It baffles me why he did not kill Shasta Groene? What is your theory on this?

[newtv]

I am totally dismayed as to why he did not kill both children? I am glad he did not but its puzzling. Just wondering what some of you are making of it.
I do not tink its because he wanted to get caught. I really cannot think of one reason for not killing her given she was the only witness left.

[WebbyCat]

He wanted her available for sex anytime he wanted.

[Peabody]

I am totally dismayed as to why he did not kill both children? I am glad he did not but its puzzling. Just wondering what some of you are making of it.
I do not tink its because he wanted to get caught. I really cannot think of one reason for not killing her given she was the only witness left.
I don't think any of us could come close with the correct answer --- we just are not wired like he is.

The only certain thing was that he was just not ready to kill her - I am sure had Shasta not been recognized, he would have murdered her eventually.

Thank God for saving Shasta.


Bring Maura Home!
www.mauramurray.com (http://www.mauramurray.com/)
www.spbowers.com\mauramissing.html (http://www.spbowers.com/mauramissing.html)

[MistyM]

maybe because he has only attacked males in the past, he had no interest in killing her. /shrug. although she did say he molested her too. then there is the family. i don't know. maybe he actually felt something towards her, as sick as that sounds.

[Anarinda]

He's only been convicted of raping and molesting boys. For all we know he may have done the same to girls.

[LTUlegal]

My opinion is that with boys, he had absolutely no respect for them, as though they were trash because that's how he had been treated (allegedly). (Daniel Horowitz would be trying to play the violin in the background for this, but I still say it didn't have to turn him into a monster!)
From reading his blog entries, it appears that he was very lonely and I think he thought of Shasta as a "girlfriend" rather than a child. It's sick and twisted and makes me so angry, but that's what I think about it.:sick:

[Verity]

I'm leaning towards his being part of an online pedophile ring and taking her not so much to abuse for his own satisfaction, but to make videos and photos to sell to other pedophiles. As long as she was productive, he had no reason to kill her. I think she's a very smart little girl and kept him interested. She knew the fate that had befallen the rest of her family at his hands and did what she needed to do to stay alive.

It doesn't bear thinking about...they really screwed up badly not keeping this guy locked up...it makes me so angry to think that people can hurt innocent children in this way.

[BillyGoatGruff]

I'm leaning towards his being part of an online pedophile ring and taking her not so much to abuse for his own satisfaction, but to make videos and photos to sell to other pedophiles. As long as she was productive, he had no reason to kill her. I think she's a very smart little girl and kept him interested. She knew the fate that had befallen the rest of her family at his hands and did what she needed to do to stay alive.

It doesn't bear thinking about...they really screwed up badly not keeping this guy locked up...it makes me so angry to think that people can hurt innocent children in this way.
I think she was a bartering tool for $$$ from amother pedo. Maybe that's why he was on the move.

[CaliKid]

This is stretching it a bit (ok, a lot), but what if JED was using his knowledge of geocacheing to swap kids? And what if he left Dylan in that remote spot in Montana for someone else to find, but the child died accidentally.

[Rocky]

This is stretching it a bit (ok, a lot), but what if JED was using his knowledge of geocacheing to swap kids? And what if he left Dylan in that remote spot in Montana for someone else to find, but the child died accidentally.

on the news tonight they said they found what they think are pieces of Dylan... Did he cut him up hoping a grisly might eat him?

this guy could end up being worse than the BTK killer...


my theory on what I've read about this guy is he wanted to sacrifice her when the moon was right... The devil made him do it...

[Casshew]

Maybe shasta's personality made her easy to manipulate (brainwash) she wasn't combative, didn't challenge him or resist him. She was easy to deal with and no trouble so he kept her around.

[Shazzie]

on the news tonight they said they found what they think are pieces of Dylan... Did he cut him up hoping a grisly might eat him?Grossness warning--sorry!

I'll try to put this as delicately as possible: if a body is left exposed in an area where there is wildlife (which means just about anywhere, really), animals are going to find it and feed on it. That's a given. In that locale, grizzlies are certainly a possibility, as well as black bears, wolves, coyotes, mountain lions, buzzards or vultures, who knows what. No one would need to cut anything up; the animals would take care of that themselves. As they fed, the parts they had no use for (bones, scraps of clothing, etc.) would be scattered about.

Sorry, I know that was graphic. But I'm sure that's what happened here.

[OneMADmomma]

Grossness warning--sorry!

I'll try to put this as delicately as possible: if a body is left exposed in an area where there is wildlife (which means just about anywhere, really), animals are going to find it and feed on it. That's a given. In that locale, grizzlies are certainly a possibility, as well as black bears, wolves, coyotes, mountain lions, buzzards or vultures, who knows what. No one would need to cut anything up; the animals would take care of that themselves. As they fed, the parts they had no use for (bones, scraps of clothing, etc.) would be scattered about.

Sorry, I know that was graphic. But I'm sure that's what happened here.
I read on Fox that that was exactly what happened...the animals got to the body that they discovered. That is the reason it is taking so long to identify, not much to work with. I think that Steve Groene was telling this to Geraldo. That poor man. I can't even imagine having to deal with that image much less be able to talk about it...:sick:

[packerdog]

I think this is the first pedophile that I have heard of that has sex with both boys and girls, he is a case study thats for sure. Has anyone else heard of this type of pedophile? I thought it was bad when these guys would break into a house and steal a child, now they are desparate enough to kill a whole family to get the kids. Just horrible!

[mysteriew]

I think this is the first pedophile that I have heard of that has sex with both boys and girls, he is a case study thats for sure. Has anyone else heard of this type of pedophile? I thought it was bad when these guys would break into a house and steal a child, now they are desparate enough to kill a whole family to get the kids. Just horrible!

True pedofiles tend to have a preference for one gender or another. However a predator, while maybe having a preference for gender, will take either sex. For them, it is not the sex that is the gratification- it is the violence, the control of another, the intimidation that is the true excitement. The sex is just a release for that.

[fran]

I think this is the first pedophile that I have heard of that has sex with both boys and girls, he is a case study thats for sure. Has anyone else heard of this type of pedophile? I thought it was bad when these guys would break into a house and steal a child, now they are desparate enough to kill a whole family to get the kids. Just horrible!

Packerdog:

I've been reading so many places since this case broke open this last weekend, I can't remember where I saw this. But I believe this guy might fall into the category of 'sexual sadist.' It doesn't matter if it's male, female, old, young,.........He can't be classified just as a 'molester,' 'a pedophile,' whatever. The changing of sexes of victims, the violence,......murder......

I'm sure there's more to it, but that's what I gather.

JMHO
fran

PS......sorry Mysterview, posted before I read your entry. That too!! :)

[Mirielle]

My opinion is that with boys, he had absolutely no respect for them, as though they were trash because that's how he had been treated (allegedly). (Daniel Horowitz would be trying to play the violin in the background for this, but I still say it didn't have to turn him into a monster!)
From reading his blog entries, it appears that he was very lonely and I think he thought of Shasta as a "girlfriend" rather than a child. It's sick and twisted and makes me so angry, but that's what I think about it.:sick:I tend to go along with this theory. Especially if he had been raped and molested by the men in his family as a youngster, he would would be more sadistic towards males. However, I think he killed Beaner after he was done with her so he wouldn't get caught. The other thing I kept reading in his blog was all about control. He could not stand having his life controlled, either in prison....or out of it, by the police checking up on him. He might have perceived that a young boy was harder to control than a girl. I also think he wanted to get caught.

I also agree that being molested does not have to turn anyone into a monster. There seem to be two kinds of people who survive sexual abuse...people who really remember what it feels like to be victimized and would never do that to another human...and those that are so angry and confused that they don't care what pain they inflict on others. I would say Duncan was a sadistic predator, full of rage. Somebody that can beat two adults and one teenager to death at the same time has got to be almost manic with rage.

[mysteriew]

I tend to go along with this theory. Especially if he had been raped and molested by the men in his family as a youngster, he would would be more sadistic towards males.

From some of the reading that I have done, there are indications that JED was abused by the female members of his family- possibly the sisters.

His father was in the military and they moved a lot. JED reportedly has told officials that he spent a lot of time dreaming and watching TV.
I wondered if Dad wasn't distant and dismissive of JED.

[Linda7NJ]

I tend to go along with this theory. Especially if he had been raped and molested by the men in his family as a youngster, he would would be more sadistic towards males. However, I think he killed Beaner after he was done with her so he wouldn't get caught. The other thing I kept reading in his blog was all about control. He could not stand having his life controlled, either in prison....or out of it, by the police checking up on him. He might have perceived that a young boy was harder to control than a girl. I also think he wanted to get caught.

I also agree that being molested does not have to turn anyone into a monster. There seem to be two kinds of people who survive sexual abuse...people who really remember what it feels like to be victimized and would never do that to another human...and those that are so angry and confused that they don't care what pain they inflict on others. I would say Duncan was a sadistic predator, full of rage. Somebody that can beat two adults and one teenager to death at the same time has got to be almost manic with rage.
Maybe his fictional character "Jan" in his blog isn't fictional. (No excuse to become a monster.....)

[mysteriew]

I have thought of several theories about why he may have left Shasta alive.
My opinions only.

Since in his blog he kept complaining about what society had done to him, and then he decided to get even. Maybe Shasta was left alive to tell the story of what a monster society had made him become.

Maybe he connected with her is some non-sexual way. Maybe she reminded him of a favorite sister or something.

Maybe he had finally expended all of his rage, was out of money and saw no other way to get out of what had happened. Maybe he was just giving up. Allowing Shasta to live was his way of trying to say, "see I am not all bad, I let the little girl live."

[newtv]

Hi all - great thoughts and it still makes no sense to me. (You guys do-but it remains a puzzle in my mind still).
I cant imagine him as having bonded with her- I do not think he is capable. (which is why it baffles me so much that he would keep her alive).
He has no respect for humanity so he would not spare her out of any sense of good will.
Maybe as someone said, he just had not killed her YET? Then in the meantime he was caught with her.
He had money enough to feed her that night at denny's..but yes. he could be running out of money..again though: why not kill her-go back into his life and be done with it- he could not have been caught unless he told someone as he has no connection to them. He would not have been a suspect. (the remaons of both chldren would never have been found).

I do not believe he wanted to be caught-it doesnt make sense. As well he hasnt cooperated with police so he isnt using her as barter. He didn't confess to killing dylan and it was shasta whom led them to the remains, (if they are his).
Its quite a curiosity to me how she escaped death and why he kept her around. As cashew suggested, it is possible she was good company. Again, maybe not because of a bond but he met his lonliness needs including being forced to have sex.
I am so glad he did not kill her and i am so glad that shasta has her dad and vice versa. (They at least have each other and the older brother-its not the same without dylan and their mom but its something greater than having no family).

[Shazzie]

Thanks for the link, Dara. That article is short, but very informative, IMO.

I could easily believe that he had some kind of detailed plan that would include his reasons for letting Shasta stay alive. I have no idea what that might be, but this guy sounds very methodical. He seems to be what the profilers call an "organized" offender.

http://www.courttv.com/onair/shows/profiler/crime_scene_col.html

Profilers characterize the crime scenes — and by extension, the criminals themselves — as either "organized" or "disorganized." In general terms, an organized offender’s crimes are premeditated while a disorganized offender acts with little or no planning.

<SNIP>

The organized offender is portrayed as manipulative, cunning, deliberate and methodical. He is often a classic psychopath — narcissistic and lacking empathy and remorse. He takes pride in his appearance and can be articulate, outgoing and pleasant enough on the surface. Because of his ability to appear non-threatening, he is able to snare his victims by charming or conning them, or perhaps by offering them money or some sort of assistance.

This type of offender doesn't just lash out randomly; he thinks things through and plans his crimes. I believe Duncan is this type of offender. I have no idea what his reason was for keeping Shasta alive, but I believe he did have a definite reason in mind.

[Dara]

Thanks for the link, Dara. That article is short, but very informative, IMO.

I could easily believe that he had some kind of detailed plan that would include his reasons for letting Shasta stay alive. I have no idea what that might be, but this guy sounds very methodical. He seems to be what the profilers call an "organized" offender.

http://www.courttv.com/onair/shows/profiler/crime_scene_col.html

Profilers characterize the crime scenes — and by extension, the criminals themselves — as either "organized" or "disorganized." In general terms, an organized offender’s crimes are premeditated while a disorganized offender acts with little or no planning.

<SNIP>

The organized offender is portrayed as manipulative, cunning, deliberate and methodical. He is often a classic psychopath — narcissistic and lacking empathy and remorse. He takes pride in his appearance and can be articulate, outgoing and pleasant enough on the surface. Because of his ability to appear non-threatening, he is able to snare his victims by charming or conning them, or perhaps by offering them money or some sort of assistance.

This type of offender doesn't just lash out randomly; he thinks things through and plans his crimes. I believe Duncan is this type of offender. I have no idea what his reason was for keeping Shasta alive, but I believe he did have a definite reason in mind.
Wow, lots of food for thought. Always good to read you, Shaz.

[BillyGoatGruff]

on the news tonight they said they found what they think are pieces of Dylan... Did he cut him up hoping a grisly might eat him?

this guy could end up being worse than the BTK killer...


my theory on what I've read about this guy is he wanted to sacrifice her when the moon was right... The devil made him do it...
It doesn't take animals long to scatter a carcass in thw wild. Coyotes and wild dogs in particular are pretty good at dragging bodies around to break off pieces.

[Shazzie]

Wow, lots of food for thought. Always good to read you, Shaz.
Thanks, Dara. Believe me, the feeling is mutal! :)

[BillyGoatGruff]

I think this is the first pedophile that I have heard of that has sex with both boys and girls, he is a case study thats for sure. Has anyone else heard of this type of pedophile? I thought it was bad when these guys would break into a house and steal a child, now they are desparate enough to kill a whole family to get the kids. Just horrible!
There are several cases of pedophiles who abuse both males & females.
There was a guy named "Treefrog" several years back who, along with one of his young "loved boys" kidnapped a toddler female.(google "treefrog" + "pedophile"--it's a horrific story) Usually the younger the child, the less important the gender is to the offender. The older the age of the preferred victim, the more likely the gender is specific. A 13 year old girl is often too close to genuine womanhood to attract a pedo, as opposed to a girl of 7-9. Peter Kurtin attacked both male & female children, as did Chikatilov.

[Snikx]

I am totally dismayed as to why he did not kill both children? I am glad he did not but its puzzling. Just wondering what some of you are making of it.
I do not tink its because he wanted to get caught. I really cannot think of one reason for not killing her given she was the only witness left.

I've wondered about that too. I've read his fifthnail blog in which he says that he wants to have his revenge on society because he can never have the approval and continued friendship with people due to being labelled as a sex offender. In his last posts he warns of wanting to do something, that the demons are winning. Regardless of what we all think of his whining and complaining about his sorry lot in life, the jerk may have been truly lonely and not wanting to take responsibility for the consequences of his actions. Meaning he did not want to go back to prison.

He knew what the consequences would be. Shasta, if you think about it, would be the last person who was not a member of the criminal justice system with whom he would have a "relationship", even though it was not a willing one. If he killed her, then there was no one or he would have to go and abduct someone else. He may have been capable even of liking her, despite what he intended for her and despite his treatment of her. She was the last one. Once she was gone, he knew the probable next step for him was arrest and imprisonment forever and ever and ever and ever and ever. No parole. No more chances. No more doctor to bail him out. Nothing was ever going to get him out again.

Shasta was the last person who he would ever spend time with who was a free normal person who couldn't arrest him, jail him, or do anything to him other than be a companion. Once she was gone, there would be no one.

Maybe his fear of loneliness kept her alive? Fortunately.

[irishlass]

Maybe he planned on using her to help lure in other children? Didn't the guy who had Steven Stayner use Steven that way sometimes?

[Floh]

I knew what the poster was trying to convey too, for sure. i knew they wouldn't at all wish more upon Shasta than the poor mite has already suffered.

that's what can be a problem with message boards. we miss tone and intonation we readily use when actually speaking with another person when all we can do here is write. i know i don't always use totally correct words when i am posting my musings. especially when i absolutely have to post my thoughts there and then and get to read them back a few hours later and wonder, myself, what went wrong when someone has, IMO, misinterpreted me. :(

fortunately, Websleuths is not that type of board. :)

[Beyond Belief]

I think Duncan had planned somekind of finale for the fourth of July weekend. The fifth murder right under the LE's noses.

[Linda7NJ]

I think he simply wasn't finished with her YET.

[kline]

Its an interesting question.

I think once he killed her it would all truly be over.
I think in his sick brain Shasta might have been meant to be the one who would tell the world about his suffering.Its also very important to alot of pedaphiles to believe they're victim has fallen in love with him.
She possibly was meant to be his Valediction. Mea Culpa.
Because Im sure that poor child has had to listen to more of the same sort of sewage that smeared his Blog website then most of us could stomach in one lifetime.
Ive heard of a lot of heinous evil things in my life but this case is one of the worst.

[Mirielle]

I've wondered about that too. I've read his fifthnail blog in which he says that he wants to have his revenge on society because he can never have the approval and continued friendship with people due to being labelled as a sex offender. In his last posts he warns of wanting to do something, that the demons are winning. Regardless of what we all think of his whining and complaining about his sorry lot in life, the jerk may have been truly lonely and not wanting to take responsibility for the consequences of his actions. Meaning he did not want to go back to prison.

He knew what the consequences would be. Shasta, if you think about it, would be the last person who was not a member of the criminal justice system with whom he would have a "relationship", even though it was not a willing one. If he killed her, then there was no one or he would have to go and abduct someone else. He may have been capable even of liking her, despite what he intended for her and despite his treatment of her. She was the last one. Once she was gone, he knew the probable next step for him was arrest and imprisonment forever and ever and ever and ever and ever. No parole. No more chances. No more doctor to bail him out. Nothing was ever going to get him out again.

Shasta was the last person who he would ever spend time with who was a free normal person who couldn't arrest him, jail him, or do anything to him other than be a companion. Once she was gone, there would be no one.

Maybe his fear of loneliness kept her alive? Fortunately.

Excellent, excellent post!:clap: I have read your post over several times and I think you are right on. The thing that I keep getting with Duncan is that he wanted to connect with people, but that he had no clue how to develop intimacy. When I read his blog and look at his pictures, I see a lonely, isolated man who knew deep inside that he was a monster. No matter how many jobs, degrees, computer equipment, trips and websites he piled on, he was alone. No matter how intelligent he was and no matter how articulate, he was a lost soul. The hatred and resentment in the blog that he turns on society was what he really felt inside for himself. I think he may have felt Shasta, as a child, would not judge him. And I totally agree that she was the last non law-enforcement person he probably would ever have contact with because he was running out of options.

[newtv]

I've wondered about that too. I've read his fifthnail blog in which he says that he wants to have his revenge on society because he can never have the approval and continued friendship with people due to being labelled as a sex offender. In his last posts he warns of wanting to do something, that the demons are winning. Regardless of what we all think of his whining and complaining about his sorry lot in life, the jerk may have been truly lonely and not wanting to take responsibility for the consequences of his actions. Meaning he did not want to go back to prison.

He knew what the consequences would be. Shasta, if you think about it, would be the last person who was not a member of the criminal justice system with whom he would have a "relationship", even though it was not a willing one. If he killed her, then there was no one or he would have to go and abduct someone else. He may have been capable even of liking her, despite what he intended for her and despite his treatment of her. She was the last one. Once she was gone, he knew the probable next step for him was arrest and imprisonment forever and ever and ever and ever and ever. No parole. No more chances. No more doctor to bail him out. Nothing was ever going to get him out again.

Shasta was the last person who he would ever spend time with who was a free normal person who couldn't arrest him, jail him, or do anything to him other than be a companion. Once she was gone, there would be no one.

Maybe his fear of loneliness kept her alive? Fortunately.
I agree with your thots but if he had killed her I doubt he would ever be caught? So its as if he risked being caught when he did not have to. But I cant imagine that it was from a place of goodwill or kindness or attachment.
I do not think he goes there-he thinks of himself only.
Some dweeb of a doctor tried saying his blog was well written and that he was tortured by guilt-had the capacity for empathy and so on..I surely did not think that by what I read or have been told about him in reports.
If you have guilt then you ocme clean-he has not.

[newtv]

Excellent, excellent post!:clap: I have read your post over several times and I think you are right on. The thing that I keep getting with Duncan is that he wanted to connect with people, but that he had no clue how to develop intimacy. When I read his blog and look at his pictures, I see a lonely, isolated man who knew deep inside that he was a monster. No matter how many jobs, degrees, computer equipment, trips and websites he piled on, he was alone. No matter how intelligent he was and no matter how articulate, he was a lost soul. The hatred and resentment in the blog that he turns on society was what he really felt inside for himself. I think he may have felt Shasta, as a child, would not judge him. And I totally agree that she was the last non law-enforcement person he probably would ever have contact with because he was running out of options.
again- i agree with your thots but remember that he could have committed the perfect crime had he killed her. he would not be going to jail-there would not be any proof-nothing would tie him to the cxrime scene.
In fact he had the community belieiving it was drug related. They did not have a clue it was him or could be him?
Had he killed her he would go scot free..(hence I am shocked/dismayed/shaking my head/ at why he did not.
I do think he may have wanted her around for awhile as company-so he had someone to control, but I would love to be a fly on the wall while he is interrogated just to know what he was thinking.

[newtv]

I disagree that he had no plan to kill her. I think he was just not ready to kill her yet.
Perhaps she had not yet fully gotten in the way.
And I addressed your dismayed comment on another post-it is defined in the dictionary as an adjective conveying SHOCK- I used it in that context..shocked/not being able to think of one reason not to/ in disbelief about it.
Additionally it is defined clearly in the thread title..what would make you go out of your way to be disturbed about a word you dont have the full meaning of when the context is everywhere to support the choice of word.
To me its intentionally to undermine or embarrass another. Why would you be so quick to do that?
In fact, it astonishes me that this is the only word you chose to see-all words have,meaning only in a context. You would have to work overtime to miss what I meant.
:banghead:
I really do not appreciate the lesson here-first of all you are inaccurate, but more than that its just simply unnecessary. Go check a word out and interpret it by its context. It was clear what I meant and I even redefined myself with another word to describe my feeling state. (I clarified it myself).
F or you to then post about at best is redundant and at worst an attempt at judgement. Its petty and misguided in my books.:waitasec:
Please Just worry about your own english I am happy with mine.

[newtv]

Its an interesting question.

I think once he killed her it would all truly be over.
I think in his sick brain Shasta might have been meant to be the one who would tell the world about his suffering.Its also very important to alot of pedaphiles to believe they're victim has fallen in love with him.
She possibly was meant to be his Valediction. Mea Culpa.
Because Im sure that poor child has had to listen to more of the same sort of sewage that smeared his Blog website then most of us could stomach in one lifetime.
Ive heard of a lot of heinous evil things in my life but this case is one of the worst.
This makes sense too- again the shock part for me is that he could have gone free and not had to get the word aout about his suffering. Why go to jail in order to expose your suffering-when in fact it evokes the opposite imo. Who cares about a mans suffering when he kills 4 people nearly 5.

I am truly delighted+++ that he did not and I am grateful that she has a father that seems to be solid. (jmo).
I believe she will be loved back to her self-not as she once knew it, but enough to get on with a non-tormented life.
She will have lots to go through-loss-survivor guilt and so on, but it seems as if she is loved in a positive way.
Does anyone know why her brother is in jail?

[Snikx]

again- i agree with your thots but remember that he could have committed the perfect crime had he killed her. he would not be going to jail-there would not be any proof-nothing would tie him to the cxrime scene.

True! Interesting, isn't it? In fact why have the blog? Why drive a RED car? Why rent another RED car when you're on the run? Why say ANYTHING in a public blog about other crimes or codes?
He had also been diagnosed as a narcissist early on. I'd include the url here if I could find it quickly but it would take a little time.
If he committed the perfect crime, then no one would know and he is a narcissist. One of the points of doing the deed is so that people will know.
Here's one link about narcissists:
http://www.bullyonline.org/workbully/npd.htm

[newtv]

True! Interesting, isn't it? In fact why have the blog? Why drive a RED car? Why rent another RED car when you're on the run? Why say ANYTHING in a public blog about other crimes or codes?
He had also been diagnosed as a narcissist early on. I'd include the url here if I could find it quickly but it would take a little time.
If he committed the perfect crime, then no one would know and he is a narcissist. One of the points of doing the deed is so that people will know.
Here's one link about narcissists:
http://www.bullyonline.org/workbully/npd.htmyes- I agree with this too..it may simply be the need to show the world he knew how to commit the perfect crime and did so? (That he is telling us so he gets the last laugh at society).

[Berksleuth]

Not all sexually abused children grow to be sexual abusers,

but 99% of sexual abusers were sexually abused.......



Some adults who were sexually abused as children do continue to repeat
the event over and over. This explains his attraction to boys. Because
the "repeated event" doesn't eleveate his anger he will continue repeating
it. Unfortunately, his rage becomes expotentiated, and that is when he
starts killing his victims.



I don't doubt Dylan put up a fight, if not only for himself, his sister. JED
wasn't going to put up with that. Shasta probably figured out real quick
that fighting wasn't the means for survival.


I don't believe he "cared" for her. This guy is a narcissist as well as an
anti-social personality .... they are unable to feel for anyone else.
However, narcissists tend to associate themselves with people of

admiration to make themselves feel good. He did trust her or he would
not have let her wander free around the store, he would have had hold
of her hand the entire time. I am also sure he didn't have many friends
(at least anyone who would admit to it).


This guy sounds and reads like a sick being. All my studies have always
pointed to one conclusion, these people are "unrehabilitable."

[Berksleuth]

Sorry guys for taking up all the space. I intended to make "all that I had to say" take up less space, but hitting the enter key only made it worse....:blushing:

[Only4Justice]

Maybe shasta's personality made her easy to manipulate (brainwash) she wasn't combative, didn't challenge him or resist him. She was easy to deal with and no trouble so he kept her around.

Hi Casshew ..... I agree with you......

It was either this theory OR the thought that perhaps Shasta got to his heart (if he has one).....and he couldn't kill her.....

[kline]

I really think this something he had wanted to do for a long time.

And knew he would.This was the Apothesis of his miserable life.
He just wanted to do it and maintain his Martyr and Victim status by which he defined himself.
His whole Blog is nothing more then a "See What You Finally Made Me Do?" cop out.
Its whole purpose was to be read after he indulged himself in this.
I think Shasta was to be his living testimonial.
Brain washed with his perverted philosophy.An example of his sick minimilization of the damage pedophiles do to their victims.And frankly its one thing to fantasize about going down in a hail of cop bullets quite another to get to the point of actually doing it.Thus prolonging Shasta's ordeal for so long(other then for having her available to abuse.)
One way or another she was definitley crucial to what he considered the final act of his sick little saga.

[Jvon]

My opinion to this thread is that this was this monster's ultimate fantasy, a boy and a girl. As ashamed of myself to think about this, I wonder if he did not only molest both of them but ordered them to do unthinkable acts to each other for his sexual pleasure. I feel perhaps Dylan, as young as he was, believed it was time to save his precious sister as well as himself and tried to make an effort to free both of them. At that time, this a..hole decided he would eliminate this poor child. If this happened, I am sure Shasta will hold this ultimate brave act of her brother forever in her heart. JUST MY OPINION.

[Tom'sGirl]

My opinion to this thread is that this was this monster's ultimate fantasy, a boy and a girl. As ashamed of myself to think about this, I wonder if he did not only molest both of them but ordered them to do unthinkable acts to each other for his sexual pleasure. I feel perhaps Dylan, as young as he was, believed it was time to save his precious sister as well as himself and tried to make an effort to free both of them. At that time, this a..hole decided he would eliminate this poor child. If this happened, I am sure Shasta will hold this ultimate brave act of her brother forever in her heart. JUST MY OPINION.
I just posted this on another thread. I just wanted you to know this.......

July 11th.......Just read this!

Dylan's and Shasta's father, Steve Groene, said Shasta did not know the fate of her brother until the family received confirmation this weekend.



“She asked me last week in the hospital if I knew what had happened to Dylan,” Groene said.

http://www.spokesmanreview.com/breaking/story.asp?submitDate=200571012524 ("")

[newtv]

I just posted this on another thread. I just wanted you to know this.......

July 11th.......Just read this!

Dylan's and Shasta's father, Steve Groene, said Shasta did not know the fate of her brother until the family received confirmation this weekend.



“She asked me last week in the hospital if I knew what had happened to Dylan,” Groene said.

http://www.spokesmanreview.com/breaking/story.asp?submitDate=200571012524 (http://<font%20color=)thanks for the update - i am glad she did not know.

[Jvon]

I just posted this on another thread. I just wanted you to know this.......

July 11th.......Just read this!

Dylan's and Shasta's father, Steve Groene, said Shasta did not know the fate of her brother until the family received confirmation this weekend.



“She asked me last week in the hospital if I knew what had happened to Dylan,” Groene sai
http://www.spokesmanreview.com/breaking/story.asp?submitDate=200571012524 (http://%3Cfont%20color=%22#0000ff%22%3Ehttp://www.spokesmanreview.com/breaking/story.asp?submitDate=200571012524%3C/font%3E)
I am sorry, I did not have time to read all but look forward to reading your's and responding.:doh:

[Tom'sGirl]

I am sorry, I did not have time to read all but look forward to reading your's and responding.:doh:No one can read all the postings at once, at least not me
:bang:
I was just letting you know so you could feel a bit relieved Jvon like I was.

[Jvon]

No one can read all the postings at once, at least not me
:bang:
I was just letting you know so you could feel a bit relieved Jvon like I was.
Thank you, Tom'sGirl. I appreciate your response. I have become more emotional about this story than any in my life. I am amazed by you and so many others when it comes to discussing current events. I was one of those people a couple of years ago that never was concerned about any problem outside my small "middle class" world. After reading these forums and learning so much from all of you, I have become so interested. I have not learned all "the rules" yet but hope to discuss with you again.:chicken:

[chicoliving]

Thank you all for getting back to the topic of the thread :)

I must say this news that Shasta didn't know is puzzling.....I need to catch up a bit.

[Tom'sGirl]

Thank you all for getting back to the topic of the thread :)

I must say this news that Shasta didn't know is puzzling.....I need to catch up a bit.
Chico,

After reading the CNN Transcripts link you provided on another thread it sounds to me like she may have not witnessed any of the actual murders. She may have been told they were dead, but not actually witnessed the acts.

JMO and I hope that is the case

[chicoliving]

That is a good thing if she didn't actually witness the murders.....and it sounds as if she didn't know for sure about Dylan which is also good in that she doesn't have the visual and hopefully not the auditory memories of such horrific acts. Poor baby, she's got enough memories as it is...she can overcome this and lead a happy life, she has a lot of family to help see to it.

[Tom'sGirl]

That is a good thing if she didn't actually witness the murders.....and it sounds as if she didn't know for sure about Dylan which is also good in that she doesn't have the visual and hopefully not the auditory memories of such horrific acts. Poor baby, she's got enough memories as it is...she can overcome this and lead a happy life, she has a lot of family to help see to it.
I feel she definately can, and will get over this in years to come.

I feel the family will be the main factor in her healing, more so than doctors.

[CaliKid]

With decent therapy, Shasta will learn to deal with the cringing horror and will look back with mostly regret and sorrow. Hopefully she won't become an angry young woman, although she has every reason to be.

I wonder if JED was trying to make her feel as if she was to blame for what happened to her family, and once that was accomplished he planned to kill her.

[kline]

Praise God if thats true that she didnt see any of her family actually killed.

Which makes sense in a sick way... you can rest assured that animal was playing with her head...you could tell from some of his comments on his blog that he subscribed to the common warped notion that the molester and the victim share a covenant,that they really want to be 'liberated 'and shown something new' and grow to love the molester.
Almost impossible to brainwash or toy with somebody utterly hysterical or catatonic from watching her brother killed in front of eyes.God only knows what he told that poor girl.
You know im trying really hard to supress having an urge to strangle this guy three times a day because I feel like its giving him a victory in his big 'Damage Society' plan but man, then you hear something new....

[nanandjim]

Chico,

After reading the CNN Transcripts link you provided on another thread it sounds to me like she may have not witnessed any of the actual murders. She may have been told they were dead, but not actually witnessed the acts.

JMO and I hope that is the case
I believe that the waitress said that Shasta said a couple of things, like "My brother is at the house where we were staying." and "My brother is in heaven."

Perhaps, when Dylan was no longer around, Shasta asked Duncan where he was. Perhaps, Duncan replied that Dylan was in heaven.

I think that he was in total control and domination over Shasta and that's why he didn't kill her. She was not a threat to him at all. She totally complied. I think Shasta is a very smart, little girl. She handled the situation perfectly. I believe that if she had tried to get away or if she had cried or acted out in any way, she would be dead.

Even though I see her as standoff-ish in the store video, I believe that she went along and acted like Duncan's companion. You can see his confidence in the power he has over this little girl.

Shasta was so clever to walk around the store in hopes that someone would recognize her. Thank God that he stopped at the Denny's and that they did indeed recognize her.

[Cowgirl]

I believe that the waitress said that Shasta said a couple of things, like "My brother is at the house where we were staying." and "My brother is in heaven."

Perhaps, when Dylan was no longer around, Shasta asked Duncan where he was. Perhaps, Duncan replied that Dylan was in heaven.

I think that he was in total control and domination over Shasta and that's why he didn't kill her. She was not a threat to him at all. She totally complied. I think Shasta is a very smart, little girl. She handled the situation perfectly. I believe that if she had tried to get away or if she had cried or acted out in any way, she would be dead.

Even though I see her as standoff-ish in the store video, I believe that she went along and acted like Duncan's companion. You can see his confidence in the power he has over this little girl.

Shasta was so clever to walk around the store in hopes that someone would recognize her. Thank God that he stopped at the Denny's and that they did indeed recognize her.I agree with your assessment here. I think she was looking into the surveillance cameras more than others too, probably in hopes of being recognized, but that is just a guess. It pains me that she seems to walk with her legs splayed as if she had irritation in her pants and she most certainly did, poor little girl.

I am not sure how or why she stayed alive as so long, but it seems her survival instincts may be the key. However, with a psycho sexual sadist like Duncan who seemed chiefly interested in little boys as his victims, it may be that he paid more disgusting attention to her brother and the things he was doing to him were more depraved and intolerable than what he forced Shasta to do. That is just a guess. I will be interested to hear when in the seven week time frame that Dylan was murdered. Even the forensic talking heads don't seem to agree about the remains. Some seem to think there was no soft tissue and others speak as though there was. I wonder if they can tell through forensics how long ago the murder happened if there was just skeletal remains, as several of them have said.

When trying to second guess a sexual sadist who derives pleasure from the suffering and terror of his victims, it may seem ridiculous, but his "preference" for boys may be why his female victim survived longer. It may ultimately be his biggest mistake. He might never have been tied to this horror if he had killed her too.

[surf_moon_stars]

Just a thought, and this is a long shot.

Maybe Shasta reminded Duncan of someone he knew back in his younger
days, childhood, a relative etc. , someone he could trust or confide in.

I think that every single post here represents some really big facts about this
guy and I am trying to piece all of it together and think of Shasta and Dylan daily.

His Holiday video (thanksgiving) is so deep and eerie with the music he uses...like a video documentary photo album of his family, and if you notice he ends the video, if I remember correctly on a picture of himself....which seems strange to me.

I don't know why he would "expose his family members" to that kind of exposure on any website if he has "other sites" with videos of himself acting like an insane person who just hurt someone in the video he did on his webiste....

I don't know, just a thought as to why he would place that type of video alongside the other "OMGosh" videos on his site.

Those other videos certainly are completely "oppisite" of a spending time
with Thanksgiving holiday picture with music, and seem out of place on
the website in the first place.

Did his family or any of his friends make mention to the media that they knew he had this website.

Thanks for listening

[Liz]

>>snip>> Did his family or any of his friends make mention to the media that they knew he had this website. >snip>


Now that you mention it, for having a rather large family, we haven't heard from ANY of them, to my knowledge.

[chicoliving]

Let's get back to topic and leave the vocabulary lesson in the dust.....:)

[Beyond Belief]

In reviewing the SOB's website, he's description of the cat Copper, and how he spoke of its beautiful copper colored coat, it made me remember that they described Shasta's hair as auburn. I wonder if her beautiful hair, gentle ways, reminded him of the cat.


The video at the convenience showed me a little girl who was wearing flipflops tht she was having a difficult time keeping on her feet.

[Cowgirl]

In reviewing the SOB's website, he's description of the cat Copper, and how he spoke of its beautiful copper colored coat, it made me remember that they described Shasta's hair as auburn. I wonder if her beautiful hair, gentle ways, reminded him of the cat.


The video at the convenience showed me a little girl who was wearing flipflops tht she was having a difficult time keeping on her feet.Her hair looked darker than "copper" to me, a lot darker. You can see the cats, big old fat orange and white striped cats, on his video thing. Shasta was walking like she had either wet pants or she was irritated in that area, with her legs splayed. No doubt she was hurting between being molested and having diarrhea from a water born bacteria that she had. I wonder also where she got clean clothes, if she did.

[Beyond Belief]

Her hair looked darker than "copper" to me, a lot darker. You can see the cats, big old fat orange and white striped cats, on his video thing. Shasta was walking like she had either wet pants or she was irritated in that area, with her legs splayed. No doubt she was hurting between being molested and having diarrhea from a water born bacteria that she had. I wonder also where she got clean clothes, if she did.
Thanks for the lecture.

[surf_moon_stars]

Quote:
Originally posted by Liz
>>snip>>Now that you mention it, for having a rather large family, we haven't heard from ANY of them, to my knowledge. >snip>



I am going to see if I can find any information on that Liz.



I will see if cowgirl posted it somewhere.

[Cowgirl]

Thanks for the lecture.Sorry, I meant no offense.

[Beyond Belief]

Sorry, I meant no offense.
Just trying to stick to the topic. Theory only.

[fran]

Sorry if this has already been said, because I haven't read this entire thread. But, IMO, the reason he hadn't killed Shasta was he wasn't done with her. IMO, when he tired of her, she would have had the same fate as Dylan.

JMHO
fran

[newtv]

Sorry if this has already been said, because I haven't read this entire thread. But, IMO, the reason he hadn't killed Shasta was he wasn't done with her. IMO, when he tired of her, she would have had the same fate as Dylan.

JMHO
fran
fran- I agree..I think he simply wasnt finished with her yet..

[newtv]

Chico,

After reading the CNN Transcripts link you provided on another thread it sounds to me like she may have not witnessed any of the actual murders. She may have been told they were dead, but not actually witnessed the acts.

JMO and I hope that is the case
Nancy Grace show said she was told and shown the hammer he used.

[Shelayne]

I also heard on separate reports that he brought her back into the house to show Shasta her mother after he killed her. I pray that is not true.

I believe he wasn't done with her yet, either. I think he was sitting pretty confidently that no one would be looking for him. At least not yet. All he did was jump bail for-what he considered to be- a non-offense. He knew that there was no national manhunt for bail jumpers, and no one would tie this little ex-con to a horrific murder a thousand miles away. He was under the radar, and he knew it. It was a matter of time before he tired of little Shasta, disposed of her, and found some new victims to terrorize.

Thank God his arrogance got ahead of him, and he started bringing Shasta out of hiding. Thank God for the stop at Denny's. I just thank God.

[newtv]

I also heard on separate reports that he brought her back into the house to show Shasta her mother after he killed her. I pray that is not true.

I believe he wasn't done with her yet, either. I think he was sitting pretty confidently that no one would be looking for him. At least not yet. All he did was jump bail for-what he considered to be- a non-offense. He knew that there was no national manhunt for bail jumpers, and no one would tie this little ex-con to a horrific murder a thousand miles away. He was under the radar, and he knew it. It was a matter of time before he tired of little Shasta, disposed of her, and found some new victims to terrorize.

Thank God his arrogance got ahead of him, and he started bringing Shasta out of hiding. Thank God for the stop at Denny's. I just thank God.
actually u are correct- i did not hear that part but have since read it..thanks so much for adding this- I was going to once I understood what was..and all I can say is he should be sent straight to the death row-he is a monster and not even a human..
and I agree with your theory-this evil human was so sure he would not be found out..and they always do that dont they..push it one more step until they are caught..(thankgod for shasta).
good to chat:))

[GatorMom]

IMO, he kept her alive to torture her with his stories about killing her familiy and why he did it.

He's a sadist. He gets a thrill from causing pain. Maybe Shasta responded in a way that excited him when he told her the story of how he stalked her family and watched through the windows.

I'm not convinced a pedophile is drawn to just boys or girls. I think about the story of Sharon Marshall and how she was kept as her molestor's "daughter" and then as his "wife" for most of her life. Her son was only 2 when she was murdered, Franklin Floyd was obsessed with the boy. He eventually kidnapped and murdered the child (who has never been found). His obsession with Sharon ended when she grew up, his obsession with Michael started when he was born.

Shasta's terror was exciting to him and that's why he kept her around. IMO.

[oceanblueeyes]

It is for certain, imo, Joe Duncan takes us to a further level than we have ever experienced before as we have kept up with crimes. He is unique as I have never heard of a pedophile wanting to kill adults in order to get to their prey or a pedophile going hi-tech to stalk and troll.

When reading his blog writings at times the thoughts are deep and complex, causing me to re-read certain parts again. He leaves many hints to his evilness but one thing for sure he does, imo, is that he is totally thorough. This wasn't some happenstance killing and abduction....it was by design and it was carried out to a T and so was the return of Shasta to CdA. All by design and always in the control of the one who carried it out. He had a purposed intent for everything, imo.

Duncan has more frustration when he has all this pent up anger and gets even, yet feels so enraged that he wasn't caught, so he lashes out again with no response. He knew what he had done but what did it matter if no one else knew it too? (according to his mindset in blog). Was the reason that no one knew because he left no one behind to tell his story? IMO, yes. I truly believe he has murdered children before this case. It would be different in this case.

Now how would he finally get his just due and the demons locked up? How could he insure that LE this time wouldn't be inept in catching him, like all the times he went undetected? Yes, by insuring that someone was left behind to tell HIS story of evil and madness.

I think it is very foolish to assume that Duncan did not know exactly what he was doing when he didn't head further North with Shasta but slowly took his time coming right back where it all began... the busiest place in town (98 people in restaurant) with the brightest lights..the town that held loads of LE and FBI. He strolls in with her, even leaves her alone while he goes to the bathroom, comes out, police is there and it is over..he never tried to flee, he simply sat back down till they handcuffed him and probably asked him his name and with shock they thought "Joe Duncan"? Who in the hell is Joe Duncan? and he knew they were going to find out the answer very fast. (IMO) This is what he had wanted all along...reconition and he was so afraid that once again this crime was never going to be solved either...THIS one was too big, too well planned.....he wasn't going to let that happened.

Duncan is a psychotic killer with intelligence a dangerous mixture. He is calculating, methodical and cunning. If he had wanted Shasta dead, Shasta would be dead and I am not so sure this case would have ever been solved. No ONE not even police knew anything about a Joe Duncan and he had no linkage to the victims.

Sorry for lengthy post lol....I dont post too much these days but I sure read all of everyone's interesting posts. :)

JMO of course.

Ocean

[nanandjim]

Ocean - I tend to agree with your post. He planned everything. There is no way that you will get me to believe (without further evidence) that he would be dumb enough to come back to the scene of the crime. He could have driven anywhere else.

I also tend to believe Shasta's stroll around the store was "authorized" by Duncan. I do not think that this little girl would have done this without permission. He probably told her what to do before they entered the store. From what I saw on the video camera, Duncan was casually reading a newspaper as Shasta strolled throughout the store. She was under his complete control.

[oceanblueeyes]

Ocean - I tend to agree with your post. He planned everything. There is no way that you will get me to believe (without further evidence) that he would be dumb enough to come back to the scene of the crime. He could have driven anywhere else.

I also tend to believe Shasta's stroll around the store was "authorized" by Duncan. I do not think that this little girl would have done this without permission. He probably told her what to do before they entered the store. From what I saw on the video camera, Duncan was casually reading a newspaper as Shasta strolled throughout the store. She was under his complete control.

Exactly as I watched the video I fully expected him or Shasta to wave at the camera. He is BOLD.......he mocks the police by driving a RED car.....one that will stand out. He had a RED Pontiac, then he rents/steals a RED Jeep.......then he is seen.. not in nondescript clothing color but bright RED on the tape. He totally knows what most pedophiles would never do and he does just the opposite, playing mind games with LE. Cunning, knowledgeable, smart and a very dangerous mixture.

I think as the entire case unfolds it will be learned that he told Shasta he was bringing her home and she must do exactly what he said do and she did.

IMO

Ocean :)

[mysteriew]

Ocean (thanks for posting) and nanandjim I agree. I have said all along that Duncan took Shasta to the diner for a reason. He was arrogant yes, and if he had taken her out in St. Regis and no one noticed I would believe that he was just thumbing his nose at people (haha, look what I did and get by with). But, instead it was like- they didn't notice in St. Regis so I will just have to take her closer, and he drives her right into Cor D Alene!
He was in control. He committed the murders and kidnapped the children and I believe he probably also kept up with the investigation through newspapers. He probably was aware that LE had no suspicions of him. He was intelligent enough to realize that if he got into the Jeep and drove off, the worst that would ever happen to him was that he might get caught and sent to prison for the escape from the court, the stolen jeep, and failure to register on the sex offenses (a minor thing, wouldn't have hurt him much). So if he got caught he would serve a little more time in prison and then would be let out again.
I think this was his "suicide". If he didn't get killed in a cop shootout, then he knows he will be given the death penalty.
Dylan's death? It is hard to tell without knowing his cause of death. He could have died due to injuries recieved as a result of the assaults, an anger response, or during an escape attempt (a fall or the like, though I doubt that he would have attempted an escape without Shasta- unless he was attempting to get help for her during an assault). Why is Shasta alive? I too think it is because she was old enough to tell the "story" and thus ensure the conviction.
Duncan did show some conflict with his "demons" in his blog. He blamed society instead of himself it is true. But he didn't seem to be too proud of his demons. He put "Happy Joe" away when the demons took over. So evidently the demons weren't making him happy.
I think that in the minor rational part of his mind, he knew that being caught was the only way he would be stopped- and he "allowed" a ready made witness to live to tell the story and ensure his conviction.

[joanofarc]

Ocean...I agree with your assessment of Duncan totally!!!

Shasta was Duncan's "fifth" nail....left alive to tell her HORRIFIC story!!

JED's web blog is the "story" of his life and he knew after he was caught it would be studied and albiet used to elevate his status to one of notarity (the "status" to which he's always aspired...dreamed of (narcissist).....)

There was no "mistake", "taunting", or "slip-up" taking Shasta back to Coeur de Alene where he knew the chances of her being recognized would be high...it was all part of his MASTER plan....IMO

[islegirl]

I agree-
I think he wanted to keep her as his 'girlfriend'-- (why else would he show up in public w/ her-?)

I also think he would have tried to kidnap other kids, and omit those who didn't comply with him.




Maybe shasta's personality made her easy to manipulate (brainwash) she wasn't combative, didn't challenge him or resist him. She was easy to deal with and no trouble so he kept her around.

[chicoliving]

Everyone back to the topic of the thread and get off the vocabulary lessons and the boo hooing....NOW!

In case the reasons for the deletions are unclear let me spell it out....do not bring up old crap once I've addressed it because subsequent posts will go poof. Drop it and move on.

Now lets get back to this POS and let him take the wrath of our frustrations :)

[newtv]

Everyone back to the topic of the thread and get off the vocabulary lessons and the boo hooing....NOW!

In case the reasons for the deletions are unclear let me spell it out....do not bring up old crap once I've addressed it because subsequent posts will go poof. Drop it and move on.

Now lets get back to this POS and let him take the wrath of our frustrations :)gotcha- i am sorry- i seriusly did not know u were a moderator -and i am glad u told me:)) and u are a great person to be one..even if u are from chicago..I wont cause u any more wasted time ..sorry my friend. (u know i am just playing about chicago-anywhere oprah calls home is a friend of mine).

[newtv]

Ocean- great post- I have missed you and glad u decided to post this:)) Given that he was detailed in this plan-one has to consider that he knew what he was doing when he brought her so close to home..now, do you (or anyone who is reading), think he would have killed her at some point?

[Liz]

Take my advice ... you'd be best served by taking the time to learn who the moderators are. :) Trust me, on that one.

[Tom'sGirl]

gotcha- ..sorry my friend. (u know i am just playing about chicago-anywhere oprah calls home is a friend of mine).
Huh, I'm lost on this????

[chicoliving]

LOL Not a big deal....I live in Chico hence the nick and I'm originally from IN which is close enough to Chicago to count :)

[newtv]

Take my advice ... you'd be best served by taking the time to learn who the moderators are. :) Trust me, on that one.
I thot I did know-thats my point..but I guess I havent kept up since the Laci case. I used to be here more and I cannot think of a better choice for a moderator than chico..(but am I right in my thinking that you were not a moderator during the laci case?)
just curious.
I respect chico no matter-even if I did not know-the reason I mentioned it is that I read we are not to carry this on after chico said its over..and I did not realize that was from a moderator..so it was good to realize it before I said another thing.

[newtv]

LOL Not a big deal....I live in Chico hence the nick and I'm originally from IN which is close enough to Chicago to count :)hey-is it katz then who lives in chicago- I thot it was one of the gang from the laci era?

[newtv]

Take my advice ... you'd be best served by taking the time to learn who the moderators are. :) Trust me, on that one.
hey Liz- I have posted here long before this case and know the ropes pretty much-I have about 4000 posts-so its funny to have anyone tell me the kind of thing u just did..lol
I really do know-but thanks for the suggestion.

[oceanblueeyes]

Ocean- great post- I have missed you and glad u decided to post this:)) Given that he was detailed in this plan-one has to consider that he knew what he was doing when he brought her so close to home..now, do you (or anyone who is reading), think he would have killed her at some point?


Sorry for the late reply newtv and it is great to see you as well.

No, I dont think he had any intentions of killing Shasta. Everything that JED does is with a purposeful intent imo. He is way too organized, methodical and cunning. If he had wanted Shasta dead........she would be dead.

I truly believe that Duncan wanted the Groene saga to end so the story about Joe Duncan could begin.

All along he knew he wasn't going to kill her, imo, she was his validator, his storyteller. IMO, that is why he went into great detail about how he had her home under surveillance and how he murdered her family and with what weapon. In fact I think there are many more things he told Shasta.

I think he simply knew after almost seven weeks and no detection that LE once again would not catch him so he brought her back to their turf to end it. He made them all look foolish and I am sure he loved that as he has much contempt for LE.

IMO, JED will not talk to LE not now or ever. What more could they possibly want? He gave them Shasta and her knowledge of what happened and he left the stolen Jeep packed full of evidence.

I dont think he had a softness toward Shasta she merely is a tool in all of his madness.

IMO

Ocean

[concernedperson]

Sadly, this is true. She wasn't anything to him but to tell his story because his story was over in his mind. He had used all the people he could muster. No more money, no more safe refuges just this little girl who could make him importent Sad and thankfully ended.