Madeleine McCann 3 year old missing in Portugal - Part 7

[WindChime]

I removed part 6 due to some heated post. I'm WARNING everyone right now get a grip on it or this thread will be totaly closed and timeouts will be given.

PART 6
http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=50759

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[Shazza]

Hi everyone, I think I had something to do with the other thread being closed, if so, am very sorry. I only want Madelaine to be found safe and well.

[WindChime]

I will be moving thread #6 back once I review it and delete any post that may be needed to be deleted.

[Taximom]

I just have one question before I post on this thread: was the "attack" by WSer's to other posters or by WSer's to the McCann's?

I wouldn't attack other WS'ers but I have a few choice thoughts about the McCann's. Just want to be clear before I say anything! TIA.

[Shazza]

Thankyou Windchime, I personally do not feel like I was attacking, but if that is how it came across, I deeply apologise.

[BethInAK]

Windchime and everyone.
I'm sure I agreed to a TOS when I signed up for WS, but that was long ago and I perhaps don't know whats permitted here and whats not. I personally didn't see any personal attacks. I'm wondering if there is a TOS I can read thats specific about whats permissable to discuss and how much its permissable to "argue about our opinions".

[WindChime]

Just so that our members now I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU I have one page left to read and so far I DO NOT FIND ANY OF YOU ATTRACTING the family of this precious little girls family. IMO What these parents did is wrong it's against the laws to leave your your young children alone at any time let alone taking them on vacation to a strange country and while your out at night wining and dining and having a hay old time you leave your children alone with the doors unlocked.

[CaliKid]

Just so that our members now I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU I have one page left to read and so far I DO NOT FIND ANY OF YOU ATTRACTING the family of this precious little girls family. IMO What these parents did is wrong it's against the laws to leave your your young children alone at any time let alone taking them on vacation to a strange country and while your out at night wining and dining and having a hay old time you leave your children alone with the doors unlocked.

Thank you, WindChime. I think I speak for most of us on the Madeleine thread when I say we totally disagree with what the McCanns did and believe this is a clear case of neglect. But we aren't mounting a personal vendetta against them.

[Shazza]

Thank you, WindChime. I think I speak for most of us on the Madeleine thread when I say we totally disagree with what the McCanns did and believe this is a clear case of neglect. But we aren't mounting a personal vendetta against them.
I was not personally attacking a WS member, but I was stating my opinions about the McCanns which another poster said I was attacking them, but we cleared that up and ended up having a civil conversation. We dont agree on the word attack, buy hey thats cool, we all think differently, and I do respect the posters on WS, but it is the topic Im giving my opinions on not the poster.

[CaliKid]

Another Madeleine sighting in Malta:
http://www.postchronicle.com/news/original/article_21291122.shtml

Despite Malta sighting, Police say Madeleine is in Portugal
http://www.nationalledger.com/artman/publish/article_272614657.shtml

British PM Brown discusses Madeleine case with Portugal PM Socrates:
http://www.politics.co.uk/news/zopinion-former-index/foreign-policy/brown-thanks-portugal-over-madeleine-mccann-$475815.htm

Murat Re-interviewed
http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/international.cfm?id=1077792007

[Salem]

British PM Brown discusses Madeleine case with Portugal PM Socrates:
http://www.politics.co.uk/news/zopinion-former-index/foreign-policy/brown-thanks-portugal-over-madeleine-mccann-$475815.htm



`snip ~
Mr Brown this morning held talks with the Portuguese prime minister Jose Socrates.

It is the first meeting between the two leaders since Mr Brown was appointed prime minister and comes as Portugal assumes the EU presidency.

Mr Socrates is pushing for progress on the EU Treaty, agreed in draft form at last month's EU summit.

He wants to push for a Treaty of Lisbon in October and today told Mr Brown Europe had to move from a mandate to a formalised treaty.

Talks on the wording of the treaty began on July 23. Mr Brown affirmed today the UK would seek to see its "negotiating objectives" in the detail of the agreement.
~ end snip ~

Is it just me, or does anyone else find it interesting that all this reinterviewing of suspects and hints of development in Madeleine's case follow the talk between Brown and Socrates?

Am I seeing conspiracies where there are none?

Moongodesss - what say you? Is there a link between Socrates wanting something from Brown and the new activity on the case? Are politics at play here?

Salem

[Salem]

I think all these little press leaks are very interesting. Portugal LE are very tight-lipped and now we are seeing leaks that something is about to happen, the one and only suspect is being reinterviewed, more than one person involved, the parents have no comment....

Is something really up? or is this to make the UK happy so Brown will support Socrates' political agenda? or is this to throw the parents off guard?

Hmmmmm......

Salem

[BethInAK]

I think all these little press leaks are very interesting. Portugal LE are very tight-lipped and now we are seeing leaks that something is about to happen, the one and only suspect is being reinterviewed, more than one person involved, the parents have no comment....

Is something really up? or is this to make the UK happy so Brown will support Socrates' political agenda? or is this to throw the parents off guard?

Hmmmmm......

Salem

I personally believe that PE is entirely clueless.

[docwho3]

I hesitate to condemn the Portuguese L.E. in their investigations. They may not have the training in forensic science or the tools to go along with it (or they may have- I don't know) but that does not mean they don't perhaps have some very sharp minds. And also there are people looking at this thing internationally-right?

This crime might well have gone unsolved in this country for just as long a time. The child, if she was truly kidnapped, was taken when circumstances were favorable and so there may not be the evidence we would all hope would have been found.

I hope that the recent hints of action in the case pan out because I am thinking that this case could well be one of those few that go unsolved for 70 years or so.

[CaliKid]

I think the P-LE are undermanned, under-funded and slightly overwhelmed. I'd hate to call them complacent about child abductions, but either they haven't had many or the investigations are so low-key nothing gets accomplished. And then Madeleine's disappearance gets dropped into their laps.

[Shazza]

I think the New Prime Minister was just throwing his two cents worth in about Madelaine, he is more focused on the EU treaty, and keeping in good with socrates.

The investigation is no further ahead than it was when Madelaine went missing.

[MoonGoddess]

H'yall:blowkiss:

I haven't quite got my head around what has happened here:confused: but I am guessing that this thread is in danger of going down the route of DS.

I respect the moderators in their attempt to maintain a sense of decorum:) I hope that we are allowed to continue in our search for the Truth in this. TBH this is why I haven't posted, I do get so enraged by some of the antics of the 'Team' and their supporters and I have to step away from my computor.........

Anyway you know I love all you guys:) I had my mouth in my stomach for most of the day yesterday whilst Murat was with the PLE - I will be stunned if it turns out he played any part in the allleged abduction of Madeleine.

Hey! maybe we should all take up jogging?..... it seems to be working for some involved in all this :rolleyes: - whilst the rest of us are bordering on a mental breakdown!

See you later:blowkiss:

[MoonGoddess]

This is an excellent site for up to the minute information:-

http://formadeleine.proboards106.com/index.cgi?board=news&action=display&thread=1180304465&page=28

I think I recognise some familiar faces from here?..... I really am struggling finding my way around all these forums:confused:

[april4sky]

Hi everyone, I think I had something to do with the other thread being closed, if so, am very sorry. I only want Madelaine to be found safe and well.
Hi Shazza, I really don't think it had anything to do with you. I think it involved me and another poster. I don't know if i'm allowed to say who so I won't. I'm sorry the thread was closed. Prayers for Madeleine.

[Shazza]

Hi Shazza, I really don't think it had anything to do with you. I think it involved me and another poster. I don't know if i'm allowed to say who so I won't. I'm sorry the thread was closed. Prayers for Madeleine.
Hey it happens, this case is enough to send anyone round the twist, we all get frustrated and feel helpless, we want to help but dont know how, or are too far away. Of course there are going to be difference of opinions, we all dont think alike, and therefore arguments and disagreements are part and parcel of debating about something we all feel very strongly about. We all have one thing in common and that is the safe return of Madelaine, lets focus on her and how the investigation is going.

Anyway april4sky my name is Shazza, glad to meet you.

[SeriouslySearching]

I don't even know what you guys are talking about...but I think the thread is redundant at best. How many times can we chastize the parents and how many times can we say we are sorry for Maddy? Outside of that, I never read any news. "He said in his blog...mom looks this way"...but never any real news. This case is cold. Sorry, but they did all the wrong things to begin with. Everyone did. What are the chances we will find poor Maddy? Slim. So why don't we make this a thread of being positive for children, in hopes of helping Maddy? Let's put our energy into naming perps in those regions and sending letters to whomever to see them.

[Shazza]

I don't even know what you guys are talking about...but I think the thread is redundant at best. How many times can we chastize the parents and how many times can we say we are sorry for Maddy? Outside of that, I never read any news. "He said in his blog...mom looks this way"...but never any real news. This case is cold. Sorry, but they did all the wrong things to begin with. Everyone did. What are the chances we will find poor Maddy? Slim. So why don't we make this a thread of being positive for children, in hopes of helping Maddy? Let's put our energy into naming perps in those regions and sending letters to whomever to see them.

That is a good idea SS but I cant get Madelaine out of my mind, even though she may never be found, Im not ready to give up on her yet, I still feel there is hope and until proven otherwise I will keep posting and reading whatever information I can.

[SeriouslySearching]

Great! If it is pertinent info! I am sorry, but all I have seen thread after thread here is not. I wish we could turn it into something productive!

[april4sky]

Hey it happens, this case is enough to send anyone round the twist, we all get frustrated and feel helpless, we want to help but dont know how, or are too far away. Of course there are going to be difference of opinions, we all dont think alike, and therefore arguments and disagreements are part and parcel of debating about something we all feel very strongly about. We all have one thing in common and that is the safe return of Madelaine, lets focus on her and how the investigation is going.

Anyway april4sky my name is Shazza, glad to meet you.
Hi Shazza, This time I completely agree with you....Feels good. :) Hopefully we will chat again sometime, maybe on another thread where we are both on the same page...I think I would enjoy that....or better yet, God willing when Madeleine is found safe and well. And my name is April and i'm very pleased to have met you too.

[Shazza]

Great! If it is pertinent info! I am sorry, but all I have seen thread after thread here is not. I wish we could turn it into something productive!
We do seem to keep rehashing old news, I think whilst Im talking about her she is still alive, and there is a chance she will be found. I dont know why I cant let this go, I just think she needs to be brought home, whether alive or dead and then there will be closure.

[Shazza]

Hi Shazza, This time I completely agree with you....Feels good. :) Hopefully we will chat again sometime, maybe on another thread where we are both on the same page...I think I would enjoy that....or better yet, God willing when Madeleine is found safe and well. And my name is April and i'm very pleased to have met you too.
I will look forward to talking to you on another thread about a different subject, as Im sure we will have a lot in common.:)

[MrsG728]

I agree with SS... I believe it has gone cold. Whomever took Maddie was long gone (out of town) with her before LE could even get their hands on this case.
I don't mind all the talking about (mainland) Europe LE- my family is from Italy, and we can safely assume that they don't ALL have the technology or the wherewithall to handle something like this on such a large scale. I firmly believe that in some european countries, LE is much more easily influenced by bribery and "thug mentality" than in the UK and the US. I know for a fact it is in Italy; my uncle is a police officer in a small city.
For example, WHY does LE seem to think she's still in Portugal? are they trying to throw off the media or are they trying to tell the truth or are they trying to lure someone? I think the lack of answers is an indication that there are no new real solid leads, and that they may feel helpless.
This is just my opinion, but I haven't seen any real new news on Maddie's case lately.

[SeriouslySearching]

It is tragic. I feel the same way. However, it isn't good for anyone to sit and dwell. Turn this into an opportunity to do something about it.

[Reannan]

From Sky News:
"Three close friends of Madeleine McCann's parents are among people being questioned by Portuguese police over the missing girl, a source has said. Detectives from the Policia Judiciaria (PJ) are speaking to Rachael Oldfield, Russell O'Brien and Fiona Payne to go over their accounts of events on May 3. ........ Police have already interviewed the party in detail including one woman - who has not been named - who saw a girl being carried away by a man in Praia Da Luz and now believes it was Madeleine. A spokeswoman for the McCann family said that the three were due to be re-interviewed at the PJ headquarters in Portimao."

http://preview.tinyurl.com/2hcsvw

I think it is very telling that the Portugese police are still interviewing the friends of the family. It is also interesting that the English friends are being intereviewed in Portimao....does that mean they have to return to Portugal? I also sort of wonder if the parents are still in Portugal because they are suspects and CAN'T leave?

[Shazza]

From Sky News:
"Three close friends of Madeleine McCann's parents are among people being questioned by Portuguese police over the missing girl, a source has said. Detectives from the Policia Judiciaria (PJ) are speaking to Rachael Oldfield, Russell O'Brien and Fiona Payne to go over their accounts of events on May 3. ........ Police have already interviewed the party in detail including one woman - who has not been named - who saw a girl being carried away by a man in Praia Da Luz and now believes it was Madeleine. A spokeswoman for the McCann family said that the three were due to be re-interviewed at the PJ headquarters in Portimao."

http://preview.tinyurl.com/2hcsvw

I think it is very telling that the Portugese police are still interviewing the friends of the family. It is also interesting that the English friends are being intereviewed in Portimao....does that mean they have to return to Portugal? I also sort of wonder if the parents are still in Portugal because they are suspects and CAN'T leave?

This is the first time that I have heard that the friends of the McCanns who were with them on the night of Madelaines disappearance have been questioned. Im glad they are being interviewed again, somebody in that party knows something about Madelaines disappearance.

[SeriouslySearching]

I would only hope so. Now...let's find out who the predators are out there and why we should not tread their beaches!

[Jdee]

I don't even know what you guys are talking about...but I think the thread is redundant at best. How many times can we chastize the parents and how many times can we say we are sorry for Maddy? Outside of that, I never read any news. "He said in his blog...mom looks this way"...but never any real news. This case is cold. Sorry, but they did all the wrong things to begin with. Everyone did. What are the chances we will find poor Maddy? Slim. So why don't we make this a thread of being positive for children, in hopes of helping Maddy? Let's put our energy into naming perps in those regions and sending letters to whomever to see them.

I agree and I think it's because there is just no new news coming out. However one thought I had this morning with the news that they are reinterviewing the M's friends... We have for so long poured all our focus onto the parents we have let slip by the 'friends' that were also checking in on the kids. Or so it has been stated in the news. It could very easily have been one of them that perhaps came in and found Madeleine a bit disruptive and got a bit too harsh with her.... you get my point here. It seems a LOT of 'people' were in that room that night IF they are telling a scrap of truth about checking in on those kids so anyone one of them is suspect to me.
Another thing is it has been stated there is a lot of descrepincies in Murat's story of if he was in the room that night or not. They could be going back to the 'group' to try and find a witness that could place him there that night. IF they could then that would blow a hole in his story.

[Jdee]

From G's blog:

"The investigation into Madelienes disapperance remains very active and we note that the Portuguese police are conducting a series of interviews today and tomorrow."

So he STILL can't spell Madeleine's name right...:rolleyes:

[SeriouslySearching]

I agree and I think it's because there is just no new news coming out. However one thought I had this morning with the news that they are reinterviewing the M's friends... We have for so long poured all our focus onto the parents we have let slip by the 'friends' that were also checking in on the kids. Or so it has been stated in the news. It could very easily have been one of them that perhaps came in and found Madeleine a bit disruptive and got a bit too harsh with her.... you get my point here. It seems a LOT of 'people' were in that room that night IF they are telling a scrap of truth about checking in on those kids so anyone one of them is suspect to me.
Another thing is it has been stated there is a lot of descrepincies in Murat's story of if he was in the room that night or not. They could be going back to the 'group' to try and find a witness that could place him there that night. IF they could then that would blow a hole in his story.
Which would then be news! But...until then...all we have is speculation and we feed into the bigger picture of targeting the parents in all of this which gets all of us nowhere. I would like to see WSers DO something besides badmouth the parents and actually take an active role to save another child from such a fate...no matter how bad the parents are. WE can and must point out places and people where everyone is at risk. Find and name them. Pedophiles are not protected here by law as to their names or whereabouts. Shouldn't we be making other people in other countries aware of our ills of society before they prey on their children in other countries? Shouldn't we know where they are and let others know why we want them monitored in every country around the globe?

[SieSie]

I just wanted to thank BadKat, petra and Jdee for their replies to my question for map info.

The thread where they replied is now closed (Part 6, page 20 (http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=50759&page=20)) and I was unable to thank them there. Copying their posts over here in case anyone else missed these informative links.


Here you go. I think far too many people haven't seen this. This isn't the original one I saw, however it is just as telling. Not nearby, in my opinion.

http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...ine20McCan.jpg



http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/6662723.stm

scorll to bottom



Heres some good pictures of the crime scene.

http://gazetadigitalmadeleinecase.bl...luz-crime.html


Great info, thanks gang!! :blowkiss:

[CarpeDiem]

This is the first time that I have heard that the friends of the McCanns who were with them on the night of Madelaines disappearance have been questioned. Im glad they are being interviewed again, somebody in that party knows something about Madelaines disappearance.

It is soooo about time! How many of us were pleading weeks ago for this! Hope is coming back!

[luvbeaches]

They were, both are charged with five counts of involuntary manslaughter and one count of making false reports to police (they lied about a babysitter being present sending the police on a two day search for an imaginary teen). They are also charged with recklessly endangering firefighters and endangering the welfare of children.

CarpeDiem...

Thanks for that information. What fools to put children and then the FD in danger when they left the kids alone.

And the children paid the ultimate price...they died...because their mom's were irresponsible.

I have no sympathy for the McCann's. All my thoughts are with Maddie. Poor thing.

[CaliKid]

This is an excellent site for up to the minute information:-

http://formadeleine.proboards106.com/index.cgi?board=news&action=display&thread=1180304465&page=28

I think I recognise some familiar faces from here?..... I really am struggling finding my way around all these forums:confused:

I'm on this board but don't post much. Every time I say anything on it that even suggests McCann neglect I get 20 other members jumping on me with their excuses and accusations. They insist that I must think I'm a perfect parent who never makes a mistake and then claim most parents do the same thing the McCanns did. Then they ask "don't you think the parents are suffering enough?" and claim our attacks on them aren't helping anyone find Madeleine. It makes me sick to my stomach.

But I'll agree, if you can wade through the nausea, they do have a lot of early-breaking news because several members live in Portugal.

[BethInAK]

I'm on this board but don't post much. Every time I say anything on it that even suggests McCann neglect I get 20 other members jumping on me with their excuses and accusations. They insist that I must think I'm a perfect parent who never makes a mistake and then claim most parents do the same thing the McCanns did. Then they ask "don't you think the parents are suffering enough?" and claim our attacks on them aren't helping anyone find Madeleine. It makes me sick to my stomach.


I hope those people aren't parents.

[BadKat]

Reading the post about those five kids dying in a fire while their mothers were off having a good old time got me to thinking.

I wonder how many people would be so supportive of the McCanns if, under the exact same circumstances, one of their children had started and fire and if, as a consequence, one or all three of the children died.

Would the parents leaving them alone then qualify as being neglectful?

If so, then why isn't that the case because one child was allegedly abducted?

I don't get it either. And I can't get nary a one to explain it even though I would sorely like to understand.

Kat



I'm on this board but don't post much. Every time I say anything on it that even suggests McCann neglect I get 20 other members jumping on me with their excuses and accusations. They insist that I must think I'm a perfect parent who never makes a mistake and then claim most parents do the same thing the McCanns did. Then they ask "don't you think the parents are suffering enough?" and claim our attacks on them aren't helping anyone find Madeleine. It makes me sick to my stomach.

But I'll agree, if you can wade through the nausea, they do have a lot of early-breaking news because several members live in Portugal.

[Reannan]

CaliKid, I also visit the board posted by MoonGoddess, and I don't post much anymore either. I don't agree with a lot of what they say, but I have to hand it to them - they are the best source of up to date news I have found anywhere on the web, and they have got to be some of the most tireless, dedicated, and deeply committed people I have ever encountered. They truly care about Madeleine, and are in my opinion, therefore, good people. Anyway, I just discovered this youtube video, and I have posted it over there, and I also wanted to share it with you. I think a ray of light, and a glimmer of hope is needed every now and then when you deal with issues like those here at WS's and with the Madeleine case. It is a video of the performance of a little 6 year old girl who reminds me of Madeleine. Her name is Connie, and she is auditioning at the English equivalent to American Idol. Enjoy:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=En0A8KGMgq8

[CaliKid]

From Sky News:
"Three close friends of Madeleine McCann's parents are among people being questioned by Portuguese police over the missing girl, a source has said. Detectives from the Policia Judiciaria (PJ) are speaking to Rachael Oldfield, Russell O'Brien and Fiona Payne to go over their accounts of events on May 3. ........ Police have already interviewed the party in detail including one woman - who has not been named - who saw a girl being carried away by a man in Praia Da Luz and now believes it was Madeleine. A spokeswoman for the McCann family said that the three were due to be re-interviewed at the PJ headquarters in Portimao."

http://preview.tinyurl.com/2hcsvw

I think it is very telling that the Portugese police are still interviewing the friends of the family. It is also interesting that the English friends are being intereviewed in Portimao....does that mean they have to return to Portugal? I also sort of wonder if the parents are still in Portugal because they are suspects and CAN'T leave?

Some of these names are now familiar due to the Sol Report that came out last week about the night of May 3. Look at the 4th comment down for the full report.

http://forums.mirror.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=1140&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=7035

Jane Tanner is the friend mentioned above who saw a child being carried by a man before Madeleine was discovered missing. Her husband/boyfriend is Russell O’Brien. Rachael Oldfield is married to Mathew Oldfield. Fiona Payne is a new name, but there was also another woman present named Najova Chekaya. Including the McCanns, there were nine at dinner that night.

[CaliKid]

CaliKid, I also visit the board posted by MoonGoddess, and I don't post much anymore either. I don't agree with a lot of what they say, but I have to hand it to them - they are the best source of up to date news I have found anywhere on the web, and they have got to be some of the most tireless, dedicated, and deeply committed people I have ever encountered. They truly care about Madeleine, and are in my opinion, therefore, good people. Anyway, I just discovered this youtube video, and I have posted it over there, and I also wanted to share it with you. I think a ray of light, and a glimmer of hope is needed every now and then when you deal with issues like those here at WS's and with the Madeleine case. It is a video of the performance of a little 6 year old girl who reminds me of Madeleine. Her name is Connie, and she is auditioning at the English equivalent to American Idol. Enjoy:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=En0A8KGMgq8



Oh, she is so sweet. Her singing made me cry. And she does look exactly like I imagine Madeleine would look in two years.

[CarpeDiem]

Oh, she is so sweet. Her singing made me cry. And she does look exactly like I imagine Madeleine would look in two years.

She is so very sweet. I was following that contest, as I was rooting for Paul Potts whom won. After the announcement, that little girl showed maturity and heart beyond her year's.

[englishleigh]

OMG, what a precious little girl, and she really does look like Madeleine!! She has an angel's voice. I hope she does get to sing for the Queen in the end, at another time. I loved seeing how she shocked Simon almost speechless with her talent.

[Shazza]

Connie was a breath of fresh air, wasnt she just great. It was what we needed, tears of happiness not sadness.:)

[CaliKid]

http://sol.sapo.pt/PaginaInicial/Sociedade/Interior.aspx?content_id=44677

From the SOL website- Policia Judiciaria is going to confront the three elements of the group that was spending holidays with Madeleine’s parents in Praia da Luz, with the statement of the person who is until now the only arguido in the process of the disappearance of the english child.

The four persons who are being inquired are going to be submitted to a confrontation, in order to clarify the truth about what happened on the night of the kidnapping, given the fact that the statements are contradictory.

Among the english that were spending their vacation with Madeleine’s parents at the Ocean Club and are going to be heard today, are the couple Russell O’Brien and Jane Tanner.

We are reminded that a SOL investigation concluded that Russell was the group’s element who was absent for the greatest amount of time, during the dinner that was held on the night Madeleine McCann disappeared.

The testimony of a resort employee confirms that a few days earlier, it was also Russell O’Brien who had been absent during the group’s dinner.

Jane Tanner is one of the key witnesses of the process, given the fact that she claims to have seen a man carrying a child, during one of her trips to the apartments to check on the children.

The english woman states she saw a man aged 35-40, with dark hair, wearing beige trousers, a dark jacket and classic black shoes, carrying a girl, who was wearing a pyjama and was barefoot.

Yet, this portrait does not fully coincide with Murat, given the fact that he never wore his hair long at the neck, which is how Jane describes the man she saw.

Although Jane describes the individual with good detail, Jeremy Wilkins – another witness who was on the street at the exact moment when Jane says she saw the suspect – guaranteed to SOL that he saw neither Jane nor any suspect, adding that if this had happened, it would have been ‘practically impossible’ not noticing the ocurrence.

Another aspect that the police will want to clarify is whether Robert Murat was at the Ocean Club on the night Maddie vanished.

The McCann’s friends confirm they saw the arguido at the resort in Praia da Luz, but staff and GNR elements deny this version.

http://tinyurl.com/2r6xj4
Here is another article about the same information. At the end it says:

Yesterday police also quizzed Antonio Toscano, a Spanish freelance journalist, who has repeatedly claimed to have information about Madeleine's abductor.

He says a repeat sex offender known as the 'Frenchman' may have taken her on behalf of a paedophile network. But Mr Sousa said: 'We have checked all the information that he has provided and have already said that it is a line which is not very strong, not consistent.'

[petra]

Latest Update - Gerry's Blog/Diary

Day 69 - 11/07/2007

This morning got off to a bad start when we were called, even before the twins were awake, by a reputable press agency saying that a body had been found and asking if it was true. It is very disappointing that this person did not check out the source of this rumour before contacting our representatives. Such calls and rumours are distressing even though we know if it does not come through an official source not to place much emphasis on it.

The Portuguese police interviewed three of our friends again today, to clarify points in their initial statements. As most of you will know, there is a lot of misleading information being published, both in the press and on the internet, about the events leading up to Madeleine's disappearance and the criminal investigation. We would like to give more information, especially about inaccurate and hurtful reports, but cannot for fear of prejudicing any subsequent court proceedings. The Portuguese police have made it clear to us that all witnesses should not divulge or discuss the information they have provided. Kate and I are, of course not party to all of the information coming into the inquiry for sound operational reasons.

Similarly a lot of people have asked to learn more about Madeleines likes and dislikes. This is information which we have been advised not to distribute publicly because of the risk of it being used in potential extortion attempts. The arrests recently in The Netherlands and Spain show that such information could be used negatively in the wrong hands

[petra]

Madeleine's Parents Learn Portuguese

Updated: 09:02, Thursday July 12, 2007
<H2>Madeleine McCann's parents are learning Portuguese as they make plans for an indefinite stay in the country to continue the search for their daughter.

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1274868,00.html

</H2>

[Shazza]

Madeleine's Parents Learn Portuguese

Updated: 09:02, Thursday July 12, 2007
<H2>Madeleine McCann's parents are learning Portuguese as they make plans for an indefinite stay in the country to continue the search for their daughter.

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1274868,00.html

</H2>
When they have masteres the Portuguese language, I hope they get out with a lot of Madelaines posters and start asking questions. I would be out there everyday from dawn till dusk asking as many people as I can if they have seen Madelaine or heard or knows anything that might help find Madelaine.

[Salem]

Petra - both of your last two posts are encouraging to me. At least McCanns are acknowledging there are questions regarding the investigation and are speaking directly about the lack of information. Maybe their new representative that helps with the blog has a little common sense?

And I am encouraged that they are learning Portugese. To me, that is something a parent would do if their child went missing in a different country. I know for me, that I would very much want to be able to understand what was being said around me, how the criminal system works and, more than anything, like Shazza says, I would want to be able to talk to the locals, the people that were near the scene of the event and of course the investigators. I have a slightly suspicious mind and I would never completely trust a translator when it was something as precious as my daughter that was being discussed.

Okay - it is almost Friday (or is Friday) in Portugal now, right? Where is the big news or the big arrest?

I have my fingers crossed it comes soon.

Oh - and did anyone else hear rumors about a body being found? or just the McCanns? That has to be heart wrenching.

Prayers for Madeleine, may she come home soon!

Salem

[Salem]

I would only hope so. Now...let's find out who the predators are out there and why we should not tread their beaches!

I think this is a great idea and would appreciate any tips or ideas you have about trying to find these guys. I know how to use the Megan's Law database here in the states, but I don't know about those same types of databases outside the states.

If you (or someone) can give me a push in the right direction (even just tell me what to google) I can probably take it from there......

Thanks,

Salem

[april4sky]

Petra - both of your last two posts are encouraging to me. At least McCanns are acknowledging there are questions regarding the investigation and are speaking directly about the lack of information. Maybe their new representative that helps with the blog has a little common sense?

And I am encouraged that they are learning Portugese. To me, that is something a parent would do if their child went missing in a different country. I know for me, that I would very much want to be able to understand what was being said around me, how the criminal system works and, more than anything, like Shazza says, I would want to be able to talk to the locals, the people that were near the scene of the event and of course the investigators. I have a slightly suspicious mind and I would never completely trust a translator when it was something as precious as my daughter that was being discussed.

Okay - it is almost Friday (or is Friday) in Portugal now, right? Where is the big news or the big arrest?

I have my fingers crossed it comes soon.

Oh - and did anyone else hear rumors about a body being found? or just the McCanns? That has to be heart wrenching.

Prayers for Madeleine, may she come home soon!

Salem
Hi Salem. There is a report here from Sky News on the find of this poor mans body...Sad

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1274977,00.html

Prayers for Madeleine.

[Reannan]

Interesting about a British yachtsman's body being found in the marina there is Portugal. I look forward to hearing what his name is, and if he is conntected to either Robert Murat, the McCann's, or some of the friends that vacationed with them. I also look forward to hearing the cause of deeath of this yachtsman.

[CaliKid]

http://ionglobaltrends.blogspot.com/2007/07/team-mccann.html
Interesting information on how the McCanns turned the media into such a huge machine and got the fund started

[Jdee]

Hi Salem. There is a report here from Sky News on the find of this poor mans body...Sad

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1274977,00.html

Prayers for Madeleine.

There was a man who went missing a couple of weeks ago there while hiking to his destination instead of riding with his family. I wonder if it's him? I remember the article where they interviewd his son who said he would never stage his own disapearance or commit sucide and they thought he had been kidnapped... but it has been so far back now in the Madeleine threads I would never find it now.

[CarpeDiem]

My opinion is shifting a wee bit, I think the McCann's are cold, stupid (how did these two become Doctor's ?), and guilty of Child Endangerment (and should be charged), but I'm starting to feel a little less that atleast one of them could have "had it" and Madeleine then "disappeared". Still though, why can't I get rid of that seed of doubt about them? That feeling?

These VERY recent things they are doing and saying are finally making sense though. Is it too late?

One thing that I have always found surprising, is that emotionally, Kate hasn't felt the need to go back to the home in England, if just for an afternoon, to be in Madeleine's room, lay in her bed, be amongst her special things and that happy time together. I would really need that.


Kind of off-topic, where's colomom been?

ETA, forget that, she posted yesterday. I remember her sweet post too.

[Jdee]

I thought this was interesting... Brian - the dream guy.. has posted a note on his site to "Robert"... follow the link and scroll to the very bottom. The "Robert" is RM who he mentions earlier in the post that he now thinks he is involved..
Interesting the way it reads...

http://briansdreams.com/dd/5441%20page%202.htm (http://briansdreams.com/dd/5441%20page%202.htm)

[Jdee]

"FRIENDS of Madeleine McCann’s parents went to a police station yesterday — amid speculation that suspect Robert Murat was facing an identity parade."

http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2-2007320182,00.html

So were they look bumping into each other in the hallway?:waitasec:

[CaliKid]

I don't put much into psychics. Another thread I post at has one named Matt who is convinced the people who took Madeleine did so for humane reasons, have been sailing around the Mediterranean with her and said she was in Malta but isn't anymore. Her captors will suposedly "return" her to her family later this year.
Another, named "The Rev" says she's still in Portugal in a city with ancient Roman ruins in an abandoned building and are waiting for someone from the McCann family to contact them.
It's all too jumbled together to make sense to me.

[Jdee]

I don't put much into psychics. Another thread I post at has one named Matt who is convinced the people who took Madeleine did so for humane reasons, have been sailing around the Mediterranean with her and said she was in Malta but isn't anymore. Her captors will suposedly "return" her to her family later this year.
Another, named "The Rev" says she's still in Portugal in a city with ancient Roman ruins in an abandoned building and are waiting for someone from the McCann family to contact them.
It's all too jumbled together to make sense to me.

Yeah.. pretty hoky stuff, but I do believe some people are gifted.
I read on some thread somewhere it was predicted she would be home on July 10th. I guess that wasn't this year though..

[Shazza]

Popped in to see if there is any new news, about the investigations of the friends of the McCanns.
Nothing.

Please God send Madelaine home.

[petra]

Latest Update - Gerry's Blog/Diary

Day 70 - 12/07/2007

It is ten weeks since Madeleine was abducted and every day has been incredibly hard for our family. No child should be separated from their family in such circumstances. The overwhelming messages of support, thoughts and prayers really help us stay strong. Somebody, somewhere knows where Madeleine is and it may take a single phone call for her to be found. We will not give up searching for her.

I came to London today to meet with the British police and will go to the Child Exploitaion and Online Protection Centre tomorrow to learn more about their role. As I have said previously we want to work closely with the police and child welfare organisations to help us keep awareness of Madeleines and other childrens disappearance high.

I was also invited to attend the National Police Federation Annual Bravery awards tonight. The work of the police is often taken for granted until you really need them. It was a humbling experience to see and meet so many officers who have shown such outstanding bravery in the line of duty and protecting us all. It was a fantastic opportunity to thank officers from all over the country who have been involved with the investigation to find Madeleine. The vast majority of those that I managed to speak to are, like us, very optimistic that we will find Madeleine safe and well.

[CaliKid]

No Shazza, nothing. The McCanns have decided to learn Portuguese because they think they will be staying there indefinitely. They're upset because some journalist contacted them about a missing body found in the marina- it turned out to be a man I think. Newspapers in the UK are no longer referring to Madeleine's disappearance only as an abduction as more and more people question what's really going on with the family. But we're no closer to finding Madeleine.

[Shazza]

No Shazza, nothing. The McCanns have decided to learn Portuguese because they think they will be staying there indefinitely. They're upset because some journalist contacted them about a missing body found in the marina- it turned out to be a man I think. Newspapers in the UK are no longer referring to Madeleine's disappearance only as an abduction as more and more people question what's really going on with the family. But we're no closer to finding Madeleine.
It is so sad.
Gerry McCann has been invited to a Police Bravery Award Convention, WHY.

[CaliKid]

It is so sad.
Gerry McCann has been invited to a Police Bravery Award Convention, WHY.

I think I'm going to throw up. :furious:

[Pinkhammer]

How very interesting that this Russell O'Brien was missing from the dinner group both on the night Maddie went missing and on one previous night.

Does this have something to do with Madeleine crying out for her father two nights in a row, according to the Portuguese family in the next apartment?

[Schmerty_Jones]

I think I'm going to throw up. :furious:

You've got company!!!:sick: "bravery' you call it!

[Shazza]

I think I'm going to throw up. :furious:
Already did.

[CaliKid]

How very interesting that this Russell O'Brien was missing from the dinner group both on the night Maddie went missing and on one previous night.

Does this have something to do with Madeleine crying out for her father two nights in a row, according to the Portuguese family in the next apartment?

It bears looking into. But from what I understand, O'Brien had to go unexpectedly back to the UK. Or maybe I'm getting him confused with someone else from the McCann party.

[Salem]

How very interesting that this Russell O'Brien was missing from the dinner group both on the night Maddie went missing and on one previous night.

Does this have something to do with Madeleine crying out for her father two nights in a row, according to the Portuguese family in the next apartment?

I agree Pinkhammer..... very interesting. I have always wondered if someone didn't get into that room on previous nights - the night Madeleine was crying, in particular.

Still no big arrests and Portugal's Friday is winding down now....... very frustrating. I was really hoping we would hear something, anything....

[meowy]

Who was it that originated their silence deal? Wonder if it was O'Brien?

[Shazza]

Who was it that originated their silence deal? Wonder if it was O'Brien?
I cant understand/believe there was silence pact made at all.
If it was O'Brien, why would the McCanns go along with it it they have nothing to do with Madelaines disappearance, I would be thinking Gerry McCann originated the silence pact. These people must have no consciouses for them to hold back any information at all in regards to Madelaines disappearance.

[CaliKid]

You can look at it two ways. A pact of silence could be set up if the McCanns did something to Madeleine and all their friends know it and are trying to protect them.

But it's just as likely that questions would arise over the neglect of all the couples in the party. The McCanns weren't the only ones with kids.

[BadKat]

it was noted by another user, and confirmed by a second, that Kate McCann (Healy) stated in an interview that they have not physically searched for Madeleine at all.

Does anyone know of this interview and if so can you point me to it via a link?

Thanks!

Kat

[BadKat]

For those interested here is the link.

http://www.functionpix.com/index.php/article/Madeleine_McCann__Parents_first_interview/1392/

Answers from the lips of the man and woman themselves.

No private investigators hired from the fund. No physical searching themselves. That dead set certainty that she couldn't have wandered off.

I have been reading and re-reading articles published from the very begining. I wanted to refresh my mind. Is what I'm thinking heresay from a blog or forum or was that a fact?

The reported distance from the apartment to the tapas bar varies significantly. I think I've satisfied myself as to what the actual distance was in viewing the photos of the the resort.

The McCanns claim to this day that there was a break in through the window although this has been disputed vigorously by Mark Warner resort management and police. There were no signs of forcible entry. Period.

From the article linked above:

“We need to believe she is coming back to us.” Said Kate.

How pathetic. How do you suppose, Kate, that she is going to come back to you? Certainly not by your hand or doing. Admittedly not having physically searched. Continuing down that passive path. Gerry's conviction that 'the public holds the key' so no need for private investigators in spite of there being almost? over? a million pounds raised in the no stone unturned fund.

What a strange name for the fund. Especially since they haven't so much as kicked a pebble over in the search for their daughter. Is it possible concieving Madeleine IVF somehow messed with this woman's maternal instincts?

Sorry, the more I find the more enraged I become.

What horrors must this child have been subjected to? Should she still be alive what terror is visited upon her every single day?

I can't even stand to think about it. And thinking about them - the people who brought her into this world - makes me want to vomit.

Kat

[Bobbisangel]

Personally I don't see a thing wrong with the interview.

[BadKat]

Personally I don't see a thing wrong with the interview.

There has been much debate regarding the fund and what it will be used for. Much speculation as to why the McCanns seem so, well, detached and cold in interviews. Those are my words, btw, detached and cold. I struggled with how to describe them and that was the best I could come up with.

I find it troubling that they are more interested in jetting off to meet dignitaries than they have been, especially in the first days, in humping along the streets, picture of Madeleine in had, querying anyone in the vicinity.

I find it odd that they would rather put faith in the 'public' than to take matters into their hands. The funds are being spent on - what??? - anything but private investigators who may be able to help further the case if their daughter was, indeed, abducted?

What is it about the interview that satisfies you?

Kat

[Shazza]

I cant believe these parents, am absolutely disgusted.:furious:

[CarpeDiem]

I agree she didn't just wander off - she would have taken her little stuffed animal with her, the one that Portuguese police never collected or did forensic testing on.:banghead:

[april4sky]

Personally I don't see a thing wrong with the interview.
Me neither. The reason this case is known far and wide is due to the hard work by them, their family, friends and many others. They have got the best possible expert advice they can find to help keep Madeleine's story out there. Without that hard work, or if the McCanns had returned home it probably would have faded long before now. I believe that is the reason they can't bring themselves to leave Portugal.

[april4sky]

Well they certainly do things differently in Portugal.

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1275069,00.html

Prayers for Madeleine.

[LaWanda]

That is really odd. Why would you let non LE folks interrogate (cos that's what it sounds like) a suspect?

Three friends of Madeleine McCann's parents have grilled suspect Robert Murat in a tense five-hour stand-off in a police station.

from link in above post: http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/...275069,00.html (http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1275069,00.html)

[petra]

Standing Ovation

Madeleine's Father Gets Standing Ovation

Updated: 08:08, Friday July 13, 2007
<H2>The father of missing Madeleine McCann has received a standing ovation at an awards ceremony for Britain's bravest police officers.

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,30000-1275024,00.html

</H2>

[petra]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/scotland/glasgow_and_west/6896001.stm

[CarpeDiem]

That is really odd. Why would you let non LE folks interrogate (cos that's what it sounds like) a suspect?



from link in above post: http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/...275069,00.html

I can't figure out WHAT is going on. Unless they met during the week before Madie disappeared, and each are pointing the finger at the other. Or, it's a desperate attempt at making one side break. :waitasec:

[Shazza]

That is really odd. Why would you let non LE folks interrogate (cos that's what it sounds like) a suspect?



from link in above post: http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/...275069,00.html (http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1275069,00.html)
It does sound like the friends of the McCanns are questioning a suspect when they could be suspects themselves or have knowledge of what happened to Madelaine, is this reverse pyschology or LE at a dead end. This is totally unreal.

[CarpeDiem]

I wish we had a way of knowing WHERE the reports are coming from, is the leak in the so called LE? Is a lot getting messed up in translation to English? I'm hopeful we don't get it, because something is missing here. It's more like a deposition or something, but I think even that is more professional than this sounds. Did all these people have lawyer's in the room? It must be something very big and very key that the parties have completely opposite answers about.

[petra]

I can't figure out WHAT is going on. Unless they met during the week before Madie disappeared, and each are pointing the finger at the other. Or, it's a desperate attempt at making one side break. :waitasec:

I am just hoping that this is poor reporting on behalf of skynews.
Many Euro countries do mediation between opposing parties instead of in a courtroom setting. But never heard of this in a serious offense:rolleyes:

What was this --a he said, we said situation--with Murant and his lawyer-yet his mother was not there (his alibi). Maybe since all parties are fluent in English, it became a *showdown*. The staff of the resort has said, that that they did not see him help with the search.

So....are we back to a Team McCann pact of agreement.

Never heard of such a thing---:waitasec: Very strange.

Not reported the same way in BBC.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/6292004.stm

[SewingDeb]

They say it's normal to get both sides together to figure out who is telling the truth. I would imagine LE is trying to get him to break and admit his alibi is a lie.

[Shazza]

Standing Ovation

Madeleine's Father Gets Standing Ovation

Updated: 08:08, Friday July 13, 2007
<H2>The father of missing Madeleine McCann has received a standing ovation at an awards ceremony for Britain's bravest police officers.

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,30000-1275024,00.html

</H2>

Kate and I would like to thank all of the police officers in the UK that were involved in the operation to find Madeleine for their sterling work."

See in the above statement from the link how GM stated "were involved" past tense, so arnt the British LE not helping the Portugese LE anymore, it makes me believe that the reason for this is that they dont want to pay any of their donated funds to keep the British LE on the job.
This is absurd.

[petra]

It does sound like the friends of the McCanns are questioning a suspect when they could be suspects themselves or have knowledge of what happened to Madelaine, is this reverse pyschology or LE at a dead end. This is totally unreal.

It is now late afternoon Friday in PT. PJ was reported as saying they would have answers by Friday.

I don't think they have any answers, evidence or even know what the questions should be.

imoo

Where is little Madeleine?

[april4sky]

From the same article...........
Police put the three friends and Mr Murat in a small room together and questioned them to try to discover whose story was true.
A police source said: "Because there was a disagreement, it is normal for the two sides to be brought together to find the truth."............Sounds as though the police did the questioning. It does sound odd though....But if it leads to the truth........and Madeleine.

[petra]

They say it's normal to get both sides together to figure out who is telling the truth. I would imagine LE is trying to get him to break and admit his alibi is a lie.

.............OR to see if the three friends have the same story!!:eek:

I believe I read that these are the only three people who said RM was there that night.

Why not poly them???

[CarpeDiem]

Another possibility, all of them agree on something that is different with the McCann's story.

[petra]

From the same article...........
Police put the three friends and Mr Murat in a small room together and questioned them to try to discover whose story was true.
A police source said: "Because there was a disagreement, it is normal for the two sides to be brought together to find the truth."............Sounds as though the police did the questioning. It does sound odd though....But if it leads to the truth........and Madeleine.

This does sound like the same way disagreements are handled here in Scandinavia.

But is this a disagreement??:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Yes, let us hope it leads to the truth and to Madeleine.

[Shazza]

.............OR to see if the three friends have the same story!!:eek:

I believe I read that these are the only three people who said RM was there that night.

Why not poly them???
I think they are putting pressure on Murat to admit he had something to do with Madelaines disappearance, because they have no hard evidence on him. Three against one, not fair.

[petra]

Another possibility, all of them agree on something that is different with the McCann's story.

:eek: :eek: :eek:

[CarpeDiem]

From the same article...........
Police put the three friends and Mr Murat in a small room together and questioned them to try to discover whose story was true.
A police source said: "Because there was a disagreement, it is normal for the two sides to be brought together to find the truth."............Sounds as though the police did the questioning. It does sound odd though....But if it leads to the truth........and Madeleine.

It would blow my mind if they were involved together with Murat in a pedo ring and Madeleine was unbeknownst to the McCann's, hand delivered to Portugal for Murat to take. That would take some stunning and cunning advance planning.

It's also possible the friends insist to have seeing Murat around that night, but he insists he wasn't.

[Shazza]

It would blow my mind if they were involved together with Murat in a pedo ring and Madeleine was unbeknownst to the McCann's, hand delivered to Portugal for Murat to take. That would take some stunning and cunning advance planning.

It's also possible the friends insist to have seeing Murat around that night, but he insists he wasn't.
I mentioned earlier that three against wasnt fair, unless there is evidence to back up their statement, the three friends of the McCanns could all be in cohoot with each other and planned this to pin on Murat.

[Jdee]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/scotland/glasgow_and_west/6896001.stm

"Police sources were quoted as saying the investigation was at a critical stage, and would not reveal the outcome of the showdown."

Well if that is the case then we know that these 4 people are somehow involved somehow someway. One of the 4 knows something or saw something. I am laying my cards on Murat.

[Shazza]

"Police sources were quoted as saying the investigation was at a critical stage, and would not reveal the outcome of the showdown."

Well if that is the case then we know that these 4 people are somehow involved somehow someway. One of the 4 knows something or saw something. I am laying my cards on Murat.

I hope they have found out something that will help Madelaine, hoping for more news tomorrow.

[Thrs0806]

"Dr Fiona Payne, Dr Russell O'Brien and Rachael Oldfield claim they saw Mr Murat - the "arguido", or only named suspect in the case - near the McCanns' holiday flat shortly after Madeleine disappeared."

Ok, lets think about this, if they all 3 claim to have seen RM shortly after Madeleine disappeared wouldn't take help RM instead of point to him. Think about it, if he did "take" Madeleine where did he stash her so he could go back to the scene of the crime and be seen helping look for her??? IF (and I think it is a BIG IF) he went back to be seen helping then I would think that he would have made sure he was "seen" and there wouldn't be any doubts. I think the whole going back to the scene story makes no sense anyways if he is guilty of having anything to be with Madeleine's disappearance. What could possibly be the purpose? Who ever took her (if someone took her) would have been getting as far away as possible with her. Going back just makes no sense to me.

I find the story of the 2 "late" dinner guests more suspicious than RM's story. Why were they late??

[CaliKid]

For those interested here is the link.

http://www.functionpix.com/index.php/article/Madeleine_McCann__Parents_first_interview/1392/

Answers from the lips of the man and woman themselves.

No private investigators hired from the fund. No physical searching themselves. That dead set certainty that she couldn't have wandered off.

I have been reading and re-reading articles published from the very begining. I wanted to refresh my mind. Is what I'm thinking heresay from a blog or forum or was that a fact?

The reported distance from the apartment to the tapas bar varies significantly. I think I've satisfied myself as to what the actual distance was in viewing the photos of the the resort.

The McCanns claim to this day that there was a break in through the window although this has been disputed vigorously by Mark Warner resort management and police. There were no signs of forcible entry. Period.

From the article linked above:

“We need to believe she is coming back to us.” Said Kate.

How pathetic. How do you suppose, Kate, that she is going to come back to you? Certainly not by your hand or doing. Admittedly not having physically searched. Continuing down that passive path. Gerry's conviction that 'the public holds the key' so no need for private investigators in spite of there being almost? over? a million pounds raised in the no stone unturned fund.

What a strange name for the fund. Especially since they haven't so much as kicked a pebble over in the search for their daughter. Is it possible concieving Madeleine IVF somehow messed with this woman's maternal instincts?

Sorry, the more I find the more enraged I become.

What horrors must this child have been subjected to? Should she still be alive what terror is visited upon her every single day?

I can't even stand to think about it. And thinking about them - the people who brought her into this world - makes me want to vomit.

Kat

Interesting. Thanks BadKat for linking back to this interview.

Did you see how GM squirmed out from under the question about leaving the children alone? He just totally ignored it. “If you actually look at our own actions and those of the group – the speed of response – Mark Warner, the resort manager was excellent”

And from KM- “I did want to go and look for Maddie myself – we may not have been physically searching but we have been very busy.”

With what, pray tell! What in the h*ll could be so much more important than looking for you missing toddler daughter? All they really wanted to talk about, even at that early stage, was the fund and how people were contributing to it.

And the classic line- “Any criticism of us at this time has been hard to deal with of course, and there has been lots which has been very hard. What we did – many others would have said the same.

[Jdee]

Interesting. Thanks BadKat for linking back to this interview.

Did you see how GM squirmed out from under the question about leaving the children alone? He just totally ignored it. “If you actually look at our own actions and those of the group – the speed of response – Mark Warner, the resort manager was excellent”

And from KM- “I did want to go and look for Maddie myself – we may not have been physically searching but we have been very busy.”

With what, pray tell! What in the h*ll could be so much more important than looking for you missing toddler daughter? All they really wanted to talk about, even at that early stage, was the fund and how people were contributing to it.

And the classic line- “Any criticism of us at this time has been hard to deal with of course, and there has been lots which has been very hard. What we did – many others would have said the same.

SO bizarre! It's almost like they are talking in riddles. I THINK they know more than they can say.. and that in PART is the reason for their dodging questions (other than the obvious). I can not however fathom why they have never looked for their child. Either they already know where she is.. or they simply just do not care.

[CaliKid]

None of what seems to have happened that night makes any sense.

A small child disappears, and one of the dinner guests of her parents' passed someone carrying a child less than an hour before- but she doesn't think it's important enough to mention until days later.

Robert Murat shows up that night to help look for Madeleine, but the three friends don't connect him (until after he's named a suspect by someone else) with an earlier sighting in the vacinity of the apartments even though the McCanns were insisting she'd been kidnapped.

It just sounds to me like the McCanns' friends are desperately trying to make the abduction scenario stick without any real evidence and pointing fingers at anyone but themselves.

[CaliKid]

It is now late afternoon Friday in PT. PJ was reported as saying they would have answers by Friday.

I don't think they have any answers, evidence or even know what the questions should be.

imoo

Where is little Madeleine?

Wasn't P-LE promising arrests were imminent by the end of this week? I'm not blaming them because I think they're doing the best job possible under the circumstances. But I don't see any forthcoming arrests at all.

[Squishified]

This case is so strange. I really hope we have answers soon. It reminds me a little too much of JonBenet Ramsey.

[Pinkhammer]

Murat is obviously being set up by the McCann gang of irresponsible heavy-drinking child-neglecting doctors.

[englishleigh]

And from KM- “I did want to go and look for Maddie myself – we may not have been physically searching but we have been very busy.”

With what, pray tell! What in the h*ll could be so much more important than looking for you missing toddler daughter? All they really wanted to talk about, even at that early stage, was the fund and how people were contributing to it.

[/i]

Very busy raising money and traveling to see the Pope...what could be more important that that??? :doh: :loser:

[BadKat]

http://www.policiajudiciaria.pt/htm/pessoas_desaparecidas/madeleine.htm

Policia Judiciaria website featuring Madeleine's missing person page. In Portuguese.

I used babelfish to translate. This is the actual translation as given to me by babelfish:

Name: Madeleine Beth Mccann

Filiation: Gerald Patrick Mccann and Kate Marie Healy

Nationality: Joined Kingdom

Naturalness: Leicester
Date of birth: 12/05/2003

Passport: 453847661 - Joined Kingdom

Date of issue: 04/08/2003

Date of validity: 04/08/2008

Physical description:

Sex: Feminine

Height: 90 cm

Hair: claro/louro, smooth chestnut, for the shoulders

Eyes: blue and green left eye, green right eye with chestnut spot in the iris.

Particular signals: Small signal in the skin, of chestnut color, in the gémeo of the left leg.

Clothes:

In the date of the disappearance, it dressed pyjamas of white pants with floral reasons, and has broken short sleeve superior, with predominance of rose color and in the front a figure of a "jumento" of blue and gray color, with registration "EEYORE".

Complementary information:

It disappeared in 03/05/2007, for 22H40, of the Ocean Club, Beach of the Light, Lakes, place where it passed vacation with the parents. The disappearance occurred in a height where the child was alone in the apartment.



Department of Criminal Inquiry of Portimão of the Judiciary Policy

Street Foot Da Cruz, 2, 8500-640 Portimão
Telephone: 282 405 400
Pole: 282 427 671
Fax: 282 412 763
Email: dic.portimao@pj.pt

22:40???

This calls into question the timeline given by the McCanns and their party yet again. 10:40 p.m.?

Also, I found it interesting that you can find more about Madeleine on the PJ website than you can on her own findmadeleine.com page.

The deeper I dig the more disturbing this becomes.

[BadKat]

And for those interested in news reports from within Portugal - courtesy of Aussie Mike - a link to numerous newspapers in Portugal.

http://www.onlinenewspapers.com/portugal.htm

Many to wade through, but I'm game to search for some unbiased news reports which actually involve utilizing the skills of investigative journalism.

[CaliKid]

22:40???

This calls into question the timeline given by the McCanns and their party yet again. 10:40 p.m.?

Also, I found it interesting that you can find more about Madeleine on the PJ website than you can on her own findmadeleine.com page.

The deeper I dig the more disturbing this becomes.

BadKat, according to reports I've seen, the local police were called immediately. The PJ were notified an hour or two later which explains the 22:40 time.

[Shazza]

When will this all end.
Prayers to you Madelaine.

[Texana]

I found it interesting that Gerry McCann did not actually answer directly the question about his decision to leave Madeleine and her siblings alone, but instead praised the "response time" of everyone once she was reportedly discovered missing.

If Kate McCann had really wanted to search physically for her child she would have.

I find it also disgusting that they keep appealing to "the public" for the child's return. If she has been abducted and is still alive, it is obviously by people who could care less about "appeals" to return her.

[CaliKid]

If Madeleine were my daughter, I would be totally upfront about my actions and movements before she disappeared, and nothing would be kept secret. I would answer the questions because that's the only way LE would know where to start looking. And I would be out, day after day, moving heaven and earth to find her. Not lying, making excuses and visiting foreign and religious dignitaries.

[Shazza]

If Madeleine were my daughter, I would be totally upfront about my actions and movements before she disappeared, and nothing would be kept secret. I would answer the questions because that's the only way LE would know where to start looking. And I would be out, day after day, moving heaven and earth to find her. Not lying, making excuses and visiting foreign and religious dignitaries.
ABSOLUTELY!!!!!!!

[CaliKid]

This is the latest article from SOL (translated by Astro on http://formadeleine.proboards106.com/index.cgi) which you unfortunately have to register for if you want to get into the forum and read anything.

Sol

13th July 2007

By Margarida Davim

At the entrance of Ocean’s Club in Praia da Luz, the journalists who participated in the press conference that was held by Madeleine’s parents for the Portuguese media, encountered a plastic box to collect donations. A small text, signed by Kate and Gerry McCann, invites everyone who enters the resort to contribute. This gesture was not appreciated by the members of staff, who claim that the resort “is full of collection boxes”.

A fund for Maddie

This box is just one of many ways that Maddie’s parents found to collect money for the ‘Leaving no Stone Unturned’ fund – which counts with almost 900 thousand pounds already (one million three hundred thousand euros).

Justine McGuinness, the McCanns' new public relations, guarantees that the collected money “is being managed by a group of independent persons”, and subject to “very rigorous rules that are imposed by british law to all charities”. Still, McGuinness refuses to explain who are the “highly qualified lawyers and managers” that are managing the fund, just highlighting they are not remunerated, and offered as volunteers.

On the findmadeleine.com site there is an online store, where Gerry and Kate sell yellow rubber bracelets and textile bands, to help finance the cause. Callum McRae, the author of the site, says it was the couple’s idea. Speaking to SOL, McRae explains that the child’s aunt, Philomena McCann, asked him to create the internet page, just two days after the girl went missing. “She knew exactly what she wanted”, says Callum McRae, who created the contents in just one day.

The McCann’s internet page also publicizes several fundraising events, all taking place in the UK, and some planned over 60 days ahead.

To SOL, McRae, who was a student of Madeleine’s aunt in highschool, did not want to specify whether his work on the site is paid by the fund or not: “I’m not authorized to speak about that”. According to the site, the fund’s purpose is to “support Madeleine’s family financially” and to make sure she is found, and her kidnappers brought to trial. After reaching these targets, the collected money shall be used to help solving “similar cases in the UK, in Portugal and elsewhere”.

Twins at the creche

This week, Kate and Gerry moved into a villa outside the Ocean Club, but are still visiting the resort. “They come here every day to drop the twins at the creche”, a member of staff reports.

Kate and Gerry, who are now staying at a villa with a pool, never had to pay for their stay at the resort. “They were not even handed a bill”, the same employee of the Ocean Club says, noting the couple’s detached and somewhat “arrogant” attitude.

Reactions to SOL

Last edition’s article on the McCann case (A pact of silence), has livened the discussion in the UK. Fully translated into English, it has prompted approximately 20 pages of reactions in the forum of the Daily Mirror. Among the comments, there is criticism of the alleged censorship that this work was subject to in the forums of other British media.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

1) It seems that the conspicuous money-making is finally starting to grate on people's sensibilities.
2) Either GM's family is incredibly talented in creating websites at a moment's notice, or ....
3) How do the McCanns know they'll need fund-raisers two months from now? I realize some stuff needs advance planning, but it seems a little far-reaching.
4) I don't understand why the McCanns get to live in the lap of luxury at other peoples' expense as if they're entitled.
5) Maybe the tide is beginning as far as British censorship is concerned. Personally, I feel as if the people who donated into the Madeleine fund have been thoroughly manipulated.

[Shazza]

This is the latest article from SOL (translated by Astro on http://formadeleine.proboards106.com/index.cgi which you unfortunately have to register for to get into the forum and read anything.

Sol

13th July 2007

By Margarida Davim

At the entrance of Ocean’s Club in Praia da Luz, the journalists who participated in the press conference that was held by Madeleine’s parents for the Portuguese media, encountered a plastic box to collect donations. A small text, signed by Kate and Gerry McCann, invites everyone who enters the resort to contribute. This gesture was not appreciated by the members of staff, who claim that the resort “is full of collection boxes”.

A fund for Maddie

This box is just one of many ways that Maddie’s parents found to collect money for the ‘Leaving no Stone Unturned’ fund – which counts with almost 900 thousand pounds already (one million three hundred thousand euros).

Justine McGuinness, the McCanns' new public relations, guarantees that the collected money “is being managed by a group of independent persons”, and subject to “very rigorous rules that are imposed by british law to all charities”. Still, McGuinness refuses to explain who are the “highly qualified lawyers and managers” that are managing the fund, just highlighting they are not remunerated, and offered as volunteers.

On the findmadeleine.com site there is an online store, where Gerry and Kate sell yellow rubber bracelets and textile bands, to help finance the cause. Callum McRae, the author of the site, says it was the couple’s idea. Speaking to SOL, McRae explains that the child’s aunt, Philomena McCann, asked him to create the internet page, just two days after the girl went missing. “She knew exactly what she wanted”, says Callum McRae, who created the contents in just one day.

The McCann’s internet page also publicizes several fundraising events, all taking place in the UK, and some planned over 60 days ahead.

To SOL, McRae, who was a student of Madeleine’s aunt in highschool, did not want to specify whether his work on the site is paid by the fund or not: “I’m not authorized to speak about that”. According to the site, the fund’s purpose is to “support Madeleine’s family financially” and to make sure she is found, and her kidnappers brought to trial. After reaching these targets, the collected money shall be used to help solving “similar cases in the UK, in Portugal and elsewhere”.

Twins at the creche

This week, Kate and Gerry moved into a villa outside the Ocean Club, but are still visiting the resort. “They come here every day to drop the twins at the creche”, a member of staff reports.

Kate and Gerry, who are now staying at a villa with a pool, never had to pay for their stay at the resort. “They were not even handed a bill”, the same employee of the Ocean Club says, noting the couple’s detached and somewhat “arrogant” attitude.

Reactions to SOL

Last edition’s article on the McCann case (A pact of silence), has livened the discussion in the UK. Fully translated into English, it has prompted approximately 20 pages of reactions in the forum of the Daily Mirror. Among the comments, there is criticism of the alleged censorship that this work was subject to in the forums of other British media.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

1) Either GM's family is incredibly talented in creating websites at a moment's notice, or ....
2) How do the McCanns know they'll need fund-raisers two months from now? I realize some stuff needs advance planning, but it seems a little far-reaching.

This is unbelievable, they are more focused on getting money not searching for their daughter, These parents are $@%%, will be banned if I say what I want to say. What really irks me is they are telling us everything they can on how we can donate money for their cause, but I would be interested and I think they should show us where all the money is actually going. As far as I can tell, the money is being spent more on them. When is Madelaine going to come first with these idiotic parents.

[CaliKid]

As it seems that GM is the family member who is handling the business end of the fund and the whole FindMadeleine enterprise, why do the McCanns still need the creche service? Can't KM handle the twins by herself? It makes me wonder whether they really wanted to be parents or just wanted to have kids so they could look successful.

[Shazza]

As it seems that GM is the family member who is handling the business end of the fund and the whole FindMadeleine enterprise, why do the McCanns still need the creche service? Can't KM handle the twins by herself? It makes me wonder whether they really wanted to be parents or just wanted to have kids so they could look successful.
I think these parents are very materialistic, they want the good things in life at the expense of their daughter.

Putting your children in daycare everyday is not being a parent, I feel sorry for those children, they are not being brought up by a loving family, but strangers. I bet they have never seen their first steps, their first words, they have no respect for their children and that is going to come and bite them on the bum. Wake up and get to know who your children are you selfish people.

[CaliKid]

The last page of the newest SOL report: Among the comments, there is criticism of the alleged censorship that this work was subject to in the forums of other British media.

If I lived in the UK, being a hard-working parent or even a single person, and I had been subjected to the strong-arm tactics of the fund-raising and the censorship of any negative reporting on the McCanns, I would be absolutely furious to finally learn what's been going on the past two months. I am sure there are many families who generously decided to do without so they could donate- putting off family vacations, not buying an item they'd been saving for or even eating less or using less electricity.

And then to discover that the press had been preventing full and open discussion about the circumstances surrounding Madeleine's disappearance and how the McCanns have been acting ever since. I do think the popularity train that GM has been riding on is slowing down and will shortly change course. Whether this bodes well for Madeleine is anyone's guess. But it is enough to make you lose faith in the rest of humanity.

[Shazza]

The last page of the newest SOL report: Among the comments, there is criticism of the alleged censorship that this work was subject to in the forums of other British media.

If I lived in the UK, being a hard-working parent or even a single person, and I had been subjected to the strong-arm tactics of the fund-raising and the censorship of any negative reporting on the McCanns, I would be absolutely furious to finally learn what's been going on the past two months. I am sure there are many families who generously decided to do without so they could donate- putting off family vacations, not buying an item they'd been saving for or even eating less or using less electricity.

And then to discover that the press had been preventing full and open discussion about the circumstances surrounding Madeleine's disappearance and how the McCanns have been acting ever since. I do think the popularity train that GM has been riding on is slowing down and will shortly change course. Whether this bodes well for Madeleine is anyone's guess. But it is enough to make you lose faith in the rest of humanity.
I will never lose faith in humanity, there are good out there and even on this thread, there is true concern for Madelaine, wouldnt it be good to be able to post and read more in the thread called "News that makes you smile", that thread is moving really slowly and all the bad news threads are moving along so fast. It is sad that there seems more bad than good news.

[petra]

<H2>Madeleine McCann's mother has returned to the UK for a brief visit - as a new campaign is launched to raise awareness about the missing four-year-old.

</H2>


Kate flew out of Portugal with her brother and sister. They are joining Madeleine's father Gerry, who is already in Britain.
He has been meeting with child abduction experts to learn about criminal profiling techniques used in the hunt for his young daughter.
He visited the Child Exploitation and Online Protection Centre (Ceop) in London as part of a short trip to the UK.



SNIPPET...........http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1275160,00.html..........

[s_finch]

I understand geographically that the countries in Europe are much like the states in the US, meaning that crossing borders is no big deal and it's all very close. So for argument's sake and to put this into a context I can relate to, I can't imagine parents in SC (for example) whose child has disappeared, traveling to Florida, Maryland, Arkansas, etc... meeting with Billy Graham (USA's kinda equivalent to the Pope) , and traveling non-stop all over the states, putting out boxes asking for money, etc....

What do parents here do? I imagine it's the same as other parents in Europe. We use the media to get the word out, we push to keep it in the media limelight, we push LE to bring in experts, tracking dogs, we take lie detector tests ourselves, we encourage our friends to tell anything they know, we physically search for the child ourselves. WHY WOULD THE MCCAIN'S NEED OVER A MILLION DOLLARS? Natalee Holloway's mom no doubt had huge costs in traveling to Aruba, staying there, etc.... I don't remember her pusing a fund-raising drive or going to see the Pope or the President or Billy Graham or whomever, SHE WENT TO ARUBA AND SEARCHED AND KEPT THE MEDIA FOCUSED ON NATALEE AND ARUBA.

The McCain's make no sense to me. Maybe they are a case of all book sense and no common sense.

[englishleigh]

I firmly believe that the McCanns know what happened to Madeleine and where she is. I think they are screwing with everyone trying to get as much money given to them as possible. I would love to tell them off!!! :banghead: :furious: :furious: :furious: :furious: :banghead: They make me want to scream. Why can't some people see through them????

[Pinkhammer]

<H2>Madeleine McCann's mother has returned to the UK for a brief visit - as a new campaign is launched to raise awareness about the missing four-year-old.

</H2>


Kate flew out of Portugal with her brother and sister. They are joining Madeleine's father Gerry, who is already in Britain.
He has been meeting with child abduction experts to learn about criminal profiling techniques used in the hunt for his young daughter.
He visited the Child Exploitation and Online Protection Centre (Ceop) in London as part of a short trip to the UK.



SNIPPET...........http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1275160,00.html..........

Going back to Britain with plans to avoid extradition back to Portugal?

Are the Portuguese authorities closing in on the heavy-drinking child-abandoning luxury-vacationing McCanns???

[ceeaura]

Hi everyone.New to posting here but have been reading for months.Seems like I know most of you already :)

I have been reading about little Madeleine ,here mainly and at the Mirror uk forums.I have to say at the beginning I did feel sympathy for the parents in the fact their daughter was missing.Now that doesn't mean I also didn't feel angry at them for leaving those babies alone.It just blows my mind that two well educated people would do that.
After the first couple of days though I started seeing Gerry and Kate differently.Cold,standoffish among other things and there is something in this whole thing that is off.The "fund"is another thing that has me boggled.
I just want this little girl brought home.

Has there been anything else about the Nanny that has been reported?I would really like to hear something from her.Its just been kept very quite which I find very odd.

Oh be before I forget...its nice to be posting with you guys :)

~Cee~

[Salem]

Well englishleigh and pinkhammer - I agree with you both. Interesting thought that KM may be planning to avoid extradition...... but, do you think that P-LE would have detained her, rather than letting her leave, if P-LE were close to filing charges against her and GM?

After all the hype last week, it is very disappointing to get to Saturday with no answers, no arrests, etc.

And I want to say thanks to everyone who is translating and posting the Portugese news! I really appreciate seeing those articles. I have limited time, so ususally only do one google a day and read the English articles.

Also, I want to say I actually like the luggage tag idea. I think that is something we could incorporate here in the states.

I don't approve of the bracelets, mostly because they are selling them. I think about all the missing cases we have on this website alone and I can not name another case where the major focus has been on raising money versus finding the child/adult. If I think about the bracelets unemotionally, maybe they really are a good idea in general. Surely, all the families with missing children/adults could use funds to help support their search efforts and as always, anything to keep the missing person's face in the public eye has got to be a good thing.

Now - back to team mccann - where are the twins? The article did not have a picture so I'm unsure as to whether or not the twins went back to the UK with their mom?

[Salem]

:) Welcome Ceeaura! This is a nice place to be.

I don't believe the McCanns had a nanny per se. From the media reports, I believe it was Kate's mom that helped out with the children. I think that is why we have heard nothing from an actual "nanny."

Also, I think most of us on this forum, while being upset over the parent's actions, did have some sympathy and compassion for them. However, for myself, that has changed considerably. After watching them in the news, viewing the blog, etc. etc. I am now pretty convinced that they know exactly what happened to Madeleine and where she is and it is just a matter of time before they share that information with the rest of us. This is just my opinion, based on what I have read and observed. I do still try to keep an open mind and would be quite happy to be proven wrong.

:(

[ceeaura]

:) Welcome Ceeaura! This is a nice place to be.

I don't believe the McCanns had a nanny per se. From the media reports, I believe it was Kate's mom that helped out with the children. I think that is why we have heard nothing from an actual "nanny."

Also, I think most of us on this forum, while being upset over the parent's actions, did have some sympathy and compassion for them. However, for myself, that has changed considerably. After watching them in the news, viewing the blog, etc. etc. I am now pretty convinced that they know exactly what happened to Madeleine and where she is and it is just a matter of time before they share that information with the rest of us. This is just my opinion, based on what I have read and observed. I do still try to keep an open mind and would be quite happy to be proven wrong.

:(


Well I have to agree with you Salem.I believe they know eactly what happened or one in their party does.I am with you, I would be very happy to be proven wrong.

As to the nanny thing I could have sworn that I read a article where the grandmother mentioned there was a Nanny.Was she referring to herself in that manner.If so ,how odd.I will go on a search and see if I can't find that article.I have read so many things all over the place so I could be awhile lol

Thanks for the warm welcome!!:D

[ceeaura]

Found it...didn't take me as long as I thought it would.http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=453801&in_page_id=1770&ct=5


Madeleine's grandmother, Eileen McCann, 67, added: "They weren't sure about the babysitter service, they just don't like leaving them with strangers.
"It wasn't something they did very often - they have a nanny at home whom they trust. "It's something we have all done at some point and you just don't expect anything like this to happen.


So which grandmother came to help Kate with the children.Eileen McCann or Susan Healy?So if it was Grandma Healy then that statement from Grandma Eileen is kinda of cold talking about the other grandmother as a "Nanny" :confused: