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View Full Version : FL FL - St. Petersburg - WhtFem 381UFFL, 14-17, Pushed in Front of Vehicle, Jun'73


emory76
08-10-2005, 12:47 AM
I'm sorry if this has already been discussed. I tried to search to see, but could not find anything already posted on it. This is a 14 to 17 year old female that went by the name Janice Brock, but obviously that's not her real name. She was believed to be a runaway. She was pushed in front of a moving car by a guy and died at the scene. No one has ever identified her. Does anyone know about this case? I was just curious.

Case File 381UFFL (http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/381uffl.html)


:rolleyes:

teonspaleprincess
08-10-2005, 01:50 PM
Were witnesses able to describe the man? I wonder if maybe she was involved in prostitution and he was the pimp. It is so sad when you have a young person that no one claims.

2sisters
12-06-2007, 10:40 PM
http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/381uffl.html
On June 9, 1973, this unidentified child was pushed in front of a moving vehicle in St. Petersburg, Pinellas County, Florida, and died at the scene, at 11 Avenue & 8 Street S. in St. Petersburg. According to witnesses, she was involved in an altercation with a black male prior to being pushed into the path of the vehicle.
She was new to the area, and was believed to have been a runaway from an unknown location. She had been living in the area for a few weeks prior to death and was believed to be a runaway associated with drug related activity.

Sleuthster
10-24-2008, 10:24 PM
New info found.

First of all, she had another alias, Janice Marie Bromke.
Also, she may have been from Virginia or NC. I think she was from Cherry Hill,NJ and I will explain why in a minute.

A 24 yo man named Lawrence was charged in her death right after the incident.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=NL8MAAAAIBAJ&sjid=JGADAAAAIBAJ&pg=5936,2097037&dq=janice+bromke

I believe this is the same Lawrence (teddy)
http://www.sptimes.com/2002/05/12/SouthPinellas/Gulfport_looks_north_.shtml

Found him on knowx marrying this Katie.

Dont know if he was convicted.

Anyways, so I ran Janice Bromke. First of all there are only 9 Bromke's on ssdi. Not a common name.

Well it seems that there was a Dorothy born 1923 died 1997, google news shows she has a daughter named Janice listed but it doesnt show where she is. Dorothy was married to Bruno he died in 1996. Bruno had a son named (suprise) Bruno, who was a doctor and died suddenly in 2003 at age 58, he has a daughter named Janice who lives in NY, I have her married name dont want to print it here.
SO..... I believe that Janice Marie Bronke is our Janice and that her brother Bruno named his daughter after his sister.
I also believe that this was a prominent family and the stigmatism that Janice ran away made them refrain from persuing her missing.
Also, I have found that alot of info is missing on many of our cold cases that I looked up on this google news website. I am not sure why this name was omited and if this is Bruno and Dorothy's daughter it makes me sad that they have passed on as has the possible brother.

Sleuthster
10-24-2008, 10:55 PM
Hey, I just found a pic on myspace of a direct relation to this bromke family (the othe janice is her cousin,her uncle was the younger Bruno that died) and she looks like the Janice girl! OMG. Same little elfy ears and blue eyes.

raindrops300
10-25-2008, 10:35 AM
I think you are right on with this. I agree with you that Bromke is likely her real name.
Have you contacted anyone?

Sleuthster
10-25-2008, 01:01 PM
I think you are right on with this. I agree with you that Bromke is likely her real name.
Have you contacted anyone?

No, do you think I should contact St Pete police with this? Or do you think I should contact this relative on myspace first or at all ??

forthelost
10-25-2008, 04:42 PM
No, do you think I should contact St Pete police with this? Or do you think I should contact this relative on myspace first or at all ??

Why not both?

Sleuthster
10-25-2008, 05:09 PM
I sent a message on my space to the direct cousin of this family that I found. Would like to see if there was a Janice Bromke missing in her family back in the 70's before I contact LE.

mel36
10-27-2008, 01:45 PM
Sleuthster,
Did you get a response yet?

Sleuthster
10-27-2008, 01:55 PM
No,

She hasn't been logged in since Oct 22.

Hope she checks her myspace soon, I am really anxious to know but on the other hand if this is a relative it will be sad news for the family.

kline
10-28-2008, 03:00 AM
Nice Work!
It will be interesting to see how this pans out.

Boyz_Mum
10-28-2008, 10:00 AM
I clicked on the link in the OP and it brought up a home page for doe.us. Was there a picture of the UID?

Sleuthster
10-28-2008, 10:16 AM
I clicked on the link in the OP and it brought up a home page for doe.us. Was there a picture of the UID?

Doenetwork changed it's website address sometime ago and got rid of the .net and replaced it with .org.

Here is the correct link
www.doenetwork.org/cases/381uffl.html (http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/381uffl.html)

Boyz_Mum
10-28-2008, 11:05 AM
Thank you for the updated link, Sleuthster.

Cubby
10-28-2008, 11:08 AM
Sleuthster - I really think you are onto something hear. I hope you get a response. I might contact LE now too. Wouldn't hurt and they might have access to info the general public is unable to obtain.

Boyz_Mum
10-28-2008, 11:13 AM
Sleuthster - I really think you are onto something hear. I hope you get a response. I might contact LE now too. Wouldn't hurt and they might have access to info the general public is unable to obtain.

I agree.

x117236
10-28-2008, 01:45 PM
Have you also looked at Facebook for relatives?

Sleuthster
10-29-2008, 05:52 PM
Hi,

Just an update. I sent 2 messages on myspace to 2 different possible relatives and I heard back from one. I told him I was sincere and he wanted to know who I was so I told him I was harmless ;)

He said that he is 24 and wasnt even around in 1973 but would ask his dad and grandparents.

I think contacting LE would be premature if this is a dead end BUT like I said before Bromke is not a common name so where would she have gotten this from? And there is another Janice. LE thinks I am batty in Pinellas anyways from sending them other leads hehehe:woohoo:
Sometimes, I think, hey maybe I am.LOL

Also, we had a thread on here about checking school records for free. I ran her name and it came up with someone with that name born in 1958. This would make her 15 in 1973 and that would be right on the mark. I could not find any other info on that site though, unfortunately.

Sleuthster
10-29-2008, 06:07 PM
Have you also looked at Facebook for relatives?
I am Facebook Phobic LOL

What is up with facebook?It like you have to join each school just to see their profile or ask them to be your friend.

x117236
10-29-2008, 08:57 PM
Most people sign up for Facebook under their real names so it's easier to find someone by name. And you can send them a message whether you're a "friend" or not.

I see 12 Bromkes out there, some are from PA and 1 from Cherry Hill NJ.

MaedchenX
11-04-2008, 03:21 PM
Any news?

MadeaBecBec
01-22-2009, 01:01 AM
http://www.missingkids.com/missingkids/servlet/PubCaseSearchServlet?act=viewChildDetail&caseNum=604875&orgPrefix=NCMC&seqNum=1&caseLang=en_US&searchLang=en_US

I wonder if this could be Kathy?http://www.missingkids.com/missingkids/servlet/PubCaseSearchServlet?act=viewChildDetail&caseNum=400072&orgPrefix=NCMC&seqNum=1&caseLang=en_US&searchLang=en_US The blue eyes & the nose really stood out for me! Has this JD, already been ruled out? :confused:
I know Kathy would've been missing for almost a year when this happened, but, I keep looking at Kathy's school picture, she looks so sad, maybe she had just lost a boyfriend or someone that she loved, when the pic was taken, but, her eyes are just so sad.. I mean that like maybe she was not a happy girl at home for whatever reason & ran away that summer.. Another scenario, is that she just wanted to go to Florida and vacation with friends, then decided to stay, I don't really know!
:bang: But, when I was 15, me and friends got a little crazy and took off towards Florida, didn't quite make it there, we stopped at Gulfport, we stayed for 8 days, when I got back home though, I was in serious trouble, I didn't tell my parents when we left, waited until we stopped at Gulfport, made a collect call and told them then, they weren't frantic about me being gone for 3 days before I called, it was summer & I usually stayed weekends with a close friend anyway, but that was early 70's, we could be a little more carefree as teenagers, or so we believed! I thought I would share one of my little adventures, my own experiences have helped my reasoning skills later in life! Honestly!
I'm kind of thankful that I didn't know about all the pervs & serial killers, back then, I never would've left home!
I'll wait to see if you all agree, before I call or email this in...
(:blushing: PS: I posted this in the Missing Children's Forum & took it down, because that was just for Notices of Missing Children, no discussions & I have searched every thread to make sure no one else had put this on here)

chaddylex
01-22-2009, 08:52 AM
Wow! I think Kathy is a strong resemblence to the UID. Too bad we don't have a pic of Kathy smiling so we could compare her teeth to the UID's..the UID's teeth had a distintive look.

Christine and Believe are very good sleuthers here. See what they think and see if you should turn it in!! I think they will back you up!!

Chaddylex:)

rozey
01-22-2009, 09:10 AM
Kathy had multiple healed leg fractures. It would be interesting to see the autopsy report on JD.

Mr. E
01-22-2009, 09:50 AM
Wow, they certainly do look alike! Good eye, MadeaBecBec! There's is a height descrepency, but those aren't always accurate.

Their ears, especially, are very similar.

not_my_kids
01-22-2009, 09:51 AM
Kathy had multiple healed leg fractures. It would be interesting to see the autopsy report on JD.


Maybe someone could call and ask the coroner or medical examiner to look into it. Ask them about the leg fractures.

believe09
01-22-2009, 11:24 PM
Here is the link to the UID on the NamUs website:
https://identifyus.org/report.php?p=individual&i=1342

There is an email address for the MedEx-I would send an email asking if the UID had healed leg fractures and if she has been compared to your missing child....nice work! :blowkiss:

MadeaBecBec
01-23-2009, 12:30 AM
Here is the link to the UID on the NamUs website:
https://identifyus.org/report.php?p=individual&i=1342

There is an email address for the MedEx-I would send an email asking if the UID had healed leg fractures and if she has been compared to your missing child....nice work! :blowkiss:

Thank you for that info! I have an email drafted... I was just researching where to send it (my laptop must've got overloaded and shut down, I had to go to desktop) and I will do that now, so, maybe I will get something back soon! I'll be posting as soon as I do! :)

BethInAK
01-24-2009, 01:30 AM
timeline is great- I hope this pans out!!

OC Lady
03-31-2009, 10:37 PM
I think this is one of the saddest I've ever seen...surely someone knows who she is!!!

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/381uffl.html


Reconstruction of Victim by National Center for Missing & Exploited Children

Unidentified White Female


The victim was discovered on June 9, 1973 in St. Petersburg, Pinellas County, Florida.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Vital Statistics


Estimated age: 14 - 17 years old
Approximate Height and Weight: 5'1" (155 cm); 110 lbs (50 kg)
Distinguishing Characteristics: Dark auburn hair, wavy shoulder length; deep blue eyes.
Dentals: Her front tooth was chipped, but it is not clear whether the chip was present prior to her death.
Clothing/Jewelry: Purple pant suit. Pair of earrings.
Other: She has used the name Janice Marie Brock, and friends knew her as "Maria" or "Marie".
Fingerprints: Available


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Case History
On June 9, 1973, this unidentified child was pushed in front of a moving vehicle in St. Petersburg, Pinellas County, Florida, and died at the scene, at 11 Avenue & 8 Street S. in St. Petersburg. According to witnesses, she was involved in an altercation with a black male prior to being pushed into the path of the vehicle.
She was new to the area, and was believed to have been a runaway from an unknown location. She had been living in the area for a few weeks prior to death and was believed to be a runaway associated with drug related activity.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Sleuthster
03-31-2009, 10:42 PM
Hi, There is another thread on this,
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=27541&highlight=brock

Sadly, I believe that i found her real name but the possible family that I found said they never heard of her or didnt contact me back. LE in St. Pete never called back, I left them a message.

OC Lady
04-01-2009, 12:20 AM
This is one of the saddest cases I've seen...someone must have known her!!!


Unidentified White Female


The victim was discovered on June 9, 1973 in St. Petersburg, Pinellas County, Florida.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Vital Statistics


Estimated age: 14 - 17 years old
Approximate Height and Weight: 5'1" (155 cm); 110 lbs (50 kg)
Distinguishing Characteristics: Dark auburn hair, wavy shoulder length; deep blue eyes.
Dentals: Her front tooth was chipped, but it is not clear whether the chip was present prior to her death.
Clothing/Jewelry: Purple pant suit. Pair of earrings.
Other: She has used the name Janice Marie Brock, and friends knew her as "Maria" or "Marie".
Fingerprints: Available


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Case History
On June 9, 1973, this unidentified child was pushed in front of a moving vehicle in St. Petersburg, Pinellas County, Florida, and died at the scene, at 11 Avenue & 8 Street S. in St. Petersburg. According to witnesses, she was involved in an altercation with a black male prior to being pushed into the path of the vehicle.
She was new to the area, and was believed to have been a runaway from an unknown location. She had been living in the area for a few weeks prior to death and was believed to be a runaway associated with drug related activity.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Investigators
If you have any information about this case please contact:
St. Petersburg Police Department
Homicide Unit
727-893-7164
You may remain anonymous when submitting information.

Agency Case Number:
73-46184

NCMEC #: NCMC400072


NCIC Number:
N/A
Please refer to this number when contacting any agency with information regarding



http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/381uffl.html

Lady Stardust
04-01-2009, 08:40 AM
There is already a thread on this case:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=27541&highlight=brock

:)

badhorsie
04-01-2009, 09:21 AM
Is there any update on this dear child?:blowkiss:

OC Lady
04-01-2009, 10:37 PM
Sorry I started another thread on the "Unidentified" section - has anyone been able to find out anything on this...it seems like there is lots of info....

MadeaBecBec
04-02-2009, 01:16 AM
We are all trying to find a match for this child!
I started a thread herein the Unidentified forum : http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=78442

I have not heard back from the ME about the possible match, but sent a follow up email, so maybe I'll hear something soon!! I'll try to post in all of the threads, whatever I find out....



________________
Jeremiah 29: 11-14

MadeaBecBec
04-02-2009, 01:23 AM
I haven't heard back from ME or LE on this one, but sent a follow-up email to to both, I also sent a copy of email to the Cold Case Unit in Michigan, hopefully someone will let us know what's going on with this case!!
There's 3 threads on this Jane, one in the Cold Case forum here: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3539632#post3539632
and another in this forum here: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=82278 (Not alot in this thread)
Should these all be combined? Or should I bring some info here from the Cold Case thread?

I will let everyone know if I hear back from anybody!


_______________
Jeremiah 29:11-14

meloniepet
04-27-2009, 08:21 AM
What about UID 67UFFL as being Kathy Wilcox?

MadeaBecBec
04-30-2009, 12:43 AM
What about UID 67UFFL as being Kathy Wilcox?
That's a very strong possibility!! :bananalama:(here's the link for others: http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/67uffl.html )
I wish that the witness, that held the Janes purse, could've given a better description of the girl, as Kathy has distinct eyes (bluish gray) but the Michigan connection is a pretty good clue! The re-construction is close, too!
Thanks for posting, I need to nudge my contacts on this case to see how the ruling is coming!! While doing so, I may suggest they look into this one as well...:bee:

kpdx
05-13-2009, 03:12 PM
i really like the seminole doe for kathy...wish we could have an artist rendering of jane.

MadeaBecBec
05-14-2009, 04:20 PM
i really like the seminole doe for kathy...wish we could have an artist rendering of jane.

Did you mean a sketch instead of the reconstruction bust for 67uffl ?

anthrobones
08-07-2009, 01:05 AM
http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/1673dffl.html


Debora Sue Lowe
Missing since February 29, 1972 from Pompano Beach, Broward County, Florida
Classification: Lost, Injured, Missing

Vital Statistics

Date Of Birth: September 19, 1958
Age at Time of Disappearance: 13 years old
Height and Weight at Time of Disappearance: 5'6"; 125 lbs.
Distinguishing Characteristics: White female. Brown long, straight hair; brown eyes.
Marks, Scars: A small scar on her left leg
Clothing: A yellow blouse, black pants with vertical rose stripes and a tan poncho.
AKA: Debbie
Dentals: A chipped front tooth; Crowded upper teeth.
DNA: Available in CODIS

Circumstances of Disappearance
Lowe was last seen walking to Rickards Middle School in Pompano Beach, FL. Her parents called the police when she failed to come home from school.
The family was new to South Florida. They had just moved down from West Virginia. Gerald Schaefer, one of South Florida's most brutal serial killers has been named as a suspect. Schaefer, a one-time Martin County police deputy, had been linked to the deaths of 20 or more girls and young women between 1969 and 1972, including at least two other girls from Pompano Beach. His victims ranged in age from 9 to 25.

chaddylex
08-07-2009, 10:47 AM
Anthrobones,

I would say it is a possible - age, both have a chipped tooth. One thing I do see that is different is the color of eyes. The UID has "deep Blue eyes" while Debora is listed as having brown. I know typos have been made before about eye color, height, etc.

mysticrose
09-08-2009, 02:33 PM
Has there been any news on this at all?
TIA

Kat
09-08-2009, 04:11 PM
http://www.examiner.com/x-7403-Tampa-Crime-Examiner~y2009m9d7-Do-you-know-this-unidentified-Jane-Doe

September 7, 11:20 PM


No updates at above link. Just recent reposting of her information.

I had a hard time finding her thead. I'm going to post this case number so I can find it again if need be... Case Number: NCMC400072
http://www.missingkids.com/missingkids/servlet/PubCaseSearchServlet?act=viewChildDetail&caseNum=400072&orgPrefix=NCMC&seqNum=1&caseLang=en_US&searchLang=en_US

Sleuthster
02-09-2010, 08:17 PM
http://www.tampabay.com/news/publicsafety/crime/usf-anthropologist-to-help-exhume-unidentified-st-pete-murder-victims/1070778

ST. PETERSBURG They are the coldest of cold cases, murders committed decades ago. But when authorities exhume the bodies of three victims next week, it won't be in a last-ditch effort to finally solve their murders.
Instead, their graves will be reopened in the hopes that those victims can finally be identified.
That's why University of South Florida forensic anthropologist Erin Kimmerle will be helping the St. Petersburg Police Department and the Pinellas-Pasco Medical Examiner's Office unearth the bodies at Memorial Park cemetery on Wednesday.
Kimmerle is an expert in helping law enforcement identify skeletonized remains.
"If we can identify these individuals and bring closure to their families," police Chief Chuck Harmon said, "then I certainly think that's something we should do."
All three victims are buried at Memorial Park cemetery at 54th Avenue N and 49th Street. The general manager, John Bunnell, has agreed to exhume the bodies at the cemetery's expense.
In the days leading to the exhumation, investigators will use ground-penetrating sonar to pinpoint the graves. Then on Wednesday, they'll start digging them up.
Then investigators will collect DNA samples from the bodies to be submitted to the FBI lab matching against the National Missing Persons DNA database.
Since 2001, the database has been indexing DNA from biological relatives of missing persons, the missing themselves and unidentified human remains.
Here are the cases police will re-examine:
An unidentified white woman, 30 to 35 years of age, was found Oct. 31, 1969, dressed in a "flimsy green nightgown," according to The Evening Independent. She was wrapped in plastic and left inside a steamer trunk beneath a tree near the old Oyster Bar Restaurant near 4200 34th St. S. The woman was beaten and strangled. She was about 5 feet 9 and 130 pounds. There were no suspects in her death. St. Petersburg police Sgt. Bill Carlisle told the Independent that whoever killed her may have wanted her to be found.
A white teenage girl, reportedly named Maria, who was shoved into the path of an oncoming vehicle during an argument with Lawrence Edward Dorn on June 9, 1973. The girl, who was 14 to 17 years old, reportedly had been in town only a few weeks and was from the Carolinas. Dorn was charged with manslaughter, but the case was later dropped for reasons that could not be determined Thursday.
Two men shot to death in Room 15 of the Siesta Motel at 701 34th St. N on April 26, 1980. One victim was identified as Jack Roy Davis, 40, of Knoxville, Tenn. The other never was identified. Police had a suspect in the case, a 39-year-old Tennessee man named Kyle Coy "Cowboy" Watson, according to St. Petersburg Times archives. But he was gunned down by his girlfriend four months after the murders.

Lady Stardust
02-10-2010, 07:19 AM
New info found.

First of all, she had another alias, Janice Marie Bromke.
Also, she may have been from Virginia or NC. I think she was from Cherry Hill,NJ and I will explain why in a minute.

A 24 yo man named Lawrence was charged in her death right after the incident.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=NL8MAAAAIBAJ&sjid=JGADAAAAIBAJ&pg=5936,2097037&dq=janice+bromke

I believe this is the same Lawrence (teddy)
http://www.sptimes.com/2002/05/12/SouthPinellas/Gulfport_looks_north_.shtml

Found him on knowx marrying this Katie.

Dont know if he was convicted.

Anyways, so I ran Janice Bromke. First of all there are only 9 Bromke's on ssdi. Not a common name.

Well it seems that there was a Dorothy born 1923 died 1997, google news shows she has a daughter named Janice listed but it doesnt show where she is. Dorothy was married to Bruno he died in 1996. Bruno had a son named (suprise) Bruno, who was a doctor and died suddenly in 2003 at age 58, he has a daughter named Janice who lives in NY, I have her married name dont want to print it here.
SO..... I believe that Janice Marie Bronke is our Janice and that her brother Bruno named his daughter after his sister.
I also believe that this was a prominent family and the stigmatism that Janice ran away made them refrain from persuing her missing.
Also, I have found that alot of info is missing on many of our cold cases that I looked up on this google news website. I am not sure why this name was omited and if this is Bruno and Dorothy's daughter it makes me sad that they have passed on as has the possible brother.

Hello Sleuthster, do you have any news about this lead?

Sleuthster
02-10-2010, 05:10 PM
Hello Sleuthster, do you have any news about this lead?

No, but I did email the reporter who wrote the story I posted yesterday. I asked him to forward the info to whom ever he got the story from at LE.

Cubby
12-02-2010, 09:03 PM
bump ..

CarlK90245
12-02-2010, 10:22 PM
I noticed that anthrobones mentioned Debora Sue Lowe, but no indication that she was called in, and she is not listed as a rule-out in NamUs.

NamUs UP Case 1342 https://identifyus.org/cases/1342
Debora Sue Lowe http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/l/lowe_debora.html


http://i1354.photobucket.com/albums/q697/Carlkopp90245/Facial%20Reconstructions%20002/2529256640045078242S425x425Q851_zpsb4d28922.jpghtt p://i1354.photobucket.com/albums/q697/Carlkopp90245/Missing%20Persons%20Photos/2227115810045078242S425x425Q851_zps1761140f.jpg

She is a little doubtful because of the eye color and height, but I would think that if they checked out Jamie Grisim and Cynthia Coon (who both have brown eyes and are a few inches taller than the UID and aren't from Florida), they would look at Debra Lowe.

Another one that I think deserves a look is Mary Ann Wesolowski

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/w/wesolowski_mary.html

http://i1354.photobucket.com/albums/q697/Carlkopp90245/Facial%20Reconstructions%20002/2529256640045078242S425x425Q851_zpsb4d28922.jpghtt p://i1354.photobucket.com/albums/q697/Carlkopp90245/Missing%20Persons%20Photos/2601593250045078242S425x425Q851_zpsc0f93f2e.jpg
She has blue eyes, identical eyebrows, and her teeth are pretty close. And she is shorter than the UID at age 13, so she could have grown to the UID's height.

She's the right age, although the circumstances don't seem to suggest that she was a runaway.

The teeth are close considering that it is a drawing that the photo is being compared to. The chip in the tooth could have occurred after her disappearance. If that was a photo that I was comparing the teeth to, I'd probably say no.

hollye
12-03-2010, 10:51 AM
I noticed that anthrobones mentioned Debora Sue Lowe, but no indication that she was called in, and she is not listed as a rule-out in NamUs.

NamUs UP Case 1342 https://identifyus.org/cases/1342
Debora Sue Lowe http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/l/lowe_debora.html


http://i1354.photobucket.com/albums/q697/Carlkopp90245/Facial%20Reconstructions%20002/2529256640045078242S425x425Q851_zpsb4d28922.jpghtt p://i1354.photobucket.com/albums/q697/Carlkopp90245/Missing%20Persons%20Photos/2227115810045078242S425x425Q851_zps1761140f.jpg

She is a little doubtful because of the eye color and height, but I would think that if they checked out Jamie Grisim and Cynthia Coon (who both have brown eyes and are a few inches taller than the UID and aren't from Florida), they would look at Debra Lowe.

Another one that I think deserves a look is Mary Ann Wesolowski

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/w/wesolowski_mary.html

http://i1354.photobucket.com/albums/q697/Carlkopp90245/Facial%20Reconstructions%20002/2529256640045078242S425x425Q851_zpsb4d28922.jpghtt p://i1354.photobucket.com/albums/q697/Carlkopp90245/Missing%20Persons%20Photos/2601593250045078242S425x425Q851_zpsc0f93f2e.jpg
She has blue eyes, identical eyebrows, and her teeth are pretty close. And she is shorter than the UID at age 13, so she could have grown to the UID's height.

She's the right age, although the circumstances don't seem to suggest that she was a runaway.

The teeth are close considering that it is a drawing that the photo is being compared to. The chip in the tooth could have occurred after her disappearance. If that was a photo that I was comparing the teeth to, I'd probably say no.

I think Debra Lowe definitely looks similar with the facial features. However, Mary Wesolowski's teeth appear very similar to me.

CaseyLPC
12-03-2010, 11:41 AM
Based on these comparisons, I would definitely lean toward Mary Ann. The teeth are strikingly similar and the eye color matches. She also has the type of complection that would be prone to freckles, which it mentions the UID having. Just my $.02 though.

Penny_Lane
12-03-2010, 11:49 AM
New to WS but just came across this thread Mary Ann Wesolowski's teeth do look similar to me as well. Although, I can not tell really in the pic what color her eyes are.

Soulmagent
12-03-2010, 12:12 PM
Has Gail Joiner been ruled out for being this girl?

CaseyLPC
12-03-2010, 12:13 PM
In the picture of her the light appears to be hitting the left eye on the inner side. From that point it appears that her eyes are a deep blue color, IMO. I could be wrong though...

Donjeta
07-23-2011, 06:09 PM
Kathy Wilcox Namus page says her DNA tests are complete but no dentals.
https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/1832/1/

The Pinellas county UID https://identifyus.org/cases/1342
has dentals but no DNA. A sample exists but tests are not complete. (She only died less than forty years ago, it's still early days for doing that...) :banghead:
Cynthia Coon 1956 Michigan and Jamie Grissim 1955 Washington have been ruled out.

The Seminole county UID has no dentals on file, loose teeth were found nearby, but a DNA sample is complete and entered.
https://identifyus.org/cases/1341

q64ceo
07-29-2012, 08:34 AM
BUMP

Lets do this

DippyBlonder
07-29-2012, 11:54 AM
New info found.

First of all, she had another alias, Janice Marie Bromke.
Also, she may have been from Virginia or NC. I think she was from Cherry Hill,NJ and I will explain why in a minute.

A 24 yo man named Lawrence was charged in her death right after the incident.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=NL8MAAAAIBAJ&sjid=JGADAAAAIBAJ&pg=5936,2097037&dq=janice+bromke

I believe this is the same Lawrence (teddy)
http://www.sptimes.com/2002/05/12/SouthPinellas/Gulfport_looks_north_.shtml

Found him on knowx marrying this Katie.

Dont know if he was convicted.

Anyways, so I ran Janice Bromke. First of all there are only 9 Bromke's on ssdi. Not a common name.

Well it seems that there was a Dorothy born 1923 died 1997, google news shows she has a daughter named Janice listed but it doesnt show where she is. Dorothy was married to Bruno he died in 1996. Bruno had a son named (suprise) Bruno, who was a doctor and died suddenly in 2003 at age 58, he has a daughter named Janice who lives in NY, I have her married name dont want to print it here.
SO..... I believe that Janice Marie Bronke is our Janice and that her brother Bruno named his daughter after his sister.
I also believe that this was a prominent family and the stigmatism that Janice ran away made them refrain from persuing her missing.
Also, I have found that alot of info is missing on many of our cold cases that I looked up on this google news website. I am not sure why this name was omited and if this is Bruno and Dorothy's daughter it makes me sad that they have passed on as has the possible brother.

Going on from this:

Bruno Bromke (the father) was born in 1921, Dorothy Bromke (the mother) was born in 1923 and the other Bruno Bromke (the brother) was born in 1945.

The Doe calling herself Janice Marie Bromke was born between 1956-1959.

And geneologybank.com shows a J K Bromke born in 1946 who died in 1991 with the same birth place as Bruno Bromke (the brother).

So I suspect, J K Bromke is the real Janice Bromke and not our Doe - HOWEVER, as you say, Bromke is a very rare name! It is very likely that our Doe came from Camden, New Jersey and knew the real Janice Bromke. The only other Bromkes were the great/grandparents that came from Pennsylvania but they either died or moved to Camden. There are no other Bromkes anywhere else.

So our Jane Doe has a connection to Camden somehow. All we have to do now is figure out how she knew the real Janice Bromke or why she came up with that name. :banghead:

friends knew her as "Cindy", "Maria" or "Marie"

One of those is probably her real name.

DP

Sleuthster
07-29-2012, 01:35 PM
Is there a Marie or Mary on the family list?

The fact that Bromke is such a unique last name makes me think it is atleast her last name or tied to her family in some way.

I did find a Mary Bromke 1899-1986 http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=29253157 From Camden.

I wonder if they are Amish or Mennonite. Bellmawr has an Amish community and stores according to google.

ZealotButterfly
08-15-2012, 07:34 PM
Did anyone ever contact Bruce's daughter? To see what she may have known? I did see someone tried making contact with a cousin. I notice she's active on Facebook... Sorry was thinking about this last night.

Wanting2Help
09-17-2012, 01:22 PM
Has anyone submitted Mary Anne Wesolowski as a possible match?

carbuff
09-17-2012, 03:59 PM
Is there a Marie or Mary on the family list?

The fact that Bromke is such a unique last name makes me think it is atleast her last name or tied to her family in some way.

I did find a Mary Bromke 1899-1986 http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=29253157 From Camden.

I wonder if they are Amish or Mennonite. Bellmawr has an Amish community and stores according to google.

I think it's very likely that our UID went to school with Janice Bromke at some point.

JupiterAmmon
09-17-2012, 11:44 PM
I think it's very likely that our UID went to school with Janice Bromke at some point.



Very interesting point - if in fact this Doe knew Janice at some point and simply used her name as an alias, perhaps year books that Ms. Bromke would be in should be checked for people resembling the Doe.

I also wonder if witnesses recall if this Doe had an accent - if she really did come from VA or NC she may have had one.

carbuff
09-18-2012, 01:27 PM
Very interesting point - if in fact this Doe knew Janice at some point and simply used her name as an alias, perhaps year books that Ms. Bromke would be in should be checked for people resembling the Doe.

I also wonder if witnesses recall if this Doe had an accent - if she really did come from VA or NC she may have had one.

That sounds like a really good idea. Wonder if the Camden schools are in yearbooks.com?

DippyBlonder
09-18-2012, 04:00 PM
New/Additional information:
http://www.fluiddb.com/php/details10.php?case=378

Other Details: Decedent was believed to be between 14 and 17 years old and was 5' 1" at the time of her death. She was believed to have been living in the area for a short time prior to death. Believed to be a runaway associated with drug related activity. Decedent struck by vehicle. Decedent used the unconfirmed name of Janice Marie Brock (W/F with DOB 6/17/53). Her friends knew her as "Maria" or "Marie." NCIC fingerprint classification and dental information available. A photograph of a reconstruction is available on the Doe Network's website (reference 381UFFL). Homicide investigation reference SPPD case # 73-46814.

DippyBlonder
09-18-2012, 04:32 PM
https://identifyus.org/cases/1342
Updated namus page too.

Note this:
Her front tooth/teeth were chipped. Unknown if due to accident or not.

JupiterAmmon
09-18-2012, 08:38 PM
New/Additional information:
http://www.fluiddb.com/php/details10.php?case=378

Other Details: Decedent was believed to be between 14 and 17 years old and was 5' 1" at the time of her death. She was believed to have been living in the area for a short time prior to death. Believed to be a runaway associated with drug related activity. Decedent struck by vehicle. Decedent used the unconfirmed name of Janice Marie Brock (W/F with DOB 6/17/53). Her friends knew her as "Maria" or "Marie." NCIC fingerprint classification and dental information available. A photograph of a reconstruction is available on the Doe Network's website (reference 381UFFL). Homicide investigation reference SPPD case # 73-46814.

Thanks for the update. I wonder if this is a case like Serena Balint or Cynthia Hanes, where the decedents true name is known, but either there is no missing persons report, or the missing person report was lost, or something of that sort.

Wanting2Help
10-08-2012, 07:46 AM
Can You Identify Me? created a profile for this girl...


http://canyouidentifyme.blogspot.com/2012/10/four-names-are-any-of-them-mine.html

carbuff
10-08-2012, 10:18 AM
Thanks for the update. I wonder if this is a case like Serena Balint or Cynthia Hanes, where the decedents true name is known, but either there is no missing persons report, or the missing person report was lost, or something of that sort.

I wonder if she was a "throwaway." That was unfortunately rather common in the 70's with parents who didn't agree with their child's moral, sexual, or political choices.

CarlK90245
10-08-2012, 11:21 AM
New/Additional information:
http://www.fluiddb.com/php/details10.php?case=378

Other Details: Decedent was believed to be between 14 and 17 years old and was 5' 1" at the time of her death. She was believed to have been living in the area for a short time prior to death. Believed to be a runaway associated with drug related activity. Decedent struck by vehicle. Decedent used the unconfirmed name of Janice Marie Brock (W/F with DOB 6/17/53). Her friends knew her as "Maria" or "Marie." NCIC fingerprint classification and dental information available. A photograph of a reconstruction is available on the Doe Network's website (reference 381UFFL). Homicide investigation reference SPPD case # 73-46814.

Looking in Ancestry, I couldn't find anyone named Janice Marie Brock.

However, when I searched on first name and DOB, I found a Janice Marie M----, born 17-Jun-1953 in Texas. But when I looked up her mother's name, the mother (VDB of Houston TX) is listed as "Negro (Black)"

I also found a Janice M. M----- born on the same date in Union County Kentucky. But there is no indication of what the middle initial stands for.

DippyBlonder
10-08-2012, 01:15 PM
I think she either knew, or came into contact somehow with the real Janice Bromke but that her real name is probably Marie or Maria as people were calling her that. (see my comments above)

I don't know ancestry. Is there any way to look up births for 17-Jun-1953 for just Marie/Maria? Or births on that date in Camden or New Jersey?

CarlK90245
10-08-2012, 02:22 PM
I think she either knew, or came into contact somehow with the real Janice Bromke but that her real name is probably Marie or Maria as people were calling her that. (see my comments above)

I don't know ancestry. Is there any way to look up births for 17-Jun-1953 for just Marie/Maria? Or births on that date in Camden or New Jersey?

Marie and Maria are common names, so there are a bunch with that DOB, but none from Camden or New Jersey

DippyBlonder
10-08-2012, 02:30 PM
Appreciate you looking, thank you.

carbuff
11-29-2012, 12:03 AM
Kathie Wilcox is mentioned upthread, but did anybody ever submit her?

LovinTK
11-29-2012, 06:08 AM
New/Additional information:
http://www.fluiddb.com/php/details10.php?case=378

Other Details: Decedent was believed to be between 14 and 17 years old and was 5' 1" at the time of her death. She was believed to have been living in the area for a short time prior to death. Believed to be a runaway associated with drug related activity. Decedent struck by vehicle. Decedent used the unconfirmed name of Janice Marie Brock (W/F with DOB 6/17/53). Her friends knew her as "Maria" or "Marie." NCIC fingerprint classification and dental information available. A photograph of a reconstruction is available on the Doe Network's website (reference 381UFFL). Homicide investigation reference SPPD case # 73-46814.

As someone who ran away a lot as a teenager and having a few friends who did the same it was pretty common for us to use a birth date that was either the same year as our actual birthday or at most a year or two off. So I'd be looking for missing people who were born most likely in 1953 but possibly 1952-1955. I would say 1951 but as kids we all lied to make ourselves sound older than we really were rather than younger. Sorry to ramble on... just a thought.

Cymro
12-01-2012, 03:46 AM
This is interesting ... the real JKB died in 1991. I found her obituary and it confirms that she was a registered nurse at Cherry Hill Alternative School, for students who need behavioral and emotional support. The school opened in 1969, and the decedent was born in the mid to late 1950s, so around 10 years younger than the real JKB.

There's no confirmation that JKB was working there at the time (it's around 18 years from the decedent's death, to JKB's own passing, so it is of course possible).

However doesn't this give us a good idea of where the decedent may have gotten her alias from.

kpdx
12-03-2012, 04:13 PM
The wiki on Cherry Hill says it was for early childhood dev. until 1997, when it became an alternative high school. Originally called Malberg Early Childhood Center.

cymster
12-03-2012, 05:27 PM
In terms of Malberg....it was a regular elementary school until 1982-ish. I have no idea why, but many of Cherry Hill's elementary schools were closed and the kids from the closed schools were then phased into certain other elementary school, like Kingston Elementary school (mine).

Cymro
12-06-2012, 10:21 AM
Hmm... nonetheless, perhaps it might be possible, somehow to find out where the real JMB was working in the early 70s and if she was involved in troubled teens then.

The obituary actually says:


"Mrs. Bromke was a registered nurse at the Alternative School Inc. in Cherry Hill. She was a 1968 graduate of the Helene Fuld School of Nursing in Camden. Survivors: her husband, Bruno J. of Bellmawr; two daughters, Janice and Cheryl Annboth of Bellmawr, and two sisters, Judy Sebastian and Dianne Sieck"


Wait crap... we may now have a fourth Janice Bromke: our 1973 deceased, our 1991 deceased, our 1991 deceased's sister-in-law (now unaccounted for but too old to be our UID) and our 1991 deceased's daughter.

The school moved to a former elementary school.

"The Stafford School's current tenant is the Alternative School Inc., a private, nonprofit junior high and high school for emotionally disturbed young people"

I can't find much else than that just yet, but there may be more opportunity for research here.

What this does also mean is that we could yet have somewhere to go with the idea that the deceased runaway was using her real name. It's still unlikely, but she could be 10 or more years younger than her brother, and we no longer have a confirmed obituary for the daughter of the NJ family.

KateB
06-06-2013, 04:56 PM
Additional photo on NamUs. I don't know if this is new or not.

https://identifyus.org/en/medias/show/19225

https://identifyus.org/cases/1342

Magnum P.E.
06-07-2013, 08:29 AM
I wish they would post a copy of the "Gloria" letter. It is not clear to me if the letter was to be sent to Gloria or if the decedent WAS Gloria. Is anyone able to get LE in St. Pete to post a copy for us (as if THAT ever will happen....)

SociologySleuth
01-13-2014, 10:52 AM
Hi, first time poster but long time reader :)

I found this article:

http://news.usf.edu/article/templates/?a=2051

and was just wondering if there were any results/conclusions/updates? This case is so sad.

carbuff
01-13-2014, 01:01 PM
Not much new. According to Namus, her DNA is now available, but no indication of what kind. With remains of that age, I'm guessing it's only mDNA, but that's not stated.

Still the same two ruleouts:

First Name Last Name Year of Birth State LKA
Cynthia Coon 1956 Michigan
Jamie Grissim 1955 Washington