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Valhall
09-01-2009, 10:20 PM
It appears - with the exception of the hicky-jicky JWG reports above - that the "last update" time reported on the favorite screen is PST.

That would place the last update time for the zenaida myspace at 2:31 pm Orlando time.

cecybeans
09-01-2009, 10:22 PM
Given the huge amount of traffic that MySpace gets worldwide, is it possible that it is networked in various locations for redundancy sake and that there is more than one "portal of entry" server that could impact the numbering system?

BondJamesBond
09-01-2009, 10:24 PM
Encase activity times on desktop for 06/16 are:

7-9 am
10-noon
1-3 pm

Thanks, Val.

Now I fully realize that this all begins to sound like a "magic bullet" theory, but, described in detail here some information to suggest the Encase timestamps may be shifted by 1 hour:


Encase / Realtime
7-9AM / 8-10AM
10-Noon / 11-1PM
1-3PM / 2-4PM

Now...we bounced this around some time ago and perhaps JWG will recall the flaw in it all...I'd be the first one to accept a correction. :blushing:

Valhall
09-01-2009, 10:26 PM
Given the huge amount of traffic that MySpace gets worldwide, is it possible that it is networked in various locations for redundancy sake and that there is more than one "portal of entry" server that could impact the numbering system?

I'm going to give a half-educated answer on this....because my husband is co-owner of a rather large website.

It probably goes without saying that myspace has server farms in various locations - including California, Dallas, and possibly international. But they would resolve back to the server time that myspace established as its default. So the actual physical location of the server farm processing data would not affect the time-stamp.

I am assuming that the bizarro-ness that JWG detected and conveyed in his previous post is more likely that some one lied about their actual location (i.e. they either put in a false location and entered a true zip code/timezone, or they did the opposite) - and it threw off their updating time.

If KC made this zenaida page and wanted to present her as being in Miami - I can't see her jacking with the timezone.

christee
09-01-2009, 10:37 PM
I have a Myspace pg which I stumbled through when I joined. If it would help at all, I'd be happy to offer it's use if anyone wants to do a test or experiment of some kind!!!

cecybeans
09-01-2009, 10:43 PM
Orlando and Miami are both EST, so that wouldn't have been an issue, if I understand you correctly.

Thanks for the confirmation on server farms. I was just wondering if - depending on when they dump their info (if they do it like mail servers and can be set to various time increments) into the master or mainframe and data arrives simultaneously from various locations, if that might slightly mess up the chronology.

Valhall
09-01-2009, 10:45 PM
Thanks, Val.

Now I fully realize that this all begins to sound like a "magic bullet" theory, but, described in detail here (http://websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3723917&postcount=340) some information to suggest the Encase timestamps may be shifted by 1 hour:


Encase / Realtime
7-9AM / 8-10AM
10-Noon / 11-1PM
1-3PM / 2-4PM

Now...we bounced this around some time ago and perhaps JWG will recall the flaw in it all...I'd be the first one to accept a correction. :blushing:

BJB, you are reading the Encase graphs wrong. And I have CONFIRMED this. I have found out from some one who works with Encase on a regular basis. I asked specifically about this case and the interpretation of Encase graphs because I had gone out and read the training manuals that had referenced that the ellipse (...) meant there were too many files accessed to show, and I wanted to be sure I was interpreting correctly. That is the correct way to interpret the graphs. It is not a "percent of activity", but a literal graphic count of files accessed, created, deleted and modified. So where you are reading that from 3-4 pm on 06/17 there was no activity, there was actually more files accessed than could be depicted on the graph - hence the ellipse. It was actually MORE active during that hour than from 2-3 pm.

I do not believe there is any shift in the Encase data.

JWG
09-01-2009, 10:46 PM
Thanks, Val.

Now I fully realize that this all begins to sound like a "magic bullet" theory, but, described in detail here (http://websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3723917&postcount=340) some information to suggest the Encase timestamps may be shifted by 1 hour:

Encase / Realtime
7-9AM / 8-10AM
10-Noon / 11-1PM
1-3PM / 2-4PMNow...we bounced this around some time ago and perhaps JWG will recall the flaw in it all...I'd be the first one to accept a correction. :blushing:

No, I don't think we ever quite got to the bottom of it. There was some evidence that supported a shift (such as a Photobucket upload, IIRC) and others that did not quite support one (the early morning chat with one of her friends).

I just sort of left it as a problem for Bond to solve. :razz:

Valhall
09-01-2009, 10:49 PM
Orlando and Miami are both EST, so that wouldn't have been an issue, if I understand you correctly.

Thanks for the confirmation on server farms. I was just wondering if - depending on when they dump their info (if they do it like mail servers and can be set to various time increments) into the master or mainframe and data arrives simultaneously from various locations, if that might slightly mess up the chronology.

Agreed! I'm just saying I can't see KC setting this up with a timezone way off from the east coast. She would want it to look legit, IMO.

JWG
09-01-2009, 10:50 PM
BJB, you are reading the Encase graphs wrong. And I have CONFIRMED this. I have found out from some one who works with Encase on a regular basis. I asked specifically about this case and the interpretation of Encase graphs because I had gone out and read the training manuals that had referenced that the ellipse (...) meant there were too many files accessed to show, and I wanted to be sure I was interpreting correctly. That is the correct way to interpret the graphs. It is not a "percent of activity", but a literal graphic count of files accessed, created, deleted and modified. So where you are reading that from 3-4 pm on 06/17 there was no activity, there was actually more files accessed than could be depicted on the graph - hence the ellipse. It was actually MORE active during that hour than from 2-3 pm.

I do not believe there is any shift in the Encase data.

Ya know, I forgot you pointed that out. Now that I think about it I do remember going back and looking at the PDF and seeing that ellipse. :doh:

I tried ordering a demo version of Encase a while back but they did not bite off on my reasons why I needed it. :rolleyes: I sure wish I had those training manuals, but in the absence of them I have to acknowledge what you say makes perfect sense. If she had massive activity from 3 - 4 PM then I would agree there was no shift.

Valhall
09-01-2009, 10:55 PM
Just to be clear, there definitely IS a time shift between the photobucket data and the IP information LE requested from Bright House (or whatever the name is). They did not shift the MT of photobucket to ET before requesting IP activity on the Anthony home. I hope they have corrected that since!

BondJamesBond
09-01-2009, 10:57 PM
That would place the last update time for the zenaida myspace at 2:31 pm Orlando time.*snipped*

So...if we go with a 2:31PM Eastern realtime MS update, the absence of any MySpace alerts to Casey's cell log >5:31PM would simply mean that a Casey-as-Zenaida didn't leave any messages on Casey's MS page. :crazy:

Getting back to placing it in context...the bookend activity for a 2:31PM Eastern set-up would've been between the call w/ Amy and Jesse:

6/16/08 MON 1:44:54 PM OUTGOING CALL Casey Anthony Amy Huzienga
6/16/08 MON 2:52:53 PM INCOMING CALL Jesse Grund Casey Anthony

Noting that the call w/ Amy lasted 36 mins it would mean that Casey ended it @ ~2:21PM :shocked2:

Also noting that George'd be leaving somewhere ~2:30-2:45PM'ish.

JWG: What time suited the naps? 2-4PM?

Valhall
09-01-2009, 11:00 PM
*snipped*

So...if we go with a 2:31PM Eastern realtime MS update, the absence of any MySpace alerts to Casey's cell log >5:31PM would simply mean that a Casey-as-Zenaida didn't leave any messages on Casey's MS page. :crazy:

I have to admit I prefer 11:31 am much better. :P

BUT - keep in mind that this "last update" could have been nothing but adding the Dora pic, entering a blog entry (that later could have been deleted without affecting the update field), etc.

So...what I'm saying is, the page could have been created earlier in the day and then trivially updated at 2:31 pm. In fact, if there is a 3 hour lag between her setting up the account and getting the cell phone myspace notification that the account is set up, and then being able to load a picture, etc....it kind of makes sense, doesn't it?

cecybeans
09-01-2009, 11:00 PM
Okay, I hope I can say this right. It has been bugging me for quite a bit and I was talking to another WS'er and we agreed.

If KC is ZG22, wouldn't she want to retain that alias for future use? Once she paid off her ticket she could continue to use the ID in the future - especially if she had eventual plans to "fall off the grid" as herself. (and particularly if she wanted to "disappear" in case anything happened to her parents, then pop back up when she inherited a house - or so she may have thought).

So why - either before or after killing Caylee - would she use that name for a MySpace page and to finger a real ZG who had visited Sawgrass? Wouldn't she have taken the time to just find another person with a common name to set up for the kidnapping and keep her own fake identity intact? She acted like she had all the time in the world after she left home - and apparently didn't think her parents were smart enough to track her down to Tony's when she had told them she was in Jacksonville.

Do you think she just thought it was a good way to ditch her aka so she wouldn't have to pay the traffic fine? Maybe she was planning on retiring that name and getting a new alias.

So little that girl does makes any sense at all. Like I said before, she is like some kind of challenged sociopath, in that many of them seem to be smart enough to pull off an "event planner" type incident that she doesn't have the follow-through skill set to pull off.

cecybeans
09-01-2009, 11:04 PM
Agreed! I'm just saying I can't see KC setting this up with a timezone way off from the east coast. She would want it to look legit, IMO.

Gotcha - I probably misunderstood what you meant. Although my provider email and various web-based emails I have have goofed up the time stamp more than once.

I sure hope LE can use all this in their case. It would deflate a lot of defense nonsense we might have to listen to otherwise.

JWG
09-01-2009, 11:07 PM
Okay, I hope I can say this right. It has been bugging me for quite a bit and I was talking to another WS'er and we agreed.

If KC is ZG22, wouldn't she want to retain that alias for future use? Once she paid off her ticket she could continue to use the ID in the future - especially if she had eventual plans to "fall off the grid" as herself. (and particularly if she wanted to "disappear" in case anything happened to her parents, then pop back up when she inherited a house - or so she may have thought).

So why - either before or after killing Caylee - would she use that name for a MySpace page and to finger a real ZG who had visited Sawgrass? Wouldn't she have taken the time to just find another person with a common name to set up for the kidnapping and keep her own fake identity intact? She acted like she had all the time in the world after she left home - and apparently didn't think her parents were smart enough to track her down to Tony's when she had told them she was in Jacksonville.

Do you think she just thought it was a good way to ditch her aka so she wouldn't have to pay the traffic fine? Maybe she was planning on retiring that name and getting a new alias.

So little that girl does makes any sense at all. Like I said before, she is like some kind of challenged sociopath, in that many of them seem to be smart enough to pull off an "event planner" type incident that she doesn't have the follow-through skill set to pull off.

Well, all I can offer is that perhaps 10-minute KC did not have anything that resembled a plan. :waitasec: She was working with a name - "zenaida" - and that was about it. Lazy KC started to create a myspace identity and then got distracted by Tony and Fusian. Somehow the Sawgrass Zenaida fell into her lap, and she partially latched on to that. Who really knows?

In many respects, KC is the Homer Simpson of this case: "Why, I'll create a Zenaida Fernandez Gonzalez web... oooohh party at Fusian !!!"

The Eunice Burns
09-01-2009, 11:13 PM
Instead of thanking each post, may I say Thank You and Brilliant! to JWG, Val, and BJB. It's at this point of your sleuthing that I feel an overwhelming need to get out of the way, go sit in a corner, and watch it all unfold.:ashamed: I am nowhere in your league. Thank you for all the work you do!

The Eunice Burns
09-01-2009, 11:19 PM
Okay, I hope I can say this right. It has been bugging me for quite a bit and I was talking to another WS'er and we agreed.

If KC is ZG22, wouldn't she want to retain that alias for future use? Once she paid off her ticket she could continue to use the ID in the future - especially if she had eventual plans to "fall off the grid" as herself. (and particularly if she wanted to "disappear" in case anything happened to her parents, then pop back up when she inherited a house - or so she may have thought).

So why - either before or after killing Caylee - would she use that name for a MySpace page and to finger a real ZG who had visited Sawgrass? Wouldn't she have taken the time to just find another person with a common name to set up for the kidnapping and keep her own fake identity intact? She acted like she had all the time in the world after she left home - and apparently didn't think her parents were smart enough to track her down to Tony's when she had told them she was in Jacksonville.

Do you think she just thought it was a good way to ditch her aka so she wouldn't have to pay the traffic fine? Maybe she was planning on retiring that name and getting a new alias.

So little that girl does makes any sense at all. Like I said before, she is like some kind of challenged sociopath, in that many of them seem to be smart enough to pull off an "event planner" type incident that she doesn't have the follow-through skill set to pull off.

I agree. I also think it got too convoluted for her abilities. It's a lot of balls to keep up in the air---stealing, shopping w/ stolen money, lying, partying, banging, playing house, clubbing, texting umpteen hours of the day, avoiding your family, etc etc.....too much to keep track of, and something had to give. A sociopath to be sure, but just a middling one. Not one of the masterminds.

christee
09-01-2009, 11:21 PM
Well, all I can offer is that perhaps 10-minute KC did not have anything that resembled a plan. :waitasec: She was working with a name - "zenaida" - and that was about it. Lazy KC started to create a myspace identity and then got distracted by Tony and Fusian. Somehow the Sawgrass Zenaida fell into her lap, and she partially latched on to that. Who really knows?

In many respects, KC is the Homer Simpson of this case: "Why, I'll create a Zenaida Fernandez Gonzalez web... oooohh party at Fusian !!!"
Also sounds like someone with ADD/ADHD!

(I know of that which I speak, lol)

:abnormal:

The Eunice Burns
09-01-2009, 11:21 PM
In many respects, KC is the Homer Simpson of this case: "Why, I'll create a Zenaida Fernandez Gonzalez web... oooohh party at Fusian !!!"

(respectfully snipped)

:laugh: That's great!

Valhall
09-01-2009, 11:26 PM
Eunice,

This thread has been - and I predict will be - a lesson in community. All we can do is pray that LE took this serious (which I believe they did), took the steps to acquire the needed data (which I believe they did), and know far more than we do at this time (which I believe they do).

It's just complete anguish sitting on the outside and waiting to see if that is the case.

If all of this is bullcrap, I'll be the first to come and eat my hat - and any other piece of clothing required to appease the gods - and accept the facts. The facts are what is important.

BondJamesBond
09-01-2009, 11:32 PM
I have to admit I prefer 11:31 am much better. :P

BUT - keep in mind that this "last update" could have been nothing but adding the Dora pic, entering a blog entry (that later could have been deleted without affecting the update field), etc.

So...what I'm saying is, the page could have been created earlier in the day and then trivially updated at 2:31 pm. In fact, if there is a 3 hour lag between her setting up the account and getting the cell phone myspace notification that the account is set up, and then being able to load a picture, etc....it kind of makes sense, doesn't it?

Ya know...:waitasec: the scary thing is...that actually DOES make sense. ;) Which would put us back to the candidates highlighted in red as potentials. Which put us sideways w/ the Encase report. So....:waitasec:...seems possible...but maybe not as much so as the 2:31PM scenario. If I'm puttin' money down I'm puttin' it on 2:31PM Eastern @ the moment.

magic-cat
09-01-2009, 11:53 PM
Instead of thanking each post, may I say Thank You and Brilliant! to JWG, Val, and BJB. It's at this point of your sleuthing that I feel an overwhelming need to get out of the way, go sit in a corner, and watch it all unfold.:ashamed: I am nowhere in your league. Thank you for all the work you do!
Sitting quietly in the corner with Eunice.:cool:

RR0004
09-01-2009, 11:58 PM
Eunice,

This thread has been - and I predict will be - a lesson in community. All we can do is pray that LE took this serious (which I believe they did), took the steps to acquire the needed data (which I believe they did), and know far more than we do at this time (which I believe they do).

It's just complete anguish sitting on the outside and waiting to see if that is the case.

If all of this is bullcrap, I'll be the first to come and eat my hat - and any other piece of clothing required to appease the gods - and accept the facts. The facts are what is important.
Val...did they ever respond after you submitted all the info?

essies
09-02-2009, 12:00 AM
Instead of thanking each post, may I say Thank You and Brilliant! to JWG, Val, and BJB. It's at this point of your sleuthing that I feel an overwhelming need to get out of the way, go sit in a corner, and watch it all unfold.:ashamed: I am nowhere in your league. Thank you for all the work you do!

http://i705.photobucket.com/albums/ww53/essie_bucket/myspacejunks62.gifhttp://i705.photobucket.com/albums/ww53/essie_bucket/thcrossfingers-1.gif

BondJamesBond
09-02-2009, 12:11 AM
Well, all I can offer is that perhaps 10-minute KC did not have anything that resembled a plan. :waitasec: She was working with a name - "zenaida" - and that was about it. Lazy KC started to create a myspace identity and then got distracted by Tony and Fusian. Somehow the Sawgrass Zenaida fell into her lap, and she partially latched on to that. Who really knows?


So...prolly belongs on a "Theories..." thread, but, WTH, I've already mucked up this one :bang:...

IF Casey put no-shoed Caylee down for a nap @ 2PM'ish while George was still @ home...THEN Casey created a Zenaida-MS @ 2:31PM (or before) just a few minutes BEFORE George left home ~2:45PM'ish...THEN...Casey dropped an on-going call with Jesse that started @ 2:52PM to take a call from George's cell @ 3:04PM (telling us she was nervous 'bout something perhaps :waitasec:)....

One scenario would have the deed going down the second George walked out the door and before Casey accepted the incoming call from Jesse @ 2:52PM. IMHO, it seems unlikely Casey would've accepted that incoming call from Jesse if she was engaged in...or had just engaged in snuffing out Caylee :(

Another scenario would have Casey putting the pieces in place (e.g. Zenaida's MS set-up) waiting for George to leave and taking Jesse's call before committing the crime. Going this route would mean that taking George's call was necessary to make sure the coast was going to remain clear...otherwise it seems Casey might've just continued her convo w/ Jesse. That would give Casey her first opportunity @ 3:05PM when she hung up w/ George.

FWIW...some discussion earlier 'bout the 4:11PM "flurry" being an exercise in gotta-break-the-prearrangement-to-leave-Caylee-with-Cindy-cause-Caylee's-dead-and-howinthehellamIgonnaexplainthattoMom (nod to AZ ;) ) which would fit w/ a...

Applied duct tape to a sleeping no-shoed, Caylee between 3:05PM-4:11PM...perhaps even considering the ~20 second call to Tony @ 3:35PM indicating that the timing was more like 3:05PM-3:35PM...with 3:35-4:11PM being stow-Caylee-in-the-trunk-initially-and-grab-some-stuff time.

...further out on that limb :poke:...I can imagine that you might be able to ever-so-gently-so-as-not-to-awaken-them apply a strip or two of duct tape over a sleeping child's mouth before placing the final strip over their nose :( and if it the ends were long enough to be stuck to the hair it would only serve to make it painful for the victim to to attempt removing...intentional or not...serving a secondary purpose. Put the heart sticker on the last piece of tape over the mouth before applying one final piece over the nose.

In this scenario the duct tape wouldn't be conveniently in the nightstand...it would have to be retrieved...fitting with a Zenaida-MS-set-up ahead of time @ 2:31PM. Gonna make this look like a kidnapping gone wrong and blame it on 'Zenaida'...

Somewhere between 4:11PM and showing up @ Tony's apt. she (a) lost her nerve about reporting the kidnapping, (b) realized she hadn't thought of the details of what she was going to tell LE about how Zenaida got away from her without signs of a scuffle or any witnesses, (c) something else...and the defer/delay strategy kicked in.

A Zenaida-in-Miami does seem to fit nicely with some of the statements Casey made after her initial arrest 'bout whether or not Zenaida had left the area and what area code she associated w/ some of Zenaida's past phone #'s. And IIRC, she stated ZFG's mother Gloria lived in Miami.

...pehaps the tape was just over the mouth and the idea was to have an alive-Caylee staged somewhere to scare-the-helloutta Cindy so she'd insist on keeping Caylee in the future. :waitasec: Heart sticker applied in an attempt to make it a game. Casey places an alive, but, taped Caylee in the trunk so as not to be seen, but, ready to be dropped somewhere that doesn't work out...

Theory #...ahhhhelll...I've lost count :bang:

cecybeans
09-02-2009, 12:15 AM
Eunice,

This thread has been - and I predict will be - a lesson in community. All we can do is pray that LE took this serious (which I believe they did), took the steps to acquire the needed data (which I believe they did), and know far more than we do at this time (which I believe they do).

It's just complete anguish sitting on the outside and waiting to see if that is the case.

If all of this is bullcrap, I'll be the first to come and eat my hat - and any other piece of clothing required to appease the gods - and accept the facts. The facts are what is important.

Dearheart, if you end up eating any items of clothing, I'm sure we will all be happy to do the same - your excellent work on both the zenaida website and ZG22, and the validation and corroboration JWG, BJB and others have contributed make this theory one of the very few that actually make a lot of sense in this case of convoluted confusion and coagulated conundrums.

If we in fact end up doing that, let's just make sure we wash it all down with some great margaritas! And if not, and your valuable work comes to fruition, let's celebrate with some great margaritas too.

christee
09-02-2009, 12:21 AM
Sitting quietly in the corner with Eunice.:cool:
(lol, me too :read:)

cecybeans
09-02-2009, 12:26 AM
BJB - great theory. I would assume that even a sleeping Caylee (unless she was totally out because she'd been drugged or something) would have awakened when she couldn't breathe and tried to claw away the duct tape from her face.

If there are any marks showing a struggle, or Caylee's prints on that or any other layer, it will show she was still alive when it was applied. Of course, KC could have also used bedding (like a pillow) to restrain her and quicken the process. I don't imagine that would take more than a few minutes. Whatever happened, the phrase "spiteful little b****" keeps taking on more weight as time goes by.

AZlawyer
09-02-2009, 12:29 AM
Dearheart, if you end up eating any items of clothing, I'm sure we will all be happy to do the same - your excellent work on both the zenaida website and ZG22, and the validation and corroboration JWG, BJB and others have contributed make this theory one of the very few that actually make a lot of sense in this case of convoluted confusion and coagulated conundrums.

If we in fact end up doing that, let's just make sure we wash it all down with some great margaritas! And if not, and your valuable work comes to fruition, let's celebrate with some great margaritas too.

Yes!! Margaritas either way!

And BJB's latest theory is excellent. Answering the phone for George's call just after 3 pm makes a lot of sense if she was just about to enact the Plan and was afraid he was calling to say, "I'm on my way back to the house."

BondJamesBond
09-02-2009, 12:34 AM
Some terrifically-sleuthy stuff Val & JWG :clap:

Esp. hafta love Archenemies observation 'bout Favoriting the Zenaida myspace and revealing the timestamp on last updated too! :thumb:

The Eunice Burns
09-02-2009, 12:41 AM
Eunice,

This thread has been - and I predict will be - a lesson in community. All we can do is pray that LE took this serious (which I believe they did), took the steps to acquire the needed data (which I believe they did), and know far more than we do at this time (which I believe they do).

It's just complete anguish sitting on the outside and waiting to see if that is the case.

If all of this is bullcrap, I'll be the first to come and eat my hat - and any other piece of clothing required to appease the gods - and accept the facts. The facts are what is important.

Thank you, Val. I think you're right on--it is agonizing, the wait to see how all of this pans out and how all of this info that you and others are processing fits into the case. FWIW, I don't think you'd have to eat your hat or any other item of clothing, b/c I think you are all onto something here.

cecybeans
09-02-2009, 12:41 AM
What I don't get is all the calls to Lexus during the "flurry" - isn't that the same day when they happened? What was that all about? Or am I just too sleepy to recall correctly?

BondJamesBond
09-02-2009, 01:49 AM
What I don't get is all the calls to Lexus during the "flurry" - isn't that the same day when they happened? What was that all about? Or am I just too sleepy to recall correctly?

Now you're just taunting me. :) Thread in the Case Analysis Forum re: "Lexus".

lin
09-02-2009, 02:20 AM
Okay, I hope I can say this right. It has been bugging me for quite a bit and I was talking to another WS'er and we agreed.

If KC is ZG22, wouldn't she want to retain that alias for future use? Once she paid off her ticket she could continue to use the ID in the future - especially if she had eventual plans to "fall off the grid" as herself. (and particularly if she wanted to "disappear" in case anything happened to her parents, then pop back up when she inherited a house - or so she may have thought).

So why - either before or after killing Caylee - would she use that name for a MySpace page and to finger a real ZG who had visited Sawgrass? Wouldn't she have taken the time to just find another person with a common name to set up for the kidnapping and keep her own fake identity intact? She acted like she had all the time in the world after she left home - and apparently didn't think her parents were smart enough to track her down to Tony's when she had told them she was in Jacksonville.

Do you think she just thought it was a good way to ditch her aka so she wouldn't have to pay the traffic fine? Maybe she was planning on retiring that name and getting a new alias.

So little that girl does makes any sense at all. Like I said before, she is like some kind of challenged sociopath, in that many of them seem to be smart enough to pull off an "event planner" type incident that she doesn't have the follow-through skill set to pull off.

ZG was the murderer. KC has to explain why she doesn't have Caylee anymore. ZG starts out as the imaginanny; maybe morphed into a possible getaway id; but ended up the imagimurderer. IOW, she can remain clever KC, the grieving mother; tearfully accept fame, donations, book & movie deals if ZG is the culprit. If she absconds as ZG, that all goes down the drain. Remember the missing children's website searches...

Doesn't all that sound like a game of CLUE? And that's about the max of her thinking level, imo. In fact, probably giving her way too much credit.

lin
09-02-2009, 02:23 AM
Sitting quietly in the corner with Eunice.:cool:

And I'm coming to sit with you both. I'm bringing popcorn to share.


http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll230/lin5000/corn.gif

lin
09-02-2009, 02:26 AM
So...prolly belongs on a "Theories..." thread, but, WTH, I've already mucked up this one :bang:...

IF Casey put no-shoed Caylee down for a nap @ 2PM'ish while George was still @ home...THEN Casey created a Zenaida-MS @ 2:31PM (or before) just a few minutes BEFORE George left home ~2:45PM'ish...THEN...Casey dropped an on-going call with Jesse that started @ 2:52PM to take a call from George's cell @ 3:04PM (telling us she was nervous 'bout something perhaps :waitasec:)....

One scenario would have the deed going down the second George walked out the door and before Casey accepted the incoming call from Jesse @ 2:52PM. IMHO, it seems unlikely Casey would've accepted that incoming call from Jesse if she was engaged in...or had just engaged in snuffing out Caylee :(

Another scenario would have Casey putting the pieces in place (e.g. Zenaida's MS set-up) waiting for George to leave and taking Jesse's call before committing the crime. Going this route would mean that taking George's call was necessary to make sure the coast was going to remain clear...otherwise it seems Casey might've just continued her convo w/ Jesse. That would give Casey her first opportunity @ 3:05PM when she hung up w/ George.

FWIW...some discussion earlier 'bout the 4:11PM "flurry" being an exercise in gotta-break-the-prearrangement-to-leave-Caylee-with-Cindy-cause-Caylee's-dead-and-howinthehellamIgonnaexplainthattoMom (nod to AZ ;) ) which would fit w/ a...

Applied duct tape to a sleeping no-shoed, Caylee between 3:05PM-4:11PM...perhaps even considering the ~20 second call to Tony @ 3:35PM indicating that the timing was more like 3:05PM-3:35PM...with 3:35-4:11PM being stow-Caylee-in-the-trunk-initially-and-grab-some-stuff time.

...further out on that limb :poke:...I can imagine that you might be able to ever-so-gently-so-as-not-to-awaken-them apply a strip or two of duct tape over a sleeping child's mouth before placing the final strip over their nose :( and if it the ends were long enough to be stuck to the hair it would only serve to make it painful for the victim to to attempt removing...intentional or not...serving a secondary purpose. Put the heart sticker on the last piece of tape over the mouth before applying one final piece over the nose.

In this scenario the duct tape wouldn't be conveniently in the nightstand...it would have to be retrieved...fitting with a Zenaida-MS-set-up ahead of time @ 2:31PM. Gonna make this look like a kidnapping gone wrong and blame it on 'Zenaida'...

Somewhere between 4:11PM and showing up @ Tony's apt. she (a) lost her nerve about reporting the kidnapping, (b) realized she hadn't thought of the details of what she was going to tell LE about how Zenaida got away from her without signs of a scuffle or any witnesses, (c) something else...and the defer/delay strategy kicked in.A Zenaida-in-Miami does seem to fit nicely with some of the statements Casey made after her initial arrest 'bout whether or not Zenaida had left the area and what area code she associated w/ some of Zenaida's past phone #'s. And IIRC, she stated ZFG's mother Gloria lived in Miami.

...pehaps the tape was just over the mouth and the idea was to have an alive-Caylee staged somewhere to scare-the-helloutta Cindy so she'd insist on keeping Caylee in the future. :waitasec: Heart sticker applied in an attempt to make it a game. Casey places an alive, but, taped Caylee in the trunk so as not to be seen, but, ready to be dropped somewhere that doesn't work out...

Theory #...ahhhhelll...I've lost count :bang:

BBM -- or... I wonder if there are still some of those cookies in the kitchen? Or maybe a commercial with a "really cute boy" came on the tv...

All around excellent post, btw. :)

JWG
09-02-2009, 07:51 AM
*snipped*

So...if we go with a 2:31PM Eastern realtime MS update, the absence of any MySpace alerts to Casey's cell log >5:31PM would simply mean that a Casey-as-Zenaida didn't leave any messages on Casey's MS page. :crazy:

Getting back to placing it in context...the bookend activity for a 2:31PM Eastern set-up would've been between the call w/ Amy and Jesse:

6/16/08 MON 1:44:54 PM OUTGOING CALL Casey Anthony Amy Huzienga
6/16/08 MON 2:52:53 PM INCOMING CALL Jesse Grund Casey Anthony

Noting that the call w/ Amy lasted 36 mins it would mean that Casey ended it @ ~2:21PM :shocked2:

Also noting that George'd be leaving somewhere ~2:30-2:45PM'ish.

JWG: What time suited the naps? 2-4PM?





I had based my nap-time assumption on Photobucket upload patterns, which put nap time at roughly 1-3PM. But, IIRC, the Photobucket time stamps are CST (per a response to a subpoena), which would put us at 2-4PM.

Valhall
09-02-2009, 07:58 AM
Val...did they ever respond after you submitted all the info?

No, but as I've said before, I never expected to get a response. Even a "thank you" could be misinterpreted, so I think they would not respond.

ExpectingUnicorns
09-02-2009, 08:36 AM
. . . and here's another thank you from the quiet corner. I think God is working some of His miracles through all of you. (Sorry, the "button" doesn't show quite enough appreciation from this ancient cheerleader ~ but I do feel embarrassed to take up any space in this brilliant thread so will try to remain in that corner!)

cecybeans
09-02-2009, 09:22 AM
I had based my nap-time assumption on Photobucket upload patterns, which put nap time at roughly 1-3PM. But, IIRC, the Photobucket time stamps are CST (per a response to a subpoena), which would put us at 2-4PM.

I just got the chills when I read "nap-time", although I've read your post before and for some reason it didn't strike me the way it did today. If that's when it happened, that may also have been a factor. When my daughter was almost three, it was very difficult to get her to take a nap or to get to sleep at night; she had erratic sleep patterns from day one. I told her it was okay to just lay in bed and read books and have "quiet time" instead of taking a nap.

But if she kept getting up I really wasn't thinking about putting duct tape on her mouth just because I was a little busy...

cecybeans
09-02-2009, 09:36 AM
Now you're just taunting me. :) Thread in the Case Analysis Forum re: "Lexus".

Sorry! I forgot the Lexus calls might have been Gentiva calls if that is what you are referring to. Sometimes consensus is reached and then unreached and it gets jammed in a cloverleaf of my brain synapses as to what the decision was. If I'm still not correct, feel free to flog me with an appropriate smilie.

AZlawyer
09-02-2009, 12:34 PM
I was attempting to follow the brilliant sleuthing on this thread last night from my cell phone while riding a stationary bike at the gym--so I may have missed something. :) Did you guys ever figure out whether the "profile last updated" time of 11:31 am was Eastern time or Pacific? I just updated my MySpace profile, and the "profile last updated" time showed as my own time zone (AZ), but then I realized that Arizona is on the same time as Pacific at the moment (we don't have daylight savings time), and Pacific is the MySpace default time zone anyway. :doh: So I have no way of telling whether it is using my "home" time zone or PST.

By the way, I never filled in any zip code or city for my profile. So is it just taking my "home" time from my computer clock?

Intermezzo
09-02-2009, 12:46 PM
I was attempting to follow the brilliant sleuthing on this thread last night from my cell phone while riding a stationary bike at the gym--so I may have missed something. :) Did you guys ever figure out whether the "profile last updated" time of 11:31 am was Eastern time or Pacific? I just updated my MySpace profile, and the "profile last updated" time showed as my own time zone (AZ), but then I realized that Arizona is on the same time as Pacific at the moment (we don't have daylight savings time), and Pacific is the MySpace default time zone anyway. :doh: So I have no way of telling whether it is using my "home" time zone or PST.

By the way, I never filled in any zip code or city for my profile. So is it just taking my "home" time from my computer clock?

BBM
From what I read in different websites about that last night, the answer is Yes.

sumbunny
09-02-2009, 01:37 PM
Hey guys! Any more news about the ZG22 that had the ticket? Is there a way to get information on who it may be?

This thread is amazing! Thank you so much!

april_showers
09-02-2009, 01:53 PM
In this scenario the duct tape wouldn't be conveniently in the nightstand...it would have to be retrieved...fitting with a Zenaida-MS-set-up ahead of time @ 2:31PM. Gonna make this look like a kidnapping gone wrong and blame it on 'Zenaida'...

Somewhere between 4:11PM and showing up @ Tony's apt. she (a) lost her nerve about reporting the kidnapping, (b) realized she hadn't thought of the details of what she was going to tell LE about how Zenaida got away from her without signs of a scuffle or any witnesses, (c) something else...and the defer/delay strategy kicked in.



(respectfully snipped...) I like considering the notion that Casey originally intended on playing up the kidnapping thing immediately, but then realized it would not help her case. Considering "freedom" as a primary motive (or at least a major player in her motive pool), I think Casey may have only begun considering the implications of reporting a kidnapping after the deed was done (the whole "10 minutes at a time" mindset rearing it's head once again...). A phone call w/ Tony about movie night may have been all it took for her to realize that reporting a kidnapping would ruin the romantic date night... and the next night... and every night for the foreseable future. I don't think it was ever Casey's intention to be the weeping mother/victim... until she was caught, that is.

I still have to maintain that the myspace was set up to keep Cindy off her case (in a haphazard, scattered way of course). I can't see even someone as misguided as Casey assuming a myspace created in her living room that afternoon, from an email address likely created in her living room that afternoon, would hold up to any form law enforcement. I can't see her being naive enough to wave that in a detective's face: "look, Zenaida exists! I can prove it!" Granted, we have evidence of countless other clueless actions - leading LE down the Universal hallway, for instance - but these were all her panicked actions after being confronted, not the result of a calculated move to report a kidnapping. I definitely think she created Z's page as "evidence" the nanny existed, I just think it was for the Anthony family's eyes only...

JWG
09-02-2009, 02:10 PM
Well, bummer.

Val and I can both vouch that OCSO did investigate this page earlier this spring when she sent them the information and that the IP address is not from the Orlando area. While it is possible to mask an IP, the investigation was characterized as "thorough" which presumably would also mean the friend ID associated with the page was not found on the computers.

Looks like it is just another one of many amazing coincidences.

JWG
09-02-2009, 02:13 PM
And, continuing to be a wet blanket on what is actually a beautiful day up here in the Northeast....

The ZG22 traffic ticket was also thoroughly checked out and the person really was a 22-year old ZG from Mexico who spoke only Spanish and needed an interpreter. :doh:

PassTheMotrin
09-02-2009, 02:21 PM
JWG! Get outta here! :eek:

How can there be so many coincidences?

ExpectingUnicorns
09-02-2009, 02:23 PM
Well, bummer.

Val and I can both vouch that OCSO did investigate this page earlier this spring when she sent them the information and that the IP address is not from the Orlando area. While it is possible to mask an IP, the investigation was characterized as "thorough" which presumably would also mean the friend ID associated with the page was not found on the computers.

Looks like it is just another one of many amazing coincidences.

:yow::(:banghead::doh::sick::bang::mad:
(I couldn't find the falling out of the chair one.)

april_showers
09-02-2009, 02:25 PM
Well, bummer.

Val and I can both vouch that OCSO did investigate this page earlier this spring when she sent them the information and that the IP address is not from the Orlando area. While it is possible to mask an IP, the investigation was characterized as "thorough" which presumably would also mean the friend ID associated with the page was not found on the computers.

Looks like it is just another one of many amazing coincidences.

these coincidences are mind boggling! I almost wish everyone could do a crappier job of sleuthing (well, not really... :) ) so we could continue to believe they were true. It's so sad when exciting theories get debunked!

AZlawyer
09-02-2009, 02:26 PM
I am amazed and disappointed but wanted to add THANKS VAL :blowkiss: and please don't stop applying your talents to this case. We will need you for the next doc dump. :)

SideKick
09-02-2009, 03:11 PM
http://www.myspace.com/412577746

Hi All,

Have you noticed this myspace created by the one and only? Last login: 14/10/08?

Maybe check those times?

SKick.

nephers
09-02-2009, 03:12 PM
On myspace and facebook they have a spot that has friend suggestions. It is usually a friend of a friend or someone in your area. Is it possible that KC saw this ZG as a suggested friend and boom, she has a ZG in the area that fits the story she's been using? I know it's a stretch but this is one of my favorite threads to read and i was really disappointed to see it didn't pan out. Maybe my mind is trying to come up with a way to keep it going.

JWG
09-02-2009, 03:25 PM
http://www.myspace.com/412577746

Hi All,

Have you noticed this myspace created by the one and only? Last login: 14/10/08?

Maybe check those times?

SKick.

Based on the two numerically-adjacent myspace friend IDs, this page was created September 10, 2008. I don't recall when she was in jail, but my guess is this is a fake.

SideKick
09-02-2009, 03:33 PM
Based on the two numerically-adjacent myspace friend IDs, this page was created September 10, 2008. I don't recall when she was in jail, but my guess is this is a fake.

... My first thought it was fake, the login date threw me... double and triple checking!

Thanks

WolfmarsGirl
09-02-2009, 03:33 PM
http://www.myspace.com/412577746

Hi All,

Have you noticed this myspace created by the one and only? Last login: 14/10/08?

Maybe check those times?

SKick.

Good one!!

I don't think I have ever seen that photo either.

I think Myspace could do a little research and give LE loads of information. Maybe that will be prosecution's trump card??

JWG
09-02-2009, 03:39 PM
... My first thought it was fake, the login date threw me... double and triple checking!

Thanks

Well, and I should be careful. I don't know for a fact that it is fake. If KC was not in prison on September 10 then it is possible it is her. But one has to wonder what the point would have been for her to put up a myspace. IIRC she was not allowed to use a computer, and her friends wanted nothing to do with her. It does not seem it would have been a useful device for her.

WolfmarsGirl
09-02-2009, 03:43 PM
Well, bummer.

Val and I can both vouch that OCSO did investigate this page earlier this spring when she sent them the information and that the IP address is not from the Orlando area. While it is possible to mask an IP, the investigation was characterized as "thorough" which presumably would also mean the friend ID associated with the page was not found on the computers.

Looks like it is just another one of many amazing coincidences.

Ok, so what you are saying is that OCSO actually traced the IP address and it was NOT from Casey's area? So, in other words, KC did not create or edit the Zenaida Myspace account?? Really???

That is kind of odd because it is way too much of a coincidence. I wonder if they tracked down who it really was? Or, is it possible LE is not spilling the whole story??? OR, could it have been someone else who created it as a favor to KC (not knowing WHY he/she was asked by KC to create this account???

If the 2nd scenario is possible, then one of her friends knows that fact. So, they will give it up on the stand???

So confusing.

JWG
09-02-2009, 03:51 PM
Ok, so what you are saying is that OCSO actually traced the IP address and it was NOT from Casey's area? So, in other words, KC did not create or edit the Zenaida Myspace account?? Really???

That is kind of odd because it is way too much of a coincidence. I wonder if they tracked down who it really was? Or, is it possible LE is not spilling the whole story??? OR, could it have been someone else who created it as a favor to KC (not knowing WHY he/she was asked by KC to create this account???

If the 2nd scenario is possible, then one of her friends knows that fact. So, they will give it up on the stand???

So confusing.

As I understand it, the IP was not from Orlando, but the dates we have been discussing were genuine. No idea if they actually discovered who the person was that created it and investigated them. However, given the IP was not Orlando and (as I understand it) the friend ID was not found on either computer, there is nothing to tie KC to the site other than strange coincidence...and they can't convict on coincidences like that.

cecybeans
09-02-2009, 03:59 PM
Well, bummer.

Val and I can both vouch that OCSO did investigate this page earlier this spring when she sent them the information and that the IP address is not from the Orlando area. While it is possible to mask an IP, the investigation was characterized as "thorough" which presumably would also mean the friend ID associated with the page was not found on the computers.

Looks like it is just another one of many amazing coincidences.

Is there any chance that the zenaida page was made from another IP address using the laptop - like some hot spot within an hour away during one of those frequent 3 or 4 hours of cellphone ping "dead time" (she had one of those on the 17th, but she might have done something earlier?) She's only about a half hour away from Volusia County and a little over an hour from Tampa or Ocala (which came up before when CA told that silly story that someone "hacked" her email account.)

I'm not saying she had software that could scramble IP addresses, but if the page was created earlier and elsewhere, and updated on the 16th with the Dora pic, would that pan out as a possibility?

If not, I am gonna have to go start rimming glasses with salt...

Woe.be.gone
09-02-2009, 04:05 PM
As I understand it, the IP was not from Orlando, but the dates we have been discussing were genuine. No idea if they actually discovered who the person was that created it and investigated them. However, given the IP was not Orlando and (as I understand it) the friend ID was not found on either computer, there is nothing to tie KC to the site other than strange coincidence...and they can't convict on coincidences like that.

Wow! Would all of this then, in some way, support that there could have been a script KC was trying to follow?

Blows one's mind. :eek:

rookie
09-02-2009, 04:14 PM
*snipped respecfully*

I am not entirely sure what I think about these "coincidences". Are they in fact truly just coincidences or is it more? I keep going back and forth. Probably because I can't wrap my head around WHY someone would do such a thing, let alone a mother to her child. :furious:

At any rate, just wanted to throw this out there for thought. We have all discussed at length the possibility that Casey was living in a fantasy world, plotting and planning the demise of possibly a number of people: George, Cindy, Amy, Caylee...maybe part of those fantasies was all of these eerie "coincidences". Maybe she did plan these sinister pieces of the puzzle. Perhaps she planned this to be some sick scavenger hunt of sorts. She told LE that she was following a "script", maybe it was her own disgusting script. We know she loved CSI, which is famous for its intricate and often surprising twists and turns in the story lines. She did google that episode of One Tree Hill where the child is kidnapped by the nanny. Why did she do that? maybe to get "ideas" for her sick puzzle she was building. What I do know is that there are an awful lot of coincidences in this case! one or two, maybe...but all of these that you wonderful sleuthers have pointed out?

* address where Caylees remains were found - 8905 Suburban Drive. 8/9/05 is Caylee's birthday. "I feel in my gut that she'll be found by her birthday" :eek:

*She dropped her off between (470)9 and (470)1 Hopespring Drive

*She dropped Caylee off with Zenaida Gonzalez. The address on one side of the dump site is listed as belonging to a Zenaida, the adress on the other side is listed as belonging to residents with the last name Gonzalez.

I'm sure there are more to add to this list, but these are the most shocking.

And to answer the question that I know many of you are asking, "WHY, though?", the only thing I can offer is maybe just because she is one sick individual, a "SPITEFUL B*TCH"! I don't think any of us will ever be able to truly understand why she did this because we are not cold blooded killers like she is. We shouldn't underestimate her intelligence, for those who say that Casey just isn't smart enough to hatch a plan like this. We don't know her or the inner workings of her mind. She was intelligent enough to come up with all these intricate lies for her entire life. Yes, it might have been stupid of her to lie like she did/does, but from all accounts, she went to some great lengths for her lies (even coming up with a fake deposit slip after saying she'd been held at gunpoint and robbed), and also convinced people that she held down a job for years. It takes someone with at least a little bit of a brain to pull those types of things off.

The more and more I think about this, the more I am convinced that she did plot these little "coincidences" into her fantasy. I do think that she didn't plan for things to go wrong, though-like the car being towed by LE, or Cindy calling 911 and all of that. But as for the act of killing and disposing Caylee, I think that Casey wrote these little sinister (or, poetic in her twisted mind) details into her script. She just didn't expect for things to go "wrong". Thank goodness they did, because LE is going to blow her out of the water at trial. Like another poster said, if we have put all of this together with what little bit of evidence we have seen, imagine what LE has! :eek:


I got goosebumps from head to toe reading about the "between 9 and 1" and especially the 8905.

Either she is the biggest mastermind genius criminal in history (which I don't think anyone thinks) or there are some outside forces at work here.

A few years ago DH & I went to a psychic about a young family member's early death.
She told us that we pre-existed and that we agreed to things before we came including how long we would stay.

Something a psychic says to make you feel better right?

Well, those words came back to me when I read this and it really makes you wonder.

sarah7855
09-02-2009, 04:14 PM
Wow! Would all of this then, in some way, support that there could have been a script KC was trying to follow?

Blows one's mind. :eek:

BBM...really, it's making me second guess everything that I personally thought was "certain" about this case. I just can't accept that this wasn't her. JWG/Val, any way you might detail how you came to find out that this had been investigated?

Woe.be.gone
09-02-2009, 04:16 PM
Would LE at least check out thoroughly the id of the person with the ip to make sure they had no connection to the family? Make sense?

KC has connections with people who do know a lot about computer technology, etc. More than her I would imagine. Her Lawyer owned a company about this stuff did he not? Or taught about evidence through computer use or something like that - no? Lexus-Nexus? Am I wrong?

This is too much. Unbelievable. Of course everything smells in this case to include the Pontiac. Of course that can't be true either because twelve years ago a junk science establishment was begun in order to some day debunk any evidence that there had been a dead toddler in the trunk of a one Casey A's Pontiac so ...

chefmom
09-02-2009, 04:18 PM
As I understand it, the IP was not from Orlando, but the dates we have been discussing were genuine. No idea if they actually discovered who the person was that created it and investigated them. However, given the IP was not Orlando and (as I understand it) the friend ID was not found on either computer, there is nothing to tie KC to the site other than strange coincidence...and they can't convict on coincidences like that.

But, was there anything more specific other than it wasn't in Orlando? I mean, could it have been from another, nearby, neighboring town? Do any of her pings place her outside of the Orlando area during this time frame? I'm not buying coincidence on this. There is something there. We just haven't quite pegged it. Or, it was pegged, and they don't want it talked about on an internet forum.

chefmom
09-02-2009, 04:22 PM
Wow! Would all of this then, in some way, support that there could have been a script KC was trying to follow?

Blows one's mind. :eek:

I don't think so. She is still charged with the murder of her child and the state is seeking the DP. If anything about this had lent credence to the whole script theory, they wouldn't have put the DP back on the table. Unless they had actually found a copy of the "script" and it was written in KC's handwriting! :furious:

TUSK
09-02-2009, 04:23 PM
don't rule out the traveling brother,"he knows what he did" or traveling talk
show talking head,CA who's been inventing alibi's for her 20 years.

sarah7855
09-02-2009, 04:37 PM
But, was there anything more specific other than it wasn't in Orlando? I mean, could it have been from another, nearby, neighboring town? Do any of her pings place her outside of the Orlando area during this time frame? I'm not buying coincidence on this. There is something there. We just haven't quite pegged it. Or, it was pegged, and they don't want it talked about on an internet forum.

never thought of that, great point. Like you said, I'm not buying coincidence on this either.

Reagan
09-02-2009, 04:37 PM
BBM...really, it's making me second guess everything that I personally thought was "certain" about this case. I just can't accept that this wasn't her. JWG/Val, any way you might detail how you came to find out that this had been investigated?

Yeah, what'd I miss? How did you guys find out it wasn't legit? I thought everyone was still discussing the possibility only yesterday?
I feel like I'm in the twilight zone with this case sometimes..

AZlawyer
09-02-2009, 04:45 PM
Based on the two numerically-adjacent myspace friend IDs, this page was created September 10, 2008. I don't recall when she was in jail, but my guess is this is a fake.

KC was in jail July 16-August 21, August 29-September 5, September 15-September 16, and October 14-now and forever.

So she was out Sept. 10, which means this other MySpace could possibly be real. But I'm not sure I care if KC made an essentially blank MySpace page while out of jail. The interesting thing about the Zenaida page was that it could help prove premeditation, which this other one can't.

sarah7855
09-02-2009, 04:52 PM
Yeah, what'd I miss? How did you guys find out it wasn't legit? I thought everyone was still discussing the possibility only yesterday?
I feel like I'm in the twilight zone with this case sometimes..


Per JWG's post, it's been investigated and proven not to be her :eek:

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Is Casey the real Zenaida?

Valhall
09-02-2009, 05:06 PM
I have personally been told that:

1. ZG22 of the traffic ticket is NOT KC.

2. The IP address associated with the myspace is in SOUTHERN FLORIDA (i.e. probably Miami).

All roads lead to...nothing.

But at least we know now and don't have to waste our time in this area any longer. Thanks for all the help from everybody on getting to the truth in this particular area of this case. I can't express my gratitude adequately.

Vera_75
09-02-2009, 05:41 PM
Valhall your time line and theory on Casey posing as Zenaida Gonzales, by using a fake driver's license, was outstanding!!!

I left a message for you, but I think it should go here, instead.

My question to you is, how did Casey (posting as ZG), receive mail from the Courts regarding her hearings on the driving violations?

Obviously, she did not get mail addressed to Zenaida Gonzales, at the home of her parents, so where did that mail go? If you believe Casey's parents, they stated that they never heard of ZG until after Caylee went missing.

Evidently, Casey a/k/a ZG, appeared in Court on the ZG traffic violations, but how did she know when and where to appear?

When you are summoned to Court you must provide proof of address, telephone number, name, etc. I would like to know what address was given for ZG in regard to these hearings?

Also, in the state where I live, all hearings before a Judge, are video taped. If the same applies to FL, all the DA has to do is get a summons, subpoena the tapes for the days that ZG appeared in Court, on the above violations, and physically identify her! This would also clear up who appeared as her attorney at the hearing(s).

If she did have an attorney, his/her name would appear on the Court documents. Those documents should be available to anybody under the FL Sunshine Law. Does anybody have a link to the county courthouse? It has to be the county in which ZG (a.k.a. Casey), alleged that she lived.

WolfmarsGirl
09-02-2009, 05:51 PM
I have personally been told that:

1. ZG22 of the traffic ticket is NOT KC.

2. The IP address associated with the myspace is in SOUTHERN FLORIDA (i.e. probably Miami).

All roads lead to...nothing.

But at least we know now and don't have to waste our time in this area any longer. Thanks for all the help from everybody on getting to the truth in this particular area of this case. I can't express my gratitude adequately.

Did LE tell you this? Or can you not reveal the source?

Also, are we talking about the "Zenaida" Myspace with Dora on it or are we talking about the "Casey" Myspace?

WolfmarsGirl
09-02-2009, 06:23 PM
Well, and I should be careful. I don't know for a fact that it is fake. If KC was not in prison on September 10 then it is possible it is her. But one has to wonder what the point would have been for her to put up a myspace. IIRC she was not allowed to use a computer, and her friends wanted nothing to do with her. It does not seem it would have been a useful device for her.

But, then we have to question where the creator of the myspace got the pic of Casey. I guess whoever the other girl in the picture is could be the creator.

More likely, it was created by whoever took the picture. I have never seen this photo before, so it is probably from someone's private collection, meaning one of KC's friends.

But, I don't know why a friend would create a Myspace page with KC's name on it amidst all of the craziness that was going on at the time. They ought to know they would be questioned about it...

So, then maybe it was NOT the other girl in the pic OR the photographer who took the photo. It was probably done by a friend of a friend who had the picture emailed to him/her.

Still, why would anyone want to throw themselves into anything Casey-related last September??? Unless it was just a gag.

Besides, if Casey did create this 'Casey' MS, it is hardly an incriminating page, so it probably doesn't matter much.

What is important is the 'Zenaida' Myspace. Do we know for a fact then that KC could not have created this page?

I don't buy that either. I think KC must have created the Zenaida page and I think LE knows she did. Since the information about this page has not been released, maybe they are holding it as a trump card???

Perhaps KC did leave the house when GA said she did. Could she have gone somewhere outside of Orlando and used her laptop to create the page then return to the house later when GA was gone???

I don't think she would have a cause to make the Zenaida MS unless one of two things is true:
-She was planning to kill Caylee and she needed some evidence of the existence of ZFG.
or
-She was NOT planning to kill Caylee, but needed to solidify proof that there was a 'nanny' just to make it easier to continue her lies and way of life. In my opinion, that would mean that she was planning to stow Caylee away somewhere (trunk?) more often than usual.

But that would be a terrific coincidence if she just created the ZFG MS in order to make her non-deadly lies sound more believable on the exact date that Caylee went missing. Way too much of a coincidence.

Valhall
09-02-2009, 06:52 PM
Did LE tell you this? Or can you not reveal the source?

Also, are we talking about the "Zenaida" Myspace with Dora on it or are we talking about the "Casey" Myspace?

Nah, I'm not going to discuss the source per request. And, yes, we are discussing the Dora Zenaida myspace.

It is my intention to trust that LE ran this rabbit hole as far as they could. All I'll throw out is this...

if myspace was subpoenaed for MY myspace records their records would show an IP attached to Kingfisher, Oklahoma. That's exactly 2 hours and 20 minutes from where I live.

So I'm trusting they ran this rabbit hole plum to the bottom.

april_showers
09-02-2009, 06:55 PM
I might just be grasping at straws / in denial / whatever you want to call it, since I so desperately wanted the Zani page to be Casey's work...

But Miami is what - 3, 4 hours away from Orlando? When you first said "non-Orlando area..." I was thinking it would end up being Nebraska, or North Dakota, or some other seemingly random locale. But just a few hours down the interstate? It does seem to me like this could still be related somehow.

I was the first to cry "coincidence" with all of the Zenaida's backyard touching a Gonzales' backyard, touching a burial spot with Caylee's birthday as an address comparisons. Some facets of this case just seem way out there to me.

But a Myspace page with the nanny's name, a location she was associated with, a Dora picture... likely created the day Caylee was killed and last accessed the day Casey went to jail?? That just seems like too much to just be fate playing games with us.

ETA: Just wanted to add that, Valhall, I'm in no way implying that I don't believe you, or distrust the extensive work you've done on this topic. I completely trust you and your sources - just having a hard time rationalizing the level of mere coincidences!

Pink Panther
09-02-2009, 07:03 PM
I don't believe that KC was "Zenaida". I think KC invented the nanny when the Grunds told her to get a babysitter and she's been nursing her story ever since. Possibly, she found someone on the internet that suited her purposes, or she bumped into her somewhere (tattoo parlour, grocery store) and honed in but I don't believe that the nanny existed in any way shape or form in Caylee's life or in her (horribly unfortunate) death. KC is KC. A murderer and nothing else.

MOO

ETA - I haven't really decided on what I think about the Zenaida/Dora myspace yet but I do believe it's possible that some silly person following the case set it up. I know there was a lot of discussion about this a while back and some posters who were well versed in Myspace were saying that it was possible to alter the "sign up" date. I'm sure LE has followed up on this by now. If not, I hope they will soon.

chefmom
09-02-2009, 07:31 PM
Nah, I'm not going to discuss the source per request. And, yes, we are discussing the Dora Zenaida myspace.

It is my intention to trust that LE ran this rabbit hole as far as they could. All I'll throw out is this...

if myspace was subpoenaed for MY myspace records their records would show an IP attached to Kingfisher, Oklahoma. That's exactly 2 hours and 20 minutes from where I live.
So I'm trusting they ran this rabbit hole plum to the bottom.

BBM

Then, this IP could still be for a computer in Orlando even if the IP address was Miami.

WolfmarsGirl
09-02-2009, 08:36 PM
I don't believe that KC was "Zenaida". I think KC invented the nanny when the Grunds told her to get a babysitter and she's been nursing her story ever since. Possibly, she found someone on the internet that suited her purposes, or she bumped into her somewhere (tattoo parlour, grocery store) and honed in but I don't believe that the nanny existed in any way shape or form in Caylee's life or in her (horribly unfortunate) death. KC is KC. A murderer and nothing else.

MOO

ETA - I haven't really decided on what I think about the Zenaida/Dora myspace yet but I do believe it's possible that some silly person following the case set it up. I know there was a lot of discussion about this a while back and some posters who were well versed in Myspace were saying that it was possible to alter the "sign up" date. I'm sure LE has followed up on this by now. If not, I hope they will soon.

I agree, there was no person, KC or otherwise, wandering around using the name ZFG. Usually the simplest answer is the correct one.

KC made up this name to pretend she had a sitter for whatever reason. The only thing I am questioning is if the Myspace page for Zenaida was created by KC.

Truthfully, if it was created by KC, I think it was made after the fact. That is, after Caylee was gone. Therefore, no premeditation.

I don't think GA and CA realize how much they are contributing to the premeditation issue by pretending KC had mentioned the name 'Zanny' on numerous occasions for over a year.

Don't they understand that, if that is the case, then the whole scenario gives credence to the premeditation probability??

I mean if there is no Zanny yet she was mentioned over a year ago on a regular basis and Zanny killed the baby, then the only conclusion is that the person who created Zanny killed the child.

JWG
09-02-2009, 08:57 PM
Nah, I'm not going to discuss the source per request. And, yes, we are discussing the Dora Zenaida myspace.

It is my intention to trust that LE ran this rabbit hole as far as they could. All I'll throw out is this...

if myspace was subpoenaed for MY myspace records their records would show an IP attached to Kingfisher, Oklahoma. That's exactly 2 hours and 20 minutes from where I live.

So I'm trusting they ran this rabbit hole plum to the bottom.

As Val told us, the source said the IP was located in south Florida. No more specific than that. When I asked "Miami?" the response was "I cannot say." :rolleyes:

I did not push further because I had previously checked the three IP addresses from the Photobucket subpoena materials released March 5. One can check IP addresses at http://whatismyipaddress.com/. I took the IP addresses listed in the documents and plopped them into the site. Two of them - the one at Tony's and the "mystery IP" that was not ID'd are both in Winter Park. The third - the Anthony's - is Orlando.

I think we have long established based on cell pings and home computer usage that KC did not leave the Anthony home. Therefore, she had to have been accessing the web through the Anthony IP address, which is Orlando. In fact, a 10:27 AM upload to Photobucket is tagged as being from that IP.

I know it can be hard to accept that this myspace page is not a result of KC because of the uncanny string of coincidences (the name, the Dora image, the birthdate, the sign-up date, the time the profile was last changed, the date of the login) but it in fact appears that it is nothing more than that. :waitasec:

What are the odds? Apparently 1 in 256,000. :bang:

cecybeans
09-02-2009, 09:00 PM
KC was in jail July 16-August 21, August 29-September 5, September 15-September 16, and October 14-now and forever.

So she was out Sept. 10, which means this other MySpace could possibly be real. But I'm not sure I care if KC made an essentially blank MySpace page while out of jail. The interesting thing about the Zenaida page was that it could help prove premeditation, which this other one can't.

No, but if it were created by her it after-the-fact would also point to a calculated cover-up.

Well, I'll be busy mixing pitchers of you-know-what...dang!

The Eunice Burns
09-02-2009, 09:04 PM
I have personally been told that:

1. ZG22 of the traffic ticket is NOT KC.

2. The IP address associated with the myspace is in SOUTHERN FLORIDA (i.e. probably Miami).

All roads lead to...nothing.

But at least we know now and don't have to waste our time in this area any longer. Thanks for all the help from everybody on getting to the truth in this particular area of this case. I can't express my gratitude adequately.

Nooooooooooooo! I feel like the air is seeping out of me......say it aint so. :raincloud: :no: I had such high hopes, like everyone.

Val, JWG, BJB, (and others who contributed who I may be overlooking.)thanks for all your tireless work. :bowdown: I learned a lot. And yes, we will need you for the next doc dump, as someone pointed out.

Sorry for the "late to the party" post, I just got caught up to speed.

christee
09-02-2009, 09:16 PM
Well, bummer.

Val and I can both vouch that OCSO did investigate this page earlier this spring when she sent them the information and that the IP address is not from the Orlando area. While it is possible to mask an IP, the investigation was characterized as "thorough" which presumably would also mean the friend ID associated with the page was not found on the computers.

Looks like it is just another one of many amazing coincidences.
No Way!!!
R U serious? Everything seemed to fit

Ok, Are we being Punked?!! :bang:

There goes my "If it looks like a duck..." policy!


*Shoot*

AZlawyer
09-02-2009, 09:25 PM
As Val told us, the source said the IP was located in south Florida. No more specific than that. When I asked "Miami?" the response was "I cannot say." :rolleyes:

I did not push further because I had previously checked the three IP addresses from the Photobucket subpoena materials released March 5. One can check IP addresses at http://whatismyipaddress.com/. I took the IP addresses listed in the documents and plopped them into the site. Two of them - the one at Tony's and the "mystery IP" that was not ID'd are both in Winter Park. The third - the Anthony's - is Orlando.

I think we have long established based on cell pings and home computer usage that KC did not leave the Anthony home. Therefore, she had to have been accessing the web through the Anthony IP address, which is Orlando. In fact, a 10:27 AM upload to Photobucket is tagged as being from that IP.

I know it can be hard to accept that this myspace page is not a result of KC because of the uncanny string of coincidences (the name, the Dora image, the birthdate, the sign-up date, the time the profile was last changed, the date of the login) but it in fact appears that it is nothing more than that. :waitasec:

What are the odds? Apparently 1 in 256,000. :bang:

JWG, I believe the third IP address (used for Photobucket activity late on June 9) was the laptop. So the three IP addresses are: the Anthony house (IP address located in Orlando), the one registered to Tony's roommate (IP address located in Winter Park), and the laptop (IP address located in Winter Park).

That was the first thing I checked--to see if maybe the laptop IP address was somehow in South Florida. :rolleyes:

christee
09-02-2009, 09:32 PM
I'm curious abt the two people who left a comment on the Video section of theZG/Dora MS pg. They seemed to think it was KCs pg.
I read thru early posts and didn't catch anything but I could have missed something if it was discussed.

Muzikman
09-02-2009, 10:21 PM
I have personally been told that:

1. ZG22 of the traffic ticket is NOT KC.

2. The IP address associated with the myspace is in SOUTHERN FLORIDA (i.e. probably Miami).

All roads lead to...nothing.

But at least we know now and don't have to waste our time in this area any longer. Thanks for all the help from everybody on getting to the truth in this particular area of this case. I can't express my gratitude adequately.

Well I wonder.... the 6/16 and 10/14 dates are just TOO coincidental.

Could a Myspace tech, following the case through the national attention it got, have set this up as a (cruel) joke? Miami IP addy included?

Just Jayla
09-02-2009, 10:37 PM
Well I wonder.... the 6/16 and 10/14 dates are just TOO coincidental.

Could a Myspace tech, following the case through the national attention it got, have set this up as a (cruel) joke? Miami IP addy included?



I was hopeful on this one, too!

Is it at all possible that maybe LE did find something but are not going to tell anyone, or even lie and say they found nothing? I know they're not typically liars, but maybe a judge would want that info sealed due to being inflammatory, and the state knows it could cause trouble if LE gave an affirmative back to an individual.

JWG
09-02-2009, 10:50 PM
I was hopeful on this one, too!

Is it at all possible that maybe LE did find something but are not going to tell anyone, or even lie and say they found nothing? I know they're not typically liars, but maybe a judge would want that info sealed due to being inflammatory, and the state knows it could cause trouble if LE gave an affirmative back to an individual.

It was a source, and I cannot think of a reason why the source would be misleading on the information.

Whyamisointerested
09-02-2009, 10:58 PM
I just cant even get over the fact how KC had told everyone that Zani was definately from MIAMI and so was her family.. Wasnt there a huge gap of unaccounted(non phone use) time on the 16th p.m. ? Could the times be off for any other reason? Could she have opened it in Orlando and then updated it on her cell phone internet while somewhere else? Any other connections to Miami area?Did anyone close visit there? Are GA's parent there? Lee? This has to be connected..If it was just a random Zani how come she has hasnt added any friends/done anything to it at all...Not sure how Myspace works has anyone tried requesting her as a friend? just doesnt make sense..ugh:(

Just Jayla
09-02-2009, 11:01 PM
It was a source, and I cannot think of a reason why the source would be misleading on the information.

Shucks...

JWG
09-02-2009, 11:31 PM
From what I can tell, there are 148 zenaida's on myspace in Florida. In some cases, the same person opened multiple accounts. myspace challenged like me, I guess. :bang:

A large percentage - maybe up to 20% - look like they were abandoned the day they signed up.

So it seems small odds to have one of those zenaida's decide to sign up on June 16, 2008 and stop using on October 14, 2008.

Even though the source more or less confirmed the dates were genuine and not faked, the IP was south Florida. Go figure. :waitasec:

kew17
09-02-2009, 11:35 PM
Nah, I'm not going to discuss the source per request. And, yes, we are discussing the Dora Zenaida myspace.

It is my intention to trust that LE ran this rabbit hole as far as they could. All I'll throw out is this...

if myspace was subpoenaed for MY myspace records their records would show an IP attached to Kingfisher, Oklahoma. That's exactly 2 hours and 20 minutes from where I live.

So I'm trusting they ran this rabbit hole plum to the bottom.

Kingfisher huh? wow - I actually know someone who lives there. I believe the town is so big that it actually has one traffic signal. Very small town. Hummmm........Isn't that near an Army base? ooppss...just saw you typed "your" myspace records, duh...it's late for me.

Valhall, JWG, BJB and the countless others ~ great sleuthing! My Momma told me I couldn't always get what I wanted or wished for. But I don't have to like it! Tremendous teamwork and investigating....I kinda feel sad right now.

JWG
09-02-2009, 11:36 PM
On the bright side, LE had to submit a subpoena to get the IP records for this page. On top of that, the existence of the page - if it were not KC - could be considered by the defense as exculpatory evidence. As a result, LE has to turn the investigative materials over to the defense as part of discovery.

Which means they will be part of some future document dump. At that point we will be able to get to the bottom of the mystery. :thumb:

ETA: Heck, I'm half motivated to send him the info and have him chase it down for us.

Geez...did I just say that? :waitasec: No, no, no, JWG...what are you thinking?? :doh:

abel
09-02-2009, 11:59 PM
Well, bummer.

Val and I can both vouch that OCSO did investigate this page earlier this spring when she sent them the information and that the IP address is not from the Orlando area. While it is possible to mask an IP, the investigation was characterized as "thorough" which presumably would also mean the friend ID associated with the page was not found on the computers.

Looks like it is just another one of many amazing coincidences.

BBM
Well, I say we keep the rabbit hunt going. Wasn't it earlier this Spring when they put the death penalty back on the table? ;)

TakeNote
09-03-2009, 02:35 AM
ok....popin in.....

just a thought......

could KC use her computer to access another computer ? and then from that computer access the myspace you all are talking about?

......who does KC know from Winter Park?....

Searchfortruth
09-03-2009, 07:24 AM
I don't believe that KC was "Zenaida". I think KC invented the nanny when the Grunds told her to get a babysitter and she's been nursing her story ever since. Possibly, she found someone on the internet that suited her purposes, or she bumped into her somewhere (tattoo parlour, grocery store) and honed in but I don't believe that the nanny existed in any way shape or form in Caylee's life or in her (horribly unfortunate) death. KC is KC. A murderer and nothing else.

MOO

ETA - I haven't really decided on what I think about the Zenaida/Dora myspace yet but I do believe it's possible that some silly person following the case set it up. I know there was a lot of discussion about this a while back and some posters who were well versed in Myspace were saying that it was possible to alter the "sign up" date. I'm sure LE has followed up on this by now. If not, I hope they will soon.
I agree Pink Panther...the whole Zenaida thing was a story she first provided to the Grunds and kept using it when the situation arose...much easier than making up a whole new story. By the time LE got involved she had uttered Zanny's name so many times it rolled off her tongue effortlessly.

sarah7855
09-03-2009, 07:55 AM
ok....popin in.....

just a thought......

could KC use her computer to access another computer ? and then from that computer access the myspace you all are talking about?

......who does KC know from Winter Park?......

A good portion of IP addys and phone #'s in this area show up as winter park, mine included. It's a town within the city of orlando :)

sarah7855
09-03-2009, 08:05 AM
On the bright side, LE had to submit a subpoena to get the IP records for this page. On top of that, the existence of the page - if it were not KC - could be considered by the defense as exculpatory evidence. As a result, LE has to turn the investigative materials over to the defense as part of discovery.

Which means they will be part of some future document dump. At that point we will be able to get to the bottom of the mystery. :thumb:

ETA: Heck, I'm half motivated to send him the info and have him chase it down for us.

Geez...did I just say that? :waitasec: No, no, no, JWG...what are you thinking?? :doh:

While I'm happy that it'll come out in a doc dump so we can sleuth it with full info, I'm not happy that it could potentially be exculpatory...like I said yesterday, this now makes me question a lot of personal beliefs about this case.
Regardless, thank you so much, you, Val & BJB in particular, for all of your tireless hard work. All of your sleuthing is top notch, and it is much appreciated.

sarah7855
09-03-2009, 08:17 AM
I might just be grasping at straws / in denial / whatever you want to call it, since I so desperately wanted the Zani page to be Casey's work...

But Miami is what - 3, 4 hours away from Orlando? When you first said "non-Orlando area..." I was thinking it would end up being Nebraska, or North Dakota, or some other seemingly random locale. But just a few hours down the interstate? It does seem to me like this could still be related somehow.

I was the first to cry "coincidence" with all of the Zenaida's backyard touching a Gonzales' backyard, touching a burial spot with Caylee's birthday as an address comparisons. Some facets of this case just seem way out there to me.

But a Myspace page with the nanny's name, a location she was associated with, a Dora picture... likely created the day Caylee was killed and last accessed the day Casey went to jail?? That just seems like too much to just be fate playing games with us.

ETA: Just wanted to add that, Valhall, I'm in no way implying that I don't believe you, or distrust the extensive work you've done on this topic. I completely trust you and your sources - just having a hard time rationalizing the level of mere coincidences!

I agree a million percent with every single word of your post. Thank you for saying it a million times better than I ever could have :)

WolfmarsGirl
09-03-2009, 10:57 AM
From what I can tell, there are 148 zenaida's on myspace in Florida.

snipped

JWG, have you looked into all of those 148 accounts (not that you need more work to do...)?

What I am getting at is this: Do any of those 'zenaida' myspace accounts match the description in the Dora account?? Were they set up the same day and have the same age and location, for instance?

If so, then we can pretty much assume a genuine Zenaida just abandoned her first account with Dora on it and set up another one.

If not, then what happened to Dora/Zenaida? She just never came back? Except, of course, October 14th?

Could KC have called a long-distance friend and said something like, "Hey, my nanny wants me to set her up a Myspace today. I am dealing with the snot-head and I don't have time to do it. Could you do it for me???"

Then KC accessed it on 10/14 (and maybe prior) to see if the page looked legit.

The only problem I have with that possibility is that the 'friend' would have come forward by now. All in all, it seems like KC had a bunch of seemingly normal kids as friends, so I can't see someone keeping a secret like that from LE unless KC was holding something over their head.

Remember how KC mentioned a few times to her parents in jail visits that she would like to see Ryan? In my opinion, she was trying to snag a new boyfriend, lol. But, maybe it was more than that..

Reagan
09-03-2009, 12:15 PM
Val and JWG,
Thanks... Yesterday I somehow missed the part where you guys explained 'how' it was debunked. I just read one day that the zenaida myspace was still a possibility, then the next day it wasn't. I didn't catch the whole 'a valid source informed us it wasn't KC'. So I was extremely confused.

So yea.. thanks again for the info. And thanks for all the hard work you guys have done.

P.S Val, I think I told you this before, but I printed out your comprehensive timeline from another site (I think your husbands?) at work and got spanked for it. lol
It was like a gajillion pages. The printer almost exploded. :)
It's very handy when I'm at home doing my own research on the case. So thanks for your hard work especially.

TotallyObsessed
09-03-2009, 01:07 PM
As Val told us, the source said the IP was located in south Florida. No more specific than that. When I asked "Miami?" the response was "I cannot say." :rolleyes:

I did not push further because I had previously checked the three IP addresses from the Photobucket subpoena materials released March 5. One can check IP addresses at http://whatismyipaddress.com/. I took the IP addresses listed in the documents and plopped them into the site. Two of them - the one at Tony's and the "mystery IP" that was not ID'd are both in Winter Park. The third - the Anthony's - is Orlando.

I think we have long established based on cell pings and home computer usage that KC did not leave the Anthony home. Therefore, she had to have been accessing the web through the Anthony IP address, which is Orlando. In fact, a 10:27 AM upload to Photobucket is tagged as being from that IP.

I know it can be hard to accept that this myspace page is not a result of KC because of the uncanny string of coincidences (the name, the Dora image, the birthdate, the sign-up date, the time the profile was last changed, the date of the login) but it in fact appears that it is nothing more than that. :waitasec:

What are the odds? Apparently 1 in 256,000. :bang:


That's the same way I feel about the odds of a real ZG showing up at Sawgrass Apartments to be used to fill the fictitious ZG Nanny story. WTH? I have never, ever been able to accept that as a coincidence and I can't accept this MS creation as a coincidence either.

AND GREAT WORK to all on this thread.

Woe.be.gone
09-03-2009, 01:37 PM
I remember that AD was involved in the traffic tickets and ZG id mixup, court proceeding things, etc. She lawyered up, backstroke from being KC's best friend, yet slumbered over at the house when KC was on house arrest. She had lived at SG and was a little difficult for LE to contact initially. I'm just saying something does not smell right about all of this. Like AD said, KC must have had other people involved as "she is not smart enough" to do "this" alone. Something to that effect. I'll bet ya, AD knows more about Caylee's story - whatever it is - than she has told LE.

Don't everybody get excited - I'm not accusing her of killing Caylee - just saying I think she knows the truth about what happened to her. Why would she need a Lawyer? I've wondered about that a lot. (wrong thread though)

WolfmarsGirl
09-03-2009, 03:36 PM
I remember that AD was involved in the traffic tickets and ZG id mixup, court proceeding things, etc. She lawyered up, backstroke from being KC's best friend, yet slumbered over at the house when KC was on house arrest. She had lived at SG and was a little difficult for LE to contact initially. I'm just saying something does not smell right about all of this. Like AD said, KC must have had other people involved as "she is not smart enough" to do "this" alone. Something to that effect. I'll bet ya, AD knows more about Caylee's story - whatever it is - than she has told LE.

Don't everybody get excited - I'm not accusing her of killing Caylee - just saying I think she knows the truth about what happened to her. Why would she need a Lawyer? I've wondered about that a lot. (wrong thread though)

Not to go OT here, but I think the BFF thing ended the night KC and AD made out at the Halloween party in Oct. of '06. I think AD mentioned something about not being KC's best friend after that date. In fact, I think she was pretty specific about the month and year they stopped being close. (She did not mention the incident though.)

I mean, how could normal, straight young girls remain friends after something like that??? Creepy, to say the least. Maybe AD had guilt and creepy feelings about KC after that, so she backed away...

Befriending her again after Caylee went missing seems normal enough considering the amount of time that had passed since the make-out session...

Woe.be.gone
09-03-2009, 03:55 PM
The thread is about the identity of ZG. AD was present when the d.l. of ZG was presented to LE. That is why I brought it up. AD could be connected (in KC's mind) to ZG. AD lived at SG in the past.

Don't know about those two making out together - do know AD was at KC's 21st B-day party (there are pictures) which would have been in March of 2007 - correct? KC is 23 now I believe.

Woe.be.gone
09-03-2009, 04:11 PM
It was a source, and I cannot think of a reason why the source would be misleading on the information.

The sources that count here are the ones that everyone is allowed access to though - you can understand that. I can say "My source said blah, blah, blah" why just believe me?

I mean no offense to you or anyone else but tell me why I'm wrong? :slap:

WolfmarsGirl
09-03-2009, 04:21 PM
The thread is about the identity of ZG. AD was present when the d.l. of ZG was presented to LE. That is why I brought it up. AD could be connected (in KC's mind) to ZG. AD lived at SG in the past.

Don't know about those two making out together - do know AD was at KC's 21st B-day party (there are pictures) which would have been in March of 2007 - correct? KC is 23 now I believe.

Remember the Halloween pics with KC and AD in costume? That is what I am talking about. I don't have the link, but it is the set of pics where KC is eating a lollipop.

WolfmarsGirl
09-03-2009, 04:23 PM
The sources that count here are the ones that everyone is allowed access to though - you can understand that. I can say "My source said blah, blah, blah" why just believe me?

I mean no offense to you or anyone else but tell me why I'm wrong? :slap:

I agree. My sister-in-law who is in LE in LA 'leaked' info to us about the OJ case and a bunch of 'top secret' files that were not released that would seal OJ's guilt (in the murder trial, that is.) Well, she was wrong, sad to say.

While we should believe our sources, if they are credible, it is difficult to believe anyone who is not invovled with the prosecution directly. I am talking about LE or DA. If the source is, in fact, one of those then we should believe it. If not, take it with a grain of salt, even if we personally trust the source.

On the other hand, if the source is a Myspace tech who would also know about this zenaida page, then he/she might be correct.

There are just too many coincidences here to ignore.

WolfmarsGirl
09-03-2009, 04:32 PM
The thread is about the identity of ZG. AD was present when the d.l. of ZG was presented to LE. That is why I brought it up. AD could be connected (in KC's mind) to ZG. AD lived at SG in the past.

Don't know about those two making out together - do know AD was at KC's 21st B-day party (there are pictures) which would have been in March of 2007 - correct? KC is 23 now I believe.

I think AD was there, but not in a 'best' friend capacity. AD stated in her deposition that her and KC had stopped being close around october of 06. I will try to find a link. (sorry, not good with that stuff like links, lol)

Do we know for a fact that AD was present when the dl of zanaida was presented? I think I missed a lot of this thread. Sorry about that.

TotallyObsessed
09-03-2009, 04:46 PM
I think AD was there, but not in a 'best' friend capacity. AD stated in her deposition that her and KC had stopped being close around october of 06. I will try to find a link. (sorry, not good with that stuff like links, lol)

Do we know for a fact that AD was present when the dl of zanaida was presented? I think I missed a lot of this thread. Sorry about that.

And do we know for a fact that a dl of zanaida was ever presented? I don't remember anything about that - all I remember is one of the original responding officers taking something out of KC's wallet when Cindy dumped it out on the floor and stole the $200....

what have I missed about this DL? sorry

AZlawyer
09-03-2009, 06:12 PM
The thread is about the identity of ZG. AD was present when the d.l. of ZG was presented to LE. That is why I brought it up. AD could be connected (in KC's mind) to ZG. AD lived at SG in the past.

Don't know about those two making out together - do know AD was at KC's 21st B-day party (there are pictures) which would have been in March of 2007 - correct? KC is 23 now I believe.


I think AD was there, but not in a 'best' friend capacity. AD stated in her deposition that her and KC had stopped being close around october of 06. I will try to find a link. (sorry, not good with that stuff like links, lol)

Do we know for a fact that AD was present when the dl of zanaida was presented? I think I missed a lot of this thread. Sorry about that.

We definitely do not know that AD was present when any ZG license was ever presented to LE. No one has testified to that, and no document supports that conclusion.

Valhall
09-03-2009, 06:26 PM
The sources that count here are the ones that everyone is allowed access to though - you can understand that. I can say "My source said blah, blah, blah" why just believe me?

I mean no offense to you or anyone else but tell me why I'm wrong? :slap:

You are very correct. So you'll have to decide how you take the information we've given you considering we're not naming the source. You are free to disregard it if you choose, and it will be understood why. We're just telling you what we've been told, and that's all we can do.

Woe.be.gone
09-03-2009, 06:59 PM
We definitely do not know that AD was present when any ZG license was ever presented to LE. No one has testified to that, and no document supports that conclusion.

As you say - I just searched under the key words I remember as being significant to the story of the traffic tickets of KC and AD. I can't find it. It doesn't matter enough to me to argue or try to prove anything (I never knew if it was true to begin with). I just know that there was once pages and pages discussed about a theory that KC and AD and someone posing as ZG and mysterious traffic tickets. The tickets would have been written in early 2008 I think. The pages here delt with when they paid the ticket, when someone did not pay a ticket, the distances between places where the tickets could have been paid, etc. Even the poster is no longer listed here so I don't know what to think.

We can't possibly know the truth if we are being (what to call it?) kept from knowing information especially if after we think we do know it. Honestly, I don't know what to think. The trial will come eventually. Even then, we'll have people saying they didn't say that, they didn't say this. Time will tell I guess.

O/T but someone brought it up - I'm glad OJ's butt is in the clink finally. That was a great example of justice - NOT!

AZlawyer
09-03-2009, 07:16 PM
As you say - I just searched under the key words I remember as being significant to the story of the traffic tickets of KC and AD. I can't find it. It doesn't matter enough to me to argue or try to prove anything (I never knew if it was true to begin with). I just know that there was once pages and pages discussed about a theory that KC and AD and someone posing as ZG and mysterious traffic tickets. The tickets would have been written in early 2008 I think. The pages here delt with when they paid the ticket, when someone did not pay a ticket, the distances between places where the tickets could have been paid, etc. Even the poster is no longer listed here so I don't know what to think.

We can't possibly know the truth if we are being (what to call it?) kept from knowing information especially if after we think we do know it. Honestly, I don't know what to think. The trial will come eventually. Even then, we'll have people saying they didn't say that, they didn't say this. Time will tell I guess.

O/T but someone brought it up - I'm glad OJ's butt is in the clink finally. That was a great example of justice - NOT!

Oh, there was definitely a theory--I think it's earlier in this same thread! :blowkiss: Didn't mean to say you were misremembering the theory--just that there was no testimonial or documentary evidence from which you could say "AD was there when ZG's license was handed to LE" or anything like that. At most, IIRC, you could say that AD got a ticket the same day (but from a different officer) as someone named ZG. There were also a bunch of interesting questions like whether or not KC might have needed that $250 cash she got from Amy's account to make a payment that same day on the ZG ticket, whether or not the amount of AD's fine indicated there were two people in her car, etc.

I believe this is the other theory that JWG announced was squelched by his source, who says the ZG from the traffic ticket is a real, separate person (not KC) who is now back in Mexico (thus explaining why she hasn't bothered to clear up her ticket).

JWG
09-03-2009, 07:21 PM
The sources that count here are the ones that everyone is allowed access to though - you can understand that. I can say "My source said blah, blah, blah" why just believe me?

I mean no offense to you or anyone else but tell me why I'm wrong? :slap:

No offense taken.

I have always been skeptical of folks that post on boards - especially anonymously like me :slap: - who say a little birdie told me :chicken: ...trust me :deal:.

I take them with a big grain of salt, and fully expected the same sort of skepticism :snooty: when I posted the "bummer" message yesterday. I won't bother trying to allude to credentials of the person. It won't help win over converts ... and ... I promised this person I would not :silenced:.

All I will say is that Val received the same call and knows who the person is, and holds the person in the same regard :thumb:. Yesterday was a roller-coaster ride because earlier in the morning we were really walking down the path - with this source - where that website was KC. The bombshell left me stunned :eek:, and I am sure it did Val as well.

Remember, Val found this site and did as much as humanly possible to validate it without the benefit of a subpoena :highfive:. If she alone said it had been debunked I would have believed her without needing to get the call, because I know how hard it can be to invest so much time in something that appears so promising but ends up a dead end. :bang:

So, some of us might feel befuddled, shocked, and disappointed, but imagine how Val feels. Val...don't let this deter you...you are a great sleuth :blowkiss:.

AZlawyer
09-03-2009, 07:28 PM
No offense taken.

I have always been skeptical of folks that post on boards - especially anonymously like me :slap: - who say a little birdie told me :chicken: ...trust me :deal:.

I take them with a big grain of salt, and fully expected the same sort of skepticism :snooty: when I posted the "bummer" message yesterday. I won't bother trying to allude to credentials of the person. It won't help win over converts ... and ... I promised this person I would not :silenced:.

All I will say is that Val received the same call and knows who the person is, and holds the person in the same regard :thumb:. Yesterday was a roller-coaster ride because earlier in the morning we were really walking down the path - with this source - where that website was KC. The bombshell left me stunned :eek:, and I am sure it did Val as well.

Remember, Val found this site and did as much as humanly possible to validate it without the benefit of a subpoena :highfive:. If she alone said it had been debunked I would have believed her without needing to get the call, because I know how hard it can be to invest so much time in something that appears so promising but ends up a dead end. :bang:

So, some of us might feel befuddled, shocked, and disappointed, but imagine how Val feels. Val...don't let this deter you...you are a great sleuth :blowkiss:.

That's a really good point, JWG...one reason to trust the source is because the source was just as surprised and disappointed as you and Val were to learn the truth.

WolfmarsGirl
09-03-2009, 07:36 PM
And do we know for a fact that a dl of zanaida was ever presented? I don't remember anything about that -

snipped

You are 100% correct. If there was a Zenaida dl in KC's posession, or if anyone presented a dl with Zenaida on it in AD's presence, then we would have iron-clad evidence for either the prosecution or the defense.

If AD was hanging out with someone other than KC who had such a license, then there would be evidence of the existance of a living, breathing ZFG.

Or, if the ZG license was on KC's person, then the prosecution would have pretty much sewed everything up with that one piece of evidence.

So, no, there could not have been any dl with the name Zenaida presented in AD's presence unless she just happened to be in the courthouse at the same time as this zenaida person.

Just Jayla
09-03-2009, 09:10 PM
We definitely do not know that AD was present when any ZG license was ever presented to LE. No one has testified to that, and no document supports that conclusion.

I might have confused myself here, but when did KC possibly show LE a ZG license? Wasn't the ticket for not having a license? Or was it that the doctored license was expired?

http://www.myorangeclerk.com/myclerk/Details.aspx?SessionID=b373c8b3-c600-4e15-9d8b-4207df02631d&CaseID=5898474


If she did not show a license, then having a ZG ID would not apply to the 05/24 traffic stop.

AZlawyer
09-03-2009, 09:14 PM
I might have confused myself here, but when did KC possibly show LE a ZG license? Wasn't the ticket for not having a license? Or was it that the doctored license was expired?

http://www.myorangeclerk.com/myclerk/Details.aspx?SessionID=b373c8b3-c600-4e15-9d8b-4207df02631d&CaseID=5898474


If she did not show a license, then having a ZG ID would not apply to the 05/24 traffic stop.

Right. A bunch of things were getting confused, but the bottom line is it appears that this lead went nowhere anyway.

Just Jayla
09-03-2009, 09:15 PM
You are very correct. So you'll have to decide how you take the information we've given you considering we're not naming the source. You are free to disregard it if you choose, and it will be understood why. We're just telling you what we've been told, and that's all we can do.

Valhall, did your source mention whether AD/anyone close to the case (I'm not really sure I suspect AD) could be ruled out as having set up the MySpace? In other words, was the information given stated as "KC had no connection to this", or "KC nor anyone she knows had anything to do with this MySpace"? What was your interpretation?

Valhall
09-03-2009, 09:28 PM
Valhall, did your source mention whether AD/anyone close to the case (I'm not really sure I suspect AD) could be ruled out as having set up the MySpace? In other words, was the information given stated as "KC had no connection to this", or "KC nor anyone she knows had anything to do with this MySpace"? What was your interpretation?

I will attempt to quote as best I can from memory.

Early yesterday (around 10:30 am CT) the source was saying that my tip in February had been overlooked and not followed up on, and that when the latest findings (i.e. the myspace page was definitely created on 6/16/08) were revealed LE was regretful they had lost my tip in the "white noise" of so many tips they had received (and probably are still getting) and hadn't followed up. At that time (prior to noon CT yesterday) they were "jumping through their asses" to get information on this.

About 4 hours later I received a call from the source and was told that my tip, submitted in February, had been followed up thoroughly at that time and that it resulted in the zenaida myspace being determined to have been created by an IP in "southern Florida". The source stated "while IP addresses can be duped" it was assumed to have been sufficiently researched and "her cell phone records do not show a call to the 305 area code" so it most likely was not a matter of her contacting a friend in that area to create the myspace.

While JWG has shared that the same source told him that the userid of the myspace had not turned up in forensic searches on the computer (i.e. the myspace userid was not found)...that has not been stated to me. I actually did not ask any questions, I just listened and said thank you for the information.

I was devastated, but grateful to get the information. I do not want to waste anyone's time - including my own - but more specifically all of yours or LE's.

chefmom
09-03-2009, 10:23 PM
I will attempt to quote as best I can from memory.

Early yesterday (around 10:30 am CT) the source was saying that my tip in February had been overlooked and not followed up on, and that when the latest findings (i.e. the myspace page was definitely created on 6/16/08) were revealed LE was regretful they had lost my tip in the "white noise" of so many tips they had received (and probably are still getting) and hadn't followed up. At that time (prior to noon CT yesterday) they were "jumping through their asses" to get information on this.

About 4 hours later I received a call from the source and was told that my tip, submitted in February, had been followed up thoroughly at that time and that it resulted in the zenaida myspace being determined to have been created by an IP in "southern Florida". The source stated "while IP addresses can be duped" it was assumed to have been sufficiently researched and "her cell phone records do not show a call to the 305 area code" so it most likely was not a matter of her contacting a friend in that area to create the myspace.

While JWG has shared that the same source told him that the userid of the myspace had not turned up in forensic searches on the computer (i.e. the myspace userid was not found)...that has not been stated to me. I actually did not ask any questions, I just listened and said thank you for the information.

I was devastated, but grateful to get the information. I do not want to waste anyone's time - including my own - but more specifically all of yours or LE's.

Val, :smoochiesmilie:! You did some AWESOME sleuthing on this and we were all very impressed with the way you did it! :bow: Everyone is, of course, disappointed that it turned out to not be true because we were all vested in the fact that it was. Please! Don't let this deter you from the fine sleuthing that you have been doing! Even seasoned agents and detectives have this happen to them. But, if you don't follow the leads and hunches to their inevitable end, we would never figure anything out. So, kudos to you and the others who found this tidbit of info and followed it through to the end! :applause: Keep on sleuthing! :sleuth:

JWG
09-03-2009, 10:50 PM
Val, :smoochiesmilie:! You did some AWESOME sleuthing on this and we were all very impressed with the way you did it! :bow: Everyone is, of course, disappointed that it turned out to not be true because we were all vested in the fact that it was. Please! Don't let this deter you from the fine sleuthing that you have been doing! Even seasoned agents and detectives have this happen to them. But, if you don't follow the leads and hunches to their inevitable end, we would never figure anything out. So, kudos to you and the others who found this tidbit of info and followed it through to the end! :applause: Keep on sleuthing! :sleuth:

Our "source" even philosophically said (paraphrasing) "I'd rather know the truth and be disappointed than not know what the truth is."

chefmom
09-03-2009, 11:01 PM
Our "source" even philosophically said (paraphrasing) "I'd rather know the truth and be disappointed than not know what the truth is."

ITA! Even if we don't like the truth, at least we will know what it is. You guys are fantastic at figuring things out! Keep up the good work!

:blowkiss:

BondJamesBond
09-03-2009, 11:09 PM
Esp. impressed w/ the way this was handled. :thumb: :detective: :clap:

Insofaras nothing is 100% (Cindyism) it is just gonna take some time to sink in that this was all an amazing coincidence.

Personally, I really appreciate all the effort on Val & JWG's part to creatively & thoroughly sleuth this out and keep us informed along the way. I hope both of you realize - regardless of the outcome - that giving this the 'wire brush' really is a great example of seeking justice for Caylee. Really like the source quote too, JWG...very likeminded ;)

Just Jayla
09-03-2009, 11:41 PM
I will attempt to quote as best I can from memory.

Early yesterday (around 10:30 am CT) the source was saying that my tip in February had been overlooked and not followed up on, and that when the latest findings (i.e. the myspace page was definitely created on 6/16/08) were revealed LE was regretful they had lost my tip in the "white noise" of so many tips they had received (and probably are still getting) and hadn't followed up. At that time (prior to noon CT yesterday) they were "jumping through their asses" to get information on this.

About 4 hours later I received a call from the source and was told that my tip, submitted in February, had been followed up thoroughly at that time and that it resulted in the zenaida myspace being determined to have been created by an IP in "southern Florida". The source stated "while IP addresses can be duped" it was assumed to have been sufficiently researched and "her cell phone records do not show a call to the 305 area code" so it most likely was not a matter of her contacting a friend in that area to create the myspace.

While JWG has shared that the same source told him that the userid of the myspace had not turned up in forensic searches on the computer (i.e. the myspace userid was not found)...that has not been stated to me. I actually did not ask any questions, I just listened and said thank you for the information.

I was devastated, but grateful to get the information. I do not want to waste anyone's time - including my own - but more specifically all of yours or LE's.



Thank you for sharing that....that does not leave a lot of wiggle room-
It does not sound like a "Richard Cain" happened-in other words, it sounds like they gave enough detail to tell us that they did indeed look at it in some detail.
It also seems to rule out a FrankM, or AD, or JG for that matter.

Too bad, my spirits were high on this one, but I think they just landed on my head on their way down :(

ExpectingUnicorns
09-03-2009, 11:59 PM
I so stand in awe of Valhall and those of you who were so intimately involved in discovering all the facts in this thread. After you all put so much time and effort into this discovery I know I can take it to the bank that if you believe your source then I do too. Please don't feel like you have to defend it. And please try not to be devastated because even if it turned out to be a dead end we all still learned a lot! We WSers have been on a wonderful tour of many analytical minds as well as tours of the county clerk's site and how to research almost everything there, a condensed course of computer forensics (I was limping along there at the back of the line), how MySpace works, time zones, cell tower pings and too many other things for my brain to spit out right now. It has been wonderful. So if you sense any frustration from those of us who have been following all your hard work please understand that it's directed not at you but because we, too, thought you had found that perfect piece that completed the ugly puzzle. It seemed to fit just right and bring the entire picture together. If we WSers are so disappointed, I can hardly imagine how you all who have put all the energy into this project must feel. Even though it didn't produce the end result that we had all hoped for it was still a wonderful exercise and produced many beneficial dividends. Thank you, thank you, thank you!

Just Jayla
09-04-2009, 12:06 AM
I so stand in awe of Valhall and those of you who were so intimately involved in discovering all the facts in this thread. After you all put so much time and effort into this discovery I know I can take it to the bank that if you believe your source then I do too. Please don't feel like you have to defend it. And please try not to be devastated because even if it turned out to be a dead end we all still learned a lot! We WSers have been on a wonderful tour of many analytical minds as well as tours of the county clerk's site and how to research almost everything there, a condensed course of computer forensics (I was limping along there at the back of the line), how MySpace works, time zones, cell tower pings and too many other things for my brain to spit out right now. It has been wonderful. So if you sense any frustration from those of us who have been following all your hard work please understand that it's directed not at you but because we, too, thought you had found that perfect piece that completed the ugly puzzle. It seemed to fit just right and bring the entire picture together. If we WSers are so disappointed, I can hardly imagine how you all who have put all the energy into this project must feel. Even though it didn't produce the end result that we had all hoped for it was still a wonderful exercise and produced many beneficial dividends. Thank you, thank you, thank you!


:clap:

And we are not done! Have to roll up our sleeves and get back to making the Sawgrass connection with ZG. I may be a little more apt now to accept that there are some coincidences in this case, but is the ZG that went to Sawgrass on the 17th of June yet another coincidence?
She still would have a civil case, but from KC's POV, could it be coincidental?

Valhall
09-04-2009, 06:08 AM
Our "source" even philosophically said (paraphrasing) "I'd rather know the truth and be disappointed than not know what the truth is."

That's weird in a nice kind of way because at the end of the conversation that's pretty much what I told him. "Thank you for calling me and letting me know this. I had hoped this was something that could help, but I really just want to know the truth." And he agreed.

The main reason I was devastated was not so much because it turned out to be nothing (that's bad enough as it is), but it was the 4 hour roller coaster ride of the day. For 4 hours I thought it had never been looked into and there was a big chance, then BAM! the rollercoaster fell plum off the tracks!

haha - :(

Valhall
09-04-2009, 06:12 AM
:clap:

And we are not done! Have to roll up our sleeves and get back to making the Sawgrass connection with ZG. I may be a little more apt now to accept that there are some coincidences in this case, but is the ZG that went to Sawgrass on the 17th of June yet another coincidence?
She still would have a civil case, but from KC's POV, could it be coincidental?

IF there is a real connection (i.e. KC had foreknowledge that ZFG was going to be there), I think our best bet at finding out how is in a chunk of discovery that has yet to be released...

the full activity log from their ISP - Bright House. I'm going to have to be doubly disappointed if there isn't some very telling nuggets in that log.

Woe.be.gone
09-04-2009, 12:59 PM
IF there is a real connection (i.e. KC had foreknowledge that ZFG was going to be there), I think our best bet at finding out how is in a chunk of discovery that has yet to be released...

the full activity log from their ISP - Bright House. I'm going to have to be doubly disappointed if there isn't some very telling nuggets in that log.

Look at that picture of CA you have there on your space, that's how I looked yesterday after reading that all your great sleuthing had been debunked! :mad::furious::mad:

I had been thinking "finally there is evidence to bring forth the truth." :blowkiss:

:waitasec: Then, dum.dum.da.dum., the CA look came over me!!!! :eek:

WolfmarsGirl
09-04-2009, 03:03 PM
I will attempt to quote as best I can from memory.

Early yesterday (around 10:30 am CT) the source was saying that my tip in February had been overlooked and not followed up on, and that when the latest findings (i.e. the myspace page was definitely created on 6/16/08) were revealed LE was regretful they had lost my tip in the "white noise" of so many tips they had received (and probably are still getting) and hadn't followed up. At that time (prior to noon CT yesterday) they were "jumping through their asses" to get information on this.

About 4 hours later I received a call from the source and was told that my tip, submitted in February, had been followed up thoroughly at that time and that it resulted in the zenaida myspace being determined to have been created by an IP in "southern Florida". The source stated "while IP addresses can be duped" it was assumed to have been sufficiently researched and "her cell phone records do not show a call to the 305 area code" so it most likely was not a matter of her contacting a friend in that area to create the myspace.

While JWG has shared that the same source told him that the userid of the myspace had not turned up in forensic searches on the computer (i.e. the myspace userid was not found)...that has not been stated to me. I actually did not ask any questions, I just listened and said thank you for the information.

I was devastated, but grateful to get the information. I do not want to waste anyone's time - including my own - but more specifically all of yours or LE's.

Thanks Val.

Although I/we have no right to know who your source is, I think I understand now who it is.

Well, maybe I don't know who, but I get where and which agency this person represents.

The point is, I have complete faith in your source now. Thank you for sharing. :biggrin:

Tulessa
09-30-2009, 06:06 PM
Well he's done his research wonder if he's a member here...even filmed the home the PI videoed and knew who the previous owners were there as well and the backyard looks cleaned up.
Wonder when Part 3 of the Casey Tour of Orlando will be posted?

Here's his site.

Sorry if it's been posted already.



http://marinadedave.wordpress.com/

Valhall
10-24-2009, 11:09 PM
So...maybe this subject isn't dead.

There is a suspicion - held by at least myself - that after we contacted OCSO at the first of September, they did, in fact, look into the myspace page. And, there is a suspicion - held by at least myself - that maybe we were misled so that they could have time to look into it.

There's been a development, if you will, in the past week. The zenaida myspace

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=389838213

has changed.

Note that the video link that was formerly present (which would lead you to a video comment area where you could post a comment without being approved as a friend - like two men, including marinadedave did)...

http://www.thehinkymeter.com/images/CMA/zenaidamyspace090109.jpg

http://www.thehinkymeter.com/images/CMA/zenaidamyspacevideocomments.jpg

Is no longer there...

http://www.thehinkymeter.com/images/CMA/zenaidavideos.jpg

So you can't even get to the location where the comments could be made and were made.

I spoke to my friend in computer forensics and he said the first thing that is done in a computer or cyber forensics investigation is to "freeze" the files so that no contamination can take place once the investigation has started.

Maybe they have.

Reagan
10-25-2009, 12:08 AM
Thanks for the info. I hope computer forensics guy is right. I thought this had to be more than a coincidence, and was very disappointed when it was said to be disproved (I never read the in-depth answer as to why though)

I assume this zenaida myspace was checked on quite often. Enough to notice if that video link has remained there since the creation of it (or a month or so later when sleuthers found it) and noticed that it is no longer valid for the first time.

I'm curious as to what made you take another look at the zenaida myspace when it was supposedly determined it had no relation to KC?

darnudes
10-25-2009, 02:21 AM
You know what, I bet there is something in this. Not that I doubted you and JWG at the time but I just didn't think it had been cleared up enough for my liking. I won't be satisfied until the trial and it all comes out or not.

My money is still on that Casey made this page.

Valhall
10-25-2009, 06:29 AM
Thanks for the info. I hope computer forensics guy is right. I thought this had to be more than a coincidence, and was very disappointed when it was said to be disproved (I never read the in-depth answer as to why though)

I assume this zenaida myspace was checked on quite often. Enough to notice if that video link has remained there since the creation of it (or a month or so later when sleuthers found it) and noticed that it is no longer valid for the first time.

I'm curious as to what made you take another look at the zenaida myspace when it was supposedly determined it had no relation to KC?

I've checked it at least once a week even.. :). I noticed the video link was gone Friday and I got hold of JWG. He has been checking the site weekly as well... :) So he thinks it was around Wednesday when he checked it and the videos link was still there.

P.S. Because my hinky meter went off with the abrupt change of story concerning the myspace. Then when Tracy McLaughlin stated KC had spent her days at JB's office on myspace, my head started hurting.

ThoughtFox
10-25-2009, 06:43 AM
Valhall: I did not follow this discussion of your sleuthing when it was first posted, but nothing is over until it's over. There may still be something strange going on here.

You may feel this didn't go anywhere, or was a dead end. But you still raised some important questions about the whole Zenaida question and the way Casey was trying to "invent" a different persona.

I've been around Websleuths long enough to realize that time spent talking about a great theory is never wasted because it's a learning experience. The stuff people learned from your research might help solve the next crime that comes along, or save a child who is still alive.

QB.
10-25-2009, 07:32 AM
I was so glad to see this thread re-emerge. I was not convinced this was completely looked into and was dropped by LE.
Has anyone ever heard of Foxy Proxy?
I remember the reason given it was dropped was that the IP address was from Miami or at least not Orlando. I think if one is clever enough this can be manipulated.

Is it possible a tool like Foxy Proxy was used to change IP address?

JWG
10-25-2009, 09:41 AM
I've checked it at least once a week even.. :). I noticed the video link was gone Friday and I got hold of JWG. He has been checking the site weekly as well... :) So he thinks it was around Wednesday when he checked it and the videos link was still there.


Sometime Monday through Wednesday. It had gotten to the point where I did it almost absent-mindedly. The link into the video page where the comments could be seen was stored in my "Last 7 days" history, so I clicked on it after Val told me the videos page link was missing, and I got the following:

5840


I was so glad to see this thread re-emerge. I was not convinced this was completely looked into and was dropped by LE.
Has anyone ever heard of Foxy Proxy?
I remember the reason given it was dropped was that the IP address was from Miami or at least not Orlando. I think if one is clever enough this can be manipulated.

Is it possible a tool like Foxy Proxy was used to change IP address?

The problem is the use of Foxy Proxy still requires someone like Casey to go out and find an anonymous proxy server located in Miami, FL and then configure Firefox to use that server. That's a lot harder than one might think, and I don't know that KC would have gone to the trouble. After all, this is a girl that did not pay a lot of attention to the uniqueness of the duct tape she used - which she took from the garage and then put back in the garage for George to later use on Caylee posters.

The only reason I can see for us being told the IP address was Miami was to get us to quit talking about the site long enough for the proper paperwork to be filed to get the site locked down. I am sure they were afraid someone might post more comments or, worse, attempt to figure out what email address and password was used to register the site, then log in. Clearly extraordinary action was taken, because that link simply does not vanish without the owner logging in !

QB.
10-25-2009, 10:13 AM
The only reason I can see for us being told the IP address was Miami was to get us to quit talking about the site long enough for the proper paperwork to be filed to get the site locked down. I am sure they were afraid someone might post more comments or, worse, attempt to figure out what email address and password was used to register the site, then log in. Clearly extraordinary action was taken, because that link simply does not vanish without the owner logging in !

respectfully snipped and bbm

JWG, I agree, that seems the most likely scenario.

Mosby
10-25-2009, 11:26 AM
Sometime Monday through Wednesday. It had gotten to the point where I did it almost absent-mindedly. The link into the video page where the comments could be seen was stored in my "Last 7 days" history, so I clicked on it after Val told me the videos page link was missing, and I got the following:

5840



The problem is the use of Foxy Proxy still requires someone like Casey to go out and find an anonymous proxy server located in Miami, FL and then configure Firefox to use that server. That's a lot harder than one might think, and I don't know that KC would have gone to the trouble. After all, this is a girl that did not pay a lot of attention to the uniqueness of the duct tape she used - which she took from the garage and then put back in the garage for George to later use on Caylee posters.

The only reason I can see for us being told the IP address was Miami was to get us to quit talking about the site long enough for the proper paperwork to be filed to get the site locked down. I am sure they were afraid someone might post more comments or, worse, attempt to figure out what email address and password was used to register the site, then log in. Clearly extraordinary action was taken, because that link simply does not vanish without the owner logging in !

Wow is all I can say. I followed this whole thread (lurker) and always thought that this was too much for coincidence. This is VERY interesting. Thanks Valhall and JWG. You both amaze me.

ExpectingUnicorns
10-25-2009, 11:45 AM
Such a neat gift this morning ~ to see this phoenix rising from the ashes!!!!

cecybeans
10-25-2009, 12:03 PM
I am so glad this happened! Not only because it was an excellent theory and you did such a great job sleuthing, but because this, imo, is a much more critical piece of premeditation evidence than the google searches in March which could have various explanations and can be rebutted - even if somewhat lamely - by the defense. They have reasonable doubt, in my mind, without a clear COD.

This page was created the day Caylee went missing BEFORE she went missing. It is a blatant attempt to create a SODDI persona. It shows that definitely KC planned on using a Zenaida as a scapegoat for whatever fate she had planned for Caylee. That fate, she had obviously decided, was going to happen soon.

I think it is possibly the best evidence of premeditation we have because it cannot be interepreted ANY other way, unlike some of the physical evidence left at the scene. It completely rules out an accident. Completely. If it pans out, even more than other evidence we have, it shows undeniable premeditated intent. There is no other reason to create a Zenaida red herring ahead of time. While it is extremely coincidental that the page was last accessed the day KC was indicted and went to jail, no one else but the killer would have known to create the page BEFORE Caylee disappeared. Especially on the day she disappeared. I would go so far as to call it a smoking gun.

sumbunny
10-25-2009, 12:09 PM
I can see the headlines now "myspace solves premeditated murder mystery"
This thread amazes me. You guys rock :)

Tracey276
10-25-2009, 12:40 PM
Wow! That's the word that completely sums this up. Just WOW!

So, if I understand this, it was thought this was a MySpace set up by KC. Then passed on to LE. LE said no, not anything. Now turns out it was something BIG? I need to go back and read this entire thread to fully understand the details.

But I just had to say, Wow, I am in awe of how absolutely brilliant you all are here.

texaslb218
10-25-2009, 12:45 PM
I accidentally snipped Cecybeans from her post when I quoted it. Sorry, Cecy!

...[no one else but the killer would have known to create the page BEFORE Caylee disappeared. Especially on the day she disappeared. I would go so far as to call it a smoking gun.[/quote]

snipped and BBM

If it turns out to be KC created, then there would be NO OTHER explanation. I wonder who else has realized this. Who besides you smart people. Defense? SA?

cecybeans
10-25-2009, 01:09 PM
I accidentally snipped Cecybeans from her post when I quoted it. Sorry, Cecy!

...[no one else but the killer would have known to create the page BEFORE Caylee disappeared. Especially on the day she disappeared. I would go so far as to call it a smoking gun.

snipped and BBM

If it turns out to be KC created, then there would be NO OTHER explanation. I wonder who else has realized this. Who besides you smart people. Defense? SA?[/QUOTE]

Hey, KB and LDB are on top of things. I'm sure if this pans out, they'll look at it the same way we do. We are so lucky to have such incredible sleuthers here - they sure rock my little world!

sarah7855
10-25-2009, 01:12 PM
Val/JWG, when you first told us about contacting LE and said that their inital response was that it seemed like your tip had slipped through the cracks without being investigated, but then they quickly came back and said that it had been, my hinky meter went off. I never did fully accept that this had been discredited. I am so very happy to hear this news, and it goes to show: never give up! Thanks to your persistence and excellent sleuthing, you have found a major break!!! :clap:

TallyHo
10-25-2009, 01:13 PM
Sometime Monday through Wednesday. It had gotten to the point where I did it almost absent-mindedly. The link into the video page where the comments could be seen was stored in my "Last 7 days" history, so I clicked on it after Val told me the videos page link was missing, and I got the following:

5840



The problem is the use of Foxy Proxy still requires someone like Casey to go out and find an anonymous proxy server located in Miami, FL and then configure Firefox to use that server. That's a lot harder than one might think, and I don't know that KC would have gone to the trouble. After all, this is a girl that did not pay a lot of attention to the uniqueness of the duct tape she used - which she took from the garage and then put back in the garage for George to later use on Caylee posters.

The only reason I can see for us being told the IP address was Miami was to get us to quit talking about the site long enough for the proper paperwork to be filed to get the site locked down. I am sure they were afraid someone might post more comments or, worse, attempt to figure out what email address and password was used to register the site, then log in. Clearly extraordinary action was taken, because that link simply does not vanish without the owner logging in !

Well, George did tell LE that Casey was really, really good on the computer!:waitasec:

Mosby
10-25-2009, 01:32 PM
Perhaps Valhall's and JWG's sources were being honest when they said it had been thoroughly investigated and debunked. Maybe someone had an "AHA" moment or a new set of eyes took a crack at it last week and found something. Just thinkin'!!

Valhall
10-25-2009, 01:35 PM
Well, I don't want to get hopes too high. Lord knows this particular issue has been a rollercoaster of hopes high and dashed. So I want to clarify that I and JWG THINK msypace may have frozen the account, and we THINK it might be because LE is investigating it.

JWG spoke with his source on Friday after we talked and that source stated that as late as this week LE was still confirming this myspace had no connection to the case. I found it interesting that JWG's source was still asking them about it at this late date.

AND...even if LE IS looking at it...it could still be a bust. But at least we won't be nagged with the fear it was never investigated!

Valhall
10-25-2009, 01:37 PM
And p.s. - for those members who may be new and unable to read through this entire thread, I have posted a synopsis on my blog covering the history of this myspace. Kind of like cliff notes.

http://www.thehinkymeter.com/?p=44

texaslb218
10-25-2009, 01:43 PM
And p.s. - for those members who may be new and unable to read through this entire thread, I have posted a synopsis on my blog covering the history of this myspace. Kind of like cliff notes.

http://www.thehinkymeter.com/?p=44

I am always happy to have a summary. Thanks, Val.

Can you speculate on how the "female, 54" fits into the situation? Or, did I read that post wrong?

RR0004
10-25-2009, 01:58 PM
Well, something was a little bit off about the creation of the Caylee page as well. It was supposed to have been done on the 16th...but for the life of me I got the impression that something was started on the 15th. Lee's depo was so confusing...he admitted to going on Casey's MySpace one minute...then saying he hadn't...then saying he had his laptop there at the family home on the 15th. I gave up trying to follow it all...but I was thinking he was messing with photos...and it wasn't days later like he claimed. LE knows he was up to more than just investigating stuff (what a load of cr*p that was!). His own sister says JG is not Zenaida...but he doesn't believe her?! What if he helped set up the page? At the end of the depo he was asked about accessing a MySpace page...but I got the impression it wasn't Caylee's. I also got the impression that he got caught with his hand in the cookie jar. Remember the "fake" letter he supposedly retrieved from Casey's boss? There's nothing I don't think this family wouldn't do KWIM. If there is anything to your theory Valhall...I think there was more than one person involved in creating that page.

PS- Have you been keeping a watch on that page on a regular basis? Did you happen to go on last June?

Valhall
10-25-2009, 02:17 PM
I am always happy to have a summary. Thanks, Val.

Can you speculate on how the "female, 54" fits into the situation? Or, did I read that post wrong?

Should be female, 24 if you are talking about the age on the myspace.

darnudes
10-25-2009, 04:04 PM
Aha, so you Val and JWG didn't quite believe it either...or else why check the page everyday? :)

Mosby
10-25-2009, 04:45 PM
Question for Valhall/JWG:

If KC was logging into this Myspace page from JB's office, would Myspace have a record of her logging in from JB's IP address? Sorry if this is dumb question but I know absolutely nothing techie about these things.

TIA!

Valhall
10-25-2009, 04:54 PM
Question for Valhall/JWG:

If KC was logging into this Myspace page from JB's office, would Myspace have a record of her logging in from JB's IP address? Sorry if this is dumb question but I know absolutely nothing techie about these things.

TIA!

Possibly. There are statements made on myspace that the IP information for activity OTHER THAN CREATION data can be discarded if the account goes 90 days inactive. So...whether the log in(s) after the creation date are still in the myspace IP data is unknown at this time. If they are...then, yes, it will track back to JB's office.

Mosby
10-25-2009, 05:12 PM
Possibly. There are statements made on myspace that the IP information for activity OTHER THAN CREATION data can be discarded if the account goes 90 days inactive. So...whether the log in(s) after the creation date are still in the myspace IP data is unknown at this time. If they are...then, yes, it will track back to JB's office.

Thanks so much for answering so quickly. I will keep my fingers crossed in the hopes that if this is KC (which I've always thought it was) that the info will still be available, or better yet, LE already has it. How great would that be!

banzai
10-25-2009, 05:41 PM
I apologize if this has already been discussed.
I was reading back on LA's 1st sworn interview with LE from 29-Jul-08 this morning and even back then, it appears that LE was aware that KC was somewhat computer savvy. They were discussing the deleted emails and photos and these interesting comments ensued from LE.

snipped... (underlined by me)

EE: I am going to tell you a few things that I am just am questioning. Your sister sporadically visits her Photo Bucket from another persons account and enters numerous photos into her Photo Bucket account, not utilizing her computer.

LA: Not utilizing the laptop?
EE: Correct.
LA: Okay.
EE: So she still has a laptop but, and this is prior to it crashing.
LA: Uh-hum (affirmative).
EE: There's Photo Bucket entries all the way up to the 15th of July.
LA: Hmm.

EE: But not made over her laptop. Made over a, a uh, service of another person. Does that make any sense to you?

here's the link, pdf begin page 56 line 19

http://www.wftv.com/download/2008/0923/17540065.pdf

texaslb218
10-25-2009, 05:51 PM
I apologize if this has already been discussed.
I was reading back on LA's 1st sworn interview with LE from 29-Jul-08 this morning and even back then, it appears that LE was aware that KC was somewhat computer savvy. They were discussing the deleted emails and photos and these interesting comments ensued from LE.

snipped... (underlined by me)

EE: I am going to tell you a few things that I am just am questioning. Your sister sporadically visits her Photo Bucket from another persons account and enters numerous photos into her Photo Bucket account, not utilizing her computer.

LA: Not utilizing the laptop?
EE: Correct.
LA: Okay.
EE: So she still has a laptop but, and this is prior to it crashing.
LA: Uh-hum (affirmative).
EE: There's Photo Bucket entries all the way up to the 15th of July.
LA: Hmm.

EE: But not made over her laptop. Made over a, a uh, service of another person. Does that make any sense to you?

here's the link, pdf begin page 56 line 19

http://www.wftv.com/download/2008/0923/17540065.pdf

WOW! This seems to fit right in with the other specualtion on a fake ZFG netpage.

Just Jayla
10-26-2009, 12:37 AM
So...maybe this subject isn't dead.

There is a suspicion - held by at least myself - that after we contacted OCSO at the first of September, they did, in fact, look into the myspace page. And, there is a suspicion - held by at least myself - that maybe we were misled so that they could have time to look into it.

There's been a development, if you will, in the past week. The zenaida myspace

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=389838213

has changed.

Note that the video link that was formerly present (which would lead you to a video comment area where you could post a comment without being approved as a friend - like two men, including marinadedave did)...

http://www.thehinkymeter.com/images/CMA/zenaidamyspace090109.jpg

http://www.thehinkymeter.com/images/CMA/zenaidamyspacevideocomments.jpg

Is no longer there...

http://www.thehinkymeter.com/images/CMA/zenaidavideos.jpg

So you can't even get to the location where the comments could be made and were made.

I spoke to my friend in computer forensics and he said the first thing that is done in a computer or cyber forensics investigation is to "freeze" the files so that no contamination can take place once the investigation has started.

Maybe they have.


Agh! I don't want to get my hopes up again, I have to remember what JWG pointed out when I asked him if LE could be fudging....and that is, why would the source lie (or be lied to), if the presumption is that the source is directly in contact with the true procedures they are performing at OCSO?
I may be misconstruing what JWG was saying, or what your source was drawing his info from....Would like to believe that OCSO did cover this up because it is information that CANNOT be released to the public before trial (I'm thinkin the judge would seal this faster than I can type s-e-a-l :))

ETA-Although, why seal at this point? It's out there, baby!

Just Jayla
10-26-2009, 12:42 AM
Sometime Monday through Wednesday. It had gotten to the point where I did it almost absent-mindedly. The link into the video page where the comments could be seen was stored in my "Last 7 days" history, so I clicked on it after Val told me the videos page link was missing, and I got the following:

5840



The problem is the use of Foxy Proxy still requires someone like Casey to go out and find an anonymous proxy server located in Miami, FL and then configure Firefox to use that server. That's a lot harder than one might think, and I don't know that KC would have gone to the trouble. After all, this is a girl that did not pay a lot of attention to the uniqueness of the duct tape she used - which she took from the garage and then put back in the garage for George to later use on Caylee posters.

The only reason I can see for us being told the IP address was Miami was to get us to quit talking about the site long enough for the proper paperwork to be filed to get the site locked down. I am sure they were afraid someone might post more comments or, worse, attempt to figure out what email address and password was used to register the site, then log in. Clearly extraordinary action was taken, because that link simply does not vanish without the owner logging in !


JWG, I am wondering how this may lead back to JT's shop, her looking for a monitor....She's not a gamer that I know of, and she was not linking the computer to a projector, so what's the deal with her hardware needs in, perhaps, relation to this?

ETA-Or if not in relaton to this, in relation to her degree of computer savviness...

JWG
10-26-2009, 08:46 AM
I apologize if this has already been discussed.
I was reading back on LA's 1st sworn interview with LE from 29-Jul-08 this morning and even back then, it appears that LE was aware that KC was somewhat computer savvy. They were discussing the deleted emails and photos and these interesting comments ensued from LE.

snipped... (underlined by me)

EE: I am going to tell you a few things that I am just am questioning. Your sister sporadically visits her Photo Bucket from another persons account and enters numerous photos into her Photo Bucket account, not utilizing her computer.

LA: Not utilizing the laptop?
EE: Correct.
LA: Okay.
EE: So she still has a laptop but, and this is prior to it crashing.
LA: Uh-hum (affirmative).
EE: There's Photo Bucket entries all the way up to the 15th of July.
LA: Hmm.

EE: But not made over her laptop. Made over a, a uh, service of another person. Does that make any sense to you?

here's the link, pdf begin page 56 line 19

http://www.wftv.com/download/2008/0923/17540065.pdf

Great observation, banzai. :clap:

I had not recalled that discussion, but it is certainly interesting. I do recall seeing a Photobucket document listing the IP addresses from which KC uploaded her pictures, and the majority came from Tony's apartment. What EE is saying, I think, is that copies of the images could not be found on her computer. :waitasec: AFAIK, LE did not examine a computer from Tony's.

Clearly, though, she was using the laptop while at Tony's, because the internet history shows lots of activity on the days leading up to July 15, although her internet history prior to July 3 or 4 seems to have been largely wiped. :doh:

Kind of makes you think she knew she'd left some incriminating tracks out on the internet and was trying to cover them. :bang:

cecybeans
10-26-2009, 10:06 AM
I wish EE was a little more precise in his terminology. I am not sure from the words "account" and "service" what he means. If that laptop had wireless capacity, she could have been at Starbucks or Borders and logged in with their IP address or any number of others. It doesn't sound from the above as if EE understands that IP address is simply location.

If she was using a web-based program like Photobucket, she may have been able to access her personal account through another person's account (like CA's) if she had the password, similar to the social networking sites. Or maybe she simply used CA's account.

I agree that kind of activity, and trying to wipe her internet history off would indicate she was trying to operate in stealth mode.

KenoshaKid
10-26-2009, 11:25 AM
I wish EE was a little more precise in his terminology. I am not sure from the words "account" and "service" what he means. If that laptop had wireless capacity, she could have been at Starbucks or Borders and logged in with their IP address or any number of others. It doesn't sound from the above as if EE understands that IP address is simply location.

If she was using a web-based program like Photobucket, she may have been able to access her personal account through another person's account (like CA's) if she had the password, similar to the social networking sites. Or maybe she simply used CA's account.

I agree that kind of activity, and trying to wipe her internet history off would indicate she was trying to operate in stealth mode.

BBM

Yes, but stealth mode from whom? If she really was computer savvy AND watched all those CSI shows, surely she knew that didn't do Jack-squat to cover her tracks if the pros got ahold of her computer. It might cover her tracks with a lightweight like her Mom.

Here where I work we have the hard drives SHREDDED before computers are surplussed, just in case a doofus provider saved patient data to the hard drive, because we know that in the right hands and with the right software, data can be retrieved.

Now, blue-screening the laptop before the cops got there, that was more of a move in the right direction for stealth mode. Sledge-hammer would have been a better move.

cecybeans
10-26-2009, 11:39 AM
BBM

Yes, but stealth mode from whom? If she really was computer savvy AND watched all those CSI shows, surely she knew that didn't do Jack-squat to cover her tracks if the pros got ahold of her computer. It might cover her tracks with a lightweight like her Mom.

Here where I work we have the hard drives SHREDDED before computers are surplussed, just in case a doofus provider saved patient data to the hard drive, because we know that in the right hands and with the right software, data can be retrieved.

Now, blue-screening the laptop before the cops got there, that was more of a move in the right direction for stealth mode. Sledge-hammer would have been a better move.

Stealth mode from CA was all I think KC anticipated. She is used to operating carte blanche just using convoluted lies. She was actually shocked when Lee told her what the cops would ask, and I don't think she anticipated that they would have the right to make her produce her child simply on CA's "whim". I believe she planned to admit that Caylee was gone at a later date, and at a time of her own choosing.

Also, I'm not convinced that KC did the blue-screen bit. Her mom hauled her out of there too quickly, and she had no notice from Amy as far as we know. Lee was over there for two hours and he may have been deleting things he thought were incriminating about KC's activities so that her parents wouldn't see them. He is not the brightest bulb or he would have just taken the hard drive out and smashed it in the driveway and ran over it a few times.

faefrost
10-26-2009, 12:03 PM
You don't learn to be a master criminal watching CSI. You just think you might be clever.

Regardless, these changes to that web site might not be LE related. The site could also have been locked down in response to an action in the civil ZFG case. It is safe to assume that that site would be of interest to the plaintiff and her attorneys.

cecybeans
10-26-2009, 01:02 PM
You don't learn to be a master criminal watching CSI. You just think you might be clever.

Regardless, these changes to that web site might not be LE related. The site could also have been locked down in response to an action in the civil ZFG case. It is safe to assume that that site would be of interest to the plaintiff and her attorneys.

Very true! We know that Morgan was informed by our sly sleuthers. I think he keeps himself informed on all things ZFG. Having his people do due diligence on that matter would certainly help the stretched resources of the state right now. CA did not know who she was fooling with when she called him an ambulance chaser. He knows how to incapacitate a Doberman!

SCSam
10-26-2009, 02:37 PM
Very true! We know that Morgan was informed by our sly sleuthers. I think he keeps himself informed on all things ZFG. Having his people do due diligence on that matter would certainly help the stretched resources of the state right now. CA did not know who she was fooling with when she called him an ambulance chaser. He knows how to incapacitate a Doberman!
She CERTAINLY didn't know about Websleuths!

KenoshaKid
10-26-2009, 04:29 PM
Stealth mode from CA was all I think KC anticipated. She is used to operating carte blanche just using convoluted lies. She was actually shocked when Lee told her what the cops would ask, and I don't think she anticipated that they would have the right to make her produce her child simply on CA's "whim". I believe she planned to admit that Caylee was gone at a later date, and at a time of her own choosing.

Also, I'm not convinced that KC did the blue-screen bit. Her mom hauled her out of there too quickly, and she had no notice from Amy as far as we know. Lee was over there for two hours and he may have been deleting things he thought were incriminating about KC's activities so that her parents wouldn't see them. He is not the brightest bulb or he would have just taken the hard drive out and smashed it in the driveway and ran over it a few times.

Oh, I agree with you, Cecy. I think she told Lee to haul ash over there to take care of the deed for her. I often wonder if that's what LE meant by their comment that he knows what he's done. :innocent:

ExpectingUnicorns
10-26-2009, 10:28 PM
Stealth mode from CA was all I think KC anticipated. She is used to operating carte blanche just using convoluted lies. She was actually shocked when Lee told her what the cops would ask, and I don't think she anticipated that they would have the right to make her produce her child simply on CA's "whim". I believe she planned to admit that Caylee was gone at a later date, and at a time of her own choosing.

Also, I'm not convinced that KC did the blue-screen bit. Her mom hauled her out of there too quickly, and she had no notice from Amy as far as we know. Lee was over there for two hours and he may have been deleting things he thought were incriminating about KC's activities so that her parents wouldn't see them. He is not the brightest bulb or he would have just taken the hard drive out and smashed it in the driveway and ran over it a few times.

I always had a feeling that Casey did the BSOD. And when I found the following in Cindy's depo (part 2) I thought it may have been enough warning for Casey to have gone to work on the blue screen:

kew17
10-26-2009, 10:34 PM
Great observation, banzai. :clap:

I had not recalled that discussion, but it is certainly interesting. I do recall seeing a Photobucket document listing the IP addresses from which KC uploaded her pictures, and the majority came from Tony's apartment. What EE is saying, I think, is that copies of the images could not be found on her computer. :waitasec: AFAIK, LE did not examine a computer from Tony's.

Clearly, though, she was using the laptop while at Tony's, because the internet history shows lots of activity on the days leading up to July 15, although her internet history prior to July 3 or 4 seems to have been largely wiped. :doh:

Kind of makes you think she knew she'd left some incriminating tracks out on the internet and was trying to cover them. :bang:

Great job JWG and Valhall and all who have contributed to this wonderful thread!

Question: Would "timer55" come into play at all here. I'm no puter xpert, but understood it to be an "away" type message or computer code. Could that be connected to her accessing accounts from an alternate location? Just a thought and like I said, I'm not computer savy.

cecybeans
10-26-2009, 10:59 PM
I always had a feeling that Casey did the BSOD. And when I found the following in Cindy's depo (part 2) I thought it may have been enough warning for Casey to have gone to work on the blue screen:

If CA called and left that message, I'll bet you're right. My problem is that I never know if CA is telling the truth about anything. It would certainly make sense that KC was deleting stuff she did in June and July if she got a heads up from her mom and thought she might have to leave town (although why she wouldn't just steal the computer is beyond me). I doubt Lee would know too much about whatever she was up to. Maybe. Darn that duplicitous family! There are always eighteen different scenarios that are possible any time any of them open their mouths!

BAHD
10-26-2009, 11:14 PM
It seems to me that whenever a thread like this gets too close to the truth, someone has to put a damper on it. Didn't the same thing happen with the NG thread? I think that someone doesn't want us to go there!

The Eunice Burns
10-26-2009, 11:37 PM
Coming on here tonight and seeing this..........just made my day. I recall the day/night that Val told us that the zenaida myspace page had been investigated and the word was it was not related.......I, along w/ everyone, felt like a deflated balloon. I accepted it, but it didn't go away for me. I thought it was too pat of an answer from the source. Val, I went and read your posting on thehinkymeter, and besides THANK YOU!!!, I wanted to comment on something...to recap.....you said that the source first said that LE was excited, said they had missed your tip, then less than a day later, the source said that the tip had been investigated, but it didn't pan out---no connection. A retraction, in essence. I'm not buying that. My gut (FWIW) tells me the first information that JWG and you received is the truth. The "retraction" is a smoke screen.

But, thank you, thank you, thank you to Val and JWG for keeping on point with this. I think it's huge.

Imbackon
10-26-2009, 11:41 PM
Great job JWG and Valhall and all who have contributed to this wonderful thread!

Question: Would "timer55" come into play at all here. I'm no puter xpert, but understood it to be an "away" type message or computer code. Could that be connected to her accessing accounts from an alternate location? Just a thought and like I said, I'm not computer savy.


I think another poster back aways said Timer55 might be some software that makes it appear like you are logged on and doing some activity when you are actually away.
Whereas the proxy stuff refers to faking your ISP.

Valhall
10-27-2009, 05:54 AM
Coming on here tonight and seeing this..........just made my day. I recall the day/night that Val told us that the zenaida myspace page had been investigated and the word was it was not related.......I, along w/ everyone, felt like a deflated balloon. I accepted it, but it didn't go away for me. I thought it was too pat of an answer from the source. Val, I went and read your posting on thehinkymeter, and besides THANK YOU!!!, I wanted to comment on something...to recap.....you said that the source first said that LE was excited, said they had missed your tip, then less than a day later, the source said that the tip had been investigated, but it didn't pan out---no connection. A retraction, in essence. I'm not buying that. My gut (FWIW) tells me the first information that JWG and you received is the truth. The "retraction" is a smoke screen.

But, thank you, thank you, thank you to Val and JWG for keeping on point with this. I think it's huge.

Well, I felt the same way, Eunice. And to this day we still don't know which will ultimately turn out to be true. JWG and I discussed this behind the scenes when we were told the second story and we kind of - without really coming to an agreement or explicitly stating it - decided we would let this thread die because there was the chance LE needed time to look into the myspace without attention becoming greater to it. At least that's why I stayed away even though I felt the second story might not be true. Another reason was, I didn't want to keep this thread in a "hopeful mode" if, in fact, the second story WAS true.

When Tracy Mc's interview audio came out and I heard her say KC was on myspace at home and on myspace all day at JB's office while she was out, I almost wet myself. I PM'd JWG and basically said O_O !

cecybeans
10-27-2009, 10:51 AM
Well, I felt the same way, Eunice. And to this day we still don't know which will ultimately turn out to be true. JWG and I discussed this behind the scenes when we were told the second story and we kind of - without really coming to an agreement or explicitly stating it - decided we would let this thread die because there was the chance LE needed time to look into the myspace without attention becoming greater to it. At least that's why I stayed away even though I felt the second story might not be true. Another reason was, I didn't want to keep this thread in a "hopeful mode" if, in fact, the second story WAS true.

When Tracy Mc's interview audio came out and I heard her say KC was on myspace at home and on myspace all day at JB's office while she was out, I almost wet myself. I PM'd JWG and basically said O_O !

In addition to wanting your Excellent Theory to pan out - I also hope Tracy's words come back to bite JB in the butt. He had no business allowing her to freely roam the internet all day while she was on bail. If LE can show the site was accessed from his IP during the time she was out, I'm wondering if they can gain access to his computer records. He make think what she did in his office is privileged, but if she was interfering with an investigation in any way shape or form, using his equipment, he just may be toast.

The Eunice Burns
10-27-2009, 11:32 AM
Well, I felt the same way, Eunice. And to this day we still don't know which will ultimately turn out to be true. JWG and I discussed this behind the scenes when we were told the second story and we kind of - without really coming to an agreement or explicitly stating it - decided we would let this thread die because there was the chance LE needed time to look into the myspace without attention becoming greater to it. At least that's why I stayed away even though I felt the second story might not be true. Another reason was, I didn't want to keep this thread in a "hopeful mode" if, in fact, the second story WAS true.

When Tracy Mc's interview audio came out and I heard her say KC was on myspace at home and on myspace all day at JB's office while she was out, I almost wet myself. I PM'd JWG and basically said O_O !

I understand why you and JWG let this fizzle for awhile. And I did wonder about Tracy's revelations that KC was on myspace (which many suspected) at home and at JB's that somehow the zenaida myspace page would work itself back into the case. And, the icing would be that as cecy points out, JB is toast.

panama
10-27-2009, 09:29 PM
Disclaimer: I'm about 2/3 through this thread. I figured I'd post this now, at the risk that it's redundant, just to get thoughts and ideas whilst I read the rest of the thread. :)

This has to do with the zenadia myspace page.

Here's the deal: it occurred to me that maybe the Myspace ID's correspond, sequentially, to account creation date. Also, I looked around, and noticed that there are timestamps on the myspace blog posts.

So, I searched google and yahoo for this:
site:blogs.myspace.com "signup date: 6/16/2008" "June 16, 2008"

This turned up pages wherein the signup was on June 16th 2008, AND there was a blog entry from June 16th 2008.

For the pages that turned up, I made a few assumptions:

Assumption 1: If the Myspace ID is GREATER that the zenadia ID (389838213), the person signed up AFTER "zenaida."

Assumption 2: The timestamp of any blog entry on June 16, 2008 can be no earlier than the time of signup on June 16, 2008. So we can call the time of the first blog post on June 16th, the latest possible signup time.

Therefore, given the assumptions, the time that the zenaida page was created must be earlier than any latest possible signup time for the pages with IDs greater than zenaida's.

I went through and these are the ones close to the zenadia ID (389838213), which is in red in the table.

They're sorted by Myspace ID, increasing.

Important things:

Each row corresponds to a myspace page with a signup date of 6/16/08.
The first column corresponds to whether I found the page on yahoo or google. y = yahoo.
The times are exactly what was listed on the page as the timestamp of the first 6/16/08 blog post. (These are the latest possible signup times.)
Without exception, google's and yahoo's cache of the sites listed times that were 4 hours greater than the timestamps on the "current" page.
My time zone is east coast US. (Just in case.)
I don't know if any of these pages used any myspace hacks that you guys were talking about earlier.


So, here's the table of what I found.

site ID 1st Post Time City State Country
389716473 2:51 AM the hills of northwest / the coast of southeast Georgia US
389722494 12:45 PM Capital federal Buenos Aires (Ciudad Autónoma de) AR
y 389732053 9:38 AM USA Texas US
389739359 3:33 AM garden city Michigan
y 389746986 5:49 AM INDIANA Pennsylvania US
389753025 10:09 AM DE
Y 389753234 5:33 AM ENCINITAS California US
389759552 2:40 PM Subang Jaya Selangor MY
389768897 5:41 PM Reading/London/Northampton/Newbury UK
389771457 10:03 AM Groningen - Den Haag Groningen NL
389775669 9:37 AM Languedoc-Roussillon FR
y 389780091 4:00 PM Music City Tennessee US
389787299 10:42 AM DALLAS Texas US
y 389797079 7:19 AM CHICAGO Illinois US
389805372 1:21 PM SURPRISE Arizona US
389807043 1:15 PM Ile-de-France FR
389813816 4:16 PM Ile-de-France FR
389814334 1:15 PM Porto Alegre Rio Grande do Sul BR
389827687 2:22 PM TACOMA Washington US
y 389827902 7:03 PM GRAND RAPIDS Michigan US
389838213 MIAMI Florida US
y 389840621 3:50 PM LOS ANGELES California US
389849906 4:32 PM EUGENE Oregon US
389875570 4:56 PM Hawaii US
y 389878141 7:02 AM NEW YORK New York US
y 389878200 5:45 PM CALIFORNIA US
389887981 6:04 PM Ile-de-France FR
y 389888720 6:53 PM FREDERICKSBURG Virginia US
Y 389900897 11:08 AM SANDOWN New Hampshire US

Here are the profiles created after zenaida's, along with the timestamps converted to Miami time. (I assumed that the timestamps were local to the places listed in the profile. I used http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedform.html , so it took into account whatever daylight savings craziness there might have been.)

site ID 1st Post Time City State Country Miami Time
389838213 MIAMI Florida US
y 389840621 3:50 PM LOS ANGELES California US 6:50 PM
389849906 4:32 PM EUGENE Oregon US 7:32 PM
389875570 4:56 PM Hawaii US 10:56 PM
y 389878141 7:02 AM NEW YORK New York US 7:02 AM
y 389878200 5:45 PM CALIFORNIA US 8:45 PM
389887981 6:04 PM Ile-de-France FR 12:04 PM
y 389888720 6:53 PM FREDERICKSBURG Virginia US 6:53 PM
Y 389900897 11:08 AM SANDOWN New Hampshire US 11:08 AM

So... does this tell us that since "NEW YORK, New York" signed up at 7:02 AM at the latest, and that zenaida had to sign up before "NEW YORK, New York" signed up, zenaida had to sign up before 7:02 AM? Or, does it tell us.... nothing at all? Hard to say...

Any other ideas about this? I have a feeling that my assumptions may have been faulty...

Again, sorry if this is old news; I'm a bit impulsive when it comes to information retrieval. :)

ZsaZsa
10-27-2009, 09:39 PM
In addition to wanting your Excellent Theory to pan out - I also hope Tracy's words come back to bite JB in the butt. He had no business allowing her to freely roam the internet all day while she was on bail. If LE can show the site was accessed from his IP during the time she was out, I'm wondering if they can gain access to his computer records. He make think what she did in his office is privileged, but if she was interfering with an investigation in any way shape or form, using his equipment, he just may be toast.

Hmmm- I smell toast burning..:innocent:

flourish
10-27-2009, 09:56 PM
Disclaimer: I'm about 2/3 through this thread. I figured I'd post this now, at the risk that it's redundant, just to get thoughts and ideas whilst I read the rest of the thread. :)

This has to do with the zenadia myspace page.
<most respectful snipping>


So... does this tell us that since "NEW YORK, New York" signed up at 7:02 AM at the latest, and that zenaida had to sign up before "NEW YORK, New York" signed up, zenaida had to sign up before 7:02 AM? Or, does it tell us.... nothing at all? Hard to say...

Any other ideas about this? I have a feeling that my assumptions may have been faulty...

Again, sorry if this is old news; I'm a bit impulsive when it comes to information retrieval. :)

Snipped with mad respect, for spacial reasons.
I don't know if it means anything, but I must say you've got some fine sleuthing skills going on over there, so keep it up! :)

Valhall
10-27-2009, 10:04 PM
Disclaimer: I'm about 2/3 through this thread. I figured I'd post this now, at the risk that it's redundant, just to get thoughts and ideas whilst I read the rest of the thread. :)

This has to do with the zenadia myspace page.

Here's the deal: it occurred to me that maybe the Myspace ID's correspond, sequentially, to account creation date. Also, I looked around, and noticed that there are timestamps on the myspace blog posts.

So, I searched google and yahoo for this:
site:blogs.myspace.com "signup date: 6/16/2008" "June 16, 2008"

This turned up pages wherein the signup was on June 16th 2008, AND there was a blog entry from June 16th 2008.

For the pages that turned up, I made a few assumptions:

Assumption 1: If the Myspace ID is GREATER that the zenadia ID (389838213), the person signed up AFTER "zenaida."

Assumption 2: The timestamp of any blog entry on June 16, 2008 can be no earlier than the time of signup on June 16, 2008. So we can call the time of the first blog post on June 16th, the latest possible signup time.

Therefore, given the assumptions, the time that the zenaida page was created must be earlier than any latest possible signup time for the pages with IDs greater than zenaida's.

I went through and these are the ones close to the zenadia ID (389838213), which is in red in the table.

They're sorted by Myspace ID, increasing.

Important things:

Each row corresponds to a myspace page with a signup date of 6/16/08.
The first column corresponds to whether I found the page on yahoo or google. y = yahoo.
The times are exactly what was listed on the page as the timestamp of the first 6/16/08 blog post. (These are the latest possible signup times.)
Without exception, google's and yahoo's cache of the sites listed times that were 4 hours greater than the timestamps on the "current" page.
My time zone is east coast US. (Just in case.)
I don't know if any of these pages used any myspace hacks that you guys were talking about earlier.



So... does this tell us that since "NEW YORK, New York" signed up at 7:02 AM at the latest, and that zenaida had to sign up before "NEW YORK, New York" signed up, zenaida had to sign up before 7:02 AM? Or, does it tell us.... nothing at all? Hard to say...

Any other ideas about this? I have a feeling that my assumptions may have been faulty...

Again, sorry if this is old news; I'm a bit impulsive when it comes to information retrieval. :)

*Respectfully snipped for space*

Holy cow, panama! Thanks a lot for the hard work. That helps to further validate the 06/16 creation date. When you get further in the thread you'll see that the last update time on the 16th is 11:31 am PST (2:31 Orlando).

This info you put together is awesome!

RR0004
10-27-2009, 10:09 PM
I always had a feeling that Casey did the BSOD. And when I found the following in Cindy's depo (part 2) I thought it may have been enough warning for Casey to have gone to work on the blue screen:
I don't know who stated that Casey was on the couch playing on the computer when her mom came over...but in another depo (IIRC Lee's?) he stated she was in the bedroom. So maybe she was busy messing with the computer.

MD MOMMY
10-27-2009, 11:13 PM
I don't know who stated that Casey was on the couch playing on the computer when her mom came over...but in another depo (IIRC Lee's?) he stated she was in the bedroom. So maybe she was busy messing with the computer.

I believe that came from TonE.

cyberborg
10-27-2009, 11:29 PM
Anyone notice that the blogs picked up this and are citing the source as this link?

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/5395519/Info-on-a-Zenaida-My-Space-Created-by-Casey-Anthony

Valhall
10-27-2009, 11:54 PM
Anyone notice that the blogs picked up this and are citing the source as this link?

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/5395519/Info-on-a-Zenaida-My-Space-Created-by-Casey-Anthony

Cecy had shown that to me. That's wrong. How do we get that taken down or corrected to reference WS?

piratemom
10-28-2009, 12:11 AM
Is it possible she set this up during the flurry of calls on 6/16 after she killed Caylee? As a last minute cover up.

cecybeans
10-28-2009, 12:26 AM
Cecy had shown that to me. That's wrong. How do we get that taken down or corrected to reference WS?

I sent a copy to Tricia. Since the site accepts comments perhaps we should comment on Proper Attribution Etiquette 101.

Valhall
10-28-2009, 06:05 AM
panama,

What you have done here is just so awesome! You have established a creation time before 7:02 am on the June 16th!!!

There's one correction to your uber work that needs to be clarified - although the pearl in this treasure is absolutely perfect and needs NO CORRECTION because it is on the East Coast!!!

In your far right column in the smaller table at the bottom of your post - you don't need to correct to Orlando time. The time you are seeing on the blogs/posts is based on YOUR time zone. See, I'm central time and when I go to the New York "Kess" blog entry, I see 6:02 am. So the time on any blog or comment is not server based, but based on the viewer's time zone.

Like I said, this doesn't affect the Kess time any for you (or Casey!) because it is eastern time.

Thanks again for this work!

KenoshaKid
10-28-2009, 09:55 AM
panama,

What you have done here is just so awesome! You have established a creation time before 7:02 am on the June 16th!!!

There's one correction to your uber work that needs to be clarified - although the pearl in this treasure is absolutely perfect and needs NO CORRECTION because it is on the East Coast!!!

In your far right column in the smaller table at the bottom of your post - you don't need to correct to Orlando time. The time you are seeing on the blogs/posts is based on YOUR time zone. See, I'm central time and when I go to the New York "Kess" blog entry, I see 6:02 am. So the time on any blog or comment is not server based, but based on the viewer's time zone.

Like I said, this doesn't affect the Kess time any for you (or Casey!) because it is eastern time.

Thanks again for this work!

Val, but it still says Miami as the creation location. Any thoughts on that? Maybe it truly was created in Miami after all? :(

Just Jayla
10-28-2009, 10:04 AM
I believe that came from TonE.

She can't have been in the bedroom, becuase acording to CA and AH, KC answered the door.

Maybe TL answered the door and called KC over, unless he lazily sat on the couch and screamed for her to answer the door, but either way, she was not technically in the bedroom when CA came through the door.

sumbunny
10-28-2009, 10:04 AM
Can't you put any location while creating a myspace page? I know my ISP says i'm in toronto..but i'm not. It depends on my I.S.P's hub location (if that makes sense)

Just Jayla
10-28-2009, 10:08 AM
IIRC, KC walked back to the bedroom when CA came in, while CA was trash talking KC to TL....she must have wanted to grab something....but at the same time, she told her mom she was coming back to TL's (though I believe CA told her to get her stuff, and there was a mini debate over whether she could come back). Lemme get the link.....

Just Jayla
10-28-2009, 10:18 AM
For where KC was at the time CA/Ah showed up to TL's and what transpired:

http://www.cfnews13.com/News/Sidebar/2008/9/27/audio_video_recordings_released_by_law_enforcement .html

Go to bottom of page to Anthony Lazzaro interview, then go to 36:30 mark.

ETA Note: CA did not even ask TL about Caylee, she did not ask TL if Caylee was there or if he had seen her, and certainly did not look around for Caylee-Maybe KC told her while they were outside that Caylee was with "Zanny"

belle3
10-28-2009, 10:30 AM
dont know if this will help you in here or if it vene belongs in here but it isa computer forensics report which has some info on zenaida searches from the computers. sorry if this is already posted here or irrelevant.
http://blogs.discovery.com/criminal_report/files/casey_anthony_computer_report.pdf

KenoshaKid
10-28-2009, 10:40 AM
Can't you put any location while creating a myspace page? I know my ISP says i'm in toronto..but i'm not. It depends on my I.S.P's hub location (if that makes sense)

Anyone know?

JWG
10-28-2009, 10:41 AM
Anyone know?

You can put any location you desire in your Myspace page.

recklessrex
10-28-2009, 10:58 AM
When the police first arrived at the Anthony home, I recall Cindy and an officer dumped KC's purse. Didn't a police officer take a drivers license/credit card from the wallet and keep it? I wonder what it was? Sorry if this is OT but this could possibly tie into KC being Zenaida.

Valhall
10-28-2009, 11:25 AM
You can put any location you desire in your Myspace page.

JWG,

What are your thoughts on the fact that panama's work potentially pushes the creation of this myspace to the timeframe of midnight to 1 am? We know KC was up then talking to TL and she received two myspace alerts on her cell phone. One at 12:20 and one at 12:40. One was a new message alert and one was a new friend request alert.

Any thoughts?

cecybeans
10-28-2009, 11:57 AM
You can put any location you desire in your Myspace page.

So the listed location is simply self-populated? If I created a page and I lived in Orlando, but I put the city of origin as San Diego, it would say San Diego, but the time-stamp would be EST, correct?

If that is correct, then the creation time would certainly point to Orlando and in the absence of other info; I'd like to assume that the time stamp of EST suffices. Should that pan out to be true, and this is definitely KC, based on actual IP address if that is available, it would seem the best part of this evidence now is how EARLY this was created on the 16th. If indeed a fight occurred the evening before (it's hard for me to think that KC couldn't just have abandoned Caylee and disappeared and stayed at Tony's by herself if he told her that a toddler was not appropriate or welcome - so I tend to go with some kind of argument that would have left her feeling cornered and "spiteful") - then KC was up that early in the morning hatching her plan.

It strikes me as odd that both CA and GA reversed their earlier stance that they knew that KC was in her bedroom early in the morning of the 16th. It makes me wonder where she was and what she was up to. On the computer??

At any rate, it makes the premeditated aspect of this case stand out in high relief.

KenoshaKid
10-28-2009, 12:28 PM
You can put any location you desire in your Myspace page.

Thanks. Now I feel better. :)

JWG
10-28-2009, 01:07 PM
JWG,

What are your thoughts on the fact that panama's work potentially pushes the creation of this myspace to the timeframe of midnight to 1 am? We know KC was up then talking to TL and she received two myspace alerts on her cell phone. One at 12:20 and one at 12:40. One was a new message alert and one was a new friend request alert.

Any thoughts?

Looking at the sequencing of myspace member IDs, it looks like the range 389715668 to 389972021 represents all people who signed up for a myspace account on June 16, 2008. That's 256,353 people world-wide.

The zenaida page has ID 389838213, which is 122,545 after the first on June 16.

The 7:02 AM blog page has ID 389878141, which is 162,473 after the first on June 16.

I guess I have a problem believing she signed up between 12AM and 1AM (when there was computer activity) and that 122,000 people signed up already that day, YKWIM? :waitasec:

Myspace is a global site, so June 16 started earlier in Europe and Asia, but I did notice a number of the early sign-ups were in the US.

I can believe a 7:00 AM sign-up more readily.

Please check my assumptions. I am often wrong. :bang:

JWG
10-28-2009, 01:17 PM
So the listed location is simply self-populated? If I created a page and I lived in Orlando, but I put the city of origin as San Diego, it would say San Diego, but the time-stamp would be EST, correct?

If that is correct, then the creation time would certainly point to Orlando and in the absence of other info; I'd like to assume that the time stamp of EST suffices. Should that pan out to be true, and this is definitely KC, based on actual IP address if that is available, it would seem the best part of this evidence now is how EARLY this was created on the 16th. If indeed a fight occurred the evening before (it's hard for me to think that KC couldn't just have abandoned Caylee and disappeared and stayed at Tony's by herself if he told her that a toddler was not appropriate or welcome - so I tend to go with some kind of argument that would have left her feeling cornered and "spiteful") - then KC was up that early in the morning hatching her plan.

It strikes me as odd that both CA and GA reversed their earlier stance that they knew that KC was in her bedroom early in the morning of the 16th. It makes me wonder where she was and what she was up to. On the computer??

At any rate, it makes the premeditated aspect of this case stand out in high relief.

KC was on the computer sometime between 7AM and 8AM. The encase timeline for the desktop shows this, and her IMs to witeplayboi show this as well.

sumbunny
10-28-2009, 01:22 PM
Can LE get the I.P address used to make this myspace page? Does myspace keep track of the I.P's?

Valhall
10-28-2009, 01:26 PM
Looking at the sequencing of myspace member IDs, it looks like the range 389715668 to 389972021 represents all people who signed up for a myspace account on June 16, 2008. That's 256,353 people world-wide.

The zenaida page has ID 389838213, which is 122,545 after the first on June 16.

The 7:02 AM blog page has ID 389878141, which is 162,473 after the first on June 16.

I guess I have a problem believing she signed up between 12AM and 1AM (when there was computer activity) and that 122,000 people signed up already that day, YKWIM? :waitasec:

Myspace is a global site, so June 16 started earlier in Europe and Asia, but I did notice a number of the early sign-ups were in the US.

I can believe a 7:00 AM sign-up more readily.

Please check my assumptions. I am often wrong. :bang:

Yep, seems reasonable to me. The only issue I have with the 7 a.m. sign-up is that Cindy would have most likely been up and around by then, but maybe that isn't as much of an issue as I'm making it in my mind. I think I'm looking at from "me" instead of KC. For me, I would be scared to death mom was going to walk in while I was creating "zenaida". I'm not sure KC even had/has fears like that.

JWG
10-28-2009, 01:35 PM
Just found this interesting:

WitePlayboi (8:01:33 AM): so what r u up 2
casey o marie (8:02:02 AM): not a whole lot. checking up on all the myspace/facebook hoopla

Valhall
10-28-2009, 01:49 PM
Just found this interesting:

WitePlayboi (8:01:33 AM): so what r u up 2
casey o marie (8:02:02 AM): not a whole lot. checking up on all the myspace/facebook hoopla

JWG, would you mind linking the doc with the witeplayboi IM's in it?

Thank you in advance!

AZlawyer
10-28-2009, 01:55 PM
Yep, seems reasonable to me. The only issue I have with the 7 a.m. sign-up is that Cindy would have most likely been up and around by then, but maybe that isn't as much of an issue as I'm making it in my mind. I think I'm looking at from "me" instead of KC. For me, I would be scared to death mom was going to walk in while I was creating "zenaida". I'm not sure KC even had/has fears like that.

KC helped her friends (including TonE) create/improve their Myspace pages. It would be pretty easy for her to say "Hi, Mom. Zanni asked me to help her make a Myspace page. What do you think? Is it cute?"

In fact, she still might say that. Hmmmm. :waitasec:

Valhall
10-28-2009, 01:58 PM
KC helped her friends (including TonE) create/improve their Myspace pages. It would be pretty easy for her to say "Hi, Mom. Zanni asked me to help her make a Myspace page. What do you think? Is it cute?"

In fact, she still might say that. Hmmmm. :waitasec:

GOOD POINT! See, that's where she's different than me. If I got caught creating a cover up for something bad, I'd wet down both legs, puke and be as transparent as glass. Apparently KC is of the fabric it's just a new unexpected challenge worthy of whipping out her "fibbilator". So you're probably right, she would have just let that one fly without changing her breathing.

reeseeva
10-28-2009, 02:01 PM
Yep, seems reasonable to me. The only issue I have with the 7 a.m. sign-up is that Cindy would have most likely been up and around by then, but maybe that isn't as much of an issue as I'm making it in my mind. I think I'm looking at from "me" instead of KC. For me, I would be scared to death mom was going to walk in while I was creating "zenaida". I'm not sure KC even had/has fears like that.

BBM

Val, Acccording to CA's deposition, part 2, page 275, she says she left early on the morning of June 16th, about 1/2 hr. to 45 mins. earlier than usual.

Her time card is always 8 am., so if she usually leaves at 7:30am., she is saying she left before 7 am.

cecybeans
10-28-2009, 02:28 PM
BBM

Val, Acccording to CA's deposition, part 2, page 275, she says she left early on the morning of June 16th, about 1/2 hr. to 45 mins. earlier than usual.

Her time card is always 8 am., so if she usually leaves at 7:30am., she is saying she left before 7 am.

Yeah, I noticed that - and the fact that she and GA now say they did not hear - or notice - KC asleep in her room. It seems as if they are trying in their depos to set the record straight and create a consistent new story. I'm think KC was simply up all night and let Caylee sleep undisturbed in her bed - otherwise it doesn't make sense that a toddler wouldn't be up earlier than a rather lazy mom. It still makes me wonder why CA and GA insisted that KC and Caylee were both still sleeping in their original interviews. What would they have to gain by that?

Valhall
10-28-2009, 02:37 PM
BBM

Val, Acccording to CA's deposition, part 2, page 275, she says she left early on the morning of June 16th, about 1/2 hr. to 45 mins. earlier than usual.

Her time card is always 8 am., so if she usually leaves at 7:30am., she is saying she left before 7 am.

VERY interesting.

ClockWatcher
10-28-2009, 02:44 PM
Quick question...

Which computer was used for the IM's and the My Space posting? Was it the PC in the computer room or the lap top?

Cindy in the depo stated the lap top was buried under a pile of clothing in her bed room, right?

The PC, to my knowledge, hasn't been in KC's room, so how did Cindy not notice KC in the computer room?

JWG
10-28-2009, 02:54 PM
JWG, would you mind linking the doc with the witeplayboi IM's in it?

Thank you in advance!

Val, this came out of the computer forensic zip file from 9 / 2008. Media never uploaded it. OCSO released it in HTML format but I converted to PDF. Here is a copy:

5938

Leila
10-28-2009, 03:25 PM
dont know if this will help you in here or if it vene belongs in here but it isa computer forensics report which has some info on zenaida searches from the computers. sorry if this is already posted here or irrelevant.
http://blogs.discovery.com/criminal_report/files/casey_anthony_computer_report.pdf

Something to think about.............Casey isn't very creative in her thinking and lying. She makes up lies based on things that she's familiar with. We've seen her throw out names of people who don't exist, and give their telephone numbers, only to find out those telephone numbers belong to neighbors of the Anthony family.

She stated that she met ZFG through Jeff Hopkins, who had a little boy named Zack, and ZFG was babysat with Zack. While a Jeff Hopkins does exist, he hasn't worked at Universal since 2004 (?) and doesn't have a son named Zack. So, in this case, the person exists, but Casey's description of him is a lie.

Casey bases her lies on real life, changing the names and circumstances to fit her needs, and embellishing her lies in an attempt to make them believable.

Casey has stated that she had a second phone, a Blackberry, that she somehow lost. In the forensic report, it's stated that TonE's cell phone is a Blackberry. I'm sure Casey saw that phone, observed TL using the phone and knows it's functions, and wanted one like it.

So, when she was pressured to come up with an explanation of why she didn't have a telephone number for the nanny who kidnapped Caylee, or for any of the non-existent friends, or telephone numbers of ZFG's relatives, who could vouch for the existence of ZFG, she made up the lie of the lost cell phone, and said it was a Blackberry, based only on the fact that TonE had a Blackberry.

This post should properly belong on the thread about the Blackberry, but in re-reading the computer forensic report linked by belle3, that thought came to mind.

It's Not the Nanny
10-28-2009, 03:49 PM
Val, this came out of the computer forensic zip file from 9 / 2008. Media never uploaded it. OCSO released it in HTML format but I converted to PDF. Here is a copy:

5938

Wow! Thanks, JWG. I've never read that!

"between caylee, getting ready for UCF this fall, getting my personal training
certification, working, and a few hours a week with the new boyfriend, ****, and
house-hunting, i don't sleep"...... oh the web we weave! :waitasec:

MissJames
10-28-2009, 03:51 PM
GOOD POINT! See, that's where she's different than me. If I got caught creating a cover up for something bad, I'd wet down both legs, puke and be as transparent as glass. Apparently KC is of the fabric it's just a new unexpected challenge worthy of whipping out her "fibbilator". So you're probably right, she would have just let that one fly without changing her breathing.

I always remember her walk down the hallway at Universal with LE.I bet if she had seen an empty office she would have walked in and told Yuri "here it is!".
She lies easily.

sleutherontheside
10-28-2009, 03:55 PM
Wow! Thanks, JWG. I've never read that!

"between caylee, getting ready for UCF this fall, getting my personal training
certification, working, and a few hours a week with the new boyfriend, ****, and
house-hunting, i don't sleep"...... oh the web we weave! :waitasec:


Noting the absence of "Event Planning at Universal" instead of just working. I think the only truthful statement in there was "I don't sleep".

It's Not the Nanny
10-28-2009, 04:16 PM
Noting the absence of "Event Planning at Universal" instead of just working. I think the only truthful statement in there was "I don't sleep".

"personal training certification" ?? That was a new one for me!

Sdavidson11
10-28-2009, 04:18 PM
Just found this interesting:

WitePlayboi (8:01:33 AM): so what r u up 2
casey o marie (8:02:02 AM): not a whole lot. checking up on all the myspace/facebook hoopla

What a great sleuther you are. These postings to me read like a skit. Any how kc still is getting her house and Amy is moving in. The time frame has just shifted a bit. I also had so giggle with her saying this is her first boyfriend in over a year. Poor sweet Caylee, if only her mother was as ambitious as she tried to portray herself to be we would not be reading about her crazy life and Caylee would still be alive. Back on the subject of kc & zanny. I have been trying to tag old threads and on one of them someone posted that there was a zenaida Gonzalez/Jacksonville, fl search and a zenaida Fernandez/25 search. I may have the last names reversed but have these searches been confirmed? I have not been able to find confirmation. Thanks in advance.

RR0004
10-28-2009, 04:46 PM
So the listed location is simply self-populated? If I created a page and I lived in Orlando, but I put the city of origin as San Diego, it would say San Diego, but the time-stamp would be EST, correct?

If that is correct, then the creation time would certainly point to Orlando and in the absence of other info; I'd like to assume that the time stamp of EST suffices. Should that pan out to be true, and this is definitely KC, based on actual IP address if that is available, it would seem the best part of this evidence now is how EARLY this was created on the 16th. If indeed a fight occurred the evening before (it's hard for me to think that KC couldn't just have abandoned Caylee and disappeared and stayed at Tony's by herself if he told her that a toddler was not appropriate or welcome - so I tend to go with some kind of argument that would have left her feeling cornered and "spiteful") - then KC was up that early in the morning hatching her plan.

It strikes me as odd that both CA and GA reversed their earlier stance that they knew that KC was in her bedroom early in the morning of the 16th. It makes me wonder where she was and what she was up to. On the computer??

At any rate, it makes the premeditated aspect of this case stand out in high relief.
It tells me they sensed the need to cover for that time frame. They have info that we have yet to receive (obviously).

AZlawyer
10-28-2009, 05:03 PM
What a great sleuther you are. These postings to me read like a skit. Any how kc still is getting her house and Amy is moving in. The time frame has just shifted a bit. I also had so giggle with her saying this is her first boyfriend in over a year. Poor sweet Caylee, if only her mother was as ambitious as she tried to portray herself to be we would not be reading about her crazy life and Caylee would still be alive. Back on the subject of kc & zanny. I have been trying to tag old threads and on one of them someone posted that there was a zenaida Gonzalez/Jacksonville, fl search and a zenaida Fernandez/25 search. I may have the last names reversed but have these searches been confirmed? I have not been able to find confirmation. Thanks in advance.

The searches were done (probably by Lee, based on his testimony) after Cindy picked up Casey and Casey "confessed" the kidnapping.

Kentjbkent
10-28-2009, 05:25 PM
Wow! Thanks, JWG. I've never read that!

"between caylee, getting ready for UCF this fall, getting my personal training
certification, working, and a few hours a week with the new boyfriend, ****, and
house-hunting, i don't sleep"...... oh the web we weave! :waitasec:


First time I have heard that??? Where in the heck did that come from?

Ok...wait...I get it. THAT'S why she spent so much time on stage at Fusion Lounge?

panama
10-29-2009, 12:24 AM
I finally finished the thread. You guys aren't kidding about the rollercoaster ride! :) I almost updated my last post with "ETA: nevermind," but it is interesting that the zenaida MS might not be a wild goose chase after all.

Thanks, Valhall, for the time zone info! Looking back, it does make sense that it's in the observer's timezone. I guess that explains why the timestamps on the cached versions of the pages were always 4 hours later than mine: they were just from google's servers' perspective. Also, I want to believe that the signup time can be narrowed down by the later signups' first post times, but part of me wonders whether that's really valid. Hmm. Like others have said, there is something comical about how LE can just call up MS and get the IP and signup info, in comparison to what's gone on in this 70 page thread :)

A few other thoughts:

What if the page, with its IP supposedly being from southern Florida, actually indicates that there is a real, non-KC Zenaida from Miami, who planned to kidnap Caylee on the 16th and set up the page while KC was comfortably at home surfing the web, and then she or KC last checked (updated?) the account on Oct. 14th to see if either had left messages while KC was out of Jail. (Just playing devil's advocate. :p In fact, maybe someone else proposed this before... long thread, man.)

Maybe this belongs in the computer forensics thread, but I remember that there was some question about the deal with Safari being installed on one of the computers. If I'm not mistaken, Safari for the PC was the first browser with a "stealth" mode, where you go into that mode to surf, and it automagically deletes (and/or minimally stores?) cache, history, cookies, logins, etc. when you leave that mode. It's only recently that Firefox et al added this feature. I haven't checked the details about this, though.

I think KC may have actually been somewhat knowledgeable about tech/computer stuff. I remember a jail phonecall she had w/ LA, where he's trying to tell her something about cell phones and SIM cards, and he says "KC, look, here's how this works..." and she replies and basically corrects him with accurate, seemingly tech-y information. (Like how you can save different things to the SIM card and to the phone, switch the SIM etc.)

In terms of the blue screen, I might be mistaken, but I don't think it's trivially possible to induce an actual blue screen of death... Just putting this out there.

Ok, that's all for now. Keep up the good work, guys. This thread may have been a rollercoaster, but it was definitely fun to read. :)

QB.
10-29-2009, 06:50 AM
Just a question- when was the first comment left on the video portion of the myspace site? Was there a date visible and what was that date? Was it pre Oct 14? I just wonder if the person who created the page saw that comment and realized it would be found out.


I found the date
Monday Mar 2, 2009

BondJamesBond
10-29-2009, 08:54 AM
BBM

Val, Acccording to CA's deposition, part 2, page 275, she says she left early on the morning of June 16th, about 1/2 hr. to 45 mins. earlier than usual.

Her time card is always 8 am., so if she usually leaves at 7:30am., she is saying she left before 7 am.

...making it reasonably certain in either case that the 7:45AM call from G&C's house phone to Casey's cell phone was placed by Casey (e.g. "WTH's my phone?")


Just found this interesting:

WitePlayboi (8:01:33 AM): so what r u up 2
casey o marie (8:02:02 AM): not a whole lot. checking up on all the myspace/facebook hoopla

Interesting, indeed. Casey found her phone. Must've just checked it to see if she'd missed anything from Tony...then hopped on to IM, etc.

KenoshaKid
10-29-2009, 09:07 AM
In terms of the blue screen, I might be mistaken, but I don't think it's trivially possible to induce an actual blue screen of death... Just putting this out there.


respectfully snipped for brevity and relevance:

I would think reformatting the hard drive would do the trick, no?

faefrost
10-29-2009, 10:34 AM
respectfully snipped for brevity and relevance:

I would think reformatting the hard drive would do the trick, no?

It would depend on exactly what the blue screen error was. But deleting portions of the windows directory without reformatting would do it pretty easily. It's a sign that whoever had that computer simply attempted to "delete" everything on the hard drive, but didn't reformat it. A reformat would cause a black no boot device found message on startup. Blue screen means it attempted to boot normally but found system files missing or damaged.

KenoshaKid
10-29-2009, 10:45 AM
It would depend on exactly what the blue screen error was. But deleting portions of the windows directory without reformatting would do it pretty easily. It's a sign that whoever had that computer simply attempted to "delete" everything on the hard drive, but didn't reformat it. A reformat would cause a black no boot device found message on startup. Blue screen means it attempted to boot normally but found system files missing or damaged.

Not sure if you can do that in XP like you could in the old DOS days.. and I'm not gonna try that one, LOL!! :)

sumbunny
10-29-2009, 11:34 AM
What version of windows was she using? I'm going to assume xp?

ETA: there are simple instructions on youtube on how to get the blue screen of death

YouTube - How to get blue screen of death
YouTube - How to crash Windows XP

Snaz
10-29-2009, 01:16 PM
Can someone please refresh my memory who witeplayboi is?

TIA!!!

cyberborg
10-29-2009, 01:27 PM
respectfully snipped for brevity and relevance:

I would think reformatting the hard drive would do the trick, no?

Not really, you need to do more than reformat the drive, you'd also need to rewrite new data on top a few times to ensure that it is not recoverable. A formatted drive's data can be recovered, the prior data of an over-written drive can be often recovered. Safest way is to physically destroy the drive.

cyberborg
10-29-2009, 01:35 PM
It would depend on exactly what the blue screen error was. But deleting portions of the windows directory without reformatting would do it pretty easily. It's a sign that whoever had that computer simply attempted to "delete" everything on the hard drive, but didn't reformat it. A reformat would cause a black no boot device found message on startup. Blue screen means it attempted to boot normally but found system files missing or damaged.

To me, a blue screen might put off a casual user that the computer was broken/unusable but the applications and data are still fine and the system can be easily recovered. Even if severe damage is done to the Windows OS such that it needs re-install or the drive cannot be booted --- you can still access the drive from another system and recover a LOT!.

JWG
10-29-2009, 02:05 PM
I am pretty confident I have determined when the zenaida Myspace page was created.

As I mentioned in a previous post, the range 389715668 to 389972021 represents all people who signed up for a myspace account on June 16, 2008. That's 256,353 people world-wide.

The zenaida page has ID 389838213, which is 122,545 after the first on June 16. It seems unreasonable to believe that the zenaida page would be created in the 12AM to 1AM window that someone was on the computer at the Anthony's. After all, can we believe that nearly half of those who signed up on June 16 did so before 1AM? Naw... :snooty:

It turns out that we can use "false starts" to nail down when the zenaida page was created. What is a "false start", you ask? :waitasec:

A false start occurs when a person signs up for Myspace, but never follows through on the email confirmation. :bang: It turns out Myspace goes ahead and creates the basic page when you first sign-up, not when you click on the email confirmation. I tested that this morning and, although I never confirmed, I could see the Myspace page by just using the ID number that was part of the confirmation link included in the email to me from Myspace.

Now, if one has a Myspace account and adds a false start as a favorite, one can see exactly when the profile was automatically created (last updated) by Myspace as a result of the sign-up. Things get a little flaky with Myspace in that the "last updated" field for a favorite is given in PST. :doh:

I noticed first that the ~250,000 new members on June 16, 2008 equates to just over 10,000 per hour. The first thing I did was look at the first few false starts in that ID range, then every 10,000th ID, to see if the sign-up rate was just over 10,000 an hour. The answer is yes. The rate drops down unsurprisingly in the early morning hours and rises in the late afternoon and evening, but the distribution across the day is fairly even. :)

The first false start sign-up of June 16 occurred at 9:00 PM PST on June 15. This is one of the first June 16 sign-ups overall. I was able to find pretty easily some number of false starts roughly every 10,000th sign up, including false starts very close to the zenaida ID, on either side. :dance:

Recall from posts 7 weeks or so ago that adding zenaida as a favorite showed us that the last profile update was made at 11:31 AM PST on June 16. Interestingly, there are a number of false starts on either side of the zenaida page. All of these false starts have a time stamp of 11:29 PST. :eek:

My conclusion is that KC signed up for the page at 2:29 PM EST (11:29 PST) and, after confirming the account, spent all of two minutes to upload a profile picture - Dora the Explorer. That last update is recorded at 11:31 PST.

Note that KC ends a call with Amy at 2:21 PM, and starts a call with Jesse at 2:53 PM, so creation of this Myspace page fits nicely within that window of time. :thumb:

ETA: The zenaida myspace ID is 389838213.

For completeness, here is a false start ID 68 sign-ups before zenaida: 389838145
And here is a false start ID 36 sign-ups after zenaida: 389838249

For those with a Myspace page, you can add them as a favorite and confirm that the last profile update for each was 11:29 AM (PST). There are a number of false starts in between that all show the same 11:29 AM time.

sleutherontheside
10-29-2009, 02:21 PM
JWG......I am humbled to read your words. I am not worthy of posting in your near vicinity. The work you have done is nothing short of AMAZING!

panama
10-29-2009, 04:57 PM
Great idea, JWG! Wow, so the signup time finally appears to be pinned down. Very cool.

I have a tangential question: how can you tell a 'false start' from a... 'nearly false start'? What I mean by a 'nearly false start' is if someone signs up, does confirm via email, but then does nothing else. Does the "profile updated" time not appear in the latter case or something? (I don't think the distinction matters here in terms of pinning down the creation time of the zenadia page; I'm just curious :) )

cecybeans
10-29-2009, 05:43 PM
JWG - I hope you are passing all this fabulous info along to other Enquiring Minds. With a bill for services rendered...

The fact KC most likely is the MS page creator and the time coincides with cell records indicates that she was not all that worried about getting a babysitter if push came to shove. That's at best. IMO, she may have already been visualizing the deed itself. Between this and the battery of duct tape evidence you've pulled together, I can't see any juror not seeing premeditation. Kudos, oh Breather of Rarified Air! We most humbly genuflect!

JWG
10-29-2009, 05:46 PM
Great idea, JWG! Wow, so the signup time finally appears to be pinned down. Very cool.

I have a tangential question: how can you tell a 'false start' from a... 'nearly false start'? What I mean by a 'nearly false start' is if someone signs up, does confirm via email, but then does nothing else. Does the "profile updated" time not appear in the latter case or something? (I don't think the distinction matters here in terms of pinning down the creation time of the zenadia page; I'm just curious :) )

Good question...and the best answer I have is that I believe there is no difference so long as none of the "profile wizard" screens are updated. Myspace does not call it a profile wizard, but it is a set of 3 or 4 screens that ask you to enter more information about yourself once you click on the link confirming signup. Things like "where did you go to school". They also give you a chance to enter a profile picture.

I believe what KC did is update the profile picture during the "profile wizard" screens. Otherwise I cannot come up with a reason why her timestamp is only 2 minutes different than the surrounding false starts.

chefmom
10-29-2009, 06:46 PM
JWG, as always.... :bow: :bow: :bow: We are so lucky to have such wonderful sleuthers as yourself. :blowkiss:

JWG
10-29-2009, 06:53 PM
JWG, as always.... :bow: :bow: :bow: We are so lucky to have such wonderful sleuthers as yourself. :blowkiss:

Well, not so fast CM...:bang:

Not retracting anything above regarding the time the page was created... :snooty:

But, what started this whole recent flurry was the fact the "Videos" link disappeared from the zenaida Myspace.

Now looking for "false starts", I cannot find anyone with a "Videos" link unless they are running profile 2.0.

So, did LE seize everyone's Myspace, or did everyone's Myspace simply lose the link? :waitasec:

chefmom
10-29-2009, 07:01 PM
Well, not so fast CM...:bang:

Not retracting anything above regarding the time the page was created... :snooty:

But, what started this whole recent flurry was the fact the "Videos" link disappeared from the zenaida Myspace.

Now looking for "false starts", I cannot find anyone with a "Videos" link unless they are running profile 2.0.

So, did LE seize everyone's Myspace, or did everyone's Myspace simply lose the link? :waitasec:

Hmmmm! I don't have MS, but maybe anyone else who does have one could check this out?

Valhall
10-29-2009, 07:15 PM
JWG,

DO you still have the URL to the zenaida myspace video section? If so, can you try putting my user number in and see if it tells you my channel is gone? (may not tell you anything because I've never put videos up so I'm not sure I ever had a channel...snicker).

And thanks for all the hard work! So maybe the LE DIDN'T do anything to this page???

And then the other question is (trying to step up to your level of thinking on your sleuthy business about the false starts). Am I understanding correct that any one who started making a website say from the night of the 15th to the morning of the 16th and then later logged into their email and completed the process was assigned the same "last updated" time of 11:31 am? Is that correct?

Valhall
10-29-2009, 07:19 PM
P.s. JWG, I added a video so that I should have a "channel". Now tell me if you see a video link or if putting the URL into that video section works on my page.

cecybeans
10-29-2009, 07:27 PM
I rarely go to MySpace anymore - they dumped the playlists feature and that was basically the only thing I enjoyed. Listening to Grateful Dead and Laurie Anderson in the background while I read email. I'm too old to care about anything else on there, lol. It does look like they have changed a few things around this year though.

MAMABEAR
10-29-2009, 07:42 PM
I rarely go to MySpace anymore - they dumped the playlists feature and that was basically the only thing I enjoyed. Listening to Grateful Dead and Laurie Anderson in the background while I read email. I'm too old to care about anything else on there, lol. It does look like they have changed a few things around this year though.

So what r u sayin Beans? The adults have moved over to facebook? LMAO