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krimekat
08-19-2008, 11:56 AM
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/community/news/conway/orl-caylee2008jul20,0,2486087.story

there was a car seat was in the car . . . although the above link was from 20 July, Padilla (LE, not BH) said a child's car seat was found in the Pontiac. Also from the article, "The white 1998 Pontiac was towed June 30 from an Amscot Financial store at Colonial Drive and Goldenrod Road, said sheriff's spokesman Carlos Padilla.

"It had been with the wrecker a while before the family found out," Padilla said."

Posting this specific thread to help fellow posters who do not know if a car seat was found in the 98 Pontiac. REDACTED

krimekat
08-19-2008, 12:01 PM
I am blaming the media for NOT checking their facts before reporting . . . :mad:

krimekat
08-19-2008, 12:05 PM
No car seat? What are they talking about?

From the Orlando Sentinel, July 20th.
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/community/news/conway/orl-caylee2008jul20,0,2486087.story

NG show needs fact checkers . . .

tttterri
08-19-2008, 12:56 PM
Thanks for the info. I didnt know about Googling for past info on these threads and I did not know where to find that link that stated the car seat was found although I knew it had been said! Helpful info!

krimekat
08-19-2008, 01:03 PM
I typically use the Search function this forum provides in the tool bar, and if that is not helpful, I open another Explorer Window and Google the info . . . which usually leads me to one of Orlando's media outlets which have timelines, pictures, and such . . .

During Nancy Grace last night (18 Aug) it was stated the car seat ws not located . . . which is misinformation according to OCPD:bang:

JBean
08-19-2008, 01:38 PM
Thanks for setting the record straight on this. I have read most evreything here and i was confused by the conflicting reports on the car seat.

Devorahhh
08-19-2008, 05:35 PM
I live in Orlando and I remember reading about the car seat. Can't remember all the details, but I DO remember that they stated the seat did not have any signs death in it.

Devorahhh

NighTillDawn
08-19-2008, 05:54 PM
But if ZG has Caylee, you know the babysitter, wouldn't she need the car seat? Maybe ZG doesn't drive...stupid me, I should know these things.

krimekat
08-19-2008, 07:56 PM
But if ZG has Caylee, you know the babysitter, wouldn't she need the car seat? Maybe ZG doesn't drive...stupid me, I should know these things.

gets around on a magic carpet

ThoughtFox
08-19-2008, 07:59 PM
gets around on a magic carpet

No, something more appropriate for a flying imaginary nanny:


Zanny Poppins
http://www.alexloveseverything.com/uploaded_images/poppins4-715158.jpg

*Sometimes we just have to laugh, or we'll go crazy* :bang:

AutomaticAuttie
08-19-2008, 08:15 PM
no, something more appropriate for a flying imaginary nanny:


zanny poppins
http://www.alexloveseverything.com/uploaded_images/poppins4-715158.jpg

*sometimes we just have to laugh, or we'll go crazy* :bang:

:) lol :)

krimekat
08-20-2008, 01:56 PM
Car seat was found in the car Casey drove . . .


http://www.orlandosentinel.com/community/news/conway/orl-caylee2008jul20,0,2486087.story

there was a car seat was in the car . . . although the above link was from 20 July, Padilla (LE, not BH) said a child's car seat was found in the Pontiac. Also from the article, "The white 1998 Pontiac was towed June 30 from an Amscot Financial store at Colonial Drive and Goldenrod Road, said sheriff's spokesman Carlos Padilla.

"It had been with the wrecker a while before the family found out," Padilla said."

Posting this specific thread to help fellow posters who do not know if a car seat was found in the 98 Pontiac. REDACTED

krimekat
08-20-2008, 02:00 PM
Hey, everybody!!! There was a car seat found in the car casey was driving that was towed

manatee
08-20-2008, 02:08 PM
Hey, everybody!!! There was a car seat found in the car casey was driving that was towed

:clap:
"CAR SEAT WAS FOUND IN CAR"!!!!
thought we should make double sure everyone heard
:)

krimekat
08-20-2008, 02:14 PM
Let's keep the posters honest, manatee -- that's why the thread was started

manatee rocks!!! :rocker:

pregodego2
08-20-2008, 05:04 PM
please explain why Padilla would be mentioned in an article dated july 20th?

krimekat
08-20-2008, 05:07 PM
please explain why Padilla would be mentioned in an article dated july 20th?

The Padilla in the article is Carlos Padilla, Deputy & OC Sheriff Dept spokesman.

JBean
08-20-2008, 05:08 PM
Have they found the car seat yet?




This is a joke. </sigh>

krimekat
08-20-2008, 05:12 PM
Hey, JBean . . . check out my RANT . . . :rocker:

it is in the appropriate thread . . .

JBean
08-20-2008, 05:14 PM
Hey, JBean . . . check out my RANT . . .

it is in the appropriate thread . . .
been there done that:rocker:

krimekat
08-20-2008, 05:16 PM
Have they found the car seat yet?




This is a joke. </sigh>

JBean Rocks!!! :rocker:

Isn't is sad you must "say" it is in jest!!!?

krimekat
08-20-2008, 05:21 PM
been there done that:rocker:

how do you remain "chill"? You old wise old with 29,174 posts

BondJamesBond
09-06-2008, 10:49 PM
Saw it asked in another thread and have been wondering same...

Pic we've all seen of Caylee in a gray carseat w/ "Eddie B." liner is in a car w/ a gray interior. I can't tell if that is the Pontiac, or another car.

Anyone seen decent pics of the interior of the other Anthony cars? Other pics of Caylee around one of the cars w/ a glimpse of a different carseat in it?

lizzysf
10-22-2009, 11:56 AM
Saw it asked in another thread and have been wondering same...

Pic we've all seen of Caylee in a gray carseat w/ "Eddie B." liner is in a car w/ a gray interior. I can't tell if that is the Pontiac, or another car.

Anyone seen decent pics of the interior of the other Anthony cars? Other pics of Caylee around one of the cars w/ a glimpse of a different carseat in it?After reading Cindy's depo..I think the carseat has become an issue and is worth re-sleuthing. The state is very interested in the 2 carseats. Cindy claims she has hers still in the attic. They are both Eddie Bauer carseats. The pic of Caylee in the car is in a black and grey eddie bauer (not black and white as Cindy claims) and it is Caseys car. If you look at Exhibit #9 in the depo (colored version provided by Musikman)
you can see the window panel is the same line and same color, and you can see the back window so it can't be Cindy's 4Runner. I am wondering if Cindy switched the carseats before LE impounded the car.

Woe.be.gone
10-22-2009, 12:01 PM
bumping - some very observant sleuthers theorize that there are two EB carseats that may have been changed out, that is, the one from CA's car was placed into the Pontiac. Where is the other carseat now? Could it be a source of evidence?

lizzysf, I didn't know you were here - great!

The Eunice Burns
10-22-2009, 12:19 PM
After reading Cindy's depo..I think the carseat has become an issue and is worth re-sleuthing. The state is very interested in the 2 carseats. Cindy claims she has hers still in the attic. They are both Eddie Bauer carseats. The pic of Caylee in the car is in a black and grey eddie bauer (not black and white as Cindy claims) and it is Caseys car. If you look at Exhibit #9 in the depo (colored version provided by Musikman)
you can see the window panel is the same line and same color, and you can see the back window so it can't be Cindy's 4Runner. I am wondering if Cindy switched the carseats before LE impounded the car.

lizzy, thanks for the bump. The attic---why of all places would someone put an item like that in the attic? (rhetorical question......) The garage was out---LE was all over the garage. Back porch, yard, etc......anywhere highly visible. IMO, if that seat is in the attic it was to try and keep it from LE as long as possible. I think she incriminated herself by claming it's in the attic, b/c she knew anything Caylee used on a regular basis would be important for LE and the FBI to examine, so why stash something like that in the attic? She was hiding it. And I think you are onto something......she could have easily switched the seats. Did SB from Johnson's notice anything about the car seat? (It's been so long since I read his LE interview and I think this case has short circuited some of my memory.....) I think I will review that......just to see......

Woe.be.gone
10-22-2009, 12:27 PM
Here are the results of the tests done on the carseat that was taken by OSCO and forwarded to the FBI for testing.

http://www.wesh.com/download/2009/0929/21147593.pdf

lizzysf
10-22-2009, 12:48 PM
Here are the results of the tests done on the carseat that was taken by OSCO and forwarded to the FBI for testing.

http://www.wesh.com/download/2009/0929/21147593.pdf

All it notes is that item Q45 (carseat) is being stored. It then says in a written communication that they will visually look at it for stains. Then further down it asks "shall we vacuum the carseat for samples?" And then further down again it says nothing has been done with the carseat or passenger seat of the car. There are no carseat results.


Why is OSCO interested in Cindy's carseat now in Aug 09 on the depo? Why are they questioning her as to whether she still has it?

AZlawyer
10-22-2009, 01:00 PM
I have looked at the photo of Caylee in the carseat in Casey's car, and the photo of the carseat in the back of the car after Cindy and George retrieved it. They look like the same carseat to me--black and gray Eddie Bauer. What is the reason we think that the carseats might have been switched?

lizzysf
10-22-2009, 01:03 PM
Why in the depo does Cindy say Casey's car seat is black and white when you can see in the photo of Caylee in the car in the Eddie Bauer carseat it is clearly black and charcoal grey? She is disassociating herself from knowledge of what the carseat looks like. It clearly has Eddie Bauer written acro9ss the seat in plain sight.. and if Cindy's carseat is also Eddie Bauer you think she would know this information, yet in the depo she claims not to remember the brand on Caseys. Read depo Part I pages 68-69. There is definetely something going on. They are asking here questions that I think would indicate they are comparing her answers to a picture they have.. I totally think she switched carseats.
I think we will see George as the back-up alibi on the carseat...he changes his story about the last time he saw Casey and Caylee from...said goodbye, they left...to... walked them out and helped her into the car. Expect to hear from George which carseat he saw in the car that day.

Woe.be.gone
10-22-2009, 01:05 PM
On the last page of the link above, page No. 8417, there is a description of the car seat that was turned over to the FBI by OSCO.
It reads:

Q47 car seat
(plastic side surface)

One black/gray/red "Eddie Bauer" child's car seat, worn.

Faint Brown areas throughout.

Please note that the Q47 number is the one assigned by the FBI. Another identifying number exists (Q45 from property form H-52025) which was assigned by OSCO. JWG explained once how the FBI assigns new numbers for their system. Also I read that OSCO had not processed the car seat in any way - "nothing had been done to it" - other than to box it loose and send it to the FBI (item #30 on a list).

There is a Chain of Custody Log that indicates when the car seat was taken in and out of the Evidence Storage location.

Woe.be.gone
10-22-2009, 01:10 PM
All it notes is that item Q45 (carseat) is being stored. It then says in a written communication that they will visually look at it for stains. Then further down it asks "shall we vacuum the carseat for samples?" And then further down again it says nothing has been done with the carseat or passenger seat of the car. There are no carseat results.


Why is OSCO interested in Cindy's carseat now in Aug 09 on the depo? Why are they questioning her as to whether she still has it?

It is very tedious to read these reports and I, at least, cannot tell if they are inclusive, etc.

As I have posted above, I found a more thorough description of the carseat in custody of the FBI. How does this prove or despell our line of inquiry as to if it is the same carseat that was said to have been in KC's car all along?

lizzysf
10-22-2009, 01:12 PM
I have looked at the photo of Caylee in the carseat in Casey's car, and the photo of the carseat in the back of the car after Cindy and George retrieved it. They look like the same carseat to me--black and gray Eddie Bauer. What is the reason we think that the carseats might have been switched?
I looked too. A few theories. Either Cindy is lying about the colors of the 2 Eddie Bauer seats they owned, or the OSCO pic is not displaying very well that it could in fact be brown tones..like in the taupe range looking like it could be grey in the photo and not the "tan and brown" like Cindy calls it. I looked up Eddie Bauer carseats and have found many varieties in the taupe-looking color range. If you look at the light and dark values of both photos side by side, comparing each part of the seats, it does open that to question. Even with difference in lighting when the photos were taken. I bet both seats they purchased are the same Eddie Bauer model and purchased together... I don't believe her when she says in the depo that Casey purchased her own.

Woe.be.gone
10-22-2009, 01:16 PM
I have looked at the photo of Caylee in the carseat in Casey's car, and the photo of the carseat in the back of the car after Cindy and George retrieved it. They look like the same carseat to me--black and gray Eddie Bauer. What is the reason we think that the carseats might have been switched?

Just covering all the bases I guess.

lizzysf
10-22-2009, 01:16 PM
It is very tedious to read these reports and I, at least, cannot tell if they are inclusive, etc.

As I have posted above, I found a more thorough description of the carseat in custody of the FBI. How does this prove or despell our line of inquiry as to if it is the same carseat that was said to have been in KC's car all along?

Do you have a link to the more descriptive version of the carseat in OSCO's posession? I have looked and came up empty handed. Nothing at this point is proven or dispelled... but I do believe with the info in the depo, it is worth questioning.

AZlawyer
10-22-2009, 01:19 PM
On the last page of the link above, page No. 8417, there is a description of the car seat that was turned over to the FBI by OSCO.
It reads:

Q47 car seat
(plastic side surface)

One black/gray/red "Eddie Bauer" child's car seat, worn.

Faint Brown areas throughout.

Please note that the Q47 number is the one assigned by the FBI. Another identifying number exists (Q45 from property form H-52025) which was assigned by OSCO. JWG explained once how the FBI assigns new numbers for their system. Also I read that OSCO had not processed the car seat in any way - "nothing had been done to it" - other than to box it loose and send it to the FBI (item #30 on a list).

There is a Chain of Custody Log that indicates when the car seat was taken in and out of the Evidence Storage location.

OK, so the one LE took out of the car was black and gray, and the one in the pic of Caylee in Casey's car was black and gray, so there doesn't appear to have been any switch. If Cindy has a brown and tan one, it doesn't look like she put it in Casey's car. Cindy's claim that Casey's carseat was black and white is pretty obviously wrong, based on the picture of Caylee in the carseat.

lizzysf
10-22-2009, 01:19 PM
On the last page of the link above, page No. 8417, there is a description of the car seat that was turned over to the FBI by OSCO.
It reads:

Q47 car seat
(plastic side surface)

One black/gray/red "Eddie Bauer" child's car seat, worn.

Faint Brown areas throughout.

Please note that the Q47 number is the one assigned by the FBI. Another identifying number exists (Q45 from property form H-52025) which was assigned by OSCO. JWG explained once how the FBI assigns new numbers for their system. Also I read that OSCO had not processed the car seat in any way - "nothing had been done to it" - other than to box it loose and send it to the FBI (item #30 on a list).

There is a Chain of Custody Log that indicates when the car seat was taken in and out of the Evidence Storage location.Thankyou! So it is grey.. one question out of the way. There is still something going on with the carseat questions though I believe.

Woe.be.gone
10-22-2009, 01:19 PM
"black, gray, red "Eddie Bauer" child's car seat, worn - per FBI.

Woe.be.gone
10-22-2009, 01:22 PM
OK, so the one LE took out of the car was black and gray, and the one in the pic of Caylee in Casey's car was black and gray, so there doesn't appear to have been any switch. If Cindy has a brown and tan one, it doesn't look like she put it in Casey's car. Cindy's claim that Casey's carseat was black and white is pretty obviously wrong, based on the picture of Caylee in the carseat.

Cindy cannot afford to be careless at this time. She should try not to misspeak as she draws suspicion onto herself.
Nobody believes anything she says anymore.

Plus we know by now that the A's are the types that if they say it, then it is true. People want to see proof now more than ever.

lizzysf
10-22-2009, 01:23 PM
I wonder too about the seat cover being changed. They asked Cindy about removable seat cover.

Woe.be.gone
10-22-2009, 01:29 PM
Do you have a link to the more descriptive version of the carseat in OSCO's posession? I have looked and came up empty handed. Nothing at this point is proven or dispelled... but I do believe with the info in the depo, it is worth questioning.

linked above in Post 27, last page within link (of course!). The carseat went from OSCO's hands into the hands of the FBI. Same carseat, different identification numbers.

Woe.be.gone
10-22-2009, 01:31 PM
I wonder too about the seat cover being changed. They asked Cindy about removable seat cover.

If not changed, it would not surprise me if it had been removed and washed and put back on again prior to OSCO taking the car seat - would not surprise me at all.

The Eunice Burns
10-22-2009, 01:53 PM
I will say that I could be overthinking it, which is a tendency of mine, so bear that in mind.....

But, the statement she made that the car seat is in the attic is telling to me. It just seems like an odd place to put it. Not odd if you are trying to hide it, but if you are cooperating w/ LE and know they have been interested in virtually everything that Caylee came in contact w/ in the A home and vehicles, why would you put it in such an out of the way place?

lizzysf
10-22-2009, 02:02 PM
When you read the line of questioning in the depo regarding the 2 carseats.. It sure appears that they have uncovered something. The questions are asked so she commits to an answer, obviously, and what they have found will discredit her story. Just like the rest of the depo..they are eliciting answers from her for very specific reasons. They know. I am just trying to figure out what they know about the 2 carseats ;) It's too easy to skim over the depo and miss some of the important stuff because it doesn't ring a bell or seem important. All the lines of questioning hold something important, IMO. They wouldn't waste their time with non-issue questions.

AZlawyer
10-22-2009, 02:10 PM
When you read the line of questioning in the depo regarding the 2 carseats.. It sure appears that they have uncovered something. The questions are asked so she commits to an answer, obviously, and what they have found will discredit her story. Just like the rest of the depo..they are eliciting answers from her for very specific reasons. They know. I am just trying to figure out what they know about the 2 carseats ;) It's too easy to skim over the depo and miss some of the important stuff because it doesn't ring a bell or seem important. All the lines of questioning hold something important, IMO. They wouldn't waste their time with non-issue questions.

Oh, I agree. I just think the issue about the car seat is not that it was switched with another one. I certainly wouldn't put it past Cindy to wash it, but the FBI description did say there were brown areas (stains, I assume).

lizzysf
10-22-2009, 02:17 PM
Oh, I agree. I just think the issue about the car seat is not that it was switched with another one. I certainly wouldn't put it past Cindy to wash it, but the FBI description did say there were brown areas (stains, I assume).
Not so sure. We don't know for a fact that hers is really brown and tan. No one has ever seen it. They could have bought 2 identical seats at the same time. Hers is not in LE posession....unless, of course they got it from her sometime after the depo when she says it's in the attic. They definetely want to know what stores they purchased things for Caylee at during the questioning about the carseats. Did they find records of a purchase in the financial records of the A's proving that the 2 were purchased at the same time perhaps?

lizzysf
10-22-2009, 02:22 PM
Cindy also states these 2 carseats were the convert type so they could be used from infancy on.. How about accessories purchased with the seats or accessories that came with the seats, such as seat covers.. How many?

lizzysf
10-22-2009, 02:29 PM
I would think that LE would have seen the carseat in the back of Cindy's 4Runner when they were at the house and would taken it as well. I think she took it out of the car before LE got there for SOME reason. Why wouldn't they have taken it??

Spangle
10-22-2009, 02:34 PM
I would think that LE would have seen the carseat in the back of Cindy's 4Runner when they were at the house and would taken it as well. I think she took it out of the car before LE got there for SOME reason. Why wouldn't they have taken it??

They would have had to have it on the warrent. If the LE didn't think the family would have switched them out, then they might not have thought to request all the car seats.

The Eunice Burns
10-22-2009, 02:38 PM
Cindy also states these 2 carseats were the convert type so they could be used from infancy on.. How about accessories purchased with the seats or accessories that came with the seats, such as seat covers.. How many?

In 13 years of using car seats and boosters.....(my youngest is nearly big enough to graduate from his booster seat......Yay!) I have only had a seat come w/ the cover that is on it. You can get covers that specficially fit that seat from the manufacturer. ( I once ordered one, b/c I washed the cover and it did not fit right after air drying, even, and the seat was a Britax, and I didn't want to shell out $$ for another seat, but I'm veering off course here......) Or you can buy generic covers that cover, but don't provide the snug fit that the cover gave that the seat came with. Where am I going w/ this.......I forgot....Well, Eddie Bauer seats of the type the As had I've seen at Target. The extra accessories available I've only seen at specialty baby stores or from the manufacturer.

Sorry. I still don't know what my original thought was when I was replying to your post! It was there.....

lizzysf
10-22-2009, 02:55 PM
How about this? What if LE got a tipster call. Someone that says.. I worked at such and such store and I recognized Casey and Cindy on TV and remember them coming into the store and buying 2 Eddie Bauer carseats at the same time. Maybe remembering because most people don't buy 2 at the same time for 1 child?
LE wants to know what stores they shopped at in the depo. LE could have already dug up that record of purchase from such and such store. They catch Cindy in a lie saying Casey bought her seat on her own. Maybe the tipster call is when they discovered there were 2 carseats? Now they are questioning Cindy about her seat?
Just trying to think out of the box here.. bear with me :)

cecybeans
10-22-2009, 02:57 PM
Fooling around with the car seat or cover also makes sense in light of something else CA said in her depo. She mentioned wiping the "mama" dolls face, which was found in the car seat. That doll is cloth she said, but has a plastic face. She mentioned she did it because it was not as clean as she thought it ought to be. Yeah. Right. She comes home with the Deathmobile and takes out a steak knife which she quickly washes and returns to the box under the silverware, removes a pair of KC's pants, which she washes (and which could not possibly smell like smoke after being in that car for two weeks, they would smell like a dead child) and takes the time to wipe a baby doll's face. Everything else she just takes out and sets aside on the cooler.

And she does all this before she can even locate her daughter to find out what happened. And before she decides to return to work to give the appearance that she and GA are not tampering with what they both know is evidence.

I find it odd as well that her car seat is stored in the attic; that garage is full of items on shelves, like the pet carriers, and items at least as large, like coolers.

If LP is right and they replaced the washer and dryer, they'd better hope they replaced the hoses on the vacs and the wetvac.

And if people's speculation that something physical happened to Caylee in the carseat is true (and the missing tooth is an indication of foul play), then perhaps that is another reason, in addition to the duct tape, that allowed Dr. G to establish Caylee's death as a homicide.

Somebody needs to tell CA that telling a half truth is the same thing as being half-pregnant.

lizzysf
10-22-2009, 03:06 PM
The million dollar question is.. if she did tamper with the carseat, did she do it to remove obvious evidence she found, such as blood, or just odor? She says she just Febreezed the inside of the car. I think Cindy for sure put the dryer sheets in the car to mask the odor. I am convinced that whatever LE knows about the carseats is NOT limited to odor removal. They are questioning her about BOTH seats.

JBean
10-22-2009, 03:09 PM
please be cautious about rumors. thanks.

also:
Contacting Case Players - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

what each of you do offboard is of course up to you. But please do not post any references to what you may choose to do or mention Websleuths in your activities as though you are doing something on our behalf or as our representative.

Thanks.

static
10-22-2009, 03:10 PM
ok I found this...must be what he is talking about
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0901/22/ng.01.html

lizzysf
10-22-2009, 04:43 PM
It boggles my mind that Cindy says Caseys car seat was black and white. It was clearly black and dark grey as shown in the pics. So Cindy, goes through the car, lifts up carseat to see if anything was under it, finds mama doll in the seat, has seen the carseat since Caylee was an infant, likely even purchased it, and recalls that it was black and white? She probably even sold the pic of Caylee in the carseat that we have all seen...and can't remember its color? The only white I see on it is the Eddie Bauer logo (in plain sight) yet she doesn't remember the brand. This is so Cindy. I don't buy it. What is she plotting? Hmmm.

celticthyme
10-22-2009, 05:05 PM
Edie Bauer Car Seat

3doglady
10-22-2009, 05:56 PM
I think the significance of the car seat is that Caylee was taped to it. Wasn't it the 13" piece of tape that had fringe hair(chest or neck) on it? What would be the point of taping Caylee's chest unless you are going to tape it to something? Maybe adhesive was found on the carseat and the SA was trying to verify the fact that that specific carseat was KC's. The was speculation early on that Caylee did not have on clothes. Someone posted yesterday that all the items were found in the garage. Plastic bags, laundry bag, duct tape and possible dirty clothes(striped shorts and pink shirt). LE verified in their communication that the car seat had been placed in a box and nothing had been had been done to it. That could have been asked to verify that LE did not tape anything to it.

lizzysf
10-22-2009, 06:34 PM
I think the significance of the car seat is that Caylee was taped to it. Wasn't it the 13" piece of tape that had fringe hair(chest or neck) on it? What would be the point of taping Caylee's chest unless you are going to tape it to something? Maybe adhesive was found on the carseat and the SA was trying to verify the fact that that specific carseat was KC's. The was speculation early on that Caylee did not have on clothes. Someone posted yesterday that all the items were found in the garage. Plastic bags, laundry bag, duct tape and possible dirty clothes(striped shorts and pink shirt). LE verified in their communication that the car seat had been placed in a box and nothing had been had been done to it. That could have been asked to verify that LE did not tape anything to it.

Why would she tape her to the carseat when all she had to do was shoulder strap her in as shown in the picture? And driving around with a child duct taped to a car seat would draw a bit of attention I would think... A 13" piece of tape wouldn't accomplish that anyway. JMO :)

3doglady
10-22-2009, 06:46 PM
Why would she tape her to the carseat when all she had to do was shoulder strap her in as shown in the picture? I don't think at all that she was taped to the seat. JMO

When my son was two the straps would not keep him in. He could get out of those in a heartbeat.

jandkmom
10-22-2009, 06:53 PM
I have a question for the "Legal Eagles" here. Is it normal for the prosecution to not ask questions such as "Did you swap carseats?" Do you hold back asking questions until the trial? I would think that you would ask such questions if that was a theory so that you could either debunk it or get a lie under oath so as to create the waiver of immunity. Are there some questions that you don't ask because you don't want the defense to know your strategy? Thanks in advance.

3doglady
10-22-2009, 06:57 PM
If KC hit Caylee while in the car seat and knocked out a tooth I would think there would be blood on the Pontiac car seat also. Ever seen a child fall and cut their head? Blood vessels are very close to the skin in the head. Consequently any cut to the head or mouth produces a lot of blood.

lizzysf
10-22-2009, 06:58 PM
I have a question for the "Legal Eagles" here. Is it normal for the prosecution to not ask questions such as "Did you swap carseats?" Do you hold back asking questions until the trial? I would think that you would ask such questions if that was a theory so that you could either debunk it or get a lie under oath so as to create the waiver of immunity. Are there some questions that you don't ask because you don't want the defense to know your strategy? Thanks in advance.
I think they are both holding back and asking the questions.. They asked..Did you remove anything else from the car? Did you hide any evidence? All during the carseat questioning.

MD MOMMY
10-22-2009, 06:59 PM
How about this? What if LE got a tipster call. Someone that says.. I worked at such and such store and I recognized Casey and Cindy on TV and remember them coming into the store and buying 2 Eddie Bauer carseats at the same time. Maybe remembering because most people don't buy 2 at the same time for 1 child?
LE wants to know what stores they shopped at in the depo. LE could have already dug up that record of purchase from such and such store. They catch Cindy in a lie saying Casey bought her seat on her own. Maybe the tipster call is when they discovered there were 2 carseats? Now they are questioning Cindy about her seat?
Just trying to think out of the box here.. bear with me :)

Actually a lot of people buy 2 of the same carseats for one child. I have 2 small kids myself and have tons of friends who have small kids. You normally buy 2, one for each car. Switching a car seat is a big pain the butt, not to mention a lot of people take their car to the police station to make sure they are installed properly. 80% of car seats are not installed properly, that is a huge statistic. Just my 2 cents.

ETA..also another reason people have two is in case say the Mom drops the kids off at daycare and the father picks them up etc.

jandkmom
10-22-2009, 07:00 PM
I think they are both holding back and asking the questions.. They asked..Did you remove anything else from the car? Did you hide any evidence? All during the carseat questioning.

But after that questioning, if they thought that she may have moved the car seat, why didn't they just ask it specifically? They have given the excuse before that they weren't asked that specific question, and they don't give up information freely.

MD MOMMY
10-22-2009, 07:01 PM
If KC hit Caylee while in the car seat and knocked out a tooth I would think there would be blood on the car seat also. Ever seen a child fall and cut their head? Blood vessels are very close to the skin in the head. Consequently any cut to the head or mouth produces a lot of blood.

I agree the mouth bleeds horribly. My daughter fell and bit her tongue, it bled for 2 hours. I called the Dr. and she said mouths bleed the most.

3doglady
10-22-2009, 07:05 PM
If the SA has reason to believe Ca exchanged car seats wouldn't they have LE get another search warrant and take the car seat before questioning CA about it? Why tip her off so she can sanitize it again.

lizzysf
10-22-2009, 07:52 PM
If the SA has reason to believe Ca exchanged car seats wouldn't they have LE get another search warrant and take the car seat before questioning CA about it? Why tip her off so she can sanitize it again.

I am not so sure it was a total switch of carseats.. possibly a switch of car seat covers?

Curious Me
10-22-2009, 08:46 PM
Here's my thought process on this. I have to ask why. Why would they need to switch/hide car seats?

What was on the car seat? Blood could be washed off unless it got in the cracks or maybe on the straps. Sticky duct tape residue couldn't be wiped off as easily, and would collect fibers.

Can we see the one in the attic? Is it the brown/tan one?

Were maggots on the car seat, and Cindy did make a switch?

Why are they questioning CA specifically about those car seats?

GA will say he buckled Caylee into which ever color car seat Cindy tells him to.

Now, I've got to ask a what question? What happened to make the car seat have to be tampered with or hidden?

Yes, as someone mentioned, Cindy had time to wash the knife and the pants. And so, I doubt Cindy just sprayed Febreze without wiping down that car. After scrubbing that smell out as best she could, she then actually ate her sandwich, and went back to work! She didn't even know what had happened at that point. It does make you wonder, doesn't it?

I agree with all of you who think this is worth thinking about, and trying to find out more. It isn't a matter of LE not doing enough, but the fact that evidence has been tampered with by the suspect's family, as I see it.

P.S. BTW, there's a whole long interesting thread about the Mama doll.

Woe.be.gone
10-22-2009, 09:18 PM
I will say that I could be overthinking it, which is a tendency of mine, so bear that in mind.....

But, the statement she made that the car seat is in the attic is telling to me. It just seems like an odd place to put it. Not odd if you are trying to hide it, but if you are cooperating w/ LE and know they have been interested in virtually everything that Caylee came in contact w/ in the A home and vehicles, why would you put it in such an out of the way place?

No use for it anymore? Sad but true.

Woe.be.gone
10-22-2009, 09:31 PM
Edie Bauer Car Seat

Where is the red? FBI says Black, gray and red, and worn.

Does this look like that? :waitasec:

lizzysf
10-22-2009, 09:32 PM
Where is the red? FBI says Black, gray and red, and worn.

Does this look like that? :waitasec:The red can be found on both sides of the seat..plastic parts

Woe.be.gone
10-22-2009, 09:43 PM
If KC hit Caylee while in the car seat and knocked out a tooth I would think there would be blood on the Pontiac car seat also. Ever seen a child fall and cut their head? Blood vessels are very close to the skin in the head. Consequently any cut to the head or mouth produces a lot of blood.

This brings up another related but semi off topic topic. I was reading today part of CA's depo where she begins explaining that new seat covers for the Pontiac should have been in the trunk too but that as far as she knows, they never got around to installing them onto the seats. She said the reason for them was that the actual seats in the Pontiac were becoming worn in spots.

My questions are, why would she bring this up, do we know for a fact that the Pontiac did not have seat covers on/in it, and were there new seat covers in the trunk waiting to be installed?

iirc CA just rattled this info off as she was stating that although she didn't often go into the trunk of the Pontiac, the last time she did, she recalled the following items - then she tells of the new seat covers there.

Where are they?

Could they have been on the seats of the Pontiac but removed if the crime did happened in the car?

static
10-22-2009, 09:45 PM
Also CIndy was talking of a garage sale and she sold many of Caylee's clothes because she wanted them to go to good use. Why didn't she sell the carseat as well? I do believe she washed the covers. She can always say she made a mistake and forgot which cover went on which carseat, or they were so filthy she took it upon herself to clean them. Makes her actions unassuming.

Woe.be.gone
10-22-2009, 09:56 PM
I am not so sure it was a total switch of carseats.. possibly a switch of car seat covers?

And what do you think the "brown spots throughout" statement refers too?

Wasn't it discussed once in another thread that Arm and Hammer brand laundry detergent will destroy blood related findings - am I remembering this wrong? That's the brand that the A's have next to their washing machine.

I know sometimes I can't quite get a stain out and it will leave a brown discoloration. If you don't wash blood out immediately, it will do that.

CA Mom
10-22-2009, 10:06 PM
For what ever reason, CA knew she had to clean that pontiac pronto, and I think she knew how difficult cleaning the car seat would be. I'll bet they owned more than 2 car seats, probably 2 Eddie Bauer black & gray. CA most likely bought 2 Eddie B at the same time and possibly SA has proof. Can't see casey wasting her stolen $$ on a car seat for caylee. Maybe SA looked into "recall notices" sent in by CA, I know I'm faithful about sending these in.

Between my home and SUV, I have 6 car seats for my grandkids, cuz I don't share with DIL's, too difficult to move from car to car and they keep em' as clean as I do! Sippy cups leak, french fries, cookies, etc get wedged in those tiny..tiny little spots. We all have "extra" car seats, and I store the used ones that I've replaced. Yeap, I am the car seat cleaner for all in my family.

I think CA would not want the car seat to look and smell like it was just cleaned. IMO, she had GA toss it out on his way to work that day, cuz she knew she had another one just like it.

lizzysf
10-22-2009, 10:20 PM
For what ever reason, CA knew she had to clean that pontiac pronto, and I think she knew how difficult cleaning the car seat would be. I'll bet they owned more than 2 car seats, probably 2 Eddie Bauer black & gray. CA most likely bought 2 Eddie B at the same time and possibly SA has proof. Can't see casey wasting her stolen $$ on a car seat for caylee. Maybe SA looked into "recall notices" sent in by CA, I know I'm faithful about sending these in.

Between my home and SUV, I have 6 car seats for my grandkids, cuz I don't share with DIL's, too difficult to move from car to car and they keep em' as clean as I do! Sippy cups leak, french fries, cookies, etc get wedged in those tiny..tiny little spots. We all have "extra" car seats, and I store the used ones that I've replaced. Yeap, I am the car seat cleaner for all in my family.

I think CA would not want the car seat to look and smell like it was just cleaned. IMO, she had GA toss it out on his way to work that day, cuz she knew she had another one just like it.They do have 2 carseats.. Cindy says hers is Eddie Bauer and Caseys is unknown brand.. (it's also Eddie Bauer).. No one has seen Cindy's but she claims it is brown and tan, and claims to still have it in her attic. The depo covers alot of questioning about the 2 carseats. Hinky, Hinky.

Woe.be.gone
10-22-2009, 11:42 PM
If the SA has reason to believe Ca exchanged car seats wouldn't they have LE get another search warrant and take the car seat before questioning CA about it? Why tip her off so she can sanitize it again.

Or hold another garage sale. :doh:

Woe.be.gone
10-22-2009, 11:55 PM
Also CIndy was talking of a garage sale and she sold many of Caylee's clothes because she wanted them to go to good use. Why didn't she sell the carseat as well? I do believe she washed the covers. She can always say she made a mistake and forgot which cover went on which carseat, or they were so filthy she took it upon herself to clean them. Makes her actions unassuming.

She did? I hadn't seen this post when I made the comment above. :eek:

MD MOMMY
10-22-2009, 11:57 PM
She did? I hadn't seen this post when I made the comment above. :eek:

I'm confused about this b/c when I read it, CA was talking about in the past or so I thought. I don't think she was talking about since Caylee passed away in regards to holding yard sales.

static
10-23-2009, 12:18 AM
She did? I hadn't seen this post when I made the comment above. :eek:

lol I do that too WOe. You know what they say, great minds yada yada yada:)

Curious Me
10-23-2009, 05:05 AM
This brings up another related but semi off topic topic. I was reading today part of CA's depo where she begins explaining that new seat covers for the Pontiac should have been in the trunk too but that as far as she knows, they never got around to installing them onto the seats. She said the reason for them was that the actual seats in the Pontiac were becoming worn in spots.

My questions are, why would she bring this up, do we know for a fact that the Pontiac did not have seat covers on/in it, and were there new seat covers in the trunk waiting to be installed?

iirc CA just rattled this info off as she was stating that although she didn't often go into the trunk of the Pontiac, the last time she did, she recalled the following items - then she tells of the new seat covers there.

Where are they?

Could they have been on the seats of the Pontiac but removed if the crime did happened in the car?

Thank You for your post. Casey likes to give clues to Lee with their code talk. Cindy we are finding out likes to plant new tidbits of info she plans to manipulate into a defense tactic. It's become a regular occurence and a lot of us on here do not trust anything Cindy offers as the truth.

Your theory above would fit perfectly if LE found out those new seat covers for the Pontiac were in use, but Cindy is saying they never were put on, and she is now saying they were missing from the trunk. Very good sleuthing, woe.be.gone. We know Cindy usually throws these things into the story for a reason.

Wish we could figure out if the crime happened in the car.

And Why?

Woe.be.gone
10-23-2009, 11:32 AM
Thank You for your post. Casey likes to give clues to Lee with their code talk. Cindy we are finding out likes to plant new tidbits of info she plans to manipulate into a defense tactic. It's become a regular occurence and a lot of us on here do not trust anything Cindy offers as the truth.

Your theory above would fit perfectly if LE found out those new seat covers for the Pontiac were in use, but Cindy is saying they never were put on, and she is now saying they were missing from the trunk. Very good sleuthing, woe.be.gone. We know Cindy usually throws these things into the story for a reason.

Wish we could figure out if the crime happened in the car.

And Why?

Worthy of a thread?

Personally I found this very interesting but I'm not certain if I missed a big chunk of information along the way that would clarify the situation. But like you said, it almost read like a clue, or info CA wanted to put out there for some reason.

Dear Prudence
10-23-2009, 01:22 PM
Has anyone seen this picture before? I can't really tell but it looks like it might have a little bit of white on the side of the carseat. Could be the one Cindy was talking about, but then again it could be the same one as in the more recent picture. Does anyone know how to enlarge it for a better look?

It's the first picture in the bottom row of this page:

http://photobucket.com/images/caylee%20anthony/?page=5&sortby=sevendaysview&source=header

You can also see in this picture and the one right before it a name brand on the chair (upper left side). I can't tell if it says Eddie Bauer or not.

lizzysf
10-23-2009, 01:39 PM
Has anyone seen this picture before? I can't really tell but it looks like it might have a little bit of white on the side of the carseat. Could be the one Cindy was talking about, but then again it could be the same one as in the more recent picture. Does anyone know how to enlarge it for a better look?

It's the first picture in the bottom row of this page:

http://photobucket.com/images/caylee%20anthony/?page=5&sortby=sevendaysview&source=header
It's the same one in Casey's car. The only white is the Eddie Bauer logo (which Cindy claims she can't remember the brand haha) The part on the right of Caylee that may look white is hard plastic reflecting the sunlight...actually black if you compare it to the other photo.
Awesome find on the photo though! Wow, I hadn't seen it. Good to have comparisons.. and you can see how much younger Caylee is...same carseat Casey has now.

I LOOKED AGAIN!
OMG!!! IT DOES LOOK DIFFERENT! SAME SEAT BUT DIFFERENT COVER OR CUSHION! Look at the top of the cushion behind her..looks completely different than the other photo! Can anyone blow this up and post it next to the photo with Caylee and Mama in the carseat?

Dear Prudence
10-23-2009, 01:44 PM
It's the same one in Casey's car. The only white is the Eddie Bauer logo (which Cindy claims she can't remember the brand haha) The part on the right of Caylee that may look white is hard plastic reflecting the sunlight...actually black if you compare it to the other photo.
Awesome find on the photo though! Wow, I hadn't seen it. Good to have comparisons.. and you can see how much younger Caylee is...same carseat Casey has now.

Thanks for the clarification, I was wondering if that logo was Eddie Bauer, couldn't read it myself.

The pattern does look a little different to me too. Hopefully someone can blow it up and see for sure.

lizzysf
10-23-2009, 01:49 PM
Thanks for the clarification, I was wondering if that logo was Eddie Bauer, couldn't read it myself.

The pattern does look a little different to me too. Hopefully someone can blow it up and see for sure.
Great find and Great sleuthing DP!!!:woohoo:

lizzysf
10-23-2009, 02:11 PM
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/caylee202620doll.jpg
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/cayleeride.jpg
THE SEAT OCSO HAS:
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/08_09.jpg

NONE OF THE COVERS LOOK THE SAME. SEE PIC #1..HOW HIGH THE BACK INSERT GOES?
SEE #2 COMPLETELY DIFFERENT THAN THE OTHER 2
SEE PIC # 3 BACK INSET MUCH LOWER THAN PIC #1

ALL 3 DIFFER.

I say Cindy changed the seat cover.

sleutherontheside
10-23-2009, 02:22 PM
Just a note about the possible difference in carseats. Convertible seats, meaning those meant to be used into toddlerhood, often come with an insert that provides additional cushioning around the head. As the child grows taller, the extra cushioning is easily removed. I had one much like this. If people opt for a seat like this as opposed to an infant carrier type then they do come with the removable head cushion. I think that is the situation here.

carrie
10-23-2009, 02:25 PM
Quoting myself from the tooth thread:

"I don't believe she was in coverup mode at that point in time - when she made the 911 call. It's obvious she's in coverup for KC mode now, but I don't think she was covering up when she removed the knife and cleaned the car. I think she just always did most of the (literal) cleaning/picking up after KC and that's all there was to what she did with the car.

IMO, if she'd been trying to coverup for whatever KC did to little Caylee (back when they got the car back and cleaned it), she'd have never dialed 911 to start with. JMHO. No one knew Caylee was missing but KC, and then Cindy, George, and Lee. They could have easily helped her to "disappear" instead of getting LE involved."

LE probably was trying to establish something pertaining to the carseat with their line of questioning. I just don't think it was about a carseat switch/cleanup, etc. Because I don't think CA knew at that time what KC had done or she'd never have called 911. JMHO.

If she did know at that time, there's have been so many other easier ways to go about hiding the fact that KC had killed Caylee.

lizzysf
10-23-2009, 02:27 PM
Just a note about the possible difference in carseats. Convertible seats, meaning those meant to be used into toddlerhood, often come with an insert that provides additional cushioning around the head. As the child grows taller, the extra cushioning is easily removed. I had one much like this. If people opt for a seat like this as opposed to an infant carrier type then they do come with the removable head cushion. I think that is the situation here.
I'll grant you that on the infant picture...but how do you explain the difference between pic # 1 and OCSO's pic #3?

I'd say pic #1 was a seat cover and pic #3 shows it was removed. Look at the difference in the height of the black insert on the backrest. Completely different.
Pic #1 looks more plush while pic #3 looks like the bare bone seat or different cover.

sumbunny
10-23-2009, 02:31 PM
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/caylee202620doll.jpg
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/cayleeride.jpg
THE SEAT OSCO HAS:
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/08_09.jpg

NONE OF THE COVERS LOOK THE SAME. SEE PIC #1..HOW HIGH THE BACK INSERT GOES?
SEE #2 COMPLETELY DIFFERENT THAN THE OTHER 2
SEE PIC # 3 BACK INSET MUCH LOWER THAN PIC #1

ALL 3 DIFFER.

I say Cindy changed the seat cover.

The first one looks like casey's carseat for caylee..the last one looks like it would be cindys? brown and beige?

lizzysf
10-23-2009, 02:34 PM
The first one looks like casey's carseat for caylee..the last one looks like it would be cindys? brown and beige?

I had questioned that earlier in some posts until someone provided a link with the OCSO description of the seat which said black, grey, red (plastic parts are red as you can see in the pic)

The seat cover has changed.

OR

We will discover Cindy's seat wasn't brown/tan..but also grey and black and this is her seat, not Casey's. A seat switcharoo. Or Cindy's is a different shade of black and grey than Casey's and Cindy calls it brown and tan.. think taupe family...greyish-BROWN...Would you say grey or brown to describe taupe?

sumbunny
10-23-2009, 02:40 PM
I had questioned that earlier in some posts until someone provided a link with the OSCO description of the seat which said black, grey, red (plastic parts are red as you can see in the pic)

The seat cover has changed.

OR

We will discover Cindy's seat wasn't brown/tan..but also grey and black and this is her seat, not Casey's. A seat switcharoo.es

I must be color blind because picture 3 looks like beige, brown with orange plastic parts. ~rubs eyes~

I do believe Cindy admitted to having a beige/brown version of casey's black/grey verision (although cindy says black/white)

lizzysf
10-23-2009, 02:47 PM
I wonder what color the inside of Cindy's 4Runner is... I am sure she would choose a seat that complimented the interior..(supposing she had the 4Runner at that time) If it is grey/black she probably wouldn't pick a brown seat.. just a hunch.. and just a hunch the interior of her car will be grey/black or taupe family...if in fact she switched seats.
I think she could be trying to throw us off by calling it TAN and BROWN. When I hear that I think BROWN, not grey/taupe.

OR, Hers may actually be brown and tan and a seat switch did not occur...just a grey/black cover switch on Casey's seat.

sumbunny
10-23-2009, 02:49 PM
Cindy has a green four runner.. I'll guess it's got a beige interior :)

Does anyone know what the interior color of casey's car is? I can't remember :)

lizzysf
10-23-2009, 02:49 PM
es

I must be color blind because picture 3 looks like beige, brown with orange plastic parts. ~rubs eyes~

I do believe Cindy admitted to having a beige/brown version of casey's black/grey verision (although cindy says black/white)
When I first saw it...I thought it could be beige.. But OCSO is calling it grey/black...
It may just be the lighting between the 2 photos.. but none the less...it is different.

lizzysf
10-23-2009, 02:50 PM
Cindy has a green four runner.. I'll guess it's got a beige interior :)

Does anyone know what the interior color of casey's car is? I can't remember :)

Casey's is grey

lizzysf
10-23-2009, 02:54 PM
Cindy has a green four runner.. I'll guess it's got a beige interior :)

Does anyone know what the interior color of casey's car is? I can't remember :)
Any pictures or videos of Cindy in her car that you can recall?

sumbunny
10-23-2009, 02:56 PM
Not sure about the lighting. Is picture one taken in the back of cindy's car then?

They are clearly 3 different seats. Are we sure that picture three is a picture of casey's back seat and not cindys?
I'm going to have to look up pictures of 4 runner back interiors now..~L~ Any idea on the year of cindy's car?

lizzysf
10-23-2009, 03:02 PM
So this carseat is a convertible. Pic #2 shows infant cover, Pic #3 shows stage 2 inset, and pic #1 shows toddler or stage 3 inset... so if she had already graduated to the stage3/toddler inset...why does OSCO pic show stage 2 inset?

Would convertibles have accessories in stages like this? Not sure what would come with one. Anyone? Anyone?

lizzysf
10-23-2009, 03:07 PM
Not sure about the lighting. Is picture one taken in the back of cindy's car then?

They are clearly 3 different seats. Are we sure that picture three is a picture of casey's back seat and not cindys?
I'm going to have to look up pictures of 4 runner back interiors now..~L~ Any idea on the year of cindy's car?
No...it is Casey's car...look at the color of the panel and the line of the window to Caylee's left. Same. And you can see the back window. Cindy has a 4Runner...you would not see the back window like that.

lizzysf
10-23-2009, 03:09 PM
Not sure about the lighting. Is picture one taken in the back of cindy's car then?

They are clearly 3 different seats. Are we sure that picture three is a picture of casey's back seat and not cindys?
I'm going to have to look up pictures of 4 runner back interiors now..~L~ Any idea on the year of cindy's car?
Picture #3 is Casey's car impounded at OCSO...so yes, it's Casey's.

sumbunny
10-23-2009, 03:15 PM
Ok found the back seat of a green/beige toyota four runner (still not sure of cindy's age of car, but figured about a 2001?)

http://www.terrydavison.com/shared/photos-2001-toyota-4runner-sr5-4726690.html?src=CraigsList&pid=1

sumbunny
10-23-2009, 03:19 PM
thanks lizy :) So picture 1 is apparently in the back of casey's car as is picture 3?

It truly doesn't look the same color at all. Lighting can't change it's color so drastically!

lizzysf
10-23-2009, 03:22 PM
thanks lizy :) So picture 1 is apparently in the back of casey's car as is picture 3?

It truly doesn't look the same color at all. Lighting can't change it's color so drastically!For sure it is. Look at how rich the charcoal grey on the panel looks in pic #1, yet so faded out in pic #3... I bet #3 was taken inside the OCSO garage with flash and #1 was taken outside in daylight.

sumbunny
10-23-2009, 03:30 PM
I think cindy changed the covers. Or, put her seat in casey's car.

I remember in cindy's deposition stating that she lifted the carseat in casey's car.
(why add so much detail? it wasn't asked)

msinformed
10-23-2009, 03:30 PM
If I am not mistaken, the transitional components of the car seat are directly related to the "interior" of the seat, i.e., padding in different areas (for different stages of growth). However, I believe the "harness" portion of the seat does not change, per se. Consequently, in viewing the pics, the padding on the torso harness in the first two pics are of the same color, however, in pic #3 the torso harness padding is definitely a different color. Therefore, I conclude pic #3 is a totally different seat than that in pics #1 & #2 - which I believe are in KC's vehicle. Also, pic #3, looks to be more dark gray/light gray to me .... I see no brown/beige, but, then again, my eyes are old! LOL!

So ......... Lizzy, me thinks CA probably DID pull a switch-a-roo, based on pic #3, which is the car seat in KC's vehicle in the custody of the OCSO.

Hope this make sense !!??

lizzysf
10-23-2009, 03:35 PM
Back to the depo:

Cindy starts crying when discussing what she found in the backseat right around the time they are discussing the carseat.

OCSO asks...did you change the position or move the seat (something like that) Cindy says NO. She just lifted it up to see if there was anything under it.

Again while discussing the carseat..OCSO asks her did you remove anything else from the backseat you haven't told us? Did you hide any evidence? (not quotes, but close..)
Cindy says NO.

ALSO NOTE in pic 1 and pic 3 the difference in the height of the actual seat istelf. In pic 1 it goes higher than the back of the Pontiac seat, in pic 3 it does not.

sumbunny
10-23-2009, 03:40 PM
OCSO is on to her. Will she face prosecution if she knowingly tampered with evidence?
Do you know if they will test cindy's carseat from the attic? (i'm going to guess the one in the attic may very well be casey's original car seat)

lizzysf
10-23-2009, 03:41 PM
So...if in fact she did a switch...the question is why? To remove evidence (ie: blood) or merely odor control? And why does she begin to cry when the carseat subject starts? The whole inside of the car stunk to high heaven..would changing the carseat or cover make a difference? I think she switched it because she saw blood. Which takes me back to the missing upper left lateral incisor...and the theory that Casey hit Caylee while she was in the carseat.

lizzysf
10-23-2009, 03:43 PM
OCSO is on to her. Will she face prosecution if she knowingly tampered with evidence?
Do you know if they will test cindy's carseat from the attic? (i'm going to guess the one in the attic may very well be casey's original car seat)
The one in the attic...the big question. What color is it? Does Cindy actually still have it? If so, has OCSO taken it since this deposition in August 09?

sumbunny
10-23-2009, 03:56 PM
The one in the attic...the big question. What color is it? Does Cindy actually still have it? If so, has OCSO taken it since this deposition in August 09?

page 68 line 10

cindy-I have my car seat yes.
Q-ok, can you describe it?
cindy-it's an eddie bauer car seat
Q- color?
cindy-brown and tan. We put it away a few months ago--
Q ok
cindy- in the attic.
Q-and what kind of car seat did casey have for caylee?
cindy I'm not sure what the name of hers was. I know it was black and white, but I don't know what the make of it was. She picked it out. She bought it.
Q- ok. Did you always keep your car seat in yoru vehicle?
cindy- Uh-huh.
Q-What kind fo car did you have?
cindy- i have a 4runner
Q- Toyota 4 runner?
cindy uh-huh.
Q-okay. And do you have knowledge as to whether or not casey kept the car seat that she purchased in the vehicle she used?
cindy-Right, And she would use it in her car and then jesse would use it if he--if she--if he was watching caylee at his house, or she would take his truck to work and he'd use her car.

lizzysf
10-23-2009, 04:13 PM
page 68 line 10

cindy-I have my car seat yes.
Q-ok, can you describe it?
cindy-it's an eddie bauer car seat
Q- color?
cindy-brown and tan. We put it away a few months ago--
Q ok
cindy- in the attic.
Q-and what kind of car seat did casey have for caylee?
cindy I'm not sure what the name of hers was. I know it was black and white, but I don't know what the make of it was. She picked it out. She bought it.
Q- ok. Did you always keep your car seat in yoru vehicle?
cindy- Uh-huh.
Q-What kind fo car did you have?
cindy- i have a 4runner
Q- Toyota 4 runner?
cindy uh-huh.
Q-okay. And do you have knowledge as to whether or not casey kept the car seat that she purchased in the vehicle she used?
cindy-Right, And she would use it in her car and then jesse would use it if he--if she--if he was watching caylee at his house, or she would take his truck to work and he'd use her car.LOL!!! They are soooo on to her! They also ask...what stores did you buy items for Caylee at...she rattles off the names of some stores.. I can guarantee you...she paid with check or credit card for a carseat. They have already tracked the item through her bank/credit card company. I believe the truth will be is that she bought both Eddie Bauer Seats at the same time. And OCSO knows everything. I don't believe Casey bought her own. George will be the carseat alibi..of course...now that his story has changed and he now remembers walking them out to the car and helping Caylee in that last day. Another LIE.

wonders
10-23-2009, 05:06 PM
LOL!!! They are soooo on to her! They also ask...what stores did you buy items for Caylee at...she rattles off the names of some stores.. I can guarantee you...she paid with check or credit card for a carseat. They have already tracked the item through her bank/credit card company. I believe the truth will be is that she bought both Eddie Bauer Seats at the same time. And OCSO knows everything. I don't believe Casey bought her own. George will be the carseat alibi..of course...now that his story has changed and he now remembers walking them out to the car and helping Caylee in that last day. Another LIE.

BBM
ITA lizzys.
Q-and what kind of car seat did casey have for caylee?
Cindy- I'm not sure what the name of hers was. I know it was black and white, but I don't know what the make of it was. She picked it out. She bought it.
Cindy added what I bolded last. I would love to hear that part of the depo with my own ears to see if she paused before she added that.

ETC

Horace Finklestein
10-23-2009, 07:13 PM
OCSO is on to her. Will she face prosecution if she knowingly tampered with evidence?
Do you know if they will test cindy's carseat from the attic? (i'm going to guess the one in the attic may very well be casey's original car seat)

I for one think that prosecuting CA and probably GA is really a necessity for justice for Caylee. They've really taken it too far and crossed the line from protectiveness into criminality. There's just no two ways about it.

lizzysf
10-23-2009, 08:10 PM
I for one think that prosecuting CA and probably GA is really a necessity for justice for Caylee. They've really taken it too far and crossed the line from protectiveness into criminality. There's just no two ways about it.Agreed!

Curious Me
10-24-2009, 04:45 AM
IMO, when the parents of the suspect not only tamper with crucial evidence but are caught in lie after lie to LE they should expect to do some jail time. They have been allowed to make a mockery of Caylee's death.

I think most of us wanted to feel more empathy for the Anthonys, but they have really made it hard. It's like Caylee cries in each of our hearts to give her Justice. Don't CA and GA hear her?

Bee Charmer
10-24-2009, 11:28 AM
I have truly never seen such rank exploitation of a murdered child, as I have seen in this case from her own family. It is digusting, imo.

If the anthonys have broken the law with all their lies and evidence tampering, I pray LE can prove it and prosecute accordingly. :furious:

lizzysf
10-24-2009, 12:29 PM
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/caylee202620doll.jpg
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/cayleeride.jpg
THE SEAT OCSO HAS:
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/08_09.jpg

NONE OF THE COVERS LOOK THE SAME. SEE PIC #1..HOW HIGH THE BACK INSERT GOES?
SEE #2 COMPLETELY DIFFERENT THAN THE OTHER 2
SEE PIC # 3 BACK INSET MUCH LOWER THAN PIC #1

ALL 3 DIFFER.

I say Cindy changed the seat cover.
Bumpin' to get some opinion on the 3 photos.. Different/same?

Misfitdolly
10-24-2009, 12:34 PM
These are either 3 different seats or 1 and 3 are the same seat with different covers. none are bare bones seats, they all have a cover on them. I believe they are all 3 Eddie Bauer brand but 2 is a different model, it has armrests build into the seat like this one Amazon.com: Eddie Bauer Vantage Highback Booster, Blue: Baby
but 1 and 3 do not.
On some models the harness strap padding is removable, they just wrap around the harness and velcro in place but on the Eddie Bauer seat I had (they are very bad car seats btw) the straps were sewn on but if you took the whole harness off of the seat you could slide them off the top and potentially put a different colored pad on it.
I just noticed that the harness straps themselves appear to be grey on seat 3 and black on seat 1. It is possible to change the harness straps but I doubt someone would go to the trouble to change everything on the seat including the harness straps. If you had another seat to swap out the cover and the harness straps wouldn't you just swap the seats? IMO these pictures show 3 different seats.

Baxter
10-24-2009, 01:18 PM
Bumpin' to get some opinion on the 3 photos.. Different/same?

I think that they are 3 different seats.

#1 seems more black with very little accents of dark grey
Very wide and puffy

#2 seems black with more accents of light grey also wide and puffy

#3 Different altogether. Much thinner base is light grey or taupe, accents
seem darker grey or darker taupe. This is the only one that has side
buckles in red/orange.

Cindy what did you do?

Misfitdolly
10-24-2009, 01:53 PM
I think that they are 3 different seats.

#1 seems more black with very little accents of dark grey
Very wide and puffy

#2 seems black with more accents of light grey also wide and puffy

#3 Different altogether. Much thinner base is light grey or taupe, accents
seem darker grey or darker taupe. This is the only one that has side
buckles in red/orange.

Cindy what did you do?

The orange on the side would not be seen from a frontal view photo. Pic #1 could have the same orange on the side. I do think they are 3 different seats but 1 and 3 are the same model, different colors.

Imbackon
10-24-2009, 02:04 PM
Well one things for sure, LE has possession of more photos of the seat taken into evidence, and probably more photos taken from the A's home where the car seat is featured.
I think from the depo is can be surmised that LE knows something, and that something will be in evidence at the trial.
The differences between the seats will be more evident with more photos and the seats themselves in evidence.

lizzysf
10-24-2009, 02:06 PM
Well one things for sure, LE has possession of more photos of the seat taken into evidence, and probably more photos taken from the A's home where the car seat is featured.
I think from the depo is can be surmised that LE knows something, and that something will be in evidence at the trial.
The differences between the seats will be more evident with more photos and the seats themselves in evidence.
Me thinks Cindy is in deep doodah with the carseats.. Can't wait for the TADA! moment when the SA feeds it to her on the stand..

sumbunny
10-24-2009, 02:24 PM
Well it seems cindy still has "her" carseat in the attic. Why aren't they picking that up before she has a garage sale?

gaelicpeas
10-24-2009, 03:03 PM
It is clear to me that carseat #1 and carseat #3 are different! Great find! I have been reading WS for months, but never joined, and I had to join just to say I agree these are different carseats!

Also, on one of the threads they are discussing 2 different Mama dolls. In that thread, there is one more view of carseat #1.

ExpectingUnicorns
10-24-2009, 03:10 PM
It is clear to me that carseat #1 and carseat #3 are different! Great find! I have been reading WS for months, but never joined, and I had to join just to say I agree these are different carseats!

Also, on one of the threads they are discussing 2 different Mama dolls. In that thread, there is one more view of carseat #1.

So glad you decided to join in ~ I love your name! Thanks for the info on the other picture. And . . .


:Welcome-12-june:

lizzysf
10-24-2009, 03:16 PM
It is clear to me that carseat #1 and carseat #3 are different! Great find! I have been reading WS for months, but never joined, and I had to join just to say I agree these are different carseats!

Also, on one of the threads they are discussing 2 different Mama dolls. In that thread, there is one more view of carseat #1.
Anyone know how to bring that photo over here and add it to the other 3?

gaelicpeas
10-24-2009, 03:23 PM
Anyone know how to bring that photo over here and add it to the other 3? I will try, but now I can't remember what thread it is on! I will look, though... maybe we can just ask whoever posted it to post it over here, too.

static
10-24-2009, 03:25 PM
So...if in fact she did a switch...the question is why? To remove evidence (ie: blood) or merely odor control? And why does she begin to cry when the carseat subject starts? The whole inside of the car stunk to high heaven..would changing the carseat or cover make a difference? I think she switched it because she saw blood. Which takes me back to the missing upper left lateral incisor...and the theory that Casey hit Caylee while she was in the carseat.

I agree with you on this. Casey could have even thrown something at her, put her in the carseat so violently she hit her tooth while getting in the car(the top part of the car while the door is open. No matter what the situation was, something is being hidden. I have a gut feeling this will appear in doc dumps later on...the syringe as well.

gaelicpeas
10-24-2009, 03:32 PM
http://cayleeanthony.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/cayleemarie-age254-1.jpg

That is the link that Harmony2 posted on the Evidence thread that has the picture. I can't seem to copy the pic, though. I will try something else and see if I can get it to copy.

gaelicpeas
10-24-2009, 03:35 PM
maybe this will work - if not, I give up!

http://cayleeanthony.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/cayleemarie-age254-1.jpg

ETA: it worked.

Woe.be.gone
10-24-2009, 03:36 PM
Thank You for your post. Casey likes to give clues to Lee with their code talk. Cindy we are finding out likes to plant new tidbits of info she plans to manipulate into a defense tactic. It's become a regular occurence and a lot of us on here do not trust anything Cindy offers as the truth.

Your theory above would fit perfectly if LE found out those new seat covers for the Pontiac were in use, but Cindy is saying they never were put on, and she is now saying they were missing from the trunk. Very good sleuthing, woe.be.gone. We know Cindy usually throws these things into the story for a reason.

Wish we could figure out if the crime happened in the car.

And Why?

As I read CA's depo further (I can only handle 75 pages at a time), she says they have the extra seat covers for the Pontiac at home. They revisited the subject later in the depo.

I sure hope LE confirms this and goes to see/get the never used covers. Also I hope they have a way to verify that the covers CA claims to have at home weren't conveniently picked up yesterday if you know what I mean.

lizzysf
10-24-2009, 03:37 PM
I agree with you on this. Casey could have even thrown something at her, put her in the carseat so violently she hit her tooth while getting in the car(the top part of the car while the door is open. No matter what the situation was, something is being hidden. I have a gut feeling this will appear in doc dumps later on...the syringe as well.And now with the possible switcharoo on Mama Doll, which I hadn't heard of until today, my suspicion is even higher. What was on the doll besides smell? Why switch it over the smell alone when the whole car smells the same..?

gaelicpeas
10-24-2009, 03:38 PM
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/caylee202620doll.jpg
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/cayleeride.jpg
THE SEAT OCSO HAS:
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/08_09.jpg

NONE OF THE COVERS LOOK THE SAME. SEE PIC #1..HOW HIGH THE BACK INSERT GOES?
SEE #2 COMPLETELY DIFFERENT THAN THE OTHER 2
SEE PIC # 3 BACK INSET MUCH LOWER THAN PIC #1

ALL 3 DIFFER.

I say Cindy changed the seat cover.

Also, if you look at the left side of carseat #1 (our left), there is an insert of something in the left upright part. But in carseat #3, that insert seems to be missing.

static
10-24-2009, 03:38 PM
I tried to lighten it, hope this helps.

gaelicpeas
10-24-2009, 03:41 PM
I tried to lighten it, hope this helps.I guess I haven't been a member long enough to view this image. Can you post the actual image? TIA

static
10-24-2009, 03:45 PM
I guess I haven't been a member long enough to view this image. Can you post the actual image? TIA

I am not sure, it is the same pic you posted, I didn't realize you had posted it, I move a little slow sometimes:)

static
10-24-2009, 03:47 PM
Now, if we could get Judge Judy to interrogate Cindy...I would pay for a ticket to see that.

gaelicpeas
10-24-2009, 03:49 PM
I am not sure, it is the same pic you posted, I didn't realize you had posted it, I move a little slow sometimes:)lol, no worries. At the rate I am going this morning, I will have enough posts soon to view it!

I used the insert image icon to post the pic. But maybe I am able to view mine since it is saved to my computer now, but can't view yours? lol, I am too new here to know exactly why I can't see it. Sorry...

sleutherontheside
10-24-2009, 03:50 PM
I guess I haven't been a member long enough to view this image.* Can you post the actual image?* TIAWELCOME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Take some time to visit the game room.* You will boost your post # quickly and be able to soon view images.* Lot's of good stuff on here you'll want to see.

lizzysf
10-24-2009, 03:51 PM
Now, if we could get Judge Judy to interrogate Cindy...I would pay for a ticket to see that.
Yeah! If it doesn't make sense, it's a lie...or something to that effect.. That would be an event to see! Imagine those two in the ring.. Cindy would put up one h@ll of a contest, but I believe JJ would smack her down in finality.

sleutherontheside
10-24-2009, 03:54 PM
Hey guys.....a bit OT. This thread is 6 pages long and there were zero tags. I added some, but please take time to review tags and add when needed. It will make searches much easier. No tags means good info we are missing.

Bee Charmer
10-24-2009, 04:12 PM
It is clear to me that carseat #1 and carseat #3 are different! Great find! I have been reading WS for months, but never joined, and I had to join just to say I agree these are different carseats!

Also, on one of the threads they are discussing 2 different Mama dolls. In that thread, there is one more view of carseat #1.

Hiya Gael, it's me Scampi....... :woohoo:

Snaz
10-24-2009, 04:13 PM
I think carseat #1 and carseat #3 are the same carseat and here's why: That black insert (the piece that actually says 'Eddie Bauer') that Caylee is leaning up against in #1 is the same insert as in #3, only it is up much higher in #1. If you look at where the holes are for the harness to come through that black insert, in pic #3, they are quite low... because the black insert is down lower. In pic #1, the harness couldn't have been that low or it would have been at or even below Caylee's waist.

Plus you can tell by the handles where Caylee has her hand rested that the two are exactly the same in that area, as well.

JMO

lizzysf
10-24-2009, 04:30 PM
I think carseat #1 and carseat #3 are the same carseat and here's why: That black insert (the piece that actually says 'Eddie Bauer') that Caylee is leaning up against in #1 is the same insert as in #3, only it is up much higher in #1. If you look at where the holes are for the harness to come through that black insert, in pic #3, they are quite low... because the black insert is down lower. In pic #1, the harness couldn't have been that low or it would have been at or even below Caylee's waist.

Plus you can tell by the handles where Caylee has her hand rested that the two are exactly the same in that area, as well.

JMO
I googled images for Eddie Bauer carseats..and the shoulder straps all originate from very low on the backrest area.
Like this one:
http://images.hayneedle.com/mgen/master:DJG053.jpg
and this one:
http://common3.csnimages.com/lf/1/hash/894/237978/1/Deluxe+High+Back+Booster+Car+Seat+in+Astoria+Black +and+Gray.jpg

Snaz
10-24-2009, 05:08 PM
I googled images for Eddie Bauer carseats..and the shoulder straps all originate from very low on the backrest area.
Like this one:
http://images.hayneedle.com/mgen/master:DJG053.jpg
and this one:
http://common3.csnimages.com/lf/1/hash/894/237978/1/Deluxe+High+Back+Booster+Car+Seat+in+Astoria+Black +and+Gray.jpg

Thank you for your research, and I understand what you are saying... but since neither of those carseats are the same as the ones in the pictures, it is really hard to compare them. I was referring to specifically THAT carseat.

lizzysf
10-24-2009, 05:18 PM
Thank you for your research, and I understand what you are saying... but since neither of those carseats are the same as the ones in the pictures, it is really hard to compare them. I was referring to specifically THAT carseat.
Gotcha..wish I could find the exact on online. I just noticed something else too though. Comparing pic's number 1&3...See on the grey part where there appears to be an insert of possibly different fabric? Note the difference how low it is on #3 and much higher on #1...and the grey part of the seat is fixed, whereas the black backrest may be an insert and moveable (ie: slide down)..
Look from the peak of the grey part at the top of the chair and visually track down the edge of the seat to where that fabric insert begins on both.. They look different.

Sorry for my wretched Paint Skills..

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/caylee202620doll-1-1.jpghttp://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/08_09.jpg

Doesn't the distance on #1 look shorter than #3? In #1 the top of her head looks to be 2-3 inches from the top of the seat...look where that fabric top is... Place her in seat # 3, again top of head 2-3 " from the top...that fabric would be much lower.

Snaz
10-24-2009, 05:44 PM
Gotcha..wish I could find the exact on online. I just noticed something else too though. Comparing pic's number 1&3...See on the grey part where there appears to be an insert of possibly different fabric? Note the difference how low it is on #3 and much higher on #1...and the grey part of the seat is fixed, whereas the black backrest may be an insert and moveable (aka slide down)..
Look from the peak of the grey part at the top of the chair and visually track down the edge of the seat to where that fabric insert begins on both.. They look different.

Sorry for my wretched Paint Skills..

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/caylee202620doll-1-1.jpghttp://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/08_09.jpg

Doesn't the distance on #1 look shorter than #3? In #1 her the top of her head looks to be 2-3 inches from the top of the seat...look where that fabric top is... Place her in seat # 3, again top of head 2-3 " from the top...that fabric would be much lower.


That black insert is actually what I was referring to when I said one is higher than the other... I think it is adjustable and can be moved up and down. That's one of the reasons I believe they are the same carseat.

lizzysf
10-24-2009, 06:13 PM
That black insert is actually what I was referring to when I said one is higher than the other... I think it is adjustable and can be moved up and down. That's one of the reasons I believe they are the same carseat.But do you agree that the grey part of the seat would be fixed? The top of that side fabric insert measures about mid-face with her head 2-3 inches from the top of the actual seat. If she was sitting in seat #3 with her head 2-3 inches from the top...the top of the fabric insert wouldn't reach her face. I agree.. the black pad may be moveable, but not the grey.

Snaz
10-24-2009, 06:17 PM
But do you agree that the grey part of the seat would be fixed? The top of that side fabric insert measures about mid-face with her head 2-3 inches from the top of the actual seat. If she was sitting in seat #3 with her head 2-3 inches from the top...the top of the fabric insert wouldn't reach her face. I agree.. the black pad may be moveable, but not the grey.

Yes, I absolutely agree that the lighter grey fabric is fixed... and the black is most likely adjustable. That was my original reason in believing those two seats are the same carseat.

lizzysf
10-24-2009, 06:29 PM
That black insert is actually what I was referring to when I said one is higher than the other... I think it is adjustable and can be moved up and down. That's one of the reasons I believe they are the same carseat.

Ok..then visually pull up the black insert on #3 to the top of the chair... Look where the Eddie Bauer logo would be in comparison to the top of the grey fabric insert on the left of the chair. Now look at chair #1, with the insert already up to the top. Compare THAT Eddie Bauer logo position with the top of the fabric insert on the left. Way differerent. The grey part of the chair looks different in 1 and 3.

Snaz
10-24-2009, 06:37 PM
Ok..then visually pull up the black insert on #3 to the top of the chair... Look where the Eddie Bauer logo would be in comparison to the top of the grey fabric insert on the left of the chair. Now look at chair #1, with the insert already up to the top. Compare THAT Eddie Bauer logo position with the top of the fabric insert on the left. Way differerent. The grey part of the chair looks different in 1 and 3.

LOL... I guess we will have to agree to disagree on this one. To me, the 'Eddie Bauer' logo looks to be in exactly the same position on the black insert in both pic #1 and pic #3.

gaelicpeas
10-24-2009, 08:00 PM
LOL... I guess we will have to agree to disagree on this one. To me, the 'Eddie Bauer' logo looks to be in exactly the same position on the black insert in both pic #1 and pic #3.The logo, I agree, would probably be in the same place if that black part was slid up.

BUT, I agree with lizzy that these are 2 different carseats. That part on our left side looking at the pics is very different, IMO. Plus, why would the adjustable part be UP in an earlier pic, then DOWN in the evidence pic, obviously taken later.

Lizzy, you should forward these pics to the SA, IMO.

lizzysf
10-24-2009, 09:18 PM
The logo, I agree, would probably be in the same place if that black part was slid up.

BUT, I agree with lizzy that these are 2 different carseats. That part on our left side looking at the pics is very different, IMO. Plus, why would the adjustable part be UP in an earlier pic, then DOWN in the evidence pic, obviously taken later.

Lizzy, you should forward these pics to the SA, IMO. I am not disagreeing that the logos would both be in the same place if the black pad in seat 3 were pulled up. Yes. They would be the same. But the distance from the logo (both pulled up, to an equal level) would be a different distance to the top of the grey fabric insert on the arm to the left of each seat. The distance on #3 is longer than #1. That's why I drew the red marker on that pic to illustrate it.
It's not that i'm trying to force feed my opinion... I just don't think we aren't on the same page with the focal point on the pic I am failing miserably at describing. :) I am specifically making reference to the grey part inconsistencies, not the black cushion. Sorry for the confusion. Hey..no one has to agree, i'm ok with that..just want to make sure we are talking about the same thing.

gaelicpeas
10-24-2009, 09:30 PM
I am not disagreeing that the logos would both be in the same place if the black pad in seat 3 were pulled up. Yes. They would be the same. But the distance from the logo (both pulled up, to an equal level) would be a different distance to the top of the grey fabric insert on the arm to the left of each seat. The distance on #3 is longer than #1. That's why I drew the red marker on that pic to illustrate it.
It's not that i'm trying to force feed my opinion... I just don't think we are discussing the same focal point on the pic. I am specifically making reference to the grey part inconsistencies, not the black cushion. Sorry for the confusion. Hey..no one has to agree, i'm ok with that..just want to make sure we are talking about the same thing.I completely agree with what you are saying, Lizzy. Plus, not only that inconsistency, but that part on the left side on the evidence pic is MISSING.

lizzysf
10-24-2009, 09:53 PM
I completely agree with what you are saying, Lizzy. Plus, not only that inconsistency, but that part on the left side on the evidence pic is MISSING.
So you understand what I was comparing? Whew. My downfall is articulating what's in my head sometimes!! LOL. I can see it but I can't say it simply and clearly.. Do you think the 2 distances are different or the same? What part is missing on the evidence pic?

sumbunny
10-24-2009, 09:59 PM
Caylee got bigger not smaller..Why would the insert be smaller if she were bigger?
It makes no sense.

I do believe they are different carseats. Completely different colors as well.

noto different carseats per say *both the same type of carseat* just not the one casey always had in her car.
They are the same seats, different colors imo
and the inserts aren't identical. One sits lower then the other.

IMO as the child gets bigger the insert would be higher. Depending on where the straps are located. The bigger the child the higher the straps are..moving the insert higher along with the straps. Smaller children have lower straps, as the child ages, the straps are moved higher. *(thus moving the insert)

***sorry for my poor grammar I live in quebec and was taught in french***

MOO

MD MOMMY
10-25-2009, 12:53 AM
I think it's the same seat. Most infant seats are good until about 40lbs. My daughter is just 40 lbs at 4 years-old. The middle section goes up to accomodate the shoulder straps, as you raise them as the child gets taller. The head rest found in the 1st pic comes off. JMO.

Truthwillsetufree
10-25-2009, 01:33 AM
That black insert is actually what I was referring to when I said one is higher than the other... I think it is adjustable and can be moved up and down. That's one of the reasons I believe they are the same carseat.

I theorize these are two different carseats from the very fact alone the big orange circle on the side is not visible in one, although it is obvious in one picture the round thing is black. It's just not that hard to figure out. JMO.

static
10-25-2009, 06:01 AM
That is my opinion as well. 2 different car seats altogether.

Misfitdolly
10-25-2009, 09:09 AM
I theorize these are two different carseats from the very fact alone the big orange circle on the side is not visible in one, although it is obvious in one picture the round thing is black. It's just not that hard to figure out. JMO.

The orange circle is only on the outside of the seat and the inside where the circle is it is black. Pic one does not show the outside of the seat, therefore you do not see the orange. It does not mean it isn't there.

Misfitdolly
10-25-2009, 09:20 AM
I consulted with some car seat gurus at a car seat board and they all were in agreement that the 3 seats are one and the same but the lighting in pic #3 makes it look a different color. The arm rest in seat #2 is down and it is up in the other 2 pictures (it folds up and goes underneath the cover). They said it is the Eddie Bauer Deluxe Booster in Astor. Here is one I found in a different color. click the pic for an enlarged photo.
http://www.likemyprices.com/product_info.php/products_id/4919907?osCsid=fcc2596a7593414972cfb807d3314be7

gaelicpeas
10-25-2009, 11:00 AM
I consulted with some car seat gurus at a car seat board and they all were in agreement that the 3 seats are one and the same but the lighting in pic #3 makes it look a different color. The arm rest in seat #2 is down and it is up in the other 2 pictures (it folds up and goes underneath the cover). They said it is the Eddie Bauer Deluxe Booster in Astor. Here is one I found in a different color. click the pic for an enlarged photo.
http://www.likemyprices.com/product_info.php/products_id/4919907?osCsid=fcc2596a7593414972cfb807d3314be7I agree that the lighting is very different, and also the scale. But the sides are very different, IMO.

TinTX
10-25-2009, 11:28 AM
What if KC had a carseat (#1 or #3) and CA kept a carseat in her car (#2) for convenience? If so, which carseat has been admitted as evidence? CA's or KC's? Now I want to see the remaining carseat that is supposedly in the attic. (My apologies if this has been previously discussed.)

gaelicpeas
10-25-2009, 11:33 AM
What if KC had a carseat (#1 or #3) and CA kept a carseat in her car (#2) for convenience? If so, which carseat has been admitted as evidence? CA's or KC's? Now I want to see the remaining carseat that is supposedly in the attic. (My apologies if this has been previously discussed.)A grey and black carseat has been admitted as evidence - it is the pic #3 posted earlier. CA said in her depo that hers is in the attic and it is a different color (I think she said it was brown and tan).

cecybeans
10-25-2009, 12:09 PM
Maybe they purchased a third car seat when GA returned home so he could transport the baby when necessary. I'd think he was doing a lot of the daytime babysitting while CA was at work. I don't think they'd leave him out of the equation, especially if he had to take her to the doctor's. Perhaps he and KC had the same model and color and CA's was different, and they used the "extra" one to switch out covers, etc.

gaelicpeas
10-25-2009, 12:15 PM
Maybe they purchased a third car seat when GA returned home so he could transport the baby when necessary. I'd think he was doing a lot of the daytime babysitting while CA was at work. I don't think they'd leave him out of the equation, especially if he had to take her to the doctor's. Perhaps he and KC had the same model and color and CA's was different, and they used the "extra" one to switch out covers, etc.Could be, although Cindy never mentioned in her depo that George had one. FWIW, lol.

cecybeans
10-25-2009, 12:27 PM
Could be, although Cindy never mentioned in her depo that George had one. FWIW, lol.

Well, that right there is a "red flag"! These people have had a year to corroborate things, and if the car seat situation happened the day they picked up the Pontiac, and they knew it would be evidence from the get-go; I'm sure that car seat was up in the attic before LE even returned for the car. Probably by the time those pants hit the dryer.

texaslb218
10-25-2009, 12:31 PM
Well, that right there is a "red flag"! These people have had a year to corroborate things, and if the car seat situation happened the day they picked up the Pontiac, and they knew it would be evidence from the get-go; I'm sure that car seat was up in the attic before LE even returned for the car. Probably by the time those pants hit the dryer.

Coverup already started!

gaelicpeas
10-25-2009, 12:33 PM
Well, that right there is a "red flag"! These people have had a year to corroborate things, and if the car seat situation happened the day they picked up the Pontiac, and they knew it would be evidence from the get-go; I'm sure that car seat was up in the attic before LE even returned for the car. Probably by the time those pants hit the dryer.I wonder how much attention the towyard manager paid to the carseat? Wonder if he could identify it as the one in evidence?

Baxter
10-25-2009, 12:56 PM
Could be, although Cindy never mentioned in her depo that George had one. FWIW, lol.

But, they never asked. If Cindy was doing a switch-a-roo, she would not have voluntarily supplied this information.

lizzysf
10-25-2009, 01:08 PM
Even though nothing yet (including the pics) has proven that switch occurred, I believe it did occur. The depo with Cindy convinces me it has and that LE knows too. Too many red flags in the depo regarding it.
And if in fact the doll was switched too.. it is for the same reason. Both had evidence that an event occured in the carseat. Cindy's crying during those specific questions helps confirm it to me as well.

lizzysf
10-25-2009, 03:18 PM
Pic #1
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/caylee202620doll-4.jpg

Pic#3
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/08_09-2-1.jpg
If you believe that chair #3 is reclined, if you sat it upright she would sit even higher in the chair, lengthening the distance even more...which you can see in upright pic #1, is not the case. (or she would stay the same, but definetely not sit lower in the upright position) So even if the black pad in pic #3 is just slid down, raising it to the top does not cause the chairs to then match.
If chair #1 is already reclined like #3, or both are upright, the distances still are still different.
The Eddie Bauer logo's alone, both pads pulled up equally with logos in the same place on both chairs, shows a difference in distance to the red dot reference point.

So this is either an entirely different chair, a different pad, or a different chair base (grey part).
Again..sorry for my Paint skills :(

carrie
10-25-2009, 04:57 PM
JMO but I believe it's the same car seat in both pictures, #1 and #3.

In th evidence photo, the insert/liner/pad whatever it's called, is in a different position. They probably took it apart to examine it and then put it back in a little off kilter or haphazardly. It's the same pad/insert. It's just not in the position it would be in during use by a child. JMO.

lizzysf
10-25-2009, 05:03 PM
JMO but I believe it's the same car seat in both pictures, #1 and #3.

In th evidence photo, the insert/liner/pad whatever it's called, is in a different position. They probably took it apart to examine it and then put it back in a little off kilter or haphazardly. It's the same pad/insert. It's just not in the position it would be in during use by a child. JMO.
That's why in pic #3, I raised the pad like in pic #1.

carrie
10-25-2009, 05:14 PM
That's why in pic #3, I raised the pad like in pic #1.

When I try to imagine/visualize the pad pulled up, the logo is at the same height in both pics. As for the distance from the logo to the dot you note as being different, to me, it isn't enough of a difference for me to believe it's a different pad or seat. The photos show different angles/points of view of the car seat and I think that probably accounts for that IMO small difference.

[Thanks btw for combining the photos for us so we can try to compare them :) ]

CarrieSis
10-25-2009, 05:19 PM
The carseats are the same, IMO (which doesn't mean a cover wasn't replaced at any point in time. The things are removable and replaceable).

The reason the black pad is lower in the 2nd pic is because what holds it "up" is the harness straps when tightened around a child. Without the child in the seat, the pad would "slip down" to touch the bottom of the inner carseat seat (its natural position at the lowest harness setting).

In the comparison of the 2 different pictures I think perspective - foreshortening - is at fault. The first has the seat positioned more head-on towards the viewer, and the second is at a much different side-angle. This makes it look like points don't line up when they in fact do IRL.

Another angle:
http://ypyp.com/deals/product_thumb.php?img=../images/dg/206317/300.jpg&w=150&h=150

Here's a video with the seat type in question http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://l.yimg.com/a/i/us/sch/cn/v/v3/w485/1214444_100_70.jpeg&imgrefurl=http://video.yahoo.com/watch/1296199/5614132&usg=__RVIFGz6H7KQEl0i6KRF5F2jdqHk=&h=70&w=100&sz=3&hl=en&start=258&um=1&tbnid=YcV_u9BFMED_eM:&tbnh=57&tbnw=82&prev=/images%3Fq%3DEddie%2BBauer%2BDeluxe%2BBooster%26nd sp%3D20%26hl%3Den%26safe%3Doff%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official%26sa%3DN%26start%3D240%26um%3D1

/not a carseat tech, but faithfully haunting carseat.org since 2003.

lizzysf
10-25-2009, 05:25 PM
When I try to imagine/visualize the pad pulled up, the logo is at the same height in both pics. As for the distance from the logo to the dot you note as being different, to me, it isn't enough of a difference for me to believe it's a different pad or seat. The photos show different angles/points of view of the car seat and I think that probably accounts for that IMO small difference.

[Thanks btw for combining the photos for us so we can try to compare them :) ]
That's why I drew the line of reference differently in each pic from eye to side of chair to accomodate for the different angles of the pics. Not with 100% angle accuracy, but very close I think. I used the slant of the Eddie Bauer logo in each pic for the same slant on my reference lines. The pics are also in different scale.

The logos would be in the same position on each chair if both pads are pulled up to the top. Yes.

cecybeans
10-25-2009, 06:31 PM
But, they never asked. If Cindy was doing a switch-a-roo, she would not have voluntarily supplied this information.

Truly. This is the same woman who cackled that she should have given LE the dog's toothbrush and surrendered the "half-truth" hairbrush of Caylee and KC.

lizzysf
10-25-2009, 07:41 PM
Dimensions of the chair itself ....(ignore the black pad;))
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/C1.jpg
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/C3.jpg


Angle nor scale should account for this much difference in the 2, IMO.

carrie
10-25-2009, 07:43 PM
That's why I drew the line of reference differently in each pic from eye to side of chair to accomodate for the different angles of the pics. Not with 100% angle accuracy, but very close I think. I used the slant of the Eddie Bauer logo in each pic for the same slant on my reference lines. The pics are also in different scale.

The logos would be in the same position on each chair if both pads are pulled up to the top. Yes.

Respectfully, I just don't see it. I understand what you did with the photos and what you're saying, they just still look like the same pad and car seat IMO.

That's one of the great thing about WS, we can agree to disagree. :)

lizzysf
10-25-2009, 08:10 PM
Respectfully, I just don't see it. I understand what you did with the photos and what you're saying, they just still look like the same pad and car seat IMO.

That's one of the great thing about WS, we can agree to disagree. :)Oh, I agree! The post wasn't for you specifically... I am just banging away at every angle I can think of to size the two up. For me and for anyone who has doubts about the 2 being the same. I see the two as different, others may not.. no problem. ;)

carrie
10-25-2009, 08:16 PM
Dimensions of the chair itself ....(ignore the black pad;))
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/C1.jpg
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/C3.jpg


Angle nor scale should account for this much difference in the 2, IMO.


Besides being a different camera, lighting, and angle, the lens is a different focal length.

The combination of a different angle and a different length lens can make a big difference.

Truthwillsetufree
10-25-2009, 10:01 PM
The orange circle is only on the outside of the seat and the inside where the circle is it is black. Pic one does not show the outside of the seat, therefore you do not see the orange. It does not mean it isn't there.

The picture/link you provided the carseat is at the same angle as Caylee's carseat. If caylee's carseat had that big bright orange circle on it, we would be able to see it, just like in the picture you provided. I have to say 2 different carseats.

http://www.likemyprices.com/product_info.php/products_id/4919907?osCsid=fcc2596a7593414972cfb807d3314be7

spqr
10-25-2009, 10:18 PM
I'll grant you that on the infant picture...but how do you explain the difference between pic # 1 and OCSO's pic #3?

I'd say pic #1 was a seat cover and pic #3 shows it was removed. Look at the difference in the height of the black insert on the backrest. Completely different.
Pic #1 looks more plush while pic #3 looks like the bare bone seat or different cover.

Lizzysf,

You are absolutely correct...two different car seats. Same manufacturer(eddie bauer) but definitely two different models. jmo

Truthwillsetufree
10-25-2009, 10:22 PM
The carseats are the same, IMO (which doesn't mean a cover wasn't replaced at any point in time. The things are removable and replaceable).

The reason the black pad is lower in the 2nd pic is because what holds it "up" is the harness straps when tightened around a child. Without the child in the seat, the pad would "slip down" to touch the bottom of the inner carseat seat (its natural position at the lowest harness setting).

In the comparison of the 2 different pictures I think perspective - foreshortening - is at fault. The first has the seat positioned more head-on towards the viewer, and the second is at a much different side-angle. This makes it look like points don't line up when they in fact do IRL.

Another angle:
http://ypyp.com/deals/product_thumb.php?img=../images/dg/206317/300.jpg&w=150&h=150

Here's a video with the seat type in question http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://l.yimg.com/a/i/us/sch/cn/v/v3/w485/1214444_100_70.jpeg&imgrefurl=http://video.yahoo.com/watch/1296199/5614132&usg=__RVIFGz6H7KQEl0i6KRF5F2jdqHk=&h=70&w=100&sz=3&hl=en&start=258&um=1&tbnid=YcV_u9BFMED_eM:&tbnh=57&tbnw=82&prev=/images%3Fq%3DEddie%2BBauer%2BDeluxe%2BBooster%26nd sp%3D20%26hl%3Den%26safe%3Doff%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official%26sa%3DN%26start%3D240%26um%3D1

/not a carseat tech, but faithfully haunting carseat.org since 2003.

The pad of the seat you have pictured is not removeable, therefore, it will not slip down if a child is in or out of it. The carseat you have pictured is the Eddie Bauer Deluxe Convetible seat for a child 22-40 pounds, 34-43 inches in height and over 1 year in age.
So where is Caylee's first carseat?

Truthwillsetufree
10-25-2009, 10:29 PM
Dimensions of the chair itself ....(ignore the black pad;))
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/C1.jpg
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/C3.jpg


Angle nor scale should account for this much difference in the 2, IMO.

I would surmise that the top photo is a new carseat to accomodate Caylee's increase in size. The bottom photo was Caylee's first carseat that held her as an infant and up to a certain size. JMO. There are 2 carseats.

christee
10-25-2009, 10:35 PM
I found an earlier pic of Caylee in EB? car seat:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=847&pictureid=8710

JBean
10-25-2009, 10:40 PM
do you guys want me to add a poll? they look just the same to me. But the differences in models of one manufacturer can be subtle. I don't think we have enough info to be able to tell for sure.

Baxter
10-25-2009, 10:49 PM
do you guys want me to add a poll? they look just the same to me. But the differences in models of one manufacturer can be subtle. I don't think we have enough info to be able to tell for sure.

That would be great!

76GaRN
10-25-2009, 11:38 PM
IMHO they are definitely two different seats based on the fact that the straps of the harness in #1 are black, the same as the TRIM around the chest strap pad and in #3 the straps are light gray--the same color as the CENTER of the chest strap pad

carrie
10-25-2009, 11:49 PM
The picture/link you provided the carseat is at the same angle as Caylee's carseat. If caylee's carseat had that big bright orange circle on it, we would be able to see it, just like in the picture you provided. I have to say 2 different carseats.

http://www.likemyprices.com/product_info.php/products_id/4919907?osCsid=fcc2596a7593414972cfb807d3314be7

I have to respectfully disagree. I don't see how you can say the pics are from the same angle. They are not.

Pic#1 is taken from what looks like the front passenger seat-perhaps leaning in toward the middle of the front seat. It's basically from almost directly in front of Caylee and the car seat. It's from quite close also and Caylee's legs look a bit out of proportion (larger) due to the angle.

Pic#3 is taken from the angle of the back driver's side door. Either through the open window, or the door is open and the camera person is standing there. This angle looks down more on the car seat from a standing position whereas, by contrast, in pic #1, the camera person is much closer to Caylee's eye level (due to being inside the car and therefore in a sitting position)

Also they are taken with lenses of different focal lengths-which will alter the angle and perspective of a picture even if it's taken from the same physical location, angle, and distance from the subject.

I'm basing this on my experience as a photographer. I've been an avid amateur photographer for 23 years. I also do some professional work, mostly portraits but also some weddings, anniversary parties, birthdays, etc.

lizzysf
10-25-2009, 11:55 PM
IMHO they are definitely two different seats based on the fact that the straps of the harness in #1 are black, the same as the TRIM around the chest strap pad and in #3 the straps are light gray--the same color as the CENTER of the chest strap pad

Unless it is flipped backwards there.. we don't know what the inside part is colored like...

But why would they reverse the color pattern of the trim and center of the strap on the inside? Makes no sense. You would think the color patterning would be the same on both sides for ease of manufacturing...why take the time/effort to switch it when you dont even see the inside surface? Color coded this way for front and back?

Misfitdolly
10-25-2009, 11:58 PM
I would surmise that the top photo is a new carseat to accomodate Caylee's increase in size. The bottom photo was Caylee's first carseat that held her as an infant and up to a certain size. JMO. There are 2 carseats.

The 3rd pic is also a booster seat and would not be a first car seat. Her first car seat would have likely been a bucket type infant car seat with a handle to carry it.

lizzysf
10-26-2009, 12:02 AM
I noticed on pic #3 also that on the black pad which appears to be faded grey because of the lighting...the two spots where the straps come out of the back pad a a very nice black, not grey. Why are they black? Is this normally a plastic area?
The plastic arms showing black seems normal because of the reflection.
There are also two rows of blacker piping around the inside and perimeter of the pad in seat #3.

Truthwillsetufree
10-26-2009, 12:06 AM
I have to respectfully disagree. I don't see how you can say the pics are from the same angle. They are not.

Pic#1 is taken from what looks like the front passenger seat-perhaps leaning in toward the middle of the front seat. It's basically from almost directly in front of Caylee and the car seat. It's from quite close also and Caylee's legs look a bit out of proportion (larger) due to the angle.

Pic#3 is taken from the angle of the back driver's side door. Either through the open window, or the door is open and the camera person is standing there. This angle looks down more on the car seat from a standing position whereas, by contrast, in pic #1, the camera person is much closer to Caylee's eye level (due to being inside the car and therefore in a sitting position)

Also they are taken with lenses of different focal lengths-which will alter the angle and perspective of a picture even if it's taken from the same physical location, angle, and distance from the subject.

I'm basing this on my experience as a photographer. I've been an avid amateur photographer for 23 years. I also do some professional work, mostly portraits but also some weddings, anniversary parties, birthdays, etc.

I respect your opinion as a photographer. It is 2 different car seats. The carseat Caylee is sitting in the cushion thing is not removeable and see the black center, behind Caylee's head that goes over the back of the carseat, this is the part that attaches to the car itself. This carseat is meant to hold a biggger, heavier child. If you look at the 2nd picture, this carseat does not have this feature. I would guess at one time this carseat had the infant head holder, but has since been removed, as this was a feature on this carseat. This was Caylee's first carseat as it is not as Deluxe as the one she is pictured in. JMO.

Truthwillsetufree
10-26-2009, 12:13 AM
The 3rd pic is also a booster seat and would not be a first car seat. Her first car seat would have likely been a bucket type infant car seat with a handle to carry it.

Not on the all Eddie Bauer models.

lizzysf
10-26-2009, 12:14 AM
I have to respectfully disagree. I don't see how you can say the pics are from the same angle. They are not.

Pic#1 is taken from what looks like the front passenger seat-perhaps leaning in toward the middle of the front seat. It's basically from almost directly in front of Caylee and the car seat. It's from quite close also and Caylee's legs look a bit out of proportion (larger) due to the angle.

Pic#3 is taken from the angle of the back driver's side door. Either through the open window, or the door is open and the camera person is standing there. This angle looks down more on the car seat from a standing position whereas, by contrast, in pic #1, the camera person is much closer to Caylee's eye level (due to being inside the car and therefore in a sitting position)

Also they are taken with lenses of different focal lengths-which will alter the angle and perspective of a picture even if it's taken from the same physical location, angle, and distance from the subject.

I'm basing this on my experience as a photographer. I've been an avid amateur photographer for 23 years. I also do some professional work, mostly portraits but also some weddings, anniversary parties, birthdays, etc.Caylee is looking at the camera it appears..to whomever is in the DRIVERS seat taking it, not the passenger seat.

gaelicpeas
10-26-2009, 12:25 AM
IMO, lizzy has clearly pointed out how these 2 carseats are different. If ya can't see that, then I am just not sure what you are looking at. THESE ARE NOT THE SAME CARSEATS.... no how, no way.

lizzysf
10-26-2009, 12:34 AM
And picture # 3 is taken from just a tad bit higher level (still low enough to catch only the lower part of the back window on the left), outside the open door, angled through right behind the drivers seat headrest area. IMO.

christee
10-26-2009, 12:35 AM
I found another pic of younger Caylee. It doesn't look like "Eddie Bauer" on the fabric.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=847&pictureid=8712

gaelicpeas
10-26-2009, 12:36 AM
I found another pic of younger Caylee. It doesn't look like "Eddie Bauer" on the fabric.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=847&pictureid=8712I at first didn't think Eddie Bauer was on both pics of the carseat. But I am pretty sure now they both say Eddie Bauer.

lizzysf
10-26-2009, 12:39 AM
IMO, lizzy has clearly pointed out how these 2 carseats are different. If ya can't see that, then I am just not sure what you are looking at. THESE ARE NOT THE SAME CARSEATS.... no how, no way.
Thanks G.. but I haven't proven it...although I definetely think they are different.. but one vote doesn't count. :) and others may not agree.

Just Jayla
10-26-2009, 12:45 AM
Just a note about the possible difference in carseats. Convertible seats, meaning those meant to be used into toddlerhood, often come with an insert that provides additional cushioning around the head. As the child grows taller, the extra cushioning is easily removed. I had one much like this. If people opt for a seat like this as opposed to an infant carrier type then they do come with the removable head cushion. I think that is the situation here.

Agreed, I think 1 & 2 are the same, 3 is suspect, but could be a lighter color due to lighting...

lizzysf
10-26-2009, 12:46 AM
I found another pic of younger Caylee. It doesn't look like "Eddie Bauer" on the fabric.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=847&pictureid=8712
Can you post it ?

76GaRN
10-26-2009, 12:46 AM
The main difference I see is that the harness straps are black in #1 & 2 but gray in #3

lizzysf
10-26-2009, 12:56 AM
The main difference I see is that the harness straps are black in #1 & 2 but gray in #3
I think the grey you see is just from the difference in lighting.

lizzysf
10-26-2009, 01:06 AM
Dimensions of the chair itself ....(ignore the black pad;))

Imagine Caylee sitting in chair 3, with her head about 3 inches below the top like in pic one. The top of the fabric insert I marked on the left arm would not even reach her face. But in pic 1..it reaches to nose level on her. http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/C1.jpg
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/C3.jpg


Different angle, lens nor scale should account for this much difference in the 2, IMO.

gaelicpeas
10-26-2009, 01:10 AM
Imagine Caylee sitting in chair 3, with her head about 3 inches below the top like in pic one. The top of the fabric insert I marked on the left arm would not even reach her face. But in pic 1..it reaches to nose level on her.These carseats are clearly not the same. Makes me wonder why some protesteth too much. JMO

lizzysf
10-26-2009, 01:18 AM
We can't even see the top of the chair in pic #2 (younger Caylee) so I can't say for sure if it's same or different. It does match #1 from the parts I can see, but it would be great to be able to compare all 3. The only way to vote out 3 being the different one is to say 1 and 2 are the same. I was hoping to see a choice of 1 and 3 are different...because that's what I think...and #2 can't be evaluated because the pic is cut off at the top.

christee
10-26-2009, 01:21 AM
Can you post it ?
I did post it, is it not showing?

lizzysf
10-26-2009, 01:27 AM
I did post it, is it not showing?No.. where did you post it? What # post on this thread?

christee
10-26-2009, 01:30 AM
No.. where did you post it? What # post on this thread?
In #207 but I'll try something else and repost
brb

christee
10-26-2009, 01:41 AM
lizzysf,
Maybe this will work although it's such a small pic to begin with.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=847&pictureid=8712

ETA
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=847&pictureid=8712

lizzysf
10-26-2009, 01:45 AM
In pic 1...all the greys are darker...note inside of car panel and chair. Now look at pic 3. Everything is lighter, including inside of car.

The lighting is different.

By this, you can't really deduce that chair 3 is lighter than chair 1

gaelicpeas
10-26-2009, 01:55 AM
lizzysf,
Maybe this will work although it's such a small pic to begin with.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=847&pictureid=8712

ETA
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=847&pictureid=8712
I see nothing, sorry.

christee
10-26-2009, 02:13 AM
Last try on posting the pic

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=847&pictureid=8712

CarrieSis
10-26-2009, 03:31 AM
I'm sure, if we truly desired it, that carseat.org could point us in the right direction for determining all models of convertible OR forward-facing only 5pt harness seats made by Eddie Bauer from May 2003-Nov 2008. (Most carseats expire after 5 years and Cindy was probably aware of this even if KC wasn't.) They are sold at both Target and JCPenney among other places but those 2 that we know the Anthony's shopped at could narrow down the model #'s even further.

We can knock off a few more models easily due to design changes that include "wings" attached to the back pad in more recent models.

This was addressed to me:

The pad of the seat you have pictured is not removeable, therefore, it will not slip down if a child is in or out of it. The carseat you have pictured is the Eddie Bauer Deluxe Convetible seat for a child 22-40 pounds, 34-43 inches in height and over 1 year in age.
So where is Caylee's first carseat?

The seat I pictured and the ones shown in pic #1 and #3 being referred to, is of a CONVERTIBLE carseat; the answer is in your question. Convertible means it goes from (typically) 5-33lbs rear facing and then converts to face forward to around 40lbs. (Exact lb guidelines vary by manufacturer). This may indeed have been her first carseat OR the Anthony's may have had a single infant bucket seat (5-22lbs rearfacing only) with 2 seperate *bases* for when she was an infant (a common setup with parents using multiple cars).

The pad is not removable, but if you look at the height of the harness strap openings they are quite low; it's likely that the pad moves upward when the harness is adjusted higher in order for the holes to line up correctly.

I am unable to locate the manual for this model carseat online but will report back if I find it!

CarrieSis
10-26-2009, 03:37 AM
I believe I have located the manual :) There was a design change in January of 2006 that encompasses wings around the head, and this model predates that.
http://www.elitecarseats.com/assets/product_files/instructions/Eddie-Bauer/EddieBauer_3in1_manual.pdf

manatee
10-26-2009, 07:34 AM
I'm leaning to the theory that the pic #3 (exhibit) is showing CA carseat. CA & KC had the same kind and brand carseats. CA probably had not been using hers lately...so CA's carseat had not beem moved to the highest level where KCs was on pic 1 showing Caylee.
So CA switched her carseat for KC's. CA did not notice to switch the height of the seat belt straps...and she placed KC's in the attic do to the smell...she didn't think it would be noticed.

Why would the carseat found in the car have the seat belt straps LOWER than the pics of Caylee in it had them set at? no reasonable explanation for this :waitasec:

CA Mom
10-26-2009, 09:03 AM
I'm leaning to the theory that the pic #3 (exhibit) is showing CA carseat. CA & KC had the same kind and brand carseats. CA probably had not been using hers lately...so CA's carseat had not beem moved to the highest level where KCs was on pic 1 showing Caylee.
So CA switched her carseat for KC's. CA did not notice to switch the height of the seat belt straps...and she placed KC's in the attic do to the smell...she didn't think it would be noticed.

Why would the carseat found in the car have the seat belt straps LOWER than the pics of Caylee in it had them set at? no reasonable explanation for this :waitasec: I agree that CA forgot to adjust the belt straps in pic #3....caylee could not have been strapped in properly in this carseat pictured. But CA did take caylee to Mt. Dora on June 15th,so I'm thinking that the carseat CA had, would be properly adjusted. Maybe this carseat was an extra that GA would use if needed? Probably not very often and maybe the reason for the belt straps not being adjusted.

I do believe that LE knows this was not caylee's regular carseat, maybe having proof of purchases by CA and maybe statements by ppl who were in casey's car and can describe the carseat?

JBean
10-26-2009, 09:45 AM
These carseats are clearly not the same. Makes me wonder why some protesteth too much. JMO
Because there are different points of view on it. There are others that literally see it differently.

lizzysf
10-26-2009, 12:29 PM
IMHO they are definitely two different seats based on the fact that the straps of the harness in #1 are black, the same as the TRIM around the chest strap pad and in #3 the straps are light gray--the same color as the CENTER of the chest strap pad
I just looked at a messenger bag I have with a shoulder strap..it also has that pad on the strap like the carseat strap.. The outside of the that pad is black trimmed, with a grey/green center...but the opposite side is black trimmed with white comfort padding. That strap may just be flipped over in the pic and could be a different color than the front.

added:
But actually, if you look at the 2 pics..it appears to be the same side.. that center area would be the same in both if you match it to the seat cover in both pics respectively.

whisperOFwings
10-26-2009, 01:28 PM
Thank You for your post. Casey likes to give clues to Lee with their code talk. Cindy we are finding out likes to plant new tidbits of info she plans to manipulate into a defense tactic. It's become a regular occurence and a lot of us on here do not trust anything Cindy offers as the truth.

Your theory above would fit perfectly if LE found out those new seat covers for the Pontiac were in use, but Cindy is saying they never were put on, and she is now saying they were missing from the trunk. Very good sleuthing, woe.be.gone. We know Cindy usually throws these things into the story for a reason.

Wish we could figure out if the crime happened in the car.

And Why?


page 68 line 10

cindy-I have my car seat yes.
Q-ok, can you describe it?
cindy-it's an eddie bauer car seat
Q- color?
cindy-brown and tan. We put it away a few months ago--
Q ok
cindy- in the attic.
Q-and what kind of car seat did casey have for caylee?
cindy I'm not sure what the name of hers was. I know it was black and white, but I don't know what the make of it was. She picked it out. She bought it.
Q- ok. Did you always keep your car seat in yoru vehicle?
cindy- Uh-huh.
Q-What kind fo car did you have?
cindy- i have a 4runner
Q- Toyota 4 runner?
cindy uh-huh.
Q-okay. And do you have knowledge as to whether or not casey kept the car seat that she purchased in the vehicle she used?
cindy-Right, And she would use it in her car and then jesse would use it if he--if she--if he was watching caylee at his house, or she would take his truck to work and he'd use her car.

Bolded by me...
Whatever may have happened in the car... Cindy is, once again, trying to tie Jesse to it. :furious:

Marina2
10-26-2009, 02:01 PM
This car seat is "convertible" because it goes from using a harness sytem to restrain the smaller child to a seat which uses the car's own seat belt sytem, i.e. a booster seat, for the older child. It is not the type that can be used as a rear facing infant seat.
I have the same car seat for my granddaughter. It is the brown version. Lighting can change the look of the colors. The pad moves up as the straps are raised. It's hard to tell from the pics if it is the same seat but what is obvious to me is the fact that the last pic shows the pad in a lower position than it should have been for Caylee's size. The slots that the straps go through should be at the child's shoulder level. In pic 3, they are very low and do not even have the straps running through them as they should have. The straps remain in the slots, this isn't something that changes while using the seat. The straps should be visible in pic #3 and the slots they run through should be much higher than is shown.

100%Agave
10-26-2009, 02:23 PM
I voted not enough detail but I will say this much.

In seat 3, the straps are too far down for a 2 year old. They seem to be in the same position as seat 2 when she was a baby.

The cover in 3 looks to be much lighter than in the other 2. Of course, this could be a lighting issue.

I thought that the seat in KC's car was black and white. I don't see any black and white seats in these pictures. Where did I get the idea that it was black and white checks as far as the pattern for the seat cover went? I have no idea but that is what I thought.

If I was LE, I would pull CA's car seat just in case and I would find out if GA and LA had car seats as well and get them too.

wonders
10-26-2009, 06:08 PM
I will try to make sense here, prolly wont succeed.

If CA did change out the carseat would her finger prints be on key places to install it in the car (as in the last person to do so) and maybe the same thing with mama doll?

I brought this over from Caylee's doll "mama" thread

gaelicpeas
10-26-2009, 06:19 PM
I will try to make sense here, prolly wont succeed.

If CA did change out the carseat would her finger prints be on key places to install it in the car (as in the last person to do so) and maybe the same thing with mama doll?

I brought this over from Caylee's doll "mama" threadCindy noted in her depo that she lifted the carseat, so her prints would be expected on it -although maybe not in the areas you mentioned. She also said she moved mama doll and wiped the face, so again, fingerprints to be expected.

Well, unless she was wearing gloves.

lizzysf
10-26-2009, 06:41 PM
This car seat is "convertible" because it goes from using a harness sytem to restrain the smaller child to a seat which uses the car's own seat belt sytem, i.e. a booster seat, for the older child. It is not the type that can be used as a rear facing infant seat.
I have the same car seat for my granddaughter. It is the brown version. Lighting can change the look of the colors. The pad moves up as the straps are raised. It's hard to tell from the pics if it is the same seat but what is obvious to me is the fact that the last pic shows the pad in a lower position than it should have been for Caylee's size. The slots that the straps go through should be at the child's shoulder level. In pic 3, they are very low and do not even have the straps running through them as they should have. The straps remain in the slots, this isn't something that changes while using the seat. The straps should be visible in pic #3 and the slots they run through should be much higher than is shown.Do you have to re-adjust the straps everytime you use it? I mean does the pad have a tendency to slide down when not in use? Or is it a firmly fixed adjustment each time you reposition the back pad/straps?

AZlawyer
10-26-2009, 06:47 PM
This car seat is "convertible" because it goes from using a harness sytem to restrain the smaller child to a seat which uses the car's own seat belt sytem, i.e. a booster seat, for the older child. It is not the type that can be used as a rear facing infant seat.
I have the same car seat for my granddaughter. It is the brown version. Lighting can change the look of the colors. The pad moves up as the straps are raised. It's hard to tell from the pics if it is the same seat but what is obvious to me is the fact that the last pic shows the pad in a lower position than it should have been for Caylee's size. The slots that the straps go through should be at the child's shoulder level. In pic 3, they are very low and do not even have the straps running through them as they should have. The straps remain in the slots, this isn't something that changes while using the seat. The straps should be visible in pic #3 and the slots they run through should be much higher than is shown.

Thanks--it's been too long since I had a little one in a car seat for me to remember this on my own. :)

I think, then, that all 3 pics in the post mentioned in the survey are all the same seat. However, if the convertible insert was placed too low for Caylee when the car was picked up from the A. house, that means to me that CA probably took out the insert and washed it (or at least wiped it down with something), then returned it to the car.

passionflower
10-26-2009, 06:49 PM
is there a link to pictures to compare the carseats????

AZlawyer
10-26-2009, 06:57 PM
is there a link to pictures to compare the carseats????

post #88

CuriousTwo
10-26-2009, 07:28 PM
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/caylee202620doll.jpg
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/cayleeride.jpg
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/08_09.jpg

Just bumping the pics up.

Snaz
10-26-2009, 09:08 PM
#1
http://i37.tinypic.com/2u7y3aq.jpg

#3
http://i34.tinypic.com/6gwnr7.jpg

I hope I made what I am trying to show clear enough... I'm new at using this illustration feature. I believe these are the same two seats....

1. Little black handle can be seen clearly in #1 and just barely in #3.
2. Dark grey/black colored piece sewn into the lighter grey can be seen in both pics.
3. Black plastic piece is the same on both seats.

I believe any differences in the appearances of these two seats (#1 and #3) are due to the fact that these two pics are both taken from different angles... and the color difference is due to two different cameras taking the pics on two different days and at two different times of day.

I recently took pictures of my hardwood floor with one camera and more pics another day on a different camera... the same floor looked like two completely different floors.

Just some food for thought.

elissabee
10-26-2009, 09:15 PM
I think all three pictures are the same seat. Different lighting, different time of day, and different angles affect the look and colors. In pic 2 it looks like they were using a head positioner when Caylee was younger.

CarrieSis
10-26-2009, 10:15 PM
This car seat is "convertible" because it goes from using a harness sytem to restrain the smaller child to a seat which uses the car's own seat belt sytem, i.e. a booster seat, for the older child. It is not the type that can be used as a rear facing infant seat.

Unless it's a completely different seat, according to the manual it is indeed a 3 in 1 seat - rearfacing, then forward facing with the same harness, then as a booster/seat belt positioner. I posted the manual and had previously posted a picture of the seat. If it IS a totally different seat then let's try to identify it so I can find that manual? If I'm wrong, I do want to know! :D

3doglady
10-26-2009, 10:19 PM
I think all three pictures are the same seat. Different lighting, different time of day, and different angles affect the look and colors. In pic 2 it looks like they were using a head positioner when Caylee was younger.

I agree. If you look at the same two items, placed the same distance apart, the distance will look different as your perspective(angle) changes. I'm an artist, hope that made sense. Also when I lightened the top picture in photoshop the seats looked the same color. Color can look different in different rooms even at the same time of day. Ever picked out a paint sample in the paint store, get it home and it looks like a totally different color?

Snaz
10-26-2009, 10:27 PM
I don't think #2 is the same as #1 and #3..... the sides come up much higher (nothing to do with size of child in seat) than they do on the other two, which I believe are the same seat.... Plus #2 is missing the side dark grey/black insert (see my illustrated item #2 in both seats at post #236) that is in both pic #1 and pic #3.

JMO.

lizzysf
10-26-2009, 10:43 PM
Dimensions of the chair itself ....(ignore the black pad;))

Imagine Caylee sitting in chair 3, with her head about 3 inches below the top like in pic one. The top of the fabric insert I marked on the left arm would not even reach her face. But in pic 1..it reaches to nose level on her. http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/C1.jpg
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/C3.jpg


Different angle, lens nor scale should account for this much difference in the 2, IMO.

Bumping... Snaz...do you think that chair 3 and 2 are the same and 1 is different? You said that 2 looks higher. I think 3 looks higher also than 1.

gaelicpeas
10-26-2009, 11:12 PM
Bumping... Snaz...do you think that chair 3 and 2 are the same and 1 is different? You said that 2 looks higher. I think 3 looks higher also than 1.
These are the key pics that show the difference, IMO. The lighting and scaling is completely different in both pics, yes. However, if you use a ruler and measure the difference between the top of the seat to the logo on one pic, and you find that ratio, and then measure the same thing on the other seat using its own ratio, you will see that they are not the same. Ack... lol, I am having a hard time explaining this!

TakeNote
10-26-2009, 11:34 PM
Bumping... Snaz...do you think that chair 3 and 2 are the same and 1 is different? You said that 2 looks higher. I think 3 looks higher also than 1.

to me....these two seats do not look the same to me.....

the top one with an older caylee is rounder -wider-shorter at top

the other one....empty....

is longer up to the top...more square looking....more narrow.....and much lighter color....

lizzysf
10-26-2009, 11:34 PM
These are the key pics that show the difference, IMO. The lighting and scaling is completely different in both pics, yes. However, if you use a ruler and measure the difference between the top of the seat to the logo on one pic, and you find that ratio, and then measure the same thing on the other seat using its own ratio, you will see that they are not the same. Ack... lol, I am having a hard time explaining this!
I did that too.. All I can say is don't be fooled by the "angle and lens" explanation until you actually do these measurements. Then decide.

Truthwillsetufree
10-26-2009, 11:41 PM
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/caylee202620doll.jpg
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/cayleeride.jpg
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f352/lizo128/08_09.jpg

Just bumping the pics up.

If you look at the second photo of Caylee in her carseat when she is the youngest, if you look on the top right at the latch, it is dark in color, I presume black, not orange. So this one is definately different.

ExpectingUnicorns
10-27-2009, 12:08 AM
Because of the inconsistencies in the angles, lighting, camera and grade of the pictures this is really hard to compare! I think we have to disregard all the red portions that are in photo #3 because they wouldn't be in sight because the angles of the other pictures don't show those same areas. The color is difficult because the hues will vary depending on camera, lighting and printing. The best way, I think, to compare the colors would be to compare the values not the hues. In other words to look at how the lightness/darkness (values) of each car seat contrasts to the interior of the car. (See how even the car interior "color" (hue) looks different in each picture? Well, the contrast between the car interior and the car seats look about the same to me . . . I don't think you can be very definite about it, though.
The only difference that interests me is the shoulder straps. They are either hidden in picture #3 or they are the wrong color. But I can't see where they go through the slots even when I magnify it to 400%. And as has already been pointed out, if they have been disconnected that means that the seat had been removed ~ which would be very suspicious!!
My observations are few and not enlightening enough for me to make a solid decision ~ but I've sure enjoyed this thread and all the work everyone has put into it!! Wish we could find more pictures for comparison.

AZlawyer
10-27-2009, 12:16 AM
If you look at the second photo of Caylee in her carseat when she is the youngest, if you look on the top right at the latch, it is dark in color, I presume black, not orange. So this one is definately different.

All 3 seats have the black latch-looking thing sticking up on the sides. Only in #3 is the angle correct to see the orange part.

Truthwillsetufree
10-27-2009, 12:19 AM
Because of the inconsistencies in the angles, lighting, camera and grade of the pictures this is really hard to compare! I think we have to disregard all the red portions that are in photo #3 because they wouldn't be in sight because the angles of the other pictures don't show those same areas. The color is difficult because the hues will vary depending on camera, lighting and printing. The best way, I think, to compare the colors would be to compare the values not the hues. In other words to look at how the lightness/darkness (values) of each car seat contrasts to the interior of the car. (See how even the car interior "color" (hue) looks different in each picture? Well, the contrast between the car interior and the car seats look about the same to me . . . I don't think you can be very definite about it, though.
The only difference that interests me is the shoulder straps. They are either hidden in picture #3 or they are the wrong color. But I can't see where they go through the slots even when I magnify it to 400%. And as has already been pointed out, if they have been disconnected that means that the seat had been removed ~ which would be very suspicious!!
My observations are few and not enlightening enough for me to make a solid decision ~ but I've sure enjoyed this thread and all the work everyone has put into it!! Wish we could find more pictures for comparison.

It is obvious in picture 2 what is red/orange, look at the release button in between caylee's legs, it is red/orange. Now look up to the top right at the latch that is facing up it is black. In the other picture, it is facing down and orange/red. That is obvious.

JBean
10-27-2009, 12:22 AM
If you look at the second photo of Caylee in her carseat when she is the youngest, if you look on the top right at the latch, it is dark in color, I presume black, not orange. So this one is definately different.
The orange portion is not visible on all seats so we cannot use that as a comparison.

ETA: IN picture 3 the top latch is black and the bottom latch is orange, but we can only see the top latch in other pictures so we have no way of knowing if they are orange.

Truthwillsetufree
10-27-2009, 12:25 AM
The carseats are the same, IMO (which doesn't mean a cover wasn't replaced at any point in time. The things are removable and replaceable).

The reason the black pad is lower in the 2nd pic is because what holds it "up" is the harness straps when tightened around a child. Without the child in the seat, the pad would "slip down" to touch the bottom of the inner carseat seat (its natural position at the lowest harness setting).

In the comparison of the 2 different pictures I think perspective - foreshortening - is at fault. The first has the seat positioned more head-on towards the viewer, and the second is at a much different side-angle. This makes it look like points don't line up when they in fact do IRL.

Another angle:
http://ypyp.com/deals/product_thumb.php?img=../images/dg/206317/300.jpg&w=150&h=150

Here's a video with the seat type in question http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://l.yimg.com/a/i/us/sch/cn/v/v3/w485/1214444_100_70.jpeg&imgrefurl=http://video.yahoo.com/watch/1296199/5614132&usg=__RVIFGz6H7KQEl0i6KRF5F2jdqHk=&h=70&w=100&sz=3&hl=en&start=258&um=1&tbnid=YcV_u9BFMED_eM:&tbnh=57&tbnw=82&prev=/images%3Fq%3DEddie%2BBauer%2BDeluxe%2BBooster%26nd sp%3D20%26hl%3Den%26safe%3Doff%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official%26sa%3DN%26start%3D240%26um%3D1

/not a carseat tech, but faithfully haunting carseat.org since 2003.
Brought this over from front of thread.......
The pad of the seat you have pictured is not removeable, therefore, it will not slip down if a child is in or out of it. The carseat you have pictured is the Eddie Bauer Deluxe Convetible seat for a child 22-40 pounds, 34-43 inches in height and over 1 year in age.
So where is Caylee's first carseat?
The picture of the first carseat is the newer carseat. The one that LE has in evidence I would theorize is her old carseat and the one in the attic is CA's carseat. The newer carseat is long gone! JMO of course.