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SeriouslySearching
10-22-2007, 07:08 PM
Here is the last thread: 50/60 year old Amnesia... (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?goto=newpost&t=53847)

MaconChange
10-22-2007, 07:12 PM
Dear Mxxxxxxxx,
I am amazed at how much time and effort you and your fellow websleuthers have put into Benjaman Kyleís case. Thank you so much.
I got in touch with Mr. Kyle and we took a good look at the photos and profile for Steve Dewey. He does not believe it is him. The noses are very different and Steve Deweyís jaw line is more square. His facial shape and expressions donít seem to match, especially, when compared to all of Mr. Kyleís photos (from the TV news, newspaper as well as the ones I forwarded). I prefer to believe that every time one possibility is eliminated, we are one step closer to uncovering his true identity.
On a more positive note, The National Enquirer wants to profile Mr. Kyle. We might be seeing that in a couple of weeks. I donít have a date for the article yet. Their circulation is supposed to be about 1.5 to 2 million readers (not counting the ones who just peek at it while waiting on line in the grocery store without actually buying it).
Thanks again and please give a big thank you from us to all of your fellow websleuthers, too.
Sincerely,
Kxxxxxxxxxxx

marysawol
10-22-2007, 07:17 PM
ok, I know I'm new here and no one else is publically making a statement to the nurses note,,,and I certainly don't want to offend anyone by any means. But,,,,,,

the thing about the National Enquirer really bothers me. Anyone else?

SeriouslySearching
10-22-2007, 07:21 PM
Let me start by saying this is deeply disturbing.

I feel the overlays prove the facial features do match. There are other things which match, too.

*BK said he thought he recalled living in Colorado and Indiana. Steve lived in Colorado and was from a northern state (Heyworth, Illinois).

*BK said he thought he had 3 brothers. Steve had 3 brothers.

If you can see other parallels here, please feel free.

My hinky meter is ringing off the charts after reading the letter from the nurse.

MaconChange
10-22-2007, 07:21 PM
ok, I know I'm new here and no one else is publically making a statement to the nurses note,,,and I certainly don't want to offend anyone by any means. But,,,,,,

the thing about the National Enquirer really bothers me. Anyone else?

I'm just curious, do they pay people for the stories they publish?

rmf
10-22-2007, 07:21 PM
I wouldn't get too discouraged until the FBI rules him out. The nurse seems like a nice enough person but I'd be interested to see what LE thinks about this.

rmf
10-22-2007, 07:22 PM
I'm just curious, do they pay people for the stories they publish?


Sometimes, yes.

marysawol
10-22-2007, 07:24 PM
I'm just curious, do they pay people for the stories they publish?

I'm pretty sure they do.

MidnightMyst
10-22-2007, 07:24 PM
:(



that's all I can say....

SeriouslySearching
10-22-2007, 07:25 PM
The National Enquirer mention really makes me uncomfortable, to be honest. I have never heard of anyone missing turning to the NE before...but then I don't read that rag. I prefer to get my information from trusted media outlets.

marysawol
10-22-2007, 07:26 PM
The National Enquirer mention really makes me uncomfortable, to be honest. I have never heard of anyone missing turning to the NE before...but then I don't read that rag. I prefer to get my information from trusted media outlets.


exactly my feeling

MaconChange
10-22-2007, 07:27 PM
The National Enquirer mention really makes me uncomfortable, to be honest. I have never heard of anyone missing turning to the NE before...but then I don't read that rag. I prefer to get my information from trusted media outlets.


I feel the same way...

SeriouslySearching
10-22-2007, 07:27 PM
I wouldn't get too discouraged until the FBI rules him out. The nurse seems like a nice enough person but I'd be interested to see what LE thinks about this.Will the FBI keep going to rule him out if Mr. Kyle feels it is not him? I would have to assume they could not exactly trust Mr. Kyle's judgement because he has no memories...so wouldn't this mean they would be required to fully investigate this as a possible match?

Gina_M
10-22-2007, 07:27 PM
I wouldn't get too discouraged until the FBI rules him out. The nurse seems like a nice enough person but I'd be interested to see what LE thinks about this.

I agree. The FBI need to take a look at this. BK did say he'd be willing submit DNA and such to compare with potential matches.

Gina_M
10-22-2007, 07:36 PM
I feel the overlays prove the facial features do match. There are other things which match, too.

*BK said he thought he recalled living in Colorado and Indiana. Steve lived in Colorado and was from a northern state (Heyworth, Illinois).

*BK said he thought he had 3 brothers. Steve had 3 brothers.



I agree. And Heyworth Illinois is quite close to Indiana.

BK mentioned in the interview that he thought he went to Catholic school. Do we know if Steve Dewey went to Catholic school? Websleuths is being really slow for me right now but I will try to check the previous thread.

marysawol
10-22-2007, 08:00 PM
Let me start by saying this is deeply disturbing.

I feel the overlays prove the facial features do match. There are other things which match, too.

*BK said he thought he recalled living in Colorado and Indiana. Steve lived in Colorado and was from a northern state (Heyworth, Illinois).

*BK said he thought he had 3 brothers. Steve had 3 brothers.

If you can see other parallels here, please feel free.

My hinky meter is ringing off the charts after reading the letter from the nurse.

same height
weight is basically the same
mustache looks identical
hair coloring (even with age) looks the same
eyes look the same color

dottierainbow
10-22-2007, 08:04 PM
I'm wondering if they understood the overlay. They may be computer illiterate like I am. The overlay side by side is what convinced me they may be one of the same.

Gina_M
10-22-2007, 08:04 PM
I wonder if the nurse and BK are looking at any differences so closely that they are not noticing all the similarities. Kinda like when you don't notice that you resemble someone in your own family, but everyone else notices it.

Gina_M
10-22-2007, 08:06 PM
I'm wondering if they understood the overlay. They may be computer illiterate like I am. The overlay side by side is what convinced me they may be one of the same.

Yes, I wonder that too. Perhaps the overlay should be explained to them?
I wonder if they read the posts about the overlay with the descriptions of how it's done.

dottierainbow
10-22-2007, 08:07 PM
The side by side is the best one to use I believe.

Gina_M
10-22-2007, 08:14 PM
Benjaman on Doe Network:
http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/1007umga.html

Article: A Real Live Nobody:
http://savannahnow.com/node/364434

Article with video interview: Amnesia victim looks for answers:
http://www.wsav.com/midatlantic/sav/news.apx.-content-articles-SAV-2007-10-15-0025.html

Gina_M
10-22-2007, 08:20 PM
Family holds memorial for missing Heyworth native
PANTAGRAPH STAFF (http://javascript%3cb%3e%3c/b%3E:void%280%29;). Pantagraph (http://proquest.umi.com/pqdweb?RQT=318&pmid=33010&TS=1193073230&clientId=72171&VInst=PROD&VName=PQD&VType=PQD). Bloomington, Ill.: Nov 23, 2004 (http://proquest.umi.com/pqdweb?RQT=572&VType=PQD&VName=PQD&VInst=PROD&pmid=33010&pcid=14187811&SrchMode=3). pg. B.5


Abstract (Summary) Rescue workers with boats and planes searched for six days around the islands west of Morocco, and his family hired private investigators. His employer, the multinational agribusiness company Sygenta, posted a Web site, www.steve-dewey.com (http://www.steve-dewey.com/), to ask for help.


Ľ Jump to indexing (document details) (http://proquest.umi.com/pqdweb?index=0&did=748804331&SrchMode=1&sid=4&Fmt=3&VInst=PROD&VType=PQD&RQT=309&VName=PQD&TS=1192999235&clientId=72171#indexing)
Full Text (201 words)
Copyright Pantagraph Publishing Co. Nov 23, 2004

HEYWORTH -- Steven Dewey, a talented, three-sport athlete at Heyworth High School in the early 1970s, turned his hand to wind- surfing during a family vacation in August in the Canary Islands.
He disappeared around 1 p.m. Aug. 3 off the coast of Fuerteventura.
Rescue workers with boats and planes searched for six days around the islands west of Morocco, and his family hired private investigators. His employer, the multinational agribusiness company Sygenta, posted a Web site, www.steve-dewey.com (http://www.steve-dewey.com/), to ask for help.
Family members finally concluded he won't be found, so they memorialized him with a service on Monday at the Heyworth United Methodist Church.
"This is in place of a funeral," said his brother, Bob Dewey of Heyworth. "We don't have his body -- they didn't find anything -- but we wanted to have some closure on this. It's been hard on the family."
Steven Dewey, 50, was an agribusiness executive based in Basel, Switzerland, for Sygenta.
Survivors include his wife, Gwen; two sons, Kirk, 21, and Eric, 15; a daughter, Hannah, 19; his mother, Joanne Dewey; and a sister, Susan Rehtmeyer, McLean.
Memorials may be made to Heyworth High School, where he graduated in 1972.
[Illustration]Steven Dewey

Gina_M
10-22-2007, 08:24 PM
Article about Steve Dewey: Relatives remember lost windsurfer
http://www.tenerifenews.com/cms/front_content.php?idart=672

Chloekins
10-22-2007, 08:35 PM
Ive been a long time lurker and have been following this thread for a while now. I just wanted to say I'm very impressed and touched by all the hard work everyone here has put into finding this mans identity. You all are truly an inspiration.

I don't know anything about amnesia but I would think that one would be able to recognize themselves were they to see a picture of themselves. Could it be possible that the recognition of self would be altered?

Its such a pity I thought for sure this was the one!
The only thing that has kept me from going all the way was that Ben has both surgical scars on his jaw and his elbow, the missing man has nothing stated to that effect.

dottierainbow
10-22-2007, 08:42 PM
I'm also wondering if its fear of the unknown letting go of the person he knows as Benjamin Kyle. I really would hate to walk in his shoes.

satemplet
10-22-2007, 08:46 PM
I posted this on page 1 but will post again here,Do you think this man could be him?
http://www.nampn.org/cases/poole_gary.html

I know this man is younger but being homeless can make you look older than what you are and his height was probably just an estimate.
Here are the two photos
http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff41/satemplet/poole_gary.jpg
http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff41/satemplet/202282929.jpg

Can anyone do an overlay?
Thanks

SeriouslySearching
10-22-2007, 08:49 PM
It isn't a surgical scar on his jaw, but his neck. I had forgotten about that myself. I would be interested to know if Mr. Dewey did have such scars present.

KT Can
10-22-2007, 09:00 PM
Sorry guys, had to step away for a few & then get caught up on the posts. Any publicity is good publicity but in context with the received response the NE thing leave$ me $cratching my head a bit. To dismiss Dewey so quickly,or anyone for that matter, is puzzling. It has been more than 3 years since BK was found & I personally wouldn't expect him, a person who has been through the ringer, to look exactly the same as he did then. Age, time, stress, changes in eating habits, etc. can change a person drastically. I understand that the circumstances of Dewey's desappearance make him a long-long-long shot, but as we all know from being on this board, stranger things have happened.

From what I have read, other than the amnesia, BK is healed of all of his injuries & no longer lives or works at the hospital & is living with friends... so what role does a nurse play in his life now? Is this a nurse who treated him & then became a friend after the fact? Just curious as to the relationship.

SuziQ
10-22-2007, 09:25 PM
KT CAN, you have a pm

SuziQ
10-22-2007, 09:26 PM
And I don't think the noses are different. I think they are a perfect match.

Chloekins
10-22-2007, 09:28 PM
It isn't a surgical scar on his jaw, but his neck. I had forgotten about that myself. I would be interested to know if Mr. Dewey did have such scars present.

Its quite noticeable in the one picture from the side. I would imagine that it would be something that would be mentioned had the missing gentleman had such a scar.

I know this may be a bit far fetched but could Ben have been living in Canada when he disappeared? I think we should perhaps include Canada in our missing persons searches.

Another thing that keeps bugging me is the lack of clothing. If he was lost at sea he would still have had to walk a certain distance nude. I cant imagine people ignoring a large (6 footer) naked man walking down a busy city street such as the one on which he was found. We unfortunately all know that killers try to rid their victims of any identifying clues in order to thwart law enforcement. Could this be the real reason to the lack of clothing? Was Ben assaulted with the intention of leaving him for dead?

One last thought, now I do not know how long one would have to lay in the sun in order to induce UV related cataracts but I assume it would be an excessive amount of time. I just wanted to throw this out in the air but I read recently in a journal that airline pilots and fisherman are more likely to develop cortical cataracts as a result of long term UV exposure.

Sorry about all of this , just thinking out loud.

DawnTCB
10-22-2007, 10:06 PM
I really would hate to walk in his shoes.

I was thinking of this today... I would imagine that after so long of being a "real life nobody" it would get more and more difficult to imagine the truth... each dead end, each non-match would add to the belief (internal, and largely unspoken I would imagine) that the miracle will not occur, and so all possibilities are dismissed... The fear of the unknown is far worse than the safety of his known, I would imagine, no matter how much he believes in his conscious mind that he really wants to find his past.

That said, I would wish he would look into this more carefully. So many things match, and facial expressions mean diddley to me at this point. :) We don't know if the pictures of Mr. Dewey are even capturing his "facial expressions", and from what I have seen on this board, too many missing people photos are posed, staged photos of them looking "perfect"... not how they look after they haven't slept, or looking surprised over their shoulder, or fondly at a little puppy.... :) I think most of Steve's look the same. "Say Cheese!" photos, if you will, not real life.

The National Enquirer does raise some concerns for me, but my heart is saying they wouldn't want just BK... they would want his match too. Are they reading here? Did they send someone out already? Grrr. :razz:

Also the part about the noses not matching just really throws me. I did the Photoshop on my own as I mentioned and those two pictures the noses matched EXACTLY. Not way off, not a little off, not off at all. I am stumped by that comment.

Finally, I am wondering, is it possible to work this from the Dewey side? I would really like to know about the elbow scar BK has and whether Dewey had one. As someone mentioned earlier, that would solve this for me once and for all.

rhyno1974
10-22-2007, 10:36 PM
I think it is great all the work everyone is putting into this and I agree they do resemble each other a lot, but not enough to think that it is a match let alone a perfect match. Just my two cents.

Elphaba
10-22-2007, 11:10 PM
*raises my hand from the lurking peanut gallery* I have been searching out Canadian missing adult reports... with not much success.

Keep this in mind: just like celebrities have lookalikes, your average Joe or Jane can have them, too. BK and Stewey could just be that... lookalikes with only minor differences that aren't easily detectable. What I would like to know: are there any images of BK from when he was first found. That would help a great deal in being able to match him up to Dewey, if they are one in the same.

And a note of support: please don't get disappointed if these 2 men are not the same person. You guys have really worked hard with the best of intentions... I find that awesome. Keep it up!!!

rmf
10-22-2007, 11:18 PM
I have a question and forgive me if I missed it in the earlier thread:

The Doe Network page says BK weighs 240 lbs. Mr. Dewey's site says he weighed approx. 190 lbs. I am curious if anyone was able to find out what BK weighed when they found him? If he weighed 240 THEN, then I think it is highly unlikely BK is the missing man. If we carry the hypotheses forward that he somehow got caught in a current in the Atlantic and ended up on the southern coast, that would mean he'd probably lost a lot of weight during the journey and due to exposure. If he's gained weight since being found then that would make more sense, but I was just curious about the weight? Anyone know?

Gina_M
10-23-2007, 12:40 AM
I have a question and forgive me if I missed it in the earlier thread:

The Doe Network page says BK weighs 240 lbs. Mr. Dewey's site says he weighed approx. 190 lbs. I am curious if anyone was able to find out what BK weighed when they found him? If he weighed 240 THEN, then I think it is highly unlikely BK is the missing man. If we carry the hypotheses forward that he somehow got caught in a current in the Atlantic and ended up on the southern coast, that would mean he'd probably lost a lot of weight during the journey and due to exposure. If he's gained weight since being found then that would make more sense, but I was just curious about the weight? Anyone know?



Good point. I assumed he'd put on some weight after being found...though I would think they'd have noted what he weighed when he was found and used that on the Doe Network. Steve Dewey could have put on some weight before he was lost, but not that much. Since he was windsurfing he was probably in pretty good shape.

Gina_M
10-23-2007, 12:56 AM
I posted this on page 1 but will post again here,Do you think this man could be him?
http://www.nampn.org/cases/poole_gary.html

I know this man is younger but being homeless can make you look older than what you are and his height was probably just an estimate.
Here are the two photos
http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff41/satemplet/poole_gary.jpg
http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff41/satemplet/202282929.jpg

Can anyone do an overlay?
Thanks


I'm sure Dimples will be on soon. She is great at doing overlays. Thanks for the suggestion! We do need to keep our options open. Welcome to Websleuths :D

dimples37398
10-23-2007, 02:21 AM
I am up now it is 8 am here........Let me know if there is anything important I missed.....

Kel

dottierainbow
10-23-2007, 05:23 AM
Kel, Do you know how the nurse was invited to come here?

phenolred
10-23-2007, 08:01 AM
Wow I just got back, and I am soooo Disappointed about the response from the nurse. I thought she/they would be AS excited as WE were about the similarites, the side by side is just amazing, you cant take any old joe blow and do a side by side or overlay and have them be that much of a match. Even if they thopught it wasnt him I am surprised they werent amazed about how much they look alike, like twins separted at birth, like I said in a previous post I wonder if we can find out if Dewey was adopted.

I dont think
Gary David Poole looks like match because of the hairlines it looks like Garys hairline is more receded than BK's.

fox1950
10-23-2007, 08:14 AM
MaconChange-Wow, what a typo. Sorry. I should re-read what I type.:doh:

Synthia1021
10-23-2007, 09:19 AM
Kel, Do you know how the nurse was invited to come here?

I think I might be the source of that.. After reading the article that was first written about BK, I emailed the reporter of the article with several questions about BK when this thread was first started. I think the reporter must have forwarded it to the nurse as I got an email from her.

dottierainbow
10-23-2007, 09:44 AM
Do we actually know that the reporter invited this person? I'm only asking because what if it was a hoaxter? I'm not saying she was but I've seen them on Websleuths before. Did she give anything to show she is who she says she is?
I know some people who have been kicked off come back resurrected as someone else. I'm truly sorry if I'm out of line. I don't mean to offend but want to make sure.

DawnTCB
10-23-2007, 10:13 AM
I have concerns about Dottie's issue as well. No offense to anyone.

Gina_M
10-23-2007, 10:13 AM
The nurse addressed Synthia1021 in her first post here, even though Synthia1021 had mainly been lurking on the thread. So I think it is from Synthia contacting the reporter:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=53847&page=3

Synthia1021
10-23-2007, 10:16 AM
Dottie

You have a PM

Synthia1021
10-23-2007, 10:26 AM
Actually, I have had several posts on here.. usually I lurk, but I have been quite active with this one, as much as I can be at work..

My initial first posting here was a possible match, but the dates were wrong, then I saw the questions posted, so I thought I would email the reporter with some of the questions, I never got a reply from the reporter, but an answer from the nurse that was posted here which is the link that in post #45.

Since then I had two other private emails from the nurse that was about possible matches that were ruled out, I didn't post them here, because the two matches that I was speaking of were already posted here as not possible.

Also SS who has been keeping track of the states that have been searched. I completed NH, ME and VT.. but didn't find anything that was even close, using several different search options. I would be glad to help in any other way. Just let me know.. Thanks, Synthia

dottierainbow
10-23-2007, 10:39 AM
Thank you synthia.

SuziQ
10-23-2007, 11:36 AM
Thank you Synthia, here is the latest list. I will pick up more states, but I am following the San Diego County fires as I have family there.

Benjaman Kyle Search List
*States completed

CO-Dimples*
IN-Phenolred
IN-Gina M
ME-Synthia*
NB-AJ1020
NH-Synthia*
OK-SS
OR-SuziQ*
TX-KT CAN
UT-SuziQ*
VT-Synthia*

aj1020
10-23-2007, 11:51 AM
Nebraska is also done, I didn't find anything relavent. I will check Kansas next if no one objects.

phenolred
10-23-2007, 12:56 PM
I have done All I can do on Indiana unless Gina M is still searching, I came up empty.

Oneshoe01
10-23-2007, 01:35 PM
Hi. I emailed the WSAV3 reporter that interviewed BK on 10/15. She replied that NBC and CNN picked up his story and put it on the national feeds. Hopefully that will generate leads.

Mark Franzeo
10-23-2007, 02:56 PM
I think that Steve Dewey looks shockingly like him almost twins but, I feel the weight, and the missing scar on his neck kinda make it look like less of a match. And I don’t see Steve’s cleft chin on Mr. Kyle. Also, Mr. Kyle looks a lot older than Steve. Steve looks really good for his age and was probably rather fit considering all the sports he played. I don’t think he would age that much in less than a month regardless of what he’s been through. And I don’t think you would loose that much hair in less than a month either. Not to mention how did he get from Georgia from the Canary Islands. Does Georgia have any ports near where Mr. Kyle was found that would be getting freighters from that area in? I really would love for them to be a match because that would mean he has a rather nice life to go back to, i.e. a loving family, good job etc. but I just don’t think it’s him. I really do hope I am wrong.

Mark Franzeo
10-23-2007, 02:57 PM
Ok, I reread the " A Real, Live Nobody " article and 2 statements caught my eye. The first, "It's like I have a 20-year gap," . I think that is a clue. If you couple that with "When I looked in the mirror, I could not believe how gray my hair was and how old I was,"Kyle said. "There's a bunch of years missing, and I don't know what happened." It makes me think he was actually missing for a long time. I wonder how much of the first 30-40 years he actually remembers? It seems odd to me that he would say something so specific like I feel I lost 20 years. Why not say I can’t remember anything. I wonder if he knew what year it was when he was found? Now the statement that really got me thinking was He worries he might never find out - or, if he does, he might not like the person he was, he said. That I think is a major clue. I get a feeling that Mr. Kyle has a few memories about his first 30-40 years that he is not sharing. I bet he remembers something about his past he rather not and is just writing it off because he rather it not be true. The scenario I am putting together in my head goes something like this. Perhaps, he left his family or life behind voluntarily about 20 years or so ago and was either living a completely different life or maybe even as a transient until he was attacked in 2004 giving him the amnesia. That would explain why nobody is looking for him. I mean if he left on his own accord for selfish reasons leaving behind a jilted lover or wife, maybe they don't want to find him, are not even looking for him, or never even reported him missing. I just think that is a odd statement. I feel he remembers something about his past that he doesn’t like thus making him wonder if he was a bad person or a jerk before he lost his memory. I don’t think he was a criminal nor do I think he was bad as in a thief or hurting people. I think the worse he could have done is abandon his family or something thus being a "bad" person perhaps morally but not criminally. Sorry that this is so long winded but I have been thinking about this All last night and today.

phenolred
10-23-2007, 04:29 PM
Amnesia is a strange thing. I have watched programs about it and I have even seen people on Oprah that have gotten it. Some people remember their very early chilhood but remembered nothing about say the last 5 years of their lives their new husbands were strangers to them etc. Then I have seen amnesiacs with memory of the recent but nothing of their early childhood. It might have something to do with what part of the brain gets damaged etc.

SeriouslySearching
10-23-2007, 05:26 PM
I have given this much thought the past day or so and had almost written off even coming back to work on this case anymore. When the nurse mentioned the National Enquirer, it really did not sit well with me AT ALL! I feel this will take take away all credibility of his case being true. John Q. Public nor the media will take it seriously after they see his face in such a magazine (which sounds like is through no fault of Mr. Kyle's, but the person handling things for him). I finally decided we might be the only people actually left to try to find out his true identity. This man is not a sideshow and maybe we need to find his family before he becomes one. Perhaps the person handling things for Mr. Kyle does not have his best interests at heart.

So...where were we? Yes, take Kansas! We can still methodically rule out any missing from the ones we can find.

We need to get to the bottom of this whole thing. We need to figure out who he is or isn't now, as the case may be. I think we should establish a direct connection with the law enforcement agency involved and the officer responsible for his case. This doesn't mean everyone should jump on this. There should be one person designated to contact them. I volunteer Christine for this as she has rapport already established in GA with LE there. (she already mentioned her organization would like to help.) If anyone disagrees...please say so. Not trying to be bossy here, but I feel in order to get the best results in working with LE to gain information pertinent to finding his identity...we should make certain to do things the right way. : )

marysawol
10-23-2007, 06:05 PM
I have given this much thought the past day or so and had almost written off even coming back to work on this case anymore. When the nurse mentioned the National Enquirer, it really did not sit well with me AT ALL! I feel this will take take away all credibility of his case being true. John Q. Public nor the media will take it seriously after they see his face in such a magazine (which sounds like is through no fault of Mr. Kyle's, but the person handling things for him). I finally decided we might be the only people actually left to try to find out his true identity. This man is not a sideshow and maybe we need to find his family before he becomes one. Perhaps the person handling things for Mr. Kyle does not have his best interests at heart.

So...where were we? Yes, take Kansas! We can still methodically rule out any missing from the ones we can find.

We need to get to the bottom of this whole thing. We need to figure out who he is or isn't now, as the case may be. I think we should establish a direct connection with the law enforcement agency involved and the officer responsible for his case. This doesn't mean everyone should jump on this. There should be one person designated to contact them. I volunteer Christine for this as she has rapport already established in GA with LE there. (she already mentioned her organization would like to help.) If anyone disagrees...please say so. Not trying to be bossy here, but I feel in order to get the best results in working with LE to gain information pertinent to finding his identity...we should make certain to do things the right way. : )

I concur.

rhyno1974
10-23-2007, 07:03 PM
I think the National Enquirer idea is great. It is getting his face out to Millions of people. Everyone goes to the corner store, grocery store etc. Someone out there knows him.

Gina_M
10-23-2007, 07:06 PM
I have done All I can do on Indiana unless Gina M is still searching, I came up empty.

I'll do some more searches in the newspaper archives, but so far I haven't found anything. Anyone else have a subscription to the newspaper archives?
If not I can focus on searching that site for anything that might be related to Benjaman.

Off topic in reference what SuziQ said about following the fire coverage - I have family in San Diego County too, and friends throughout the area. I live in the area too, luckily not too close to any of the fires, but I've been checking on the fires and keeping my family out of state up to date on things!

Gina_M
10-23-2007, 07:08 PM
I think the National Enquirer idea is great. It is getting his face out to Millions of people. Everyone goes to the corner store, grocery store etc. Someone out there knows him.

It's good to get his story out there - but I think a preferred outlet would be something more like People magazine. It is taken more seriously than the NE.

SeriouslySearching
10-23-2007, 07:18 PM
I think the National Enquirer idea is great. It is getting his face out to Millions of people. Everyone goes to the corner store, grocery store etc. Someone out there knows him.They could use the headline....ALIENS ABDUCTED MAN AND ERASED HIS MEMORY THROUGH SMALL HOLE IN HIS JAW. Uh huh...it sounds like a fabulous idea. (shaking head) How many people honestly take that magazine seriously?!?!?!?! If I saw a person's photo in it...I wouldn't look twice to identify them due to the nature of the magazine and it's reputation.

aj1020
10-23-2007, 07:28 PM
They could use the headline....ALIENS ABDUCTED MAN AND ERASED HIS MEMORY THROUGH SMALL HOLE IN HIS JAW. Uh huh...it sounds like a fabulous idea. (shaking head) How many people honestly take that magazine seriously?!?!?!?! If I saw a person's photo in it...I wouldn't look twice to identify them due to the nature of the magazine and it's reputation.

I totally agree with you, SS. But, someone recently (maybe in the Maddy forum??) had mentioned that the NE was making strides at becoming more "mainstream" and honest. I guess I haven't paid much attention to NE while I've been in the checkout lately (or EVER :)) but I will see if I can find any articles pointing to the increased credibility of the NE. If nothing else it would put my mind at ease a little to know the NE isn't quite as trashy as it once was.

I guess I just don't really see the point of putting it in the NE if it's still a total fake tabloid - I mean who would see him that would think the story was real???

Gina_M
10-23-2007, 07:42 PM
I've been thinking about that 20-year gap comment too, thinking maybe he went missing 20 years before he was found. I've been doing searches for people disappearing around 1984.

Also, I joined a site called wikimapia...kinda like a combination of Google Earth and Wikipedia. If you set the view to Hybrid you can see the aerial view plus the names of the roads - plus users can go in and label specific landmarks and add a description. I've been looking on there to get a better overview of the Richmond Hill area:
http://www.wikimapia.org/#lat=31.940072&lon=-81.309986&z=13&l=0&m=h&v=2

rhyno1974
10-23-2007, 07:46 PM
They could use the headline....ALIENS ABDUCTED MAN AND ERASED HIS MEMORY THROUGH SMALL HOLE IN HIS JAW. Uh huh...it sounds like a fabulous idea. (shaking head) How many people honestly take that magazine seriously?!?!?!?! If I saw a person's photo in it...I wouldn't look twice to identify them due to the nature of the magazine and it's reputation.


Who cares if people take it seriously or not. Its not like a lot of people are going to see his story and start looking for him. Its just getting his photo out to someone who might recognize him.

Gina_M
10-23-2007, 07:54 PM
Who cares if people take it seriously or not. Its not like a lot of people are going to see his story and start looking for him. Its just getting his photo out to someone who might recognize him.

But what if someone does not immediately recognize him by glancing at the cover, because he may have been missing for many years and/or presumed dead. Someone in his family or friends may need to read the article and study his photos more closely.

rhyno1974
10-23-2007, 08:52 PM
But what if someone does not immediately recognize him by glancing at the cover, because he may have been missing for many years and/or presumed dead. Someone in his family or friends may need to read the article and study his photos more closely.

Yes that is true. But if the story isn't run at all there is no chance of anything. Of course I think it would be great for the story to be in more respected magazines, cnn, etc, but if this is all we got I will take it. 99% of the cases that we look at on here get zero coverage anywhere.

Earthbound Misfit I
10-23-2007, 09:22 PM
It seems to me that Mr. Kyle helped make the decision for an article to be written in the NE about himself. Mr. Kyle is an adult and by no means stupid. He is capable of making choices for himself without anyones aide. Just because he has amnesia it doesn't mean he is mentally challenged in any way and doesn't know what he is doing. He has been described as having an above average IQ. I don't think the nurse is abusing any privileges here. She isn't forcing him to do anything he doesn't want to do IMO.

SeriouslySearching
10-23-2007, 09:30 PM
It seems to me that Mr. Kyle helped make the decision for an article to be written in the NE about himself. Mr. Kyle is an adult and by no means stupid. He is capable of making choices for himself without anyones aide. Just because he has amnesia it doesn't mean he is mentally challenged in any way and doesn't know what he is doing. He has been described as having an above average IQ. I don't think the nurse is abusing any priviledges here. She isn't forcing him to do anything he doesn't want to do IMO.Then maybe he doesn't realize what type of magazine NE has been for the past 20 years or so. You are right and I would never think of Mr. Kyle as being anything less than intelligent, of course.

However, Mr. Kyle has been unable or unwilling to come to this site to work on his case for whatever reason and has depended on the nurse to do so. We don't know he is receiving all of the information or if he is allowing her to take over for him in order for him not to deal with it...as it could prove to be too distressing for him. This could be the case and we don't know how little or much he is actively involved in finding out his identity besides searching various missing person sites and doing a couple of interviews thus far.

Earthbound Misfit I
10-23-2007, 09:45 PM
Benjaman was found in 2004. He isn't residing in a hospital anymore. He lives with friends. I'm sure he has most likely been to a grocery store during that time and most likely knows what NE is. I think it's a good chance for him to get some exposure.



Then maybe he doesn't realize what type of magazine NE has been for the past 20 years or so. You are right and I would never think of Mr. Kyle as being anything less than intelligent, of course.

SeriouslySearching
10-23-2007, 09:50 PM
In that case, I would hope his intelligence tells him to seek advice of people who have dealt with such cases in the past. I find it would be a bad choice of places to put his story. Hopefully, his friends...the nurses and doctors who treated him...will help steer him away from this one. : )

rhyno1974
10-23-2007, 09:59 PM
In that case, I would hope his intelligence tells him to seek advice of people who have dealt with such cases in the past. I find it would be a bad choice of places to put his story. Hopefully, his friends...the nurses and doctors who treated him...will help steer him away from this one. : )

Simply Ridiculous! I guess we will agree to disagree.

Gina_M
10-23-2007, 10:01 PM
I just hope his story is picked up by more media. What about People magazine?

Autumn2004
10-23-2007, 10:05 PM
I wonder if the reason why they let it be in NE was because of the money from selling the story. Since he cannot hold down a job he might need financial help and hopes that this will allow people to figure out who he is.

SeriouslySearching
10-23-2007, 10:05 PM
I just hope his story is picked up by more media. What about People magazine?We should concentrate heavily on this before it hits the newsstands in a rag mag! Let's get our letter campaign back on the legitimate news media and magazines before that possibly hits the stands or we might not get another chance. ;)

Gina_M
10-23-2007, 10:12 PM
http://www.people.com/people/about

Have a hot news tip, celebrity photo or celebrity video?

* Email the editors of PEOPLE magazine at editor@people.com
* Or call us at 1-212-522-6699

SeriouslySearching
10-23-2007, 10:13 PM
I wonder if the reason why they let it be in NE was because of the money from selling the story. Since he cannot hold down a job he might need financial help and hopes that this will allow people to figure out who he is.Can he legally get that money since he has no SSN? It seems to me he would have to pay taxes on it as income and with no SSN...he couldn't. However, the nurse sure could if she sold it to them.

Gina_M
10-23-2007, 10:21 PM
Saw this in another thread:

A new blog by The Denver Post will highlight cold cases from throughout Colorado.

http://blogs.denverpost.com/coldcases

sweetpea657
10-23-2007, 11:31 PM
I've been searching right along with all of you and although this is probably nothing, I'm coming out of lurkdom to post this.

http://www.nola.com/forums/searching/index.ssf?artid=38738

The age, ties to Indiana and the three brothers fit to what Mr. Kyle believes he remembers. I don't know enough about post-traumatic stress and schizophrenia to know if this rules Mr. Kyle out though.

If Benjaman's nurse (or anyone) thinks it's a possible match and wants to respond to her post, feel free!

Back to searching and lurkdom. :)

Earthbound Misfit I
10-23-2007, 11:58 PM
I wonder if Larry Huff would have been fingerprinted when he went to Vietnam? If so, would those fingerprints be among those already checked by the FBI when they checked the databases for fingerprint matches for Benjaman Kyle?

ETA: Your post brings up a good question though. Did "Benjaman Kyle" serve in Nam? He would have been about the approximate age to have done so.


I've been searching right along with all of you and although this is probably nothing, I'm coming out of lurkdom to post this.

http://www.nola.com/forums/searching/index.ssf?artid=38738

The age, ties to Indiana and the three brothers fit to what Mr. Kyle believes he remembers. I don't know enough about post-traumatic stress and schizophrenia to know if this rules Mr. Kyle out though.

If Benjaman's nurse (or anyone) thinks it's a possible match and wants to respond to her post, feel free!

Back to searching and lurkdom. :)

SeriouslySearching
10-24-2007, 01:50 AM
I've been searching right along with all of you and although this is probably nothing, I'm coming out of lurkdom to post this.

http://www.nola.com/forums/searching/index.ssf?artid=38738

The age, ties to Indiana and the three brothers fit to what Mr. Kyle believes he remembers. I don't know enough about post-traumatic stress and schizophrenia to know if this rules Mr. Kyle out though.

If Benjaman's nurse (or anyone) thinks it's a possible match and wants to respond to her post, feel free!

Back to searching and lurkdom. :)This is certainly worth checking out! I am glad you posted it!

Don't lurk! Come join us! Welcome to WS!

ShowerSinger
10-24-2007, 02:55 AM
There is a thread on here started by Jeana, about a Kevin Mura. I don't know how to link it, but it sounds familiar. Catholic, 3 sons, can't remember... Just wanted to throw this out there.
You guys are doing great here, I do so enjoy reading this thread!

marysawol
10-24-2007, 03:08 AM
There is a thread on here started by Jeana, about a Kevin Mura. I don't know how to link it, but it sounds familiar. Catholic, 3 sons, can't remember... Just wanted to throw this out there.
You guys are doing great here, I do so enjoy reading this thread!

http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17739&highlight=kevin+mura

snarkymalarkey
10-24-2007, 07:52 AM
http://www.theyaremissed.org/ncma/gallery/ncmaprofile_all.php?A200300883W

i can't remember if he had tattoos? This missing person has scars on his left elbow

I thing left elbow and scar/scars would be some good key words to google

phenolred
10-24-2007, 08:01 AM
I was remembering the old saying ANY publicity is GOOD publicity. That being said I can understand some peoples reservations about the NE however, I think they are not as bad as they used to be. There are far worse ones out there. The NE has alot of celebrity gossip etc. The other ones deal with the strange and wacko stories, aliens abducted my pet frog etc....LOL
I was just surprised by the nurses reaction. I thought she would have been more excited about the eerie similarties between the merge pic and the side by side we were ALL astonded by the likeness!

phenolred
10-24-2007, 08:03 AM
ETA: Your post brings up a good question though. Did "Benjaman Kyle" serve in Nam? He would have been about the approximate age to have done so.
So if BK did serve in NAM they would have identified him when they took the prints.

I found this
the FBI (http://savannahnow.com/content/related?topic=Federal+Bureau+of+Investigation) took Kyle (http://savannahnow.com/content/related?topic=Benjaman+Kyle)'s fingerprints and forwarded them to the National Criminal Justice Information Services Division (http://savannahnow.com/content/related?topic=Information+Services+Division) in West Virginia (http://savannahnow.com/content/related?topic=West+Virginia). There, technicians ran the prints through their national databases, which include convicted criminals, crime scene evidence and anyone who ever served in U.S. (http://savannahnow.com/content/related?topic=United+States) armed forces, said William Kirkconnell (http://savannahnow.com/content/related?topic=William+Kirkconnell), supervisory senior resident agent for the FBI (http://savannahnow.com/content/related?topic=Federal+Bureau+of+Investigation) in Savannah (http://savannahnow.com/content/related?topic=Savannah).
"There was nothing on file," They also took photographs and checked to make sure Kyle (http://savannahnow.com/content/related?topic=Benjaman+Kyle) was not in the federal Witness Protection Program, Kingston (http://savannahnow.com/content/related?topic=Jack+Kingston) said.

Gina_M
10-24-2007, 10:40 AM
http://www.theyaremissed.org/ncma/gallery/ncmaprofile_all.php?A200300883W

i can't remember if he had tattoos? This missing person has scars on his left elbow

I thing left elbow and scar/scars would be some good key words to google

Good find - except according to the nurse's first post, BK doesn't have any tattoos. Here's the link to her post with a bunch of info in it:
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=53847&page=3

ETA: good idea to google for missing people with scars on their left elbow!

Gina_M
10-24-2007, 10:42 AM
Just a thought...could he have previously had a tattoo, and then had it removed? Would they be able to tell that he used to have a tattoo? If so, don't want to rule anyone out just on the basis of the tattoos.

KT Can
10-24-2007, 10:55 AM
Weight description is way off, but worth a look as he's been missing since 1980.


http://www.nola.com/forums/searching/index.ssf

28177. Jerry or Gerald Havron
by catc (http://www.nola.com/forums/profile.ssf?nickname=catc), 2/17/06 4:10 ET
Looking for Jerry or Gerald Havron. Last seen in 1980. Was working at the Blue bayou inn as a chef in Manitowish waters, WI. Short with a slight build about 120-160 pounds; blondish hair mustache,. Is about 50 to 56 years old now. Might reside in Georgia, Florida or North Caroline and work in the restaurant-related field.

Gina_M
10-24-2007, 11:04 AM
Weight description is way off, but worth a look as he's been missing since 1980.


http://www.nola.com/forums/searching/index.ssf

28177. Jerry or Gerald Havron
by catc (http://www.nola.com/forums/profile.ssf?nickname=catc), 2/17/06 4:10 ET
Looking for Jerry or Gerald Havron. Last seen in 1980. Was working at the Blue bayou inn as a chef in Manitowish waters, WI. Short with a slight build about 120-160 pounds; blondish hair mustache,. Is about 50 to 56 years old now. Might reside in Georgia, Florida or North Caroline and work in the restaurant-related field.

That sounds close except that he's short with a slight build. BK is 5'11" and described as large-framed. That "restaurant-related field" really got me though!

christine2448
10-24-2007, 11:23 AM
I've been searching right along with all of you and although this is probably nothing, I'm coming out of lurkdom to post this.

http://www.nola.com/forums/searching/index.ssf?artid=38738

The age, ties to Indiana and the three brothers fit to what Mr. Kyle believes he remembers. I don't know enough about post-traumatic stress and schizophrenia to know if this rules Mr. Kyle out though.

If Benjaman's nurse (or anyone) thinks it's a possible match and wants to respond to her post, feel free!

Back to searching and lurkdom. :)

Very interesting find, IMO. Amazing what is out there to be found if you really know how to get around on the net.

Sable
10-24-2007, 12:30 PM
Could he be a possibility?
Eugene Fish

http://www.charleyproject.org/images/f/fish_eugene.jpg
Above: Eugene, circa 1990 http://www.charleyproject.org/banners/bar.jpg Vital Statistics at Time of Disappearance

Missing Since: June 21, 2004 from Fremont County, Colorado
Classification: Endangered Missing
Age: 53 years old
Distinguishing Characteristics: Caucasian male. Brown hair. Eugene's nickname is Gene.

http://www.charleyproject.org/banners/bar.jpg
Details of Disappearance

Eugene was last seen at his home in rural Fremont County, Colorado on June 21, 2004. Lynn Fish, his wife, stated he left their home angrily after and argument. She called Eugene's father a week later and told him Eugene had left; she stated she believed he left of his own volition. Lynn said Eugene had wanted to be free of responsibilities and he had smashed his computer and cut up his credit cards before leaving without the house. He left his cellular phone behind. She believed he was planning to go to Mexico or South America.
Eugene is a retired federal agent and has a pension of over $4,000 a month. He has not attempted to access it since his disappearance and Lynn is now collecting it in his stead. He has also not used his credit cards, passport and bank accounts since his disappearance. His parents have hired a private investigator to help locate him; the investigator believe Eugene met with foul play. He was born and raised New York, attended Siena College, and moved to Colorado in 2003 after his retirement. Most of his family lives in New York and he is the sole heir to his parents' estate, worth an estimated $500,000. Eugene was close to his family prior to his disappearance and called his parents every weekend.
Lynn has allegedly given inconsistent statements about Eugene's disappearance and has been uncooperative with the police investigation. She did not report him missing; one of his friends did so on September 1. Lynn stated that when Eugene left, he was driving his red 2000 Ford pickup truck. Eugene allegedly said he would send the truck back to her later. Lynn stated the truck reappeared in the Fish family's driveway days later, three miles inside the locked gate to the property.
Prior to his disappearance, Eugene had made statements to the effect that he was disillusioned by his retirement and his marriage. He and Lynn married in 1997 after cohabiting for four years. In January 2004, the police were called to their home to investigate a domestic dispute, but both Lynn and Eugene stated no violence had occurred, so no arrests were made. After his disappearance, however, Lynn told Eugene's father that her husband had been beating and shoving her. Eugene's father died in 2007, at the age of ninety. In his will he left provisions for the foundation of a trust fund. The money from the fund will be used to search for Eugene. Eugene has previously lived in Utah and Texas. Although his family believes he met with foul play, police are investigating his case as a missing person rather than a crime.

Indiana at Heart
10-24-2007, 12:32 PM
Did we rule out Steve Dewey? DNA ran to make sure?

Sable
10-24-2007, 12:40 PM
Lots more info about Eugene Fish:
http://www.crimeandjustice.us/forums/lofiversion/index.php?t6193.html

Synthia1021
10-24-2007, 12:47 PM
I had sent Eugene Fish's profile to the nurse earlier.. I didn't get a response back about if it could be him.

MaxMoMom
10-24-2007, 01:06 PM
Did someone "say" earlier on that they sent the Steve Dewey possilbility to the FBI?

Also since Eugene Fish is a former federal agent then I would think that his finger prints are on file somewhere...

MaconChange
10-24-2007, 01:26 PM
Did someone "say" earlier on that they sent the Steve Dewey possilbility to the FBI?

Also since Eugene Fish is a former federal agent then I would think that his finger prints are on file somewhere...


Yes, I called the FBI...

MaxMoMom
10-24-2007, 01:28 PM
Glad to hear that! I checked out the website for NE and it seems to be all about the celebrities. It doesn't really seem like a story they would pick up.


Yes, I called the FBI...

SeriouslySearching
10-24-2007, 04:10 PM
Yes, if BK were Fish...the FBI would have his prints, photos, and everything about this man on file and would be able to have found him easily while running BK's prints.

Does Eugene Fish have a thread here? It sounds like his wife was instrumental in getting rid of him. It sounds like she also had motive and the means. His truck showing up after 3 days is a huge red flag.

SeriouslySearching
10-24-2007, 04:17 PM
Just a thought...could he have previously had a tattoo, and then had it removed? Would they be able to tell that he used to have a tattoo? If so, don't want to rule anyone out just on the basis of the tattoos.There would be definite scars from tattoo removal. I think we can safely rule anyone with tats out.

SeriouslySearching
10-24-2007, 04:22 PM
Did we rule out Steve Dewey? DNA ran to make sure?No. :(

Indiana at Heart
10-24-2007, 07:24 PM
I feel until DNA is done this might be Steve! The pictures keep telling me there is a big chance it is him! We can't say cause the nurse feels it's not him. I have a strong feeling it maybe him


No. :(

Chloekins
10-24-2007, 09:55 PM
I feel until DNA is done this might be Steve! The pictures keep telling me there is a big chance it is him! We can't say cause the nurse feels it's not him. I have a strong feeling it maybe him

I think that DNA testing would be a waste of time and money. I think he could easily be identified by family members or distinguishing characteristics. Keep in mind that testing runs between 300 to 500 for a credible lab. Just my 2 cents for what its worth. :)

SeriouslySearching
10-24-2007, 11:32 PM
Yes, if they knew about BK perhaps they could. However, since BK is choosing not to entertain this as an option...it is doubtful this will happen.

DNA testing, imo, is not a waste of time or money when other factors do match so closely. Besides...does the FBI put a dollar value on testing now? We are the taxpayers footing the bill for ALL of the the FBI lab work going through Quantico, VA, as far as I know.

Gina_M
10-25-2007, 03:11 AM
This guy was reportedly in the military at one point, so he would have been ruled out by fingerprints, but I'd still like to see a picture of the guy.

Kenneth Raynor Childress
born Sept. 1945 in North Carolina
missing since 1979-1980
brown hair
5'10" to 6 feet tall
http://icaremissingpersonscoldcases.yuku.com/topic/564/t/Missing-brother-Kenneth-Raynor-Childress.html

Indiana at Heart
10-25-2007, 05:55 AM
The family as far as I know knows nothing of this BK. He feels its not him but if he can't remember anything so how can he know. I don't feel it's a waste of money! If it is Steve Dewey, money is not the answer but the love of his family is a lot more then money for DNA!

They overlay of picture gives me so much hope on this one!



I think that DNA testing would be a waste of time and money. I think he could easily be identified by family members or distinguishing characteristics. Keep in mind that testing runs between 300 to 500 for a credible lab. Just my 2 cents for what its worth. :)

Chloekins
10-25-2007, 07:26 AM
Yes, if they knew about BK perhaps they could. However, since BK is choosing not to entertain this as an option...it is doubtful this will happen.

DNA testing, imo, is not a waste of time or money when other factors do match so closely. Besides...does the FBI put a dollar value on testing now? We are the taxpayers footing the bill for ALL of the the FBI lab work going through Quantico, VA, as far as I know.

I understand why my comment would be upsetting but the fact of the matter is that LE would not place money into this when Ben has very distinguishing characteristics. Yes his features match closely, however, the missing gentleman does not have the same scars as Ben. I think we need to eliminate all the logical options before jumping onto the pirates/lost at sea scenario.

Proper credible DNA testing is costly, time consuming and not something that is done on a whim. I dont mean to sound harsh this is not my intention but if you dont think the FBI factors in cost during an investigation you are very mistaken. :(

DawnTCB
10-25-2007, 10:11 AM
Did I miss something? What scars does BK have that we know Steve Dewey did not have?

(going back to make sure I read every post...)

Gina_M
10-25-2007, 10:43 AM
As far as I know, we don't know anything about Steve Dewey's scars or lack thereof.

Gina_M
10-25-2007, 10:50 AM
Judd Miller
missing May 1, 1975 from Tenants Harbor, Maine
age 21 at time of disappearance
(this means he was born around 1954)

presumed lost at sea

Miller's family, however, believes he may have survived. They think he may have suffered a head injury, developed amnesia, and forgotten his identity. There have been reported sightings of Miller since his disappearance, which would support the amnesia theory, but none of the sightings have been confirmed.

http://charleyproject.org/cases/m/miller_judd.html

phenolred
10-25-2007, 10:57 AM
Did I miss something? What scars does BK have that we know Steve Dewey did not have?

(going back to make sure I read every post...)


I do not believe anybody has confirmed that Dewey did or did not have any scars. But we know that BK has some surgical scars. I think on neck and elbows, and the large pock mark on his jaw he thinks from a tooth abcess or something to that effect

Chloekins
10-25-2007, 12:03 PM
I do not believe anybody has confirmed that Dewey did or did not have any scars. But we know that BK has some surgical scars. I think on neck and elbows, and the large pock mark on his jaw he thinks from a tooth abcess or something to that effect


I assumed that if Dewey had such prominent scarring it would have been mentioned with his missing persons information. Especially scarring about the face and neck which would be easily noticeable upon casual interaction. Of course you know what happens when you assume! lol!

Babyslims
10-25-2007, 12:31 PM
but it is for sure he had those scars before he was beat up??

fox1950
10-25-2007, 01:34 PM
I think it is amazing how much time and effort you guys have put into this case. Although, I see that SD and Bk look almost the same I have never from the start thought they were the same person. BK looks so much older than SD, and there are certain facial features such as his chin, the look in this eyes, the nose, that make me feel that it is not him although certainly this is just an opinion and they could very well be the same person.

Has BK'S dnA been taken to match up with any missing persons that they already have DNA on? This seems to be the first step in finding out who he is. Forgive me if this has already been addressed.

Keep up the hard work---I know that one day you will be successful in finding out the answers.

Chloekins
10-25-2007, 01:49 PM
but it is for sure he had those scars before he was beat up??

The scar on his neck/jaw line is consistent with drainage of a large abscess which would not have occurred during his initial injuries but as a result of dental infection. The scaring on his elbow is from reconstructive surgery which placed pins in his elbow.

The only injuries that were mentioned specifically in the original report are that he had head injuries from blunt force trauma to the skull, severe cataracts from extended UV exposure, sun burn, dehydration and multiple fire ant bites.

phenolred
10-25-2007, 02:31 PM
This is from the Doe Network it will help clear up some information about his scars... This is Benjaman Kyles info
for more info see his Doe Network page http://www.doenetwork.org/ its case number 1007umga
Vital Statistics

Estimated age: 50-60's
Approximate Height and Weight: 5'11"; 240 lbs.
Distinguishing Characteristics: Graying hair with receding hairline. Blue-green eyes. Above-average intelligence. Well-spoken. Professional demeanor.
Marks, Scars: Two parallel surgical scars on left elbow (from reparative surgery for broken elbow that may involve pins/plates implantation). Surgical scar on front of neck appears to be from cervical discotomy. Small round scar on left side of face near chin appears to be a puncture-type wound but believes it may be related to former tooth abscess. No tattoos. No body piercings.
Medical: Blinding cataracts in both eyes may have resulted from prolonged exposure to sun while unconscious prior to being found and brought to hospital.
Fingerprints: On file with the FBI in Savannah, Georgia.
Dentals: Three teeth missing from upper front and one tooth missing from upper right side of mouth. Not known whether dental problems occurred after or as result of mugging in August of 2004.

snarkymalarkey
10-25-2007, 02:37 PM
Does anybody know how long does it take go blind from exposure to the sun?

Al_B
10-25-2007, 03:12 PM
Sun and eye damage


Sunlight is very bright, and looking directly at the Sun is painful to the eyes. Looking directly at the Sun when it is high in the sky causes temporary bleaching of the photosensitive pigments in the retina, which makes phosphene visual artifacts and may cause temporary partial blindness. Direct viewing of the Sun with the naked eye delivers about 4 milliwatts of sunlight to the retina that is in the solar image, heating it up and potentially (though not normally) damaging it. Brief viewing of the full direct Sun with the naked eye is unpleasant but generally safe.

Viewing the Sun through light-concentrating optics such as binoculars is hazardous without an attenuating (ND) filter to dim the sunlight. Suitable filters are available at welding (http://www.solarnavigator.net/welding.htm) supply shops and camera stores. Using a proper filter is very important as some improvised filters reduce visible light while passing either infrared or ultraviolet rays that can still damage the eye. Viewing the Sun through unfiltered 7x50 mm binoculars can deliver as much as 2.5 watts of sunlight into each eye, over 300 times more power than naked eye viewing. Even brief glances at the midday Sun through unfiltered binoculars can cause permanent blindness.
http://www.solarnavigator.net/the_sun.htm
this is all I can find

SeriouslySearching
10-25-2007, 03:15 PM
As far as I know, we don't know anything about Steve Dewey's scars or lack thereof.This is true. We don't know since they did not mention with certainty any physical characteristics such as birth marks or scars.

I have never been able to visually see the possible surgical scar on BK's neck in the photos...so I have no idea how large or small it is either.

Another thing we have to consider is that the family of BK may not be aware of those scars or injuries he has sustained. We don't know if this is his first bout of amnesia or how long he could have been estranged from his family before now.

I am trying to understand how the physicians at the hospital who nursed BK back to health don't know the exact procedure done to his elbow if there are pins and plates. A simple x-ray would be able to detect if it was due to a break, a shatter, or something else. (pins and plates should have numbers which are traceable, too) Also, they should be able to tell if he definitely had surgery to his spine via the neck area.

I have never heard of a drainage tube being used on the outside of the face for an abcessed tooth. This doesn't make sense to me. (Maybe someone can enlighten me.) I found a case where a woman was in critical condition due to an abcess and altho they did use a needle to aspirate, a drainage tube was only used in the neck area and not on the face or jaw. (This could explain his neck scar.) http://www.cda-adc.ca/jcda/vol-67/issue-6/324.html

Chloekins
10-25-2007, 03:18 PM
Does anybody know how long does it take go blind from exposure to the sun?

Ok I called a friend of mine who routinely does lens replacement surgery. I asked him how long it would take for someone to develop cataracts from UVB exposure. I know from personal knowledge that it is a cumulative outcome after many years, but since I am not an ophthalmologist I decided I needed backup. He confirmed that cataracts due to sun exposure usually take many years to develop. Interestingly he noted that obese people and alcoholics are more prone to developing cataracts.

I mentioned previously that Ben may have spent time in very sunny areas, or was perhaps a fisherman or pilot. There are a great deal of professions that would cause one to be exposed to sunlight for long periods of time. He may have had clouding of the eye before his prolonged exposure post beating that may have exacerbated an existing condition.

With that in mind it is very rare for a person to be in a comatose state with open eyes. Most comatose patient's eyes roll back into the skull because of relaxation of the muscles holding the eye. Im not saying that there are no cases of open eyes Im just pointing out the most people do not.

I wish I could take a look at his blood work and liver panel that was drawn up at admittance. I think it would be very telling about his lifestyle previous to being attacked.

SeriouslySearching
10-25-2007, 03:23 PM
Did you happen to ask what damage could occur if a person was floating in the ocean with the hot, August sun beating down on them for an extended period of time without any way to shield the eyes?

Chloekins
10-25-2007, 03:28 PM
This is true. We don't know since they did not mention with certainty any physical characteristics such as birth marks or scars.

I have never been able to visually see the possible surgical scar on BK's neck in the photos...so I have no idea how large or small it is either.

Another thing we have to consider is that the family of BK may not be aware of those scars or injuries he has sustained. We don't know if this is his first bout of amnesia or how long he could have been estranged from his family before now.

I am trying to understand how the physicians at the hospital who nursed BK back to health don't know the exact procedure done to his elbow if there are pins and plates. A simple x-ray would be able to detect if it was due to a break, a shatter, or something else. (pins and plates should have numbers which are traceable, too) Also, they should be able to tell if he definitely had surgery to his spine via the neck area.

I have never heard of a drainage tube being used on the outside of the face for an abcessed tooth. This doesn't make sense to me. (Maybe someone can enlighten me.) I found a case where a woman was in critical condition due to an abcess and altho they did use a needle to aspirate, a drainage tube was only used in the neck area and not on the face or jaw. (This could explain his neck scar.) http://www.cda-adc.ca/jcda/vol-67/issue-6/324.html


Sorry to double post but perhaps this will help a little. Abscesses are normally very difficult to heal. Depending on whether the abscess was superficial or deep would decide whether aspiration would be sufficient or if indeed surgical intervention would be needed. In the event of deep tissue deterioration, one would need to cut open the tissue in order to access the infected area. After the wound is cleaned and removed of all cellular and tissue debris the wound would be packed with sterile gauze. The gauze would need to be changed frequently and the area cleaned to ensure that healing occurred without the reoccurrence of pus formation. In deep tissue abscesses scar tissue is almost a guarantee especially in the face/neck area.

I am not familiar with dental abscesses and how they are treated but Im sure this doesnít stray too far from the steps in which they treat. I didnít want to go into too much detail and gross everyone else out. lol

Chloekins
10-25-2007, 03:29 PM
Did you happen to ask what damage could occur if a person was floating in the ocean with the hot, August sun beating down on them for an extended period of time without any way to shield the eyes?

haha no I didnt go into that much detail. I will call him later after my rotations and ask that specifically.

SeriouslySearching
10-25-2007, 03:36 PM
Thanks, there probably isn't an answer for it...but doesn't hurt to ask. : )

On the other thread, I had many questions I would like answers to about BK. Maybe I should bring them over here and we could try to get those answers from somewhere.

SeriouslySearching
10-25-2007, 03:40 PM
Sorry to double post but perhaps this will help a little. Abscesses are normally very difficult to heal. Depending on whether the abscess was superficial or deep would decide whether aspiration would be sufficient or if indeed surgical intervention would be needed. In the event of deep tissue deterioration, one would need to cut open the tissue in order to access the infected area. After the wound is cleaned and removed of all cellular and tissue debris the wound would be packed with sterile gauze. The gauze would need to be changed frequently and the area cleaned to ensure that healing occurred without the reoccurrence of pus formation. In deep tissue abscesses scar tissue is almost a guarantee especially in the face/neck area.

I am not familiar with dental abscesses and how they are treated but Im sure this doesn’t stray too far from the steps in which they treat. I didn’t want to go into too much detail and gross everyone else out. lolSo if it were due to an abcess...he would have a straight scar due to an actual incision then possibly the rounded scarring seen with drainage tubes. Right?

(Sorry for the detailed questions...just trying to pinpoint exactly what could have occurred to cause his unusual facial atrophy or scar. Past medical or dental history with unusual characteristics could help identify him.)

phenolred
10-25-2007, 03:58 PM
Ok this got me to thinking about something my husband had on his back, and he had it removed. It was a cyst under the skin, the size of a golfball. He took forever to go to the Dr because he was scared what they might say. It started bothering him. They said it might have started from an ingrown hair, and just grew into this LARGE CYST. My hubby scar look alittle like the indention on BK's jaw. They removed the cyst it was like a capsule, and it left quite a hole, they packed it with gauze.

But what I am getting at is maybe it was a cyst or boil I have been looking alittle on google and it seems these to happen on the face as well.

My husbands was surgically cut and removed but it looks like an indention with a cut line near it.


here is a little bit of something I found.



If a cyst appears to be growing, if it hurts or itches or if it's swollen and oozing profusely, it may be showing signs of serious infection," says Jack L. Lesher, Jr., M.D., associate professor of dermatology at the Medical College of Georgia in Augusta. "You'll need to see a dermatologist to have the cyst surgically removed or treated with antibiotics."
There's also a chance of severe infection after a cyst bursts or ruptures, so be sure to see the doctor if this occurs.

SeriouslySearching
10-25-2007, 04:18 PM
That would be a possibility. Still...we can't tell if there is a straight incision which coincides with the scar we can readily see. I thought it might be something we could narrow down. Perhaps not.

Chloekins
10-25-2007, 04:23 PM
I wasnt able to talk to my friend for very long but I was able to get a basic answer from him. He wasnt too keen on the situation I presented due to how many variables that would be involved in such a case however, he did have this to say. If an individual was exposed to the sun for long periods of time with open eyes such as the situation in which you hypothesized the overall damage would be solar retinopathy. The retina itself would be completely damaged and blindness would be complete. This would be irreversible. Since this did not occur with Mr. Kyle he was more inclined to believe that this was not the case. He said to make any true diagnosis he would have to review the patients chart and subsequent surgical write up. I did get him to admit that he wouldnt expect such minimal damage as cataract formation from that sort of scenario. I hope this helps.

As for the cysts or possible abscess. A draining tube is usually only used in abscesses where there is great deal of blood, pus formation, and necrotic debris. I have seen abscesses of the neck that were so bad that continual draining were needed. This is getting into major surgery and the patient is usually in the hospital for a period of time. With cyst or small abscesses the before mentioned procedure is usually sufficient. Of course every case is different and i am merely hypothesizing with the information available.

The scar that would be left is just as you would imagine. Scarification would be more intense the more invasive the procedure. So a simple draining and packing would leave less of a scar then insertion of a perpetual drainage tube.

Please bring all of your questions I dont mind in the least answering anything medical.

SeriouslySearching
10-25-2007, 04:54 PM
Thanks, Cloekins! It does help answer some of my questions.

I am just trying to figure out if there is anything in his medical history or dental history that could set him apart from others.

Chloekins
10-25-2007, 06:49 PM
Im going to get my hubby to enhance the picture that clearly shows the scar to see if I can get a closer look.

update: I have taken a closer look at the scar and I think it was either a cyst or a tumor that was removed possibly relating to the salivary glands. The scarring appears to be the same that one would see with a penrose drain. Im no oral surgeon but I am having a hard time believing that this scar was merely the result of treatment for dental abscess. Thanks to PhenolRed for making me think about all the possible mandible associated tumors and cysts on the way home. ; )

SeriouslySearching
10-25-2007, 08:56 PM
That would make more sense to me, too. I hadn't thought of a cyst or a tumor either...but I knew it wasn't gelling for me for it to be an abscessed tooth.

Chloekins
10-25-2007, 09:08 PM
That would make more sense to me, too. I hadn't thought of a cyst or a tumor either...but I knew it wasn't gelling for me for it to be an abcessed tooth.

you know what is really bugging me? The fact that he seems to remember certain things but not others. For instance he thinks he remembers an abscessed tooth, possible reconstruction on his elbow, the name Benjamin, 3 brothers (or was it sons?), the state of Colorado, etc. Something is just not jiving for me and I cant put a finger on it. Bah.

marysawol
10-25-2007, 09:21 PM
you know what is really bugging me? The fact that he seems to remember certain things but not others. For instance he thinks he remembers an abscessed tooth, possible reconstruction on his elbow, the name Benjamin, 3 brothers (or was it sons?), the state of Colorado, etc. Something is just not jiving for me and I cant put a finger on it. Bah.

I agree with you. It's almost as if he's saying something without saying it,,does that make sense?

Chloekins
10-25-2007, 09:38 PM
I agree with you. It's almost as if he's saying something without saying it,,does that make sense?

Exactly! Its interesting because I had to ask my hubby to enlarge and enhance the photo of his scar for me and as a result I had to tell him Mr. Kyle's story. The first words out of his mouth were "Maybe he is hiding something".

Which if he is why would he be willing to have his story go to the media? Unless he knew that there was no way anyone would ever recognize. Hmmm. Its all so very strange and I do hate to think this way but its the natural skeptic in me.

Earthbound Misfit I
10-25-2007, 09:47 PM
Why would he go to the press to try and find out who he was if he knew there would be no chance of being recognized? What would his purpose for doing that be?


Exactly! Its interesting because I had to ask my hubby to enlarge and enhance the photo of his scar for me and as a result I had to tell him Mr. Kyle's story. The first words out of his mouth were "Maybe he is hiding something".

Which if he is why would he be willing to have his story go to the media? Unless he knew that there was no way anyone would ever recognize. Hmmm. Its all so very strange and I do hate to think this way but its the natural skeptic in me.

Chloekins
10-25-2007, 09:54 PM
Why would he go to the press to try and find out who he was if he knew there would be no chance of being recognized? What would his purpose for doing that be?

Good question. I honestly dont have an answer that really works for me. The only thing that comes to my mind is perhaps his refusal to agree would seem just too suspicious. The only reason I brought this up is that I think all avenues of thought should be explored, even the ones we dont want to acknowledge.

There are hospital records for this gentleman somewhere. A surgeon/s worked on this man three times( elbow, mandible area and a cervical disectomy). He has medical records and a history somewhere. I cant believe this day in age that someone can just appear out of seemingly thin air.

edited: altered number of surgeries to three

Earthbound Misfit I
10-25-2007, 10:38 PM
You are right. There are medical records somewhere. But, when did BK have the surgeries? Where? They could have happened anywhere. How many doctors are there per state that could have performed those surgeries? How many of those doctors have seen the recent articles on BK? How many of those doctors may not be practicing anymore? If BK had the surgeries long ago what are the chances the doc who did the surgery would remember him by a photo of what BK looks like today? BK says it's like he lost the past 20 years of his life so if he recalls the surgeries somewhat does that mean the surgeries were performed over 20 years ago?


Good question. I honestly dont have an answer that really works for me. The only thing that comes to my mind is perhaps his refusal to agree would seem just too suspicious. The only reason I brought this up is that I think all avenues of thought should be explored, even the ones we dont want to acknowledge.

There are hospital records for this gentleman somewhere. A surgeon/s worked on this man three times( elbow, mandible area and a cervical disectomy). He has medical records and a history somewhere. I cant believe this day in age that someone can just appear out of seemingly thin air.

edited: altered number of surgeries to three

Chloekins
10-25-2007, 10:50 PM
You are right. There are medical records somewhere. But, when did BK have the surgeries? Where? They could have happened anywhere. How many doctors are there per state that could have performed those surgeries? How many of those doctors have seen the recent articles on BK? How many of those doctors may not be practicing anymore? If BK had the surgeries long ago what are the chances the doc who did the surgery would remember him by a photo of what BK looks like today? BK says it's like he lost the past 20 years of his life so if he recalls the surgeries somewhat does that mean the surgeries were performed over 20 years ago?

Those are all very good questions. It seems this would be the best of our avenues to explore but when they are all laid out like that they seem down right daunting in their immensity. I know for certain that cervical discectomy alone has been around since the 40s and who knows what was done concerning the reconstruction of his elbow.

He has missing teeth, however they do not know whether this was a previous incidence or in relation to the beating he received. I think it would be safe to assume that at least dental work could easily be done 20+ years ago.

I know someone mentioned this earlier but what an odd way for a 40/50 year old man to phrase the state of his memories. Does this mean that there are things that he remembers between the ages of birth-20/30 yrs and then after that it is a blank? If so what are those memories? Is he maybe holding back details in order to verify those who come forward with identities?

Earthbound Misfit I
10-25-2007, 11:04 PM
I find it odd that they wouldn't know if his tooth loss was as a result of his being beat or if it was because of a prior incidence? If it happened prior to his being beat wouldn't his gums have been healed somewhat as opposed to if it happened because of the beating the sockets wouldn't be healed?

ETA: Weren't the only injuries that were noted by paramedics the 3 indentations to BK's skull that could have come from being hit with a blunt object, sunburn, cataracts that could have come from long term exposure to the sun & many, many fire ant bites? How would those injuries account for the missing teeth?


He has missing teeth, however they do not know whether this was a previous incidence or in relation to the beating he received. I think it would be safe to assume that at least dental work could easily be done 20+ years ago.

SeriouslySearching
10-25-2007, 11:53 PM
The fact he could not provide them with any medical history means they should have run every test imaginable to try to determine a reason for his amnesia and to clear him medically for internal injuries from a severe beating. Previous back/spinal plus elbow surgeries should have been found during the course of testing...shouldn't they? If so, why are they only guessing now?

There are many things we are not getting answers for here and I asked a lot of questions his nurse should have been able to answer easily...such as inquiries about his overall hygiene, dental hygiene, beard growth, etc. when found.

What did the toxicology reports show? Was he an alcoholic or drug user?

Al_B
10-26-2007, 12:00 AM
I some how don't think they would have tested for anything and everything He is a uninsured they'd only do enough to keep him alive and it's all that's required I think

SeriouslySearching
10-26-2007, 12:04 AM
This is what the nurse previously said: He has a scar across the front of the neck that is most likely from cervical disk surgery. He has two parallel scars on his left elbow and believes it pertains to reparative surgery on the elbow that most likely entails surgical implantation of pins and/or plates. He believes the elbow surgery dates back to his 20's and is not very clear about the cervical surgery timeframe.

SeriouslySearching
10-26-2007, 12:13 AM
I some how don't think they would have tested for anything and everything He is a uninsured they'd only do enough to keep him alive and it's all that's required I thinkI would think it would be required of them to do adequate testing in response to his medical condition of Amnesia. Would they have treated his burns, his bruises, and given him an IV for dehydration then simply stopped because he could be indigent and uninsured?

If this was the case, I would recommend he seek legal counsel because they could have missed something which has caused this seemingly permanent state of Amnesia and could have been possible to treat initially.

benjamankyle
10-26-2007, 12:34 AM
Bingo!!!


I some how don't think they would have tested for anything and everything He is a uninsured they'd only do enough to keep him alive and it's all that's required I think

Chloekins
10-26-2007, 07:36 AM
I would think it would be required of them to do adequate testing in response to his medical condition of Amnesia. Would they have treated his burns, his bruises, and given him an IV for dehydration then simply stopped because he could be indigent and uninsured?

If this was the case, I would recommend he seek legal counsel because they could have missed something which has caused this seemingly permanent state of Amnesia and could have been possible to treat initially.

We need to keep in mind that a lot of information concerning the sharing of the details of his injuries and subsequent treatment are limited under HIPPA.

When he was brought to the emergency room he would have had a full blood panel and liver functions test in addition to full body x-rays, MRIs etc. This is how they came up with the cervical surgery. This has nothing to do with insurance or ability to pay. This has to due with good medicine. No attending physician would treat a comatose patient without detailed information. A) it would be unethical and B) thats just asking for a lawsuit. I know that the real reason that we are not getting this information is either Mr. Kyle never bothered to ask what his emergency medical care consisted of or the nurses and physicians who attended him are unable to share details because of the bonds of HIPPA.

I am beginning to wonder if the cervical surgery which more than likely resulted in fusion of the damaged disks and the reconstructive surgery were not the overall effect of a severely traumatic event such as a car accident. This would make sense. This leads me to further postulate that perhaps trouble with memory is not a new situation for Mr. Kyle. I wonder if this has plagued him for the past 20 yrs (since his accident) and thus is why the past two decades seem to be gone.

phenolred
10-26-2007, 08:25 AM
It seems he HAS sought legal help and help from the congressman...

The Hopitial that treated him wants $800.00 for his medical records BUT he cant WORK because he has NO ss #.....

Here is the info from the original article


Georgia Legal Services was trying to help him obtain a Social Security number, but they hit a wall when Memorial Health wanted $800 to obtain copies of his medical records, said U.S. Rep. Jack Kingston, R-Ga.
Kyle said things started to turn around a bit last month after a friend wrote to Kingston for help.
"We're just thinking there is some family out there who may have written him off like he's dead," Kingston said. "We get lots of oddball cases that come through our office, but we've never had one like this."
But even though a police report was issued, it's still not enough for the Social Security Administration.
"You can't get a replacement Social Security number by walking in there and saying you have amnesia. He does not know his name, his Social Security number or where he was born. He has no picture ID," said Trish DePriest, Kingston's district case manager. "That's why we are at square one."

The congressman's office is trying to get the Medical College of Georgia in Augusta to provide psychiatric help for the man, including hypnosis.
"It's a very interesting mystery, but it's also very sad when you consider there has to be some family out there somewhere," Kingston said.
Kyle said he tries not to think about a family or what he might be missing out on.
He worries he might never find out - or, if he does, he might not like the person he was, he said.
Kyle considers himself a walking missing person's poster: The more people see him, the more chances he has that someone might know him.
"I have nothing from my old life," he said. "I just hope someone recognizes me."

Chloekins
10-26-2007, 08:57 AM
It seems he HAS sought legal help and help from the congressman...

The Hopitial that treated him wants $800.00 for his medical records BUT he cant WORK because he has NO ss #.....

Here is the info from the original article


Georgia Legal Services was trying to help him obtain a Social Security number, but they hit a wall when Memorial Health wanted $800 to obtain copies of his medical records, said U.S. Rep. Jack Kingston, R-Ga.
Kyle said things started to turn around a bit last month after a friend wrote to Kingston for help.
"We're just thinking there is some family out there who may have written him off like he's dead," Kingston said. "We get lots of oddball cases that come through our office, but we've never had one like this."
But even though a police report was issued, it's still not enough for the Social Security Administration.
"You can't get a replacement Social Security number by walking in there and saying you have amnesia. He does not know his name, his Social Security number or where he was born. He has no picture ID," said Trish DePriest, Kingston's district case manager. "That's why we are at square one."

The congressman's office is trying to get the Medical College of Georgia in Augusta to provide psychiatric help for the man, including hypnosis.
"It's a very interesting mystery, but it's also very sad when you consider there has to be some family out there somewhere," Kingston said.
Kyle said he tries not to think about a family or what he might be missing out on.
He worries he might never find out - or, if he does, he might not like the person he was, he said.
Kyle considers himself a walking missing person's poster: The more people see him, the more chances he has that someone might know him.
"I have nothing from my old life," he said. "I just hope someone recognizes me."

There simply has to be more to this story. Under HIPAA regulations a patient has the right to access and obtian a copy of their medical records. This is a federal law. The fact that the hospital is holding the records in request for a fee leads me to believe that there are many details we are not privy too.

phenolred
10-26-2007, 09:26 AM
I looked this up for Georgia, You have to pay a fee and cost for copying the pages. So, maybe he has soooo many pages the fee is $800.00


http://medicalboard.georgia.gov/00/article/0,2086,26729866_27509335_27165592,00.html

You are entitled to a copy of your medical records under most circumstances after providing the physician with a signed release and paying the required fees as set by state law. If you still cannot obtain your records, you may file a complaint with the Medical Board. HIPAA regulations may also apply. Below is a sample note of what you should say in writing to request the record(s):

How do I obtain a copy of my hospital medical record? Instead of addressing your letter (please refer to previous question) to an individual physician, you should call the hospital and find out who is in charge of the Medical Records Department for the hospital. By calling ahead of time, you will be able to inquire about the cost of providing this service. You may have to put your request in writing and then receive correspondence seeking payment for the copying charges in advance.

phenolred
10-26-2007, 09:27 AM
found this one too

http://www.shepherd.org/about/records.asp
Fees
Under Georgia law, you may be charged a fee for administrative and copying services. These fees can change from year to year. For a current fee schedule regarding release of information, please contact the Health Information Department at 404-350-7325. Fees are waived for copies provided directly to a health care provider for continuing medical care.

phenolred
10-26-2007, 09:34 AM
Awhile back I had wondered if this could have been a sexual assualt which might explain the lack of clothing. I was looking up amnesia and just happened to find this about the Date Rape drug called GHB seems it can cause coma,s and amnesia. I wonder if BK could have been on a business trip and had meet people in the area into bondage or S&M and it was a consentula thing and maybe they slipped him GHB and they panicked because they thought he was dead and just dumped him.

GHB (Gamma Hydroxy Butyrate)
GHB was banned in the United States in 1990 and approved only for medical use in July 2002 for the treatment of narcolepsy. Prior to the ban, it was marketed and sold at health food stores as both a sleep-aid and a body building supplement.

The effects of GHB:
GHB is a central nervous system depressant. Effects occur within 10-15 minutes after ingestion and last 2-3 hours unless combined with alcohol, where effects can last 20-30 hours. Large doses of GHB can produce sleep within five minutes. Once in your system the drug can cause dizziness, nausea, vomiting, confusion, dehydration, seizures, respiratory depression, hallucinations, giddiness, disinhibition and unconsciousness. When mixed with alcohol, GHB can cause coma and/or death.

GHB can cause partial or complete amnesia, meaning you may not be able to remember anything you did or anything that was done to you while under the influence of the drug.

phenolred
10-26-2007, 09:52 AM
Interesting article on amnesia, seems GHB would not cause long lasting amensia...I also wonder if they have given him this drug that helps amnesia???

http://www.athealth.com/Consumer/disorders/Amnesia.html

How is amnesia diagnosed?
A mental health professional will want to take a careful personal history.
Causes of amnesia can include:
External trauma, such as a blow to the head
Internal trauma, such as stroke
Exposure to a toxic substances such as carbon monoxide
Inadequate diet
Brain tumors
Seizures

How is amnesia treated?
Psychotherapy can be helpful for people whose amnesia is caused by emotional trauma. For instance, hypnosis may help some patients/clients recall forgotten memories.
Sometimes it is appropriate to administer a drug called Amytal (sodium amobarbital) to people suffering from amnesia. The medicine helps some people recall their lost memories

Chloekins
10-26-2007, 11:43 AM
Interesting article on amnesia, seems GHB would not cause long lasting amensia...I also wonder if they have given him this drug that helps amnesia???

http://www.athealth.com/Consumer/disorders/Amnesia.html

How is amnesia diagnosed?
A mental health professional will want to take a careful personal history.
Causes of amnesia can include:
External trauma, such as a blow to the head
Internal trauma, such as stroke
Exposure to a toxic substances such as carbon monoxide
Inadequate diet
Brain tumors
Seizures

How is amnesia treated?
Psychotherapy can be helpful for people whose amnesia is caused by emotional trauma. For instance, hypnosis may help some patients/clients recall forgotten memories.
Sometimes it is appropriate to administer a drug called Amytal (sodium amobarbital) to people suffering from amnesia. The medicine helps some people recall their lost memories
I think you may be spot on in the amount of administration/copying fees being the reason for the $800. The files could have been stored off site in addition to other fees a hospital can dream up and believe me they can and do!

As far as Amytal that drug is primarily given to people with insomnia. Im sure that it is often used off-label but as far as I know clinically it is only approved to be used in cases where someone has anxiety and/or chronic insomnia.

I just looked it up on the PDR and it does mention a use in unresponsive epilepsy cases. I do not think this would be helpful in memory resolution as barbiturates tend to cause memory loss.

If I get a bit of free time today I will access my hospitals journal records and see if I can dig up any information about amensia. My expertise is not mental health and so therefore I know nothing about this topic. Ill jot down any pertinant information that I find in case anyone else in my shoes.

christine2448
10-26-2007, 01:05 PM
*note to self* left off ;)

Earthbound Misfit I
10-26-2007, 01:15 PM
What about rivastigmine for treating his amnesia?


I think you may be spot on in the amount of administration/copying fees being the reason for the $800. The files could have been stored off site in addition to other fees a hospital can dream up and believe me they can and do!

As far as Amytal that drug is primarily given to people with insomnia. Im sure that it is often used off-label but as far as I know clinically it is only approved to be used in cases where someone has anxiety and/or chronic insomnia.

I just looked it up on the PDR and it does mention a use in unresponsive epilepsy cases. I do not think this would be helpful in memory resolution as barbiturates tend to cause memory loss.

If I get a bit of free time today I will access my hospitals journal records and see if I can dig up any information about amensia. My expertise is not mental health and so therefore I know nothing about this topic. Ill jot down any pertinant information that I find in case anyone else in my shoes.

Chloekins
10-26-2007, 01:37 PM
What about rivastigmine for treating his amnesia?

The only use that I know of rivastigmine being used in is dementia with or without full presentation of Alzheimer's disease and Parkinson's disease. His amnesia is less a wasting of the brain matter and more of damage to the hippocampus due to lesion or injury. I would be hesitant to cross the line from use of this drug in manifestations of disease into use for psychological dysfunction. Does that make sense?

SeriouslySearching
10-26-2007, 04:00 PM
We need to keep in mind that a lot of information concerning the sharing of the details of his injuries and subsequent treatment are limited under HIPPA.

When he was brought to the emergency room he would have had a full blood panel and liver functions test in addition to full body x-rays, MRIs etc. This is how they came up with the cervical surgery. This has nothing to do with insurance or ability to pay. This has to due with good medicine. No attending physician would treat a comatose patient without detailed information. A) it would be unethical and B) thats just asking for a lawsuit. I know that the real reason that we are not getting this information is either Mr. Kyle never bothered to ask what his emergency medical care consisted of or the nurses and physicians who attended him are unable to share details because of the bonds of HIPPA.If you read into the nurse's post to Al_B..."Bingo!"...sounds to me like they witheld such tests and treatment. She never said they found any proof of cervical surgery. They are only guessing this is what the scar on his neck could be from. They don't even know if his elbow has pins or plates, which I have questioned repeatedly as this would only take a simple x-ray. A good Ortho surgeon could tell them what the injury was.

Phenol~ Contacting a Congressman or Dept. of Human Services is not the type of legal help I meant at all. I meant an Attorney to represent him! If the hospital failed to run such tests (as Cloekins mentioned) immediately after he was diagnosed with Amnesia (which he had when brought in...but probably wasn't diagnosed with for awhile afterward) then they could be responsible. A court order could obtain the medical files without the fee.

phenolred
10-26-2007, 04:16 PM
i want suggesting we contact a congressman, it seems they have already done that. But the article says this

Georgia Legal Services was trying to help him obtain a Social Security number

I was assuming Georgia Legal Services was some type of "free" legal assitance, seems they got the congressman involved

phenolred
10-26-2007, 04:25 PM
Yep its seems like what they ( georgia legal services) are
http://www.glsp.org/

they have been helping him.

But legally they can charge a fee for copying the medical records etc. Maybe he needs to have a fundraiser to help raise the money. But the thing it DID say was that records can be transferred to a new doctor for no charge for ongoing treatment. Maybe he has already got this taken care of and has the records already. Nurse are you watching could you let us know if this has been resolved?

Chloekins
10-26-2007, 04:48 PM
[quote=SeriouslySearching;1761445]If you read into the nurse's post to Al_B..."Bingo!"...sounds to me like they witheld such tests and treatment. She never said they found any proof of cervical surgery. They are only guessing this is what the scar on his neck could be from. They don't even know if his elbow has pins or plates, which I have questioned repeatedly as this would only take a simple x-ray. A good Ortho surgeon could tell them what the injury was.
quote]
Is the nurse that is Mr. Kyle's spokes person a RN or a MA? Wasnít this nurse connected with Mr. Kyle after he was placed in a long term care facility which was almost 3 years after he was found? Or was she an employee of the Medical center he was transferred to 2 weeks after admittance to the original hospital? Was she present during the original emergency admittance or an attending nurse during follow up care at said hospital? These are all pertinent questions before I assume that she has a solid ground from which to determine what was and was not done during admittance.

I just can not wrap my head around this scenario. An unresponsive unconscious man is brought into the ER. He has blunt force trauma to the face and head. He is sun burned and covered in ant bites. Paramedics relay the information that there are possible neurological problems.

Doctors refuse to do any x-ray analysis but merely treat the gentlemanís superficial wounds. Scaring is noted on both neck, jaw and elbow but these are not deemed related to current injuries. CT determined to not be needed regardless of the fact that there are 3 depressions along the side of the head consistent with object being used to create trauma.

No blood work is done to see if the gentleman in question is on any medications or has any medical conditions. He is merely hooked up to an IV and given fluids but no pain medications because there is no blood work to correlate to.

Make sense? Not to me either. There is no way that this man did not receive a full blood/liver panelís, CT (for the trauma to the head), x-rays (for possible broken bones) and a neurological consultation (to determine full extent of injuries). These are guidelines that all emergency medicine physicians follow. This is done before anyone even knows whether the patient has insurance or not. If a patient has prolonged LOC and a possible neurological problem there is no way in heck the physician would not order all of the above mentioned procedures and thatís just the beginning. This man underwent a lot of consultations and tests, I guarantee it.

At some point in time his PCP determined that he was in exceptional good health and did not need any medications to maintain this state of health. He was routinely and continually monitored for two weeks at the original hospital at which time he was determined to be healthy enough for transfer to another facility albeit semiconscious. He eventually ended up at the JC Lewish Health Center whose main purpose is care of the indigent population.


Here is something I found from the website:
Benjamin Kyle:
Benjamin Kyle has made great strides in the process to piecing his life back together. When Benjamin was referred to Union Missionís Grace House from Memorial Medical Center, it appeared he was functionally blind, suffering from memory loss, and just barely beginning his recovery from a recent surgery. Because of the seriousness of his condition, Mr. Kyle was transferred from Grace House to the J. C. Lewis Health Center for respite care.

While at J. C. Lewis Health Center, Mr. Kyle underwent more surgery to help correct his vision problems. Union Mission collaborated with the Knights Templar Eye Foundation to assist with funding the procedures necessary to restore Mr. Kyleís vision. Staying at the J. C. Lewis Health Center for the duration of his post-operative care ensured the success of his recovery. As soon as he was able, Mr. Kyle began to read anything that he could; for so long he had been unable to see the basic things that most people take for granted.

Mr. Kyle currently is the resident manager of the J. C. Lewis Health Center. He gained this position by assisting staff members with small duties and was eventually hired as one of the centerís live in managers. Mr. Kyle continues to give accolades to Union Mission staff for helping restore his health so he could begin his new life.

Source: http://www.unionmission.org/health_center.asp

phenolred
10-26-2007, 04:57 PM
He no longer works there here is the information from the original article ( the one that started this thread from the 1st post), I think it might benefit everyone to go back and read this and it may help refresh your memory
It is from Spet 2007
http://savannahnow.com/node/364434

In November 2004, he was taken to the J.C. Lewis Health Center, where his story became legendary, he said. Nurses and other patients would quiz him in an attempt to ignite a memory.
They never succeeded, he said.
While at J.C. Lewis, Kyle's physical injuries healed. The fire-ant bites went away, and his back grew stronger. His blindness, which doctors diagnosed as bad cataracts, was repaired by donated surgery.
Kyle achieved such good health that he started to work at the medical center. He did building maintenance, changed beds and helped with patients.
He worked for a year and a half as a residence manager, but he was never paid, Kyle said.
The Rev. Micheal Elliott, president of Union Mission Inc., said Kyle's recompense was free shelter, free food and free medical assistance.
"Because we couldn't establish his identity, I could only pay him illegally without a Social Security number," Elliott said. "We found ourselves in a moral dilemma. We took care of this guy for more than a year, but we can't break the law. So Benjaman got frustrated and left, against our wishes."

On May 31, Kyle (http://savannahnow.com/content/related?topic=Benjaman+Kyle) grew weary of not earning a paycheck and left J.C. Lewis (http://savannahnow.com/content/related?topic=J.C.+Lewis) - the only home he had known, he said.
Since then, Kyle (http://savannahnow.com/content/related?topic=Benjaman+Kyle) has moved back and forth among the homes of friends. Most of them are nurses and people he met at J.C. Lewis (http://savannahnow.com/content/related?topic=J.C.+Lewis).
He works whatever odd jobs he can find for under-the-table cash to buy food and clothing.

SeriouslySearching
10-26-2007, 05:11 PM
Make sense? Not in the least! There is no way that this man did not receive a full blood/liver panelís, CT (for the trauma to the head), x-rays (for possible broken bones) and a neurological consultation (to determine full extent of injuries). These are guidelines that all emergency medicine physicians follow. This is done before anyone even knows whether the patient has insurance or not. If a patient has prolonged LOC and a possible neurological problem there is no way in heck the physician would not order all of the above mentioned procedures and thatís just the beginning. This man underwent a lot of consultations and tests, I guarantee it. I totally agree! Does he have short term memory loss ongoing which would prevent him from remembering anything the original medical staff told him? They had to tell him the results of those tests. He would surely remember a few items. [/COLOR]

Here is something I found from the website:
Benjamin Kyle:
Benjamin Kyle has made great strides in the process to piecing his life back together. When Benjamin was referred to Union Missionís Grace House from Memorial Medical Center, it appeared he was functionally blind, suffering from memory loss, and just barely beginning his recovery from a recent surgery. What surgery was this?

Al_B
10-26-2007, 05:16 PM
I don't know I think some things like broken bones in the arms or legs are obvious so x-rays may not be necessary. I'm sure they may have some blood work, but they aren't going to go above and beyond to try and figure out someones whole medical history in the ER their job is to save people. The times I have gone to ER they don't always do x-rays,they don't always take blood. They have ways of telling if there are things they should be testing for without running a person through every machine at the hospital.they choose where to send them on a case by case. He had the obvious head injury so I am sure some sort of x-ray was taken there,listen to his lungs for a pnumothorax(spelling), blood pressure,standard blood tests and drug screens.

KT Can
10-26-2007, 05:27 PM
Long shot... Charley Project has his eye color as being brown however I found another link where his eye color is described as being blue... a little young but who knows how the years have treated him...

http://charleyproject.org/cases/p/pitkethly_albert.html

http://216.109.125.130/search/cache?ei=UTF-8&p=Albert+Jay+Pitkethly+&fr=yfp-t-488&u=web.ukonline.co.uk/katsplace/id/guestbook2.html&w=albert+jay+pitkethly&d=GQgwe-dmPoXa&icp=1&.intl=us

Earthbound Misfit I
10-26-2007, 09:15 PM
I wonder if this man would have regained his memory on his own had he not been recognized by someone who knew him and being brought back to his family? Also, at link below there is another man who has been missing since March and it's thought that he may have amnesia.

<snip>
Joe Bieger, 60, lived most of his life in Oklahoma City, but moved with his wife, Patricia, to the Dallas area in 2005. (he was eventually diagnosed with global amnesia, a condition that essentially wipes the brain clean of all memories.)

Last Oct. 6, wearing a T-shirt and shorts, he left the house before 6 a.m. to walk his dogs. He remembers feeling ill, even worse than two bouts of dizziness and disorientation he had suffered in the weeks before that.

A couple of hours later, the dogs were found a mile away, their leash tangled on a street sign. But Bieger didn't come home.

Bieger has only tiny snippets of memory from the 25 days he was missing.

He remembers waking up on a school playground one chilly morning. He found a sweat shirt and cut off the sleeves to put over his legs to stay warmer.

He recalls sleeping under a construction trailer one night and at a coin laundry another. With no money on him, he has a faint memory of eating discarded french fries off the table at a restaurant. Jelly packets and part of a bagel were discovered in his pockets when he was finally found.

One unusual recollection he retained was stopping at a bowling alley and talking to a man who was in the midst of rolling a perfect game. Once he was questioned by police investigating a pizza restaurant robbery.

Another memory that came back to him weeks later is stopping at a red brick church. He even remembered the name and that it was a mostly African-American congregation. He and his family later tracked down the church and stopped there to talk to people who remember their encounter with Bieger.

"They said I walked up on their Halloween carnival. I talked about my grandkids and that I had lost my car keys," Bieger said. They said he also claimed he was a volunteer at a nearby Habitat for Humanity work site, which wasn't true.
</snip>

More at link: http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=594166

Earthbound Misfit I
10-26-2007, 09:36 PM
Another man who had severe amnesia below. I seriously wonder if it will take someone recognizing BK to bring back his identity to him.

<snip>
He had been living as a homeless man in Chicago, staying at a shelter called the Pacific Gardens Mission. He could remember nothing of his former existence except a semblance of his name: Jay Tower. One of his homeless buddies in the shelter had been watching "America's Most Wanted" and recognized him.
</snip>

also from article:
<snip>
Power was haunted by the memories of the friends he lost while fighting in Vietnam. The psychological pain was dredged up after a narrow escape from the terrorist attacks of Sept. 11.
</snip>

ETA: This man still had no memories of his family or any memories of his life and at the time of the article was reacquainting himself with a family and world he has no recollection of.

More at link below:
Homeless Man Discovered to Be Lawyer With Amnesia
http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=1629645&page=1

Al_B
10-26-2007, 09:38 PM
What surgery was this?
probably the eye surgery

Earthbound Misfit I
10-26-2007, 09:54 PM
There are others listed on the web who suffer from prolonged severe amnesia. Most of the cases are believed to have been caused by severe stress or PTSD.

Earthbound Misfit I
10-26-2007, 10:05 PM
What about ECT? Could the treatments cause the type of memory loss that BK has?

Chloekins
10-26-2007, 10:27 PM
Al B: Im not trying to make light of your own personal experiences whilst in the ER but did you arrive there in a unconscious state with blunt force trauma to the head? That may be why your experience was completely different than one would experience with severe head trauma and LOC.

In reference to the surgery that SS was questioning could not have been the eye surgery as it states that he was functionally blind whilst recovering from recent surgery.

SS: Good question! I didnt even notice that! Eagle eyes and a quick mind. Lethal combination!

After reading a ton of articles about amnesia it is the general consensus that even with ungraded retrograde amnesia (what Mr. Kyle has) there are still some memories retained as long term memories are the hardest to disturb. These memories, however, are autobiographical, are usually from childhood and often times lead no clues to identity. Most articles also mentioned significant loss of memories not concerning self, such as presidents, important news events etc.

Id like to point out that in the only two documented cases that I came across of true URA both gentleman had some memory retention even though it was insignificant and they were unable to put meaning to the memories themselves. The important part is that there have been no documented cases of a person having amnesia so severe (ungraded) that they remembered absolutely no details of their former life.

Two quotes Id like to refresh us on. One that I believe PhenolRed reminded us of:
"It's like I have a 20-year gap," he said. "I just don't remember."
Mr. Kyle's approx. age is 40/50s which means that 20 or 30 years of his life are not part of this gap.

and another interesting one:
"He worries he might never find out - or, if he does, he might not like the person he was"

I dont know why I am having such a hard time convincing people that this gentleman was not given just basic keep him alive care. There is simply no way that this occurred even if he got the most incompetent, self serving physician, they would give him the best that she/he could give in order to simply avoid a malpractice lawsuit. Nor am I exactly sure why I have given the impression that Mr. Kyle was run through every machine and given every test available. I dont care if you come into the ER with your bone protruding from your skin you are still going to get an xray of the entire length of that bone. If you come in with any sort of trauma, abdominal, cranial, pelvic, etc, you are getting a CT. Im hoping that this stubbornness to understand what I am saying concerning basic emergency medicine is due to lack of knowledge and not for the purpose of being obtuse. I think I am going to just not discuss this particular aspect anymore as I am getting too frustrated over the whole business.

Chloekins
10-26-2007, 10:36 PM
What about ECT? Could the treatments cause the type of memory loss that BK has?

Its interesting that you mention this because one of the most famous cases of retrograde amnesia was in a gentle man that had severe epilepsy from the age of ten that received ECT.

So to answer your question ECT would absolutely cause amnesia both retrograde and anterograde. It is actually one of the main reasons that this sort of treatment fell out of favour in the mental health community. There was no way of telling what the outcome would be prior to treatment. It was too unpredictable. I do think that in some circles it is coming back as viable option of treatment for certain disorders.

Earthbound Misfit I
10-26-2007, 10:43 PM
The reason I asked about it is because my sister (she had her treatments around 1992 or so) and my aunt (she had her treatments around 2002) both had ECT for severe depression. My sister at first couldn't recall that she had a son and that she was married. Those memories came back but she still has years of her life that are missing (not 20 years by any means). My aunt also has parts of her life she doesn't recall. I was just curious if ECT could knock out 20 years or so of someone's memories.


Its interesting that you mention this because one of the most famous cases of retrograde amnesia was in a gentle man that had severe epilepsy from the age of ten that received ECT.

So to answer your question ECT would absolutely cause amnesia both retrograde and anterograde. It is actually one of the main reasons that this sort of treatment fell out of favour in the mental health community. There was no way of telling what the outcome would be prior to treatment. It was too unpredictable. I do think that in some circles it is coming back as viable option of treatment for certain disorders.

Chloekins
10-26-2007, 10:50 PM
The reason I asked about it is because my sister (she had her treatments around 1992 or so) and my aunt (she had her treatments around 2002) both had ECT for severe depression. My sister at first couldn't recall that she had a son and that she was married. Those memories came back but she still has years of her life that are missing (not 20 years by any means). My aunt also has parts of her life she doesn't recall. I was just curious if ECT could knock out 20 years or so of someone's memories.

Yes absolutely. The man in question of the article that I read lost 30 years. He could remember instances from childhood before the age of 10 but nothing beyond that. His memory loss coincided with the beginning of ECT.

My grandmother received this treatment as well. She was unable to care for herself for a good 6 months post treatment. She eventually regained her memory but later in life developed a very aggressive manifestation of Alzheimer's. I have no proof of what I am about to say, but I am convinced this is linked somehow to her treatments years ago.

Earthbound Misfit I
10-26-2007, 11:07 PM
Alcoholic or Drug Addict? I don't think BK was either a alcoholic or a drug addict. I think the hospitals would have noted any withdrawl symptoms. Also, would someone who was an alcoholic or a drug addict still be an alcoholic or a drug addict with amnesia? I think the body would still want those substances even with the amnesia? I think I'm confusing myself. I hope someone understands what I am asking more than I do, lol!

Chloekins
10-26-2007, 11:13 PM
Alcoholic or Drug Addict? I don't think BK was either a alcoholic or a drug addict. I think the hospitals would have noted any withdrawl symptoms. Also, would someone who was an alcoholic or a drug addict still be an alcoholic or a drug addict with amnesia? I think the body would still want those substances even with the amnesia? I think I'm confusing myself. I hope someone understands what I am asking more than I do, lol!

If he was a drug addict or alcoholic his liver functions would have be en abnormal. It would have definitely been noticed by the hospital. Where did that come from? Someone's post?

Earthbound Misfit I
10-26-2007, 11:18 PM
Yes, somewhere on this thread (I think) it was questioned whether BK was an alcoholic or drug addict. I will see if I can find the post again.


If he was a drug addict or alcoholic his liver functions would have be en abnormal. It would have definitely been noticed by the hospital. Where did that come from? Someone's post?

Earthbound Misfit I
10-26-2007, 11:28 PM
The only reference I found in this thread to the question of whether BK was an alcoholic or drug addict was post #139 by SeriouslySearching. I thought there was reference elsewhere also. Maybe it was in the other thread that was locked up and then the new one started.

SeriouslySearching (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/member.php?u=13831)
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 4,499
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1760461&postcount=139

The fact he could not provide them with any medical history means they should have run every test imaginable to try to determine a reason for his amnesia and to clear him medically for internal injuries from a severe beating. Previous back/spinal plus elbow surgeries should have been found during the course of testing...shouldn't they? If so, why are they only guessing now?

There are many things we are not getting answers for here and I asked a lot of questions his nurse should have been able to answer easily...such as inquiries about his overall hygiene, dental hygiene, beard growth, etc. when found.

What did the toxicology reports show? Was he an alcoholic or drug user?

Earthbound Misfit I
10-26-2007, 11:30 PM
I would still like to know that if a person was an alcoholic or drug addict prior to developing amnesia, would that person still "need" alcohol or drugs or being they have amnesia would they not have the need anymore I wonder??


If he was a drug addict or alcoholic his liver functions would have be en abnormal. It would have definitely been noticed by the hospital. Where did that come from? Someone's post?

lymom3
10-27-2007, 12:10 AM
I have read a couple of articles a while back and for the life of me can't find links or the articles. One that I do remember is a woman who was very agoraphobic and got into a car accident. She suffered some brain injury. She had no recollection of being agoraphobic; she did everything that "normal" people do. As I recall, prior to the accident she had been a smoker but was not afterwards.

I will keep looking and see if I can find that article somewhere but it seems possible. He was found with head trauma.

SeriouslySearching
10-27-2007, 03:04 AM
His body would have recovered from alcohol or drug abuse during his hospital stay and without the memories of the abuse...it wouldn't be part of his withdrawal. With his body recovered, the part of the brain which controls addictive behaviors might have been affected by the same cause of the amnesia. (This would present a good case study in addictions and recoveries. Medically induced amnesia for severe addicts.)

The reason I questioned the alcohol or drug abuse is obvious. Was this part of the lifestyle he was living prior to his being found? If he were homeless and if we concentrated our efforts next on shelters around the surrounding states where he was found...we might come up with his name.

Chloekins
10-27-2007, 11:33 AM
PKnowley: I think the a great deal of the confusion is related to his "nurse". She is the one that is delivering information that seems to be of question. I do not know if this is because of HIPPA laws and her inability to actually discuss her patients health status with stranger or if it is because she simply does not know because she is a tertiary care provider and would not have access to this information. I believe the later is the true answer.

I know in a later post you asked would he still be a drug addict or alcoholic after his beatings. I would say yes since half of drug and alcohol addiction is mental and the other being physical. It is a good question to think over because of the loss of autobiographical knowledge would this also lead to loss of addiction memories? I, like SS, think that since addiction is such a primal urge I dont know if one would lose that even with amnesia. All of this is such unchartered territory since amnesia is so very very rare to begin with. Especially to the degree at which Mr. Kyle is experiencing.

SS: I myself have long thought this. Perhaps Mr. Kyle has no living family members and prior to being found lived a fringe existence. This would explain the absolute lack identification. Good idea!

SeriouslySearching
10-27-2007, 01:49 PM
I will compile lists of shelters we can contact to request they put up posters. I believe BK already did this in the immediate area of where he was found.

Earthbound Misfit I
10-27-2007, 01:53 PM
I understand the reason you questioned the alcohol & the drug abuse and I do know how obvious that reason is. I was only stating my opinion on why I think that BK was neither an alcoholic or drug addict.



The reason I questioned the alcohol or drug abuse is obvious. Was this part of the lifestyle he was living prior to his being found? If he were homeless and if we concentrated our efforts next on shelters around the surrounding states where he was found...we might come up with his name.

Chloekins
10-27-2007, 02:08 PM
I will compile lists of shelters we can contact to request they put up posters. I believe BK already did this in the immediate area of where he was found.

Ok bear with me on this one, but I'm to go a bit further with Mr. Kyle being homeless prior to being found. I don't know that much about the homeless population or way of life, but how often does this portion of the population move around? Do they often move state to state? I know that this particular population can be very violent in regards to each others welfare. I think this may have been mentioned earlier so forgive me whomever originally mentioned it, but could Mr. Kyle have been a victim of this sort of situation? Could he have been beaten and robbed for something in his possession? That may be why he was found nude. Am I way out in left field on this one? :(

believe09
10-27-2007, 02:32 PM
Hi-I have been lurking on this one for a while and have taken the time to read this twice. I find this thread very alarming for the reasons that Cloekins has been trying to communicate:
I know that you have seen it articulated several times now, but I am going to go through it backwards with you to see if it strikes you the way it struck me.

The hospital wants to charge BK 800.00 for his medical records-that's a whole lot of money which would indicate a whole lot of medical records. Yet they cannot tell you anything going on inside BK, for example does he have pins, did he lose his teeth to his beating, did he have spinal surgery? Any ER physician worth their salt is going to work this guy up for drugs and alcohol when he came in naked, sunburned, beaten, indigent and ant bitten. Is he diabetic, what is his blood type etc...He is revived, he is virtually blind and an amnesiac. Off he goes to a rehab facility, then his sight is restored, but only because the money was raised by good samaritans. Then he starts to bounce from person to person, home to home while he waits to be found.

There is something wrong here.

believe09
10-27-2007, 02:34 PM
Sorry for the double post-will the FBI let one of you know if they think any of the matches you called in is a good one and what they think of the nurse sending him up over NE?

Chloekins
10-27-2007, 03:05 PM
Hi-I have been lurking on this one for a while and have taken the time to read this twice. I find this thread very alarming for the reasons that Cloekins has been trying to communicate:
I know that you have seen it articulated several times now, but I am going to go through it backwards with you to see if it strikes you the way it struck me.

The hospital wants to charge BK 800.00 for his medical records-that's a whole lot of money which would indicate a whole lot of medical records. Yet they cannot tell you anything going on inside BK, for example does he have pins, did he lose his teeth to his beating, did he have spinal surgery? Any ER physician worth their salt is going to work this guy up for drugs and alcohol when he came in naked, sunburned, beaten, indigent and ant bitten. Is he diabetic, what is his blood type etc...He is revived, he is virtually blind and an amnesiac. Off he goes to a rehab facility, then his sight is restored, but only because the money was raised by good samaritans. Then he starts to bounce from person to person, home to home while he waits to be found.

There is something wrong here.

Thank you Believe, Im glad someone else is feeling a bit off about this whole thing.:)

Al_B
10-27-2007, 09:28 PM
have they tried any music from the era he would have been a young adult,maybe shows, something other things(hypnosis or whatever) to maybe trigger his memory?

Chloekins
10-27-2007, 10:49 PM
have they tried any music from the era he would have been a young adult,maybe shows, something other things(hypnosis or whatever) to maybe trigger his memory?

According to some of the journal articles I read they do a test similar to that to gauge the degree of amnesia. They show the patient pictures of people or news events from time periods spanning 10 years to see if the patient recognizes any of them. They also gauge personal memories much the same way. They try to get them to remember information regarding certain ages. For instance in one study they required them to remember memories from the age of 10, one from school, one from a family vacation and one from home. Then they went to age 15, than 20, etc. I wouldn't know for certain whether Mr. Kyle underwent this sort of quizzing or not but someone decided that he had amnesia. One thing I found very interesting from all these studies that I read was that there was not one instance in all the cases where the patient remembered absolutely nothing from his entire lifespan. I am willing to bet that Mr. Kyle has memories but they are probably from his childhood and are not being shared with the general public.

Al_B
10-27-2007, 11:00 PM
ok maybe thats how he is so certain he was born in Indiana

Chloekins
10-27-2007, 11:06 PM
ok maybe thats how he is so certain he was born in Indiana

That and that he is pretty certain he has 3 brothers. There is more to this story than we are privy to.

dimples37398
10-28-2007, 02:49 AM
Also is it normal for the hospital to charge him so much or charge him at all for his records? I have had doctors office's and stuff wanna charge like 20 bucks for the copying and all that of medical records but on the website of the Hospital he was at for 2 weeks I found this........


Part of the Patients rights and responsibilities.........

16. Access information contained in their clinical records within a reasonable time frame.

Gina_M
10-28-2007, 03:36 AM
have they tried any music from the era he would have been a young adult,maybe shows, something other things(hypnosis or whatever) to maybe trigger his memory?

Music - now there's a great idea! As Chloekins mentioned, they probably showed him info about news events, public figures, etc. But memory for music is very different from memory for facts. Often someone will have certain "special songs" that are tied together with certain events, people, or timeframes in their memory. At least, that's been my experience, and I seem to remember learning about that in my memory classes as well. For example, if Benjaman had been in a relationship and they had a special song together, listening to that song could stir up memories of the person. Or if his mom had a certain song she would sing to him, listening to it could bring back memories of his childhood. I wonder if they have tried this with various songs from the past 50 or so years.

Chloekins
10-28-2007, 11:30 AM
Also is it normal for the hospital to charge him so much or charge him at all for his records? I have had doctors office's and stuff wanna charge like 20 bucks for the copying and all that of medical records but on the website of the Hospital he was at for 2 weeks I found this........


Part of the Patients rights and responsibilities.........

16. Access information contained in their clinical records within a reasonable time frame.

PhenolRed found that in the state of GA they are able to charge both administrative and copying fees for patients records. Yes patients are able to access their medical records however the degree of access is left up to the state, meaning reading through at the office vs going home with a copy. Believe09 pointed out that the shear amount of medical attention he received may be the reason why his fee is so large. I know personally of patients who have part A-D of their records. Once you factor in off site storage and copying of voluminous records fees can become very high.

christine2448
10-28-2007, 02:30 PM
We need to get to the bottom of this whole thing. We need to figure out who he is or isn't now, as the case may be. I think we should establish a direct connection with the law enforcement agency involved and the officer responsible for his case. This doesn't mean everyone should jump on this. There should be one person designated to contact them. I volunteer Christine for this as she has rapport already established in GA with LE there. (she already mentioned her organization would like to help.) If anyone disagrees...please say so. Not trying to be bossy here, but I feel in order to get the best results in working with LE to gain information pertinent to finding his identity...we should make certain to do things the right way. : )



I have printed both threads and am going through my notes now and compiling a summary, coming up with questions, concerns, a couple of :slap:'s and some ideas.

I am now working via tele/email with the nurse who is seeking the assistance of LTWH. I'd like to give her a name on here instead of just saying the nurse, I am going to call her Betty ;) no meaning, just popped in my head.....I will be back as soon as I'm finished.

Thanks to all of you for your hard work here! I think if we pull together and organize we can get to the bottom of this.

SeriouslySearching
10-28-2007, 04:12 PM
Thanks so much, Christine!! I am glad you are here and have taken on yet another case! Woohoo!

Chloekins
10-28-2007, 04:51 PM
I have printed both threads and am going through my notes now and compiling a summary, coming up with questions, concerns, a couple of :slap:'s and some ideas.

I am now working via tele/email with the nurse who is seeking the assistance of LTWH. I'd like to give her a name on here instead of just saying the nurse, I am going to call her Betty ;) no meaning, just popped in my head.....I will be back as soon as I'm finished.

Thanks to all of you for your hard work here! I think if we pull together and organize we can get to the bottom of this.

Fantastic! Thank you so much for your interest in this.

Earthbound Misfit I
10-28-2007, 04:59 PM
I have been sitting here waiting with baited breath for Christine to give us the details of what she learned from the nurse "Betty" so that perhaps we may have new avenues to research in finding out who BK is.

Thank you Christine for your help. :)

SeriouslySearching
10-28-2007, 05:33 PM
Every time I see "baited breath", I envision a cat eating cheese to entice the rat because of an old English teacher who screamed about the spelling. LOL

Does anyone else find it odd that the FBI went on camera, but the Richmond Hill Police Department who found him won't even comment?! They mentioned in the article RHPD refers to this case as a "miscellaneous incident" is all. They didn't even consider a crime occurred or what?!

Richmond Hill (http://savannahnow.com/content/related?topic=Richmond+Hill) police recently issued a report describing Kyle (http://savannahnow.com/content/related?topic=Benjaman+Kyle)'s injuries, which they have labeled as a miscellaneous incident. It's not known if there has been any response from anywhere. Richmond Hill Police Chief Billy Reynolds (http://savannahnow.com/content/related?topic=Billy+Reynolds) did not return two telephone calls Friday.

http://savannahnow.com/node/364434

christine2448
10-28-2007, 07:13 PM
WOW, the things that you all have compiled are absolutely amazing.

Someone mentioned Ray Gricar and my heart STOPPED for a second, I rushed and stared at the pics, it is not him, but for a minute I was freakin!!!! Those of you who do not know, that is the case that brought me to WS. Ray Gricar helped my family once.

OK....back on topic:

As mentioned, I printed and read this entire thread, taking notes, getting caught up.To this point.

I want to address a few things that I have read. I was going to do a summary of the entire case, but I
have taken notes and have lots of questions, comments.

1st, I detect a bit of mistrust between some posters and your only contact with Mr Kyle right now, Betty (the nurse).
Some of it is understandable (only because of 'who we are and where we come from'), IMO, some is a bit over the top. I want to ease everyone's mind and tell you that I have spoke to her on quite a few occassions and she is sincere, caring, and wanting to only help him.
What I think you all do not realize is she (Betty the nurse) just met Mr Kyle in March of this year. When she met him she had deep feeling he was not the 'vagabond' (sp?) he was labeled, it was obvious...it is also obvious to me from my research and I can see where she is coming from. So, Betty and Mr Kyle's paths cross, Betty takes notice, she decides to help this man, because HE wants so badly to discover his identity. ( could you imagine on of us coming across this man who doesn't know who he is?????) Betty is just like us, she is wanting to help him, she had NO idea about the missing, UID, problems w/no help/and lack of education in LE on how to deal with such cases.

This woman has spent countless hours researching, she didn't even know what date he had been found back in March/April... trying to figure out what to do, how to help, trying to get people to listen. Well, let's listen and let's ask instead of assuming...k?
They are reading here, Mr Kyle is seeing everything you all are saying...I understand, we are investigators, but let's be sensitive, k?
Some of you are not used to dealing directly with the 'family'and most of us don't get to deal with the survivor directly. If there are things that NEED to be mentioned/questioned, that may 'hurt' feelings of those reading, please, keep it in PM...there is always work
being done behind the scenes..there is a solid group here, you all know how to commincate privately when needed. This is an odd case.

I ask everyone to be polite and considerate because we do have parties involved here, which is a blessing and huge advantage.

Okie dokies..notes

8/31/04, Found behind BK, next 2 dumptser, US17, Richmond Hill, Savannah (US INT 8 Exit 87)
Markings, scar across front neck, 2 scars on elbow.
5'11", 240, large frame, brown hair, blue/green eyes.

From what I can gather and what has been mentioned he is well mannered, has knowlege of restaurant bldgs, supplies and equipment. Seems to know a lot about buildings in general.


Memories: Indiana, Colorado, 3 Brothers, name of Benjaman spelling, catholic school (I haven't verified this, where did this come from?)

Possibles (One I couldn't find ellimated or follow up on):
AJ1020 suggested Thomas Ray James, MI. What happened with this?
also, Timothy A Felton??

MaconChange posted Steve Dewey...need to discuss with Betty and Mr Kyle more to see why
they are so sure it's not him. I know for us it's easy to think it is him. But he knows what he looks like...hard for us to understand.

kaylenbabysims suggested Ronald Zellmer, kaylen? Anymore research on this?

SS-you suggested missing boater John Nance? Anything?

Dimples-you found an article about "Found Car Intesifies Search for Man"...what happened with that?
You also posted an Eric Peterson?

Mark Franzeo/CP- you all discussed a William Herbert Pear....anything?

Satemplet-Gary David Poole?

sweetpea-Larry Huff?

ShowerSinger-Kevin Muca?

KT Can-Jerry or Gerald Harlean (sp? my notes are getting sloppy ;)

Sable-Eugene Fish?


Here are some questions I have on what has been discussed vs done:

SS-You said you would send info to Arch Dios. and info to local stations in Tulsa and OKC. Has this been done, can you copy us the emails please?

lymom3 suggested contacting today show, anyone do this yet? Please post correspondence if so?

aj1020 suggested contacting the Early Show, GMA and Today show....done? Please post correspondence if so?

Dottierainbow-you sent links to John Scoot, Wish TV....have you followed up? Can you post your correspondence?

Has anyone sent his story to WTHR or WRTV as discussed?

Oneshoe-you stated WSAV Rep said NBC/CNN picked up, can you follow up on this, please copy us will all correspondence?

MaconChange-you stated you talked with Savannah Now, Savannah PD, Richmond Hill PD, and FBI...can you please give us details ofthese conversations, including dates, whom you spoke with and a good summary of discussion?

Dimples-what happened with the MySpace incident, the final outcome?


DNA-FBI took Kyle's FINGERPRINTS and ran them in National Criminal Justice Info Serv Div. This is NOT GOOD ENOUGH.

He should have his DNA taken and entered into CODIS. I have already spoke to Betty and will have this arranged at no cost to Mr Kyle.
Mr Kyle's DNA will be taken and entered in CODIS, once this is done it will run against the following indexes:
the Convicted Offender Index, Forensic Index, Arrestee Index, a Missing or Unidentified Persons Index, and a Missing Persons Reference Index.

The NE article- I know this is hitting some nerves here, HOWEVER, come on peeps....2 mill viewers..NE is not what it used to be. I think
the exposure is incredible, IMO, FWIW, and I give kudos to Benjaman and Betty for agreeing to do this story. 2 million viewers, this man is
50+, someone, somewhere, knows who is is. This is an incredible opportunity for exposure. I am onboard with it and will need volunteers to
help me weed through tips that come from the article running. christine@lightingthewayhome.org Subject Volunteer for NE article. (we will have volunteers set up to weed through then send on to more exp. volunteers (former LE) to weed through more, then on to LE/FBI whoever if tip is credible to get to that point, if that makes sense!)

Ideas that I have run across in thread that I think are good and should be pursued:
Getting Mr Kyle listed on every site possible!

SusieQ mentioned researching accidents/incidents presumed dead.

Gina M mentioned You Tube Video-I think a slideshow has been done..but I think a good video of him and story if possible (I dont' know how
to do this)

KT Can mentioned maybe he was on business trip...investigating local big businesses (we could send out emails/flyers to all)

I see you all have divided states, I say keep going, state by state, then go out to Canada then further. Great work and organization there, kudos!


The 20 yr gap has me too, need to research this more with Betty and Mr. Kyle.

I think we need extensive mapping done of the area he was found.

OK...you all have a lot of questions about his medical care....I will answer what I can by what I saw posted, if you already knew, I apologize in advance:
Tattoos-NO
Dental Work-I can't find my notes on this!!!! I know it was discussed, will come back to this.

Here is the info on when he was first discovered:
Upon admission, the ER doctor reported him as appearing as a well-developed and well-nourished middle-aged man (not a bum), although he had depressed neurological reflexes (which is not a positive finding) and rapid heartbeat. His liver function was normal, alcohol and drug screen was negative, his condition on admission was considered serious per the ER doctor's report. He was sent up to the Neuro. A CT scan of the head was normal except for several small lacunes (depressions) in the right cerebellar
hemisphere. Perhaps a closed-head injury? The attending doctor states in his report that Mr. Kyle's labs are "surprisingly within normal limits" - probably because this is not the case for homeless people by the time they reach middle age - they would usually have bad liver damage by then and very poor nutrition. Mr. Kyle's lab tests alone are indicative of one who had practiced a healthy lifestyle right up to the time of his attack. He presently has very good to excellent health and needs no prescription or over-the-counter drugs to maintain this favorable state of health.

I have a couple of questions to ask from all of you...if they have been answered, please let me know and I will remove them from
my list:
Tan lines, glasses, beard/facial hair growth at time of discovery?
Photos when found?

Anymore you all would like me to inquire about?
Any questions I may be able to answer?

I think the key here is keep searching the missing and group together to get more exposure.

PHEW!

Chloekins
10-28-2007, 07:37 PM
I would like to apologize if I at any time appeared to be unfeeling or negative in any way or aspect. It was certainly not my intention. I like facts and I speak very matter of fact, I know sometimes this can be off putting for some people. Once again my apologies.

Thank you Christine for providing me with the ER physicians orginal analysis, this helps me put things into prospective. Its good that we can pretty much rule out long term homelessness as I think this would just compound our search immensely. This gentleman seems to have been well cared for prior to his injuries. CHI (closed head injuries) are some of the hardest to treat long term. PTA (post traumatic amnesia) is not uncommon in severe CHI so this is understandable.

Christine, is there a way if you can ask if Mr. Kyle has problems forming new memories since his injury? Has he received any follow up CT scans to determine if his original cerebellar lacuna were resolved?

KT Can
10-28-2007, 07:48 PM
Christine,

Thank you for taking your time & delving into this case with us, your dedication & organization is amazing as always. I would also like to thank you for stepping up, taking control & steering us all back to the the real reason that brought us to this thread in the first place & that is to help Mr. Kyle find his true identity. I agree wholeheartedly that we have gotten off track a bit here & there, however I know with 100&#37; certainty that my fellow Websleuther's & I do everything from the heart & never out of malice. I think we all come from a natural place of wanting to help yet being skeptical of every single detail of every single case from all of our past experience on this board & the many cases that each of us has been & are personally invested in, which I can imagine would be hard for a lay person just being introduced to this sight to understand. I for one promise to re-dedicate my efforts towards a more positive & constructive effort in order to help Mr. Kyle. I apologize to Mr. Kyle's friend, Nurse Betty :) & can only say that I hope someone would step up to help me as she has should I ever find myself in such a situation. Thanks again Christine & to all my fellow sleuther's that are a part of this thread. I know when we WS's work together we can do AMAZING things, I've witnessed it first hand many, many times. I think we all should think of Mr. Kyle & his friend as we would any family member of a missing person & show them the respect & compassion that we do so many.

There but for the grace of God go I.

KT Can

believe09
10-28-2007, 07:51 PM
How about checking whether there has been confirmation of the suspected surgeries, like if he had a head and neck CT, could they see if his spine was fused and if that was the scar on his neck was from? Did anyone every confirm the pins etc from the elbow and is there a way to estimate the age of the injury? Thanks. I mean what are the chances his head depressions, neck scar and elbow surgery aren't all from the same event, IE a car wreck and he isn't having somekind of PTSD Amnesia from the closed head injury as a result, as Chloekins has suggested, right?

Earthbound Misfit I
10-28-2007, 08:52 PM
If Benjaman Kyle were born between 1944-1950 he would have to have been part of the Vietnam lotteries. I wonder if there is any footage available of the lottery drawing that was held on December 1, 1969 and if that footage may spark any memories for Benjaman? If BK was actually born in 1948 he would have been around 21 at the time of the lottery drawing. The lottery drawing had tv, film and radio coverage.

THE VIETNAM LOTTERIES

A lottery drawing - the first since 1942 - was held on December 1, 1969, at Selective Service National Headquarters in Washington, D.C. This event determined the order of call for induction during calendar year 1970, that is, for registrants born between January 1, 1944, and December 31, 1950. Reinstitution of the lottery was a change from the "draft the oldest man first" method, which had been the determining method for deciding order of call.

There were 366 blue plastic capsules containing birth dates placed in a large glass container and drawn by hand to assign order-of-call numbers to all men within the 18-26 age range specified in Selective Service law.

With radio, film and TV coverage, the capsules were drawn from the container, opened, and the dates inside posted in order. The first capsule - drawn by Congressman Alexander Pirnie (R-NY) of the House Armed Services Committee - contained the date September 14, so all men born on September 14 in any year between 1944 and 1950 were assigned lottery number 1. The drawing continued until all days of the year had been paired with sequence numbers.

Source & More at link: http://www.sss.gov/lotter1.htm

Earthbound Misfit I
10-28-2007, 09:21 PM
Were there physical signs that Benjaman was attacked? The injuries to the head could have came from a previous incident? He was sunburned, ant bites, blind from bad cataracts. Was there any bruising, scratches, etc? Were his feet dirty like he may have been walking or were they clean with no abrasions on them?

Earthbound Misfit I
10-28-2007, 09:25 PM
I don't recall offhand if the articles state what time BK was found at Burger King by the dumpster? Was it morning or afternoon? How long was BK out in the elements? How busy was the Burger King and how often were things brought out to the dumpsters?


Christine says:

>>8/31/04, Found behind BK, next 2 dumptser, US17, Richmond Hill, Savannah (US INT 8 Exit 87)

Earthbound Misfit I
10-28-2007, 09:36 PM
Has anyone checked out the restaurant equipment supply companies in the Richmond Hill area ( or in the entire Georgia area for that matter) to see if Benjaman may have been a salesman (perhaps from out of state) for one of them?

SuziQ
10-28-2007, 09:42 PM
Christine, here is the presumed dead, missing, news articles and local state and county missing persons search list.

Benjaman Kyle Search List
*States completed

CO-Dimples*
IN-Phenolred*
IN-Gina M
KS-AJ1020
ME-Synthia*
NB-AJ1020*
NH-Synthia*
OK-SS
OR-SuziQ*
TX-KT CAN
UT-SuziQ*
VT-Synthia*

Gina_M
10-28-2007, 10:02 PM
Time BK was found: shortly before 7 a.m. on August 31, 2004.
http://savannahnow.com/node/364434

Catholic School - in the recent news interview, BK said "I believe I was born in Indianapolis. I know I'm from Colorado. I'm sure my first name is Benjaman. I'm pretty sure I went to a Catholic school."
http://www.wcsh6.com/news/watercooler/article.aspx?storyid=72686


Question - how much did Benjaman weigh when he was found? Is that weight reflected on the Doe Network (http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/1007umga.html) listing, or is that his "current" weight?


Thank you so much Christine for taking charge :)

Gina_M
10-28-2007, 10:38 PM
The video from the news interview is now on LiveLeak (http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=aef_1193096986) which has a similar video format to YouTube. It has an embed code so the video can be posted on websites, MySpace pages, etc. I've been trying to download the video from the news sites so I can put it up on YouTube - wasn't having much luck - they have those "hidden" pretty well ;)

raindrops300
10-29-2007, 12:11 AM
Christine, here is the presumed dead, missing, news articles and local state and county missing persons search list.

Benjaman Kyle Search List
*States completed

CO-Dimples*
IN-Phenolred*
IN-Gina M
KS-AJ1020
ME-Synthia*
NB-AJ1020*
NH-Synthia*
OK-SS
OR-SuziQ*
TX-KT CAN
UT-SuziQ*
VT-Synthia*


I searched several AL missing data bases; came up with nothing. Please add this to the list of states searched. Thanks.

SuziQ
10-29-2007, 01:22 AM
I searched several AL missing data bases; came up with nothing. Please add this to the list of states searched. Thanks.

Done!

Gina_M
10-29-2007, 07:06 AM
I just sent out an email to People magazine, explaining BK's story, providing them with links, and explaining why I think it would be a good story for them to cover. Let's hope they pick it up!

Gina_M
10-29-2007, 07:27 AM
Dottierainbow-you sent links to John Scoot, Wish TV....have you followed up? Can you post your correspondence?

Has anyone sent his story to WTHR or WRTV as discussed?

Gina M mentioned You Tube Video-I think a slideshow has been done..but I think a good video of him and story if possible (I dont' know how
to do this)



WTHR picked up the story: (they spelled his name wrong though!)
http://www.wthr.com/Global/story.asp?S=7218919

Can't find it on WRTV website.
http://www.theindychannel.com/index.html

I found WISH TV on YouTube, not realizing that Dottie had already mentioned contacting them. I sent them an email through YouTube, hoping they would pick up the story and put the video on their YouTube channel.

I did a slideshow, but have been unable to download the actual video from the Savannah station to post on YouTube (the news websites encrypt the info so it is not downloadable unless you're computer savvy ;) )

I'm going out of town in the next couple days but I will stay in touch. I sent an email to People magazine...anyone else I should forward it to? Other magazines or news outlets that might be interested in his story? Has anyone contacted Today show/GMA, etc.?

believe09
10-29-2007, 10:09 AM
Good Housekeeping or Woman's Day might be interested and they have a pretty good readership/exposure the the age range of people who might know him.

christine2448
10-29-2007, 10:17 AM
I just sent out an email to People magazine, explaining BK's story, providing them with links, and explaining why I think it would be a good story for them to cover. Let's hope they pick it up!

Please post the copy of your correspondence, this way we can follow up if needed and also, it saves time of everyone rewriting emails, if yours is pulled together we can use it over and over ;)

believe09
10-29-2007, 10:17 AM
Sorry for the double post-has anyone who has listened to him placed his accent?

christine2448
10-29-2007, 10:18 AM
Good Housekeeping or Woman's Day might be interested and they have a pretty good readership/exposure the the age range of people who might know him.

Gina can you send the letter you sent to People to both of these publications?

phenolred
10-29-2007, 10:44 AM
He is articulate enough to be on Oprah, IMO. She has had a couple of people in the past appear about amnesia.

Gina_M
10-29-2007, 10:47 AM
Gina can you send the letter you sent to People to both of these publications?

Will do :)

Here's what I sent to People:

Subject: Amnesia victim - story idea

To Whom It May Concern:

I have recently become aware of a man down in Georgia who has amnesia. He was discovered unconscious behind a Burger King in Richmond Hill, Georgia, in 2004, and so far has been unable to find out his true identity. He is now using the name of Benjaman Kyle. He is unable to obtain a social security number, and therefore, he is unable to obtain a job.

Here is the first article:
http://savannahnow.com/node/364434

Here is the second article, which is accompanied by a video:
http://www.wsav.com/midatlantic/sav/news.apx.-content-articles-SAV-2007-10-15-0025.html

Here is his listing on the Doe Network:
http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/1007umga.html

Several internet sleuthers, along with one of his nurses from the hospital, have been trying to help him discover his identity. We believe that he needs national exposure by well known media such as your magazine in order for someone to recognize him. He is very intelligent and well-spoken, and he seems to come from a well-educated background. We believe he has a family out there who may believe he is deceased.

Amnesia is a very rare condition, but there have been other cases in which amnesia has kept someone separated from their loved ones. In particular, the case of Jeffrey Ingram, a Canadian who went missing from Seattle and ended up in Denver with no memory, garnered national attention. Jeffrey achieved national exposure by appearing on television and was recognized by a friend.

You can read more about Jeffrey Ingram at:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15373503/
and
http://www.rd.com/content/a-man-with-amnesia-reunited-with-his-wife/

Jeffrey's is a story that captivated many people, including myself. I believe the public would be interested in Benjaman's story as well. He has been featured on two MySpace pages:
http://www.myspace.com/missinginplainsight
http://www.myspace.com/seriouslysearching

and several news affiliates have picked up the interview from Savannah.

Your consideration of this story would be much appreciated!

Best regards,

Gina [last name edited]

Chloekins
10-29-2007, 10:50 AM
Sorry for the double post-has anyone who has listened to him placed his accent?

I am by no means an expert on american accents, but I have a colleague who is from the midwest (indiana) who sounds just like him. The only reason this stands out in my mind is that we both tease each other about how different we pronounce the same words.

believe09
10-29-2007, 10:51 AM
Another approach I have been taking, FYI-In response to some of his memories, I took another run through Indiana and CO discovering this:

-President Benjamin Harrison's house is in Indianapolis, Indiana. Perhaps he grew up near it?
- There are 165 People of the last name of Benjamin in the state of Indiana and a number that I found are in the age range of BK.
-There is a society called the Colorado Britten Society dedicated to the music of British composer Benjamin Britten. Perhaps he may be familiar with it?
-Eaton, CO was founded by Gov Benjamin Eaton...

Perhaps some of this far reaching stuff might spark something?

LionRun
10-29-2007, 11:12 AM
I am pretty good with accents and can even mimic a couple of them myself. I have turtle speed dial up so it is not easy for me to download video, but I can try. Is there a way for me or any of us to hear his voice? Please forgive for not having read through all the posts to find this on my own. Normally I do, but I am just coming back after a bit of time away. I would like to help if I can, though.

Lion

phenolred
10-29-2007, 11:36 AM
I was wondering about the Catholic school. Could it have been College I wonder? The popluar Catholic College here in Indiana is Notre Dame.

aj1020
10-29-2007, 12:01 PM
I am pretty good with accents and can even mimic a couple of them myself. I have turtle speed dial up so it is not easy for me to download video, but I can try. Is there a way for me or any of us to hear his voice? Please forgive for not having read through all the posts to find this on my own. Normally I do, but I am just coming back after a bit of time away. I would like to help if I can, though.

Lion

Ohh Lion, I'm so glad you're here! Welcome! :)

believe09
10-29-2007, 12:09 PM
Notre Dame has a Senior Alumni Website and National Organization. I hope it is OK, but I amended Gina's letter and contacted the Regional director who oversees GA, NC and SC. I explained, provided the links and requested they give the story some exposure on their website if they agreed there was a chance BK could be an alumn. If I overstepped my bounds, let me know. I will post any reply I receive.

Mark Franzeo
10-29-2007, 12:25 PM
I just checked the NJ Unexplained Disappearances section of doenetwork.org and did not find anybody of interest. Is there any other sites I should visit to rule out NJ as a possibility? I also will start looking at Ohio listings as well if no one has taken Ohio yet.

dottierainbow
10-29-2007, 12:30 PM
Wish Tv never did reply to my email.

Chloekins
10-29-2007, 01:52 PM
Christine, here is the presumed dead, missing, news articles and local state and county missing persons search list.

Benjaman Kyle Search List
*States completed

CO-Dimples*
IN-Phenolred*
IN-Gina M
KS-AJ1020
ME-Synthia*
NB-AJ1020*
NH-Synthia*
OK-SS
OR-SuziQ*
TX-KT CAN
UT-SuziQ*
VT-Synthia*

I will do MI, WI, and MN

christine2448
10-29-2007, 02:17 PM
Notre Dame has a Senior Alumni Website and National Organization. I hope it is OK, but I amended Gina's letter and contacted the Regional director who oversees GA, NC and SC. I explained, provided the links and requested they give the story some exposure on their website if they agreed there was a chance BK could be an alumn. If I overstepped my bounds, let me know. I will post any reply I receive.

Great! Please post your letter, we may use it too! I figured we would have to change somethings depending on who we had to send it to..thanks for thinking of this....great idea.

Thanks everyone! Everyone that is emailing and researching! For those researching Missing sites...remember "20 yr gap"...keep this in mind...he may be missing for over 20 yrs...which would place his disappearance I believe in the mid 80's.

believe09
10-29-2007, 02:43 PM
Dear Sir:
I have recently become aware of a man down in Georgia who has amnesia. He was discovered unconscious behind a Burger King in Richmond Hill, Georgia, in 2004, and so far has been unable to find out his true identity. He is now using the name of Benjaman Kyle. He is unable to obtain a social security number, and therefore, he is unable to obtain a job.

Here is the first article:
http://savannahnow.com/node/364434

Here is the second article, which is accompanied by a video:
http://www.wsav.com/midatlantic/sav/...0-15-0025.html (http://www.wsav.com/midatlantic/sav/news.apx.-content-articles-SAV-2007-10-15-0025.html)

Here is his listing on the Doe Network:
http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/1007umga.html

Several internet sleuthers, along with one of his nurses from the hospital, have been trying to help him discover his identity. Due to some statements he has made regarding his past, we think there may be a chance he could be an alumnus of Notre Dame. We also believe he has a family out there who may believe he is deceased.

Amnesia is a very rare condition, but there have been other cases in which amnesia has kept someone separated from their loved ones. In particular, the case of Jeffrey Ingram, a Canadian who went missing from Seattle and ended up in Denver with no memory, garnered national attention. Jeffrey achieved national exposure by appearing on television and was recognized by a friend.

You can read more about Jeffrey Ingram at:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15373503/
and
http://www.rd.com/content/a-man-with...with-his-wife/ (http://www.rd.com/content/a-man-with-amnesia-reunited-with-his-wife/)

Jeffrey's is a story that captivated many people, including myself. I believe the public would be interested in Benjaman's story as well. He has been featured on two MySpace pages:
http://www.myspace.com/missinginplainsight
http://www.myspace.com/seriouslysearching

and several news affiliates have picked up the interview from Savannah.

Your consideration and assistance in any way towards helping Mr. Kyle determine his identity would be greatly appreciated! If there is a means towards circulating some of this information on your Senior Alumni Website, those of us trying to help Mr. Kyle identify himself would be truly grateful.

Best regards,

Earthbound Misfit I
10-29-2007, 02:46 PM
If anyone knows how to write a story you could submit your story idea (BK's story) to Reader's Digest and if the story idea is picked you would be the one to actually write the story about BK. I would do it but I isn't no writer.

Here is the info:

Article Proposal

Original articles are generally assigned to regular contributors to Reader's Digest magazine. We do not accept or return unpublished manuscripts.

We do, however, accept brief queries (up to 2,500 characters) that clearly detail the article idea -- with special emphasis on the arc of the story, your interview access to the main characters, your access to special documents, etc. We look for dramatic narratives, articles about everyday heroes, crime dramas, adventure stories. Do include your writing credits.

We are not interested in poetry, fiction or opinion pieces.

Link to form to fill out http://www.rd.com/articleproposal.do?wtGroup=RDCOM_FOOTER&wtID=ARTPROP_SITE&lid=31

christine2448
10-29-2007, 03:26 PM
If anyone knows how to write a story you could submit your story idea (BK's story) to Reader's Digest and if the story idea is picked you would be the one to actually write the story about BK. I would do it but I isn't no writer.

Here is the info:

Article Proposal

Original articles are generally assigned to regular contributors to Reader's Digest magazine. We do not accept or return unpublished manuscripts.

We do, however, accept brief queries (up to 2,500 characters) that clearly detail the article idea -- with special emphasis on the arc of the story, your interview access to the main characters, your access to special documents, etc. We look for dramatic narratives, articles about everyday heroes, crime dramas, adventure stories. Do include your writing credits.

We are not interested in poetry, fiction or opinion pieces.

Link to form to fill out http://www.rd.com/articleproposal.do?wtGroup=RDCOM_FOOTER&wtID=ARTPROP_SITE&lid=31

Betty is a great writer, let me mention this to her! She knows the story better than any of us! Thanks RKnowley, this is a great idea. Reader Digest I believe would be the perfect reader base (ages, etc) for this type of story.

Earthbound Misfit I
10-29-2007, 03:43 PM
ty Christine for suggesting nurse Betty (maybe I should just call her Betty as "Nurse Betty" sounds like a porn star name to me, lol) write an article for RD. I didn't want to suggest someone (a certain person) write the article because I didn't want to put the stress on somebodyelse. You are in the perfect position to suggest to Betty that she write the article as you are working with her now. You are correct in saying Betty knows BK & his story better than all of us and I know she would write the perfect article on BK. Thanks again for all your help Christine.


Betty is a great writer, let me mention this to her! She knows the story better than any of us! Thanks RKnowley, this is a great idea. Reader Digest I believe would be the perfect reader base (ages, etc) for this type of story.

dimples37398
10-29-2007, 03:54 PM
Yeah I really would like to find more out about Thomas Ray James(the dates add up real good for Thomas Ray James as well as the body build and dates....the only thing that is off is the brown eyes, and the photo you can't tell anything because of the quality.) as well as Steve Dewey. As far as the myspace thing Christine, I still have Steve Dewey's sons page and I haven't heard back from him, and didnt want to message him and be the cause of more dissappointment or hurt.

I am willing to help out in any way I can at all. If anyone needs anything please message me and let me know......

Kel

dimples37398
10-29-2007, 04:38 PM
I know this as a match is unlikely for a number of reasons but figured I would post it here and let everyone else look and rule it out instead of me ruling it out without other opinions.

--------Newspaper Article---------

Authorities are seeking help from the public in finding a 46- year-old Covington man who has been missing for two months.
Edward James Terrebonne IV was last seen the morning of July 9 in Covington. His car was found that day abandoned about 275 miles away on Interstate 49 near Natchitoches, Covington police Lt. Robert Donald said.
Terrebonne, whose mother reported him missing July 12, has been diagnosed with paranoid schizophrenia, a condition that sometimes causes him to lose his memory and forget his identity, Donald said.
Terrebonne is 5 feet 10 inches tall, weighs 180 pounds and has blue eyes and brown hair.

_____Charley Project Site Link for Terrebonne____

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/t/terrebonne_edward.html

Kel

dimples37398
10-29-2007, 04:44 PM
I am hoping one of you great searchers might be able to find out more on this article as well. I can't find the couple's names or if the body of the husband was ever found. I know it is probably a long shot but who knows......Don't want to ignore any chance of figuring this out.....

----Only Newspaper Article I could Find-------

A man knocked out of a speedboat remained missing late Saturday after a boating accident near the Kemah Boardwalk.
Jim Christy, Clear Lake Emergency Medical Corps spokesman, said the man and his wife, whose identities were not released, were returning to Kemah when their boat got snared by submerged crab traps.
Christy said the speedboat was traveling about 55 mph when it became entangled in underwater ropes from the traps about 300 yards from the boardwalk. The force of the impact sent the man overboard, he said.
The accident happened about 7:30 p.m.
Christy said Kemah Fire Department dive teams and rescue boats searched a large area for the missing man, but suspended the search about 10 p.m. due to poor visibility.
He said a Kemah firefighter was injured when he attempted to board the speedboat, which was spinning in circles anchored to ropes from the traps, to help the man's wife. The firefighter was sent by LifeFlight to Hermann Memorial Hospital while the woman was sent to an area hospital by ambulance for minor injuries.
The firefighter and woman were rescued by other firefighters who cut off the boat's engine.

aj1020
10-29-2007, 04:54 PM
I am hoping one of you great searchers might be able to find out more on this article as well. I can't find the couple's names or if the body of the husband was ever found. I know it is probably a long shot but who knows......Don't want to ignore any chance of figuring this out.....

----Only Newspaper Article I could Find-------

A man knocked out of a speedboat remained missing late Saturday after a boating accident near the Kemah Boardwalk.
Jim Christy, Clear Lake Emergency Medical Corps spokesman, said the man and his wife, whose identities were not released, were returning to Kemah when their boat got snared by submerged crab traps.
Christy said the speedboat was traveling about 55 mph when it became entangled in underwater ropes from the traps about 300 yards from the boardwalk. The force of the impact sent the man overboard, he said.
The accident happened about 7:30 p.m.
Christy said Kemah Fire Department dive teams and rescue boats searched a large area for the missing man, but suspended the search about 10 p.m. due to poor visibility.
He said a Kemah firefighter was injured when he attempted to board the speedboat, which was spinning in circles anchored to ropes from the traps, to help the man's wife. The firefighter was sent by LifeFlight to Hermann Memorial Hospital while the woman was sent to an area hospital by ambulance for minor injuries.
The firefighter and woman were rescued by other firefighters who cut off the boat's engine.


I found the following post on a boating forum. It looks like this boating accident occured in Sep, 2004, so I don't believe it's a match to BK.

07-25-2005, 02:04 PM #1 (http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1400952&postcount=1) westwelljs (http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/member.php?u=64223) vbmenu_register("postmenu_1400952", true);
Registered


Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 5



Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
My husband and I were boating last year.
Well, first let me say that I just found this site today, and think it is a great resource for power boating and for owners.
That being said. I want to share with each of you that reads this, that I truly hope you will always exercise good judgement when you are out in your boats. Please wear a "kill switch" , and keep it on until you dock the boat. He had taken his off too soon that day.
My husband is gone now, and I think he would like this site too, if he were still here.
We were in our boat last September, less than a 1/4 mile from the Kemah Boardwalk/ Chanel,when he swerved to miss a crab trap, that was barely noticeable because of the poorly discolored float, and also it was in a navigable chanel, and was not supposed to be. We immediately hit another boat's wake that was off to our port side about a 100 feet, and he was ejected from the boat, where it ran over him & he went into the prop and died.
I sustained broken ribs, and an arm, and was knocked out.
I stayed inside the confines of our boat.
I would like to know if any of you has ever heard of such an incident,etc?
I had always felt like our boat was too fast & too light for the type of chop we have in Trinity/Galveston Bay, and that the accident was avoidable, if only some slight changes to the boat were made during manufacturing. and lastly that there were stricter laws for crab trapping in the Gulf waters.
I have been writing to our representatives and trying to get some new laws passed regulating the placement of crab traps.
Our speed at the time of the accident was not very fast, maybe 45-5- mph, again the chop keeps the speed down somewhat.
Not sure why I wrote this today, but I have been planning his one year memorial this past week, and so it is so fresh on my mind, I guess.
Clark was 45, and died one day shy of his 46th birthday.
We had just gotten married a few months before in May in Grand Cayman.
He loved all kinds of boating, especially being in our Baja, as well as sailing, and he was formerly in the Navy when he was younger.
He died September 4th, 2004. His Memorial is going to be held on September 3rd, 2005, at Outrigger's in Kemah, TX, at 2pm. If you think about it that day, maybe you can say a prayer for him. I know he would appreciate it.
Sincerely,
Jacque West
Seabrook, TX

from: http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/showthread.php?t=108448

Gina_M
10-29-2007, 05:43 PM
I am pretty good with accents and can even mimic a couple of them myself. I have turtle speed dial up so it is not easy for me to download video, but I can try. Is there a way for me or any of us to hear his voice? Please forgive for not having read through all the posts to find this on my own. Normally I do, but I am just coming back after a bit of time away. I would like to help if I can, though.

Lion

Hi Lion! :blowkiss:

The video is on LiveLeak which is similar to YouTube's video format, at this link:
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=aef_1193096986

The video will automatically start playing (it's down at the bottom of the page). Since you have dialup, I would suggest hitting the "pause" on the video (lower left corner of the video box), and letting it load up before you play it. Otherwise it will play very choppily.

Hope you're able to watch the video!

dimples37398
10-29-2007, 06:37 PM
Thanks aj1020.........I am posting the articles like this because it is a paid archive newspaper site and I don't know how to post these without it giving people the register and pay page of the site....So here is another one....also doesn't have a name and would be a man in his 60's ....which I am not sure if BK would be this old.....

Lafourche Parish authorities and the Coast Guard searched Friday for a missing fisher who fell off an oyster boat in Hackberry Bay.
The man and two companions were aboard a 45-foot, unnamed boat in the bay about 10 miles north of Grand Isle when the boat hit a submerged pipeline about 8:30 a.m., knocking the three men into the water, according to the Coast Guard.
Two of the men were able to climb back on board, but the third man did not surface, the Coast Guard said.
The identities of the three men weren't available. Lafourche Parish Sheriff's Office spokesman Larry Weidel said the missing man is 60 years old, and the boat belongs to Simmons Marine of Empire.
The men weren't wearing life jackets, the Coast Guard said.
The two men who returned to the boat radioed the Coast Guard station at Grand Isle.
Two rescue boats were dispatched from Grand Isle, and a helicopter was sent from Coast Guard Air Station New Orleans.
It was unclear if Jefferson Parish Sheriff's Office boats initially assisted with the search. The accident happened near the Lafourche-Jefferson parish line.
The search was suspended about 5:30 p.m. because of rough weather, Weidel said. Wind was gusting at about 30 mph, he said.
Officials plan to resume the search this morning.
Hackberry Bay is very shallow in winter when tides are low, Weidel said. "It's not unusual to drag bottom this time of year."
. . . . . . .
Sandra Barbier can be reached at sbarbier@timespicayune.com or (504) 826-3784.

dimples37398
10-29-2007, 06:43 PM
The other missing crew members are Baldemar Villerreal, 54, of Lake Jackson; Daniel Lopez, 31, of Port Arthur; Joseph Brown, 44, of Vidor; and Lawrence Glass, 65, of Mobile, Ala.
The company that owns the vessel, Galveston-based Ocean Runner Inc., declined to comment on the incident Sunday.
The Coast Guard had few answers, though the collision was under investigation, McCool said. The weather played a role in the collision, McCool said, though officials had not determined Sunday to what extent. Navy divers examined the wreckage of the Lee III, using radar equipment to search for clues.
Searchers have found life vests and preservers and a raft floating near the sunken ship. Only the bow of the overturned ship remained above water.
The Lee III, a 178-foot offshore-platform supply ship, was carrying about 30,000 gallons of diesel fuel when it collided with Zim Mexico III about 5:30 a.m. Saturday. Investigators are assessing possible environmental damage and safety conditions connected to the leaking fuel.

SuziQ
10-29-2007, 06:49 PM
I just checked the NJ Unexplained Disappearances section of doenetwork.org and did not find anybody of interest. Is there any other sites I should visit to rule out NJ as a possibility? I also will start looking at Ohio listings as well if no one has taken Ohio yet.

Thanks Mark! I will add you to the list for NJ and Ohio. If you could also check the local state, county and city govt websites for missing persons. Also google, or use whatever your prefered search engine is, and search terms such as missing person+state name, presumed dead+state name, and any other combination you can think of. Another missing person website I like to use is National Center for Missing Adults.

http://www.theyaremissed.org/ncma/index.php

christine2448
10-29-2007, 06:55 PM
Yeah I really would like to find more out about Thomas Ray James(the dates add up real good for Thomas Ray James as well as the body build and dates....the only thing that is off is the brown eyes, and the photo you can't tell anything because of the quality.) as well as Steve Dewey. As far as the myspace thing Christine, I still have Steve Dewey's sons page and I haven't heard back from him, and didnt want to message him and be the cause of more dissappointment or hurt.

I am willing to help out in any way I can at all. If anyone needs anything please message me and let me know......

Kel


I wouldn't email or contact anyone w/o first discussing with Mr. Kyle/LE....I feel we are advocating for him, secondly...we have NO idea about the circumstances that landed him in such a condition behind that dumptser. I think all things should be discussed with Mr Kyle/LE first, before any contact is made. I know everyone's hearts are in the right place, but this is a picture here, and we need to see ALL the landscape!

You all ROCK!

ASU2USC
10-29-2007, 07:10 PM
I'm new, but I've been lurking for about a week and reading this thread. I was just looking at the Doe Network site for Colorado disappearances and came across Douglas Edward Meer:

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/1120dmco.html

The second picture from the left reminds me of BK for some reason.

SuziQ
10-29-2007, 07:15 PM
Here is the latest search list. Pm me if I've missed someone or if you've completed or want to start a new state. Thanks!

Benjaman Kyle Search List
*States completed

AL-Raindrops*
CO-Dimples*
IN-Phenolred*
IN-Gina M
KS-AJ1020
ME-Synthia*
MI-Chloekins
MN-Chloekins
NB-AJ1020*
NH-Synthia*
NJ-Mark Franzeo
OH-Mark Franzeo
OK-SS
OR-SuziQ*
TX-KT CAN
UT-SuziQ*
VT-Synthia*
WI-Chloekins

Gina_M
10-29-2007, 07:25 PM
Hi SuziQ,

I guess we can mark off Indiana as searched, as I think Phenolred and I both searched pretty thoroughly. I'm keeping Indiana in the back of my mind though because I think it's pretty likely BK is from there.

Thanks for keeping track of this list! :)

christine2448
10-29-2007, 07:35 PM
Matches...I see everyone is bringing up more matches and hitting more states, awesome.

But...:truce: I was thinking. :waitasec: Up to post # post 198, 715 or so yesterday I compiled all the possibles you all had discovered.

I say we quash those now first...then go from post 198 to here and eliminate those. Then, if someone finds one, or you find 2, stick to those, eliminate, find more. Make sense?

Just a suggestion, really. You all are doing good, it's just so hard to keep it all straight in one thread.

Soooo, if you like my idea ;)

AJ1020 suggested Thomas Ray James, MI. What happened with this?
also, Timothy A Felton??

MaconChange posted Steve Dewey...need to discuss with Betty and Mr Kyle more to see why
they are so sure it's not him. I know for us it's easy to think it is him. But he knows what he looks like...hard for us to understand.

kaylenbabysims suggested Ronald Zellmer, kaylen? Anymore research on this?

SS-you suggested missing boater John Nance? Anything?

Dimples-you found an article about "Found Car Intesifies Search for Man"...what happened with that?
You also posted an Eric Peterson?

Mark Franzeo/CP- you all discussed a William Herbert Pear....anything?

Satemplet-Gary David Poole?

sweetpea-Larry Huff?

ShowerSinger-Kevin Muca?

KT Can-Jerry or Gerald Harlean (sp? my notes are getting sloppy ;)

Sable-Eugene Fish?

Earthbound Misfit I
10-29-2007, 07:36 PM
I sent Oprah.com an email asking them to cover BK's story. I think the more people who submit a request the better the chance would be of her covering it.

You can submit your request here:

https://www.oprah.com/plugger/templates/BeOnTheShow.jhtml?action=respond&plugId=B2100004

christine2448
10-29-2007, 07:41 PM
I just checked the NJ Unexplained Disappearances section of doenetwork.org and did not find anybody of interest. Is there any other sites I should visit to rule out NJ as a possibility? I also will start looking at Ohio listings as well if no one has taken Ohio yet.

I have a list of missing clearing houses on my board, US, Canada, and Puerto Rico, but not many have links, some do, but not a lot.. click here to link LTWH Resource Room (http://ltwh.proboards55.com/index.cgi#trr)

Gina_M
10-29-2007, 07:41 PM
Just a suggestion, really. You all are doing good, it's just so hard to keep it all straight in one thread.


It is hard to keep track of everything. I'm starting to wonder if we need a forum ;)

marysawol
10-29-2007, 07:42 PM
Matches...I see everyone is bringing up more matches and hitting more states, awesome.

But...:truce: I was thinking. :waitasec: Up to post # post 198, 715 or so yesterday I compiled all the possibles you all had discovered.

I say we quash those now first...then go from post 198 to here and eliminate those. Then, if someone finds one, or you find 2, stick to those, eliminate, find more. Make sense?

Just a suggestion, really. You all are doing good, it's just so hard to keep it all straight in one thread.

Soooo, if you like my idea ;)

AJ1020 suggested Thomas Ray James, MI. What happened with this?

Christine, When BK's news first hit another forum I'm on, I spent two days researching and had come across Thomas Ray James. I felt out of all the possibilities (at the time) Mr James was the best match. I called the Savannah FBI and gave them my findings. Tomorrow I'll call the Grosse Pointe Police (where Mr James is from) and ask if the FBI ever got a hold of them regarding Mr James.

Gina_M
10-29-2007, 07:45 PM
I have a list of missing clearing houses on my board, US, Canada, and Puerto Rico, but not many have links, some do, but not a lot.. click here to link LTWH Resource Room (http://ltwh.proboards55.com/index.cgi#trr)

I've been compiling a list of missing persons sites too...it's nowhere near complete, but it may be helpful to some:

General Missing Persons sites
http://findmywayhome.org/page6.html

Local sites for specific areas
http://findmywayhome.org/page7.html