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Samiya
01-10-2007, 01:38 AM
:eek: A new thread, lol.

Praying praying praying for new news.

Sami.

close_enough
01-10-2007, 08:02 AM
checked the last thread & i see there was nothing new as of yesterday...hot coffee here....

MREG2
01-10-2007, 12:23 PM
Fran, the guy you are talking about is Mel Ignatow. The crime happened right here in Louisville, KY. The SOB is now free, walking the streets. He was released from prison sometime in Nov or Dec. He was staying with his son not too far from me and people were outraged that he even came back here. They interviewed his son and he said that his father (some father) was just tying up some loose ends and would be on his way. The son is also sickened by the people's outrage saying that his "father served his time and the community should get over it." OMG!!! I was so p*ssed to read that statement. That POS only served time for perjury NOT for TORTURING and MURDERING the Brenda. And the community should get over it?!?!?! Whatever.

Sorry for hijacking this thread....

Samiya
01-10-2007, 02:01 PM
People magazine to feature an article on Michelle

Raleigh People magazine plans to feature a local high-profile murder case in an upcoming issue.

Michelle Young, 29, was found beaten to death in her Wake County home Nov. 3. She was pregnant at the time of her death, and her 2-year-old daughter was found unharmed by her side.

http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/1132362/

Sami

jilly
01-10-2007, 02:39 PM
Great to hear Sami - thanks for posting this. I doubt there will be much content but at least someone is stepping up to give this case some exposure!!

scandi
01-10-2007, 05:20 PM
Hi guys,

That is great news. It also says it might be as early as this weekend when that issue hits the stands. Maybe they will have some good photos.

panthera
01-10-2007, 06:42 PM
People magazine to feature an article on Michelle

Raleigh People magazine plans to feature a local high-profile murder case in an upcoming issue.

Michelle Young, 29, was found beaten to death in her Wake County home Nov. 3. She was pregnant at the time of her death, and her 2-year-old daughter was found unharmed by her side.

http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/1132362/

SamiThanks for posting the story and I definitely will be buying that issue! ;)

Samiya
01-10-2007, 08:47 PM
Thanks for posting the story and I definitely will be buying that issue! ;)Can someone buy me a copy too? I'd be happy to pay for it and postage to Australia :) (Lol, anyone have paypal)

I don't think we get that mag over here.........unless is the one with all the boobies in it, lol. I think that's the only People mag we get here and if I bought one of those my DH will be a wunderen, lmao!.

Sami

Taximom
01-11-2007, 01:59 AM
Hi guys, I saw the cover of the new People on one of those E shows tonight (last night) and it's the cover story!!! Yay! I hope Jason and his family feel some pressure now. I hope Cassidy doesn't see the magazine in a store somewhere. :(

Edited because I didn't see the cover originally on the WRAL site. Oops!

Taximom
01-11-2007, 02:01 AM
Can someone buy me a copy too? I'd be happy to pay for it and postage to Australia :) (Lol, anyone have paypal)

I don't think we get that mag over here.........unless is the one with all the boobies in it, lol. I think that's the only People mag we get here and if I bought one of those my DH will be a wunderen, lmao!.

Sami
I'll get you one, Sami. Let me clean out my pm's and we can work out the details-addy and such.

raisincharlie
01-11-2007, 04:28 AM
People magazine to feature an article on Michelle

Raleigh People magazine plans to feature a local high-profile murder case in an upcoming issue.

Michelle Young, 29, was found beaten to death in her Wake County home Nov. 3. She was pregnant at the time of her death, and her 2-year-old daughter was found unharmed by her side.

http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/1132362/

Sami
Here's a bit more info about the People Mag article, according to this article anonymous sources provided info which implicates JY - maybe a teaser:

http://www.newsobserver.com/141/story/531184.html

Don't know but of course there is the other side - perfect husband who loved his wife...sounds familiar. JMO

Bobbisangel
01-11-2007, 05:55 AM
I wish they would just arrested his sorry butt.

less0305
01-11-2007, 10:18 AM
How did I completely miss the $1million life insurance policy?? I heard this on NBC this morning and I nearly fell out. I have not read or heard that before this morning. Can someone point me to information about this?

packerdog
01-11-2007, 11:30 AM
How did I completely miss the $1million life insurance policy?? I heard this on NBC this morning and I nearly fell out. I have not read or heard that before this morning. Can someone point me to information about this?

Well that says alot. Million $ life insurance on someone so young, wonder when it was taken out. Where were those insurance papers found? Were they in the SUV?

Floh
01-11-2007, 11:42 AM
Is it really above normal? a $1m premium nowadays?

i think i read it cost something like $500 per annum. but i've been mistaken before. and likely will be again. :truce:

when you lose a working partner, not only is it tragic personally, but also financially. so thinking about it, $1m isn't the riches it once was.

BUT, it may be enough to save someone's butt who has gotten themselves into a tricky financial situation, for sure.

less0305
01-11-2007, 11:46 AM
Well that says alot. Million $ life insurance on someone so young, wonder when it was taken out. Where were those insurance papers found? Were they in the SUV?

This morning on the Today show someone stated the fact that the husband took out $1 million life insurance policy three months before her death gave the police suspicion he was involved in her death. I had never heard that before this morning. Has anyone else heard or read that - that a life insurance policy for $1 million was taken out three months before her death?

Scout
01-11-2007, 12:11 PM
This morning on the Today show someone stated the fact that the husband took out $1 million life insurance policy three months before her death gave the police suspicion he was involved in her death. I had never heard that before this morning. Has anyone else heard or read that - that a life insurance policy for $1 million was taken out three months before her death?

One of the "insiders" posted at CTV that they had both taken out $1 million life insurance policies recently -- within the last year, IIRC. Not sure it was specified as being three months prior to murder, but that would coincide with when Jason started working for ChartOne.

packerdog
01-11-2007, 12:12 PM
This morning on the Today show someone stated the fact that the husband took out $1 million life insurance policy three months before her death gave the police suspicion he was involved in her death. I had never heard that before this morning. Has anyone else heard or read that - that a life insurance policy for $1 million was taken out three months before her death?

Thanks for the info Less. I guess it's not so much the amount of the policy but only 3 months ago is a red flag. I have to wonder how much insurance Jason has on himself.

packerdog
01-11-2007, 12:14 PM
One of the "insiders" posted at CTV that they had both taken out $1 million life insurance policies recently -- within the last year, IIRC. Not sure it was specified as being three months prior to murder, but that would coincide with when Jason started working for ChartOne.

And right after he he had an affair with MM.

FactsareFacts
01-11-2007, 12:16 PM
Thanks for the info Less. I guess it's not so much the amount of the policy but only 3 months ago is a red flag. I have to wonder how much insurance Jason has on himself.
Three months ago is when he started his new job. Sounds like maybe something to do with that.

FactsareFacts
01-11-2007, 12:18 PM
And right after he he had an affair with MM.

I thought they got together in Sept.? Three months before the murder would be the begining of August wouldn't it?:confused:

Samiya
01-11-2007, 12:30 PM
This morning on the Today show someone stated the fact that the husband took out $1 million life insurance policy three months before her death gave the police suspicion he was involved in her death. I had never heard that before this morning. Has anyone else heard or read that - that a life insurance policy for $1 million was taken out three months before her death?mmmmm........

3 months before Chele's death....

MM
+
Insurance policy

what next? 3 months in planning? Would explain why Duffield was chosen on route to Bravardo, oops Brevard.

susPISHass :bang:

Sami

Samiya
01-11-2007, 12:33 PM
I thought they got together in Sept.? Three months before the murder would be the begining of August wouldn't it?:confused:Yes, August.

Sami

Taximom
01-11-2007, 12:34 PM
Three months ago is when he started his new job. Sounds like maybe something to do with that.
Why would getting a new job affect your spouse's life insurance, FactsareFacts? Other than MY being listed as a beneficiary on any life insurance rec'd through work, I can't see how this would affect it. I'm just wondering out loud, Facts!

Gosh, if you can get 1mill for about $500 per year, hubby and I are seriously doing something wrong. We are paying more than that for WAY less than 1 mill. Hmm. :cool:

When I worked, I had a large insurance policy through my job. Now that I'm "just" a homemaker.... I wonder what is typical nowadays for younger, working couples with children.

Anyway, nothing will surprise me about insurance in this case. I will be interested if there were changes or additions made by him prior to that car "accident".

Does anyone remember a case where the wife was murdered and the girlfriend of the husband actually went w/him to the insurance agency to take out increased life insurance on the wife, prior to her murder? She signed as the wife and everything. They got caught, of course.

If Michelle Money had anything to do with this, I'm guessing she would have brought that up by now.

Sorry, rambling.

Samiya
01-11-2007, 12:34 PM
I'll get you one, Sami. Let me clean out my pm's and we can work out the details-addy and such.Thanks hon,

Close beat you to it. But I really appreciate your offer :)

Hugs
Sami
xxx

Taximom
01-11-2007, 12:36 PM
Thanks hon,

Close beat you to it. But I really appreciate your offer :)

Hugs
Sami
xxx
No problem, Sami! Close must be feeling better!

Samiya
01-11-2007, 12:40 PM
Okes,

I've done some calculations going on the 'possibility of Jason being the perp' and backtracking.

I'll type it up :)

Sami

wufdude
01-11-2007, 01:39 PM
bad link removed

not that this was unexpected but new news anyway....

thanks for the repost...

Samiya
01-11-2007, 01:48 PM
http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/1133617/

Thought I'd repost the link so it'll work :)

Thanks WufDude :)

Sami

Floh
01-11-2007, 01:50 PM
http://http://wral.com/news/local/story/1133617/

not that this was unexpected but new news anyway....


Authorities: Youngs in Financial Trouble Before Slaying

Michelle and Jason Young were in financial straits before she was beaten to death two months ago, according to a court document obtained by WRAL.

http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/1133617/

Things are moving on, then!

Floh
01-11-2007, 01:53 PM
http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/1133617/

Thought I'd repost the link so it'll work :)

Thanks WufDude :)

Sami

Ha! we're the business!

thanks for the heads up, WufDude! :)

Floh
01-11-2007, 01:55 PM
not that this was unexpected but new news anyway....

I agree this wasn't unexpected, but it is confirmation of suspicions.

less0305
01-11-2007, 02:08 PM
It also mentions the $1 to $2 million insurance policy. Doesn't say when it was taken out, but says it's a rather large policy.

Samiya
01-11-2007, 02:31 PM
Some of the credit for this goes to Scout and Raisin :)

If Jason *doubled back* after originally leaving Thursday night this gets quite interesting. These are 'straight runs' times, ie without stopping. Just points on the maps. Of course stops extend the times.

Raleigh via Duffield to Brevard is a total 7 hours 32. If a 'straight run' he would've left Raleigh around 7:30am Friday 3rd. He'd be in Duffield around 12:20pm, arriving in Brevard around 3pm.

If he had gone (comparitive example) via Danville, thanks RaisinCharlie.

Raleigh via Danville via Duffield to Brevard is a total of 8 hours 33 minutes. If a 'straight run' he would've left Raleigh around 6:30am Friday 3nd. He would've been in Danville around 8am, then in Duffield around 12:20pm, then Brevard around 3pm.

Now.....If Jason 'back tracked', then we can probably say that there was no business meeting as there's no way he could fit one in if he arrived in Brevard around 3pm. Even leaving earlier in the am by 3 to 4 hours would leave no time for a meeting....but would leave time to clean up at a motel/hotel. But leaving the night before, or even afternoon before would giev him plenty of rest for what lay ahead.

yep, my brain cells are now officially dead lol.

All JMO :) well except the brain cells part, lol.

Sami

Samiya
01-11-2007, 02:36 PM
OMG... :banghead:

The "document" they're quoting is the Non Testimonial Order.

Read closely :)

Sami

Floh
01-11-2007, 02:42 PM
OMG... :banghead:

The "document" they're quoting is the Non Testimonial Order.

Read closely :)

Sami

I'm a thicko what does Non Testimonial Order mean, please?

Samiya
01-11-2007, 02:43 PM
Seems like no-one wants to be scooped, check this one

http://www.newsobserver.com/1413/story/531283.html

And it basically confirms my opinion that the 'document' referred to is the Non Testimonial order.

Sami

Samiya
01-11-2007, 02:45 PM
I'm a thicko what does Non Testimonial Order mean, please?It's an order which allows them to collect forensic evidence without interviewing him.

And by the sounds of the article I just posted she struggled with her attacker.

He might be arrested before People comes out, lol.

Sami

raisincharlie
01-11-2007, 02:55 PM
It's an order which allows them to collect forensic evidence without interviewing him.

And by the sounds of the article I just posted she struggled with her attacker.

He might be arrested before People comes out, lol.

Sami


If you check the link:

http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/1133617/

and go down a ways to the right there is a link for "The request for Evidence"

This is the order and it is very interesting.

Floh
01-11-2007, 02:59 PM
It's an order which allows them to collect forensic evidence without interviewing him.

And by the sounds of the article I just posted she struggled with her attacker.

He might be arrested before People comes out, lol.

Sami


Thank you and let's hope so. i'm sorry Cassidy seems about to lose her remaining parent, but it would be no life for her to be stuck with a man who murdered her mother. if, indeed, he did so.

ther would have been something solid reported which would redeem him of suspicion by now, i believe.

pack_fan
01-11-2007, 03:07 PM
The order gives a lot of detail. Signs of struggle, footprints and possible dna left at the scene. I tend to beleive that forensics is coming back with the release of the vehicle and also the testimonial evidence released. I think that an arrest could be soon. Hope so for Michelle and her family.

I think the footprints will be significant. JY is a big man. This would definately rule out a lot of people. His footprints would not be mistaken for female.

Also signs of a struggle, in the testimonial order gives reason for body photographs, hair and other forms of dna.

Did anyone else catch the fact that the testimonial order also included pubic hair? I thought this was rather strange and would imagine that it would only be requested if they found some at the scene.

raisincharlie
01-11-2007, 03:08 PM
From the NTO


" Crime scene indicates possible struggle between victim and perpertrator, which could have resulted in injuries to the perpertrator, which injuries, or evidence thereof, may heal, or become undetectable over time."

Samiya
01-11-2007, 03:14 PM
If you check the link:

http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/1133617/

and go down a ways to the right there is a link for "The request for Evidence"

This is the order and it is very interesting.Lol, no need to go there. I have a print out on my desk :)

Good to see everyone here.....and glad of some news too

Sami
xxx

raisincharlie
01-11-2007, 03:17 PM
Lol, no need to go there. I have a print out on my desk :)

Good to see everyone here.....and glad of some news too

Sami
xxxYou better watch out ! Those "print outs" could be deadly :eek:

I don't think some fellow posters saw that link off to the side...just in case!

Samiya
01-11-2007, 03:18 PM
Did anyone else catch the fact that the testimonial order also included pubic hair? I thought this was rather strange and would imagine that it would only be requested if they found some at the scene.It's not unusual to gather pubic hair for evidence....there ae some hubby's who fake a sexual assault...who have absolutely NO idea that they'll get plucked, lol. (actually combed, but if none come out....they are plucked)

Hand me a bowl of wax and I'll do Jas properly :)

Sami

jilly
01-11-2007, 03:19 PM
Wow. Footprints and skin cell evidence, possible injuries to JY. This is BIG. Thanks you guys!!

packerdog
01-11-2007, 03:25 PM
It's good to see some new news coming out. Now I wonder about the sun glasses.

Samiya
01-11-2007, 03:27 PM
You better watch out ! Those "print outs" could be deadly :eek:

I'm safe, my hubby's at work and my house is well armed :) We have interior and exterior alarms. The person would have to be under 2 ft tall to get around the exterior alarms and all the door locks and handles are 4 ft plus window bottom ledges are 3ft off the ground.

He won't be sneaking back in in a hurry, lol.

Sami

jilly
01-11-2007, 03:28 PM
It's good to see some new news coming out. Now I wonder about the sun glasses.

Me too packerdog. I still can't get over all the men wearing sunglasses either as if to coverup so to speak with JY. If he did have some scratches or whatever to his eye, surely his family must be a little nervous.

pack_fan
01-11-2007, 03:36 PM
It's not unusual to gather pubic hair for evidence....there ae some hubby's who fake a sexual assault...who have absolutely NO idea that they'll get plucked, lol. (actually combed, but if none come out....they are plucked)

Hand me a bowl of wax and I'll do Jas properly :)

Sami
I guess if I was going to play devil's advocate for a minute, a sexual assault could explain a lot. I had sort of discredited the sexual assault thing but it could explain some questions I had. I thought the perp had just the intention of coming in the house with murder in mind. That would narrow the list of suspects rather quickly.

Although I have no reason to suspect that the reports are wrong, I wonder how LE can state so quickly that they were having financial difficulties. I doubt that they had pulled financial records so quickly to determine the Young's net worth. Just because they lived in a big house doesn't mean they had financial problems. They had two houses, not just one. I just have a hard time beleiving that she would be considering cutting back time at work if they were barely scraping by as is.

As for the LI, a million isn't that much considering the two houses, they probably both had student loans, two cars, and a second child on the way. That could wipe out a million quickly. The timing of the insurance is suspicious for sure but also they had recently found out that she was pregnant again. Upping the life insurance could have been necessary.

The circumstancial evidence is somewhat overwhelming. The timing of the insurance, out of town, fax-printout, no forced entry, everything. I can say this, either he did it, or he is the unluckiest person alive.....

raisincharlie
01-11-2007, 03:47 PM
I guess if I was going to play devil's advocate for a minute, a sexual assault could explain a lot. I had sort of discredited the sexual assault thing but it could explain some questions I had. I thought the perp had just the intention of coming in the house with murder in mind. That would narrow the list of suspects rather quickly.

Although I have no reason to suspect that the reports are wrong, I wonder how LE can state so quickly that they were having financial difficulties. I doubt that they had pulled financial records so quickly to determine the Young's net worth. Just because they lived in a big house doesn't mean they had financial problems. They had two houses, not just one. I just have a hard time beleiving that she would be considering cutting back time at work if they were barely scraping by as is.

As for the LI, a million isn't that much considering the two houses, they probably both had student loans, two cars, and a second child on the way. That could wipe out a million quickly. The timing of the insurance is suspicious for sure but also they had recently found out that she was pregnant again. Upping the life insurance could have been necessary.

The circumstancial evidence is somewhat overwhelming. The timing of the insurance, out of town, fax-printout, no forced entry, everything. I can say this, either he did it, or he is the unluckiest person alive.....LE did remove documents from the house on the first day - they had 20 officers working on it as I recall I don't think it is beyond the realm of possibility of knowing the financial status very quickly. Perhaps MF or LF were aware of it through conversations with MY as well.

Something tells me MY was aware of it, and it wasn't because they were living beyond their means IMO. I have wondered why after the accident JY was driving a 2004 ford - just one thought.

I can see uping the insurance when she was pregnant back in the spring - but to up it again 3 months before her murder does not make sense IMO.

less0305
01-11-2007, 04:06 PM
Did anyone else catch the fact that the testimonial order also included pubic hair? I thought this was rather strange and would imagine that it would only be requested if they found some at the scene.

If this occurred in the bedroom and pubic hairs were found (which should be normal in a bedroom), I'm sure they would collect his to match against all pubic hair found in order to rule out that anybody else was in the home. Imagine if they found pubic hair and didn't do testing on it to determine if it was his or not his. A defense attorney would jump on that and say - oh, they didn't test it. It could be from an intruder that they never checked out.

pack_fan
01-11-2007, 04:15 PM
If this occurred in the bedroom and pubic hairs were found (which should be normal in a bedroom), I'm sure they would collect his to match against all pubic hair found in order to rule out that anybody else was in the home. Imagine if they found pubic hair and didn't do testing on it to determine if it was his or not his. A defense attorney would jump on that and say - oh, they didn't test it. It could be from an intruder that they never checked out.
Makes perfect sense, thanks.

panthera
01-11-2007, 04:20 PM
It also mentions the $1 to $2 million insurance policy. Doesn't say when it was taken out, but says it's a rather large policy.And that she planned to cut back on work after her maternity leave. The home value is listed at $379,000, purchased in May 2005, but that still doesn't explain the need for a $1-2million life insurance policy.
:waitasec:

panthera
01-11-2007, 04:22 PM
Something tells me MY was aware of it, and it wasn't because they were living beyond their means IMO. I have wondered why after the accident JY was driving a 2004 ford - just one thought.

I can see uping the insurance when she was pregnant back in the spring - but to up it again 3 months before her murder does not make sense IMO.Do we know what type of vehicle they were driving when that accident occurred? I still think something might be true about the rumor of online gambling or such ~ in other words, a debt that Michelle didn't incur.

Samiya
01-11-2007, 04:26 PM
And that she planned to cut back on work after her maternity leave. The home value is listed at $379,000, purchased in May 2005, but that still doesn't explain the need for a $1-2million life insurance policy.
:waitasec:The house may have had a mortgage on it. Part of a post I just put up at ctv..

Michelle alone would've had to had a "HUGE" income to be paying off a house of that expense, plus rates, regular bills, Cassidy's needs (daycare costs etc)......to to top it all off, her hubby is away "apparently" 3 to 4 nights a week according to some person.

Now if he was away like that and it was never actually on business....bye bye finances.....

Sami

panthera
01-11-2007, 04:30 PM
The house may have had a mortgage on it. Part of a post I just put up at ctv..

Michelle alone would've had to had a "HUGE" income to be paying off a house of that expense, plus rates, regular bills, Cassidy's needs (daycare costs etc)......to to top it all off, her hubby is away "apparently" 3 to 4 nights a week according to some person.

Now if he was away like that and it was never actually on business....bye bye finances.....

Sami
You're right, Michelle's income alone wouldn't support a home like that, with all the accompanying bills. And we don't know exactly how much Jason was earning, but wouldn't his expenses for travel be covered by his employer? Or as you say, he may not have been "away at business" all the time, and Michelle found out? At any rate, it sure looks now like he is the one who committed this murder.

fran
01-11-2007, 04:32 PM
I was sooo glad to see that they took photographs of his body. I kept thinking that IF he was the perp, any injuries he may have sustained would be healed. But, it looks like they got to him early. Good!

IMHO, there's much going on behind the scenes. I just wish they'd hurry up! :doh:

JMHO
fran


http://www.wral.com/news/local/flash/1133639/


"Photographs of body (injuries to body),..."


..............snip................


"There is probable cause to believe that an offense punishable as a felony or a Class A1 or Class 1 misdemeanor has been committed and reasonable grounds to suspect that the person named or described above committed the offense. The results of the requested non testimonial identification procedures will be of material aid in determining whether this person committed the offense."

pack_fan
01-11-2007, 04:48 PM
I was sooo glad to see that they took photographs of his body. I kept thinking that IF he was the perp, any injuries he may have sustained would be healed. But, it looks like they got to him early. Good!

IMHO, there's much going on behind the scenes. I just wish they'd hurry up! :doh:

JMHO
fran


http://www.wral.com/news/local/flash/1133639/


"Photographs of body (injuries to body),..."


..............snip................


"There is probable cause to believe that an offense punishable as a felony or a Class A1 or Class 1 misdemeanor has been committed and reasonable grounds to suspect that the person named or described above committed the offense. The results of the requested non testimonial identification procedures will be of material aid in determining whether this person committed the offense."
I agree that there is a lot more going on behind the scenes.

IMO, LE has all the pieces of the puzzle right there in front of them if JY is the perp. The news and observer article says that the evidence collected was to COMPARE against evidence found at the scene. So they do have dna at the scene, just have to match it. There will be a lot more presented at trial but the dna alone, assuming it is under her fingernails or possibly on something she used to protect herself, should be enough to convict.

fran
01-11-2007, 04:50 PM
I can't find the link now that included a statement by local LE, but it basically said LE believe they know who did this crime and they will solve it. They are just gathering evidence and when they have enough to make an arrest they will. They just aren't there yet.

So, I guess we'll just have to continue to have patience and know LE is doing their job. :snooty:

FWIW, IMHO, I do believe $1 million is excessive insurance in this case. Enough to cover paying of the house off, maybe, but a million, no way!

I believe on the policy being between $1 to $2 million is because it MAY have a double indemnity clause for accidental death. Oh, and MURDER is considered 'accidental' so it would probably be $2 million.

I highly doubt the insurance company has paid a dime on this yet, especially due to the husband being a POI, as LE is indicating.

Guess JY didn't watch the SP case. :slap: The insurance company put the $$ in a 'trust account' until after the trial. SP never collected a dime and neither did his family.

JMHO
fran

fran
01-11-2007, 04:53 PM
I agree that there is a lot more going on behind the scenes.

IMO, LE has all the pieces of the puzzle right there in front of them if JY is the perp. The news and observer article says that the evidence collected was to COMPARE against evidence found at the scene. So they do have dna at the scene, just have to match it. There will be a lot more presented at trial but the dna alone, assuming it is under her fingernails or possibly on something she used to protect herself, should be enough to convict.


I bet you're right. I imagine she probably did scratch the perp. IF it's JY's dna under her nails, he's toast! ;)

FWIW and as horrible as it sounds, I've always told my girls that if they're ever attacked, no matter what, scratch the SOB. At least, IF they don't survive, there's evidence of who did it.

JMHO
fran

raisincharlie
01-11-2007, 05:01 PM
Do we know what type of vehicle they were driving when that accident occurred? I still think something might be true about the rumor of online gambling or such ~ in other words, a debt that Michelle didn't incur.
A 2004 Mitsubishi

raisincharlie
01-11-2007, 05:09 PM
I bet you're right. I imagine she probably did scratch the perp. IF it's JY's dna under her nails, he's toast! ;)

FWIW and as horrible as it sounds, I've always told my girls that if they're ever attacked, no matter what, scratch the SOB. At least, IF they don't survive, there's evidence of who did it.

JMHO
franI'm wondering if there was a broken wedding photo and perhaps the perp cut his foot on it. I am intrigued by the footprint and measurements taken of JY. Almost makes me think he did cleanup in the home and stepped in (at least partially) something (i.e.blood) when stripping down and did not realize it.

No point in measuring his foot against Cassidy's prints, I doubt Meredith was barefoot when she came by, did MY have big feet ? So might be some other reason they want his foot print and measurements...unless the other perp is a bare foot killer. JMO

ETA - perhaps our mystery machine ? http://www.officer.com/article/article.jsp?id=29886&siteSection=18

packerdog
01-11-2007, 05:15 PM
I can't find the link now that included a statement by local LE, but it basically said LE believe they know who did this crime and they will solve it. They are just gathering evidence and when they have enough to make an arrest they will. They just aren't there yet.

So, I guess we'll just have to continue to have patience and know LE is doing their job. :snooty:

FWIW, IMHO, I do believe $1 million is excessive insurance in this case. Enough to cover paying of the house off, maybe, but a million, no way!

I believe on the policy being between $1 to $2 million is because it MAY have a double indemnity clause for accidental death. Oh, and MURDER is considered 'accidental' so it would probably be $2 million.

I highly doubt the insurance company has paid a dime on this yet, especially due to the husband being a POI, as LE is indicating.

Guess JY didn't watch the SP case. :slap: The insurance company put the $$ in a 'trust account' until after the trial. SP never collected a dime and neither did his family.

JMHO
fran

Hi Fran, I think the amount of the insurance is excessive too. I am sure she has life insurance through the company she works for, it wouldn't,be that much though, unless she added to it. I also find it odd that it was taken out 3 months ago. She had been with the company 3years or so. Where were the LI papers found? I had heard that they were in the SUV but that might be a rumor.

packerdog
01-11-2007, 05:24 PM
I'm wondering if there was a broken wedding photo and perhaps the perp cut his foot on it. I am intrigued by the footprint and measurements taken of JY. Almost makes me think he did cleanup in the home and stepped in (at least partially) something (i.e.blood) when stripping down and did not realize it.

No point in measuring his foot against Cassidy's prints, I doubt Meredith was barefoot when she came by, did MY have big feet ? So might be some other reason they want his foot print and measurements...unless the other perp is a bare foot killer. JMO

Good thoughts on the footprints Charlie. Maybe they have a shoeless house (like I do) . An intruder wouldn't know that and wouldn't take off his shoes anyway. I have to laugh, years ago I had white carpeting in the living room and I had vacuumed it in perfect rows, I could tell if anyone walked in the room. That was always checked first when we returned from vacation.LOL

Floh
01-11-2007, 05:26 PM
As for the LI, a million isn't that much considering the two houses, they probably both had student loans, two cars, and a second child on the way. That could wipe out a million quickly. The timing of the insurance is suspicious for sure but also they had recently found out that she was pregnant again. Upping the life insurance could have been necessary.

that's what i feel. these days, $1m really doesn't go far. considering expenses as far as home, childcare and schooling, etc. are concerned. IMO.

panthera
01-11-2007, 05:31 PM
A 2004 MitsubishiThanks raisincharlie. I don't think it's odd that he has a 2004 Explorer now though ~ especially if he was supposed to be travelling on business.

scandi
01-11-2007, 05:39 PM
Great news coming out today, finally! Thanks guys.

In the non-protective order it implied they found evidence that told them JY was the perp. Anyone have any idea what this could have been? They wouldn't be able to look at footprints and tell they were from his shoes. Maybe she was not dressed from the waist down with only a top as we heard from someone. and something was done to her down there. Possibility if it had to do with the pregnancy.

Hey! Today is the day that RPD goes to look at the death photos. I'm interested to see what he reports.

panthera
01-11-2007, 05:42 PM
Good thoughts on the footprints Charlie. Maybe they have a shoeless house (like I do) . An intruder wouldn't know that and wouldn't take off his shoes anyway. I have to laugh, years ago I had white carpeting in the living room and I had vacuumed it in perfect rows, I could tell if anyone walked in the room. That was always checked first when we returned from vacation.LOLYou're right and the type of carpeting in the house would matter, for instance if it were a thick plush or not. Shoe prints could flatten the pile of the carpet.

fran
01-11-2007, 05:55 PM
Great news coming out today, finally! Thanks guys.

In the non-protective order it implied they found evidence that told them JY was the perp. Anyone have any idea what this could have been? They wouldn't be able to look at footprints and tell they were from his shoes. Maybe she was not dressed from the waist down with only a top as we heard from someone. and something was done to her down there. Possibility if it had to do with the pregnancy.

Hey! Today is the day that RPD goes to look at the death photos. I'm interested to see what he reports.

Scandi, I don't know if it's true, but a saw somewhere that JY has large feet.

Why is RPD looking at the 'death photos?'

JMHO
fran

fran
01-11-2007, 05:57 PM
Good thoughts on the footprints Charlie. Maybe they have a shoeless house (like I do) . An intruder wouldn't know that and wouldn't take off his shoes anyway. I have to laugh, years ago I had white carpeting in the living room and I had vacuumed it in perfect rows, I could tell if anyone walked in the room. That was always checked first when we returned from vacation.LOL


packerdog:
This is a little off topic but I had a friend and her parent's home had shag carpeting. Her mom used to wait up for her to get home from her dates so she could 'rake' the carpet before she went to bed! :D

fran

raisincharlie
01-11-2007, 06:02 PM
Thanks raisincharlie. I don't think it's odd that he has a 2004 Explorer now though ~ especially if he was supposed to be travelling on business.Considering the accident happened in May 2006 - I don't kow why he wouldn't take the insurance money and buy a newer vehicle - especially if he was traveling a lot or expected to travel alot. I think the ford came from MY's Father's dealership - surely he could have gotten a good deal on a new vehicle. JMO

scandi
01-11-2007, 06:04 PM
OMG Fran, that is too funny! :p She'd drive me nuts for sure.

They published a notice in the paper that anyone could go look at the photos as they are public info. He was going this afternoon and it is already 5pm there. Hopefully tonight we'll learn something.

I think the pubic hairs are normal to be right there. Once I read on this forum that in the average home you will find pubic hairs in every room of the house. I don't know why. Maybe they are easily transfered or blown from one area to the next.

Floh
01-11-2007, 06:10 PM
I have wondered why after the accident JY was driving a 2004 ford - just one thought.


Please someone explain what may be wrong with driving a 2004 ford? does everyone get a new car yearly in the states?

panthera
01-11-2007, 06:12 PM
Considering the accident happened in May 2006 - I don't kow why he wouldn't take the insurance money and buy a newer vehicle - especially if he was traveling a lot or expected to travel alot. I think the ford came from MY's Father's dealership - surely he could have gotten a good deal on a new vehicle. JMOOr an even better deal on the 2004? Not knowing how much the insurance paid for the wrecked Mitsubishi, your guess is as good as mine on this one, charlie!!

panthera
01-11-2007, 06:13 PM
Please someone explain what may be wrong with driving a 2004 ford? does everyone get a new car yearly in the states?Not at all, floh!! And I'm finding it rather funny since I also have one!! :D

raisincharlie
01-11-2007, 06:38 PM
Please someone explain what may be wrong with driving a 2004 ford? does everyone get a new car yearly in the states?
Nothing wrong with driving a 2004 Ford - I am simply wondering if the reason he is driving a 2004 Ford is because they simply did not have enough $ beyond the insurance payout to purchase a new one, even with an obvious discount that could have been obtained through MY's Dad. Seems reasonable to wonder about it if we are now hearing there were financial troubles - perhaps this lends a bit of credence. The wreck was in 2006 -the vehicle wrecked was a 2004 - why not just get a new one in May 2006 ?

panthera
01-11-2007, 06:49 PM
Nothing wrong with driving a 2004 Ford - I am simply wondering if the reason he is driving a 2004 Ford is because they simply did not have enough $ beyond the insurance payout to purchase a new one, even with an obvious discount that could have been obtained through MY's Dad. Seems reasonable to wonder about it if we are now hearing there were financial troubles - perhaps this lends a bit of credence. The wreck was in 2006 -the vehicle wrecked was a 2004 - why not just get a new one in May 2006 ?Yes, I agree that they likely only had the insurance payout and it was more or less an even trade, even with any help they might have gotten from Michelle's father's business.

ialy
01-11-2007, 08:34 PM
It also mentions the $1 to $2 million insurance policy. Doesn't say when it was taken out, but says it's a rather large policy.
Haven't read through everything yet, so sorry if this is repetitive --

We have 2 children, and have 1.5 mil insurance on my husband, less on me as he is the sole wage earner. We were told based on our chidren being young, being in fairly new mortgage, wanting to know kids college woud be covered, etc -- it is a reasonabe amount and premium is less than $700 a year on the 1.5. I woud bet it has more to do with timing if it is a new policy -- but as others have said, if it came about as a change in employment, that will be the counter argument by his side to be sure.

packerdog
01-11-2007, 09:01 PM
I have a friend that has an insurance company and he said that he never insures a child for more than the parents. I wonder how much insurance they had on Cassity.

cricket
01-11-2007, 10:54 PM
Why would getting a new job affect your spouse's life insurance, FactsareFacts? Other than MY being listed as a beneficiary on any life insurance rec'd through work, I can't see how this would affect it. I'm just wondering out loud, Facts!

Gosh, if you can get 1mill for about $500 per year, hubby and I are seriously doing something wrong. We are paying more than that for WAY less than 1 mill. Hmm. :cool:
I'm in HR (Human Resources) and I can tell you that many benefit plans will provide free life insurance for the employee, usually at some multiple of the person's annual salary, and also will offer additonal optional insurance - where the employee can pay for extra insurance for themselves and for family members. It is usually a good deal because it's offered at group rates and there is no qualifying for it (if you sign up when it's initially offered).

If JY did get insurance on Michelle at the time he changed jobs, it would not be all that unusual.

pack_fan
01-12-2007, 12:05 AM
Alright, I'm back. Too much going on to sleuth, have to sneak some time away.

Back to the insurance policy. I am a little older than JY but have a child around the same age. Speaking to an insurance salesman (who wants you to give everything you have and name your first born after them) a million would not seem excessive to me. I will ignore the two million for the time being, that would seem like overkill to me but could be part of the accidental death and I'm not going there. Could have been quite the motive but seems there could have been plenty of motives for JY.

Just in my situation, my wife and I bought a new house. To pay off the mortgage on the house, assure college for our child, and loss of income of one of the parents would be substantial. Child care alone while one of the parents worked would be a significant amount. Raleigh is certainly not LA by any means but it would be rather expensive compared to smaller towns in the area or even major cities across the us. Raleigh is a up and coming town which has lots of bio medical and research firms in the area. NC is not the farming capital of the world like it used to be. This doesn't account for any car loans, college loans, or personal debt. Remember that there were two homes not just one. IMO, a million would let JY or MY basically break even. Probably enough to pay for Cassidy to go to college, but neither one would be living it up. Young couples out of college tend to have tons of debt and spend beyond their means. I don't think anyone here should beleive that JY would be moving to an island to live the life of the rich and famous. Not saying that it couldn't have gotten him out of a bad situation, but certainly not buying him an oceanfront pad.

I would think that the choice of vehicle would depend on what kind of deal her dad would get them. Both seemed reasonable finacially, not wanting to buy a new car to impress the neighbors.

Charlie, I keep thinking about the footprints as well. Will be very telling if the perp made a dash to the door or hung around a while. Certainly LE can determine if the perp tried to clean up or took the shoes off after the fact. I would tend to beleive that there is at least one good footprint at the scene if they are taking size measurements of his feet. This would basically exclude everyone with less than a size 11 or less from commiting this crime. Someone would have to be very clever to wear oversized shoes to commit the crime.

otto
01-12-2007, 12:28 AM
Alright, I'm back. Too much going on to sleuth, have to sneak some time away.

Back to the insurance policy. I am a little older than JY but have a child around the same age. Speaking to an insurance salesman (who wants you to give everything you have and name your first born after them) a million would not seem excessive to me. I will ignore the two million for the time being, that would seem like overkill to me but could be part of the accidental death and I'm not going there. Could have been quite the motive but seems there could have been plenty of motives for JY.

Just in my situation, my wife and I bought a new house. To pay off the mortgage on the house, assure college for our child, and loss of income of one of the parents would be substantial. Child care alone while one of the parents worked would be a significant amount. Raleigh is certainly not LA by any means but it would be rather expensive compared to smaller towns in the area or even major cities across the us. Raleigh is a up and coming town which has lots of bio medical and research firms in the area. NC is not the farming capital of the world like it used to be. This doesn't account for any car loans, college loans, or personal debt. Remember that there were two homes not just one. IMO, a million would let JY or MY basically break even. Probably enough to pay for Cassidy to go to college, but neither one would be living it up. Young couples out of college tend to have tons of debt and spend beyond their means. I don't think anyone here should beleive that JY would be moving to an island to live the life of the rich and famous. Not saying that it couldn't have gotten him out of a bad situation, but certainly not buying him an oceanfront pad.

I would think that the choice of vehicle would depend on what kind of deal her dad would get them. Both seemed reasonable finacially, not wanting to buy a new car to impress the neighbors.

Charlie, I keep thinking about the footprints as well. Will be very telling if the perp made a dash to the door or hung around a while. Certainly LE can determine if the perp tried to clean up or took the shoes off after the fact. I would tend to beleive that there is at least one good footprint at the scene if they are taking size measurements of his feet. This would basically exclude everyone with less than a size 11 or less from commiting this crime. Someone would have to be very clever to wear oversized shoes to commit the crime.

I read the Porco case looking for similarities. There was absolutely no blood in the vehicle, none on the perp, no footprints, false allegations about gambling problems, long hours of driving, no forced entry, bludgeoned, financial (insurance) motive and there's probably more that I can't think of right now. Bludgeoning with an axe, like Porco, allowed him to be at least a yard/metre away from the injuries. Porco could sleep like a baby after both the murder and the conviction. Porco worked at a vet clinic and his employer testified that he gave instruction to Porco on how to bath a dog without getting wet, with the implication being that Porco could have used similar techniques to avoid blood spatter. As for wearing coveralls, I think that's very possible ... like disposable paint coveralls (http://paint-and-supplies.hardwarestore.com/47-248-painting-coveralls/disposable-coveralls-456467.aspx). Porco took 2 hours and 45 minutes to kill one person and maim another. That included staging a break-in, no robbery and coming out clean. Porco probably didn't shower because his father wasn't dead and was able to walk, so if there was someone in the shower, his father would have confronted him (evidence doesn't support that). The "no robbery" decision was made right away because Joan Porco's purse was on the table and the house wasn't ransacked. The Raleigh police probably made the same quick assumptions without needing anyone to verify whether anything was taken. I doubt Jason stayed around to shower, maybe just quickly washed up his hands and face, stripped off some coveralls and hit the road. Porco was wearing old running shoes the night before and probably threw them away after the event ... Jason probably did the same thing. What really sunk Porco was his initial statement to police and how that conflicted with evidence. Jason not giving a statement was a very smart thing to do. Porco's vehicle was caught on video and I bet that if Jason did this, he too was caught somewhere on video. It seems medical buildings often have exterior video equipment.

ialy
01-12-2007, 02:02 AM
If you check the link:

http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/1133617/

and go down a ways to the right there is a link for "The request for Evidence"

This is the order and it is very interesting.
YES!! Essentially saying it is reasonabe to consider he could have committed the felony crime of murder and that's why the request was being made -- and this was 11/11 I believe

Samiya
01-12-2007, 02:55 AM
http://www.nbc17.com/midatlantic/ncn/news.apx.-content-articles-NCN-2007-01-11-0008.html

RALEIGH, N.C. -- The November murder of Michelle Young is now on the cover of a national magazine.

Authorities still have not identified her suspected killer, leaving many questions still unanswered.

Michelle Young was found dead in her home Nov. 3. Her 2-year-old daughter was found by her side, unharmed.

Sami

Taximom
01-12-2007, 03:07 AM
http://www.nbc17.com/midatlantic/ncn/news.apx.-content-articles-NCN-2007-01-11-0008.html

RALEIGH, N.C. -- The November murder of Michelle Young is now on the cover of a national magazine.

Authorities still have not identified her suspected killer, leaving many questions still unanswered.

Michelle Young was found dead in her home Nov. 3. Her 2-year-old daughter was found by her side, unharmed.

SamiSami, thanks for this link. Excellent video, I might add. So they are just now getting back lab tests, etc. Yay.

Interesting to me is that one article says Cassidy was "found wandering around the house" and others say "found by her (MY) side". I wonder which is truth and which is a reporter's doing.

Another quote I really like:
"Wake County Sheriff Donnie Harrison told NBC17 Thursday that he's happy with the pace of the investigation and that his people are working to make sure they build a good, solid case."

The Sheriff does not say "We are working hard to find MY's killer". Nope. He says they are working on building a good, solid case.

To me, that means they have their killer. :cool:
:D

Taximom
01-12-2007, 03:08 AM
Hey! Today is the day that RPD goes to look at the death photos. I'm interested to see what he reports.
Any news, scandi?

Samiya
01-12-2007, 03:36 AM
Any news, scandi?Sending you a pm :)

xxx
Sami

scandi
01-12-2007, 04:12 AM
Hi Taximom,

I got out of bed to go check it out, and voila those guys had been going crazee over there.

He has to be approved by the coroner before they will let him view the photos as the report is not finished yet. So that was a letdown.

Just The Facts was there and so it was an interesting discussion. He let little bombs drop, like the insurance policy wasn't purchsed only 3 mos before the death, Michelle had a lot of lovely jewelry was missing along with the jewelry drawers, mmmm what else. Oh, he knows who killed her. Says RPD is a lady cop with the Raleigh Police Dept and shouldn't be posting on a public forum. So evidently RPD and Just The Facts must know each other. JTF was very upset RPD was going to view the photos. What else Sami?

Taximom
01-12-2007, 04:13 AM
I didn't think it would be available online so soon, but here it is:
http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20007855,00.html

The first line got me:
Tiny footprints, made of blood, were everywhere.

EDITED: MY BAD. Just the first page there unless you subscribe to it. I thought something was up. :(

Taximom
01-12-2007, 04:15 AM
Hi Taximom,

I got out of bed to go check it out, and voila those guys had been going crazee over there.

He has to be approved by the coroner before they will let him view the photos as the report is not finished yet. So that was a letdown.

Just The Facts was there and so it was an interesting discussion. He let little bombs drop, like the insurance policy wasn't purchsed only 3 mos before the death, Michelle had a lot of lovely jewelry was missing along with the jewelry drawers, mmmm what else. Oh, he knows who killed her. Says
RPD is a lady cop with the Raleigh Police Dept and shouldn't be posting on a public forum. What else Sami?(my bold)
Well, that certainly makes sense, scandi. Sorry you got out of bed for nothing, but I just posted something you might be interested in. (edited to add: never mind!)

scandi
01-12-2007, 04:16 AM
At CTV? Are you kidding? It was one of the most interesting reads I've had in a long time. Lots of insiders over there. Hot discussion. I posted the question as to why JTF changed his nik to Just The Facts. I think he puts a lot of wrong info out there and has a definate agenda. Plus he loves to post and is used to doing it. Guess who I think he is? :D

Taximom
01-12-2007, 04:17 AM
At CTV?
Nope, I'm a dope. I thought the entire PEOPLE mag article was online (free). Silly me. Sorry.

scandi
01-12-2007, 04:22 AM
Did you find the article on line and post it? :cool: I see Charlie's been here. Bet he is pooped tonight searching for Ben all day. :hand: to you Charlie

Thanks Taximom for finding and posting that article. It is going to hit the hometown tomorrow and I think very soon we might see some real hot action in this case. I am READY ! Goona go read then hit the hay. Arthritis has hit my shoulder joint and is pressing a nerve and the pain is unyielding. Awful.
Tomorrow I'm gonna try and find out how to treat it.

Taximom
01-12-2007, 04:28 AM
Did you find the article on line and post it? :cool: I see Charlie's been here. Bet he is pooped tonight searching for Ben all day. :hand: to you Charlie

Thanks Taximom for finding and posting that article. It is going to hit the hometown tomorrow and I think very soon we might see some real hot action in this case. I am READY ! Goona go read then hit the hay. Arthritis has hit my shoulder joint and is pressing a nerve and the pain is unyielding. Awful.
Tomorrow I'm gonna try and find out how to treat it.
I'm tempted to subscribe tonight, but guess I'll just get it tomorrow at the store. Mid-morning reading w/coffee.

I hope you find some relief soon for your shoulder. Nite.

packerdog
01-12-2007, 12:44 PM
http://www.nbc17.com/midatlantic/ncn/news.apx.-content-articles-NCN-2007-01-11-0008.html

RALEIGH, N.C. -- The November murder of Michelle Young is now on the cover of a national magazine.

Authorities still have not identified her suspected killer, leaving many questions still unanswered.

Michelle Young was found dead in her home Nov. 3. Her 2-year-old daughter was found by her side, unharmed.

Sami

Thanks for the article Sami. It states that the insurance policy was taken out 3 months before her death and also says that he had been in contact with MM for 3 months before MY death. Thats what I brought up yesterday. Big red flag to me.

fran
01-12-2007, 07:50 PM
Thanks for the article Sami. It states that the insurance policy was taken out 3 months before her death and also says that he had been in contact with MM for 3 months before MY death. Thats what I brought up yesterday. Big red flag to me.

Sorry, but is JY playing with a full deck? :bang:

The timing, 3 months for the LI, 3 months for the affair, then murder!

Guess he didn't follow the Peterson trial.

There is NO COINCIDENCE when it comes to MURDER! :woohoo:

JMHO
fran

otto
01-12-2007, 08:47 PM
http://www.nbc17.com/midatlantic/ncn/news.apx.-content-articles-NCN-2007-01-11-0008.html

RALEIGH, N.C. -- The November murder of Michelle Young is now on the cover of a national magazine.

Authorities still have not identified her suspected killer, leaving many questions still unanswered.

Michelle Young was found dead in her home Nov. 3. Her 2-year-old daughter was found by her side, unharmed.

Sami

I get the distinct impression that they are closing in on Jason. If this goes to trial, the first thing the defense lawyer will complain about is that the police zeroed in on Jason and didn't look anywhere else. I suppose the police will anticipate this antic and have investigators looking into other perps in the area.

BarnGoddess
01-12-2007, 10:52 PM
The really big clue will be who took out the policy on MY. If he is the only one who purchased the policy and she had no clue about it, then it tells me he planned it. If she has one on him, taken out at the same time, it still doesn't absolve him. He could have suggested insurance. I could take a policy out on Raisin Charlie if I wanted to. Double indemnity if he gets trampled by a horse. Employers take out policies on key personnel and sometimes never cancel them when they leave a company. Then when they die they get paid, even years later.

Bee Charmer
01-13-2007, 08:45 AM
Sorry, but is JY playing with a full deck? :bang:

The timing, 3 months for the LI, 3 months for the affair, then murder!

Guess he didn't follow the Peterson trial.

There is NO COINCIDENCE when it comes to MURDER! :woohoo:

JMHO
fran
Boy, do I agree with your statement about
coincidences Fran. That's why I think that JY taking their
car down that 100 foot embankment is very suspicious.

close_enough
01-13-2007, 10:07 AM
The really big clue will be who took out the policy on MY. If he is the only one who purchased the policy and she had no clue about it, then it tells me he planned it. If she has one on him, taken out at the same time, it still doesn't absolve him. He could have suggested insurance. I could take a policy out on Raisin Charlie if I wanted to. Double indemnity if he gets trampled by a horse. Employers take out policies on key personnel and sometimes never cancel them when they leave a company. Then when they die they get paid, even years later.

this is how the article states this....

---was covered by a $1 million insurance policy that her husband took out three months before her murder and that made him the beneficiary."

otto
01-13-2007, 12:35 PM
this is how the article states this....

---was covered by a $1 million insurance policy that her husband took out three months before her murder and that made him the beneficiary."

A prosecutor once said that all criminals are stupid. Even though at first I thought this was a rather clever crime, I think that if Jason did this, he is stupid.

Actually, that's one point in the direction of sociopath: thinks he is smarter than everyone else. Anyone that plans a murder 3 months in advance, starting with a huge life insurance policy one month after learning that their family is expanding, is downright stupid.

Scout
01-13-2007, 01:06 PM
this is how the article states this....

---was covered by a $1 million insurance policy that her husband took out three months before her murder and that made him the beneficiary."

I'm not sure People magazine is a reliable source. I'm taking the wait and see approach as to when that insurance policy was taken out. I think it was recently, but I'm not yet convinced it was 3 months ago.

fran
01-13-2007, 02:41 PM
I'm not sure People magazine is a reliable source. I'm taking the wait and see approach as to when that insurance policy was taken out. I think it was recently, but I'm not yet convinced it was 3 months ago.

IMHO, even if it was a year ago, there was that one car accident whereby it's being said Michelle didn't have on her seatbelt because she was reaching into the back seat for something. She wasn't injurred but she lost the baby. Then she gets pregnant again and is murdered in her own home by a mysterious stranger. :rolleyes:

The one thing is, we know JY had a million or TWO MILLION reasons for Michelle to have a fatal 'accident.'

JMHO
fran

fran
01-13-2007, 09:56 PM
Boy, do I agree with your statement about
coincidences Fran. That's why I think that JY taking their
car down that 100 foot embankment is very suspicious.

I tell ya Bee Charmer, I honestly believe that accident was NO accident.

JMHO of course,
fran

scandi
01-14-2007, 12:54 AM
Hi agree Frannie about that accident. Now I'm ready for some facts. Goin' crazy for the few things we are learning.

Maybe next week? :rolleyes: Scandi

philamena
01-14-2007, 02:25 AM
Fox news covered the case again tonight. Fox reinterated that Jason was the POI in the case and also said that there was blood found on/in the car. They also stated that Jason still isn't cooperating with LE.
How can Jason be allowed to walk the streets?

3 months ago he began an "intense affair"-that's how Kimberely Newsom described it tonight.
3 months ago he took out a million bucks worth of life ins.
His wife was pregnant and found brutally murdered.
Blood was found on the car.
Jason was conviently out of town.
He mysteriously has his SIL go to the house for what???? To discover the body?

LE needs to arrest this guy now.

PolkSaladAnnie
01-14-2007, 04:58 AM
Fox news covered the case again tonight. Fox reinterated that Jason was the POI in the case and also said that there was blood found on/in the car. They also stated that Jason still isn't cooperating with LE.
How can Jason be allowed to walk the streets?

3 months ago he began an "intense affair"-that's how Kimberely Newsom described it tonight.
3 months ago he took out a million bucks worth of life ins.
His wife was pregnant and found brutally murdered.
Blood was found on the car.
Jason was conviently out of town.
He mysteriously has his SIL go to the house for what???? To discover the body?

LE needs to arrest this guy now.


Aaah! I read this would be on Fox on another site about Shawn Hornbeck! Thanks for posting, philamena.

Yep, WHYYYYY is he still on the streets? What little detail is outstanding that's deterring LE? Questions, questions questions! Also wondering why the media are letting this one sink? I'd have thought Nancy at last would be camped outside someone's house to keep it in the spotlight.

Bee Charmer
01-14-2007, 08:31 AM
He's still loose because he's kept his
mouth shut, so the police haven't been able to
catch him in any deceptive statements and because
imo, they have not been able to conclusively link
him to the actual murder. Yet.

Taximom
01-14-2007, 12:04 PM
I saw (correction, "heard") something about this case on the Line-up w/Kimberly G last night. Just heard bits and pieces but there was nothing new to report.

All indications most of us are on the right track here w/who-done-it...and it wasn't the butler. ;)

Taximom
01-14-2007, 01:32 PM
I just posted this on the "media links" thread:
------
I think their headline is a little misleading! There isn't much in this article that we haven't already read. Local perspective since this is where Meredith Fisher owned a home:

http://www.fuquay-varinaindependent...er%20update.txt (http://www.fuquay-varinaindependent.com/articles/2007/01/12/news/michelleyoungmurder%20update.txt)



Murder investigation leads to Fuquay-Varina



By Stephanie Eaton Harvie (localnews2005@yahoo.com)
Friday, January 12, 2007 4:25 PM EST


In early November a pregnant mother was found beaten to death in her south Raleigh home. Over two months after her body was discovered no arrests have been made in the case, but Wake County Sheriff's Deputies have entered into the Fuquay-Varina community to collect evidence. (more at link)

BarnGoddess
01-14-2007, 02:16 PM
I saw (correction, "heard") something about this case on the Line-up w/Kimberly G last night. Just heard bits and pieces but there was nothing new to report.

All indications most of us are on the right track here w/who-done-it...and it wasn't the butler. ;)
I caught that last night. I was disappointed that they didn't go into depth though. I think with the recovery of the two boys, they didn't have time enough. I wonder if even the little bit we heard was due to the People Magazine article being out there.

BarnGoddess
01-14-2007, 06:01 PM
Insurance question. Help please.....

I can't find the link to what was found in the SUV. I know they mentioned some papers, etc. Could the 1-2 million pollicy been in the SUV? Could that indicate that MY knew nothing about the policy? Is it legal in NC to take out a policy on someone without their knowledge. If not, could her signature have been forged?

Just ramble thoughts on this.

happy2bn10ec
01-14-2007, 06:34 PM
Hi y'all - I am an old reader and a new poster to this board. Anyway, in TN and VA, you have to have the witnessed signature of the Insured to take out a policy on them. If the Insured is a minor, you have to have the signature of the child's parent or guardian. At least, that was the deal when I was working for an insurance company about 5 years ago.

Of course, it would be relatively easy to get a forged signature. I've seen that done many times. It's probably never checked out...until some dumb jerk murders his wife.

scandi
01-14-2007, 07:03 PM
That is really interesting Taximom that as of 2 days ago, almost 2 1/2 months after her murder they are starting to investigate in the Fuquey-Varina area. I don't really believe this, unless they have had a new tip. Somehow I think the Sheriff's office has a lot more on the ball than this!~

Hi Goddess :) We just had a dusting here in Portland + some narly ice in the mornings, but the beach got the brunt of the storm. I lived in Depoe Bay when we had an incredible snow storm around 1989, and it was so weird to look out and see all the big rocks in the ocean covered with snow. Really beautiful. I heard it was 0 degrees in Denver this week, and was sure thinking of you. Now it's Charlie and 3 more inches of ice due to come in with the new storm. Chalk it all up to El Ninyo. At least now I've learned that Global Warming does not affect the daily temp[eratures that we live with, as I always thought it did.

Scandi

Melinda Tidwell
01-14-2007, 08:31 PM
Happy New Year to you all. Your all such good detectives.:woohoo:
Just read where Jason has a life ins. policy. You would think these stupid jerks would learn from previous cases that the husband is the first suspect police have. Look at all the stuff Scott Peterson tried to cover up and got caught. You would think these violent husbands would learn from each others mistakes. Sure hope they don't pay him on that policy. Soon he will look like this.:behindbar !!!!!!

Keep up the good work guys.
MT

jilly
01-14-2007, 08:48 PM
Happy New Year to you all. Your all such good detectives.:woohoo:
Just read where Jason has a life ins. policy. You would think these stupid jerks would learn from previous cases that the husband is the first suspect police have. Look at all the stuff Scott Peterson tried to cover up and got caught. You would think these violent husbands would learn from each others mistakes. Sure hope they don't pay him on that policy. Soon he will look like this.:behindbar !!!!!!

Keep up the good work guys.
MT

Hi Medlinda, welcome & happy New Year to you too! :)

We had a poster here awhile back knowledgeable about the insurance and she said that monies would not be paid out so long as he's a person of interest or suspect, I believe.

otto
01-14-2007, 08:51 PM
Hi y'all - I am an old reader and a new poster to this board. Anyway, in TN and VA, you have to have the witnessed signature of the Insured to take out a policy on them. If the Insured is a minor, you have to have the signature of the child's parent or guardian. At least, that was the deal when I was working for an insurance company about 5 years ago.

Of course, it would be relatively easy to get a forged signature. I've seen that done many times. It's probably never checked out...until some dumb jerk murders his wife.

Welcome aboard. Good to see you again ... and thanks for the insurance info. I don't think that Michelle would have objected to having an insurance policy taken out on her and she would have no reason to suspect that there was anything suspicious about it. The only reason she might have been suspicious is if she thought the car accident was deliberate, but I don't think she thought it was anything other than an accident.

raisincharlie
01-14-2007, 09:07 PM
Hi y'all - I am an old reader and a new poster to this board. Anyway, in TN and VA, you have to have the witnessed signature of the Insured to take out a policy on them. If the Insured is a minor, you have to have the signature of the child's parent or guardian. At least, that was the deal when I was working for an insurance company about 5 years ago.

Of course, it would be relatively easy to get a forged signature. I've seen that done many times. It's probably never checked out...until some dumb jerk murders his wife.
Hello Happy2bn10ec !

Post away ! I find this insurance issue interesting but the thing that worries me about it is that it seems to be a very old excuse by LE. LE always uses this towards motive, sometimes it is true, sometimes it is not. The same with financial issues - old and tiresome excuse IMO.

What will sell me on the insurance issue is if there was an increase on Michelle when she was pregnant last spring and then there is another increase during the pregnancy when she was murdered this fall. Not to make light of an insurance policy as being a motive but in a lot of cases, it becomes prosecutorial fodder for suspicion and never really proven. JMO

happy2bn10ec
01-14-2007, 09:15 PM
I agree with you, rc, I think LE is trying to make the insurance policy more of a big deal than it really is. I think if it figures into it at all, it's kind of a side issue; like an added bonus. But I do believe he did it. It just comes down to the same thing that convinced me of SP's guilt in the Laci trial - WHO ELSE would want her dead?

p.s. I think it is so cool that you went and helped out in the search for Ben.

raisincharlie
01-14-2007, 09:27 PM
I agree with you, rc, I think LE is trying to make the insurance policy more of a big deal than it really is. I think if it figures into it at all, it's kind of a side issue; like an added bonus. But I do believe he did it. It just comes down to the same thing that convinced me of SP's guilt in the Laci trial - WHO ELSE would want her dead?

p.s. I think it is so cool that you went and helped out in the search for Ben.
There you go ! Who would want Michelle dead - I'm sure by now LE has figured out if there was anyone who might even remotely want her to be dead. Then there is the issue of who would benefit if she were deceased...always an interesting question and one with multiple answers. I think JY did it as well and I do not believe he will get away with it - JMO.

To your p.s. - yes this search was very cool - it ended extremely well. I wish they all did.

strach304
01-14-2007, 09:36 PM
Even in Laci's case she had life insurance but that wasn't the motive. In Michele's case it may play a part but probably isn't the sole reason alone.

Welcome Melinda, I think these guys always reason that they are smarter and will get away with it. Only logical explanation it would seem. If they bothered to consider the consequences to themselves if caught they probably would do things differently. To this day I think SP isn't remorseful for killing Laci he's hung up on the mistakes he made like placing himself at the marina.

Yah! Charlie :woohoo:
ETA: You are one very special man! Glad to know you :)

raisincharlie
01-14-2007, 09:50 PM
Even in Laci's case she had life insurance but that wasn't the motive. In Michele's case it may play a part but probably isn't the sole reason alone.

Welcome Melinda, I think these guys always reason that they are smarter and will get away with it. Only logical explanation it would seem. If they bothered to consider the consequences to themselves if caught they probably would do things differently. To this day I think SP isn't remorseful for killing Laci he's hung up on the mistakes he made like placing himself at the marina.

Yah! Charlie :woohoo:
ETA: You are one very special man! Glad to know you :)
I hope SP has a window facing the bay. I hope it is the only view he has of the world outside of San Quentin. Sick :liar: . JMO

I think Mitch Hults is one very special young man !

Taximom
01-14-2007, 10:33 PM
Hi y'all - I am an old reader and a new poster to this board. Anyway, in TN and VA, you have to have the witnessed signature of the Insured to take out a policy on them. If the Insured is a minor, you have to have the signature of the child's parent or guardian. At least, that was the deal when I was working for an insurance company about 5 years ago.

Of course, it would be relatively easy to get a forged signature. I've seen that done many times. It's probably never checked out...until some dumb jerk murders his wife.
I brought that up before but don't remember getting an answer. I saw some case broadcast on tv where the girlfriend went w/the husband to the insurance agent to get or increase the insurance on the "real" wife. Of course, the wife ended up dead a little while later! lol Hmm wonder who killed the wife? :waitasec: :rolleyes:

I think if Michelle Money did anything like that, she might have fessed up by now. Wasn't she cooperating with LE?

Taximom
01-14-2007, 10:34 PM
Oh, and welcome to happy2bn10ec!!

happy2bn10ec
01-14-2007, 11:25 PM
Thanks, taximom and rc. Like I said, I have been reading here for years, I guess since Laci. Finally decided to post! There are lots of very smart people here - I love to read all the new ideas and opinions.

jilly
01-15-2007, 12:08 AM
Even in Laci's case she had life insurance but that wasn't the motive. In Michele's case it may play a part but probably isn't the sole reason alone.

My memory's gone but what exactly was the life insurance that the Petersons' had? I thought somehow it was attached to the mortgage.

fran
01-15-2007, 12:14 AM
My memory's gone but what exactly was the life insurance that the Petersons' had? I thought somehow it was attached to the mortgage.

They each had a $250K policy, it was one of those that accumulates value over time,..........actually a 'financial planning' type thing. I think they took them out at about the time they purchased their home.

JMHO
fran

PS....although the rumors swirled that MPD said Laci's had just been taken out, I don't think MPD necessarily said it was 'new,' they just didn't comment or correct the reports.......they kept mum about the whole thing.........

jilly
01-15-2007, 12:21 AM
They each had a $250K policy, it was one of those that accumulates value over time,..........actually a 'financial planning' type thing. I think they took them out at about the time they purchased their home.

JMHO
fran

PS....although the rumors swirled that MPD said Laci's had just been taken out, I don't think MPD necessarily said it was 'new,' they just didn't comment or correct the reports.......they kept mum about the whole thing.........

Oh yes - that refreshs my memory! Thank you! MPD was very good at their job!

Samiya
01-15-2007, 04:12 AM
Hey RC...

You were in the search party finding Ben? Sorry hon, just catching up after the hoohaa at ctv, lmao.

hugs for a hero :)

Love
Sami
xxx

raisincharlie
01-15-2007, 11:36 AM
Sami,


No hero here, just trying to help out along with the other folks (ladies and gents) in the CCOM unit. Its what we do, just ride and look.

My hero - Mitch Hults, a very fine young man.

close_enough
01-15-2007, 12:39 PM
doing my morning 'check' of the forum w/my coffee.....

interesting about the insurance.....about it MIGHT not be the 'real' motive & all that....a million dollars is a lot of money, especially if someone has grown to hate their wife, & IF someone enjoys gambling....(i know, i know, i'm still a little stuck on THAT rumor we heard very early on, but i can't help it..it's just there in the back of my mind)....oh, & then there's a girlfriend to add in the mix.....

i just don't know what to think anymore....i was pretty hopeful for an arrest last week, but i was wrong, so i'm not doing anymore guessing about that......something is preventing LE from arresting JY...something that they can't put their finger on, something that's making this hard to take to a court of law for a conviction......i hope i'm wrong, & they're still waiting on lab reports, etc......

welcome Melinda & Happy.....i must tell you all that i know Happy, & i'm soooooo glad she's decided to join in with us here on this forum:)...she's a sweetie & very smart to boot!!

packerdog
01-15-2007, 12:54 PM
Hi Close, I think it is the lab they are waiting on. Maybe this week there will be more news.

close_enough
01-15-2007, 01:00 PM
Hi Close, I think it is the lab they are waiting on. Maybe this week there will be more news.

well, i hope you're right...i'm just too impatient..don't get me wrong though..i want EVERYTHING to be done right, WHEN an arrest is made, but the waiting bothers me .....

panthera
01-15-2007, 09:27 PM
Happy New Year to you all. Your all such good detectives.:woohoo:
Just read where Jason has a life ins. policy. You would think these stupid jerks would learn from previous cases that the husband is the first suspect police have. Look at all the stuff Scott Peterson tried to cover up and got caught. You would think these violent husbands would learn from each others mistakes. Sure hope they don't pay him on that policy. Soon he will look like this.:behindbar !!!!!!

Keep up the good work guys.
MTHi Melinda! Just got back here after being gone over the weekend~ yes, Peterson, Entwistle, and all the other "DH". No, they won't pay on the policy as long as the case is under investigation and he's a potential suspect.

panthera
01-15-2007, 09:29 PM
Hey RC...

You were in the search party finding Ben?

hugs for a hero :)

Love
Sami
xxx

I definitely agree! Good work raisincharlie! :)

happy2bn10ec
01-15-2007, 10:23 PM
well, i hope you're right...i'm just too impatient..don't get me wrong though..i want EVERYTHING to be done right, WHEN an arrest is made, but the waiting bothers me .....
This waiting isn't only bothering me - it is making me NUTS!!! I want it done right, too, but after so long it worries me that they really don't have anything.

Are y'all watching LKL? Defense attorneys make me absolutely sick. They are worried about Devlin's health problems while he is incarcerated. Boofreakinghoo...

sweetmop
01-15-2007, 10:47 PM
This waiting isn't only bothering me - it is making me NUTS!!! I want it done right, too, but after so long it worries me that they really don't have anything.

Are y'all watching LKL? Defense attorneys make me absolutely sick. They are worried about Devlin's health problems while he is incarcerated. Boofreakinghoo... Too bad... Why in the world are they worrying over HIS health problems? Yuccccckkkkk!!! I'm with you, happy2bn10ec, defense attornies are sickening. The worry should be for Shawn and for Ben, and how these young boys can recover their selfes and live the rest of their lives in a halfway normal fashion.

ialy
01-15-2007, 10:48 PM
VERY thankful the Missouri boys were found and found safely -- their story has just gripped my heart, so definitely do not want this to come across wrong, please know i do not mean anything negative by this -- just betting JY is very thankful something else big grabbed the news cycle right when his People cover came out -- and hoping that people will keep MY and the pursuit of justice for her in the public eye -- and heat on her murderer

scandi
01-15-2007, 10:54 PM
Me too Ialy, I'm going :crazy: But I think it is better to wait and have it progress at its own pace. This Sheriff is a good one I think, so we gotta keep the faith, right?

otto
01-15-2007, 11:29 PM
Me too Ialy, I'm going :crazy: But I think it is better to wait and have it progress at its own pace. This Sheriff is a good one I think, so we gotta keep the faith, right?

Confidence in the police is important. Even in the much publicized Peterson case, the police had a lot of evidence that the media and public knew nothing about. I'm sure they have their eye on the right guy and are methodically building a solid case against him. It's the curiousity that makes us all crazy.

jilly
01-15-2007, 11:32 PM
This waiting isn't only bothering me - it is making me NUTS!!! I want it done right, too, but after so long it worries me that they really don't have anything.

Are y'all watching LKL? Defense attorneys make me absolutely sick. They are worried about Devlin's health problems while he is incarcerated. Boofreakinghoo...

I only caught the part about him being scared and that was good enough for me!:dance:

Welcome happy! :)

jilly
01-15-2007, 11:34 PM
Confidence in the police is important. Even in the much publicized Peterson case, the police had a lot of evidence that the media and public knew nothing about. I'm sure they have their eye on the right guy and are methodically building a solid case against him. It's the curiousity that makes us all crazy.

You're right. LE wants this case solved more than anyone of us!

panthera
01-15-2007, 11:38 PM
This waiting isn't only bothering me - it is making me NUTS!!! I want it done right, too, but after so long it worries me that they really don't have anything.

Are y'all watching LKL? Defense attorneys make me absolutely sick. They are worried about Devlin's health problems while he is incarcerated. Boofreakinghoo...The LE don't have "smoking gun" evidence against JY or anyone else right now, or there would've been an arrest. But I'm confident they're building their case and there will be justice for Michelle. ;)

I saw the LKL show and I agree: too bad about him. I feel sorry for the boys, especially Shawn.

ialy
01-15-2007, 11:53 PM
I get hope thinking of Scott Peterson's arrest -- it was months before he was arrested, and the police suspected him strongly within days, knew much that was not released for a long time, etc. Granted, there was the issue of not having yet found dear Laci and Connor, but time was taken, and it paid off. JY seems to be much better at staying quiet, but there certainly is much le knows, continuing to hope their case becomes rock solid, and that that little girl is somehow protected through all of this

panthera
01-16-2007, 12:17 AM
I get hope thinking of Scott Peterson's arrest -- it was months before he was arrested, and the police suspected him strongly within days, knew much that was not released for a long time, etc. Granted, there was the issue of not having yet found dear Laci and Connor, but time was taken, and it paid off. JY seems to be much better at staying quiet, but there certainly is much le knows, continuing to hope their case becomes rock solid, and that that little girl is somehow protected through all of thisI'm thinking about him also, and what really prompted his arrest was when the bodies washed ashore. In this case, Michelle was found in her bedroom, no sign of forced entry, no apparent interrupted burglary, etc. ~ so who else would want her dead?

Melinda Tidwell
01-16-2007, 03:21 AM
I hope JY lays in bed every night just sweating and wondering if it's his last night of freedom. It really must be stressful for him everyday just wondering. :banghead: I hope he reads all this too! I can't even imagine being in his place nor would I ever put myself there. Even if they don't love their spouse, why would anyone want to ruin their own life in this way? If I live to be 100 I will never understand anyone being capable to commit a crime like this .:waitasec:
MT

packerdog
01-16-2007, 12:41 PM
I wonder what JY tells Cassity when she is crying for her mother. How can he tell her with a straight face that mommy is in heaven?

panthera
01-16-2007, 03:06 PM
I wonder what JY tells Cassity when she is crying for her mother. How can he tell her with a straight face that mommy is in heaven?That is a very sad thought. :(

ljwf22
01-16-2007, 03:33 PM
I wonder what JY tells Cassity when she is crying for her mother. How can he tell her with a straight face that mommy is in heaven?
But, she is in heaven! :innocent:
He probably won't have the same result. Hopefully Michelle's spirit can guide LE in the right direction...

PolkSaladAnnie
01-16-2007, 03:42 PM
I wonder what JY tells Cassity when she is crying for her mother. How can he tell her with a straight face that mommy is in heaven?

oooh.... the thought of this stings .... and I'll BET Cassie's asked the Q more than once last few months...

You so HIT the right chords, PD ... WHAT does he tell her? Isn't it heartbreaking?

Blessings to all, stay well, stay safe and keep healthy .... Polk :)

curious1
01-16-2007, 03:49 PM
Oh, I think he can do it with a straight face. If he did it he has probably managed to convince himself that he was justified in what he did. He's been telling himself "I'm not a bad person, I just snapped, I would never do anything like this again". I don't see how he could live with himself otherwise.

And I kind of like this waiting game, you know it has to drive whoever did this nutz. The wondering when the knock on the door will come...Mr. XXXX we have a warrant for your arrest. And with LE taking their time we hope that means all the i's are dotted and all the t's crossed leaving very little wiggle room for the perp.

panthera
01-16-2007, 04:09 PM
Oh, I think he can do it with a straight face. If he did it he has probably managed to convince himself that he was justified in what he did. He's been telling himself "I'm not a bad person, I just snapped, I would never do anything like this again". I don't see how he could live with himself otherwise.

You're right. Anyone who could be capable of brutally murdering his wife (and unborn child) and attend her funeral, refuse to speak with the police, and not be out there begging to find the perp would be capable to talking to Cassidy with a straight face. :mad:

scandi
01-16-2007, 09:15 PM
Hi Guys, The only thing I found today that was new was this from a poster at CTV. It is from the Comment section of WRAL, so I won't put it on the links thread:

http://forums.triangle.com/WebX?7@159.UMwKazrqHVL.0@.eef3635/22

eta: If you click on 'all messages' at the bottom of the page there are a few more posts inc, one more by this poster.

raisincharlie
01-16-2007, 09:25 PM
Hi Guys, The only thing I found today that was new was this from a poster at CTV. It is from the Comment section of WRAL, so I won't put it on the links thread:

http://forums.triangle.com/WebX?7@159.UMwKazrqHVL.0@.eef3635/22

eta: If you click on 'all messages' at the bottom of the page there are a few more posts inc, one more by this poster.
How are you doing Scandi ?

Its been a bit quiet since the People mag but I have a feeling we are going to hear more soon. 10 weeks now on the autopsy , should be something before long, I would think. I would like to see a warrant on the hotel and some confirmation warrants for video that may pertain to the hotel and gas stations if there was anything caught on video. Maybe soon, I really want to know where the hotel is located, that could provide some really good conversation. If JTF shows up again - we'll know something is coming...

jilly
01-16-2007, 09:42 PM
I was reading over at CTV today, between all the fax/printer stuff & everthing else it seems we are dissecting every word of LE on the basis that it is perfectly correct.

We've seen that on one warrant or whatever they stated the Get I Market when it turns out to be Get It. There's also the Hampton 'Hotel' which could be Inn. There may be some discrepancies in this Fax as opposed to Printout.

We really need some more information......soon.

raisincharlie
01-16-2007, 09:50 PM
I was reading over at CTV today, between all the fax/printer stuff & everthing else it seems we are dissecting every word of LE on the basis that it is perfectly correct.

We've seen that on one warrant or whatever they stated the Get I Market when it turns out to be Get It. There's also the Hampton 'Hotel' which could be Inn. There may be some discrepancies in this Fax as opposed to Printout.

We really need some more information......soon.
We do need more information Jilly ! I admit it, I was in on the fax deal. I'm anal retentive and could not help myself. :o Iwill take LE's words everytime over what the media puts out, and for good reason. I see a computer taken from the home and I see a printer but I do not see a fax machine in any of the warrants or even a reference to a fax. It does not in truth matter what it was - all that matters is who it came from, how it was printed, when it arrived, as well as what it was to see if everyone's story matches up. JMO.

jilly
01-16-2007, 10:02 PM
We do need more information Jilly ! I admit it, I was in on the fax deal. I'm anal retentive and could not help myself. :o Iwill take LE's words everytime over what the media puts out, and for good reason. I see a computer taken from the home and I see a printer but I do not see a fax machine in any of the warrants or even a reference to a fax. It does not in truth matter what it was - all that matters is who it came from, how it was printed, when it arrived, as well as what it was to see if everyone's story matches up. JMO.

Exactly! Like you I sure hope it relates to JY and not MM.

scandi
01-16-2007, 10:39 PM
Oh Charlie, I'm miserable! For some reason I couldn't go to sleep last night. About 5am I turned on the local news and they said it was snowing :eek: I jumped out of bed and threw open the sliding glass door to my patio, and sure enough there was a good solid dusting of snow on everything and it was really coming down. I threw on my clothes and headed out the door to run to the store and stopped short - no way was I going to risk driving down a hill with 2 corners!

I had no ciggies, the snow was now an inch deep, then 2" LOL when I spotted a young man walking past my apt - I hired him on the spot to walk down the hill and get me some. What a morning. The snow is beautiful, and as I'm on a hill I look out over the valley towards the west. Really a beautiful scene. So I did some reading on the case today!

I read through all ConcernedCitizens posts at CTV, as I thought maybe he had mentioned the luggage. Nopey Nope. For the life of me I can't remember where I read that except at CTV mid Nov.

CC did have one early post where he timed out the trip to VA. It was to Blacksburg he thought but his timing wasn't perfect. He must know JY, and definately had an agenda, to the point he suggested Michelle was the one who was unfaithful. So I don't really believe him anyway no matter what he says. He hasn't posted since the 1st week in Decd!

I can't understand the whoopala about the fax or document sent to the house, and think the timing of it being sent is the important thing 'in the hours before she was found', and I read your post and thought it was very good. On thinking about that, it is the words used that give a clue as to when the document printed out. To me, in the hours before would be 2 or 3 hours. Several hours could be 6-8, many hours up to 12.

I think this is what happened: He had a time in mind for a last min fix of getting Cassidy out of there and the discoverery of the body. Meredith went to work that day at 11 or 11:30 as I remember. So when that time came and he had to do something, he opened up his laptop, pulled up the flyer on the purse, and since his laptop was tied into the home computer {if it was LOL, why not be able to print off his lap top that way>}, and clicked on print.

In his house, the printer reved up like mine does {the Officejet All-in=one}. and out came a copy of the flyer on the purse. He then called Meredith and left her a message. It is so simple, and I can not understand why it is discussed over and over again. But then I have that new HP machine that is absolutely the best and know that as long as the computer is on the printer will even work when you are offline.

If anyone can remember about the link to the luggage that would be :cool: Maybe it isn't important, but could help show motive that she had kicked him out, or first steps were being taken. It made reality grim for him and he couldn't accept that.

Oh, the new 'insider', I see right thru her unfortunately. She reminds me of a bouncing bubbly realtor I once worked with, and is a nice contrast to just the facts who I think is quite deceitfrul. This is the case of the agenda. I too need more facts is what I've been trying to say! LOLOLOL

Hope your farm is faring well with all the ice Charlie.

raisincharlie
01-16-2007, 11:12 PM
<snip>


I think this is what happened: He had a time in mind for a last min fix of getting Cassidy out of there and the discoverery of the body. Meredith went to work that day at 11 or 11:30 as I remember. So when that time came and he had to do something, he opened up his laptop, pulled up the flyer on the purse, and since his laptop was tied into the home computer {if it was LOL, why not be able to print off his lap top that way>}, and clicked on print.

In his house, the printer reved up like mine does {the Officejet All-in=one}. and out came a copy of the flyer on the purse. He then called Meredith and left her a message. It is so simple, and I can not understand why it is discussed over and over again. But then I have that new HP machine that is absolutely the best and know that as long as the computer is on the printer will even work when you are offline.

If anyone can remember about the link to the luggage that would be :cool: Maybe it isn't important, but could help show motive that she had kicked him out, or first steps were being taken. It made reality grim for him and he couldn't accept that.

Oh, the new 'insider', I see right thru her unfortunately. She reminds me of a bouncing bubbly realtor I once worked with, and is a nice contrast to just the facts who I think is quite deceitfrul. This is the case of the agenda. I too need more facts is what I've been trying to say! LOLOLOL

Hope your farm is faring well with all the ice Charlie.
Scandi,

I really enjoy sitting out on the deck watching the snow with a good cup of coffee - I like to capture flakes and look at them - amazing. Yes, a nice easy snowfall is great - unfortunately don't get much here but when we do I am all over it ! Your view sounds very nice-enjoy!

As for the print out - I agree he could have sent it himself - stop by a wifi location and send it on its way. No matter what, JY knew it was at the house, that says something. As for the luggage - Scandi I can't think of who said that or when - wish I could help you - I know it is making you crazy. Sorry luv!

I bucked at the new insider - JY was not technologically savvy comment. don't buy that for a minute, in one sentence says she worked with him a while ago and is now claiming to know things - the past and present have melded. Nope no turnips for me. I'm so jaded...

Things are fine here Scandi - the ice is awesome on the trees that are still standing anyway...:p

RC

scandi
01-16-2007, 11:29 PM
That's good news your trees are holding up. They must have nice deep roots.

I don't know what a Wifi station is or why it would be needed? Is that because his lap-top is wireless?

raisincharlie
01-16-2007, 11:40 PM
That's good news your trees are holding up. They must have nice deep roots.

I don't know what a Wifi station is or why it would be needed? Is that because his lap-top is wireless?
I have a Dell Lattitude lap top - mine is wireless. Around here there are several small specialty shops such as coffee houses and bagel shops that have wireless transmitters. Buy a bagel or Danish, a nice coffee (not Starbucks - yuckie :D ) and internet away. Here it is called wifi - maybe some other name somewhere else.

pack_fan
01-17-2007, 01:06 AM
I have a Dell Lattitude lap top - mine is wireless. Around here there are several small specialty shops such as coffee houses and bagel shops that have wireless transmitters. Buy a bagel or Danish, a nice coffee (not Starbucks - yuckie :D ) and internet away. Here it is called wifi - maybe some other name somewhere else.
Charlie,

You been bickering with posters on other boards? I'm keeping an eye on you. HEE HEE HEE.

I was so looking forward to reading the people magazine but quite a disappointment for me. Not quite sure what I was expecting but I didn't get it. I suppose I was waiting for them to lay out LE's entire batch of facts and go ahead and solve the case for us but no luck.

As for JY being technically saavy, don't have a clue. I would think that it would be a disadvantage in his job but it could be that his company has a technical support department to run through networking issues and so forth. It has been my experience that software salesmen simply know the software and not much else. Come out and demonstrate the functions of the software and don't get into the other issues. If you like the software, technical issues can be addressed with the appropriate parties. Actually the last one that came calling on us brought a networking guy to answer questions about compatibility with our current system and so on and so on.

I don't know who sent the printout/fax and I'm not sure the source of the document would be that important. If it was not sent by JY then I would suspect that it was requested to be sent by him. UNLESS it could be determined that the document was directly from the home computer in the middle of the night or wee hours of the morning. This would pretty much give it away.

I have had a complete change of heart over the last week. After reviewing the facts that we know along with some of the other information that I have gathered along the way, I think this was premeditated all the way. This completely goes against my last theory but I think I mentioned quite some time ago that I would reserve the right to change my mind. I wanted to believe that things were not so happy in the house, tensions were high and he just snapped but I think I was giving him the benefit of the doubt.

I had always thought that she was attacked in bed (wishful thinking I suppose, hoping that she didn't know what happened) like someone snuck up on her while sleeping but I have been led to beleive other wise recently. In the lastest release, the reason for photo evidence and otherwise was clearly stated that there was dna, footprints, and other trace evidence to be used for COMPARISON. IMO, the perp wanted to sneak up on MY while sleeping but she woke up, either dog barking or just a light sleeper. I would tend to agree with some other posters here that the time of death is later rather than earlier. Some time in the middle of the night but definately time to do whatever necessary and get out of there well before dawn. Not sure of when that would have been on the morning of Nov. 3rd but wouldn't want to risk being seen.

Just my opinion but I beleive that there will be an arrest as soon as all of the forensics is returned and reviewed. I suspect they have long been done with trying to exclude JY. More along the lines of excluding the possibility that someone didn't help him.

Mama-cita
01-17-2007, 01:19 AM
Just my opinion but I beleive that there will be an arrest as soon as all of the forensics is returned and reviewed. I suspect they have long been done with trying to exclude JY. More along the lines of excluding the possibility that someone didn't help him.
It's really good to see you Pack Fan, I came out of lurk-dome to say thanks for that post! I am crossing my fingers you are right!

Mama-cita
01-17-2007, 01:26 AM
Hi Guys, The only thing I found today that was new was this from a poster at CTV. It is from the Comment section of WRAL, so I won't put it on the links thread:

http://forums.triangle.com/WebX?7@159.UMwKazrqHVL.0@.eef3635/22

eta: If you click on 'all messages' at the bottom of the page there are a few more posts inc, one more by this poster.
This is very interesting. I wonder why Cassidy hasn't been taken OUT of his home! I hope to goodness he doesn't harm her!

raisincharlie
01-17-2007, 01:26 AM
Pack fan,


Who me - bickering - naw simply holding my ground :D I must admit I did say something I wish I had not said but...it was a momentary condition of weakness and being fed up. :silenced:

I have to admit that I am strongly leaning to the premeditation theory but am trying to fight it off as I have seen nothing concrete on which to base that opinion. I think the non testimonial order pushed me over. Not much there but I was concerned about the comments about a possible struggle. I think if JY returned to the home in the middle of the night - he meant to do something. Talking things out could have waited and would have been wise if things were in an uproar - to return is looking for an excuse IMO.

I still hope it is not JY for Cassidy's sake but very honestly, that hope is dwindling. I think you may well be correct about lab results coming back and being reviewed - things being put in perspective. If the autopsy is released soon I think that will verify your thought that forensics are coming in. I do not mind the delay, even though I want more information, as long as the criminal is cornered, captured, and brought to trial facing a strong solid case followed by a conviction.

pack_fan
01-17-2007, 01:28 AM
Couple of other random thoughts since there hasn't been anything released since the NTO.

I think the murder weapon was brought from outside the home which would have been a definite sign of pre-meditation but just my opinion of course.

Since the NTO stated that the perp may have been injured, I think Michelle was grabbing at whatever to defend herself. Possible lamp as mentioned or broken picture frame.

MF mentioned in the 911 call that she moved a pillow. Possible that it fell off the bed in a struggle but also possible that she was covered up afterwards. Don't think MF would have moved a pillow on the bed if MY was discovered on the floor. I think I recall hearing somewhere, you guys may be able to help me on this, that sometimes when people kill those close to them, they cover the victim so they don't have to see them afterwards. Can't think of any other reason that she would have moved the pillow. BUT, since Cassidy was in the house, no telling how or what went on. Might be a moot point.

Also been wondering what LE confiscated the memory stick that belonged to LS. Wondering if they were looking for photos of inside the house to determine if things were in the right places.

Anyway, just a few random thoughts to get the wheels turning, helps me to think out loud.

Taximom
01-17-2007, 01:29 AM
This is very interesting. I wonder why Cassidy hasn't been taken OUT of his home! I hope to goodness he doesn't harm her!
I just read about a case where two older children were living with their father and everyone KNOWS that he killed their mother (about a year ago). Somehow LE isn't able to piece it all together yet... (I wish I could remember the names.) After reading about that, I figured this is "normal" in this type of investigation. Scary, but normal.

raisincharlie
01-17-2007, 01:33 AM
<snip>

Also been wondering what LE confiscated the memory stick that belonged to LS. Wondering if they were looking for photos of inside the house to determine if things were in the right places.

Anyway, just a few random thoughts to get the wheels turning, helps me to think out loud.
Holy smoke - I never thought about that ! LE could also tell if some things might be missing. I'm thinking you are a genius ! :cool:

pack_fan
01-17-2007, 01:34 AM
This is very interesting. I wonder why Cassidy hasn't been taken OUT of his home! I hope to goodness he doesn't harm her!
Good to see you too, thanks for the hello.

I don't know if they can take her out of the home unless he is charged but someone else probably knows more than I do.

scandi
01-17-2007, 01:35 AM
How Funny, I thought the same thing Mama-cita when I saw his post, and it is also good to see you MC. I think if they haven't arrested him by say Feb 4th or 5th, I'm gonna wonder what in the world isn't sitting right with investigators.

In rereading all those older posts today I read many that involved the sighting of a car there in the wee hours of the morning, given by a neighbor. Wouldn't that have been great if it had panned out? Wonder why the neighbor said he saw a car there if there wasn't one. They said that is why LE took so many photos of all the cars parked at the funeral. Would be interesting to see if a definition of it was ever put out there.

Taximom
01-17-2007, 01:39 AM
I was thinking that Cassidy might have gotten a pillow for her mommy. Reason being, if the killer put a pillow over MY, Cassidy surely would have moved it to get closer to her mommy.

I guess it depends on where the pillow was. Maybe MY was clutching it as protection against the violence and it stayed near her hands on the ground.

Not happy thoughts, that's for sure.

Gee, I hope Cassidy didn't have to step in broken glass or anything like that. :sick:

pack_fan
01-17-2007, 01:43 AM
And so all know, I too have an agenda that you should all be aware of. Justice for Michelle, Cassidy, and her unborn child.....

scandi
01-17-2007, 01:53 AM
Thanks for that PackFan. One thing going in favor of justice ruling in the case I think is the Prosecutor. We are very fortunate I think about that.

Who is LS? I think Harrison said in Greta's interview that there was no burglary. It was kind of a definative statement, and he probably should have qualified it. But you are right, as they would have to use photos to compare things.

pack_fan
01-17-2007, 02:04 AM
I was thinking that Cassidy might have gotten a pillow for her mommy. Reason being, if the killer put a pillow over MY, Cassidy surely would have moved it to get closer to her mommy.

I guess it depends on where the pillow was. Maybe MY was clutching it as protection against the violence and it stayed near her hands on the ground.

Not happy thoughts, that's for sure.

Gee, I hope Cassidy didn't have to step in broken glass or anything like that. :sick:
Very possible that Cassidy did get it for her.

I think you all know I'm not here to spread rumors so take this for what it's worth. Some friends of mine who were interviewed by LE told me that Michelle did not die without a fight. LE said she fought like hell and I hope she kicked him where it hurts, REPEATEDLY. Point being, she wasn't cowering at the perp in a defensive position. This is one of the reasons that I think that this case will be solved when forensics is returned. There is no way that she put up the fight she did without scratching, or getting some sort of dna evidence.

My only concearn is that the defense attorney is going to argue that his dna is going to be all over the house since he lived there. Hoping for dna under the fingernails, hair and blood on a broken picture frame, somewhere rather incriminating is the point I'm trying to make.

Taximom
01-17-2007, 02:07 AM
Very possible that Cassidy did get it for her.

I think you all know I'm not here to spread rumors so take this for what it's worth. Some friends of mine who were interviewed by LE told me that Michelle did not die without a fight. LE said she fought like hell and I hope she kicked him where it hurts, REPEATEDLY. Point being, she wasn't cowering at the perp in a defensive position. This is one of the reasons that I think that this case will be solved when forensics is returned. There is no way that she put up the fight she did without scratching, or getting some sort of dna evidence.

My only concearn is that the defense attorney is going to argue that his dna is going to be all over the house since he lived there. Hoping for dna under the fingernails, hair and blood on a broken picture frame, somewhere rather incriminating is the point I'm trying to make.
I think she put up a heck of a fight too, thank goodness. She might have been in defensive mode toward the end of the struggle though. He could have kicked her or attacked her when she was down.

Ack, just the thought. I'll have to read something "happy" before heading to bed.

close_enough
01-17-2007, 02:17 AM
Oh, I think he can do it with a straight face. If he did it he has probably managed to convince himself that he was justified in what he did. He's been telling himself "I'm not a bad person, I just snapped, I would never do anything like this again". I don't see how he could live with himself otherwise.
And I kind of like this waiting game, you know it has to drive whoever did this nutz. The wondering when the knock on the door will come...Mr. XXXX we have a warrant for your arrest. And with LE taking their time we hope that means all the i's are dotted and all the t's crossed leaving very little wiggle room for the perp.

me either...

pack_fan
01-17-2007, 02:19 AM
Thanks for that PackFan. One thing going in favor of justice ruling in the case I think is the Prosecutor. We are very fortunate I think about that.

Who is LS? I think Harrison said in Greta's interview that there was no burglary. It was kind of a definative statement, and he probably should have qualified it. But you are right, as they would have to use photos to compare things.
Elizabeth Shroff, sorry. She goes by Lisa.

I wasn't suggesting a burglary, only trying to figure out why the photos were taken. Really the only things I could come up with were for compromising pictures or comparison purposes. When I was thinking about some thing missing, I was thinking more along the lines of a murder weapon possibly.

close_enough
01-17-2007, 02:21 AM
oooh.... the thought of this stings .... and I'll BET Cassie's asked the Q more than once last few months...

You so HIT the right chords, PD ... WHAT does he tell her? Isn't it heartbreaking?

Blessings to all, stay well, stay safe and keep healthy .... Polk :)

i'll bet she has too, Polk.....i picture him not telling her anything....letting his parents, brother/sister??? handle all that...he's too 'distraught' over it all..... :rolleyes:

but that's just me...

raisincharlie
01-17-2007, 02:26 AM
Very possible that Cassidy did get it for her.

I think you all know I'm not here to spread rumors so take this for what it's worth. Some friends of mine who were interviewed by LE told me that Michelle did not die without a fight. LE said she fought like hell and I hope she kicked him where it hurts, REPEATEDLY. Point being, she wasn't cowering at the perp in a defensive position. This is one of the reasons that I think that this case will be solved when forensics is returned. There is no way that she put up the fight she did without scratching, or getting some sort of dna evidence.

My only concearn is that the defense attorney is going to argue that his dna is going to be all over the house since he lived there. Hoping for dna under the fingernails, hair and blood on a broken picture frame, somewhere rather incriminating is the point I'm trying to make.
Pack fan,

I think perhaps the DNA issue may in fact be the reason LE is going very slowly and why they are hunting for every single piece of circumstancial evidence that can be found to back up the DNA. I think the returns of warrant we have seen so far points out that LE is leaving nothing unturned, nothing to chance.

I have thought long and hard about the warrant on the SUV. If the two drops noted turn out to be blood, it is significant. It is huge if it is MY's, but if JYs it is still of importance. The reason I say that is - one can easily explain blood inside the vehicle that belongs to JY, MY, or even Cassidy but how does one address blood on the outside of the vehicle ? True the date and time of that deposit cannot be made from the sample collected however it can be narrowed by going back and reviewing the weather for things such as rainfall and dewpoint temperatures. If that vehicle was routinely parked out of doors - lots of things can be determined. I hate saying this but I do hope that external droplet is blood, and not Cassidy's.

As to your agenda - I think it is safe to say it is shared by those who post here. For rumors - you have never gone down that path and have always acted admirably with respect to that issue. I admire that - you are in a most difficult position, one for which I would not wish to find myself in or would I wish on anyone. What you have posted has always been done so with integrity and conviction. For what you have shared - I hope there is indeed evidence in or on unlikely places to help pinpoint the killer. There will be an answer IMO.

close_enough
01-17-2007, 02:33 AM
I was reading over at CTV today, between all the fax/printer stuff & everthing else it seems we are dissecting every word of LE on the basis that it is perfectly correct.

We've seen that on one warrant or whatever they stated the Get I Market when it turns out to be Get It. There's also the Hampton 'Hotel' which could be Inn. There may be some discrepancies in this Fax as opposed to Printout.

We really need some more information......soon.

i know...it's really crazy weird, ya know?...it's very repetitive, for the most part, till someone pops in says they know who killed Michelle.....wtf?

i'm going to get really frustrated soon.....let's face it, .... it's the Get IT Market..come on...LOL
have no clue about Hampton....that "receipt" thing threw me for a loop, to be honest......
didn't i read an article that stated that LE "knows certain times & certain places JY was" already..??? ( i know it wasn't worded the same, but it led me to believe they've got all the info they're gonna get, as far as motel/inn/hotel, cell phone calls & 'fax'.....which means an alibi, right?)

i don't know...i'm just thinking

Taximom
01-17-2007, 02:38 AM
I'm still hoping for carpet fibers or something else traceable from that hotel in their home.

raisincharlie
01-17-2007, 02:41 AM
I'm still hoping for carpet fibers or something else traceable from that hotel in their home.
That is why I think the special piece of equipment may have been an electrostatic duster... just my (most likely silly) thought.

close_enough
01-17-2007, 02:43 AM
Charlie,

You been bickering with posters on other boards? I'm keeping an eye on you. HEE HEE HEE.

I was so looking forward to reading the people magazine but quite a disappointment for me. Not quite sure what I was expecting but I didn't get it. I suppose I was waiting for them to lay out LE's entire batch of facts and go ahead and solve the case for us but no luck.

As for JY being technically saavy, don't have a clue. I would think that it would be a disadvantage in his job but it could be that his company has a technical support department to run through networking issues and so forth. It has been my experience that software salesmen simply know the software and not much else. Come out and demonstrate the functions of the software and don't get into the other issues. If you like the software, technical issues can be addressed with the appropriate parties. Actually the last one that came calling on us brought a networking guy to answer questions about compatibility with our current system and so on and so on.

I don't know who sent the printout/fax and I'm not sure the source of the document would be that important. If it was not sent by JY then I would suspect that it was requested to be sent by him. UNLESS it could be determined that the document was directly from the home computer in the middle of the night or wee hours of the morning. This would pretty much give it away.

I have had a complete change of heart over the last week. After reviewing the facts that we know along with some of the other information that I have gathered along the way, I think this was premeditated all the way. This completely goes against my last theory but I think I mentioned quite some time ago that I would reserve the right to change my mind. I wanted to believe that things were not so happy in the house, tensions were high and he just snapped but I think I was giving him the benefit of the doubt.

I had always thought that she was attacked in bed (wishful thinking I suppose, hoping that she didn't know what happened) like someone snuck up on her while sleeping but I have been led to beleive other wise recently. In the lastest release, the reason for photo evidence and otherwise was clearly stated that there was dna, footprints, and other trace evidence to be used for COMPARISON. IMO, the perp wanted to sneak up on MY while sleeping but she woke up, either dog barking or just a light sleeper. I would tend to agree with some other posters here that the time of death is later rather than earlier. Some time in the middle of the night but definately time to do whatever necessary and get out of there well before dawn. Not sure of when that would have been on the morning of Nov. 3rd but wouldn't want to risk being seen.

Just my opinion but I beleive that there will be an arrest as soon as all of the forensics is returned and reviewed. I suspect they have long been done with trying to exclude JY. More along the lines of excluding the possibility that someone didn't help him.

of course it was premeditated..i think the DA will prove it too..jmo

glad to see you here Pack:)

close_enough
01-17-2007, 02:45 AM
I think she put up a heck of a fight too, thank goodness. She might have been in defensive mode toward the end of the struggle though. He could have kicked her or attacked her when she was down.

Ack, just the thought. I'll have to read something "happy" before heading to bed.

i think she did too, TM.....

lol, i'll have to read something "happy" soon too....

close_enough
01-17-2007, 02:52 AM
Pack fan,

I think perhaps the DNA issue may in fact be the reason LE is going very slowly and why they are hunting for every single piece of circumstancial evidence that can be found to back up the DNA. I think the returns of warrant we have seen so far points out that LE is leaving nothing unturned, nothing to chance.

I have thought long and hard about the warrant on the SUV. If the two drops noted turn out to be blood, it is significant. It is huge if it is MY's, but if JYs it is still of importance. The reason I say that is - one can easily explain blood inside the vehicle that belongs to JY, MY, or even Cassidy but how does one address blood on the outside of the vehicle ? True the date and time of that deposit cannot be made from the sample collected however it can be narrowed by going back and reviewing the weather for things such as rainfall and dewpoint temperatures. If that vehicle was routinely parked out of doors - lots of things can be determined. I hate saying this but I do hope that external droplet is blood, and not Cassidy's.

As to your agenda - I think it is safe to say it is shared by those who post here. For rumors - you have never gone down that path and have always acted admirably with respect to that issue. I admire that - you are in a most difficult position, one for which I would not wish to find myself in or would I wish on anyone. What you have posted has always been done so with integrity and conviction. For what you have shared - I hope there is indeed evidence in or on unlikely places to help pinpoint the killer. There will be an answer IMO.

i have to agree....RC said it perfectly!
...i'm glad you're around....the footprints 'thing' got me to thinking....

eta.....oops, let me correct this...the possibility of footprints....they wanted a "comparison"....

Taximom
01-17-2007, 02:58 AM
That is why I think the special piece of equipment may have been an electrostatic duster... just my (most likely silly) thought.
Naw, raisin, that's not silly in the least.

Good reading here tonight, everyone. Maybe later today justice will be served. We can only hope.

close_enough
01-17-2007, 03:05 AM
Couple of other random thoughts since there hasn't been anything released since the NTO.

I think the murder weapon was brought from outside the home which would have been a definite sign of pre-meditation but just my opinion of course.

Since the NTO stated that the perp may have been injured, I think Michelle was grabbing at whatever to defend herself. Possible lamp as mentioned or broken picture frame.

MF mentioned in the 911 call that she moved a pillow. Possible that it fell off the bed in a struggle but also possible that she was covered up afterwards. Don't think MF would have moved a pillow on the bed if MY was discovered on the floor. I think I recall hearing somewhere, you guys may be able to help me on this, that sometimes when people kill those close to them, they cover the victim so they don't have to see them afterwards. Can't think of any other reason that she would have moved the pillow. BUT, since Cassidy was in the house, no telling how or what went on. Might be a moot point.

Also been wondering what LE confiscated the memory stick that belonged to LS. Wondering if they were looking for photos of inside the house to determine if things were in the right places.

Anyway, just a few random thoughts to get the wheels turning, helps me to think out loud.

yeah....that's true...some murderers/freaks enjoy looking in the eyes, some don't...it's something a 'profiler' would look at...(am i making sense?)....i think the pillow was over Michelle's head too....& you're right, there's no telling how or what went on...i don't think it's moot though, at all....at some point JY thought enough to cover Michelle's head...he knew Cassidy was there....since Meredith moved the pillow, we know Cassidy didn't.....

eta.....i hadn't thought about the pics of inside the house being on that computer, but i forgot about the "scrapbook" for Cassidy....since JY isn't helping LE with the investigation, (not letting them know if anything was out of place) this would seem a good way to check it out....cool
....

close_enough
01-17-2007, 03:12 AM
That is why I think the special piece of equipment may have been an electrostatic duster... just my (most likely silly) thought.

not silly at all :slap: .....lots & lots of info/evidence fixin to come out...imo?

Taximom
01-17-2007, 04:07 AM
yeah....that's true...some murderers/freaks enjoy looking in the eyes, some don't...it's something a 'profiler' would look at...(am i making sense?)....i think the pillow was over Michelle's head too....& you're right, there's no telling how or what went on...i don't think it's moot though, at all....at some point JY thought enough to cover Michelle's head...he knew Cassidy was there....since Meredith moved the pillow, we know Cassidy didn't.....

eta.....i hadn't thought about the pics of inside the house being on that computer, but i forgot about the "scrapbook" for Cassidy....since JY isn't helping LE with the investigation, (not letting them know if anything was out of place) this would seem a good way to check it out....cool
....
We don't know where Meredith moved the pillow from, do we?

I can't remember much from the very beginning anymore. I really don't want to listen to the 911 tape again. :(

close_enough
01-17-2007, 04:15 AM
We don't know where Meredith moved the pillow from, do we?

I can't remember much from the very beginning anymore. I really don't want to listen to the 911 tape again. :(

nope...it's never been officially stated....but we know Meredith had to move a pillow, when she found Michelle...she states that all she did was "move a pillow"....this was during 911 call, near the end when it's decided by the dispatcher that there's nothing that can be done for Michelle...he tells her to not touch anything, & she tells him all she did was move a pillow......i think she HAD to move a pillow to view Michelle's head...

don't blame you for not wanting to listen to the 911 tape again...lol, i don't either....(not making lite of it, but god knows i listened to that tape a gazillion times)

strach304
01-17-2007, 09:58 AM
I just had a strange out of nowhere thought that I can't reconcile from what we do know so far :confused:
Jason hasn't exactly denied killing Michele has he or don't we know? We got media reports early on as to his whereabouts or where he was thought to be which I think came from LE. We don't know what transpired in that brief phone call he had with LE. Don't ask, don't tell?

I know the idea sounds crazy except for his lawyer advising him not to talk I suppose because if he gives LE info denying it and they end up with strong forensics or witness id something really strong that backs him into a corner then he can't use other types of defense that may be open to him otherwise. If he doesn't talk to LE they can't ask him. His lawyer won't know what evidence they have until he's charged. That one post some of us saw on another message board about the bruises on Jason's arm made me think at the time he would go for the battered spouse defense. Yeah I know crazy but it never stopped Geragos from inventing satanists. There's always the heated argument that got out of hand and try and get manslaughter too. Look at Robert Durst. :eek:

packerdog
01-17-2007, 11:38 AM
I was thinking about the blood spots on/in the SUV. If it is MY blood, could they tell when testing the blood if she was pregnant? I would think the blood spot on the door would be recent. I wonder when he last had the SUV washed.

panthera
01-17-2007, 03:01 PM
I'm still hoping for carpet fibers or something else traceable from that hotel in their home.That would be interesting if something like that had stuck to his shoes all the way from the hotel back to the house, but stranger things have happened. Did we ever hear if there were any type of foot or shoe print in the blood other than Cassidys?

nanandjim
01-17-2007, 03:14 PM
If possible, I think that they should have a cop openly trailing him at all times and openly sitting outside of his residence. I think that they should drive him crazy and make him paranoid, enough so that it might finally make him make a wrong move or break down.

panthera
01-17-2007, 03:18 PM
If possible, I think that they should have a cop openly trailing him at all times and openly sitting outside of his residence. I think that they should drive him crazy and make him paranoid, enough so that it might finally make him make a wrong move or break down.I won't disagree with that idea! :D

jilly
01-17-2007, 05:54 PM
If possible, I think that they should have a cop openly trailing him at all times and openly sitting outside of his residence. I think that they should drive him crazy and make him paranoid, enough so that it might finally make him make a wrong move or break down.

Me too Nan - and tap all his phones and keep re-interviewing his friends (especially MM) possibly updating them with little tidbits as LE did with the Peterson friends. If this guy is guilty, he won't have a friend left. I want them to keep this in the national media so at the very least to prevent him from getting another job. It's time to take the gloves off and eliminate this guy's smug attitude.

Taximom
01-17-2007, 06:06 PM
That would be interesting if something like that had stuck to his shoes all the way from the hotel back to the house, but stranger things have happened. Did we ever hear if there were any type of foot or shoe print in the blood other than Cassidys?
Let's just hope they have something good!

panthera
01-17-2007, 07:41 PM
Let's just hope they have something good!I too am hoping they've got something after all the days spent in the house collecting evidence! :cool:

raisincharlie
01-18-2007, 12:33 AM
Since it has been confirmed over and over in warrant after warrant and now in the People Mag LE says they offered JY their condolences and asked him for assistance and he refused from that moment forward - does anyone believe JY truly had a scheduled meeting that he actually attended in Virginia on 3 November?

jilly
01-18-2007, 12:52 AM
Since it has been confirmed over and over in warrant after warrant and now in the People Mag LE says they offered JY their condolences and asked him for assistance and he refused from that moment forward - does anyone believe JY truly had a scheduled meeting that he actually attended in Virginia on 3 November?

I'm starting to think 'no' if I can believe a poster at CTV who said JY told a friend at the funeral that he had a meeting in Va. JY knows LE would be talking to that friend.

I think this murder was premeditated and if he did have a meeting it would be anywhere but Va.

Taximom
01-18-2007, 01:13 AM
I'm starting to think 'no' if I can believe a poster at CTV who said JY told a friend at the funeral that he had a meeting in Va. JY knows LE would be talking to that friend.

I think this murder was premeditated and if he did have a meeting it would be anywhere but Va.
jilly, I'm with you! Anything JY told friends at the funeral should be highly suspect. :liar:

It would be interesting to find out how ChartOne gets new business. Do they get the potential clients and assign the client to the rep that has that area? Or do they expect their reps to get clients and do the cold calls? (or both?!) I'm just wondering how JY would have had a client in VA. :waitasec: Maybe all the reps have large areas to cover.

pack_fan
01-18-2007, 01:43 AM
Since it has been confirmed over and over in warrant after warrant and now in the People Mag LE says they offered JY their condolences and asked him for assistance and he refused from that moment forward - does anyone believe JY truly had a scheduled meeting that he actually attended in Virginia on 3 November?
Yes and no and don't really know. My multiple personalities keep arguing with one another. I do beleive that all of us (the personalities) will be in counseling when this is said and done with.

If money was the motive for the murder, this had been planned for at least three months (considering the insurance change/addition). If he was going to use the business trip as a motive, he would be quite foolish to tell friends at the funeral that he was gone to a business meeting if indeed there was not one in the first place. I would think that he would want someone to see his smiling face the next day in order to establish his whereabouts and make LE prove that he had the opportunity to commit the crime. I would also think that it would have been an early morning meeting to narrow down the time line.

His statements could have been taken the wrong way by RF and misrepresented in the media. It is possible that he was in the area cold calling on customers or checking on things for current customers. This would seem less likely to me if he had planned the murder so far in advance. I still think he would want to create a timeline for himself if indeed he is the perp. It would be interesting to find out how Chart one handles travel with salesmen. Most companies arrange travel for scheduled meetings, others do so by expense reports and the salesmen handle their own arrangements.

I guess I would lean towards yes to the business meeting. It would narrow the window of opportunity if he checked in late or made a late night phone call then had an early business meeting rather than no scheduled agenda.

jmo, imo, moo, xyz, abc, xxx, ooo, and zzz......

scandi
01-18-2007, 02:02 AM
Hi Pack Fan,

Did you ever hit that nail on the head when you said "I do beleive that all of us (the personalities) will be in counseling when this is said and done with."

I just found myself in that predicament, imagining what I would have to do to kill someone so viciously and leave my baby girl alone with the dead body.
Totally bizarre. I can't believe I even said that.

But tonight I started thinking about Cassidy. That simple and astute little protector of her mommy who loved her daddy too. It just overwhelmed me so and made me realize she is the passion for me in this case. It is what keeps my brain trying to solve the case.

When I think about it I had just watched 2 hours of American Idol in Seattle, and believe me, if anything could turn a woman nutso, that could do it! :rolleyes:

jilly
01-18-2007, 02:11 AM
jilly, I'm with you! Anything JY told friends at the funeral should be highly suspect. :liar:

It would be interesting to find out how ChartOne gets new business. Do they get the potential clients and assign the client to the rep that has that area? Or do they expect their reps to get clients and do the cold calls? (or both?!) I'm just wondering how JY would have had a client in VA. :waitasec: Maybe all the reps have large areas to cover.

Yup - just more questions to add to our pile!

raisincharlie
01-18-2007, 02:13 AM
Yes and no and don't really know. My multiple personalities keep arguing with one another. I do beleive that all of us (the personalities) will be in counseling when this is said and done with.

If money was the motive for the murder, this had been planned for at least three months (considering the insurance change/addition). If he was going to use the business trip as a motive, he would be quite foolish to tell friends at the funeral that he was gone to a business meeting if indeed there was not one in the first place. I would think that he would want someone to see his smiling face the next day in order to establish his whereabouts and make LE prove that he had the opportunity to commit the crime. I would also think that it would have been an early morning meeting to narrow down the time line.

His statements could have been taken the wrong way by RF and misrepresented in the media. It is possible that he was in the area cold calling on customers or checking on things for current customers. This would seem less likely to me if he had planned the murder so far in advance. I still think he would want to create a timeline for himself if indeed he is the perp. It would be interesting to find out how Chart one handles travel with salesmen. Most companies arrange travel for scheduled meetings, others do so by expense reports and the salesmen handle their own arrangements.

I guess I would lean towards yes to the business meeting. It would narrow the window of opportunity if he checked in late or made a late night phone call then had an early business meeting rather than no scheduled agenda.

jmo, imo, moo, xyz, abc, xxx, ooo, and zzz......
Pack fan,

Multiple personalities - bless your heart !

I agree with most of what you have said, it all makes sense. IMO there may have been a meeting - but I am not convinced he attended it if it existed. Yes he would want someone to see him if he indeed had on a bright smiling face - but what if he didn't have a bright smiley face - would he still want someone to see him ? He would have to be aware that whoever he met with might also be able to say he looked like cold cr@p as easily as they could say he looked bright and smiley. I think if he looked bad from being awake all nite, or he had a shiner, or scratches he would rather not be seen to avoid anyone saying so. JMO

LE was looking for something on his person that might reveal a struggle when they requested the non testimonial order - I'm not big on reading much into the sunglasses at the funeral service - but there is the possiblity that there was a reason for them beyond just the fact it was a bright sunny day.

I still can't get past LE detaining his SUV upon his return to Raleigh and then getting a warrant to sieze it after inspection - hinky meters were ringing IMO. There is no logical reason to detain his vehicle if he admitted to LE where he was - plenty of reason for LE to go hinky if he refused to tell them anything. JMO.

pack_fan
01-18-2007, 02:13 AM
Hi Pack Fan,

Did you ever hit that nail on the head when you said "I do beleive that all of us (the personalities) will be in counseling when this is said and done with."

I just found myself in that predicament, imagining what I would have to do to kill someone so viciously and leave my baby girl alone with the dead body.
Totally bizarre. I can't believe I even said that.

But tonight I started thinking about Cassidy. That simple and astute little protector of her mommy who loved her daddy too. It just overwhelmed me so and made me realize she is the passion for me in this case. It is what keeps my brain trying to solve the case.

When I think about it I had just watched 2 hours of American Idol in Seattle, and believe me, if anything could turn a woman nutso, that could do it! :rolleyes:
I can't imagine what kind of person could commit a crime like this in the first place, much less with Cassidy in the house. If JY did this and knew that she would wake up to her dead mother or even worse wake up during the act, I'm all for bringing back hangings.

Sort of off topic but not really. Another case this week near Raleigh where a little girl was beheaded by her father with a knife. He was returned today and his pastor made a statement saying that this just wasn't his personality. I guess you never know do you?

pack_fan
01-18-2007, 02:19 AM
Pack fan,

Multiple personalities - bless your heart !

I agree with most of what you have said, it all makes sense. IMO there may have been a meeting - but I am not convinced he attended it if it existed. Yes he would want someone to see him if he indeed had on a bright smiling face - but what if he didn't have a bright smiley face - would he still want someone to see him ? He would have to be aware that whoever he met with might also be able to say he looked like cold cr@p as easily as they could say he looked bright and smiley. I think if he looked bad from being awake all nite, or he had a shiner, or scratches he would rather not be seen to avoid anyone saying so. JMO

LE was looking for something on his person that might reveal a struggle when they requested the non testimonial order - I'm not big on reading much into the sunglasses at the funeral service - but there is the possiblity that there was a reason for them beyond just the fact it was a bright sunny day.

I still can't get past LE detaining his SUV upon his return to Raleigh and then getting a warrant to sieze it after inspection - hinky meters were ringing IMO. There is no logical reason to detain his vehicle if he admitted to LE where he was - plenty of reason for LE to go hinky if he refused to tell them anything. JMO.
You make good points as well. I would suspect that he wouldn't have wanted to be seen if he was not up to snuff so to speak. I can't make up my mind on this one, could go either way for me. I would think in a perfect scenario that there would be a meeting and he would have shown up but there are endless possibilities on this one (and I guess all the rest as well). Only JY knows the truth.

Taximom
01-18-2007, 02:27 AM
Did he wear his sunglasses to this meeting if it occurred? :p

I still think the total silence from MY's family says it all. I think Linda and Meredith Fisher would be calling publically for LE to arrest a killer at this point, but they aren't. That's because they know LE will arrest the killer and they all know who he is.

It must be driving the Fishers crazy that Cassidy is with JY. I hope they have an attorney working on custody papers ready to serve when the killer is arrested.

All my opinion, as usual.

raisincharlie
01-18-2007, 02:30 AM
You make good points as well. I would suspect that he wouldn't have wanted to be seen if he was not up to snuff so to speak. I can't make up my mind on this one, could go either way for me. I would think in a perfect scenario that there would be a meeting and he would have shown up but there are endless possibilities on this one (and I guess all the rest as well). Only JY knows the truth.
FWIW - most of the time when I have these imaginings - I'm wrong.:)

pack_fan
01-18-2007, 02:37 AM
FWIW - most of the time when I have these imaginings - I'm wrong.:)
With as little info as we have to work with, we could be so far off course that we may never make it back.

raisincharlie
01-18-2007, 02:48 AM
With as little info as we have to work with, we could be so far off course that we may never make it back.
Sometimes what is not said is equally as important as what is uttered. So far I have heard nothing saying JY has been cleared of any wrong doing in connection with this case. By now, if JY had an air tight alibi that checked out - that statement should have been forthcoming from LE in light of the media making it rather obvious by the public release of warrants aimed specifically at him.

pack_fan
01-18-2007, 02:59 AM
Sometimes what is not said is equally as important as what is uttered. So far I have heard nothing saying JY has been cleared of any wrong doing in connection with this case. By now, if JY had an air tight alibi that checked out - that statement should have been forthcoming from LE in light of the media making it rather obvious by the public release of warrants aimed specifically at him.
Yeah, I was talking out of my rear end. All the warrants have been just like this...


:laugh: JY.


Charlie, may have seen this already but I posted a little nasty gram for you in the people thread. All in good fun. I'll check in tomorrow and hope for some good news.

SO What
01-18-2007, 07:29 AM
I just had to come out of lurkdome.

The thing that is missing in this case is the media interest. SP couldn't leave his house unless the media was all over him. We new where he was, who he was with, what he was doing down to the minute detail.

What can we do to get the media interested in this case like they were interested in the SP case.

raisincharlie
01-18-2007, 10:45 AM
I just had to come out of lurkdome.

The thing that is missing in this case is the media interest. SP couldn't leave his house unless the media was all over him. We new where he was, who he was with, what he was doing down to the minute detail.

What can we do to get the media interested in this case like they were interested in the SP case.
SO What,

You have hit on an issue we have wondered about - the media. I don't know the answers but can speculate. I would say the first thing that stands out is Jason Young is not out there lapping up the media attention as did SP, he loved it. I also don't think he ever thought he would get caught so for him it was much as his phone calls - very imaginative.

I think there is a huge difference in the mindset of the media from the east coast versus the west coast, well lets be blunt - California, overall. Then throw in the Duke fiasco which is only a county away from Raleigh and I can see reasons why the media is being rather precise in this case. In this case I also think that the LE department investigating has made a firm commitment to solving the case correctly and as it should be. Just because sleuths find this case intriging does not mean the local residents do, just a few thoughts.

SO What
01-18-2007, 11:04 AM
RC, I agree with your take on it. I just find it hard to believe that there haven't been any sightings of JY (that I heard of) out to dinner, at a bar, shopping, etc, etc.

I haven't read every single thread on this subject so maybe I missed something.

L L & S
01-18-2007, 11:10 AM
Scott Peterson did get a lot of camera time and a lot of people writing about him online.

I only wish Janet Christiansen Abaroa's case would get a little spot light time. People Mag.... anywhere. She was such a beautiful person. I have gotten to know more about her from her family. I wish NiFong would pack up his desk and move away and let someone with some ethics step into that office.

I'm happy that Michelle is getting the press she deserves. I feel her case will go to court way before Janet's ever will. I say a little pray for Cassidy every night.

Thanks for letting me vent on your thread! http://bestsmileys.com/flowers/1.gif

raisincharlie
01-18-2007, 11:14 AM
RC, I agree with your take on it. I just find it hard to believe that there haven't been any sightings of JY (that I heard of) out to dinner, at a bar, shopping, etc, etc.

I haven't read every single thread on this subject so maybe I missed something.
So What - you haven't missed it - it just hasn't happened. JY is reported to be down in Brevard but is keeping a very low profile. As I recall the media did follow him around when he came in to respond to the non testimonial order and once they reported he was at the cemetery. Other than that - he is in deep seclusion. Honestly I don't blame him - and I am sure his lawyer has expressed to him the importance of maintaining complete silence on several fronts, not just with LE. JMO

close_enough
01-18-2007, 12:02 PM
Since it has been confirmed over and over in warrant after warrant and now in the People Mag LE says they offered JY their condolences and asked him for assistance and he refused from that moment forward - does anyone believe JY truly had a scheduled meeting that he actually attended in Virginia on 3 November?

i'm still thinking he did....at least for the time being...i think he at least stopped & discussed 'business' with someone in VA...

close_enough
01-18-2007, 12:05 PM
Yes and no and don't really know. My multiple personalities keep arguing with one another. I do beleive that all of us (the personalities) will be in counseling when this is said and done with.

If money was the motive for the murder, this had been planned for at least three months (considering the insurance change/addition). If he was going to use the business trip as a motive, he would be quite foolish to tell friends at the funeral that he was gone to a business meeting if indeed there was not one in the first place. I would think that he would want someone to see his smiling face the next day in order to establish his whereabouts and make LE prove that he had the opportunity to commit the crime. I would also think that it would have been an early morning meeting to narrow down the time line.
His statements could have been taken the wrong way by RF and misrepresented in the media. It is possible that he was in the area cold calling on customers or checking on things for current customers. This would seem less likely to me if he had planned the murder so far in advance. I still think he would want to create a timeline for himself if indeed he is the perp. It would be interesting to find out how Chart one handles travel with salesmen. Most companies arrange travel for scheduled meetings, others do so by expense reports and the salesmen handle their own arrangements.

I guess I would lean towards yes to the business meeting. It would narrow the window of opportunity if he checked in late or made a late night phone call then had an early business meeting rather than no scheduled agenda.

jmo, imo, moo, xyz, abc, xxx, ooo, and zzz......

i agree with the above..especially in bold letters....i think the 'meeting' was part of the plan/alibi/timeline....he needed to be seen doing some kind of business early morning on November 3rd....

close_enough
01-18-2007, 12:11 PM
I too am hoping they've got something after all the days spent in the house collecting evidence! :cool:

i hope so too...i'm with you & Taximom....they spent a LOT of time in the home collecting evidence....the Sheriff even mentioned in one article that they collected "tons" of evidence.....i know that doesn't mean that any of it points to JY, but they combed over that house really well, is what i gather....

probably should find a link for that comment the Sheriff made, but it's in one of the articles on the "media links" thread....

raisincharlie
01-18-2007, 12:14 PM
i'm still thinking he did....at least for the time being...i think he at least stopped & discussed 'business' with someone in VA...
Morning Close,

I agree - he could have stopped and discussed something business related with someone - but that doesn't mean he had an early morning "scheduled" meeting. He could have gone by Duffield area just to pick up a bid package - that would be business related but not necessarily requiring a scheduled time to do so.

Don't you wonder why the location of this meeting has never come out? Even blabbering Fussell couldn't spit out a location other than VA... intriguing no one will say where - or no one knows where. JMO.

jilly
01-18-2007, 12:38 PM
Keep at it RC - you're convincing me! I also agree with PacFan that he would want to be seen on the morning of the 3rd. He's conveniently left his hotel receipt & others in his vehicle for his alibi so he needs to be seen at this suspicious "meeting".

Maybe that was the intention but like you say - since we know there was a struggle at the murder scene, he couldn't be seen because of some sort of injury.

I wonder what's entailed with picking up a bidding package if he did that. Surely, there would be some formality to that?

Samiya
01-18-2007, 12:39 PM
I can only think that if he was at a meeting, it wasn't a sales meeting with a 'client'. Chartone already has sales personnel in Virginia, so what reason is there for a North Carolina employee (let alone a possible probationary employee) to travel to VA to sell to a client residing there when it's cheaper for them businesswise to send a VA Sales person? If you look at the job vacancies at Chartone, it seems that employees have a sales area. Any out of town or overnight stayers would probably be for training purposes or personnel meetings or conferences.

Due to Jason's lack of cooperation with LE, I don't think he would've told them where he stayed during the phone call. They found that out during the search of his SUV, same as where he stopped for gas fills. So by that time, the cleaner would've already cleaned the hotel room he had apparently stayed in, sheets would've been washed etc. They could still go over the room with a vacuum sweeper as I would hazard a guess and say that if the room was in a clean state, the cleaner would've given it a quick go over, but hopefully not a thorough clean.

LE would questioned the cleaner as to whether or not the bed appeared to be slept in. Depending on how observant the cleaner is she/he may have noticed that the bed may have been crumpled but without tell tale signs of having actually been slept in.....ie sheets etc 'with signs of heat creasing from a body laying in it for a period of time' as opposed to just messed up to look like it was slept in.

Sami

MOO..

(I'm starting to sound like a cow, lmao)

close_enough
01-18-2007, 12:41 PM
Morning Close,

I agree - he could have stopped and discussed something business related with someone - but that doesn't mean he had an early morning "scheduled" meeting. He could have gone by Duffield area just to pick up a bid package - that would be business related but not necessarily requiring a scheduled time to do so.

Don't you wonder why the location of this meeting has never come out? Even blabbering Fussell couldn't spit out a location other than VA... intriguing no one will say where - or no one knows where. JMO.

yes, i do wonder about that, but i also wonder why LE hasn't released the autopsy, or the ME's time of death....LE's just not saying anything about anything, & that's what drives me crazy ...... & the word "scheduled" could mean that's how JY would describe it....he had scheduled a meeting with someone, somewhere in VA... i really think JY wouldn't have told Fussell this bit of info, if he hadn't met up with someone relating to business in VA, the morning of Nov 3rd.....there's someone 'out there' that knows about this 'business meeting'....someone 'out there' that talked business with JY the morning of the 3rd, imo......i believe LE has talked with this person, but they just can't pin down the complete timeline.....ugh, i want to know if there really was an 11 pm phone call!!!!!!!!....i think LE already knows if there was one....they've had plenty of time to find out through phone records...that's another thing that LE isn't talking about either, ugh.......

Samiya
01-18-2007, 12:45 PM
I think we'd have more of a chance seeing a Yeti before seeing JY out and about at the moment.

raisincharlie
01-18-2007, 12:55 PM
Keep at it RC - you're convincing me! I also agree with PacFan that he would want to be seen on the morning of the 3rd. He's conveniently left his hotel receipt & others in his vehicle for his alibi so he needs to be seen at this suspicious "meeting".

Maybe that was the intention but like you say - since we know there was a struggle at the murder scene, he couldn't be seen because of some sort of injury.

I wonder what's entailed with picking up a bidding package if he did that. Surely, there would be some formality to that?
Jilly,

I'm really not trying to convince anyone as much as I'm trying to get other thoughts to convince myself. I often tend to over-analyze things. For me this "scheduled" meeting has never added up, even from the git go. I'm inviting the conversations incase I have missed something - which happens frequently! :crazy:

Pack_fan gave me a good run and made me think outside "my box" - that's a good thing ! That one little tidbit from Richard Johnson in the people mag article sent me over the edge with this thought - I just do not believe there was a firm, established, business (ChartOne related) meeting anywhere in Virginia. JMO of course - I keep studying Johnsons words...

close_enough
01-18-2007, 01:00 PM
With as little info as we have to work with, we could be so far off course that we may never make it back.

true....

jilly
01-18-2007, 01:02 PM
I think we'd have more of a chance seeing a Yeti before seeing JY out and about at the moment.

Oh Sami - :laugh: Now that made me LOL!

close_enough
01-18-2007, 01:06 PM
Sometimes what is not said is equally as important as what is uttered. So far I have heard nothing saying JY has been cleared of any wrong doing in connection with this case. By now, if JY had an air tight alibi that checked out - that statement should have been forthcoming from LE in light of the media making it rather obvious by the public release of warrants aimed specifically at him.

i don't think JY had a "air tight" alibi in the eyes of LE....i think LE just can't pin him down in the hours betw midnight & 6 am, on the 3rd...(most folks are asleep, but i think JY was driving, most of that time, with his cell turned off)...unless someone actually saw him out & about in the wee hours of the morning of the 3rd, LE is going to have to rely on other evidence somehow (if there's any).....they need to show that he was IN the home sometime betw those hours, & i think they're having trouble w/that, & that's why they haven't come out & said he had an air tight alibi...they're still working around other things/evidence...i just find it hard to believe that the forensic evidence STILL hasn't come back from a lab with results...it's been what..over 8 weeks now for some of it?

close_enough
01-18-2007, 01:09 PM
Jilly,

I'm really not trying to convince anyone as much as I'm trying to get other thoughts to convince myself. I often tend to over-analyze things. For me this "scheduled" meeting has never added up, even from the git go. I'm inviting the conversations incase I have missed something - which happens frequently! :crazy:

Pack_fan gave me a good run and made me think outside "my box" - that's a good thing ! That one little tidbit from Richard Johnson in the people mag article sent me over the edge with this thought - I just do not believe there was a firm, established, business (ChartOne related) meeting anywhere in Virginia. JMO of course - I keep studying Johnsons words...

ok, i read the article, but i'm not remembering what the tidbit from Richard Johnson was...i already mailed my copy to Sami, so i can't go back & look at it....what was the tidbit?...if it's here in the thread, i'm missing it somehow..

raisincharlie
01-18-2007, 01:13 PM
I can only think that if he was at a meeting, it wasn't a sales meeting with a 'client'. Chartone already has sales personnel in Virginia, so what reason is there for a North Carolina employee (let alone a possible probationary employee) to travel to VA to sell to a client residing there when it's cheaper for them businesswise to send a VA Sales person? If you look at the job vacancies at Chartone, it seems that employees have a sales area. Any out of town or overnight stayers would probably be for training purposes or personnel meetings or conferences.

Due to Jason's lack of cooperation with LE, I don't think he would've told them where he stayed during the phone call. They found that out during the search of his SUV, same as where he stopped for gas fills. So by that time, the cleaner would've already cleaned the hotel room he had apparently stayed in, sheets would've been washed etc. They could still go over the room with a vacuum sweeper as I would hazard a guess and say that if the room was in a clean state, the cleaner would've given it a quick go over, but hopefully not a thorough clean.

LE would questioned the cleaner as to whether or not the bed appeared to be slept in. Depending on how observant the cleaner is she/he may have noticed that the bed may have been crumpled but without tell tale signs of having actually been slept in.....ie sheets etc 'with signs of heat creasing from a body laying in it for a period of time' as opposed to just messed up to look like it was slept in.

Sami

MOO..

(I'm starting to sound like a cow, lmao)
Thanks Sami - I agree. I can't find or even invent an explanation why a probationary type employee would be covering VA when ChartOne has a rep setting in Blacksburg VA, as well as other locations in VA.

I also agree JY told LE nothing from the begining - buying time IMO. I can also accept that JY telling nothing to LE means LE has to figure it out - if no meeting can be found through all the phone data, receipts, or computer data LE will be hard pressed to say he was not at a meeting - no DA is going to like that - too much of a potential for surprise at trial It is an aspect which must be resolved either way for the state. As much as JY needs an alibi - he is still somewhat covered if no one can locate him exactly - LE cannot definitively say there was or was not a meeting if it is never discovered - this alibi aspect works both ways IMO.

raisincharlie
01-18-2007, 01:16 PM
ok, i read the article, but i'm not remembering what the tidbit from Richard Johnson was...i already mailed my copy to Sami, so i can't go back & look at it....what was the tidbit?...if it's here in the thread, i'm missing it somehow..http://celebrity.aol.com/people/ataol/articles/0,,20007855,00.html

" What happened next surprised them. "Italked to [Jason], offered him condolences and said, 'I'm sorry for the timing, but we need your assistance in this case,' " says Wake County Sheriff Chief of Operations Richard Johnson. "And he has refused to comply."

If this quote did not come from LE direct - it would not have caught my attention. This does imply JY offered nothing in the phone call, nothing when he arrived in Raleigh - nothing at all.

jilly
01-18-2007, 01:35 PM
Well.....hopefully the lab reports will speak on JY's behalf.

eta - and hopefully some delivery person did see his vehicle at the house in the early hours of the morning like someone posted at CTV.

and hopefully someone did see him in his travels throughout that nite. You never know. I think in the Peterson case, there were sightings of SP. Maybe some alert trucker saw him. If the police don't have anything, I'm surprised that they wouldn't be making a plea of some sort for people to come forward.

close_enough
01-18-2007, 01:39 PM
http://celebrity.aol.com/people/ataol/articles/0,,20007855,00.html

" What happened next surprised them. "Italked to [Jason], offered him condolences and said, 'I'm sorry for the timing, but we need your assistance in this case,' " says Wake County Sheriff Chief of Operations Richard Johnson. "And he has refused to comply."

If this quote did not come from LE direct - it would not have caught my attention. This does imply JY offered nothing in the phone call, nothing when he arrived in Raleigh - nothing at all.

i agree...we've pretty much thought that all along...no wonder it's being repeated over & over & over that LE would sure like to talk to JY....LE is having to figure everything out without JY's help....they have to figure out who all (if anyone) had keys to the house.....if anything was missing from the house, etc......JY is a worm, imo :mad:

packerdog
01-18-2007, 01:41 PM
http://celebrity.aol.com/people/ataol/articles/0,,20007855,00.html

" What happened next surprised them. "Italked to [Jason], offered him condolences and said, 'I'm sorry for the timing, but we need your assistance in this case,' " says Wake County Sheriff Chief of Operations Richard Johnson. "And he has refused to comply."

If this quote did not come from LE direct - it would not have caught my attention. This does imply JY offered nothing in the phone call, nothing when he arrived in Raleigh - nothing at all.

It sure speaks volumes. He doesn't say if he sounded upset or anything. Jason has to know that he looks guilty as sin.

jilly
01-18-2007, 01:42 PM
i agree...we've pretty much thought that all along...no wonder it's being repeated over & over & over that LE would sure like to talk to JY....LE is having to figure everything out without JY's help....they have to figure out who all (if anyone) had keys to the house.....if anything was missing from the house, etc......JY is a worm, imo :mad:

He is sooooo guilty in my mind. And if he did pack enough clothes that nite because he knew he wouldn't be getting into the house for awhile as another poster suggested he's really put some thought into this.

Like I said before - come onnnnnn lab reports!!

Samiya
01-18-2007, 01:45 PM
ok, i read the article, but i'm not remembering what the tidbit from Richard Johnson was...i already mailed my copy to Sami, so i can't go back & look at it....what was the tidbit?...if it's here in the thread, i'm missing it somehow..You sent me your copy? I thought you sent me a spare one :doh:

Anyway, thanks *big hugs* :) and I sent you docs in word format so you can keep them on your computer.

Love
Sami

close_enough
01-18-2007, 01:45 PM
He is sooooo guilty in my mind. And if he did pack enough clothes that nite because he knew he wouldn't be getting into the house for awhile as another poster suggested he's really put some thought into this.

Like I said before - come onnnnnn lab reports!!

i know jilly....LE is keeping EVERYTHING very close to the vest....i've never seen anything like it before :confused:

close_enough
01-18-2007, 01:46 PM
You sent me your copy? I thought you sent me a spare one :doh:

Anyway, thanks *big hugs* :) and I sent you docs in word format so you can keep them on your computer.

Love
Sami

oh, it's no big deal Sami....i read it, then mailed it right on out...i could have bought another copy, but didn't ..... heck, that link you posted for the article is perfect though, on the "People Mag" thread....thanks!

raisincharlie
01-18-2007, 01:49 PM
i agree...we've pretty much thought that all along...no wonder it's being repeated over & over & over that LE would sure like to talk to JY....LE is having to figure everything out without JY's help....they have to figure out who all (if anyone) had keys to the house.....if anything was missing from the house, etc......JY is a worm, imo :mad:
We have thought all along JY was not cooperating but know we pretty much know this non cooperation started the very second LE contacted him to offer condolences...yes JY is allowed to have a lawyer but I will say again- he who has nothing to hide, hides nothing. JMO

Samiya
01-18-2007, 01:53 PM
oh, it's no big deal Sami....i read it, then mailed it right on out...i could have bought another copy, but didn't ..... heck, that link you posted for the article is perfect though, on the "People Mag" thread....thanks!Ahem....*steps up on little soapbox*

it is a big deal to me :) For someone to do something like that for little ole me over here in Oztraylia is a really cool and very nice someone.

*steps off soapbox and giggles*

Lmao.....If we all had known that AOL were going to have the entire article online, People mag would've got alot less money hahahahaha!

And just so I get to sound like a cow again.......

"Mooooooo" lol

Sami

close_enough
01-18-2007, 02:00 PM
Ahem....*steps up on little soapbox*

it is a big deal to me :) For someone to do something like that for little ole me over here in Oztraylia is a really cool and very nice someone.

*steps off soapbox and giggles*

Lmao.....If we all had known that AOL were going to have the entire article online, People mag would've got alot less money hahahahaha!

And just so I get to sound like a cow again.......

"Mooooooo" lol

Sami

i know.....had i known AOL was going to do that, i wouldn't have purchased the mag either, lol....oh well :crazy:

got things to do around here today, & a couple of errands to run....laterrrrrrrr!

jilly
01-18-2007, 02:16 PM
i know.....had i known AOL was going to do that, i wouldn't have purchased the mag either, lol....oh well :crazy:

me neither! You should see the mess I made of scanning and sending the article to Annie due to my incompetence! :blushing: :bang: We probably haven't heard from her today because she's bogged down trying to sort it all out!! :p

Samiya
01-18-2007, 02:20 PM
I'm off to beddie byes for now....it's almost 04:30 here, lol.

lmao@Jilly :)

Love
Sami

scandi
01-18-2007, 02:24 PM
And I'm off to work for the day ;{ but will check in mid afternoon. I'd rather just be here. LOLOLOLOLOLOL

raisincharlie
01-18-2007, 11:56 PM
i don't think JY had a "air tight" alibi in the eyes of LE....i think LE just can't pin him down in the hours betw midnight & 6 am, on the 3rd...(most folks are asleep, but i think JY was driving, most of that time, with his cell turned off)...unless someone actually saw him out & about in the wee hours of the morning of the 3rd, LE is going to have to rely on other evidence somehow (if there's any).....they need to show that he was IN the home sometime betw those hours, & i think they're having trouble w/that, & that's why they haven't come out & said he had an air tight alibi...they're still working around other things/evidence...i just find it hard to believe that the forensic evidence STILL hasn't come back from a lab with results...it's been what..over 8 weeks now for some of it?
Close,

Do you recall any links to the discussion Sheriff Harrison had about the labs being backed up. There is nothing I can find in the links thread above. As I recall it was NBC 17 that did that piece but I cannot pull up that article or video - you know of anything else ?

scandi
01-19-2007, 12:00 AM
What I remember about that Charlie is it was said to mentally prepare us for a two month wait, which would have put us close to Feb 1st by my mental calculations.

raisincharlie
01-19-2007, 12:04 AM
What I remember about that Charlie is it was said to mentally prepare us for a two month wait, which would have put us close to Feb 1st by my mental calculations.
You scare me Scandi - you read my mind! :D (Please be nice and don't say it's easy - even if it is the truth !)

Gave me exactly the information I was wanting to know, an approximate date. Thinking about it - Feb 1 isn't that far away now. Thanks Scandi!

scandi
01-19-2007, 12:33 AM
De Nada, Dah'ling. :D Charlie, here is the link for that article from Dec 5th. I can't get anything from it no matter what I search:

http://www.nbc17.com/midatlantic/ncn/search.apx.-content-articles-NCN-2006-12-04-0005.html


At least it is a time reference. I got this from the links thread at CTV and it qualifies it as 'Crime lab backed up'.