Embezzlement charges: discussion, etc.

[SouthEastSleuth]

I know I keep harping on this embezzlement business, but for the life of me, I think it all connects together, albeit in some convoluted fashion. I mean come on, do we honestly think that Raven gets caught at work, Janet quits out of humiliation, that at home that night, things are just as normal as can be??? Speculation of course, but, surely Janet has a few JUSTLY warranted words for Raven, even with her humble nature...again, pure speculation. And accordingly, the poor girl quits a job she really enjoys, leave people she enjoys, and has to start from scratch looking for a new job...all the while, with a young baby at home. Who's fault is this? Raven's, pure and simple. I know if I were in that situation I would have been FURIOUS. But, that's me. So over those next couple of months, it's Janet who finds a real job. And Janet that starts working. No doubt there were bills to be paid. Diapers to be bought. Doctors visits to be paid for Kaiden. Car payments. On and on and on. Oh, and of course on top of everything else, they now have Raven's legal issues to deal with... a lawyer has to be hired. There may be fines and other court costs on the horizon. Maybe restitution to Eurosport. Who knows. Again, all speculation for the most part.

So on that dreaded evening, who knows what could have happened. But, I maintain that life on Ferrand Drive was probably not all rosy those months from January to April.

It seems from info we've had posted here that things just may have started to spiral out of control sometime last summer or in the fall...when the embezzlement presumably began. Was Janet's death a culmination of months of financial chaos...instability...turmoil? Hopefully we'll know soon.

But to me, even with the chaotic life Raven led, etc., the ultimate whirlwind of events, starting last summer through December 2004, the period of the Eurosport embezzling, was the beginning of the end... once he was caught, he says he was trying to get his life together. Maybe he was. Who knows. But, in the short term, the bills were still due....mouths still needed to be fed.... And selling of assets can sometimes not be a quick fix...it often takes time and patience.

I still find it hard to believe that Raven acted alone with regard to the embezzlement. It is speculation, purely, but I believe he had help - a family member or members or maybe a friend. But someone.

Ok, so I vented and rambled on, somewhat incoherently I think. But, Janet's murder and the embezzlement are linked, I'm convinced of it. I don't mean to imply a DIRECT connection, but more so a connection as far as state of mind, family life, emotional state of being, financial stability, etc.

Ok, off the soapbox for now.

And if you're reading this: I'm looking for you Mr. or Mrs Embezzling Accomplice(s).... and if I don't find you before, maybe I'll hear more about you in Orange County District Court on the afternoon of Friday, June 10. 2005!

[golfmom]

And if you're reading this: I'm looking for you Mr. or Mrs Embezzling Accomplice(s).... and if I don't find you before, maybe I'll hear more about you in Orange County District Court on the afternoon of Friday, June 10. 2005!
:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

SES that was a very powerful post.

Janet had to face daily public humilation of Raven's illegal actions; she had to leave the one job that she loved; they were practically homeless; late on all their bills; and how much you want to bet the infidelity did NOT stop after they reconciled. How many lies from Raven was it until Janet finally said ENOUGH!

So, what did she tell her friends from work that made them so worried for her safety?

[golfmom]

La Liga de Raleigh
Jesus Duarte
Samual Peters

[ewwwinteresting]

And if you're reading this: I'm looking for you Mr. or Mrs Embezzling Accomplice(s).... and if I don't find you before, maybe I'll hear more about you in Orange County District Court on the afternoon of Friday, June 10. 2005!
SES: You are going to the hearing, yes???

[Jesstexas]

He may have told her that the charges were false - that he had done nothing wrong and someone at Eurosport had it out for him and used trumped up embezzlement charges just to get rid of him. Who knows whether she'd believe him at that point though.

I highly doubt he just up and confessed to Janet. He had a persona to fulfill to the world, even to Janet.

[Maybe So]

He may have told her that the charges were false - that he had done nothing wrong and someone at Eurosport had it out for him and used trumped up embezzlement charges just to get rid of him. Who knows whether she'd believe him at that point though.

I highly doubt he just up and confessed to Janet. He had a persona to fulfill to the world, even to Janet.

I agree that what you say is very possible I think it likely that at first Raven tried to convince Janet that he hadn't done anything, was set up, was framed, or it was all a mistake. After a few months she began to put it all together and knew he was lying? This would certainly have led to some fights if it happened in my house.

Some other thoughts on the imbezzlement. Could someone have been mad enough at Raven over the embezzlement to set up a hit on him and Janet got killed instead because Raven wasn't home, or maybe someone thought she was in on the imbezzlement and wanted to have them both killed? After all he embezzled thousands of dollars worth right? That had to hurt someone's pocket.

One other thought. There was a poster here who seemed very sure that it was a robbery gone bad....well, what if it was something like that???... What if Raven set up a faked robbery to fraudulently collect insurance money and
Janet being killed wasn't part of the plan but the plan went bad and the robber panicked? Perhaps they didn't expect Janet to be there or ????

Just random thoughts.

[newkid]

One other thought. There was a poster here who seemed very sure that it was a robbery gone bad....well, what if it was something like that???... What if Raven set up a faked robbery to fraudulently collect insurance money and
Janet being killed wasn't part of the plan but the plan went bad and the robber panicked? Perhaps they didn't expect Janet to be there or ????

Maybe Janet and Kaiden were supposed to go to the "soccer game". But, how much would renters insurance really pay. I remember having renters insurance and at least our policy wouldn't have been a way to make money.

[Maybe So]

Maybe Janet and Kaiden were supposed to go to the "soccer game". But, how much would renters insurance really pay. I remember having renters insurance and at least our policy wouldn't have been a way to make money.

Maybe they were supposed to also steal a vehicle or something insured separately? Just a thought, though probably not likely.

[Rooster]

Some other thoughts on the imbezzlement. Could someone have been mad enough at Raven over the embezzlement to set up a hit on him and Janet got killed instead because Raven wasn't home, or maybe someone thought she was in on the imbezzlement and wanted to have them both killed? After all he embezzled thousands of dollars worth right? That had to hurt someone's pocket.

I think this is a very good possiblity. There were people at Eurosport who could have been mad at him.

[golfmom]

I think this is a very good possiblity. There were people at Eurosport who could have been mad at him.

You bring up an interesting possibility here, I did hear that a lot of people were very resentful that Raven was hired directly into management. This was a company that was known for hiring within first and turns around and brings in basically a *snot-nosed* kid into a managerial position.

[JerseyGirl]

Some other thoughts on the imbezzlement. Could someone have been mad enough at Raven over the embezzlement to set up a hit on him and Janet got killed instead because Raven wasn't home, or maybe someone thought she was in on the imbezzlement and wanted to have them both killed? After all he embezzled thousands of dollars worth right? That had to hurt someone's pocket.My problem with this theory is that Raven allegedly embezzled "only" $9,000. In most cases, wouldn't it cost more than that to put out a hit?

[NCBanker]

Hey GM. How do we know he was hired directly in the management position? I was under the impression that he had started elsewhere and had been promoted...?

You bring up an interesting possibility here, I did hear that a lot of people were very resentful that Raven was hired directly into management. This was a company that was known for hiring within first and turns around and brings in basically a *snot-nosed* kid into a managerial position.

[golfmom]

Hey GM. How do we know he was hired directly in the management position? I was under the impression that he had started elsewhere and had been promoted...?

Reeaaalllyyyy ? ? ? :waitasec:
Maybe I misunderstood what was being told to me ....
Maybe he was promoted over people who thought they were more qualified?

[SouthEastSleuth]

Reeaaalllyyyy ? ? ? :waitasec:
Maybe I misunderstood what was being told to me ....
Maybe he was promoted over people who thought they were more qualified?
No, I heard the exact same thing. That he was hired directly into management, to be precise, to head up one of two Team Sales groups at Eurosport. Janet was hired initially to work in the order department (taking phone orders, etc.) but then later moved into the accounting department.

[golfmom]

No, I heard the exact same thing. That he was hired directly into management, to be precise, to head up one of two Team Sales groups at Eurosport. Janet was hired initially to work in the order department (taking phone orders, etc.) but then later moved into the accounting department.

I heard that Janet temp'd / filled in over at accounting and when the position opened they liked her so much that it was a given that she'd get that job. It had nothing to do with Raven.

[ewwwinteresting]

I heard that Janet temp'd / filled in over at accounting and when the position opened they liked her so much that it was a given that she'd get that job. It had nothing to do with Raven.
Working with soccer gear......sounded like Janet's dream job! How she must have felt to have to resign from it.:(

[JerseyGirl]

Working with soccer gear......sounded like Janet's dream job! How she must have felt to have to resign from it.:(Was she still into soccer? It seems as if Raven may have been playing regularly but I got the impression that Janet was just enjoying being a Mommy. I wonder if she would have preferred to be a stay-at-home Mom. Raven said that it hurt her to have to be away from Kaiden upon starting her new job. Of course, he could have gone to get one so that she could be with her son. But that's just my opinion.

[golfmom]

Was she still into soccer? It seems as if Raven may have been playing regularly but I got the impression that Janet was just enjoying being a Mommy. I wonder if she would have preferred to be a stay-at-home Mom. Raven said that it hurt her to have to be away from Kaiden upon starting her new job. Of course, he could have gone to get one so that she could be with her son. But that's just my opinion.

I was told that she still played soccer, just not competitively. I bet that's how come she looked so great, so soon after having Kaiden.

[NCBanker]

Well here's what I was told by a Eurosport employee:

Raven was the manager over the internal sales department (online sales, phone orders, etc.). I couldn't verify where he started in the company.

I WAS told, however, that Raven DID in fact push for Janet to be moved into accounting.


I heard that Janet temp'd / filled in over at accounting and when the position opened they liked her so much that it was a given that she'd get that job. It had nothing to do with Raven.

[JerseyGirl]

Well here's what I was told by a Eurosport employee:

Raven was the manager over the internal sales department (online sales, phone orders, etc.). I couldn't verify where he started in the company.

I WAS told, however, that Raven DID in fact push for Janet to be moved into accounting.Does this mean that both Janet and Raven worked in the orders department, and he pushed for her to be put in accounting? Or was Janet temp'ing in accounting as someone else mentioned, and Raven pushed for them to give her a permanent position?

[SouthEastSleuth]

Does this mean that both Janet and Raven worked in the orders department, and he pushed for her to be put in accounting? Or was Janet temp'ing in accounting as someone else mentioned, and Raven pushed for them to give her a permanent position?
**This is NOT CONFIRMED INFORMATION:**

As I understand it. there is a Team Sales department at Eurosport. They do exactly that, sell to organized teams.

The Team Sales dept is actually split into two groups:

1) one of which deals with large organized programs, ie, college teams, pro teams, etc.

2) The other division deals with soccer clubs, amateur groups, parks & rec type groups, etc. (this sort of group include organizations such as the Hispanic league GM pointed out, La Liga de Raleigh).

Raven was hired directly to manage the second division.

At the same time Raven was hired, Janet was hired as well. She was working in the basic Eurosport order department, or call center as they call it. There, you take primarily phone orders and internet orders.

Later on, Janet was helping out in the accounting department. An opening came up eventually, and Janet moved full-time to accounting.

Both were in these same positions as the time Raven was terminated.

Again, NOT CONFIRMED INFORMATION...NOT VERIFIED INFORMATION...

[JerseyGirl]

Okay, so it's not that they were working side-by-side, and Raven pushed to get her into a different department, (in other words, somewhere away from where he was working).

[SouthEastSleuth]

Okay, so it's not that they were working side-by-side, and Raven pushed to get her into a different department, (in other words, somewhere away from where he was working).
As I understand it Jersey, and I'll say once again, this is NOT CONFIRMED information, they never worked "together" at Eurosport, as in the same department.

[JerseyGirl]

Thanks a million, SES. :)

[golfmom]

Apparently Raven wasn't embezzling cash but goods, making up dummy orders, sometimes using his mother's name and address.

http://www.planethuff.com/darkside/archives/000775.html

WOW! Misterallgood were you able to confirm this information. Is it green or red?

Information is CONFIRMED!

[misterallgood]

Apparently Raven wasn't embezzling cash but goods, making up dummy orders, sometimes using his mother's name and address.

http://www.planethuff.com/darkside/archives/000775.html

WOW! Misterallgood were you able to confirm this information. Is it green or red? Confirmed. Not sure about the green or red. I did mention orange, though, as you noted. *edited to add -- Sorry, I did miss that one. Thanks for the heads up.

Mr. A.

[golfmom]

Confirmed. Not sure about the green or red. I did mention orange, though, as you noted.

Mr. A.

Did you miss the new system if we have CONFIRMED information it is green, UNCONFIRMED is red. That way when we discuss the facts versus rumors we can keep track of our info. Also anything red we need to check to verify.
:dance:

[SouthEastSleuth]

Ah, so his mom, Karyn Bolton as I recall, is the "missing" accomplice we speculated on, perhaps? Interesting. So one can't help wondering what THAT means in terms of the embezzlement investigation....

[golfmom]

Ah, so his mom, Karyn Bolton as I recall, is the "missing" accomplice we speculated on, perhaps? Interesting. So one can't help wondering what THAT means in terms of the embezzlement investigation....

However, she could have been an unknowing accomplice as well.

[JerseyGirl]

Ah, so his mom, Karyn Bolton as I recall, is the "missing" accomplice we speculated on, perhaps? Interesting. So one can't help wondering what THAT means in terms of the embezzlement investigation....And in terms of the trust fund in Utah.

[ewwwinteresting]

:laugh: And in terms of the trust fund in Utah.
Scary, isn't it?

[golfmom]

:laugh:
Scary, isn't it?

:silenced:

[ewwwinteresting]

Ah, so his mom, Karyn Bolton as I recall, is the "missing" accomplice we speculated on, perhaps? Interesting. So one can't help wondering what THAT means in terms of the embezzlement investigation....
Uhhh, IF she is involved, puts a whole different light on his childhood, doesn't it?

[misterallgood]

Uhhh, IF she is involved, puts a whole different light on his childhood, doesn't it?
I've heard unconfirmed stuff about his Moms right N' left, but nothing that I think is pertinent to this, or to be honest, the embezzling, at the moment.

I'm usually of the mind to try and leave the potential or actual POI's family alone in these circumstances. If an accused criminal was raised in a certain milieu, we can always discuss it after the accusations are official or there's a verdict. In this instance I don't think we can necessarily assume his Mom or step-Dad had any idea what he was doing.

If I find something in the press that says otherwise, I'll change my mind about that. Having been a relative to a few criminals I'm always wary of indicting the whole family -- not that anyone here is doing that, just trying to underline where I'm coming from, subjectively speaking.

Mr. A.

[golfmom]

I've heard unconfirmed stuff about his Moms right N' left, but nothing that I think is pertinent to this, or to be honest, the embezzling, at the moment.
Mr. A.


Whether his family knew or not, RAVEN knew and involved them. That says something to me.

[misterallgood]

Whether his family knew or not, RAVEN knew and involved them. That says something to me.
Oh, I don't disagree.

Mr. A.

[ewwwinteresting]

Oh, I don't disagree.

Mr. A.Mr. A:

If his mother's name and address were used, is it assumed that the product(s) were shipped there? And if it was, if his mother didn't receive it, someone living in the house did, right?

BTW: GREAT FIND!

[newkid]

I agree with leaving his family alone. I have confirmed information regarding his mother and step-father, but nothing provoking or relevant to Raven's current legal trouble or the murder of his wife. I have a couple of shady relatives myself and certainly wouldn't want to be judged by their actions.

[newkid]

If his mother's name and address were used, is it assumed that the product(s) were shipped there? And if it was, if his mother didn't receive it, someone living in the house did, right?

Still, who knows what Raven told his mother or whoever was receiving the products? He may have told them it was items he purchased and had to ship to them for tax reasons or because the items ultimate destination was closer to his parents house than NC.

[newkid]

Whether his family knew or not, RAVEN knew and involved them. That says something to me.
Yes, I think that was slimey on his part.

[ewwwinteresting]

I have a couple of shady relatives myself and certainly wouldn't want to be judged by their actions.
Who doesn't?

However, if any of the family members are involved someway with the embezzlement and we will have to wait to see if that is confirmed or not, then, as some other poster previously said, the white gloves come off. I was wondering if the two posters that voted for a family member on the Who killed Janet Abaroa poll knows something and wants to share?

[munch]

**This is NOT CONFIRMED INFORMATION:**

As I understand it. there is a Team Sales department at Eurosport. They do exactly that, sell to organized teams.

The Team Sales dept is actually split into two groups:

1) one of which deals with large organized programs, ie, college teams, pro teams, etc.

2) The other division deals with soccer clubs, amateur groups, parks & rec type groups, etc. (this sort of group include organizations such as the Hispanic league GM pointed out, La Liga de Raleigh).

Raven was hired directly to manage the second division.

At the same time Raven was hired, Janet was hired as well. She was working in the basic Eurosport order department, or call center as they call it. There, you take primarily phone orders and internet orders.

Later on, Janet was helping out in the accounting department. An opening came up eventually, and Janet moved full-time to accounting.

Both were in these same positions as the time Raven was terminated.

Again, NOT CONFIRMED INFORMATION...NOT VERIFIED INFORMATION...
SES has it pretty much right. Janet and Raven never worked in the same department. She worked in the regular call center, then part-time in accounting, then full-time in accounting. Raven managed the inbound sales group that worked with individual teams that called in, not large clubs, colleges or high schools.

[JerseyGirl]

Munch, you're an angel. Thanks so much for registering to share what you know with us. We've been banging our heads repeatedly over some of these issues so your presence here is truly invaluable. Thanks again from the bottom of my heart.

[ewwwinteresting]

SES has it pretty much right. Janet and Raven never worked in the same department. She worked in the regular call center, then part-time in accounting, then full-time in accounting. Raven managed the inbound sales group that worked with individual teams that called in, not large clubs, colleges or high schools.
Munch: Do you know of anyone at Raven's former employment or anyone he fired, in your opinion, that was truly angry with Raven.....enough to murder?

[golfmom]

Munch: Do you know of anyone at Raven's former employment or anyone he fired, in your opinion, that was truly angry with Raven.....enough to murder?

UNCONFIRMED. I was told that over a year had passed since Raven had fired anyone before he was fired. JMHO, but if that is true, it would have been a very long time for someone to hold a grudge.

[SouthEastSleuth]

I have some additional information regarding Raven's court hearing.

The court calendars for Friday were released, and Raven's five charges are clearly on the docket.

177 05CR 050503 ABAROA,RAVEN FOSTER,D HPD
BOND: WPA
(F)EMBEZZLEMENT PLEA: VER:
CLS:H P: L: JUDGMENT:

178 05CR 050504 ABAROA,RAVEN FOSTER,D HPD
BOND: $1 WPA
(F)EMBEZZLEMENT PLEA: VER:
CLS:H P: L: JUDGMENT:

179 05CR 050505 ABAROA,RAVEN FOSTER,D HPD
BOND: $1 WPA
(F)EMBEZZLEMENT PLEA: VER:
CLS:H P: L: JUDGMENT:

180 05CR 050506 ABAROA,RAVEN FOSTER,D HPD
BOND: $1 WPA
(F)EMBEZZLEMENT PLEA: VER:
CLS:H P: L: JUDGMENT:

181 05CR 050507 ABAROA,RAVEN FOSTER,D HPD
BOND: $1 WPA
(F)EMBEZZLEMENT PLEA: VER:
CLS:H P: L: JUDGMENT:



I was a little confused over some of the notations, and searched forever trying to find some explanations, finally gave up, and just called the Clerk of Court's Office for Orange County. The kind woman there provided me the following info:

- D. Foster is the complainant, and HPD is the Hillsborough Police Dept.

- $1 WPA is just an internal note that designated no actual bond was paid. The WPA stands for "written promise to appear."

- (F)EMBEZZLEMENT - felony, embezzlement

- "H" is the type of felony classification


She told me that TYPICALLY if the case is noted "WPA," then the defendant does indeed HAVE to appear in court.

What I'm not exactly clear on is what is supposed to transpire. If in fact Raven has "confessed", perhaps this is the formality of a plea of guilty in court?

Also, as I understand it from asking some local lawyers, an appearance in District Court (which is what's scheduled here) for a FELONY, is usually just to bind a defendant over to SUPERIOR COURT, which handles ALL felonies in NC.

Confusing stuff, I know.

So, it will interesting to see what, if anything happens on Friday with all of this. As has been pointed out, it could very well end up being a closed meeting with his attorney and the ADA! But, who knows....

The details:

Orange County, District Court Division
Criminal Court
Hillsborough, NC

Firday, June 10, 2005

Courtroom #2
Afternoon Session, begins at 2:00PM

407 (YIKES!) cases on the docket (although, I'm told that many are not even dealt with, or, take like 30 seconds). And Raven's cases are #177-181.

It is my INTENT to go over to Hillsborough for the hearing. I'm having a little trouble clearing my schedule right now...but, hopefully. If there is anyone else relatively local that is planning on going, or, would go, that'd be great too!


The calendar link: (FYI, these links do NOT stay active for very long)

http://www1.aoc.state.nc.us/www/data/ORANGE/calendar/DISTRICT.DISTRICT_CRIMINAL_FELONY_.06.10.05.PM.000 2.CAL.txt

[cappuccina]

...I hope that you are able to attend...

[JerseyGirl]

SES, thanks for the research! Any chance of you hiding behind poles to snap some photos of Raven on his way in and out? :crazy:

[golfmom]

It's been a long time waiting, but I received this reply to an inquiry I made regarding the upcoming court date:

I'm so sorry it's taken me so long to reply. I've been swamped lately. I check with the district attorney and he told me this case has NOT been resolved. There is actually a hearing set for this Friday regarding the case, although I don't think Raven Abaroa has to be there- just his attorney.


Again- sorry for the delay!

Julia Lewis

ReporterWRAL-TV5

[newkid]

Nice work SES. I'm interested to find out what transpires.

[ewwwinteresting]

I have some additional information regarding Raven's court hearing.

The court calendars for Friday were released, and Raven's five charges are clearly on the docket.

She told me that TYPICALLY if the case is noted "WPA," then the defendant does indeed HAVE to appear in court.This would be my understanding too. Why the media suggested he didn't have to be there is interesting. But the media has been wrong before, haven't they??:crazy:

Thanks for going SES....wish I could join you!

[golfmom]

This would be my understanding too. Why the media suggested he didn't have to be there is interesting. But the media has been wrong before, haven't they??:crazy:

Thanks for going SES....wish I could join you!

Just a thought, but do you think that the media is being told this information so that they will NOT show up? :waitasec:

[anneshirley]

Just a thought, but do you think that the media is being told this information so that they will NOT show up? :waitasec:
That might make sense. It seems like that would take a lot of effort, though, to mislead the media like that. (or am I just being naive?)

[golfmom]

That might make sense. It seems like that would take a lot of effort, though, to mislead the media like that. (or am I just being naive?)

Heck again I don't know and it was just a thought. If the media is being mislead, someone is doing a great job of doing so. Especially in light of the next-to-nothing coverage we've seen to date.

But, if LE didn't want reporters at the scheduled court date, all they need to say is ... we don't expect him to be there.

[anneshirley]

Heck again I don't know and it was just a thought. If the media is being mislead, someone is doing a great job of doing so. Especially in light of the next-to-nothing coverage we've seen to date.

But, if LE didn't want reporters at the scheduled court date, all they need to say is ... we don't expect him to be there.
You're right. I wouldn't be surprised if LE was behind all of the silence (from reporters, raven and janet's family...). I wonder why....hmmm.
and here we go...full circle.
It's an interesting theory, GM. I'm sure there's validity to it!

[newkid]

You're right. I wouldn't be surprised if LE was behind all of the silence (from reporters, raven and janet's family...). I wonder why....hmmm.
and here we go...full circle.
It's an interesting theory, GM. I'm sure there's validity to it!
Yeah, but I'm impatient!:crazy:

[anneshirley]

Yeah, but I'm impatient!:crazy:
Welcome to our world! It's insane, isn't it? :banghead:

[Jesstexas]

Just a thought, but do you think that the media is being told this information so that they will NOT show up? :waitasec:
You know . . . it had crossed my mind that LE may not have released much info on this case to the press cuz they KNOW where a certain person is going to be at a certain time on Friday, June 10th.

SES, have you decided whether you're going to be able to attend the proceedings on Friday yet?

[Timex]

You know . . . it had crossed my mind that LE may not have released much info on this case to the press cuz they KNOW where a certain person is going to be at a certain time on Friday, June 10th.

SES, have you decided whether you're going to be able to attend the proceedings on Friday yet?


There really is no rush for LE in this case. Look at it this way...Raven goes to court for the embezzlement. He will at LEAST get probation and fines, so LE is going to know where Raven is for the next several years. They have all the time in the world to cross their "t's" and dot their "i's".

[cappuccina]

...there is a small innocent boy, Kaiden, involved here who is possibly being cared for by someone who may have murdered his mother...

[Timex]

...there is a small innocent boy, Kaiden, involved here who is possibly being cared for by someone who may have murdered his mother...


Im thinking if law enforcement felt for one minute that Kaiden was in even the slightest bit of danger, they would be removing him from the home. Of course, I cant prove that, I would just find it hard to think they would knowingly allow Raven to harm him.

[ewwwinteresting]

But, if LE didn't want reporters at the scheduled court date, all they need to say is ... we don't expect him to be there.
I would think that covering this story would be VERY news worthy. I mean the media could go to the courthouse on Friday and show Raven walking in or out. IMO, whether anything happens at this particular hearing is irrelevant. The media would have him in person and be able to mention that this is the husband that found his wife's body upstairs in their home the night of April 26th, while their baby was in another room. They could try and get a statement. How can anybody not be interested in covering this story? IMO, what an opportunity for a reporter!

[cappuccina]

...knowing that at the very least there was serious domestic violence and possibly (at least verbal) child abuse in that home...

[Timex]

...knowing that at the very least there was serious domestic violence and possibly (at least verbal) child abuse in that home...

So you feel Durham LE is like california LE? If so, we may be right, this case may never be solved. I was somehow thinking Durham LE was competant.

[Timex]

Does anyone have the statistics on just what percentage of crimes are solved in Durham? That may help us to know if we are dealing with Barney Fife type LE.

[anneshirley]

I would think that covering this story would be VERY news worthy. I mean the media could go to the courthouse on Friday and show Raven walking in or out. IMO, whether anything happens at this particular hearing is irrelevant. The media would have him in person and be able to mention that this is the husband that found his wife's body upstairs in their home the night of April 26th, while their baby was in another room. They could try and get a statement. How can anybody not be interested in covering this story? IMO, what an opportunity for a reporter!
True, but at the same time, I think the media appeal is probably a big reason for LE's silence. you saw all of the negative press that LE got in the OJ case or in similar cases. From what I understand, LE and the media are rarely good friends.

[NCBanker]

I'm not sure on murders, but I know that 99% of all bank robberies in the state of NC are solved. We may not be as dynamic on murders.

Does anyone have the statistics on just what percentage of crimes are solved in Durham? That may help us to know if we are dealing with Barney Fife type LE.

[Timex]

Crime Type 2002 Total Per 100,000 People National per 100,000 People
Overall 14461 7480.03 4118.8
Murders 30 15.52 5.6
Rapes 75 38.79 33.0
Robberies 942 487.25 145.9
Assaults 763 394.67 310.1
Burglaries 3088 1597.29 746.2
Larceny/Thefts 8483 4387.88 2445.8
Vehicle Thefts 1080 558.64 432.1
Durham Arsons 38 19.66 N/A

http://durham.areaconnect.com/crime1.htm

[Timex]

I'm not sure on murders, but I know that 99% of all bank robberies in the state of NC are solved. We may not be as dynamic on murders.


Im looking for specific stats....I know nationwide 40% of murders go unsolved. Will post durham stats if I find them.

[Timex]

Looks like in 2002, 60% of murders in Durham were solved. In 2003, that figured jumped to 93%. It doesnt really give an explanation or breakdown of victims etc.

http://www.durham-nc.com/secondary/SODE2004/slides_files/frame.htm#slide0036.htm

[ewwwinteresting]

True, but at the same time, I think the media appeal is probably a big reason for LE's silence. you saw all of the negative press that LE got in the OJ case or in similar cases. From what I understand, LE and the media are rarely good friends.
I'm not talking about LE saying something.....and WHEN did the media ever care about LE's silence (LE is pretty silent about the missing girl in Aruba, but the media is all over it)......Maybe I didn't word in correctly, but what I was trying to point out, imo, the court hearing on Friday would be a great opportunity for a reporter to put a live body with an ongoing investigation of a murder case......showing Raven going in or out of the court house, asking for a statement, telling the audience what has happened in his life.....whether Raven is guilty of the murder or not, it certainly is a story to be covered, IMO.

[lauriej]

I'm not talking about LE saying something.....and WHEN did the media ever care about LE's silence (LE is pretty silent about the missing girl in Aruba, but the media is all over it)......Maybe I didn't word in correctly, but what I was trying to point out, imo, the court hearing on Friday would be a great opportunity for a reporter to put a live body with an ongoing investigation of a murder case......showing Raven going in or out of the court house, asking for a statement, telling the audience what has happened in his life.....whether Raven is guilty of the murder or not, it certainly is a story to be covered, IMO.
.......i agree completely on this ews...! and it had me thinking back to the email g/m rec'd from the reporter she's been in touch with, when she ( the reporter ) stated, 'there's nothing new'....'once we hear something'.....( not in those words of course .....but similar...)

...why on earth wouldn't that reporter want to be there????? uncover the something NEW herself and get a story going ??? this case has soooooo many elements you'd think a reporter would jump on..........murder.......all-star soccer.....adultry.....embezzlement.....( a soap opera for the media for crying out loud.....)

....g/m.....you've got a rapport going with that reporter.........why not email her AND her editor? no harm in him/her sending this reporter out for the day to the courthouse if they end up with a major scoop.....

[golfmom]

Does anyone have any information on Raven's attorney Julian Mack? Law firm, what he specializes in, etc.?

This is the only one I've found so far:

http://www.buchalter.com/bio/JulianMack.asp

Julian (Pete) Mack
San Francisco, California
Senior Counsel

........

There does appear to be an attorney in NC named Julian Mack as well. One in Florida (district attorney) and one that is a judge somewhere. Who would have thunk there'd be some many people with that name practicing law.

[Timex]

Mack Julian S Attorney At Law
123 West Main Street, Durham, NC 27701
phone: (919) 680-6446
fax: (919) 680-6372
email: jsmacklaw@verizon.net



Practice Areas:
Felonies,Misdemeanor,Dwi,Traffic Offense,White Collar Crime


Appears in the Categories:
Criminal Law Attorneys, Traffic Law Attorneys, Firearm & Gun Law Attorneys, Appeals Attorneys

[SouthEastSleuth]

Just FYI -

With regards to Raven's court date today on the embezzlement charges:

I spoke directly with someone today in the DA's office in Orange County. I told them that we had heard, via a media source, some information regarding today's hearing, and I just wanted to confirm the information.

They told me that Raven is NOT going to appear in court today. That it will be a private meeting with just the attorney, no Raven. They would provide no other information, not that I would think that they would. Accordingly, I'm not going to the hearing today...seems like a waste of time.

[Timex]

Just FYI -

With regards to Raven's court date today on the embezzlement charges:

I spoke directly with someone today in the DA's office in Orange County. I told them that we had heard, via a media source, some information regarding today's hearing, and I just wanted to confirm the information.

They told me that Raven is NOT going to appear in court today. That it will be a private meeting with just the attorney, no Raven. They would provide no other information, not that I would think that they would. Accordingly, I'm not going to the hearing today...seems like a waste of time.

Sounds to me as if a plea is in the works.

[newkid]

They told me that Raven is NOT going to appear in court today. That it will be a private meeting with just the attorney, no Raven. They would provide no other information, not that I would think that they would. Accordingly, I'm not going to the hearing today...seems like a waste of time.
Bummer! I had hoped that somehow more information would be released today.

[golfmom]

Court hearing for embezzlement charges has been moved until July 22nd.

[newkid]

Court hearing for embezzlement charges has been moved until July 22nd.
Thanks! I'm glad you found that, I was just (unsuccessfully) searching through North Carolina's court site.

[golfmom]

Thanks! I'm glad you found that, I was just (unsuccessfully) searching through North Carolina's court site.

I was very surprised and pleased to get the update from a local reporter.

[ewwwinteresting]

I was very surprised and pleased to get the update from a local reporter.
That's because you are da bomb GM!

[juliagoulia]

LaurieJ just posted this on the media links page:

re: embezzlement hearing june 10/2005..
http://www.herald-sun.com/archives/search.html



Herald-Sun, The (Durham, NC)


June 11, 2005
Section: Durham
Edition: Final
Page: E2

Victim's husband to get hearing
Spouse is accused of embezzlement
From staff reports </I></FONT>

While Durham police detectives continue to investigate the April murder of Janet Abaroa, attorneys met Friday to discuss fraud charges her husband is facing in Orange County. Orange County Assistant District Attorney Jacqueline Perez said she met with Julian Mack to discuss details of five counts of embezzlement his client, Raven Abaroa, is facing.

The pair set a hearing for July 22, Perez said.


"Hopefully, by that day I will know whether I will indict him or if we will do some kind of plea," she said. "But there is no offer on the table right now."

[SouthEastSleuth]

LaurieJ just posted this on the media links page:

re: embezzlement hearing june 10/2005..
http://www.herald-sun.com/archives/search.html



Herald-Sun, The (Durham, NC)


June 11, 2005
Section: Durham
Edition: Final
Page: E2

Victim's husband to get hearing
Spouse is accused of embezzlement
From staff reports </I></FONT>

While Durham police detectives continue to investigate the April murder of Janet Abaroa, attorneys met Friday to discuss fraud charges her husband is facing in Orange County. Orange County Assistant District Attorney Jacqueline Perez said she met with Julian Mack to discuss details of five counts of embezzlement his client, Raven Abaroa, is facing.

The pair set a hearing for July 22, Perez said.


"Hopefully, by that day I will know whether I will indict him or if we will do some kind of plea," she said. "But there is no offer on the table right now."

Ok, being no legal expert, I have some questions about this, that maybe someone with more knowledge than me can shed some light on....

IF in fact when Raven was arrested, he confessed to the embezzling (as we've been told) .... procedurally where does that leave things at this point? When the ADA says, "...whether I will indict him or if we will do some kind of plea."... what exactly does that mean?

In meeting with Raven' attorney, would the point have been to start talking about what sort of penalty is involved, (assuming guilt has already been established)?

It would seem to me that if fact that is the ultimate goal of the July 22nd hearing, then Raven would indeed HAVE to be in court that day?

Thoughts anyone?

[juliagoulia]

In meeting with Raven' attorney, would the point have been to start talking about what sort of penalty is involved, (assuming guilt has already been established)?

It would seem to me that if fact that is the ultimate goal of the July 22nd hearing, then Raven would indeed HAVE to be in court that day?

Thoughts anyone?
I spoke with an attorney. These are his thoughts.

A hearing could mean several things:

1. It could be an arraignment, where he is formally charged with the crime (indictment).

2. It could be an intial "probable cause" hearing in one of the NC lower criminal courts. Most of the NC criminal courts have to be reviewed by an initial judge, and then he determines if there is probable cause for the charges to go forward. Now this is only for the felony offenses. The defendant can waive this procedural step. Rarely do the judges find NO probable cause.

3. It could be a preliminary motion's hearing, or a hearing to enter into a plea, and set a trial date

Unless he pleads guilty, I highly doubt that there will be a trial that day. Regardless, he will have to show up at the hearing.

[SouthEastSleuth]

You know, I wonder if there is any link between the delay in the embezzlement proceedings and the ongoing murder investigation? Could very well be two independent issues, with no overlap, but it does make you wonder...

And also, on the embezzlement front, I would assume that those working that case in Orange County have all the information they need to proceed with that case.... but we did in fact dig up a fair amount of info on that front, with regards to eBay especially. Might be worth making sure the Orange County ADA indeed has the specific info that was uncovered here.

It did always strike me as odd, that if the eBay connection had in fact been made, and surely it was, that the eBay account is still up and active (even though the eBay "feedback" info was intentionally hidden by the account owner). Yikes, I'd sure hate to be one of those eBay folks that inadvertantly bought stolen goods!!!

[golfmom]

I'm interested in if the ADA knows that Raven's mother may have been involved .... hmmmm maybe I send her an email letting her know what we've dug up on this end with the embezzlement charges . . .

[ewwwinteresting]

I'm interested in if the ADA knows that Raven's mother may have been involved .... hmmmm maybe I send her an email letting her know what we've dug up on this end with the embezzlement charges . . .
SES and GM.....you are so right. The ADA absolutely needs to know all of the information that has been recovered and the possibility of another person being involved. They may already know this, but they may not. We all have been thanked, at one time or another, by family, friends, media and LE to keep up the good work, keep it coming, thanks for trying to bring justice to this case. It has also been rumored about the low manpower in the LE and DA's office so maybe they haven't had time to really search all of this information out. Who knows, maybe we will uncover additional embezzling with other employers....it's hard for me to believe he just started stealing in July 2004!

[golfmom]

....it's hard for me to believe he just started stealing in July 2004!

I agree! or scamming somehow, I wonder about the mini-coop stories if he torched the car for insurance money? Maybe there's a pattern here.

[ewwwinteresting]

I agree! or scamming somehow, I wonder about the mini-coop stories if he torched the car for insurance money? Maybe there's a pattern here.
And I would think a pattern means no deal.......indict and go to trial or if he pleads guilty, throw the book at him!

Just wondering, even if he gets a deal, what employer would hire him?? Could you imagine.....well, I embezzled only $9 from my last employer, but I learned my lesson and I won't steal from you, I promise!

[SouthEastSleuth]

Just as confirmation of information we've heard elsewhere -

a query of the Orange County District Court site does indeed now reflect Raven's new court date for the pending charges for five counts of felony embezzlement:



Friday, July 22, 2005. Courtroom #2, afternoon session (2:00pm)

[ewwwinteresting]

OK, question for y'all.

Having been charged with 5 felony embezzlement charges, who in the hell is going to hire you? We have no evidence that Raven had a job after being fired. He certainly isn't working now. Where is he going to work? I mean what employer is going to hire somebody that stole from his past employer?? I guess maybe fast food or some frivolous job won't do background checks, but any type of job Raven is going to want would. He could lie on his application about working at ES, but I can't imagine ES giving him any type of a decent referral!

[NCBanker]

Well there's always some member of the Church that'll feel sorry for him... As good a talker as he is, he'll con someone into believing it was a huge misunderstanding, or he was doing it to help someone else, etc.

OR, he'll change his name, get a new SS#, etc. It's not hard to reinvent yourself. People do it every day.

OK, question for y'all.

Having been charged with 5 felony embezzlement charges, who in the hell is going to hire you? We have no evidence that Raven had a job after being fired. He certainly isn't working now. Where is he going to work? I mean what employer is going to hire somebody that stole from his past employer?? I guess maybe fast food or some frivolous job won't do background checks, but any type of job Raven is going to want would. He could lie on his application about working at ES, but I can't imagine ES giving him any type of a decent referral!

[L L & S]

Good evening friends.

[ewwwinteresting]

Good evening friends.
Hey LL&S......welcome!

[ewwwinteresting]

Well there's always some member of the Church that'll feel sorry for him... As good a talker as he is, he'll con someone into believing it was a huge misunderstanding, or he was doing it to help someone else, etc.

OR, he'll change his name, get a new SS#, etc. It's not hard to reinvent yourself. People do it every day.
Maybe that is why he went back to Utah to find a church member or family to hire him. I can tell you, family or friend, if you embezzled, you are not working for me.

[juliagoulia]

Good evening friends.
Thank you for these graphics. :clap:

They will be great attachments to any media contacts, letters to the editor, etc.

[JerseyGirl]

Since Raven is only charged, does it show up when someone does a check? Can it be held against him if he hasn't been convicted (yet)?

[NCBanker]

No. He hasn't been convicted yet, so it wouldn't show up.

Since Raven is only charged, does it show up when someone does a check? Can it be held against him if he hasn't been convicted (yet)?

[LTUlegal]

Well there's always some member of the Church that'll feel sorry for him... As good a talker as he is, he'll con someone into believing it was a huge misunderstanding, or he was doing it to help someone else, etc.

OR, he'll change his name, get a new SS#, etc. It's not hard to reinvent yourself. People do it every day.
And, according to Raven's blog, he's done it several times throughout his life.

[ewwwinteresting]

No. He hasn't been convicted yet, so it wouldn't show up.
But wouldn't the charge show up? It is public knowledge and I would assume be in a database when doing a background check??

[snapple]

But wouldn't the charge show up? It is public knowledge and I would assume be in a database when doing a background check??
It is my understanding that the charges would not show up, basically because you are innocent until proven guilty. It's too bad for employers though, because some employer will be hiring an embezzler.

[Tammie63]

Charges wont show up on a felony charge until fingerprints are sent in to the National database, haven't worked in Law Enforcement in a long while but I think that is NCIC for felonies offenses. I know a lot of the smaller counties don't send in the prints until they can also put the conviction on the card.

A future employer can do a criminal background search in which they call all the local law enforcement agencies (police, sheriffs dept) where the applicant has lived and ask if the applicant has an arrest history in that city or county but they can only go by what the applicant has listed as his past city/county of residence.

[ewwwinteresting]

Charges wont show up on a felony charge until fingerprints are sent in to the National database, haven't worked in Law Enforcement in a long while but I think that is NCIC for felonies offenses. I know a lot of the smaller counties don't send in the prints until they can also put the conviction on the card.

A future employer can do a criminal background search in which they call all the local law enforcement agencies (police, sheriffs dept) where the applicant has lived and ask if the applicant has an arrest history in that city or county but they can only go by what the applicant has listed as his past city/county of residence.
Thanks for the info Tammie. So if the applicant "skips" a certain place where he worked or lived, the employer would not know to look in that county, correct? Hmmmmm.....I could see Raven skipping the entire embezzlement job and murder address on his applications and no one would be the wiser.

In your backgound of LE, does it usually take 2 or more months before you arrest a suspect? and if they had a lot of evidence against someone in particular, would they still wait for test results to return before making the arrest? Just curious!

[Tammie63]

Its been a while since I worked in LE so I am by no means an expert Plus I am only familiar with Texas law.
I do know that NO D.A. is going to give the ok to arrest unless he feels that he has a STRONG case. That being said I don't see an arrest being made until all test/evidence are in order specially now days with the all the scientific means they have...30 years ago... probably someone would be sitting in jail by now.

[lauriej]

Charges wont show up on a felony charge until fingerprints are sent in to the National database, haven't worked in Law Enforcement in a long while but I think that is NCIC for felonies offenses. I know a lot of the smaller counties don't send in the prints until they can also put the conviction on the card.

A future employer can do a criminal background search in which they call all the local law enforcement agencies (police, sheriffs dept) where the applicant has lived and ask if the applicant has an arrest history in that city or county but they can only go by what the applicant has listed as his past city/county of residence.
...isn't there an area /line on a job application asking " have you ever been arrested ?" or is it, "have you ever been convicted ?"

..a friend of mine ( in the u.s. ) was recently job hunting, and she had to go herself to the police dept. and have a criminal records search done...
...if raven had to do so, would anything show up at this time, the charge of embezzlement itself ?

...in addition to the employer calling LE...i wonder if they do their own online 'zaba search' etc. of prospective applicants ?

[ewwwinteresting]

...isn't there an area /line on a job application asking " have you ever been arrested ?" or is it, "have you ever been convicted ?"

..a friend of mine ( in the u.s. ) was recently job hunting, and she had to go herself to the police dept. and have a criminal records search done...
...if raven had to do so, would anything show up at this time, the charge of embezzlement itself ?

...in addition to the employer calling LE...i wonder if they do their own online 'zaba search' etc. of prospective applicants ?
Could you imagine being a prospective employer that searches Raven's name on the internet? Wonder what they would think?

[Jenifred]

...isn't there an area /line on a job application asking " have you ever been arrested ?" or is it, "have you ever been convicted ?"
I think that it's convicted. So, he's got until at least July 22nd to slip by on that question.

[juliagoulia]

In reference to this post: http://websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=708099&postcount=41

You mentioned that one of Raven's co-workers at HP was involved in product embezzelment. Is it possible they were working as a team? Do you know if Raven was still in touch with him while he worked at EuroSport?

[SouthEastSleuth]

Ok, here is what I know about Raven. I only met him through mutual friends, and we only hung out for a night. He was very charming and we all had lots of fun. I really liked him. He stayed in touch with my friend and even set them up with one of his friends. He used to work for HP before going to Eurosport so he is definitely computer savvy. Anyway, I would imagine it to be very difficult to sale computers and equipment if he wasn’t. It’s rumored that another one of his friends who also use to worked at HP was let go for suspicion of embezzlement and it was the same type of thing……..taking equipment and turning a personal profit. However if it is true, maybe Raven knew about it and knew that he was never arrested so he thought that he could get away with it. Who knows what Raven was thinking? I remember when he got the job with Eurosport and how excited he was to be working in the soccer industry.

Yes, I agree with juliagoulia, this is an intriguing bit of information... Do you know ItsMe, anything more about the HP alleged embezzlement? So it's your understanding that there were never any charges brought against the employee?

Perhaps you're right, even if Raven himself had no involvement, it may have provided the "scheme," if you will, that he later used at Eurosport??

[NCBanker]

Someone mentioned this fact earlier in one of the other threads here. Whoever mentioned this before said they didn't believe Raven had been involved in the scam at HP; at least he wasn't caught, if he was involved.

Yes, I agree with juliagoulia, this is an intriguing bit of information... Do you know ItsMe, anything more about the HP alleged embezzlement? So it's your understanding that there were never any charges brought against the employee?

Perhaps you're right, even if Raven himself had no involvement, it may have provided the "scheme," if you will, that he later used at Eurosport??

[ewwwinteresting]

Someone mentioned this fact earlier in one of the other threads here. Whoever mentioned this before said they didn't believe Raven had been involved in the scam at HP; at least he wasn't caught, if he was involved.
I don't remember the HP embezzlement story on this forum:waitasec: . I think this would definitely want to be checked out by the current DA on the ES embezzlement case to make sure Raven wasn't involved.

[juliagoulia]

I think the HP connection is important. If Raven was involved but didn't get caught, that would give him the courage to try it again. If he was only aware of the embezzelment at HP and not involved, then trying it after someone was caught is patently idiotic.

Then again, Raven is very arrogant. Perhaps the other co-worker gave him the idea and Raven thought, "I am smart enough to get away with it."

However, if the two were partners in crime, that produces another POI. It would be someone that could possibly have a grudge against Raven... All speculation of course!

Anyone out there know the name of the fired HP co-worker?

[ewwwinteresting]

I think the HP connection is important. If Raven was involved but didn't get caught, that would give him the courage to try it again. If he was only aware of the embezzelment at HP and not involved, then trying it after someone was caught is patently idiotic.

Then again, Raven is very arrogant. Perhaps the other co-worker gave him the idea and Raven thought, "I am smart enough to get away with it."

However, if the two were partners in crime, that produces another POI. It would be someone that could possibly have a grudge against Raven... All speculation of course!

Anyone out there know the name of the fired HP co-worker?
I agree. If Raven was involved, this ES embezzlement charge would not be the first time he embezzled and I would think, multiple embezzler.....tougher sentence.

[lauriej]

...found the discussion that was happening re "HP ", back on the discussion #4 thread...

...(at that time, we didn't have the info that anyone had been fired for embezzling from HP...it would be interesting to know those details, how the 2 embezzlement schemes matched up , was raven's just a "new and improved" version of the HP employees attempt?)

newkid
I have a teeny bit of infomation that isn't exactly new, just reaffirms other things you guys have already found.

When my husband worked with Raven, Raven owed the company money for unauthorized expenses and never paid. It wasn't a large amount, less than $50, but he still never paid it back. Also similar things happened at the company as far as people selling company property on ebay for personal profit, but my husband doesn't think Raven was involved.

newkid
The stuff being sold on ebay was computer equipment, and new stuff at that. This was back in Raven's HP days.

forgot to add that my husband doesn't think Raven was involved in ebaying the HP stuff.

golfmom
THAT is exactly what I heard. They have an annual "yard sale" where they sell all sorts of discontinued items, overstock, etc. And people can buy whatever (even the public is invited, although I THINK it's open initially to employees only)....and often, people would buy "stuff" and then resell on eBay. In truth, I don't think there's any crime or misdoing in this whatsoever...as long as the employee purchased and PAID for the items, then it would seem to be theirs, to do then whatever they chose...

I didn't mean to imply there was anything wrong with the employees doing this. It's actually pretty smart. If I worked there, I'd be saving my pennies all year to do that!

[ewwwinteresting]

...found the discussion that was happening re "HP ", back on the discussion #4 thread...

...(at that time, we didn't have the info that anyone had been fired for embezzling from HP...it would be interesting to know those details, how the 2 embezzlement schemes matched up , was raven's just a "new and improved" version of the HP employees attempt?)

newkid
I have a teeny bit of infomation that isn't exactly new, just reaffirms other things you guys have already found.

When my husband worked with Raven, Raven owed the company money for unauthorized expenses and never paid. It wasn't a large amount, less than $50, but he still never paid it back. Also similar things happened at the company as far as people selling company property on ebay for personal profit, but my husband doesn't think Raven was involved.

newkid
The stuff being sold on ebay was computer equipment, and new stuff at that. This was back in Raven's HP days.

forgot to add that my husband doesn't think Raven was involved in ebaying the HP stuff.

golfmom
THAT is exactly what I heard. They have an annual "yard sale" where they sell all sorts of discontinued items, overstock, etc. And people can buy whatever (even the public is invited, although I THINK it's open initially to employees only)....and often, people would buy "stuff" and then resell on eBay. In truth, I don't think there's any crime or misdoing in this whatsoever...as long as the employee purchased and PAID for the items, then it would seem to be theirs, to do then whatever they chose...

I didn't mean to imply there was anything wrong with the employees doing this. It's actually pretty smart. If I worked there, I'd be saving my pennies all year to do that!
Thanks for finding that lauriej. When I first read it (seems like years ago), I thought newkid was talking about a job in Utah. I didn't connect it with working at HP (more recent). And for some reason I thought GM was talking about Eurosport having an annual "yard sale"....I guess I was totally out of it when I was reading that part:doh:

[JerseyGirl]

And for some reason I thought GM was talking about Eurosport having an annual "yard sale"....I guess I was totally out of it when I was reading that part:doh:I thought this too. I'm still not convinced which she meant for sure. GM, if you read this, did you mean that HP or ES have an annual "yard sale"?

[SouthEastSleuth]

I thought this too. I'm still not convinced which she meant for sure. GM, if you read this, did you mean that HP or ES have an annual "yard sale"?

I actually know this - from what I understand Eurosport has an annual "yard sale," where they sell excess stock, discontinued items, damaged items, etc. It's my understanding that employees all work the sell... but they are also allowed to purchase items, etc. (correct me if I'm wrong on this anyone..)

Have no knowledge at all regarding any sort of similar situation, or not, with HP.

[newkid]

MarketStar (the company Raven worked for while he was contracted out to HP) occasionally sells off old equipment to employees. Not at any set time and not like a yard sale, the word just goes out to employees.

What had been happening at MarketStar was that certain individuals were ebaying brand new equipment. They were also buying amex gift checks that were supposed to be used for promotions and giveaways, but were depositing the checks in their own bank accounts. These people were discovered and fired a little after Raven had already left the company I think. They had been at it for quite a while. From what we've heard though, Raven's name never came up. He certainly could have picked up ideas from it, by the time it was over nearly everyone had heard about it.

Sorry about the confusion, people thinking I was referring to a different Utah job. MarketStar is located in Utah, but has people all over the country contracted out to HP.

[SouthEastSleuth]

MarketStar (the company Raven worked for while he was contracted out to HP) occasionally sells off old equipment to employees. Not at any set time and not like a yard sale, the word just goes out to employees.

What had been happening at MarketStar was that certain individuals were ebaying brand new equipment. They were also buying amex gift checks that were supposed to be used for promotions and giveaways, but were depositing the checks in their own bank accounts. These people were discovered and fired a little after Raven had already left the company I think. They had been at it for quite a while. From what we've heard though, Raven's name never came up. He certainly could have picked up ideas from it, by the time it was over nearly everyone had heard about it.

Sorry about the confusion, people thinking I was referring to a different Utah job. MarketStar is located in Utah, but has people all over the country contracted out to HP.

Ah, ok. So this is clear to me now...thanks newkid! (I always enjoy on WS, when we go round and round with some piece of information, and then eventually someone gives us the FACTS... then I can sit back and say, "ok, that makes sense..."!)

As I wrote in another post elsewhere, my thought is that perhaps Raven at least "heard" about the previous scheme at MarketStar, and perhaps when his thoughts turned towards embezzlement at Eurosport he remembered all of that...and maybe did something similar at ES. Who knows, but could be a possibility I suppose.

[lauriej]

..thanks newkid........

...it would seems that i only added to the confusion digging up old posts...sorry about that everyone...
...there was just SO much flying around 2 months ago, i'm never sure what i'm remembering correctly!

...(p.s..how nice to log on a see so many new posts! and posters!)


MarketStar (the company Raven worked for while he was contracted out to HP) occasionally sells off old equipment to employees. Not at any set time and not like a yard sale, the word just goes out to employees.

What had been happening at MarketStar was that certain individuals were ebaying brand new equipment. They were also buying amex gift checks that were supposed to be used for promotions and giveaways, but were depositing the checks in their own bank accounts. These people were discovered and fired a little after Raven had already left the company I think. They had been at it for quite a while. From what we've heard though, Raven's name never came up. He certainly could have picked up ideas from it, by the time it was over nearly everyone had heard about it.

Sorry about the confusion, people thinking I was referring to a different Utah job. MarketStar is located in Utah, but has people all over the country contracted out to HP.

[ewwwinteresting]

..thanks newkid........

...it would seems that i only added to the confusion digging up old posts...sorry about that everyone...
...there was just SO much flying around 2 months ago, i'm never sure what i'm remembering correctly!

...(p.s..how nice to log on a see so many new posts! and posters!)
Yes, newkid that you for the clarification....lauriej was trying to confuse me :):blowkiss:

This is awsome you new posters. Glad to see so many more people interested in finding Justice for Janet. Boo, feel like going to the house, walking through (if it's still for sale) and taking pictures??? I would love to see the crime scene itself. NC did a great job of taking pictures of the outside but was too :chicken: to go in :) LOL!

[SouthEastSleuth]

MarketStar (the company Raven worked for while he was contracted out to HP) occasionally sells off old equipment to employees. Not at any set time and not like a yard sale, the word just goes out to employees.

What had been happening at MarketStar was that certain individuals were ebaying brand new equipment. They were also buying amex gift checks that were supposed to be used for promotions and giveaways, but were depositing the checks in their own bank accounts. These people were discovered and fired a little after Raven had already left the company I think. They had been at it for quite a while. From what we've heard though, Raven's name never came up. He certainly could have picked up ideas from it, by the time it was over nearly everyone had heard about it.

Sorry about the confusion, people thinking I was referring to a different Utah job. MarketStar is located in Utah, but has people all over the country contracted out to HP.

I've been thinking about this MarketStar/HP deal for days now.

It's my understanding that Raven worked for MarketStar as a rep for HP products (while in Fredericksburg, Virginia, but servicing various territories). (While there, one of his customers was the IT company, Monette, in Smithfield, Virginia....)...

I also understand that at some point in time, Raven was still working for MarketStar, but based out of Charlotte, NC.

From what I gather he worked for MarketStar, then at some point, sometime in Fall of 2001, went to work for Monette (there's a post here somewhere with a company newsletter announcing him as a new employee), then ultimately went BACK to work for MarketStar again.

I'm not clear on whether he worked first for MarketStar in Charlotte or in Fredericksburg.... but apparantly WAS employed there at two different times.

My point is -

I wonder about the exact timing of the embezzlement and fraud that went on at MarketStar. The whole scheme of selling new equipment (albeit STOLEN) on eBay is certainly the MO that Raven used at Eurosport it seems...

So at Eurosport, did Raven, while seemingly caught up in a world of Big Boy Toys, large expenses, etc., just decide one day - "you know what, I need money...so I think I'll figure out a way to steal things, then resell them. 100% profit."

Perhaps. But it seems that this scheme was fairly elaborate. Certainly not just going to the shipping department and slipping out the door with a pair of soccer shoes here and there. If in fact the value of the embezzled goods was indeed $9000, that's a good number of those shoes, or whatever, in a fairly short period of time (4-5 months). So it stands to reason that, perhaps:

a) Raven gave the scheme a good deal of thought and planning before starting the actual embezzlement... And keep in mind, as we've been told, the first embezzlement charge is linked to July 2004...Raven was only hired at Eurosport the previous summer (2003)... so, I suppose one could say he had nearly a year to plan and get this scheme up and going...or,

b) He "knew" of this whole scheme from somewhere else. Perhaps knowledge of the MarketStar/HP embezzlement scheme...or,

c) Perhaps he WAS involved in the scheme at MarketStar, on some level, either the first or second time he was employed there.... involved, I suppose, can mean many things - he knew about the scheme, he participated in the scheme but wasn't caught, or perhaps he helped cover up the scheme....

You often read that people who participate in so-called white-collar-crimes have done so throughout their professional careers. Something as simple as taking home a legal pad for personal use, is in fact technically employee theft. And as in the case of many crimes, when a person "gets away" with something once, they are often emboldened to keep at it... Perhaps this speaks to Raven and the embezzlement - one charge in July...not another until September. Maybe "testing" the scheme in July, laid low in August to see how things went, nothing happens, back to "Futbalrguy's Soccer Shop on eBay" in September ( I made that name up...)...

That said, was this just another stop on a pattern in Raven's professional career? Who knows. But that MarketStar business sure has a familiar ring to it - my bet is, Raven had SOME involvement - directly or indirectly - if nothing else, it may have provided information - information used to embezzle at Eurosport...

And that, was the beginning of the end. For Raven, professionally, and perhaps, for Janet, and her life.

[juliagoulia]

Raven's embezzelment trial date is this Friday, July 22nd. Any locals planning to attend?

(Pretty please?!)
:blowkiss:

[golfmom]

I thought this too. I'm still not convinced which she meant for sure. GM, if you read this, did you mean that HP or ES have an annual "yard sale"?

Eurosport!

I think at that time there was an ES post a few posts ahead of the ones listed below that I was responding to.

[ewwwinteresting]

Eurosport!

I think at that time there was an ES post a few posts ahead of the ones listed below that I was responding to.
Thanks for responding to the question...uhhhh 6 weeks later GM :blowkiss:

[golfmom]

Thanks for responding to the question...uhhhh 6 weeks later GM :blowkiss:

LOL

I think that's what I did before too. :D

That's why it was confusing. ;)

[Moxie]

Okay, here is my understanding of what has taken place and what will or could take place in the embezzlement charges Raven is facing.

Raven was discovered to have embezzled money from his employer Eurosport.

Raven was fired, arrested and charged.

Raven's lawyer represented him on June 10th at a hearing to determine if a plea could be made or if the charges would stand.

No plea was made and a hearing was scheduled for July 22nd.

On July 22nd if no plea is made the charges will stand and go to a grand jury for indictment on felony charges.

If the grand jury indicts then this case will go to trial.

So it seems to me, we are looking at a bit more time involved before this case is resolved let alone anything on his wife's murder.

[JerseyGirl]

Eurosport!

I think at that time there was an ES post a few posts ahead of the ones listed below that I was responding to.I couldn't find the original post at the time, I don't think. I don't even remember now! lol. But thanks for clearing it up. :)

[snapple]

Do we think media is going to cover the hearing on Friday? Is emailing and advising/reminding the media in NC about the hearing date something we should do?

[JerseyGirl]

Do we think media is going to cover the hearing on Friday? Is emailing and advising/reminding the media in NC about the hearing date something we should do?I would think that the media should be there. Of course, I'm hoping to see a dramatic arrest at the same time so my opinion may be biased.

[lauriej]

Do we think media is going to cover the hearing on Friday? Is emailing and advising/reminding the media in NC about the hearing date something we should do?
.......i would hope that they have bookmarked the date themselves and were planning on covering the court date.......

...but who knows what has come up for them in the interim........i'm emailing a couple of the 'major media players' just in case............those who have given us the most recent coverage...

news 14:
http://rdu.news14.com/content/contact_us/viewer_center/talk_to_14/

eyewitness news 11 erin o'hearn
http://a.abclocal.go.com/images/wtvd_erin_ohearn04.jpg
E-mail Erin O'Hearn (http://abclocal.go.com/wtvd/bios/email_erin_ohearn.html)

[lauriej]

weird...

...i know i've checked recently and raven waas facing 5 charges on the embezzlement this friday...

...it now shows 4 charges against him on fridays docket............... anyone know why this would be ?

http://www1.aoc.state.nc.us/www/servlet/calendars.Criminal.do?county=670&court=BTH&defendant=abaroa&start=0&navindex=0&submit=Submit+Query

District and Superior Courts of ORANGE County

CourtDefendantDate of
BirthCourt
DateCourt
RoomSessionCase
NumberCitation
Number District ABAROA,RAVEN 10/11/1979 07/22/2005 0002 PM 2005CR050503 (http://www1.aoc.state.nc.us/www/servlet/calendars.Offense.do?submit=submit&case=6702005050503&court=CR&defendant=ABAROA,RAVEN) District ABAROA,RAVEN 10/11/1979 07/22/2005 0002 PM 2005CR050504 (http://www1.aoc.state.nc.us/www/servlet/calendars.Offense.do?submit=submit&case=6702005050504&court=CR&defendant=ABAROA,RAVEN) District ABAROA,RAVEN 10/11/1979 07/22/2005 0002 PM 2005CR050505 (http://www1.aoc.state.nc.us/www/servlet/calendars.Offense.do?submit=submit&case=6702005050505&court=CR&defendant=ABAROA,RAVEN) District ABAROA,RAVEN 10/11/1979 07/22/2005 0002 PM

2005CR050507 (http://www1.aoc.state.nc.us/www/servlet/calendars.Offense.do?submit=submit&case=6702005050507&court=CR&defendant=ABAROA,RAVEN)

[SouthEastSleuth]

weird...

...i know i've checked recently and raven waas facing 5 charges on the embezzlement this friday...

...it now shows 4 charges against him on fridays docket............... anyone know why this would be ?

http://www1.aoc.state.nc.us/www/servlet/calendars.Criminal.do?county=670&court=BTH&defendant=abaroa&start=0&navindex=0&submit=Submit+Query


Interesting. I check those Orange County Court Calendars every single morning, wihout fail, and sometimes again at noon, just to check for updates. Yesterday, all five charges were showing as of noon, for sure.

The only reason I could possibly guess that one is now missing, is that some sort of plea deal has been made between the ADA and Raven and his attorney??? Perhaps some deal that includes dropping one of the charges for some reason?? Just guessing really, but as LJ points out, those 5 charges have been listed as such for months, until now, one day before the actual hearing.

Note: The case number for the "missing" charge is 2005CR050506

[golfmom]

Tomorrow! Tomorrow!
I love ya Tomorrow!
You're always
A day
A way!

[rememberjanet]

From what I can tell, Raven is being charged with four Class H felony counts of Embezzlement (embezzlement of property received by virtue of office or employment, Amount involved less than $100,000). This may be a little premature to even discuss, but how much time in jail would he serve? This is under sentencing statute GS 14-90. From what I can get from these sentencing guidelines, am I correct to think that the presumptive sentence would be 5-6 months minimum, 6-7 maximum for each count? And I think I see that he could do community service if he has a clean record (which I assume he does, but didn’t we hear about him assaulting a soccer official or something?). Just a thought, in case he is convicted or pleads guilty or no contest to these charges tomorrow!

http://www.nccourts.org/Courts/CRS/Councils/spac/Publications/Manual.asp (http://www.nccourts.org/Courts/CRS/Councils/spac/Publications/Manual.asp)

http://www.nccourts.org/Courts/CRS/Councils/spac/Documents/appendix-a-felonyclassification.pdf

http://www.nccourts.org/Courts/CRS/Councils/spac/Documents/trainingandreferencemanual2004.pdf

[golfmom]

Rememberjanet!

Thank you so much for putting that together for us.

:blowkiss:

[ewwwinteresting]

Interesting. I check those Orange County Court Calendars every single morning, wihout fail, and sometimes again at noon, just to check for updates. Yesterday, all five charges were showing as of noon, for sure.

The only reason I could possibly guess that one is now missing, is that some sort of plea deal has been made between the ADA and Raven and his attorney??? Perhaps some deal that includes dropping one of the charges for some reason?? Just guessing really, but as LJ points out, those 5 charges have been listed as such for months, until now, one day before the actual hearing.

Note: The case number for the "missing" charge is 2005CR050506
SES, you didn't call and ask the nice clerk lady what happened to the missing charge? That is so unlike you:blowkiss:

[golfmom]

Everyone's sitting around waiting for an update.

First sleuther to post what happened today in court gets to wear the Sleuther of the Week Crown!

[terminatrixator]

:banghead: waiting with you, very impatiently, might I add.

[ewwwinteresting]

Everyone's sitting around waiting for an update.

First sleuther to post what happened today in court gets to wear the Sleuther of the Week Crown!
Maybe chocolates would be more enticing!:blowkiss:

[golfmom]

Maybe chocolates would be more enticing!:blowkiss:

mmmmmmmm chocolates ....

[terminatrixator]

:banghead::banghead::banghead: Okay - I'm still sitting here banging my head and its starting to hurt. NEWS, I NEED NEWS!

[golfmom]

Word has it that it didn't happen today. No idea why not or what happened ... YET :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

[juliagoulia]

Word has it that it didn't happen today. No idea why not or what happened ... YET :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:
NOOOOOOOOOOOO! :furious:

[golfmom]

http://www.wral.com/news/4760082/detail.html?rss=ral&psp=news

DURHAM, N.C. -- Prosecutors offered the husband of a homicide victim a plea deal on embezzlement charges.

[JerseyGirl]

http://www.wral.com/news/4760082/detail.html?rss=ral&psp=news

DURHAM, N.C. -- Prosecutors offered the husband of a homicide victim a plea deal on embezzlement charges.So Raven gets lucky again? Another situation with minimal consequences? I give up trying to understand. :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

[golfmom]

So Raven gets lucky again? Another situation with minimal consequences? I give up trying to understand. :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

Officials have not said if Abaroa wants the deal.

Maybe it's not a sweet deal; the prosecutor's probably left off an offer for chocolates and the Websleuth Crown.

[JerseyGirl]

Officials have not said if Abaroa wants the deal.


Maybe it's not a sweet deal...I hope not but knowing Raven's luck, I won't believe it's not a sweet deal until I see it!

[golfmom]

http://www.herald-sun.com/durham/4-629294.html

Plea offered in embezzlement case

BY ERIC OLSON : The Herald-Sun
eolson@heraldsun.com
Jul 22, 2005 : 9:56 pm ET

The Orange County District Attorney's Office has offered a plea agreement in the embezzlement charges facing Raven Abaroa, whose wife was murdered in Durham in April.

Should Abaroa accept, the deal would place him on probation and force him to make some $9,000 of restitution to his former employer, Assistant District Attorney Jacqueline Perez said.

"That's just what we talked about," Perez said. "Mr. Abaroa hasn't agreed to anything yet."

Perez said she should know by Aug. 23 whether or not Abaroa would agree to the deal. Otherwise, she would indict Abaroa on five counts of embezzlement and put the case before the Sept. 21 grand jury session, she said.

"Since I don't know if he's going to plead or not, I can't say what's going to happen," she said. "And if he does, it's going to be probation and restitution."

...........

[SouthEastSleuth]

Should Abaroa accept, the deal would place him on probation and force him to make some $9,000 of restitution to his former employer, Assistant District Attorney Jacqueline Perez said.

"That's just what we talked about," Perez said. "Mr. Abaroa hasn't agreed to anything yet."

Perez said she should know by Aug. 23 whether or not Abaroa would agree to the deal. Otherwise, she would indict Abaroa on five counts of embezzlement and put the case before the Sept. 21 grand jury session, she said.

"Since I don't know if he's going to plead or not, I can't say what's going to happen," she said. "And if he does, it's going to be probation and restitution."

...........Not a huge surprise I don't think.

I think it's interesting the article refers to FIVE accounts of embezzlement though, at least as a possible indictment.

"Since I don't know if he's going to plead or not." This is almost amusing to me. It would take some nerve not to take that deal. But, stranger things have happened. And arrogance can certainly get in the way of common sense...

So, no wearing orange today for Raven.

___________________________________

So, Raven, wiping the sweat from your brow this morning buddy? I wouldn't get too excited, just yet. If you murdered Janet, and are ultimately found guilty, somehow I don't think probation would cut it...wearing ORANGE would be a fact, at minimum, and most likely for a long, long time.

So go ahead and breathe that sigh of relief right now - tell yourself life is getting better - pat yourself on the back - enjoy life right now - make big plans - maybe some off-roading or mtn biking is in order to celebrate - maybe have a celebration party with your family....

The clock is ticking and freedom is indeed a precious thing, then again, so is life...

[JerseyGirl]

Should Abaroa accept, the deal would place him on probation and force him to make some $9,000 of restitution to his former employer, Assistant District Attorney Jacqueline Perez said.

"That's just what we talked about," Perez said. "Mr. Abaroa hasn't agreed to anything yet."

Perez said she should know by Aug. 23 whether or not Abaroa would agree to the deal.And he's not jumping on this deal?????

[juliagoulia]

There is the matter of $9000 restitution. He may not be able to take the deal if he can't come up with the money. Somehow, I'm sure he will. I wonder how much the Utah "Memorial" fund has collected...:(

[ewwwinteresting]

There is the matter of $9000 restitution. He may not be able to take the deal if he can't come up with the money. Somehow, I'm sure he will. I wonder how much the Utah "Memorial" fund has collected...:(
For some reason, I am seeing more articles, in mormon papers, in different cities!:sick:

[ewwwinteresting]

http://www.herald-sun.com/durham/4-629294.html

Plea offered in embezzlement case

BY ERIC OLSON : The Herald-Sun
eolson@heraldsun.com
Jul 22, 2005 : 9:56 pm ET

http://www.wral.com/news/4760082/de...ss=ral&psp=news (http://www.wral.com/news/4760082/detail.html?rss=ral&psp=news)

DURHAM, N.C. -- Prosecutors offered the husband of a homicide victim a plea deal on embezzlement charges............
Yeah, two different articles written on this...and one where the reporter went searching for Perez for comments. At least Perez knows there are people watching!

BTW, why would Raven only be responsible for $9,000.00 if the stuff he sold could have been sold at $17,000.00+....and how much did Raven received from selling the stuff? If he sold it for $10,000.00, where is the punishment????? He should have to at least pay for the value of the stolen merchandise AND repay back what he received from selling the merchandise. They are letting him profit from his crime! Oh wait, that seems to be happening with another crime I know of:eek:

[lauriej]

Yeah, two different articles written on this...and one where the reporter went searching for Perez for comments. At least Perez knows there are people watching!

BTW, why would Raven only be responsible for $9,000.00 if the stuff he sold could have been sold at $17,000.00+....and how much did Raven received from selling the stuff? If he sold it for $10,000.00, where is the punishment????? He should have to at least pay for the value of the stolen merchandise AND repay back what he received from selling the merchandise. They are letting him profit from his crime! Oh wait, that seems to be happening with another crime I know of:eek:
..NO kidding..........i cannot believe the plea offered is for raven to only repay the $9000 in goods that he stole in the 1st place.....

.. what kind of idiot DA can't do the math between wholesale embezlement and resale value..?????........especially on ebay...plus the super deluxe soccer shoes he kept for himself...

... and she offers him a plea?!..........."pay back the 9K....( "ummmmmmmmmm, ok, i sold the stuff for 20K, sounds good.....).............pathetic .............i hope voters in NC are paying attention to her .

[lauriej]

.....and now there are, again, 5...(not 4)..........charges against raven listed on the court docket for august 26th......

http://www1.aoc.state.nc.us/www/servlet/calendars.Criminal.do?county=670&court=BTH&defendant=abaroa&start=0&navindex=0

[lauriej]

http://www.wral.com/news/4760082/detail.html?rss=ral&psp=news

DURHAM, N.C. -- Prosecutors offered the husband of a homicide victim a plea deal on embezzlement charges.
...i wish we had the email address of the prosecuter, so we could offer her lame brain our services in calculating the net profit raven made AFTER selling off the $9000 worth of mechandise that he stole..

...i only hope ths isn't the same prosecuter we have on the murder case........

... what did it take ? raven batted his pretty blue eyes at her and begged for mercy as a single parent ?a widower ? ...beyond pathetic..

[Moxie]

.....and now there are, again, 5...(not 4)..........charges against raven listed on the court docket for august 26th......

http://www1.aoc.state.nc.us/www/servlet/calendars.Criminal.do?county=670&court=BTH&defendant=abaroa&start=0&navindex=0
Hi LaurieJ,

So does this mean that Raven has not accepted the plea? Can we tell the date this was posted? It would seem that if Raven had accepted the plea, his upcoming court date on August 26, 2005 would not be listed.

Moxie

[golfmom]

Hi LaurieJ,

So does this mean that Raven has not accepted the plea? Can we tell the date this was posted? It would seem that if Raven had accepted the plea, his upcoming court date on August 26, 2005 would not be listed.

Moxie

Moxie, the date listed on the top of the page is today's date July 30, 2005. Wish we knew if that meant it was updated today (doubtful as it's Saturday). However, It doesn't make much sense to me that they would just have the date you visit the page up on the top. I mean really why put that?

[JerseyGirl]

Hi LaurieJ,

So does this mean that Raven has not accepted the plea? Can we tell the date this was posted? It would seem that if Raven had accepted the plea, his upcoming court date on August 26, 2005 would not be listed.

MoxieI think that that date is scheduled in case Raven decides to take it to court rather than accepting the plea deal. I don't remember the date that was mentioned but one of the articles stated that they will know by [whatever date - could be 8/26] whether or not he's accepting. If he chooses to accept the deal, I imagine that that court date will be used to inform the court of the decision or whatever other housekeeping issues they have with the case.

[JerseyGirl]

There is the matter of $9000 restitution. He may not be able to take the deal if he can't come up with the money.I don't know this for sure, but it's probably safe to assume that Raven will be given a repayment schedule. He will not be required to pay back the $9,000 in one lump sum. So if he decides not to take the deal, it won't be because the courts didn't try to work it out reasonably with him.

[JerseyGirl]

heraldsun.com: Plea offered in embezzlement case (http://www.herald-sun.com/durham/4-629294.html)

... Perez said she should know by Aug. 23 whether or not Abaroa would agree to the deal. Otherwise, she would indict Abaroa on five counts of embezzlement and put the case before the Sept. 21 grand jury session, she said.

__________________________________________________ __________________

So it seems as if the August 26th court date might be to discuss whether or not the plea has been accepted?

[JerseyGirl]

..NO kidding..........i cannot believe the plea offered is for raven to only repay the $9000 in goods that he stole in the 1st place.....

.. what kind of idiot DA can't do the math between wholesale embezlement and resale value..?????........especially on ebay...plus the super deluxe soccer shoes he kept for himself...

... and she offers him a plea?!..........."pay back the 9K....( "ummmmmmmmmm, ok, i sold the stuff for 20K, sounds good.....).............pathetic .............i hope voters in NC are paying attention to her .Let's hope that if LE thinks that Raven is the perp., that all of this is being done in an attempt to make him feel like he's "home free". Once you eliminate stress, that's when a perp. is most likely to slip up. And IMO, if he killed Janet, he will slip up eventually. And considering the rules of 'double jeopardy', we don't want him in court before then unless there's enough evidence to convict him.

[Moxie]

Let's hope that if LE thinks that Raven is the perp., that all of this is being done in an attempt to make him feel like he's "home free". Once you eliminate stress, that's when a perp. is most likely to slip up. And IMO, if he killed Janet, he will slip up eventually. And considering the rules of 'double jeopardy', we don't want him in court before then unless there's enough evidence to convict him.
Wow - you raise a good point!

[Moxie]

I think that that date is scheduled in case Raven decides to take it to court rather than accepting the plea deal. I don't remember the date that was mentioned but one of the articles stated that they will know by [whatever date - could be 8/26] whether or not he's accepting. If he chooses to accept the deal, I imagine that that court date will be used to inform the court of the decision or whatever other housekeeping issues they have with the case.
That would make sense. I don't know a lot about how the justice system works, so this is a crash course for me. But the charges are listed as Felony Embezzlement, and the new court date is August 26th. It also says at the top, "arraignment", all five charges are there, and all five are listed as felonies.

[snapple]

Let's hope that if LE thinks that Raven is the perp., that all of this is being done in an attempt to make him feel like he's "home free". Once you eliminate stress, that's when a perp. is most likely to slip up. And IMO, if he killed Janet, he will slip up eventually. And considering the rules of 'double jeopardy', we don't want him in court before then unless there's enough evidence to convict him.
Good Point, JG... I REALLY, REALLY hope that's why raven hasn't been arrested yet.

[JerseyGirl]

Good Point, JG... I REALLY, REALLY hope that's why raven hasn't been arrested yet.I'm with ya', snapple. That's why I'm still giving LE the benefit of the doubt, and trying to be patient, (although that does get difficult at times). Circumstantial cases can be successfully prosecuted but if it comes down to being a case involving little or no hard evidence, they've got to be sure to turn over every possible stone before going forward. If it means that the perp. will end up in jail for his crime, then I'm willing to wait. Of course, I am not directly involved so that's easier for me ... I can certainly understand how family and friends would become frustrated after so much time.

[JerseyGirl]

I don't know a lot about how the justice system works, so this is a crash course for me.Moxie, I am so very sorry that some selfish, evil "person" thrust you into this through his unspeakable actions. What an awful reason to have to learn about all of this. :(

I'm glad that you're here, and I hope that you realize how much we all care about all of you.

[ewwwinteresting]

I'm with ya', snapple. That's why I'm still giving LE the benefit of the doubt, and trying to be patient, (although that does get difficult at times). Circumstantial cases can be successfully prosecuted but if it comes down to being a case involving little or no hard evidence, they've got to be sure to turn over every possible stone before going forward. If it means that the perp. will end up in jail for his crime, then I'm willing to wait. Of course, I am not directly involved so that's easier for me ... I can certainly understand how family and friends would become frustrated after so much time.
It has been said that almost all evidence is collected within the first 72 hours of a crime.

It has been three months. I am concerned that there hasn't been an arrest yet.

We were told Raven was interviewed all night and released in the morning. Considering LE was called out at 10:58 pm, how many hours could they have really talked to him? By the time he got to the station (most likely having to wait for someone to come get Kaiden)...how much time did they really interrogate him, 4 or 5 hours? :eek: Raven has left the jurisdiction of Durham PD. He lives in Utah with his son, whose mommy's killer is still on the loose. So it is presumed that LE has no plans of further interrogation of Raven since he has not been in NC to be interrogated since Wife died and no longer lives in the area. So, if LE got information for Raven to hang himself, why not arrest him? If LE didn't get Raven to hang himself, I highly