The Doe Network, Part 3: Who is Princess Blue?

[LionRun]

For convenience here are the links to parts one and two.

Part 1
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=48232&highlight=doe+network

Part 2
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=48762&page=15

[Sable]

http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w137/LionRun/PrincessBlue1.jpgThese are both sketches of Princess Blue. Please note that no one knows her what her hair color, eye color, or skin tone was. Focusing on her facial structure and imagining her with any hair color, eye color, and skin tone may help bring back memories of who she was. Princess Blue may have been White (aka Caucasian) with the possibility of mixed race ancestry.


http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w137/LionRun/PrincessBlueupdatedpic.jpg

This is part two of a thread called, The Doe Network" at http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=48232

The Doe Network:
Case File 137UFTX

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/images/137UFTX.jpg Please Note: She is now being described as, "White" on the TX dps site. This has recently been changed. It is a possibility that she was White with the possibility of mixed race ancestry.
Victim's Ring
Unidentified White / Hispanic Female


The victim was discovered on September 10, 1990 in Brazoria County, Texas.
Estimated Date of Death: 6 months - 1 year
Vital Statistics


Estimated age: 16 - 22 years old
Approximate Height and Weight: 4'10" - 5'2"
Distinguishing Characteristics: The victim possibly had a tumor on her knee.
Dentals: Dental information available
DNA: IN CODIS
Jewelry: A gold band with 6 clear stones, 2 thin silver bands, a silver band with a scroll design, a Robert E. Lee High School ring (1975), a silver ring with a turquoise unicorn and a pearl-beaded bracelet.http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/images/137UFTX1.jpg http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/images/137UFTX2.jpg
Victim's Rings
Case History
The victim was located on a pile of debris at the end of a Brazoria County road on September 10, 1990
The skeleton was found by an Alvin man who had pulled off the highway to find a place to urinate. He stepped behind a barricade and saw a skull in an old tire.
Authorities beleive the rings are the clue to solving the case. Three rings were on the skeleton's fingers. One was silver with a scroll design, another had a turquoise unicorn on it. But investigators think the 1975 Lee High School ring probably has the best chance of leading to her identity. A jeweler told investigators the ring was a size 9 1/2 and had been resized twice. The person it fit was probably about 175 pounds. She would have been far too young for the 1975 class ring to be hers. It could have been given to her by an aunt, an older sister, by anybody.
The company that made Lee High School's rings doesn't have records from 1975. The Lee class of 1975 probably had about 150 girls. Authorities would like to hear from any of the girls who lost a ring or gave it to somebody else. An ornate "L" inlaid in the blue stone could have stood for the owner's last name or for Lee High School.
No traces of drugs were found in the bone marrow.

Manvel, Texas
Manvel Police Department
POC: Jay Coffman - 281-489-1212
Saturday, September 2, 2006




Ring is top clue in cold case

Teens Remains were found along Brazoria County road in 1990


By: Richard Stewart (richard.stewart@chron.com), Houston Chronicle



ANGLETON, TEXAS - A well-worn ring from the 1975 class of Houston's Robert E. Lee High School is the main evidence police have to try to unravel a 16-year-old mystery. It was found on the finger of a skeleton at the end of a Brazoria County road in 1990.



"It's not much to go on," said Manvel police Detective Jay Coffman, "but it's about all we've got."



In the nine years since the remains were found, investigators have not been able to tell what happened to the female victim, how she got to be on a pile of debris or, more importantly, who she was.



"Somebody's missing this girl," Coffman said, holding the ring. Somebody is missing the ring, too, he said, because he doubts it originally belonged to the victim.



A medical examiner's report estimated that the skeleton found on September 10, 1990, was that of a girl about 17 years old, plus or minus two years, Coffman said. She would have been far too young for the 1975 class ring to be hers.

(Please Note: Princess Blue's time of death has recently been changed from between 6 months to 1 year prior to being found on September 10th, 1990 to, "Unknown." Therefore, it is possible that the ring did originally belong to her. I am currently trying to work this possibility out with the fact that it was reported that bone marrow was taken from at least one of her bones for drug testing. I don't know how there would have been viable bone marrow left in 1990 if she had been killed years before in the mid 70's. Please look for updated information on this in future posts).



"It could have been given to her by an aunt, an older sisters, by anybody," Coffman said.



Richard Rosser, an investigator with the Brazoria County Sheriff's Department, is working with Coffman to solve the mystery.



"Back then, Brazoria County was a dumping ground for bodies of people killed in Houston," Rosser said. "It seemed like we had at least one a month."



The skeleton was found by an Alvin man who had pulled off the highway to find a place to urinate. He told investigators that he stepped behind a barricade and saw a skull in an old tire.



Investigators have no clues as to how she died. No traces of drugs were found in the bone marrow. Medical examiners estimated she had been dead six months to a year.



The victim was about 5 feet tall, plus or minus 2 inches. Medical examiners said the skeleton was probably that of a Hispanic female.



Investigators looked at dozens of different reports of missing teenage girls, but none seemed to match the skeleton.



Three rings were on the skeleton's fingers. One was silver with a scroll design, another had a turquoise unicorn on it. But investigators think the 1975 Lee High School ring probably has the best chance of leading to her identity.



A jeweler recently told investigators the ring was a size 91/2 and had been resized twice. The person it fit was probably about 175 pounds. [Please Note: The TX dps site has changed her weight to, "unknown". A forensic pathologist was not used to help determine her weight. Going by just the ring size would not necessarily be accurate]



An ornate "L" inlaid in the blue stone could have stood for the owner's last name or for Lee High School. The company that made Lee High School's rings doesn't have records from 1975, Rosser said.



The Lee class of 1975 probably had about 150 girls, Rosser said. He would like to hear from any of them who lost a ring or gave it to somebody else. The skeleton is now at the University of North Texas Health Science Center at Forth Worth. That facility operates the Texas Missing Persons DNA Database, which, in turn, feeds information about missing persons to the Combined DNA Index System (CODIS), operated by the Federal Bureau of Investigation.



If investigators get new leads, they can try to test the DNA of relatives to identify her.



"We would at least have a name," Coffman said.



Anyone with information about this case can contact Manvel Police Detective Jay Coffman at 281-489-1212 or e-mail him at jcoffman@manvelpd.org.

[LionRun]

Sloane, please check your PM's--they are runningith overith lol.

Lion

[LionRun]

Sable you are quick! Thank you so much for copying the info. I too thought the thread was long, so I hope it is okay with everyone that I started a new one. I sent PM's to the core group members and gave them a link.

I couldn't include one for sloane, but since I sleft the link for this thread on the last post I think everyone can find this easily.

I haven't heard from MrsG for some time, and I PM'd her a little while ago. I hope she is doing okay, but I know she has a lot going on.

Lion

[sissy's mom]

I am still searching ,I know all all of you are better at it than me, will still keep trying

[LionRun]

Thank you sissy:). I am probably not as good as you at it, or at least my dial up isn't. Can you tell me the names of the major local TV stations are? For example, we have one called KVUE 24. Then I can google it and hopefully find it. Thanks muches:)

Lion

[sissy's mom]

lion,These are the major local news... we have krtk 13, khou 11 and krpc 12 , there are a few smaller ones and I will keep searching

[richandfamous]

search links for texas:
http://www.blackbookonline.info/bbotx.htm
http://www.genlookups.com/texas_divorces/
http://www.usa-people-search.com/Default.aspx?view=PE
http://zabasearch.com/
http://www.switchboard.com/swbd.main/dir/6_0/whitepage.htm?mem=1
http://ssdi.genealogy.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/ssdi.cgi

and there's a few listed here also: http://someoneknowsme.com/upload/index.php?showtopic=62

[richandfamous]

Hey, I can't find my texas marriage link...anyone have it???

tia

[LionRun]

Hi rich:). Here it is. You originally gave it to me. So now I am giving it back to you:crazy:.

http://www.genlookups.com/texas_marriages/



Lion

[richandfamous]

Hi rich:). Here it is. You originally gave it to me. So now I am giving it back to you:crazy:.

http://www.genlookups.com/texas_marriages/



Lion

Oh thank gawd...I thought I had lost it forever! Thank you!

[LionRun]

lion,These are the major local news... we have krtk 13, khou 11 and krpc 12 , there are a few smaller ones and I will keep searching

Thank you sissy:).

Lion

[LionRun]

Oh thank gawd...I thought I had lost it forever! Thank you!

Just don't forget to give it back when your done:laugh: :crazy: lol.

Lion

[Lanie]

The Doe Network:
Case File 955DFFL

Tabbetha Kay Worford
Missing since May 5, 1990 from Pensacola, Escambia County, Florida.
Classification: Endangered Missing


Vital Statistics
Date Of Birth: July 23, 1970
Age at Time of Disappearance: 19 years old
Height and Weight at Time of Disappearance: 4'11; 85 lbs.
Distinguishing Characteristics: White female. Blonde hair; blue eyes.
Medical: Tabbetha has a club foot.Circumstances of Disappearance
Worford disappeared from her North Fairfiled Road Apartment the night of May 5, 1990.
Worford’s baby was found abandoned on the doorstep of the ex-wife of the baby’s father, Tim Reno

Investigators
If you have any information concerning this case, please contact:
Escambia County Sheriff's Office
850-436-9599
Email Form (http://www.escambiaso.com/contactUs.asp)
Agency Case Number: 90S681230
NCIC Number: M-423169639
Please refer to this number when contacting any agency with information regarding this case. Source Information:
Escambia County Sheriff's Office (http://www.escambiaso.com/coldCase.htm)
FDLE (http://www3.fdle.state.fl.us/fdle/mpersons_res_detail.asp?item_seq=24283)

http://doenetwork.org/cases/955dffl.html

[Lanie]

Morgan Anne Munson


Missing Since:
Age: 16
Missing From: Baton Rouge, LA
Sex: Female
Height: 5 ft.
Weight: 120 lbs.
Eye Color: Blue
Hair Color: Brown
Race: Caucasian
Complexion: Fair
Birth Date:
Last seen wearing: Unknown.
Last Seen: Morgan was last seen boarding a Greyhound bus in Baton Rouge, LA to go to Houston, TX. She has not been seen or heard from since.

Please call the Houston Police Department at (713) 731-5224. Or Call Texas EquuSearch at 281-309-9500 or Toll-free (877) 270-9500. Fax: 281-534-6719

Case #


TES Case # 03191

http://www.texasequusearch.org/images/patch_for_stickers.png[/IMG]


Prepared by: Texas EquuSearch Mounted
Search and Recovery Team

Download Flyers From: www.texasequusearch.org (http://www.texasequusearch.org)


Email: info@texasequusearch.org


http://www.texasequusearch.org/missing_persons/MorganMunson.htm

[Lanie]

I edited down the Morgan Munson page as much as I could, and I have no idea when she went missing, though I spent several hours trying to track it down. I'll check the Houston Chron archives now and see if I can find anything there.
Lanie

[LionRun]

Hi Lanie:). I have a gut feeling about what may have happened to poor Tabbetha. I find it odd that her baby was found, "abandoned" on the doorstep of the ex-wife of the baby's father. Hmmm. My guess is that is the last place that a woman would leave a baby in most cases. Very strange. I don't know how much of Princess Blue's skeletal remains were found in Manvel. If they have bones from both feet and ankles they would have been able to tell and would have reported that she had a club foot. But, we just don't know. We want to hold on to any possible match, but I doubt this would be her.

Lion

[RKnowley]

Sable on the previous thread you had asked what Kimberly Shawn Cheatham's mother's maiden name is and it is Coates. None of them in the class of 75 alumni either. First thing I checked was for her parents or siblings being in the Class of 75.

[LionRun]

Even though Morgan has a fair complexion with blue eyes it does not rule her out as being our Princess Blue. Princess could have had any type of complexion--we just don't know.

It is interesting that she was last seen boarding a bus heading to Houston, and she is the right height. I wonder if we can find out if she has ties to Houston to see where if at all the ring might fit in.

Do you have the link for the page on Morgan that you posted? I want to email TX Equisearch and ask them if they have a date last seen for her, and I want to direct them to the link.

Thank you for doing this research and posting it for us, Lanie!

Lion

[Lanie]

The link for Morgan is the giant blue underlined thing at the bottom of the page. When I first tried to post it, the whole thing was humongous, so I shrank the fonts down some.

I agree with you about having a good guess about what happened to Tabbetha. I still think she could be possible, though remote. The reports for Princess Blue sometimes refer to "incomplete skeletal remains", which could explain the club foot, but it is a pretty far distance to dump a body if my suspicions are correct.

[LionRun]

I agree with you about having a good guess about what happened to Tabbetha. I still think she could be possible, though remote. The reports for Princess Blue sometimes refer to "incomplete skeletal remains", which could explain the club foot, but it is a pretty far distance to dump a body if my suspicions are correct.

Lanie, I agree that it would be a pretty far ride to dump a body if it were her and the ex had anything to do with it. It would be too far removed from the ring and from the Houston area. Chances are if he is responsible, he dumped her close by or at least fairly close by. I really think that because there are two strong connections to the Houston area(the REL High School ring and that she was found in Manvel, TX near Houston) that she was either originally from the Houston area or she had a definite connection the the Houston area.

Lion

[LionRun]

Hi everyone;). I still have not intently read the letter, but I did notice something that we may want to change. Under Princess' vital statistics it states that her body my have been out there since the seventies. I am afraid that if someone knows a girl who went missing in say 1989 who fits the description except for that they may not come forward. The truth is that we don't know how long she was out there. I don't think that statement was made by a forensic specialist but instead possibly a member of LE who simply didn't know how long she was out there for.

Although, I can't find reliable info to answer certain forensic questions, certain things tell me that she most likely was not out there since the 70's. They have dentals, for example. Remains left out in all weather in a humid area like Houston probably would not have intact teeth for dentals. Also, she still had viable bone marrow which was tested for drugs. Chances are if she were out there since the 70's, that would not be the case.

We have all heard of cases where DNA and nearly or fully complete remains have been found for people or animals who lived up to thousands of years ago. However, those cases are special. There were either frozen, mummified or fossilized due to the conditions that they remained in for all that time. In the Houston area decomposition would be quick and remains would most likely not be intact for very long. The combination of routine high humidity with high heat would accelerate decomposition.

I am thinking that instead we might say something like, "Her remains may have been out there for as long as the 1970's, however her time of death was more likely in the late 80's to early 1990."

This way we cover our bases all around. What does everyone think?

Lion

[sissy's mom]

I am so sorry but I never did find anything more about this story, not in the news paper either

[LionRun]

That is okay, sissy. Thank you for searching! There are several articles in Houston papers, but I was trying to see if there was a TV news report so I could see the video--even though it might take 15 minutes to download it if it works at all.

Lion

[Lanie]

I have been unable to access the Texas Equusearch website. It says I do not have permission to view it. Can someone else try and see what happens?

[sloane]

Hello everyone,
I only have a few minutes, but I promise I will be more avail. later this week!
So...WOW!! I never thought the story would be quite this hot! I'm immensely grateful that it is out and in soooo many places. I agree w/ most of you that she sure seems connected to the Houston area, but it doesn't hurt for the story to appear elsewhere. You never know where OTHER ppl. are who may recognize her, be alums, or be able to help in some other way.

A big THANK YOU!! to all of you are putting in so much time and effort working on the spreadsheets and poring over MP sites. The possibles you have posted are helpful. I will take the time to really look closely at them soon, but for now I can say that Cheatham made me gasp! I see definite facial similarities. Whoever said the hair is off is correct, but that is often the case. Hair can be a tricky part of a facial recon. or reprodux. Oh, and to clear things up, NOOOOO, there WAS NOT any hair at the scene, contrary to what some of the articles are starting to say. I get frustrated at how the media takes liberties w/ what they print. They are stretching some of the facts, at a minimum. RKnowley, I don't blame you for being a little confused! :)

more soon,

[sloane]

Yes, I have already expressed my displeasure, to say the least, at the media outlets who are getting things incorrect. :bang: My guess on the Houston Chronicle write-up(s) is that it is the same reporter from the first article and he is pulling some of the old info. from his first article forward, such as the PMI (time of death). Unless there is something he knows that none of the investigators have been told, THERE IS NO FORENSICALLY DETERMINED TOD!! So, I see that one article has been saying the 6 mos. to one year thing again, and another one says up to 2 yrs... aaagghh!What is it that richandfamous says? "Facts, facts, get them straight!":banghead:

I tend to agree with what Lion has been surmising, that it would be closer to the 1990 discovery, rather than further out. Maybe the two years interval IS a good assumption, but that's all that it is. She was out in the open, which means open to the elements, scavenging, etc. And due to the weather conditions in a place like the Houston, coastal area, in my experience, skeletonization can happen quicker than one would think. And we now know that there was no clothing to help protect her. (poor girl!) So that helps speed the process as well. I think it is likely that her death occurred in '88, '89, or early '90, in my experience and opinion, but it is not fact. (CYA!;) or rather, C my A!)

I am really hoping that some family members will start coming forward to have their DNA taken, so that comparisons can start being made, and "possibles" ruled out, slowly.

You guys are awesome in your dedication! :angel:

[sloane]

Sloane, please check your PM's--they are runningith overith lol.

Lion
Got them Lion! :D Thanks! Time has been of the essence lately. They are cleared out now. :p

[sloane]

I'm afraid Miss Munson's teeth are much too beautiful to be Princess Blue's! :( thank you for posting a "possible", though.

On that note, can anyone who has more time than I do currently, please contact the "Doe Ntwk." and ask them to update their site?? It is my understanding that they just pull their postings from sites like those from LE or places like the TXMPCH. They have needed to pop back over for months now and see the changes to be sure they are posting proper and current info.,; they still have the Hispanic thing going on...;)

TIA TIA TIA

[sloane]

BTW, YES!!!
The first online forum the articles about PB are referencing ARE you guys here at WS!!:woohoo: It's time you deserve some credit, even if it doesn't mention WS by name. Then later, in a diff. article, it does mention the SKM site by name, so if ppl. go to that one I'm sure they'll make their way to this one from the links. Great job, everyone! Even though I kow you're not doing it for the credit...:angel:

I feel pretty sure that the investigators keep up with what is being posted on the varying sites.

[LionRun]

Hi sleuthers. I tried posting post 57 on Princess Blue part 2, but it blew the margins so I took it out. Edit: It was not this post after all that is blowing the margins. Oh well, I though it was this post. I missed this in the last thread and wanted to comment on 2 possible matches that Sable posted. The matches were suggested to her by people who emailed in regards to Princess' myspace.

I think Kimberly Norwood would not be a match because she was 2 when she disappeared. Even if she were kept alive until early 1990, which is highly doubtful, she would only have been 13 at TOD. Princess was likely 17-21 or 16-22 if a margin is given.

Maria De Los Angeles Martinez disappeared after Princess Blue's remains were found so it cannot be her.

I am sending Kimberly Shawn Cheatham's(WS Princess thread, part 2, post 536) info to Sgt. Coffman, however. She has enough facial features similar to Princess' recon. She disappeared from Dallas, so we don't know how the ring would come into play. But, there could be a connection we don't know about. We also don't know her height in life. It says 4'6" and that could be wrong. 4'6" is possible, but that would mean that she was VERY petite in life.

We will just keep trying and one of these days we might find a match. '

Lion

[LionRun]

I edited down the Morgan Munson page as much as I could, and I have no idea when she went missing, though I spent several hours trying to track it down. I'll check the Houston Chron archives now and see if I can find anything there.
Lanie

Good luck, Lanie and thank you for being a part of this!

Lion

[LionRun]

I'm afraid Miss Munson's teeth are much too beautiful to be Princess Blue's! :( thank you for posting a "possible", though.

On that note, can anyone who has more time than I do currently, please contact the "Doe Ntwk." and ask them to update their site?? It is my understanding that they just pull their postings from sites like those from LE or places like the TXMPCH. They have needed to pop back over for months now and see the changes to be sure they are posting proper and current info.,; they still have the Hispanic thing going on...;)

TIA TIA TIA

Hi there sloane! It is so good to see you:blowkiss:. Can you perhaps let us know something about Princess' dentals? Does she have crowding or specifically crooked teeth? Does she have many fillings? Does she have missing teeth? Do you know if she had her last molars, if they had been surgically removed or if they never came in? This could help us in finding possible matches.

I guess I could refer them to the link where the article states that a new forensics team has a new description. Hopefully, they don't have a policy whereby they only print info from legal sites, because I haven't noted that the TX dps site has updated their site either. I hope both sites will be updated.

Lion

[TCMom]

Keep up the good work gang! I don't have the time, nor resources to do a lot of sleuthing, but you guys are doing great. I'd say the Kimberly Cheatham one looks promising.

[teonspaleprincess]

Hi everyone! So, did they do a DNA analysis that made them change thier minds about her being hispanic and decide that she may be african american and caucasian instead? I have been searching for women listed as biracial or mixed but so far I don't see any that look promising.

[LionRun]

Hi everyone! So, did they do a DNA analysis that made them change thier minds about her being hispanic and decide that she may be african american and caucasian instead? I have been searching for women listed as biracial or mixed but so far I don't see any that look promising.

Hi teons:). Princess Blue's DNA has been in CODIS for some time. Actually, a top Forensics team just did an examination of Princess' remains at the end of 2006. The original work up was performed by an ME in 1990.

Although an ME is qualified to determine cause, manner, and TOD for a person who passes shortly before they are found, a complete forensics team is more qualified to determine such things when skeletal remains are found. The ME unfortunately got it wrong when he/she determined Princess to be Caucasian/Hispanic. He/she was correct that Princess was Caucasian with something else. But, the something else was a possibility of mixed race African American ancestry, not Hispanic. Back in 1990 there simply was not enough funds for a complete forensic work up by a full forensics team. Fortunately, funds were available to finally do this a few months ago.

Again, I think it is best to be open minded concerning her race when looking for a possible match. Princess may have had no African American facial features noticeable to most people when she was alive. Or she may have had such features. The forensics's team's examination did reveal that she had a possibility of mixed race African American ancestry, but notice that they did not classify her as bi-racial.

She may or may not have had African American features that were noticeable in life. So, we need to pay attention to all possible matches if the basic description, date last seen, and other factors fit.

I am hoping that we don't overlook a possible match just because the description does not show a girl with African American features or is not listed as bi-racial.

Lion

[Lanie]

Lion, you said something about a date being wrong, so it couldn't be her. I posted a link in here somewhere, I don't have time to look it up right now, but there is a thread here in websleuths about a woman who was missing for over 11 years before her body was identified. Her remains were found 5 miles away, and IIRC, after a couple of weeks, but her bf didn't report her missing for 2 or 3 weeks, so the two weren't compared for over 11 years. LE was looking at the missing woman as having disappeared a few days after the body was found.

[LionRun]

Lion, you said something about a date being wrong, so it couldn't be her. I posted a link in here somewhere, I don't have time to look it up right now, but there is a thread here in websleuths about a woman who was missing for over 11 years before her body was identified. Her remains were found 5 miles away, and IIRC, after a couple of weeks, but her bf didn't report her missing for 2 or 3 weeks, so the two weren't compared for over 11 years. LE was looking at the missing woman as having disappeared a few days after the body was found.

Lanie, you have a very good point. Perhaps we should include certain possible matches if the person who reportedly last saw the victim may also be the POI or possible suspect. And, if the last time she was seen by others(at work, at a club, by her family and other friends, etc..) was prior to the time that a possible match in a UID is discovered, we may want to look further. If someone fits the description like a well fitting glove perhaps we need to research further to see if the date last seen was printed wrong intentionally or unintentionally. Thank you for enlightening me. We sure do not want to miss the right match!

Lion

[Lanie]

Here's the thread I was talking about.
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=49520

and another link to this story.
http://z13.invisionfree.com/PorchlightUSA/index.php?showtopic=3943&st=0&#last

[LionRun]

Here's the thread I was talking about.
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=49520

and another link to this story.
http://z13.invisionfree.com/PorchlightUSA/index.php?showtopic=3943&st=0&#last

I agree that is a possibility that something like this happened. Or maybe some other mistake was made in Princess' case. It is also possible that she was never put on any of the major Missing sites making it hard to ID her. Somehow our beloved Princess Blue seems to have fallen through the cracks, and something is missing or she most likely would have been ID'd by now.

Lion

[LionRun]

Our richandfamous started a thread on topix about Princess Blue, and it is getting a little attention. Here is the link.

http://www.topix.net/forum/houston/TAVJDVIJL1QL7P158#lastPost

Lion

[sloane]

Good Morning all!
(We need a cup of steaming coffee icon!)

Just to be clear, (Lion's post), the newest forensic anthropological work-up on PB was completed in March, 2007, not last Sept.
I believe I read that they re-opened the case in Sept. (Perhaps that's from where you pulled that date, Lion?) Which is why I was saying WAAAYY back somewhere that it is amazing to me sometimes all the coincidences in WS' interest in this case happening at the same time as the new for. anth. report, at the same time as the drawings coming out, at the same time as the public latching on to this, etc. This case was DEF. meant to be looked at. Makes you wonder what the deep story really is...? I truly hope we can find out one day!

Usually a skeleton's ancestral background is not determined by DNA, but rather by what the bones "have to say." Shapes, teeth structure, suture lines, measurements, as well as the "spaces" in the bones - the nasal aperture, eye orbits, foramen magnum, etc. The skull is THE place from which to determine ancestral background firstly, and secondly, the sex. Of course the pelvic bones are number one for determining sex, followed by the skull, then perhaps leg bones.

Thanks, rich, for starting another thread abut this story. We haven't seen you around here much...hope things are okay? Have you taken your big exam yet? Yikes!

More later when I have more time. Have a wonderful day sleuthers!:blowkiss:

[RKnowley]

Sloane, do you have any idea approximately how many of the 1975 REL (Houston) Class Alumni were originally contacted/located by LE? Just a ballpark figure? One of the articles stated that LE were able to locate "a member" of the class alumni (I'm guessing they really meant "a number") and that also turned out to be a dead end.

[LionRun]

Good Morning all!
(We need a cup of steaming coffee icon!)

Just to be clear, (Lion's post), the newest forensic anthropological work-up on PB was completed in March, 2007, not last Sept.
I believe I read that they re-opened the case in Sept. (Perhaps that's from where you pulled that date, Lion?) Which is why I was saying WAAAYY back somewhere that it is amazing to me sometimes all the coincidences in WS' interest in this case happening at the same time as the new for. anth. report, at the same time as the drawings coming out, at the same time as the public latching on to this, etc. This case was DEF. meant to be looked at. Makes you wonder what the deep story really is...? I truly hope we can find out one day!

Usually a skeleton's ancestral background is not determined by DNA, but rather by what the bones "have to say." Shapes, teeth structure, suture lines, measurements, as well as the "spaces" in the bones - the nasal aperture, eye orbits, foramen magnum, etc. The skull is THE place from which to determine ancestral background firstly, and secondly, the sex. Of course the pelvic bones are number one for determining sex, followed by the skull, then perhaps leg bones.

Thanks, rich, for starting another thread abut this story. We haven't seen you around here much...hope things are okay? Have you taken your big exam yet? Yikes!

More later when I have more time. Have a wonderful day sleuthers!:blowkiss:

Sloane, thank you for correcting my error on when the recent forensic work up was done. I confused the date with when that article came out last year, perhaps when the case was reopened as well. Oops. I always welcome corrections, though. It is import ant for me to get my facts right and not to inadvertently repeat incorrect info.

I understand that race/ancestry is usually determined by forensic examination to include the factors you describe. Actually, doing it that way rather than relying on DNA would give a more accurate picture of what the person may have looked like in life. And, that is the bottom line.

Sloane, do you know the general condition of Princess' teeth? I know I asked this before, but with all of the posts perhaps it was overlooked. I know you have been busy, too, so I am asking again in the hopes that you can answer when you have more time. Did she have a lot of cavities? Crowding? Over shot jaw? Missing or chipped teeth? This may be helpful in some cases to make a possible match.

Have a wonderful rest of the week, and thank you for being here for us.

Lion

[LionRun]

Hi friends:). I just received an email from Sgt. Coffman regarding a possible match, Kimberley Shawn Cheatham. He said that although, he won't eliminate anyone until someone with a more scientific background tells him to, he does not think she is a match. He said that her height and other characteristics don't match. I know that her height is listed as 4'6", and I explained that we don't know if this is an error or not.

However, I also had sent in info on Michelle Doherty just 4 days before that. He did not mention her in his reply, today. I do not know if that means anything like he is checking further or that he sooooo doesn't think she is a match that he didn't even mention her. I have no idea.

Lion

[teonspaleprincess]

At least he is keepng in touch and letting us know updates. I still wish we could get a list of everyone that has been checked and ruled out.

[LionRun]

At least he is keepng in touch and letting us know updates. I still wish we could get a list of everyone that has been checked and ruled out.

Yes, teons, I wish that were the case, too. And, like RKnowly asked, who from the 75 grad class was successfully contacted. I have a feeling that very few students were contacted. We will just keep working, for this is a project, and a group of us truly care and are dedicated.

Lion

[sloane]

Good Morning to all!:) :)

I was catching up on some of the past posts, and I wanted to address #486 and #487 in the P.Blue Part II thread. It won't let me quote it in this Part III, but RKnowley and Lion were asking about facial reproductions done with a smile, showing teeth. It depends on the skill and thoroughness of the forensic artist, of course, as there really is no standard in this field as far as procedure goes; usually if you see a facial reconstruction done with the teeth showing, (the sculpture is smiling), or facial reproduction drawn with a smile, it is because the UID's teeth were present and in good condition. Many times, as Lion has stated, some or almost all of the teeth have fallen out in the field, and been lost. Some investigators are instructed to sift and use metal detectors at the scene of discovery, to "catch" teeth that may have become a bit buried, or may blend in w/ pebbles, soil, etc. But They can only go so far. How do you know when to stop? How deep do you dig? How far out of a radius do you search? At some point they must call off the excavation. Granted, there are def. more thorough investigations than others. I certainly don't know how much effort was put into retrieving every last tooth and phalange of P.Blue, but I was thinking that maybe all her front teeth were not in condition to show in the drawing, so the artist created P. Blue's face with a closed-mouth...??

[sloane]

Sloane, do you have any idea approximately how many of the 1975 REL (Houston) Class Alumni were originally contacted/located by LE? Just a ballpark figure? One of the articles stated that LE were able to locate "a member" of the class alumni (I'm guessing they really meant "a number") and that also turned out to be a dead end.
Hi there!
No, I'm sorry...I don't think I can help you guys much on this one. :(
I don't know what their attempts have been to contact alums. I can say with fair certainty it has not been ANYTHING on the level of what you guys are doing: making lists of the Yb ppl., getting updated contact info. on each of them, looking up marriages/divorces, etc. I simply cannot see how they would have the time to spend on it THAT thoroughly. Just look at how much time it has taken all of you, and how many of you are there, that have divided up the duties??:clap: You are to be commended...again!!

What about "icepickPhil"?? Are you still reading, Phil? Can you enlighten us as to how it was you were contacted by LE? Or did you find out about this case through this forum?

Thanks,

[sloane]

Well, I feel like I may not hold a place to make a suggestion, since I'm not doing any of the legwork on the research to get contact info. on the alums...:blushing: BUT...
I was going to suggest that the letters be sent out, in small groups maybe, AS YOU GO ALONG, rather than waiting for all the names on all the blocks of the spreadsheetes to be complete. Or did you guys already have that in mind? :silenced: That way, at least some of them are already reaching their intended destinations, without having to wait on some names / info. to be found. What do you think?

[sloane]

By the way, my welcome to Lanie is long overdue...so, WELCOME!! And thank you for pitching right in and helping so much. It must be great to be "oozing free time," as you put it! LOL!!
I can tell you are also researching MPs; would you be willing to take a look at our other project, "Princess Lavender?" She's another UID that someone here posted a facial reconstruction of (jodierenee, I think). It's in this "Located" section, under the title "Unidentified white female Kilgore" or something similar. The leads have been quiet over there lately...

thank you for your time and interest!

warmly,

[sloane]

Okay, I'm lost again.

Lanie, what does IIRC stand for?

Jaded, how about H T H?

TIA :)

[Lanie]

By the way, my welcome to Lanie is long overdue...so, WELCOME!! And thank you for pitching right in and helping so much. It must be great to be "oozing free time," as you put it! LOL!!
I can tell you are also researching MPs; would you be willing to take a look at our other project, "Princess Lavender?" She's another UID that someone here posted a facial reconstruction of (jodierenee, I think). It's in this "Located" section, under the title "Unidentified white female Kilgore" or something similar. The leads have been quiet over there lately...

thank you for your time and interest!

warmly,

Thanks for the welcome. Actually, I have been following the Princess Lavender case, but not as much as this one. I thought the Alexis girl was a strong possibility for that one, even though Kilgore is not between Dallas and Houston, as someone posted.:)
IIRC is 'if I remember correctly'.
Lanie

[sloane]

Hi all,
In response to christine's post #560, I too, think what Kelly does is fantastic work, and thank christine for assisting her with it. She has a full plate! On top of being so incredibly emotionally involved with the situation of MPs...:(
Well, if you need input, I certainly would be one of the persons interested in having a readable (is that a word?) form of her DNA reports, rather than needing to listen to it in all its 4 parts. I think the info. is priceless, and I want to be able to refer back to it at any time, highlight it, make notes, etc. So...you've got my vote of support! :dance:

If all of you noticed, the lab of which Kelly speaks, that is one of only three in the nation to be an expert in the field of mitochondrial DNA, is UNT (Univ. of North Tx). THAT is the place that did the recent work-up on Princess Blue!! Finally, experts on the case! So they will be a great asset in comparing PB's DNA with that of samples submitted my family members of MP who think their MP might be P.Blue. And...the lab is federally funded. Yea!!

[LionRun]

Good Morning to all!:) :)

I was catching up on some of the past posts, and I wanted to address #486 and #487 in the P.Blue Part II thread. It won't let me quote it in this Part III, but RKnowley and Lion were asking about facial reproductions done with a smile, showing teeth. It depends on the skill and thoroughness of the forensic artist, of course, as there really is no standard in this field as far as procedure goes; usually if you see a facial reconstruction done with the teeth showing, (the sculpture is smiling), or facial reproduction drawn with a smile, it is because the UID's teeth were present and in good condition. Many times, as Lion has stated, some or almost all of the teeth have fallen out in the field, and been lost. Some investigators are instructed to sift and use metal detectors at the scene of discovery, to "catch" teeth that may have become a bit buried, or may blend in w/ pebbles, soil, etc. But They can only go so far. How do you know when to stop? How deep do you dig? How far out of a radius do you search? At some point they must call off the excavation. Granted, there are def. more thorough investigations than others. I certainly don't know how much effort was put into retrieving every last tooth and phalange of P.Blue, but I was thinking that maybe all her front teeth were not in condition to show in the drawing, so the artist created P. Blue's face with a closed-mouth...??

Thank you sloane, and this makes complete sense.

Lion

[LionRun]

Well, I feel like I may not hold a place to make a suggestion, since I'm not doing any of the legwork on the research to get contact info. on the alums...:blushing: BUT...
I was going to suggest that the letters be sent out, in small groups maybe, AS YOU GO ALONG, rather than waiting for all the names on all the blocks of the spreadsheetes to be complete. Or did you guys already have that in mind? :silenced: That way, at least some of them are already reaching their intended destinations, without having to wait on some names / info. to be found. What do you think?

I agree with you, sloane. And, since the articles just came out we were thinking that now is a good time. People may be more likely to give it more thought and to respond if they heard about Princess on TV or in the paper.

Lion

[RKnowley]

I've had my block ready to go since the articles were released. Now I'm just waiting for the letter to be completed so I can stuff my envelopes and send them off. :)

[LionRun]

I've had my block ready to go since the articles were released. Now I'm just waiting for the letter to be completed so I can stuff my envelopes and send them off. :)

RKnowley, I admire your dedication and get it done ways! I am not finished with mine, mostly because for me to do research takes very, very long. It takes several minutes to load one page, and sometimes it just doesn't work after waiting for so long for one silly page to come up. Gosh, I wish I could get high speed! But, I am in the sticks, and I can't. Uck! Well, enough ranting for me. Sorry.

Hopefully, the letter will be finalized, soon and at least you can mail out some of your letters. I am excited to hear back from at least some of the grads. We have worked so hard, and I don't even think that anything like this has even been attempted before. Great folks, here--really great folks!

Lion

[sloane]

That's excellent, RKnowley! You go! (you're mighty fast.)

I put in my suggestions to the letter on the SKM site earlier today. It seems as if it is very near ready...yea! Yes, I think we HAD previously discussed the timing of the letter going out to coincide w/ the press releases, but at the time we just didn't know when that was. So, Yes, I think now is an excellent time to start the mail-out, to whichever ones are ready. This is certainly not to rush anyone, though...

[RKnowley]

Lion, some research had already been done on your block several names (well 25 of them) have contact information and just need to have envelopes addressed for them and have the spreadsheet marked what names you are sending out in this batch.

I have not FINISHED my block but I have addressed the envelopes for the names I do have contact information on so that the first batch is ready to go.

RKnowley, I admire your dedication and get it done ways! I am not finished with mine, mostly because for me to do research takes very, very long. It takes several minutes to load one page, and sometimes it just doesn't work after waiting for so long for one silly page to come up. Gosh, I wish I could get high speed! But, I am in the sticks, and I can't. Uck! Well, enough ranting for me. Sorry.

Hopefully, the letter will be finalized, soon and at least you can mail out some of your letters. I am excited to hear back from at least some of the grads. We have worked so hard, and I don't even think that anything like this has even been attempted before. Great folks, here--really great folks!

Lion

[RKnowley]

Sloane, so far I've only been able to find 50 of the 75 + students that are on my block. I hope to go back and find the rest of them but you know they have last names like Smith and Miller, lol so they are harder to track down. I had found contact information on several other students before we divided them up into blocks. There should be a lot more ready to go out. I will keep working on the rest.

ETA: Since nobody has put a claim on block 8 I am going to get envelopes addressed and ready to go for what names have contact information on them for that bunch already.

That's excellent, RKnowley! You go! (you're mighty fast.)

I put in my suggestions to the letter on the SKM site earlier today. It seems as if it is very near ready...yea! Yes, I think we HAD previously discussed the timing of the letter going out to coincide w/ the press releases, but at the time we just didn't know when that was. So, Yes, I think now is an excellent time to start the mail-out, to whichever ones are ready. This is certainly not to rush anyone, though...

[sloane]

Wow- already that is a lot of names...how do you do it? Plus all the names the others have completed, we're off to a fantastic start!! Who is finishing up the letter? themis? Who is she? (lol) :) Is she under another name over here? If not, how come she doesn't post on WS?

[RKnowley]

Sloane, Themis is Jaded over here. She was nice enough to set up SKM so that we had a private place to discuss Princess Blue because we didn't want to post any private information regarding the class alumni just anywhere. Jaded/Themis is finishing up the letter then we are ready to roll on the first round I believe!


Wow- already that is a lot of names...how do you do it? Plus all the names the others have completed, we're off to a fantastic start!! Who is finishing up the letter? themis? Who is she? (lol) :) Is she under another name over here? If not, how come she doesn't post on WS?

[LionRun]

Lion, some research had already been done on your block several names (well 25 of them) have contact information and just need to have envelopes addressed for them and have the spreadsheet marked what names you are sending out in this batch.

I have not FINISHED my block but I have addressed the envelopes for the names I do have contact information on so that the first batch is ready to go.

Thank you RKnowley:). I will get envelopes next time I go the grocery store and continue with that then.

Lion

[RKnowley]

Sloane, the way I research the female names is a first see if I can find the birth for them. Then the marriage records. If I find they have been married I check to see if they divorced (so I would know that there may be another name change down the road). Then I look for a marriage record and see if they could have married after the first divorce and if I find another marriage for them then again I would check for a divorce for that couple. If I don't find one then I go to the "living people finder" and look for them by the last married name they had. If I don't find them that way I look for them by their maiden name or their first marriage, second marriage (etc) surname. If I don't find them then I move on to another name and go back and research the names I wasn't able to find information on at another time when they aren't frustrating me :eek:

Wow- already that is a lot of names...how do you do it? Plus all the names the others have completed, we're off to a fantastic start!! Who is finishing up the letter? themis? Who is she? (lol) :) Is she under another name over here? If not, how come she doesn't post on WS?

[RKnowley]

I don't know if it will help (help get the letters opened by alumni?) but I also put a silver & a gold star sticker (REL colors were yellow and gray) on the front of my envelopes and wrote "Attn: 1975 REL Class Alumni next to the stars. :cool:

[Lanie]

Lion, some research had already been done on your block several names (well 25 of them) have contact information and just need to have envelopes addressed for them and have the spreadsheet marked what names you are sending out in this batch.

I have not FINISHED my block but I have addressed the envelopes for the names I do have contact information on so that the first batch is ready to go.

What if I have more than one likely address for the same name, any suggestions on how to pare it down, or should we just send it to all and hope we get a hit?

LOL, guess I should have read farther!

[teonspaleprincess]

My name research wasn't going so hot so I took a break. I am terrible at researching the names. I am going to start back soon and try and get it finished.

[RKnowley]

There are about 30 names done (contact information found) on MrsG's block (block 1) that could be addressed and ready to go. Does anyone want to do them? :D

[richandfamous]

Hello all, I have been so busy at work and school and kids and graduations that I have missed a bunch and haven't been able to do any research but I will get back to it as soon as I'm able!!!
Now, was there some news articles that I missed??? darnit...

[Jaded]

There are about 30 names done (contact information found) on MrsG's block (block 1) that could be addressed and ready to go. Does anyone want to do them? :D


I'll address them since I'm lacking the research on my block. I can do that this next few days.

[LionRun]

Hello all, I have been so busy at work and school and kids and graduations that I have missed a bunch and haven't been able to do any research but I will get back to it as soon as I'm able!!!
Now, was there some news articles that I missed??? darnit...

Here ya go, rich:blowkiss:.



http://www.myfoxhouston.com/myfox/pages/News/Detail?contentId=3427425&version=2&locale=EN-US&layoutCode=TSTY&pageId=3.2.1 (http://www.myfoxhouston.com/myfox/pages/News/Detail?contentId=3427425&version=2&locale=EN-US&layoutCode=TSTY&pageId=3.2.1)


http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/...o/4870484.html


http://www.kten.com/Global/story.asp?S=6626525


http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/ap/tx/4871172.html


http://www.click2houston.com/news/13462498/detail.html


http://thefacts.com/story.lasso?ewcd=86ae85fb572b774b


http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/...o/4870484.html


I don't know if I included them all, but i went through the pages on the last Princess thread and found these. Pretty darn good coverage with all of these articles. There are a couple of errors, for example, it is not a 27 year old case, and we named Princess Blue on this thread, not on SKE. I sent an email to ask for a correction on the 27 year issue, but I will be surprised if they print the correction. All in all I think they were well written and pretty inclusive, and I hope it caught some public interest.

Lion

[Lanie]

Good Morning Everyone!! Wow, this is really rolling right along. I have a lot of work to get done today, but I anticipate having 5 ready to mail sometime tomorrow.
I can't remember who is in charge of contacting LE, possibly Lion?, but I was wondering if maybe we should let LE know we are about start on the mailing, so (hopefully) when all this alumni start calling in, they will be ready for it.
This is so thrilling! I know not to get my hopes up, but I can't help it, how cool would it be if this leads to Princess Blue's identity after all these years? I printed out her reconstruction and hung it on my desk, so I see her every day. I have my fingers crossed!
Lanie

[RKnowley]

That would be terrific! Thank you.

I'll address them since I'm lacking the research on my block. I can do that this next few days.

[LionRun]

Good Morning Everyone!! Wow, this is really rolling right along. I have a lot of work to get done today, but I anticipate having 5 ready to mail sometime tomorrow.
I can't remember who is in charge of contacting LE, possibly Lion?, but I was wondering if maybe we should let LE know we are about start on the mailing, so (hopefully) when all this alumni start calling in, they will be ready for it.
This is so thrilling! I know not to get my hopes up, but I can't help it, how cool would it be if this leads to Princess Blue's identity after all these years? I printed out her reconstruction and hung it on my desk, so I see her every day. I have my fingers crossed!
Lanie

Yes, Lanie. It is me. This is part of an email I recently sent to Sgt. Jay.


A note about our progress on the year book: We are in the process of getting current contact information for as many of the 1975 REL grads as possible. We are working very hard to track them down, and we have composed a rough draft of a letter, and we will include pertinent info to send with it. We have a PO box and anonymous email addys to receive replies from the grads. So far we have tracked down quite a few of them. If we come across anything that seems relevant to the case we will research as far as we can and send the info to you if it might help.


Lion

[Lanie]

Jaded and MrsG, I think I might have emailed you the other day instead of pmmed. Did you get my question about the names, or do I need to resend? Sorry about the messup.
Lanie

[Jaded]

Could you resend it? I was going through emails and inadvertently deleted it. I am so sorry.

[Jaded]

btw, everyone...I'm overhauling someoneknowsme so that we can add articles on missing and UID on the front end. It's a work in progress, but check it out.

[LionRun]

Wow, jaded! What a great siggy! I will check out SKE, too. I know so little about internet, though. Can you explain what you mean when you say we can add articles on the front end? Thanks so much, friend:).

Lion

[Jaded]

Wow, jaded! What a great siggy! I will check out SKE, too. I know so little about internet, though. Can you explain what you mean when you say we can add articles on the front end? Thanks so much, friend:).

Lion

If you click on my siggie it will take you to the new front page of the site. I have a link up to the old forum, as I don't think I can convert the database over to the forum on the portal. If you look at the site, we now will have the ability to post articles about missing and UID cases.

Thanks re: the siggie. I feel so passionate about finding out who our Princess Blue is. I just know that eventually she will have a real name.

[sloane]

Good morning everyone!

Jaded, what a great signature block. You're so creative. I've seen the other images you've compiled throughout WS...nice!! I don't know how to do that at all...are you an artist?

Well, thank you for keeping up w/ SKM so much. I'm going to go there next and check out your changes. It's awesome to have so many ppl. working together toward a common goal that have such varying skills, interests and personalities.

Speaking of... (LOL) welocme back rich! :cool: Nice to see you on again. If you haven't already, catch yourself up on the rest of Part II and it will show you a lot of the news coverage. Of course, you'll see some mistakes...(no offense to any of you who are reading who may be in the media field, but it is so frustrating to see them print mistake after mistake, stretch the truth to make things more "grabbing" or graphic, etc.) How does a "silver and turquoise unicorn or horse ring" turn into a "golden unicorn pin?" Aaagh!

RKnowley, I don't know how you have the time and patience to do all that research like you've explained on the alums, but I'm grateful to you that you have.:clap:
:blowkiss: And all of you who spend your free time donating to this quest. Truly admirable!

have a great day all,

[Jaded]

Good morning everyone!

Jaded, what a great signature block. You're so creative. I've seen the other images you've compiled throughout WS...nice!! I don't know how to do that at all...are you an artist?

Well, thank you for keeping up w/ SKM so much. I'm going to go there next and check out your changes. It's awesome to have so many ppl. working together toward a common goal that have such varying skills, interests and personalities.

Speaking of... (LOL) welocme back rich! :cool: Nice to see you on again. If you haven't already, catch yourself up on the rest of Part II and it will show you a lot of the news coverage. Of course, you'll see some mistakes...(no offense to any of you who are reading who may be in the media field, but it is so frustrating to see them print mistake after mistake, stretch the truth to make things more "grabbing" or graphic, etc.) How does a "silver and turquoise unicorn or horse ring" turn into a "golden unicorn pin?" Aaagh!

RKnowley, I don't know how you have the time and patience to do all that research like you've explained on the alums, but I'm grateful to you that you have.:clap:
:blowkiss: And all of you who spend your free time donating to this quest. Truly admirable!

have a great day all,

Naw, not an artist, although I would LOVE to learn to paint. Thanks for the compliment. :) I do graphics mainly as a way to stay occupied. I'm self taught and still have a long way to go before I'm as good as some people out there.

[LionRun]

Good morning everyone!

Jaded, what a great signature block. You're so creative. I've seen the other images you've compiled throughout WS...nice!! I don't know how to do that at all...are you an artist?

Well, thank you for keeping up w/ SKM so much. I'm going to go there next and check out your changes. It's awesome to have so many ppl. working together toward a common goal that have such varying skills, interests and personalities.

Speaking of... (LOL) welocme back rich! :cool: Nice to see you on again. If you haven't already, catch yourself up on the rest of Part II and it will show you a lot of the news coverage. Of course, you'll see some mistakes...(no offense to any of you who are reading who may be in the media field, but it is so frustrating to see them print mistake after mistake, stretch the truth to make things more "grabbing" or graphic, etc.) How does a "silver and turquoise unicorn or horse ring" turn into a "golden unicorn pin?" Aaagh!

RKnowley, I don't know how you have the time and patience to do all that research like you've explained on the alums, but I'm grateful to you that you have.:clap:
:blowkiss: And all of you who spend your free time donating to this quest. Truly admirable!

have a great day all,

Hi sloane:). The turquoise unicorn or horse ring going sideways is similar to the game, "Telephone", except that it is real life and can have consequences, unfortunately. It happens everywhere with most people, and often it is unintentional many times. That is one reason why I am so anal retentive about consciously taking any action possible to keep our facts straight. I hope I haven't driven anyone too cuckoo for coco puffs because of my ways:blushing: .

Lion

[Lanie]

I can't access it. I apparently have forgotten what my user name was over there. :confused: *I'm really not an idiot, I just signed up/registered for several different things together. Could someone send it to me, and then I will send off for my password if I can't remember it.
:confused: :confused: :confused:

[RKnowley]

Aren't you just "Lanie" over there also? That's the name I've seen you use there. ETA: If you are trying to access the new info on the page you need to register again I believe. Until then here is the link to the message board http://www.someoneknowsme.com/upload/

I can't access it. I apparently have forgotten what my user name was over there. :confused: *I'm really not an idiot, I just signed up/registered for several different things together. Could someone send it to me, and then I will send off for my password if I can't remember it.
:confused: :confused: :confused:

[LionRun]

If you click on my siggie it will take you to the new front page of the site. I have a link up to the old forum, as I don't think I can convert the database over to the forum on the portal. If you look at the site, we now will have the ability to post articles about missing and UID cases.

Thanks re: the siggie. I feel so passionate about finding out who our Princess Blue is. I just know that eventually she will have a real name.

Thank you jaded:blowkiss:. I am so glad you are here.

Lion

[RKnowley]

I have 40 letters ready to go out tomorrow (6/19/2007) to the Class Alumni. Then my sister is donating to me 2 books of stamps and once I get those I have 20 more letters to go out immediately and then I will get 20 more from the spreadsheet. I think I will be able to get most of block 9 (which nobody had taken) done with the stamps I get from my sister and I think my other sister will donate a book of stamps for me to finish up all of block 9 (not sure on this because I haven't talked to my other sis yet but I'm pretty sure she'd be happy to help).

[LionRun]

I have 40 letters ready to go out tomorrow (6/19/2007) to the Class Alumni. Then my sister is donating to me 2 books of stamps and once I get those I have 20 more letters to go out immediately and then I will get 20 more from the spreadsheet. I think I will be able to get most of block 9 (which nobody had taken) done with the stamps I get from my sister and I think my other sister will donate a book of stamps for me to finish up all of block 9 (not sure on this because I haven't talked to my other sis yet but I'm pretty sure she'd be happy to help).

RKnowley, how fantastic! And, it is so nice that your sister is helping you. I am so excited, and I look forward to getting replies from at least some of the grads.

Lion

[RKnowley]

I wasn't real happy with my printer today though.....grrrrrrrrrrr....paper kept getting jammed in the durn thing. I may have to have my hubby make copies at his office for the next batch to go out or I may pull my hair out.

[LionRun]

Uh oh, I feel for you, RKnowley. I hope you can get it to work for you.

Lion

[RKnowley]

I'll get them done one way or another :) Thanks!

Uh oh, I feel for you, RKnowley. I hope you can get it to work for you.

Lion

[Lanie]

I'm a little behind. We had some severe flooding pretty close to where I live, and I got busy in my job. I should have time today to get my five mailed, and my block updated.
Lanie

[LionRun]

I'm a little behind. We had some severe flooding pretty close to where I live, and I got busy in my job. I should have time today to get my five mailed, and my block updated.
Lanie

No worries, Lanie:blowkiss:. Thank you for all that you do, and if it helps I am behind, too. I am committed, but behind.

Lion

[RKnowley]

40 more letters are going out tomorrow (6/21/2007). My sister was super speedy in sending me 2 books of stamps for our project. My other sister is sending me a book also so I will be able to get 20 more letters out soon.

[Jaded]

I'll be mailing a bunch off tomorrow, and I am going to start checking the PO box daily for responses. :)

[sloane]

Good morning all-
Sorry I've been away for awhile...the good news is one of my UIDs was identified recently!! :o The bad news is that it was likely a "criminal" ending to his life, so that opens a whole other branch of questions and investigations...I'm tired, but so happy he has his identity and many questions have been answered.
Now if only we could get to that point with our Princess Blue...I think we are well on our way, in great part due to dedicated sleuthers like you guys! Kudos to all of you who are working so diligently on the spreadsheets. I'm so happy so many letters are ready to go out! THANK YOU, THANK YOU! I haven't been to SKM in awhile...is the letter to the alums finalized??
:blushing: I'm embarrassed to say that I had not really considered the finanacial dedication some of you are putting into this until I read that RKnowley's sisters are donating stamps to her. That's a great idea...and so kind of them. With all the work she has put in, it's nice she won't have to use her money on top of that. I don't know how else to express it, RKnowley, Lion, Jaded, Lanie, Sable, rich, MrsG, MissieMt, teons, jules and anyone else I failed to mention off the top of my head....but, THANK YOU!!!! :clap:

Have a great day, all. Lanie, I hope things are better in your area re: the flooding...are you and your home and family okay?

[Spazkat9696]

Does Princess have a myspace page? If not she should we could send out friend requests to people in the area people who went to that school if they have pages but more likely we could reach a younger family member who has heard about a missing family member or mom's lost class ring just a thought let me know what you think or if she already has one. I find a lot of missing person cases just by jumping around to my friends-friends pages and so on.

[RKnowley]

Hi Spazkat,
Yes, Princess Blue has a fantastic myspace page set up by Sable. Here is the link to Princess Blue's myspace page: http://www.myspace.com/uidprincessblue

ETA: Looks a though somebody thinks missing persons need breast enlargements according to Princess Blue's myspace page :snooty:

Does Princess have a myspace page? If not she should we could send out friend requests to people in the area people who went to that school if they have pages but more likely we could reach a younger family member who has heard about a missing family member or mom's lost class ring just a thought let me know what you think or if she already has one. I find a lot of missing person cases just by jumping around to my friends-friends pages and so on.

[sloane]

Okay--
you know you're an active sleuther when...
you go to a Starbucks, see a German Shepherd waiting patiently at an outside table waiting for his owner to come back out , and you think, "Lion...?" :eek:
Ha ha - I knew she couldn't really be inside, but for a split second she came to my mind!! :crazy:

Just checking in...it seems a bit quiet lately. I have a call into another for. anth. friend to see what he thinks about the bone marrow issue. Brazoria Co. and Manvel PD are receiving LOTS of calls and e-mails since the news articles came out...I wonder if any of them are worthwhile?

Have a sweet day, all,

[Jaded]

Okay--
you know you're an active sleuther when...
you go to a Starbucks, see a German Shepherd waiting patiently at an outside table waiting for his owner to come back out , and you think, "Lion...?" :eek:
Ha ha - I knew she couldn't really be inside, but for a split second she came to my mind!! :crazy:

Just checking in...it seems a bit quiet lately. I have a call into another for. anth. friend to see what he thinks about the bone marrow issue. Brazoria Co. and Manvel PD are receiving LOTS of calls and e-mails since the news articles came out...I wonder if any of them are worthwhile?

Have a sweet day, all,

I hope that one of the calls pays off. I so want to identify Princess Blue. If you hear anything, sloane please let us know.

[Lanie]

Have a great day, all. Lanie, I hope things are better in your area re: the flooding...are you and your home and family okay?

Well, I didn't realize it until the second rain came through, but water did seep in underneath my bathroom carpet. We vacuumed it as best as we could, and I have a box fan going in there nonstop. Other than that, we are all doing great.
I've sent my girls to Gainesville today to volunteer, and tomorrow my son and I go. (One of my daughters works with me, and we are trading out the work/volunteer stuff.)
Anyway...if I can quit dilly-dallying at this website, and get my work work done, lol, I can probably get to cracking on my block. My ability to procrastinate is astounding.
Lanie

[RKnowley]

Hi Sloane,

First off let me say it is wonderful that you identified one of your UIDs. Have you figured out if he has any family? I sure hope we can figure out who Princess Blue is. I am happy to hear that LE are receiving a number of calls and hopefully they will lead to Princess Blue's identity. The letter we have been sending out to class alumni is on the SKM site and we have sent out probably a total of close to 150 letters so far. I am getting 20 more ready to go. They will hopefully go out tomorrow (6/26). I wish my printer would be more cooperatative. I have to feed each sheet of paper in individually and then flip over. If not the printer either jams or picks up a piece of paper it's not supposed to and the it messes up the whole process :cool: But I'm getting close to having 20 more going out. Wahooo!

We have all worked together wonderfully on this project and hopefully there will be more projects like this one down the road. I would like to thank you for all the input and help you have put into helping US find out who Princess Blue is. Please let us know if you find out any new information on her. Thanks!

OT: Has anyone seen our Lion around in the last few days?? I'm getting worried about her.


Good morning all-
Sorry I've been away for awhile...the good news is one of my UIDs was identified recently!! :o The bad news is that it was likely a "criminal" ending to his life, so that opens a whole other branch of questions and investigations...I'm tired, but so happy he has his identity and many questions have been answered.
Now if only we could get to that point with our Princess Blue...I think we are well on our way, in great part due to dedicated sleuthers like you guys! Kudos to all of you who are working so diligently on the spreadsheets. I'm so happy so many letters are ready to go out! THANK YOU, THANK YOU! I haven't been to SKM in awhile...is the letter to the alums finalized??
:blushing: I'm embarrassed to say that I had not really considered the finanacial dedication some of you are putting into this until I read that RKnowley's sisters are donating stamps to her. That's a great idea...and so kind of them. With all the work she has put in, it's nice she won't have to use her money on top of that. I don't know how else to express it, RKnowley, Lion, Jaded, Lanie, Sable, rich, MrsG, MissieMt, teons, jules and anyone else I failed to mention off the top of my head....but, THANK YOU!!!! :clap:

Have a great day, all. Lanie, I hope things are better in your area re: the flooding...are you and your home and family okay?

[LionRun]

Hello friends:blowkiss:. Sorry for the absenteeism, but my internet has been down since last Thursday, and it just came back up about an hour ago! Yahoo! I am sorry I haven't been here, and I would have if I could have. Thank you for asking about me sloane and RKnowley:).

Congratulations times many sloane! I am so glad to hear that you had a match on a Prince Doe you probably worked very hard on. I am sorry to hear that there may have been foul play, yet your match may help solve it. Best to you in all of the wonderful things you do for humanity.

Great job RKnowley with your letters! I am still behind, and I need to catch up big time!

I think it is a good sign that people are calling in tips to Sgt. Coffman. It shows that Princess' story has reached some people, and eventually a good tip or two may come in. I am hoping and praying!

Oh, and sloane I love the way you described the GSD at the Starbucks. I bring my dogs there all the time for training and socialization. Well, the coffee is great and I get to use high speed internet, too!



Lion

[LionRun]

Hi sleuther friends:). Dr. Cecil Wingo has joined WS just today, and I posted on a thread that he posted on in Cold Cases, I invited him to check out Princess's threads, and that we would love for him to give us ideas and suggestions. Dr. Wingo is a retired Harris County doctor from the ME's office, although he was not the doctor for our Princess' case as I understand it.

Lion

[sloane]

Hi all-
Well, I have much info. to post, although, at the end of the day I don't know that it brings us any closer to PBlue's ID. BUT, I wanted to follow up though, on some info. I said I would look into.

First of all, may I say WELCOME!! to Dr. Wingo, should he be reading this. He would be a valuable voice, not only from the past, but from the particular area this case is based in. Great! He helped to retrieve P.Blue's remains from the scene, but did not actually examine her at the ME's offc., at least not on record. Pls. correct me if I am wrong, Wingo. I'm sure everyone would like to ask you about the rings found w/ her. Namely, which fingers were they all on? I would imagine it would be difficult to recall unless you retained photos, and I know you were involved in SOOO many cases over the years! But we appreciate your input. We already understand that her death is most likely going to be attributed to one of the known serial killers of that area, perhaps a certain man who is already serving life in prison for similar charges. But that doesn't help to determine WHO SHE WAS, unless he decides to reveal that, if he even knew, could remember, or cares.
That is the main focus here, if I may speak for everyone, to find out her identity, no matter how sordid her story may be. We all understand it is very likely she was a prostitute. That doesn't matter... Ppl. have worked very hard and long to think through this case and take action in ways they believe to be helpful, non-intrusive and caring. Hopefully it will all pay off. So...Wingo, please join us!

BRB,

[sloane]

Rknowley and Lion,
Thank you for your kind words re: my recent case that was ID'd. :blushing: I was only a small part of the whole story, but it still affects me and his photo is up on my pegboard so I won't forget as time goes by. It is turning into a pretty nasty case, with ties to several others, so this won't be going away anytime soon. Yes, RKnowley, unfortunately he had family...many children and at least one parent that we know of. He did not live a stellar life and was not a great example for his kids, but many times tried to straighten out and possibly could have...if he had had more time.

Anyway, this has nothing to do w/ THIS case except to validate once again the value of DNA and the need of family members of the missing to submit, so that there can be a comparison to UIDs. I know it must be a horrible, incomprehensible thought for some, to think they have to give something to some LE person so that in the future it can be checked against to see whether or not their loved one is deceased...my thoughts and sympathy go out to all of you reading who have been personally affected by such a situation. But it IS an important step, and can provide answers...

[sloane]

Well, what I wanted to post earlier, but something came up (imagine that, I got interrupted...sarcasm icon!), is that I heard back from not only one, but two forensic anthropologists and an ME re: some of our questions. Basically Lion was probabaly correct (no surprise there :p ) in that it is logical to surmise that the PMI (time since death) for P. Blue was much more likely to have been at most two years, and more likely w/in one year. This is still an ASSUMPTION bec. it was never stated forensically and it is much too late to have it looked at now, but this is based on IF there was viable bone marrow for the drug testing. I say IF, because they (the dr's.) brought up a good point:
because the opiates test came back negative could very well mean it was because the marrow was not viable enough for a proper analysis for the drugs to show up. They could have pulled the marrow and run it for certain drugs, and have it say,"negative" but not bec. there WEREN'T drugs at one point in her system, but rather, bec. the marrow sample was "weak." All also agreed that it seemed strange that there was only an "opiates" test run, not a complete toxicology test. Which may suggest they had reason to suspect an opiate or opiate-derivative (heroin, codeine, morphine,methoadone) may be there...for example, syringes near the remains. Or...it could mean that there WAS a complete tox screen run, and we just don't know about it!:silenced:

All the professionals also agreed w/ the previous for. anth. with whom I spoke about this subject, in that there is no documentation to show how bone marrow breaks down (like a rate), but they say there IS less of it in older ppl., overweight ppl., and persons w/ certain illnesses. Interesting...of course, we don't know how much was there in P.Blue's bones, anyway. But we do know she wasn't old!

Hope this answers some of our inquisitiveness,

[LionRun]

Well, what I wanted to post earlier, but something came up (imagine that, I got interrupted...sarcasm icon!), is that I heard back from not only one, but two forensic anthropologists and an ME re: some of our questions. Basically Lion was probabaly correct (no surprise there :p ) in that it is logical to surmise that the PMI (time since death) for P. Blue was much more likely to have been at most two years, and more likely w/in one year. This is still an ASSUMPTION bec. it was never stated forensically and it is much too late to have it looked at now, but this is based on IF there was viable bone marrow for the drug testing. I say IF, because they (the dr's.) brought up a good point:
because the opiates test came back negative could very well mean it was because the marrow was not viable enough for a proper analysis for the drugs to show up. They could have pulled the marrow and run it for certain drugs, and have it say,"negative" but not bec. there WEREN'T drugs at one point in her system, but rather, bec. the marrow sample was "weak." All also agreed that it seemed strange that there was only an "opiates" test run, not a complete toxicology test. Which may suggest they had reason to suspect an opiate or opiate-derivative (heroin, codeine, morphine,methoadone) may be there...for example, syringes near the remains. Or...it could mean that there WAS a complete tox screen run, and we just don't know about it!:silenced:

All the professionals also agreed w/ the previous for. anth. with whom I spoke about this subject, in that there is no documentation to show how bone marrow breaks down (like a rate), but they say there IS less of it in older ppl., overweight ppl., and persons w/ certain illnesses. Interesting...of course, we don't know how much was there in P.Blue's bones, anyway. But we do know she wasn't old!

Hope this answers some of our inquisitiveness,

Thank you sloane:). I am also thinking that if it had been as long as the 70's that Princess was out there there may have been NO bone marrow left, viable or not, for testing. Bodies left out in the open in hot, humid climates like the Houston area decompose very fast. Their teeth fall out in a shorter period of time as well, yet Princess has dentals on file.

Although, in a hot, dry climate bodies can mummify, and if buried in the cold will stay preserved for many years, that should not be the case here. But, because we do not know for sure, I will look at missing cases as old as the mid 70's. But, there will need other factors(height, ring, location missing from, etc..) for me to give it serious thought for a missing case from the mid 70's.

Sloane, I notice that you stated that Princess was very likely a prostitute. I know you don't care, and I sure don't care. Each unidentified Princess or Prince Doe deserves to be identified no matter what. But, I am wondering why you suggested that. Is it because prostitutes are more likely in general to be murdered by serial killers? Is it because a high number of the missing and murdered in the Houston area were prostitutes? Or is there something you know specifically that we don't know? You've got me thinking, friend:).

Lion

[Jaded]

Hi all. Just wanted you to know that I have spent the last few hours addressing and licking envelopes. *ick* LOL But I am more than glad to do this for our Princess Blue. I'm going to the post office today to mail the next batch of letters and to check our post office box for any replies. Cross your fingers that today will be the day we receive positive information. :)

[Lanie]

Hi all. Just wanted you to know that I have spent the last few hours addressing and licking envelopes. *ick* LOL But I am more than glad to do this for our Princess Blue. I'm going to the post office today to mail the next batch of letters and to check our post office box for any replies. Cross your fingers that today will be the day we receive positive information. :)

Try glue sticks, they are cheap, easy, and less messy than those water sponge thingys.

I'm so far behind in all the stuff I wanted to do. I leave on Monday, so I will do my very best to get as much done as I can before I go. My daughter is trying to register to this site as we speak, (well, as I type, lol), so I might get as many addresses as I can, then have her mail them out. She's signing up to a google email account, I will give you all her email addy, so you will know where this stuff is coming from.

[Spazkat9696]

Try glue sticks, they are cheap, easy, and less messy than those water sponge thingys.

I'm so far behind in all the stuff I wanted to do. I leave on Monday, so I will do my very best to get as much done as I can before I go. My daughter is trying to register to this site as we speak, (well, as I type, lol), so I might get as many addresses as I can, then have her mail them out. She's signing up to a google email account, I will give you all her email addy, so you will know where this stuff is coming from.

I just use a damp washcloth

[sloane]

Jaded, thank you for the work you've completed on the letters...would you like an Altoid? :p So...even one response yet? Even if it's not really anything to go on, will you let us know if ppl. write or call and tell us what they say? Even if they really have nothinjg to add, just knowing they responded is nice...sort of makes the attempt to "reach out" to them seem worthwhile. At least then we know some of them are actually opening the letters and taking it seriously.

And thanks again to everyone for spending your personal time and resources on this project. Someone mentioned a little while back (RKnowley, maybe??) that they hope this is one of many projects
"we" can work on together... maybe that would work out! I can think of at least a dozen that I know of that need more eyes...
warmly,

[sloane]

Thank you sloane:). I am also thinking that if it had been as long as the 70's that Princess was out there there may have been NO bone marrow left, viable or not, for testing. Bodies left out in the open in hot, humid climates like the Houston area decompose very fast. Their teeth fall out in a shorter period of time as well, yet Princess has dentals on file.

Although, in a hot, dry climate bodies can mummify, and if buried in the cold will stay preserved for many years, that should not be the case here. But, because we do not know for sure, I will look at missing cases as old as the mid 70's. But, there will need other factors(height, ring, location missing from, etc..) for me to give it serious thought for a missing case from the mid 70's.

Sloane, I notice that you stated that Princess was very likely a prostitute. I know you don't care, and I sure don't care. Each unidentified Princess or Prince Doe deserves to be identified no matter what. But, I am wondering why you suggested that. Is it because prostitutes are more likely in general to be murdered by serial killers? Is it because a high number of the missing and murdered in the Houston area were prostitutes? Or is there something you know specifically that we don't know? You've got me thinking, friend:).

Lion
Well, I was also told by my dr. contacts that when marrow is "all dried up" that they can still do bone scrapings to attempt to retrieve info. from what is clinging to the inside of the bone. I would think this would work more in searches for something that can withstand time and degradation like that, maybe not drugs or alcohol...that is only a supposition. I did not ask them that directly.

As far as thinking she was a prostitute, no that's not based on anything factual that I know, just experience (precedence). Prostitutes, unfortunately are "easy" targets, as are homeless persons, for violence, theft, abuse, intolerance, lack of patience/resources being exercised when there is a legal issue involving them, and yes, murder. Sorry to be so direct, but darn it, it is true. And yes, many victims/UIDs who are unclaimed, and seemingly not in the system are persons with such a life of crime...not only does it make it hard for ppl. to keep up w/ their whereabouts, but it makes it less noticeable when they have been gone from somwhere for awhile. And yes, there are many prostitutes in that particular region that have been victims of foul play. (In part, bec. Houston and its suburbs are so MASSIVE!!) Of course, this doesn't mean at all that she is any less impt. and that she in any way deserved this kind of inexcuseable ending to her young life. I can easily separate the two.

And..I could be wrong, of course. It could be nothing like this at all. Just don't want to get anyone's hopes up that this will be some beautiful story with a tragic end. If it turns out that she was a drug-user prostitute criminal who ran away from home as a teenager, many might think...why did she put herself in such a dangerous position in the first place? Well, I don't know if that is for us to question, even though it is natural. Our focus here seems to be staying on track of ID'ing her, so that's good.

Sorry, all, to have to be so blunt...:(

[LionRun]

Well, I was also told by my dr. contacts that when marrow is "all dried up" that they can still do bone scrapings to attempt to retrieve info. from what is clinging to the inside of the bone. I would think this would work more in searches for something that can withstand time and degradation like that, maybe not drugs or alcohol...that is only a supposition. I did not ask them that directly.

As far as thinking she was a prostitute, no that's not based on anything factual that I know, just experience (precedence). Prostitutes, unfortunately are "easy" targets, as are homeless persons, for violence, theft, abuse, intolerance, lack of patience/resources being exercised when there is a legal issue involving them, and yes, murder. Sorry to be so direct, but darn it, it is true. And yes, many victims/UIDs who are unclaimed, and seemingly not in the system are persons with such a life of crime...not only does it make it hard for ppl. to keep up w/ their whereabouts, but it makes it less noticeable when they have been gone from somwhere for awhile. And yes, there are many prostitutes in that particular region that have been victims of foul play. (In part, bec. Houston and its suburbs are so MASSIVE!!) Of course, this doesn't mean at all that she is any less impt. and that she in any way deserved this kind of inexcuseable ending to her young life. I can easily separate the two.

And..I could be wrong, of course. It could be nothing like this at all. Just don't want to get anyone's hopes up that this will be some beautiful story with a tragic end. If it turns out that she was a drug-user prostitute criminal who ran away from home as a teenager, many might think...why did she put herself in such a dangerous position in the first place? Well, I don't know if that is for us to question, even though it is natural. Our focus here seems to be staying on track of ID'ing her, so that's good.

Sorry, all, to have to be so blunt...:(

Thank you sloane for being blunt:). I like the facts, and I like it told like it is. I think it is more helpful that way. I fully understand that prostitutes, drug users and such are easy targets for rape and/or murder. I was just wondering if there was something found with Princess or what ever that may have indicated she may have been a prostitute. And, I only wanted to know that to see if we could check that angle and get a lead. I would care no less about her and ID'ng her if I knew she was a prostitute. I imagine others here who care about her probably feel as you and I do.

Lion

[Jesstexas]

Do we know for sure that the class ring came from Houston's Robert E. Lee High School? I only ask because I grew up in San Antonio (which is only three hours from Houston) and there's a Robert E. Lee High Schoool there as well.

[RKnowley]

Hi Jesstexas,
Yes, we are very certain the class ring came from Robert E Lee High School in Houston.
Here is a link with a photo of the ring:
http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/director_staff/public_information/pr060707photos.htm
It shows clearly that the ring is from the REL HS in Houston, Texas.

Do we know for sure that the class ring came from Houston's Robert E. Lee High School? I only ask because I grew up in San Antonio (which is only three hours from Houston) and there's a Robert E. Lee High Schoool there as well.

[Jesstexas]

Yes, indeed it does, RKnowley - thanks! It's so hard to believe that they haven't been able to figure out who she is yet - that ring is such a good clue.

[RKnowley]

Jess, that is for sure. She sure is a mystery girl. I hope we are able to figure out who she is. That would be wonderful. If you run across any possibilities on who Princess Blue may be please let us know. :)

Yes, indeed it does, RKnowley - thanks! It's so hard to believe that they haven't been able to figure out who she is yet - that ring is such a good clue.

[Jaded]

Jaded, thank you for the work you've completed on the letters...would you like an Altoid? :p So...even one response yet? Even if it's not really anything to go on, will you let us know if ppl. write or call and tell us what they say? Even if they really have nothinjg to add, just knowing they responded is nice...sort of makes the attempt to "reach out" to them seem worthwhile. At least then we know some of them are actually opening the letters and taking it seriously.

And thanks again to everyone for spending your personal time and resources on this project. Someone mentioned a little while back (RKnowley, maybe??) that they hope this is one of many projects
"we" can work on together... maybe that would work out! I can think of at least a dozen that I know of that need more eyes...
warmly,

An Altoid would have been lovely. LOL I was glad to do it. A few seconds of *ick* will be worthwhile if we can find the identity of Princess Blue. I also went through the other blocks of the list and added addresses when I found them. Hope no one minds that I reached outside of the block that I was working on. I was motivated this morning.
I just use a damp washcloth
Good idea!!
Try glue sticks, they are cheap, easy, and less messy than those water sponge thingys.

I'm so far behind in all the stuff I wanted to do. I leave on Monday, so I will do my very best to get as much done as I can before I go. My daughter is trying to register to this site as we speak, (well, as I type, lol), so I might get as many addresses as I can, then have her mail them out. She's signing up to a google email account, I will give you all her email addy, so you will know where this stuff is coming from.
Lanie, is she applying here or over at someoneknowsme.com where she will have access to the spreadsheet? Let me know. We do accept free email accounts. All of our new registrations are not validated, but we do check to make sure it's not the forum spammers who have been driving us nuts lately. We just felt that it would be easier for us to not have validation if someone who got a letter wanted to register - they wouldn't have to wait. We can deal with the spammer problem one internet gnat at a time. LOL

Well, I was also told by my dr. contacts that when marrow is "all dried up" that they can still do bone scrapings to attempt to retrieve info. from what is clinging to the inside of the bone. I would think this would work more in searches for something that can withstand time and degradation like that, maybe not drugs or alcohol...that is only a supposition. I did not ask them that directly.

As far as thinking she was a prostitute, no that's not based on anything factual that I know, just experience (precedence). Prostitutes, unfortunately are "easy" targets, as are homeless persons, for violence, theft, abuse, intolerance, lack of patience/resources being exercised when there is a legal issue involving them, and yes, murder. Sorry to be so direct, but darn it, it is true. And yes, many victims/UIDs who are unclaimed, and seemingly not in the system are persons with such a life of crime...not only does it make it hard for ppl. to keep up w/ their whereabouts, but it makes it less noticeable when they have been gone from somwhere for awhile. And yes, there are many prostitutes in that particular region that have been victims of foul play. (In part, bec. Houston and its suburbs are so MASSIVE!!) Of course, this doesn't mean at all that she is any less impt. and that she in any way deserved this kind of inexcuseable ending to her young life. I can easily separate the two.

And..I could be wrong, of course. It could be nothing like this at all. Just don't want to get anyone's hopes up that this will be some beautiful story with a tragic end. If it turns out that she was a drug-user prostitute criminal who ran away from home as a teenager, many might think...why did she put herself in such a dangerous position in the first place? Well, I don't know if that is for us to question, even though it is natural. Our focus here seems to be staying on track of ID'ing her, so that's good.

Sorry, all, to have to be so blunt...:(
Thank you for being blunt. It doesn't matter to me what Princess Blue's past may have been. In my mind she was a human being. Someone that had a personality and whether she had to prostitute or thieve to survive, that doesn't change the core person. Someone, somewhere loved her because she was "family". Families can look past social immorality because sometimes family is all ya' got. I think of Princess Blue as family. She's ours now to love and care about until we can give her back to the people that loved her before us.

[Jaded]

I will most certainly let everyone know if we get any responses. There were four returned envelopes for insufficient address. IMO, that's GREAT considering the amount of letters that have been sent out. Great sleuthing, friends!!

[LionRun]

An Altoid would have been lovely. LOL I was glad to do it. A few seconds of *ick* will be worthwhile if we can find the identity of Princess Blue. I also went through the other blocks of the list and added addresses when I found them. Hope no one minds that I reached outside of the block that I was working on. I was motivated this morning.

Good idea!!

Lanie, is she applying here or over at someoneknowsme.com where she will have access to the spreadsheet? Let me know. We do accept free email accounts. All of our new registrations are not validated, but we do check to make sure it's not the forum spammers who have been driving us nuts lately. We just felt that it would be easier for us to not have validation if someone who got a letter wanted to register - they wouldn't have to wait. We can deal with the spammer problem one internet gnat at a time. LOL


Thank you for being blunt. It doesn't matter to me what Princess Blue's past may have been. In my mind she was a human being. Someone that had a personality and whether she had to prostitute or thieve to survive, that doesn't change the core person. Someone, somewhere loved her because she was "family". Families can look past social immorality because sometimes family is all ya' got. I think of Princess Blue as family. She's ours now to love and care about until we can give her back to the people that loved her before us.

I think of Princess Blue as family, too. We have grown to care so much about who she may have been in life, and we want to do right by her in death.

Lion

[Jaded]

I think of Princess Blue as family, too. We have grown to care so much about who she may have been in life, and we want to do right by her in death.

Lion

I 100% agree. Until we can return her to her family, she's one of us. I hope and pray that we can solve the mystery of her identify.

[Lanie]

Sloane, I would also like to say HURRAY!! to you for getting a name on your UID case. My social skills seem to be non-existant from lack of use. :(
I am leaving for overseas Monday, and I am trying to get all of our stuff done before I go. We have been having a whole lot of extra rain around here, and it has created unexpected problems for me, and taken a lot of my time. On my block, I have found marriage information for almost all the females, and I was working on getting addresses. I have 5, and have the envelopes ready. I got thrown off balance when I lost access to the spreadsheet temporarily, and that is about the same time everything else came up, so I haven't made any more progress. I have been talking to my daughter about some of the stuff on this website, and she is very interested. She wanted to join Websleuths, so I asked her if she would be willing to pick up my slack while I was gone. I was just going to give her my info and let her email it to one of you to enter in the spreadsheet, and also get my 5 envelopes stuffed and mailed. (I didn't know if we were supposed to also include a list of alumni with the letter, so are we, and if so, where do I find it?) Anyway, every email address she tries to sign up with comes back banned. I tried emailing Tricia, but haven't heard back (haven't checked yet this morning). I thought it might be because we are both on the same IP address. I'm just going to let her use my account while I am gone, and we'll work it out when I get back. She starts a new job next week, so I don't know how much time she will have after that.
If I think of anything else, I'll post it. I've got so much work still to do, plus packing, and I'm still struggling with procrastination, sigh.
Lanie

[sloane]

Lanie- First of all, GIVE YOURSELF A BREAK!! It's okay that you are "only" as far as you are. All of us have lives surrounding (and besides) our interest in this forum, and all of us understand that. Don't worry about how much you need to do. Start w/ your personal committments, before this. Perhaps your daughter can help, or someone else can while you are gone, if not, work on it when you can. How long will you be away? I hope it is a fun trip!:p

Secondly, thank you for your nice thought re: "my" recent UID case being "solved." Only part of it is solved, of course. Now there is the crime of it...

Thank you for your interest in P. Blue's case!

[sloane]

Thank you for being blunt. It doesn't matter to me what Princess Blue's past may have been. In my mind she was a human being. Someone that had a personality and whether she had to prostitute or thieve to survive, that doesn't change the core person. Someone, somewhere loved her because she was "family". Families can look past social immorality because sometimes family is all ya' got. I think of Princess Blue as family. She's ours now to love and care about until we can give her back to the people that loved her before us.
This is indeed a lovely thought and moral code by which to live. :innocent:
I believe that a person can choose their "family." The persons that are your blood are not nec. the best persons to surround yourself with. For the lucky some, they may be. I know plenty of families that are beautiful and loving and functioning normally. Unfortunately, I know of 10 times that many that are not. I think one can choose whom to be associated with, whom to surround himself with, and whom to love and care about. It's wonderful that there is a group here of "surrogate" family for P. Blue !

Keep up the nice work, and thanks for the update on the P.O.Box, Jaded!

[Lanie]

Lanie- First of all, GIVE YOURSELF A BREAK!! It's okay that you are "only" as far as you are. All of us have lives surrounding (and besides) our interest in this forum, and all of us understand that. Don't worry about how much you need to do. Start w/ your personal committments, before this. Perhaps your daughter can help, or someone else can while you are gone, if not, work on it when you can. How long will you be away? I hope it is a fun trip!:p

Secondly, thank you for your nice thought re: "my" recent UID case being "solved." Only part of it is solved, of course. Now there is the crime of it...

Thank you for your interest in P. Blue's case!


Lol, when I was talking about all I had to get done, I meant my real job. I get very absorbed in all this research, and I neglected my job some, and then I had extra piled up because I was leaving on this trip.
Hi from Paris. We finally made it. I don't know if anyone caught the news yesterday about a Heathrow terminal being shut down because of ??whatever, but that was my terminal. My daughter and I, along with all the other passengers, spent about 6.5 hours sitting on the plane at the gate, except for the 30 min or so when we were brought back into the terminal (evacuated) to have our persons and our stuff sniffed by dogs. Two of these dogs cracked me up, they looked like slightly larger than normal cocker spaniels with border collie coloring, but they were good at their job. I still don't know what happened, they wouldn't tell us anything, and the only news I saw was in French. I'll look it up later. Anyway, we left our