Hung, drawn and quartered

[Floh]

What i believe should be this monster's fate: revive an old English tradition especially for him and his ilk.

Until 1870, the full punishment for the crime was to be "Hung, drawn and quartered" in that the culprit would be:
1 Dragged on a hurdle to the place of execution
2 Hung (hanged) by the neck, but removed before death
3 Disembowelled, and the genitalia and entrails burned before the victim's eyes
4 Beheaded and the body divided into four parts (quartered).

More: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drawing_and_quartering

they did the above to those who committed treason, but i believe it more fitting for monsters.

this is my wish for the end to him. what would you like to see happen?

[TexMex]

I'd like to leave him alone in a room, handcuffed- with Dylan and Shasta's Dad and a hammer for about ten minutes. :twocents:

[lady-eowyn]

I don't care what happens to take his earthly life, but I do hope he burns in hell for an eternity :sick:

[gine]

Sounds more fitting than a simple needle in the arm. IMHO if we dolled out the punishment fitting to the crime then maybe some of this madness would stop. I think these guys should have done to them, exactly what they have done to their victim.

[surf_moon_stars]

orignally posted by me :D

Lethal injection is much too kind, and if he were in another country where you are (grossly punished ) just for stealing , let alone killing anyone, then this man would be put to death very quickly with all the evidence gathered.

This punishment would be well fitted for him in a country that still has the "old fashioned" way of taking care of criminals.


JMO

I posted this as well, and I am glad you posted what that old fashioned way of taking care of "the monster" could really be like if he did this back then.


Life in jail would definitely be a death sentence for him for a short time. :behindbar

He may not be the Prison queen anymore (as he bragged about in his picture log), at least not yet, and he does not have "Big Al" to take care of him, but I have a feeling that unless he is in MAJOR ISOLATION, he may enjoy now what he used to get then in jail as per his pics and sad acts of bragging about them :sick:

JMO

[Jade]

What i believe should be this monster's fate: revive an old English tradition especially for him and his ilk.

Until 1870, the full punishment for the crime was to be "Hung, drawn and quartered" in that the culprit would be:
1 Dragged on a hurdle to the place of execution
2 Hung (hanged) by the neck, but removed before death
3 Disembowelled, and the genitalia and entrails burned before the victim's eyes
4 Beheaded and the body divided into four parts (quartered).

More: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drawing_and_quartering

they did the above to those who committed treason, but i believe it more fitting for monsters.

this is my wish for the end to him. what would you like to see happen?

Having no experience with sexual sadism I may be making an incorrect assumption but some of the forms of punishment being offered seem to be right up this guys alley. I am already upset that poor Slade was probably played like a mouse to JED’s cat so I do not desire to please him any further with thoughts of violence especially that that would involve his genitals, which he is so obsessed with.

IMO

[SpringTxMom]

Death is too good...

http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=731992#post731992

[Linda7NJ]

What i believe should be this monster's fate: revive an old English tradition especially for him and his ilk.

Until 1870, the full punishment for the crime was to be "Hung, drawn and quartered" in that the culprit would be:
1 Dragged on a hurdle to the place of execution
2 Hung (hanged) by the neck, but removed before death
3 Disembowelled, and the genitalia and entrails burned before the victim's eyes
4 Beheaded and the body divided into four parts (quartered).

More: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drawing_and_quartering

they did the above to those who committed treason, but i believe it more fitting for monsters.

this is my wish for the end to him. what would you like to see happen?
I LOVE it!

[Casshew]

I try not to get caught up in the 'blood thirsty mob' mentailty but it's pretty hard not to with this monster.

I don't think becoming barbaric does us any good, I don't want the blood on my hands, having said that, I am 100% for the DP - it's a contradiction for me obviously, I am okay with the sterile sanitized death, but not the violent one.:truce:

[dannyodie]

Originally Posted by Floh
What i believe should be this monster's fate: revive an old English tradition especially for him and his ilk.

Until 1870, the full punishment for the crime was to be "Hung, drawn and quartered" in that the culprit would be:
1 Dragged on a hurdle to the place of execution
2 Hung (hanged) by the neck, but removed before death
3 Disembowelled, and the genitalia and entrails burned before the victim's eyes
4 Beheaded and the body divided into four parts (quartered).

More: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drawing_and_quartering

they did the above to those who committed treason, but i believe it more fitting for monsters.

this is my wish for the end to him. what would you like to see happen?

I can understand the rage that most of us feel about how this monster did this family and these poor innocent children, Even though I have offered not to pray for this mans soul, we all really should not want to revert to the kind of evil doings and thoughts as described above, I don't mean to undermind anyones thoughts or feelings about how one should be punished, the thought of what god has planned for those that do evil acts against others is far more greater than anything any of us could possibly imagine, knowing that is far more satisfying to me than to cast my own judgement. I myself have even stated that he should be fried to a crisp in the hot seat and burned, we all react in the same way when crimes like this happen, it certainly is an outrage that one human can do things to a fellow brother the way this man did. he is full of hate, and blames the rest of society for his problems, he chose his own path and fate and he should suffer the ultimate price for his crime.

[Cowgirl]

Having no experience with sexual sadism I may be making an incorrect assumption but some of the forms of punishment being offered seem to be right up this guys alley. I am already upset that poor Slade was probably played like a mouse to JED’s cat so I do not desire to please him any further with thoughts of violence especially that that would involve his genitals, which he is so obsessed with.

IMOActually, the more I read about this freak, the more I think you are right. He might like it too much. He may be a sexual sadist, but in prison he learned to enjoy being the victim too, so he might like the pain. The worst thing for him would be to be all alone and ignored. But for the safety of society, he needs to die.

[Shazzie]

I try not to get caught up in the 'blood thirsty mob' mentailty but it's pretty hard not to with this monster.

I don't think becoming barbaric does us any good, I don't want the blood on my hands, having said that, I am 100% for the DP - it's a contradiction for me obviously, I am okay with the sterile sanitized death, but not the violent one.:truce:NOTE: The following is NOT meant as a criticism of anyone else's views!

THANK YOU for this post, Casshew! You said exactly what I've been thinking but was afraid to say.

As horrifying as the actions of this POS are,I swear to God it would not make me feel ONE BIT BETTER to torture him or kill him in some extremely barbaric fashion. The idea simply does nothing for me WHATSOEVER. If anyone thinks that means there's something wrong with me, so be it. I can't help feeling this way.

The truth is, no matter what is done to him, it will not bring back Dylan or any of the others, and it will not erase one iota of the sufferings of any of his victims. I also do not believe there is any form of punishment that could make him feel genuine remorse, because I do not believe he is capable of that.

I could say more, but I think I'll stop here. I imagine I've already offended enough people as it is. :(

[Cowgirl]

NOTE: The following is NOT meant as a criticism of anyone else's views!

THANK YOU for this post, Casshew! You said exactly what I've been thinking but was afraid to say.

As horrifying as the actions of this POS are,I swear to God it would not make me feel ONE BIT BETTER to torture him or kill him in some extremely barbaric fashion. The idea simply does nothing for me WHATSOEVER. If anyone thinks that means there's something wrong with me, so be it. I can't help feeling this way.

The truth is, no matter what is done to him, it will not bring back Dylan or any of the others, and it will not erase one iota of the sufferings of any of his victims. I also do not believe there is any form of punishment that could make him feel genuine remorse, because I do not believe he is capable of that.

I could say more, but I think I'll stop here. I imagine I've already offended enough people as it is. :(Nah, you aren't offending anyone, Shaz. People are just frustrated that there appears to be nothing that can be done to fix this. No matter what happens, the damage is done. I really think those of us spewing about what we would like to do to him are just appalled at the depravity of the guy and are reacting to that. And so many times in the past, a pervert like this whines about his rights while depriving everyone else of theirs so brutally. Making little kids the victims of his rage--using that method to "pay back society" is just beyond sick.

I hope it makes him happy that he has actually made things worse for perverts like him. If you read the links that Dragonfly provided today, you see that a lot of those who examined him warned over and over that he was a danger but his boyfriends insisted they were all wrong...sheesh.

[blueclouds]

This is too good for him. I can think of 7 weeks of torture style techniques that would not only keep him alive during that time, but have the most excruciating pain he could ever imagine. After day 2, he'd begggggggggggggg me to kill him....

But I wouldn't, no no no no no! After 7 weeks of that, I'd hand him over to some hells angels and Shasta's father. They can finish him how they'd like.

After that's finally accomplished, I can only PRAY THAT GOD would have him in the worst hell imaginable for all eternity. Then, maybe, it would be justice!

[Shazzie]

Nah, you aren't offending anyone, Shaz. People are just frustrated that there appears to be nothing that can be done to fix this. No matter what happens, the damage is done. I really think those of us spewing about what we would like to do to him are just appalled at the depravity of the guy and are reacting to that. And so many times in the past, a pervert like this whines about his rights while depriving everyone else of theirs so brutally. Making little kids the victims of his rage--using that method to "pay back society" is just beyond sick.

I hope it makes him happy that he has actually made things worse for perverts like him. If you read the links that Dragonfly provided today, you see that a lot of those who examined him warned over and over that he was a danger but his boyfriends insisted they were all wrong...sheesh.
Thanks for understanding. I completely understand the frustration people are feeling myself. I do share it, even though my response to it is a little different.

Yes, it is astounding the way he kept getting out of jail over and over again. The way his boyfriends kept going to bat for him truly blows my mind. I'll bet this case will be studied in law schools, criminal justice classrooms, and LE training programs for years to come. It perfectly exemplifies all the ways in which the safeguards that have been put in place to keep somebody like Duncan locked up can fail...and how disastrous the outcome can be when they do.

[Cowgirl]

Thanks for understanding. I completely understand the frustration people are feeling myself. I do share it, even though my response to it is a little different.

Yes, it is astounding the way he kept getting out of jail over and over again. The way his boyfriends kept going to bat for him truly blows my mind. I'll bet this case will be studied in law schools, criminal justice classrooms, and LE training programs for years to come. It perfectly exemplifies all the ways in which the safeguards that have been put in place to keep somebody like Duncan locked up can fail...and how disastrous the outcome can be when they do.While he was out on parole he was messing up over and over, which tells you he had no intention of reforming himself from day one. He got in mess after mess and then just took off. When the FBI picked him up in Kansas City, it was all over because he had absconded (tantamount to escape in prison terms). So they revoked him despite Wacksman pleading with them. The jerk has two kids he cared less about than that little...punk. And when the punk went back to prison, he knew he was only a couple years from completing the sentence. He would not play any of their games at all, which should have been a red flag for them to do something toward civil commitment. They knew from those parole reports that he was a danger and they all said he needed treatment and was unwilling.

I wonder what happened after he got out. The punk went right to Fargo, obviously to be near the good doctor. But the doctor moved to Florida after a while. Now, I wonder why that was? I bet there is a story there of some kind. The doctor risked his reputation to vouch for him -- that could have ruined his practice as a pediatrician, easily. Then he moved to New Port Richey and his wife (who is also a doctor) became a pharmacist. Hmmm... and the doctor has been going to school down in Fort Lauderdale. Oh, I bet we learn more about this guy. And Crary too. Woelfert is/was just a big trick, but at least he has the conscience to feel guilty about being dumb. I wonder if he helped out financially too?

Anyway, it seems the prison officials and head shrinkers knew this guy was bad news but they also found it a losing battle keeping him locked up. The punk worked the system. And after his apparent self-rehabilitation upon release? Bull. He was always thinking like a perv and it was always just a matter of time. He had these sick ideas when he was a little kid.

[dannyodie]

hey, just pour sticky gooey honey all over him, hang him out in a hot forest where fire ants thrive and let them have at it:laugh:

[dragonfly]

Its possible that with all the community attention the backing of Duncan had created a lot of tension in Wackmans professional life. It could have effected his business...I could very easily see why parents would be asking for their childs medical records right and left and going to another doctor. I would venture to say it probably also effect his private life too. Wackman if he is bisexual his wife could have said he had to make a choice.. an ultimateum... "It's your gay life syle or we leave and go far far away and start over and you attempt to lead a straight life." JMO and thoughts

[Liz]

Good points, dragonfly!

[Mathew]

Wacksman worked in emergency medicine by the time that he got to Fargo. He continues to work in emergency medicine in New Port Richey, FL. His wife who goes by the name of G. Paulina Wacksman, however I found a legal document with Richard's name and a Polit Wacksman. The nature of the document would suggest that "Polit" was his wife.

[Shazzie]

Wacksman worked in emergency medicine by the time that he got to Fargo. He continues to work in emergency medicine in New Port Richey, FL. His wife who goes by the name of G. Paulina Wacksman, however I found a legal document with Richard's name and a Polit Wacksman. The nature of the document would suggest that "Polit" was his wife.Yes, I think that may be her name. Earlier on, I found a listing for Richard Wacksman and Polit Wacksman at a website listing money the state of ND owes to various people. I posted about this in a thread on the doctor giving Duncan money.

A bunch of us were researching him at the time. If you want to see all the dirt we drug up, here's a link to the thread: http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=25840

Of course, even more dirt on him and his relationship with Duncan has surfaced since then!

[Liz]

Wacksman worked in emergency medicine by the time that he got to Fargo. He continues to work in emergency medicine in New Port Richey, FL. His wife who goes by the name of G. Paulina Wacksman, however I found a legal document with Richard's name and a Polit Wacksman. The nature of the document would suggest that "Polit" was his wife.


If Wacko's still working, I surely hope he's being shunned and castigated by his peers.

[sabego]

I have been thinking for some time that these people, when convicted, should lose their eyes. Without their sight they would not be able to do the damage to children that they are doing. I know it sounds harsh, but what they are doing is much worse.


Just my opinion.

Sabego:furious:

[Linda7NJ]

I have been thinking for some time that these people, when convicted, should lose their eyes. Without their sight they would not be able to do the damage to children that they are doing. I know it sounds harsh, but what they are doing is much worse.


Just my opinion.

Sabego:furious:
I like it! Can we lop off their hands too?

[Annagirl]

Lets try to maintain some objectivity here, people. This is Websleuths, and we should not lose sight of our goals here - to solve crimes and help the victims - not talk like this is the Middle Ages and some child molester is going to hung, drawn, quartered, castrated, locked in a cell with family members, etc. This is ridiculous - because of the way the system of law works in this country, no matter the horrendous nature of the crime, this stuff will never happen. If it did, our justice system would be in shambles and we would be in a state of anarchy.

This sorry man, Duncan, does not deserve what you are giving him. Each time you express your desire to cut off his dick or whatever, you are telling him what he wants to hear. His desire was to cause as much damage to society as possible, and sadly, it looks like his plan worked. The most you can do is put your energy into helping Shasta or changing laws to prevent this from happening again; do not think of this man, do not waste your energy on typing out punishments for him, do not lend him your energy and spirit to think about him.

[Leigh]

I agree that Duncan would relish reliving all the evil he has done, and he has done enough to last him a life time. I think he gets his highs from torture, killing and reliving it over and over. I wonder if he was videotaping the torture of Shasta and Dylan to sell or to watch again and again for his own pleasure?

I don't want to see him sitting in a temperature controlled cell separated from the general population for his own safety for the rest of his life while eating his 3 meals a day paid for by taxpayers.

I think he should pay for what he has done either by death or by hard labor I couldn't care less which one. I kind of favor hard labor on a chain gang while sweltering in the summer heat for the rest of his life. That way he should be so exhausted by the end of each day that he wouldn't have the energy to lay awake and relive his crimes.

I was for the death penalty for this monster at first, but in rethinking it I now think that death is too good for him. His just punishment should be making him suffer enough so that he would dread each moment of the rest of his long life ahead. I don't think that is too inhumane or too cruel for him.

[Cowgirl]

I agree that Duncan would relish reliving all the evil he has done, and he has done enough to last him a life time. I think he gets his highs from torture, killing and reliving it over and over. I wonder if he was videotaping the torture of Shasta and Dylan to sell or to watch again and again for his own pleasure?

I don't want to see him sitting in a temperature controlled cell separated from the general population for his own safety for the rest of his life while eating his 3 meals a day paid for by taxpayers.

I think he should pay for what he has done either by death or by hard labor I couldn't care less which one. I kind of favor hard labor on a chain gang while sweltering in the summer heat for the rest of his life. That way he should be so exhausted by the end of each day that he wouldn't have the energy to lay awake and relive his crimes.

I was for the death penalty for this monster at first, but in rethinking it I now think that death is too good for him. His just punishment should be making him suffer enough so that he would dread each moment of the rest of his long life ahead. I don't think that is too inhumane or too cruel for him.Death is a whole lot more likely than hard labor. The Feds are not into the chain gang thing at all but they do execute. The state of Idaho doesn't have a lot of heat for hard labor either! And they never execute anyone so I hope that the Feds go for the death penalty since they are far more likely to do it. I would like his life to be miserable too, but I think we have to settle for death.

[Shazzie]

Lets try to maintain some objectivity here, people. This is Websleuths, and we should not lose sight of our goals here - to solve crimes and help the victims - not talk like this is the Middle Ages and some child molester is going to hung, drawn, quartered, castrated, locked in a cell with family members, etc. This is ridiculous - because of the way the system of law works in this country, no matter the horrendous nature of the crime, this stuff will never happen. If it did, our justice system would be in shambles and we would be in a state of anarchy.

This sorry man, Duncan, does not deserve what you are giving him. Each time you express your desire to cut off his dick or whatever, you are telling him what he wants to hear. His desire was to cause as much damage to society as possible, and sadly, it looks like his plan worked. The most you can do is put your energy into helping Shasta or changing laws to prevent this from happening again; do not think of this man, do not waste your energy on typing out punishments for him, do not lend him your energy and spirit to think about him.
THANK YOU for this post.

[Tom'sGirl]

Lets try to maintain some objectivity here, people. This is Websleuths, and we should not lose sight of our goals here - to solve crimes and help the victims - not talk like this is the Middle Ages and some child molester is going to hung, drawn, quartered, castrated, locked in a cell with family members, etc. This is ridiculous - because of the way the system of law works in this country, no matter the horrendous nature of the crime, this stuff will never happen. If it did, our justice system would be in shambles and we would be in a state of anarchy.

This sorry man, Duncan, does not deserve what you are giving him. Each time you express your desire to cut off his dick or whatever, you are telling him what he wants to hear. His desire was to cause as much damage to society as possible, and sadly, it looks like his plan worked. The most you can do is put your energy into helping Shasta or changing laws to prevent this from happening again; do not think of this man, do not waste your energy on typing out punishments for him, do not lend him your energy and spirit to think about him.Aahhhh, well thanks for your opinion Anna,:waitasec: BUT AFTER ALL we are giving our opinions according to the title of this thread.

[Annagirl]

Aahhhh, well thanks for your opinion Anna,:waitasec: BUT AFTER ALL we are giving our opinions according to the title of this thread.

Hi Tom'sGirl,

I agree - everyone is giving their opinions, including me, to the title of this thread: "Hung, Drawn, and Quartered". Perhaps I was out of line in criticizing those who are imagining gory punishments for this subhuman. However, what I meant was, instead of putting energy into thinking of ways to punish the subhuman mass of s#$%, I think it would be better spent focusing on the future - put that energy into writing senators and representatives about sex offender laws, donate to Shasta's fund, or talk about and remember the victims, as they are the ones that deserve your energies and beautiful spirits (I know you all have both). It just makes me mad, I guess, that when he said, "I want to harm society as much as I can..." he was predicting correctly(?) A whole thread devoted to that Thing in human packaging. He doesn't even deserve it; he probably would love it; after all, in his sick twisted mind, everyone thinking of terrible specific punishments for him would probably be the equivalent of websleuth posters talking about all of your good qualities and how much they love you. This soulless beast obviously wants to be as evil as possible and affect society negatively, and this thread just seems to epitomize that yes, he succeded. He succeded in making everyone's mind think evil things they never have before (regarding him, of course). Once these evil thoughts enter one's consciousness, I think they are extremely difficult to wash away completely. I don't want him to have the satisfaction of knowing he created a little dark corner of evil thoughts in my brain. To use a metaphor, if the Klu Klux Klan showed up in your town for a scheduled march, instead of acting on instinct and attending their march to protest, it would be more offensive to them to stay far away from them and/or ignore them. Show up screaming epithets and holding signs will thrill them; it will tell them you care, even if its negatively, about them. The KKK would gasp in amazement and say, "Look at all these people who care about us (even if its negative); look at the attention we're getting!" Whereas if you and everyone else stay far, far away, it is telling them they are all alone in their views and that they are not worth your time or presence. I don't know if this makes sense, I'm sorry if it doesn't, as its 5 in the morning and I'm not even half all here right now.

But ultimately, leave Satan's spawn to the people who are getting paid to punish him and devote some of their energy to him. Have faith that our justice system will pull through for us this time. Scott Wayman looks like a good, reasonable, steady man, and I DO have faith that our justice system will hand this demonic force the worst punishment that is legal in this country. Have faith in that, and devote your energy to the victims, especially little Shasta. People can send her gifts with the package or envelope labeled: "Shasta, Couer D'Alene, Idaho, zip". Apparently the mailman/woman knows where to bring them, and I also read that Shasta opens every card and package sent to her father's home herself. That said, I know material things will not heal her, but she is a little girl, and I'm sure she enjoys pretty things, and it will help her heal to know everyone in this country is rooting for, loves, and admires her. She probably hasn't seen too much of the country (although I could be wrong), and I know that she would love looking at where all the packages and envelopes are from - which state, which town or city.

I also wanted to post a little something about some threads I've seen on Websleuths. I just recently joined Websleuths this month and I love this place because there are so many f#$%@#$ brilliant people here (Cowgirl, where are you???) But sometimes I think we all get off the track of solving the case and working on preventing future ones, and focus on the sensational, i.e., wanting to know how Dylan was killed and if Shasta watched and why exactly Shasta was sedated, etc. Those things have nothing to do with what we're working with now, and most didn't when the threads were started, and I don't want to use this word, but sometimes it sounds like gossip. I know that if I were in any of the surviving Groenes shoes, I would not want people trying to imagine the specifics of what happened; it would seem like an invasion of my privacy. I WOULD, I think, want people to support me (Steve Groene) in changing the laws regarding sex offenders and to not forget my family as I knew them when they were alive. Dylan, Slade, and Shasta are so much, much more than rape and death and beatings etc...I would want others to remember them as they were, and I would, for most of their lives, and not what they were in their last horrendous hours or days.

I love this board! I've got alot of catching up to do in learning how to websleuth. I am truly amazed at some of the posters on here -- I think some of you were and are way ahead of LE in many facets of this case. So thank you! I'm honored to be in everyone's company, truly and surely.

[kline]

I have to agree for the most part.

Ive ran the whole gamut of emotions....everytime a new revelation is released that gives another dimension to the suffering those children went through it opens up the wound...I just want to get my hands around his neck.
.....but your right. JED would LOVE that.
He doesnt deserve to lessen the quality of anybodys life one iota more then he already has.
It gives him power over us.
He not worth wasting the emotion over.
He forfeited his humanity the moment he harmed a child to fullfill his perversions.
He is nothing more then a 6'2" talking Maggot.
And deserves as much of our attention.
Besides there is nothing you or I can do to him that would make him feel for one moment a fraction of the suffering that he has inflicted on the Groene family and the rest of us.
He lacks the capacity to feel it. He doesnt have the equipment.
If he did this tragedy would never have happened .
Its like wishing a rattlesnake would be sorry for bitting you..
Instead,make a donation to Shasta's trust fund.
Take the time to contact your elected officials,lobby for changes in the way the courts and parole boards deal with sex offenders.
About the time judges get it through their heads its good P.R. to be tough on sex offenders and politicians realize its political currency things will change damn quick.
And most importantly:
Stop and take some time with your kids.
Color a picture with them.Go for a walk.
Just tell them you love them .
Hell,that goes for anyone in your life who is important to you .
Someone you havent taken the time to let them know just how important .
Because so many other things take priority.
The less we allow this monster's evil to taint our lives the better it will be .
ANY thing good thing coming from this tragedy, no matter how small is a tribute for Shasta and a good memorial for Brenda,Mark ,Slade,and Dylan.

[Tom'sGirl]

Hi Tom'sGirl,

I agree - everyone is giving their opinions, including me, to the title of this thread: "Hung, Drawn, and Quartered". Perhaps I was out of line in criticizing those who are imagining gory punishments for this subhuman. However, what I meant was, instead of putting energy into thinking of ways to punish the subhuman mass of s#$%, I think it would be better spent focusing on the future - put that energy into writing senators and representatives about sex offender laws, donate to Shasta's fund, or talk about and remember the victims, as they are the ones that deserve your energies and beautiful spirits (I know you all have both). It just makes me mad, I guess, that when he said, "I want to harm society as much as I can..." he was predicting correctly(?) A whole thread devoted to that Thing in human packaging. He doesn't even deserve it; he probably would love it; after all, in his sick twisted mind, everyone thinking of terrible specific punishments for him would probably be the equivalent of websleuth posters talking about all of your good qualities and how much they love you. This soulless beast obviously wants to be as evil as possible and affect society negatively, and this thread just seems to epitomize that yes, he succeded. He succeded in making everyone's mind think evil things they never have before (regarding him, of course). Once these evil thoughts enter one's consciousness, I think they are extremely difficult to wash away completely. I don't want him to have the satisfaction of knowing he created a little dark corner of evil thoughts in my brain. To use a metaphor, if the Klu Klux Klan showed up in your town for a scheduled march, instead of acting on instinct and attending their march to protest, it would be more offensive to them to stay far away from them and/or ignore them. Show up screaming epithets and holding signs will thrill them; it will tell them you care, even if its negatively, about them. The KKK would gasp in amazement and say, "Look at all these people who care about us (even if its negative); look at the attention we're getting!" Whereas if you and everyone else stay far, far away, it is telling them they are all alone in their views and that they are not worth your time or presence. I don't know if this makes sense, I'm sorry if it doesn't, as its 5 in the morning and I'm not even half all here right now.

But ultimately, leave Satan's spawn to the people who are getting paid to punish him and devote some of their energy to him. Have faith that our justice system will pull through for us this time. Scott Wayman looks like a good, reasonable, steady man, and I DO have faith that our justice system will hand this demonic force the worst punishment that is legal in this country. Have faith in that, and devote your energy to the victims, especially little Shasta. People can send her gifts with the package or envelope labeled: "Shasta, Couer D'Alene, Idaho, zip". Apparently the mailman/woman knows where to bring them, and I also read that Shasta opens every card and package sent to her father's home herself. That said, I know material things will not heal her, but she is a little girl, and I'm sure she enjoys pretty things, and it will help her heal to know everyone in this country is rooting for, loves, and admires her. She probably hasn't seen too much of the country (although I could be wrong), and I know that she would love looking at where all the packages and envelopes are from - which state, which town or city.

I also wanted to post a little something about some threads I've seen on Websleuths. I just recently joined Websleuths this month and I love this place because there are so many f#$%@#$ brilliant people here (Cowgirl, where are you???) But sometimes I think we all get off the track of solving the case and working on preventing future ones, and focus on the sensational, i.e., wanting to know how Dylan was killed and if Shasta watched and why exactly Shasta was sedated, etc. Those things have nothing to do with what we're working with now, and most didn't when the threads were started, and I don't want to use this word, but sometimes it sounds like gossip. I know that if I were in any of the surviving Groenes shoes, I would not want people trying to imagine the specifics of what happened; it would seem like an invasion of my privacy. I WOULD, I think, want people to support me (Steve Groene) in changing the laws regarding sex offenders and to not forget my family as I knew them when they were alive. Dylan, Slade, and Shasta are so much, much more than rape and death and beatings etc...I would want others to remember them as they were, and I would, for most of their lives, and not what they were in their last horrendous hours or days.

I love this board! I've got alot of catching up to do in learning how to websleuth. I am truly amazed at some of the posters on here -- I think some of you were and are way ahead of LE in many facets of this case. So thank you! I'm honored to be in everyone's company, truly and surely.Nice to have you aboard Anna, I didn't realize you were fairly new. I'm glad you love this site, as most of us here do.

Now, getting back to Hung, drawn and quartered .......we'll just have to wait this thing out and see how it plays out.

My dream of dreams would be that he spills his guts on all the details of the Groene crime & all other crimes he was involved with............AND THEN WE SPILL HIS GUTS.

[Liz]

Snippets from 7/21 Bonner County Daily Bee which pertain to the topic of this thread ---

http://www.bonnercountydailybee.com/articles/2005/07/21/news/news02.txt


As information about the case continues to surface, residents come up with their own suggestions how Duncan should be punished if he's convicted.

Letters suggest a range of punishment from life in prison with "two bubbas" to immediate execution following conviction at trial.

Others had different ideas.

"Duncan should get worse than death," wrote Coeur d'Alene's Crystal Reinicke. "I believe that by giving Duncan the death penalty is an easy way out for him. I think that a sick freak like himself should be tortured in the sickest, most unearthly way imaginable.

"I think he should have to hurt, even though no matter how much torture, he will never feel pain like the pain he has caused."

Others think that since writings in his online diary show Duncan appeared to have a death wish, he ought to take matters into his own hands.

"You also hoped you would die (soon). I really think that now that will come. How soon, it's up to you," said Scott Metcalf of Coeur d'Alene. "Tell the truth about this ordeal and ask to be put to death. Don't be a coward and file appeals to prolong your fate.

"You will meet God and you will meet the ones you have harmed and they will see you to the gates of hell!"

Another had an even more Biblical end in sight.

"God's law says that pedophiles like Joseph Duncan should have been dead a long time ago," said John Reed of Coeur d'Alene. "But morons in the legal system says he has rights, the right to serve some years in prison, the right to parole, the right to kill, the right to kidnap children, the right to molest children, the right to kill the children he kidnapped, the right to rape little kids.

"God's law says Duncan should have had a millstone tied around his neck and thrown in the sea -- permanently cures child molesters, rapists and child murderers. I personally believe in God's laws, and if someone should end this vicious criminal's existence on the face of this earth, that person should receive a standing ovation and be given the key to the city."

[Cowgirl]

While it is an exercise in futility to rant and rave about someone who will "get a fair trial" rather than be drawn and quartered, people need to vent. I don't see it as giving the monster what he wants, and it is their right to spew. Just because someone vents their frustration that Duncan will never get the kind of punishment he deserves does not mean these same people won't find time or energy to do something more productive. No one needs a sermon about it.

I don't think any of us knows how Duncan perceives anything. His blog was full of lies and self-centered, self-serving whining nonsense. Who cares how he really feels?

[Floh]

I believe there are people who are busy acting positively (by contacting powers that be to get things changed, helping Shasta with her futue, etc.) and also venting.

why not?

people are allowed to do both, IMO.

[Cristal]

Sexual Predator Removes Tracking Device, Flees
Idaho officials are trying to track down William Lightner, who police say is a violent sex offender who cut off his ankle monitor and took off. Lightner was convicted of lewd contact with a minor under the age of 16 in 1994. He served ten years, was let out of prison in March of 2005. He had been constantly monitored by a GPS tracking system for the past two months until Saturday, when police say Lightner cut off his device and fled.

Poilce say Lightner is one of 30 Idaho sexual predators registered as a violent sexual predator and one of 10 in the Boise area alone. When officers went to check on him Saturday, July 23, 2005, Lightner was nowhere to be found.




Lightner - The Latest In String Of Idaho Cases
It's been a busy year for Idaho law enforcement battling sex offenders.



Joseph Duncan: (http://www.amw.com/fugitives/brief.cfm?id=33054)On May 16, 2005, police say registered sex offender Joseph Duncan murdered Brenda Groene, her son Slade and her boyfriend Mark McKenzie in their Coeur d' Alene home, then abducted 8-year-old Shasta and 9-year-old Dylan Groene. Shasta was later recovered alive. Dylan's remains were found in Montana. Police say both children suffered ongoing sexual abuse at the hands of Duncan.

John Tuggle (http://www.amw.com/fugitives/brief.cfm?id=33503): On July 21, 2005, police in Wallace, Idaho say registered sex offender John Tuggle sexually assaulted and stabbed his 12-year-old daughter, then left her to die along a deserted road. Daniel Farinholt (http://www.amw.com/fugitives/brief.cfm?id=28525): On January 18, 2005, tips to AMW.COM led police to Daniel Farinholt, an accused sex offender from Irvine, Cal. who was hiding out in Boise, Idaho.

[Cristal]

this world is just getting completely out of control, now there is another demon loose whats next?

[dragonfly]

Yes Cristal,
another lovely one to add to the list!
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1449604/posts :rolleyes: