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Dr. Doogie
11-27-2007, 09:18 PM
I want to consolidate the information concerning Evelyn Wanek in one place.

Here is what we know as of now:

In the days following the death of George Brody, George Waters placed a 40 minute call to Evelyn Wanek. Evelyn ran a health studio in Pacifica (which is just south of San Francisco on the Pacific Ocean and just north of Half Moon Bay). Joe Ford later had a conversation with her and she confirmed that she knew Brody, but knew Waters as Jack Wolf (Wolfe? Woolf?).

We discovered that, in 1970, she ran a health studio in San Francisco at 967 Sutter Street. At this time, Brody lived at 1156 Sutter Street and Waters lived at 630 Geary Street. Below is a map created by MagicRose99 that demonstrates how close these address are.

The timing of when Evelyn became acquainted with the two Georges is important because if we can establish that they knew each other prior to January 16th, 1973, then she becomes a viable candidate as a possible co-conspirator.

We have also discovered a 40 year old woman with the last name of Wanek living in California who seems to resemble the age-progression of Anna. Details about her are being kept off of the forum to protect her privacy. We are trying to determine if a link between this woman and Evelyn exists - so far, no luck.

Jodibug
11-27-2007, 09:32 PM
More exciting news.... thanks for keeping us posted, Doogie! Anna is in my thoughts daily.

Dr. Doogie
11-27-2007, 09:35 PM
A person who is not a member of Websleuths sent me the following information: Evelyn obtained a patent for an "Apparatus for Facilitating Colonic Irrigation" in 1958. http://patimg2.uspto.gov/.piw?docid=US002818862&SectionNum=1&IDKey=D50C650BC351&HomeUrl=http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1%2526Sect2=HITOFF%2526d=PALL%2526 p=1%2526u=%25252Fnetahtml%25252FPTO%25252Fsrchnum. htm%2526r=1%2526f=G%2526l=50%2526s1=2,818,862.PN.% 2526OS=PN/2,818,862%2526RS=PN/2,818,862 (http://patimg2.uspto.gov/.piw?docid=US002818862&SectionNum=1&IDKey=D50C650BC351&HomeUrl=http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1%2526Sect2=HITOFF%2526d=PALL%2526 p=1%2526u=%25252Fnetahtml%25252FPTO%25252Fsrchnum. htm%2526r=1%2526f=G%2526l=50%2526s1=2,818,862.PN.% 2526OS=PN/2,818,862%2526RS=PN/2,818,862) Her listed address is in San Francisco, so that establishes that she was in SF in 1958 and 1970, then moved to Pacifica sometime between 1970 and 1981. (She later moved to the Santa Cruz area where she died in December 1992.)

Now follow me here (even though this is a little distasteful): Annasmom mentions in her manuscript about her attempt to give Waters an enema at the suggestion of Brody. Wanek ran a health studio that featured "colon therapy" and she had a patent for a fancy device to facilitate enemas. While not proof positive of a link between Wanek and Brody at the time of the ill-fated enema (late 1960's), it does seem to show that Brody had some familiarity with enemas and their purported medical benefits during this era. Such knowledge may quite likely have come from Evelyn. This provides one more clue that Wanek and Brody may have known each other prior to January 1973.

I have now spent more time thinking about enemas than I thought I would have done in a lifetime... :doh:

MagicRose99
11-27-2007, 10:35 PM
Doogie... that link for the patent comes up with a blank page for me...

ETA: After a search, I found she also filed her patent in Canada in 1961:
http://patents.ic.gc.ca/cipo/cpd/en/patent/616139/summary.html

Cubby
11-28-2007, 07:23 AM
I wonder if a picture of this device exists, and as distasteful as this might be if Annasmom would recognize the picture. Perhaps GB suggested this particular device? Especially if others existed at the time.

Gina_M
11-28-2007, 07:54 AM
As Bill Murray said in Tootsie, "I think we're getting into a weird area here"!

But seriously, that does sound like a plausible lead.

MagicRose99
11-28-2007, 08:25 AM
I wonder if a picture of this device exists, and as distasteful as this might be if Annasmom would recognize the picture. Perhaps GB suggested this particular device? Especially if others existed at the time.

If you click on the link I (or Doogie's link, if you can see it) it provides drawings of the device...

Cubby
11-28-2007, 08:35 AM
If you click on the link I (or Doogie's link, if you can see it) it provides drawings of the device...


Thank you. I had the blank page first too. :blushing:

natasha-cupcake
11-28-2007, 10:14 AM
Bleecch!

Asthetics aside, I really believe you may be onto something, Doogie. Great detective work and kudos to you for boldly going where no man has gone before!

iNTERESTEDWOMAN
11-28-2007, 10:48 AM
A little more genealogical information on Evelyn Wanek

Maybe Joe Ford or Annasmom will reconize a name.

According US census records Evelyn's family lived in North Dakota from at least 1910 to 1930. Death records show her mother, father, and at least one sister also died in CA

Father: Joseph M. Wanek b. 1-27-1873 d. 4-15-1972 (SF CA)
Mother: Barbara (Matuska) b. 6-27-1883 d. 11-30-1981 (SF CA)
Sister: Florence M. b.1905
Self: Evelyn R. b. 2-11-1906 d.12-31-1992 (San Mateo CA)
Sister: Loretta F. (Guidici) b. 10-25-1911 d. 10-19-1995 (Santa Cruz CA)

I haven't been able to trace info on older sister Florence yet

Loretta Frances Wanek married Peter Guidici (both deceased)
children:
David Charles Guidici b.5-16-42 d.10-27-81 (San Mateo CA)
Maureen C. Guidici b.12-7-37

Maureen is still living, married twice, and appears to have a couple step-children, none of her own. If Anna was given to a Wanek family member, Maureen would be a possible choice. IMHO. There was a (now 40 year old) woman living in their household at one time. I believe she was the wife of a step son.

Evelyn's uncle Nick Matuska (b.10-11-1883 d.3-28-1965 Wilkin, MN) lived with the Wanek family for several years. Uncle Nick married in 1911 to Wilma and had 3 daughters (one named Evelyn) and 2 sons in ND by 1930. Not sure when he moved to MN, but his children would all be about the right age to receive a child Anna's age. Nick's WWI draft info lists him as medium height, blue eyes and brown hair

A man by the name of Frank Zitka (b.1868) lived with the Wanek family as a lodger or a servant in the 1930's

iNTERESTEDWOMAN
11-28-2007, 11:00 AM
Doogie... that link for the patent comes up with a blank page for me...

ETA: After a search, I found she also filed her patent in Canada in 1961:
http://patents.ic.gc.ca/cipo/cpd/en/patent/616139/summary.html

Wow...this and Doogies info are great finds! It's just so strange how a little farm girl from North Dakota ended up inventing enema equipment ...:eek:

iNTERESTEDWOMAN
11-28-2007, 11:30 AM
A person who is not a member of Websleuths sent me the following information: Evelyn obtained a patent for an "Apparatus for Facilitating Colonic Irrigation" in 1958.... :doh:

If you look closely at the drawing, it states that the patent was actually filed December 14, 1953.

Mischa
11-28-2007, 04:00 PM
Well, as a told you in another thread English is not my first language and I’m affraid I lack the vocabulary to explain you properly what I mean and – even worse - the knowlegde about the life in the USA and its differences to our life in Germany.

But reading through the postings about Evelyn Waneck my first thought was, that she probably was George Brodies last “doctor” and offered some unusual treatment for his throat cancer.

As I told you I don’t know about the USA, but here in Germany it would be a status problem for a real academic doctor like George Waters if he would have to admit or if there only were rumours that someone close to him ( and someone who was also his patient) went to the owner of a health studio for treatment after he – the real doctor – failed in curing his patient.


I don’t know about the USA but here in Germany every doctor would have a good reason to give a false name in this case.

SherlockJr
11-28-2007, 04:12 PM
But reading through the postings about Evelyn Waneck my first thought was, that she probably was George Brodies last “doctor” and offered some unusual treatment for his throat cancer.

OMG, I'm picuturing this rectal tubing going down his throat! LOL

Mischa, welcome to the forum!

Mischa
11-28-2007, 04:39 PM
Thanx Sherlock :-)

Personally I hope Evelyns cure for cancer was a good whipping !

MagicRose99
11-28-2007, 05:08 PM
Wasn't GW Brody's doctor? Also, GW's frame of mind I don't think he cared about his reputation as a Dr... he already had several disciplinary issues, didn't he?

My minds foggy for some reason today...

Mischa
11-28-2007, 05:34 PM
I think status and discipline are two diffent issues that could be the same.
..If GW disciplinary problems arised from struggles with his disciplinarians the reason was probably a kind of job-related vanity. And not wanting to admit that he was unable to cure George Brody would have arised fromm much the same reason.

( Sorry, I don't think my mind is foggy, but my English probably is)

Annasmom
11-28-2007, 07:22 PM
I think status and discipline are two diffent issues that could be the same.
..If GW disciplinary problems arised from struggles with his disciplinarians the reason was probably a kind of job-related vanity. And not wanting to admit that he was unable to cure George Brody would have arised fromm much the same reason.

( Sorry, I don't think my mind is foggy, but my English probably is)

I think your English is just fine, and your comments are perceptive. Some of the disciplinary problems had to do with bizarre therapies (possibly suggested by GB), but also with "normal" things like not showing up for work on time, not doing paperwork, etc. He obviously tried LOTS of "alternative" therapies for GB once they knew how sick he was. All this is documented in what we have been calling the Box From Hell.

Dr. Doogie
02-10-2008, 06:37 PM
I don't see where I ever posted this bit of information before: I heard back from the Gearson Institute (the alternative medicine / cancer clinic in San Diego which uses, among other techniques, enema therapy). They do not have a record of Evelyn Wanek being an authorized practicioner of their techniques.

itsreenw
02-26-2008, 02:37 AM
I'm just catching up so bear with me...This is the Evelyn Wanek we are interested in, right? Died in 1992 at the age of 86?*Full Name Age Year Born Birth Date Death Date Last Residence * *******************************************WANEK, EVELYN 86 1906
Sorry, the post doesn't appear as it did on the site I found it on

Dr. Doogie
02-26-2008, 12:38 PM
I'm just catching up so bear with me...This is the Evelyn Wanek we are interested in, right? Died in 1992 at the age of 86?*Full Name Age Year Born Birth Date Death Date Last Residence * *******************************************WANEK, EVELYN 86 1906
Sorry, the post doesn't appear as it did on the site I found it on

The last residence should be Boulder Creek, Santa Cruz County, CA.

Annasmom
02-26-2008, 01:50 PM
The last residence should be Boulder Creek, Santa Cruz County, CA.
That's about 50 miles south of Purisima Canyon.

itsreenw
02-27-2008, 04:18 AM
A little more genealogical information on Evelyn Wanek

&Evelyn's uncle Nick Matuska (b.10-11-1883 d.3-28-1965 Wilkin, MN) lived with the Wanek family for several years. Uncle Nick married in 1911 to Wilma and had 3 daughters (one named Evelyn) and 2 sons in ND by 1930. Not sure when he moved to MN, but his children would all be about the right age to receive a child Anna's age. Nick's WWI draft info lists him as medium height, blue eyes and brown hair

A man by the name of Frank Zitka (b.1868) lived with the Wanek family as a lodger or a servant in the 1930's

http://www.loc.gov/poetry/poetpoem2.html There's a Connie Wanek in MN at the link to the left (scroll down til you get to her bio). She works at the public library so maybe we can get her interested in helping us with some research

InterestedNHelping
02-27-2008, 12:11 PM
Boulder Creek is a notorious area of alternative healing gurus and 60's hippies even to this day...Wanek being here is not a surprise, Her family is probably still in the bay area, if she has one

iNTERESTEDWOMAN
02-27-2008, 12:12 PM
The last residence should be Boulder Creek, Santa Cruz County, CA.
Just to add to this, her CA death index records states she died in San Mateo County...probably in a hospital I'd assume.

iNTERESTEDWOMAN
02-27-2008, 12:16 PM
http://www.loc.gov/poetry/poetpoem2.html There's a Connie Wanek in MN at the link to the left (scroll down til you get to her bio). She works at the public library so maybe we can get her interested in helping us with some research

:blowkiss: It's SOOO good to have you back!!! :woohoo:

iNTERESTEDWOMAN
02-27-2008, 12:23 PM
...
Eveylns Sister: Loretta F. (Guidici) b. 10-25-1911 d. 10-19-1995 (Santa Cruz CA)

Loretta Frances Wanek married Peter Guidici (both deceased)
children:
David Charles Guidici b.5-16-42 d.10-27-81 (San Mateo CA)
Maureen C. Guidici b.12-7-37

Maureen is still living, married twice, and appears to have a couple step-children, none of her own. If Anna was given to a Wanek family member, Maureen would be a possible choice. IMHO. There was a (now 40 year old) woman living in their household at one time. I believe she was the wife of a step son....



Sorry to quote my own quote, but I was wondering if Doogie or SherlockJr ever contacted Maureen yet? Last I head, there where plans to. I realize you guys are very busy, but she's getting older, (70). She might have a story to tell...or maybe not. :rolleyes:

itsreenw
02-27-2008, 12:49 PM
:blowkiss: It's SOOO good to have you back!!! :woohoo:

Thanks Much. I can't dp much until I get my laptop fixed. I have NO idea what happened. I can go to certain sites but others just come up blank so I'll do as much as I can. It should be fixed this week.

iNTERESTEDWOMAN
03-10-2008, 05:30 PM
Would anyone object if I wrote Maureen Guidici a letter? I've asked about her a few times, but no one has replied if she has been contacted or not.

Annasmom
03-10-2008, 06:29 PM
Would anyone object if I wrote Maureen Guidici a letter? I've asked about her a few times, but no one has replied if she has been contacted or not.
I'm sure nobody would object to your writing Maureen Guidici a letter.

Dr. Doogie
03-10-2008, 06:47 PM
Go for it. Thanks, IW!

mysteriew
04-05-2008, 12:33 AM
http://www.loc.gov/poetry/poetpoem2.html There's a Connie Wanek in MN at the link to the left (scroll down til you get to her bio). She works at the public library so maybe we can get her interested in helping us with some research

I wonder if she has ever done any geneological research on her family history?
If she is not related to the Wanek in Calif, then I wonder if she could be persuaded to see if the woman is related to her/get more info from her?

Annasmom
11-29-2009, 08:30 PM
I don't see where I ever posted this bit of information before: I heard back from the Gearson Institute (the alternative medicine / cancer clinic in San Diego which uses, among other techniques, enema therapy). They do not have a record of Evelyn Wanek being an authorized practicioner of their techniques. This is the woman (now deceased) with whom GW had a 40-minute phone conversation around the time Brody died. This is one of the items of interest which really had no resolution. Another is the Freedom of Information Act and how one could get any documents about GW and GB which might exist. Any ideas?

OzzieMum
11-30-2009, 05:20 AM
This is the woman (now deceased) with whom GW had a 40-minute phone conversation around the time Brody died. This is one of the items of interest which really had no resolution. Another is the Freedom of Information Act and how one could get any documents about GW and GB which might exist. Any ideas?

Hi Annasmom,

This and many other ideas, suggestions and theories (some very good ones) seem to have gone by the wayside. I have an idea that I am working on to try to make sure that these things are not overlooked. I will post my idea in the next few days to get some feedback.

SideKick
11-30-2009, 11:58 AM
Would anyone object if I wrote Maureen Guidici a letter? I've asked about her a few times, but no one has replied if she has been contacted or not.

Hey Interested...


Did you ever write to Marureen Guidici? Excellent idea!

SK

iNTERESTEDWOMAN
11-30-2009, 07:15 PM
Hey Interested...


Did you ever write to Marureen Guidici? Excellent idea!

SK

Hello...yes, I did write to her 2 times, basically the same letter a month or so apart. (If I remember correctly) All I had was a snail mail address so I sent real letters in the mail, (with a stamp and everything...lol) to the address I had found on Ancestry or Veromi, (can't recall which). I included my name, address and phone number...and nothing. Never heard from her. I'm only guessing that it was an old address, or she didn't bother to reply.

I think about Anna a lot, and have saved a few of her pictures onto my slide show screen saver. Every time I see her sweet little face I always say a prayer for her. I wish I had more time to dedicate to Anna but unfortunately I don't have the time I once did.

Since I'm on here, I have a question that I always wanted to ask Annasmom. Were Anna's eyes a deep chocolate brown or were they lighter...more on the hazel side of brown?

Annasmom
11-30-2009, 10:06 PM
Hello...yes, I did write to her 2 times, basically the same letter a month or so apart. (If I remember correctly) All I had was a snail mail address so I sent real letters in the mail, (with a stamp and everything...lol) to the address I had found on Ancestry or Veromi, (can't recall which). I included my name, address and phone number...and nothing. Never heard from her. I'm only guessing that it was an old address, or she didn't bother to reply.

I think about Anna a lot, and have saved a few of her pictures onto my slide show screen saver. Every time I see her sweet little face I always say a prayer for her. I wish I had more time to dedicate to Anna but unfortunately I don't have the time I once did.

Since I'm on here, I have a question that I always wanted to ask Annasmom. Were Anna's eyes a deep chocolate brown or were they lighter...more on the hazel side of brown?
It's good to see you here again! Her eyes were a light brown.

SideKick
12-15-2009, 01:58 PM
http://whitepages.addresses.com/white_pages_city/39825.html

I searched Wanek in CA and a long list came up. Does anyone have a subscription to the whitepages? Apparently they also have DOB. If GW called Wanek shortly after Brody passed, maybe he called her because a W family member adopted Anna.

~ Just thinking!!

SK

Dr. Doogie
12-15-2009, 07:25 PM
I looked into this woman awhile ago, but cannot recall why I stopped. I do not believe that she has been ruled out.

http://slocea.org/Tracy%20Wanek.jpg

Does she look close enough to follow up on?

Cubby
12-15-2009, 09:01 PM
I looked into this woman awhile ago, but cannot recall why I stopped. I do not believe that she has been ruled out.

http://slocea.org/Tracy%20Wanek.jpg

Does she look close enough to follow up on?

She was ruled out. I don't remember why, but she was.... Doogie you ought to know I am the nit picky about the nit pickiest, lol. She was.... I will look over my the holiday break. I vaguelly remember she was married to someone or something like that....

Did anyone ever do an family tree on Evelyn and see about adoptee's that way?

C'

Dr. Doogie
12-15-2009, 09:13 PM
My mind may be going, but I think that we ruled out a different woman with the same name who lived in North Dakota. This one lives on the central coast of California and was raised in Southern California. I know that I have not contacted this woman but I have a way to contact her.

Cubby
12-15-2009, 09:51 PM
Give me between friday and two weeks for the break. I will look into this doogie.

Dr. Doogie
12-15-2009, 10:10 PM
Thanks! I think that this Wanek's birthday is March 1967, but there is another Wanek (same first name) with a September 1967 birthday who has lived in California (along with many other addresses). With this second Wanek, it may be a married name - she also uses the last name of "Moon".

SideKick
12-16-2009, 11:34 AM
She was ruled out. I don't remember why, but she was.... Doogie you ought to know I am the nit picky about the nit pickiest, lol. She was.... I will look over my the holiday break. I vaguelly remember she was married to someone or something like that....

Did anyone ever do an family tree on Evelyn and see about adoptee's that way?

C'

Cubby, good for you, you're memory is good! I cannot recall the details of this woman however I do recall her photo and seeing her on the web but without age related issues affecting memory, I can't remember why she was ruled out. Did someone contact her? She definitely resembles Anna and think we should go forward in contacting her again just to confirm for ourselves. Her bdate is close enuff to make one wonder.

SideKick
12-16-2009, 01:29 PM
Here we go again, such a coincidence to Annasmom as a musician.
I found a L.W. a violinist and member of Vintage Strings, she is in San Diego.

Attached is her photo

A founding member of Vintage Strings, L.W. completed her BA in Music from San Diego State University. While there, she studied with internationally known violinist M.G. Currently she is studying with H.C., concertmaster of the San Diego Symphony. Besides playing with Vintage Strings, L.W plays for local musical theater groups and orchestras. She has performed with members of the San Diego Symphony and other free lance groups in San Diego and Santa Barbara counties.

OzzieMum
12-16-2009, 04:22 PM
I looked into this woman awhile ago, but cannot recall why I stopped. I do not believe that she has been ruled out.

http://slocea.org/Tracy%20Wanek.jpg

Does she look close enough to follow up on?

Is there any other photo's of this lady? It looks to me like she has blue eyes. But that could just be my bad eye sight.

Annasmom
12-17-2009, 12:00 AM
Here we go again, such a coincidence to Annasmom as a musician.
I found a L.W. a violinist and member of Vintage Strings, she is in San Diego.

Attached is her photo

A founding member of Vintage Strings, L.W. completed her BA in Music from San Diego State University. While there, she studied with internationally known violinist Michael Gaisler. Currently she is studying with Hernan Constantino, concertmaster of the San Diego Symphony. Besides playing with Vintage Strings, L plays for local musical theater groups and orchestras. She has performed with members of the San Diego Symphony and other free lance groups in San Diego and Santa Barbara counties.
I googled her and found other pictures, but couldn't get them large enough to tell too much. She has light brown curly hair. The group was only formed last year, so they are all fairly young.

Dr. Doogie
12-17-2009, 04:25 AM
Just a quick note: Both of Anna's brothers are also musicians. Nonda is a respected drummer/percussionist and Ed is a former high school music teacher and primo pianist.

Cubby
12-17-2009, 10:32 AM
Is there any other photo's of this lady? It looks to me like she has blue eyes. But that could just be my bad eye sight.


Her eyes look blue to me too. I wondering if that is why we ruled her out a few years ago.

Cubby
12-25-2009, 01:27 PM
I googled her and found other pictures, but couldn't get them large enough to tell too much. She has light brown curly hair. The group was only formed last year, so they are all fairly young.


I found some additional info. I'd like another set of eyes to look.....

Google images - name in quotes. I found a picture of her as a violin teacher but because she is with her student, a child, in the picture I am hesitant to add a link. ( I am not able to crop it to post just her picture) This one can be zoomed in.... My initial impression is no, her chin is too square and shorter(?) than Anna's in the most recent age progressed. If anyone has trouble locating the picture pm me and I will send a link. I think she looks like she has a hint of Asian? .... hard to tell.

Age is close to correct, currently listed at 39.

Middle name is the same as an alternative Margaret Kukoda used....

Cubby
12-25-2009, 01:56 PM
Thanks! I think that this Wanek's birthday is March 1967, but there is another Wanek (same first name) with a September 1967 birthday who has lived in California (along with many other addresses). With this second Wanek, it may be a married name - she also uses the last name of "Moon".


Working on this now.

I found a post from way back discussing this: Her parents were divorced in 1968...... a little discussion starting from this post.
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Seaching for Anna, Part 2

IIRC, her eyes really looked blue. I remember you sent the link to the picture out via PM to those who requested it Doogie, rather than posting it on the forum.

I have not looked at veromi again, but will shortly. I think it may be possible her parents still appear to be living together as possible relatives if they both have some kind of public record documentation listing them as parents, even if they no longer reside together.

I don't know if I have mentioned it on this forum or not, but I recently became familiar with another search site, called integrascan.com While it is for background checks, it gives full possible address listings as part of the information provided to searchers to verify the correct person one is searching.

I'll do a cross check and update when I can... sneaking a bit of sleuthing in here and there today.

raf
12-25-2009, 05:43 PM
Is there any other photo's of this lady? It looks to me like she has blue eyes. But that could just be my bad eye sight.
here another picture
http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/dp0i3eGagk-A9SVUhshTEQ
and, frankly, seeming not Anna...........
raf

OzzieMum
12-26-2009, 05:31 AM
I found some additional info. I'd like another set of eyes to look.....

Google images - name in quotes. I found a picture of her as a violin teacher but because she is with her student, a child, in the picture I am hesitant to add a link. ( I am not able to crop it to post just her picture) This one can be zoomed in.... My initial impression is no, her chin is too square and shorter(?) than Anna's in the most recent age progressed. If anyone has trouble locating the picture pm me and I will send a link. I think she looks like she has a hint of Asian? .... hard to tell.

Age is close to correct, currently listed at 39.

Middle name is the same as an alternative Margaret Kukoda used....

I did a side by side of this lady and Anna's latest AP pic and I think there is enough of a resemblance the we need to make sure before ruling her out.

I agree that this lady's jaw does look more square but sometime the angle that a photo is taken on can alter the shape of someone's face.

SideKick
12-26-2009, 08:34 AM
I did a side by side of this lady and Anna's latest AP pic and I think there is enough of a resemblance the we need to make sure before ruling her out.

I agree that this lady's jaw does look more square but sometime the angle that a photo is taken on can alter the shape of someone's face.

Ok, well oddly enuff, this photo is smack on to me. If you take Anna's photo of her coming out of the outhouse with her white sweater on, put it beside this photo, the resemblance is remarkable.

Her jaw line is indeed square but who's to say Anna's jaw wouldn't be? I know the age progression photo of Anna displays a narrow face however, I think she should be looked into as well. I cannot verify if her eyes are blue or brown.

raf
12-26-2009, 01:26 PM
here it are the email address of L.W. private violin teacher
http://www.sandiegocyo.org/Instrument/Report-Private%20Teacher%20Violin.pdf
maybe a contact.. it could be helpful...
raf

Cubby
12-26-2009, 01:35 PM
Ok, well oddly enuff, this photo is smack on to me. If you take Anna's photo of her coming out of the outhouse with her white sweater on, put it beside this photo, the resemblance is remarkable.

Her jaw line is indeed square but who's to say Anna's jaw wouldn't be? I know the age progression photo of Anna displays a narrow face however, I think she should be looked into as well. I cannot verify if her eyes are blue or brown.


I was able to zoom in on the photo raf linked ( but I was able to zoom from the cached google images link, not rafs link as provided). Same one I found... The eyes are clearly a light brown with kind of a hazelish tint but definately light brown. IIRC, Annasmom recently posted Anna had light brown eyes when asked to describe the color brown.

I also agree it was difficult to tell based on the photo angle which is why I asked for more eyes. :)

ETA: I think the violin teacher looks petite and thin.... she looks 'smaller than average' in the chair based on the chair size. Compared to the chairs at the table, the one she is sitting in does not look oversized. jmo for additional thoughts....

I agree we need to look further. Can anyone tell if she is related to the Evelyn Wanek GW knew? If there is no direct link to this Wanek and Evelyn, I think we can safely rule her out. Thoughts?

ETA again: I also think there is something distinctive about the violin teachers eyes, if anyone can pull up the photo and zoom closer..... what are your thoughts about her eyes compared to Anna's eyes? For me there is enough of a resemblence there too, but it is hard to tell....

SideKick
12-26-2009, 04:42 PM
I was able to zoom in on the photo raf linked ( but I was able to zoom from the cached google images link, not rafs link as provided). Same one I found... The eyes are clearly a light brown with kind of a hazelish tint but definately light brown. IIRC, Annasmom recently posted Anna had light brown eyes when asked to describe the color brown.

I also agree it was difficult to tell based on the photo angle which is why I asked for more eyes. :)

ETA: I think the violin teacher looks petite and thin.... she looks 'smaller than average' in the chair based on the chair size. Compared to the chairs at the table, the one she is sitting in does not look oversized. jmo for additional thoughts....

I agree we need to look further. Can anyone tell if she is related to the Evelyn Wanek GW knew? If there is no direct link to this Wanek and Evelyn, I think we can safely rule her out. Thoughts?

ETA again: I also think there is something distinctive about the violin teachers eyes, if anyone can pull up the photo and zoom closer..... what are your thoughts about her eyes compared to Anna's eyes? For me there is enough of a resemblence there too, but it is hard to tell....


Uhmm.. I agree with you Cubby. Where did this photo originate from? I found this:
L.W.
City: Encinitas CA- United States of America
Location: Map it!
Offering: Private Lessons, Performing, Special Events, Recording
Lessons: violin, piano
Music: classical, celtic, fiddle

http://www.privatelessons.com/daypoint/media/editsnapshot.asp?mode=view&showmail=true&userid=5156

Annasmom
12-26-2009, 04:57 PM
Uhmm.. I agree with you Cubby. Where did this photo originate from? I found this:
L.W.
City: Encinitas CA- United States of America
Location: Map it!
Offering: Private Lessons, Performing, Special Events, Recording
Lessons: violin, piano
Music: classical, celtic, fiddle

http://www.privatelessons.com/daypoint/media/editsnapshot.asp?mode=view&showmail=true&userid=5156
The first time I looked at this photo, I didn't think I saw much resemblance, but now that I've printed it out and looked more closely, I think it really justified more research. Anna resembled her father more than she did me, and this woman has the rather small chin, the brown (I think) eyes, the sandy-colored hair.

Cubby
12-26-2009, 05:19 PM
Let's see if I can get a different link to this picture working so it can be zoomed easier.

http://lh4.ggpht.com/__S33Cw4wzBw/SKdnE4cJe1I/AAAAAAAABEI/AjvtKNW8SqQ/2008-08-16+Nectarines+and+Violin+-+003.JPG

Ok, open for regular size, click once to zoom after opening. (then one can still further zoom to enlarge but the clarity decreases with size.)
both raf and I found this via google image search.

Cubby
12-26-2009, 05:23 PM
The first time I looked at this photo, I didn't think I saw much resemblance, but now that I've printed it out and looked more closely, I think it really justified more research. Anna resembled her father more than she did me, and this woman has the rather small chin, the brown (I think) eyes, the sandy-colored hair.


The hair is highlighted, but the natural color still, imo, looks like the dark blonde, or a brown color which is the normal change from a blonde child to a darker haired adult.

Cubby
12-26-2009, 05:30 PM
Uhmm.. I agree with you Cubby. Where did this photo originate from? I found this:
L.W.
City: Encinitas CA- United States of America
Location: Map it!
Offering: Private Lessons, Performing, Special Events, Recording
Lessons: violin, piano
Music: classical, celtic, fiddle

http://www.privatelessons.com/daypoint/media/editsnapshot.asp?mode=view&showmail=true&userid=5156


She's tiny. Imo, either the kid is off the charts on the growth charts, or more likely, he is an average size child and she doesn't look like she is more than 6"-7" or so taller than him. -

Annasmom, was anyone in GW's family tiny? I know in the past we thought Anna would be taller, but honestly, I've seen in families it can go both ways with ancesters well below and well above average hts. It's just the pick of the genes, so it is possible Anna could have grown up to be a tiny petite adult.

ETA: This woman is in the San Diego area. IIRC, Evelyn Wanek was in the SD area also..... not that it necessarily means they are related, but still a step in the right direction.

Can someone who has the ancestry stuff see if they can link this woman to Evelyns family tree?

Cubby
12-26-2009, 05:38 PM
Annasmom,

remember a long time ago I asked if you happen to have Annas medical records or baby book around and I asked if you have her ht for her 2nd birthday?

My adult ht is almost exactly double my ht at my 2 yr check up. (Yes, I still have my baby book.) I was taller as a child, 5"2" by the time I was 10, but am just under 5'6" now.

If you happen to have it easily available, or when you have time, it might be worth checking Annas 2 yr ht, and doubling it for a somewhat scientific estimate of her adult ht.

Also, the other measure they use to determine within 2" of adult ht, is to take both the mothers adult ht. and the fathers adult ht. Add them and then divide them by 2 for a boy. Dang I am gonna have to go find the calculations for a girl and see if they are the same.

OzzieMum
12-26-2009, 07:58 PM
Annasmom,

remember a long time ago I asked if you happen to have Annas medical records or baby book around and I asked if you have her ht for her 2nd birthday?

My adult ht is almost exactly double my ht at my 2 yr check up. (Yes, I still have my baby book.) I was taller as a child, 5"2" by the time I was 10, but am just under 5'6" now.

If you happen to have it easily available, or when you have time, it might be worth checking Annas 2 yr ht, and doubling it for a somewhat scientific estimate of her adult ht.

Also, the other measure they use to determine within 2" of adult ht, is to take both the mothers adult ht. and the fathers adult ht. Add them and then divide them by 2 for a boy. Dang I am gonna have to go find the calculations for a girl and see if they are the same.

Hi Cubby,

When my girls were little, the "rule of thumb" for adult height was, take a boy's height at 2 and double it and a girl's height at 18 months and double it and that would give you a rough idea of what their adult height would be. This did not prove to be true with my girls.

The other measure you pointed out also doesn't work in my family as my Mum was 5'2" and my Dad 5' 10", this does work out for my 2 sisters that are both 5' 4" (or 5") yet I am only 5' 2" (and that's when I stand up really tall and straight).

It really is difficult to judge a child's adult height.

I did spend some time on ancestry yesterday and nothing really jumped out at me. Does anyone know what this lady's middle name is? That would make it easier research her on ancestry.

Cubby
12-26-2009, 08:38 PM
You're right, you refreshed my memory, I think it was 18 mo's. Whatever it was, it was right on the money for my adult ht.

I will pm you the middle name.

Cubby
12-26-2009, 08:45 PM
I just did the integrascan check..... her birth year is 1970. Could be she is too young to be Anna.

SideKick
12-26-2009, 09:46 PM
I just did the integrascan check..... her birth year is 1970. Could be she is too young to be Anna.

Hi Cubby!

Sorry, what is an integrascan?

thanks

Cubby
12-26-2009, 09:55 PM
integrascan.com a background search engine which lists addresses for potential search free, as an option to verify the user has the right person they are searching.

SideKick
12-26-2009, 10:16 PM
integrascan.com a background search engine which lists addresses for potential search free, as an option to verify the user has the right person they are searching.

I see, thanks. I am not sure what other people would say about her age, in my opinion, I think that 1970 is close enough to 1967 to consider. Let's say the W's adopted Anna, they could have changed her birth year, it's not a far fetched idea considering the magnitude of this entire situation we're dealing with here. The only thing is they can't change a birth certificate, she must have one, in that regard I'm stumped....

Uhmm...

OzzieMum
12-26-2009, 10:27 PM
I see, thanks. I am not sure what other people would say about her age, in my opinion, I think that 1970 is close enough to 1967 to consider. Let's say the W's adopted Anna, they could have changed her birth year, it's not a far fetched idea considering the magnitude of this entire situation we're dealing with here. The only thing is they can't change a birth certificate, she must have one, in that regard I'm stumped....

Uhmm...

I agree, 1970 is close enough for me. As we've discussed before, they could have got a fake birth cert for her.

Is there any way to do a search to find out if she has a SSN? And if so does that give any details of age etc?

SideKick
12-26-2009, 10:44 PM
I agree, 1970 is close enough for me. As we've discussed before, they could have got a fake birth cert for her.

Is there any way to do a search to find out if she has a SSN? And if so does that give any details of age etc?


Veromi ~
Looking at L.W. in Veromi, potential parents are now 68 and 69 yrs old, in 1973, they would have been 29ish... we have to somehow link L to Evelyn because that is the initial connection unless Evelyn passed her on to other Waneks..

Is there anyone who can put a side by side photo of Anna and L on here?

OzzieMum
12-26-2009, 10:58 PM
Veromi ~
Looking at L.W. in Veromi, potential parents are now 68 and 69 yrs old, in 1973, they would have been 29ish... we have to somehow link L to Evelyn because that is the initial connection unless Evelyn passed her on to other Waneks..

Is there anyone who can put a side by side photo of Anna and L on here?

Hi SideKick,

What are the parents names. PM me if you don't want to post them. I can check them on ancestry.

SideKick
12-26-2009, 11:22 PM
P.M.. and P.L.

SideKick
12-26-2009, 11:26 PM
Hi SideKick,

What are the parents names. PM me if you don't want to post them. I can check them on ancestry.

Just to confirm, is this the same L.W. I posted earlier, the musician in the vintage strings band?

OzzieMum
12-27-2009, 12:06 AM
Just to confirm, is this the same L Wanek I posted earlier, the musician in the vintage strings band?

Hi SideKick,

Yes, it's the L.W. from vintage strings that we are looking at but the pic you posted looks to be a different person. Where did you get that pic from? Have you looked at the pic that Raf posted the link to? And also the pic on vintage strings website.

SideKick
12-27-2009, 08:28 AM
Hi SideKick,

Yes, it's the L.W. from vintage strings that we are looking at but the pic you posted looks to be a different person. Where did you get that pic from? Have you looked at the pic that Raf posted the link to? And also the pic on vintage strings website.

Ozziemum, yes I looked at both but they didn't look the same to me therefore my question. I thought the L in the band had bangs and glasses, but I'll look again. Busy season!! LOL

Thank you! x

Annasmom
12-27-2009, 02:11 PM
WebSleuths, all the Wanek stuff is coming up on Google search, so I recommend that we refer to this young woman by her initials only. I have found one post in which she recalls kindergarten memories; she apparently has brothers and sometimes wears glasses. She is registered for an August wedding. Until we get some possible link to Evelyn, it seems that it's unlikely that she would be Anna, but wouldn't it be fantastic if she was? Regarding height: You can't really tell from the photo's perspective. In pictures of her playing, she appears to be average height, about 5'6", which would fit with the family profile (average to tall).

Cubby
12-27-2009, 03:57 PM
You are right Annasmom. I will notify a mod so they can edit the full name out to initials only. We should have done that to begin with.......

OzzieMum
12-27-2009, 07:42 PM
WebSleuths, all the Wanek stuff is coming up on Google search, so I recommend that we refer to this young woman by her initials only. I have found one post in which she recalls kindergarten memories; she apparently has brothers and sometimes wears glasses. She is registered for an August wedding. Until we get some possible link to Evelyn, it seems that it's unlikely that she would be Anna, but wouldn't it be fantastic if she was? Regarding height: You can't really tell from the photo's perspective. In pictures of her playing, she appears to be average height, about 5'6", which would fit with the family profile (average to tall).

Good call Annasmom. I was thinking the same thing yesterday.

OzzieMum
12-27-2009, 08:10 PM
Ozziemum, yes I looked at both but they didn't look the same to me therefore my question. I thought the L in the band had bangs and glasses, but I'll look again. Busy season!! LOL

Thank you! x

Hi SideKick,

I got a bit confused with the photo's. I researched LW all day yesterday and also went back and re-read this entire thread. I think the photo of LW on the vintage strings website and the photo of LW the teacher are the same person. I think the photo on vintage strings may have been taken some time ago, when she was younger. I was getting confused with the photo of the lady ruled out (the one we thought had blue eyes).

I did find the parents, PM and PL on ancestry (marriage record) but just to add to the confusion, there is another LW (LRW) who is a lawyer in the same area and I haven't been able to verify if PM and PL are her parents or the parents of the LW we are looking at.

Interestedwoman posted some fantastic info early in this thread (post #10) and I looked up all of the people in the post on ancestry. There is no one that Evelyn could have given Anna to in her immediate family and have her retain the surname of Wanek. Evelyn only had 2 sisters, Florance and Lorreta. I can't find anything to show that Florance ever got married and had children. Lorreta did get married and had 2 children but if Anna was given to one of them her surname would not be Wanek.

The only way I can see that Anna would have the surname of Wanek would be if she was given to a son of a brother to Evelyn's father (or some other more distant relative). So far, I have not been able to confirm what siblings Evelyn's father had, but I will keep looking.

Bottom line is that I can't find any way to link LW to Evelyn and I think the only way this is going to be possible is to contact LW and ask her.

Cubby
12-27-2009, 09:17 PM
thanks Ozziemum,...

I'd like to add to your theory. The possibility still exists that Anna could have been given to a single mother and retained the mothers surname. I'm a single mom and my son has my last name, not his dads last name........

OzzieMum
12-27-2009, 09:39 PM
thanks Ozziemum,...

I'd like to add to your theory. The possibility still exists that Anna could have been given to a single mother and retained the mothers surname. I'm a single mom and my son has my last name, not his dads last name........

Hi Cubby,

This is true and I thought about that too however, back then, unlike today, single parenthood was still pretty much frowned upon, not that it was unheard of. So I guess we still have to take it into consideration as a possibility.

Julessleuther
12-28-2009, 03:10 AM
I have an ancestry account, so will look into Evelyn's geneology.

Off topic, I missed before that Evelyn said that she knew GW as Jack Wolf(e). Has anyone ever looked into this? I wonder if she meant that GB was Jack Wolf? Why would she know him as another name? I did a quick ancestry.com search and there is a Jack Wolf who lived in San Fran. in the 1930's. It says he was born in Germany in 1903, but it also appears he lived in NJ at some point in time too. Anything I should pursue more? There are actually several Jack Wolfs, but this one caught my eye because of the SF connection. There was also several Jack Wolfe's, including one born in 1909 in Los Angeles.

Also O/T: Has anyone noticed that Margaret referred to him as Bobby, Evelyn knew GW as Jack, and GB was supposedly from Mass....just like the Kennedy's?

OzzieMum
12-28-2009, 06:14 AM
I have an ancestry account, so will look into Evelyn's geneology.

Off topic, I missed before that Evelyn said that she knew GW as Jack Wolf(e). Has anyone ever looked into this? I wonder if she meant that GB was Jack Wolf? Why would she know him as another name? I did a quick ancestry.com search and there is a Jack Wolf who lived in San Fran. in the 1930's. It says he was born in Germany in 1903, but it also appears he lived in NJ at some point in time too. Anything I should pursue more? There are actually several Jack Wolfs, but this one caught my eye because of the SF connection. There was also several Jack Wolfe's, including one born in 1909 in Los Angeles.

Also O/T: Has anyone noticed that Margaret referred to him as Bobby, Evelyn knew GW as Jack, and GB was supposedly from Mass....just like the Kennedy's?

Hi Julessleuther,

I and some others have already researched Evelyn and I re-checked ancestry yesterday and there is nothing new, but feel free to check again (never know if any of us might miss something that someone else might pick up).

Interesting idea that GB might have been Jack Wolf (e) and not GW. Not quite sure who you are saying that Margaret referred to as Bobby but it was GB.

OzzieMum
12-28-2009, 06:45 AM
Hi again Julessleuther,

I want to do some research into Evelyn's fathers family but I haven't had time today and I go back to work tomorrow :( and I was wondering if you might have time to look into this on ancestry?

Evelyn's father's name was Joseph M Wanek and her mother was Barbara (or Barbora) and they were both born in Bohemia (according to US census) but I am not sure if that is Bohemia, Czech Republic or one of the places in the US called Bohemia (I think it is probably the Czech Republic but could be wrong).

Interestedwoman has a post in this thread (post #10) with all the info on Evelyn's immediate family. She refers to a sister of Evelyn's that died and I'm thinking it may have been Florance.

The reason I am interested in Evelyn's father's side of the family is because of the LW we are looking at.

raf
12-28-2009, 01:19 PM
WebSleuths, all the Wanek stuff is coming up on Google search, so I recommend that we refer to this young woman by her initials only. I have found one post in which she recalls kindergarten memories; she apparently has brothers and sometimes wears glasses. She is registered for an August wedding. Until we get some possible link to Evelyn, it seems that it's unlikely that she would be Anna, but wouldn't it be fantastic if she was? Regarding height: You can't really tell from the photo's perspective. In pictures of her playing, she appears to be average height, about 5'6", which would fit with the family profile (average to tall).

You are right!
Thanks,
raf

raf
12-28-2009, 01:56 PM
Hi again Julessleuther,

I want to do some research into Evelyn's fathers family but I haven't had time today and I go back to work tomorrow :( and I was wondering if you might have time to look into this on ancestry?

Evelyn's father's name was Joseph M Wanek and her mother was Barbara (or Barbora) and they were both born in Bohemia (according to US census) but I am not sure if that is Bohemia, Czech Republic or one of the places in the US called Bohemia (I think it is probably the Czech Republic but could be wrong).

Interestedwoman has a post in this thread (post #10) with all the info on Evelyn's immediate family. She refers to a sister of Evelyn's that died and I'm thinking it may have been Florance.

The reason I am interested in Evelyn's father's side of the family is because of the LW we are looking at.
Hi,

-Joseph M Wanek on 1910 census declaring that he was born in Nebraska (??) by austrian parents;

1910 United States Federal Census about Joseph M Wanek
Name: Joseph M Wanek
Age in 1910: 34
Estimated birth year: abt 1876
Birthplace: Nebraska
Relation to Head of House: Head
Father's Birth Place: Austria
Mother's Birth Place: Austria
Spouse's name: Barbara
Home in 1910: Summit, Richland, North Dakota
Marital Status: Married
Race: White
Gender: Male
Neighbors: View others on page

Household Members: Name Age
Joseph M Wanek
34
Barbara Wanek
27
Florence Wanek
5
Evelyn Wanek 4
Nick Matuska
25
[15]

-in 1920 census Joseph M Wanek declaring that was born in Wisconsin from bohemian parents;
1920 United States Federal Census about M Joe Wanek
Name: M Joe Wanek
Home in 1920: Summit, Richland, North Dakota
Age: 46 years

Estimated birth year: abt 1874
Birthplace: Wisconsin
Relation to Head of House: Head
Spouse's name: Barbara
Father's Birth Place: Bohemia
Mother's Birth Place: Bohemia
Marital Status: Married
Race: White
Sex: Male
Home owned: Rent
Able to read: Yes
Able to Write: Yes
Image: 729
Neighbors: View others on page

Household Members: Name Age
M Joe Wanek
46
Barbara Wanek
36
M Florence Wanek
13
R Evelyn Wanek
13
F Loretta Wanek
8


-in WWI draft registration card only : native born
World War I Draft Registration Cards, 1917-1918 about Joe M Wanek
Name: Joe M Wanek
County: Richland
State: North Dakota
Birth Date: 27 Jan 1873
Race: White
FHL Roll Number: 1819453
farmer, next of kin: wife Barbara

-in 1930 census again born in Wisconsin...
1930 United States Federal Census about Joseph Wanek
Name: Joseph Wanek
Home in 1930: Wahpeton, Richland, North Dakota
View Map

Age: 56

Estimated birth year: abt 1874
Birthplace: Wisconsin
Relation to Head of House: Head
Spouse's name: Barbora
Race: White
Occupation:

Education:

Military service:

Rent/home value:

Age at first marriage:

Parents' birthplace:
View image

Neighbors: View others on page

Household Members: Name Age
Joseph Wanek
56
Barbora Wanek
48
Evelyn Wanek
24
Laretta Wanek
18
Frank Zitka
62


-In 1905 Minnesota census the birthplace is the Wisconsin:
Minnesota Territorial and State Censuses, 1849-1905
about Joseph M Wanek
Name: Joseph M Wanek
Census Date: 20 Jun 1905
County: Wilkin
Locality: Breckenridge
Birth Location: Wisconsin
Gender: Male
Estimated birth year: abt 1873
Race: White
Father's Birth Location: Bohemia
Mother's Birth Location: Bohemia
Roll: MNSC_162

Evelyn was born in Minnesota also... however Joseph M Wanek died in San Francisco, CA:

Death Index
Name: Joe M. Wanek
Birth: 27 Jan 1873
Death: 15 Apr 1972 - San Francisco, San Francisco, California, United States of America
Civil: Minnesota

California Death Index, 1940-1997
about Joseph Wanek
Name: Joseph Wanek
Social Security XXXXXXXXXXXX
Sex: MALE
Birth Date: 27 Jan 1873
Birthplace: Wisconsin
Death Date: 13 Apr 1972
Death Place: San Francisco

all the best,
raf

spikydragon
12-28-2009, 02:13 PM
If I remember history correctly, there's no contradiction between Bohemia/Austria/Czechoslovakia; the CZ Republic (that Bohemia was then part of) was founded in 1918, and before that, Bohemia was part of Austria.

Julessleuther
01-01-2010, 04:21 AM
Thanks Raf---I did not get back here in time. I wonder if there is a chance that GB was a relative of Evelyns, considering GW called her after he died...

OzzieMum
01-01-2010, 06:23 AM
Thanks Raf---I did not get back here in time. I wonder if there is a chance that GB was a relative of Evelyns, considering GW called her after he died...

Good point Julessleuther.

I've also been wondering if there was any connection between Evelyn and Margaret K. Margaret was a nurse and Evelyn was in to alternative medicine. This could be how GB met Margaret.

Skully
01-01-2010, 02:53 PM
Good point Julessleuther.

I've also been wondering if there was any connection between Evelyn and Margaret K. Margaret was a nurse and Evelyn was in to alternative medicine. This could be how GB met Margaret.

That would make a lot of sense. Usually someone will call a family member when a relative dies. I am new to the thread and have been reading and got "searching for Anna" and read it also. trying to catch up.

Is Evelyn and Joe both deceased? If so any signs of children? Or other relatives? I am assuming you are trying to find some link so you can contact them to see if they can be of some help.

Skully
01-09-2010, 03:41 PM
I decided to do a people search on Evelyn W and found one who would be 99 in Green Bay, WI

I found another name that was listed as possible relatives ( Germaine Ettien age 74) and put it in and found an Anne M Wanek, age 45.

One of her names is Ettien, reminded me of Effie.
the stranger part is this woman went by

Lynn A E.
Adreinne L E.
Adrienne L. E.
Adrienne L Ettienives
Ives, Lynn
Adreinne L Ives,
Adrienne L Ives,
Anne M Wanek

So maybe Wanek is the maiden name, the others married names. But the Ettien caught my eye.

Not sure if this is going anywhere, but I wanted to see what others think and if it is worth perusing.

I put in E W for CA and nothing comes up for her. I don't know why yet.

Skully
01-09-2010, 08:34 PM
I had a question about the day Joe spoke with Evelyn. Did she ever say why GW called her? Was it to say GB had died? Did she give any useful information about the relationship between her and the two Georges? A 40 minute call is a bit of a chat, how was it discovered, by phone records?

Skully
01-09-2010, 09:23 PM
I found Adrienne E on face book. I emailed her and ask if she had a family member by the name of E W in the 70's to 80's that ran a health care studio in Ca at 967 Sutter Street. I ask her if she would check with family members as this woman is deceased and she may have not know her personally. I told her I was looking for information about a friend of hers that she may have know during that time period. If this is not the family it rules out one thing or place for us.

Possible Relatives on her name search

Frank W age 96
Evelyn W age 99
Germaine E age 74
herself
Lynn I
Eric I

all from Green Bay WI
De Pere WI
New Franken, WI

If this is the family :woohoo:

Annasmom
01-09-2010, 10:02 PM
I had a question about the day Joe spoke with Evelyn. Did she ever say why GW called her? Was it to say GB had died? Did she give any useful information about the relationship between her and the two Georges? A 40 minute call is a bit of a chat, how was it discovered, by phone records? All I have to go on are Joe's notes. On Jan 29, 1982, he called 355-6185 (it would have been area code 415 in those days, but the 355 numbers were and still are Pacifica), the number on GW's bill that showed the 40-minute conversation. Joe writes "Health studio in Pacifica. Lady answers. Name: Evelyn Wanick sp? Knew Geo. Brody as Brody G.W. as "Jack Wolf" - colon therapy - massage therapy". That's all Joe wrote, and I doubt he remembers more than this, since he called all the numbers on the phone bill way back then. Those people are listed somewhere on the forum; most of the numbers seemed to be work-related.

Julessleuther
01-09-2010, 10:35 PM
It is interesting to me that she would know GW as Jack Wolf, because GW was a practicing physician---she very easily could have found out his real name, so why did he use a fake name? M ost curious...
All I have to go on are Joe's notes. On Jan 29, 1982, he called 355-6185 (it would have been area code 415 in those days, but the 355 numbers were and still are Pacifica), the number on GW's bill that showed the 40-minute conversation. Joe writes "Health studio in Pacifica. Lady answers. Name: Evelyn Wanick sp? Knew Geo. Brody as Brody G.W. as "Jack Wolf" - colon therapy - massage therapy". That's all Joe wrote, and I doubt he remembers more than this, since he called all the numbers on the phone bill way back then. Those people are listed somewhere on the forum; most of the numbers seemed to be work-related.

Skully
01-09-2010, 10:57 PM
It is interesting to me that she would know GW as Jack Wolf, because GW was a practicing physician---she very easily could have found out his real name, so why did he use a fake name? M ost curious...

Maybe if she was a contact of sorts, he went by Jack Wolf because when Anna's disappearance hit the papers he didn't want her to put two and two together. I am convinced there is a trail because they had to know people to pass her off too and had to have people to help, so there is a trail, we just have to dig.

Cubby
01-19-2010, 12:31 PM
I've always thought GW used George Wolfe because he didn't want Evelyn to know he was a physician. I've had the impression he would not have been comfortable sharing such personal details of his life which she could have probably verified easily at the time given licensing standards and access to those having state licenses, in addition to the two G's being so private and the possibility Bern suggested.

JMO

Cubby
01-19-2010, 12:33 PM
Question about Evelyn. Do we know if Evelyn always resided in Pacifica? Did we ever do a city history for her? I'm curious to know if she resided in any other cities which they were and if that makes anything stand out to us.

thanks!

Skully
01-20-2010, 03:03 PM
Question about Evelyn. Do we know if Evelyn always resided in Pacifica? Did we ever do a city history for her? I'm curious to know if she resided in any other cities which they were and if that makes anything stand out to us.

thanks!

Cubby,

I can't remember, is this woman deceased? I posted on another thread that I did a name search on her and I did find on in Pacifica. I am wondering if I should get the background search on her. I don't get an age or possible relatives, but if this is the right one, we may get a lead on her family.

SideKick
01-20-2010, 03:28 PM
See Post #10

Self: Evelyn R. b. 2-11-1906 d.12-31-1992 (San Mateo CA)

:-)

Cubby
01-20-2010, 07:49 PM
See Post #10

Self: Evelyn R. b. 2-11-1906 d.12-31-1992 (San Mateo CA)

:-)


Thanks. IIRC she never married and records did not indicate she had children. Most of the family info is within the thread here I believe.... if not, do a WS search of the name in this forum for the info on EW. I think she had some siblings and last I recall not sure if their children were searched or not..... or, IIRC, the few people we had found that might have been possible matches, I am unsure if we linked them as relatives to EW or not. I read more than I did research on EW because at the time a few others were doing that research.

hth

Skully
01-22-2010, 04:14 PM
Are we still interested in finding her family or friends? I found one EW, no age displayed but for Pacifia CA. If it sounds like it is worth looking into I will.

I have two to choose from, one in Pacifica and one in San Franciso. I did a small one on the one from Pacifica and got an address but no phone number or age. So I don't know if this is the right one to do a background check on?????

Cubby
01-22-2010, 05:05 PM
She was the one in Pacifica IIRC. I thought I posted somewhere.... that the discussion on Evelyn was started back in searching for Anna part 2 (IIRC). I think we were unable to find any relatives of hers who had offspring that were adopted that would have matched a possible Anna.

What we were basically unsure of is what the relationship was between her and the two G's. She had a patent for something too that we found.... I'd kind of put this off to the side for a lul time to further research.... JMO

and thank you!

SideKick
01-22-2010, 05:11 PM
[QUOTE=Bern;4717576]Are we still interested in finding her family or friends? I found one EW, no age displayed but for Pacifia CA. If it sounds like it is worth looking into I will.

Bringing back from the beginning of the EW Thread which Interested posted:

A little more genealogical information on Evelyn Wanek

Maybe Joe Ford or Annasmom will reconize a name.

According US census records Evelyn's family lived in North Dakota from at least 1910 to 1930. Death records show her mother, father, and at least one sister also died in CA

Father: Joseph M. Wanek b. 1-27-1873 d. 4-15-1972 (SF CA)
Mother: Barbara (Matuska) b. 6-27-1883 d. 11-30-1981 (SF CA)
Sister: Florence M. b.1905
Self: Evelyn R. b. 2-11-1906 d.12-31-1992 (San Mateo CA)
Sister: Loretta F. (Guidici) b. 10-25-1911 d. 10-19-1995 (Santa Cruz CA)

I haven't been able to trace info on older sister Florence yet

Loretta Frances Wanek married Peter Guidici (both deceased)
children:
David Charles Guidici b.5-16-42 d.10-27-81 (San Mateo CA)
Maureen C. Guidici b.12-7-37 IIRC, we were trying to track down Maureen Guidici, she is Evelyn's neice. See above.

Maureen is still living, married twice, and appears to have a couple step-children, none of her own. If Anna was given to a Wanek family member, Maureen would be a possible choice. IMHO. There was a (now 40 year old) woman living in their household at one time. I believe she was the wife of a step son.

Evelyn's uncle Nick Matuska (b.10-11-1883 d.3-28-1965 Wilkin, MN) lived with the Wanek family for several years. Uncle Nick married in 1911 to Wilma and had 3 daughters (one named Evelyn) and 2 sons in ND by 1930. Not sure when he moved to MN, but his children would all be about the right age to receive a child Anna's age. Nick's WWI draft info lists him as medium height, blue eyes and brown hair

A man by the name of Frank Zitka (b.1868) lived with the Wanek family as a lodger or a servant in the 1930's

Skully
01-22-2010, 08:33 PM
Do you know what her married name is now? I did a name search on Maureen G and nothing..... So if I can get a little more to go on maybe we can find her.

SideKick
01-27-2010, 03:11 PM
Do you know what her married name is now? I did a name search on Maureen G and nothing..... So if I can get a little more to go on maybe we can find her.

~

On Veromi there is a Guidici living in Redwood CA, IIRC, this is the last city EW lived. Correct me if I am wrong. There are, as you may well be aware, several Guidici's in CA. Is there anyone on the westcoast who has an account to call some of these folks and ask if they are related to EW? or better yet, the Guidici's related to the Waneks?

All we need is one person who may recall their Aunt Evelyn..... and have the info we are looking for.

Thanku!

yosande
02-07-2010, 07:21 AM
[quote=Bern;4717576]Are we still interested in finding her family or friends? I found one EW, no age displayed but for Pacifia CA. If it sounds like it is worth looking into I will.

Bringing back from the beginning of the EW Thread which Interested posted:

A little more genealogical information on Evelyn Wanek

Maybe Joe Ford or Annasmom will reconize a name.

According US census records Evelyn's family lived in North Dakota from at least 1910 to 1930. Death records show her mother, father, and at least one sister also died in CA

Father: Joseph M. Wanek b. 1-27-1873 d. 4-15-1972 (SF CA)
Mother: Barbara (Matuska) b. 6-27-1883 d. 11-30-1981 (SF CA)
Sister: Florence M. b.1905
Self: Evelyn R. b. 2-11-1906 d.12-31-1992 (San Mateo CA)
Sister: Loretta F. (Guidici) b. 10-25-1911 d. 10-19-1995 (Santa Cruz CA)

I haven't been able to trace info on older sister Florence yet

Loretta Frances Wanek married Peter Guidici (both deceased)
children:
David Charles Guidici b.5-16-42 d.10-27-81 (San Mateo CA)
Maureen C. Guidici b.12-7-37 IIRC, we were trying to track down Maureen Guidici, she is Evelyn's neice. See above.

Maureen is still living, married twice, and appears to have a couple step-children, none of her own. If Anna was given to a Wanek family member, Maureen would be a possible choice. IMHO. There was a (now 40 year old) woman living in their household at one time. I believe she was the wife of a step son.

Evelyn's uncle Nick Matuska (b.10-11-1883 d.3-28-1965 Wilkin, MN) lived with the Wanek family for several years. Uncle Nick married in 1911 to Wilma and had 3 daughters (one named Evelyn) and 2 sons in ND by 1930. Not sure when he moved to MN, but his children would all be about the right age to receive a child Anna's age. Nick's WWI draft info lists him as medium height, blue eyes and brown hair

A man by the name of Frank Zitka (b.1868) lived with the Wanek family as a lodger or a servant in the 1930's

This post should be cleaned as it is using full names, but that's not why I quoted it.....

Since Nick M is EW's uncle, perhaps Frank Z is also related.
Has anyone done some digging into who this person is?
He would have been in his seventies when he lodged with the W family.
Perhaps a great uncle or a maternal grandfather of Barbara W, who is EW's mother?

What was the reason the W Family moved to Calif?
Did they move there before, after, or at the same time as EW, who iirc was first noted as being in Calif in 1958, and does it even matter? If EW was a next of kin to GB, then perhaps it is.
tia

Odyssey
02-07-2010, 01:02 PM
I found it interesting that EW knew Brody as living at 1156 Sutter (Otis Hotel) and that she knew GW (Jack Wolf) to be living at 630 Geary. The reason I find this strange is that GB was at 1156 Sutter as early as 1967 - that was the address where he received the premium notice for MK while MK was sick. GB supposedly lived with MK at 1006 Noe at this time, but the premium was mailed to 1156 Sutter.

GW lived at 630 Geary in 1972-1973, and lived at home with his family for at least part of 1967 I believe.. that is when Annasmom met GB.

This leads me to believe that GB knew EW before GW did....

raf
02-07-2010, 01:59 PM
I know not if can help, but EW addresses in SF:
1943-nurse h1025 Sutter
1948/9-mgr Nine Sixty Seven Sutter Health Studio r1025 Sutter ; same years also: 967 Sutter
....
1970- Westlake Physical Therapy 967 Sutter and ditto, Nine Sixty Seven Sutter Health Studio

so very near at 1156 Sutter .....

in 1970 in SF, 1156 Sutter :

Otis Hotel



all the best,
raf

Cubby
02-07-2010, 05:08 PM
When someone is deceased we have been using full names. I'll ask Tricia if that is appropriate or if we should be using initials with ancestry records we find on people who are no longer living. As far as I know we have only been using initials for people who are still living to protect their privacy.

Will post what I find out.

Cubby
02-08-2010, 01:52 AM
I confirmed with Tricia full names are OK if the person is deceased.
Hope this clarifies any confusion.

SideKick
02-08-2010, 04:49 PM
This is Evelyn R Wanek's irrigation devise. Ok Ok.. at the bottom of the page is the Agent's name. Can anyone make out what name this is.. Looks like Sam Ga..scean?

http://brevets-patents.ic.gc.ca/opic-cipo/cpd/eng/patent/616139/images.html?section=drawings&modificationDate=19950211&page=1&scale=50&rotation=0&type=

And for privacy reasons, I suppose a PM will do or just the last name? Cubby is that ok? If we have the last name people can search him?

Thank you! :-)

SideKick
02-08-2010, 04:57 PM
This is Evelyn R Wanek's irrigation devise. Ok Ok.. at the bottom of the page is the Agent's name. Can anyone make out what name this is.. Looks like Sam Ga..scean?

http://brevets-patents.ic.gc.ca/opic-cipo/cpd/eng/patent/616139/images.html?section=drawings&modificationDate=19950211&page=1&scale=50&rotation=0&type=

And for privacy reasons, I suppose a PM will do or just the last name? Cubby is that ok? If we have the last name people can search him?

Thank you! :-)

The above is the Canadian Agent.

Here is the American signed copy by lawyers...

http://news.google.com/patents?id=uCdmAAAAEBAJ&pg=PA1&dq=in&source=gbs_selected_pages&cad=2#v=onepage&q=&f=false

SK.

Cubby
02-08-2010, 04:57 PM
let's see if we can make out - determine the correct last name. I looks like Ga??ean.

If he is still living I can go back and edit the name to initials. In the mean time use the first initial and let's try and figure out the last name.

Cubby
02-08-2010, 04:59 PM
The above is the Canadian Agent.

Here is the American signed copy by lawyers...

http://news.google.com/patents?id=uCdmAAAAEBAJ&pg=PA1&dq=in&source=gbs_selected_pages&cad=2#v=onepage&q=&f=false

SK.


based on the above date (1958) Clearly Brody must have known Evelyn long before he met GW. Especially knowing it was GB who gave GW the 'enema' instructions while he was still married to Annasmom.

Odyssey
02-08-2010, 05:02 PM
considering that it is Canadian, it could be a french name which would more likely end in eau

SideKick
02-08-2010, 05:07 PM
based on the above date (1958) Clearly Brody must have known Evelyn long before he met GW. Especially knowing it was GB who gave GW the 'enema' instructions while he was still married to Annasmom.

I agree, Brody must have know her before the patent was done.. you'd think!

SideKick
02-08-2010, 05:09 PM
considering that it is Canadian, it could be a french name which would more likely end in eau

Oh for sure! The French connection!!

I'm looking at Gagseau?? First same ....short for Samuel?
LOL!

Cubby
02-08-2010, 05:25 PM
I'm sure the first name is likely Samuel. I found two legit surnames being Gagneau and Gasteau but nothing indicating a Samuel, Sam or Sam H.

SideKick
02-08-2010, 05:42 PM
http://www.schroederpatlaw.com/Overview.shtml

The Law Firm (American)
The question would be: We have seen your signature on a patent ERW's.. Bla Bla...

What kind of information could they offer us in the search for Anna?

Looks like a father and son practice.

SideKick
04-14-2010, 09:10 AM
Bringing this back to discuss Evelyn's relatives. I feel we are fortunate to have at least one living Wanek to try to track down. Loretta Francis's children, David and Maureen are out there. Evelyn would be the aunt to these people. There is also Florence born in 1905. Smaller chance she is still alive but one never knows.....

Due to the fact the George Waters made a call to Evelyn after Brody passed, one would think they were close enough for a chat despite GW being distraught and feeling very low at this time.

~


A little more genealogical information on Evelyn Wanek

Maybe Joe Ford or Annasmom will reconize a name.

According US census records Evelyn's family lived in North Dakota from at least 1910 to 1930. Death records show her mother, father, and at least one sister also died in CA

Father: Joseph M. Wanek b. 1-27-1873 d. 4-15-1972 (SF CA)
Mother: Barbara (Matuska) b. 6-27-1883 d. 11-30-1981 (SF CA)
Sister: Florence M. b.1905
Self: Evelyn R. b. 2-11-1906 d.12-31-1992 (San Mateo CA)
Sister: Loretta F. (Guidici) b. 10-25-1911 d. 10-19-1995 (Santa Cruz CA)

I haven't been able to trace info on older sister Florence yet

Loretta Frances Wanek married Peter Guidici (both deceased)
children:
David Charles Guidici b.5-16-42 d.10-27-81 (San Mateo CA)
Maureen C. Guidici b.12-7-37

Maureen is still living, married twice, and appears to have a couple step-children, none of her own. If Anna was given to a Wanek family member, Maureen would be a possible choice. IMHO. There was a (now 40 year old) woman living in their household at one time. I believe she was the wife of a step son.

Evelyn's uncle Nick Matuska (b.10-11-1883 d.3-28-1965 Wilkin, MN) lived with the Wanek family for several years. Uncle Nick married in 1911 to Wilma and had 3 daughters (one named Evelyn) and 2 sons in ND by 1930. Not sure when he moved to MN, but his children would all be about the right age to receive a child Anna's age. Nick's WWI draft info lists him as medium height, blue eyes and brown hair

A man by the name of Frank Zitka (b.1868) lived with the Wanek family as a lodger or a servant in the 1930's

Reels
05-29-2010, 04:38 PM
Oh for sure! The French connection!!

I'm looking at Gagseau?? First same ....short for Samuel?
LOL!

It looks like Gasseau to me. The letter before the "seau" looks just like the s. I don't see anything that mixes with the typed/printed A below those two letters, if that makes sense. I have no idea if this is even still being looked at though. :)

I was also going to say, my friend has 2 birth certificates, with 2 different dates of birth on them, and they both bear the seal of the state. They both look legitimate. She was concerned she was kidnapped and told me, which is how I know. I was told by a doctor I knew that if parents had a legitimate reason for changing a birthday back then, they were able to get it changed on the birth certificate. He (the doctor) said it was not an uncommon practice back then (my friend was born in 1976). I don't know if that was true when Anna was born or not. But one reason for changing the day was for school enrollment. I say this because I think it would not be unreasonable to look at women around Anna's current age. Her birthdate could have been changed to a different month/day or even year. They could have her original birth day amended, or (of course) they could have gotten a fake birth certificate.

MissMarple
08-07-2010, 09:46 AM
I would say that late EW was a kind of a friend or maybe a distant cousin of GB, becasue she was called immidiately after the death of GB. She is of the chech origin and I woud sau that we can exclude possibility that M. Kukoda was of the same origin, maybe GB also...or at least from the same town....

SideKick
09-20-2010, 11:28 AM
Due to the fact that Dr. Waters made a long call to E. Wanek after Brody passed away still haunts me as to WHY this call and WHY so long?

Apparently if I am recalling, it was rouphly a 40 minute call. I have contacted some Waneks via email/facebook with no response whatsoever. I would like to list as many W's on the west coast to find relatives of Evelyn (if possible). No replies tells me perhaps they do know....... something?

I'd like to either rule out all together or keep wondering till the cows decide to come home. Any thoughts? :banghead:

~ If Anna were given to this family, and she gave birth lets say, without marrying, (it happens!), she may have given birth between 1987 age 20 to 1995 age 28. We can take it younger as well, 1985 Anna would have been 18yrs old.

SKick

Annasmom
09-20-2010, 12:35 PM
Due to the fact that Dr. Waters made a long call to E. Wanek after Brody passed away still haunts me as to WHY this call and WHY so long?

Apparently if I am recalling, it was rouphly a 40 minute call. I have contacted some Waneks via email/facebook with no response whatsoever. I would like to list as many W's on the west coast to find relatives of Evelyn (if possible). No replies tells me perhaps they do know....... something?

I'd like to either rule out all together or keep wondering till the cows decide to come home. Any thoughts? :banghead:

~ If Anna were given to this family, and she gave birth lets say, without marrying, (it happens!), she may have given birth between 1987 age 20 to 1995 age 28. We can take it younger as well, 1985 Anna would have been 18yrs old.

SKick
I think the most likely (and least sinister) answer to the telephone call is that he just didn't have anybody to talk to except this woman, who had seen both of them in her spa or clinic. I think some of his telephone calls had to do with anesthetizing GB in his last hours. If GW planned to take poison himself, he would not have worried about the legal consequences of this action. It was almost pathetic, how he tried to pay all his bills, etc. I'd give a lot to know what was on those notes he apparently left. They were confiscated by the coroner, and we do not know what they said, only that they had something to do with guilt (I forget where I got this idea; maybe from the brother.)

SideKick
09-20-2010, 01:11 PM
I think the most likely (and least sinister) answer to the telephone call is that he just didn't have anybody to talk to except this woman, who had seen both of them in her spa or clinic. I think some of his telephone calls had to do with anesthetizing GB in his last hours. If GW planned to take poison himself, he would not have worried about the legal consequences of this action. It was almost pathetic, how he tried to pay all his bills, etc. I'd give a lot to know what was on those notes he apparently left. They were confiscated by the coroner, and we do not know what they said, only that they had something to do with guilt (I forget where I got this idea; maybe from the brother.)

Hi!

'The Brother', which brother Annasmom? I do believe you are correct in that EW became a friend/professional health administrator for both G's. So, the Dr.'s coroner took Waters notes and these notes were never confiscated by LE? Do we know the name of this coroner?

Thanks~

Cubby
09-20-2010, 02:27 PM
The above makes a lot of sense Annasmom and I think you are likely right. I do think GW used the name Jack Wolfe when associating with EW to keep from being associated with his physicians license, possibly do to previous disciplinary action. IIRC he was disciplined for over dx'ng a particular condition but I don't recall which it was.

I wonder about those notes you mention which the coroner confiscated. Shouldn't they have been reviewed by the detective handling Annas case? Were you told LE conclusively ruled out everything contained in those notes as being related in any way to Annas case? I wonder about trying to obtain them via the FOIA. Does anyone know, would those notes confiscated by the coroner be available via the FOIA? They would be worth trying to obtain if they might contain clues to Annas disappearance.

Dr. Doogie
09-20-2010, 05:12 PM
The notes should be in a file somewhere with the coroner's report (different than the death certificate). These should be available - at least to a family member. Perhaps one of George's sibling's coulds assist us - if necessary - in obtaining these files. I will see if I can get the files myself first fromn the SF coroner, but it may take a family member.

SideKick
09-20-2010, 05:16 PM
The notes should be in a file somewhere with the coroner's report (different than the death certificate). These should be available - at least to a family member. perhaps one of George's sibling's coulds assist us - if necessary - in obtaining these files. I will see if I can get the files myself first fromn the SF coroner, but it may take a family member.

~ Thank you Dr. Doogie,

I really think it is important to try to obtain these last notes Dr. Water's had written. You're efforts are appreciated.

Dr. Doogie
09-20-2010, 05:22 PM
We, as non-family members, can obtain a medical examiner's report (the equivilent to a coroner's report) for only $15. It probably does not contain the notes, but it is the place to start. If it does not have the notes, then the next step is to request that the Medical Examiner's Office locate them in a seperate storage facility and provide them to us. I will send off for the ME report this week.

Annasmom
09-20-2010, 10:00 PM
The above makes a lot of sense Annasmom and I think you are likely right. I do think GW used the name Jack Wolfe when associating with EW to keep from being associated with his physicians license, possibly do to previous disciplinary action. IIRC he was disciplined for over dx'ng a particular condition but I don't recall which it was.

I wonder about those notes you mention which the coroner confiscated. Shouldn't they have been reviewed by the detective handling Annas case? Were you told LE conclusively ruled out everything contained in those notes as being related in any way to Annas case? I wonder about trying to obtain them via the FOIA. Does anyone know, would those notes confiscated by the coroner be available via the FOIA? They would be worth trying to obtain if they might contain clues to Annas disappearance.

I think Doogie's plan is a great one. The FOIA now has at least four files on our case, but apart from one phone call, nothing has come out of it. Apart from following him for a while, LE did not look closely into George's activities and wouldn't have had reason to re-examine his possible involvement with Anna's disappearance when he died nine years later. I am very, very reluctant to involve George's brother in this. I am willing to do whatever it takes to try to solve the mystery of Anna's disappearance myself, but I do not want to cause further trauma to other members of the family. Also, I am not even sure the notes were kept. It was the hotel manager who mentioned them to Joe Ford, and that is the only way I knew about them.

mahoneys07
09-20-2010, 10:50 PM
surely they would have kept these as they are proof of suicide right? Otherwise wouldn't they have investigated it more?

Cubby
09-20-2010, 11:05 PM
I think Doogie's plan is a great one. The FOIA now has at least four files on our case, but apart from one phone call, nothing has come out of it. Apart from following him for a while, LE did not look closely into George's activities and wouldn't have had reason to re-examine his possible involvement with Anna's disappearance when he died nine years later. I am very, very reluctant to involve George's brother in this. I am willing to do whatever it takes to try to solve the mystery of Anna's disappearance myself, but I do not want to cause further trauma to other members of the family. Also, I am not even sure the notes were kept. It was the hotel manager who mentioned them to Joe Ford, and that is the only way I knew about them.


I completely understand. I'm sure GW's family has struggled with both the disappearance of Anna and the loss of GW.

What we need to do, imo, is get the files, ALL Files we can via the FOIA and see if we can't find a way to get the coroners office to release any info via FOIA. I'll do some digging in the UID forum and see if anyone knows the SF CTY coroners office.... I may be able to find someone who can. Will update as able.....

Cubby
09-20-2010, 11:11 PM
surely they would have kept these as they are proof of suicide right? Otherwise wouldn't they have investigated it more?


I'm not sure what they retained regarding those notes. Hopefully we can find out through the FOIA and hopefully we can get some assistance from a WS'rs who works the UID forum who might know someone in the SF Cty coroners office.

Cubby
09-21-2010, 12:53 AM
We, as non-family members, can obtain a medical examiner's report (the equivilent to a coroner's report) for only $15. It probably does not contain the notes, but it is the place to start. If it does not have the notes, then the next step is to request that the Medical Examiner's Office locate them in a seperate storage facility and provide them to us. I will send off for the ME report this week.

FWIW, I asked CarlK from the UID forum, who has the most contact with ME's and he has not spoken with anyone in the SF Cty ME ofc. I did a quick search of CA UID's and SF Cty does have a few listed, which is good as not all ME's are yet using NamUs. There is a contact name, tele and email address for the SF ME office. If you want me to pull that info for you and send it to you Doogie let me know.


CarlK did suggest, since both GW and GB are deceased unless those notes are part of an ongoing criminal investigation, to which our knowledge they are not as we don't believe LE ever looked at those notes in connection with Annas disappearance, we should be able to get them. There may or may not be some clue within them, but it they would be interesting to know in relation to Annas disappearance and possibly some answers with regards to GW's relationship with EW.

hth

Annasmom
09-21-2010, 08:01 PM
FWIW, I asked CarlK from the UID forum, who has the most contact with ME's and he has not spoken with anyone in the SF Cty ME ofc. I did a quick search of CA UID's and SF Cty does have a few listed, which is good as not all ME's are yet using NamUs. There is a contact name, tele and email address for the SF ME office. If you want me to pull that info for you and send it to you Doogie let me know.


CarlK did suggest, since both GW and GB are deceased unless those notes are part of an ongoing criminal investigation, to which our knowledge they are not as we don't believe LE ever looked at those notes in connection with Annas disappearance, we should be able to get them. There may or may not be some clue within them, but it they would be interesting to know in relation to Annas disappearance and possibly some answers with regards to GW's relationship with EW.

hth

I do not believe those notes were kept. They were not suicide notes, but rather mottoes or expressions of guilt. As I said, I only knew about them because the hotel manager mentioned them to Joe Ford. As to the coroner's report, the name of the coroner is on GW's death certificate, but I cannot decipher his handwriting. The death certificate (which I have scanned and posted on the forum previously) says that death was a suicide by cyanide poisoning and that an autopsy was performed.

Cubby mentioned the reason GW was terminated from his jobs. I have a letter from the Permanente Medical Group dated December 31, 1973, terminating him for various reasons including productivity, but apparently Kaiser rehired him and on November 5, 1980, reprimanded him for only seeing 3190 patients instead of the minimum of 4200. The Mission Neighborhood Health Center fired him in February, 1981, for insubordination and absenteeism.

Julessleuther
09-21-2010, 08:40 PM
Forgive me if this has already been answered, I have not been here for awhile (but have been following), but do you have any credit card slips in the BFH from the late 70's/80's before he died? Perhaps he traveled to see Anna? What made me think of it were his frequent absences. I would have thought GB would want him to work as much as possible to make more $$--why was he absent so much? Also--did anyone at his workplace know that he lived with GB and if so, how did he describe their relationship (father, friend, etc.)


I do not believe those notes were kept. They were not suicide notes, but rather mottoes or expressions of guilt. As I said, I only knew about them because the hotel manager mentioned them to Joe Ford. As to the coroner's report, the name of the coroner is on GW's death certificate, but I cannot decipher his handwriting. The death certificate (which I have scanned and posted on the forum previously) says that death was a suicide by cyanide poisoning and that an autopsy was performed.

Cubby mentioned the reason GW was terminated from his jobs. I have a letter from the Permanente Medical Group dated December 31, 1973, terminating him for various reasons including productivity, but apparently Kaiser rehired him and on November 5, 1980, reprimanded him for only seeing 3190 patients instead of the minimum of 4200. The Mission Neighborhood Health Center fired him in February, 1981, for insubordination and absenteeism.

Julessleuther
09-21-2010, 08:45 PM
I did not wish to be disrespectful in any way, but has GW's family assisted you in any way in finding Anna? Since she is family to them as well, I woudl think they would have a vested interest?
I think Doogie's plan is a great one. The FOIA now has at least four files on our case, but apart from one phone call, nothing has come out of it. Apart from following him for a while, LE did not look closely into George's activities and wouldn't have had reason to re-examine his possible involvement with Anna's disappearance when he died nine years later. I am very, very reluctant to involve George's brother in this. I am willing to do whatever it takes to try to solve the mystery of Anna's disappearance myself, but I do not want to cause further trauma to other members of the family. Also, I am not even sure the notes were kept. It was the hotel manager who mentioned them to Joe Ford, and that is the only way I knew about them.

Annasmom
09-22-2010, 12:38 AM
Forgive me if this has already been answered, I have not been here for awhile (but have been following), but do you have any credit card slips in the BFH from the late 70's/80's before he died? Perhaps he traveled to see Anna? What made me think of it were his frequent absences. I would have thought GB would want him to work as much as possible to make more $$--why was he absent so much? Also--did anyone at his workplace know that he lived with GB and if so, how did he describe their relationship (father, friend, etc.)

There were probably two reasons he was absent from work...first, he was taking care of Brody, who had terminal cancer, and second, he had at least two jobs that we know of. I am quite sure nobody knew that he lived with GB except the hotel manager, who called them the "odd couple" and believed it was sort of a father-son situation.

In answer to your question about the family, they have been extremely traumatized and have expressed a willingness to help in any way they could, but what can they do? The brother offered to give a DNA sample when we were doing the comparisons, but it wasn't necessary. They are wonderful people and you can imagine what a catastrophic tragedy it was for them to lose a granddaughter and then a son, especially under the circumstances.

Julessleuther
09-22-2010, 01:16 AM
Thank you for answering Annasmom. You are so gracious. You too have been traumatized, but are so strong!

Do we know when GB was diagnosed with cancer? Probably irrelevant, but perhaps EW administered some "cancer treatment" to him and that is how they know her?


There were probably two reasons he was absent from work...first, he was taking care of Brody, who had terminal cancer, and second, he had at least two jobs that we know of. I am quite sure nobody knew that he lived with GB except the hotel manager, who called them the "odd couple" and believed it was sort of a father-son situation.

In answer to your question about the family, they have been extremely traumatized and have expressed a willingness to help in any way they could, but what can they do? The brother offered to give a DNA sample when we were doing the comparisons, but it wasn't necessary. They are wonderful people and you can imagine what a catastrophic tragedy it was for them to lose a granddaughter and then a son, especially under the circumstances.

Annasmom
09-22-2010, 11:59 AM
Thank you for answering Annasmom. You are so gracious. You too have been traumatized, but are so strong!

Do we know when GB was diagnosed with cancer? Probably irrelevant, but perhaps EW administered some "cancer treatment" to him and that is how they know her?

I'm sorry; I don't know this. The only information about GW's cancer we have is test results which were among GW's papers, and those were done when the illness was very advanced. Your suggestion about EW makes sense to me.

Cubby
09-22-2010, 01:10 PM
I do not believe those notes were kept. They were not suicide notes, but rather mottoes or expressions of guilt. As I said, I only knew about them because the hotel manager mentioned them to Joe Ford. As to the coroner's report, the name of the coroner is on GW's death certificate, but I cannot decipher his handwriting. The death certificate (which I have scanned and posted on the forum previously) says that death was a suicide by cyanide poisoning and that an autopsy was performed.

Cubby mentioned the reason GW was terminated from his jobs. I have a letter from the Permanente Medical Group dated December 31, 1973, terminating him for various reasons including productivity, but apparently Kaiser rehired him and on November 5, 1980, reprimanded him for only seeing 3190 patients instead of the minimum of 4200. The Mission Neighborhood Health Center fired him in February, 1981, for insubordination and absenteeism.


I had thought they were notes of somekind retained by the coroner. Perhaps I misunderstood.... I was hoping if there were any notes with th coroner we might find some clues.

Interesting about GW... I was actually recalling something about over diagnosing a thyroid? condition and thought perhaps he had some kind of contact or shared interest in the same medical condition with EW.

Do you recall what medical condition that might have been Annasmom? Thinking outloud....

thank you!

Cubby
09-22-2010, 01:14 PM
Good points Jules'... in particular it would be sooo nice to know what the relationship was between GW GB and EW prior to the phone call Joe Ford discovered. Which is my reasoning for asking about the over dx of some medical condition by GW which he was disciplined for but I can't recall......

I think we should go back and look more into the 'spa' facility EW ran... I wonder what else we can find out about that spa.

Dr. Doogie
09-22-2010, 02:50 PM
I believe that it was an alternative-therapy spa that emphasized enemas to treat conditions. Considering that the spa was located nearby where Brody lived in SF and that Brody had recommended that Annasmom administer an enema to Waters, I speculate that Brody and Wanek may have known each other prior to Brody and Waters meeting. More speculation: that Wanek may have "treated" Margaret also and that is how GB and EW meet, then GB used her later when he became ill.

Cubby
09-22-2010, 04:58 PM
I believe that it was an alternative-therapy spa that emphasized enemas to treat conditions. Considering that the spa was located nearby where Brody lived in SF and that Brody had recommended that Annasmom administer an enema to Waters, I speculate that Brody and Wanek may have known each other prior to Brody and Waters meeting. More speculation: that Wanek may have "treated" Margaret also and that is how GB and EW meet, then GB used her later when he became ill.

Why then am I thinking she was in so cal when GB made the call to her? Or did she later move to that area? Didn't GW make a call to someone closer to LA or San Diego? Or am I getting mild dementia in my 40's? ;)

Annasmom
09-22-2010, 06:31 PM
Why then am I thinking she was in so cal when GB made the call to her? Or did she later move to that area? Didn't GW make a call to someone closer to LA or San Diego? Or am I getting mild dementia in my 40's? ;) She had her office in Pacifica (a few miles south of San Francisco) when George made the long telephone call to her.

Cubby
09-22-2010, 07:21 PM
She had her office in Pacifica (a few miles south of San Francisco) when George made the long telephone call to her.

Thanks! I just realized what I had done... in my mind I registered Pacifica as being in So Cal for some reason and never looked at a map. :doh: I'm laughing at myself..... lol

Thank you so much for clarifying that for me. That's what I get for assuming I know CA well when I am half way across the country. lol

SideKick
09-22-2010, 08:18 PM
Thanks! I just realized what I had done... in my mind I registered Pacifica as being in So Cal for some reason and never looked at a map. :doh: I'm laughing at myself..... lol

Thank you so much for clarifying that for me. That's what I get for assuming I know CA well when I am half way across the country. lol

.... where did EW pass away again? Redwoods area? Teehee, I am not looking at a map. Redwood City maybe what we're thinking of.

Cubby
09-22-2010, 08:53 PM
.... where did EW pass away again? Redwoods area? Teehee, I am not looking at a map. Redwood City maybe what we're thinking of.


I'm not even going to take a guess at that one, I'd probably do about as good as say playing pin the tail on the donkey after being spun around. ay yi yi! I need a good nights sleep as here I am getting slap happy talking about pin the tail on the donkey on Annas threads...... :crazy:

Firefly75
06-25-2011, 05:30 AM
What is the verdict then on EW? No connexion except for the phone call, and no way she could have had anything to do with Anna, or am I reading things wrong?

I wondered for a while if she could have been a go-between of some sort between the two Georges and whoever the adoptive/foster parents were - if the two Georges actually had something to do with Anna's disappearance and wanted to remove her from the family. EW could have been in a position to arrange illegal adoption or selling of children or know coupes who wanted to adopt through her profession; then again, she may have been completely unconnected with Anna's disappearance.

smile22
06-25-2011, 06:42 PM
maybe she knew someone who needed a child and gave them that info. the whole georges dying shortly after she disaapered is even stranger. so many unanswered questions

SideKick
08-29-2011, 11:42 AM
The call to Evelyn Wanek after Brody died from Waters drives me insane. Why did he call her and have such a long conversation? OK, if EW assisted in Brody's health why such a call after he died? Wouldn't it only take a few moments to tell someone he passed away but thank you for your help?

Is there anyone out there who can find an obit on Evelyn? Was Anna given to her, we need to find out if this is so - perhaps it was written in her obit?

I can't see either George doing something dreadful to Anna, no way.... so, with that said, Anna is definitely out there!

SK

mbroemsen
09-07-2011, 02:31 AM
The call to Evelyn Wanek after Brody died from Waters drives me insane. Why did he call her and have such a long conversation? OK, if EW assisted in Brody's health why such a call after he died? Wouldn't it only take a few moments to tell someone he passed away but thank you for your help?

Is there anyone out there who can find an obit on Evelyn? Was Anna given to her, we need to find out if this is so - perhaps it was written in her obit?

I can't see either George doing something dreadful to Anna, no way.... so, with that said, Anna is definitely out there!

SK

Grrr. it took me so long to type my reply, it logged me out. There is a new site called Fold3.com that has a lot of good info, and has (5) EV records, one of which is listed in Cali -- about the right time frame. Maybe someone can check it out - I dont feel like I have enough grasp to make the connections.

On a side note, as I was rereading, there was a reference to GB in Stark County, Ohio -- thinking perhaps his ashes were sent back here... has this ever been ruled out?

If GB was from Bucks county, I dont think it would be a stretch to think he had relatives here -- and if GW flew to Chicago, perhaps he took a connecting flight here (not sure if you could go direct to Cleveland then, which would have been closer).

Anyway, if someone can make a connection/think its worth follow up, let me know - they have cemetery books in the library downtown.

I forgot to mention that politics would have been a hot issue here back then, President McKinley was from here, and there were some other Ohio presidents about the right time frame. Also, Annasmom mentioned the lack of an accent - People from pittsburgh are about 90 min usually have a distinct accent/word usage that we can tell, but this area is pretty commonly known for its "common american accent" - like what you hear on TV - hope that makes sense. so maybe a couple of things to support that idea.

SideKick
12-14-2011, 11:08 AM
Hi!
On dobsearch.com I typed in Anna C. Wanek and there are a few but I cannot thoroughly check as I do not have an account. If anyone has one, can you please check. The slim chance Anna was adopted into a Wanek family is something I still think of and because the last call G.W.s made was to E. Wanek when Brody passed.

https://www.dobsearch.com/people-finder/view.php?t=1323874304&sessid=6763f3d91b88edc9c5fd5dc2cb69aa8f&searchnum=93195436167&page=1

SideKick
12-14-2011, 11:10 AM
ANNA WANEK

Associated Names / Possible Aliases:
ANNA M HAYDEL (Age 44)
ANNA M ONEAL (Age 44)
ANNA M WANEK (Age 44)
ANNA M WARDREP (Age 44)
ANNA WARDREP (Age 44)
ANNA M WARNKE (Age 44) 44 CROSBY, TX 77532
WASILLA, AK 99654
BAYTOWN, TX 77521
MAYO, FL 32066
LEESVILLE, LA 71446
[ 9 Unique Addresses ]
[ 3 Unique Telephone Numbers ]


WARDREP, SHAWN L
WARNKE, JAMES E (Age 58)
WARNKE, MONICA
WARNKE, KRISTY
WARNKE, JAMES EDWARD (Age 58)

Odyssey
04-25-2012, 12:54 AM
Just did a search for Evelyn Wanek on Ancestry and found some information that has not previously been discussed in this thread, for some reason. Maybe the info was added recently.

She was in *drumroll* Oakland California 1939-1941... then she appears in San Francisco from 1943-1970 (not all years have directories available but assuming she didn't leave and come back)

GB was last listed in Oakland in 1944, then is missing until 1962 when he appears in SF. But she was in Oakland when he was.

Also in 1941, she was listed as a masseuse in Oakland. There was a David Westling at the same address, also listed as a masseuse in 1941. He was most likely a relative of EW's. He also was at 967 Sutter (same as EW) in 1943. He appears to have died in 1977. He was also, like EW, born in Minnesota.

SideKick
04-30-2012, 11:03 AM
Wondering where Evelyn lived before living and passing in California?

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=Mv0tAAAAIBAJ&sjid=09kFAAAAIBAJ&pg=2464,7743526&dq=evelyn+wanek&hl=en

A few articles about 'an' Evelyn Wanek in the archived newspapers...

SK

SideKick
05-16-2012, 01:17 PM
I think it is extremely important to try to locate Evelyn's family who are still living. Like most folks, everyone leaves 'stuff' behind. Perhaps in our luck she left some information unknowingly that would help us further this search/cross the family off this list or perhaps, gain some info. Just a reminder GW went as George Wolf/Wolfe to Eveyln.

Below is her death record:


Evelyn WANEK
Birth Date: 11 Feb 1906
Death Date: 31 Dec 1992
Social Security Number: 557-18-1586
State or Territory Where Number Was Issued: California

Death Residence Localities
ZIP Code: 95006
Localities: Big Basin, Santa Cruz, California
Boulder Creek, Santa Cruz, California


http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Search/ssdi/individual_record.asp?recid=557181586&lds=3&region=%2D1&regionfriendly=&juris1=&juris2=&juris3=&juris4=&regionfriendly=&juris1friendly=&juris2friendly=&juris3friendly=&juris4friendly=

SideKick
05-16-2012, 02:02 PM
She was about 79 years old when George Waters called her after Brody passed away. I wonder what an almost 80 yr. old woman would need to know OTHERTHAN if she did treat Brody with his illness's. A 40 minute chat is quite a long chat just to let a medical contact know about the death of Brody.

I feel that whoever was involved in Anna's disappearance could be not that far off from who we know, who they knew. Afterall, Anna wasn't given to just anyone in the world if you believe the G's were involved. I can't imagine even if she was sent oversea's that the person taking her would be an unknown to the point that no one can find that person, that is why awhile back I asked everyone who George Waters may have known whether or not he kept in touch ... I think another prospect would be a nurse or Dr. he worked with if we can find names of these people. At age 5, I am wondering if whoever fell for this scenerio changed Anna's name. Could well be but who knows.

If ..... Anna's caretakers were completely not related to friendship or acquaintance to the G's, how would Waters find a person to take Anna and go along with a story for so long? Ok, despite money. Both G's are now gone. Whoever took Anna, could well have told her something about her life/what happened as a child/some truth?