Siblings - Jesse and Vance Groene

[Liz]

It's been widely reported that Jesse Groene, age 18, is presently serving time in the Kootenai County Jail, awaiting sentencing on unrelated charges of 'Burglary'. If I understand correctly, he is also being investigated for some other various and assorted charges.

News @ 5 disclosed that Jesse is going to be given special dispensation tomorrow to attend the funeral services of his mother, Brenda, 40, and his brother, Slade, 13.

After conferencing with the district attorney, and the sheriff's dept, the judge agreed to an unescorted release for 6 hours. He will be released to his father, Steve Groene.

I read an article last night that lead me to believe he truly loved his mother and little brother, Slade, very dearly. As well as his missing little brother and sister, too.

Even though he seems to be a troubled young man, Brenda and Steve did seem to instill some good family values in their kids.

Jesse will have to return to the Kootenai County Jail by 6 p.m. tomorrow night.

[Liz]

From Geraldo's interview -
Vance stated that he'd just moved out within two weeks before the murders occured.

I wish we knew if it was his idea, or did his mom ask him to leave; and was it on good terms. Since he referred to the pit bull, as his ("I've got a 90 pound pit bull"), why didn't he take his dog with him, when he left? I wonder IF the dog is with him now?

I would also like to know if his G/F and their two babies were living with him at his mom's, too. In the interviews where I saw him mention moving, he used "I" in singular form; leading me to believe it was only him living at his mom's. If that is the case, where were his g/f and their two babies living?

His father, Steve Groene, said that Vance is getting his act together now. I hope that is the case.

Another thing that made me curious, is the article someone posted that said that "Jesse" had been pounding his fists and had failed that part of his polygraph test, about not knowing the children's whereabouts. Is it safe to assume that the article erroneously identified Vance as Jesse, since Jesse is currently incarcerated, and wouldn't have needed to be polygraphed. Or, would he?

[lynie]

I have not studied this case as much as others but could see why they would poly Jesse. If it was a grudge/gang retaliation, he may have info on gang memebers etc....grudge maybe the murders were a payback for something he supposedly did and doesn't want to admit to? :confused:

[packerdog]

I have not studied this case as much as others but could see why they would poly Jesse. If it was a grudge/gang retaliation, he may have info on gang memebers etc....grudge maybe the murders were a payback for something he supposedly did and doesn't want to admit to? :confused:

There was a news article that stated that this murder was not gang related. I think LE would know if Jesse was in a gang.

[Et al]

Do you have a link?
I don't think they were murdered by a bunch of potheads, or these were random murders.

[Liz]

After reading this article, it makes me wonder about my previous suggested possibility that this crime may have been some type of 'payback' to Jesse. In the event that Jesse had been negotiating a plea and had implicated anyone else, involved in criminal activity. This could be a real possibility, imo. Especially in light of the judge stating his desires for "security at the memorial services"! :eek:

http://www.bonnercountydailybee.com/articles/2005/05/25/news/news02.txt

Judge furloughs man for funeral
Posted: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 - 08:35:14 am PDT
By DAVE TURNER
Hagadone News Network

COEUR d'ALENE -- First District Judge John Mitchell on Tuesday ordered the son and brother of Wolf Lodge Bay murder victims Brenda and Slade Groene released from jail for six hours to grieve with the rest of family and attend services today.

[snipped: 'irrelevant to this thread' part>>]

Jesse Steven Groene will be released to the custody of his father, Steve, at noon to attend a private viewing of his mother and brother, then a memorial service at 3 p.m. at Real Life Ministries church in Post Falls. Mitchell said Jesse Groene must be back in jail by 6 p.m.

Mitchell also said while he can't order it, he would "prefer the church took on security" for the event.

"I don't know why they can't hire Watson (Agency) or some other security company to do metal detection," Mitchell said.

Church officials said they are not planning any special security measures. Law enforcement agencies will be on hand.

Afterward, Mitchell said he knew of no specific threat, but said it was better to err on the side of caution.

"I'm worried about Mr. (Jesse) Groene's safety," Mitchell said.

[snip>>>]
Jesse Groene, 18, was scheduled to be sentenced Tuesday for his guilty pleas on original charges of burglary, auto theft and felony injury to a jail for damage to a locking device after his arrest. His bail was continued at $15,000.

The sentencing was set back to June 28.

Mitchell allowed Jesse Groene to be released without a guard, on the condition he go with his father only to the funeral home, then to the services, then to any reception that might follow, then straight back to jail.

Much of the hearing dealt with Mitchell's question about Groene's security at the event, which is expected to draw hundreds of family, media and other mourners.

Kootenai County Sheriff's Lt. Dan Soumas said deputies were "not in a position to provide security.

"The sheriff's department has empathy for his position," Soumas said. >>> much more at link
=============================

Mods, This is a very lengthy article, so I hope I didn't violate any copyright laws. :)

[Liz]

Pic of Jesse Groene, on furlough from KC Jail, holding hands with his fiance, Corina Tosh at this link:

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/7984259/

ETA News reported there were almost 600 people in attendance at the Celebration of Life.

Jesse was the only family member that spoke at the service today. He said that his mother was his best friend and read a poem that he had previously written for her.

He assured the crowd that investigators will find the killer, and that the killer will be dealt with.

Wow! That sure makes him sound pretty confident in LE!

[redeskimo]

I think Liz is right . Jesse has done some sort of deal with LE and this was the result . I dont think there is much chance that the two children will be comming back safe . I'ts just all so very sad that a whole family has been destroyed . :(

[Liz]

I think Liz is right . Jesse has done some sort of deal with LE and this was the result . I dont think there is much chance that the two children will be comming back safe . I'ts just all so very sad that a whole family has been destroyed . :(


Jesse was supposed to have been sentenced last Tuesday, May 24th. Sentencing was moved forward to June 28th. I wonder IF there could be any connection of this crime to Jesse's sentencing? i.e. Plea deals and turning state's evidence on some other perp.

Could the said perp have killed the first three as a warning and maybe are holding the children, as some type of guarantee? Thinking, thinking, thinking ...

Is that the norm when sentencing is re-scheduled to move it a full month ahead? Or, did LE request Judge to reschedule it, allowing time to retrieve the children before Jesse is finally sentenced?

[JerseyGirl]

Another thing that made me curious, is the article someone posted that said that "Jesse" had been pounding his fists and had failed that part of his polygraph test, about not knowing the children's whereabouts. Is it safe to assume that the article erroneously identified Vance as Jesse, since Jesse is currently incarcerated, and wouldn't have needed to be polygraphed. Or, would he?
I thought it was the polygraphers that were pounding their fists. I don't remember if it was Vance or Jesse but they also used that same approach with their father, Steve. I guess that they were trying to turn on the pressure to see if they would crack & confess to something.

[CaliKid]

From what I've read, a typical form of interrogation involves telling a person of interest that they failed part of the poly and supposedly leads to confessions, whether true or not.

[close_enough]

Jesse was supposed to have been sentenced last Tuesday, May 24th. Sentencing was moved forward to June 28th. I wonder IF there could be any connection of this crime to Jesse's sentencing? i.e. Plea deals and turning state's evidence on some other perp.

Could the said perp have killed the first three as a warning and maybe are holding the children, as some type of guarantee? Thinking, thinking, thinking ...

Is that the norm when sentencing is re-scheduled to move it a full month ahead? Or, did LE request Judge to reschedule it, allowing time to retrieve the children before Jesse is finally sentenced?

yes, it's normal to move court dates, a month ahead when postponing...at least it is here in Nashville...i think it's pretty common all over the US court systems...

[Liz]

I thought it was the polygraphers that were pounding their fists. I don't remember if it was Vance or Jesse but they also used that same approach with their father, Steve. I guess that they were trying to turn on the pressure to see if they would crack & confess to something.


To be honest, I really can't recall. ;) But, it does sound logical to me that the polygrapher or investigators would have been pounding their fists.
So, I stand corrected, for now. :)

[Liz]

yes, it's normal to move court dates, a month ahead when postponing...at least it is here in Nashville...i think it's pretty common all over the US court systems...


Thanks for the reply, ce. That's reassuring. I am still wonder if the rescheduling wasn't due to a connection with Jesse, a plea deal, and trying to get those kids back safely before his sentencing.

I was contemplating back to the multi-state drug ring that was recently broken up, by several arrests that were made a day or two after these murders were committed. (JerseyGirl, I think you made a comment about that bust, too.)

It just made me wonder IF something Jesse might have known about and IF he had given info in coping a plea deal. It sounded like a pretty big operation was supposedly closed down, due to that bust. And, it's just been on my mind, ever since. Here's an article detailing the multi-state operation that was busted on May 17th (I think):

http://www.idahopress.com/articles/2005/05/19/news/news1.txt

[JerseyGirl]

I was contemplating back to the multi-state drug ring that was recently broken up, by several arrests that were made a day or two after these murders were committed.This case is so weird in that there are several different avenues that seem entirely possible. This could certainly be one of them. I would think that if Jesse knew of any dirt on anyone, after finding out about the brutal murders of his family members, and the disappearance of the kids, he'd tell what he knew. At least I would. That's one of the reasons the date of this drug bust is so interesting. Of course, to get the arrests that they did in that bust, they would have had to start a lot further back than the day before but who knows if Jesse had any additional info that he gave up during interviews with LE after the tragedy.

[Liz]

Of course, to get the arrests that they did in that bust, they would have had to start a lot further back than the day before but who knows if Jesse had any additional info that he gave up during interviews with LE after the tragedy.


Jesse's been in jail since February. Maybe a dealer, perhaps even one of those arrested dealers, or someone they supply, heard Jesse was trying to negotiate a plea. Maybe the murders were to let him know they were serious (dead serious). Then, possibly took the children, as a guarantee that he doesn't talk or testify against someone.

If I understood correctly, Jesse is facing multiple other charges, besides the car theft he is awaiting sentencing on. To me, that gives him a reason to want to negotiate a plea. Who can say for sure though?

I keep thinking about what crime writer Ann Rule said, and she thought that the killer(s) might have a grudge against someone that the victims meant a lot to. Jesse had so many good things to say about his Mom, Mark and Slade. And, sounded like he just adored the heck out of the two little missing ones.

[close_enough]

Thanks for the reply, ce. That's reassuring. I am still wonder if the rescheduling wasn't due to a connection with Jesse, a plea deal, and trying to get those kids back safely before his sentencing.

I was contemplating back to the multi-state drug ring that was recently broken up, by several arrests that were made a day or two after these murders were committed. (JerseyGirl, I think you made a comment about that bust, too.)

It just made me wonder IF something Jesse might have known about and IF he had given info in coping a plea deal. It sounded like a pretty big operation was supposedly closed down, due to that bust. And, it's just been on my mind, ever since. Here's an article detailing the multi-state operation that was busted on May 17th (I think):

http://www.idahopress.com/articles/2005/05/19/news/news1.txt

interesting article, for sure....that's quite a bit of pot & meth...that bust threw a "small wrench" in some dealing, up there, for sure.....i see what you're thinking..hmmm

[JerseyGirl]

If I understood correctly, Jesse is facing multiple other charges, besides the car theft he is awaiting sentencing on. To me, that gives him a reason to want to negotiate a plea. Who can say for sure though?Yet I don't recall if any of those charges were drug related. I seem to remember theft, burglary, assault ... does anyone remember for sure the details of Jesse's charges?

[close_enough]

Jesse's been in jail since February. Maybe a dealer, perhaps even one of those arrested dealers, or someone they supply, heard Jesse was trying to negotiate a plea. Maybe the murders were to let him know they were serious (dead serious). Then, possibly took the children, as a guarantee that he doesn't talk or testify against someone.

If I understood correctly, Jesse is facing multiple other charges, besides the car theft he is awaiting sentencing on. To me, that gives him a reason to want to negotiate a plea. Who can say for sure though?

I keep thinking about what crime writer Ann Rule said, and she thought that the killer(s) might have a grudge against someone that the victims meant a lot to. Jesse had so many good things to say about his Mom, Mark and Slade. And, sounded like he just adored the heck out of the two little missing ones.

well, i see what you mean, but the fact that Mark & Brenda were doing meth, themselves, for at least, the past year, i think this is something that was betw the killers & them (Mark & Brenda)...you could be right though...

people that do crystal meth, do NOT attract "good" people, as a rule, imho...at least that's the way i see it, with meth/crack/cocaine...it's highly addictive, therefore causing many problems for everyone involved..stealing, desperate people, etc.....many people's lives have been completely ruined, because it's so addictive...sure it's cheap, but you keep wanting more, & more.....i can't even imagine..it's just a "darker side", that i can't fathom.....

i really hated to hear that meth was even mentioned with this case, in the beginning..... :(

[close_enough]

Yet I don't recall if any of those charges were drug related. I seem to remember theft, burglary, assault ... does anyone remember for sure the details of Jesse's charges?

glad you posted this...i meant to add that to my last drawn out message....i don't think Jesse had any drug related offenses, but i don't think Brenda did either...dui & possession of parafanalia/paraphanalia (?).....that could mean anything...like a pipe of some kind, with residue in it...

[close_enough]

This case is so weird in that there are several different avenues that seem entirely possible. This could certainly be one of them. I would think that if Jesse knew of any dirt on anyone, after finding out about the brutal murders of his family members, and the disappearance of the kids, he'd tell what he knew. At least I would. That's one of the reasons the date of this drug bust is so interesting. Of course, to get the arrests that they did in that bust, they would have had to start a lot further back than the day before but who knows if Jesse had any additional info that he gave up during interviews with LE after the tragedy.

i agree...i think most people would, also....

[Liz]

Yet I don't recall if any of those charges were drug related. I seem to remember theft, burglary, assault ... does anyone remember for sure the details of Jesse's charges?

I don't think there are any drug related charges being investigated. That doesn't mean that Jesse doesn't know some of the local dealers. The things that Jesse is being investigated for, from what I've researched, are all the types of crimes that meth users tend to and may get involved in. Or, maybe he turned in some players in a car theft ring? His alleged crimes seem to be garden variety.

Plus, under his own admission, he (and Vance, according to him) have had their own struggles with meth.

In a 5/19 Spokesman Review article, "Jesse Groene said his mother always took in him and his oldest brother, Vance Groene, when they struggled with methamphetamine addiction. She would sometimes track the boys down, load them in the truck and take them home."

How long ago could that have been when they are only 18 and 20 now? I believe Jesse's confession to the S-R reporter, as it's a first person confession.

Basically, I've been trying to make the point that Jesse got himself into a position where he might have been inclined to have ratted someone out, in order to receive a lighter sentence. And, I'm sure we've all heard stories about retribution taken upon jailhouse snitches.

It's just speculation though.

[SauerKraut]

I don't think there are any drug related charges being investigated. That doesn't mean that Jesse doesn't know some of the local dealers. The things that Jesse is being investigated for, from what I've researched, are all the types of crimes that meth users tend to and may get involved in. Or, maybe he turned in some players in a car theft ring? His alleged crimes seem to be garden variety.

Plus, under his own admission, he (and Vance, according to him) have had their own struggles with meth.

In a 5/19 Spokesman Review article, "Jesse Groene said his mother always took in him and his oldest brother, Vance Groene, when they struggled with methamphetamine addiction. She would sometimes track the boys down, load them in the truck and take them home."

How long ago could that have been when they are only 18 and 20 now? I believe Jesse's confession to the S-R reporter, as it's a first person confession.

Basically, I've been trying to make the point that Jesse got himself into a position where he might have been inclined to have ratted someone out, in order to receive a lighter sentence. And, I'm sure we've all heard stories about retribution taken upon jailhouse snitches.

It's just speculation though.

I think it's very interesting about Jesse being sentenced and if he was possibly contemplating testifying against some people. This seems very plausible. The fact that it happened right before his orig. sentencing date seems like they were sending him a warning about copping any type of plea.

[joanofarc]

In a 5/19 Spokesman Review article, "Jesse Groene said his mother always took in him and his oldest brother, Vance Groene, when they struggled with methamphetamine addiction. She would sometimes track the boys down, load them in the truck and take them home."
This is one of the reasons I question why Brenda and Mark would dabble in meth....obviously Brenda had experienced what this drug did to her own 2 sons...why would she risk her own life and Mark's and get involved with this type of drug....it doesn't make sense to me....

What if, before Mark and Brenda were killed, they were forced to smoke or ingest meth...just so it would show up in their systems and make it look like the couple used the drug....something to ponder :waitasec:

[close_enough]

This is one of the reasons I question why Brenda and Mark would dabble in meth....obviously Brenda had experienced what this drug did to her own 2 sons...why would she risk her own life and Mark's and get involved with this type of drug....it doesn't make sense to me....

What if, before Mark and Brenda were killed, they were forced to smoke or ingest meth...just so it would show up in their systems and make it look like the couple used the drug....something to ponder :waitasec:

i don't think they were forced to smoke meth, myself...mainly because we already know that Mark & Brenda were into it, at least, for the past year....so Brenda's son said.....i also believe that's why he (Vance) moved out recently...some shady stuff, most likely related to meth, was going on, & maybe he didn't want any part of it....i had a friend that was a pill head, pretty much (pain pills)....as the years went by, she ended up smoking crystal meth, then on to crack....by that time, i wasn't hanging around her anymore....her son told me that she would ask HIM for money, or for him to try to find meth for her....no one could have ever told me that she would get into crystal meth, years ago....she was found dead, in the snow, behind a Mapco, down the street from her house....apparently she had left, walking, for the store for cigarettes, & had a heart attack...
you would think that Brenda would have known the dangers involved with meth, if her sons had done it in the past...hard to say though...Brenda may have been dabbling in it, for awhile, herself...apparently it's a really good high...i wouldn't know...i'm too afraid of it...

[joanofarc]

i don't think they were forced to smoke meth, myself...mainly because we already know that Mark & Brenda were into it, at least, for the past year....so Brenda's son said.....i also believe that's why he (Vance) moved out recently...some shady stuff, most likely related to meth, was going on, & maybe he didn't want any part of it....you would think that Brenda would have known the dangers involved with meth, if her sons had done it in the past...hard to say though...Brenda may have been dabbling in it, for awhile, herself...apparently it's a really good high...i wouldn't know...i'm too afraid of it...See this is what bothers me...when Mark's mom talked to the press she said she did not know of any meth use...she said they smoked pot but didn't think there was Meth involved as Mark was a hard worker who never missed a days work in almost 20 years....perhaps she just didn't know as I guess that isn't something you would broadcast to your family.

Brenda's mom has not commented at all. However, the dad, Steve and the two sons who have a history of meth addiction are claiming that Brenda and Mark were getting into "heavy" use and this was causing problems....it just makes me wonder are they trying to divert the suspicion off themselves by declaring that it was Mark and Brenda who were having drug problems...or did the problems originally begin with Vance and Jesse's addictions??

[close_enough]

See this is what bothers me...when Mark's mom talked to the press she said she did not know of any meth use...she said they smoked pot but didn't think there was Meth involved as Mark was a hard worker who never missed a days work in almost 20 years....perhaps she just didn't know as I guess that isn't something you would broadcast to your family.

Brenda's mom has not commented at all. However, the dad, Steve and the two sons who have a history of meth addiction are claiming that Brenda and Mark were getting into "heavy" use and this was causing problems....it just makes me wonder are they trying to divert the suspicion off themselves by declaring that it was Mark and Brenda who were having drug problems...or did the problems originally begin with Vance and Jesse's addictions??

yeah, i wouldn't think Mark would have told his mama that he was using meth, but i would think that some, if not most, of the other family members were aware.....(just a feeling)...you know, like siblings, cousins, that kind of thing...i want to think that this was a fairly big family, but i could be wrong on that.....i see what you're saying, & it could make sense, for sure.....but i really don't think Vance, Jesse, or Steve is involved, in any way, in this...i DO think they have a good idea why Brenda & Mark were killed though....i could be completely off base though...it's just a feeling i have...i don't think Brenda & Mark's problems had anything to do with Vance, Jesse or Steve...

[joanofarc]

yeah, i wouldn't think Mark would have told his mama that he was using meth, but i would think that some, if not most, of the other family members were aware.....(just a feeling)...you know, like siblings, cousins, that kind of thing...i want to think that this was a fairly big family, but i could be wrong on that.....i see what you're saying, & it could make sense, for sure.....but i really don't think Vance, Jesse, or Steve is involved, in any way, in this...i DO think they have a good idea why Brenda & Mark were killed though....i could be completely off base though...it's just a feeling i have...i don't think Brenda & Mark's problems had anything to do with Vance, Jesse or Steve...I don't think they were directly involved either...but the perps could have been acquaintances of Jesse, Vance, or Steve....especially with the boys if they were known Meth addicts....IMO

[close_enough]

I don't think they were directly involved either...but the perps could have been acquaintances of Jesse, Vance, or Steve....especially with the boys if they were known Meth addicts....IMO

true...hmm, if it's someone that knows Jesse, Vance, or Steve, then it seems like one of them would give a name/address, or whatever..you know, if they think they might know who did this....i would think that LE has drilled all three of them about names of folks that might have wanted to do this against them, like retaliation...(jesse, vance, steve) ...if it were me, & i knew someone was "upset" w/me, i'd tell LE, so they could check it out....gosh, these folks might have crossed a lot of paths, over time....ugh, if it's all meth related.... :(

[joanofarc]

true...hmm, if it's someone that knows Jesse, Vance, or Steve, then it seems like one of them would give a name/address, or whatever..you know, if they think they might know who did this....i would think that LE has drilled all three of them about names of folks that might have wanted to do this against them, like retaliation...(jesse, vance, steve) ...if it were me, & i knew someone was "upset" w/me, i'd tell LE, so they could check it out....gosh, these folks might have crossed a lot of paths, over time....ugh, if it's all meth related.... :(That is if they are above board and their supplying of names and information does not implicate them in a criminal offense where they could do time or more time as in the case of Jesse...but you are right, keeping quiet about information that might lead them to the kids does not help them ....however it makes me wonder about the strange statements made to the public by Steve....such as take my harley and Shasta and Dylan had nothing to do with this!!

[Nchadwickaz]

glad you posted this...i meant to add that to my last drawn out message....i don't think Jesse had any drug related offenses, but i don't think Brenda did either...dui & possession of parafanalia/paraphanalia (?).....that could mean anything...like a pipe of some kind, with residue in it...I think it is very important to keep in mind that in a majority of criminal cases -- a very high number of these are never taken to trial and instead result in a plea agreement. I know at least where I live (since my county criminal/civil/family records are available on-line) so often the charges that they were arrested or orginally charged w/ are plead down to a lessor charge or even dropped (especially in the case where another count is a higher felony)....

To show my point (only using this as an example - from my county) --this case below has nothing to do w/ topic case but shows how plea agreements do not accuratly reflect the actual crimes committed:
http://http://www.superiorcourt.maricopa.gov/docket/criminal/caseInfo.asp?caseNumber=CR2000-015394 (http://http://www.superiorcourt.maricopa.gov/docket/criminal/caseInfo.asp?caseNumber=CR2000-015394)


If you view the docket date of 10/4/2004 - Shows the following charges that this person was charged w/ when he was arrested: Keep in mind (every count is a seperate crime -- that is why cts 2-4 these are 3 different acts of forgery AND the lower the number of felony 1-6 the higher the severity of the sentencing (1 being the worst, 6 least)



*Count 1: THEFT OF MEANS OF TRANSPORTATION CL 3 FELONY
Count 2: FORGERY CL 4 FELONY
Count 3: FORGERY CL 4 FELONY
Count 4: FORGERY CL 4 FELONY
*Count 5: POSSESSION OF DANGEROUS DRUGS CL 4 FELONY
Count 6: POSSESSION OF DRUG PARAPHERNALIA CL 6 FELONY
Count 7: POSSESSION OF BURGLARY TOOLS CL 6 FELONY
Count 8: POSSESSION OF A FORGERY DEVICE CL 6 FELONY

* the only convictions that will appear on his criminal record


This is what this person's plea agreement consisted of
http://www.courtminutes.maricopa.gov/docs/Criminal/112000/m0226584.pdf




Guity on Count 1 as Amended: Attempt to Commit Theft of

Means of Transportation, a class 4 felony
Guity on Count 5: Possession of Dangerous Drugs, a class 4
felony
IT IS FURTHER ORDERED that the motion to dismiss Counts 2,
3, 4, 6, 7 and 8 as reflected in the Plea Agreement, will be
deemed submitted at the time of sentencing.



Sorry this is long -- but as I started researching local cases I am in awe of how frequently plea agreements are used....

[CaliKid]

I think Mark's mom either didn't know about the meth use or is in heavy denial.

[TisHerself]

I think Mark's mom either didn't know about the meth use or is in heavy denial.

It is pretty hard to hide meth use especially if it was as heavy as Vance is saying it was. As for me the jury is still out on that, I'm not really buying the meth use (I could be wrong).
Maybe it had nothing to do with meth, nothing to do with any family members. That house is right of a main highway suppose it was just random nothing would surprise me.

[close_enough]

That is if they are above board and their supplying of names and information does not implicate them in a criminal offense where they could do time or more time as in the case of Jesse...but you are right, keeping quiet about information that might lead them to the kids does not help them ....however it makes me wonder about the strange statements made to the public by Steve....such as take my harley and Shasta and Dylan had nothing to do with this!!

good point....
i think the reason Steve said that Shasta & Dylan "had nothing to do with anything" (along those lines) was because he thinks it's drug related, himself...jmo
i know some folks here get tired of me going on & on with this drug/meth theory, but i think that since Vance had been living there, & recently moved out, he knew a lot about what was going on in the household....i believe he knew something was coming to a head, & got out, therefore he probably told Steve why he moved out, & that's why Steve said what he did, about the children.....
i only know a handful of people that are big Harley lovers....they DO love their motorcycles....not sure why he said that, except maybe it's one of the dearest things to him, that he could offer??

[close_enough]

this is an interview w/Vance Groene, apparently the day after the murders, that Rle7 posted on a closed thread...i had never seen this...thought i would post it here, incase others hadn't either...

http://www.krem.com/perl/common/video/wmPlayer.pl?title=www.krem.com/crime/052005_vance-groene.wmv

[Rle7]

Along those lines, for those interested, here is a video of a jailhouse interview with Jesse Groene shortly after the murders. This was originally posted by JerseyGirl on the first closed thread:

KXLY.COM Audio/Video Player (http://kxly.com/player/player.asp?v=stories/video/2005may/fam.ram)

Video interview of Jesse Groene. Jesse said that this is where his life changes because his family didn't want him "to be like this".

If you can't see the video for some reason, here's the main page with a small photo of Jesse:

KXLY -- Spokane, WA (http://www.kxly.com/common/getStory.asp?id=43848)

[JerseyGirl]

I think it's very interesting about Jesse being sentenced and if he was possibly contemplating testifying against some people. This seems very plausible. The fact that it happened right before his orig. sentencing date seems like they were sending him a warning about copping any type of plea.It does seem possible but then again, if he doesn't know that Shasta & Dylan are still out there somewhere, where is his incentive to NOT tell what he knows? At this point, as far as we can tell, he's got nothing left to lose. If this was my family that was murdered & kidnapped, I'd drop every dime I had and take these sick b*stards as far down as I possibly could. And then I would count down the seconds until my release so that I could hunt them down & inflict my own justice. If I'd go back to jail; if they'd kill me; who cares ... I don't know if I could go on after something like this anyway.

[Liz]

I've been wondering how Jesse's sentencing turned out today. I tried to find anything online and so far, haven't found much.

I did find out that Jesse was scheduled to go before the Honorable John T. Mitchell at 3:30 pm this afternoon. So Jesse has either already received his sentence or is just about to go before the judge at any moment.

Here's the link (http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:5gF4b_VB_wEJ:www.co.kootenai.id.us/departments/districtcourt/schedules/20050628_TUESDAY_HTML_CALENDAR_TUESDAY.html+kooten ai+county+sentencing%2BJesse+Groene&hl=en&ie=UTF-8) to cases in Kootenai county that were to be heard today.

[Gracelin]

I've been wondering how Jesse's sentencing turned out today. I tried to find anything online and so far, haven't found much.

I did find out that Jesse was scheduled to go before the Honorable John T. Mitchell at 3:30 pm this afternoon. So Jesse has either already received his sentence or is just about to go before the judge at any moment.

Here's the link (http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:5gF4b_VB_wEJ:www.co.kootenai.id.us/departments/districtcourt/schedules/20050628_TUESDAY_HTML_CALENDAR_TUESDAY.html+kooten ai+county+sentencing%2BJesse+Groene&hl=en&ie=UTF-8) to cases in Kootenai county that were to be heard today.
It may take 24 hours to update the system,

It's almost a shame to say, But that boy will be better off if he is sentenced for a while, Can you imagine him turned loose with the anger he has built up inside of him.
I say it's a shame cause on one hand he needs his remaining family emotionally now. But on the other he neds to be punished for his crime and could end up in some deep dodo if he was set free. If it were me getting out. I would be coming out with a mission.

It will be interesting to hear that outcome. It would be something if LE pulled the strings to get him out so he could lead them unknowingly straight to the perps..Or does that only happen in the movies..

[Rle7]

I've been wondering how Jesse's sentencing turned out today. I tried to find anything online and so far, haven't found much.

I did find out that Jesse was scheduled to go before the Honorable John T. Mitchell at 3:30 pm this afternoon. So Jesse has either already received his sentence or is just about to go before the judge at any moment.

Here's the link (http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:5gF4b_VB_wEJ:www.co.kootenai.id.us/departments/districtcourt/schedules/20050628_TUESDAY_HTML_CALENDAR_TUESDAY.html+kooten ai+county+sentencing%2BJesse+Groene&hl=en&ie=UTF-8) to cases in Kootenai county that were to be heard today.Here you go Liz :) :

(Jesse) Groene, 18, was sentenced to six years in prison for felony burglary and five years for damaging a lock at the Kootenai County jail.

Mitchell ordered the sentences to run concurrently and allowed the first six months to be served at Cottonwood, where Groene would undergo in-patient drug treatment. Mitchell told Groene if he is to succeed on probation in six months, he will have to stay away from people, maybe even family members, connected to a lifestyle which includes methamphetamine use.

"You are the one who bears the responsibility" for the future, Mitchell said.

http://www.cdapress.com/articles/2005/06/29/news/news03.txt (http://www.cdapress.com/articles/2005/06/29/news/news03.txt)


Sounds like Jesse can get out on probation in six months if he completes his drug treatment. But the judge doesn't want him around family members that use or have used, probably referring to Vance. That's got to be tough considering the loss they have suffered. You would think they needed each other's support right now. I wonder if that would include Steve too because of his previous drug history?

Well, its better then serving two felony sentences concurrently. :behindbar

[annie mae]

Hi Guys. Well, I have thought about the sentence that was given to Jesse and it sounds like an ok one IF:( he can stay away from the drugs, friends, and family, a mighty large order:( And if he does make it thru the drug treatment, will it really all go away, the other charges that is? or will Jesse go ballistic? I am scared for Jesse. If he is succesful with his drug reabilitation and hits the streets in 6 months, and knowledge of the killers are exposed, what then??? And what do "they" expect from a boy of 18 years of age if he learns who is responsible for his loss and pain??? I hope Jesse is a strong person and can play by the rules. Candles STILL burning for the children.:)

[Liz]

Here you go Liz :)


Thank you for the links, Rle7! :) I appreciate all your efforts and contributions.

I hope and pray that Jesse keeps his word to the judge and takes this great opportunity he has been given to clean up his life.

As for his desire to go into Coast Guard, I think it would be great IF he can get in. But with his past, I almost doubt it. They're pretty selective nowadays. Unless maybe the judge agrees to expunge his record after he completes his probation. Does anyone know?

[Lili]

I know a local who was paroled on condition that he joined the service for 4 years. He went into the Navy.

[Liz]

Lili, do you know if that was recently?

This website states that a requirement for enlistment of all branches of service is, "no criminal record". :confused:

http://www.thehighschoolgraduate.com/editorial/USarmed.htm


Edited to clarify

[Liz]

Forgot to mention that all three Spokane channels covered Jesse's sentencing and also made mention of the missing children and gave out the contact into. A couple of the stations interviewed Jesse back at the county jail.

The judge brought up this little group or gang that Jesse is a member of, the "North Francis Pimps". I guess now LE is looking into that possibility. Jesse said that they didn't go around hurting anyone. I did a little searching but was unable to find anything online about them.

I don't know. Jesse sure changed his tune, unless I am mistaken. Prior to yesterday, he didn't seem to think that the triple homicide was due to drugs; but now he seems to think it was drugs that caused the murders. He even expressed concern that Vance better change, as the same thing could happen to him and his family! :eek:

Hmmmm.... I could have sworn that Steve had previously said that Vance already had gotten his act together???

Either stories are a-changing or I'm losing my mind. :banghead:

ETA: Forgot to tell you that Jesse's been interview by LE 15-20 times since the murders

ETA KREM link (http://www.krem.com/news/police/stories/krem2_062905_jesse-groene.5910318b.html) on Jesse's plea for leniency. Not much there that you don't already know, except for a pic of Jesse.

Here's a blurb from KHQ (http://msnbc.msn.com/id/8410313/)

[Lili]

Lili, do you know if that was recently?

This website states that a requirement for enlistment of all branches of service is, "no criminal record". :confused:

http://www.thehighschoolgraduate.com/editorial/USarmed.htm


Edited to clarify
It was about 5 years ago. He's out of the service and back home now. And he wasn't a juvenile when this occured. He was in his early 20's with family. He had been busted more than once with controlled substances and had DUI's etc. His charges were reduced on condition that he go into the service.

[CaliKid]

So it would seem that Jesse is highly invested in getting the story out there, but Vance isn't saying much?

[Rle7]

Jesse Groene jailhouse interview for 7/6/05:

http://www.krem.com/perl/common/video/wmPlayer.pl?title=www.krem.com/crime/070605_groene-latest3.wmv

[kpass]

OK...can someone help me here? I know Steve is Shasta's dad, Jesse is her brother in prison on drug charges, but who is Vance? Another brother?

[chicoliving]

OK...can someone help me here? I know Steve is Shasta's dad, Jesse is her brother in prison on drug charges, but who is Vance? Another brother?
Hi kpass! Yep, Vance is the oldest brother. He had just moved out of the house a week or two prior to the murders.....he's got a girlfriend and they have I think two children.

[PrayersForMaura]

Hi kpass! Yep, Vance is the oldest brother. He had just moved out of the house a week or two prior to the murders.....he's got a girlfriend and they have I think two children.
Is there any possibility that Vance knew Duncan somehow?

[kpass]

Hi kpass! Yep, Vance is the oldest brother. He had just moved out of the house a week or two prior to the murders.....he's got a girlfriend and they have I think two children.

Thanks Chicoliving for your :twocents: it helped clear the :waitasec:

[Liz]

From this article (http://www.cdapress.com/articles/2005/07/14/news/news01.txt) in yesterday's CdA Press.

Meanwhile, 1st District Judge John Mitchell on Wednesday granted a motion to allow Dylan's 18-year-old brother, Jesse, a furlough to attend the boy's funeral on Saturday.

Mitchell agreed to the request to have Jesse Groene brought back from the Shoshone County Jail, where he is awaiting transportation to the Idaho State Prison's diagnostic unit on his felony convictions for burglary and damaging a lock at the Kootenai County jail. Both boys' father, Steve Groene, told Mitchell law officers had offered to assist in getting Jesse back to town in time for the funeral and returning him to custody.

Mitchell released Jesse Groene once before without incident for the funeral of his mother and brother, Slade. Jesse Groene's public defender, Martin Neils, also said he was told Dylan's public funeral, set for 1 p.m. at the Real Life Ministries church in Post Falls, might have to be postponed to accommodate the illness of another family member.

Mitchell told Neils to keep him informed of any possible changes.


I'm not soft on crime, and I do appreciate that the judge is even allowing Jesse to attend Dylan's memorial service. But, I sure wish the judge would let Jesse have a full day, to be able to grieve with his family. It doesn't really say exactly how long he is being released for; but last time it was only like 4 hours, if memory serves me correctly.

I guess that's the thing about crime. As they say, "don't do the crime, if you can't do the time".

[Tom'sGirl]

From this article (http://www.cdapress.com/articles/2005/07/14/news/news01.txt) in yesterday's CdA Press.

Meanwhile, 1st District Judge John Mitchell on Wednesday granted a motion to allow Dylan's 18-year-old brother, Jesse, a furlough to attend the boy's funeral on Saturday.

Mitchell agreed to the request to have Jesse Groene brought back from the Shoshone County Jail, where he is awaiting transportation to the Idaho State Prison's diagnostic unit on his felony convictions for burglary and damaging a lock at the Kootenai County jail. Both boys' father, Steve Groene, told Mitchell law officers had offered to assist in getting Jesse back to town in time for the funeral and returning him to custody.

Mitchell released Jesse Groene once before without incident for the funeral of his mother and brother, Slade. Jesse Groene's public defender, Martin Neils, also said he was told Dylan's public funeral, set for 1 p.m. at the Real Life Ministries church in Post Falls, might have to be postponed to accommodate the illness of another family member.

Mitchell told Neils to keep him informed of any possible changes.


I'm not soft on crime, and I do appreciate that the judge is even allowing Jesse to attend Dylan's memorial service. But, I sure wish the judge would let Jesse have a full day, to be able to grieve with his family. It doesn't really say exactly how long he is being released for; but last time it was only like 4 hours, if memory serves me correctly.

I guess that's the thing about crime. As they say, "don't do the crime, if you can't do the time".
Thanks Liz for the up-date!

[Liz]

A little more on Jesse, from the S-R, 7/15/05 --

http://www.spokesmanreview.com/local/story.asp?ID=80206

Among family members expected to attend the service will be Jesse Groene, Shasta's 18-year-old brother who is in the Shoshone County Jail awaiting transport to a state correctional facility on a burglary conviction. On Wednesday, 1st District Judge John Mitchell granted Jesse Groene an afternoon furlough to attend the service.

[AdoraBlue]

http://www.co.kootenai.id.us/departments/districtcourt/schedules/20051123_WEDNESDAY_HTML_CALENDAR_WEDNESDAY.html

I noticed this at the link Liz provided in the Trial thread (in Judge John T. Mitchell's courtroom):

11:00 AMGroene, Jesse StevenJurisdictional ReviewCR-2005-0007778Prosecutor: Kootenai County, Prosecutor
Defense Attorney: Palmer, Conflict Public Defender, Michael G.
11:00 AMGroene, Jesse StevenJurisdictional ReviewCR-2005-0002488Prosecutor: Kootenai County, Prosecutor
Defense Attorney: Palmer, Conflict Public Defender, Michael G.


I can't help but feel for Jesse (and Vance). No matter what Jesse has done, losing his mother and two brothers is devastating. And then to be in court on the same day as the monster, I would be overwhelmed.

Does anyone know what "conflict public defender" and "jurisdictional review" mean?

[mysteriew]

I am not sure Adorablue. I wonder if it isn't related to the fact that the same office is representing Duncan and the brother of his victim. That could be seen as a conflict of interest, esp in such a high profile case.

[tired.old.hag]

No matter what Jesse has done, losing his mother and two brothers is devastating.

From http://www.spokesmanreview.com/sections/groene/?ID=77545

Groene, 18, was charged with burglary and grand theft after he was caught shoplifting from the Post Falls Wal-Mart and found with a stolen Jeep on Feb. 9. He also was charged with injury to jail when he kicked a door at the jail while in custody and damaged the locking mechanism.
<snip>

As part of a plea agreement, Jesse Groene pleaded guilty to the burglary and injury to jail charges. The grand theft charge was dismissed. Mitchell sentenced Groene to two years in the state penitentiary, with four more years possible.

Mitchell, however, retained jurisdiction, which means that Groene will attend a six-month program at the state Department of Corrections facility in Cottonwood, Idaho, and if he's successful, he'll be put on probation. If he fails, he could serve out the entire sentence.



I sure wish they'd go ahead and let him out so he can be home with his family for Christmas. This Christmas is going to be awfully hard on all of them. Life and JED have punished Jesse more than enough. He needs his family, and they need him.

[tired.old.hag]

And then to be in court on the same day as the monster, I would be overwhelmed.

And on the day before Thanksgiving, and 2 days before Shasta's birthday. For god's sake that's crazy as hell.

[Openmind]

From http://www.spokesmanreview.com/sections/groene/?ID=77545

Groene, 18, was charged with burglary and grand theft after he was caught shoplifting from the Post Falls Wal-Mart and found with a stolen Jeep on Feb. 9. He also was charged with injury to jail when he kicked a door at the jail while in custody and damaged the locking mechanism.
<snip>

As part of a plea agreement, Jesse Groene pleaded guilty to the burglary and injury to jail charges. The grand theft charge was dismissed. Mitchell sentenced Groene to two years in the state penitentiary, with four more years possible.

Mitchell, however, retained jurisdiction, which means that Groene will attend a six-month program at the state Department of Corrections facility in Cottonwood, Idaho, and if he's successful, he'll be put on probation. If he fails, he could serve out the entire sentence.



I sure wish they'd go ahead and let him out so he can be home with his family for Christmas. This Christmas is going to be awfully hard on all of them. Life and JED have punished Jesse more than enough. He needs his family, and they need him.
I agree. I remember Jesse talking about Dylan getting a buzz cut in support of his big brother having one in jail. It would be good if he could be home for Thanksgiving, Shasta's birthday, and Christmas. There are going to be enough empty spaces this year for the holidays.

[Liz]

http://www.co.kootenai.id.us/departments/districtcourt/schedules/20051123_WEDNESDAY_HTML_CALENDAR_WEDNESDAY.html

I noticed this at the link Liz provided in the Trial thread (in Judge John T. Mitchell's courtroom):

11:00 AMGroene, Jesse StevenJurisdictional ReviewCR-2005-0007778Prosecutor: Kootenai County, Prosecutor
Defense Attorney: Palmer, Conflict Public Defender, Michael G.
11:00 AMGroene, Jesse StevenJurisdictional ReviewCR-2005-0002488Prosecutor: Kootenai County, Prosecutor
Defense Attorney: Palmer, Conflict Public Defender, Michael G.


I can't help but feel for Jesse (and Vance). No matter what Jesse has done, losing his mother and two brothers is devastating. And then to be in court on the same day as the monster, I would be overwhelmed.

Does anyone know what "conflict public defender" and "jurisdictional review" mean?


Glad you picked up on that, AdoraBlue! I completely missed it!

I bet Mysteriew is right on about the "conflict public defender", being due to a conflict of interest in the public defender's office.

My guess on "jurisdictional review" is that the Judge is going to review Jesse's case, to determine whose jurisdiction Jesse will remain in. Whether Judge Mitchell is going to let Jesse out on probation, or make him serve out his time in a state correctional facility, would be my guess.

I didn't think Jesse was due for this hearing until 6 months after his sentencing date (June 29th, I think). Maybe Judge Mitchell is hearing his case early so that Jesse might be able to be home for Christmas, if not for Thanksgiving.

I'm praying that Jesse completed his program at Cottonwood successfully and is ready to be released on probation.

[tired.old.hag]

I found something that said a Conflict Public Defender is a private lawyer appointed for someone when there's a conflict of interest in a criminal case within the county's public defender's office. I just accidentally hit the 'X' trying to switch windows and the window closed LOL. I'm too tired to go back and find it again LOL. God I hate when I do that.

Yep, you were right, mysterview. Good call.

[Liz]

Saw Jesse walking out with his girlfriend ....

Happy Thanksgiving, Jesse!

[Becba]

Mark and Brenda both had trace amounts of meth and marijuana. Not a lot in their system. I think it was Vance who mentioned their "escalating" drug use and violence. Perhaps they had just recently began trying meth and Vance meant that was escalating drug use.
I do think Duncan may have smoked some of their stash after the crime. There were a few areas in the house where residue was found.
It sounds like they both were functioning as capable of holding a job or parenting so I do not think they were heavy drug users. Brenda's friends described her as a good mother and Mark was described as hard working.
We know there were 2 DUI's and a drug charge against Brenda and Mark had a charge of pulling a firearm on someone and child endangerment or cruelty, something like that.
Mark was said to have pulled a gun on Vance and that is why he moved out the first time. So both Mark and Brenda had issues. But none of this had anything to do with what turned out to be a random crime by a crazed sadist, who just happened to desire the 2 little children playing in the pool that he spotted from the road.

[Openmind]

Saw Jesse walking out with his girlfriend ....

Happy Thanksgiving, Jesse!
Thanks for sharing that. I'm glad Jesse is home with his family.

[Liz]

Thanks for sharing that. I'm glad Jesse is home with his family.

Me, too.

Melissa Luck covered his court hearing and there was a little more on KXLY at 6:30.

The prosecutor didn't even try to argue Jesse's release. He said Jesse's performance in boot camp was outstanding, and that he was a changed man. He also recommended Jesse be allowed to move away to western Washington, to live with family.

Jesse thanked the judge for allowing him the opportunity and the "interstate compact with Tacoma", telling him he just wanted to "get out of this mess and start his life over". The Judge agreed and told Jesse he was proud of him.

He will have to serve three years of probation but is being given a second chance. He will have to adhere to strict probation guidelines including drug treatment and anger management. If he doesn't he could still go back to prison.

He is going to go live with his aunt and uncle (I'm guessing 'Aunt Wendy & Uncle Bob') in Tacoma, where he has a job lined up and will attend community college.

I will be praying that this young man turns his life around and succeeds with the opportunity given him. I truly think he can and will!

[JerseyGirl]

What a heart-warming Thanksgiving story to hear that Jesse is now out of prison and can hopefully begin a new chapter in his life. What an absolute nightmare to have something so unbelievably atrocious happen to your family, and be stuck behind bars. Maybe he can begin his own healing now. Good luck to you, Jesse.

[AdoraBlue]

Godspeed, Jesse!

[tired.old.hag]

OMG what great, great news! For the whole family! I am so very happy for all of them - I know this will help them all on their road to recovery and healing.

Sounds like Jesse has done an extremely excellent job in his program. What a terrific young man. And what a super plan he has for his life - already a job lined up, going to college. This is just wonderful news.

I hope the Groene and McKenzie families were able to be together yesterday for Thanksgiving, and to have some support and love.

I'm getting sappy :)


Now. What's Vance doing? Anyone know?

And last I heard, Steve was not having his cancer treatments. Anyone know what's going on with him? Is he working? I really would like him to be home with Shasta, if that's what he feels is best for her and for him.

Aren't I a busybody? lol

[partyuv5]

I didn't know Steve had cancer? Did I miss this?

[GreekSong]

partyuv5, Steve was diagnosed with throat cancer in August. He said on Oprah(which was taped in September) that he would have radiation, but I haven't heard anything since. They said it was caught early though, and that's good. Steve will be fine. I know he will be, because God or the universe or karma or whatever would not do that to Shasta(or Jesse or Vance for that matter).

TOH, you're not a busybody. It's not like you're hanging out in front of their house or stalking them like papparazzi, lol. You're just concerned for the family, like we all are. I'm sure they understand that people have sort of become attached to them. I actually kind of feel like they're my family. Hell, I'm even starting to feel like all the LE people are my family(which makes my major crush on Bill Douglas boderline weird, lol). I think they appreciate that there's so many people out there pulling for them.

[tired.old.hag]

TOH, you're not a busybody. It's not like you're hanging out in front of their house or stalking them like papparazzi, lol. You're just concerned for the family, like we all are. I'm sure they understand that people have sort of become attached to them. I actually kind of feel like they're my family. Hell, I'm even starting to feel like all the LE people are my family(which makes my major crush on Bill Douglas boderline weird, lol). I think they appreciate that there's so many people out there pulling for them.
LOL Greeksong. And thank you :) But yes, that's exactly how it feels, doesn't it? Like they're family almost. I worry about them all so much.

Now, about your crush on my Bill Douglas... ahem... I believe I put first dibs on him... ;)

[Tom'sGirl]

Saw Jesse walking out with his girlfriend ....

Happy Thanksgiving, Jesse!
I assume you mean Corina M. Tosh right?

[concernedperson]

Blessings to this family no matter how they resurrect themselves. This is one family that has seen hell. Their daughter is in my prayers daily. She needs so much support.Shasta, everyday of my life Iwill pray for you. I mean this, from the bottem of my heart.

[Tom'sGirl]

And last I heard, Steve was not having his cancer treatments. Anyone know what's going on with him? Is he working? I really would like him to be home with Shasta, if that's what he feels is best for her and for him.
I sure hadn't heard that toh, I thought he started having them back a couple of months ago according to this article:confused:

September 9, 2005
SNIP:
Price said the children's father, Steve Groene, hopes he'll be well enough to attend the show. (ETA:, this show aired in October)
On Wednesday, (ETA:, Sept. 14th?) Price said, Groene was preparing for radiation treatments for cancer in his vocal cords, a recent diagnosis.

She said doctors have said the cancer was caught early and is "very curable."



http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:7yqi24s72DYJ:www.spokesmanreview.co m/sections/groene/%3FID%3D89567+Steve+Groene+cancer+treatment&hl=en (http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:7yqi24s72DYJ:www.spokesmanreview.co m/sections/groene/%3FID%3D89567+Steve+Groene+cancer+treatment&hl=en)

[tired.old.hag]

Hi, TomsGirl. I didn't know Jesse's girlfriend's name. Thanks for providing that. Corina has been a fav name of mine for a long time. I had seen a pic of her. It's good to put a name with her face.


That article says he was preparing for radiation, not started, and on Oprah, he said he had not started.

I've been wracking my brain trying to remember where I read that Steve was still not getting treatment. It was definitely after the Oprah show aired.

I'm really sorry, all. I think you all know I'm a stickler, particularly on this case, for avoiding rumors, and sticking with reports only from reliable sources.

I should have found the source again before posting it. I will dig around today and see if I can find it.

[Tom'sGirl]

Hi, TomsGirl. I didn't know Jesse's girlfriend's name. Thanks for providing that. Corina has been a fav name of mine for a long time. I had seen a pic of her. It's good to put a name with her face.


That article says he was preparing for radiation, not started, and on Oprah, he said he had not started.

I've been wracking my brain trying to remember where I read that Steve was still not getting treatment. It was definitely after the Oprah show aired.

I'm really sorry, all. I think you all know I'm a stickler, particularly on this case, for avoiding rumors, and sticking with reports only from reliable sources.

I should have found the source again before posting it. I will dig around today and see if I can find it.
Hi back,

Hey, one can't always attach a link, at least I can't if I heard it on T.V. especailly if it was on some news station at some point in time:waitasec: then I try to remember which channel, and come up empty.

I did read up on Throat Cancer treatment and I read this:

The standard treatment for most laryngeal and pharyngeal cancers is surgery and radiation therapy, either alone or in combination, depending on the size and location of the tumor. http://www.mayoclinic.org/throatcancer-jax/ (http://www.mayoclinic.org/throatcancer-jax/)
So maybe the doctor's decided if it was only Stage I it wasn't necessary??????

RE:Corina:
The only reason I know of Jesse's girlfriend's name is because when we were all gathering information in the early stages of the case her name was mentioned several times. I won't say anything more, as those who remember won't want to bring up old facts, or her past.

[Liz]

I assume you mean Corina M. Tosh right?


I guess it was Corina, Tom'sGirl. Looked like the same girl that accompanied him to the funeral. There was also another couple with her, that were there for Jesse's release.

[GreekSong]

I've never seen a picture of Corina, so I can't compare, but I did assume the girl walking out with Jesse was her.

[Liz]

When checking the court schedule a couple of days ago, I discovered that an arraignment/pre-trial conference was scheduled for Vance Robert Groene for this morning at 8:30 AM.

I have learned that the charges involve Possession of a Controlled Substance and Possession of Drug Paraphernalia with Intent to Use or Deliver.

I know he is innocent until proven guilty but ...

I am dismayed that the horrific crimes this family has been faced with are not enough to make Vance straighten up and fly right. It's well past time for Vance to grow up and be an example to his younger brother and sister, and especially his own young children.

Please, get with the program, Vance; and get your $hit together, for heaven's sake! Think of your family! They need you!

[concernedperson]

When checking the court schedule a couple of days ago, I discovered that an arraignment/pre-trial conference was scheduled for Vance Robert Groene for this morning at 8:30 AM.

I have learned that the charges involve Possession of a Controlled Substance and Possession of Drug Paraphernalia with Intent to Use or Deliver.

I know he is innocent until proven guilty but ...

I am dismayed that the horrific crimes this family has been faced with are not enough to make Vance straighten up and fly right. It's well past time for Vance to grow up and be an example to his younger brother and sister, and especially his own young children.

Please, get with the program, Vance; and get your $hit together, for heaven's sake! Think of your family! They need you!

Great plea and I hope someone sends him this. His family needs him and he can supply the support. All he needs to do is step up to the plate.

[dragonfly]

When checking the court schedule a couple of days ago, I discovered that an arraignment/pre-trial conference was scheduled for Vance Robert Groene for this morning at 8:30 AM.

I have learned that the charges involve Possession of a Controlled Substance and Possession of Drug Paraphernalia with Intent to Use or Deliver.

I know he is innocent until proven guilty but ...

I am dismayed that the horrific crimes this family has been faced with are not enough to make Vance straighten up and fly right. It's well past time for Vance to grow up and be an example to his younger brother and sister, and especially his own young children.

Please, get with the program, Vance; and get your $hit together, for heaven's sake! Think of your family! They need you!
This is truly heartbreaking! I know there must be an unbelievable amount of pain to deal with...but drugs are not the answer. Poor Steve, how much can one father take?

[Openmind]

When checking the court schedule a couple of days ago, I discovered that an arraignment/pre-trial conference was scheduled for Vance Robert Groene for this morning at 8:30 AM.

I have learned that the charges involve Possession of a Controlled Substance and Possession of Drug Paraphernalia with Intent to Use or Deliver.

I know he is innocent until proven guilty but ...

I am dismayed that the horrific crimes this family has been faced with are not enough to make Vance straighten up and fly right. It's well past time for Vance to grow up and be an example to his younger brother and sister, and especially his own young children.

Please, get with the program, Vance; and get your $hit together, for heaven's sake! Think of your family! They need you!

I guess it is foolish to ask, but these are current charges, correct? I was hoping they might predate the crimes but.... Does he have 2 babies?

So much for one family, isn't it?

[Liz]

This is truly heartbreaking! I know there must be an unbelievable amount of pain to deal with...but drugs are not the answer. Poor Steve, how much can one father take?

I know what you mean, Dragonfly. Back in post #2 of this thread, on 5/25/05, I posted, "His father, Steve Groene, said that Vance is getting his act together now. I hope that is the case."

I had high hopes for Vance; even though when I saw him in videos, I preceived a troubled young man.

I would have hoped that the miracle of getting his little sister returned alive, that maybe that would be his motivation to live a good life, to the fullest.

I realize he has a lot to deal with; but, as you say, drugs are not the answer!

[Liz]

I guess it is foolish to ask, but these are current charges, correct? I was hoping they might predate the crimes but.... Does he have 2 babies?

So much for one family, isn't it?


I don't think it's foolish to ask, Openmind. They are definitely current charges, and the case number lead me to believe that the charges stem from 2006.

Vance has two children. Now I'm wondering if his girlfriend and their children are still together with Vance.

[Socks]

Easy to judge when we are not in his shoes. I'm sure he lives in a mental hell everyday thinking what if...

[Liz]

Easy to judge when we are not in his shoes. I'm sure he lives in a mental hell everyday thinking what if...


In case you mean moi ... I haven't judged him.

[NanaMcZoo]

I think anyone having substance abuse issues when something like this happens to their family, is going to have a damn near impossible time staying clean/sober.
I hope he is motivated to fight for his sobriety and succeeds.

[Socks]

In case you mean moi ... I haven't judged him.
Oh no, Liz..I was just commenting on the fact that many posters here probably think that if they were he, they'd handle it differently. I only say that we cannot know what mental images and tortures he must live with having his mother, two brothers, and step dad murdered in such a heinous way. If anything, I feel sad for him and hope that he can one day be able to deal with the issues in his life drug and crime free...until then, I only can pray.