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View Full Version : Skyla Whitaker, 11, & Taylor Placker 13 - Found Murdered - #19



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christine2448
09-19-2008, 10:45 AM
Continue here please.

k4kathy
09-19-2008, 11:28 AM
Yellowdog,
You make a very good point about the purse.

EnvoyDriver61
09-19-2008, 03:17 PM
I know kids will be kids and kids are different across the USA; however, from all reports about Taylor and Skyla, they were the cream of the crop. Good students, sweet, nice, etc. I just don't see them doing or carrying drugs or drug money.

No, they probably weren't as innocent or sheltered as perhaps I would like to believe, but given their descriptions, I've always thought it a stretch to suggest they were somehow involved with drugs or drug money of any sort.

YellowDog
09-19-2008, 03:18 PM
Another thing that bothers me is:

How do we know when the girls left the house? If the Plackers weren't at home, who's to say they hadn't been gone for quite awhile. Their stomachs didn't have food in them.
I also wonder if they could have quietly sneaked out the night before and gotten into some mischief. Early reports said Taylor slept in a sleeping bag in front of the TV. Or I've even thought of the possibility that something could have happened within the house and they were running away when they were killed. This case is so weird.

Claycat
09-19-2008, 03:54 PM
All of the cases are weird lately, YellowDog!

I think it was Skyla that would sleep in front of the TV in a sleeping bag. Her Dad talked about looking over to see her there, and she wasn't. I wouldn't be surprised if Taylor did it, as well!

Hi, EnvoyDriver61!

Boots-OK
09-19-2008, 04:16 PM
I know kids will be kids and kids are different across the USA; however, from all reports about Taylor and Skyla, they were the cream of the crop. Good students, sweet, nice, etc. I just don't see them doing or carrying drugs or drug money.

No, they probably weren't as innocent or sheltered as perhaps I would like to believe, but given their descriptions, I've always thought it a stretch to suggest they were somehow involved with drugs or drug money of any sort.
Hi, Envoy - I agree with your observations completely.

k4kathy
09-19-2008, 05:10 PM
Another thing that bothers me is:

How do we know when the girls left the house? If the Plackers weren't at home, who's to say they hadn't been gone for quite awhile. Their stomachs didn't have food in them.
I also wonder if they could have quietly sneaked out the night before and gotten into some mischief. Early reports said Taylor slept in a sleeping bag in front of the TV. Or I've even thought of the possibility that something could have happened within the house and they were running away when they were killed. This case is so weird.I was wondering the same thing.It's possible that the girls had been gone longer,even if one of them called to check in w/ a family member,they could have called from anywhere.It is odd that there was no food contents in their stomachs,nothing at all.No urine in their bladders either.They either voided after the attack or had little to drink.I was wondering if any tire tread casts were taken from the driveway at the house.It's possible the killer/killers were at the house first.
Has anybody else thought that who ever murdered these girls, could be someone who has done alot of deer hunting?Deer hunters tend to go for lung/heart shots,to get a lethal shot at their target.Sometimes,if the deer doesn't die right away,and hunter will use a handgun to shoot the deer in the head.The killer could have used their experience from hunting.MOO.

oceanblueeyes
09-19-2008, 05:53 PM
Another thing that bothers me is:

How do we know when the girls left the house? If the Plackers weren't at home, who's to say they hadn't been gone for quite awhile. Their stomachs didn't have food in them.
I also wonder if they could have quietly sneaked out the night before and gotten into some mischief. Early reports said Taylor slept in a sleeping bag in front of the TV. Or I've even thought of the possibility that something could have happened within the house and they were running away when they were killed. This case is so weird.

Well Rose said she talked with Skyla at 4:30 and they were at Taylor's home. So it had to be after then and when Rose tried to call again 5:08 there was no answer and she called PP and he tried to call Taylor around 5:10. And the witnesses said they heard the gun shots around 5:15. So even if they left shortly after talking with Rose that would give them around 45 minutes on the road. Since there was no answer by 5:08...... I think they were dead by then.

The guy on YouTube said it would take 15 minutes to walk to the bridge and then 15 minutes back. He also says they did not stay at the bridge long but I don't find that unusual. If that was their target when they got there they could have just swung around and started back.

I don't think they were delivering anything. The bag was still on Taylor's shoulder and I think it was nothing but girly stuff in there. If the guys grabbed the purse to get the contents then the purse would have been beside their bodies not still on Taylor's shoulder imo.

imoo

oceanblueeyes
09-19-2008, 06:04 PM
Another thing that bothers me is:

How do we know when the girls left the house? If the Plackers weren't at home, who's to say they hadn't been gone for quite awhile. Their stomachs didn't have food in them.
I also wonder if they could have quietly sneaked out the night before and gotten into some mischief. Early reports said Taylor slept in a sleeping bag in front of the TV. Or I've even thought of the possibility that something could have happened within the house and they were running away when they were killed. This case is so weird.

I think it is very normal for kids to get sleeping bags out and put them in the living room to watch tv or whatever. I don't see anything odd about that at all and it was Skyla who did that so her father said.

A lot of kids especially girls will not eat right. I guess they think they will gain weight.

I think all was normal and a typical Sunday until they ventured out on that dirt road for a walk on a Sunday afternoon. I don't think they had a clue this was going to happen or that they would meet the killers on that road they had walked down before.

This case still smells of young killers maybe with the leader being a little older than them. They are impulsive, reckless and lethal.

imoo

Morag
09-19-2008, 06:04 PM
Here's something that I keep remembering- Taylor's little dog was found at the bridge the next day. I can't believe that that tiny little thing ran/walked/toddled all the way back to the bridge instead of heading for the driveway a short distance ahead. That dog was put or left at the bridge by someone. (IMO). I can just imagine some smart aleck youth taking the dog from Taylor and laughing when she protested. I believe that this is a major clue as to the nature of the crime.

Mysterylover
09-19-2008, 06:10 PM
Another thing that bothers me is:

How do we know when the girls left the house?
If the Plackers weren't at home, who's to say they hadn't been gone for quite awhile.
Their stomachs didn't have food in them.

I also wonder if they could have quietly sneaked out the night before and gotten into some mischief.
Early reports said Taylor slept in a sleeping bag in front of the TV.

Or I've even thought of the possibility that something could have happened within the house and they were running away when they were killed.
This case is so weird......

Yellow Dog, All very good questions that need answers...

I have never understood why on a sunday the girls had not eaten in 12 hours.....it's very unusual in my family to not have breakfast and lunch on Sunday.

I have also thought T. sleeping in a sleeping-bag seems suspicious, as if a way to protect herself. Now and then seems o.k... BUT all the time, seems strange to me!.....Had some other person moved into her bedroom?.

No one has said WHO was at the P. house that Sunday.

Something could have happened and the girls was waiting for Rose, possibly because someone very negative was at the P. house.

Could the killer been at the P. house that day looking for someone or something ???

Another possibility is, someone at the P. house got into a bad argument/fight/maybe drugs involved/,
with a male, and that person, upon leaving the P. house mad, shot the girls to get back at the person they were arguing with.

I question WHY P.P. lied about getting the cell phone from Taylor's pocket and making the 911 call, the reason behind this should be looked at more closely.
Maybe he was 'covering' for checking T.'s Purse for 'something' ....jmo

Mysterylover
09-19-2008, 06:33 PM
Here's something that I keep remembering- Taylor's little dog was found at the bridge the next day.
I can't believe that that tiny little thing ran/walked/toddled all the way back to the bridge instead of heading for the driveway a short distance ahead.

That dog was put or left at the bridge by someone. (IMO).
I can just imagine some smart aleck youth taking the dog from Taylor and laughing when she protested.
I believe that this is a major clue as to the nature of the crime....

Morag, I agree...
Why would the little dog run 1/2 to 3/4 mile toward the bridge and stay there all night, when it could have ran home and hid on the porch or in T.'s playhouse, or got with the other dogs at the house and slept with them????
It doesn't make sense, dogs are smarter than that and they are 'pack' animals.

I agree with your point, the little dog could have been somewhere else and dropped off at the bridge later that night or early morning...or escaped and got to the bridge on it's way home..

tapu
09-19-2008, 06:43 PM
~snip~

This case still smells of young killers maybe with the leader being a little older than them. They are impulsive, reckless and lethal.

imoo


How about a Charles Starkweather, Caril Ann Fugate?

CMorrison64
09-19-2008, 10:26 PM
Every day I say a prayer for these girls ... I'd give anything for closure.

KeyboardPlayer
09-19-2008, 10:30 PM
Every day I say a prayer for these girls ... I'd give anything for closure.
You and me both, CM...

Ruflossn
09-19-2008, 11:14 PM
Yellow Dog, All very good questions that need answers...

I have never understood why on a sunday the girls had not eaten in 12 hours.....it's very unusual in my family to not have breakfast and lunch on Sunday.

I have also thought T. sleeping in a sleeping-bag seems suspicious, as if a way to protect herself. Now and then seems o.k... BUT all the time, seems strange to me!.....Had some other person moved into her bedroom?.

No one has said WHO was at the P. house that Sunday.

Something could have happened and the girls was waiting for Rose, possibly because someone very negative was at the P. house.

Could the killer been at the P. house that day looking for someone or something ???

Another possibility is, someone at the P. house got into a bad argument/fight/maybe drugs involved/,
with a male, and that person, upon leaving the P. house mad, shot the girls to get back at the person they were arguing with.

I question WHY P.P. lied about getting the cell phone from Taylor's pocket and making the 911 call, the reason behind this should be looked at more closely.
Maybe he was 'covering' for checking T.'s Purse for 'something' ....jmo

Hi,
I was unaware that PP had lied about calling 911. I know that his wife called, but, I also understood that there had been more than one 911 call. The call that LE released was the female. Do we know for certain who Vicki Placker was yelling at on the 911 call?

frogjustfrog
09-20-2008, 01:36 AM
does anyone know if the show, "The Bachelor" or something like that, was on tv that day? I really would like to know this, and if so, what time did it go off? I heard that someone else heard the shots, but this was not reported. That they heard they at 5:30 or very near to that after the show went off. It could be a rumor, but I heard that and they were very adament about it.

frogjustfrog
09-20-2008, 01:56 AM
I know kids will be kids and kids are different across the USA; however, from all reports about Taylor and Skyla, they were the cream of the crop. Good students, sweet, nice, etc. I just don't see them doing or carrying drugs or drug money.

No, they probably weren't as innocent or sheltered as perhaps I would like to believe, but given their descriptions, I've always thought it a stretch to suggest they were somehow involved with drugs or drug money of any sort.

I would not think the girls would KNOWINGLY take drugs or drug money to someone at the bridge... and its just a scenerio.... but they may have trusted an extended family member who COULD HAVE been there, and took something to someone at the bridge at 5:00, is all I am saying. I would hope no one would think I would believe the girls would KNOWINGLY do something like this! sigh

Mysterylover
09-20-2008, 05:05 AM
does anyone know if the show, "The Bachelor" or something like that, was on tv that day?

I really would like to know this, and if so, what time did it go off?

I heard that someone else heard the shots, but this was NOT reported.

That they heard them at 5:30 or very near to that after the show went off. It could be a rumor, but I heard that and they were very adament about it.......

Frog...Glad you mentioned this, it could be important to the 'time' line on these murders.

I tried to google the Bachelor tv shows and 65 different names came up.......What TV station was it on?

If we knew the exact name of The Bachelor show someone could possibly find when it was on TV the Sunday of June 8th.

Does the library have past TV guides?

IF these people heard the shots, the time they heard them, would be extremely important to compare with what others reported.....

Who knows, it could help solve this case...the murder 'time' being the key!

Claycat
09-20-2008, 08:54 AM
Hi,
I was unaware that PP had lied about calling 911. I know that his wife called, but, I also understood that there had been more than one 911 call. The call that LE released was the female. Do we know for certain who Vicki Placker was yelling at on the 911 call?

I think it was LE that made us think PP called 911. I believe he actually called Vicki on one of the girls' cell phone.

I believe Vicki was on her way to the scene when she called 911. The girl in the background told her, "He says they're dead."

Ruflossn
09-20-2008, 09:24 AM
Frog~
I believe that the show was on that evening. However, it was on a satellite station, not a mainstream station. It may be hard to research. The name of the show is simply titled, "The Bachelor".

Flossie

oceanblueeyes
09-20-2008, 10:27 AM
I think it was LE that made us think PP called 911. I believe he actually called Vicki on one of the girls' cell phone.

I believe Vicki was on her way to the scene when she called 911. The girl in the background told her, "He says they're dead."

I think you are right. I think Vicki was on the phone when she was leaving their home going down the road toward the girls. She can be heard saying to someone "Run!" iirc.

imoo

oceanblueeyes
09-20-2008, 10:30 AM
How about a Charles Starkweather, Caril Ann Fugate?

Wow, tapu, the thought of that just chills my bones.

But yes, one older and one very willing participant.

imoo

GetSmart
09-20-2008, 10:41 AM
Here's something that I keep remembering- Taylor's little dog was found at the bridge the next day. I can't believe that that tiny little thing ran/walked/toddled all the way back to the bridge instead of heading for the driveway a short distance ahead. That dog was put or left at the bridge by someone. (IMO). I can just imagine some smart aleck youth taking the dog from Taylor and laughing when she protested. I believe that this is a major clue as to the nature of the crime.

I can see this happening..... I also really think that she put her little doggie & girlie things in her purse.

If the girls are anything like we were growing up they probably were up late.. talking,hoping, dreaming...that is what just breaks my heart & I am starting to cry typing this.. their little dreams & plans & I wanna do this or I would never do that...
anyway I am thinking they slept in till about noon.. but if taylor had animal chores like feeding a horse then I don't know. Do horses have to be fed in am or do you just put out the hay & sweet feed anytime & they munch?

I also remember someone saying that evacuation time after eating in relation to their ages & metabolism might explain empty stomach contents.

Great suggestion about tracks at Plackers but with all the confusion I highly doubt it.. I just don't think they were that precise. I still want to know about the report of a prowler being @ Plackers after the fact in the middle of the night.

YellowDog
09-20-2008, 01:02 PM
Well Rose said she talked with Skyla at 4:30 and they were at Taylor's home. So it had to be after then and when Rose tried to call again 5:08 there was no answer and she called PP and he tried to call Taylor around 5:10. And the witnesses said they heard the gun shots around 5:15. So even if they left shortly after talking with Rose that would give them around 45 minutes on the road. Since there was no answer by 5:08...... I think they were dead by then.

The guy on YouTube said it would take 15 minutes to walk to the bridge and then 15 minutes back. He also says they did not stay at the bridge long but I don't find that unusual. If that was their target when they got there they could have just swung around and started back.

I don't think they were delivering anything. The bag was still on Taylor's shoulder and I think it was nothing but girly stuff in there. If the guys grabbed the purse to get the contents then the purse would have been beside their bodies not still on Taylor's shoulder imo.

imoo

But couldn't they have just told Rose they were at Taylor's house, especially if they were up to something secretive?

YellowDog
09-20-2008, 01:11 PM
Yellow Dog, All very good questions that need answers...

I have never understood why on a sunday the girls had not eaten in 12 hours.....it's very unusual in my family to not have breakfast and lunch on Sunday.

I have also thought T. sleeping in a sleeping-bag seems suspicious, as if a way to protect herself. Now and then seems o.k... BUT all the time, seems strange to me!.....Had some other person moved into her bedroom?.

No one has said WHO was at the P. house that Sunday.

Something could have happened and the girls was waiting for Rose, possibly because someone very negative was at the P. house.

Could the killer been at the P. house that day looking for someone or something ???

Another possibility is, someone at the P. house got into a bad argument/fight/maybe drugs involved/,
with a male, and that person, upon leaving the P. house mad, shot the girls to get back at the person they were arguing with.

I question WHY P.P. lied about getting the cell phone from Taylor's pocket and making the 911 call, the reason behind this should be looked at more closely.
Maybe he was 'covering' for checking T.'s Purse for 'something' ....jmo



Good ideas, Letsthink. I keep coming back to Uncle Joe who was so visible right after the murders. Was he trying to deflect attention from himself? Could he have known the girls were home alone and paid a visit, the girls got scared and ran off, he pursued them and............

Or could they have been paid to unknowingly serve as mules delivering drugs to someone?

Someone in that area knows more than they're telling and I suspect it's because they are involved in some way even if it's not the killing.

Lauren - CA
09-20-2008, 02:38 PM
But couldn't they have just told Rose they were at Taylor's house, especially if they were up to something secretive?

Yes YD they could have. Especially if Taylor's gp's were strict with her, she could have been testing them especially if they were not at home. How easy could that have been? The People magazine article indicates they were recently allowing her to "spread her wings".

Lauren - CA
09-20-2008, 02:40 PM
Good ideas, Letsthink. I keep coming back to Uncle Joe who was so visible right after the murders. Was he trying to deflect attention from himself? Could he have known the girls were home alone and paid a visit, the girls got scared and ran off, he pursued them and............

Or could they have been paid to unknowingly serve as mules delivering drugs to someone?

Someone in that area knows more than they're telling and I suspect it's because they are involved in some way even if it's not the killing.

The whole "Uncle Joe" thing has really bothered me from day one. Very good point about them wanting to leave the house especially if they felt uncomfortable around Uncle Joe. But why would he stay that long at the house if no one was home? Has it ever been proven that anyone else was in the house at the time of the murders?

I completely agree with your last statement. Someone does know something. Why else would they resort to play an excerpt from that 911 tape?

GetSmart
09-20-2008, 04:37 PM
This was in the Crimes thread on the front page.. maybe this kind of testing could help with case...
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=71328

technical aspects of new procedure:
http://pda.physorg.com/lofi-news-sweat-processed-bond_140762564.html (http://pda.physorg.com/lofi-news-sweat-processed-bond_140762564.html)
"New study will make criminals sweat
Dr John Bond, a researcher at the University of Leicester, has developed a method that enables scientists to 'visualise fingerprints' even after the print itself has been removed. He and colleagues conducted a study into the way fingerprints can corrode metal surfaces. The technique can enhance – after firing– a fingerprint that has been deposited on a small calibre metal cartridge case before it is fired." ... snip.... goes on to explain how salts excreted through fingertip pores are detected & an
"indirect link therefore between obesity and the chances of being caught of a crime. "Other research has drawn links between processed foods and obesity and we know that consumers of processed foods will leave better fingerprints," he said. " ... thus the title of the article.

more:
Fingerprint Breakthrough Hope In US Double Murder Probe
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/08/080827102738.htm (http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/08/080827102738.htm)

YellowDog
09-20-2008, 05:50 PM
does anyone know if the show, "The Bachelor" or something like that, was on tv that day? I really would like to know this, and if so, what time did it go off? I heard that someone else heard the shots, but this was not reported. That they heard they at 5:30 or very near to that after the show went off. It could be a rumor, but I heard that and they were very adament about it.

I believe "The Bachelor" didn't come on until 8:00 where I live.

frogjustfrog
09-20-2008, 06:30 PM
Every day I say a prayer for these girls ... I'd give anything for closure.

OT but wanted to mention pics to CM

I want to tell you, these pictures are absolutely gorgeous! can I save them?
I have never gotten into the Casey case. I am just too soft hearted. I wish I didnt hurt so easily, but I do. Well, about things like this, I do. This is why I have never sleuthed, and probably never will again. It just makes my heart break!

And every day, I too pray for them ALL!

oceanblueeyes
09-20-2008, 07:38 PM
But couldn't they have just told Rose they were at Taylor's house, especially if they were up to something secretive?

I really don't know, YD. I am just going by what Rose was supposed to have said. Maybe the Plackers have a land line and she called there? Maybe she could hear the tv playing in the background or something?

imoo

oceanblueeyes
09-20-2008, 07:46 PM
Good ideas, Letsthink. I keep coming back to Uncle Joe who was so visible right after the murders. Was he trying to deflect attention from himself? Could he have known the girls were home alone and paid a visit, the girls got scared and ran off, he pursued them and............

Or could they have been paid to unknowingly serve as mules delivering drugs to someone?

Someone in that area knows more than they're telling and I suspect it's because they are involved in some way even if it's not the killing.

But isn't he Vicki's own brother in law or brother? I would think he would be one of the first ones down there knowing it involved one of his nieces.

imoo

oceanblueeyes
09-20-2008, 07:49 PM
This was in the Crimes thread on the front page.. maybe this kind of testing could help with case...
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=71328

technical aspects of new procedure:
http://pda.physorg.com/lofi-news-sweat-processed-bond_140762564.html (http://pda.physorg.com/lofi-news-sweat-processed-bond_140762564.html)
"New study will make criminals sweat
Dr John Bond, a researcher at the University of Leicester, has developed a method that enables scientists to 'visualise fingerprints' even after the print itself has been removed. He and colleagues conducted a study into the way fingerprints can corrode metal surfaces. The technique can enhance – after firing– a fingerprint that has been deposited on a small calibre metal cartridge case before it is fired." ... snip.... goes on to explain how salts excreted through fingertip pores are detected & an
"indirect link therefore between obesity and the chances of being caught of a crime. "Other research has drawn links between processed foods and obesity and we know that consumers of processed foods will leave better fingerprints," he said. " ... thus the title of the article.

more:
Fingerprint Breakthrough Hope In US Double Murder Probe
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/08/080827102738.htm (http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/08/080827102738.htm)


I wonder if OSBI is familiar with this new test and the testing of touch DNA too?

Maybe you should forward it to them, GS. Sure wouldnt hurt.

Ann Fan
09-20-2008, 08:28 PM
The Bachelor comes on here (Tulsa area) about 8:00 p.m. on ABC. An old rerun may have been on a cable station at that time of day but I have never seen it. We have a tv guide type of thing that comes out in print for the week in every Sunday paper of the Tulsa World. I can't think of what it is called off hand but will know tomorrow when I get one. I would think they would have an archived listing - it wasn't that long ago. It shows cable stations also.

frogjustfrog
09-20-2008, 09:29 PM
I'm not positive that was the show she was talking about, but the person who told me said it was a show about a guy who picks a girl from a bunch of girls, and it's real popular. So I am assuming that it was The Bachelor. Anyway.... she said the friend watched the show, and then when it was over, went outside, and heard the gunshots. So it was very near to 5:30, give or take a few minutes depending on if any commercials came on after the show before 5:30. It could have been 5 minutes before or after, but she swears she heard them. I havent found out what she said they sounded like, but I will try to. so........... if this is correct, the girls were shot right at 5:30 give or take prob 5 min at the most....unless someone is fibbing, and I didnt take it that way.

black poodle
09-20-2008, 11:25 PM
Hey guys this is my first post in this forum, Do you all think the sketch of the POI is a real person that was actually seen there or someone that the "witnesses" made up to throw LE off

oceanblueeyes
09-21-2008, 12:04 AM
Hey guys this is my first post in this forum, Do you all think the sketch of the POI is a real person that was actually seen there or someone that the "witnesses" made up to throw LE off

Hi Black Poodle! Your nic reminds me of my precious little dog, Ruffles.

I do think he fits into the case somehow but I am not sure where.

The artist said he interviewed several witnesses that helped him with the composite sketch.

imo

ArizonaGiGi
09-21-2008, 03:29 AM
Oh My Gosh I love your avitar Black poodle.
I loooove poodles and had 3 of them until just recently.
Oh and Welcome to WS

frogjustfrog
09-21-2008, 04:48 AM
Hey guys this is my first post in this forum, Do you all think the sketch of the POI is a real person that was actually seen there or someone that the "witnesses" made up to throw LE off

I know for a fact he was actually seen... but may not look much like the sketch. Oh... and welcome to this forum. =)

cloudajo
09-21-2008, 08:15 AM
This was in the Crimes thread on the front page.. maybe this kind of testing could help with case...
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=71328

technical aspects of new procedure:
http://pda.physorg.com/lofi-news-sweat-processed-bond_140762564.html (http://pda.physorg.com/lofi-news-sweat-processed-bond_140762564.html)
"New study will make criminals sweat
Dr John Bond, a researcher at the University of Leicester, has developed a method that enables scientists to 'visualise fingerprints' even after the print itself has been removed. He and colleagues conducted a study into the way fingerprints can corrode metal surfaces. The technique can enhance – after firing– a fingerprint that has been deposited on a small calibre metal cartridge case before it is fired." ... snip.... goes on to explain how salts excreted through fingertip pores are detected & an
"indirect link therefore between obesity and the chances of being caught of a crime. "Other research has drawn links between processed foods and obesity and we know that consumers of processed foods will leave better fingerprints," he said. " ... thus the title of the article.

more:
Fingerprint Breakthrough Hope In US Double Murder Probe
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/08/080827102738.htm (http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/08/080827102738.htm)


GS, thanks for the info!

cloudajo
09-21-2008, 08:23 AM
I'm not positive that was the show she was talking about, but the person who told me said it was a show about a guy who picks a girl from a bunch of girls, and it's real popular. So I am assuming that it was The Bachelor. Anyway.... she said the friend watched the show, and then when it was over, went outside, and heard the gunshots. So it was very near to 5:30, give or take a few minutes depending on if any commercials came on after the show before 5:30. It could have been 5 minutes before or after, but she swears she heard them. I havent found out what she said they sounded like, but I will try to. so........... if this is correct, the girls were shot right at 5:30 give or take prob 5 min at the most....unless someone is fibbing, and I didnt take it that way.

Frog, thanks for the info. Since the autopsy reports say the girls were found at 5:21PM, combined with Ocean's earlier post about unanswered calls to the girls at 5:08 & 5:10, is it possible the show ended at 5:00 and not 5:30?

cloudajo
09-21-2008, 08:27 AM
I know for a fact he was actually seen... but may not look much like the sketch. Oh... and welcome to this forum. =)

Frog, can you share any more info about this?

Mysterylover
09-21-2008, 10:42 AM
Good ideas, Letsthink. I keep coming back to Uncle Joe who was so visible right after the murders.
Was he trying to deflect attention from himself?
Could he have known the girls were home alone and paid a visit, the girls got scared and ran off, he pursued them and............

Or could they have been paid to unknowingly serve as mules delivering drugs to someone?

Someone in that area knows more than they're telling and I suspect it's because they are involved in some way even if it's not the killing.....

YellowDog...good points!
I have always had questions about Uncle J. seeing the girls on the road before the shooting. Like, what time, where was he going, did he stop etc. etc?
Where was Uncle J. when the girls was found?

What did the 'customers" think/ feel about Uncle going to the restaurant at 4:00 AM talking about the murders? Many unanswered questions!

YellowDog
09-21-2008, 11:17 AM
YellowDog...good points!
I have always had questions about Uncle J. seeing the girls on the road before the shooting. Like, what time, where was he going, did he stop etc. etc?
Where was Uncle J. when the girls was found?

What did the 'customers" think/ feel about Uncle going to the restaurant at 4:00 AM talking about the murders? Many unanswered questions!

In my opinion, he was just a little too visible after the murders were discovered and seemed to show up on TV quite a bit and was quoted several times.

CMorrison64
09-21-2008, 11:55 AM
OT but wanted to mention pics to CM

I want to tell you, these pictures are absolutely gorgeous! can I save them?
I have never gotten into the Casey case. I am just too soft hearted. I wish I didnt hurt so easily, but I do. Well, about things like this, I do. This is why I have never sleuthed, and probably never will again. It just makes my heart break!

And every day, I too pray for them ALL!

Yes of course you can, I made them on www.imikimi.com ... please feel free to use them.

Lauren - CA
09-21-2008, 12:07 PM
In my opinion, he was just a little too visible after the murders were discovered and seemed to show up on TV quite a bit and was quoted several times.


Yes, he seemed a bit anxious to have his 15 minutes of fame!

Lauren - CA
09-21-2008, 12:09 PM
YellowDog...good points!
I have always had questions about Uncle J. seeing the girls on the road before the shooting. Like, what time, where was he going, did he stop etc. etc?
Where was Uncle J. when the girls was found?

What did the 'customers" think/ feel about Uncle going to the restaurant at 4:00 AM talking about the murders? Many unanswered questions!


Does anyone remember a local talking about Uncle Joe being at the Placker residence while they were not there. He had gone there after passing the girls on the road. I remember reading something about Uncle Joe being one of the witnesses. Does anyone remember this. I don't even know where to start to start looking for these posts. Can anyone else remember this??

little726
09-21-2008, 01:28 PM
Does anyone remember a local talking about Uncle Joe being at the Placker residence while they were not there. He had gone there after passing the girls on the road. I remember reading something about Uncle Joe being one of the witnesses. Does anyone remember this. I don't even know where to start to start looking for these posts. Can anyone else remember this??

http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2508355#post2508355

Here it is Lauren. It was posted by Flower Child. By the way...where has she been?

Lauren - CA
09-21-2008, 01:51 PM
http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2508355#post2508355

Here it is Lauren. It was posted by Flower Child. By the way...where has she been?


I have heard she has been busy with work or something. She herself mentioned it when she last posted about three weeks ago.

Lauren - CA
09-21-2008, 01:52 PM
http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2508355#post2508355

Here it is Lauren. It was posted by Flower Child. By the way...where has she been?

Oh thank you for the link by the way!! You saved me a lot of time.

little726
09-21-2008, 02:30 PM
Oh thank you for the link by the way!! You saved me a lot of time.

Thanks, Lauren (about FC). I hope she comes back soon. She was very informative about this case.

You are also welcome for the link.

lilacwine
09-21-2008, 04:01 PM
A few random points/comments

I went through a period as a little girl where I LOVED to sleep in sleeping bag... and it wasn't protection... it was just fun.

Secondly, the Bachelor is sometimes rerun on at least 2 channels here in NH.... so it's possible it was playing at anytime of the dya. One of the channels is a reality show channel and all they play is marathons of shows like that.

frogjustfrog
09-21-2008, 04:09 PM
Frog, thanks for the info. Since the autopsy reports say the girls were found at 5:21PM, combined with Ocean's earlier post about unanswered calls to the girls at 5:08 & 5:10, is it possible the show ended at 5:00 and not 5:30?

Since I used to be a local to Henryetta, I still stay in touch with friends down there. My cousin knows one of the witnesses to seeing the POI. And yes, there was a POI, but is still seems no one knows who he is or anything about him. It was said he didnt look as much like the sketch as they had hoped. What that means, I am not sure of. Maybe a hat with a fake ponytail or something, like someone said before on Topix I think. Sorry I wasnt more help, but I know he wasnt made up.

I also heard this weekend, that a number of people heard gunshots that day.... at different times, in different areas around there, so now they are saying it was probably not the gunfire that killed the girls. I guess maybe those boys who were in the area shooting could have been some of it, or even maybe other shooters in the area. Seems alot of people shoot guns out in the country. Its not too far from the river and creeks. So........ now that blows that theory. Sorry again. I just repeat what I am told. I guess I should have been on the rumor thread? Although, it wasnt rumor... just apparently OTHER gunfire probably from someone else? I dont know anymore. It makes me afraid to repeat anything.

frogjustfrog
09-21-2008, 04:20 PM
A few random points/comments

I went through a period as a little girl where I LOVED to sleep in sleeping bag... and it wasn't protection... it was just fun.

Secondly, the Bachelor is sometimes rerun on at least 2 channels here in NH.... so it's possible it was playing at anytime of the dya. One of the channels is a reality show channel and all they play is marathons of shows like that.

Ya, Lilac... I remember even when I was a child, I loved to get in a sleeping bag. And nowadays, just walking down the isles of Walmart, Target, Kmart... all the kids stores, it seems the fun thing nowadays is sleeping bags with the latest movie... or Disney, princesses, Cars.... all that fun stuff that attracts children in the store! They just gotta have it! And cant wait to cuddle up in it. I found everything from huggable toys with soft throws rolled up in their arms, to those big ol pillows that we used to put in the bed and lean up against, to sleeping bags, all with the latest craze printed on them, just the other night when I was at Walmart. Of course, I had to buy a frog one for my little granddaughter's bday.
Kids love sleeping bags, jammies, throws.... you name it. I think both the families homes were small too, and more than one family living in Whitaker's... and usually more than would normally accomodate at Plackers, just from what I read. So I dont think it uncommon at all for the girls to sleep in a sleeping bag. More like very normal.

evelyn24
09-21-2008, 05:13 PM
Thanks, Lauren (about FC). I hope she comes back soon. She was very informative about this case.

You are also welcome for the link.

I agree, I loved her posts.

black poodle
09-21-2008, 07:45 PM
Oh My Gosh I love your avitar Black poodle.
I loooove poodles and had 3 of them until just recently.
Oh and Welcome to WS
Thanks for the welcome when my daughter left home for college I got him so I wouldn't be so sad now he is more spoiled than she was, LOL

black poodle
09-21-2008, 07:52 PM
What ever happened with the grand jury thing? Do any of the locals know why the one couple had to be brought in in handcuffs instead of coming in the day before and also any local gossip about them?

KeyboardPlayer
09-21-2008, 08:08 PM
There were no indictments issued as a result of the GJ questioning, unfortunately... I'm not local so I can't answer your second two questions :D

Cheers,
KP

ArizonaGiGi
09-21-2008, 08:15 PM
Yes of course you can, I made them on www.imikimi.com (http://www.imikimi.com) ... please feel free to use them.


CM I am going to make some Skyla/Taylor T-shirts with iron on fusing. Do you mind if I consider using your lovely picture of the girls?
:blowkiss:

KeyboardPlayer
09-21-2008, 08:35 PM
What a beautiful idea for a pic, AZ!!! Bless you for doing that :)

YellowDog
09-21-2008, 08:38 PM
What ever happened with the grand jury thing? Do any of the locals know why the one couple had to be brought in in handcuffs instead of coming in the day before and also any local gossip about them?


I believe it was because they didn't report willingly and had to be forced to testify.

Mysterylover
09-21-2008, 08:45 PM
http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2508355#post2508355

Here it is Lauren. It was posted by Flower Child. By the way...where has she been?.....

Flowerchild has many very good questions that need answers, before I'm totally convinced a family member wasn't involved.

Okie ties
09-21-2008, 09:04 PM
Hi all~
My daughter just called and asked if there is any recent news in this case? She is at work at the TV station in OKC and someone called in having heard a rumor that arrests were made today. Have any of you locals heard anything like this? Thanks!

little726
09-21-2008, 09:24 PM
Hi all~
My daughter just called and asked if there is any recent news in this case? She is at work at the TV station in OKC and someone called in having heard a rumor that arrests were made today. Have any of you locals heard anything like this? Thanks!

Hi Okie.

I pray to God, that it's true.

Ruflossn
09-21-2008, 09:37 PM
What ever happened with the grand jury thing? Do any of the locals know why the one couple had to be brought in in handcuffs instead of coming in the day before and also any local gossip about them?

The couple that were brought in w/ handcuffs, for questioning by the GJ, did not arrive the day before (as requested by the GJ) because they said they did not have a vehicle and could not get there. The only rumor I have read about them is that one of them may be related to Dustyn Dailey. He is one that was also questioned by the GJ. It is said he was questioned for approx. 2 hours. i just re-read this post and it does not make a lot of sense. Sorry if it is confusing. I am too tired to try and make corrections! lol.

Lauren - CA
09-21-2008, 11:25 PM
Ya, Lilac... I remember even when I was a child, I loved to get in a sleeping bag. And nowadays, just walking down the isles of Walmart, Target, Kmart... all the kids stores, it seems the fun thing nowadays is sleeping bags with the latest movie... or Disney, princesses, Cars.... all that fun stuff that attracts children in the store! They just gotta have it! And cant wait to cuddle up in it. I found everything from huggable toys with soft throws rolled up in their arms, to those big ol pillows that we used to put in the bed and lean up against, to sleeping bags, all with the latest craze printed on them, just the other night when I was at Walmart. Of course, I had to buy a frog one for my little granddaughter's bday.
Kids love sleeping bags, jammies, throws.... you name it. I think both the families homes were small too, and more than one family living in Whitaker's... and usually more than would normally accomodate at Plackers, just from what I read. So I dont think it uncommon at all for the girls to sleep in a sleeping bag. More like very normal.

Frog, I have never heard that there was more than one family living in the Whitaker home. Where did that info come from?? Do you know who the other family was??

My daughters love to sleep on air mattresses or sleeping bags in the summer. They like to stay up late together and watch tv and stuff. I don't find that unusual at all. For them it's fun. Believe it or not, they like sleeping on the floor.

frogjustfrog
09-21-2008, 11:45 PM
Frog, I have never heard that there was more than one family living in the Whitaker home. Where did that info come from?? Do you know who the other family was??

My daughters love to sleep on air mattresses or sleeping bags in the summer. They like to stay up late together and watch tv and stuff. I don't find that unusual at all. For them it's fun. Believe it or not, they like sleeping on the floor.

Been trying to remember who told me and cant remember, but since I dont know it for a fact, lets call it hearsay... but I was told that Rose and Bill Whitaker and their children, lived in the house next door to Rose's mother, Claudia. They were said to live in Rose's brother's home... with his family. I really dont know how true it is. I dont have any reason to doubt it, but I dont know it to be a fact. Just something I remember someone saying.

Dr. Pennypacker
09-22-2008, 09:30 AM
Frog,
Thanks for sharing all your local inside information. :blowkiss:

Mysterylover
09-22-2008, 10:13 AM
Hi all~
My daughter just called and asked if there is any recent news in this case?

She is at work at the TV station in OKC and someone called in having heard a rumor that arrests were made today.

Have any of you locals heard anything like this? Thanks!.....

That would be good news IF an arrest has been made.

Is there any way to find who has been arrested in that county?

In my state and county, a person can find WHO has been arrested in the last 24 hours,
with booking picture and info..on the computer/ web site....

no names needed....
it shows the entire list of everyone arrested on the date you type in...it's very helpful..

frogjustfrog
09-22-2008, 12:16 PM
That would be good news IF an arrest has been made.

Is there any way to find who has been arrested in that county?

In my state and county, a person can find WHO has been arrested in the last 24 hours,
with booking picture and info..on the computer/ web site....

no names needed....
it shows the entire list of everyone arrested on the date you type in...it's very helpful..

Has anyone found out about an arrest yet? I am wondering if they may have caught whoever has been spraypainting stuff on the school, the old sewing factory, the I40 bridge, etc. Someone apparently keeps painting things pointing fingers, probably where they shouldnt be pointed... and I guess county maintainence has to keep painting over it.
Such a shame! Whoever is doing it is not only showing destructive behavior, but childish, nonrespectable behavior as well.

CMorrison64
09-22-2008, 12:58 PM
CM I am going to make some Skyla/Taylor T-shirts with iron on fusing. Do you mind if I consider using your lovely picture of the girls?
:blowkiss:

Not at all, let me know if you sell them, I would love one.

YellowDog
09-22-2008, 01:11 PM
Since I used to be a local to Henryetta, I still stay in touch with friends down there. My cousin knows one of the witnesses to seeing the POI. And yes, there was a POI, but is still seems no one knows who he is or anything about him. It was said he didnt look as much like the sketch as they had hoped. What that means, I am not sure of. Maybe a hat with a fake ponytail or something, like someone said before on Topix I think. Sorry I wasnt more help, but I know he wasnt made up.

I also heard this weekend, that a number of people heard gunshots that day.... at different times, in different areas around there, so now they are saying it was probably not the gunfire that killed the girls. I guess maybe those boys who were in the area shooting could have been some of it, or even maybe other shooters in the area. Seems alot of people shoot guns out in the country. Its not too far from the river and creeks. So........ now that blows that theory. Sorry again. I just repeat what I am told. I guess I should have been on the rumor thread? Although, it wasnt rumor... just apparently OTHER gunfire probably from someone else? I dont know anymore. It makes me afraid to repeat anything.


Whoever killed those girls just might have been shooting guns earlier in the area so the shots could have been from the same guns.

frogjustfrog
09-22-2008, 01:59 PM
Whoever killed those girls just might have been shooting guns earlier in the area so the shots could have been from the same guns.

I guess anything is possible, but OSBI reports were that they checked the kids who were in the area shooting guns, and cleared them. However, I have no idea what to believe anymore!
OSBI says one thing... then changes it.... I think they are trying to throw people off track, myself.

YellowDog
09-22-2008, 02:27 PM
I guess anything is possible, but OSBI reports were that they checked the kids who were in the area shooting guns, and cleared them. However, I have no idea what to believe anymore!
OSBI says one thing... then changes it.... I think they are trying to throw people off track, myself.


I think OSBI is making a big mistake by not releasing more information to the public. For one thing, it might cause the killer/killers to slip up and say something to someone who might, in turn, turn them in if they thought LE was on their trail.

Missing Sarah
09-22-2008, 03:58 PM
you can go your own way

Missing Sarah
09-22-2008, 04:08 PM
hello everyone

KeyboardPlayer
09-22-2008, 05:05 PM
Hi MS!

k4kathy
09-22-2008, 05:05 PM
Here's something that I keep remembering- Taylor's little dog was found at the bridge the next day. I can't believe that that tiny little thing ran/walked/toddled all the way back to the bridge instead of heading for the driveway a short distance ahead. That dog was put or left at the bridge by someone. (IMO). I can just imagine some smart aleck youth taking the dog from Taylor and laughing when she protested. I believe that this is a major clue as to the nature of the crime.I'm puzzled as to where the little dog was at til the time it was found the next day.Could the killer/killers be so brazen to drop the dog off?I would think they would be too paranoid to bring the dog back and drop it off at the bridge.I can't believe that little dog just showed up the next day.The killer/killers are ruthless enough to take the lives of two little girls,but spared the dogs life...unless the dog ran and hid.

frogjustfrog
09-23-2008, 02:12 AM
I'm puzzled as to where the little dog was at til the time it was found the next day.Could the killer/killers be so brazen to drop the dog off?I would think they would be too paranoid to bring the dog back and drop it off at the bridge.I can't believe that little dog just showed up the next day.The killer/killers are ruthless enough to take the lives of two little girls,but spared the dogs life...unless the dog ran and hid.

I would imagine it did hide. That breed of dog, (not even going to try to spell it) are easily frightened. I had a friend who had one, and if you slipped up on it, it was actually known to panic and lie like dead for a long time! so dont you think it prob hid til the next day, then hung around maybe, because of the girls? kinda sad, huh? I doubt anyone took it and had the guts to come back to the crime scene. However, I wonder if it was a killer who disfigured Skyla's cross. THAT wouldnt suprise me!

tapu
09-23-2008, 06:56 AM
you can go your own way



night cometh


(good to see you, M.S.)

Dr. Pennypacker
09-23-2008, 07:51 AM
I think OSBI is making a big mistake by not releasing more information to the public. For one thing, it might cause the killer/killers to slip up and say something to someone who might, in turn, turn them in if they thought LE was on their trail.
I agree. If they don't do something soon it's going to go cold.

k4kathy
09-23-2008, 08:46 AM
I would imagine it did hide. That breed of dog, (not even going to try to spell it) are easily frightened. I had a friend who had one, and if you slipped up on it, it was actually known to panic and lie like dead for a long time! so dont you think it prob hid til the next day, then hung around maybe, because of the girls? kinda sad, huh? I doubt anyone took it and had the guts to come back to the crime scene. However, I wonder if it was a killer who disfigured Skyla's cross. THAT wouldnt suprise me!I couldn't find much about the cross being disfigured.Would you fill me in?
I'm interested in knowing who found the dog the next day.Does anybody know?This breed of dog is very loyal to it's owner,but if it would have hidden in the general area,I assume someone would have come across it.Does anyone else find it strange that the dog didn't walk to the house?

Mysterylover
09-23-2008, 09:51 AM
I couldn't find much about the cross being disfigured.Would you fill me in?
I'm interested in knowing who found the dog the next day.Does anybody know?

This breed of dog is very loyal to it's owner,but if it would have hidden in the general area,I assume someone would have come across it.

Does anyone else find it strange that the dog didn't walk to the house?....

K4Kathy, Good questions...Yes, as a dog breeder I have found it very strange from the beginning.
Why didn't the little dog run home and hid on the porch, in Taylor's playhouse, or sleep with their other dogs that night....

Why would the tiny dog been at the Bridge the next day?...Hmmmm!

That behavior is not like a dog. Dogs go home if possible, unless they are Left elsewhere, lost or stolen.

Dogs and cats try to FIND their way back home to their masters, as soon as they can, walking many miles and many days to do so......Was Taylor's little dog on it's way back home when it was found at the bridge the next day? If not why?

YellowDog
09-23-2008, 11:06 AM
K4Kathy, Good questions...Yes, as a dog breeder I have found it very strange from the beginning.
Why didn't the little dog run home and hid on the porch, in Taylor's playhouse, or sleep with their other dogs that night....

Why would the tiny dog been at the Bridge the next day?...Hmmmm!

That behavior is not like a dog. Dogs go home if possible, unless they are Left elsewhere, lost or stolen.

Dogs and cats try to FIND their way back home to their masters, as soon as they can, walking many miles and many days to do so......Was Taylor's little dog on it's way back home when it was found at the bridge the next day? If not why?


Maybe the dog did go home and hide until the next day and then went to the bridge looking for the girls.

Boots-OK
09-23-2008, 12:13 PM
I know there have been stories related to Taylor's dog. Can you please post a link to what is known or has it been speculation. Please and thank you...

frogjustfrog
09-23-2008, 12:16 PM
K4Kathy, Good questions...Yes, as a dog breeder I have found it very strange from the beginning.
Why didn't the little dog run home and hid on the porch, in Taylor's playhouse, or sleep with their other dogs that night....

Why would the tiny dog been at the Bridge the next day?...Hmmmm!

That behavior is not like a dog. Dogs go home if possible, unless they are Left elsewhere, lost or stolen.

Dogs and cats try to FIND their way back home to their masters, as soon as they can, walking many miles and many days to do so......Was Taylor's little dog on it's way back home when it was found at the bridge the next day? If not why?

Maybe if someone was home, that the girls were arguing with, thus the reason for them wanting to leave, maybe the dog didnt want to go home because that person was there? Or because of the tension at home from an earlier event that led the girls to leave? Just another scenario. Something to think about. Still wondering who was at that house. Was uncle joe? or someone else too?
I got a pm awhile back, from someone who said she wont post. And she swore she had a dream and saw the whole thing. She said she saw Taylor arguing with someone at the house so they left... and they were followed. They said it was a male.
Well, of course, I didnt know what to make of it. Of course, this is the internet and you never know who is gonna pop on and say what. So I didnt say anything. Now I havent seen this posters name online for at least a month or more. She said she was psychic and I told her to post on the psychic thread, but she said she wouldnt. That people would say she was crazy. Maybe she was. And maybe she wasnt. I just dont know. Weird! I havent said anything til now because I thought she just might tell others her dream. She appears to be gone now.
You all may think I am nuts for even telling you. But that's the story I got. Take it or leave it. I wouldnt make it up, but I wont tell names either.

Morag
09-23-2008, 12:55 PM
What I imagined happened with the dog is that he was taken from the girls at the bridge. The girls walked toward home to complain to their parents, who would surely take action- the girls knew the boys who took the dog. At some point the dog holders (?) drove up to the girls, there was an argument, and suddenly one of the boys started shooting. The killers then drove away and tossed the dog out at the bridge.

Tom'sGirl
09-23-2008, 01:02 PM
I know there have been stories related to Taylor's dog. Can you please post a link to what is known or has it been speculation. Please and thank you...
Try here, (http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=66612) nothing recent as all posts seem to go in this thread :)

Ruflossn
09-23-2008, 01:33 PM
Try here, (http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=66612) nothing recent as all posts seem to go in this thread :)

Thanks TG. I love how you always have the thread at your finger tips. How do you do that? :confused:''

Flossie

Tom'sGirl
09-23-2008, 02:23 PM
Thanks TG. I love how you always have the thread at your finger tips. How do you do that? :confused:''

Flossie


LOL, probably because I've been here since this case Forum was started.

The point of granting a Forum to a case it to have threads within that Forum regarding different subjects so that the posts pertain and stay 'On Topic'.

Granted, you will find threads that were added at random and pointless and have become dormant.

Requesting someone to stay ''On Topic' or post in appropriate thread has at times only gotten some upset. I'm not a MOD on this Forum so I only try to keep it on track, but not lately http://mail.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/09.gif

JP76ER
09-23-2008, 06:29 PM
:)
I was wondering the same thing.It's possible that the girls had been gone longer,even if one of them called to check in w/ a family member,they could have called from anywhere.It is odd that there was no food contents in their stomachs,nothing at all.No urine in their bladders either.They either voided after the attack or had little to drink.I was wondering if any tire tread casts were taken from the driveway at the house.It's possible the killer/killers were at the house first.
Has anybody else thought that who ever murdered these girls, could be someone who has done alot of deer hunting?Deer hunters tend to go for lung/heart shots,to get a lethal shot at their target.Sometimes,if the deer doesn't die right away,and hunter will use a handgun to shoot the deer in the head.The killer could have used their experience from hunting.MOO.

Hi, I'm way behind on catching up on this, but I have been a life long hunter & you described deer hunting perfectly. We use the same rule as our military snipers, "One Shot, One Kill". I'm from Illinois & they just started allowing us to bring handguns with us into the field. If the deer is still alive, we are to use the handgun to put them down. We are responsible & ethical hunters, we do not want the animal to suffer. We also eat what we take. I prefer venison over beef anytime. I'm not bragging, but it has been a very long time since I had to fire twice.

Back to the two murders, I have been thinking about the way they we're killed & it definitely fits someone who knows firearms & probably hunts. You describe things accurately & I have thought this since the beginning.

Excellent post.

Mysterylover
09-23-2008, 08:34 PM
Maybe if someone was home, that the girls were arguing with, thus the reason for them wanting to leave, maybe the dog didnt want to go home because that person was there?

Or because of the tension at home from an earlier event that led the girls to leave? Just another scenario.
Something to think about.
Still wondering who was at that house. Was uncle joe? or someone else too?

I got a pm awhile back, from someone who said she wont post. And she swore she had a dream and saw the whole thing.

She said she saw Taylor arguing with someone at the house so they left... and they were followed. They said it was a male.

Well, of course, I didnt know what to make of it. Of course, this is the internet and you never know who is gonna pop on and say what. So I didnt say anything. Now I havent seen this posters name online for at least a month or more. She said she was psychic and I told her to post on the psychic thread, but she said she wouldnt. That people would say she was crazy. Maybe she was. And maybe she wasnt. I just dont know. Weird!

I havent said anything til now because I thought she just might tell others her dream. She appears to be gone now.
You all may think I am nuts for even telling you. But that's the story I got. Take it or leave it. I wouldnt make it up, but I wont tell names either.....

Frog....with the Time Line as tight as they say, it's a good possibility it could have happened this way.

Trino
09-23-2008, 08:46 PM
I generally check Caylee's thread and this thread daily. Just gotta say how sad it is to see 500-800 people on Caylee's thread and only 5-10 on this one.

Maybe it's that posters think Casey's the perp and are just waiting for an arrest. Then, too, there's the intriguing parts the grandparents are playing. Still, there needs to be a resolution to the murders of Taylor and Skyla, and I hope more people show an interest in the resolution of this case. Most of all, I hope it doesn't grow cold.

JP76ER
09-23-2008, 09:00 PM
I generally check Caylee's thread and this thread daily. Just gotta say how sad it is to see 500-800 people on Caylee's thread and only 5-10 on this one.

Maybe it's that posters think Casey's the perp and are just waiting for an arrest. Then, too, there's the intriguing parts the grandparents are playing. Still, there needs to be a resolution to the murders of Taylor and Skyla, and I hope more people show an interest in the resolution of this case. Most of all, I hope it doesn't grow cold.


Hi Trino,

I think there are a lot of people like me, who are late catching up. This case intrigues me because of way too many items to list. I know I read a lot, I just don't post a lot. I'm trying to be patient & hope they (LE) are putting final touches on this case, they know who the perps are & they have them under a close watch. Hopefully, we will see arrests soon. Believe me, the murders of these two innocent young girls angers me deeply. This is a death penalty case if I have ever seen one. I'm not sure if Oklahoma has the death penalty or not. I will have to read more & catch up.

Best.

Tom'sGirl
09-23-2008, 09:04 PM
I generally check Caylee's thread and this thread daily. Just gotta say how sad it is to see 500-800 people on Caylee's thread and only 5-10 on this one.
If there was something new in this case, more would be reading. So far it's just speculations or re-hashing old thoughts.

Tom'sGirl
09-23-2008, 09:09 PM
I'm not sure if Oklahoma has the death penalty or not. I will have to read more & catch up.
YES
http://www.doc.state.ok.us/offenders/deathrow.htm

k4kathy
09-24-2008, 12:11 PM
I generally check Caylee's thread and this thread daily. Just gotta say how sad it is to see 500-800 people on Caylee's thread and only 5-10 on this one.

Maybe it's that posters think Casey's the perp and are just waiting for an arrest. Then, too, there's the intriguing parts the grandparents are playing. Still, there needs to be a resolution to the murders of Taylor and Skyla, and I hope more people show an interest in the resolution of this case. Most of all, I hope it doesn't grow cold.Trino,
You are right,it is sad.I suppose one reason would be the Caylee Anthony case has so much national media coverage,and the murder's of Skyla and Taylor is hardly mentioned by the media anymore.
I don't know if it has to do with ratings or what,but I think it is very unfair for the media to focus primarily on the Anthony case.I think there are plenty other cases (especially Skyla and Taylors) that deserve much more media airtime.:confused:

Tom'sGirl
09-24-2008, 12:30 PM
There are many, many, many murder cases with little or no current information. In each case there are those who follow them and become discouraged, just like those that follow this case.

It's only been 31/2 months since these brutal murders occurred, so far from being a Cold Case.

YellowDog
09-24-2008, 01:00 PM
Another reason this case is not getting the media attention like the Casey Anthony case is because these parents of the girls are not vocal and do no appear to be demanding justice. They are off to the nearest casino.

And no pressure from the townspeople that I have read about either. As I've said before, if OSBI would just release some information they might get some help on this case.

ArizonaGiGi
09-24-2008, 03:43 PM
I really feel that this case will be solved. In due time. it may be a few years even but I believe it will be solved.

frogjustfrog
09-24-2008, 04:23 PM
There are many, many, many murder cases with little or no current information. In each case there are those who follow them and become discouraged, just like those that follow this case.

It's only been 31/2 months since these brutal murders occurred, so far from being a Cold Case.

I agree with you TG. This is far from being a cold case. I believe LE is working diligently on it. I just believe that they have so few facts, that they cant release any information for fear of possibly not being able to make the arrest and case against whoever they are most suspecting. Still, it does make us anxious and frustrated, doesnt it?
Keep the faith!

k4kathy
09-24-2008, 04:53 PM
Has anyone else besides me considered the possibility that there could be two crime scenes?This might be totally ridiculous,but based on what I read in the girls's autopsy reports,I think it is a possibility that the girl's were shot in two different locations.Both girl's had abrasions.And I seriously doubt these abrasions were the result of falling after being shot.Seems to me like these could very well be "drag" abrasions,caused from being dragged.If you read the autopsy report's,you probably noticed abrasions were found on both girls.To me,the locations of the abrasions coincide with being dragged.Just sharing my thoughts...
Also,does anyone know if the dirt road was sandy or soft enough that the dogs paw prints might have been found.On another note,are they completely sure that Taylor even took the dog with her on the walk?Does anyone know who found the dog at the bridge the next day?I hope it was OSBI/LE ...maybe there were fibers on the dogs coat or snagged on a claw...what a long shot that would be.

Mysterylover
09-24-2008, 08:34 PM
Has anyone else besides me considered the possibility that there could be two crime scenes?

This might be totally ridiculous,but based on what I read in the girls's autopsy reports,
I think it is a possibility that the girl's were shot in two different locations.

Both girl's had abrasions.And I seriously doubt these abrasions were the result of falling after being shot.
Seems to me like these could very well be "drag" abrasions,caused from being dragged.
If you read the autopsy report's,you probably noticed abrasions were found on both girls.To me,the locations of the abrasions coincide with being dragged.Just sharing my thoughts...

Also,does anyone know if the dirt road was sandy or soft enough that the dogs paw prints might have been found.On another note,are they completely sure that Taylor even took the dog with her on the walk?
Does anyone know who found the dog at the bridge the next day?I hope it was OSBI/LE ...maybe there were fibers on the dogs coat or snagged on a claw...what a long shot that would be......

K4Kathy, YES, I thought that was a possibility from the very beginning.

It makes alot of sense...The girls shot elsewhere...possibly taken there in the back of a truck, layed-out beside the road and shot many more times....all in 38 minutes.

After reading the autopsy reports, with abrasions found on both girls, I felt there is MORE to this murder than what we think....

Ruflossn
09-24-2008, 08:52 PM
Has anyone else besides me considered the possibility that there could be two crime scenes?This might be totally ridiculous,but based on what I read in the girls's autopsy reports,I think it is a possibility that the girl's were shot in two different locations.Both girl's had abrasions.And I seriously doubt these abrasions were the result of falling after being shot.Seems to me like these could very well be "drag" abrasions,caused from being dragged.If you read the autopsy report's,you probably noticed abrasions were found on both girls.To me,the locations of the abrasions coincide with being dragged.Just sharing my thoughts...
Also,does anyone know if the dirt road was sandy or soft enough that the dogs paw prints might have been found.On another note,are they completely sure that Taylor even took the dog with her on the walk?Does anyone know who found the dog at the bridge the next day?I hope it was OSBI/LE ...maybe there were fibers on the dogs coat or snagged on a claw...what a long shot that would be.

Hi K4kathy,
The "dirt" road is hard packed in the middle and has a sandy texture off to the sides. I am unsure if there were dog prints found or not. I do know they were able to get tire impressions before the rain began. (I think the rain began sometime around 4:00 a.m.) I have not been able to look closely at the autopsies to try and figure out where the abrasions would figure into this whole mess. Your theory makes common sense. However, imo, nothing about this case is "common".
:confused:

Thanks for your post. It certainly gives us something to ponder.
Flossie

cloudajo
09-24-2008, 08:52 PM
<snipped> Also,does anyone know if the dirt road was sandy or soft enough that the dogs paw prints might have been found.On another note,are they completely sure that Taylor even took the dog with her on the walk?Does anyone know who found the dog at the bridge the next day?I hope it was OSBI/LE ...maybe there were fibers on the dogs coat or snagged on a claw...what a long shot that would be.

K4, I think the dog's prints might show up. Not sure who found the dog at the bridge the next day.

Not sure if you saw this already - this was a video of Sheriff Jack Choate from June 9th - about 40 seconds into the video he says "...we were able to track them and their little dog to the bridge and then on the return trip back."

http://www.newsok.tv/?titleID=1599177548 (http://www.newsok.tv/?titleID=1599177548)

Also, there was the male witness (described as credible) who saw the girls walking together on the road supposedly minutes before shots were heard. Not sure if he saw the dog too but I imagine he was asked.

oceanblueeyes
09-24-2008, 11:00 PM
K4Kathy, YES, I thought that was a possibility from the very beginning.

It makes alot of sense...The girls shot elsewhere...possibly taken there in the back of a truck, layed-out beside the road and shot many more times....all in 38 minutes.

After reading the autopsy reports, with abrasions found on both girls, I felt there is MORE to this murder than what we think....

But didn't LE say that the girls were shot and killed exactly where they were found?

If they had been moved LE would know that. The blood pooling and smears would have been different and they could tell if the bodies had been picked up and were in contact with the killers as they handled them. There would be blood smearing on their clothing if they were handled to place into the ditch.

Did we ever find out for sure that the little dog was found the next day? All I remember was the Sheriff said that LE tracked the girls and Taylor's dog to the bridge and back. There would be paw prints of the little dog as they ran along side of the girls.

The only thing I can think of as to why the dog did not come back home is because dogs are terrified of gun shots. When I was growing up our little dog went with my daddy when he was target practicing and he didn't even notice she wasn't around until he got ready to leave. We looked for her for three days and finally she made it home all by herself and it was three miles away from where she got spooked to where we lived.

Personally, I think these little girls died right where they stood and had but a split second warning. So little time that Taylor's bag was still on her shoulder. I think whomever did this.......did it in rapid succession and was gone as quickly as it happened.

imoo

Boots-OK
09-25-2008, 12:04 AM
Re: Abrasions

I've always wondered if the girls had been chased and maybe had stumbled/fallen causing the abrasions. Since they were not shot in the road but off the road and back up in the bushes it seems they may have been trying to hide or get away.

IIRC they were not moved after they were murdered. The reports did indicate they were killed where they were found I believe.

YellowDog
09-25-2008, 12:04 PM
Re: Abrasions

I've always wondered if the girls had been chased and maybe had stumbled/fallen causing the abrasions. Since they were not shot in the road but off the road and back up in the bushes it seems they may have been trying to hide or get away.

IIRC they were not moved after they were murdered. The reports did indicate they were killed where they were found I believe.

That's what I think happened, too Boots.

k4kathy
09-25-2008, 03:56 PM
Hmmm,I just composed a very lengthy post,and as I was getting ready to submitt it,it just vanished.Has this happened to anyone else?

YellowDog
09-25-2008, 04:19 PM
Hmmm,I just composed a very lengthy post,and as I was getting ready to submitt it,it just vanished.Has this happened to anyone else?

No, try reposting it.

k4kathy
09-25-2008, 04:35 PM
No, try reposting it.I can't.It's gone.I usually just type my thoughts as they come to mind.Oh well....:)

ArizonaGiGi
09-25-2008, 05:07 PM
YES!!! :eek: I thought I was the only one it happened to. And it's always a long post too. :crazy: I can never re-create it either.


Hmmm,I just composed a very lengthy post, and as I was getting ready to submitt it,it just vanished.Has this happened to anyone else?

Ruflossn
09-25-2008, 06:12 PM
Hmmm,I just composed a very lengthy post,and as I was getting ready to submitt it,it just vanished.Has this happened to anyone else?

Hi k4kathy~
This has happened to me. It happens when I try to post long PM's also. I think it occurs when you are typing and the server "times out". For this reason, I always, copy any post that is very long. That way, if you the server times out, you can log in and simply paste it where you originally wanted to post. I hope this makes sense. I hope it helps.

Flossie

Lauren - CA
09-25-2008, 06:21 PM
Hmmm,I just composed a very lengthy post,and as I was getting ready to submitt it,it just vanished.Has this happened to anyone else?

Yes. You will learn to copy, copy and copy just in case, lol!

Lauren - CA
09-25-2008, 06:24 PM
But didn't LE say that the girls were shot and killed exactly where they were found?

If they had been moved LE would know that. The blood pooling and smears would have been different and they could tell if the bodies had been picked up and were in contact with the killers as they handled them. There would be blood smearing on their clothing if they were handled to place into the ditch.

Did we ever find out for sure that the little dog was found the next day? All I remember was the Sheriff said that LE tracked the girls and Taylor's dog to the bridge and back. There would be paw prints of the little dog as they ran along side of the girls.

The only thing I can think of as to why the dog did not come back home is because dogs are terrified of gun shots. When I was growing up our little dog went with my daddy when he was target practicing and he didn't even notice she wasn't around until he got ready to leave. We looked for her for three days and finally she made it home all by herself and it was three miles away from where she got spooked to where we lived.

Personally, I think these little girls died right where they stood and had but a split second warning. So little time that Taylor's bag was still on her shoulder. I think whomever did this.......did it in rapid succession and was gone as quickly as it happened.

imoo

Yes, I agree. They were killed where they stood. I believe the autopsy reports point to this.

The abrasions could have come from anywhere. They were little girls. Like most kids that age, I'm sure they were out running around every day. Their playhouse, were they able to stand up in it? Possibly they may have been hanging posters of their fav celebs on their knees? If it wasn't very high, I can see them on their knees marking themselves as the autopsies showed.

Tom'sGirl
09-25-2008, 06:24 PM
Billboard a reminder about Weleetka killings (http://www.kjrh.com/content/news/2viewgc/story.aspx?content_id=8d5b1817-579f-4230-91f0-e6c7a828b7ed)
kjrh.com (http://kjrh.com/) - Tulsa,OK,USA

The billboard will state that over $30000 is available for information about the deaths of Skyla Whitaker and Taylor Placker.

ArizonaGiGi
09-25-2008, 07:37 PM
Billboard a reminder about Weleetka killings (http://www.kjrh.com/content/news/2viewgc/story.aspx?content_id=8d5b1817-579f-4230-91f0-e6c7a828b7ed)
kjrh.com (http://kjrh.com/) - Tulsa,OK,USA

The billboard will state that over $30000 is available for information about the deaths of Skyla Whitaker and Taylor Placker.

:clap::clap:
I just wish it was a higher reward. Like a couple hundred K higher.:waitasec:
Like the Caylee Anthony reward fund. :rolleyes:

black poodle
09-25-2008, 09:31 PM
Wonder why these girls families have not been more vocal demanding justice, if this was my child I would be screaming from the roof tops that something be done. I would be on Nancy, Greta, Ophra, the Today show anywhere that would listen to me. Maybe the locals can answer what is wrong with them? I am sure they are grieving terribly but the squeaky wheel usually gets the most grease

GetSmart
09-25-2008, 10:29 PM
BPoodle you & me both.. but I am thinking there must be a reason. True alot baggage in Placker Family ..Unless the LE is telling them things but asking them not to talk?? Who knows... I just get anxious .. PO"d because Fl LE can release 600 paGES OF INTERVIEWS & we cant even get a time line accurate or find out who was at Plackers house prior to shooting.. ERERER

Sooner Fan#1
09-26-2008, 02:10 AM
:blowkiss:Well, wouldn't you just know it...I'm been out of town and just got in and was gonna say hi and noone is here! Well....hi anyway!

Sooner Fan#1
09-26-2008, 02:19 AM
:crazy:O/T btw, I hope everyone noticed ny new avatar. That's my grandbaby when she was down here in OK last month. She's in our pool and she sooo loved it!!!

Ok, Back on topic...When I get stumped on a case at work, I always say....go all the way back to the beginning. Here's MY problem right off the bat....Peter Placker gave a statement to LE immediately after this occured....and said he took the girl's cell phone and called 911....later when the tapes were released, it was Vicky Placker's voice. Now, how do you proceed from there? I'm not sayin....just sayin....There is something that's just not right there.

ArizonaGiGi
09-26-2008, 04:51 AM
Oh Sooner she is so pretty! So that's the pool you are always talking about. nice!
Sorry don't have anything to add in order to stay on topic

cloudajo
09-26-2008, 07:11 AM
9/25 – Fox 23 - Police Investigate Weleetka Fires

Investigators say they have two people of interest in a rash of arsons.

Five fires have been set in Weleetka, a town still dealing with the unsolved murders of two young girls.

The last fire set was tuesday. One of the buildings burned was a church.

Police say the murders are not connected to this string of arson.

“All the fires have been within a three block radius of one another,” said Undersheriff, Derrall Summers.

Police say all five fires happened between 3 and 5 o’clock in the morning. Arsonist set fire to four homes and one church.

http://www.fox23.com/news/local/story.aspx?content_id=6812179f-e61c-46c1-8198-0cda970a147e&rss=77 (http://www.fox23.com/news/local/story.aspx?content_id=6812179f-e61c-46c1-8198-0cda970a147e&rss=77)

Ruflossn
09-26-2008, 09:10 AM
:crazy:O/T btw, I hope everyone noticed ny new avatar. That's my grandbaby when she was down here in OK last month. She's in our pool and she sooo loved it!!!

Ok, Back on topic...When I get stumped on a case at work, I always say....go all the way back to the beginning. Here's MY problem right off the bat....Peter Placker gave a statement to LE immediately after this occured....and said he took the girl's cell phone and called 911....later when the tapes were released, it was Vicky Placker's voice. Now, how do you proceed from there? I'm not sayin....just sayin....There is something that's just not right there.

Hi Sooner,
I remember something about the 911 phone call and PP. Do you have a link for that info?

Mysterylover
09-26-2008, 11:00 AM
:crazy:O/T
btw, I hope everyone noticed ny new avatar. That's my grandbaby when she was down here in OK last month. She's in our pool and she sooo loved it!!!

Ok, Back on topic...When I get stumped on a case at work, I always say....go all the way back to the beginning.

Here's MY problem right off the bat....Peter Placker gave a statement to LE immediately after this occured....and said he took the girl's cell phone and called 911....
later when the tapes were released, it was Vicky Placker's voice.

Now, how do you proceed from there? I'm not sayin....just sayin....There is something that's just not right there......

Sooner, I agree, that Lie/ statement made by PP was said for a reason, WHY is the question that needs an answer.
IF he told that in the beginning what else was "falsely' said?

We were told in the press conference, there was only ONE 911 call made and it was by Vickie as she ran to the murder scene.....jmo

Annie
09-26-2008, 11:10 AM
Sooner, I agree, that Lie/ statement made by PP was said for a reason, WHY is the question that needs an answer.
IF he told that in the beginning what else was "falsely' said?

We were told in the press conference, there was only ONE 911 call made and it was by Vickie as she ran to the murder scene.....jmo


One of my concerns is that the "witnesses" of the POI and of the girls walking that day could be involved and made up the stories. I am suspicious of any of the boys shooting being witnesses or of Uncle Joe being a witness. I have thought from the beginning there is a possibility the girls could have been shot somewhere else and finished off at that spot. If there really was a truck there, it could have been used to transport them to that spot. As far as footprints and dog tracks on a dirt road, they could have been made any time over the weekend if this was not their first trip to the bridge. I still think the road grading so soon was a huge mistake. I wish the police would release more information. I think they are in over their heads.

Sooner Fan#1
09-26-2008, 12:26 PM
Ruf, I'm looking for the Peter Placker interview, soon as I find it I will post

oceanblueeyes
09-26-2008, 03:31 PM
:crazy:O/T btw, I hope everyone noticed ny new avatar. That's my grandbaby when she was down here in OK last month. She's in our pool and she sooo loved it!!!

Ok, Back on topic...When I get stumped on a case at work, I always say....go all the way back to the beginning. Here's MY problem right off the bat....Peter Placker gave a statement to LE immediately after this occured....and said he took the girl's cell phone and called 911....later when the tapes were released, it was Vicky Placker's voice. Now, how do you proceed from there? I'm not sayin....just sayin....There is something that's just not right there.

Your granddaughter is beautiful.

Did LE ever specifically say that it was PP that made the 911 call or just that a 911 call was made right away? What officer talked about exactly what PP told them in his interview? It seems they would want to keep that information confidential.

It may have been misinformation put out by the media. From what I can remember I thought he immediately called Vicki and she in turn called 911 while running down the road toward the girls. But maybe he didn't call her but ran back and got her because in the 911 call she is telling someone to "run!".

imoo

oceanblueeyes
09-26-2008, 03:38 PM
One of my concerns is that the "witnesses" of the POI and of the girls walking that day could be involved and made up the stories. I am suspicious of any of the boys shooting being witnesses or of Uncle Joe being a witness. I have thought from the beginning there is a possibility the girls could have been shot somewhere else and finished off at that spot. If there really was a truck there, it could have been used to transport them to that spot. As far as footprints and dog tracks on a dirt road, they could have been made any time over the weekend if this was not their first trip to the bridge. I still think the road grading so soon was a huge mistake. I wish the police would release more information. I think they are in over their heads.

It seems they were able to gather a lot of information from the scene before the road was graded.


Brown: Evidence from scene includes tire tracks, footprints, ballistics, DNA/blood evidence – blood is probably the girls but we still have to test. (All taken to crime laboratory.)

MSNBC Video – Jun 11th
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/25098696#25098696

Tom'sGirl
09-26-2008, 03:57 PM
Did LE ever specifically say that it was PP that made the 911 call or just that a 911 call was made right away?
In this video of the Presser on 6-10-08 it says PP took one of the girl's cell phones and called 911..............this may not have been factual, but that's what was reported.

VIDEO: http://www.koco.com/video/16562436/?taf=okl (http://www.koco.com/video/16562436/?taf=okl)

Sooner Fan#1
09-26-2008, 04:03 PM
It seems they were able to gather a lot of information from the scene before the road was graded.


Brown: Evidence from scene includes tire tracks, footprints, ballistics, DNA/blood evidence – blood is probably the girls but we still have to test. (All taken to crime laboratory.)

MSNBC Video – Jun 11th
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/25098696#25098696

Ocean, it could very well have been false info from the media, wouldn't be the first time. huh But I ABSOLUTELY remember hearing that Peter Placker reached down and got the girls cell phone from her pocket....then later we all wondered about her having a purse with her. I'm just going to have to go back and go thru all the media reports but I can't do it now....dang phone ringing off the hook...darn these people think I should have to work....don;t they know I don't work on Friday afternoons. Then going out to dinner but I'll find it if it's the last thing I do lol....oh and thanks for the compliment about my baby....I have tons more I will be switching...I warned you all I'd bore you to death with them.

Sooner Fan#1
09-26-2008, 04:08 PM
I've tried using the search function but as you can imagine, 9 gazillion things come up when I do. My skills on this format are not what they should be.

oceanblueeyes
09-26-2008, 04:24 PM
Ocean, it could very well have been false info from the media, wouldn't be the first time. huh But I ABSOLUTELY remember hearing that Peter Placker reached down and got the girls cell phone from her pocket....then later we all wondered about her having a purse with her. I'm just going to have to go back and go thru all the media reports but I can't do it now....dang phone ringing off the hook...darn these people think I should have to work....don;t they know I don't work on Friday afternoons. Then going out to dinner but I'll find it if it's the last thing I do lol....oh and thanks for the compliment about my baby....I have tons more I will be switching...I warned you all I'd bore you to death with them.

I love baby photos.:)

I know we heard that somewhere but now I don't know if was LE or if the media said it. It does get so confusing to remember all the way back to the first of June and the media is known to misinterpret things sometime.

If it were me, since Vicki was just 300 yards away, from seeing the girls I would have called for my spouse first letting them know what had happened. I would definitely want them there with me.

imoo

Sooner Fan#1
09-26-2008, 04:27 PM
When they didn't return and could not be reached by cell phone, Peter Placker (http://newsok.com/keysearch/?er=1&CANONICAL=Peter+Placker&CATEGORY=PERSON) went looking for them and found the bodies. He called 911 using Taylor's phone.

http://newsok.com/for-slain-weleetka-girls-kin-pain-keeps-coming/article/3256335/?tm=1213280045

Sooner Fan#1
09-26-2008, 04:32 PM
maybe they didn't release the entire 911 call...maybe peter tried to report it but was too upset and since vicky was running down the road maybe he handed her the phone...I don't think that's too much of a stretch....I really have no suspicions about the ones that raised that baby.

Mysterylover
09-26-2008, 04:32 PM
One of my concerns is that the "witnesses" of the POI and of the girls walking that day could be involved and made up the stories.

I am suspicious of any of the boys shooting being witnesses or of Uncle Joe being a witness.
I have thought from the beginning there is a possibility the girls could have been shot somewhere else and finished off at that spot.

If there really was a truck there, it could have been used to transport them to that spot.
As far as footprints and dog tracks on a dirt road, they could have been made any time over the weekend if this was not their first trip to the bridge.

I still think the road grading so soon was a huge mistake.
I wish the police would release more information. I think they are in over their heads.....

Annie, good points...
IF the P's were not home, the girls could have walked to the bridge several times that Sunday...it's a fact the girls wasn't eating where ever they were.

It's my opinion LE would be making a mistake thinking the footprints were made in that 38 minutes, when they could have been made anytime that day.
I wish LE would have brought Bloodhounds in and we would know WHERE the girls had been that day.
I still have questions about what was going on with the girls when Rose called at 4:30.....

oceanblueeyes
09-26-2008, 04:33 PM
In this video of the Presser on 6-10-08 it says PP took one of the girl's cell phones and called 911..............this may not have been factual, but that's what was reported.

VIDEO: http://www.koco.com/video/16562436/?taf=okl (http://www.koco.com/video/16562436/?taf=okl)


Thanks. Ok this leads me to believe that two 911 calls were made. One made from Taylor's phone and one made from Vicki's phone as she was running down the road from their house.

They have chosen to release Vicky's call only. There may be something on there that PP stated as he looked at the overall scene that they don't want the public privy to....

Or maybe PP could not get a good reception and lost connection when he placed 911 call. I did hear Rosser say that the cell phone reception in that area at times was poor.

JMO

KeyboardPlayer
09-26-2008, 04:35 PM
I thought I remember a post or something a while ago about PP using Taylor's phone to call 911 but having connection problems? If this was not the case, I wonder why they wouldn't release THAT call? I'm confused (again!) :)

KeyboardPlayer
09-26-2008, 04:35 PM
Sorry ocean, I posted before I refreshed :)

Sooner Fan#1
09-26-2008, 04:45 PM
ok, we finally jumped that hurdle...now what do we think about Peter's first interview? remember, he wouldn't speak for a couple of weeks....does he act like he knows something and is very angry and tormented? The way I see it he was directing that statement to someone in particular.....http://www.koco.com/video/16712513/

oceanblueeyes
09-26-2008, 04:51 PM
I thought I remember a post or something a while ago about PP using Taylor's phone to call 911 but having connection problems? If this was not the case, I wonder why they wouldn't release THAT call? I'm confused (again!) :)

Hi there.:)

I don't find there is anything sinister about Vicki placing the call. It is just we don't know the particulars but OSBI does imo.

I think it is very reasonable that he may have tried to use the phone and it wouldn't work. Heck I would be shaking so bad I don't think I could use the phone even if it did work. So Vicky wasn't that far away so PP ran as fast as he could back to the house, screaming for her to come and call 911. That would explain why she was telling someone on the 911 call to RUN!!! She may have been outrunning Peter since he had to run there and back.

imoo

Sooner Fan#1
09-26-2008, 04:54 PM
ITA ...watch the interview again and tell me what you think, Ocean

oceanblueeyes
09-26-2008, 04:58 PM
ok, we finally jumped that hurdle...now what do we think about Peter's first interview? remember, he wouldn't speak for a couple of weeks....does he act like he knows something and is very angry and tormented? The way I see it he was directing that statement to someone in particular.....http://www.koco.com/video/16712513/

Is this the one on the video thread?

I can't watch that video of Peter anymore. It breaks my heart. To see him so sad, begging for anyone to come forward and tell what they know.

To hear him say what keeps him going is he has faith in LE that they will solve this case only to know it is now almost 4 months and still with no justice just makes me feel so sorry for both of these families.

No, imo he has no clue who would do this and that is what he wants to know. Who could do such a thing and why. I think it haunts them all.

imoo

Sooner Fan#1
09-26-2008, 04:59 PM
http://www.koco.com/video/16712513/

Mysterylover
09-26-2008, 04:59 PM
Thanks. Ok this leads me to believe that two 911 calls were made. One made from Taylor's phone and one made from Vicki's phone as she was running down the road from their house.

They have chosen to release Vicky's call only. There may be something on there that PP stated as he looked at the overall scene that they don't want the public privy to....

Or maybe PP could not get a good reception and lost connection when he placed 911 call. I did hear Rosser say that the cell phone reception in that area at times was poor.

JMO

Ocean, I heard this question asked in one of the press conferences and Agent Brown said 'NO' only one 911 call...

I still wonder why one witness did not come forward til Thursday and the girls were murdered on Sunday....
(QUOTE)

WELEETKA -- Authorities on Thursday were interviewing a person who they said saw two Weleetka area girls just minutes before they were shot and killed on the side of a dirt road.

Oklahoma State Bureau of Investigation Special Agent Ben Rosser said authorities believe the witness is credible and that they don't believe he was involved in the shootings.

Asked if the witness saw anyone or any vehicles nearby at the time he saw the girls walking on the road, Rosser declined comment.

Investigators on Thursday also returned to the scene where two girls were found slain over the weekend.

Sooner Fan#1
09-26-2008, 04:59 PM
i think several posters posted at once...i had it posted a few posts back

oceanblueeyes
09-26-2008, 05:03 PM
Ocean, I heard this question asked in one of the press conferences and Agent Brown said 'NO' only one 911 call...

I still wonder why one witness did not come forward til Thursday and the girls were murdered on Sunday....
(QUOTE)

WELEETKA -- Authorities on Thursday were interviewing a person who they said saw two Weleetka area girls just minutes before they were shot and killed on the side of a dirt road.

Oklahoma State Bureau of Investigation Special Agent Ben Rosser said authorities believe the witness is credible and that they don't believe he was involved in the shootings.

Asked if the witness saw anyone or any vehicles nearby at the time he saw the girls walking on the road, Rosser declined comment.

Investigators on Thursday also returned to the scene where two girls were found slain over the weekend.

Now I do question that but there must have been a good reason for them not coming forward. There again that is what makes it so hard for us imo. We do not know the intricate details of the case as OSBI does.

imoo

Sooner Fan#1
09-26-2008, 05:29 PM
Ocean, empty you mailbox...I sent you a PM

Mysterylover
09-26-2008, 05:31 PM
Does anyone have a link to Vickies 911 call?...I want to listen to it again.

I'm interested in trying to figure who's voice is hollowing to Vickie that the girls are dead...

Sooner Fan#1
09-26-2008, 05:32 PM
Does anyone have a link to Vickies 911 call?...I want to listen to it again.

I'm interested in trying to figure who's voice is hollowing to Vickie that the girls are dead...

Yeah, I'll run it down for you....just so you know, there is a thread to "catch up" on this thread that absolutely is wonderful

Tom'sGirl
09-26-2008, 05:34 PM
Does anyone have a link to Vickies 911 call?...I want to listen to it again.

I'm interested in trying to figure who's voice is hollowing to Vickie that the girls are dead...
Here is the thread (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=68373)

Sooner Fan#1
09-26-2008, 05:35 PM
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=66462

Sooner Fan#1
09-26-2008, 05:36 PM
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67771

oceanblueeyes
09-26-2008, 05:41 PM
Ocean, empty you mailbox...I sent you a PM

:) done.

cloudajo
09-26-2008, 06:28 PM
I thought I remember a post or something a while ago about PP using Taylor's phone to call 911 but having connection problems? If this was not the case, I wonder why they wouldn't release THAT call? I'm confused (again!) :)

Keyboard, I could swear that about a month ago I read at the bottom of an article about something else, 1 or 2 sentences that explained the 911 mixup. I remember thinking to myself, Oh so that explains it. It was burried in the article and not a post.

I searched a bunch of articles but cannot find it. So I could be completely wrong!

And this is what Brown answered during Q&A in press conf when the 911 tape was released:

Q: Is this the only 911 call that came in?
A: To my knowledge, that’s the only 911 tape.
Q: And that call was placed from Taylor’s cell phone?
A: No. That call was placed from another cell phone. And that’s why it was so difficult finding the area because it wasn’t on a landline from which the phone call was made.

Lauren - CA
09-26-2008, 07:00 PM
If it were me, since Vicki was just 300 yards away, from seeing the girls I would have called for my spouse first letting them know what had happened. I would definitely want them there with me.

imoo

Good point. No one knows what they would do if they were in the same situation. He probably did want his spouse there for support. I'm just bothered by the report that PP did in fact use one of the girl's cell phones to dial 911.

Lauren - CA
09-26-2008, 07:17 PM
http://www.fox23.com/mediacenter/local.aspx

The first interview with Vickie. She does not want to be on camera. Only Pete is on camera.

YellowDog
09-26-2008, 07:44 PM
Can someone please enlighten me? I was just rereading the autopsy reports on both girls and it says both of their hands were in bags secured with tape. Were they found this way or was that done as a protective measure when the bodies were discoveed?

As I reread those, I still think there may be some clues in the scribblings on their bodies done with markers.

It almost appears to me that they were madder at Skla than they were at Taylor due to the number of times she was shot and the shot to her neck that appears to have been done at very close range almost as if to "finish her off".

I'm also very curious about the tattoos on Taylor. Were they self done or professionally done?

Tom'sGirl
09-26-2008, 08:09 PM
[quote]Can someone please enlighten me? I was just rereading the autopsy reports on both girls and it says both of their hands were in bags secured with tape. Were they found this way or was that done as a protective measure when the bodies were discoveed?

Standard procedure/to not contaminate DNA found under nails, other.

As I reread those, I still think there may be some clues in the scribblings on their bodies done with markers.
There may or may not mean anything, more than likely girly crush 'stuff'

It almost appears to me that they were madder at Skla than they were at Taylor due to the number of times she was shot and the shot to her neck that appears to have been done at very close range almost as if to "finish her off".
Many theories on this have been posted.

I'm also very curious about the tattoos on Taylor. Were they self done or professionally done?
Due to her age, and the cost, most likely done by a family member or friend.

Tom'sGirl
09-26-2008, 08:18 PM
http://www.fox23.com/mediacenter/local.aspx

The first interview with Vickie. She does not want to be on camera. Only Pete is on camera.
I wonder why now she doesn't want to be seen on camera when she has in the past?

Lauren - CA
09-26-2008, 09:13 PM
I wonder why now she doesn't want to be seen on camera when she has in the past?


Do you think she is afraid? In fear of her life? Or is she afraid of being ridiculed the way people have ridiculed her husband? Judging him on his appearance etc.

Lauren - CA
09-26-2008, 09:14 PM
I wonder why now she doesn't want to be seen on camera when she has in the past?

I just thought of something else. She has been on camera before but I don't believe she has ever spoken on "air". Usually she just sat there or something. Maybe she didn't feel comfortable being on camera?

YellowDog
09-26-2008, 10:32 PM
[quote=YellowDog;2742510]

Standard procedure/to not contaminate DNA found under nails, other.

There may or may not mean anything, more than likely girly crush 'stuff'

Many theories on this have been posted.

Due to her age, and the cost, most likely done by a family member or friend.


Thanks TG

Tom'sGirl
09-26-2008, 10:46 PM
Do you think she is afraid? In fear of her life? Or is she afraid of being ridiculed the way people have ridiculed her husband? Judging him on his appearance etc.
I have no idea if she's in fear or not.

Tom'sGirl
09-26-2008, 10:48 PM
I just thought of something else. She has been on camera before but I don't believe she has ever spoken on "air". Usually she just sat there or something. Maybe she didn't feel comfortable being on camera?
I can understand not wanting to be filmed. Skyla's mother hasn't been in any interviews at all.

RPS
09-26-2008, 11:05 PM
Hey Folks-

This is RPS - some of you might know me from topix. I think I'll now avoid that site for now as it has now reached unconceivable heights of immaturity among grown adults.

My latest look at the case was to review the Okmulgee Conuty Inmate roster to see if the DD and CL case was being treated differently than the others. It seems that with a 2nd degree burglary charge, someone would have bailed them out by now. And CL has a young child.

I got this far:

Jul 11 2008 District Charge
Jul 16 2008 Warrant/Felony
Jul 18 2008 DOC
Jul 18 2008 Warrant
Jul 21 2008 On Writ/OKC
Jul 22 2008 Local Hold
Jul 23 2008 Warrant/Felony
Jul 23 2008 Warrant/Felony
Jul 23 2008 Felony/Meth
Jul 23 2008 Felony/Meth
Jul 29 2008 Felony/Rape
Jul 29 2008 Drug Ct Hold
Jul 30 2008 County Hold
Jul 31 2008 DOC
Aug 1 2008 Fed Hold
Aug 1 2008 Fed Hold
Aug 1 2008 Fed Hold
Aug 1 2008 Fed Hold
Aug 5 2008 DOC
Aug 5 2008 DOC
Aug 5 2008 Felony/Burglary (2nd degree)
Aug 5 2008 Felony/Burglary (2nd degree)
Aug 6 2008 DOC

Then I received the warning:

"Only 50 inmate Records may be viewed in any 24 hour period. This activity is monitored for abuse."

I guess I have to wait before I do more inquiries on the information that they put on the public domain. Sorry!

There seems to be a pattern emerging about who they keep and who they release. And Burglary seems out of place. But hopefully they will give me more data points later.

k4kathy
09-26-2008, 11:13 PM
Can someone please enlighten me? I was just rereading the autopsy reports on both girls and it says both of their hands were in bags secured with tape. Were they found this way or was that done as a protective measure when the bodies were discoveed?

As I reread those, I still think there may be some clues in the scribblings on their bodies done with markers.

It almost appears to me that they were madder at Skla than they were at Taylor due to the number of times she was shot and the shot to her neck that appears to have been done at very close range almost as if to "finish her off".

I'm also very curious about the tattoos on Taylor. Were they self done or professionally done?
The hands are always bagged to preserve evidence.Skin under the nails,GSR,etc.Actually,I think I read something in Taylors autopsy report that indicated she was a nail biter/her nails were too short to cut.

oceanblueeyes
09-27-2008, 12:02 AM
Good point. No one knows what they would do if they were in the same situation. He probably did want his spouse there for support. I'm just bothered by the report that PP did in fact use one of the girl's cell phones to dial 911.

Better to do that imo than let the police come screaming by with their sirens on right down from her house when she knew that the girls and Peter were on that road.

imoo

oceanblueeyes
09-27-2008, 12:11 AM
http://www.fox23.com/mediacenter/local.aspx

The first interview with Vickie. She does not want to be on camera. Only Pete is on camera.

OMG! This poor woman just rips my heart out. She is so tormented by this tragedy.

God Bless her and give her strength to endure.

imoo

Claycat
09-27-2008, 12:16 AM
It is so sad, Ocean!

Welcome RPS! Welcome K4Kathy!

ArizonaGiGi
09-27-2008, 04:33 AM
Do you think she is afraid? In fear of her life? Or is she afraid of being ridiculed the way people have ridiculed her husband? Judging him on his appearance etc.

Lauren, You are right. She is afraid. The reporter states in the very beginning of the video that she doesn't want to show her face because she is afraid. Poor thing. She can barely speak.

Man it's only been 3 months but it seems like soooo much longer than that to me.

cloudajo
09-27-2008, 08:13 AM
OMG! This poor woman just rips my heart out. She is so tormented by this tragedy.

God Bless her and give her strength to endure.

imoo

Ocean, I agree about Vicky.

Lauren, thanks for posting the video.

I jotted down what it says on the billboard shown in the video (which is in Henryetta, on I40 westbound just west of 75). I don't understand why reward in big letters is only $1,000.

Billboard
Information Wanted
Pics of Taylor & Skyla
$1000 Reward (and in smaller letters: Plus over $30,000 from other sources)
Remain Anonymous!
800-635-8477; okcrimestoppers.com

OK Crimestoppers website main page:

Crime Stoppers encourages members of the community to assist local law enforcement agencies in the fight against crime by overcoming the two key elements that inhibit community involvement: fear and apathy.

Crime Stoppers provides a telephone number and Web Tips to encourage citizens in the community to volunteer vital information helpful to law enforcement agencies to fight against crime.

Callers can remain anonymous and are eligible to recieve a cash reward if the information given leads to an arrest or grand jury indictment of a felony offender.

http://oklahoma.crimestoppersweb.com/ (http://oklahoma.crimestoppersweb.com/)

cloudajo
09-27-2008, 08:14 AM
Hey Folks-

This is RPS - some of you might know me from topix. I think I'll now avoid that site for now as it has now reached unconceivable heights of immaturity among grown adults.

My latest look at the case was to review the Okmulgee Conuty Inmate roster to see if the DD and CL case was being treated differently than the others. It seems that with a 2nd degree burglary charge, someone would have bailed them out by now. And CL has a young child.

snipped

Hi RPS - glad to see you here. Thanks for the info.

Lauren - CA
09-27-2008, 08:44 AM
Welcome RPS!!! You will love it here. And one good thing, we stay on topic!!!

Lauren - CA
09-27-2008, 08:50 AM
Lauren, You are right. She is afraid. The reporter states in the very beginning of the video that she doesn't want to show her face because she is afraid. Poor thing. She can barely speak.

Man it's only been 3 months but it seems like soooo much longer than that to me.


It is hard to watch. She can barely breathe it seems. I wanted to cry when she mentioned that she can't get out of bed and wants to be with Taylor. As a mother, put yourself in her shoes.

From what she said in the video, does anyone get the impression that they are still in the dark about who committed these murders? Or do you feel that she was trying to get someone to say something that could possibly "seal the deal"? I personally think OSBI knows who did this, but they don't have the proof they need to convict. Arrest is one thing, but to make sure the person/persons who did this stay behind bars for the rest of eternity or die for it is completely another. They may not have that one thing and they need someone to come forward with it.

Lauren - CA
09-27-2008, 08:57 AM
Ocean, I agree about Vicky.

Lauren, thanks for posting the video.

I jotted down what it says on the billboard shown in the video (which is in Henryetta, on I40 westbound just west of 75). I don't understand why reward in big letters is only $1,000.

Billboard
Information Wanted
Pics of Taylor & Skyla
$1000 Reward (and in smaller letters: Plus over $30,000 from other sources)
Remain Anonymous!
800-635-8477; okcrimestoppers.com

OK Crimestoppers website main page:

Crime Stoppers encourages members of the community to assist local law enforcement agencies in the fight against crime by overcoming the two key elements that inhibit community involvement: fear and apathy.

Crime Stoppers provides a telephone number and Web Tips to encourage citizens in the community to volunteer vital information helpful to law enforcement agencies to fight against crime.

Callers can remain anonymous and are eligible to recieve a cash reward if the information given leads to an arrest or grand jury indictment of a felony offender.

http://oklahoma.crimestoppersweb.com/ (http://oklahoma.crimestoppersweb.com/)

You're very welcome cloudajo. I came by that video by accident and when I checked, I realized no one else had posted it. I wonder if I should post it in the media thread? Or has someone else done that?

Anyhow, regarding the billboard. I'm wondering if the $1000 is from Crimestoppers or whomever paid to put the billboard up and the balance is from private sources (OSBI, public donations etc.) and therefore that is why it had to be put up that way?

$1000 these days is not enough money to get anyone to talk. But we know the reward money had been listed over $40,000 in the first weeks and no one came forward. You'd think that someone would think about that kind of money, especially a young person. If someone only sees $1000 and is driving by and doesn't have time to read the part about $30,000 will they be enticed to call? Probably not.

oceanblueeyes
09-27-2008, 11:11 AM
Ocean, I agree about Vicky.

Lauren, thanks for posting the video.

I jotted down what it says on the billboard shown in the video (which is in Henryetta, on I40 westbound just west of 75). I don't understand why reward in big letters is only $1,000.

Billboard
Information Wanted
Pics of Taylor & Skyla
$1000 Reward (and in smaller letters: Plus over $30,000 from other sources)
Remain Anonymous!
800-635-8477; okcrimestoppers.com

OK Crimestoppers website main page:

Crime Stoppers encourages members of the community to assist local law enforcement agencies in the fight against crime by overcoming the two key elements that inhibit community involvement: fear and apathy.

Crime Stoppers provides a telephone number and Web Tips to encourage citizens in the community to volunteer vital information helpful to law enforcement agencies to fight against crime.

Callers can remain anonymous and are eligible to receive a cash reward if the information given leads to an arrest or grand jury indictment of a felony offender.

http://oklahoma.crimestoppersweb.com/ (http://oklahoma.crimestoppersweb.com/)

Good Morning cloudajo and Everyone!

Do we know who paid for the Billboard? Those can be quite expensive. I hope someone donated money so they could see that this was done.

Peter also seems so lost. I think it has been very hard for him too...not only losing Taylor and Skyla this way but feeling so helpless when he sees Vicki coming apart at the seams. Both of these families need to know who did this and why. They need to see that justice has been done for Taylor and Skyla.

imo

frogjustfrog
09-27-2008, 11:18 AM
Good Morning cloudajo and Everyone!

Do we know who paid for the Billboard? Those can be quite expensive. I hope someone donated money so they could see that this was done.

Peter also seems so lost. I think it has been very hard for him too...not only losing Taylor and Skyla this way but feeling so helpless when he sees Vicki coming apart at the seams. Both of these families need to know who did this and why. They need to see that justice has been done for Taylor and Skyla.

imo

I agree with you. And it just breaks my heart to feel the pain that they are feeling! I just wish there was something I could do for them. I know we all feel that way.
Has anyone made a connection with the fires? Were the fires targeted at people who are suspects... or maybe just random, trying to give locals something to focus on besides the criminals? It seems someone in that town is harboring a lot of hate! I dont understand this behavior! Someone needs alot of help!

oceanblueeyes
09-27-2008, 11:41 AM
You're very welcome cloudajo. I came by that video by accident and when I checked, I realized no one else had posted it. I wonder if I should post it in the media thread? Or has someone else done that?

Anyhow, regarding the billboard. I'm wondering if the $1000 is from Crimestoppers or whomever paid to put the billboard up and the balance is from private sources (OSBI, public donations etc.) and therefore that is why it had to be put up that way?

$1000 these days is not enough money to get anyone to talk. But we know the reward money had been listed over $40,000 in the first weeks and no one came forward. You'd think that someone would think about that kind of money, especially a young person. If someone only sees $1000 and is driving by and doesn't have time to read the part about $30,000 will they be enticed to call? Probably not.

We have crimestoppers in my town and I believe the reward is $1500.00 and there have been plenty of crimes solved from tipsters calling in and some of them were murder cases. I think it depends on the person who knows something and whether a thousand bucks is something they need. I have always felt this case will be solved if a younger person speaks up and $1000 is a lot of money to them especially if they may be poor or have no jobs.

So it does give me a little glimmer of hope that someone will do the right thing. They truly can remain anonymous and no one knows they collected the money. They don't even have to agree to testify in the case.

I would think that if any of them called into Crimestoppers that CSs would tell them there is also another reward of over $30K

imoo

oceanblueeyes
09-27-2008, 11:50 AM
I agree with you. And it just breaks my heart to feel the pain that they are feeling! I just wish there was something I could do for them. I know we all feel that way.
Has anyone made a connection with the fires? Were the fires targeted at people who are suspects... or maybe just random, trying to give locals something to focus on besides the criminals? It seems someone in that town is harboring a lot of hate! I don't understand this behavior! Someone needs alot of help!

Morning frog,

They will never be whole again.....their lives are forever changed and shattered now but I do think if they could just find out who did this to the girls and why it would bring them some relief. It has got to be sheer torture for the families to know that no one is paying for what they have done to these innocent girls.

Like PP said it won't bring them back but they need to know who and why this happened.

I can understand Vicki being afraid. The killer or killers are still out there and no one knows if they know them are not. That has to be frightening for all in Weleetka. Do they people see these killers everyday thinking they are just a part of their community that means no harm? It has got to be nerve wracking for these families.



imoo

Boots-OK
09-27-2008, 02:21 PM
http://www.newsok.com/article/3302941

This is a link to who paid for the billboard. Crimestoppers and Lamar Sign Company.

KeyboardPlayer
09-27-2008, 02:29 PM
Hi there Boots! Thanks for posting the link... :)
Cheers,
KP

Boots-OK
09-27-2008, 03:05 PM
"She said someone in the community who likely drives the Interstate 40 route knows something about the deaths. It is hoped the billboard will serve as a constant reminder of the slayings and will work on somebody's conscience", she said.

Howdy, Kbd...having a good Saturday, I hope... The above is a Jessica Brown quote from the linked article.

Sorry to say it again, but, I find the need for the billboard to be discouraging. My hopes were that they were closer to an arrest...guess not?

Since they aren't - the billboard is a good idea - I agree with the other posters, though, why is the $30K not bolded and highlighted. Oh well, these people (Lamar Advertising) have done this for years and know what works I guess.

KeyboardPlayer
09-27-2008, 03:15 PM
Yeah, I find it discouraging too, really... But then again, I haven't completely ruled out the possibility that the billboard may only be part of their strategy, and they actually MAY be closer than we think to figuring this one out, but they don't want people to know that. Granted, that is a very REMOTE possibility in my mind. I agree with you, though, the $30k should be on there in very BIG, BOLD LETTERS.

So far so good this weekend, Boots... Hope you're having a great weekend as well!
Cheers,
KP

cloudajo
09-27-2008, 06:02 PM
Thanks for info and thoughts everyone.

Here's another article with a pic of the billboard and a video.

Lamar manager said they hope to leave billboard in that location for 3-5 months and then move it to another location if necessary.

Video also has Peter Placker thanking them and saying he hopes it helps.

http://www.kjrh.com/content/news/2viewgc/story.aspx?content_id=0b8bbecd-07c9-4453-a647-177f4ed6474f

cloudajo
09-27-2008, 10:20 PM
Sorry, last one.

So again, Crime Stoppers approached Lamar and asked if they would put up billboard. Brown is calling it a “new medium” for the OSBI. Yikes.

snips

The billboard, on the north side of I-40 a mile west of the U.S. 75 interchange, is a joint effort by Oklahoma Crime Stoppers and Lamar Outdoor Advertising of Tulsa to help solve the nearly 4-month-old case.

Lamar spokesman Pat Selcer said Crime Stoppers approached the company to ask if it was interested in posting the reward information. Lamar quickly agreed and designed the ad. "We've done this before on other Oklahoma cases, and we've done this in other states using digital billboards," Selcer said. "You'd be surprised how effective these are."

He said he didn't know how much Lamar spent on the billboard but noted that the monthly advertising fee at the location is $600. Lamar is absorbing the costs.

Oklahoma State Bureau of Investigation spokeswoman Jessica Brown welcomed the billboard as another tool in the hunt for the killers of Skyla Jade Whitaker, 11, and Taylor Paschal-Placker, 13. Brown called it a "new medium" for the OSBI.

"We've always believed that someone close to the killers knows something, and hopefully the billboard will wear on them to the point they come forward and help solve this case," she said.

http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?articleID=20080927_12_A14_ALamar46205 4 (http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?articleID=20080927_12_A14_ALamar46205 4)

RPS
09-27-2008, 11:06 PM
Sorry, last one.

So again, Crime Stoppers approached Lamar and asked if they would put up billboard. Brown is calling it a “new medium” for the OSBI. Yikes.

snips

The billboard, on the north side of I-40 a mile west of the U.S. 75 interchange, is a joint effort by Oklahoma Crime Stoppers and Lamar Outdoor Advertising of Tulsa to help solve the nearly 4-month-old case.

Lamar spokesman Pat Selcer said Crime Stoppers approached the company to ask if it was interested in posting the reward information. Lamar quickly agreed and designed the ad. "We've done this before on other Oklahoma cases, and we've done this in other states using digital billboards," Selcer said. "You'd be surprised how effective these are."

He said he didn't know how much Lamar spent on the billboard but noted that the monthly advertising fee at the location is $600. Lamar is absorbing the costs.

Oklahoma State Bureau of Investigation spokeswoman Jessica Brown welcomed the billboard as another tool in the hunt for the killers of Skyla Jade Whitaker, 11, and Taylor Paschal-Placker, 13. Brown called it a "new medium" for the OSBI.

"We've always believed that someone close to the killers knows something, and hopefully the billboard will wear on them to the point they come forward and help solve this case," she said.

http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?articleID=20080927_12_A14_ALamar46205 4 (http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?articleID=20080927_12_A14_ALamar46205 4)

Cloudajo-

This is my interpretation of this. I know that other forums have interpreted this as a desperation move by the OSBI. But I don't think that the OSBI had anything to do with this except to give it's final stamp of approval.

Scenario only:
With the economy being slow, Lamar had a billboard that was not bringing in revenue. Let's face it, they probably did not kick off a paying client off the billboard to do this. It was vacant or left over from an expired contract. They are as upset with this case as we are. They then approached crimestoppers to get involved, not to mention the free advertising (and good will) they got in the newspaper (therefore tax write-off?). And I suggest no nefarious intentions here, but just a win-win situation for all involved. OSBI approved- and why not? A little extra help can't hurt and it only stenghthens their case they did every thing they could to look at other options. Scenario only.

cloudajo
09-28-2008, 12:34 AM
Cloudajo-

This is my interpretation of this. I know that other forums have interpreted this as a desperation move by the OSBI. But I don't think that the OSBI had anything to do with this except to give it's final stamp of approval.

Scenario only:
With the economy being slow, Lamar had a billboard that was not bringing in revenue. Let's face it, they probably did not kick off a paying client off the billboard to do this. It was vacant or left over from an expired contract. They are as upset with this case as we are. They then approached crimestoppers to get involved, not to mention the free advertising (and good will) they got in the newspaper (therefore tax write-off?). And I suggest no nefarious intentions here, but just a win-win situation for all involved. OSBI approved- and why not? A little extra help can't hurt and it only stenghthens their case they did every thing they could to look at other options. Scenario only.

RPS, good points! I'm being overly critical. :)

RPS
09-28-2008, 11:21 AM
Interesting quote from DD's Mom on her myspace:

"Some day he will be sorry, some day when he is free, memories will remind him of what he used to be."

oceanblueeyes
09-28-2008, 12:09 PM
Interesting quote from DD's Mom on her myspace:

"Some day he will be sorry, some day when he is free, memories will remind him of what he used to be."

Very interesting indeed.

imo

Albert18
09-28-2008, 12:09 PM
If the killers were young and local and if LE doesn't know who did this, which I think is the case, then LE seriously muffed this investigation at the beginning.

I hate to see them at a point where the only way this case can be solved is if somebody talks. That is beyond depressing.

I'm glad to hear Vickie talking. Now she needs to convince Rose to join her and they need to take it up a notch. I would only give this current campaign a bit more time and then if I were them I would start seeking help in going around the current investigators.

oceanblueeyes
09-28-2008, 12:41 PM
If the killers were young and local and if LE doesn't know who did this, which I think is the case, then LE seriously muffed this investigation at the beginning.

I hate to see them at a point where the only way this case can be solved is if somebody talks. That is beyond depressing.

I'm glad to hear Vickie talking. Now she needs to convince Rose to join her and they need to take it up a notch. I would only give this current campaign a bit more time and then if I were them I would start seeking help in going around the current investigators.

I am not so sure I believe that is the case at all. I think OSBI does have suspects in mind and have since early on. However like many Cold Case detectives have said that they did not have the evidence they needed to take it to trial at the time. Many times the actually perpetrators will be the ones that LE suspected back then, all along.

What I see is they have plenty of forensic evidence but those findings involve the girls and their DNA. Imo, what they are lacking is the forensic evidence to tie the perps to this crime. If this case is ever solved or a new type of forensic testing reveals more than the testing of today's standards, I do believe OSBI will have been right and these killers are local and able to blend in to their own community. I also believe that they will be young killers when the crime happened. (late teens-early 20s)

This case will be solved by one or two things or both. New type of forensic testing done. A tip from someone who is very knowledgeable about the perps and what happened that day. Sometimes it takes years for those kind of witnesses to come forward out of fear of the killers.

But imo OSBI does think they know who did this........they just can't prove it sufficiently enough for a trial. I certainly hope they will get a break. I think that is all they need and are waiting for. That one call where they know for certain the person they talk to has the information they need.

imoo

cloudajo
09-28-2008, 03:39 PM
I am not so sure I believe that is the case at all. I think OSBI does have suspects in mind and have since early on. However like many Cold Case detectives have said that they did not have the evidence they needed to take it to trial at the time. Many times the actually perpetrators will be the ones that LE suspected back then, all along.

What I see is they have plenty of forensic evidence but those findings involve the girls and their DNA. Imo, what they are lacking is the forensic evidence to tie the perps to this crime. If this case is ever solved or a new type of forensic testing reveals more than the testing of today's standards, I do believe OSBI will have been right and these killers are local and able to blend in to their own community. I also believe that they will be young killers when the crime happened. (late teens-early 20s)

This case will be solved by one or two things or both. New type of forensic testing done. A tip from someone who is very knowledgeable about the perps and what happened that day. Sometimes it takes years for those kind of witnesses to come forward out of fear of the killers.

But imo OSBI does think they know who did this........they just can't prove it sufficiently enough for a trial. I certainly hope they will get a break. I think that is all they need and are waiting for. That one call where they know for certain the person they talk to has the information they need.

imoo

Ocean, good thoughts. Other than releasing 911 call, setting up roadblock, using GJ, just going out and talking to people, billboard, etc. is there anything else they can do to compel someone to come forward if they are either fearful, don't want to get involved, or want to protect someone?

cloudajo
09-28-2008, 03:46 PM
Here is a pic of the judge presiding over Cody & Dustyn's current burglary charges:

Cynthia Pickering - Special Judge (Okmulgee County)
http://www.oscn.net/applications/oscn/start.asp?viewType=COUNTYINFO&county=OKMULGEE

Here is a pic of the DA - Thomas Giulioli (Okmulgee County)
http://www.ok.gov/dac/District_Attorneys/District_25/

Question: If at some point there are charges filed against a person(s) for the murders, would one of these judges preside over the trial or no?

cloudajo
09-28-2008, 03:47 PM
Interesting quote from DD's Mom on her myspace:

"Some day he will be sorry, some day when he is free, memories will remind him of what he used to be."

I wonder what happened at the preliminary hearing on 9/18.

little726
09-28-2008, 03:55 PM
Interesting quote from DD's Mom on her myspace:

"Some day he will be sorry, some day when he is free, memories will remind him of what he used to be."

Hi RPS and welcome to WS.

Do you have the link handy to DD's mother's MySpace page?

oceanblueeyes
09-28-2008, 04:11 PM
Ocean, good thoughts. Other than releasing 911 call, setting up roadblock, using GJ, just going out and talking to people, billboard, etc. is there anything else they can do to compel someone to come forward if they are either fearful, don't want to get involved, or want to protect someone?

Thank you.

I think at this time that is all they can do. They are trying to keep these girls in the memories of the people who live in those surrounding communities. They are trying to keep the message out there that the killers still runs loose and most of all they want that certain someone to see the haunting photos of those murdered little girls hoping and praying it sparks some semblance of compassion and decency in them.

Sometimes the wheel of justice moves slowly but it does move and there is no limitation on murder. It has become a waiting game now. I do think that the four OSBI agents still assigned to this case work it daily and are always looking for new avenues that may bring them to these horrid people.

Maybe by calling certain people to testify in the GJ was done as a mind game. To let them know that one day OSBI will be closer than ever before. They may have wanted to make them very nervous hoping they would run and tell someone the real story. I am just using that as an example. Many times a DA uses a GJ as an investigative tool and is not seeking an indictment at that time. Whatever they may have said in a GJ under oath they are locked in with that now and if any deviation is discovered it heightens the suspicion of LE and they will keep coming back applying pressure.

imoo

RPS
09-28-2008, 08:21 PM
Hi RPS and welcome to WS.

Do you have the link handy to DD's mother's MySpace page?

Thanks for the welcome!

Here it is, I got this from Cloudajo:
http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=392120703

Bills Sidenote: little726, we are 4-0!!!

frogjustfrog
09-28-2008, 08:31 PM
Thanks for the welcome!

Here it is, I got this from Cloudajo:
http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=392120703

Bills Sidenote: little726, we are 4-0!!!

RPS! So nice to see you join us here. The biggest reason I have even been reading a different forum lately, was to read your posts. Welcome to WS! Glad your're here! :grouphug:

little726
09-28-2008, 09:51 PM
Thanks for the welcome!

Here it is, I got this from Cloudajo:
http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=392120703

Bills Sidenote: little726, we are 4-0!!!

Thanks, RPS.

:dance: :dance: :dance: YEP....4-0. GO BILLS!!!

Ruflossn
09-28-2008, 11:03 PM
RPS! So nice to see you join us here. The biggest reason I have even been reading a different forum lately, was to read your posts. Welcome to WS! Glad your're here! :grouphug:

I was doing the same thing Frog. So glad that I no longer have to subject myself to the other thread.................... :)

frogjustfrog
09-28-2008, 11:13 PM
very interesting remark on DD's mom's page. This is looking more and more like an anger issue! Isnt that a shame! I am lost for words!

Albert18
09-29-2008, 03:38 PM
By their actions, LE has lead us to believe they have dna evidence. If they have names and dna, this case shouldn't still be in limbo.

Therefore, they must not have names and/or they don't have dna. Or fingerprints.

With the emphasis on somebody giving them a tip, I believe this is what they are telling us. They either don't have the names or they don't have the physical evidence they need. Something must really be lacking.

If there were two shooters and they were young they should be able to scare one of them into helping them. I see no evidence of them doing this.
They seem to be trying to reach out to somebody who knows something but wasn't a part of the shootings. Which suggests to me they don't have a good idea of the identity of the shooters.

Ruflossn
09-29-2008, 03:53 PM
By their actions, LE has lead us to believe they have dna evidence. If they have names and dna, this case shouldn't still be in limbo.

Therefore, they must not have names and/or they don't have dna. Or fingerprints.

With the emphasis on somebody giving them a tip, I believe this is what they are telling us. They either don't have the names or they don't have the physical evidence they need. Something must really be lacking.

If there were two shooters and they were young they should be able to scare one of them into helping them. I see no evidence of them doing this.
They seem to be trying to reach out to somebody who knows something but wasn't a part of the shootings. Which suggests to me they don't have a good idea of the identity of the shooters.


Albert, I totally agree w/ your analysis. I believe they have DNA but, I do not think it matches any DNA that has been previously entered into the data base. I also am not convinced there are 2 shooters. If there were, I believe we would have had one "turning" on the other. Just as you stated above. I think the 911 call and the billboard are to try and beget an emotional response out of someone. I hope the ploy works.

Albert18
09-29-2008, 03:57 PM
We also need to be careful of just thinking the killers must have been young and local as this case shows.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,425696,00.html

"Police all along thought the killer was a teen in the neighborhood, likely someone Marcia knew. They were so certain, in fact, that they arrested someone who fit that profile, the one the FBI conjured up.

Then they dropped the case and admitted they had the wrong man.

But they stuck unwaveringly to their theory for a third of a century, and that hammered home a message: Fear thy neighbor."

RPS
09-29-2008, 04:53 PM
Two more names- see June 14 comment:

http://www.myspace.com/littlerey87

Anyone know anything about these guys and where they live?



BTW- I owe some folks some PM responses that I hope to get to tonight.

OKCrimestoppers
09-29-2008, 05:24 PM
Crime Stoppers USA has an agreement with Lamar Outdoor Advertising to assist us with certain cases for no cost. The people at Lamar in Tulsa had the billboards in that area and were wonderful to work with. Also, in areas where Lamar has digital billboards they work with law enforcement on Amber Alert and on wanted posters.

When the billboard was put up in Henryetta there were certain guidelines that had to be met. One of the main guidelines is, Crime Stoppers offers up to a $1,000 reward leading to an arrest. Since this billboard is from Crime Stoppers the $1,000 had to be prominent. The $30,000 is from other sources and the anonymity does not go along with the $30,000. The anonymity only goes with the $1,000.

Crime Stoppers of Oklahoma worked with OSBI in making sure the billboard was placed in an area it would get the most impact. They do know that someone in the area knows who did it. It is our hope that this will help induce someone to call in with information.

Crime Stoppers of Oklahoma has started a Youtube site and our website at www.okcrimestoppers.com has anonymous web tips. I hope this has helped answer any questions.

frogjustfrog
09-29-2008, 06:06 PM
Crime Stoppers USA has an agreement with Lamar Outdoor Advertising to assist us with certain cases for no cost. The people at Lamar in Tulsa had the billboards in that area and were wonderful to work with. Also, in areas where Lamar has digital billboards they work with law enforcement on Amber Alert and on wanted posters.

When the billboard was put up in Henryetta there were certain guidelines that had to be met. One of the main guidelines is, Crime Stoppers offers up to a $1,000 reward leading to an arrest. Since this billboard is from Crime Stoppers the $1,000 had to be prominent. The $30,000 is from other sources and the anonymity does not go along with the $30,000. The anonymity only goes with the $1,000.

Crime Stoppers of Oklahoma worked with OSBI in making sure the billboard was placed in an area it would get the most impact. They do know that someone in the area knows who did it. It is our hope that this will help induce someone to call in with information.

Crime Stoppers of Oklahoma has started a Youtube site and our website at www.okcrimestoppers.com (http://www.okcrimestoppers.com) has anonymous web tips. I hope this has helped answer any questions.

Thank you so much for posting this information. It answers alot of questions which have been asked on this forum, and others. We all appreciate Lamar and Crimestoppers for this billboard, and hope for an answer in this brutal crime.
Sincerely,
Someone who cares deeply

RPS
09-29-2008, 08:33 PM
Interesting quote from DD's Mom on her myspace:

"Some day he will be sorry, some day when he is free, memories will remind him of what he used to be."

The comment is now removed, of course.

Lauren - CA
09-29-2008, 08:44 PM
The comment is now removed, of course.


I'm hoping the LE/OSBI got to see it first.

RPS
09-29-2008, 08:44 PM
Who is this "Aaron"? He's friends with MG (ICEMAN). This is not Aaron G.


http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=416455645

little726
09-29-2008, 08:56 PM
The comment is now removed, of course.

LOL...That's not surprising. At any one time, there's 800 plus people on this website.

You never know who's lurking :eek:!

Tom'sGirl
09-29-2008, 09:00 PM
LOL...That's not surprising. At any one time, there's 800 plus people on this website.

You never know who's lurking :eek:!
You've got that right, anyone can read here........as of now the stats are:

Currently Active Users (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/online.php): 879 (343 members and 536 guests)

frogjustfrog
09-29-2008, 09:02 PM
Who is this "Aaron"? He's friends with MG (ICEMAN). This is not Aaron G.


http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=416455645

Are you sure that isnt AG? Seems they each have several myspaces.

As far as the comment is concerned, people often change them daily... even several times a day, to show what kind of a mood they are in, but it wouldnt suprise me if they read this forum. Alot of people know about these forums. Ya think?

RPS
09-29-2008, 09:03 PM
/// NEWS FLASH ///

"WINDY ESPINOSA" from the GJ was arrested yesterday:

http://okokmulgee.jailsoftware.com/inmateroster.asp

Tom'sGirl
09-29-2008, 09:06 PM
/// NEWS FLASH ///

"WINDY ESPINOSA" from the GJ was arrested yesterday:

http://okokmulgee.jailsoftware.com/inmateroster.asp
WoW, I knew she was hefty, but 210 lbs :eek:

RPS
09-29-2008, 09:17 PM
Are you sure that isnt AG? Seems they each have several myspaces.



I think the image of total jock to total pothead would be difficult to pull off:

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=388706692

Boots-OK
09-29-2008, 09:28 PM
/// NEWS FLASH ///

"WINDY ESPINOSA" from the GJ was arrested yesterday:

http://okokmulgee.jailsoftware.com/inmateroster.asp

Thanks, RPS - you're all over it!

Evan's Mom
09-29-2008, 11:01 PM
You guys are doing such amazing work and I know it's a matter of time before Taylor and Skyla's killers are brought to justice.
I just wanted to stop by and show some appreciation.
While I don't post in the forum, it was the reason I joined WS.
Thanks guys.

Lauren - CA
09-29-2008, 11:41 PM
Look at the one for Dustin Osmond. Why is there no info in it? Arrest was today.

Lauren - CA
09-29-2008, 11:43 PM
I think the image of total jock to total pothead would be difficult to pull off:

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=388706692


How can you even read anything on that page???

RPS, this is OT but what do you do for a living?? LOL. How do you find all this stuff?

Lauren - CA
09-29-2008, 11:48 PM
RPS, What does DOC Contract mean??

oceanblueeyes
09-29-2008, 11:59 PM
Albert, I totally agree w/ your analysis. I believe they have DNA but, I do not think it matches any DNA that has been previously entered into the data base. I also am not convinced there are 2 shooters. If there were, I believe we would have had one "turning" on the other. Just as you stated above. I think the 911 call and the billboard are to try and beget an emotional response out of someone. I hope the ploy works.

Hi Ruflossn!

When they said that it was very early in the investigation. I think they were hoping since they had bullet casings that it might yield fingerprints. However it really is very hard to obtain prints off of such a small casing and the casing has oils that can come from the gun being cleaned and that will destroy prints. Also they may have thought DNA would be found under the girls fingernails. That may have not panned out or the DNA may have been too degraded. Personally I don't think the killers ever touched the girls.

At first I thought it was one shooter but over time it just makes more sense to me that it was two who shot almost in tandem and fled quickly.

I am not ruling anyone in or anybody out except family members but I do think that when these killers are found they will be young in age...from 18 to 20ish.

imoo

oceanblueeyes
09-30-2008, 12:01 AM
/// NEWS FLASH ///

"WINDY ESPINOSA" from the GJ was arrested yesterday:

http://okokmulgee.jailsoftware.com/inmateroster.asp

Wow, think LE is trying to rachet up the pressure some?

black poodle
09-30-2008, 01:49 AM
i read or heard somewhere that Pete and Vickie moved is this true? i certantely would not blame them if they did. I wonder who Vicki is so afraid of its not like if these people are local that they don't know who she is, just wondering why she didn't want her face shown on camera. Has Skyla's parents made a public statement yet? I would think maybe if they were more vocal this case would get the attention it deserves. These b@$(#%#* need to be caught and locked up before they hurt anyone else, I would be scared to death id I lived near there

Ruflossn
09-30-2008, 02:43 AM
Hi Ruflossn!

When they said that it was very early in the investigation. I think they were hoping since they had bullet casings that it might yield fingerprints. However it really is very hard to obtain prints off of such a small casing and the casing has oils that can come from the gun being cleaned and that will destroy prints. Also they may have thought DNA would be found under the girls fingernails. That may have not panned out or the DNA may have been too degraded. Personally I don't think the killers ever touched the girls.

At first I thought it was one shooter but over time it just makes more sense to me that it was two who shot almost in tandem and fled quickly.

I am not ruling anyone in or anybody out except family members but I do think that when these killers are found they will be young in age...from 18 to 20ish.

imoo

Hi Ocean~
Excellent post as always.
Where do you think the POI fits into all of this? He is described as older than 18 -20.

Flossie

Ruflossn
09-30-2008, 02:44 AM
Wow, think LE is trying to rachet up the pressure some?

My thoughts exactly.
What were the charges that Ms. Espinoza incurred? I looked at the website and could not decipher it................

frogjustfrog
09-30-2008, 04:51 AM
I think the image of total jock to total pothead would be difficult to pull off:

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=388706692

I could see it happening quite easliy. I grew up in the area. Sounds like alot of kids from that area. They think the pot thing makes them kewl.

Ruflossn
09-30-2008, 07:28 AM
This is what Windy Espinoza has been charged with:
"CITY OF OKMULGEE CHARGES"

It seems like a pretty generic charge. Any thoughts?

cloudajo
09-30-2008, 07:34 AM
This is what Windy Espinoza has been charged with:
"CITY OF OKMULGEE CHARGES"

It seems like a pretty generic charge. Any thoughts?

Flossie, interesting. I guess we have to wait and see when it shows up in court records?

Ruflossn
09-30-2008, 07:36 AM
Flossie, interesting. I guess we have to wait and see when it shows up in court records?
Good Morning Cloud~
Yes, I guess we will have to wait. Patience is not my strong suit. lol

cloudajo
09-30-2008, 07:37 AM
I could see it happening quite easliy. I grew up in the area. Sounds like alot of kids from that area. They think the pot thing makes them kewl.

Frog, good point.

Here is the info for each “Aaron” page. Note sign up date and last login of first one. Open the link for a closeup pic of each. Do we think these the same guy or not?

aaron
Male
18 years old
HENRYETTA, Oklahoma
United States
Sign Up Date: 6/11/2008
Last Login: 6/22/2008

my name is aaron, and i am athletic, and relaxed and i am 18 yrs. of age

Close Up Pic: http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=viewImage&friendID=388706692&albumID=408874&imageID=2004138 (http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=viewImage&friendID=388706692&albumID=408874&imageID=2004138)


Aaron
"what up"
Male
18 years old
HENRYETTA, Oklahoma
United States
Sign Up Date: 09/24/08
Last Login: 9/29/2008

I am 18 yrs of age, and i love football, and i just like hanging out with friends

Close Up Pic: http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=viewImage&friendID=416455645&albumID=0&imageID=991035 (http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=viewImage&friendID=416455645&albumID=0&imageID=991035)

cloudajo
09-30-2008, 07:40 AM
RPS, good find on the myspace.

So that was posted June 14th.

Nick Burden (Audrey's little brother)
Jeremy Wilbanks

I couldn't find anything on them, has anyone? Maybe someone on Topix would know the names.

cloudajo
09-30-2008, 07:45 AM
Good Morning Cloud~
Yes, I guess we will have to wait. Patience is not my strong suit. lol

Hi Flossie, me neither!

cloudajo
09-30-2008, 08:01 AM
i read or heard somewhere that Pete and Vickie moved is this true? i certantely would not blame them if they did. I wonder who Vicki is so afraid of its not like if these people are local that they don't know who she is, just wondering why she didn't want her face shown on camera. Has Skyla's parents made a public statement yet? I would think maybe if they were more vocal this case would get the attention it deserves. These b@$(#%#* need to be caught and locked up before they hurt anyone else, I would be scared to death id I lived near there

black poodle, I believe Skyla's father was in a news video within this past month.

cloudajo
09-30-2008, 08:09 AM
Hey everyone,

I have a summary of early (June) rumors/hearsay/News Report/OSBI Press Conf.

Should I post it in here or create a separate thread so we can reference when needed? It doesn't really fit into Rumors thread since it's a combo.

Ruflossn
09-30-2008, 08:20 AM
Hey everyone,

I have a summary of early (June) rumors/hearsay/News Report/OSBI Press Conf.

Should I post it in here or create a separate thread so we can reference when needed? It doesn't really fit into Rumors thread since it's a combo.

I like the idea of a new thread. Maybe we could have one for each month since the girls murders? jmo.

oceanblueeyes
09-30-2008, 08:55 AM
i read or heard somewhere that Pete and Vickie moved is this true? i certainly would not blame them if they did. I wonder who Vicki is so afraid of its not like if these people are local that they don't know who she is, just wondering why she didn't want her face shown on camera. Has Skyla's parents made a public statement yet? I would think maybe if they were more vocal this case would get the attention it deserves. These b@$(#%#* need to be caught and locked up before they hurt anyone else, I would be scared to death id I lived near there

I think they have moved. I understand why.

I think these families are scared to death. I can't even begin to comprehend my child and her friend being brutally murdered but what is just as torturous is they have no clue who the monsters are but they know they still remain loose. They really have to be fearful of people that even pretend to be their friends as well as others they don't know well in their community. How in the world do they know who to trust?

I do think OSBI is right and it is someone from that community or surrounding community.

I don't believe Rose has made a public statement. Her husband who had adopted Skyla has talked on occasion like Pete Placker has done.

I can certainly see why they are fearful and the entire community too. If this can happen to Skyla and Taylor this can happen to anyone.

I pray someone breaks and can't live with what they know or what they did. Maybe OSBI can ratchet up the pressure on some that they have suspicions about.

imoo

oceanblueeyes
09-30-2008, 09:08 AM
Hi Ocean~
Excellent post as always.
Where do you think the POI fits into all of this? He is described as older than 18 -20.

Flossie

Good Morning, Flossie and Everyone!

Well I tell you this...more and more I am wanting to know who gave the most information to assist the artist with this composite. We really don't know if he went back to each one of them and asked them if the sketch was right.

Did one person say they saw him this well and the others just saw him from afar? I sure would like to know the answer to that one. lol

I do think he fits into this somewhere though but I don't think he is in his 30s but younger..maybe 20s. I think he may have been on that road with the killers. Either meeting with them for some reason but something that makes them all be on that road at the same time right at the crime scene area.

imoo

YellowDog
09-30-2008, 11:08 AM
Good Morning, Flossie and Everyone!

Well I tell you this...more and more I am wanting to know who gave the most information to assist the artist with this composite. We really don't know if he went back to each one of them and asked them if the sketch was right.

Did one person say they saw him this well and the others just saw him from afar? I sure would like to know the answer to that one. lol

I do think he fits into this somewhere though but I don't think he is in his 30s but younger..maybe 20s. I think he may have been on that road with the killers. Either meeting with them for some reason but something that makes them all be on that road at the same time right at the crime scene area.

imoo


At this point, I'm not even convinced there is a POI. If there was and he was local, it just seems like he would have been identified by now.

I know this is far out, but could the girls have witnessed a murder? This would certainly give reason for assassinations.

YellowDog
09-30-2008, 11:10 AM
And, if they did, could it be intertwined with one of those other 50 or so unsolved cases in the area?

frogjustfrog
09-30-2008, 02:09 PM
in re: cloudajo's post #233.... certainly looks like the same person to me! I'm betting it is.

RPS
09-30-2008, 05:26 PM
/// NEWS FLASH ///

"WINDY ESPINOSA" from the GJ was arrested yesterday:

http://okokmulgee.jailsoftware.com/inmateroster.asp

And now it looks like she has been released...

RPS
09-30-2008, 05:34 PM
RPS, What does DOC Contract mean??

The way it was explained to me was that inmates can be imprisoned at this jail under contract from the OK Dept of Corrections. The DOC has a contract with the jail to house inmates for some dollar amount per day (In Tulsa, I think the rate was $80/day). So inmates imprisoned at the Okmulgee jail under the DOC Contract probably came from other jurisdictions (state level convictions or perhaps other counties that don't have large prisons). At least, this is my understanding as it was explained to me.

As a sidenote, Okmulgee has about the 10th largest county prison in OK and can house 228 inmates (as of today, there were 153 inmates). Okfuskee is one of the smallest and can house 25.

RPS
09-30-2008, 05:48 PM
in re: cloudajo's post #233.... certainly looks like the same person to me! I'm betting it is.

Yep, that's him. I 'm relieved because throwing another "Aaron" in the picture could have got confusing. He certainly had an image makeover.

Cloudajo- Thanks again, you are THE myspace wizard. --RPS

Ruflossn
09-30-2008, 05:53 PM
And now it looks like she has been released...

Hi RPS~
Did you ever figure out exactly why she had been arrested?

Flossie

RPS
09-30-2008, 06:17 PM
Hi RPS~
Did you ever figure out exactly why she had been arrested?

Flossie

Hmmm...sounded like a trumped-up charge to me - jaywalking? I think that Okmulgee updates its ODCR on the first Thursday on the month. If that's true, we should see something there by this Thursday, OCT 2.

RPS
09-30-2008, 06:58 PM
Sorry, one more observation--

I just noticed that there is a cell phone tower, that would have been probably the only tower providing the service to the girls' cell phones throughout the whole incident. It is located near the intersection of Route 75 and E1140 (on mapquest), southwest of the crime. Generally, there is recorded data for the "pings" that occur regularly between a tower and phone. This data includes the phone number, time, and strength of the ping. Judging by the strength of the ping, one can estimate the distance of the phone from the tower, but this can be distorted by a lot of other variables. But that strength may be able to tell LE something.

For example, a sudden increase in strength that remains could have indicated that the girls left their house. As they walked north to the bridge, the ping strength would decrease (and a tower north on Route 40 might have been able to pick up their ping). As they returned south, the ping strength would increase. Based on this data, LE should be able to construct quite the timeline of events. In addition, they would have the numbers of anyone having cell phones in the area at that time. In this way, they could corroborate witness stores, and identify others who may have been in the area who have not come forward. And they should be able to identify who was traveling through that area, as opposed to staying in a single place during that time. And this isn't a very populated area, so there the number of phones/people to check are limited.

When I realized this, it just made me more confident that OSBI has a pretty idea where they are going with this case.

cloudajo
09-30-2008, 07:48 PM
Sorry, one more observation--

I just noticed that there is a cell phone tower, that would have been probably the only tower providing the service to the girls' cell phones throughout the whole incident. It is located near the intersection of Route 75 and E1140 (on mapquest), southwest of the crime. Generally, there is recorded data for the "pings" that occur regularly between a tower and phone. This data includes the phone number, time, and strength of the ping. Judging by the strength of the ping, one can estimate the distance of the phone from the tower, but this can be distorted by a lot of other variables. But that strength may be able to tell LE something.

For example, a sudden increase in strength that remains could have indicated that the girls left their house. As they walked north to the bridge, the ping strength would decrease (and a tower north on Route 40 might have been able to pick up their ping). As they returned south, the ping strength would increase. Based on this data, LE should be able to construct quite the timeline of events. In addition, they would have the numbers of anyone having cell phones in the area at that time. In this way, they could corroborate witness stores, and identify others who may have been in the area who have not come forward. And they should be able to identify who was traveling through that area, as opposed to staying in a single place during that time. And this isn't a very populated area, so there the number of phones/people to check are limited.

When I realized this, it just made me more confident that OSBI has a pretty idea where they are going with this case.

RPS, great info. Two questions:

1) Is there a website that shows the locations of cell towers in the area?

2) Does the cell phone have to be turned on for it to ping the tower?