Brooke Bennett, 12 years old Randolph VT #15

[Adalena935]

i see what you are saying, but i feel like maybe he was sort of obessed with her, like she was some ultimate prize or something. yes, it was planned, but from his deep desire to hurt specifically her. IMO :)

I think he would've done this to anyone available. They're opportunists like wolves hunting prey.

Edited to Add: If they wouldn't have caught him now, he surely would've continued murdering other children for the same purposes.

[petra]

Maybe the house in in Denise's name. :waitasec:

ETA: Or they owe more than it's worth.

IIRC, someone posted info on the house and it was in both MJ and DJ's name. Also, built on his family's land. In the photo section there are pictures.
Seems MJs granparents owned alot of land in that area.

But maybe overextended. Who knows?

In Norway, MJ or family would have to pay, even if it meant garnishing all future wages and all assets.

[close_enough]

However difficult viewing the equipment that he purchased along with the accessories, you can see that he obviously meant her great physical harm and definitely points to the "premeditation of murder". There was no way, in my opinion, that she was expected to ever leave that house alive. The use of all of the equipment would have caused severe injury. For reasons we do know yet know, she had to be eliminated. The sick bastard probably thought, "Hey, might as well video this for all my mutually perverted friends, no need to waste this action".

that's what i'm thinking also....:furious:

(found the "machine", btw)

[liljim]

for those that choose not to go to the website and view the "machine" i will give a description;

there is no head restraint as mentioned, the person is on their hands and knees and there are "cuffs" to restrain them at the wrists and ankles attached to a metal frame, the waist bar mentioned is a metal T shaped support that the person can rest their waist area on for support. the cuffs are as much a way to keep you attached to the thing as they are intended as a bondage/restraint device. (no i dont have one of these things its just obvious from viewing it)

the "machine" is simply an arm behind the person that is powered by a small motor to move in and out, i would imagine that it has a speed control of some sort, there are attachments you purchase to put on the end of the bar, this would be the vac-u-lok "dildo" mentioned in the affidavit. obviously this is what penetrates the person.

now, this machine is not designed for pain, it is not inherently a toy for people that are aroused by pain, it is simply a mechanical dildo. but in the context of this case, knowing who it was to be used on, and considering the size of the dildo he purchased for it, and what is said in the emails, i think it is clear that this was intended all along to be a torturous affair.

there can be no question in my mind that this was never intended to be an attempt to induct brooke into their "sex ring", this was not a kidnapping that "just happened" to end in death, this was a premeditated abduction, rape, possibly torture, and murder. i would bet the house that it will come out eventually thru either email or from AR that brooke was to be killed. i would virtually guarantee that the possibility of brooke needing to be killed was brought up, at the very least it was known to be a likely outcome but again i feel certain that it was part of the plan all along.

i just wanted to point out that there is nothing wrong with the machine itself, it is not a torture rack of some sort, i also want to make clear i am not trying to minimize its likely usage in this case.

[close_enough]

Back a couple of threads ago....there was a discussion on the equipment purchased and UPSed to his home. The discussion was about adult sex entertainment (?) -bondage and SM. It certainly was interesting, IMO.

I'll go back and see if I can find it, if you are interested!:blowkiss:

...Not just a plastic white high heeled shoe and wig....(Winkler case)

i saw a picture of it, petra....whew!...my jaw dropped!......

(oh gosh, don't eeeven get me started on the Winkler case)...:rolleyes:

[gigi2009]

The last time I had read any info on rape, control and death..it had nothing to do with love and or even liking..it is about control and violence. Rape never has been about love or even sex..it is about control and violence, the most violent act a person can perpetrate against another is rape followed by death...I think MJ had that all tied up in a Little package for himself to experience and his friends to view.

Don't ever think someone that rapes and murders ever has even the slightest sense of feeling or love for the vic...it just ain't so!

Right as far as rapists are concerned. But this is Pedophilia, a whole different animal. We know as normal, healthy adults know that this is rape but to Pedo's it's a relationship. Not a hit and run. It's strategic. It's planned. They choose victims carefully and over time lure them into a sense of trust and well being. A very controlled, manipulative atmosphere. The mind in such a young age is vulnerable and they know it. How often do you hear of a child that's been neglected or overlooked by hurried,harried parents that end up being victims? Compare them to the children that are secure, looked after and have diligent parents--there's quite a difference in the numbers. I'm not saying it never happens to diligent parents, I'm just saying that these guys know exactly whom to prey upon.

[Jaded]

In one of the affidavits, they list exactly what the devices are and the website. I couldn't bring myself to actually "see the items" or visit the website but from the WS'ers that did, they said it was pretty graphic.

for those that choose not to go to the website and view the "machine" i will give a description;

there is no head restraint as mentioned, the person is on their hands and knees and there are "cuffs" to restrain them at the wrists and ankles attached to a metal frame, the waist bar mentioned is a metal T shaped support that the person can rest their waist area on for support.

the "machine" is simply an arm that is powered to move in and out, i would imagine that it has a speed control of some sort, there are attachments you purchase to put on the end of the bar, this would be the vac-u-lok "dildo" mentioned in the affidavit. obviously this is what penetrates the person.

now, this machine is not designed for pain, it is not inherently a toy for people that are aroused by pain, it is simply a mechanical dildo. but in the context of this case, knowing who it was to be used on, and considering the size of the dildo he purchased for it, and what is said in the emails, i think it is clear that this was intended all along to be a torturous affair.

there can be no question in my mind that this was never intended to be an attempt to induct brooke into their "sex ring", this was not a kidnapping that "just happened" to end in death, this was a premeditated abduction, rape, possibly torture, and murder. i would bet the house that it will come out eventually thru either email or from AR that brooke was to be killed. i would virtually guarantee that the possibility of brooke needing to be killed was brought up, at the very least it was known to be a likely outcome but again i feel certain it is was part of the plan all along.

i just wanted to point out that there is nothing wrong with the machine itself, it is not a torture rack of some sort, i also want to make clear i am not trying to minimize its likely usage in this case.

I agree that the plan all along was to get rid of Brooke. AR (IIRC) stated in the affidavit that Brooke was a "problem".

That poor child and what she had to endure if she was indeed tortured with this device.

[RR0004]

*sighs* I've been trying to avoid this, but since it's a major part of this case, and people are always mentioning it, I guess I should take a look at this contraption.
Do you have a link to where I can see this machine?
You can PM it to me if you like.

Thank you.
Brave soul...can't bring myself to do it.

[petra]

*sighs* I've been trying to avoid this, but since it's a major part of this case, and people are always mentioning it, I guess I should take a look at this contraption.
Do you have a link to where I can see this machine?
You can PM it to me if you like.

Thank you.

Does anybody have the link for Evelyn.?
I can't remember the name of the store and can't find it after searching.
Thanks.

[Carrington]

We never posted the link on here.
The name of the site is Extreme Restraints. BEWARE XXX

[Jaded]

Does anybody have the link for Evelyn.?
I can't remember the name of the store and can't find it after searching.
Thanks.

I sent her the link in PM.

[Tom'sGirl]

I sent her the link in PM.
So did I :crazy:

[philamena]

My very dearest Philamena,:blowkiss:
Just my opinion that Brooke was held captive and not murdered on the day that she went missing.


So much Love and Respect,
dark_shadows
Hello sweet one,:blowkiss:
I think you are most likely correct.

[close_enough]

That's what I was wondering myself. Why couldn't he pay for his own attorney? Both he and his wife work, right?

Okay, this is what really ticks me off. Hello McFly! She KNEW he was a RSO and finds kiddie porn yet does nothing about it? IMO this makes her just as culpable for what happened to poor Brooke as the POS MJ.

heck, that contraption cost over $700.00:eek:

[gigi2009]

I sent it to her too. After reading the description, I'm still thinking about it. I just pray that she died prior to enduring any horror of that magnitude. I'm hoping God spared her any pain.

[petra]

Thanks liljim.

[petra]

We never posted the link on here.
The name of the site is Extreme Restraints. BEWARE XXX

Thanks Carrington--No wonder why I could not fnd it!

[petra]

heck, that contraption cost over $700.00:eek:

plus attachments..I think the affadavite said the total was just a bit over 1,000 USD.

[Jaded]

plus attachments..I think the affadavite said the total was just a bit over 1,000 USD.

If he has that kind of money to toss around then why should the citizens of VT pay his tab for legal representation?

[DianeB]

Where on earth would you you park something like that? Or does it fold up for easy storage?

[philamena]

Along with other poor choices Cassandra has made, having an Open Casket adds to her list IMO.
:clap::clap::clap:
I couldn't believe she choose to have the casket open.
My first thought...what an azzhole. :banghead:

[Tom'sGirl]

Where on earth would you you park something like that? Or does it fold up for easy storage?
Folds up flat, weighs only 30 lbs.

[SuziQ]

If he has that kind of money to toss around then why should the citizens of VT pay his tab for legal representation?

I agree!

[RR0004]

Where on earth would you you park something like that? Or does it fold up for easy storage?
Supposedly only weighs 30lbs.

[Tom'sGirl]

plus attachments..I think the affadavite said the total was just a bit over 1,000 USD.
Total order including tax and shipping was $1,033.45. Maybe he put it on his Visa???

[petra]

If he has that kind of money to toss around then why should the citizens of VT pay his tab for legal representation?

:crazy: Because they are so kind and generous to sex offenders?

Seriously, something is very very wrong with the legal system there..IMO

(Info taken from articles posted by DS and others-)

[evelyn24]

THANK YOU to everybody who sent me a link to the sex machine.

[dark_shadows]

Hello sweet one,:blowkiss:
I think you are most likely correct.
My very dearest Philamena,:blowkiss:
Big hugs to you my friend.

Thank-you so much for your post.

I would say that it would have been for approximately 3 days.




So much Love and Respect for you,
dark_shadows

[gigi2009]

okay--getting a glass of wine here. Perhaps he had a public defender just for that hearing? He has yet to go to arraignment.

[RR0004]

Supposedly only weighs 30lbs.
Oops, sorry TG...didn't see your post!

[close_enough]

for those that choose not to go to the website and view the "machine" i will give a description;

there is no head restraint as mentioned, the person is on their hands and knees and there are "cuffs" to restrain them at the wrists and ankles attached to a metal frame, the waist bar mentioned is a metal T shaped support that the person can rest their waist area on for support. the cuffs are as much a way to keep you attached to the thing as they are intended as a bondage/restraint device. (no i dont have one of these things its just obvious from viewing it)

the "machine" is simply an arm behind the person that is powered by a small motor to move in and out, i would imagine that it has a speed control of some sort, there are attachments you purchase to put on the end of the bar, this would be the vac-u-lok "dildo" mentioned in the affidavit. obviously this is what penetrates the person.

now, this machine is not designed for pain, it is not inherently a toy for people that are aroused by pain, it is simply a mechanical dildo. but in the context of this case, knowing who it was to be used on, and considering the size of the dildo he purchased for it, and what is said in the emails, i think it is clear that this was intended all along to be a torturous affair.

there can be no question in my mind that this was never intended to be an attempt to induct brooke into their "sex ring", this was not a kidnapping that "just happened" to end in death, this was a premeditated abduction, rape, possibly torture, and murder. i would bet the house that it will come out eventually thru either email or from AR that brooke was to be killed. i would virtually guarantee that the possibility of brooke needing to be killed was brought up, at the very least it was known to be a likely outcome but again i feel certain that it was part of the plan all along.

i just wanted to point out that there is nothing wrong with the machine itself, it is not a torture rack of some sort, i also want to make clear i am not trying to minimize its likely usage in this case.

i understand what you're saying...i think, as you said, "knowing who it was to be used on" is just so sickening!....i also agree with you...it was to be a torturous affair....

[petra]

Folds up flat, weighs only 30 lbs.

It sounds like a commercial for the device.!!
I know you didn't mean it that way in all seriousness.:)

[Tom'sGirl]

okay--getting a glass of wine here. Perhaps he had a public defender just for that hearing? He has yet to go to arraignment.
If he didn't request an attorney prior to his hearing, he was assigned one. He may now retain one for the future.

[RR0004]

My very dearest Philamena,:blowkiss:
Big hugs to you my friend.

Thank-you so much for your post.

I would say that it would have been for approximately 3 days.




So much Love and Respect for you,
dark_shadows
ITA...which makes me feel sooooo sick!!

[eris]

I think Deloris Gagnon is Raymond Gagnon's mother. Her age is not 40 . She's 70 years old. She's from Caribou Maine. If you search for Ray Gagnon at Veromi, one of the city and state he stayed was Caribou Maine. Ray studied at University of Maine and graduated 1990 ( mechanical engineering )

At veromi.net the results for deloris gagnon is :

Name/AKAsPhoneAddressCity, StatePossible Relatives 1. GAGNON, DELORIS M (Age 70) (http://www.veromi.net/order.asp?1=DELORIS;;M;;GAGNON;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;27 831719;;&2=name&3=people&4=1&5=deloris;;;;gagnon;;;;ME;;;;;;;;&rc=1)
Available(2)AvailableCARIBOU, ME
BREWER, ME
BANGOR, MEPossible Relatives:
GAGNON, JANET M (Age 47) (http://www.veromi.net/order.asp?1=JANET;;M;;GAGNON;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;9436 17933&2=name&3=people&4=1&5=deloris;;;;gagnon;;;;ME;;;;;;;;&rc=1&rel=Y)
GAGNON, RAYMOND (http://www.veromi.net/order.asp?1=RAYMOND;;;;GAGNON;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;518 415025&2=name&3=people&4=1&5=deloris;;;;gagnon;;;;ME;;;;;;;;&rc=1&rel=Y)
CAGNON, RAYMOND A (Age 40) (http://www.veromi.net/order.asp?1=RAYMOND;;A;;CAGNON;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;37 0399459&2=name&3=people&4=1&5=deloris;;;;gagnon;;;;ME;;;;;;;;&rc=1&rel=Y)
MCCORMACK, DENISE R (Age 43) (http://www.veromi.net/order.asp?1=DENISE;;R;;MCCORMACK;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;; 27846444&2=name&3=people&4=1&5=deloris;;;;gagnon;;;;ME;;;;;;;;&rc=1&rel=Y)
GAGNON, EDWARD L (Age 70) (http://www.veromi.net/order.asp?1=EDWARD;;L;;GAGNON;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;278 41402&2=name&3=people&4=1&5=deloris;;;;gagnon;;;;ME;;;;;;;;&rc=1&rel=Y)
GAGNON, LORI L (Age 43) (http://www.veromi.net/order.asp?1=LORI;;L;;GAGNON;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;27841 284&2=name&3=people&4=1&5=deloris;;;;gagnon;;;;ME;;;;;;;;&rc=1&rel=Y)
LAPOINTE, LESLIE A (Age 29) (http://www.veromi.net/order.asp?1=LESLIE;;A;;LAPOINTE;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;3 29703329&2=name&3=people&4=1&5=deloris;;;;gagnon;;;;ME;;;;;;;;&rc=1&rel=Y)

[petra]

THANK YOU to everybody who sent me a link to the sex machine.

I am glad you came back. I was worried there for a minute.

[Tom'sGirl]

It sounds like a commercial for the device.!!
I know you didn't mean it that way in all seriousness.:)
LOL, just answering the question as asked :gavel:

[close_enough]

So did I :crazy:

so did i, lol......she must have gotten a slew of pm's, bless her heart!

[RR0004]

If he didn't request an attorney prior to his hearing, he was assigned one. He may now retain one for the future.
Oh, absolutely... I kinda hoped maybe no one wanted to take his case on. (Yes, I know they haven't made that kind of attorney yet.)

[petra]

If he didn't request an attorney prior to his hearing, he was assigned one. He may now retain one for the future.

Thanks for explaning that, TG.

[DeltaDawn]

Right as far as rapists are concerned. But this is Pedophilia, a whole different animal. We know as normal, healthy adults know that this is rape but to Pedo's it's a relationship. Not a hit and run. It's strategic. It's planned. They choose victims carefully and over time lure them into a sense of trust and well being. A very controlled, manipulative atmosphere. The mind in such a young age is vulnerable and they know it. How often do you hear of a child that's been neglected or overlooked by hurried,harried parents that end up being victims? Compare them to the children that are secure, looked after and have diligent parents--there's quite a difference in the numbers. I'm not saying it never happens to diligent parents, I'm just saying that these guys know exactly whom to prey upon.

Well..as someone who has studied, counseled and written some of those articles you have read I will tell you that you are right on some points..but a very wrong on the idea that the relationship is about their version of love, no it's about about control and rape and violence. Don't buy into that girl love, child love BS ..it isn't so. These guys are very much invested in a relationship to control, rape and act violently toward their vics. Which is why many end up in the morgue..but we only hear the child was raped or killed by a family member or associate. The devil is in the details. The pedos have no love for the child, only conquer, control and violence..meaning rape of the child. It progresses in some of them to the point of murder..we are witness to that in this case. There's no love here or relationship other then sado/masochistic between the perp and his vics.

It is violent and it is deadly..it has nothing to do with a relationship..they are forging that to get a means to an end. They are violent predators waiting to strike..and buy the vids of others that have..that alone tells the nature of this beast.

[dark_shadows]

okay--getting a glass of wine here. Perhaps he had a public defender just for that hearing? He has yet to go to arraignment.
Dearest Gigi,:blowkiss:
Jacques Attorney is a Federal Public Defender.
His name is Michael Desautel.


Love and Respect,
dark_shadows

[gigi2009]

My very dearest Philamena,:blowkiss:
Big hugs to you my friend.

Thank-you so much for your post.

I would say that it would have been for approximately 3 days.




So much Love and Respect for you,

dark_shadows



DS, Would you be so kind as to explain why you think it was 3 days? I have the utmost respect for your opinion and knowledge and I'm very curious as to you thoughts and why you think this. I appreciate any information you're willing to share.

[close_enough]

Right as far as rapists are concerned. But this is Pedophilia, a whole different animal. We know as normal, healthy adults know that this is rape but to Pedo's it's a relationship. Not a hit and run. It's strategic. It's planned. They choose victims carefully and over time lure them into a sense of trust and well being. A very controlled, manipulative atmosphere. The mind in such a young age is vulnerable and they know it. How often do you hear of a child that's been neglected or overlooked by hurried,harried parents that end up being victims? Compare them to the children that are secure, looked after and have diligent parents--there's quite a difference in the numbers. I'm not saying it never happens to diligent parents, I'm just saying that these guys know exactly whom to prey upon.

(in bold)...i agree with you completely..

[dark_shadows]

ITA...which makes me feel sooooo sick!!
My very dearest RR,:blowkiss:
It is horrifying.

So much Love and Respect for you,
dark_shadows

[petra]

Well..as someone who has studied, counseled and written some of those articles you have read I will tell you that you are right on some points..but a very wrong on the idea that the relationship is about their version of love, no it's about about control and rape and violence. Don't buy into that girl love, child love BS ..it isn't so. These guys are very much invested in a relationship to control, rape and act violently toward their vics. Which is why many end up in the morgue..but we only hear the child was raped or killed by a family member or associate. The devil is in the details. The pedos have no love for the child, only conquer, control and violence..meaning rape of the child. It progresses in some of them to the point of murder..we are witness to that in this case. There's no love here or relationship other then sado/masochistic between the perp and his vics.

It is violent and it is deadly..it has nothing to do with a relationship..they are forging that to get a means to an end. They are violent predators waiting to strike..and buy the vids of others that have..that alone tells the nature of this beast.

ITA, very well put. I get too emotional about this to write a cohesive statement in English. Thank you DD

[RR0004]

Dearest Gigi,:blowkiss:
Jacques Attorney is a Federal Public Defender.
His name is Michael Desautel.


Love and Respect,
dark_shadows
Thanks, DS!

[close_enough]

I think Deloris Gagnon is Raymond Gagnon's mother. Her age is not 40 . She's 70 years old. She's from Caribou Maine. If you search for Ray Gagnon at Veromi, one of the city and state he stayed was Caribou Maine. Ray studied at University of Maine and graduated 1990 ( mechanical engineering )

At veromi.net the results for deloris gagnon is :

Name/AKAsPhoneAddressCity, StatePossible Relatives 1. GAGNON, DELORIS M (Age 70) (http://www.veromi.net/order.asp?1=DELORIS;;M;;GAGNON;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;27 831719;;&2=name&3=people&4=1&5=deloris;;;;gagnon;;;;ME;;;;;;;;&rc=1)
Available(2)AvailableCARIBOU, ME
BREWER, ME
BANGOR, MEPossible Relatives:
GAGNON, JANET M (Age 47) (http://www.veromi.net/order.asp?1=JANET;;M;;GAGNON;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;9436 17933&2=name&3=people&4=1&5=deloris;;;;gagnon;;;;ME;;;;;;;;&rc=1&rel=Y)
GAGNON, RAYMOND (http://www.veromi.net/order.asp?1=RAYMOND;;;;GAGNON;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;518 415025&2=name&3=people&4=1&5=deloris;;;;gagnon;;;;ME;;;;;;;;&rc=1&rel=Y)
CAGNON, RAYMOND A (Age 40) (http://www.veromi.net/order.asp?1=RAYMOND;;A;;CAGNON;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;37 0399459&2=name&3=people&4=1&5=deloris;;;;gagnon;;;;ME;;;;;;;;&rc=1&rel=Y)
MCCORMACK, DENISE R (Age 43) (http://www.veromi.net/order.asp?1=DENISE;;R;;MCCORMACK;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;; 27846444&2=name&3=people&4=1&5=deloris;;;;gagnon;;;;ME;;;;;;;;&rc=1&rel=Y)
GAGNON, EDWARD L (Age 70) (http://www.veromi.net/order.asp?1=EDWARD;;L;;GAGNON;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;278 41402&2=name&3=people&4=1&5=deloris;;;;gagnon;;;;ME;;;;;;;;&rc=1&rel=Y)
GAGNON, LORI L (Age 43) (http://www.veromi.net/order.asp?1=LORI;;L;;GAGNON;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;27841 284&2=name&3=people&4=1&5=deloris;;;;gagnon;;;;ME;;;;;;;;&rc=1&rel=Y)
LAPOINTE, LESLIE A (Age 29) (http://www.veromi.net/order.asp?1=LESLIE;;A;;LAPOINTE;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;3 29703329&2=name&3=people&4=1&5=deloris;;;;gagnon;;;;ME;;;;;;;;&rc=1&rel=Y)

here's the one that's 40 yrs old....same site (veromi.com)

People Search: GAGNON, DELORIS in VT<< Search Again

1 Match Found (100 max.)
Name/AKAs Phone Address City, State Possible Relatives
1. GAGNON, DELORIS N (Age 40)
Available(1) Available CULLMAN, AL
RANDOLPH, VT Possible Relatives:

GAGNON, CASSANDRA M (Age 51)
GAGNON, RAYMOND A (Age 40)

[petra]

LOL, just answering the question as asked :gavel:

:) ..and indeed you did. LOL

[Beyond Belief]

I am hearing thoughts of Brooke being held captive for 3 days? How? Wasn't the wife in that home?

[eris]

here's the one that's 40 yrs old....same site (veromi.com)

People Search: GAGNON, DELORIS in VT<< Search Again

1 Match Found (100 max.)
Name/AKAs Phone Address City, State Possible Relatives
1. GAGNON, DELORIS N (Age 40)
Available(1) Available CULLMAN, AL
RANDOLPH, VT Possible Relatives:

GAGNON, CASSANDRA M (Age 51)
GAGNON, RAYMOND A (Age 40)

Yep but if you noticed on my search i dunno if this was just a mistyped but Ray's name was mentioned twice but the other last name was Cagnon.

[petra]

My very dearest RR,:blowkiss:
It is horrifying.

So much Love and Respect for you,
dark_shadows

And for you to say this DS, after all you have seen, heard and are aware of...just makes my heart sink further.
Thank you my friend for always being so honest.

[close_enough]

Yep but if you noticed on my search i dunno if this was just a mistyped but Ray's name was mentioned twice but the other last name was Cagnon.

you're right....hmmm, got to be a typo, imo

[gigi2009]

[QUOTE=DeltaDawn;2362278]Well..as someone who has studied, counseled and written some of those articles you have read I will tell you that you are right on some points..but a very wrong on the idea that the relationship is about their version of love, no it's about about control and rape and violence. Don't buy into that girl love, child love BS ..it isn't so."

Just highlighting this point--with all due respect, I didn't glean my information from articles that I read. I stated earlier, it might've been missed--that I have worked in Emergency Services, Victims Services and aside from that interviewed many (ugh)Pedo's. I'm referring to THEIR thought process in order to better equip us and methods we can use to stop them. To prevent more victims. Of course they are raping and controlling and brutalizing etc.... and yes, they do get off on control and pain etc...But because of their reasoning and justification behind it is how they are coming up with better ways to get access to their victims.

[wicket]

I'll be blunt: if this ^$%##*& can afford sex toys at $700 or so, afford time-off from work to torture, rape, and kill, live in a home larger than my own (and I work full-time and sent two children to college as a widow), why the heck can't he pay for an attorney? He has quite a bit of property from the pictures - the home should be sold and the rental property to boot. Let the family revert to living in an apartment - I'm sorry but the taxpayers of VT should not have to pay for this vile and horrendous death and mode of living.

On another note: all the emails and pictures that were supposedly sent to Gagnon have supposedly been tossed. I'll bet the LE have found them on one of the computers in MJ's possession-anything he sent has an OUT file and he would never have sent stuff without copies. Copies are supposedly the lifeblood of pedos. I believe this is only the tip of the iceberg and like a spider web it will spread out and capture many other sickos in and out of VT. Anyone who has had any contact via email or cell phone etc. with Gagnon or Jacques will be hauled in for questioning and investigated. Even pornography via the U.S. mail will be a charge, I'll bet.

[close_enough]

yes, DS.....do you mind explaining why you think Brooke may have been held captive?....just a hunch?...as others have mentioned, i'm also interested in 'hearing' what you have to think:)

[eris]

you're right....hmmm, got to be a typo, imo

If Deloris is his mom, i am wondering if he's bringing his mom whereever he goes because Veromi is Listing's Deloris states where Ray used to stay as well. Or he could be using his mom's identity to purchase something online that's why Deloris's age was mistakenly placed at 40? There is a Maine marriage of Deloris to a Poulin.

[Jaded]

I'll be blunt: if this ^$%##*& can afford sex toys at $700 or so, afford time-off from work to torture, rape, and kill, live in a home larger than my own (and I work full-time and sent two children to college as a widow), why the heck can't he pay for an attorney? He has quite a bit of property from the pictures - the home should be sold and the rental property to boot. Let the family revert to living in an apartment - I'm sorry but the taxpayers of VT should not have to pay for this vile and horrendous death and mode of living.

On another note: all the emails and pictures that were supposedly sent to Gagnon have supposedly been tossed. I'll bet the LE have found them on one of the computers in MJ's possession-anything he sent has an OUT file and he would never have sent stuff without copies. Copies are supposedly the lifeblood of pedos. I believe this is only the tip of the iceberg and like a spider web it will spread out and capture many other sickos in and out of VT. Anyone who has had any contact via email or cell phone etc. with Gagnon or Jacques will be hauled in for questioning and investigated. Even pornography via the U.S. mail will be a charge, I'll bet.
IIRC the news was tossing out teasers that more arrests were to come. I think there is a porn ring involved.

yes, DS.....do you mind explaining why you think Brooke may have been held captive?....just a hunch?...as others have mentioned, i'm also interested in 'hearing' what you have to think:)

I'm with CE - I am interesting in it as well. TIA

[cheko1]

I know, but sometimes the way the body is positioned, you can tell where the trauma is...I was at an open-casket wake for a young car accident victim, and he was placed on his side to conceal the point of impact. Despite the fact that the side facing me was untouched by the accident, I found the hidden side disturbing and wished they had had a closed casket.


My brother was killed in a auto accident. My Dad insisted on a open casket. He was at 2 different funeral homes, since he was being buried in another town. The first did nothing to hide the swelling, it looked nothing like him at all. I was mortified! At the 2nd they rearranged the angle he was laying / they also put a netting over the coffin & it looked identical to him. He had ever bone in his body broken.

[Chica]

I don't know about the rest of you, but I have been having a terrible time sleeping for the past week and a half. I spend so much time on this site, my right hand is numb from working the mouse, and my neck has a permanent 'kink' in it.

Anyway...the more I think about it, the more I think this is the ONLY thing in MJ's life where he feels he has any kind of control. Just the way he manipulates AR in the emails, "...I hear your mom is taking calls from your FATHER and flirting, and crap ... I'm a little worried about your mom and dad...there is talk around town that your mom is talking about divorcing your dad...she isn't very nice to him...snippy and bitchy to him...telling her to tell the counselor that she doesn't like the way her mom treats her dad...".

It seems to me he doesn't have backbone enough to stand up for himself to his wife, or even his stepdaughter, for that matter! I know he is not normal, but any HALF-WAY normal adult would talk to their spouse or child face-to-face and tell them directly how they feel, not all this passive/aggressive behavior - and not dragging children into their spousal relationship. It just makes me sick in-and-of itself...and this is not even getting so far as the sexual abuse he has been subjecting AR to for all these years. I can't help but to feel sorry for AR...the poor kid never even had a chance to get a fair shot at a 'normal life' with this sick pervert in her life...it just makes me ill.

Thank you for letting me rant...
:rant::no:

[dark_shadows]

Thanks, DS!


My very dearest RR,:blowkiss:
You are so very welcome.

Gagnon went to Federal Court from the Chittenden facility. He was then transferred to the St. Albans facility. Gagnon is now back in Chittenden.

Jacques was being housed in the Springfield facility prior to his court appearance.

Jacques is now in the St.Albans facility.


The two are not allowed any contact at all.

So much Love and Respect,
dark_shadows

[close_enough]

If Deloris is his mom, i am wondering if he's bringing his mom whereever he goes because Veromi is Listing's Deloris states where Ray used to stay as well. Or he could be using his mom's identity to purchase something online that's why Deloris's age was mistakenly placed at 40? There is a Maine marriage of Deloris to a Poulin.

dang!...i hadn't thought of that....hmmm

[cheko1]

I'm new to this board but I have been following this since Brooke became missing. I believe the question of "why" he killed her can be answered by AR. Remember, on the e-mails, it was stated that AR "knew why this had to happen". I do believe that she holds the key to a lot of our unanswered questions and that if she had indeed talked to LE, they are holding any additional information closely.


Welcome to WS lonetraveler! I think your correct.....

[liljim]

from the little we have heard from AR thru the emails and her statements to police she had no suspicion she was being lied to, as twisted and sick as things were, it was normal to her and she seems to have been thoroughly convinced and "on board" so to speak with the whole charade.

i havent seen anything to suggest she hated or was angry with MJ, just the opposite actually. it may even take a while for her to stop trying to defend/protect him.

her world was going to collapse at some point regardless, but for it to unfold like this, involving a murder that she took part in, to now hear that her father made this whole sordid tale up just so he could have sex with her... i sure hope they are keeping a close eye on her.

i cant help but be extremely curious about what we will hear from her next, will she be completely forthcoming now, or will she still feel some attachment to MJ even after learning of the magnitude of the deception.

as i said before, i dont think it is reasonable to expect AR to have even the remotest sense of right and wrong at this point, i wont be surprised by anything she says or does. i do hope somehow she can make her way thru this and do the right thing. i think it would go a long way towards starting her on a healing path.

[Leve]

THANK YOU to everybody who sent me a link to the sex machine.

My hubby happened by while this was on my screen - poor man. He never questions anymore. I once had to get him to click off a picture in the Darlie case (I wasn't expecting to see a dead little boy).

DS (my dad was a captain in the Alabama Prison System - My Mom was an account payables Clerk at Limestone Correctional Athens, AL) I would love to hear why you think she was held too.

[cheko1]

To me, this was not an uncontrolable urge. It was premeditated over a month long period of setting this seduction up.

JMO

I agree with you petra!!!! :blowkiss:

[dark_shadows]

And for you to say this DS, after all you have seen, heard and are aware of...just makes my heart sink further.
Thank you my friend for always being so honest.
My very dearest Petra,:blowkiss:
You have always supported me from day one my friend and I am very grateful for that.
Forgive me for being late in responding to your post. I need to scroll back more after I post anything to see the what was posted while I was in the middle of pecking out a post! These threads are moving way too fast.


All of my Love and Respect for you,
dark_shadows

[SuziQ]

The O'Reilly Factor
Enough is Enough

http://www.foxnews.com/video/index.html?playerId=videolandingpage&streamingFormat=FLASH&referralObject=2133326&referralPlaylistId=949437d0db05ed5f5b9954dc049d70b 0c12f2749

[DeltaDawn]

I am sure that AR is intensive therapy right now..and that they are hoping for a major breakthrough with her before this goes to trial..which will be quite a while from now. But for now..she doesn't trust anyone and she still will feel very much controlled by the relationship she had with her Dad and Ray. It is going to be a very long road to recovery for her..everything that she has built her life on since 9 years old (or possibly younger) is false.
Her cousin is murdered and how does she process that compared to being told her cousin was being intiated into Breckenridge that day? Sexual abuse and control she will understand in a few months..murder and her role in helping get her to the site..that's going to be even tougher for her to comprehend and come of out on the other side whole and functional.

[Jaded]

from the little we have heard from AR thru the emails and her statements to police she had no suspicion she was being lied to, as twisted and sick as things were, it was normal to her and she seems to have been thoroughly convinced and "on board" so to speak with the whole charade.

i havent seen anything to suggest she hated or was angry with MJ, just the opposite actually. it may even take a while for her to stop trying to defend/protect him.

her world was going to collapse at some point regardless, but for it to unfold like this, involving a murder that she took part in, to now hear that her father made this whole sordid tale up just so he could have sex with her... i sure hope they are keeping a close eye on her.

i cant help but be extremely curious about what we will hear from her next, will she be completely forthcoming now, or will she still feel some attachment to MJ even after learning of the magnitude of the deception.

as i said before, i dont think it is reasonable to expect AR to have even the remotest sense of right and wrong at this point, i wont be surprised by anything she says or does. i do hope somehow she can make her way thru this and do the right thing. i think it would go a long way towards starting her on a healing path.

I hope that she is receiving immediate therapy and treatment. As I said before, she is not your average 14 year old and is WISE beyond her years. I don't even want to think of what this child has gone through at the hands of MJ and his pervy associates.

[cheko1]

Yup...the "people" are paying. What a system!

When he has assetts like he does why is the state paying?
Wow Vermont really does need to change there laws.

[close_enough]

My hubby happened by while this was on my screen - poor man. He never questions anymore. I once had to get him to click off a picture in the Darlie case (I wasn't expecting to see a dead little boy).

DS (my dad was a captain in the Alabama Prison System - My Mom was an account payables Clerk at Limestone Correctional Athens, AL) I would love to hear why you think she was held too.

ok, i couldn't help but laugh at this....picturing it in my head:crazy:

[gigi2009]

While listening to the O'Reilly Factor, I have to wonder why on earth aren't the children that live in homes with SO's interviewed during the so called rehab process? Perhaps if that was in place AR would have said something and none of this would have ever happened. But I personally don't believe in rehab for pedo's.

[cheko1]

IIRC, someone posted info on the house and it was in both MJ and DJ's name. Also, built on his family's land. In the photo section there are pictures.
Seems MJs granparents owned alot of land in that area.

But maybe overextended. Who knows?

In Norway, MJ or family would have to pay, even if it meant garnishing all future wages and all assets.


Thats the way it needs to be done in the USA too, petra!!!:blowkiss:

[Tom'sGirl]

The O'Reilly Factor
Enough is Enough

http://www.foxnews.com/video/index.html?playerId=videolandingpage&streamingFormat=FLASH&referralObject=2133326&referralPlaylistId=949437d0db05ed5f5b9954dc049d70b 0c12f2749
Thanks for the link SQ!

[DianeB]

Her cousin is murdered and how does she process that compared to being told her cousin was being intiated into Breckenridge that day? Sexual abuse and control she will understand in a few months..murder and her role in helping get her to the site..that's going to be even tougher for her to comprehend and come of out on the other side whole and functional.I hesitate to say this because the implications are so chilling, but her story to the state police about Brooke being initiated into Breckenridge may have also been a lie. AR may have been aware that Brooke was going to be killed. In one of her emails she mentioned wanting to see her "suffer", and there was that peculiar passage about who would "have time" with Brooke, and how much. Why would time have been an issue if she was to remain alive?

Jacques may have planted in AR's mind the fear that something terrible would happen were Brooke to remain alive.

[hockeymom]

The O'Reilly Factor
Enough is Enough

http://www.foxnews.com/video/index.html?playerId=videolandingpage&streamingFormat=FLASH&referralObject=2133326&referralPlaylistId=949437d0db05ed5f5b9954dc049d70b 0c12f2749

I am so happy O'Reilly is back and on this case. I hope he continues to bring this to the attention of everyone in the nation.

[becca]

While listening to the O'Reilly Factor, I have to wonder why on earth aren't the children that live in homes with SO's interviewed during the so called rehab process? Perhaps if that was in place AR would have said something and none of this would have ever happened. But I personally don't believe in rehab for pedo's.

Even if that interview had taken place, the control over the children is such that never would the truth come out. These kids fear for their very well being. They have a zone that is comfortable for them... its safe. Any thing from an outsider is going to disrupt their life. They've been programed that way.

[liljim]

Even if that interview had taken place, the control over the children is such that never would the truth come out. These kids fear for their very well being. They have a zone that is comfortable for them... its safe. Any thing from an outsider is going to disrupt their life. They've been programed that way.

quite possibly true in most cases, but trained experts could at least have the opportunity to look for signs of abuse. it also provides a regular wake-up call for people like the mother of AR in this case, where she obviously fooled herself into ignoring warning signs, with mandatory regular counseling/interviews maybe she is forced to be more aware and honest with herself about the situation and the danger.

[RR0004]

father made this whole sordid tale up just so he could have sex with her

Lil Jim

Let's be clear...this man is in no way a father...he never was...never will be. (JMO)


BTW- he is not AR's biologival for anyone new to reading the boards.

[liljim]

thanx for the link to the o'reilly piece, i dont usually like his style but he couldnt more right on this point.

[gigi2009]

I believe the people of Vermont love their children and want to see a change. Although this tragedy happened to Brooke, maybe her death will be the change that Vermont needed and it won't be in vain.

[liljim]

father made this whole sordid tale up just so he could have sex with her

Lil Jim

Let's be clear...this man is in no way a father...he never was...never will be. (JMO)


BTW- he is not AR's biologival for anyone new to reading the boards.


i certainly dont consider him a father, i was looking at it from her perspective and using her words. she calls him dad, and refers to him as her father. so it seems clear in AR's world this man was her father.

you and I know different, but i was just taking her perspective to make a point as to how difficult it must be for her to realize the truth of what has been happening to her.

edit - and yes, for anyone that is uncertain - MJ is not this girls biological father, he is her stepfather.

[becca]

quite possibly true in most cases, but trained experts could at least have the opportunity to look for signs of abuse. it also provides a regular wake-up call for people like the mother of AR in this case, where she obviously fooled herself into ignoring warning signs, with mandatory regular counseling/interviews maybe she is forced to be more aware and honest with herself about the situation and the danger.
She is like the abused spouse (only we don't know that she was) she overlooks, stays in denial, and stays right there in the home... the only way she is forced to see what is going on is what has happened. We still don't really know if she accepts it yet. She may stay with MJ, if she does then her children should be taken away. Stupid only goes so far... then it becomes criminal.

[DianeB]

How many times has Denise been married? Three, four?

[liljim]

quick question - do we know approximately how long MJ was around/living with AR's mother before the abuse started? AR said she was 9 when she received the note, how long had she known MJ at that point?

if only she had just taken the note to her mother... (not blaming her, just imagining how simply this could have been avoided with just a small twist of fate) surely AR's mother couldnt have ignored her 9 year old daughter being given a note saying she was to be given sex training by her stepfather... could she?!

[close_enough]

How many times has Denise been married? Three, four?

two times, that i can figure out...it might be more, though...Woodard is a name associated with her, as far as i can tell at veromi.com....maybe Woodard was her maiden name??

[Busylady]

Three times i believe.

How many times has Denise been married? Three, four?

[liljim]

She is like the abused spouse (only we don't know that she was) she overlooks, stays in denial, and stays right there in the home... the only way she is forced to see what is going on is what has happened. We still don't really know if she accepts it yet. She may stay with MJ, if she does then her children should be taken away. Stupid only goes so far... then it becomes criminal.

i agree 100%, im just allowing for the possibility that in some small percentage of cases, mandatory interviews of family members living with convicted sex offenders, particularly when children are in the household, may just be beneficial in some way.

its possible right? some children do tell when given what they feel is a safe opportunity, some spouses do break free of the bonds of abuse...

[close_enough]

quick question - do we know approximately how long MJ was around/living with AR's mother before the abuse started? AR said she was 9 when she received the note, how long had she known MJ at that point?

if only she had just taken the note to her mother... (not blaming her, just imagining how simply this could have been avoided with just a small twist of fate) surely AR's mother couldnt have ignored her 9 year old daughter being given a note saying she was to be given sex training by her stepfather... could she?!

gosh, i just don't know....one would think had she given this note to her mother, none of this would have ever happened....at least not to AR or Brooke, anyway.......this note still has me puzzled a bit though...can't put my finger on it....

[DianeB]

quick question - do we know approximately how long MJ was around/living with AR's mother before the abuse started? AR said she was 9 when she received the note, how long had she known MJ at that point?Denise's mother was interviewed by one of the news stations and commented that MJ has been her son-in-law for twelve years, so AR must have been 2 years old when her mother married him.

[close_enough]

Three times i believe.

ok, the the Woodard name is possibly another married name....veromi.com shows her with the last names of Woodard, Rice & Jacques...

[SuziQ]

How many times has Denise been married? Three, four?

Three times. She married two brothers then an RSO. She obviously doesn't know when certain boundaries shouldn't be crossed.

[close_enough]

Denise's mother was interviewed by one of the news stations and commented that MJ has been her son-in-law for twelve years, so AR must have been 2 years old when her mother married him.

wow, 12 yrs with this freak, ugh.....

[VTNance]

quick question - do we know approximately how long MJ was around/living with AR's mother before the abuse started? AR said she was 9 when she received the note, how long had she known MJ at that point?

if only she had just taken the note to her mother... (not blaming her, just imagining how simply this could have been avoided with just a small twist of fate) surely AR's mother couldnt have ignored her 9 year old daughter being given a note saying she was to be given sex training by her stepfather... could she?!

Yes, I think she could, given what else she has ignored over the years.

[close_enough]

Three times. She married two brothers then an RSO. She obviously doesn't know when certain boundaries shouldn't be crossed.

ooooh, ok....right, right!...thanks for reminding me of that Suzi....then Woodard would be her maiden name....

[Chica]

wow, 12 yrs with this freak, ugh.....

Is that possible? When did he get out of Prison??

[Busylady]

I would say MJ started brainwashing AR at a very young age and turning her against her mother. AR probably felt like if she took the note to her mom something awful would happen. Maybe AR would have to move out and go live with her bio dad, or she would kick MJ out etc. I would say AR felt like there wasnt a soul in the world she could turn to except MJ because thats what he convinced her of.

[DianeB]

I could swear I saw a post from someone who'd determined that she had been married to two brothers with the last name of Rice, but for the life of me I can't find it. If that's true and Woodward is also a married name, she's had at least four husbands.

ETA: Woodward was her maiden name? This family tree is as convoluted as one of those Mafia organization charts you see in RICO trials.

[close_enough]

Yes, I think she could, given what else she has ignored over the years.

good point, there....

[Busylady]

Woodard is her maiden name.

I could swear I saw a post from someone who'd determined that she had been married to two brothers with the last name of Rice, but for the life of me I can't find it. If that's true and Woodward is also a married name, she's had at least four husbands.

ETA: Woodward was her maiden name? This family tree is as convoluted as one of those Mafia organization charts you see in RICO trials.

[close_enough]

Is that possible? When did he get out of Prison??

i don't know about that, Chica...just responding to the fact that Denise's mama said Jacques had been her son-in-law for 12 yrs.....

how long was he in prison???....i thought i read 4 yrs??..maybe 6???...wasn't it in 1993 that he went to jail??? (i'm confused on this, obviously)

eta...12 yrs would put them married in 1996.....hmmm

[gigi2009]

Mj could have also convinced her that Denise knew and didn't care. Or that Denise was part of the Breckenridge program. I can't remember the case but there was a girl who was abused by her father and he convinced her Mom knew and wasn't going to do anything about it. I think MJ took it further. I think he convinced AR that Denise knew AR was chosen and was fine with it. I think then he set out to pin them against each other. He could have been working on Denise too, telling her how AR needed guidance, a father figure etc.... I know as a teenage girl, my mom and I didn't get along at all. Imagine in this situation how easy it was to push it even farther.

[close_enough]

here we go, Chica....

http://www.wcax.com/global/story.asp?s=8618279

Court records released today show his sex crime history began in 1985 when he was 18, charged with having sex with a 15-year-old relative.

She told police he had sex with her at least 100 times starting when she was eight.

But she refused to testify against him, so the charge of lewd and lascivious conduct had to be dismissed.

Eight years later, Jacques was convicted of a kidnapping and raping an 18-year-old woman in Rutland.

Court records say she was gagged and handcuffed with a rope around her neck while he subjected her to depraved and humiliating sexual violence for four hours.

His sentence called for six years in prison to be followed by 14 years on probation into 2013.

But, after four years behind bars, he was released and then petitioned for early release from probation. He had the full support of his probation officer

more at link above....

appears that MJ was released from prison in 1997....(going by all the dates above, in the article)

[DianeB]

According to the Burlington Free Press,
Jacques was convicted of kidnapping and aggravated sexual assault of an 18-year-old West Rutland woman in 1992. He served four years of a 6-to-20 year prison term and, under an order signed by Judge Amy Davenport, was released early from probation in 2006.
http://www.burlingtonfreepress.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080708/NEWS01/80707017/1007/NEWS02

Denise must have married him the minute he got sprung.

Here's a link to the interview a reporter from that paper conducted with Brooke's grandmother.
http://www.burlingtonfreepress.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=200880701027

There is a link on that page to an on-camera interview with Mrs Milne. Hindsight being 20-20, when I watch it now I can't help but think she knew that Brooke was dead before her body was found.

[cheko1]

I don't know about the rest of you, but I have been having a terrible time sleeping for the past week and a half. I spend so much time on this site, my right hand is numb from working the mouse, and my neck has a permanent 'kink' in it.

Anyway...the more I think about it, the more I think this is the ONLY thing in MJ's life where he feels he has any kind of control. Just the way he manipulates AR in the emails, "...I hear your mom is taking calls from your FATHER and flirting, and crap ... I'm a little worried about your mom and dad...there is talk around town that your mom is talking about divorcing your dad...she isn't very nice to him...snippy and bitchy to him...telling her to tell the counselor that she doesn't like the way her mom treats her dad...".

It seems to me he doesn't have backbone enough to stand up for himself to his wife, or even his stepdaughter, for that matter! I know he is not normal, but any HALF-WAY normal adult would talk to their spouse or child face-to-face and tell them directly how they feel, not all this passive/aggressive behavior - and not dragging children into their spousal relationship. It just makes me sick in-and-of itself...and this is not even getting so far as the sexual abuse he has been subjecting AR to for all these years. I can't help but to feel sorry for AR...the poor kid never even had a chance to get a fair shot at a 'normal life' with this sick pervert in her life...it just makes me ill.

Thank you for letting me rant...
:rant::no:

Chica,
The one part of the rant you left out was, who was responsible for bringing a RSO into the home. Who decided all the children in the family were safe living with a RSO? Who had the power to stop this entire mess?
Who had clues in the palm of her hand & turned her head the other way?
Who was in court today standing by her man?

DENISE!!!!

[Busylady]

If someone could take a moment and check the Vermont registry, and tell me if they find Michael Jacques listed? I am not finding him listed any longer?

[DianeB]

Court records released today show his sex crime history began in 1985 when he was 18, charged with having sex with a 15-year-old relative.

She told police he had sex with her at least 100 times starting when she was eight.

...and he was 11.

[Chica]

here we go, Chica....

http://www.wcax.com/global/story.asp?s=8618279

[I][B]Court records released today show his sex crime history began in 1985 when he was 18, charged with having sex with a 15-year-old relative.

appears that MJ was released from prison in 1997....(going by all the dates above, in the article)

Thank you so much, Close! Unbelievable! I think Denise's mom has to be off though, because if he was released from prison in '97, that's only 11 years ago, and I'm certain (almost, anyway!!) that somewhere it said they got married after he was released from prison...I don't know anymore - too much info and too many players to keep straight!
:crazy:

[DeltaDawn]

i don't know about that, Chica...just responding to the fact that Denise's mama said Jacques had been her son-in-law for 12 yrs.....

how long was he in prison???....i thought i read 4 yrs??..maybe 6???...wasn't it in 1993 that he went to jail??? (i'm confused on this, obviously)

eta...12 yrs would put them married in 1996.....hmmm


Ibelieve he only served 4 years of a sentence where the minimum was supposed to be six. But he was such a fine example of a rehabilitated sex offender they let him off early, with probation and sexual offenders school. This means he was abusing AR while attending classes to not abuse her and got flying colors. Isn't that lovely..maybe we need judges on the bench who have more info in sex offenders and only try those cases. All other occupations are very specialized..why not judges if they can't tell a pervert from the next guy..maybe they need to be in traffic court.
If I am wrong on dates, timed served correct me..don't even go there with me on judges unless you live in a state where the judges are elected called magistrates..even my mom says that's the dark ages.

Filly , Girlfriend where are you..you know in our state all you need to do is buy an election to be a magistrate..you don't need a law degree, nor do you need to have ever practiced law.

DD

[close_enough]

...and he was 11.

oh lord...that hadn't even 'hit' me yet....i'm still stunned that he wasn't even on probation at this point in time.....

[close_enough]

Thank you so much, Close! Unbelievable! I think Denise's mom has to be off though, because if he was released from prison in '97, that's only 11 years ago, and I'm certain (almost, anyway!!) that somewhere it said they got married after he was released from prison...I don't know anymore - too much info and too many players to keep straight!
:crazy:

yep, they got married immediately after he got out of prison, looks to me.....ACK!

eta...& you're welcome:)

[Chica]

Chica,
The one part of the rant you left out was, who was responsible for bringing a RSO into the home. Who decided all the children in the family were safe living with a RSO? Who had the power to stop this entire mess?
Who had clues in the palm of her hand & turned her head the other way?
Who was in court today standing by her man?

DENISE!!!!

Oh, Cheko...I know...I didn't even touch on that part of the whole sordid mess...I still don't want to believe she was in court FOR HIM...I want to think she was there to shame him, but I honestly just don't think that is the case...I sure would like to hear from her!

[Tom'sGirl]

If someone could take a moment and check the Vermont registry, and tell me if they find Michael Jacques listed? I am not finding him listed any longer?
I went here http://170.222.137.2:8080/sor/servlet/SOR and he's NOT THERE!

[Chica]

I went here http://170.222.137.2:8080/sor/servlet/SOR and he's NOT THERE!

Maybe because he is in custody??? I hope?????:eek:

[Jaded]

I went here http://170.222.137.2:8080/sor/servlet/SOR and he's NOT THERE!

WTH!!! I am assuming he was on there before? If not, WHY didn't he have to register?

[DianeB]

If someone could take a moment and check the Vermont registry, and tell me if they find Michael Jacques listed? I am not finding him listed any longer?Yes, the record is gone. Maybe the site was getting too many hits for its server to handle?

[Pinkhammer]

Three times. She married two brothers then an RSO. She obviously doesn't know when certain boundaries shouldn't be crossed.

I believe this poor excuse for a mother knew exactly what was going on with her daughter.

[VTNance]

I went here http://170.222.137.2:8080/sor/servlet/SOR and he's NOT THERE!

He was on the list last week, and before that.
I think they took him off the list because he's incarcerated.

[close_enough]

I went here http://170.222.137.2:8080/sor/servlet/SOR and he's NOT THERE!

pathetic, just pathetic:mad:

well, i waited to see if Greta would mention the case...she didn't as far as what i saw......my eyes are getting tired...good night all :bateyes:

[becca]

i agree 100%, im just allowing for the possibility that in some small percentage of cases, mandatory interviews of family members living with convicted sex offenders, particularly when children are in the household, may just be beneficial in some way.

its possible right? some children do tell when given what they feel is a safe opportunity, some spouses do break free of the bonds of abuse...
Yes some spouses do break free.... I'm living proof of that. But it takes a long time. Plus after the denial comes anger something that DJ should have had long ago.

[cheko1]

Oh, Cheko...I know...I didn't even touch on that part of the whole sordid mess...I still don't want to believe she was in court FOR HIM...I want to think she was there to shame him, but I honestly just don't think that is the case...I sure would like to hear from her!


I doubt she was there to shame him Chica, she is going to stand by her man. She never cared about her own daughter & what her RSO hubby did to her. Any normal person would of stood up & ask the judge to throw the book at him. She will go to her grave denying MJ had anything to do with Brooke's death.

She is as sick & warped as MJ or she'd of never brought him into there lives. JMO

[nanandjim]

Maybe AR was the one who revealed something to Brooke either inadvertently or because she didn't expect Brooke to react negatively?

And MJ guilt-tripped her into participating in coming up with a solution for "the problem"?

Hmm.
Very good point, Diane. In one of the emails, MJ to AR, '...and Breckenridge is not very happy with you right now...'. I didn't understand what that meant. Perhaps, she did say something or do something and Brooke did react in a negative way, which created a problem that needed to be fixed.

[DeltaDawn]

Well..all I can say is he never registered in New Hampshire where he worked..and they need to register where they live and also if they work in another location ..they should have to register there also.

As far as the family..give me a break..not even sorry for the mother of Denise and Cassandra..she knew her daughter Denise married two brothers, then brought a RSO into the family and married him. Now, Cassandra at her age is still living in her mom's house..according to the article posted above. They've all been in the area for sometime..they knew what MJ's family history was. Then she hugs MJ at the beginning of all this because she thought what...he was hurting..let's try scared.
She knew that the outcome would be bad..mom's and granny's have that extra sense..why the hell didn't she use it when her daughter's were marrying these perverts? She may be a nice lady..but if Cassandra and Brooke lived with her..where the hell did all these people think Brooke was, and if MJ's ..why didn't they check to make sure Denise was there? I mean were not talking rocket science here..were talking keeping track of your kids.

Dumb, dumber, dumbest.

[christine2448]

Please don't miss adnoid's new sticky :D (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67094)

[Chica]

Very good point, Diane. In one of the emails, MJ to AR, '...and Breckenridge is not very happy with you right now...'. I didn't understand what that meant. Perhaps, she did say something or do something and Brooke did react in a negative way, which created a problem that needed to be fixed.

Wow...Diane and Nan - I was wracking my brain trying to figure out what that meant about Breckenridge not being very happy with AR right now...and all that talk about "(paraphrasing)...and you know why it has to be done by..." whatever date he was spewing...this could very possibly be why! Because it was alllll AR's fault for something she said or let slip to Brooke...now they (AR and MJ) only have a certain amount of time to 'take care of the problem'...that's how MJ could have sucked AR in so deeply too. And why AR would have such deep seeded hatred and strong feelings for Brooke - AR thought it was her (AR's) fault, so she was angry with/at Brooke for making AR have to do whatever the plans were for Brooke...

[DeltaDawn]

Very good point, Diane. In one of the emails, MJ to AR, '...and Breckenridge is not very happy with you right now...'. I didn't understand what that meant. Perhaps, she did say something or do something and Brooke did react in a negative way, which created a problem that needed to be fixed.

I think that if we were able to see more emails we would find that used frequently..Breckenridge isn't happy with you right now. Remember he threatened to kill her , the person that came in second got their throat cut. He used that to manipulate AR to do his bidding..do what Breckenridge wants or die. Remember these kinds of messages started when she was 9 years old..how horrific to a little 9 year old girl to believe that the abuse of her body sexually would be what keeps her alive. Especially at her step dad's hands..and she knew he was part of this..he was the trainer..and her uncle was also part of this, a person who evidently participated and gave critiques on her performance.

Just too disgusting to think about what this little girl went through from the time she was 9 years old..now at 14 she equates sex with survival. How horrid!

[christine2448]

Please continue here. (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2362749#post2362749)