Nancy Cooper, 34, of Cary, N.C. #11

[Just the Fax]

HT is NOT just around the corner!! It is in the opposite direction of the dump site. Lowes is just around the corner. Two minutes at the most. I go every day and I can almost throw a rock to the Coopers' yard.

Check the map.
Both are on Tryon in opposite directions....no more than 1/2 mile further to HT

[raisincharlie]

HT is NOT just around the corner!! It is in the opposite direction of the dump site. Lowes is just around the corner. Two minutes at the most. I go every day and I can almost throw a rock to the Coopers' yard.

In the Maps thread - post 10 shows a map of the locations - does that look correct to you ? The HT is one major road over due west of the Cooper residence.

[panthera]

I think most joggers would agree they don't carry their cell phone as they pound the pavement.....ipod yes
Oh, I didn't know that! I was thinking of the need for it in case of an emergency ~ like an injury or something. :)

[Just the Fax]

I think Brad made a point to say Nancy called him from home, which indicates to me she used the home phone.

I too believe he used the home phone at 6:40 to dial his cell.

Looks better....you can play no games. It is a fact the call originated from the residence if the AT&t records are checked

[panthera]

This store is a bit closer, but not by much.
I bet they normally shopped at HT....He could get in and out by
knowing where things were...+ the employees could recognize him.
That is what he wanted for his alibi
I have more than one supermarket nearby too and use them both depending on what I'm buying. It does seem Lowes was open at 6am though so it being closed wouldn't be why he didn't go there. :)

[Just the Fax]

Oh, I didn't know that! I was thinking of the need for it in case of an emergency ~ like an injury or something. :)

I jog often and simply don't see many people carrying cell phones in their hands.

[reddress58]

This store is a bit closer, but not by much.
I bet they normally shopped at HT....He could get in and out by
knowing where things were...+ the employees could recognize him.
That is what he wanted for his alibi
Crossing Kildaire Farm Rd. to get to HT takes forever sometimes because of the stoplights. In reality, Lowes in much closer timewise...and in this scenerio, time was of the essence. Yes, HT could be there regular grocery store, but he supposedly wasn't in a "regular" situation...unless he thought ahead and realized it would be "odd" that his credit card didn't normally have any Lowes purchases. However, from the dump site, you are right; the stores are pretty much the same distance. It's just the HT would be farther from home, which means the kids are home alone longer.

[carolinalady]

HT is NOT just around the corner!! It is in the opposite direction of the dump site. Lowes is just around the corner. Two minutes at the most. I go every day and I can almost throw a rock to the Coopers' yard.

2 mins vs 4 mins according to mapquest. I often bypass the closer Food Lion to go to the HT. I think if it was the store he normally frequented, he'd go there.

HT's website shows it's 24hrs (I know the point is moot if he was going in the 6am hr and Lowe's opens at 6am).

[reddress58]

Oh, I didn't know that! I was thinking of the need for it in case of an emergency ~ like an injury or something. :)
I don't take a cell to run unless I'm expecting a call...after all, I live in Lochmere...safest place in the USA! LOL

[panthera]

I too believe he used the home phone at 6:40 to dial his cell.

Looks better....you can play no games. It is a fact the call originated from the residence if the ATT&t records are checked
Ok, here's where it doesn't make sense to me ~ if he killed Nancy. He's out at the store at 6am to cover up disposing of her body. He then fakes a phone call from her to his cell at 6:40am telling him to get laundry detergent while he's actually back at home then goes out again and gets it? Wouldn't he risk someone have seen him leaving the house again?

[raisincharlie]

Crossing Kildaire Farm Rd. to get to HT takes forever sometimes because of the stoplights. In reality, Lowes in much closer timewise...and in this scenerio, time was of the essence. Yes, HT could be there regular grocery store, but he supposedly wasn't in a "regular" situation...unless he thought ahead and realized it would be "odd" that his credit card didn't normally have any Lowes purchases. However, from the dump site, you are right; the stores are pretty much the same distance. It's just the HT would be farther from home, which means the kids are home alone longer.

In Brad's affidavit he said he went to HT, at Waverly Place, which if I understand it, the HT is in the Crescent Commons which is across the street actually - is that right ?

[panthera]

I don't take a cell to run unless I'm expecting a call...after all, I live in Lochmere...safest place in the USA! LOL
It probably still is the safest place!! ;)

[Just the Fax]

Crossing Kildaire Farm Rd. to get to HT takes forever sometimes because of the stoplights. In reality, Lowes in much closer timewise...and in this scenerio, time was of the essence. Yes, HT could be there regular grocery store, but he supposedly wasn't in a "regular" situation...unless he thought ahead and realized it would be "odd" that his credit card didn't normally have any Lowes purchases. However, from the dump site, you are right; the stores are pretty much the same distance. It's just the HT would be farther from home, which means the kids are home alone longer.

Personally, My family shops at HT.....very loyal.
I hate Lowes foods

At the end of the day, I guess it does not matter. Picking HT over Lowes (1/2 mile further) means nothing.

[raisincharlie]

Hmmmm....regarding her cell phone....

This may mean nothing at all, but I wonder if HIS fingerprints are all over that cell? Or if there could be any other/forensic evidence (microscopic) left on her cell phone.

Did he personally hand Nancy's cell phone over to police? Or did the police 'reach' into Nancy's car to retrieve the phone?

WHO last touched Nancy's cell phone?

Bet LE knows.

[Just the Fax]

In Brad's affidavit he said he went to HT, at Waverly Place, which if I understand it, the HT is in the Crescent Commons which is across the street actually - is that right ?

correct

[carolinalady]

Oh, I didn't know that! I was thinking of the need for it in case of an emergency ~ like an injury or something. :)

As a runner, I take my cell phone if I'm running and a sitter is w/ my kids. If husband is home w/ the kids, I normally wouldn't take it.

[reddress58]

2 mins vs 4 mins according to mapquest. I often bypass the closer Food Lion to go to the HT. I think if it was the store he normally frequented, he'd go there.

HT's website shows it's 24hrs (I know the point is moot if he was going in the 6am hr and Lowe's opens at 6am).
He may not have known Lowes was open that early if he didn't shop there regularly...and didn't want to waste extra time in case it wasn't.

[raisincharlie]

Affidavit of one of her friends.

So if this woman is sleeping in the kids room with her keys in her pocket, does anyone really believe her cell phone was locked outside in her car ?

Not me.

[carolinalady]

In Brad's affidavit he said he went to HT, at Waverly Place, which if I understand it, the HT is in the Crescent Commons which is across the street actually - is that right ?

That's correct. The HT used to be at Waverly Place. It moved across the street to Crescent Commons years ago. I mentioned previously that many still refer to it as Waverly Place (or at least many people I know).

[panthera]

As a runner, I take my cell phone if I'm running and a sitter is w/ my kids. If husband is home w/ the kids, I normally wouldn't take it.
Well then, that would fit in just with what Nancy supposedly did, according to Brad. I'm really beginning to wonder if he didn't kill her, but then who would have? :eek:

[Just the Fax]

Ok, here's where it doesn't make sense to me ~ if he killed Nancy. He's out at the store at 6am to cover up disposing of her body. He then fakes a phone call from her to his cell at 6:40am telling him to get laundry detergent while he's actually back at home then goes out again and gets it? Wouldn't he risk someone have seen him leaving the house again?


No, he said he went at 6:15 to get milk.

When he came home , he forgot the detergent and headed back.
Thats when he said Nancy called from home at 6:40 am to ask him for juice.

I think he left the 2nd time at 6:40 , as he thought the 'call' from Nancy would prove she was alive at 6 :40 (she was in fact dead)

[panthera]

So if this woman is sleeping in the kids room with her keys in her pocket, does anyone really believe her cell phone was locked outside in her car ?

Not me.
Someone who needed that "lifeline" wouldn't have left it where they couldn't get to it, imo.

[carolinalady]

Someone who needed that "lifeline" wouldn't have left it where they couldn't get to it, imo.

Right, but would they have left a more precious gift, the kids, with him?

[panthera]

No, he said he went at 6:15 to get milk.

When he came home , he forgot the detergent and headed back.
Thats when he said Nancy called from home at 6:40 am to ask him for juice.

I think he left the 2nd time at 6:40 , as he thought the 'call' from Nancy would prove she was alive at 6 :40 (she was in fact dead)
Oops, I got the detergent mixed up with the juice. It was the juice trip I was referring to. He's still making too many trips in and out of the driveway, imo, if he's the one who faked the call from Nancy at 6:40am, since he should have been out at that time.

[panthera]

Right, but would they have left a more precious gift, the kids, with him?
If she was that afraid of him, no. MOO

[Just the Fax]

Oops, I got the detergent mixed up with the juice. It was the juice trip I was referring to. He's still making too many trips in and out of the driveway, imo, if he's the one who faked the call from Nancy at 6:40am, since he should have been out at that time.


The 2nd trip was detergent and she 'called' him at 6;40 for the juice too....remember it is < 5 minutes away to the store.
Make the call at 6:40 and arrive at the store at 6:45....convenient time-line huh ?

[raisincharlie]

Someone who needed that "lifeline" wouldn't have left it where they couldn't get to it, imo.

I agree - IMO that cell phone would have been right in the same room with her not locked outside in the car overnight. But yet for some reason that phone is reported to have been in the car that morning. Quess it is possible she threw it in there on her way out to run, or someone else put it in there, or it wasn't in the car at all. Hopefully LE looked when they arrived at the Cooper residence that afternoon.

[Just the Fax]

I agree - IMO that cell phone would have been right in the same room with her not locked outside in the car overnight. But yet for some reason that phone is reported to have been in the car that morning. Quess it is possible she threw it in there on her way out to run, or someone else put it in there, or it wasn't in the car at all. Hopefully LE looked when they arrived at the Cooper residence that afternoon.

If Brad killed her, why would he place her phone in the car ?
Or why would he say it was there when it was in the house ?

[panthera]

The 2nd trip was detergent and she 'called' him at 6;40 for the juice too....remember it is < 5 minutes away to the store.
Make the call at 6:40 and arrive at the store at 6:45....convenient time-line huh ?
Yes it would be as long as the neighbors didn't see him leave the house between 6:40am-6:45am ~ which it seems they didn't. I have too many neighbors out and about on Saturday morning! Two weeks ago the ones next door were having a garage sale and sat out in the front yard all day. Too bad that didn't happen with Brad that Saturday!

[carolinalady]

Has Jessica Adam confirmed the normal time for their training runs? I know that it has been stated that Nancy's norm was to go to Java Jive and run from there. I just am curious if her normal run time was when BC was home w/ the girls or if she had a sitter/friend watch. I would also like to know how long the training routine has been going on.

I know some of the affidavits state that BC was an absentee father and did nothing to help w/ the kids. And I know that some say that he had become more involved in the past 2 months. So, I'd just like see if the training routine had changed to match that timeline.

[panthera]

I agree - IMO that cell phone would have been right in the same room with her not locked outside in the car overnight. But yet for some reason that phone is reported to have been in the car that morning. Quess it is possible she threw it in there on her way out to run, or someone else put it in there, or it wasn't in the car at all. Hopefully LE looked when they arrived at the Cooper residence that afternoon.
My DH works nights and I have both the cellphone and landline phone in the bedroom ~ just in case of an emergency either with him at work or something at the house. Even when he's home the cell phone is there just out of habit. I can't figure out though why Brad would've put hers in the car unless he used it.

[Just the Fax]

Yes it would be as long as the neighbors didn't see him leave the house between 6:40am-6:45am ~ which it seems they didn't. I have too many neighbors out and about on Saturday morning! Two weeks ago the ones next door were having a garage sale and sat out in the front yard all day. Too bad that didn't happen with Brad that Saturday!


panthera, he wanted to be seen leaving again at 6:40.
Presumably, he has video and a paper trail to prove he was at the HT both times he said

[raisincharlie]

If Brad killed her, why would he place her phone in the car ?

That seems to be my question as well. Someone told Jessica it was in the car, why tell that? Why would she tell the 911 dispatcher it was in the car if someone hadn't told her it was?

[reddress58]

In the Maps thread - post 10 shows a map of the locations - does that look correct to you ? The HT is one major road over due west of the Cooper residence.
Yes...but look at Mahmoo's map. See Tryon Rd. in the upper left-hand corner? THAT is where Lowes is. Much closer driving-wise because you don't have to wait long at the one and only stoplight. This is something you have to take my word for. I am a creature of convenience, and when I want something fast, I go to Lowes.

[panthera]

panthera, he wanted to be seen leaving again at 6:40.
Presumably, he has video and a paper trail to prove he was at the HT both times he said
OK ~ I think I'm getting this figured out! I can see the video/paper trail at the store but not wanting to be seen leaving the driveway at 6:40am when he wasn't supposed to be home unless he's saying he just pulled into the driveway when she called and he backed right out. That possibility would also work with the landline phone!

[Just the Fax]

That seems to be my question as well. Someone told Jessica it was in the car, why tell that? Why would she tell the 911 dispatcher it was in the car if someone hadn't told her it was?

She got no answer from her cell.
When she called Brad at 9 am, she told him that fact...I guess his response was it was in the car....good excuse for him to not hear the rings and answer it.

If my wife were out w/o her phone and it rang, I would answer it if I knew the caller.

[reddress58]

Maybe during the "altercation" she ran outside with her cell and tried to lock herself in the car to call 911!

[Just the Fax]

OK ~ I think I'm getting this figured out! I can see the video/paper trail at the store but not wanting to be seen leaving the driveway at 6:40am when he wasn't supposed to be home unless he's saying he just pulled into the driveway when she called and he backed right out. That possibility would also work with the landline phone!

remember, he said he returned home and then remembered he forgot the detergent. He then left again, conveniently receiving a call from Nancy 'proving' she was alive at 6:40

[carolinalady]

Yes...but look at Mahmoo's map. See Tryon Rd. in the upper left-hand corner? THAT is where Lowes is. Much closer driving-wise because you don't have to wait long at the one and only stoplight. This is something you have to take my word for. I am a creature of convenience, and when I want something fast, I go to Lowes.

How long would it take if he took Lochmere around to Kildaire Farm Road? It goes all the way through, right (going on memory)?

[raisincharlie]

Yes...but look at Mahmoo's map. See Tryon Rd. in the upper left-hand corner? THAT is where Lowes is. Much closer driving-wise because you don't have to wait long at the one and only stoplight. This is something you have to take my word for. I am a creature of convenience, and when I want something fast, I go to Lowes.

I have no problem with your word. But it makes one think, why go to Harris Teeter when one could have stopped at the Lowes if it was open. Unless he too was a creature of habit and always went to Harris Teeter ?

But wouldn't it make sense if you had just dumped a body off Fielding Road - it would be more convenient to go to HT - left and a right instead of going back by the house and around on Tyron Road ?

[SleuthyGal]

When he came home , he forgot the detergent and headed back.

Regarding the IMMEDIATE need for laundry detergent: I'm curious if an empty laundry detergent box/bottle was found anywhere in the Cooper garbage? What day is their garbage pickup? If they had just run out of detergent (and one would assume this had to have happened sometime in the last 2 days) then where is this empty container? Was it in the laundry room garbage? Or in the bin outside? Did they recycle? How often was laundry done in that household? I'm assuming often with 4 people (2 little kids).

What type was purchased? Is it the SAME type/brand they always purchased? Was it different? And if yes, how so?

[Just the Fax]

Maybe during the "altercation" she ran outside with her cell and tried to lock herself in the car to call 911!


I don't know, but I suspect she would have made the call if that were the case...in addition to blowing the horn

[carolinalady]

Maybe during the "altercation" she ran outside with her cell and tried to lock herself in the car to call 911!

I would think that would've made too much noise and the neighbors would have definitely noticed!

[Just the Fax]

Regarding the IMMEDIATE need for laundry detergent: I'm curious if an empty laundry detergent box/bottle was found anywhere in the Cooper garbage? What day is their garbage pickup? If they had just run out of detergent (and one would assume this had to have happened sometime in the last 2 days) then where is this empty container? Was it in the laundry room garbage? Or in the bin outside? Did they recycle? How often was laundry done in that household? I'm assuming often with 4 people (2 little kids).

What type was purchased? Is it the SAME type/brand they always purchased? Was it different? And if yes, how so?


It was said Brad was forced to do his own laundry since April, as Nancy refused to handle his.

one friend said his sheets were 'yellow' from not being changed :eek:

[raisincharlie]

It was said Brad was forced to do his own laundry since April, as Nancy refused to handle his.

one friend said his sheets were 'yellow' from not being changed :eek:

That couldn't have made him happy that Nancy used all the detergent up then :crazy:

[panthera]

remember, he said he returned home and then remembered he forgot the detergent. He then left again, conveniently receiving a call from Nancy 'proving' she was alive at 6:40
Got it! Thanks so much for helping me decipher these trips. :) I do think it's possible he could've even had the landline phone in the car and in the driveway he'd be able to call his cell.

[SleuthyGal]

It was said Brad was forced to do his own laundry since April, as Nancy refused to handle his.

one friend said his sheets were 'yellow' from not being changed :eek:

WELL then...if this is true, does it make sense that Nancy would have any conversation w/Brad about him picking up laundry detergent? I mean if he's on his own with that...then why would Nancy bother talking to him about it. That doesn't make sense to me.

AND....if Brad is okay with his sheets being 'yellow' from not being washed, then WHAT WAS THE URGENCY to having to get laundry detergent at/around 6am on Saturday morning?

Does this raise the 'HINKY FLAG' for anyone else?

I mean I don't think they can have it both ways... :confused:

[carolinalady]

I have no problem with your word. But it makes one think, why go to Harris Teeter when one could have stopped at the Lowes if it was open. Unless he too was a creature of habit and always went to Harris Teeter ?

But wouldn't it make sense if you had just dumped a body off Fielding Road - it would be more convenient to go to HT - left and a right instead of going back by the house and around on Tyron Road ?

From the map though, it still would appear that Lowes is closer to where the body was found (haven't mapquested distances though). You're right though, no doubling back if that would've been a consideration.

My guess is that HT is where he normally shopped. If he used his VIC card, it could be checked to see how often he shopped there. Also, if he paid routinely w/ a debit/credit card it would show on those records (even w/o a VIC card). Also, he may have known HT was a 24 hr shop and not been sure that Lowes would've been open that early.

[reddress58]

It takes longer to drive down Lochmere Dr...it's the whole length to Kildaire Fm Rd. Then he has to make a right and go a ways up to HT on the left. Two stop lights. If he goes out Tryon and up to Kildaire, he'd turn left then right into HT...three stop lights. (he wouldn't enter from Tryon at the Walmart end because he'd have to snake through the long parking lot) Lowes is 1 stoplight and, at that time of day, a 1 to 2 min. drive at most. It's within walking distance. Lot's of middle schoolers from our end of Lochmere walk to that corner to catch the bus for magnet schools.

[SleuthyGal]

I do think it's possible he could've even had the landline phone in the car and in the driveway he'd be able to call his cell.

Hmmmm yes....cordless phone?

[Just the Fax]

Got it! Thanks so much for helping me decipher these trips. :) I do think it's possible he could've even had the landline phone in the car and in the driveway he'd be able to call his cell.

He prolly went inside first to be sure the girls were still asleep

[reddress58]

From the map though, it still would appear that Lowes is closer to where the body was found (haven't mapquested distances though). You're right though, no doubling back if that would've been a consideration.

My guess is that HT is where he normally shopped. If he used his VIC card, it could be checked to see how often he shopped there. Also, if he paid routinely w/ a debit/credit card it would show on those records (even w/o a VIC card). Also, he may have known HT was a 24 hr shop and not been sure that Lowes would've been open that early.
That's what i said earlier, CarolinaL.

[Just the Fax]

It takes longer to drive down Lochmere Dr...it's the whole length to Kildaire Fm Rd. Then he has to make a right and go a ways up to HT on the left. Two stop lights. If he goes out Tryon and up to Kildaire, he'd turn left then right into HT...three stop lights. (he wouldn't enter from Tryon at the Walmart end because he'd have to snake through the long parking lot) Lowes is 1 stoplight and, at that time of day, a 1 to 2 min. drive at most. It's within walking distance. Lot's of middle schoolers from our end of Lochmere walk to that corner to catch the bus for magnet schools.

Ok, that fact is established.
Never the less, for what ever reason , he obviously decided to go to HT .

My guess it was habit...in this situation, go with what you know

[reddress58]

Regarding the IMMEDIATE need for laundry detergent: I'm curious if an empty laundry detergent box/bottle was found anywhere in the Cooper garbage? What day is their garbage pickup? If they had just run out of detergent (and one would assume this had to have happened sometime in the last 2 days) then where is this empty container? Was it in the laundry room garbage? Or in the bin outside? Did they recycle? How often was laundry done in that household? I'm assuming often with 4 people (2 little kids).

What type was purchased? Is it the SAME type/brand they always purchased? Was it different? And if yes, how so?
Garbage pickup is Thursday.

[raisincharlie]

WELL then...if this is true, does it make sense that Nancy would have any conversation w/Brad about him picking up laundry detergent? I mean if he's on his own with that...then why would Nancy bother talking to him about it. That doesn't make sense to me.

AND....if Brad is okay with his sheets being 'yellow' from not being washed, then WHAT WAS THE URGENCY to having to get laundry detergent at/around 6am on Saturday morning?

Does this raise the 'HINKY FLAG' for anyone else?

I mean I don't think they can have it both ways... :confused:

In Brad's affidavit he says he noticed they needed laundry detergent after he came back from getting Milk for the little one, not that Nancy asked for it, so he went out on his own to get it and while gone Nancy called him about juice.

I have to take this back after reading again - he does say nancy asked him to go get detergent - my bad. But still Nancy was going running, Brad was suppose to play tennis, Nancy was suppose to be going to two friend's houses that day - when was the detergent to be used - not exactly right away - not enough to send someone out at 630 a.m - he could have picked it up on the way back from tennis. I don't think he was so whipped he would just go at 630 am to get something that wasn't going to be used for a while.

But you're right about the urgency between 6 and 7 am - enoughto motivate him to make a second trip to the store - doubt it.

[runnermomof5]

THANKS TO EVERYONE FOR MAKING ME FEEL WELCOME!
YOU GUYS ROCK!

I carry my cell phone in a small waist pack that was designed for running.
I take it because I have 1 child at home who has Type 1 diabetes and I also have a son in Iraq.
So....I carry it in case of an emergency if my family needed to reach me.
I keep thinking that since NC was such a devoted mom, that surely she would have carried her cell with her when she ran, especially since her daughters are still very young. Or at the least, left it in her car so that she could check for messages after her run.
IMO the reason that BC could describe exactly what NC was wearing when she went out for her supposed run that morning, is because he dressed her in those clothes.
The last time she was seen alive by her friends was at the party the night before. I doubt that she was dressed in running clothes at the party.

[raisincharlie]

THANKS TO EVERYONE FOR MAKING ME FEEL WELCOME!
YOU GUYS ROCK!

I carry my cell phone in a small waist pack that was designed for running.
I take it because I have 1 child at home who has Type 1 diabetes and I also have a son in Iraq.
So....I carry it in case of an emergency if my family needed to reach me.
I keep thinking that since NC was such a devoted mom, that surely she would have carried her cell with her when she ran, especially since her daughters are still very young. Or at the least, left it in her car so that she could check for messages after her run.
IMO the reason that BC could describe exactly what NC was wearing when she went out for her supposed run that morning, is because he dressed her in those clothes.
The last time she was seen alive by her friends was at the party the night before. I doubt that she was dressed in running clothes at the party.

Do you think it is possible that maybe Nancy slept in a t and shorts ?

[Just the Fax]

Do you think it is possible that maybe Nancy slept in a t and shorts ?


.....Definitely not blue running shoes

[carolinalady]

THANKS TO EVERYONE FOR MAKING ME FEEL WELCOME!
YOU GUYS ROCK!

I carry my cell phone in a small waist pack that was designed for running.
I take it because I have 1 child at home who has Type 1 diabetes and I also have a son in Iraq.
So....I carry it in case of an emergency if my family needed to reach me.
I keep thinking that since NC was such a devoted mom, that surely she would have carried her cell with her when she ran, especially since her daughters are still very young. Or at the least, left it in her car so that she could check for messages after her run.
IMO the reason that BC could describe exactly what NC was wearing when she went out for her supposed run that morning, is because he dressed her in those clothes.
The last time she was seen alive by her friends was at the party the night before. I doubt that she was dressed in running clothes at the party.

I'm a devoted mom and I normally don't carry my cell phone when running if my husband is home w/ the kids.

I guess I'm the only one that doesn't think BC's description of what she was wearing was that specific. A t-shirt, shorts and light blue shoes? I think my husband would know the color of my running shoes b/c I have one pair, but maybe not know which shorts/shirt I was wearing. I would think it was specific if he said her "white nike shirt and pink shorts."

[reddress58]

In Brad's affidavit he says he noticed they needed laundry detergent after he came back from getting Milk for the little one, not that Nancy asked for it, so he went out on his own to get it and while gone Nancy called him about juice.

But you're right about the urgency between 6 and 7 am - enoughto motivate him to make a second trip to the store - doubt it.
If I remember correctly, she had recently returned from the trip with her parents and discovered the house was a mess...including his dirty sheets & bathroom. She was upset about it and it supposedly discussed with at least one friend at the party. I can very well see that could have been the catalyst for the argument when she came home from the party or early in the morning...his gross bed, bath and kitchen. He could have felt embarrassed and finally decided to wash his sheets...remember, she'd stopped doing his laundry.

[carolinalady]

In Brad's affidavit he says he noticed they needed laundry detergent after he came back from getting Milk for the little one, not that Nancy asked for it, so he went out on his own to get it and while gone Nancy called him about juice.

But you're right about the urgency between 6 and 7 am - enoughto motivate him to make a second trip to the store - doubt it.

Maybe the urgency was just being able to go to the store alone (speaking from experience).

Of course, according to his own affidavit, he was going to play tennis in the morning, so I'd guess he thought he was going to have some "alone" time then. Maybe he need to wash his tennis clothes and was going to do that during Nancy's run?

[runnermomof5]

Do you think it is possible that maybe Nancy slept in a t and shorts ?

That is possible. But what about a jogging bra? Those things can be uncomfortable to sleep in. Did BC say if she was wearing one, or just the shirt, shorts, and running shoes. I would go back and reread , but was hoping that someone remembers what all BC described that NC had on that morning.

[panthera]

Hmmmm yes....cordless phone?
Exactly! I can take mine out to the driveway and around the yard. Used to do it all the time before getting the cell phone! :)

[SleuthyGal]

In Brad's affidavit he says he noticed they needed laundry detergent after he came back from getting Milk for the little one, not that Nancy asked for it, so he went out on his own to get it and while gone Nancy called him about juice.

But you're right about the urgency between 6 and 7 am - enoughto motivate him to make a second trip to the store - doubt it.

Well that just raises my HINKY METER even higher. So he noticed he needed some detergent and went back on a separate trip...on Saturday morning....around 6:30am....

Nopey. Not buying his reasoning. Hinky x 2

[raisincharlie]

Do you think it is possible that maybe Nancy slept in a t and shorts ?

That is possible. But what about a jogging bra? Those things can be uncomfortable to sleep in. Did BC say if she was wearing one, or just the shirt, shorts, and running shoes. I would go back and reread , but was hoping that someone remembers what all BC described that NC had on that morning.

Dunno - the only thing the flier says is t-shirt, shorts and blue running shoes.

[IMHO63]

Okie dokey. That confirms what she was wearing.
Thanks, raisin. :)

Note, this does not confirm what she was wearing when she was found, only that she was last SEEN wearing, which are the same items BC told LE she was wearing. Nothing really new in the flyer. Thanks to raisin for posting the flyer

[reddress58]

I'm a devoted mom and I normally don't carry my cell phone when running if my husband is home w/ the kids.

I guess I'm the only one that doesn't think BC's description of what she was wearing was that specific. A t-shirt, shorts and light blue shoes? I think my husband would know the color of my running shoes b/c I have one pair, but maybe not know which shorts/shirt I was wearing. I would think it was specific if he said her "white nike shirt and pink shorts."
One thing we need to remember that someone brought up in an earilier thread...this whole morning routine sounds like things were just honky dory pinky in that household. The nice hubby running errands for wifey and kiddies...for breakfast, household chores. What we need to remember is she was STEAMED about the mess she found upon returning, and the household was very tense. I just can't imagine the whole "errand" thing taking place that morning.

[wirehair]

Many times I pull into the driveway and leave my purse and cell phone in my vehicle. The only time I bring it in is when I know I am not leaving again. She might have been away from home shopping or at the grocery store. She could have carried shopping bags or grocery bags into the house and just left her purse and phone in the car to retrieve later. One of the girls might have been asleep and she carried her in. Time could have been short and she had to get ready to go directly across the street to the party. She could have not given another thought about her phone being in her car. She would have probably got it out on her way in. BC probably grabbed her as soon as she came into the house. As far as nosy neighbors seeing you leave at an unusual time. Most part goers would have been sound asleep by 3 am. I come and go at all hours of the night and I have the nosiest people around me. Not one has ever asked me where i went. Their houses are all dark in the middle of the night. If they are up, they are watching tv or on the computer, not looking out the window. No someone screaming might make you look out the window. If you are clobbered from behind, there is only the thud when you hit the floor. Too much noise and the children would wake up. Also there is a Lowe's at Kildaire Farm Road and Ten Ten Road right near the car wash at Food Lion. He could have gone to any convenience store close by also to buy cleaning products. Both are open 24 hours and within one and one half mi. of the dumping site. I wonder is LE has checked the videos at those stores.

[raisincharlie]

Well that just raises my HINKY METER even higher. So he noticed he needed some detergent and went back on a separate trip...on Saturday morning....around 6:30am....

Nopey. Not buying his reasoning. Hinky x 2

I went back in read it again - he does indicate Nancy asked him to go back. Note my addition to the post - the urgency is not there - she was off to run and to do some work for friends and he says he was suppose to play tennis. So it isn't like the detergent was necessary for several hours at best and either one could have picked it up on their way home from their various activities.

Part of the reason I don't think Brad was aware Nancy was suppose to go to Jessica's that day - who was going to care for the girls while he was playing tennis ? Maybe daycare ?

[Just the Fax]

One thing we need to remember that someone brought up in an earilier thread...this whole morning routine sounds like things were just honky dory pinky in that household. The nice hubby running errands for wifey and kiddies...for breakfast, household chores. What we need to remember is she was STEAMED about the mess she found upon returning, and the household was very tense. I just can't imagine the whole "errand" thing taking place that morning.

Besides, was it not Nancy's 'duty' to grocery shop for the kids with her $300? If the child needed milk , I can see him say'n , you go get it.

[panthera]

He prolly went inside first to be sure the girls were still asleep
I was thinking the exact opposite that he wouldn't want to go inside because if they were up he woudn't be able to leave again immediately and that would throw off his "timeline".

[SleuthyGal]

What we need to remember is she was STEAMED about the mess she found upon returning, and the household was very tense. I just can't imagine the whole "errand" thing taking place that morning.

EGGSACTLY Reddress! These 2 were not communicating or working together. So Brad is painting a picture that just doesn't make sense. And I'm sorry, but I just don't see the urgency for him to be at the grocery store...TWICE...between 6am and 7am. The only reason is that he needed to try and establish an alibi at that time and create a phone record to somehow 'prove' that Nancy (or Nancy's phone) called his phone.

BTW, did either his phone or Nancy's phone have that push button/instant talk capability? Nextel was the first to have it, but some other cell phone companies offer it too.

[runnermomof5]

Part of the reason I don't think Brad was aware Nancy was suppose to go to Jessica's that day - who was going to care for the girls while he was playing tennis ? Maybe daycare ?

But BC stated in his affidavit that Sat were mommy's day off.
So, why did he schedule a tennis match in the first place ?

[reddress58]

Good point, Raisin; but Nancy was painting at a friend's. The kids usually came with her most everywhere she went.

[Just the Fax]

I was thinking the exact opposite that he wouldn't want to go inside because if they were up he woudn't be able to leave again immediately and that would throw off his "timeline".

If he drove in the drive and left again w/o going in , how would he explain Nancy asking him to go back to the store ?

A neighbor could have seen him and his story would be busted

[reddress58]

But BC stated in his affidavit that Sat were mommy's day off.
So, why did he schedule a tennis match in the first place ?
We established earlier on that not EVERY Sat. were mommy's days off... He didn't say that.

[panthera]

Do you think it is possible that maybe Nancy slept in a t and shorts ?

That is possible. But what about a jogging bra? Those things can be uncomfortable to sleep in. Did BC say if she was wearing one, or just the shirt, shorts, and running shoes. I would go back and reread , but was hoping that someone remembers what all BC described that NC had on that morning.
I think it's possible she slept in a t-shirt and shorts but those sleepwear sets usually aren't the same thing you'd wear jogging, and of course, no I don't think she'd wear the jogging bra to bed or go jogging without it. Some items of clothes aren't too easy to "redress" on a dead body, imo, so I think it'd be huge to know if she had a bra on when she was found. Even putting the socks & shoes on her might not be that easy. And of course, with redress I have to assume she didn't have any injuries on her body for blood transfer.

[carolinalady]

But BC stated in his affidavit that Sat were mommy's day off.
So, why did he schedule a tennis match in the first place ?

Did he say that all Saturdays were Mommy's Day Off? I cannot remember. I guess I'll go back and read.

Sorry, y'all are too fast. Already answered.

[raisincharlie]

Good point, Raisin; but Nancy was painting at a friend's. The kids usually came with her most everywhere she went.

See, that is why it doesn't make sense to go back on a second trip to get detergent - Nancy could have done it herself if she wanted it or needed it. No need at all to send him out at 630. I just don't think he knew she was going to her friends at 8 am - thus the running story - that would to most seem normal - except the friend who she was supposed to be with, which in this case turns out to be the person who called 911.

[panthera]

If he drove in the drive and left again w/o going in , how would he explain Nancy asking him to go back to the store ?

A neighbor could have seen him and his story would be busted
That she called him on the phone?

[panthera]

See, that is why it doesn't make sense to go back on a second trip to get detergent - Nancy could have done it herself if she wanted it or needed it. No need at all to send him out at 630. I just don't think he knew she was going to her friends at 8 am - thus the running story - that would to most seem normal - except the friend who she was supposed to be with, which in this case turns out to be the person who called 911.
I don't think he knew about that either since he was really cutting it close having her leave for the run just before 7am. I still wonder about his tennis date that morning and who that was with? Like, if LE has talked to that person and confirmed Brad had a date and what Brad sounded like when he cancelled it?

[reddress58]

That she called him on the phone?
Wonder if anyone asked the girls if daddy gave them Benedryl? If he wanted the kids to sleep through this stuff, he could easily have drugged them before bed or during the night. I remember when my kids were young and we were going to take a loooong car trip. I'd say, "Oh, I think I detect a sniffle. Better give um a little dose of Beneydrl." :-)

[runnermomof5]

Did he say that all Saturdays were Mommy's Day Off? I cannot remember. I guess I'll go back and read.

Sorry, y'all are too fast. Already answered.

Okay, I did go back and read it. Item # 17 he stated that "we frequently had mommy's day off ."
So, I guess not always on Sat. I stand corrected. :)

BUT............also in item # 27 he states that "I frequently pick up groceries or run out to the store for milk or juice in the mornings before work, or in the evenings when we are running low on items. "
He did not mention weekends, only weekdays and evenings.

[SleuthyGal]

See, that is why it doesn't make sense to go back on a second trip to get detergent - Nancy could have done it herself if she wanted it or needed it. No need at all to send him out at 630. I just don't think he knew she was going to her friends at 8 am - thus the running story - that would to most seem normal - except the friend who she was supposed to be with, which in this case turns out to be the person who called 911.

Yep! It's the COMBO of Nancy having plans @ 8am (which were confirmed the night before, right?), but Nancy going "jogging" 1 hr before she's to meet said friend, and Brad up 'n out between 6am and 6:45am for TWO trips to HT...the 2nd one to specifically get laundry detergent....and the only urgency to that would be to maybe wash clothes for a tennis match he had scheduled at 9am...

a tennis match he had to postpone then cancel on because the wife wasn't back home yet....but he was not worried and didn't bother looking for her or calling her...for HOURS.

UH HUH.

[raisincharlie]

Okay, I did go back and read it. Item # 17 he stated that "we frequently had mommy's day off ."
So, I guess not always on Sat. I stand corrected. :)

BUT............also in item # 27 he states that "I frequently pick up groceries or run out to the store for milk or juice in the mornings before work, or in the evenings when we are running low on items. "
He did not mention weekends, only weekdays and evenings.

Don't you wonder why he had to go out so frequently ?

[reddress58]

See, that is why it doesn't make sense to go back on a second trip to get detergent - Nancy could have done it herself if she wanted it or needed it. No need at all to send him out at 630. I just don't think he knew she was going to her friends at 8 am - thus the running story - that would to most seem normal - except the friend who she was supposed to be with, which in this case turns out to be the person who called 911.
I honestly think this is where he will get nailed. There is no way Nancy would tell him she would be back at 9 when she had already made plans for 8. At least it's why the LE knows it's him and not a "random" act.

[Just the Fax]

Yep! It's the COMBO of Nancy having plans @ 8am (which were confirmed the night before, right?), but Nancy going "jogging" 1 hr before she's to meet said friend, and Brad up 'n out between 6am and 6:45am for TWO trips to HT...the 2nd one to specifically get laundry detergent....and the only urgency to that would be to maybe wash clothes for a tennis match he had scheduled at 9am...

a tennis match he had to postpone then cancel on because the wife wasn't back home yet....but he was not worried and didn't bother looking for her or calling her...for HOURS.

UH HUH.

He worked out obsessively, he had more than enough clothes he could use to play tennis. This whole thing smells to high heaven...especially when you consider every little thing that does not quite add up.

IMO, Brad Cooper killed Nancy.
There is no doubt in my mind

[SleuthyGal]

I mean...these two were NOT communicating about their plans and yet Brad is trying to sell the idea that they were communicating about things like MILK and JUICE?

Yes I know it has to do with the kids' needs, but I still don't believe it. Nopey.

[outside_of_apex]

The phone does not have to be 'in-use' for the tower to pick up the signal.

And I'm not even sure if the phone has to be 'ON' though I need to research that.

While a cell phone is on it is constantly being tracked and it's general location (to within 10s of yards) can be logged. It is more murky what happens when the phone is OFF. The OFF button doesn't necessarily turn everything off.

In the Hans Reiser murder case, Hans was concerned about this very thing and removed the battery from Nina's cell phone and frequently from his own. This behavior helped the jury convict him (there was no body at the time of the trial; Hans led investigators to the body before sentencing hoping to get a break).

[Just the Fax]

I just pray there are some forensics that come back soon and nail him .

Look at Jason Young, there is a list 2 pages long of all the little things that add up to him 100% being the killer.

He has walked a free man for going on 2 years :furious:

[runnermomof5]

I think it's possible she slept in a t-shirt and shorts but those sleepwear sets usually aren't the same thing you'd wear jogging, and of course, no I don't think she'd wear the jogging bra to bed or go jogging without it. Some items of clothes aren't too easy to "redress" on a dead body, imo, so I think it'd be huge to know if she had a bra on when she was found. Even putting the socks & shoes on her might not be that easy. And of course, with redress I have to assume she didn't have any injuries on her body for blood transfer.

BINGO! I have been thinking the same thing about the running bra. I doubt that she would have ran without one and if BC had to dress her in her running clothes before dropping her body off, that running bra would have been very difficult to put on her. IMO, more difficult than the shoes.

[SleuthyGal]

He worked out obsessively, he had more than enough clothes he could use to play tennis. This whole thing smells to high heaven...especially when you consider every little thing that does not quite add up.

IMO, Brad Cooper killed Nancy.
There is no doubt in my mind

I have no doubt either. As to whether there is enough 'evidence' to arrest him and make a case in court is a whole other matter. But I will remain hopeful that an arrest & conviction is possible in this case.

[panthera]

I mean...these two were NOT communicating about their plans and yet Brad is trying to sell the idea that they were communicating about things like MILK and JUICE?

Yes I know it has to do with the kids' needs, but I still don't believe it. Nopey.
If they were out of milk and juice and this is something she gave the kids, don't you think she would've been screaming about it to her friends and if she didn't have the money, gotten it from one of them that night? In other words, I can't see Nancy allowing the children to be without something they needed and asking him to pick it up on an early morning trip to the store especially when they weren't getting along.

[runnermomof5]

I have no doubt either. As to whether there is enough 'evidence' to arrest him and make a case in court is a whole other matter. But I will remain hopeful that an arrest & conviction is possible in this case.

I 3rd that! I have no doubt whatsoever.

[reddress58]

I 3rd that! I have no doubt whatsoever.
Me 4.

[carolinalady]

He worked out obsessively, he had more than enough clothes he could use to play tennis. This whole thing smells to high heaven...especially when you consider every little thing that does not quite add up.

IMO, Brad Cooper killed Nancy.
There is no doubt in my mind

I don't know. If he was now responsible for his laundry, he could've waited and waited and waited to do laundry (would jive w/ the "yellow sheets").

[carolinalady]

I mean...these two were NOT communicating about their plans and yet Brad is trying to sell the idea that they were communicating about things like MILK and JUICE?

Yes I know it has to do with the kids' needs, but I still don't believe it. Nopey.

OK, but in previous threads people were saying even w/ the tension, these people would be calling/communicating with each other about stuff for the kids. This was in response to people saying that if things were tense, they might not have been telling each other their plans.

[panthera]

BINGO! I have been thinking the same thing about the running bra. I doubt that she would have ran without one and if BC had to dress her in her running clothes before dropping her body off, that running bra would have been very difficult to put on her. IMO, more difficult than the shoes.
And remember the news report that she was "partially clothed" or words to that effect? Does that mean that something was missing when she was found, like the jogging bra? Just a thought!

[pamlet]

Fran, I certainly respect your opinion. However, put yourself in BC's shoes IF he did not do it. He has been trashed and he is concerned he is going to lose custody of his children FOREVER. After reading the affidavits, you see that many of her friend's statements are "Nancy told me" and not directly witnessing the behavior. He is presenting his side of things. I'll state this again, he has plenty in his affidavits that could be proved true or false (looking at signatures on CC receipts, phone calls, emails, etc.).

You're definitely right, Nancy is the true victim here. She's the one who is dead and cannot stand here to defend herself against these statements. However, the statements of her friends have trashed him and he IS here to be able to defend himself.

:clap::clap:
Well said!

[carolinalady]

If they were out of milk and juice and this is something she gave the kids, don't you think she would've been screaming about it to her friends and if she didn't have the money, gotten it from one of them that night? In other words, I can't see Nancy allowing the children to be without something they needed and asking him to pick it up on an early morning trip to the store especially when they weren't getting along.

What if the last of the juice & milk was used up when BC brought them home from the BBQ. I think it's more reasonable to go out in the morning (again this is a been there, done that scenario).

[panthera]

I don't know. If he was now responsible for his laundry, he could've waited and waited and waited to do laundry (would jive w/ the "yellow sheets").
I don't think the detergent is as big a thing as him going back out again for the juice. I could see him even having to buy his own detergent for his laundry, but not having the things the kids needed for breakfast there in the house, like I said, even if Nancy had to borrow some money from friends for it.

[Just the Fax]

I don't know. If he was now responsible for his laundry, he could've waited and waited and waited to do laundry (would jive w/ the "yellow sheets").

He could have just had a 'stinky day' :)

[runnermomof5]

And remember the news report that she was "partially clothed" or words to that effect? Does that mean that something was missing when she was found, like the jogging bra? Just a thought!

Wow, good question!

[raisincharlie]

BINGO! I have been thinking the same thing about the running bra. I doubt that she would have ran without one and if BC had to dress her in her running clothes before dropping her body off, that running bra would have been very difficult to put on her. IMO, more difficult than the shoes.

I think there is a definite reason Brad's lawyer was so adamant about getting that autopsy report. Other than the clothing found on her there would have been little a week ago to clear Brad - lab tests would not be back, bloodwork most likely not done. I do think he gave LE a pretty accurate picture of what Nancy was wearing and the autopsy report was to be his confirmation of that.

That being said, I am not at all sure Nancy was murdered as soon as she came home or shortly there after. In some of the affidavits it is indicated that she sometimes ran as early as 5:45 am. It is IMO possible that she indeed got herself up and got dressed and things then got out of control then. I know alot may think that is nuts because he would have had to dump the body in the daylight or very close to it - but it would not be the first time such has happened nor would it be the last. Much discussion here of how remote the area was in which Nancy was found.

[Just the Fax]

And remember the news report that she was "partially clothed" or words to that effect? Does that mean that something was missing when she was found, like the jogging bra? Just a thought!

I don't recall a report saying "partially clothed"

Some said Amanda Lamb used that term in her video report, but there is no transcript.
LE did not release that statement so i would doubt she would know that and report it.

[carolinalady]

He could have just had a 'stinky day' :)

The "Stink Day" did bring a smile to my face and certainly seemed reasonable to me. I've had a Stink Day or two myself. Sometimes, as a stay at home mom, it's hard to squeeze that shower into your day.

[panthera]

Wow, good question!
I really wish we could read the autopsy report! :(

[cochrngj]

I have lots of reading to catch up on... still have to read half of thread 10 before moving on to this one but I wanted to comment then go back and try to catch up. Like the rest of you, I too have an opinion! Boy are the opinions strong around here!

I’ve been an on-again, off-again lurker for about three years since the Natalee Holloway case. I came back here by way of Eyes when NC was found.

I want to preface my comments by saying I am not convinced that BC is the perp. If he is, IMO this happened by accident from an argument that got way out of control and crossed the line…. Not premeditated. There are many things about this case that just don’t seem right. So much of what is being said is hearsay and secondhand information.

Re the money issues, based upon the things said in the media and in the affidavits, NC sounds like a spoiled, overindulged SAHM that was rebelling when reigned in on her inability to control impulsive spending habits. She got $300 a week (or say BC says), she complained enough that friends AND her parents were giving her money, she sold her personal belongs, and she did odd jobs painting. IMO, NC manipulated the truth to her advantage. I have known many people, some very near and dear, who were the same. IMO the affidavits by friends served only to paint a bad picture of NC. Imagine if you will that you are not from an affluent family and are reading those affidavits. Lots of repetitive whining and mudslinging going on, and almost all of it is based upon hearsay. So little of it is firsthand knowledge that I question the actually witnessed incidents.

BC certainly sounded like a control freak, but what husband that is the sole supporter isn’t to some extent? I would have initiated some of the same steps had I realized I was in a state of financial stress. Actually, I did now that I think of it!

BC was an introvert; NC loved being the center of attention. Opposites attract; sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn’t.

What makes no sense to me it that if things were as bad as NC wanted her friends and parents to believe, why stick around? She is an educated woman. She was intelligent by all indications. She has a father that is in the business to help in such cases. Why did she stay there? To get the BMW X5, $2100 a month in CS, $50,000 lump sum, alimony, and the residual of the 401K after all else was paid off? This strikes me as a bit odd. Maybe it wasn’t as bad as described. But regardless, NC apparently felt trapped in a marriage to someone she did not want to be married to. But was she trapped by him or by selfish desires?

It will be interesting to see the evidence, if and when it comes to the surface for MSM to print. It will also be interesting to see how much of BC’s rebuttal can be verified in a positive manner. Just too little that is truly know; very little confirmed fact to base judgment upon. Question – I think I read somewhere that everyone in NC’s life will be ruled out as a POI – does that include the twin and BIL, mom and dad, other sis and BIL? Just curious.

This is just one more in a string of sad, sad cases. It is truly so sad that those two little girls have lost a mom who by all appearance adored them. Now they also stand to lose any resemblance of a relationship with their dad. So such. Such a shame. Why can’t adults get along and play fair?
You are one of the few to doubt Brad's guilt. I too am uncertain, or at least believe her death was accidental. If Nancy feared for her safety she should have left. Money was obviously of great concern/interest to both Brad and Nancy. I wonder how LE views the conflicting stories told in the affadavits. Hopefully the truth will come out sometime in the future.

[Just the Fax]

You are one of the few to doubt Brad's guilt. I too am uncertain, or at least believe her death was accidental. If Nancy feared for her safety she should have left. Money was obviously of great concern/interest to both Brad and Nancy. I wonder how LE views the conflicting stories told in the affadavits. Hopefully the truth will come out sometime in the future.


The ME ruled it a homicide, how could it be accidental ?

[carolinalady]

I don't recall a report saying "partially clothed"

Some said Amanda Lamb used that term in her video report, but there is no transcript.
LE did not release that statement so i would doubt she would know that and report it.

"Cooper, 34, was reported missing Saturday when she failed to meet up with a friend as planned. Two days later, authorities recovered her body, wearing little clothing, in an undeveloped subdivision less than three miles from her home. "

Full story: http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/3228887/

[Star12]

I don't recall a report saying "partially clothed"

Some said Amanda Lamb used that term in her video report, but there is no transcript.
LE did not release that statement so i would doubt she would know that and report it.

I remember hearing her say that, and thought it odd because LE had refused to answer the question of what she was wearing.

[Just the Fax]

"Cooper, 34, was reported missing Saturday when she failed to meet up with a friend as planned. Two days later, authorities recovered her body, wearing little clothing, in an undeveloped subdivision less than three miles from her home. "

Full story: http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/3228887/

thanks....'wearing little clothing' is not the same as 'partially clothed'.

Sounds like her jogging attire (as expected) or perhaps some of the clothes were in fact missing.

[carolinalady]

thanks....'wearing little clothing' is not the same as 'partially clothed'.

Sounds like her jogging attire or perhaps some of the clothes were in fact missing.

That's what I thought. I even thought that possibly she might have been in a jog bra and shorts (of course that goes against the tshirt mentioned by BC). There is a picture of her w/ one of the girls where she's wearing that type of outfit.

[panthera]

thanks....'wearing little clothing' is not the same as 'partially clothed'.

Sounds like her jogging attire (as expected) or perhaps some of the clothes were in fact missing.
I'm sorry I couldn't remember the exact words. I have the article bookmarked now for next time I have to reference it. :)

[Just the Fax]

I'm sorry I couldn't remember the exact words. I have the article bookmarked now for next time I have to reference it. :)

No problem....but there is a big difference:)

[reddress58]

He could have just had a 'stinky day' :)
You are TOO funny!

[Sewing_Buddy]

It was said Brad was forced to do his own laundry since April, as Nancy refused to handle his.

one friend said his sheets were 'yellow' from not being changed :eek:


How did I miss the "yellow sheets" quote? Which friend said that? My friends and I never discuss how often we launder our sheets and I've never seen the sheets on some of my best friends' beds!
What kind of friend discusses that topic???

[runnermomof5]

thanks....'wearing little clothing' is not the same as 'partially clothed'.

Sounds like her jogging attire (as expected) or perhaps some of the clothes were in fact missing.

I have wondered about the jogging bra since the very beginning.
In his affidavit, BC seems to have addressed so many of the concerns that have been posted on here. I am glad that this has not been discussed previously, or he probably would have stated in his affidavit that NC jogged without a jogging bra, just to cover his tracks. :rolleyes:

[reddress58]

That's what I thought. I even thought that possibly she might have been in a jog bra and shorts (of course that goes against the tshirt mentioned by BC). There is a picture of her w/ one of the girls where she's wearing that type of outfit.
Remember guys, I saw her running recently. She wore a t-shirt...not just shorts and a jog bra. (which is what I usually wear in the heat)

[Just the Fax]

How did I miss the "yellow sheets" quote? Which friend said that? My friends and I never discuss how often we launder our sheets and I've never seen the sheets on some of my best friends' beds!
What kind of friend discusses that topic???


Jennifer Fetterolf

"Nancy told me on 7-8-08 that his sheets were a yellowish-brown color and the bathroom hadn't been cleaned since she cleaned it " :eek:

[Just the Fax]

Talk about airing your dirty laundry to the entire world

[reddress58]

I know it may have sounded like I was joking, but I really am curious how all of this happened with children at home. If NC was up in the morning, then most likely the children would be up and she getting them fed and clothed before they were off to paint. It the dirty deed was performed late at night and BC had to dispose of the body right after daybreak, the chance of the girls awakening and wandering out of the house was HUGE! If this was even semi-premeditated (meaning he actually thought it through enough to cover his rear to still not be arrested at this point of the investigation) he had to think of this scenerio. So he may very well have given the girls some kind of medication to assure they stayed asleep in the am. Should be a question they ask the oldest. Of course, no one would have thought to test them the next day becasue NC wasn't found right away; and any medication in the blood stream would have worn off at a later date. Plus, Bella has allergies, so at least her medicince could be explained.

Any thoughts on this?

[reddress58]

Talk about airing your dirty laundry to the entire world
You, too, are too funny!

[carolinalady]

Remember that benadryl has the reverse effect on some kids. It makes them wired.

[reddress58]

Remember that benadryl has the reverse effect on some kids. It makes them wired.
It could have been something other than Benadryl if this were pre-meditated. I bring this up only because it seems the majority of us believe he's guilty but haven't quite decided to what degree this was planned out. It's amazing the skill he's shown covering his tracts using the grocery store trips and the phone; and obviously staging her body to take the heat off him. Yet, to accomplish all of this so effortlessly you would think he had considered beforehand the possibility of the children waking up. If it were a crime of passion and not pre-meditated, then he is one smart cookie to come up with the alibies he has in such a short time period...and performing all these task with the clock ticking waiting for that first sleepy head to come out of her room! I would have thrown up with stress if I were him!

[citygirl]

Talk about airing your dirty laundry to the entire world

Lord have mercy on us all.
I've been out of the loop and catching up.
Just read the affidavits in the custody hearing.
I think he deserves a life sentence soley for being mean and indifferent to his wife and children.
His parent's should serve time for aiding and abetting.
When all the evidence is in and he is convicted, he should be entitled to all the amentities provided on death row.....forever.
Hey, just sayin'....and just my humble opinion.
Nice to see you JTF and Raisin.:blowkiss:

[jilly]

I can't tell you how many crimes I've heard about where cell phone records ultimately play a large part in helping to nail a suspect.

Otoh - because of this, these guys are getting smarter because of hearing about this are turning their phones off/using disposable phones. I'm thinking of jason young here.

Thanks for your info on the phones - I was happy to read what you colored in red.

[lunarmodule]

I believe I read that tomorrow is Grand Jury day. What are the chances the DA will present the case? Any signs or indications to look for? There has been so little information released at this point, and you know they know a lot more. Does anyone know what time the Grand Jury meets and what the typical protocol might be?

[boxy]

Hi all. I've been lurking for a while and just got approved to post. I posted the results of a 5k race that Nancy ran in June over on the "Nancy, the runner" thread". She was with Carey Clark in that race.

Why haven't we heard anything from Carey? Did she have plans to run with Nancy that morning? If so, how was that arranged and when was the last communication about it? I would think they would have confirmed that morning unless it was a regular thing. Carey's condo is about 2 miles away by road, perhaps shorter by trail but it would take at most 20 min to jog over there, so the time window would be very narrow.

[carolinalady]

Hi all. I've been lurking for a while and just got approved to post. I posted the results of a 5k race that Nancy ran in June over on the "Nancy, the runner" thread". She was with Carey Clark in that race.

Why haven't we heard anything from Carey? Did she have plans to run with Nancy that morning? If so, how was that arranged and when was the last communication about it? I would think they would have confirmed that morning unless it was a regular thing. Carey's condo is about 2 miles away by road, perhaps shorter by trail but it would take at most 20 min to jog over there, so the time window would be very narrow.

Which direction was her condo, towards or away from the location her body was found?

[Just the Fax]

I believe I read that tomorrow is Grand Jury day. What are the chances the DA will present the case? Any signs or indications to look for? There has been so little information released at this point, and you know they know a lot more. Does anyone know what time the Grand Jury meets and what the typical protocol might be?

In NC, the GJ indictment is just based on what the cop presents as probable cause. In Wake county, the presentation averages <5 minutes.

I would be shocked if they are ready yet....unless they have DNA back from a private lab that shows his DNA under her fingernails (for example)

I would guess we are looking at a month or 2 before an arrest. This DA wants his ducks lined up before he pulls the trigger, especially in a very high profile case.

[CyberPro]

Hi all. I've been lurking for a while and just got approved to post. I posted the results of a 5k race that Nancy ran in June over on the "Nancy, the runner" thread". She was with Carey Clark in that race.

Why haven't we heard anything from Carey? Did she have plans to run with Nancy that morning? If so, how was that arranged and when was the last communication about it? I would think they would have confirmed that morning unless it was a regular thing. Carey's condo is about 2 miles away by road, perhaps shorter by trail but it would take at most 20 min to jog over there, so the time window would be very narrow.

I don't recall where I read it previously, but I read that Carrie is a real person, but she had no plans to run on Saturday, with or without NC, or at least that was the way it read.

CyberPro

[boxy]

Which direction was her condo, towards or away from the location her body was found?

Away. The condo is off of Kildaire Farm Rd. Not sure that matters though as it appears pretty clear she was not killed at the site where her body was found.

[carolinalady]

I don't recall where I ead it previously, but I read that Carrie is a real person, but she had no plans to run on Saturday, with or without NC, or at least that was the way it read.

CyberPro

I don't remember them talking to her. I remember Jessica Adam stating that she wasn't aware of a run and that normally Carey, Nancy, and Jessica informed each other of their training runs.

[carolinalady]

Away. The condo is off of Kildaire Farm Rd. Not sure that matters though as it appears pretty clear she was not killed at the site where her body was found.

How does it appear pretty clear? Cause of death has not been released and we don't know what was seized from the house.

[panthera]

In NC, the GJ indictment is just based on what the cop presents as probable cause. In Wake county, the presentation averages <5 minutes.

I would be shocked if they are ready yet....unless they have DNA back from a private lab that shows his DNA under her fingernails (for example)

I would guess we are looking at a month or 2 before an arrest. This DA wants his ducks lined up before he pulls the trigger, especially in a very high profile case.
I agree about the DA and unless they've got a lot of evidence that's being kept under wraps for now, it doesn't seem there will be an arrest anytime soon. MOO :)

[SleuthyGal]

I would be shocked if they are ready yet....unless they have DNA back from a private lab that shows his DNA under her fingernails (for example)

I would guess we are looking at a month or 2 before an arrest.

agreed! long way to go still.

[Just the Fax]

How does it appear pretty clear? Cause of death has not been released and we don't know what was seized from the house.

Lets just say 'best odds are' she was killed elsewhere and transported there.

[boxy]

How does it appear pretty clear? Cause of death has not been released and we don't know what was seized from the house.

The investigation is being conducted by the Cary PD. If they thought she was killed at the site she was found, it would be the jurisdiction of the Wake Co. Sheriff.

[Just the Fax]

agreed! long way to go still.

With a mountain of damning CE, we have waited almost 21 months for jason Young to be cuffed by the same DA :mad:

[carolinalady]

The investigation is being conducted by the Cary PD. If they thought she was killed at the site she was found, it would be the jurisdiction of the Wake Co. Sheriff.

I just remember from the news conference when the body was found is that if it was Nancy Cooper that it would be handled by CPD and if it was not it would be handled by the sheriff's dept. This was before they even determined it was a homicide (nothing from the ME at this point).

[SleuthyGal]

With a mountain of damning CE, we have waited almost 21 months for jason Young to be cuffed by the same DA :mad:

I know. But there's no use in trying to bring a case in if you don't think you have enough evidence to convict, since you only get ONE shot. Unfortunately (and fortunately) at that point it becomes not about what happened, but about what you can prove or clearly infer in court to convince others.

[Just the Fax]

The investigation is being conducted by the Cary PD. If they thought she was killed at the site she was found, it would be the jurisdiction of the Wake Co. Sheriff.


There would be no point in WCSO starting a new investigation when the case was clearly being handled by Cary police. Since she disappeared from Cary, it made sense to let them continue the investigation.....these departments work together all the time.

[carolinalady]

With a mountain of damning CE, we have waited almost 21 months for jason Young to be cuffed by the same DA :mad:

It took a long time for Ann Miller to be brought in,too. Eventually she was (thank goodness!).

[Zeke]

Shoelaces: I'm sure her friends could tell you whether the loops laid horizontal or vertical. She could tie either way depending on who taught her and where they sat when they were teaching her to tie.

Hi, not to throw a wrench into the possible evidence in the running shoes laces, but as a runner, I haven't used regular laces for years. Many runners are using different options, like http://www.locklaces.com.

[raisincharlie]

The investigation is being conducted by the Cary PD. If they thought she was killed at the site she was found, it would be the jurisdiction of the Wake Co. Sheriff.

Agreed - key word jurisdiction.

[Just the Fax]

Agreed - key word jurisdiction.

If that's the case, there is evidence she was killed somewhere in Cary because the Cary police took over the day the body was identified as Nancy.

I don't think they have such hard evidence (blood or her clothing found in cary, ect)....but who knows ?

[jilly]

It took a long time for Ann Miller to be brought in,too. Eventually she was (thank goodness!).

The only reason she was imo is because her friend Willard commit suicide and his lawyer (Gammon) was ordered to state what Willard had divulged about Ann's involvement in the murder.

[jilly]

Hi, not to throw a wrench into the possible evidence in the running shoes laces, but as a runner, I haven't used regular laces for years. Many runners are using different options, like http://www.locklaces.com.

Wow. Very interesting Zeke. Thanks for this. I'm continuing to learn so much from this forum. Also - welcome!

[raisincharlie]

If that's the case, there is evidence she was killed somewhere in Cary because the Cary police took over the day the body was identified as Nancy.

I don't think they have such hard evidence (blood or her clothing found in cary, ect)....but who knows ?


Perhaps there was none of this at the location of her body either, which would rule out she was murdered there. No signs of a struggle at the scene is also possible. Dependent on COD and considering the swiftness of declaring it a homicide, the manner of death must have been rather obvious I would think. LE could have also seen something in the home when Brad invited them in previous days that raised an alert, possibly resulting in the soon to come search warrant, now sealed.

[Just the Fax]

Perhaps there was none of this at the location of her body either, which would rule out she was murdered there. No signs of a struggle at the scene is also possible. Dependent on COD and considering the swiftness of declaring it a homicide, the manner of death must have been rather obvious I would think. LE could have also seen something in the home when Brad invited them in previous days that raised an alert, possibly resulting in the soon to come search warrant, now sealed.


Like all of us, it was likely apparent to all the cops her body was dumped there. As many posters have confirmed, it is not remotely feasible to think she was jogging down very busy Holly Springs road.

The autopsy will be interesting for sure.
My preliminary vote for COD is strangulation (bare hands or ligature) with maybe some evidence of blunt force trauma.

[panthera]

If that's the case, there is evidence she was killed somewhere in Cary because the Cary police took over the day the body was identified as Nancy.

I don't think they have such hard evidence (blood or her clothing found in cary, ect)....but who knows ?
If Brad killed her, it probably was strangulation or smothering which wouldn't give LE much forensic evidence. The only thing I'm curious about are the items LE took from his house. One bag seemed to have a somewhat large item in it, as I recall. Just MOO :)

[Just the Fax]

If Brad killed her, it probably was strangulation or smothering which wouldn't give LE much forensic evidence. The only thing I'm curious about are the items LE took from his house. One bag seemed to have a somewhat large item in it, as I recall. Just MOO :)

I too wondered what that was ?
A floor plant ? Floor lamp?

We know they grabbed the standard stuff...computers, answering machine, cell phones, financial and estate records, photos, notes and other items of interest from his office.

[panthera]

I too wondered what that was ?
A floor plant ? Floor lamp?

We know they grabbed the standard stuff...computers, answering machine, cell phones, financial and estate records, photos, notes and other items of interest from his office.
At first I was thinking it was something that might have been used as a weapon but I really can't see him bludgeoning her and then putting her in the back of his car to take her to where she was found. Too risky for transferring blood evidence, imo. If only we knew how she was killed!

[Just the Fax]

There is a reason the cops are not telling us the COD and there is also a reason why Brad and his attorney wants them to.

[Star12]

At first I was thinking it was something that might have been used as a weapon but I really can't see him bludgeoning her and then putting her in the back of his car to take her to where she was found. Too risky for transferring blood evidence, imo. If only we knew how she was killed!

My guess is that long thing was a shovel.

[panthera]

My guess is that long thing was a shovel.
That's interesting ~ something I hadn't thought of!

[WSTarheel]

My guess is that long thing was a shovel.

I was thinking stand up vacuum cleaner.

[Raebie]

I'm leaning towards an impromptu fight that got out of control and she ended up dead. Did she trip & hit her head on a table, did he land on devastating blow?

We'll know soon enough.

[WSTarheel]

>> If only we knew how she was killed!

I have no first hand knowledge but I live in the area and keep hearing the rumor of stab wounds. That's the rumor circulating around BC's workplace, etc.

[panthera]

>> If only we knew how she was killed!

I have no first hand knowledge but I live in the area and keep hearing the rumor of stab wounds. That's the rumor circulating around BC's workplace, etc.
OMG ~ if that is true, her body would definitely have to be wrapped in something like bedding to be transported, and where is that?

[OtisCampbell]

That's interesting ~ something I hadn't thought of!

You didn't think that if he hit her with an object that it may have been a shovel? Why would you? There's been zero evidence that she was even struck by an object. You find it interesting that someone thinks she was struck with a shovel?

If it turns out that she was in fact struck by an object it could be any of hundreds of objects.

It could have been a hammer.
It could have been a vase.
It could have been a candle holder.
It could have been a wall clock.
It could have been...........
I'm tired now, so I think I'll stop.

[NCBanker]

>> If only we knew how she was killed!

I have no first hand knowledge but I live in the area and keep hearing the rumor of stab wounds. That's the rumor circulating around BC's workplace, etc.

That would certainly make more sense of LE getting samples of his DNA. If the COD was strangulation, there's typically no DNA, unless she scratched him.

Remember in the rebuttal affidavit from Brad that he stated Nancy phoned him while he was out Saturday morning to tell him to buy an additional item. If that is substantiated, it certainly changes a lot of our theories regarding time of death being around midnight.

To Otis: We apologize that our level of sleuthing doesn't meet with your approval. Unlike the rest of us, you're obviously educated beyond your intelligence.

[panthera]

:couch:

[EntreNous]

Wow, Otis, I thought that was what this forum was for. Ya know, sleuthing and whatnot. I think there are a lot of really bright people here with some interesting ideas. I find the theories and insights fascinating personally.

I also thought the large item might be an upright vacuum cleaner/sweeper.

[boxy]

There would be no point in WCSO starting a new investigation when the case was clearly being handled by Cary police. Since she disappeared from Cary, it made sense to let them continue the investigation.....these departments work together all the time.

That would be logical and you may be correct but not what I remember hearing from the news media. The CPD were doing a missing person case. A murder case is substantially different. I just hope whoever is doing the investigation does a good job.

[CyberPro]

<SNIP>
The problem with this forum is that there's very little logical thinking.


I disagree! I agree there IS some speculation, but it IS logical, based upon the information that is available. I make a living by logical thinking, so I think I am qualified to recognize it when I see it.

Now, it might well be that we will receive different information that will render some of these theories invalid, but nothing on the face of the theories advanced to this point are absent at least some degree of logical thinking.

So, if you seek logic, let's examine the facts, as we understand them thus far.

1. Nancy was murdered
2. She was found in a location that was not listed in her typical running paths.
3. She was seen leaving the BBQ on Friday, and there were no reports of anyone seeing her after this, other than BC.
4. If she did leave to run, the manner of her leaving was atypical of her normal pattern.
5. She did not arrive at an appointment that she was scheduled to attend, and she was noted as being punctual.
6. She did not inform anyone that she would not attend the appointment.
7. The last person who reported seeing her alive was BC.
8. The marriage was troubled, and reportedly on the verge of collapse
9. BC did not report her as being overdue, even when she was much later getting back than she planned to be.

Now, this does not all completely add up to BC being guilty, but his actions do not seem to be in line with what many people would do in a similar situation. This, coupled with the fact that she lived in a fairly safe area, would have had to be abducted in daylight, and dumped in daylight, and the closest people to the victim are always under suspicion, it seems completely logical that he receives a very close inspection, unless you have a better suspect.

CyberPro

[Just the Fax]

That would certainly make more sense of LE getting samples of his DNA. If the COD was strangulation, there's typically no DNA, unless she scratched him.

Remember in the rebuttal affidavit from Brad that he stated Nancy phoned him while he was out Saturday morning to tell him to buy an additional item. If that is substantiated, it certainly changes a lot of our theories regarding time of death being around midnight.

To Otis: We apologize that our level of sleuthing doesn't meet with your approval. Unlike the rest of us, you're obviously educated beyond your intelligence.

NCBanker, if there was a stabbing, you know there would be a flood of blood. Hard to imagine him cleaning all beyond the reach of luminol.

Concerning the 6:40 am call from "Nancy"...we speculated he placed that call from the home phone to his cell right before he left for the 2nd trip to the store....5 minutes away.

[boxy]

One of the pictures in the Pictures thread has the outline of a body near the site where the body was found. Is that red spray paint or has that been photoshopped onto the image? If the latter, how is the location of the body known?

[Star12]

The reason I said shovel is that the one time BC was out searching, he found and pointed out a construction shovel to those with whom he was searching.

The long item in the bag did not appear to be overly heavy nor bulky. Perhaps a shovel?

[carolinalady]

SNIP



Now, this does not all completely add up to BC being guilty, but his actions do not seem to be in line with what many people would do in a similar situation. This, coupled with the fact that she lived in a fairly safe area, would have had to be abducted in daylight, and dumped in daylight, and the closest people to the victim are always under suspicion, it seems completely logical that he receives a very close inspection, unless you have a better suspect.

CyberPro

The problem is that there is no norm for how people act in these situations.

I do agree that the closest people are always the first to be looked at and either determined to be a suspect or cleared so the investigation can move on.

I wish I could remember one of the initial news reports of this case. A reporter mentioned how concerned BC seemed about his wife's whereabouts. It was prior to his news conference just prior to her body being found.

Can any other locals remember this report? I honestly cannot remember which channel it was on as the case was mentioned on ALL of the local stations.

[Just the Fax]

That would be logical and you may be correct but not what I remember hearing from the news media. The CPD were doing a missing person case. A murder case is substantially different. I just hope whoever is doing the investigation does a good job.

What did you hear from the media ?
They certainly did not say the Cary cops 'knew' she was killed in Cary.

[Just the Fax]

One of the pictures in the Pictures thread has the outline of a body near the site where the body was found. Is that red spray paint or has that been photoshopped onto the image? If the latter, how is the location of the body known?

Well I posted the pic and I posted the detailed explanation today (guess you missed it)

I added the red body....it was directly over 2 spays of flowers that were laid in that spot

[Star12]

>> If only we knew how she was killed!

I have no first hand knowledge but I live in the area and keep hearing the rumor of stab wounds. That's the rumor circulating around BC's workplace, etc.

Wow. That goes to blood evidence. (Too bad we don't have the bleach anymore). The only problem with that is, if the home were the site there would be a lot of blood, and there would be blood in the transfer vehicle. And that does not appear to be the case.

I have not heard [I]any[I]one talking about the case.

[citygirl]

I've been out of the loop for a week. Not a frequent poster, but reading, reading, reading. Has the bleach and detergent purchase gone by the wayside? Also the video from 4 a.m.? Where is the mother that posted that info? Has she stopped posting?

[Just the Fax]

>> If only we knew how she was killed!

I have no first hand knowledge but I live in the area and keep hearing the rumor of stab wounds. That's the rumor circulating around BC's workplace, etc.

How would people at Cisco know (except Brad of course) anything about the cause or manner of death ?

This is under seal and only the NCME , the DA and LE knows this information.

I would say this is a rumor based strictly on speculation.

[Just the Fax]

I've been out of the loop for a week. Not a frequent poster, but reading, reading, reading. Has the bleach and detergent purchase gone by the wayside? Also the video from 4 a.m.? Where is the mother that posted that info? Has she stopped posting?

Hi, Brad said it laundry detergent, not 'bleach"

[Star12]

How would people at Cisco know anything about the cause or manner of death ?

This is under seal and only the NCME , the DA and LE knows this information.

I would say this is a rumor based strictly on speculation.

ITA with you, JTF, and it just doesn't make sense with what we know from the aftermath.

[carolinalady]

That would be logical and you may be correct but not what I remember hearing from the news media. The CPD were doing a missing person case. A murder case is substantially different. I just hope whoever is doing the investigation does a good job.

As I stated before, what I remember the news media reporting (and this was prior to ME ID'ing and pronouncing it a homicide) was that if the body that was found was determined to be Nancy Cooper, then CPD would handle the investigation. If it was not Nancy, then the Wake Co. Sheriff's Dept. would handle it. I, too, took it to mean that because they had the open case on her, they would handle it.

[boxy]

Well I posted the pic and I posted the detailed explanation today (guess you missed it)

I added the red body....it was directly over 2 spays of flowers that were laid in that spot

Thanks and sorry I missed it. If this info is not already in the Picture thread, perhaps it could be added.

I would infer that the exact location where the body was found is not known to the public so the location of the flowers may also be inaccurate.

[jilly]

:couch:

:rotfl::floorlaugh:Cracked me right up!

[citygirl]

Hi, Brad said it laundry detergent, not 'bleach"

What about the 4 a.m. video?
Has that poster been back to clarify?
Sorry, I know people like me are a pain in the butt. Just trying to get the fax straight.:)

[Just the Fax]

What about the 4 a.m. video?
Has that poster been back to clarify?
Sorry, I know people like me are a pain in the butt. Just trying to get the fax straight.:)

She never mentioned it again.
Brad said he was at the store at 6:15 am and again at 6:45 am.
If he was there at 4 am, I imagine the cops would have cuffed him by now.

[citygirl]

How would people at Cisco know (except Brad of course) anything about the cause or manner of death ?

This is under seal and only the NCME , the DA and LE knows this information.

I would say this is a rumor based strictly on speculation.

I think that started with Dr. Baden, purely by accident though.:bang:

[boxy]

As I stated before, what I remember the news media reporting (and this was prior to ME ID'ing and pronouncing it a homicide) was that if the body that was found was determined to be Nancy Cooper, then CPD would handle the investigation. If it was not Nancy, then the Wake Co. Sheriff's Dept. would handle it. I, too, took it to mean that because they had the open case on her, they would handle it.

This is slightly different from what I remember hearing some time after her body was found. The news person said LE had not said whether she was killed where the body was found or not and then went on to say what I said initially about the case being handled by the CPD implied death thought to be in Cary. I could have misunderstood or the media person could be wrong. Wish I could find that again.

[sues]

What did you hear from the media ?
They certainly did not say the Cary cops 'knew' she was killed in Cary.

After NC's body was found, but before it was identified, Wake Cnty police were in charge of the investigation, but the media reported that if the body turned out to be NC's, the CPD would take over. Perhaps if the location of death is not known, the police from the victim's home always take over?

If that is the case, then it would tell us that they didn't think the murder happened where the body was, but they might not actually know where the murder occurred.

[Just the Fax]

I think that started with Dr. Baden, purely by accident though.:bang:

He has a way of screwing things up....blabbing with little or no factual background.

Remember the knurling marks on Michelle :rolleyes:

[jumpstreet]

Well I posted the pic and I posted the detailed explanation today (guess you missed it)

I added the red body....it was directly over 2 spays of flowers that were laid in that spot

Thanks to JTF for the photos from the site.

I too had a question on them: Is the location of the imposed red outline based (only) on the location of the flowers you saw there, or some other info?

When looking at the WRAL footage (and other clips from the time after discovery), it was unclear to me if the exact location was between the road and the water, or on the *other* side of the water (ie, with the water being between the road and where she was found (on or near the white erosion tarp))

It seems (from the footage/photos) that there were several LE officers at both these spots, so it was unclear to me. (Or perhaps she was actually IN the water (in the middle), and they were just examining both sides?).

If she was on the far side of the holding reservoir (on or near the white erosion tarp),