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SoSueMe
05-18-2012, 11:30 AM
Thank you for joining Websleuths! :welcome3:



Please remember the following when discussing the Allison Baden-Clay case:
Websleuths is a moderated forum. We strive to discuss cases in a friendly environment.

Our rules can be reviewed here: The Rules (PLEASE make sure you know the rules!)


Gerard Bayden-Clay has been arrested and charged with the murder of Allison Bayden-Clay


Thread 1

Thread 2 (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=170913&page=46)
Thread 3 (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=171159&page=18)
Thread 4

Thread 5

Thread 6

Thread 7

Thread 8

Thread 9

Thread 10

Thread 11

Thread 12

Thread 13

Thread 14 (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=173624&page=37)
Thread 15

Thread 16

Thread 17

Thread 18

Thread 19

Thread 20

Thread 21 (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=8045871&posted=1#post8045871)
Thread 22

Thread 23

Thread 24

Thread 25

Thread 26

Thread 27

Thread 28

Thread 29

Thread 30

Thread 31 ( http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=177738)
Thread 32

Thread 33

Thread 34


REMEMBER: No cutting and pasting of comments from other social or media websites. You may paraphrase and provide a link.

The only social media sites allowed are those belonging to the victim, Gerard Baden-Clay and any named (by law enforcement) POI or Suspect, or site created and devoted to the murder of Allison.


Media/Timeline Reference Thread: CLICK HERE



CHAT ROOM: not for case discussion!

Kimster
05-22-2012, 10:05 AM
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Have you read the previous post? If not, read it now.
By posting on this thread, you are stating you know the rules!

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Kimster
05-27-2012, 11:26 AM
A list of our verified posters can be found here...

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If your not on our list and would like to be verified please contact Admin at the address below, its all confidential.
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Any post without this procedure will result in the post being removed without explanation and repeated violations could result in a loss of posting privileges.

imamaze
06-17-2012, 10:10 AM
We have a detailed, formal Terms of Service (TOS) posted separately, and that TOS is what you will be held to as a member here. It's long and detailed because it has to be in the world we live in, and you are expected to read it, understand it and abide by it. However, we can sum it up as follows:

1) Be a decent human being;
2) Treat your fellow posters as the decent human beings they are;
3) Keep in mind that whatever you post will likely live on forever, so think before you press "Submit Reply".
4) It's a big world. People will disagree with you. You will disagree with them. This can be done with respect, and that's what we expect.

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Please continue here...

summer_breeze
07-21-2012, 07:42 AM
Please do not discuss rumors. Although SOME rumors turn out to be true in the end, there are also those that are just that 'rumor,' and tend to derail the threads. Until there's a 'link' to verify a circumstance, we ask you do NOT post rumors.

This includes discussion of what the minor children "might" have said.

If locals wish to be verified (as local residents with insider information), then we would be able to discuss, unless the information might jeopardize the investigation or case.

Rational
07-28-2012, 12:52 AM
First hahaha!!!!

Timmy
07-28-2012, 12:53 AM
First hahaha!!!!

You're GOOD!

minni
07-28-2012, 12:54 AM
that is so unfair :(

Timmy
07-28-2012, 12:56 AM
Now! Where were we?

possumheart
07-28-2012, 12:57 AM
Just had a vision of a potato sack race.

possumheart
07-28-2012, 12:59 AM
Now! Where were we?

Indromum is trying to upload her photos, I am sure she will be back to us soon.

CJ60
07-28-2012, 01:02 AM
that is so unfair :(

Min -who is that dude in your profile pic?

Timmy
07-28-2012, 01:02 AM
Just had a vision of a potato sack race.

With Minni falling face first just before the finish line. ha!

Kimster
07-28-2012, 01:05 AM
Okay guys. Back to Allison's case or head over to the chit chat thread. :cheers:

Timmy
07-28-2012, 01:06 AM
Okay guys. Back to Allison's case or head over to the chit chat thread. :cheers:

Sorry Kimster! (again!) You are very patient with us.

Indromum
07-28-2012, 01:18 AM
Indromum is trying to upload her photos, I am sure she will be back to us soon.
I think I have a headache! Will try again tomorrow..............

pulpfiction
07-28-2012, 02:21 AM
Ok just caught up on what Kimster was saying - off topic stuff.

Ok...now to Nads & Mani who asked before what I thought about Little Ugly Creek and Allison being placed in water when she apparently hated it.

1. The idea Allison was placed in or around Little Ugly Creek because she was "beautiful" is just a romantic notion I feel. I don't believe GBC would have given that line of thinking a second thought and feel it wouldn't have even occurred to him to make any such connection. He was more interested in other things. I personally think its name says it all. It is a little, ugly creek IMO. I've been there.

2. As for the water, Allison hating it and putting her there as a final punishment. Nah. I'm still going with she was put there as it was close to the Brisbane river and decomposition was thought to be speedier I'd say and cause of death harder to detect. Burying in national park is futile I feel for GBC. He needed a body to be found - eventually. If he buried her it's riskier I feel all around.

J-Diggety
07-28-2012, 02:26 AM
Ok just caught up on what Kimster was saying - off topic stuff.

Ok...now to Nads & Mani who asked before what I thought about Little Ugly Creek and Allison being placed in water when she apparently hated it.

1. The idea Allison was placed in or around Little Ugly Creek because she was "beautiful" is just a romantic notion I feel. I don't believe GBC would have given that line of thinking a second thought and feel it wouldn't have even occurred to him to make any such connection. He was more interested in other things. I personally think its name says it all. It is a little, ugly creek IMO. I've been there.

2. As for the water, Allison hating it and putting her there as a final punishment. Nah. I'm still going with she was put there as it was close to the Brisbane river and decomposition was thought to be speedier I'd say and cause of death harder to detect. Burying in national park is futile I feel for GBC. He needed a body to be found - eventually. If he buried her it's riskier I feel all around.


Sanity resumes.

Great post and agree wholeheartedly with both points.

GBC has shown nothing to meet the notions that he displayed some thought processes around the resting place.

He's just a simple muppet

pulpfiction
07-28-2012, 03:15 AM
He's just a simple muppet

Oh that is so funny. A muppet indeed he is IMO. I've previously referred to him as a nimrod...exact same meaning:)

pulpfiction
07-28-2012, 03:21 AM
Interesting the friend who visited with the BCs...google him when you get time. I wonder if he's one of the people GBC had a gentlemans handshake deal with?! He's an accountant. Somehow I knew that before I googled him but had to convince myself. Pure speculation of course but people like GBC often have friends who are in the financial industry...convenient:)

Liadan
07-28-2012, 03:40 AM
Interesting the friend who visited with the BCs...google him when you get time. I wonder if he's one of the people GBC had a gentlemans handshake deal with?! He's an accountant. Somehow I knew that before I googled him but had to convince myself. Pure speculation of course but people like GBC often have friends who are in the financial industry...convenient:)


hmm coudl Rob be any relation to Ray, because Ray is a real estate agent in Brisbane. Do you think CM could have got the name wrong? Or do you think it is a relation?

DunnoZo
07-28-2012, 03:41 AM
:greetings:
Pssst, while it's so quiet, Hi CJ! :great: Good to have you back,been wondering where you went... wish we had some exciting news for you. :waiting: :anguish: :pullhair:

(soz Kimster..)

CJ60
07-28-2012, 03:46 AM
:greetings:
Pssst, while it's so quiet, Hi CJ! :great: Good to have you back,been wondering where you went... wish we had some exciting news for you. :waiting: :anguish: :pullhair:

(soz Kimster..)

I've been here - my posts keep getting deleted :floorlaugh:

possumheart
07-28-2012, 04:02 AM
Sweetest avatar CJ

knowledgethirsty
07-28-2012, 04:08 AM
Interesting the friend who visited with the BCs...google him when you get time. I wonder if he's one of the people GBC had a gentlemans handshake deal with?! He's an accountant. Somehow I knew that before I googled him but had to convince myself. Pure speculation of course but people like GBC often have friends who are in the financial industry...convenient:)

airline background too..

CJ60
07-28-2012, 04:08 AM
Sweetest avatar CJ

Yes - cute as! But look at my teeth! They pack a punch..

Is there anyone that can verify that? Anyone been attacked by a savage caterpillar lately?

possumheart
07-28-2012, 04:14 AM
Interesting the friend who visited with the BCs...google him when you get time. I wonder if he's one of the people GBC had a gentlemans handshake deal with?! He's an accountant. Somehow I knew that before I googled him but had to convince myself. Pure speculation of course but people like GBC often have friends who are in the financial industry...convenient:)

Based at toowongtower where GBC was last based

pulpfiction
07-28-2012, 04:18 AM
hmm coudl Rob be any relation to Ray, because Ray is a real estate agent in Brisbane. Do you think CM could have got the name wrong? Or do you think it is a relation?

Quite possibly brothers perhaps. The one you speak of is in the western suburbs so likely they knew each other (maybe). Probably wouldn't go down real well to rock up to AG and say "g'day...lost a bit of weight mate - btw can I have my money now thanks"!

pulpfiction
07-28-2012, 04:26 AM
Based at toowongtower where GBC was last based

Ah...explains a bit:) thank you

pulpfiction
07-28-2012, 04:28 AM
Does anyone know if GBC had a beard anytime prior to growing it after the "old razor" fiasco? I note in the CM article he has grown it back. Interesting.

Rational
07-28-2012, 04:32 AM
Does anyone know if GBC had a beard anytime prior to growing it after the "old razor" fiasco? I note in the CM article he has grown it back. Interesting.

May be thinking of joining the Taliban if he gets out!!

Flinders
07-28-2012, 04:40 AM
Hi everyone. Love all the posts. My iPad logs me out so it is frustrating not to say thanks. Sometimes Lurkers maybe us iPad users.

Giving a shout out to Kimster here. A couple of months ago when the discussion was going around in circles.... For example those who joined in April vs. July roundabouts, rivers, etc... We go over the same old things but the discussions is not old for new members.

So Kimster suggested and referenced to another WS forum about how to formulate a timeline including MSM facts, filling in the gaps with questions. Ive tried to Google it but it has something to do with 'did the car have gas' ie petrol.

BTW my MIL is visiting and after looking at my housework she is doing a victory dance because of my lack of dusting. Hahaha. Are winners grinners?

AAAA
07-28-2012, 04:53 AM
in the words of Bernard Fanning "i hope and I pray that the rainbow comes," and that the court case comes faster than we are lead to believe. I think all on here are wanting justice pronto!

AAAA
07-28-2012, 05:19 AM
Ok just caught up on what Kimster was saying - off topic stuff.

Ok...now to Nads & Mani who asked before what I thought about Little Ugly Creek and Allison being placed in water when she apparently hated it.

1. The idea Allison was placed in or around Little Ugly Creek because she was "beautiful" is just a romantic notion I feel. I don't believe GBC would have given that line of thinking a second thought and feel it wouldn't have even occurred to him to make any such connection. He was more interested in other things. I personally think its name says it all. It is a little, ugly creek IMO. I've been there.

2. As for the water, Allison hating it and putting her there as a final punishment. Nah. I'm still going with she was put there as it was close to the Brisbane river and decomposition was thought to be speedier I'd say and cause of death harder to detect. Burying in national park is futile I feel for GBC. He needed a body to be found - eventually. If he buried her it's riskier I feel all around.I'm not so sure that anyone, even the accused would be thinking clearly enough to purposely leave her there, i think it would have all been done on autopilot, not that thats an excuse. I think it was probably a case of "Oh ****, what do I do now?" However I also think that there are definately more players in this story. and they are going to get busted! IMO

AAAA
07-28-2012, 05:23 AM
Does anyone know if GBC had a beard anytime prior to growing it after the "old razor" fiasco? I note in the CM article he has grown it back. Interesting.never seen one before

Maigret
07-28-2012, 05:33 AM
Does anyone know if GBC had a beard anytime prior to growing it after the "old razor" fiasco? I note in the CM article he has grown it back. Interesting.

Of you google him and select images there are none of him with any facial hair prior to Allison's demise

J-Diggety
07-28-2012, 05:38 AM
Does anyone know if GBC had a beard anytime prior to growing it after the "old razor" fiasco? I note in the CM article he has grown it back. Interesting.

Of all the photos I've seen, he looks like the Datsun 180B car salesman of the year with no beard.

AAAA
07-28-2012, 05:43 AM
Of all the photos I've seen, he looks like the Datsun 180B car salesman of the year with no beard.
Haha so true. Whenever I saw him around he was always clean shaven, odd that now in jail he prefers the rugged look!

Nads
07-28-2012, 05:49 AM
He can't stand to look at his own face in the mirror any more to shave. Well, that's what I'd like to believe anyway.

I still am unsure she was left in water.

Am I the only one who doesn't want the trial to come? I'm quite happy he's rotting in jail (allegedly) and stewing, wasting money on lawyers and wasting away. Funny how he was happy and not gaunt just before he was sent to jail.

J-Diggety
07-28-2012, 05:51 AM
He can't stand to look at his own face in the mirror any more to shave. Well, that's what I'd like to believe anyway.

I still am unsure she was left in water.

Am I the only one who doesn't want the trial to come? I'm quite happy he's rotting in jail (allegedly) and stewing, wasting money on lawyers and wasting away. Funny how he was happy and not gaunt just before he was sent to jail.

I agree, i like the fact that he is having to stew without anything finite in his own life, apart from lights out, lights on every day.

AAAA
07-28-2012, 05:56 AM
He can't stand to look at his own face in the mirror any more to shave. Well, that's what I'd like to believe anyway.

I still am unsure she was left in water.

Am I the only one who doesn't want the trial to come? I'm quite happy he's rotting in jail (allegedly) and stewing, wasting money on lawyers and wasting away. Funny how he was happy and not gaunt just before he was sent to jail.

Wow, you lot are a tough crowd to get into. I do want the trial to hurry up 'cause I want to know for sure what evidence there is and that justice will be done. I don't like the thought that people can continue to hide behind lawyers and dates. Allison didn't get the chance to wait, hide, appeal, so why should anyone else? I would think that her family would want a quick, sharp sentence to their daughters killer! Rot in jail so to speak!

summer_breeze
07-28-2012, 05:58 AM
Hello everyone,

It is with great pleasure that the Moderators and Administrators of WebSleuths introduce to you the newest member of the MOD team!

Our very own Marlywings has accepted the role of WebSleuths moderator for Allison's sub forum and all the threads in the forum.

Kimster, myself and the other moderators will still be here and available, but Marly will be your primary contact for Allison's sub forum.

Please know that the other moderators are also here to support Marly as she steps into this new role.

The Mod team is very excited! Please join us in congratulating Marlywings!

AAAA
07-28-2012, 05:59 AM
And adding to my post, he's not wasting his own money on lawyers, he's wasting everybody's money that is silly enough to donate!

AAAA
07-28-2012, 06:03 AM
Hello everyone,

It is with great pleasure that the Moderators and Administrators of WebSleuths introduce to you the newest member of the MOD team!

Our very own Marlywings has accepted the role of WebSleuths moderator for Allison's sub forum and all the threads in the forum.

Kimster, myself and the other moderators will still be here and available, but Marly will be your primary contact for Allison's sub forum.

Please know that the other moderators are also here to support Marly as she steps into this new role.

The Mod team is very excited! Please join us in congratulating Marlywings!
YAY Marlywings! Great work!

KG1
07-28-2012, 06:04 AM
Hello everyone,

It is with great pleasure that the Moderators and Administrators of WebSleuths introduce to you the newest member of the MOD team!

Our very own Marlywings has accepted the role of WebSleuths moderator for Allison's sub forum and all the threads in the forum.

Kimster, myself and the other moderators will still be here and available, but Marly will be your primary contact for Allison's sub forum.

Please know that the other moderators are also here to support Marly as she steps into this new role.

The Mod team is very excited! Please join us in congratulating Marlywings!

But, but, but, she's ours! Well, you can't keep her for ever you know. Lol

Congratulations Marlywings, be kind to us.

possumheart
07-28-2012, 06:11 AM
Marly, can we call you MARGE?

Rational
07-28-2012, 06:11 AM
Hello everyone,

It is with great pleasure that the Moderators and Administrators of WebSleuths introduce to you the newest member of the MOD team!

Our very own Marlywings has accepted the role of WebSleuths moderator for Allison's sub forum and all the threads in the forum.

Kimster, myself and the other moderators will still be here and available, but Marly will be your primary contact for Allison's sub forum.

Please know that the other moderators are also here to support Marly as she steps into this new role.

The Mod team is very excited! Please join us in congratulating Marlywings!

Go Marly!!! You are the Queen!


Question? First Aussie moderator !?

J-Diggety
07-28-2012, 06:12 AM
Respect Marly

Rational
07-28-2012, 06:15 AM
Hello everyone,

It is with great pleasure that the Moderators and Administrators of WebSleuths introduce to you the newest member of the MOD team!

Our very own Marlywings has accepted the role of WebSleuths moderator for Allison's sub forum and all the threads in the forum.

Kimster, myself and the other moderators will still be here and available, but Marly will be your primary contact for Allison's sub forum.

Please know that the other moderators are also here to support Marly as she steps into this new role.

The Mod team is very excited! Please join us in congratulating Marlywings!

Thank you for all your hard work to date Kimster, Summer, ynotdivein, and all other mods. Hopefully you can now get some sleep at the times we all go crazy!!

In all seriousness all your work is hugely appreciated even though we are a bit crazy!

CJ60
07-28-2012, 06:17 AM
Hello everyone,

It is with great pleasure that the Moderators and Administrators of WebSleuths introduce to you the newest member of the MOD team!

Our very own Marlywings has accepted the role of WebSleuths moderator for Allison's sub forum and all the threads in the forum.

Kimster, myself and the other moderators will still be here and available, but Marly will be your primary contact for Allison's sub forum.

Please know that the other moderators are also here to support Marly as she steps into this new role.

The Mod team is very excited! Please join us in congratulating Marlywings!

Wonderful news!

Congratulations Marlywings! you are just the perfect poster for the role of Moderator!

So now, I promise to behave for you!

summer_breeze
07-28-2012, 06:23 AM
Go Marly!!! You are the Queen!


Question? First Aussie moderator !?

Yes indeed. In fact, first international moderator! (Outside of North America)

AAAA
07-28-2012, 06:24 AM
Marly, can we call you MARGE?

Hee Hee, Marge! Love it!

Rational
07-28-2012, 06:25 AM
Yes indeed. In fact, first international moderator! (Outside of North America)

Gold Australia Gold Gold Gold... Sorry have a bit of Olympic fever!!

On ya Marls you deserve it!

AAAA
07-28-2012, 06:26 AM
Respect Marly
J-Diggety is that like a fist pump?

AAAA
07-28-2012, 06:28 AM
Yes indeed. In fact, first international moderator! (Outside of North America)
Aussie Aussie Aussie OI OI OI!

Rational
07-28-2012, 06:28 AM
Wonderful news!

Congratulations Marlywings! you are just the perfect poster for the role of Moderator!

So now, I promise to behave for you!

I will not make any promises I cannot keep, but will treat you with all the respect all our mods deserve. I just have to remember if I am on he main thread or the chit chat one! :gasp:

marlywings
07-28-2012, 06:29 AM
Hello everyone,

It is with great pleasure that the Moderators and Administrators of WebSleuths introduce to you the newest member of the MOD team!

Our very own Marlywings has accepted the role of WebSleuths moderator for Allison's sub forum and all the threads in the forum.

Kimster, myself and the other moderators will still be here and available, but Marly will be your primary contact for Allison's sub forum.

Please know that the other moderators are also here to support Marly as she steps into this new role.

The Mod team is very excited! Please join us in congratulating Marlywings!

Thankyou very much summer, thanks also to all WS mods & also our Aussie members. I hope to give it my best shot....looking forward to working with all of you.

I'm a little bit embarrassed now but I'll be ok...lol..

DunnoZo
07-28-2012, 06:31 AM
:applause:Marlywings got her wings!:angel:

emirates1957
07-28-2012, 06:34 AM
Is there anything I could do in regards to this person having an airline background. Have worked for major airlines for 35 years..so if there is anything I could sleuth please let me know. I have been a victim of mental and emotional abuse....certainly nothing to the extent of others that have endured. As a family we are grieving the loss of a beloved 16 year old dog and planning a funeral and wake tomorrow. And then there is the Dickie family I could not even imagine for a split second what they are going through. I have close friends who own a real estate agenciy in QLD, was also in AFrica 2 months ago with a senior employee of the CM. I am a novice in sleuthing....so if there is anything I could help with down in Melbourne please let me know.

Bayside
07-28-2012, 06:39 AM
Wonderful news!

Congratulations Marlywings! you are just the perfect poster for the role of Moderator!

So now, I promise to behave for you!

Oh come on doesnt she deserve some sort of initiation at least lolol.

minni
07-28-2012, 06:39 AM
Hello everyone,

It is with great pleasure that the Moderators and Administrators of WebSleuths introduce to you the newest member of the MOD team!

Our very own Marlywings has accepted the role of WebSleuths moderator for Allison's sub forum and all the threads in the forum.

Kimster, myself and the other moderators will still be here and available, but Marly will be your primary contact for Allison's sub forum.

Please know that the other moderators are also here to support Marly as she steps into this new role.

The Mod team is very excited! Please join us in congratulating Marlywings!


ER MAH GERD!!!

Congrats Marly xx

Rational
07-28-2012, 06:40 AM
Is there anything I could do in regards to this person having an airline background. Have worked for major airlines for 35 years..so if there is anything I could sleuth please let me know. I have been a victim of mental and emotional abuse....certainly nothing to the extent of others that have endured. As a family we are grieving the loss of a beloved 16 year old dog and planning a funeral and wake tomorrow. And then there is the Dickie family I could not even imagine for a split second what they are going through. I have close friends who own a real estate agenciy in QLD, was also in AFrica 2 months ago with a senior employee of the CM. I am a novice in sleuthing....so if there is anything I could help with down in Melbourne please let me know.

Hi Emirates and welcome!!


Seen you lurking before so hope you feel at home soon.

I have been wondering if GBC had any plans or bookings just before or around the bail hearing??

Bayside
07-28-2012, 06:40 AM
Is there anything I could do in regards to this person having an airline background. Have worked for major airlines for 35 years..so if there is anything I could sleuth please let me know. I have been a victim of mental and emotional abuse....certainly nothing to the extent of others that have endured. As a family we are grieving the loss of a beloved 16 year old dog and planning a funeral and wake tomorrow. And then there is the Dickie family I could not even imagine for a split second what they are going through. I have close friends who own a real estate agenciy in QLD, was also in AFrica 2 months ago with a senior employee of the CM. I am a novice in sleuthing....so if there is anything I could help with down in Melbourne please let me know.

That is very nice of you to offer.

DunnoZo
07-28-2012, 06:41 AM
:welcome4:emirates 1957! I'm sorry for what you must be going through, a beloved pet is part of a family. Consider yourself part of the websleuth family now! we are her for you, and would love to know any details about conversations with this Sr. employee!

CJ60
07-28-2012, 06:41 AM
Oh come on doesnt she deserve some sort of initiation at least lolol.

Oopsy! Have I been misbehaving on the chitchat thread?? Timmy made me do it!

Bayside
07-28-2012, 06:42 AM
J-Diggety is that like a fist pump?

Lolol.

minni
07-28-2012, 06:42 AM
Thankyou very much summer, thanks also to all WS mods & also our Aussie members. I hope to give it my best shot....looking forward to working with all of you.

I'm a little bit embarrassed now but I'll be ok...lol..

Congratulations MW!!
Now, first up, we are going to need an ERMERGERD emoticon. It is of upmost importance. Can you hook us up please :D

minni
07-28-2012, 06:47 AM
Is there anything I could do in regards to this person having an airline background. Have worked for major airlines for 35 years..so if there is anything I could sleuth please let me know. I have been a victim of mental and emotional abuse....certainly nothing to the extent of others that have endured. As a family we are grieving the loss of a beloved 16 year old dog and planning a funeral and wake tomorrow. And then there is the Dickie family I could not even imagine for a split second what they are going through. I have close friends who own a real estate agenciy in QLD, was also in AFrica 2 months ago with a senior employee of the CM. I am a novice in sleuthing....so if there is anything I could help with down in Melbourne please let me know.

:wagon: Nice to meet you emirates :D

alioop
07-28-2012, 06:53 AM
Congratulations Marlywizz, you deserve the accolades. I hope your moderation duties include still being our search wizz because I am useless at searching. I can't even find where you posted your search tips!

AAAA
07-28-2012, 06:55 AM
Is there anything I could do in regards to this person having an airline background. Have worked for major airlines for 35 years..so if there is anything I could sleuth please let me know. I have been a victim of mental and emotional abuse....certainly nothing to the extent of others that have endured. As a family we are grieving the loss of a beloved 16 year old dog and planning a funeral and wake tomorrow. And then there is the Dickie family I could not even imagine for a split second what they are going through. I have close friends who own a real estate agenciy in QLD, was also in AFrica 2 months ago with a senior employee of the CM. I am a novice in sleuthing....so if there is anything I could help with down in Melbourne please let me know.

Hi Emerates. So good you are here. I am in a similar "group" to you, having been kicked, punched, bottles broken over my head etc. it's amazing how many stories are coming out. My husband has been amazing in trying to break through my barriers in regards to this, in fact he would love to meet the ex. I hope you have found someone to help you get past this. I thought I had until my husband of ten years, now 22 told me that I still hadn't let the walls down. All good now. Sorry, OT, sort of.

J-Diggety
07-28-2012, 06:59 AM
J-Diggety is that like a fist pump?

You know it, double fist pump with a woot woot!!

possumheart
07-28-2012, 07:02 AM
Is there anything I could do in regards to this person having an airline background. Have worked for major airlines for 35 years..so if there is anything I could sleuth please let me know. I have been a victim of mental and emotional abuse....certainly nothing to the extent of others that have endured. As a family we are grieving the loss of a beloved 16 year old dog and planning a funeral and wake tomorrow. And then there is the Dickie family I could not even imagine for a split second what they are going through. I have close friends who own a real estate agenciy in QLD, was also in AFrica 2 months ago with a senior employee of the CM. I am a novice in sleuthing....so if there is anything I could help with down in Melbourne please let me know.

BBM

I have done mostly what most men do,
And pushed it out of my mind;
But I can't forget, if I wanted to,
Four-Feet trotting behind.

Day after day, the whole day through --
Wherever my road inclined --
Four-feet said, "I am coming with you!"
And trotted along behind.

Now I must go by some other round, --
Which I shall never find --
Somewhere that does not carry the sound
Of Four-Feet trotting behind.
Rudyard Kipling

marlywings
07-28-2012, 07:04 AM
Thankyou again to everyone...much appreciated.

Hi & welcome emirates1957...nice to see you on board.

Timmy
07-28-2012, 07:05 AM
:fence:

Getting new shoes?

No- new legs!

AAAA
07-28-2012, 07:13 AM
No- new legs!
Spunky legs too! Lol

ollijack
07-28-2012, 07:14 AM
Clever girl sweet marly xxxxx

MaxwellSmart
07-28-2012, 07:15 AM
No- new legs!

How on EARTH are you going to chase caterpillars in those! Velcro soles perhaps?

ollijack
07-28-2012, 07:15 AM
Thankyou for the flowers on the bridge. Xxxxxxxxxxx

marlywings
07-28-2012, 07:19 AM
Congratulations Marlywizz, you deserve the accolades. I hope your moderation duties include still being our search wizz because I am useless at searching. I can't even find where you posted your search tips!

Thanks alioop...I posted the search tips in the old chat thread...if you look down to post #354 in this thread...

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=172214&page=15

AAAA
07-28-2012, 07:22 AM
Kind of OT, just had a quick squizz ( sorry Squizzey01) at the other forum and a poster is quoting from this site. "Sad for Allison" says " a poster from the other site visits prisoners in jail during the course of their work and posted that GBC'S done plenty of crying but has now settled down" maybe KTK has a fan?

AAAA
07-28-2012, 07:32 AM
I feel like I have too much to say, maybe because we are unable to say what we've heard recently, I.E. rumors. Marlywings what are the rules again?

pulpfiction
07-28-2012, 07:36 AM
Of you google him and select images there are none of him with any facial hair prior to Allison's demise

I say it's interesting as from a psychological standpoint it can mean several different things. Of course it can also just mean he can't be bothered shaving but it is interesting if he hasn't had facial hair before. Curious:)

AAAA
07-28-2012, 07:39 AM
I say it's interesting as from a psychological standpoint it can mean several different things. Of course it can also just mean he can't be bothered shaving but it is interesting if he hasn't had facial hair before. Curious:)
Also, if you're in jail, why bother? It's not as though any mistresses are going to see it. (I hope)

Maigret
07-28-2012, 07:41 AM
I say it's interesting as from a psychological standpoint it can mean several different things. Of course it can also just mean he can't be bothered shaving but it is interesting if he hasn't had facial hair before. Curious:)

If you don't mind answering what are the several different meanings???

Maigret
07-28-2012, 07:43 AM
Also, if you're in jail, why bother? It's not as though any mistresses are going to see it. (I hope)

I tend to think its because he has something to hide

possumheart
07-28-2012, 07:44 AM
GBC stopped shaving pretty much after 19/4 when he became BO IMO

marlywings
07-28-2012, 07:46 AM
I feel like I have too much to say, maybe because we are unable to say what we've heard recently, I.E. rumors. Marlywings what are the rules again?

WS rules as posted on first page of every thread...

The Rules - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

Rules about rumours as per Summer's post on first page.


Please do not discuss rumors. Although SOME rumors turn out to be true in the end, there are also those that are just that 'rumor,' and tend to derail the threads. Until there's a 'link' to verify a circumstance, we ask you do NOT post rumors.

This includes discussion of what the minor children "might" have said.

If locals wish to be verified (as local residents with insider information), then we would be able to discuss, unless the information might jeopardize the investigation or case.

Maigret
07-28-2012, 07:46 AM
gbc stopped shaving pretty much after 19/4 when he became bo imo

bo. ???

possumheart
07-28-2012, 07:50 AM
bo. ???

Overland, Bruce Overland

pulpfiction
07-28-2012, 08:13 AM
Of all the photos I've seen, he looks like the Datsun 180B car salesman of the year with no beard.

Yep...he doesn't do the "Century 21 Agents...Smarter, Bolder, Faster" much justice does he. When I met him a few years back he was a little on the slick side. Sweeping generalization I know, but he personified the quintessential real estate agent. Swooping in for a sale and full of ***** about the property he wanted me to look at. I did buy at Kenmore but we didn't like GBC. Did not seem genuine...just saying that's all.

pulpfiction
07-28-2012, 08:16 AM
GBC stopped shaving pretty much after 19/4 when he became BO IMO

That's what I thought hehe. I've always called him BO...he's a bit on the nose. But seriously, sometimes accused have done or do develop a bit of an alter ego - more so when incarcerated. Can be an attention thing but he's interesting given he was into BO before he was arrested.

Bayside
07-28-2012, 08:17 AM
I tend to think its because he has something to hide

I agree, a lot of them do it after ....murdering husbands I mean.

Rational
07-28-2012, 08:20 AM
I say it's interesting as from a psychological standpoint it can mean several different things. Of course it can also just mean he can't be bothered shaving but it is interesting if he hasn't had facial hair before. Curious:)

Maybe he started growing it to cover up the scratches. And he is now maintaining it to cover up for his cover up. I. Other words, pretending this is what he wanted to do when in reality he did it for another reason.

There may have also been an element that with his beard he looks remarkably like his brother!

TootsieFootsie
07-28-2012, 08:23 AM
:floorlaugh:




No- new legs!

TootsieFootsie
07-28-2012, 08:28 AM
Body Odour :dunno:

Oops I didn't read down far enough BO Bruce Overland


bo. ???

pulpfiction
07-28-2012, 08:39 AM
I'm popping over to JonBenet Ramsey for awhile. For those wondering if you can go the distance with potentially up to 3 years before a trial, spare a thought for thr JB Ramsey case. 15 years and still the mystery and sleuthing continues.

Fly on the Wall
07-28-2012, 08:54 AM
Hello everyone,

It is with great pleasure that the Moderators and Administrators of WebSleuths introduce to you the newest member of the MOD team!

Our very own Marlywings has accepted the role of WebSleuths moderator for Allison's sub forum and all the threads in the forum.

The Mod team is very excited! Please join us in congratulating Marlywings!

Congrats Marly, you will be amazing :rocker:

Even
07-28-2012, 08:59 AM
Anyone else notice that it could be said the opposite of Bruce Overland is Sheila Underwater...

mrs plod
07-28-2012, 09:02 AM
Maybe he started growing it to cover up the scratches. And he is now maintaining it to cover up for his cover up. I. Other words, pretending this is what he wanted to do when in reality he did it for another reason.

There may have also been an element that with his beard he looks remarkably like his brother!

Totally agree. Plus from experience with little children fighting and fingernail scratches on their face, there can be some scarring.

TootsieFootsie
07-28-2012, 09:05 AM
If it was Overlander, we could be on The Overlander Trail

The Overlander Trail -- Buddy Williams - YouTube

Curiousasacat
07-28-2012, 11:15 AM
Wow,blown away.....Congrats Marly......

Good luck keeping us all in line. LOL

Kimster
07-28-2012, 11:27 AM
Wow,blown away.....Congrats Marly......

Good luck keeping us all in line. LOL

Oh, she won't be alone in that task. :saber:

summer_breeze
07-28-2012, 12:11 PM
Oh, she won't be alone in that task. :saber:

hehehe. Not at all alone!

http://i273.photobucket.com/albums/jj222/Nonnie87/Smiley/107.gif

summer_breeze
07-28-2012, 12:30 PM
Also please note that alioop is now a verified attorney/solicitor in Australia.

The verified professionals document to be updated shortly, but I did want to let everyone know.

kailee
07-28-2012, 04:56 PM
good morning everyone :) can someone point me in the direction of the timeline thread? hoping it's up to date with all the latest, I've missed too many threads!

edit: actually, is there a current list of rumours/verified facts.. I found the timeline, not so far behind as I thought I was

Mountain Misst
07-28-2012, 05:17 PM
Now! Where were we?

Click those heels Dorothy. Go girl!!!!!!

Mountain Misst
07-28-2012, 05:19 PM
hmm coudl Rob be any relation to Ray, because Ray is a real estate agent in Brisbane. Do you think CM could have got the name wrong? Or do you think it is a relation?

Rob connection is in accountancy and flight centre history in common.....

minni
07-28-2012, 05:21 PM
Maybe he started growing it to cover up the scratches. And he is now maintaining it to cover up for his cover up. I. Other words, pretending this is what he wanted to do when in reality he did it for another reason.

There may have also been an element that with his beard he looks remarkably like his brother!


I have two trains of thought.

1. like the incessant way he held his phone to his face every single time he was in public, or held his daughters close to him, he feels exposed and worried that people will read his facial expressions and see right through him. Its highly possible that when he saw his video with the reporter that even he knew how untruthful and pathetic his face looked, and realised that, in this case at least, he can't lie for s***, so he'd better cover up.

Either that, or in his arrogance, he googled self incriminating, flicked over a few generalised pointers thinking he is too clever and special to need to do any thorough research, and misread it, not realising that it is incriminating to change your appearance after you murder someone, not the other way round.

Mountain Misst
07-28-2012, 05:25 PM
Haha so true. Whenever I saw him around he was always clean shaven, odd that now in jail he prefers the rugged look!

As long as he keeps the beard he can be in denial of the scratches episode ever having happened.

Maybe even has 'made up' a caterpillar phobia by now.

minni
07-28-2012, 05:28 PM
Anyone else notice that it could be said the opposite of Bruce Overland is Sheila Underwater...

wow Even, that is very very eerie........kind of freaks me out

Rational
07-28-2012, 06:32 PM
As long as he keeps the beard he can be in denial of the scratches episode ever having happened.

Maybe even has 'made up' a caterpillar phobia by now.

Maybe he is trying to hide it from himself as every time he sees it it goes against what he is trying to tell himself 'it is all a bad dream, someone else did it, right Bruce!!?'

Mani
07-28-2012, 06:45 PM
:guitar:
Congratulations to Marly on becoming a Mod and to Alioop on your verification.:woohoo:

:fireworks:

CJ60
07-28-2012, 06:50 PM
Maybe he is trying to hide it from himself as every time he sees it it goes against what he is trying to tell himself 'it is all a bad dream, someone else did it, right Bruce!!?'

If someone is a 'pathological' liar - do they not believe their lies are 'real?'

It amazes me that anyone could keep lying in this situation. Is pathological lying associated with any type of personality disorder?

(I'm not a Psychologist)

KG1
07-28-2012, 06:59 PM
As long as he keeps the beard he can be in denial of the scratches episode ever having happened.

Maybe even has 'made up' a caterpillar phobia by now.

When he was court ordered to shave the beard off, hopefully police photographs of his appearance then were obtained. If so, any proof of scarring at that time would become evidence.

Mani
07-28-2012, 07:12 PM
If someone is a 'pathological' liar - do they not believe their lies are 'real?'

It amazes me that anyone could keep lying in this situation. Is pathological lying associated with any type of personality disorder?

(I'm not a Psychologist)

I think that is the nature of pathological lying - they can't help themselves CJ.

appleblossom
07-28-2012, 08:03 PM
I've been thinking about the name 'Bruce OVERLAND'.

I found this site with a meaning of the word OVERLAND, 'adventure'.
http://www.overlandafrica.com/about_overlanding

Was he planning on getting away with murder, paying out the debts with the insurance and starting an 'adventure' with TM and the girls in Africa? Could that have been part of the reason he didn't get bail?

I was googling 'Overland' and GBC and came across a forum poster called 'kay' on another website, that made large interesting comments regarding 'Overland 4WD tours', and the Baden-Clay family. (at the bottom of the page)
http://aussiecriminals.com.au/2012/05/23/allison-baden-clay-murder-investigation-everyone-is-under-pressure/

I also note the similarities in the Rayney murder..

Mr Rayney had a "great deal" to gain from Mrs Rayney's death, Mr Agius said, because the couple owned numerous investment properties together and she had two superannuation policies and a life insurance policy.
Mr Agius said the death was "planned" to remove the embarrassment of a divorce and preserve his career.

In the days before she was killed, Corryn Rayney wrote an email to her sister stating her husband and accused murderer, Lloyd Rayney, was "having an affair".

http://www.watoday.com.au/wa-news/rayney-murder-trial-the-prosecutions-opening-statement-continues-20120717-227j2.html#ixzz21xt78NsZ

AAAA
07-28-2012, 08:21 PM
I've been thinking about the name 'Bruce OVERLAND'.

I found this site with a meaning of the word OVERLAND, 'adventure'.
http://www.overlandafrica.com/about_overlanding

Was he planning on getting away with murder, paying out the debts with the insurance and starting an 'adventure' with TM and the girls in Africa? Could that have been part of the reason he didn't get bail?

I was googling 'Overland' and GBC and came across a forum poster called 'kay' on another website, that made large interesting comments regarding 'Overland 4WD tours', and the Baden-Clay family. (at the bottom of the page)
http://aussiecriminals.com.au/2012/05/23/allison-baden-clay-murder-investigation-everyone-is-under-pressure/[/ur
I also note the similarities in the Rayney murder..

Mr Rayney had a "great deal" to gain from Mrs Rayney's death, Mr Agius said, because the couple owned numerous investment properties together and she had two superannuation policies and a life insurance policy.
Mr Agius said the death was "planned" to remove the embarrassment of a divorce and preserve his career.

In the days before she was killed, Corryn Rayney wrote an email to her sister stating her husband and accused murderer, Lloyd Rayney, was "having an affair".

[url]http://www.watoday.com.au/wa-news/rayney-murder-trial-the-prosecutions-opening-statement-continues-20120717-227j2.html#ixzz21xt78NsZhow bizarre!

frustrated detective
07-28-2012, 08:24 PM
That's what I thought hehe. I've always called him BO...he's a bit on the nose. But seriously, sometimes accused have done or do develop a bit of an alter ego - more so when incarcerated. Can be an attention thing but he's interesting given he was into BO before he was arrested.

Just pondering that IF GBC does have traits of Narcissist personality disorder (as has been suggested many times on this forum), then his main preoccupation would be to get his narcissistic supply of admiration, pity, attention and so on.

Now that he is restricted to the inside (with limited contact with the outside) his supply would have to come from the inside. In that case he would simply discard the previous sources of supply. It would just be a matter of moving on to the next candidates within the prison system.

My father - who I now think had NPD - discarded nearly all his previous supply when he went into a nursing home in his 80s. This included loyal friends from his childhood, one of his two daughters (me) and many others.

He was getting his supply from residents and staff who were part of his new everyday life and didn't need the others anymore.

At the time I could not comprehend his actions. But with my current understanding of NPD I can see that it was a predictable outcome for his personality type.

All very interesting to observe, but very painful to be one of the discarded ones.

Mani
07-28-2012, 08:37 PM
1. The idea Allison was placed in or around Little Ugly Creek because she was "beautiful" is just a romantic notion I feel. I don't believe GBC would have given that line of thinking a second thought and feel it wouldn't have even occurred to him to make any such connection. He was more interested in other things. I personally think its name says it all. It is a little, ugly creek IMO. I've been there.

2. As for the water, Allison hating it and putting her there as a final punishment. Nah. I'm still going with she was put there as it was close to the Brisbane river and decomposition was thought to be speedier I'd say and cause of death harder to detect. Burying in national park is futile I feel for GBC. He needed a body to be found - eventually. If he buried her it's riskier I feel all around.

Pulps - I am a realist. Thanks for your input but it isn't delving into what I was after.

If GBC disliked Allison enough to murder her then the place he put her shows that dislike. IMO

I also think Allison was the true achiever in that relationship, as evidenced by her past and that can create anger and jealousy in a narcissist.

I was hoping for a psychological profiling from you as to what you have derived from his personality. You may have already done this in a former thread though that I have missed.

Cheers

marlywings
07-28-2012, 08:42 PM
Thanks again everyone for the congrats....much appreciated.

Thanks again also to Kimster & Summer...glad I've got you guys by my side ;)

Mani
07-28-2012, 08:43 PM
Just pondering that IF GBC does have traits of Narcissist personality disorder (as has been suggested many times on this forum), then his main preoccupation would be to get his narcissistic supply of admiration, pity, attention and so on.

Now that he is restricted to the inside (with limited contact with the outside) his supply would have to come from the inside. In that case he would simply discard the previous sources of supply. It would just be a matter of moving on to the next candidates within the prison system.

My father - who I now think had NPD - discarded nearly all his previous supply when he went into a nursing home in his 80s. This included loyal friends from his childhood, one of his two daughters (me) and many others.

He was getting his supply from residents and staff who were part of his new everyday life and didn't need the others anymore.

At the time I could not comprehend his actions. But with my current understanding of NPD I can see that it was a predictable outcome for his personality type.

All very interesting to observe, but very painful to be one of the discarded ones.

One thing is for sure - the members on here have taught us more about personality disorders than most of us would have exposure to/experience of.

Thank you for your story Frustrated, this must have been a very painful experience to go through with your dad. :) x

Mani
07-28-2012, 08:46 PM
Doc,

In your practice (as a medico not a specialist so might have been a while ago) - did you come across narcissistic personalities (and others) and did it stand out to you?

I know you are not a psychologist but do these tendencies stand out?

Nads
07-28-2012, 09:04 PM
:truce:
Doc,

In your practice (as a medico not a specialist so might have been a while ago) - did you come across narcissistic personalities (and others) and did it stand out to you?

I know you are not a psychologist but do these tendencies stand out?

That would be pretty hard to get from 15 minute consultations IMO where you are concentrating on the task at hand.

BreakingNews
07-28-2012, 09:09 PM
If someone is a 'pathological' liar - do they not believe their lies are 'real?'

It amazes me that anyone could keep lying in this situation. Is pathological lying associated with any type of personality disorder?

(I'm not a Psychologist)

My understanding of a pathological liar is someone who continually lies (usually to make themselves look good) and they really believe what they say is the truth. If not at the start, they quickly come to believe this as their truth. But I'm a psychologist either.

Timmy
07-28-2012, 09:11 PM
My understanding of a pathological liar is someone who continually lies (usually to make themselves look good) and they really believe what they say is the truth. If not at the start, they quickly come to believe this as their truth. But I'm a psychologist either.

Oh no! I think I'm a pathological liar! But if I am so is CJ!!!

DrWatson
07-28-2012, 09:19 PM
Doc,

In your practice (as a medico not a specialist so might have been a while ago) - did you come across narcissistic personalities (and others) and did it stand out to you?

I know you are not a psychologist but do these tendencies stand out?

It was indeed a while ago ;)

Except for the colleagues with narcissistic tendencies, that is - and there are a few around....

They're the ones that always have to go one better. No matter what you say or do, they've done just that bit more. One in particular, I can think of - is so predictable, that my wife and I often have a chuckle and a bet. I'll deliberately say something, having predicted what his reply will involve, and it always works.

There is one area in which I have been the only one in Oz doing what I do for many years, and only over the last 3 or 4 years is it becoming a little more widespread through the training fellows I've had. But that galled the particular person referred to above no end - because he couldn't trump me on that particular thing. I won't specify what it was, exactly, but it got right up his nose for years.

So yes - I have come across that personality type, but I've never been involved in the treatment of them (if there IS a treatment), not being a psychiatrist and all....

minni
07-28-2012, 09:20 PM
Just pondering that IF GBC does have traits of Narcissist personality disorder (as has been suggested many times on this forum), then his main preoccupation would be to get his narcissistic supply of admiration, pity, attention and so on.

Now that he is restricted to the inside (with limited contact with the outside) his supply would have to come from the inside. In that case he would simply discard the previous sources of supply. It would just be a matter of moving on to the next candidates within the prison system.

My father - who I now think had NPD - discarded nearly all his previous supply when he went into a nursing home in his 80s. This included loyal friends from his childhood, one of his two daughters (me) and many others.

He was getting his supply from residents and staff who were part of his new everyday life and didn't need the others anymore.

At the time I could not comprehend his actions. But with my current understanding of NPD I can see that it was a predictable outcome for his personality type.

All very interesting to observe, but very painful to be one of the discarded ones.

Thanks Frustrated....it will be interesting to watch if he goes through this type of process. It will also be terribly sad if he does because there are three little people who would still love him very much, regardless.

I have no experience with narcissists or sociopathic people as such, but I think that one of the first experiences they have when they are caught and go to jail, is severe depression. They may not feel empathy or care for the suffering of others, but they certainly feel it for themselves. ONce they no longer have control over anything, they sink very low. I have heard many kill themselves as a final act of control.

If this is this case (and I have no real idea, I just read a lot), then I would say the latest MSM report shows he is right there in the throes of self pity and depression at the moment and not at all coping with the control being taken from him.
MOO MOO MOO MOO MOO

minni
07-28-2012, 09:32 PM
Good old WIKI

Narcissistic personality disorder - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Symptoms of this disorder may include, but are not limited to:


Reacting to criticism with anger, shame, or humiliation
Taking advantage of others to reach their own goals
Exaggerating their own importance, achievements, and talents
Imagining unrealistic fantasies of success, beauty, power, intelligence, or romance
Requiring constant attention and positive reinforcement from others
Easily becoming jealous
Lacking empathy and disregarding the feelings of others
Being obsessed with oneself
Mainly pursuing selfish goals
Trouble keeping healthy relationships
Easily becoming hurt and rejected
Setting goals that are unrealistic
Wanting "the best" of everything
Appearing unemotional

I think from all accounts, from people who knew GBC and from information gathered over the last three months, it would be hard not to consider that he either has NPD or at least traits of that, comorbid with other personality disorders.

minni
07-28-2012, 09:39 PM
Hey Marlywings-shouldn't your name be bolded down in the members and guests box now. Or are you only sometimes a moderator and sometimes a sleuther? How does it work?

Marly's a "mini-mod" being bolded must come with experience ;)

frustrated detective
07-28-2012, 09:39 PM
Good old WIKI

Narcissistic personality disorder - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcissistic_personality_disorder)

Symptoms of this disorder may include, but are not limited to:


Reacting to criticism with anger, shame, or humiliation
Taking advantage of others to reach their own goals
Exaggerating their own importance, achievements, and talents
Imagining unrealistic fantasies of success, beauty, power, intelligence, or romance
Requiring constant attention and positive reinforcement from others
Easily becoming jealous
Lacking empathy and disregarding the feelings of others
Being obsessed with oneself
Mainly pursuing selfish goals
Trouble keeping healthy relationships
Easily becoming hurt and rejected
Setting goals that are unrealistic
Wanting "the best" of everything
Appearing unemotional

I think from all accounts, from people who knew GBC and from information gathered over the last three months, it would be hard not to consider that he either has NPD or at least traits of that, comorbid with other personality disorders.

Yes, and another trait is reacting with rage if they are criticised or don't get what they want (possibly murderous rage?)

Definitely, as Doc mentioned, always have to be one up on everyone. With my father his sufferings were always worse, e.g. for every childhood suffering of mine, it was always "worse in the depression years" or "worse in the army" etc...

No doubt, it is "worse in prison" than being murdered for GBC, I would guess.

Mani
07-28-2012, 09:56 PM
:truce:

That would be pretty hard to get from 15 minute consultations IMO where you are concentrating on the task at hand.

True Nads, but what I am asking is about these sociopaths etc that live amongst us - would a medical practitioner be aware that their patient was suffering from this kind of condition.

Mani
07-28-2012, 09:59 PM
It was indeed a while ago ;)

Except for the colleagues with narcissistic tendencies, that is - and there are a few around....

They're the ones that always have to go one better. No matter what you say or do, they've done just that bit more. One in particular, I can think of - is so predictable, that my wife and I often have a chuckle and a bet. I'll deliberately say something, having predicted what his reply will involve, and it always works.

There is one area in which I have been the only one in Oz doing what I do for many years, and only over the last 3 or 4 years is it becoming a little more widespread through the training fellows I've had. But that galled the particular person referred to above no end - because he couldn't trump me on that particular thing. I won't specify what it was, exactly, but it got right up his nose for years.

So yes - I have come across that personality type, but I've never been involved in the treatment of them (if there IS a treatment), not being a psychiatrist and all....

Sorry I read from bottom of page upwards Nads and Doc has answered my query! LOL We have had a lot of talk on here about all sorts of personality disorders.

Thank you Doc - this is the answer I was looking for from the clinical experience of a medical professional who doesn't work in that field but who comes into contact with all types of characters throughout their normal working day. Cheers

they'll get you
07-28-2012, 10:22 PM
I worked in a particular real estate agency for 2 years and saw the fake ‘facades’, the bigger the agencies the more influential and impressive they look to the public with large amounts of staff & new, big flashy cars. The real estate agency I worked for was one of those who couldn’t pay our wages/commissions on time and yes the principal and sales girl had a long standing affair. The affair was easily hidden due to ‘evening appraisals’, ‘long business meetings’ weeks away ’ corporate & franchise conventions’ all at the company expense. I was only aware of the wife from the rumours but I hadn’t met her in the two years I worked there, unfortunately, like ABC she was last to know. One day the Mrs turned up sobbing at the office and all hell broke loose, the sales girl who was having the affair flew out the back door at the directions of the owner who said he’ll take care of the situation. We heard some of the confrontation until he took the Mrs away from the office. He (the slime) was exposed! He was a bully & would always get his way. Similarities? Ultimately there was a divorce and the owner & salesgirl continue together in that agency. He is now living with the salesgirl in her highly mortgaged home because the little Mrs took him for everything! Haha Justice! ...... I noticed the similarities as there seemed so many ‘ hangers on’ with GBC’s company, poor Allison must have seen all her dreams just slipping away.....so very very unfair and spineless.....he didn’t need to take her life.

CJ60
07-28-2012, 10:23 PM
My understanding of a pathological liar is someone who continually lies (usually to make themselves look good) and they really believe what they say is the truth. If not at the start, they quickly come to believe this as their truth. But I'm a psychologist either.

Thanks, BreakingNews!

I just did a double take!!! Thought I had come back as the 'cow!' No, I am now a caterpillar!

minni
07-28-2012, 10:26 PM
wow, so similar...Im glad he didnt think killing her was the most beneficial way for him to get what he wanted.

CJ60
07-28-2012, 10:27 PM
Oh no! I think I'm a pathological liar! But if I am so is CJ!!!

:floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

Timmy
07-28-2012, 10:34 PM
Thanks, BreakingNews!

I just did a double take!!! Thought I had come back as the 'cow!' No, I am now a caterpillar!

I did too! I thought you were quoting yourself! I love it when people quote themselves!!! :)

DrWatson
07-28-2012, 10:44 PM
Brain surgery is NOT a laughing matter!

You're right - it's white and grey matter.... ;)

Timmy
07-28-2012, 10:48 PM
You're right - it's white and grey matter.... ;)

I know my stuff!

minni
07-28-2012, 10:54 PM
I know my stuff!

just not what a gastroenterologist is hey, thats a bit tricky ;)

Timmy
07-28-2012, 10:59 PM
just not what a gastroenterologist is hey, thats a bit tricky ;)

Minni- it's just not my field of specialty!

minni
07-28-2012, 11:20 PM
I was just looking through a folder I have on my desktop, and its obviously written earlier on, but its a bit of a compilation of theories about GBC and father mostly, but olso other theories involving financial problems. some of it is mine and some of it is grabbed from other posters theories. But this one is pretty much on the money. I think maybe its written by Keyboredom, but I didn't reference :what:

Marly you could probably find that when you have time, please?


My guess is that the eventual case will involve a son and father, underlying financial motivation, heat of the moment anger/confusion, then panic, coupled with unexpected witnesses and a lack of support from people who might be expected to help the perpetrators when everything comes out. Completely JMO. I have no evidence who the murderer/accomplice is.

Nads
07-28-2012, 11:53 PM
You're right - it's white and grey matter.... ;)

And Psychology is 50 Shades of Grey matter.

Edit- oops, back on track.

Will the marriage counsellor Allison and the accused saw be called as a witness do you think? Reckon they'd have anything interesting to say?

Saw a true crime story on tv yesterday. Over 20 years after the crime there were advancements in DNA technology and 3 brothers were arrested simultaneously (because of their close DNA). Two of them answered questions and were cooperative. One wasn't cooperative and wouldn't talk. Guess which ones DNA ended up being the exact match and he ended up pleading guilty?

they'll get you
07-28-2012, 11:57 PM
Gerard Baden-Clay has emotional reunion with parents-I am intrigued with the wording of this article that GBC was forced to talk to mother and father Elaine and Nigel, FORCED? Why FORCED and by whom? Has he taken a fall for his parents or scared they may say something during the recorded meeting?

http://www.news.com.au/national/gerard-baden-clays-has-emotional-reunion-with-parents/story-fndo4ckr-1226437064918

minni
07-28-2012, 11:59 PM
Gerard Baden-Clay has emotional reunion with parents-I am intrigued with the wording of this article that GBC was forced to talk to mother and father Elaine and Nigel, FORCED? Why FORCED and by whom? Has he taken a fall for his parents or scared they may say something during the recorded meeting?

http://www.news.com.au/national/gerard-baden-clays-has-emotional-reunion-with-parents/story-fndo4ckr-1226437064918


and was forced to talk to mother and father Elaine and Nigel, and friend Rob Cheesman through a wall of glass when they came to visit him on Thursday morning.

It just means he was forced to talk through the glass partition, rather than be allowed face to face contact I think

Nads
07-29-2012, 12:03 AM
Gerard Baden-Clay has emotional reunion with parents-I am intrigued with the wording of this article that GBC was forced to talk to mother and father Elaine and Nigel, FORCED? Why FORCED and by whom? Has he taken a fall for his parents or scared they may say something during the recorded meeting?

http://www.news.com.au/national/gerard-baden-clays-has-emotional-reunion-with-parents/story-fndo4ckr-1226437064918


I think the wording means he was forced to talk to them through a glass wall. rather than meaning he was forced to talk to them.

Edit - Minni, you were too quick for me!

Don't you think being gaunt and tired looking is a great way of getting pity and attention? The narcissistic husband I had would get this hangdog look and pretend to be sick or sore or exhausted every time he saw his mother as he knew she was the only one who would be sucked in by this. Oh, I guess the floozie was too.

Woodstock
07-29-2012, 12:28 AM
I was just looking through a folder I have on my desktop, and its obviously written earlier on, but its a bit of a compilation of theories about GBC and father mostly, but olso other theories involving financial problems. some of it is mine and some of it is grabbed from other posters theories. But this one is pretty much on the money. I think maybe its written by Keyboredom, but I didn't reference :what:

Marly you could probably find that when you have time, please?


My guess is that the eventual case will involve a son and father, underlying financial motivation, heat of the moment anger/confusion, then panic, coupled with unexpected witnesses and a lack of support from people who might be expected to help the perpetrators when everything comes out. Completely JMO. I have no evidence who the murderer/accomplice is.

Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, 43, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 #20 - Page 7 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

Found it! This is my first post but I've been following Allison's sad, sad story for many weeks now.

Minni and keyboredom, your scenario sounds highly likely to me, and may be the reason we're struggling to make sense of the clues that are available to us. It's not easy for me to sit at my keyboard and try to explain the actions and motives of someone who's angry, confused, panicked, and/or unexpectedly witnessed.

Liadan
07-29-2012, 12:29 AM
I tend to think its because he has something to hide


Yes I think GBC does the beard thing cause he is morphing into a different character. He doesn't need the GBC persona of RE Agent with honesty and integrity now, he needs to change to adapt to jail. So the beard and probably the lack of 5 star lunches and no personal trainer are going to tell on his frame. So he becomes more aligned with the BO persona one that he can mould to suit his new situation. Still GBC but more BO.
Narcisissts keep things at a distance from everyone -some have been known to have double families that each of the wives knows nothing about. (albeit different cities)

Maybe he thinks that TM likes the beard. And I must say I hope TM got to give GBC a real good serve before he got to jail. I am sure she would have had her suspicions - the police practically grilled her. She probably had the most dollars invested as he was planning for a brighter future with a cash cow in TM. No disprespect intended to TM with that cow comment.

:congrats:
Also ****:cheer:******Congrats Marley wings************
ace work GAL

minni
07-29-2012, 12:37 AM
Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, 43, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 #20 - Page 7 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=8032451)

Found it! This is my first post but I've been following Allison's sad, sad story for many weeks now.

Minni and keyboredom, your scenario sounds highly likely to me, and may be the reason we're struggling to make sense of the clues that are available to us. It's not easy for me to sit at my keyboard and try to explain the actions and motives of someone who's angry, confused, panicked, and/or unexpectedly witnessed.

:welcome4: Woodstock!!

It's nice to meet you!! Thanks for finding it.....so it was KB!! his posts are well worth reading hey??
most of his actions seem unexplainable to the average person I suppose. (gbc's actions...not KeyBoredoms haha)

Makara
07-29-2012, 12:42 AM
Congratulations Marly. I know you'll do an awesome job.

http://i475.photobucket.com/albums/rr120/Angelintown/Smiley%20diversen/smiley_champagne.gif

Kimster
07-29-2012, 12:44 AM
Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, 43, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 #20 - Page 7 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=8032451)

Found it! This is my first post but I've been following Allison's sad, sad story for many weeks now.

Minni and keyboredom, your scenario sounds highly likely to me, and may be the reason we're struggling to make sense of the clues that are available to us. It's not easy for me to sit at my keyboard and try to explain the actions and motives of someone who's angry, confused, panicked, and/or unexpectedly witnessed.

:welcome:

:wagon:

I just love Peanuts!

Opinionsgalore
07-29-2012, 12:53 AM
Gerard Baden-Clay has emotional reunion with parents-I am intrigued with the wording of this article that GBC was forced to talk to mother and father Elaine and Nigel, FORCED? Why FORCED and by whom? Has he taken a fall for his parents or scared they may say something during the recorded meeting?

http://www.news.com.au/national/gerard-baden-clays-has-emotional-reunion-with-parents/story-fndo4ckr-1226437064918

I'm intrigued that the word 'forced' was used twice. Once in relation to the non contact visit and the other in relation to his beard removal. It's unusual to see the same adjective used twice in a news story. Usually the same adjective is re used to re- iterate a point.
It's probably nothing - but it caught my attention.

minni
07-29-2012, 01:03 AM
I'm intrigued that the word 'forced' was used twice. Once in relation to the non contact visit and the other in relation to his beard removal. It's unusual to see the same adjective used twice in a news story. Usually the same adjective is re used to re- iterate a point.
It's probably nothing - but it caught my attention.

I think the media are getting some satisfaction with their use of words. They may think its nice for people who believe him to be guilty (ie, the major population) to read how he is being forced against his will to do things. Maybe he reads the paper and its just a little dig at him, and small way to humiliate and belittle him the way they think he did his wife??

no idea really, just filling time!

Opinionsgalore
07-29-2012, 01:11 AM
I think the media are getting some satisfaction with their use of words. They may think its nice for people who believe him to be guilty (ie, the major population) to read how he is being forced against his will to do things. Maybe he reads the paper and its just a little dig at him, and small way to humiliate and belittle him the way they think he did his wife??

no idea really, just filling time!

I do a bit of amateur study in linguistics, and it's a VERY strong word. I read it (twice) and thought it was geared towards those who think he's innocent.

Yes, I'm filling time too :)

ALL MOO

OakingtonAve
07-29-2012, 01:14 AM
Haha so true. Whenever I saw him around he was always clean shaven, odd that now in jail he prefers the rugged look!

I cannot remember where I read this, but apparantly the growing of facial hair/beard is very typical of (alledged) murderers.

minni
07-29-2012, 01:16 AM
I do a bit of amateur study in linguistics, and it's a VERY strong word. I read it (twice) and thought it was geared towards those who think he's innocent.

Yes, I'm filling time too :)

ALL MOO

I SEE, good one Onions!!..rather than a little celebration that he's miserable...its a statement of outrage that this wonderful man is being forced to endure terrible things?

Thats pretty interesting. Poor dear innocent Gerard. Its an abomination to the unjustly accused man

SCOFF!!!

minni
07-29-2012, 01:21 AM
I cannot remember where I read this, but apparantly the growing of facial hair/beard is very typical of (alledged) murderers.

Yes I think I read a story years ago in one of the FBI profilers book John Douglas maybe?
Anyway, the killer grows the beard AFTER the murder but BEFORE he is accused, in an attempt to disguise their image to confuse any later witnesses. And to hide their lies and expressions from giving them away (I think, it was probably 20 years ago I read that one) and I think its popular to change their hairstyle too?

Opinionsgalore
07-29-2012, 01:22 AM
I SEE, good one Onions!!..rather than a little celebration that he's miserable...its a statement of outrage that this wonderful man is being forced to endure terrible things?

Thats pretty interesting. Poor dear innocent Gerard. Its an abomination to the unjustly accused man

SCOFF!!!

That's how it read to me-like a 'boohoo poor GBC' story.
I'm openly anti GBC-so I'm going to get a linguistics friend to take a look at it, as it could just be me being overly sensitive.

All MOO

Bayside
07-29-2012, 01:30 AM
Congratulations Marly. I know you'll do an awesome job.

http://i475.photobucket.com/albums/rr120/Angelintown/Smiley%20diversen/smiley_champagne.gif

I think she will need a bigger bottle of booze than that to keep this lot under control lolol.

Nads
07-29-2012, 02:03 AM
http://victimsheartland.forumotion.com/t2229-why-do-men-kill-their-wives-girlfriend-s

This is an interesting article. Nothing particularly new, just summarises many of the characteristics we think we can see in this case.

Opinionsgalore
07-29-2012, 02:15 AM
http://victimsheartland.forumotion.com/t2229-why-do-men-kill-their-wives-girlfriend-s

This is an interesting article. Nothing particularly new, just summarises many of the characteristics we think we can see in this case.

Oh my ! Thanks for posting, it screams GBC all over, his motives, his (flawed) reasoning, the affairs, the monetary shenanigans..... It's just chilling to read that it's not unusual for husbands to murder their wives for all the reasons that many (here) hypothesise lead to Allisons murder.



All MOO.

Opinionsgalore
07-29-2012, 02:26 AM
That's how it read to me-like a 'boohoo poor GBC' story.
I'm openly anti GBC-so I'm going to get a linguistics friend to take a look at it, as it could just be me being overly sensitive.

All MOO

Quoting myself - how sad.
Linguistics friend replied "Almost like its setting a story up for abuse".
Pointed out that the story was made to seem 'personally related"' ie: HIS family and HIS facial hair.
Closing comment from friend was "underlying agenda ??".

Now my 2 cents worth:
.................................................. .........
As is often said: innocent until proven guilty.
This particular story really seems to go for sympathy in a BIG way for GBC, and to my mind appears to imply that he (GBC) is being treated unjustly-this was also implied by the big wig lawyer who visited him.
Personally ( please take note of the word 'personally') I think it's reprehensible to imply that Corrective services are somehow unjust for following the rules and regulations of the facility where GBC is currently interred.
I'm using iPhone, so you'll need to picture a 'steam coming out of ears' emoticon.




All MOO.

Nads
07-29-2012, 02:34 AM
I don't think it's a sympathetic article in the least. All of the things I read in the CM about the case, they seem to be saying we know he's guilty and there's so much more we could tell you, but this is how we have to word it to avoid problems. That's just my opinion.

Timmy
07-29-2012, 02:44 AM
I'm intrigued that the word 'forced' was used twice. Once in relation to the non contact visit and the other in relation to his beard removal. It's unusual to see the same adjective used twice in a news story. Usually the same adjective is re used to re- iterate a point.
It's probably nothing - but it caught my attention.

I think it's more to point out the fact that he is an accused murderer and is being treated like one. And also to point out how far his fall from grace is-no longer is he calling the shots, he's being told what he can and can't do!

minni
07-29-2012, 02:47 AM
Oh my ! Thanks for posting, it screams GBC all over, his motives, his (flawed) reasoning, the affairs, the monetary shenanigans..... It's just chilling to read that it's not unusual for husbands to murder their wives for all the reasons that many (here) hypothesise lead to Allisons murder.



All MOO.

just about to read the link, but earlier on when I was reading about narcissistic behaviour, it occurred to me that a LOT of wife killers would exhibit many of these behaviours. I mean regardless of the situation that these killers find themselves in, whether it be monetary problems, other women, custody battles, or just wanting to get out.......they all choose to kill their wives, as they gain more from them dead than alive. Total disregard for anything other than the means to an end, regardless of how to obtain it.

frustrated detective
07-29-2012, 02:49 AM
http://victimsheartland.forumotion.com/t2229-why-do-men-kill-their-wives-girlfriend-s

This is an interesting article. Nothing particularly new, just summarises many of the characteristics we think we can see in this case.


Sometimes I think that a woman rarely wins with a narcissistic husband who wants out.

If he doesn't kill her in cold blood as GBC allegedly killed Allison, then he kills her slowly over a decade or more of property and child custody issues.

If there are children involved it is almost impossible to 'get away' from them and not be affected almost daily by their narcissistic behaviors.

Imagine what someone like GBC would be like in a family law battle ... impossible to reason with or rely on. Allison was just killed the fast way, IMO.

Opinionsgalore
07-29-2012, 02:55 AM
just about to read the link, but earlier on when I was reading about narcissistic behaviour, it occurred to me that a LOT of wife killers would exhibit many of these behaviours. I mean regardless of the situation that these killers find themselves in, whether it be monetary problems, other women, custody battles, or just wanting to get out.......they all choose to kill their wives, as they gain more from them dead than alive. Total disregard for anything other than the means to an end, regardless of how to obtain it.

*cold shiver* it's that 'total disregard' that chills me, to reduce another human being to an inanimate object that needs to be gotten rid of.


All MOO.

BigT
07-29-2012, 02:59 AM
Did anyone notice the plate on NBC car driven to police station before funeral? He is south African and must consider himself some kind of chief (BWANA) in the scheme of things. http://media.brisbanetimes.com.au/news/national-news/badenclay-picks-up-wifes-photos-3270841.html

minni
07-29-2012, 03:09 AM
http://victimsheartland.forumotion.com/t2229-why-do-men-kill-their-wives-girlfriend-s

This is an interesting article. Nothing particularly new, just summarises many of the characteristics we think we can see in this case.

Thanks Nads..that was so insightful! Some statements REALLY stnad out for me.

"the materially motivated."

Men in this last category lack emotional involvement, remorse, and a conscience. "They don't get jealous, because they don't care much about women," "They care more about the assets." They're preoccupied with money and status.

The men involved often have something to lose: fine cars, nice homes, reputations they've carefully crafted, or lives that others consider perfect.

Yet those lives are never as perfect as they appear. Typically, these men are keeping secrets - secrets they will do almost anything to protect.
"They tend to have affairs," .

"They tend to have a lot of financial dealings on the side. In fact, experts agree that most men who kill their wives to avoid divorcing them are sociopaths, able to distinguish right from wrong but not caring too much about that distinction. They will do what's good for them,

Berry
07-29-2012, 03:10 AM
Did anyone notice the plate on NBC car driven to police station before funeral? He is south African and must consider himself some kind of chief (BWANA) in the scheme of things. http://media.brisbanetimes.com.au/news/national-news/badenclay-picks-up-wifes-photos-3270841.html

Oh yes indeedy, we discussed that plate name for pages, way long time ago Pulp....just so disgusting to us.....agree.....

they'll get you
07-29-2012, 03:15 AM
Did anyone notice the plate on NBC car driven to police station before funeral? He is south African and must consider himself some kind of chief (BWANA) in the scheme of things. http://media.brisbanetimes.com.au/news/national-news/badenclay-picks-up-wifes-photos-3270841.html

They have so many cars they could open up a used car lot ! :banghead:

they'll get you
07-29-2012, 03:18 AM
PashPop & Co used cars. Now would you buy a used car from this mob ?

frustrated detective
07-29-2012, 03:18 AM
Oh yes indeedy, we discussed that plate name for pages, way long time ago Pulp....just so disgusting to us.....agree.....

Mix up here? BigT seems to have same avatar as Pulpfiction.

BigT
07-29-2012, 03:33 AM
Mix up here? BigT seems to have same avatar as Pulpfiction. updated selection of avatar is good. I missed discussion about Big Bwana who must think he is the boss. This might indicate he Is real afrikana type maybe from free state or something like this. Thre are many south Africans who belive in apartheid. I think there is a lot to learn about dispossession in a QLD jail, and some real good teachers. I just can't see how a good Ippi girl could have put up with a Bwana. I guess that's what te pages were eh?

minni
07-29-2012, 03:34 AM
Mix up here? BigT seems to have same avatar as Pulpfiction.

The post originally was from pulp, then its changed to BigT with a new avatar? must have been

linette
07-29-2012, 03:35 AM
http://victimsheartland.forumotion.com/t2229-why-do-men-kill-their-wives-girlfriend-s

This is an interesting article. Nothing particularly new, just summarises many of the characteristics we think we can see in this case.

Hey, that was very interesting, Nads. Thankyou. For any of us struggling with the idea that a man could do that to his wife might understand a little more... well not 'understand' why, but just know that it does happen.

Even though I have no doubt in my mind that GBC did it, I still can't phathom what could possibly go through their minds to enable them to do it. I'm glad I don't 'get it'.

linette
07-29-2012, 03:41 AM
Sometimes I think that a woman rarely wins with a narcissistic husband who wants out.

If he doesn't kill her in cold blood as GBC allegedly killed Allison, then he kills her slowly over a decade or more of property and child custody issues.

If there are children involved it is almost impossible to 'get away' from them and not be affected almost daily by their narcissistic behaviors.

Imagine what someone like GBC would be like in a family law battle ... impossible to reason with or rely on. Allison was just killed the fast way, IMO.

I have to agree. These men do not let up, they don't have respect for the law... and they don't even care about the children through it all.
I know some people find it hard to believe that these men may not love their kids, but it does happen. They even go as far as to prefer that their kids are 'attractive' because it makes them look bad to have a less than attractive child. They don't care how their threats and rubbish affect them either. They don't love, they 'possess'. Yet they can put on a damn good show of being the perfect family man, adored by all. It's sickening.
And you're right, they carry on with their rubbish for years, there is no end.

possumheart
07-29-2012, 03:51 AM
I missed discussion about Big Bwana who must think he is the boss. This might indicate he Is real afrikana type maybe from free state or something like this. Thre are many south Africans who belive in apartheid. I think there is a lot to learn about dispossession in a QLD jail, and some real good teachers. I just can't see how a good Ippi girl could have put up with a Bwana. I guess that's what te pages were eh?

Guess it is all complicated ...

BigT
07-29-2012, 03:56 AM
Oh dear....

minni
07-29-2012, 04:09 AM
Nice one Possum......and very good saying (had to google it of course to be sure haha)

something narcissistic types could not even fathom

TootsieFootsie
07-29-2012, 05:03 AM
Some of the links posted about Narcissism made me think of Dr Harold Shipman, the serial killer, he seemed to have a lot of the traits, was arrogant, thought he was a genious and its estimated that he murdered at least 260 people :what:

I just don't know how people like that can think its ok to kill people, like that person's life has no value :tears:




*cold shiver* it's that 'total disregard' that chills me, to reduce another human being to an inanimate object that needs to be gotten rid of.


All MOO.

Nads
07-29-2012, 05:29 AM
Some of the links posted about Narcissism made me think of Dr Harold Shipman, the serial killer, he seemed to have a lot of the traits, was arrogant, thought he was a genious and its estimated that he murdered at least 260 people :what:

I just don't know how people like that can think its ok to kill people, like that person's life has no value :tears:

Even if they don't value others' lives, I can't understand why they kill people they don't know. Why it would make them happy.

Rational
07-29-2012, 06:19 AM
Some of the links posted about Narcissism made me think of Dr Harold Shipman, the serial killer, he seemed to have a lot of the traits, was arrogant, thought he was a genious and its estimated that he murdered at least 260 people :what:

I just don't know how people like that can think its ok to kill people, like that person's life has no value :tears:

However much I hate to say this but if they don't love themselves (and have never known real unconditional love) a narcissists thinks that other people are just as expendable as they are themselves. Very deep down they hate themselves hence the constant need for self affirmation. They have the lowest self confidence of all!!

Only IMOO and from my own experience.

They try to project confidence, worth, genius , charm etc etc only because they know exactly what they are lacking: a sense of self, a sense of worth and confidence.

They are amongst he saddest people in the world. Yet no one will ever feel sorry for them, which is IMO all they want. They want to be loved but have no idea how to go about it.

If I were a psychologist/ psychiatrist (which I am not) I would focus on his mother, not on his father. Does anyone know if his mother had any issues after he was born or what the circumstances of his birth and upbringing were?

they'll get you
07-29-2012, 06:21 AM
Where is everyone??
I read that the Dickies will be relocating from their home on the Gold Coast to Brookfield to enable the children to return to their community, school, church and friends. How unselfish of them to uproot themselves and their home for their grandchildren.

I’m betting they want to be closer to the upcoming court proceedings of their beloved Allison as well. They'll be there at the court !! My respect goes to Mr & Mrs Dickie

Cyansea
07-29-2012, 06:33 AM
Congratulations to Marlywings on becoming Moderator of Allison's Forum!
The wealth of information you provide is very much appreciated.
:woohoo:

Thinking
07-29-2012, 06:35 AM
Sometimes I think that a woman rarely wins with a narcissistic husband who wants out.

If he doesn't kill her in cold blood as GBC allegedly killed Allison, then he kills her slowly over a decade or more of property and child custody issues.

If there are children involved it is almost impossible to 'get away' from them and not be affected almost daily by their narcissistic behaviors.

Imagine what someone like GBC would be like in a family law battle ... impossible to reason with or rely on. Allison was just killed the fast way, IMO.

So true. How, HOW can we teach our daughters to identify these characters and avoid them like the plague?! :please:

linette
07-29-2012, 06:46 AM
So true. How, HOW can we teach our daughters to identify these characters and avoid them like the plague?! :please:

It's a hard one. All we can do is try. But you can't put an old head on young shoulders. Remember these people are very good at what they do, TOO GOOD!!
We can only tell them what we know and hope for the best. It might help if they've had them in their lives beforehand, as a father, uncle, family friend etc, but even then it can be hard to recognize.

they'll get you
07-29-2012, 06:56 AM
So true. How, HOW can we teach our daughters to identify these characters and avoid them like the plague?! :please:

That's the problem, when it's all they know and unfortunately they go out to find someone just like 'dear old dad'. When I exposed my daughter's new found mental case, he admitted bear faced to me 'she was a target and a good one at that'. THE PARASITE CONSUMES THE HOST.

linette
07-29-2012, 07:05 AM
That's the problem, when it's all they know and unfortunately they go out to find someone just like 'dear old dad'. When I exposed my daughter's new found mental case, he admitted bear faced to me 'she was a target and a good one at that'. THE PARASITE CONSUMES THE HOST.

That's true, they can go looking for someone the same... then they can also do the opposite and be so on guard that they see problems in good people when they aren't even there. These men/women have NO idea what they do to people, and the legacy they leave their children... they leave a massive mess behind and won't take any blame at all.

they'll get you
07-29-2012, 07:12 AM
Has the world exploded and linette & I are the only ones left on the planet ??
Where the bloody hell is everyone ?? C'mon get back to work here !!

they'll get you
07-29-2012, 07:19 AM
There is something that doesn’t sit right with the ‘Pash’ could it be that EBC was submissively begging NBC to settle down, don’t react and keep his head (in other words don’t lose it now, shut up & stay with me on this) He could have been ready to have it out with the cameraman and loose it big time? Maybe she stuck her tounge down his throught so he couldn't say anything? Hard to explain what I am seeing. Any thoughts? There's something there I can't put my finger on but it's *&^8=* too weird !

J-Diggety
07-29-2012, 07:28 AM
Has the world exploded and linette & I are the only ones left on the planet ??
Where the bloody hell is everyone ?? C'mon get back to work here !!

The world has exploded.

I reckon until something new comes out, this will become a little bit tumbleweed in here.

Try the chit chat for some love

marlywings
07-29-2012, 07:30 AM
I think she will need a bigger bottle of booze than that to keep this lot under control lolol.

Thanks Liadan, Makara & Cyansea...much appreciated. :)

Bayside...actually I don't drink but I reckon you lot could be enough to drive me to it...lol.

No need for it tonight though...looks like you've all been on best behaviour in this thread today...well done!!! :woohoo:

marlywings
07-29-2012, 07:37 AM
Quoting myself - how sad.
Linguistics friend replied "Almost like its setting a story up for abuse".
Pointed out that the story was made to seem 'personally related"' ie: HIS family and HIS facial hair.
Closing comment from friend was "underlying agenda ??".

Now my 2 cents worth:
.................................................. .........
As is often said: innocent until proven guilty.
This particular story really seems to go for sympathy in a BIG way for GBC, and to my mind appears to imply that he (GBC) is being treated unjustly-this was also implied by the big wig lawyer who visited him.
Personally ( please take note of the word 'personally') I think it's reprehensible to imply that Corrective services are somehow unjust for following the rules and regulations of the facility where GBC is currently interred.
I'm using iPhone, so you'll need to picture a 'steam coming out of ears' emoticon.
All MOO.

Interesting points from your linguistics friend although I tend to think the journos are treading very carefully since the bail hearing after the judge said....

June 22, 2012

However Justice Boddice did continue his address to the court, issuing a warning to the media. He said “constraint must be shown” in opinions published by journalists.

“One will hope that the media will ensure justice can take place in a proper, respectful way, for what the law allows and applies,” Justice Boddice said.

Mr Davis added: “And the media should have regard to the fact that those comments are made with the force of your Honour’s office”.

Justice Boddice replied: “And that is why I have said what I have”.

http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/accused-wifekiller-gerard-badenclay-denied-bail-20120622-20s73.html#ixzz220Wb0N00

bellgirl
07-29-2012, 07:50 AM
Congratulations Marly! You are incredible and extremely talented, it's no wonder that you were snatched up! I wish you all the best - I know that you'll do an incredible job as Mod. We're so proud of you, our very special 'Aussie Mod'.

I'm taking a much needed vacation, but couldn't stop myself from popping in to say "well done" :)

marlywings
07-29-2012, 07:58 AM
Congratulations Marly! You are incredible and extremely talented, it's no wonder that you were snatched up! I wish you all the best - I know that you'll do an incredible job as Mod. We're so proud of you, our very special 'Aussie Mod'.

I'm taking a much needed vacation, but couldn't stop myself from popping in to say "well done" :)

Thanks bellgirl...much appreciated....have a great vacation!!...see you when you're back on board :)

minni
07-29-2012, 01:03 PM
There is something that doesn’t sit right with the ‘Pash’ could it be that EBC was submissively begging NBC to settle down, don’t react and keep his head (in other words don’t lose it now, shut up & stay with me on this) He could have been ready to have it out with the cameraman and loose it big time? Maybe she stuck her tounge down his throught so he couldn't say anything? Hard to explain what I am seeing. Any thoughts? There's something there I can't put my finger on but it's *&^8=* too weird !

Well, thanks, I just had to have another look and rewind it four or five times eeeeewww.

She has first contact, with her hand on his chest then at his waist and at first I thought she was looking up at him, like she is maybe asking him to do it, but it looks more like they are both looking at each other. He leans in first, but she forces it to keep going, and thats when it seems to me that she has just 'abated' his possible anxiety or any moment of weakness.

Thanks, they'll get you, for that, I'll never get back to sleep now!

Also, when I watch it, it doesnt seem to show that much really, but every time I leave the page and come back here to type, I feel like I just watched her 'settle' him. Its a hard one to decipher

minni
07-29-2012, 04:44 PM
However much I hate to say this but if they don't love themselves (and have never known real unconditional love) a narcissists thinks that other people are just as expendable as they are themselves. Very deep down they hate themselves hence the constant need for self affirmation. They have the lowest self confidence of all!!

Only IMOO and from my own experience.

They try to project confidence, worth, genius , charm etc etc only because they know exactly what they are lacking: a sense of self, a sense of worth and confidence.

They are amongst he saddest people in the world. Yet no one will ever feel sorry for them, which is IMO all they want. They want to be loved but have no idea how to go about it.

If I were a psychologist/ psychiatrist (which I am not) I would focus on his mother, not on his father. Does anyone know if his mother had any issues after he was born or what the circumstances of his birth and upbringing were?
:goodpost:

Onlyone
07-29-2012, 05:26 PM
Well, thanks, I just had to have another look and rewind it four or five times eeeeewww.

She has first contact, with her hand on his chest then at his waist and at first I thought she was looking up at him, like she is maybe asking him to do it, but it looks more like they are both looking at each other. He leans in first, but she forces it to keep going, and thats when it seems to me that she has just 'abated' his possible anxiety or any moment of weakness.

Thanks, they'll get you, for that, I'll never get back to sleep now!

Also, when I watch it, it doesnt seem to show that much really, but every time I leave the page and come back here to type, I feel like I just watched her 'settle' him. Its a hard one to decipher

Still having nightmares from having saw it the first time, you're right though & to be commended for watching it more than once.. There's a plead for something there...

Maigret
07-29-2012, 05:29 PM
A little bit of trivia - Gerard Baden-Clay married Allison Dickie on 23rd August 1997
http://www.news.com.au/national/the-life-and-times-of-gerard-baden-clay-as-supplied-to-police-via-affidavits-used-in-supreme-court-bail-application/story-e6frfkvr-1226410326970
His parents also married on 23rd August but in 1969
http://www.thepeerage.com/p6368.htm#i63676

linette
07-29-2012, 05:36 PM
Is anyone else having problems with the site? I find I'm getting logged out every 5 minutes??

Opinionsgalore
07-29-2012, 05:37 PM
Congrats Marly !!
Great to see one of our own as a mod :D


All MOO.

Opinionsgalore
07-29-2012, 05:38 PM
Is anyone else having problems with the site? I find I'm getting logged out every 5 minutes??

Yes ! When I first tried to log in, it said I didn't have permission - freaked out that I'd been put in naughty corner.


All MOO.

frustrated detective
07-29-2012, 06:23 PM
So true. How, HOW can we teach our daughters to identify these characters and avoid them like the plague?! :please:

Yes, that's a hard one. The best formula I have come up with is: GO BY WHAT THEY DO, NOT BY WHAT THEY SAY.

Gemini Girl
07-29-2012, 06:27 PM
how bizarre!

Many parallels between these two cases IMHO

:jail::jail:

and both equally sickening

JMO MOO

BreakingNews
07-29-2012, 06:48 PM
There is something that doesn’t sit right with the ‘Pash’ could it be that EBC was submissively begging NBC to settle down, don’t react and keep his head (in other words don’t lose it now, shut up & stay with me on this) He could have been ready to have it out with the cameraman and loose it big time? Maybe she stuck her tounge down his throught so he couldn't say anything? Hard to explain what I am seeing. Any thoughts? There's something there I can't put my finger on but it's *&^8=* too weird !

I'm a page behind, sorry. That Pash seemed to be EBC's doing and doesn't look like NBC wants any part of it. So I agree that EBC was diverting his attention from something.

BreakingNews
07-29-2012, 06:54 PM
Thanks bellgirl...much appreciated....have a great vacation!!...see you when you're back on board :)

I agree. Marlywings has always been so delightful and tactful and I looove your posts. One thing for sure, our MW will be fair, but will also tactfully tell us to behave when needed.

:clap:

GEANIE
07-29-2012, 07:20 PM
:goodpost:

Congrats Marlywings what a good choice by websleits......they know a good thing when they see it!!!!!
Your such good value.:woohoo::woohoo:

My x's mother was/is a wonderful person, 20 years after my divorce we are still great friends. She's not one to sit on the:fence: A real :rocker::woohoo:
She is traveling around Aus, at the monent in Urulu and still finds time to e-mail me.
She was a nurse and a very compasionate one at that:woohoo:
The two other brothers are just lovely....one serving in Afganastan with the air force, the other an accountant.
So how do you figure????

GEANIE
07-29-2012, 07:43 PM
I'm a page behind, sorry. That Pash seemed to be EBC's doing and doesn't look like NBC wants any part of it. So I agree that EBC was diverting his attention from something.

I think the 'PASH' was a distraction too....if NBC has the temper GBC apparently has ...then it was to shut him up.:truce:
I wonder what they think if they read this forum......'Darn everything we do is seen through'!!!! They must be wrapt in 'Glad Wrap' GBC might have got that cut on his hand wraping them up.....Ma and Pa?????
Keep things tight and air proof......:jail::banghead:

linette
07-29-2012, 08:19 PM
Interesting. I'd never thought of the 'putrid pash' being a way of calming him down.
So looking at the video does anyone get the feeling that Daddy was becoming irate, therefore giving a reason for Mummy to calm him down?

Nads
07-29-2012, 08:22 PM
Perhaps it was an attention-seeking behaviour rather than a distraction? Although I prefer distraction.

possumheart
07-29-2012, 08:30 PM
Perhaps it was an attention-seeking behaviour rather than a distraction? Although I prefer distraction.

I have attached a screen cap of where NBC stumbles getting things out of the car just before the pash. You may have never noticed it. I think he probably hurt his ankle or his dignity as he stumbled and EBC was giving him a kiss to make it all better. MOO

J-Diggety
07-29-2012, 08:33 PM
You guys are gutsy watching that rubbish, makes me ill.

possumheart
07-29-2012, 08:35 PM
You guys are gutsy watching that rubbish, makes me ill.

Don't know what got into me, sorry. New topic?

Nads
07-29-2012, 08:40 PM
I have attached a screen cap of where NBC stumbles getting things out of the car just before the pash. You may have never noticed it. I think he probably hurt his ankle or his dignity as he stumbled and EBC was giving him a kiss to make it all better. MOO

It was a big stumble, but it could have been some time afterwards that the moment occurred. It looked a little like she was frisking his neck, chest, then side areas before the moment. Perhaps he fell right over and she was checking for injuries, then kissing better?

J-Diggety
07-29-2012, 08:40 PM
Don't know what got into me, sorry. New topic?

Don't be silly, you're a better human than I

Nads
07-29-2012, 08:41 PM
You guys are gutsy watching that rubbish, makes me ill.

So we can talk about decomposition and causes of death but not you know what?

minni
07-29-2012, 08:43 PM
new topic, just for poss

Remember there was a minor connection between the commissioner and NBC? what was it? facebook friends? scout members? something minor.
I once asked the question of whether NBC could be given immunity (If it was even given to anyone?) Dont remember the answers I got or the exact reasoning but it was collectively a resounding NO.

IF NBC is involved or was involved after the fact....something is keeping his arrest at bay. What is it?

Could he be given special consideration based on any health issues? I am definitely not saying he gets special circumstances because or if he knows B.A....I know he is a man of integrity and I am not suggesting that.

Im just changing the subject for possum ;)

minni
07-29-2012, 08:44 PM
So we can talk about decomposition and causes of death but not you know what?

Absolutely!!! I still cant sleep and Ive been up since 2o'clock!!!!

J-Diggety
07-29-2012, 08:48 PM
So we can talk about decomposition and causes of death but not you know what?

I fell much more comfortable with that, much better than picturing the once useful gums of two seniles gnashing each other to bits.

alioop
07-29-2012, 08:49 PM
new topic, just for poss

Remember there was a minor connection between the commissioner and NBC? what was it? facebook friends? scout members? something minor.
I once asked the question of whether NBC could be given immunity (If it was even given to anyone?) Dont remember the answers I got or the exact reasoning but it was collectively a resounding NO.

IF NBC is involved or was involved after the fact....something is keeping his arrest at bay. What is it?

Could he be given special consideration based on any health issues? I am definitely not saying he gets special circumstances because or if he knows B.A....I know he is a man of integrity and I am not suggesting that.

Im just changing the subject for possum ;)

Good question Minni, about reason for no arrest. My guess would be strategic and or evidence issues. Not health reasons as they can deal with those in remand if they need to.

possumheart
07-29-2012, 08:55 PM
It was a big stumble, but it could have been some time afterwards that the moment occurred. It looked a little like she was frisking his neck, chest, then side areas before the moment. Perhaps he fell right over and she was checking for injuries, then kissing better?

Perhaps he had the missing phone in the clothes basket and was flustered, and fell as a result and EBC was giving him a mission accomplished reward.

(Hide it in plain sight strategy)

Nads
07-29-2012, 09:00 PM
new topic, just for poss

Remember there was a minor connection between the commissioner and NBC? what was it? facebook friends? scout members? something minor.
I once asked the question of whether NBC could be given immunity (If it was even given to anyone?) Dont remember the answers I got or the exact reasoning but it was collectively a resounding NO.

IF NBC is involved or was involved after the fact....something is keeping his arrest at bay. What is it?

Could he be given special consideration based on any health issues? I am definitely not saying he gets special circumstances because or if he knows B.A....I know he is a man of integrity and I am not suggesting that.

Im just changing the subject for possum ;)

I thought I read something about if NBC was also charged with something that he wouldn't have to testify at GBC's trial as he could incriminate himself. But if he wasn't charged then he could be forced to testify. Or was I imagining it?

Wonder if any of them got dragged to that thing that Paul Tully was talking about? Where you are forced to talk, but they can't use it in court?

pulpfiction
07-29-2012, 09:18 PM
So yes - I have come across that personality type, but I've never been involved in the treatment of them (if there IS a treatment), not being a psychiatrist and all....

Very difficult to work with. Deeply entrenched values, beliefs and thought patterns.

possumheart
07-29-2012, 09:23 PM
Wonder if any of them got dragged to that thing that Paul Tully was talking about? Where you are forced to talk, but they can't use it in court?
"If the evidence of a reluctant accessory would overcome that evidentiary difficulty and ensure the guilty party is brought to justice, it would be a powerful inducement to a person in such predicament to give evidence against the murderer in exchange for an iron-clad deal to give them legal immunity from prosecution.

"Normally, such immunities are rarely given early in a murder investigation."

Police said yesterday there was no basis for the speculation, and asked if Cr Tully could call them should he have "any information or inside gossip" in the future.

When asked about the strength of his sources, Cr Tully told The Courier-Mail they were "reliable, but not impeccable".

Cr Tully also wrote that the Crime and Misconduct Commission may already be using its "star chamber" coercive powers to make people talk.

A spokeswoman for the CMC yesterday said the commission could neither confirm nor deny involvement.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/allison-baden-clay-murder-rumour-of-indemnity-application-for-accessory-rejected/story-e6freon6-1226391562829

pulpfiction
07-29-2012, 09:35 PM
Now that he is restricted to the inside (with limited contact with the outside) his supply would have to come from the inside. In that case he would simply discard the previous sources of supply. It would just be a matter of moving on to the next candidates within the prison system.

Yes that is often exactly what happens. It's not as prevalent here but in the US there are well reported instances of these types "turning on the charm" for female prison guards. Scott Petersen (death row inmate San Quentin) is one who reportedly lights up when female officers are on duty. They are highly manipulative types - truly masterful - so IF GBC is narcissistic then it is possible. Of course we do not know if he has any kind of personality disorder.

Somewhat like the Batman Shooter in the US recently, the public often assumes these people who do terrible things must have a personality disorder, schizophrenia or some other compulsion or affliction that drives them to do the unthinkable. They might be deemed to be a "psychiatric client" but do not have a disorder however. At this point it's probably a good idea to look at the DSM V

http://www.dsm5.org/

Also important to note that in my experience there are many who commit heinous crimes and do not have a PD or other diagnosable mental disorder. Likewise, some are influenced by other problems - eg. anxiety and many other problematic issues - including stress which can act as a trigger.

So it is important not to get hung up on attaching a label to GBC because we don't know anything about this as yet. We think he might be narcissistic because of what has transpired but it is possible he doesn't have NPD at all. Also pertinent to remember that virtually all of us have traits that might fit certain criteria for mental health issues. And yet we don't commit violent crimes.

marlywings
07-29-2012, 09:36 PM
Thanks Opinionsgalore, BreakingNews & GEANIE...much appreciated :)

pulpfiction
07-29-2012, 09:50 PM
Yes, that's a hard one. The best formula I have come up with is: GO BY WHAT THEY DO, NOT BY WHAT THEY SAY.

The trick with this is, and it's tricky to teach, is

When someone shows you their true colours always pay attention and don't minimize it. These types do show it but often it's brushed off. They can snap when challenged and watching their reaction is the key. Need to watch verbal and non-verbal. never reward or ignore bad behaviour.

alioop
07-29-2012, 09:52 PM
The trick with this is, and it's tricky to teach, is

When someone shows you their true colours always pay attention and don't minimize it. These types do show it but often it's brushed off. They can snap when challenged and watching their reaction is the key. Need to watch verbal and non-verbal. never reward or ignore bad behaviour.


Thanks pulp, that is very good advice for us all.

Rational
07-29-2012, 11:59 PM
Yes that is often exactly what happens. It's not as prevalent here but in the US there are well reported instances of these types "turning on the charm" for female prison guards. Scott Petersen (death row inmate San Quentin) is one who reportedly lights up when female officers are on duty. They are highly manipulative types - truly masterful - so IF GBC is narcissistic then it is possible. Of course we do not know if he has any kind of personality disorder.

Somewhat like the Batman Shooter in the US recently, the public often assumes these people who do terrible things must have a personality disorder, schizophrenia or some other compulsion or affliction that drives them to do the unthinkable. They might be deemed to be a "psychiatric client" but do not have a disorder however. At this point it's probably a good idea to look at the DSM V

http://www.dsm5.org/

Also important to note that in my experience there are many who commit heinous crimes and do not have a PD or other diagnosable mental disorder. Likewise, some are influenced by other problems - eg. anxiety and many other problematic issues - including stress which can act as a trigger.

So it is important not to get hung up on attaching a label to GBC because we don't know anything about this as yet. We think he might be narcissistic because of what has transpired but it is possible he doesn't have NPD at all. Also pertinent to remember that virtually all of us have traits that might fit certain criteria for mental health issues. And yet we don't commit violent crimes.

Thank you pulp for your insights, they are a pleasure to read.

Gemini Girl
07-30-2012, 12:18 AM
<modsnip>
Alternatively, there is the trial currently occuring in Perth, in the murder of Corryn Rayney.

Australia: The murder of Corryn Rayney - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community



New evidence from the trial every day, lots to sleuth - just a thought

:moo:

JMO MOO

Nads
07-30-2012, 12:31 AM
Alternatively, there is the trial currently occuring in Perth, in the murder of Corryn Rayney.

Australia: The murder of Corryn Rayney - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=179098)



New evidence from the trial every day, lots to sleuth - just a thought

:moo:

JMO MOO

Yes, this is a gripping case. It would only take ten mins to read a summary of the case. There are all the intriguing elements as the BC case, lots of circumstantial evidence, but the defendant is a barrister himself, he got bail previously(!) and it's a judge-only trial. It's going to take a lot to prosecute this alleged wife-killer! And the trial is only a few days in and there are media updates twice a day. Very exciting!

Back to BC. I wonder if BC senior had any catepillar bites, ticks, or visits to the doctor?

If someone is or was interviewd in the star chamber we will never know either.

minni
07-30-2012, 12:38 AM
Alternatively, there is the trial currently occuring in Perth, in the murder of Corryn Rayney.

Australia: The murder of Corryn Rayney - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=179098)



New evidence from the trial every day, lots to sleuth - just a thought

:moo:

JMO MOO

Thanks Gemini , I think I will do exactly that. It seems to have many similarities from what I have read so far
Cheers :D

possumheart
07-30-2012, 01:53 AM
Have just had a session with Mr Google and can't work out which ear NBC wears the hearing aid on. Going by my experience, if the aid is on the left ear the person prefers to only be a passenger in the car because of the hearing situation. If his is on his right ear he would be more likely to have driven the car to Kholo or Little Ugly Creek IMO

marlywings
07-30-2012, 02:32 AM
Have just had a session with Mr Google and can't work out which ear NBC wears the hearing aid on. Going by my experience, if the aid is on the left ear the person prefers to only be a passenger in the car because of the hearing situation. If his is on his right ear he would be more likely to have driven the car to Kholo or Little Ugly Creek IMO

Excellent point possum....although doesn't appear to be in right ear in this photo??...

25124

http://www.couriermail.com.au/ipad/early-hours-call-to-father-alleged/story-fn6ck45n-1226406356989

Rational
07-30-2012, 02:37 AM
I thought I read something about if NBC was also charged with something that he wouldn't have to testify at GBC's trial as he could incriminate himself. But if he wasn't charged then he could be forced to testify. Or was I imagining it?

Wonder if any of them got dragged to that thing that Paul Tully was talking about? Where you are forced to talk, but they can't use it in court?

Hey Nads I think as Actusreus or Hawkins explained if they charged NBC now than he could refused to answer at the trial as is every accused's right. However, if he is called as a witness and refuses to answer he becomes in contempt of court, which has severe penalties.

If he has been before the star chamber of the CMC he would have had to answer without being able to have his legal advisors provide him with advice. However, the CMC could also have been involved with witness protection or seeking a reduction in charges, not necessarily a star chamber process.

I thinkHawkins very early on suggested that if this case ever went to trial it could involve perjury as well as contempt of court. So we won't know for awhile yet.

I think also that a wife cannot necessarily be asked to give evidence against her husband so that would exclude either NBC or EBC from being charged.

All IMO

Nads
07-30-2012, 02:56 AM
Excellent point possum....although doesn't appear to be in right ear in this photo??...

25124

http://www.couriermail.com.au/ipad/early-hours-call-to-father-alleged/story-fn6ck45n-1226406356989

They are very very discrete these days so I wouldn't expect to be able to see a hearing aid in such a photo. I'd never heard about the hearing aid driving thing.

The stumble of NBC in the video getting things out of the car makes me think he is frailer and less physically able than I had initially thought. I do "see" him as a canny fellow though, a good tactician and very practical. Guess it could be the hunting and scouting background and some of the things we've read about him.

Nads
07-30-2012, 02:58 AM
Hey Nads I think as Actusreus or Hawkins explained if they charged NBC now than he could refused to answer at the trial as is every accused's right. However, if he is called as a witness and refuses to answer he becomes in contempt of court, which has severe penalties.

If he has been before the star chamber of the CMC he would have had to answer without being able to have his legal advisors provide him with advice. However, the CMC could also have been involved with witness protection or seeking a reduction in charges, not necessarily a star chamber process.

I thinkHawkins very easy on suggested that if this case eve went to trial it could involve perjury as well as contempt of court. So we won't know for awhile yet.

I think also that a wife cannot necessarily be asked to give evidence against her husband so that would exclude either NBC or EBC from being charged.

All IMO

Ah, glad someone else remembers better than I do. Didn't one of our members ? Alioop? Get made an expert on WS in the law? Perhaps they can add some knowledge.

Rational
07-30-2012, 03:13 AM
Ah, glad someone else remembers better than I do. Didn't one of our members ? Alioop? Get made an expert on WS in the law? Perhaps they can add some knowledge.

Good thinking!! Alioop?? Every time I see your name I have to sing that song 'Alioop oop oop oop'. Don't ask me the name of the song or who sings it though (sorry Marly no link!!?)

marlywings
07-30-2012, 03:24 AM
They are very very discrete these days so I wouldn't expect to be able to see a hearing aid in such a photo. I'd never heard about the hearing aid driving thing.

The stumble of NBC in the video getting things out of the car makes me think he is frailer and less physically able than I had initially thought. I do "see" him as a canny fellow though, a good tactician and very practical. Guess it could be the hunting and scouting background and some of the things we've read about him.

Yes the tactician & "be prepared" in him may have come to the fore that night. From Keyboredom's posts a while back, NBC certainly doesn't sound the strongest these days...

#695 06-04-2012, 07:26 PM
Keyboredom
Registered User Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 323

[Quote]
Originally Posted by linette
That's interesting. Since I've never , ever seen the man in person... by 'weak old man' do you think he would possibly be too weak to help dispose of a body? I'm only asking because in the pics he always looks very strong. [Quote]

He looked a bit hunched over, walking slowly, looked like someone just recently released from hospital, or depressed and disoriented, IMO. Reminded me of what i think i probably looked like when i was told someone close had died, and tried to function. However I have seen them both maybe 10 days ago, he was moving faster then, looked less beaten down. Certainly in the most recent state I couldn't picture anyone calling on him for physical assistance.

----------------------------------------------

#661 06-04-2012, 05:45 PM
Keyboredom
Registered User Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 323

Thought I'd get out in the fresh air while nothing new was in the press

FWIW I did see Nigelaine out at the local shops this past weekend. They were sitting at a coffee shop then walking a dog. He did not look at all like a proud 'Bwana' to me, more like a weak old man with jeans that were too big for him, in cheap running shoes and walking fairly slowly and definitely showing some age. They were both walking some distance apart and didn't seem to be exchanging many pleasantries. He did not strike me as the strong type portrayed in his old bio, presumably his aura has changed a bit since this event happened, or maybe the 'Bwana' was always in his head and in print. They're most likely changed people from all the recent events - let's hope they are relieved when their daughter in law's killer/s is/are finally dragged into a dark cell where they belong.

Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, 43, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 - #17 - Page 27 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

marlywings
07-30-2012, 03:34 AM
Ah, glad someone else remembers better than I do. Didn't one of our members ? Alioop? Get made an expert on WS in the law? Perhaps they can add some knowledge.

Yep alioop is a verified solicitor...

List of Professional Posters & Verified Locals / Insiders

Professional Posters & Verified Locals / Insiders *MAIN PAGE* - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

Karo
07-30-2012, 03:59 AM
In order for evidence to be admissible, three separate but related issues must be considered.[4] Firstly, a witness must be competent; they may be lawfully called to give evidence. Instances of non-competence at common law are limited to certain types of children,[5] to ‘persons of defective intellect’, [6] and to the accused or the accused's spouse when called as a prosecution witness,[7] although family members are now deemed competent at law.[8] In modern Australian law, the topic of non-competence is heavily regulated by statute.

http://www.deakin.edu.au/deakin-speaking/node/264
too difficult for me to understand sorry but I think it means she has to give evidence.

Rational
07-30-2012, 04:20 AM
In order for evidence to be admissible, three separate but related issues must be considered.[4] Firstly, a witness must be competent; they may be lawfully called to give evidence. Instances of non-competence at common law are limited to certain types of children,[5] to ‘persons of defective intellect’, [6] and to the accused or the accused's spouse when called as a prosecution witness,[7] although family members are now deemed competent at law.[8] In modern Australian law, the topic of non-competence is heavily regulated by statute.

http://www.deakin.edu.au/deakin-speaking/node/264
too difficult for me to understand sorry but I think it means she has to give evidence.

Karo
I amnot sure that applies in Qld? Any experts out there!??!

alioop
07-30-2012, 05:37 AM
I am on the job and will report on the legal position later this evening when my household is a bit calmer.

drsleuth
07-30-2012, 05:56 AM
4 Corners ( ABC 1 ) is running a story on domestic violence tonight.........8:30pm

http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/stories/2012/07/26/3554420.htm

emirates1957
07-30-2012, 06:33 AM
Have just tuned in thank you.

Rational
07-30-2012, 06:48 AM
I am on the job and will report on the legal position later this evening when my household is a bit calmer.

Thanks Alioop appreciated!!

TootsieFootsie
07-30-2012, 07:31 AM
OT but new lead in local to me case of missing 15 year old girl Jessica Small.
Missing since 1997 from Bathurst NSW :(

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/search-for-jessica-police-to-dig-near-bathurst-20120730-2385y.html

J-Diggety
07-30-2012, 07:53 AM
Good thinking!! Alioop?? Every time I see your name I have to sing that song 'Alioop oop oop oop'. Don't ask me the name of the song or who sings it though (sorry Marly no link!!?)

Shoop - Salt N Pepa?



Was it Sept 3rd for the new date?

Apologies for not having a look for it

summer_breeze
07-30-2012, 08:51 AM
I wish I was closer! I would play a round....

http://www.river949.com.au/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=84700:turn-despair-into-delight&catid=53:around-river&Itemid=89

<snipped>

The event is on next Sunday August 5 at the Sandy Gallop Golf Course in Ipswich.