Brianna Denison 19yo Reno NV #5

[LionRun]

I am unfamiliar with Nevada law, but in Louisana stalking and peeping tom offenders were (?are) not "registered sex offenders," and it turns out that the killer in Louisiana had a pretty extensive history of stalking and peeping offenses, but no offenses for which he had to be on the sex offender registry. Is anybody here familiar with Nevada sexual offense laws?

However, this is not the only similar aspects I see to the Reno cases. Again, DNA linkage, terror in a smaller city, unprocessed DNA backlogs, mentioning possibility of DNA dragnets, etc.

I pray that this rapist/killer is caught soon.

Great question, AdoraBlue! I can't seem to open any new windows to search for the definition of, "sex offender" in Nevada--darn windows vista! bad windows vista!

Lion

[StillHoping]

I wanted to bring back up a question I had in one of Bri's previous threads, because over the weekend, I had some new thoughts on it.

I wanted to know how LE got DNA evidence from the November groping victim, as she was not raped. I realize semen is not the only way to get DNA. I am just curious. When I posted the question, a poster replied stating that someone let slip that the DNA was from oils excreted by the human body. I had forgotten about that slip and was satisfied with that answer, although still curious about the DNA from oils, which has been relatively unheard of in my experience.

But over the weekend, I got to thinking, and IIRC the slip was originally said concerning Brianna's case, not the November groping victim. So I guess I am saying that my original question still stands.

How did they get DNA from the November groping victim?

It seems that if getting DNA from excreted body oils worked in both that case AND in Bri's, wouldn't this be a more common and better known practice?

[Ca-Sun]

>
But the definitive tone of the word "strangulation" leads me to believe otherwise. From the outside looking in, it seems like and accidental strangulation. I'm curious - why do you think it looks like an "accidental" strangulation?

[StillHoping]

Great question, AdoraBlue! I can't seem to open any new windows to search for the definition of, "sex offender" in Nevada--darn windows vista! bad windows vista!

Lion

I haven't read up on the site yet, but I thought I would post this for everyone. Maybe it will answer some of our questions about who would be looked at by LE.

http://www.nvsexoffenders.gov/

[adnoid]

...It becomes silly after a while...

It certainly does.

...Evidence preservation, crime scene integrity and due process are paramount. This seems to escape some people.

It certainly does.

[StillHoping]

I think this answers our question about whether peeping toms, etc would need to register as a sex offender in Nevada. This is from the same link I posted above. From what I can tell, they WOULD have to register, but their identities are not made public.

Tier 0 (No assessment required)
Convicted sex offenders who are required to register; however, they are convicted of a misdemeanor, gross misdemeanor, or crime against a child, and are not subject to community notification. These offenders are not subject to a risk assessment and therefore the identities of these offenders will not be posted to this Website because their offense is not listed under NRS 179D.620 (http://www.leg.state.nv.us/nrs/NRS-179D.html#NRS179DSec620).

[Ca-Sun]

"Reno police are trying to identify the female who owned a pair of Pink Panther thong underwear found with Brianna Denison’s body on Friday.

Lt. Robert McDonald said DNA of an unknown woman and the DNA of the man who abducted and strangled Denison were on the panties. McDonald said the underwear was found with Denison’s body but was not hers. The male DNA found on the panties is from the same man who committed at least two sexually motivated crimes against other young college women recently."

More here (http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080219/NEWS01/80219018&oaso=news.rgj.com%2Fbreakingnews)

[aj1020]

"Reno police are trying to identify the female who owned a pair of Pink Panther thong underwear found with Brianna Denison’s body on Friday.

Lt. Robert McDonald said DNA of an unknown woman and the DNA of the man who abducted and strangled Denison were on the panties. McDonald said the underwear was found with Denison’s body but was not hers. The male DNA found on the panties is from the same man who committed at least two sexually motivated crimes against other young college women recently."

More here (http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080219/NEWS01/80219018&oaso=news.rgj.com%2Fbreakingnews)

WHAT?!?! :eek:

[SuziQ]

"Reno police are trying to identify the female who owned a pair of Pink Panther thong underwear found with Brianna Denison’s body on Friday.

Lt. Robert McDonald said DNA of an unknown woman and the DNA of the man who abducted and strangled Denison were on the panties. McDonald said the underwear was found with Denison’s body but was not hers. The male DNA found on the panties is from the same man who committed at least two sexually motivated crimes against other young college women recently."

More here (http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080219/NEWS01/80219018&oaso=news.rgj.com%2Fbreakingnews)

He's definitely playing a game. I wonder if he strangled her with them?

[StillHoping]

"Reno police are trying to identify the female who owned a pair of Pink Panther thong underwear found with Brianna Denison’s body on Friday.

Lt. Robert McDonald said DNA of an unknown woman and the DNA of the man who abducted and strangled Denison were on the panties. McDonald said the underwear was found with Denison’s body but was not hers. The male DNA found on the panties is from the same man who committed at least two sexually motivated crimes against other young college women recently."

More here (http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080219/NEWS01/80219018&oaso=news.rgj.com%2Fbreakingnews)


:eek: WOW.
Maybe he really is playing a game. That or we have all given him far to much credit intellectually.

[SuziQ]

He wants LE and everyone know there is another vic he hadn't gotten credit for. It's obviously not any of the currently known vics.

[StillHoping]

He's definitely playing a game. I wonder if he strangled her with them?

LOL, SuziQ, your post wasn't there yet when I posted mine. It looks like we shared the same brainwave.

[SuziQ]

http://www.krnv.com/global/story.asp?s=7892883

(snip)
Police hope to find the killer and serial rapist before he strikes again. They say about 30 to 36 days elapse between each of the attacks. It's been almost 30 days since Denison disappeared on Jan. 20.
Police say the attention from the Denison case could cause the man to change his tactics or commit his crime in a new location. In the mean time, police say they're relying on the community to send in tips to catch this man.

[SuziQ]

LOL, SuziQ, your post wasn't there yet when I posted mine. It looks like we shared the same brainwave.

It sure does. lol

[adnoid]

I just got back from the site, and my previous assumption of where she was found was incorrect. Here is a map, with the location of Brianna's body marked with a blue dot:

Map of the field (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v468/adnoid/WS/Denison/Windows.jpg)

There has been a cross erected and rose petals scattered on the spot:

Cross at Site (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v468/adnoid/WS/Denison/DSCN5227.jpg)

To try to answer questions about what could have been seen from windows of buildings surrounding the location, I stood as close as I felt respectful to the point she was found and, starting with the closest building (the irregular one immediately West) I took a series of pictures, turning counterclockwise:

Picture 1 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v468/adnoid/WS/Denison/DSCN5228.jpg)
Picture 2 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v468/adnoid/WS/Denison/DSCN5229.jpg)
Picture 3 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v468/adnoid/WS/Denison/DSCN5230.jpg)
Picture 4 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v468/adnoid/WS/Denison/DSCN5231.jpg)
Picture 5 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v468/adnoid/WS/Denison/DSCN5232.jpg)

Note: In the last picture what looks like 2nd floor offices is a parapet - you can see it on the adjacent building.

Note that the Google map does not show some buildings that are there now. While it may be hard to tell, her body was in a ditch, so I doubt it could be seen from the windows in the buildings that did have them, as they were pretty far away.

The signs around town have been updated:

Bring Bri Justice (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v468/adnoid/WS/Denison/DSCN5234.jpg)

[adnoid]

...Lt. Robert McDonald said DNA of an unknown woman and the DNA of the man who abducted and strangled Denison were on the panties...

Holy crap.

[StillHoping]

He wants LE and everyone know there is another vic he hadn't gotten credit for. It's obviously not any of the currently known vics.


I really think you are correct on this. He is having a field day with the media coverage on this, and he wants us all to know that he has the upper hand.

So many scenarios running through my head about the underwear.
- could this field have been a regular place he took victims to rape them, and the panties were previously left there? (I don't think so, but its a possibility)
- Is he (as suggested by SuziQ) intent that LE know there is another victim?
- Could the panties belong to the girlfriend or wife that we are all so publicly posting that we hope will come forward? His way of saying "dream on"

At this point, I am really starting to think that he is PURPOSELY leaving his DNA behind. He wants all of his cases connected, he wants to scare the public, he wants the notoriety, even if not specific to his name.

[SuziQ]

Once again, thank you Adnoid! (I never thought I would be thanking an adnoid). Seriously though, you have been wonderful.

Brianna was much closer to the road than I originally thought. There doesn't appear to be a clear shot from a window.

[SuziQ]

Stillhoping, the discovery of the panties sure change the whole picture doesn't it? Any of the above theories regarding the panty owner are good ones. He's a confident one isn't he?

[StillHoping]

Link with photo of panties.

http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080219/NEWS01/80219019&theme=

[SuziQ]

I'm going to post some possible vics from National Center for missing adults: The first one here fits the physical description of his "type".

http://www.theyaremissed.org/ncma/gallery/ncmaprofile_all.php?A200502909S

[Blondieskatz]

He wants LE and everyone know there is another vic he hadn't gotten credit for. It's obviously not any of the currently known vics.

I agree SuziQ. There's no telling how many women he has actually raped and killed that LE is not aware of. Maybe that's why he left the panties there, so LE would know Bri wasn't the only one he had killed. Sounds like he's playing a cat and mouse game. :twocents:

[10EC_Dad]

I really think you are correct on this. He is having a field day with the media coverage on this, and he wants us all to know that he has the upper hand.

So many scenarios running through my head about the underwear.
- could this field have been a regular place he took victims to rape them, and the panties were previously left there? (I don't think so, but its a possibility)
- Is he (as suggested by SuziQ) intent that LE know there is another victim?
- Could the panties belong to the girlfriend or wife that we are all so publicly posting that we hope will come forward? His way of saying "dream on"

At this point, I am really starting to think that he is PURPOSELY leaving his DNA behind. He wants all of his cases connected, he wants to scare the public, he wants the notoriety, even if not specific to his name.


Well, I am certainly surprised by this news.

It might be helpful to know the size of the panties. Does it fit a petite woman?

I am puzzled. Were they left intentionaly or accidently in the dark?

I am not ready to give this perp credit for intentionaly leaving these "clues".

But, could he be this careless?

I will have to get back to you.

[SuziQ]

IMO, this case happened too long ago. But you never know.

http://www.theyaremissed.org/ncma/gallery/ncmaprofile_all.php?A200300833W

I think this case is going to get more complicated. Do we want a forum?

[StillHoping]

Well, I am certainly surprised by this news.

It might be helpful to know the size of the panties. Does it fit a petite woman?

I am puzzled. Were they left intentionaly or accidently in the dark?

I am not ready to give this perp credit for intentionaly leaving these "clues".

But, could he be this careless?

I will have to get back to you.

I know, I am still reeling from this news also. I literally feel odd right now. This info really threw me for a loop, cause I was SURE this guy is trying to avoid being caught. But now it looks like he's either completely careless, or he is pretty sure of himself.
It would be good to know what size the panties are, but I have yet to see that reported.

I am NOT however, surprised to see that he obviously has more/unknown victims, and I don't think you are surprised either.

[adnoid]

Once again, thank you Adnoid! (I never thought I would be thanking an adnoid)...

You can't even thank my adenoids - I had them removed last year!

Brianna was much closer to the road than I originally thought. There doesn't appear to be a clear shot from a window.

She was about 30 feet from Sand Hill and 100 feet from Prototype, so I guess both of the original reports of "about a car length" and "100 feet from the road" were correct, depending on which road was the reference point.

...Seriously though, you have been wonderful...

I wish with all my heart that I hadn't been in a position to do this.

My daughter had a couple of her friends spend the night this weekend. I was out in back running the BBQ and avoiding the teenage girl talk. It was a beautiful night, the moon a little more than 1/2 full. I looked up and thought, "You know, this beautiful night, this beautiful moon, shines down on me, but also on the heartache of Brianna's family and friends, as well as on the monster that cut her life short. Why? Why should he get to enjoy anything?"

Sometimes I have doubts about my support of the Death Penalty. Then some pitiful wast of oxygen like our perp will come along and remind me that not all lives are valuable. This worthless scumbucket needs to assume room temperature without delay.

[SuziQ]

A third one with long dark hair.

http://www.theyaremissed.org/ncma/gallery/ncmaprofile_all.php?A200300772W

[concernedperson]

He wants LE and everyone know there is another vic he hadn't gotten credit for. It's obviously not any of the currently known vics.

Maybe it is his wife's or girlfriend's panties. :eek:

[StillHoping]

IMO, this case happened too long ago. But you never know.

http://www.theyaremissed.org/ncma/gallery/ncmaprofile_all.php?A200300833W

I think this case is going to get more complicated. Do we want a forum?

I really think a forum would be a good idea at this point. We already have 4 threads for Bri, and I have a feeling that this case is going to get alot stranger before it's solved.

I was researching missing women from Reno a week or two ago and came across Terri's case, I also thought she could be a possible victim. I kinda discarded the theory though because our perp seemed to just be escalating now. But now, I'm thinking he's been doing this for quite some time.

Now I am wondering if he has been trying to get more of a spotlight on "his cases". Could that be why he went back to the Nov. victims home?

Another thought: (and I know this is kinda off from most profiling in these types of cases) Maybe he is not escalating just now. Maybe he has been doing this for awhile, and it's part of his game to decide which victims he kills and which he lets go.

I can say, that I no longer believe he is in his early 20's as I previously did. I have to agree more with 10ECDad now, he is likely in his early 30's, and I think he has much more experience behind him than we originally thought.

[Ca-Sun]

Maybe it is his wife's or girlfriend's panties. :eek:I was about to post the same exact thought. I hope that isn't the case because I think it would be very difficult for her to go to the authorities and report him.

[SuziQ]

The only three missing women that I have found so far all fit the type that LE talked about. Long dark hair.

I'll PM a mod about getting a forum. The we can all spread out and move info into different threads. Adnoid, you could set up a photo thread, etc.

[StillHoping]

A third one with long dark hair.

http://www.theyaremissed.org/ncma/gallery/ncmaprofile_all.php?A200300772W


I considered Star also, and wanted to point out that she goes along with the theory I share with 10ECDad. Star is believed to have turned to prostitution to support her drug habits.
Also of interest in Stars case, very peculiar items were found in her car including a drawing of a woman who looked like Star, bound and gagged.

[Ca-Sun]

I wish with all my heart that I hadn't been in a position to do this.

This worthless scumbucket needs to assume room temperature without delay.Cases like this are extra difficult when it is so close to home. I appreciate what you have brought to us so much! Thank you.

I really feel it is just a matter of time until this worthless POS is brought to justice.

[SuziQ]

Also of interest in Stars case, very peculiar items were found in her car including a drawing of a woman who looked like Star, bound and gagged.

Wow, that's interesting. I would like to read more about her case if you have a link, thanks!

[StillHoping]

Okay, I said in a previous post that this latest news made me feel odd. I am having a major case of creepy-crawlies that won't go away at the moment. Yuck.

So maybe this is a really out there thought, but it came to me, and I thought I should share it.

What if the woman's DNA on the panties turns out to match a missing person, but a MUCH older case or a case from a different area?

I just feel like there is a specific reason the panties were left where Brianna was found. I leave it open that it could have been an accident or carelessness, but I just "feel" that they were purposely left.

[newshound81]

Okay, I said in a previous post that this latest news made me feel odd. I am having a major case of creepy-crawlies that won't go away at the moment. Yuck.

So maybe this is a really out there thought, but it came to me, and I thought I should share it.

What if the woman's DNA on the panties turns out to match a missing person, but a MUCH older case or a case from a different area?

I just feel like there is a specific reason the panties were left where Brianna was found. I leave it open that it could have been an accident or carelessness, but I just "feel" that they were purposely left.
Great point. I was just thinking that Pink Panther isn't really popular anymore....they seem like they might be an old type of panty. I've never seen PP thongs before, and I am part of the generation that wears them frequently.

[StillHoping]

Wow, that's interesting. I would like to read more about her case if you have a link, thanks!

I will look for more info (don't remember where I originally read up on Star's case) but here is some info. Also two other cases that might be connected are at this link.
Jeanette Marie Corpuz and Jennifer Casper-Ross. Jennifer is VERY pretty and somehow reminds me of Brianna. Maybe it's the big gorgeous innocent smile.

http://www.cityofreno.com/index.aspx?page=894

and also:
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-37989

[SuziQ]

Thank you StillHoping, what an odd case.

[10EC_Dad]

Okay, I said in a previous post that this latest news made me feel odd. I am having a major case of creepy-crawlies that won't go away at the moment. Yuck.

So maybe this is a really out there thought, but it came to me, and I thought I should share it.

What if the woman's DNA on the panties turns out to match a missing person, but a MUCH older case or a case from a different area?

I just feel like there is a specific reason the panties were left where Brianna was found. I leave it open that it could have been an accident or carelessness, but I just "feel" that they were purposely left.


Does anyone know what phase the moon was in the night Brianna was abducted? I guess what I am really asking is, how much light is available at night where Brianna was found?

[10EC_Dad]

Great point. I was just thinking that Pink Panther isn't really popular anymore....they seem like they might be an old type of panty. I've never seen PP thongs before, and I am part of the generation that wears them frequently.

Can someone research if Pink Panther thongs are still available?

[close_enough]

Okay, I said in a previous post that this latest news made me feel odd. I am having a major case of creepy-crawlies that won't go away at the moment. Yuck.

So maybe this is a really out there thought, but it came to me, and I thought I should share it.

What if the woman's DNA on the panties turns out to match a missing person, but a MUCH older case or a case from a different area?

I just feel like there is a specific reason the panties were left where Brianna was found. I leave it open that it could have been an accident or carelessness, but I just "feel" that they were purposely left.

:eek:

i think so too!

[close_enough]

Can someone research if Pink Panther thongs are still available?

they are...

http://www.webundies.com/pink_panther_women.htm

although, i don't see black ones...

[dimples37398]

I don't think they were accidently left at all, I also don't think that he has been keeping these for years....

I have a weird creepy crawly feeling that they may be a girlfriends or wife whom may be involved somehow, wether knowing what he is doing, participating, helping cover up......something....I believe they were what he used to strangle her. I really really really have a feeling they were a females that is still in his life.

I hope and pray this isn't the case, but I just have a strange feeling that it may very well be the case, and this could be why nobody has turned him in.

Actually in that one crazy dream the other night where I dreamt that the blood on the pillow was from her biting her tongue, I also dreamt something about the significant other being involved somehow. I told hubby about it and just blew it off. I have never and still don't have dreams that mean or amount to anything at all.

A family man, wife, kids, little league coach, soccer coach, position of authority?....something. I am betting when he is caught that a whole bunch of people in his life will be stunned.

Kel

[adnoid]

I was about to post the same exact thought. I hope that isn't the case because I think it would be very difficult for her to go to the authorities and report him.

Perhaps they are from a women he was involved with in the past, the message being "Go to the cops, sweetheart, and you or someone you care about will be next".

[newshound81]

Does anyone know what phase the moon was in the night Brianna was abducted? I guess what I am really asking is, how much light is available at night where Brianna was found?
According to http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/astronomy.html?n=127&month=1&year=2008&obj=moon&afl=-1&day=1, it was between the first quarter and full and it was 97 percent illuminated. It set at around 5:30. The sun did not rise that day tilk 7 a.m....time in darkness for the perp to carry out his crime.

[adnoid]

although, i don't see black ones...

And be forewarned - a Google search on "black pink panther thong" gets you stuff you probably don't want. Adding "women's" helps. A little. But still nothing I've found that matches.

[newshound81]

Same here adnoid. Also, I just had a sick thought: what if the panties represent what the perp wants to be known as in terms of hunting women - "The Pink Panther?"

[aj1020]

I know its a pain. Want a forum to thread out some subjects??

I really think a forum would be a good idea at this point. We already have 4 threads for Bri, and I have a feeling that this case is going to get alot stranger before it's solved.

We didn't take chico up on the forum offer from yesterday. Thanks, chico. :)

[lorelei]

http://www.amazon.com/Panther-Caught-Handed-Panty-women/dp/B000VKQGXE/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&s=apparel&qid=1203455476&sr=1-4
This pattern looks closer to the one in the picture, but no hearts from what I can tell. Its from the same shop as the other pair close enough posted. Maybe the exact style isn't sold anymore. Does anyone think this pattern matches (minus the hearts)?
add- also not thong, but again maybe that style isn't sold anymore?

[chicoliving]

Soon as I get back I'll get it er up and going! bbs

[newshound81]

Found them in white:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Auth-PINK-PANTHER-Underwear-PINK-HEART-Thong-Panty-NWT_W0QQitemZ220095744924QQihZ012QQcategoryZ63854Q QrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQ_trksidZp1638.m118.l1247QQ cmdZViewItem

[Ca-Sun]

Perhaps they are from a women he was involved with in the past, the message being "Go to the cops, sweetheart, and you or someone you care about will be next".Let's hope!

[lew657]

I searched a bunch of websites and I couldn't find a match to these. Must be an old style - the hearts made me think a valentine's day pair? The article does say the appear "worn" and in the picture they look faded (could be the pic but makes me think they could be last year's style?

IMO he wanted them to be found - he wants credit for his "accomplishments." I think he feels he is smarter than the LE and they will never catch him - definitely not a convicted SO with DNA on file.

What about fingerprints - I work in finance and I know FINRA requires we all be fingerprinted. Not sure who they share their data with though. He carried her - there have to be some on her somewhere?

[adnoid]

The RJG has a full picture of them:

Panties - Full Shot (http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/misc?url=/misc/zoompicture.pbs&Site=J7&Date=20080219&Category=NEWS01&ArtNo=80219019&Ref=V1&rgj_caption=Underwear%20found%20near%20Brianna%20D enison%27s%20body%20that%20were%20not%20hers.&rgj_credit=Reno%20PD&cachetime=0)

I see that there is a tag on there but they are not giving out the info on the tag - very smart!

[StillHoping]

Same here adnoid. Also, I just had a sick thought: what if the panties represent what the perp wants to be known as in terms of hunting women - "The Pink Panther?"

That thought crossed my mind also. A panther is a stealthy creature which stalks it's prey. Fitting maybe?

Adnoid,
I hadn't considered that the panties were left as a message/warning to a previous woman in his life. But that is a big possibility. How scary if that's the case.

Also, I wanted to mention that these panties probably belong to a teenager or college aged girl. While I'm sure some older women, may still wear them, especially if they fit into the Jr's size clothing still, cartoon character underwear is much more popular with the younger crowd.

[close_enough]

And be forewarned - a Google search on "black pink panther thong" gets you stuff you probably don't want. Adding "women's" helps. A little. But still nothing I've found that matches.

lol..thanks

i did a search with just the words "Pink Panther clothing"....i had no idea there was so much PP stuff out there!

[aj1020]

The RJG has a full picture of them:

Panties - Full Shot (http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/misc?url=/misc/zoompicture.pbs&Site=J7&Date=20080219&Category=NEWS01&ArtNo=80219019&Ref=V1&rgj_caption=Underwear%20found%20near%20Brianna%20D enison%27s%20body%20that%20were%20not%20hers.&rgj_credit=Reno%20PD&cachetime=0)

I see that there is a tag on there but they are not giving out the info on the tag - very smart!

I just think the undies are worn and old and the writing on the satin tag has worn off. Mine do that quite often and I think it's pretty common.

[aj1020]

Also, I wanted to mention that these panties probably belong to a teenager or college aged girl. While I'm sure some older women, may still wear them, especially if they fit into the Jr's size clothing still, cartoon character underwear is much more popular with the younger crowd.

Ummm, without revealing too much info that ya'll don't want to hear :D, I think you'd be surprised at the age of women who wear thongs. It's many, many years past the college-age. If my circle of friends is any indication - I'd say up into the lower 30s it's fairly common.

[close_enough]

http://www.amazon.com/Panther-Caught-Handed-Panty-women/dp/B000VKQGXE/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&s=apparel&qid=1203455476&sr=1-4
This pattern looks closer to the one in the picture, but no hearts from what I can tell. Its from the same shop as the other pair close enough posted. Maybe the exact style isn't sold anymore. Does anyone think this pattern matches (minus the hearts)?
add- also not thong, but again maybe that style isn't sold anymore?

yes, i think it's very close to the pattern, but i think you're right...i'll guess the style isn't sold anymore.....hmmm

[DeltaDawn]

The RJG has a full picture of them:

Panties - Full Shot (http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/misc?url=/misc/zoompicture.pbs&Site=J7&Date=20080219&Category=NEWS01&ArtNo=80219019&Ref=V1&rgj_caption=Underwear%20found%20near%20Brianna%20D enison%27s%20body%20that%20were%20not%20hers.&rgj_credit=Reno%20PD&cachetime=0)

I see that there is a tag on there but they are not giving out the info on the tag - very smart!


Also..notice the bows..they are in very good shape, after several washings they would have frayed somewhat.

Yep, he purposely left these. I think they belong to another vic that has not come forward. Maybe it is meant to scare her enough to believe he's coming back for more. If she had come forward then the police would know who she was, they'd have her DNA. He is trying to leave a message not only to police but to the owner of those panties. I pray this person, if still alive, gets her self to the police and fast.

Or, this is far out there though, these belong to his next vic who he has been stalking. He grabbed them somewhere in a laundry mat where students do their laundry, out of someone's dirty wash pile. Then had his way with them if you will. I know..I did say this was bizarre.

Anywhoo anyone missing thongs matching these needs to get to the police ASAP.

Also the description says he is about 5"6" tall ..that is relatively short for a man..so that should help narrow the search somewhat..if that info is correct.

[close_enough]

I just think the undies are worn and old and the writing on the satin tag has worn off. Mine do that quite often and I think it's pretty common.

yep, i think you're right...they do look old/faded somewhat, imo....

eta..thanks for the full shot, adnoid:)

[Leila]

Some Other Issues:

It is possible that Brianna may have been severely unconscious or dead before being removed from the house. This is certainly not to assert that she didn't fight like crazy; however, if this guy did get the jump on her and covered her with a pillow to the point of a nose bleed there may have also been enough pressure to have killed her.

I cannot possibly rule out (1) either a part-time student at UNR; or (2) perhaps a maintenance worker; yet, most of all and (3) I do not believe that Brianna was the intended victim. Here's my reasoning:

It seems to me that this perp is very well aware of this house, its occupants, and all manner of things that go on inside. To leave a door unlocked—anywhere in this country—is basically an act of lunacy. How quickly do you suppose just by word of mouth it spread throughout a university district that there's a party and if no one answers the door, just walk in, they leave it unlocked? This is extremely real to me insofar as it's happened to me.

Moreover, I've been privy to such information just sitting in class before. So I ask my friend, a very attractive (to-die-for) friend, "hey…what's up with that rubbish?" She says to me, "…oh everyone knows I have roommates that are on the football team so they don't f**k around…" What if…

Lastly, DeltaDawn...the attempt burglary was approximately 5 or so hours before Brianna was abducted. From what I gathered, the Dec. victim originally "out of town" then the next thing I read was she was "out of the country" and then spoken to again via telephone.

Leviosa.............you bring up some excellent points. In particular in regards to how Brianna's blood may have gotten on the pillow. If she had been sound asleep and the suspect entered so quietly that she didn't wake up, he could have grabbed her from behind like the other victim, with his hand over her mouth and nose. She struggled, and he placed a pillow over her face to subdue her. That would account for why the others didn't hear anything and it accounts for the blood on the pillow. Brianna may have been unconscious when she was taken out of there.

[StillHoping]

Ummm, without revealing too much info that ya'll don't want to hear :D, I think you'd be surprised at the age of women who wear thongs. It's many, many years past the college-age. If my circle of friends is any indication - I'd say up into the lower 30s it's fairly common.

Sorry, I think my post was unclear. I didn't mean to suggest that thongs are not generally worn by older women, but that cartoon character underwear is not as popular with older women. (I know there are some who will wear them still). I am petite and still shop in the Jr's section but I avoid alot of the cutesy stuff. I think alot less cartoon themed clothing is available for older women.

[close_enough]

Found them in white:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Auth-PINK-PANTHER-Underwear-PINK-HEART-Thong-Panty-NWT_W0QQitemZ220095744924QQihZ012QQcategoryZ63854Q QrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQ_trksidZp1638.m118.l1247QQ cmdZViewItem

oh, you sure did!

[adnoid]

Ummm, without revealing too much info that ya'll don't want to hear :D, I think you'd be surprised at the age of women who wear thongs. It's many, many years past the college-age. If my circle of friends is any indication - I'd say up into the lower 30s it's fairly common.

I would never reveal Mrs. Adnoid's age. She and I are the same age, however, and it's all she wears.

[aj1020]

Sorry, I think my post was unclear. I didn't mean to suggest that thongs are not generally worn by older women, but that cartoon character underwear is not as popular with older women. (I know there are some who will wear them still). I am petite and still shop in the Jr's section but I avoid alot of the cutesy stuff. I think alot less cartoon themed clothing is available for older women.

Oh gotcha. Yes, I agree that cartoon characters would mostly be worn by the college crowd... which definitely seems to fit the perp's MO.

[dimples37398]

http://www.krnv.com/global/story.asp?s=7892883

Police asked area resident Scott Birmingham to submit a DNA sample after a tip came in. Birmingham, who does not fit the suspect description, said police were nice and apologetic about having to go through with the testing. Birmingham says he's happy to help in the process.

[j2mirish]

I wish with all my heart that I hadn't been in a position to do this.

My daughter had a couple of her friends spend the night this weekend. I was out in back running the BBQ and avoiding the teenage girl talk. It was a beautiful night, the moon a little more than 1/2 full. I looked up and thought, "You know, this beautiful night, this beautiful moon, shines down on me, but also on the heartache of Brianna's family and friends, as well as on the monster that cut her life short. Why? Why should he get to enjoy anything?"

Sometimes I have doubts about my support of the Death Penalty. Then some pitiful wast of oxygen like our perp will come along and remind me that not all lives are valuable. This worthless scumbucket needs to assume room temperature without delay.
:blowkiss::blowkiss:

[StillHoping]

I searched a bunch of websites and I couldn't find a match to these. Must be an old style - the hearts made me think a valentine's day pair? The article does say the appear "worn" and in the picture they look faded (could be the pic but makes me think they could be last year's style?

While googling it myself, I found a hit that had a Valentines Day special on some Pink Panther undies, though I couldn't open the link (blocked at work). But it made me wonder, is there some significance to Valentine's Day? I had to question it due to the fact that Bri was found the day after V-day, and the panties seem V-day themed. That lead me to a horrible thought...
Could the perp have abducted someone else (maybe even on V-day) and left the panties where he left Bri's body? As in "Here's a clue to the next one"?

I know I am stretching here, but I really think there is a message to be deciphered.

[SuziQ]

Or, this is far out there though, these belong to his next vic who he has been stalking. He grabbed them somewhere in a laundry mat where students do their laundry, out of someone's dirty wash pile. Then had his way with them if you will. I know..I did say this was bizarre.

I don't think it's far out there at all. Very plausible IMO.

[SuziQ]

The UW doesn't look like it's been exposed to the elements or exposed to the elements that long. Were they sealed in a bag? Or was Brianna not there very long.

[dimples37398]

Here is a link to the large photo of the panties that Newshound found. They do seem to be the exact same ones but white. On these the bows are pink..I would assume they are suppose to be pink on the black ones too, they look silver/gray to me though.

http://img.inkfrog.com/click_enlarge1.php?image=feb07_437.jpg&username=dragonrath45

Here is a link to an article where you can see the closer photo of the ones found near brianna....You can click on the photos in the article to blow them up bigger....

http://www.nevadaappeal.com/article/20080219/NEWS01/626051833

[newshound81]

DeltaDawn and StillHoping, I think those are great theories! I completely forgot that Brianna was found right after Valentine's Day. The only thing that would be slightly weird about that is the fact that Brianna was there for at least a week, possibly longer. So these panties, whoever they belong to, were taken at least a week and a half ago at this point.

[DeltaDawn]

The UW doesn't look like it's been exposed to the elements or exposed to the elements that long. Were they sealed in a bag? Or was Brianna not there very long.


I agree the thongs don't look like they have been in the snow, dirt etc and the bows on them are not frayed, they look perfect from that stan point. Maybe Brianna was clothed and he stuffed these inside a pocket or under her shirt. Otherwise I would think they would look much worse if laying in the elements for atleast a week. Interesting we have heard no more on an exact timeframe that they believe she was laying there or the time of death.

[newshound81]

Oops, I meant two and a half weeks! I can't do math :crazy:

[Leila]

"Reno police are trying to identify the female who owned a pair of Pink Panther thong underwear found with Brianna Denison’s body on Friday.

Lt. Robert McDonald said DNA of an unknown woman and the DNA of the man who abducted and strangled Denison were on the panties. McDonald said the underwear was found with Denison’s body but was not hers. The male DNA found on the panties is from the same man who committed at least two sexually motivated crimes against other young college women recently."

More here (http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080219/NEWS01/80219018&oaso=news.rgj.com%2Fbreakingnews)

OMG...........there might be another victim out there.....someone who the suspect raped and kept their underwear as a souvenir. OR, is this the underwear of the wife or girlfriend of the suspect!

[newshound81]

OMG...........there might be another victim out there.....someone who the suspect raped and kept their underwear as a souvenir. OR, is this the underwear of the wife or girlfriend of the suspect!
If anyone cares to sift through with me, I just found the police blotters for UNR for all of 2007 and this year: http://www.unr.edu/vpaf/police/blotters/BlotterArchives2007.htm

[aj1020]

If anyone cares to sift through with me, I just found the police blotters for UNR for all of 2007 and this year: http://www.unr.edu/vpaf/police/blotters/BlotterArchives2007.htm

I wonder why they only have the daily blotters from certain days. All the important, recent dates aren't available.

ETA: nevermind, I'm dumb. It's just the summary of the previous days activities, posted on that certain day...:doh:

[Leila]

I just got back from the site, and my previous assumption of where she was found was incorrect. Here is a map, with the location of Brianna's body marked with a blue dot:

Map of the field (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v468/adnoid/WS/Denison/Windows.jpg)

There has been a cross erected and rose petals scattered on the spot:

Cross at Site (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v468/adnoid/WS/Denison/DSCN5227.jpg)

To try to answer questions about what could have been seen from windows of buildings surrounding the location, I stood as close as I felt respectful to the point she was found and, starting with the closest building (the irregular one immediately West) I took a series of pictures, turning counterclockwise:

Picture 1 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v468/adnoid/WS/Denison/DSCN5228.jpg)
Picture 2 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v468/adnoid/WS/Denison/DSCN5229.jpg)
Picture 3 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v468/adnoid/WS/Denison/DSCN5230.jpg)
Picture 4 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v468/adnoid/WS/Denison/DSCN5231.jpg)
Picture 5 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v468/adnoid/WS/Denison/DSCN5232.jpg)

Note: In the last picture what looks like 2nd floor offices is a parapet - you can see it on the adjacent building.

Note that the Google map does not show some buildings that are there now. While it may be hard to tell, her body was in a ditch, so I doubt it could be seen from the windows in the buildings that did have them, as they were pretty far away.

The signs around town have been updated:

Bring Bri Justice (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v468/adnoid/WS/Denison/DSCN5234.jpg)

Adnoid..............thanks for the pictures! A question: in the first picture there's what looks like some sort of office building on the far left with a parking lot that borders the field. The place where Brianna's body was found looks like a well-worn path from the parking lot of that building on the left to the other street where the path ends. On the other street, there's two buildings together and then one with a red roof. Are any of those buildings restaurants?

What I'm wondering is if employees of the office building on the left cut through the field to a restaurant for lunch on regular basis?

[StillHoping]

DeltaDawn and StillHoping, I think those are great theories! I completely forgot that Brianna was found right after Valentine's Day. The only thing that would be slightly weird about that is the fact that Brianna was there for at least a week, possibly longer. So these panties, whoever they belong to, were taken at least a week and a half ago at this point.

Thanks Newshound81,

I wanted to point out though, that while unlikely, this guy could have left Bri's body there, abducted someone else, and then returned to where he left Bri to leave the panties of the next victim. It is certainly common for killers to return to the scene of the crime. Scott Peterson visited the Berkely(sp?) Marina multiple times before Laci was found. And the perp is undoubtedly following this case, so he would have known they hadn't found Bri yet.

[newshound81]

All right, here's what I found of minor interest from Sept to Dec. Check out the Dec. 2 one - a missing person! I don't know how to find out whether or not it was resolved.

09-11-07 15:03 hrs UN07-0775 401 W. 2nd Street
Incident
Reported by Officer Eric James

A university student reported an assault that took place at her residence.

11-05-07 19:48 hrs UN07-0946 Mack Social Science
Incident
Reported by Officer John Whitehorn

A university student reported an incident of sexual harassment at the Mack Social Science Building.
11-19-07 14:45 hrs UN07-0998 Police Services Office
Sex Offender Registration
Reported by Jeanne Ohlson


A convicted sex offender reported to University Police Services to complete registration as required by law.

12-02-07 13:28 hrs UN07-1028 Argenta Hall
Missing Person
Reported by Officer Eric James


A university student reported her sister missing since Friday November 30th. The missing person is also a university student.
12-10-07 12:14 hrs UN07-1049 Virginia & 11th St.
Suspicious Circumstance
Reported by Lt. Ed Rinne


A university student reported a suspicious male approaching her vehicle as she attempted to leave a parking space near Virginia & 11th St.

[paddy01]

If anyone cares to sift through with me, I just found the police blotters for UNR for all of 2007 and this year: http://www.unr.edu/vpaf/police/blotters/BlotterArchives2007.htm

First one that caught my eye was 12/2/07 A University student reported sister missing 11/30, who is also University student.
Every time I try to pull this link up it shuts my computer down!

[glezell]

OMG...........there might be another victim out there.....someone who the suspect raped and kept their underwear as a souvenir. OR, is this the underwear of the wife or girlfriend of the suspect!


It would either have to be another victim or someone involved I would think. I immediately thought of Karla Holmolka case when i read this.

Was she wearing these panties or were they just found with her body? do we know?

[aj1020]

A convicted sex offender reported to University Police Services to complete registration as required by law.


Convicted sex offenders can live on college campuses in Nevada?? Scary!!

[Leila]

IMO, this case happened too long ago. But you never know.

http://www.theyaremissed.org/ncma/gallery/ncmaprofile_all.php?A200300833W

I think this case is going to get more complicated. Do we want a forum?

Yes! I think a forum on this case is an excellent idea! There too many aspects for just one thread. It needs to be divided up into the victims, the suspect, the suspect vehicle, etc.

[StillHoping]

If anyone cares to sift through with me, I just found the police blotters for UNR for all of 2007 and this year: http://www.unr.edu/vpaf/police/blotters/BlotterArchives2007.htm

08-08-07 23:50 hrs UN07-0673 N. Virginia St.
Field Interview
Reported by Officer Richard Hicks


A subject in a traffic stop was questioned regarding his status as a registered sex offender. Information was submitted to the Reno PD Sex Offender Unit for review.

[StillHoping]

08-21-07 14:28 hrs UN07-0698 Sparks, NV
Agency Assist
Reported by Officer


University Police Services was contacted by Sparks PD regarding a report of a missing person who is a university employee. Police Services is working with Sparks PD on this investigation.

[adnoid]

Adnoid..............thanks for the pictures! A question: in the first picture there's what looks like some sort of office building on the far left with a parking lot that borders the field. The place where Brianna's body was found looks like a well-worn path from the parking lot of that building on the left to the other street where the path ends. On the other street, there's two buildings together and then one with a red roof. Are any of those buildings restaurants?

What I'm wondering is if employees of the office building on the left cut through the field to a restaurant for lunch on regular basis?

The only restaurant I know of is at the end of this building (the Hong Kong Diner - you can see part of the sign but you can't read it) and is the closest business to where she was found:

Picture 5 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v468/adnoid/WS/Denison/DSCN5232.jpg)

I've never eaten there, but according to the hours posted on the door it's open every day for lunch.

I'm afraid I don't work in the area, so where people tend to walk is something I can't answer.

[newshound81]

03-11-07 04:00 hrs UN07-0259 Nye Hall
Sexual Assault
Reported by Officer Richard Hicks


A university student reported being sexually assaulted at Nye Hall. The case is under investigation.

[StillHoping]

07-24-07 08:02 hrs UN07-0645 Getchell Library
Incident
Reported by Officer Andrew Casacca


A university employee reported a suspicious person in the library. Some written notes were found in the area after the subject left the building.

[Leila]

lol..thanks

i did a search with just the words "Pink Panther clothing"....i had no idea there was so much PP stuff out there!

I think the Pink Panther got a resurgence in popularity in recent years with the release of the newer Pink Panther movie with Steve Martin. I've never seen the movie, but see if for sale at Walmart and other places greatly discounted.

[newshound81]

06-07-08 20:39 hrs UN07-0523 Virginia & 10th
Robbery
Reported by Officer Tom Emmons


A university student reported an unknown male approached her from behind while walking near 10th & Virginia St. The male violently grabbed her purse, and then fled the scene.

[newshound81]

06-28- 7 07:26 hrs UN07-0586 Main Campus
Runaway Juvenile
Reported by Sgt. Kevin Stein


A citizen reported her daughter missing from a summer course at the university. The juvenile was entered into the national missing person database.

[newshound81]

Thanks StillHoping, I think together we looked at them all!

[10EC_Dad]

Carson City Missing Persons / Rapes / Attempted Rapes

Where is a source for that information?

[newshound81]

Carson City Missing Persons / Rapes / Attempted Rapes

Where is a source for that information?
10EC_Dad, I looked that up earlier today and couldn't find anything, other than Secret Witness, which says it serves Reno, Sparks and Carson City...

[DeltaDawn]

Convicted sex offenders can live on college campuses in Nevada?? Scary!!

I agree isn/t that like opening the candy store for them? My goodness, that's scary when you think about it. Young men and women could be taking classes along side a 20 something sex offender, which is when most of these guys get their start. How rediculous..shouldn't they just say no to housing sex offenders on college grounds? I never even considered the thought that known sex offenders could be living on campus at any college.

[Leila]

The only restaurant I know of is at the end of this building (the Hong Kong Diner - you can see part of the sign but you can't read it) and is the closest business to where she was found:

Picture 5 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v468/adnoid/WS/Denison/DSCN5232.jpg)

I've never eaten there, but according to the hours posted on the door it's open every day for lunch.

I'm afraid I don't work in the area, so where people tend to walk is something I can't answer.

Thanks Adnoid................I was thinking perhaps the employees were in the habit of cutting through this field on a regular basis to go to lunch at a nearby restaurant. Snow on the ground from Jan. 20th onward would have prevented the employees from taking the path, and they would have walked around the field instead. Then.....when the weather warmed and the snow melted, they were able to use the path again, and that's when Brianna's body was found.

The reason I thought this might be important is the possibility that the suspect may know the habits of the employees, and left Brianna's body in a location where once the snow melted, it would be found.

[10EC_Dad]

10EC_Dad, I looked that up earlier today and couldn't find anything, other than Secret Witness, which says it serves Reno, Sparks and Carson City...

You are way ahead of me.

Thanks Newshound!

[DeltaDawn]

Thanks Adnoid................I was thinking perhaps the employees were in the habit of cutting through this field on a regular basis to go to lunch at a nearby restaurant. Snow on the ground from Jan. 20th onward would have prevented the employees from taking the path, and they would have walked around the field instead. Then.....when the weather warmed and the snow melted, they were able to use the path again, and that's when Brianna's body was found.

The reason I thought this might be important is the possibility that the suspect may know the habits of the employees, and left Brianna's body in a location where once the snow melted, it would be found.

Leila, I agree, I am pretty confident that he knew the body would be found there. I think everything about that crime scene is very important, how she was postioned, what she did or did not have on, the other woman's panties found with Bri, also where she was found. Seems to me she would had to be placed there in the early morning hours, the same time as the crimes take place. Otherwise people would have noticed him doing this, esspecially if he had to carry her even 10 feet..during the day someone would have seen him. So is this possibly someonE who works second shift. Gets off work, then goes out clubbing and to bars, then starts his stalking..until the early hours of the morning?

[10EC_Dad]

Leila, I agree, I am pretty confident that he knew the body would be found there. I think everything about that crime scene is very important, how she was postioned, what she did or did not have on, the other woman's panties found with Bri, also where she was found. Seems to me she would had to be placed there in the early morning hours, the same time as the crimes take place. Otherwise people would have noticed him doing this, esspecially if he had to carry her even 10 feet..during the day someone would have seen him. So is this possibly someonE who works second shift. Gets off work, then goes out clubbing and to bars, then starts his stalking..until the early hours of the morning?

I tend to agree that it is someone working 2nd shift and "hunting" during the morning.

[bigbuck]

Wow, I picked the wrong day to be gone. I cannot believe this punk is toying with LE. Is it possible his partner/gf/wife was involved.?? I know its sick but, could he have brought poor Brianna home to share???

:eek:

[TheBugHouse]

I'm curious - why do you think it looks like an "accidental" strangulation?
>
The previous victim being "rendered unconscience". Perhaps he tried the same on Brianna. She, being previously compromised by alcohol ect., succumed far easier than he expected. Pure speculation.

[TheBugHouse]

Holy crap.
>
Ditto that!

[paddy01]

I think the Pink Panther got a resurgence in popularity in recent years with the release of the newer Pink Panther movie with Steve Martin. I've never seen the movie, but see if for sale at Walmart and other places greatly discounted.

Pink Panther with Steve Martin was in 2006.

[Leila]

Something that has bothered me since I read it yesterday is the following brief excerpt from the RGJ:

“This case is shocking to us, but to 99.9 percent of the people who live in this community, they have no comprehension and cannot even fathom that someone had done what this guy did,” McDonald said. “He’s a deviant not working on the same moral plane as the rest of us. Something is wrong with this person.”

That quote is from one of the detectives working on the case. What I read into that quote is that there's something more about this case - something different than a rape/murder. Police have been quiet about evidence found at the scene and the condition of Brianna's body. Only today did they release the information and picture of the underwear found at the scene.

There's something about this suspect that's particularly heinous.

Link to article where that quote is from:
http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080218/NEWS01/80218030/0/NEWS18&theme=DENISON

[10EC_Dad]

Wow, I picked the wrong day to be gone. I cannot believe this punk is toying with LE. Is it possible his partner/gf/wife was involved.?? I know its sick but, could he have brought poor Brianna home to share???

:eek:

While it is a possibility that he has a female partner involved, it seems highly unlikely. First, he acted alone in the previous known crimes. Second, these pervs usually are loners in their sickness.

Unfortunately, this could mean there is another victim.

It could also be a wife/gf. If so, I don't understand why he would leave them there.

[10EC_Dad]

Something that has bothered me since I read it yesterday is the following brief excerpt from the RGJ:

“This case is shocking to us, but to 99.9 percent of the people who live in this community, they have no comprehension and cannot even fathom that someone had done what this guy did,” McDonald said. “He’s a deviant not working on the same moral plane as the rest of us. Something is wrong with this person.”

That quote is from one of the detectives working on the case. What I read into that quote is that there's something more about this case - something different than a rape/murder. Police have been quiet about evidence found at the scene and the condition of Brianna's body. Only today did they release the information and picture of the underwear found at the scene.

There's something about this suspect that's particularly heinous.

Link to article where that quote is from:
http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080218/NEWS01/80218030/0/NEWS18&theme=DENISON

You know, I did not read anything into their statement other than the crimes of rape and murder. But I do think there is alot we don't know about.

It is interesting that they asked for the owner of the thong to come forward. That would indicate they have no reason to believe that she (thong owner) is dead.

[bigbuck]

Something that has bothered me since I read it yesterday is the following brief excerpt from the RGJ:

“This case is shocking to us, but to 99.9 percent of the people who live in this community, they have no comprehension and cannot even fathom that someone had done what this guy did,” McDonald said. “He’s a deviant not working on the same moral plane as the rest of us. Something is wrong with this person.”

That quote is from one of the detectives working on the case. What I read into that quote is that there's something more about this case - something different than a rape/murder. Police have been quiet about evidence found at the scene and the condition of Brianna's body. Only today did they release the information and picture of the underwear found at the scene.

There's something about this suspect that's particularly heinous.

Link to article where that quote is from:
http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080218/NEWS01/80218030/0/NEWS18&theme=DENISON

I noticed that too! and I hate to say it but, the first thing that came to my mind was Imette St Guillen.

[DeltaDawn]

I noticed that too! and I hate to say it but, the first thing that came to my mind was Imette St Guillen.

That's who I thought of too BIGBUCK.

[H0NEYWEST]

Refocusing on the suspect, I want to restate my "profile" of the perp and get your thoughts.

Male in early 30s
Married/recently divorced
Lives in suburb within 30 mins of crimes ( I have suspected an area like North Valleys based on proximity and demograhics obtained from Google Maps and Census websites)
Works within 15 mins of crimes
Chose his "territory" due to the availabilty of chosen "targets"
Is quite, no close friends, however can be charming
Has no previous criminal record

I may be way off base in my opinion. I would greatly appreciate others' "profile".

I do not think murder was his motive with Brianna. It may have been contemplated but not the ultimate objective. I think the murder is an example that his sickness is writing checks that his intelligance can't cover. Thus, Brianna was found in an unlikely location not indicitive of a well thought out disposal plan.

It appears obvious that his sickness is progressing. He is loosing more control of his actions and covers his fear with quite arrogance. He will strike again but not on his monthly cycle this month. Will likely go to a prostitute this month.

Someone suspects it is him, but beyond the coincidental indicators, he does not have the "personality" of someone who could do these things. The person who suspects is afraid of falsely accusing someone with no visiable signs of being such a monster. We should all pray for this person to have courage.

If this person does not call in the tip, the perp will strike again. He will be careless and hopefully caught while pursuing the victim.

Again, I would appreciate others' similar posts.

I'm just catching up on what was posted today, so I apologize for commenting so late - and for saying things that may have already been said. Anyway...

I agree with most of your profile, but I doubt he lives in the North Valleys. I live there and there are very, very few apartment complexes, and the cost to rent a house in Reno is ridiculous, especially in the North due to the size of the properties. I don't see the perp owning a house. Even the wages for a "good" paying job in Reno are disproportionate to the cost of housing. I further don't think he has a "good" paying job.

There is also an element of compartmentalization here. What I mean is that people tend to stay in their own areas (around their residence or work). For example, you won't find people from the South, going up to Spanish Springs, unless for a very specific reason, like to visit someone. I think Adnoid will agree with on that.

I see the perp living near UNR, both for the lower rents and being familiar with the area. If he was just targeting students, as opposed to targeting students in a particular area, he could just as well be hunting at Truckee Meadows Community College. I think he knows that many of the UNR students live very near the campus and may walk home, giving him easy access. The area around UNR also has lots of winding little streets that might pose a problem for a perp unfamiliar with the area.

I think there is a tie to the university, and a reason he is targeting pretty, fresh-faced young women. If he just wanted a young women, UNR isn't very far from 4th Street, where most of the illegal prostitutes hang out.

He maybe targeting the sort of women who reject him (or looks like a specific woman who rejected him). Maybe he looks weird or something. Despite not being able to score with the sort of women he is attracted to, I agree with you that he is married/lives with a woman, or recently did. I think she has a child, probably by him, and he's lost interest in her since the baby came along. I'm not sure he even cared that much for her to begin with. She may have just been convenient. He may also be abusive to her, perhaps just emotionally, because she isn't up to his "standards". I think the baby shoe belongs to her child - it may even be her vehicle. I opined before that she may work nights at a hospital or casino, and he's supposed to be watching the baby, but instead goes out hunting when the baby is asleep. In that scenario, he wouldn't have to account for being out late at night.

It also occurred to me yesterday, that he might have had to work the day he abducted Brianna. My reasoning is that the area he chose to dump her body is undeveloped enough that he knew the body wouldn't be quickly discovered, but if he really didn't want her to be found he wouldn't have to drive very much further in any direction to dump her where she likely wouldn't be found for years. I don't think he wanted her body discovered, I think he ran out of time.

I guess I should go back to reading the 10 or so pages I need to catch up on, since it's very likely someone has posted similar thoughts or have already come up with a scenario that blows mine out of the water.

This is all speculation and I reserve the right to ammend my opinion about any/all of this should hard evidence come to light or I just change my mind. :rolleyes:

[concernedperson]

You know, I did not read anything into their statement other than the crimes of rape and murder. But I do think there is alot we don't know about.

It is interesting that they asked for the owner of the thong to come forward. That would indicate they have no reason to believe that she (thong owner) is dead.

That is why I kinda latched on to the wife or girlfriend aspect. Only she would know what type of undies she wore. The perp probably didn't know either. He may have thought including evidence of this nature would confuse the investigation vs. help it. Remember we are dealing with a person without a normal range of function or he wouldn't be committing these crimes.

[TheBugHouse]

Something that has bothered me since I read it yesterday is the following brief excerpt from the RGJ:

“This case is shocking to us, but to 99.9 percent of the people who live in this community, they have no comprehension and cannot even fathom that someone had done what this guy did,” McDonald said. “He’s a deviant not working on the same moral plane as the rest of us. Something is wrong with this person.”

That quote is from one of the detectives working on the case. What I read into that quote is that there's something more about this case - something different than a rape/murder. Police have been quiet about evidence found at the scene and the condition of Brianna's body. Only today did they release the information and picture of the underwear found at the scene.

There's something about this suspect that's particularly heinous.

Link to article where that quote is from:
http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080218/NEWS01/80218030/0/NEWS18&theme=DENISON
>
I wonder what the other evidence found along with her body is. (aside from the UW obviously) Also, without getting into graphic detail, WHERE was it found.

[bigbuck]

That's who I thought of too BIGBUCK.

I really hope we're WAY off on this DD.

[10EC_Dad]

>
I wonder what the other evidence found along with her body is. (aside from the UW obviously) Also, without getting into graphic detail, WHERE was it found.

I do wonder if they were used in her death.

[nanandjim]

From an acrticle at the Reno Gazette-Journal: http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080219/NEWS01/802190344/1002

"Police are not disclosing information about the condition of her body or any evidence found on or near her body. They did say her abduction was sexually motivated and that they collected items of evidence found near her body that they are testing for clues."
Thanks, Dad. I was just wondering if she fought so hard that he just strangled her and didn't rape her. I personally think that he killed her shortly after he abducted her.

[10EC_Dad]

Thank you for your reply.

You have convinced me that he does not reside in North Valleys.

However, I do not think he lives near campus either.

Are there any areas south of town off of 395 that would fit the demographic profile?

[bigbuck]

I do wonder if they were used in her death.

I can't help but think that they were. I also cannot shake the terrible feeling that this creep put on some kind of show for LE to find.

[10EC_Dad]

I can't help but think that they were. I also cannot shake the terrible feeling that this creep put on some kind of show for LE to find.

I think he dumped her just the way she died. I just can't go beyond that at this time.

[bigbuck]

[/b]

I think he dumped her just the way she died. I just can't go beyond that at this time.

I'm sorry, I didn't mean to upset anyone.

[rmf]

I've been lurking in this thread and want to ask a question, forgive me if this has already been asked:

is there a military base near Reno? I grew up in Nor Cal and I can't remember. I wonder if this person has a military connection.

Also I am a licensed PI so if I can be of any help with theories, feel free to PM me.

I think this person is very dangerous and will likely be escalating the behavior sooner rather than later.

[paddy01]

I've been lurking in this thread and want to ask a question, forgive me if this has already been asked:

is there a military base near Reno? I grew up in Nor Cal and I can't remember. I wonder if this person has a military connection.

Also I am a licensed PI so if I can be of any help with theories, feel free to PM me.

I think this person is very dangerous and will likely be escalating the behavior sooner rather than later.

Stead Training facility for Army Guard training site, I was thinking perhaps perp had military connection.

[H0NEYWEST]

Thank you for your reply.

You have convinced me that he does not reside in North Valleys.

However, I do not think he lives near campus either.

Are there any areas south of town off of 395 that would fit the demographic profile?

If you rule out the area around UNR, which is pretty dense, then he could live in a number of different areas, even Sparks. For the most part, the further south one goes, the newer/more expensive housing becomes (I used to work for the Housing Authority); however, there is a large low-income/subsidized apartment complex off S. Meadows Parkway. I don't in any way want to sterotype low-income families, I just don't don't think the perp is "white-collar" and would make enough to afford rent in the south (which tends to be more than my house payment).

[TheBugHouse]

Something that has bothered me since I read it yesterday is the following brief excerpt from the RGJ:

“This case is shocking to us, but to 99.9 percent of the people who live in this community, they have no comprehension and cannot even fathom that someone had done what this guy did,” McDonald said. “He’s a deviant not working on the same moral plane as the rest of us. Something is wrong with this person.”

That quote is from one of the detectives working on the case. What I read into that quote is that there's something more about this case - something different than a rape/murder. Police have been quiet about evidence found at the scene and the condition of Brianna's body. Only today did they release the information and picture of the underwear found at the scene.

There's something about this suspect that's particularly heinous.

Link to article where that quote is from:
http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080218/NEWS01/80218030/0/NEWS18&theme=DENISON
>
This is really terrible to think, but what if this guy "attacked" her postmortem?

[bigbuck]

>
This is really terrible to think, but what if this guy "attacked" her postmortem?

OMG! He could have accidentally killed her on the couch and then.... Would LE be able to tell ????
:eek:

[H0NEYWEST]

Stead Training facility for Army Guard training site, I was thinking perhaps perp had military connection.

Stead is an interesting idea; not for the "base" (it's really, really small), but that a disproportionate number of parolees reside in that area. I don't know why, but I recall that the residents were up in arms about it a few years ago. There is also an area called "Sun Valley", which is up Clearacre and is a pretty rough area. So is an area aproximately with Oddie to the north, Sullivan to the east, 4th Street to the south, west of UNR. This is a very vague approximation on my part. Reno/Sparks is kind of weird in that little pockets of high crime areas can change almost street by street.

I also noticed on Google maps that the area labeled "North Valley" isn't what we refer to as North Valley, which is actually further north up 395 by Lemmon Valley/Red Rock/Cold Springs. I can see now why 10EC_Dad suggested North Valley as a possible place the perp might live, if he was looking at Google maps.

[adnoid]

I also noticed on Google maps that the area labeled "North Valley" isn't what we refer to as North Valley, which is actually further north up 395 by Lemmon Valley/Red Rock/Cold Springs. I can see now why 10EC_Dad suggested North Valley as a possible place the perp might live, if he was looking at Google maps.

Yeah, I caught that too.

[LionRun]

OMG! He could have accidentally killed her on the couch and then.... Would LE be able to tell ????
:eek:

If he injured her in a way that suggests the injury/injuries were sexually based and her body was not in an advanced state of decomposition a good forensics specialist might be able to tell if that injury/injuries were inflicted before or after death.

As horrible as it sounds your thinking may not be far fetched. That the one victim regained consciousness to find him assaulting her suggests it is possible that he may have necrophilic tendencies. Please know that I am not saying that this is true; I am only saying that I believe it is possible--along with many other things that may be possible.

Heck, I'd like to know who's underwear were found with Brianna's body, and why on earth they were there. I didn't think the slime was necessarily interested in taunting LE or the public. Most aren't. But, after today I'm rethinking that unless or until I learn that there is another completely different explanation.

Lion

[H0NEYWEST]

Yeah, I caught that too.

LOL! That's why I never trust Google maps or Mapquest to get me anywhere.

[bigbuck]

Thank you Lion. Like I posted a little while ago I'm really afraid this sicko used Brianna to put on a show for LE.

[paddy01]

Stead is an interesting idea; not for the "base" (it's really, really small), but that a disproportionate number of parolees reside in that area. I don't know why, but I recall that the residents were up in arms about it a few years ago. There is also an area called "Sun Valley", which is up Clearacre and is a pretty rough area. So is an area aproximately with Oddie to the north, Sullivan to the east, 4th Street to the south, west of UNR. This is a very vague approximation on my part. Reno/Sparks is kind of weird in that little pockets of high crime areas can change almost street by street.

I also noticed on Google maps that the area labeled "North Valley" isn't what we refer to as North Valley, which is actually further north up 395 by Lemmon Valley/Red Rock/Cold Springs. I can see now why 10EC_Dad suggested North Valley as a possible place the perp might live, if he was looking at Google maps.

Hi, Why I thought perhaps "perp" had military training is he quickly rendered his victims unconscious, which is learned in combat training. Also noticed that "STEAD" does not offer housing and most trainees stay at Motel 8 in Reno, which so happens to be 2 miles & 7 minute drive from where Brianna was abducted. I'm pretty new at this investigating stuff, so only post once in awhile & cautiously.

[paddy01]

Stead is an interesting idea; not for the "base" (it's really, really small), but that a disproportionate number of parolees reside in that area. I don't know why, but I recall that the residents were up in arms about it a few years ago. There is also an area called "Sun Valley", which is up Clearacre and is a pretty rough area. So is an area aproximately with Oddie to the north, Sullivan to the east, 4th Street to the south, west of UNR. This is a very vague approximation on my part. Reno/Sparks is kind of weird in that little pockets of high crime areas can change almost street by street.

I also noticed on Google maps that the area labeled "North Valley" isn't what we refer to as North Valley, which is actually further north up 395 by Lemmon Valley/Red Rock/Cold Springs. I can see now why 10EC_Dad suggested North Valley as a possible place the perp might live, if he was looking at Google maps.

Hi, Why I thought perhaps "perp" had military training as he quickly rendered his victims unconscious, which is learned in combat training. Also noticed that "STEAD" does not offer housing and most trainees stay at Motel 8 in Reno, which so happens to be 2 miles & 7 minute drive from where Brianna was abducted. I'm pretty new at this investigating stuff, so only post once in awhile & cautiously.

[panthera]

>
The previous victim being "rendered unconscience". Perhaps he tried the same on Brianna. She, being previously compromised by alcohol ect., succumed far easier than he expected. Pure speculation.
I think that's what probably happened. :)

[panthera]

If you rule out the area around UNR, which is pretty dense, then he could live in a number of different areas, even Sparks. For the most part, the further south one goes, the newer/more expensive housing becomes (I used to work for the Housing Authority); however, there is a large low-income/subsidized apartment complex off S. Meadows Parkway. I don't in any way want to sterotype low-income families, I just don't don't think the perp is "white-collar" and would make enough to afford rent in the south (which tends to be more than my house payment).
What about the businesses around the field where Brianna was found, such as what companies are there (besides the Chinese restaurant)? Are any of them not offices or white collar? I'm wondering if he could work around there. :)

[mikesmom1989]

Something that has bothered me since I read it yesterday is the following brief excerpt from the RGJ:

“This case is shocking to us, but to 99.9 percent of the people who live in this community, they have no comprehension and cannot even fathom that someone had done what this guy did,” McDonald said. “He’s a deviant not working on the same moral plane as the rest of us. Something is wrong with this person.”

That quote is from one of the detectives working on the case. What I read into that quote is that there's something more about this case - something different than a rape/murder. Police have been quiet about evidence found at the scene and the condition of Brianna's body. Only today did they release the information and picture of the underwear found at the scene.

There's something about this suspect that's particularly heinous.

Link to article where that quote is from:
http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080218/NEWS01/80218030/0/NEWS18&theme=DENISON

OMG, Leila .... I so agree with you,unfortunately, I think as more is disclosed it will be horrifying ---
Very perceptive of you to pick that up, I read the same article and didnt until I read your post
Prayers to Bri's family

[rmf]

Leila,

Yes, I agree that your observations are very perceptive. I am of the belief that LE would not be releasing as much information as they are, especially about the undergarments found at the Denison crime scene, if they did not believe this person was very dangerous. That may seem like a misnomer since murderers are of course automatically assumed to be very dangerous, but I think this perp is on another level entirely. (If that makes sense.)

[Rick777]

I think that's what probably happened. :)


wait. Are you saying he might have had sex with her corpse???

[LookOut]

The panties have me puzzled... So many different possibilities for them being there. I wonder if he might have killed Brianna the morning he kidnapped her, at the location she was found?? There's just not enough details at this time to really determine much.

[panthera]

wait. Are you saying he might have had sex with her corpse???
That's a possibility especially after reading Leila's post. There's something LE found that put this murder beyond the norm, imo.

[adnoid]

What about the businesses around the field where Brianna was found, such as what companies are there (besides the Chinese restaurant)? Are any of them not offices or white collar? I'm wondering if he could work around there. :)

It's mixed. IGT is huge, they are considered light manufacturing, there are offices and other light industrial firms. I didn't think to take notes of what is there, I suppose I could do that, but nothing remarkable as far as I could see.

[panthera]

It's mixed. IGT is huge, they are considered light manufacturing, there are offices and other light industrial firms. I didn't think to take notes of what is there, I suppose I could do that, but nothing remarkable as far as I could see.
Thanks so much :)

[DeltaDawn]

When you go into the military do you give a DNA sample? Don't know the answer to this but was thinking they might have troops do this now with a war time philospy in effect. If they do give a DNA sample then this would rule out a military background..if not..then that idea would still be in play. Obviously he knows something of martial arts or that type of training on how to render a vic unconscious quickly.

Still thinking that the thongs are a big clue to either a prior vic, someone he is stalking or someone currently in his life.

I would be curious about the crime scene and if they felt the body was just dumped or was it postioned? Were there other articles left there that the police are not mentioning. I am sure they will not release all this info because they need to hold some things back that only the perp would know. I 'd also be curious if there was a note or any type of signature that he is trying to leave to associate these crimes to only him..doesn't want anyone else taking credit for his work.

[paddy01]

When you go into the military do you give a DNA sample? Don't know the answer to this but was thinking they might have troops do this now with a war time philospy in effect. If they do give a DNA sample then this would rule out a military background..if not..then that idea would still be in play. Obviously he knows something of martial arts or that type of training on how to render a vic unconscious quickly.

Still thinking that the thongs are a big clue to either a prior vic, someone he is stalking or someone currently in his life.

I would be curious about the crime scene and if they felt the body was just dumped or was it postioned? Were there other articles left there that the police are not mentioning. I am sure they will not release all this info because they need to hold some things back that only the perp would know. I 'd also be curious if there was a note or any type of signature that he is trying to leave to associate these crimes to only him..doesn't want anyone else taking credit for his work.

Spoke to my SIL he's in USMC and yes they do have his DNA on file.

[SuziQ]

Chico, thank you for the forum!

[SuziQ]

Other Possible Victims?
I thought I would start a thread for other possible victims. Feel free to post other cases and links to them here. I'll post the ones I found earlier today.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=60668

[panthera]

Chico, thank you for the forum!
Ditto that! It's very much appreciated! :)

[KR2tonenow]

Is it possible that he bought the "panties" for Brianna, sort of a disturbed gift...used them for perverse reasons and discarded along with her body. Do we know yet time of death?:confused:

[panthera]

Is it possible that he bought the "panties" for Brianna, sort of a disturbed gift...used them for perverse reasons and discarded along with her body. Do we know yet time of death?:confused:
The panties have the his DNA and that of another woman on them.

[LionRun]

Is it possible that he bought the "panties" for Brianna, sort of a disturbed gift...used them for perverse reasons and discarded along with her body. Do we know yet time of death?:confused:

I don't think this is the case because it was reported that there was DNA of the perp and an unknown woman on those panties.

http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080219/NEWS01/80219018&oaso=news.rgj.com%2Fbreakingnews

Lt. Robert McDonald said DNA of an unknown woman and the DNA of the man who abducted and strangled

Lion

[H0NEYWEST]

Yikes! It's taken me all afternoon to read the previous posts. The underwear discovery (and the fact LE released the information) is amazing.

We have a lot of interesting intelligent speculations on this thread. My mind keeps going back and forth - panties were another victim's/he stole them, he's a late-20s to early 30s loner/he's a married guy next door type, etc. Two things have crossed my mind:

1) The released description of what the perp was wearing changed a little bit: "They describe the suspect as white man with light brown/dirty blonde hair. He is 5'8'' to 5' 10'' with a slender to medium build. The victim said the suspect was wearing a dark hooded pull over sweat shirt with no zippers or markings, athletic type nylon silver sweat pants with black stripes, and white tennis shoes." http://www.krnv.com/global/story.asp?s=7892883

2) - Now this gets me - in earlier descriptions (from the rape victim) it states that the perp had shaved pubic hair, something we haven't talked about very much here. Shaved Pubes? WTF is up with that? I quizzed my Insignificant Other about it, and once he got passed the EEEEEEWWWWW, he really couldn't come up with an answer as to why a guy would do that (although I know some do).

Could it be that the perp didn't want to leave any pubic hairs on his victims (for a DNA match)? My IO mentioned that it could be a "metro-sexual" kind of thing (he's in L.A.), but Reno's not exactly a mecca for for trendy guys.

[KR2tonenow]

Thanks for the insight, guys. This has taken a perverse weird turn.:mad:

[adnoid]

2) - Now this gets me - in earlier descriptions (from the rape victim) it states that the perp had shaved pubic hair, something we haven't talked about very much here. Shaved Pubes? WTF is up with that? I quizzed my Insignificant Other about it, and once he got passed the EEEEEEWWWWW, he really couldn't come up with an answer as to why a guy would do that (although I know some do)...

My search for "pink panther black thong" earlier gave me the distinct impression that that sort of shaving is fairly common in the gay porn world - information I could do without, thank you very much.

[panthera]

<respectfully snipped>

Could it be that the perp didn't want to leave any pubic hairs on his victims (for a DNA match)? My IO mentioned that it could be a "metro-sexual" kind of thing (he's in L.A.), but Reno's not exactly a mecca for for trendy guys.
But he still left his DNA in some other form so that defeats his purpose of shaving. I also can't comprehend it. :sick:

[panthera]

My search for "pink panther black thong" earlier gave me the distinct impression that that sort of shaving is fairly common in the gay porn world - information I could do without, thank you very much.
There's a lot of information I can do without too and sometimes it's nice to be ignorant of what goes on out there. ;)

[KR2tonenow]

OK, is it possible that a man/woman is involved in some weird perverse way.

I don't want to assume that the panties are from a victim. Seems to me a "couple" could be involved.

No one has turned this guy in~ a girlfriend, wife, mother, landlady, neighbor, so???

[DeltaDawn]

Yikes! It's taken me all afternoon to read the previous posts. The underwear discovery (and the fact LE released the information) is amazing.

We have a lot of interesting intelligent speculations on this thread. My mind keeps going back and forth - panties were another victim's/he stole them, he's a late-20s to early 30s loner/his a married guy next door, etc. Two things have crossed my mind:

1) The released description of what the perp was wearing changed a little bit: "They describe the suspect as white man with light brown/dirty blonde hair. He is 5'8'' to 5' 10'' with a slender to medium build. The victim said the suspect was wearing a dark hooded pull over sweat shirt with no zippers or markings, athletic type nylon silver sweat pants with black stripes, and white tennis shoes." http://www.krnv.com/global/story.asp?s=7892883

2) - Now this gets me - in earlier descriptions (from the rape victim) it states that the perp had shaved pubic hair, something we haven't talked about very much here. Shaved Pubes? WTF is up with that? I quizzed my Insignificant Other about it, and once he got passed the EEEEEEWWWWW, he really couldn't come up with an answer as to why a guy would do that (although I know some do).

Could it be that the perp didn't want to leave any pubic hairs on his victims (for a DNA match)? My IO mentioned that it could be a "metro-sexual" kind of thing (he's in L.A.), but Reno's not exactly a mecca for for trendy guys.


I noticed that the description changed and attributed the change in clothing to this being another of his vics describing what he was wearing, maybe the one where he fondled her, describing what he wore that night. Aren't there three other vics now? So I would think his clothing might be different in each case.

The pubic hair is strange..and actually I can't see why a man would do this..it also is a clue if he has a wife or girlfriend they certainly would have noticed that. Maybe he doesn't want to pick up lice or other critters and since he rapes people he doesn't want to pick up their bugs and diseases..he even used a condom the one vic said. I don't think that is very usual for a rapist to worry about using a condom. Maybe we are dealing with someone who is overly concerned with their health or cleanliness, like to the point of opcd.

[SuziQ]

lol, Honeywest there was about a whole thread taken up on the discussion of "shaving". It just about got outta hand. More info than you ever wanted to know.....KWIM?

Bottom line is, and pardon the pun, shaving it common according to the WS personal impromptu poll. The two main reasons behind it is for hygene, it's cleaner. And no pubs in your mouth from giving oral sex.

[SuziQ]

Delta and Panthera! You both were around for the last discussion on this weren't you? Shaving is not a shocking or noticable trait. It's a common as having a mustache or not having one.

[LionRun]

Actually, we did go round and round about the male pubic hair shaving deal. According to a number of posters that are from various parts of the country it is not uncommon for men to shave there. Heck, I must be in the darkest of ages--I never heard of that until this case.

I do think it is a good idea for the public to know that he shaves his pubic area. But, I don't know if it is unique as some may think.

I strongly doubt that he shaved to decrease the chances of DNA being an issue. The sorry excuse for a man left DNA for the forensics specialists to find at least three times in a row. That doesn't show that he was being careful to not leave DNA behind.

Lion

[SuziQ]

Most people, especially the under 30-40 crowd view not shaving a pubic area the same as not shaving your armpits. They view it as not being very clean.

[panthera]

Delta and Panthera! You both were around for the last discussion on this weren't you? Shaving is not a shocking or noticable trait. It's a common as having a mustache or not having one.
Yes I was here but I still think it's weird (and so does Nancy :crazy: )!!

[H0NEYWEST]

My search for "pink panther black thong" earlier gave me the distinct impression that that sort of shaving is fairly common in the gay porn world - information I could do without, thank you very much.

Yeah, that's what my IO was saying. Something that started with some in the gay community, and then was adopted by straight guys for whatever reason.

[H0NEYWEST]

But he still left his DNA in some other form so that defeats his purpose of shaving. I also can't comprehend it. :sick:

True, but early on LE mentioned a specific brand of condom was left at the scene of both the earlier rape and the fondling. Maybe he isn't aware (although who wouldn't be with all the CSI type of shows on TV) of DNA collected from body oils, etc.

Still...shaved???? I think a wife or g/f would...ummmm...notice that.

[solidarity]

Shaved Pubes? WTF is up with that? I quizzed my Insignificant Other about it, and once he got passed the EEEEEEWWWWW, he really couldn't come up with an answer as to why a guy would do that (although I know some do).

A guy I used to date, once pointed out to me that most guys on sex videos seem to have their pubes shaved off. He was asking if girls like that.

That has made me wonder if the perpetrator could perhaps work in the sex industry...perhaps sex was coming to him so easy that he needed more of a challenge, if one can put it that way....and he turned to rape.

Just a theory.

[adnoid]

... and then was adopted by straight guys for whatever reason.

Not at my house.

[Ca-Sun]

Yes I was here but I still think it's weird (and so does Nancy :crazy: )!!Well, um... thinking it was way too weird I kinda asked around :blushing: and it is NOT common here at all (SF Bay Area.) In fact, everyone thought I was crazy for even wondering! All I've been able to come up with is perps often do it to eliminate leaving any evidence.

[SuziQ]

Still...shaved???? I think a wife or g/f would...ummmm...notice that.

Of course they would notice that, but it wouldn't stand out as being unusual if the perp always shaved.

[H0NEYWEST]

Most people, especially the under 30-40 crowd view not shaving a pubic area the same as not shaving your armpits. They view it as not being very clean.

You can tell I'm not reading fast enough to keep up and I'm commenting late....

Are you kidding me??? When did this trend start? I have never dated a shaved guy in my life. I'm not saying it isn't popular with some crowds, but did the practice for "most" guys start recently? Or do I just like bad, dirty boys?

[Ca-Sun]

Not at my house.LOL! Nobody here, either - or any friends.

[LookOut]

and maybe the shaved groin will help identify him when he is caught,,,,

[Ca-Sun]

and maybe the shaved groin will help identify him when he is caught,,,,No problem if it isn't shaved any more - they have his DNA.

[mikesmom1989]

Does anybody know the status of the DNA backlog? The last I heard, they raised more $$$ than anticipated and were processing the backlog in batches of 100 -- & then were going to start comparing via national data bases.

Do we know if they are all caught up? Im thinking not but am curious to know if Ive missed an update on where they are with that.

I am baffled because although I certainly know that it is possible, I just find it so difficult to believe that this animal has never been registered, in other words I believe this isnt new behavior for him.

[H0NEYWEST]

Well, um... thinking it was way too weird I kinda asked around :blushing: and it is NOT common here at all (SF Bay Area.) In fact, everyone thought I was crazy for even wondering! All I've been able to come up with is perps often do it to eliminate leaving any evidence.

But this is Reno - not SF or LA; not exactly the cutting edge of fashion trends.

[H0NEYWEST]

LOL! I deleted the post adnoid :innocent: