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mystified
08-13-2008, 07:37 PM
Post away ~ tell us why you think Casey is still alive.

Anita Richman
08-13-2008, 07:39 PM
I don't believe poor little Caylee is still alive, but your thread looked incredibly lonely!

:blowkiss:

kathyn2
08-13-2008, 08:13 PM
I don't think she is alive either. :-( In fact I feel it in my bones she is dead. If she was alive Casey would have had to tell all these whopper lies. As Anita said the thread looks very lonely so I thought I would give it a post.

armywife210
08-13-2008, 08:18 PM
:cry: I was really REALLY hoping that SOMEBODY would think she was still alive.... not me though, realistically.

SelmaClue
08-13-2008, 08:29 PM
If you think she's still alive, you have to buy the abduction fairytale. That's your only option.
:(

Hailiejade77
08-13-2008, 08:42 PM
IF Caylee is still alive,.. I don't think she was kidnapped. I think she was sold. That would be the ONLY reason a mother would keep quiet about her kid being gone. (from either being sold or being killed) jmo

RoseRed
08-13-2008, 08:50 PM
I do not believe the nanny/babysitter story but she could be with someone known to Casey.

Alyzabeth
08-13-2008, 08:57 PM
I think Caylee is alive because they haven't found a body yet. I think if Casey had killed her or accidentally allowed some means of her death, Casey would have run and they would be searching for her right now too. She didn't run, she stayed put as if nothing was wrong. Even the simplest minded person attempts to flee when they are in trouble.
I personally do not buy the kidnapping story and I do not believe Caylee is dead.
I think Casey knows exactly where she is and that she is safe with a trusted friend. I think for whatever reason, Casey feels it is necessary to hide her.
Who knows, maybe she was so afraid of her parents getting custody she figured she better beat them to the punch. Look at how Caseys parents are now with the media and all this other crap...would you want them to get custody of your child? Who knows what kind of info they may have been holding over her head that would have helped them to achieve that? I'm not making accusations towards anyone, I am just trying to reason it out.
I just don't think Casey harmed her daughter. I could be wrong, of course, but it is the only way I can explain her lack of emotion.

lisalei321
08-13-2008, 08:57 PM
I'm still hoping (major sigh) that this is some reallllly stupid publicity hoax....(I know, trust me, I know)

SelmaClue
08-13-2008, 08:58 PM
After all this brouhaha and nationwide press, if this child had been with someone ... how long would she have been kept alive after the circus hit town? Caylee is 3 years old. She can talk. She can tell people what happened. Sad to say, but .... you know.
:(

Evan's Mom
08-13-2008, 08:58 PM
I do not believe the nanny/babysitter story but she could be with someone known to Casey.

This is my hope.

not_my_kids
08-13-2008, 09:15 PM
I believe she is alive and I am not going with the abduction, I am going with Mommy sold her. I will believe that until I am sure she dead. i.e. a body, substantial blood, believable confession.

MaggieMom
08-13-2008, 09:17 PM
I'm a newbie in denial....yes, I believe Caylee is alive.

SelmaClue
08-13-2008, 09:20 PM
I believe she is alive and I am not going with the abduction, I am going with Mommy sold her. I will believe that until I am sure she dead. i.e. a body, substantial blood, believable confession.

I'm thinkin' .......... If Casey "sold" her, she wouldn't have had to forge checks and steal money from her friend Amy after the "sale" -- but she did.

tiffertots
08-13-2008, 09:26 PM
I am so torn with this case. Though the sensible part of me can see all the negative evidence piling up...I still have doubts. I need Proof!!

I've done some "research" of my own. Mind you I am in no way an expert on anything...
But I do believe that Casey loved her child...A picture says a 1000 words and in one in particular, when little Caylee is looking up at her mom and Casey is looking into the camera, you can tell that this little girl loves her mother...That is why I don't see that there was ever a history of abuse. Their family was once close...I've seen many Myspace comments referring to family gatherings, dinners, Caylee wanting to see her Uncle Lee, "sunday funday" etc...Maybe they had some dysfunction in the mix...but whose family doesn't?

If there had been an accident I think Casey would have phoned police...The ONLY reason I can see that she wouldn't is if there was something illegal involved. And I DO think there is something very illegal involved. It wouldn't surprise me given the environment she was in.

Nevertheless, am waiting to hear the DNA EVIDENCE before concluding that this child is no longer alive.

Casey claims that she told Jeff Hopkins about Caylees disapearence. He supposedly introduced the nanny to Casey. Although he and Casey did not work together it seems that they are friends on Myspace. There have been comments back and forth between them. After scrolling through his comments I've come to the conclusion that he was a very popular guy. Very connected with this crowd. Everyone wanted to hang out and party with him. Then I found comments asking him where he has been...as if he'd stopped partying. Granted those comments were sent many months ago. His comments are very limited since this story broke...I believe that many have been deleted because there are some weeks that there are no comments at all...very strange..Is he hiding something?? What or Who does he know that is connected to this...Have they questioned him thoroughly?

I also think there is a close, personal friend of hers that knows something...someone with whom she has a past, old friend, old love...Someone she could trust with this secret...someone who cares for her very deeply!!

I've been studying Casey's "Diary of Days" blog she posted on July 7. I have my own theories to that as well...maybe it contains clues that no one has uncovered yet.
I have memorized it and sadly, it is stuck in my brain...I run through it over and over trying to decode it. maybe soon I will.

The only reasoning I can give for her non-caring attitude is that she indeed give her child to someone on purpose and wanted that person to keep Caylee safe. Maybe that is why she gave a false name or misdirected the police. She claims to have spoken to Caylee and possibly the nanny on July 15, but it has not been revealed what was said...What did the nanny say to her?? What did Caylee say to her??

If the evidence from the trunk comes back negative for Caylee's DNA but positive for someone else's DNA...Then that would explain her wanting immunity for information on the whereabouts of Caylee. If not...hey I'll admit I was duped!! I'll admit that everyone else is right and I'm completly wrong!

I know that all this sounds like a Hollywood movie...but it is possible! Anything is possible.There is 98% chance that I am wrong...hell 99.9% of posters here will tell me I'm wrong!
I will say this...I don't know that she is alive...but I don't think she is dead.

My heart aches for her family because I myself know how it feels to have a close family member missing...unfortunatly my sister was not found alive. I know how it feels..I've carried that bright light of hope...only mine was tragically put out. It is devastating!!

I hope that is not the case here...I only pray that they don't have to wait any longer to find their answer...waiting is such torture.

So, if there is anyone reading this...anyone with close, personal ties to this case...I wish the very, very best in solving this mystery. I only hope that it has a happy ending...

Peace, Love, and Hope
Let's Bring Caylee Home

Hailiejade77
08-13-2008, 09:29 PM
I also think it might be possible that someone took Caylee out of the country. It could be very easily to buy "fake" birth certificates and disguise Caylee. The people that have her most likely left the country before she was even reported missing. I just have a hard time believing a mother would not be upset that their daughter was missing. Even cases where the family member was the killer,.. atleast they acted like they cared where the hell the person was to the media and police. Casey acts like she knows exactly who has her and that she is fine. I find it hard to believe as each day goes by though, that Caylee is still alive. I pray that she is though!

not_my_kids
08-13-2008, 09:36 PM
I'm thinkin' .......... If Casey "sold" her, she wouldn't have had to forge checks and steal money from her friend Amy after the "sale" -- but she did.

A lot of the time in human trafficking especially of children when the parents are involved, payment is deferred until the buyers are sure the paret will not talk. Or she could have regretted it and tried to buy her back.
Do the research on human trafficking, it is scary, real and almost unbelievable.

tiffertots
08-13-2008, 09:44 PM
I heard that none of her so called "friends" want to talk to police and that people are now claiming that they never even knew her...Who are they afraid of...None of them are talking!!

tttterri
08-13-2008, 09:45 PM
I'm sitting on the fence here but since LE will not give proof yet of her being dead, then I am keeping hope that she is alive also. Even in the LE press meetup today, the LE stated that it was THEIR hope and prayers that they will find Caylee safe also. So we are not alone in our hope. The link to that:
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/video/?autoStart=true&topVideoCatNo=default&clipId=2798642

Also on another thread a list of questions were floated around about things pointing to her being dead so I will put my answers on this thread along with the questions. If anyone wants to do that same, that would be great. Here's to hope til there is no hope! thanks for the thread!

A list of things from another thread:
A seasoned detective testified that he smelled decomp.
George smelled Decomp.
Cindy smelled Decomp.
My thoughts:
It has not been proven that the smell was decomp other than the dog hits. Dogs have failed although they have success often also.
If George and Cindy were sure they smelled decomp, George wouldnt have went onto work that day, Cindy wouldnt have been delaying her search to find Casey and would not have proceeded in washing clothes instead.
If detective smelled decomp, why the delay in waiting to seize the car?

Why did she abandon the car?
My thoughts:
It ran out of gas possibly. It has not been proven that it did not.
It may have been left on the 27th, which was a Friday. More important things awaited her, the Fusion All White Party date. She was broke since Amy wasnt gone on vacation yet and we do not know when the credit cards were cut from grandmother. She had just supposedly stole gas a few days earlier. After the wild weekend, it was Monday. Too late, car was towed and no money to go get it still.

Why is there hair,stain, and smell of decomp in trunk
My thoughts:
Beach trips will usually put clothing with hair in a trunk or other items, even a car seat could put hair in trunk if too many riders needed the room.
Stain could be spill from the laundry detergent which glows in black light, if that container existed.
Smell from a rotted pizza and laundry detergent could be real bad, unknown how bad, but that smell has not been proven as like the decomp smell has not been proven either.

Why did she fabricate Zenaida?
My thoughts:
It has not been proven that someone did not go by the alias of ZG and that Casey knew her.
If Casey did not want to report this ZG, then she would not give correct details but would lie.
If she did not, does not, want to report this ZG, it is possible that she does fear the results of what would happen if she did/does.

Why did she fabricate her job?
My thoughts:
She stated that she wanted to go there to Universal to see if they might somehow find out if the ZG person or Caylee had been seen there, how she thought she might find this out is unknown.
Why she did not tell the detectives that they needed to go there for leads is unknown.

Why did she not just "pick up" Caylee from this so called person after Cindy forced her to admit she hadn't seen her.
My thoughts:
She really could not find the person because the person was given Caylee, bought Caylee, or stole Caylee, and the person left the country or the person is someone who she wanted and still wants to have Caylee forever instead of her parents or DSS.

Why did she borrow a shovel?
My thoughts:
She may have used it to open the shed. Her father may have been reporting the stolen gas late, or he may have added that info to give a better report. It is always better to have a breaking into than it is to have just something stolen from an unlocked shed. Maybe George decided to report the stolen gas just to make Casey come home, but it didnt work because she did come, but without Caylee, and then, she didnt stay.

Why did she tell everyone who asked "she is with the nanny" she is with my parents" conflicting statements.
My thoughts:
Maybe she was using both as sitters during that time. Note that on the 15th, she was with her mother.

Why would she say she was conducting her own investigation if she willingly let Caylee go with someone?
My thoughts:
She had to give a reason for not reporting and that sounded like one, even though she admitted it was a stupid one later.

What kind of invisible, untraceable, heartless individual would have not come forward with Caylee by now?
My thoughts:
Someone who loves her as their own and wants a child badly, possibly not in their own right mind. Someone who is a sex predator. Someone who sold her. Someone who got rid of her body a long time ago already.

redmamatwo
08-13-2008, 09:49 PM
I also think it might be possible that someone took Caylee out of the country. It could be very easily to buy "fake" birth certificates and disguise Caylee. The people that have her most likely left the country before she was even reported missing. I just have a hard time believing a mother would not be upset that their daughter was missing. Even cases where the family member was the killer,.. atleast they acted like they cared where the hell the person was to the media and police. Casey acts like she knows exactly who has her and that she is fine. I find it hard to believe as each day goes by though, that Caylee is still alive. I pray that she is though!

I'm not sure what I think at this point, I have been on the fence from day one. I think though if she is still alive this scenario is probable. That someone took her out of the country. Especially since no one knew she was gone for a month. Seems unlikely to me, with everything else, but I am trying to be hopeful. I would rather hear that someone took her than her mother killed her. Let's pray that's right. I have noticed on some other threads that people think that the kidnappers haven't asked for ransom, or demanded anything, so it seems unlikely she's been kidnapped, but People kidnap kids all the time just cause they want kids! It's that simple. I just hope it's that and not something sinister. We'll just have to wait for the evidence.

SelmaClue
08-13-2008, 09:50 PM
There's a river in Egypt.....

tiffertots
08-13-2008, 09:54 PM
If an accident occurred which resulted in Caylee's death...why not call 911...Casey seems like the dramatic type anyway...and if God forbid this did happen, and if Casey was as cold-hearted as she has been said to be, and if she is such an attention hog, then the pity and condolence for her tragedy would have been desirable to her. Then she could have played off the whole woe-is-me crap!!

tiffertots
08-13-2008, 09:57 PM
now let's not be cynical...SelmaClue...those of us who have different opinions are simply posting them...like everyone else

Amberjack
08-13-2008, 09:57 PM
I used to believe "no body; no death"...Prove it.

The cadaver dogs hitting on the trunk & Casey's odd behavior points to a death. Seems to me, Casey is "waiting on something" Time to pass?....Caylee will not be found.

tiffertots
08-13-2008, 09:58 PM
I'm just saying there's something very wrong with this picture...and until I see DNA evidence and/or a body...I'm not convinced!

tiffertots
08-13-2008, 09:59 PM
Maybe there was a body...but what if it wasn't Caylee's

SelmaClue
08-13-2008, 10:00 PM
now let's not be cynical...SelmaClue...those of us who have different opinions are simply posting them...like everyone else

Well, I wasn't really trying to be cynical. I just am. I admit that I am guilty of stating my opinion one too many times. Sorry.
:bang:

Amberjack
08-13-2008, 10:01 PM
Why did she fabricate Zenaida?
My thoughts:
It has not been proven that someone did not go by the alias of ZG and that Casey knew her.
If Casey did not want to report this ZG, then she would not give correct details but would lie.
If she did not, does not, want to report this ZG, it is possible that she does fear the results of what would happen if she did/does.

How did Casey know that a ZG visited the Sawgrass Apts on June 17th and looked at Apt. 210?

tiffertots
08-13-2008, 10:02 PM
I think we're all guilty of that!! But you know what they say about opinions... :-)

Amberjack
08-13-2008, 10:02 PM
Maybe there was a body...but what if it wasn't Caylee's

Where and who is it?

tiffertots
08-13-2008, 10:03 PM
I just wish I were a fly on the wall...you know??

SelmaClue
08-13-2008, 10:09 PM
I think we're all guilty of that!! But you know what they say about opinions... :-)

I only know what they say about excuses...
:crazy:

Amberjack
08-13-2008, 10:10 PM
You suggested it...Who else is missing from the Orlando area?
No one.

not_my_kids
08-13-2008, 10:11 PM
You suggested it...Who else is missing from the Orlando area?
No one.

Bodies are often found hundreds of miles from where they were missing from. Not to mention the huge number of people that are never reported...as CAylee almost wasn't.

tiffertots
08-13-2008, 10:12 PM
are you saying that you know for a fact AmberJack that there have been no other murders/missing persons in the Orlando area since june 15?

tiffertots
08-13-2008, 10:14 PM
oops...Greta's on...can't miss this!!

tiffertots
08-13-2008, 10:29 PM
Couldn't the actions and demeanor of Casey be explained as a mother who felt that her child was with someone and was safe, rather than in harms way.
If she had murdered Caylee, don't you think she would have disapeared. She had plenty of time to do so. If there had been sooo much conflict at home, Cindy was too overbearing and controlling, wouldn't it have have been easier to pack up all her stuff, leave a note that said she was taking her daughter with her, and moving on with her life. Then she could have disapeared into the night...I'm sure her parents would have tried to find her...but if you want to disapear...you can!!
It just doesn't make sense to me.

Amberjack
08-13-2008, 10:32 PM
Maybe there was a body...but what if it wasn't Caylee's

I thought you implied
the cadaver dogs hit on someone else in Casey's car trunk.

not_my_kids
08-13-2008, 10:40 PM
Just thought that I would bring up that since June 15th, there are 121 reported children on the NCMEC website. That is just for FL, just children and just the ones that were reported.
http://www.missingkids.com/missingkids/servlet/PubCaseSearchServlet

Among them are:
ERIC M CAMACHO Age 17, Missing from Orlando since 7/7/08
RICARDO KING Age 17, missing from Orlando since 6/16/08
KIANA A. REYNOLDS Age 16, missing from Orlando since 7/11/08

Those are just from Orlando proper. I would go on, but it would just be repetitive.

tiffertots
08-13-2008, 10:41 PM
Until DNA evidence concludes that CAYLEE'S decomposed fluid/hair whatever was in the trunk of that car...I'm not buyin it!
If there is evidence of decomposition and the DNA does not match that of Caylee's then it must belong to someone else...If it does match Caylee..I'll stand corrected!

tiffertots
08-13-2008, 10:46 PM
maybe that "someone else" is the reason that Casey wants immunity

not_my_kids
08-13-2008, 10:48 PM
Until DNA evidence concludes that CAYLEE'S decomposed fluid/hair whatever was in the trunk of that car...I'm not buyin it!
If there is evidence of decomposition and the DNA does not match that of Caylee's then it must belong to someone else...If it does match Caylee..I'll stand corrected!


Congratulations on sticking to a theory, whether you are right or wrong, I support your determination. I believe she is alive, but I do play devils advocate sometimes, because there are parts of the whole thing that are hard to explain. Casey has not put herself in a good position, regardless of her guilt or innocence.

Anita Richman
08-13-2008, 10:55 PM
Couldn't the actions and demeanor of Casey be explained as a mother who felt that her child was with someone and was safe, rather than in harms way.
If she had murdered Caylee, don't you think she would have disapeared. She had plenty of time to do so. If there had been sooo much conflict at home, Cindy was too overbearing and controlling, wouldn't it have have been easier to pack up all her stuff, leave a note that said she was taking her daughter with her, and moving on with her life. Then she could have disapeared into the night...I'm sure her parents would have tried to find her...but if you want to disapear...you can!!
It just doesn't make sense to me.

But if she disappeared, she wouldn't be able to spend time with Tony. Oh, wait a second...she did and she was...until Amy told Cindy where she was (at Tony's) and Cindy came and got her.:bang:

I am guessing that Casey has a mental illness that allows her to:
1. Lie and lie and lie and lie (and steal)
2. Get busted in a lie, and still lie without skipping a beat (ie "working" at Universal)
3. Kill or let her daughter die accidentally and then cover it up
4. Not show normal emotion or let on that her daughter is dead
5. Lie about her daughter's where-abouts
6. Pretend that nothing is wrong
7. Hang out in jail and be the model prisoner (unlike most innocent parents, who would be screaming and fighting to get out and find their daughter!)

This doesn't make sense to most people because we are (for the most part) sane, healthy, normal adults. Casey Anthony is an aberration.

tiffertots
08-13-2008, 11:03 PM
I don't think so...

tiffertots
08-13-2008, 11:05 PM
I think there is more to the story...remember..you shouldn't believe everything you see on t.v.
Show me proof and I'll bow my head!

tiffertots
08-13-2008, 11:10 PM
dang..I must be in the wrong place...I thought it was a discussion thread for those who think Caylee's ALIVE...

tiffertots
08-13-2008, 11:10 PM
Gosh...it sure gets lonely in here... :-(

Amberjack
08-13-2008, 11:12 PM
What is your evidence that Caylee is alive?

Who's DNA did they come upon in the trunk?

Mohabi
08-13-2008, 11:16 PM
Gosh...it sure gets lonely in here... :-(

Let me sit here with you, in silence. I too will continue to believe she's alive. I will believe that until all my hopes are crushed with proof. Remember that you can't be lonely as long as you still have yourself.

Anita Richman
08-13-2008, 11:16 PM
dang..I must be in the wrong place...I thought it was a discussion thread for those who think Caylee's ALIVE...
Tiffertots, you DID ask some questions in the post I quoted. I was just answering you.

tiffertots
08-13-2008, 11:17 PM
I have no evidence...neither to they
unless they do and aren't saying
why wouldn't they turn this into a homicide investigation and put an end to the kidnapping rumors?
something tells me they the results were not conclusive

tiffertots
08-13-2008, 11:21 PM
gee I thought my questions could have been answered with a simple yes or no...i guess i was wrong

tttterri
08-14-2008, 12:12 AM
I might be wrong on this, but will know for sure when gretas transcript goes online and I can read it but....I believe I heard that DJ state that Casey was taking Caylee away and bringing her back repeatedly. He said Casey spent many nights there but Caylee didnt, that Casey would take her somewhere and then Casey would come back wo her. I will correct this tomorrow if that is not what he stated but it is what I thought I heard on tv! If this is true, there was a sitter, or the sitter was the trunk.

tiffertots
08-14-2008, 12:18 AM
anything is possible

tttterri
08-14-2008, 12:28 AM
I did hear it. Here is the link!

Straitfan
08-14-2008, 12:30 AM
Yes, anything is possible, no to those who post nasty comments insinuating others may just be ignorant! Because you, yourself, don't know the truth and stranger things have happened... I won't give my thoughts as once again don't care to be advised what a "River in Egpyt" I would buy.... I hope for Caylee's sweet precious self that everyone is off the mark and she is still alive.

AutomaticAuttie
08-14-2008, 01:59 AM
I am so torn with this case. Though the sensible part of me can see all the negative evidence piling up...I still have doubts. I need Proof!!

I've done some "research" of my own. Mind you I am in no way an expert on anything...
But I do believe that Casey loved her child...A picture says a 1000 words and in one in particular, when little Caylee is looking up at her mom and Casey is looking into the camera, you can tell that this little girl loves her mother...That is why I don't see that there was ever a history of abuse. Their family was once close...I've seen many Myspace comments referring to family gatherings, dinners, Caylee wanting to see her Uncle Lee, "sunday funday" etc...Maybe they had some dysfunction in the mix...but whose family doesn't?

If there had been an accident I think Casey would have phoned police...The ONLY reason I can see that she wouldn't is if there was something illegal involved. And I DO think there is something very illegal involved. It wouldn't surprise me given the environment she was in.

Nevertheless, am waiting to hear the DNA EVIDENCE before concluding that this child is no longer alive.

Casey claims that she told Jeff Hopkins about Caylees disapearence. He supposedly introduced the nanny to Casey. Although he and Casey did not work together it seems that they are friends on Myspace. There have been comments back and forth between them. After scrolling through his comments I've come to the conclusion that he was a very popular guy. Very connected with this crowd. Everyone wanted to hang out and party with him. Then I found comments asking him where he has been...as if he'd stopped partying. Granted those comments were sent many months ago. His comments are very limited since this story broke...I believe that many have been deleted because there are some weeks that there are no comments at all...very strange..Is he hiding something?? What or Who does he know that is connected to this...Have they questioned him thoroughly?

I also think there is a close, personal friend of hers that knows something...someone with whom she has a past, old friend, old love...Someone she could trust with this secret...someone who cares for her very deeply!!

I've been studying Casey's "Diary of Days" blog she posted on July 7. I have my own theories to that as well...maybe it contains clues that no one has uncovered yet.
I have memorized it and sadly, it is stuck in my brain...I run through it over and over trying to decode it. maybe soon I will.

The only reasoning I can give for her non-caring attitude is that she indeed give her child to someone on purpose and wanted that person to keep Caylee safe. Maybe that is why she gave a false name or misdirected the police. She claims to have spoken to Caylee and possibly the nanny on July 15, but it has not been revealed what was said...What did the nanny say to her?? What did Caylee say to her??

If the evidence from the trunk comes back negative for Caylee's DNA but positive for someone else's DNA...Then that would explain her wanting immunity for information on the whereabouts of Caylee. If not...hey I'll admit I was duped!! I'll admit that everyone else is right and I'm completly wrong!

I know that all this sounds like a Hollywood movie...but it is possible! Anything is possible.There is 98% chance that I am wrong...hell 99.9% of posters here will tell me I'm wrong!
I will say this...I don't know that she is alive...but I don't think she is dead.

My heart aches for her family because I myself know how it feels to have a close family member missing...unfortunatly my sister was not found alive. I know how it feels..I've carried that bright light of hope...only mine was tragically put out. It is devastating!!

I hope that is not the case here...I only pray that they don't have to wait any longer to find their answer...waiting is such torture.

So, if there is anyone reading this...anyone with close, personal ties to this case...I wish the very, very best in solving this mystery. I only hope that it has a happy ending...

Peace, Love, and Hope
Let's Bring Caylee Home

I would have to agree with most of what you have said. I just don't think she could have or would have killed her.

MommaShark
08-14-2008, 02:13 AM
I have no clue where this case is going. I do believe in my heart that regardless Casey was mixed up with some trouble. But I don't understand why everyone is so quick to hang her. I still have a feeling about this ZG that was at the sawgrass apts. Why should we believe her? Do we have any hard evidence to say she has nothing to do with this? I am grasping at straws here in hopes this beautiful little girl will be found ALIVE.

Amberjack
08-14-2008, 02:46 AM
Unfortunately, the cadaver dogs hit on the trunk of Casey's car.

chicoliving
08-14-2008, 03:07 AM
dang..I must be in the wrong place...I thought it was a discussion thread for those who think Caylee's ALIVE...

It is fine to discuss the reasons posters may have for a case that Caylee is alive. Just as it is ok for posters to disagree. There will not be a thread that welcomes only one viewpoint. As you can tell, it does not work.

Alyzabeth
08-14-2008, 06:18 AM
As absurd as it sounds, isn't it possible someone else used the Pontiac to transport a body? If it was a simple matter of running out of gas, how difficult is it to pour some gas into it and take off? They would just drop the car back off where Casey alledgedly left it when they were done. Who knew she left the car there?

unravel
08-14-2008, 08:49 AM
As absurd as it sounds, isn't it possible someone else used the Pontiac to transport a body?

I'll offer up another absurd possibility to explain the hits on/in the car.

Somebody with access to that car bought something secondhand (Garage/yard/estate sale? No wait, found on Craigslist, yea!). That item came from a house in which someone had passed, and the corpse had rested on/against it for some period of time before the body was removed. I'm thinking small furniture or storage, which would have been substantial enough for somebody to _try_ to pull themselves up on if they were incapacitated (reaching for a phone), AND been able to fit into a trunk.

Depending on that object's size, shape and weight, one person may have been able to move it but had difficulty with it. It could have been balanced awkwardly against the person's legs as it was put into the trunk, or left balanced against the rear end of the car for a period of time (payment is exchanged, smalltalk's made, they look at another item, there's enough time for the scent to "stick" to that area, which explains the taillights and the trunk].

The hits in the yard? That item was either for the yard, or placed there for a while before it was washed down.

------

I was sure Caylee was dead as soon as this story broke, and I still lean that way, but stranger things have happened, and truly, fact IS stranger than fiction. The longer we wait for DNA results to be released, the easier it becomes to entertain other possibilities. I'll post one in a minute.

Alyzabeth
08-14-2008, 08:56 AM
I'll offer up another absurd possibility to explain the hits on/in the car.

Somebody with access to that car bought something secondhand (Garage/yard/estate sale? No wait, found on Craigslist, yea!). That item came from a house in which someone had passed, and the corpse had rested on/against it for some period of time before the body was removed. I'm thinking small furniture or storage, which would have been substantial enough for somebody to _try_ to pull themselves up on if they were incapacitated (reaching for a phone), AND been able to fit into a trunk.

Depending on that object's size, shape and weight, one person may have been able to move it but had difficulty with it. It could have been balanced awkwardly against the person's legs as it was put into the trunk, or left balanced against the rear end of the car for a period of time (payment is exchanged, smalltalk's made, they look at another item, there's enough time for the scent to "stick" to that area, which explains the taillights and the trunk].

The hits in the yard? That item was either for the yard, or placed there for a while before it was washed down.

------

I was sure Caylee was dead as soon as this story broke, and I still lean that way, but stranger things have happened, and truly, fact IS stranger than fiction. The longer we wait for DNA results to be released, the easier it becomes to entertain other possibilities. I'll post one in a minute.
I really have to think that unless they can prove beyond a doubt that the car in question was watched 24/7, they can not prove that Casey is the one responsible for anything that is detected on/in that car. For all we know, someone had her purse as well and when they were done with the car, put her purse on the seat because they were done with it too. There are too many maybe's and probably's. I am not saying Casey is 100% innocent, I just think her lifestyle and tendencies towards dishonesty made her an easy target.

mazajo
08-14-2008, 09:22 AM
Here are some thoughts from another newbie :)

Going along with the suggestion that there was a body in the car but it wasn't Caylee's... Maybe Casey was somehow involved in a murder, like she witnessed somebody she knew murdering somebody. Her car was used for transportation. The murderer or someone else involved has Caylee and is holding her to make sure Casey doesn't talk?

I definately agree that Casey is a liar, is selfish, is immature and has very bad judgement. That doesn't mean she is a murderer.

I know it looks unlikely, but I'll keep believing this little girl just might be alive until there is concrete proof otherwise.

french75
08-14-2008, 09:57 AM
This doesn't account for the hit in the yard (which I think may have been inconsistent), but is it possible that someone from the tow yard "borrowed" the car for purposes of moving a body? I would think that if someone had a body to get rid of and had access to a lot of cars, that might seem like a convenient solution.

Perhaps the hit in the yard was caused by removing some items from the car when they got it back?

JBean
08-14-2008, 10:14 AM
I held out hope for Natalee Holloway
I held out hope for Laci
I held out hope for Elizabeth Smart.
So, now I am going to hold out hope for Caylee.

I know all the evidence and all the facts, I've read the threads and followed the case.
But I also know that if this was my own child or my own granddaughter I would not give her up for dead quite yet.
Reasonable, unreasonable, smart or stupid..I am just being honest and I really hope she is alive.

awakewriter
08-14-2008, 10:50 AM
I held out hope for Natalee Holloway
I held out hope for Laci
I held out hope for Elizabeth Smart.
So, now I am going to hold out hope for Caylee.

I know all the evidence and all the facts, I've read the threads and followed the case.
But I also know that if this was my own child or my own granddaughter I would not give her up for dead quite yet.
Reasonable, unreasonable, smart or stupid..I am just being honest and I really hope she is alive.


Amen.

I held out hope for Laci, Elizabeth, Chandra. I continue to hold out hope for Caylee, Nancy, Stacy.

mom_of_five
08-14-2008, 10:55 AM
When it comes down to it, Casey's lack of emotion is due to a) mental disconnection/mental illness or b) she truly feels Caylee is okay. Obviously the forensics will answer which possibility is the most likely.

I've been an optimist all my life and I'm not going to be inconsistent now -- in my mind (and heart), Caylee is alive until science tells me otherwise.

May God protect you wherever you are, sweet girl.

awakewriter
08-14-2008, 11:05 AM
Does anyone remember the fable, "The Boy Who Cried Wolf?"

IIRC, when the boy really did see a wolf and cried "wolf," no one came to help him.

http://www.storyarts.org/library/aesops/stories/boy.html

TotallyObsessed
08-14-2008, 11:18 AM
Tiffertots : I am in 100% total agreement with your theory. I have posted a similar theory and I believe you and I are the only ones who think this is a viable scenario. I evidently watch too much Lifetime TV!

raeann
08-14-2008, 11:23 AM
I just keep thinking about the Brooke Bennett case compared to this one. A career criminal planned for weeks to commit a crime in that case, ordered things, plotted out a plan to plant evidence, staged her "meeting" with someone else, etc. YET, the whole thing fell apart and Brooke was found within days. So how could her murderer fail with all his planning, yet Casey (in a panic), with NO HELP OR PLAN at all manage to commit a murder and hide ALL the evidence completely? It just makes no sense that she could do that without anyone seeing, hearing, or finding anything at all.

I also believe in the time honored concept of police investigation that "THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS COINCIDENCE". The fact that there is a ZG, at that exact apartment complex, the exact apartment number on the exact day that Caylee is believed to have disappeared is NOT A COINCIDENCE. There is no reason at all to believe that ZG is telling the truth or that no one else could have used her identity either with or without her knowledge. If she was involved in this, she is of course going to deny it, and of course going to say she doesn't recognize Casey or Caylee. AND if Casey is afraid for Caylee, she is of course going to say she didn't recognize that ZG's picture. It is not like she has any problem with lying to police!

AlwaysShocked
08-14-2008, 11:26 AM
Well, obviously I think the child is long dead. An accident? Very possibly. I would have a tendency to think accidental death before I would think murder.

Casey would not have called 911 like the rest of us would have because when she discovered Caylee (in the pool?) she knew the child was already dead. And her thinking immediately went to what her mother was going to say to her about not watching the child carefully enough, allowing this to happen. And she immediately went into her well developed self-protective mode - which is to lie, lie, lie.

BUT - there is still a small, small part of me that has hope that this child is still alive. Does that count?

TotallyObsessed
08-14-2008, 11:28 AM
I also believe in the time honored concept of police investigation that "THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS COINCIDENCE". The fact that there is a ZG, at that exact apartment complex, the exact apartment number on the exact day that Caylee is believed to have disappeared is NOT A COINCIDENCE. There is no reason at all to believe that ZG is telling the truth or that no one else could have used her identity either with or without her knowledge. If she was involved in this, she is of course going to deny it, and of course going to say she doesn't recognize Casey or Caylee. AND if Casey is afraid for Caylee, she is of course going to say she didn't recognize that ZG's picture. It is not like she has any problem with lying to police!

I believe that also. I mean, did the police look into ZG's background, etc. How extensive was the interrogation? It's these kind of "mysterious" incidents, along with the trail of "shady" characters in Casey's background that make me believe that someone might be holding Caylee. Now the case it too "red hot" for them to give her back.

SelmaClue
08-14-2008, 11:45 AM
I have no clue where this case is going. I do believe in my heart that regardless Casey was mixed up with some trouble. But I don't understand why everyone is so quick to hang her. I still have a feeling about this ZG that was at the sawgrass apts. Why should we believe her? Do we have any hard evidence to say she has nothing to do with this? I am grasping at straws here in hopes this beautiful little girl will be found ALIVE.

Hi MommaShark,

The reason is because nobody's seen or heard this baby after June 16th and it's been proven that Casey was out partying at Fusion on June 20th, with witnesses and photos. Whether little Caylee was abducted or met her early demise, a concerned mother doesn't go party instead of report her missing or grieve. That's why everyone's so quick to hang her. Oh, and she's also a proven liar, which is one of the reasons she's in prison at the moment.

SelmaClue
08-14-2008, 11:49 AM
Well, obviously I think the child is long dead. An accident? Very possibly. I would have a tendency to think accidental death before I would think murder.

Casey would not have called 911 like the rest of us would have because when she discovered Caylee (in the pool?) she knew the child was already dead. And her thinking immediately went to what her mother was going to say to her about not watching the child carefully enough, allowing this to happen. And she immediately went into her well developed self-protective mode - which is to lie, lie, lie.

BUT - there is still a small, small part of me that has hope that this child is still alive. Does that count?


I'm with you! And yes it counts that we all have hope the child is alive. I think everyone has hope for that.

Thinking_Out_Loud
08-14-2008, 12:07 PM
I just keep thinking about the Brooke Bennett case compared to this one. A career criminal planned for weeks to commit a crime in that case, ordered things, plotted out a plan to plant evidence, staged her "meeting" with someone else, etc. YET, the whole thing fell apart and Brooke was found within days. So how could her murderer fail with all his planning, yet Casey (in a panic), with NO HELP OR PLAN at all manage to commit a murder and hide ALL the evidence completely? It just makes no sense that she could do that without anyone seeing, hearing, or finding anything at all.

I also believe in the time honored concept of police investigation that "THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS COINCIDENCE". The fact that there is a ZG, at that exact apartment complex, the exact apartment number on the exact day that Caylee is believed to have disappeared is NOT A COINCIDENCE. There is no reason at all to believe that ZG is telling the truth or that no one else could have used her identity either with or without her knowledge. If she was involved in this, she is of course going to deny it, and of course going to say she doesn't recognize Casey or Caylee. AND if Casey is afraid for Caylee, she is of course going to say she didn't recognize that ZG's picture. It is not like she has any problem with lying to police!


I agree with you! Pretty much ever since this case broke out, I was ready for Casey to go to prison for the rest of her life even though there was speculation and no concrete evidence. I think the girl is nuts; howeer, since they said there was a ZG at Sawgrass on 7/17, I cannot get beyond this so called "coincidence". Plus, I don't think Casey is smart enough to have planned this all out where she won't get caught. Not to mention, she has had an entire month to get her web of lies straight, and she seems like she makes things up as she goes along. I think maybe there is more to this case than what everyone thinks. I would not be a bit surprised to find out if there was a conspiracy to kidnap little Caylee. Human trafficking is a very common thing in the world. It is possible that Caylee was taken by professionals. Whether this is true or not, Casey should tell the authorities as much as possible so they can find her. Deceitful people that would abduct a child will not hesitate to murder a child, IMHO.

But yeah, I think that this half-witted chick behind bars probably got involved in something that is way over her head no matter what happened to Caylee.

TotallyObsessed
08-14-2008, 12:27 PM
Unfortunately, the cadaver dogs hit on the trunk of Casey's car.


Yes they did - but it could have been because there was clothing, etc. from ANOTHER body. A body from a crime that was committed that Casey was involved in or witnessed. Casey took the clothes out of her car and buried them in the yard. Then later removed them and burned them (with gas from the stolen cans).

awakewriter
08-14-2008, 12:37 PM
Does anyone else think it's strange that ZG that checked out Sawgrass Apts is having a hard time finding a job because of this? Is that maybe because she recently lost a job as a nanny?

tttterri
08-14-2008, 12:43 PM
I find the management (in their 20's) and the entire Sawgrass Apts curious. After reading how promoters sometimes are allowed to rent out vacant apts for party dates at some complex apts, anything is possible. Management sure wouldnt volunteer that info if it happened but neighbors sure would know if anyone entered that apt there.

SelmaClue
08-14-2008, 12:45 PM
It is fine to discuss the reasons posters may have for a case that Caylee is alive. Just as it is ok for posters to disagree. There will not be a thread that welcomes only one viewpoint. As you can tell, it does not work.

Thanks so much for making this clear to us, Chico.
:blowkiss:

Dolphinmomcca
08-14-2008, 01:04 PM
I still believe Caylee is alive "somewhere out there" I am changing my stance on Casey getting rid of Caylee so she could be childless though......not gonna do much good if she is in jail and not having her Freedom anymore. I dont think her life will ever be the same, wether the truth comes out or not.....I just pray for this little girls safe return.....

tiffertots
08-14-2008, 01:43 PM
the whole Sawgrass crew seems very suspicious to me...I wonder if LE ever questioned other tennents about any commings-and-goings from that apartment...The fact that this particular apt. was vacant for so long...hmm
what if sawgrass was aware of and maybe even a part of illegal activity that went on in that building...thus keeping it vacant on purpose...Then when someone rats the apt. out they have a major clean-up party...I'm wondering if there had been other inquires about that apt. in the months prior to June 15. If so how many?
I would like to find out if they've had other units come available and then rented...if so why not this apt.? Unless they had many units available and this one was at the bottom of the list and just hasen't been rented yet...
but really...142 days...thats over 4 months...seems to me that management would want that unit rented A.S.A.P.

SelmaClue
08-14-2008, 01:57 PM
Does anyone else think it's strange that ZG that checked out Sawgrass Apts is having a hard time finding a job because of this?

Nah. It makes perfect sense to me.

SelmaClue
08-14-2008, 02:02 PM
the whole Sawgrass crew seems very suspicious to me...I wonder if LE ever questioned other tennents about any commings-and-goings from that apartment...The fact that this particular apt. was vacant for so long...hmm
what if sawgrass was aware of and maybe even a part of illegal activity that went on in that building...thus keeping it vacant on purpose...Then when someone rats the apt. out they have a major clean-up party...I'm wondering if there had been other inquires about that apt. in the months prior to June 15. If so how many?
I would like to find out if they've had other units come available and then rented...if so why not this apt.? Unless they had many units available and this one was at the bottom of the list and just hasen't been rented yet...
but really...142 days...thats over 4 months...seems to me that management would want that unit rented A.S.A.P.

What "crew" are you referring to? I must have missed reports on the Sawgrass crew. A link about them would be helpful.

As for vacant apartments, property owners will often let a space go unrented to write off the loss instead of renting it at a lesser monthly amount. It appears that Sawgrass is quite large and most apartments are rented. Maybe there are issues with this particular apartment. There could be a number of reasons. Maybe it faces an undesirable direction. Maybe it smells or the apartment next door is full of small noisy children. Who knows?!
:crazy:

But I'd still like the link of information about the Sawgrass crew. Thanks!

JBean
08-14-2008, 02:56 PM
the whole Sawgrass crew seems very suspicious to me...I wonder if LE ever questioned other tennents about any commings-and-goings from that apartment...The fact that this particular apt. was vacant for so long...hmm
what if sawgrass was aware of and maybe even a part of illegal activity that went on in that building...thus keeping it vacant on purpose...Then when someone rats the apt. out they have a major clean-up party...I'm wondering if there had been other inquires about that apt. in the months prior to June 15. If so how many?
I would like to find out if they've had other units come available and then rented...if so why not this apt.? Unless they had many units available and this one was at the bottom of the list and just hasen't been rented yet...
but really...142 days...thats over 4 months...seems to me that management would want that unit rented A.S.A.P.
FWIW and IIRC, I think Sawgrass is owned by PAC Land Development. IT was called something else at some point, but the name is escaping me right now.They own several luxury aptmt complexes.

I have no idea what the occupancy/vacancy rate is for that complex. They may have several units that remain vacant. But it would be interesting to do a market study and see what the apt turnover is typical and so if there is anything unusual about a 142 day vacancy.

newtv
08-14-2008, 03:03 PM
For anyone who wonders why the grandparents of Caylee still believe she is alive, this thread speaks volumes.

Whether she is or isnt alive, there are obviously a number of people who believe she is..if they can believe it then the grandparents should not be criticized for believing it either.

(I am one who doesnt' think Caylee is alive..but I respect that many do and my only point is it speaks to why the grandparents seem to belive it as well)

Further, if there are people who believe she is still alive, it speaks to a hung jury or an acquittal should it go to a jury. (On murder charges).

angelmom
08-14-2008, 03:09 PM
Couldn't the actions and demeanor of Casey be explained as a mother who felt that her child was with someone and was safe, rather than in harms way.
If she had murdered Caylee, don't you think she would have disapeared. She had plenty of time to do so. If there had been sooo much conflict at home, Cindy was too overbearing and controlling, wouldn't it have have been easier to pack up all her stuff, leave a note that said she was taking her daughter with her, and moving on with her life. Then she could have disapeared into the night...I'm sure her parents would have tried to find her...but if you want to disapear...you can!!
It just doesn't make sense to me.

I guess I might have believed that for a short time, but I just cannot imagine being separated from my children for 2 weeks, much less 2 months, and not being the slightest bit concerned about them. Even when they spend the night with my parents I call to check on them and think of them.

If Casey gave Caylee to someone and thinks she is safe with them, but feels Caylee might be in danger if she says too much, why isn't she at least a little worried about LE and the media looking into the case? Why isn't she anxious about being in jail and out of contact? Why isn't she worried about Caylee being afraid of being with strangers (because it's obviously someone no one else knows well - they haven't been seen or heard from in 2 months!).

As a mom, there is no way I could go 2 months without any contact or news about my kids and not be frantic with worry. Casey's attitude says it all to me. Unfortunately I think she knows exactly where Caylee is b/c she put her there. She knows Caylee isn't frightened or hurt or missing her mommy.

I wish I were wrong, I would love to be wrong.

tuppence
08-14-2008, 03:17 PM
I think she is dead but would love to be convinced otherwise.

The only ray of hope I see is that the tests on the car have come back but not released and the cops have not said they are looking for a body so I think it's possible that the tests were not conclusive.

The Anthony's clearly didn't initially think there was really a dead body when they first picked up the car. They probably thought someone had been throwing up in there or other bodily functions...or maybe a dead animal. The 911 calls clearly become much more frantic with the expanding information from Casey which makes them become a lot more concerned about the smell.

You could also argue if the detective was so sure there was a dead body smell when he saw the car they would not have waited so long to impound/test the car. According to the bond hearing the Anthonys gave them LE free reign to search the car, house etc those first days.

So playing devils advocate it is at least possible that it will turn out there was no dead body in the car. If we knew that was the case then more people would likely believe she could be alive.

The biggest thing to get over is that Casey displays NO emotion or concern for her daugher and she obviously was not searching for her so she either does not believe her daughter is in danger or does not care so it does not make sense that she would withhold info to protect her daughter. That suggests her daughter was not kidnapped or taken for drugs/money issues.

The only answer would be that she voluntarily gave her away to people. However I think at this point she would have conceded some real info if that was the case.

JBean
08-14-2008, 03:19 PM
For anyone who wonders why the grandparents of Caylee still believe she is alive, this thread speaks volumes.

Whether she is or isnt alive, there are obviously a number of people who believe she is..if they can believe it then the grandparents should not be criticized for believing it either.

(I am one who doesnt' think Caylee is alive..but I respect that many do and my only point is it speaks to why the grandparents seem to belive it as well)

Further, if there are people who believe she is still alive, it speaks to a hung jury or an acquittal should it go to a jury. (On murder charges).
Well hello there newt :) I think criticism of the gp's has been over the top.
I don't blame the grandparents one bit for imagining that she is alive. I am sure if we were to quiz relatives of this missing in our missing forum, we would find some that still hold out hope for a safe return.
My heart goes out to this whole family.

JBean
08-14-2008, 03:21 PM
I think she is dead but would love to be convinced otherwise.

The only ray of hope I see is that the tests on the car have come back but not released and the cops have not said they are looking for a body so I think it's possible that the tests were not conclusive.

The Anthony's clearly didn't initially think there was really a dead body when they first picked up the car. They probably thought someone had been throwing up in there or other bodily functions...or maybe a dead animal. The 911 calls clearly become much more frantic with the expanding information from Casey which makes them become a lot more concerned about the smell.

You could also argue if the detective was so sure there was a dead body smell when he saw the car they would not have waited so long to impound/test the car. According to the bond hearing the Anthonys gave them LE free reign to search the car, house etc those first days.

So playing devils advocate it is at least possible that it will turn out there was no dead body in the car. If we knew that was the case then more people would likely believe she could be alive.

The biggest thing to get over is that Casey displays NO emotion or concern for her daugher and she obviously was not searching for her so she either does not believe her daughter is in danger or does not care so it does not make sense that she would withhold info to protect her daughter. That suggests her daughter was not kidnapped or taken for drugs/money issues.

The only answer would be that she voluntarily gave her away to people. However I think at this point she would have conceded some real info if that was the case.
Good post tuppence.

krimekat
08-14-2008, 03:24 PM
I have no idea what the occupancy/vacancy rate is for that complex. They may have several units that remain vacant. But it would be interesting to do a market study and see what the apt turnover is typical and so if there is anything unusual about a 142 day vacancy.

I know here in StL some "lux" apts are vacant for months (6 mos next door to me) because of the current housing market . . .

Thinking_Out_Loud
08-14-2008, 03:25 PM
the whole Sawgrass crew seems very suspicious to me...I wonder if LE ever questioned other tennents about any commings-and-goings from that apartment...The fact that this particular apt. was vacant for so long...hmm
what if sawgrass was aware of and maybe even a part of illegal activity that went on in that building...thus keeping it vacant on purpose...Then when someone rats the apt. out they have a major clean-up party...I'm wondering if there had been other inquires about that apt. in the months prior to June 15. If so how many?
I would like to find out if they've had other units come available and then rented...if so why not this apt.? Unless they had many units available and this one was at the bottom of the list and just hasen't been rented yet...
but really...142 days...thats over 4 months...seems to me that management would want that unit rented A.S.A.P.

You know, I never really thought that this apartment being vacant for so long suspicious;however, that I think about it being vacant for 142 days that is really bizarre. This area of Orlando and Winterpark has an amazing turn-over rate. I live over about 13 miles from the Anthony's house in an apartment, and I know for a fact that apartments go fast. When I signed the lease on my place there was someone else walking in the door ready to sign on the same apartment. All the apartments off University BLVD, Alafaya, Goldenrod, and Conway should rent like hotcakes since they are within close range to UCF and Fullsail. Conway is not of a good street though.. That might be why it would be slow to rent. If they were renovating that apartment for any reason that would take some time. I don't know...That is a little weird, and maybe something to think about. Maybe the management there just do not know their facts. I thought it was weird that they recontacted LE and told them about the date. Why didn't they know what date was on the card before? Why didn't ZG correct LE and tell them that she was there in June and not April? Why would the management remember what ZG looked like after seeing her about a month ago? That should have so many people coming in and out of there that they would not be able to remember her face?

newtv
08-14-2008, 03:36 PM
Well hello there newt :) I think criticism of the gp's has been over the top.
I don't blame the grandparents one bit for imagining that she is alive. I am sure if we were to quiz relatives of this missing in our missing forum, we would find some that still hold out hope for a safe return.
My heart goes out to this whole family.

helloooooooooooooo tweety bird..:blowkiss:LOL So nice to see a familiar name..quite the case don't u think.

Again, I tend to think that things are more simple than not..Casey is yet another Mother (imo), who killed her child just because she wanted to)..
It's not nearly as mysterious as our imaginations makes it when we cannot understand the lies.

Lies are lies- the truth is usually far more simple..she killed her and desposed of her body somehow. (And may just be lucky so far - just like scott was for a few months).

(No offense intended to those who think she is still alive as I realize the thread is for those who think so).

PS I wonder if she used the gas from the cans to burn her dead body..that would make it a lot more easy to hide remains. Everyone is focused on her stealing gas for the car..I am not so sure.

tuppence
08-14-2008, 03:40 PM
I don't blame the grandparents one bit for imagining that she is alive. I am sure if we were to quiz relatives of this missing in our missing forum, we would find some that still hold out hope for a safe return.
My heart goes out to this whole family.

Good point. Over the years I've seen many families hold out hope for a long time despite strong evidence to to the contrary.

krimekat
08-14-2008, 03:41 PM
helloooooooooooooo tweety bird..:blowkiss:LOL So nice to see a familiar name..quite the case don't u think.

Again, I tend to think that things are more simple than not..Casey is yet another Mother (imo), who killed her child just because she wanted to)..
It's not nearly as mysterious as our imaginations makes it when we cannot understand the lies.

Lies are lies- the truth is usually far more simple..she killed her and desposed of her body somehow. (And may just be lucky so far - just like scott was for a few months).

(No offense intended to those who think she is still alive as I realize the thread is for those who think so).

PS I wonder if she used the gas from the cans to burn her dead body..that would make it a lot more easy to hide remains. Everyone is focused on her stealing gas for the car..I am not so sure.

Is this another "Mercy Killing" America is facing (tee hee)?

JBean
08-14-2008, 03:45 PM
helloooooooooooooo tweety bird..:blowkiss:LOL So nice to see a familiar name..quite the case don't u think.

Again, I tend to think that things are more simple than not..Casey is yet another Mother (imo), who killed her child just because she wanted to)..
It's not nearly as mysterious as our imaginations makes it when we cannot understand the lies.

Lies are lies- the truth is usually far more simple..she killed her and desposed of her body somehow. (And may just be lucky so far - just like scott was for a few months).

(No offense intended to those who think she is still alive as I realize the thread is for those who think so).

PS I wonder if she used the gas from the cans to burn her dead body..that would make it a lot more easy to hide remains. Everyone is focused on her stealing gas for the car..I am not so sure.


:blowkiss: Yep quite a case.
There is much merit in your simplicity theory. I have said before our rational minds are trying despreately to make sense of irrational actions and it just sends the brain into overdirve.
Casey certainly doesn't think like most of us here posting, yet we want it to make sense on our level. Frustrating and futile.

I am not big on the burning the body theory, mainly because it is messy, stinky and can't be done completely. Not that it is impossible, it just isn't working for me currently.
Besides, I hate the thought of it.

good to cya newt..back to work :)

newtv
08-14-2008, 03:49 PM
:blowkiss: Yep quite a case.
There is much merit in your simplicity theory. I have said before our rational minds are trying despreately to make sense of irrational actions and it just sends the brain into overdirve.
Casey certainly doesn't think like most of us here posting, yet we want it to make sense on our level. Frustrating and futile.

I am not big on the burning the body theory, mainly because it is messy, stinky and can't be done completely. Not that it is impossible, it just isn't working for me currently.
Besides, I hate the thought of it.

good to cya newt..back to work :)

good point - my mind is on overdrive? LOL

JBean
08-14-2008, 03:53 PM
good point - my mind is on overdrive? LOLheehee what I meant was, those of us that are trying to decipher this from that and coming up with explanations are probably in overdrive. OTOH, people like you that just cut out all the carp and get down to the simple facts aren't as frustrated.
It was a positive comment on your *simple* theory. Occam's razor I suppose.:)

RoseRed
08-15-2008, 12:31 AM
I just keep thinking about the Brooke Bennett case compared to this one. A career criminal planned for weeks to commit a crime in that case, ordered things, plotted out a plan to plant evidence, staged her "meeting" with someone else, etc. YET, the whole thing fell apart and Brooke was found within days. So how could her murderer fail with all his planning, yet Casey (in a panic), with NO HELP OR PLAN at all manage to commit a murder and hide ALL the evidence completely? It just makes no sense that she could do that without anyone seeing, hearing, or finding anything at all.

I also believe in the time honored concept of police investigation that "THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS COINCIDENCE". The fact that there is a ZG, at that exact apartment complex, the exact apartment number on the exact day that Caylee is believed to have disappeared is NOT A COINCIDENCE. There is no reason at all to believe that ZG is telling the truth or that no one else could have used her identity either with or without her knowledge. If she was involved in this, she is of course going to deny it, and of course going to say she doesn't recognize Casey or Caylee. AND if Casey is afraid for Caylee, she is of course going to say she didn't recognize that ZG's picture. It is not like she has any problem with lying to police!

I agree with this 100% and do not believe in this as a coincidence. I believe this ZG needs to be closely investigated.

SelmaClue
08-15-2008, 12:53 AM
I also believe in the time honored concept of police investigation that "THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS COINCIDENCE". The fact that there is a ZG, at that exact apartment complex, the exact apartment number on the exact day that Caylee is believed to have disappeared is NOT A COINCIDENCE. There is no reason at all to believe that ZG is telling the truth or that no one else could have used her identity either with or without her knowledge. If she was involved in this, she is of course going to deny it, and of course going to say she doesn't recognize Casey or Caylee. AND if Casey is afraid for Caylee, she is of course going to say she didn't recognize that ZG's picture. It is not like she has any problem with lying to police!

Hi Raeann ... you think the ZG who was interviewed is ..... hiding in plain sight, so to speak? It could very well be. If so, she should be nominated for an Academy Award.

tiffertots
08-15-2008, 02:51 AM
for all of those people that believe that you have seen all you need to see of casey anthony..remember this...
you have only seen her actions for probably a total of 5 minutes running...arrest time phone call to family time...and bond hearing time...really 5 MIN. TOPS!!!...
and you have only heard her speak to her family for maybe 10 min. tops...MOM...LEE..whatever
Really
I'm sick of everyone claiming that thay know what she is or how she is...we don't know S*@*T. All we know is what we're shown!! And we feed on it like cows in the meadow...

Honestly, I've spent some time clubbin it up..and the pics took while "partying" at fusion could have spanned a total of 30 min. a couple of songs...a contest or two...a drink or two...
no pictures have come out that shows that during that time she was getting too wasted...heck her hair wan't even wet..(as mine always was from drinking and dancing!!)

all I have to say is...everyone has based her total character and demeanor on less than an hour of media based info!!!
WOW...I'm gald that so many people are experts in determining a persons mental well being/state of mind etc...based on less than 1 HOUR OF MEDIA FED INFORMATION!!
really...we don't really know who Casey is or what she has done...all we can do is speculate...every one of us...
I can see it now...the mob with torches and pitchforks!!
I, myself will wait for the evidence to appear before I make my decision...

until then I will pray that this sweet child comes home safe!!

angelmom
08-15-2008, 10:41 AM
for all of those people that believe that you have seen all you need to see of casey anthony..remember this...
you have only seen her actions for probably a total of 5 minutes running...arrest time phone call to family time...and bond hearing time...really 5 MIN. TOPS!!!...
and you have only heard her speak to her family for maybe 10 min. tops...MOM...LEE..whatever
Really
I'm sick of everyone claiming that thay know what she is or how she is...we don't know S*@*T. All we know is what we're shown!! And we feed on it like cows in the meadow...

Honestly, I've spent some time clubbin it up..and the pics took while "partying" at fusion could have spanned a total of 30 min. a couple of songs...a contest or two...a drink or two...
no pictures have come out that shows that during that time she was getting too wasted...heck her hair wan't even wet..(as mine always was from drinking and dancing!!)

all I have to say is...everyone has based her total character and demeanor on less than an hour of media based info!!!
WOW...I'm gald that so many people are experts in determining a persons mental well being/state of mind etc...based on less than 1 HOUR OF MEDIA FED INFORMATION!!
really...we don't really know who Casey is or what she has done...all we can do is speculate...every one of us...
I can see it now...the mob with torches and pitchforks!!
I, myself will wait for the evidence to appear before I make my decision...

until then I will pray that this sweet child comes home safe!!

You are very right. We are seeing what the media gives us. My point is that if I were in fear for my child's safety, one song at a club would be too long. One drink would be too many. One smile would be too much effort.

Every single phone call would be about my child, not about taking showers or trying to get in touch with my boyfriend, or complaining that people were thinking TOO MUCH about my missing baby.

Maybe I'm personalizing it too much. Maybe everyone really does handle things differently and I'm not giving Casey enough of the benefit of the doubt. All I know is my own experience. But I've been around people who have lost a child before. I have been around people who have suffered a tragedy before. I have witnessed lots of other kinds of fear and grief. And this is not what it looks like, not for one hour or ten minutes or five minutes or five seconds. Not for a very long time after and sometimes never again.

momsickle
08-15-2008, 11:32 AM
You go, tiffertots! It saddens me also to read all the vitriol against these players. The case is already so bizarre that all of us may be totally slam dunked in our theories. 22 yr olds and younger base alot of their info on what they read online - scary thought there.

LI_Mom
08-15-2008, 12:32 PM
all I have to say is...everyone has based her total character and demeanor on less than an hour of media based info!!!
WOW...I'm gald that so many people are experts in determining a persons mental well being/state of mind etc...based on less than 1 HOUR OF MEDIA FED INFORMATION!!
really...we don't really know who Casey is or what she has done...all we can do is speculate...every one of us...


And yet.... people who DO know Casey say she's a LIAR & say she never bothered mentioning that Caylee was missing... as a matter of fact she LIED when they asked about Caylee & said told them Caylee was perfectly fine.

Even if we're going to believe her cockamamie story about Caylee being in danger IF she told anyone she was 'kidnapped' any mother with an ounce of concern about her baby WOULD have shown some small sign that the questions upset her.... but NO.... Casey was happy as a clam & nobody near her had a CLUE anything was bothering her.

And that's not speculation.... it's a fact..... unless we're to believe ALL her friends hate her so much that they'd lie about her to investigators AND the media while she's rotting away in her jail cell.

Not ONE person has come forward to say they noticed Casey was upset after her daughter disappeared from her life. Not one.

MommaShark
08-15-2008, 01:46 PM
And yet.... people who DO know Casey say she's a LIAR & say she never bothered mentioning that Caylee was missing... as a matter of fact she LIED when they asked about Caylee & said told them Caylee was perfectly fine.

Even if we're going to believe her cockamamie story about Caylee being in danger IF she told anyone she was 'kidnapped' any mother with an ounce of concern about her baby WOULD have shown some small sign that the questions upset her.... but NO.... Casey was happy as a clam & nobody near her had a CLUE anything was bothering her.

And that's not speculation.... it's a fact..... unless we're to believe ALL her friends hate her so much that they'd lie about her to investigators AND the media while she's rotting away in her jail cell.

Not ONE person has come forward to say they noticed Casey was upset after her daughter disappeared from her life. Not one.

I have one point to make about her "friends". If any of them were true friends they would have known something was not right. Also it wasn't until she was locked up that they began to speak badly of her. I know first hand that if someone is believed to be guilty of something, that is when all the bad things come out about them. Why is it they were all her good friends until this? I would say that none were ever really true friends to begin with. So why did they stick around. The company you keep says a lot about who you are yourself. So if she was such a lying thief why were they hanging with her? If everyone wants to throw this woman under the bus prematurely, then you have given up on that beautiful little girl. My friends would stand beside me until they knew the facts. I CHOSE TO HOPE SHE IS STILL ALIVE!

dreamfeather
08-15-2008, 01:55 PM
(respectfully snipped)Maybe I'm personalizing it too much. Maybe everyone really does handle things differently and I'm not giving Casey enough of the benefit of the doubt. All I know is my own experience. But I've been around people who have lost a child before. I have been around people who have suffered a tragedy before. I have witnessed lots of other kinds of fear and grief. And this is not what it looks like, not for one hour or ten minutes or five minutes or five seconds. Not for a very long time after and sometimes never again.

:clap::clap::clap:

I agree. I hope to Hades I'm wrong and this is just the flukiest expression of a worried, bereft, and grieving parent I've ever seen. But for now, I agree.

Thinking_Out_Loud
08-15-2008, 02:23 PM
I have one point to make about her "friends". If any of them were true friends they would have known something was not right. Also it wasn't until she was locked up that they began to speak badly of her. I know first hand that if someone is believed to be guilty of something, that is when all the bad things come out about them. Why is it they were all her good friends until this? I would say that none were ever really true friends to begin with. So why did they stick around. The company you keep says a lot about who you are yourself. So if she was such a lying thief why were they hanging with her? If everyone wants to throw this woman under the bus prematurely, then you have given up on that beautiful little girl. My friends would stand beside me until they knew the facts. I CHOSE TO HOPE SHE IS STILL ALIVE!


I agree that the media makes people seem worse than they are. It is true that we only know so much about this girl, and we do not know the whole truth. At the same time, it is also true that this girl is not NORMAL. We can deduce that she is a negligent mother regardless of whether her baby girl was kidnapped or not. This goes beyond what the dirty laundry found by the media and the testimony of her so-called friends. We have witnessed Casey's OWN mother calling the police to say that her daughter was stealing from her. We know that her OWN mother, Cindy, was fooled by Casey's lies. Her whole family was fooled. How can you account for this family saying they trusted her and had no reason to believe that Caylee was missing? In fact, nobody in Casey's life had reason to believe that she was missing. Casey did show the emotions that would indicate that anything was seriously wrong in her life. Unless of course, you were to include the time that she told a friend on facebook that she has not been home for the past 9 days due to DRAAAMMMMA. Telling a friend that there has been drama is not the reaction people expect of a a mother who is missing her flesh and blood. Many of us, have read her comments that she posted on Myspace and Facebook. There was no indication that anything was wrong. She seemed happy, if anything. She seemed like she was going about her life, and partying all the time.

I do not know the whereabouts of this child, and I cannot account for Casey's lack of concern that she has continuously displayed. I have my own theories about the matter. Sure, I think there is more than meets the eye to this case. Specifically, I do not entirely believe that this is a homicide due to several reasons; however, I will be the first to say that we can make some assumptions about this girl. I think that it is crucial to the case. She may have some sort of psychoses or neuroses, and that could play a role in her lies and actions. The grandparents do not know where to look to find Caylee. LE does not really know where to look to find this beautiful little child. AMERICA does not know where to find her either. Let's face facts, we need to know more about Casey, so we can find the truth behind all the lies. We need a starting point to search for Caylee. One cannot just drive around the world stopping at a location every few minutes to see if that is where Caylee is hiding (contrary to what some "psychics" believe). We need a valuable clue from a reliable source, and we do not have a leg to walk on thanks to Casey.

LI_Mom
08-15-2008, 03:38 PM
I have one point to make about her "friends". If any of them were true friends they would have known something was not right. Also it wasn't until she was locked up that they began to speak badly of her. I know first hand that if someone is believed to be guilty of something, that is when all the bad things come out about them. Why is it they were all her good friends until this? I would say that none were ever really true friends to begin with. So why did they stick around. The company you keep says a lot about who you are yourself. So if she was such a lying thief why were they hanging with her? If everyone wants to throw this woman under the bus prematurely, then you have given up on that beautiful little girl. My friends would stand beside me until they knew the facts. I CHOSE TO HOPE SHE IS STILL ALIVE!

Well, why would any of her friends really CARE if she lied about having an actual job? Or going back to school? Or whether Caylee was REALLY being taken care of by a nanny or her GPs?? They wouldn't.... it's not THEIR responsibility to worry about these things or to question what Casey would do with her life beyond the club scene.

It was only AFTER they found out Caylee mysteriously disappeared that they realized she LIED... that's when they learned she was NOT w/ Cindy & that nobody except Casey had ever heard of this ZG & that there was no possible way to even reach this long term nanny.

We DO know that as soon as Amy discovered Casey stole from her, she was angry. I'm sure when they all got together & compared notes about Casey.... they were appalled as the pieces starting coming together.

angelmom
08-15-2008, 06:06 PM
I have one point to make about her "friends". If any of them were true friends they would have known something was not right. Also it wasn't until she was locked up that they began to speak badly of her. I know first hand that if someone is believed to be guilty of something, that is when all the bad things come out about them. Why is it they were all her good friends until this? I would say that none were ever really true friends to begin with. So why did they stick around. The company you keep says a lot about who you are yourself. So if she was such a lying thief why were they hanging with her? If everyone wants to throw this woman under the bus prematurely, then you have given up on that beautiful little girl. My friends would stand beside me until they knew the facts. I CHOSE TO HOPE SHE IS STILL ALIVE!

If these people aren't really her friends, then where ARE her friends? Doesn't she have any? Why not? Is it because she lies and steals and manipulates and uses people and no one ever sticks around for very long?

Don't you think it's weird that we haven't heard from anyone who is a long time friend who has anything good to say about Casey? We haven't even heard from any relatives other than her parents and Lee...and even Lee has stopped talking. Why is that?

This is not a girl who inspires loyalty. I think we know quite a bit about her.

websurfer
08-15-2008, 06:10 PM
I will say


I truely hope she is alive.

:angel:

websurfer
08-15-2008, 06:12 PM
If these people aren't really her friends, then where ARE her friends? Doesn't she have any? Why not? Is it because she lies and steals and manipulates and uses people and no one ever sticks around for very long?

Don't you think it's weird that we haven't heard from anyone who is a long time friend who has anything good to say about Casey? We haven't even heard from any relatives other than her parents and Lee...and even Lee has stopped talking. Why is that?

This is not a girl who inspires loyalty. I think we know quite a bit about her.


naw......not friends......
drinking partying buds but not friends.

wedavis
08-15-2008, 10:03 PM
I'm in the mood to play devil's advocate:

I wouldn't be surprised to learn that there was a real threat to Caylee's life (for whatever reason) and she was sent (flown) to another state or country to protect her. And maybe Casey does love Caylee so much that she will do and say ANYTHING so that no one finds out where Caylee is. If that means lying her butt off and sitting in jail for the rest of her life, so be it.

LI_Mom
08-15-2008, 10:11 PM
I'm in the mood to play devil's advocate:

I wouldn't be surprised to learn that there was a real threat to Caylee's life (for whatever reason) and she was sent (flown) to another state or country to protect her. And maybe Casey does love Caylee so much that she will do and say ANYTHING so that no one finds out where Caylee is. If that means lying her butt off and sitting in jail for the rest of her life, so be it.

And she practiced lying & stealing BEFORE Caylee went missing so she'd be ready when it counted.

She's a regular hero alright. And what a planner. lol

MommaShark
08-15-2008, 10:38 PM
And she practiced lying & stealing BEFORE Caylee went missing so she'd be ready when it counted.

She's a regular hero alright. And what a planner. lol

Hero? No I don't think so. But there is a huge difference between a dishonest thief and a murderer. You can be a lyer and a thief and not a murderer. So this woman is not the best of people. That does not mean that you should automatically assume the worse. I have known plenty of people that were questionable characters but before assuming they are murderers also I feel you need hard evidence.

Alyzabeth
08-15-2008, 10:59 PM
I'm in the mood to play devil's advocate:

I wouldn't be surprised to learn that there was a real threat to Caylee's life (for whatever reason) and she was sent (flown) to another state or country to protect her. And maybe Casey does love Caylee so much that she will do and say ANYTHING so that no one finds out where Caylee is. If that means lying her butt off and sitting in jail for the rest of her life, so be it.
I agree with you 110%.
I am shocked at how quickly people have jumped into the pack mentality without knowing what is going on behind the scenes. It's a little frightening:confused:
I have no idea what is going on behind the scenes, and I choose to believe that Casey is innocent until proven guilty.

LI_Mom
08-15-2008, 11:06 PM
Hero? No I don't think so. But there is a huge difference between a dishonest thief and a murderer. You can be a lyer and a thief and not a murderer. So this woman is not the best of people. That does not mean that you should automatically assume the worse. I have known plenty of people that were questionable characters but before assuming they are murderers also I feel you need hard evidence.

I agree but I do think people have seen NO redeeming qualities in Casey to give them much hope that she really believes Caylee is "safe" or able to ever come home alive.

I don't think many people accuse of of outright murder but the majority DO believe Caylee died by accident or sheer neglect & Casey did her best to cover it up AND put it out of her mind & move on with her life.

When we hear ALL the evidence, we'll all have a much clearer picture of HOW deep a hole Miss Casey is really in.

wedavis
08-15-2008, 11:07 PM
I agree with you 110%.
I am shocked at how quickly people have jumped into the pack mentality without knowing what is going on behind the scenes. It's a little frightening:confused:
I have no idea what is going on behind the scenes, and I choose to believe that Casey is innocent until proven guilty.

Right. I don't want to be one of those people in the pack, and if there is some shocking discovery or revelation, end up feeling like an a**hole.

If she didn't do it (kill Caylee) I wouldn't be surprised. Same goes for if she did do it.

In this case, I think having the mentality that she did do it (and that she is some sort of sociopath) is much more exciting/interesting than saying wisely "we don't have all the facts. we don't know what is going on behind the scenes" etc. I like a good murder mystery too, but I'm just trying to prevent feeling like a jerk for having all this "fun" if I am way off in my assumptions.

rozey
08-15-2008, 11:07 PM
I'm in the mood to play devil's advocate:

I wouldn't be surprised to learn that there was a real threat to Caylee's life (for whatever reason) and she was sent (flown) to another state or country to protect her. And maybe Casey does love Caylee so much that she will do and say ANYTHING so that no one finds out where Caylee is. If that means lying her butt off and sitting in jail for the rest of her life, so be it.

I would love to believe this. Can you make it so?

wedavis
08-15-2008, 11:33 PM
I would love to believe this. Can you make it so?


Well this theory is no more outrageous than the one being bandied about right now again: that all of this is someone's idea of a joke/scam/staged for a faux documentary on missing children or "punking" America.

wedavis
08-15-2008, 11:40 PM
They need to rename this thread. I haven't read a post that says "Caylee is alive." A more appropriate name would be: Caylee could be alive. Stranger things have happened. :)

RebeccaAdrianne
08-16-2008, 09:30 AM
I still have a feeling Casey sold her daughter and shipped her out of the country. Hell maybe she gave her away to the nanny who's name is not Zenaida. But lied to cover her arse to keep her family from taking legal action against her. I bet she never even considered at that time, "what if mom calls the cops?" Until DNA or a body shows up, I still cant say Casey killed her daughter I need more from LE against Casey before I believe the child is dead at the hand of her mother.

There is chat of Caylee having a forced smile in many pictures with her mother. I dont see that at all. I see a little girl that was comfortable in Casey's presence. Who the heck knows, but if it does turn out that Caylee is alive, I would hope everyone that accused Casey of murder and speculated on her mental stability will openly admit they were wrong. I still see more images like this one below of the 2. I just cant allow myself to believe she killed her baby. At least not right now.

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s43/timeoutlounge/l_b86854677741c807bda253604ac6f560.jpg

RebeccaAdrianne
08-16-2008, 09:38 AM
Another thing, I am only posting the link since there is alot of "F-Bombs" dropped. If you haven't seen the myspace account www.myspace.com/JUSTICEFORCAYLEE Apparently, while adding some of Casey's friends, this girl got some pretty horrible emails back from them. It's interesting insight. Obviously Casey has support from her friends even what little we are seeing or hearing on the news.http://blog.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.view&friendID=400867314&blogID=421580454

tttterri
08-16-2008, 09:39 AM
Why should we not hope for a live Caylee? Seems LE wants us to keep on.
I urge anyone in the areas to FL to carry some fliers of Caylee around with you and post, post, post. It has been said that someone visited the airport there and found not ONE flier posted. Post post post, PLEASE!


Thursday, Aug 14:
According to Orange County Sheriff's spokesman Carlos Padilla, "Right now we have nothing that can say that this child is not alive."
http://www.540wfla.com/cc-common/mai...rticle=4095641

tiffertots
08-16-2008, 10:44 AM
still hoping...maybe when she gets bailed out padilla can get some answers out of her

LoriKeet
08-16-2008, 10:53 AM
If these people aren't really her friends, then where ARE her friends? Doesn't she have any? Why not? Is it because she lies and steals and manipulates and uses people and no one ever sticks around for very long?

Don't you think it's weird that we haven't heard from anyone who is a long time friend who has anything good to say about Casey? We haven't even heard from any relatives other than her parents and Lee...and even Lee has stopped talking. Why is that?

This is not a girl who inspires loyalty. I think we know quite a bit about her.

Sociopaths are INCAPABLE of forming genuinely close relationships with ANYONE! They are users. When you have given a sociopath whatever it is they wanted from you and you are no longer of use to them...they move on. If you keep "feeding" them whatever it is they crave, they'll stick around, but it's all very superficial.

tttterri
08-16-2008, 01:12 PM
Well, if she talks to LE, it can incriminate her, if she talks to her lawyer, he is under oath and cannot tell what she says, if she talks to her family, they love her-no need to say more, if she talks to the Bounty Hunter, he can do as he pleases with the info. So, in my opinion that could be a good thing, plus, while folks are getting irritated about the publicity the Bounty Hunter and new spokesperson will be getting, I dont mind at all because the more publicity for this case, the better for bringing Caylee home.

tttterri
08-16-2008, 01:16 PM
I keep thinking about the DJ who said Casey didnt have any friends. I dont think it is true about Casey not having friends because the Amy is her friend who let her use her car and she seems to go back a ways with Casey. LE has sealed Amy's lips I believe so we do not know her participation in this mystery if any. The girl named Christine Chester stated she was a friend of Casey and that they had all went for a walk recently when Casey visted her with Caylee. We should not say there were no friends when we do not know what is what.

Nemont
08-16-2008, 04:29 PM
This is going to be a real hypothetical scenario...but...

WHAT IF it's all about the reward money...what if Caylee is suddenly found and the $225,000 reward is claimed...say on the 19th or 20th?

I started reading a thread that has now been moved and after doing some searching on my own came up with some (what I thought) was interesting info. but I'm not smart enough to nail down what it really means. Now, it seems the domain record has been altered as of today - the same day that the thread I posted the info on early this morning was "moved" and no longer accessible.

I'm flusterated!

NighTillDawn
08-16-2008, 07:14 PM
This is going to be a real hypothetical scenario...but...

WHAT IF it's all about the reward money...what if Caylee is suddenly found and the $225,000 reward is claimed...say on the 19th or 20th?

I started reading a thread that has now been moved and after doing some searching on my own came up with some (what I thought) was interesting info. but I'm not smart enough to nail down what it really means. Now, it seems the domain record has been altered as of today - the same day that the thread I posted the info on early this morning was "moved" and no longer accessible.

I'm flusterated!

Whoever finds Caylee gets the reward money, so of course people are coming out of the woodwork wanting to help find her. If Caylee is found this week, it would be a miracle. That's what we are all hoping for.

tttterri
08-16-2008, 08:15 PM
I believe the reward states "the safe return of Caylee" and that it expires in 90 days from date offered.

NighTillDawn
08-16-2008, 08:57 PM
I believe the reward states "the safe return of Caylee" and that it expires in 90 days from date offered.

Then they better hurry up because soon the 90 days will be over.

MommaShark
08-16-2008, 10:08 PM
This is going to be a real hypothetical scenario...but...

WHAT IF it's all about the reward money...what if Caylee is suddenly found and the $225,000 reward is claimed...say on the 19th or 20th?

I started reading a thread that has now been moved and after doing some searching on my own came up with some (what I thought) was interesting info. but I'm not smart enough to nail down what it really means. Now, it seems the domain record has been altered as of today - the same day that the thread I posted the info on early this morning was "moved" and no longer accessible.

I'm flusterated!

Did you ever find out what happened to that thread? It had me up until 4 this morning. It was very interesting. Maybe it was something we shouldn't have been talking about. (The Bogus Dummy thread something like that)

tttterri
08-19-2008, 04:24 PM
I wish there would be more people searching for Caylee. I do not understand. If LE knows something that proves she is dead, why won't they search for her remains? If LE does not know something that proves she is dead, why won't they search for her alive? If they are searching for her alive, I guess they might keep that quiet if they are watching someone but I dont think they are waiting for Casey to lead them there. It is so obvious that Casey is not going to lead them anywhere so they cannot possibly be waiting for her information. If they are looking for her remains, with the phone pinging and records, surely they would have an area to look and search in by now but it has been done extremely quietly or not at all. I am so confused. Can anyone add light as to why are there NO searches in this case? what am I missing?

angelmom
08-19-2008, 04:41 PM
Well, if she talks to LE, it can incriminate her Not if she is innocent!

if she talks to her lawyer, he is under oath and cannot tell what she says Not if she waives that priveledge!

if she talks to her family, they love her-no need to say more Unless they really want to find their granddaughter MORE than they want to protect Casey's legal status.

if she talks to the Bounty Hunter, he can do as he pleases with the info. So, in my opinion that could be a good thing, plus, while folks are getting irritated about the publicity the Bounty Hunter and new spokesperson will be getting, I dont mind at all because the more publicity for this case, the better for bringing Caylee home.

None of those excuses fly for an innocent person. They only work for the guilty.

s1rebecca
08-19-2008, 04:46 PM
I guess your right about the company you keep as Cindy said on Myspace and the 911 calls, my daughter stole a lot of money and my car. I believe her friend Aimee said she stole checks from her, so maybe her friends are thieves and liers just like her. IMO

tttterri
08-19-2008, 06:27 PM
I'm sure Casey is guilty of something, we just don't know what yet.

CrimeBella
08-19-2008, 08:15 PM
I am starting to believe Caylee is alive. I believe that Casey was invovled in something that does not leave her blameless in this, but I am really beginning to believe she is alive.

RoseRed
08-20-2008, 03:49 AM
None of those excuses fly for an innocent person. They only work for the guilty.

She could be guilty of something entirely different than murder.

RoseRed
08-20-2008, 03:51 AM
I guess your right about the company you keep as Cindy said on Myspace and the 911 calls, my daughter stole a lot of money and my car. I believe her friend Aimee said she stole checks from her, so maybe her friends are thieves and liers just like her. IMO

I agree with that about the friends. She can't be the only one that parties, lies and steals or the friends would not have remained her friends that long.

angelmom
08-20-2008, 09:22 AM
She could be guilty of something entirely different than murder.


Do you not believe that LE would cut virtually ANY sweetheart Queen for a Day deal if there was the slightest chance of getting that baby back alive?

There are murderous mobsters and gang members who go into WitSec and never serve a day if they testify against their co-conspirators. If Casey did anything short of murder and could help bring Caylee home safely they would do ANYTHING.

Think about it.

momof6
08-20-2008, 09:53 AM
I wish there would be more people searching for Caylee. I do not understand. If LE knows something that proves she is dead, why won't they search for her remains? If LE does not know something that proves she is dead, why won't they search for her alive? If they are searching for her alive, I guess they might keep that quiet if they are watching someone but I dont think they are waiting for Casey to lead them there. It is so obvious that Casey is not going to lead them anywhere so they cannot possibly be waiting for her information. If they are looking for her remains, with the phone pinging and records, surely they would have an area to look and search in by now but it has been done extremely quietly or not at all. I am so confused. Can anyone add light as to why are there NO searches in this case? what am I missing?

I've been wondering this also!
Absolutely no searches by LE ,very odd.

tttterri
08-20-2008, 10:37 AM
I'd like to hear anyone's ideas on why LE would not be holding searches for Caylee. Thanks, ANYONE?

LoriKeet
08-20-2008, 11:29 AM
I'd like to hear anyone's ideas on why LE would not be holding searches for Caylee. Thanks, ANYONE?

Because...

They don't know where to begin;
Casey has lied to them repeatedly and proven herself to be completely untrustworthy and unreliable;
Casey WAITED at least 31 days to report her child missing (would have been longer if Cindy didn't find her); and
Casey doesn't seem interested in finding her daughter...alive!


With all due respect, this is not the first missing child case LE or the FBI have investigated. Based on the collective experience of investigators I am certain they have the ability "profile" persons of interest--which is why her suspicious actions and omissions and inability to come clean, are all red flags.

momsickle
08-20-2008, 01:58 PM
Hi MommaShark - I was on that thread that disappeared yesterday - maybe it was seized for investigation - I hope! I was locked out until I removed a friend request.

AmyinTheHam
08-20-2008, 02:36 PM
Because...

They don't know where to begin;
Casey has lied to them repeatedly and proven herself to be completely untrustworthy and unreliable;
Casey WAITED at least 31 days to report her child missing (would have been longer if Cindy didn't find her); and
Casey doesn't seem interested in finding her daughter...alive!


With all due respect, this is not the first missing child case LE or the FBI have investigated. Based on the collective experience of investigators I am certain they have the ability "profile" persons of interest--which is why her suspicious actions and omissions and inability to come clean, are all red flags.

I think the area around the airport and that park would be two good starting places. I think LE should at least be looking for her dead or alive.

This is just strange. They SHOULD be looking... Despite how Casey acts, they should still search...

momsickle
08-20-2008, 03:01 PM
Interesting in passing - a post in the Dreamin'Demon site from Jesse's dad to a poster there:

I]1purplemoon
Aug 17, 2008 at 11:42 pm -

I have to tell you guys I have held out on you a little bit. I actually emailed Jesse Gunds dad over a week ago. He responded back and I was hoping to keep up a repore with him to see if I could get some information. He emailed me back once and that is all. Below is a copy of that email.

Aug 7, 2008 7:21 RE: CayleeBody:Thank you Susan!I have an associate of mine in my ministry and one of my endeavors who feels as you do. He went and visited the new development and saw some areas that gave him a sense of Caylee. However, they are deep woods areas and we must go back prepared for the underbrush. It’s very possible that the tattoo is a clue and must be looked at. Her mother is a victim in this as well. What you see in jail is not Casey Anthony but something that has been taken her over. It’s hard to explain but that is not the girl who came to our house and who my son fell in love with. Something happened to her. Sadly, after her mother meddled with their engagement and ruined it for her, it would seem her life fell apart. I do not know if thing would have turned out differently except that Caylee would be safe right now. Regardless, keep praying for every hidden thing to be revealed for Caylee to come home…one way or the other!Thanks for your message and compassion for her.I believe in my heart it’s almost over.God bless,RJ***The area he is referring to is the La Bela Vida resort construction site.

post1848 [/I]

?everything
08-20-2008, 03:59 PM
I belive Caylee is alive. There is not one thing out that proves she is dead. Yes Casey lied and the gp's to. But I have not seen one thing to show she is dead.

mazajo
08-20-2008, 10:14 PM
Okay, I keep going back forth in what I think, sometimes I think she's alive, sometimes I don't. Here's something that's been bugging me though:

If Casey did kill Caylee on purpose, why did she do it? She wasn't exactly 'tied down' with Caylee, was she? She lived with her parents who financially supported Casey and Caylee both, and it sounds like Casey had plenty of freetime for herself. The only premeditated reason I can think of a mother killing their child is they don't want to be bothered with the kid but that doesn't seem to fit this case.

If it was an accidental death due to negligence and Casey just got scared and tried to cover it up, it sure seems like there would be more emotion on Casey's part. If it was premeditated, I would understand the lack of emotion, but if it were accidental? Surely there'd be SOMETHING. Right?

So those things lead me to believe that Caylee is alive and Casey knows who has her and isn't all that worried.

There's something just beyond my grasp here, I know it....

Katie526
09-06-2008, 10:36 AM
Just starting this thread because there seem to be people that believe as I do that Caylee is Alive. Just don't want to clog the other threads with this topic.

I personally (JMO) think that Caylee is alive. It's just a gut feeling that I have as some of you do.

I'm not in denial, I just don't believe someone hurt her.:)

momtective
09-06-2008, 10:39 AM
Against my better judgement..so do I.

My reasons for believing so
1. Hair that was found in trunk has not been identified conclusively as that of Caylee.

2. No body yet found. Note... Yet

3. Too many people in KC's life traveling around the time Caylee went missing.

4. Interviews with prople involved too vague.

5. Still other possibilities as to where Caylee might be.

6. If LE had evidence to prove Caylee is indeed dead KC would have already been charged with murder.

I reserve the right to change my opinion at any time!

Katie526
09-06-2008, 10:40 AM
Hi Momtective:

I'm a mom and mother's always have very good gut feelings. That's why I am believing my gut.

tehcloser
09-06-2008, 10:43 AM
Hi Momtective:

I'm a mom and mother's always have very good gut feelings. That's why I am believing my gut.

I am a Mom and a Grandmom...and my gut says she's dead....but to each his own.

Katie526
09-06-2008, 10:44 AM
I am a Mom and a Grandmom...and my gut says she's dead....but to each his own.

Everyone feels differently and that's okay

SeriouslySearching
09-06-2008, 10:44 AM
Did you search for similar threads on this topic? I believe there are quite a few of them.

Katie526
09-06-2008, 10:45 AM
Can't find them.

halleyscomet
09-06-2008, 10:46 AM
Unfortunately, I don't agree with you. However, this is one time in my life when I would just love to be proven wrong and I would happily apologize to all the folks who believe she's alive.

Fandy
09-06-2008, 10:48 AM
bump...here it is....gotta love that search feature on the top right corner of the forums.

momtective
09-06-2008, 10:49 AM
Hi Momtective:

I'm a mom and mother's always have very good gut feelings. That's why I am believing my gut.

I can't base my opinion on the fact that I am a mother, although I am...to 12.

I base my opinion on the evidence or should I say lack thereof.

I'm keeping an open mind and until there is evidence to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that Caylee is dead. When and if that happens I will gladly yet sadly change my opinion.

There are far too many innocent people sitting in prison for crimes they did not commit. KC in my opinion is guilty of may things, evidence proves she is a liar, a thief, of low moral character and without emotion. Only one of the aforementioned is a crime.
Until the evidence is in I will maintain my opinion that this precious little girl is alive and most likely living in Puerto Rico.

Katie526
09-06-2008, 10:51 AM
I can't base my opinion on the fact that I am a mother, although I am...to 12.

I base my opinion on the evidence of should I say lack thereof.

I'm keeping an open mind and until there is evidence to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that Caylee is dead. When and if that happens I will gladly yet sadly change my opinion.

There are far too many innocent people sitting in prison for crimes they did not commit. KC in my opinion is guilty of may things, evidence proves she is a liar, a thief, of low moral character and without emotion. Only one of the aforementioned is a crime.
Until the evidence is in I will maintain my opinion that this precious little girl is alive and most likely living in Puerto Rico.


God Bless You - 12! What a great thing.

monoxide
09-06-2008, 10:51 AM
I can't base my opinion on the fact that I am a mother, although I am...to 12.

I base my opinion on the evidence of should I say lack thereof.

I'm keeping an open mind and until there is evidence to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that Caylee is dead. When and if that happens I will gladly yet sadly change my opinion.

There are far too many innocent people sitting in prison for crimes they did not commit. KC in my opinion is guilty of may things, evidence proves she is a liar, a thief, of low moral character and without emotion. Only one of the aforementioned is a crime.
Until the evidence is in I will maintain my opinion that this precious little girl is alive and most likely living in Puerto Rico.

Whats up with everybody accusing AH?

Katie526
09-06-2008, 10:52 AM
Who's AH?

RoseRed
09-06-2008, 10:53 AM
Until more evidence is in I will also continue to believe Caylee is alive.

Katie526
09-06-2008, 10:53 AM
I believe Caylee is in PR or near there. I think she went somewhere with someone around the time Amy, and the others took their vacation.

gypsiechavi
09-06-2008, 10:54 AM
You most likely can not find the Caylee is alive type threads because since the release of the evidence that YES there was a decomposing body in the car and YES the hair belonged to Caylee - the Caylee is Alive type threads are IMO as silly as having a thread that Caylee was abducted by aliens.

I am not trying to upset anyone here. I also wish she is alive. Unfortunately all of the evidence to date states otherwise.

momtective
09-06-2008, 10:56 AM
You most likely can not find the Caylee is alive type threads because since the release of the evidence that YES there was a decomposing body in the car and YES the hair belonged to Caylee - the Caylee is Alive type threads are IMO as silly as having a thread that Caylee was abducted by aliens.

I am not trying to upset anyone here. I also wish she is alive. Unfortunately all of the evidence to date states otherwise.

NO ONE had stated that the hair found in the trunk is that of Caylee. It is not yet a fact and until it is it can not be considrerd as evidence to prove she is dead.

Samijeansg
09-06-2008, 10:56 AM
There are people in this thread that feel the way you do. Hope this helps you.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=68947

monoxide
09-06-2008, 10:59 AM
Why does everybody blame Amy? She cooperated with law enforcement. Casey didn't.........Whether she is alive or dead Casey basically refused to cooperate....Amy cooperated.....Pretty sad that Amy allowed Casey to borrow her car and then Casey goes and robs her blind. I would never let anybody drive my car.

How can she steal from her grandparents. I think she is a shopping addict or something

Deedlbugg
09-06-2008, 11:00 AM
I personally (JMO) think that Caylee is alive. It's just a gut feeling that I have as some of you do.

I'm not in denial, I just don't believe someone hurt her.:)


Casey or Cindy, is that you? J/K

I wish I felt the same as you do, but sadly, I don't.
Cadaver dogs,DNA, LIES, Decomp smell...
Imagine what evidence we DON'T know about.

Katie526
09-06-2008, 11:01 AM
You most likely can not find the Caylee is alive type threads because since the release of the evidence that YES there was a decomposing body in the car and YES the hair belonged to Caylee - the Caylee is Alive type threads are IMO as silly as having a thread that Caylee was abducted by aliens.

I am not trying to upset anyone here. I also wish she is alive. Unfortunately all of the evidence to date states otherwise.

No-one has to be on this thread if they don't want to. I created it for people who do believe.

Katie526
09-06-2008, 11:02 AM
Casey or Cindy, is that you? J/K

I wish I felt the same as you do, but sadly, I don't.
Cadaver dogs,DNA, LIES, Decomp smell...
Imagine what evidence we DON'T know about.

LOL

I wish and welcome Cindy, Lee or George to join this thread. Hope they do.:clap:

Seamaid
09-06-2008, 11:03 AM
I hope she's alive too but unfortunately it doesn't seem possible. Even though the hair in the trunk isn't conclusively Caylee's it does have the "death ring" on it so it does belong to someone who's dead and anyone else it could belong to is obviously alive. Plus, if she was in Puerto Rico there would have been aleast 1 sighting of her....they have TV and internet there and the Caylee story is EVERYWHERE.

momtective
09-06-2008, 11:04 AM
Why does everybody blame Amy? She cooperated with law enforcement. Casey didn't.........Whether she is alive or dead Casey basically refused to cooperate....Amy cooperated.....Pretty sad that Amy allowed Casey to borrow her car and then Casey goes and robs her blind. I would never let anybody drive my car.

How can she steal from her grandparents. I think she is a shopping addict or something

Not blaming anyone...just making the observation from reading through what seemed like 100's of myspace pages before they went private, that a lot of these young people associated with KC lived a very elite lifestyle and traveled a lot...many of them to PR. The possible father (not proven) of Caylee was PR and for some reason a lot of her friends were drawn to PR. Why? I donno. But as stated before...until someone comes up with evidence to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that Caylee is dead, I stand by my opinion that she is alive.

JBean
09-06-2008, 11:04 AM
There are people in this thread that feel the way you do. Hope this helps you.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=68947

Just to help everyone, if you go to
search this forum upper right corner of index
advanced search
titles only
*alive*
threads of this nature would pop up!
Then when you post on one, it bumps it right up to the front page.

http://i233.photobucket.com/albums/ee54/tinpiggy/searchalive.jpg

amethyst221
09-06-2008, 11:05 AM
I believe Caylee is in PR or near there. I think she went somewhere with someone around the time Amy, and the others took their vacation.

That seems even less persuasive, unsupported and unfair than the suspicion of wrongdoing by Casey.

whiteangora
09-06-2008, 11:05 AM
Can't find them.


Sniff tests, hair decomp, really so conclusive? Fence sitters thread (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=69995)

Here is a thread that has already been started on this. There are some people there that feel almost 'exactly the same way as you'.

Galina
09-06-2008, 11:06 AM
Wow, so how do you explain away the body in the trunk?

Sure, it's circumstantial ... but Occam's Razor is an invaluable line of reasoning in this instance: the simplest explanation is usually the correct one.

We all hoped little Caylee would be found alive but you cannot deny the overwhelming possibility with the current evidence. Wishful thinking is only reasonable up to a point IMHO.

Katie526
09-06-2008, 11:08 AM
Wow, so how do you explain away the body in the trunk?

Sure, it's circumstantial ... but Occam's Razor is an invaluable line of reasoning in this instance: the simplest explanation is usually the correct one.

We all hoped little Caylee would be found alive but you cannot deny the overwhelming possibility with the current evidence. Wishful thinking is only reasonable up to a point IMHO.

I understand that their is "evidence" but it's not evidence until submitted to the court. I am going on my own feeling here, no one elses. I hope I am right, I am an optimist by nature.

princess
09-06-2008, 11:11 AM
Just starting this thread because there seem to be people that believe as I do that Caylee is Alive. Just don't want to clog the other threads with this topic.

I personally (JMO) think that Caylee is alive. It's just a gut feeling that I have as some of you do.

I'm not in denial, I just don't believe someone hurt her.:)

Thread for this here..all you had to do was type Caylee alive in the search feature.


http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=68947&highlight=caylee+alive

momtective
09-06-2008, 11:11 AM
Casey or Cindy, is that you? J/K

I wish I felt the same as you do, but sadly, I don't.
Cadaver dogs,DNA, LIES, Decomp smell...
Imagine what evidence we DON'T know about.

Why is it that everytime someone posts the possibility that Caylee might be alive others suspect it's one of the A's?

Not everyone believes this little girl is dead and with the lack of evidence I would hate to think any of you would be on the jury. Reminds me of the Salem witch trials. We live in America, here you are suppose to be innocent until PROVEN guilty. I hate to think that if Caylee is found alive that narrow minded, quick to convict people will have crucified this family for nothing more than an overwhelmings popular opinion.

Katie526
09-06-2008, 11:11 AM
Nothing wrong with having this new thread. Thanks

Katie526
09-06-2008, 11:12 AM
I can't imagine what everyone who has this child dead would say if she was found alive.

OriginalJerseyGirl
09-06-2008, 11:12 AM
Against my better judgement..so do I.

My reasons for believing so
1. Hair that was found in trunk has not been identified conclusively as that of Caylee.

2. No body yet found. Note... Yet

3. Too many people in KC's life traveling around the time Caylee went missing.

4. Interviews with prople involved too vague.

5. Still other possibilities as to where Caylee might be.

6. If LE had evidence to prove Caylee is indeed dead KC would have already been charged with murder.

I reserve the right to change my opinion at any time!
I so hope that you're right and I appreciate very much you listing the reasons that you believe so. Unfortunately, I don't agree. I'll explain why by referencing your points:

1. The hair allegedly has the "death ring". Since the hair has allegedly been determined to either belong to Casey or Caylee, and Casey is not dead, that leaves only one logical conclusion.

2. Many cases have been tried successfully without a body. Decomposition, cadaver dog hits, hair with death rings, etc., can likely add up to a conviction, IMO.

3. Casey is a young person (and not exactly stable). Young people often move around a lot. But I definitely see where you're coming from on this point and it does, indeed, warrant looking into.

4. I can't really comment on this as I don't know what has been divulged to LE in the various interviews. I think that there is a lot of evidence that we have yet to see.

5. I think that this links up with #2.

6. LE doesn't need to prove just that Caylee is dead. If they want to get a conviction, they have to prove that Casey did it. I believe that they are quite able to prove death at this point. They're just trying to line up the evidence that implicates the murderer. ETA: I also agree with the poster below that states that they are waiting to charge her until they have as much evidence as possible. No need to start the clock ticking while you're still chasing down information.

All of this is, of course, my opinion. I find it refreshing to see a post about Caylee being alive that takes the time to outline some reasons.

I TRULY hope that Caylee might still be alive and that I can eat my hat on this one!

pb6656
09-06-2008, 11:13 AM
I understand that their is "evidence" but it's not evidence until submitted to the court.

I have heard this a couple times now. I don't get it. If it cannot be considered evidence until it is presented to the court, then how come people can be charged with "tampering with evidence"?

tabbykiki
09-06-2008, 11:14 AM
My reasons for believing so
1. Hair that was found in trunk has not been identified conclusively as that of Caylee.
The hair has been identified as either Casey's or Caylees. The hair has the brown decomposing band on it that has been discussed to the nth degree here and on t.v. Since we know Casey is alive, it's Caylees.

2. No body yet found. Note... Yet
True but that doesn't mean she's alive.

3. Too many people in KC's life traveling around the time Caylee went missing.
What does this have to do with whether she's alive or dead?

4. Interviews with prople involved too vague.
Did you read through the 400 + pages of released documents? I didn't find anything vague about those interviews at all.

5. Still other possibilities as to where Caylee might be.
True, but NOTHING credible. There's also a reward for $250 for a "live" Caylee. No one has given any credible tips on where she is. With that big of a reward, it surprises me.

6. If LE had evidence to prove Caylee is indeed dead KC would have already been charged with murder.
False. Prosecutors are doing their best in compiling all of the evidence. As soon as they bring her up on charges, the defense attorney (JB) has a right to a speedy trial. That means prosecutors will be forced to trial quickly (either 60 or 90 days- I can't remember which). They are taking their time so as not to run into issues such as double jeopardy.


There are my answers.

Cagney
09-06-2008, 11:15 AM
Against my better judgement..so do I.

My reasons for believing so
1. Hair that was found in trunk has not been identified conclusively as that of Caylee.


Snipped.....

The hair was identified using mitochondrial dna, and it shows decomposition....It belongs to someone in the Anthony family. I.E, Cindy, Casey, Caylee, Lee.....Since we have seen that 3 of the 4 are living, breating, walking...We can assume that the person that the hair belonged to was Caylee and she is no longer alive.

whiteangora
09-06-2008, 11:15 AM
I understand that their is "evidence" but it's not evidence until submitted to the court.

Not exactly. The evidence of stealing and forging didn't stop an arrest warrant.
Still nice to have an early morning chuckle over Baez's inane comment tho.
:rolleyes:

princess
09-06-2008, 11:15 AM
bump...here it is....gotta love that search feature on the top right corner of the forums.

I have quite a few Friends who believe she may be alive..

Katie526
09-06-2008, 11:16 AM
Not defending Casey, but was doing what a normal 22 year old does. She had a baby at 19? She wanted to give her up for adoption and her mother wouldn't allow it. It's a lot for a 22 year old to be a mother, not that she didn't create that situation herself, but still, it's a lot. Her friends are out having fun and she has a child. She seems from photos and video to be a very loving mother to Caylee so we cannot criticize her for being in a bar with her friends or partying. May so after Caylee went missing but not in general.

I bet some parents don't even know that their own children are doing the same thing. It's just not open in public like Caseys actions are. I think Casey is protecting someone or was and it went wrong somewhere.

OriginalJerseyGirl
09-06-2008, 11:17 AM
Not everyone believes this little girl is dead and with the lack of evidence I would hate to think any of you would be on the jury. Reminds me of the Salem witch trials. We live in America, here you are suppose to be innocent until PROVEN guilty. I hate to think that if Caylee is found alive that narrow minded, quick to convict people will have crucified this family for nothing more than an overwhelmings popular opinion.
Those air tests will be evidence, the detectives statements about the "death smell" will be evidence, the hair with the "death rings", the cadaver dog hits, etc., will all be evidence. Therefore, there is no lack of evidence. IMO, there MAY just be a lack of evidence about who is responsible and what the circumstances were. And for all of the evidence we've heard, I'm sure that there is so much more that we haven't.

You are 100% correct, though, in your statement that we are supposed to be innocent until proven guilty.

monoxide
09-06-2008, 11:17 AM
So why is everyone blaming Amy? Not all 22 year olds act like that especially those with children :)

tabbykiki
09-06-2008, 11:17 AM
I have heard this a couple times now. I don't get it. If it cannot be considered evidence until it is presented to the court, then how come people can be charged with "tampering with evidence"?

What is comical about this statement is that I just seen an interview with JB and he said the same exact thing. It's the first time I've ever heard such a ridiculous statement. I wouldn't believe or repeat anything out of his mouth as credible IMO.

Definitions of evidence on the Web:

* your basis for belief or disbelief; knowledge on which to base belief; "the evidence that smoking causes lung cancer is very compelling"
* attest: provide evidence for; stand as proof of; show by one's behavior, attitude, or external attributes; "His high fever attested to his illness"; "The buildings in Rome manifest a high level of architectural sophistication"; "This decision demonstrates his sense of fairness"
* testify: provide evidence for; "The blood test showed that he was the father"; "Her behavior testified to her incompetence"
* an indication that makes something evident; "his trembling was evidence of his fear"
* tell: give evidence; "he was telling on all his former colleague"
* (law) all the means by which any alleged matter of fact whose truth is investigated at judicial trial is established or disproved
wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn

Alyzabeth
09-06-2008, 11:18 AM
I still believe Caylee is alive. I haven't seen anything to prove otherwise. I think she is in another country. I think the dead body that was alledgedly in Casey's car is the reason she sent Caylee away.
I have no idea what is going on with this case, it is sometimes too far out there to even comprehend, but one thing I feel sure of, is that Caylee is alive somewhere.
I will not believe, in 1000 years that Casey hurt her intentionally or otherwise. There is too much evidence; friends, videos, pictures, family, all saying she was a loving and attentive mother.
Anyway, until someone starts talking about how she treats/treated animals, I won't believe she is capable of harming another human being in a physical way. Research has shown there is a direct connection between some types of mental illness and animal abuse/human violence.
If she doesn't have a history of animal abuse, animal neglect, torturing or killing animals, I am going to keep believing she is a good person.

Katie526
09-06-2008, 11:18 AM
I have heard this a couple times now. I don't get it. If it cannot be considered evidence until it is presented to the court, then how come people can be charged with "tampering with evidence"?

I'm not sure about that.

Admissibility
Evidence comes in four basic forms:

Demonstrative evidence
DOCUMENTARY EVIDENCE
REAL EVIDENCE
Testimonial evidence
Some rules of evidence apply to all four types and some rules apply to one or two of them. All of these forms of evidence must be ADMISSIBLE, though, before they can be considered as probative of an issue in a trial.

Basically, if evidence is to be admitted at court, it must be relevant, material, and competent. To be considered relevant, it must have some reasonable tendency to help prove or disprove some fact. It need not make the fact certain, but at least it must tend to increase or decrease the likelihood of some fact. Once admitted as relevant evidence, the finder of fact (judge or jury) will determine the appropriate weight to give a particular piece of evidence. A given piece of evidence is considered material if it is offered to prove a fact that is in dispute in a case. Competent evidence is that evidence that accords with certain traditional notions of reliability. Courts are gradually diminishing the competency rules of evidence by making them issues related to the WEIGHT OF EVIDENCE.


Real Evidence
Real evidence is a thing. Its existence or characteristics are considered relevant and material to an issue in a trial. It is usually a thing that was directly involved in some event in the case, such as a murder weapon, the personal effects of a victim, or an artifact like a cigarette or lighter belonging to a suspect. Real evidence must be relevant, material, and competent before a judge will permit its use in a trial. The process whereby a lawyer establishes these basic prerequisites (and any additional ones that may apply), is called laying a foundation. In most cases, the relevance and materiality of real evidence are obvious. A lawyer establishes the evidence's competence by showing that it really is what it is supposed to be. Establishing that real or other evidence is what it purports to be is called AUTHENTICATION.

Demonstrative Evidence
Evidence is considered "demonstrative" if it demonstrates or illustrates the TESTIMONY of a witness. It is admissible when it fairly and accurately reflects the witness's testimony and is otherwise unobjectionable. Maps, diagrams of a crime scene, charts and graphs that illustrate profits and losses are examples of demonstrative evidence.

monoxide
09-06-2008, 11:19 AM
Those air tests will be evidence, the detectives statements about the "death smell" will be evidence, the hair with the "death rings", the cadaver dog hits, etc., will all be evidence. Therefore, there is no lack of evidence. IMO, there is just lack of evidence about who is responsible and what the circumstances were. And for all of the evidence we've heard, I'm sure that there is so much more that we haven't.

You are 100% correct, though, in your statement that we are supposed to be innocent until proven guilty.

Even Cindy's statement on 911 call will be evidence. I assume if she says otherwise she'll be in trouble

tabbykiki
09-06-2008, 11:19 AM
Not defending Casey, but was doing what a normal 22 year old does. She had a baby at 19? She wanted to give her up for adoption and her mother wouldn't allow it. It's a lot for a 22 year old to be a mother, not that she didn't create that situation herself, but still, it's a lot. Her friends are out having fun and she has a child. She seems from photos and video to be a very loving mother to Caylee so we cannot criticize her for being in a bar with her friends or partying. May so after Caylee went missing but not in general.

I bet some parents don't even know that their own children are doing the same thing. It's just not open in public like Caseys actions are. I think Casey is protecting someone or was and it went wrong somewhere.

But you are defending Casey. She acts like a murderer IMO.

jbar
09-06-2008, 11:20 AM
Guts can be wrong. Science cannot.

Katie526
09-06-2008, 11:21 AM
:confused::confused:But you are defending Casey. She acts like a murderer IMO.

Can you tell me what shows she acts like a murderer.:confused:

librarian_mama
09-06-2008, 11:21 AM
I believe Caylee is in PR or near there. I think she went somewhere with someone around the time Amy, and the others took their vacation.

Why? What reason does Amy have? The problem I have with these threads is that when people discuss that Caylee is dead, they cite concrete reasons--i.e. Casey's lies, her actions afterwards, etc. If you want to explore the argument that Caylee is alive, what are some logical reasons for this opinion? I'd love for her to be alive in PR--I just can't blindly hope, though. Give us your argument, or there's not much point in exploring this angle.

tabbykiki
09-06-2008, 11:22 AM
I still believe Caylee is alive. I haven't seen anything to prove otherwise. I think she is in another country. I think the dead body that was alledgedly in Casey's car is the reason she sent Caylee away.
I have no idea what is going on with this case, it is sometimes too far out there to even comprehend, but one thing I feel sure of, is that Caylee is alive somewhere.
I will not believe, in 1000 years that Casey hurt her intentionally or otherwise. There is too much evidence; friends, videos, pictures, family, all saying she was a loving and attentive mother.
Anyway, until someone starts talking about how she treats/treated animals, I won't believe she is capable of harming another human being in a physical way. Research has shown there is a direct connection between some types of mental illness and animal abuse/human violence.
If she doesn't have a history of animal abuse, animal neglect, torturing or killing animals, I am going to keep believing she is a good person.
Wow. Let's hope that you are never selected to be on a jury. Just because someone acts a certain way and they seem loving doesn't mean they didn't kill anyone. Look at Scott Peterson. Everyone says he was the "perfect husband". We all know that was only when people were watching.

What's going to convict Casey IMO is all of the evidence in this case, circumstancial especially.

momtective
09-06-2008, 11:25 AM
I'm not sure about that.

Admissibility
Evidence comes in four basic forms:

Demonstrative evidence
DOCUMENTARY EVIDENCE
REAL EVIDENCE
Testimonial evidence
Some rules of evidence apply to all four types and some rules apply to one or two of them. All of these forms of evidence must be ADMISSIBLE, though, before they can be considered as probative of an issue in a trial.

Basically, if evidence is to be admitted at court, it must be relevant, material, and competent. To be considered relevant, it must have some reasonable tendency to help prove or disprove some fact. It need not make the fact certain, but at least it must tend to increase or decrease the likelihood of some fact. Once admitted as relevant evidence, the finder of fact (judge or jury) will determine the appropriate weight to give a particular piece of evidence. A given piece of evidence is considered material if it is offered to prove a fact that is in dispute in a case. Competent evidence is that evidence that accords with certain traditional notions of reliability. Courts are gradually diminishing the competency rules of evidence by making them issues related to the WEIGHT OF EVIDENCE.


Real Evidence
Real evidence is a thing. Its existence or characteristics are considered relevant and material to an issue in a trial. It is usually a thing that was directly involved in some event in the case, such as a murder weapon, the personal effects of a victim, or an artifact like a cigarette or lighter belonging to a suspect. Real evidence must be relevant, material, and competent before a judge will permit its use in a trial. The process whereby a lawyer establishes these basic prerequisites (and any additional ones that may apply), is called laying a foundation. In most cases, the relevance and materiality of real evidence are obvious. A lawyer establishes the evidence's competence by showing that it really is what it is supposed to be. Establishing that real or other evidence is what it purports to be is called AUTHENTICATION.

Demonstrative Evidence
Evidence is considered "demonstrative" if it demonstrates or illustrates the TESTIMONY of a witness. It is admissible when it fairly and accurately reflects the witness's testimony and is otherwise unobjectionable. Maps, diagrams of a crime scene, charts and graphs that illustrate profits and losses are examples of demonstrative evidence.

Exactaly!

Katie526
09-06-2008, 11:26 AM
Not exactly. The evidence of stealing and forging didn't stop an arrest warrant.
Still nice to have an early morning chuckle over Baez's inane comment tho.
:rolleyes:

Amy went in and pressed charges I believe for the stealing and forging.

jbar
09-06-2008, 11:27 AM
I'm really starting to believe this thread has been started to get people riled up, ie: trolls or family members or members of the defense.


I agree. And like someone said in the other thread like this, I am not interested in helping the Anthony's build a defense.

curiousmind
09-06-2008, 11:27 AM
I have a feeling that she is alive as well.

I do believe that there is a Puerto Rico connection. I believe that KC set this all in motion and never took into account that whoever she passed her off too would fall in love with her and believe that they could give her a better life, therefore cutting off contact.

I have flown 2 times in the last 3 years with my kids. One of which is 3. When he flew as a lap child he was not listed anywhere on the ticket.

He just boarded on my pass. The airline had no record of him at all. There never would have been proof that he was on the plane.

After getting my ticket I called back and once again asked if he needed to be listed since I was getting worried that he would not be allowed to board.

I flew this past August across country with my two kids. I was never once asked by anyone for proof that they were mine or able to fly with me.

texasgirl
09-06-2008, 11:27 AM
I'm really starting to believe this thread has been started to get people riled up, ie: trolls or family members or members of the defense. We all know they read here at WS.

:clap: Thank you. I agree!

I was sitting here wondering why it was so hostile in here and WHY there needed to be a new thread about this when there are several others. I don't think it's right to be defensive either when others try and help you understand about threads and how they work.

Although I don't agree that Caylee is alive, I think everyone has an opinion...but when I came in here, it seems more to "defend" than to "discuss". I think this thread should be merged with others of the same topic personally.

IMO

tabbykiki
09-06-2008, 11:27 AM
:confused::confused:

Can you tell me what shows she acts like a murderer.:confused:

Hmmm, let me start:

1. The fact she LIED, LIED, LIED continuously to LE and still has not said one truth to them on where her daughter is or where she left her.
2. The fact that she partied for days and days after her daughter was "missing".
3. The fact that she didn't tell anyone her daughter was missing for "31 days".
4. The fact that she never once attended any vigils in her front/back yard for her daughter while she was home.
5. Listen to her attitude during those jail house calls - "all anyone cares about is finding Caylee..."
6. The fact that this woman has shown no emotion to LE or anyone about her child "missing". Oh wait! JB says she is emotional all of the time to him! Maybe she's crying because she knows she's going to get the DP.
7. And the most important fact of all - the fact that she NEVER reported her daughter missing. Her mother had to! Sick, sick, sick, and every bit acting like a murderer.

Again, I implore you to read the 400+ pages LE released. This will allow you to be more informed as a WS poster.

STEADFAST
09-06-2008, 11:28 AM
:confused::confused:

Can you tell me what shows she acts like a murderer.:confused:

She lies about the circumstances surrounding the last time her child was seen. In all the cases I've followed on WS, there is not one in which a person who lied about about the circumstances surrounding the last time a missing person was seen has turned out to be innocent of murdering that person.

Katie526
09-06-2008, 11:28 AM
I agree. And like someone said in the other thread like this, I am not interested in helping the Anthony's build a defense.

Please. I started this thread because I believe she is alive. I live in NY and I am not part of the Anthony family. Please leave and stop starting trouble. Thank you MY GOD

Katie526
09-06-2008, 11:29 AM
Hmmm, let me start:

1. The fact she LIED, LIED, LIED continuously to LE and still has not said one truth to them on where her daughter is or where she left her.
2. The fact that she partied for days and days after her daughter was "missing".
3. The fact that she didn't tell anyone her daughter was missing for "31 days".
4. The fact that she never once attended any vigils in her front/back yard for her daughter while she was home.
5. Listen to her attitude during those jail house calls - "all anyone cares about is finding Caylee..."
6. The fact that this woman has shown no emotion to LE or anyone about her child "missing". Oh wait! JB says she is emotional all of the time to him! Maybe she's crying because she knows she's going to get the DP.
7. And the most important fact of all - the fact that she NEVER reported her daughter missing. Her mother had to! Sick, sick, sick, and every bit acting like a murderer.

Again, I implore you to read the 400+ pages LE released. This will allow you to be more informed as a WS poster.

Doesn't prove she committed murder.

SUR
09-06-2008, 11:29 AM
I can't base my opinion on the fact that I am a mother, although I am...to 12.

I base my opinion on the evidence or should I say lack thereof.

I'm keeping an open mind and until there is evidence to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that Caylee is dead. When and if that happens I will gladly yet sadly change my opinion.

There are far too many innocent people sitting in prison for crimes they did not commit. KC in my opinion is guilty of may things, evidence proves she is a liar, a thief, of low moral character and without emotion. Only one of the aforementioned is a crime.
Until the evidence is in I will maintain my opinion that this precious little girl is alive and most likely living in Puerto Rico.

Great post and i so agree with you. Thank you

tabbykiki
09-06-2008, 11:30 AM
Oh, almost forgot to add:

The fact that she LIED and said she talked to Caylee 7/15 at noon (incoming call from a private number). LE got the phone records and investigated and there was NO call coming in anywhere near that time; plus no call from any private/unregistered numbers. The closest call was boyfriend Tony an hour and a half or two hours later.

There are many more facts as well...

I ask, would a non-murderer cover her tracks like this, and LIE LIE LIE if she really wanted to find her baby? She is acting in the best interests of CASEY and that tells me she is responsible and a murderer.

Katie526
09-06-2008, 11:31 AM
For the folks that decided to come in here and try to start trouble. Please start your own thread that "Caylee is gone" for the folks that believe as you.


I do not wish this thread to become an angry forum. We are entitled to our opinions and we did this so that you wouldn't have to see it or hear it. It is your choice to come in here, but please don't bash people or accuse us of trying to rally something up.

pb6656
09-06-2008, 11:31 AM
I'm not sure about that.





Basically, if evidence is to be admitted at court, it must be relevant, material, and competent. To be considered relevant, it must have some reasonable tendency to help prove or disprove some fact. It need not make the fact certain, but at least it must tend to increase or decrease the likelihood of some fact. Once admitted as relevant evidence, the finder of fact (judge or jury) will determine the appropriate weight to give a particular piece of evidence. A given piece of evidence is considered material if it is offered to prove a fact that is in dispute in a case. Competent evidence is that evidence that accords with certain traditional notions of reliability. Courts are gradually diminishing the competency rules of evidence by making them issues related to the WEIGHT OF EVIDENCE.


IMO, that just makes the statement more laughable. The hair evidence will certainly be part of the prosecutions case should charges actually be filed and it goes to court. Phone calls will make it to court. Even the people who saw the car two days in a row at Amscot will have their testimony presented as evidence.

I have a pee stain on my throw rug that I haven't washed yet. That is evidence that one of the dogs did a no-no.

tabbykiki
09-06-2008, 11:31 AM
Doesn't prove she committed murder.

You didn't ask me "to prove that she committed murder". You asked me:

Can you tell me what shows she acts like a murderer.

Cagney
09-06-2008, 11:32 AM
Not defending Casey, but was doing what a normal 22 year old does. She had a baby at 19? She wanted to give her up for adoption and her mother wouldn't allow it. It's a lot for a 22 year old to be a mother, not that she didn't create that situation herself, but still, it's a lot. Her friends are out having fun and she has a child. She seems from photos and video to be a very loving mother to Caylee so we cannot criticize her for being in a bar with her friends or partying. May so after Caylee went missing but not in general.

I bet some parents don't even know that their own children are doing the same thing. It's just not open in public like Caseys actions are. I think Casey is protecting someone or was and it went wrong somewhere.

I'm sorry but Casey is not doing what a normal 22 year old who is a mother is doing.
I became a mom at 18, one year earlier than Casey. By the time I was 22 I had a 4 year old. I did not nor have I ever gone out and partied the way that she has.
I am now a mom to 5. My husband and I go out MAYBE once a month.
I was the last of my friends to have kids, believe it or not. (there was apparently something in the water where I went to school) No one that I know who was a young/teen mom has behaved like this, and that includes a friend who TRULY did not want her son but had him anyway and has turned out to be an EXCELLENT parent.

Regardless of how old you are when you have children, once you become a parent you loose the right to act irresponsibly and to be a child yourself.
Being a parent you loose the right to be selfish and stupid.

And I still maintain that if Casey truly did not want that baby, she could have done many things to avoid having her. Despite what Cindy's opinion was. Casey was an adult.

I really think that Caylee was like arm candy to Casey. I really think that Casey liked some of the attention that Caylee brought her. But then started to become insecure of it.

SUR
09-06-2008, 11:33 AM
Wow, so how do you explain away the body in the trunk?

Sure, it's circumstantial ... but Occam's Razor is an invaluable line of reasoning in this instance: the simplest explanation is usually the correct one.

We all hoped little Caylee would be found alive but you cannot deny the overwhelming possibility with the current evidence. Wishful thinking is only reasonable up to a point IMHO.

Body in the trunk has not been proven. Leaks are not proof.

Katie526
09-06-2008, 11:34 AM
You didn't ask me "to prove that she committed murder". You asked me:

We know casey is a liar, we know she is crazy at times, but many people in this world lie and act as she does. Doesn't mean they murdered anyone. I really don't want to discuss this further. This thread is supposed to be a positive one, thanks anyway.

I want solid proof.

whiteangora
09-06-2008, 11:34 AM
I'm really starting to believe this thread has been started to get people riled up, ie: trolls or family members or members of the defense. We all know they read here at WS.

I agree, best to just leave them alone.
There is real news here on the forum to look over.

SUR
09-06-2008, 11:35 AM
IMO, that just makes the statement more laughable. The hair evidence will certainly be part of the prosecutions case should charges actually be filed and it goes to court. Phone calls will make it to court. Even the people who saw the car two days in a row at Amscot will have their testimony presented as evidence.

I have a pee stain on my throw rug that I haven't washed yet. That is evidence that one of the dogs did a no-no.


What hair evidence has been proven?

momtective
09-06-2008, 11:35 AM
I'm really starting to believe this thread has been started to get people riled up, ie: trolls or family members or members of the defense. We all know they read here at WS.

Again I ask, WHY is it that every time someone posts an opinion contrary to the popular belief, we are considered part of the A family.

Not building a defense for KC but exploring the possibility that this little girl is alive.

I'm entitled to my opinion and I'm entitled to change it as often as I like and I resent being suspected of being a member of the A family just because I have a different opinion than the majority.

Katie526
09-06-2008, 11:37 AM
:clap:Again I ask, WHY is it that every time someone posts an opinion contrary to the popular belief, we are considered part of the A family.

Not building a defense for KC but exploring the possibility that this little girl is alive.

I'm entitled to my opinion and I'm entitled to change it as often as I like and I resent being suspected of being a member of the A family just because I have a different opinion than the majority.


:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::woohoo:

texasgirl
09-06-2008, 11:39 AM
Please. I started this thread because I believe she is alive. I live in NY and I am not part of the Anthony family. Please leave and stop starting trouble. Thank you MY GOD

I don't think that jbar is trying to start trouble. When you start a new thread and there are several of the same kind already here, people are going to come here to find out what's being said.

I think the thing that you have to understand is that if you are going to start a thread, you better be here to back it up. If you have info, you provide a link. If you have an opinion, you look to make sure there isn't a thread already....and there ARE threads already discussing this as one of our regular posters has already pointed out to you.

Don't get mad that others are stating their opinions....you started this thread and you should have known it would happen. I feel like you are being a little defensive with those that disagree....and that doesn't help at all. Please try and understand that WS is here to discuss and debate. Don't start a thread if it's going to make you mad to have others disagree with you. That's why we're here! :)

I am happy that you feel that Caylee is alive. I am a mother and I wish I felt the same way as you....I wish I could say that my intuition tells me that Caylee is alive too. :(

SUR
09-06-2008, 11:40 AM
Again I ask, WHY is it that every time someone posts an opinion contrary to the popular belief, we are considered part of the A family.

Not building a defense for KC but exploring the possibility that this little girl is alive.

I'm entitled to my opinion and I'm entitled to change it as often as I like and I resent being suspected of being a member of the A family just because I have a different opinion than the majority.

Don't worry about it, some people just are prone to think negative and attack if others do not agree with them. We would have no need for courts if everyone just KNEW who was guilty from the get go of every crime based on how the suspect "act", leaks and mind reading.

tabbykiki
09-06-2008, 11:41 AM
Again I ask, WHY is it that every time someone posts an opinion contrary to the popular belief, we are considered part of the A family.

Not building a defense for KC but exploring the possibility that this little girl is alive.

I'm entitled to my opinion and I'm entitled to change it as often as I like and I resent being suspected of being a member of the A family just because I have a different opinion than the majority.

Good, I'm glad you're here for the right reasons. I think it would be wonderful if she was found alive. I'm sorry you resent being accused as such,but I never accused anyone in particular of being apart of the A family. I do think anyone whom would like to seem the least bit informed about this case should at least read through the documents LE released, as when they post and make statements they will be grounded in fact not defense theories. :bang: JMO though.

I'm outta here

Katie526
09-06-2008, 11:42 AM
I don't think that jbar is trying to start trouble. When you start a new thread and there are several of the same kind already here, people are going to come here to find out what's being said.

I think the thing that you have to understand is that if you are going to start a thread, you better be here to back it up. If you have info, you provide a link. If you have an opinion, you look to make sure there isn't a thread already....and there ARE threads already discussing this as one of our regular posters has already pointed out to you.

Don't get mad that others are stating their opinions....you started this thread and you should have known it would happen. I feel like you are being a little defensive with those that disagree....and that doesn't help at all. Please try and understand that WS is here to discuss and debate. Don't start a thread if it's going to make you mad to have others disagree with you. That's why we're here! :)

I am happy that you feel that Caylee is alive. I am a mother and I wish I felt the same way as you....I wish I could say that my intuition tells me that Caylee is alive too. :(

I am new to WS this year with this case so I was not prepared for people to come in and challenge me. I don't have proof that Caylee is alive; I just feel this way. I don't have to prove anything. I'm almost sorry I started this and for the folks that did join me with the right intentions, I'm sorry that this is turing out this way. I will continue here but I will not respond to negative comments.

*Kat*
09-06-2008, 11:42 AM
I am hoping, praying & wishing that she is still with us on Earth. I am with you Katie. My mind just cannot go to that other place. I have so many scenarios in my head that people maybe really did take her & force mom to lie...I just cannot believe otherwise at this time even with all the compelling evidence, etc. Call me gullible, vulnerable, whatever - I just cannot fathom that anything happened to this little girl & people have held out on the information for so long. How do you not break down at some point?

SewingDeb
09-06-2008, 11:45 AM
I really started this thread to discuss that Caylee is alive, not to argue with people who don't. You don't have to be in this thread if you don't believe as some of us do. It was the whole reason I created it.:rolleyes:

I don't think the mods generally like threads that exclude people from the discussion. We saw that with Trenton Duckett's case.

momtective
09-06-2008, 11:46 AM
Good, I'm glad you're here for the right reasons. I think it would be wonderful if she was found alive. I'm sorry you resent being accused as such,but I never accused anyone in particular of being apart of the A family. I do think anyone whom would like to seem the least bit informed about this case should at least read through the documents LE released, as when they post and make statements they will be grounded in fact not defense theories. :bang: JMO though.

I'm outta here

I have read the 400+ pages of the docs and honestly I think those who were interviewed were very vague and not one suggested that CA killed Caylee. Quite the contrary, they suggested she was a good mother adn that she loved her little girl. Not one of them trashed her.
Another thing I noticed right away was that many of the interviews paralled one another making me think this may have been rehearsed. Just seemed like everyone knew what to say and what not to say.

Katie526
09-06-2008, 11:46 AM
I don't think the mods generally like threads that exclude people from the discussion. We saw that with Trenton Duckett's case.

Thanks, I don't want to exclude anyone but I don't want people being attacked either. There are plenty of threads with different topics. I don't go into one's that I don't want to discuss.

SUR
09-06-2008, 11:47 AM
I am new to WS this year with this case so I was not prepared for people to come in and challenge me. I don't have proof that Caylee is alive; I just feel this way. I don't have to prove anything. I'm almost sorry I started this and for the folks that did join me with the right intentions, I'm sorry that this is turing out this way. I will continue here but I will not respond to negative comments.


I have to wonder why so many do not want this thread? What is the problem? There are other threads that are similar to each other trashing the Anthony family and/or casey and that seems to be ok? Why is that?

You're right, you don't have to prove anything here just as no one else has proven anything on any of the threads.

AutomaticAuttie
09-06-2008, 11:47 AM
What hair evidence has been proven?

No way, no how is that "hair evidence" solid evidence!

momtective
09-06-2008, 11:48 AM
The two interviews that disturbed me the most were Kiomarie and ZG. Kiomarie gave a second interview stating she had 2 friends named C and she made a mistake and confused the two. Doesn't this seem just a little strange.

Katie526
09-06-2008, 11:48 AM
i have to wonder why so many do not want this thread? What is the problem? There are other threads that are similar to each other trashing the anthony family and/or casey and that seems to be ok? Why is that?

You're right, you don't have to prove anything here just as no one else has proven anything on any of the threads.

thanks sur!

pb6656
09-06-2008, 11:49 AM
What hair evidence has been proven?


The mere fact that there was hair in the trunk consistent with Caylee's will be brought in as evidence. They will even bring the pings from Casey's cell phones into court. Each item in itself will not be considered the "smoking gun" so to speak. They will use it all to tie the whole case together.

If you are set on focusing upon just the hair, even though my original question was just "evidence" in general, then why would they not bring the hair into court? Even as Casey's hair, it is evidence.

SUR
09-06-2008, 11:51 AM
No way, no how is that "hair evidence" solid evidence!


Because it was leaked? What more could we ask for? Strange some people forget it has to be proven in court.

texasgirl
09-06-2008, 11:51 AM
I am new to WS this year with this case so I was not prepared for people to come in and challenge me. I don't have proof that Caylee is alive; I just feel this way. I don't have to prove anything. I'm almost sorry I started this and for the folks that did join me with the right intentions, I'm sorry that this is turing out this way. I will continue here but I will not respond to negative comments.

Don't worry about it Katie....Yes, there will be people who will disagree with you and be nasty about it but for the majority, most here will respectfully disagree. Those that give you a hard time can be ignored....don't let it get you all defensive because some of us are pretty nice usually! :) I really don't get involved in drama here but I had to tell you that it seemed a little hostile here. I'd like to hear your opinions and why you think that Caylee is alive but I don't want to do it in a hostile environment. Ya know what I mean?

I'm glad you're here....and I'm glad you have HOPE. I don't and I could use some. You can't change my mind about Caylee but I'd love to hear your thoughts.

One more thing, there are a lot of posters here that have been here a while, posted a lot and know more about WS than I ever could....you don't have to listen to their opinions if you don't want to but you should listen to any advice they give you in regards to threads and that sort of thing. They are really helpful! :) Just IMO.

Now that we got that out of the way....I really am glad that there are posters on WS that believe Caylee to be alive. I wish I felt the same.

tabbykiki
09-06-2008, 11:52 AM
I have read the 400+ pages of the docs and honestly I think those who were interviewed were very vague and not one suggested that Caylee killed Casey. Quite the contrary, they suggested she was a good mother adn that she loved her little girl. Not one of them trashed her.
Another thing I noticed right away was that many of the interviews paralled one another making me think this may have been rehearsed. Just seemed like everyone knew what to say and what not to say.

Remember, the 400 pages released were only to support the current charges KC was facing - child neglect, etc. Even so, there are things in there that certainly contribute to her acting inappropriately for her daughter being missing, etc. which have lead me to believe she is likely a murderer.

Any evidence contained within them about possible murder were only released to support the original charges. LE has a lot of stuff we have no idea of...

Mama-cita
09-06-2008, 11:52 AM
Thanks, I don't want to exclude anyone but I don't want people being attacked either. There are plenty of threads with different topics. I don't go into one's that I don't want to discuss.

I think the point that several posters who have been here for a long time have tried gently to make is that every time someone starts a thread which is similar to many others that exist, it just wastes space and everybody's time. When something is not *NEW* or *breaking news* or *continuation of a forum* one should simply add their OPINIONS to a similar forum that already exists.
Some people come in and try to "rally the masses" to agree with an unpopular opinion, and if you do that you have to live with the fact that other people are going to disagree with you. Just as it is your constitutionally protected right to have an opinion, other posters here have the same right to theirs.
You should review forum etiquette and TOS before starting a new thread since you are so new.

Katie526
09-06-2008, 11:53 AM
Don't worry about it Katie....Yes, there will be people who will disagree with you and be nasty about it but for the majority, most here will respectfully disagree. Those that give you a hard time can be ignored....don't let it get you all defensive because some of us are pretty nice usually! :) I really don't get involved in drama here but I had to tell you that it seemed a little hostile here. I'd like to hear your opinions and why you think that Caylee is alive but I don't want to do it in a hostile environment. Ya know what I mean?

I'm glad you're here....and I'm glad you have HOPE. I don't and I could use some. You can't change my mind about Caylee but I'd love to hear your thoughts.

One more thing, there are a lot of posters here that have been here a while, posted a lot and know more about WS than I ever could....you don't have to listen to their opinions if you don't want to but you should listen to any advice they give you in regards to threads and that sort of thing. They are really helpful! :) Just IMO.

Now that we got that out of the way....I really am glad that there are posters on WS that believe Caylee to be alive. I wish I felt the same.


Thank you for your kind words. I respect people on WS and there are so many nice people here.

SUR
09-06-2008, 11:53 AM
The mere fact that there was hair in the trunk consistent with Caylee's will be brought in as evidence. They will even bring the pings from Casey's cell phones into court. Each item in itself will not be considered the "smoking gun" so to speak. They will use it all to tie the whole case together.

If you are set on focusing upon just the hair, even though my original question was just "evidence" in general, then why would they not bring the hair into court? Even as Casey's hair, it is evidence.

Brought into as evidnce yes if leak is true BUT it ALSO has to be PROVEN. Each leak has to be proven to tie anything.

Centaurus
09-06-2008, 11:53 AM
I'm on the fence. When I look at Casey, I don't see a murderer. The photos that came out with her in the clubs dancing while Caylee was supposedly missing really make me think that Casey knows Caylee is OK and in good hands.

Casey may be a lot of things, but I don't see her as a cold-blooded killer. Because you have two options to believe; she is either a brutal killer of her own daughter or she is innocent. There really is no gray area here. For those of you that think this was an accidental death, I really don't think it's possible. If it were truly an accident, I believe she would have called 911 AND would have been grieving. So in my book accidental death is ruled out, which leaves me once again with the two options: premeditated murder or innocent.

To me the evidence is sketchy at best. The decomp smell is the only thing that I think is believable, and let's face it, that is not reason enough to believe that CAYLEE is deceased. After doing more research on Hair Evidence, I'm even less convinced than ever before about the supposed "hair sample."

Here is a brief abstract from The Journal of Forensic Sciences:

http://www.astm.org/JOURNALS/FORENSIC/PAGES/3575.htm

And here are the Standards and Guidelines from the FBI lab:

http://www.fbi.gov/hq/lab/fsc/backissu/april2005/standards/2005_04_standards02.htm

(long read, but really worth it to understand how this all works)

Other than that, there is just a lot of circumstantial evidence. I believe innocent until proven guilty. What scares me is this lynch mob mentality that I see so often, and like a previous poster mentioned, there are so many innocent people sitting in jail cells right now.

To be completely honest, I get a little sick to my stomach that some people have completely written her off already, writing R.I.P Caylee, etc. It's almost like they can't wait to find a dead Caylee just to be proven right. :eek:

This is all my opinion, and while it may not be popular, please respect it. I will not debate my stand on this case, as I don't go to the other threads and interject my opinions there. If you believe Caylee is dead, this is probably not the thread for you.

I have gone back and forth so many times on this case, and am more and more thinking Caylee is still alive. I don't believe the "Zanny the Nanny" story, but I think there is obviously more to this case than the public knows and am holding judgement until definite evidence from a LE spokesperson is made public and/or Casey is arrested for killing her daughter.

ketel0ne
09-06-2008, 11:55 AM
I have to wonder why so many do not want this thread? What is the problem? There are other threads that are similar to each other trashing the Anthony family and/or casey and that seems to be ok? Why is that?

You're right, you don't have to prove anything here just as no one else has proven anything on any of the threads.

But what backs up these "feelings" in this thread? Where is there any statements that show Caylee to be alive or seen by anyone after June 16th. Where is any article, interview or theory that puts Caylee in the hands of another that doesn't originate from a pathological liar? No has to believe anything in any of the threads, but at websleuths we build theories on what is presented via LE, the media, or our own sleuthing, how has this thread contributed to that to state a case that Caylee is alive? Also believing Caylee is dead doesn't make Casey a murderer either.

Mama-cita
09-06-2008, 11:56 AM
I have to wonder why so many do not want this thread? What is the problem? There are other threads that are similar to each other trashing the Anthony family and/or casey and that seems to be ok? Why is that?

You're right, you don't have to prove anything here just as no one else has proven anything on any of the threads.

People have tried to say, VETERAN people who have been here for a LONG time, that is not proper "forum etiquette" to start a NEW THREAD when others exist on the same/similar topic, particularly when said thread is merely a poster's OPINION. WHEN NEWS BREAKS and people get excited, you may see 2 or 3 topics pop up under different threads but the mods do their best to merge them. This case is going to be long, and it makes it rough when you have to page through threads of "Casey's still alive, I just know it" to get to the real, concrete, goings on of this case.

momtective
09-06-2008, 11:56 AM
I think the point that several posters who have been here for a long time have tried gently to make is that every time someone starts a thread which is similar to many others that exist, it just wastes space and everybody's time. When something is not *NEW* or *breaking news* or *continuation of a forum* one should simply add their OPINIONS to a similar forum that already exists.
Some people come in and try to "rally the masses" to agree with an unpopular opinion, and if you do that you have to live with the fact that other people are going to disagree with you. Just as it is your constitutionally protected right to have an opinion, other posters here have the same right to theirs.
You should review forum etiquette and TOS before starting a new thread since you are so new.

Directions to the other thread plz and we can take the conversation over there.

Laece
09-06-2008, 11:57 AM
Body in the trunk has not been proven. Leaks are not proof.

actually, the fact that there was a body in the trunk has been proven.

although it is likely, it has yet to be proven that the body is that of caylee's.

there's a difference.

Katie526
09-06-2008, 11:57 AM
I'm on the fence. When I look at Casey, I don't see a murderer. The photos that came out with her in the clubs dancing while Caylee was supposedly missing really make me think that Casey knows Caylee is OK and in good hands.

Casey may be a lot of things, but I don't see her as a cold-blooded killer. Because you have two options to believe; she is either a brutal killer of her own daughter or she is innocent. There really is no gray area here. For those of you that think this was an accidental death, I really don't think it's possible. If it were truly an accident, I believe she would have called 911 AND would have been grieving. So in my book accidental death is ruled out, which leaves me once again with the two options: premeditated murder or innocent.

To me the evidence is sketchy at best. The decomp smell is the only thing that I think is believable, and let's face it, that is not reason enough to believe that CAYLEE is deceased. After doing more research on Hair Evidence, I'm even less convinced than ever before about the supposed "hair sample."

Here is a brief abstract from The Journal of Forensic Sciences:

http://www.astm.org/JOURNALS/FORENSIC/PAGES/3575.htm

And here are the Standards and Guidelines from the FBI lab:

http://www.fbi.gov/hq/lab/fsc/backissu/april2005/standards/2005_04_standards02.htm

(long read, but really worth it to understand how this all works)

Other than that, there is just a lot of circumstantial evidence. I believe innocent until proven guilty. What scares me is this lynch mob mentality that I see so often, and like a previous poster mentioned, there are so many innocent people sitting in jail cells right now.

To be completely honest, I get a little sick to my stomach that some people have completely written her off already, writing R.I.P Caylee, etc. It's almost like they can't wait to find a dead Caylee just to be proven right. :eek:

This is all my opinion, and while it may not be popular, please respect it. I will not debate my stand on this case, as I don't go to the other threads and interject my opinions there. If you believe Caylee is dead, this is probably not the thread for you.

I have gone back and forth so many times on this case, and am more and more thinking Caylee is still alive. I don't believe the "Zanny the Nanny" story, but I think there is obviously more to this case than the public knows and am holding judgement until definite evidence from a LE spokesperson is made public and/or Casey is arrested for killing her daughter.

Great Post, my feelings as well. I don't see a killer when I see Casey. Personally, regardless of her actions, she would have broken down by now. Only a serial killer has no emotions for eternity.

pb6656
09-06-2008, 11:58 AM
Brought into as evidnce yes if leak is true BUT it ALSO has to be PROVEN. Each leak has to be proven to tie anything.

I realize I am new here. My question was about the statement: it's not evidence until submitted to the court.

It will all be brought into court as evidence whether it was leaked or not. Why would it have to be leaked?

Katie526
09-06-2008, 11:58 AM
But what backs up these "feelings" in this thread? Where is there any statements that show Caylee to be alive or seen by anyone after June 16th. Where is any article, interview or theory that puts Caylee in the hands of another that doesn't originate from a pathological liar? No has to believe anything in any of the threads, but at websleuths we build theories on what is presented via LE, the media, or our own sleuthing, how has this thread contributed to that to state a case that Caylee is alive? Also believing Caylee is dead doesn't make Casey a murderer either.

We are not required to have back-up.

Mama-cita
09-06-2008, 11:59 AM
Directions to the other thread plz and we can take the conversation over there.

Well, as JBean tried to direct you several hours ago to do a forum search for "alive" that should take you to any of the threads in this forum on that topic.

pb6656
09-06-2008, 11:59 AM
Great Post, my feelings as well. I don't see a killer when I see Casey. Personally, regardless of her actions, she would have broken down by now. Only a serial killer has no emotions for eternity.

Scott Peterson has shown no emotion regarding Lacey and his baby. He wasn't a serial killer.

Katie526
09-06-2008, 12:00 PM
Scott Peterson has shown no emotion regarding Lacey and his baby. He wasn't a serial killer.

Okay, I agree on that.