Updates On Stanley Case-2008

[SeriouslySearching]

This case isn't over yet! Do we have any new updates on where the case stands right now? :confused:

[SydneyMum]

This is from the 7th Feb

http://www.pal-item.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080202/NEWS01/802020302

[SydneyMum]

Another article
http://www.pal-item.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080207/UPDATES/80207024/1008/NEWS01

[HAWG]

If they set bail for him I will just die!!! Her goes my fear agian. I hope that there is enough evidence to hold him with out bail. Today will tell a little bit about the evidence that they have against him. Just because they set a bail dosent mean he can come up with the money to get out. Im keeping my fingers crossed and praying alot today!!! PLease help me pray?

[Taximom]

Yes, HAWG, I'll be praying with you. I can't get over this case, AND the severe lack of news about it. These girls should not be forgotten.

I hope the little baby is doing well. Thanks for the updates, Sydneymum, and welcome to WS! :blowkiss:

[SeriouslySearching]

Welcome to WS and Thank you, Sydneymum!!

I don't want this case to go away. I want the truth to come out of what really happened and for things to move forward for their family. That precious little girl needs to have answers in the future.

[Littledeer]

HAWG:

I am praying with you hon! We just need to keep on having faith in God and in all that he does. Even when it doesn't make any sense, which I am finding out more and more as I read here on Web Sleuths.

Since the trial is to start in March, I just can't see the Judge granting bail. imo, there is no need to.

I see the same crap is starting all over again over at the Pandiam(?) news site on whether Erin and Kelly's parents acted appropriately along with a lengthly discussion over one of the firemen.

Although I have my thoughts on how I feel the parents should have acted, it's just that...........my thoughts. I have to realize that we are all different and don't all act in the same way to the same circumstances.

Although I haven't posted here, it does not mean I have forgotten Erin, Kelly, you, your precious grandaughter, your daugher. I haven't, just been waiting patiently for the trial to start.

[Wrinkles]

Hello Gang,

It is good to see that something is coming up finally and hopefully the truth will be clarified and justice will prevail. I, too, cannot forget these two lovely girls.

Hawg, hang in there. I'll be praying about the situation, as well. I can imagine the fear you might have of James getting out on bail. Hopefully that will NOT happen.

Taximom, Seriously Searching, and Littledeer good to see your faces :)

SydneyMum, thanks for posting those links! I'll be hoping that you and others can pick these up and post them, as I have little time to be hunting lately :( So I really appreciate when others do.

Wrinkles

[SeriouslySearching]

(Waves at Wrinkles!) Great to see ya! Welcome back!

[SydneyMum]

Thanks for the welcome :)
I've been a long time lurker and decided to sign up the other day.

I've found a bit more news.....
He's being held without bond!
Murder hearing set for March 11.
http://www.pal-item.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080209/NEWS01/802090301
http://www.pal-item.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080208/NEWS01/802080312/1008

[HAWG]

I dont like what I have heard so far I hope this dont turn out to be a circus show. I would love to see the evidence because I dont think that they have handled this properly. This is scaring me to death!!!

[Bobbisangel]

From what has been said...Erin was without oxygen for quite a while. I would like to know if the blood vessels in her eyes broke. That is usually a sign of being strangled or suffocated. I just find it hard to believe that nothing was going on between Erin and the baby's daddy..like a fight or something...and all of a sudden she couldn't get any air and died with him right there in the room. No doubt the same bed. They had been fighting...the neighbors had witnessed it. They had just moved back in with Erin's parents and Kelly so the fight had to have been at Erin's home. Dad didn't care for the boyfriend for some reason. I think the boyfriend had a lot of nerve moving in with them probably knowing that the dad didn't approve of him.

I realize that we don't know all of the facts but if I were on his jury I would vote "guilty" but because of the fact that we know so far!

Kelly died of a seizure? Sounds just like ole Joran Van Der Sloot.

[FormerRichmondRes]

http://www.pal-item.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080214/UPDATES/80214016/1008/NEWS01

This article was updated this morning, I believe.

[HAWG]

My heart goes out to the Stanleys today. That would have to be very hard for them. I hope this is not drug out too long for them!!!

JUSTICE FOR ERIN !!!

[SewingDeb]

There's an article at Pal-item about her mother testifying but when I click on the link it is a blank page.

[Taximom]

Try this link, SewingDeb:
http://www.pal-item.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080215/UPDATES/80215026

[HAWG]

There is another article that states Lonny and Kelly went to get them in Ohio. It was said that they didnt want James to come but Erin did so they allowed it. She also said she wasent aware of any abuse and that she only knew of one fight that they had. She was sobing on the stand poor woman this has to be very hard.
Im wonering what bumblebug is talking about???

[Littledeer]

Winkles: Great seeing you again! :blowkiss:

Welcome to WS SydneyMum!! :)

HAWG: I truly believe there will be no bail granted to James! We will be with you every step of the way! Keep the faith!!! How's that beautiful grandaughter doing? Can you put up a picture of the little darling?

[HAWG]

Ld, I dont think that there will be a bond either. Thank you for your support!!! As for Haley she is doing fine she is really growing she comes up with something new everyday. She has the biggest imagination it is so funny to watch her play. I say she is going to be a movie star because of her imagination! LOL Sorry about the picture but you can go to Ashley Messer myspace and then you can see her.

[SewingDeb]

Try this link, SewingDeb:
http://www.pal-item.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080215/UPDATES/80215026

Thanks Taximom. Just now getting back to this one.

[the bumblebug]

Bumblebug is back.

During the first session of the bond hearing the lead investigaztor testigied the following:

[the bumblebug]

During the first session of the hearing the lead investigator testified to the following.
1. James was interviewed for more than an hour in Richmond and it was taped.
2. The investigator asked another officer to conduct a detailed interview on the Stanleys. They were separated and each asked approximately 7 questions.
3. Even after the investigator was advised that Erin had probably been strangled, he did not ask for a sexual assault kit to be run nor did he ask that scrapings be taken from underneath Erin's fingernails to see if tissue, DNA, fiberts etc. might be collected that could lead them to a probable suspect.
4. The investigator said that Kelly Stanleys only role during the investigation was to help him get access to Erin's web page. She provided him her password so that he could then access Erins site via her guest status on that site.
5. The bed sheet on which Erin and James slept was collected shortly after the incident and place in a trash bag and stored in the garage. The investigator collected the sheet a few days later when he came to ask more questions of the family.
6. During the second session, Lonny Stanley testified that the night before Erin's death, she and Dale had gone to the Brown Jug for a few drinks. She indicated that they stayed there between 1 and 1 1/2 hours. She further indicated that she had had 1 White Russion before going to the tavern and had 3 while she was there. She also indicated that Dale had
drank 10 beers while they were at the tavern.

It is my sincere hope that if anyone had a different version of the testimony they will post it on this threat. I have no desire to incorrectly state what has taken place during these first two session. I know there is more....it's just my brain is tired.

[Busylady]

Sounds like they are gonna have a rough time providing any evidence in this case. No DNA, fibers etc, sheets left at the scene for two days??? What police force does that? If they took the time to collect them why store them at the house? I just don't get it.

Everyones alcohol tolerance is different but 3 White Russians and 10 beers in an 1 1/2 hours would definelty impair most I think, which would make any details they provided maybe questioned?

As I have said before and I realize its not a popular statement something about this whole thing just doesnt seem right. I really hope James isnt getting blamed because he is an easy target.

[the bumblebug]

One small correction: It was Lonnie that had the three White Russians and Dale that had the 10 beers at the tavern. Lonny also said she had one White Russian before she and Dale went to the tavern. For what its worth the top sheet and blanket that was on the bed where James and Erin slept doesn't appear to have been collected at the site and is lost or has been thrown out. That testimony also came from the investigator.

[the bumblebug]

Lonny Stanley said that she and Dale went to the Brown Jug tavern about once a week. I know there were a lot of individuals that wanted to know about what happened to Kelly Stanley's body. Lonny said that Kelly's body was cremated just like Erin's. Again I ask if anyone that might have attended the hearing and has a different take on what was said, please post. I am sure everyone would be anxious to hear.

[MCDRAW]

Sounds like they are gonna have a rough time providing any evidence in this case. No DNA, fibers etc, sheets left at the scene for two days??? What police force does that? If they took the time to collect them why store them at the house? I just don't get it.

Everyones alcohol tolerance is different but 3 White Russians and 10 beers in an 1 1/2 hours would definelty impair most I think, which would make any details they provided maybe questioned?

As I have said before and I realize its not a popular statement something about this whole thing just doesnt seem right. I really hope James isnt getting blamed because he is an easy target.


I agree.

[Indy Gal]

:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: Sounds like they are gonna have a rough time providing any evidence in this case. No DNA, fibers etc, sheets left at the scene for two days??? What police force does that? If they took the time to collect them why store them at the house? I just don't get it.

Everyones alcohol tolerance is different but 3 White Russians and 10 beers in an 1 1/2 hours would definelty impair most I think, which would make any details they provided maybe questioned?

As I have said before and I realize its not a popular statement something about this whole thing just doesnt seem right. I really hope James isnt getting blamed because he is an easy target.

[Taximom]

Thank you so much for the updates, bumblebug.

[HAWG]

Now I have more questions?
1) Why didnt they scrap her nails?
2) Why didnt they seal the bedroom if they thought she was strangled?
3) What time did they go to the Brown Jug, and what time did they get home?
4) Did they see Erin after they returned?

I will have more they just have not hit me yet.
Thank you for the update bumblebug!!!

[the bumblebug]

HAWG
You'll have to ask the lead investigator regarding Q #1 This came from his own testimony
Q-2 Again you will have to ask the lead investigator
Q-3 I believe Lonny said they went there early in the evening
Q-4 I don't know if they saw Erin after they returned
Note: I am even more concerned about why they didn't run a sexual assault kit. There is a lot more that did not make it into the local paper.
Anyone out there know why?

[the bumblebug]

During Lonny Stanley's testimony she was asked about James and his behavior toward Erin and the Stanley family in general. More specifically, she was asked if she had ever seen James violent or if she had ever seen him threaten anyone. She said she had not seen him violent or threaten anyone. When asked about the specific night Erin and James returned from Ohio, Lonny said that nothing out of the ordinary had occurred. Lonny was then asked about the "the stressful day' comment heard on the 911 tape. She said that what she meant pertained to the long trip to Columbus Ohio and back and the cleaning out of space in the house space for James, Erin's and Alexis' things. She said there were no threats or arguments among James, Erin, Dale or herself. She also said that Kelly's visit to a friends house was just that. Kelly just asked if she could spend the night at a friends house and was told it would be OK. comment: I was just thinking about Alexis and I sure hope she is doing OK...I know that about a week ago an intoxicated mother passed out and rolled over on top of her 2 year old and the baby suffocated. Any feedback would be welcome.

[Taximom]

Thanks again, bumblebug. I would like to know if the parents were allowing James to stay there or if he had to move out. I thought I remembered hearing he had to leave by the next day.

Then there was the "argument" a neighbor heard. I wonder if there will be testimony about that?

[the bumblebug]

I too heard that there had been an argument that had been heard by a neighbor. I also remember hearing that he was asked to leave. I don't think Lonny's testimony included any comments about the argument. Please remember I am only referencing what came out of testimony...I am not in search of anything beyond that because that would be conjecture. I thin Lonny's testimony did cover the issue of James taking care of the baby when the parents accompanied Erin to the hospital. She did say that the baby was left with James. In all honesty I find Lonny's testimony compelling with respect the immediate mood within the house before Erin's death and immediately after the Stanleys left for the hospital. Does their behavior suggest to anybody that they thought there was any reason to believe James was involved. If anyone living in Wayne county has a different take on what I have posted. Please post your ideas. I'm having a hard time making sense of this case based on testimony given thus far.

[Taximom]

Oh, I know, bumblebug. I was just wondering out loud. I suppose they'll call that neighbor if they are really interested in that.

I'd have to go back over all the threads to remember all that I once knew about this case! lol So far it does not sound like James was a danger to anyone. Just IMO from what I'm seeing here. I wish they had transcripts or video available....

[the bumblebug]

Taximom
I imagine that a transcript can be obtained but it might take a little time and cost a few pennies since it will probably have to be transcribed and put into a more readable form. Again I want to emphasize that the information I have posted came from testimony given in the first two sessions of the bond hearing. Needless to say that there is still a lot more to be said by others on the witness lists. I think Dale Stanley will be next after Lonny finishes. If I come up with more I will share it.

[Taximom]

Thanks for all you are doing, bumblebug!! :blowkiss:

[HAWG]

Thank you bumblebug!!!

How is James holding up?
The more I here about this the more I think that this is a big mess. It wasnt handled very professional!!! I just dont think they have what it is going to take to convict him.

[the bumblebug]

I just made another post and this time it was on the Suspect James McFarland thread.

[the bumblebug]

HAWG and others
Today Dale Stanley testified as did the coroner. We now apparently know that even though everyone was told at the autopsy that Erin (a 19 year old female) died under suspicious circumstances. Neither the investigator, the coroner nor the pathologist thought it might be a good idea to comb the body for hair, threads etc. run a sexual assault kit (rape Kit) on the body or collect scrapings from the fingernails that might help in one way or another determine who might have assaulted or otherwise choked this young lady. I believe there will be one more session with Lonny Stanley to finish up questioning that was completed at the last questioning. For Wayne county residence Have you seen any of these items reported in the local media lately.

[Taximom]

Oh boy, bumblebug. I'm half for letting him off just because they did such a shoddy job. The defense will have a blast with this. :(

Thanks again! :blowkiss:

[Chicogirl36]

We now apparently know that even though everyone was told at the autopsy that Erin (a 19 year old female) died under suspicious circumstances. Neither the investigator, the coroner nor the pathologist thought it might be a good idea to comb the body for hair, threads etc. run a sexual assault kit (rape Kit) on the body or collect scrapings from the fingernails that might help in one way or another determine who might have assaulted or otherwise choked this young lady.

OMG- I cant believe that- I would think that it would be SOP on ANY homicide/suspicous/undetermined death- What is wrong with these people? Their lack of competence showed in the beginning of the investigation when they were quiet about Erin's death- How did they plan on prosecuting him? What evidence? People watch too many crime shows and read too many true crime foums now a days- they want to see real evidence- they even scared me for taking so long in Cutt's trial- they are up on the processes that need to be gone thru-
Although I personally believe that he is gulity, I have a bad feeling that a jury may not be legally campable of convicting him- what evidence are they going to use? No DNA, hair, sample, swabs,etc. Even the sheets are contaminated from being in the garage-It took them a few days to come over and collect- what is wrong with this small town PD??

[the bumblebug]

Chicogirl36
I just made a hugh post which would take me forever to post her on the Paladium-Item web site forum. What I posted above is just a small part of what I was able to post on the other site. It summarizes testimony from Lonny Stanley, Dale Stanley and the coroner thus far. I believe they plan on holding one more small session to finish up testimony that was being given by Lonny Stanley when they ran out of time. Even though it's kind of long I thin you will enjoy it.

[the bumblebug]

HAWG

Sorry, I missed answering your earlier question. James seems to be OK.

[Chicogirl36]

Thanks for all of the updates bumblebug- The Pal-item forum is huge and has many threads- I found one that had some extensive posts on it, but Im not sure if you have the same screen name over there? I will post the link I found, becaus eit has some great posts on it. Please post a link to your post so I can find it easier- I will keep looking in the meantime- Thanks again- You have put a lot of dedication into following the facts on this case-

http://tinyurl.com/3xpcgf

[HAWG]

Thank you bumblebug, Look like to me he will be out on bond before you know it. They have really messed this investigation up. I really dont see him being convicted without a reasonable dought on the evidence they have presented so far.

[the bumblebug]

Chicogirl36
First me say that I would not use the same screen name if I were posting on the Pal-Item forum. The forums are quite difference and the individuals posting on this forum seem to be more mature and willing to examine the facts. The Pal-Item forum seems to be more emotional in nature and that is to be expected with so many people knowing many of the individuals involved. Yes I am familiar with the posts you are talking about and I feel sure you can read between these lines. For those who live in the vicinity and have intense interest in this case, let me assure you that my interest are two fold. First, I don't want someone who may be innocent sent to jail for a crime he may not have committed. Second, as a former journalist, I am genuinely interested in the pursuit of truth and not conjecture, theories or hunches. A few days ago an Indiana man was released from prison after serving 24 years for a crime he did not commit. My concern in this case is that the defense appears to be denied forensic evidence that is usually available to them when a crime scene is taped off in a timely fashion and the evidence is properly collected. As a minimum I would have thought the residence would have been taped off and processed as soon as the autopsy was completed.

HAWG
I don't know if the defendant will be out on bond soon but it appears he has stuck by his story from the very beginning and that might be important. As I understand it he did not flee the jurisdiction and I find that interesting as well.

[HAWG]

Yes, I thought of that because if he had done it seems to me that he would have wanted to run. I have more doughts then ever about this . James has a temper but temper and murder are two different things. Like I said because this investigation has been so messed up we will never know the truth!!! If James didnt do it who did? With the back door it leaves it wide open!!!!

[the bumblebug]

HAWG
I wasn't there and I don't know who did it. I just wish there was more evidence available. I agree with you temper comment. There are a lot of people with tempers that haven't killed anybody.

[the bumblebug]

As crazy as this case has been, I'm am thinking of writing it up as a case study for an Ethics in Criminal Justice (CJ) or Ethics in Communications class. I have friends in both disciplines and I feel sure they would love to present this to their students. If I decided to do this, I want to thank the forum members for compiling so useful much information like media threads, photos, drawings, and a time a time line that would all be most useful. Thanks to all.

[the bumblebug]

This is for HAWG and others who know James. I understand that he was beaten up last night inside the Wane County Jail. I do not have any particulars. This case is indeed beginning to sound very serious.

[Wrinkles]

Greetings Bumblebug,

You wrote:
>>This case is indeed beginning to sound very serious.<<

Can you elaborate on what you mean? Serious in which fashion? Does the "serious" relate to your report of hearing James had been beaten up? Do you have a news article to which you can refer us about this?

Wrinkles

[Taximom]

Good luck if you decide to write about this, bumblebug.

Sorry to hear about James.

[the bumblebug]

I couldn't help noticing that the most recent forum on this case has virtually come to a screeching halt. I have a hard time believing that everyone in the county where this happened has suddenly lost interest especially after so much was revealed that was not published in the newspaper. I understand that the Pal-item reporter spend a lot of time chatting with the prosecution side during the session breaks and after the end of the session. Any reporter worth his or her salt knows that you don't do that out in public. It tends to make the coverage look one sided. Example: I believe they said he was surrounded by armed guards or words to that effect. I understand there were two jailers from jail one mail and one female. I believe this is standard practice. That is one of the reasons I call the situation serious. I's like someone is trying to keep very recent stuff out of the press. To directly answer your question about a news article. You have made my point for me. There haven't been any news articles that have said anything to the defenses favor to include a contaminated crime scene, a lose of the top sheet and blanket, the lose of chain of custody on the lower bed sheet and then not having it tested for DNA, fibers, hairs etc. They have said nothing about anything that would be to the defense's benefit. The question is why. If there is someone out there that can explain why this information wasn't reported I would like to hear it. I use to teach Journalism and I assure you my students would not have missed those specifics.

[HAWG]

Im sorry to here that James was beaten up I dont want to see that, butt I kinda figured something like that would happen.
bumblebug, Haley is getting here tonsil taken out tomarrow. I know she will be fine, It is just scary because she is so little.
Please let us know if he is alright!!!

I agree that they have some explaining to do. I feel like they are holding something back. Something is not right!!!

[the bumblebug]

HAWG

As far as I know he is OK. With this being a high profile case I can't imagine the prosecution not taking special precautions to insure he is not in danger. I couldn't help notice in the Pal-items Internet edition they have reposted their article about the last hearing and this time they have shown that many comments have been submitted to include some with a lot of info that the Pal-item didn't report. I imagine that some editor was not happy about having his paper sort of shown up by an observer. IMO ... I would think the paper and other media would play this close the best from now on to preclude readers from believing they (the paper) have chosen sides and are only reporting one side of the story. If this one side reporting continues I imagine that some readers might conclude that it is being done on purpose. If that were the case then, in deed, we would really have a story of intrigue. I wish Haley well. I seem to remember favoring ice cream when I was sick.

[Taximom]

O/T alert: Hawg, my son just had his out and it went real well. The doc told him to stay away from dairy stuff like ice cream because it makes more mucus (sp) and causes more swallowing. Icee/slushies/slurpees and popsicles were fine though. He was in heaven! lol I hope she does well. ((Haley))

[Taximom]

Is Pal-Item the only main newspaper in town, bumblebug? I don't understand the lack of news about this strange case.

[HAWG]

she is a popsicle girl. We got the real fruit ones and jello.
I cant believe the newspaper. They must not want to sell papers? Or they know something we dont know?

[the bumblebug]

I may have to slow down or stop my postings. I am very concerned right now.

[MCDRAW]

I may have to slow down or stop my postings. I am very concerned right now.


Concerned for your safety?

[Taximom]

((bumblebug)) Please be careful. I can't imagine though what might be happening to you because you are only posting updates here. Have you been threatened? Tell us about it if you can. Take care.

[Indiana at Heart]

Oh I hope she can let someone know!

I'll be Richmond In by April 15 I'm moving back home! I can't wait. Been 17 years since I live there!

[the bumblebug]

I am not worried about myself. I no longer live in Wayne county.
That's all I can say.

[Taximom]

Well, if you have anything you want us to know, but don't want to post it here, you can always PM us. Are you worried about James?

[the bumblebug]

Taximom
The short answer to your question is yes. I just saw on the Pal-Item's forums page that someone posted that the coroner is now trying to charge the county for storage of the Stanley girls bodies. If someone that lives in Richmond can keep track of what's going on around Richmond or Centerville and post it here I would appreciate it.
Thanks in advance.

[Smugshots]

Taximom
The short answer to your question is yes. I just saw on the Pal-Item's forums page that someone posted that the coroner is now trying to charge the county for storage of the Stanley girls bodies. If someone that lives in Richmond can keep track of what's going on around Richmond or Centerville and post it here I would appreciate it.
Thanks in advance.

I'm confused, I thought they were cremated? What is there for the coroner to charge for storage?

[the bumblebug]

I believe that came from another post. Someone who lives in Richmond said that he understood that happened. you might want to look into post either here or in the Paladium Item newspaper. They have a web version of the paper they post every day and they also have forums. Ever day this case seems to get more strange. I remember at the very beginning of this case that I thought the relationships of the players would end up being more important that the crime. I still believe this to be the case especially when to examine what happened to any potential evidence.

[HAWG]

haley is doing alot better, she is eating strange stuff but she is eating.
Iam so confused, but I stay that way in this case. I hope they get on with it soon and not drag it out. I think that there is some covering up going on when it comes to evidence. They have totally messed up. They need to make that known because it looks worse if they dont!!!just my opinion!!!

[the bumblebug]

HAWG

First let me say that I am glad that Haley is doing better. I too am confused about this case. Nonetheless, when evidence is not collected, not analyzed, lost and the body cremated quickly it brings a lot of questions to mind. In some ways the unavailable facts seem to say a great deal.

[HAWG]

Well, I hope he is okay and this works out for him . With the evidence being so messed up I really dont beleive they are going to get a coviction.I think that there was alot more that they dont know about this case and probley wont find out because of their expertese HAHA! They do need to answer some quetions if they think they are going to sweep this under the rug They are in for a big suprise.

[the bumblebug]

With evidence not being collected, not being analyzed, lost and the body being cremated, it makes me wonder how the case can be pursued at all. It seems that with anything less than a confession that there is already more than enough doubt in this case. I can't get over what has not been said in the local media. Anyone out there got any thoughts on that?

[the bumblebug]

Has anyone know when the next session of the bond hearing is scheduled. I would sure like to know just in case I can get someone there.

[HAWG]

I havent heard anything bumblebug. they just are not saying much at all about it period.

[the bumblebug]

HAWG

I think there is another session of the bond hearing today. If you hear anything please post. Thanks

[Chicogirl36]

Bumblebug and Hawg-

Thank you both for keeping us up to date on what is going on- I cant believe that the DA even arrested James after what we have seen- his lawyers must think it is a joke? Not that I am a lawyer, or have any authority on prosecuting cases, but I have never seen such amateur detective/police work in my life-
Centerville makes themselves sound like Mayberry PD with a bunch of Barney Fifes running around- but then again, they probably did a better job- they had a script- lol

Keep up the good updates both/all of you- I check the Pal-Item Forum once in a while, but it is filled with so much crap, you get knee deep quik :eek:

[the bumblebug]

I think there was another session of the bond hearing last Monday. I noticed
the Pal-Item (local paper) said nothing about it. This was a high profile case and it doesn't make sense not to cover it with all that has come out in the past sessions. Whatever is going on here...has the Pal-Item has made a conscience decision to say nothing. Very interesting.

[the bumblebug]

Hello, AIs there anybody out there that knows what happened at the bond hearing. Other than what has been posted in these forums I have not heard a thing. I wonder if this case will end up getting dismissed because of the lack of forensic evidence. Can't wait to find out. I have a case study to write.

[the bumblebug]

I have learned that the parties involved are still trying to come up with a date that all can agree upon regarding addition testimony from Mrs. Stanley.
I wonder if all these delays might result in a change of venue request on the part of the defense attorney. I think Hancock county would provide an excellent jury pool for this kind of trial. A lot of Lilly employees work there as well as a lot of people who work in downtown Indianapolis. I suspect what I am trying to say is that this jury pool might need to see some real evidence before convicting anyone of such a serious crime.

[Littledeer]

I'm confused. With all the information that shows a "lack" of sufficient evidence that James did kill Erin, why would the defense think a change of venue is needed??

Also, what do you mean by "Lilly employees"?? I must have missed something.

[the bumblebug]

Littledeer
Here is my thought process on this one. If the prosecutor is determined to proceed with what appears to be such a weak case then who knows what the underlying motives or factors might exist. Small towns are sometimes a little too cozy for my blood. Obviously there are two ways to look at small town justice. When everyone knows each other one would think it might be easy for the parties to get together and work things out. The other possibility is that sometimes people in small towns tend to cover or take care of one another. The Lilly comments refers to the fact that Lilly is a major drug manufacturer and hires a lot of chemists and other well educated professionals. Additionally, Greenfield is a major bedroom community for professionals who work in an around Indianapolis.
My only real point is that if this case drags on the defense might want to consider taking local issues, personalities and politics out of play by moving the trial to different venue. Actually, I think the trial will stay in Richmond unless something new shows up out of the blue.

[the bumblebug]

I saw it is the Internet version of the Paladium Item that April 11th is suppose to be the date of the next session of the bond hearing. I think they said it will start at 1:30. I wonder if they will let me in after my postings in this forum. If they let me in I will try to post everything I can that is missed by the local media. After the hearing, I might also need to take a quick vacation.

[the bumblebug]

I have a question for any detective or court person out there that is familiar with what is considered common practice today regarding the taking statements. Is it common practice to tape a discussion with the witness or is it preferred to sit down and type up a statement and ask the witness to sign the statement. I know I was always asked to prepare a statement with the witnesses help and have them sign the statement or affidavit. How does a court look at unsigned statements? Regarding this particular case the Lead Investigator said he did not have any statement regarding his request to Kelly Stanley to give him her "My Space" password so he could gain entry into Erin's "My Space" page. I would have thought that it have been advisable to protect Kelly from any later challenge to her entry into Erin's "My Space" after Erin's death. I just find it strange that there appears to be no record of a conversation with Kelly after Erin's death. I would have thought the police would have had lots of questions for her under the circumstances. Lastly, does anyone know where the early rumors regarding this case came from. They were all over the place. If anyone knows I would appreciate a posted reply.

[miss_vegemite]

I have followed this case from the very very beginning. I do think LE bungled a lot. Especially by not treating Erins' death as a crime scene from the beginning. That sure went in James' favor IMO.

And I don't believe in co-incidences as such.. Erin murdered then kelly dying...Hmm I dont think So!!

[the bumblebug]

I agree with your comments. If LE had said that Kelly's death was not of natural causes it wouldn't have squared with their theory that James strangled Erin. Also, it would have virtually assured the linkage of both deaths and James could not have been considered a prime suspect. It is my understanding that James had an air tight alibi fort Kelly's death. The bottom line is that it appear that a lot of assumptions were made in this case that likely are untrue. I find it absolutely impossible for three so called professionals (Lead Investigator, Coroner, and pathologist) to be standing over the body of a 19 year old female and not deciding it necessary to take finger nail scrapings, run a sexual assault kit, nor combing the body for hairs, fibers, or anything else that might contain DNA. I know some of the players in this case and believe me it is very strange for the family not to say anything at all about this case. It's like somebody is afraid to let them say anything. On the witness stand they admitted to a lot and did not try to point a finger to the defendant. They said there were no arguments, fights or violence the night before Erin's death. The only thing that was said was that they talked to James about the need to find a job and keep it. They also stated that James had found a job in Ohio (just across the state line) and that they were working on the details to let him use one of their cars to get there. Additionally, he was to report to work the next evening. This case is strange and gets more so each day. It's like everything that could go wrong with this case has gone wrong with respect to the collection and processing of forensic evidence. I would certainly like for someone who controls such things to take another pole as to whether they think the defendant murdered Erin. Do I hear a second on that motion.

[MCDRAW]

I second that motion. I have never been sure about James being guilty. I do find it very suspicious that her sister died a few days later. If one had a seizure and died. Isn't it possible that the other one did too? Do you know if there were any toxicology reports done on both sisters? This case just baffles me.

[HAWG]

Im pretty sure they did toxicology test on both and they came back no drugs or alcohol in their system. I third the motion because the evidence or should I say the lack of evidence in this case is a complete mess and I think people feel alot different.

[the bumblebug]

I believe the way the coroner worded it when he was referring to Kelly's death was there was something in the family's medical background history that helped him reach the conclusion that she died from a seizure. I do know that some neurological illnesses tend to run in families and some like chatorei tumors can cause seizures with little or no warning. These tumors wrap themselves around the spine at the top of the spine. They generally start forming very early in a child"s life. I understand they are sometimes hard to find. All updates on the trial or rumors about the case would be appreciated.

[MCDRAW]

Do you think it's possible that instead of looking for signs of a seizure, they charged James because he was in the room with her? My brother has seizures in his sleep and it took the Doctors over a year before they diagnoised him. They kept telling us it was a sleep disorder. My Dad insisted that they put him on seizure medication. He said if it was a sleep disorder the medicine wouldn't help. He's been on the medication for about 12 years now. The only time he has had an episode, they tried to take him off his medication. So I know that some seizures can be hard to detect.

[the bumblebug]

mcdraw: the lead investigator said almost exactly what you said on the stand. He said he arrested James because it was just common sense that he did it because he had admitted that he was in the room with her. If that is not word for word ...it's close. Personally I'm unimpressed since everyone knew he was in the room with her because it was he that called Erin's parents and asked that they call 9-1-1. The Lead Investigator also admitted that he had never considered the possibility that Erin had died outside the room and returned injured or had been brought back into the room and placed on the bed. I am a very strong sleeper and when I am asleep after a long day it take a lot to wake me up. The bottom line,.. with so little forensic evidence collected and processed, why was anyone charged with murder in this case. I believe the term "rush to judgment" certainly applies in this case. Comments welcome. I know there must be more info out there.

[pooky169]

I have been following this case closely and with everything said I am not sure that James had anything to do with Erin's death. I mean all of Bumblebugs theorys make sense. I mean if James and Dale had a disagreement earlier that evening that doesn't give him an excuse to hurt Erin he could have told Erin it wasn't gonna work him living there and as soon as he found a job he or they would be moving.
I just hope since LE has bungled this case badly that a man who may be completely innocent isn't sent to prison to serve for a murder he didn't commit.
And on a side note I dont remember did James ever submit to a lie detector test? If not i would order one to prove my innocence if I was him because they are supposed to be pretty much foolproof.

[MCDRAW]

I have been following this case closely and with everything said I am not sure that James had anything to do with Erin's death. I mean all of Bumblebugs theorys make sense. I mean if James and Dale had a disagreement earlier that evening that doesn't give him an excuse to hurt Erin he could have told Erin it wasn't gonna work him living there and as soon as he found a job he or they would be moving.
I just hope since LE has bungled this case badly that a man who may be completely innocent isn't sent to prison to serve for a murder he didn't commit.
And on a side note I dont remember did James ever submit to a lie detector test? If not i would order one to prove my innocence if I was him because they are supposed to be pretty much foolproof.


I'm not sure that lie detectors are fool proof. They say that O.J. could pass a lie detector because over the years he has convinced himself he didn't do it. And lie detectors are not admissable in court. Maybe they should have given him one in the beginning to rule him out. I, too, hope an innocen man doesn't get sent to prison just so they can "solve a case".

[MCDRAW]

Bumblebug: Do you think the police department is corrupt or just inept. Don't answer if it will cause you trouble.

[Blink34]

I'm not sure that lie detectors are fool proof. They say that O.J. could pass a lie detector because over the years he has convinced himself he didn't do it. And lie detectors are not admissable in court. Maybe they should have given him one in the beginning to rule him out. I, too, hope an innocen man doesn't get sent to prison just so they can "solve a case".
I am not familiar with this case except superficially, but OJ did not pass a lie detector test, his result was "deceptive", and as you pointed out it was not admissable because certain psychological conditions whether organic or medication induced can alter a result. Conversely, because in theory they can exclude a suspect who is not decptive, you probably won't see anyone lobbying for a change- Typically the result is only ever mentioned if they pass

[the bumblebug]

This case seems to have taken on a life of its own. I would really like to think that the Centerville police department is not really corrupt. I would more likely think they got in over their heads and tried to make sure the evidence collected supported their hypothesis as to how the events unfolded. In other words, it appears they didn't examine all the potential scenarios that were out there as to how this death occurred. In some ways, I think not collecting finger nail scrapings nor running a rape kit at the autopsy is even a more serious issue. In essence, the defense has been denied information that is almost always collected in strangulation cases like this one. A rape kit would have almost assuredly revealed if Erin had had sex that night which would certainly be important in assessing James's supposed motive. Finger nail scrapings might provide insight into the persons identity that might have assaulted her. Collection of fibers and similar items which contain DNA might also have provided insight into the culprit's identity. Having said all this it might just be that she died of an injury that occurred when she had a seizure. Anyone seeing a person experiencing a seizure knows the event can appear to be both intense and violent. Falls and secondary injuries are not uncommon. We could all go on but in all honestly I am just looking forward to the next session of the bond hearing. I wonder if the judge will issue a summary judgment and dismiss the case for lack of evidence. With all the scenarios that are out there how can this case be tried and a conclusion reached without reasonable doubt. Anybody out there agree?

[MCDRAW]

a honest mistake is better than corruption in my opinion. I

[Taximom]

I don't think this is a case of corruption, at least from the little I've heard. Inept? Incapable of handling a case like this? Yeah. :( I'm sorry for the Stanley Sisters if they are not getting justice.

[HAWG]

I just wish they would have been more thero. Because they wasnt we are always going to wonder about the truth. I have said from the begining that we will never know the truth and that really bugs me for my daughters sack and my grandaughters. Hopefully this will all be over and the right person will be in jail for this terrible crime!!!

[Taximom]

You certainly have said that from the beginning, as have a few others. ((Hawg))

[the bumblebug]

Taximom & HAWG

I agree that Erin and Kelly deserve justice and I feel sorry for them. If the defendant is innocent, I feel sorry for him as well. He has already spent 6 months in jail and has been beaten up with more waiting to come before his trial. I must admit that small towns scare me when it comes to justice. You never know who went to school with whom, who is related to whom, or whose child played little league with whom etc. I would have less doubts if the case had been handled by another agency like the State Police. I think we will know a lot more after the next hearing session. I think it will be interesting to see how much Mrs. Stanley has been prepped for her testimony. Regarding the comments about lie detectors, they do have flaws and can be beaten by a good sociopath. Please note that my postings are either my opinions or come from information obtained from testimony in open court. I'm not trying to point fingers at anybody or accusing anyone.

[Chicogirl36]

Taximom & HAWG

I agree that Erin and Kelly deserve justice and I feel sorry for them. If the defendant is innocent, I feel sorry for him as well. He has already spent 6 months in jail and has been beaten up with more waiting to come before his trial. I must admit that small towns scare me when it comes to justice. You never know who went to school with whom, who is related to whom, or whose child played little league with whom etc. I would have less doubts if the case had been handled by another agency like the State Police. I think we will know a lot more after the next hearing session. I think it will be interesting to see how much Mrs. Stanley has been prepped for her testimony. Regarding the comments about lie detectors, they do have flaws and can be beaten by a good sociopath. Please note that my postings are either my opinions or come from information obtained from testimony in open court. I'm not trying to point fingers at anybody or accusing anyone.

Keep up the good work Bumblebug- You are and have done a great job reporting the facts. I too, feel that LE has goofed up all the facts on both of these cases- IF ONLY they would have done standard, everyday forensics on Erin, they could have some evidence to stand up in court. I am afraid that either:
A. James did it and there was not enough evidence preserved at the crime scene/morgue to prove his guilt in a court of law and he will walk OR
B. James didnt do it and like you said, some small-town, good-ole boys will get their "rough" justice on him and lock him up without enough evidence proving his guilt or innocence.

My wish, as Im sure most WS'ers is, for Erin and Kelly to get justice in their deaths. They were both so young, so pretty, and had too much life to live still. It is a shame that there probably will never be any 100% proven facts during Jame's trial regarding their deaths either. Speaking of that, there is "no one" being held responsible for Kelly's death (which I dont buy the seizure theory). I think taxi or vegemite said it earlier- there are no coincidences. Two healthy sisters don't just die a week apart from each other and chalk it up to a coincidence.- Sorry- just doesnt happen! :mad:

God Bless Mr and Mrs Stanley both- They have that beautiful baby girl to take care of and need to stay healthy both physically and mentally in order to be a positive influence in her life-

[the bumblebug]

Chicagogirl36
You know I kind of wonder if there isn't another option. Could law enforcement have realized their hunches were wrong and not collect incriminating evidence because they really didn't want him found guilty.
Just a thought (IMO). The reason I added this one is because the Stanley's both testified that there had been no violence, fights, arguments etc. the night before Erin's death. If they really wanted to nail him they certainly had their chance since James was the only other person supposedly in the house that night. Just to ad a little more, Mr. Stanley said he usually slept across the hall from Erin and James' bedroom with the door open. Mrs. Stanley said she fell asleep that night in another room. Both admitted to drinking the night before at the brown jug tavern in town. Mrs. Stanley said Mr. Stanley drank 10 beers at the tavern where they stayed for between one to one and half hours. Mr. Stanley said he only drank two or three beers. Mrs. Stanley said she drank one white Russian before she left for the tavern and three white Russians while she was there.

If anyone out there can get your hands on the probable cause affidavit and read it, I think you will ask yourself where is the probable cause. I didn't find anything that explained why the defendant should be any more of a suspect than anyone else inside or outside the house.

I sincerely hope that a local person can attend the next session of the hearing and report what was actually said. We need more of this type of information. The facts need to be posted to forums like this one.

[Taximom]

I hope you caught my "if", bumblebug. Truly, I don't want anything to happen to James IF he is innocent. If he's guilty and gets away with it, it's a shame.

ETA: I also appreciate your info and updates. There certainly isn't much being printed. :(

[Chicogirl36]

Chicagogirl36
You know I kind of wonder if there isn't another option. Could law enforcement have realized their hunches were wrong and not collect incriminating evidence because they really didn't want him found guilty.
Just a thought (IMO). The reason I added this one is because the Stanley's both testified that there had been no violence, fights, arguments etc. the night before Erin's death. If they really wanted to nail him they certainly had their chance since James was the only other person supposedly in the house that night. Just to ad a little more, Mr. Stanley said he usually slept across the hall from Erin and James' bedroom with the door open. Mrs. Stanley said she fell asleep that night in another room. Both admitted to drinking the night before at the brown jug tavern in town. Mrs. Stanley said Mr. Stanley drank 10 beers at the tavern where they stayed for between one to one and half hours. Mr. Stanley said he only drank two or three beers. Mrs. Stanley said she drank one white Russian before she left for the tavern and three white Russians while she was there.

If anyone out there can get your hands on the probable cause affidavit and read it, I think you will ask yourself where is the probable cause. I didn't find anything that explained why the defendant should be any more of a suspect than anyone else inside or outside the house.

I sincerely hope that a local person can attend the next session of the hearing and report what was actually said. We need more of this type of information. The facts need to be posted to forums like this one.

WOW- there are more twists and turns than a rollercoaster! That sure is a lot of alcohol consumed in a short period of time, plus, IIRC, they had a few drinks before they went to the bar-they should have been knocked out pretty good with that amount- IMO, but Im not a big drinker either.
I dont understand about what you are saying about LE not collecting on purpose? Maybe I am reading it wrong, it is a Monday and I am blonde...lol.:crazy: You would think they would want as much as possible to back up their arrest and make their case. They had to know at the time of arrest that they screwed up BIG time, and from the news printed in that area, there sure isnt a public outcry for justice! It kind of seems like the community forgot about this tragedy. I do agree BB, we definitely need more info. :confused:

[the bumblebug]

Chicogirl36
I kind of tossed that comment out there tongue in cheek. My only real point was to point out that there are about as many stories out there as there are people who can make them up. It will be interesting to see what stories the witnesses bring to next session of the bond hearing. I certainly now realize that my attempt at describing something so confusing that approaches what we might call "the theater of the absurd" didn't carry its intended meaning. Sometimes that happens when we lose site of the reality that surrounds a unique event. I think from now on, I'll stay closer to the facts as we know them or as they were testified to be in court. I am not at all trying to say that anybody did anything improper. I think we can all remember when we have moved quickly moved into a forest in search for some trees. Chicogirl36: and others: I not only couldn't find the trees I got lost in them. I do hope there will someone else at the next bond hearing session to keep us all straight. I don't expect much from the local media in the way of solid reporting. Have a good day and let us pray for all involved.

[pooky169]

http://palitem.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080411/NEWS01/804110302


http://palitem.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080411/UPDATES/80411030


Latest updates on the case.
Not alot to go on but hopefully things start going a lil quicker.
I agree that is is a weak case I see James being able to get bail. They don't have enough concrete evidence. I wish I could post more but not alot happening.

[the bumblebug]

I just posted what seems to have happened at today's bond hearing on the Pal-Item forum about this case. They have two forum articles close together so you might want to check both of them. I think I posted different items on each. Have a good Day.

[Littledeer]

Glad to see you around bumblebug. Was getting worried about you.

[the bumblebug]

Littledeer
As far as I know next week they will have a Pre-trial hearing in chambers. I expect a break after that perhaps until early or mid May when the trial is scheduled to start. I will be on vacation next week but will return before the beginning of May.

[Chicogirl36]

Snipped from article that pooky posted, and explains what happened today at the hearing:
SNIP:
Todays hearing was very short with only a few new items being revealed. The defense again asked Mrs. Stanley about the sequence of events that took place the day after Erin's death. He asked about the statement that she gave to the police on the day of Erin's death and she was also asked about what happened the the bed clothes that were in the bedroom where Erin, James and Alexis slept. She said that she had asked James to pick up the bottom sheet because it was wet and place it in a trash bag, She said that James placed it in the bag and the bag was later placed in a trashcan outside. She said the bag was retrieved from the trashcan a day or so later when the local police stopped by. She said the mattress was taken to the Richmond dump about one month after Erin's passing. She was asked if she had been given any instructions from the police to preserve items in the bedroom and she said she had not been asked to do so. Pretty much at this point, the defense said they had no more questions for Mrs. Stanley. The prosecution asked Mrs. Stanley about the bad lock on the door that had been discussed in an earlier session. She said to get to the bad lock one would first have to go through the garage doors or through a metal door that leads out from the garage. She further indicated that she thought the garage doors were locked as well as the small metal door that led out from the garage. Mrs. Stanley also said that her dog "Shadow" was with her when she fell asleep in the living room that evening. She described the dog as an older dog but somewhat active and attentive. She indicated that the dog did not seem to react to any unique activity after she fell asleep in the living room.
SNIP~more at link http://palitem.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080411/UPDATES/80411030

The first link on pooky's post discusses the length of the bond hearing. It is saying that it could possibly be the longest in history? It may not be THE longest, but it is certainly is in Centerville's history. I wondered the same thing, but I didnt want to sound dumb in case it was some special hearing I didnt know about and missed some info along the way :confused: :rolleyes:
Anyhoo, any ideas on WHY it has taken so long? I am thinking that maybe the DA is getting cold feet now that all the cards have been dealt. I certainly would be embarrassed if I had to try this case. I personally think there isnt enough evidence in this case to support anything that they say. It seems Lonny and Dale's testimony has somehow helped him. I also feel that since this is such a small community, that when/if it finally does go to trial, that the community will already have a pre-conceived notion from all of this evidence being made public. It looks like Shipman will need to wipe the egg off of his face before he continues- :crazy:

One more thing- Isnt James' grandpa the only one in his family that could possibly have enough $ to post his bond? If this is true, anyone know/heard if he is willing to post bond? Since this has been such a long, and expensive case to try, would they hold this type of hearing without checking to see if he has a source of income? I dont know if that is his legal right, but since it is so rare to hold a bond hearing on a murder case, do you think they would first check to even see if it is possible to even post bond?

[the bumblebug]

As I understand it the initial reason the bond hearing took so long was because the court recorder had a scheduled vacation and the court did not want to bring in another that was unfamiliar with the case. The next delay occurred when Mrs. Stanley called in sick when she was scheduled to continue her testimony. I believe there is a pretrial scheduled for next week in chambers. I think also the trial is scheduled sometime in Mid May. I really suspect that this bond hearing was an opportunity for the defense to see what evidence had been collected. I would think it might be easier to prepare a case if the defendant was more readily available to help . I think another reason for the delay might have something to do with court scheduling. I suspect this since all the hearings ended up on Friday. Regarding the bail. I think James' attorney is probably working this case on his time schedule with little expectation of payment. I do know that before he took the case he was with James at his first appearance before the Judge after he had been arrested. I understand he just happened to be in the building at the time. What I am wondering about now is whether or not the local paper will summarize the bond hearing and print all the things they missed. I did noticed the reporter was in the court room.

[Chicogirl36]

As I understand it the initial reason the bond hearing took so long was because the court recorder had a scheduled vacation and the court did not want to bring in another that was unfamiliar with the case. The next delay occurred when Mrs. Stanley called in sick when she was scheduled to continue her testimony. I believe there is a pretrial scheduled for next week in chambers. I think also the trial is scheduled sometime in Mid May. I really suspect that this bond hearing was an opportunity for the defense to see what evidence had been collected. I would think it might be easier to prepare a case if the defendant was more readily available to help . I think another reason for the delay might have something to do with court scheduling. I suspect this since all the hearings ended up on Friday. Regarding the bail. I think James' attorney is probably working this case on his time schedule with little expectation of payment. I do know that before he took the case he was with James at his first appearance before the Judge after he had been arrested. I understand he just happened to be in the building at the time. What I am wondering about now is whether or not the local paper will summarize the bond hearing and print all the things they missed. I did noticed the reporter was in the court room.

Thank you for clearing all that up BB- I didnt realize all of the "technical" difficulties and setbacks they have had during this. I just re-read that article, and boy , the PI sure is biased, IMO. Maybe its just me, but speaking from someone who is no legal expert, but it sounds like they are biasing any potential jurors. From reading this alone, I get the idea that they are delaying the trial due to his possible innocense/lack of evidence. Now that you explained what really happened, it shows what a mess they have on their hands. I cant believe this paper has been 'allowed' to get away with this type of reporting. I dont know, but suspect, but is the PI the only paper in Centerville? I find it hard to believe, but then I have heard stories about small town politics and government.
What a shame~

[the bumblebug]

Yes, the P-I is the only paper in town. I think they are part of the Gannett chain but I have never seen this type of reporting at the local level in their other papers. This is one of those cases where you have to ask yourself if its better to ask for a change of venue to get a more objective jury or keep the case in Wayne county and count of the ineptness of local law enforcement to secure an acquittal. I'm glad that I am not James' attorney...what a question. There are new posting addresses this case on forum threads in the Pal-Item. I think they address a couple of interesting topics. I think it is very interesting that the investigator apparently never prepared a statement on what kind of assistance Kelly was providing the police. The Lead Investigator testified that the police said the only help she provided was providing her password so the police could gain access to Erin's My Space page. If Kelly had thought that James was guilty, I would have thought that they would have prepared a statement...preferably a signed affidavit noting what she believed about his guilt or innocence. Additionally, I would think they would have prepared documentation describing her participation in the investigation in order to protect her and themselves. I feel reasonably sure that there are laws out there that address unauthorized access to Internet hosted web sites like "My Space"
I can't help wonder if this means that Kelly didn't think James was involved in Erin's death. Enough said

[the bumblebug]

I decided to post the posting that appears in the Pal-Item: Here it is:
This is in response to another poster who thought Kelly thought James was involved in her sisters death.

Freelancer
Sorry, but I think Kelly actually didn't think James was the perpetrator. The lead investigator said that Kelly's only assistance was to provide her (Kelly's) password information so he could gain access to Erin's "My Space" page. I believe the investigator said that Kelly had some kind special access to Erin's page...perhaps as an invited guest or some other category of authorized visitor. I think it is very important to note that their appears to be no record of the investigator's discussions with Kelly that spelled out exactly in what way she was helping with the investigation. I don't recall the investigator saying anything about getting access to James' "My Space" page. I believe he also said that he got access through a computer at the police station and not the one in the house. I wonder if the home computer was ever examined. I would think that if Kelly was contributing to the investigation beyond just providing her password that the police would want to have that well documented to protect both Kelly and themselves. I suspect that there are laws out there regarding gaining unauthorized access to electronic information hosted on Internet sites like "My Space". Here is my bottom line on Kelly. If Kelly knew the perpetrator or even had suspicions why is there not a statement from her telling the police whom she thought was involved or responsible for Erin's death. If I were the investigator, I assure you that I would not wait to ask that question and I would be darn sure to put Kelly's answer down on paper in the form of a signed affidavit. Wildhorses59. I hope this information obtained from bond hearing testimony addresses some of the issues you mentioned in your last two paragraphs. I think your right . I imagine that Kelly was privy to what went on in the house.

[the bumblebug]

I understand the trial may not be held till Sept or Oct. I suspect that more discovery is under way. I think this suggest that the defense believes somewhere out there is evidence that will show his client is not guilty. It's a shame that James has to wait this all out in Jail.

[pooky169]

I am hoping they are doing more testing on evidence and such as to why Erin was found dead. After all this time and all the bungled evidence and the way LE has handled this I am beginning to doubt James's guilt.
Like I said before I hope if he is innocent and LE didn't do all the necessary testing on the evidence and such I hope he isn't convicted and sent to prison on a charge he didn't commit.
My prayers to the Stanley family and Alexis.
Also more prayers to James in hopes they can find out the truth and if he isn't guilty he can be released to possibly lead a normal life with some contact with his daughter Alexis with Erin gone besides Dale and Lonny he is all she has left.

[Indy Gal]

I hope this man gets a fair trial. We can all see it hasnt been fair for him so far. Now if he is guilty I will eat my crow. But I really have doubted his guilt.

[MCDRAW]

I don't think James is guilty either. I have wondered if she might have had a seizure like her sister.

[HAWG]

I wanted to post since I havent been posting because I just dont know what to say. I have such mixed emotion about this. It really hurts me to think that James may go to prison for something he didnt do an then on the other hand I havent forgot the James that was so angery. I just dont know and will never know now that so many mistakes have been made. I can only hope that it comes out in the trial so that we dont have to wonder if he really did it.
I want to thank everyone for their information it is helping as much as it can. This is a very unusual situation. Thank you for being there!!!
Because they didnt do the testing on Erin that they did on Kelly we will never know if it was a sizure and that is so sad for everyone involved.

[deb2007]

IMO this whole case has been a complete disaster from the beginning. I have a feeling that we may never know the truth to what happened to these young, beautiful girls. They had so much to live for and so very much to give. Very sad indeed.

[Indiana at Heart]

I hope this man gets a fair trial. We can all see it hasnt been fair for him so far. Now if he is guilty I will eat my crow. But I really have doubted his guilt.



I too hope he gets a fair trial. This case threw me for a loop! If I was wrong about James I will say I'm sorry if he is found not guilty!


On another note. Indy how things going with you?? I'm back living in Indiana now over here in Richmond!!!

[the bumblebug]

HAWG
I know how easy it is to look back especially in your circumstance. I anm sure there will be some that will dwell on James past. Nonetheless, I think what matters most is what happened the night 'Erin died. The Stanleys testified as fact that there was no anger expressed, no threats made nor violence present the night before her death. In my opinion, I think there is as much a chance that Erin had a seizure or was injured outside the bedroom. If the police decide to test the bottom bed sheet, we might have a better idea if that was likely what happened. If anyone out there that has any thing they want to share about this case I would certainly like to see it posted, specially someone local. The silence that has surrounded this case has been deafening.

[Indy Gal]

I too hope he gets a fair trial. This case threw me for a loop! If I was wrong about James I will say I'm sorry if he is found not guilty!


On another note. Indy how things going with you?? I'm back living in Indiana now over here in Richmond!!!
Going good!! Thanks for asking. Welcome home to the corn...LOL

[pooky169]

I hope they can get this case done and over with. I used to think James was guilty not I am not so sure. I just want this done and over with for Alexis so whatever happened to her mom can be dealt with accordingly. But after all of the posts I have read in here I am doubting James's involvement.
Prayers to everyone involved in this case and who have been posting in this thread that something good will come of this.

[SeriouslySearching]

This case has really been dragging on and on. I hope it to the benefit of James, if he indeed had nothing to do with either of their deaths. I suspect this is the case and it is hard to imagine him sitting in jail this long waiting.

[the bumblebug]

I too would be most surprised if he is found guilty. It has already been in jail 6 months and by the trial date it will be a year. I would suspect that the prosecutor has already thought about offering a lesser charge if he thought it would get this case off his desk. Nonetheless, it appears that the defense wants to proceed. I think this strongly suggest James was not responsible for Erin's death as he has claimed all along. Does anyone know if the judge has made a decision on bond for James? I have not heard. Also I heard that there was suppose to be a hearing on Alexis' situation but I have not seen anything in print.

[HAWG]

I wish the vey best for James, I hope he isnt guilty and he is a free man soon. If so then they should give some explanations of what happened to these girls. It will be interesting to see what they have to say if he is found not guilty.
I think they are stalling thinking something will turn up. If they had some solid evedence they would have tried it quicker.It just seems that is the way they work in that town. I have heard soo many diffrent opinions on this case that I dont they know what is going on LOL!!!
Ashley and the babies are doing well.They are prepareing to move into a bigger place. Haley wants to go swimming already and we had to let her feel the water because she didnt realize how cold it was now she knows it was so funny. She loves her new puppy.

Take care and best wishes

[MCDRAW]

I too would be most surprised if he is found guilty. It has already been in jail 6 months and by the trial date it will be a year. I would suspect that the prosecutor has already thought about offering a lesser charge if he thought it would get this case off his desk. Nonetheless, it appears that the defense wants to proceed. I think this strongly suggest James was not responsible for Erin's death as he has claimed all along. Does anyone know if the judge has made a decision on bond for James? I have not heard. Also I heard that there was suppose to be a hearing on Alexis' situation but I have not seen anything in print.


If James is not guilty, shouldn't he get his baby back? I wonder why they would have a hearing before the outcome of this case.

[the bumblebug]

HAWG
I heard that James was not granted bond. I suspect that has more to do with his circumstances than evidence. He has no work, no place to live and I imagine it would not be good for him to be out and have to put up with reporters that will certainly follow him around. At this stage of the game I imaging that the judge did what he thought was the right thing to do because of all the recent instances of people getting out on bond and committing other crimes. In this case I really don't think he is a flight risk nor a threat to anyone in particular. I remain concerned about the coroners findings with respect to both Erin's and Kelly's deaths. For the pathologist, the lead investigator and the coroner not to run a sexual assault kit, comb for fibers hairs etc. that might contain DNA or take scrapings from under Erin's fingernails is simple too difficult for me to understand. I suspect the defense will take some time to do their own testing on the bottom bed sheet and also to begin additional discovery to try to find out more about the players in this case. As I have stated from the beginning, this case will most likely be decided by the existing relationships that exist between the people associated with this case than by evidence. I believe we can all agree that thus far this appears to be the case. For HAWG say hello to Ashley for me and I certainly hope everything is going well with the new puppy. She deserves much happiness.

[the bumblebug]

HAWG
I heard that James was not granted bond. I suspect that has more to do with his circumstances than evidence. He has no work, no place to live and no place to hide from reporters that will certainly follow him around. At this stage of the game I imaging that the judge did what he thought was the right thing to do because of all the recent instances of people getting out on bond and committing other crimes. In this case I really don't think he is a flight risk nor a threat to anyone in particular. I remain concerned about the coroners findings with respect to both Erin's and Kelly's deaths. For the pathologist, the lead investigator and the coroner not to run a sexual assault kit, comb for fibers hairs etc. that might contain DNA or take scrapings from under Erin's fingernails is simple too difficult for me to understand. I suspect the defense will take some time to do their own testing on the bottom bed sheet and also to begin additional discovery to try to find out more about the players in this case. As I have stated from the beginning, this case will most likely be decided by understanding the relationships that exist between the people associated with this case than by evidence. I believe we can all agree that thus far this appears to somewhat true. For HAWG say hello to Ashley for me and I certainly hope everything is going well with the new puppy. She and her family deserve much happiness.

[FormerRichmondRes]

http://www.pal-item.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080425/UPDATES/80425013/1008/NEWS01

[the bumblebug]

On the Pal-Item forum there are a couple recent comments worth seeing regarding this case. FormerRichmondRes - Thanks for the posted link.

[SeriouslySearching]

I keep praying for James. In my mind, he doesn't have anything to do with what happened and he has been stripped of his life, his child, and people who used to love him. I cannot imagine a worse sentence than he has already served if he is indeed innocent of any crime against these women.

I might be wrong, but from the time we started this...I just had this nagging doubt that he was involved. From the evidence they have released...I am more confident he does not hold any responsibility for their deaths. I feel badly for this man. I think they need to clear him and let him go.

[the bumblebug]

Great Handle by the way. I think all of us familiar with this case are doing some serious searching about what has gone on with respect to this investigation. I don't recall so many things being handled so badly. I too want justice for those who deserve it and I hope the trial will occur sometime before October. In October, James will have been in jail for 1 year. I very much agree with you when you say this needs to get cleared up. I am still trying to figure out how anyone is going to get beyond reasonable doubt with all the obvious known shortcomings in the investigation.

[HAWG]

There is a good article in the PI today. The attorneys for James are wanting the sheets to be examined and have let everyone know the evidence was not collected properly if at all. I think this will open a whole new can of worms for James. I would like to here from Shipmen on this to see why this was not done in the first place. This will be interesting to see how they try to cover up there mistakes.

[the bumblebug]

to: HAWG
I saw the article and isn't it interesting that those discrepancies only showed up in the forum and not in the news stories. I think that says a great deal about this case. Believe me, the article doesn't even come close to pointing out the desparte nature of the investigation of this case. The day of the incident James was interviewed on tape for over an hour while the Stanley's were only asked seven or eight very short questions each. As I am sure you read in the article, the defense is strongly implying the investigation was insufficient to say the least. I could list most of the discrepancies but most have already been posted earlier.

[pooky169]

I seen that and made a comment on the PI about it. But with the new PI site it is taking some time to get used to the new format and posting.
I hope they can get their acts together on this case as James has waited long enough.
Hawg I am glad things are going ok for your daughter and grandchildren. And I am also glad it seems like you are trying to be objective when it comes to James I don't think this investigation has went well because of LE not doing a thorough job.
I just want whats best for Alexis and if he isn't guilty and is released he can have a life with her he at least deserves that.

[the bumblebug]

Pooky 169 and HAWG
First let me say that I think everyone knows how badly this case has been handled. I wonder if there is some point where someone will say that so much evidence has been lost or not collected that there is no way that his attorneys can prepare a proper defense. Also, I think we have to ask ourselves why so much evidence was not collected or lost and why. I know that there have been times when the truth from LE has been tough to come by. Let's hope we can all keep attention on this case so it doesn't get forgotten. Alexis should be the focal point of our concern...It's is important that she has a bright future to include her dad if he isn't guilty.

[the bumblebug]

Question for everyone out there. If James were guilty, why would the defense want the bottom sheet (the one police did not send out for testing) tested for forensics evidence DNA, Hairs, fiber, etc. Why risk finding something that might hurt his case. Just a thought.

[SeriouslySearching]

If the defense team is asking for it, I would have to assume they feel he is not guilty and want to provide additional proof of both: he was not there and someone else might have been.

[Chicogirl36]

Hi BB- I would think if the defense wanted the sheet, it would to prove that nothing out of the ordinary happened that night or or her sheets. Maybe it is to show that they had sex recently and could have died in her sleep afterwards? I dont feel that they are looking for someone else on them, I think they are looking for just the opposite. Nothing out of the ordinary of two young kids DNA should be found on it. IMO

[the bumblebug]

Chicogirl36.
Certainly if they had sex that evening it would go a long way towards dispelling any notion that Erin and James were not getting a long. I don't thing most people kill their partners after sex...we are not praying mantises you know. Additionally, had Erin actually died outside the room and somehow made it back to bed there might have been some DNA or other items like fibers etc. that might have transferred to the bottom sheet. Remember, Erin had a contusion on the side of her head as well as evidence that she had been strangled. Someone could have smacked her in such a way that she fell and hit her head on a piece of furniture etc. and died and then picked her up and placed her in the bed next to a sleeping James. In this case all types of things might have transferred. Let's not forget it's believe the Stanleys either threw out the blanket and top sheet or burned them. They also took the top mattress to the local dump about a month after her death. Needless the say the police did not ask them to preserve the mattress. I wondered if they looked at furniture in the house or molding etc. to see if their were blood spots. There is a lot more that I haven't posted but that it for now. This might end up being my last post for some time. It is probable that I may have the enter the hospital later this week and be out for an unknown period of time. Needless to say I hope someone will keep posting keeping an objective point of view and looking at the evidence. I did notice on the Paladium Item site that there was a post essentially saying they those either one or both of the parents were involved. I wasn't there so I can't say but I find it interesting that a comment like that has finally come out. Thanks for all the support on this site and keep me in your prayers over the next few days or weeks. Take care

[Chicogirl36]

Thanks for the clarification BB- I need to go back and read up- I dont remember anything about a cotusion on her head- i just remember the strangulation marks and bruising- My bad- I apologize for any confusion-

That does shed a different light- I was thinking even if they didnt have sex that night, they have in th past obviously,and we have learned from the Stiles case that DNA can stay on sheets after having been laundered. Let me back to your orig question after I re-read some posts from the beginning (I thought I knew all the details,...lol)

[the bumblebug]

Chicogirl36
There was a lot said in the bond hearing that never made it into the paper. I believe I either heard it or saw it somewhere where they did have sex that night. Assuming that were true, how would that affect your feeling about the case.

[Chicogirl36]

Chicogirl36
There was a lot said in the bond hearing that never made it into the paper. I believe I either heard it or saw it somewhere where they did have sex that night. Assuming that were true, how would that affect your feeling about the case.

If that is the prosecuting atty , I would say that they had rough sex, did that passing out/choking thing that people do during sex (sorry, dont know the name of it- but fairly popular, sadly), and it went too far. Ahh- I thinks its auto-erotic something? Anyways, I would say that maybe they got carried away during that and it went wrong- Mom and dad admittingly had quite a few drinks each that night and didnt hear a thing. IMHO, they were probably sleeping pretty well during it- also, the dog didnt bark, so that wouldnt set off any alarms- I know when my hubby and I were first married, when visiting my parents, we waited till they were good and sleepy till we did it, and I can still remember how scared I was to get caught...lol).

With that said, it sounds quite plausible that this could have happened. I was going to post a defense side, but I will probably do so in my closing sentences. The more I think about what I just said, it very well could be true. I did go back and couldnt find anything in the threads, but I couldnt find the autopsy report. I admit, i was a lil/lot dazed after looking thru this whole freaking forum, but I didnt see it. I swear, I wouldnt be surprised if that was mis-handled also.
As for defending it, I know its probably not legal, but maybe can argue down to manslaughter and say that it was sexually related. Im not sure how many cases like this have been tried/won, and wouldnt know the first place to look either, but Im sure there have been some, if not quite a few. Regardless the time of sex, the sheet WILL contain both of their DNA even if they didnt have sex THAT night- it would explain all the loose ends IMO (everyone getting along, parents 'passed out' from heavy drinking-didnt hear the sex btw, Erin prob didnt scream due to having sex next to parents room and waking the baby, no struggle (except if head contusion is correct,and with this PD, NOTHING surprises me any longer), dog not barking, no sign of outside intruder (who would NOT go into her room and be able to strangle her w/o James waking), etc,etc,etc.......
You know, it bothers me very much that this young man is jailed and CHARGED with such crime with the lack of evidence, and the evidence they do have, is so flimsy, Im surprised it has stood up this long-but is pretty much paper thin.
When you really think about it, as we have, its a travesty to both sides involved- I think its not right to charge him with what they have with what evidence they don't have. Dont need to repeat it all, we all are aware-unfortunately.
I think its sad for her family to have lost half of their family in less than a week. Poor baby Alexis will have learn about mommy and auntie from her grandparents- God bless her heart-Mom and Dad seemed to do well raising two nice girls who people had nothing but nice things to say about both of them. This whole case is horrible no matter which side of the fence you are on. I know James has a pretty rough past, but i hope he someone in his corner when/if he is ever released?

BB- I was just thinking- Is the bond hearing over yet? I havent heard, but at the same time, cant fathom the PI boards, and havent read there unless you direct me to a certain post :blowkiss: I want to also thank you for keeping this case going- There were so many people on it in the beginning, as we were all interested in this tragedy. You have devoted a lot of time and dedication, and I thank you for that- I appreciate you keeping us non-locals up to date on the local news/case details. Good luck on your project- Do you start now, or after the trial is over, btw- I understand if you cant answer/too personal- I apologize in advance, if so.

[the bumblebug]

Chicogirl36
1. I would recommend that you look at the last few days of posts in the Pal Item under forums which I think is now under comments and opinions.
2. There are no winners in this case. I found it very interesting thsat in the bond hearing neither Mr. or Mrs. Stanley had anything particularly bad to say about James. They said that they had talked with him earlier about making sure he had a job and could support his family. They even testified that the following evening that they were going to lend him their car so he could report to a new job he had just landed just across the line in Ohio. For this reason I don't think they would have been upsat about his job situation since he had just landed a new job.
3. Like you I am concerned about the charge. I think this was truly a rush to judgment because the prosecutor was getting heat from the public to arrest somebody. Regardless of what happened that night I feel pretty sure that he is either completely innocent or at least he has been charged with the wrong offense. If it were rough sex or an accident I would thing negligent homicide would have been the appropriate charge. If that had been the charge I image that he would have already been out of jail for time served. Since he is fighting the charge and still saying he is innocent, I can only presume that he didn't do it. I got a few day respect and don't have to go in for my heart cath until Monday. Take Care and I try to back with everyone after I get over whatever they are going to do to me.

[the bumblebug]

Chicogirl36. Yes the bond hearing is over. I will have to wait until I have heart surgery probably sometime this week or next before I can continue on the case study. While I am recuperating I hope to have a lot of time to examine the case from several different perspectives.

[Taximom]

bumblebug, I will keep you in my prayers! I hope everything goes well. Thank you for all the updates, especially with what you have going on in your personal life. :blowkiss:

[the bumblebug]

Thanks for the prayers. I'll try to keep up on the case as soon as I get home from the hospital. This case deserves a lot of attention especially with respect the the facts or lack thereof. I think it is quite telling that the Stanleys didn't have anything particularly bad to say about James. I also have a very difficult time believe Kelly's death was a result of seizures. I wonder if the police checked the house to see if the small contusion on Erin's head left a mark that could be matched to a particular piece of furniture in the household. I understand that jury selection starts June 11th but I doubt I will be able to attend so close to the time I expect to be out of the hospital. I would appreciate it if HAWG or some other local resident would attend so they could keep us all up to date. Hope to see you soon

[HAWG]

I am going to try to make it to the jury trial but I have alot of extras going on right now and I will try to keep everyone informed as much as possible, You are right this case deserves alot of attention especially since they have not done a good job so far.
Bumblebug, I wish you well and a speedy recovery. I will let Ashley know what is going on Im sure she will send her prayers. See you soon!!!

[the bumblebug]

HAWG
Thanks so much for posting the above comment. The surgery will be in about two weeks because they want me to participate in a very important clinical study that few people fit the parameters for. I don't know whether the 14 day wait is good or bad but if it will help someone later and I am in a position to do it since I am semi-retired then I guess I should do it Thanks for telling Ashley and I hope she and her new family are doing well. Someday, I would like to see a picture of Haley if you can post one. The last time I saw her she was between the twilight zone and a nap. I think you know that all in all I have tried to be fair with my post but of course I am concerned about James getting a fair deal. Local law enforcement's inability to collect evidence, test it, process it or accurately report it has me more than confused. I just hope something shows up that clearly demonstrates what happened either way. HAWG what is your sense of the mood in Richmond, Centerville, Cambridge City and Wayne
County in general. Is pretty much everyone getting tired of this case. I know I am.
Take Care and I'll try to learn as much as I can within the next two weeks and get it posted. thanks Again

[HAWG]

bumblebug
I was involved in a drunk driving accident in Richmond in 91 and the drunk driver only served 6 hours in jail and was released he was sentenced to 8 months on house arrest and it was a vehicular man slaughter. It was a good friend of mine and I dont think justice was served at all. I moved away in 2000 and I really dont go home much because of gas prices and not much left there for me other than family on the holidays. From what I have gathered it hasent changed much. LOL I think the people are some what angery about it and the way it was investigated. My Mom had told me that alot of people have commented on the way it was handeld.
Best wishes to you and to James. I will see what I can do about the pictures.

[the bumblebug]

Thanks for you kind response. I fully understand that you would not want to post pictures of Haley on the net. I hope I didn't leave that impression that I wanted you to post them. I suppose for the next 14 days I will be trying to understand this case better. Often, I ask myself how we got here. I do not want anything but justice in this matter. If someone commits a crime I think they should be convicted on evidence and not a hunch. Also if they did something wrong I think it is reasonable to expect that the individual be tried for the right crime. I believe James was arrest and charged for strangling Erin when many still believed that two sisters and been killed within six days of each other and a serial killer was on the loose. In reality, as it has turned out we don't have two sisters dead from similar causes as the papers said early on. We have one young woman dead and I believe most most people feel there is a lot of doubt as to what happened. This whole matter needs to be reexamined in a different light. I think only then will be get at the truth.

[Chicogirl36]

Bumblebug-
Please do all you can to try and forget this case for the next couple weeks and concentrate on your recovery. I didnt realize it was so soon. I wish you well my friend :blowkiss:. I know you have a lot of time invested in this case, but you have even more invested in yourself.

You will have all the time in the world to contemplate the facts later-

Take care of yourself- God Bless

Chicogirl36 :)

[pooky169]

Best wishes to you Bumblebug on your surgery and recovery. You are doing a great service here and trying to help this case.
You take care of yourself and we can handle it til you return!!!!
Prayers for you!!!

[Littledeer]

Bumblebug:

Adding my prayers also for a successful surgery and a rapid recovery!!! Right now, you are the most important.

I'm sure HAWG can keep us updated and pooky and others will see that this case does not die away.

Take care and wishing you the best!!! :blowkiss:

[the bumblebug]

Thanks to all for the kind words and best wishes. Actually, when one finds himself with ill health a lot of things come into better perspective. My first battle with ill health was 19 years ago. There is an old saying that "there is something wrong in Denmark" (I suspect from Hamlet) that truly applies to this case. The lead investigator said the defendant was arrested because it was just common sense. It just might turn out that "common sense" as applied to the nature and magnitude of the investigation might set the defendant free. The uneven treatment of the defendant in this case as compared to other potential suspects might reveal a bias so great that a true defense is being denied to the defendant. Just another thought for everyone to ponder. If Kelly thought James killed Erin why is there no documentation of an interview with her that validates her beliefs as to who killed Erin. This leads me to believe that Kelly did not believe Erin was killed by the defendant. I suspect that Kelly told someone that she thought James was not responsible and that there is evidence out there that confirms her belief. I think I see a Perry Mason moment coming here. Tune in again...same bat time....same bat place

[miss_vegemite]

bumblebug - i want to wish you the very best of luck for your upcoming surgery and good health afterwards.

Also, thanks for keeping us updated regularly.

[the bumblebug]

Because of the study I mentioned earlier, the surgery is now scheduled for June 3rd. Any thoughts on my comments in my last posting. If the rationale is faulty please let me know. I am willing to examine any and all ideas about this case. Take care and I'll keep digging for the next week or so.

[SewingDeb]

Bumblebug, wishing you a successful surgery and speedy recovery.

This case is still a mystery to me. You made a good point about there being no statements from Kelly saying she believed he killed her sister.

[the bumblebug]

SewingDeb

It makes you wonder about what other potential pieces of evidence might have been missed or pitched. During an investigation, it is just standard practice to document every interview in case the witness later has an accident or just passes away. Thanks for your well wishes also.

[the bumblebug]

Today, I looked at a letter that contained the following: "I will be glad when this nightmare is over. I'm still in a state of shock over everything . Still can't believe I'm in here for something I didn't do." "....In the court at my trial when I walk out I will know in my heart I never did anything wrong to that girl or her family."

I certainly hope that this case is handled justly. These comments do not sound to me like they came from someone who was guilty.

[miss_vegemite]

Today, I looked at a letter that contained the following: "I will be glad when this nightmare is over. I'm still in a state of shock over everything . Still can't believe I'm in here for something I didn't do." "....In the court at my trial when I walk out I will know in my heart I never did anything wrong to that girl or her family."

I certainly hope that this case is handled justly. These comments do not sound to me like they came from someone who was guilty.

bumblebug - I can't remember a letter. I've fallen a bit behind in this thread, so may have missed it. Has it been posted here?

[the bumblebug]

Miss vegemite
The letter is just a few days old. It is a personal letter and is not part of the case. Nonetheless it certainly demonstrates that he has not changed his story. I also understand that at his own request he is isolated and not in the jails general population.
I guess he wants to make sure that nothing that could happen in jail is going to occur. Sounds smart to me. I know the jail has to sometimes have more that one visitation session when they think there might be a confrontation in the inmates area of the visitation section.
Hope that explains things a bit.

[miss_vegemite]

Miss vegemite
The letter is just a few days old. It is a personal letter and is not part of the case. Nonetheless it certainly demonstrates that he has not changed his story. I also understand that at his own request he is isolated and not in the jails general population.
I guess he wants to make sure that nothing that could happen in jail is going to occur. Sounds smart to me. I know the jail has to sometimes have more that one visitation session when they think there might be a confrontation in the inmates area of the visitation section.
Hope that explains things a bit.
Thanks for explaining that bumblebug. Do you have any idea what Jame's thoughts are on Erin dying? He must have his own theory.

[the bumblebug]

I don't think it advisable to try to explain someone thoughts on who killed Erin. As I understand it there were four people in the house (James, Erin, Lonny, and Dale). Additionally, there was one other person who had a key to the house and that of course would have been Kelly.(Erin's younger sister). We also know that one door had a bad lock but to get to that door one would have to have already entered through one of two other doors that apparently did not have bad locks. That does not mean that someone could not have entered one of those doors earlier and waited until later to enter the house. We also know that everyone in the house said that there had been no threats of any kind nor violence in the house that evening. Also we know that neither Dale nor Lonnie Stanley said anything suggesting James had any responsibility for Erin's death during his bond hearing. We also know that James was given the Baby (Alexis) to take of when Lonny and Dale went to the hospital to check on ?Erin. The bottom line is that the only possibilities as far as suspects goes appear to be (1) an intruder, (2) Dale, (3) Lonnie (4) James or (5) Kelly had she decided to return to the house for sonme reason. We know that Dale and Lonnie were observed drinking the night before Erin's death at the Brown Jug tavern and we know that Dale was described as being angry that James returned with Erin and the baby (Alexis) earlier in the day. We know that Mrs Stanley was sleeping down the hall in another room and Dale said he was sleeping directly across from James and Erin's bedroom door. We know that James woke up at 5:15 or so and he said that when he tried to get Erin up because of the baby crying he notice that the bed sheet was wet and that Erin was having difficulty breathing. Lastly we know that James had already found a new job and was scheduled to begin that job the following evening across the border in Ohio. The only thing I can say is that James said he did not kill Erin and I believe he has stuck by that statement from the very beginning. As I understand it James was the prime suspect from the very beginning and little effort during the investigation was directed at any other potential suspects. The evidence regarding James questioning and the questioning of others clearly demonstrates that law enforcement was not particularly interested in developing alternate theories as to what might have taken place that evening. I believe this is what happens when a small police force of around five officers finds itself in over it head and is too close the victims. I think the cause of deaths of both Erin and Kelly need to be fully reexamined as well as the family's medical history which the Coroner mentioned when he announced Kelly's cause of death determination. Please keep posting as I plan on taking my laptop to the hospital so I can keep current on this case.

[MCDRAW]

Bumblebug,

The sheets being wet, is why I thought she may have had a seizure. Were there signs of stagulation? I think I read somewhere that there were but not sure.

[the bumblebug]

As I understand it here is what was testified to at the bond hearing. The Stanley's (one or both of them) asked James to take the bottom bed sheet off the bed an poace it in a trash bag that was then taken to the trash (I do not know for sure whether or not the trash was taken to a trash can inside a garage or outside). The police asked for the bottom bed sheet a few days later and then took it to the police evidence locker in Centerville. The Lead Investigator said he did not send the sheet out for testing for DNA, fibers, hair etc. that might reveal if anyone else had been in the bedroom or exposed in someway to Erin. When ask if had plans to send the sheet out for testing, the Lead investigator indicated that he had none. I do believe that the defense either has addressed the issue or plans to address the issue. I suspect the investigator thought the wetness was from urine which is often found in and around a body after death. For the record, the top sheet and blanket are missing and I don't recall anyone saying James was in the house after the Stanley's asked him (James) to collect the bottom bed sheet and place it in the trash bag. One of the Stanleys (I believe it was Mrs Stanley said the mattress was taken to the local dump about one month after Erin's death. Take Care and again thanks for our prayers and concerns.
I will keep posting as long as I can.

[MCDRAW]

My brother has seizures when he is asleep. When he has one, he wets the bed. I guess that's why I was thinking she may have had a seizure. I hope you get well soon, Bumblebug.

[comfort80]

what if both girls came into contact with something they were allergic to? Would/could the coroner have checked for signs of anyphlactic(?) distress?

[the bumblebug]

Comfort80 See my post 167 above regarding the autopsy. There is a new story in today's Pal-Item newspaper (Richmond, Indiana). It says the defense wants the state to pay for bringing the pathologist back for a deposition on the autopsy. Since so much of the usual evidence was not collected, that certainly sounds like a fair request. I see also there have been two or three comments posted which kind of tell you how the locals view their police departments. I suspect even those who don't want to use governmental funds for anything will agree that the defendant is entitled to get a deposition from the pathologist who forgot to take fingernail scrapings, run a sexual assault kit or comb the body for DNA evidence. He, the lead investigator and Coroner apparently also forgot the track down the clothes she was wearing that night since I recall it being testified to that she arrived at the autopsy without her clothes. The closeness of the players in this case reminds me of some places in the world where family trees don't seem to have any forks.

[pooky169]

My prayers for James I honestly don't think he is guilty he is showing too many signs of innocence.
I hope when and if he is aquitted in Erin's death he can have a relationship with Alexis his daughter.
Bumblebug take care of yourself and don't stress yourself out in the hospital trying to follow this case.
I asked God to watch over James and to let the courts do the right thing towards him. Alexis depends on it.

[the bumblebug]

McDraw -- I understand seizures pretty well myself and I know sometimes what you described happens. Since the cause of death for Kelly was also seizures you may have something, In my opinion, I find all the medical information suspect because I have a hard time thinking both a coroner and a pathologist would not run a sexual assault kit, comb the body for DNA evidence like hair, fibers etc. or take scrapings from under the fingernails of a 19 year old female that had died under unusual circumstances. I also think someone needs to explain the medical history of the family that led the coroner to say that the family medical history influenced his decision to say the Kelly died of seizures. I think it was stress related seizures but I don't have the paperwork in front of me so am not sure.

[MCDRAW]

Bumblebug,

i

[MCDRAW]

Bumblebug, I am not sure why they wouldn't have investigated better. I also know it would be a huge coinincedence for both sisters to have died from a seizure. Especially that close together. Do you know if they tested for some kinds of drug that would bring on seizures? This case bothers me because I am afraid James is innocent. I'm worried he was arrested because he was convenent and they wanted to close their case. I'm sorry about the post above, I'm really not sure what happened there.

[the bumblebug]

McDraw

I don't know why the case wasn't investigated better. I hope it was simply a case of a small police force getting in over their heads and not knowing how to investigate this type of crime. It was testified at the bond hearing that the police force had no policies or procedures that covered this type of investigation. It is also clear that they were unaware of standard investigative techniques and practices used when a young woman is found dead under unusual circumstances.(e.g no sexual assault kit, no scraping of fingernails, no combing of the body for DNA type evidence (hair, fibers, etc)) I am however equally concerned with many other aspects of the case. Why was there such uneven treatment of potential suspect. The evidence suggest that James was really the only real suspect. The Lead Investigator in the bond hearing said that he never considered the possibility that Erin died outside of the bedroom. He said that he arrested James because it was just common sense to do so. He also said that the only evidence seized was the bottom bed sheet but noted that it was picked up a few days later and was found in a trash bag. James had been asked by the Stanleys to take the wet sheet off the bed and place it in the trash bag. He took the bed sheet to the evidence locker at the Centerville Police Department. The Lead Investigator also said he had no plans to send the bed sheet out for forensic investigation. Today in the Pal-Item (Richmond's Newpaper) it was reported that the defense is asking for funds to bring back the pathologist for a deposition. I guess he has sinced moved out of the area. This has been a very unusual case from the very beginning. My biggest fear is that someone who could be innocent has been denied evidence that is normally collected in these types of investigations....evidence that could clear the defendant. As it stands now the defendant will have served over one year before the case even goes to trial. In my opinion, every day that goes by in this case, makes the defendant look less guilty.

[miss_vegemite]

bumblebug - Is the court case now in October? I think I read that here somewhere. Seems a long time to wait, although looking at most cases these days it seems to be the way unfortunately.

The facts to this case are very limited, which makes me hestitant to make a judgement. But I will say I certainly do not like how long they are taking to get this heard. If James is innocent, then this is not only unfair for him but also Erin's family.

But I just can't help to keep thinking that Erin was strangled. That is a fact, right? James was in bed with her. It does Not make sense that either her mother or father slipt into the bedroom and did this with James sleeping quietly next to her. Nor a stranger.

The father being across the room and not hearing anything. Well that is not a surprise to me either. Is there a lot of noise being stranged? Also I consider the amount of alcohol the father apparently drank, and imagine he was probably in a drunk slumber. Same with mother. Possibly flaked out on the couch.

You have also mentioned there was no conflict in the house that the parents mentioned. Well, they were out drinking earlier that evening. We don't know what happened between James and Erin while they were out. They may have been fighting.

But I do agree with you that the Police have done a crappy job with evidence etc.. an innocent man may pay for this, or a guilty man may get away with this..

[the bumblebug]

I believe the court date is set for Oct 13th. Jury Selection I think is set for June 11th. I think what may be the key to this investigation is something that was said by the Lead Investigator. He said that he never considered that Erin might have been killed outside the bedroom. I think there are, in fact, several different scenarios that could account for Erin's death that do not include James, especially if we consider possibilities that involve accidents, the family medical history or errors in conclusions drawn from the autopsy. I suspect one of the reasons the defense is requesting the testing of the bottom bed sheet is to document whether or not James and Erin had sex that night. That certainly might change the minds of those who might think they had had an argument or some other confrontation that evening. We do know from testimony in the bond hearing that there are statements that say that Erin's parents were very angry that night that James had returned with Erin from Columbus, Ohio. I still have difficulty finding a motive that would encourage James to strangle Erin in front of their daughter. That would be hard. Additionally, Erin's parents testified that there were no threats or violence demonstrated that evening. In that regard, since the comments were made under oath, I take them at their word. I do think there is lot more to learn in this case but for now it would be wrong for me to flame the fire further. Nonetheless, I feel confident that there is evidence out there that is known but has not been released to the press. Although I do know principle parties in this case, I will nonetheless try hard to keep my postings as objective as possible. I want most of all for everyone to be treated fairly and justice to prevail.

[MCDRAW]

That is the problem that I see, there are just too many other possibilities. Even if it's a small town, with a small police force, with very little or no violent crime, it seems to me that the police should know how to collect basic things. If not, they should have asked the state police for help. The fact that they didn't worries me. If James is innocent, I want there to be no doubt. He doesn't deserve to live under the cloud of suspicion for the rest of his life. On the other hand, if he is guilty, I wouldn't want him to get away with it.

[the bumblebug]

McDraw
Thanks for your comments and I agree. If he is innocent and there is insufficient evidence to put him away then do the right thing and let him go. If he is guilty, I think important to charge him with the right crime. Without forensics and without an eye witness I suspect he should have been charged with something else from the beginning. Additionally, I am not at all convinced that the public is buying the notion that Kelly's death was unrelated to Erin's. Why hasn't that aspect of things been more thoroughly explained. What about the family medical history and what was meant early in the investigation when it was said that both girls appeared to have died under similar circumstances. How do we get from that statement to she (Kelly) died from a seizure (stress induced or not). I sincerely want justice for everyone here that deserves it. If a local person could keep us informed about the jury selection...I'm sure it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Again for the best wishes.

[the bumblebug]

For those who have not been following the posting on the Pal-Item web page I think it is interesting that the defense is asking the state to pay expenses for the autopsy pathologist to return to Richmond to be deposed.
It will be interesting to see if they get the funds. As badly as this case was handled by the Centerville Police Department, I suspect it is only right thing to do. I suspect I would start of the deposition with.."Why did you not not think is advisable to take scrapings from under Erin's fingernails, run a sexual assault kit or comb the body for DNA evidence like hairs, fibers, semen etc. after you determined Erin had died under unusual circumstances. The second question of course would be did anyone ask you not to do those things. Every time I think about this case I keep asking myself why didn't the police test the bottom bed sheet. It sounds like it was the only real forensic type evidence they had. It seems so obvious that the bed sheet could potentially rule James out or even identify the culprit if James was not responsible for Erin's death. I don't know how any police department (even a very small one) can make that kind of a mistake. Perhaps they were afraid that if they tested the bed sheet they would have to explain how they let the bed sheet stay in the trash bag that remained at the residence after James took it off the bed at the family's request. If anyone out there has any ideas or suggestions I am willing to listen. Take Care and thanks again for the best wishes.

[the bumblebug]

First let me thank everyone for their prayers prior to and after my surgery. I am now at home trying to recuperate and get my strength back. The surgery was complex but with the Lords help I'll should be able to be around a few years longer. If anyone has heard anything please advise.

[MCDRAW]

I'm glad your home bumblebug and I hope you get to feeling better soon.

[miss_vegemite]

Good to have you back Bumblebug:blowkiss:

[Littledeer]

Welcome back bumblebug!!!!

Unfortunately, this thread has been quiet while you were gone. So, I can assume nothing happened or I would have thought at the least HAWG would have said something.

Or, she was just waiting for you so you could relax after the surgery.

I'm sure if there was anything earth shattering, we would have heard!!

[HAWG]

Glad everything went well, sorry I havent been posting I have been trying to get ready for Ashleys wedding in July. Alot of trips to Hobby Lobby if you know what I mean. I had alot of friends in the flood in Columbus, Indiana also plus I started a new job so I hope guys understand. I really havent heard anything at all. I hate the new PI I cant find anything, I will get use to it.LOL Things around here have been non-stop. I will let you know if I find anything out.

[SewingDeb]

Hawg, it sounds like you have really been busy! Hang in there and let us know if you happen upon any new information.

[the bumblebug]

HAWG
First of all, congratulate Ashley on her upcoming marriage. I'm sure you know I wish her the very best. Regarding the case, the only thing I can say at this time is that the case remains as much as a mystery as ever.
If the police had done anything close to what they should have, everything would have been over now one way or the other. I just can't imagine how difficult it is to be in jail waiting for trial. Take care and thanks for everyones best wishes.

[the bumblebug]

I just got a letter from one of the players saying the pre-trial is set for Sep 15th at 1:30 p.m. and that the trial is scheduled for 9:00 a.m. on October 13th. The letter also affirms that James still says that he had nothing to do with Erin's death. Anyone else out there have any ideas?

[MCDRAW]

I really can't believe they have enough evidence to send James to trial.

[the bumblebug]

McDraw
I have read thousands of postings on the Internet about this case as well as lots of other material.
For now I concur with your statement.

[Chicogirl36]

I really can't believe they have enough evidence to send James to trial.


:clap::clap::clap: I third your post :)

I hope that the jury sees what we do- Its a shame that there are 2 dead sisters, but SOMEONE had to kill Erin. That is the only thing that bothers me about proclaiming his 100% innocense. Im at about 95% right now :confused: Hope that makes sense. :crazy:

[MCDRAW]

:clap::clap::clap: I third your post :)

I hope that the jury sees what we do- Its a shame that there are 2 dead sisters, but SOMEONE had to kill Erin. That is the only thing that bothers me about proclaiming his 100% innocense. Im at about 95% right now :confused: Hope that makes sense. :crazy:


I understand what you are saying. I keep thinking maybe Erin had a seizure too. Then again I think it's too coincindental that both sisters died within such a short time of each other. I can't remember if toxicoligy reports were done on the sisters. So I'm not 100% either.

[miss_vegemite]

I understand what you are saying. I keep thinking maybe Erin had a seizure too. Then again I think it's too coincindental that both sisters died within such a short time of each other. I can't remember if toxicoligy reports were done on the sisters. So I'm not 100% either.

I'm pretty certain toxicology reports were done on both girls. They came back clear.

The autopsy report determined Erin was strangled. Now we need to know, by who?

[the bumblebug]

miss vegemite
I believe you are correct about the toxicology report. Both girls came back negative. For the record there are a few things that continue to bother me a great deal about this case. (1) There is no documentation regarding the police talking to Kelly. I would think they would want this documented since they asked for per password so they could gain access to Erin's "My Space" page. (2) What would James' motive be. I can understand how James and Erin might have a problem with her parents or vice versa but what would James gain by strangling Erin. I think it has also been established that James and Erin had sex that evening. I suspect that is why the defense wanted the bottom bed sheet tested. As we all know the local police did not want to test the bottom bed sheet. (3) Why was so little attention paid to making sure the body and evidence was preserved (Lead investigator said Erin's clothes are missing) (The Stanley's said one month after Erin's death they took the mattress to the dump to get rid of it. They also said no one asked them to preserve it. The top sheet and blanket are missing and lastly no sexual assault kit was ran at the autopsy, the body was not combed for DNA type materials like fiber, hair etc, and no scrapings were taken from under Erin's fingernails ...even though the pathologist told the lead investigator and coroner that Erin had apparently been strangled. I am looking forward to see what the test tell us.

[Chicogirl36]

First of all, Bumblebug, bice to see you back- How are you feeling? Well, I hope. :blowkiss: Your post makes sense as always, but Im curious as to the fact that you said they had sex that night. Is this in a public record somewhere, or just speculation? Not that I care if they did, and I wouldnt be surprised- They were two yound kids in love. A few months ago I mentioned maybe this was auto-erotic asphyxiation gone bad? Maybe they were into into that type of thing, and it went too far?

You would be surprised how many people actually do that- It is a scary, sexual game to play, but that's what makes it more erotic to some :eek:. They get off accomplishing it at the perfect timing (usually,unfortunately, right before death). It is more common than the average person thinks (I know I was shocked!) I heard a news program on Dateline a few years ago. if anyone thinks this may be the case, I will look up some stats- I don't want to sound crazy, but something like this could easily be the missing piece to this wierd puzzle. Plus it would account for the bruising she had around her throat.

Not sure this means anything, but I could have sworn I read she had sweatpants on when they found her (and she had soiled them during death). :waitasec:

[miss_vegemite]

[quote=Chicogirl36;2342985A few months ago I mentioned maybe this was gone bad? Maybe they were into into that type of thing, and it went too far?

You would be surprised how many people actually do that- It is a scary, sexual game to play, but that's what makes it more erotic to some :eek:. They get off accomplishing it at the perfect timing (usually,unfortunately, right before death). It is more common than the average person thinks (I know I was shocked!) I heard a news program on Dateline a few years ago. if anyone thinks this may be the case, I will look up some stats- I don't want to sound crazy, but something like this could easily be the missing piece to this wierd puzzle. Plus it would account for the bruising she had around her throat.

Not sure this means anything, but I could have sworn I read she had sweatpants on when they found her (and she had soiled them during death). :waitasec:[/quote]

Chicogirl, yes, apparently she was wearing sweatpants. I also wonder about auto-erotic asphyxiation and if this was what happened. But considering she was wearing her sweatpants, it seems less likely in my mind. I am inclined to think that for whatever reason, James was seething mad that night. I tend to think he strangled Erin in a rage, not premeditated. He probably freaked out afterwards and called out to Erins's parents.... I can't really believe any other scenario. I have no idea what his motive was without knowing more about his personality and their relationship.

I agree with Bumblebug though, the police have done a very shoddy job. To not take DNA from Erin is unbelievable.

[the bumblebug]

Chicogirl36
As you know not everything is in the paper (especially if it is Richmond, Indiana). To the best of my knowledge the having sex comment is not speculation. That's all I can say.
Miss Vegemite
As I understand it, by the time she arrived for the autopsy she did not have her clothes. I don't recall the staff at the hospital being told to preserve anything. I think at the bond hearing that question was asked of both the attending doctor and the lead investigtor...but don't me to that.
Miss Vegemite
I don't recall any testimony that said James was mad that night at anyone. Both Mr. and Mrs Stanley said there was no anger displayed, no threats made nor any tension in the house when everyone went to bed. Also it was the Stanleys that were out drinking the night before. During the bond hearing it was also mentioned that another couple not from Centerville mentioned to the Stanleys that they needed to get a hold of their anger before going home...or word to that affect. Even though Mr. Stanley said he drank only two or three beers that evening, Mrs Stanley said he drank 10 beers in the 1 to 2 hours they were there. I wonder who slept on the couch after that testimony. I seem to recall they were not sleeping in the same room the night Erin died. I think Mrs. Stanley slept down the hall in the living room.
Lastly, I think it's obvious that local law enforcement was ill prepared to handle a case like this one. Take Care and again thanks for your prayers. Please pray for Alexis as well. She certainly has lost the most.

[the bumblebug]

Has anyone out there heard anything. It sure has been quiet. Perhaps we'll learn something in September at the pre-trial.

[HAWG]

Hello, bumblebug
We havent heard anything for awhile but I didnt expect to here much. I think that they are hopeing that all the publicity will die down so they dont look soo bad. jmo
Ashley got married over the weekend, it was very warm but beautiful. Alot of work, I had forgotten how much.
Have you heard anything from James? How is holding up?

[the bumblebug]

HAWG

Got a letter yesterday. I think he is holding up reasonably well considering the situation. He is still in isolation at his own request. He said he did not want any trouble to find him before his pretrial and trial. I think he is for the most part looking forward to getting this over with so he can get on with his life. I get the impression that he feels that the mishandling of his case will help his position a great deal. For now I think that's all should say.

Please tell Ashley that I wish her the very best. She has worked hard and deserves much happiness.

Take Care

[Chicogirl36]

BB- Thanks for the update- Please let James know that he has some supporters on his side- at least speculative ones :waitasec: I do not think they were arguing that evening or the Stanleys would take the opportunity they had at pre-trial/bond hearing and tell the court that they were arguing- Instead, they told everyone that there was no tension in the house-

That statement may very well be the key to unlocking James' cell door. That is what puts the most reasonable doubt into my head. IMO, it shows what type of people they are- Honest, caring, people that just lost their two grown babies and are left with the gift of baby Alexis. If they wanted to, they could have painted a false story of the two of them fighting/arguing that evening, and that would probably be bought by most jurors- The bruising around her neck is troubling to me-

[miss_vegemite]

HAWG

Got a letter yesterday. I think he is holding up reasonably well considering the situation. He is still in isolation at his own request. He said he did not want any trouble to find him before his pretrial and trial. I think he is for the most part looking forward to getting this over with so he can get on with his life. I get the impression that he feels that the mishandling of his case will help his position a great deal. For now I think that's all should say.

Take Care

bumblebug, thank you for the update. I think we will all be glad when this gets to trial. I also wonder if the mishandling of this case with be a big player in the outcome!!

[the bumblebug]

Ms. Vegemite & Chicogirl36
My biggest problem with this case is motive. If James was angry with someone, I would think it would have been with Erin's parents and not Erin. Strangling Erin in the room with Alexis just doesn't make a whole lot of sense. My second is the police's assumption that Erin was strangled in the bedroom. I think that is as likely that she was strangled in the hall or elsewhere in the house and was able to get back to her bed. I also find it interesting that the State Police that investigated Kelly death found nothing that suggested James was involved. I believe they he had an air tight alibi for Kelly's death. I would have thought if Kelly believe James did it she would have shared that with the police. I also think if Kelly believed her parents thought James
did it she would have shared that with the police. The lead investigator told the judge in the bond hearing that he never documented any conversations with Kelly. That raises the obvious question of Why was this conversation. You have to ask the questions was it not documented because Kelly didn't think James had a role inErin's death. That's all for now- have a good day.

[MCDRAW]

Ms. Vegemite & Chicogirl36
My biggest problem with this case is motive. If James was angry with someone, I would think it would have been with Erin's parents and not Erin. Strangling Erin in the room with Alexis just doesn't make a whole lot of sense. My second is the police's assumption that Erin was strangled in the bedroom. I think that is as likely that she was strangled in the hall or elsewhere in the house and was able to get back to her bed. I also find it interesting that the State Police that investigated Kelly death found nothing that suggested James was involved. I believe they he had an air tight alibi for Kelly's death. I would have thought if Kelly believe James did it she would have shared that with the police. I also think if Kelly believed her parents thought James
did it she would have shared that with the police. The lead investigator told the judge in the bond hearing that he never documented any conversations with Kelly. That raises the obvious question of Why was this conversation. You have to ask the questions was it not documented because Kelly didn't think James had a role inErin's death. That's all for now- have a good day.



Maybe she was strangled elsewhere in the house and made it back to the bed to get James to help her. What I don't understand is at first they thought both sisters died the same way. Then changed it.

[the bumblebug]

McDraw
Your thoughts seem right on. I suspect James was arrested because other possibilities didn't fit the the police's crime scenario. I also suspect that Kelly's cause of death turned out the way it did because to say otherwise would fit the the crime scenario. I too remember the early police comments that both girls deaths seemed to be similar...whatever that is suppose to mean. I think it is important to understand that Erin's dad slept in the room directly across the hall from the bedroom where Erin, James and the baby were sleeping. If I recall Mrs. Stanley that evening (and possibly at other times) slept down the hall in the living area.

[miss_vegemite]

McDraw
Your thoughts seem right on. I suspect James was arrested because other possibilities didn't fit the the police's crime scenario. I also suspect that Kelly's cause of death turned out the way it did because to say otherwise would fit the the crime scenario. I too remember the early police comments that both girls deaths seemed to be similar...whatever that is suppose to mean. I think it is important to understand that Erin's dad slept in the room directly across the hall from the bedroom where Erin, James and the baby were sleeping. If I recall Mrs. Stanley that evening (and possibly at other times) slept down the hall in the living area.
Bumblebug, thanks for your thoughts.

Like you, I just want answers that make some sense. Initially we all lumped together Erin and Kelly's death. Then the autopsy report on Kelly was relased!! I must admit I fully expected to see that she had also died from strangulation, from their prior statements about the similarities of both girls. LE/Coroner seemed to have really mucked us around on this.

Me, well I still think James had something to do with Erin's death. I have thought of the other theories, but I just keep coming back to James. I really hope I'm wrong.

[the bumblebug]

miss vegemite
Until James tells me different I have to go along with his side of the story. Here is my reason. Let's say her death was an accident or rough sex or whatever. I would think the charge would be manslaughter and not murder. If it were manslaughter he would probably be sentenced to perhaps as few as two years which would mean he could walk after one year which by the time of the trial he has already served. Why then would he not offer to take that kind of a deal. It doesn't fit into the scheme of things. I think McDraw's comments were indeed right on. Let's not forget Mr. Stanley who was just across the hall was the person who was apparently angry and had been drinking the night before. I'll feel a whole lot better when wee get back the evidence from the bed sheet testing and from a deposition of the pathologist. I want to know why a LE officer, a coroner and a pathologist chose not to take scrapings fro under Erin's finger nails, come the body for DNA evidence like hair, fibers etc and not run a sexual assult to see if at least Erin had sex that night and with whom. When those questions are answered I might be persuaded to go down a different path.

[the bumblebug]

I understand that the defense will depose the pathologist sometime in August. I think it's pretty obvious what the first few questions should be?
1. Can you tell us why you didn't think it important to take scrapings from underneath Erin fingernails since it was believed that she may have been strangled?
2. Can you tell us why you didn't come the body for DNA evidence like hair, fibers or other materials that might contain DNA evidence?
3. Can you tell us why a sexual assault (rape) kit was not run on Erin...after all she was a 19 year old female and it was believe that she had been strangled? Also had you considered that running the kit might tell you if she and James had had sex the evening before her death.
4. Where you asked by someone to not the collect the evidence mentioned above?
If so, by whom and did they explain why they did not want you to collect the evidence.
5. Have you ever had formal training as a forensic pathologist? If so, where? If so was it not part of the training to try to anticipate the needs of the investigators when performing this type of autopsy?

Bottom Line. Why were these things not done and were you asked to not collect the evidence?

[miss_vegemite]

I understand that the defense will depose the pathologist sometime in August. I think it's pretty obvious what the first few questions should be?
1. Can you tell us why you didn't think it important to take scrapings from underneath Erin fingernails since it was believed that she may have been strangled?
2. Can you tell us why you didn't come the body for DNA evidence like hair, fibers or other materials that might contain DNA evidence?
3. Can you tell us why a sexual assault (rape) kit was not run on Erin...after all she was a 19 year old female and it was believe that she had been strangled? Also had you considered that running the kit might tell you if she and James had had sex the evening before her death.
4. Where you asked by someone to not the collect the evidence mentioned above?
If so, by whom and did they explain why they did not want you to collect the evidence.
5. Have you ever had formal training as a forensic pathologist? If so, where? If so was it not part of the training to try to anticipate the needs of the investigators when performing this type of autopsy?

Bottom Line. Why were these things not done and were you asked to not collect the evidence?
I am looking forward to some answers here.

Bumblebug, theoritically, had James and Erin had sex that night, how might that change things?

[FormerRichmondRes]

I haven't been here in a while, so I was catching up on reading . . . Bumblebug - there is one thing that is troubling me. I believe I've seen 2 different instances now where James said, "I didn't kill THAT GIRL." This was the girl he was sleeping with, who he had a daughter with and obviously cared enough about to stay with . . . why would he call her THAT GIRL?? And has he ever said anything about how he felt about her??? That is the part that bothers me most. Was he upset that she was gone?

I'm not saying he did it - it's just the words "that girl" rub me completely the wrong way.

[the bumblebug]

FormerRichmondRes
I believe the "that girl" response initially came from a question that a reporter asked him before he was arrested. It certainly isn't unusual for a phrase to stick with us when we are talking about the same subject.

James was devastated after Erin's death and I think some of the best evidence supporting his claims is that he chose to stay in the jurisdiction. He certainly had places to go a long way from Wayne county.

I actually have photos of he and Erin and he and Alexis that were taken just a few months before Erin's death. She appeared very happy and had her head resting on James' shoulder. The photo of James and Alexis shows James laying down on a couch with Alexis laying on his chest. Unfortunately these types of photos will never find their way into the local newspaper.

I think there is one other thing we tend to forget about this case. After Kelly's death, James was extensively interviewed and checked for scratches or bruises on his body. I wonder if anyone else in the house was checked for bruises or scratches. One last thing, at the bond hearing I didn't here the Stanleys say anything that suggested James had even so much as raised his voice the night of Erin's death.
Hopefully the pretrial will go on as scheduled in September and the trial will be over with no later than the third week in October.

[the bumblebug]

I talked with James briefly a few days ago and he seems in reasonably good spirits. I believe he will have an opportunity to sit in on a deposition of the pathologist later this month. I certainly know that I would have a lot of questions for him if I were doing the questioning. As far as I know the pretrial is still set for the middle of September and the trial is set for the 13th of October. I do hope the local paper has enough sense to publish all the facts regardless of whom they favor. Up to now they certainly have been one sided. Take care and if anyone has heard anything please post for the rest of us. Thanks in advance.

[MCDRAW]

bumblebug,

Do

[MCDRAW]

bumblebug,

Do you know if James has a good attorney? I'm sorry for that earlier post I must have hit the wrong key.

[the bumblebug]

James' attorney is a former prosecutor and held that position in Wayne county which is where the trial is to be held. As I understand it, the judge in this case formerly worked for James' attorney ( I assume when he worked in the Prosecutor's office). I really don't know if they parted on good terms or remained friends. From my own observations, the judge seemed more than fair in handling the bond hearing. I think James' attorney is probably competent to handle his case but I do not know how much time he and his associate have had to work on his case. I understand that he took the case without a fee. I would not be surprised if this is one of those cases that a lawyer might take to demonstrate that he would like to do more of this kind of work. Regarding the case, I really have not talked with his attorneys hardly at all.
I simply see my role in this thing as seeing James is treated fairly by those involved in this case (especially the press). I think it has already been shown that the local press has already compromised any notion that they are going to cover this case in a manner that is fair to all parties. I would like to see that change. I do hope that someone insures the Indianapolis and Dayton media cover the pretrial and trial so that some professionalism will be shown in the trials coverage.

[commongrackle]

Okay...what do we know? Mr. and Mrs. Stanley, and James and Erin and Alexis were in the house that night, and Kelly was not, right?

It has been determined that Erin was strangled, right?

And, from what I recall, James was asleep in bed at the time Erin was strangled?

If this is correct...who came into James and Erin's room and strangled Erin while James was lying in bed right next to her? Unless I am missing something...but I thought that was his original story.

[miss_vegemite]

Okay...what do we know? Mr. and Mrs. Stanley, and James and Erin and Alexis were in the house that night, and Kelly was not, right?

It has been determined that Erin was strangled, right?

And, from what I recall, James was asleep in bed at the time Erin was strangled?

If this is correct...who came into James and Erin's room and strangled Erin while James was lying in bed right next to her? Unless I am missing something...but I thought that was his original story.

Hi commongrackle:) What you say is pretty spot on!!

I have a feeling that the defence will use 'reasonable doubt', regarding the parent (s) involvement!! The fact that DNA was not taken from the bed sheet will also be another factor in Jame's trial.

In my opinion, I believe James is guilty of strangling Erin.

[the bumblebug]

Commongrackle & Miss Vegimite

I think what is missing revolves arround the assumption that Erin was strangled inside the bedroom. I know that Lead Investigators was asked during the bond hearing if he had ever considered that Erin could have been in the hall or elsewhere in the house and he testified that he had not given that possibility any consideration.
I think it is just as likely that Erin got up (perhaps to go into the bathroom or whatever) and was confronted in the hallway as to why she brought James back with her from Ohio. I think at that point Erin was strangled by someone else. It is also important to understand that both parents had been drinking substantially at a local pub the evening before. Lastly I cannot imagine anyone waiting in a bed with someone (after strangling her) until she soiled her clothes before asking her parents to call 9-1-1. I know that I could never do that. Personally, I am more concerned about all the evidence that was not collected and the quick cremation of both Erin and Kelly. I believe next week James attorney will be deposing the pathologist who did the autopsy. I still want to know why fingernail scrapings were not collected as well as a rape kit run. I also want to know why the pathologist did not comb the body for fibers or hair or any other evidence that contains DNA. Perhaps a better question to ask is who told you not the collect that evidence. I believe the pathologist, the coroner and the lead investigator were present when the autopsy was conducted. I was not in the home when Erin or Kelly died and I don't know what happened but I do know that no one should be convicted or a crime like this without evidence. I recall quite well what the lead investigator said in the bond hearing when asked what prompted him to arrest James. He said it was just common sense. He said nothing about evidence. I hopes this better lets you understand my concern about this case.

[the bumblebug]

Commongrackle and Miss Vegimite

I should have added this to the last post. For those convinced that Erin was strangled in her bedroom I believe it also possible that James was out of the room and the time and return not understanding that Erin had been strangled. I recall only too well when my children were that age that often had to get up and either feed them or change them elsewhere in the house depending on where the formula or diapers were. One other thought. James seems, for whatever reason, to want this case played out. If James had told the police this was a case of lets say rough sex gone bad I suspect he would have been charged with manslaughter in which case by this time he might have been let go with a little more than time served. If I had been in his shoes I would would think long and hard about that option if I had been guilty. The only reason I can think of for him to let this case go this far is that he believe he is innocent. Not long ago I read in the paper that James' attorney said this case is somewhat generic. That suggests to me that he believes it lacks details. With so much of the evidence not collected I think both side should feel nervous. I continue to ask for all to pray for Alexis. She is the one that will have to go on without so much of her family to include her mother and aunt. Thanks for your prayers.

[the bumblebug]

Just a quick thought for everyone. The doctor at the emergency room said that when he checked Erin's breathing tube he did not see anything particularly unusual with respect to any marks on her throat. I'm still trying to figure out how the attending physician at the hospital was able to reset the breathing tube without noticing the "reported" crushed haoid bone in Erin's throat. I really look forward seeing what happens in the pretrial...this could get interesting.

[the bumblebug]

For those who might be interested, I think today is the day for the deposition of the pathologist. Let's see now. Question # 1: Why were no fingernail scrapings taken at the autopsy after it was decided that Erin might have been strangled. Question # 2. Why was the body not combed for fibers, hairs etc. that might reveal DNA evidence. Question # 3: Why was a sexual assault kit not run on Erin Stanley. Even if she was not raped, it might reveal that she and James might have had sex that evening and that would certainly shed some light on his state of mind. Question# 4: Did anyone ask you not to run a rape kit, scrape from under Erin's fingernails or comb her body for fibers, hair etc. that might reveal DNA evidence. I am sure that James' attorney can come up with a few more on his own. Any thoughts?

[MCDRAW]

Let us know what happens.

[HAWG]

Someone needs to answer those quetions, She may have just feel and landed and hit her throat so many thing could have happened butt they didnt investigate it so we may never know.

[the bumblebug]

McDraw & HAWG
If James gives me a call I expect he might be a little reluctant to say much about the deposition since the calls are monitored. For now I feel fortunate that they were able to get the deposition. I certainly hope the questions I posted got asked.

In all honesty, I still can't figure out a motive nor do I understand why this case hasn't already gone to trial.

Take care all.

[Chicogirl36]

Bumblebug- First of all, please let me applaud all of your efforts and hard work you do to help bring some justice to James' case. :clap::clap::clap:Your good karma will come back to you ten-fold.

As you know, I have pretty much been here since the beginning also. I do not recall, but are you related or friends wil James' in any way? The reason I ask is that I have yet to hear one word from his family members. IIRC, his parents arent around anymore, but where are his friends? At that age, I had more than I do now, lol. I wish you were his defense atty since you bring up such valid points and facts.

I look forward to daily "bumblebug updates" :) and I appreciate all the hard work you do. I know others have applauded your efforts in the past, but you have dedicated yourself to this help-less young man and I truely admire your self-lessness in doing so. You were even posting from the hospital while you were so sick!! That shows dedictaion in my book!!

I also know that you will do your best to get him as fair publicity as possible. Its a shame what the PI has done to his reputation and trashing of his character- almost seems like that kind of thing should be taboo in these days and times :rolleyes:

Keep up your dedication and hard work. I know that I, for one appreciate your first-hand info and knowledge on this case-

Thank you for all you do/post.

Your friend,

Chico :blowkiss:

Keep up the hard work- you are awesome!

PS- To all of my fellow WS'ers- When I first got involved in this case, I was one of the first to say that he was guilty as sin. After reading the posts from BB, and all of the research and shoddiness from CPD as well as the state police. (I think I made a new word-lol), I can see the case from a different angle and it is very plausible that he didnt do it- Dont get me wrong, the chances are slim, but they are slim to say the least, and that is all a jury needs to have that reasonable doubt!

[the bumblebug]

Chicogirl36
First let me say thanks for your kind comments. Second, James is not without his friends, families or supporters. For several different reasons some have chosen to say little or nothing at this time. I just thought it only fair that this case be more out in the open and honest. I certainly don't expect the local media to help since they depend on the Wayne county prosecutor for all his press releases. Heaven forbid that they would actually look into the details. For this case, all I want is an honest and fair trial for James. For those who don't see this case the same way I do, I can only say this is one of those times you have to say "you have to have had to been there" to see how this how poorly this case was handled. There is so much more that could be said but in all candor it will have to wait till after the trial. Thanks again to all of you for your support and for being willing to listen to the alternatives that were so possible.

[the bumblebug]

To those living in or near Wayne county
In a little more than a week the pretrial for this case will begin. Since I don't live in the area I sincerely hope that some of the local residents attend the pretrial and provide feedback to those of us posting on this forum. I think we can all agree that the local press has done almost nothing to accurately report the full details of this case. I also hope that local residents will contact both print and electronic media in the area (Muncie and Indianapolis in Indiana, Dayton, and Cincinnati, Ohio etc.to see if they will send reporters to cover both the pretrial and trial occurring this month and next month respectively. It is somewhat comforting to know that is a little more than sixty days we should know how this is all going to turn out. I continue to ask for your prayers for the people involved to include the families and friends of those involved especially Alexis.

[MCDRAW]

Bumblebug, I'm sorry I am not anywhere near there. I hope someone can attend court and report back to us. I am interested in finding out how this all turns out.

[the bumblebug]

McDraw
Thanks for your thoughts and comments. I can't help think there is still something wrong here and I still find it difficult to accept that Kelly's death was an accident. Seizures are not generally the prime cause of death for people to have them. Usually they fall or hurt themselves in some other way and that is the cause of death. Thanks for your support and comments.

[deb2007]

McDraw
Thanks for your thoughts and comments. I can't help think there is still something wrong here and I still find it difficult to accept that Kelly's death was an accident. Seizures are not generally the prime cause of death for people to have them. Usually they fall or hurt themselves in some other way and that is the cause of death. Thanks for your support and comments.

I will never believe that Kelly's death was an accident due to a seizure. I believe this whole case has been mishandled from the very beginning. There have been a lot of questions but no answers imo. I had thought at the beginning that James had to be guilty....but the question was why if he was guilty didn't he run? At this point I don't understand why the bodies were disposed of so quickly either. I have a very bad feeling that we will never know what happened to those two girls....very sad.
I live in Richmond and would love to be able to go to the pre-trial and report back, however, I work I will not be able to attend. Bumblebug, I have to say that I admire you for your stance in your beliefs, and I know you have taken a lot of heat for those beliefs but I have to say that you have made me look at this case in a different light....thank you.
Deb

[the bumblebug]

Deb2007
This is one of those cases where there is so much wrong that one has to believe that the conclusions can't be right. I too find it difficult to believe that Kelly's death was from natural causes. It appears that her cause of death was determined as it was because any other conclusion would have linked the two deaths and James would have had to be considered innocent because he had an alibi for the Kelly's death. At this time the best that I can hope for is that other local news media with cover both the pretrial and trial both fairly and accurately. I also ask that we not forget Alexis in all this. She certainly is deserving of all our prayers.

[deb2007]

[quote=the bumblebug;2631398]
It appears that her cause of death was determined as it was because any other conclusion would have linked the two deaths and James would have had to be considered innocent because he had an alibi for the Kelly's death.
<<Snipped>>
I do understand what you are saying. I have to say that I had never thought about it like that...and that's what has been driving me crazy. But the explanation you give makes perfect sense.
I will never forget Alexis, believe me she has always been in my prayers.
Take care,
Deb

[the bumblebug]

deb2007
Let us not forget that initially the Coroner said he thought the girls died of similar causes. The attending physician at the hospital however, said that even though he had to adjust the breathing tube in Erin's throat he saw nothing particularly unusual about her throat's appearance. He said that at the bond hearing. I also found it particularly unusual that the medical examiner was called to perform the autopsy on the day of Erin's death all the way from Fishers. As I think everyone knows Erin's and Kelly's bodies were cremated shortly after their deaths. The family said it was because of cost that they chose to have the bodies cremated. That was also stated by the family members at the bond hearing. deb 2007 thanks for your prayer for Alexis.

[the bumblebug]

The local paper says today the that defense is requesting a postponement of both the pretrial and trial to investigate facts revealed a a deposition of the pathologist who performed the autopsy on Erin Stanley. The article said that the Coroner did not comply with the pathologist's request to hold off on the washing of the body and harvesting of organs before the autopsy. Needless to say this might be the reason that the pathologist was unable to comb the body for DNA evidence like hair, fibers etc. It's beginning to sound like some of the players attending the autopsy might have had their own agenda. The article is in the Richmond Paladium Item. (Pal-Item) and is on their web site.

[the bumblebug]

Update
The follow info is extracted from the a Pal-Item article published today. I will skip what we already know.
"In their motion filed this week, the defense attorneys claimed that Czaja (the pathologist) acknowledged in a deposition conducted last month that he could not rule out seizure as the cause of Erin Stanleys death."
"Specifically, the attorneys contend that Wayne County Coroner Keven Fouche permitted processing of Erin Stanleys body in a manner that might resemble strangulation. "Tissue procurement people performed a bloopd draw with severtal punchures to the neck area opf Erin Stanley," McFarland's attorneys contend in their motion.
The defense attorneys say they need added time to review evidence against their client as well as other evidence they contend has only recently or hasn't yet been turned over to them.
Czaja (the pathologist) reached by the Paladium Item on Thursday confirmed from his office in Fort Wayne that he had asked the Wayne County Coroner (Keven Fouche) to prohibit any tissue procedures on Erin Stanley's body unit (he) Czaja had performed the autopsy.
Czaja said the decision wasn't necessarily "terrible" or "bad" because investigators were treating Erin Stanley's death as natural causes.
Note: I find that last comment troubling since it is not logical on one had to ask the Coroner not to let anything happen to Erin's body until he finished the autopsy and then say it was not "terrible" or "bad". I wonder what prompted that change in tone.
I believe this article does shed some light on small town politics and justice.

[the bumblebug]

update
Just a quick thought, early in the investigation, when the Coroner said the Kelly died of a seizure, he noted a check of the family's medical history aided him in reaching that conclusion. Certainly there are tumors like chiari tumors found in the upper spine and brain step areas that do cause seizures and can eventually cause death to the patient.

[MCDRAW]

I guess that is what I keep remembering that their cause of deaths "were similar". I just think if Kelly died from a seizure then Erin may have too. I live in a small town so I know they have their own way of doing things. Or at least mine does. And the "good ole boy" system is alive and well.

[the bumblebug]

McDraw,
Another quick draw. I wonder if the Coroner might have had a financial motive in not complying with the pathologist's request not to harvest any organs until he had conducted his autopsy. Does anyone know if the owner of the facility where harvesting takes place gets paid for letting the organ collectors use his facility. It would certainly be horrible for someone to be convicted because someone thought his profit was more important than his responsibility to preserve the body. If anyone knows I think it would add a great deal to the case. Also if there is no clear without a doubt cause of death, why is the defendant still being held. After all, he never left the jurisdiction of the court after Erin's death and he has claimed from the very beginning that he had nothing to do with her death. I find it interesting that if he had claim this was an accident (e.g. rough sex or whatever) he would probably already be out of jail. His sticking to his guns (as he has) suggest he truly believes he is innocent of the charges. I too still believe the causes of death for both girls are certainly in question. The tumors I described above are very hard to find because as I understand it they entwine themselves around the spine and lower brain stem. Although I am not a doctor I know someone who had the condition and treatment opportunities are very limited. Surgery for this condition can truly be life altering.

[the bumblebug]

It was in today's Pal-Item newspaper that the trial has been moved back until February 2, 2009 because the DNA evidence test results are not yet completed. By that date James will have spent more than a year in the Wayne county jail. If it's determined that James is innocent I suspect that a truly justified lawsuit might be in order. That would certainly be one way for his defense attorneys to get their fees. Since there is now a question as to Erin's cause of death (strangulation vs natural causes - seizures) does anyone out there have an opinion regarding grant James the opportunity to post bail. Just a thought.

[the bumblebug]

In the article in yesterdays paper the Prosecutor said that statements and arguments made by the defense are not evidence. That may be true but the deposition of the pathologist I suspect will most certainly be introduced as evidence at the trial. Thus far I haven't seen anything that resembles evidence and I have reviewed and analyzed a great deal of the paperwork that has already been collected. The arrest warrant was so generic that if I were a judge I would have a hard time signing it. I don't think my conscience would let me. The Lead Investigator said in open court that the reason he arrested James was because he thought it was just common sense to do so. Somehow I just don't think a jury of 12 people will send someone to jail for a long time without substantial forensic evidence or an eye witness to support their claim of the defendant's guilt. Today is a quiet day for me so I think I will review all the paper work I have on the case again and see what else the Lead Investigator missed. He has missed so much that I hardly know where to begin. FOR HAWG is everything OK. How are your daughter doing and granddaughter doing. I very much appreciate the information she provided me early on in the case. Well take care and may God bless.

[Chicogirl36]

It was in today's Pal-Item newspaper that the trial has been moved back until February 2, 2009 because the DNA evidence test results are not yet completed. By that date James will have spent more than a year in the Wayne county jail. If it's determined that James is innocent I suspect that a truly justified lawsuit might be in order. That would certainly be one way for his defense attorneys to get their fees. Since there is now a question as to Erin's cause of death (strangulation vs natural causes - seizures) does anyone out there have an opinion regarding grant James the opportunity to post bail. Just a thought.


TYSM BB for keeping us all up to date on whats going on with James and his case. I cant speak for others, but from the vibe on this thread, I think a lot of people are with me when I say that he has some supporters on his side. :) Poor guy= Seems that he has just been hit with one curve ball after another.

I can honestly say, from the bottom of my heart, that this is the VERY FIRST case I have ever got involved in and has changed my mind about a person's guilt/innocence. For a silly reason, I would like to thank James for opening my mind, and I will continue to look at other cases with an open, clear mind before rushing to the 'publics perception' and in this case, the media's rush to judgement. For this reason, I will read all facts, look at all evidence and investigate a lil further than to rush to judgement in the future.

Thank you for all the updates again BB- I dont know what we'll do without anyone reporting from the courtroom- PLEASE- If you are local, maybe y'all can set up a system and take a couple days each, so we can get 'un-biased ' coverage- I KNOW that is tons to ask, and I prob wouldn't be able to get in everyday either if I was local, but ANY help would be deeply appreciated!! I feel like these two girls deserve to rest in peace and not just have their last few minutes/days/hours dictated by the local, biased paper. That PI is a freaking joke!!

Sorry for the rant y'all. I have been here from the get go, and the more I hear, the more outraged I get. That young man deserves justice, as those beautiful girls need to RIP- AND,,,,,MOST OF ALL, Alexis deserves to know the truth. :rant:

PS- Sorry for typos- my spell check wont work on my laptop :mad:

[MCDRAW]

It was in today's Pal-Item newspaper that the trial has been moved back until February 2, 2009 because the DNA evidence test results are not yet completed. By that date James will have spent more than a year in the Wayne county jail. If it's determined that James is innocent I suspect that a truly justified lawsuit might be in order. That would certainly be one way for his defense attorneys to get their fees. Since there is now a question as to Erin's cause of death (strangulation vs natural causes - seizures) does anyone out there have an opinion regarding grant James the opportunity to post bail. Just a thought.


What happened to James right to a speedy trial? I have believed from the first (probably because they said both girls died from similar causes) That Erin died from a seizure. That's just my opinion.

[pooky169]

Praying for James and Alexis that the truth is told and that him and his daughter can have a life together.
Because James needs his daughter and his daughter needs a father since her mother has passed on.

[the bumblebug]

pooky169 MCDRAW & Chicogirl36 I think as long as the delays are because of delays in testing that it is probably in James' benefit to wait. Since it is obvious that Jame' DNA would be expected to be on the bed sheet I see not real problem in having the sheet tested. If they find his semen then of course we have another issue in that it is unlikely that someone would kill a partner right after sex and that would certain go to his state of mind in a courtroom. If someone else's DNA is found then I suspect we have another suspect and the whole charge needs to be examined. Frankly, I don't see how we get to a charge of murder in the first place. For the life of me I can't come up with a motive to kill Erin. If this case continues down this path I think there are several irregulrtities about the investigation that need to be examined, not the least of which was why didn't the investigator present at the autopsy let the organ and tissue proceed when he had the body of a 19 year old female on the table and someone had said there were suspictions of foul play. It should have been his responsibility to tell the coroner to preserve the body until a forensic autopsy could be conducted. Why did he not do this? When this is all over I suspect that some journalism or criminal justice graduate student might want to take this up as a great thesis assignment and get to the bottom of who knows who and why was so much effort put into not collecting or testing forensic evidence. Wha is being hidden here. I suspect to that child and family services needs to look into the drinking habits of the grandparents. I have heard all types of comments and read in this forum that the day after Kelly's death they purchased alcohol at a local bottle shop. I am anxious to see how that behavior plays out in court if this ever gets to court. I encourage everyone to read the arrest warrant. It is about as generic as they come. Take Care and thanks for your prayers regarding Alexis and James family who have had to go through this as well.

[the bumblebug]

Quick comment: A speedy trial goes by the wayside when evidence is not tested in a timely fashion and the defense has to wait to depose important witnesses. I look forward to seeing what happens when the trial is over. Is there anyone out there that thinks a better explanation is owed the public in this case? Believe me I still don't get it especially now that we know the Coroner did not follow the wishes of the pathologist who performed the autopsy.

[the bumblebug]

Thought everyone might like to know that I spoke with the defendant yesterday and he seems to be handling things pretty well. Needless to say he has not changed his story and looks forward to his trial being over sometime in February. I think now that the handling of the body prior to the autopsy as well as the taking of tissue from Erin's body is in question that everyone needs to reexamine whether or not a crime has been committed and if not the defendant should be released. I don't know how much doubt the prosecutor or judge is looking for but certainly this raises many questions. Via conversations I have had I understand that members of the Centerville police department were close friends with the Stanleys. This, of course, brings into question why the local police did not ask the county or state to conduct the investigation into Erin's death to aleviate even the appearance of prejudice. Right now the way the investigation was handled suggests that all the people in the house were not treated the same. Take Care and May God Bless.

[dellemma]

Thank you so much for all the updates BumbleBug!

[Chicogirl36]

Thanks BB for letting us know about James. I hope you let him know he has supporters on his side. I do have to admit when Erin was killed I was skeptical, but when Kelly died a few days later, YOU most of all changed my mind.

Thinking thru the common sense of all of it, I do think there is a substantial amount of probable cause NOT to convict him.

I do believe that he has served more than enough time if this is the ONLY evidence that the DA has. Thanks again BB.:blowkiss:

[the bumblebug]

Just a quick thought with respect to a rationale that James did not kill Erin. If James had had anything to do with Erin's death, I think we all agree that we still are not talking about premeditated murder. Absent premeditation, I suspect James attorney could have gotten the charge pled down to lets say manslaughter. Had that of been the case it does not seem far fetched to believe that he has already served more time than he would have been served for manslaughter minus time off for good behavior etc. The very fact that he has not done so strongly suggests that he is sticking with his statement that he had nothing to do with Erin's death. Does this make sense to everyone out there that's following this case.

HAWG
Are you still out there. How are your daughter and granddaughter doing? Fine I hope. Is she getting close to graduation? I am sure she is looking forward to that day. I remember well how I felt when I graduated from college. Strangely enought I was just relieved that it was all over. Nonetheless, I am sure she will sense he accomplishment. Take Care and hope to see ou back on the forum soon.

[MCDRAW]

You would think that if James was guilty he would try to work a deal. I hope it all turns out all right for James. Who has custody of Alexis?