Duncan made video tape

[Incognito]

http://www.inlander.com/localnews/298391639739380.php

Source say Duncan also used the camcorder to film what appear to be several attempts to kill the children. Each time, however, some gesture or action by the children would stop him. In one apparent attempt to slay Dylan, the boy — who was bound and gagged and unable to wiggle little more than his hands — flashed the "I love you" sign to his sister.

[Whimsigal]

http://www.inlander.com/localnews/298391639739380.php

Source say Duncan also used the camcorder to film what appear to be several attempts to kill the children. Each time, however, some gesture or action by the children would stop him. In one apparent attempt to slay Dylan, the boy — who was bound and gagged and unable to wiggle little more than his hands — flashed the "I love you" sign to his sister.
OMG It can't get any worse, can it??????? This @$***&% better be put down. Jail is too good for him, he would enjoy it too much. Stake him out in the desert and cover him with honey and let nature have it's way with him.

I'm so OVER these sick, sick sick people.

What else can be said?????

[BillyGoatGruff]

http://www.inlander.com/localnews/298391639739380.php

Source say Duncan also used the camcorder to film what appear to be several attempts to kill the children. Each time, however, some gesture or action by the children would stop him. In one apparent attempt to slay Dylan, the boy — who was bound and gagged and unable to wiggle little more than his hands — flashed the "I love you" sign to his sister.
There is no hell hot enough for this man.

[aussieblue]

:( OMG all of this is so sickening, those poor kids :(

~aussieblue

[Amster]

http://www.inlander.com/localnews/298391639739380.php

Source say Duncan also used the camcorder to film what appear to be several attempts to kill the children. Each time, however, some gesture or action by the children would stop him. In one apparent attempt to slay Dylan, the boy — who was bound and gagged and unable to wiggle little more than his hands — flashed the "I love you" sign to his sister.
It keeps getting worse.....he tortured poor little Dylan. Shasta saw it all. Monsters like Duncan need to be put down like a rabid dog. After torturing him.

[Floh]

I'm horrified with each new fact revealed.

can anyone please tell me what the "I love you" sign would be Dylan 'flashed' to Shasta? as he was bound and gagged, i'm not aware of what such a sign would be.

but i know for sure Shasta will never forget her brother's love for her. and with that thought tears are simply spilling down my face.

[surf_moon_stars]

I am crying and I am angry.....


A trial for what reason........:behindbar



Lethal injection is much too kind, and if he were in another country where you are (grossly punished ) just for stealing , let alone killing anyone, then this man would be put to death very quickly with all the evidence gathered.

This punishment would be well fitted for him in a country that still has the "old fashioned" way of taking care of criminals.


JMO

[fran]

Oh my gosh! Each day reveals a new horror poor Shasta and Dylan had to endure at the hands of this monster! She must have seen this piece of **** actually murder her brother!

He filmed it! OMG! I'm just sick!

When are law makers going to get it through their head, you cannot rehabilitate these scum?! Lock em up FOREVER!!!! Execute them! They are a blight on society!

JMHO
fran

[Pharlap]

Oh my gosh! Each day reveals a new horror poor Shasta and Dylan had to endure at the hands of this monster! She must have seen this piece of **** actually murder her brother!

He filmed it! OMG! I'm just sick!

When are law makers going to get it through their head, you cannot rehabilitate these scum?! Lock em up FOREVER!!!! Execute them! They are a blight on society!

JMHO
fran

:eek: Sick too......
This has to be the worst ever.......

[amandab]

I'm horrified with each new fact revealed.

can anyone please tell me what the "I love you" sign would be Dylan 'flashed' to Shasta? as he was bound and gagged, i'm not aware of what such a sign would be.

but i know for sure Shasta will never forget her brother's love for her. and with that thought tears are simply spilling down my face.

I assumed it was the ASL sign for it....index, pinky finger, and thumb extended, with the middle and ring fingers down.

[Shelayne]

I'm horrified with each new fact revealed.

can anyone please tell me what the "I love you" sign would be Dylan 'flashed' to Shasta? as he was bound and gagged, i'm not aware of what such a sign would be.

but i know for sure Shasta will never forget her brother's love for her. and with that thought tears are simply spilling down my face.

Floh~ that would probably be folding down your middle and ring finger w/ rest of them up (the thumb, the index, and pinkie) It's sign for "I love you" and they teach it to cub scouts. I wonder if Dylan was a scout. :(

[Floh]

Thanks to both of you for the information about ASL symbol for "I love you".

i'm grateful he was able to communicate that and i have no doubt Shasta returned the sign herself.

[jc9876]

The freaking torture those kids would have had to go through to have this POS stop and say "awww you're ruining my shot, act scared, you're not screaming enough" and how he probably stepped up his sadism each time.

I was hoping to find out that maybe he killed him quickly, but of course not.

Bless Dylan for having the courage to stand up in any way he could to this poor excuse for a human being. He's not a monster, he's a f***ing coward. And I'm sure that somewhere there is another one just like him reading these crimes and smiling, planning. Just like Duncan surely did when he read of other cases that may have inspired him.

And NO ONE saw this in him? Un freakin believable!!!

[IdahoMom]

Source say Duncan also used the camcorder to film what appear to be several attempts to kill the children. Each time, however, some gesture or action by the children would stop him. In one apparent attempt to slay Dylan, the boy — who was bound and gagged and unable to wiggle little more than his hands — flashed the "I love you" sign to his sister.

:mad: That is the saddest thing I have heard!:mad: Poor little kids!

[mysteriew]

I'm horrified with each new fact revealed.

can anyone please tell me what the "I love you" sign would be Dylan 'flashed' to Shasta? as he was bound and gagged, i'm not aware of what such a sign would be.

but i know for sure Shasta will never forget her brother's love for her. and with that thought tears are simply spilling down my face.

In a lot of schools, and on some tv programing they teach kids some of the language used with the deaf. I am thinking that is probably something similiar. Though the symbol that I am thinking of uses the crossing of arms over the heart and if Dylan's hands were bound, he would have been unable to do that.
I cannot imagine the horror! I am going to stop for now, I cannot comment, because I cannot let myself imagine, or even think of this. I cannot.

[kk's mom]

I'm horrified with each new fact revealed.

can anyone please tell me what the "I love you" sign would be Dylan 'flashed' to Shasta? as he was bound and gagged, i'm not aware of what such a sign would be.

but i know for sure Shasta will never forget her brother's love for her. and with that thought tears are simply spilling down my face.

Mine too Floh, mine too! I'm heartbroken. I'm absolutely devastated. To find out that children were put through such torment. This guy's gotta go. I am at a lost for words but the tears won't stop. Bless little Dylan and the love he had for his sister and bless her little heart for the love she had for her brother and what she has to live with for the rest of her life. I'm truly shocked. It can't get any worse, can it?

[kk's mom]

I assumed it was the ASL sign for it....index, pinky finger, and thumb extended, with the middle and ring fingers down.

My daughter and I do that too each other when I drop her off at school. She's Dylan's age. She gets out of the car, turns around at the door and flashes me the sign. I'm so unbelievably devastated right now. Just crying my eyes out. That poor child.

[surf_moon_stars]

That is the symbol for me and my child ALL THE TIME...

WE use it all the time, when that sign goes up to eachother, we know
all is good....


I will never not think of Dylan and Shasta without using this symbol.


God Bless you sweet Dylan, (Brenda, Slade and Mark)

[Cowgirl]

Is this guy in a county jail? I would hate for some locals to get themselves in trouble trying to lynch him. If we could just lock him up with a hungry lion for a while, or in a shark tank, but they won't allow justice. They just allow protecting the public.

I wonder how his jailers can stand it.

[surf_moon_stars]

My thoughts exactly cowgirl...


I am feeling the same way about that, knowing the man they have, who
they have to feed (does not deserve a scarp of anything) has done all of this,
and it keeps unfolding.

I truly don't think this guy is going to make it too far thru the system.... :clap:

[lady-eowyn]

Unbelievable...what a sick *&^%

[kpass]

http://www.delta.edu/jfrohm/sign/iloveyou-sm.jpg

I Googled it...This is heartwrenching :sick: I say HANG HIM!!!!!!!!!!!

[TexMex]

Is this guy in a county jail? I would hate for some locals to get themselves in trouble trying to lynch him. If we could just lock him up with a hungry lion for a while, or in a shark tank, but they won't allow justice. They just allow protecting the public.

I wonder how his jailers can stand it.


I'd like to leave him alone in a room, handcuffed- with Dylan and Shasta's Dad and a hammer for about ten minutes.

[Shazzie]

Thanks to both of you for the information about ASL symbol for "I love you".

i'm grateful he was able to communicate that and i have no doubt Shasta returned the sign herself.
Here's what it looks like:

http://www5e.biglobe.ne.jp/~shuwa516/images/Sign.gif

Sorry this is so large. I don't have time to resize is right now.

The pinky represents the letter "I", and the thumb and forefinger stand for "L". The whole thing has become a shorthand sign meaning "I love you."

[Incognito]

Is this guy in a county jail? I would hate for some locals to get themselves in trouble trying to lynch him. If we could just lock him up with a hungry lion for a while, or in a shark tank, but they won't allow justice. They just allow protecting the public.

I wonder how his jailers can stand it.
I believe he is in jail here. 30 minute visits....hmmm

http://www.co.kootenai.id.us/departments/sheriff/

[Cowgirl]

I don't think he should share the air of civilized people, but then putting him out of his misery...I just don't know. I wish we were more of an "eye for an eye" country. I don't think swine like Duncan deserve to be treated like humans when they are obviously not.

I want him scared. I don't care about hurting him, I care about him being afraid like those children were. I want him begging for help and knowing it won't come. It just isn't fair. At times like this, I wish I believed in God. Death is too easy, but letting him live means he could hurt someone else.

[Shazzie]

http://www.inlander.com/localnews/298391639739380.php

Source say Duncan also used the camcorder to film what appear to be several attempts to kill the children. Each time, however, some gesture or action by the children would stop him. In one apparent attempt to slay Dylan, the boy — who was bound and gagged and unable to wiggle little more than his hands — flashed the "I love you" sign to his sister.I can't stop thinking about the LE personnel who have to view this video footage--some repeatedly, no doubt. It's almost more than I can stand just to read about it. I cannot even imagine having to watch the video.

I feel so much respect and admiration for the brave men and women who have to investigate every detail of these horrific events, in order to put together an airtight case against the b@st@rd. My hat is truly off to them. They are my heroes.

[Casshew]

Well, if they have the footage - they should not require any testimony at all from Shasta...

what a sick SOB this animal is, there are no words to describe him.. heartless, souless :razz:

This new revelatiion is just devestating... I would not want to be a juror viewing it.

[kk's mom]

Well, if they have the footage - they should not require any testimony at all from Shasta...

what a sick SOB this animal is, there are no words to describe him.. heartless, souless :razz:

This new revelatiion is just devestating... I would not want to be a juror viewing it.

How could a lawyer defend this pond scum? If I were a public defender and was assigned to this piece of garbage, I'd quit. I'd rather stand in the unemployment line. Actually, it's guys like this that if I were a public defender I'd rethink my goals as an attorney and jump the fence to the other side to make sure pieces of garbage like this are dealt with and don't hurt anymore children.

Those children should not have had to go through this. I hope that anyone that was involved in letting this guy out on bail lose alot of sleep about this.

I'm so upset and so furious at the same time, I just can't stand it.

[Floh]

How could a lawyer defend this pond scum? If I were a public defender and was assigned to this piece of garbage, I'd quit. I'd rather stand in the unemployment line. Actually, it's guys like this that if I were a public defender I'd rethink my goals as an attorney and jump the fence to the other side to make sure pieces of garbage like this are dealt with and don't hurt anymore children.

Those children should not have had to go through this. I hope that anyone that was involved in letting this guy out on bail lose alot of sleep about this.

I'm so upset and so furious at the same time, I just can't stand it.

I hope anyone who was involved in advancing him money kills themselves. because they aren't fit to live after handing out death sentences to this family.

[nanandjim]

This is absolutely unreal. I still hope that they ask Shasta about the convenience store and why she was allowed to walk around in the store and also where they were headed and why they stopped in her hometown.

It sounds like this idiot discussed everything with this child. God help her recover emotionally, mentally and physically.

[bakerprune64]

:mad: I'm still kind of new here, but as I sit and read this thread, the tears are streaming down my face. I have an 8 year old daughter and a 9 year old daughter and couldn't imagine a child this age(8) being able to articulate this horrific crime. My god what has our world come to that monsters like this are free to walk the earth and violate innocent babies?:furious:

[KrazyKollector]

Floh~ that would probably be folding down your middle and ring finger w/ rest of them up (the thumb, the index, and pinkie) It's sign for "I love you" and they teach it to cub scouts. I wonder if Dylan was a scout. :(I taught that to my kids when they were very young. That way, I could communicate my feelings to them without embarrassing them, as they got older.

I still use it to this day. After today, it will have new meaning for me, as an expression of love not only to my children, but as that and an honor to Dylan and Shasta.

I don't know why, but this case has bothered me more than any other ever has. My heart has just been broken for their family and I pray everyday that Shasta will continue getting help forever. I think that right now, she is in a type of shock. She knows what happened but it hasn't hit yet. I continue to feel very scared for Shasta and will keep her in my heart.

[DuckFeet]

To BakerPrune- are you the same BakerPrune from ABC30.com message board? Welcome aboard!!!!!!

[BillyGoatGruff]

I can't stop thinking about the LE personnel who have to view this video footage--some repeatedly, no doubt. It's almost more than I can stand just to read about it. I cannot even imagine having to watch the video.

I feel so much respect and admiration for the brave men and women who have to investigate every detail of these horrific events, in order to put together an airtight case against the b@st@rd. My hat is truly off to them. They are my heroes.
Hard tio imagine how they could restrain themselves from beating this ogre todeath.

[less0305]

This bastard better not even put a jury through watching this evidence. He best plead guilty and beg for the death penalty!!!! and save everyone the heartache!!!!!

[bakerprune64]

To BakerPrune- are you the same BakerPrune from ABC30.com message board? Welcome aboard!!!!!!
Yep, it's me duck, and which one are you on Abc30? Thanks for the welcome.

[Floh]

I taught that to my kids when they were very young. That way, I could communicate my feelings to them without embarrassing them, as they got older.

I still use it to this day. After today, it will have new meaning for me, as an expression of love not only to my children, but as that and an honor to Dylan and Shasta.

I don't know why, but this case has bothered me more than any other ever has. My heart has just been broken for their family and I pray everyday that Shasta will continue getting help forever. I think that right now, she is in a type of shock. She knows what happened but it hasn't hit yet. I continue to feel very scared for Shasta and will keep her in my heart.

KrazyKollector , this case has bothered me more than any other i have read about too.

i followed the Jackson case last, as i was horrified this monster Jackson might walk free to molest again.

but, but, but . . . he was nothing compared to the events which are unfolding here.

altho, i honestly, honestly believe paedophiles continue on a downward slope. i'm not cutting out the possibility paedophiles who think they are being 'loving' and there is nothing wrong with sharing their beeeeeeeed won't descend into the depraved depths this character has.

and, what's more, this character's story hasn't given them fantasies anew.

bigger and better fantasies.

oh nooooooooooooooo. now i will fall asleep to that thought. :(

[newtv]

Oh my gosh! Each day reveals a new horror poor Shasta and Dylan had to endure at the hands of this monster! She must have seen this piece of **** actually murder her brother!

He filmed it! OMG! I'm just sick!

When are law makers going to get it through their head, you cannot rehabilitate these scum?! Lock em up FOREVER!!!! Execute them! They are a blight on society!

JMHO
fran
well i think the tape will eliminate any need for shasta to testify-they do not need her if they have this stuff on tape.

[Linda7NJ]

I'd like to leave him alone in a room, handcuffed- with Dylan and Shasta's Dad and a hammer for about ten minutes.
10 minutes ..hammer? Please!~ Send him to the Cowgirl and me....we could think of far worse!!!

[crocus]

I don't think he should share the air of civilized people, but then putting him out of his misery...I just don't know. I wish we were more of an "eye for an eye" country. I don't think swine like Duncan deserve to be treated like humans when they are obviously not.

I want him scared. I don't care about hurting him, I care about him being afraid like those children were. I want him begging for help and knowing it won't come. It just isn't fair. At times like this, I wish I believed in God. Death is too easy, but letting him live means he could hurt someone else.


Oh yeah....."scared" like he has never been before....and begging for mercy, God help me mercy that won't EVER come.....

[SewingDeb]

Well, if they have the footage - they should not require any testimony at all from Shasta...

what a sick SOB this animal is, there are no words to describe him.. heartless, souless :razz:

This new revelatiion is just devestating... I would not want to be a juror viewing it.

With our system, it will probably be considered too inflammatory to show the jury. :banghead:

[Cowgirl]

10 minutes ..hammer? Please!~ Send him to the Cowgirl and me....we could think of far worse!!!I have the pickup truck, Linda, you got a rope? Chains will do too. And I have an extra car battery...

[AdoraBlue]

I can't stop thinking about the LE personnel who have to view this video footage--some repeatedly, no doubt. It's almost more than I can stand just to read about it. I cannot even imagine having to watch the video.

I feel so much respect and admiration for the brave men and women who have to investigate every detail of these horrific events, in order to put together an airtight case against the b@st@rd. My hat is truly off to them. They are my heroes.Pray, plead, incant, beseech to your Supreme Being(s) that these LE heroes learn something (ETA about what causes these evil beings to develop, how they operate, etc.,) from this tape. That (and his conviction/penalty) is the only glimmer of good that can be obtained from this evil.

[TexMex]

10 minutes ..hammer? Please!~ Send him to the Cowgirl and me....we could think of far worse!!!


Yeah, I guess 10 minutes would be too quick but it would give Steve a chance to release some anger and give the scumbag a piece of his mind.



quote=TexMex

I'd like to leave him alone in a room, handcuffed- with Dylan and Shasta's Dad and a hammer for about ten minutes.

[Cowgirl]

Pray, plead, incant, beseech to your Supreme Being(s) that these LE heroes learn something (ETA about what causes these evil beings to develop, how they operate, etc.,) from this tape. That (and his conviction/penalty) is the only glimmer of good that can be obtained from this evil.Someone posted a feelgood thread for praying and reflection. I stay away from there because I am an atheist and I see nothing of any God in this subject. Maybe some can find a way to FORGIVE this sob, but it is rather telling that even the Christians want this scumbag to die slowly and painfully. I don't think LE will learn much from this horrid tape but perhaps it will save this sweet innocent girl from having to talk about what happened to her that is embarrassing because it is on tape. That is about all the good I can see in it.

[AdoraBlue]

Someone posted a feelgood thread for praying and reflection. I stay away from there because I am an atheist and I see nothing of any God in this subject. Maybe some can find a way to FORGIVE this sob, but it is rather telling that even the Christians want this scumbag to die slowly and painfully. I don't think LE will learn much from this horrid tape but perhaps it will save this sweet innocent girl from having to talk about what happened to her that is embarrassing because it is on tape. That is about all the good I can see in it.
I have no forgiveness or mercy in my heart for the monster that is JED (or any sexual/violent predators/criminals).

When I mentioned learning something from these tapes, I was referring to agents working in the FBI Investigative Support Unit and Child Abduction and Serial Killer Unit. They need to know all they can from pseudo-humans such as JED, Rader, Derrick Todd Lee, etc. The next monster might not walk into a well-lighted restaurant with a victim in tow and any information/insight gleaned from any case might well save somebody's life.

From the time I could think, the why's have haunted me.

I was also wondering about your second point, that the tapes could definitely be used to obtain the DP against JED without sweet Shasta having to testify.
It seems to me that it is entirely possible. Does anyone know if there is a legal precedent for this? Or for videotaped testimony/deposition or closed-circuit testimony?

[Cowgirl]

I have no forgiveness or mercy in my heart for the monster that is JED (or any sexual/violent predators/criminals).

When I mentioned learning something from these tapes, I was referring to agents working in the FBI Investigative Support Unit and Child Abduction and Serial Killer Unit. They need to know all they can from pseudo-humans such as JED, Rader, Derrick Todd Lee, etc. The next monster might not walk into a well-lighted restaurant with a victim in tow and any information/insight gleaned from any case might well save somebody's life.

From the time I could think, the why's have haunted me.

I was also wondering about your second point, that the tapes could definitely be used to obtain the DP against JED without sweet Shasta having to testify.
It seems to me that it is entirely possible. Does anyone know if there is a legal precedent for this? Or for videotaped testimony/deposition or closed-circuit testimony? :waitasec: I didn't even mention the death penalty in my post, so I don't know what you meant when you said:

I was also wondering about your second point, that the tapes could definitely be used to obtain the DP against JED without sweet Shasta having to testify.

Nevertheless, a lot is still to be determined in this regard. Some states routinely allow child victims to testify on closed circuit TV so that they do not have to face the defendant at all. I don't know if Idaho is one of them, but I am sure the Feds allow that. And I was specifically speaking of the molestation part. While I don't think LE can learn much about the pervert by looking at the tape, it may speak for what he did to the kids and therefore make it possible for Shasta not to have to tell them over and over and over what Duncan did to her sexually. The tape could speak for her -- not for the kidnapping but certainly for the detail of the molestations and perhaps in regard to what he did to Dylan.

I am hoping that there is enough other evidence of what this mad man did to Brenda and her son Slade and Mark that they won't be using Shasta for that. She probably did not see the actual murders, so she may not be required to testify about that. I am hoping that if she does have to testify for the State of Idaho on the murders that she will only have to identify the man who was in her house, tied her up, put her outside, and then came back and took her away. Surely she could ID him without being in open court? (Rhetorical question)

[richandfamous]

I have to say that I am horrified by what he has done. I am also horrified that he was also brutalized as a child by big men in his family and when he acted out his rage by brutilizing another boy he was put in a cell and brutilized by others, one of them being, "Big Al" in ways that most of us have never imagined. It is no excuse for what he has done but I do want to bring you the possible parallels in what he has done and what has been done to him. I am NO liberal by any means and think he should be put to death because he is a threat to society but I see how you all want to get into his cell and brutalize him for what he has done...to late....that has already happened to him...the only horrible thing that hasn't been done to him is that someone has not killed him yet!.
We don't know what age this all started for him...2yrs old, 3yrs old. That is what makes a monster folks...full blown.
That said...I have no sympathy for him and want him executed.

[AdoraBlue]

[QUOTE=Cowgirl]:waitasec: I didn't even mention the death penalty in my post, so I don't know what you meant when you said:

I was also wondering about your second point, that the tapes could definitely be used to obtain the DP against JED without sweet Shasta having to testify.

I was speaking of the DP in the context of the conditions that Steve Groene placed (via Geraldo's statement on the O'Reilly show) on the question of LWOP vs DP for JED.

I personally am in favor of a swift and public execution for this pseudo-human. Set an example. :furious:

However, I still believe there is possibly something to be learned from the tapes that might lead us to the what or why that creates these monsters.

[Floh]

I have to say that I am horrified by what he has done. I am also horrified that he was also brutalized as a child by big men in his family and when he acted out his rage by brutilizing another boy he was put in a cell and brutilized by others, one of them being, "Big Al" in ways that most of us have never imagined. It is no excuse for what he has done but I do want to bring you the possible parallels in what he has done and what has been done to him. I am NO liberal by any means and think he should be put to death because he is a threat to society but I see how you all want to get into his cell and brutalize him for what he has done...to late....that has already happened to him...the only horrible thing that hasn't been done to him is that someone has not killed him yet!.
We don't know what age this all started for him...2yrs old, 3yrs old. That is what makes a monster folks...full blown.
That said...I have no sympathy for him and want him executed.

Was he brutalised as a child? i must have missed some posts/news pertaining to this.

[Cowgirl]

Was he brutalised as a child? i must have missed some posts/news pertaining to this.He whined about it in his blog saying he had been a victim countless times and such. I don't believe it. I think some monsters are just wired wrong from the start. I don't think his "permissive father" and "disciplinarian/dance teacher/delusional-in-denial" mother have much to do with it. He alleged he was the victim of incest at the hands of his sister. I think he is the victim of his own sick mind.

I am just grateful that this kind of monster only comes along once in a while.

[Cowgirl]

[QUOTE=Cowgirl]:waitasec: I didn't even mention the death penalty in my post, so I don't know what you meant when you said:

I was also wondering about your second point, that the tapes could definitely be used to obtain the DP against JED without sweet Shasta having to testify.

I was speaking of the DP in the context of the conditions that Steve Groene placed (via Geraldo's statement on the O'Reilly show) on the question of LWOP vs DP for JED.

I personally am in favor of a swift and public execution for this pseudo-human. Set an example. :furious:

However, I still believe there is possibly something to be learned from the tapes that might lead us to the what or why that creates these monsters.I don't know what could possibly be learned by viewing a kiddy porn tape, but just the idea of the tapes being used in any way at all scares me. As long as they exist, there is the chance they will get in the wrong hands or be copied by someone. I just hope these tapes don't manage to get out of the hands of LE somehow. That would just be devastating. So I hope they are locked up and guarded without having them just placed in some evidence room where too many people have access and all of a sudden they are on the internet. That is my chief worry about the tapes.

As far as a swift and public execution goes... unfortunately that can't happen either. First, the existing laws would have to be changed to allow it. And that takes time, so right away, nothing is swift. Public? That is a possibility. But I think it is rather anticlimactic to see someone strapped to a gurney and an IV stuck in their arm and then they are no longer breathing. It was far more dramatic when they had public hangings, and that is what we should return to, in my estimation. We are far too civilized with putting these pigs to sleep. Maybe if they feared their momma seeing them having their scrawny neck snapped they might think twice before they do things to innocent children.

The rights of the monsters in our society are far too important. What about the rights of the kids? When a pig like this violates a little kid's rights he should lose all of his rights. I just don't care how he got that way.

[AdoraBlue]

"I just hope these tapes don't manage to get out of the hands of LE somehow. That would just be devastating."

Good point, had not crossed my mind. Surely this evidence is sealed and hopefully very secure. The Groene family has been exploited beyond belief already.

"It was far more dramatic when they had public hangings, and that is what we should return to, in my estimation."

That is exactly the kind of thing I am envisioning. I have a few nice trees in my yard I would volunteer to hang this pseudo-human from.

"I just don't care how he got that way."

I'll agree to disagree with you on this point cause I do care about why. I believe the "whys" and "whats" will ultimately be a part of prediction and prevention of heinous crimes.

P.S. When I question "why" and "what" regarding these monsters, I am not looking for an excuse or justification, rather whether LE might one day develop some method of screening or prediction process that could stop a monster before it offended at all.

[Sofia]

I don't know what could possibly be learned by viewing a kiddy porn tape, but just the idea of the tapes being used in any way at all scares me. As long as they exist, there is the chance they will get in the wrong hands or be copied by someone. I just hope these tapes don't manage to get out of the hands of LE somehow.
There's a lot of talk in the blog and panda site about making movies, etc. Considering JED's computer abilities and online friends, I just hope that he was in the woods so long and afraid to take Shasta out that he never got a chance to get near a computer.

[Sofia]

He whined about it in his blog saying he had been a victim countless times and such. I don't believe it. I think some monsters are just wired wrong from the start. I don't think his "permissive father" and "disciplinarian/dance teacher/delusional-in-denial" mother have much to do with it. He alleged he was the victim of incest at the hands of his sister. I think he is the victim of his own sick mind.

I am just grateful that this kind of monster only comes along once in a while.
I think he probably was abused. It doesn't excuse his actions. I think that as with everything in life, it's a mixture of nature/nurture. Or lack thereof.

[Cowgirl]

"I just hope these tapes don't manage to get out of the hands of LE somehow. That would just be devastating."

Good point, had not crossed my mind. Surely this evidence is sealed and hopefully very secure. The Groene family has been exploited beyond belief already.

"It was far more dramatic when they had public hangings, and that is what we should return to, in my estimation."

That is exactly the kind of thing I am envisioning. I have a few nice trees in my yard I would volunteer to hang this pseudo-human from.

"I just don't care how he got that way."

I'll agree to disagree with you on this point cause I do care about why. I believe the "whys" and "whats" will ultimately be a part of prediction and prevention of heinous crimes.

P.S. When I question "why" and "what" regarding these monsters, I am not looking for an excuse or justification, rather whether LE might one day develop some method of screening or prediction process that could stop a monster before it offended at all.I understand. I used to be really curious about how they "got that way." And then I just got fed up with the abuse excuse.

Did you read the stuff posted yesterday about the parole reports? A lot of smart people spent a lot of time and effort trying to figure the guy out. They knew he was dangerous and tried to warn officials. In the end, they could not stop the guy from getting out despite how poorly he did on parole. In the end, the powers that be just stopped listening. But when you read the 28 pages of reports, one thing is constant: the only time Duncan participated in any kind of treatment for what ailed him was when it was made clear to him that he would not be paroled without it. After he was revoked, he knew he only had about 3 years at the most and would not participate in treatment at all. Their rules for civil commitment are such that they had to have the word "predator" in the description and because that was not in the "sexual deviant, schizoid sadist" description, he got out. The shrinks all knew. The administrators just pushed their papers. And this animal got out.

It is really not that I don't think it is important to know how humans are turned into animals. I just am more concerned about locking up the animals now and I will let someone else worry about how they got that way! Just a personal preference. We each only have just so much compassion and I don't want to waste a bit of it on the animals.

[Cowgirl]

There's a lot of talk in the blog and panda site about making movies, etc. Considering JED's computer abilities and online friends, I just hope that he was in the woods so long and afraid to take Shasta out that he never got a chance to get near a computer.Oh, ugh. I didn't think of that idea, Sofia. I was just thinking that evidence goes missing sometimes. And sometimes a clerk or a cop is careless with the way evidence is stored.

There have been huge scandals where I live in Texas where a whole group of people were framed for drug trafficking and the evidence turned out to be chalk. The scandal caused a lot of probable drug people to be let loose. It also caused a lot of probable innocent people to be charged and jailed wrongly. And a few bad cops lost their jobs and/or went to jail. But lost in the whole scandal is the very real possibility that there were real drugs involved and that someone, probably in law enforcement, took real drugs and put the chalk in the evidence room...we shall probably never know what really happened. But when you hear about stuff like this you begin to realize that not all evidence rooms are secure and if tapes like these were not handled properly, they could get in the wrong hands.

The only thing I can think of that never ended up on the internet were the pictures of Michael Jackson's dappled dinky!

[Sofia]

The only thing I can think of that never ended up on the internet were the pictures of Michael Jackson's dappled dinky!
I'm still working on getting that key, Cowgirl. ;)

[BillyGoatGruff]

I understand. I used to be really curious about how they "got that way." And then I just got fed up with the abuse excuse.

Did you read the stuff posted yesterday about the parole reports? A lot of smart people spent a lot of time and effort trying to figure the guy out. They knew he was dangerous and tried to warn officials. In the end, they could not stop the guy from getting out despite how poorly he did on parole. In the end, the powers that be just stopped listening. But when you read the 28 pages of reports, one thing is constant: the only time Duncan participated in any kind of treatment for what ailed him was when it was made clear to him that he would not be paroled without it. After he was revoked, he knew he only had about 3 years at the most and would not participate in treatment at all. Their rules for civil commitment are such that they had to have the word "predator" in the description and because that was not in the "sexual deviant, schizoid sadist" description, he got out. The shrinks all knew. The administrators just pushed their papers. And this animal got out.

It is really not that I don't think it is important to know how humans are turned into animals. I just am more concerned about locking up the animals now and I will let someone else worry about how they got that way! Just a personal preference. We each only have just so much compassion and I don't want to waste a bit of it on the animals.
All I can figure out is that Duncan must have been badly sexually abused at a VERY early age. Possibly before the age of 4, when he was pre-verbal, to create the rage and deviancy we have seen from this man. Often times children abused so early in life are left with rage disorders and suffer from attachment disorders because their parents did nothing (in their eyes) to prevent the damage/harm to them, assuming the parents weren't the ones doing it themselves. The inability to trust their caregivers mutates over time into a severe sociopathy. That's all I can figure out abut this man. Doesn't excuse him, though.

[Cowgirl]

I'm still working on getting that key, Cowgirl. ;)Work fast, Sofia. He is going to court trying to get them back. Well, his mouthpieces are going to court, that is. I heard them discussing this on Nancy Grace last night. That pretty defense attorney Lisa Wayne said he won't get them though! Sneddon has grounds to keep them for "future cases" and even if no one goes to court, you and I know there will be more victims.

[Cowgirl]

All I can figure out is that Duncan must have been badly sexually abused at a VERY early age. Possibly before the age of 4, when he was pre-verbal, to create the rage and deviancy we have seen from this man. Often times children abused so early in life are left with rage disorders and suffer from attachment disorders because their parents did nothing (in their eyes) to prevent the damage/harm to them, assuming the parents weren't the ones doing it themselves. The inability to trust their caregivers mutates over time into a severe sociopathy. That's all I can figure out abut this man. Doesn't excuse him, though.Hmmm...well, Duncan says his sister did something to him. I think that is bull though. His relatives at his Thanksgiving video all look like they are family people uncomfortable with his presence. And if he had been assaulted in this way, why has he not mentioned it among all his other whining, I wonder? I know early abuse can end up with damaged people, but I also believe that some people are just bad. In fact, I have personally witnessed it. I had a close friend who had one lovely child and one devil child who never saw any abuse at all. He was just bad.

[fran]

There's a lot of talk in the blog and panda site about making movies, etc. Considering JED's computer abilities and online friends, I just hope that he was in the woods so long and afraid to take Shasta out that he never got a chance to get near a computer.

In the Thanksgiving family video, there's a picture of JED with a laptop, sitting on the couch, I believe. Since the last entry to his blog was dated 5/13/05, and the Groenes were attacked on 5/15/05, and because he told Shasta he'd watched them for 2 or 3 days or nights, IMO, he placed his last entry into his blog while he was watching them near CD.

JMHO
fran

[Cowgirl]

In the Thanksgiving family video, there's a picture of JED with a laptop, sitting on the couch, I believe. Since the last entry to his blog was dated 5/13/05, and the Groenes were attacked on 5/15/05, and because he told Shasta he'd watched them for 2 or 3 days or nights, IMO, he placed his last entry into his blog while he was watching them near CD.

JMHO
franWell, the cops may also come up with more purchases he made. When the cops searched his apartment and car in April, they took his laptop, his video equipment, and anything that might show pictures of those kids in Detroit Lakes. So, as much of a computer guy as he was, he probably bought another laptop, just like he bought the camcorder at Walmart in mid April. Either that or he made his blog entries from an internet cafe or library if he was getting paranoid about computer usage.

[fran]

Well, the cops may also come up with more purchases he made. When the cops searched his apartment and car in April, they took his laptop, his video equipment, and anything that might show pictures of those kids in Detroit Lakes. So, as much of a computer guy as he was, he probably bought another laptop, just like he bought the camcorder at Walmart in mid April. Either that or he made his blog entries from an internet cafe or library if he was getting paranoid about computer usage.

My guess is, he bought another laptop. Since he didn't pay his attorney fees with the $6500 he got from the doctor, he had enough $$ to spend over $700 at the store for his supplies, I'm sure he could have found a suitable laptop for under $1000. Also, since he did make posts after the April raid by LE, he was posting while on the run. Either an internet cafe, library, or new laptop, he had to have made his last entry while he was actually stalking the family. IMO....

JMHO
fran

[Cowgirl]

My guess is, he bought another laptop. Since he didn't pay his attorney fees with the $6500 he got from the doctor, he had enough $$ to spend over $700 at the store for his supplies, I'm sure he could have found a suitable laptop for under $1000. Also, since he did make posts after the April raid by LE, he was posting while on the run. Either an internet cafe, library, or new laptop, he had to have made his last entry while he was actually stalking the family. IMO....

JMHO
franYeah, that would be my thought too. He was too interested in computers to go without one. But I wonder why that info is not in the list of other stuff they have mentioned? Well, maybe he bought other things at Walmart that they didn't mention too. Maybe they just mentioned stuff that related directly to the crime. I wonder how much a pocket camcorder goes for? And the goggles too.

[ISPTRAX]

I think he probably was abused. It doesn't excuse his actions. I think that as with everything in life, it's a mixture of nature/nurture. Or lack thereof.

Well, I was too. And I'm not out there molesting and killing kids and adults. He's demonized, that's the only explanation for a mind as twisted as his.

[indigomood]

The only thing I can think of that never ended up on the internet were the pictures of Michael Jackson's dappled dinky!

I'm still working on getting that key, Cowgirl. ;)

Here you go, be forewarned it's not a pretty sight... *warning graphic image*

MJ's spotted dick (http://www.fscwv.edu/users/rheffner/ydkd/images/spotted.jpg)

[nanandjim]

I think that I just heard on Fox that Dylan died trying to defend/protect Shasta. I just put into words the disgust that I feel for this sicko.

[Cowgirl]

I think that I just heard on Fox that Dylan died trying to defend/protect Shasta. I just put into words the disgust that I feel for this sicko.How would they know that? And what kept her alive once he was dead? The police said he was alive until about a week before she was spotted in Denny's. And they also said something about Duncan trying to videotape the murder of Dylan. I don't know how one uses a shotgun and a videocamera at the same time though.

[Tom'sGirl]

How would they know that? And what kept her alive once he was dead? The police said he was alive until about a week before she was spotted in Denny's.
Good two questions, I too would like to know!

[surf_moon_stars]

How would they know that? And what kept her alive once he was dead? The police said he was alive until about a week before she was spotted in Denny's. And they also said something about Duncan trying to videotape the murder of Dylan. I don't know how one uses a shotgun and a videocamera at the same time though.

____________________________________________
Quote:
Originally posted by; tomsgirl


Good two questions, I too would like to know!
_____________________________________________

A tripod could have been (used ) to have his
hands free to try and do this on video. :(

[Mathew]

Those who have “Normal” sexual experiences and those who have “deviant” sexual experiences both derive a sense of pleasure. Both make a “choice” to have the experience and it is the pleasure that brings them to desire repeating that experience. The society one lives in sets the bar for what is considered normal. The reaction toward those who exceed the acceptable is also societal. The disconnect with those societal norms that allows a Duncan or the most minor sexual offender to make inappropriate “choices” are frequently traced to a momma Lillian, a grandpa Earl or even the spoiling Joseph Jr., but not always. (JET appears to have siblings that have managed to avoid any detected deviant traits.) It is addiction to this deviance that results in the destruction we see in a Duncan. Becoming addicted to sexual pleasure is every bit as compelling as any drug. It is also progressive much like heroin or alcohol addiction. As the addiction progresses, paranoia develops concerning the forces that may restrict ones ability to satisfy the addiction. At some point the desire to satisfy the addiction, the paranoia, the original inability to make appropriate choices, and all of the experiences one has had along the way, combine and result in a complete disconnect with reality. Some have the ability to step in and out of that state (Ted Bundy). Some saw Duncan out of that state Shasta experienced the other side. Both of them may find it hard to recognize that the opposite side existed.

[Cowgirl]

Oh boy. That sounds like shrink talk. And it seems like the exact same answer I read on the thread called "Duncan's Parole Board Reports." Wow, it is the exact same response...hmmm.

I find anything that the other person is not okay with to be deviant. Not the social norms or what society deems blah X 3. If it is forced on someone, it is deviant. And it doesn't have to be sex. It can just be sadistic violence, like Duncan visited on Brenda Groene.

Duncan fantasized about violence since he was a kid. And he never submitted to any treatment offered that would discourage that.

[Mathew]

Oh boy. That sounds like shrink talk.

I find anything that the other person is not okay with to be deviant. Not the social norms or what society deems blah X 3. If it is forced on someone, it is deviant. And it doesn't have to be sex. It can just be sadistic violence, like Duncan visited on Brenda Groene.
Duncan fantasized about violence since he was a kid. And he never submitted to any treatment offered that would discourage that.Understanding what makes the monster a monster is very helpful in catching monsters. Just as you need to know a little about the behavior of fish before you can catch fish. Learning not to think like the fish is the trick! By the way the sadistic violance that was visited on Brenda is perhaps the ultimate progression of the addiction or just a necessary function of reaching his goal.
Don't let my "shrink talk" lead you to believe that I am justify this fish being a fish!

[SimonSays]

I was thinking... maybe he made Shasta hold the camera? I wouldn't put it past him.

I glanced around, and didn't see this posted anywhere... article from Yahoo earlier today, tells possibly how little Dylan was murdered. :(

Excerpt from the article:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050716/ap_on_re_us/idaho_missing_children;_ylt=AjvKXDhj7sbQkFODcqNH8g Gs0NUE;_ylu=X3oDMTA3MjBwMWtkBHNlYwM3MTg-

Meanwhile, additional details keep leaking into the open. The Pacific Northwest Inlander, a free weekly based in Spokane, Wash., reported on Thursday that officers had recovered a video camcorder from the stolen Jeep Duncan was driving and found footage of him abusing and threatening to kill the two children. The Inlander also reported that Dylan Groene was shot to death and his body was burned.

The newspaper cited unnamed sources who were working on the case. The FBI and Kootenai County sheriff's office declined to comment on the report.



How would they know that? And what kept her alive once he was dead? The police said he was alive until about a week before she was spotted in Denny's. And they also said something about Duncan trying to videotape the murder of Dylan. I don't know how one uses a shotgun and a videocamera at the same time though.

[BillyGoatGruff]

Hmmm...well, Duncan says his sister did something to him. I think that is bull though. His relatives at his Thanksgiving video all look like they are family people uncomfortable with his presence. And if he had been assaulted in this way, why has he not mentioned it among all his other whining, I wonder? I know early abuse can end up with damaged people, but I also believe that some people are just bad. In fact, I have personally witnessed it. I had a close friend who had one lovely child and one devil child who never saw any abuse at all. He was just bad.
Wellll, there is the multiple-molester grandpa...I can't imagine he only molested other people's kids, and not family as well.
I suspect the incest Duncan described with his sister was his acting out due to his being molested by a male family member, which he blamed on her. Which would be typical behavior for him, and most molesters, for that matter.

[Tom'sGirl]

I was thinking... maybe he made Shasta hold the camera? I wouldn't put it past him.

I glanced around, and didn't see this posted anywhere... article from Yahoo earlier today, tells possibly how little Dylan was murdered. :(

Excerpt from the article:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050716/ap_on_re_us/idaho_missing_children;_ylt=AjvKXDhj7sbQkFODcqNH8g Gs0NUE;_ylu=X3oDMTA3MjBwMWtkBHNlYwM3MTg-

Meanwhile, additional details keep leaking into the open. The Pacific Northwest Inlander, a free weekly based in Spokane, Wash., reported on Thursday that officers had recovered a video camcorder from the stolen Jeep Duncan was driving and found footage of him abusing and threatening to kill the two children. The Inlander also reported that Dylan Groene was shot to death and his body was burned.

The newspaper cited unnamed sources who were working on the case. The FBI and Kootenai County sheriff's office declined to comment on the report.Thanks Simon for the link, but some of it does not fit with what was released to the press. The press said that he took Shasta & Dylan inside the home to see what he had done, BUT this article states:

Although Shasta and her brother were taken to a waiting truck and did not witness the killings of her family, she said Duncan later showed her a FatMax brand hammer and told her he used it to kill the others, according to Sheriff's Detective Brad Maskell.

[Cowgirl]

I was thinking... maybe he made Shasta hold the camera? I wouldn't put it past him.

I glanced around, and didn't see this posted anywhere... article from Yahoo earlier today, tells possibly how little Dylan was murdered. :(

Excerpt from the article:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050716/ap_on_re_us/idaho_missing_children;_ylt=AjvKXDhj7sbQkFODcqNH8g Gs0NUE;_ylu=X3oDMTA3MjBwMWtkBHNlYwM3MTg-

Meanwhile, additional details keep leaking into the open. The Pacific Northwest Inlander, a free weekly based in Spokane, Wash., reported on Thursday that officers had recovered a video camcorder from the stolen Jeep Duncan was driving and found footage of him abusing and threatening to kill the two children. The Inlander also reported that Dylan Groene was shot to death and his body was burned.

The newspaper cited unnamed sources who were working on the case. The FBI and Kootenai County sheriff's office declined to comment on the report.It would surely help if we could read one comprehensive report instead of this leak here and that rumor there. I did read the report that said there was video footage of him abusing the kids and I think about the same time there was a report (all coming from a court hearing) that he tried to also tape a murder and there was also something about Dylan making some hand gesture that stopped the taping. Or stopped the murder? I don't see how that would be possible, but nonetheless, the whole thing is so shocking that who knows? Then of course there were a bunch of opinions and rumors about what kind of hand signal and were his hands bound...

Even the autopsy report would help. It was reported that he was cremated. That inspired rumors that Dylan was burned alive and Shasta was run through the fire--okay she isn't burned so maybe her hand was held to the fire... After that came conjecture that Dylan was burned to ashes which seems impossible--they had to have something to check the DNA--bones at least. Then the report about him being shot to death--they could not know that unless there was soft tissue or a hole in the skull. I know they are trying to be sensitive to the family, but the conjecture and rumors could be worse than the truth. If that is possible.

[Cowgirl]

Thanks Simon for the link, but some of it does not fit with what was released to the press. The press said that he took Shasta & Dylan inside the home to see what he had done, BUT this article states:

Although Shasta and her brother were taken to a waiting truck and did not witness the killings of her family, she said Duncan later showed her a FatMax brand hammer and told her he used it to kill the others, according to Sheriff's Detective Brad Maskell.See, another story that does not fit. But then on Nancy Grace they said Shasta was marched through the crime scene. Someone suggested Duncan made her go get clothes. Possible. Others said that was not in the court proceedings, but then there was talk about little footprints in the blood in the house. So who knows?

[Liz]

Tom'sGirl, I may be out of the loop on this but, the only report I've seen about Shasta being paraded back through the crime scene, was via Nancy Grace's Headline News show.

I am not buying into it; although I would not put something like that (or anything at all) past that slimeball sadist.

Along that same note, I've never seen any reports of Dylan being marched through the house. Not even on Nancy Grace.

If somebody here has seen other reports to substantiate what was reported via Grace, I'd sure like to see a post about it.

[Tom'sGirl]

Tom'sGirl, I may be out of the loop on this but, the only report I've seen about Shasta being paraded back through the crime scene, was via Nancy Grace's Headline News show.

I am not buying into it; although I would not put something like that (or anything at all) past that slimeball sadist.

Along that same note, I've never seen any reports of Dylan being marched through the house. Not even on Nancy Grace.

If somebody here has seen other reports to substantiate what was reported via Grace, I'd sure like to see a post about it.
Liz, I will try and find something to back up what was said about the children being brought back into the house.......in fact, it was discussed or posted somewhere on one of these links.

The LE had stated that the children had seen the murders & we all figured it had to be from footprints. THEN is was told later on in the case that the children had been brought back into the house.

[Liz]

Liz, I will try and find something to back up what was said about the children being brought back into the house.......in fact, it was discussed or posted somewhere on one of these links.

The LE had stated that the children had seen the murders & we all figured it had to be from footprints. THEN is was told later on in the case that the children had been brought back into the house.


I definitely recall us discussing how LE could be so certain the children were there at the time of the murders. And the possibility of the kid's footprints being left in some blood; because I was the one who suggested that was one way LE might be so sure that the kids were there are the time the crime occured.

Remember I was speculating, hoping and praying that the kids had run off into some secret hiding place in the woods.

Even so, there could have already been some blood on the floor, when Shasta came into the living room.

Don't knock yourself out, too hard, TG! It's not that important, that you need to put yourself to all that trouble. At least not to me.

Thanks for offering though. That's mighty thoughtful of you.

[Tom'sGirl]

See, another story that does not fit. But then on Nancy Grace they said Shasta was marched through the crime scene. Someone suggested Duncan made her go get clothes. Possible. Others said that was not in the court proceedings, but then there was talk about little footprints in the blood in the house. So who knows?Here is what was posted I THINK on the 12th...may be wrong on the date!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirielle
I just read on another post on WS that LE found the kids footprints inside the house tracked in the blood. Maybe JED made them take their clothes. Based on how much equipment the guy seemed to have just in computers...and nightscopes...and cameras...and scuba diving stuff (all a phallic substiute, I am sure), it wouldn't surprise me if he had tents and a sleeping bag. And maybe Mark and Brenda had camping equipment that he stole.

REPLY
There was a story on Nancy Grace about him having Shasta march through the crime scene--that she saw her mother's bloody body and I don't think she could not see her mother if her footprints were there--so that would make sense. I didn't hear how they knew that, but maybe that is what he did...had Shasta get some clothes. Poor child.

Has anyone said whose white truck it was that he took from the crime scene?

ETA:

Granted, there was no link, just what was reported by NG. If it's not factual, either was the report in the beginning when they found Shasta that she said "Dylan was at the house", or her grandmother Darlene saying Duncan was alive.

[Linda7NJ]

Here you go, be forewarned it's not a pretty sight... *warning graphic image*

MJ's spotted dick (http://www.fscwv.edu/users/rheffner/ydkd/images/spotted.jpg)
:slap: Such a TEASE you are! LOL

[Linda7NJ]

Tom'sGirl, I may be out of the loop on this but, the only report I've seen about Shasta being paraded back through the crime scene, was via Nancy Grace's Headline News show.

I am not buying into it; although I would not put something like that (or anything at all) past that slimeball sadist.

Along that same note, I've never seen any reports of Dylan being marched through the house. Not even on Nancy Grace.

If somebody here has seen other reports to substantiate what was reported via Grace, I'd sure like to see a post about it.
I adore Nancy, but she does seems to get the facts WRONG...... a lot.......especially at the "begining" of a case !

[dragonfly]

Speaking of talk show hosts...Did anyone happen to caught Geraldo tonight. If that show hasn't aired in your time zone, please plan to watch.
He talks about this case in detail.
It includes a phone interview with JED step mom
It includes photos of Wackman and Crary on network news.
It includes interview with Bill O'Reilly re the judge and the heat he plans to send his way.

[Mathew]

When is the press going to get on this guy Wacksman and for that matter the rest of those that "helped" Duncan. From the first day that I heard about this Wacksman I could tell that he has a great deal to do with what Duncan became. A detective from Fargo called him on the phone but he surely deserves a visit from the FBI.

[tjack1970]

The only thing I can think of that never ended up on the internet were the pictures of Michael Jackson's dappled dinky!
Bad Bad Visual:eek:

[tjack1970]

IMy heart has just been broken for their family and I pray everyday that Shasta will continue getting help forever. I think that right now, she is in a type of shock. She knows what happened but it hasn't hit yet. I continue to feel very scared for Shasta and will keep her in my heart.
Massive amounts of therapy and unconditional love is what she needs now and for many years to come

:twocents: :twocents: I always give more than my two cents- for what its worth. I am newly registered here. Please check out my mom's best friend -missing person Carolyn Dunn Avdeef

[tjack1970]

[
I personally am in favor of a swift and public execution for this pseudo-human. Set an example. :furious:

However, I still believe there is possibly something to be learned from the tapes that might lead us to the what or why that creates these monsters.
Swift would not be good enough to scare others from doing the same. We should have a punishment system like some of the third world countries. SCARE them so they won't want to do it. Force them to do hard labor for the rest of the lives under VERY medial conditions(not like in U.S. jails or prisons where they get to work out and eat balanced meals on taxpayer's money), or perhaps whip them while they carry the cross that we're going to hang them on at the top of the hill. Walk the plank, make THEM feel helpless. An eye for an eye. The bible said it. Which of course means some king probably threw it in there under his reign, but Scary enough to me.
Then again, who knows if those sickos have the capability to think rationally of the punishment they would get if caught. But it might make a little bit of a difference. A little bit can go a long way.........
:banghead: we need a better system of punishment for these people

would Michael Jackson want to be hung on a cross or caned and beaten in front of his mother (if guilty)? I think not.

my opinion and my opinion only, but it works for me

[tjack1970]

I am just grateful that this kind of monster only comes along once in a while.
We can only pray (or hope) that is true. There is a WORLD full of people out there. Just getting more full by the minute. More people, more sickos, more tragedies, more lives wasted.

Please check out my mom's best friend Missing Person Carolyn Dunn Avdeef