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christine2448
08-13-2008, 07:55 PM
Please continue GENERAL discussions here. Look around Nancy has her own forum (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=165), there are several threads started on specific topics to try and stay organized.


Links to previous and similar threads can be found toward the bottom of the page.


Newbies.....

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y171/christine2448/WELCOMETOWSBLUE.gif

I am sad such a tragedy is bringing us all together.

I advise everyone to read the RULES of WS, Long (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=66869)and Short Version (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=66872).

raisincharlie
08-13-2008, 08:08 PM
Roy,

I'm curious why you are thinking EVERYTHING is hearsey ?

Do you think Chief Bazemore was not telling the truth when she said there were no reported sightings of Nancy in the press conference on the evening of the 14th ?

ncnative
08-13-2008, 08:25 PM
Here's my latest opinion. I remember when there was the press conference via the police, and one of Nancy Cooper's family members (I think one of her sisters) said something about the killer being a coward. The word cowardice was used by her.

The killer (in my opinion, I'm betting on BC) may have used a cowardly way of killing her. IF she came home under the influence of alcohol, say, he could have used that to somehow make it easier to bring her down. Or, he could've used a drug, or just hit her with something. A drug would have made it more planned, I think, so I'm not betting on that so much.

Do I sound like an amateur? I am!

I just think he would have been cowardly in his ways of bringing on her demise. Or at least in his cover-ups after the fact.

I've always thought that NC's family knew enough to come out and say the "cowardly" comment, and the comment about the killer coming forward and admitting it. They know something we don't.

ncnative
08-13-2008, 08:31 PM
Things are a bit boring here. I wish that some of our Canadian folks who possibly knew Brad's mom and dad would speak up. I'm always interested in the family dynamics behind someone who exhibits personality disorders, or shall we say emotional problems. The ex-girlfriend and others have spoken out from his past.

Love to hear from Medicine Hat in Canada if anyone actually knows BC's mom. Even better, old elementary through high school teachers he had? Did he do team sports, etc.? A common thread would arise in his personality perhaps. WHETHER he did the crime or not.

EntreNous
08-13-2008, 08:34 PM
Well, certainly they do since they've interacted with him face to face over the years of knowing him. They have a very personal take on BC that we don't.

They may well have knowledge that we don't but I think that would be unusual if LE shared any details with them.

SleuthSayer
08-13-2008, 08:39 PM
So you believe a presser on the 16th in which they said nothing should not have been allowed ? The one on the 17th - the press had questions of them - should that have been disallowed as well ? And the one on the 18th they expressed thanks, assured people the kids were okay, and announced memorial services and responded to questions should also have been disallowed ?

Since I brought up the issue about the press conferences, I'll respond. As I said when I originally mentioned it, I didn't expect my opinion on them to be popular here. That's fine.

The general opinion here seems to be that Brad has not been sufficiently "public" since his wife's death. I.e., not at the press conferences and not at public memorials. I was just expressing my opinion that people can also be too public in some cases.

I just went back and listened to the first few minutes of the 7/18 press conference. The police chief said that the investigation was progressing well, that she wouldn't take any questions, detailed the plans for a memorial service, and then she said that the family wanted to talk about the children. They discussed the personalities of the children (how they differed, etc), how the children got along with cousins, etc, etc.

I personally don't see why there is any public need to know of information related to 4 and 2 year old children of a murder victim. I seems that all the public needs to know is that the children are safe and are being cared for. I can't imagine seeing my in-laws sitting in front of cameras discussing my children.

The 7/17 press conference was similar in nature, but was focused on Nancy.

As far as whether the conferences should have been "disallowed", I guess that's the Cary Police's call. To me, if the family felt that the public needed to know personal information about Nancy and the children, a more appropriate venue would have been the Today Show or Larry King rather than a Cary Police news conference.

JMHO and I don't have a problem with people having the different opinions.

raisincharlie
08-13-2008, 08:50 PM
Since I brought up the issue about the press conferences, I'll respond. As I said when I originally mentioned it, I didn't expect my opinion on them to be popular here. That's fine.

The general opinion here seems to be that Brad has not been sufficiently "public" since his wife's death. I.e., not at the press conferences and not at public memorials. I was just expressing my opinion that people can also be too public in some cases.

I just went back and listened to the first few minutes of the 7/18 press conference. The police chief said that the investigation was progressing well, that she wouldn't take any questions, detailed the plans for a memorial service, and then she said that the family wanted to talk about the children. They discussed the personalities of the children (how they differed, etc), how the children got along with cousins, etc, etc.

I personally don't see why there is any public need to know of information related to 4 and 2 year old children of a murder victim. I seems that all the public needs to know is that the children are safe and are being cared for. I can't imagine seeing my in-laws sitting in front of cameras discussing my children.

The 7/17 press conference was similar in nature, but was focused on Nancy.

As far as whether the conferences should have been "disallowed", I guess that's the Cary Police's call. To me, if the family felt that the public needed to know personal information about Nancy and the children, a more appropriate venue would have been the Today Show or Larry King rather than a Cary Police news conference.

JMHO and I don't have a problem with people having the different opinions.

I see this very differently. Had her parents gone on the syndicated shows such as you reference, they would have been open to accusations by Brad and others that they were sensationalizing this tragedy and exploiting those children. In the confines of the Cary PD press room, they were communicating with the community that knew Nancy, with the Cary community and they controlled what was being asked and not being put on the spot by some half asleep codger like Larry King.

momto3kids
08-13-2008, 09:02 PM
Since I brought up the issue about the press conferences, I'll respond. As I said when I originally mentioned it, I didn't expect my opinion on them to be popular here. That's fine.

The general opinion here seems to be that Brad has not been sufficiently "public" since his wife's death. I.e., not at the press conferences and not at public memorials. I was just expressing my opinion that people can also be too public in some cases.

I just went back and listened to the first few minutes of the 7/18 press conference. The police chief said that the investigation was progressing well, that she wouldn't take any questions, detailed the plans for a memorial service, and then she said that the family wanted to talk about the children. They discussed the personalities of the children (how they differed, etc), how the children got along with cousins, etc, etc.

I personally don't see why there is any public need to know of information related to 4 and 2 year old children of a murder victim. I seems that all the public needs to know is that the children are safe and are being cared for. I can't imagine seeing my in-laws sitting in front of cameras discussing my children.

The 7/17 press conference was similar in nature, but was focused on Nancy.

As far as whether the conferences should have been "disallowed", I guess that's the Cary Police's call. To me, if the family felt that the public needed to know personal information about Nancy and the children, a more appropriate venue would have been the Today Show or Larry King rather than a Cary Police news conference.

JMHO and I don't have a problem with people having the different opinions.

I think part of the problem is...
Cary has only had 3or4 murders in 9 yrs. This is not something the CPD have encountered too often, and like anything you have to learn on trial and error if it was good or not to do anything in the manner they did. They will know by public opinion after all is said and done.

As we all know this is unprecedented to where the victims family moved in and took the children with no notice what so ever. The biological parent is alive and not been named a suspect or POI. IMO this in itself was a concern to many of us as to how the girls are doing and see how this happened and for what reasons.

This was their way to say the girls are adjusting and doing well, then to go on national tv and parade them.

ncnative
08-13-2008, 09:06 PM
Raisincharlie said: "... some half asleep codger like Larry King..." :D

LOL

raisincharlie
08-13-2008, 09:06 PM
Raisincharlie said: "... some half asleep codger like Larry King..." :D

LOL

I was being kind :crazy:

EntreNous
08-13-2008, 09:08 PM
I see this very differently. Had her parents gone on the syndicated shows such as you reference, they would have been open to accusations by Brad and others that they were sensationalizing this tragedy and exploiting those children. In the confines of the Cary PD press room, they were communicating with the community that knew Nancy, with the Cary community and they controlled what was being asked and not being put on the spot by some half asleep codger like Larry King.

:spit:

CARYISHOME
08-13-2008, 09:16 PM
I think part of the problem is...
Cary has only had 3or4 murders in 9 yrs. This is not something the CPD have encountered too often, and like anything you have to learn on trial and error if it was good or not to do anything in the manner they did. They will know by public opinion after all is said and done.

As we all know this is unprecedented to where the victims family moved in and took the children with no notice what so ever. The biological parent is alive and not been named a suspect or POI. IMO this in itself was a concern to many of us as to how the girls are doing and see how this happened and for what reasons.

This was their way to say the girls are adjusting and doing well, then to go on national tv and parade them.

Just a comment on the CPD - IMO

Since murder investigations are not that common in Cary, I am hoping the CPD has had lots of opportunity to go to training to prepare for such an event. They certainly have not had much on the job training as a group. Still, the community has high expectations of them and I am sure they are acutely aware of that.

EntreNous
08-13-2008, 09:17 PM
I think part of the problem is...
Cary has only had 3or4 murders in 9 yrs. This is not something the CPD have encountered too often, and like anything you have to learn on trial and error if it was good or not to do anything in the manner they did. They will know by public opinion after all is said and done.

As we all know this is unprecedented to where the victims family moved in and took the children with no notice what so ever. The biological parent is alive and not been named a suspect or POI. IMO this in itself was a concern to many of us as to how the girls are doing and see how this happened and for what reasons.

This was their way to say the girls are adjusting and doing well, then to go on national tv and parade them.

I agree this established them as a grieving family concerned for the babies who were fast becoming the focus of the public and press. I think this was a very nice way of saying, the girls are going back to Canada to be protected from the circus of the investigation and the media, so kindly let us be in peace with them far, far away.

Also, someone stated this some threads back that these kinds of pressers are pretty common in missing persons cases which this started out being.

Deduction
08-13-2008, 09:29 PM
Since I brought up the issue about the press conferences, I'll respond. As I said when I originally mentioned it, I didn't expect my opinion on them to be popular here. That's fine.

The general opinion here seems to be that Brad has not been sufficiently "public" since his wife's death. I.e., not at the press conferences and not at public memorials. I was just expressing my opinion that people can also be too public in some cases.

I just went back and listened to the first few minutes of the 7/18 press conference. The police chief said that the investigation was progressing well, that she wouldn't take any questions, detailed the plans for a memorial service, and then she said that the family wanted to talk about the children. They discussed the personalities of the children (how they differed, etc), how the children got along with cousins, etc, etc.

I personally don't see why there is any public need to know of information related to 4 and 2 year old children of a murder victim. I seems that all the public needs to know is that the children are safe and are being cared for. I can't imagine seeing my in-laws sitting in front of cameras discussing my children.

The 7/17 press conference was similar in nature, but was focused on Nancy.

As far as whether the conferences should have been "disallowed", I guess that's the Cary Police's call. To me, if the family felt that the public needed to know personal information about Nancy and the children, a more appropriate venue would have been the Today Show or Larry King rather than a Cary Police news conference.

JMHO and I don't have a problem with people having the different opinions.


I agree with you completly. Your opinion on this board might not be popular, but I remember on the comments section of the WRAL board that many posters were yelling for the publicity to stop. They thought it was way over the top. Many here have tried and convicted Brad because he did not attend the Memorial services with his children. I am not real certain he could have even if he would have wanted to.
Let us remember the Rentz family had a large number of police officers surround him and take the children from him crying. They did this on a Ex Parte Court Order claiming the children were in danger if they were in his care. Even now he can not visit the children without supervised visitation. Let's just suppose he did show up at the Memorial service. It would not have surprised me in the least if the Rentz would had him arrested for being a threat to the children or whatever charge they might have sneaked past the judge earlier that day. At the very best, everone could read the tension in the air between the Rentz and Brad. I very much respect that he stepped back and allowed her the decency of having a Memorial service without all that tension in the air. Until you have grieved alone or in secret I wouldn't expect you to understand.

If Brad is guilty, there is no reason for Brad to go to any of the services, and if he is innocent, IMO, he certainly doesn't owe it to Nancy's family to go. If he is innocent his first duty right now is to get his children back. IMO.

Roy23
08-13-2008, 09:32 PM
Roy,

I'm curious why you are thinking EVERYTHING is hearsey ?

Do you think Chief Bazemore was not telling the truth when she said there were no reported sightings of Nancy in the press conference on the evening of the 14th ?


I believe he said that but she is not leaning in any direction in saying that. She has said that Nancy was murdered, Brad is cooperating and it is not an isolated event. In any case, she has not tipped her hand at all. The fact that nobody saw Nancy could mean a whole lot but the Chief has not led us to believe anything as far as I can tell.

You make a good point but I don't live there. In almost all cases, the police release a heck of a lot more than they are doing here. That is why Brad's attorneys are getting whatever they can. I just think if this was simple they would have a POI. Any sign of struggle in the home and Brad is in jail.

ncnative
08-13-2008, 09:34 PM
Does anyone remember when a pregnant Cary woman was murdered by her husband when he pushed her over a bridge onto a Cary greenway? I don't even remember the decade it happened in, but I'm thinking the 1990's. There's a Cary murder that I bet has gone forgotten.

raisincharlie
08-13-2008, 09:35 PM
I believe he said that but she is not leaning in any direction in saying that. She has said that Nancy was murdered, Brad is cooperating and it is not an isolated event. In any case, she has not tipped her hand at all. The fact that nobody saw Nancy could mean a whole lot but the Chief has not led us to believe anything as far as I can tell.

You make a good point but I don't live there. In almost all cases, the police release a heck of a lot more than they are doing here. That is why Brad's attorneys are getting whatever they can. I just think if this was simple they would have a POI. Any sign of struggle in the home and Brad is in jail.

Ok - I got it. Just checking - thanks :)

CARYISHOME
08-13-2008, 09:38 PM
I agree with you completly. Your opinion on this board might not be popular, but I remember on the comments section of the WRAL board that many posters were yelling for the publicity to stop. They thought it was way over the top. Many here have tried and convicted Brad because he did not attend the Memorial services with his children. I am not real certain he could have even if he would have wanted to. let us remember the Rentz family had the a large number of police officer surround him and take the children from him crying. They did this on a Ex Parte Cort Order claiming the children were in danger if they were in his care. Even now he can not visit the children without supervised visitation. Let's just suppose he did show up at the Memorial service. It would not have surprised me in the least if the Rentz would had him arrested for being a threat to the children or whatever charge they might have sneaked past the judge earlier that day.

If Brad is guilty, there is no reason for brad to go to any of the services, and if he is innocent, IMO, he certainly doesn't owe it to Nancy's family to go. If he is innocent his first duty right now is to get his children back. IMO.

Regarding public appearances - Brad seemed to be in a da*ned if you do da*ned if you don't type of situation. Given that, I have a hard time judging him negatively for not attending the various events. He may have felt the best thing to do for the children was to just lay low. Besides, these public events were for the most part orchestrated by NC's parents.

mahmoo
08-13-2008, 09:38 PM
Things are a bit boring here. I wish that some of our Canadian folks who possibly knew Brad's mom and dad would speak up. I'm always interested in the family dynamics behind someone who exhibits personality disorders, or shall we say emotional problems. The ex-girlfriend and others have spoken out from his past.

Love to hear from Medicine Hat in Canada if anyone actually knows BC's mom. Even better, old elementary through high school teachers he had? Did he do team sports, etc.? A common thread would arise in his personality perhaps. WHETHER he did the crime or not.

hi ncnative :seeya:

I wish we would hear from relatives, friends......anyone close to this case....I know it's asking for too much but.....I still wish it anyway.

At least we do have many locals posting here and I really like that......ya'll have been able to give us a better idea of what the scenario is like there and it helps.

jumpstreet
08-13-2008, 09:38 PM
Tonight my husband brought up a good point that I had not thought of....

By pushing for the psychiatric test as NC's family is, if it proves BC does have some psychological issues, then IMO K&B are going to jump all over it in their defense for BC if he gets charged with murder. Should we be handing them this on a silver platter?

It's a good point. Here's my thought on it: The top priority in the moment for NC's family is permanent custody of the children. They may have their suspicions of who the perpetrator is, or they may know for sure it is (or isn't) BC. [For example, they may already know it falls in the Theory B (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2465948&postcount=171) (someone besides BC that knows NC did it) category for example.

Nevertheless, they are 100% of the opinion (regardless of who did it), that what's best for the kids is for them to have custody (they are also convinced, as are most NC's friends who submitted affidavits, that this is what Nancy would want).

So, in the moment, that's their #1 priority (custody), with less regard for any impacts on the criminal investigation.

If they already (somehow) know that BC didn't do it (but of course aren't at liberty to say that per advice from LE), yet still don't want him to have the children, then there's even less (zero) conflict between the custody battle, and the criminal investigation anyway.

If BC did do it, and somehow, someway the (potentially ordered) psyche evaluation helps with a (however many years from now) defense, then NC's family may exchange that in return for solidifying their custody case (in the near-term).

CARYISHOME
08-13-2008, 09:42 PM
Does anyone remember when a pregnant Cary woman was murdered by her husband when he pushed her over a bridge onto a Cary greenway? I don't even remember the decade it happened in, but I'm thinking the 1990's. There's a Cary murder that I bet has gone forgotten.

OMG! Yes, I remember! I live very close to there and drive over that bridge several times a day. I walk down that greenway sometimes, too.

Her husband was eventually convicted.

wirehair
08-13-2008, 09:44 PM
I think he was convicted.

Does anyone remember when a pregnant Cary woman was murdered by her husband when he pushed her over a bridge onto a Cary greenway? I don't even remember the decade it happened in, but I'm thinking the 1990's. There's a Cary murder that I bet has gone forgotten.

mahmoo
08-13-2008, 09:44 PM
If Brad is guilty, there is no reason for Brad to go to any of the services, and if he is innocent, IMO, he certainly doesn't owe it to Nancy's family to go. If he is innocent his first duty right now is to get his children back. IMO.

Maybe he didn't owe "it" to Nancy's family but, I think he d-mn-d sure owed it to Nancy, their 2 daughters and himself !!! If he was innocent.......his children wouldn't be in Canada right now.

mahmoo
08-13-2008, 09:53 PM
some half asleep codger like Larry King.

He's sweet though..........


http://i34.tinypic.com/xas4uv.jpg

raisincharlie
08-13-2008, 10:01 PM
He's sweet though..........


http://i34.tinypic.com/xas4uv.jpg

OMG :floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

EntreNous
08-13-2008, 10:03 PM
I agree with you completly. Your opinion on this board might not be popular, but I remember on the comments section of the WRAL board that many posters were yelling for the publicity to stop. They thought it was way over the top. Many here have tried and convicted Brad because he did not attend the Memorial services with his children. I am not real certain he could have even if he would have wanted to.
Let us remember the Rentz family had a large number of police officers surround him and take the children from him crying. They did this on a Ex Parte Court Order claiming the children were in danger if they were in his care. Even now he can not visit the children without supervised visitation. Let's just suppose he did show up at the Memorial service. It would not have surprised me in the least if the Rentz would had him arrested for being a threat to the children or whatever charge they might have sneaked past the judge earlier that day. At the very best, everone could read the tension in the air between the Rentz and Brad. I very much respect that he stepped back and allowed her the decency of having a Memorial service without all that tension in the air. Until you have grieved alone or in secret I wouldn't expect you to understand.

If Brad is guilty, there is no reason for Brad to go to any of the services, and if he is innocent, IMO, he certainly doesn't owe it to Nancy's family to go. If he is innocent his first duty right now is to get his children back. IMO.
Since when did the Rentz family tell the CPD how to retrieve the girls? They had a large number of police officers surround him and take the children from him crying? You really think the Rentz's orchestrated the manner in which the CPD did that? And you believe they'd sneak an arrest past the judge? Really? Wow, they must be some seriously sinister people in your estimation. And apparently the CPD is up for hire by the Rentz family and the judge is in what, a coma?

As to the third highlighted comment, Brad Cooper isn't grieving alone. He's grieving with his parents, his brother, Scott Heider and his other friends who filed affidavits on his behalf. He's not alone. What would make you think he is?

I forgot something, any and all secret grieving he does is his clear and conscious choice.

jumpstreet
08-13-2008, 10:04 PM
I just think if this was simple they would have a POI. Any sign of struggle in the home and Brad is in jail.

Make no mistake, they have at least one POI. If nothing else, as evidenced by the warrant of the workplace. I assert they don't bother to search one's office (nor get judge to issue a warrant for same) without being [I]very interested in you, or something about you.

The key is they (presumably intentionally) haven't named a POI (as that requires them to divulge other pieces of information to the defense earlier than LE would prefer to). It may be frustrating to the public, and may appear as if there's little progress, but it doesn't mean that's reality.

It's semantics, and strategic: If LE thinks that publicly naming someone a POI will help them get to an arrest sooner (perhaps force someone to "slip up", get "nervous", or confess), then they'll name a POI/suspect.

If LE doesn't think naming a POI/suspect will help them get to an arrest sooner, then there's no incentive to name one. [ At least not in the short term, and even in the long term, it just becomes a PR problem ("LE's been working on this case for XX and they still don't have any leads/suspects!"), but the PR is still secondary to their desire to achieve justice (and rightly so IMO) ]

In this specific case, it seems fairly likely that a suspect/POI will be named/made-known at the same time they're being placed under arrest. Even then, they may not do it explicitly. [ Though, I'll also assert it can be inferred when being read your Miranda rights, that LE has a developed a profound interest in you :) ]

LE has POI(s), they just haven't (and likely) won't name them (does not imply a lack of progress [let's hope] :) ).

cygnusx1
08-13-2008, 10:06 PM
Does anyone remember when a pregnant Cary woman was murdered by her husband when he pushed her over a bridge onto a Cary greenway? I don't even remember the decade it happened in, but I'm thinking the 1990's. There's a Cary murder that I bet has gone forgotten.

Yep. Happened about a mile from my previous home.

http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/165670/
http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/165915/

Hey, he is Canadian and was studying for an MBA too!

mahmoo
08-13-2008, 10:07 PM
omg :floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

bad moo moo :slap:

Roy23
08-13-2008, 10:19 PM
Make no mistake, they have at least one POI. If nothing else, as evidenced by the warrant of the workplace. I assert they don't bother to search one's office (nor get judge to issue a warrant for same) without being [I]very interested in you, or something about you.

The key is they (presumably intentionally) haven't named a POI (as that requires them to divulge other pieces of information to the defense earlier than LE would prefer to). It may be frustrating to the public, and may appear as if there's little progress, but it doesn't mean that's reality.

It's semantics, and strategic: If LE thinks that publicly naming someone a POI will help them get to an arrest sooner (perhaps force someone to "slip up", get "nervous", or confess), then they'll name a POI/suspect.

If LE doesn't think naming a POI/suspect will help them get to an arrest sooner, then there's no incentive to name one. [ At least not in the short term, and even in the long term, it just becomes a PR problem ("LE's been working on this case for XX and they still don't have any leads/suspects!"), but the PR is still secondary to their desire to achieve justice (and rightly so IMO) ]

In this specific case, it seems fairly likely that a suspect/POI will be named/made-known at the same time they're being placed under arrest. Even then, they may not do it explicitly. [ Though, I'll also assert it can be inferred when being read your Miranda rights, that LE has a developed a profound interest in you :) ]

LE has POI(s), they just haven't (and likely) won't name them (does not imply a lack of progress [let's hope] :) ).


I totally understand what you are saying BUT this will be different than any case than I can ever think of. Sure they looked hard at her husband and only idiots would not. The fact is that if he just went nuts and killed her and left evidence everywhere, he would be in jail by now. He is not and has not been named as anything but cooperative even with all of the search warrants. I could name numerous reason that they would search
Brad's computer at work.

cygnusx1
08-13-2008, 10:27 PM
[snip]
The key is they (presumably intentionally) haven't named a POI (as that requires them to divulge other pieces of information to the defense earlier than LE would prefer to). It may be frustrating to the public, and may appear as if there's little progress, but it doesn't mean that's reality.

It's semantics, and strategic: If LE thinks that publicly naming someone a POI will help them get to an arrest sooner (perhaps force someone to "slip up", get "nervous", or confess), then they'll name a POI/suspect.

If LE doesn't think naming a POI/suspect will help them get to an arrest sooner, then there's no incentive to name one.

[snip]

LE has POI(s), they just haven't (and likely) won't name them (does not imply a lack of progress [let's hope] :) ).

Doesn't LE risk their prime suspect fleeing if they don't name them as a POI or suspect?

mahmoo
08-13-2008, 10:32 PM
Make no mistake, they have at least one POI. If nothing else, as evidenced by the warrant of the workplace. I assert they don't bother to search one's office (nor get judge to issue a warrant for same) without being [I]very interested in you, or something about you.

The key is they (presumably intentionally) haven't named a POI (as that requires them to divulge other pieces of information to the defense earlier than LE would prefer to). It may be frustrating to the public, and may appear as if there's little progress, but it doesn't mean that's reality.

It's semantics, and strategic: If LE thinks that publicly naming someone a POI will help them get to an arrest sooner (perhaps force someone to "slip up", get "nervous", or confess), then they'll name a POI/suspect.

If LE doesn't think naming a POI/suspect will help them get to an arrest sooner, then there's no incentive to name one. [ At least not in the short term, and even in the long term, it just becomes a PR problem ("LE's been working on this case for XX and they still don't have any leads/suspects!"), but the PR is still secondary to their desire to achieve justice (and rightly so IMO) ]

In this specific case, it seems fairly likely that a suspect/POI will be named/made-known at the same time they're being placed under arrest. Even then, they may not do it explicitly. [ Though, I'll also assert it can be inferred when being read your Miranda rights, that LE has a developed a profound interest in you :) ]

LE has POI(s), they just haven't (and likely) won't name them (does not imply a lack of progress [let's hope] :) ).


Thank ya Jesus.............the voice of reason here :clap: and I love the way you put it in "basic" terms. Can we "sticky" this post.......LOL.

raisincharlie
08-13-2008, 10:34 PM
I totally understand what you are saying BUT this will be different than any case than I can ever think of. Sure they looked hard at her husband and only idiots would not. The fact is that if he just went nuts and killed her and left evidence everywhere, he would be in jail by now. He is not and has not been named as anything but cooperative even with all of the search warrants. I could name numerous reason that they would search
Brad's computer at work.

How cooperative is he ? Why did LE have to have a warrant to take a DNA sample from him at 3am on the 16th ?

Roy I just don't buy the line if he left evidence everywhere he would be in jail. Collecting that evidence, controlling it and having it analyzed all take time. The SBI lab does not prioritize samples to the point of having results yesterday - in fact their turn around time is reported to be 60 days. While LE may see evidence everywhere - until the reality of it is determined through testing and following all records and leads- LE would be incredibly foolish to arrest someone without these results. No DA is going to go for an arrest warrant from the GJ until they have a darn good idea they can prove the case - what LE may simply see is simply not good enough.

Roy23
08-13-2008, 10:43 PM
RC,

LE has stated that Brad has been fully cooperative. Brad did not deny DNA samples. They just got a warrant for it anyway. Name a case that has been even remotely like this where you have TONS of circumstancial evidence that shows the husband despises his wife, has been totally cooperative, they recovered a body close to the house, and is not a POI at this point of the investigation.

raisincharlie
08-13-2008, 10:53 PM
RC,

LE has stated that Brad has been fully cooperative. Brad did not deny DNA samples. They just got a warrant for it anyway. Name a case that has been even remotely like this where you have TONS of circumstancial evidence that shows the husband despises his wife, has been totally cooperative, they recovered a body close to the house, and is not a POI at this point of the investigation.

Cooperative - not fully cooperative. Tons of circumstantial evidence - you told me earlier it is all hearsey - EVERYTHING was hearsey even the PD Chief reporting that there had been no reported sightings of Nancy.

He could not deny the DNA sample when being served a warrant for the collection of it - otherwise he would indeed be in jail, for contempt. How do you know he or his lawyer didn't deny to give the sample and tell LE to get a warrant for it, if I may ask ?

These kinds of cases are a dime a dozen anymore - unfortunately. Some even include murder victims inside their own home much less dumped. Several are being discussed on this website.

momto3kids
08-13-2008, 11:09 PM
If Brad is guilty, there is no reason for Brad to go to any of the services, and if he is innocent, IMO, he certainly doesn't owe it to Nancy's family to go. If he is innocent his first duty right now is to get his children back. IMO.

No, but he owed it to Nancy the woman he claims to have loved, and wanted the marriage to work with.

Reread BC's affidavit 194 & 195. He spent the morning with the girls before the service on Saturday and told Bella what happened to her mom just before the service.

If BC was anything of a man and not a mouse, he would have sucked it up for those girls he claims he loves and gotten thru it with them. What is a parent for? To be there in time of need. HE WASN'T THERE when they needed him!:mad:

How HORRIBLE to tell you children mommy is dead then walk away from them.
It is absolutely disgusting IMO

Roy23
08-13-2008, 11:09 PM
Cooperative - not fully cooperative. Tons of circumstantial evidence - you told me earlier it is all hearsey - EVERYTHING was hearsey even the PD Chief reporting that there had been no reported sightings of Nancy.

He could not deny the DNA sample when being served a warrant for the collection of it - otherwise he would indeed be in jail, for contempt. How do you know he or his lawyer didn't deny to give the sample and tell LE to get a warrant for it, if I may ask ?

These kinds of cases are a dime a dozen anymore - unfortunately. Some even include murder victims inside their own home much less dumped. Several are being discussed on this website.


Had he denied a DNA sample he would have been labled incooperative. When LE is forced to get search warrants they do not label a suspect or anyone as cooperative. You should know this. It is time for you to accept that this is not as simple of a case as you think. Right now Brad Cooper is free to leave the country and do whatever he wants. I don't doubt that he might be a killer but this case has twists and turns that we have no idea of. Scott Peterson was a POI almost immediately and without a body. He was shadowed. Brad is a cooperative and LE is doing everything they can to try and name him a POI or suspect. Think about how DNA could be involved in this case. They are obviously waiting on it. If this is a DNA case, there was a struggle. They obviously see very little at minimum sign of a stuggle in that house. Touch DNA maybe? Or possibly a rape/murder.

You have to understand that LE has labeled BC as very cooperative. Just read the interviews. Name a case like this. Casey Anthony? Michelle Young? Scott Peterson? There is not one that I know of.

fran
08-13-2008, 11:11 PM
FWIW, Laci Peterson disappeared on Xmas Eve and by March LE had submitted their case to the DA who wanted them to hold off and continue to search for the body.

Laci and Conner washed ashore and five days later identified and Scott Peterson was arrested on April 18th.

Long time coming when LE KNEW they had their man, just not quite enough evidence, ie the body.

Nancy Cooper has been autopsied prior to all of the 'evidence' being tested. It's just a matter of time before the results will be in.

JMHO
fran

Roy23
08-13-2008, 11:14 PM
FWIW, Laci Peterson disappeared on Xmas Eve and by March LE had submitted their case to the DA who wanted them to hold off and continue to search for the body.

Laci and Conner washed ashore and five days later identified and Scott Peterson was arrested on April 18th.

Long time coming when LE KNEW they had their man, just not quite enough evidence, ie the body.

Nancy Cooper has been autopsied prior to all of the 'evidence' being tested. It's just a matter of time before the results will be in.

JMHO
fran


Scott Peterson was a POI that LE followed every where he went. LE was his shadow and they released evidence of foul play. He was a suspect and POI unlike here. It doesn't compare.

momto3kids
08-13-2008, 11:15 PM
So an update....BC has paid his electric bill as of today. He has lights on, actually all the downstairs are on, even the porch light. You would think company is coming. The blind that was partially opened on the staircase...the one with the ADT sign in it....CLOSED tight.

Sorry this can't be more exciting to report, but I am sure it will be soon, I hope.

ncnative
08-13-2008, 11:18 PM
Larry's mom is looking good. Heh.

ncnative
08-13-2008, 11:19 PM
:bang:Uh, woops. I'm on the wrong board...

No wait. I'm in the right place. Just on page 2...I'm going to go check in at the local "home" and ask for some of that there Alzheimers medication.

fran
08-13-2008, 11:20 PM
Scott Peterson was a POI that LE followed every where he went. LE was his shadow and they released evidence of foul play. He was a suspect and POI unlike here. It doesn't compare.

Sorry, he wasn't a POI.

MPD said 'Scott has not been cleared' or something like that. They NEVER said he was a 'suspect' or POI.

You're right, they did follow him. We watched that case very closely here at Websleuths and CourtTV board and we NEVER knew LE was tailing him, they were taping him, nothing. LOTS of info came out that we knew NOTHING about.

This case DOES compare quite well to the Laci Peterson investigation. Similar, :eek:very similar, IMHO.

JMHO
fran

fran
08-13-2008, 11:24 PM
So an update....BC has paid his electric bill as of today. He has lights on, actually all the downstairs are on, even the porch light. You would think company is coming. The blind that was partially opened on the staircase...the one with the ADT sign in it....CLOSED tight.

Sorry this can't be more exciting to report, but I am sure it will be soon, I hope.

Wonder if he's packing up?:confused:

Could be cleaning house and doing the wash!:eek:

Maybe he's not even home, just wants us to think he's home. ;)

JMHO
fran


PS....orrrrrrr, maybe he's sitting behind the shuttered windows reading Websleuths! OH, hi Brad! :)

Oh, yeah! PPS........SCOTT PETERSON was cooperative too! Until the day he was arrested. Boy, was he surprised! :woohoo:

maconrich
08-13-2008, 11:25 PM
Had he denied a DNA sample he would have been labled incooperative. When LE is forced to get search warrants they do not label a suspect or anyone as cooperative. You should know this. It is time for you to accept that this is not as simple of a case as you think. Right now Brad Cooper is free to leave the country and do whatever he wants. I don't doubt that he might be a killer but this case has twists and turns that we have no idea of. Scott Peterson was a POI almost immediately and without a body. He was shadowed. Brad is a cooperative and LE is doing everything they can to try and name him a POI or suspect. Think about how DNA could be involved in this case. They are obviously waiting on it. If this is a DNA case, there was a struggle. They obviously see very little at minimum sign of a stuggle in that house. Touch DNA maybe? Or possibly a rape/murder.

You have to understand that LE has labeled BC as very cooperative. Just read the interviews. Name a case like this. Casey Anthony? Michelle Young? Scott Peterson? There is not one that I know of.

I'm sure you have a link that proves exactly how LE thinks BC has been cleared of all/any suspicion? That he's not being tailed? That there was or wasn't a struggle in the house? Anything at all on DNA? And that he's free to leave the country at will?

raisincharlie
08-13-2008, 11:25 PM
Had he denied a DNA sample he would have been labled incooperative. When LE is forced to get search warrants they do not label a suspect or anyone as cooperative. You should know this. It is time for you to accept that this is not as simple of a case as you think. Right now Brad Cooper is free to leave the country and do whatever he wants. I don't doubt that he might be a killer but this case has twists and turns that we have no idea of. Scott Peterson was a POI almost immediately and without a body. He was shadowed. Brad is a cooperative and LE is doing everything they can to try and name him a POI or suspect. Think about how DNA could be involved in this case. They are obviously waiting on it. If this is a DNA case, there was a struggle. They obviously see very little at minimum sign of a stuggle in that house. Touch DNA maybe? Or possibly a rape/murder.

You have to understand that LE has labeled BC as very cooperative. Just read the interviews. Name a case like this. Casey Anthony? Michelle Young? Scott Peterson? There is not one that I know of.

I understand Roy - trust me I understand cop speak very well. I also understand police procedure very well. I also understand the implications of search warrants and of DNA very well.

I do not however understand how you can claim LE saw very little sign of a struggle at the house or that this case has all these twists and turns. I do not see how you can claim that at all after watching the videos of LE removing bag after bag of evidence from that house.

Brad may be free to do as he pleases, but I seriuously doubt LE is going to allow him to leave the country - if he is cooperating, he has turned his passport over to prove it. LE has never said Brad has been anything other than cooperative - not very cooperative, not totally not extremely - just cooperative. No doubt he gave them his story, that is cooperating.

FWIW - Touch DNA is a load of garbage.

Fairy1
08-13-2008, 11:28 PM
Sorry, he wasn't a POI.

MPD said 'Scott has not been cleared' or something like that. They NEVER said he was a 'suspect' or POI.

You're right, they did follow him. We watched that case very closely here at Websleuths and CourtTV board and we NEVER knew LE was tailing him, they were taping him, nothing. LOTS of info came out that we knew NOTHING about.

This case DOES compare quite well to the Laci Peterson investigation. Similar, :eek:very similar, IMHO.

JMHO
fran

Honestly, we don't know if LE is tailing BC. I'm curious, is he there in that house ALONE?

momto3kids
08-13-2008, 11:30 PM
Wonder if he's packing up?:confused:

Could be cleaning house and doing the wash!:eek:

Maybe he's not even home, just wants us to think he's home. ;)

JMHO
fran


PS....orrrrrrr, maybe he's sitting behind the shuttered windows reading Websleuths! OH, hi Brad! :)

Fran...all I hope is his mommy is not in there taking charge and doing away with NC's things. After reading her and NC were not on good terms at all.

It will be a sad day if NC's parents can't get some of NC cherished items to take back to Canada, ie, yearbooks, baby pictures, family jewelry, what ever it may be. Why will it not surprise me to hear this might be occuring? I guess because BC would be in control again if he does this, to hurt the Rentz's for what they did with his girls?

fran
08-13-2008, 11:32 PM
Honestly, we don't know if LE is tailing BC. I'm curious, is he there in that house ALONE?

I NEVER said they were tailing BC. It was said Scott Peterson was a POI when LE was tailing him. I'm just correcting this for the record. Scott Peterson was NEVER named a POI or suspect.

He was JUST arrested! then tried. :rolleyes:

I have no idea if he's in the house alone. He's using a lot of electricity for just one person IF he's alone though!

JMHO
fran

fran
08-13-2008, 11:38 PM
Fran...all I hope is his mommy is not in there taking charge and doing away with NC's things. After reading her and NC were not on good terms at all.

It will be a sad day if NC's parents can't get some of NC cherished items to take back to Canada, ie, yearbooks, baby pictures, family jewelry, what ever it may be. Why will it not surprise me to hear this might be occuring? I guess because BC would be in control again if he does this, to hurt the Rentz's for what they did with his girls?

Well, they are a lot like the P's and they seemed to do whatever they could to hurt the Rochas. Even sent their little lawyer over to Laci's house and tried to have them arrested for taking their own daughter's things.

Getting back to the Coopers, yes, it would be sad if Nancy's parents couldn't get her cherished items, to save for the children. IF the MIL is anything like Nancy made her out to be, she sounds........nevermind.;)

You're right, it would be too sad. :(

JMHO
fran

EntreNous
08-13-2008, 11:43 PM
FWIW, Laci Peterson disappeared on Xmas Eve and by March LE had submitted their case to the DA who wanted them to hold off and continue to search for the body.

Laci and Conner washed ashore and five days later identified and Scott Peterson was arrested on April 18th.

Long time coming when LE KNEW they had their man, just not quite enough evidence, ie the body.

Nancy Cooper has been autopsied prior to all of the 'evidence' being tested. It's just a matter of time before the results will be in.

JMHO
fran
And Fran, IIRC they wanted to wait to make the arrest on Peterson until the DNA on the bodies came back but with Scott bleaching his hair and his newly grown goatee, and his weird behavior after the bodies washed ashore they made the arrest in anticipation of him leaving the country. So even in that case, they wanted to wait for the DNA but couldn't.

Anderson
08-13-2008, 11:50 PM
No, but he owed it to Nancy the woman he claims to have loved, and wanted the marriage to work with.

Reread BC's affidavit 194 & 195. He spent the morning with the girls before the service on Saturday and told Bella what happened to her mom just before the service.

If BC was anything of a man and not a mouse, he would have sucked it up for those girls he claims he loves and gotten thru it with them. What is a parent for? To be there in time of need. HE WASN'T THERE when they needed him!:mad:

How HORRIBLE to tell you children mommy is dead then walk away from them.
It is absolutely disgusting IMO

Well put.:clap:

fran
08-13-2008, 11:56 PM
And Fran, IIRC they wanted to wait to make the arrest on Peterson until the DNA on the bodies came back but with Scott bleaching his hair and his newly grown goatee, and his weird behavior after the bodies washed ashore they made the arrest in anticipation of him leaving the country. So even in that case, they wanted to wait for the DNA but couldn't.

Actually, they told EVERYONE it would take a month for the DNA to come back. But what they didn't say was they already had 1/2 of it done from previously. ie Scott's etc.

They finished in just a few days. LOTS of personnel burned the midnight oil to get that DNA done ASAP! Federal and State agencies participated in that analysis, I believe working 24 hours a day.

That's why old SP was soooo sooo surprised when they stopped and arrested him!:eek:

He thought he had a few more days and he didn't.

Wonder if Brad is wondering if the SAME thing will happen to him?:waitasec:

Time will tell, huh :wave:Brad! ;)

JMHO
fran

Fairy1
08-13-2008, 11:58 PM
I NEVER said they were tailing BC. It was said Scott Peterson was a POI when LE was tailing him. I'm just correcting this for the record. Scott Peterson was NEVER named a POI or suspect.

He was JUST arrested! then tried. :rolleyes:

I have no idea if he's in the house alone. He's using a lot of electricity for just one person IF he's alone though!

JMHO
fran

Jeez - settle down, Fran! My post was not directed at you. I said WE DON'T KNOW if LE is tailing Brad. I understand the parallels here. And I know you would have no idea if BC is there alone. I'm curious because, under the circumstances, I know my family (if they believed in me) would be by my side until I was in the clear. That's just MO. :blowkiss:

raisincharlie
08-14-2008, 12:01 AM
Well put.:clap:

Impossible to argue with those words isn't it ? Very well put indeed.

fran
08-14-2008, 12:03 AM
Jeez - settle down, Fran! My post was not directed at you. I said WE DON'T KNOW if LE is tailing Brad. I understand the parallels here. And I know you would have no idea if BC is there alone. I'm curious because, under the circumstances, I know my family (if they believed in me) would be by my side until I was in the clear. That's just MO. :blowkiss:

ok then.:heart:

LOL, as long as you know I neva said that he was being followed, all's good.

:angel2:
fran

jumpstreet
08-14-2008, 12:06 AM
Doesn't LE risk their prime suspect fleeing if they don't name them as a POI or suspect?

It's a reasonable question. In general, I'm not sure how much that risk changes though even if they do name a POI or suspect. Unless you've been charged with a crime, presumably, you're free to roam? [ Sure LE can ask/request you to "hang tight", (and they may very well have in this case, with BC responding in kind) but unless they arrest you, I don't think it can be enforced (even if they name you as a suspect/POI) ]

I think one of the reasons an arrest can come before an indictment is in cases where flight-risk is considered significant (with another driver being considered a risk to others/society).

[ and even then, LE would certainly want to have significant enough evidence to make that arrest hold through to indictment and not just be temporary ]

So, as I understand it, even if you're a suspect/POI/none-of-the-above, you're free to go/do/be as you please (which makes sense).

Not to say LE isn't keep an eye on you in all of these cases, and hopefully a close eye (in the Laurean case (in NC) he was surely a POI (even if not named), and no doubt they were keeping an eye on him, but he managed get to Mexico before ultimately being tracked down).

Certainly if you're an (unnamed) POI, and you go on the lam, I don't think it helps the "optics". :)

momto3kids
08-14-2008, 12:08 AM
Well put.:clap:
Thank You Anderson. The more I hear of poor Brad and how he couldn't handle the service and the attention...BULL!

IMO he brought this on himself and no one else did it to him. If he thinks the media is in his face now, he has no idea what it is going to be like when they come to take him to :behindbar

Those poor children...if he had a thread of decency in his body he would have put those girls feelings 1st and foremost putting his feelings 2nd. That's what parents do!! He should have sucked it up, gone to the service to show them it is OK to be sad.

How, just how can anyone tell a child your mom is ~dead~ and walk away. :mad:

His day is coming and not soon enough IMO

Fairy1
08-14-2008, 12:09 AM
ok then.:heart:

LOL, as long as you know I neva said that he was being followed, all's good.

:angel2:
fran


I know you never said that! I was just speculating. If I had to guess, I would say NC was murdered somewhere in or around her own home. We ALL know where she was found. There is no reason really for the killer to return to the scene of the crime. With respect to Brad being that house ALONE, I think it's odd (and quite telling) if there is no one there to support him.....:blowkiss:

raisincharlie
08-14-2008, 12:11 AM
I know you never said that! I was just speculating. If I had to guess, I would say NC was murdered somewhere in or around her own home. We ALL know where she was found. There is no reason really for the killer to return to the scene of the crime. With respect to Brad being that house ALONE, I think it's odd (and quite telling) if there is no one there to support him.....:blowkiss:

Last I heard, his Mum was there, but that was last week - don't know if she still is or not.

momto3kids
08-14-2008, 12:15 AM
Last I heard, his Mum was there, but that was last week - don't know if she still is or not.

I don't know either, but someone appears to be scared of the dark with all the lights on.:eye::eye:

raisincharlie
08-14-2008, 12:18 AM
I don't know either, but someone appears to be scared of the dark with all the lights on.:eye::eye:


Maybe the place is haunted by a ghost seeking justice - or there's a whole lot of painting going on - house needs to be on the market soon.

jilly
08-14-2008, 12:19 AM
Sorry, he wasn't a POI.

MPD said 'Scott has not been cleared' or something like that. They NEVER said he was a 'suspect' or POI.

fran

That's right Fran - I believe they said he hadn't been ruled out as a suspect.
Seems to me I read or heard someone from LE recently say that they don't use POI, that POI was a media term. Can't remember exactly.

Fairy1
08-14-2008, 12:21 AM
It's a reasonable question. In general, I'm not sure how much that risk changes though even if they do name a POI or suspect. Unless you've been charged with a crime, presumably, you're free to roam? [ Sure LE can ask/request you to "hang tight", (and they may very well have in this case, with BC responding in kind) but unless they arrest you, I don't think it can be enforced (even if they name you as a suspect/POI) ]

I think one of the reasons an arrest can come before an indictment is in cases where flight-risk is considered significant (with another driver being considered a risk to others/society).

[ and even then, LE would certainly want to have significant enough evidence to make that arrest hold through to indictment and not just be temporary ]

So, as I understand it, even if you're a suspect/POI/none-of-the-above, you're free to go/do/be as you please (which makes sense).

Not to say LE isn't keep an eye on you in all of these cases, and hopefully a close eye (in the Laurean case (in NC) he was surely a POI (even if not named), and no doubt they were keeping an eye on him, but he managed get to Mexico before ultimately being tracked down).

Certainly if you're an (unnamed) POI, and you go on the lam, I don't think it helps the "optics". :)

I wonder if his status as a Canadian on a work visa has something to do with this? It's not your average "not named as a POI" POI. Perhaps due to his status, he's not free to come and go as he pleases?

jumpstreet
08-14-2008, 12:24 AM
I totally understand what you are saying BUT this will be different than any case than I can ever think of.

Regarding why this case is different from others (ie, so much circumstantial, and not even naming one POI), I think it's a fair question.

Agree, it seems there's a whole lot more examples of cases where with even (seemingly) less CE, POI/suspects are named. Maybe it's case-by-case like I said though: IF LE thinks naming you may 'force your hand', or force others around you to make a move, then it's done. If not, then they keep it close to the vest.

LE does have the PR aspect of it, and as mentioned, that can be a factor (though presumably secondary to getting justice).

Here's a thought: LE has made the statement that it isn't a random crime, and they're making great progress. These are seemingly is in contradiction with not naming any suspects or POIs.

The thing is, in this Cary neighborhood, given the circumstances, time-of-day, etc, it is fairly easy for most folks to reasonably accept that it really isn't likely to be a random crime (sure, it's possible, but not likely). Therefore, LE can "get away with" making these seemingly contradictory statements (for now), and not risk (overwhelming) fear of public outcry/panic.

Certainly, if it was in a different neighborhood perhaps, and/or different circumstances, and/or if there were suddenly a string of similar crimes like this in the same vicinity, then LE would have a much tougher PR situation on their hand to continue making the statements ("no named suspects/POIs", "not random", "making great progress")

What makes this one unique is the circumstances are such that LE can (for now) "get away" with making these statements (thus far) without a massive public outcry/panic, thereby allowing them to keepthe cards closer to the vest (for the time being).

Is that plausible?

Fairy1
08-14-2008, 12:25 AM
Maybe the place by a ghost seeking justice - or there's a whole lot of painting going on - house needs to be on the market soon.


:clap::clap::clap::eek::clap::clap::clap:

jilly
08-14-2008, 12:25 AM
No, but he owed it to Nancy the woman he claims to have loved, and wanted the marriage to work with.

Reread BC's affidavit 194 & 195. He spent the morning with the girls before the service on Saturday and told Bella what happened to her mom just before the service.

If BC was anything of a man and not a mouse, he would have sucked it up for those girls he claims he loves and gotten thru it with them. What is a parent for? To be there in time of need. HE WASN'T THERE when they needed him!:mad:

How HORRIBLE to tell you children mommy is dead then walk away from them.
It is absolutely disgusting IMO

Post of the Day Mom!:clap::clap:

raisincharlie
08-14-2008, 12:27 AM
:clap::clap::clap::eek::clap::clap::clap:

Totally messed that up didn't I - haunted by - but I see you filled in the blank. :clap::clap:


It is getting late...:crazy:

Fairy1
08-14-2008, 12:33 AM
Totally messed that up didn't I - haunted by - but I see you filled in the blank. :clap::clap:


It is getting late...:crazy:

I believe it was you who, earlier today, asked everyone to post their "red flags" in this case. Here are mine:

Marriage appears to be completely deteriorated and even hostile.

LE stated -IMMEDIATELY - that they believe this was an isolated incident and NOT a random act of violence.

That's all. Until the autopsy report is in, I need nothing more to form my opinion. :crazy:

raisincharlie
08-14-2008, 12:34 AM
Regarding why this case is different from others (ie, so much circumstantial, and not even naming one POI), I think it's a fair question.

Agree, it seems there's a whole lot more examples of cases where with even (seemingly) less CE, POI/suspects are named. Maybe it's case-by-case like I said though: IF LE thinks naming you may 'force your hand', or force others around you to make a move, then it's done. If not, then they keep it close to the vest.

LE does have the PR aspect of it, and as mentioned, that can be a factor (though presumably secondary to getting justice).

Here's a thought: LE has made the statement that it isn't a random crime, and they're making great progress. These are seemingly is in contradiction with not naming any suspects or POIs.

The thing is, in this Cary neighborhood, given the circumstances, time-of-day, etc, it is fairly easy for most folks to reasonably accept that it really isn't likely to be a random crime (sure, it's possible, but not likely). Therefore, LE can "get away with" making these seemingly contradictory statements (for now), and not risk (overwhelming) fear of public outcry/panic.

Certainly, if it was in a different neighborhood perhaps, and/or different circumstances, and/or if there were suddenly a string of similar crimes like this in the same vicinity, then LE would have a much tougher PR situation on their hand to continue making the statements ("no named suspects/POIs", "not random", "making great progress")

What makes this one unique is the circumstances are such that LE can (for now) "get away" with making these statements (thus far) without a massive public outcry/panic, thereby allowing them to keepthe cards closer to the vest (for the time being).

Is that plausible?


The residents of Enchanted Oaks heard this same exact story - 20 months ago. Nice neighborhood, low to no crime etc. LE isn't trying to get away with anything. They are saying what they believe to be true, anything less is pure negligence. There is no contradiction in saying non random and not naming a suspect to the public as long as LE has one in mind - once that label goes on the whole game changes.

jumpstreet
08-14-2008, 12:37 AM
I wonder if his status as a Canadian on a work visa has something to do with this? It's not your average "not named as a POI" POI. Perhaps due to his status, he's not free to come and go as he pleases?

I would tend to doubt the work-visa situation results in any short-term travel limitations.
As a Canadian citizen, he's surely free to travel back to Canada, and then any other places in the world where Canadians are free to travel (still quite welcome in most countries I think :) ]

The work-visa situation is US regulation that says non-citizens can't just come in and work forever in the US (presumably displacing a US job) without the special government approvals (escalating from visa/greencard/citizenship) (which take time, company sponsorship, etc). I'm not aware that being in this process limits your ability to travel in any way in the meantime.

If you don't get sponsored/approved (at least to greencard status) then ultimately, you have to return to your home country (or risk deportation), but I think that's the worst that comes of it.

Disclaimer: Not nearly as well versed as others might be on this, but the above my general understanding.

momto3kids
08-14-2008, 12:49 AM
Maybe the place is haunted by a ghost seeking justice - or there's a whole lot of painting going on - house needs to be on the market soon.

NoNo RC....remember the house was going on the market because NC & BC were going to seperate. Now Nancy is dead so he doesn't have to sell. He can have it all to himself.:furious:

jumpstreet
08-14-2008, 12:56 AM
The residents of Enchanted Oaks heard this same exact story - 20 months ago. Nice neighborhood, low to no crime etc. LE isn't trying to get away with anything. They are saying what they believe to be true, anything less is pure negligence. There is no contradiction in saying non random and not naming a suspect to the public as long as LE has one in mind - once that label goes on the whole game changes.

Good point. Yeah, didn't mean to imply LE was trying to be deceptive or anything, and agree they're telling it like it is to the extent they can (weighing keeping the public "calm/assured", while not disclosing anything that would impede their own investigation)

My assumption is that the external pressure on them (for reasons ranging from PR/political/public-calming/other) to name any KNOWN POI's can vary from case-to-case.

In the case of NC, for now, the external pressure to name a POI is (relatively) low, so they have little (no) incentive to name any known POIs. [ In general, most reasonable folks in the public seem to accept (on face value) their statement that the crime isn't random ] [ Perhaps similarly in Enchanted Oaks - though I thought in that case they did fairly quickly name the husband as a "POI" ].

If the circumstances/neighborhood/frequency are different, then the pressure to name their known POIs increases, and perhaps they end up doing so (weighing that against the desire to not "tip their hand" any more than they want to).

For example, if there were a rash of similar crimes all in a short timeframe, and all close together, and LE kept saying they weren't random, they were making good progress, and yet they weren't "naming" any POI's, (all of which would be true, as they may have POI's, just didn't want to name them), the public would probably start to get a little more... well... anxious, and LE may opt to name a POI so as to dispel fears. For now, that doesn't seem necessary, and therefore no one has been named.

All this is just my speculation/response to Roy23's query as to why in some (seemingly many) cases, LE (relatively) quickly announces a POI, and in other cases they don't (or never do). Outside the above thoughts, (and my earlier thought that sometimes naming someone as a POI might "force some movement" or put some pressure on the POI), why would LE ever name someone as a POI/suspect prior to arrest?

Fairy1
08-14-2008, 01:02 AM
NoNo RC....remember the house was going on the market because NC & BC were going to seperate. Now Nancy is dead so he doesn't have to sell. He can have it all to himself.:furious:

And apparently does have it all to himself! If the reports of his attempted/threatened suicides are true, I fear that is how this may end...

On another note, I posted my "red flags" earlier. I left out the fact that BC's childrent were removed from his care almost immediately. That is so uncommon...

CyberPro
08-14-2008, 01:05 AM
Does anyone remember when a pregnant Cary woman was murdered by her husband when he pushed her over a bridge onto a Cary greenway? I don't even remember the decade it happened in, but I'm thinking the 1990's. There's a Cary murder that I bet has gone forgotten.

NCNative,

Nope, I recall that case very well... I should, it practically happened in my back yard. I HAD nearly forgotten about it, or at least had not thought of it in a while. It was in the 90's, and at the time I was living in my house that backed up against Cary Parkway near the intersection with Harrison. Crow's flight distance between my house and the bridge where this one happened could not have been 300 yards.

In this case, the husband said he was out walking with his wife, and a car came along as they were crossing the bridge, and knocked him into the concrete railing, but knocked her off the bridge. It was New Years night or New Years Day, IIRC. I KNOW it was VERY FOGGY that night, I remember that very well, one of the most dense fogs I have ever seen. The story did not ring true to me at the time, and as it turned out, he pushed or threw his wife over the bridge, she fell about 30 feet and landed on her feet! Her ankles and other bones were broken, and he apparently attacked her with a rock at the bottom of the greenway. IIRC, he was from Canada too, and had served in the Canadian Army, I believe he took a plea bargin, because I never heard about his trial, although I do know he was arrested.

CyberPro

ncnative
08-14-2008, 01:11 AM
If Brad is the murderer, he is probably scared to stay in that house. I think that show where they look for ghosts or whatever in houses, should come to the Cooper's house.

Another thing: the home in Enchanted Oaks where Michelle Young was murdered is now owned by someone else. I saw a couple's name when I did the search. Do you think you could live in a home when you know someone has been murdered in the home? I could NOT.

Do realtors/previous owners have to disclose that information? I would not want to buy the Cooper's home, no matter what.

And last of all, I still think that if Brad is the murderer, he would take the cowardly way out if/when caught and commit suicide if he didn't pull a Scott Peterson and try to run away, which is really stupid. But it's been done before.

momto3kids
08-14-2008, 01:12 AM
And apparently does have it all to himself! If the reports of his attempted/threatened suicides are true, I fear that is how this may end...

On another note, I posted my "red flags" earlier. I left out the fact that BC's childrent were removed from his care almost immediately. That is so uncommon...


There are so many red flags with BC and this situation, that once you sit back and look at them it is overwhelming, isn't it?

As bad as I hate to say it, if he goes thru with his threats of the past, he brought this on himself. NC wanted to live and she wasn't given that opportunity IMO. If this is his easy way out so be it.

CyberPro
08-14-2008, 01:18 AM
And Fran, IIRC they wanted to wait to make the arrest on Peterson until the DNA on the bodies came back but with Scott bleaching his hair and his newly grown goatee, and his weird behavior after the bodies washed ashore they made the arrest in anticipation of him leaving the country. So even in that case, they wanted to wait for the DNA but couldn't.

(Bolding Above is Mine)

Scott did NOT bleach his hair. Don't you remember, he just fell into a pool at a friend's house and the chlorine in the pool bleached it! :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Yep, that sure must have been a CLEAN pool... sounds like they filled it with Ty-D-Bowl.

CyberPro

ncnative
08-14-2008, 01:20 AM
Oh yes, CyberPro, I remember the fog when that pregnant woman was killed too. You were very close to all of it. I remember reading all the details in the Cary News. I don't remember his being Canadian. I wish someone who is good at researching could bring that news article up. It told all about how she was pregnant but that wasn't really what he or maybe both of them (?) wanted. The details have faded.

There was yet another woman killed by her husband in a home in Cary. All I remember is something about her being upstairs. Gosh darn this simple brain tonight. I'd say that was probably in the 1990s too. I do remember that the husband called the police and even met them when they came. Am I right on this one?

I just can't imagine killing a spouse that wasn't putting you in danger. People are nuts. Now if I was married to a nutjob and he was threatening my safety and I couldn't get away, I might take care of things for survival. But even then I'd be scared to death.

ncnative
08-14-2008, 01:29 AM
OK. The murdered woman on the Cary greenway was 4 mos. pregnant, 1995, Karen Boychuk. That's what I found. I'm going to research this stuff.

Cary isn't as innocent as it seems. We old timers remember the bad things.

If only they would hurry up and solve this murder of Nancy Cooper. It's has more twists and turns than the others.(Edited to correct the date).

Fairy1
08-14-2008, 01:33 AM
Oh yes, CyberPro, I remember the fog when that pregnant woman was killed too. You were very close to all of it. I remember reading all the details in the Cary News. I don't remember his being Canadian. I wish someone who is good at researching could bring that news article up. It told all about how she was pregnant but that wasn't really what he or maybe both of them (?) wanted. The details have faded.

There was yet another woman killed by her husband in a home in Cary. All I remember is something about her being upstairs. Gosh darn this simple brain tonight. I'd say that was probably in the 1990s too. I do remember that the husband called the police and even met them when they came. Am I right on this one?

I just can't imagine killing a spouse that wasn't putting you in danger. People are nuts. Now if I was married to a nutjob and he was threatening my safety and I couldn't get away, I might take care of things for survival. But even then I'd be scared to death.

Yes - Look it up!!!! And while you're at it, look at Stephen and Tara Grant's case. I've mentioned it before and, while I don't want to go O/T here, I do believe there are many similarities. :crazy::crazy::crazy:

Roy23
08-14-2008, 02:30 AM
Good point. Yeah, didn't mean to imply LE was trying to be deceptive or anything, and agree they're telling it like it is to the extent they can (weighing keeping the public "calm/assured", while not disclosing anything that would impede their own investigation)

My assumption is that the external pressure on them (for reasons ranging from PR/political/public-calming/other) to name any KNOWN POI's can vary from case-to-case.

In the case of NC, for now, the external pressure to name a POI is (relatively) low, so they have little (no) incentive to name any known POIs. [ In general, most reasonable folks in the public seem to accept (on face value) their statement that the crime isn't random ] [ Perhaps similarly in Enchanted Oaks - though I thought in that case they did fairly quickly name the husband as a "POI" ].

If the circumstances/neighborhood/frequency are different, then the pressure to name their known POIs increases, and perhaps they end up doing so (weighing that against the desire to not "tip their hand" any more than they want to).

For example, if there were a rash of similar crimes all in a short timeframe, and all close together, and LE kept saying they weren't random, they were making good progress, and yet they weren't "naming" any POI's, (all of which would be true, as they may have POI's, just didn't want to name them), the public would probably start to get a little more... well... anxious, and LE may opt to name a POI so as to dispel fears. For now, that doesn't seem necessary, and therefore no one has been named.

All this is just my speculation/response to Roy23's query as to why in some (seemingly many) cases, LE (relatively) quickly announces a POI, and in other cases they don't (or never do). Outside the above thoughts, (and my earlier thought that sometimes naming someone as a POI might "force some movement" or put some pressure on the POI), why would LE ever name someone as a POI/suspect prior to arrest?

Maybe you and RC know something about Cary that I don't. I just have never seen another case like this. I am under the impression that BC can go and do whatever he likes since he has not been named an POI or suspect. That is the way I understand it. I know BC has already lawyered up and LE has issued search warrants pertaining to him but he has legal rights to do as he pleases. And LE, the Coroner's office still has released nothing. He can walk and force their hand.

FlowerChild
08-14-2008, 03:14 AM
Thank You Anderson. The more I hear of poor Brad and how he couldn't handle the service and the attention...BULL!

IMO he brought this on himself and no one else did it to him. If he thinks the media is in his face now, he has no idea what it is going to be like when they come to take him to :behindbar

Those poor children...if he had a thread of decency in his body he would have put those girls feelings 1st and foremost putting his feelings 2nd. That's what parents do!! He should have sucked it up, gone to the service to show them it is OK to be sad.

How, just how can anyone tell a child your mom is ~dead~ and walk away. :mad:

His day is coming and not soon enough IMO

Do we know if Brad was welcome at the memorial? Perhaps Nancy's family asked Brad to stay away? The memorials seemed to be set up by Nancy's family and Nancy's friends. I doubt Brad would have been welcome at EITHER and I have no doubt it fell to someone involved to tell Brad he was not welcome to attend. Since both Nancy's closest friends and Nancy's family have made no secret about stating they believe Brad to be guilty of murdering Nancy I cannot imagine them asking (or even allowing) Brad to attend any memorial they organized. And Brad attending could have ended in a horrid public confrontation or worse and I doubt THAT would have been something anyone wanted - especially Nancy's family with the girls in attendance.

I cannot see THIS as a "sign" of anything. We do not know the details and have no way of knowing if Brad stayed away by his own choice, or at the request of someone else. Other things are far more telling, IMO.

My Opinion

LillyRush
08-14-2008, 03:48 AM
Do we know if Brad was welcome at the memorial? Perhaps Nancy's family asked Brad to stay away? The memorials seemed to be set up by Nancy's family and Nancy's friends. I doubt Brad would have been welcome at EITHER and I have no doubt it fell to someone involved to tell Brad he was not welcome to attend. Since both Nancy's closest friends and Nancy's family have made no secret about stating they believe Brad to be guilty of murdering Nancy I cannot imagine them asking (or even allowing) Brad to attend any memorial they organized. And Brad attending could have ended in a horrid public confrontation or worse and I doubt THAT would have been something anyone wanted - especially Nancy's family with the girls in attendance.

I cannot see THIS as a "sign" of anything. We do not know the details and have no way of knowing if Brad stayed away by his own choice, or at the request of someone else. Other things are far more telling, IMO.

My Opinion

I agree. I'm highly suspicious of Brad myself. But, considering it was made clear right away that her family and friends suspected him, I think him not attending the memorial service speaks only to the fact that they did not want him there. Of course, he could have just showed up, though things (as you explained) could have easily gotten out of hand.

Overall, I definitely think it's one of those damned if you or damned if you don't things that comes up in the beginning of these types of investigations. People have said the same thing about Neil Entwistle, for example. But, really, would her family have wanted him there? It's the same situation.

MoonFlwr
08-14-2008, 04:49 AM
No, but he owed it to Nancy the woman he claims to have loved, and wanted the marriage to work with.

Reread BC's affidavit 194 & 195. He spent the morning with the girls before the service on Saturday and told Bella what happened to her mom just before the service.

If BC was anything of a man and not a mouse, he would have sucked it up for those girls he claims he loves and gotten thru it with them. What is a parent for? To be there in time of need. HE WASN'T THERE when they needed him!:mad:

How HORRIBLE to tell you children mommy is dead then walk away from them.
It is absolutely disgusting IMO

While I agree that the timing may have been weird....Brad telling the girls just before the service and then not attending, I still think we may be assuming too much about why Brad didn't go.

As has been brought up before, there could be several reasons why he didn't attend. It seems strange to take as fact the idea that he chose not to go out of lack of respect/cowardliness, when we have no evidence of that.

MoonFlwr
08-14-2008, 04:50 AM
i agree. I'm highly suspicious of brad myself. But, considering it was made clear right away that her family and friends suspected him, i think him not attending the memorial service speaks only to the fact that they did not want him there. Of course, he could have just showed up, though things (as you explained) could have easily gotten out of hand.

Overall, i definitely think it's one of those damned if you or damned if you don't things that comes up in the beginning of these types of investigations. People have said the same thing about neil entwistle, for example. But, really, would her family have wanted him there? It's the same situation.

Makes a lotta sense! :)

Just the Fax
08-14-2008, 07:13 AM
Make no mistake, they have at least one POI. If nothing else, as evidenced by the warrant of the workplace. I assert they don't bother to search one's office (nor get judge to issue a warrant for same) without being very interested in you, or something about you.

The key is they (presumably intentionally) haven't [I]named a POI (as that requires them to divulge other pieces of information to the defense earlier than LE would prefer to). It may be frustrating to the public, and may appear as if there's little progress, but it doesn't mean that's reality.

It's semantics, and strategic: If LE thinks that publicly naming someone a POI will help them get to an arrest sooner (perhaps force someone to "slip up", get "nervous", or confess), then they'll name a POI/suspect.

If LE doesn't think naming a POI/suspect will help them get to an arrest sooner, then there's no incentive to name one. [ At least not in the short term, and even in the long term, it just becomes a PR problem ("LE's been working on this case for XX and they still don't have any leads/suspects!"), but the PR is still secondary to their desire to achieve justice (and rightly so IMO) ]

In this specific case, it seems fairly likely that a suspect/POI will be named/made-known at the same time they're being placed under arrest. Even then, they may not do it explicitly. [ Though, I'll also assert it can be inferred when being read your Miranda rights, that LE has a developed a profound interest in you :) ]

LE has POI(s), they just haven't (and likely) won't name them (does not imply a lack of progress [let's hope] :) ).

Red is not true.
I agree with your other comments though.

jumpstreet
08-14-2008, 07:45 AM
he key is they (presumably intentionally) haven't named a POI (as that requires them to divulge other pieces of information to the defense earlier than LE would prefer to)

Red is not true.
I agree with your other comments though.

Thanks JTF - maybe I misunderstood this one. I thought I had read (here) that was the whole reason it had been stated that LE was careful to use the words "we haven't named a suspect/POI..." vs "we have no suspects/POIs".

[ Use of the latter had some implications I thought, and my recollection/understanding was it triggered something that might help the defense. Am I mis-remembering? ]

Just the Fax
08-14-2008, 07:56 AM
Thanks JTF - maybe I misunderstood this one. I thought I had read (here) that was the whole reason it had been stated that LE was careful to use the words "we haven't named a suspect/POI..." vs "we have no suspects/POIs".

[ Use of the latter had some implications I thought, and my recollection/understanding was it triggered something that might help the defense. Am I mis-remembering? ]

The implication of 'naming' a POI/suspects is the terms are considered prejudicial and inflammatory. The use of the terms can also effect the eventual defendants right to a fair trial by having the potential jury pool assume he is likely guilty during the investigation time-line.
Like you said, the cops have no incentive to 'name' a POI or Suspect.
Of course, that does not mean they don't have one.

Just the Fax
08-14-2008, 07:58 AM
The sealed search warrant order expires soon.
Unless the cops or DA asks the judge to reseal, we will see them Monday.

Star12
08-14-2008, 08:22 AM
The implication of 'naming' a POI/suspects is the terms are considered prejudicial and inflammatory. The use of the terms can also effect the eventual defendants right to a fair trial by having the potential jury pool assume he is likely guilty during the investigation time-line.
Like you said, the cops have no incentive to 'name' a POI or Suspect.
Of course, that does not mean they don't have one.

JTF, you said this so well. I'm sharing your words with a friend who is not a WS member, but who is interested in this case. This is the main sticking point.

carolinalady
08-14-2008, 08:24 AM
OK. The murdered woman on the Cary greenway was 4 mos. pregnant, 1995, Karen Boychuk. That's what I found. I'm going to research this stuff.

Cary isn't as innocent as it seems. We old timers remember the bad things.

If only they would hurry up and solve this murder of Nancy Cooper. It's has more twists and turns than the others.(Edited to correct the date).

And, Tharrington Smith was involved in that one, too.

Who was the school teacher strangled by her husband/boyfriend? Weren't they Canadian, too?

Found it: Heather Domenie/Ian Campbell

jumpstreet
08-14-2008, 08:24 AM
Maybe you and RC know something about Cary that I don't. I just have never seen another case like this. I am under the impression that BC can go and do whatever he likes since he has not been named an POI or suspect. That is the way I understand it. I know BC has already lawyered up and LE has issued search warrants pertaining to him but he has legal rights to do as he pleases. And LE, the Coroner's office still has released nothing. He can walk and force their hand.

Agree he is surely (technically) free to leave/travel (even though police may have respectfully requested he stay close to home). Even naming him a suspect/POI probably wouldn't (technically) restrict his ability to travel I assume (though any informal request from LE may be made with more insistence).

Regarding why he hasn't been named a POI/suspect, I guess I'll summarize my impressions to it being related to one (or more) of the following 3 things :
- Would be inflammatory/prejudicial... may effect eventual defendant's right to fair trial (per JTF - thanks for the clarification)...
- LE is not receiving overwhelming external pressure to name a suspect/POI in this case (public/media aren't is a panic thinking this is random crime) {the case is somewhat unique in that regard - for now, the public is relatively willing to accept on "face value", that it isn't a random crime }
- BC may very well not be a suspect/POI, and the police don't want to tip their hand to their real suspect/POI. [ Though, IMO, this one is somewhat counter to the warrant of the workplace, it still certainly could be true, per Theory B ]

Given the above, despite likely having at least one suspect/POI in mind, LE has no incentive to name a suspect/POI, and I'd be surprised if they do so. [ In fact, I'm somewhat surprised they do so in as many other cases as they do. Perhaps we're on the start of a trend towards less "naming" until arrest time, in general ]

jumpstreet
08-14-2008, 08:28 AM
The sealed search warrant order expires soon.
Unless the cops or DA asks the judge to reseal, we will see them Monday.

Do all 3 expire on the same day, or is this one just for the home (were they all sealed for "30 days from time they were submitted")?

If unsealed (unlikely, unless there's an arrest between now and then), what gets disclosed? (warrant, supporting affidavits, and inventory?)

Just the Fax
08-14-2008, 09:11 AM
Do all 3 expire on the same day, or is this one just for the home (were they all sealed for "30 days from time they were submitted")?

If unsealed (unlikely, unless there's an arrest between now and then), what gets disclosed? (warrant, supporting affidavits, and inventory?)

It sounds like the home and Cisco office.
Once they are unsealed, we can read the PC affidavits and inventory.
I would guess the DA will ask that they be resealed, as not much has changed since the court battle that denied the unsealing

RKAB
08-14-2008, 09:37 AM
I wonder if his status as a Canadian on a work visa has something to do with this? It's not your average "not named as a POI" POI. Perhaps due to his status, he's not free to come and go as he pleases?

With Brad having worked at Cisco in the US for as long as he has, and with them potentially covering the costs of some/all of his MBA, it's possible that he is working on getting his US citzenship. When you apply and go through the motions of getting citzenship, there is a period of time during the process(can be up to a year) that you can not return to Canada. He may be at this stage. Cisco has invested alot of money into him and he may be taking steps to remain in the US permanently. This may also be one of the reasons why the girls and a guardian need to come to him for visits as opposed to the less expensive route of him going to see them.

Might just be our local hometown gossip but it's my understanding that Terry (Brad's dad) has had to return to work at the college but that his mom has remained down south with him. Still trying to check with a friend who lives near them to see if she knows for sure.

raisincharlie
08-14-2008, 09:43 AM
Thanks RKAB. :)

carolinalady
08-14-2008, 09:53 AM
With Brad having worked at Cisco in the US for as long as he has, and with them potentially covering the costs of some/all of his MBA, it's possible that he is working on getting his US citzenship. When you apply and go through the motions of getting citzenship, there is a period of time during the process(can be up to a year) that you can not return to Canada. He may be at this stage. Cisco has invested alot of money into him and he may be taking steps to remain in the US permanently. This may also be one of the reasons why the girls and a guardian need to come to him for visits as opposed to the less expensive route of him going to see them.

Might just be our local hometown gossip but it's my understanding that Terry (Brad's dad) has had to return to work at the college but that his mom has remained down south with him. Still trying to check with a friend who lives near them to see if she knows for sure.

I do think I read somewhere that he was working on getting permanent residency status.

Edited to add: It was #7 of BC's affidavit.

ncnative
08-14-2008, 10:02 AM
Ol' BC might be a permanent resident of NC if he is tried and that trial results in conviction.

Since I don't even play a lawyer on TV, please advise me: he'd be imprisoned in NC if found guilty, even though he's a Canadian citizen, correct? Suddenly I feel dumb. Very dumb.

RaleighNC
08-14-2008, 10:04 AM
Is there a concern about him going to Canada since he's a Canadian citizen? remember aren't we still awaiting extradition of Caesar Laurean who fled to Mexico after (allegedly) killing his his pregnant girlfriend? Didn't he specifically go there because a) he had family there and b) they won't extradite unless they have a guarantee of no death penalty? Hasn't it been said they can tie up the extradition for YEARS?

Now, I know that Canada is not the same as Mexico, but.... it's possible that he is restricted from traveling there and that's why he's visiting with the girls via webcam and visits when they are brought to NC.

Jeepers, I hope this case breaks soon.

raisincharlie
08-14-2008, 10:05 AM
Ol' BC might be a permanent resident of NC if he is tried and that trial results in conviction.

Since I don't even play a lawyer on TV, please advise me: he'd be imprisoned in NC if found guilty, even though he's a Canadian citizen, correct? Suddenly I feel dumb. Very dumb.

If tried and convicted he would be imprisoned in NC.

CyberPro
08-14-2008, 10:31 AM
And, Tharrington Smith was involved in that one, too.

Who was the school teacher strangled by her husband/boyfriend? Weren't they Canadian, too?

Found it: Heather Domenie/Ian Campbell

Oh, Yes! I recall hearing about that happening now. I had forgotten about that one. The names jogged the memories.

I did not follow that case, in fact this Cooper case is the closest that I have followed a local case. I am not sure what about this one piques my interest, other than it was mentioned that she went running in Regency, and I live very close to Regency.

CyberPro

RKAB
08-14-2008, 10:32 AM
Now, I know that Canada is not the same as Mexico, but.... it's possible that he is restricted from traveling there and that's why he's visiting with the girls via webcam and visits when they are brought to NC.


I don't think that they can restrict his travel unless he is named as a POI/suspect. At that point, LE would have him surrender his passport. He may be receiving advice from his lawyers or LE that it's in his best interest NOT to travel to Canada but I don't think they can stop him.

Canada does have some bleeding heart agencies that would work to keep him from being extradited to a death penalty state if it came to that. Should he be charged, found guilty and sentenced to the death penalty, these agencies will also work hard to try and get him OUT of a death penalty state and back to Canada or have his sentence commuted to life. They have not been terribly successful in a recent case though.

CyberPro
08-14-2008, 10:36 AM
Ol' BC might be a permanent resident of NC if he is tried and that trial results in conviction.


:floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh: NCNATIVE,

You might have discovered a shortcut to permanant resident status! Cuts through all the red tape that the government has.

CyberPro

Topsail Girl
08-14-2008, 10:39 AM
I don't think that they can restrict his travel unless he is named as a POI/suspect. At that point, LE would have him surrender his passport. He may be receiving advice from his lawyers or LE that it's in his best interest NOT to travel to Canada but I don't think they can stop him.

Canada does have some bleeding heart agencies that would work to keep him from being extradited to a death penalty state if it came to that. Should he be charged, found guilty and sentenced to the death penalty, these agencies will also work hard to try and get him OUT of a death penalty state and back to Canada or have his sentence commuted to life. They have not been terribly successful in a recent case though.

Interesting info RKAB, I can't help but wonder why in the world Canada would WANT a murdering citizen back in their country. Why not let him rot on death row in the States like Entwistle???

RKAB
08-14-2008, 10:40 AM
:floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh: NCNATIVE,

You might have discovered a shortcut to permanant resident status! Cuts through all the red tape that the government has.

CyberPro

:rolling:

RKAB
08-14-2008, 10:43 AM
Interesting info RKAB, I can't help but wonder why in the world Canada would WANT a murdering citizen back in their country. Why not let him rot on death row in the States like Entwistle???

*I* wouldn't want him back but there's always someone who thinks the death penalty is cruel punishment. :boohoo:

I, personally, am pro-death penalty. I also think that if you commit a crime in another country, you should be subject to their laws and your home country keep out of it.

fran
08-14-2008, 10:46 AM
Is there a concern about him going to Canada since he's a Canadian citizen? remember aren't we still awaiting extradition of Caesar Laurean who fled to Mexico after (allegedly) killing his his pregnant girlfriend? Didn't he specifically go there because a) he had family there and b) they won't extradite unless they have a guarantee of no death penalty? Hasn't it been said they can tie up the extradition for YEARS?

Now, I know that Canada is not the same as Mexico, but.... it's possible that he is restricted from traveling there and that's why he's visiting with the girls via webcam and visits when they are brought to NC.

Jeepers, I hope this case breaks soon.

An infamous serial killer, Charles Ng, citizen of Hong Hong, but resident of the U.S., fled to Canada after he and his accomplice's crimes were uncovered. While his accomplice committed suicide shortly after being arrested, Ng had been arrested in Canada for another crime. After serving 4 years or so for his crimes in Canada, it took another 6 years for the U.S. to finally extradict him for trial.

After the costliest trial in U.S. history, Ng was sentenced to death row and presently awaits execution in San Quentin.

So, yes, he can be deported to the U.S. IF he were to run to Canada, but I'm not sure IF because he's a Canadian citizen, they would allow the DP to be imposed. I would imagine it could possibly be part of an extradition agreement, NO dp IF found guilty.

JMHO
fran

fran
08-14-2008, 10:53 AM
*I* wouldn't want him back but there's always someone who thinks the death penalty is cruel punishment. :boohoo:

I, personally, am pro-death penalty. I also think that if you commit a crime in another country, you should be subject to their laws and your home country keep out of it.

Oh, we have those here too, people who think the dp is cruel and unusual punishment.:boohoo:

What I don't get is, the crime itself is cruel and unusual to the victim and their family, so why not repay them in kind?:bang:

I believe it's called KARMA! and it's a bit**.:rolleyes:

JMHO
fran

EntreNous
08-14-2008, 12:11 PM
(Bolding Above is Mine)

Scott did NOT bleach his hair. Don't you remember, he just fell into a pool at a friend's house and the chlorine in the pool bleached it! :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Yep, that sure must have been a CLEAN pool... sounds like they filled it with Ty-D-Bowl.

CyberPro

Yeah, I remember him saying that.:crazy: As a hair stylist myself I can say with 100% confidence that he did indeed bleach his hair. That was bleach with at least 30 vol. developer which is why it was completely brassy in tone, the volume was too strong and it "pulled" too fast, leaving it that bright electric orange color. No pool water can do that to "virgin" hair or otherwise in my book.

I've always wondered what Laci's sister thought about that remark since she too is a hairstylist. Totally ridiculous.

jilly
08-14-2008, 12:17 PM
If tried and convicted he would be imprisoned in NC.

This could be interesting - if this goes on like the Young case and he goes on with his life and becomes a US citizen - if and when he's subsequently charged, he'd be facing the DP. Bit of a dilemma for him, I would think.

jilly
08-14-2008, 12:20 PM
Interesting info RKAB, I can't help but wonder why in the world Canada would WANT a murdering citizen back in their country. Why not let him rot on death row in the States like Entwistle???

Entwistle got LWOP. I don't believe Mass has the DP.

Topsail Girl
08-14-2008, 12:40 PM
Entwistle got LWOP. I don't believe Mass has the DP.

You're correct Jilly, Mass does not have the death penalty. I was just trying to imply that State laws applied and not English law. Dummy me picked the first case that came to mind and that state doesn't even have the death penalty. I think it's because Entwistle is the last case I kept up with start to finish. :crazy: :crazy:

ETA I love your avatar!!! What a cutie!!!

raisincharlie
08-14-2008, 12:47 PM
This could be interesting - if this goes on like the Young case and he goes on with his life and becomes a US citizen - if and when he's subsequently charged, he'd be facing the DP. Bit of a dilemma for him, I would think.

Jilly

For some reason, maybe just wishful thinking, I do not believe this will drag on like the Young case. Perhaps it is perception but in this case it "appears" that the DA has taken a much more active roll - i.e. Colon Willoughby sitting in the judge's kitchen at 2:30 am verbally requesting a seal be placed on a warrant not yet issued. I think perhaps the DA has learned a few "how not to's" since the Young case.

Seems WCSO took the lead in the Young case and the DA just sat back waiting - that does not appear to be the case here and I base that on having watched the hearing regarding the unsealing of the warrants.

I don't see much right now to figure if this will become a DP case or not. If Brad turns out to be tried for this - one would think, being as how many think he is brilliant, he would have figured a way to make sure he wasn't the last to report seeing her. He would have figured a way to have her whereabouts confirmed after 7 am, and if you think about it, this might not have been hard to do. Given the few facts we do have - this just seems to me to be, if planned, not planned well at all, but more likely spur of the moment.

But then you know me - I don't want to think someone plotted to murder their wife. :)

Roy23
08-14-2008, 01:06 PM
I don't think that they can restrict his travel unless he is named as a POI/suspect. At that point, LE would have him surrender his passport. He may be receiving advice from his lawyers or LE that it's in his best interest NOT to travel to Canada but I don't think they can stop him.

Canada does have some bleeding heart agencies that would work to keep him from being extradited to a death penalty state if it came to that. Should he be charged, found guilty and sentenced to the death penalty, these agencies will also work hard to try and get him OUT of a death penalty state and back to Canada or have his sentence commuted to life. They have not been terribly successful in a recent case though.


Okay, I have researched the term "Person of interest". Opinion vary from LE quite a bit depending on the circumstances. I found that I am not 100% right or wrong. Back to Scott Peterson for a moment. He was named a "POI" within 3 weeks of his wife's disappearance. You can check it Fran. There was still a lot of clammoring at the time to name him a "Suspect". That did not happen until late in the game. Media was real intense here.

Back to "POI's. Brad does have every legal right to do and go whereever he wants. But because he has not been named a "POI" that could be for numerous reason, some of which have been stated by some smart sleuthers. Two of the biggest things they consider is:

1. Danger to the public
2. Media scrutiny

The police have really put themselves on the line by stating that this was not a random crime and the public is safe. That really does seem to imply that a crazy killer is not on the loose and that Brad or someone else who hated Nancy is in the crosshairs here. Another muder and LE has some serious explaining to do.

So in a nutshell, they are putting their p's and q's together. They do not want to be accused of not looking at all the possibilities and Brad(or whomever) get off due to his attorney scrutinizing LE's objectivity in its investigation. RC made a great point early on about Brad's choice of Lawyer. I expect this to be a case that was premeditated and planned well. But at the end of the day, somebody real close to Nancy will be the suspect.

ncnative
08-14-2008, 02:08 PM
Trivia report: had to ride by BCooper's home about 20 min. ago. His white BMW was in the driveway. It must be really dark inside with all the blinds closed.

Colon Willoughby should have become a proctologist.

momto3kids
08-14-2008, 02:27 PM
Trivia report: had to ride by BCooper's home about 20 min. ago. His white BMW was in the driveway. It must be really dark inside with all the blinds closed.

Colon Willoughby should have become a proctologist.

I know he paid his light bill for sure. Last night he had every light on downstairs including the front porch.

Is his BMW still way back from the garage doors and not pulled right up to them? It gave me the impression last night he had been cleaning the garage out like a while back when he was in there and the BMW was about 15' back.

He has now shut the blind on his staircase. It was pulled up about 1', but not any more. It is now shut entirely also.

Bob&Bob
08-14-2008, 02:33 PM
I know he paid his light bill for sure. Last night he had every light on downstairs including the front porch.

Is his BMW still way back from the garage doors and not pulled right up to them? It gave me the impression last night he had been cleaning the garage out like a while back when he was in there and the BMW was about 15' back.

He has now shut the blind on his staircase. It was pulled up about 1', but not any more. It is now shut entirely also.


How wide are the blinds?

jilly
08-14-2008, 03:27 PM
You're correct Jilly, Mass does not have the death penalty. I was just trying to imply that State laws applied and not English law. Dummy me picked the first case that came to mind and that state doesn't even have the death penalty. I think it's because Entwistle is the last case I kept up with start to finish. :crazy: :crazy:

ETA I love your avatar!!! What a cutie!!!

That's one guy that should be on Death Row! Too bad you didn't join us here on the case. I think it was speculated at one point that he fled to the UK because he thought the entire US had the DP and once he discovered otherwise, he waived extradition.

Peppurr thanks you for the compliment.:crazy:Right now, he's laying on his back with all fours open wide because of our present heat wave!

Topsail Girl
08-14-2008, 03:29 PM
That's one guy that should be on Death Row! Too bad you didn't join us here on the case. I think it was speculated at one point that he fled to the UK because he thought the entire US had the DP and once he discovered otherwise, he waived extradition.

Peppurr thanks you for the compliment.:crazy:Right now, he's laying on his back with all fours open wide because of our present heat wave!

I was glued to the live broadcasts daily in that case. I'll never forget the way that onsie looked. I wanted to kill him myself - the scum bag!!!

Are you in the states or elsewhere? I ask because you're speaking of a heat wave.

WSTarheel
08-14-2008, 03:35 PM
How wide are the blinds?

ACK! You crack me up B&B! The last (and only) time I looked they were probably your average 1-2 inch variety.

ncnative
08-14-2008, 03:43 PM
Bob, the blinds look like the wide slatted wooden blinds, white. Maybe 3" wide slats?

Mom, yes, his car was not close to the garage door. More like 2/3 down the driveway.

Mom, I think I'll hire you to house-sit our home when we go away. I'm sure you'd do a great job. I have a terrible Lochmere neighbor who waits til we go away to do naughtly things that affect our yard. We have cameras, but not enough on the side of the house.

ncnative
08-14-2008, 03:45 PM
Let's all get together and have a peeper party on Lochmere Dr. behind BC's home at night. Maybe Java Jive will supply coffee. We may solve the crime whilst we are at it.

Bob&Bob
08-14-2008, 03:49 PM
Bob, the blinds look like the wide slatted wooden blinds, white. Maybe 3" wide slats?

Mom, yes, his car was not close to the garage door. More like 2/3 down the driveway.

Mom, I think I'll hire you to house-sit our home when we go away. I'm sure you'd do a great job. I have a terrible Lochmere neighbor who waits til we go away to do naughtly things that affect our yard. We have cameras, but not enough on the side of the house.

You haven't measured?

raisincharlie
08-14-2008, 03:51 PM
Let's all get together and have a peeper party on Lochmere Dr. behind BC's home at night. Maybe Java Jive will supply coffee. We may solve the crime whilst we are at it.

Could be the reason he keeps the back light on and the shades drawn - tired of peepers and no freebies for LE.

ncnative
08-14-2008, 03:55 PM
If BC doesn't like peepers, he should have chosen a better location. The back of his home is visible to everyone who drives down Lochmere Dr. where it meets up at Cary Parkway. His house is the only one whose landscape screening is gone. His died. Had to be cut out. Leyland cypress. His front yard is not private either. I love privacy.

BOB!! OK. I've wised up now. May I come and measure your slats?

ncnative
08-14-2008, 03:58 PM
(edited to delete duplicate post)

ncnative
08-14-2008, 04:35 PM
Woops. Too many posts.

jilly
08-14-2008, 04:42 PM
Jilly

For some reason, maybe just wishful thinking, I do not believe this will drag on like the Young case. Perhaps it is perception but in this case it "appears" that the DA has taken a much more active roll - i.e. Colon Willoughby sitting in the judge's kitchen at 2:30 am verbally requesting a seal be placed on a warrant not yet issued. I think perhaps the DA has learned a few "how not to's" since the Young case.

Seems WCSO took the lead in the Young case and the DA just sat back waiting - that does not appear to be the case here and I base that on having watched the hearing regarding the unsealing of the warrants.

I don't see much right now to figure if this will become a DP case or not. If Brad turns out to be tried for this - one would think, being as how many think he is brilliant, he would have figured a way to make sure he wasn't the last to report seeing her. He would have figured a way to have her whereabouts confirmed after 7 am, and if you think about it, this might not have been hard to do. Given the few facts we do have - this just seems to me to be, if planned, not planned well at all, but more likely spur of the moment.

But then you know me - I don't want to think someone plotted to murder their wife. :)

In the Ann Miller case (which took 4 yrs to charge) Willoughby appeared to handle the difficult matters. I would think that requesting a seal on a warrant not issued is no routine matter. Maybe we'll hear from Willoughby in the next 10 days on the Young case.

I agree with you about the Cooper murder not being 'planned'. I can't see it being a DP case. Imo Brad stewed, boiled over and subsequently put his mind to meticulously building a defense.

Out of curiosity, how long do you figure Cisco will keep him on Admin leave?

jilly
08-14-2008, 04:58 PM
Are you in the states or elsewhere? I ask because you're speaking of a heat wave.

Check your pms.

raisincharlie
08-14-2008, 05:55 PM
In the Ann Miller case (which took 4 yrs to charge) Willoughby appeared to handle the difficult matters. I would think that requesting a seal on a warrant not issued is no routine matter. Maybe we'll hear from Willoughby in the next 10 days on the Young case.

I agree with you about the Cooper murder not being 'planned'. I can't see it being a DP case. Imo Brad stewed, boiled over and subsequently put his mind to meticulously building a defense.

Out of curiosity, how long do you figure Cisco will keep him on Admin leave?

If we hear anything from Willoughby about the Young case in the next 10 days it will be another of those <THUD> moments for me. ( Star keep the brown paper and vinegar handy incase - okay ? ).

Cisco - I imagine after 8 years of service to Cisco - they will honor their commitment to Brad until he is either ruled out or in.

jilly
08-14-2008, 06:37 PM
If we hear anything from Willoughby about the Young case in the next 10 days it will be another of those <THUD> moments for me. :yes:( Star keep the brown paper and vinegar handy incase - okay ? ). :laughitup:

Cisco - I imagine after 8 years of service to Cisco - they will honor their commitment to Brad until he is either ruled out or in.

Interesting... I forgot about the 8 yrs. Thanks RC!:)

CARYISHOME
08-14-2008, 09:04 PM
ACK! You crack me up B&B! The last (and only) time I looked they were probably your average 1-2 inch variety.

B&B cracks me up,too. But, I can't help but think about what he/she says and give it some serious consideration.

I like B&B.

momto3kids
08-14-2008, 09:08 PM
If BC doesn't like peepers, he should have chosen a better location. The back of his home is visible to everyone who drives down Lochmere Dr. where it meets up at Cary Parkway. His house is the only one whose landscape screening is gone. His died. Had to be cut out. Leyland cypress. His front yard is not private either. I love privacy.

BOB!! OK. I've wised up now. May I come and measure your slats?

Have you noticed that about 80% of all the homes along Lochmere Drive don't use window treatments? I finally put blinds in the back of our home this year since my youngest is sometimes home alone now. Are they shut? NO. But she can close them if she needs to.

momto3kids
08-14-2008, 09:14 PM
How wide are the blinds?

:waitasec: It appears most are the 2" ones 2B's. The upstairs front ones look like plantation shutters.

Front door is probably a white sheet Mr. Brad and mommy bought at Pennys a few weeks ago, because during the seach the pictures show none are there, but now there are.:crazy:

CARYISHOME
08-14-2008, 09:14 PM
Have you noticed that about 80% of all the homes along Lochmere Drive don't use window treatments? I finally put blinds in the back of our home this year since my youngest is sometimes home alone now. Are they shut? NO. But she can close them if she needs to.

I didn't have window treatments on the back of my house for some time. That seems to be fairly common.

ncnative
08-14-2008, 09:24 PM
I use privacy in my window treatments. I can open or close, or be somewhere in between. Yes, lots of the people around don't use window treatments. Maybe they don't want to spend the money. Your life is an open book when you leave your windows uncovered at night with lights on. Easy for crooks to watch too. Not to mention pervs.

Back in the mid 1980s local thugs came through the neighborhood and tried to kick in back doors. Some of the french doors are easy to kick in. Luckily, I had the sliding floor bolt locks, which held enough to keep them out, but the french doors were open a wee bit after the kicking. The bolts held.

momto3kids
08-14-2008, 09:35 PM
I posted this 2 days ago...
I was raised with the motto, 'actions speak louder than words,' and BC actions have spoken volumes with this entire situation. This was his children's mother, the woman he states he loved, a marriage he wanted to work on....but he is concerned what the public thinks?

He is the one who declined all but one press conference. He didn't attend the private memorial at Bella's pre-school, which I believe the press was off at a distance.

He is not a POI or suspect even today, so why hide and mourn?
I would think if he was uncomfortable thinking the media would be in his face, he could have requested assistance with the CPD.

The most this man has done is tie a white ribbon around his mailbox, that is if he even did it.

Where is the wreath from him at the site NC was found? This was per se her last resting place besides an urn....why hasn't he gone to the site to put something, just something there?

As of this afternoon there ARE fresh 'white' flowers with a white satin ribbon wrapped around the bundle with a bow tied. I had taken some friends with me to show them the location where NC was found, and was rather surprised to see a fresh bunch.

BC? I don't know, but if it is maybe just maybe his actions are sinking in.:rolleyes:

CARYISHOME
08-14-2008, 09:46 PM
I posted this 2 days ago...
I was raised with the motto, 'actions speak louder than words,' and BC actions have spoken volumes with this entire situation. This was his children's mother, the woman he states he loved, a marriage he wanted to work on....but he is concerned what the public thinks?

He is the one who declined all but one press conference. He didn't attend the private memorial at Bella's pre-school, which I believe the press was off at a distance.

He is not a POI or suspect even today, so why hide and mourn?
I would think if he was uncomfortable thinking the media would be in his face, he could have requested assistance with the CPD.

The most this man has done is tie a white ribbon around his mailbox, that is if he even did it.

Where is the wreath from him at the site NC was found? This was per se her last resting place besides an urn....why hasn't he gone to the site to put something, just something there?

As of this afternoon there ARE fresh 'white' flowers with a white satin ribbon wrapped around the bundle with a bow tied. I had taken some friends with me to show them the location where NC was found, and was rather surprised to see a fresh bunch.

BC? I don't know, but if it is maybe just maybe his actions are sinking in.:rolleyes:


Hmmmmm...who knows? Clearly, someone cares....

raisincharlie
08-14-2008, 09:51 PM
I posted this 2 days ago...
I was raised with the motto, 'actions speak louder than words,' and BC actions have spoken volumes with this entire situation. This was his children's mother, the woman he states he loved, a marriage he wanted to work on....but he is concerned what the public thinks?

He is the one who declined all but one press conference. He didn't attend the private memorial at Bella's pre-school, which I believe the press was off at a distance.

He is not a POI or suspect even today, so why hide and mourn?
I would think if he was uncomfortable thinking the media would be in his face, he could have requested assistance with the CPD.

The most this man has done is tie a white ribbon around his mailbox, that is if he even did it.

Where is the wreath from him at the site NC was found? This was per se her last resting place besides an urn....why hasn't he gone to the site to put something, just something there?

As of this afternoon there ARE fresh 'white' flowers with a white satin ribbon wrapped around the bundle with a bow tied. I had taken some friends with me to show them the location where NC was found, and was rather surprised to see a fresh bunch.

BC? I don't know, but if it is maybe just maybe his actions are sinking in.:rolleyes:

Glad someone took some flowers by.

BC - could be. I wouldn't consider it beyond the realm of possibility that things said here aren't being viewed at numerous locations. Wouldn't be the first time it has happened, doubt it will be the last.

CARYISHOME
08-14-2008, 09:51 PM
I use privacy in my window treatments. I can open or close, or be somewhere in between. Yes, lots of the people around don't use window treatments. Maybe they don't want to spend the money. Your life is an open book when you leave your windows uncovered at night with lights on. Easy for crooks to watch too. Not to mention pervs.

Back in the mid 1980s local thugs came through the neighborhood and tried to kick in back doors. Some of the french doors are easy to kick in. Luckily, I had the sliding floor bolt locks, which held enough to keep them out, but the french doors were open a wee bit after the kicking. The bolts held.


Yes, your life is an open book. For me at the time it was a money issue - window treatments are expensive. But, as I sit here now all my blinds are closed, I have privacy and feel very comfortable.

momto3kids
08-14-2008, 10:11 PM
Glad someone took some flowers by.

BC - could be. I wouldn't consider it beyond the realm of possibility that things said here aren't being viewed at numerous locations. Wouldn't be the first time it has happened, doubt it will be the last.

Your right RC...I see sometimes there are more guests than members on here, so they stay behind hidden doors. Oh well.

Many of the statements on here re-quoted on other boards. This appears to be the board to come to and seek information.

I thought someone mentioned not too long ago K&B user name was being used on here. Wonder if someone thinks it funny or really them?:waitasec:

raisincharlie
08-14-2008, 10:16 PM
Your right RC...

I have also seen many of the statements on here re-quoted on other boards. It appears to be the board to go and seek information on.

I thought someone mentioned not too long ago K&B user name was being used on here. Wonder if someone thinks it funny or really them?:waitasec:

There is a Kurtz & Blum poster on WS - last activity 7/30/08. Page 9 of the K's if one wants to verify. Could be a joke, could be for real. All you have to do to be invisible is log out.

Seen it before on this website - LE looks, lawyers look, even so called experts - MSilver is one of those but I don't think he is much of an expert really. Wouldn't rule out those who have been named on search warrants - especially tekkie ones. It happens Mom.

CARYISHOME
08-14-2008, 10:19 PM
Your right RC...I see sometimes there are more guests than members on here, so they stay behind hidden doors. Oh well.

Many of the statements on here re-quoted on other boards. This appears to be the board to come to and seek information.

I thought someone mentioned not too long ago K&B user name was being used on here. Wonder if someone thinks it funny or really them?:waitasec:

What other boards are you talking about?

ncnative
08-14-2008, 10:24 PM
Well, Mom, when are you going to set up $10 tours like they do in Charleston? A couple of fine Clydesdales pulling an old fashioned trolley... You could do the Harris Teeter, "Wisteria Lane" (front and back street views), the preschool, all the friends homes, CISCO, the place where Nancy was found. You could donate the money to NC's memorial fund.

momto3kids
08-14-2008, 10:24 PM
What other boards are you talking about?

I know WolfWeb? has done it. I am seeing it where there are forums in the media, city-data, Carolina Hurricanes I think someone posted what was being said here.

How I found this is when I do a google search the other websites pull up and sure enough it is things we are talking about.

It's not bad at all, just this board is the most active one so they are gathering info from us.

ncnative
08-14-2008, 10:27 PM
One board I know of is called In Session. It's boring. What's a good one? I love this one because it seems there are people from the neighborhood, community, BC's work, even people from Canada who knew him. I mean, what boards can be as good as having me, Mom and others who can look in the windows, drive around, hit the HT and other sites and report back? WS folks will solve the murder mystery too!

jumpstreet
08-14-2008, 10:27 PM
As of this afternoon there ARE fresh 'white' flowers with a white satin ribbon wrapped around the bundle with a bow tied. I had taken some friends with me to show them the location where NC was found, and was rather surprised to see a fresh bunch.


Thanks MT3...just curious - were the fresh flowers at the exact spot where we've suspected the final location was? (Or were they just in the "general area").

[ ie, were they placed where that original bouquet was placed - which was placed there very shortly after the tragedy, or elsewhere ]

CARYISHOME
08-14-2008, 10:28 PM
I know WolfWeb? has done it. I am seeing it where there are forums in the media, city-data, Carolina Hurricanes I think someone posted what was being said here.

How I found this is when I do a google search the other websites pull up and sure enough it is things we are talking about.

It's not bad at all, just this board is the most active one so they are gathering info from us.

Well, of course; I am not surprised to hear that. We have some lively and intelligent conversation.

:)

raisincharlie
08-14-2008, 10:30 PM
One board I know of is called In Session. It's boring. What's a good one? I love this one because it seems there are people from the neighborhood, community, BC's work, even people from Canada who knew him. I mean, what boards can be as good as having me, Mom and others who can look in the windows, drive around, hit the HT and other sites and report back? WS folks will solve the murder mystery too!

Seriously ncnative - it has been great having people who live there on the board - it certainly helps in the visualization of the area and the perspective between locations. Extremely helpful and much appreciated.

CARYISHOME
08-14-2008, 10:31 PM
One board I know of is called In Session. It's boring. What's a good one? I love this one because it seems there are people from the neighborhood, community, BC's work, even people from Canada who knew him. I mean, what boards can be as good as having me, Mom and others who can look in the windows, drive around, hit the HT and other sites and report back? WS folks will solve the murder mystery too!

Exactly....:D

momto3kids
08-14-2008, 10:31 PM
Well, Mom, when are you going to set up $10 tours like they do in Charleston? A couple of fine Clydesdales pulling an old fashioned trolley... You could do the Harris Teeter, "Wisteria Lane" (front and back street views), the preschool, all the friends homes, CISCO, the place where Nancy was found. You could donate the money to NC's memorial fund.

:coffeeup: add Java Jive, LifeTime Fitness {cough}, K&B office, Wake County Courthouse and the :behindbar since this is where the perp will end up!:clap:

$20 to take a bus...since there will be a huge request to come along.

raisincharlie
08-14-2008, 10:34 PM
:coffeeup: add Java Jive, LifeTime Fitness {cough}, K&B office, Wake County Courthouse and the :behindbar since this is where the perp will end up!:clap:

$20 to take a bus...since there will be a huge request to come along.

Yes, Lifetime Fitness - I definitely appreciate all the info on that - all the ammenities, cameras, check in procedures, dumpsters, cafes and so on. There is something about that place...just gotta figure out what it is.

momto3kids
08-14-2008, 10:41 PM
Thanks MT3...just curious - were the fresh flowers at the exact spot where we've suspected the final location was? (Or were they just in the "general area").

[ ie, were they placed where that original bouquet was placed - which was placed there very shortly after the tragedy, or elsewhere ]

If you mean once you go down the embankment off the road, not against the black barrier but where the area flattens out, old flowers are there. Is this the location you are asking about?

The fresh flowers were there with them. It appears someone had gone down the embankment recently looking at the footprints on the embankment.

Anyone willing to go check BC's shoes for mud?:chicken:

CARYISHOME
08-14-2008, 10:46 PM
If you mean once you go down the embankment off the road, not against the black barrier but where the area flattens out, old flowers are there. Is this the location you are asking about?

The fresh flowers were there with them. It appears someone had gone down the embankment recently looking at the footprints on the embankment.

Anyone willing to go check BC's shoes for mud?:chicken:

The new flowers are in the same place as the old flowers? Like placed next to the old flowers?

As I recall the old flowers are not too far from the bottom of the embankment.

momto3kids
08-14-2008, 10:49 PM
Yes, Lifetime Fitness - I definitely appreciate all the info on that - all the ammenities, cameras, check in procedures, dumpsters, cafes and so on. There is something about that place...just gotta figure out what it is.

I happen to have someone I know well who works at LTF. I should see if there happens to be any mention to what went on there. Especially since both BC and NC were members, someone should remember them.
I also know someone else who I think is a lifeguard there.

BC...I will have to ask them.

ncnative
08-14-2008, 10:55 PM
I know a hairstylist/colorist who works at the salon there. She used to work at another salon. I haven't thought about asking her.

Oh you can bet the perp cleaned his shoes, tires and probably took himself through a carwash and vacuum. It's killing me not knowing Who Done It, officially.

momto3kids
08-14-2008, 10:59 PM
So Ncnative...would you please go by BC's, knock and ask to see his shoes? :help:

He won't answer the door for me, I know he won't.
He has shut his blinds, draped the windows with sheets, and now sleeping with the lights on :eye::eye:. I think he is reading WS...really I do.:eek:

raisincharlie
08-14-2008, 11:00 PM
I happen to have someone I know well who works at LTF. I should see if there happens to be any mention to what went on there. Especially since both BC and NC were members, someone should remember them.
I also know someone else who I think is a lifeguard there.

BC...I will have to ask them.

Mom

I'm anal retentive :) - it could be nothing at all but there is something about LTF that sticks in my craw. Same as LE passing out fliers at 6 am at Cary Parkway and Holly Springs Road two weeks after Nancy went missing.

Star12
08-14-2008, 11:04 PM
So Ncnative...would you please go by BC's, knock and ask to see his shoes? :help:

He won't answer the door for me, I know he won't.
He has shut his blinds, draped the windows with sheets, and now sleeping with the lights on :eye::eye:. I think he is reading WS...really I do.:eek:

Whether BC did it or not, I sincerely believe it would not be in his best interests to be reading WS.

Bad for his emotional and mental health, don'tcha know.

Star12
08-14-2008, 11:12 PM
Whether BC did it or not, I sincerely believe it would not be in his best interests to be reading WS.

Bad for his emotional and mental health, don'tcha know.

Quoting myself here, but in the Photos thread, the slideshow in Post #5, Photo 22. Brad.

I would love for ya'll to take a little bit of time and just look at that photo. The eyes, the mouth.

Tell us your what you see. Your impressions.

EntreNous
08-14-2008, 11:16 PM
Loathing, that's what I see.

raisincharlie
08-14-2008, 11:16 PM
Quoting myself here, but in the Photos thread, the slideshow in Post #5, Photo 22. Brad.

I would love for ya'll to take a little bit of time and just look at that photo. The eyes, the mouth.

Tell us your what you see. Your impressions.

That was taken during the 14 July presser at 630 - right before Nancy was found.

The man is flat ticked off with questions reporters are asking - they weren't shy about asking about that possible trip to the store at 4 am - he's ticked.

EntreNous
08-14-2008, 11:40 PM
The implication of 'naming' a POI/suspects is the terms are considered prejudicial and inflammatory. The use of the terms can also effect the eventual defendants right to a fair trial by having the potential jury pool assume he is likely guilty during the investigation time-line.
Like you said, the cops have no incentive to 'name' a POI or Suspect.
Of course, that does not mean they don't have one.

I was speaking with my BIL tonight about this case and the whole POI/Suspect thing, he's a sgt. on our police force. He said basically the same thing JTF. In his words it would taint the trial.

ncnative
08-14-2008, 11:55 PM
Mom, I ain't goin' over to that scary house.

Wonder who paid for Nancy's final arrangements? (As in burial or cremation?) I don't recall hearing about that.

ncnative
08-15-2008, 12:05 AM
Star12, you asked us to look at Brad's photo. I did. He looks surly. Dissociated. His amblyopic left eye scares the doody out of me. I bet he was made fun of as a child about his eye. It wanders off to the left, and it sits a little bit up higher when it's centered, than the other one. I can see him being belittled as a kid. Now why the heck didn't his parents take care of that when he was young? My daughter had amblyopia and she had to go through lots to get it straight.

Yes, he looks surly and dissociated. I noticed that he was wearing his wedding ring the day he did that appearance. He put his hands on the table with the ring hand out front. Probably for show.

Is his left ear pierced, or is that a freckle?

If I slept on brown and yellow stained sheets all the time, I'd probably look like him too. Why couldn't he use the Tide way back then to wash his sheets? Ha ha.

I'm scared to write stuff that would tick Brad off. He could probably find me!

momto3kids
08-15-2008, 12:34 AM
Whether BC did it or not, I sincerely believe it would not be in his best interests to be reading WS.

Bad for his emotional and mental health, don'tcha know.

Star12....I believe he is monitoring WS. What else has he got to do except wash his sheets?

Oh by the way BC, HT has a full stock of Tide on the shelf. I was there tonight to get some myself.

momto3kids
08-15-2008, 12:37 AM
Mom, I ain't goin' over to that scary house.

Wonder who paid for Nancy's final arrangements? (As in burial or cremation?) I don't recall hearing about that.

Probably sleeping on the couch with a baseball bat or a tennis racket. I betcha he is more scare than you NCNative. Watch out he will throw tennis balls at you if you knock on the door.
You will need to do this...:woohoo:

momto3kids
08-15-2008, 12:41 AM
RC...just had it confirmed the K&B user name I mentioned earlier....

IS the real mccoy! :Banane38:

jumpstreet
08-15-2008, 12:51 AM
If you mean once you go down the embankment off the road, not against the black barrier but where the area flattens out, old flowers are there. Is this the location you are asking about?


Thanks, and yes. The location of the old flowers was what I recall we had considered/assumed to presumably be the exact location of discovery. [ Only because the flowers seemed to be placed there intentionally - just off the road, down the embankment, somewhat to the left - matches description of location from WCSO, etc ]

It's of course not clear who left those (or the latter set), but obviously someone who cared. The original set (if it's correct they are in the exact location) would have to be someone who knew themselves (family) - or someone who was told by LE, or perhaps the person who made the discovery (that was no doubt very traumatic)).

OTOH, they could have been left there by a friend or someone just "guessing" as to the original location, or could have been someone who knew exactly.

fran
08-15-2008, 12:52 AM
That was taken during the 14 July presser at 630 - right before Nancy was found.

The man is flat ticked off with questions reporters are asking - they weren't shy about asking about that possible trip to the store at 4 am - he's ticked.

Was this the LAST presser he appeared at? :eek:
Kinda' like Scott Peterson at the ONE presser he was at, the reporters asked him about the 'fishing trip' and he stomped off all pizzy.:chicken:

Scott never allowed any questions again until AFTER LE brought Amber forward, then he made that fake tear on DS when he :liar:denied having anything to do with his sweet wife's disappearance.:bang:

Yeah, these guys all think they're Academy Award material with their 'fake' concerned gazes. They just don't get it, that people can see right through their BS, especially people who've never even met them.:loser:

Hey, BC, you need to keep those lites down low so your bill doesn't get too high. Thing$ might get a little tight now that you don't have Nancy to control your $pending! ;)

JMHO
fran

jumpstreet
08-15-2008, 12:53 AM
RC...just had it confirmed the K&B user name I mentioned earlier....

IS the real mccoy! :Banane38:

Not doubting, but I'm totally amazed if this is the case. Amazed they would use the name of the firm as their username, amazed they would make any posts at all (vs merely lurk). Very bizarre. (like many other things about this case... almost unbelievably bizarre)

fran
08-15-2008, 12:58 AM
Whether BC did it or not, I sincerely believe it would not be in his best interests to be reading WS.

Bad for his emotional and mental health, don'tcha know.

ditto!

JMHO
fran

:Banane19:

Yeah! YOU!

:aktion033: Go work out instead! ;)

momto3kids
08-15-2008, 12:58 AM
Quoting myself here, but in the Photos thread, the slideshow in Post #5, Photo 22. Brad.

I would love for ya'll to take a little bit of time and just look at that photo. The eyes, the mouth.

Tell us your what you see. Your impressions.

He is playing over and over in his mind what he has left to clean and what else he needs to do to cover his tracks. He has just realized this was harder to do than he expected.:eek:

fran
08-15-2008, 01:01 AM
I was speaking with my BIL tonight about this case and the whole POI/Suspect thing, he's a sgt. on our police force. He said basically the same thing JTF. In his words it would taint the trial.

He doesn't need an 'official label' of POI. The invisible one seems to fit him just fine.:waitasec:

IF he allegedly did it!:behindbar

JMHO
fran

momto3kids
08-15-2008, 01:02 AM
Not doubting, but I'm totally amazed if this is the case. Amazed they would use the name of the firm as their username, amazed they would make any posts at all (vs merely lurk). Very bizarre. (like many other things about this case... almost unbelievably bizarre)

H Kurtz it is assigned to. No posts, but certainly his email address. :crazy:

fran
08-15-2008, 01:06 AM
He is playing over and over in his mind what he has left to clean and what else he needs to do to cover his tracks. He has just realized this was harder to do than he expected.:eek:

Bet this is first time in his life he found all the education in the world couldn't teach what he needs to know.:waitasec:

Heck, he can't even get his story straight on WHAT TIME he went to HT!:bang:

Details.:rolleyes:

JMHO
fran

jumpstreet
08-15-2008, 01:06 AM
Quoting myself here, but in the Photos thread, the slideshow in Post #5, Photo 22. Brad.

I would love for ya'll to take a little bit of time and just look at that photo. The eyes, the mouth.

Tell us your what you see. Your impressions.

I'll be honest - when I first saw the replay of this press conference, and this extracted photo, my first impression (before all the affidavits/implications came out) was that he looked overwhelmed with sadness and grief, to the extent that he could barely move/function. It seemed that it was all he could do, and took all of the strength he could muster to get through that moment. That was my initial impression (FWIW).

momto3kids
08-15-2008, 01:06 AM
ditto!

JMHO
fran

:Banane19:

Yeah! YOU!

:aktion033: Go work out instead! ;)

That's where he should have gone to work out his aggression, but it is too late for that now.:bang:

fran
08-15-2008, 01:11 AM
I know a hairstylist/colorist who works at the salon there. She used to work at another salon. I haven't thought about asking her.

Oh you can bet the perp cleaned his shoes, tires and probably took himself through a carwash and vacuum. It's killing me not knowing Who Done It, officially.

Wonder IF he used part of that unaccounted for two hours BEFORE LE called him back to the house, to run his car through the car wash?:waitasec:

Wonder if he went to a self serve or hand wash?:confused:

I know our hand wash writes you license # down when taking your order.:eek:

Maybe he should run back to where he got the car cleaned and request a copy of his receipt.....Oh, no! wait,..........he better check if they have cameras. Don't want to have any surprises.:slap:

JMHO
fran

momto3kids
08-15-2008, 01:14 AM
I'll be honest - when I first saw the replay of this press conference, and this extracted photo, my first impression (before all the affidavits/implications came out) was that he looked overwhelmed with sadness and grief, to the extent that he could barely move/function. It seemed that it was all he could do, and took all of the strength he could muster to get through that moment. That was my initial impression (FWIW).

He could function...he was worn out mentally making sure he was kepting his story straight and believable.

maconrich
08-15-2008, 01:14 AM
His eyes and face/mouth are sending out mixed emotions imo. When you cover his eyes it's like he's smirking; but that's not what's showing in his eyes. Maybe like you said Mom, thinking back over things but trying not to let it show in his eyes and po'd like RC said. Something that I'm not getting a good read on but at least better then when I try to look at the whole picture.

Mom, you mean the little windows around the door are now covered??? TYI!

fran
08-15-2008, 01:17 AM
I'll be honest - when I first saw the replay of this press conference, and this extracted photo, my first impression (before all the affidavits/implications came out) was that he looked overwhelmed with sadness and grief, to the extent that he could barely move/function. It seemed that it was all he could do, and took all of the strength he could muster to get through that moment. That was my initial impression (FWIW).

Can I be honest?:rolleyes:

When I saw it, I immediately thought of Scott Peterson.:eek:

seriously, I did.

Why?:confused:

Because he kept pulling his hat down. That's exactly what SP did. Like he was trying to hide his eyes or something. Of course, it turned out he was trying to hide his face, so Amber wouldn't recognize him on tv.

With Brad, I think he didn't want anyone to see his eyes.

JMHO
fran

momto3kids
08-15-2008, 01:19 AM
His eyes and face/mouth are sending out mixed emotions imo. When you cover his eyes it's like he's smirking; but that's not what's showing in his eyes. Maybe like you said Mom, thinking back over things but trying not to let it show in his eyes and po'd like RC said. Something that I'm not getting a good read on but at least better then when I try to look at the whole picture.

Mom, you mean the little windows around the door are now covered??? TYI!

Yup...covered entirely. The window for the staircase...ADT sign window....is now pulled down to the sill, tight. Yes, the house is now closed off to any sunlight and tighter than a tick.
At least in :behindbar he might get a window...I don't know how they decide who gets one...maybe flip a coin?

maconrich
08-15-2008, 01:24 AM
Yup...covered entirely. The window for the staircase...ADT sign window....is now pulled down to the sill, tight. Yes, the house is now closed off to any sunlight and tighter than a tick.
At least in :behindbar he might get a window...I don't know how they decide who gets one...maybe flip a coin?

geesh, that's a little extreme. otoh, hope he gets outside and gets some fresh air while he still can.

Anderson
08-15-2008, 01:42 AM
H Kurtz it is assigned to. No posts, but certainly his email address. :crazy:

Is this on this forum or another one? Why would the personal email address be accessible?

fran
08-15-2008, 01:58 AM
Is this on this forum or another one? Why would the personal email address be accessible?

It's most likely on their profile at Websleuths. You can look it up yourself. At the top is a button for "Member's List." They're alphabetical.

HTH
fran

fran
08-15-2008, 01:59 AM
geesh, that's a little extreme. otoh, hope he gets outside and gets some fresh air while he still can.

Did you see this BC?;)

JMHO
fran

Anderson
08-15-2008, 02:09 AM
It's most likely on their profile at Websleuths. You can look it up yourself. At the top is a button for "Member's List." They're alphabetical.

HTH
fran

Thanks!

maconrich
08-15-2008, 02:44 AM
Did you see this BC?;)

JMHO
fran

and he also needs to think about how much better he'd feel if he'd snuggle up with a sensitive woman and tell her everything that's bothering him. I'm sure there's someone out there that he can trust... and they say confession is good for the soul...

ncnative
08-15-2008, 09:41 AM
:eek: What?

Those wussy little K&B guys on a WS message board to get their case lined up? They need to spend more time looking at themselves on the TV clips, where one of the K&B dudes was trying ever so hard to strut like the lawyer for the OJ Simpson trial did. (Can't remember the guy's name. He used to hold his head up too high, and too far back with a smirky, overconfident grin on his face.)

When I saw that short, wimpy K&B pair, with the one of them doing that I had to laugh. Shoot, anyone that's had a ballet class knows that isn't proper posture, with the head all thrown back and chin up in the air.

I'll have to check out their photos again to see if they (K&B) are wearing their dress shirt collars up high on their necks to try and make them appear taller.

K&B, NOTHING will help you there. Try to be yourselves, that's about all you can do without looking ridiculous. No struts down lawyer lane in front of the courthouse. It's wussy looking. Besides, Brad Cooper makes you two look like ants.:behindbar

ncnative
08-15-2008, 09:54 AM
In the photo mentioned of Brad on TV with his hat on...I'll add that he looks just like a narcissistic mental case would look after the fact. Like I said: Dissociated. SURLY. In need of a good opthalmologic surgeon too. Shame on his parents for not taking care of that boy's eye when he was a young one.

His daughters also show this eye problem in their photos, bless their tiny hearts. Will someone please notify the family in Canada to take these little girls to be evaluated for their amblyopia? It can be helped. Maybe K&B will get that message to Brad, knowing how caring Brad is for his daughters. Brad will jump right on it.

No wait. He won't. The daughters are carrying a trait of Brad's. This will appeal to his narcissistic mentality. He will want the girls to be branded for life with HIS Daddy Eye. :eye:

raisincharlie
08-15-2008, 10:00 AM
Wow - tough crowd. :) Gotta have defense lawyers to make the justice system work folks. It simply has to work or we are all in trouble. Part of the court room drama, beyond the case, is the lawyers and how well they act out their parts. Have to act like they are right no matter what. Its called bluff, smoke and mirrors, and some red herrings thrown in. I have to say I find them interesting, but I keep that store of nerf bricks within close reach so as not to do permanent damage to tv's, monitors, walls, and floors:crazy:

Topsail Girl
08-15-2008, 10:11 AM
Wow - tough crowd. :) Gotta have defense lawyers to make the justice system work folks. It simply has to work or we are all in trouble. Part of the court room drama, beyond the case, is the lawyers and how well they act out their parts. Have to act like they are right no matter what. Its called bluff, smoke and mirrors, and some red herrings thrown in. I have to say I find them interesting, but I keep that store of nerf bricks within close reach so as not to do permanent damage to tv's, monitors, walls, and floors:crazy:

Tooo funny RC - I have a nerf football (a Steelers one) that I keep handy for the games and for defense lawyers. Mornin' everyone. Looking forward to meeting some of you tomorrow. :blowkiss:

ncnative
08-15-2008, 10:16 AM
Yeah, well K&B's bluff smoke and mirrors in their courthouse strut reminds me of a cat trying to look intimidating and big right before a big catfight. They puff out their fur, arch their backs and do some really funny stuff. :bud:

raisincharlie
08-15-2008, 10:17 AM
Tooo funny RC - I have a nerf football (a Steelers one) that I keep handy for the games and for defense lawyers. Mornin' everyone. Looking forward to meeting some of you tomorrow. :blowkiss:

I'm sure glad that football is not an Eagles football... :shrug:

:poke: :poke: :poke:

raisincharlie
08-15-2008, 10:27 AM
Seal on warrants for house and cars extended until Monday:

http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/3385292/

Willoughby has until 1 p.m. Monday to file a motion for such a request. If he does not, the document will be released. If he does, Stephens will hold a hearing on the matter at 2:30 p.m.
Two other search warrants in the case are also under seal and could be released later this month.

maconrich
08-15-2008, 10:31 AM
In the photo mentioned of Brad on TV with his hat on...I'll add that he looks just like a narcissistic mental case would look after the fact. Like I said: Dissociated. SURLY. In need of a good opthalmologic surgeon too. Shame on his parents for not taking care of that boy's eye when he was a young one.

His daughters also show this eye problem in their photos, bless their tiny hearts. Will someone please notify the family in Canada to take these little girls to be evaluated for their amblyopia? It can be helped. Maybe K&B will get that message to Brad, knowing how caring Brad is for his daughters. Brad will jump right on it.

No wait. He won't. The daughters are carrying a trait of Brad's. This will appeal to his narcissistic mentality. He will want the girls to be branded for life with HIS Daddy Eye. :eye:

Please don't take this wrong - I love reading your posts and you have so many great thoughts, but at this point I tend to think BC's eye condition is the least of his problems. I mean his receding hairline is just so much more obvious than his eye ;)

Hope y'all have a great day!!

-- interesting on the warrants, RC. Not surprised and would guess they'll stay sealed past Monday???

Topsail Girl
08-15-2008, 10:39 AM
I'm sure glad that football is not an Eagles football... :shrug:

:poke: :poke: :poke:

Nope no eagles allowed in my house.

I bleed black and gold and Willie Parker is my favorite player. July of 2006 I was flying to Rochester NY and sat beside Willie Parker from RDU to Pittsburg. He was trying to be in stealth mode with his Ipod ear phones and hoodie pulled up tight around his face. Very nice young man, very polite and I was expressing to him how much I enjoyed watching him play. He was raised in a tiny little town in NC known for it's good football team and hosting a great high school band competition. He had been home to see family and friends. We talked about the high school team and band competitions as if he was any regular joe off the street. When we got to Pittsburgh we got off the plane and we walked to a gift shop where he autographed a magazine, a hat and a terrible towel for me. No one on the plane ever realized who he was except me. He thanked me for not letting on and shook my hand and jogged off. I will never forget it as long as I live. The funniest part about it all is when I first sat down in the seat next to him I thought to myself it was him but then blew it off because we weren't in first class and I thought I was just mistaken. Then I noticed his boarding pass. He had laid it in the seat while he was fiddling with the Ipod. I couldn't believe it. So I whispered to him (THANK GOD LOL) and told him he looked just like Willie Parker - he just smiled and held out his hand and said "I am" with his big toothy grin. I 'bout needed a change of pants right then and there. :crazy:

Star12
08-15-2008, 10:40 AM
Please don't take this wrong - I love reading your posts and you have so many great thoughts, but at this point I tend to think BC's eye condition is the least of his problems. I mean his receding hairline is just so much more obvious than his eye ;)

Hope y'all have a great day!!

-- interesting on the warrants, RC. Not surprised and would guess they'll stay sealed past Monday???

(cleaning tea off monitor regarding hairline...)

Seriously, though, my take on the photo is exhaustion, fear, and he seems right at the edge of an explosion, ready to lash out.

If I saw that look, I would verrrry quietly back out of the room.

raisincharlie
08-15-2008, 10:44 AM
Please don't take this wrong - I love reading your posts and you have so many great thoughts, but at this point I tend to think BC's eye condition is the least of his problems. I mean his receding hairline is just so much more obvious than his eye ;)

Hope y'all have a great day!!

-- interesting on the warrants, RC. Not surprised and would guess they'll stay sealed past Monday???


All Willoughby has to say is that the release of the warrants would hinder the investigation or harm a defendents right to a fair trial and Judge Stephens will extend the seal IMO. However, the opposing lawyers may have a point or two on the warrants for the house and cars, depending of course on what LE found/retreived from the house.

The other two - I do not believe they will be unsealed at all.

If Willoughby says it will prejudice a defendents right to a fair trial - he might as well name a POI since Brad Cooper owned the home and cars - something to watch for.

raisincharlie
08-15-2008, 10:58 AM
Always good to review different outlets:

http://www.newsobserver.com/front/story/1179143.html


The News & Observer has asked Stephens to release the documents. But District Attorney Colon Willoughby has indicated that he may ask that some portion of the documents remain sealed.

raisincharlie
08-15-2008, 11:08 AM
Topsail - I thought you would catch that :::shrug::: :crazy:

maconrich
08-15-2008, 11:09 AM
All Willoughby has to say is that the release of the warrants would hinder the investigation or harm a defendents right to a fair trial and Judge Stephens will extend the seal IMO. However, the opposing lawyers may have a point or two on the warrants for the house and cars, depending of course on what LE found/retreived from the house.

The other two - I do not believe they will be unsealed at all.

If Willoughby says it will prejudice a defendents right to a fair trial - he might as well name a POI since Brad Cooper owned the home and cars - something to watch for.

Gotcha, TY!! They'd be interesting to see but I sure wouldn't want anything to mess up the investigation! I'm not sure that seeing a list of things taken would be overly detrimental, but I guess that would depend on what they took. OTOH if they're really not looking at BC, I could see them releasing at least parts like you mention from the other article.

Star - I too would back outta a room!!

raisincharlie
08-15-2008, 11:19 AM
Gotcha, TY!! They'd be interesting to see but I sure wouldn't want anything to mess up the investigation! I'm not sure that seeing a list of things taken would be overly detrimental, but I guess that would depend on what they took. OTOH if they're really not looking at BC, I could see them releasing at least parts like you mention from the other article.

Star - I too would back outta a room!!

This is kind of a funny issue I think. Searching the house should be a normal and expected activity since Nancy did reside there. From that perspective sealing the warrants seems rather absurd on face value. However, the probable cause affidavits , not sure how the release could hinder the investigation but can surely understand the prejudicial potential. The same with the inventory of items siezed - not sure how that would hinder an investigation but again the prejudicial value may be more extreme.

We shall see but my quess is the affidavits for probable cause at least will remain sealed. The inventory 50 - 50. In the end all I see being unsealed is the warrant form itself, if anything is unsealed.

JMO

momto3kids
08-15-2008, 11:27 AM
All Willoughby has to say is that the release of the warrants would hinder the investigation or harm a defendents right to a fair trial and Judge Stephens will extend the seal IMO. However, the opposing lawyers may have a point or two on the warrants for the house and cars, depending of course on what LE found/retreived from the house.

The other two - I do not believe they will be unsealed at all.

If Willoughby says it will prejudice a defendents right to a fair trial - he might as well name a POI since Brad Cooper owned the home and cars - something to watch for.

Less than 2 weeks ago Judge Stephens wouldn't open them, IMO not now either. Willoughby is going to make sure of that. Stephens is the one who sat at his kitchen table signing for the SW, not to share :coffeeup:at 2am. These men are too intelligent to let this case slip thru their hands. BC knows what was taken from his house or at least should.

K&B are probably lining up what subpoena's they want to do next. They're getting so impatient they'll try for the DNA before its ready. With them nothing would surprise me.:rolleyes:

raisincharlie
08-15-2008, 11:27 AM
I see WRAL has updated in the last few minutes with the following

http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/3385292/

Willoughby has asked that no part of the warrants be released, saying that keeping the information private now is crucial to the investigation.

KTaylorsc
08-15-2008, 11:29 AM
Hi all! I see nothing new happening.

raisincharlie
08-15-2008, 11:37 AM
Less than 2 weeks ago Judge Stephens wouldn't open them, IMO not now either. Willoughby is going to make sure of that. Stephens is the one who sat at his kitchen table signing for the SW, not to share :coffeeup:at 2am. These men are too intelligent to let this case slip thru their hands. BC knows what was taken from his house or at least should.

K&B are probably lining up what subpoena's they want to do next. They're getting so impatient they'll try for the DNA before its ready. With them nothing would surprise me.:rolleyes:

I don't disagree but for the sake of looking PC - the Judge might release the warrant form - not much of anything can be gleaned from the form.

Either way - no matter what excuse Willoughby uses, and I agree he will get his way, he is providing information. Crucial to the investigation - how can it be crucial - only if something was found to indicate a crime occurred in the house or is related to the cars. Prejudicial - only one person it can prejudice if you think about it.

Then there is that pesky part about DNA -

Star12
08-15-2008, 11:38 AM
I see WRAL has updated in the last few minutes with the following

http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/3385292/

Willoughby has asked that no part of the warrants be released, saying that keeping the information private now is crucial to the investigation.

I think that is sloppy wral writing. I think that is a rehash of last month's hearing, and that Willoughby has yet to make his request (file) known.

Pretty sure we won't know anything about the documents on Monday, though.

But, question. If releasing the documents would be prejudicial, how is not releasing them not prejudicial? My mind tells me there is something there...:waitasec:

raisincharlie
08-15-2008, 11:39 AM
I think that is sloppy wral writing. I think that is a rehash of last month's hearing, and that Willoughby has yet to make his request (file) known.

Pretty sure we won't know anything about the documents on Monday, though.

But, question. If releasing the documents would be prejudicial, how is not releasing them not prejudicial? My mind tells me there is something there...:waitasec:

uh huh - bingo :)

I suppose one could argue the "crucial" by saying nothing was found but seems to me - all those pictures of LE carrying stuff out of the house does not quite support that arguement. Lot of stuff hauled in.

momto3kids
08-15-2008, 11:43 AM
Wow - tough crowd. :) Gotta have defense lawyers to make the justice system work folks. It simply has to work or we are all in trouble. Part of the court room drama, beyond the case, is the lawyers and how well they act out their parts. Have to act like they are right no matter what. Its called bluff, smoke and mirrors, and some red herrings thrown in. I have to say I find them interesting, but I keep that store of nerf bricks within close reach so as not to do permanent damage to tv's, monitors, walls, and floors:crazy:

:Jumpie: doing this act will bring distraction, but he has to do something to be seen. Maybe they will bring a ladder so Blum can be raised to a height that Judge Stephens can see them without having to lean forward the entire case.:crazy:

I can see it now Judge Stephens keeps telling Blum to stand and he keeps telling him, I am Judge!

citygirl
08-15-2008, 12:52 PM
Topsail - I thought you would catch that :::shrug::: :crazy:

I caught it. It gave me the "stupid" chills.:crazy:

MoonFlwr
08-15-2008, 12:57 PM
No wait. He won't. The daughters are carrying a trait of Brad's. This will appeal to his narcissistic mentality. He will want the girls to be branded for life with HIS Daddy Eye. :eye:

man ...that's filling in a lot of gaps with assumption!

raisincharlie
08-15-2008, 12:58 PM
I caught it. It gave me the "stupid" chills.:crazy:


:floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

The devil made me do it...:slap: (me this side)

ncnative
08-15-2008, 01:20 PM
No, Moonflower, the girls did get Brad's "eye" ailment. I didn't assume that.

Trivia alert! I went by Brad Cooper's on my way to and from my physical therapy appt. today. His car is in a different place than a few days ago. Now it's up closer to the garage door. Either someone (he, or who?) is living there, or someone is playing musical cars to keep us entertained on WS. :beamup:

MoonFlwr
08-15-2008, 01:22 PM
No, Moonflower, the girls did get Brad's "eye" ailment. I didn't assume that.



Wasn't that part I was talking about.

FullDisclosure
08-15-2008, 01:25 PM
Wasn't that part I was talking about.

Seriously....Sheesh. :rolleyes: I totally agree, MoonFlwr.

carolinalady
08-15-2008, 01:31 PM
No, Moonflower, the girls did get Brad's "eye" ailment. I didn't assume that.

Trivia alert! I went by Brad Cooper's on my way to and from my physical therapy appt. today. His car is in a different place than a few days ago. Now it's up closer to the garage door. Either someone (he, or who?) is living there, or someone is playing musical cars to keep us entertained on WS. :beamup:

I'm sorry, but have we seen some medical documentation or is this going on some photographs of the girls? I am asking this b/c even if it looks like they have it in a picture doesn't mean they do. I'm sure a pediatrician would have noted it and referred them to a specialist.

Topsail Girl
08-15-2008, 01:34 PM
Topsail - I thought you would catch that :::shrug::: :crazy:

I caught it :crazy: I just love my cat, don't you?

momto3kids
08-15-2008, 01:34 PM
No, Moonflower, the girls did get Brad's "eye" ailment. I didn't assume that.

Trivia alert! I went by Brad Cooper's on my way to and from my physical therapy appt. today. His car is in a different place than a few days ago. Now it's up closer to the garage door. Either someone (he, or who?) is living there, or someone is playing musical cars to keep us entertained on WS. :beamup:

I am pretty much sure he is there....otherwise I don't think he would have all the lights on like he did Wednesday nite (save $$), all the blinds shut tighter than a tick....

Is the Cary newspaper still in plastic on his front lawn? If it is gone then I assume he got it and is there. Ya know he wants to see if he is on the front page and keep up on the Cary news :laughbounce::laughbounce:

Topsail Girl
08-15-2008, 01:36 PM
RC or anyone who knows, can I post a pic her or just a link? Is it against TOS to post a picture directly in this thread?

raisincharlie
08-15-2008, 01:37 PM
RC or anyone who knows, can I post a pic her or just a link? Is it against TOS to post a picture directly in this thread?

Don't know about TOS but for bandwidth reasons I would say a link is best. Haven't seen pictures posted to be honest - just links.

Topsail Girl
08-15-2008, 01:40 PM
K thanks!! Someone asked for a pic of Scott Heider on one of the threads.

link removed to get someone elses panties out of a wad

Topsail Girl
08-15-2008, 01:44 PM
I caught it. It gave me the "stupid" chills.:crazy:


OMG now that's funny!!!! :cool2:

ncnative
08-15-2008, 01:48 PM
Topsail Girl, are you friends with Scott? Looks like a photo at a beach cottage for sure, while we're at it.

Topsail Girl
08-15-2008, 02:02 PM
I'm not friends with him and this is him at the outer banks at a rented beach house with his sons. I kept only a few of the pics that I saw and now for the life of me I can't find the link.

momto3kids
08-15-2008, 02:26 PM
Yes, Lifetime Fitness - I definitely appreciate all the info on that - all the ammenities, cameras, check in procedures, dumpsters, cafes and so on. There is something about that place...just gotta figure out what it is.

I feel the same RC. It just makes no sense to me why go there when you can simply call. He knew NC couldn't get in with no ID card. He states, she carried nothing with her at all but sometimes a stick of gum...how did he think she got in to LTF?

She had other plans following her jog, why would he think she went there instead of helping JA paint? It has been said he punished her for making $$ by painting, so now she had no choice but to paint Saturday if she wanted any $$ for the week.

LTF was IMO a way to show he was looking for NC because no where else he could have gone within her jogging area to prove he was looking. So this poor lady he spoke to now is being drawn into this case. :rolleyes:

raisincharlie
08-15-2008, 02:34 PM
I feel the same RC. It just makes no sense to me why go there when you can simply call. He knew NC couldn't get in with no ID card. He states, she carried nothing with her at all but sometimes a stick of gum...how did he think she got in to LTF?

She had other plans following her jog, why would he think she went there instead of helping JA paint? It has been said he punished her for making $$ by painting, so now she had no choice but to paint Saturday if she wanted any $$ for the week.

LTF was IMO a way to show he was looking for NC because no where else he could have gone within her jogging area to prove he was looking. So this poor lady he spoke to now is being drawn into this case. :rolleyes:

I think a phone call would have worked as well Mt3K - and the looking for Nancy part - I question what he thought he could see of the running trails from a vehicle to begin with. Just trying to be logical - I don't see how he could have believed he could tell anything about the trails. Then from reading posters responses - it does not seem that LTF is exactly on the way to Carey's house. JMO, it kind of smells funny and for some reason the trip to LTF has my hinky meter through the roof - as you say, according to Brad all Nancy took running was a stick of gum.

Skittles
08-15-2008, 02:49 PM
There is one thing about Lifetime fitness that fits in. If Nancy did go out jogging, she could have gone all way down Lochmere Drive (has sidewalk or trail the whole way) to where it ends on Crescent Green Drive which has a nice trail alongside it. If she went on that trail, there is a spur off the trail that leads directly into the LTF back parking lot. This would be a shortcut to get to Regency Park that is less isolated than cutting through Ritter Park and taking the greenway trail through Hemlock Bluffs. It is longer to take the Crescent Green route, but if she did I would think she would take that spur trail rather than go out by Tryon Rd.

So, logically Brad could have gone to LTF to check out their back lot.

fran
08-15-2008, 02:57 PM
I think a phone call would have worked as well Mt3K - and the looking for Nancy part - I question what he thought he could see of the running trails from a vehicle to begin with. Just trying to be logical - I don't see how he could have believed he could tell anything about the trails. Then from reading posters responses - it does not seem that LTF is exactly on the way to Carey's house. JMO, it kind of smells funny and for some reason the trip to LTF has my hinky meter through the roof - as you say, according to Brad all Nancy took running was a stick of gum.

I agree with you about the LFT visit. In addition to that, I'd like to know just where the heck he was for over two hours driving around Cary allegedly looking for Nancy? IMO, the distance that he could look by car, even counting all three known usual jogging routes of Nancy, stopping by LTF AND Carey's to boot, shouldn't have taken even ONE hour.

Wonder what he was doing for so long?
Wonder why he didn't want Jessica to come to their home to watch the girls?
Wonder why he's changed the time Nancy allegedly left to go running from 6:30 to 7:00?
Wonder what allegedly took so long for Brad to become concerned that something may have happened to Nancy? She did have a medical condition and could have been hospitalized or fallen unconcious by the side of the trail. It was Brad's own words that Nancy wouldn't be out of touch at the most two hours. Yet,.............he waited from 6:30-7:00 until 1????:eek:

Puzzling, :waitasec:IMHO,
fran

Topsail Girl
08-15-2008, 02:59 PM
Actually Fran he waited from 6:30-7:00 until he got questioned and knew the gig was up. IMO

raisincharlie
08-15-2008, 03:02 PM
There is one thing about Lifetime fitness that fits in. If Nancy did go out jogging, she could have gone all way down Lochmere Drive (has sidewalk or trail the whole way) to where it ends on Crescent Green Drive which has a nice trail alongside it. If she went on that trail, there is a spur off the trail that leads directly into the LTF back parking lot. This would be a shortcut to get to Regency Park that is less isolated than cutting through Ritter Park and taking the greenway trail through Hemlock Bluffs. It is longer to take the Crescent Green route, but if she did I would think she would take that spur trail rather than go out by Tryon Rd.

So, logically Brad could have gone to LTF to check out their back lot.

I can see this. There would be no need to go in as Nancy didn't carry anything with her while jogging and based on members of the club that have posted here - it is doubtful she would have gained access without her card or at least some identification. Le reported there were no sightings of her so it is reasonable to assume she did not enter Lifetime on the 12th.

fran
08-15-2008, 03:02 PM
Actually Fran he waited from 6:30-7:00 until her got questioned and knew the gig was up. IMO

Maybe time flew by quickly because he was so busy cleaning house, doing wash, watching the two little ones,............oh a woman's work is just NEVER done!;)

JMHO
fran

momto3kids
08-15-2008, 03:03 PM
There is one thing about Lifetime fitness that fits in. If Nancy did go out jogging, she could have gone all way down Lochmere Drive (has sidewalk or trail the whole way) to where it ends on Crescent Green Drive which has a nice trail alongside it. If she went on that trail, there is a spur off the trail that leads directly into the LTF back parking lot. This would be a shortcut to get to Regency Park that is less isolated than cutting through Ritter Park and taking the greenway trail through Hemlock Bluffs. It is longer to take the Crescent Green route, but if she did I would think she would take that spur trail rather than go out by Tryon Rd.

So, logically Brad could have gone to LTF to check out their back lot.


Skittles...he claims he went into LTF to ask about her. How in the heck did he do it...my wife is this tall, hair this color, etc? There is NO photo on the ID I understand.

A--If LTF gives out the information to him with no problem he could have called.
B--He knows she couldn't enter without an ID at all. He states she didn't carry anything on her to jog.
C--By the time he arrived to look in any parking lot hours had past since she left home. If anything happened to her she would have contacted him or a friend.
D--We didn't hear him state he called the hospital. Since she had no ID that is the 1st place he should have called.

IMO this is highly suspicious. His activity from the time he left home to the time LE called him.

Topsail Girl
08-15-2008, 03:03 PM
Maybe time flew by quickly because he was so busy cleaning house, doing wash, watching the two little ones,............oh a woman's work is just NEVER done!;)

JMHO
fran


Never I'll tell you!!!! :)

fran
08-15-2008, 03:04 PM
I can see this. There would be no need to go in as Nancy didn't carry anything with her while jogging and based on members of the club that have posted here - it is doubtful she would have gained access without her card or at least some identification.

Well alrighty then! It seems old Brad MAY have gone to LTF to make an appearance that he was (allegedly ;)) looking for his dear wife.

Wonder where else he went during that more than two hourse, that he did NOT want witnesses?:eek::confused:

JMHO
fran

Anderson
08-15-2008, 03:09 PM
Well alrighty then! It seems old Brad MAY have gone to LTF to make an appearance that he was (allegedly ;)) looking for his dear wife.

Wonder where else he went during that more than two hourse, that he did NOT want witnesses?:eek::confused:

JMHO
fran

IMO, that is a very good question. Also, didn't he say that he stopped IN at LTF? He didn't say that he went there to look around the back parking lot. I could be wrong, though.

CyberPro
08-15-2008, 03:15 PM
Trivia report: had to ride by BCooper's home about 20 min. ago. His white BMW was in the driveway. It must be really dark inside with all the blinds closed.

Colon Willoughby should have become a proctologist.

NCNATIVE,

Ohhh, I have to make a choice of witty responses here... having a bit of a hard time with it. If you were me would you pick:

1. I suspect that BC agrees with you on that

or

2. I think that BC will think Willoughby IS a proctologist by the time he is finished with him.

CyberPro

fran
08-15-2008, 03:16 PM
Skittles...he claims he went into LTF to ask about her. How in the heck did he do it...my wife is this tall, hair this color, etc? There is NO photo on the ID I understand.

A--If LTF gives out the information to him with no problem he could have called.
B--He knows she couldn't enter without an ID at all. He states she didn't carry anything on her to jog.
C--By the time he arrived to look in any parking lot hours had past since she left home. If anything happened to her she would have contacted him or a friend.
D--We didn't hear him state he called the hospital. Since she had no ID that is the 1st place he should have called.

IMO this is highly suspicious. His activity from the time he left home to the time LE called him.

He musta' gotten this from the Scott Peterson play book:


Wife missing, check.

Run washing machine, check.

Contact 1 or 2 of wife's friends to display concern, check

Deny friends or family to meet up at your house, check

Leave house and do NOT call hospitals, check...........oh, wait, he SHOULD HAVE CALLED THE HOSPITAL before he left home! RED FLAG ALERT ;)

Let at least ONE person see you as the (allegedly) conerned husband looking for his missing wife, check...

Go to the park, wandering aimlessly for your missing wife........or drive aimlessly,....check

Uhhh.........doesn't work for me. :rolleyes:

Didn't work for Scott Peterson either, check

JMHO and FACT :)
fran

raisincharlie
08-15-2008, 03:24 PM
Well alrighty then! It seems old Brad MAY have gone to LTF to make an appearance that he was (allegedly ;)) looking for his dear wife.

Wonder where else he went during that more than two hourse, that he did NOT want witnesses?:eek::confused:

JMHO
fran


The car wash :rolleyes:

Skittles
08-15-2008, 03:27 PM
Are these photos of the same Scott? These are all supposed to be pictures of athlete 647 in this race, listed as Scott Heider. If you enlarge the photos you can see "Scott" on his racing number.

http://www.asiorders.com/view_user_event.asp?EVENTID=13991&BIB=647&LNSEARCH=1


ETA: Crap, this was supposed to go in the astrology thread, oh well.

Onescout
08-15-2008, 03:44 PM
The car wash :rolleyes:

Hi guys,

Geez, I go outa town and hoped when I came back, maybe,maybe someone was charged!

Anyway, love all the theories on WHY BC drove around for soooooo long with those girls...so far here's what I've seen ....

1) Car wash (love this)
2) Disposing of something
3) Being seen as "looking" for Nancy
4) Coaching the girls on what to say
5) My personal theory, buying time, possibly considering bolting and then thinking better of it.

If /when he is charged, this will be something the prosecution will focus on...you know how they love timelines!

This is one of the many things BC did that make him look very suspicious.
...

Topsail Girl
08-15-2008, 03:44 PM
Skittles according to this link that is Scott Heider - I looked up his jersey number

http://ironman.com/assets/files/results/arizona/2007.htm

ETA He finished 244th

Anderson
08-15-2008, 03:50 PM
Are these photos of the same Scott? These are all supposed to be pictures of athlete 647 in this race, listed as Scott Heider. If you enlarge the photos you can see "Scott" on his racing number.

http://www.asiorders.com/view_user_event.asp?EVENTID=13991&BIB=647&LNSEARCH=1


ETA: Crap, this was supposed to go in the astrology thread, oh well.

Thanks Skittles. I believe that Scott was the only other person besides BC to describe Nancy as a story teller who often exaggerated. It still seems so odd to me for both Brad and Scott to speak this way about a wife/friend who has just been killed. I suppose that they felt this would be the only way that they could respond to the affidavits of NC's friends. Still, all just thoughts.

IMO

Skittles
08-15-2008, 03:52 PM
Skittles...he claims he went into LTF to ask about her. How in the heck did he do it...my wife is this tall, hair this color, etc? There is NO photo on the ID I understand.

A--If LTF gives out the information to him with no problem he could have called.
B--He knows she couldn't enter without an ID at all. He states she didn't carry anything on her to jog.
C--By the time he arrived to look in any parking lot hours had past since she left home. If anything happened to her she would have contacted him or a friend.
D--We didn't hear him state he called the hospital. Since she had no ID that is the 1st place he should have called.

IMO this is highly suspicious. His activity from the time he left home to the time LE called him.

Oh I agree this is suspicious. I doubt she ever went running. But he could have had a reason to think she might have run that path, and gone into check at the front desk while he was there.

I don't understand your emphasis on no photo on the ID at LTF. He has an ID; it's a family membership. He could ask them to check the computer to see if she checked in (although why she would go in at all is a mystery). They do have your photo on the computer when they run the ID through.

Skittles
08-15-2008, 04:06 PM
Skittles according to this link that is Scott Heider - I looked up his jersey number

http://ironman.com/assets/files/results/arizona/2007.htm

ETA He finished 244th

Yes, I had seen that. Just wasn't sure it wasn't some other Scott Heider.

raisincharlie
08-15-2008, 04:31 PM
Hi guys,

Geez, I go outa town and hoped when I came back, maybe,maybe someone was charged!

Anyway, love all the theories on WHY BC drove around for soooooo long with those girls...so far here's what I've seen ....

1) Car wash (love this)
2) Disposing of something
3) Being seen as "looking" for Nancy
4) Coaching the girls on what to say
5) My personal theory, buying time, possibly considering bolting and then thinking better of it.

If /when he is charged, this will be something the prosecution will focus on...you know how they love timelines!

This is one of the many things BC did that make him look very suspicious.
...

I thought about number 5 on your list - buying time in particular. I suspect if this was part of it, he figured he could hold off anymore questions from JA by saying he was out looking and I suspect he didn't think she would call 911, and definitiely not as quick as she did.

But I also suspect when LE called him to return to the house, he may have visited that car wash again - it was too late to run at that point. :crazy:

momto3kids
08-15-2008, 05:04 PM
Oh I agree this is suspicious. I doubt she ever went running. But he could have had a reason to think she might have run that path, and gone into check at the front desk while he was there.

I don't understand your emphasis on no photo on the ID at LTF. He has an ID; it's a family membership. He could ask them to check the computer to see if she checked in (although why she would go in at all is a mystery). They do have your photo on the computer when they run the ID through.

Skittles...with no photo on his ID, I would think he would have to present his ID to obtain information about a guest. Wife or not, the lady at the desk doesn't know the circumstances. Once scanned his photo comes up at LTF to confirm it is him. Then possibly they would tell him.

But, if they give information freely about their guests with no ID required, then he could have just made a phone call.

Skittles
08-15-2008, 05:11 PM
Skittles...with no photo on his ID, I would think he would have to present his ID to obtain information about a guest. Wife or not, the lady at the desk doesn't know the circumstances. Once scanned his photo comes up at LTF to confirm it is him. Then possibly they would tell him.

But, if they give information freely about their guests with no ID required, then he could have just made a phone call.

I see what you mean. I'm guessing he would need to present an ID. Maybe if he called they would accept his CallerID info for sufficiently identifying him, though.