Canada-Victoria Stafford, 8, Woodstock, Ontario; thread #6

[hoppyfrog]

Continue here.

[another nosey mom]

I wonder what the criteria is for the rewards, why has the Oxford Police offered the reward and NOT the OPP even though the OPP are handling the investigation?? Yes, to me that would say it is a local crime and one that the OPP thinks is going to be solved locally and not jump to different areas of the province/country... I wish they would say more

[doubletrouble]

whew...i can see that you all have been so busy googling, searching, researching..etc, it took me since 9am this morning till now to catch up on posts....wow great sleuthing...
so what i have taken away from this, is that the ride came and went with no tori in sight...tara cried and ctv cameras even caught it..although not sure if they aired it, i didnt see it....anyhoo...there have been no sightings of tori...none, zero, nada...even in caylee's case, there were false sightings....this tells me that tori is def no longer with us, as much as i hate to believe that...i believe the astro is 100% accurate thus far, and tori is no longer with us, and the police know this too..hence the searching in the landfill...
also ..before the first day tori returned to school on the 8th...was that not the spring/easter holiday break? was she and her bro not out of school for awhile? if this was brought up before, i didnt see it..here in florida our spring /easter breaks are differant times than canadas..
and finally an amber alert can be issued the day after..its not too late..as was in my neice's case..she was abducted on a sunday...surviellance showed her abduction on a monday, and monday the police issued her amber alert...of course we all know now then it was too late..but just saying...not to late to issue an amber alert the day after..as long as they have solid evidence that the child was abducted by a stranger and/or is in danger....

[paris_paris]

OK, here's the problem I'm having with Sterling Sinclair. He is making me feel like I am personally responsible for finding Victoria.

I found a link to him on the FB group. I was fascinated by his stuff. He mentioned Tori's doll, maybe Julie (it's not, it's Chloe). On FB, when I typed "Who's Julie", I remembered something from when my Mom died a month ago. We kept a journal for my Mom at the hospital. My niece had written in it "Who's Julie" because my Mom was asking about her. There is no Julie in our family. The memory was eerie, and at that point little things came together. My login password on FB was Sinclair. I have since changed it. Tara's house number is 647 (correct me if that's wrong). My Mom's house number was 647.

I kept watching Sterling's updates, and he mentioned Apps Mill, which is very close to my home. I decided one night that putting up posters at the campgrounds might be a good idea, as there were other psychic references to trailers. Pinehurst Park is near me. I don't remember why, but I sent Sterling a map of Pinehurst Park. That's when he did the overlay of one of his older drawings with Pinehurst. I can't decide myself if there really is a similarity.

Sterling has many updates today. He says that Tori is in Paris. I live in Paris. I did not tell him that.

He mentions the river and the dam. Yes Paris has those. Paris does not have a Front Street. The one-eyed man? My husband plays darts with someone who is blind in one eye.

I will admit that the news article with Tori's grandmother that mentioned the purple blanket and Sunday dress just made me think that she had spoken with Sterling before he posted that stuff.

Maybe I have just read too much in the last weeks, and too much feels personal. Sorry for my first post being so long. I just had to put that all out there, and my husband thinks I'm crazy.

In Sterling's "Lifting the Fog" auracature today, he indicates Tori will be found tomorrow. I hope he's right.

[elepher50]

So sad that Tori cannot be found - the search is still concentrated in Woodstock. Evidence has been removed from the previous residence. The abductor in the video has not been identified. Nobody has been absolved of involvement with Tori's abduction - nobody has been cleared. Fund raisers have raised many a person's eyebrows and questions of how the money will be spent. Limo drive to Toronto yet no reporters or locals can confirm that there was a limo anywhere near Frances Street. Purple is Tori's favorite color. Grandma usually took Tori to Sunday school on Sundays and Grandma dropped Tori off at school on the morning she went missing. Grandma recently purchased a doggie after her husband passed away. Tara's FB comments are said to include "had a blast at the doggie park" on Family Day.
Key notes relating to findings on the Astro Thread:
1. deception
2. money
3. Dates noted around the same weekend as Family Day in Ontario
4. Plot probably involved
5. Addictions
6. Knowledge of what happened rests on the mother's side of the family
7. Daryn is heartbroken

Overall we know very little and there are confusing/conflicting accounts of family connections on the mother's side. The person in the video and the composite sketch has not been identified even though Woodstock is a small town.

Tori should be found already and she is not. Maybe we should go back through the basics and list all the facts that we know, timeline what information was made available when - list each day and what we gleaned from each day - factual with no rumours. Sadly, I think the answer is staring us in the face and we can't see it. All this is MOO.

[Flowercb]

Paris Paris, I hope that if sterling is right about anything, that he is right about tori being found tomorrow. That would be truly amazing. I think we would all have to go to Woodstock to meet and celebrate when this happens. Except, of course, those that live in the U.S.

[LuckyPenny]

So sad that Tori cannot be found - the search is still concentrated in Woodstock. Evidence has been removed from the previous residence. The abductor in the video has not been identified. Nobody has been absolved of involvement with Tori's abduction - nobody has been cleared. Fund raisers have raised many a person's eyebrows and questions of how the money will be spent. Limo drive to Toronto yet no reporters or locals can confirm that there was a limo anywhere near Frances Street. Purple is Tori's favorite color. Grandma usually took Tori to Sunday school on Sundays and Grandma dropped Tori off at school on the morning she went missing. Grandma recently purchased a doggie after her husband passed away. Tara's FB comments are said to include "had a blast at the doggie park" on Family Day.
Key notes relating to findings on the Astro Thread:
1. deception
2. money
3. Dates noted around the same weekend as Family Day in Ontario
4. Plot probably involved
5. Addictions
6. Knowledge of what happened rests on the mother's side of the family
7. Daryn is heartbroken

Overall we know very little and there are confusing/conflicting accounts of family connections on the mother's side. The person in the video and the composite sketch has not been identified even though Woodstock is a small town.

Tori should be found already and she is not. Maybe we should go back through the basics and list all the facts that we know, timeline what information was made available when - list each day and what we gleaned from each day - factual with no rumours. Sadly, I think the answer is staring us in the face and we can't see it. All this is MOO.

I agree the answer is staring us in the face, I believe we just need more concrete proof. I believe the police also know the answer, they are keeping it close to them and I believe slowly things are starting to unravel and slowly things are not adding up thus the answer will all come out.

[LuckyPenny]

Psychic Sterling Sinclair Erased Tori Stafford Posts, April 26, 2009
April 26, 2009

Psychic Sterling Sinclair Erased Tori Stafford Posts, April 26, 2009

For reasons that I am not able to elaborate on,

I have deleted the past Tori Stafford posts.

I still recommend the family seek a medium.

I will no longer be posting further psychic information that I receive regarding Tori Stafford.

Sorry for any and all inconvenience this may cause or has caused.

Sterling

Is he now posting about Tori again? What made him quit?

[Flowercb]

Is he now posting about Tori again? What made him quit?

I don't know exactly what made him quit. I think people were not reading the information. But he said that Tori kept coming to him so strongly that he could not ignore her. This could be her live spirit, it does not mean she is gone. In fact he feels she is alive.

Common that everyone of the psychics (six that I know of) have indicated that Tori is alive.

[paris_paris]

I read that as the family asked him to stop. Just my guess.

Before he erased anything, he posted about thinking the artistic rendering looking like Tara. I don't know what he said after that got erased.

He said he started posting again because Tori wouldn't leave him alone.

[Flowercb]

One of Sinclairs two auracatures for today indicates that Tori is saying why did they leave me alone. Maybe they left her and someone will find her soon. I hope she is free to run as fast as her little legs take her. GO TORI!!

[doubletrouble]

well being that not much news came from the "tori ride home" bike rally yesterday...and most seem focused on this psychic dreamer...true or not i have no clue... i think im going to take this opportunity to finally look thru the caylee newest doc dump that has been on the back burner for awhile now...could/would someone be kind enough to p.m me or alert me if there is any activity or any changes with the tori case? i promise in return id be happy to do the same for whoever, whichever case they happen to be working on but are preoccupied at the momment to tackle.
tyia for all my websleuth friends

[justbetweenus]

Is he now posting about Tori again? What made him quit?

JMO and a guess, but maybe to attract attention. Like to make followers think the police asked him to delete because they believe his dreams are going to break the case.

[prism]

JMO and a guess, but maybe to attract attention. Like to make followers think the police asked him to delete because they believe his dreams are going to break the case.
Bullseye! :)

[FUNNYGIRL101]

http://www.mapquest.com/mq/6-ZN2rd3c0Q8IPdMyL

The above map-link to Burleigh Falls, Ontario shows on the left all of the pizza places in the area. If tori is smelling pizza then it would be people who run a pizza place or do a lot of deliveries for one.

Thought I would drop this in .. as I believe others were doing well with this lead.

[another nosey mom]

Is he now posting about Tori again? What made him quit?

okay, why did he stop commenting on Tori, is that not kind of strange? Did someone say something to him to stop?? maybe he was getting too close?

[another nosey mom]

http://www.mapquest.com/mq/6-ZN2rd3c0Q8IPdMyL

The above map-link to Burleigh Falls, Ontario shows on the left all of the pizza places in the area. If tori is smelling pizza then it would be people who run a pizza place or do a lot of deliveries for one.

Thought I would drop this in .. as I believe others were doing well with this lead.

I understood the reading as Tori seeing a pizza truck (maybe old pizza truck, now sitting in a field or something) and she would hope/think that it would smell of pizza but it doesnt - my thoughts are there are a bunch of old cars/vans, etc. sitting up in long grass, pasture where cows are... she is in the old house

[PenelopePetunia]

I understood the reading as Tori seeing a pizza truck (maybe old pizza truck, now sitting in a field or something) and she would hope/think that it would smell of pizza but it doesnt - my thoughts are there are a bunch of old cars/vans, etc. sitting up in long grass, pasture where cows are... she is in the old house


Right! It is a Pizza truck he has sensed... and according to his insight it doesn't smell like one. I guess its a bad smell like old oil or gas... ???

[FUNNYGIRL101]

from SS: The brown van parked beside the pizza truck smells bad.

I thought it would smell like pizza but it doesn’t.


SS states she told him the brown van smells bad. (rotten?)
Possibly tori is thinking the pizza truck would smell like pizza but it doesn't. I don't take that to necessarily mean that the pizza truck is old, only that (if you've ever been in a vehicle that has been used for pizza deliveries) it smells like sh*t .. !

Also on CH's prediction.. below the sketch she mentioned Oxford. Since Toronto was mentioned and areas there.. I thought of Oxford Seminars... Just a thought.

[justbetweenus]

okay, why did he stop commenting on Tori, is that not kind of strange? Did someone say something to him to stop?? maybe he was getting too close?


By golly I think you're right...^^5.;)

Sadly our Sinclair needs a reboot. I had no idea that psychics are prone to brain damage from all the voices they hear. I'd be afraid to go to sleep at night, but then I'm a wimp lol.:)

http://propheticwisdom.wordpress.com/2009/05/03/psychic-sterling-sinclair-requests-ethereal-psychic-markers-and-website-addresses-may-3-2009/

[Flowercb]

I heard because of the amount of energy that passes through their bodies they can get all kinds of health problems.

[justbetweenus]

whew...i can see that you all have been so busy googling, searching, researching..etc, it took me since 9am this morning till now to catch up on posts....wow great sleuthing...
so what i have taken away from this, is that the ride came and went with no tori in sight...tara cried and ctv cameras even caught it..although not sure if they aired it, i didnt see it....anyhoo...there have been no sightings of tori...none, zero, nada...even in caylee's case, there were false sightings....this tells me that tori is def no longer with us, as much as i hate to believe that...i believe the astro is 100% accurate thus far, and tori is no longer with us, and the police know this too..hence the searching in the landfill...
also ..before the first day tori returned to school on the 8th...was that not the spring/easter holiday break? was she and her bro not out of school for awhile? if this was brought up before, i didnt see it..here in florida our spring /easter breaks are differant times than canadas..
and finally an amber alert can be issued the day after..its not too late..as was in my neice's case..she was abducted on a sunday...surviellance showed her abduction on a monday, and monday the police issued her amber alert...of course we all know now then it was too late..but just saying...not to late to issue an amber alert the day after..as long as they have solid evidence that the child was abducted by a stranger and/or is in danger....

Hi DT...I would imagine you had to wade through a bunch of my useless posts to catch up, and for that I apologize. It was just one of those evenings.:) Your post is interesting, and one I agree with, and would like to discuss further when I have more time. Just hope i don't forget.;)

[paris_paris]

Something new the FaceBooker's have found.

4 seconds into this video... http://watch.ctv.ca/news/latest/missing-ont-girl/#clip164457

you will find this woman compared in the image below. Although it looks like James Goris with her in the video, I have been told it is not him. Thoughts?

http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n64/paris_images/compare.jpg

[another nosey mom]

By golly I think you're right...^^5.;)

Sadly our Sinclair needs a reboot. I had no idea that psychics are prone to brain damage from all the voices they hear. I'd be afraid to go to sleep at night, but then I'm a wimp lol.:)

http://propheticwisdom.wordpress.com/2009/05/03/psychic-sterling-sinclair-requests-ethereal-psychic-markers-and-website-addresses-may-3-2009/

have you read his website about him, I'm surprised he can function in real life, with so many voices speaking to him, I think I'd have a headache!

[another nosey mom]

Something new the FaceBooker's have found.

4 seconds into this video... http://watch.ctv.ca/news/latest/missing-ont-girl/#clip164457

you will find this woman compared in the image below. Although it looks like James Goris with her in the video, I have been told it is not him. Thoughts?

http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n64/paris_images/compare.jpg

the pictures do look alike, this was in Brantford...I wonder if it was a family member?

[just_curious]

I have been lurking for a while but my first post

I do believe the picture is from the Brantford vigil.
I so believe the resemblence is uncanny.

[ChaChaCha]

I have been lurking for a while but my first post

I do believe the picture is from the Brantford vigil.
I so believe the resemblence is uncanny.

Welcome JustCurious!

Yes, the resemblance is more than uncanny...it is eerie... Looks more like the sketch than TM even...

ParisParis is veeeeeeeeerrrrrrrrrrryyyyyyyy close to Brantford! Quick, send her out looking!!!!

[KT Can]

Wow....who IS the girl in the photo???

[gogrannypop]

I have been lurking for a while but my first post

I do believe the picture is from the Brantford vigil.
I so believe the resemblence is uncanny.

I agree!

I must also say that I am glad to see so many neighbors to the north joining WS. (speaking as someone that can walk there from here).

Welcome and hello!

:chicken::chicken:

[just_curious]

Ok just looking at the pic from the Brantford vigil again...Is that woman wearing some kind of puffy light colored coat?

[Lexiintoronto]

I have been lurking for a while but my first post

I do believe the picture is from the Brantford vigil.
I so believe the resemblence is uncanny.

I wonder if that hairstyle is popular in Woodstock? (severly pulled back).

Welcome to WS!!

:Welcome-12-june::leaf::newbie::canada:

[Doodlelover]

Wow the pic of the girl from Brantford is very very close to the composite picture.

I had been wondering why the cheekbones were so prominent in the sketch and if it was accurate that it would help catch the person or that it may have just been overdone by the sketch artist, but NOW, looking at the cheekbones on the girl in the pic, it has to be her. Look at the odd pointy sort of nose, the thin downturned lips. This is the closest I've seen anybody look to a composite.

We need to try and sleuth out who that is and how she's connected. At the very least LE need to see these pics together and check it out.

[just_curious]

We need to try and sleuth out who that is and how she's connected. At the very least LE need to see these pics together and check it out.

I agree!

I grew up in Brantford and lived there till my mid-20's I racking my brain to see if I can think of anyone who kind of looks like this woman (a cousin , sister...anyone)
I feel like putting her on my FB account to see if any of my Brantford friends/family have an idea.

[another nosey mom]

Ok just looking at the pic from the Brantford vigil again...Is that woman wearing some kind of puffy light colored coat?

I think that is what makes this picture fit, the hair, the cheeks , the coat, so much...gosh, why would you where the coat to the vigil and your hair back like that, unless... the vigil was before the composite drawing was posted after.... the vigil was in Brantford since they have lots of relatives that live there...

[paris_paris]

The coat is green. The video is in colour.

[another nosey mom]

this new pic is being discussed as we speak, on facebook... time will tell if anyone figures it out!

[Lexiintoronto]

this new pic is being discussed as we speak, on facebook... time will tell if anyone figures it out!
I can only visit that site for about 3 minutes at a time before I want to throw away my laptop. A lot of arguing about nothing over there :poke:

[justbetweenus]

this new pic is being discussed as we speak, on facebook... time will tell if anyone figures it out!

Could you direct me to where you FBers are discussing this? Thanks.

[just_curious]

Could you direct me to where you FBers are discussing this? Thanks.

http://www.facebook.com/topic.php?uid=74634371858&topic=8300&post=38123#/group.php?gid=74634371858

[another nosey mom]

I can only visit that site for about 3 minutes at a time before I want to throw away my laptop. A lot of arguing about nothing over there :poke:

no kidding, I only go there when I'm desperate for any new info, but to date, it's just garbage

[justbetweenus]

http://www.facebook.com/topic.php?uid=74634371858&topic=8300&post=38123#/group.php?gid=74634371858


Thank-you just! And welcome to ws.

The other just.:)

[LuckyPenny]

She does look like the sketch; however, so does everyone else in Woodstock. It's a pretty common look if you ask me. The way girls wear their hair and make up (dark under the eyes).

[Crazy Canuck]

[quote=doubletrouble;3692252]
also ..before the first day tori returned to school on the 8th...was that not the spring/easter holiday break? was she and her bro not out of school for awhile? if this was brought up before, i didnt see it..here in florida our spring /easter breaks are differant times than canadas..
quote]

In Ontario the easter holiday only includes Good Friday and Easter Monday. Good Friday was on April 10 this year...two days after the abduction.

[justbetweenus]

She does look like the sketch; however, so does everyone else in Woodstock. It's a pretty common look if you ask me. The way girls wear their hair and make up (dark under the eyes).

I agree with you Lucky.....the sketch resembles a very common appearance.

I really don't see the similarities between these two pics that others are seeing, other then maybe approx. same height, and both having a pony tail. I think the profile pic of this lady shows someone with a very skinny nose, with a prominent upturn peak.

However, I'm sure there have been 175 calls to the tip line concerning her. And just maybe with all the attention on this pic the lady will come forward.

Look at the size of those paws on her shoulders lol.

[Flowercb]

She does look like the sketch; however, so does everyone else in Woodstock. It's a pretty common look if you ask me. The way girls wear their hair and make up (dark under the eyes).

I agree, that this is a common look. The features in the composite sketch could fit many woman. The key is for anyone who remembers a woman who looked like the composite sketch in the area of the time of the abduction wearing a white coat.

I certainly would not want my photo posted on sites on the internet. I would be careful as there could be people who could take legal action against people accusing them and posting their picture on sites.

[justbetweenus]

The coat is green. The video is in colour.

And a much bigger parka/hood.

[LuckyPenny]

http://www.lfpress.ca/cgi-bin/publish.cgi?x=galleries&s=missing&p=2975&pg=89

Tons of pictures at this site.

[Turbododger]

Just wanted to point out that besides some positive support and well wishing by folks on the FB group for Tori (which by the way has over 100,000 members), there is alot of discussion about nothing. BUT both Rodney and his brother read it often (it seems) and go on there and post, the only ones I have caught have been later in the evening. So, if you wanted to ask them anything, you could get there attention sometimes, and they have been responding to some. But they admit that they couldn't possibly read everything.

There are over 55,000 posts on the FB wall for that group.

[Turbododger]

This is the first "broadcast" post that Rodney has written, I think from last night, on FB group:

Recent NewsRodney Stafford wrote
at 22:24
IF BY CHANCE THE PERSONS RESPONSIBLE FOR THE DISSAPPEARENCE OF VICTORIA ARE READING THIS,,,, I HOPE YOU ARE SCARED, NERVOUS, OR WHATEVER YOUR SICK MINDS ARE FEELING RIGHT NOW,,,, BUT KNOW THIS................."DADDY, AND THE WORLD, ARE COMING FOR VICTORIA. DO THE RIGHT THING AND LET HER GO!!! DROP HER AT AN OPEN STORE, A MALL, INFRONT OF SOMEONE'S HOUSE, ANYTHING!!!! SHE IS JUST AN INNOCENT LITTLE GIRL WITH DREAMS OF PLAYING WITH HER BROTHER, FAMILY, AND FRIENDS. THE LONGER THIS GOES ON, THE WORSE THINGS GET FOR YOU. PLEASE, PLEASE, DO THE RIGHT THING AND LET "OUR" , NOT JUST MINE, BUT THE WORLDS LITTLE ANGEL GO!! DROP HER AND RUN, I DON'T CARE, JUST HAVE A HEART AND LET MY BABY BE HAPPY AGAIN!!!

______________________________________________

THANK YOU ALL SO VERY MUCH FOR HELPING IN OUR SEARCH.

______________________________________________

To everyone that missed our press conference on April 23, 2009, the following is from the actual sheet read to the media:

"...there has been much discussion concerning fundraising for Victoria's family. We would like to stress the fact that the only thing we want people to be spending is their time and effort in spreading our message. VICTORIA IS MISSING.

Any financial struggles resulting from this situation are our burden to bear. The opportunity costs incurred during our search are resulting from our choices in dealing with this situation. We are dealing with this as a family should - together.

If perchance, people are wanting to make any financial contributions to our cause, we are asking people to direct those funds to an organization such as Child Find, Missing Children, or the Oxford Community Police Services. We want to help others who may be in, or may end up in a situation like ours."

Oxford Community Police Services:
519-537-2323

Crime Stoppers:
519-421-TIPS (8477)

Information???
Please call 911

www.toricomehome.com

PLEASE help us find her!

[justbetweenus]

http://www.lfpress.ca/cgi-bin/publish.cgi?x=galleries&s=missing&p=2975&pg=89

Tons of pictures at this site.

Thank-you Lucky. A couple pics that interested me is the first one of James, with the mention of him telling the media to leave the property. I can't remember which media site I read he did this, but they said he stood near the door, and told them to leave. The picture clearly shows him sitting outside.

Another interesting photo is the one, of a police officer checking out a car at a townhouse on Young St. Standing by is a couple guys with a dog. Does anyone know how this townhouse on Young St. could be a place of interest? I'm thinking did they bring the dog there or did the dog bring them?

[ThoughtElf]

<respectfully snipped>

Overall we know very little and there are confusing/conflicting accounts of family connections on the mother's side. The person in the video and the composite sketch has not been identified even though Woodstock is a small town.

Tori should be found already and she is not. Maybe we should go back through the basics and list all the facts that we know, timeline what information was made available when - list each day and what we gleaned from each day - factual with no rumours. Sadly, I think the answer is staring us in the face and we can't see it. All this is MOO.

TurboDodger put some great effort into a facts & links thread here which the others have been adding to: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=83738

That would be a good spot to do a daily fact/timeline post. In fact, if you title each post with either 'fact' or 'timeline' it would be really easy to transfer posts to separate threads later if Tori gets her own forum.

[ThoughtElf]

Something that has been on my mind since last week. Did anyone else notice that Rodney stated that HE is the one working with KidFind (note - NOT Kid Finders!!). not Tara?

He stated this in Wednesday or Thursday's presser. He said he was doing the paperwork and having the communications with them.

I found that interesting.

[another nosey mom]

Thank-you Lucky. A couple pics that interested me is the first one of James, with the mention of him telling the media to leave the property. I can't remember which media site I read he did this, but they said he stood near the door, and told them to leave. The picture clearly shows him sitting outside.

Another interesting photo is the one, of a police officer checking out a car at a townhouse on Young St. Standing by is a couple guys with a dog. Does anyone know how this townhouse on Young St. could be a place of interest? I'm thinking did they bring the dog there or did the dog bring them?

I was just looking at those pictures too, I still wonder why you would be sitting in lawn chair outside of your home, drinking a tim's and telling the media to get off your property, when your gf's child is missing... obviously he is/was not comfortable with all of the attention

[justbetweenus]

Something that has been on my mind since last week. Did anyone else notice that Rodney stated that HE is the one working with KidFind (note - NOT Kid Finders!!). not Tara?

He stated this in Wednesday or Thursday's presser. He said he was doing the paperwork and having the communications with them.

I found that interesting.

Yea I think it's his sister working with them because he stated this finder group was in Alberta where she lives.

[LuckyPenny]

http://rodney-stafford.love.com/

Another interesting source / timeline

[LuckyPenny]

"Realistically, it is 3:23 in the afternoon on a week day," he said. "There are a lot of people out and about. I am hoping somebody in the community has seen her and maybe this composite will jog their memory. "

He declined to comment on the accuracy of the sketch, reliability of the witness's memory or when and where the witness saw the woman.

above both said by lead investigator OPP Det. Insp. Bill Renton

Source: http://www.winnipegsun.com/news/canada/2009/04/22/9202771.html

I caught this at the live press conference (heard it on the radio at the time it was done), check out the time 3:23. I know that the 'person of interest' was seen walking to the school that day in the video camera to pick up Tori, as well as walking away with Tori. Could the 3:23 time be the first time the 'person of interest' was caught on tape? Just something to think about!

[ThoughtElf]

Not sure if this has been posted, but here is good news about the trust fund for Tori and Daryn:
http://www.oxfordreview.com/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=1551370

A snippet from the article:

Allison Karl, a local tax manager, will act as a third person on the account.
Karl said she met Tori’s parents for the first time on Saturday.


As part of the arrangement McDonald, Karl and Tori’s father Rodney Stafford will have to be in agreement before a cheque can be cut from the account.


I do though find it odd that Tara seems to have stated in previous pressers that 'someone else handles the account.' If Allison only met them on Saturday, who was responsible for the funds up until then?


Things that make you go hmmmm....

[LuckyPenny]

I do though find it odd that Tara seems to have stated in previous pressers that 'someone else handles the account.' If Allison only met them on Saturday, who was responsible for the funds up until then?


Things that make you go hmmmm....


I think TM means that her 'friends' look after it ... ie. Puffer girl who looked after the 'charity bbq' - first fund raiser that they had

[ThoughtElf]

I think TM means that her 'friends' look after it ... ie. Puffer girl who looked after the 'charity bbq' - first fund raiser that they had

Gotcha. TY

[Beast]

Photoshop, and Photoimpact, are remarkable tools. And in the hands of a talented person can do just about anything. Given enough time and a good original to work with, I could put Adam Sandler next to Abe Lincoln and you'd swear it was authentic. Where did that photo from Brantford come from? Is there another like it in a news story somewhere?

[PepperFritz]

Photoshop, and Photoimpact, are remarkable tools. And in the hands of a talented person can do just about anything. Given enough time and a good original to work with, I could put Adam Sandler next to Abe Lincoln and you'd swear it was authentic. Where did that photo from Brantford come from? Is there another like it in a news story somewhere?

Go back and read the post in which the photo was first mentioned and posted. The poster said it was a photo capture from a video posted on a news site, and provided a link to the video.

[Peekaboo10]

I wonder if that hairstyle is popular in Woodstock? (severly pulled back).

Welcome to WS!!

:Welcome-12-june::leaf::newbie::canada: Not just in Woodstock, that hair style is very popular among teenagers everywhere :)

[justbetweenus]

This is the reply to the e-mail I sent requesting the meaning of the tattoo on Tara's right shoulder.

I did this tattoo on a couple as a representation of how "U" make us,they each have it the exact same size


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0703/justbetweenus/TaraTattoo.jpg

[doubletrouble]

Hi DT...I would imagine you had to wade through a bunch of my useless posts to catch up, and for that I apologize. It was just one of those evenings.:) Your post is interesting, and one I agree with, and would like to discuss further when I have more time. Just hope i don't forget.;)

omg...there are no useless posts...i am so appreciative for each and everyone of you who take the time to research, compare, study , analyze on tori..every little bit helps..it just takes one person with that hunch...i.e roy.k in caylee case or keith w. as well...to make a differance...i enjoy reading all the posts and at times have been gone 12 or so hours, im so impressed with all that has been uncovered.. please dont ever apoligize...no post is useless..imo:blowkiss:

[daisy.faithfull]

This is the reply to the e-mail I sent requesting the meaning of the tattoo on Tara's right shoulder.

I did this tattoo on a couple as a representation of how "U" make us,they each have it the exact same size


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0703/justbetweenus/TaraTattoo.jpg

Popping out of lurker mode... hmmmm, so I'm assuming that the other tattoo was done on Tori's dad. Do we know when the tat was done, because I'm wondering if the "U" was Tori and the "us" was Tara and Rodney.

If it were just on Tara, I would say that Tara was the U and her kids were the us... but that doesn't make sense if two people have to tats.

It is interesting, thanks for writing to the tat artist and getting the meaning behind it! Good sleuthing!:detective:

[daisy.faithfull]

Forgot to add, what do you all thing the "how the 'U' makes us" means?

[butterfly1978]

Photoshop, and Photoimpact, are remarkable tools. And in the hands of a talented person can do just about anything. Given enough time and a good original to work with, I could put Adam Sandler next to Abe Lincoln and you'd swear it was authentic. Where did that photo from Brantford come from? Is there another like it in a news story somewhere?


It comes from a website called crime searchers, and yes it was retrieved off of a news video. Here is a link to crime searchers blog in blue it will link you to the video.
http://crimesearchersonline.com/index.php?option=com_myblog&show=Who-Are-You-.html&Itemid=9

[elepher50]

The father of abducted Victoria (Tori) Stafford of Woodstock unleashed a blistering online message on the weekend to those responsible for her disappearance.



http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/News/Local/2009/05/04/9337806-sun.html

[doubletrouble]

Something new the FaceBooker's have found.

4 seconds into this video... http://watch.ctv.ca/news/latest/missing-ont-girl/#clip164457

you will find this woman compared in the image below. Although it looks like James Goris with her in the video, I have been told it is not him. Thoughts?

http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n64/paris_images/compare.jpg

has this one been forwarded to LE? anyone know...i imagine so, as i see it is on other sites as well....i hope im not just assuming it is tho..:rolleyes:

[doubletrouble]

http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/News/Local/2009/05/04/9337806-sun.html

wow...it has been over three weeks now..i imagine this has taken a toll on him...(dad-Rod)..i know his sister is back in Alberta...does he have any family here to support him? i heard the son Daryn..toris bro hasnt returned to school...is he staying with his dad.? anyone know?

[canadianwhitedove]

Hi I have been lurking here while sleuthing. I have tried to read all the post but there are so many and I get easily lost in my own home.:) So here is my first post.

I have not seen anything mention (but I might have missed it) about the changes in appearance of TM on April 9th to now. And I am not talking about hair colour or cuts. Her physical appearance has changed. On her first interview she and J (with hair) were on a couch. She is thin and sickly looking. Here is a link to the first pic of them. They both look like they are rabbits caught in headlights.

http://www.ctv.ca/mar/photo.html?pname=http://images.ctv.ca/archives/CTVNews/img2/20090409/450_mother_090409.jpg&win_width=595.0&description=Tara MacDonald, Victoria's mother, appeals for her daughter's safe return, from her home in Woodstock, Ont., on Thursday, April 9, 2009.

Here is a pick 12 days later and she look like she has gained some weight.
http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/News/Local/2009/04/20/ln.jpg

I am not sure if I am just seeing thing. I have a few more opinions but for now but I am keeping those to myself until I think they might be feasible so not to create rumours and speculations.

I am curious about others thoughts on this change in appearance? :fish:

[roseofsharon]

Good morning everyone ...

I am still watching the surveillance video over and over trying to pick up more details.

It looks like the jacket is being worn open and there is something long and dark down the front, possibly a scarf? Or is the photo so grainy and the darkness down the middle just a top to go with the black pants.

Or is it long dark hair? I still can't see ponytail, but I am still on the fence about black sling or purse strap. Hmm -- it's hard to decifer what that would be or just as someone mentioned, a shadow across the coat of something else. I can see on the enhanced video the elastized waist at the back of the coat.

Thanks for any clarification.

[elepher50]

Hi I have been lurking here while sleuthing. I have tried to read all the post but there are so many and I get easily lost in my own home.:) So here is my first post.

I have not seen anything mention (but I might have missed it) about the changes in appearance of TM on April 9th to now. And I am not talking about hair colour or cuts. Her physical appearance has changed. On her first interview she and J (with hair) were on a couch. She is thin and sickly looking. Here is a link to the first pic of them. They both look like they are rabbits caught in headlights.

http://www.ctv.ca/mar/photo.html?pname=http://images.ctv.ca/archives/CTVNews/img2/20090409/450_mother_090409.jpg&win_width=595.0&description=Tara MacDonald, Victoria's mother, appeals for her daughter's safe return, from her home in Woodstock, Ont., on Thursday, April 9, 2009.

Here is a pick 12 days later and she look like she has gained some weight.
http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/News/Local/2009/04/20/ln.jpg

I am not sure if I am just seeing thing. I have a few more opinions but for now but I am keeping those to myself until I think they might be feasible so not to create rumours and speculations.

I am curious about others thoughts on this change in appearance? :fish:

There has been a noticeable change in her appearance since Tori first went missing - not just in the hair and color of her hair but also in her physical properties. In the very first pix, she indeed looks gaunt whereas now she looks "well fed, more rounded in the face and looks like she has gained some weight". Perhaps she is now under the care of a doctor, attending clinics and generally leading a more healthy life style - all of this would contribute to a more healthy looking person if indeed this is what is happening. This of course would indicate that there was an unhealthly lifestyle prior to Tori going missing for this turn about in appearance since then. There is speculation, however, it has not been confirmed and specific rumours are being denied by TM. The change in appearance over the past month is visual by means of the videos and cannot be denied.

[doubletrouble]

[quote=doubletrouble;3692252]
also ..before the first day tori returned to school on the 8th...was that not the spring/easter holiday break? was she and her bro not out of school for awhile? if this was brought up before, i didnt see it..here in florida our spring /easter breaks are differant times than canadas..
quote]

In Ontario the easter holiday only includes Good Friday and Easter Monday. Good Friday was on April 10 this year...two days after the abduction.

ty for clearing that one up...i was under impression that they were on holiday (easter/spring) and moved during that time..and this was toris first day back at school from her new home location...now that im clearer....

[doubletrouble]

Good morning everyone ...

I am still watching the surveillance video over and over trying to pick up more details.

It looks like the jacket is being worn open and there is something long and dark down the front, possibly a scarf? Or is the photo so grainy and the darkness down the middle just a top to go with the black pants.

Or is it long dark hair? I still can't see ponytail, but I am still on the fence about black sling or purse strap. Hmm -- it's hard to decifer what that would be or just as someone mentioned, a shadow across the coat of something else. I can see on the enhanced video the elastized waist at the back of the coat.

Thanks for any clarification.

someone, somewhere, stated that t.m was first interviewed before the surviellance tape came out..and she was wearing the white jacket..the police are now in possession of this jacket...does anyone have a confirmed link to this interview-pic...or is this just a rumor?:bang: trying to clear up some things here..before posting on turbo's confirmed links board..tyia

[kaas]

Just for interest :
http://www.camh.net/Care_Treatment/Resources_clients_families_friends/Methadone_Maintenance_Treatment/mmt_clienthndbk_myths.html

"Not everyone gains weight when they go on methadone, but some do. This is usually because methadone improves your health and appetite, and so you eat more. If you’ve been using drugs for a long time, you may be underweight and need to gain a few pounds.

Even though the methadone drink is not “fattening” like sweets and fatty foods, methadone can slow your metabolism and cause water retention, which can lead to weight gain. "

[kaas]

someone, somewhere, stated that t.m was first interviewed before the surviellance tape came out..and she was wearing the white jacket..the police are now in possession of this jacket...does anyone have a confirmed link to this interview-pic...or is this just a rumor?:bang: trying to clear up some things here..before posting on turbo's confirmed links board..tyia


From here: http://www.nationalpost.com/related/links/story.html?id=1508626
"Ms. McDonald-- who told Global News police have taken her white jacket -- said she thought it would have been better if the provincial force had been involved sooner."

[Mazama]

Good morning,

I was away for the weekend, anything new or interesting happen?

[Doodlelover]

Hi I have been lurking here while sleuthing. I have tried to read all the post but there are so many and I get easily lost in my own home.:) So here is my first post.

I have not seen anything mention (but I might have missed it) about the changes in appearance of TM on April 9th to now. And I am not talking about hair colour or cuts. Her physical appearance has changed. On her first interview she and J (with hair) were on a couch. She is thin and sickly looking. Here is a link to the first pic of them. They both look like they are rabbits caught in headlights.

http://www.ctv.ca/mar/photo.html?pname=http://images.ctv.ca/archives/CTVNews/img2/20090409/450_mother_090409.jpg&win_width=595.0&description=Tara MacDonald, Victoria's mother, appeals for her daughter's safe return, from her home in Woodstock, Ont., on Thursday, April 9, 2009.

Here is a pick 12 days later and she look like she has gained some weight.
http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/News/Local/2009/04/20/ln.jpg

I am not sure if I am just seeing thing. I have a few more opinions but for now but I am keeping those to myself until I think they might be feasible so not to create rumours and speculations.

I am curious about others thoughts on this change in appearance? :fish:


Funny you should mention this. I was just thinking this yesterday. She looked horrible the first days. I really thought she looked like a distraught grieving mother but as the days go by, she's looking better and better. She looks healthy and she used to look gaunt and had bags under her eyes. Now she looks like she's eating and sleeping. It's usually the opposite in these cases.

IMO she is off the hard drugs and on the methadone program. That would do it. If that is true, it's sad that it took her little girl being abducted for her to get straight. Too bad she didn't do it before FOR her kids.

Also Welcome to WS and feel free to post your questions and ideas. That's what we are all doing, sharing ideas and info so that maybe we can find a way to bring Tori home.

[elepher50]

Good morning,

I was away for the weekend, anything new or interesting happen?

Not a thing - bike rally on the weekend did not produce Tori like everyone hoped it would. We spent the weekend chasing physics around with their clues. Tori is still not home where she should be. I so wish there was more information forthcoming and better yet, that Tori would be found.

[kaas]

Not sure if this has been posted, but here is good news about the trust fund for Tori and Daryn:
http://www.oxfordreview.com/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=1551370

A snippet from the article:

Allison Karl, a local tax manager, will act as a third person on the account.
Karl said she met Tori’s parents for the first time on Saturday.


As part of the arrangement McDonald, Karl and Tori’s father Rodney Stafford will have to be in agreement before a cheque can be cut from the account.


I do though find it odd that Tara seems to have stated in previous pressers that 'someone else handles the account.' If Allison only met them on Saturday, who was responsible for the funds up until then?


Things that make you go hmmmm....

I do hope that this volunteer is up for the full implications of managing the children's trust fund. With a tax managment background she should be able to provide the paperwork in order to saitsfy Rev Canada regarding protecting the income and interest from being taxed or considered as income for the parents. There will be considerable amount of time etc. put in to ensuring that the funds are used explicitly for the children.

[concentric]

[QUOTE=roseofsharon;3694673
I am still on the fence about black sling or purse strap. Hmm -- it's hard to decifer what that would be or just as someone mentioned, a shadow across the coat of something else. I can see on the enhanced video the elastized waist at the back of the coat.

Thanks for any clarification.[/QUOTE]

I just watched that very blurry, zoomed video. It is difficult to tell what that dark stripe is, across the back of the coat. I think the video will have to be divided into still frames and it will have to be determined what is, or is not casting shadows (I agree). Zoomed in, I see absolutely no strap diagonally across the back. Then, at the end it appears there is a strap encircling the shoulder that once again, could be a shadow.

Do you agree that the woman (?) has her hand in her jacket pocket most of the time? Wondering.

[kaas]

I do agree, the woman keeps her left hand tucked in her pocket and her left arm is immobile, in contrast to the wide swing of the right arm. This combined with the slightly smaller left eye and bent knee gait leads me to suspect perhaps a physical disability.

[Patience]

the pictures do look alike, this was in Brantford...I wonder if it was a family member?

I wonder if she could be Randi Millen-Rodney's sister?

[concentric]

I do agree, the woman keeps her left hand tucked in her pocket and her left arm is immobile, in contrast to the wide swing of the right arm. This combined with the slightly smaller left eye and bent knee gait leads me to suspect perhaps a physical disability.

Sometimes I think that she is holding Tori's hand with her right arm and swinging it exaggerately, as one would do when skipping, the child believing that something fun was in store for her. (I don't really know how else to describe it.) Otherwise, that is a mighty wide swing of the right arm relative to a pocketed left hand on the left arm.

Her pocketed left hand could either be concealing a deformity (?) or a weapon, IMO.

[Justice07]

I wonder if she could be Randi Millen-Rodney's sister?

Hi there! I am new here ~ I stumbled upon your website and have to say that I am glad that I did! It is like a breath of fresh air after reading posts on the FB group!

As for the still photo of the girl at the Brantford vigil for Tori, this is not Rodney's sister Randi. Someone asked the family on FB last night if they recognized the girl being compared to the sketch and they said that they did not recognize her.

[ThoughtElf]

I do hope that this volunteer is up for the full implications of managing the children's trust fund. With a tax managment background she should be able to provide the paperwork in order to saitsfy Rev Canada regarding protecting the income and interest from being taxed or considered as income for the parents. There will be considerable amount of time etc. put in to ensuring that the funds are used explicitly for the children.

Agree. Managing any sort of trust is a large responsibility under any circumstances, but she will be under especially close scrutiny managing this one.

I did try to find out a bit about her professional skills, but all I turned up was that she is active in the local Lions Club.

[ThoughtElf]

Hi I have been lurking here while sleuthing. I have tried to read all the post but there are so many and I get easily lost in my own home.:) So here is my first post.

I have not seen anything mention (but I might have missed it) about the changes in appearance of TM on April 9th to now. And I am not talking about hair colour or cuts. Her physical appearance has changed. On her first interview she and J (with hair) were on a couch. She is thin and sickly looking. Here is a link to the first pic of them. They both look like they are rabbits caught in headlights.

http://www.ctv.ca/mar/photo.html?pname=http://images.ctv.ca/archives/CTVNews/img2/20090409/450_mother_090409.jpg&win_width=595.0&description=Tara MacDonald, Victoria's mother, appeals for her daughter's safe return, from her home in Woodstock, Ont., on Thursday, April 9, 2009.

Here is a pick 12 days later and she look like she has gained some weight.
http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/News/Local/2009/04/20/ln.jpg

I am not sure if I am just seeing thing. I have a few more opinions but for now but I am keeping those to myself until I think they might be feasible so not to create rumours and speculations.

I am curious about others thoughts on this change in appearance? :fish:

Welcome. Great first post.

Excellent observation.

[another nosey mom]

Sometimes I think that she is holding Tori's hand with her right arm and swinging it exaggerately, as one would do when skipping, the child believing that something fun was in store for her. (I don't really know how else to describe it.) Otherwise, that is a mighty wide swing of the right arm relative to a pocketed left hand on the left arm.

Her pocketed left hand could either be concealing a deformity (?) or a weapon, IMO.

to me it looks like she is holding her left arm close so that whatever it is on her shoulder, doesn't fall down... I still think it looks like a yoga mat, which would have a strap going on the left shoulder and then the mat would go across your back.

[kaas]

Agree. Managing any sort of trust is a large responsibility under any circumstances, but she will be under especially close scrutiny managing this one.

I did try to find out a bit about her professional skills, but all I turned up was that she is active in the local Lions Club.


This woman has made a considerably generous offer in my opinion and I do hope she is well aware of what she may be taking on. A tax manager is not necessarily an accountant, as in HR Block.

[kaas]

A live stream of today's media release is scheduled for 1:00 today
http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/News/Local/2009/05/04/9343141.html

[elepher50]

A live stream of today's media release is scheduled for 1:00 today
http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/News/Local/2009/05/04/9343141.html

I got the impression they were going to stop the daily pressers. Do you know when J Goris goes back to court?

[another nosey mom]

I got the impression they were going to stop the daily pressers. Do you know when J Goris goes back to court?

I thought it was Apr28 but I didn't hear or see anything??

[ThoughtElf]

Due to technical difficulties we will not be able to live stream the 1 p.m. press conference from the home of Tara McDonald.

http://www.woodstocksentinelreview.com/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=1552405

ETA: LFP says they will post the recorded version later today.

[elepher50]

Technical difficulties on the Live press conference - they will stream it later.

[Flowercb]

They are having the same technical difficulties they had Friday. Check back later for written copy.

[crazyladi]

There has been a noticeable change in her appearance since Tori first went missing - not just in the hair and color of her hair but also in her physical properties. In the very first pix, she indeed looks gaunt whereas now she looks "well fed, more rounded in the face and looks like she has gained some weight". Perhaps she is now under the care of a doctor, attending clinics and generally leading a more healthy life style - all of this would contribute to a more healthy looking person if indeed this is what is happening. This of course would indicate that there was an unhealthly lifestyle prior to Tori going missing for this turn about in appearance since then. There is speculation, however, it has not been confirmed and specific rumours are being denied by TM. The change in appearance over the past month is visual by means of the videos and cannot be denied.

If she is indeed going to a methidone clinic, methdone makes you gain alot of weight. My aunt is a hugh pill popper, pretty much anything she can find. To get off those her doctor sent her to a methidone clinic where she gained weight at a rapid rate. Very noticable right away. it doesnt take long to gain it. But with any drug everybody's bodies are different

[another nosey mom]

more technical difficulties therefore no live "Tara Show", will have tape later for viewing

[doubletrouble]

well i was here...not even time to catch up on posts..but was ready for 1pm presser...tech diff..hhmm...i did rewatch friday presser....i noticed at the end of the presser that the dad made a plea directly to tori that we are coming for you...hang in there...and at that tar turned around and walked back inside the house...she did not agree, or act the least bit interested in his heart felt plea to tori..that may be just my opinion..ill have to read back and see if any of you noted that already

[doubletrouble]

adding link to fridays presser if it works..if not go to lfp clink on demand and go to may 1st http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/News/Local/2009/05/04/9343141.html

[doubletrouble]

is lfp the only media that does the live pressers? there are about six diff mics or so up there...any other stations that carry it live? anyone know?

[doubletrouble]

update i just found on the bike rally woodstock sentinel review.. something to read if you missed this as i did..
http://www.woodstocksentinelreview.com/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=1552226&auth=Heather%20Rivers,%20STAFF%20WRITER

[ThoughtElf]

is lfp the only media that does the live pressers? there are about six diff mics or so up there...any other stations that carry it live? anyone know?

I've checked Global & CityTV but haven't found the presser videos live on either news site.

[PepperFritz]

someone, somewhere, stated that t.m was first interviewed before the surviellance tape came out..and she was wearing the white jacket..the police are now in possession of this jacket...does anyone have a confirmed link to this interview-pic...or is this just a rumor?:bang: trying to clear up some things here..before posting on turbo's confirmed links board..tyia

I posted that my contact (someone whose brother is a police officer in Woodstock) said that Tara has a jacket like the one in the surveillance and that it is now in the possession of the police. I have no knowledge of any interview/picture of her wearing the jacket.

I consider my source to be extremely reliable, but I don't think it would qualify as a "confirmed fact".

[another nosey mom]

I posted that my contact (someone whose brother is a police officer in Woodstock) said that Tori has a jacket like the one in the surveillance and that it is now in the possession of the police. I have no knowledge of any interview/picture of her wearing the jacket.

I consider my source to be extremely reliable, but I don't think it would qualify as a "confirmed fact".

you mean Tara???

[Flowercb]

I posted that my contact (someone whose brother is a police officer in Woodstock) said that Tori has a jacket like the one in the surveillance and that it is now in the possession of the police. I have no knowledge of any interview/picture of her wearing the jacket.

I consider my source to be extremely reliable, but I don't think it would qualify as a "confirmed fact".


You mentioned Tori has a jacket.....did you mean mom T.

[another nosey mom]

http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/News/Local/2009/05/04/9345966.html


NOTES FROM PRESS CONF TODAY, video to follow later

[another nosey mom]

According to the news - the parents of Tori have been given a list of possible suspects in the disappearance...
father knows of some of the names, mother doesn't recognize any

[Flowercb]

Police are expected to give an update today. I wonder when?

[Mazama]

It also says,

Police were expected to release an update today on the investigation.

Wonder if it will be live?

[Flowercb]

Wouldn't you love to see the list! I hope they are closing in to the person(s) responsible.

[Mazama]

Wouldn't you love to see the list! I hope they are closing in to the person(s) responsible.


I agree

[Dee10]

According to the news - the parents of Tori have been given a list of possible suspects in the disappearance...
father knows of some of the names, mother doesn't recognize any

I wonder if there is a connection between the suspects? This sounds like very positive news and perhaps the case in breaking, I hope.

[another nosey mom]

Wouldn't you love to see the list! I hope they are closing in to the person(s) responsible.

You just know the 'list' is going to get out, is that how they always do it?? Give a list to the parents of possibles??? I find that kind of weird, unless they have info on these people that lead them to believe they may be responsible??

[Flowercb]

I agree this is weird. I have never heard of this before. Has anyone else?

[Lexiintoronto]

According to the news - the parents of Tori have been given a list of possible suspects in the disappearance...
father knows of some of the names, mother doesn't recognize any Is this standard police work to hand over a list of suspects to the victims? Aren't they worried about retaliation, especially if some or all of them are innocent?

And we all know that the list will be leaked - is that what LE wanted? They want the names to be out there without having to go the extra step of naming suspects?

And when the list appears in the media, LE will likely say 'no comment'.

If LE simply wanted to let the suspects know that they're being investigated, they could just make a housecall - why do it this way?

[Lexiintoronto]

I agree this is weird. I have never heard of this before. Has anyone else?
No!!! This is odd.

Remember the Holly Jones abduction and murder? LE short-listed a few suspects (some of whom simply refused a DNA test). The killer was on that list. I remember them saying that they had suspects, but they declined further comment.

[Lexiintoronto]

Police to release further photos and video related to Tori's disappearance:

http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/News/Local/2009/05/04/9345966.html

[QB.]

Is this new video to be released? It sounds like it.

Just re-reading the article and the title says it is new. So it would appear you guys were right about the other video.

[ThoughtElf]

http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/News/Local/2009/05/04/9345966.html


NOTES FROM PRESS CONF TODAY, video to follow later

From the article:

Police investigating the disappearance of an eight-year-old girl nearly a month ago have now released a video and still photographs from a surveillance system, showing a vehicle whose driver may have witnessed the little girl's abduction.

At least we now know of another potential eye witness who may provide further details beyond what could be seen in grainy surveillance video. Let's watch for a link to these.

[another nosey mom]

clipped from Lfpress

Police investigating the disappearance of an eight-year-old girl nearly a month ago have now released a video and still photographs from a surveillance system, showing a vehicle whose driver may have witnessed the little girl's abduction.

[another nosey mom]

I think we are all looking at the same things at the same times, lol - sorry for repeat postings.

[ThoughtElf]

Perhaps LE will be naming them as 'persons of interest' which is a step short of calling them suspects.

During Caylee's case we learned that in the US, use of the term 'suspect' has been pretty much dropped until a person is charged as 'suspect' is clearly defined by the US Justice Department. The term 'person of interest' is now more often used by LE until such time as person/s are arrested & charged.

I have some stuff to do, but if I can find the posts from long ago on the Caylee forum that explain this then I'll post them here later. Basically, they may have released a list of 'persons of interest' and can side-step the suspect tag from a legal standpoint.

[QB.]

http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/News/Local/2009/05/04/9345966.html

Its a photo of a car

[Flowercb]

No!!! This is odd.

Remember the Holly Jones abduction and murder? LE short-listed a few suspects (some of whom simply refused a DNA test). The killer was on that list. I remember them saying that they had suspects, but they declined further comment.


I wonder if they now have DNA evidence of some kind that they can use to test this list of people. Having DNA isn't usually a good thing, unless they found the "famous" white jacket" or other object they think could belong to the abductor.

[Amster]

If the person driving the car saw something, why haven't they come forward?

[Flowercb]

This isn't the green van that we saw in the initial video is it? I think this is a car. Didn't someone say that the police were on the roof of the school looking at all the angles of the surveillance camera the other day. Is it me or is it taking them a long time to find information that they had from day one?

[doubletrouble]

ty to lexiintoronto for giving me the heads up that something is breaking..no presser yet? it looks like a green/teal minivan..it does appear to be the same one that we saw passing by on the original abduction video...okay was it going the other way? or was it darker? or is it because this is now a differant camera and angle...it does appear to be a mini van..like a ford windstar..like late 98 99 series? where they started to look more areo dynamic? jmo what do you all think?

[ThoughtElf]

Without some sort of height reference to compare to it is hard to tell from the perspective of the picture if this is a car similar to a honda civic or more like a van or small SUV.

There appears to be a sign about 5-10 feet behind the vehicle and that leads me to guess that this vehicle is lower in height profile than a van or SUV.

Thoughts?

[doubletrouble]

can someone more puter savvy post the pic on this thread...i cant seem to find it anymore..there was someone in here who did a great sleuthing anaylisis on measurements of tori and the abductor and came up with the height of the suspect? where or where are u fellow sleuther..i cant remember who this was...gosh too much going on at once? lol

[another nosey mom]

Without some sort of height reference to compare to it is hard to tell from the perspective of the picture if this is a car similar to a honda civic or more like a van or small SUV.

There appears to be a sign about 5-10 feet behind the vehicle and that leads me to guess that this vehicle is lower in height profile than a van or SUV.

Thoughts?

imo it looks like a small station wagon (vw or something??)

[doubletrouble]

going to try to add pic..first try http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/News/Local/2009/05/04/9345966.html

[doubletrouble]

the sign almost appears to be a shadow of a sign...could it? boy this is tough..gonna pull out hubbys reading glasses

[justbetweenus]

going to try to add pic..first try http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/News/Local/2009/05/04/9345966.html

I'm thinking mini van by the square looking back end.

[doubletrouble]

okay potatohead(sp) it appears that my teen is in agreement with u..he thinks he appears to be a honda civic...something small like a 3 cyl?

[butterfly1978]

We have a sketch and a vehical belonging to a person who in 3 weeks has not come forward...
Why are there no arrests, why is this baby not found yet?

WHERE IS TORI?????

[ThoughtElf]

here you go

http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/News/Local/2009/05/04/VOI_3.jpg

[doubletrouble]

we need a local...kaas? paris? there are more..but not coming to mind at moment..sorry...anyone know how high the nursing home stone is before it becomes window..approx? that would be a great determining factor..sure police already know by now... im leaning towards minivan now cuz of the sign (shadow) height there and the large window size...and it appears to be longer length wise as well

[ThoughtElf]

OK, we're assuming that the driver hasn't come forward simply from the wording the LFP used in the article. We won't know that for sure until it is stated by LE. We don't know that they haven't come forward.

I'm also going to go cook dinner and stop stretching my brain re: the vehicle as I imagine the LE press release will have more details as to type of vehicle. :wink:

[CarrieBean]

From the first video
http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/7488/torivan.jpg

[Patience]

http://www.thestar.com/News/Ontario/article/628791

[another nosey mom]

If police gave you a list of potential suspects, would you not be trying to track down these people yourself... I just kind of find this very strange, maybe they are trying to see what reactions they get from the parents?

[Patience]

http://www.cp24.com/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20090504/090504_stafford/20090504/?hub=CP24Home

[CarrieBean]

If police gave you a list of potential suspects, would you not be trying to track down these people yourself... I just kind of find this very strange, maybe they are trying to see what reactions they get from the parents?
I know I would, but maybe they're holding back and letting LE do their job. After a month I think I'd be knocking down everyone's door.

[gogrannypop]

I just looked up the hand rail height requirements for Canada. They are between 34" (800mm) and 38"(965mm).

I'm thinking station wagon.

[justbetweenus]

If police gave you a list of potential suspects, would you not be trying to track down these people yourself... I just kind of find this very strange, maybe they are trying to see what reactions they get from the parents?

I'm thinking they are going through the many suggestions/tips called in from the public concerning who the composite sketch might be, and by asking the parents if any names that were given are familiar to them may narrow it down further.

ETA: I think they are trying to work with the parents, not trap them.

[MIMOMMY]

Just my opinion - looks like the same car as above from first video --- Anddddddddd, I dont think its a mini-van, Fortunately Im a "soccer mom", and that vehicle is much "shorter" than mine. It looks much more "station wagonish"........

[justbetweenus]

I just looked up the hand rail height requirements for Canada. They are between 34" (800mm) and 38"(965mm).

I'm thinking station wagon.

Yea station wagon.

[justbetweenus]

I know I would, but maybe they're holding back and letting LE do their job. After a month I think I'd be knocking down everyone's door.

and looking under garbage cans in desperation.

[PepperFritz]

you mean Tara???

Yes, sorry, I meant Tara. I went back and edited my post.

[doubletrouble]

sorry if already posted just confirmed...station wagon..at first said small to med...here it is i hope..Oxford police have release new photos of a car in the search for missing eight-year-old Tori Stafford.

The pictures captured on surveillance video show a vehicle whose driver may have witnessed the little girl's abduction.

The car is described as a small to mid-sized dark coloured station wagon. It was driving northbound on Fyfe Avenue in Woodstock after Stafford was seen with the unidentified woman.

Police believe the driver may have witnessed the incident and would like to speak with this person.

Victoria Stafford, also known as Tori, was last seen on April 8 leaving her school with an unidentified woman.

Investigators say the surveillance video shows the little girl and her abductor were last seen walking across Fyfe Avenue and crossing into the parking lot of a nursing and retirement home.

[Turbododger]

http://www.cp24.com/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20090504/090504_stafford/20090504/?hub=CP24Home

The car is described as a small to mid-sized dark coloured station wagon. It was driving northbound on Fyfe Avenue in Woodstock after Stafford was seen with the unidentified woman.

Police believe the driver may have witnessed the incident and would like to speak with this person.

Investigators say the surveillance video shows the little girl and her abductor were last seen walking across Fyfe Avenue and crossing into the parking lot of a nursing and retirement home.

Regarding earlier questions, here are your answers.

My 2 cents are that it is a Ford Focus Hatchback.

[justbetweenus]

The police took Tara's computer.

[Flowercb]

Can anyone do a side by side of the vehicle in the first video and this one. The one driving by in the first video looks longer than this one.

I wonder if it is a possibility that this is the car that they suspect Tori was taken away with? I wonder if they might even have the license plate number and if the person doesn't come forward they will go after them?

[doubletrouble]

wasnt it said that the mother was visiting her father in the nursing home around three ish? than i read somewhere (fb?) he died not long ago...ok i need a break..or need to head over to the confirmed links thread cuz if im not already all jumbled up..ill pull you all in too..i may be getting too much info from too many sources....

[Turbododger]

4 Second Video on the Car:

http://www.citynews.ca/news/news_34283.aspx

[kaas]

The vehicle in the first video appears to be more like a minivan. My guess is a montana svs or uplander because of the square back end.

I had posted early on regarding my theory that perhaps the abductor was dressed as a PCA/PSW, (longish dark shirt and matching dark pants) which would give her more of a credible appearance to Tori and also allow for her to park in the Nursing home parking lot without notice.

[PepperFritz]

Investigators say the surveillance video shows the little girl and her abductor were last seen walking across Fyfe Avenue and crossing into the parking lot of a nursing and retirement home.

Tori's great-grandfather is a resident in that nursing home (Caressant Care). Dunno which side of the family he belongs to, but he would either be Tara's or Rodney's grandfather (not father).

I know this for an absolute fact. My cousin and housemate works at Caressant Care.

[justbetweenus]

4 Second Video on the Car:

http://www.citynews.ca/news/news_34283.aspx

I have a lot of sunlight glare coming in my window but I think it looks like the same vehicle in the first video, or very close.

[QB.]

The police took Tara's computer.

Is there a link for this info?

[justbetweenus]

Is there a link for this info?

She put it on her FB status. She has no problem with it, just wants her baby back.

[PepperFritz]

I had posted early on regarding my theory that perhaps the abductor was dressed as a PCA/PSW, (longish dark shirt and matching dark pants) which would give her more of a credible appearance to Tori and also allow for her to park in the Nursing home parking lot without notice.

There are specific staff and patients who tend to sit out on the "porch" area at the door of Caressant Care facing the parking lot (where there are chairs for that purpose). The police should be talking to them. They would notice anything/anyone "different"....

[doubletrouble]

Tori's great-grandfather is a resident in that nursing home (Caressant Care). Dunno which side of the family he belongs to, but he would either be Tara's or Rodney's grandfather (not father).

I know this for an absolute fact. My cousin and housemate works at Caressant Care.

have the police not questioned the people or at the very least the employees at the nursing home? at least those who worked the 7-3 and the 3-11 shift? it seems to have occured around thier shift change? esp those who worked on the day tori was taken...did they question your cousin for suspicious activity? did she work on that day? just sleuthing along here...perhaps already been asked and answered..if so sorry..think thinkin out loud

[girlfriday]

She put it on her FB status. She has no problem with it, just wants her baby back.

Do you know anything about her having had a dog go missing recently too (it's been reported that someone wrote that in FB on her behalf)? I don't have access to her FB to confirm.

BTW - I'm newish here (been lurking till now). TIA

[QB.]

She put it on her FB status. She has no problem with it, just wants her baby back.

I wonder if that happened very recently - any indication?

[kaas]

Tori's great-grandfather is a resident in that nursing home (Caressant Care). Dunno which side of the family he belongs to, but he would either be Tara's or Rodney's grandfather (not father).

I know this for an absolute fact. My cousin and housemate works at Caressant Care.

So it is possible that the abductor parked in the nursing home parking lot, met with Tori on the sidewalk, told Tori that her mom (Tara) was in visiting her greatgrandfather and wanted her to come quickly inside. Once they reached the parking area she could have been scooped in to a vehicle.

[justbetweenus]

Do you know anything about her having had a dog go missing recently too (it's been reported that someone wrote that in FB on her behalf)? I don't have access to her FB to confirm.

BTW - I'm newish here (been lurking till now). TIA

Hi girlfriday, welcome to ws.

No I never seen any message concerning a missing dog.

[Dee10]

Here's a link to the OPP site with 3 pictures of the vehicle http://micro.newswire.ca/release.cgi?rkey=1705048267&view=11636-2&Start=0

[elepher50]

update i just found on the bike rally woodstock sentinel review.. something to read if you missed this as i did..
http://www.woodstocksentinelreview.com/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=1552226&auth=Heather%20Rivers,%20STAFF%20WRITER

Thanks, just catching up after the work day. This sentence was interesting "I'm really proud of the motorcycle community and of Woodstock," she said. "It's amazing what the motorcycle community will do for one of its own."



As taken from the article you pointed out in the link above.

[PepperFritz]

have the police not questioned the people or at the very least the employees at the nursing home? at least those who worked the 7-3 and the 3-11 shift? it seems to have occured around thier shift change? esp those who worked on the day tori was taken...did they question your cousin for suspicious activity? did she work on that day? just sleuthing along here...perhaps already been asked and answered..if so sorry..think thinkin out loud

I know that EVERYONE at Caressant Care was questioned extensively at the time; I meant that in view of the new video/car, they should be re-questioned. My cousin was never questioned, as she works the Night shift (11pm-7am) and was not there at the relevant time period.

[justbetweenus]

I wonder if that happened very recently - any indication?

I would say very recently.

[kaas]

This may be a little out there but I noticed that the other parent and child that Tori and her abductor passed were not in this video, nor were there any other walkers. The camera is noted as west smoking but there is no time stamp visible.
Is it possible that this car or one similar was seen by witnesses as parked in the nursing home parking lot (and either out of place or Tori witnessed getting in to it) and it has taken the police some time to go over the days's videos to try to locate it? Therefore this vehicle is seen on video prior to the abduction?

[another nosey mom]

http://www.woodstocksentinelreview.com/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=1552657

video I believe from today

[justbetweenus]

Here's a link to the OPP site with 3 pictures of the vehicle http://micro.newswire.ca/release.cgi?rkey=1705048267&view=11636-2&Start=0


Thanks Dee....gogrannypop was right about it being a station wagon.

[PepperFritz]

So it is possible that the abductor parked in the nursing home parking lot, met with Tori on the sidewalk, told Tori that her mom (Tara) was in visiting her greatgrandfather and wanted her to come quickly inside. Once they reached the parking area she could have been scooped in to a vehicle.

Yes, quite plausible. In which case this would not have been a random snatching. Whoever it was knew that Tori's great-grandfather is a resident there, and that Tori visits him there on a regular basis. But Tori was never seen in the nursing home that day, so she obviously never made it inside.

There are actually TWO separate parking lots at Caressant Care. The first one (where the porch and chairs are) would have too many people around for the person to just openly "grab" Tori and put her in a car. But that lot leads to a more remote one at the back of the building, where there would be no one around to notice.

But even so, if Tori became "alarmed" in any way, I'm sure she wouldn't have "gone quietly". Which suggests to me that her mother or someone else she knew and trusted would have been waiting for her in the car....

[another nosey mom]

http://www.woodstocksentinelreview.com/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=1552506

police comment on video of green car


imo it's a saturn station wagon

[justbetweenus]

http://www.cp24.com/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20090504/090504_stafford/20090504/?hub=CP24Home

The car is described as a small to mid-sized dark coloured station wagon. It was driving northbound on Fyfe Avenue in Woodstock after Stafford was seen with the unidentified woman.

Police believe the driver may have witnessed the incident and would like to speak with this person.

Investigators say the surveillance video shows the little girl and her abductor were last seen walking across Fyfe Avenue and crossing into the parking lot of a nursing and retirement home.

Regarding earlier questions, here are your answers.

My 2 cents are that it is a Ford Focus Hatchback.

WOW I never did believe they went down Walter St. Thanks Turbo.

[another nosey mom]

WOW I never did believe they went down Walter St. Thanks Turbo.

IMO sounds like the are starting to put things together, and are just looking for a few loose ends to wind things up??? hopefully????

[just_curious]

The police took Tara's computer.

Is this confirmed in some news story somewhere?

[another nosey mom]

http:// calgary.kijiji.ca/c-cars-vehicles-cars-Saturn...


I googled the make/year and came up with this image


http://calgary.kijiji.ca/c-ViewAdLargeImage?AdId=114033925&img=http%3A%2F%2Fimg1.classistatic.com%2Fcps%2Fl%2 Fkj%2F09%2F3%2F16%2F408%2Fr6%2F5847ejk_18.jpeg

[justbetweenus]

Is this confirmed in some news story somewhere?

Sorry no, not that i know of yet. She posted it on her FB status.

[elepher50]

Hi Sleuthers, We have new important information:

This vehicle is probably a Ford Windstar Wagon - side by side comparison to follow shortly.

ETA: I have been wrong many a time before though.

[justbetweenus]

http:// calgary.kijiji.ca/c-cars-vehicles-cars-Saturn...


I googled the make/year and came up with this image


http://calgary.kijiji.ca/c-ViewAdLargeImage?AdId=114033925&img=http%3A%2F%2Fimg1.classistatic.com%2Fcps%2Fl%2 Fkj%2F09%2F3%2F16%2F408%2Fr6%2F5847ejk_18.jpeg


Good work ANM!

[Dee10]

Is this confirmed in some news story somewhere?


Not that I could find. This is a copy of supposedly what Tara's FB status says (note her friends have not denied this) on the other FB group.

Tara's status:

Tara McDonald
Hey eeryone, I'm going to be without a computer for a while until I get mine back from the police. To all of my friends, I LOVE YOU AND WE"RE GOING TO GET OUR BABY BACK...to all the idiots who have too much time on their hands....you don't phase me. I hope you all have big feet to put in YOUR HUGE MOUTHS!!!!!!!! The day will come where I will be waiting for your apologies.51 minutes ago

[Kat]

http:// calgary.kijiji.ca/c-cars-vehicles-cars-Saturn...


I googled the make/year and came up with this image


http://calgary.kijiji.ca/c-ViewAdLargeImage?AdId=114033925&img=http%3A%2F%2Fimg1.classistatic.com%2Fcps%2Fl%2 Fkj%2F09%2F3%2F16%2F408%2Fr6%2F5847ejk_18.jpeg

That fits another nosey mom. I was in the process of looking for a station wagon with a 262 centimeter wheel base (converted for Americans, that is around about 103 inch wheel base).

I got the 262 centimeter wheel base from the article that turbododger posted and was working on finding a few models when my internet went down and now it's back up.

[justbetweenus]

IMO sounds like the are starting to put things together, and are just looking for a few loose ends to wind things up??? hopefully????

I hope so too ANM. Pray pray pray!

[Lexiintoronto]

video of presser with the parents: http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/News/Local/2009/05/04/9345966.html

[justbetweenus]

Not that I could find. This is a copy of supposedly what Tara's FB status says (note her friends have not denied this) on the other FB group.

Tara's status:

Tara McDonald
Hey eeryone, I'm going to be without a computer for a while until I get mine back from the police. To all of my friends, I LOVE YOU AND WE"RE GOING TO GET OUR BABY BACK...to all the idiots who have too much time on their hands....you don't phase me. I hope you all have big feet to put in YOUR HUGE MOUTHS!!!!!!!! The day will come where I will be waiting for your apologies.51 minutes ago

Thanks Dee. I didn't want to copy word for word. You guys can trust me. I wouldn't post it, if it wasn't true.:)

[elepher50]

Here is a side by side comparison with Ford Windstar Wagon:

[Flowercb]

This may be a little out there but I noticed that the other parent and child that Tori and her abductor passed were not in this video, nor were there any other walkers. The camera is noted as west smoking but there is no time stamp visible.
Is it possible that this car or one similar was seen by witnesses as parked in the nursing home parking lot (and either out of place or Tori witnessed getting in to it) and it has taken the police some time to go over the days's videos to try to locate it? Therefore this vehicle is seen on video prior to the abduction?

Exactly what I thought. In the news link I believe (citytv) they say that it is not suspected to be the car that Tori got in. But who knows if this is true.

[Kat]

Here is a side by side comparison with Ford Windstar Wagon:

It's close elepher. The windstar has a 121 inch wheel base. The car in the video has about a 103 inch wheel base (262 centimeters).

[ChaChaCha]

Thanks Dee. I didn't want to copy word for word. You guys can trust me. I wouldn't post it, if it wasn't true.:)

"Phase me?" Right. Gosh somebody must have peed in her corn flakes this morning. Arrogant and ungrateful to those people who got off their rumps and went out there looking for her daughter notwithstanding what they may think of the woman. She has thumbed her nose at anyone who isn't fawning all over her.

I've said it before, I'll say it again. Even if TM was not the one who physically assisted in her daughter's abduction, her lifestyle and life choices are the reason that her daughter is now in danger just as surely as if she masterminded the whole thing herself.

I feel like just popping down there and giving her a piece of my mind and my shoe up her butt.

Grrrrr.....

[gitana1]

Here is a side by side comparison with Ford Windstar Wagon:

I don't think it's the same vehicle. The one from the surveillance video looks longer, more aerodynamic than the Windstar, JMO. But, it's hard to tell since many of these vehicles look so much alike!

[nursebeeme]

the rear window in the car is also a triangle... it looks like my WV wagon I drive... but more ford~ish moo..

What is this thing about Tara's computer being taken by LE? It is really on her fb status?

[gogrannypop]

I think it is a Pontiac station wagon. Trying to narrow it down.

[elepher50]

262 centimeter wheelbase would be 103.1 inches wheelbase ... good grief .... has anybody checked the wheelbases of any wagons? I think DTrouble started to - did you get anywhere?

[Kat]

The one that ANM posted fits the wheelbase. I'll look for others.

[Dee10]

The tape of the earlier press conferences today are available http://www.mogulus.com/lfpress under "On Demand".

[ThoughtElf]

Working on 262 cm wheel base

- Volvo 200 series

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/08/1990_volvo_240dl_wagon_2.jpg/250px-1990_volvo_240dl_wagon_2.jpg
- 5th generation Honda Civics

[ChaChaCha]

video of presser with the parents: http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/News/Local/2009/05/04/9345966.html


From the article:
Stafford also said he had Facebook take down a page implicating Tori's mother and his ex-wife, Tara McDonald.

My question: shouldn't the wording be "accusing" instead of "implicating". To my mind, (I have a legal background) "implicating" means a post that would give information/testimony/proof that she was involved. Now if the word was implying, then that would be a different scenario.

Hmmmm, is the Facebook Wall always referred to as a "page" - as in WebPage? I thought there was different terminology - I believe it is easy enough to delete comments off a Facebook Wall, but to remove a "page"???
Unless it was a link someone had posted on the wall to a webpage?

Your thoughts???

[Kat]

The Ford Escape XLT fits the Wheel base length and has the "trianglish" window that nurse was describing.

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/review-ford-escape-xlt-4wd/

[canadianwhitedove]

Just a quick thought but I remember someone saying on here that LE found prescription bottles in TM old place of residences with other peoples names on it. Could these be the names on the list and maybe these names were just a ploy for the investigators to see if they can catch someone in a lie.

[ThoughtElf]

2008 SUBARU IMPREZA 2.5i ET WRX (too round IMO)

http://images.nadaguides.com/j/10806.jpg

[ThoughtElf]

PT Cruiser, but I can't find out which year/s was on 262 wheelbase. It would be square enough at the back.

[tsalta]

Hi everyone:

The vehicle in the video looks to me, to be something similar to a 1991 Ford Taurus wagon. Although the Taurus wagon has a wheel base of 106 inches. Also the front of the car in the video looks to have some sort of insignia in the centre of the grill. Probably incorrect, but that is what I came up with via google.
Again just my opinion.

[doubletrouble]

Here is a side by side comparison with Ford Windstar Wagon:

my first prediction and i posted way up upon first seeing the car..was that it appears to be a ford windstar minivan gree/teal 1998-1999 as it had a more areo dynamic front...wow if this is what it turns out to be...im gonna turn into a full time sleuther..okay a little more practice needed im sure...but getting goosebumps if this is infact true..but didnt police confirm it to a station wagon?

[ThoughtElf]

http://%20calgary.kijiji.ca/c-cars-vehicles-cars-Saturn...


I googled the make/year and came up with this image


http://calgary.kijiji.ca/c-ViewAdLargeImage?AdId=114033925&img=http%3A%2F%2Fimg1.classistatic.com%2Fcps%2Fl%2 Fkj%2F09%2F3%2F16%2F408%2Fr6%2F5847ejk_18.jpeg


That looks like a good candidate.

[ThoughtElf]

Here is a side by side comparison with Ford Windstar Wagon:

Nice job. Definitely a strong possibility.

[Flowercb]

Guys a thought just crossed my mind. Even if the police don't have the license plate, they could look in their records of people licensed to that particular model, approx. year and colour of vehicle. They could have a "short" list.

[LuckyPenny]

I posted that my contact (someone whose brother is a police officer in Woodstock) said that Tara has a jacket like the one in the surveillance and that it is now in the possession of the police. I have no knowledge of any interview/picture of her wearing the jacket.

I consider my source to be extremely reliable, but I don't think it would qualify as a "confirmed fact".

Tara HERSELF said that they have her white coat actually in one of her "press releases"

[tsalta]

Really bugging me, Why would it take 4 weeks to post that video of the vehicle? Would that not have been one of the first things to have been noticed, that there was a car passing at the same time as this was going down. Some things just don't seem to make sense to me. Sorry just ranting here.

[paris_paris]

A little info. The Facebook "page" they talked about... a guy made a facebook group about "Convict Tara of Tori's Murder" or something along those lines. Rodney posted there telling the guy get rid of it. Other Facebooker's click on the report link at the bottom of the group and it got deleted.

Now about that car. Why in hell would they be looking for a witness in a car a month later?

Spec allowed here? Here's how I see it. They have video of Tori and her abductor walking into the parking lot of the nursing home. They aren't showing that video. Chances are they also have video of that same car leaving the parking lot.

Tara was at the nursing home visiting her grandfather at 3:00. The nursing home is between the school and home. Why the hell didn't she pick her kid up at school if she was right there?

And really, the abductor took Tori into the parking lot of a building that Tara just happened to be visiting?

The more I see, the more I'm convinced Tara has her hidden. Maybe for a very good reason. Maybe not.

Oh, and somebody was looking for me a couple of pages back, a local. I'm not a local. I live in Paris, more than an hour away.

[elepher50]

Here are the 3 pix released by the police in one pix:

Just so it may be easier than keep going back to the polcie photos. Photos as taken from:

http://micro.newswire.ca/release.cgi?rkey=1705048267&view=11636-2&Start=0

ETA: I see a tiangular window in the back - just as Nurse and others are saying .. hmmmm

[CarrieBean]

Yes, quite plausible. In which case this would not have been a random snatching. Whoever it was knew that Tori's great-grandfather is a resident there, and that Tori visits him there on a regular basis. But Tori was never seen in the nursing home that day, so she obviously never made it inside.

There are actually TWO separate parking lots at Caressant Care. The first one (where the porch and chairs are) would have too many people around for the person to just openly "grab" Tori and put her in a car. But that lot leads to a more remote one at the back of the building, where there would be no one around to notice.

But even so, if Tori became "alarmed" in any way, I'm sure she wouldn't have "gone quietly". Which suggests to me that her mother or someone else she knew and trusted would have been waiting for her in the car....
I wonder if Tara visited the great grandfather that day.

[kaas]

The vehicle seen in the first released video looks like a pontiac montana/chev uplander/buick terraza to me. http://www.carsdirect.com/pontiac/montana/pictures

Note, the side windows, tail lights and angle of the rear hatch.

The vehicle in the second released video is not as long, and no sliding side door.

[ThoughtElf]

Unless noted the wheel base is the same for all body types of that vehicle (coupe,sedan,wagon). Some models have wheel base ranges (ex 101-103) for this reason. If the car you are looking for has a range you will need to measure it for it for an exact wheel base. Hopefully this will help get you close.

Acura
Integra (1986-1989) 96.5-99.2" (1990-1996)101-104"
Integra GS-R (1992-1993) 100.4" (1994-1996)102-104"
Vigor (1992-1994) 110.4"
2.5TL (1995-1996) 112"
3.2TL (1996) 112"
Legend (1986-1990)108.7" (1991-1995) 111.4-111.6"
Legand Coupe (1987-1990) 106.5"
3.5RL (1996) 115"
NSX (1991-1996) 100" http://www.suddenlaunch.com/bimages/cry.gif http://www.suddenlaunch.com/bimages/cry.gif

American Motors
Encore Renault (1984-1986) 98"
Alliance Renault (1984-1987) 98"
Eagle (1984-1987) 109"

Audi
80 (1988-1992) 100.2"
80/90 Quattro (1988-1992) 100.2"
90 (1993-1995) 102.2-102.8"
A4 2.8 (1996) 103"
100 (1989-1991) 105.6-105.9" (1992-1994) 105.8-106"
A6 (1995-1996) 106"
200 (1989-1991) 105.6-106.1"
4000S (1985-1987)99.8"
4000S Quattro (1985-1987) 106.4"
5000S (1985-1988) 99.4"
5000S Turbo(1985) 105.8"
5000CS Quattro (1986-1988) 105.8"
5000S Quattro (1988) 108.7"
S4 (1992-1994) 106"
S6 (1995) 106"
Coupe GT (1985-1987) 99.8"
Coupe Quattro (1990-1991) 99.8"
V8 Quattro (1990-1991) 105.9-106.4" (1992-1994)106.4

BMW
318 (1985) 101.2"
325/325E (1985-1989) 101.2"
524TD (1985-1986) 103.3"
525I (1987-1995) 108.7"
525I (1987-1995)108.7"
528E (1985-1988) 103.3"
530I (1994-1995) 108.7"
535 (1985-1988) 103.3"
535I (1989-1993) 108.7"
540I (1994-1995) 108.7"
635CSI,L6 (1985-1989) 103.3"
735I/735IL (1988-1992) 111.5-116"
740I/IL (1993-1995) 111.5-120.9", (1996)116-121"
750IL (1988-1994) 116", (1995-1996) 121"
840CI (1994-1995) 105.7", (1996) 106"
850I/CI (1991-1994) 105.7, (1995-1996) 106"
850CSI (1994-1995) 105.7
Z3 1.9 (1996) 97"
M3 (1988-1991) 101" (1995) 106.3" (1996) 107"
M5 (1988) 103.3" (1991-1993) 108.7"
M6 (1987-1988) 103.3"

Buick
SkyHawk (1984-1989) 101"
Skylark (1984-1985) 105"
Skylark (1988-1996) 103"
Somerset Skylark (1986-1987) 103"
Somerset Regal (1985) 103"
Regal (1984-1995) 108"
Century All Body Types(1984-1996) 105"
Lesabre (1984-1985) 116" , (1986-1993) 111" ,(1994-1996) 111"-113"
Riviera (1984-1985) 114", (1986-1993) 108", (1995-1996) 114"
Park Ave (1985-1991) 111"

Cadillac
Cimarron (1984-1985) 101"
Seville (1984-1985) 114", (1986-1991) 108", (1992-1996) 111"
Deville (1985-1988) 111", (1989-1993) 111"-114",(1994-1996) 114"-116"
Eldorado (1984-1985) 114", (1986-1996) 108"

Chevrolet
Camaro (1984-1995) 101"
Sprint (1985-1988) 88"-92"
Chevette (1976-1987) 94"-97"
Spectrum (1985-1988) 95"
Nova (1985-1988) 96"
Cavalier (1984-1994) 101", (1995-2005) 104"
Beretta & Corsica (1987-1996) 103"
Ciatation (1984-1985) 105"
Lumina (1990-1996) 108"
Monte Carlo (1985-1988) 108" ,(1995-1996) 108"
Celebrity All Body Types (1984-1990) 105"

Chrysler
Laser (1984-1986) 97"
Lebaron GTS (1985-1988) 103"
Concorde (1993-1995) 113"
Conquest (1987-1989) 96"
E Class (1984) 103"
LHS (1994-1996) 113"
Lebaron Coupe (1987-1995) 100"-101"
Lebaron Sedan (1984-1994) 100"-104"
Sebring (1995-1996) 104"
Cirrus (1995-1996) 108"
Newyorker (1984-1987) 103", (1988-1993) 104", (1994-1996) 113"
NY 5th Ave (1984-1993) 109"-113"
Imperial (1990-1993) 109"

Dodge
Omni (1984-1990) 97"-99"
Avenger (1995-1996) 104"
Conquest (1984-1986) 96"
Daytona (1984-1993) 97"
Colt (1984) 91"-103", (1985-1994) 94"-104"
Stratus (1995-1996) 108"
Shadow (1987-1994) 97"
Neon (1995-1996) 104"
Spirit (1989-1995) 103"-104"
Monaco (1990-1992) 106"
600 (1984-1988) 103"
Lancer (1985-1989) 103"
Aries (1984-1989) 100"
Dynasty (1988-1993) 104"
Intrepid (1993-1996) 113"
Diplomat (1984-1989) 109"-113"

Eagle
Summit (1989-1995) 94"-99"
Eagle (1988) 109"
Talon (1990-1996) 97"-99"
Medallion ( 1988-1989) 102"-108"
Preimer (1988-1992) 106"
Vision (1993-1996) 113"

Ford
Aspire (1994-1996) 91"-94"
Festiva (1988-1993) 90"
Escort (1984-1996) 94"-98"
EXP (1984-1988) 94"
Granada (1975-1980) 109.9", (1981-1982) 105.5"
LTD not crown vic model (1983-1986) 106"
Tempo (1984-1994) 100"
Taurus All Body Types (1986-1995) 106" ,(1996) 109"
Thunderbird (1985-1988) 104", (1989-1996) 113"
Probe (1989-1992) 99", (1993-1996) 103"
Mustang (1984-1995) 101" ,(1996) 101"-102"
Contour (1995-2001) 107"
Ford Fairmont (78-83) 105.5"

Geo
Metro ((1989-1996) 89.2"-93.1"
Metro 4cyl (1995-1996) 93.1"
Spectrum (1989) 94.5"
Prizm 1.8 (1993-1996) 97.1"
Prizm (1989-1996) 95.7"-97.1"
Storm (1990-1993) 96.5"

Honda
Civic 1300 ( 1984-1985) 88.6"-93.7"
Civic 1500 (1984-1987) 86.6"-96.5"
Civic (1988-1995) 98.4"-103.2"
Civic EX/SI (1990-1995) 98.4"-103.2"
Civic (1996) 104"
CRX (1988-1991) 90.6"
Accord ( 1984-1985) 96.5", (1986-1989) 102.4", (1990-1996) 106.9"-107.1"
prelude(85-87) 96.5", (88-91) 101.1"
prelude SI (86-87) 96.5", (92-96) 101"
prelude S (92-96), SE (1995), Vtech (93-96) 101"

Hyundai
Excel (1986-1989) 93.7", (1990-1994) 93.8"
Accent (1995-1996) 94.5"
Elantra (1992-1995) 98.4", (1996) 101"
Sonata (1989-1992) 104.3", (1993-1996) 104.3"-106.3"

Isuzu
I Mark (1984-1985) 94.3", (1986-1989) 94.5"
Stylus (1986-1993) 96.5"
Impulse (1984-1986) 96"-96.1", (1987-1991) 96.1",
Impulse Turbo & 1992 (1985-1989) 96.5"

Jaguar
XJ6 (1985-1989) 113"
XJ6,XJR (1990-1996) 113-118"
XJ212 (1993-1995) 113", (1996) 118"
XJS (1985-1996) 102"
XJS12 (1994-1995) 102"


Lexus
SC400 (1992-1996)106"
LS400 (1990-1996) 111"-113"

Lincoln
Town Car (1985-1996) 117"
Continental (1985-1996) 109"
Mark Vll (1985-1992) 108"
Mark Vlll (1993-1996) 113"

Mazda
GLC (1984-1985) 93.1"
323 (1986-1994) 94.5"-96.5"
Protege (1990-1994) 98.4", (1995-1996) 102.6"
MX3 (1992-1995) 96.3"
626 (1984-1987) 98.8", (1988-1992) 101.4", (1993-1996) 102.8"
MX6 (1988-1992) 99", (1993-1995) 102.8"
929 (1988-1991) 106.7" , (1992-1995) 112.2"
Millenia (1995) 108.3"

Mercedes
300SE/SEL (1988-1991) 115.6-121.1"
300SE (1992-1993) 119.7"
S320 (1994-1996) 120-124"
300SL (1990-1993) 99"
SL320 (1990-1993) 99"
300TE (1988-1993) 110.2"
350SDL (1990-1991) 121.1"
350SD (1991) 115.6"
350SE (1985) 115.6"
380SL (1985) 97"
400E (1992-1993) 110.2"
E420 (1994-1995) 110.2"
400SE (1992) 120"
400SEL (1993) 123.6"
S420 (1994-1996) 124"
420SEL (1986-1991) 121.1"
500SEC (1993) 115.9"
500E (1992-1993) 110.2"
E300 (1995) 110.2", (1996) 112"
E500 (1994) 110.2"
500SEL/SEC (1985) 112-120.9"
S500 (1994-1996) 116-124"
500SL (1990-1993) 99"
SL500 (1994-1996) 99"
560SEC (1986-1991) 112-112.2"
560SEL (1986-1991) 120.9-121.1"
560SL (1986-1989) 96.7"
600SEC (1993) 115.9"
600SEL (1992-1993) 123.6"
S600 (1994-1996) 116-124"
SL600 (1994-1996) 99"

Mercury
Capri (1985-1986) 95", (1991-1994) 100"-104"
Cougar (1985-1988) 104"-106", (1989-1996) 113"
Tracer (1988-1989) 95", (1991-1996) 98"
Mystique (1995-1996) 107"
Lynx (1984-1987) 94"
Topaz (1984-1994) 100"
Sable All Body Types(1986-1995) 106", (1996) 109"
Marquis (1984-1986) 106"
Capri (1984-1986) 100"-101", (1991-1994) 95"
Zephyr (1978-1983) 105.5"

Merkur
XR4Ti (1985-1989) 102.7"
Scorpio (1988-1989) 108.7"

Mitsubishi
Mirage (1985-1996) 94"-99"
Tredia/Cordia (1984-1988) 96.3"
Expo (1992-1995) 99.2"-107.1"
Galant (1985-1993) 102.4", (1994-1996) 103.7"
Eclipse (1990-1994) 97.2", (1995-1996) 98.8"
Sigma (1989-1990) 102.4"
Diamante (1992-1996) 107.1"
Starion (1984-1988) 95.9

Nissan/ Datsun
Sentra (1985-1996) 95"-99.8"
Sentra SE-R (1991-1994) 95.7"
Sentra Diesel (1985-1986) 94.5"
Pulsar (1984-1990) 95.1"-95.7"
Altima (1993-1996) 103.1"
NX 1600 (1991-1993) 95.7"
NX 2000 (1991-1993) 95.7"
Stanza (1984-1989) 97.2"-100.4", (1990-1992) 100.4"
Axxess (1990-1991) 102.4"-102.8"
Maxima (1984) 103.4", (1985-1995) 100.4"-106.3", (1996)107"-109"

Oldsmobile
Firenza (1984-1988) 101"
Omega (1984) 105"
Achieva (1992-1996) 103"
Cutlass Calais (1985-1991) 103"
Cutlass Ciera All Body Types (1984-1996) 105"
Cutlass Supreme(1984-1996) 108"
Delta Royale (1984-1985) 116", (1986-1988) 111"
88 Royale (1989-1996) 111"
Aurora (1995) 114"
98 Regency (1984) 119", (1985-1996) 111"
Torando (1984-1985) 114", (1986-1992) 108"

Plymouth
Breeze (1996) 108"
Colt (1984) 91"-103", (1985-1994) 92"-104"
Horizon (1984-1990) 99"
Sundance (1987-1994) 97"
Reliant (1984-1989) 100"
Acclaim (1989-1995) 103"
Gran Fury (1984-1989) 113"
Neon (1995-1996) 104"
Caravelle (1985-1988) 103"
Laser (1990-1994) 97"
Conquest (1984-1986) 96"

Pontiac
Firebird (1984-1995) 101"
T1000/1000 (1984-1987) 94"
Lemans (1988-1993) 99"
Sunfire (1995-2005) 104"
Sunbird (1984-1994) 101"-103"
Phoenix (1984) 105"
Grand Am (1985-1993) 103" (1994-1996) 103"-107"
6000 All Body Types (1984-1991) 105"
Bonneville ( 1984-1995) 108"-111", (1996) 111"-113"
Grand Prix (1984-1996) 108"

Saturn
Saturn (1991-1996) 99"-102"

Suzuki
Swift (1989-1996) 89.2"-93.1"
Esteem (1995-1996) 97.6"

Toyota
Tercel (1984-1986) 95.7", (1987-1995) 93.7"
Tercel Wagon (1987-1988) 95.7"
Corolla (1984-1995) 95.7"-97"
Corolla DX,LE (1993-1995) 97"
Corolla Diesel (1984-1985) 94.5"-97"
Corolla SR5 (1984-1989) 94.5"-97.5"
Corolla GTS (1985-1987) 94.5"
Camary (1984-1991) 102.4", (1992-1995) 103.1"
Celica (1984-1985) 98.4", (1986-1993) 99.4", (1994-1996) 99.9"
Celica GT/GTS (1990-1995) 99.9"
Celica Turbo (1990-1993) 99.4"
Cressida (1984-1988) 104.1"-105", (1989-1992) 105.5"
Avalon (1995-1996) 107.1"

Volkswagon
Rabbit (1984) 94.5"
Golf (1984-1995) 87.3"
Fox (1991-1993) 92.8"
Jetta (1984) 94.5", (1985-1992) 97.3", (1993-1996) 98"-99"
Scirocca (1984-1988) 94.5"
Corrado (1990-1994) 97.3"
Quantuim (1984-1988) 100.4"
Passat (1990-1996) 103.3"

Volvo
240 (1984-1993) 104.3"-109.1"
740/740GLE (1984-1991) 104"
740 (1985-1992) 109.1
760GLT/780 (1984-1989) 109.1"
GLT (1984) 104"
760/780 ( 1984-1991) 109.1"
850/GLT (1993-1996) 104.9"
940 (1991-1995) 109.1
960 (1992-1996) 109.1

Note: most of these are pre-2000 vehicles, but I am saving this one anyways for other cases where we try to figure out vehicles :D

[PenelopePetunia]

From the article:
Stafford also said he had Facebook take down a page implicating Tori's mother and his ex-wife, Tara McDonald.

My question: shouldn't the wording be "accusing" instead of "implicating". To my mind, (I have a legal background) "implicating" means a post that would give information/testimony/proof that she was involved. Now if the word was implying, then that would be a different scenario.

Hmmmm, is the Facebook Wall always referred to as a "page" - as in WebPage? I thought there was different terminology - I believe it is easy enough to delete comments off a Facebook Wall, but to remove a "page"???
Unless it was a link someone had posted on the wall to a webpage?

Your thoughts???

If I am not mistaken. I think someone created a "I hate TM" page on FB. I am glad they deleted it.

[another nosey mom]

video of presser with the parents: http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/News/Local/2009/05/04/9345966.html

I just watched the video of the woman and Tori, it looks clearer now, to me, IMO, that is a very casual walk and not a walk of someone who is scurrying away with a stolen child - weird

[another nosey mom]

A little info. The Facebook "page" they talked about... a guy made a facebook group about "Convict Tara of Tori's Murder" or something along those lines. Rodney posted there telling the guy get rid of it. Other Facebooker's click on the report link at the bottom of the group and it got deleted.

Now about that car. Why in hell would they be looking for a witness in a car a month later?

Spec allowed here? Here's how I see it. They have video of Tori and her abductor walking into the parking lot of the nursing home. They aren't showing that video. Chances are they also have video of that same car leaving the parking lot.

Tara was at the nursing home visiting her grandfather at 3:00. The nursing home is between the school and home. Why the hell didn't she pick her kid up at school if she was right there?

And really, the abductor took Tori into the parking lot of a building that Tara just happened to be visiting?

The more I see, the more I'm convinced Tara has her hidden. Maybe for a very good reason. Maybe not.

Oh, and somebody was looking for me a couple of pages back, a local. I'm not a local. I live in Paris, more than an hour away.

I feel the same way, after watching the clearer video of Tori and ?? I still think this is mom IMO... the walk, the walk is not a walk of urgency.

[Mazama]

That looks like a good candidate.


I think it is the 1997 Saturn SW2 Station Wagon like the one pictured in the kijiji link. It's almost spot on, imo

[ThoughtElf]

I think it is the 1997 Saturn SW2 Station Wagon like the one pictured in the kijiji link. It's almost spot on, imo

It is a good likeness. I am leaning more towards the Saturn than to the Windstar only because of the height. The wheelbase is helpful, but if they could also calculate the height I'll bet this could be narrowed down very quickly.

[ThoughtElf]

It is interesting that Tara's pc was taken just now. Wonder what the catalyst was? Something must have triggered that decision by LE.

[LuckyPenny]

ty to lexiintoronto for giving me the heads up that something is breaking..no presser yet? it looks like a green/teal minivan..it does appear to be the same one that we saw passing by on the original abduction video...okay was it going the other way? or was it darker? or is it because this is now a differant camera and angle...it does appear to be a mini van..like a ford windstar..like late 98 99 series? where they started to look more areo dynamic? jmo what do you all think?

OCPS Constable Laurie Ann Maitland says police are looking to speak with the driver of a station wagon that drove by the scene of Tori's abduction, moments after the video captured Tori walking with an unknown woman. "Investigators have identified the footage of a small to mid-sized dark coloured station wagon. It has an approximate 262cm wheel base. This vehicle was driving northbound on Fyfe Ave. after Tori was seen in the surveillance video with the unidentified woman."

http://www.1047.ca/news.php

[LuckyPenny]

Earlier I posted about 2 of Tori's class mates seeing TM put Tori in a car .. wonder if this is the car?

[Lexiintoronto]

Really bugging me, Why would it take 4 weeks to post that video of the vehicle? Would that not have been one of the first things to have been noticed, that there was a car passing at the same time as this was going down. Some things just don't seem to make sense to me. Sorry just ranting here. LE spokesperson Maitland said today that they were working on enhancing the video and stills to get a clear image. (four weeks?!! four days seems unreasonable)

She also said that the other car(s) have been identified, which to me means 'cleared'. They must know the make and model and have run checks on all licenced owners of that type of vehicle in Woodstock and the surrounding areas. I'm wondering if that failed, and they're thinking that it may be a car from far outside the area. (back to the toronto theory)

[another nosey mom]

It is a good likeness. I am leaning more towards the Saturn than to the Windstar only because of the height. The wheelbase is helpful, but if they could also calculate the height I'll bet this could be narrowed down very quickly.

I think the new video from police is 99% a Saturn and the other vehicle going the other way is a Ford windstar minivan or dodge - they all look alike

[Mazama]

Earlier I posted about 2 of Tori's class mates seeing TM put Tori in a car .. wonder if this is the car?

I remember your post. Do you recall where you got that information?

[Lexiintoronto]

It is interesting that Tara's pc was taken just now. Wonder what the catalyst was? Something must have triggered that decision by LE.
Maybe theyve been reading WS. We've been wondering for weeks if her computer revealed any clues.

[ThoughtElf]

I think the new video from police is 99% a Saturn and the other vehicle going the other way is a Ford windstar minivan or dodge - they all look alike

I'm leaning in the same direction.

The OPP article did say:
With respect to the vehicle, the make and model have not been identified
at this time. Further efforts are being made in this regard.Waterloo Regional helped with enhancements on the other tape and on the composite so they may also be helping with the vehicle images. Hoping we get the height soon.

[another nosey mom]

just re-watched the video of Tori walking away from school, watched it about 5 more times..... still looks to me like a person who is very familar to Tori, wearing white jacket with maybe a black hoodie or black scarf... normal looking walk, brisk but not to urgent... woman is a couple of steps ahead of Tori, which, if you were stealing a child would you not stay a foot behind?? I think the entire mystery is going to be answered by all of our earliest info - all of the surviellance videos, etc.... the police seem to be letting out new, clearer, longer videos.... hopefully this is all good news... but where is Tori??

[another nosey mom]

Maybe theyve been reading WS. We've been wondering for weeks if her computer revealed any clues.

I also asked that question a few weeks back, why is Tara still able to follow fb, (this is what she said at a presser, that she follows the case by fb) - so why would she still have a computer in her home - would police not want to look at it for evidence? imo I would think police would have taken all of the computers that Tori would have had access to.

[justbetweenus]

A little info. The Facebook "page" they talked about... a guy made a facebook group about "Convict Tara of Tori's Murder" or something along those lines. Rodney posted there telling the guy get rid of it. Other Facebooker's click on the report link at the bottom of the group and it got deleted.

Now about that car. Why in hell would they be looking for a witness in a car a month later?

Spec allowed here? Here's how I see it. They have video of Tori and her abductor walking into the parking lot of the nursing home. They aren't showing that video. Chances are they also have video of that same car leaving the parking lot.

Tara was at the nursing home visiting her grandfather at 3:00. The nursing home is between the school and home. Why the hell didn't she pick her kid up at school if she was right there?

And really, the abductor took Tori into the parking lot of a building that Tara just happened to be visiting?

The more I see, the more I'm convinced Tara has her hidden. Maybe for a very good reason. Maybe not.

Oh, and somebody was looking for me a couple of pages back, a local. I'm not a local. I live in Paris, more than an hour away.

My bold.

Thanks Paris. I don't think I've heard that Tara was at the nursing home at 3:00 that day. Is this confirmed for sure?

[LuckyPenny]

I remember your post. Do you recall where you got that information?

From a mother who knows the students mother, the 2 students were interviewed twice about this fact.

[Mazama]

I also asked that question a few weeks back, why is Tara still able to follow fb, (this is what she said at a presser, that she follows the case by fb) - so why would she still have a computer in her home - would police not want to look at it for evidence? imo I would think police would have taken all of the computers that Tori would have had access to.

Maybe on her Iphone? :crazy:

[ThoughtElf]

Maybe theyve been reading WS. We've been wondering for weeks if her computer revealed any clues.

Hey Lexi!

Here are a bunch of scenarios that might have caused them to finally take it now:
1. Up until now, perhaps they had no direct reason to suspect TM or Goris - perhaps something changed recently to alter that

2. All of the FB activity might have been a catalyst to learn more. I'd certainly wish to know where they've been surfing/emailing since Tori's disappearance, even more I think than activity beforehand. It could be very telling. Keep in mind that they'd get more detail as to activities faster directly from the pc history than they would from their ISP.

3. The fund-raising/donations - for all we know there could be an additional investigation going on in regards to the funds gathered/spent to date.

4. If LE already knows that TM does know/recognize names on the 'suspect tip list' and has denied it, they may be looking for proof via pc activity.

5. As in Caylee's case, it would also be of great interest to know which files, if any, have been deleted from the pc since April 8th

All pure speculation, but any of the above might have finally triggered this.

[LuckyPenny]

I really hope all this means Tori is coming home soon!!

[Mazama]

I really hope all this means Tori is coming home soon!!

I couldn't agree with you more. :)

[Flowercb]

Thank you Lexiintoronto. Exactly what I believe. Why else would mom be saying that her baby is coming home. A car license is as good as having your man/woman. They probably ditched the vehicle or stored it somewhere by now if that is the case.

I have a question for PepperFritz. If they used the parking lot further behind the building, would they have to drive around the back and turn onto Fyfe again going past the Caressant care in the same direction the car was seen travelling (north on Fyfe I believe)? I know I sound confusing but I am trying to fit this car into the picture.

[justbetweenus]

Popping out of lurker mode... hmmmm, so I'm assuming that the other tattoo was done on Tori's dad. Do we know when the tat was done, because I'm wondering if the "U" was Tori and the "us" was Tara and Rodney.

If it were just on Tara, I would say that Tara was the U and her kids were the us... but that doesn't make sense if two people have to tats.

It is interesting, thanks for writing to the tat artist and getting the meaning behind it! Good sleuthing!:detective:

Hi Daisy;

Great seeing you come out of lurk mode. The tattoo picture was uploaded last November with a comment "we love our new tattoos." I'm thinking that both Tara and James had the same tattoo done, and the message is between the two of them...as in U make us. (as in make us complete as a couple?) if that makes any sense lol. That is really just a guess on my part though. Nice tattoo work regardless though.

Thanks for your response Daisy.:)

[another nosey mom]

My bold.

Thanks Paris. I don't think I've heard that Tara was at the nursing home at 3:00 that day. Is this confirmed for sure?

I believe someone on here has family that works at the nursing home and can say that she TM was there visiting??? maybe Pepper??

[another nosey mom]

Hi Daisy;

Great seeing you come out of lurk mode. The tattoo picture was uploaded last November with a comment "we love our new tattoos." I'm thinking that both Tara and James had the same tattoo done, and the message is between the two of them...as in U make us. (as in make us complete as a couple?) if that makes any sense lol. That is really just a guess on my part though. Nice tattoo work regardless though.

Thanks for your response Daisy.:)

I guess maybe she had a "S" on her back from earlier Stafford and now has added the "U" - and that makes "US"

[roseofsharon]

The following comments are just my own thoughts and opinions ...

People have idiosyncrasies. Sometimes they are unaware they even have them.

Playing the abduction video over and over, it is apparent ...

.... perp does not have jacket done up
.... perp walks with hand in pocket

Hmmm -- watch some of the pressers!!:eek:

Also, could weight gain be due to pregnancy -- just wondering???

[Mazama]

The following comments are just my own thoughts and opinions ...

People have idiosyncrasies. Sometimes they are unaware they even have them.

Playing the abduction video over and over, it is apparent ...

.... perp does not have jacket done up
.... perp walks with hand in pocket

Hmmm -- watch some of the pressers!!:eek:

Also, could weight gain be due to pregnancy -- just wondering???

I also noticed the similarities...especially the hand in pocket part. I never thought about a possible pregnancy but if it were so it seems to me that she would be possibly sick, pale, emotional etc...?:waitasec:

[another nosey mom]

The following comments are just my own thoughts and opinions ...

People have idiosyncrasies. Sometimes they are unaware they even have them.

Playing the abduction video over and over, it is apparent ...

.... perp does not have jacket done up
.... perp walks with hand in pocket

Hmmm -- watch some of the pressers!!:eek:

Also, could weight gain be due to pregnancy -- just wondering???

I agree with you, the jacket is not done up, and yes the person has her hand in her pocket... and I don't think the person walking with Tori took her, I think it happened sometime shortly after, this person handed her over to someone else ...IMO

[ThoughtElf]

I also noticed the similarities...especially the hand in pocket part. I never thought about a possible pregnancy but if it were so it seems to me that she would be possibly sick, pale, emotional etc...?:waitasec:

Not to mention she wouldn't be out drinking beer. But then again, who knows?

[kaas]

Backtracking a bit here to the Who Are You? http://crimesearchersonline.com/index.php?option=com_myblog&show=Who-Are-You-.html&Itemid=9 In the video http://watch.ctv.ca/news/latest/missing-ont-girl/#clip164457 at 00:05 you see the young woman, with two men. Who is the man in the black cap?

[justbetweenus]

I guess maybe she had a "S" on her back from earlier Stafford and now has added the "U" - and that makes "US"

I guess anything is possible. They both got the same tattoo anyway.

[ThoughtElf]

Backtracking a bit here to the Who Are You? http://crimesearchersonline.com/index.php?option=com_myblog&show=Who-Are-You-.html&Itemid=9 In the video http://watch.ctv.ca/news/latest/missing-ont-girl/#clip164457 at 00:05 you see the young woman, with two men. Who is the man in the black cap?

Don't know. Looks familiar though? Did we see him in any other videos?

[paris_paris]

kaas, that vigil video was taken in Brantford. I can only confirm that the man is not James. Nobody in the family recognizes either person.

Hand in pocket. I'm having trouble finding the video, but it's an earlier one. It shows Tara and her friend Sara walking with posters to put up. Sara is walking with the left hand in pocket. It really stood out to me. I will post if I find it.

[Flowercb]

From the London Free Press Article:

"The nursing home has a video camera pointing to the parking lot and intersection of Fyfe and Walter Street, but a supervisor there wouldn't say if police had taken tape from that camera as well."

Want to make a bet?