The evidence - what is it linked/pointing to?

[PonderingThings]

I thought I'd like a brief description of the evidence revealed so far - and what its pointing, or not pointing to.


The suspect:
Darryl Littlejohn - 7 time convicted felon
Rape Line Up - Victim does not pick him out of the lineup
Cell phone - Littlejohn used his cell phone, in the area where Imette's body was found, around the time Imette was thought to have been dumped there.

The Witnesses:
Homeless woman - Saw Imette talking to Littlejohn outside the bar
Homeless man - Saw Imette being led to Littlejohn's van while he was saying "Don't worry" I'll take you home.
Cameras - none of the 20+ surveillence cameras show Imette's departure from the bar.

Blanket:
Blanket - believed to have come from the basement of "The Falls"
Semen on Blanket - Not Littlejohn's

Carpet Fibres:
Carpet Fibres - The red fibres are a match to Littlejohn's home carpet BUT the carpet is "fairly common".

DNA under Imette's fingernails - Her own DNA

[MrsMush99]

Ponderingthings, there were two lineups, two different victims and neither one picked him out.

Edited, because I had the wrong name. Not enough coffee yet.

[nanandjim]

PT - Good summation. Thanks for putting this together.

[docwho3]

Is there any way you can go back and edit to link the facts to the appropriate online news release of the item?

I thought I'd like a brief description of the evidence revealed so far - and what its pointing, or not pointing to.


The suspect:
Darryl Littlejohn - 7 time convicted felon
Rape Line Up - Victim does not pick him out of the lineup
Cell phone - Littlejohn used his cell phone, in the area where Imette's body was found, around the time Imette was thought to have been dumped there.

The Witnesses:
Homeless woman - Saw Imette talking to Littlejohn outside the bar
Homeless man - Saw Imette being led to Littlejohn's van while he was saying "Don't worry" I'll take you home.
Cameras - none of the 20+ surveillence cameras show Imette's departure from the bar.

Blanket:
Blanket - believed to have come from the basement of "The Falls"
Semen on Blanket - Not Littlejohn's

Carpet Fibres:
Carpet Fibres - The red fibres are a match to Littlejohn's home carpet BUT the carpet is "fairly common".

DNA under Imette's fingernails - Her own DNA

[PonderingThings]

The suspect:
Darryl Littlejohn - 7 time convicted felon
Alias's - 9 known alias's REFERENCE: http://www.nysun.com/article/28935 "Daryl Banks, Damon Wells, JonathanBlaze and John Handsome" REFERENCE: http://www.nypost.com/news/regionalnews/64815.htm
Cell phone - Littlejohn used his cell phone, in the area where Imette's body was found, 2 hours before Imette's body was discovered. REFERENCE: http://www.forbes.com/home/feeds/ap/2006/03/07/ap2576880.html

Possible rape accusations against Darry Littlejohn:
The October 16th rape - 22 yr old woman: Victim DID pick Littlejohn out of a photo lineup, but in the subsequent actual line up she said her rapist was bigger. Physical evidence is still being compared to Littlejohn REFERENCE: http://www.nysun.com/article/28935
November rape of 15 year old in Long Island - LE is currently investigating possibility he is involved. Physical evidence still being compared to Littlejohn. REFERENCE: http://www.nysun.com/article/28935

The Witnesses:
Homeless woman - Saw Imette talking to Littlejohn outside the bar
Homeless man - Saw Imette being led to Littlejohn's van while he was saying "Don't worry" I'll take you home. REFERENCE: http://www.nypost.com/news/regionalnews/65076.htm
Cameras - none of the 20+ surveillence cameras show Imette's departure from the bar.

Blanket:
Blanket - believed to have come from the basement of "The Falls"
Semen on Blanket - Not Littlejohn's REFERENCE: http://www.ny1.com/ny1/content/index.jsp?stid=1&aid=57669

Carpet Fibres:
Carpet Fibres - The red fibres are a match to Littlejohn's home carpet BUT the carpet is "fairly common".

DNA under Imette's fingernails - Her own DNA
All DNA is being retested, including samples that were deemed to be "inconclusive", using more sophisticated tests.

Edited to include Alias reference and to add some links - other links will come as I read new stories or come across the reference again.

[PonderingThings]

Is there any way you can go back and edit to link the facts to the appropriate online news release of the item?
Doc all this information can be found in the other threads, on this forum, and the appropriate article is linked in those threads.

[docwho3]

Doc all this information can be found in the other threads, on this forum, and the appropriate article is linked in those threads.Yes but it would be easier and nicer to not have to go all over on an easteregg hunt because you being the wonderful person you are would have done that for us. :angel:

[PonderingThings]

Yes but it would be easier and nicer to not have to go all over on an easteregg hunt because you being the wonderful person you are would have done that for us. :angel:
Doc I'm not as wonderful as you think. I've added some links as a reference, and will add any new ones as this develops. The links are "easy search" links I came across - not necessairly the exact story I read the information in.

[PrayersForMaura]

Cat Hair on the Blanket:

"Cops were hunting for blood, sand, hair and DNA evidence, Harris told The Daily News. Police tell Chang a cat is significant because feline hair was found on the bedspread used to wrap St. Guillen's body. "

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/03/08/national/main1381503.shtml


Ties:



Good thread by the way ;)

[docwho3]

DNA under Imette's fingernails - I looked for a news report (as opposed to a blog report or forum report) on this fact but could not find one stating that the DNA was anything other than inconclusive. I saw nothing that said it was only her own DNA conclusively tested. I did find :
. . .Does it disturb you, Dr. Kobilinsky, that they were saying the DNA is inconclusive? And we`ve got DNA, we believe, under her fingernails where she fought. I know she had broken fingernails. But where`s the sperm? If this was a rape, where`s the sperm to make that DNA match? We need that!
LARRY KOBILINSKY, FORENSIC SCIENTIST: Well, Let me answer that question very quickly. In the Elmont rape of that 15-year-old, the victim was forced to shower to remove physical evidence. In the rape of the 22- year-old in Queens, the victim was forced to wipe herself, clean herself with baby wipes. There`s indications that in the case of Imette St. Guillen, her body was cleaned off, so that any semen evidence would be removed.
As far as the DNA under the fingernails, I had predicted that this might happen. There may very well be a small amount of the perpetrator`s DNA under her fingernails, but it`s swamped out by her own DNA. And this is very commonly found when you do the analysis.
What they have to do now is some further testing using what we call Y- chromosome STRs, and perhaps other DNA on her body in very trace amounts. Even though he cleaned her up, he may have left some over. We use low-copy DNA methodology, which the medical examiner`s office is doing now. And I think that this will not be inconclusive. . .
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0603/09/ng.01.html

Note:I added the bolding.
Does anyone else have links to anything of news reports that are newer on this issue?
************
DNA under her fingernails: results inconclusive
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0603/09/ng.01.html
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime_file/story/398145p-337374c.html

[strach304]

When I first found out they were trying to pin the area rapes on him I figured that would help their case for Imette and that's why they were doing it not necessarily that he was guilty of it although that one sketch does look a lot like him. Here's my theory on what line they should be pursuing in that avenue; start with Richmond, Balto. and DC. they'll find victims there that are more willing to talk. The women in NY know or at least think the buck doesn't stop with him so if they do make an id on him they won't make it to trial to give testimony.

[docwho3]

Fibers match :
. . .NEW YORK - NYPD detectives have matched carpet fibers seized from the home of career criminal Darryl Littlejohn with threads recovered from the packing tape and blanket used to wrap up the face and body of rape and murder victim Imette St. Guillen of Boston, the Herald has learned. . .http://news.bostonherald.com/stGuillenMurder/view.bg?articleid=129652

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0603/09/acd.01.html

[PonderingThings]

THE SUSPECT:

Darryl Littlejohn - 7 time convicted felon

Alias's - 9 known alias's REFERENCE: http://www.nysun.com/article/28935 "Daryl Banks, Damon Wells, JonathanBlaze and John Handsome" REFERENCE: http://www.nypost.com/news/regionalnews/64815.htm

Cell phone - Littlejohn used his cell phone, in the area where Imette's body was found, 2 hours before Imette's body was discovered. REFERENCE: http://www.forbes.com/home/feeds/ap/2006/03/07/ap2576880.html more info on cell phone record he was within a mile of where body was found: REFERENCE http://wfrv.com/topstories/topstories_story_069082648.html


POSSIBLE RAPE ACCUSATIONS AGAINST DARRYL LITTLEJOHN:

The October 16th rape - 22 yr old woman: Victim DID pick Littlejohn out of a photo lineup, but in the subsequent actual line up she said her rapist was bigger. Physical evidence is still being compared to Littlejohn REFERENCE: http://www.nysun.com/article/28935

November rape of 15 year old in Long Island - LE is currently investigating possibility he is involved. Physical evidence still being compared to Littlejohn. REFERENCE: http://www.nysun.com/article/28935


The Witnesses:

Homeless woman - Saw Imette talking to Littlejohn outside the bar

Homeless man - Saw Imette being led to Littlejohn's van while he was saying "Don't worry" I'll take you home. REFERENCE: http://www.nypost.com/news/regionalnews/65076.htm

Cameras - more than 2 dozen cameras in the area, none show the victim, or the suspect walking on the street that night REFERENCE http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/story?section=local&id=3981332


BLANKET:

Blanket - believed to have come from the basement of "The Falls"

Semen on Blanket - Not Littlejohn's REFERENCE: http://www.ny1.com/ny1/content/index.jsp?stid=1&aid=57669

Cat hairs found out blanket - there are cats in the basement of "The Falls" but no word if the hairs match those cats. REFERENCE: http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/03/08/national/main1381503.shtml
Cats were combed and forensic tests will determine if its their hairs REFERENCE http://wfrv.com/topstories/topstories_story_069082648.html



CARPET FIBRES:

Carpet Fibres - The red fibres are a match to Littlejohn's home carpet BUT the carpet is "relatively common". REFERENCE: http://wfrv.com/topstories/topstories_story_069082648.html
Fibres are so common they are irrelevant REFERENCE: http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/story?section=local&id=3981332


DNA UNDER IMETTE'S FINGERNAILS:

Does not match Littlejohn's - REFERENCE http://wfrv.com/topstories/topstories_story_069082648.html

Her own DNA - LINK ?

Her DNA may be covering other DNA more sophisticated tests required: REFERENCE: http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0603/09/ng.01.html


ALL DNA:

ALL DNA is being retested, including samples that were deemed to be "inconclusive", using more sophisticated tests.

POSSIBLE 2ND SUSPECT?

Female customer at bar indicates possible accomplice REFERENCE http://wfrv.com/topstories/topstories_story_069082648.html

Littlejohn's neighborhood is being canvassed to possibly interview young men. http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/story?section=local&id=3981332

[docwho3]

I just watched a fox news report at 26 mins past noon CST that says that the first DNA tests were inconclusive and that we are still looking at waiting on more stringent testing to be completed.

I personally think it would "jumping the gun" at this point to declare the DNA conclusively does not match the POI/suspect.

I think they also said they are still working on the cat hair match.

It seems the door to this POI/suspect is not, by any means, closed.

[PonderingThings]

Doc no one has said the door is closed. The media has repeatedly reported that all DNA is being retested and some of the forensic tests take longer and they are awaiting the results.

This thread is about the information that has been reported in the media. Since no one has been charged in this crime its not about the court transcripts, etc.. Its about the investigation and what the reporters have been able to find out.

Whether those reports are right, wrong, incomplete, or essentially accurate we can only speculate. Only time will reveal where the case stands.

[docwho3]

Doc no one has said the door is closed. The media has repeatedly reported that all DNA is being retested and some of the forensic tests take longer and they are awaiting the results.

This thread is about the information that has been reported in the media. Since no one has been charged in this crime its not about the court transcripts, etc.. Its about the investigation and what the reporters have been able to find out.

Whether those reports are right, wrong, incomplete, or essentially accurate we can only speculate. Only time will reveal where the case stands. I wasn't accusing anyone of saying the door was closed. I was just commenting in general not to give up, sheesh. The thread is titled "The evidence - what is it linked/pointing to?" I posted about what the evidence is linked to but you started the thread and I guess that makes it yours so I will leave it alone.

[PonderingThings]

Doc it appears that I have offended you by responding to your comment. It was not my intention to do so and I'm sorry you took my words that way.

I do not claim property of this thread. I started it simply to show how little information has been revealed, followed up on, and pointing towards a killer or killers.

Nothing has been solved or closed. Mostly its just frustrating trying to glean what information is accurate and what information has been incorrectly reported. That is the problem with speculating on cases that are only updated by media sources. To make matters worse the TV media appears to say some things that do not appear in their online articles.

[docwho3]

Doc it appears that I have offended you by responding to your comment. It was not my intention to do so and I'm sorry you took my words that way.

I do not claim property of this thread. I started it simply to show how little information has been revealed, followed up on, and pointing towards a killer or killers.

Nothing has been solved or closed. Mostly its just frustrating trying to glean what information is accurate and what information has been incorrectly reported. That is the problem with speculating on cases that are only updated by media sources. To make matters worse the TV media appears to say some things that do not appear in their online articles.I had noticed that some people in the news and some others in various threads in various forums had seemed ready to abandon the current POI/suspect because they seemed to be under the impression that the DNA had cleared him but so far as I can tell from the news reports that is not true so I tried to add an encouraging word in my post about it being too soon to give up on a match to him. And since I had just seen the news report on TV I figured it wasn't on the websites yet and so I reported that in my post.

As to your response:Thank you for the kind words. Never mind my crabbiness. My son and his wife are visiting for several days and one of them came down with strep throat and the other got pneumonia in the left lung and then their car had a sensor go out somewhere and it tries to rev the motor when in park and it rained a lot here and both basement sump pumps are going every little bit and I have 2 more comps left to fix. . . .lol Maybe I need to just sit back with a cup of hot coacoa.

[scandi]

Good Morning,

Great thread Pondering! Has the fact that the red carpet in the basement of the Falls has also been mentioned as the same carpeting as in his home mean anything.

Also, you don't consider statements made by TH's viable media links unless they are printed, do you? I would agree tho that Koblinski would be an exception to that rule. I can't remember where I heard about the red carpet fibres in the basement, but haven't read everything printed so it's probably from a live interview with a reporter. :rolleyes:

Scandi

[scandi]

Definately go get a cup of hot cocoa Doc, as long as you sit back down in front of your computer!.

Scandi

[PonderingThings]

Doc perhaps I'll join you in getting a hot cocoa! We all deserve a break!
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/images/smilies/smile.gif



Good Morning,

Great thread Pondering! Has the fact that the red carpet in the basement of the Falls has also been mentioned as the same carpeting as in his home mean anything.

Also, you don't consider statements made by TH's viable media links unless they are printed, do you? I would agree tho that Koblinski would be an exception to that rule. I can't remember where I heard about the red carpet fibres in the basement, but haven't read everything printed so it's probably from a live interview with a reporter. :rolleyes:

Scandi
I have only read that the red carpet fibers match the red carpet in his home (not any carpet at the bar). However, it appears that red carpet was installed at many, many locations and is so common it will be difficult to prove the fibers came from his home specifically.

I only consider PRINTED versions of the story the most viable - the reason? Laws governing the truthfulness of written articles were put in place for the WRITTEN/PUBLISHED word. Therefore the "burden of truth" is stricter on a published article than an internet article from the same news source!

Same goes for a TV News Source. Many of the same laws that govern published articles cover the TV News. Their show has stronger laws of what they can say and show, that their website.

Most reputable news sources do try to maintain the same "level of truth" for their multiple outlets (Written, TV show, Internet articles, Blogs, etc.).

Having said that, I have NEVER actually read a NY Newspaper, nor have I seen any of their local News shows. In addition I don't get to see Nancy Grace or any of the other national shows (including CNN) - so I am somewhat limited to internet articles that with a hope and a prayer have some degree of accuracy.

Personally what I try to do is confirm, from more than one source, that the information is accurate. ...of course they may just be copying each other!

[JDB]

Good Morning,

Great thread Pondering! Has the fact that the red carpet in the basement of the Falls has also been mentioned as the same carpeting as in his home mean anything.

Also, you don't consider statements made by TH's viable media links unless they are printed, do you? I would agree tho that Koblinski would be an exception to that rule. I can't remember where I heard about the red carpet fibres in the basement, but haven't read everything printed so it's probably from a live interview with a reporter. :rolleyes:

Scandi

They the LE need alot more then the carpet fibers. from what I heard the Red carpet is to common.

[docwho3]

Cat hairs aren't so common as they belong to a specific cat so I eagerly wait for when the DNA on those comes back :)

[strach304]

I never heard anything about red carpet at the Falls only his apt. and it was said to be relatively common. There was a quilt I've read many different places it's supposed to have come from, we heard wire vs. ties, the blanket, etc. You sure can't believe what you see in print either because unless they put info out there that was intentionaaly fabricated with the intent of damaging someone then you can't get them on slander or libel.

[scandi]

Yea Strach I agree. I do also think Pondering has a good take on what is viable and what isn't. Boy did we learn in the Peterson case, right! :D There were links on so many things that were never verified at the end of the trial - drove me bonkers!

I really think links are a guideline for study. Look in Imette's case, LE is already learning they could be wrong and are now qualifying things, like the match of carpet fibres.

Scandi

[docwho3]

I never heard anything about red carpet at the Falls only his apt. and it was said to be relatively common. There was a quilt I've read many different places it's supposed to have come from, we heard wire vs. ties, the blanket, etc. You sure can't believe what you see in print either because unless they put info out there that was intentionaaly fabricated with the intent of damaging someone then you can't get them on slander or libel. I read ties on the hands and shoestrings on the feet. Thats a combo :)

[PonderingThings]

THE SUSPECT:

Darryl Littlejohn - 7 time convicted felon

Alias's - 9 known alias's REFERENCE: http://www.nysun.com/article/28935 "Daryl Banks, Damon Wells, JonathanBlaze and John Handsome" REFERENCE: http://www.nypost.com/news/regionalnews/64815.htm

Cell phone - Littlejohn used his cell phone, in the area where Imette's body was found, 2 hours before Imette's body was discovered. REFERENCE: http://www.forbes.com/home/feeds/ap/2006/03/07/ap2576880.html more info on cell phone record he was within a mile of where body was found: REFERENCE http://wfrv.com/topstories/topstories_story_069082648.html

Worked for a bail enforcement company - took a 30 hour course, had a license, could have got the bullet proof vest and gun there. http://www.nypost.com/news/regionalnews/65156.htm


POSSIBLE RAPE ACCUSATIONS AGAINST DARRYL LITTLEJOHN:

The October 16th rape - 22 yr old woman: Victim DID pick Littlejohn out of a photo lineup, but in the subsequent actual line up she said her rapist was bigger. Physical evidence is still being compared to Littlejohn REFERENCE: http://www.nysun.com/article/28935

November rape of 15 year old in Long Island - LE is currently investigating possibility he is involved. Physical evidence still being compared to Littlejohn. REFERENCE: http://www.nysun.com/article/28935


The Witnesses:

Homeless woman (Lorraine House, 50) - Saw Imette talking to Littlejohn outside the bar http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/399067p-338092c.html

Homeless man (Cruz) - Saw Imette being led to Littlejohn's van while he was saying "Don't worry" I'll take you home. REFERENCE: http://www.nypost.com/news/regionalnews/65076.htm

Cameras - more than 2 dozen cameras in the area, none show the victim, or the suspect walking on the street that night REFERENCE http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/story?section=local&id=3981332


BLANKET:

Blanket - believed to have come from the basement of "The Falls"

Semen on Blanket - Not Littlejohn's REFERENCE: http://www.ny1.com/ny1/content/index.jsp?stid=1&aid=57669

Cat hairs found out blanket - there are cats in the basement of "The Falls" but no word if the hairs match those cats. REFERENCE: http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/03/08/national/main1381503.shtml
Cats were combed and forensic tests will determine if its their hairs REFERENCE http://wfrv.com/topstories/topstories_story_069082648.html



CARPET FIBRES:

Carpet Fibres - The red fibres are a match to Littlejohn's home carpet BUT the carpet is "relatively common". REFERENCE: http://wfrv.com/topstories/topstories_story_069082648.html

Fibres are so common they are irrelevant REFERENCE: http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/story?section=local&id=3981332

Fibres were found on the tape around Imette's face and on the comforter that swaddled Imette's body http://news.bostonherald.com/stGuillenMurder/view.bg?articleid=130104


PLASTIC TIES

The plastic ties that bound her hands were "of the kind" that were found in Littlejohn's home http://news.bostonherald.com/stGuillenMurder/view.bg?articleid=130104


SHOELACES

Bound her feet? Link?

TAPE

Brown packing tape that was used on Imette's face was "of the kind" found in Littlejohn's home http://news.bostonherald.com/stGuillenMurder/view.bg?articleid=130104

DISPENCER Tape was applied using a dispencer - link?


DNA UNDER IMETTE'S FINGERNAILS:

Does not match Littlejohn's - REFERENCE http://wfrv.com/topstories/topstories_story_069082648.html

Her own DNA - LINK ?

Her DNA may be covering other DNA more sophisticated tests required: REFERENCE: http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0603/09/ng.01.html


ALL DNA:

ALL DNA is being retested, including samples that were deemed to be "inconclusive", using more sophisticated tests.


POSSIBLE 2ND SUSPECT?

Female customer at bar indicates possible accomplice REFERENCE http://wfrv.com/topstories/topstories_story_069082648.html

Littlejohn's neighborhood is being canvassed to possibly interview young men. http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/story?section=local&id=3981332

LE is calling people in Littlejohn's cell phone and recording their voices to compare to the 911 call. http://news.bostonherald.com/stGuillenMurder/view.bg?articleid=130104


WHAT WAS DONE TO IMETTE:

Tied up, raped, strangled http://msnbc.msn.com/id/11785818/site/newsweek/

beaten

Sock found in her mouth http://msnbc.msn.com/id/11785818/site/newsweek/

Packing taped wrapped around her head http://msnbc.msn.com/id/11785818/site/newsweek/

Vertical pieces of packing tape placed on her face
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/11785818/site/newsweek/

Her hair had been cut off on one side only

Genitals cut

Clothing, purse & cell phone missing


Edit to list: Added info on homeless witnesses/bail enforcement company/what was done to Imette/2nd suspect/tape/plastic ties/shoelaces/tape dispencer....

[strach304]

I tracked down the source for the red carpet at the Falls Scandi saw. I read a recent update on Steve Huff's crime blog and apparently it was stated by Dan Riehl on his blog.

[felder]

PonderingThings, your evidence summary is excellent. You might want to add the following to your next update:

He (witness Miguel Angel Cruz) also told cops about distinctive jewelry that Imette was wearing - a detail that detectives have not revealed publicly.

http://www.nypost.com/news/regionalnews/65076.htm

[i.b.nora]

In today's Boston Herald article I noted that

# DNA found so far on the comforter does not match DNA taken from Littlejohn’s food utensils.

So, perhaps this answers the question of how they got his DNA if he refused to give it.

This article preceded the Police Commissioner's announcement today.

[concernedperson]

In today's Boston Herald article I noted that

# DNA found so far on the comforter does not match DNA taken from Littlejohn’s food utensils.

So, perhaps this answers the question of how they got his DNA if he refused to give it.

This article preceded the Police Commissioner's announcement today.

I understand they sent in Chinese food and captured the utensils to get a DNA analysis.

[dragonfly]

In today's Boston Herald article I noted that

# DNA found so far on the comforter does not match DNA taken from Littlejohn’s food utensils.

So, perhaps this answers the question of how they got his DNA if he refused to give it.

This article preceded the Police Commissioner's announcement today.Glad you mentioned this again i.b.nora, I was thinking this is what I remembered too,... the source for his DNA.
Frankly, I have to tell you I am thrilled that this was the source! What this means is that LE had absolutely NO CONTACT with any of Littlejohn's blood! I don't even want to hear the defense thinking about planted evidence!!!

[docwho3]

Glad you mentioned this again i.b.nora, I was thinking this is what I remembered too,... the source for his DNA.
Frankly, I have to tell you I am thrilled that this was the source! What this means is that LE had absolutely NO CONTACT with any of Littlejohn's blood! I don't even want to hear the defense thinking about planted evidence!!!They can always try to stick a latex glove on his hand and say "if it doesn't fit . . . "

(Sorry, couldn't resist trying to add a little humor.)

[dragonfly]

They can always try to stick a latex glove on his hand and say "if it doesn't fit . . . "

(Sorry, couldn't resist trying to add a little humor.)
Yes, docwho3 LOL it's too bad it's come to this!

[Vet4Bush]

Gotta wonder if the two homeless drunks who saw Littlejohn load Imette in a van across the street from the Falls can pick out Littlejohn in a lineup. Littlejohn has escaped three lineups already without being picked. My guess is they were blind drunk, only interested in the 40,000 clams for reward.

[i.b.nora]

According to the latest ABC News article I just posted on the media thread:

"Authorities say phone records place Littlejohn near the spot where here body was dumped. Sources tell ABC News that investigators have linked hair on the blanket that was used to wrap her body to Littlejohn's cat."

Edited to add this from same article:

"In fact, the NYPD confirmed today that they will also present evidence to the grand jury that connects Littlejohn to other crimes in the area. Sources tell Eyewitness News that includes at least one prior sex assault."

[concernedperson]

According to the latest ABC News article I just posted on the media thread:

"Authorities say phone records place Littlejohn near the spot where here body was dumped. Sources tell ABC News that investigators have linked hair on the blanket that was used to wrap her body to Littlejohn's cat."

Well, the deeper we go the more evidence is apparent. It is really too bad NY doesn't have the death penalty. Maybe, you locals should proceed with this and put a bill up that would allow for it.

[railbird]

Ponderingthings, there were two lineups, two different victims and neither one picked him out.

Edited, because I had the wrong name. Not enough coffee yet.

Eye witness evidence is notoriously unreliable and I thought line-ups were done with multiple 'suspects'? Unless all men participating in the line up were the same height and build, how would she know Littlejohn was not the "right" size to match her offender?

[strach304]

His lawyer will tear up the homeless people on the stand anyway, that's a pretty safe bet. IMO he is a pretty ordinary looking guy and he started right away with the race card so LE knew they'd need forensics to proceed. He also had his lawyer and Aunt as mouthpieces to the media spewing the same crap. Not everyone can be scared off though so if they try they will suceed.

[dragonfly]

http://news.bostonherald.com/stGuillenMurder/view.bg?articleid=130225

I have long suspected this!

Increasingly popular TV crime dramas are giving criminals “cheap and easy” lessons on how to get away with murder - and the monster who raped and killed Imette St. Guillen might have learned a trick or two from the tube.

Criminal experts say there are similarities between the savage unsolved murder of the New York student and crime shows, such as “CSI: Crime Scene Investigation.”

St. Guillen’s body was dumped in a remote location away from the crime scene, a tactic often used by killers seen on TV.
St. Guillen’s killer knew enough to avoid leaving fingerprints on the packing tape wrapped around her body and face. Efficient murderers also restrain their victims.
St. Guillen’s body was wiped clean with disinfectant. Alcohol swabs were found in the home of prime suspect Darryl Littlejohn. Alcohol cleans away DNA better than water but not as good as bleach, experts said.
“If you watch CSI, you’d know you have to use bleach or alcohol,” said former Massachusetts prosecutor Wendy Murphy.
“(The killer) knew enough not to go anywhere near it with his fingers,” Murphy said of the tape - the best repository for fingerprints. “Bad guys are learning tricks. Criminals don’t want to get caught. It’s cheap and easy.”

[Mygirlsadie]

vet4bush I agree with you . Unless the homeless ppl were paid by LJ to help him load her in the van to begin with I don't see how they would of been able to tell what kind of jewelry she had on or what LJ looked like.



Gotta wonder if the two homeless drunks who saw Littlejohn load Imette in a van across the street from the Falls can pick out Littlejohn in a lineup. Littlejohn has escaped three lineups already without being picked. My guess is they were blind drunk, only interested in the 40,000 clams for reward.

[Mygirlsadie]

Thats just terrible. Almost like it's a 'how to' show. I love CSI & all the other crime shows but if it means pulling these types of shows off the air because of psychopaths getting ideas then do it..We will all live.. (literally)



http://news.bostonherald.com/stGuillenMurder/view.bg?articleid=130225

I have long suspected this!

Increasingly popular TV crime dramas are giving criminals “cheap and easy” lessons on how to get away with murder - and the monster who raped and killed Imette St. Guillen might have learned a trick or two from the tube.

Criminal experts say there are similarities between the savage unsolved murder of the New York student and crime shows, such as “CSI: Crime Scene Investigation.”

St. Guillen’s body was dumped in a remote location away from the crime scene, a tactic often used by killers seen on TV.
St. Guillen’s killer knew enough to avoid leaving fingerprints on the packing tape wrapped around her body and face. Efficient murderers also restrain their victims.
St. Guillen’s body was wiped clean with disinfectant. Alcohol swabs were found in the home of prime suspect Darryl Littlejohn. Alcohol cleans away DNA better than water but not as good as bleach, experts said.
“If you watch CSI, you’d know you have to use bleach or alcohol,” said former Massachusetts prosecutor Wendy Murphy.
“(The killer) knew enough not to go anywhere near it with his fingers,” Murphy said of the tape - the best repository for fingerprints. “Bad guys are learning tricks. Criminals don’t want to get caught. It’s cheap and easy.”

[dragonfly]

Thats just terrible. Almost like it's a 'how to' show. I love CSI & all the other crime shows but if it means pulling these types of shows off the air because of psychopaths getting ideas then do it..We will all live.. (literally)Mygirlsadie, I know what you mean I am a big fan of these shows too. While our motives are seening the bad guys caught, predators can also be watching to gain insight into what the latest science is able to uncover as evidence. I also do believe that any time spent in prison is a train ground for these bad guys too. They learn from those who are always looking for a way to do a crime and not have to do the time.

[strach304]

In today's news articles it states that LE got his dna profile only 2 years ago as a condition of his release so any other crimes from before then if he left dna behind wouldn't have been in the system at the time. I wish Md. and Va. would take a look at him now because both states do have the DP.

[leesa]

I saw last night on the news that they found matched his DNA to the blood on the plastic ties used to bind Imette's hands.

[strach304]

I saw last night on the news that they found matched his DNA to the blood on the plastic ties used to bind Imette's hands.

That's what the press conference was about yesterday.

[mocity]

Did LE or anyone else ever say if Littlejohn had any scratches or anything? I am hoping she caused a little damage to the monster.

[Buzzm1]

Littlejohn will never see the outside again. They have him by the "short hairs", whatever that means (it takes a little visualation/imagination). The ABC article, that I posted yesterday, said they had DNA matched him with another rape--it didn't say when/where. I'm interested in hearing how many charges the Grand Jury indicts him on; there should be quite a few.

[dark_shadows]

It was said today that this could be the start of a serial killing for Littlejohn or that he did commit serial killings and had not been caught.This was stated today on Foxnews.

[leann coburn]

He must have had a cut of some kind in order to have left his blood on the ties (I hope I am not assuming wrong that his blood was found there). Also, as many have said, it is easy to cut yourself on a tape dispenser. My hubby is an ebay nut, so he's always using it to ship.

[mocity]

Someone mentioned his DNA was tied to another rape yesterday. I am confused. If they had his DNA "on file" because he is a career criminal and had DNA from a rape... why wasn't this already matched in the national database? Isn't that the purpose? If so and it had been matched earlier I would think this girl could have been saved???? Am I off target?

[strach304]

We have discussed the dna here mocity because we wondered the same thing in todays reports I read that they got his dna 2 years ago as a condition of his release. We focused on that too because if he's a convicted felon they should've had it but maybe the way they have to run it if they don't have a suspect is like searching for a needle in a haystack? He had no prior sex offenses so maybe that's why his wasn't looked at?

[willowhorse]

Someone mentioned his DNA was tied to another rape yesterday. I am confused. If they had his DNA "on file" because he is a career criminal and had DNA from a rape... why wasn't this already matched in the national database? Isn't that the purpose? If so and it had been matched earlier I would think this girl could have been saved???? Am I off target?
mocity, You are right on target! This scum should have been off the street a long time ago! Also, New York City needs to require background checks on all bouncers and require licenses. There is no excuse for the bar's lack of responsibility to Imette!

[strach304]

I want to add an interesting tidbit for you guys to chew on after seeing some of the conjecture on the ctv boards (I haven't posted there) motive is one topic and the brutality of Imette's crime keep popping up. First of all he's a sadistic sexual psychopath and we all know they just get worse over time so imo a sexual assault is what starts it and I refuse to believe Imette was his first murder victim.

As of today I read reports from the neighbors saying he did beat his girlfriends but until the dna link was announced these people did not remember it. I worked with a black girl named Angela that told me about the Littlejohn name coming from a rapper and her whole attitude about him was that she looked down on him and he claimed he didn't like black women and my theory on that was he thought other women weren't wise to scammers like him whereas black women automatically knew what he was about at first sight. Imette was a strong independant woman that he probably couldn't scam and he needed that power trip and on top of that we already know he couldn't let her live because she'd report it and id him.

[panthera]

Gotta wonder if the two homeless drunks who saw Littlejohn load Imette in a van across the street from the Falls can pick out Littlejohn in a lineup. Littlejohn has escaped three lineups already without being picked. My guess is they were blind drunk, only interested in the 40,000 clams for reward.
Or money the Dorrians or the NY Post paid them...the distinctive jewelry the 'witness' described could have been described to him by Danny Dorrian who was tending bar that night. The witness would not be able to see across the street at 4:00am with the lighting on that street. Imette also was supposed to be wearing a long grey coat over a white sweater/sweatshirt hoodie. What jewelry is it he saw???

[dolly1]

I see no reason to attack this man's credibility. Just because he's living on the street doesn't mean he's a liar, drug user or a drunk. Many street people are sharp at noticing details; they do have to live by their wits. I pray to God what he tells the police help them catch this fiend. Someone with this much rage, against women, will probably repeat.

It was 4 a.m. eh? I always told my daughters...nothing good happens after midnight.

[panthera]

Did LE or anyone else ever say if Littlejohn had any scratches or anything? I am hoping she caused a little damage to the monster.
He had a scratch on the back of his neck. So if his blood(DNA) is on the wrist ties, you'd think he also cut his fingers - maybe? Unless he had other scratches that healed during the time the Dorrians waited to tell the police that Imette left with Littlejohn.

[mocity]

Regardless of the scratches something happened to where his DNA is on those ties. Thank goodness.

[panthera]

Regardless of the scratches something happened to where his DNA is on those ties. Thank goodness.
It would seem he cut his finger without knowing it while securing the wrist ties. As careful as these perps try to be they always leave something monumental behind. However, his defense is probably going to be that this happened at some other time (same kind of ties were in a box at The Falls) or that the NYPD planted the 'evidence'.

[LovelyPigeon]

The use of Littlejohn's van is apparently in question:

A Brooklyn grand jury is hearing evidence that police say links the bar bouncer to the murder of Imette Saint Guillen. Police say the ties used to bind the victim's hands had traces of his blood. But Littlejohn's lawyer says he has concerns about the police investigation.

For example: the blue van in Littlejohn's driveway. O'Donnell says it can't be the vehicle Saint Guillen got into the night she was killed.

Kevin O'Donnell, Defense Attorney: "That van has been in his driveway for the last three months. The axel is damaged and that car, if it's able to run, can't go anymore than 20 miles an hour without stalling." http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/story?section=local&id=3996030

Has there been media report of what transportation Littlejohn was using if his van wasn't operating?

[T'sNana]

The van bothers me as well. I wouldn't consider this a slam-dunk case just with the witness(es) of the van. There are problems if they are describing THIS particular van for sure! I wonder if someone else had a similar van that he was using or if a van resembling his van was in the area? The DNA is very compelling, IMO. The use of Littlejohn's van is apparently in question:

A Brooklyn grand jury is hearing evidence that police say links the bar bouncer to the murder of Imette Saint Guillen. Police say the ties used to bind the victim's hands had traces of his blood. But Littlejohn's lawyer says he has concerns about the police investigation.

For example: the blue van in Littlejohn's driveway. O'Donnell says it can't be the vehicle Saint Guillen got into the night she was killed.

Kevin O'Donnell, Defense Attorney: "That van has been in his driveway for the last three months. The axel is damaged and that car, if it's able to run, can't go anymore than 20 miles an hour without stalling." http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/story?section=local&id=3996030

Has there been media report of what transportation Littlejohn was using if his van wasn't operating?

[dragonfly]

http://abcnews.go.com/US/LegalCenter/story?id=1756433&page=2

from the article just posted in the media thread by i. b. nora

In addition, Kelly said, other evidence now links Littlejohn to past sexual assaults — rapes and attempted rapes — that help establish a pattern of sexual violence. In those cases, women were bound and washed or swabbed clean by an assailant. St. Guillen's case bears several similarities.

ABC News has learned the evidence includes a DNA match to Littlejohn on the handcuffs used to bind a victim in an alleged attempted rape. Two victims of those assaults failed to identify Littlejohn as their assailant in police lineups held earlier this month.

O'Donnell said he would have no comment on any of the DNA evidence "until my own experts analyze it."

Besides the DNA evidence, detectives and forensic examiners have linked cat hairs found on the floral-patterned blanket wrapping the criminal justice graduate student's corpse to a cat belonging to Littlejohn, according to ABC News sources.

Plus, carpet fibers found on the old blanket matched red carpet samples taken from Littlejohn's Queens, N.Y., home.

[panthera]

"Fibers discovered on the tape on the victim's head were consistent with those from a rug and two fur-collared jackets from the defendant's apartment," police commissioner Ray Kelly said. Investigators said they found mink and rabbit fur on the tape.

http://www.news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060323/