PDA

View Full Version : More about Patsy's Rings



WolfmarsGirl
02-01-2004, 11:02 PM
It seems like the BPD was interested in Patsy's rings too. I think we may have hit the nail on the head. Notice how Trujillo, in a round-about way, comes back to the jewelry issue twice in this clip from Patsy's April, 1997 interview:


TT: So you go upstairs, jump into pajamas go into bed. Did you have to take off your makeup, take off your jewelry. Whatís that whole sequence?
PR: (Laughs)
TT: I donít wear a lot of makeup, so itís hard for me to know how often you have to do that.
PR: Oh, I probably washed my face, brushed my teeth.
TT: Okay. Whatís your normal get ready for bed routine I guess is what Iím asking?
PR: Um, take my makeup off. Brush my teeth.
TT: Okay. Take all your jewelry off then.
PR: No, I donít take them off.
TT: Okay.
PR: Sometime, I mean, it depends on what I have on, sometimes I take it off, sometimes I donít, but . . .

What's more, this Q&A session answers whether or not Patsy removes her rings. According to Patsy, she normally does not.

Now, all we have to do is find someone who knows which rings she had on Christmas night. Where are the photos of the White's party? I can't believe no one has leaked them yet...Oh, well.

Also, notice how PR answers..."I don't take them off..." When you are talking about jewelry, you answer, "I don't take it off." You don't say, "I don't take 'them' off," unless you are talking and/or thinking about a specific item of jewelry, of which there are two or more.

For instance, if someone asked me if I took my earrings off, I would say, "No, I didn't take them off."

Or, if someone said, did you take your jewelry off, and I was thinking, "Yeah, well the only jewelry I had on was my earrings...," I might incorrectly answer, "No, I didn't take them off..."

But, the appropriate answer would be "No, I didn't take it off" to the question posed by Trujillo. He didn't ask PR about a specific few pieces of jewelry, but that is how she responded...as though he said, "Did you take your earrings (or rings) off?"

Must have been on her mind, ya think?



(emphasis mine for demonstration purposes)

Cherokee
02-02-2004, 10:41 AM
It seems like the BPD was interested in Patsy's rings too. I think we may have hit the nail on the head. Notice how Trujillo, in a round-about way, comes back to the jewelry issue twice in this clip from Patsy's April, 1997 interview:

Excellent find and excellent post, WolfmarsGirl!




IMO

Jayelles
02-02-2004, 11:35 AM
What was it Toth said about women sleeping with jewellery on?

WolfmarsGirl
02-02-2004, 03:59 PM
What was it Toth said about women sleeping with jewellery on?

Yes, I think we were arguing with Toth about women taking off their jewelery or not. He insisted we did. Most of us agreed that we don't normally remove it.

I think that was on the thread you started about the rings. That thread got kind of burried, so I started this one. I will go look at your thread to find Toth's quote...Be back :)

WolfmarsGirl
02-02-2004, 04:17 PM
Here is what Toth said:


Originally Posted by Toth:

"Essential to the 'ring theory' is that at the time of this supposed bedwetting incident Patsy would have had to have been wearing her rings in the middle of the night.

Not totally impossible, though highly unlikely."

Uh huh...
:rolleyes:

Britt
02-02-2004, 04:29 PM
WolfmarsGirl... I still think your ring theory is right on the money. BTW, those rings didn't happen to get burgled during the Atlanta gentleman burglar incident, did they?

Ivy
02-02-2004, 04:38 PM
Britt, you mean the incident when the gentleman dapper tied John in the crapper? lol

I have always suspected that the mysterious Atlanta intruder conveniently made off with some evidence pertinent to the JonBenet case. Does Patsy still have the rings she wore in 1996? Are they visible in any photos of her taken after the Atlanta incident? If not, my guess would be that the burglar stole them...er, yeah, that's the ticket...the burglar stole them, uh huh, yup.

Imon128
02-02-2004, 05:30 PM
LOL, Ivy. The perps in the R's lives seem to have been the 'kinder, gentler" kind. I can just see John stomping up and down in the bathroom while he was 'locked' in there. Bravery is not his middle name....nope. ;)

Toltec
02-02-2004, 10:07 PM
Patsy most likely would not have removed her wedding ring...but then she is right-handed. Was she wearing a ring on her right finger the morning of the 26th? If she grabbed JonBenet by the shirt collar then she most likely would have used her right hand.

We can go through pictures of Patsy and look for a ring on her right hand...everyone can help out.

Britt
02-02-2004, 11:00 PM
We can go through pictures of Patsy and look for a ring on her right hand...everyone can help out.
Already did, Toltec. See post #7 on the Patsy's Rings thread on page 2. :) The photo was in the National Enquirer, December 3, 2002, issue, page 49.

WolfmarsGirl
02-02-2004, 11:18 PM
WolfmarsGirl... I still think your ring theory is right on the money. BTW, those rings didn't happen to get burgled during the Atlanta gentleman burglar incident, did they?


Thanks, Britt.

Yes, I think they had "K-Mart" jewelry stolen, or something along those lines, if I remember correctly.

It might just be a coincidence, but who knows?

Surely, someone out there has answered questions about Patsy's rings on the night of the 25th...

BlueCrab
02-02-2004, 11:57 PM
WolfmarsGirl,

Help! I need a refresher course about the rings. As I remember, you suggest the "stun gun" marks on JonBenet could actually be little twin contusions from Patsy's rings on her fingers. Did you mean the ring marks got there before JonBenet died, or during the killing, or after death, (such as when she first discovered the body)?

There were twin "stun gun" marks at three locations on JonBenet's body -- the right side of the face; the left side of the back; and the back of the left leg near the ankle. Would Patsy's rings have made the marks at all three locations?


JMO

WolfmarsGirl
02-03-2004, 01:16 AM
WolfmarsGirl,

Help! I need a refresher course about the rings. As I remember, you suggest the "stun gun" marks on JonBenet could actually be little twin contusions from Patsy's rings on her fingers. Did you mean the ring marks got there before JonBenet died, or during the killing, or after death, (such as when she first discovered the body)?

There were twin "stun gun" marks at three locations on JonBenet's body -- the right side of the face; the left side of the back; and the back of the left leg near the ankle. Would Patsy's rings have made the marks at all three locations?


JMO

Here, BC. I will quote myself from a thread from last year below. I have added additional information after the post:

...
I have a theory about the "stun gun" marks. First of
all, does anyone know if Patsy wore any rings on a
regular basis, or if she had any on at the White's
party? I'll get back to that thought in a moment.

Anyway, as peculiar as this sounds, I had a dream last
night about JB. Ok, so I am doped up on cold medicine,
so give me a little bit of room here, lol.

Basically, in the dream, I was holding JB, in a way I
often hold my own little girl. It was just a flash of
a second in my dream, but the whole thing even made
sense in the morning.

So, I tried the 'dream hold' on my daughter today.
Yes, she thinks I am nutty, lol, but I figured that a
good hug between us is welcomed at any time, no matter
what my motive.

I sat on the floor with my child in my lap, with her
legs both hanging over my left leg. She was kind of
sitting up, laying her weight on her left hip, facing
me. I held her head in my right hand and the fingers
on my right hand ended up on her right cheek and/or or
on her neck. So, I gave her a kiss on the nose, lol...

My left arm was over her right side and my left hand
ended up, quite naturally, on the lower, left side of
her back.

This is typically how I hold her when I 'rock' my
great-big baby girl, or when I carry her quickly in a
rain-storm (when walking would be too slow), or any
other time I have to move her in a hurry and I want to
get a good grip on her and hold her close at the same
time.

Try it with your own child. Make sure his or her face
is close to your face (and don't forget the kiss on
the nose.) This hug kind of looks like holding a
guitar.

Now, back to Patsy's rings (or not). Now, if PR
accidentally killed (or thought she killed) JB, there
would have been a lot of squeezing and rocking with
mother and child in this exact position. If PR was
wearing two or more rings on each hand AND she held,
and squeezed JB in this manner, (a little too hard out
of grief and overwhelming anguish) would those rings
leave marks similar to the "stun gun" marks? I think
so.

The positioning of where a grown-up's fingers would
land on a child of JB's size match up perfectly to
where the marks were found on her body. AND, the
distance between the marks (within each set of marks)
is just about the distance between two adult fingers.

Of course, the rings would most likely have been on
backwards. That is the only problem I have with this
theory. However, as I am typing, two of my rings are
reversed and they swing around constantly.

I even thought about trying this trick with four
smiley-faced-stamper rings. But, since I don't want my
poor little girl to be too severely emotionally
scarred by my obsessive sleuthing, lol, I didn't
conduct this further experiment.
+++++

I did conduct an additional 'experiment.' I am
posting a link to marks I made on the smooth part of
my right hand. I squeezed my right hand with my left
hand. I had two, round-cut rings on my left hand.
Both rings are mounted with four-prongs.

Please see the link below:

http://www.geocities.com/wolfchick942003/photopage.html

With very little effort, I was able to reproduce the
exact markings I see on the autopsy photos of Jonbenet
Ramsey.

In addition, the marks fell approximately 3.5
centimeters apart.

As I outlined in my original post, the angle of the marks
on Jonbenet (from the autopsy photos) line up in an
identical pattern and angle to where an adult's
fingers would rest if that adult was holding a child
as I described. It is crucial to note that this is a
very common position for a parent (typically a mom) to
hold and/or rock their small child.

The positions are the same. The markings made by me
are nearly identical to the marks on Jonbenet's body.

Once again:
*The positions of the marks can be explained, within a
fraction of an inch.
*The distance between two marks of either pair of
marks can be explained.
*The angle of the marks (extremely important!) can be
explained.
*The 'weapon' or cause of the marks can be explained.
* If Patsy's rings made the marks, then evidence, or
at least witnesses can testify to their existence.
*Both the occurence of the marks and the location of
the marks can be easily re-created in any court room.
* This theory explains why 'stun gun' marks are NOT
equidistant (as they would be expected to be) on the
body of Jonbenet....


There is also another set of marks on JBR's calf, I believe. I will be back on that...wolfkid needs to be tucked in.

:rolleyes:

WolfmarsGirl
02-03-2004, 01:44 AM
BC, I think, the marks on JBR's lower leg could have been made when Patsy grabbed the child when she initially realized what she had done. Maybe, she pulled her close to her by grabbing her leg.

Maybe, JBR was falling (down the stairs, perhaps?) and Patsy grabbed at her to prevent the fall, only managed to grab her leg and the child bashed her head anyway...

I have not given too much thought the the marks on the leg because I have never seen a photo of them. Perhaps they were completely different from the other abrasions.

I think all of these injuries occured while JBR was near death. I don't think she was dead yet. But, she was certainly very close.

Either your BDI scenario or my PDI scenario could fit here. Patsy did not have to be the perp to rock and hold her child the way I described.

Regarding the leg marks specifically, if Patsy found JBR knocked out and strangled, I think she would have grabbed her in this same fashion. Maybe, she just saw the child's leg sticking out under something and panicked and squeezed too hard while she pulled.

BlueCrab
02-03-2004, 09:03 AM
Wolfee,

The photo on the left is your hand; but is the photo on the right you or a JonBenet autopsy photo? It appears to be JonBenet but just wanna make sure.

JMO

WolfmarsGirl
02-03-2004, 07:00 PM
Wolfee,

The photo on the left is your hand; but is the photo on the right you or a JonBenet autopsy photo? It appears to be JonBenet but just wanna make sure.

JMO

Actually, BC, it is just another angle of my hand...See. That's what I am saying; the marks I made do, in fact, resemble the marks on JBR.

Imon128
02-03-2004, 07:11 PM
It's possible that Patsy (or John, if he had jewelry/buttons/etc. on, that he/she held JB close and long after finding her dead...no matter WHO killed JB. I do think that would indicate a family involvement.

I also entertain the thought that JB was laid on her bed, in her room after the intial shock or holding or whatever, to allow the household to perpetuate that JB was only sleeping, for whomever would WASN'T involved to allow the coverup time.