Missing in WV (Sodder Family) #3

[Teresa Larson]

Shoot ... just typed a big, long message and lost it. I think I timed out taking a phone call. Here's the short version. Sorry I've been absent for so long. As Birdie said, I 've been swamped with my business and family stuff. We recently added two very young foster children to our home, so I haven't had any spare time for weeks.

On the trucking business, my grandfather wasn't hauling coal at the time. He was primarily moving goods from train and boat to stores and private individuals. These were the days before semi trucks rolling across the US, when long hauls were done by boat and river and then moved by trucks. His coal mines began around 1948 and ended some time in the 1960's after a fatality in the mine due to methane. Mining was very risky back then, and my grandfather couldn't stand to lose another life. His trucking business continued after his death through my uncles. They did haul coal for others after closing the mines.

There were no mines near my grandparent's home. My grandfather's mines (after the fire) were on Gauley Mountain near Hawks Nest, and later at Boomer.

Hope this helps. I'll try not to be absent for so long.


This is new information Granddaughter. It states every where in this thread and in the news articles that Mr Sodder hauled coal for the coal mines when the fire happened. I am surprised this wasn't mentioned a long time ago.

[Laura_Bean]

Okay so I have some ideas and wanted to run them by everybody.

1 = The children are outside doing chores when their mother accidentally locks them out of the house. Instead of waking their parents, the children decide to go and play in the woods and they probably had a small lantern with them. In the dark they could easily have become lost. One wrong turn, than another, and than another as they hurriedly try to find the house. By the time the sun comes up, they are freezing and too far away from the home to be heard screaming. It would be easy for these small children to succumb to the cold. And no one went looking for them at first, because well, everyone believed the children were dead in the fire. They could have walked for miles before even realizing how lost they were. And it's quite possible, (it being winter, slippery, etc) that they died of hypothermia, or could have tried to take a shortcut to get home, such as across a frozen lake? Which wasn't thick enough to hold them. The fire could have been accidental. The Sodder's try to get to their children, the cold is the reason the cars will not start, and the ladder and other property being stolen could have been a coincidence. This is my first thought/idea.

[Laura_Bean]

2 = My second idea is that the children themselves took the ladder and cut the phone lines. Could the children have been trying to get into the phone lines and prank call other homes? Could they have done this in the past, and be doing it again? Maybe they called their mother by mistake, perhaps they were trying to call the person they asked for, and didn't realize they had the wrong line until their mother said "He doesn't live here". Perhaps the children played with the phone line and accidentally cut it in the process. Perhaps also, the children than played with fire. No I am not saying the children were bad or horrible or anything, but we have all done stupid things as young teenagers and children. And perhaps between the phone line being cut, and the house being caught ablaze they were much too afraid to return home. I would be scared if it was me.

[Teresa Larson]

The door was not locked when Mrs. Sodder got up. If they were outside she would have heard them knocking on the door when they tried to get back into the house and even if they did play with the phone wires they couldn't have talked to anybody If they did set the fire and were afraid to come back where would they have gone all these years? It was too cold for them to run away that night. IMO

[birdie74]

I can see why the children wouldn't want to wake up their parents if they were locked out, but if it were very cold out, I think they would have anyway. Maybe they wouldn't have if they had parents who were overly strict, but that wasn't the case. Mrs. Sodder was apparently a light sleeper, especially that night with all the interruptions.

I don't know much about phone lines, so I'm not sure how that could work for them to prank call from curring the lines. There's always the chance that they wandered off for some reason, but to me it wouldn't explain all of the other strange events in this case.

[fox1950]

It was a cold, rainy night. Ice was hanging from the house and probably trees, phone and telephone lines, also. Mrs. Sodder awoke when the phone rang and thought it strange the children had not locked the door and closed the curtains. If the children had died during the night due to exposure, Fayetteville is a avid hunting area. Some hunter would have found their bones even in a remote area.

Fayetteville is a some town, there was much going on that night with people passing by and stopping and watching the fire. Where the Sodder's lived is country, even through it was just a few miles from Fayetteville. I can't see them running away-someone who would have picked them up would surely have told the family.

Great Laura. Your posts always give us food for thought. Keep posting.

[Laura_Bean]

Thing is birdie, if they were excited about christmas in the morning, etc, perhaps they went looking for santa or were just so excited the cold didn't phase them at first. I remember as a child I once went outside playing with some friends, and even though it was extremely cold and I wasn't wearing anything but a coat I played for a good twenty minutes. My grandma was angry, because she said I would catch my death of cold, and did get sick soon after. But during the playtime, I barely felt the cold. I was having too much fun playing. If the siblings were friends, and enjoyed playing together, they may not have felt the cold until it was too late. Now, I do agree with Fox, however. If the area had tons of hunters going through constantly, someone should have found them. At least you would think they would have.

[Teresa Larson]

Thing is birdie, if they were excited about christmas in the morning, etc, perhaps they went looking for santa or were just so excited the cold didn't phase them at first. I remember as a child I once went outside playing with some friends, and even though it was extremely cold and I wasn't wearing anything but a coat I played for a good twenty minutes. My grandma was angry, because she said I would catch my death of cold, and did get sick soon after. But during the playtime, I barely felt the cold. I was having too much fun playing. If the siblings were friends, and enjoyed playing together, they may not have felt the cold until it was too late. Now, I do agree with Fox, however. If the area had tons of hunters going through constantly, someone should have found them. At least you would think they would have.

Not all of the kids were young. There was 2 older ones They were too old to believe in Santa and they would have had enough sense to come inside. :)

[birdie74]

I suppose anything is possible. It's good that after reading all about the case, we can come at it from different view points and put more options out there. My gut leads me to think it was foul play, but many think they died in the fire or have other theories. It's good to put all of these ideas on the table.

[Laura_Bean]

Did the children have any money? Allowance type stuff? The older children do odd jobs to make money? Just a small idea that I have forming. I know back than children could easily get small odd jobs, maybe not Betty, but the others, the older children?

[Laura_Bean]

Did the children have any money? Allowance type stuff? The older children do odd jobs to make money? Just a small idea that I have forming. I know back than children could easily get small odd jobs, maybe not Betty, but the others, the older children?

[birdie74]

I just wanted to bump up this thread. The general discussion has shifted to another thread but it's probably easier to follow for future readers if we discuss it here.

[snowme]

I can see why the children wouldn't want to wake up their parents if they were locked out, but if it were very cold out, I think they would have anyway. Maybe they wouldn't have if they had parents who were overly strict, but that wasn't the case. Mrs. Sodder was apparently a light sleeper, especially that night with all the interruptions.

I don't know much about phone lines, so I'm not sure how that could work for them to prank call from curring the lines. There's always the chance that they wandered off for some reason, but to me it wouldn't explain all of the other strange events in this case.

bold by me
That's the nagging thing that keeps me believing they didn't die in the fire. All those other odd little things... and not so little odd things. For instance... who takes a Christmas Eve midnight fire as the opportunity to steal from them?!!! Who does that?! If he would do that (or allow that to be thought of him to do), I'd suspect he'd do anything. And I do suspect that man. I don't recall reading anything that made me believe that LE or anyone else looked at him in any light but a thief and it seems he was dealt with in a very light fashion, considering. I find that convenient. :rolleyes:

[Laura_Bean]

Hold on one second... I just thought of something, was going to post something entirely different but after reading the last posts over and over, something just occurred to me.

"It was a rainy cold night". Just rain or thunder and lightning?

Did anyone inspect where the line had been "cut"? Could a direct hit with lightning to the phone line cut it and created a spark that went right up the phone line and to the roof of the house? If the line was hit by lightning, and than it created a spark which followed the line to the house, and set the roof on fire, that could explain easily how it got started. Sort of like setting fire to the end of a firecracker.

[Laura_Bean]

Why was the ladder near the phone line? Perhaps the man stealing the ladder, dropped it there, and ended up leaving it if it was too heavy, and the stealing could have happened before the fire even was started. I don't think I would call him a cold blooded killer just yet.

Now I have another point to make real quick. There were reports of MarthaLee living in a convent in New Orleans. We have a picture that looks like the younger of the two boys, Louis Sodder coming in from possibly somewhere in Italy. We have a photograph of a little girl living in New York and taking a ballet class, supposedly it was Betty. This would be why I am beginning to believe it entirely possible that these children were taken by family, (I don't know a motive yet), and split up. Without the family's knowledge is entirely possible.

[snowme]

Why was the ladder near the phone line? Perhaps the man stealing the ladder, dropped it there, and ended up leaving it if it was too heavy, and the stealing could have happened before the fire even was started. I don't think I would call him a cold blooded killer just yet.

Now I have another point to make real quick. There were reports of MarthaLee living in a convent in New Orleans. We have a picture that looks like the younger of the two boys, Louis Sodder coming in from possibly somewhere in Italy. We have a photograph of a little girl living in New York and taking a ballet class, supposedly it was Betty. This would be why I am beginning to believe it entirely possible that these children were taken by family, (I don't know a motive yet), and split up. Without the family's knowledge is entirely possible.

I'm not calling him a cold blooded killer - because I've seen nothing that confirms those children died that night. I just find it too coincidental that he happened to be caught stealing during a tragic fire on a cold, windy Christmas Eve that turned out to be even more of a mystery due to the odd phone call (laughing lady), lack of forensic evidence of five of the family members who were no longer with them afterward, and the fact that the community members who would normally be called upon to tend to a fire were so uncaring to the point of not even trying to get there till morning. Alot of things just seem too *convenient*.

[raf]

Thank you Fox and Catsy for looking all of that up! BTW, I think it's kind of funny that we're a fox, cat, and bird. I hope nobody's hungry because I would be at the bottom of that food chain!

The people finder idea helped a lot and some other googling led me to a list of Frank Sr. and Louise's heirs, so that gives me a good idea of who the kids were.

I mainly want to know who they are so that if I find anything that indicates other kids lived with them, I can narrow it down. I also figure if I can find his biological kids in yearbooks or something, I might be able to find the Sodders among other kids there, most likely with different names.

It looks like Edward and Frank Jr. still live there. I know someone needs to question them about they know know of their cousins, but I don't want to do it myself just yet. I know they're probably nice guys, and even if their family was involved, they likely were told the same story as the Sodder kids, but I don't want to take any chances just yet. Maybe by some miracle I'll come across some evidence that proves they were there, and if I do I'll take it to law enforcement and let them ask the questions. After all, a lot of people have been afraid to talk for many years, and we still don't know if the family has mafia connections. I'd rather talk to people who knew the family (like schoolmates) before I talk to the family themselves. If I find nothing useful, I'll probably go back on a later trip and talk directly to family members if I can. Maybe I'm paranoid, but I am a young lady who will be traveling there alone.
Hi dear birdie74,
maybe this is not helpful, however Edward Cipriani, I believe was born with complete name of Edward Joseph Cipriani in the 19 Nov 1921; he died in 26 May 1998 Manatee, FLORIDA; he had a son:
Edward Joseph Cipriani Jr married at Pamela Joan Walton in the 20 Jan 1973 Manatee FL; divorced: 28 Mar 1979..
maybe this is Frank's son...
best regards,
raf

[Laura_Bean]

The fact that the fire department did not show up until morning has already been explained in back posts. The way the fire department worked back than made it impossible for the fire department to show up any faster than they did. Unfortunatly it worked this way.

First someone had to call the phone operator, and tell him or her, (usually a woman's job back than), that there was a fire at such and such an address.

Than the operator would call the chief of the fire department, and alert him that there was a fire that needed to be attended to. She (or he in the rare cases), would than give the fire chief the address where the fire was located.

Next, the fire chief would call the next person in line.

The next person would call the next person.

It went on until the entire fire department knew of the fire, and than they would meet at the fire house, and leave from there.

It took hours to get the help needed for anyone especially when we are talking about the night being Christmas eve in the middle of the night. It is entirely possible that most of these people were sleeping when they were called.................

_------ HOLD THE PHONE --------- Pardon the pun

I think I need to check on something.

[Laura_Bean]

Okay I have a question.... Did the person who called the Sodder family in the middle of the night ask for a man who was a fire department worker? This could be imperative. In the recounts I have read it states, "And asked for a man who had no apparent reason to be at the Sodder home". Was it a firefighter the woman was asking for? Because if it was, it shows to me that the person who called that number knew there would be a fire at the Sodder home before it even started. This would totally disprove my first thought of the line being hit by lightening, and could show that someone knew the fire was going to happen, and called thinking it was just going to be a small fire, and put out quickly, maybe they thought just to scare the Sodder family. No one came forward admitting to making that call did they? Just a thought I have. Maybe a wife whose husband worked for the fire dept and wanted to ensure he was safe because the fire dept knew about it.

[Laura_Bean]

Also could someone have called the fire in right as it was started or a little before? Think about this possibility. Someone called the Sodder home looking for a fireman because he wasn't at home, and they were just calling everyone he knew, searching for him. Like I say, they would call each fireman in turn and than meet at the firehouse.

[birdie74]

Raf, thank you so much for the info about Edward. I didn't find out about his death until I was in Cortez. I got copies of the obits for several in the family who died in Manatee County, but I didn't post any of it. I should have mentioned that about Edward though, so thank you for doing it.

Laura, there was a report that the phone call was by a Mrs. Frank Harding. I'm guessing it was Lura White Harding, but I may have the wrong Mrs. Harding. From other stories I've read that didn't mention her name, I believe she at one point said she had made the call, but later changed her story. I also believe I had read that the caller asked for someone Mrs. Sodder had never heard of at that time. I would think she probably would have heard of most or all in the fire dept., even a volunteer dept. with it being a rather small community.

[raf]

Raf, thank you so much for the info about Edward. I didn't find out about his death until I was in Cortez. I got copies of the obits for several in the family who died in Manatee County, but I didn't post any of it. I should have mentioned that about Edward though, so thank you for doing it.

Laura, there was a report that the phone call was by a Mrs. Frank Harding. I'm guessing it was Lura White Harding, but I may have the wrong Mrs. Harding. From other stories I've read that didn't mention her name, I believe she at one point said she had made the call, but later changed her story. I also believe I had read that the caller asked for someone Mrs. Sodder had never heard of at that time. I would think she probably would have heard of most or all in the fire dept., even a volunteer dept. with it being a rather small community.
Hi birdie74 maybe another input:
Bride:

Florida Marriage Collection, 1822-1875 and 1927-2001 about Martha Lee Cipriani
Name: Martha Lee Cipriani
Marriage Date: 1952
County of Marriage: Alachua
Volume: 1377
Certificate: 10876
Source: Florida Department of Health

Groom:
Florida Marriage Collection, 1822-1875 and 1927-2001 about Bruce Elliott Parrish
Name: Bruce Elliott Parrish
Marriage Date: 1952
County of Marriage: Alachua
Volume: 1377
Certificate: 10876
Source: Florida Department of Health

well if this Martha Lee is really the daughter of Frank Cipriani and not the daughter of George Sodder, she cannot have in the DNA the sardinian genoma ( genotype?? spell?) that is very, very peculiar.. in facts only a member of Sodder family can have it, because Georde Soddu was of Sardinia isle; instead the Cipriani was continental....
I wish search more... bye,
raf

[birdie74]

It was very confusing for law enforcement back when they investigated the Cipriani family bacause 1st cousins were both named Martha Lee. The Sodders and the Ciprianis both had daughters with this name. The Martha Lee who married Mr. Parrish was definitely Frank Cipriani's daughter, and the Sodders didn't dispute that.

There were just some claims that other kids had been there before they were investigated. Until a few months ago, I really thought the Sodder children had been there. I still think it's possible, but I really don't know what to think. I believe any other kids there may have belonged to Frank and Jennie's brother, Jimmy Cipriani, who went back and forth between West Virginia and Florida quite a bit for a while. I just don't know.

[christine2448]

Getting close to the holidays. Would like to see this case on front page news again. Was trying to find it, shadow205 worked tirelessly on this and got it in news on christmas before, and I know I have emails w/reporters relating. I am searching......

[Laura_Bean]

Can we find out if it is possible for the phone wire to have been hit with lightning and created a spark which set that home ablaze? How would we find that out, remembering that these were old wires?

[christine2448]

Where are the children?
Internet sleuths awaken 61-year-old Christmas mystery

Audrey Stanton
Register-Herald Reporter


The Sodder children were excited on Christmas Eve 1945. After all, their 17-year-old sister, Marian, had just given them new toys from her dime-store job.

Three of her sisters, Martha Lee, 12, Jennie, 8, and Betty, 6, and two of their brothers, Maurice, 14, and Louis, 10, didn’t want to go to bed. They begged their mother, Jeannie, to let them stay up a little longer and play with their new toys. It was already 10 p.m.

Their mother told them they could, but she reminded Louis and Maurice to feed the cows and close the chicken coop before they settled in for the night.

<snip>

For decades, the mystery lived on throughout the region, fueled by the large billboard fence the Sodders placed near Ansted. It offered $10,000 for information leading to the five children. The weathered sign has since been torn down, but the mystery did not die with it.

The popularity of the Internet has led a number of sleuths to try their hands at finding out what became of the Sodder children.

“My personal interest stems from seeing the Sodder billboard as a child. An image was etched in my mind that to this day remains with me, and just as strong, the desire to know what really happened to this family,” said Nancy Rust, a retired law enforcement officer who resides in Greenbrier County and participates in an Internet forum on the topic. “I believe the main thing that draws people to this particular case is the pure mystery of it, and also as with me, many saw the billboard and it just stayed with them.”

Rust is a member of Wewsleuths.com, where forums allow many hobbyist detectives to post their theories on a variety of unsolved events. Their theories on the Sodder case range from a fire caused by an angry World War II veteran seeking revenge on an Italian to the possibility that some of the children started the fire and fled. Some theorize about a vengeful kidnapping followed by a community-wide cover-up, not unheard of in the days of coal wars.

But none of them knows what happened to the children.

Neither does Sylvia (Sodder) Paxton, 64, who resides in St. Albans.

“We are touched deeply to know that people still care about the fate of our family after so many years,” she said. “Our parents hoped that some day their efforts would bring a resolution, even if it came after their lifetimes.”

Her daughter, Jennie Henthorn of Saint Albans, the granddaughter of Jeannie and George Sodder, still has hope answers can be found. She has also posted on websleuths.com.

“It was always a part of my life growing up,” she said. “It wasn’t until much later that I realized it was something more of a regional mystery and not just a family thing.”

Henthorn said the revival of the mystery among Internet sleuths has meant a great deal to her mother.

“She promised my grandparents she wouldn’t let the story die, that she would do everything she could,” Henthorn said.

Still, despite the sleuths’ collective resources, the family has seen no fruits from their efforts.

“It honestly is just a mystery still, for everyone,” Henthorn said. “Just to have some resolution for my mom would be a good thing.”

Rust, for one, has hope that could happen.

“Myself and fellow armchair sleuths have more than hope, we have determination and strong belief that if we continue to push on, and continue to get people ... getting this story back in the spotlight we will find the answers that the family has searched for 61 years to find,” she said.

— E-mail:

bnaudrey@register-herald.com

For more information on the Sodder children mystery, read “West Virginia Unsolved Murders,” a book by George and Melody Bragg.

http://www.register-herald.com/local...358182913.html (http://www.register-herald.com/local/local_story_358182913.html)

Thank you Audrey and Merry Christmas to all.

[Teresa Larson]

Can we find out if it is possible for the phone wire to have been hit with lightning and created a spark which set that home ablaze? How would we find that out, remembering that these were old wires?

The wires wouldn't have been old back then. They also wouldn't have had any voltage coming through them to start a fire. The wires were cut not struck by lightening. It was the middle of winter it wasn't raining or lightening. If I remember correctly the ladder wasn't near the house it was further away from it. They looked for it the night of the fire and it was no where to be found. I believe who ever took the children called the house and moved the ladder.

[birdie74]

Also, the authorities said that the lines were cut. I believe even back then they would be able to tell the difference if the lines were burned, struck by lightning, or anything else rather than cut. I know he wasn't very credible, but the man who was arrested for stealing that night admitted to cutting the lines.

[birdie74]

Getting close to the holidays. Would like to see this case on front page news again. Was trying to find it, shadow205 worked tirelessly on this and got it in news on christmas before, and I know I have emails w/reporters relating. I am searching......

Great idea Christine!

[raf]

It was very confusing for law enforcement back when they investigated the Cipriani family bacause 1st cousins were both named Martha Lee. The Sodders and the Ciprianis both had daughters with this name. The Martha Lee who married Mr. Parrish was definitely Frank Cipriani's daughter, and the Sodders didn't dispute that.

There were just some claims that other kids had been there before they were investigated. Until a few months ago, I really thought the Sodder children had been there. I still think it's possible, but I really don't know what to think. I believe any other kids there may have belonged to Frank and Jennie's brother, Jimmy Cipriani, who went back and forth between West Virginia and Florida quite a bit for a while. I just don't know.
ok dear birdie74, I read no all postings of this case and sure I missed something...
abt Jimmie Ciprianos what are the more recent infos that you have?
death record?
marriage record? ( until 1943 he was single)

and also abt Edna...: it is possible that she changed the surname when raising the Sodder children? what are the more recent infos that you have abt Edna?
Thanks for a reply.
Regards, raf

[fox1950]

Yes, I thought Jimmie was single also during this time. Good point.

[Laura_Bean]

Okay listen I'm not saying the lines were old back than. Nor am I saying that they started the fire. What I am saying is that the lines were made of different material than they are made of today, I am sure. Secondly, my suggestion is that because it was a rainy night, there could have been lightening which struck the line, (where it was supposedly cut). Because of the material they used back than, could it be possible for the line to have sparked if the lightening hit it directly, and sent the spark all the way down the line, and to the house where it was connected for the phone.

[Laura_Bean]

Someone said it was a cold rainy night. Hold on let me look that up.

[Laura_Bean]

It was a cold, rainy night. Ice was hanging from the house and probably trees, phone and telephone lines, also. Mrs. Sodder awoke when the phone rang and thought it strange the children had not locked the door and closed the curtains. If the children had died during the night due to exposure, Fayetteville is a avid hunting area. Some hunter would have found their bones even in a remote area.

Fayetteville is a some town, there was much going on that night with people passing by and stopping and watching the fire. Where the Sodder's lived is country, even through it was just a few miles from Fayetteville. I can't see them running away-someone who would have picked them up would surely have told the family.

Great Laura. Your posts always give us food for thought. Keep posting.


Yes this is where it was. Fox says it was a cold and rainy night.

[Laura_Bean]

However, Birdie has a good point. You would think that the fire department would know if the line had been cut by lightning and not actually cut with something sharp. There would be burns on the line, you would think. Never thought of that. Thanks Birdie, you always have good insight. :)

[Valiant]

It would be very rare to expect lightening at that time of the year in that part of the country.

[raf]

Yes, I thought Jimmie was single also during this time. Good point.
right:

U.S. World War II Army Enlistment Records, 1938-1946 about James Cipriani
Name: James Cipriani
Birth Year: 1911
Race: White, citizen (White)
Nativity State or Country: West Virginia
State: West Virginia

Enlistment Date: 8 May 1943
Enlistment State: Virginia
Enlistment City: Huntington West
Branch: No branch assignment
Branch Code: No branch assignment
Grade: Private
Grade Code: Private
Term of Enlistment: Enlistment for the duration of the War or other emergency, plus six months, subject to the discretion of the President or otherwise according to law
Component: Selectees (Enlisted Men)
Source: Civil Life

Education: Grammar school
Marital Status: Single, without dependents
Height: 08
Weight: 134

bye, raf

[TallCoolOne]

Okay listen I'm not saying the lines were old back than. Nor am I saying that they started the fire. What I am saying is that the lines were made of different material than they are made of today, I am sure. Secondly, my suggestion is that because it was a rainy night, there could have been lightening which struck the line, (where it was supposedly cut). Because of the material they used back than, could it be possible for the line to have sparked if the lightening hit it directly, and sent the spark all the way down the line, and to the house where it was connected for the phone.If that were the case, the family would have heard and felt the lightening strike and that would have been mentioned. There's no way lightening could have struck the house directly and nobody would have heard it.

[Laura_Bean]

I'm talking about it hitting the phone line not the house directly. But that's okay let's let it go. Everyone says it could not have happened so let's drop that theory. I'm okay with that guys.

[wv171]

Originally Posted by christine2448 http://www.websleuths.com/forums/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2989887#post2989887)
Getting close to the holidays. Would like to see this case on front page news again. Was trying to find it, shadow205 worked tirelessly on this and got it in news on christmas before, and I know I have emails w/reporters relating. I am searching......

Anybody try Channel 59 news wvns http://www.wvnstv.com/

Sometimes they pretty good on showing Cold Case's..

As much shadow205 and some other's got on this case they could easy make a hour special show just on this case..

[christine2448]

Originally Posted by christine2448 http://www.websleuths.com/forums/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2989887#post2989887)
Getting close to the holidays. Would like to see this case on front page news again. Was trying to find it, shadow205 worked tirelessly on this and got it in news on christmas before, and I know I have emails w/reporters relating. I am searching......

Anybody try Channel 59 news wvns http://www.wvnstv.com/

Sometimes they pretty good on showing Cold Case's..

As much shadow205 and some other's got on this case they could easy make a hour special show just on this case..


Good idea! I will write them. I sent email reporter who did previous story. Will update you as I am!

[christine2448]

Originally Posted by christine2448 http://www.websleuths.com/forums/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2989887#post2989887)
Getting close to the holidays. Would like to see this case on front page news again. Was trying to find it, shadow205 worked tirelessly on this and got it in news on christmas before, and I know I have emails w/reporters relating. I am searching......

Anybody try Channel 59 news wvns http://www.wvnstv.com/

Sometimes they pretty good on showing Cold Case's..

As much shadow205 and some other's got on this case they could easy make a hour special show just on this case..

Done! Thanks.

[birdie74]

Great job Christine and wv171!

Raf and Fox, good point about Jimmie. You're probably right... I'll check to see what I have about Jimmie and why I had thought he might have had kids in Fl.

[wv171]

I give you all the area news outlets if you need them..

But Channel 59 news is the only one I ever seen really interested in cold case's..

I saw where Shadow 205 got Beckley newspaper to do a story , That about only newspaper I seen will do cold case's in this area..

[Laura_Bean]

Birdie --- I could see why you think that is a good possibility. I am wondering about that too. It is entirely possible the family took the children, although I can't fathom a good reason. But a lot of evidence seems to point that way. Can anyone think of a reason that they might have been taken by family?

[Granddaughter]

Mom recalls that Jimmy Cipriani married, but she doesn't think he had any children. He may have adopted a child later in life.

As far as the trucking business, I think the references to hauling coal is an anachronism. By the time most of the articles were written, he was hauling coal. I don't guess any of us ever focused on that as a significant detail, although now you guys have focused on things none of us (or the paid detectives) had ever caught. Since he had dump trucks, he certainly could have delivered loads of coal for businesses, but it was not the focus of his business at the time.

The electric lines were definitely cut and not hit by lightning. Interesting though, as a small tree next to the house survived the fire. Many years later, when I was a girl, the tree was hit by lightning and survived. The energy traveled out through the roots and broke the mortar in a circular brick path my grandmother had placed around the base of the tree. The tree lived though both the fire and the lightning, and it was still there when my grandmother moved from her house to ours. I wonder if it's still alive. I know, it's entirely irrelevant to this website, but that lightning strike always fascinated me. So it was odd to see that idea just pop up here, out of the blue.

Thanks for all that you do on this website.

[Granddaughter]

Ack. Should have been "... the references to hauling coal are an anachronism." My English teacher just rolled over in her grave.

[birdie74]

Granddaughter, I hope you and your family had a happy Thanksgiving!

[Laura_Bean]

The photo was not the right one. *Sighs* I am so sorry to granddaughter for sending the wrong one. I will try again. The pose was wrong. Granddaughter, could you please give us some insight as to why the family in Florida was suspected of having the children? Was there some issues between your family and theirs? Did they have a reason to want to take the children?

Thanks

[raf]

Hi, I know not if this article can be interesting:

Cortez Bridge Tender’s House
4319 127th Street West, Cortez, Florida
Circa 1910
Threat: Development
The original bridge from Cortez to Anna Maria Island was completed in 1922. It extended from Cortez Road which was at that time called Bradentown Street on the Amended Addition to Cortez Plat. John Guthrie was the bridge tender for many years and is shown as the bridge tender in the 1930 census for Manatee County and probably built this house. F.T. and Mary Guthrie purchased the property from the Georgia Florida Land Company on December 5, 1913. Lena Durrance purchased the property on September 26, 1916 from F.T. and Mary Guthrie. John W. Guthrie married Lena Durrance on December 26, 1916 in Manatee County. The Gutheries, John W. and Lena sold the property on December 30, 1938 to Amerigo Giannini and Frenchi Cipriani. The property remained in the Cipriani family until it was sold with other holdings to the Bay Boat Company on December 22, 1995 and in turn sold to PND LLC September 13, 2002. In 1963, it was listed as a store and restaurant.
source (http://www.manateeclerk.com/news%20archive/2007EndangeredBuildings.html)
Amerigo Giannini (birth: 1907 abt -Falls, WV), wife: Julie Giannini ( birth: 4 Aug 1909 Argentina; imm. 1921;Death: 1976 - Smithers, WV; daughter of italian parents; mother name: Antonia Regis; children of Amerigo and Julie Giannini: 2 sons-John Paul Giannini and Macy Giannini ; and 1 daughter----) was the brother in law of Francesco Paolo Cipriani ( Frank Cipriani/Franchi Cipriani); Amerigo was the son of M. and Olivia/Alesia Giannini; sibling: Louisa Giannini Cipriani; and Julia Giannini...
so Frank Cipriani was in business with the brother in law...

regards,
raf

[birdie74]

Thank you raf. Frank and Amerigo apparently owned the property for a few years together, though it looks like Amerigo never lived in Florida. A few years later, his share was transferred from his and his wife's name to Frank's wife's name. I don't have the info in front of me at the moment, but I believe it was around 1942.

This article caused me some confusion because I thought this Cortez Bridge Tender House would be the property in front of the bridge where Alma died. This made me very suspicious, but it turned out to be a different piece of property. The Ciprianis owned the old tender house property from years before, and the bridge location had apparently moved by the time of her death.

[coltsgal]

Ok, I haven't read every thread here to get caught up on the story.

But has anyone ever asked any questions to the two boys who survived from coming down from the attic?

Were their brothers and sisters still even up there? Did they notice any strange activity in the attic?

[snowme]

Hi coltsgal, I'm sure questions were asked of the two boys that survived and came down from upstairs. I'm paraphrasing an article that is here on the forum and I will link it afterward... the boys weren't able to wake them in their rush, one remembered calling to Maurice and thought he heard him either move or make noise. But in the rush and panic - afterward he wasn't sure.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=936324&postcount=460 This is to the magazine article that was uploaded by "granddaughter". The area of the article we're talking about is below the line of the children's pictures and to the right of the the picture of the the new house that was built.

Tomorrow will be the 63rd anniversary of this tragedy. Sodder family, you're in my thoughts and prayers.

[msmikey]

Hi All,
just stumbled on this case while searching the internet for unsolved crimes in wv ( I am from Huntington,wv) The case interest me and I was wondering if there had ever been any books written on this Case? i googled the sodder children but, all i could find was articles and such on the story. Is there a book anywhere? And if so where can I order it online?

JoAnn

[snowme]

Hi All,
just stumbled on this case while searching the internet for unsolved crimes in wv ( I am from Huntington,wv) The case interest me and I was wondering if there had ever been any books written on this Case? i googled the sodder children but, all i could find was articles and such on the story. Is there a book anywhere? And if so where can I order it online?

JoAnn

Welcome to websleuths msmikey! I've not read it myself but seen mention of it here and elsewhere: “West Virginia Unsolved Murders,” by George and Melody Bragg. I don't know if it is available online or not but if you are still in WV or perhaps even a neighboring state I'd check the library. If you're set on purchasing try googling the title and/or authors names; perhaps they have a site set up for sales of it???

Glad you found websleuths!

[fox1950]

Hi All,
just stumbled on this case while searching the internet for unsolved crimes in wv ( I am from Huntington,wv) The case interest me and I was wondering if there had ever been any books written on this Case? i googled the sodder children but, all i could find was articles and such on the story. Is there a book anywhere? And if so where can I order it online?

JoAnn
Here is their website: Gem Publications and Photography - www.coalphotos.com (http://www.coalphotos.com/books.htm)
The Mystery of the Sodder Children • And Many More... West Virginia Unsolved Murders Book II featuring: • The WVU Coed Murders • Cop Killer Ronald Williams ...

[raf]

when Joseph CIPRIANI came in USA the first time, nobody final destination listed... in 1903 he back in Italy, and in 1905 came in USA again and alone; final destination Massimino LIZZI brother in law, Pittsburg, PA; in 1907 Francesco Cipriani joining at Giuseppe father in Pittsburg, the child was in travel with Francesco TAMMISO ( I believe that the correct italian spell is CAMMISA), single, 25 old, cousin of Giuseppe/Joseph CIPRIANI...

it is possible that someone of Lizzi or Tammiso family knew something abt Sodder abductions?
It could be possible to find some descendent of this families?
Regards,
raf

[Laura_Bean]

Okay guys I have been attempting to get 20/20 to do a story about this. I don't know if they will decide to do it or not. Please hope that they do. I think, no I know that this story NEEDS some publicity. If 20/20 did a story and the children or families of the children or friends who knew or know the children saw it, anyone who knows or knew or heard stories about it, they would probably call in to the station with info.