Michelle Young. Murdered Pregnant Mom, NC Part 11

[Samiya]

I thought I'd start a newy and post this while I'm here so it doesn't get lost, lol.

Greta Transcript of show 22 Jan 2007

GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, HOST: And now in North Carolina, a grizzly and brutal murder — Michelle Young, the pregnant mother bludgeoned in her home two months ago. Well, there's news tonight. You remember the gruesome case? Michelle Young's daughter had tracked her mother's blood throughout the house.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,245919,00.html

Sami

[Samiya]

Just finished reading the above link and am seriously left with a feeling of WT????

Insert screwed up face.

Sami

[jilly]

It sure makes me :mad: when Dr Baden says a "clump of hair" when it is clearly one hair.

I didn't realize that the first payment on the insurance policy was a month before the car accident!

I truly believe that this murderer has slipped up somewhere at the crime scene.

[scandi]

Thanks Sami,

They hadn't reported on this case for so long the basics were forgotten, like the fact that Michelle was pregnant {:eek: No A for Greta today!}.

And even tho Baden had to hunt and peck to remember a very odd word - gnurl, I think, which means inverted stridations and not proturbing ones lol, I forgave him for that. I did learn from him it was the combination of 20 various blows to Michelles head that caused her death, causing intracranial bleeding.

We also learned that whatever weapon was used had those gnurls on it, like you would find on a rubber tire or Mag lite flashlight, so every time she was struck imprints from this weapon were left on her. Quite unusual I think and should have been a match to something the killer could have used.

Today I feel more strongly than ever that JY killed Michelle, and that he took time in the house before he left to go out of town. I need to listen to
Sami today and learn more about the AR and the interpretation of it, and see why Charlie is puzzled by the cut on the thumb!

[close_enough]

Just finished reading the above link and am seriously left with a feeling of WT????

Insert screwed up face.

Sami

LOL, yeah it wasn't a real good show, as far as info, IMO....a couple of things were interesting, but some of the silly errors in reporting are just crazy...i should be use to that; it happens a lot in the media....

[close_enough]

It sure makes me :mad: when Dr Baden says a "clump of hair" when it is clearly one hair.

I didn't realize that the first payment on the insurance policy was a month before the car accident!

I truly believe that this murderer has slipped up somewhere at the crime scene.

yeah, that was another 'error'....i'm kinda surprised Amanda Lamb made that one....she made it sound like the car 'accident' happened in 2006....

[scandi]

It did Close. I read yesterday at CTV that the 2005 date was an error and the accident was in May of 2006. She got pregnant in June with her second baby boy who was about 4 mos along when she was murdered.

[close_enough]

It did Close. I read yesterday at CTV that the 2005 date was an error and the accident was in May of 2006. She got pregnant in June with her second baby boy who was about 4 mos along when she was murdered.

ok, so the car accident WAS in 2006???....was this error just discovered??...hasn't it been stated over & over that it happened in 2005? :banghead:

[close_enough]

so Michelle got pregnant immediately after losing the baby, after the 'accident'......

[close_enough]

i'm still ticked off about losing that photo of the 3 maglites last night :rolleyes:

[packerdog]

It was brought up time and again that JB Ramsey was hit in the head by the mag lite that was found in the kitchen. Dr. Spitz (spelling) did test with the maglite several times hitting it against some type of styrofoam to see the marks and such it left. Her skull was cracked, but then again she was a child.

[raisincharlie]

yeah, that was another 'error'....i'm kinda surprised Amanda Lamb made that one....she made it sound like the car 'accident' happened in 2006....
It did happen in 2006.

[scandi]

Interesting, There is a new poster at CTV that must be a sorority sister by the sound of her nik. She is saying that the relationship between JY and MM will end up haveing much more to do with this crime than we now realize and that MM went to Denver in October at the same time JY did:

http://boards.courttv.com/showthread.php?threadid=285173&perpage=40&pagenumber=4


Scandi

So if that is true and JY and MM were together on that trip to Denver, and MY found out about it, it rocked her world. This is what probgably caused Michelle to decide the marriage was over and she started taking steps to end the marriage. I still think that last night was when he first started taking things out of the house that he would need immediately. It also could be why Michelle didn't have her wedding ring on at the funeral, as no jewelry was found on her body. I think she had stopped wearing the ring!

[close_enough]

It was brought up time and again that JB Ramsey was hit in the head by the mag lite that was found in the kitchen. Dr. Spitz (spelling) did test with the maglite several times hitting it against some type of styrofoam to see the marks and such it left. Her skull was cracked, but then again she was a child.

yeah, good point about the Ramsey case...

[raisincharlie]

Sami,


I did note that mag lites have serial numbers - often the serial numbers are tracked through shipments, in other words numbers x - y went to store such and such and so forth. For instance if JY or MY purchased one - the location from which it was purchased and the date would be known based on the serial number. Also if the warranty information was sent in - the serial number is required on the form - LE needs only to contact the vendor to check serial numbers under warranty. If no warranty submission and there is no flashlight in the home - might be the proverbial needle in the haystack to track it.

[raisincharlie]

Interesting, There is a new poster at CTV that must be a sorority sister by the sound of her nik. She is saying that the relationship between JY and MM will end up haveing much more to do with this crime than we now realize and that MM went to Denver in October at the same time JY did:

http://boards.courttv.com/showthread.php?threadid=285173&perpage=40&pagenumber=4


Scandi

So if that is true and JY and MM were together on that trip to Denver, and MY found out about it, it rocked her world. This is what probgably caused Michelle to decide the marriage was over and she started taking steps to end the marriage. I still think that last night was when he first started taking things out of the house that he would need immediately. It also could be why Michelle didn't have her wedding ring on at the funeral, as no jewelry was found on her body. I think she had stopped wearing the ring!
Especially since the Denver trip covered the wedding aniversary...rock your world is right.

[close_enough]

Interesting, There is a new poster at CTV that must be a sorority sister by the sound of her nik. She is saying that the relationship between JY and MM will end up haveing much more to do with this crime than we now realize and that MM went to Denver in October at the same time JY did:

http://boards.courttv.com/showthread.php?threadid=285173&perpage=40&pagenumber=4


Scandi

So if that is true and JY and MM were together on that trip to Denver, and MY found out about it, it rocked her world. This is what probgably caused Michelle to decide the marriage was over and she started taking steps to end the marriage. I still think that last night was when he first started taking things out of the house that he would need immediately. It also could be why Michelle didn't have her wedding ring on at the funeral, as no jewelry was found on her body. I think she had stopped wearing the ring!

thanks for the link Scandi:)
interesting reading for sure.....

[close_enough]

Especially since the Denver trip covered the wedding aniversary...rock your world is right.

OH that's right!!....October
i hadn't thought of that...

[raisincharlie]

OH that's right!!....October
i hadn't thought of that...
I have to tell you - I'm having trouble with that scenario. MM taught classes 2 nights a week and had a 2 year old boy. Seems to me a very long shot that she could or would get out of her teaching slot and find a justifiable reason for all concerned (husband, employer, baby) to fly to Denver to mess around with JY. Call me niave - but I don't think it happened with MM - thats not to say he didn't manage to pick up a lady or two while in Denver.

[close_enough]

I have to tell you - I'm having trouble with that scenario. MM taught classes 2 nights a week and had a 2 year old boy. Seems to me a very long shot that she could or would get out of her teaching slot and find a justifiable reason for all concerned (husband, employer, baby) to fly to Denver to mess around with JY. Call me niave - but I don't think it happened with MM - thats not to say he didn't manage to pick up a lady or two while in Denver.

hmmmm....i haven't thought much about MM, to be honest, except for investigators taking her computer...there's someone over at ctv that thinks that MM has a lot more to do with this than we think....then someone else has posted that we're all going to be shocked when this case unfolds, yada yada yada.....drives me nuts, lol....


but you're right...does seem like MM would have a hard time going on 'trips' w/o her husband & son...

[close_enough]

talked to my oldest son earlier.....(he thinks i'm crazy)... when i mentioned that "i'm on the internet looking at the AR of Michelle Young, the pregnant girl that was beaten to death in NC" he's like :waitasec:
but he 'gets into it' when we talk about it.....we discussed the lacerations on the back of MY's head...he said the murder weapon could have been anything, but flashlight was the first 'weapon' he mentioned.....

[happy2bn10ec]

talked to my oldest son earlier.....(he thinks i'm crazy)... when i mentioned that "i'm on the internet looking at the AR of Michelle Young, the pregnant girl that was beaten to death in NC" he's like :waitasec:
but he 'gets into it' when we talk about it.....we discussed the lacerations on the back of MY's head...he said the murder weapon could have been anything, but flashlight was the first 'weapon' he mentioned.....My whole family thinks I am crazy, too. My son aggravated me to death all day yesterday wanting me to find a cabin in western NC for him and his girlfriend to go for a weekend. He kept saying "what else do you have to do that you can't do it?" I finally told him I was studying a 13 page autopsy report and just didn't have time to surf for his cabin. I don't guess he has gotten over the fact that I was late picking him up at the airport because they were announcing the verdict in SP's trial at the exact same time I had to be there. I didn't know they had it on in the lounge at the airport or I would have made it on time. I think I embarass them being so obsessed with this stuff. And maybe I DO have too much time on my hands...?

eta...I just thought of something - he is wanting to go over there where all the outfitters are, very close to Brevard...how could I use this to my advantage??? There's gotta be something he could do for me!

[panthera]

It did Close. I read yesterday at CTV that the 2005 date was an error and the accident was in May of 2006. She got pregnant in June with her second baby boy who was about 4 mos along when she was murdered.That's what I thought we heard back in the beginning that the accident was just before she became pregnant again. Maybe the confusion started with the change from 2006 to 2007 and now it is 'last year'. ;)

[close_enough]

My whole family thinks I am crazy, too. My son aggravated me to death all day yesterday wanting me to find a cabin in western NC for him and his girlfriend to go for a weekend. He kept saying "what else do you have to do that you can't do it?" I finally told him I was studying a 13 page autopsy report and just didn't have time to surf for his cabin. I don't guess he has gotten over the fact that I was late picking him up at the airport because they were announcing the verdict in SP's trial at the exact same time I had to be there. I didn't know they had it on in the lounge at the airport or I would have made it on time. I think I embarass them being so obsessed with this stuff. And maybe I DO have too much time on my hands...?

eta...I just thought of something - he is wanting to go over there where all the outfitters are, very close to Brevard...how could I use this to my advantage??? There's gotta be something he could do for me!

lol..Sam asked..."is this all you do?".... :eek:

[jilly]

My whole family thinks I am crazy, too. My son aggravated me to death all day yesterday wanting me to find a cabin in western NC for him and his girlfriend to go for a weekend. He kept saying "what else do you have to do that you can't do it?" I finally told him I was studying a 13 page autopsy report and just didn't have time to surf for his cabin. I don't guess he has gotten over the fact that I was late picking him up at the airport because they were announcing the verdict in SP's trial at the exact same time I had to be there. I didn't know they had it on in the lounge at the airport or I would have made it on time. I think I embarass them being so obsessed with this stuff. And maybe I DO have too much time on my hands...?

eta...I just thought of something - he is wanting to go over there where all the outfitters are, very close to Brevard...how could I use this to my advantage??? There's gotta be something he could do for me!

That is hilarious Happy about being late for the airport. I think everyone here would have done what you did!! It reminds me when the OJ verdict came down, I was in an OR waiting for eye surgery. I was waiting and waiting and all of a sudden I heard these groans & moans. Yes - the entire staff was huddled around a TV in an adjoining room watching the verdict! I think the whole world stopped on that day! hehe.

ETA PS. I printed out the AR & have it hidden under a pile of papers on my desk so that no one in my family sees! :dance:

[panthera]

My whole family thinks I am crazy, too. My son aggravated me to death all day yesterday wanting me to find a cabin in western NC for him and his girlfriend to go for a weekend. He kept saying "what else do you have to do that you can't do it?" I finally told him I was studying a 13 page autopsy report and just didn't have time to surf for his cabin. I don't guess he has gotten over the fact that I was late picking him up at the airport because they were announcing the verdict in SP's trial at the exact same time I had to be there. I didn't know they had it on in the lounge at the airport or I would have made it on time. I think I embarass them being so obsessed with this stuff. And maybe I DO have too much time on my hands...?

eta...I just thought of something - he is wanting to go over there where all the outfitters are, very close to Brevard...how could I use this to my advantage??? There's gotta be something he could do for me!My dear, you need to get the 'sleuth of the year' award for this post! I don't think it's cause we have too much time on our hands but that we care for justice for these poor victims.

[jilly]

lol..Sam asked..."is this all you do?".... :eek:

What did you say? :D

[happy2bn10ec]

That is hilarious Happy about being late for the airport. I think everyone here would have done what you did!! It reminds me when the OJ verdict came down, I was in an OR waiting for eye surgery. I was waiting and waiting and all of a sudden I heard these groans & moans. Yes - the entire staff was huddled around a TV in an adjoining room watching the verdict! I think the whole world stopped on that day! hehe.

ETA PS. I printed out the AR & have it hidden under a pile of papers on my desk so that no one in my family sees! :dance:
It's just that we had waited for months and months and more months and I had LIVED that case from the first day she disappeared. I just COULDN'T stand not to be there to see it! And I was counting on the fact that most flights are usually late...only they weren't that day. Oh well, it's not like I've never waited on HIM!

[happy2bn10ec]

My dear, you need to get the 'sleuth of the year' award for this post! I don't think it's cause we have too much time on our hands but that we care for justice for these poor victims.
And the ones that get to me so bad are these pregnant women cases or anything about a little kid. I just can't get them off my mind.

[happy2bn10ec]

What did you say? :D
When mine asks me "Is that all you do?" I just said "Yep."

Like - what about it? I have raised my kids (except for one still home) and I baby-sit my grandkids on a regular basis. I think I can do about anything I want to with my free time and it's really none of their business.

[close_enough]

What did you say? :D

lmao...i said "NOOO!!!...the AR just came in yesterday" :rolleyes:

:eek: :p

[Taximom]

That is hilarious Happy about being late for the airport. I think everyone here would have done what you did!! It reminds me when the OJ verdict came down, I was in an OR waiting for eye surgery. I was waiting and waiting and all of a sudden I heard these groans & moans. Yes - the entire staff was huddled around a TV in an adjoining room watching the verdict! I think the whole world stopped on that day! hehe.

ETA PS. I printed out the AR & have it hidden under a pile of papers on my desk so that no one in my family sees! :dance:
When I saw on the news that the two Missouri boys had been discovered I gave the family dinner and said I'd eat later, and left them all together! lol I imagine they had quite a conversation about me that evening.

Yesterday I saw the article about the autopsy for MY and heard it was going to be posted, but had to do family stuff the rest of the day. Most of the time I spent wondering about that darn autopsy report and its findings. When I heard Baden talk about it I got excited about the "clump of hair". By the time I got back to WS last night you had already had 5 pages of comments about the autopsy! (and no clump of hair, rats)

I can't explain to my family why certain cases interest me. :shrugs: They have their interests and I have mine. :p

I have told my oldest daughter that if anyone goes through my pc when I'm dead and gone that they need to disregard most of the bookmarks and google search terms from true-crime related cases.... :D

Oops, I'm off-topic. :truce:

[panthera]

And the ones that get to me so bad are these pregnant women cases or anything about a little kid. I just can't get them off my mind.Any woman assaulted and murdered in her own home is what hits me, and yes especially if they're pregnant and killed by their husband. And of course crimes against children.

[Samiya]

My whole family thinks I am crazy, too. My son aggravated me to death all day yesterday wanting me to find a cabin in western NC for him and his girlfriend to go for a weekend. He kept saying "what else do you have to do that you can't do it?" I finally told him I was studying a 13 page autopsy report and just didn't have time to surf for his cabin. I don't guess he has gotten over the fact that I was late picking him up at the airport because they were announcing the verdict in SP's trial at the exact same time I had to be there. I didn't know they had it on in the lounge at the airport or I would have made it on time. I think I embarass them being so obsessed with this stuff. And maybe I DO have too much time on my hands...?

eta...I just thought of something - he is wanting to go over there where all the outfitters are, very close to Brevard...how could I use this to my advantage??? There's gotta be something he could do for me!LMAO!

My son has a cartoon he did about me on his computer.

It is of investigators standing around checking the crime scene in my house and one is standing with the ME. The caption has the ME looking at my office bookshelf and saying.........................

"can't we just use one of those autopsy reports? It'd save me heaps of time"

Sami

[panthera]

lmao...i said "NOOO!!!...the AR just came in yesterday" :rolleyes:

:eek: :pI printed the A/R out so I didn't have to hop between open windows here and my DH comes home and wonders what's on the desk ~ even though this isn't something new to him! :D

[jilly]

:laugh: When I saw on the news that the two Missouri boys had been discovered I gave the family dinner and said I'd eat later, and left them all together! lol I imagine they had quite a conversation about me that evening.

I'm still laughing!

Yes....it was quite a day yesterday. When I got home from work there were I don't know how many pages here and 50+ at CTV. I almost had a panic attack wondering how I'd ever catch up!lol

[jilly]

Any woman assaulted and murdered in her own home is what hits me, and yes especially if they're pregnant and killed by their husband. And of course crimes against children.

Same here although I didn't really follow the Dyleski case. I really didn't want that kid to be guilty.

[panthera]

:laugh:

I'm still laughing!

Yes....it was quite a day yesterday. When I got home from work there were I don't know how many pages here and 50+ at CTV. I almost had a panic attack wondering how I'd ever catch up!lolOn a day like yesterday with a lot of news I was glad to just have this forum to keep up with ~ don't know how people manage two or more! :cool:

[panthera]

Same here although I didn't really follow the Dyleski case. I really didn't want that kid to be guilty.I didn't either, but he is. And extremely sad to see two lives wasted. :(

[jilly]

I didn't either, but he is. And extremely sad to see two lives wasted. :(

I agree. By the way, someone at CTV said Fox is advertising that Greta will cover the Young case again tonite in case you hadn't seen.

[panthera]

I agree. By the way, someone at CTV said Fox is advertising that Greta will cover the Young case again tonite in case you hadn't seen.She is? the State of the Union address is tonight, so didn't know Greta would be on or covering this or any case! :)

[jilly]

She is? the State of the Union address is tonight, so didn't know Greta would be on or covering this or any case! :)

Ohhhhh yes and of course you must be right! I'll have to write-off that poster! :crazy:

[close_enough]

When I saw on the news that the two Missouri boys had been discovered I gave the family dinner and said I'd eat later, and left them all together! lol I imagine they had quite a conversation about me that evening.

Yesterday I saw the article about the autopsy for MY and heard it was going to be posted, but had to do family stuff the rest of the day. Most of the time I spent wondering about that darn autopsy report and its findings. When I heard Baden talk about it I got excited about the "clump of hair". By the time I got back to WS last night you had already had 5 pages of comments about the autopsy! (and no clump of hair, rats)

I can't explain to my family why certain cases interest me. :shrugs: They have their interests and I have mine. :p

I have told my oldest daughter that if anyone goes through my pc when I'm dead and gone that they need to disregard most of the bookmarks and google search terms from true-crime related cases.... :D

Oops, I'm off-topic. :truce:

same here sometimes....& when i go off on a tangent about 'a case' i sound obsessed...lol, can't help it...i KNOW i sound that way too!.......i was ALL enthralled (i know that's not spelled right) in the Peterson case..(Laci)...my husband told me ..with a straight face..."i'd get more attention if i had a keyboard chained around my neck"........yikes, he was right lol...at THAT time :eek: LOL

[close_enough]

:laugh:

:laugh:

I'm still laughing!

Yes....it was quite a day yesterday. When I got home from work there were I don't know how many pages here and 50+ at CTV. I almost had a panic attack wondering how I'd ever catch up!lol

you were missed....:)

[close_enough]

I printed the A/R out so I didn't have to hop between open windows here and my DH comes home and wonders what's on the desk ~ even though this isn't something new to him! :D

lol...good girl! (thumbs up here)

[close_enough]

LMAO!

My son has a cartoon he did about me on his computer.

It is of investigators standing around checking the crime scene in my house and one is standing with the ME. The caption has the ME looking at my office bookshelf and saying.........................

"can't we just use one of those autopsy reports? It'd save me heaps of time"

Sami

lol..i had a picture out of a magazine of a guy sitting at his computer...the goldfish is almost belly up, this guys face is on a milk carton, the plants are dead, & so forth...lol
it was on the fridge for a long time.....i had forgotten about that...cool:)

[close_enough]

Same here although I didn't really follow the Dyleski case. I really didn't want that kid to be guilty.

i did at first..i was 'one of those' that thought Horowitz (sp?) killed his wife....:(

[jilly]

i did at first..i was 'one of those' that thought Horowitz (sp?) killed his wife....:(

me too!

[jilly]

same here sometimes....& when i go off on a tangent about 'a case' i sound obsessed...lol, can't help it...i KNOW i sound that way too!.......i was ALL enthralled (i know that's not spelled right) in the Peterson case..(Laci)...my husband told me ..with a straight face..."i'd get more attention if i had a keyboard chained around my neck"........yikes, he was right lol...at THAT time :eek: LOL

Bwaaaaahahahahahahaha!

That is so funny!!! Still laughin'!!

[scandi]

Me too! During the SP case I didn't like him at all and it carried right over to the SD case. Many of us ate crow for dinner on that one.

They just found those 4 children and mother in a motel. It's BREAKING NEWS, at least I hadn't heard it. The Swat team knocked on the motel door, the mother came to the door, crying and shaking, they took the family outside and Swat stormed the room and caught him in a ventilation tube trying to escape. They are all alive and well and it is a good day to be in LE acc to the PD that made the rescue. Mike Brooks got so excited talking about the rescue. It was in Elkhart Ill I think.

Neat, huh? YaYa

[jilly]

:laugh:



you were missed....:)

Awwwww! :blowkiss:

Back on topic - I've been reading over at CTV - seems the general consensus there and maybe here is that he did not venture far that night, waited it out and went back.

His "friends" over at CTV are adamant that he stayed in a hotel in Va that nite. LE has a Hampton Hotel receipt for Nov 2.

If we go with this 'theory' seems to me he might have got a hotel just an hour or so away and could easily go back. There was no hotel in Va imo.

Wonder why he told his friends he stayed in Va? Any idea?

[jilly]

Me too! During the SP case I didn't like him at all and it carried right over to the SD case. Many of us ate crow for dinner on that one.

They just found those 4 children and mother in a motel. It's BREAKING NEWS, at least I hadn't heard it. The Swat team knocked on the motel door, the mother came to the door, crying and shaking, they took the family outside and Swat stormed the room and caught him in a ventilation tube trying to escape. They are all alive and well and it is a good day to be in LE acc to the PD that made the rescue. Mike Brooks got so excited talking about the rescue. It was in Elkhart Ill I think.

Neat, huh? YaYa

Oh Thank God. Thanks for letting us know!

[close_enough]

Awwwww! :blowkiss:

Back on topic - I've been reading over at CTV - seems the general consensus there and maybe here is that he did not venture far that night, waited it out and went back.

His "friends" over at CTV are adamant that he stayed in a hotel in Va that nite. LE has a Hampton Hotel receipt for Nov 2.

If we go with this 'theory' seems to me he might have got a hotel just an hour or so away and could easily go back. There was no hotel in Va imo.

Wonder why he told his friends he stayed in Va? Any idea?

yeah, i'm starting to wonder myself....when RC first mentioned this, i was like naaawwwww, there had to be....i'm not so sure anymore...

not sure why he'd say it though....not thinking?...something off the top of his head?? :waitasec:
......i don't know?

[close_enough]

Bwaaaaahahahahahahaha!

That is so funny!!! Still laughin'!!

lol :p it's a true story...

[close_enough]

Me too! During the SP case I didn't like him at all and it carried right over to the SD case. Many of us ate crow for dinner on that one.

They just found those 4 children and mother in a motel. It's BREAKING NEWS, at least I hadn't heard it. The Swat team knocked on the motel door, the mother came to the door, crying and shaking, they took the family outside and Swat stormed the room and caught him in a ventilation tube trying to escape. They are all alive and well and it is a good day to be in LE acc to the PD that made the rescue. Mike Brooks got so excited talking about the rescue. It was in Elkhart Ill I think.

Neat, huh? YaYa

yes, yes...& while we're 'admitting' things....i was all up for crucifiying Jessica Lunsford's grandfather at one time, during the investigation....man, i was way off base & it's 'taught' me a lot....i truly try not to get so emotional that i start thinking & saying crazy things......i mean, i know NONE of these people that we discuss 'here'.......i've probably, & i say probably become a better 'sleuther' because of that case.....

course i think JY will rot in hell...

[scandi]

There are two rumors from CTV 'insiders' that still could end up being true. One was that he rented a hotel only a 1/2 hour away from the home. The other was that he had bruises on his arms after she was killed.

Does anyone know any more about the bruising? Where we heard it? There was something about him talking to a minister where the bruising was brough up, but RPD kind of poo pooed that idea.

Then there is the poster who says the motel where he stayed had a video camera. Have heard nothing more on that. Also LE took a video tape from the Get It Market in Duffield. Nothing more on that either.

Wonder how far away they are to an arrest. I think they have plenty, don't you? :D :D

[scandi]

The truth is Close, when I first heard little Jessicas father I though for sure he was plum guilty. He was hard to read and he looked to odd to me, like a real hillbilly. WOW, was I wrong on calling that one as he has turned out to be a real trooper for childrens rights against pedo's. After he got cleaned up and started touring with Erin Runnion I always kind of hoped they'd become a duo. :rolleyes: I'm bad I know, but hey, just fessin' up. :)

[j2mirish]

There are two rumors from CTV 'insiders' that still could end up being true. One was that he rented a hotel only a 1/2 hour away from the home. The other was that he had bruises on his arms after she was killed.

Does anyone know any more about the bruising? Where we heard it? There was something about him talking to a minister where the bruising was brough up, but RPD kind of poo pooed that idea.

Then there is the poster who says the motel where he stayed had a video camera. Have heard nothing more on that. Also LE took a video tape from the Get It Market in Duffield. Nothing more on that either.

Wonder how far away they are to an arrest. I think they have plenty, don't you? :D :D
i'm thinking time for handcuffs--- so where are they? what piece of the puzzle are they missing?

[jilly]

yes, yes...& while we're 'admitting' things....i was all up for crucifiying Jessica Lunsford's grandfather at one time, during the investigation....man, i was way off base & it's 'taught' me a lot....i truly try not to get so emotional that i start thinking & saying crazy things......i mean, i know NONE of these people that we discuss 'here'.......i've probably, & i say probably become a better 'sleuther' because of that case.....

course i think JY will rot in hell...

I forgot about that one.....me too! again!!! I think the Dyleski one was just too close to the Peterson case which I was consumed with. With Jessica - I was really out of my element - no clue about pedophiles etc. It was a real eye opener for me let me tell ya.

[jilly]

There are two rumors from CTV 'insiders' that still could end up being true. One was that he rented a hotel only a 1/2 hour away from the home. The other was that he had bruises on his arms after she was killed.

Does anyone know any more about the bruising? Where we heard it? There was something about him talking to a minister where the bruising was brough up, but RPD kind of poo pooed that idea.

Then there is the poster who says the motel where he stayed had a video camera. Have heard nothing more on that. Also LE took a video tape from the Get It Market in Duffield. Nothing more on that either.

Wonder how far away they are to an arrest. I think they have plenty, don't you? :D :D

Hi Scandi - about the bruising - if I recall, this bruising was awhile back in their marriage wasn't it? I thought the poster (don't remember who) was suggesting that JY had been subjected to some abuse (burising) and he talked to a priest about it.

[scandi]

For me Jessica's case was the saddest I had ever seen and I still think about it to this day. Put in a double bag fully aware of what was happening and buried alive, It still boggles my brain the suffering she went through.

[jilly]

i'm thinking time for handcuffs--- so where are they? what piece of the puzzle are they missing?

The lab results? Just guessing here. Otherwise, if they've got him checking into a hotel but can't put him at the murder scene?

[scandi]

Oh, like he was the victim of the abuse from her. Eegads! Thanks Jilly. That rumor is officialy squalshed :laugh: :croc: Eaten up and thrown away.

[raisincharlie]

There are two rumors from CTV 'insiders' that still could end up being true. One was that he rented a hotel only a 1/2 hour away from the home. The other was that he had bruises on his arms after she was killed.

Does anyone know any more about the bruising? Where we heard it? There was something about him talking to a minister where the bruising was brough up, but RPD kind of poo pooed that idea.

Then there is the poster who says the motel where he stayed had a video camera. Have heard nothing more on that. Also LE took a video tape from the Get It Market in Duffield. Nothing more on that either.

Wonder how far away they are to an arrest. I think they have plenty, don't you? :D :D
Sources tell me there is video tape from both hotel and the get it market and LE has reviewed those tapes. He was at certain places at certain times, but I do not know what times and only one place for sure. :p

[close_enough]

For me Jessica's case was the saddest I had ever seen and I still think about it to this day. Put in a double bag fully aware of what was happening and buried alive, It still boggles my brain the suffering she went through.

i know what you mean...Couey (sp?) is a parasite, imo

[j2mirish]

For me Jessica's case was the saddest I had ever seen and I still think about it to this day. Put in a double bag fully aware of what was happening and buried alive, It still boggles my brain the suffering she went through.
beyond words....her killer and the idaho scum should just be burned at a stake:furious:

[strach304]

Sources tell me there is video tape from both hotel and the get it market and LE has reviewed those tapes. He was at certain places at certain times, but I do not know what times and only one place for sure. :p

Ok, now you have sources? That's the second time I've seen you say that :D Keep it coming, got some good info so far.

[scandi]

Yea, Couey looks like a little old dottering wimp of a man. Who would ever in a million years guess he could do this to any child. And Duncan who stole used abused and killed so many, like so much trash, you'd probably never guess he was a scary lethal killer as he probably has the gift of gab and the little wink to go along with it.

[scandi]

Hi Charlie, The place would have to be the station where he bought gas in Duffield. Wish we knew where the hotel was.

Your source is what I would call on the inside track of things. I went back and read all of his posts today, there aren't many, but he has all the confidence in the world that JY is guilty and that LE has plenty to nail him. They are just taking their sweet time, and I wish they would speed it up.

All the extra time they take is a longer one for Cassidy in what I think is a bad situation. He must be moody and grumpy, on edge, looking over his back even if he hears a noise in the house. A total :chicken: is what I think, catching his wife sleeping in bed and slamming her with his fists.

[raisincharlie]

Ok, now you have sources? That's the second time I've seen you say that :D Keep it coming, got some good info so far.
So far they have been correct, no reason to doubt them and I am a huge doubting Joe when it comes to insiders...the video tape from the Duffield store has been independently verified.

[raisincharlie]

Hi Charlie, The place would have to be the station where he bought gas in Duffield. Wish we knew where the hotel was.

Your source is what I would call on the inside track of things. I went back and read all of his posts today, there aren't many, but he has all the confidence in the world that JY is guilty and that LE has plenty to nail him. They are just taking their sweet time, and I wish they would speed it up.

All the extra time they take is a longer one for Cassidy in what I think is a bad situation. He must be moody and grumpy, on edge, looking over his back even if he hears a noise in the house. A total :chicken: is what I think, catching his wife sleeping in bed and slamming her with his fists.
I think things will change when the forensics come back - all of them. I think Becky Holt wants to know without a doubt she can put this slime bucket away for good. JMO.

[scandi]

I think things will change when the forensics come back - all of them. I think Becky Holt wants to know without a doubt she can put this slime bucket away for good. JMO.

Charlie, Will there be one specific report the ME will release concerning DNA? Is it like the AR where it has to be of public record when it is complete? I would think they would have released the AR at the same time as the DNA as it completes the report, right? Are there any other things that should have been in the report that you didn't see?

[jilly]

I think things will change when the forensics come back - all of them. I think Becky Holt wants to know without a doubt she can put this slime bucket away for good. JMO.

I agree on this. I can't forget about that non testimonial order. They've got his palm prints, fingerprints, foot size, photographs and whatever else.

[raisincharlie]

Charlie, Will there be one specific report the ME will release concerning DNA? Is it like the AR where it has to be of public record when it is complete? I would think they would have released the AR at the same time as the DNA as it completes the report, right? Are there any other things that should have been in the report that you didn't see?
Scandi,

I do believe there will be specific reports for toxicology, serology, tests on blood from MY and the fetal blood samples collected. DNA is usually a stand alone document seperate from the AR. I do not know about NC but if you recall Pamela Vitale's AR - everything was included except the DNA work. I know in Missouri - you would see much as we have seen for MY - and thats it - everything else is a seperate report and not publically released.

[yadler]

Right. The striations are inverted and not protruding. However, with enough force, that pattern could surely be transferred onto flesh.

[SueY]

I've been reading over at CTV - seems the general consensus there and maybe here is that he did not venture far that night, waited it out and went back.
His "friends" over at CTV are adamant that he stayed in a hotel in Va that nite. LE has a Hampton Hotel receipt for Nov 2.
If we go with this 'theory' seems to me he might have got a hotel just an hour or so away and could easily go back. There was no hotel in Va imo.
Wonder why he told his friends he stayed in Va? Any idea?I have wondered the same, jilly. I was looking at the items found in the search warrants at http://rdu.news14.com/content/your_news/triangle/?SecID=512&ArID=95905.

It lists Confirmation for Hampton Inn reservation from early September 2006. Would JY have booked a hotel in early September for a Va business trip not taking place until early November 2006? There are a number of Hampton Inns in the Denver, Co area as well. Could that reservation confirmation maybe relate to the Denver trip in October?

The search warrant also lists Receipt for the Adam's Mark in Denver, CO. Could JY have stayed at a Hampton Inn during his Denver trip, and maybe just gone to the Adam's Mark for dinner, or whatever?

Could it be that there was no Hampton Inn reservation in Va for the November business trip the night MY was killed?

I see that raisincharlie says there is video evidence from both a hotel and the market, so mine are just rambling (and very much behind) thoughts.

[SueY]

Could it be that there was no Hampton Inn reservation in Va for the November business trip the night MY was killed?Oh well, I did some more looking and see another search warrant, for the SUV, that lists 1 copy of hotel receipt for Hampton Hotel for 11/2/06.

So much for that theory!

[raisincharlie]

Oh well, I did some more looking and see another search warrant, for the SUV, that lists 1 copy of hotel receipt for Hampton Hotel for 11/2/06.

So much for that theory!
SueY,

Because he had a receipt for a hotel and because there is video - it does not mean he stayed there. All it means is that he showed up,paid for a room and got a receipt. We still do not know where that hotel is - could be Cary or Durham or Raleigh for that matter so don't throw your theory out just yet. If it turns out to be VA - the same applies as we still do not know what time he left his home on this "trip".

[packerdog]

Does anyone know where JY durring the day thursday? He could have stopped at a hotel far away and paid for a room for thursday night and never stayed there. He could have gone into the room and left the key there and never went back. No one would be the wiser. Then he could have waited until her friend left and gonein and murdered her.

[jilly]

Does anyone know where JY durring the day thursday? He could have stopped at a hotel far away and paid for a room for thursday night and never stayed there. He could have gone into the room and left the key there and never went back. No one would be the wiser. Then he could have waited until her friend left and gonein and murdered her.

That's what we're saying Packerdog. All we know is that LE has a receipt for the "Hampton Hotel" for Nov 2. They haven't said where. JY apparently told a friend at the funeral that he had a business meeting in Va on the morning of the 3rd so at first many of us assumed the hotel was in Va. But when you add up the mileage, time of death, food contents in MYs stomach etc., it's looking to some of us that this hotel was not very far.

[packerdog]

That's what we're saying Packerdog. All we know is that LE has a receipt for the "Hampton Hotel" for Nov 2. They haven't said where. JY apparently told a friend at the funeral that he had a business meeting in Va on the morning of the 3rd so at first many of us assumed the hotel was in Va. But when you add up the mileage, time of death, food contents in MYs stomach etc., it's looking to some of us that this hotel was not very far.

I see what you mean jilly. I was thinking that the receipt for the hampton hotel was a ploy to decieve LE into thinking he was far away from his home at the time of the murder. Like SP with the reciept for the boat launch.

[jilly]

I see what you mean jilly. I was thinking that the receipt for the hampton hotel was a ploy to decieve LE into thinking he was far away from his home at the time of the murder. Like SP with the reciept for the boat launch.

Well yes, we are thinking it was a ploy too (By the way I shouldn't have referred to the TOD in my post - we don't know that either!!!). Seems he was definitely trying to set up an alibi. Some of us are wondering if he even had a meeting scheduled at all. We don't know what time he left his house on Thursday. All we know (from an insider) is that Michelle had friend(s) over to watch Greys Anatomy on the 2nd & JY wasn't around at that time. He could have left in the daytime for all we know.

So it would be good to know where this hotel is. We do know that a sleuther at CTV tracked his gas receipt to Duffield. They've also got video surveillance of him. She personally made a visit to the place.

[jilly]

Here's a little tidbit everyone from a poster at CTV. The poster phoned the Get it Market in Duffield today. Their hours of operation - 5am-midnite.

[panthera]

Here's a little tidbit everyone from a poster at CTV. The poster phoned the Get it Market in Duffield today. Their hours of operation - 5am-midnite.Well isn't that interesting! Good sleuthing :D

[Samiya]

Lol, I was searching the news this morning and found one about Michelle with the heading of Just The Facts. Turns out to be one of Amanda Lamb's blogs.

http://www.wral.com/news/local/blogpost/1177614/

And here I was thinking that someone decided to interview JTF.

*Sami Smackdown*

(Although I would be interested in a one on one with JTF.)

[jilly]

Good sleuthing :D

ROFL!! Cracked me up!!

[panthera]

ROFL!! Cracked me up!!well it did require making a phone call! :D

[jilly]

Lol, I was searching the news this morning and found one about Michelle with the heading of Just The Facts. Turns out to be one of Amanda Lamb's blogs.

http://www.wral.com/news/local/blogpost/1177614/

And here I was thinking that someone decided to interview JTF.

*Sami Smackdown*

(Although I would be interested in a one on one with JTF.)

LOL - I think most of us would have thought the same thing Sami! Interesting that JTF did not want to comment on the autopsy.

[Samiya]

FOr those who want to make comparisions between Chelle, Laci and Janet....

I've opened up a new thread with permission from Tybee so you can do so :)

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1299480#post1299480

hugs
Sami

[raisincharlie]

Lol, I was searching the news this morning and found one about Michelle with the heading of Just The Facts. Turns out to be one of Amanda Lamb's blogs.

http://www.wral.com/news/local/blogpost/1177614/

And here I was thinking that someone decided to interview JTF.

*Sami Smackdown*

(Although I would be interested in a one on one with JTF.)

I'm thinking Ms. Lamb has probably received a few letters, the haranging type epistle from JTF - and is responding in kind - just the facts - "no one deserves to die this way". JMO and go Ms. Lamb!

[jilly]

I'm thinking Ms. Lamb has probably received a few letters, the haranging type epistle from JTF - and is responding in kind - just the facts - "no one deserves to die this way". JMO and go Ms. Lamb!

I noticed that Lamb refers to Cassidy's room being across the hall fwiw.

[jilly]

Another tidbit from CTV :angel: - MM is no longer on the list of staff & faculty at Valencia Community College & VCC has a job listing for a Math prof. Another poster confirmed she is no longer working there.

[pack_fan]

Another tidbit from CTV :angel: - MM is no longer on the list of staff & faculty at Valencia Community College & VCC has a job listing for a Math prof. Another poster confirmed she is no longer working there.
This is true Jilly but don't read too much into it. Has nothing to do with the case.

[raisincharlie]

I noticed that Lamb refers to Cassidy's room being across the hall fwiw.
I noticed that as well. Scary, the baby right across the hallway.

[pack_fan]

I noticed that as well. Scary, the baby right across the hallway.
Kinda makes you think that she may have indeed been a witness. I imagine there was a lot of yelling and screaming going on.

[raisincharlie]

Does anyone know where JY durring the day thursday? He could have stopped at a hotel far away and paid for a room for thursday night and never stayed there. He could have gone into the room and left the key there and never went back. No one would be the wiser. Then he could have waited until her friend left and gonein and murdered her.
This is very true - also possible - he could have gotten a room quite far from Raleigh if this is the case. Something to consider IMO. we have heard nothing of what he was doing or where he was Thursday during the day.

[raisincharlie]

Kinda makes you think that she may have indeed been a witness. I imagine there was a lot of yelling and screaming going on.
I keep trying to convince myself that Cassidy neither heard or saw anything but am having a difficult time swallowing that one. One of the posters at CTV with a very clear side to JY also said the dog routinely slept in Cassidy's room, right across the hall...if one could just turn back time.

[pack_fan]

I keep trying to convince myself that Cassidy neither heard or saw anything but am having a difficult time swallowing that one. One of the posters at CTV with a very clear side to JY also said the dog routinely slept in Cassidy's room, right across the hall...if one could just turn back time.
Well don't waste too much time over there. They are telling half truths over there as we speak. I'm lurking and its quite amusing.

[jilly]

This is very true - also possible - he could have gotten a room quite far from Raleigh if this is the case. Something to consider IMO. we have heard nothing of what he was doing or where he was Thursday during the day.

Well....we can probably narrow that day down a bit because they won't usually let you check into a hotel before 3 pm.

RC how long does it take to drive from Raleigh to Duffield?

[jilly]

This is true Jilly but don't read too much into it. Has nothing to do with the case.

I figured as much but thank you for setting me straight! :)

[pack_fan]

I figured as much but thank you for setting me straight! :)
Anytime. I'm having a hard time tonight. NC State is playing basketball on tv and trying to keep up here and ctv. Quite difficult for a slow minded person like me.

[raisincharlie]

Well don't waste too much time over there. They are telling half truths over there as we speak. I'm lurking and its quite amusing.
No problem ! :)

[raisincharlie]

Well....we can probably narrow that day down a bit because they won't usually let you check into a hotel before 3 pm.

RC how long does it take to drive from Raleigh to Duffield?If I recall correctly between 5 to 6 hours depending on route. The concern I have with a straight through drive however comes down to the mileage - given the hilly - semi mountainous terrain of western VA - I have doubts an Explorer could make it that far on a single tank -if it did it was certainly running on fumes. I truly want to know what time the gas was bought as well as how much gas was bought. JMO - it won't add up.

ETA - hope this works - the drive time estimated at just over 5 hours, mileage approximately 320 - advised route:

http://www.mapquest.com/directions/main.adp?go=1&do=nw&rmm=1&un=m&cl=EN&qq=m4ZeC4eEaUjB0vOlaUxfVT5f51Bpt4EJHn%252bKdy9%252 buhniWrMMPtEyQIcZh3zQYIMZqITWNnXrJHnnPqka8TWFW2Rli OZFq31%252f%252bNqe89msInEV5ss1VF4QdMEfwgIt3WI5%25 2bde%252bZwfA3FTLKvp4AWJyDNLKiJDtBur4MRSKZk50Pi3ug xOUxxdKTryfSfssHY8ka2S3bhetrDOL1pxURUbw1wpmcvn9iAM dvO4EJuKTcdsLxVnyqR%252bvkg%253d%253d&ct=NA&rsres=1&1y=US&1ffi=&1l=kWaydvEn2xNKn6mpUA%252b5sA%253d%253d&1g=roXBcdQnKnU9Ddf0OD9Zhw%253d%253d&1pl=&1v=ADDRESS&1n=&1pn=&1a=5108+Birchleaf+Dr&1c=Raleigh&1s=NC&1z=27606-9360&2y=US&2ffi=&2l=&2g=&2pl=&2v=&2n=&2pn=&2a=&2c=Duffield&2s=VA&2z=&panelbtn=2

[raisincharlie]

Virginia

Florida

What is the third state LE went to ? Tenn ?

[jilly]

Anytime. I'm having a hard time tonight. NC State is playing basketball on tv and trying to keep up here and ctv. Quite difficult for a slow minded person like me.

LOL l I have enough problem keeping up with just here & CTV so you're one up on me. :crazy: I'm a very slow reader, so I think if this thing ever goes to trial I'll give up CTV like I did with the Peterson case.

[pack_fan]

Virginia

Florida

What is the third state LE went to ? Tenn ?
I would suspect NY. Interviewing friends and family of Michelle.

[jilly]

Virginia

Florida

What is the third state LE went to ? Tenn ?

Yes, I believe so.

Back to the drive & gas. It may not have any bearing but I often do a 5 hr drive through the Coastal Mountains and I have a V8. I make it easily on a tank of gas.

[raisincharlie]

I would suspect NY. Interviewing friends and family of Michelle.
I wondered about NY - but kinda thought not as LE might have interviewed them as they did some of the other friends that came from out of state for the services. I do recall supposedly LE was taking plate numbers - out of state would of course have rentals - do you know if NC has a special sequence of plates that provided to rental car companies ? I know MO does - the plate sequence of letters versus numbers identifies it as a rental.

[raisincharlie]

Yes, I believe so.

Back to the drive & gas. It may not have any bearing but I often do a 5 hr drive through the Coastal Mountains and I have a V8. I make it easily on a tank of gas.
Do you do the speed limit or 80 mph like JY's speeding tickets say he does ?

[pack_fan]

I wondered about NY - but kinda thought not as LE might have interviewed them as they did some of the other friends that came from out of state for the services. I do recall supposedly LE was taking plate numbers - out of state would of course have rentals - do you know if NC has a special sequence of plates that provided to rental car companies ? I know MO does - the plate sequence of letters versus numbers identifies it as a rental.
Can't say for sure but don't think so charlie. All of the rental cars I have ever seen have had the big fat stickers on the back to advertise their services. They were there taking pictures, it was on the news. Showed them out in the parking lot not so discreetly taking photos.

NY was just a guess. Tenn. could be a possibility, he was in the area. I would tend to beleive if they mentioned it, they had a reason to go there. Like a person closely related somehow or a confirmed stop on his trip out of town. With the timing so early in the investigation, I would tend to think person instead of place.

[jilly]

Do you do the speed limit or 80 mph like JY's speeding tickets say he does ?

Well, since I've had the only 2 speeding tickets in my life on that stretch, I do the speed limit now! :) I never did 80 - the most 75mph.

I see what you're saying about Mr Leadfoot though.

[scandi]

I think it was Colorado Charlie. When LE learned of the affair it heightened the investigation in the case from what I read in a link. Since the new poster at CTV has stated they were both in Denver at the same time, I think LE wanted to learn all they could about what went on there. Interview the maids, talk to waitresses, etc to see if they were often together and it was a real thing between them with all the natural intimacies.

For some reason I think this affair had gone on for awhile, maybe back before the accident. For them to have known each other so long it seems odd they would suddenly just have the hots for each other.

I'm hoping we'll have an arrest this week. I don't think they would have released the AR unles they had all parts of it together. What could be missing now is what I wonder, but I really think the case is pretty much in the hands of the DA and her boss at this point, planning a defense strategy. It will take some study because the Smith law firsm has a certain way of attacking a case, one of which is on the minute details of the forensics. So they might be checking all their bases so there are no holes.

Just rambling here, as I am dissapointed they don't have it ready yet - I thought today would be the day! :rolleyes:

I did learn some things at CTV today from close friends posting, and don't know if this is already here:

* The affair was over between JY and MM right after the funeral.
* The sorority sisters were over at MM's house when LE showed up w/ warrant.
* Cassidy was tenatively suppose to spend the night {Thurs} with the GA guest.
* MM & SM are moving to Myrtle Beach where her dad owns several motels and Steve will work for him.

Isn't it something, that as a result of some hot passion laced with some deceit and selfcenterdness, the lives of these two people have been changed forever. Both no longer have their good jobs, it looks like one will be arrested for murder and the other will have to testify in court as to what she learned as the whole thing transpired and went down. Sad.

[raisincharlie]

I think it was Colorado Charlie. When LE learned of the affair it heightened the investigation in the case from what I read in a link. Since the new poster at CTV has stated they were both in Denver at the same time, I think LE wanted to learn all they could about what went on there. Interview the maids, talk to waitresses, etc to see if they were often together and it was a real thing between them with all the natural intimacies.

<snip>

Scandi,

Gonna be real honest here - someone is blowing major smoke about the Denver trip IMO. White Wolf helped me out and we were able to come up with a medical records seminar and convention at the Denver Convention Center for the dates matching the airline tickets found in the Birchleaf residence. Part of the convention area is the Adams Mark hotel where JY stayed. These receipts for hotels and airline tickets were taken from the home long before LE knew anything about MM.

Trying to be logical - how would MM explain to her employer (the Jr College) that she needed that week off from teaching - would they give her the time off ? How would she explain this trip to her husband ? What extra arrangements would have been made for the care of her young child so she could just visit Denver ? To me, and I could be wrong, but this claim MM was in Denver with JY is bull chit of the highest order - JMO.

[pack_fan]

Scandi,

Gonna be real honest here - someone is blowing major smoke about the Denver trip IMO. White Wolf helped me out and we were able to come up with a medical records seminar and convention at the Denver Convention Center for the dates matching the airline tickets found in the Birchleaf residence. Part of the convention area is the Adams Mark hotel where JY stayed. These receipts for hotels and airline tickets were taken from the home long before LE knew anything about MM.

Trying to be logical - how would MM explain to her employer (the Jr College) that she needed that week off from teaching - would they give her the time off ? How would she explain this trip to her husband ? What extra arrangements would have been made for the care of her young child so she could just visit Denver ? To me, and I could be wrong, but this claim MM was in Denver with JY is bull chit of the highest order - JMO.
I don't know the facts on this trip to colorado so I'm not going to agree or disagree but here is the story.

Charlie,

MM taught on tuesdays and thursdays and traveled on the weekends often. She had a brother and sister that lived in Denver so this trip would not at all been hard to disguise if true. I know for certain that she did go to colorado in october but don't know if it was the same weekend or not.

Scandi,

Don't beleive everything you read at CTV. MM did not lose her job at the cc over this. They have been planning on moving for quite some time. She was not going back to work at the cc regardless. It is LS's dad that they are talking about in Myrtle Beach and it is not true that SM is going to work for him. SM is going into business for himself and they have been trying to get closer to family and friends for a good while now.

[raisincharlie]

I don't know the facts on this trip to colorado so I'm not going to agree or disagree but here is the story.

Charlie,

MM taught on tuesdays and thursdays and traveled on the weekends often. She had a brother and sister that lived in Denver so this trip would not at all been hard to disguise if true. I know for certain that she did go to colorado in october but don't know if it was the same weekend or not.

Scandi,

Don't beleive everything you read at CTV. MM did not lose her job at the cc over this. They have been planning on moving for quite some time. She was not going back to work at the cc regardless. It is LS's dad that they are talking about in Myrtle Beach and it is not true that SM is going to work for him. SM is going into business for himself and they have been trying to get closer to family and friends for a good while now.
Pack_fan,

I did not know that but I can tell you from the search warrant - Jy's airline ticket was for 9 October which was a Monday. The seminar/convention was 10/10 through 10/12 (Tuesday through Thursday). I quess it is possible he stayed for the weekend of 14/15 but considering that was the same week as his and MY's anniversary - do you think it is possible ? Maybe I need to eat some words...

[pack_fan]

Pack_fan,

I did not know that but I can tell you from the search warrant - Jy's airline ticket was for 9 October which was a Monday. The seminar/convention was 10/10 through 10/12 (Tuesday through Thursday). I quess it is possible he stayed for the weekend of 14/15 but considering that was the same week as his and MY's anniversary - do you think it is possible ? Maybe I need to eat some words...
Sending you a pm.

[scandi]

Oh drats! :angel: lol

Pack Fan, thanks for the one up. Guess I'm gullible as can be, but that poster sounded so matter of fact about it. I did read that he was in Denver for their anniversary.

If she flew to Denver over the weekend and stayed with him Monday, she could have flown back Tues morn and not missed her class! :innocent:

[pack_fan]

Oh drats! :angel: lol

Pack Fan, thanks for the one up. Guess I'm gullible as can be, but that poster sounded so matter of fact about it. I did read that he was in Denver for their anniversary.

If she flew to Denver over the weekend and stayed with him Monday, she could have flown back Tues morn and not missed her class! :innocent:
He was there, she might have been. Can't say for sure about the trip but not all of their information tonight has been correct. Just don't beleive everything that you read.....

[scandi]

That's exasperating, isn't it. We're so starved for facts in this case. I have noticed several discrepancies though in one main insider posters posts and it had me scratching my head.

Thanks sweetie, off to bed.

[curious1]

I'm thinking Ms. Lamb has probably received a few letters, the haranging type epistle from JTF - and is responding in kind - just the facts - "no one deserves to die this way". JMO and go Ms. Lamb!
So do I have this right....JTF is harrassing Ms. Lamb? I assume he is a JY supporter. I have not been to the other sites to read about this crime so I am not familiar with who JTF is. The other sites get to vitriolic for my tastes. I don't like the attacking each other thing. There may be a few heated words of disagreement from time to time on WS, but we are human and so it will happen, but not like the stuff on courttv.

[raisincharlie]

So do I have this right....JTF is harrassing Ms. Lamb? I assume he is a JY supporter. I have not been to the other sites to read about this crime so I am not familiar with who JTF is. The other sites get to vitriolic for my tastes. I don't like the attacking each other thing. There may be a few heated words of disagreement from time to time on WS, but we are human and so it will happen, but not like the stuff on courttv.Curious1,

Let me start at the begining - JTF (short for "Just the Facts") is a poster who showed up over at CTV not long after Michelle's murder. From JTFs posts, it is clear that this person defends JY at every turn. This poster also was constantly whining about all the press coverage and even demeaning posters on the CTV board for even discussing this case. Her stated objective was to demonstrate just the facts which of course excluded JY from having any involvement whatsoever. Lots of excuses but IMO never direct responses to questions and many times incorrect.

The news observer in Raleigh published an article about message boards and posters, directly referencing the CTV board - this was I believe shortly before Christmas - over all the article made the posters seem strange is the best way to call it.

My comment above was strictly off the cuff - I do not know if JTF has contacted Ms. Lamb in any way. I said what I said because of how the article placed quotations around "Just the Facts". My first thought was Ms. Lamb most likely did receive at least one of JTFs epistles whining and demeaning the press for their handling of this case by making JY look bad - this is a constant mantra of JTF. The final sentence by Ms. Lamb that no one deserves to die this way IMO was directly aimed at someone. Strictly my interpretation based on the dogged persistence of JTF to berate anyone who carries an opinion that even suggests JY killed his wife.

[nanandjim]

...From JTFs posts, it is clear that this person defends JY at every turn. This poster also was constantly whining about all the press coverage and even demeaning posters on the CTV board for even discussing this case...
Hopefully, JTF doesn't join this website. ;) I for one think Jason is guilty as the day is long.

P.S. My days are long. :)

[scandi]

I agree with everything you said, and would further say I do think Amanda reads that CTV board as part of her daily research on the case. At least often. And I think she knows what just the facts agenda is on the board and sees right through what this person is trying to do on Jason's behalf.

I don't think that person would send a letter to her and sign it with her CTV nik. As a member of the family they could be expected to write an epistle to her along the same lines as we have read from JTF at CTV. But I think Amanda is very smart and can tell that this person and JTF are one and the same.

[curious1]

Curious1,

Let me start at the begining - JTF (short for "Just the Facts") is a poster who showed up over at CTV not long after Michelle's murder. From JTFs posts, it is clear that this person defends JY at every turn. This poster also was constantly whining about all the press coverage and even demeaning posters on the CTV board for even discussing this case. Her stated objective was to demonstrate just the facts which of course excluded JY from having any involvement whatsoever. Lots of excuses but IMO never direct responses to questions and many times incorrect.

The news observer in Raleigh published an article about message boards and posters, directly referencing the CTV board - this was I believe shortly before Christmas - over all the article made the posters seem strange is the best way to call it.

My comment above was strictly off the cuff - I do not know if JTF has contacted Ms. Lamb in any way. I said what I said because of how the article placed quotations around "Just the Facts". My first thought was Ms. Lamb most likely did receive at least one of JTFs epistles whining and demeaning the press for their handling of this case by making JY look bad - this is a constant mantra of JTF. The final sentence by Ms. Lamb that no one deserves to die this way IMO was directly aimed at someone. Strictly my interpretation based on the dogged persistence of JTF to berate anyone who carries an opinion that even suggests JY killed his wife.
Thanks RC. As always your opinions and interpretations seem to be very good and accurate. Thanks for filling me in. I'll just keep my head in the sand here at WS, the other places scare me. :p

[5bigfish5]

Curious1,

Let me start at the begining - JTF (short for "Just the Facts") is a poster who showed up over at CTV not long after Michelle's murder. From JTFs posts, it is clear that this person defends JY at every turn. This poster also was constantly whining about all the press coverage and even demeaning posters on the CTV board for even discussing this case. Her stated objective was to demonstrate just the facts which of course excluded JY from having any involvement whatsoever. Lots of excuses but IMO never direct responses to questions and many times incorrect.

The news observer in Raleigh published an article about message boards and posters, directly referencing the CTV board - this was I believe shortly before Christmas - over all the article made the posters seem strange is the best way to call it.

My comment above was strictly off the cuff - I do not know if JTF has contacted Ms. Lamb in any way. I said what I said because of how the article placed quotations around "Just the Facts". My first thought was Ms. Lamb most likely did receive at least one of JTFs epistles whining and demeaning the press for their handling of this case by making JY look bad - this is a constant mantra of JTF. The final sentence by Ms. Lamb that no one deserves to die this way IMO was directly aimed at someone. Strictly my interpretation based on the dogged persistence of JTF to berate anyone who carries an opinion that even suggests JY killed his wife.

RC,

I don't think Amanda Lamb's article has anything to do with CTV's "JTF". WRAL has a recurring section that is titled "Just The Facts", see below.


http://www.wral.com/apps/search/search/?qs=%22just+the+facts%22&jump=1&x=29&y=10


Cheers!

[raisincharlie]

RC,

I don't think Amanda Lamb's article has anything to do with CTV's "JTF". WRAL has a recurring section that is titled "Just The Facts", see below.


http://www.wral.com/apps/search/search/?qs=%22just+the+facts%22&jump=1&x=29&y=10


Cheers!
You could be right - I'm just not sure how Michelle Young's murder fits into columns mainly dealing with business concerns.

I think Scandi is correct, Ms. Lamb has figured out who JTF is and is tired of being accused of misreporting and slanting things. The autopsy tells the tale and just the facts. JMO

[raisincharlie]

Thanks RC. As always your opinions and interpretations seem to be very good and accurate. Thanks for filling me in. I'll just keep my head in the sand here at WS, the other places scare me. :p
:D they scare me as well...

[panthera]

If I recall correctly between 5 to 6 hours depending on route. The concern I have with a straight through drive however comes down to the mileage - given the hilly - semi mountainous terrain of western VA - I have doubts an Explorer could make it that far on a single tank -if it did it was certainly running on fumes. I truly want to know what time the gas was bought as well as how much gas was bought. JMO - it won't add up.

ETA - hope this works - the drive time estimated at just over 5 hours, mileage approximately 320 - advised route:

http://www.mapquest.com/directions/main.adp?go=1&do=nw&rmm=1&un=m&cl=EN&qq=m4ZeC4eEaUjB0vOlaUxfVT5f51Bpt4EJHn%252bKdy9%252 buhniWrMMPtEyQIcZh3zQYIMZqITWNnXrJHnnPqka8TWFW2Rli OZFq31%252f%252bNqe89msInEV5ss1VF4QdMEfwgIt3WI5%25 2bde%252bZwfA3FTLKvp4AWJyDNLKiJDtBur4MRSKZk50Pi3ug xOUxxdKTryfSfssHY8ka2S3bhetrDOL1pxURUbw1wpmcvn9iAM dvO4EJuKTcdsLxVnyqR%252bvkg%253d%253d&ct=NA&rsres=1&1y=US&1ffi=&1l=kWaydvEn2xNKn6mpUA%252b5sA%253d%253d&1g=roXBcdQnKnU9Ddf0OD9Zhw%253d%253d&1pl=&1v=ADDRESS&1n=&1pn=&1a=5108+Birchleaf+Dr&1c=Raleigh&1s=NC&1z=27606-9360&2y=US&2ffi=&2l=&2g=&2pl=&2v=&2n=&2pn=&2a=&2c=Duffield&2s=VA&2z=&panelbtn=2You're right, raisincharlie ~ that highway mpg estimation wouldn't apply to driving uphill on mountain roads. I seriously doubt it would make it without refueling.

[scandi]

Hi 'ya Big Fish LOL

I just think then that it is quite ironic that they have that section named Just The Facts and a poster at probably the main crime forum that discusses the case who has the agenda with his epistles like Charlie pointed out. I don't think she misses a post. They give her insight and info from the public which makes her a more studied crime reporter in this case. I bet she also has a good idea who this poster is as she is a very involved local.

[scandi]

You're right, raisincharlie ~ that highway mpg estimation wouldn't apply to driving uphill on mountain roads. I seriously doubt it would make it without refueling.


Panthera, could it be he had gas already in the car to where he didn't have to fill up right away?

[panthera]

Panthera, could it be he had gas already in the car to where he didn't have to fill up right away?That's another thing we don't know and why it's so hard to determine where he went based on the known fuel stops. There's a 22 gal. tank in that vehicle though and I was guessing based on the terrain.

[happy2bn10ec]

I would call the roads in that area more mountainous than semi-mountainous. We rode from here (as upper East TN as you can get without being in VA) to Fontana Village, which is very near Brevard, several years ago. Took us 5 1/2 hours, which doesn't have anything to do with it, but the roads are very curvy and very mountainous. We call them the "kiss your a** good-bye" kind of roads. You just have to decide if you call them that because the curves are so sharp you can literally kiss your a** going around them or if it's because you're gonna get killed on them! Both would apply.

So he probably used much more gas than under normal driving conditions.

[panthera]

I would call the roads in that area more mountainous than semi-mountainous. We rode from here (as upper East TN as you can get without being in VA) to Fontana Village, which is very near Brevard, several years ago. Took us 5 1/2 hours, which doesn't have anything to do with it, but the roads are very curvy and very mountainous. We call them the "kiss your a** good-bye" kind of roads. You just have to decide if you call them that because the curves are so sharp you can literally kiss your a** going around them or if it's because you're gonna get killed on them! Both would apply.

So he probably used much more gas than under normal driving conditions.Good example! And just what I was thinking about the mpg statistics. :D

[Taximom]

I watched a crime documentary last night about the case of Ronald Gillette who killed his wife and apparently got away with it in the 80's. I haven't been able to find anything about except for a blurb at CTV.
http://www.crimelibrary.com/criminal_mind/forensics/fingerprints/6.html

I bring this case up because of something Ron Gillette did after he murdered his wife. Briefly, he crushed up a bunch of sleeping pills and put them in her drink. A few hours later when he found it didn't work, he suffocated her w/a black plastic garbage bag while she was still in bed. He turned the bag inside out, stuffed it with clothes and put the bag next to her on the bed so it would look like an accident. (that's pretty dumb, isn't it?!)

ANYWAY, what he did next horrified me. He brought their 3 yr old son in and had him sleep on the bed with his wife. It was like 3 or 4 a.m. at that point. They said that the boy did not see his mom dead, but is that what the father/husband wanted???

I only caught bits of it so I don't know where the husband was supposed to be, but just the thought of putting your sweet little boy next to his dead mother started me thinking about JY.

These types of people are evil and don't care about anyone but themselves.

[concernedperson]

FYI, The Lineup With Kimberly Guilfoyle will highlight Michelle's murder tonight at 10 PM (Saturday 1-27) on Fox.

[close_enough]

I watched a crime documentary last night about the case of Ronald Gillette who killed his wife and apparently got away with it in the 80's. I haven't been able to find anything about except for a blurb at CTV.
http://www.crimelibrary.com/criminal_mind/forensics/fingerprints/6.html

I bring this case up because of something Ron Gillette did after he murdered his wife. Briefly, he crushed up a bunch of sleeping pills and put them in her drink. A few hours later when he found it didn't work, he suffocated her w/a black plastic garbage bag while she was still in bed. He turned the bag inside out, stuffed it with clothes and put the bag next to her on the bed so it would look like an accident. (that's pretty dumb, isn't it?!)

ANYWAY, what he did next horrified me. He brought their 3 yr old son in and had him sleep on the bed with his wife. It was like 3 or 4 a.m. at that point. They said that the boy did not see his mom dead, but is that what the father/husband wanted???

I only caught bits of it so I don't know where the husband was supposed to be, but just the thought of putting your sweet little boy next to his dead mother started me thinking about JY.

These types of people are evil and don't care about anyone but themselves.

i watched that also!!.... :furious:

not sure where the POS was suppose to be, but it was said that he probably put the child in the bed to make it look more normal..(or something like that?)...maybe the child had a habit of getting up & getting in the bed with her/them???.....just unbelievable how evil some folks are...

[close_enough]

FYI, The Lineup With Kimberly Guilfoyle will highlight Michelle's murder tonight at 10 PM (Saturday 1-27) on Fox.

well, i missed it...hmm, going to assume there was nothing new to report since there are no posts relating to it?

[Taximom]

I think she had a long-time coroner or investigator on that reviewed the autopsy report, as well as a psychologist or psychiatrist. I don't recall hearing anything that we haven't already discussed here. Both seemed to imply the husband did it without actually saying it. :winkwink: Lots of rage, etc. Inner turmoil on the part of the killer. They had a revolving 3-d animated image of her head w/injuries in one corner of the tv screen for some time. I think the coroner said that in his many years this was one of the most violent attacks he's seen. (I hate to say this, but surely he's seen more like this in his 20+ years on the job?)

Kim mentioned something about it being an awful lot like the Laci Peterson case. Yep.

I wish they would read here and ask the hard questions we keep asking about this case.

[Samiya]

well, i missed it...hmm, going to assume there was nothing new to report since there are no posts relating to it?Hi Close,

The magazine arrived last week....thanks honey :)

:eek: I just read about the Montana boy found in a septic tank. Poor little angel. That has tears in my eyes :( I won't post the link it's devastating :( :(

Sami

[Taximom]

Hi Sami. Just a quick thanks for your autopsy notes in this case. Very helpful! :blowkiss:

[Samiya]

Hi Sami. Just a quick thanks for your autopsy notes in this case. Very helpful! :blowkiss:Thanks :)

I have written alot more than what I posted but as it is extremely graphic I won't post it, I may add bits and pieces later on.

I finally ordered Austar but have to wait until the 8th of Feb before they'll connect it..I'm going to harass them to see if they can do it before then.

I would've liked to have been able to see the 3d image as it would've helped me alot more. Did the 3d image happen to show where the teeth were avulsed? I can certainly agree with the 5 to 15 minute attack and would lean more to 10 to 15 due to the amount of injuries. I do believe that Michelle was pleading and screaming, at least once or twice, and crying/sobbing until she was unconcious.

Hopefully Kimberly will have it up on her site so I can see it.

We need a bouquet of roses emoticon here!

**Roses for Chelle** and I'm off to light another candle for her on the candles site. The majority of the time mine is the only candle burning but it's lit on behalf of all of us here at Websleuths.

Next weekend, I'm going to organise an online candle vigil and hope everyone here joins in.

Sami

[Taximom]

Thanks :)

I have written alot more than what I posted but as it is extremely graphic I won't post it, I may add bits and pieces later on.

I finally ordered Austar but have to wait until the 8th of Feb before they'll connect it..I'm going to harass them to see if they can do it before then.

I would've liked to have been able to see the 3d image as it would've helped me alot more. Did the 3d image happen to show where the teeth were avulsed? I can certainly agree with the 5 to 15 minute attack and would lean more to 10 to 15 due to the amount of injuries. I do believe that Michelle was pleading and screaming, at least once or twice, and crying/sobbing until she was unconcious.

Hopefully Kimberly will have it up on her site so I can see it.

We need a bouquet of roses emoticon here!

**Roses for Chelle** and I'm off to light another candle for her on the candles site. The majority of the time mine is the only candle burning but it's lit on behalf of all of us here at Websleuths.

Next weekend, I'm going to organise an online candle vigil and hope everyone here joins in.

Sami
Hi Sami,

The autopsy report I viewed did not show any missing teeth, nor did Kim's 3-D diagram. I was disappointed by that as it might have helped a little more with the direction of the blunt force that caused the avulsion of her teeth. :( Just the thought. UGH.

I lit a candle for Laci during that investigation. I'll gladly join in on the vigil you arrange.

Roses for Michelle:
http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/12_3_49.gif (http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb001_ZNxdm824YYUS) http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/12_3_49.gif (http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb001_ZNxdm824YYUS) http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/12_3_49.gif (http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb001_ZNxdm824YYUS) http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/12_3_49.gif (http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb001_ZNxdm824YYUS)

[Samiya]

Hi Sami,

The autopsy report I viewed did not show any missing teeth, nor did Kim's 3-D diagram. I was disappointed by that as it might have helped a little more with the direction of the blunt force that caused the avulsion of her teeth. :( Just the thought. UGH.

I lit a candle for Laci during that investigation. I'll gladly join in on the vigil you arrange.

Roses for Michelle:
http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/12_3_49.gif http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/12_3_49.gif http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/12_3_49.gif http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/12_3_49.gifThanks hon,

The AR I have also doesn't show the placement of avulsed teeth, but I was hoping that the 3d image on Kim's show might have. Even a report of how many were avulsed would've helped and that info maybe in the investigative AR, which we wouldn't be seeing for a while yet.

Sami

[nanandjim]

I noticed that as well. Scary, the baby right across the hallway.
On Kimberly Guilfoyle's show last night, an expert said that this violent struggle could have gone on for a while, like 10-15 minutes or longer. I would think that the baby would be awakened by all this noise. I imagine that Jason closed the baby's door before entering the master bedroom. So, that would have buffered some of the noise. Also, perhaps, there was a "noise" machine in the baby's room which would drown out some of the sound.

However, if the dog were in the baby's room, I would think that it would sense or hear the struggle and begin to bark, awakening the baby.

Would Jason have had the foresight to put the dog in the basement, if there is a basement in the house?

[jilly]

The 3D image last nite on The Lineup, was of the head only and copied exactly what was on the AR diagram so we learned nothing more.

And I agree, there was nothing other than the 5-15 min statement that was new.

I'm just grateful that Kimberly is keeping this in the national news.

I read a lot at CTV yesterday. I think it's absolutely disgusting that JTF is trying to pin this on Meredith. I listened to some of the 911 tape last nite and from the very beginning Meredith certainly sounds distressed to me. I think she did a better job than I ever could with holding herself together. Even at the press LFs press conference you can see that Meredith is struggling to keep it together as well.

You can tell where this is going to go if it ever gets to trial! :furious:

[AlwaysShocked]

I do NOT agree that this type of an attack would take 15 minutes or even 5 minutes. Now think about it.....someone is placing their hands around the neck of another and squeezing. How long would that last? 30 seconds? One minute? Two minutes at most? Remember, she did not die from strangulation.

The person being attacked is fighting back. The attacker lets go of her neck and she falls to the floor face down. The attacker grabs something laying closeby or perhaps in his pocket- a maglite probably, but perhaps another object.

The attacker immediately begins beating the back of her head. Swings the object one, two, three, four, five, six, seven........ times. All of this would not take long AT ALL!

[Taximom]

The 3D image last nite on The Lineup, was of the head only and copied exactly what was on the AR diagram so we learned nothing more.

And I agree, there was nothing other than the 5-15 min statement that was new.

I'm just grateful that Kimberly is keeping this in the national news.

I read a lot at CTV yesterday. I think it's absolutely disgusting that JTF is trying to pin this on Meredith. I listened to some of the 911 tape last nite and from the very beginning Meredith certainly sounds distressed to me. I think she did a better job than I ever could with holding herself together. Even at the press LFs press conference you can see that Meredith is struggling to keep it together as well.

You can tell where this is going to go if it ever gets to trial! :furious:
I'm not up to speed on exactly what motive (according to CTV) Meredith might have to brutally murder her pregnant sister, but I will wholeheartedly disagree anyway! I've said this before that the odds of a cheating husband killing his pregnant wife beat the odds that MY's sister had anything to do with this.

Besides that, LE says JY is the one that isn't exactly cooperating here.

I'm thankful Kimberly G is keeping this in the news too. I'm really surprised Nancy G hasn't picked up on it, though I guess that's a blessing in itself. I don't know if I could handle listening to them discuss a single point about this case for an entire hour!

[otto]

I do NOT agree that this type of an attack would take 15 minutes or even 5 minutes. Now think about it.....someone is placing their hands around the neck of another and squeezing. How long would that last? 30 seconds? One minute? Two minutes at most? Remember, she did not die from strangulation.

The person being attacked is fighting back. The attacker lets go of her neck and she falls to the floor face down. The attacker grabs something laying closeby or perhaps in his pocket- a maglite probably, but perhaps another object.

The attacker immediately begins beating the back of her head. Swings the object one, two, three, four, five, six, seven........ times. All of this would not take long AT ALL!

I'm with you on this one. I don't see how it could take more than about 5 minutes from the initial attack, attempt to strangle, change plan to beating, hitting 10 - 20 times and then it's all over.

[nanandjim]

I do NOT agree that this type of an attack would take 15 minutes or even 5 minutes. Now think about it.....someone is placing their hands around the neck of another and squeezing. How long would that last? 30 seconds? One minute? Two minutes at most? Remember, she did not die from strangulation.

The person being attacked is fighting back. The attacker lets go of her neck and she falls to the floor face down. The attacker grabs something laying closeby or perhaps in his pocket- a maglite probably, but perhaps another object.

The attacker immediately begins beating the back of her head. Swings the object one, two, three, four, five, six, seven........ times. All of this would not take long AT ALL!
I can see the struggle lasting at least five minutes if Michelle was fighting back, which by all indications she was.

Also, I believe I read in the warrant information that the weapon used was gathered as evidence. So, it must have been something left behind, which is a good thing.

[panthera]

The 3D image last nite on The Lineup, was of the head only and copied exactly what was on the AR diagram so we learned nothing more.

And I agree, there was nothing other than the 5-15 min statement that was new.

I'm just grateful that Kimberly is keeping this in the national news.

I read a lot at CTV yesterday. I think it's absolutely disgusting that JTF is trying to pin this on Meredith. I listened to some of the 911 tape last nite and from the very beginning Meredith certainly sounds distressed to me. I think she did a better job than I ever could with holding herself together. Even at the press LFs press conference you can see that Meredith is struggling to keep it together as well.

You can tell where this is going to go if it ever gets to trial! :furious:I saw the Lineup last night also and am very pleased to see the FNC continue their coverage of Michelle's case. I didn't expect there to be anything new that we haven't discussed since the program is only on the weekend. About someone suggesting that Michelle's sister either committed this heinous murder or was somehow involved, is absolutely appalling. Shame on them. :furious:

[panthera]

I'm with you on this one. I don't see how it could take more than about 5 minutes from the initial attack, attempt to strangle, change plan to beating, hitting 10 - 20 times and then it's all over.I also agree. It always seems like it would take longer because of the violent nature of the murder, but it actually could be carried out very quickly by someone in such a rage as this killer was. :mad:

[jilly]

About someone suggesting that Michelle's sister either committed this heinous murder or was somehow involved, is absolutely appalling. Shame on them. :furious:

I agree. Somewhat cryptic posts but referring to M&JY changing Cassidy's guardianship from Meredith to JYs sister and some "jewellry dispute" between the sisters telling us to "look for the answer in New York".

Like I said, if JY is the killer and this goes to trial, I think it's going to get ugly for MF. :(

OK!! let's hope for some news this week!!!

[nanandjim]

No one will believe the sister did it. This is a ridiculous and desperate red herring to divert attention away from the real killer.

[panthera]

I agree. Somewhat cryptic posts but referring to M&JY changing Cassidy's guardianship from Meredith to JYs sister and some "jewellry dispute" between the sisters telling us to "look for the answer in New York".

Like I said, if JY is the killer and this goes to trial, I think it's going to get ugly for MF. :(

OK!! let's hope for some news this week!!!And if it does "get ugly" let's hope we have twelve sane jurors on that panel, because let's not forget that Jason called Meredith and asked her to go pick up the fax/printout.

[jilly]

No one will believe the sister did it. This is a ridiculous and desperate red herring to divert attention away from the real killer.

I agree. They were even criticizing at Great length her reaction on the 911 call - the fact that she wanted Cassidy to go into her room when MF didn't know if the murderer was still there. Doesn't mention the fact though that Cassidy was wandering around that house for several hours.

It was absolutely horrible.

[jilly]

And if it does "get ugly" let's hope we have twelve sane jurors on that panel, because let's not forget that Jason called Meredith and asked her to go pick up the fax/printout.

Exactly but of course this particular poster doesn't want to discuss that or the autopsy. Just seems hell bent on pointing the finger at MF - I mean real hostility towards her.

[SeriouslySearching]

My money would have to be on the husband in this case, providing they don't come up with a lover on her side *and yes, she could have found out about his affair and had her own who could be included in this scenerio. (This to me is ONE of her lovers...past or present, but the motive is still about the same. The crime IMPO is too horrific for one of her family members to leave the daughter behind, but for a lover/husband to be seen as part of the problem.)

It was very personal, had the rage, and she was pregnant...making the stats go even higher in favor of the husband. Not saying in every case the stats gel...I am sure there are exceptions...but it is certainly reminiscent of several other cases in the past few years. Men become very passionate about the new 'love' in their life which transfers into much rage from the evil one, in their view, keeping them from all this happiness and newfound freedom they are currently enjoying then add to that a child present and another coming with more of an obstruction. I am just speculating, but have seen nothing which really makes me lean towards anyone or anything else.

[panthera]

Exactly but of course this particular poster doesn't want to discuss that or the autopsy. Just seems hell bent on pointing the finger at MF - I mean real hostility towards her.I rarely pay attention to CTV for that reason. I like it here instead! :)

[panthera]

It was very personal, had the rage, and she was pregnant...making the stats go even higher in favor of the husband. Not saying in every case the stats gel...I am sure there are exceptions...but it is certainly reminiscent of several other cases in the past few years. Men become very passionate about the new 'love' in their life which transfers into much rage from the evil one, in their view, keeping them from all this happiness and newfound freedom they are currently enjoying then add to that a child present and another coming with more of an obstruction. I am just speculating, but have seen nothing which really makes me lean towards anyone or anything else.I also think he's the one who killed her since there is so much personal rage directed at her and we know it's not a burglar. Since it's believed that Laci may have been strangled, I think it's possible why Jason attempted to strangle Michelle, but when he didn't succeed it made him even angrier.

[strach304]

Another possibility I haven't seen posted imo that would fit since I think a man did this is the husband or lover of someone Jason was fooling with. Remember the case in Florida where the husband and wife were killed but not the baby and they thought the baby dialed 911? If the woman involved was afraid he found out and was gonna do something she may have alerted Jason who made up a phoney reason to have Meredith go to the house when he couldn't get Michele on the phone to check on her. Possibly SM but then again if Jason was seeing other women there are possibilities there too. Would explain also why LE is saying publicly he isn't cooperating and his exact location with Cassidy isn't known. Someone like SM would be known to Michele and she might have let him. The exact crime scene and forensics are not known to us.

If that isn't it my best guess is Jason fighting with Michele because she learned of the affair and then there was a fight that turned into a rage for him. From what little is known so far that is. I keep thinking about so many of the most violent killings of women and children that have been beat to death in a similar manner and keep coming up with random killers.

[Samiya]

As we have no idea of what the crime scene looks like, it's impossible to tell how long the attack went for.

The perp may have been holding her down yelling at her for god knows how long. 'He' may have paused sometime during the attack then thought to give her more to make sure she was out of the picture. It is not unheard of where a perp has thought the victim to be dead, then the victim moves slightly (or goes into death throes, yes bodies do spasm) and they panic thinking they are still alive and begin attacking again....so 10 to 15 minutes is not impossible, unfortunately.

Someone who begins strangling a person will almost always finish 'the job' unless the victim is able to fully escape the situation or is extremely 'lucky'. And if a perp is unsuccessful at the strangulation, they then tend to bludgeon or knife their victims repeatedly. Once a person begins to murder someone by strangulation, it's not as though they can fail and think to themselves "oh well, that didn't work, I'll do it another time".

Sometimes that 'rage' is actually directed at themselves as they see themselves as a failure, not being able to complete a 'simple' task as strangling someone. That rage then turns outward at the victim and the result is often 'overkill'.

Sami

[raisincharlie]

As we have no idea of what the crime scene looks like, it's impossible to tell how long the attack went for.

The perp may have been holding her down yelling at her for god knows how long. 'He' may have paused sometime during the attack t