Nancy Cooper, 34, of Cary, N.C. #22

[chicoliving]

Continue here!

[raisincharlie]

Jumpstreet - murder is nonsensical in and of itself. Murderers are nonsensical as well.

Refering back - I have no idea what LE knew or what they were thinking. The response to a reporter concerning a POI or suspect could have and probably should have been that they were treating it as a missing persons case - end of sentence. Regardless of what they may have thought they still had a duty to search for Nancy until the search was exhausted.

LE typically talks about suspects or POIs when dealing with a missing persons case that involves a KNOWN abduction. If that is known - they will issue a description of the POI if they have a witness or something to point to the person. If a vehicle has been used - if LE has information they do issue a description of the vehicle if they have it.

I find it odd they were even responding to the issue of a POI or suspect since Nancy was not reported to have been abducted. Odd wording perhaps, definitely odd to me.

[momto3kids]

RC...did you see where I posted the chiefs response when asked about BC looking for NC when she didn't come back for jogging? Interesting I thought. I had not heard that until today.

[raisincharlie]

RC...did you see where I posted the chiefs response when asked about BC looking for NC when she didn't come back for jogging? Interesting I thought. I had not heard that until today.

I did but my interprestation of that is different to yours. To me she never responded to the actual question which was - was Brad out looking for Nancy when the 911 call came in.

It does not surprise me that during the first few hours/first day of a response such as this that LE would tell Brad to stay home and out of the way basically, and in the event Nancy called. Not surprised by that, seen it happen many times.

[Roy23]

I really look forward to finding out how real some of this inside information that we have seen here is factual. Maybe LE will make a move soon and we will find out.

[momto3kids]

I did but my interprestation of that is different to yours. To me she never responded to the actual question which was - was Brad out looking for Nancy when the 911 call came in.

It does not surprise me that during the first few hours/first day of a response such as this that LE would tell Brad to stay home and out of the way basically, and in the event Nancy called. Not surprised by that, seen it happen many times.

You're thinking even after she repeated the question she answered it not regarding Saturday before the LE arrived and the answer to mean Sunday?

If that is the case IMO she did it so she wouldn't say NO BC did not look for his wife. Otherwise why would she not answer the direct question?

[jmflu]

Roy, if you have the time to go back through the threads, this is a fascinating discussion the group members have been having. Several people live here in Cary, and some, right on BC's street. Some actually assisted in the search, talked to BC, saw things, heard things. You'll find from the discussion that folks are tossing around ideas more than hearsay. I believe Mom has her eye right on BC, knows more than she can tell us, and that we will find what she says to be extremely accurate, hopefully soon.

[raisincharlie]

You're thinking even after she repeated the question she answered it not regarding Saturday before the LE arrived and the answer to mean Sunday?

If that is the case IMO she did it so she wouldn't say NO BC did not look for his wife. Otherwise why would she not answer the direct question?

Let me listen once again - this came from the 14 July 6:30 presser correct - or did you hear it at a different presser? Lets make sure we are talking the same presser first - K ?

[momto3kids]

I really look forward to finding out how real some of this inside information that we have seen here is factual. Maybe LE will make a move soon and we will find out.

You can count of much of what I said. I have stated before if I didn't believe it myself I wouldn't have posted it.

Fact....BC wore a particular cap, North Face jacket, shorts on Monday the 14th, and has a medium size tattoo right above his ankle.

Fact...He went to HT as I posted and admitted most of what I put out there, with him not yet admitting a 4:20 trip. I said milk at 6, I said detergent..

Fact...He did have a missing or broken bolt on his license tag.

I really encourage you to listen and watch the chief when asked about the trip to HT @ 4am. Actions speak louder than words in this, her actions spoke volumes IMO.

LTF and his BMW will be 2 things that I am certain will come out.

[Roy23]

Roy, if you have the time to go back through the threads, this is a fascinating discussion the group members have been having. Several people live here in Cary, and some, right on BC's street. Some actually assisted in the search, talked to BC, saw things, heard things. You'll find from the discussion that folks are tossing around ideas more than hearsay. I believe Mom has her eye right on BC, knows more than she can tell us, and that we will find what she says to be extremely accurate, hopefully soon.



I have read all of it. Because I say that doesn't mean that I think none of it is true. But I don't know people personally that post on this thread. So in a nutshell, I am not going to just believe that every insider has posted 100% factual information until I read a SW. I do not discredit Mom at all but it is hearsay until LE confirms it. At least that is way I have to look at it.

[momto3kids]

Let me listen once again - this came from the 14 July 6:30 presser correct - or did you hear it at a different presser? Lets make sure we are talking the same presser first - K ?

15th...when she announced it was confirmed to be NC.

I posted it exactly how the question was asked, how she repeated it, and her response. It took me 30 minutes to put it exactly correct on here...Thread #21 last page I posted it before we got moved to this thread.

[raisincharlie]

15th...when she announced it was confirmed to be NC.

I posted it exactly how the question was asked, how she repeated it, and her response. It took me 30 minutes to put it exactly correct on here...Thread #21 last page I posted it before we got moved to this thread.

Okay will listen to that one - I was listening to the 14th.

[jmflu]

Want to meet up with all of us in the area and do the same thing they've done twice... go by the places of interest, get together to discuss the case?

[Roy23]

Want to meet up with all of us in the area and do the same thing they've done twice... go by the places of interest, get together to discuss the case?


I would love to but unfortunately I live in Atlanta and have a 7 month old son. Otherwise, I would be there to visit with all of you.

[Roy23]

You can count of much of what I said. I have stated before if I didn't believe it myself I wouldn't have posted it.

Fact....BC wore a particular cap, North Face jacket, shorts on Monday the 14th, and has a medium size tattoo right above his ankle.

Fact...He went to HT as I posted and admitted most of what I put out there, with him not yet admitting a 4:20 trip. I said milk at 6, I said detergent..

Fact...He did have a missing or broken bolt on his license tag.

I really encourage you to listen and watch the chief when asked about the trip to HT @ 4am. Actions speak louder than words in this, her actions spoke volumes IMO.

LTF and his BMW will be 2 things that I am certain will come out.



Because you have said all this, I am really anxious to see LE confirm all that you have said. Don't take it personal, but I can't accept everything as accurate until confirmed. I always look forward to your insights due to your being right there. I hope you understand.

[reddress58]

You can count of much of what I said. I have stated before if I didn't believe it myself I wouldn't have posted it.

Fact....BC wore a particular cap, North Face jacket, shorts on Monday the 14th, and has a medium size tattoo right above his ankle.

Fact...He went to HT as I posted and admitted most of what I put out there, with him not yet admitting a 4:20 trip. I said milk at 6, I said detergent..

Fact...He did have a missing or broken bolt on his license tag.

I really encourage you to listen and watch the chief when asked about the trip to HT @ 4am. Actions speak louder than words in this, her actions spoke volumes IMO.

LTF and his BMW will be 2 things that I am certain will come out.
Mom, I've looked all through last Sunday's posts and can't find where you talked about BC swiping his card and asking for Nancy's to be swiped. Can you be more specific? I'd like to read that post. Thanks

[jmflu]

Does anyone know what's going on with the wreath?? Has it been made? Put out?

[Skittles]

I did but my interprestation of that is different to yours. To me she never responded to the actual question which was - was Brad out looking for Nancy when the 911 call came in.

It does not surprise me that during the first few hours/first day of a response such as this that LE would tell Brad to stay home and out of the way basically, and in the event Nancy called. Not surprised by that, seen it happen many times.

That's how I interpreted it, too.

[Skittles]

You're thinking even after she repeated the question she answered it not regarding Saturday before the LE arrived and the answer to mean Sunday?

If that is the case IMO she did it so she wouldn't say NO BC did not look for his wife. Otherwise why would she not answer the direct question?

I think that is what the chief was doing.

[SleuthyGal]

I too heard the Chief in that presser on the 15th answer a different question than what may have been asked. Actually, as she repeated back the question each reporter would ask, I noticed she sometimes got the question wrong--whether this was on purpose or not I don't know, but I *did* notice it as she was repeating them. She got at least 5 - 8 questions wrong, in that she got words mixed up or skipped some words and the meaning of what was asked was changed a bit as a result. I think perhaps she was exhausted and also maybe a bit nervous, facing all that media at once.

The question she answered (which wasn't exactly the one asked) had to do with Brad 'joining in' search efforts (which I took to mean organized searches, not searches he may have taken on his own). When she said "not right away initially," I assumed she was referring to organized searches). That wasn't quite the question asked and I suspect the reporter wanted to know about Brad's activities on Saturday, but said reporter didn't word it precisely and also didn't follow up to clarify the question s/he really was asking, after Chief Bazemore answered the first time.

[momto3kids]

I have read all of it. Because I say that doesn't mean that I think none of it is true. But I don't know people personally that post on this thread. So in a nutshell, I am not going to just believe that every insider has posted 100% factual information until I read a SW. I do not discredit Mom at all but it is hearsay until LE confirms it. At least that is way I have to look at it.

Roy....I won't give my sources to risk anyone losing their job over this XXXX, because he's not worth it. I live dead center between all the places spoken about and lived here many years. My husband and my combined time living here is 53 years.

No one needs to believe me 100% because no one on here knows who I am. I assure you what I posted is because I believe it and the person who told it.

Are there things I'm not sure about? yes, and I didn't post it.
Are there things I will not indulge in on here? Yes

[sunflowers]

Mom, I've looked all through last Sunday's posts and can't find where you talked about BC swiping his card and asking for Nancy's to be swiped. Can you be more specific? I'd like to read that post. Thanks

read post #361 & #365 on page 15 of the previous thread

[momto3kids]

Because you have said all this, I am really anxious to see LE confirm all that you have said. Don't take it personal, but I can't accept everything as accurate until confirmed. I always look forward to your insights due to your being right there. I hope you understand.

I guess I have lying eyes then and my children lie too?

You think the LE is going to say BC wore this on the 14th during the search, why would they? The tatoo can be described...
3 of us saw the missing bolt ourselves, why would the LE confirm a missing bolt seen on the 27th? They already did their search.
HT BC put in his affidavit, the rest is on a conference call from a reporter in Canada. Watch and listen to the chief when the 4am trip is asked about.

[carolinalady]

MT3K, is the broken/missing bolt issue something of LE concern or are you talking about you noticing it? IIRC, you noticed it following the SWs being served on the house/cars/BC's DNA. Is this something that you've heard was an issue FOUND during the search? I'm asking b/c I'm wondering if the missing bolt could be DUE to LE search (they removed/loosened plate to retrieve or look for evidence).

[momto3kids]

Mom, I've looked all through last Sunday's posts and can't find where you talked about BC swiping his card and asking for Nancy's to be swiped. Can you be more specific? I'd like to read that post. Thanks

I have to run...I am 15 minutes late for an appointment. Skittles was in on the conversation with me and RC...maybe they can direct you to the discussion...I thought it was Sunday morning we had it..

I will be back in a few hours if you can't locate it.

[jmflu]

Things you won't indulge in on here? Like rumors?

Or did you mean things you won't "divulge" on here because it might risk LE's case?

[Roy23]

Roy....I won't give my sources to risk anyone losing their job over this XXXX, because he's not worth it. I live dead center between all the places spoken about and lived here many years. My husband and my combined time living here is 53 years.

No one needs to believe me 100% because no one on here knows who I am. I assure you what I posted is because I believe it and the person who told it.

Are there things I'm not sure about? yes, and I didn't post it.
Are there things I will not indulge in on here? Yes



Good. So you and I are cool.:crazy:

I don't think you should give your sources either. LE will spill it all soon. For me, it still goes back to the chief saying this is neither an "isolated" or "random" act of violence. That is the only thing that I have ever been able to read her on.

[raisincharlie]

I think we should take a poll as to what was asked and what was answered in the 15 July presser.

My opinion -listening to the reporter's question only - the reporter asks if Brad Cooper was out actively searching for his wife when she was reported missing ( 2:51 pm on 12 July).

The response I hear - never answers that very specific time frame - instead what I hear is Chief Bazemore says that Brad did not participate in organized searches in the beginning but he did participate later.

Link:

http://www.wral.com/news/video/3211708/

The question is asked at 8:32 into this presser. See what you all think.



Mt3K - while listening again to the 14th 6:30 presser I noted at 2:36 into the conference that Chief Bazemore confirms that Brad allowed LE into the house and into BOTH cars the afternoon of 12 July.

So LE did look inside both vehicles the day Nancy went missing.

[SleuthyGal]

I think the key word in there is "actively." And who can say how 'actively' he was looking when (IMHO) he already knew right where she was. And, since there were no witnesses to Brad's 'search activities' on Sat (aside from any LTF front desk employees and maybe a few customers there) the chief couldn't very well answer a question about what he was doing on the 12th, before LE got to his house.

[raisincharlie]

I think the key word in there is "actively." And who can say how 'actively' he was looking when (IMHO) he already knew right where she was.

I quess that's my point - the Chief does not address that issue period. Dances all the way around it actually. Don't know what that means but she did not answer the actual question, maybe understandably so.

[SleuthyGal]

I quess that's my point - the Chief does not address that issue period. Dances all the way around it actually. Don't know what that means but she did not answer the actual question, maybe understandably so.

I'd say it means she's taken some tap dancing classes and got pretty got at it! :crazy:

[raisincharlie]

I'd say it means she's taken some tap dancing classes and got pretty got at it! :crazy:

Pretty good - yes, and an old ploy when you just don't want to raise suspicion or answer the question.

[SleuthyGal]

Indeed! Must have taken some tight rope walking classes in there somewhere too! :wink:

So Raisin, what do you think they need in order to do an arrest? And how 'much' of it do they need (given the DA's penchance of waiting and waiting)?

[jmflu]

The wreath... the wreath... has anybody seen the WREATH...

(Said to the tune of Led Zepplin's "...Has anybody seen the BRIDGE")

[raisincharlie]

Indeed! Must have taken some tight rope walking classes in there somewhere too! :wink:

So Raisin, what do you think they need in order to do an arrest? And how 'much' of it do they need (given the DA's penchance of waiting and waiting)?

No clue what they have, what they are waiting for, and given the fact that Willoughby will only venture to a courtroom when he believes he has a slam dunk - it could be a while.

What I have seen in the Young case, the recent unsealed warrants seem to show a fairly strong case of who dunit but Willoughby has done nothing yet and he had this information before February of this year and it will soon be 22 months since Michelle's murder.

Your guess is as good as mine.

[Roy23]

I guess I have lying eyes then and my children lie too?

You think the LE is going to say BC wore this on the 14th during the search, why would they? The tatoo can be described...
3 of us saw the missing bolt ourselves, why would the LE confirm a missing bolt seen on the 27th? They already did their search.
HT BC put in his affidavit, the rest is on a conference call from a reporter in Canada. Watch and listen to the chief when the 4am trip is asked about.

Actually, I don't care what he was wearing. The only inside information that I see any relevance in is the time of the HT trip which you have inside info on and the LTF card. None of which is substantiated yet by police. I am not calling you or your children a liar. It will be a fact to me when the police comment about it.

[Roy23]

I think we should take a poll as to what was asked and what was answered in the 15 July presser.

My opinion -listening to the reporter's question only - the reporter asks if Brad Cooper was out actively searching for his wife when she was reported missing ( 2:51 pm on 12 July).

The response I hear - never answers that very specific time frame - instead what I hear is Chief Bazemore says that Brad did not participate in organized searches in the beginning but he did participate later.

Link:

http://www.wral.com/news/video/3211708/

The question is asked at 8:32 into this presser. See what you all think.



Mt3K - while listening again to the 14th 6:30 presser I noted at 2:36 into the conference that Chief Bazemore confirms that Brad allowed LE into the house and into BOTH cars the afternoon of 12 July.

So LE did look inside both vehicles the day Nancy went missing.



He was cooperating as LE has said since day 1.

[raisincharlie]

He was cooperating as LE has said since day 1.

Lots of folks do, no doubt about it. David Speers even went so far as to tell LE about a sink hole, which happened to be the sink hole he dumped his step daughter into after he and his buddy savagely raped her and murdered her. He was cooperative as well and is now facing a DP trial.

[Roy23]

Lots of folks do, no doubt about it. David Speers even went so far as to tell LE about a sink hole, which happened to be the sink hole he dumped his step daughter into after he and his buddy savagely raped her and murdered her. He was cooperative as well and is now facing a DP trial.



I totally agree.

[Roy23]

No clue what they have, what they are waiting for, and given the fact that Willoughby will only venture to a courtroom when he believes he has a slam dunk - it could be a while.

What I have seen in the Young case, the recent unsealed warrants seem to show a fairly strong case of who dunit but Willoughby has done nothing yet and he had this information before February of this year and it will soon be 22 months since Michelle's murder.

Your guess is as good as mine.



Yep. There seems to be a trend by LE, at least in North Carolina, to not try cases in the media. I have no doubt that they are trying to tie up every loose end before they lay their cards on the table.

[maconrich]

Actually, I don't care what he was wearing. The only inside information that I see any relevance in is the time of the HT trip which you have inside info on and the LTF card. None of which is substantiated yet by police. I am not calling you or your children a liar. It will be a fact to me when the police comment about it.

Personally I'm storing that info away just in case something comes out that relates to it (what he was wearing that is). ;)

[raisincharlie]

Yep. There seems to be a trend by LE, at least in North Carolina, to not try cases in the media. I have no doubt that they are trying to tie up every loose end before they lay their cards on the table.

I think Chief Bazemore did a very good job of handling this situation. I believe the press gave out more information than she did, and considering the press was on the ground and in the middle of it talking to neighbors and whoever, they were certainly asking questions related to what they were hearing from the neighborhood. The Chief did a good job indeed of getting around it.

[Roy23]

Personally I'm storing that info away just in case something comes out that relates to it (what he was wearing that is). ;)


If I find out he was searching for his wife with bloody clothes I will be furious that I let this case intrigue me at all. :furious:

[maconrich]

If I find out he was searching for his wife with bloody clothes I will be furious that I let this case intrigue me at all. :furious:

That just made my stomach flip :( I'm thinking more of maybe some video that may come out of him shopping or something.

[maconrich]

I think we should take a poll as to what was asked and what was answered in the 15 July presser.

My opinion -listening to the reporter's question only - the reporter asks if Brad Cooper was out actively searching for his wife when she was reported missing ( 2:51 pm on 12 July).

The response I hear - never answers that very specific time frame - instead what I hear is Chief Bazemore says that Brad did not participate in organized searches in the beginning but he did participate later.

Link:

http://www.wral.com/news/video/3211708/

The question is asked at 8:32 into this presser. See what you all think.



Mt3K - while listening again to the 14th 6:30 presser I noted at 2:36 into the conference that Chief Bazemore confirms that Brad allowed LE into the house and into BOTH cars the afternoon of 12 July.

So LE did look inside both vehicles the day Nancy went missing.

That's how I take it, and agree the Chief has done a good job with her answers (including some dancing). BTW I've searched high and low without finding the video that shows LE looking in the garbage can to see if it shows the side door; so I'm glad someone is going to drive by and look!

[raisincharlie]

That's how I take it, and agree the Chief has done a good job with her answers (including some dancing). BTW I've searched high and low without finding the video that shows LE looking in the garbage can to see if it shows the side door; so I'm glad someone is going to drive by and look!

I think the trash can shot was a still IIRC - I'm thinking the N &O shots.

[Roy23]

That just made my stomach flip :( I'm thinking more of maybe some video that may come out of him shopping or something.

That all goes back to LE not confirming that he was shopping at 4:20. I will care about clothes when they at least suggest that this trip happened. I don't doubt that MOM trusts whomever she heard this information from or that she saw Brad with a certain set of clothes. I want LE to confirm it all.

Last Friday on CNN, I am watching a news conference on the discovery of Bigfoot (Sasquatch). They had DNA, photos, and the works. For whatever reason, I wanted to get some conformation from more recognizable scientists and reputable personel before actually believing this amazing discovery. Good thing, huh?

[maconrich]

I think the trash can shot was a still IIRC - I'm thinking the N &O shots.

TY that is exactly where it was http://www.newsobserver.com/news/photos/story/1144014.html

-- but it doesn't show the side of the house :banghead:

[raisincharlie]

TY that is exactly where it was http://www.newsobserver.com/news/photos/story/1144014.html

-- but it doesn't show the side of the house :banghead:

Must of been low man on the chain got that job...:crazy:

[jumpstreet]

Last Friday on CNN, I am watching a news conference on the discovery of Bigfoot (Sasquatch). They had DNA, photos, and the works. For whatever reason, I wanted to get some conformation from more recognizable scientists and reputable personel before actually believing this amazing discovery. Good thing, huh?

So Roy, are you saying that since we now know that Bigfoot is still at large (and not frozen in that block of ice), that perhaps BF had something to do with NC's murder? {Sorry... couldn't resist} If so, I can add this one as Theory E, but it would be even more "out there" than Theory D (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2465948&postcount=171). :)

[Daphne69]

TY that is exactly where it was http://www.newsobserver.com/news/photos/story/1144014.html

-- but it doesn't show the side of the house :banghead:

Is this what you're looking for, maconrich?

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=69148&page=27

Post 669.

[maconrich]

Is this what you're looking for, maconrich?

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=69148&page=27

Post 669.

Yep TY - but can't see the danged door good enuf to know if it's solid or if there's a window. It looks solid but as RC pointed out that bush won't get out of the way to make sure ;)And yep RC, I don't think the garbage digger got the best job of the afternoon!

[Roy23]

So Roy, are you saying that since we now know that Bigfoot is still at large (and not frozen in that block of ice), that perhaps BF had something to do with NC's murder? {Sorry... couldn't resist} If so, I can add this one as Theory E, but it would be even more "out there" than Theory D (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2465948&postcount=171). :)


hahaha. No I gotta go with A. I kind of agree with RC in that I think the Chief has done a fabulous job. I don't think she has given anything away except for that one little thing at the beginning. She comforted the public by saying this crime was not "isolated nor random".

There really is only one way to interpret that.

[reddress58]

Back to the LTF subject: if BC wasn't successful having NC's card scanned after having his own card scanned (as reported in an earlier post), did he still enter the club? Some have suggested he spent a good deal of the two plus hours at LTF. Yet, others think he never went past the main lobby. If he didn't go in, what did he do for the rest of that time? There is a reason I'm asking this, but first I would like some clarification of the general consensus that may have been established on WS... since I've been out of the loop for awhile. .

[SleuthyGal]

There is a reason I'm asking this, but first I would like some clarification of the general consensus that may have been established on WS

On the issue of whether he went in past the front desk and if so, how long did he stay there, no consensus has been reached on the board. We know he was gone from home for 2.5 hrs and had both girls. We don't know where all he went. Carwash is one speculation, in addition of course to LTF.

[FlowerChild]

As to the LTF cards issue.

LTF, like many places, has been sued for revealing information to the wrong person - like the spouse/SO/Family Member of clients. I KNOW from working with hotels and gyms, that company policies say you do not give out a members info to ANYONE, no matter what they say - basically it takes a WARRANT to compel them to give out membership/guest info to ANYONE but the member him/herself. This is what may have happened...

Brad went in looking for Nancy and asked if she had been in that day
The Front Desk Person said, "I can't give you that information sir"
Brad gave them his card, said I am a member here, we have a "family membership, I am her husband (see here's my card)
The Front Desk Person may have scanned his card to pull up his info and make a note and then repeated "I am sorry sir, I understand it is a joint membership, but per company policy I cannot give you that information - maybe you should just go in and look around and see if she is here"
IF Brad had Nancy's card (or A CARD - maybe she had two, or he had an old card) he said, here, I have her card, she has not come home, and my kids are waiting in the car - can't you just scan it and let me know if she is here or has been in today?
And The Front Desk Person hands him back the card(s) and says, "I am sorry Mr Cooper, I sympathize, but that is private information and LTF company policies say I cannot give it out to ANYONE, even you"

I think it's possible that too much is being read into what basically was a MAYBE 2 minute exchange. I don't believe BC was so calm, cool and collected as to sit down 4 hours after murdering his wife in cold blood and figure out a way to make it LOOK like Nancy was at LTF when she wasn't. BC is smart, but he's a nerd, not socially outgoing and not very "people savvy" and this does not fit with the other "profile" information we have gotten from his prior behaviors and the behaviors and activity of that day. I think BC DID go to LTF, I just don't believe he was "trying to get Nancy's card scanned" - that is so transparent even Bella would have seen thru it and he had to know that. He either presented HIS card and asked about Nancy, or presented her card and asked about Nancy. He was standing at the front desk with people and a half-dozen cameras - he wouldn't have tried to "fool" anyone - especially if he KNEW Nancy was dead and LE would dissect every step and every breath he took that day.

If you believe BC killed Nancy you have to look at EVERYTHING BC said and did that day thru the lens of someone who ALREADY KNEW NANCY WASN'T COMING HOME. He would have KNOWN he would be the main suspect. He would have KNOWN that Nancy was only a short distance from home in a populated area and WOULD BE FOUND. He let LE into his house, he let them search the cars, he told them what he had done that day and when. He openly told them he went to HT and LTF. He opened the door for them to question the staff at HT and LTF (remember he knows he killed Nancy) - if he was trying to make it look like Nancy was at LTF Sat, why tell LE he went there looking for her? Brad was obviously setting up HT visits as an alibi and LTF as a concerned husband with a missing (remember he knows she is dead) wife.

For me the Limus test for all of the speculation about BC is that he KNEW she was dead and WHERE she was when ALL of these activities and actions and statements happened. He wouldn't have set up LTF as a "Nancy was still alive" Sat afternoon" because he KNEW she wasn't and might be found any minute.

My Opinion

[reddress58]

On the issue of whether he went in past the front desk and if so, how long did he stay there, no consensus has been reached on the board. We know he was gone from home for 2.5 hrs and had both girls. We don't know where all he went. Carwash is one speculation, in addition of course to LTF.
Ok. Thanks, SG. Back to the lockers. Apparently by having her card scanned, he wanted it to appear NC was at the club after she left the house. To support this line of thinking, he also may have planned to leave items in a locker belonging to her to make it further appear she had checked in. This is entirely possible without using a card. Many times members simply put items in a locker without locking them, which requires leaving the card behind. A friend of mine made a habit of this and had an expensive pair of running shoes stolen (yes; in Cary at LTF shock/shock) while he was swimming. You do not need a card to use a locker.

If BC continued into the club after failing to have her card swiped, he still could have left items in a locker in the family dressing room. I have no idea because Momto3 has not told us yet if he left after being refused the card swipe. This could be another reason he had her purse with him in the car. He had planned to leave it in a locker.

[reddress58]

As to the LTF cards issue.

LTF, like many places, has been sued for revealing information to the wrong person - like the spouse/SO/Family Member of clients. I KNOW from working with hotels and gyms, that company policies say you do not give out a members info to ANYONE, no matter what they say - basically it takes a WARRANT to compel them to give out membership/guest info to ANYONE but the member him/herself. This is what may have happened...

Brad went in looking for Nancy and asked if she had been in that day
The Front Desk Person said, "I can't give you that information sir"
Brad gave them his card, said I am a member here, we have a "family membership, I am her husband (see here's my card)
The Front Desk Person may have scanned his card to pull up his info and make a note and then repeated "I am sorry sir, I understand it is a joint membership, but per company policy I cannot give you that information - maybe you should just go in and look around and see if she is here"
IF Brad had Nancy's card (or A CARD - maybe she had two, or he had an old card) he said, here, I have her card, she has not come home, and my kids are waiting in the car - can't you just scan it and let me know if she is here or has been in today?
And The Front Desk Person hands him back the card(s) and says, "I am sorry Mr Cooper, I sympathize, but that is private information and LTF company policies say I cannot give it out to ANYONE, even you"

I think it's possible that too much is being read into what basically was a MAYBE 2 minute exchange. I don't believe BC was so calm, cool and collected as to sit down 4 hours after murdering his wife in cold blood and figure out a way to make it LOOK like Nancy was at LTF when she wasn't. BC is smart, but he's a nerd, not socially outgoing and not very "people savvy" and this does not fit with the other "profile" information we have gotten from his prior behaviors and the behaviors and activity of that day. I think BC DID go to LTF, I just don't believe he was "trying to get Nancy's card scanned" - that is so transparent even Bella would have seen thru it and he had to know that. He either presented HIS card and asked about Nancy, or presented her card and asked about Nancy. He was standing at the front desk with people and a half-dozen cameras - he wouldn't have tried to "fool" anyone - especially if he KNEW Nancy was dead and LE would dissect every step and every breath he took that day.

If you believe BC killed Nancy you have to look at EVERYTHING BC said and did that day thru the lens of someone who ALREADY KNEW NANCY WASN'T COMING HOME. He would have KNOWN he would be the main suspect. He would have KNOWN that Nancy was only a short distance from home in a populated area and WOULD BE FOUND. He let LE into his house, he let them search the cars, he told them what he had done that day and when. He openly told them he went to HT and LTF. He opened the door for them to question the staff at HT and LTF (remember he knows he killed Nancy) - if he was trying to make it look like Nancy was at LTF Sat, why tell LE he went there looking for her? Brad was obviously setting up HT visits as an alibi and LTF as a concerned husband with a missing (remember he knows she is dead) wife.

For me the Limus test for all of the speculation about BC is that he KNEW she was dead and WHERE she was when ALL of these activities and actions and statements happened. He wouldn't have set up LTF as a "Nancy was still alive" Sat afternoon" because he KNEW she wasn't and might be found any minute.

My Opinion
I wish I had read this before I responded because you make a whole lot of sense. I totally agree!!

[SleuthyGal]

For me the Limus test for all of the speculation about BC is that he KNEW she was dead and WHERE she was when ALL of these activities and actions and statements happened. He wouldn't have set up LTF as a "Nancy was still alive" Sat afternoon" because he KNEW she wasn't and might be found any minute.

I think it comes down to what Brad knew and what Brad didn't know as of 1 - 2pm on Sat. 7/12. Brad DID NOT know that JA had called police and reported her friend missing. All Brad knew was that JA was looking for Nancy, he found out they had an appt to paint together, and JA was worried. He told JA he was going out to look for her (this is some 5+ hrs after Nancy 'left to go jogging').

So in Brad's mind, not knowing what else JA did besides call HIM, he believes (and said this later) that he can't report NC missing for 24 hrs. So again, in his mind, he's got time to be out and about doing whatever he was doing for 2.5+ hrs.

He told LE he looked for her at LTF because he was there; he was not expecting LE to be at his house by 3pm that Saturday, asking questions. I believe he switched his story. I think the original plan was to somehow have that LTF system show Nancy as 'being there/card scanned.' I agree it was a stupid plan because of course someone somewhere would have to see that he faked that visit, but who knows WHAT was in his mind. There is no reason for him to

1. Have Nancy's card on him. He had his own. He could go in and look around.

2. Go to LTF first (or even at all). Why? Because obviously Nancy didnt have her card--HE had it! So a trip to LTF was moot. He could have called them instead of strapping the kids into their car seats and going there in person.

If his activities are as mt3k described, then his visit was not really looking for Nancy.

I believe Brad's 6:15am & 6:40am HT visits are to try and cover himself in case someone saw him out driving around EARLIER and also to try and show (through bogus phone calls) that Nancy was alive as late as 7am.

Of course I could be wrong and I eagerly await learning what LE has ascertained in this case...that is if they ever release any info and move this investigation into a more public arena.

[SleuthyGal]

This could be another reason he had her purse with him in the car. He had planned to leave it in a locker.Wait a sec. Which car did he take to LTF. It was his SEDAN, right? But JA said that Nancy's purse was in HER car...the SUV. And LE took Nancy's purse out of the SUV. So Brad didn't have Nancy's purse with him when he went out in his car to LTF--he put her purse in HER car, along with her cell phone.

[reddress58]

Ok. Thanks, SG. Back to the lockers. Apparently by having her card scanned, he wanted it to appear NC was at the club after she left the house. To support this line of thinking, he also may have planned to leave items in a locker belonging to her to make it further appear she had checked in. This is entirely possible without using a card. Many times members simply put items in a locker without locking them, which requires leaving the card behind. A friend of mine made a habit of this and had an expensive pair of running shoes stolen (yes; in Cary at LTF shock/shock) while he was swimming. You do not need a card to use a locker.

If BC continued into the club after failing to have her card swiped, he still could have left items in a locker in the family dressing room. I have no idea because Momto3 has not told us yet if he left after being refused the card swipe. This could be another reason he had her purse with him in the car. He had planned to leave it in a locker.
I have to correct myself. He didn't HAVE her purse with him...just her card because JA somehow knew the purse was in her car, which was parked in the driveway. Brain cobwebs from being away too long. Sorry.

[momto3kids]

rdd58....did you find the conversation you were looking for?

[reddress58]

I sure wish someone would establish a facts timeline like SOMEONE promised us he would. It would help us old folks keep our facts straight.

[reddress58]

rdd58....did you find the conversation you were looking for?
Yes, thank you, Mom. I used to get irritated with folks who popped in on the conversation and we had to repeat ourselves. Now I know how it feels being on the other end. I think I'm caught up.

[momto3kids]

I think it comes down to what Brad knew and what Brad didn't know as of 1 - 2pm on Sat. 7/12. Brad DID NOT know that JA had called police and reported her friend missing. All Brad knew was that JA was looking for Nancy, he found out they had an appt to paint together, and JA was worried. He told JA he was going out to look for her (this is some 5+ hrs after Nancy 'left to go jogging').

So in Brad's mind, not knowing what else JA did besides call HIM, he believes (and said this later) that he can't report NC missing for 24 hrs. So again, in his mind, he's got time to be out and about doing whatever he was doing for 2.5+ hrs.

He told LE he looked for her at LTF because he was there; he was not expecting LE to be at his house by 3pm that Saturday, asking questions. I believe he switched his story. I think the original plan was to somehow have that LTF system show Nancy as 'being there/card scanned.' I agree it was a stupid plan because of course someone somewhere would have to see that he faked that visit, but who knows WHAT was in his mind. There is no reason for him to

1. Have Nancy's card on him. He had his own. He could go in and look around.

2. Go to LTF first (or even at all). Why? Because obviously Nancy didnt have her card--HE had it! So a trip to LTF was moot. He could have called them instead of strapping the kids into their car seats and going there in person.

If his activities are as mt3k described, then his visit was not really looking for Nancy.

I believe Brad's 6:15am & 6:40am HT visits are to try and cover himself in case someone saw him out driving around EARLIER and also to try and show (through bogus phone calls) that Nancy was alive as late as 7am.

Of course I could be wrong and I eagerly await learning what LE has ascertained in this case...that is if they ever release any info and move this investigation into a more public arena.


SG...you have described it well....

[raisincharlie]

I think it comes down to what Brad knew and what Brad didn't know as of 1 - 2pm on Sat. 7/12. Brad DID NOT know that JA had called police and reported her friend missing. All Brad knew was that JA was looking for Nancy, he found out they had an appt to paint together, and JA was worried. He told JA he was going out to look for her (this is some 5+ hrs after Nancy 'left to go jogging').

So in Brad's mind, not knowing what else JA did besides call HIM, he believes (and said this later) that he can't report NC missing for 24 hrs. So again, in his mind, he's got time to be out and about doing whatever he was doing for 2.5+ hrs.

He told LE he looked for her at LTF because he was there; he was not expecting LE to be at his house by 3pm that Saturday, asking questions. I believe he switched his story. I think the original plan was to somehow have that LTF system show Nancy as 'being there/card scanned.' I agree it was a stupid plan because of course someone somewhere would have to see that he faked that visit, but who knows WHAT was in his mind. There is no reason for him to

1. Have Nancy's card on him. He had his own. He could go in and look around.

2. Go to LTF first (or even at all). Why? Because obviously Nancy didnt have her card--HE had it! So a trip to LTF was moot. He could have called them instead of strapping the kids into their car seats and going there in person.

If his activities are as mt3k described, then his visit was not really looking for Nancy.

I believe Brad's 6:15am & 6:40am HT visits are to try and cover himself in case someone saw him out driving around EARLIER and also to try and show (through bogus phone calls) that Nancy was alive as late as 7am.

Of course I could be wrong and I eagerly await learning what LE has ascertained in this case...that is if they ever release any info and move this investigation into a more public arena.

I'm with you. IMO the trip to LTF was all about placing Nancy there-because this meant someone else besides him would have access to her and she disappeared from there. He admits in his affidavit that he thought he could not report Nancy missing for 24 hours. What he did not take into account was JA calling 911 to find out if something could be done. He thought he had time to do something to place Nancy away from him and thus divert suspicion as well.

[momto3kids]

Going back to the purse in the car...and I know RC you are on the same page with me on this....this was my 1st red flag.

I still say he put it there with her cell after he went thru it trying to figure what kind of alibi he could use. The card was there and his lightbulb went off...LTF

I feel he had all intentions of having the SUV parked at LTF once he pulled off the card being swept.

Not going by JJ when he had to sit basically in front of it while waiting for the red light...he mentioned coffee to JA and HP when he spoke to them.

[Skittles]

I feel he had all intentions of having the SUV parked at LTF once he pulled off the card being swept.


He had the girls with him, though. He'd have to take a cab home or carry them.

[SleuthyGal]

On the topic of whether this a planned vs. heat of the moment...

Some of you think he attacked her as she came home from the party, perhaps doing the deed in the garage. That implies planning, at least to some extent.

Others think they got into a fight and he then killed her...not planning it ahead of time.

As I look at his actions as reported by mt3k on Saturday 7/12, it doesn't seem like the murder was planned. If it was, his planning skills totally suck. Someone who planned (as in more than an hour or 2 ahead) to kill their spouse would have acquired basic things to have on-hand like cleaning supplies and already had an alibi figured out (a la Jason Young). Not that he would have had everyone convinced or anything, but the 2 (or possibly 3) trips to HT, the weird LTF membership card shell game, and other things yet to be discovered, do not seem the plan of someone who thought things through very well.

Of course as we all know, JA screwed up his Sat. alibi plan (and thank goodness for that), and Nancy was probably found sooner than she would have, otherwise. And no, he couldn't plan for the JA thing to have happened, but his mistakes are really big/stupid ones, IMHO. Just the fact that he went to HT at ALL that morning was a big mistake.

[Star12]

He had the girls with him, though. He'd have to take a cab home or carry them.

And, of course, there would be that pesky problem of fingerprints.

[momto3kids]

I sure wish someone would establish a facts timeline like SOMEONE promised us he would. It would help us old folks keep our facts straight.

If it is who I am thinking he tried and it got moved, or something occured..I'm not positive what it was. I know Fran did one and has tried to keep it updated.

[FlowerChild]

I think it comes down to what Brad knew and what Brad didn't know as of 1 - 2pm on Sat. 7/12. Brad DID NOT know that JA had called police and reported her friend missing. All Brad knew was that JA was looking for Nancy, he found out they had an appt to paint together, and JA was worried. He told JA he was going out to look for her (this is some 5+ hrs after Nancy 'left to go jogging').

So in Brad's mind, not knowing what else JA did besides call HIM, he believes (and said this later) that he can't report NC missing for 24 hrs. So again, in his mind, he's got time to be out and about doing whatever he was doing for 2.5+ hrs.

He told LE he looked for her at LTF because he was there; he was not expecting LE to be at his house by 3pm that Saturday, asking questions. I believe he switched his story. I think the original plan was to somehow have that LTF system show Nancy as 'being there/card scanned.' I agree it was a stupid plan because of course someone somewhere would have to see that he faked that visit, but who knows WHAT was in his mind. There is no reason for him to

1. Have Nancy's card on him. He had his own. He could go in and look around.

2. Go to LTF first (or even at all). Why? Because obviously Nancy didnt have her card--HE had it! So a trip to LTF was moot. He could have called them instead of strapping the kids into their car seats and going there in person.

If his activities are as mt3k described, then his visit was not really looking for Nancy.

I believe Brad's 6:15am & 6:40am HT visits are to try and cover himself in case someone saw him out driving around EARLIER and also to try and show (through bogus phone calls) that Nancy was alive as late as 7am.

Of course I could be wrong and I eagerly await learning what LE has ascertained in this case...that is if they ever release any info and move this investigation into a more public arena.
If he killed Nancy then BC KNEW Nancy was dead and lying OPENLY on a lot a mile from his house. While he was out driving around somebody COULD HAVE ALREADY FOUND HER BODY. You have to remember BC KNEW SHE WAS DEAD AND WHERE SHE WAS! The 24 hours means NOTHING, she was not buried, not hidden and was left in a populated area (even if it was new lots, there was a ROAD and weekend lot shoppers). Before he left to go to LTF to look for Nancy Brad KNEW she was dead and KNEW her friends were already "looking" for her and there was a possibility she was going to be found at ANY minute - or even that she had already been found and not yet ID'd.

I don't think BC would go to LTF and try some awkward, and frankly STUPID ploy to set up Nancy ALIVE on Sat afternoon when he KNEW she wasn't and that he might arrive home to a phone call or LE at his door.

See, this is why the HT thing and the LTF thing just don't "fit" for me except as alibis for BRAD's time and his driving around and him being a "good husband/father". BC KNEW Nancy was dead and it doesn't matter WHEN she was reported missing --- he KNEW the body was out there to be found at ANY TIME. If BC killed Nancy he dumped her body on the 2nd trip to HT - he could PROVE why he was out driving around on BOTH TRIPS (scouting the location 1st trip, dumping 2nd trip). In case anyone saw him no-one could prove (before he dumped the body) that she wasn't alive. BC KNEW Nancy was dead and that she could be located at ANY TIME - by a jogger, bike rider, a dog walker, someone looking for a lot (on a typically active for "lookers" Saturday morning). The 24 hour thing is throwing everyone off, for BC, it wouldn't MATTER because he KNEW she might be found within MINUTES of him dumping her body, reported missing officially or not. See, BC KNEW he didn't have "24 hours" to prepare because he KNEW Nancy was dead and might be found at any time. It wouldn't have mattered to him that JA was upset or "looking", all he was focused on at that time was looking like a concerned husband (and father) of a "missing" wife because he already KNEW SHE WAS DEAD. JA might have surprised him with her immediate reaction, but it really didn't matter WHEN the report was made - he KNEW she was dead already and was likely going to be found fairly quickly. Any "cover-up" BC was doing regarding Nancy's death was already done by 7AM - the time he SAYS he saw her last (which was true, he knew WHERE Nancy was and no-one could PROVE she wasn't alive because he was "with her" until that last trip to HT when he dumped her body). BC controlled everything until the moment Nancy's body left his control. By 7AM, he was "ready" for whatever came when Nancy was found - all he had to do is play along with whatever scenario presented itself and repeat the key items - HT 2X and phone call before 7, LTF and "searching" Sat afternoon. JA was certainly "pressing" things earlier from a "missing" standpoint than BC might have considered, but he just played the cards he was dealt, including JA and her involvement. And since JA spoke to BC several times, BC was aware before he went to LTF that JA was upset and MIGHT go looking and find Nancy herself before he returned home. Brad knew by JA's 1st PHONE CALL he didn't have 24 hours - why? Because he KNEW NANCY WAS DEAD and that she could be easily found.

And the thing is that even if he killed Nancy, BC is telling the truth - he last saw Nancy at around 7AM Sat morning....

My Opinion

[SleuthyGal]

If it is who I am thinking he tried and it got moved, or something occured..I'm not positive what it was. I know Fran did one and has tried to keep it updated.

He never did it and likely never intended to...he was making fun of those who analyze the case closely. Yes, Fran has a pretty good timeline, which is at the top of the threads.

[momto3kids]

He had the girls with him, though. He'd have to take a cab home or carry them.

He did have the girls with him, but there were many ways to have this done.

This is only my thought process and nothing I heard...just knowing what he tried at LTF and the purse in the car back home....

1-go home, put the girls down for a nap. Load and ride a bike or jog back to the house.
2-Ask one of his friends to follow him and take the SUV to LTF since NC was needing her car and the girls needed a nap.
3-Ask CM or DD to watch the girls for 30 minutes for an errand he needed to run and NC wasn't home yet.

[SleuthyGal]

If he killed Nancy then BC KNEW Nancy was dead and lying OPENLY on a lot a mile from his house.

Nancy was about 2.75 mi from their house. It was an isolated area, not readily visible even from the paved road. Someone driving in there very well might not have seen her. Those of us who went and looked at the dump site all realized how 'hidden in the open' she was...there is an incline down and she was at the base of that, obscured from the road. And the cul-de-sac itself it a good 1/2 mi or more from the houses that are inhabited, at the end of what is a construction site.

Did Brad take a risk in going to LTF? Yes! Yes he did! Let me ask you this: if Brad did the murder then why did he go to LTF at all? Alternatively, if Brad didn't do the murder, and he could see that Nancy did NOT have her LTF card, then why would he think she did go there? According to him she was out on a 'jog,' having taken nothing with her. His visit to LTF makes no sense in either a guilty or innocent scenario, but in a guilty scenario it adds the purpose of trying to see if he can get her scanned in so she appears on the computer.

And I know they weren't getting along, but seriously...the guy is not worried, and does NOT go looking for her until almost 6 hours later (coincidently when her friend calls and wants to come over to watch the kids). Do you not find that just a bit strange?

[reddress58]

Nancy was about 2.75 mi from their house. It was an isolated area, not readily visible even from the paved road. Someone driving in there very well might not have seen her. Those of us who went and looked at the dump site all realized how 'hidden in the open' she was...there is an incline down and she was at the base of that, obscured from the road. And the cul-de-sac itself it a good 1/2 mi or more from the houses that are inhabited, at the end of what is a construction site.

Did Brad take a risk in going to LTF? Yes! Yes he did! Let me ask you this: if Brad did the murder then why did he go to LTF at all? Alternatively, if Brad didn't do the murder, and he could see that Nancy did NOT have her LTF card, then why would he think she did go there? According to him she was out on a 'jog,' having taken nothing with her. His visit to LTF makes no sense in either a guilty or innocent scenario, but in a guilty scenario it adds the purpose of trying to see if he can get her scanned in so she appears on the computer.

And I know they weren't getting along, but seriously...the guy is not worried, and does NOT go looking for her until almost 6 hours later (coincidently when her friend calls and wants to come over to watch the kids). Do you not find that just a bit strange?
I still think this theory requires too much thought process for someone who just committed a crime of passion....not pre-meditated. I have to go with FC's theory because, in his place, I would do the same thing

[raisincharlie]

Going back to the purse in the car...and I know RC you are on the same page with me on this....this was my 1st red flag.

I still say he put it there with her cell after he went thru it trying to figure what kind of alibi he could use. The card was there and his lightbulb went off...LTF

I feel he had all intentions of having the SUV parked at LTF once he pulled off the card being swept.

Not going by JJ when he had to sit basically in front of it while waiting for the red light...he mentioned coffee to JA and HP when he spoke to them.

Mt3K

First I hope you have understood my point about Chief Bazemore not answering the question she was asked. There are only a few possibliites as to why she did not answer the question.

She misunderstood the question (not sure how)
She knew the answer but did not wish to answer (can understand this)
The issue was being investigated so can't say (can understand this)

So if she understood this question and danced about it - either she knew Brad wasn't exactly looking or she knew detectives were checking into it. She is IMO too smart to have misunderstood the question. I have a tendancy to think this supports the theory that Brad was up to something but it was not looking for Nancy between 1 and 3 pm on Saturday.

I have really studied on that purse. We know Nancy spoke with JA the night of the party at about 10:30. We also know Nancy did not get home until midnight or just after. It is therefore reasonable to figure that Nancy had her cell phone with her at the party. Is it reasonable to figure she had it in her purse ? From that point one might say she put the purse in the X5 on her way into the house when returning from the party. We know Brad took the girls passports from the X5 once - so there does not seem to me to be any reason for her to have put the purse in the X5 - Brad could get to it if he wanted to obviously. I also find it strange to think, this woman slept in the room with her children but didn't keep her cell phone in close proximity. From this it is reasonable to me to figure the cell phone and the purse were wherever Nancy was, which was not in the X5 but in the childrens room.

This leaves two possible scenarios:

Nancy was alive sometime in the morning not long before the so called 7 am runtime. If so it is possible she may have put the purse in the X5 in anticipation of driving to get her coffee before her run as this was her habit. Either she mysteriously vanished after putting her purse in the car or she went back into the house for something and never came back out.

or

If Nancy was murdered much earlier, and figuring she kept her purse and cell phone close and the phone was in the purse, the only way for the purse to have been in the X5 was it was put there by the murderer. The murderer would have had access to the house to get the purse in order to accomplish this.


Any other ideas.

[Star12]

If Nancy was murdered much earlier, and figuring she kept her purse and cell phone close and the phone was in the purse, the only way for the purse to have been in the X5 was it was put there by the murderer. The murderer would have had access to the house to get the purse in order to accomplish this.


Any other ideas.

The phone was not in the purse if JA saw it in there. However, if she stood by the car and tried calling NC's cell, JA would have heard it ring. I still think, however, that BC used NC's cell to call his own. OR he could have easily come back home, made the call on his landline, and then gone back out to HT. He had plenty of time for that.

My other question is this: why would NC have taken her purse to a get together just across the street? She wasn't going to buy anything, nor would she have need for anything you would typically put in a purse. Cell phone would be it. And BC was at the party, and he had keys, if they even locked the doors.

[reddress58]

Mt3K

First I hope you have understood my point about Chief Bazemore not answering the question she was asked. There are only a few possibliites as to why she did not answer the question.

She misunderstood the question (not sure how)
She knew the answer but did not wish to answer (can understand this)
The issue was being investigated so can't say (can understand this)

So if she understood this question and danced about it - either she knew Brad wasn't exactly looking or she knew detectives were checking into it. She is IMO too smart to have misunderstood the question. I have a tendancy to think this supports the theory that Brad was up to something but it was not looking for Nancy between 1 and 3 pm on Saturday.

I have really studied on that purse. We know Nancy spoke with JA the night of the party at about 10:30. We also know Nancy did not get home until midnight or just after. It is therefore reasonable to figure that Nancy had her cell phone with her at the party. Is it reasonable to figure she had it in her purse ? From that point one might say she put the purse in the X5 on her way into the house when returning from the party. We know Brad took the girls passports from the X5 once - so there does not seem to me to be any reason for her to have put the purse in the X5 - Brad could get to it if he wanted to obviously. I also find it strange to think, this woman slept in the room with her children but didn't keep her cell phone in close proximity. From this it is reasonable to me to figure the cell phone and the purse were wherever Nancy was, which was not in the X5 but in the childrens room.

This leaves two possible scenarios:

Nancy was alive sometime in the morning not long before the so called 7 am runtime. If so it is possible she may have put the purse in the X5 in anticipation of driving to get her coffee before her run as this was her habit. Either she mysteriously vanished after putting her purse in the car or she went back into the house for something and never came back out.

or

If Nancy was murdered much earlier, and figuring she kept her purse and cell phone close and the phone was in the purse, the only way for the purse to have been in the X5 was it was put there by the murderer. The murderer would have had access to the house to get the purse in order to accomplish this.


Any other ideas.
Yes. She put the purse in there trying to get away from Brad during an argument. He apprehended her before she could drive away.

[reddress58]

Mt3K

First I hope you have understood my point about Chief Bazemore not answering the question she was asked. There are only a few possibliites as to why she did not answer the question.

She misunderstood the question (not sure how)
She knew the answer but did not wish to answer (can understand this)
The issue was being investigated so can't say (can understand this)

So if she understood this question and danced about it - either she knew Brad wasn't exactly looking or she knew detectives were checking into it. She is IMO too smart to have misunderstood the question. I have a tendancy to think this supports the theory that Brad was up to something but it was not looking for Nancy between 1 and 3 pm on Saturday.

I have really studied on that purse. We know Nancy spoke with JA the night of the party at about 10:30. We also know Nancy did not get home until midnight or just after. It is therefore reasonable to figure that Nancy had her cell phone with her at the party. Is it reasonable to figure she had it in her purse ? From that point one might say she put the purse in the X5 on her way into the house when returning from the party. We know Brad took the girls passports from the X5 once - so there does not seem to me to be any reason for her to have put the purse in the X5 - Brad could get to it if he wanted to obviously. I also find it strange to think, this woman slept in the room with her children but didn't keep her cell phone in close proximity. From this it is reasonable to me to figure the cell phone and the purse were wherever Nancy was, which was not in the X5 but in the childrens room.

This leaves two possible scenarios:

Nancy was alive sometime in the morning not long before the so called 7 am runtime. If so it is possible she may have put the purse in the X5 in anticipation of driving to get her coffee before her run as this was her habit. Either she mysteriously vanished after putting her purse in the car or she went back into the house for something and never came back out.

or

If Nancy was murdered much earlier, and figuring she kept her purse and cell phone close and the phone was in the purse, the only way for the purse to have been in the X5 was it was put there by the murderer. The murderer would have had access to the house to get the purse in order to accomplish this.


Any other ideas.
What baffles me RC is at one time you supported my theory of how the purse got in the car. Now you don't even list it as a possibility. Do you know something we don't? Hmmmm

[momto3kids]

RC...I like hearing your thoughts on all the scenario's that are possible. I know there are so many IF's with this case.
But living in the very center of this as some others are on here are, and knowing where he went and as they say 'the lay of the land', some things are possible and other things just aren't reasonable.

Example...some still are trying to say she might have gone jogging in MeadowRidge. I said from the beginning no she wouldn't, it takes someone to see what Cary offers for jogging and bike riding to understand why she wouldn't go there.

As for the purse, I still believe it was in the house. As you mentioned BC could get to it if he wanted so what would be the reason to leave it outside and with her cell?

I don't believe NC was alive near 7am. I think the rage occured when she got home or shortly after. Was he up when she got home or did he get up shortly after midnight and she had gone to bed and he confronted her? I don't know. What we know is she corrected him per DD affidavit in front of guests and they were back again in the 'hate' mode. That final week was not pleasant with her not getting her allowance from him, the place was like a pig pen and then she corrected Mr. controlling ego???

Anything around 7 had a possibility of the children up and around..walkers, joggers behind his house, etc.

Back to the purse....planted, because IMO she was dead much sooner than 7am.

[raisincharlie]

The phone was not in the purse if JA saw it in there. However, if she stood by the car and tried calling NC's cell, JA would have heard it ring. I still think, however, that BC used NC's cell to call his own. OR he could have easily come back home, made the call on his landline, and then gone back out to HT. He had plenty of time for that.

My other question is this: why would NC have taken her purse to a get together just across the street? She wasn't going to buy anything, nor would she have need for anything you would typically put in a purse. Cell phone would be it. And BC was at the party, and he had keys, if they even locked the doors.

This is why I asked the question - she had the phone at the party - we know that - did she just carry it around or did she have her purse and put the phone "in there" - the purse ? My wife doesn't carry a cell phone around - it is usually in her purse - just asking.

If BC used Nancy's cell to call his own - either it was in the house and he had access to it or in whatever vehicle he used to go to the store in, which I think was the X5. If he used the landline at 640 - he had less than 5 minutes to get to HT to be seen buying detergent and juice at 645 - he has receipts, he knew exactly what time he purchsed those items when he wrote that affidavit. No way could he have used the landline at 640 and have a receipt for items at 645.

If he used his car to dispose of the body, chances are he didn't have time to clean it up prior to the second series of trips to HT and since he needed detergent. According to Scott Heider - they always locked their doors.

[raisincharlie]

What baffles me RC is at one time you supported my theory of how the purse got in the car. Now you don't even list it as a possibility. Do you know something we don't? Hmmmm

Jog my brain please :crazy:

I don't know anything - just puzzling like everyone else.

[reddress58]

Jog my brain please :crazy:

I don't know anything - just puzzling like everyone else.
SHE put the purse in the car when she was trying to get away from him. He followed her to the car, pulled her out and did her in...in the garage.

[reddress58]

RC...I like hearing your thoughts on all the scenario's that are possible. I know there are so many IF's with this case.
But living in the very center of this as some others are on here are, and knowing where he went and as they say 'the lay of the land', some things are possible and other things just aren't reasonable.

Example...some still are trying to say she might have gone jogging in MeadowRidge. I said from the beginning no she wouldn't, it takes someone to see what Cary offers for jogging and bike riding to understand why she wouldn't go there.

As for the purse, I still believe it was in the house. As you mentioned BC could get to it if he wanted so what would be the reason to leave it outside and with her cell?

I don't believe NC was alive near 7am. I think the rage occured when she got home or shortly after. Was he up when she got home or did he get up shortly after midnight and she had gone to bed and he confronted her? I don't know. What we know is she corrected him per DD affidavit in front of guests and they were back again in the 'hate' mode. That final week was not pleasant with her not getting her allowance from him, the place was like a pig pen and then she corrected Mr. controlling ego???

Anything around 7 had a possibility of the children up and around..walkers, joggers behind his house, etc.

Back to the purse....planted, because IMO she was dead much sooner than 7am.
Why would he leave her purse in her car for LE to find unless he didn't realize that's where it was? You would think if he used it for purposes for establishing NC's whereabouts before 7 that he would have removed it when he got home. As for the LTF card being in his possession; I keep mine in my gym bag. It wouldn't be with my purse.

[raisincharlie]

SHE put the purse in the car when she was trying to get away from him. He followed her to the car, pulled her out and did her in...in the garage.

Would the first theory not encompass that ? I think so - just not in the same words you used is all.

[reddress58]

She wasn't planning on leaving and didn't put her purse there in anticipation of that. It was spur of the moment in anger or fear...running from the monster. Just my opinion. I guess I'm trying to tie it in with why he was confident enough and so agreeable to allow LE into the house. It seems to me the garage would be a likely place for the deed, and how the two of them got there would tie in why the purse was in the car.

[jumpstreet]

I still think this theory requires too much thought process for someone who just committed a crime of passion....not pre-meditated. I have to go with FC's theory because, in his place, I would do the same thing

Agree! Thanks Flowerchild - that theory on the (alleged) LTF attempt to swipe NC's card makes a whole lot more sense than it being a trip to "place" her there.

Before, I was saying I couldn't think of a reasonable explanation (though I really thought the notion of it "placing" her there was nonsensical). You thought of a perfectly reasonable, and IMO likely one.

Anything is possible, and like RC has said, murderers aren't always thinking/behaving rationally, but the notion that he would utilize LTF trip for anything other than what you said just doesn't seem reasonable at all. (again, IMO... :) )

[momto3kids]

Why would he leave her purse in her car for LE to find unless he didn't realize that's where it was? You would think if he used it for purposes for establishing NC's whereabouts before 7 that he would have removed it when he got home. As for the LTF card being in his possession; I keep mine in my gym bag. It wouldn't be with my purse.

That's just it..it wasn't for LE to find except in the parking lot of LTF. He was trying to establish an alibi around noon to 1pm. The car was his next step in his plan...but JA was too far ahead of him by calling the LE.

NC card could have been in a gym bag...but we don't know that to be the case. Either way the purse was planted there with her cell phone, IMO

[reddress58]

That's just it..it wasn't for LE to find except in the parking lot of LTF. He was trying to establish an alibi around noon to 1pm. The car was his next step in his plan...but JA was too far ahead of him by calling the LE.

NC card could have been in a gym bag...but we don't know that to be the case. Either way the purse was planted there with her cell phone, IMO
Do you think he was driving NC's car when LE called him to come home? Doesn't make sense. Put the purse in her car, drive to LTF with children to get her card scanned, come home, drive her car back there. Why not just take her car in the first place to leave? We know it was in the driveway because JA was looking in it. Perplexed!

[reddress58]

That's just it..it wasn't for LE to find except in the parking lot of LTF. He was trying to establish an alibi around noon to 1pm. The car was his next step in his plan...but JA was too far ahead of him by calling the LE.

NC card could have been in a gym bag...but we don't know that to be the case. Either way the purse was planted there with her cell phone, IMO
...also, he told JA she went for a run from the house. How could he explain that the car was all of a sudden not there at the house when he already told JA she didn't drive?

[ncnative]

No matter what time of day or night, the homes are really close together where Brad and Nancy live(d). Doors opening/closing on cars, garage, or house, a scuffle--while outside would have made someone's dog bark or someone may have been awake using the bathroom (neighbors), etc. I hear everything.

If he had been threatening and had Nancy outside, she probably would have screamed loudly to get attention, I would think. I think it was an "inside" job. I also think that we will be in for a little surprise or two when all is said and done.

[reddress58]

No matter what time of day or night, the homes are really close together where Brad and Nancy live(d). Doors opening/closing on cars, garage, or house, a scuffle--while outside would have made someone's dog bark or someone may have been awake using the bathroom (neighbors), etc. I hear everything.

If he had been threatening and had Nancy outside, she probably would have screamed loudly to get attention, I would think. I think it was an "inside" job. I also think that we will be in for a little surprise or two when all is said and done.
But it could have been muffled if it took place in the garage. That is not outside.

[SleuthyGal]

This leaves two possible scenarios:

Nancy was alive sometime in the morning not long before the so called 7 am runtime. {snip}
Any other ideas.

What I can't get past is that she had plans with JA for 8am to paint. I can't see why she would go running at 7am if she was to be at JA's at 8am. I mean I suppose it's not impossible to do so, but it just doesn't feel' right and that's as specific as I can be.

[momto3kids]

She wasn't planning on leaving and didn't put her purse there in anticipation of that. It was spur of the moment in anger or fear...running from the monster. Just my opinion. I guess I'm trying to tie it in with why he was confident enough and so agreeable to allow LE into the house. It seems to me the garage would be a likely place for the deed, and how the two of them got there would tie in why the purse was in the car.

Too much time would be spent to unlock a vehicle, open the door shut it, lock it and start the engine...

She had a friend directly in front of her doorstep she could scream and bang on the Duncan's door.

Her vehicle was outside not the garage from what I have gathered, so flinging the purse in the SUV would mean she had to go outside.

[reddress58]

Too much time would be spent to unlock a vehicle, open the door shut it, lock it and start the engine...

She had a friend directly in front of her doorstep she could scream and bang on the Duncan's door.

Her vehicle was outside not the garage from what I have gathered, so flinging the purse in the SUV would mean she had to go outside.
I asked at one time if anyone knew where the SUV was during the night, and no one knew for sure. Why do you think it was in the drive all night?

[reddress58]

Too much time would be spent to unlock a vehicle, open the door shut it, lock it and start the engine...

She had a friend directly in front of her doorstep she could scream and bang on the Duncan's door.

Her vehicle was outside not the garage from what I have gathered, so flinging the purse in the SUV would mean she had to go outside.
...also, I suggested she may be leaving in anger...not just fear. If that were the case, she wouldn't need to bang on the Duncan's door.

[momto3kids]

Agree! Thanks Flowerchild - that theory on the (alleged) LTF attempt to swipe NC's card makes a whole lot more sense than it being a trip to "place" her there.

Before, I was saying I couldn't think of a reasonable explanation (though I really thought the notion of it "placing" her there was nonsensical). You thought of a perfectly reasonable, and IMO likely one.

Anything is possible, and like RC has said, murderers aren't always thinking/behaving rationally, but the notion that he would utilize LTF trip for anything other than what you said just doesn't seem reasonable at all. (again, IMO... :) )

My source tells me it was NOT to inquire about NC and her whereabouts.

[reddress58]

My source tells me it was NOT to inquire about NC and her whereabouts.
Well, THAT makes a big difference. Could you tell us exactly what you know so we can see things from your perspective? Once again, you have a serious advantage, Mom.

[SleuthyGal]

Anything around 7 had a possibility of the children up and around..walkers, joggers behind his house, etc.

Back to the purse....planted, because IMO she was dead much sooner than 7am.

Not to mention his 4:20am visit to HT. If that's true and he did go to HT at 4:20am to buy detergent, then she was dead before that...dead before or by 4am. Otherwise, what would be the point of going to the store at 4am? A suddent urge to get up and do laundry?

[momto3kids]

I asked at one time if anyone knew where the SUV was during the night, and no one knew for sure. Why do you think it was in the drive all night?

Since the last time you asked ...I found out about the vehicles. Just take my word for it, the sedan was the vehicle of choice.

[reddress58]

Not to mention his 4:20am visit to HT. If that's true and he did go to HT at 4:20am to buy detergent, then she was dead before that...dead before or by 4am. Otherwise, what would be the point of going to the store at 4am? A suddent urge to get up and do laundry?
Maybe he had a particular kind of dream. (Lordy...somebody slap me)

[reddress58]

Since the last time you asked ...I found out about the vehicles. Just take my word for it, the sedan was the vehicle of choice.
Oh I agree that was the car used to take her to the recovery site. I just want to know if she ran to her car while it was in the garage before the altercation. He could have switched cars if one was in the driveway.

[ncnative]

Reddress, that is hilarious!!!

[reddress58]

Reddress, that is hilarious!!!
Well, he WAS deprived....since the conception of Katie. Those things happen. :-)

[reddress58]

I'm going to bed early before I get myself in trouble with the web police. Ya'll solve this by the morning and I'll give you each a quarter. LOL

[ncnative]

He had ladies of the evening on the side, but I'm sure he had "a particular kind of dream" many times, due to the yellow/brown stained sheets. Well, I don't know about the brown part...

[momto3kids]

Well, THAT makes a big difference. Could you tell us exactly what you know so we can see things from your perspective? Once again, you have a serious advantage, Mom.

I just said the most I can. I am not willing to jepordize anyone's job or friendship over BC...he is not worth it to me. He went in trying to get an alibi for NC last place seen and not inquire about her.

The one thing I keep saying is remember the gp's were already in front of a judge for the Ex Parte, even before the SW was completed! A family from out of the country, bio parent still alive, SW still underway, and the judge believe's what a family says about BC being unstable?

ON Saturday the LE knew what they had on their hands when they left BC home, and everyone was ready to go to the judge once NC was identified.

[jumpstreet]

My source tells me it was NOT to inquire about NC and her whereabouts.

Wow. Just when I was about to offer to go to LTF myself, show my membership card, and see if I could get them to tell me if my spouse had been there earlier in the day. [I was going to personally test the sanity of FC's theory... guess I won't bother now... :) ]

Thinking more about FC's theory, still what would be the point of him asking them to swipe her card. Why would he need to ask that I wonder. Are you assuming that they need the card to pull up her membership or something? (Vs being able to pull it up via his card). [ It's moot point if Mom's source is right, but just wondering ]

[momto3kids]

He had ladies of the evening on the side, but I'm sure he had "a particular kind of dream" many times, due to the yellow/brown stained sheets. Well, I don't know about the brown part...

I sure hope he and mommy dearest bought several sets while at Penney's!:crazy:

[jumpstreet]

The one thing I keep saying is remember the gp's were already in front of a judge for the Ex Parte, even before the SW was completed! A family from out of the country, bio parent still alive, SW still underway, and the judge believe's what a family says about BC being unstable?


Agree here - I've always thought the plantiff's must have something of substance to get that ex-parte. Also feel they have a "position of negotiation" even to get the current arrangement. [ Don't buy it was all a 'generous gift' from BC ]. (IMO) W. Smith said "here's what will come out if we go into court... unless you want that... then these are the terms... "

[reddress58]

I just said the most I can. I am not willing to jepordize anyone's job or friendship over BC...he is not worth it to me. He went in trying to get an alibi for NC last place seen and not inquire about her.

The one thing I keep saying is remember the gp's were already in front of a judge for the Ex Parte, even before the SW was completed! A family from out of the country, bio parent still alive, SW still underway, and the judge believe's what a family says about BC being unstable?

ON Saturday the LE knew what they had on their hands when they left BC home, and everyone was ready to go to the judge once NC was identified.
Which would explain why Bazemore was so quick to conclude it was an isolated incident and not an random killing.

[momto3kids]

Wow. Just when I was about to offer to go to LTF myself, show my membership card, and see if I could get them to tell me if my spouse had been there earlier in the day. [I was going to personally test the sanity of FC's theory... guess I won't bother now... :) ]

Thinking more about FC's theory, still what would be the point of him asking them to swipe her card. Why would he need to ask that I wonder. Are you assuming that they need the card to pull up her membership or something? (Vs being able to pull it up via his card). [ It's moot point if Mom's source is right, but just wondering ].


1--If it was that easy he could have called.
2--He knew she couldn't get in without her ID
3--If he was inquiring about NC then how would he explain it when he takes her ID card out?

[reddress58]

Wow. Just when I was about to offer to go to LTF myself, show my membership card, and see if I could get them to tell me if my spouse had been there earlier in the day. [I was going to personally test the sanity of FC's theory... guess I won't bother now... :) ]

Thinking more about FC's theory, still what would be the point of him asking them to swipe her card. Why would he need to ask that I wonder. Are you assuming that they need the card to pull up her membership or something? (Vs being able to pull it up via his card). [ It's moot point if Mom's source is right, but just wondering ]
He could not establish she was at the club unless her card was swiped. You can't enter without your card being swiped. He needed it to be so he could say she was there.

[jumpstreet]

Which would explain why Bazemore was so quick to conclude it was an isolated incident and not an random killing.

Can someone PLEASE go down to the SBI and tell them to get a move on??!!

[Roy23]

Does anyone think that BC didn't know that Nancy's friend was frantically trying to get in touch with her when the cell phone was near BC the whole time? I know you are an insider MOM but this LTF stuff maybe is not as accurate as has been told to you.

[reddress58]

He had ladies of the evening on the side, but I'm sure he had "a particular kind of dream" many times, due to the yellow/brown stained sheets. Well, I don't know about the brown part...
Self tanning lotion maybe? :-)

[momto3kids]

Which would explain why Bazemore was so quick to conclude it was an isolated incident and not an random killing.

Ya think??:waitasec:

Hey you were going to bed....I guess you're like me, come back for more..:crazy:

[SleuthyGal]

Maybe he had a particular kind of dream. (Lordy...somebody slap me) omg! bwah!! :slap: :slap:

[raisincharlie]

What I can't get past is that she had plans with JA for 8am to paint. I can't see why she would go running at 7am if she was to be at JA's at 8am. I mean I suppose it's not impossible to do so, but it just doesn't feel' right and that's as specific as I can be.

Thats part of my problem with this. Add to it - the day before she had a plan to run at 5:45 am - this was cancled. 5:45 am

It was also reported Nancy was not feeling well at the party. She did however tell CM that she planned to run Saturday morning. A lot of contrdictions with these items.

[momto3kids]

He could not establish she was at the club unless her card was swiped. You can't enter without your card being swiped. He needed it to be so he could say she was there.

Exactly..so again question #1...why did BC go there in the 1st place? NC couldn't enter without her card and she carried NOTHING when she went jogging.

OOPS...I miss read your statement..oh well I look like I went off the deep end didn't I just then???LOL

[reddress58]

Ya think??:waitasec:

Hey you were going to bed....I guess you're like me, come back for more..:crazy:
Now you know why I needed the vacation. Off to bed...really, this time.

[sunflowers]

The wreath... the wreath... has anybody seen the WREATH...

(Said to the tune of Led Zepplin's "...Has anybody seen the BRIDGE")


great song, & it's a great tune for the wreath, the wreath, ....

[momto3kids]

Does anyone think that BC didn't know that Nancy's friend was frantically trying to get in touch with her when the cell phone was near BC the whole time? I know you are an insider MOM but this LTF stuff maybe is not as accurate as has been told to you.

BC didn't have the phone next to him, it was in the SUV.

I just listed about LTF...reasons 1,2 and 3

[momto3kids]

Thats part of my problem with this. Add to it - the day before she had a plan to run at 5:45 am - this was cancled. 5:45 am

It was also reported Nancy was not feeling well at the party. She did however tell CM that she planned to run Saturday morning. A lot of contrdictions with these items.


But was CM at the party? If NC wasn't feeling good maybe CM didn't know that since she wasn't with her Friday nite.
NC was at CM house Wednesday night and went home leaving BC and the girls behind.

[Roy23]

BC didn't have the phone next to him, it was in the SUV.

I just listed about LTF...reasons 1,2 and 3



hmmm. Okay, so it is clear for sure which vehicle that Brad dumped the body and drove around with his two kids in.

[raisincharlie]

But was CM at the party? If NC wasn't feeling good maybe CM didn't know that. NC was at CM house Wednesday night and went home leaving BC and the girls behind.


Dunno - but it was in CM's interview - she said it herself that nancy planned to run Saturday.

Nothing else to say about it.

But I do not believe for one second BC was out looking for Nancy at LTF - he had a much different reason for being there and it was strictly related to him and him alone. JA brought to his attention - inadvertantly - that there was a huge hole in his little plan - he knew he could not be the last person to see Nancy, he also knew he had to have ber located somewhere away from the home. JA rocked his little world big time. His affidavits are going to come back and bite him.

[SleuthyGal]

he knew he could not be the last person to see Nancy, he also knew he had to have ber located somewhere away from the home. And whadyaknow...he is the last known person to see her alive. Exactly what he didn't want to have happen.

[raisincharlie]

And whadyaknow...he is the last known person to see her alive. Exactly what he didn't want to have happen.

Might have worked somewhat, only somewhat thought, if JA had not felt so strongly there was something wrong and waited 24 hours...

[momto3kids]

Does anyone think that BC didn't know that Nancy's friend was frantically trying to get in touch with her when the cell phone was near BC the whole time? I know you are an insider MOM but this LTF stuff maybe is not as accurate as has been told to you.

Roy.....I totally understand what you are saying, but again........

1--If it was that easy to get information he could have called.
2--He knew she couldn't get in without her ID and she carried nothing as he stated
3--If he was inquiring about NC then how would he explain it when he takes her ID card out, knowing she couldn't have gotten in to LTF?

It is because he asked for it to be scanned.

[momto3kids]

Might have worked somewhat, only somewhat thought, if JA had not felt so strongly there was something wrong and waited 24 hours...

Have you ever smelled a freshly cleaned home and car?:waitasec:

[SleuthyGal]

I was driving back home from my (non-swanky) gym tonight and thinking about when a spouse is murdered and it's NOT the intimate partner. You know the remaining spouse is often seen in/around the community, on TV, in articles, talking about the dead spouse, looking for the perp, keeping the publicity up...it's often a way to cope as well as I'm sure coming from a place of grief and anger. Families do this who have a loved one that is murdered too.

Now let's look at Brad. Assume for a moment he's innocent. Wife is murdered. Mother of his kids dead. And...no reaction other than a look of annoyance at the press conf. Doesn't attend any memorial, none of Nancy's friends are consoling him. Nancy's parents think he did it, he's lost custody of the kids temporarily...

and...

he's just kind of doing a virtual shrug.

This 'devastated' man who now has allll the time in the world to help seek the killer of his wife is just hanging out. Now I know people grieve in different ways; of course they do.

But this guy? Does nothing. He or someone in his home removes the white bow honoring Nancy, from the front of his house. He could have made a sign, "Justice for Nancy." He could have done lots of little/quiet things. But what does he do?

Nothing.

This 'innocent' guy, whose wife (who he claims to love) was murdered...the mother of his 2 little girls...does

NOTHING.

And yes, that's absolutely his right.

But it doesn't look right.

[ember]

I've been busy w/cheerleading and football...haven't been around much but I do stop in to check to see what's going on with this case and I'm really surprised that there is still no movement on this one way or another.

Does LE know anything new? Has anything new come out? I checked the media thread but...nothing....hmmmm...seems if they had anything on Brad, action would have been taken by now. This case is even completely out of the media too.....

[Roy23]

I was driving back home from my (non-swanky) gym tonight and thinking about when a spouse is murdered and it's NOT the intimate partner. You know the remaining spouse is often seen in/around the community, on TV, in articles, talking about the dead spouse, looking for the perp, keeping the publicity up...it's often a way to cope as well as I'm sure coming from a place of grief and anger. Families do this who have a loved one that is murdered too.

Now let's look at Brad. Assume for a moment he's innocent. Wife is murdered. Mother of his kids dead. And...no reaction other than a look of annoyance at the press conf. Doesn't attend any memorial, none of Nancy's friends are consoling him. Nancy's parents think he did it, he's lost custody of the kids temporarily...

and...

he's just kind of doing a virtual shrug.

This 'devastated' man who now has allll the time in the world to help seek the killer of his wife is just hanging out. Now I know people grieve in different ways; of course they do.

But this guy? Does nothing. He or someone in his home removes the white bow honoring Nancy, from the front of his house. He could have made a sign, "Justice for Nancy." He could have done lots of little/quiet things. But what does he do?

Nothing.

This 'innocent' guy, whose wife (who he claims to love) was murdered...the mother of his 2 little girls...does

NOTHING.

And yes, that's absolutely his right.

But it doesn't look right.



Post of the day.

[raisincharlie]

Have you ever smelled a freshly cleaned home and car?:waitasec:

Never :crazy:

Mom, I have little doubt that LE did know something was up very early on. Did you see my note that Bazemore confirmed that both cars were looked at by LE on that very Saturday ? Bet they smelled a clean car too.

[Roy23]

Roy.....I totally understand what you are saying, but again........

1--If it was that easy to get information he could have called.
2--He knew she couldn't get in without her ID and she carried nothing as he stated
3--If he was inquiring about NC then how would he explain it when he takes her ID card out, knowing she couldn't have gotten in to LTF?

It is because he asked for it to be scanned.


I ask this in ignorance so bear with me. What exactly has LE or LTF said about BC visiting this establishment?

[momto3kids]

SG....lets add NO obituary.
Tells the sweet innocent children their mom is dead just before the memorial and walks away. This man is suppose to protect them, help them thru times of need. JERK is putting it mildly.

[EntreNous]

What concerns me is Willoughby in all this. JY is walking around scott free with extremely damning SW's that you'd think would be enough to put this guy away for a very long time. In the meantime JY has enjoyed several additional months of freedom. Why? So Willoughby's ego will remain pristine?

It's only been several weeks in BC's case so I understand to an extent but is this case going to drag out for an eternity like the JY case has??? Should everyone just sit back and wait for BC's to wallow around in freedom for the next few years while Willoughby deals with his perfectionism?

[momto3kids]

I ask this in ignorance so bear with me. What exactly has LE or LTF said about BC visiting this establishment?

Again, I won't elaborate....just he didn't go to check on NC.

[jumpstreet]

I was driving back home from my (non-swanky) gym tonight and thinking about when a spouse is murdered and it's NOT the intimate partner. You know the remaining spouse is often seen in/around the community, on TV, in articles, talking about the dead spouse, looking for the perp, keeping the publicity up...it's often a way to cope as well as I'm sure coming from a place of grief and anger. Families do this who have a loved one that is murdered too.

Now let's look at Brad. Assume for a moment he's innocent. Wife is murdered. Mother of his kids dead. And...no reaction other than a look of annoyance at the press conf. Doesn't attend any memorial, none of Nancy's friends are consoling him. Nancy's parents think he did it, he's lost custody of the kids temporarily...

and...

he's just kind of doing a virtual shrug.

This 'devastated' man who now has allll the time in the world to help seek the killer of his wife is just hanging out. Now I know people grieve in different ways; of course they do.

But this guy? Does nothing. He or someone in his home removes the white bow honoring Nancy, from the front of his house. He could have made a sign, "Justice for Nancy." He could have done lots of little/quiet things. But what does he do?

Nothing.

This 'innocent' guy, whose wife (who he claims to love) was murdered...the mother of his 2 little girls...does

NOTHING.

And yes, that's absolutely his right.

But it doesn't look right.

I've thought a bit about this too, and agree on the surface it might not look right, but to some extent, won't he get dinged either way? If he were to campaign / offer reward / go on TV and say he will fight for justice... won't people just say he's being disingenuous, and trying to "trick" everyone (ie, pull an "OJ"). [ Similar reaction when K&B posted up their web site ]

If it were me, and I was innocent, I suppose I wouldn't care what everyone thought, and I'd do it (search, go on TV, offer award, go vigilante, whatever)... anyway, who knows what his attorneys have advised him... who knows EXACTLY how any of us would deal with this exact situation.

Bottom line, it's hard (for me anyway) to pass too much judgment on this particular front.

[EntreNous]

I've thought a bit about this too, and agree on the surface it might not look right, but to some extent, won't he get dinged either way? If he were to campaign / offer reward / go on TV and say he will fight for justice... won't people just say he's being disingenuous, and trying to "trick" everyone (ie, pull an "OJ"). [ Similar reaction when K&B posted up their web site ]

If it were me, and I was innocent, I suppose I wouldn't care what everyone thought, and I'd do it (search, go on TV, offer an award, go vigilante, whatever)... anyway, who knows what his attorneys have advised him... who knows EXACTLY how any of us would deal with this exact situation.

Bottom line, it's hard (for me anyway) to pass too much judgment on this particular front.
Not if he's being sincere.

Trust me, something happens to your spouse and I don't care how private you are, you start acting hinky and people are going to pick up on it.

[jumpstreet]

It's only been several weeks in BC's case so I understand to an extent but is this case going to drag out for an eternity like the JY case has??? Should everyone just sit back and wait for BC's to wallow around in freedom for the next few years while Willoughby deals with his perfectionism?

I've said it before, that either the forensics yield a slam-dunk, in which case look for a prompt arrest sometime next week (post GJ on Monday and pre-Sep 2nd).. OR... we might as well make ourselves comfortable here...

[raisincharlie]

I've said it before, that either the forensics yield a slam-dunk, in which case look for a prompt arrest sometime next week (post GJ on Monday and pre-Sep 2nd).. OR... we better start make ourselves comfortable here...

There is no such thing as a slam dunk when it comes to a trial.

[momto3kids]

Never :crazy:

Mom, I have little doubt that LE did know something was up very early on. Did you see my note that Bazemore confirmed that both cars were looked at by LE on that very Saturday ? Bet they smelled a clean car too.

I just know when someone scrubs their home it smells it, at least to me. BC house has all hardwoods downstairs except for the family room from what I know. So not too much vacuming, but mopping.

I believe when one enters the home a just cleaned fresh home was noticed, not to mention a BMW.:crazy:

[Roy23]

Again, I won't elaborate....just he didn't go to check on NC.

I am not asking you to elaborate. I am asking if Brad went to LTF for an absolute fact and what do we know that is not rumor? Anybody?

[EntreNous]

I've said it before, that either the forensics yield a slam-dunk, in which case look for a prompt arrest sometime next week (post GJ on Monday and pre-Sep 2nd).. OR... we might as well make ourselves comfortable here...

Well, that would certainly be a shame because if Brad Cooper did murder his wife he doesn't deserve that freedom.

[mahmoo]

What I can't get past is that she had plans with JA for 8am to paint. I can't see why she would go running at 7am if she was to be at JA's at 8am. I mean I suppose it's not impossible to do so, but it just doesn't feel' right and that's as specific as I can be.

That's always been a big sticking point with me as well........just doesn't gel.

[EntreNous]

I am not asking you to elaborate. I am asking if Brad went to LTF for an absolute fact and what do we know that is not rumor? Anybody?

A very reliable source Roy. I don't think she can get it notarized for you.:crazy:

[SleuthyGal]

I've thought a bit about this too, and agree on the surface it might not look right, but to some extent, won't he get dinged either way? If he were to campaign / offer reward / go on TV and say he will fight for justice... won't people just say he's being disingenuous, and trying to "trick" everyone (ie, pull an "OJ"). [ Similar reaction when K&B posted up their web site ]

If it were me, and I was innocent, I suppose I wouldn't care what everyone thought, and I'd do it (search, go on TV, offer an award, go vigilante, whatever)... anyway, who knows what his attorneys have advised him... who knows EXACTLY how any of us would deal with this exact situation.

Bottom line, it's hard (for me anyway) to pass too much judgment on this particular front.

I've watched the reaction of the people around him. He is part of a very caring community. The fact that NO ONE is showing up on his doorstep with casserole in hand, NONE of their friends (other than S.H.) is speaking with him, let alone consoling him. Nancy's parents want nothing to do with him. He's not calling L.E. and asking for updates on the investigation to find Nancy's killer. Forget all the high profile stuff that some people do. Just little acts that are caring things. He's persona non grata now. And no, I don't think it's *just* the fact that they were headed towards divorce.

The community does NOT appear to be supporting Brad. There's no reward being offered for the killer(s)...not offered by ANYONE, including Nancy's family, friends, Cisco...NO ONE.

Now that doesn't mean a person is guilty if the community isn't supportive of them, but it's a clue as to what people think and the environment.

Brad is more concerned with getting receipts from HT (and probably learning what video they have on him) than in helping to catch the 'real killer' of his wife. Again, that doesn't mean he's guilty, but it does give one pause. And yes, Mom, no obituary in the paper! And I sincerely doubt he had any memorial service for NC. He's not sorry she's dead...he's just sorry that the spotlight is on him for it.

Now I worry that there won't be enough evidence for super-careful-DA Willoughby to ever take this to trial. Yes, I'm concerned. He seems very hesitant to prosecute and you know what? Not ALL cases are 'slam dunks.' Sometimes you do have to take a little risk in order to get justice.

[Roy23]

What concerns me is Willoughby in all this. JY is walking around scott free with extremely damning SW's that you'd think would be enough to put this guy away for a very long time. In the meantime JY has enjoyed several additional months of freedom. Why? So Willoughby's ego will remain pristine?

It's only been several weeks in BC's case so I understand to an extent but is this case going to drag out for an eternity like the JY case has??? Should everyone just sit back and wait for BC's to wallow around in freedom for the next few years while Willoughby deals with his perfectionism?


The JY case is not even close to an open and shut case. The shoes he bought were similar, but not exact. Heck yeah he is guilty but a whole lot of wiggle room to prove beyond a reasonable doubt. It stinks.

[raisincharlie]

I just know when someone scrubs their home it smells it, at least to me. BC house has all hardwoods downstairs except for the family room from what I know. So not too much vacuming, but mopping.

I believe when one enters the home a just cleaned fresh home was noticed, not to mention a BMW.:crazy:

Would take some serious scrubbing the carpeting in the BMW. If he scrubbed it - LE would have noted it Saturday when they checked both cars- can you say dead give away?

[momto3kids]

A very reliable source Roy. I don't think she can get it notarized for you.:crazy:

Roy...BC put it in his affidavit.

[jumpstreet]

There is no such thing as a slam dunk when it comes to a trial.

By "slam-dunk", I meant enough to at least convince the DA to bring it to GJ. My prediction is that if that doesn't happen next week (assuming the forensics will be back next week (if they aren't already back), and I'm basing that on the 2 week extension on the SW sealing) it won't happen anytime soon

Agreed, for the trial part, of course anything (and I mean anything) can happen.
If indicted, would you predict a request for change-of-venue?

[momto3kids]

Would take some serious scrubbing the carpeting in the BMW. If he scrubbed it - LE would have noted it Saturday when they checked both cars- can you say dead give away?

DEAD :thumb:.

[Roy23]

A very reliable source Roy. I don't think she can get it notarized for you.:crazy:


So in a nutshell, again no proof of LTF at all. This doesn't get it done for me although it may be 100% correct. I want to deal with proven facts. I will watch this from the sidelines until this all comes out. I am not used to one insider having more information than the bloodsucking media.

[SleuthyGal]

I am not asking you to elaborate. I am asking if Brad went to LTF for an absolute fact and what do we know that is not rumor? Anybody?

Roy, LE has not commented on any aspect of this case or its details past the statement that this is an isolated incident and not a random crime. And no other organization involved (be it HT or LTF or anyone else) has publicly commented on any aspect of this case. Ditto any organization that was served with a SW, except for the generic statement from Cisco that they are cooperating with LE/SW request.

[jumpstreet]

Now I worry that there won't be enough evidence for super-careful-DA Willoughby to ever take this to trial. Yes, I'm concerned. He seems very hesitant to prosecute and you know what? Not ALL cases are 'slam dunks.' Sometimes you do have to take a little risk in order to get justice.

If in doubt, DA has to err on the side of avoiding an OJ situation (he walks), or worse, Duke Lacrosse situation. At least (and it's probably a good thing) - Wake DA is the anti-Nifong. :)

[mahmoo]

Post of the day.

I'm nominating that baby for post of the month!!!!

[raisincharlie]

By "slam-dunk", I meant enough to at least convince the DA to bring it to GJ. My prediction is that if that doesn't happen next week (assuming the forensics will be back next week (if they aren't already back), and I'm basing that on the 2 week extension on the SW sealing) it won't happen anytime soon

Agreed, for the trial part, of course anything (and I mean anything) can happen.
If indicted, would you predict a request for change-of-venue?

Don't know why you think the foresnics would be back next week - 60 days is 60 days and its not there yet. You've seen the warrants on Jason Young yes ? If what they have on that guy isn't enough to motivate Mr. Willoughby, I seriously wonder what it would take - a stick of dynamite perhaps to get him out of his office and into a courtroom ?

I have no doubt there will be a request for a change of venue but I have serious doubts it will be granted. LE has been very careful, no leaks, no evidence released, not even a COD has slipped out. I don't see a change of venue being granted.

[jumpstreet]

He's not calling L.E. and asking for updates on the investigation to find Nancy's killer.

Thanks SG. Agree with the gist of your post. For the above though - is it a known fact (if so, reliable source?) - or just speculation?

[EntreNous]

The JY case is not even close to an open and shut case. The shoes he bought were similar, but not exact. Heck yeah he is guilty but a whole lot of wiggle room to prove beyond a reasonable doubt. It stinks.
IIRC the shoes had the same sole, that's not similar, that's the same.
If Willoughby hasn't got his junk in one bag by now, he's probably not going to unless he gets a written confession from JY. Sometimes you have to know when to take your best shot.

Same with BC. I really hope he doesn't flounder again.

[SleuthyGal]

I'm nominating that baby for post of the month!!!!

Awwww you guys! :blush:

[raisincharlie]

So in a nutshell, again no proof of LTF at all. This doesn't get it done for me although it may be 100% correct. I want to deal with proven facts. I will watch this from the sidelines until this all comes out. I am not used to one insider having more information than the bloodsucking media.

If you listen to the questions asked by the bloodsucking media in the pressers, you will hear they have heard a great deal and have gotten the standard response. I doubt the media has missed much.

[EntreNous]

If in doubt, DA has to err on the side of avoiding an OJ situation (he walks), or worse, Duke Lacrosse situation. At least (and it's probably a good thing) - Wake DA is the anti-Nifong. :)

I don't buy it. He's walking now and will for his lifetime unless W can muster the courage to at least try.

[SleuthyGal]

Thanks SG. Agree with the gist of your post. For the above though - is it a known fact (if so, reliable source?) - or just speculation?

Speculation on my part. But I believe we'd be hearing about it from someone if that were the case. Stuff manages to get talked about, ya know?

[reddress58]

Roy.....I totally understand what you are saying, but again........

1--If it was that easy to get information he could have called.
2--He knew she couldn't get in without her ID and she carried nothing as he stated
3--If he was inquiring about NC then how would he explain it when he takes her ID card out, knowing she couldn't have gotten in to LTF?

It is because he asked for it to be scanned.
I couldn't sleep. I need another vacation. :-) One thing here you have wrong. You most certainly can get into LTF without your ID. As I stated on a previous post, you can give them your name and they will match the mug on their computer with yours and let you in. So it wouldn't matter if she left home without anything; she could still go to the gym.

[Roy23]

Roy...BC put it in his affidavit.

Think about this for a minute or longer. He put that he went there to look for Nancy and asked to swipe her card so that he could prove that he was not the last person to see her alive.

Am I missing something here?

[SleuthyGal]

Kind of humorous aside: in the trunk of my car (not a BMW, btw) some liquid laundry detergent oozed out...oh... about 2 years ago. I didn't know it for a long time cause my trunk was packed with junk. Plus I have/had dried mulchy type clippings in there from some gardening stuff I purchased. Basically my trunk was kinda a pig sty (not even kinda...it was).

I just kind of chuckle now when I see that still sort-of gooey spot in the middle where the laundry detergent coagulated. It never dried completely. I did finally clean out my trunk and it's a LOT better than it was. A lot less grass/mulch stuff and all the junk is gone.

But...it's a good thing I have no desire to commit a crime and then transport anything via trunk to 'hide' it. Cause yeah, THAT wouldn't work.

[jumpstreet]

Don't know why you think the foresnics would be back next week - 60 days is 60 days and its not there yet...

Yeah, perhaps I read too much into the fact that the judge granted a 2 week extension. My take on it was that the judge perhaps knew (via DA or whoever) that they anticipated the forensics back this week or next. That's why he wasn't inclined to grant any more than 2 more weeks. With the forensics (the major outstanding datapoint right now), there's either a case for GJ or not.

I'll soften the prediction to say that if the forensic results don't yield an indictment, then it's going to be a long (if not indefinite) wait. [ and yes, I based this on the Young case status, after reading that stuff ]

The follow-up statement is, I would not be surprised if there is some anticipation of the forensic results being returned this week or next.

But of course... what do I know. :)

[SleuthyGal]

Think about this for a minute or longer. He put that he went there to look for Nancy and asked to swipe her card so that he could prove that he was not the last person to see her alive.

Roy, BC didn't say anything about cards or getting cards swiped at LTF. He just says he went there to look for her.

Mom got some 'insider' info on the rest...that's the part you want official confirmation on and sorry, there just isn't anything OFFICIAL out there on this so we're just going to have to be patient.

[raisincharlie]

Yeah, perhaps I read too much into the fact that the judge granted a 2 week extension. My take on it was that the judge perhaps knew (via DA or whoever) that they anticipated the forensics back this week or next. That's why he wasn't inclined to grant any more than 2 more weeks. With the forensics (the major outstanding datapoint right now), there's either a case for GJ or not.

I'll soften the prediction to say that if the forensic results don't yield an indictment, then it's going to be a long (if not indefinite) wait. [ and yes, I based this on the Young case status, after reading that stuff ]

The follow-up statement is, I would not be surprised if there is some anticipation of the forensic results being returned this week or next.

But of course... what do I know. :)

For all we know he could already have been indicted, same with Jason Young. LE and the DA do not have to act immediately on a true bill indictment or an arrest warrant.

[Roy23]

If you listen to the questions asked by the bloodsucking media in the pressers, you will hear they have heard a great deal and have gotten the standard response. I doubt the media has missed much.

they might be getting some of it from here Charlie. They are on a fishing expedition but don't want to get sued in the process. Lets face it, in any situation like this comes rampant rumors. In most cases, they get it from LE running their mouths. I don't know that is true here.

It is obvious that BC is in the crosshairs. So he is most likely guilty. That doesn't mean we can just paint the picture of how we know he is guilty. We don't know anything other than LE immediately knew this was not random and they knew to haul fanny back to Brad's house.

[momto3kids]

Speculation on my part. But I believe we'd be hearing about it from someone if that were the case. Stuff manages to get talked about, ya know?

You know, BC could have gone on any national program and discussed this like so many do, but no he only attends 1 press conference and 1 phone interview. Does this sound like he really is trying?:waitasec:

I really do believe if NC family didn't feel pretty confident in who did this and who was going to be arrested one of those family members would be here staying on top of it.

[sunflowers]

He had the girls with him, though. He'd have to take a cab home or carry them.

could easily drop the girls off w a friend or neighbor while he "looked" for Nancy (& coincidentally dropped her car off at LTF, & ran home.) LTF is actually quite close to his house (there's a path to cut through to Ritter Park to Resurrection Lutheran Church & onto Lochmere--going past, of course JJ)

[jumpstreet]

I don't buy it. He's walking now and will for his lifetime unless W can muster the courage to at least try.

Yeah, it's a judgment call no doubt. Probably hard to say exactly what's the right call without being in the DA's shoes. No doubt having to consider that you only get one crack at this thing weighs in there.

I would think that unless you think there's absolutely no reasonable chance of finding out more about a given case (getting more evidence) now or in the future, and/or you just don't think you've got that pesky reasonable doubt thing take care of... you just don't make a move.

While we all have our theories, the earlier informal poll to the group didn't yield anyone saying they would convict based on current knowns, if they were sitting on the jury today. [ Anyone changed their mind? ]

Side bar: Is it possible DA has already taken what they have to the GJ, and the GJ denied it? [ I assume "yes".. and maybe even for the Young case also? We've getting on Wake DA, but for all we know, is it a couple of sticklers on the GJ that are the hold up for both cases? :) ]

[raisincharlie]

they might be getting some of it from here Charlie. They are on a fishing expedition but don't want to get sued in the process. Lets face it, in any situation like this comes rampant rumors. In most cases, they get it from LE running their mouths. I don't know that is true here.

It is obvious that BC is in the crosshairs. So he is most likely guilty. That doesn't mean we can just paint the picture of how we know he is guilty. We don't know anything other than LE immediately knew this was not random and they knew to haul fanny back to Brad's house.

I figure everyone has the right ot their opinion and if they want to paint a certain picture - that's okay. The more pictures painted the more likely some potential truth can be seen. I understand wanting facts - I would like the same thing but I have discovered that everytime I go back and listen to a presser I do learn a fact or two. There are facts there to fuel some of the things being spoken of here.

[sunflowers]

Kind of humorous aside: in the trunk of my car (not a BMW, btw) some liquid laundry detergent oozed out...oh... about 2 years ago. I didn't know it for a long time cause my trunk was packed with junk. Plus I have/had dried mulchy type clippings in there from some gardening stuff I purchased. Basically my trunk was kinda a pig sty (not even kinda...it was).

I just kind of chuckle now when I see that still sort-of gooey spot in the middle where the laundry detergent coagulated. It never dried completely. I did finally clean out my trunk and it's a LOT better than it was. A lot less grass/mulch stuff and all the junk is gone.

But...it's a good thing I have no desire to commit a crime and then transport anything via trunk to 'hide' it. Cause yeah, THAT wouldn't work.

And I had a bottle of milk (whole foods bottle of milk, thus, the bottle) break in my car and I took it to Bunky's Car Wash on the corner of Kildare & Cary Pkwy for detailing---without an appointment, & they spent a great deal of time getting every little area of the trunk.....

[SleuthyGal]

No one could convict based on what we know so far because we know very little at this point. We have lots of tips, inside info and rumors, but NOTHING from official sources...no COD, no autopsy results being reported other than 'homicide.'

So no...he could NOT be convicted by anyone based on having no real info. We have suspicions but it takes more than that to actually convict someone.

[jumpstreet]

For all we know he could already have been indicted, same with Jason Young. LE and the DA do not have to act immediately on a true bill indictment or an arrest warrant.

Is this usual, or would it surprise you if this were true? What circumstances might explain proceeding in this way? (ie, GJ returned an indictment last Monday, and LE is biding their time for days/weeks?... why/when is this done I wonder?)

[momto3kids]

I am not asking you to elaborate. I am asking if Brad went to LTF for an absolute fact and what do we know that is not rumor? Anybody?


Roy...you asked the question about BC going to LTF being a fact. I answered he did go to LTF per his affidavit, so that is a fact. That was your question.

[SleuthyGal]

And I had a bottle of milk (whole foods bottle of milk, thus, the bottle) break in my car and I took it to Bunky's Car Wash on the corner of Kildare & Cary Pkwy for detailing---without an appointment, & they spent a great deal of time getting every little area of the trunk.....

I need to get my car detailed, badly! And I had an appt with one mobile car detailer and then it rained and they never rescheduled with me. So I think I may go the Bunky's route! Maybe I'll see Brad one of you there! Wave hi, k? :waitasec:

[Roy23]

IIRC the shoes had the same sole, that's not similar, that's the same.
If Willoughby hasn't got his junk in one bag by now, he's probably not going to unless he gets a written confession from JY. Sometimes you have to know when to take your best shot.

Same with BC. I really hope he doesn't flounder again.


Unfortunately, hushpuppy made many shoes with that same sole. The experts used the word similar even though it is the same sole. They need a distinguishing mark on his exact shoes for a Defense attorney not to blow up the DA. I think they are hoping for something else to avoid double jeopardy.

[Roy23]

Roy...you asked the question about BC going to LTF being a fact. I answered he did go to LTF per his affidavit, so that is a fact. That was your question.

I know. So the card swiping is either inside info. or a theory of yours.

[SleuthyGal]

I know. So the card swiping is either inside info. or a theory of yours. M23K already said she has an inside contact/source for that info. I don't think it's 'just her theory.'

[Roy23]

No one could convict based on what we know so far because we know very little at this point. We have lots of tips, inside info and rumors, but NOTHING from official sources...no COD, no autopsy results being reported other than 'homicide.'

So no...he could NOT be convicted by anyone based on having no real info. We have suspicions but it takes more than that to actually convict someone.




I also nominate this for post of the day.

[momto3kids]

So in a nutshell, again no proof of LTF at all. This doesn't get it done for me although it may be 100% correct. I want to deal with proven facts. I will watch this from the sidelines until this all comes out. I am not used to one insider having more information than the bloodsucking media.

And who do you think the bloodsucking media wants information from?:whistle:
This is one time the media isn't 1 up on someone.

[SleuthyGal]

I also nominate this for post of the day.

Holy cow!

{ ready to quit job and become a full time writer }

{rethinking this...}

{crawling back to employer...}

[SleuthyGal]

you know...I think he commited this murder...I've thought that since the beginning.

HOWEVER, if I were on the jury (his or anyone else's) I would absolutely require the state (or county) to prove their case beyond a reasonable doubt EVEN IF IN MY HEART I THOUGHT HE WAS GUILTY.

Absolutely. They would HAVE to prove it.

That's the standard I'd expect if I were ever charged with a crime.

It would be hard to put my personal feelings aside but I know I could do it because it's just that important to uphold the laws.

{ waiting to be tar'd 'n feathered }

[Roy23]

I figure everyone has the right ot their opinion and if they want to paint a certain picture - that's okay. The more pictures painted the more likely some potential truth can be seen. I understand wanting facts - I would like the same thing but I have discovered that everytime I go back and listen to a presser I do learn a fact or two. There are facts there to fuel some of the things being spoken of here.


So now you are saying that the media is speculating and doesn't have true inside information. Go ahead and paint away, you answered my question. I really am not trying to be an xxxxxxxxx. I see many here arguing over speculation as if it were fact. Mom may know more than anyone besides LE, and I will apologize for not just believing when it all comes out. Logic plays a big thing there though and many are missing it. Like I said earlier, I really look forward to how they caught Brad to see the truth. Maybe the LTF card or maybe the 4:20 HT purchase had a part in it. We will see.

[momto3kids]

I couldn't sleep. I need another vacation. :-) One thing here you have wrong. You most certainly can get into LTF without your ID. As I stated on a previous post, you can give them your name and they will match the mug on their computer with yours and let you in. So it wouldn't matter if she left home without anything; she could still go to the gym.

Thanks...I understand you can't enter LTFwithout an ID being swiped, correct?

Do you know if they will give out information on a family member having checked in?

[EntreNous]

you know...I think he commited this murder...I've thought that since the beginning.

HOWEVER, if I were on the jury (his or anyone else's) I would absolutely require the state (or county) to prove their case beyond a reasonable doubt EVEN IF IN MY HEART I THOUGHT HE WAS GUILTY.

Absolutely. They would HAVE to prove it.

That's the standard I'd expect if I were ever charged with a crime.

It would be hard to put my personal feelings aside but I know I could do it because it's just that important to uphold the laws.

{ waiting to be tar'd 'n feathered }
I understand and applaud your standards.

[Roy23]

And who do you think the bloodsucking media wants information from?:whistle:
This is one time the media isn't 1 up on someone.

The media wants information from you. Is this starting to ring a bell for you folks?

[sunflowers]

I need to get my car detailed, badly! And I had an appt with one mobile car detailer and then it rained and they never rescheduled with me. So I think I may go the Bunky's route! Maybe I'll see Brad one of you there! Wave hi, k? :waitasec:

LOL. i'm there regularly....i'll keep those sunflowers with me & look for you!

[raisincharlie]

Is this usual, or would it surprise you if this were true? What circumstances might explain proceeding in this way? (ie, GJ returned an indictment last Monday, and LE is biding their time for days/weeks?... why/when is this done I wonder?)

I don't think iti s as unusual as you might think. FOR EXAMPLE ONLY:

There may be some key elements already established such as Brad's DNA profile matching a sample collected from Nancy - say from under her nails or that luminol used during the search warrant defined an area indicating a struggle and blood spatter that had been washed away but LE does not have all the ancilliary evidence completed such as hairs and fibers, computer forensics, forensic accounting, and all the other zillion data points. The DA is dealing with a foreign national - an arrest warrant in hand can be forwaded to Canadian customs to insure Brad is put on the watch list and denied entry to Canada.

The reason I see this as a potential scenario is because NC is not a recipricol discovery state. In NC when a suspect is arrested the DA must immediately begin transfering copies of all evidence they have to the defendents lawyer. Yet the defendents lawyer is not required to provide the DA with any discovery at all. The bottom line to this is the DA better have every question answered before he moves for execution of the arrest warrant. In this respect - the lack of recipricol discovery - both LE and the DA have their hands tied to a certain extent. This aspect of NC law heavily favors the defendent and in the ends makes both LE and the DA's job more difficult.

[jumpstreet]

Thanks...I understand you can't enter LTFwithout an ID being swiped, correct?

Do you know if they will give out information on a family member having checked in?

Again, I offered to try an experiment on this one this weekend, and report results. :)
But MOM, I'll take your word for it that when he was there, he wasn't looking for information on her, or her whereabouts, so what does it matter?

[SleuthyGal]

Well just because the media (and we) want info...and just because Mom has been privy to some inside info, doesn't make said info false. We'll just have to see how it all comes out in the wash.

{pun intended}

[raisincharlie]

So now you are saying that the media is speculating and doesn't have true inside information. Go ahead and paint away, you answered my question. I really am not trying to be an xxxxxxxxx. I see many here arguing over speculation as if it were fact. Mom may know more than anyone besides LE, and I will apologize for not just believing when it all comes out. Logic plays a big thing there though and many are missing it. Like I said earlier, I really look forward to how they caught Brad to see the truth. Maybe the LTF card or maybe the 4:20 HT purchase had a part in it. We will see.

No I think the media has way more information than we do, just not proven. How did we find out about the warrants issued after the house was searched ?

[momto3kids]

I know. So the card swiping is either inside info. or a theory of yours.

Roy....I feel I am being interrogated by you and have told all I can. You seem to try the question in every direction you can, but I will not bite.

I put out there what I know, and will protect who told me what I know. I refuse to lose a friendship, trust or have anyone lose their job over BC. He is NOT worth it IMO. I told you today I saw with my own eyes the bolt missing. I told you what he was wearing during the search. You still don't want to take it as a fact. If you think you are going to hear what BC was wearing on the 14th by the LE you will be waiting a long time. Did that jacket have a connection? Yes, but I guess you missed that point. Sorry

At this point I feel you should believe what you want to believe if it be facts or theory, and I will do the same.

[Roy23]

No I think the media has way more information than we do, just not proven. How did we find out about the warrants issued after the house was searched ?

I am talking more specific here RC. Read above==the media wants more information from Mom or her sources.

GAME SET MATCH.

[jumpstreet]

I don't think iti s as unusual as you might think. FOR EXAMPLE ONLY:

There may be some key elements already established such as Brad's DNA profile matching a sample collected from Nancy - say from under her nails or that luminol used during the search warrant defined an area indicating a struggle and blood spatter that had been washed away but LE does not have all the ancilliary evidence completed such as hairs and fibers, computer forensics, forensic accounting, and all the other zillion data points. The DA is dealing with a foreign national - an arrest warrant in hand can be forwaded to Canadian customs to insure Brad is put on the watch list and denied entry to Canada.

The reason I see this as a potential scenario is because NC is not a recipricol discovery state. In NC when a suspect is arrested the DA must immediately begin transfering copies of all evidence they have to the defendents lawyer. Yet the defendents lawyer is not required to provide the DA with any discovery at all. The bottom line to this is the DA better have every question answered before he moves for execution of the arrest warrant. In this respect - the lack of recipricol discovery - both LE and the DA have their hands tied to a certain extent. This aspect of NC law heavily favors the defendent and in the ends makes both LE and the DA's job more difficult.

Makes sense - thanks RC. In other words, this sequence could occur when there's enough current information to indict, but in the DA/LE's opinion, there's more they'd like to do prior to trial (to ensure the desired verdict). Is that it?

How about the notion that the DA could have already presented to GJ, but GJ returned "no indictment yet". That one is also possible I assume (in either NC case or MY case). I assume that's not public record (cases presented to GJ, but denied).

All this was just in response to the earlier comments (by various) implying the Wake DA may be the hold-up here. My point was basically that for all we know an indictment has been requested. Your response furthers that to say for all we know an indictment has been requested and granted (in either case the ball wouldn't in the DA's court anyway).

Regardless, I'll stucj by my thought (only gut feel), that if when the forensics are returned there's no arrest, then there's been no indictment, and it's going to be a long wait. [ and it wouldn't surprise me if those forensics aren't back sometime this week or next ]

[sunflowers]

And who do you think the bloodsucking media wants information from?:whistle:
This is one time the media isn't 1 up on someone.

the media may know more, also, and have been asked not to talk.

but, so many of us live & breathe & walk & shop exercise in the same areas, places, & greenways, and we are friends/colleagues/neighbors with some of those close to nancy, people who know brad, people who knew nancy, the LE investigating nancy's murder, the man who found nancy, the dog with the man who found nancy, the pastors, the neighbors, the preschool people, the list goes on.... and, of course, we hear things because we're close to many of these folks & we've all been quite distraught, & we've talked & listened & cried together & heard things.....and carefully talk about it all so we can do whatever we can, on a small scale, to help justice be served for Nancy

[SleuthyGal]

I am talking more specific here RC. Read above==the media wants more information from Mom or her sources.

GAME SET MATCH.

the media ALWAYS wants info..more info = better. Insider info = great! Our great nation was built on insider info....okay not true, but remember Watergate and 'Deep Throat?' So of course in any crime, including the Cooper murder, they are interested in ANY inside info from anyone. It's a competitive business. Sources and contacts are their lifeblood.

[momto3kids]

Again, I offered to try an experiment on this one this weekend, and report results. :)
But MOM, I'll take your word for it that when he was there, he wasn't looking for information on her, or her whereabouts, so what does it matter?

JS...I say try any experiment you can. I have a feeling with what has happened recentlythey have clamped down, but I don't know. It would be interesting to see what they will or won't do for you.

Are you going to ask information about our wife or see if they will swipe her card?
The only thing is he didn't go for info, but an alibi. This is the difference.

[raisincharlie]

I am talking more specific here RC. Read above==the media wants more information from Mom or her sources.

GAME SET MATCH.

IF mom heard this stuff - that pesky press has heard it as well. That just can't say anything without proof. They've heard it - listen to the questions the media asks in the pressers and it is obvious they have heard it.

[sunflowers]

I don't think iti s as unusual as you might think. FOR EXAMPLE ONLY:

There may be some key elements already established such as Brad's DNA profile matching a sample collected from Nancy - say from under her nails or that luminol used during the search warrant defined an area indicating a struggle and blood spatter that had been washed away but LE does not have all the ancilliary evidence completed such as hairs and fibers, computer forensics, forensic accounting, and all the other zillion data points. The DA is dealing with a foreign national - an arrest warrant in hand can be forwaded to Canadian customs to insure Brad is put on the watch list and denied entry to Canada.

The reason I see this as a potential scenario is because NC is not a recipricol discovery state. In NC when a suspect is arrested the DA must immediately begin transfering copies of all evidence they have to the defendents lawyer. Yet the defendents lawyer is not required to provide the DA with any discovery at all. The bottom line to this is the DA better have every question answered before he moves for execution of the arrest warrant. In this respect - the lack of recipricol discovery - both LE and the DA have their hands tied to a certain extent. This aspect of NC law heavily favors the defendent and in the ends makes both LE and the DA's job more difficult.

this is exactly the issue in NC w why the DA moves so carefully & is absolutely certain before arresting. Until a person is arrested, the DA doesn't provide any evidence to the defense. Once there's an arrest, everything the DA has is now available to the defense. but, the reverse isn't true. it's a very significant issue w why JY has not been arrested & why there'll be careful w BC

[momto3kids]

I need to get my car detailed, badly! And I had an appt with one mobile car detailer and then it rained and they never rescheduled with me. So I think I may go the Bunky's route! Maybe I'll see Brad one of you there! Wave hi, k? :waitasec:


Corner of Six Forks and Old Wake Forest....this is where we go.

[Roy23]

Roy....I feel I am being interrogated by you and have told all I can. You seem to try the question in every direction you can, but I will not bite.

I put out there what I know, and will protect who told me what I know. I refuse to lose a friendship, trust or have anyone lose their job over BC. He is NOT worth it IMO. I told you today I saw with my own eyes the bolt missing. I told you what he was wearing during the search. You still don't want to take it as a fact. If you think you are going to hear what BC was wearing on the 14th by the LE you will be waiting a long time. Did that jacket have a connection? Yes, but I guess you missed that point. Sorry

At this point I feel you should believe what you want to believe if it be facts or theory, and I will do the same.


The inside information that I question is the 4:20 purchase at HT and the LTF card swiping. And now that the media wants information from you or your sources. The missing bolt and clothes he wore do not interest me. I understood that you were inferring that BC wore the same jacket and was caught on camera at HT at 4:20. I can't take it as fact ---I am sorry. And you have been driving around and BC was next to you looking at you funny. I am worried that your information might be misleading this forum.

I am a nice person believe it or not. I am an accountant and like to deal with facts although this forum is for opinions and speculation. You have information that you say can get many people in trouble but you post about here anyway but only in riddles. I swear that I will come here and apologize to you if you are proven right but now I am not buying it anymore after the last media comment.

[SleuthyGal]

Corner of Six Forks and Old Wake Forest....this is where we go.

Thanks Mom!

[sunflowers]

IF mom heard this stuff - that pesky press has heard it as well. That just can't say anything without proof. They've heard it - listen to the questions the media asks in the pressers and it is obvious they have heard it.

media is aware of all of this.....no proof or facts either, but Cary simulates how a small town acts (even though we're now up to 130,000, i think). the media in Cary know. they are good friends or related to some of the LE, & some of the HT or LTF or Lochmere or Cisco people, etc

[raisincharlie]

this is exactly the issue in NC w why the DA moves so carefully & is absolutely certain before arresting. Until a person is arrested, the DA doesn't provide any evidence to the defense. Once there's an arrest, everything the DA has is now available to the defense. but, the reverse isn't true. it's a very significant issue w why JY has not been arrested & why there'll be careful w BC

There are some pretty old cases in the Wake county area - some at two years old, some even older. Its not bcause LE hasn't worked their tales off. Read the book Deadly Dose - it will give you a very good idea of what has gone on there. It is unacceptable.

[Roy23]

media is aware of all of this.....no proof or facts either, but Cary simulates how a small town acts (even though we're now up to 130,000, i think). the media in Cary know. they are good friends or related to some of the LE, & some of the HT or LTF or Lochmere or Cisco people, etc

The media would love to take a good conspiricy theory if they could get someone to comment on it. Let's not pretend Cary is old school Mayberry.

[jumpstreet]

JS...I say try any experiment you can. I have a feeling with what has happened recentlythey have clamped down, but I don't know. It would be interesting to see what they will or won't do for you.

Are you going to ask information about our wife or see if they will swipe her card?
The only thing is he didn't go for info, but an alibi. This is the difference.

I can try whatever would be of value. Earlier, there was a premise (I think from FlowerChild), that LTF wouldn't provide information related to whether a spouse was in the club, or had been to the club. My thought was I would go and "test that theory", by inquiring with them whether my spouse was inside, or had been inside today. If they gladly answer my question, then it's inconsistent with FC's theory. If they politely decline, then it may or may not support FC's theory as to what went down when BC went there.

With that said, your later post (based on your source) indicated that this wasn't the dialog that BC had at the front-counter anyway. [ So seems like I'd be wasting my time trying to gather evidence for FC's theory, if we already know (or take it) to be false ]

As for trying to "test" your theory (ie, doing exactly what BC was doing on that morning to get my spouse's card swiped). I guess I'd need more information to precisely test it exactly. [ not asking you to provide more info ]

I will say this, if it were me, and I WANTED to get my spouse's card swiped... under normal circumstances, I bet I could do it with ease: (Yes, ease) I hand the receptionist the card (never hand them mine), and they swipe it. They never actually look at the photo on there, in fact, the newer membership cards (issued earlier this summer) don't have photos anyway.

If I'm BC, and I want to have NC's card swiped... just walk to the counter, and hand them that card. [ Sure if the photo comes up on their screen, and it's the wife, they may tell him "looks like your wifes card", but at that point, he can just say "oh, sorry, I must have grabbed it by mistake", and then leave. Mission (get her card swiped) accomplished. If my goal is to get my spouse's card swiped, the last thing I would do is give them my card, and then later try to convince them to swipe my spouse's card. That would just be weird, look weird, be easily remembered (as odd) by the receptionist, and have little chance of success (not saying that's what he did, since I don't know).

Will be happy to run this experiment (get front-desk person to swipe spouses card) if that's of value. [ But again, I predict it will be trivial (unless of course someone on this board rats me out prior. :) )]

[SleuthyGal]

Someone needs to go knock on BC's door and ask him about this LTF thing and ask him to tell us exactly what he said. People are losing sleep over this! I nominate M23K!

[mahmoo]

I nominate M23K!

Nooooooooooooooo :eek:

She's already makin me nervous as it is.

[momto3kids]

The inside information that I question is the 4:20 purchase at HT and the LTF card swiping. And now that the media wants information from you or your sources. The missing bolt and clothes he wore do not interest me. I understood that you were inferring that BC wore the same jacket and was caught on camera at HT at 4:20. I can't take it as fact ---I am sorry. And you have been driving around and BC was next to you looking at you funny. I am worried that your information might be misleading this forum.

I am a nice person believe it or not. I am an accountant and like to deal with facts although this forum is for opinions and speculation. You have information that you say can get many people in trouble but you post about here anyway but only in riddles. I swear that I will come here and apologize to you if you are proven right but now I am not buying it anymore after the last media comment.

I would remind you the media did NOT know anything about HT and any trip being made....I'd say that is 1 up on them.

I have not been driving around looking for BC....I have to stop at a red light right behind his house to get where I am going just about daily. For your information his home backs up to a major cut thru.

I happen to have a good friend that lives a few homes away from BC and has for years.

BC was not next to me...he passed me 2 times. Please reread what I DID say. Also if you recall I was doing some driving times with intention of posting it if BC took another route to HT. That alternate route was NOT discussed so I suggested it.

You're right, this is not the place for someone who only wants facts.

[momto3kids]

Someone needs to go knock on BC's door and ask him about this LTF thing and ask him to tell us exactly what he said. People are losing sleep over this! I nominate M23K!

You know SG...I would :other_beatingA_Dead with the mood I am in right now.

This would drive someone to drink.:beersign: And the problem is I hate beer.

[mahmoo]

You know SG...I would :other_beatingA_Dead with the mood I am in right now.

This would drive someone to drink.:beersign: And the problem is I hate beer.

Can ya do wine mom??

Also....there are martinis but they're kinda strong http://i36.tinypic.com/2aad0tl.jpg

[momto3kids]

Nooooooooooooooo :eek:

She's already makin me nervous as it is.



:floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

I'm fine..I have the air running and ceiling fan going full speed...

[momto3kids]

Can ya do wine mom??

Also....there are martinis but they're kinda strong http://i36.tinypic.com/2aad0tl.jpg

LOL...I'll have a double!

[mahmoo]

K........I'm gonna give ya 3 drinks.http://i36.tinypic.com/2aad0tl.jpghttp://i36.tinypic.com/2aad0tl.jpghttp://i36.tinypic.com/2aad0tl.jpg

[EntreNous]

LOL...I'll have a double!

I'll take an apple martini. They're deelish!

[momto3kids]

Nooooooooooooooo :eek:

She's already makin me nervous as it is.

I found out how to put the pics on here like your doing. I actually found one of the shoe line up they are going to do in court with BC

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v51/LuvClaysVoice2003/verndu.jpg

[mahmoo]

Wish I wasn't so far away mom.....I'd go sleuthing with ya :Banane48: at least you'd have a bodyguard :woohoo:

[mahmoo]

I found out how to put the pics on here like your doing. I actually found one of the shoe line up they are going to do in court with BC

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v51/LuvClaysVoice2003/verndu.jpg (http://%5BIMG%5Dhttp://img.photobucket.com/albums/v51/LuvClaysVoice2003/verndu.jpg%5B/IMG%5D)

OMG.....don't keep us in suspense girl.

[mahmoo]

dang....I can't get it to open.

[EntreNous]

dang....I can't get it to open.

Me neither.

And I'd totally go sleuthing with you guys!!! OOOH, the three of us could be Charlie's Angels. :floorlaugh:

[momto3kids]

dang....I can't get it to open.

I just came back and you say you can't get it to open? It is all the shoes in the post...Are you needing it bigger?...LOL

I couldn't find one with someone having their shoes on backwards like BC might have done.

[momto3kids]

Me neither.

And I'd totally go sleuthing with you guys!!! OOOH, the three of us could be Charlie's Angels. :floorlaugh:


Now I can always find something to get into! Come on over, we are going to have an outside den and build a fire pit hopefully this fall...we can sit around the fire and sleuth....
Right now I am stocking up on rice..

[Anderson]

LOL...I'll have a double!

Mom, I really appreciate all your contributions!! I wish I could buy you one.

[momto3kids]

Mom, I really appreciate all your contributions!! I wish I could buy you one.

That is really sweet. You know some days are tougher than others and this one proved to be.

Anyone coming here for facts needs to go the LE for that, or wait until the case is heard in court IMO

[Anderson]

That is really sweet. You know some days are tougher than others and this one proved to be.

Anyone coming here for facts needs to go the LE for that, or wait until the case is heard in court IMO

I believe that you are presenting as much information as you can. As RC mentioned, this information is most likely already known to investigators. Thanks for filling us in. I hope that there is an arrest very soon and then we will all learn more.

[EntreNous]

That is really sweet. You know some days are tougher than others and this one proved to be.

Anyone coming here for facts needs to go the LE for that, or wait until the case is heard in court IMO

We absolutely appreciate everything you've done MT3K to help us all understand elements of this case. The most important thing is for you and your loved ones to stay safe and we understand that in order for that to happen that you absolutely cannot reveal your sources or otherwise jeopardize yourself.
:blowkiss:

[Anderson]

I was driving back home from my (non-swanky) gym tonight and thinking about when a spouse is murdered and it's NOT the intimate partner. You know the remaining spouse is often seen in/around the community, on TV, in articles, talking about the dead spouse, looking for the perp, keeping the publicity up...it's often a way to cope as well as I'm sure coming from a place of grief and anger. Families do this who have a loved one that is murdered too.

Now let's look at Brad. Assume for a moment he's innocent. Wife is murdered. Mother of his kids dead. And...no reaction other than a look of annoyance at the press conf. Doesn't attend any memorial, none of Nancy's friends are consoling him. Nancy's parents think he did it, he's lost custody of the kids temporarily...

and...

he's just kind of doing a virtual shrug.

This 'devastated' man who now has allll the time in the world to help seek the killer of his wife is just hanging out. Now I know people grieve in different ways; of course they do.

But this guy? Does nothing. He or someone in his home removes the white bow honoring Nancy, from the front of his house. He could have made a sign, "Justice for Nancy." He could have done lots of little/quiet things. But what does he do?

Nothing.

This 'innocent' guy, whose wife (who he claims to love) was murdered...the mother of his 2 little girls...does

NOTHING.

And yes, that's absolutely his right.

But it doesn't look right.

I know. I guess he is living in the shadows.

[Anderson]

the media may know more, also, and have been asked not to talk.

but, so many of us live & breathe & walk & shop exercise in the same areas, places, & greenways, and we are friends/colleagues/neighbors with some of those close to nancy, people who know brad, people who knew nancy, the LE investigating nancy's murder, the man who found nancy, the dog with the man who found nancy, the pastors, the neighbors, the preschool people, the list goes on.... and, of course, we hear things because we're close to many of these folks & we've all been quite distraught, & we've talked & listened & cried together & heard things.....and carefully talk about it all so we can do whatever we can, on a small scale, to help justice be served for Nancy

I am glad to know that the community remains focused on justice for Nancy. The media may be limited as to what they can report in this case. However, I keep expecting the media to report on other aspects of the case (such as the websleuths site). Perhaps I am being naive, but isn't it possible that increased public pressure will help to move the investigation forward?

It is such an unusual story. I say this mainly because of the way that her husband, family and friends responded. And, I am a little afraid that the mainstream public (at least in other areas) will stop thinking about it. Her family and (perhaps her friends?) are not able to talk about it anymore. Wasn't that one of the conditions under which Nancy's parents were given temporary custody? I think the media has a certain responsibility to keep this case alive and in the public eye.

[Just the Fax]

I am glad to know that the community remains focused on justice for Nancy. The media may be limited as to what they can report in this case. However, I keep expecting the media to report on other aspects of the case (such as the websleuths site). Perhaps I am being naive, but isn't it possible that increased public pressure will help to move the investigation forward?

It is such an unusual story. I say this mainly because of the way that her husband, family and friends responded. And, I am a little afraid that the mainstream public (at least in other areas) will stop thinking about it. Her family and (perhaps her friends?) are not able to talk about it anymore. Wasn't that one of the conditions under which Nancy's parents were given temporary custody? I think the media has a certain rresponsibility to keep this case alive and in the public eye.

The DA in Wake County is not influenced by public pressure to make an arrest before he feels he has an airtight case.

Look at the Michelle Young murder that is nearly 2 years old without an arrest....yea, another wife killing where we know the husband is the likely perpetrator.

[jumpstreet]

The DA in Wake County is not influenced by public pressure to make an arrest before he feels he has an airtight case.

Look at the Michelle Young murder that is nearly 2 years old without an arrest....yea, another wife killing where we know the husband is the likely perpetrator.

Though in actuality, in the Young case (or Cooper case), we don't know for sure that the DA doesn't already feel there is an airtight case, and has presented same to GJ but an indictment was not returned (those pesky GJ folks)...[ Also, (as RC mentioned), in either or both cases, an indictment may have already actually been returned, but they are delaying the arrest to gather more evidence for the trial]

[sunflowers]

I am glad to know that the community remains focused on justice for Nancy. The media may be limited as to what they can report in this case. However, I keep expecting the media to report on other aspects of the case (such as the websleuths site). Perhaps I am being naive, but isn't it possible that increased public pressure will help to move the investigation forward?

It is such an unusual story. I say this mainly because of the way that her husband, family and friends responded. And, I am a little afraid that the mainstream public (at least in other areas) will stop thinking about it. Her family and (perhaps her friends?) are not able to talk about it anymore. Wasn't that one of the conditions under which Nancy's parents were given temporary custody? I think the media has a certain responsibility to keep this case alive and in the public eye.

Anderson, just to reassure you, this case is WAY in the public eye. People talk about it at most of the events that I'm at, & she is not in the least forgotten. For a few days, we were seething at John Edwards, but even in our furor about his behavior, we have kept Nancy front-and-center.

Nonetheless, though, public pressure isn't necessary in Cary to bring this case forward. As with Michelle Young, when these kinds of murders happen, LE makes a personal commitment to bring the killers to justice & their commitment isn't impacted by the public. If anything, too much info in the Media has the potential to damage their case because of how our legal system works in NC. So, the media are being careful, & LE are working around the clock on the various issues surrounding this case.

[jumpstreet]

I think the media has a certain responsibility to keep this case alive and in the public eye.

There's a number of upcoming milestones in this case that will keep it front-and-center in the media/public eye (in the Cary area, the Edmonton area, and probably others where there's general interest).

Specifically, the (potential) unsealing of the search-warrants 6 business days from now, then approximately 3 weeks after that the court (custody-related) hearing to determine if the husband should undergo a deep psychiatric probe conducted by 3rd party, and finally about 1 month after that the (potential) court hearing to determine permanent custody of the children.

So no worries about this one fading anytime soon... and of course all the above is just the known upcoming events. Other things can happen (e.g. arrest) in addition to bring it full center again.

[maconrich]

That is really sweet. You know some days are tougher than others and this one proved to be.

Anyone coming here for facts needs to go the LE for that, or wait until the case is heard in court IMO

I hope this day is a better one for you!! and, like others, I'm very grateful for all the information and thoughts you've shared with us. The facts will come out and I'm looking forward to being able to see the pieces you've given us fall into place. -- And, obviously, the highlight will be seeing the one who committed this horrendous crime brought to justice. He deserves no mercy!! :furious:


With the wreath, if/when one is put up somewhere do you think the local paper will notice and post a picture? I'd like to think so, but regardless it will be a reminder to everyone that Nancy has not been forgotten... All of you Cary ladies (and men) have helped keep her front and center, and that's how it should be :blowkiss:


Question for anyone: http://www.gratefulness.org has virtual candle lighting, and I know there's a group set up for a missing Georgia woman (that's how I learned of the site), but I don't have a clue how to set something like that up. Does anyone? And does it sound like a good idea or not? The link for the candles is http://www.gratefulness.org/candles/candles.cfm?l=eng and I see the link for Groups, but again I'm not sure how to do it or if it should even be done. So just a thought.


Mom, if he messed up that badly with the shoes, well I'm not even sure what to say. What he tried at LTF was stupid enough (I can see him trying to use hers (by accident) as someone stated and then leaving -- but Not using his and then trying to have hers scanned). Oh and there are a couple of his Ironman photos that let you see his tat; not clear enough to see what it is but you can see that he does have one (above ankle). I'd seen that before you posted and was wondering what it was of.

[sunflowers]

I hope this day is a better one for you!! and, like others, I'm very grateful for all the information and thoughts you've shared with us. The facts will come out and I'm looking forward to being able to see the pieces you've given us fall into place. -- And, obviously, the highlight will be seeing the one who committed this horrendous crime brought to justice. He deserves no mercy!! :furious:


With the wreath, if/when one is put up somewhere do you think the local paper will notice and post a picture? I'd like to think so, but regardless it will be a reminder to everyone that Nancy has not been forgotten... All of you Cary ladies (and men) have helped keep her front and center, and that's how it should be :blowkiss:


Question for anyone: http://www.gratefulness.org has virtual candle lighting, and I know there's a group set up for a missing Georgia woman (that's how I learned of the site), but I don't have a clue how to set something like that up. Does anyone? And does it sound like a good idea or not? The link for the candles is http://www.gratefulness.org/candles/candles.cfm?l=eng and I see the link for Groups, but again I'm not sure how to do it or if it should even be done. So just a thought.


Mom, if he messed up that badly with the shoes, well I'm not even sure what to say. What he tried at LTF was stupid enough (I can see him trying to use hers (by accident) as someone stated and then leaving -- but Not using his and then trying to have hers scanned). Oh and there are a couple of his Ironman photos that let you see his tat; not clear enough to see what it is but you can see that he does have one (above ankle). I'd seen that before you posted and was wondering what it was of.

i don't know how i missed it, but i've missed something with the shoes. could somebody let me know what the situation is with his shoes. THANKS!

[Star12]

[QUOTE=maconrich;2538092]
Question for anyone: http://www.gratefulness.org has virtual candle lighting, and I know there's a group set up for a missing Georgia woman (that's how I learned of the site), but I don't have a clue how to set something like that up. Does anyone? And does it sound like a good idea or not? The link for the candles is http://www.gratefulness.org/candles/candles.cfm?l=eng and I see the link for Groups, but again I'm not sure how to do it or if it should even be done. So just a thought.QUOTE]

There is a virtual candle site that has been set up by DD, and has a blog type message thingie with it. I can't remember the name of it or the url, though, but it is very nicely done.

[snowshuze]

Dear Brad:
One tiny little issue with swiping Nancys membership card at LTF....
In a THOROUGH murder investigation, detectives WILL follow through and actually interview the person on duty doing the actual swiping. :)


MOO, of course.

[Skittles]

There is a virtual candle site that has been set up by DD, and has a blog type message thingie with it. I can't remember the name of it or the url, though, but it is very nicely done.

It is here

http://www.imorial.com/NancyCooper/

[fran]

That is really sweet. You know some days are tougher than others and this one proved to be.

Anyone coming here for facts needs to go the LE for that, or wait until the case is heard in court IMO

momto3kids

FWIW, I've known from your first post you were the 'real deal' and not one to post falsities. IF you say something, I personally take it for 'fact.' Eventhough I may not know your source, you know it. That's good enough for me.

I've followed several of these cases. There's often times insiders and even loyalists to the NOT-suspects. You eventually gain the insight to recognize which is which. At times, even going along with NOT-suspects supporters, you can gain valuable perception into the facts, both known and unknown to the general public at large.

As an aside, I spent the better part of a Saturday afternoon following a particular 'poster' on another crime forum. I just KNEW that person was somehow connected to the NOT-suspect and I wanted to see what they had to say. By NOT saying a word, I realized there was an extremely important aspect to the case that we, I, had no idea HOW important a piece of information and answered many questions. LOL, trying to convince Websleuthers was quite difficult and actually took me at least two weeks. We STILL didn't realize the significance of the find until the actual trial. LOL, did I feel vindicated! ;) Of course by then, everyone had probably forgotten I'd brought it up and no one believed me, at first. (that poster later joined websleuths and, LOL, actually gave insight into what the 'defense' spin was going to be at trial, it was spot on too!)

Although we've all seen just how inaccurate an MSM article CAN be, some still do NOT want to believe another's word, unless they can provide a 'link.' They may be new to this, following a case closely on the internet and haven't been able to gauge the honesty of anonymous posters on a crime forum. Just put that aside, and agree to disagree.

I believe the information you gave about HT was basically confirmed by the requests by Brad's lawyer of information from HT. I further believe additonal information you've revealed will be confirmed once the sw's are unsealed. Until such time as the MSM catch on, those of us who want to take your info for what it is, will,......others who want to see it in print in MSM can take it and put it away until.............

It's all part of a big puzzle, one piece at a time. Truth and justice for the victim, Nancy Cooper.


You're awesome momto3kids!

{hugs} and :blowkiss:

fran

[Star12]

It is here

http://www.imorial.com/NancyCooper/

Thank you, Skittles!

[Star12]

Fran,
Thanks for saying that so well.

[maconrich]

i don't know how i missed it, but i've missed something with the shoes. could somebody let me know what the situation is with his shoes. THANKS!

Mom's post is just up the page - post 227

Star and Skittles --Thank You for link to the site set up for Nancy!! Very nicely done and love the memories her friends share :cry:

[Topsail Girl]

i don't know how i missed it, but i've missed something with the shoes. could somebody let me know what the situation is with his shoes. THANKS!


Me too sunflowers. I try to read everyday to keep caught upeven if I can't post. I totlly missed the shoe deal too. Good morning everyone. Thanks skittle for the link to the memorial page.

[Topsail Girl]

Thanks maconrich. I thought mom had revealed some new info about how Nancy's shoes were put on her feet or something like that.

[maconrich]

Yikes! I'm not really sure if Mom was being 100% serious with the shoe comment :waitasec:- I guess she's going to have to let us know now though LOL! (Again top of this page)