for you about that!

Thanks for coming back and answering re the driveway, I look forward to your future input as a local. ***Hugs***

I am glad you mentioned this as I wanted to go back to the other thread and copy it and say the same but its to hard on the ipad.

It was such a nice gesture to put that sign and flowers on the fence. I cant believe anyone could take it as a bad intention. Dont worry some people will always say something negative for the hell of it.

Tell you daughter thanks and tell her to come back and say hi and let us thank her in person so to speak haha.

J-Diggety
07-12-2012, 12:51 AM
anyone have a link to or a copy of the waltons money begging email?

thanks in advance

How much di you need?

To: Our family and friends
From: Ian and Olivia Walton
Subject: PLEASE HELP

To our dear friends and family

Our extended family around the world and those of our friends folowing the news in AU will know the heartbreaking news that our sister-in-law Allison went missing on Arpril 20th and her body was found 11 days later. Last Wednesday, 13th June, my brother Gerard was arrested and charged with her murder. We completely support Gerard in his innocence and are unwavering in continuing to stand with him.

We have been led to believe that there are two key legal events between now and any trial that may commence.

1. This coming Thursday 21st June, Gerard will appear for a bail hearing. At this hearing there will be a determination as to whether or not he is able to be released from prison until such time as the trial begins – which we understand could be several years away.

2. In the next several months there will be a committal hearing. At this hearing, it will be determined on the ‘balance of probablilities’ whether there is any likelihood that Gerard may have committed this offence. If they feel this to be the case it will be referred to the Supreme Court, with a trial at a date to be determined (again, this could be several years away). I it is felt on this balance of probabilities that there is not sufficient evidence we underrstand that he will be released and the charges against him will be dropped.

We have been told by Gerard’s lawyer that he requires AU $30,000 by no later than this coming Wednesday evening, 20th June, or the bail hearing will not occur.

Mani
07-12-2012, 12:53 AM
Squizzey - wow so you think that TM bought GBC's Lexus off him?

That is EVEN more suspect - poor Allison!!!!

Crikey, if those Lexus wheel arches could talk..............IMO

Pass the Luminol please...........

marlywings
07-12-2012, 12:54 AM
Interestingly, there is a bush area opposite the church in Boscombe Rd that has been poisoned by council or sub-contractors in recent weeks. Workers have gradually started clearing the dead lantana (there's LOADS of it). HAve been wondering if police are hopeful of the iphone being found in there? It's not far from the house. But it's quite a long process to clear it all seeing it is a very dense bush area.

Is it the area to the left of the church in this pic jojo??

24421

Bayside
07-12-2012, 12:54 AM
I think the police have the phone.IMO

It would be great if it was found but I dont think it will be. I think that is one thing that Gerard made sure of destroying real good.

marlywings
07-12-2012, 01:00 AM
It would be great if it was found but I dont think it will be. I think that is one thing that Gerard made sure of destroying real good.

Hmmm I'm not so sure....it seems he thought throwing Allison away would be the end of her & she'd never be found??

Nads
07-12-2012, 01:01 AM
Tried to be charming and charasmatic but IMO sleazy and shallow

Seems you have an intact BS metre. Lots of people don't!

Nads
07-12-2012, 01:03 AM
I deleted my post with pics of that email...made me feel sick looking at it so it's gone to the bin where it belongs...lol.

I just deleted off my ipad pics last night and I don't know how to retrieve from an ipad trash!

angel1
07-12-2012, 01:04 AM
anyone have a link to or a copy of the waltons money begging email?

thanks in advance

I still have the email saved to my computer because a relative of mine wanted it. He hasn't got a computer so i had to save it so i could print it out and post it to him. I will put it on here in a minute

Nads
07-12-2012, 01:09 AM
How much di you need?


"We completely support Gerard in his innocence."

To me, the wording of that has always seemed to me like they actually know he's not innocent. When people lie, I've heard they don't like to actually say the words, they skirt around it.

If I knew my brother was innocent I'd be likely to say

"We know that Gerard is innocent and fully support him".

IMO

Nads
07-12-2012, 01:10 AM
It would be great if it was found but I dont think it will be. I think that is one thing that Gerard made sure of destroying real good.

Wonder if it was smashed into smithereens?

possumheart
07-12-2012, 01:12 AM
Wonder if it was smashed into smithereens?

It's hurt just a little bit

marlywings
07-12-2012, 01:13 AM
I thought the 'Hot Zone' had to do with where GBC said she went walking and also where her phone was narrowed to - I so hope they did find her phone

Yes I think that "hot zone" was probably set up around the different routes GBC had told family & friends...

June 23, 2012

That morning police claim he would give four different stories to friends and family about a walk Allison could have taken when she disappeared.

To some, officers say, he said Allison liked to take a walk early in the morning. To his sister, Olivia Walton, he allegedly described a particular route. He told a close friend of Allison's that she would walk at 10pm each night and he described to Allison's parents two different walking routes.

But when police asked, they said he told them he had no idea where she would have gone walking.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/queensland/gerard-baden-clay-conducting-ongoing-affair-at-time-of-wife-allisons-death-was-in-debt-and-had-inquired-about-her-life-insurance-police-affidavits-lodged-in-court-claim/story-e6freoof-1226405967381

jojo85
07-12-2012, 01:14 AM
Is it the area to the left of the church in this pic jojo??

24421

Yes, that's it - I think it's part of the pony club. That bush area on the left of Boscombe Rd to the first driveway is what I'm talking about.

Bayside
07-12-2012, 01:23 AM
I deleted my post with pics of that email...made me feel sick looking at it so it's gone to the bin where it belongs...lol.

Awwwww come on, they need the donations how will we all know where to send them lolol.

squizzey1
07-12-2012, 01:26 AM
Awwwww come on, they need the donations how will we all know where to send them lolol.

yeah right. on the basis of nans age and her parents what are you going to do for the next 60 years lol

Bayside
07-12-2012, 01:28 AM
Wonder if it was smashed into smithereens?

I think it would be, and thrown in the water just to make sure it is useless.

I havent heard anything from my contacts about it ever being found.

Daisyinthedesert
07-12-2012, 01:31 AM
In that case, I hope he's not a little bit distracted by sluething thoughts!! lol

He could always tell his patient "You'll be fine, you're only a little bit hurt"!

Makara
07-12-2012, 01:31 AM
It's hurt just a little bit

24423

:floorlaugh: :floorlaugh:

Bayside
07-12-2012, 01:37 AM
"We completely support Gerard in his innocence."

To me, the wording of that has always seemed to me like they actually know he's not innocent. When people lie, I've heard they don't like to actually say the words, they skirt around it.

If I knew my brother was innocent I'd be likely to say

"We know that Gerard is innocent and fully support him".

IMO

Exactly and you would think they would mention finding the real killer etc.

Anemone
07-12-2012, 01:40 AM
I think it would be, and thrown in the water just to make sure it is useless.

I havent heard anything from my contacts about it ever being found.

It's possible with an iPhone, to just remove the sim card. That's a whole lot easier to dispose of than the phone itself, IMO. For all we know, one of the BC family could be using the phone right now. I know it's possible to obtain data from the ISP though. I'm hoping he wasn't that smart and the the QPS have the phone (and sim card.)

Bayside
07-12-2012, 01:51 AM
yeah right. on the basis of nans age and her parents what are you going to do for the next 60 years lol

I think your quotes are screwing up Squiz lol

Walk A Mile
07-12-2012, 02:00 AM
It's possible with an iPhone, to just remove the sim card. That's a whole lot easier to dispose of than the phone itself, IMO. For all we know, one of the BC family could be using the phone right now. I know it's possible to obtain data from the ISP though. I'm hoping he wasn't that smart and the the QPS have the phone (and sim card.)

Removing the sim card won't change the IMEI number.

Nads
07-12-2012, 02:02 AM
I think your quotes are screwing up Squiz lol

Somehow from the chat thread?

Bayside
07-12-2012, 02:06 AM
It's possible with an iPhone, to just remove the sim card. That's a whole lot easier to dispose of than the phone itself, IMO. For all we know, one of the BC family could be using the phone right now. I know it's possible to obtain data from the ISP though. I'm hoping he wasn't that smart and the the QPS have the phone (and sim card.)

The phone still stores text messages and photos etc without the sim.

Firesnake
07-12-2012, 02:08 AM
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/nation/allison-baden-clay-murdered-after-row-over-affair-supreme-court-told-in-bail-hearing/story-e6frg6nf-1226405470286

In regards to the discussion regarding the screams heard on that Thursday night..

This is from the above link

Police allege that the blood of Mrs Baden-Clay was found in the boot of her husband's car and this was consistent with their belief that she had been killed in their Brookfield home, in Brisbane's west, before her body was dumped in a creek about 14km away.

This is from the bail application hearing..

After reading this it appears to me that the police are saying that she was murdered at home.

Why would they present this to the court if the murder happened elsewhere?

It also makes sense because the house was declared a crime scene.. If no crime was committed there why would it have been declared a crime scene

IMO the screams are not relevant to the case..

This is my opinion only

Makara
07-12-2012, 02:15 AM
I saw this post over at aussiecriminals site. I'm sure it was also posted here. Has anyone else read this before? If this is in fact true, why would Nigelaine be sitting at the corner of Westridge Street and Rafting Ground Road at 8:30am and staring into the distance? There doesn't seem to be much on either side of the road. I wonder if they may have been looking for a mobile phone?

MOO.

http://aussiecriminals.com.au/2012/06/29/gerard-baden-clay-how-does-the-puzzle-look-on-means/comment-page-2/

Sasha said it: July 2, 2012 at 5:34 pm: “Spotted the Bwanna car on rafting ground road this morning corner of Westridge St Brookfield parked at 8.30 am with Mr and Mrs Bwanna looking a bit bemused and staring into the distance. It seemed bit strange to me?”

BBM.

24424

Mani
07-12-2012, 02:15 AM
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/nation/allison-baden-clay-murdered-after-row-over-affair-supreme-court-told-in-bail-hearing/story-e6frg6nf-1226405470286

In regards to the discussion regarding the screams heard on that Thursday night..

This is from the above link

Police allege that the blood of Mrs Baden-Clay was found in the boot of her husband's car and this was consistent with their belief that she had been killed in their Brookfield home, in Brisbane's west, before her body was dumped in a creek about 14km away.

This is from the bail application hearing..

After reading this it appears to me that the police are saying that she was murdered at home.

Why would they present this to the court if the murder happened elsewhere?

It also makes sense because the house was declared a crime scene.. If no crime was committed there why would it have been declared a crime scene

IMO the screams are not relevant to the case..

This is my opinion only

Nice bit of linking there I notice FS - :woohoo: Yippy ki yay :)

minni
07-12-2012, 02:15 AM
It's hurt just a little bit

Possum, you freeze framed that screen shot to the absolute funniest and perfect spot...he looks so ridiculous and untruthful! :floorlaugh:

I heard a lady on tv today say something like....'the voice is the (print?) to the soul and the soul does not accept anything but the truth - so in listening to a person's voice, you get their intent, and their guilt or innocence'

Well I dont know if thats true or not, but I don't think there is a man, woman or dog ;) on this forum (or possum for that matter) who didnt hear his whiny bullcrap tone, and know the truth, deep down. Even the ones like myself, who tried so hard to disprove it

minni
07-12-2012, 02:19 AM
Possumheart, I cant believe I forgot to mention the funniest thing of all: the phone (just a little bit hurt) and the caterpillar (getting ready to hurt GBC...just a little bit)
:rocker:

Bayside
07-12-2012, 02:20 AM
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/nation/allison-baden-clay-murdered-after-row-over-affair-supreme-court-told-in-bail-hearing/story-e6frg6nf-1226405470286

In regards to the discussion regarding the screams heard on that Thursday night..

This is from the above link

Police allege that the blood of Mrs Baden-Clay was found in the boot of her husband's car and this was consistent with their belief that she had been killed in their Brookfield home, in Brisbane's west, before her body was dumped in a creek about 14km away.

This is from the bail application hearing..

After reading this it appears to me that the police are saying that she was murdered at home.

Why would they present this to the court if the murder happened elsewhere?

It also makes sense because the house was declared a crime scene.. If no crime was committed there why would it have been declared a crime scene

IMO the screams are not relevant to the case..

This is my opinion only

I have to agree with you on this thanks.

ActusReus
07-12-2012, 02:25 AM
I saw this post over at aussiecriminals site. I'm sure it was also posted here. Has anyone else read this before? If this is in fact true, why would Nigelaine be sitting at the corner of Westridge Street and Rafting Ground Road at 8:30am and staring into the distance? There doesn't seem to be much on either side of the road. I wonder if they may have been looking for a mobile phone?

MOO.

http://aussiecriminals.com.au/2012/06/29/gerard-baden-clay-how-does-the-puzzle-look-on-means/comment-page-2/

Sasha said it: July 2, 2012 at 5:34 pm: “Spotted the Bwanna car on rafting ground road this morning corner of Westridge St Brookfield parked at 8.30 am with Mr and Mrs Bwanna looking a bit bemused and staring into the distance. It seemed bit strange to me?”

BBM.

24424

That's odd?

marlywings
07-12-2012, 02:26 AM
Awwwww come on, they need the donations how will we all know where to send them lolol.

Ok ok ok.................:smile:

24425

YoureNicked
07-12-2012, 02:32 AM
I saw this post over at aussiecriminals site. I'm sure it was also posted here. Has anyone else read this before? If this is in fact true, why would Nigelaine be sitting at the corner of Westridge Street and Rafting Ground Road at 8:30am and staring into the distance? There doesn't seem to be much on either side of the road. I wonder if they may have been looking for a mobile phone?

MOO.

http://aussiecriminals.com.au/2012/06/29/gerard-baden-clay-how-does-the-puzzle-look-on-means/comment-page-2/

Sasha said it: July 2, 2012 at 5:34 pm: “Spotted the Bwanna car on rafting ground road this morning corner of Westridge St Brookfield parked at 8.30 am with Mr and Mrs Bwanna looking a bit bemused and staring into the distance. It seemed bit strange to me?”

BBM.

24424

Thanks for posting, Makara. Maybe they just needed to get out of the (likely bugged) house for a while and be away from lots of people? Perhaps the bemused expressions were because they had had some unwelcome news or because they are shell-shocked by their current situation?

Who knows but it's interesting news, nonetheless.

Mani
07-12-2012, 02:32 AM
It's hurt just a little bit

OMG :floorlaugh:

Firesnake
07-12-2012, 02:33 AM
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - ARREST!!! Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 - #22

I have also been thinking about GBC saying Allison was watching the footy show when he went to bed at 10pm. I know just one of a few versions..

In the above post it mentions that the show stared late that night and I have since read elsewhere cant find at the moment that this was the reason QPS wanted programming schedules for that night..

I wonder what time the footy show did start that night?

IMO

Liadan
07-12-2012, 02:33 AM
It's hurt just a little bit


Is that Really really really his phone????or a clever photo shop ?

marlywings
07-12-2012, 02:36 AM
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - ARREST!!! Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 - #22 (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8048211&postcount=621)

I have also been thinking about GBC saying Allison was watching the footy show when he went to bed at 10pm. I know just one of a few versions..

In the above post it mentions that the show stared late that night and I have since read elsewhere cant find at the moment that this was the reason QPS wanted programming schedules for that night..

I wonder what time the footy show did start that night?

IMO

Another member way back found the time on Facebook...10.10pm it started that Thursday night....it's usual start time is 9.30pm although frequently starts later.

marlywings
07-12-2012, 02:38 AM
I saw this post over at aussiecriminals site. I'm sure it was also posted here. Has anyone else read this before? If this is in fact true, why would Nigelaine be sitting at the corner of Westridge Street and Rafting Ground Road at 8:30am and staring into the distance? There doesn't seem to be much on either side of the road. I wonder if they may have been looking for a mobile phone?

MOO.

http://aussiecriminals.com.au/2012/06/29/gerard-baden-clay-how-does-the-puzzle-look-on-means/comment-page-2/

Sasha said it: July 2, 2012 at 5:34 pm: “Spotted the Bwanna car on rafting ground road this morning corner of Westridge St Brookfield parked at 8.30 am with Mr and Mrs Bwanna looking a bit bemused and staring into the distance. It seemed bit strange to me?”

BBM.

24424

I think one thing it does say is even if the house is bugged, no matter where they go they're being watched.

minni
07-12-2012, 02:38 AM
Late Allison Baden Clay Childrens Appeal.........oh the audacity of these people.

Why don't they at least be honest for once and call it what it is:

Gerard Baden Clays last hoorah at scamming money out of people and juicing them for all they are worth...under false pretenses appeal

:notgood:

linette
07-12-2012, 02:40 AM
Exactly and you would think they would mention finding the real killer etc.

That is exactly what I've always thought is missing from this... if they really don't think he is guilty why aren't they out there DEMANDING the focus go elsewhere. I know that's what I'd be doing... going to the papers, anywhere there's someone who'd listen to me. I'd be stresed because nobody was listening. Instead life goes on for them. Not the sign of a family who believes their son is innocent.
But we know why they're not.. because there ISN"T anyone else... it's him, and they know it. IMO
Right from the beginning this stood out like you know what to me... they can't even pretend. Geez!!!

Nads
07-12-2012, 02:42 AM
Possum, you freeze framed that screen shot to the absolute funniest and perfect spot...he looks so ridiculous and untruthful! :floorlaugh:

I heard a lady on tv today say something like....'the voice is the (print?) to the soul and the soul does not accept anything but the truth - so in listening to a person's voice, you get their intent, and their guilt or innocence'

Well I dont know if thats true or not, but I don't think there is a man, woman or dog ;) on this forum (or possum for that matter) who didnt hear his whiny bullcrap tone, and know the truth, deep down. Even the ones like myself, who tried so hard to disprove it

This morning I called in sick and made sure I didn't sound like that!

Nads
07-12-2012, 02:43 AM
Late Allison Baden Clay Childrens Appeal.........oh the audacity of these people.

Why don't they at least be honest for once and call it what it is:

Gerard Baden Clays last hoorah at scamming money out of people and juicing them for all they are worth...under false pretenses appeal

:notgood:

What??

Mani
07-12-2012, 02:43 AM
Bumping Fergie's post of 30/5 :bump:

We agree with most of the websleuthers that this was a troubled marriage and GBC was increasingly finding himself in financial strife, seeking self satisfaction out of the marriage as he needed to be in a relationship where he could maintain a positive view of himself and the world rather than spending time with his wife who had come to know the real GBC. Facing financial and reputational ruin combined with ABC wanting to go her own way after finding out that the affair that she thought was over was still on there was an argument that night. GBC has lost it, killed her in the house in a DV situation ie not premeditated and he then called NBC to assist with the disposal of the body thus the investigation of cars through the Brookfield roundabout as 1 matching NBCs car was seen on CCTV but the number plate was not visible so they are trying to identify it by calling for witnesses and by a process of elimination.

We think the key to the murder of Allison was GBC needing to keep the marriage together because he could not afford financially to go through a separation and divorce. We think that Allison tried to save the marriage but realising just before that night that she could not save the marriage and that he was still having an affair she told him that the marriage was over and asked him to leave as she wanted a divorce. ABC and GBC may have been living apart based on the local rumors that they were and GBC was seen with TM out and about however we think if that is true then she had got to the point where she wanted a divorce and to move on with her life and her career as she was confident that she could succeed without him as she had many times before. The reports from a local hairdresser that she was in good spirits may reflect that she had made a decision to move on with her life without GBC and she was happy with that decision not that they were planning to have a romantic evening alone. We think Allison orchestrated this evening with a visit the hairdresser, a new look to look and be her best so she could say to GBC with confidence and dignity that she was moving on, I don't need you and On Your Bike Mate. Until then she may have tried to make it work and GBC may have thought that because she loved him and wanted to stay with him that she would tolerate his bad behaviors and failures or it was a marriage of mutual financial convenience until that evening.

We think a detective attended the house when Allison was reported missing and spoke to GBC and based on GBCs behavior and responses they had cause for suspicion and created a crime scene and investigation into her disappearance immediately. We agree with a previous poster that 2 cars were used to dispose of Allison's body as they knew enough not to want to mix up the DNA and they also knew the area well enough to know there was a risk of 1 vehicle getting bogged if they had to go off road and the 2nd vehicle would be available to pull the other 1 out if this did happen. GBC was probably also a wreck and needed NBC with him to manage the potential panic factor.

This is all our opinion only (OOO) however an opinion based on life and professional experience.

I think Fergie has made some good points here and I have felt for a long time that 2 cars are involved.

Bayside
07-12-2012, 02:47 AM
I saw this post over at aussiecriminals site. I'm sure it was also posted here. Has anyone else read this before? If this is in fact true, why would Nigelaine be sitting at the corner of Westridge Street and Rafting Ground Road at 8:30am and staring into the distance? There doesn't seem to be much on either side of the road. I wonder if they may have been looking for a mobile phone?

MOO.

http://aussiecriminals.com.au/2012/06/29/gerard-baden-clay-how-does-the-puzzle-look-on-means/comment-page-2/

Sasha said it: July 2, 2012 at 5:34 pm: “Spotted the Bwanna car on rafting ground road this morning corner of Westridge St Brookfield parked at 8.30 am with Mr and Mrs Bwanna looking a bit bemused and staring into the distance. It seemed bit strange to me?”

BBM.

24424

No never read it before, could be many reasons they were there.

minni
07-12-2012, 02:47 AM
Thanks for posting, Makara. Maybe they just needed to get out of the (likely bugged) house for a while and be away from lots of people? Perhaps the bemused expressions were because they had had some unwelcome news or because they are shell-shocked by their current situation?

Who knows but it's interesting news, nonetheless.

now that would be good, if they scooted off down the road so they wouldn't incriminate themselves by talking where they might be bugged, and the car was bugged too.
I sometimes wonder whether they do actually have what they need on NBC, and are biding their time? They had a fair bit on GBC and waited for the right moment, so maybe they are using the same tactic? I bet GBC was starting to think they had nothing on him, yet they knew all along

Gemini Girl
07-12-2012, 02:48 AM
Late Allison Baden Clay Childrens Appeal.........oh the audacity of these people.

Why don't they at least be honest for once and call it what it is:

Gerard Baden Clays last hoorah at scamming money out of people and juicing them for all they are worth...under false pretenses appeal

:notgood:

Sorry, I'm confused. Are there now two appeals with the same (almost) name??

:waitasec:

minni
07-12-2012, 02:49 AM
Is that Really really really his phone????or a clever photo shop ?

no, but its really really really the guilty caterpillar!!

Bayside
07-12-2012, 02:50 AM
Late Allison Baden Clay Childrens Appeal.........oh the audacity of these people.

Why don't they at least be honest for once and call it what it is:

Gerard Baden Clays last hoorah at scamming money out of people and juicing them for all they are worth...under false pretenses appeal

:notgood:

Is that what they have written now OMG

minni
07-12-2012, 02:53 AM
Okay everyone, i must have got confused. I just read Marly's screen shot of what I thought was the Waltons slimy email asking for money. They called it Late Allison Baden Clay Childrens Appeal.

I think I misunderstood. Was that the fund for the children?
Sorry if I got it wrong. I was HORRIFIED when I read it, and thought it was the email asking for money...can someone tell me which is which now that I have confused everyone?

frustrated detective
07-12-2012, 02:53 AM
Does anyone have the link to the original interview with GBC and Olivia?

minni
07-12-2012, 02:54 AM
Okay everyone, i must have got confused. I just read Marly's screen shot of what I thought was the Waltons slimy email asking for money. They called it Late Allison Baden Clay Childrens Appeal.

I think I misunderstood. Was that the fund for the children?
Sorry if I got it wrong. I was HORRIFIED when I read it, and thought it was the email asking for money...can someone tell me which is which now that I have confused everyone?

Mountain Misst
07-12-2012, 02:54 AM
Thanks for posting, Makara. Maybe they just needed to get out of the (likely bugged) house for a while and be away from lots of people? Perhaps the bemused expressions were because they had had some unwelcome news or because they are shell-shocked by their current situation?

Who knows but it's interesting news, nonetheless.

Hope QPS got to bug the car as well.

YoureNicked
07-12-2012, 02:55 AM
Late Allison Baden Clay Childrens Appeal.........oh the audacity of these people.

Why don't they at least be honest for once and call it what it is:

Gerard Baden Clays last hoorah at scamming money out of people and juicing them for all they are worth...under false pretenses appeal

:notgood:

Minni are you confusing the appeal being run by the Dickies for the children, with the appeal run by the Waltons for Gerard?

Edit: Ignore this post. I see Minni has already answered.

J-Diggety
07-12-2012, 02:55 AM
It's possible with an iPhone, to just remove the sim card. That's a whole lot easier to dispose of than the phone itself, IMO. For all we know, one of the BC family could be using the phone right now. I know it's possible to obtain data from the ISP though. I'm hoping he wasn't that smart and the the QPS have the phone (and sim card.)

A sim only carries the users id.

the IMEI and other identifying features of the phone are available to the telco and apple (iPhone) whenever it is turned on. Hence why you can remote wipe your phone if you think it has been stolen, or track it without a sim.

marlywings
07-12-2012, 02:58 AM
Okay everyone, i must have got confused. I just read Marly's screen shot of what I thought was the Waltons slimy email asking for money. They called it Late Allison Baden Clay Childrens Appeal.

I think I misunderstood. Was that the fund for the children?
Sorry if I got it wrong. I was HORRIFIED when I read it, and thought it was the email asking for money...can someone tell me which is which now that I have confused everyone?


Around second or third page I posted a photo of the OW email...it made me sick looking at it so I deleted my post with that photo in it...then I fiddled in photoshop with it...deleted the original details & added in the children's fund details instead....nawt of me but oh well...lol.

minni
07-12-2012, 02:58 AM
Minni are you confusing the appeal being run by the Dickies for the children, with the appeal run by the Waltons for Gerard?

Edit: Ignore this post. I see Minni has already answered.

Thanks YN...I was nearly vomiting onto the computer screen when I read it!!!!...just another episode of me not thinking before I post....Im hopeless

Gemini Girl
07-12-2012, 02:59 AM
Okay everyone, i must have got confused. I just read Marly's screen shot of what I thought was the Waltons slimy email asking for money. They called it Late Allison Baden Clay Childrens Appeal.

I think I misunderstood. Was that the fund for the children?
Sorry if I got it wrong. I was HORRIFIED when I read it, and thought it was the email asking for money...can someone tell me which is which now that I have confused everyone?

Hi Minni, Marly has had a byline (if that's the correct term) referring to the children's appeal set up by the Dickie family, at the bottom of her posts for some time.

I guess you saw the pic of the Walton's email, sent by Marly, and then the message down below about the valid appeal for the children, and put two and two together and came up with five, so to speak.

Easily enough done lol

Hugs:heart:

minni
07-12-2012, 03:00 AM
Around second or third page I posted a photo of the OW email...it made me sick looking at it so I deleted my post with that photo in it...then I fiddled in photoshop with it...deleted the original details & added in the children's fund details instead....nawt of me but oh well...lol.


aaaaaahhhhhh well that explains the bank details being the same as your signature! I better start counting to ten before I type haha :blushing:

Onlyone
07-12-2012, 03:00 AM
That is exactly what I've always thought is missing from this... if they really don't think he is guilty why aren't they out there DEMANDING the focus go elsewhere. I know that's what I'd be doing... going to the papers, anywhere there's someone who'd listen to me. I'd be stresed because nobody was listening. Instead life goes on for them. Not the sign of a family who believes their son is innocent.
But we know why they're not.. because there ISN"T anyone else... it's him, and they know it. IMO
Right from the beginning this stood out like you know what to me... they can't even pretend. Geez!!!

That's exactly it!
Couldn't put my finger on why I thought they were bizarre & you have absolutely just hit it on the head.

Bayside
07-12-2012, 03:20 AM
Hope QPS got to bug the car as well.

Shhhhhh they might be dumb enough to think it is safe to talk in their car lol

Bayside
07-12-2012, 03:24 AM
Hi Minni, Marly has had a byline (if that's the correct term) referring to the children's appeal set up by the Dickie family, at the bottom of her posts for some time.

I guess you saw the pic of the Walton's email, sent by Marly, and then the message down below about the valid appeal for the children, and put two and two together and came up with five, so to speak.

Easily enough done lol

Hugs:heart:

That makes sense haha

Bayside
07-12-2012, 03:27 AM
now that would be good, if they scooted off down the road so they wouldn't incriminate themselves by talking where they might be bugged, and the car was bugged too.
I sometimes wonder whether they do actually have what they need on NBC, and are biding their time? They had a fair bit on GBC and waited for the right moment, so maybe they are using the same tactic? I bet GBC was starting to think they had nothing on him, yet they knew all along

I dont think anything will happen to BC senior until after the commital hearing. IMO

linette
07-12-2012, 03:31 AM
I dont think anything will happen to BC senior until after the commital hearing. IMO

Interesting. How does that work then? Why would they wait til after the hearing?

Ooohm
07-12-2012, 03:34 AM
Waiting for the other shoe to drop, i.e. a second arrest. We all know it is possible, if not likely.
For someone who has been so glib over the years, Gerard sure is good at keeping schtum. Maybe because it isn't just his backside on the line?
But I am amazed at the high quality of sleuthing happening on these boards. This is how killers are unmasked! The Eye of the People can be unforgiving, which is why when someone attempts to steer the media, it is at their own risk. (OW looking at ya)

Makara
07-12-2012, 03:35 AM
Does anyone have the link to the original interview with GBC and Olivia?

http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/8456598/search-for-qld-mum-wont-rest-on-anzac-day

marlywings
07-12-2012, 03:40 AM
It's possible with an iPhone, to just remove the sim card. That's a whole lot easier to dispose of than the phone itself, IMO. For all we know, one of the BC family could be using the phone right now. I know it's possible to obtain data from the ISP though. I'm hoping he wasn't that smart and the the QPS have the phone (and sim card.)

You could be right about the BC's maybe using that phone...started me wondering about the visit by five detectives early evening on the day of the first aborted bail hearing.

Police had only learnt about the facetime call not long before that hearing was due to start....perhaps that's part of the reason they were searching the car & house.

BJsleuth
07-12-2012, 03:42 AM
http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/8456598/search-for-qld-mum-wont-rest-on-anzac-day

That whole interview Gerard did set off my BS meter. He says "I'm trying to look after my children" fair enough but that's not mutually exclusive to finding their Mum! IMO

YoureNicked
07-12-2012, 03:44 AM
That whole interview Gerard did set off my BS meter. He says "I'm trying to look after my children" fair enough but that's not mutually exclusive to finding their Mum! IMO

Exactly, BJSleuth!

I expect the 'I have to look after my children,' line would have worked for a long while on TM as well - stalling her demands for him to either choose her or Allison...so he brought out the 'tried and true' formula when it came to stalling the reporter. The narcissist is an expert at imposing guilt upon another in order to escape interrogation. But like BjSleuth says, caring for the children does not mean he cannot be more active in the search for his wife's killer...unless of course, he killed her.

linette
07-12-2012, 03:47 AM
That whole interview Gerard did set off my BS meter. He says "I'm trying to look after my children" fair enough but that's not mutually exclusive to finding their Mum! IMO

Yes, you'd think loving them and wanting the best for them... surely finding their mother would be a big start.

Makara
07-12-2012, 03:50 AM
I dont think anything will happen to BC senior until after the commital hearing. IMO

I feel the same Bayside. I wouldn't be surprised if NBC is called as a witness when this case goes to trial and IMO it will go to trial. Once they have NBC in the witness box he will either refuse to answer questions and will be held in contempt of court which could bring down a hefty fine, jail time or both, or he will perjure himself. The maxiumum penalty for perjury in Qld is life.

http://www.adla.com.au/web/page/qld_law_perjury

Either way Bwanna is between a rock and a hard place without a safety net right now. :moo:

Timmy
07-12-2012, 03:50 AM
Exactly and you would think they would mention finding the real killer etc.

Once again I'm playing 'catch up' with the posts but just wanted to say I wholeheartedly agree with this. IMO they 'cooked their goose' so to speak( no offence Mothergoose) from Day 1 when not one of them to my knowledge has sought help in finding the alleged killer. It made me so angry when they spoke about being harassed by the media. All I could think of is how hard some families try to keep their cases in the public light to try and find out information- BUT no appeals for help, no releasing of details to try and jog the public's memory, nothing! It is at the very least, the most peculiar behaviour for a family who has lost a loved one to murder and at the very worst.........Well.... A sign of guilt IMO. Even if you thought you would be a suspect in your wife/ husband's murder and saw the necessity to be careful and 'lawyer up', you still would be as helpful as you could possibly be. And I'd like to think you would be that helpful no matter what your current relationship might be ie. separated, divorced etc.IMO

BJsleuth
07-12-2012, 03:50 AM
Yes, you'd think loving them and wanting the best for them... surely finding their mother would be a big start.

Then he goes on to say that they have great family support and "Olivia's taking care of us". A bit of a contradiction there.

Timmy
07-12-2012, 03:53 AM
That whole interview Gerard did set off my BS meter. He says "I'm trying to look after my children" fair enough but that's not mutually exclusive to finding their Mum! IMO

So true!

Firesnake
07-12-2012, 04:08 AM
http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/queensland/witness-tells-allison-baden-clay-murder-probe-of-two-four-wheel-drives/story-e6freoof-1226356698185

A WITNESS has told police of seeing two four-wheel-drives near Kholo Creek crossing early on the day Allison Baden-Clay was reported missing.

It is alleged a white four-wheel-drive didn't have its headlights on, only parking lights, and was closely tailing a smaller, blue four-wheel-drive at about 4am on April 20.

Sorry back to the cars...

So IF the above is correct and a white four wheel drive was seen was this the BC car?

We now know that police think Allison was transported to the creek in the captiva...

To my knowledge police never appealed for information about any other make of car.. Only the BC cars...

IMO there is no blue car. It is the captiva, and the colour was mistaken...

Maybe when this was released witnesses came forward and said we didn't see a blue one but did see a silver one!!!

All IMO

Woof
07-12-2012, 04:09 AM
That whole interview Gerard did set off my BS meter. He says "I'm trying to look after my children" fair enough but that's not mutually exclusive to finding their Mum! IMO

When I saw that interview I knew then he was guilty and ABC was dead.

Indromum
07-12-2012, 04:11 AM
Can you all keep a secret? 'Cause I was told not to tell anyone.....I received the most beautiful delivery today from darling Wozzle. Flowers and chocolates (both my favourites- lilies and lindt) -as a thank you for placing flowers at the bridge. What a lovely surprise! :)

BJsleuth
07-12-2012, 04:14 AM
When I saw that interview I knew then he was guilty and ABC was dead.

It was obvious to me then too and I really believed he had nothing to with it.

Woof
07-12-2012, 04:15 AM
Bugging. Can police place listening devices in suspects cars and houses? Don't they need to get permission from a judge, or a court order or something? Is anyone in the know?

Mani
07-12-2012, 04:16 AM
Bugging. Can police place listening devices in suspects cars and houses? Don't they need to get permission from a judge, or a court order or something? Is anyone in the know?

yes they can and yes they do IMO

Timmy
07-12-2012, 04:17 AM
When I saw that interview I knew then he was guilty and ABC was dead.

I had exactly the same thoughts- as I'm sure lots of us did. And while I agree with 'innocent until proven guilty'- it's very hard to look past that interview. It's still fascinating to watch even after all this time ( and cringe worthy at the same time).IMO

linette
07-12-2012, 04:18 AM
When I saw that interview I knew then he was guilty and ABC was dead.

Agree!! During that interview I went from thinking "I wonder what happened?" ... to knowing.

Timmy
07-12-2012, 04:19 AM
Can you all keep a secret? 'Cause I was told not to tell anyone.....I received the most beautiful delivery today from darling Wozzle. Flowers and chocolates (both my favourites- lilies and lindt) -as a thank you for placing flowers at the bridge. What a lovely surprise! :)

That's lovely! but I just wanted you to know I'm hopeless with keeping secrets so if anyone else finds out, it was probably me who told them. :)

linette
07-12-2012, 04:21 AM
Can you all keep a secret? 'Cause I was told not to tell anyone.....I received the most beautiful delivery today from darling Wozzle. Flowers and chocolates (both my favourites- lilies and lindt) -as a thank you for placing flowers at the bridge. What a lovely surprise! :)

That is beautiful. Aaaw!!! ... have a chocky for me please.

Fuskier
07-12-2012, 04:23 AM
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/nation/allison-baden-clay-murdered-after-row-over-affair-supreme-court-told-in-bail-hearing/story-e6frg6nf-1226405470286

In regards to the discussion regarding the screams heard on that Thursday night..

This is from the above link

Police allege that the blood of Mrs Baden-Clay was found in the boot of her husband's car and this was consistent with their belief that she had been killed in their Brookfield home, in Brisbane's west, before her body was dumped in a creek about 14km away.

This is from the bail application hearing..

After reading this it appears to me that the police are saying that she was murdered at home.

Why would they present this to the court if the murder happened elsewhere?

It also makes sense because the house was declared a crime scene.. If no crime was committed there why would it have been declared a crime scene

IMO the screams are not relevant to the case..

This is my opinion only

Correct link this time:

We don't know if the female screams heard are connected or not connected. Anything may have happened. Fact is none of us know. We are sleuthing possibilities. She may have been chased and grabbed by the alleged murderer and/or accomplice(s) for all we know. The screams appear to be closer in vicinity to the NBC house. We don't know what Allison did after leaving the hairdressers, do we? we don't know if she went to NBC's house. We don't know if they called her and asked her to come over after the hairdressers. We can't rule it in or out just yet. But we do know that nobody has come forward to say they had a party near there that night. Keeping an open mind. MOO

Mani
07-12-2012, 04:23 AM
Then he goes on to say that they have great family support and "Olivia's taking care of us". A bit of a contradiction there.

You know if GBC couldn't search because he had no alibi the night Allison disappeared why didn't OW and the seniors - what was stopping them searching for their daughter/sister-in-law? I think their attitude is what gave the game away and IMO did not help GBC's cause one little bit. MOO

As for 'devastation' - we kept hearing the word on MSM but did anyone see any of it? MOO

Shame, shame shame! IMO

YoureNicked
07-12-2012, 04:24 AM
When I saw that interview I knew then he was guilty and ABC was dead.

Same here, Woof.

At first, when I heard of Allison's disappearance on the news I thought to myself, 'It's probably the husband' (because, it usually is.)

Then, when I learnt of Allison's incredible beauty, talent and intelligence and compared it to her husband's comparatively meagre accomplishments I thought, 'Jealousy is a big motive here.'

THEN I saw that TV interview and I was SURE he did it.

Firesnake
07-12-2012, 04:25 AM
I had exactly the same thoughts- as I'm sure lots of us did. And while I agree with 'innocent until proven guilty'- it's very hard to look past that interview. It's still fascinating to watch even after all this time ( and cringe worthy at the same time).IMO

The appeal by the dickies is what put doubts in my mind from the very beginning..

I sat and watched as they pleaded and begged the public for help in finding their precious daughter and I thought.. WHERE is her husband?

Even if he was too distraught to speak he still should have been there IMO

I do believe in innocent till proven guilty cause that is the law but......

This is My opinion only

linette
07-12-2012, 04:28 AM
I'm curious about something... not just regarding this case, but I have always wondered... and another missing woman on the news today has brought it up again.
You know how Allison went missing and it quickly skyrocketed into something more than a missing person case... like, I mean VERY quickly. Then there's the lady Angel1 brought to our attention that has been missing from Warwick {QLD} since July 3rd? First time it's really been on the news is today, the 12th? {Correct me if it has been on before now} Now, they're looking at a her ex for some reason... this is my question... how to the police determine what is high priority and what isn't?

There have been a few times where you'll see on the news that police are enquiring about someone who has now been missing for quite a few days...
Not picking or anything like that... but how do they determine this, especially since they are now talking about this missing woman's ex?
I'm not meaning to go off topic or anything with this...

BJsleuth
07-12-2012, 04:29 AM
Bugging. Can police place listening devices in suspects cars and houses? Don't they need to get permission from a judge, or a court order or something? Is anyone in the know?

Yes they need a warrant to do it I think.

Mani
07-12-2012, 04:32 AM
The appeal by the dickies is what put doubts in my mind from the very beginning..

I sat and watched as they pleaded and begged the public for help in finding their precious daughter and I thought.. WHERE is her husband?

Even if he was too distraught to speak he still should have been there IMO

I do believe in innocent till proven guilty cause that is the law but......

This is My opinion only

Well if you were innocent - you would be hanging off every word the QPS and SES had to say and you would be out of your mind with it all........I am sure the police see a lot of that in cases where people go missing - real gut wrenching devastation from the family that are coming to terms with what might have happened to their loved one.......
however
not so here - the 'stonewall mob', didn't search, didn't speak to the media (who are just trying to do their job), didn't attend the command post, didn't appear devastated and in OW's case, ran up a neighbour's driveway!

MOO

jubillee
07-12-2012, 04:33 AM
In regards to GBC TV interview he did come off very ingenuous. But that could also be because he had already moved on emotionally from ABC and wasn't as upset as he otherwise would have been.
I am not saying he isn't guilty, just that his response could have have had other reasons as well.

linette
07-12-2012, 04:34 AM
You know if GBC couldn't search because he had no alibi the night Allison disappeared why didn't OW and the seniors - what was stopping them searching for their daughter/sister-in-law? I think their attitude is what gave the game away and IMO did not help GBC's cause one little bit. MOO

As for 'devastation' - we kept hearing the word on MSM but did anyone see any of it? MOO

Shame, shame shame! IMO

Did I see any devastation? No. You only have to compare the faces of the Dickies to the faces of the BC's. One lot were truly heartbroken... the other lot were truly, well worried about themselves. IMO

J-Diggety
07-12-2012, 04:35 AM
Bugging. Can police place listening devices in suspects cars and houses? Don't they need to get permission from a judge, or a court order or something? Is anyone in the know?

Yes they can and they do need to get permission/warrant for TI (telephone intercept) and other forms of surveillance.

Because it is so intrusive, the requesting officer/s would need exceptionally strong grounds to get permission to place them in houses etc....and use them.

BJsleuth
07-12-2012, 04:36 AM
You know if GBC couldn't search because he had no alibi the night Allison disappeared why didn't OW and the seniors - what was stopping them searching for their daughter/sister-in-law? I think their attitude is what gave the game away and IMO did not help GBC's cause one little bit. MOO

As for 'devastation' - we kept hearing the word on MSM but did anyone see any of it? MOO

Shame, shame shame! IMO

Exactly.

There are also no reasons for not utilising the constant media presence to keep making pleas for assistance and information from the public to help find her.

Mani
07-12-2012, 04:37 AM
Did I see any devastation? No. You only have to compare the faces of the Dickies to the faces of the BC's. One lot were truly heartbroken... the other lot were truly, well worried about themselves. IMO

It was heartbreaking watching the Dickies' plea. It appeared farcical watching BCs IMO

Timmy
07-12-2012, 04:40 AM
In regards to GBC TV interview he did come off very ingenuous. But that could also be because he had already moved on emotionally from ABC and wasn't as upset as he otherwise would have been.
I am not saying he isn't guilty, just that his response could have have had other reasons as well.

I understand what you are saying.... But I would think that when faced with the prospect of another human being missing presumed murdered that you would have some sort of emotion. Maybe that's just me- but I cry when people I've never met have died let alone the mother of your children- no matter what the current relationship.iMO

marlywings
07-12-2012, 04:42 AM
Bugging. Can police place listening devices in suspects cars and houses? Don't they need to get permission from a judge, or a court order or something? Is anyone in the know?

Somewhere around page 305 I think you'll find the answer is yes....

http://www.legislation.qld.gov.au/LEGISLTN/current/P/PolicePowResA00.pdf

Also...another member posted this report a while back although it is in UK....

6 July 2012

A couple who covered up their son's murder of his girlfriend at their Bournemouth home have been jailed

Their actions were uncovered when police bugged their house and recorded conversations where they discussed whether they had done the right thing.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-dorset-18733240

Fuskier
07-12-2012, 04:50 AM
This morning I called in sick and made sure I didn't sound like that!:floorlaugh:

YoureNicked
07-12-2012, 04:51 AM
In regards to GBC TV interview he did come off very ingenuous. But that could also be because he had already moved on emotionally from ABC and wasn't as upset as he otherwise would have been.
I am not saying he isn't guilty, just that his response could have have had other reasons as well.

I have no doubt he'd 'already moved on' emotionally from Allison. As we now know, he was having multiple affairs so that seems to tell me that the only emotions he had for Allison were scorn, derision and contempt. -- all of which are motives for murder, in my opinion.

linette
07-12-2012, 04:55 AM
I understand what you are saying.... But I would think that when faced with the prospect of another human being missing presumed murdered that you would have some sort of emotion. Maybe that's just me- but I cry when people I've never met have died let alone the mother of your children- no matter what the current relationship.iMO

Yes, no matter what the state of the relationship is at the time, you should still 'feel' something if the person missing is someone who you once loved very much, and who was such a huge part of your life, aswell as being the much loved mother of your three little girls. He could have at least cried for how this was going to hurt his daughters.

Mani
07-12-2012, 05:05 AM
:yourock: Keentoknow - thank you for making and placing the cross at the bridge - it really is a bright yellow beacon - I know I have said it before but indulge me again - thanks for thinking of this lovely gesture. IMO

At some late stage we need to hire a mini bus and get our WS tushies up the coast and have a bbq on the beach near you and give cheers to Allison and WS for bringing us together.

minni
07-12-2012, 05:08 AM
Bumping Fergie's post of 30/5 :bump:

I think Fergie has made some good points here and I have felt for a long time that 2 cars are involved.

yes...I agree that Fergie wrote a great post here..We have talked so much about his wormy ways (caterpillary ways?), but not so much the 'why' he kept doing this to his wonderful, intelligent, loving and clearly attractive wife. IMO I think its highly probable reason that GBC cheated was because Allison knew the real him....and he no longer felt 'special' or superior in her presence. In his eyes, no doubt she made him look and feel bad, it was her fault.
In his egotistical mind, he must find someone who will be in awe of his awesomeness and he must do so post haste!! and when she starts to become less adoring and begin querying or harrassing him in any way, well, he must find someone post haste again to boost his ego!!!!

it reminds me of an old book on star signs I once read. The phrase she used to describe the Aries man was,

"I am back!" he said hotly, "why do you not cheer?"

Keentoknow
07-12-2012, 05:15 AM
:yourock: Keentoknow - thank you for making and placing the cross at the bridge - it really is a bright yellow beacon - I know I have said it before but indulge me again - thanks for thinking of this lovely gesture. IMO

At some late stage we need to hire a mini bus and get our WS tushies up the coast and have a bbq on the beach near you and give cheers to Allison and WS for bringing us together.

You are more than welcome to come to Bribie Island. To get over the bridge you must wear yellow. I am in Victoria again at the moment. Home next Thursday. Freeeezing here. We will see what we can do then.

Firesnake
07-12-2012, 05:21 AM
I had wondered if police use canoes in their searches.. It appears from this they do!!!

The massive air and ground search, involving more than 80 police and 50 SES volunteers, continued across the town yesterday, with police divers scouring dams, officers on horseback, and others taking to the fast-flowing waters of Moggill Creek in canoes.


http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/queensland/baden-clay-arrives-at-police-station/story-e6freoof-1226341919352

Bayside
07-12-2012, 05:26 AM
Bugging. Can police place listening devices in suspects cars and houses? Don't they need to get permission from a judge, or a court order or something? Is anyone in the know?

I think the perception is that bugging is a big deal, it is very common.

You know that saying that "loose lips sink ships", I think the BC's ship is going to be sitting on the bottom of the ocean soon enough.

Bayside
07-12-2012, 05:30 AM
I feel the same Bayside. I wouldn't be surprised if NBC is called as a witness when this case goes to trial and IMO it will go to trial. Once they have NBC in the witness box he will either refuse to answer questions and will be held in contempt of court which could bring down a hefty fine, jail time or both, or he will perjure himself. The maxiumum penalty for perjury in Qld is life.

http://www.adla.com.au/web/page/qld_law_perjury

Either way Bwanna is between a rock and a hard place without a safety net right now. :moo:

Thats what I think too, but you said it better lol.

Onlyone
07-12-2012, 05:32 AM
That's exactly it!
Couldn't put my finger on why I thought they were bizarre & you have absolutely just hit it on the head.

I'm curious about something... not just regarding this case, but I have always wondered... and another missing woman on the news today has brought it up again.
You know how Allison went missing and it quickly skyrocketed into something more than a missing person case... like, I mean VERY quickly. Then there's the lady Angel1 brought to our attention that has been missing from Warwick {QLD} since July 3rd? First time it's really been on the news is today, the 12th? {Correct me if it has been on before now} Now, they're looking at a her ex for some reason... this is my question... how to the police determine what is high priority and what isn't?

There have been a few times where you'll see on the news that police are enquiring about someone who has now been missing for quite a few days...
Not picking or anything like that... but how do they determine this, especially since they are now talking about this missing woman's ex?
I'm not meaning to go off topic or anything with this...

Can only be because the initial responding police reported something suspicious right away ???

BJsleuth
07-12-2012, 05:34 AM
I think the perception is that bugging is a big deal, it is very common.

You know that saying that "loose lips sink ships", I think the BC's ship is going to be sitting on the bottom of the ocean soon enough.

They changed the name of their iPhone to Titanic, it's syncing now! :what:

minni
07-12-2012, 05:34 AM
Can you all keep a secret? 'Cause I was told not to tell anyone.....I received the most beautiful delivery today from darling Wozzle. Flowers and chocolates (both my favourites- lilies and lindt) -as a thank you for placing flowers at the bridge. What a lovely surprise! :)


A lovely surprise which you more than deserve Indro. What you do (and not just once or twice) is more than just a kind gesture. You, in your, unobtrusive, kind hearted and totally natural way, represent every single one of us here that have been touched by Allison's life, and her death, every time you go out there. For the sleuthers who may never get to visit the bridge, it is so so special to know that you have taken a little piece of their love, thoughts, grief or even hope...and left it their for Allison when you place those flowers down.

You are just wonderful xxxxxx
:tyou:

Berry
07-12-2012, 05:36 AM
I dont think anything will happen to BC senior until after the commital hearing. IMO

Wonder why Bay?
Thoughts please, I was hoping this new rain would flush him out!!

YoureNicked
07-12-2012, 05:37 AM
They changed the name of their iPhone to Titanic, it's syncing now! :what:

LOL very clever, BJSleuth!

BreakingNews
07-12-2012, 05:40 AM
Around second or third page I posted a photo of the OW email...it made me sick looking at it so I deleted my post with that photo in it...then I fiddled in photoshop with it...deleted the original details & added in the children's fund details instead....nawt of me but oh well...lol.

Marlywings, you'll go in the naughty corner!:floorlaugh:

Fergie
07-12-2012, 05:44 AM
Bumping Fergie's post of 30/5 :bump:

I think Fergie has made some good points here and I have felt for a long time that 2 cars are involved.

The question that I really struggle with is why didn't they leave Allison's car at Kholo Creek Bridge? GBC's story would have been so much more plausible if he said that he went to bed while Allison was watching the Footy Show and he woke in the morning to find her missing. If Allison had a history of depression (this is confirmed by many locals, well known IMO) thanks to GBC and his behavior and infidelities why didn't they leave the car at the bridge and both GBC and NBC return home in the other vehicle so that it looked like Allison drove to the bridge in her car after an argument and jumped off the bridge to commit suicide? The calls that night would have been difficult to explain but the scenario would have been more credible and more difficult to challenge. GBC could have said he woke at night and Allison was gone so he assumed she had gone out or gone to stay with a friend. He would have had a valid reason to call his parents to express his concern but they reassured him and he went back to sleep. As soon as they drove Allison's car back home the whole "story" became implausible. Is this stupidity or did something go wrong such that they could not leave Allison's car at Kholo Creek Bridge?

Spotted Reptile
07-12-2012, 05:45 AM
Then he goes on to say that they have great family support and "Olivia's taking care of us". A bit of a contradiction there.

I only watched this interview once. It seemed like he was trying to sound like a grieving husband and watching his words so they came out right, like people do when they lie - that kind of forced unnatural wording and voice control.

OW looked like she was terrified he'd blow it IMO, she's very nervous all right. Wondering how they appear to the media - NOT worrying about the safety of ABC. No wonder they can't say the right words - they're not feeling or thinking them. And at no stage did either GBC or OW make a direct appeal - they just talked to the reporter like it was a normal interview, not a chance to talk directly to tv viewers. I know if it was me I'd be in that camera's face like a shot, begging the public to help and come forward etc etc. It didn't seem to occur to either of them to do that.

Wish I could watch it again, but I can't stomach it. It makes me feel nauseous looking at that squirrelly expression (you know the one!) and thinking what poor ABC had to endure all her married life.

IMO.

minni
07-12-2012, 05:49 AM
I'm curious about something... not just regarding this case, but I have always wondered... and another missing woman on the news today has brought it up again.
You know how Allison went missing and it quickly skyrocketed into something more than a missing person case... like, I mean VERY quickly. Then there's the lady Angel1 brought to our attention that has been missing from Warwick {QLD} since July 3rd? First time it's really been on the news is today, the 12th? {Correct me if it has been on before now} Now, they're looking at a her ex for some reason... this is my question... how to the police determine what is high priority and what isn't?

There have been a few times where you'll see on the news that police are enquiring about someone who has now been missing for quite a few days...
Not picking or anything like that... but how do they determine this, especially since they are now talking about this missing woman's ex?
I'm not meaning to go off topic or anything with this...

I think the police knew of the DVO's. I thinks its possible that there was a call out the night before which I remember being talked about here, but not in the media.
Somewhere (here I guess, maybe the affidavit?) it was stated that the scratches on his face made them suspicious, because before they had barely got up the driveway, he was quick to explain them, without ever being asked....warning bells would go off it that one were true and I think its fact? sorry I wouldnt even know where to look?

and my personal thoughts I've had from the beginning.. there may have been water pooled around the tires of the cars, indicating he had washed them at some ridiculous hour like 6.30 -7.00 (between cleverly dressing himself and banging a couple of sangas together that is)

Unfortunately, there would be thousands upon thousands of women murdered by their husbands every year, and we never hear a peep about it. They too are probably mums, normal everyday women living normal everyday lives. Maybe GBC's mildly apparent (keyword) success or even the prestigious reputation of Brookfield could have added to the initial media interest, but I think the police that attended the call that morning believed she had been killed already. ( I know that is contrary to Mark Ainsworths 'we dont believe she has met her demise' comment he made early on...but I am learning that this very smart, streetwise man does not give away anything he doesnt need to)

Berry
07-12-2012, 05:58 AM
He must be running out of time to lodge an appeal against his denial of bail now...30 days almost gone

minni
07-12-2012, 05:59 AM
there is another video of GBC coming out of the police station with his father. As he comnes out the doors, he looks at the press and gives them the most pathetic, apologetic, sheepish type grimace...its the same one he gives the reporter as he was walking over to her to say he was 'just a little bit hurt'.

He can not pull off a single look of concern EVER. except maybe at the funeral, that looked real. but I think he was hurting for his daughters (ironic that he did this to them huh?).... but we've seen his acting skills, he couldnt pull of tears if he tried

I suppose I better go find the link (sigh)

BJsleuth
07-12-2012, 05:59 AM
I only watched this interview once. It seemed like he was trying to sound like a grieving husband and watching his words so they came out right, like people do when they lie - that kind of forced unnatural wording and voice control.

OW looked like she was terrified he'd blow it IMO, she's very nervous all right. Wondering how they appear to the media - NOT worrying about the safety of ABC. No wonder they can't say the right words - they're not feeling or thinking them. And at no stage did either GBC or OW make a direct appeal - they just talked to the reporter like it was a normal interview, not a chance to talk directly to tv viewers. I know if it was me I'd be in that camera's face like a shot, begging the public to help and come forward etc etc. It didn't seem to occur to either of them to do that.

Wish I could watch it again, but I can't stomach it. It makes me feel nauseous looking at that squirrelly expression (you know the one!) and thinking what poor ABC had to endure all her married life.

IMO.

Definitely, his body language gave away so much- swallowing tightly, shaking his head. Twice there was mention of co-operating with the police, that wasn't the question the reporter asked. It seems all so off.

YoureNicked
07-12-2012, 06:02 AM
The question that I really struggle with is why didn't they leave Allison's car at Kholo Creek Bridge? GBC's story would have been so much more plausible if he said that he went to bed while Allison was watching the Footy Show and he woke in the morning to find her missing. If Allison had a history of depression (this is confirmed by many locals, well known IMO) thanks to GBC and his behavior and infidelities why didn't they leave the car at the bridge and both GBC and NBC return home in the other vehicle so that it looked like Allison drove to the bridge in her car after an argument and jumped off the bridge to commit suicide? The calls that night would have been difficult to explain but the scenario would have been more credible and more difficult to challenge. GBC could have said he woke at night and Allison was gone so he assumed she had gone out or gone to stay with a friend. He would have had a valid reason to call his parents to express his concern but they reassured him and he went back to sleep. As soon as they drove Allison's car back home the whole "story" became implausible. Is this stupidity or did something go wrong such that they could not leave Allison's car at Kholo Creek Bridge?

I've thought about this myself Fergie, and I came to the conclusion that the idea of Allison committing suicide would be very difficult to believe.

For one thing, a loving mother as Allison was reported to be, would not easily leave her children in the care of a man who could very likely (given his affair with TM) have other children - thus necessitating that any financial and emotional resources GBC had to give the girls would be even more scarce. Very few people would believe this loving mother, no matter how depressed, would kill herself. I suffered extreme depression after I discovered my ex's affair and I wanted the pain to go away...but this is a far cry from actually visualising suicide, let alone going through with the act of killing oneself. I neither visualised the act, nor tried to do myself in and I doubt Allison, who had three beautiful reasons to live, would have even contemplated killing herself...and I think GBC knew noone would believe it either.

Second, even if she was to commit suicide, I think her apparent love for her daughters would have seen her leaving some kind of last 'love letter' to her children. If GBC was going to fake a suicide then he'd have the added problem of faking a note.

Just my opinion.

marlywings
07-12-2012, 06:04 AM
Marlywings, you'll go in the naughty corner!:floorlaugh:

:noooo:
................:angel:..............

Flinders
07-12-2012, 06:07 AM
You know if GBC couldn't search because he had no alibi the night Allison disappeared why didn't OW and the seniors - what was stopping them searching for their daughter/sister-in-law? I think their attitude is what gave the game away and IMO did not help GBC's cause one little bit. MOO

As for 'devastation' - we kept hearing the word on MSM but did anyone see any of it? MOO

Shame, shame shame! IMO

I fully understand this. As per MSM Mr and Mrs Dickie also wanted to search desperately. They were told to leave it to the profesionals but they were at Brookfield Show grounds every day. Moo and can't get links at the moment.

marlywings
07-12-2012, 06:10 AM
I think the perception is that bugging is a big deal, it is very common.

You know that saying that "loose lips sink ships", I think the BC's ship is going to be sitting on the bottom of the ocean soon enough.

Yes I agree....they were also used on Sica...

One of his lawyer's points in summing up at end of the trial...

June 20, 2012

why his client should not be found guilty of the murders

6. In the five years and eight months, Sica did not run away and despite the deployment of undercover police, listening devices and tracking devices, they were not able to produce one iota of direct evidence

http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/sicas-lawyer-gives-lettermanstyle-jury-plea-20120620-20nbl.html#ixzz20OlauftC

pickle99
07-12-2012, 06:16 AM
I really hoped (and still do) for the children's sake that GBC is innocent. But some of the posts have really nailed it on the head tonight - Why would you not be pleading with police to find the real killer if you were innocent? I just cant get past that!

There is something that has been bugging me for a while...Many people here seem to be of the opinion the HE did it. But the scenario in my head is unless this was a situation that got out of hand, and in fact there was premeditation that maybe he got/tried to get someone to do it for him...but all didnt go to plan. It kinda fits in with the 'self incrimination' searches. I know this can be easily explained away...blood in the car etc. but it is still bugging me...

of course just my rambling thoughts and opinions...

Strangeworld
07-12-2012, 06:16 AM
I'm curious about something... not just regarding this case, but I have always wondered... and another missing woman on the news today has brought it up again.
You know how Allison went missing and it quickly skyrocketed into something more than a missing person case... like, I mean VERY quickly. Then there's the lady Angel1 brought to our attention that has been missing from Warwick {QLD} since July 3rd? First time it's really been on the news is today, the 12th? {Correct me if it has been on before now} Now, they're looking at a her ex for some reason... this is my question... how to the police determine what is high priority and what isn't?

There have been a few times where you'll see on the news that police are enquiring about someone who has now been missing for quite a few days...
Not picking or anything like that... but how do they determine this, especially since they are now talking about this missing woman's ex?
I'm not meaning to go off topic or anything with this...

I strongly believe Allison's disappearance/murder made the headlines consistently and solidly for so long (and still does) because of who they are. They lived in a suburb that is viewed as affluent, influential, and portrayed as the 'white picket fence' lifestyle (if you know what I mean). I think the media realised very quickly that things were not all as they seemed, and they knew readers would lap this contradiction up (and they have).

There are missing people that disappear suspiciously, and murders happening every day (or close to it) around Australia, yet only some make the media and dominate the press. These are usually the ones that involve scandal, and people who would not normally be seen as the 'murdering type'.

BJsleuth
07-12-2012, 06:19 AM
Can only be because the initial responding police reported something suspicious right away ???

When police are gathering the facts and interviewing you, they will ask questions a million different ways and if you answer differently and what you've told them differs too much, then that in itself is enough to set off warning bells and they'll suspect you're hiding something.

Fergie
07-12-2012, 06:22 AM
IMO GBC took Allison out to Kholo Creek Bridge in the Captiva and got bogged. GBC rang NBC to come and get him out of trouble. NBC went to the location and towed GBC out of trouble in the Prado. I think GBC planned to drive the cleaned Captiva back to Kholo Creek and leave it there with assistance from NBC after the children had been dropped off at school but before he reported her missing. Something happened on the morning of the 20 April that meant he could not drive the Captiva back to Kholo Creek Bridge before reporting Allison missing. Perhaps after speaking to the Dickies they had reason to call police and police attended before he could execute the last stage of the plan? MOO.

Strangeworld
07-12-2012, 06:24 AM
I strongly believe Allison's disappearance/murder made the headlines consistently and solidly for so long (and still does) because of who they are. They lived in a suburb that is viewed as affluent, influential, and portrayed as the 'white picket fence' lifestyle (if you know what I mean). I think the media realised very quickly that things were not all as they seemed, and they knew readers would lap this contradiction up (and they have).

There are missing people that disappear suspiciously, and murders happening every day (or close to it) around Australia, yet only some make the media and dominate the press. These are usually the ones that involve scandal, and people who would not normally be seen as the 'murdering type'.

Meant to add (how vain of me, quoting my own post :) :)) that I also believe the media felt this was a 'water cooler' case - something that people would be talking about with friends, family, colleagues, etc. Bit like the Cluedo/whodunnit scenario.

linette
07-12-2012, 06:25 AM
I really hoped (and still do) for the children's sake that GBC is innocent. But some of the posts have really nailed it on the head tonight - Why would you not be pleading with police to find the real killer if you were innocent? I just cant get past that!

There is something that has been bugging me for a while...Many people here seem to be of the opinion the HE did it. But the scenario in my head is unless this was a situation that got out of hand, and in fact there was premeditation that maybe he got/tried to get someone to do it for him...but all didnt go to plan. It kinda fits in with the 'self incrimination' searches. I know this can be easily explained away...blood in the car etc. but it is still bugging me...

of course just my rambling thoughts and opinions...

There is a chance he got someone else to do it. As someone posted earlier, this could be the reason he's being how he is ... because he isn't the only one with his butt on the line. {They said something like that, I used my own words. haha}
The BC's have never been helpful in finding the 'real' killer, have they?

marlywings
07-12-2012, 06:26 AM
there is another video of GBC coming out of the police station with his father. As he comnes out the doors, he looks at the press and gives them the most pathetic, apologetic, sheepish type grimace...its the same one he gives the reporter as he was walking over to her to say he was 'just a little bit hurt'.

He can not pull off a single look of concern EVER. except maybe at the funeral, that looked real. but I think he was hurting for his daughters (ironic that he did this to them huh?).... but we've seen his acting skills, he couldnt pull of tears if he tried

I suppose I better go find the link (sigh)

This may be the video of him coming out of police station.....& at 1.22 he took a swipe at one of the cameramen at the front of the car....I always remember that!!!

Search for missing woman now murder investigation - YouTube

Also on same video at .55 & .57 I wonder where those areas are.

Strangeworld
07-12-2012, 06:26 AM
Sorry this is OT, but I had to post. Every time I open a new page in here, I have a giggle when I read the top of the page:

"Please scroll down just a bit, look to your right, and you will see new scrolling books from Amazon. We ask that if you want a book or anything from Amazon to please click " :)

Fergie
07-12-2012, 06:28 AM
I've thought about this myself Fergie, and I came to the conclusion that the idea of Allison committing suicide would be very difficult to believe.

For one thing, a loving mother as Allison was reported to be, would not easily leave her children in the care of a man who could very likely (given his affair with TM) have other children - thus necessitating that any financial and emotional resources GBC had to give the girls would be even more scarce. Very few people would believe this loving mother, no matter how depressed, would kill herself. I suffered extreme depression after I discovered my ex's affair and I wanted the pain to go away...but this is a far cry from actually visualising suicide, let alone going through with the act of killing oneself. I neither visualised the act, nor tried to do myself in and I doubt Allison, who had three beautiful reasons to live, would have even contemplated killing herself...and I think GBC knew noone would believe it either.

Second, even if she was to commit suicide, I think her apparent love for her daughters would have seen her leaving some kind of last 'love letter' to her children. If GBC was going to fake a suicide then he'd have the added problem of faking a note.

Just my opinion.

I don't think that she committed suicide but that GBC wanted to stage her murder as suicide. I don't think he would have been thinking rationally in terms of what others would believe but I agree with you about the logic of leaving a note if he intended this to look like suicide.

linette
07-12-2012, 06:28 AM
I strongly believe Allison's disappearance/murder made the headlines consistently and solidly for so long (and still does) because of who they are. They lived in a suburb that is viewed as affluent, influential, and portrayed as the 'white picket fence' lifestyle (if you know what I mean). I think the media realised very quickly that things were not all as they seemed, and they knew readers would lap this contradiction up (and they have).

There are missing people that disappear suspiciously, and murders happening every day (or close to it) around Australia, yet only some make the media and dominate the press. These are usually the ones that involve scandal, and people who would not normally be seen as the 'murdering type'.

Thanks for your reply. Sad, but I guess you're right. :(

Strangeworld
07-12-2012, 06:29 AM
When police are gathering the facts and interviewing you, they will ask questions a million different ways and if you answer differently and what you've told them differs too much, then that in itself is enough to set off warning bells and they'll suspect you're hiding something.

And also too much detail can set off alarm bells. I remember reading a long time ago about eyewitness accounts, and how trained interviewers can detect when someone is including too much detail that suggests they are 'elaborating' either intentionally or unintentionally.

Spotted Reptile
07-12-2012, 06:31 AM
This may be the video of him coming out of police station.....& at 1.22 he took a swipe at one of the cameramen at the front of the car....I always remember that!!!

Search for missing woman now murder investigation - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D34mOPcYogs&feature=related)

Also on same video at .55 & .57 I wonder where those areas are.


It's so creepy that as the reporter is saying that the children of ABC are waiting for confirmation that the body is that of their mother, GBC is busy dialling the insurance company to make a claim.

minni
07-12-2012, 06:33 AM
I really hoped (and still do) for the children's sake that GBC is innocent. But some of the posts have really nailed it on the head tonight - Why would you not be pleading with police to find the real killer if you were innocent? I just cant get past that!

There is something that has been bugging me for a while...Many people here seem to be of the opinion the HE did it. But the scenario in my head is unless this was a situation that got out of hand, and in fact there was premeditation that maybe he got/tried to get someone to do it for him...but all didnt go to plan. It kinda fits in with the 'self incrimination' searches. I know this can be easily explained away...blood in the car etc. but it is still bugging me...

of course just my rambling thoughts and opinions...

good point Pickle and good posts here tonight I agree...I keep trying to read but nearly every post has me wanting to 'chat' about it and respond haha.

I really think you make an excellent point regarding the self incrimination. If he had been planning it for a while, he would have done at least a small amount of research (isnt that what you do when you are going to kill your wife?)....it is very odd that he waited until the 11th hour to suddenly say to himself 'gee, how should I act now that I've followed through on all the other aspects of my dastardly plan?'

It definitely seems like an action taken by someone who is a bit 'frantic' and trying to tie up loose ends as oppposed to someone 'following the plan'
thanks Pickle...its got me going on a whole new tangent..again! :banghead::banghead:

YoureNicked
07-12-2012, 06:35 AM
I don't think that she committed suicide but that GBC wanted to stage her murder as suicide. I don't think he would have been thinking rationally in terms of what others would believe but I agree with you about the logic of leaving a note if he intended this to look like suicide.

I agree with you Fergie...Gerard may have wanted Allison's death to look like a suicide but somewhere he changed his mind. I think the reason he changed his mind is per my post...that very few people would believe Allison would have taken her own life.

If GBC had tried to make it look like suicide, not many people would have believed it was possible Allison had killed herself...and therefore he would have drawn even more suspicion upon himself. So he changed his mind and didn't leave one car at Kholo Creek Bridge.

MOO

linette
07-12-2012, 06:37 AM
And also too much detail can set off alarm bells. I remember reading a long time ago about eyewitness accounts, and how trained interviewers can detect when someone is including too much detail that suggests they are 'elaborating' either intentionally or unintentionally.

I saw something to a couple of weeks ago, a guy called Paul who was a serial killer... police were suspicious when he could 'remember' exactly where he was on the occassion of the 3 killings even though they spanned a few weeks. He even went into detail about EXACTLY what he did on those days. They said nobody can recall that off the top of their head. True. You'd have to sit back and think about it.

Fergie
07-12-2012, 06:38 AM
Thanks for your reply. Sad, but I guess you're right. :(

My husband is a detective with QPS in an area where there are up to 7 murders a year and most of them are women in DV scenarios, some of whom have never been found. I find it sad that because these women come from a poor area where there is a lot of crime that the murder is reported but the next day fades into insignificance but because Allison is like many of us living in a comfortable "normal" suburb her murder becomes a topic of interest for many over a much longer period of time.

Mani
07-12-2012, 06:39 AM
I had wondered if police use canoes in their searches.. It appears from this they do!!!

The massive air and ground search, involving more than 80 police and 50 SES volunteers, continued across the town yesterday, with police divers scouring dams, officers on horseback, and others taking to the fast-flowing waters of Moggill Creek in canoes.


http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/queensland/baden-clay-arrives-at-police-station/story-e6freoof-1226341919352

I remember seeing SES paddling canoes and I thought they were searching at Mt Crosby Weir MOO

minni
07-12-2012, 06:39 AM
This may be the video of him coming out of police station.....& at 1.22 he took a swipe at one of the cameramen at the front of the car....I always remember that!!!

Search for missing woman now murder investigation - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D34mOPcYogs&feature=related)

Also on same video at .55 & .57 I wonder where those areas are.

Bless you Marly.. I am searching and searching and all I could come up with was it was the 30th and he was wearing pink!!!! you are a legend x

and wow :what:...the footage on this particular report is really really REALLY good in relation to the bridge...I am off to have a really good look at it and identify the shrubs, the trees, the position of Allison (as I have never been able to see her in the photos since day dot, even though nearly everyone could see her positioning clearly, and compare the differences to then and the photos Mani's wonderful hubby took the other day

Marly 'has totally earned her' Wings :hugs:

minni
07-12-2012, 06:41 AM
This may be the video of him coming out of police station.....& at 1.22 he took a swipe at one of the cameramen at the front of the car....I always remember that!!!

Search for missing woman now murder investigation - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D34mOPcYogs&feature=related)

Also on same video at .55 & .57 I wonder where those areas are.


Bless you Marly.. I am searching and searching and all I could come up with was it was the 30th and he was wearing pink!!!! you are a legend x

and wow :what:...the footage on this particular report is really really REALLY good in relation to the bridge...I am off to have a really good look at it and identify the shrubs, the trees, the position of Allison (as I have never been able to see her in the photos since day dot, even though nearly everyone could see her positioning clearly, and compare the differences to then and the photos Mani's wonderful hubby took the other day

Marly 'has totally earned her' Wings :blowkiss:

Fergie
07-12-2012, 06:42 AM
I agree with you Fergie...Gerard may have wanted Allison's death to look like a suicide but somewhere he changed his mind. I think the reason he changed his mind is per my post...that very few people would believe Allison would have taken her own life.

If GBC had tried to make it look like suicide, not many people would have believed it was possible Allison had killed herself...and therefore he would have drawn even more suspicion upon himself. So he changed his mind and didn't leave one car at Kholo Creek Bridge.

MOO

I wonder how many people who have had loved ones who committed suicide anticipated this or thought that it was possible. I am a health professional who have experience with families of those who have committed suicide who could not believe that this was possible. IMO.

marlywings
07-12-2012, 06:42 AM
I agree with you Fergie...Gerard may have wanted Allison's death to look like a suicide but somewhere he changed his mind. I think the reason he changed his mind is per my post...that very few people would believe Allison would have taken her own life.

If GBC had tried to make it look like suicide, not many people would have believed it was possible Allison had killed herself...and therefore he would have drawn even more suspicion upon himself. So he changed his mind and didn't leave one car at Kholo Creek Bridge.

MOO

After he'd given the four different "walk" versions I think he tried to make it appear she'd wandered off & had been abducted...in turn, some locals were concerned about it being a possible abduction which was why Inspector Ainsworth came out & said it wasn't a random attacker.

bellgirl
07-12-2012, 06:45 AM
I remember seeing SES paddling canoes and I thought they were searching at Mt Crosby Weir MOO

Me too! I saw the canoes. But I've also been waiting for someone to mention the Mt Crosby Weir (thanks Mani) as I was sure that it was mentioned in the very early days.

BJsleuth
07-12-2012, 06:45 AM
And also too much detail can set off alarm bells. I remember reading a long time ago about eyewitness accounts, and how trained interviewers can detect when someone is including too much detail that suggests they are 'elaborating' either intentionally or unintentionally.

Yep and if that TV interview was anything to go by, GBC is good at giving too many details and not directly answering what he's asked!

Thinking
07-12-2012, 06:45 AM
The question that I really struggle with is why didn't they leave Allison's car at Kholo Creek Bridge? GBC's story would have been so much more plausible if he said that he went to bed while Allison was watching the Footy Show and he woke in the morning to find her missing. If Allison had a history of depression (this is confirmed by many locals, well known IMO) thanks to GBC and his behavior and infidelities why didn't they leave the car at the bridge and both GBC and NBC return home in the other vehicle so that it looked like Allison drove to the bridge in her car after an argument and jumped off the bridge to commit suicide? The calls that night would have been difficult to explain but the scenario would have been more credible and more difficult to challenge. GBC could have said he woke at night and Allison was gone so he assumed she had gone out or gone to stay with a friend. He would have had a valid reason to call his parents to express his concern but they reassured him and he went back to sleep. As soon as they drove Allison's car back home the whole "story" became implausible. Is this stupidity or did something go wrong such that they could not leave Allison's car at Kholo Creek Bridge?

These are really good questions I think, Fergie. I do wonder if it was their intention all along to leave Allison's car at Anstead as it does make more sense for the reasons you have mentioned - but something happened to change their minds once out there. I have thought that this is perhaps why GBC stuffed up the "gone for a walk" story so many times - because this wasn't the original story he had in his head. The original story may have been "I left her watching TV, and when I woke she and the car were gone." or "she went for a drive and never came back". For some reason that plan changed on the night and he got himself all confused in the retelling - IMO (only speculating)

Mani
07-12-2012, 06:53 AM
:tyou: :tyou:


Wozzle :takeabow: lovely thought to send flowers and chockies to Indromum today - I need to thank her myself as she was very generous to Minni and I last weekend and she, like several people on WS are keeping the bridge looking beautiful with fresh flowers.

Indromum
07-12-2012, 06:55 AM
:yourock: Keentoknow - thank you for making and placing the cross at the bridge - it really is a bright yellow beacon - I know I have said it before but indulge me again - thanks for thinking of this lovely gesture. IMO

At some late stage we need to hire a mini bus and get our WS tushies up the coast and have a bbq on the beach near you and give cheers to Allison and WS for bringing us together.
Can I drive the bus please Mani?

Mani
07-12-2012, 06:58 AM
Me too! I saw the canoes. But I've also been waiting for someone to mention the Mt Crosby Weir (thanks Mani) as I was sure that it was mentioned in the very early days.

I should have found the link Bellgirl.....

http://www.news.com.au/national/horrific-end-hope-turns-to-heartbreak-as-search-for-killer-begins/story-e6frfkvr-1226343136055

kiwi50
07-12-2012, 07:01 AM
I remember we discussed it a lot on earlier threads, that look on Olivia's face and biting the lips etc during the video interview.
Now with the benefit of hindsight, what was her main concern, whether it was worry that he wouldn't be able to pull it off, or was it " something isn't right with your story"
I guess what I'm really saying is did she know or didn't she at that point. I can't recall if we established she was at NBC's house on the night of murder.
If she was there, I'm sure she did know what happened, especially now we know about gerard's scratches and how quick she was to provide a reason for them.

Mani
07-12-2012, 07:04 AM
Can I drive the bus please Mani?

Why not - sounds like a plan! :)

BJsleuth
07-12-2012, 07:04 AM
I remember we discussed it a lot on earlier threads, that look on Olivia's face and biting the lips etc during the video interview.
Now with the benefit of hindsight, what was her main concern, whether it was worry that he wouldn't be able to pull it off, or was it " something isn't right with your story"
I guess what I'm really saying is did she know or didn't she at that point. I can't recall if we established she was at NBC's house on the night of murder.
If she was there, I'm sure she did know what happened, especially now we know about gerard's scratches and how quick she was to provide a reason for them.

I took her lip biting to mean that she really wanted to speak to the reporter (and maybe be the centre of attention) and put her :twocents: in but was biting her lip while waiting her turn.

Mani
07-12-2012, 07:06 AM
I remember we discussed it a lot on earlier threads, that look on Olivia's face and biting the lips etc during the video interview.
Now with the benefit of hindsight, what was her main concern, whether it was worry that he wouldn't be able to pull it off, or was it " something isn't right with your story"
I guess what I'm really saying is did she know or didn't she at that point. I can't recall if we established she was at NBC's house on the night of murder.
If she was there, I'm sure she did know what happened, especially now we know about gerard's scratches and how quick she was to provide a reason for them.

I thought that she was standing so close to him - like a spouse would and although she appeared concerned - the more I watched it the more I saw her as controlling the situation like a minder does with a politician, making sure he didn't say the wrong thing - ready to jump in and correct him if he did! MOO

minni
07-12-2012, 07:06 AM
IMO GBC took Allison out to Kholo Creek Bridge in the Captiva and got bogged. GBC rang NBC to come and get him out of trouble. NBC went to the location and towed GBC out of trouble in the Prado. I think GBC planned to drive the cleaned Captiva back to Kholo Creek and leave it there with assistance from NBC after the children had been dropped off at school but before he reported her missing. Something happened on the morning of the 20 April that meant he could not drive the Captiva back to Kholo Creek Bridge before reporting Allison missing. Perhaps after speaking to the Dickies they had reason to call police and police attended before he could execute the last stage of the plan? MOO.

To be honest, the entire story and the entire bridge/camp/creek location seems off to me. Why, of ALL the possible scenarios he could have come up with, would he decide this if he was attempting to make her look suicidal, it seems WRONG...

"I'll take her out and 'plant' her at that bridge near the scout camp." Why in the hell would this be a plausible place that she might take herself? it would be bloody eerie and dark and just plain scary out there at night all by yourself... so what could make him think....'oh that is SO the spot that will substantiate my story'

Cant get my head around that.....sometimes I think that something DID go down out there that night, maybe between TM, GBC and Allison. Scratches even may have occurred here, during confrontation, before all parties left there ALIVE.

but no, Allison wouldnt leave the children home to chase after him, still, I dont see the relevance of this place unless it really was not planned and he had to make decisions quickly, hence, not much thought went into it. (starting to get a feel for this idea)

Mani
07-12-2012, 07:10 AM
I took her lip biting to mean that she really wanted to speak to the reporter (and maybe be the centre of attention) and put her :twocents: in but was biting her lip while waiting her turn.

I took it as a sign of nervousness IMO

Bayside
07-12-2012, 07:13 AM
After he'd given the four different "walk" versions I think he tried to make it appear she'd wandered off & had been abducted...in turn, some locals were concerned about it being a possible abduction which was why Inspector Ainsworth came out & said it wasn't a random attacker.

I think that was what he was going for too, and still will go that way.

minni
07-12-2012, 07:14 AM
I took her lip biting to mean that she really wanted to speak to the reporter (and maybe be the centre of attention) and put her :twocents: in but was biting her lip while waiting her turn.

http://www.businessballs.com/body-language.htm#mouth-body-language

biting the lip is typically a sign of nervousness, it often means anxiety or worryhttp://www.businessballs.com/body-language.htm#mouth-body-language

however, this is more interesting regarding the eyes shifting from side to side:

http://changingminds.org/techniques/body/parts_body_language/eyes_body_language.htmLateral movement

Eyes moving from side-to-side can indicate shiftiness and lying, as if the person is looking for an escape route in case they are found out.
Lateral movement can also happen when the person is being conspiratorial, as if they are checking that nobody else is listening.
Eyes may also move back and forth sideways (and sometimes up and down) when the person is visualizing a big picture and is literally looking it over.


yay...I linked

kiwi50
07-12-2012, 07:14 AM
IMO GBC took Allison out to Kholo Creek Bridge in the Captiva and got bogged. GBC rang NBC to come and get him out of trouble. NBC went to the location and towed GBC out of trouble in the Prado. I think GBC planned to drive the cleaned Captiva back to Kholo Creek and leave it there with assistance from NBC after the children had been dropped off at school but before he reported her missing. Something happened on the morning of the 20 April that meant he could not drive the Captiva back to Kholo Creek Bridge before reporting Allison missing. Perhaps after speaking to the Dickies they had reason to call police and police attended before he could execute the last stage of the plan? MOO.
Yes what you have said sounds perfectly feasible to me, I don't believe the car was meant to be found at their home.
Either this was the worst planned murder in history and GBC will be up for a darwin award, or it was not premeditated and it was total panic afterwards.

BreakingNews
07-12-2012, 07:16 AM
This may be the video of him coming out of police station.....& at 1.22 he took a swipe at one of the cameramen at the front of the car....I always remember that!!!

Search for missing woman now murder investigation - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D34mOPcYogs&feature=related)

Also on same video at .55 & .57 I wonder where those areas are.

In this video, isn't that the same shirt he had on the day he was arrested?

Mani
07-12-2012, 07:17 AM
To be honest, the entire story and the entire bridge/camp/creek location seems off to me. Why, of ALL the possible scenarios he could have come up with, would he decide this if he was attempting to make her look suicidal, it seems WRONG...

"I'll take her out and 'plant' her at that bridge near the scout camp." Why in the hell would this be a plausible place that she might take herself? it would be bloody eerie and dark and just plain scary out there at night all by yourself... so what could make him think....'oh that is SO the spot that will substantiate my story'

Cant get my head around that.....sometimes I think that something DID go down out there that night, maybe between TM, GBC and Allison. Scratches even may have occurred here, during confrontation, before all parties left there ALIVE.

but no, Allison wouldnt leave the children home to chase after him, still, I dont see the relevance of this place unless it really was not planned and he had to make decisions quickly, hence, not much thought went into it. (starting to get a feel for this idea)

Min, most of us don't have experiences of this kind (and rely on stories in the msm or crime stories) but would it be safe to say that if a woman was being strangled she would scratch her perpetrator on or near the face and neck, as apart from kicking, that would be one of the few things she could manage to do. IMO

BJsleuth
07-12-2012, 07:29 AM
http://www.businessballs.com/body-language.htm#mouth-body-language

biting the lip is typically a sign of nervousness, it often means anxiety or worryhttp://www.businessballs.com/body-language.htm#mouth-body-language

however, this is more interesting regarding the eyes shifting from side to side:

http://changingminds.org/techniques/body/parts_body_language/eyes_body_language.htmLateral movement

Eyes moving from side-to-side can indicate shiftiness and lying, as if the person is looking for an escape route in case they are found out.
Lateral movement can also happen when the person is being conspiratorial, as if they are checking that nobody else is listening.
Eyes may also move back and forth sideways (and sometimes up and down) when the person is visualizing a big picture and is literally looking it over.


yay...I linked

Whoohoo, well done!

Yeah I know the body language can have those meanings. I was thinking in terms of if she didn't know what had happened, why else she'd be anxious or nervous. I'm not convinced she knew anything at that stage but I could be wrong. MOO

Fergie
07-12-2012, 07:34 AM
To be honest, the entire story and the entire bridge/camp/creek location seems off to me. Why, of ALL the possible scenarios he could have come up with, would he decide this if he was attempting to make her look suicidal, it seems WRONG...

"I'll take her out and 'plant' her at that bridge near the scout camp." Why in the hell would this be a plausible place that she might take herself? it would be bloody eerie and dark and just plain scary out there at night all by yourself... so what could make him think....'oh that is SO the spot that will substantiate my story'

Cant get my head around that.....sometimes I think that something DID go down out there that night, maybe between TM, GBC and Allison. Scratches even may have occurred here, during confrontation, before all parties left there ALIVE.

but no, Allison wouldnt leave the children home to chase after him, still, I dont see the relevance of this place unless it really was not planned and he had to make decisions quickly, hence, not much thought went into it. (starting to get a feel for this idea)

If you are familiar with the area it is the only isolated place that you could make a suicide plausible by someone jumping from a bridge with enough height to cause death.

I was gobsmacked by the evidence at the bail hearing that indicated it was premeditated as I had always thought DV and Allison was killed in the heat of an argument. How wrong I was IMO.

marlywings
07-12-2012, 07:35 AM
In this video, isn't that the same shirt he had on the day he was arrested?

Yes it seems the same shirt....also looks like pink shirt in his party boy days...think he liked pink...lol. (photos courtesy of member DorkWhisperer)

24426

24427

24428

BreakingNews
07-12-2012, 07:44 AM
Yes it seems the same shirt....also looks like pink shirt in his party boy days...think he liked pink...lol. (photos courtesy of member DorkWhisperer)

24426

24427

24428
Maybe he only had one shirt - couldn't afford another. It probably went well with his mustard jacket.

Spotted Reptile
07-12-2012, 07:45 AM
Yes it seems the same shirt....also looks like pink shirt in his party boy days...think he liked pink...lol. (photos courtesy of member DorkWhisperer)



Gak. Make it STOP.

pickle99
07-12-2012, 07:47 AM
With regards to GBCs debts - as detailed here

http://www.news.com.au/national/gerard-baden-clay-conducting-ongoing-affair-at-time-of-wife-allisons-death-was-in-debt-and-had-inquired-about-her-life-insurance-police-affidavits-lodged-in-court-claim/story-e6frfkvr-1226406037780

The $335000 as guarantor on a mortgage - is this a debt because the person he is guaranteeing has failed to pay up on their mortgage? Or a potential debt IN CASE the person doesnt pay up on their mortgage?

Am I right in thinking either his debts were actually smaller if this is potential debt...or he is paying someone else's mortgage because they have defaulted?

minni
07-12-2012, 07:47 AM
Whoohoo, well done!

Yeah I know the body language can have those meanings. I was thinking in terms of if she didn't know what had happened, why else she'd be anxious or nervous. I'm not convinced she knew anything at that stage but I could be wrong. MOO

absolutely BJ...I would be hugely anxious if my brother was in the firing line AND I thought he might be guilty or not telling the truth..Id be biting away like crazy....and probably checking the hell out of the people listening to him

Ive said this many times, that Olivia's behaviour could easily be construed both ways MOO

Timmy
07-12-2012, 07:49 AM
Yes it seems the same shirt....also looks like pink shirt in his party boy days...think he liked pink...lol. (photos courtesy of member DorkWhisperer)

24426

24427

24428

That's almost as hard to watch as the interview!

BJsleuth
07-12-2012, 07:51 AM
absolutely BJ...I would be hugely anxious if my brother was in the firing line AND I thought he might be guilty or not telling the truth..Id be biting away like crazy....and probably checking the hell out of the people listening to him

Ive said this many times, that Olivia's behaviour could easily be construed both ways MOO

Minni, I have to be honest with you, my thoughts initially were the same as yours and I had to force myself to think outside of that and look for another reason for it.