Nancy Cooper, 34, of Cary, N.C. #11

[christine2448]

Please continue GENERAL discussions here. Look around Nancy has her own forum (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=165), there are several threads started on specific topics to try and stay organized.


Links to previous and similar threads can be found toward the bottom of the page.


Newbies.....

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y171/christine2448/WELCOMETOWSBLUE.gif

I am sad such a tragedy is bringing us all together.

I advise everyone to read the RULES of WS, Long (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=66869)and Short Version (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=66872).

[Bob&Bob]

Pedicures
http://art2mis.blogspot.com/2006/09/rossi-pasta.html


"The only way we beat the heat here in NC is by running at 6:00 am." (https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=31717822&postID=115439707438489110)

https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=31717822&postID=115439707438489110

[pamlet]

Pedicures
http://art2mis.blogspot.com/2006/09/rossi-pasta.html


"The only way we beat the heat here in NC is by running at 6:00 am." (https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=31717822&postID=115439707438489110)

https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=31717822&postID=115439707438489110


Now THAT is an interesting blog... gives you a little peek into the social life around there huh?

[carolinalady]

Just wanted to bring this to the new thread:



Originally Posted by LillyRush
The beach trip included Mike and Clea Morwick and their children, along with Nancy and her kids. The only person who wasn't there was Brad.

In the affidavits submitted by Nancy's parents, Clea Morwick (Mike's wife) has her own separate affidavit where she discusses the very same beach trip and how she thought it was odd too that Brad didn't even try to be there for the weekend part of the trip.

edited to add that Clea Morwick's affidavit is the 3rd one, right after Jessica Adams and her husband.
Read this one: http://www.wral.com/asset/news/local...y,_friends.pdf

Michael Morwick's is on page 24, line #8. It says Brad & Clea were not there.

[Bob&Bob]

Now THAT is an interesting blog... gives you a little peek into the social life around there huh?


I thought it was very interesting reading.

I have an affinity for mint, yogurt and grape leaves.

[LillyRush]

Carolina Lady, I see where they (Mike Morwick and NC, w/o either spouse) went on one out of the many family beach trips together. I believe this is the one that Clea Morwick cites when she discusses how Nancy came back to the house all messed up and the bugs. That seems to fit the timeframe for that trip. So, it doesn't seem like Mike's wife was unaware of it.

All the others that they describe seem to be with them all together, with Brad being the only person notably absent. Clea also mentions that they, all of them minus Brad again, were supposed to go on vacation again during the 1st week of August.

It's interesting that Mike mentions that in his opinion Brad may have been uncomfortable around he and his wife Clea due to their knowledge of his affair. Interesting in that Jessica Adams says practically the opposite and that she felt Nancy was uncomfortable around the Morwicks. That's a whole lot of contradictory wierdness and uncomfortableness going around there.

[mom2boys]

I thought it was very interesting reading.


Yes very interesting. Check this out...it's not hard to figurre out who Mr. B and Mrs. N is

Sunday, November 12, 2006
Iron Man
Congratulations to Mr. B! Last week, he competed in his first Iron Man triathlon, and finished in under 13 hours, which is an excellent time. Last night, Ms. N threw a party to celebrate his achievement, and to celebrate that she'll get a little bit more hub-time for a while. Except that he's already signed up to do two more of these crazy races in the next 12 months. And he has a full-time job and is getting his MBA at night school and has two small daughters. I thought I was tired...obviously I'm just not doing enough.

[carolinalady]

Carolina Lady, I see where they (Mike Morwick and NC, w/o either spouse) went on one out of the many family beach trips together. I believe this is the one that Clea Morwick cites when she discusses how Nancy came back to the house all messed up and the bugs. That seems to fit the timeframe for that trip. So, it doesn't seem like Mike's wife was unaware of it.

All the others that they describe seem to be with them all together, with Brad being the only person notably absent. Clea also mentions that they, all of them minus Brad again, were supposed to go on vacation again during the 1st week of August.

It's interesting that Mike mentions that in his opinion Brad may have been uncomfortable around he and his wife Clea due to their knowledge of his affair. Interesting in that Jessica Adams says practically the opposite and that she felt Nancy was uncomfortable around the Morwicks. That's a whole lot of contradictory wierdness and uncomfortableness going around there.

Nancy was with the girls and her family in Hilton Head (I think) and came home to the bugs and filth.

Brad did have an answer to why he did not go on the beach trip w/ the Morwicks in his rebuttal. He stated that he couldn't get off work (again, if he put in a request someone should be able to confirm his request). He also said that they had a previously scheduled vacation for the week immediately following the time w/ the Morwicks (again, should be verifiable).

I do find the discrepancies between all the affidavits very interesting (& confusing!!!).

[carolinalady]

Yes very interesting. Check this out...it's not hard to figurre out who Mr. B and Mrs. N is

Sunday, November 12, 2006
Iron Man
Congratulations to Mr. B! Last week, he competed in his first Iron Man triathlon, and finished in under 13 hours, which is an excellent time. Last night, Ms. N threw a party to celebrate his achievement, and to celebrate that she'll get a little bit more hub-time for a while. Except that he's already signed up to do two more of these crazy races in the next 12 months. And he has a full-time job and is getting his MBA at night school and has two small daughters. I thought I was tired...obviously I'm just not doing enough.

Very interesting indeed!

[luckyme]

wow! Who her has a change of heart about the husband? I know i do and want to see evidence!! jmo

[christine2448]

know i do and want to see evidence!! jmo


From yer post to Gods ears!

[Jaydee0158]

I have lots of reading to catch up on... still have to read half of thread 10 before moving on to this one but I wanted to comment then go back and try to catch up. Like the rest of you, I too have an opinion! Boy are the opinions strong around here!

I’ve been an on-again, off-again lurker for about three years since the Natalee Holloway case. I came back here by way of Eyes when NC was found.

I want to preface my comments by saying I am not convinced that BC is the perp. If he is, IMO this happened by accident from an argument that got way out of control and crossed the line…. Not premeditated. There are many things about this case that just don’t seem right. So much of what is being said is hearsay and secondhand information.

Re the money issues, based upon the things said in the media and in the affidavits, NC sounds like a spoiled, overindulged SAHM that was rebelling when reigned in on her inability to control impulsive spending habits. She got $300 a week (or say BC says), she complained enough that friends AND her parents were giving her money, she sold her personal belongs, and she did odd jobs painting. IMO, NC manipulated the truth to her advantage. I have known many people, some very near and dear, who were the same. IMO the affidavits by friends served only to paint a bad picture of NC. Imagine if you will that you are not from an affluent family and are reading those affidavits. Lots of repetitive whining and mudslinging going on, and almost all of it is based upon hearsay. So little of it is firsthand knowledge that I question the actually witnessed incidents.

BC certainly sounded like a control freak, but what husband that is the sole supporter isn’t to some extent? I would have initiated some of the same steps had I realized I was in a state of financial stress. Actually, I did now that I think of it!

BC was an introvert; NC loved being the center of attention. Opposites attract; sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn’t.

What makes no sense to me it that if things were as bad as NC wanted her friends and parents to believe, why stick around? She is an educated woman. She was intelligent by all indications. She has a father that is in the business to help in such cases. Why did she stay there? To get the BMW X5, $2100 a month in CS, $50,000 lump sum, alimony, and the residual of the 401K after all else was paid off? This strikes me as a bit odd. Maybe it wasn’t as bad as described. But regardless, NC apparently felt trapped in a marriage to someone she did not want to be married to. But was she trapped by him or by selfish desires?

It will be interesting to see the evidence, if and when it comes to the surface for MSM to print. It will also be interesting to see how much of BC’s rebuttal can be verified in a positive manner. Just too little that is truly know; very little confirmed fact to base judgment upon. Question – I think I read somewhere that everyone in NC’s life will be ruled out as a POI – does that include the twin and BIL, mom and dad, other sis and BIL? Just curious.

This is just one more in a string of sad, sad cases. It is truly so sad that those two little girls have lost a mom who by all appearance adored them. Now they also stand to lose any resemblance of a relationship with their dad. So such. Such a shame. Why can’t adults get along and play fair?

[luckyme]

I have lots of reading to catch up on... still have to read half of thread 10 before moving on to this one but I wanted to comment then go back and try to catch up. Like the rest of you, I too have an opinion! Boy are the opinions strong around here!

I’ve been an on-again, off-again lurker for about three years since the Natalee Holloway case. I came back here by way of Eyes when NC was found.

I want to preface my comments by saying I am not convinced that BC is the perp. If he is, IMO this happened by accident from an argument that got way out of control and crossed the line…. Not premeditated. There are many things about this case that just don’t seem right. So much of what is being said is hearsay and secondhand information.

Re the money issues, based upon the things said in the media and in the affidavits, NC sounds like a spoiled, overindulged SAHM that was rebelling when reigned in on her inability to control impulsive spending habits. She got $300 a week (or say BC says), she complained enough that friends AND her parents were giving her money, she sold her personal belongs, and she did odd jobs painting. IMO, NC manipulated the truth to her advantage. I have known many people, some very near and dear, who were the same. IMO the affidavits by friends served only to paint a bad picture of NC. Imagine if you will that you are not from an affluent family and are reading those affidavits. Lots of repetitive whining and mudslinging going on, and almost all of it is based upon hearsay. So little of it is firsthand knowledge that I question the actually witnessed incidents.

BC certainly sounded like a control freak, but what husband that is the sole supporter isn’t to some extent? I would have initiated some of the same steps had I realized I was in a state of financial stress. Actually, I did now that I think of it!

BC was an introvert; NC loved being the center of attention. Opposites attract; sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn’t.

What makes no sense to me it that if things were as bad as NC wanted her friends and parents to believe, why stick around? She is an educated woman. She was intelligent by all indications. She has a father that is in the business to help in such cases. Why did she stay there? To get the BMW X5, $2100 a month in CS, $50,000 lump sum, alimony, and the residual of the 401K after all else was paid off? This strikes me as a bit odd. Maybe it wasn’t as bad as described. But regardless, NC apparently felt trapped in a marriage to someone she did not want to be married to. But was she trapped by him or by selfish desires?

It will be interesting to see the evidence, if and when it comes to the surface for MSM to print. It will also be interesting to see how much of BC’s rebuttal can be verified in a positive manner. Just too little that is truly know; very little confirmed fact to base judgment upon. Question – I think I read somewhere that everyone in NC’s life will be ruled out as a POI – does that include the twin and BIL, mom and dad, other sis and BIL? Just curious.

This is just one more in a string of sad, sad cases. It is truly so sad that those two little girls have lost a mom who by all appearance adored them. Now they also stand to lose any resemblance of a relationship with their dad. So such. Such a shame. Why can’t adults get along and play fair?

Thats my opinion! Im still not conviced he is the murder though! I was one of the guilties! Im not so sure now! JMO:confused:

[SleuthyGal]

Yes, how IRONIC that this "spoiled, spendthrift, SAHM, who was just in it for the lump sum, the BMW, the $2100/month" happened in that coinky-dink way to be murdered just when her separation was really getting legs.

Well the way you describe her out-of-control spending and personality and narcissistic tendencies to be 'the center of attention,' she absolutely deserved this, eh?

Well, let THAT be a lesson to all those OTHER "spendthrift, out-of-control wives who don't know their place." Shape up or find yourself dead by that random thug/stranger who apparently hates spoiled wives and follows them around to make sure justice is doled out on behalf of henpecked husbands everywhere. Randomly of course. Not instigated by anyone or anything but their own self-centered ways.

@@

[fran]

I think we should ask Nancy if she was embellishing and IF her husband was really as bad as she told everyone.

Oh, wait, she's dead.

She was MURDERED!

Hmmmm...........abusive husband who said he wasn't,..........wife who said she was abused (in other words) and now she's dead.

Decisions, decisions,........

JMHO
fran

[Jaydee0158]

Thats my opinion! Im still not conviced he is the murder though! I was one of the guilties! Im not so sure now! JMO:confused:

I was suspicious in the very beginning b/c of all the wives that have been turning up dead, but after some of the things starting coming out in the MSM, I really was not convinced that he did this. I'll reserve my judgment for more facts....
JMO, too.

[mom2boys]

Regardless of whether she was a spender or not really doesn't have anything to do with her being murdered.
I do tend to think it is the husband. I've just seen so many cases like this. It makes the most sense based on the information that is there. Emotions and spending aside. It is usually the one with the motive and reason and the one closest to the victim.
Seems to be Brad had a lot to lose if the divorce she was seeking went through.

[Jaydee0158]

Excuse me? Oh, I see. You must think I think she deserved this? Not in a million years! No one deserves to have their life taken by anyone!

That does not erase the mental picture that is being painted in the press - by both sides... like I said, a lot of mudslinging is going on and very little fact b/c those are being withheld by the authorities.

IMHO.

[Jaydee0158]

Yes, how IRONIC that this "spoiled, spendthrift, SAHM, who was just in it for the lump sum, the BMW, the $2100/month" happened in that coinky-dink way to be murdered just when her separation was really getting legs.

SNIP

@@

tsk, tsk, tsk. Name calling and I've only posted one little opinion. I thought those were allowed. Or am I misreading this @@?

[SleuthyGal]

@@ = blinking eyes

[Fuquaylj]

We all have a right to our opinions. I think all the reading we've been doing over the last couple of days has shown that this case is not as black & white as we thought.

[sues]

Snipped from Jaydee0158:
"What makes no sense to me it that if things were as bad as NC wanted her friends and parents to believe, why stick around? She is an educated woman. She was intelligent by all indications. She has a father that is in the business to help in such cases. Why did she stay there? To get the BMW X5, $2100 a month in CS, $50,000 lump sum, alimony, and the residual of the 401K after all else was paid off? This strikes me as a bit odd. Maybe it wasn’t as bad as described. But regardless, NC apparently felt trapped in a marriage to someone she did not want to be married to. But was she trapped by him or by selfish desires?"

I certainly think it's possible that these allegations are partially if not completely true. And I've posted before that if a friend of mine had a wife that was using him for $ and driving them to the poorhouse, I would hate her and think she was horrible. Nancy could, in fact, be a horrible gold-digger who was trying to take BC for everything he was worth. Is that illegal? No. Is she on trial for that? No. If true, would BC have a reason to hate her? Yep. Could it be a powerful motivator for murder? Possibly.

I'm just saying that all of this stuff about NC being spendy and trying to take him to the cleaners, while it doesn't make NC smell like a rose, it really does bring to light a strong morivator for murder. (NOT saying she deserved to be killed IF the allegations are true--just that it would be a motivator.)

[Crazy Canuck]

I have to admit I believed some of Brad's' rebuttal because it was all stuff that could be easily proven. However, whether Brad or nancy's friends are telling the truth is really not relevant to whether he killed her. Sure her friends make him out to be an absentee husband who may or may not have been a little controlling but none of that can prove murder.

If Brad is innocent then I would like him to answer the following questions, since he seems to have an answer for everything and many here suspect he is reading. Here are my questions:

1. Why have the LE publically stated that her murder is not random. Isn't he concerned that someone he knows killed his wife then? Wouldn't he be concerned for his own safety?

2. Why - in a neighbourhood where everyone seemed to know everyone and their business- did not one person see nancy jogging on a Saturday morning?

Thats all I've got which is why I'm wondering why everyone thinks he did it. My gut tells me he did it but the facts don't.:confused:

[maggief]

Pedicures
http://art2mis.blogspot.com/2006/09/rossi-pasta.html


"The only way we beat the heat here in NC is by running at 6:00 am." (https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=31717822&postID=115439707438489110)

https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=31717822&postID=115439707438489110


Saturday, April 26, 2008
Spanakopitakia
These have been altered to be Ms. N-friendly...she cannot digest any cow-based dairy products, but is fine with goat's milk.


Monday, August 14, 2006
A summer week of fun...

Sun. 8/13: We were going to have Ms. N. et famille over, but they canceled, so we did ribs for ourselves again. This time we tossed the broth, though, since I'll be out of town later on in the week.

[Jaydee0158]

@@ = blinking eyes

Oh, thanks! Sorry. I will have to learn all the WSese around here.

[luckyme]

I have to admit I believed some of Brad's' rebuttal because it was all stuff that could be easily proven. However, whether Brad or nancy's friends are telling the truth is really not relevant to whether he killed her. Sure her friends make him out to be an absentee husband who may or may not have been a little controlling but none of that can prove murder.

If Brad is innocent then I would like him to answer the following questions, since he seems to have an answer for everything and many here suspect he is reading. Here are my questions:

1. Why have the LE publically stated that her murder is not random. Isn't he concerned that someone he knows killed his wife then? Wouldn't he be concerned for his own safety?

2. Why - in a neighbourhood where everyone seemed to know everyone and their business- did not one person see nancy jogging on a Saturday morning?

Thats all I've got which is why I'm wondering why everyone thinks he did it. My gut tells me he did it but the facts don't.:confused:

wow! very good! jmo

[Carrington]

I thought Brad's statements did read as to his motive for murder.
Motive is the biggie, means and opportunity he already had.
IMO

[luckyme]

wow! very good! jmo

Oh shoot! i forgot ot say how many people were up on that sat morning to know if she went jogging? I bet no one at that party? JMO

[Jaydee0158]

Sues, I agree that there is definitely cause for some suspicion... ie. huge motive! Then again, some things have been said over the past week that, IMO, raise the possibility of other POIs. Does anyone know with 100% certainty NC was not seeing someone (emotionally affair, maybe)? Impatient she would not just end the relationship with BC? Forensics on the PCs will tell that. What about a potential love interest of BC, IF he was have all those affairs alleged by neighbors. What $$$$ would be left for his "tart" (loved it when I read that by someone!) if NC got it all?

Again, I am waiting for the facts. In the meantime, I find some of the theories here very interesting.

[SleuthyGal]

On the heels of Crazy's good questions I too am concerned. I live in Cary. I'm a single woman, living alone.

The CPD said this is "an isolated incident and the community is not at risk to the best of their knowledge." To me that means it was someone close to or known by the victim.

If it's someone 'random,' then that is scary stuff indeed and it makes me very nervous. Do I believe the police on this? Should I assume they've got it wrong?

And if the husband didn't want her dead and didn't do the deed, then which friend or acquaintance might have done it?

And if it's none of the above then who is the murdering nutjob running around Cary?

[SleuthyGal]

On the heels of Crazy's good questions I too am concerned. I live in Cary. I'm a single woman, living alone.

The CPD said this is "an isolated incident and the community is not at risk to the best of their knowledge." To me that means it was someone close to or known by the victim.

If it's someone 'random,' then that is scary stuff indeed and it makes me very nervous. Do I believe the police on this? Should I assume they've got it wrong?

And if the husband didn't want her dead and didn't do the deed, then which friend or acquaintance might have done it?

And if it's none of the above then who is the murdering nutjob running around Cary?

[sues]

Sues, I agree that there is definitely cause for some suspicion... ie. huge motive! Then again, some things have been said over the past week that, IMO, raise the possibility of other POIs. Does anyone know with 100% certainty NC was not seeing someone (emotionally affair, maybe)? Impatient she would not just end the relationship with BC? Forensics on the PCs will tell that. What about a potential love interest of BC, IF he was have all those affairs alleged by neighbors. What $$$$ would be left for his "tart" (loved it when I read that by someone!) if NC got it all?

Again, I am waiting for the facts. In the meantime, I find some of the theories here very interesting.

Jaydee, I am with you on withholding judgement until evidence is revealed. I am far from 100% certain that it was BC.

However, if I had to bet on it, my $ would be on BC as the murderer. Just statistically, given their apparent circumstances (money issues being undisputed), BC has a HUGE motive. It is a much bigger motive than a lover of NC would have. I mean, gosh, if his affidavit is true, then he would have every reason to really, really dislike her (not justification for murder, of course)! And it just is statistically less likely that a woman--a lover of BC-- would commit a murder of another woman(not impossible, just much, much less common).

Luckily I don't have to bet. And luckily a jury will have all of the evidence.

And to Sleuthygirl: I am with you. For my piece-of-mind, I want to know who committed this murder. A big part of me WANTS it to be BC so I won't be so nervous when I'm out jogging. Honestly, I am not the WSer type, and I joined to try to get some piece-of-mind that I *might* be safe around here.

ETA: I didn't mean anything bad by "WSer type". I just meant that I don't usually follow criminal cases very closely. :)

[RoughlyCollie]

There's a guy over on the TWW (the wolf web) site that says she was the #1 customer in his store and that she never once came in there looking like she was on a budget.

Another guy said NC (also the #1 customer in his store) was supposed to come into their store around noon on that Saturday to buy some clothes she had on hold and they put them back on the rack at 4 pm figuring she didn't want them. Then they donated the white dresses to the family that the girls wore to the memorial service -- the same white dresses NC had put on hold for them. (Children's boutique with $150 dresses)




I do find the discrepancies between all the affidavits very interesting (& confusing!!!).

[Jaydee0158]

1. Why have the LE publically stated that her murder is not random. Isn't he concerned that someone he knows killed his wife then? Wouldn't he be concerned for his own safety?

2. Why - in a neighbourhood where everyone seemed to know everyone and their business- did not one person see nancy jogging on a Saturday morning?

Thats all I've got which is why I'm wondering why everyone thinks he did it. My gut tells me he did it but the facts don't.:confused:

I'm not BC, but I will say that maybe he is concerned for his safety. We do not know for a fact that he is not. Re Q-2, don't know. Could it be that they partied late and slept in? Not advocating for him, by any means. Just questioning the very little that we actually do know at this point.

[Jaydee0158]

I am so sorry this happened in your area. I am really concerned with the state of things in general in this country and the lack of morals or value of life. I have been through the bad marriage thing with a gun-toting ex who's life ambition was to be on a PD. I am fortunate to have that behind me.

[raisincharlie]

Oh shoot! i forgot ot say how many people were up on that sat morning to know if she went jogging? I bet no one at that party? JMO

Nancy was up by at least 6:40 am - why wouldn't other partiers be up ? Maybe they all went to the store :crazy:

[raisincharlie]

I am so sorry this happened in your area. I am really concerned with the state of things in general in this country and the lack of morals or value of life. I have been through the bad marriage thing with a gun-toting ex who's life ambition was to be on a PD. I am fortunate to have that behind me.

Hopefully he didn't make it on a PD.

[Jaydee0158]

On the heels of Crazy's good questions I too am concerned. I live in Cary. I'm a single woman, living alone.

The CPD said this is "an isolated incident and the community is not at risk to the best of their knowledge." To me that means it was someone close to or known by the victim.

If it's someone 'random,' then that is scary stuff indeed and it makes me very nervous. Do I believe the police on this? Should I assume they've got it wrong?

And if the husband didn't want her dead and didn't do the deed, then which friend or acquaintance might have done it?

And if it's none of the above then who is the murdering nutjob running around Cary?

Always use caution, regardless. I am sorry this happened in your area. I am really concerned about the state of our world -- too much violence with no morals or regard for human life. I hope the CPD have a POI in their sights with some good hard evidence. It will be interesting to see if anything happens on Monday (GJ day).

[Jaydee0158]

Yikes ! Three times the same thought! That's what happens when one is distracted by a 7-year old naked jaybird running through the house! Gotta get a youngster to bed. Will catch up on all the reading later. Be safe, everyone!

[SleuthyGal]

Good thing I am neither a jogger nor an early morning riser! On the walks I go on I am always with my dog and we stay on well-traveled sidewalks right in the open, during daylight hours.

[jilly]

I have lots of reading to catch up on... still have to read half of thread 10 before moving on to this one but I wanted to comment then go back and try to catch up. Like the rest of you, I too have an opinion! Boy are the opinions strong around here!

First of all Jaydee :Welcome-12-june:

I totally agree with you on the fact that this was not a planned murder. We have no evidence of that to date. Like you, I think it's a good possibility that things got out of hand and he basically 'lost it'. Since we don't yet know the COD (cause of death), it's impossible for me to speculate on premeditation.

At the present time, I believe Brad is the perp. He was the last one to see her that morning (by his own admission). The nite before he had left her at a party and they were having marital difficulties and planning a divorce. For me, he had the means, motive and opportunity.

You may be right about Nancy but the poor woman is dead now so I think, at the very least, we should keep in mind that all parties who gave these sworn affidavits have not been cross examined in a Court of Law.

As far as why Nancy stayed with him there could have been a million reasons. For starters, I believe she couldn't get a green card or that was in the process. Maybe she loved him; maybe she believed in family and holding it together; maybe she thought their girls would have a better life if they stayed together. In the end, she apparently made the move to end the marriage.

On the other side of the coin, we've been advised that Brad was having an affair, maybe more. - so why did he "stick around"? I guess, like many couples, they may have both stayed in the marriage initially out of convenience.

[Magister]

The Chief actually said that nothing had been reported that would indicate this was anything other than an isolated incident. She did not and could not categorically say it that is was or was not an isolated incident because at that time they had only started gathering the evidence and it would've been irresponsible for her to say anything, otherwise.

Not to mention that this was over a week ago and what's more, prior to the body being found, she said that they had no reason to suspect foul play. For all we know, as I keep saying, perhaps Bella saw her mother go running. I mean at that early stage of the investigation, I don't know how much the children had been questioned, but just like the Chief couldn't confirm or deny the bleach, she simply said that nothing had been reported, nothing more.

Thus far, the police have not named anyone a person of interest and they've been so tight-lipped, we really don't have any evidence for or against Brad or anyone. Perhaps, the Cary PD is sticking to their guns and not commenting on anything and/or maybe they're letting all of us focus on Brad, so the real killer will make a mistake.

We really don't know anything, except for a few statistics and what a couple of people think.
---

ETA: Cops don't generally go around sounding alarms when there's only been one incident and most of the time, they don't publicly classify murders as random or not. I mean, how many murders today in LA were random and how many isolated? I don't have a clue.

[jilly]

There's a guy over on the TWW (the wolf web) site that says she was the #1 customer in his store and that she never once came in there looking like she was on a budget.

Another guy said NC (also the #1 customer in his store) was supposed to come into their store around noon on that Saturday to buy some clothes she had on hold and they put them back on the rack at 4 pm figuring she didn't want them. Then they donated the white dresses to the family that the girls wore to the memorial service -- the same white dresses NC had put on hold for them. (Children's boutique with $150 dresses)

Awww, isn't that nice of them to do that! Thanks for that tidbit Roughly Collie!:)

[jilly]

Nancy was up by at least 6:40 am - why wouldn't other partiers be up ? Maybe they all went to the store :crazy:

:rotfl:

[Magister]

Nancy was up by at least 6:40 am - why wouldn't other partiers be up ?

Reportedly, Nancy left the BBQ around midnight and Brad's affidavit implies that the kids are early risers, perhaps they get up at 6:30?

I know that a couple of my daughter's friends get up at six, my daughter gets up around seven and my wife at 5:30, all with or without an alarm and generally without regard for what they did, the night before.

[Magister]

On the heels of Crazy's good questions I too am concerned. I live in Cary. I'm a single woman, living alone.

The CPD said this is "an isolated incident and the community is not at risk to the best of their knowledge." To me that means it was someone close to or known by the victim.

If it's someone 'random,' then that is scary stuff indeed and it makes me very nervous. Do I believe the police on this? Should I assume they've got it wrong?

And if the husband didn't want her dead and didn't do the deed, then which friend or acquaintance might have done it?

And if it's none of the above then who is the murdering nutjob running around Cary?

A mobile serial killer leaves "isolated incidents" wherever they go; Someone who kills every ten years on some kind of anniversary could appear random; A drunk driver that accidently hits and kills a jogger, then quickly disposes of the body to avoid a DWI wouldn't necessarily appear to be nutjob running around the streets of Cary, though such a callous act would certainly make them one...

IOW: Just because something is isolated doesn't mean that it's always obvious to those without the facts, and what would you have rather the Chief done? There's a single victim, by definition it is isolated and not part of any pattern, so should she have started screaming "lock your doors" just because one person fell?

[Jaydee0158]

Hopefully he didn't make it on a PD.

No, but he is in the security business. Haven't seen him in years.

[Jaydee0158]

First of all Jaydee :Welcome-12-june:

I totally agree with you on the fact that this was not a planned murder. We have no evidence of that to date. Like you, I think it's a good possibility that things got out of hand and he basically 'lost it'. Since we don't yet know the COD (cause of death), it's impossible for me to speculate on premeditation.

At the present time, I believe Brad is the perp. He was the last one to see her that morning (by his own admission). The nite before he had left her at a party and they were having marital difficulties and planning a divorce. For me, he had the means, motive and opportunity.

You may be right about Nancy but the poor woman is dead now so I think, at the very least, we should keep in mind that all parties who gave these sworn affidavits have not been cross examined in a Court of Law.

As far as why Nancy stayed with him there could have been a million reasons. For starters, I believe she couldn't get a green card or that was in the process. Maybe she loved him; maybe she believed in family and holding it together; maybe she thought their girls would have a better life if they stayed together. In the end, she apparently made the move to end the marriage.

On the other side of the coin, we've been advised that Brad was having an affair, maybe more. - so why did he "stick around"? I guess, like many couples, they may have both stayed in the marriage initially out of convenience.

Thank you, Jilly.

You're right above - all good points. Lots of good points to ponder contributed by many here. My head is spinning. :abnormal: Going to bed. Good night, all.

[NCBanker]

WOW - I go out of town on business for a couple of days and then get back to find all these affidavits!

I never thought I'd say this, but after reading both sides, I'm not as convinced as I was...

It's unfortunate that there are things less flattering surfacing about Nancy. Of course, we know no one's perfect, and she certainly didn't deserve to die.

Reading the other side's response does, however, give me pause. I'm not as ready to convict him now that he's provided ample response to the litany of accusations, which can easily be verified.

Justthefax pointed out a few days ago that if in fact BC had been caught in a lie concerning the trip to the store, he would have already been arrested. I agree with that assertion.

If only we could know the cause of death...

[MoonFlwr]

On the previous thread, someone asked why some posters are saying, "I hope it wasn't Brad who killed Nancy".

Well, it would be a happy ending (as happy as it can be, given you've lost your mom) for the girls to at least be able to have their father back if he was not involved in Nancy's death!

[wirehair]

LE is out on Holly Springs road again this morning stopping traffic and giving out flyers.

[RoughlyCollie]

That doesn't seem like a good sign to me. If they had the evidence to arrest BC, I think they would have done so already. IMO, LE wouldn't waste the time and personnel to hand out flyers if they knew for sure that BC did it. I don't think they are doing this just to put icing on the cake, ie., to prove that they looked at someone other than BC.

What we think we know about BC may fit the profile (not literally, just based on other cases) and statistics associated with wife killers, but that alone does not prove anything.

Respectfully,
RC

LE is out on Holly Springs road again this morning stopping traffic and giving out flyers.

[raisincharlie]

LE is out on Holly Springs road again this morning stopping traffic and giving out flyers.


Question about the fliers - if you know - do the fliers show Nancy and are they requesting information as to if anyone saw her during a certain time period ?

[raisincharlie]

That doesn't seem like a good sign to me. If they had the evidence to arrest BC, I think they would have done so already. IMO, LE wouldn't waste the time and personnel to hand out flyers if they knew for sure that BC did it. I don't think they are doing this just to put icing on the cake, ie., to prove that they looked at someone other than BC.

What we think we know about BC may fit the profile (not literally, just based on other cases) and statistics associated with wife killers, but that alone does not prove anything.

Respectfully,
RC

Until the forensics come back or a witness, extremely reliable witness, appears, I see no reason how LE could arrest anyone. LE has said it is isolated, they have also said it was not a random murder. Sure would look like that old rush to judgement issue again if LE does not pursue all avenues.

I don't know how to interpret the fliers since we don't know what the focus of the flier is. It very well could be a cover all the bases approach or it could be a serious attempt to get someone to come forward and say they saw Nancy jogging at such and such place at such and such time, or it could be did anyone see a vehicle or an odd person in the undeveloped area where Nancy was found.

Maybe someone can tell us.

[Figbarinc]

Hey everyone!!!
I am new to the ballgame, Just getting my feet wet.
I have been lurking for the last 1 and 1/2 weeks.
I am not up to a sparing match yet. Maybe I will be able
to show my fangs later on

Just throwing my two cents in.

IIRC about 10 mil. letters ago a former room-mate of BC implied that
BC was quite the narcissist. NC friends have all alluded to this and
his very controlling nature.
There is still a nagging rumor that BC went shopping much earlier than
he states in any of his affivadits or statements.
Why file a rebuttal against supposed allegations if you are also filing an
objection against these allegations?
My gut leans toward BC killing his wife. However, CPD has not named a POI or
names a suspect Yet.We having nothing in the way of hard evidence implicating anyone Hopefully the sands of time will provide Golden Nuggets of truth that we so desperately need. I guess until then every opinion and observation is usefual

[raisincharlie]

Hey everyone!!!
I am new to the ballgame, Just getting my feet wet.
I have been lurking for the last 1 and 1/2 weeks.
I am not up to a sparing match yet. Maybe I will be able
to show my fangs later on

Just throwing my two cents in.

IIRC about 10 mil. letters ago a former room-mate of BC implied that
BC was quite the narcissist. NC friends have all alluded to this and
his very controlling nature.
There is still a nagging rumor that BC went shopping much earlier than
he states in any of his affivadits or statements.
Why file a rebuttal against supposed allegations if you are also filing an
objection against these allegations?
My gut leans toward BC killing his wife. However, CPD has not named a POI or
names a suspect Yet.We having nothing in the way of hard evidence implicating anyone Hopefully the sands of time will provide Golden Nuggets of truth that we so desperately need. I guess until then every opinion and observation is usefual

Welcome Figbarinc ! Fangs included :)

I have highlighted what I believe is an excellent point. Such a contradiction isn't it ? And a very good question.

Have fun !

[Just the Fax]

For what it's worth, I was at the court house yesterday. Before 2 pm, the judge brought all the media in (20 +). She laid the rules about no using blackberries or texting + other behavior rules. When the parties never showed, word soon came in the hall around 2:45 that they were together on the 4th floor trying to compromise an agreement before the hearing.

It was worth the wait, as on the 8th floor is the DA office as well as the Grand Jury room.

The Wake DA, Colin Willoughby walked down the hall and I overheard a conversation he had with a female from WTVD. I got lucky and was in the right place at just the right time.
He obviously knew these media people very well and off the record said:

"I don't know what they will decide, but I would guess they will go for status-quo for now. It would be messy if he is charged 2 months from now and another emergency custody hearing must be scheduled"....

Sooo....I took it as it is very likely Brad Cooper will be charged with murder before October.

[Star12]

[QUOTE=Just the Fax;2419713]

The Wake DA, Colin Willoughby walked down the hall and I overheard a conversation he had with a female from WTVD. I got lucky and was in the right place at just the right time.
He obviously knew these media people very well and off the record said: QUOTE]

I would think that if the Wake County DA were speaking off the record, it would not be proper to disseminate his words in a public forum on the internet.

It would be proper to delete your message, however, before someone else does.

[Just the Fax]

[quote=Just the Fax;2419713]

The Wake DA, Colin Willoughby walked down the hall and I overheard a conversation he had with a female from WTVD. I got lucky and was in the right place at just the right time.
He obviously knew these media people very well and off the record said: QUOTE]

I would think that if the Wake County DA were speaking off the record, it would not be proper to disseminate his words in a public forum on the internet.

It would be proper to delete your message, however, before someone else does.

I overheard a simple conversation in a public domain. He did not reveal anything confidential , he was simply saying he guessed it would remain status quo based on a hypothetical.

I then drew my own conclusion and posted it.

Did you wake up on the wrong side of the bed Star ?

[fran]

For what it's worth, I was at the court house yesterday. Before 2 pm, the judge brought all the media in (20 +). She laid the rules about no using blackberries or texting + other behavior rules. When the parties never showed, word soon came in the hall around 2:45 that they were together on the 4th floor trying to compromise an agreement before the hearing.

It was worth the wait, as on the 8th floor is the DA office as well as the Grand Jury room.

The Wake DA, Colin Willoughby walked down the hall and I overheard a conversation he had with a female from WTVD. I got lucky and was in the right place at just the right time.
He obviously knew these media people very well and off the record said:

"I don't know what they will decide, but I would guess they will go for status-quo for now. It would be messy if he is charged 2 months from now and another emergency custody hearing must be scheduled"....

Sooo....I took it as it is very likely Brad Cooper will be charged with murder before October.


That's interesting JTF. Glad you were able to make court.

We've had various Websleuthers attend court on different cases and it's always great to have a first hand account.

Thanks for your time,:)
fran

[fran]

Hey everyone!!!
I am new to the ballgame, Just getting my feet wet.
I have been lurking for the last 1 and 1/2 weeks.
I am not up to a sparing match yet. Maybe I will be able
to show my fangs later on

Just throwing my two cents in.

IIRC about 10 mil. letters ago a former room-mate of BC implied that
BC was quite the narcissist. NC friends have all alluded to this and
his very controlling nature.
There is still a nagging rumor that BC went shopping much earlier than
he states in any of his affivadits or statements.
Why file a rebuttal against supposed allegations if you are also filing an
objection against these allegations?
My gut leans toward BC killing his wife. However, CPD has not named a POI or
names a suspect Yet.We having nothing in the way of hard evidence implicating anyone Hopefully the sands of time will provide Golden Nuggets of truth that we so desperately need. I guess until then every opinion and observation is usefual

Great first post Figbarinc.

I totally agree.

Welcome to Websleuths! :)

fran

[fran]

Until the forensics come back or a witness, extremely reliable witness, appears, I see no reason how LE could arrest anyone. LE has said it is isolated, they have also said it was not a random murder. Sure would look like that old rush to judgement issue again if LE does not pursue all avenues.

I don't know how to interpret the fliers since we don't know what the focus of the flier is. It very well could be a cover all the bases approach or it could be a serious attempt to get someone to come forward and say they saw Nancy jogging at such and such place at such and such time, or it could be did anyone see a vehicle or an odd person in the undeveloped area where Nancy was found.

Maybe someone can tell us.

IMHO, the flyers could be to eliminate, as well as accumulate information. Like, IF a person was out that Saturday morning and did NOT see Nancy jogging, that's evidence.

We've seen this before. All the witnesses at the Berkeley Marina who testified they did NOT see SP. He said he'd actually spoken to the personnel there and even describe the conversation. The pros proved he did NOT talk to anyone there, which was circumstantial evidence he did NOT leave from the Marina as he had stated.

There were people who originally stated they had seen Laci at the park. Yet,...........they were never called by the defense. IMO, because they most likely realized it was NOT Laci they had seen. Thus, she was NOT at the park as the now convicted murderer had stated.

JMHO
fran

[Just the Fax]

It is interesting the DA or cops in Wake County refuse to 'name' a suspect in these high profile cases (same with Ann Miller and Jason Young).

I asked a deputy at the courthouse yesterday about that in general. He said it is done so it is not inflammatory towards the potential jury pool and does not influence someones right to a fair trial.....same basic thought with sealing damning search warrants.

Remember, the key words when you hear no 'person of interest' or 'suspect' is not named

[fran]

That doesn't seem like a good sign to me. If they had the evidence to arrest BC, I think they would have done so already. IMO, LE wouldn't waste the time and personnel to hand out flyers if they knew for sure that BC did it. I don't think they are doing this just to put icing on the cake, ie., to prove that they looked at someone other than BC.

What we think we know about BC may fit the profile (not literally, just based on other cases) and statistics associated with wife killers, but that alone does not prove anything.

Respectfully,
RC

Whenever we, from the outside looking in, get impatient of LE not making a speedy arrest,...........think OJ.

The defendent is entitled to a speedy trial. LE MUST have all their evidence gathered BEFORE they arrest the POI, or suspect. IF they don't, they may loose because evidence comes in too late to be presented in court.

THe defendent is entitled to review evidence to be used against him, 30 days, IIRC, prior to trial.

JMHO
fran

[Star12]

It just seems to me that since it was off the record, and was said by the district attorney, that perhaps it should be held as confidential.

I don't mean to step on any toes here, but after many years working in the legal field, you get kind of cautious about what is said, implied, or just understood.

I would hate for this case to be compromised, or for WS to be censured, because of a slip.

I get very hinky, and very much uptight about stuff like this. So maybe it's just me being very straightlaced.

Sorry if I offended you, Fax, but to paraphrase Fran's tag, I'm not saying, I'm just saying.

[raisincharlie]

IMHO, the flyers could be to eliminate, as well as accumulate information. Like, IF a person was out that Saturday morning and did NOT see Nancy jogging, that's evidence.

We've seen this before. All the witnesses at the Berkeley Marina who testified they did NOT see SP. He said he'd actually spoken to the personnel there and even describe the conversation. The pros proved he did NOT talk to anyone there, which was circumstantial evidence he did NOT leave from the Marina as he had stated.

There were people who originally stated they had seen Laci at the park. Yet,...........they were never called by the defense. IMO, because they most likely realized it was NOT Laci they had seen. Thus, she was NOT at the park as the now convicted murderer had stated.

JMHO
fran

I think so as well Fran. LE wants to know if anyone saw Nancy that Saturday morning, what time and where if they did see her. If witnesses come foward LE will make the maps and note the times to define the potential viability of such sightings if there are any. Same with a vehicle, lets hope another brown van shows up :crazy:

I believe LE would be remiss if it did not have all this data before taking the cas to the DA. Its all good.

[fran]

It is interesting the DA or cops in Wake County refuse to 'name' a suspect in these high profile cases (same with Ann Miller and Jason Young).

I asked a deputy at the courthouse yesterday about that in general. He said it is done so it is not inflammatory towards the potential jury pool and does not influence someones right to a fair trial.....same basic thought with sealing damning search warrants.

Remember, the key words when you hear no 'person of interest' or 'suspect' is not named


LOL, we here at Websleuths learned that a long time ago. They used to say POI, thinking that would satisfy everyone without actually naming a suspect. Yet the public became aware POI means they're a 'suspect' in LE's eye. So they've even done away with POI unless they are SURE they have their man, orrrr woman!

JMHO
fran

[Just the Fax]

It just seems to me that since it was off the record, and was said by the district attorney, that perhaps it should be held as confidential.

I don't mean to step on any toes here, but after many years working in the legal field, you get kind of cautious about what is said, implied, or just understood.

I would hate for this case to be compromised, or for WS to be censured, because of a slip.

I get very hinky, and very much uptight about stuff like this. So maybe it's just me being very straightlaced.

Sorry if I offended you, Fax, but to paraphrase Fran's tag, I'm not saying, I'm just saying.

The DA had nothing to do with the custody hearing....hence, that is why he was walking the halls conversing with numerous media folks in the area.

The term 'off the record' was mine, as that was not used by him to preface his casual conversation.

Again, I drew my own conclusion based on his hypothetical that if he is arrested in 2 months.....

[Just the Fax]

LOL, we here at Websleuths learned that a long time ago. They used to say POI, thinking that would satisfy everyone without actually naming a suspect. Yet the public became aware POI means they're a 'suspect' in LE's eye. So they've even done away with POI unless they are SURE they have their man, orrrr woman!

JMHO
fran

The DA in Wake county does not like to use either term even if the know who the killer is....just look at Jason Young and Ann Miller ;)

[fran]

LE is out on Holly Springs road again this morning stopping traffic and giving out flyers.

That's good! Shows they're continuing the investigation.

Everybody should be happy about that!

JMHO
fran

[fran]

The DA in Wake county does not like to use either term even if the know who the killer is....just look at Jason Young and Ann Miller ;)

That's what I was saying. LE STOPPED using that term. Errrr........unless an arrest is IMINENT.........meaning within hours! ;)

JMHO
fran

[raisincharlie]

Whenever we, from the outside looking in, get impatient of LE not making a speedy arrest,...........think OJ.

The defendent is entitled to a speedy trial. LE MUST have all their evidence gathered BEFORE they arrest the POI, or suspect. IF they don't, they may loose because evidence comes in too late to be presented in court.

THe defendent is entitled to review evidence to be used against him, 30 days, IIRC, prior to trial.

JMHO
fran

Additionally in NC the moment a person is arrested, their counsil has the right to receive all discovery beginning at that point. Also if I recall it correctly, NC is not a reciprical discovery state. In other words the DA must turn over his evidence but the defense council is not required to provide any to the DA.

Am I recalling that correctly Just the Fax ?

[Just the Fax]

That's good! Shows they're continuing the investigation.

Everybody should be happy about that!

JMHO
fran

They want to know if anyone saw a silver BMW X-5 .


While out, I drove by Brad's house and the area where her body was found.

*Her body was dumped 10 feet off the road in a paved, but totally undeveloped cul-de-sac. It was 1.1 miles in the very back area of a new section of existing subdivision ($500,000 + homes).

*The entrance to the subdivision is only 1.3 miles from his home
(no way anyone would jog there, as 2 lane very busy road with no SWs)

It was obvious he chose a remote area where the body would not likely be found for days or possibly weeks.


Photos of the actual site and area

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s216/alive695/bodylocation.jpg

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s216/alive695/bodyloc1.jpg

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s216/alive695/culdesac.jpg

[raisincharlie]

They want to know if anyone saw a silver BMW X-5 .


While out, I drove by Brad's house and the area where her body was found.

*Her body was dumped 10 feet off the road in a paved, but totally undeveloped cul-de-sac. It was 1.1 miles in the very back area of a new section of existing subdivision ($500,000 + homes).

*The entrance to the subdivision is only 1.3 miles from his home
(no way anyone would jog there, as 2 lane very busy road with no SWs)

It was obvious he chose a remote area where the body would not likely be found for days or possibly weeks.

Is that what the fliers are asking - about the BMW SUV ? Really?

[Just the Fax]

Is that what the fliers are asking - about the BMW SUV ? Really?

I have not seen one of the flyers .

I doubt they are being that direct, but likely asking if they saw an 'unfamiliar vehicle' in the area.

I guess I need to drive back over there and see for myself.:)

[fran]

I have to admit I believed some of Brad's' rebuttal because it was all stuff that could be easily proven. However, whether Brad or nancy's friends are telling the truth is really not relevant to whether he killed her. Sure her friends make him out to be an absentee husband who may or may not have been a little controlling but none of that can prove murder.

If Brad is innocent then I would like him to answer the following questions, since he seems to have an answer for everything and many here suspect he is reading. Here are my questions:

1. Why have the LE publically stated that her murder is not random. Isn't he concerned that someone he knows killed his wife then? Wouldn't he be concerned for his own safety?

2. Why - in a neighbourhood where everyone seemed to know everyone and their business- did not one person see nancy jogging on a Saturday morning?

Thats all I've got which is why I'm wondering why everyone thinks he did it. My gut tells me he did it but the facts don't.:confused:

Those are very good questions Crazy Canuck. I'm sure he's working on the answers right now. ;)

My question to anyone that doubts there was actually abuse in the Cooper marriage, I would like to ask just one thing.

Which one was MURDERED?

Just sayin'
fran

PS...I know this is going to sound corny........but that's why we're here at Websleuths. We're the voice for the victim, the silenced.....:(......fran

[fran]

I have not seen one of the flyers .

I doubt they are being that direct, but likely asking if they saw an 'unfamiliar vehicle' in the area.

I guess I need to drive back over there and see for myself.:)

Great pictures! That would be helpful if you could actually get one of the flyers.

Boy, we're lucky you joined our community. Wealth of information.

Thanks,:)
fran

PS......see how these cases can get under your skin.....'voice for the silenced.'

[Just the Fax]

Additionally in NC the moment a person is arrested, their counsil has the right to receive all discovery beginning at that point. Also if I recall it correctly, NC is not a reciprical discovery state. In other words the DA must turn over his evidence but the defense council is not required to provide any to the DA.

Am I recalling that correctly Just the Fax ?


North Carolina's open file discovery law passed in 2004.

Correct, the prosecutors must turn over everything to the defense but the defense does not have to do the same.

" Without the 2004 law, much of the exculpatory evidence Durham County Prosecutor Mike Nifong illegally withheld in the Duke case would never have come to light because Nifong wouldn't have been required to inform defense attorneys it existed."

http://charlotte.creativeloafing.com/gyrobase/Content?oid=oid%3A156124

[fran]

North Carolina's open file discovery law passed in 2004.

In California they must turn over discovery 30 days prior to trial. I'm not sure if it's 30 days before it's going to be used, or the actual onset of the trial.

Oh, and they ONLY turn over what they HAVE to.

Like if they have evidence to go to a GJ, they ONLY present what they need to to get an indictment. They may have MORE, just not turn it over until they HAVE TO by law.

A retired detective told me one time, 'you always hold something back.';)

JMHO
fran

[fran]

On the heels of Crazy's good questions I too am concerned. I live in Cary. I'm a single woman, living alone.

The CPD said this is "an isolated incident and the community is not at risk to the best of their knowledge." To me that means it was someone close to or known by the victim.

If it's someone 'random,' then that is scary stuff indeed and it makes me very nervous. Do I believe the police on this? Should I assume they've got it wrong?

And if the husband didn't want her dead and didn't do the deed, then which friend or acquaintance might have done it?

And if it's none of the above then who is the murdering nutjob running around Cary?


Just to be safe, it's best to take precausions to protect yourself. Whether there's rumor or fact or even NOT that there's someone out killing innocent people. Let's face it, this case proves that 'something bad' can happen anywhere to anyone.

Even you and me.

JMHO
fran

[Just the Fax]

Just to be safe, it's best to take precausions to protect yourself. Whether there's rumor or fact or even NOT that there's someone out killing innocent people. Let's face it, this case proves that 'something bad' can happen anywhere to anyone.

Even you and me.

JMHO
fran

Yes, domestic homicide can happen in any state, any city or any neighborhood.

IMO, If Nancy was able to leave that horrible marriage, she would be alive today.

If some of the info in those affidavits was true (and I believe most was), Nancy was living with a monster that was poised to snap.

[runnermomof5]

Hey Guys!
I posted on the Nancy the Jogger link when Pepper set it up. Then, Pepper got canned. So I am going to repeat some of my thoughts here.
Cause I am starting to feel like Bob. Sometimes I wonder, does anyone out there see me? LOL
Except my name is Brenda.
So, instead of "Bob Bob" , I guess you can call me "Bren Bren".
Anyway, as a long time runner, I immediately saw several red flags with BC story about NC going for a run at 7 and not returning.
Okay.
Briefly:
NC was in training for a half marathon with her friend Jessica A.
Saturday and Sunday mornings are prime mornings for what serious runners call "long runs". Usually shorter distance runs, say 3-4 miles, are done during the week and the longer runs of training are done on the weekends. Okay, IMO, Nancy would not have gone out on a run on Saturday without Jessica.
Also, since they were training together, they most likely were following a training schedule which would lead up to the half marathon. I think Jessica even mentioned this, that she and NC had discussed all their training plans.
Someone posted the finishing time for NC and HM from a 5K race a few years ago. Since they had the same finishing time, they most likely ran the race together.
Not a very fast time for someone who was supposedly quite athletic and had aspirations for being in the Olympics at one time. Of course, that is around the time NC babies were being born, too. So, she may have not been putting in much running time back then.
Another thing that bothers me is that she supposedly left the house for her run instead of her usual drive to the coffee shop, park, and then start her run from there.
Also , no one saw her out running that morning.
No one.
One Heather stated while being interviewed that she saw NC out running all the time.
So , on a Saturday morning, when lots of people are out running , walking, biking, etc. someone would have seen her, IMO.
Okay, I have read all the affidavits and I have followed all the posts here so I know that I am kinda going "backwards" by bringing this up again. BUT........to me this is where it all started. BC says that NC left the house on a run. IMO , she did not.
Oh, one more thought.
Who can get up and go running after being out late at a party the night before?
Especially if she had some wine, or other alcohol to drink at the party.
Very dehydrating!
Okay, that's it. That's my story and I am sticking to it. :)

[RoughlyCollie]

I have never had a client, nor has anyone I know, who had a "speedy" trial.

Mostly, the defendants don't want to speed their way into a prison cell.




The defendent is entitled to a speedy trial. LE MUST have all their evidence gathered BEFORE they arrest the POI, or suspect. IF they don't, they may loose because evidence comes in too late to be presented in court.

THe defendent is entitled to review evidence to be used against him, 30 days, IIRC, prior to trial.

JMHO
fran

[fran]

WOW - I go out of town on business for a couple of days and then get back to find all these affidavits!

I never thought I'd say this, but after reading both sides, I'm not as convinced as I was...

It's unfortunate that there are things less flattering surfacing about Nancy. Of course, we know no one's perfect, and she certainly didn't deserve to die.

Reading the other side's response does, however, give me pause. I'm not as ready to convict him now that he's provided ample response to the litany of accusations, which can easily be verified.

Justthefax pointed out a few days ago that if in fact BC had been caught in a lie concerning the trip to the store, he would have already been arrested. I agree with that assertion.

If only we could know the cause of death...

While you're pausing about who may have done this crime AND believing what her husband and friends have given affidavits of, just remember one thing.

Who was murdered?

Also, about the trip to the store. A murder case is like a huge puzzle. One piece does not spell murder. It takes a whole puzzle. LE, at this very moment, is putting the puzzle together.

Patience.

JMHO
fran

[fran]

I have never had a client, nor has anyone I know, who had a "speedy" trial.

Well, OJ did. That's because his attornies KNEW LAPD had not gotten all their evidence back yet.

Some of the evidence came in AFTER the trial had started. That's why, IMO, the defense was able to say, at times, they're manufacturing the evidence or this would have come forth earlier.

Like Robert Shiparo said when asked if he thought OJ was guilty. His response was, "Let me put it this way. Attornies don't win cases. Prosecutors loose them."

Just sayin'
fran

[SleuthyGal]

THANK YOU JTF for bringing us your observations and insights from the courtroom yesterday. I so appreciate it! And that was an interesting comment you heard. It makes sense, really, for a custodial 'status quo' to be maintained for now.

Plus I don't believe BC would want to submit to a forced psych evaluation as part of a custody condition, and I think that may have tipped the scales for him. It's one thing if he and his lawyer decide to seek a psych eval. on their terms...then they can release the results (or not), as they prefer. Quite a different thing to have it be a condition of you getting your kids back and BEFORE there's been any resolution in a murder case.

And Fran, thank you for being a voice of reason consistently day in and day out on this matter.

One day at a time, LE has to build the puzzle, they have to wait for any forensics to come back, and they can't just go out and arrest someone because they "believe he did it." The DA won't bring the case to a courtroom unless or until he believes this case can be proven beyond a 'reasonable doubt' to 12 jurors. And they're not there yet. Hopefully they'll get there. {crosses fingers}

[SleuthyGal]

David Allan Westerfield (killer of 7 yr old Danielle van Dam) also had a 'speedy trial' in CA. It was a maneuver by the defense to get that trial going so that forensic information might not be available. In his case it didn't work, but try they did.

[fran]

Hi Bren Bren or runnermomof5:

Don't be discouraged if people don't respond to you. That happens to me all the time. Just keep posting and you'll get someone's attention.

I too don't believe she went out jogging that morning. For all the reasons you said, PLUS,........how could she go on a 2 hour jog when she was due to be painting at 8:00, ONE HOUR from when she was to alleged to have left the house? Doesn't make sense, IMO.

Also, about her time. Remember, she was injurred, which was why she was no longer 'seriously' running. PLUS, she did have chrones disease, which,from what I've read, can be very hard on your body.

Nice post runnermomof5,
:)
fran

[fran]

David Allan Westerfield (killer of 7 yr old Danielle van Dam) also had a 'speedy trial' in CA. It was a maneuver by the defense to get that trial going so that forensic information might not be available. In his case it didn't work, but try they did.

Yeah, he decided on a speedy trial AFTER the DA took off the table NO DP if he showed them where the body is, which he HAD agreed to.

Danielle was found by searchers and the DA tore up the agreement. He knew he was toast,........AND the DA was too smart for him!

Poor Danielle:(


fran

[SleuthyGal]

Welcome BRENDA! It's nice to read your thoughts on this case. Not being a runner myself I didn't know how training for an upcoming race typically works.

I just looked at JTF's pictures from the previous page and WOW. I had not yet before seen exactly WHERE the body was found (as in I had not seen a body outline). She was right there in the open, off the side of that little turnaround road. I pictured her off over the silt barrier, closer to the water (and further from any road) or else hidden in whatever trees or bushes were around there. Very illuminating! That to me says it was a quick dump. She was NOT murdered there, but IMHO was dumped there.

[fran]

Yes, domestic homicide can happen in any state, any city or any neighborhood.

IMO, If Nancy was able to leave that horrible marriage, she would be alive today.

If some of the info in those affidavits was true (and I believe most was), Nancy was living with a monster that was poised to snap.

Your last sentence is very chilling. IF only people in this situation can see the face of that monster, BEFORE he snaps. These victims usually do NOT even see it coming.

Hopefully with the wide coverage cases such as this get, lives will be saved, even if only a few. ONE is TOO MANY. But we've seen our headlines littered with these cases in recent years. THIS should NOT happen!

Educate! Educate and IF you see YOURSELF in Nancy, RUN for your life!

Seriously,
fran

[SleuthyGal]

Yeah, he decided on a speedy trial AFTER the DA took off the table NO DP if he showed them where the body is, which he HAD agreed to.

Yes I remember that well. I was GLUED to that case in '02/'03. And I had just moved away from Redwood City, CA 10 months before the Laci Peterson murder. I was kind of kicking myself because I so wanted to attend that trial and there it was held in my hometown!

Well maybe I'll still get a chance if (and hopefully when) THIS case goes to trial.

[Bob&Bob]

testing testing

[OtisCampbell]

I too don't believe she went out jogging that morning. For all the reasons you said, PLUS,........how could she go on a 2 hour jog when she was due to be painting at 8:00, ONE HOUR from when she was to alleged to have left the house? Doesn't make sense, IMO.



On the 911 call she mentions 8:00, but later says the she (NC) was supposed to be at her house no later than 9:00. Not positive, but I believe she also mentions calling NC's house and talking to BC at 9:00. It sounds like there was a one hour time range in which she was suppose to be there. If she was suppose to be there at 8:00 she probably would have called a short time later and not waited an hour.

[raisincharlie]

Hey Guys!
I posted on the Nancy the Jogger link when Pepper set it up. Then, Pepper got canned. So I am going to repeat some of my thoughts here.
Cause I am starting to feel like Bob. Sometimes I wonder, does anyone out there see me? LOL
Except my name is Brenda.
So, instead of "Bob Bob" , I guess you can call me "Bren Bren".
Anyway, as a long time runner, I immediately saw several red flags with BC story about NC going for a run at 7 and not returning.
Okay.
Briefly:
NC was in training for a half marathon with her friend Jessica A.
Saturday and Sunday mornings are prime mornings for what serious runners call "long runs". Usually shorter distance runs, say 3-4 miles, are done during the week and the longer runs of training are done on the weekends. Okay, IMO, Nancy would not have gone out on a run on Saturday without Jessica.
Also, since they were training together, they most likely were following a training schedule which would lead up to the half marathon. I think Jessica even mentioned this, that she and NC had discussed all their training plans.
Someone posted the finishing time for NC and HM from a 5K race a few years ago. Since they had the same finishing time, they most likely ran the race together.
Not a very fast time for someone who was supposedly quite athletic and had aspirations for being in the Olympics at one time. Of course, that is around the time NC babies were being born, too. So, she may have not been putting in much running time back then.
Another thing that bothers me is that she supposedly left the house for her run instead of her usual drive to the coffee shop, park, and then start her run from there.
Also , no one saw her out running that morning.
No one.
One Heather stated while being interviewed that she saw NC out running all the time.
So , on a Saturday morning, when lots of people are out running , walking, biking, etc. someone would have seen her, IMO.
Okay, I have read all the affidavits and I have followed all the posts here so I know that I am kinda going "backwards" by bringing this up again. BUT........to me this is where it all started. BC says that NC left the house on a run. IMO , she did not.
Oh, one more thought.
Who can get up and go running after being out late at a party the night before?
Especially if she had some wine, or other alcohol to drink at the party.
Very dehydrating!
Okay, that's it. That's my story and I am sticking to it. :)

Hello and welcome runnermom !

Good thoughts especially if Nancy didn't return home til midnight and as BC says she likes wine. Not impossible I suppose but. Dunno about this jogging story at all to be honest. Thanks for the insight.

I kind of think the jogging story is a load and I have to wonder why BC declares in his affidavit that Nancy went running with Carrie, lines 171- 175, but yet in lines 181 - 183 it becomes clear that the last place BC went to look in his driving around looking for Nancy was to Carrie's residence. This doesn't make sense to me - seems like that should have been the first place to look actually.

I also wonder how her cell phone ended up in her car...

[raisincharlie]

Hi Bren Bren or runnermomof5:

Don't be discouraged if people don't respond to you. That happens to me all the time. Just keep posting and you'll get someone's attention.

I too don't believe she went out jogging that morning. For all the reasons you said, PLUS,........how could she go on a 2 hour jog when she was due to be painting at 8:00, ONE HOUR from when she was to alleged to have left the house? Doesn't make sense, IMO.

Also, about her time. Remember, she was injurred, which was why she was no longer 'seriously' running. PLUS, she did have chrones disease, which,from what I've read, can be very hard on your body.

Nice post runnermomof5,
:)
fran

Maybe Brad didn't know Nancy was supposed to be at Jessica's :bang:

[Bob&Bob]

Hey Guys!
I posted on the Nancy the Jogger link when Pepper set it up. Then, Pepper got canned. So I am going to repeat some of my thoughts here.
Cause I am starting to feel like Bob. Sometimes I wonder, does anyone out there see me? LOL
Except my name is Brenda.
So, instead of "Bob Bob" , I guess you can call me "Bren Bren".
Anyway, as a long time runner, I immediately saw several red flags with BC story about NC going for a run at 7 and not returning.
Okay.
Briefly:
NC was in training for a half marathon with her friend Jessica A.
Saturday and Sunday mornings are prime mornings for what serious runners call "long runs". Usually shorter distance runs, say 3-4 miles, are done during the week and the longer runs of training are done on the weekends. Okay, IMO, Nancy would not have gone out on a run on Saturday without Jessica.
Also, since they were training together, they most likely were following a training schedule which would lead up to the half marathon. I think Jessica even mentioned this, that she and NC had discussed all their training plans.
Someone posted the finishing time for NC and HM from a 5K race a few years ago. Since they had the same finishing time, they most likely ran the race together.
Not a very fast time for someone who was supposedly quite athletic and had aspirations for being in the Olympics at one time. Of course, that is around the time NC babies were being born, too. So, she may have not been putting in much running time back then.
Another thing that bothers me is that she supposedly left the house for her run instead of her usual drive to the coffee shop, park, and then start her run from there.
Also , no one saw her out running that morning.
No one.
One Heather stated while being interviewed that she saw NC out running all the time.
So , on a Saturday morning, when lots of people are out running , walking, biking, etc. someone would have seen her, IMO.
Okay, I have read all the affidavits and I have followed all the posts here so I know that I am kinda going "backwards" by bringing this up again. BUT........to me this is where it all started. BC says that NC left the house on a run. IMO , she did not.
Oh, one more thought.
Who can get up and go running after being out late at a party the night before?
Especially if she had some wine, or other alcohol to drink at the party.
Very dehydrating!
Okay, that's it. That's my story and I am sticking to it. :)

What happened to Pepper?

[Just the Fax]

Pepper apparently was banned.
I suppose you need to ask the mod if you need a forwarding address.

[Bob&Bob]

Why would I need a forwarding address?

[Just the Fax]

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s216/alive695/site.jpg

Like with most murders, Brad's computer should be very interesting to the cops.
Wonder if he used 'Google earth' shortly before the murder ?
Though the road is now paved, it still depicts the only area within 2 miles of his house that was hidden and undeveloped.

Of all areas around the home, convenient for the killer to know there was an area 1.1 miles in the very back of an established subdivision where nobody would see him dump the body.....Hmmm

[Bob&Bob]

Thanks for the answer. I really appreciate it.

[fran]

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s216/alive695/site.jpg

Like with most murders, Brad's computer should be very interesting to the cops.
Wonder if he used 'Google earth' shortly before the murder ?
Though the road is now paved, it still depicts the only area within 2 miles of his house that was hidden and undeveloped.

Of all areas around the home, convenient for the killer to know there was an area 1.1 miles in the very back of an established subdivision where nobody would see him dump the body.....Hmmm

What a coincidence! The only place undeveloped and no witness. Yeah, I'm sure Nancy would run there. NOT.

JMHO
fran

[jilly]

testing testing

:rotfl:You're a hoot Bob&Bob! Why don't you tell us a little about yourself!:)

[raisincharlie]

I haven't been jogging lately.

ROFL

Bad things happen when you go jogging...

[jilly]

I haven't been jogging lately.

LOL - well that was certainly a "little"! Thanks for that! hehe.

[SleuthyGal]

Of all areas around the home, convenient for the killer to know there was an area 1.1 miles in the very back of an established subdivision where nobody would see him dump the bodyYES! Especially since I'm certain that NC was not killed in the spot in which she was found. Although LE has not publicly released this info, I believe it will come to light that the area she was found was just the 'dump' site.

And if that's true, as I suspect it is, the question then becomes, from exactly WHERE was she "kidnapped" during "her run," and where was she killed, if she was "jogging?"

[wirehair]

OOPs!! I hit the wrong button. Large letters at the top--Information Needed for Cooper Murder Investigation. Then there is a large picture of NC. Under the picture there is the physical description and age. Next, it tells what she was last wearing. The flyer then tells what her route was thought to be in Lochmere Lake and Regency Park areas. Under this is the CrimeStoppers Logo with telephone number. Last on the page is the contact number and person at the CPD. The LE just asked me if I saw anything, no matter how small if I was out that morning. I told him I was not. I also told him that I hope the investigators checked the nooks and crannies of all of his watches because I don't think he would have scrubbed his expensive watches under the water. He said he would pass that on. If you notice in the terrific pictures that were posted on the previous page, when you compare the close up in the first picture to the second that shows where the body was dumped, one can see that the lay of the land drops off between the edge of the road and the silt fence. That's the way it appears to me...just enough that you would have to walk closer to the edge of the road to see her. I still haven't been down that road yet to see for myself. I don't want to go alone.

[raisincharlie]

YES! Especially since I'm certain that NC was not killed in the spot in which she was found. Although LE has not publicly released this info, I believe it will come to light that the area she was found was just the 'dump' site.

And if that's true, as I suspect it is, the question then becomes, from exactly WHERE was she "kidnapped" during "her run," and where was she killed, if she was "jogging?"


If you look at post 4 in the maps thread - it shows the search area. As I recall this area was established based on information of where Nancy normally ran. They got close but never crossed Holly Springs Road. So yeah, it looks like the location was indeed a dump site.

ETA in looking in the search area it seems to me observant runners could well know there was nothing over there- no occupied homes or developments.

[wirehair]

The other part of my first post didn't make it I see. I hit the wrong button. I left home after my first post, came home and couldn't get the site to work, left again tonight so when I got home I had to catch up before I could post about the flyer.

[raisincharlie]

OOPs!! I hit the wrong button. Large letters at the top--Information Needed for Cooper Murder Investigation. Then there is a large picture of NC. Under the picture there is the physical description and age. Next, it tells what she was last wearing. The flyer then tells what her route was thought to be in Lochmere Lake and Regency Park areas. Under this is the CrimeStoppers Logo with telephone number. Last on the page is the contact number and person at the CPD. The LE just asked me if I saw anything, no matter how small if I was out that morning. I told him I was not. I also told him that I hope the investigators checked the nooks and crannies of all of his watches because I don't think he would have scrubbed his expensive watches under the water. He said he would pass that on. If you notice in the terrific pictures that were posted on the previous page, when you compare the close up in the first picture to the second that shows where the body was dumped, one can see that the lay of the land drops off between the edge of the road and the silt fence. That's the way it appears to me...just enough that you would have to walk closer to the edge of the road to see her. I still haven't been down that road yet to see for myself. I don't want to go alone.

Thanks very much for that information about the fliers. Not being from the area - Holly Springs Road runs pretty much north to south yes ? The body was found east and the search area was primarily to the west of Holly Springs Road - yes ? Is it clear to you if Nancy was found actually in the water or above the silt fence closer to the turn around? Sorry for so many questions !

I don't think you should go alone.

[SleuthyGal]

I still haven't been down that road yet to see for myself. I don't want to go alone.

I want to see this area and road too, but I don't want to go alone either. Even with my dog as company I think it would still freak me out. I'm about 5 mi away, closer to the Bond Park area.

BTW, VERY GOOD idea for LE to check the watches!

[SleuthyGal]

I need to go back and look at the pixs again. What I'm missing is more of a wide/establishing shot but with a body outline in it. I'm still having some trouble picturing the exact layout.

[Busylady]

I guess I am confused by the pictures showing the red outline, the 911 call states she was in water, the pictures of LE at the scene show them around the water. In addition, i think its busier than people think, a man walking his dog found the body, there is another picture of a man jogging that shows the location Nancy was found.

If she wasnt jogging and killed there, it would be very easy for a vehicle to back up on the paved road and place her there, not much distance between the paved road and the body location from what I understand.

[wirehair]

All of us locals need to meet somewhere and follow each other down there. RaisinCharlie: You are correct about the north,south,east, and west business. I didn't appear from the pictures that she could not have been in the water. We had a big rain and storm on that Friday night but I doubt that the water in the basin would have gotten that hight. I have a large dog too; but he's too young to predict how he would react if there was any trouble. I have never seen anyone running down Holly Springs Road. The shoulder is terrible in that area and there's a lot of traffic. I haven't see many run on Ten Ten Road or Kildaire Farm Road either.

[raisincharlie]

All of us locals need to meet somewhere and follow each other down there. RaisinCharlie: You are correct about the north,south,east, and west business. I didn't appear from the pictures that she could not have been in the water. We had a big rain and storm on that Friday night but I doubt that the water in the basin would have gotten that hight. I have a large dog too; but he's too young to predict how he would react if there was any trouble. I have never seen anyone running down Holly Springs Road. The shoulder is terrible in that area and there's a lot of traffic. I haven't see many run on Ten Ten Road or Kildaire Farm Road either.

Thanks ! The reason I asked about location was I recalled in one of the photo gallerys (either WRAL or the N & O) that during the search of the Cooper residence there were several photos of LE looking in the wheel wells and under the BMW Suv - kind of made me think there were tire tracks at the scene or lots of debris on the cul de sac roadway - can't think of any other reason they would be doing such an inspection.

[SleuthyGal]

All of us locals need to meet somewhere and follow each other down there.

Count me in anytime!

[wirehair]

Maybe some silt from the sholders washed onto the pavement after the rain Friday night.

[carolinalady]

I thought the body was found in the area where the white tarp is. I just guessed that was there to preserve any evidence (since it was raining on the day she was found).

So, is the pic w/ the body outline/location one released by LE?

ETA link to picture from media w/ LE standing where body was recoved: http://www.wral.com/news/local/image/3210731/. This is why I thought she was found in the area of the white tarp.

[carolinalady]

Hey Guys!
I posted on the Nancy the Jogger link when Pepper set it up. Then, Pepper got canned. So I am going to repeat some of my thoughts here.
Cause I am starting to feel like Bob. Sometimes I wonder, does anyone out there see me? LOL
Except my name is Brenda.
So, instead of "Bob Bob" , I guess you can call me "Bren Bren".
Anyway, as a long time runner, I immediately saw several red flags with BC story about NC going for a run at 7 and not returning.
Okay.
Briefly:
NC was in training for a half marathon with her friend Jessica A.
Saturday and Sunday mornings are prime mornings for what serious runners call "long runs". Usually shorter distance runs, say 3-4 miles, are done during the week and the longer runs of training are done on the weekends. Okay, IMO, Nancy would not have gone out on a run on Saturday without Jessica.
Also, since they were training together, they most likely were following a training schedule which would lead up to the half marathon. I think Jessica even mentioned this, that she and NC had discussed all their training plans.
Someone posted the finishing time for NC and HM from a 5K race a few years ago. Since they had the same finishing time, they most likely ran the race together.
Not a very fast time for someone who was supposedly quite athletic and had aspirations for being in the Olympics at one time. Of course, that is around the time NC babies were being born, too. So, she may have not been putting in much running time back then.
Another thing that bothers me is that she supposedly left the house for her run instead of her usual drive to the coffee shop, park, and then start her run from there.
Also , no one saw her out running that morning.
No one.
One Heather stated while being interviewed that she saw NC out running all the time.
So , on a Saturday morning, when lots of people are out running , walking, biking, etc. someone would have seen her, IMO.
Okay, I have read all the affidavits and I have followed all the posts here so I know that I am kinda going "backwards" by bringing this up again. BUT........to me this is where it all started. BC says that NC left the house on a run. IMO , she did not.
Oh, one more thought.
Who can get up and go running after being out late at a party the night before?
Especially if she had some wine, or other alcohol to drink at the party.
Very dehydrating!
Okay, that's it. That's my story and I am sticking to it. :)

Welcome!

I agree that drinking alcohol is very dehydrating. However, to me that is just not a reason to assume she did not run. Neither is being out until midnight. I know lots of people who just plain need less sleep than I do. Also, we have yet to see any information about how much she drank. She might have had 1 glass or 2 and she might have had water between. We just don't know. BTW, I regularly run and exercise in the early morning hours after an evening when I've had a drink or two. SO, it is definitely doable.

I would think that someone should have seen her out and about though. On my runs around that same time (in the Raleigh area not Lochmere/Cary), traffic is sparse (in comparison of a weekday), but I can't think of a single time when I didn't see a person/car while out and about. IF someone did see her, I hope they do come forward.

As for her times in the previous race being a non-competitive time, I agree. Perhaps she wasn't in top form, perhaps her "friend" wasn't in top shape and she was being a good running partner and sticking with her.

I know that her friends and family have to be her voice since Nancy is no longer here. However, I still have not made up my mind about BC's involvement. I really want to see how some of his statements check out. Plus I'd like to hear the COD and see what was seized in the searches.

[MoonFlwr]

CarolinaLady

I agree. My brother is a die-hard runner when he is in training and he will get up to run, no matter what alcohol he consumed the night before or how late he went to bed! (He's nuts! :D )

[raisincharlie]

I guess I am confused by the pictures showing the red outline, the 911 call states she was in water, the pictures of LE at the scene show them around the water. In addition, i think its busier than people think, a man walking his dog found the body, there is another picture of a man jogging that shows the location Nancy was found.

If she wasnt jogging and killed there, it would be very easy for a vehicle to back up on the paved road and place her there, not much distance between the paved road and the body location from what I understand.

I don't believe that red outline was any work of LE to be honest. The July 14th press conference of the Cary Chief clearly indicates the body was in the drainage area. Additionally if you listen to the 911 call of the man who found the body, he states it was down an embankment and also that the only reason he noticed it was because of the vultures - not because it was out in the open. Taking those things into account I find it very unlikely that the photograph referenced is the actual location of the body when initially found nor done by LE.

http://www.wral.com/news/video/3211708/

[OtisCampbell]

My impression was that the white sheet was placed there to aid in the removal of the body from the water. This would help in preventing any evidence from being compromised.

It wouldn't make a lot of sense to take the body to this secluded area then lay it on the edge of a pretty steep embankment.

[Just the Fax]

I thought the body was found in the area where the white tarp is. I just guessed that was there to preserve any evidence (since it was raining on the day she was found).

So, is the pic w/ the body outline/location one released by LE?

ETA link to picture from media w/ LE standing where body was recoved: http://www.wral.com/news/local/image/3210731/. This is why I thought she was found in the area of the white tarp.


The white "tarp" was not placed by the cops as a similar one is on other storm basin's on the other 2-3 undeveloped cul de sacs

I outlined the body in 'red' when I posted the pic.
There were 2 bouquets of flowers specifically in that spot, so there is a good chance it was placed by someone that knew for sure.

Sheriff Harrison did say the body was found just off the road and not in the water. Like wirehair noticed, the spot is recessed from the road and shoulder grade so a body would not be obvious if one drove in the cul-de-sac and turned around. The walker said he went over there because he saw vultures circling overhead. It would have also been close enough to the road (10') that his dog could 'sniff' if he was tethered to a retractable leash. Also, it was close enough where a strong man could basically 'toss' her body without stepping on the shoulder , leaving shoe impressions.

There was no debris or dirt in the road, so I am unsure why the cops inspected his tires....unless there were tire impressions on the immediate shoulder (I think he was smarter than that).

[fran]

There was no debris or dirt in the road, so I am unsure why the cops inspected his tires....unless there were tire impressions on the immediate shoulder (I think he was smarter than that).

A wise person once said on our forum, 'there's no school for committing murder.' or something like that.

Don't be so sure the killer was too smart to drive onto the immediate shoulder.

This same wise person said the 'most difficult part of a murder for a perp, is, what? to do with the body.'

JMHO
fran

[Just the Fax]

A wise person once said on our forum, 'there's no school for committing murder.' or something like that.

Don't be so sure the killer was too smart to drive onto the immediate shoulder.

This same wise person said the 'most difficult part of a murder for a perp, is, what? to do with the body.'

JMHO
fran

Very true...that's why we see so many 'how to' google searches on many killer's computer hard drives.

Yes, disposing of the body is usually a big challenge. W/O an elaborate scheme to destroy or bury it, a body is often staged to make the death appear it was actually something it was not (accident, suicide, sex assault)

Because of Brad's burning desire for the ME to release the autopsy, something tells me she might have been found with her jogging shorts torn away and there was evidence of vaginal bruising and tearing.

[raisincharlie]

Refresher link:

http://www.wral.com/news/local/video/3210710/


ETA - I suspect the white tarps were laid by the developer for erosion control, not by LE.

[CARYISHOME]

There was no debris or dirt in the road, so I am unsure why the cops inspected his tires....unless there were tire impressions on the immediate shoulder (I think he was smarter than that).


My husband and I went there last weekend. We had to park our car because there was sherriff's tape across the road that goes off to the right from Fielding Dr. as you're facing the end of Fielding. Sorry, I don't know the name of that road. As we walked I noted there was a lot of dirt and mud (it rained last weekend) on the road. For those of you who aren't from around here we have mostly clay-like dirt, not the typical dirt you might expect.

Construction pallets and vehicles are stored along side of that road. With the construction traffic and LE traffic there were a lot of tire tracks that could be seen.

So, to get to the dump site you would have to go through all that dirt. I don't recall what the weather was that Friday night, but the dirt may have been dry that night. If so, I am not sure if enough would have stuck to the tires after the trip home and around.

You're right, Just the Fax, the cul-de-sac where she was found is clean.

[Just the Fax]

Refresher link:

http://www.wral.com/news/local/video/3210710/


ETA - I suspect the white tarps were laid by the developer for erosion control, not by LE.


Yes, as I said all the other storm drains on the other roads had a similar white tarp.

[Just the Fax]

My husband and I went there last weekend. We had to park our car because there was sherriff's tape across the road that goes off to the right from Fielding Dr. as you're facing the end of Fielding. Sorry, I don't know the name of that road. As we walked I noted there was a lot of dirt and mud (it rained last weekend) on the road. For those of you who aren't from around here we have mostly clay-like dirt, not the typical dirt you might expect.

Construction pallets and vehicles are stored along side of that road. With the construction traffic and LE traffic there were a lot of tire tracks that could be seen.

So, to get to the dump site you would have to go through all that dirt. I don't recall what the weather was that Friday night, but the dirt may have been dry that night. If so, I am not sure if enough would have stuck to the tires after the trip home and around.

You're right, Just the Fax, the cul-de-sac where she was found is clean.


Thanks CARYISHOME, I do now recall an area before the turn into the actual cul de sac that was covered with red clay.
Unfortunelly, it rained very hard before the body was found so any impressions left Saturday am would likely be washed away as mud.:mad:

[allboys]

My husband and I went there last weekend. We had to park our car because there was sherriff's tape across the road that goes off to the right from Fielding Dr. as you're facing the end of Fielding. Sorry, I don't know the name of that road. As we walked I noted there was a lot of dirt and mud (it rained last weekend) on the road. For those of you who aren't from around here we have mostly clay-like dirt, not the typical dirt you might expect.

Construction pallets and vehicles are stored along side of that road. With the construction traffic and LE traffic there were a lot of tire tracks that could be seen.

So, to get to the dump site you would have to go through all that dirt. I don't recall what the weather was that Friday night, but the dirt may have been dry that night. If so, I am not sure if enough would have stuck to the tires after the trip home and around.




You're right, Just the Fax, the cul-de-sac where she was found is clean.


We went to the pool that Friday night, so I remember it was a nice night. However, it did rain on Monday (before her body was found), so I wonder if that would have worn away any tire impressions, foot prints etc.

[carolinalady]

Yes, as I said all the other storm drains on the other roads had a similar white tarp.

Thanks for that info!

[raisincharlie]

We went to the pool that Friday night, so I remember it was a nice night. However, it did rain on Monday (before her body was found), so I wonder if that would have worn away any tire impressions, foot prints etc.

If nothing else the rain probably was sufficeint enough to distort tracks and footprints to the point they may have been unusable. Possible the only tracks of use were from the man who found her body.