Nancy Cooper, 34, of Cary, N.C. #10

[christine2448]

Please continue GENERAL discussions here. Look around Nancy has her own forum (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=165), there are several threads started on specific topics to try and stay organized.


Links to previous and similar threads can be found toward the bottom of the page.


Newbies.....

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y171/christine2448/WELCOMETOWSBLUE.gif

I am sad such a tragedy is bringing us all together.

I advise everyone to read the RULES of WS, Long (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=66869)and Short Version (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=66872).

[raisincharlie]

Raleigh NC - I just saw your post at the end of the previous thread. I had not seen Sleuthy Gal's but had questions about the VoIP.

Do you know if it would be possible for a person to configure the home phone to make a phone call to a cell phone at a certain time ? Especially a person who works with such a system on a daily basis ?

[fran]

Raleigh NC - I just saw your post at the end of the previous thread. I had not seen Sleuthy Gal's but had questions about the VoIP.

Do you know if it would be possible for a person to configure the home phone to make a phone call to a cell phone at a certain time ? Especially a person who works with such a system on a daily basis ?

You didn't address your question to me, but from what I saw on the previous thread, yes,................he could program an automatic dial for his home phone to his cell phone.

IF he could remotely cause disconnects on the home phone from work and keep a log of incoming and outgoing calls from his work, he certainly could do just about anything he wants with the home phone.

JMHO
fran

[RaleighNC]

Raleigh NC - I just saw your post at the end of the previous thread. I had not seen Sleuthy Gal's but had questions about the VoIP.

Do you know if it would be possible for a person to configure the home phone to make a phone call to a cell phone at a certain time ? Especially a person who works with such a system on a daily basis ?

I am sure it's possible - esp since everything is IP based and you can control things via computer.

But - for example, I have a wireless printer / fax machine and VoIP. I can create a doc on my PC, send it to the printer to "fax" this blank doc and sent the fax to dial my cell phone at 3 AM if I wanted to. VoIP turns everything into bits and bytes - voice, data, fax, etc. so it's easy to make it look like someone called "from home" while he was at the store - to call his cell.

(Think of the possibilities of annoying someone that pi$$ed you off - set fax machine to call them and "retry" every 30 minutes for hours starting at 2 AM... not that I would do that....)

So - if simpleton me could figure out how to do this - certainly an expert in VoIP technology could do that too without the hamfisted version of using the fax machine. ;-)

[ember]

Ok, I have finally caught up! Phew! Took me forever!

We need a poll on who thinks Brad is guilty and who doesn't.

I, for one, don't think he is....and I think he should be given his children back.
Seems they were taken on no real grounds and that does not sit well with me that the courts can just come and pull children off of their parents and give them to GP and aunts that they barely know...especially in a time when what they need most is stability and normal routine...or as normal as can be given the circumstances.
If LE does not have enough on Brad to contain him, then how can a judge take his children?! Because he had an affair? So did she.
Because he had an argument with his wife? We all do that. Because he took his girls passports? Who could blame him? I would too if I thought my wife/husband was going to run off with them while I was at work one day. And it seems to me that Nancy cried to her parents about money because Brad cut her off from her high end spending. It doens't look like she was hurting too badly to me. She drove a new BMW and he drove her old car! IMO, he had the right to choke up on her spending, he made the money. I would have a problem with my husband just running amok with our checking account if he was not replenishing it. If she needed more money, she should have went out and got a job. My mom always taught me that the true way to freedom was to have your own money...and through the years I"ve found that to be a very true statement. I was in a very bad marriage but didn't have to be "trapped" because I made my own way out. We'd all like to be kept women with an endless supply of money so we could just stay home and take care of our kids, the house and have free time with friends. Life doesn't work that way.
As for her friends....women LOVE drama, especially a bunch of housewives who have nothing better to do all day. I've experienced that first hand. It can be ugly. They very well could have blown whatever NC has told them way out of proportion...as women often do because they love their friend and want to stay vigilent of their well being. But they only heard one side.
Who really knows!

I'm in no way blaming NC for what happened to her. She certainly should still be here with her girls....but I, in no way, shape or form, think that this "evidence" against Brad is any more than a typical domestic dispute between husband and wife...and does not constitute him being prematurely hung in the public eye.

My point is we all need to lose the tunnel vision.

I may eat my words...but I just don't think he did it.
Heather's husband could have done it to get back at Brad. He'd be off the radar and could have committed the perfect crime. We had a case like that on WS, if IIRC. The husband of a woman who was cheating, went to the house where the man lived that she was cheating on him with and raped and killed his wife....to get even with the man for messing with his wife. People are crazy and nothing is ever cut and dry.
Could have been Heather...because she wanted Brad and he called her the morning after to tell her to forget about it ever happening again...and now she is going through her own divorce, so she thinks if NC was gone...she'd have shot at Brad.
Who knows!
The possibilities are endless!
Why must we all fry Brad right away!?
And why must his children, Nancy's children, suffer the most by not only having to deal with the death of their mother, but also being taken from everything that is normal for them?
Nancy must have thought he was a fit father or she would not have approved joint custody should they divorce.

Not all angles have been looked at, imo. We are tainted by the Scott Peterson's And Mark Hacking's of the world.....


just my 2 pennies....

[CyberPro]

Raleigh NC - I just saw your post at the end of the previous thread. I had not seen Sleuthy Gal's but had questions about the VoIP.

Do you know if it would be possible for a person to configure the home phone to make a phone call to a cell phone at a certain time ? Especially a person who works with such a system on a daily basis ?

I do not know what kind of phones they had, but I posted earlier about this as being a possibility. I also had another thought. I wonder if there is a free hotspot nearby. I am nearly CERTAIN that there is one in the Bear Rock Cafe that is in the same shopping center as the HT. If BC had a laptop, he could have used Telnet to access his home system, then had the call placed from the home line. This might have created some log entries on the telnet access, but he could have erased them, if he was being extra careful. He might have been banking on no one knowing that those logs exist, or thinking to look at them.

Total speculation on my part, and there could be other hotspots in the area, but last time I used one at Bear Rock, you had to login with your e-mail address and a password. It was free, but you still had to log in.

CyberPro

[raisincharlie]

I am sure it's possible - esp since everything is IP based and you can control things via computer.

But - for example, I have a wireless printer / fax machine and VoIP. I can create a doc on my PC, send it to the printer to "fax" this blank doc and sent the fax to dial my cell phone at 3 AM if I wanted to. VoIP turns everything into bits and bytes - voice, data, fax, etc. so it's easy to make it look like someone called "from home" while he was at the store - to call his cell.

(Think of the possibilities of annoying someone that pi$$ed you off - set fax machine to call them and "retry" every 30 minutes for hours starting at 2 AM... not that I would do that....)

So - if simpleton me could figure out how to do this - certainly an expert in VoIP technology could do that too without the hamfisted version of using the fax machine. ;-)

LMAO !!! I don't need any ideas of how to get into anymore trouble than normal but most interesting concept!

Thanks for the information. So the possiblity does indeed exist that the 6:40 am call from Nancy to Brad on Saturday would look like she called but could well be it wasn't her at all but a call initiated from a remote location. Since Brad is on the record now saying Nancy called him at this time, it is reasonable to assume LE would also be looking to verify this.

Wonder if it can be determined if the call was remotely initiated or not ? Hmmmm, this could get to be very interesting. Technology - amazing stuff.

[stillblv]

I do not know what kind of phones they had, but I posted earlier about this as being a possibility. I also had another thought. I wonder if there is a free hotspot nearby. I am nearly CERTAIN that there is one in the Bear Rock Cafe that is in the same shopping center as the HT. If BC had a laptop, he could have used Telnet to access his home system, then had the call placed from the home line. This might have created some log entries on the telnet access, but he could have erased them, if he was being extra careful. He might have been banking on no one knowing that those logs exist, or thinking to look at them.

Total speculation on my part, and there could be other hotspots in the area, but last time I used one at Bear Rock, you had to login with your e-mail address and a password. It was free, but you still had to log in.

CyberPro

I am envisioning a telecom geek on the witness stand explaining this. Makes me picture the PayPal guy at Entwistle's trial who got his lawyer's undies in such a knot! LOL :-)

[RaleighNC]

The other thing that seems apparent here is that this is turning into the battle of the affidavits, as someone noted in the previous thread.

I think this is a way to force the hand of the Cary PD to arrest him. Cary PD wants to build their case without the added pressure of turning over all the evidence to his attorneys, they want to build the case and keep pressure on him. They are happy to use the custody issue as letting out more and more information that will be helpful in trying him in the court of public opinion, and lastly, they also are stopping people like they are still exhausting all the possibilities that the killer is still out there - the roadblocks, etc.

One of the things that defense attorneys always say is that the police focused on the husband and never looked at any other possibilities. So - they are handling that in advance by still "looking" and amazingly, coming up empty.

IMO - Brad's attorney's are trying to force their hand to arrest / charge him so that they can truly start their defense and be entitled to view what evidence they have.

[raisincharlie]

I do not know what kind of phones they had, but I posted earlier about this as being a possibility. I also had another thought. I wonder if there is a free hotspot nearby. I am nearly CERTAIN that there is one in the Bear Rock Cafe that is in the same shopping center as the HT. If BC had a laptop, he could have used Telnet to access his home system, then had the call placed from the home line. This might have created some log entries on the telnet access, but he could have erased them, if he was being extra careful. He might have been banking on no one knowing that those logs exist, or thinking to look at them.

Total speculation on my part, and there could be other hotspots in the area, but last time I used one at Bear Rock, you had to login with your e-mail address and a password. It was free, but you still had to log in.

CyberPro

Thank you as well ! Wow - lots to think about with all this information.

[raisincharlie]

You didn't address your question to me, but from what I saw on the previous thread, yes,................he could program an automatic dial for his home phone to his cell phone.

IF he could remotely cause disconnects on the home phone from work and keep a log of incoming and outgoing calls from his work, he certainly could do just about anything he wants with the home phone.

JMHO
fran

Fran - we are getting a lot of good info about this from fellow posters - all I can say is WOW - the possibilities are most interesting.

[RoughlyCollie]

NC was not entitled to work in the U.S. She didn't have a green card.

Further, BC alleges in his affidavit that NC had an extra-marital relationship that was not sexual. How is that an affair? It sounds like a friendship to me.

If she needed more money, she should have went out and got a job.

[fran]

Fran - we are getting a lot of good info about this from fellow posters - all I can say is WOW - the possibilities are most interesting.

I wouldn't doubt if one of the people working the hardest on this case for the Cary PD is their computer expert! ;)

JMHO
fran

[Mimi]

The comment section of this article is quite interesting...mostly slanted towards BC....


http://www.newsobserver.com/print/thursday/front/story/1152214.html


I also posted a link to photos of the Memorial service in Edmonton on the photo thread.

RIP Nancy-- justice is in the works- I hope!

[fran]

The comment section of this article is quite interesting...mostly slanted towards BC....


http://www.newsobserver.com/print/thursday/front/story/1152214.html


I also posted a link to photos of the Memorial service in Edmonton on the photo thread.

RIP Nancy-- justice is in the works- I hope!

Yes, the comments section is interesting Mimi. Some people just don't seem to get it. :(

JMHO
fran

[Zeke]

...Cary PD wants to build their case without the added pressure of turning over all the evidence to his attorneys, they want to build the case and keep pressure on him. They are happy to use the custody issue as letting out more and more information that will be helpful in trying him in the court of public opinion, and lastly, they also are stopping people like they are still exhausting all the possibilities that the killer is still out there - the roadblocks, etc....

I am not familiar with the CPD or the DA on the case. Are they experienced enough to handle this case?

[ember]

NC was not entitled to work in the U.S. She didn't have a green card.

Further, BC alleges in his affidavit that NC had an extra-marital relationship that was not sexual. How is that an affair? It sounds like a friendship to me.

Illegals make money here every day. She could have done something to make money if she felt like she needed more....or maybe even tried to understand why her husband was choking up on her spending. $8000 for a painting seems a little indulgent to me and $45,000 in debt...he had to restrain her spending. I don't blame him one bit for that.

An emotional affair can be just as devastating to a marriage as a physical affair....more so in some ways.
I could not forgive my husband either way but I'd much rather him not be in love with someone else or share his most private thoughts, dreams and desires with someone other than me.
If he makes a mistake and shares his body in a moment of lustful weakness, it would hurt me to no end...but it would hurt me so much more if told me that he was in love with someone else.

[raisincharlie]

Illegals make money here every day. She could have done something to make money if she felt like she needed more....or maybe even tried to understand why her husband was choking up on her spending. $8000 for a painting seems a little indulgent to me and $45,000 in debt...he had to restrain her spending. I don't blame him one bit for that.

An emotional affair can be just as devastating to a marriage as a physical affair....more so in some ways.
I could not forgive my husband either way but I'd much rather him not be in love with someone else or share his most private thoughts, dreams and desires with someone other than me.
If he makes a mistake and shares his body in a moment of lustful weakness, it would hurt me to no end...but it would hurt me so much more if told me that he was in love with someone else.

What was she to do with the two toddlers ? She had no money to pay a babysitter. Why generate another bill when the ones you have aren't being funded ?

Nancy's supposed affair - I find it quite amusing that Brad claims it to be true and he also claims no one knows who the man was - how very convenient don't you think - especially living amongst so many drama queens ?

[caryresident]

What was she to do with the two toddlers ? She had no money to pay a babysitter. Why generate another bill when the ones you have aren't being funded ?

Nancy's supposed affair - I find it quite amusing that Brad claims it to be true and he also claims no one knows who the man was - how very convenient don't you think - especially living amongst so many drama queens ?

He said the affair was 4 years before their oldest daughter (who is 4) was born. The couple has only been married 8 years.

[ember]

Yes, the comments section is interesting Mimi. Some people just don't seem to get it. :(

JMHO
fran

I understand them completely...and agree with alot of them.
There are 3 sides to every story. His side, her side and the truth.
Right now, because she is the vicitm, her side is the only one everyone is worrying about...and that's not a fair and balanced justice system.

[christine2448]

Ok, I have finally caught up! Phew! Took me forever!

We need a poll on who thinks Brad is guilty and who doesn't.

I, for one, don't think he is....and I think he should be given his children back.
Seems they were taken on no real grounds and that does not sit well with me that the courts can just come and pull children off of their parents and give them to GP and aunts that they barely know...especially in a time when what they need most is stability and normal routine...or as normal as can be given the circumstances.
If LE does not have enough on Brad to contain him, then how can a judge take his children?! Because he had an affair? So did she.
Because he had an argument with his wife? We all do that. Because he took his girls passports? Who could blame him? I would too if I thought my wife/husband was going to run off with them while I was at work one day. And it seems to me that Nancy cried to her parents about money because Brad cut her off from her high end spending. It doens't look like she was hurting too badly to me. She drove a new BMW and he drove her old car! IMO, he had the right to choke up on her spending, he made the money. I would have a problem with my husband just running amok with our checking account if he was not replenishing it. If she needed more money, she should have went out and got a job. My mom always taught me that the true way to freedom was to have your own money...and through the years I"ve found that to be a very true statement. I was in a very bad marriage but didn't have to be "trapped" because I made my own way out. We'd all like to be kept women with an endless supply of money so we could just stay home and take care of our kids, the house and have free time with friends. Life doesn't work that way.
As for her friends....women LOVE drama, especially a bunch of housewives who have nothing better to do all day. I've experienced that first hand. It can be ugly. They very well could have blown whatever NC has told them way out of proportion...as women often do because they love their friend and want to stay vigilent of their well being. But they only heard one side.
Who really knows!

I'm in no way blaming NC for what happened to her. She certainly should still be here with her girls....but I, in no way, shape or form, think that this "evidence" against Brad is any more than a typical domestic dispute between husband and wife...and does not constitute him being prematurely hung in the public eye.

My point is we all need to lose the tunnel vision.

I may eat my words...but I just don't think he did it.
Heather's husband could have done it to get back at Brad. He'd be off the radar and could have committed the perfect crime. We had a case like that on WS, if IIRC. The husband of a woman who was cheating, went to the house where the man lived that she was cheating on him with and raped and killed his wife....to get even with the man for messing with his wife. People are crazy and nothing is ever cut and dry.
Could have been Heather...because she wanted Brad and he called her the morning after to tell her to forget about it ever happening again...and now she is going through her own divorce, so she thinks if NC was gone...she'd have shot at Brad.
Who knows!
The possibilities are endless!
Why must we all fry Brad right away!?
And why must his children, Nancy's children, suffer the most by not only having to deal with the death of their mother, but also being taken from everything that is normal for them?
Nancy must have thought he was a fit father or she would not have approved joint custody should they divorce.

Not all angles have been looked at, imo. We are tainted by the Scott Peterson's And Mark Hacking's of the world.....


just my 2 pennies....

Great post, IMO, FWIW. Nice to have a few posters looking at this from another direction.

Until the evidence comes in.............

[ember]

What was she to do with the two toddlers ? She had no money to pay a babysitter. Why generate another bill when the ones you have aren't being funded ?

Nancy's supposed affair - I find it quite amusing that Brad claims it to be true and he also claims no one knows who the man was - how very convenient don't you think - especially living amongst so many drama queens ?


What do the rest of us do in that situation? Suck it up and do what we gotta do.
The kids went to preschool a few hours a week, didn't they?
One of her many friends could have helped with child care since the children were together often anyway.
Just saying, she could have done something if she'd wanted to bad enough.
You're only as trapped as you allow yourself to be, imo

As for NC's affair, maybe her friends do know but would never betray their friend or her memory or give Brad fuel for the fire. Who knows! But no one is refuting it either.....

I'm just saying those things do not neccessarily make him a killer

[Blondieskatz]

I've been lurking on this thread~ it's taken days to read everything and absorb it!

Ember does make a good point about the spending. In his affidavit I believe he states he gave her $1200.00 a month for household expense, more if she needed it (may or may not be true), so she had money for groceries, gas, etc. IMO that is enough to buy groceries for a family of 4 and have plenty left. So he wasn't withholding food from his family. Heck I know people that don't make that much in a month.

If she had a spending problem it would make sense to take away the credit card and to remove her name off the checking account. Some people are chronic shoppers or gamblers and should have a budget. Not saying this was the case, but if she was a spender and someone was with $45,000 in credit card bills it would make sense to put her on a budget. I know my hubby would take the credit cards, checkbook and debit card away from me.

And, of course, this is just my opinion. :)

[fran]

Illegals make money here every day. She could have done something to make money if she felt like she needed more....or maybe even tried to understand why her husband was choking up on her spending. $8000 for a painting seems a little indulgent to me and $45,000 in debt...he had to restrain her spending. I don't blame him one bit for that.

An emotional affair can be just as devastating to a marriage as a physical affair....more so in some ways.
I could not forgive my husband either way but I'd much rather him not be in love with someone else or share his most private thoughts, dreams and desires with someone other than me.
If he makes a mistake and shares his body in a moment of lustful weakness, it would hurt me to no end...but it would hurt me so much more if told me that he was in love with someone else.


Nancy was working to make extra money. That painting she was scheduled to do the Saturday morning she went missing, she was doing as a JOB. She got paid to do it.

But it didn't matter if she worked or not. IF she worked, like the painting she was doing, Brad wouldn't give her any money because she already had some.

In my book, that's called controlling and manipulative.

We do NOT know that Nancy had an emotional affair or not. We just know that Brad said she did. He's already proven to be a liar. I don't believe him in that instance either. There's no way to disprove it, the only witness to dispute him is dead. He made sure of that, IMHO. Everything he's said and done in the past day or two, confirms it, IMO. :mad:

JMHO
fran

[raisincharlie]

He said the affair was 4 years before their oldest daughter (who is 4) was born. The couple has only been married 8 years.


Actually - line 65 of Brad's affidavit says Nancy's affair was "4 years ago before Bella was born". 4 years ago - not 4 years before Bella was born 4 years ago. So they were living in Cary at the time and it was in 2004.

[runnermomof5]

This may have already been pointed out, if so, please forgive me.
Did anyone else notice that in Jessica Adams affidavit that she stated that once BC had phoned NC while over at Jessica's home and he demanded that NC take the children to the Morwick home? Jessica stated that NC took the kids over there, but BC had not arrived as yet and NC felt uncomfortable because the Morwicks had been spending time with BC lately. Yet, the Morwicks both gave statements supporting NC in their affidavits. Am I reading all this correctly?
So.............even if BC was spending time with them, to shore up his superdad image, evidently the Morwicks saw thru him and had their suspicions as well. .

[ember]

Nancy was working to make extra money. That painting she was scheduled to do the Saturday morning she went missing, she was doing as a JOB. She got paid to do it.

But it didn't matter if she worked or not. IF she worked, like the painting she was doing, Brad wouldn't give her any money because she already had some.

In my book, that's called controlling and manipulative.

We do NOT know that Nancy had an emotional affair or not. We just know that Brad said she did. He's already proven to be a liar. I don't believe him in that instance either. There's no way to disprove it, the only witness to dispute him is dead. He made sure of that, IMHO. Everything he's said and done in the past day or two, confirms it, IMO. :mad:

JMHO
fran

Hey Fran, I respect that heck out of you and always enjoy your posts so don't get your :mad: out at me! :)
We just disagree on this subject, that 's all!

I just think there is alot more to this all the way around that we don't know.

[raisincharlie]

What do the rest of us do in that situation? Suck it up and do what we gotta do.
The kids went to preschool a few hours a week, didn't they?
One of her many friends could have helped with child care since the children were together often anyway.
Just saying, she could have done something if she'd wanted to bad enough.
You're only as trapped as you allow yourself to be, imo

As for NC's affair, maybe her friends do know but would never betray their friend or her memory or give Brad fuel for the fire. Who knows! But no one is refuting it either.....

I'm just saying those things do not neccessarily make him a killer

I don't think I ever said those things make him a killer. Nancy was "sucking it up" in your terms - she was making some money. This resulted in further reductions in what she was allowed by her husband - please explain how she gained anything by "sucking it up".


Only as trapped as you allow yourself - I don't think she had a lot of outs, her husband first agreed for her and the children to return to Canada then changed his mind and took the children's passports. Sucking it up, Nancy stayed with her children - I find nothing to berate her about for doing that. As you say, she could have begged her friends for help, a place to stay perhaps, but it seems to me she was sucking it up for the good of her children and not trying to impose on friends. Again I find no fault with that.

[Mimi]

Actually - line 65 of Brad's affidavit says Nancy's affair was "4 years ago before Bella was born". 4 years ago - not 4 years before Bella was born 4 years ago. So they were living in Cary at the time and it was in 2004.

That would make her quite pregnant would it not? Just an observation.

[d99gr81]

I am envisioning a telecom geek on the witness stand explaining this. Makes me picture the PayPal guy at Entwistle's trial who got his lawyer's undies in such a knot! LOL :-)

I am far from a geek but I can explain it to you.

Depending on the system and the VOIP phone you can make remote calls. NOW WAIT before people just read that and say he did it.... If this was Vonnage or something like that no he cant but if he had Cisco VOIP phone and service he could...again wait before saying he did it.

I will try and make this simple as possible. The phone registers to a CM (call Manager) It registers with this Call Manager with both a mac address and an IP address. From the Call manager you can make calls for a particular phone. We do it all the time for testing. That said... Not only does he have to log in to a highly secured CM...which I am sure he can... he can only log in with his credentials. Not only would it log his being on that CM at a given time. IF he did make a call from the Call manager its impossible to hide that the call came from the CM. So yes he can make the call but he can not hide where it came from. So example if the call comes from the house the request is sent to call manager. Then the Call manager routes the call to the appropriate carrier for the number requested. Theres is no way to hide it if he made a remote call believe me.

[raisincharlie]

That would make her quite pregnant would it not? Just an observation.

I would agree with you on that - if it was as Brad says 4 years ago and before Bella was born - guess so. But Brad also says the affair wasn't sexual and it only happened once - so who knows what the hey that means. :crazy:

[fran]

I've been lurking on this thread~ it's taken days to read everything and absorb it!

Ember does make a good point about the spending. In his affidavit I believe he states he gave her $1200.00 a month for household expense, more if she needed it (may or may not be true), so she had money for groceries, gas, etc. IMO that is enough to buy groceries for a family of 4 and have plenty left. So he wasn't withholding food from his family. Heck I know people that don't make that much in a month.

If she had a spending problem it would make sense to take away the credit card and to remove her name off the checking account. Some people are chronic shoppers or gamblers and should have a budget. Not saying this was the case, but if she was a spender and someone was with $45,000 in credit card bills it would make sense to put her on a budget. I know my hubby would take the credit cards, checkbook and debit card away from me.

And, of course, this is just my opinion. :)


He may have given her $1200 a month household expenses, he may not have. We know from her friend's statements, that when she earned extra, ie painting houses, he withheld her allotted funds.

It would also DEPEND on exactly WHAT? he expected her to cover out of that $300?? a week allowance?..Once a week groceries for 4, could easily take $125 of that. Then one tank of gasoline would run about $60 - $70. But we know that she often did NOT have enough for gas. So what all did her 'allowance' have to cover?

Groceries
Gasoline
Birthday gifts
Extra activities for the children
Utilities?
Clothes, for a family of 4
Preschool fee

IF a cell phone bill was too high, he deducted it from her allowance, or took her phone away.

One car was paid for. One has a lien. Of course, during the couples earlier time in Cary, Nancy did NOT have a car. She often times had to WALK to the grocery store with toddler in tow. Oh, that's not to mention walk to the Doctors. Or during her 'several' miscarriages, her husband was too busy, so she had to take a TAXI to the hospital to be treated.

IF you were having financial difficulty, would your husband curtail his spending on an expensive hobby? I know many guys who've given up golf because the green fees are too high.

I think he's a control freak. Plain and simple.

JMHO
fran

[raisincharlie]

This may have already been pointed out, if so, please forgive me.
Did anyone else notice that in Jessica Adams affidavit that she stated that once BC had phoned NC while over at Jessica's home and he demanded that NC take the children to the Morwick home? Jessica stated that NC took the kids over there, but BC had not arrived as yet and NC felt uncomfortable because the Morwicks had been spending time with BC lately. Yet, the Morwicks both gave statements supporting NC in their affidavits. Am I reading all this correctly?
So.............even if BC was spending time with them, to shore up his superdad image, evidently the Morwicks saw thru him and had their suspicions as well. .

You read it right. :)

[fran]

Hey Fran, I respect that heck out of you and always enjoy your posts so don't get your :mad: out at me! :)
We just disagree on this subject, that 's all!

I just think there is alot more to this all the way around that we don't know.

LOL, I'm just wonderin' if you've read the affidavits of her friends?

IF and when you do, keep in mind, these people were Brad's friends also. They chose to speak out about the personal situation.

There have also been a few, former acquaintances of his come here and tell us all the same type of things, about Brad, that are coming out on these affidavits. These really aren't telling US that have been here since the beginning, anything we didn't already know about the guy. But the extent of his bad behavior is even catching many of us long time Websleuthers off-guard.:(

IMHO, he's a devious fellow. He will do whatever it takes to win. IMHO, Nancy found out just how far that is.

I saw that you said you'd eat your words if you're wrong in that you feel he did NOT do this horrible crime. Would you like a little home-made bbq sauce for extra spice? :D

You'll see. Mark my word, you'll see. ;)

JMHO
fran

[d99gr81]

Hey Fran, I respect that heck out of you and always enjoy your posts so don't get your :mad: out at me! :)
We just disagree on this subject, that 's all!

I just think there is alot more to this all the way around that we don't know.

Hey Ember. I too have been taking this angle for the last week. I have said previously there is some major tunnel vision. I still don't know enough either way to say he did or did not do it...but after reading his accounts from that day and everything else. I have more to think he could be innocent.

As for the money ...again i noted earlier so many of you know I went through many of the same things in my divorce so I have a very close relation to some of the things he has done or said. The money part I got burned very badly.My ex stole about 18 thousand dollars from me over a period of time where she agreed with our counselor that she needed to get help for her bi-polar and other issues. While she was supposedly "working to fix some issues and save our marriage" (those we her exact words she said to me in our last session with the counselor) she was seeing a lawyer and stealing my money. Me I was so relieved that moment she said those things only to eventually find out it was more lies, manipulation and stealing. So again. I am not saying he should let his family starve but I absolutely can understand the holding back the money and having control of it...it burned me badly.

Things like the laundry and how people say he never did it so why would he need to buy detergent.... I said earlier...even though my wife was cheating I still wanted to save my family I did things I didn't normally do and I went out of my way to do so much. I fought very hard to save my marriage and my family.

The custody...doesn't matter who cheated on whom... I know this first hand as well.

The fact that she did have an affair brings in other POI. Not only that but I have said before the things many on here have claimed...if true... surly if that cut and dry he would have been arrested.

I have been saying you have to keep an open mind to find the truth.

[OtisCampbell]

I understand them completely...and agree with alot of them.
There are 3 sides to every story. His side, her side and the truth.
Right now, because she is the victim, her side is the only one everyone is worrying about...and that's not a fair and balanced justice system.

I agree with the general tenor of your comments.
It appears that many people want to paint him as the consummate devil while painting her as an angel.

As far as the statements by her friends about what a terrible person BC was, why didn't they do more to help her? If their statements are to be believed than this guy is a cad X100. Prior to the 4 year old being old she had to take a taxi cab to the hospital when she was having miscarriages? If ever there was a sign to get out of a marriage that was it. Not to mention all the other things he allegedly did. If I had a female friend that was in that type of marriage I would have done everything within my power to get her out of that marriage. If the statements are true, that might be the worst marriage I've ever heard of.

Either one of two things is happening here. Either her friends are exaggerating, they were told exaggerations or that was the marriage from hell. It may have been a bad marriage and he might be a bad guy, but I'm having a hard time believing all these statements about him.

[d99gr81]

LOL, I'm just wonderin' if you've read the affidavits of her friends?

IF and when you do, keep in mind, these people were Brad's friends also. They chose to speak out about the personal situation.

There have also been a few, former acquaintances of his come here and tell us all the same type of things, about Brad, that are coming out on these affidavits. These really aren't telling US that have been here since the beginning, anything we didn't already know about the guy. But the extent of his bad behavior is even catching many of us long time Websleuthers off-guard.:(

IMHO, he's a devious fellow. He will do whatever it takes to win. IMHO, Nancy found out just how far that is.

I saw that you said you'd eat your words if you're wrong in that you feel he did NOT do this horrible crime. Would you like a little home-made bbq sauce for extra spice? :D

You'll see. Mark my word, you'll see. ;)

JMHO
fran

Ok, I have read every link that I saw on her for these affidavits and I have only seen one friend... and that would be Adams. How are ALL THESE Friends that you are referring to? I have seen his, Adams, Shrink, custody, the removal of lawyer one, The one that named Heather Meotur sp? What other friends have done this that I missed?

[Skittles]

What other friends have done this that I missed?

The file with Jessica Adam's affidavit in it has the other friends' affidavits as well. You have to keep scrolling down.

[d99gr81]

I would agree with you on that - if it was as Brad says 4 years ago and before Bella was born - guess so. But Brad also says the affair wasn't sexual and it only happened once - so who knows what the hey that means. :crazy:

This is so creepy how this sounds like some of the things I went through. My ex started doing unfaithful things when she was 6 months pregnant with our oldest son. Her first affair never got physical...but they had every intention on meeting I just happen to find out about it a few days prior...but the things they did were way worse then just hooking up physically. Sorry but flat out just having sex is not the only thing considered cheating and to be honest that first one my EX did ...with rehashing and discussing that with you people... it wouldn't have hurt as much as what she did do. any way again my two cents. This just really starting to freak me out how similar some of the things are. I am not saying one way or the other that he did or didn't do it... I am keeping an open mind and I think theres more of a chance that he didn't do it than many other cases.

[Blondieskatz]

I agree Fran he does sound like a control freak!

As far as the expensive hobby and him curtailing his expenses~ It sounds like he has an ego, I can just see his train of thought being "I make the money, I shouldn't have to sacrifice what I enjoy". My ex was that way, I had to watch what I spent, but his hobby (motorcycles) was never put on the back burner. Wonder why he's an ex :rolleyes:

I don't think she would've been responsible for the utilities. There is no way 1200.00 would cover that with food, gas, etc. The water being cut off may mean she was, but I don't think that's the case, especially if BC was the one to have to pay it and turn it back on. The water being tuned off seems strange to me. If I had a friend who had her water turned off (four of her friends knew about it) I would pay the bill. Maybe it was just an oversight as far as the bill not being paid not some kind of "punishment or withholding"? :confused:

I'm not saying he's guilty or not guilty, just some points to ponder. And as we've all heard a million times in our lifetime there's three sides to every story. Sad that NC can't be here to tell hers. :(

[Sewing_Buddy]

I've been lurking on this thread~ it's taken days to read everything and absorb it!

Ember does make a good point about the spending. In his affidavit I believe he states he gave her $1200.00 a month for household expense, more if she needed it (may or may not be true), so she had money for groceries, gas, etc. IMO that is enough to buy groceries for a family of 4 and have plenty left. So he wasn't withholding food from his family. Heck I know people that don't make that much in a month.

If she had a spending problem it would make sense to take away the credit card and to remove her name off the checking account. Some people are chronic shoppers or gamblers and should have a budget. Not saying this was the case, but if she was a spender and someone was with $45,000 in credit card bills it would make sense to put her on a budget. I know my hubby would take the credit cards, checkbook and debit card away from me.

And, of course, this is just my opinion. :)

Since Nancy was apparently working on a "cash only" basis, how does anyone know Brad really gave her $1200 a month for household expenses. That seems like an amount Brad and his lawyers figured would make him seem generous enough to not appear to be controlling the purse strings.

I still say the affadavict makes Brad look like an ideal husband and father...that certainly isn't the picture I get from listening/reading what the neighbors say. And a person that wonderful should have lots of friends who would be happy to vouch for his involvement and love of his family.

[nctiger]

There are affidavits from others besides Jessica Adams. Michelle Simmons, Timothy Simmons, Hannah Prichard, Brett Adams, Keith Prichard, Teresa Hackeling. All surprisingly consistent. And not quite as self-serving as BC's, which, by the way, is not corroborated by anyone.

[fran]

I agree with the general tenor of your comments.
It appears that many people want to paint him as the consummate devil while painting her as an angel.

As far as the statements by her friends about what a terrible person BC was, why didn't they do more to help her? If their statements are to be believed than this guy is a cad X100. Prior to the 4 year old being old she had to take a taxi cab to the hospital when she was having miscarriages? If ever there was a sign to get out of a marriage that was it. Not to mention all the other things he allegedly did. If I had a female friend that was in that type of marriage I would have done everything within my power to get her out of that marriage. If the statements are true, that might be the worst marriage I've ever heard of.

Either one of two things is happening here. Either her friends are exaggerating, they were told exaggerations or that was the marriage from hell. It may have been a bad marriage and he might be a bad guy, but I'm having a hard time believing all these statements about him.

Welcome to Websleuths! :)

I know this is hard to digest for some people. But if you've ever know, personally, a person that has been in an abusive relationship, whether just verbal or physical, you have no idea what lengths the abuser has to go to, before the abused decides they've had ENOUGH. That's why so often these women disappear or are murdered. They tolerated the emtional abuse for years, but weren't prepared or see the danger physical abuse could happen.

Seriously,

I've known people who've gotten broken arms,...........stayed with him

I've known a woman who's husband wouldn't take her to the hospital to give birth, she had no car, so he drunkenly delivered the child himself on the kitchen table. Oh...........and she continued to stay with him until after her next child was born. THEN she decided she'd had enough and ran for her and her children's life!

I've known someone who stayed in an abusive relationship for 8 years, each time he got physical, he later apologized and she was ok with that. She even served a sentence imposed for filing a false police report, (she tried to retract her statement made after a response to a 911) her husband was on probation and she didn't want him to automatically go back to jail. She finally got out when he tried to kill her and her faithful dog saved her life by attacking him!

I think in your post, you said this very well may have been a marriage from He!!.

I think you've guessed it.:(

JMHO
fran

[fran]

Ok, I have read every link that I saw on her for these affidavits and I have only seen one friend... and that would be Adams. How are ALL THESE Friends that you are referring to? I have seen his, Adams, Shrink, custody, the removal of lawyer one, The one that named Heather Meotur sp? What other friends have done this that I missed?

I started a thread with "Legal Documents - Nancy Cooper" earlier this morning on this forum. Sorry, server is moving too slow so I can't provide a link. Just go to the main forum for Nancy Cooper and you'll see a thread titled as I stated above. The last documents filed yesterday are on there with a list of names of Cary residents who provided affidavits regarding their acquaintance of Brad and Nancy Cooper.

fran

[Blondieskatz]

Since Nancy was apparently working on a "cash only" basis, how does anyone know Brad really gave her $1200 a month for household expenses. That seems like an amount Brad and his lawyers figured would make him seem generous enough to not appear to be controlling the purse strings.



We really don't know that...just have to take it as it is for now. Until the truth comes out. But, lets be reasonable she had food to eat, a car to drive, cell phone, etc. He had to have been giving her some money because helping a friend paint for cash doesn't bring in cash on a regular basis I mean there's only so much you can paint.

Ask yourself this if you had a friend whose husband withheld food from his family what would you do? I would take food to my friend and her kids.

Don't get me wrong I am in no way defending BC just thinking it through. He may very well be guilty of murder, but we've all had (well most of us) problems with our spouses. In my experience women tend to stick up ane are more vocal for their friends more than men. :)

[Mimi]

I would agree with you on that - if it was as Brad says 4 years ago and before Bella was born - guess so. But Brad also says the affair wasn't sexual and it only happened once - so who knows what the hey that means. :crazy:

LOL! Exactly- whatever that means! I guess I was trying to point out that not many late semester, pregnant ladies are having affairs...I just didn't want to open up a whole debate on it but I think it would be one of the least times in a woman's life that she would be in an affair...that is just my personal and humble opinion though....but again, we are not sure what he is referring to here....perplexing to say the least!:confused:

[d99gr81]

The file with Jessica Adam's affidavit in it has the other friends' affidavits as well. You have to keep scrolling down.

OK I see them . I just read Bret Adams... thats just rah rahing what he heard from Jesica


Clea repeats some of what the other two all ready said. Also noted he was in fact, like I suggested, trying to do things he had not done before. To speak that she called him the budget Nazi that to me says she did have a spending problem... you know how it is when you complain to a friend... you embellish and what not for sympathy.

Again her husband repeats

Hannah - says he didn't buy her a car yet she had the nicest one. Insinuates that her miscarriages were caused by Brad. Frankly Hannah's entire affidavit is very bitter. Repeats many of the things said by others but much different wording.

So basically theres 3 voices. Three friends. You guys made it out to be this huge long list of friends. The Adam's, Morwicks's and an angry Hannah.

Look, when I was going through my divorce I have a best friend I confided in and many other friends I would complain too. They are friends...they only hear your side, so and I did this myself. I made it sound like I was in hell...I mean I was and she was horrible but what I am saying is you don't complain and then say nice things about that person.

[Mimi]

Ok, I have read every link that I saw on her for these affidavits and I have only seen one friend... and that would be Adams. How are ALL THESE Friends that you are referring to? I have seen his, Adams, Shrink, custody, the removal of lawyer one, The one that named Heather Meotur sp? What other friends have done this that I missed?

Continue to scroll down after you read the Adam's document...they are all together.

[d99gr81]

LOL! Exactly- whatever that means! I guess I was trying to point out that not many late semester, pregnant ladies are having affairs...I just didn't want to open up a whole debate on it but I think it would be one of the least times in a woman's life that she would be in an affair...that is just my personal and humble opinion though....but again, we are not sure what he is referring to here....perplexing to say the least!:confused:

Again because most of you just consider actual sex as an affair. My ex wife's first affair...and believe me it was...was not physical...but that hurt me more worse than the physical ones. And she was 6 months pregnant at the time so it was even more of a betrayal. So believe me if she was pregnant she can still have an affair and a very hurtful one at that. I have to ask you guys to really think about quick firing y our answers because some of you really come off as tunnel vision. I am not saying to be disrespectful just trying to get some of you to open your mind here.

[christine2448]

I started a thread with "Legal Documents - Nancy Cooper" earlier this morning on this forum. Sorry, server is moving too slow so I can't provide a link. Just go to the main forum for Nancy Cooper and you'll see a thread titled as I stated above. The last documents filed yesterday are on there with a list of names of Cary residents who provided affidavits regarding their acquaintance of Brad and Nancy Cooper.

fran

Legal Documents - Nancy Cooper Case (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67936)

I stuck it for ya ;) Thanks fran! :blowkiss:

[Mimi]

Again because most of you just consider actual sex as an affair. My ex wife's first affair...and believe me it was...was not physical...but that hurt me more worse than the physical ones. And she was 6 months pregnant at the time so it was even more of a betrayal. So believe me if she was pregnant she can still have an affair and a very hurtful one at that. I have to ask you guys to really think about quick firing y our answers because some of you really come off as tunnel vision. I am not saying to be disrespectful just trying to get some of you to open your mind here.

With respect, dppgr81, I do not have tunnel vision...I worked for a shelter for homeless and abused women for almost a decade...I daresay I have seen a lot and heard a lot that would curl your toes backwards! I am well aware that you can have an affair of the heart....however, when you read what was quoted...he said it happened once....THAT is not an affair of the heart or any other kind...that is a conversation at best....and yes I am aware that some pregnant women have affairs- of both natures...but typically they are relationships that have begun to evolve for a while...not a "one time" thing...that is what we mean by "whatever that means"- because truly, if you read it verbatim, you too will be perplexed...eyes wide open and all. JMHO of course :blowkiss:

ETA... I do not equate a sexual romp as an affair, either....there are so many kinds and types of affairs but that would be a separate thread and topic. Cheers!

[ember]

Since Nancy was apparently working on a "cash only" basis, how does anyone know Brad really gave her $1200 a month for household expenses. That seems like an amount Brad and his lawyers figured would make him seem generous enough to not appear to be controlling the purse strings.

I still say the affadavict makes Brad look like an ideal husband and father...that certainly isn't the picture I get from listening/reading what the neighbors say. And a person that wonderful should have lots of friends who would be happy to vouch for his involvement and love of his family.


I just find it odd that she complained that she had no money, yet bought designer clothes, Tiffany jewelry, drove a BMW, lived in a $300,000+ home and purchased $8000 paintings!

I'm sorry but if I wanted out a situation that bad and had that kind of money to throw away on "for show" junk, I would have squirrelled away some of that money used for frivilous things to get me the heck out of my situation.
She obviously had access to money.

Unfortunately, I think she embellished alot to her friends and I think she stayed because she liked the life (money) she had become accustomed to....which is most definetly sad...

This kind of drivel is being used to demonize an, as of yet, innocent man who just lost his wife....and kids

[raisincharlie]

Again because most of you just consider actual sex as an affair. My ex wife's first affair...and believe me it was...was not physical...but that hurt me more worse than the physical ones. And she was 6 months pregnant at the time so it was even more of a betrayal. So believe me if she was pregnant she can still have an affair and a very hurtful one at that. I have to ask you guys to really think about quick firing y our answers because some of you really come off as tunnel vision. I am not saying to be disrespectful just trying to get some of you to open your mind here.

Tunnel vision only exists when the questions stop. Seems to me we are all still questioning. Being as politically correct as possible let me say that I can turn this about - many of us have been on this board for years and have seen and heard some of the most amazing things. Perhaps since you are new, you are sheltered with respect to crime. I can understand this because I will be the first to admit that there are some cases that still absolutely shock me.

I am not trying to be disrespectful either, just trying to get you to open your mind to the fact that many on this board have been through numerous cases and have heard some of the most astounding things, unbelievable things, understand how LE works and what they mean when certain phrases are spoken. Some of the opinions you oppose are derived from following many cases and understanding the patterns at work. Amature sleuthers perhaps but the breath of experience with crime is very broad on this board. Again no disrespect meant.

[stillblv]

I just find it odd that she complained that she had no money, yet bought designer clothes, Tiffany jewelry, drove a BMW, lived in a $300,000+ home and purchased $8000 paintings!

I'm sorry but if I wanted out a situation that bad and had that kind of money to throw away on "for show" junk, I would have squirrelled away some of that money used for frivilous things to get me the heck out of my situation.
She obviously had access to money.

Unfortunately, I think she embellished alot to her friends and I think she stayed because she liked the life (money) she had become accustomed to....which is most definetly sad...

This kind of drivel is being used to demonize an, as of yet, innocent man who just lost his wife....and kids

I don't know - I just do not get that kind of feeling from what little I've seen of Nancy's pictures, her family (parents, siblings), friends that she was this money grabbing snob. ALL that I've heard from friends of BOTH Brad and Nancy are that she was a loving, caring woman who had tons of friends. She made a life for herself and her husband in another country where she knew no one. I don't see the same from any of Brad's parents, siblings, friends, heck, even co-workers...I am not saying FOR SURE, NO DOUBT ABOUT IT, that he is guilty. But common sense HAS to give you a sense of who is telling the truth and who isn't.

[ember]

Tunnel vision only exists when the questions stop. Seems to me we are all still questioning. Being as politically correct as possible let me say that I can turn this about - many of us have been on this board for years and have seen and heard some of the most amazing things. Perhaps since you are new, you are sheltered with respect to crime. I can understand this because I will be the first to admit that there are some cases that still absolutely shock me.

I am not trying to be disrespectful either, just trying to get you to open your mind to the fact that many on this board have been through numerous cases and have heard some of the most astounding things, unbelievable things, understand how LE works and what they mean when certain phrases are spoken. Some of the opinions you oppose are derived from following many cases and understanding the patterns at work. Amature sleuthers perhaps but the breath of experience with crime is very broad on this board. Again no disrespect meant.


That being said, we also know that no two cases are exactly alike. Each one is individually different...

Jessica Lunsford brought me here and I remember everyone had her father (and her grandfather at one point) hung high from the get go as being guilty.
Weren't we all shocked to find out that it was a neighbor unknown to her or her family who did the horrible deed.

Experience means nothing. Just when you think it's textbook, it will throw you for a loop.

Just saying......

[fran]

OK I see them . I just read Bret Adams... thats just rah rahing what he heard from Jesica


Clea repeats some of what the other two all ready said. Also noted he was in fact, like I suggested, trying to do things he had not done before. To speak that she called him the budget Nazi that to me says she did have a spending problem... you know how it is when you complain to a friend... you embellish and what not for sympathy.

Again her husband repeats

Hannah - says he didn't buy her a car yet she had the nicest one. Insinuates that her miscarriages were caused by Brad. Frankly Hannah's entire affidavit is very bitter. Repeats many of the things said by others but much different wording.

So basically theres 3 voices. Three friends. You guys made it out to be this huge long list of friends. The Adam's, Morwicks's and an angry Hannah.

Look, when I was going through my divorce I have a best friend I confided in and many other friends I would complain too. They are friends...they only hear your side, so and I did this myself. I made it sound like I was in hell...I mean I was and she was horrible but what I am saying is you don't complain and then say nice things about that person.

I know you're trying to keep an open mind on this, and that's ok. That's the only way people can get a fair trial, is that people don't automatically think they're guilty just because they're on trial.

But this isn't a court and we don't have to go by those rules. I've been here long enough, and many others as well, that can say that we are ALMOST certain the guy did it. We see these same signs in case, after case, after case. One sign shows up, you over look it. Two signs come out, you can still explain it. But it gets to be ridiculous making excuses for the SO when it's all right in your face.

Of course Brad isn't going to admit he's an abuser! As if! He was the loving husband who did nothing but work hard to provide for his family and his wife was still not happy. She spent too much money, had an affair, and stayed out all night and they hadn't had sex since their last child.

Excuse me while I wipe away that tear.:rolleyes:

But you have person after person after person, say FIRST HAND what THEY OBSERVED the state of affairs of their marriage. He was controlling, verbally abusive, moody, self-centered, manipulative, demanding, with an ego the size of the tallest mountain. He's an MBA professional, Ironman.

I invite you to re-read those affidavits. Start from the beginning when her parents filed the ExParte motion, go though his also and then the last ones filed yesterday. I believe you'll see a pattern there. A pattern of 'his word' and 'everyone else's.' Do you honestly believe that all of those people would swear under oath, with threat of perjury, to those statements they made. These are Nancy's family and friends. These are respectable people. They are not going to swear under oath to statements that are NOT true.

Sure, some of them sound alike. But, they're all friends and talk. What more can they say? It is what it is. Believe me, they've probably already thought of things they should have added. Those will probably come up at trial. IF there is a trial.

I don't expect Brad to admit what he did, they rarely do. That is IF he did it. He's going to continue to wear his game face, his public persona. He is perfect. At least that's what he wants the world to see. And it's his attorney's JOB to portray him that way and to avoid any and all legal problems, including him being charged with murder.

I would be the first to admit that I'm not always right, and he may very well be innocent. But,..............I highly doubt it. But, IF he is and another person is arrested, tried and convicted, I would be the first to admit I was wrong and probably study this case forever to figure out how I could have been so wrong about him.

JMHO
fran

PS...I didn't get out of the affidavits that anyone was blaming Brad for Nancy's miscarriages. I believe they were trying to show how indifferent he was to his family. She needed immediate medical attention, but he was too busy to come home and take his loving wife to the hospital, so she had to call a taxi, and lose THEIR baby all by herself! sad, sad, sad

[ember]

That being said, we also know that no two cases are exactly alike. Each one is individually different...

Jessica Lunsford brought me here and I remember everyone had her father (and her grandfather at one point) hung high from the get go as being guilty.
Weren't we all shocked to find out that it was a neighbor unknown to her or her family who did the horrible deed.

Experience means nothing. Just when you think it's textbook, it will throw you for a loop.

Just saying......


Hate to quote myself but wanted to add...

If LE stops looking at each individual case as it's own, true justice stops being served.

[d99gr81]

Tunnel vision only exists when the questions stop. Seems to me we are all still questioning. Being as politically correct as possible let me say that I can turn this about - many of us have been on this board for years and have seen and heard some of the most amazing things. Perhaps since you are new, you are sheltered with respect to crime. I can understand this because I will be the first to admit that there are some cases that still absolutely shock me.

I am not trying to be disrespectful either, just trying to get you to open your mind to the fact that many on this board have been through numerous cases and have heard some of the most astounding things, unbelievable things, understand how LE works and what they mean when certain phrases are spoken. Some of the opinions you oppose are derived from following many cases and understanding the patterns at work. Amature sleuthers perhaps but the breath of experience with crime is very broad on this board. Again no disrespect meant.

Sorry but many on here thus far have him convicted all ready. Lets be honest...there has been NO evidence released. Everything is hearsay and frankly many of the rumors are turning out to be incorrect... IE: Bleach at 4 am.

When I say tunnel vision i mean like saying Brad dumped her body verse the killer dumped her body. Things like this. I for one am all to familiar with many of the things that they went through and I give my valid reason why he may be doing laundry now when he never did before. Because he wanted to go and do many of the things she complained about. Heather even stated he had been around allot more the last couple months so in my eyes he was trying to make better.

Again, because you have experience talking about cases and seeing that many of them do end up the husband... lets say 75% a good detective will not ignore the other 25%. I reserver to ever judge with out hard facts and I only propose other angles that people who have that tunnel vision wont see or say. I cant claim to know whether he did it or not.. but i don't think anyone else can either. We just don't have any facts yet. You ahev to admit if you have an open mind and have not convicted him yet when speaking about it you would say the killer did this not Brad did this.

[raisincharlie]

That being said, we also know that no two cases are exactly alike. Each one is individually different...

Jessica Lunsford brought me here and I remember everyone had her father (and her grandfather at one point) hung high from the get go as being guilty.
Weren't we all shocked to find out that it was a neighbor unknown to her or her family who did the horrible deed.

Experience means nothing. Just when you think it's textbook, it will throw you for a loop.

Just saying......

I take it you were shocked as well.

[fran]

I agree Fran he does sound like a control freak!

I don't think she would've been responsible for the utilities. There is no way 1200.00 would cover that with food, gas, etc. The water being cut off may mean she was, but I don't think that's the case, especially if BC was the one to have to pay it and turn it back on. The water being tuned off seems strange to me. If I had a friend who had her water turned off (four of her friends knew about it) I would pay the bill. Maybe it was just an oversight as far as the bill not being paid not some kind of "punishment or withholding"? :confused:

I'm not saying he's guilty or not guilty, just some points to ponder. And as we've all heard a million times in our lifetime there's three sides to every story. Sad that NC can't be here to tell hers. :(

IMHO, I don't think it was always Nancy's choice on IF she could accept HELP from her friends. Seriously. I feel he had enough of an emotional hold on her that she would be almost afraid to do anything without asking his permission, or at least against his wishes. Like if she called him at work and said the water is off and they won't allow me to turn it back on, or she didn't have the ca$h to do it.

I could see him tell her he'd take care of it, and leave her stewing for hours until he felt like getting around to it. Or, she could have said, well I can borrow the $$ until you get home, and him tell her, 'no, I'll take care of it.' She dutifully waits for his beckon call.:eek:

JMHO
fran

[fran]

Legal Documents - Nancy Cooper Case (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67936)

I stuck it for ya ;) Thanks fran! :blowkiss:

Oh, thanky christine!

:)
fran

[stillblv]

Hate to quote myself but wanted to add...

If LE stops looking at each individual case as it's own, true justice stops being served.


I agree. But I don't think LE has done that - there are standards and procedures that I am sure they go through each and every case.

Unlike them, however, we on a message board do not have to do this. I don't think anyone expected all of this to come out about the Cooper's - I was very shocked when I heard her friends say the things they said. I wasn't assuming anything about her husband until more and more came out.

Just because we go a certain way does not meant that we have jumped to conclusions - you just don't see the process we are going through before we post here.

[ember]

I take it you were shocked as well.

Nope, I was against that idea from the beginning.
I just didn't think they did it, regardless of the fact that GP had been in trouble with LE years ago or that Mark was "conveniently" not home that night.
I always thought that it was ludacris that they were suspected by the public just because of some stuff that happened years ago or because they were going about life as usual, as in Mark stayed the night with his gf one night... oh for shame! that made them guilty.:rolleyes:

[raisincharlie]

Sorry but many on here thus far have him convicted all ready. Lets be honest...there has been NO evidence released. Everything is hearsay and frankly many of the rumors are turning out to be incorrect... IE: Bleach at 4 am.

When I say tunnel vision i mean like saying Brad dumped her body verse the killer dumped her body. Things like this. I for one am all to familiar with many of the things that they went through and I give my valid reason why he may be doing laundry now when he never did before. Because he wanted to go and do many of the things she complained about. Heather even stated he had been around allot more the last couple months so in my eyes he was trying to make better.

Again, because you have experience talking about cases and seeing that many of them do end up the husband... lets say 75% a good detective will not ignore the other 25%. I reserver to ever judge with out hard facts and I only propose other angles that people who have that tunnel vision wont see or say. I cant claim to know whether he did it or not.. but i don't think anyone else can either. We just don't have any facts yet. You ahev to admit if you have an open mind and have not convicted him yet when speaking about it you would say the killer did this not Brad did this.


What evidence has been presented that proves there was no bleach purchased by Brad Cooper at 4 a.m. ? There is/are no hard fact(s) that this did or did not occur so are you beguiled by tunnel vision by calling it a rumor and hearsey and inncorrect ? Can't have it both ways. I like alternative theories and wish to discuss them but there is no need to accuse posters of things to make your point. Lets discuss the case with the understanding there will be various opinions and at this point that is what they are.

[d99gr81]

I agree. But I don't think LE has done that - there are standards and procedures that I am sure they go through each and every case.

Unlike them, however, we on a message board do not have to do this. I don't think anyone expected all of this to come out about the Cooper's - I was very shocked when I heard her friends say the things they said. I wasn't assuming anything about her husband until more and more came out.

Just because we go a certain way does not meant that we have jumped to conclusions - you just don't see the process we are going through before we post here.

When people say Brad dumped the body and dressed her and brad did this...their minds are made up. And some have spoke like that since the first day. Thats all I am saying. Everyone is entitled to believe in what they want. I guess I just hope... heaven for bid I end up fighting for myself after being accused of something I didn't do... that people would not be so quick to hang me. Not only that I just want to hold out and believe there is a chance that these girls are not about to lose they're father as well.

[stillblv]

When people say Brad dumped the body and dressed her and brad did this...their minds are made up. And some have spoke like that since the first day. Thats all I am saying. Everyone is entitled to believe in what they want. I guess I just hope... heaven for bid I end up fighting for myself after being accused of something I didn't do... that people would not be so quick to hang me. Not only that I just want to hold out and believe there is a chance that these girls are not about to lose they're father as well.

Okay, I understand what you're getting at. But I think that is just laziness than anything else - in their mind they know who did it and that's how they write it. When they're trying out theories instead of saying the perp, they just say Brad.

I would love to see something from Brad or his friends or family that shows something close to what I think most of us would do if our spouses were murdered - whether we were going thru a divorce or not. Something to indicate that he didn't change his behavior in the last few months because all of a sudden he wanted to put on a good show for the lawyers and judge. Instead he's just counter attacked. Instead of focusing on what he did and didn't do, he wants to put the blame on her.

[Just the Fax]

The other thing that seems apparent here is that this is turning into the battle of the affidavits, as someone noted in the previous thread.

I think this is a way to force the hand of the Cary PD to arrest him. Cary PD wants to build their case without the added pressure of turning over all the evidence to his attorneys, they want to build the case and keep pressure on him. They are happy to use the custody issue as letting out more and more information that will be helpful in trying him in the court of public opinion, and lastly, they also are stopping people like they are still exhausting all the possibilities that the killer is still out there - the roadblocks, etc.

One of the things that defense attorneys always say is that the police focused on the husband and never looked at any other possibilities. So - they are handling that in advance by still "looking" and amazingly, coming up empty.

IMO - Brad's attorney's are trying to force their hand to arrest / charge him so that they can truly start their defense and be entitled to view what evidence they have.

I agree with the 'continued search for the killer'. The standard defense is always , " they focusing on my client from day 1 and never looked anywhere else"....blah, blah , blah

i don't agree with your opinion his attorney wants to force their hand to arrest him. Are you kidding ?

Look at wife killer, jason Young. We all knew he would be arrested and he is still walking as a free man nearly 2 years later. The Wake county DA will not seek an indictment in either case until he feels he has enough evidence to win in the courtroom.

[terminatrixator]

deleted this cause it's in the wrong area.

[Bob&Bob]

Hi there.

I was wondering if someone could post the link to the picture
of Nancy on Corolla Island. I have spent a lot of time looking
but can't find it. Things seem to be a little slow today. I messaged Christine but I guess she's not answering her thing.

Thanks so much for all your help!!!!

[d99gr81]

Okay, I understand what you're getting at. But I think that is just laziness than anything else - in their mind they know who did it and that's how they write it. When they're trying out theories instead of saying the perp, they just say Brad.

I would love to see something from Brad or his friends or family that shows something close to what I think most of us would do if our spouses were murdered - whether we were going thru a divorce or not. Something to indicate that he didn't change his behavior in the last few months because all of a sudden he wanted to put on a good show for the lawyers and judge. Instead he's just counter attacked. Instead of focusing on what he did and didn't do, he wants to put the blame on her.

Thats just it... I offer you another very valid reason why he had changed in the last few months... I offer that reason because I for one was in that same position myself. I have said it on here but no one responded to it so I will repeat. I was cheated on multiple times yet I worked very hard to save my marriage.I stayed for my two boys. My story is long and if you guys had any idea what I went through it would change the way allot of you think. I was mentally abused by a bi-polar psychotic woman yet I still tried very hard to save it. My point is even at the end I went out of my way to do things I would not normally do and go out of my way to try and please her. When I read all those documents I see that. I see her friends getting the one sided story from her that my ex would give. Believe me I don't believe she should have been murdered nor do I think or know if she did any wrong. I am just trying to let you know theres so much more then the simple He was acting because he new what he was going to do and put on a show for LE.

[stillblv]

Thats just it... I offer you another very valid reason why he had changed in the last few months... I offer that reason because I for one was in that same position myself. I have said it on here but no one responded to it so I will repeat. I was cheated on multiple times yet I worked very hard to save my marriage.I stayed for my two boys. My story is long and if you guys had any idea what I went through it would change the way allot of you think. I was mentally abused by a bi-polar psychotic woman yet I still tried very hard to save it. My point is even at the end I went out of my way to do things I would not normally do and go out of my way to try and please her. When I read all those documents I see that. I see her friends getting the one sided story from her that my ex would give. Believe me I don't believe she should have been murdered nor do I think or know if she did any wrong. I am just trying to let you know theres so much more then the simple He was acting because he new what he was going to do and put on a show for LE.


After you've seen the class act that her father and mother and siblings are and all of her friends (who, knew BOTH Nancy and Brad) and what they have had to say about her - do you believe that Nancy was somehow mentally unstable or needy or whatever you want to call it and all of a sudden Brad decided, AFTER divorce was filed for, to try to do whatever he could to make the marriage work? Especially knowing that he had had and probably was having an affair? I think you're having a bit of tunnel vision and not seeing what has been put out there. I see no reason why THEIR friends would want to make up things about him if they truly didn't believe that. And they hadn't seen it firsthand.

[d99gr81]

Here's an example of what I went through when I found out when my EX cheated the first time.

My wife at the time she was pregnant with my first son, asked me to request the evening shift. I have a career along the lines of Brad Cooper and worked with Cisco networking devices for major companies. Anyway she asked me to move to the 3-11 shift due to Cole being born soon and we can save on Daycare since she was a teacher so we could save on Day care. I can watch him during the day and she at night. When Cole was 6 month's old I found out about the affair...which had not got physical but the time I discovered it was goign on I also found out about plans to meet 3 days later when she had told me she was going to a co-workers birthday party to have that first physical affair. I got home at midnight and woke her up and told her what I new. My first though at the time was if she got mad at me I would leave...if she showed remorse I would stay.... She immediately starting crying...apologizing... then the next thing i know I am crying...because she flipped it by saying it was because I was never home and she missed me and she was lonely. My point here is she would tell friends that I was never home and complain about it... but she asked me to take that shift to save money for day care. At the time I was not making huge money. The things I saw she wrote between this man and herself caused more pain then the actually physical affair I know she had. My point is though she would complain to our friends that I was never there for her and always working but yet I took that shift on her request... my thinking was more so she could continue her affair while I worked but once it was discovered now she wanted me back. It was very manipulative and you can see how she embellished me not being around and working allot. That is just a small tidbit of what I experienced. Hope it helps with a point. If not I will spare things like that in the future. :)

[d99gr81]

After you've seen the class act that her father and mother and siblings are and all of her friends (who, knew BOTH Nancy and Brad) and what they have had to say about her - do you believe that Nancy was somehow mentally unstable or needy or whatever you want to call it and all of a sudden Brad decided, AFTER divorce was filed for, to try to do whatever he could to make the marriage work? Especially knowing that he had had and probably was having an affair? I think you're having a bit of tunnel vision and not seeing what has been put out there. I see no reason why THEIR friends would want to make up things about him if they truly didn't believe that. And they hadn't seen it firsthand.

Thats just it... My ex wife was a 7th grade English teacher and everyone outside thought she was a complete saint. Thought she was the sweetest person in the world. she new when to act nice... I am not saying NC was bad I am just explaining how people can see others in different lights.

[caryresident]

The lawyer for Nancy Cooper's parents has filed a motion to compel the dead woman's husband to submit to a psychiatric evaluation and psychological testing before Aug. 22. More to come ...

http://www.wral.com/:woohoo:

[Star12]

WRAL has just announced that attys for NC's parents are asking for pysch examination for BC, due by August 22.

I would think that the hearing tomorrow will be continued until that is completed and reviewed and ready to be presented to the court.

[Bob&Bob]

Is this working?

[fran]

OK, I want to know who this person is. I haven't seen any official statement from them and I hadn't seen this name mentioned before.

Wow!:eek:

fran


http://www.newsobserver.com/2864/story/1152214.html

By spring, Nancy and Bradley Cooper were still living together but planning their separation. Before her death, Nancy Cooper grew scared of her husband, friend Theresa Hackeling said.

"She would sleep with the girls in her room, with the car keys in her pants pocket and the bedroom door locked from Brad," Hackeling said in an affidavit.

[ember]

The lawyer for Nancy Cooper's parents has filed a motion to compel the dead woman's husband to submit to a psychiatric evaluation and psychological testing before Aug. 22. More to come ...

http://www.wral.com/:woohoo:

My question about what NC parents are doing is...why, if they believed their grandchildren to be in such great danger, didn't they do this before now? If Nancy was in such great danger before, why did it take her death to act on all of this? As a parent, if my child and grandchildren were in such hoirrible conditons, I would have done everything I could to get them out.

I just see this as another way to get "revenge" on Brad for making Nancy unhappy. Using his children to hurt him is dirty, imo.
They have no right. He is not guilty of anything yet....not even a suspect or poi.

Why was nothing done before?
And if it was, why has nothing been said about that? Surely her friends would know if she was seeking some kind of help from her parents with escape...they know everything else....

[christine2448]

Thats just it... My ex wife was a 7th grade English teacher and everyone outside thought she was a complete saint. Thought she was the sweetest person in the world. she new when to act nice... I am not saying NC was bad I am just explaining how people can see others in different lights.

I totally get what you are saying and want to sincerely thank you for giving us a look into your personal past with intentions of helping us understand.:blowkiss:

[ember]

I spy with my little eyes...a poster on this thread by the hat of NancyFriend.

Are you one of Nancy's friends? If so, please come out and give us your input!

if not, then I apologize. :)

[Jess]

What would you have liked them to do, other than giving moral and financial support? Grandparents have no rights in NC. The children are American with American passports. Ya think they could have smuggled them out of the country ? It wouldn't have worked.
Do I think they would have liked to do something? You betcha!!! But I believe their hands were tied.

[NancyFriend]

fran - Several new affidavits were recently added to the plaintiff's affidavits. I now count 12-13 friends of Nancy who are willing to have their sworn testimony on the record. Keep in mind that these friends of Nancy and Brad have nothing to gain from coming forward. In fact, it certainly opens them to scrutiny from the public, the media, and Brad's attorneys. IMO, the primary concern right now should be the safety of Katie and Bella. Of course we all want to see the killer caught and justice served, but that is the job for LE.

[MCDRAW]

My question about what NC parents are doing is...why, if they believed their grandchildren to be in such great danger, didn't they do this before now? If Nancy was in such great danger before, why did it take her death to act on all of this? As a parent, if my child and grandchildren were in such hoirrible conditons, I would have done everything I could to get them out.

I just see this as another way to get "revenge" on Brad for making Nancy unhappy. Using his children to hurt him is dirty, imo.
They have no right. He is not guilty of anything yet....not even a suspect or poi.

Why was nothing done before?
And if it was, why has nothing been said about that? Surely her friends would know if she was seeking some kind of help from her parents with escape...they know everything else....


I agree. I also think if they are going to require him to have a psych evaluation then they should be required to take one too. I read something the sister's husband said about not knowing how to tell the children but with the sister looking so much like Nancy it gave comfort. That bothered me. I honestly do not believe that they should have been given the children to take to another Country without him being charged and convicted of Nancy's death. There were other ways to keep the children safe. Regardless, of what he has or has not done, he is their father and they love him.

[SleuthyGal]

I'm going to just go by the facts that I know so far.

- Nancy is dead. Murdered. Found 3 mi from her home, 2.5 days after she disappears.
- Nancy had a Sat. 8am appt to meet her friend to paint the friend's house. Nancy never appeared.
- Nancy is not seen alive by anyone other than her husband after a party the night before.
- Husband says Nancy 'went jogging' at 7am on Sat. morning.
- No witnesses have come forward to say they saw Nancy that Saturday morning around 7am when she was out 'jogging.'
- Nancy does not appear alive ever again after 'she went jogging.'
- Nancy's husband does not report her missing when she fails to return home.
- Nancy's friend, worried, phones Brad Cooper at least once and later calls 911 to report her friend missing.
- The police chief says (twice) that this is "an isolated incident and the public is not at risk."
- Husband says he made TWO trips to Harris Teeter between 6am and 6:30am Sat morning (and admits that one of the trips was to get laundry detergent).
- Nancy and Brad were in an unhappy marriage, heading towards divorce. Regardless of whose fault it was and who did what to whom and when, these 2 people were estranged and NOT happy with each other.

Those are the facts as we know them right now.

What we don't know yet is:

- Time of death
- Location of death
- Manner of death
- What Nancy was wearing when found
- Results of any forensic testing
- Independent confirmation of BC's movements that Sat morning and what he purchased and when.

[ember]

What would you have liked them to do, other than giving moral and financial support? Grandparents have no rights in NC. The children are American with American passports. Ya think they could have smuggled them out of the country ? It wouldn't have worked.
Do I think they would have liked to do something? You betcha!!! But I believe their hands were tied.


Obvioulsy they had some rights in this country. I find it mind boggling that they could come here from another country and take his children! With no real grounds!

And for starters, they could have come to visit her more if they thought the danger was so great. If it were my daughter/sister, I'd want to see what was going on.
Why didn't they convince her to stay in Canada with the kids when she visited?
Have you ever seen "Not without my daughter?"
If that woman could make it out of a Middle Eastern country with her child, then there had to be a way and I would have found it if I thought my daughter and granddaughters were in harms way.

They could have urged her to go ahead with the divorce.
They could have urged her to move out and sent her money to help with that since they were already helping her financially. Surley they would have helped her if they thought she and the children were in that great of danger.
They could have told her keep documentation of everything that happened and keep it at a friends house so if something did happen, they'd know who to look at. something, anything!
Not once have I seen in any of these links of her friend's accounts where they say any action was taking place for her safety.
Was anything done by any of these people, who are now accusing him, to keep her safe? NO! And they all "knew"

But now they're all jumping....
It's just kind of fishy and seems like a witch hunt to me

[Bob&Bob]

<----not a friend. Just had a question.

This seems a little slow doesn't it?

[christine2448]

Is this working?

Is what working Bob&Bob. I see your post ;)

[Just the Fax]

Now we have the statements from his family, as if they are unbiased witnesses
================================================== ===========

Also filed Thursday were several affidavits from family members and friends of Brad Cooper, attesting to his character and fitness as a father.

"Brad would never do anything violent – it's just not in him," his father, Terry Cooper said.
Bradley Cooper is on paid administrative leave from his job as a systems engineer at Cisco Systems in Research Triangle Park, a spokeswoman said.

[stillblv]

Obvioulsy they had some rights in this country. I find it mind boggling that they could come here from another country and take his children! With no real grounds!

And for starters, they could have come to visit her more if they thought the danger was so great. If it were my daughter/sister, I'd want to see what was going on.
Why didn't they convince her to stay in Canada with the kids when she visited?
Have you ever seen "Not without my daughter?"
If that woman could make it out of a Middle Eastern country with her child, then there had to be a way and I would have found it if I thought my daughter and granddaughters were in harms way.

They could have urged her to go ahead with the divorce.
They could have urged her to move out and sent her money to help with that since they were already helping her financially. Surley they would have helped her if they thought she and the children were in that great of danger.
They could have told her keep documentation of everything that happened and keep it at a friends house so if something did happen, they'd know who to look at. something, anything!
Not once have I seen in any of these links of her friend's accounts where they say any action was taking place for her safety.
Was anything done by any of these people, who are now accusing him, to keep her safe? NO! And they all "knew"

But now they're all jumping....
It's just kind of fishy and seems like a witch hunt to me

Maybe they DID urge her go get a divorce, move out, send her $$, keep documentation, etc.

Have you seen all of the women who have been killed AFTER they filed a restraining order? Do you think maybe Nancy was trying to do it in the best way she could?

[christine2448]

<----not a friend. Just had a question.

This seems a little slow doesn't it?

It is very slow on and off today...a lot of HOT cases and tons of guests viewing....we are currently in the process of moving to a bigger/faster server...see here. (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2413722#post2413722) :D

[stillblv]

I never saw Not With My Daughter.

I did see My Best Friend's Wedding.

Does anyone here speak to new people?

Hi 2 Bobs!

You made me laugh and I had to answer.

Are you sure you're on the right message board?

[Knoxx]

Hi Bob&Bob! :))))

[RaleighNC]

After reading the draft separation agreement - a few things struck me.

She was not going to do too badly. I am surprised that she had the gumption to hire Alice Stubbs - a pretty high profile attorney and not just roll over and give Brad what he wnated to get the heck out of that marriage.

Please note - I am NOT SAYING that she did not deserve this - as a tagalong spouse who put her career on hold and really decreased her chances for supporting herself, etc.

I am surprised that SHE was the one driving the new(er) X5. That doesn't jibe with Brad always wanting the best - as he was going to get the older 325.

She's also getting the entire disbursement from his 401K. There's a loan against it - but if they were diligent about saving - that could be significant. She's getting the proceeds from the house after the debt is paid. Haven't had time to look and see that the original note on the house was for, but that could be reasonable.

He's also on the hook to pay for private school and a bunch of other stuff.

This agreement looks WAY too kind to Nancy to be agreeable to the Brad portrayed in the affidavits.

Perhaps he knew that she'd never collect on it????? And how much better he would look if the separation agreement wasn't "hostile" or trying to screw her over and looked like he was being very agreeable to taking financial responsibility for his children.......

Hmmmm.......

[Blondieskatz]

[
My question about what NC parents are doing is...why, if they believed their grandchildren to be in such great danger, didn't they do this before now? If Nancy was in such great danger before, why did it take her death to act on all of this? As a parent, if my child and grandchildren were in such horrible conditions, I would have done everything I could to get them out.

I just see this as another way to get "revenge" on Brad for making Nancy unhappy. Using his children to hurt him is dirty, imo.
They have no right. He is not guilty of anything yet....not even a suspect or poi.

Why was nothing done before?
And if it was, why has nothing been said about that? Surely her friends would know if she was seeking some kind of help from her parents with escape...they know everything else....

Why didn't they come and mover her out during the day while BC was at work? NC didn't work, if she was so afraid of BC they could have packed her and the kids up and moved out while he was working. Maybe she wasn't able to return to Canada, but she could've left the house until she could get the passports back. Seems they were well on there way to coming to an agreement about custody.

Why does he have to have a psychiatric evaluation to get his own children? They should be able to get the records from the marriage counselor to find out the real truth about what was going on in the marriage and what kind of father BC was. The therapist would know if there was reason for NC to fear for her life either NC told her or she would've picked up on it from the counseling sessions.

[Bob&Bob]

Thanks for answering. This sure does take a long time doesn't it?

Anyway, I've been searching for the picture of Nancy on Corolla
Island for several hours and can't find it. Since I've spent 5 hours looking I thought it would be okay to ask someone for the
link. If that's not ok, please let me know and I apologize in advance if I've done something wrong.

Thanks so much for responding. I know I should wait longer
than 5 hours but sometimes I get impatient.

Patience is a virtue but I'm not very virtuous I guess :(

[fran]

fran - Several new affidavits were recently added to the plaintiff's affidavits. I now count 12-13 friends of Nancy who are willing to have their sworn testimony on the record. Keep in mind that these friends of Nancy and Brad have nothing to gain from coming forward. In fact, it certainly opens them to scrutiny from the public, the media, and Brad's attorneys. IMO, the primary concern right now should be the safety of Katie and Bella. Of course we all want to see the killer caught and justice served, but that is the job for LE.

I'll go and check for any more new affidavits. The only new one I found was the family request for Brad to have a Psychiatic Exam.

Are there more?

I'm so sorry about your friend Nancy...........so, so sorry, you have no idea.

Please accept by sincere sympathy.

:blowkiss:

fran

PS......PLEASE tell all of Nancy's other friends how wonderful they are for stepping forward! This must be just heartbreaking for them. But believe me, Nancy is very proud of them!.....fran

[stillblv]

After reading the draft separation agreement - a few things struck me.

She was not going to do too badly. I am surprised that she had the gumption to hire Alice Stubbs - a pretty high profile attorney and not just roll over and give Brad what he wnated to get the heck out of that marriage.

Please note - I am NOT SAYING that she did not deserve this - as a tagalong spouse who put her career on hold and really decreased her chances for supporting herself, etc.

I am surprised that SHE was the one driving the new(er) X5. That doesn't jibe with Brad always wanting the best - as he was going to get the older 325.

She's also getting the entire disbursement from his 401K. There's a loan against it - but if they were diligent about saving - that could be significant. She's getting the proceeds from the house after the debt is paid. Haven't had time to look and see that the original note on the house was for, but that could be reasonable.

He's also on the hook to pay for private school and a bunch of other stuff.

This agreement looks WAY too kind to Nancy to be agreeable to the Brad portrayed in the affidavits.

Perhaps he knew that she'd never collect on it????? And how much better he would look if the separation agreement wasn't "hostile" or trying to screw her over and looked like he was being very agreeable to taking financial responsibility for his children.......

Hmmmm.......

Does the separation agreement mean that she was going to get all this? Or was it her first proposal - then he comes back with a counter offer? Just cause it was proposed doesn't in any way mean that that was what she was going to get.

[Jess]

Obvioulsy they had some rights in this country. I find it mind boggling that they could come here from another country and take his children! With no real grounds!

And for starters, they could have come to visit her more if they thought the danger was so great. If it were my daughter/sister, I'd want to see what was going on.
Why didn't they convince her to stay in Canada with the kids when she visited?
Have you ever seen "Not without my daughter?"
If that woman could make it out of a Middle Eastern country with her child, then there had to be a way and I would have found it if I thought my daughter and granddaughters were in harms way.

They could have urged her to go ahead with the divorce.
They could have urged her to move out and sent her money to help with that since they were already helping her financially. Surley they would have helped her if they thought she and the children were in that great of danger.
They could have told her keep documentation of everything that happened and keep it at a friends house so if something did happen, they'd know who to look at. something, anything!
Not once have I seen in any of these links of her friend's accounts where they say any action was taking place for her safety.
Was anything done by any of these people, who are now accusing him, to keep her safe? NO! And they all "knew"

But now they're all jumping....
It's just kind of fishy and seems like a witch hunt to me

And how do you know that they did not !!!!
Maybe they did not want to risk a kidnapping charge, with the mother being thrown into jail and the girls alone with their father. Maybe there were plans in the works. According to a local newscast, the other sister, Jill, said Nancy was planning on moving to Ottawa with the girls to be with her sister. It sounds to me that there could have been many plans , some discarded or thwarted by the husband. Who knows ???

[Blondieskatz]

I never saw Not With My Daughter.

I did see My Best Friend's Wedding.

Does anyone here speak to new people?

Hello Bob&Bob :Welcome-12-june::Welcome-12-june:

[fran]

I'm going to just go by the facts that I know so far.

- Nancy is dead. Murdered. Found 3 mi from her home, 2.5 days after she disappears.
- Nancy had a Sat. 8am appt to meet her friend to paint the friend's house. Nancy never appeared.
- Nancy is not seen alive by anyone other than her husband after a party the night before.
- Husband says Nancy 'went jogging' at 7am on Sat. morning.
- No witnesses have come forward to say they saw Nancy that Saturday morning around 7am when she was out 'jogging.'
- Nancy does not appear alive ever again after 'she went jogging.'
- Nancy's husband does not report her missing when she fails to return home.
- Nancy's friend, worried, phones Brad Cooper at least once and later calls 911 to report her friend missing.
- The police chief says (twice) that this is "an isolated incident and the public is not at risk."
- Husband says he made TWO trips to Harris Teeter between 6am and 6:30am Sat morning (and admits that one of the trips was to get laundry detergent).
- Nancy and Brad were in an unhappy marriage, heading towards divorce. Regardless of whose fault it was and who did what to whom and when, these 2 people were estranged and NOT happy with each other.

Those are the facts as we know them right now.

What we don't know yet is:

- Time of death
- Location of death
- Manner of death
- What Nancy was wearing when found
- Results of any forensic testing
- Independent confirmation of BC's movements that Sat morning and what he purchased and when.


I think that pretty well covers the public's knowledge. Good job, btw, SleuthyGal.

Now for LE to decide what 'they have' and IF they have enough evidence for an arrest or are they still looking for Nancy's killer.


JMHO
fran

[Just the Fax]

After reading the draft separation agreement - a few things struck me.

She was not going to do too badly. I am surprised that she had the gumption to hire Alice Stubbs - a pretty high profile attorney and not just roll over and give Brad what he wnated to get the heck out of that marriage.

Please note - I am NOT SAYING that she did not deserve this - as a tagalong spouse who put her career on hold and really decreased her chances for supporting herself, etc.

I am surprised that SHE was the one driving the new(er) X5. That doesn't jibe with Brad always wanting the best - as he was going to get the older 325.

She's also getting the entire disbursement from his 401K. There's a loan against it - but if they were diligent about saving - that could be significant. She's getting the proceeds from the house after the debt is paid. Haven't had time to look and see that the original note on the house was for, but that could be reasonable.

He's also on the hook to pay for private school and a bunch of other stuff.

This agreement looks WAY too kind to Nancy to be agreeable to the Brad portrayed in the affidavits.

Perhaps he knew that she'd never collect on it????? And how much better he would look if the separation agreement wasn't "hostile" or trying to screw her over and looked like he was being very agreeable to taking financial responsibility for his children.......

Hmmmm.......

http://www.wral.com/asset/news/local/2008/07/23/3258892/E-mail_to_Cooper_with_separatin_agreement.pdf (http://www.wral.com/asset/news/local/2008/07/23/3258892/E-mail_to_Cooper_with_separatin_agreement.pdf)


Also, look at the 'cover e-mail'
The alimony amount was left blank. I am sure that was a huge thorn in his side...the idea of paying a woman be despised thousands each month for 8 years may have sent him over the edge.

I think he stewed over this financial burden to the point h