PDA

View Full Version : FL FL - Carl Brandt, linked to 26 murders?



ShowerSinger
10-02-2005, 04:50 AM
A man who killed himself, his wife and niece in central Florida is being investigated as a serial killer.
www.local6.com/news/5046291/detail.html

mysteriew
10-02-2005, 05:59 AM
Whoa! I wonder what the link is? DNA?

mysteriew
10-02-2005, 08:04 AM
Details of killer emerge

They've detailed his life in a 35-page timeline to understand the man who came to Central Florida last September seeking refuge from Hurricane Ivan, but then killed his wife and her niece before hanging himself.

He didn't just murder Michelle Jones, who had opened her south Seminole County home to her aunt and uncle. He systematically dismembered Jones' body, even removing her head and then using kitchen knives to cut on her body with the skill of a surgeon.

What they saw in that bedroom convinced investigators that Brandt had killed before.
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/florida/sfl-fbrandt01oct01,0,3976156.story?coll=sfla-news-florida

He later hung himself at the crime scene.

Also, Local 6 News has learned that investigators in South Florida are now comparing his whereabouts with hundreds of unsolved murder cases.
http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/wkmg/20051002/lo_wkmg/2972034

Norma
10-02-2005, 08:11 AM
Is Carl Brandt this guys real name?

Weird, since it was also the name of Hitler's personal physician
http://www.shoah.dk/doctors/brandt.htm

mysteriew
10-02-2005, 08:16 AM
He didn't only kill Michelle Jones -- who had opened her south Seminole County home to her aunt and uncle. He systematically dismembered Jones' body, removing her head and then using kitchen knives to cut on her body with the skill of a surgeon.

After remaining tight-lipped about their investigation for a year, the investigators recently revealed additional details of the slayings to the Orlando Sentinel. They are certain Brandt killed at least two other times, in South Florida, and they hope their investigation will ultimately resolve other murder cases.

The focus is on Florida, but investigators discovered that Brandt made trips across the country as well as abroad.

An FBI computer program selected the 26 slayings that are the focus of the investigation, some simply because the victims were young women, but many because there were unusual aspects to the slaying, such as mutilation.

Not a typical case

Murder-suicides are typically open-and-shut cases, and, technically, the murder case of Michelle Jones and Teri Brandt is closed. But from the minute the two veteran investigators walked into Jones' house just south of Altamonte Springs the night of Sept. 15, 2004, they knew there was nothing typical about the case.

Neither had ever seen anything like the gruesome scene.

"We had deputies getting sick," Jaynes said.

Brandt, 47, walked into the garage and climbed a stepladder. He tied a bedsheet around his neck and hanged himself.

13-year-old killed mother

News of the crime shocked Brandt's friends, neighbors and family. Everyone told of a compassionate, friendly man nicknamed Charlie who would do anything for anyone.

The first bombshell came when investigators learned Brandt, when he was 13, fatally shot his mother and tried to kill his father. It was a secret kept even from Brandt's two younger sisters, who thought their mother died in a car crash.

Brandt spent a year in an Indiana mental institution and was taken back by his father when he was released.

"I think that's when Charlie was born," Jaynes said.

Carl Brandt visited his father, Herbert, in Ormond Beach two days before the bodies of the Brandts and Jones were found. Brandt's father told investigators that, as his son was leaving, " 'Charlie hugged me like he's never hugged me before,' " Hemmert said.
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/orl-brandt0105oct01,0,1090693.story?page=3&track=mostemailedlink&coll=orl-home-headlines

Caution: This article is very detailed and Graphic

Shadow205
10-02-2005, 10:47 AM
WOW, this is going to prove to be a very interesting case. It is one that I will follow. Please post any updates that you come across. I wonder how much of the country he might have visited? I have also been particulary interested in serial killers. I posted some info on another Florida serial killer on here a long time ago. His name was Gerard Schaefer. He was a Deputy Sheriff in Martin County in Florida. Here is a link to a book that was written about him. http://www.crimelibrary.com/serial_killers/predators/gerard_schaefer/1.htmlI have been to most of the locations where his crimes were commited and bodies were found.(I was there many years later). I had the pleasure of knowing one of the crime scene officer's who worked many of his cases. George was killed in prison a few years ago.

mysteriew
10-02-2005, 10:58 AM
I too think that it is going to be interesting. I almost couldn't believe it when I found that last post. Man did they give detail.
But if LE will only be as forthcoming in the future and if only media will continue to follow it- it is going to be real interesting. I have already been trying to figure out who the 26 they have identified are. And there could be more.
Well, maybe LE will start letting it out soon.

fran
10-02-2005, 12:31 PM
Good grief! It is so scary that these guys get away with this year after year. We'll probably never know just how many he killed.

This is one time, you wish the guy hadn't killed himself. At least then you'd have a chance to find out when, where, how many?

Horrible, horrible case.


JMHO
fran

mysteriew
10-03-2005, 01:27 AM
Good grief! It is so scary that these guys get away with this year after year. We'll probably never know just how many he killed.

This is one time, you wish the guy hadn't killed himself. At least then you'd have a chance to find out when, where, how many?

Horrible, horrible case.


JMHO
fran

Unfortunately, the majority of serials don't talk, and the ones that do will often add victims they had no possibiility of killing. So you can't trust the ones they admit to either. Because they objectify their victims to them it is not real important who they were or what their families are suffering.

mysteriew
10-03-2005, 01:30 AM
Florida investigators are looking into whether a man who killed himself after murdering two people in Central Florida last year was a serial killer, responsible for dozens of murders, Local 6 News has learned.

Seminole County deputies said Carl Brandt may be connected to more than 26 murders since 1973.

Brandt was in Altamonte Springs, Fla., last September taking refuge from Hurricane Ivan when he killed his wife and niece, police said.

He later hung himself at the crime scene.
http://www.local6.com/news/5046291/detail.html

Note: The article doesn't contain any new info, but does have a drawing of Brandt- looks an artists drawing of a suspect.

upallnite
10-03-2005, 03:09 AM
I wish we knew what town this guy originally came from in Indiana, or if it was Indiana because it just says he was institutionalized there and does anyone know what key in Florida his father lived on?

mysteriew
10-03-2005, 03:16 AM
I wish we knew what town this guy originally came from in Indiana, or if it was Indiana because it just says he was institutionalized there and does anyone know what key in Florida his father lived on?

He would have been a minor at that time so info about him would have been limited. Might be able to find something under the mothers name though- at least info about her murder.

upallnite
10-03-2005, 03:19 AM
His father lived on Big Pine Key
http://www.keynoter.com/articles/2004/10/06/news/news02.txt

mysteriew
10-03-2005, 03:20 AM
The Monroe County Sheriff's Office showed great interest in Brandt once it learned details of the Central Florida slayings. In 1989, the body of a former beauty queen, Sherry Perisho, was found in a canal less than 1,000 feet from Brandt's home. Her throat had been slashed and her heart removed.

There also was a similar slaying of a prostitute in 1995 in Miami. Darlene Toler's head and heart were never found.

Hemmert and Jaynes are convinced that both of those women were slain by Brandt.
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/orl-brandt0105oct01,0,1090693.story?page=3&track=mostemailedlink&coll=orl-home-headlines

upallnite
10-03-2005, 03:27 AM
Wonder if this one"s a possibility
http://www.fdle.state.fl.us/osi/unsolved/ccJaneDoe/ccJaneDoe.htm

mysteriew
10-03-2005, 03:27 AM
His father lived on Big Pine Key
http://www.keynoter.com/articles/2004/10/06/news/news02.txt

This article is an excellent find.
I think the father lives at Ormond Beach now. At the time of his mother's murder the family lived here, according to your link:
Most people in the quiet, tree-lined neighborhood in north Fort Wayne know about the day 33 years ago when the home at 6208 Stony Brook Drive erupted in violence. For some who were there, the memories are vivid.

News of the deaths shocked longtime friends. The Brandts, known to friends as Carl and Teri, were longtime residents of the tight-knit community on Big Pine Key.

On Sept. 20, 1978, Carol Lynn Sullivan, 12, disappeared from a rural bus stop in Osteen. Two weeks later, her head was found stuffed in a rusty paint can in a remote spot near Deltona. Her body was never recovered.

On July 19, 1989, Sherry Perisho's mutilated body was found under the North Pine Channel bridge on Big Pine Key.

What Monroe County sheriff's divers found was gruesome and shocking, even for veterans such as Sgt. Darrell Hull. Perisho, a 38-year-old drifter who called herself the "rainmaker" and slept in a dinghy, had her throat slashed with such force the blade cut through her spine, Hull said.

Her killer then cut open her torso and took her heart.

The day after Thanksgiving in 1995, the mutilated body of Darlene Toler, a 35-year-old prostitute and mother of three, was found stuffed in a plastic bag along a road in Miami-Dade's west side. Like Sullivan, Toler was decapitated. Like Perisho, her heart had been cut out.

Seminole County Sheriff Don Eslinger would not give specifics about the slayings of Teresa Brandt and Michelle Jones until a crime-scene report is completed early next week. But he said Brandt's treatment of the bodies was similar to what investigators found in the slayings of Perisho and Toler.

The gruesome signature - mutilation, decapitation, missing hearts - combined with Carl Brandt's presence nearby and evidence in the Seminole case, have investigators at several agencies combing through their unsolved slayings for cases that match the grotesque details.

A search of the Brandts' Big Pine Key home uncovered evidence - possibly on the home computer - that bolsters the theory that Carl Brandt was involved in other slayings, Eslinger said.
http://www.keynoter.com/articles/2004/10/06/news/news02.txt

mysteriew
10-03-2005, 03:46 AM
Wonder if this one"s a possibility
http://www.fdle.state.fl.us/osi/unsolved/ccJaneDoe/ccJaneDoe.htm

Hard to tell. She was beaten and strangled. They are looking at stabbings and mutilations- decaptitations, missing hearts. But it is hard to guess when he might have graduated to the mutilation- that could be his signature or it could be something he progressed to.

By the time of this latest murder, he was really into the mutilation. One of the articles I posted yesterday was really graphic and described in detail the mutilation of the neice. Much worse than what is discussed in the later articles. Wonder if that article would be available in the wayback site?

upallnite
10-03-2005, 03:52 AM
Hard to tell. She was beaten and strangled. They are looking at stabbings and mutilations- decaptitations, missing hearts. But it is hard to guess when he might have graduated to the mutilation- that could be his signature or it could be something he progressed to.

By the time of this latest murder, he was really into the mutilation. One of the articles I posted yesterday was really graphic and described in detail the mutilation of the neice. Much worse than what is discussed in the later articles. Wonder if that article would be available in the wayback site?
He almost strangled his sister though. I wanted to go back an edit my " his father lived on Big pine key" post. I found this article and I got so excited I got mixed up. Oh, well!!!! LOL!!

upallnite
10-03-2005, 03:55 AM
He almost strangled his sister though. I wanted to go back an edit my " his father lived on Big pine key" post. I found this article and I got so excited I got mixed up. Oh, well!!!! LOL!! West Summerland Key is just south of Big Pine Key, I wonder if the dates correlate.

mysteriew
10-03-2005, 04:02 AM
Big Coppit Key is just south of Big Pine Key, I wonder if the dates correlate.

The Brandts moved to Ormond Beach in the fall of 1972. But records in Fort Wayne show that Herbert, his two youngest daughters and his new wife returned to Indiana by 1974.

Carl, then 17, remained in Ormond Beach.

On Sept. 20, 1978, Carol Lynn Sullivan, 12, disappeared from a rural bus stop in Osteen. Two weeks later, her head was found stuffed in a rusty paint can in a remote spot near Deltona. Her body was never recovered.

By then, Carl Brandt had graduated from Seabreeze High School and had earned an associate of science degree from Daytona Beach Community College. He was working in nearby Flagler County.

On July 19, 1989, Sherry Perisho's mutilated body was found under the North Pine Channel bridge on Big Pine Key.

By that time, Carl Brandt had met Teresa Helfrich and married her. Just months before Perisho's body was found, Carl and Teresa had moved to Big Pine Key into a house just four blocks from the bridge.

upallnite
10-03-2005, 04:12 AM
West Summerland Key is just south of Big Pine Key, I wonder if the dates correlate.
I must be tired, nite Mysteriew!!!!

mysteriew
10-03-2005, 08:48 AM
He didn't only kill Michelle Jones -- who had opened her south Seminole County home to her aunt and uncle. He systematically dismembered Jones' body, removing her head and then using kitchen knives to cut on her body with the skill of a surgeon.

After remaining tight-lipped about their investigation for a year, the investigators recently revealed additional details of the slayings to the Orlando Sentinel. They are certain Brandt killed at least two other times, in South Florida, and they hope their investigation will ultimately resolve other murder cases.

The focus is on Florida, but investigators discovered that Brandt made trips across the country as well as abroad.

An FBI computer program selected the 26 slayings that are the focus of the investigation, some simply because the victims were young women, but many because there were unusual aspects to the slaying, such as mutilation.

Not a typical case

Murder-suicides are typically open-and-shut cases, and, technically, the murder case of Michelle Jones and Teri Brandt is closed. But from the minute the two veteran investigators walked into Jones' house just south of Altamonte Springs the night of Sept. 15, 2004, they knew there was nothing typical about the case.

Neither had ever seen anything like the gruesome scene.

"We had deputies getting sick," Jaynes said.

Brandt, 47, walked into the garage and climbed a stepladder. He tied a bedsheet around his neck and hanged himself.

13-year-old killed mother

News of the crime shocked Brandt's friends, neighbors and family. Everyone told of a compassionate, friendly man nicknamed Charlie who would do anything for anyone.

The first bombshell came when investigators learned Brandt, when he was 13, fatally shot his mother and tried to kill his father. It was a secret kept even from Brandt's two younger sisters, who thought their mother died in a car crash.

Brandt spent a year in an Indiana mental institution and was taken back by his father when he was released.

"I think that's when Charlie was born," Jaynes said.

Carl Brandt visited his father, Herbert, in Ormond Beach two days before the bodies of the Brandts and Jones were found. Brandt's father told investigators that, as his son was leaving, " 'Charlie hugged me like he's never hugged me before,' " Hemmert said.
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/orl-brandt0105oct01,0,1090693.story?page=3&track=mostemailedlink&coll=orl-home-headlines

Caution: This article is very detailed and Graphic

The correct url for this article is:
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/orl-brandt0105oct01,0,1090693.story?page=1&track=mostemailedlink&coll=orl-news-headlines-osceola

concernedperson
10-04-2005, 09:26 AM
Steve Huff's blog from yesterday. Provides more info about Charlie Brandt. Very graphic......

http://www.planethuff.com/darkside/archives/001106.html

nanandjim
10-04-2005, 11:03 AM
Didn't Hannibal Lecter say in the "Silence of the Lambs" that serial killers are made not born? I wonder if this is true and what happened to make Charlie like this?

For one, I think that it was very cruel and inhumane of the father to shoot the family dog. It makes me wonder what else went on in that household or if the father went hunting or killed/hurt and skinned other animals in front of little Charlie.

concernedperson
10-04-2005, 01:12 PM
Didn't Hannibal Lecter say in the "Silence of the Lambs" that serial killers are made not born? I wonder if this is true and what happened to make Charlie like this?

For one, I think that it was very cruel and inhumane of the father to shoot the family dog. It makes me wonder what else went on in that household or if the father went hunting or killed/hurt and skinned other animals in front of little Charlie.

In one of the earlier articles it was mentioned that the sisters didn't know their brother had killed the mother. This is very typical of the "secrets" dysfunctional families harbor. Animal cruelty is also a big part of what makes a killer, a killer. Some of Brandt's murders were very horrific with all the slicing and dicing.....most of us would be horrified why not him? Exposure at an early age to hunting...don't know but I'll bet his father could shed some light on this.

Hammerized
10-04-2005, 01:41 PM
When you look at the articles from last year, police were suspecting him of being a serial killer right away. It's been a year, and they now suspect him of at least 26? This is amazing.

A few of the original articles on the double-murder/suicide, which contain some images and video content:
3 Found Dead In Seminole County Home

http://www.wesh.com/news/3734765/detail.html


Police Say Brandt May Have Been Serial Killer


http://www.wesh.com/news/3792169/detail.html


Woman's Killer May Have Struck Before

http://www.wesh.com/news/3752492/detail.html

mysteriew
10-04-2005, 01:45 PM
In one of the earlier articles it was mentioned that the sisters didn't know their brother had killed the mother. This is very typical of the "secrets" dysfunctional families harbor. Animal cruelty is also a big part of what makes a killer, a killer. Some of Brandt's murders were very horrific with all the slicing and dicing.....most of us would be horrified why not him? Exposure at an early age to hunting...don't know but I'll bet his father could shed some light on this.

The animal cruelty is sometimes one of the early signs, but it is the early SK who usually commits the cruelty and animal killings. In this case Carl wasn't the killer, he is the one who was upset by the killing. Now I am going to be hated for saying this. But there are two points of view to the putting down of an animal. Many people (not me) will shoot an ill animal rather than watch it suffer to death (Just like this father did). For reasons of their own, they will shoot the animal, rather than pay a vet to put them down. Wasn't it 'old yeller' that the dog was ill and they shot rather than watch him suffer? That is totally different than the animal torture and killing that a SK does. An early SK may torture an animal or kill an animal just to watch it die. Totally different picture here. This was a kid who suffered at the death of his dog. Not at all atypical. What was atypical was his reaction to it.

concernedperson
10-04-2005, 02:12 PM
The animal cruelty is sometimes one of the early signs, but it is the early SK who usually commits the cruelty and animal killings. In this case Carl wasn't the killer, he is the one who was upset by the killing. Now I am going to be hated for saying this. But there are two points of view to the putting down of an animal. Many people (not me) will shoot an ill animal rather than watch it suffer to death (Just like this father did). For reasons of their own, they will shoot the animal, rather than pay a vet to put them down. Wasn't it 'old yeller' that the dog was ill and they shot rather than watch him suffer? That is totally different than the animal torture and killing that a SK does. An early SK may torture an animal or kill an animal just to watch it die. Totally different picture here. This was a kid who suffered at the death of his dog. Not at all atypical. What was atypical was his reaction to it.

This is true he suffered because it was his pet. I am basing this on info from another serial killer, Keith Jesperson. His father put down his favorite pet but he went on to abuse and torture other animals.He also was exposed to hunting etc. at a very early age. The rage and anger later evolved to women. I can't remember how many people he killed.....some he knew or some he happen to run into. He was fairly indescrimate with exception that it was always someone he could control.

mysteriew
10-04-2005, 02:27 PM
This is true he suffered because it was his pet. I am basing this on info from another serial killer, Keith Jesperson. His father put down his favorite pet but he went on to abuse and torture other animals.He also was exposed to hunting etc. at a very early age. The rage and anger later evolved to women. I can't remember how many people he killed.....some he knew or some he happen to run into. He was fairly indescrimate with exception that it was always someone he could control.

Hunting is common in the rural areas, and boys often learn to hunt at an early age. My nephew started hunting at about that age, and I know of several others. When you grow up on a farm, or in a farming community you just sort of have an understanding that animals get killed for meat. It isn't looked at as cruel as long as the manner of death is by shooting. Not really the type of killing associated with a serial killer either. When a serial killer does it- it is for the enjoyment of watching the death. Often it involves some torture of the animal prior to killing, in order to enjoy the animals pain.

Kimster
11-06-2011, 08:09 PM
From 48 Hours Mystery: http://www.cbsnews.com/2100-18559_162-1655084.html?tag=contentMain;contentBody

http://www.skcentral.com/print.php?type=N&item_id=646

vermontaigne
01-08-2014, 08:28 PM
Here's another possible victim, Sandra Binns (http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/b/binns_sandra.html), who disappeared from Big Pine Key in 1991. Just adding her, since I haven't seen her in any newspaper articles, though I'm sure it's occurred to the cops and locals.