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View Full Version : CA CA - Sugar Pine Point, WhtFem (692UFCA), 35-45, Ring: "To Mac From PNB", Sep'79



teonspaleprincess
03-12-2007, 08:45 PM
http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/692ufca.html

This seems solvable to me

JrZyChris
03-12-2007, 10:29 PM
http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/692ufca.html

This seems solvable to me
Yea, with the engraving on the ring, etc. I guess certain cases from the past could only be pursued so much before they ran cold. With the internet and technology today, I'll be a lot of old cases could be solved if someone had the time to dedicate doing all of the research.

bizzie
03-27-2007, 12:59 PM
I just don't know enough about this websleuthing I guess. I was thinking that maybe 'Mac' was a mistake... and I found a DonaMae Bayerl who was 38 who went missing in 1979 from Wisconsin. Maybe the ring actually said 'To Mae from PNB'. But I don't know how to search further.... I can't find any information on DonaMae to see if she was ever married to someone with the initials PNB. ( I know, it's a longshot)

Are there tricks to sleuthing?

jodierenee
03-27-2007, 03:30 PM
i always search http://theyaremissed.org and http://missingkids.com
because you can search by many different variables.

Next, I go to the state's missing persons' clearinghouse and search through there. Some state's sites are better than others, and sadly, some state's don't have a clearinghouse at all. Texas has an extensive one, but you can only search by last name and there is no way to filter it out anymore, which REALLY bugs me. I like to seach neighboring states too, in case they crossed state lines.

If I still don't see anything that catches my eye there, then I head on to the doe network and NAMPN websites and search by timeline.

Sadly though, you can do all the searching you want, but if the person hasn't been reported missing, it's hopeless.

mayqueen
04-28-2012, 12:57 PM
This article is 13 years old, but contains details not found on DoeNet.

Twenty years later, murder victim remains unknown (http://www.lasvegassun.com/news/1999/jul/21/twenty-years-later-murder-victim-remains-unknown/)


Detective Don Atkinson said an autopsy of the woman's body revealed she died from asphyxiation and brain hemorrhaging. From tracks it appeared that the woman was chased and then her body dragged about 100 yards into the brush. She was found sprawled on her stomach, her features unrecognizable after the savage beating.

She was wearing blue jeans and a lavender pullover T-shirt. Wooden-soled sandals were found in the area. Her attacker had no interest in her jewelry. She was left with several rings, a watch, bracelet, necklace and her wedding band. The inscription inside read "To Mack from PNB."

I wish we could see a photo of the ring, because I've seen the inscription noted three ways now:


To MAC from PNB
To Mac from PNB
To Mack from PNB


This is definitely solvable... I think it just needs more exposure? Someone who loves and is missing this woman would instantly recognize the inscription on the ring, I think.

PS the peeps who found her sound a bit sketchy... hope they were thoroughly investigated and cleared.

deca
04-28-2012, 04:54 PM
JMO
It seems most likely if you were going to inscribe a ring it would be the same for both sets.
I mean:
From Joe to Jane
From JS to JJ
From Joe Smith to Jane Jones

So I would guess it was
From MAC to PNB.
But, was this a wedding ring? Because I wouldn't imagine you would use initials like that. It could be a friendship ring or promise ring...

rcoope23
04-29-2012, 05:22 AM
What about Patricia Barrett. Her initials could match the inscription https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/12310/449?current_page=circumstances

Irish_Eyes
04-29-2012, 02:43 PM
Yes it could. Interesting.

CarlK90245
04-29-2012, 02:53 PM
What about Patricia Barrett. Her initials could match the inscription https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/12310/449?current_page=circumstances

Her middle initial is "A" for Ann, so PNB would not be her initials.

But she does fit pretty closely to the physical description and the timeline.

Hope32
04-29-2012, 05:30 PM
Maybe the middle letter is a nickname?

CarlK90245
04-29-2012, 06:28 PM
My thinking (though it might not be accurate) is that if she is wearing the ring, she would be "Mac" (the recipient), not PNB (the giver of the ring).

Mac isn't normally a woman's name, unless it is her initials "MAC".

ginestra
04-29-2012, 06:37 PM
Priscilla Anne Blevins
Missing since January 1, 1975 from Charlotte, Mecklenburg County, North Carolina.
?

ginestra
04-29-2012, 06:53 PM
Oh, oops. I did it too, picked a middle initial A.........

Irish_Eyes
04-29-2012, 07:03 PM
What about Madeline Babcock? No idea on a middle initial, or if she could have had a maiden name beginning with C. Maybe we can try to use Ancestry to find out.

https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/7003/306/

Madeline was LKA living in California
Madeline disappeared in 68, long prior, but her disappearance could well have been voluntary.

Here is Madeline:

https://www.findthemissing.org/en/photos/thumb/15105http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/images/692UFCA.jpg

Irish_Eyes
04-29-2012, 07:21 PM
Charley project lists her maiden and previous married names, and none of them are "C"
s... :((( Her middle name is A though...so unless there is any chance that MAC was actually MAP or MAL, I don't think this is her...:(

Jubble
04-29-2012, 08:01 PM
I was trying to think of M names that shorten nicknames that start with a different letter, so they may be on Charley or Doe under the nickname, for example:

Michelle = Shelly
Margaret = Peggy, Peg
Melissa = Lissa, Lisa
Melinda = Linda

deca
04-29-2012, 08:02 PM
If it is really to Mac from PNB, Mac could be an affectionate nickname short for a last name like MacBean, MacDowell, etc.

deca
04-29-2012, 08:15 PM
https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/11585/8/

Margarita MacNeill? Missing in 76, a little young- she would have been 30. But LKA in CA, height and weight are good, hair color good. Her pic is so grainy, though...

ginestra
04-30-2012, 10:03 AM
the initials match, but not the race. Seems she did have scar and a pendant. http://www.nampn.org/cases/collins_melissa.html

deca
05-01-2012, 11:41 AM
Not many people go to state parks by themselves. So I am guessing she was with a husband or boyfriend and he was her killer. Perhaps she hasn't even been reported- it is the typical "she left me" scenario that we see all the time around here. But her age is young enough that I would think she would have parents or siblings alive to question a disappearance. She might even have had kids...

I wonder what the other rings looked like and where all the rings were placed. It is entirely possible that this "wedding ring" was an heirloom ring (from a grandparents marriage or something) that she wore out of sentimental reasons. Wearing it on a different finger would suggest that and stop us from continuing to explore the MAC stuff.

I am going to go look around for Lake Tahoe missing persons. I remember there was a nurse or something that went missing around 1980 or so.
Just thinking aloud folks...

EDIT: So the woman I was thinking of went missing in 1970. So I am off by ten years or so. But I stumbled across discussion of this Doe in another thread about Toliver or Tolliver, a man who scammed and killed women (including his wife, allegedly) during this time frame and area.

deirdre1230
05-01-2012, 07:43 PM
Hi all:
This is my first post after hanging around for a few months studying some cases and learning about sleuthing. I have been amazed at the remarkable, kind, and dedicated people here. I only hope I can eventually make a meaningful contribution, especially in Ohio, where I live.

Getting back on topic, here is my admittedly "quirky" idea: I don't think the initials on the ring are conventional names at all. I think they are nicknames, based on each person's favorite comfort food: she is "Mac" for mac & cheese; he is "PNB" for peanut butter & jelly. Even if this is not entirely correct, I think that the ring initials may be more of a hindrance than a help: unless they are being strictly formal, people might engrave all kinds of unique personal things on jewelry. So I think we should look beyond matching names to the engraving.

CherBearSTL
05-01-2012, 09:31 PM
Hi all:
This is my first post after hanging around for a few months studying some cases and learning about sleuthing. I have been amazed at the remarkable, kind, and dedicated people here. I only hope I can eventually make a meaningful contribution, especially in Ohio, where I live.

Getting back on topic, here is my admittedly "quirky" idea: I don't think the initials on the ring are conventional names at all. I think they are nicknames, based on each person's favorite comfort food: she is "Mac" for mac & cheese; he is "PNB" for peanut butter & jelly. Even if this is not entirely correct, I think that the ring initials may be more of a hindrance than a help: unless they are being strictly formal, people might engrave all kinds of unique personal things on jewelry. So I think we should look beyond matching names to the engraving.

Good point. For example...Mac could stand for McKenzie as a first name or McIntire, McDaniel, McMahon, etc as a last name. My mom had a Mc name as her maiden name, and everyone called her and her brothers "Mac." But, could it be M.A.C. instead of Mac? We haven't seen the engraving.

Sent from my myTouch_4G_Slide using Tapatalk 2

JeannieC
05-01-2012, 10:28 PM
First name Mackenzie or Mackinzie

deca
05-02-2012, 10:50 AM
Hi all:
This is my first post after hanging around for a few months studying some cases and learning about sleuthing. I have been amazed at the remarkable, kind, and dedicated people here. I only hope I can eventually make a meaningful contribution, especially in Ohio, where I live.

Getting back on topic, here is my admittedly "quirky" idea: I don't think the initials on the ring are conventional names at all. I think they are nicknames, based on each person's favorite comfort food: she is "Mac" for mac & cheese; he is "PNB" for peanut butter & jelly. Even if this is not entirely correct, I think that the ring initials may be more of a hindrance than a help: unless they are being strictly formal, people might engrave all kinds of unique personal things on jewelry. So I think we should look beyond matching names to the engraving.

:welcome:


I think you have a good point- we should not get too caught up in the initials.

Just Pat 22
05-03-2012, 08:11 AM
Charley project lists her maiden and previous married names, and none of them are "C"
s... :((( Her middle name is A though...so unless there is any chance that MAC was actually MAP or MAL, I don't think this is her...:(

Madeline Anna Pouliot was my sisters Maiden name She was Married to Harold B. Larcome and to the possible perp in her dissaperence Larry Ray Babcock . Madeline was 4 ft 11 inches tall extreme high forhead . Information giving from Pat Foy Madelines sister . MAP was her initials Looking at the pictures I do not see that it is Madeline .

kemo
05-02-2013, 01:39 AM
http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/692ufca.html

This Jane Doe was a homicide victim that was murdered a day before she was found near the shore of Lake Tahoe. She does not fit the profile of most missing women:teen runaway/drug user/transient/marginal type. She was 35-45, dressed and groomed like a middle class vacationer and she was wearing a wedding ring. Nobody who could be her disappered around that time.

Two months earlier, in a town 100 miles away, a woman who appears very close in appearance, disappeared. http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/w/wulff_dolores.html

She was in a troubled marriage and the husband was always the focus of the investigation. He claimed she just "took off". He was eventually charged with her murder but the case was thrown out. Is it possible that Dolores did "take a little break" from her marriage and was hanging out at Tahoe or Reno, and then met with fowl play later?

ginestra
02-18-2014, 07:07 PM
Found this lady, searching under Mae.........
http://doenetwork.org/cases/977dfca.html


Mae W. Gebhard
Missing since February 24, 1981 from San Francisco, California
Classification: Missing
Vital Statistics

Date Of Birth: May 15, 1915
Age at Time of Disappearance: 65 years old
Height and Weight at Time of Disappearance: 5'3; 104 lbs.
Distinguishing Characteristics: White female. Gray hair; brown eyes.
Dentals: Available
Circumstances of Disappearance
Gebhard was last seen in San Francisco, California on February 24, 1981[QUOTE]

The date is a little off, but the height, eyes, weight are within range.

Redwood146
02-19-2014, 02:01 AM
My thinking (though it might not be accurate) is that if she is wearing the ring, she would be "Mac" (the recipient), not PNB (the giver of the ring).

Mac isn't normally a woman's name, unless it is her initials "MAC".

I am of Mackenzie descend and many older women in the family had Mackenzie has their middle name to keep it in the family so to speak. For instance my aunty aged 88 has a really standard first name and then she has Mackenzie for her middle name yet,it is not something that would spring to mind readily. By the way my Mackenzie line has not lived in Scotland for several generations yet the tradition continues.

Redwood146
02-19-2014, 02:38 AM
I have just read that a pendant resembling a deer was found with her. Deer have a significant and symbolic place in Scottish folklore and the Mackenzie family crest can show a deer with antlers. Link ( hopefully)
http://www.google.co.nz/search?q=mackenzie+crest+deer+antlets&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&gws_rd=cr&ei=J1AEU4vpEIXNkgW5uIHoBQ

Could this woman initially come from Scotland?

Harmony2
02-28-2014, 04:22 PM
Margarita MacNeill
•Missing Since: February 07, 1976 from Salinas, Monterey County, California
•Classification: Missing
•Age: 27
•Height: 5'2"
•Weight: 125 lbs.
•Hair Color: Light brown
•Eye Color: Brown
•Race: Hispanic
•Gender: Female
•Case Number: 94-061877

http://www.nampn.org/cases/macneill_margarita.html

The unidentified woman: http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/images/692UFCA.jpg Margarita: http://www.charleyproject.org/images/m/macneil_margarita3.jpg http://www.charleyproject.org/images/m/macneil_margarita4.jpg http://www.charleyproject.org/images/m/macneil_margarita2.jpg link (http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/m/macneil_margarita.html)

Harmony2
02-28-2014, 04:51 PM
more information on the jewelry found:

Jewelry Timex wristwatch with leather band
yellow metal ring with balk scroll circumfrentially inside "to MAC rom PNB"
yellow metal two strand chain braclet
white metal ring with floral setting with clear square stone
white metal ring with round green stone
yellow metal chain necklace with yellow metal deer pendant

https://identifyus.org/en/cases/full_report/11922