Starting over again - Brainstorm session

[Kimster]

Time for some serious detective work. Let's start over from the beginning and analyze each step of the way. Use our marvelous timeline as needed.

Shall we start with the MySpace entries? Remember, we are going to analyze all that we know each step of the way...so if we start with her MySpace entries, we want to discuss what we know about her brother going to juvie - or not!

[Kimster]

Lindsey Time-Line

MAY 29th - Lindsey wrote:
I've been getting a lot of nightmares lately and I have this bad feeling that something bads gonna happen...
Her mood - scared

June 16th (Tues)- Last day of school, around 10:00am.

June 25th (Thu) - Kayla overnight at Lindsey's home.

JUNE 26TH (Friday)- 9:15PM....LAST TIME LINDSEY WAS SEEN - dressed in light blue pull-over hoodie shirt, blue jeans, black slip on shoes.

June 26th (Day hours) - Lindsey swimming with Kayla and group of girls.

8:19pm (Friday evening hours) - Lindsey, Kayla, and group of swimming friends in video store having a good time laughing & joking. Lindsey and Kayla did not rent videos.

8:25pm - Lindsey and Kayla left video store - walked to Lindsey's home to see if another over-night was possible. Lindsey bathed and changed clothes. Mom Baum stated Lindsey left with no clothes or money; left cell phone charging.

8:45pm? - Lindsey (pushing bike with broken chain), Kayla and brother Josh left for Kayla's home where girls wanted a sleep-over.

Altercation between Lindsey and brother took place behind Shell gas station across and down the street from the Baum home. Bike left behind Shell Gas Station. (not verified by PD)

At some point during walk brother Josh was told to go home by a neighbor friend.

9:00 - 9:15pm - Two girls arrived at mom K's home. Lindsey told by mom K and friend she could not stay the night and needed to leave before dark - Lindsey left to walk the 4 blocks home.

9:10 - 9:15 - Kayla watched Lindsey walk down Maple until no longer seen.

9:15 - Two different residents saw Lindsey walking on Maple between Fifth and Sixth streets – about halfway between the two homes. According to mom Baum, one of the residents is a co-worker; according to police, one works for the county.

10:00pm - Mom Baum with a a broken down car searched for Lindsey on foot. Mom K was charging her cell phone and couldn't be reached.

10:30pm - Mom Baum joined Mom K and friend in car search for Lindsey.

10:45 - 10:50pm - Mom Baum called police - reported daughter Lindsey missing.

July 3rd - Lindsey's father, Gregory Scott Baum, a member of the Tennessee National guard, flew into Washington from Tennessee late in evening.

July 18th weekend - Gregory Scott Baum flew back to Tennessee to be with his unit.

JULY 7th - Lindsey's 11th birthday.

[Kimster]

Lindsey's MySpace entries prior to her disappearance:

Lindsey Baum is happy that her brother is going to juvi tomorrow.
Mood: happ at 2:10 PM Jun 17
Lindsey Baum is bored as hell
Mood: bored at 8:01 PM Jun 8
Lindsey Baum cabt wait to hang with kayla agian
Mood: anxious at 2:13 PM Jun 8
Lindsey Baum i've been getting a lot of nightmares latley and i have this bad feeling that something bads gonna happen
Mood: scared at 6:48 AM May 29
Lindsey Baum has joined MySpace!
Mood: good at 4:04 AM May 29

http://www.myspace.com/477760045

[Kimster]

Lindsey was getting nightmares. Okay, KageyKaren reminded us that her mom was most likely under a lot of stress...single mom....son getting into trouble....and I know even the stress of knowing the ex got married and there's a new step-mom can be tough to deal with. I wonder if there were plans for Lindsey and her brother to go back east and see her dad before he was deployed, for example? That's stressful.

So, maybe her dreams were an offshoot of knowing there was stress in the household?

[kageykaren]

Kimster, Kimster, Kimster, Delirously happy and not from heat! Sherrif Scott Richardson just announced on Komo 4 that as we type human cadaver dogs have returned to Mc Clearly and are going house to house!!! He stated lE was going off tips and and call. Lovely work by the way. I'm your side kick to your Nancy Drew notes... keep prayers going as we slueth!

[eyes4crime]

Great idea Kimster! :blowkiss: We have no idea if the nightmares and bad feelings about something happening are related to her disappearance. At this point, there is no way to know for sure.

some characteristics that have been said to describe Lindsey:

Raised her dog, Kadence, from puppyhood
loves her dog - loves animals
loves overnights with friends
loves to read - especially Harry Potter
Twilight fan
has nightmares
anticipates something bad is going to happen
grades dropping - mom thinks it's due to the divorce
missed many school days
afraid of the dark
got along well with her 5th grade teacher
loves to write
social child
had future aspirations - wanted to be a vet or a writer
happy brother is going to juvie
talkative child
drama queen
excited about her birthday on July 7th
parents separated and recently divorced
her mother is a single mom and works
Independent

Added from Coastal - post # 9

she sometimes ran the register at Mom's work ("5 Cents to 5 Bucks" store, Elma)
has long nails
she and her brother argue, and sometimes fight
has a MySpace profile named "disturbed"
seems comfortable with computer/internet
has a cell phone (which she left at home)
attended elementary school in Elma
attended _?_ church occasionally
is a Girl Scout


That's what I can think of off the top of my head - anyone else?

[yosande]

Things I find odd;

Lindsey comes home with friend, and takes a shower.
Does she ask her mom if friend can spend the night?
Does mom say no, so she takes a shower and changes clothes in hopes of spending the night at friends house?
If she was planning on returning within an hour, why shower at that time?
Is she prone to taking a lot of showers throughout the day?

After taking a shower, she, her brother, and her friend, take a broken bike with them to friends house, but it and brother are sent home due to fighting.
Where did this happen? Who sent them home;
or did they decide they didn't want to push the bike and threw it in the bushes, and the bro took off in another direction, b/c, if he was told to walk with his sister, and he went home, why wasn't he sent back to walk with his sister?

Where does mom work? What are her hours?

Why was Lindsey missing school, and her grades dropping. She likes her teacher, so that isn't it. She has plenty of friends so social outcast isn't the reason.
If mom is gone when it's time to go to school, is she not responsible enough to get herself up, dressed, and on her way? I don't believe the divorce was troubling her. They had been seperated for a couple years. and she rarely saw her dad. I simply don't accept that reason for her dropping grades and missing school.
Was JB also missing a lot of school, were his grades also dropping?

How long had they lived at that address?

The nightmares could have been a result of her choice in movies, and books. moo

I read on the doctor website, don't know where it is now, that he observed the town blaming the mom for letting her out walking around that time of evening, but, I wonder if there is more to it than that. I wonder if mom isn't around much and the kids fend for themselves. I don't know this, I'm just asking.

I noticed during the vigil pics from cyber and JvK, thanks so much again, that JB is standing directly in front of his mom when she is talking into the mic.
My observation of this is "Look at Me, Mom" and I wonder what he's thinking.
All the other kids were sitting, paying attention, but he was restless, moving about.
Why? for attention? Didn't want to hear what was being said? Wished he was anywhere else but there?
Mom calls him a wanderer. To me, that says, she often doesn't know where he is or what he's doing.

And back to the shower thing, I find the timing of it an important clue. I'm not quite sure why.
One reason I think it's an important clue is b/c if she did shower with the hope she was going to spend the night with her friend at her friends house, wouldn't she have taken her cellphone. If she expected to come back with her friend in a hour, she might not take it, but would she take the time to shower?

Why was she "happy" her bro was going to juvi? Does she not understand what juvi is? or does she think he deserves it? or does he make her life so miserable that she prefers him in kiddie lock up, than at home? This is a clue, imo.

[Kimster]

Yosande, those are great questions! For some reason, LE said they think she disappeared with someone she knew...She was having nightmares...her grades were dropping... What if she was being threatened - or even worse - molested? Is that why she took a shower at that time of day? To feel "clean"?

[coastal]

Great idea Kimster! :blowkiss: We have no idea if the nightmares and bad feelings about something happening are related to her disappearance. At this point, there is no way to know for sure.

some characteristics that have been said to describe Lindsey:

Raised her dog, Kadence, from puppyhood
loves her dog - loves animals
loves overnights with friends
loves to read - especially Harry Potter
Twilight fan
has nightmares
anticipates something bad is going to happen
grades dropping - mom thinks it's due to the divorce
missed many school days
afraid of the dark
got along well with her 5th grade teacher
loves to write
social child
happy brother is going to juvie
talkative child
drama queen
excited about her birthday on July 7th
parents separated and recently divorced
her mother is a single mom and works
Independent

That's what I can think of off the top of my head - anyone else?
she sometimes ran the register at Mom's work ("5 Cents to 5 Bucks" store, Elma)
has long nails
she and her brother argue, and sometimes fight
has a MySpace profile named "disturbed"
seems comfortable with computer/internet
has a cell phone (which she left at home)
attended elementary school in Elma
attended _?_ church occasionally
is a Girl Scout


It isn't much, is it?

[momtective]

This article is from 2000 and is based on a study by the Washington state attorney general's office. I found it very informative and it might help in building a profile of Lindsey's abductor.

http://www.post-gazette.com/headlines/20001001killings3.asp

From the statistics this is what I have:

Sexual assault was the primary motivation.

Abductor is known to have committed prior crimes against children, the most common being sexual assaults.

The typical victims in the child abduction-murder cases were white girls, about 11 years old, often described as "normal kids" from middle-class neighborhoods with stable family relationships.

White male, about 27 years old and unmarried.

Probably lives either alone (17 percent) or with their parents (34 percent.)

Probably unemployed, or was employed in unskilled or semiskilled jobs.

Is socially marginal.

Had a legitimate reason to be where Lindsey was.

Probably lives near the abduction site.

Possibly was there for some normal social activity.

Possibly either worked in the area or was there for some other business.

Lindsey was a "victim of opportunity,"

The abduction was most likely a "snatch and grab" confrontation where the abductor saw Lindsey as an available victim and quickly assaulted and subdued her.

Lindsey was not chosen because of some physical characteristic.

Most likely-- the initial contact between Lindsey and her abductor took place within a quarter-mile of the Lindsey’s home. And it’s very possible, the first contact occurred less than 200 feet from Lindsey’s home.

Unfortunately 74 percent -- of the abducted children who were murdered were dead within three hours of their abduction, the study said.

[eyes4crime]

she sometimes ran the register at Mom's work ("5 Cents to 5 Bucks" store, Elma)
has long nails
she and her brother argue, and sometimes fight
has a MySpace profile named "disturbed"
seems comfortable with computer/internet
has a cell phone (which she left at home)
attended elementary school in Elma
attended _?_ church occasionally
is a Girl Scout


It isn't much, is it?

Thanks - it's a lot of information. Hope you don't mind that I added it to the above list of qualities...besides making time-line for organization of my thinking, I like to have a feel for the child involved. If that's a prob. with my adding your info. let me know and I will delete it.. TIA:crazy:

[coastal]

No problem at all! It's smart to put all we know in one place...maybe together it will add up to something that will find her!

[TakeNote]

Things I find odd;

Lindsey comes home with friend, and takes a shower.
they had been swimming and perhaps mom said take a shower before you change into new clothesDoes she ask her mom if friend can spend the night?
this is what i thought i read, and is why she walked with friend home to friends house
Does mom say no, so she takes a shower and changes clothes in hopes of spending the night at friends house?

If she was planning on returning within an hour, why shower at that time?
Is she prone to taking a lot of showers throughout the day?

After taking a shower, she, her brother, and her friend, take a broken bike with them to friends house, but it and brother are sent home due to fighting.
Where did this happen? Who sent them home; this i would like to know also
or did they decide they didn't want to push the bike and threw it in the bushes, and the bro took off in another direction, b/c, if he was told to walk with his sister, and he went home, why wasn't he sent back to walk with his sister?

Where does mom work? i have heard the 5 cent to 5 dollar store What are her hours?

Why was Lindsey missing school, and her grades dropping. She likes her teacher, so that isn't it. She has plenty of friends so social outcast isn't the reason. this i would like to know also


If mom is gone when it's time to go to school, is she not responsible enough to get herself up, dressed, and on her way? I don't believe the divorce was troubling her. They had been seperated for a couple years. and she rarely saw her dad. I simply don't accept that reason for her dropping grades and missing school.
Was JB also missing a lot of school, were his grades also dropping?

How long had they lived at that address? i ran into someone who lives a couple of doors down and she told me 6 months

The nightmares could have been a result of her choice in movies, and books. moo i would really like to talk more into depth about this date of comment on her myspace
I read on the doctor website, don't know where it is now, that he observed the town blaming the mom for letting her out walking around that time of evening, but, I wonder if there is more to it than that. I wonder if mom isn't around much and the kids fend for themselves. I don't know this, I'm just asking.

I noticed during the vigil pics from cyber and JvK, thanks so much again, that JB is standing directly in front of his mom when she is talking into the mic.
My observation of this is "Look at Me, Mom" and I wonder what he's thinking.
All the other kids were sitting, paying attention, but he was restless, moving about.
Why? for attention? Didn't want to hear what was being said? Wished he was anywhere else but there?
Mom calls him a wanderer. To me, that says, she often doesn't know where he is or what he's doing.

And back to the shower thing, I find the timing of it an important clue. I'm not quite sure why.
One reason I think it's an important clue is b/c if she did shower with the hope she was going to spend the night with her friend at her friends house, wouldn't she have taken her cellphone. If she expected to come back with her friend in a hour, she might not take it, but would she take the time to shower?

Why was she "happy" her bro was going to juvi? Does she not understand what juvi is? or does she think he deserves it? or does he make her life so miserable that she prefers him in kiddie lock up, than at home? This is a clue, imo.


these are great questions that i have also wondered about...i hope you dont mind i put a few answers that i thought could be reasons .....

this is a great thread kimster......thanks for starting it.....: :blowkiss:

[kageykaren]

I know many adults think that these My Space pages are innocent as many teens wirte wierd stuff age appropriate for a display of teenage angst, fantasy, dreamy romance stuff ect... Lindsey's is however a bit different though. Lindsey's page is disturbing if not for just this one comment, as most 10 uy. olds don't describe themselves with a "Disturbed" label. The first thing that seems to jump out at me from all post above is that Lindsey is an old soul as far as understanding emotions that many 13 yr.olds aren't even able to assimulate. With this in mind and everything Lindsey, I find it odd she chose to put her My Space profile all in red with some heavy quotes icons. I see a angry fearful girl comming out that has shared to the world at least one thing that was bothering her and of course that would be brother as we have discussed. Some may say that Lindsey may have wanted her my space to resemble a teen and I'm only seeing a little bit of this displayed in her writings and that would be her show of music for her age as the bands she referred to are kind of geared to 16 yr.olds and up of course there are exceptions to the rule to be considered. I'v shared that I have a son who recorded on the highest selling albumn of the millineum so I'v been forced to to know the current climate in music. I guess I'm seeing more of a 10 yr. old with deep concerns in life and wanting to fit in with an older crowd. Sometimes I'v wondered if Mother Nature was just about to call on Lindsey creating so many emotions causing mom to refer to her as Drama Queen. One blessing I see for Lindsey was her scout troop as something she could count on to just be a kid. Maybe I'm to close to adolescents that have been in crisis and see things to critically but Lindsey hadn't even become an adolescent yet. I hope the family is staying strong to help LE because the problems in the family before Linsey went missing have increased ten fold obviuosly.

[LotsaLatte]

Great idea Kimster! :blowkiss: We have no idea if the nightmares and bad feelings about something happening are related to her disappearance. At this point, there is no way to know for sure.

some characteristics that have been said to describe Lindsey:

Raised her dog, Kadence, from puppyhood
loves her dog - loves animals
loves overnights with friends
loves to read - especially Harry Potter
Twilight fan
has nightmares
anticipates something bad is going to happen
grades dropping - mom thinks it's due to the divorce
missed many school days
afraid of the dark
got along well with her 5th grade teacher
loves to write
social child
had future aspirations - wanted to be a vet or a writer
happy brother is going to juvie
talkative child
drama queen
excited about her birthday on July 7th
parents separated and recently divorced
her mother is a single mom and works
Independent

Added from Coastal - post # 9

she sometimes ran the register at Mom's work ("5 Cents to 5 Bucks" store, Elma)
has long nails
she and her brother argue, and sometimes fight
has a MySpace profile named "disturbed"
seems comfortable with computer/internet
has a cell phone (which she left at home)
attended elementary school in Elma
attended _?_ church occasionally
is a Girl Scout


That's what I can think of off the top of my head - anyone else?

Bolded by me above - are we sure that's where MB works? Is that the same as Tasmanian Dollar Store (or something like that) that MM owns? And has anyone found out if MM's Boyfriend MD (no longer in real estate maybe) is possibly working at this store now? Not saying any of this is the case, just asking if anyone can tell me? And who are MB's co-workers - especially the one that presumably reported seeing LB (a few days after she disappeared?)
Also, if someone reported seeing LB almost immediately, does it seem odd that a possible co-worker of MB came forward days later and reported seeing LB at the same location? Just throwing it out there.

[Kimster]

Bolded by me above - are we sure that's where MB works? Is that the same as Tasmanian Dollar Store (or something like that) that MM owns? And has anyone found out if MM's Boyfriend MD (no longer in real estate maybe) is possibly working at this store now? Not saying any of this is the case, just asking if anyone can tell me? And who are MB's co-workers - especially the one that presumably reported seeing LB (a few days after she disappeared?)
Also, if someone reported seeing LB almost immediately, does it seem odd that a possible co-worker of MB came forward days later and reported seeing LB at the same location? Just throwing it out there.

It would be nice to even know if the co-worker was a woman..or a man?

[coastal]

Bolded by me above - are we sure that's where MB works? Is that the same as Tasmanian Dollar Store (or something like that) that MM owns? And has anyone found out if MM's Boyfriend MD (no longer in real estate maybe) is possibly working at this store now? Not saying any of this is the case, just asking if anyone can tell me? And who are MB's co-workers - especially the one that presumably reported seeing LB (a few days after she disappeared?)
Also, if someone reported seeing LB almost immediately, does it seem odd that a possible co-worker of MB came forward days later and reported seeing LB at the same location? Just throwing it out there.
Your question about where MB works keeps ringing in my head, so I'm going to go back and read from the beginning. I'll let you know what I find.

[SeriouslySearching]

Disturbed is a band, but of course we have no way to know if Lindsey liked them or maybe just thought the screenname was cool. It could speak to more than that, but then again...maybe not. I personally don't read too much into their screennames because of experience with my own kids.

I think we should look more at the content of her myspace page with the relationship references etc. They were definitely geared more towards an older teen. Did Lindsey have a boyfriend? Was there an older male in town she was chasing after? Was there an older male paying attention to her? She appeared to be living beyond her years in wanting a relationship and being in love. Was this from watching shows like Twilight or something in her real life which was going on that we are unaware of yet?

http://www.google.com/search?q=The+band+Disturbed&rls=com.microsoft:en-us:IE-SearchBox&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&sourceid=ie7&rlz=1I7SUNA

[kageykaren]

SS Thats exactly what I was trying to state in my post as well. "Disturbed" the band are artist endorcers for our guitar strap co. called Eyeland Guitar straps. The members are very nice so don't let looks be a judgement! This band is definately geared towards the teen and under thirty something males. It's kind of one of those bands that girls tend to rock to to impress guys. SS I feel your right that it seems Lindsey may have met someone older that pretended to be her night in shinning armore. One more possibility as school psychologist and educators put alot of stock into teens social sites due to Columbine and other tragedies so I'm sure FBI has gone over everything that pertains to Lindsey all social communications. Lindsey seemed older than her years on My Space instead of "The pretty in Pink" girls who flock to Jona Brothers, and chita girls.

[Kimster]

I wish we knew more about her fifth grade teacher. She liked her and girls at that age tend to be chatty with their teachers!

[Normcar21]

Thanks for this thread Kimster, I'll be using this one alot!

[TamgMit]

Things I find odd;

Lindsey comes home with friend, and takes a shower.
Does she ask her mom if friend can spend the night?
Does mom say no, so she takes a shower and changes clothes in hopes of spending the night at friends house?
If she was planning on returning within an hour, why shower at that time?
Is she prone to taking a lot of showers throughout the day?

After taking a shower, she, her brother, and her friend, take a broken bike with them to friends house, but it and brother are sent home due to fighting.
Where did this happen? Who sent them home;
or did they decide they didn't want to push the bike and threw it in the bushes, and the bro took off in another direction, b/c, if he was told to walk with his sister, and he went home, why wasn't he sent back to walk with his sister?

Where does mom work? What are her hours?

Why was Lindsey missing school, and her grades dropping. She likes her teacher, so that isn't it. She has plenty of friends so social outcast isn't the reason.
If mom is gone when it's time to go to school, is she not responsible enough to get herself up, dressed, and on her way? I don't believe the divorce was troubling her. They had been seperated for a couple years. and she rarely saw her dad. I simply don't accept that reason for her dropping grades and missing school.
Was JB also missing a lot of school, were his grades also dropping?

How long had they lived at that address?

The nightmares could have been a result of her choice in movies, and books. moo

I read on the doctor website, don't know where it is now, that he observed the town blaming the mom for letting her out walking around that time of evening, but, I wonder if there is more to it than that. I wonder if mom isn't around much and the kids fend for themselves. I don't know this, I'm just asking.

I noticed during the vigil pics from cyber and JvK, thanks so much again, that JB is standing directly in front of his mom when she is talking into the mic.
My observation of this is "Look at Me, Mom" and I wonder what he's thinking.
All the other kids were sitting, paying attention, but he was restless, moving about.
Why? for attention? Didn't want to hear what was being said? Wished he was anywhere else but there?
Mom calls him a wanderer. To me, that says, she often doesn't know where he is or what he's doing.

And back to the shower thing, I find the timing of it an important clue. I'm not quite sure why.
One reason I think it's an important clue is b/c if she did shower with the hope she was going to spend the night with her friend at her friends house, wouldn't she have taken her cellphone. If she expected to come back with her friend in a hour, she might not take it, but would she take the time to shower?

Why was she "happy" her bro was going to juvi? Does she not understand what juvi is? or does she think he deserves it? or does he make her life so miserable that she prefers him in kiddie lock up, than at home? This is a clue, imo.



You know when I was around LB age we use to go swimming down to the pond. I can remember I use to have this crush on a young man, lol first love. Anyways, we use to primp up if there was a chance we might meet up with boys. Hoping that he would at least catch his eye. Maybe this is one of the reason that LB took a shower maybe there was some hope or plan she was going to see this boy who she might have had a crush on.

[TamgMit]

What we do know she did go to KK for approximately 15 min enough time to take off her shoes according to KK and slip them back on prior to leaving. I also believe there was mention of kk was home, along with her boyfriend and four kids. Two of the children were her own. Do we know who the other kids, or persons where that where also at that house at that time. Was wondering if one of them might have been someone that LB was interested in or maybe had a crush on. Or could she have even been interested in KK's son. Just a thought

[kageykaren]

Has anyone heard any rumblings about the relationship between Mom Baum and KK as of late? Do they share a new type of friendship after weeks of rehashing the last hour Lindsey saw anyone? Are any hard feelings detected between the two adult women lately? I'm feeling like there is information LE has held back. Does finding MB's co worker remain to be difficult to slueth? Hopefully the FBI is looking at everyone with 3 to 4 degrees of separation to Lindsey as I feel she had been groomed by someone who offered "The perfect listening ear" casually towards Lindsey's very vocal valid complaints of her brother. This is the only verbal complaint we have by Lindsey that caused her elation when she realized he would be removed from the home. I'm seriously wondering also about Lindsey's missed school days and if some are from stomach issues. Stress, anxiety and fear reaction tend to settle in a childs stomach as they tend to not verbalize as adults. I keep remembering Tubas comment about brother, and I remaiin wondering if the perp also had befriended the brother. We keep hearing how friendly both kids are. So many questions as the days slip by.

[eyes4crime]

On what little I know and my logic, I'm going to rule out those who are not suspects. I know many have different ideas and that's what makes the world go round:

Mom Baum - no access to a car; no history of violence of any kind; willingly took a polygraph and passed. A loving, single mom who tries hard to make ends meet. Ruled out!

Josh Baum - a socially awkward child who seems to be the target of many. At 12 yo he doesn't have the skills to murder and dispose of human remains that go undetected by LE, FBI, peers, and the entire town of McCleary. I have no doubt Lindsey would have beaten the carp out of him if necessary. Ruled out!

Mom K - Doesn't drive; no history of violence; makes visible attempts to help find Lindsey on all fronts. Genuinely cares and tries to be helpful to many. Ruled out!
Mom K's live-in friend - willingly took a lie detector test and passed showing he has no need to be in the limelight or clutter the search for Lindsey. Ruled out!

Lindsey was last seen by two different people probably about one-two minutes apart between 5th & 6th and Maple...this is probably where she was approached and lured/taken...

1. by a person she was slightly familiar with who offered her a ride home - only to keep on driving.

2. by a slightly familiar person with a puppy, a disability, or pretending to be sick, lost, or in need of help.

3. by a person who presented as an authority figure.

or in an attempt to turn away from something that alarmed her, she turned and changed direction only to run into a more alarming situation.

to be continued....
Lindsey was taken near a somewhat busy intersection, close to the police station, and at a time when locals would be closing their business and heading home on a Friday night...about 9:15-9:30. With this in mind, I seriously believe this person knew the layout of the town and was familiar with McCleary's activity of a Friday night. Perhaps not a resident but a frequent visitor.

If Lindsey got in a car with someone familiar under the auspice of being driven home...and the car kept on driving...I hope every inch of woods and water have been searched off the road she lives on..Mommsen Road. That's it for now..sure not much to go on.

[Kimster]

Eyes, I am also interested in knowing more about those who saw Lindsey on her way home. We can't discount them when we know so little about them.

[sunni]

Things I find odd;

Lindsey comes home with friend, and takes a shower.
Does she ask her mom if friend can spend the night?
Does mom say no, so she takes a shower and changes clothes in hopes of spending the night at friends house?
If she was planning on returning within an hour, why shower at that time?
Is she prone to taking a lot of showers throughout the day?

After taking a shower, she, her brother, and her friend, take a broken bike with them to friends house, but it and brother are sent home due to fighting.
Where did this happen? Who sent them home;
or did they decide they didn't want to push the bike and threw it in the bushes, and the bro took off in another direction, b/c, if he was told to walk with his sister, and he went home, why wasn't he sent back to walk with his sister?

Where does mom work? What are her hours?

Why was Lindsey missing school, and her grades dropping. She likes her teacher, so that isn't it. She has plenty of friends so social outcast isn't the reason.
If mom is gone when it's time to go to school, is she not responsible enough to get herself up, dressed, and on her way? I don't believe the divorce was troubling her. They had been seperated for a couple years. and she rarely saw her dad. I simply don't accept that reason for her dropping grades and missing school.
Was JB also missing a lot of school, were his grades also dropping?

How long had they lived at that address?

The nightmares could have been a result of her choice in movies, and books. moo

I read on the doctor website, don't know where it is now, that he observed the town blaming the mom for letting her out walking around that time of evening, but, I wonder if there is more to it than that. I wonder if mom isn't around much and the kids fend for themselves. I don't know this, I'm just asking.

I noticed during the vigil pics from cyber and JvK, thanks so much again, that JB is standing directly in front of his mom when she is talking into the mic.
My observation of this is "Look at Me, Mom" and I wonder what he's thinking.
All the other kids were sitting, paying attention, but he was restless, moving about.
Why? for attention? Didn't want to hear what was being said? Wished he was anywhere else but there?
Mom calls him a wanderer. To me, that says, she often doesn't know where he is or what he's doing.

And back to the shower thing, I find the timing of it an important clue. I'm not quite sure why.
One reason I think it's an important clue is b/c if she did shower with the hope she was going to spend the night with her friend at her friends house, wouldn't she have taken her cellphone. If she expected to come back with her friend in a hour, she might not take it, but would she take the time to shower?

Why was she "happy" her bro was going to juvi? Does she not understand what juvi is? or does she think he deserves it? or does he make her life so miserable that she prefers him in kiddie lock up, than at home? This is a clue, imo.

I am way behind here & sorry if someone already thought of this, but is it possible she showered because they had been swimming that day?

I know I usually do, but thats just me...

[STEADFAST]

Wow, this thread is great! Really important questions and observations.

You know, I just can't get the Bee Hive retirement center off my mind in relation to this case.
1. It's right where Lindsey was last seen.
2. "Outsiders" would not be noticed there -- employee's, visitors, etc. (Even a complete stranger could be parked in the lot.)
3. According to jvk, most, if not all, of it wasn't searched during the original search.

[DotsEyes]

House to house search sounds like someone is hiding her.

[eyes4crime]

Eyes, I am also interested in knowing more about those who saw Lindsey on her way home. We can't discount them when we know so little about them.

I agree Kimster...there are two calls with very similar information about time and place. If that wasn't the case and there was only one call...my inclination would be to ignore the info. At least one of the calls is legit and I feel tells us a great deal of info. jmo

[Kimster]

Another thing I don't remember that I'd like to revisit was Lindsey's time after the bike fight. She and friend walked to friend's house...remind me how long she stayed there? KK and her BF were home and other people were there as well, weren't they? How much do we know about interactions at the time she was there before she left to go home again?

[eyes4crime]

Another thing I don't remember that I'd like to revisit was Lindsey's time after the bike fight. She and friend walked to friend's house...remind me how long she stayed there? KK and her BF were home and other people were there as well, weren't they? How much do we know about interactions at the time she was there before she left to go home again?

Hi Kimster! Here is my logic and take on the walk: Since there were 3 kids walking together going to mom K's home, I doubt we really know the facts about the walk...children are terrible reporters; extremely inaccurate. Their times are way off and each child interprets differently. So I'm not sure about the 'bike fight' and the walk to mom K's. All the two mom's know, and what we know, is what was reported by the kids.

Once at the house (somewhere around 9:00pm?), we know Lindsey was there long enough to ask about the over-night; she and her friend were told 'no'...Lindsey was told she better get going 'cause it was soon to be dark. (seems most everyone knows of Lindsey's fear of the dark). I believe mom K and her live-in boyfriend were there along with the 4 kids...I doubt they noted any exact times pertaining to arrival or exits of Lindsey...why would they? Nobody was preparing for a tragedy ( I know I don't think of noting exact time except when I have appointments to keep). I have no idea what took place amongst the 2 adults and 5 kids at that time.

Lindsey left and was watched by her friend 'till she was no longer visible. Lindsey was seen around 9:15 or so walking down Maple by a passer by. Somehow the timing of all that makes sense to me.

Considering children are doing the reporting regarding their walk - and once at the home, it may have been chaotic with all the kids - who knows for sure who was talking with whom and for how long.

this is how I see the walk and time at mom K's...everyone will have their own interpretation and that's good...that leads to many diverse possibilities.

[Kimster]

I am way behind here & sorry if someone already thought of this, but is it possible she showered because they had been swimming that day?

I know I usually do, but thats just me...

My mom made me shower BEFORE I went in the pool, not after. We all have our "things"! LOL

[Track292008]

snipped:
Mom K - Doesn't drive; no history of violence; makes visible attempts to help find Lindsey on all fronts. Genuinely cares and tries to be helpful to many. Ruled out!


I don't recall hearing or reading that Kayla's mother doesn't drive. That seems most unusual for a person today, and I wonder if anyone knows the reason. TIA.

[Haddie McFaddies Mom]

In the process of reviewing all news articles within the Media Thread in Lindsey's Forum. Does this help at all? I don't know, or does it only add to the conflicting statements and location of Lindsey's last known whereabouts? I don't even know what I'm doing besides going around in circles, but while obsessing, I might as well try and be productive. :confused:

Lindsey J. Baum was last seen at roughly 9:15 p.m. on Maple Street.
http://www.king5.com/topstories/stor....11d86a7b.html

Witnesses say Lindsey seemed normal as she headed out around 9:15. Another friend even walked her part of the way, but Lindsey never showed up at her home. (??) (bolded by me)
http://www.komonews.com/news/local/49383897.html

The last person to see Lindsey was a resident driving through town who saw her walking on Maple Street between Fifth and Sixth streets around 9:15 p.m. Scott said.
ttp://www.theolympian.com/southsound/story/896613.html

She would have walked down Maple and would have had to cross 3rd Street, which is a main road in the town and has a crosswalk. At that point she would have had a short walk through a commercial area, including a nearby bus station and a gas station. She would have had to cross the larger street, then back onto a residential street without a sidewalk and head down to her house at the 300 block of Mommsen Street, a dead-end residential neighborhood within view of the police station.
But a minute or two before she crossed 3rd Street, she disappeared. A neighbor spotted her about two-thirds of the way home, Scott said.
http://www.thedailyworld.com/article...5957341684.txt

The friend who last saw Lindsey also addressed the crowd. She said the girls asked if Lindsey could spend the night at her house, but when her parents said no, the girls parted. “I saw her at the end of Maple (Street),” the girl said.
http://www.thedailyworld.com/article...2474655699.txt

Lindsey was last seen at the corner of 6th and Maple heading home from her friend's house at about 9:15 p.m last Friday.
http://www.komonews.com/news/local/49891642.html

On Wednesday a second person came forward to report having seen Lindsey Baum on Friday night as she walked home along Maple Street from a friend's house.
http://www.komonews.com/news/49651607.html

I guess what jumps out at me is the statement about another friend walking her part of the way. (Misreported?) :waitasec:

and that this:The friend who last saw Lindsey also addressed the crowd. She said the girls asked if Lindsey could spend the night at her house, but when her parents said no, the girls parted.

conflicts with this: “She wasn’t intentionally supposed to be alone,” Melissa Baum said. “She was with a friend and was supposed to come back together.
http://www.thedailyworld.com/article...4694664243.txt

If they were asking if they could spend the night at MK's, why would MB think Lindsey was supposed to come back "together"?

My next post is going to be about what LE "thinks" based on the statements they have made, so if you think this post has you confused, just wait :crazy:

Me - :bang::confused::waitasec::banghead::sheesh::beers ign::drink::crosseyed:

[TamgMit]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_8gqOeVStjw&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Ecrimenews2000%2Ecom%2Fnews %2Ephp%3Fextend%2E1113&feature=player_embedded

I was just wondering about the feelings Shannon. It states she usually walks her dog every night except for the night LB disappeared. What made her feel uncomfortable about walking the dog that night. Was something going on prior in the area to LB going missing, that gave her these bad feelings. Was there someone new in the area that she might have seen that made her uneasy. I know I am kind of grabbing at straws and going around in circles. She seemed to think or was aware something was a not right that she wasn't going to take the risk of walking the dog that night..jmo

[JenniferO]

The bad feelings that the woman, who usually walks her dog, is talking about is the bad feelings she has now. She feels bad because she thinks if she had walked her dog that night Lindsey might not have disappeared.

[scandi]

Another thing I don't remember that I'd like to revisit was Lindsey's time after the bike fight. She and friend walked to friend's house...remind me how long she stayed there? KK and her BF were home and other people were there as well, weren't they? How much do we know about interactions at the time she was there before she left to go home again?

Hi Kimster, I don't know if KK was home or not!

I hope I can say this here, but I read a comment she wrote, somewhere Ah-Hmmmm, where she said she was not home when Lindsey left.

It contradicts what is out there, saying she told Lindsey to go home. Well actually I think it was her BF who told Lindsey to go home before it got dark, right? I am quite sure she has said that.

What got me thinking about this Kimster is in your intro timeline there was something that shouted RED FLAG at me as loud as it could. That her cell phone was being charged at the time Lindsey left. It just seems like an incongruity, MONK-like in feeling, that it could be a big clue as to the truth about what was going on when Lindsey left that home.


It is going to be something like this - an overlooked clue, something said that does not fit, or something not said about something that triggers the mind of just one investigator working on the case. God, let it be the reason. Lindsey needs to be found.

If I had not read the comment she wrote in a post about NOT BEING THERE this would never have entered my mind. I think her comments have been confusing as they continually changed from A to Z. That is never a good sign. And I don't think she was involved but for some reason can not just spit it out, the truth about the situation that night. She knows something. It could be why LE has been watching her. I would too!

[boondock]

Hi Kimster, I don't know if KK was home or not!

I hope I can say this here, but I read a comment she wrote, somewhere Ah-Hmmmm, where she said she was not home when Lindsey left.

It contradicts what is out there, saying she told Lindsey to go home. Well actually I think it was her BF who told Lindsey to go home before it got dark, right? I am quite sure she has said that.

What got me thinking about this Kimster is in your intro timeline there was something that shouted RED FLAG at me as loud as it could. That her cell phone was being charged at the time Lindsey left. It just seems like an incongruity, MONK-like in feeling, that it could be a big clue as to the truth about what was going on when Lindsey left that home.


It is going to be something like this - an overlooked clue, something said that does not fit, or something not said about something that triggers the mind of just one investigator working on the case. God, let it be the reason. Lindsey needs to be found.

If I had not read the comment she wrote in a post about NOT BEING THERE this would never have entered my mind. I think her comments have been confusing as they continually changed from A to Z. That is never a good sign. And I don't think she was involved but for some reason can not just spit it out, the truth about the situation that night. She knows something. It could be why LE has been watching her. I would too!

I don't recall KK making this comment and thought I had followed her online pretty good :eek:

[scandi]

In the process of reviewing all news articles within the Media Thread in Lindsey's Forum. Does this help at all? I don't know, or does it only add to the conflicting statements and location of Lindsey's last known whereabouts? I don't even know what I'm doing besides going around in circles, but while obsessing, I might as well try and be productive. :confused:

Lindsey J. Baum was last seen at roughly 9:15 p.m. on Maple Street.
http://www.king5.com/topstories/stor....11d86a7b.html

Witnesses say Lindsey seemed normal as she headed out around 9:15. Another friend even walked her part of the way, but Lindsey never showed up at her home. (??) (bolded by me)
http://www.komonews.com/news/local/49383897.html

The last person to see Lindsey was a resident driving through town who saw her walking on Maple Street between Fifth and Sixth streets around 9:15 p.m. Scott said.
ttp://www.theolympian.com/southsound/story/896613.html

She would have walked down Maple and would have had to cross 3rd Street, which is a main road in the town and has a crosswalk. At that point she would have had a short walk through a commercial area, including a nearby bus station and a gas station. She would have had to cross the larger street, then back onto a residential street without a sidewalk and head down to her house at the 300 block of Mommsen Street, a dead-end residential neighborhood within view of the police station.
But a minute or two before she crossed 3rd Street, she disappeared. A neighbor spotted her about two-thirds of the way home, Scott said.
http://www.thedailyworld.com/article...5957341684.txt

The friend who last saw Lindsey also addressed the crowd. She said the girls asked if Lindsey could spend the night at her house, but when her parents said no, the girls parted. “I saw her at the end of Maple (Street),” the girl said.
http://www.thedailyworld.com/article...2474655699.txt

Lindsey was last seen at the corner of 6th and Maple heading home from her friend's house at about 9:15 p.m last Friday.
http://www.komonews.com/news/local/49891642.html

On Wednesday a second person came forward to report having seen Lindsey Baum on Friday night as she walked home along Maple Street from a friend's house.
http://www.komonews.com/news/49651607.html

I guess what jumps out at me is the statement about another friend walking her part of the way. (Misreported?) :waitasec:

and that this:The friend who last saw Lindsey also addressed the crowd. She said the girls asked if Lindsey could spend the night at her house, but when her parents said no, the girls parted.

conflicts with this: “She wasn’t intentionally supposed to be alone,” Melissa Baum said. “She was with a friend and was supposed to come back together.
http://www.thedailyworld.com/article...4694664243.txt

If they were asking if they could spend the night at MK's, why would MB think Lindsey was supposed to come back "together"?

My next post is going to be about what LE "thinks" based on the statements they have made, so if you think this post has you confused, just wait :crazy:

Me - :bang::confused::waitasec::banghead::sheesh::beers ign::drink::crosseyed:

Hi Sweetie, and Yes, it is super confusing. KK is the one who made the air go hazy by saying on the way to her house the girls changed their mind and decided they would rather spend the night at KK's instead of MB's. That is the only place we have heard this, from her mouth, changing what we heard from Lindsey's Mom.

That is BIG IMO, as Lindsey's Mom has never addressed this issue.

So: Lindsey's Mom expected her to be coming back that night and she waited until 10pm until alarm bells rang in her head and she said something is not right here to herself :eek:, and without a car she proceeded on foot to try and go find her daughter.

Then there must have been a communication between her and KK {whose cellie was being charged at the time :confused:}, and they met up and since MB's car was not running and KK doesn't drive {no license evidently, or for some other reason}, and ended up in a car together searching for Lindsey.

We need to go back to the beginning. Something with this situation does not add up IMO. What is it that is off here? It does not fit, or am I too involved in this case to see it in a simple way that spells out the truth?

:blowkiss:

[scandi]

I don't recall KK making this comment and thought I had followed her online pretty good :eek:

I did read it Boondock and it was like the feeling one would get if they were walking over a bed of vertical red hot nails in India. Jagged me it did, as it so opposite to everything else we had read.

I had asked her a question about the witness and where she lived - maybe 3 weeks ago. That was about the time I read that. She quit posting not long after that and I don't know if she deleted any of her posts. I do think I will delve into it though. The point could be so major, a slip of the tongue through her fingers so to speak.

I have thought about this one point so much and never said anything. BTW, she wrote she would clarify what she thought about that witness and where they lived that she wrote. She never did :confused: xox



PSS: Animal, if you want me to delete this post I will. I am just trying to find out the truth of what happened.

[boondock]

scandi, I think I found the comment you're talking about, I believe KK meant she wasn't there when JB was told to go home

[scandi]

scandi, I think I found the comment you're talking about, I believe KK meant she wasn't there when JB was told to go home

You're a http://www.xrtheme.com/content/emoticons/Kids/12.gif Boondock, and thanks for the response to my post.

Do we really know that JB made it all the way to her house? I think that is is a big gray area. I'm glad you found the comment I read so I know I'm not dillusional http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/dirtbox/pics/muttley.gif. Gee, you know, you get so passionate about a case you are studying and when you have a 'brain fart', you have to bring it down to a yea or nay. Rule it in or rule it out.

There just has to be some BIG CLUE we have not noticed yet. Tiny things make a difference. xox xox

[eyes4crime]

I don't recall KK making this comment and thought I had followed her online pretty good :eek:

Hi there boondock! mom K did make that comment and that's the reason I put it in the time-line. Mom K said she didn't know when mom Baum started calling her cause her phone was dead. Eventually mom Baum reached her and that's why they started searching for Lindsey late...around 10:20 or so, by car. I thought it was unfortunate because mom Baum started looking for Lindsey on foot around 10:00 and joined mom K and boyfriend in a car around 10:20 - 10:30. Mom K wasn't anticipating any traumatic event that night and it could very well be her phone was as dead as Lindsey's. Remember mom K doesn't drive and her boyfriend took, and passed, a lie detector test. LE cleared them! :confused:

Mom Baum thought Lindsey would be walking home with her brother and would not be alone. If I was going to question anyone it would be the person who sent Josh home...and even than that person had no idea Lindsey would be walking home alone. Soooo confusing!

[scandi]

Hi there boondock! mom K did make that comment and that's the reason I put it in the time-line. Mom K said she didn't know when mom Baum started calling her cause her phone was dead. Eventually mom Baum reached her and that's why they started searching for Lindsey late...around 10:20 or so, by car. I thought it was unfortunate because mom Baum started looking for Lindsey on foot around 10:00 and joined mom K and boyfriend in a car around 10:20 - 10:30. Mom K wasn't anticipating any traumatic event that night and it could very well be her phone was as dead as Lindsey's. Remember mom K doesn't drive and her boyfriend took, and passed, a lie detector test. LE cleared them! :confused:

Hi Eyes, See, all that you have said in that post that you have diligently written makes no sense and creates big ??? Marks in the case IMO.

What I truly think is she said her phone was being charged because she was otherwise occupied or not home when the whole fiasco of Lindsey being sent home happened. And a logical reason would be, OH! My phone was charging. I was incommunicado!

And yet 45 min or so later she met up with Lindsey's Mom, they were in a car driving around and then at 10:40 or so MB called the police to report Lindsey was missing.

I don't think KK is involved at all in her disappearance, nor is Lindsey's Mom. I do think KK's changeable story line reflects things that she doesn't want to put out there. Who knows why? We all know of 2 occasions where our steadfast posters were on scene, each speaking to her, and LE made themselves present to our posters. That says so much to me.

A woman who went online right away to discuss the case when she was one of the last to see Lindsey. A woman who never volunteered to take a lie detector test. Add it up and I think this whole scenario and what was really going on that night needs to be re-examined again from the get go.

That is what is always done to solve a COLD case, and we aren't even cold yet. Kimster has given us this platform to try and find out the RED FLAGS, in starting all over again. I just think something isn't ringing true about what KK has put out there, like a decoy duck, sitting all pretty to look real. And what she says doesn't add up. You wouldn't have any dinner if you were going by her! xox

[eyes4crime]

I think it's important to remember that 3 kids walked to mom K's together

Lindsey isn't around to give her version of the walk
Josh - was sent home at some point in time and I'm sure his memory is somewhat traumatized by the loss of his sister
friend K - gives her version which may be totally INaccurate.

Children are notorious for their POOR reporting and inaccurate eye witness accounts. Cognitively, children are very poor at sequencing events especially when it involves time. They add their own interpretation and most often are very inacurate. These are the reports the two moms are going on...so expect many inconsistencies and inaccuracies.

Have you ever sat down with a 10yo who is telling you of an important event at school that needs accuracy? Yikes! At about 1/2 hour you'd like to put a million word limit on them. And these are children not traumatized by the loss of a sister or friend. I always keep that in mind when dealing with the inconsistencies of children...they are NOT good little eye-witness reporters. If I want accuracy - I don't go to a child!!!

[scandi]

Hi there boondock! mom K did make that comment and that's the reason I put it in the time-line. Mom K said she didn't know when mom Baum started calling her cause her phone was dead. Eventually mom Baum reached her and that's why they started searching for Lindsey late...around 10:20 or so, by car. I thought it was unfortunate because mom Baum started looking for Lindsey on foot around 10:00 and joined mom K and boyfriend in a car around 10:20 - 10:30. Mom K wasn't anticipating any traumatic event that night and it could very well be her phone was as dead as Lindsey's. Remember mom K doesn't drive and her boyfriend took, and passed, a lie detector test. LE cleared them! :confused:

Mom Baum thought Lindsey would be walking home with her brother and would not be alone. If I was going to question anyone it would be the person who sent Josh home...and even than that person had no idea Lindsey would be walking home alone. Soooo confusing!

Hi Eyes, I never read that MB thought Lindsey and JB would be walking home together. I only read at 10pm she knew something was wrong because Lindsey was not home yet, and she went out walking to try to find her. xox I actually heard her say that on a video.

[eyes4crime]

Hi Eyes, See, all that you have said in that post that you have diligently written makes no sense and creates big ??? Marks in the case IMO.

What I truly think is she said her phone was being charged because she was otherwise occupied or not home when the whole fiasco of Lindsey being sent home happened. And a logical reason would be, OH! My phone was charging. I was incommunicado!

And yet 45 min or so later she met up with Lindsey's Mom, they were in a car driving around and then at 10:40 or so MB called the police to report Lindsey was missing.

I don't think KK is involved at all in her disappearance, nor is Lindsey's Mom. I do think KK's changeable story line reflects things that she doesn't want to put out there. Who knows why? We all know of 2 occasions where our steadfast posters were on scene, each speaking to her, and LE made themselves present to our posters. That says so much to me.

A woman who went online right away to discuss the case when she was one of the last to see Lindsey. A woman who never volunteered to take a lie detector test. Add it up and I think this whole scenario and what was really going on that night needs to be re-examined again from the get go.

That is what is always done to solve a COLD case, and we aren't even cold yet. Kimster has given us this platform to try and find out the RED FLAGS, in starting all over again. I just think something isn't ringing true about what KK has put out there, like a decoy duck, sitting all pretty to look real. And what she says doesn't add up. You wouldn't have any dinner if you were going by her! xox

You're so right - no dinner! :) I'm was totally confused by the communication between the two moms and I thought what mom K said made it even more confusing. When I read her explanation about her phone charging I included it in the time-line...not because it made sense but because it was some explanation why her and mom Baum didn't hook up earlier. I have another time-line that includes her many statements because I think it's important to keep track of them within a time-line. I included them at first and noted they weren't cleared by LE. and was than told to delete them so I did. Every line in that time-line could have been offset by another 3-4 versions; by LE; by mom Baum; and by mom K. NOBODY has made an attempt to be accurate. NO press conferences to clear up contradictions. Yikes...this case is crazy! I think it's best that I leave this case until there is new information that is accurate. I responded at first just to clear up the time-line. Sorry if you thought I I was trying to correct your thinking on this matter.

[eyes4crime]

Hi Eyes, I never read that MB thought Lindsey and JB would be walking home together. I only read at 10pm she knew something was wrong because Lindsey was not home yet, and she went out walking to try to find her. xox I actually heard her say that on a video.

I heard her say she thought Lindsey would be walking back with her brother if the overnight was a 'no'....that's why she sent him along. I heard that several times. Gosh...the reporting on this case has been terrible.

[scandi]

I think it's important to remember that 3 kids walked to mom K's together

Lindsey isn't around to give her version of the walk
Josh - was sent home at some point in time and I'm sure his memory is somewhat traumatized by the loss of his sister
friend K - gives her version which may be totally INaccurate.

Children are notorious for their POOR reporting and inaccurate eye witness accounts. Cognitively, children are very poor at sequencing events especially when it involves time. They add their own interpretation and most often are very inacurate. These are the reports the two moms are going on...so expect many inconsistencies and inaccuracies.

Have you ever sat down with a 10yo who is telling you of an important event at school that needs accuracy? Yikes! At about 1/2 hour you'd like to put a million word limit on them. And these are children not traumatized by the loss of a sister or friend. I always keep that in mind when dealing with the inconsistencies of children...they are NOT good little eye-witness reporters. If I want accuracy - I don't go to a child!!!

I so agree with you they are the world's worst eyewitnesses because of their age. xox

[scandi]

I heard her say she thought Lindsey would be walking back with her brother if the overnight was a 'no'....that's why she sent him along. I heard that several times. Gosh...the reporting on this case has been terrible.

It sure is terrible Eyes, I watched one video where MB discussed this very thing. I could be wrong, but what I came away with had nothing to do with JB. He wasn't involved in an overnight stay, and the last I read the argument happened behind the Shell Station on the way to KK's house. We know the bike was ditched there, or I should say discovered there a couple of days after she went missing. I think it was just left there and if JB walked all the way up to KK's house after he was told to take the bike back home, he doesn't mind too well.

It has been a weird day for me all day, so if I am too strong here I am sorry.

Something isn't right about the whole scenario from the incept of her going missing and leaving KK's house. All the "she walked down 6th till the trees covered her, MK couldn't see her anymore, then the dogs followed her scent south on 6th, the witness could have lived on Simpson between 5th and 6th, etc. I think is it mumbo jumbo because something known might not be safe or smart for someone to tell at this point in time. It is the only thing I can think of and it is at the nub of the whole case!

xox

[scandi]

You're so right - no dinner! :) I'm was totally confused by the communication between the two moms and I thought what mom K said made it even more confusing. When I read her explanation about her phone charging I included it in the time-line...not because it made sense but because it was some explanation why her and mom Baum didn't hook up earlier. I have another time-line that includes her many statements because I think it's important to keep track of them within a time-line. I included them at first and noted they weren't cleared by LE. and was than told to delete them so I did. Every line in that time-line could have been offset by another 3-4 versions; by LE; by mom Baum; and by mom K. NOBODY has made an attempt to be accurate. NO press conferences to clear up contradictions. Yikes...this case is crazy! I think it's best that I leave this case until there is new information that is accurate. I responded at first just to clear up the time-line. Sorry if you thought I I was trying to correct your thinking on this matter.

No Eyes, both of us are trying to make sense in the matter of the timeline. Something just jumped out at me about the phone and I see why you wrote what you did. At this point we can only write down what we have read. What confuses the issue is conflicting statements from someone who is within a hairs width of a young girl vanishing, not yet seen and with no idea as to where she has gone.

So little has been confirmed by LE. We know they are hot on it, and yet it is so difficult to make sense of what happened with what we have been told by them. That is why I am going to statements that are close to a 'first witness' in the case, if she really was. xox xox

[Kimster]

My hinky meter is going bonkers now! I was wondering at the time I started this thread if we would be getting tied up at KK's house and now here we are! The reason I've been hinky over her was one comment...and I think it was something she blogged on the other site...She was asked about something and she changed the story saying she had to go back and ask her daughter that part again. I'm up too late now to go back and hunt it down...but I just remember thinking "now why wouldn't she have already gotten every detail from her daughter about that night BY NOW?" Then the dogs scent...There's starting to be too many loose ends with her now.

At first I thought that there might have been some negligence on her part...like maybe she insisted Lindsey leave and didn't really think about her welfare as far as walking home alone and now feels guilty, so she's covering up her involvement in that manner. It still might be something like that and has nothing to do with Lindsey's disappearance...or it could be something way more serious.

I definately feel KK is feeling very guilty about something.

[scandi]

deleted as double post due to hyperactive mouse! LOL

[scandi]

My hinky meter is going bonkers now! I was wondering at the time I started this thread if we would be getting tied up at KK's house and now here we are! The reason I've been hinky over her was one comment...and I think it was something she blogged on the other site...She was asked about something and she changed the story saying she had to go back and ask her daughter that part again. I'm up too late now to go back and hunt it down...but I just remember thinking "now why wouldn't she have already gotten every detail from her daughter about that night BY NOW?" Then the dogs scent...There's starting to be too many loose ends with her now.

At first I thought that there might have been some negligence on her part...like maybe she insisted Lindsey leave and didn't really think about her welfare as far as walking home alone and now feels guilty, so she's covering up her involvement in that manner. It still might be something like that and has nothing to do with Lindsey's disappearance...or it could be something way more serious.

I definately feel KK is feeling very guilty about something.


I think we all agree Kimster that something is afoot. We would never realize this if KK hadn't made all those changing statements! She must remember everything her daughter has told her about what happened. That always bugged me too, to have to fo clarify something with MK. Are posters gullible or what? LOL

It is the reality of what happened that evening that is of optimum importance. LE must feel the same way we do, her statements conflict and don't add up, or they would not have been staying so close to her in an undercover manner as they were, what, 2 1/2 weeks into the case? Bizarre. I am trying to think of another case where someone so close to the disappearance of a child has gone out of their way like KK has to openly discuss an active case on a public forum. Too much with it, changing what she has already said to reflect a very different scenario.

Well, enough said, but I bet she rue's the day she ever started discussing Lindsey's case with the general public. As though what she said to change what we had read would change it for real! It shows very little respect for Lindsey IMO. xox

[Track292008]

Because Lindsey is a Girl Scout, I wonder if she went door-to-door selling cookies earlier this year, and attracted the eye of someone who lives in the neighborhood where she was last seen, i.e., her own neighborhood.

Remember that Danielle Van Dam (sp?) had been selling cookies to her neighbors, including her abductor/killer whose name, IIRC, is Westerfield.

Just something to think about....and MOO.

[kageykaren]

Hi everyone stopping by before leaving for Aberdeen to call on music stores and thenMcCleary. Remember the old saying when refering to KK. "Thou protest too much" She can't keep still and we know what that means in profiling. Today is the day Tuba discussed as being an important day in Lindsey's investigation. Also don't forget Tubas post I think on July ist post 7??? Descibing the triangle of perps! On the road again. I find it just alitttle bit ironic to go to Mc Cleary on today. We just want to get a feel of the climate in town.

[Haddie McFaddies Mom]

You're so right - no dinner! :) I'm was totally confused by the communication between the two moms and I thought what mom K said made it even more confusing. When I read her explanation about her phone charging I included it in the time-line...not because it made sense but because it was some explanation why her and mom Baum didn't hook up earlier. I have another time-line that includes her many statements because I think it's important to keep track of them within a time-line. I included them at first and noted they weren't cleared by LE. and was than told to delete them so I did. Every line in that time-line could have been offset by another 3-4 versions; by LE; by mom Baum; and by mom K. NOBODY has made an attempt to be accurate. NO press conferences to clear up contradictions. Yikes...this case is crazy! I think it's best that I leave this case until there is new information that is accurate. I responded at first just to clear up the time-line. Sorry if you thought I I was trying to correct your thinking on this matter.

I would LOVE to see that Timeline eyes! There's no way to incorporate it into a post? (Yup, that's me .... always trying to coax the "other person" into trouble :D )

Totally agree: "NOBODY has made an attempt to be accurate. NO press conferences to clear up contradictions."

I've admired the way LE has handled some of the other high profile cases recently in their dedication to the press conference. It sends a clear message - we're not messing around, and we are not apathetic to the fact that our babies are being taken, killed, and abused right under our noses! The Sheriff that sat with the Baum's on the Early Morning Show was a poor representative of whatever drive LE may have in sending that message in Lindsey's case!

And TOTALLY disagree: "I think it's best that I leave this case until there is new information that is accurate. "

We would definitely notice you were gone eyes, and you would be missed! Please stick around ~ Lindsey needs us all!
:blowkiss:

[scandi]

Hi everyone stopping by before leaving for Aberdeen to call on music stores and thenMcCleary. Remember the old saying when refering to KK. "Thou protest too much" She can't keep still and we know what that means in profiling. Today is the day Tuba discussed as being an important day in Lindsey's investigation. Also don't forget Tubas post I think on July ist post 7??? Descibing the triangle of perps! On the road again. I find it just alitttle bit ironic to go to Mc Cleary on today. We just want to get a feel of the climate in town.

Hi Karen, I'll be looking forward to hearing your thoughts after your visit to McCleary today. Am off to work too but will see y'all tonight. I hope this is a 'trigger' day for finding Lindsey. xox

[scandi]

I would LOVE to see that Timeline eyes! There's no way to incorporate it into a post? (Yup, that's me .... always trying to coax the "other person" into trouble :D )

Totally agree: "NOBODY has made an attempt to be accurate. NO press conferences to clear up contradictions."

I've admired the way LE has handled some of the other high profile cases recently in their dedication to the press conference. It sends a clear message - we're not messing around, and we are not apathetic to the fact that our babies are being taken, killed, and abused right under our noses! The Sheriff that sat with the Baum's on the Early Morning Show was a poor representative of whatever drive LE may have in sending that message in Lindsey's case!

And TOTALLY disagree: "I think it's best that I leave this case until there is new information that is accurate. "

We would definitely notice you were gone eyes, and you would be missed! Please stick around ~ Lindsey needs us all!
:blowkiss:

ITA with your whole post Haddie.

I also remember the passion in Chief Corona's voice and his disposition when he addressed the public and led the multi agency investigation after little Samantha Runion was abducted. We all just knew he meant serious business and they were 'on it'. xox

[kageykaren]

I would love to know and I feel it is vital to the investigation of Lindsey that we know what adult or adults JB became close to at the beginning of summer.

[SailorMoon]

Where is this girl?? Why isn't more being done to find her??? Sad..so sad.

Sorry meant to be in general thread...but I'll leave it as I don't get these kids vanishing without a trace.

[ClueMan]

Something I would like to throw in to the mix that I have not seen given a lot of thought to (and I hope LE and the FBI have considered in their infinite wisdom) is McCleary's proximity to I-5.

Hwy 108 which passes through McCleary as a short cut to Hwy 101 and Shelton is a very well traveled road with the Little Creek Casino at the other end and could possibly have served as the route in to town by LB's abductor(s) if they were not from McCleary.

In the 45 minutes that passed from the last time LB was seen to when MB began her foot search the abductor(s) could have easily reached I-5 via Olympia or Grand Mound.

In the over one and a half hours before MB called LE the abductor(s) could have reached about half way between here where I live in Raymond and Astoria, gotten well south of Chehalis or even made it to nearly I-90 to the north. If you recall the Hwy 16/I-90 area was used by both Ted and Green River Gary.

Then of coarse there is the hundreds if not thousands of miles of logging roads not just around McCleary but all over southwest Washington.

Just some foiod for thought that I pray to God is wrong.

[JenniferO]

Somethings I would like to throw in to the mix that I have not seen given a lot of thought to (and I hope LE and the FBI have considered in their infinite wisdom) is McCleary's proximity to I-5.

Hwy 108 which passes through McCleary as a short cut to Hwy 101 and Shelton is a very well traveled road with the Little Creek Casino at the other end and could possibly have served as the route in to town by LB's abductor(s) if they were not from McCleary.

In the 45 minutes that passed from the last time LB was seen to when MB began her foot search the abductor(s) could have easily reached I-5 via Olympia or Grand Mound.

In the over one and a half hours before MB called LE the abductor(s) could have reached about half way between here where I live in Raymond and Astoria, gotten well south of Chehalis or even made it to nearly I-90 to the north. If you recall the Hwy 16/I-90 area was used by both Ted and Green River Gary.

Then of coarse there is the hundreds if not thousands of miles of logging roads not just around McCleary but all over southwest Washington.

I brought up the same exact things in the very beginning. I'm sure LE and the FBI have thought about this.
I can't speak for anyone but myself but I think this was a local and he's put her body someplace close by. More than likely somewhere out in those hundreds of miles of logging roads.

[ClueMan]

I brought up the same exact things in the very beginning. I'm sure LE and the FBI have thought about this.
I can't speak for anyone but myself but I think this was a local and he's put her body someplace close by. More than likely somewhere out in those hundreds of miles of logging roads.

I very much agree with the local aspect as those of us that have been to McCleary know a 10 year old could walk from one end of town to the other in nothing flat.

One thing that has been sort of rubbing at me are her MySpace pages. I could see a predator homing in on them. Do we know if she had been exchanging emails with anyone on them?

[JenniferO]

FBI looked into her computer use. I don't know if they ever released an official answer to what she was doing online or not.

[kageykaren]

FBI has a team from the Forensic Behavioral Unit that striclyt deals with Computer Forensics. This is most likely why these pages are still up. I agree that prebuescent girls like Lindsey should have parents checking these out. It only takes one perp to troll and intice which is why this team looks at every chat connection and those connecting to it. Gotta love these guys. I also feel the perp is someone of a third degree of separtion and knows her family. My only issue is why would law enforcement not act if they new the party or parties to this crime. The only reason I can come up with is their making a case and want to make sure it is solid. Lets pray this is the case and the search Fri. will weed them out and a confession happens. Probably wishful thinking but it keeps me going and remembering FBI aren't slouches when they enter into an investigation. Lindsey has them on her side, some children don't.

[Haddie McFaddies Mom]

FBI looked into her computer use. I don't know if they ever released an official answer to what she was doing online or not.

Hi JenniferO ~

Here's what I have copy and pasted into my word document of press releases regarding Lindsey's investigation:

Investigators monitored Lindsey Baum’s MySpace page but said the account has been inactive since she vanished and she left no posts indicating she was planning to leave

Police have checked her MySpace page and the phone numbers she dialed and received on her cell phone without finding any new leads, he said

If you make me, I can probably find the exact articles I copied these quotes from ~

[CorallaroC]

Disturbed is a band, but of course we have no way to know if Lindsey liked them or maybe just thought the screenname was cool. It could speak to more than that, but then again...maybe not. I personally don't read too much into their screennames because of experience with my own kids.

I think we should look more at the content of her myspace page with the relationship references etc. They were definitely geared more towards an older teen. Did Lindsey have a boyfriend? Was there an older male in town she was chasing after? Was there an older male paying attention to her? She appeared to be living beyond her years in wanting a relationship and being in love. Was this from watching shows like Twilight or something in her real life which was going on that we are unaware of yet?

http://www.google.com/search?q=The+band+Disturbed&rls=com.microsoft:en-us:IE-SearchBox&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&sourceid=ie7&rlz=1I7SUNA

~~~
Just thought I would mention that one of the songs still shown on Twilight's playlist is called "Down With The Sickness" by the band Disturbed.

I noticed it early in the case, but hadn't bothered to look up the lyrics until today. The song isn't what I would consider a catchy tune, so if she liked the lyrics, then I'm afraid I'm the one feeling disturbed right now.

Here is a link for the lyrics
http://www.sing365.com/music/lyric.nsf/Down-With-The-Sickness-lyrics-Disturbed/5ECE8E3D48F8075748256961002B2C5D

[kageykaren]

~~~
Just thought I would mention that one of the songs still shown on Twilight's playlist is called "Down With The Sickness" by the band Disturbed.

I noticed it early in the case, but hadn't bothered to look up the lyrics until today. The song isn't what I would consider a catchy tune, so if she liked the lyrics, then I'm afraid I'm the one feeling disturbed right now.

Here is a link for the lyrics
http://www.sing365.com/music/lyric.nsf/Down-With-The-Sickness-lyrics-Disturbed/5ECE8E3D48F8075748256961002B2C5DFunny how some of these cases touch our lives like 3 degrees of separation. The rock band "Disturbed" are one of our endorcers to promote our co. They are nice money making dudes performing an act on stage that does nothing but disturb my older woman senses. The audience they play to are mid teen boys in angst, 20 something males wanting to head bang with girlfriends pretending to enjoy the scene and last the 30 something crowd who say they like it because of the quality of musianship. If they only knew it is more of a Kiss thing to the artist. A band like this would not normally be one a ten or 11 yr. old could funk out to, as you know when listening. This may have appealed to Lindsey because she was watching older teenagers rocking out, mainly boys. I think My Spaces can connect dots to how someone thinks & feels at that given time along with other likes & dislikes in ones life. Good catch!

[CorallaroC]

The other thing on Twilight's page that has haunted me from the beginning is about half way down on the left, under the BuddyPoke app. with the dancing emo girls.

June 6, Tw.Fr. says "Hi, how are you"
June 15, Disturbed replies "Good, how are you?"

when you click to see more
May 29, TF is chatting on the phone
TF went ice skating with D
TF watched a movie with D
TF is bumping it to the beat
TF is looking for love
D and TF are gettin jiggy

(May 29th is of course the same day TF was created,
and the day she wrote the cryptic message about feeling
scared.)

Okay, so there's not anything terribly unusual about having 2 myspace
accounts. But logic tells me there is a specific reason why she wanted
the "outside world" to assume TF & D are two different people.

Plus we also have Alice W. on the friend list, also making contact under
the SuperPets app. So far, this person's identity is still a mystery and
is probably a third alias. At least she is not showing Alice's address as
McCleary.

Lindsey is an intelligent girl for her age, IMO. She created these for a
reason. And I think it is because she wanted someone to think she had
a couple of good friends to protect her. At least that is what logic keeps
telling me.

[kageykaren]

Bumping this thread for review & sluething. I just finished reading the transcipt of Ron & Don show. One thought that was discussed was a statement of opinion saying others need to be given lie detector test. We hear again a statement by Undersheriff RS that many individuals have been tested in the "criminal" case, 2 suspects offered to immediatly take a test, and to date no one has been cleared officially by LE. Who are the peeps that a radio host would be thinking of after just meeting a group of 40 searchers? It is interesting that we have someone not local that cares about Lindsey and is speaking up about giving someone they may have met lie detector test. This is a question I wish could be answered on W/S. Does this statement mean there is concern that a monster remains active in McCleary? If so why aren't the citiizens holding a town hall meeting of concern and protection for their children? So what alerted a radio talk show host new to McCleary to question if lie detector test need to be given to others and who those others are.

[YvonneCares]

I don't know where most of you live but I live close enough to the action
to see how much everyone seems to care about Lindsey (ME INCLUDED).
I have been to searched and have helped and seen the effort to organize and search
for her and in my opinion i see them doing thier best. Everyone is learning more & more as the searches continue and I will guess that everyone who has helped will
continue to help and pray and hold on to thier faith and see this to the end.
And as I have said before we don't know who reads these threads so IMO
I don't think we should put things on here that will help the monster know where we are going next. What do you all think about it?
The FBI & LE can't really tell us anything that would hurt Lindsey's case or Lindsey
and of course we shouldn't want them to do that.
Loving thoughts to all of you for caring so much about Lindsey. (-:
Yvonne

[LookN4Lindsey]

Bumping this thread for review & sluething. I just finished reading the transcipt of Ron & Don show. One thought that was discussed was a statement of opinion saying others need to be given lie detector test. We hear again a statement by Undersheriff RS that many individuals have been tested in the "criminal" case, 2 suspects offered to immediatly take a test, and to date no one has been cleared officially by LE. Who are the peeps that a radio host would be thinking of after just meeting a group of 40 searchers? It is interesting that we have someone not local that cares about Lindsey and is speaking up about giving someone they may have met lie detector test. This is a question I wish could be answered on W/S. Does this statement mean there is concern that a monster remains active in McCleary? If so why aren't the citiizens holding a town hall meeting of concern and protection for their children? So what alerted a radio talk show host new to McCleary to question if lie detector test need to be given to others and who those others are.

I just wanted to comment to 3 sections in your above statement:

The Baum family has been cleared according to LE, there are a couple different news stories and LE TV interviews where the Under sheriff has mentioned that the family was cleared and were not suspects. (These can be found by going through the media links provided in the media thread)

Having been at the first search where Don showed up and speaking with Don his concern is not with anyone that he may have met - his concern stems from conversations many of us had with him stating that we "were not sure" if everyone with a connection to Lindsey had been asked to take a Poly. That is still a concern many of us locals and semi-locals have.

As far as to the statement bolded in blue the answer to that is obviously since Lindsey is not home yet then absolutely Yes there is that chance.

[LookN4Lindsey]

I don't know where most of you live but I live close enough to the action
to see how much everyone seems to care about Lindsey (ME INCLUDED).
I have been to searched and have helped and seen the effort to organize and search
for her and in my opinion i see them doing thier best. Everyone is learning more & more as the searches continue and I will guess that everyone who has helped will
continue to help and pray and hold on to thier faith and see this to the end.
And as I have said before we don't know who reads these threads so IMO
I don't think we should put things on here that will help the monster know where we are going next. What do you all think about it?
The FBI & LE can't really tell us anything that would hurt Lindsey's case or Lindsey
and of course we shouldn't want them to do that.
Loving thoughts to all of you for caring so much about Lindsey. (-:
Yvonne

You nailed it YvonneCares. People (outside of a select few with absolutely no chance of a connection to LB's disappearance) will never KNOW what areas they intend on searching until and only until they are sent out to search them. This is done for many reasons. I had a long conversation with some powers that be and this is the way that they have to do it. If that makes them appear unorganized to anyone on the outside - oh well. Lindsey is their only concern at this point.

Obviously to outsiders that can be frustrating - I know from personal experience watching things take place - but when you sit down and think of why things are the way they are it makes more sense to you as far as how things are being done and being handled.

[YvonneCares]

I also would like to see several people take that polygraph test.
IMO, if they haven't taken one, then why not?
We can call with all leads and concerns too, I DID.
Just wish I would have thought to ask about the above, DARN.
But you all could. Maybe the more, the merrier?
This dragging everything along soooo slow I'm afraid it will get to late!!!
Sorry, but this is just my worried opinion ]-:

[TamgMit]

MB stated that LB left her phone at home plugged in when she went to KK house. I have a silly question that just kind of dawned on me. Got to thinking that these days a lot of kids have there own cell phone. Does MK and bro also have there own phones so that they can communicate with friends and family. Does SW also have one for when he goes on the job so that he could keep in touch with family. Was just wondering because KK phone wasn't working when MB tried to call. And if the kids did have there own phones how come they didn't notify MB that her daughter was walking home alone. If that be the case how come MB didn't call the kids phone if she couldn't get through to KK's phone. Would think that their numbers would of been listed on LB's phone.

[JenniferO]

KKs children do not have their own phones.
I don't know if SW has his own or if him and KK share. But even if SW does have a phone of his own there was a chance that MB didn't have the number. I know in my own case.. my daughters friends and their parents (usually the mother) has my phone number and not my husbands.

[kageykaren]

I just wanted to comment to 3 sections in your above statement:

The Baum family has been cleared according to LE, there are a couple different news stories and LE TV interviews where the Under sheriff has mentioned that the family was cleared and were not suspects. (These can be found by going through the media links provided in the media thread)

Having been at the first search where Don showed up and speaking with Don his concern is not with anyone that he may have met - his concern stems from conversations many of us had with him stating that we "were not sure" if everyone with a connection to Lindsey had been asked to take a Poly. That is still a concern many of us locals and semi-locals have.

As far as to the statement bolded in blue the answer to that is obviously since Lindsey is not home yet then absolutely Yes there is that chance.
I respect your answers, and thank you. My problem with the family being cleared or anyone else is that statement from LE clearing everyone they have tested has not been made officially to the public. There are no news reports stateing anyone is cleared which brought me back to the sheriffs office who stated "No one" has been cleared & this is an open investigation. LE will give an official statement in relation to Lie detector test being passsed friends & family as this helps them and the public move the investigation further on. People sometimes mistake LE wording about Lie Detector Test as they passed when in fact it was stated, "We feel comfortable with the results." This does not mean anyone has passed a test. Sure would be nice if LE would give a statement pertaining to the test so some of us could move forward and possibly away from those central to Lindsey on that day. For all who belong to W/S isn't this the reason we became involved in missing childrens cases, to bring the perpatator of these crimes against children to the forefront, even helping LE catch the criminal. Maybe all these different sites will bring this creep to confessing.

[TamgMit]

KKs children do not have their own phones.
I don't know if SW has his own or if him and KK share. But even if SW does have a phone of his own there was a chance that MB didn't have the number. I know in my own case.. my daughters friends and their parents (usually the mother) has my phone number and not my husbands.

Thank you jennifer for the response. I am kind of curious, was LB cell phone one that her mother used also except when LB was out and about so that she could stay in contact with her mother. It wasn't meant for socializing with friends then.

[JenniferO]

I can't answer what her phone was supposed to be used for. But I believe LB had her own phone.

[kageykaren]

This has me wondering if Lindsey had a contact phone (cell) throughout the day Friday and only left it on the charger by accident after her stated shower. If she had a phone throughout the day pings would show everywhere Lindsey was that day. This would be good if LE see's a ping in an odd area for that time of day. Say for an example, a woods area where she has been told not to venture, or maybe being at an older adolescents home when she knows better. A neighbor of scenarios come to mind unless we hear the phone was on the charger all day leading up to a crime. Also if this cell was used only for contact maybe someone Lindsey knows may haveleft a message. Wish we were privy to the phone records for that week and day. So little to work off of as time keeps slipping by. I hope they are gonna zone in on this perp and throw the book at him, never to see the light of day. For what this person has done to a community & thousands who care they should be made acctountable at the time of sentencing.

[YvonneCares]

That would be a very good idea but I would think the FBI
would have thought of doing that already I would think.
And yes it would be nice if we had alittle more info to go
on like the Pings you talked about. Good thought.

[TamgMit]

I also would like to see several people take that polygraph test.
IMO, if they haven't taken one, then why not?
We can call with all leads and concerns too, I DID.
Just wish I would have thought to ask about the above, DARN.
But you all could. Maybe the more, the merrier?
This dragging everything along soooo slow I'm afraid it will get to late!!!
Sorry, but this is just my worried opinion ]-:

I am not sure but, if a person takes a polygraph that it can't be used in a court law unless it is agreed with the parties prior to taking it. Seems I heard something like that just recently.

[Novice Seeker]

Lindsey's MySpace entries prior to her disappearance:

Lindsey Baum is happy that her brother is going to juvi tomorrow.
Mood: happ at 2:10 PM Jun 17
Lindsey Baum is bored as hell
Mood: bored at 8:01 PM Jun 8
Lindsey Baum cabt wait to hang with kayla agian
Mood: anxious at 2:13 PM Jun 8
Lindsey Baum i've been getting a lot of nightmares latley and i have this bad feeling that something bads gonna happen
Mood: scared at 6:48 AM May 29
Lindsey Baum has joined MySpace!
Mood: good at 4:04 AM May 29

http://www.myspace.com/477760045



Umm, not sure how all of you want to do this so if I need to sit down and be quiet just give me the glare.

1. What kept brother from going to juvi?
2. excited to hang with Kayla again? Had something happend that kept them apart for awhile?
3. Did Lindsey have a particular teacher or Girl Scout leader to talk to?
4. IMO Lindsey didn't seem to confide in mom?

Novice Seeker

[Novice Seeker]

This has me wondering if Lindsey had a contact phone (cell) throughout the day Friday and only left it on the charger by accident after her stated shower. If she had a phone throughout the day pings would show everywhere Lindsey was that day. This would be good if LE see's a ping in an odd area for that time of day. Say for an example, a woods area where she has been told not to venture, or maybe being at an older adolescents home when she knows better. A neighbor of scenarios come to mind unless we hear the phone was on the charger all day leading up to a crime. Also if this cell was used only for contact maybe someone Lindsey knows may haveleft a message. Wish we were privy to the phone records for that week and day. So little to work off of as time keeps slipping by. I hope they are gonna zone in on this perp and throw the book at him, never to see the light of day. For what this person has done to a community & thousands who care they should be made acctountable at the time of sentencing.



It would be worth looking at serveral phone pings such as the mother, brother, mother's friends

Novice Seeker

[Novice Seeker]

It sure is terrible Eyes, I watched one video where MB discussed this very thing. I could be wrong, but what I came away with had nothing to do with JB. He wasn't involved in an overnight stay, and the last I read the argument happened behind the Shell Station on the way to KK's house. We know the bike was ditched there, or I should say discovered there a couple of days after she went missing. I think it was just left there and if JB walked all the way up to KK's house after he was told to take the bike back home, he doesn't mind too well.

It has been a weird day for me all day, so if I am too strong here I am sorry.

Something isn't right about the whole scenario from the incept of her going missing and leaving KK's house. All the "she walked down 6th till the trees covered her, MK couldn't see her anymore, then the dogs followed her scent south on 6th, the witness could have lived on Simpson between 5th and 6th, etc. I think is it mumbo jumbo because something known might not be safe or smart for someone to tell at this point in time. It is the only thing I can think of and it is at the nub of the whole case!

xox



I agree, the bike situation was never explained in any way that made sense and that includes the Mom's explaination.

Novice Seeker

[Novice Seeker]

On what little I know and my logic, I'm going to rule out those who are not suspects. I know many have different ideas and that's what makes the world go round:

Mom Baum - no access to a car; no history of violence of any kind; willingly took a polygraph and passed. A loving, single mom who tries hard to make ends meet. Ruled out!

Josh Baum - a socially awkward child who seems to be the target of many. At 12 yo he doesn't have the skills to murder and dispose of human remains that go undetected by LE, FBI, peers, and the entire town of McCleary. I have no doubt Lindsey would have beaten the carp out of him if necessary. Ruled out!

Mom K - Doesn't drive; no history of violence; makes visible attempts to help find Lindsey on all fronts. Genuinely cares and tries to be helpful to many. Ruled out!
Mom K's live-in friend - willingly took a lie detector test and passed showing he has no need to be in the limelight or clutter the search for Lindsey. Ruled out!

Lindsey was last seen by two different people probably about one-two minutes apart between 5th & 6th and Maple...this is probably where she was approached and lured/taken...

1. by a person she was slightly familiar with who offered her a ride home - only to keep on driving.

2. by a slightly familiar person with a puppy, a disability, or pretending to be sick, lost, or in need of help.

3. by a person who presented as an authority figure.

or in an attempt to turn away from something that alarmed her, she turned and changed direction only to run into a more alarming situation.

to be continued....
Lindsey was taken near a somewhat busy intersection, close to the police station, and at a time when locals would be closing their business and heading home on a Friday night...about 9:15-9:30. With this in mind, I seriously believe this person knew the layout of the town and was familiar with McCleary's activity of a Friday night. Perhaps not a resident but a frequent visitor.

If Lindsey got in a car with someone familiar under the auspice of being driven home...and the car kept on driving...I hope every inch of woods and water have been searched off the road she lives on..Mommsen Road. That's it for now..sure not much to go on.


I'm still not ready to rule out the mom. IMO she appears to be passive, unable to be the parent in charge, desperate for attention or perhaps affection. For several reasons there was quite a bit of stress in that home. Lindsey was missing a lot of days and her son was about to be sent to juvi. IMO suspect we still don't a good grasp on this family unit, yet.

Novice Seeker

[coastal]

It is true that we know less than we want to about the investigation into Lindsey's disappearance. LE is tight-lipped; local media coverage is spotty and light, where it even exists. Our beloved locals have searched high and low (and everywhere else, too) but may not discuss those efforts or findings with us. WS does not allow rumors or wild speculation, and the only person I know of who actually knows Lindsey, and McCleary, and was willing to post her thoughts online for us about what happened, has stopped doing so.
Rightly so, all of it.

However, LE has said that Lindsey was taken by someone she knew.
That's a good clue, and one we can work with.

Lindsey can't have known that many people. Even if she did know every single soul in McCleary, WA, the list wouldn't be too long for WS'ers to work through. Right?
Right. I'll start.
*We can cross off all the kids under 16; they couldn't have 'taken' her anywhere far enough away to hide her for this long, without a vehicle of some kind. Make that kids 15 and under (since I drove way before I 'could')
*We can cross off Lindsey's mom and KK using the the same logic. And Lindsey's dad, who is from out of town (and busy with other things)
*KK's POSSLQ (Person of the Opposite Sex Sharing Living Quarters; a census term, and my dad's word for my :innocent: live-in bf. It sounds like it looks) scratch because he took a LDT for LE already, and isn't in jail

Now. Let's make a list of who Lindsey knows:

[TamgMit]

I wanted to bump this forward to see if we could answer some of these questions. Sometimes if you reapproach the questions again might find an answer. Especially with new sets of eyes.

Things I find odd;

Lindsey comes home with friend, and takes a shower.
Does she ask her mom if friend can spend the night?
Does mom say no, so she takes a shower and changes clothes in hopes of spending the night at friends house?
If she was planning on returning within an hour, why shower at that time?
Is she prone to taking a lot of showers throughout the day?

After taking a shower, she, her brother, and her friend, take a broken bike with them to friends house, but it and brother are sent home due to fighting.
Where did this happen? Who sent them home;
or did they decide they didn't want to push the bike and threw it in the bushes, and the bro took off in another direction, b/c, if he was told to walk with his sister, and he went home, why wasn't he sent back to walk with his sister?

Where does mom work? What are her hours?

Why was Lindsey missing school, and her grades dropping. She likes her teacher, so that isn't it. She has plenty of friends so social outcast isn't the reason.
If mom is gone when it's time to go to school, is she not responsible enough to get herself up, dressed, and on her way? I don't believe the divorce was troubling her. They had been seperated for a couple years. and she rarely saw her dad. I simply don't accept that reason for her dropping grades and missing school.
Was JB also missing a lot of school, were his grades also dropping?

How long had they lived at that address?

The nightmares could have been a result of her choice in movies, and books. moo

I read on the doctor website, don't know where it is now, that he observed the town blaming the mom for letting her out walking around that time of evening, but, I wonder if there is more to it than that. I wonder if mom isn't around much and the kids fend for themselves. I don't know this, I'm just asking.

I noticed during the vigil pics from cyber and JvK, thanks so much again, that JB is standing directly in front of his mom when she is talking into the mic.
My observation of this is "Look at Me, Mom" and I wonder what he's thinking.
All the other kids were sitting, paying attention, but he was restless, moving about.
Why? for attention? Didn't want to hear what was being said? Wished he was anywhere else but there?
Mom calls him a wanderer. To me, that says, she often doesn't know where he is or what he's doing.

And back to the shower thing, I find the timing of it an important clue. I'm not quite sure why.
One reason I think it's an important clue is b/c if she did shower with the hope she was going to spend the night with her friend at her friends house, wouldn't she have taken her cellphone. If she expected to come back with her friend in a hour, she might not take it, but would she take the time to shower?

Why was she "happy" her bro was going to juvi? Does she not understand what juvi is? or does she think he deserves it? or does he make her life so miserable that she prefers him in kiddie lock up, than at home? This is a clue, imo.

[kageykaren]

Costal, Great idea! Maybe some of the locals that posted in the beginning here at W/S might want topitch in again. I would like to know when MB moved toMcCleary to establish the lenght of time Lindsey would have had to make friends. Lindsey did attend school in the area last year, correct? What about the year before? Also the amount of days of week and time she was at work. This would atest to the amount of time the children may have been at home, alone. durig the school year and beginning of summer. It is obvious by Lindsey's My Space comment that something in her life the late afternoon and evenning frightened her on the 29th of May. I'm hoping pings and phone records forthat day have been looked at aswell. This is the only account Lindsey seems to have put out there for us topay attention to. Leave it to the children to be authentic with their statements of fear. This is the biggest clue for me!

[boondock]

It is true that we know less than we want to about the investigation into Lindsey's disappearance. LE is tight-lipped; local media coverage is spotty and light, where it even exists. Our beloved locals have searched high and low (and everywhere else, too) but may not discuss those efforts or findings with us. WS does not allow rumors or wild speculation, and the only person I know of who actually knows Lindsey, and McCleary, and was willing to post her thoughts online for us about what happened, has stopped doing so.
Rightly so, all of it.

However, LE has said that Lindsey was taken by someone she knew.
That's a good clue, and one we can work with.

Lindsey can't have known that many people. Even if she did know every single soul in McCleary, WA, the list wouldn't be too long for WS'ers to work through. Right?
Right. I'll start.
*We can cross off all the kids under 16; they couldn't have 'taken' her anywhere far enough away to hide her for this long, without a vehicle of some kind. Make that kids 15 and under (since I drove way before I 'could')
*We can cross off Lindsey's mom and KK using the the same logic. And Lindsey's dad, who is from out of town (and busy with other things)
*KK's POSSLQ (Person of the Opposite Sex Sharing Living Quarters; a census term, and my dad's word for my :innocent: live-in bf. It sounds like it looks) scratch because he took a LDT for LE already, and isn't in jail

Now. Let's make a list of who Lindsey knows:

IMO, those 16 and under or persons without traditional means of transportation should not be ruled out based on that aspect alone. ATV's and other non-traditional vehicles are common in this area and used by various age groups.

[TamgMit]

IMO, those 16 and under or persons without traditional means of transportation should not be ruled out based on that aspect alone. ATV's and other non-traditional vehicles are common in this area and used by various age groups.

I have to agree with Boondock many younger people do use the ATV's. They can use some of those loggin roads as trails as well as their own back yards.

[kageykaren]

The male population in my home asked who's house was the hangout home, until parents got home from work. There's always"that" home that parents don't have a clue about where this age group experiments with all kinds of behaviors. I'm wondering if the younger somewhat with it young girls were invited to hang by the older crowd. Older crowd for Lindsey seems to be anyone over the age of 12. Once again I must ask who were Mom B's. friends before Lindsey went missing as the internet public has only heard about 3 women who are friends now but not so much until Lindsey went missing. Was mom nuturing new friendships since moving to McCleary? I just find it odd no friends of MomB are turning out to help her. Whats up with that? Mom has only new friendships to share her grief with. Was there know one for Mom B to give support other than a few family members. It just seems like Mom B had know one in her life look at her separate and aside from mothering. Were there no gal pals to cut up with? I bet Mom B feels blessed at the new close friends she has met since Lindsey's disappearence. I cannot imagine handling such a loss without my long term friends to lean on as they know me and my family better than anyone. Was life sad and fearful within the family?

[coastal]

IMO, those 16 and under or persons without traditional means of transportation should not be ruled out based on that aspect alone. ATV's and other non-traditional vehicles are common in this area and used by various age groups.
An excellent point, boondock! Don't know what I was thinking, since I had a BIG crush on that cute 15yo old Whitley boy and his dirt bike when I was just about Lindsey's age..and I'd have gone anywhere with him on that thing (if he'd ever looked at me, that is)! :trout: << = me
(Also, Harry Oakes mentioned an ATV or a motorcycle...)

So. Add back in anybody old enough/big enough/lucky enough to ride something with a motor. Who has something like that?

[mysticrose]

I would like to know who Lindsey knew that owns a 4 wheeler or motorbike as well what ever age they may be...
I keep checking in hopes there is some new news for Lindsey I think of her daily...

[TakeNote]

hey great brain storming!!

I have always heard and understood that LE never clears anyone until they find who is at fault for the missing child.....now this doesn't me they don't use tools to help them put people at the bottom of the list :) they are though on the list :)

so that means we have to pick apart everything over and over again.....I hope that if MomB is reading here....she will understand that....knowing that is how we get to the bottom of things....let the process happen....its uncomfortable.....but needs to happen.....that is how LE-FBI work.....that is how we can get clues....to help find Lindsey

an idea maybe off the wall.....maybe outrageous....may not make since to us....we may believe/know its not true......but let the poster post it....comment on it....but don't attack it....

the idea that maybe dismissed by many.....could spark a thought in someone else.....that could lead to a clue....:)

keep going.....:)

[coastal]

That would be a very good idea but I would think the FBI
would have thought of doing that already I would think.
And yes it would be nice if we had alittle more info to go
on like the Pings you talked about. Good thought.
Welcome to Websleuths, YvonneCares!

[TamgMit]

[QUOTE=mysticrose;4203428]I would like to know who Lindsey knew that owns a 4 wheeler or motorbike as well what ever age they may be...
I keep checking in hopes there is some new news for Lindsey I think of her daily...[/QUOTE

Being that LB was new in town maybe we should also incorporate the friends of LB that knew of people that had access to either a Atv or motorbike. We know that in this community many used the nearby ATV park. Think she would be comfortable especially if it is a friend of a friend.

[TamgMit]

Welcome to Websleuths YVONNE its great to have you with the team. Always good to have some extra help and fresh ideas.

[mysticrose]

[QUOTE=mysticrose;4203428]I would like to know who Lindsey knew that owns a 4 wheeler or motorbike as well what ever age they may be...
I keep checking in hopes there is some new news for Lindsey I think of her daily...[/QUOTE

Being that LB was new in town maybe we should also incorporate the friends of LB that knew of people that had access to either a Atv or motorbike. We know that in this community many used the nearby ATV park. Think she would be comfortable especially if it is a friend of a friend.

I wonder do people have to register there ATV's there in McCleary in order to ride them?
We dont have to here where I am they do not have to be licensed.
Just a thought and how to maybe track some things down.
Most kid's likes to ride on an ATV or motorcycle if given a chance to..JMO

[YvonneCares]

Thank You for your welcome TamgMit (-:

[ClueMan]

Hi there boondock! mom K did make that comment and that's the reason I put it in the time-line. Mom K said she didn't know when mom Baum started calling her cause her phone was dead. Eventually mom Baum reached her and that's why they started searching for Lindsey late...around 10:20 or so, by car. I thought it was unfortunate because mom Baum started looking for Lindsey on foot around 10:00 and joined mom K and boyfriend in a car around 10:20 - 10:30. Mom K wasn't anticipating any traumatic event that night and it could very well be her phone was as dead as Lindsey's. Remember mom K doesn't drive and her boyfriend took, and passed, a lie detector test. LE cleared them! :confused:

Mom Baum thought Lindsey would be walking home with her brother and would not be alone. If I was going to question anyone it would be the person who sent Josh home...and even than that person had no idea Lindsey would be walking home alone. Soooo confusing!

There is something about that (what I bolded), that is just rubbing me the wrong way. I don't know about the rest of you but on more then one occasion I have talked on my dead cell phone while it is charging. It also seems to me MB would have left a voice mail which would have been time stamped.

[coastal]

I named this file 'spitball', but since we don't have a thread for that (nor do we need one) I'm posting these notes from my hard drive here in the 'brainstorming' one. Hope none of you storming brains minds...

It's sort of a running list of questions I've had about Lindsey - and a few answers, where I found them - since she first disappeared.

Maybe something here will spark a clue for someone else; I've hit the wall.

I'm also increasingly curious about the idea that Lindsey might have somehow ended up in a culvert or drain somewhere, as Corallaroc and others are discussing elsewhere in this forum.

Jody King disappeared without a trace after a minor car accident. Witnesses saw Jody exit the wreck and run into the woods, but despite several intense searches by LE, locals and expert search teams that included tracking and cadaver dogs, his body wasn't found until months later. He had gotten himself somehow wedged in a drainpipe on private property, very close to where he was last seen, and died of exposure. I'll bring more specific info here later, but I have to do some errands now. Meanwhile, there's a thread for Jody King, missing from CT, in the Missing/Located forum here that you might want to check out. Very sad.

I wonder all the time if it isn't that simple, and that tragic, for Lindsey.
She was wearing a bathing suit.
I just can't get past that one thing.

All thoughts are welcome on anything here!

>>>

Does LB's mom MB have a significant other in McC? Or another ex? Who is her BFF/bf boyfriend? Where was he?
Did KK take a LDT? When? Or, why?

Where was the pool party? Who supervised? What time did LB leave? Who are the other kids LB was seen renting videos with? (I've assumed these were movies; were they games, instead? Think RPGs: Magic, The Gathering, D&Dragons/local groups? teens) When was LB's dinner? Where? When did the KK child hook up with LB, and what did she do while LB showered and changed clothes? Would I let my kid go back out, after a pool party and running around downtown, after a shower, in clean clothes, at 9-something, without an adult? With wet hair? On a broken bike, arguing brother in tow?


LE says someone LB knows took her.
Who would be around for that, during summer afternoons and evenings, regularly enough to know the kids/ that kids know? Think summer night, unsupervised kids, bikes: creeks, woods, town...where's the hangout? Does she like boys? Hannah M? Jonas Bros? What music? Loves Twilight!, reads Harry Potter. Friday night, small town. Known for: shoplifting, being "up to something" (drunk Mark), is "10 going on 16", has myspace x2, single parent/ recent divorce/seperation from dad/conflict with brother/ trouble with other girls (resolved?)/poor attendance/ new school (2nd in 2 years). Normal tween stuff, or real issues being outpictured? Was LB threatened? (MS comment re: "something bad")

Devoted to her German Shepherd; fiercely loyal and protective dogs. Any strange behavior from the dog with any of Lindsey's friends, or MB's friends? Where was she, and why didn't she go with the kids?? Why didn't the dog figure in this?
Woods, forests, trees everywhere. Who are the rebel teens? Who are the 'mean girls'? Where are the spots kids go for spin-the-bottle, cigs?
What was happening at Beerbower park? Did LB play sports? Is there a summer day-camp, maybe summer Bibleschool? Baseball, adult softball? Who are local coaches?

Seen by 2 wits (who are these?) between home and KK's; KK very chatty online. Did she disappear from KK's? Check out KK's strange brother/ other relatives; her version of events keep(s) changing. Truth doesn't change: 1. LB was escorted 1/2way by an unknown child 2) LB was escorted 1/2way by KK's child 3)KK's child watched LB to the end of the street 4) KK's child watched LB "until the trees" (where is this exact location, where trees would obscure KK's view of Lindsey's progress?); 5) 9:15/ 9:30/ between 9 and 10, 9:30 = versions of timeline (all KK's?). What else did KK's kid notice/ see?
Did LB ever leave KKs? Did LB even get to KK's?
When did JB arrive at home? What was his demeanor? When is bedtime for the Baum kids? And where the hell is daddy?

Where are Mom B's parents/sibs/cousins? Where are Sr. Baums? Why did MB and kids come to WA from TN(?)? Check for local ties. Problems in TN? Angry neighbors? Rumors that MB is bipolar; is this significant? What examples of manic episodes - these must exist for that dx? Is she on meds? Antipsychotics? Is she rx compliant?
Is there family counseling/intervention/support for MB's dx/ JB's LD?
IS JB SPED?

LB cell wasn't charged, so left it at home when she needed it most of all. KK's phone was also dead, which meant MB didn't really worry about LB being late until (what time did MB and KK finally speak? ?). Is it strange, that both phones were ooo exactly when they were needed most? Or, normal (like mine).
_______________
Soulscape says the perp is someone who chastised LB earlier in the day. Tuba stresses an authority. Astrology also points to someone who is a caretaker of land or property, like a landlord or real estate agent, or maybe a gardener...aLSO, an event published prior to Lindsey's disapperance is key. This could be a yard sale ad, a lost dog flyer, a house for sale sign, promo for the Bear Festival, etc...could also refer to photos of LB (on internet?)
Tuba's chart says someone who was present at the search center last friday at 9:15 am, knows where Lindsey is.

*Tricia said:
Remember, in the press release it says if you want to help organize donations please call the Laura Recovery Center first and they can tell you what is needed. Their number is 866-898-5723.

*cyberswept posted on 8/28/2009 @11:30pm:
From the story on q13fox.com

*Individuals who would like to participate in the search for Lindsey should check in at the McCleary Community Center between the hours of 9 am and 4:30 pm on Friday, August 28th. Volunteers must be 18 years of age or older and bring photo identification. "Dress appropriately for the weather, wear long pants and sturdy, covered toe shoes. We need people who can do foot searches as well as individuals who are willing to work in the search center explained Dennis. Volunteers are not required to attend the community meeting. In addition, we are looking for donations of bottled water, office supplies and the use of a copier."

>Is this "the" search center?
If so, does that mean it is "owned" by the City of McCleary? Who is the landlord of this property? Who is Dennis?
>see City of Mc Chamber page:
Todd Baun, Cityof McCleary Facilities Manager
____________
*konamocha posted 8/31/09 at 6:50pm, in LB' Forensic Astrology thread (page 14):

>>>I wanted to let you know that there are a lot of the kids that attend school in Elma which starts tomorrow Sept. 1. This is because of conflicts at the McCleary school.<<<

I found the following posts on trulia.com:
http://www.trulia.com/schools/WA-Mccleary/Mccleary_Elementary_School/

*This school is limited in its learning. The Principle and Vice principle are unable to handle any type of situation and do not inform parents right away if there is a situation. Our child now goes to a different school and is much happier and the teachers give him praise on his report cards. That never happend in McCleary which does have some good teachers but some don't care as well, either.
Posted by a parent on 05/11/09

*Most of the staff are great people. The major problem at this school is the principal. Not only is the treatment of the children lopsided as to who he likes or doesn't like but also his treatment of the staff is less than desireable. If your oppinion doesnt reflect his it is easy to get on his 'bad side'. I have personal experience with Mr. Bolander not liking my child. I am just thankful that Elma is only 7 miles away.
Posted by a parent on 01/29/09

*This school has a excellent office staff. The ladies are very helpful and friendly. They really seem to care about each child and parent. I wouldn't send my child to any other school!
Posted by a parent on 09/11/07

*This school is a wonderful. The math program is one of the best it takes a new look in to investigating the math problem. The teachers really do care about the students! The class size is great usually no more than 19 in a class its great!
Posted by a student on 10/12/06

*McCleary school is a fine local K-8 school. Teachers are very friendly and responsive, but need a better discipline policy in the classroom. Math programs need to gear more towards learning fundamentals and less toward passing the WASL test. A return to basics in math and reading would help. Would eliminate having too many math concepts taught in same week. Also students should be taught cursive handwritin despite computer use for writing. Historical documents and letters are in cursive, and anyone should be able to read them. For a small local school, McCleary is very nice. Principal is very open to discussions. Most staff also very receptive to suggestions.
Posted by a parent on 09/04/06

*McCleary overall is a pretty good school. The principal could use some guidance on handling situations and some of the teachers need to learn about the effects on students by students with disabilities.
Posted by a parent on 05/08/06

**notes from affidavit for SW, Sept.25, 2009

THe officer swears on 9/25/09 that " An extensive search was conducted over the next weeks by law enforcement, search and rescue volunteers, canine teams, and citizens.
Baum could not be located nor has any evidence been located."
No evidence located as of 9/25/09!!!

City Council 6/8/2009 notes: What is "Tami Quimby case?"


<<<

Note: Soulscape and Tuba are two of our forensic astrologers; their ideas come from the many excellent charts they've done for Lindsey's case.