Four People Murdered in VA College Town #3

[hoppyfrog]

Please continue here.

[dangrsmind]

As a mother of boys (and I would call Sam one despite his 20 years), I can imagine him doing almost anything about his bloody clothes other than using a washing machine. I'm sticking with he's wearing them (under the jacket) and smells to high-heaven because of that.

As for the 3 bodies being upstairs... weird again. Could the girls have slept there, been killed in bed, moved to the floor, and then Debra Kelley either being brought up there dead, or she came to the room and he killed her then. In what they said about the females being killed in bed, was there any room left for maybe Debra not being killed there?

There's no word on where they were actually killed. We've heard they were asleep at the time and that the bodies were found on the floor.

[gxm]

This is from a story dated October 23, last Friday:

"Sources tell CBS-6 that capital murder charges are expected to be filed in two weeks. A capital murder conviction can potentially lead to a death sentence."

http://www.wtvr.com/news/wtvr-farmville-murder-update,0,1981283.story

I'm guessing that they are waiting for forensic evidence to come back. It sounds like they are playing this one extremely safe.

[gxm]

deleted double post.

[dangrsmind]

The longer it goes with no charges against Sam for killing the women, the weirder that seems to me. Could there really be some other scenario being investigated??

There was a statement that capital murder charges would be announced in about two weeks and this was reported in a story last week. Wait another week or two and see what happens.

Edited to add: gxm slipped me ;)

[dangrsmind]

Here's the entrance to Poorhouse road from the 460 that Heroine was talking about. He's already on the road to the airport before he gets here. He has to turn off onto what appears to me to be a fairly small side road that clearly isn't the main route 460. Also, if he did make this turn by mistake, he passes several other places where he could have turned around well before the location were he eventually did try to do so. IMO this theory is pretty improbable.

[tapu]

"...asleep, or in an otherwise defenseless position..."

So it's possible the girls slept up there, and that Debra was killed when she came up rather than necessarily that she was asleep too.

I'm just thinking this because both of these possibilities seem unlikely: 1) that they were all sleeping up there and he just moved them to the floor, and 2) that he moved all 3 bodies upstairs.

[gxm]

"...asleep, or in an otherwise defenseless position..."

So it's possible the girls slept up there, and that Debra was killed when she came up rather than necessarily that she was asleep too.

I'm just thinking this because both of these possibilities seem unlikely: 1) that they were all sleeping up there and he just moved them to the floor, and 2) that he moved all 3 bodies upstairs.

All we know is that there were no defensive wounds on the women. Your scenario would work if Sam attacked Debra from behind. One hit with the maul and a person would be incapacitated.

I think it's also possible that he moved Debra after he killed her so that all the bodies were in the most remote area of the house. From photos she does not look like a large woman, so I'm guessing she wouldn't be extremely difficult to move.

[tapu]

Hey, did we ever link the "horrorcore.blogspot" on here, where people are going on about horrorcore as domestic terrorism?

I could try to find it again, if not. It's got some self-proclaimed horrorcories posting on there in the comments about Sam, skr, sick, etc.

It was linked to that recent article, above, about the murder weapon, body placement.

Some of these guys are making the claim that it was set up, too. To promote skr, et al.

[deita]

Hey, did we ever link the "horrorcore.blogspot" on here, where people are going on about horrorcore as domestic terrorism?

I could try to find it again, if not. It's got some self-proclaimed horrorcories posting on there in the comments about Sam, skr, sick, etc.

It was linked to that recent article, above, about the murder weapon, body placement.

Some of these guys are making the claim that it was set up, too. To promote skr, et al.

this site? horror-core.blogspot.com (http://horror-core.blogspot.com/)

[maunsapt]

http://boardreader.com/t/Wicked_Underground/Please_Read_yclX3f8e.html?o=40

or this site?

[AndresEscobar]

I think I would be able to reconcile Sam's actions a lot better if drugs were involved.

[maunsapt]

yes, AndresEscobar, I have been wondering this myself. Also, would the 3 female victims been drugged too? Makes one wonder if any of them heard of anything before they were killed.

[claudicici]

I was wondering about sam's drug habit's as well...he didn't seem to have as much of a problem as his sister.I keep wondering about way back how it all started.According to syko mom she was super protective and took a job at the school to be close to him but sarah paints a totally different picture.syko mom smoking bowl after bowl in front of a muted TV,she didn't seem to give a damn about those kids,just didn't want to be bothered...gave them weed,took their food for weed,basically left sam to rot in his room,didn't even care if he showered...I could imagine him staying in there to avoid confrontation,his sister didn't seem tobe too kind to him either...I'm not feeling sorry for him,I'm just trying to understand....maybe the whole involvment with wicked intend and skr was positive at first...it gave him something to live for...i bet he had huge expectations about meeting emma...i can also see him doing the whole rap thing to impress her,to impress his dad...but I think we all agree he sucked bad at it...
anyways I think when he thought emma was a cheater just like his mom he just freaked,i don't think he 's a psychopath,just majorly disturbed...I also think he called to cops for a half hearted alibi but I really doubt he cared much whether or not he would get caught at that point.I do believe the murders satisfied him which would explain his calm and almost content demeanor when he was taken in by le.I keep thinking of what the original syko sam,david berkowitz said in an interview"the tension,the desire to kill a woman had built up in me to such explosive proportions that when I finally pulled the trigger ,all the pressures,all the tensions,hatred,had just vanished,disappeared.I was literally singing on my way home"

[Nikolai]

This is from a story dated October 23, last Friday:

"Sources tell CBS-6 that capital murder charges are expected to be filed in two weeks. A capital murder conviction can potentially lead to a death sentence."

http://www.wtvr.com/news/wtvr-farmville-murder-update,0,1981283.story

I'm guessing that they are waiting for forensic evidence to come back. It sounds like they are playing this one extremely safe.

Yea they probably want to know exactly everything they have before filing the capital charges. The defense will likely have the goal of just trying to save McCroskey from lethal injection, it will be interesting to see what spin they go with to try and convince a jury to spare him death.

[claudicici]

I doubt he cares to be spared

[dangrsmind]

All we know is that there were no defensive wounds on the women. Your scenario would work if Sam attacked Debra from behind. One hit with the maul and a person would be incapacitated.

I think it's also possible that he moved Debra after he killed her so that all the bodies were in the most remote area of the house. From photos she does not look like a large woman, so I'm guessing she wouldn't be extremely difficult to move.

There could be other evidence besides the lack of defensive wounds, i.e. blood stains and spatter in or near the beds, the location of the wounds (indicating they were hit from behind or while prone), etc.

[dangrsmind]

I doubt he cares to be spared

That's a curious statement. Why?

[dangrsmind]

I think I would be able to reconcile Sam's actions a lot better if drugs were involved.

Meth use seems possible. I know of another case where an apparently normal guy became violent after a short period of frequent meth use. He threatened to kill his roommate by putting his head in the oven, then assaulted some other folks. He had to leave the state to avoid the consequences. Also, FWIW, he was very into conspiracy theory stuff like SickTanick and the meth plus conspiracy thinking seemed to go together.

[dangrsmind]

I was wondering about sam's drug habit's as well...he didn't seem to have as much of a problem as his sister.I keep wondering about way back how it all started.According to syko mom she was super protective and took a job at the school to be close to him but sarah paints a totally different picture.syko mom smoking bowl after bowl in front of a muted TV,she didn't seem to give a damn about those kids,just didn't want to be bothered...gave them weed,took their food for weed,basically left sam to rot in his room,didn't even care if he showered...I could imagine him staying in there to avoid confrontation,his sister didn't seem tobe too kind to him either...I'm not feeling sorry for him,I'm just trying to understand....maybe the whole involvment with wicked intend and skr was positive at first...it gave him something to live for...i bet he had huge expectations about meeting emma...i can also see him doing the whole rap thing to impress her,to impress his dad...but I think we all agree he sucked bad at it...
anyways I think when he thought emma was a cheater just like his mom he just freaked,i don't think he 's a psychopath,just majorly disturbed...I also think he called to cops for a half hearted alibi but I really doubt he cared much whether or not he would get caught at that point.I do believe the murders satisfied him which would explain his calm and almost content demeanor when he was taken in by le.I keep thinking of what the original syko sam,david berkowitz said in an interview"the tension,the desire to kill a woman had built up in me to such explosive proportions that when I finally pulled the trigger ,all the pressures,all the tensions,hatred,had just vanished,disappeared.I was literally singing on my way home"

Blame the mother eh?

Certainly possible, but idk. I have a couple of problems with this story.

How does calling the police give him an alibi? It places him at the scene close to the time of the murders.

If he doesn't care about being caught, why is he trying to construct an alibi? It seems hard to believe that he both doesn't care about getting caught AND that he is trying to construct an alibi however lame.

What was he doing in the house for all those hours? We know he moved the bodies, but it seems like he didn't spend any time cleaning up, hence the description of the scene as horrific and brutal.

What was he doing on Poorhouse Road? Most likely dumping evidence, but we don't know yet. If he wants to get caught, why dump the evidence?

[dangrsmind]

http://boardreader.com/t/Wicked_Underground/Please_Read_yclX3f8e.html?o=40

or this site?

Boardreader is a great resource. I think I hadn't read some of the postings near the end of this thread, so thanks for the link.

[dangrsmind]

this site? horror-core.blogspot.com (http://horror-core.blogspot.com/)

The comments are the most interesting bit there. This is ground zero for the horrorcore witch hunt.

[tapu]

Yes, it was the comments on the horrorcore blog that caught my interest, too. Thanks for the other link, mauns, as well.

[AndresEscobar]

Meth use seems possible. I know of another case where an apparently normal guy became violent after a short period of frequent meth use. He threatened to kill his roommate by putting his head in the oven, then assaulted some other folks. He had to leave the state to avoid the consequences. Also, FWIW, he was very into conspiracy theory stuff like SickTanick and the meth plus conspiracy thinking seemed to go together.

Yeah, meth was the drug of which I was thinking. I went to undergrad in a farmtown in a rural area of the midwest. Every day, you'd hear all sorts of stuff about crimes involving meth use.

[dangrsmind]

Yeah, meth was the drug of which I was thinking. I went to undergrad in a farmtown in a rural area of the midwest. Every day, you'd hear all sorts of stuff about crimes involving meth use.

No sign of the appearance changes that often go with frequent meth use however.

One of my side projects at a recent gig was to measure the facial similarity of meth users after short periods. I believe we were the first people to do this type of study FWIW. Meth use is connected to identity theft in many cases and we were interested in whether we would be able to identify people during the rapid changes in appearance that accompany meth use.

See http://www.facesofmeth.us/

WARNING some may find these images shocking/disturbing...

[AndresEscobar]

No sign of the appearance changes that often go with frequent meth use however.

One of my side projects at a recent gig was to measure the facial similarity of meth users after short periods. I believe we were the first people to do this type of study FWIW. Meth use is connected to identity theft in many cases and we were interested in whether we would be able to identify people during the rapid changes in appearance that accompany meth use.

See http://www.facesofmeth.us/

WARNING some may find these images shocking/disturbing...

Good point. He's too doughy for meth. Unless he just started using? How fast does it take to experience facial changes? I mean, he didn't have great skin . . .

[magnaccia]

I feel infinitely dumber after reading that blog's comments. I love the back and forth between religious zealots condemning people's beliefs for being at the wrong at of the spectrum from their's almost as much as the illiterate artists and horrorcore aficionados who can't spell their insults nor correctly spell their musical influences name's.

[magnaccia]

I'd guess meth too if he's on drugs but he could have been strung out on roxies/oxies, tripping on a lot of cid or shrooms, whippits, freon, etc. There are a lot of drugs that can unbalance you, depending on how much he may have done or in what combinations. That could also explain why he doesn't speak to the police and has spent most of his time asleep, could be withdrawling.

Then again, you'd think that tidbit would have been released by now to explain at least some of the horrific aspects of the murders.

[dangrsmind]

Good point. He's too doughy for meth. Unless he just started using? How fast does it take to experience facial changes? I mean, he didn't have great skin . . .

We observed cases where there were significant facial changes over a period of as little as 3 months, but more typically 18-36 months. By significant facial changes I mean that a state of the art facial recognition system would assign a low matching score when comparing the faces.

We don't see these sorts of facial changes with the McCroskey images and we do have some historical images to compare to.

[Heroine]

Good point. He's too doughy for meth. Unless he just started using? How fast does it take to experience facial changes? I mean, he didn't have great skin . . .

Yeah thats what makes me somewhat discredit drug use, most drugs make you lose weight, but he looks a tad hefty to me.
Although it could have been something new to him.

[Heroine]

this site? horror-core.blogspot.com (http://horror-core.blogspot.com/)

Has anyone ever posted on that site that had something actually published, i mean comment wise?

[dangrsmind]

I'd guess meth too if he's on drugs but he could have been strung out on roxies/oxies, tripping on a lot of cid or shrooms, whippits, freon, etc. There are a lot of drugs that can unbalance you, depending on how much he may have done or in what combinations. That could also explain why he doesn't speak to the police and has spent most of his time asleep, could be withdrawling.

Then again, you'd think that tidbit would have been released by now to explain at least some of the horrific aspects of the murders.

I haven't seen any evidence of harder drugs being used at STFW, just some weed and alcohol. But you know it's an underground event and I find that a bit hard to believe actually. We know that McCroskey's sister used a variety of chemical additives for example. She's reportedly not doing that sort of thing any more BTW, I'm just saying it seems likely that other drugs were used by some of the attendees of this event. Comparing his YouTube postings to his sister's, Sam seems like he was more of a drinker than anything else. Hard to say I guess.

[dangrsmind]

Has anyone ever posted on that site that had something actually published, i mean comment wise?

There is at least one poster here who was published there. Or someone using the same handle.

[dangrsmind]

Yeah thats what makes me somewhat discredit drug use, most drugs make you lose weight, but he looks a tad hefty to me.
Although it could have been something new to him.

It's really hard to say from images when you don't know everything about the sources, but examining the images we have it looks like he gained weight over the past year or two.

Two drugs that do lead to weight gain in many cases would be weed and alcohol. But maybe he just likes to eat and he's not getting much exercise. No way to say.

[Heroine]

It's really hard to say from images when you don't know everything about the sources, but examining the images we have it looks like he gained weight over the past year or two.

Two drugs that do lead to weight gain in many cases would be weed and alcohol. But maybe he just likes to eat and he's not getting much exercise. No way to say.

I agree about the weed and alcohol. I've done my fair share unfortunately, but if I recall correctly it was stated somewhere that he loved to run, well don't you think running would have helped that situation? I run and I don't gain weight. I may not lose a lot but I don't gain any either.

[AndresEscobar]

It's really hard to say from images when you don't know everything about the sources, but examining the images we have it looks like he gained weight over the past year or two.

Two drugs that do lead to weight gain in many cases would be weed and alcohol. But maybe he just likes to eat and he's not getting much exercise. No way to say.

I know a few bigger guys that love oxies and vics . . . Along with weed and alcohol.

[dangrsmind]

I agree about the weed and alcohol. I've done my fair share unfortunately, but if I recall correctly it was stated somewhere that he loved to run, well don't you think running would have helped that situation? I run and I don't gain weight. I may not lose a lot but I don't gain any either.

I missed the running thing. Interesting.

[Heroine]

I missed the running thing. Interesting.

Yeah I'll have to find where I saw that. I know his sister commented on it once and I believe his myspace mentioned going for a jog once.

[dangrsmind]

I know a few bigger guys that love oxies and vics . . . Along with weed and alcohol.

Sure.

One of my college roommates got involved with cocaine way back in the day. He was a big guy and I think one of the things he liked about it was that it made him lose weight. But even when he was dealing you never would have called him skinny exactly. He was smaller, but still pretty large if you catch my drift.

So really anything is possible here.

[Heroine]

Here his mother mentions it....
Her son was shy and quiet and spent a lot of time in his room making music or doing online performances, she said. But he had friends growing up and took karate lessons and liked to jog.
http://www2.newsadvance.com/lna/news/state_regional/article/horrorcore_rap_artist_alerted_police_to_slayings_s uspect/19793/

[magnaccia]

He could just be a larged boned little darling too. Or just likes to eat, if you continually stuff your face it doesn't matter if you're coked up or what.

Also, the fact he stayed in his room so often and was a big gamer/online nork explains how he could remain hefty, if he was doing drugs.

And given the fact the sister said mom loved to toke up and neglect her children, is she really the person to ask about Samwise's lifestyle? She probably had very little clue what was going on in either of her children's lives, especially Sam's

[dangrsmind]

Here his mother mentions it....

http://www2.newsadvance.com/lna/news/state_regional/article/horrorcore_rap_artist_alerted_police_to_slayings_s uspect/19793/

Right. This goes against the theory that he was too wimpy or out of shape to heft the maul or move the bodies around. I think it is clear that he could have done both.

[Heroine]

He could just be a larged boned little darling too. Or just likes to eat, if you continually stuff your face it doesn't matter if you're coked up or what.

Also, the fact he stayed in his room so often and was a big gamer/online nork explains how he could remain hefty, if he was doing drugs.

And given the fact the sister said mom loved to toke up and neglect her children, is she really the person to ask about Samwise's lifestyle? She probably had very little clue what was going on in either of her children's lives, especially Sam's

She may have had little to no idea what her kids were doing but I have also seen he and his sister comment on how he liked to jog, thats how I originally got the idea.

[absynthminded1]

Has anyone ever posted on that site that had something actually published, i mean comment wise?

I have... a few times.

[Heroine]

I have... a few times.

I posted something and didn't realize until I wrote like a 3 page report that i had to wait for it to be reviewed....
That's why I was asking. Thanks for the info!
:)

[absynthminded1]

I posted something and didn't realize until I wrote like a 3 page report that i had to wait for it to be reviewed....
That's why I was asking. Thanks for the info!
:)

No problem! The guy who runs the blog seems to have his own agenda, thus he is meticulous about what he allows to be posted on the blog.

[Heroine]

No problem! The guy who runs the blog seems to have his own agenda, thus he is meticulous about what he allows to be posted on the blog.

That's what I figured. Who knows maybe he'll still post mine. :)
Now I'm curious as to what you said, I'm going to have to go take a look.

[tapu]

That's hilarious--so those are the reviewed posts!

[absynthminded1]

The blog owner may mean well, but he does seem a bit like one of the tin hat wearing types... and he does seem to have a bit of a grudge against fatass and his band of misfits.

[AndresEscobar]

I'm still cracking up about the banner I saw that advertised that SKR's hoodies are now available in XL-3XL.

[magnaccia]

My first thought was the site was done for monetary purposes. It was/is a relatively hot news story and could have driven quite a bit of traffic to a site relating to the story.

But I don't see too many ads running on the site and I noticed the counter at the bottom only registers 200kish hits.

[Nikolai]

I doubt he cares to be spared

A lot of horrible murderers, as bad or even worse than McCroskey if thats possible, are the biggest cowards ever when it comes to their own death and they will try to run appeals as many years as they can to avoid their own death. Once in awhile a death row inmate will drop appeals and accept their sentence, but its very very rare. Sometimes the inmate will appeal for decades, but Virginia has one of the best appeal processes, I think the average inmate is on death row for like 8 years before execution.

[Nikolai]

Blame the mother eh?

Certainly possible, but idk. I have a couple of problems with this story.

How does calling the police give him an alibi? It places him at the scene close to the time of the murders.

If he doesn't care about being caught, why is he trying to construct an alibi? It seems hard to believe that he both doesn't care about getting caught AND that he is trying to construct an alibi however lame.

What was he doing on Poorhouse Road? Most likely dumping evidence, but we don't know yet. If he wants to get caught, why dump the evidence?

He was already easily placed at the scene of the crime at the time of the murders. He probably made a quick and panicked plan before fleeing the house to divert future attention somewhere else, a possible unknown person he heard in or around the house at the time he left.

I think he was on poorhouse road most likely because he never had driven in the area in his life. If not that it may possibly have been as you say to get rid of evidence, maybe they found the murder weapon there, who knows. I think theres an outside chance he was scouting the area for a place to dump the bodies before heading for the airport but he had to ditch that plan after getting his car stuck. I think its obvious he was trying to avoid being caught.

I think blame will be put on a lot of things to try and avoid a death sentence. I think blame will be put on his upbringing, his heavy interest in horrorcore, the crowd he hung around with, possible drug use. Im guessing with drugs at worst he only had marijuana in his system. These days though people will even try to blame anti-depressants for a murder they committed. I dont think any of those excuses will work but you never know with any jury, some may feel sorry for him and buy what the defense is selling.

[deita]

he liked to jog

maybe in his early elementary school years only? :)

mercurynews.com/news/ci_13413230 (http://www.mercurynews.com/news/ci_13413230?source=email)

In high school, Sarah and her brother were teased and picked on at school, mainly because of their weight and "ginger" hair.

[dangrsmind]

He was already easily placed at the scene of the crime at the time of the murders. He probably made a quick and panicked plan before fleeing the house to divert future attention somewhere else, a possible unknown person he heard in or around the house at the time he left.


How so? all of the individuals that could have placed him there are dead.

I think he was on poorhouse road most likely because he never had driven in the area in his life. If not that it may possibly have been as you say to get rid of evidence, maybe they found the murder weapon there, who knows. I think theres an outside chance he was scouting the area for a place to dump the bodies before heading for the airport but he had to ditch that plan after getting his car stuck. I think its obvious he was trying to avoid being caught.


Highly unlikely he was on this road at 4AM by accident. The road leads nowhere and if he was trying to escape to the airport he would have to turn off the road that goes there to end up on Poorhouse Road. I posted an image of the intersection and there is no chance of confusing the way he went as the correct way to the airport as some have suggested.

[peace_gurl]

He had a terrible odor because he lived in the house with dead folks, or who knows he may have loved the smell. How can we explain his thought process?

[maunsapt]

i came upon another interesting blog about Sam and his killing brought more attention to him than Horrorcore itself. i don't know if this had been posted or not, but, it's interesting to read other Horrorcore folks' feelings on Sam.

http://www.insan0.com/SykoSam.html

[peace_gurl]

question? Did he have a driving permit? He left the family van in the drive way.

[gxm]

question? Did he have a driving permit? He left the family van in the drive way.

IIRC, Sam did not have a driver's license; he had a California ID card.

Early on we were speculating why he would take the pastor's car and leave the van. Perhaps the van was low on gas, or he couldn't find the keys?

[dangrsmind]

i came upon another interesting blog about Sam and his killing brought more attention to him than Horrorcore itself. i don't know if this had been posted or not, but, it's interesting to read other Horrorcore folks' feelings on Sam.

http://www.insan0.com/SykoSam.html

The claim is made there that McCroskey was in contact with the police before his arrest.

[gxm]

How so? all of the individuals that could have placed him there are dead.
(respectfully snipped)

However, he has been placed at the house when there were dead bodies there. LE came by after the three women had been killed and after the pastor had been killed. It would be very difficult for Sam's defense to argue that he was oblivious to the dead bodies, especially considering that the scene has been described as horrific.

[peace_gurl]

Poorhouse road would not be my choice to learn to drive on. It is a narrow road that would be difficult to travel at night. If he was going to turn around and go back to Farmville he would not have turned on Poor House Road. He would have used a cross over between the double highway. It is not a freeway.

[peace_gurl]

How so? all of the individuals that could have placed him there are dead.



Highly unlikely he was on this road at 4AM by accident. The road leads nowhere and if he was trying to escape to the airport he would have to turn off the road that goes there to end up on Poorhouse Road. I posted an image of the intersection and there is no chance of confusing the way he went as the correct way to the airport as some have suggested.
He was seen by the neighbors walking up and down the street alone. He went to the local Kroger to get groceries and other things.

[dangrsmind]

To Everyone In The Horrorcore Community:

What up everyone, I felt it was necessary to publicly state some things and let everyone know whats up with Wicked Intent as a Record Label and also as an Online Radio Station...

There are some BIG BIG changes in store for both. I have officially decided to step down as CEO of Wicked Intent. Many of you are probably freaking out at this point wondering WHY I am stepping down after I have spent YEARS building Wicked Intent. Well, the truth is... I am now in school full time and I am paying LOTS of money for my education. I am going to school now to become a Certified Audio Engineer, working in a major recording studio in Southern California. This will take up pretty much all my time with all the homework, studio time and internship that I will be going through. This is a very big step in my life that deserves the utmost attention from myself and running a record label is a full time job in itself.

It was a very long, hard decision that I had to make and I felt that instead of completely closing the doors at Wicked Intent, I would hand it off to some of my best peoples. So, I hereby announce that I will be handing over the title of CEO of the Record label to my boy DARK PREACHA. Dark Preacha has shown me that he has what it takes to run the label in the same way I would. He is very business minded and with the help of his wife to run the webstore things will continue as they were, but at the same time continue to evolve and push foward as a prominent force in the horrorcore genre.

As for the radio station, I have given full and utter control to Red33. She will now be the SOLE owner of Wicked Intent Radio and will continue to dominate the Horrorcore Airwaves as we have always done. Of course Killa Satan will be helping Red33 with running the radio station and all the current DJ shows and things you've grown to love about Wicked Intent Radio will remain intact.

Now... you're probably wondering where I stand as an artist in this genre. With myself being so busy with focusing on my schooling I will be taking an indefinite hiatus from making new music. I am unsure how long this hiatus will occur but it will mean that my album will be put on hold untill I decide when I am able to come back. As for my group with Fenixz, Shadow Psyche, we have decided to disband as a group. With me taking a hiatus and such, Fenixz has decided that he does not wish to make horrorcore anymore as we have put all our "chips in the bag" for Shadow Psyche. He will continue behind the scenes making beats and working on his beat company with his partner DSK @ "Cryptic Productions" but as for Fenixz as a horrorcore artist, he is officially done.

A lot of you may be thinking (and I know a lot of you are....) that this has something to do with the **** that happenend with LiLdEmOnDoG (Syko Sam) and the VA murders. Well it has absoultely NOTHING to do with any of that ****. I have never not once blamed myself, music or my label for the **** one person did. This is about my schooling and being in a recording studio nearly 12-15 hours a day and simply not having time to run a record label PROPERLY and rather then shut down shop I have decided to "pass the torch". I do not have time to run a webstore full time, or run 6 different websites full time or any of the other things that would keep me sitting infront of a computer for 8-10 hours a day, I simply cant dedicate the time I used to while I dedicate even more time to my education and career.

In closing, I really do appreciate all our supporters, and I'm sure some of you will not be happy to hear this news. It is something that I have spent a few weeks deciding, and I have come to the conclusion that this would be the best possible route for myself. I will continue from here on out as a fan like I once was until I decide I am able to return from a hiatus. Much luv and respect to all our hardcore supporters and fellow artists we've worked with, Wicked Intent will continue to support and help build this genre!

Respectfully,
Syniister

[dangrsmind]

Poorhouse road would not be my choice to learn to drive on. It is a narrow road that would be difficult to travel at night. If he was going to turn around and go back to Farmville he would not have turned on Poor House Road. He would have used a cross over between the double highway. It is not a freeway.

Agree.

[maunsapt]

i came upon another interesting blog about Sam and his killing brought more attention to him than Horrorcore itself. i don't know if this had been posted or not, but, it's interesting to read other Horrorcore folks' feelings on Sam.

http://www.insan0.com/SykoSam.html

i should have warned of this url's home page. probably best not go there if you are squeamish or not, it's quite graphic and its image could stay with you for a while.

[dangrsmind]

However, he has been placed at the house when there were dead bodies there. LE came by after the three women had been killed and after the pastor had been killed. It would be very difficult for Sam's defense to argue that he was oblivious to the dead bodies, especially considering that the scene has been described as horrific.

Right.

But I was thinking about why he might have called the police to the house to report the mysterious noises in the cellar. As an alibi, the false intruder story sucks because McCroskey is still placed at the scene at the time of the murders and the mysterious intruder is nowhere around to be found. Attention would have still turned his way even if his little story had played out. Also, I haven't heard that he made any attempt to create a false point of entry or some similar false indication of a real intruder. But again, maybe he is just that dumb or we don't have all the facts.

[dangrsmind]

He was seen by the neighbors walking up and down the street alone. He went to the local Kroger to get groceries and other things.

Very important information. This explains his need to create a false intruder.

"other things"?

Now I am curious about what exactly he bought.

[Heroine]

maybe in his early elementary school years only? :)

mercurynews.com/news/ci_13413230 (http://www.mercurynews.com/news/ci_13413230?source=email)

Well unless he's a liar, which is highly possible, he was running in july of this year according to his myspace. I'll have to find it, let me look around and see if i can find it.

[maunsapt]

very interesting that Syniister decided to go on hiatus from the Horrorcore music and company. He says its not from the VA killings, but one can wonder anyway, the timing and all with this decision.

[tapu]

maybe in his early elementary school years only? :)

mercurynews.com/news/ci_13413230 (http://www.mercurynews.com/news/ci_13413230?source=email)

I get the impression that McCroskey's childhood has been mythologized for him. (As are most people's to some extent.) He may have been a runner in early adolescence before he found sloth and drugs and alcohol. Also, his mom may have been volunteer in school when he was little, but it's easy to be involved in your kids' stuff then when they're cute and fun, and he wouldn't have that strong of a memory of it except for what she's told him as kids at that age don't form memories like that usually. She's probably more like what Sarah describes, in his recent life.

[Nikolai]

How so? all of the individuals that could have placed him there are dead.

http://www2.timesdispatch.com/rtd/news/local/crime/article/FARM27_20090926-221606/295789/

Because LE had already came into contact with him at the house before the call to check the basement. They went to the house and talked to him after Melanies mom called them worried about her daughter.

Highly unlikely he was on this road at 4AM by accident. The road leads nowhere and if he was trying to escape to the airport he would have to turn off the road that goes there to end up on Poorhouse Road. I posted an image of the intersection and there is no chance of confusing the way he went as the correct way to the airport as some have suggested.

I wouldnt say its highly unlikely or theres "no chance" for anybody to not get confused, lost, or make a wrong turn in an area they had never been in during their life no matter how clear things seem to you from a picture. People get lost and make wrong turns driving even on expressways. He could have been there to get rid of evidence, Im not saying thats not a possibility, my guess though is he didnt know where he was at.

[peace_gurl]

Right.

But I was thinking about why he might have called the police to the house to report the mysterious noises in the cellar. As an alibi, the false intruder story sucks because McCroskey is still placed at the scene at the time of the murders and the mysterious intruder is nowhere around to be found. Attention would have still turned his way even if his little story had played out. Also, I haven't heard that he made any attempt to create a false point of entry or some similar false indication of a real intruder. But again, maybe he is just that dumb or we don't have all the facts.
humn......question why do you think he called the police The officer that did the check was a skinny cop. Do you think he wanted to kill a cop too? Gotta remember he made that call shortly after the welfare check.

[peace_gurl]

Very important information. This explains his need to create a false intruder.

"other things"?

Now I am curious about what exactly he bought.
The kroger that he visited is in a shopping center. There is a little bit of everything there. The students of the university walk back there to purchase just about anything.
It is just a few blocks away.

[peace_gurl]

Very important information. This explains his need to create a false intruder.

"other things"?

Now I am curious about what exactly he bought.
I have heard rumors of things bought but dont know it for fact so would not feel comfortable posting it.

[Heroine]

How do I look at the attachments for the other 2 threads without looking through the whole thread, because I believe it was on his status page and i think we already have an attachment of that somewhere.

[tapu]

I have heard rumors of things bought but dont know it for fact so would not feel comfortable posting it.



A loud groan just went up from various locations all around the country.... :)

[Nikolai]

I get the impression that McCroskey's childhood has been mythologized for him. (As are most people's to some extent.) He may have been a runner in early adolescence before he found sloth and drugs and alcohol. Also, his mom may have been volunteer in school when he was little, but it's easy to be involved in your kids' stuff then when they're cute and fun, and he wouldn't have that strong of a memory of it except for what she's told him as kids at that age don't form memories like that usually. She's probably more like what Sarah describes, in his recent life.

I also think theres a strong possibility that the extent of how bad his childhood was will be greatly exaggerated and it may not be as bad as will be said.

[tapu]

I also think theres a strong possibility that the extent of how bad his childhood was will be greatly exaggerated and it may not be as bad as will be said.

I think that probably happens in a lot of cases, but the bad parenting in Sam's case rings very plausible to me.

[dangrsmind]

I have heard rumors of things bought but dont know it for fact so would not feel comfortable posting it.

Understood.

If he was planning to do some clean up he might have bought things like plastic garbage bags, rubber gloves, certain household chemicals, tools, etc. Of course a lot of this would likely be in the house already too.

Other items purchased might tend to support or weaken some of the other theories discussed here as well.

[deita]

How do I look at the attachments for the other 2 threads without looking through the whole thread, because I believe it was on his status page and i think we already have an attachment of that somewhere.

you were absolutely right! :)

http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/ae71/absurds/ldd.jpg

[peace_gurl]

This is an important question why do you think he called the police The officer that did the check was a skinny cop. Do you think he wanted to kill a cop too? Gotta remember he made the intruder call shortly after the welfare check.

[tapu]

This is an important question why do you think he called the police The officer that did the check was a skinny cop. Do you think he wanted to kill a cop too? Gotta remember he made the intruder call shortly after the welfare check.

Early on when this was being suggested, it didn't seem very likely to me. I just didn't imagine him, at that time, as being so intentionally set on certain types of kills, for example, that it might be why he killed a pastor. But the more that has been pointed out about how this went down, including where you said he might have expected the one guy and then got two others, then the more I have to let this idea in as a possibility. Also, there just seem to be no other satisfying theories for why he called.

On edit... I was just remembering: were there 4 icons that get killed in the video that ex-horrorcore guy was in? One was a priest? Was another a cop? And what were the others?

[deita]

I was just remembering: were there 4 icons that get killed in the video that ex-horrorcore guy was in? One was a priest? Was another a cop? And what were the others?

sammccrosky.blogspot.com (http://sammccrosky.blogspot.com/2009/09/sam-mccrosky-aka-syko-sam-aka-lil-demon.html)

In the video (In Tha Name Of) they killed a priest, a Rabbi, a Muslim Cleric, and the Pope

p.s. this video is by Sicktanick not Syniister

[dangrsmind]

Early on when this was being suggested, it didn't seem very likely to me. I just didn't imagine him, at that time, as being so intentionally set on certain types of kills, for example, that it might be why he killed a pastor. But the more that has been pointed out about how this went down, including where you said he might have expected the one guy and then got two others, then the more I have to let this idea in as a possibility. Also, there just seem to be no other satisfying theories for why he called.

On edit... I was just remembering: were there 4 icons that get killed in the video that ex-horrorcore guy was in? One was a priest? Was another a cop? And what were the others?

Think you have SickTanick confused with the Village People here ;)

[Nikolai]

This is an important question why do you think he called the police The officer that did the check was a skinny cop. Do you think he wanted to kill a cop too? Gotta remember he made the intruder call shortly after the welfare check.

I dont think he had any intention to kill the police officer who came to check the basement, I think he wanted to put someone imaginary at the scene before he bolted for California.

[tapu]

Think you have SickTanick confused with the Village People here ;)

Okay, you got me there. Literally, LOL. :)

[dangrsmind]

I dont think he had any intention to kill the police officer who came to check the basement, I think he wanted to put someone imaginary at the scene before he bolted for California.

If so it is an interesting factoid that he chose to use a horror movie cliche, the mysterious sound in the cellar, to set up his alibi. Confirming that he watched a few too many of these movies perhaps....

[dangrsmind]

This is an important question why do you think he called the police The officer that did the check was a skinny cop. Do you think he wanted to kill a cop too? Gotta remember he made the intruder call shortly after the welfare check.

Who knows, but it would have been really dumb. In both cases the dispatcher knew the officers were at the house.

[Nikolai]

Early on when this was being suggested, it didn't seem very likely to me. I just didn't imagine him, at that time, as being so intentionally set on certain types of kills, for example, that it might be why he killed a pastor. But the more that has been pointed out about how this went down, including where you said he might have expected the one guy and then got two others, then the more I have to let this idea in as a possibility. Also, there just seem to be no other satisfying theories for why he called.

On edit... I was just remembering: were there 4 icons that get killed in the video that ex-horrorcore guy was in? One was a priest? Was another a cop? And what were the others?

In the video I think one was supposed to be a jewish person and one was supposed to be a muslim. I dont think Sam planned and killed the father because he was a priest, I think he killed him simply because he showed up at the house and wanted to know where the victims were.

[dangrsmind]

In the video I think one was supposed to be a jewish person and one was supposed to be a muslim. I dont think Sam planned and killed the father because he was a priest, I think he killed him simply because he showed up at the house and wanted to know where the victims were.

Seems likely given the use of a log on the father.

However, alternatively, he could have wanted another victim. This helps explain why he was hanging around the house after the initial killings which otherwise is pretty hard to explain. And there were four victims in the video.

[peace_gurl]

I dont think he had any intention to kill the police officer who came to check the basement, I think he wanted to put someone imaginary at the scene before he bolted for California.
I totally disagree!

[dangrsmind]

I totally disagree!

So you suspect he was waiting for a fourth victim?

[peace_gurl]

If so it is an interesting factoid that he chose to use a horror movie cliche, the mysterious sound in the cellar, to set up his alibi. Confirming that he watched a few too many of these movies perhaps....
What a dumb thing for him to do when he knew there were two dogs and two cats down there. ....I am sure the officers laughed at him.

[peace_gurl]

So you suspect he was waiting for a fourth victim?
Why on earth would you stay with 3 dead bodies for several days? He robbed the preacher....he could have used that money to get an early flight rather than hanging around. Surely he knew the bodies would tell the story of when they were killed. The professional clean up crew stayed at that house many, many days. A huge dumpster was placed outside the door for things that had to be thrown away. I dont believe he tried to clean up the crime scene. I believe he enjoyed his stay.

[dangrsmind]

Why on earth would you stay with 3 dead bodies for several days? He robbed the preacher....he could have used that money to get an early flight rather than hanging around. Surely he knew the bodies would tell the story of when they were killed. The professional clean up crew stayed at that house many, many days. A huge dumpster was placed outside the door for things that had to be thrown away. I dont believe he tried to clean up the crime scene. I believe he enjoyed his stay.

Hmm. Seems like you suspect something more along the lines of a ritualistic killing or some type of corpse manipulation. And I am guessing that you have heard something that you aren't saying here.

[maunsapt]

Why on earth would you stay with 3 dead bodies for several days? He robbed the preacher....he could have used that money to get an early flight rather than hanging around. Surely he knew the bodies would tell the story of when they were killed. The professional clean up crew stayed at that house many, many days. A huge dumpster was placed outside the door for things that had to be thrown away. I dont believe he tried to clean up the crime scene. I believe he enjoyed his stay.

he robbed the preacher? i don't recall reading about it, only that he took the preacher's car. i do appreciate your input tho on the above information concerning the dumpster.

[maunsapt]

not just the dumpster, but the cleaning crew needing to be utilized for days and such.

[peace_gurl]

not just the dumpster, but the cleaning crew needing to be utilized for days and such.
Let me put it this way, two members of my family were murdered, we did not have to have a clean up team for a week to take care it and a dumpster was not needed

[Nikolai]

I totally disagree!

So you think he said "I want to kill a police officer before I leave this house?" Like you said, I totally disagree!

[peace_gurl]

he robbed the preacher? i don't recall reading about it, only that he took the preacher's car. i do appreciate your input tho on the above information concerning the dumpster.
If I remember reading correctly, the preacher was going to make a deposit and then to Richmond for a meeting. Never made it to do either. That may just be a rumor that I heard from a member of his church or community.

[peace_gurl]

So you think he said "I want to kill a police officer before I leave this house?" Like you said, I totally disagree!
I believe time will tell the entire story! : )

[Nikolai]

I believe time will tell the entire story! : )

Me too, and the simplicity of the crime is going to shock many going by a lot of the outrageous over the top Hollywood movie-like speculation you read here.

[peace_gurl]

I dont think he had any intention to kill the police officer who came to check the basement, I think he wanted to put someone imaginary at the scene before he bolted for California.
Don't think he thought he was going to get away with it. What did he have to lose? Think about it....why not really make himself name to remember....after all "Jesus told him to do it"

[Nikolai]

Don't think he thought he was going to get away with it. What did he have to lose? Think about it....why not really make himself name to remember....after all "Jesus told him to do it"

I dont know, you tell me. Why didnt he make himself a name to remember and try to kill the cops if he had a fscination with it? What did he have to lose? Why would he care? After all, as you say he knew he wouldnt get away with it? Why did he get taken so easily? Why didnt he take a cop or two with him? After all, "Jesus told him to do it." :rolleyes:

Most murderers if they think about it realize theyre not going to get away with it, but it doesnt stop nearly all of them with trying to. Sam McCroskey gets way too much credit on here. Like most killers he's a typical coward who was scared of the consequences he was facing after what he had done set in.

[dangrsmind]

The "simple crime" theory fails to explain why he didn't flee after the first three murders when he easily could have, nor does it suggest any explanation for what he was doing in the house with the bodies during the time between the initial killings and the killing of Emma's father.

Maybe he was just eating bon bons and watching Oprah.

[Nikolai]

The "simple crime" theory fails to explain why he didn't flee after the first three murders when he easily could have, nor does it suggest any explanation for what he was doing in the house with the bodies during the time between the initial killings and the killing of Emma's father.

Maybe he was just eating bon bons and watching Oprah.

Maybe he thought there wasnt a reason to leave early? Maybe he wanted to be with the dead bodies for a few days? Maybe he thought leaving early would look suspicious? Maybe he stayed to try and think of a plan to get rid of the bodies? Maybe he didnt know what to do and the easiest thing to do was nothing. And Im sure he was eating and watching tv while he was there, though it may not have been bon-bons and oprah. What we do know is once the LE pressure came on he was gone.

[deita]

A couple more links

Sam's Photobucket account:
photobucket.com/albums/c49/LiLdEmOnDoG/ (http://s24.photobucket.com/albums/c49/LiLdEmOnDoG/)

&

Richard Samuel McCroskey

[peace_gurl]

The "simple crime" theory fails to explain why he didn't flee after the first three murders when he easily could have, nor does it suggest any explanation for what he was doing in the house with the bodies during the time between the initial killings and the killing of Emma's father.

Maybe he was just eating bon bons and watching Oprah.
Don't think he was just eating bon bons and watching Oprah.
He was using the computer the phone, and walking the streets of our small, quiet, college town though.
I think you are on the right track dangrsmind.
Oh, and he ate just fine at the Huddle House so the manager said.

[dangrsmind]

Don't think he was just eating bon bons and watching Oprah.
He was using the computer the phone, and walking the streets of our small, quiet, college town though.
I think you are on the right track dangrsmind.
Oh, and he ate just fine at the Huddle House so the manager said.

Interesting.

[peace_gurl]

I dont know, you tell me. Why didnt he make himself a name to remember and try to kill the cops if he had a fscination with it? What did he have to lose? Why would he care? After all, as you say he knew he wouldnt get away with it? Why did he get taken so easily? Why didnt he take a cop or two with him? After all, "Jesus told him to do it." :rolleyes:

Most murderers if they think about it realize theyre not going to get away with it, but it doesnt stop nearly all of them with trying to. Sam McCroskey gets way too much credit on here. Like most killers he's a typical coward who was scared of the consequences he was facing after what he had done set in.
He does not want to die that is why "Jesus told him to do it." He could not overpower two policemen at one time but he could wait at the top of the steps with the maul and kill one officer with no problem. If he wanted to die he would have put up a fight with the Richmond police. He wanted his fame first with the horrorcore ppl and get off with the "Jesus told me to do it" defense.
I can not imagine what went thru his mind the days after the slayings and living in the conditions that he lived in.

[Nikolai]

He does not want to die that is why "Jesus told him to do it." He could not overpower two policemen at one time but he could wait at the top of the steps with the maul and kill one officer with no problem. If he wanted to die he would have put up a fight with the Richmond police. He wanted his fame first with the horrorcore ppl and get off with the "Jesus told me to do it" defense.
I can not imagine what went thru his mind the days after the slayings and living in the conditions that he lived in.

Oh, so he didnt kill one officer because the other one would have killed him. He wants to be famous, he has nothing to lose and has no cares, except when it comes to himself dying. Well it makes sense now, I guess he did call the police to kill them, even though he didnt. This McCroskey is the most special and well thought out murderer in our countrys history. And the "Jesus told me to do it" defense, wow, this guy is brilliant.

Like I said McCroskey gets way too much credit on here, this guy is no more special than any other killer, and he was not close to as well thought out and deep as many are hoping he is for whatever reason. McCroskey lived in the conditions of the house because he's a sick man, he killed three women with a maul, it probably wasnt as hard for him to hang around three bodies as it would be for us.

[peace_gurl]

On Monday, Sept 14 Sam sets his MySpace mood to "determined" and Emma set hers to "blazenBamBooka" with a "frown" icon.

What do you think Emma means when she sets her MySpace mood to "blazenBamBooka" with a "frown" icon?

[Nikolai]

Interesting.

Hook, line, and sinker.

[Heroine]

Is this girl even 16?
WARNING nudity, if anyone feels this is absolutely inappropriate I can delete this. This is an image from the SKR myspace....
http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=viewImage&friendID=64907055&albumID=2984831&imageID=54374147#a=2984831&i=54374445
I thought this was against myspace rules and regulations somehow. I mean if I can look at it so can 14 yo kids.
oops wrong link, it's fixed now though.

[Heroine]

On Monday, Sept 14 Sam sets his MySpace mood to "determined" and Emma set hers to "blazenBamBooka" with a "frown" icon.

What do you think Emma means when she sets her MySpace mood to "blazenBamBooka" with a "frown" icon?

I think she meant smoking weed. I'm not sure what the frown is all about though.
Edited to say that kitty is so cute! :)

[peace_gurl]

Oh, so he didnt kill one officer because the other one would have killed him. He wants to be famous, he has nothing to lose and has no cares, except when it comes to himself dying. Well it makes sense now, I guess he did call the police to kill them, even though he didnt. This McCroskey is the most special and well thought out murderer in our countrys history. And the "Jesus told me to do it" defense, wow, this guy is brilliant.

Like I said McCroskey gets way too much credit on here, this guy is no more special than any other killer, and he was not close to as well thought out and deep as many are hoping he is for whatever reason. McCroskey lived in the conditions of the house because he's a sick man, he killed three women with a maul, it probably wasnt as hard for him to hang around three bodies as it would be for us.
"McCroskey calls police from Kelley residence, claiming to hear noises from basement," "Friday, Sept 18 12:58am: He requests that the same officer that previously responded to return to check it out. The requested officer was on another call, so two other FPD officers respond, enter house, go to basement, find nothing suspicious, and leave." Ok, then tell me what you think that was all about? Wow, I don't want to give him too much credit. : )

[Nikolai]

"McCroskey calls police from Kelley residence, claiming to hear noises from basement," "Friday, Sept 18 12:58am: He requests that the same officer that previously responded to return to check it out. The requested officer was on another call, so two other FPD officers respond, enter house, go to basement, find nothing suspicious, and leave." Ok, then tell me what you think that was all about? Wow, I don't want to give him too much credit. : )

Well if thats true then that proves he wanted to kill him. Case closed. And youre not giving him too much credit, believing this kid committed this deeply planned crime to become the famous madman who used a "jesus told me to do it" defense. Its all so clear now.

[peace_gurl]

I think she meant smoking weed. I'm not sure what the frown is all about though.
Edited to say that kitty is so cute! :)
thanks, that is what my daughter said she thought it meant.
Thank you, I love my kitty too....I have saved 18 real ones from being put down.

[dangrsmind]

He does not want to die that is why "Jesus told him to do it." He could not overpower two policemen at one time but he could wait at the top of the steps with the maul and kill one officer with no problem. If he wanted to die he would have put up a fight with the Richmond police. He wanted his fame first with the horrorcore ppl and get off with the "Jesus told me to do it" defense.
I can not imagine what went thru his mind the days after the slayings and living in the conditions that he lived in.

Maybe something like this:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10929243

Or this:

http://www.detnews.com/article/20090908/METRO/909080403/Man-charged-with-mutilation-of-corpse-after-dismembered-body-found-in-freezer?imw=Y

Etc.

[Heroine]

Well at least we know emma and mel went to sicktanick and raz's room...
http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=viewImage&friendID=64907055&albumID=2984831&imageID=54374147#a=2984831&i=54374288
Raz calls sam lildemonfrog....
http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=viewImage&friendID=64907055&albumID=2659486&imageID=44293602

[Nikolai]

Maybe something like this:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10929243

Or this:

http://www.detnews.com/article/20090908/METRO/909080403/Man-charged-with-mutilation-of-corpse-after-dismembered-body-found-in-freezer?imw=Y

Etc.

That wouldnt shock me. I dont know if thats the reason he wanted to stay in the house or not, but maybe he liked the opportunity to be around some corpses.

[Mia]

Fascinating, yet horrible, case. I'm thoroughly impressed with some of the members' devotion to this story, and to exploring all possible (and some seemingly impossible) angles. Sam clearly had a horrible home life, with no familial support, affection or love of any kind, at least in the recent past. I believe part of the reason he hung around the house for so many days after the murders is because he was enjoying having the place and space to himself. He wasn't holed up in his bedroom, avoiding the insults of his sister or the depressing scene of his mother smoking pot and watching TV all day. I believe he was quite content eating the Kellys' food, playing on the computer, watching TV, going grocery shopping, and "playing house" for a bit of time, as sick as that may sound considering there were three and later four bodies sharing the space.

As far as why he took Mark's car, I don't think we can ever know the answer to this unless Sam reveals it. For all we know, he may have just needed some air (no pun intended, ahem) and a change of scenery and gone out for a joyride. Using the car for disposal of evidence or scouting for a possible body dumping site doesn't sit right with me - I think that's giving him too much credit and foresight.

And, finally, it seems we've determined, due to Peace Gurl's valuable, much appreciated information, that he called the skinny policeman to the house, in particular requesting to the dispatcher the 'same one who came before', in order to probably murder him as well. Perhaps by this point he was 'coming down' off the high of killing the other four victims and was craving that adrenaline rush and feeling of power again.

[Nikolai]

"McCroskey calls police from Kelley residence, claiming to hear noises from basement," "Friday, Sept 18 12:58am: He requests that the same officer that previously responded to return to check it out. The requested officer was on another call, so two other FPD officers respond, enter house, go to basement, find nothing suspicious, and leave." Ok, then tell me what you think that was all about? Wow, I don't want to give him too much credit. : )

By the way, could you post the legit news source that says he asked for the same officer to check the house again please? Ive read many timelines on this case and never saw that once. Ive gone over the first 20 news stories on google about that phone call and not one says that.

[ziggy]

OK, wait a tic, the same policeman as the one who came inquiring about Mel's whereabouts? When he called about the noise he requested that guy as in singular?

That seems to me that he did intend to take the guy out. He's had some time to get used to the killing thing and started to get a bit grandiose in his thoughts with sleep deprivation and a sense of power from the murders. Could be.

Also, it doesn't take a genius to know that if you claim God's voice or something like that made you do something bad you have a chance at an insanity plea. Perhaps those who know murder cases or follow serial killers?

I don't think we are giving him too much credit at times because there have been some numbnuts who've managed to elude police as well as some smart ones. I don't think the kid is dumb - and when you add deception and the nature of being dark and deceitful, anything is possible from within the hidden personality of another.

[peace_gurl]

What I would like to know is where in the house the preachers body was found.

[Nikolai]

And, finally, it seems we've determined, due to Peace Gurl's valuable, much appreciated information, that he called the skinny policeman to the house, in particular requesting to the dispatcher the 'same one who came before', in order to probably murder him as well. Perhaps by this point he was 'coming down' off the high of killing the other four victims and was craving that adrenaline rush and feeling of power again.

Please just dont believe what somebody trying to push there theory tells you, especially if you've been following the case and its something new you havent heard yet.

[Nikolai]

What I would like to know is where in the house the preachers body was found.

What I want to know is where you got that quote about McCroskey asking for the same officer who was at the house earlier? Cmon, Ive went through 30 news stories off google on the 12:58am phone call and not one says he asked for that same officer from earlier or any specific officer at all.

[claudicici]

...but peace-gurl ,you're using an exact quote about the he requested the same police guy to come back....it includes a date and time....you start with "Friday Sept 18th,12:58 AM..... where did you get that?living in Farmville is not an explanation ....
I also can't believe that people actually beleive that Sam is saying "Jesus made me do it" as a defense...it's an sarcastic remark and I know it's not a time to try to be funny but that's what he did....that's another thing that also makes me believe that he does not care at all what happens to him now....I think he's done with the world at this point.

[peace_gurl]

...but peace-gurl ,you're using an exact quote about the he requested the same police guy to come back....it includes a date and time....you start with "Friday Sept 18th,12:58 AM..... where did you get that?living in Farmville is not an explanation ....
I also can't believe that people actually beleive that Sam is saying "Jesus made me do it" as a defense...it's an sarcastic remark and I know it's not a time to try to be funny but that's what he did....that's another thing that also makes me believe that he does not care at all what happens to him now....I think he's done with the world at this point.
My heart goes out to his family, I know how they feel. I have been there and done that. But he caused his own pain. He took the lives of 4 people.
I had two teenage members of my family to kill their parents while they slept. They went to prison, got out, had families, and killed their selves. Left their small kids without a mother. And the kicker is they never told why. They never talked to each other again after getting out of prison but both killed their self. One jumped off a bridge and the other hung herself. They caused their own pain. I can not feel sorry for Sam, sorry.

The quote is on a time line that belongs to a friend of mine. I am sure you can ask the police dept and they will tell you if it is true.

[Nikolai]

...but peace-gurl ,you're using an exact quote about the he requested the same police guy to come back....it includes a date and time....you start with "Friday Sept 18th,12:58 AM..... where did you get that?living in Farmville is not an explanation ....
I also can't believe that people actually beleive that Sam is saying "Jesus made me do it" as a defense...it's an sarcastic remark and I know it's not a time to try to be funny but that's what he did....that's another thing that also makes me believe that he does not care at all what happens to him now....I think he's done with the world at this point.


I think you're right about the Jesus remark, I think its most likely meaningless. I dont know about him being done with the world though. I think his lawyer saying he was "in shock" and "Twenty years old -- he's never been locked up before. He's wrestling with it." Is more telling than anything we know. I dont think he's emotionless and non-caring, Its a shock to the system, Id bet that he's cried a couple times for himself in there the first week or so. I dont think he's an emotionless robot waiting to get to the execution gurney. We'll have to wait and see.

http://www2.timesdispatch.com/rtd/news/local/crime/article/FARM221_20090921-235202/294638/

[claudicici]

...but just IF it was true it wouldn't make sense either....he requests a certain officer and then that guy ends up dead?.....why would he give himself away like that?....I think it's obvious he got scared after the welfare check and thought if he called himself he may be able to say someone else was in the house because he reported noises....I also think he enjoyed his time alone in the house....such a nice house....I don't think he was in a hurry to leave ....

[Nikolai]

...but just IF it was true it wouldn't make sense either....he requests a certain officer and then that guy ends up dead?.....why would he give himself away like that?....I think it's obvious he got scared after the welfare check and thought if he called himself he may be able to say someone else was in the house because he reported noises....I also think he enjoyed his time alone in the house....such a nice house....I don't think he was in a hurry to leave ....

I agree, he had to leave quickly once LE showed interest in the house, they saw him there earlier so he called police in a desperate attempt to try and put another person at the scene, then made his getaway.

[tapu]

Another possibility? Positing the request for a specific officer is true, then...

Maybe Sam was considering giving it up after the officer made the first call. He's had contact with this guy once, so he asks for him now. Get him over there and let it be discovered. He's ambivalent but he feels like he can tell that guy if he gets him back. Then other officers come instead. He can't turn himself in, let his crime be discovered. His original call was to say he heard something, so he just went with the ruse.

I dunno either.... Just speculating. I definitely appreciate all the new input we're getting here. Welcome, Peace_gurl and Mia!

[dangrsmind]

...but just IF it was true it wouldn't make sense either....he requests a certain officer and then that guy ends up dead?.....why would he give himself away like that?....I think it's obvious he got scared after the welfare check and thought if he called himself he may be able to say someone else was in the house because he reported noises....I also think he enjoyed his time alone in the house....such a nice house....I don't think he was in a hurry to leave ....

Noises in the cellar makes no sense as a story to indicate an intruder. How did the intruder get into the cellar? Where is the point of entry? And since the animals are down there it is even more unbelievable.

Maybe he is just that dumb, but it is pretty hard to believe. The police didn't believe it as indicated by the fact that they made only the most cursory check of the house when he called with this report.

The fact is that he waited around the house until he found a fourth victim. We don't know if he planned to kill others or wanted to.

[dangrsmind]

Personal attacks and insults? You mean remarks like "Eating bon-bons and watching Oprah." My theory i state as my opinion, and I argue as you do with others, the hollywood movie theorys that people claims they "know" happened. And I dont make up facts to try to sound like Im right, I state whats known.

What's known doesn't fully explain the crime as we have discussed here for quite a while.

And no one "knows" whether Sam killed for simple jealousy as you have argued here over and over ad naseum. That is not a fact; it is at best an opinion, mere speculation, and I think you know that. And yet anytime an alternative appears there you are to smash it down and REPEAT THAT STORY.

It seems very important to you that no alternate theory survives.

As I said, it is quite interesting.

[Nikolai]

Noises in the cellar makes no sense as a story to indicate an intruder. How did the intruder get into the cellar? Where is the point of entry? And since the animals are down there it is even more unbelievable.

Maybe he is just that dumb, but it is pretty hard to believe. The police didn't believe it as indicated by the fact that they made only the most cursory check of the house when he called with this report.

The fact is that he waited around the house until he found a fourth victim. We don't know if he planned to kill others or wanted to.

And him wanting to kill a police officer he didnt kill makes more sense to you? How? He didnt kill a police officer or even try, he fled and tried to catch a plane to california right after he made the claim of hearing things in the house.

And again you state your opinion as a fact that he waited for a fourth victim, as if its the only possibility he stayed in the house, as if there is no way the father became a victim by showing up unexpectedly to the crime scene with the murderer still there. That couldnt possibly be true. :rolleyes:

[dangrsmind]

And him wanting to kill a police officer he didnt kill makes more sense to you? How? He didnt kill a police officer or even try, he fled and tried to catch a plane to california right after he made the claim of hearing things in the house.

And again you state your opinion as a fact that he waited for a fourth victim, as if its the only possibility he stayed in the house, as if there is no way the father became a victim by showing up unexpectedly to the house. That couldnt possibly be true. :rolleyes:

What was he doing in the house for three days? You still haven't proposed an explanation for it.

He could have left at any time. He seems to have had the money required to change his flight in his bank account all along since he used that money to pay a cab driver later. Unless you think someone deposited that money there so he could escape...but that would require an accomplice or co-conspirator wouldn't it?

And yet he did not leave, but walked and drove around the town acting like nothing ever happened. Only when he nearly got caught out on Poorhouse Road did he leave town. And even then, he didn't leave right away, but stopped and had breakfast before calling a cab.

This is not what someone does when they impulsively commit a crime and then try to avoid the consequences.

[Nikolai]

What's known doesn't fully explain the crime as we have discussed here for quite a while.

And no one "knows" whether Sam killed for simple jealousy as you have argued here over and over ad naseum. That is not a fact; it is at best an opinion, mere speculation, and I think you know that. And yet anytime an alternative appears there you are to smash it down and REPEAT THAT STORY.

It seems very important to you that no alternate theory survives.

As I said, it is quite interesting.

Yea, and you havent been spewing our occult research angle ad naseum like a professor.

It was a murder of man on his girlfriend, thats why I believe its a domestic crime, along with what a couple witnesses said. I know its to plain for you and the explanation cant be that un-creative for you. And I dont think its the only possibility, I think when those are the partys involved its the most likely. Not just jealousy, but anger at rejection or something similiar. I dont think he would have killed his girlfriend unless he was upset at her for some reason. I think there is a lesser possibility that he killed these people just to kill them.

[dangrsmind]

Yea, and you havent been spewing our occult research angle ad naseum like a professor.

It was a murder of man on his girlfriend, thats why I believe its a domestic crime, along with what a couple witnesses said. I know its to plain for you and the explanation cant be that un-creative for you. And I dont think its the only possibility, I think when those are the partys involved its the most likely. Not just jealousy, but anger at rejection or something similiar. I dont think he would have killed his girlfriend unless he was upset at her for some reason.

Wait. There were witnesses to this crime?

Also, he killed two other women. Was he jealous of them as well? Angry over being dumped?

Another interesting posting from you.

[Nikolai]

Proving my point. Thank you.

Exactly, I proved you wrong once by throwing out a fact you didnt know or forgot about, not an opinion. You said why would he call the police to check the basement when that would place him at the crime scene. I then told you the known fact that they had already seen him at the crime scene earlier that day, that wasnt an opinion. Thank you.

[dangrsmind]

Exactly, I proved you wrong once by throwing out a fact you didnt know or forgot about, not an opinion. You said why would he call the police to check the basement when that would place him at the crime scene. I then told you the known fact that they had already seen him at the crime scene earlier that day, that wasnt an opinion. Thank you.

And I accepted that point, and was also later informed that he had been seen elsewhere walking around the town by someone else you have been attacking here. I agree this is a fact and it possibly explains why he made that call but only if he was also really really dumb.

The intruder in the basement story makes little sense with the animals down there. The dogs didn't bark? How did the mysterious intruder get into the basement? The police didn't believe him when he made the call, so how could this be his alibi?

[tapu]

Good morning, friends.


Hey, I'd hate to lose either one of you to moderation, and I'd hate to lose any of our other posters because they get sick of the sniping. Just sayin'.

[Nikolai]

Wait. There were witnesses to this crime?

Also, he killed two other women. Was he jealous of them as well? Angry over being dumped?

Another interesting posting from you.

You know there was a witness who said they broke up, right? And you're right, theres no possible reason for him to kill the two other women in the house once he killed Emma. Do you know about murder cases? Do you think there have never been murders like that before, where a man kills his wife or girlfriend and also other family members? Do you think that only happens because of a murderers interest in the occult? Is that all that explains quadruple murders to you?


Interesting

[claudicici]

...nikolai postings just make a whole lot of sense to me....all the other theories sound whack...

[tapu]

It is the variety and amalgam of theories that sustain my interest here. Speaking personally....

[claudicici]

yes,i like to hear other theories,they just don't seem logical to me

[dangrsmind]

You know there was a witness who said they broke up, right? And you're right, theres no possible reason for him to kill the two other women in the house once he killed Emma. Do you know about murder cases? Do you think there have never been murders like that before, where a man kills his wife or girlfriend and also other family members?


Interesting

There were witnesses that said they were not together at STFW. That Emma said they broke up, and that neither of them seemed upset. Sam was reported to be with a different girl at the show.

That's my recollection. But my memory is hardly perfect, that's why I take notes. Sometimes I leave things out or my notes are ambiguous. I do my best.

[Nikolai]

And I accepted that point, and was also later informed that he had been seen elsewhere walking around the town by someone else you have been attacking here. I agree this is a fact and it possibly explains why he made that call but only if he was also really really dumb.

The intruder in the basement story makes little sense with the animals down there. The dogs didn't bark? How did the mysterious intruder get into the basement? The police didn't believe him when he made the call, so how could this be his alibi?

I didnt attack her I called her out because she made up a quote about something to try to further her point and angle against me, and I dont do that.

So you honestly believe, and its your opinion he called the police to get in a cop-kill on his record before leaving the house? Well thats your opinion. It cant be argued anymore, we know what happened.

[claudicici]

he went there to be with emma,he was looking forward to this trip and IMO had all his hopes invested in it....emma was not as interested and loyal as he thought she would be....according to people that knew him sam never showed anger,just took it....for years and years that boy prolly had a whole lotta anger built up inside....

[dangrsmind]

yes,i like to hear other theories,they just don't seem logical to me

Well, I have restrained myself from posting further occult related stuff here because people do not seem interested in it, not because I haven't learned anything knew or made progress in exploring that theory. I have made a lot of progress in fact and I know a lot more than I have posted or will post here.

BTW, FWIW, the theory that SKR fans don't know about the hidden occult messages in SickTanick's music is false. There are multiple discussions of the hidden meanings over KillMusick and there is even a team of fans/researchers working on publishing a "decoding" of SickTanick's Doctrines of the Damned. Any fan that poked around on that board a bit would find this out.

Google "Omega: Junction" and "AMKR" to learn more.

[dangrsmind]

he went there to be with emma,he was looking forward to this trip and IMO had all his hopes invested in it....emma was not as interested and loyal as he thought she would be....according to people that knew him sam never showed anger,just took it....for years and years that boy prolly had a whole lotta anger built up inside....

Certainly possible, but why wait around the house after killing three people? What was he doing in there? Why didn't he immediately try to hide the evidence or get away? I expect we will find out soon enough.

[claudicici]

sure they do,I just keep thinking back to when we were teens, we were into the occult and serial killers and horrormovies and all that stuff....we were not "intellectuals" however,we don't get into it on a deeper levell,it's just some cool stuff to be into...i think on an intellectual level the skr fans are more like we used to be....i'm just saying mostlly we just partied and looking at the skr related youtube videos they're like that too

[dangrsmind]

I didnt attack her I called her out because she made up a quote about something to try to further her point and angle against me, and I dont do that.

So you honestly believe, and its your opinion he called the police to get in a cop-kill on his record before leaving the house? Well thats your opinion. It cant be argued anymore, we know what happened.

You don't that peace_gurl made that up. That would be speculation. I am not saying it is true, we have only one source for that information, but I am saying that you also don't know it's false.

Unless you know a lot more about this case than you are saying here of course.

[claudicici]

....i think he was comfortable in that house and didn't wanna leave back into the real world,nothing to go back into the real world for.jmo

[dangrsmind]

sure they do,I just keep thinking back to when we were teens, we were into the occult and serial killers and horrormovies and all that stuff....we were not "intellectuals" however,we don't get into it on a deeper levell,it's just some cool stuff to be into...i think on an intellectual level the skr fans are more like we used to be....i'm just saying mostlly we just partied and looking at the skr related youtube videos they're like that too

"we"? I assume meaning your group of friends and not the community as a whole.

A decent percentage of the people on KillMusick seem to know about this stuff and some even respond with Thelemic codes to SickTanick's messages.

93
See what I mean?
93/93

Not that I think there is anything wrong with Thelema BTW. It's a religious system and makes a fair bit of sense IMO.

[dangrsmind]

....i think he was comfortable in that house and didn't wanna leave back into the real world,nothing to go back into the real world for.jmo

Ok, but then he wasn't trying to escape getting caught either was he?

This is the part I don't get. He's not trying to get away. He's sitting around in a house with three dead bodies.

He did not try to clean up the scene of the crime apparently...

[claudicici]

..."we"...yes,my group of friends....."sam": not seriously into the occullt....some skr fans i'm sure are and went to college and stuff and have a serious interest in that...not sam though.....his lyrics for example are really,really cliche and totally suck...i think anyone would agree with that.

[dangrsmind]

..."we"...yes,my group of friends....."sam": not seriously into the occullt....some skr fans i'm sure are and went to college and stuff and have a serious interest in that...not sam though.....his lyrics for example are really,really cliche and totally suck...i think anyone would agree with that.

I have no idea what Sam knew or did not know about the occult.

I agree his lyrics do not reflect any deep knowledge and they do suck.

But he was hanging around with people that DO have knowledge of this stuff and also a deep interest in it. Didn't they ever talk about it? Hard to believe that they did not IMO.

I also don't find implausible that he could have picked up a book and read it while visiting The Grotto. I don't know that he did, I'm just saying it is possible. There are multiple reasons these sorts of ideas are kept secret and the potential for misunderstanding by a mentally disturbed person is one of them.

[claudicici]

....i reallly imagine him being comfortable in that house and not leaving until he absolutely had to....i mean what was his outlook on life from that point on? i wouldn't have been in a hurry to run...run where?....imo he must have known his life was over at that point....i could imagine when he drove around he was just cruising,when he finally had to leave he still didn't seem in a hurry,he did not waste energy to clean the crime scene...and when he was caught he did not seem to care much one way or the other....

[claudicici]

....again just like nikolai said i just think you give him too much credit or too little.....you either think he is some evil mastermind plotter or some complete dumb ass that decides to kill cos someone told him to or gave him a book to read.
i think he's neither.not even a psychopath or any other major mental problem.
just a disturbed kid that was holding in too much anger

[dangrsmind]

....i reallly imagine him being comfortable in that house and not leaving until he absolutely had to....i mean what was his outlook on life from that point on? i wouldn't have been in a hurry to run...run where?....imo he must have known his life was over at that point....i could imagine when he drove around he was just cruising,when he finally had to leave he still didn't seem in a hurry,he did not waste energy to clean the crime scene...and when he was caught he did not seem to care much one way or the other....

Remember he also violently killed Emma's father after hanging around the house a bit. Was he just angry at him too? Or was he afraid of getting caught?

We don't really know.

Also, since we don't know what he was doing in the house we can't know who he called or contacted via the computer in the house. Similarly he very likely conducted some Google searches while there. I imagine examining the browser cache would be illuminating.

[dangrsmind]

....again just like nikolai said i just think you give him too much credit or too little.....you either think he is some evil mastermind plotter or some complete dumb ass that decides to kill cos someone told him to or gave him a book to read.
i think he's neither.not even a psychopath or any other major mental problem.
just a disturbed kid that was holding in too much anger

I do not think he was an "evil mastermind plotter".

I do think he was a "disturbed kid that was holding too much anger".

I do think he had interests that influenced his crimes, e.g. the mysterious noises in the basement.

[adnoid]

Good morning, friends.


Hey, I'd hate to lose either one of you to moderation, and I'd hate to lose any of our other posters because they get sick of the sniping. Just sayin'.

Good advice, but too late.

Folks, you have a choice with posts that are abusive. In order, from best to worse outcome:

1) Report it and move on. You don't need to worry, if it's not bad there's no consequence to you.

2) Ignore it. But don't complain later if nothing is done - the mods cannot possibly read every post here.

3) Respond and prolong it. Then it becomes mutual combat, and you'll both probably get a TO.

Pick one - don't report a post AND respond to it as well, it's really irritating because the mods have to clean things up.

[tapu]

Remember he also violently killed Emma's father after hanging around the house a bit. Was he just angry at him too? Or was he afraid of getting caught?

We don't really know.

Also, since we don't know what he was doing in the house we can't know who he called or contacted via the computer in the house. Similarly he very likely conducted some Google searches while there. I imagine examining the browser cache would be illuminating.



Hmmm.... It would seem possible, even likely, that Sam would have had online contact in that time. I am just thinking but... I could see him talking to some similarly sicko friend and saying what was going on, or at least alluding to it. Maybe even being egged on to do some weird **** with the bodies, whether the person actually believed it was real or not.

I finder it harder to believe Sam wouldn't have online contact with someone. Maybe through gaming, his longtime online acquaintances....

[tapu]

Good advice, but too late.

Folks, you have a choice with posts that are abusive. In order, from best to worse outcome:

1) Report it and move on. You don't need to worry, if it's not bad there's no consequence to you.

2) Ignore it. But don't complain later if nothing is done - the mods cannot possibly read every post here.

3) Respond and prolong it. Then it becomes mutual combat, and you'll both probably get a TO.

Pick one - don't report a post AND respond to it as well, it's really irritating because the mods have to clean things up.



Hi, Adnoid. I dont' THINK this is what you're saying, but to clarify: I didn't personally report any posts. Just posted what you quoted above, thinking that might be all it took.

Thanks. --tap

[claudicici]

...well,we know he had contact with sinister and imo sinister knows everything....

[dangrsmind]

...well,we know he had contact with sinister and imo sinister knows everything....

Seems like he would know whatever Sam told him, but not more. Would he have told him "everything"?

And I'm curious...If the "simple crime" theory is correct and this was just a murder over being dumped by a 14 year old girl, why do you think he would advertise that fact to his horrorcore friends?

Seems likely they would ridicule him at best.

[tapu]

...well,we know he had contact with sinister and imo sinister knows everything....

And he may have had something like this going with siniister and now siniister is, for obvious reasons, not letting on with the whole story. But there might be other "lesser" characters that Sam would feel safe letting out some of this with, in some way or the other.

That's just how "deeper" online involvement seems to go with people you know only online. Some reveal a lot and, conversely, reveal only "versions" of reality, highly circumscribed or disguised. IME, anyway.

[dangrsmind]

http://www.faygoluvers.net/main/?id=news/comments&nid=EkVyEVlpuAgXgpzjoz

Scroll down to see some scans of the recent People Magazine coverage of this story. Nothing really new here though.

[gxm]

I do not think he was an "evil mastermind plotter".

I do think he was a "disturbed kid that was holding too much anger".

I do think he had interests that influenced his crimes, e.g. the mysterious noises in the basement.

I pretty much agree with you. But, I'm curious about your last sentence. Do you think he had a psychotic break and was actually hearing voices? Or that for days he had been living in a house with dead bodies and he was starting to get spooked. That coupled with not sleeping could seriously affect one's cognitive processes.

[AndresEscobar]

(Respectfully snipped)

Also, it doesn't take a genius to know that if you claim God's voice or something like that made you do something bad you have a chance at an insanity plea. Perhaps those who know murder cases or follow serial killers?



An insanity defense is an extremely high burden to prove.

[gxm]

Good morning, friends.


Hey, I'd hate to lose either one of you to moderation, and I'd hate to lose any of our other posters because they get sick of the sniping. Just sayin'.

ITA. We have a really good bunch here. I'd hate to lose any more posters.

[gxm]

"McCroskey calls police from Kelley residence, claiming to hear noises from basement," "Friday, Sept 18 12:58am: He requests that the same officer that previously responded to return to check it out. The requested officer was on another call, so two other FPD officers respond, enter house, go to basement, find nothing suspicious, and leave." Ok, then tell me what you think that was all about? Wow, I don't want to give him too much credit. : )

Now that's interesting. If Sam did indeed ask for the same officer then he might have been trying to get him back to the house to murder him as that officer would be the only one who could identify Sam as the person who answered the door on the first call.

[gxm]

....i think he was comfortable in that house and didn't wanna leave back into the real world,nothing to go back into the real world for.jmo

You know, I think this is a very good point. Sam had slipped out of reality and he wasn't in a hurry to get back to it.

[dangrsmind]

I pretty much agree with you. But, I'm curious about your last sentence. Do you think he had a psychotic break and was actually hearing voices? Or that for days he had been living in a house with dead bodies and he was starting to get spooked. That coupled with not sleeping could seriously affect one's cognitive processes.

We don't know he didn't sleep, although he did say that to someone IIRC.

I think he surrounded himself with horror imagery and horror movie paraphernalia including horrorcore music. I think he at least watched a lot of horror movies and read stuff on the web about serial killers. There's plenty of material out there to find for those that look for it.

I think either he was trying to live out some sort of movie-like fantasy, hence the actual relevance to the case of "Hollywood" theories, or alternatively the movie themes just sort of "leaked out" out of his unconscious.

It is no coincidence IMO that it is a horror movie cliche that there are weird noises from the basement or the attic, or that in horror movies the people that check the basement usually die.

[dangrsmind]

You know, I think this is a very good point. Sam had slipped out of reality and he wasn't in a hurry to get back to it.

I don't know. Someone posted a quotation from David Berkowitz earlier that was closer to the mark IMO. A lot of serial killers report extreme clarity after killing as do soldiers. He's also reported to be walking around the town and buying things at Kroger's after the murders. I think he was quite aware that it was all very very real.

[tapu]

gxm may have meant that Sam had slipped out of his old reality--his pre-murdering loser life--and was enjoying being where he was now.

dangrs, I think you may be right on about sam immersing himself in horror/horrorcore those days. And in the bodies and what he thought to do with them then.

[dangrsmind]

gxm may have meant that Sam had slipped out of his old reality--his pre-murdering loser life--and was enjoying being where he was now.

dangrs, I think you may be right on about sam immersing himself in horror/horrorcore those days. And in the bodies and what he thought to do with them then.

Well that I agree with. But I don't think it was just because they had a well stocked fridge or premium cable.

[tapu]

Well that I agree with. But I don't think it was just because they had a well stocked fridge or premium cable.

No, neither do I. I meant for my agreement about the horror/horrorcore indulgence to be tied to that thought. I think he really got into himself, his new identity. I think it comes out when he was arrested, and when he was transported, too. Sam may have been transformed, felt transcendent. Don't know if the glow would have worn off yet. That kind of depends on his underlying sanity or lack thereof, I would think.

[dangrsmind]

http://www2.pictures.zimbio.com/mp/E4ia9moxWOrl.jpg
The Fantasy

http://www.kron.com/Portals/0/NewsThumbails/Sept09/092109/250sammy_092109.gif
The Reality

Note he's wearing the same clothes in these images.

[Heroine]

he went there to be with emma,he was looking forward to this trip and IMO had all his hopes invested in it....emma was not as interested and loyal as he thought she would be....according to people that knew him sam never showed anger,just took it....for years and years that boy prolly had a whole lotta anger built up inside....

Ted Bundy looked forward to a lot of his trips too.....just saying!

[Mia]

I really don't think we can attribute this murder to just one set of circumstances, i.e., because he was dumped by Emma, or because he had a horrible home life, or because he listened to and lived the culture of horrorcore. Like most murders, I think, and particularly an especially gruesome, multiple murder such as this, they result from a "perfect storm" of circumstances, so to speak. I don't want to get into a debate about nature vs nurture, but maybe it's safe to say Sam was born with some kind of genetic predisposition to violence and aggression, judging from the words and actions of other members of his family as have been reported. That, combined with an affection-less childhood, his parents' recent divorce, probably some underlying anger at his mother for supposedly cheating on his father and leaving the family that was transferred to Emma and the other female victims, PLUS the constant images of death and gore he was exposed to through horrorcore, PLUS Emma possibly dumping and belittling him, PLUS other factors none of us will probably ever know - all of this brewed together to create a recipe for disaster at this particular place and time.

[dangrsmind]

I'd like to know where his SKR bandana is.

[Mia]

As far as the "Jesus made me do it" line, I really wouldn't read too far into it. It's the introverted cliche of "The Devil made me do it", and probably just something he came up with off the top of his head at that particular moment. I'd be surprised if his lawyers try to use this as some kind of defense. To me, it sounds like the expected response from a confused child who hasn't yet come to realize exactly what he's done, or the repercussions.

JMHO, of course!

[dangrsmind]

As far as the "Jesus made me do it" line, I really wouldn't read too far into it. It's the introverted cliche of "The Devil made me do it", and probably just something he came up with off the top of his head at that particular moment. I'd be surprised if his lawyers try to use this as some kind of defense. To me, it sounds like the expected response from a confused child who hasn't yet come to realize exactly what he's done, or the repercussions.

JMHO, of course!

I think the demonic possession defense is looking better and better.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demon_Murder_Trial

[tapu]

I'd like to know where his SKR bandana is.

Do you know what you could get for that on eBay? :(

Seriously:
Why are you wondering? Got a theory?

[dangrsmind]

Do you know what you could get for that on eBay? :(

Seriously:
Why are you wondering? Got a theory?

Umm, he wore it during the murders?

Just a guess.

Spend some time looking at that top image. Look into his eyes. Don't look away...

[Mia]

I know that Emma was an only child. Does anyone know if Mel had any siblings? I just wonder if being an only child had anything to do with Emma's parents' apparent willingness to indulge her in her horrorcore obsession. I'm not necessarily saying she was spoiled, although a lot of kids are these days and for that reason find it difficult to look beyond themselves and their own needs and wants, but perhaps being the sole recipient of what was probably a lot of attention by her parents made her more likely to push the envelope, so to speak. That said, I'm not saying ALL only children are overindulged, only that many are.

[tapu]

Omigod, I looked, like you said, and all of a sudden the computer screen started spinning in a circle and I could hear demonic screaming.

[Heroine]

Omigod, I looked, like you said, and all of a sudden the computer screen started spinning in a circle and I could hear demonic screaming.

LMAO! I looked too and that didn't happen to me....
What am I doing wrong?
Edited to say he does look creepy though. Decided to add this, the way I see it is if he indeed thought highly of what his songs spoke of, then why is it so hard for people to believe that he didn't act them out. I mean if he was going to murder 4 people, and as we know as of right now these were his first victims, then why not make it something to remember?
As the saying goes if you're going to do something do it right. Not sure if this classifies, but why not?
I mean I can see him now thinking about murder and because he already had this strange disposition, and all of this horrorcore stuff in his mind, why not go all out and do the whole satanic shebang? That way he got to kill whoever he intended and now he looks like a God (satan) in the horrorcore community.

[ziggy]

....i reallly imagine him being comfortable in that house and not leaving until he absolutely had to....i mean what was his outlook on life from that point on? i wouldn't have been in a hurry to run...run where?....imo he must have known his life was over at that point....i could imagine when he drove around he was just cruising,when he finally had to leave he still didn't seem in a hurry,he did not waste energy to clean the crime scene...and when he was caught he did not seem to care much one way or the other....

Well he did call his family to say "I love you" and that shows he might have wanted to see them one last time. His sister thought it was strange because it wasn't like him to say that.

I would think you might want to go home, say your goodbyes and stuff before being hauled back to VA for murder. Or, get a good defense attorney and fight it for as long as you can.

[Heroine]

Think about it like this, it's hard enough to think about someone murdering 4 people and he did that, so why not go sam on it and do crazy stuff to the bodies, live with them for a few days, and live out his fantasies?
We all agree that we can believe he killed them, well if you can believe that then why not believe all the rest at that point because obviously he has already surprised us with the murders in the first place. I'm sure there are more surprises to come.

[gxm]

One local mentioned that Sam robbed the pastor. We don't know if this is true, but the pastor's arrival may have given Sam the means (cash and car) that he needed to get out of town.

[ziggy]

An insanity defense is an extremely high burden to prove.

Indeed it is, but as a last ditch effort and last resort those that come to mind the most are the one's in which the defendant has claimed that God told them to do something or voices from God etc.

The addage says that God gets you the insanity defense and Satan gets you the chair, or something like that.

I'm not insinuating that it was a good idea or even viable, and surely it could have either been a smart ass remark or a signal that he was taking the occult messages from Sick to heart. We don't know. I DO know that if you are going to say anything, saying God or Jesus made you do it would be the better of the two.

How about insanity defense because he was completely brainwashed by the teachings in the SKR music? That getting so deep into the horrorcore caused him to have a break with reality and he "believed" he was being directed to do this? Just throwing it out there. I know there's not a chance in hell it would fly (punintended) but what else is the defense going to do? He's got a crap client right? He's just going to try to keep him from getting the DP - doesn't seem like he has a lot to lose.

[ziggy]

Blazen - definitely weed...listed in her hobbies.

http://www.fairfaxunderground.com/forum/file.php?40,file=10460

[Heroine]

yes,i like to hear other theories,they just don't seem logical to me

Well IMHO killing 4 people don't seem logical either, but guess what? He killed ALL 4 of them. So speaking of being illogical, you don't think that is logical to kill 4 people either do you? I'm hoping your answer is no. In that case then I think all possibilities should be looked at.
Edited to say that nothing that we know that he did seems logical.

[Heroine]

Blazen - definitely weed...listed in her hobbies.

http://www.fairfaxunderground.com/forum/file.php?40,file=10460

Yeah I suspected that. And you know that potheads make up names for their smoking utensils, maybe her pipes name was bambooka?

[tapu]

Sam's Sep 14 mood of "Determined." Wow. Was he waiting for them to go to sleep at that point?

[ziggy]

And for those of you who don't think they know what SKR is about - she is only 16 and lists Jordan Maxwell - the godfather of it all...I think she gets it and I think most of them understand. It's their niche. They aren't JUST rap.

They get it.

[magnaccia]

I've never ever heard that in reference to weed and I'd consider myself a scholar lol.

If she were referring to getting blazed or blazing, dunno why she'd change it to blazen rather than blazin (even though kids are pretty stupid, I'm guessing it's some kind of inside joke or phrase)

Actually she spelled guitarist "guitarest", so maybe she was talking about getting high lol

[Heroine]

I've never ever heard that in reference to weed and I'd consider myself a scholar lol.

If she were referring to getting blazed or blazing, dunno why she'd change it to blazen rather than blazin (even though kids are pretty stupid, I'm guessing it's some kind of inside joke or phrase)

I admit i have smoked and still smoke on occasion. Think about it, there are bongs called hookahs. so blazenbambooka sounds right to me.

[tapu]

I've never ever heard that in reference to weed and I'd consider myself a scholar lol.

If she were referring to getting blazed or blazing, dunno why she'd change it to blazen rather than blazin (even though kids are pretty stupid, I'm guessing it's some kind of inside joke or phrase)

Actually she spelled guitarist "guitarest", so maybe she was talking about getting high lol

These kids can't spell for ****. It's what keeps me in business. :rolleyes:

[Heroine]

How to make a bamboo bong....

http://www.marijuana.com/homemade-paraphernalia/74778-how-making-bamboo-bong.html
there you have it!
http://www.stonerforums.com/lounge/bongs-pipes-bubblers/17767-hand-carved-bamboo-bong.html

[magnaccia]

Okay I stand corrected, after reading the rest of that screenshot, she just didn't have much care for the English language :(

[Heroine]

Okay I stand corrected, after reading the rest of that screenshot, she just didn't have much care for the English language :(

It seems all of them get a kick out of misspelling words, not sure why, maybe thats all part of the scene. Who knows...

[tapu]

Really, two things are going on with the spelling: first, they intentionally misspell some sounds and words quite regularly, in particular, k is used in place of c a lot. It's thought to be underground-sounding, alternative. Z for s, likewise; second, like I said, most of them can't spell for ****, so they unintentionally misspell words, too. To "outsiders," they appear semi-literate at best.

Come to think of it, there's another thing I can think of: texting has influenced spelling, for example U for you.

(I'm a linguist. Can you tell?)

[Heroine]

Really, two things are going on with the spelling: first, they intentionally misspell some sounds and words quite regularly, in particular, k is used in place of c a lot. It's thought to be underground-sounding, alternative. Z for s, likewise; second, like I said, most of them can't spell for ****, so they unintentionally misspell words, too. To "outsiders," they appear semi-literate at best.

Come to think of it, there's another thing I can think of: texting has influenced spelling, for example U for you.

(I'm a linguist. Can you tell?)

haha! Now the only thing I don't know is why the sad face if she was going to get high? Shouldn't there have been a happy face?
Come to think of it, ain't a DAMN thing about this case logical.......haha!
logically, teens don't smoke weed at their parents house
logically, 16 yo kids don't have 20 yos stay over with parents consent
logically, most parents don't take their kids to satanic events esp if you're a pastor
logically, people don't murder 4 people cuz a girl dumped them
logically, if you do murder someone you don't hang out with them for 3 to 4 days
logically, you don't call police after you murder people
logically, 20 yos don't travel half way across country to stay with 16yos and their parents
logically, people care about how they spell
wow, shall i go on?

[tapu]

maybe... she was too high to think to change her face? maybe smoking made her down. it does some.

[magnaccia]

Also a lot of times, depending on how slow myspace is or which method you use to change your status, she coulda just left an older status' smilie.

Or the frown could be eluding to the company with which she's about to get "blazen" with.. if there was a rift between her and samwise.

[dangrsmind]

Also a lot of times, depending on how slow myspace is or which method you use to change your status, she coulda just left an older status' smilie.

Or the frown could be eluding to the company with which she's about to get "blazen" with.. if there was a rift between her and samwise.

Didn't someone translate this before to mean something more like "totally screwed in the ass"? That would explain the frowny face too.

I have no idea what it actually means.

[dangrsmind]

Omigod, I looked, like you said, and all of a sudden the computer screen started spinning in a circle and I could hear demonic screaming.

Hah hah.

I am just saying that this is one of the images he chose to represent himself. Try and imagine what he is thinking there behind that mask.

He's become his own avatar.

[magnaccia]

Didn't someone translate this before to mean something more like "totally screwed in the ass"? That would explain the frowny face too.

I have no idea what it actually means.


I think on the original thread someone looked up the three words separately on urbandictionary and surmised that.

But, UD often times isn't reliable, slang changes by region, and the three words could mean something entirely different alone than they do together, or depending on context.

[dangrsmind]

How to make a bamboo bong....

http://www.marijuana.com/homemade-paraphernalia/74778-how-making-bamboo-bong.html
there you have it!
http://www.stonerforums.com/lounge/bongs-pipes-bubblers/17767-hand-carved-bamboo-bong.html

Amazing what sort of information is out there on the Internets.

http://ask.metafilter.com/7921/If-you-killed-somebody-how-would-you-dispose-of-the-body-without-getting-caught

[dangrsmind]

I think on the original thread someone looked up the three words separately on urbandictionary and surmised that.

But, UD often times isn't reliable, slang changes by region, and the three words could mean something entirely different alone than they do together, or depending on context.

Sure.

Or maybe her weed was ****ty.

[magnaccia]

They coulda been smoking Salvia lol

[dangrsmind]

They coulda been smoking Salvia lol

Explains the frowny face.

[ziggy]

OMG that's some crazy stuff.

Maybe she was in a bad mood, a little perturbed and smoked to calm down or to get in a better mood.
Perhaps she was pizzed (sorry Tapu) because even though she was totally over him, he was still a "lingerer" at her house and she was stuck with him and had to share her weed with him.

I agree texting has led to even more derioration of the ability to spell.
It's like shorthand, anyone remember that?

its ez 2 do whn u txt alot, kwim?

So, yeah, not much about this makes sense. It doesn't make sense that he flew all the way to VA and then at the concert they didn't even hang out together and nobody is gossiping about it or neither one of them is upset about that?

And then, after "breaking up" he doesn't just fly home early, he stays and then supposedly he's upset at finding a text and becomes jealous.

And then, after killing them, he doesn't just split and fly home early, he hangs out and kills the Dad.

And then...we are dying for some more details here because when something makes absolutely no sense it drives your mind crazy trying to fit the pieces together even though the parts aren't all there.

[Heroine]

Amazing what sort of information is out there on the Internets.

http://ask.metafilter.com/7921/If-you-killed-somebody-how-would-you-dispose-of-the-body-without-getting-caught

Who in the hell would ever ask that on the internet? Even I wouldn't post that! Now one day who ever posted that is going to be a suspect in someones murder....haha. There sure are some dumba** people in the world.

[Heroine]

One local mentioned that Sam robbed the pastor. We don't know if this is true, but the pastor's arrival may have given Sam the means (cash and car) that he needed to get out of town.

Maybe, but why did he still have to go to the ATM machine?

[magnaccia]

And when he did go to the ATM, why didn't he just overdraft his account to get the money for rebooking?

If I just murdered someone, I'm not going to be that concerned with a 15$ overdraft fee when fleeing the state.

[Heroine]

And when he did go to the ATM, why didn't he just overdraft his account to get the money for rebooking?

If I just murdered someone, I'm not going to be that concerned with a 15$ overdraft fee when fleeing the state.

Very true, I agree! Maybe he thought that would make him look suspicious. Actually I'm not sure he cared if he looked suspicious. I mean with the way he called the police and all, but maybe he called them trying not to look suspicious. You know they say the best time to do things is right under the polices nose then they least suspect you.

[dangrsmind]

Very true, I agree! Maybe he thought that would make him look suspicious. Actually I'm not sure he cared if he looked suspicious. I mean with the way he called the police and all, but maybe he called them trying not to look suspicious. You know they say the best time to do things is right under the polices nose then they least suspect you.

Hard to imagine something more suspicious than wandering around town smelling like death. Maybe if he had been covered in blood people would have noticed.

[Heroine]

Hard to imagine something more suspicious than wandering around town smelling like death. Maybe if he had been covered in blood people would have noticed.

Yeah nothing beats wandering around town. You know I was thinking about the cloths and how it appeared that he had them on the whole time, but maybe they were his "good clothes" you know like his favorite outfit, in which he wore out for "big days",(ex: going to concert, going home) I'm sure everyone has their own set of "good clothes". I'm sure he must have brought other clothes with him, he could have changed within the amount of time he was there and then put these back on. Because we know these are his "good clothes".
he wore them in almost every pic and on almost every occasion.
What do you think?
Edited to say that if he never came into close contact or in a small vicinity with anyone then noone would smell it I don't think, though I could be wrong.

[dangrsmind]

Yeah nothing beats wandering around town. You know I was thinking about the cloths and how it appeared that he had them on the whole time, but maybe they were his "good clothes" you know like his favorite outfit, in which he wore out for "big days",(ex: going to concert, going home) I'm sure everyone has their own set of "good clothes". I'm sure he must have brought other clothes with him, he could have changed within the amount of time he was there and then put these back on. Because we know these are his "good clothes".
he wore them in almost every pic and on almost every occasion.
What do you think?

I don't know if these were his favorite clothes or whatever. No way to say that given what I know. Howerver...below are the Syko Sam images he posted to his MySpace. There's also one of him wearing a "Jason" mask.

He created a "fictional" character as his horrorcore alter ego, Syko Sam, and the character wears these clothes. Apparently he was wearing the same outfit when he murdered four people. Not a coincidence IMO and I wouldn't be surprised to learn he had a bandanna with him somewhere along the way.

http://www4.pictures.zimbio.com/mp/lQZd0dJM98Ql.jpg
http://www2.pictures.zimbio.com/mp/jV2SzU6ljbvl.jpg
http://www2.pictures.zimbio.com/mp/E4ia9moxWOrl.jpg

[Heroine]

I don't know if these were his favorite clothes or whatever. No way to say that given what I know. Howerver...below are the Syko Sam images he posted to his MySpace. There's also one of him wearing a "Jason" mask.

He created a "fictional" character as his horrorcore alter ego, Syko Sam, and the character wears these clothes. Apparently he was wearing the same outfit when he murdered four people. Not a coincidence IMO and I wouldn't be surprised he had a bandanna with him somewhere along the way.

http://www4.pictures.zimbio.com/mp/lQZd0dJM98Ql.jpg
http://www2.pictures.zimbio.com/mp/jV2SzU6ljbvl.jpg
http://www2.pictures.zimbio.com/mp/E4ia9moxWOrl.jpg

Very true! I get your point.
Edited to say if he didn't have a bandanna, which I'm sure he did, but if he didn't I'm sure Emma did.

[claudicici]

...I'm sorry,but i don't get it,I honestly don't get what you are saying?...he decided to stage a real event that would be like in the pictures of him? why would he do that?
.....I do still think the way nikolai explained it it makes total sense and is logical to me....of course he had to kill all four....two were already in the house when he killed emma,the dad entered the house ,of course the dad would come in....sam couldn't just have said"they're at the movies right now Mr.Niederbrock,you can't come in"
....and I'm sorry but SKR IS just RAP,really bad rap at that....

[Heroine]

...I'm sorry,but i don't get it,I honestly don't get what you are saying?...he decided to stage a real event that would be like in the pictures of him? why would he do that?
.....I do still think the way nikolai explained it it makes total sense and is logical to me....of course he had to kill all four....two were already in the house when he killed emma,the dad entered the house ,of course the dad would come in....sam couldn't just have said"they're at the movies right now Mr.Niederbrock,you can't come in"
....and I'm sorry but SKR IS just RAP,really bad rap at that....

I stated this earlier and wasn't sure if you saw it...
Well IMHO killing 4 people don't seem logical either, but guess what? He killed ALL 4 of them. So speaking of being illogical, you don't think that is logical to kill 4 people either do you? I'm hoping your answer is no. In that case then I think all possibilities should be looked at.
Edited to say that nothing that we know that he did seems logical.

There is nothing logical about anything he did through-out this whole course of events. Killing people is not logical, so why do you assume that everything he did just had to be logical?

[claudicici]

...i am trying to understand,do you think he is insane?.....because I don't think he is.I think the crime was emotionally motivated not to live out a sick fantasy because that would make him insane and then anything could be possible,he could have heard voices that made him do it....or do you think he consciously wanted to do this and planned it even before he went on that trip?....i just can't see that knowing what we know of sam.

[gxm]

Maybe, but why did he still have to go to the ATM machine?

I'm guessing because he ran out of cash and the cost for a cab from Farmville to Richmond was probably more expensive than he realized. Just a guess.

[peace_gurl]

She was having a hard time in school. She was enrolled in the local system with a teacher bringing her work. I remember reading on her page how she was worried about failing a standard test that the state of va gives

[magnaccia]

...i am trying to understand,do you think he is insane?.....because I don't think he is.I think the crime was emotionally motivated not to live out a sick fantasy because that would make him insane and then anything could be possible,he could have heard voices that made him do it....or do you think he consciously wanted to do this and planned it even before he went on that trip?....i just can't see that knowing what we know of sam.

Just like people have a safety blanket or something else they lean on when they're uncomfortable or out of sorts, perhaps this persona was his. We all know Sam was nothing to write home about, so maybe Syko Sam was his way of escaping his reality. Some switch flipped at Emma's and the only way he knew how to deal with it was to let Syko handle it.

[dangrsmind]

...I'm sorry,but i don't get it,I honestly don't get what you are saying?...he decided to stage a real event that would be like in the pictures of him? why would he do that?
.....I do still think the way nikolai explained it it makes total sense and is logical to me....of course he had to kill all four....two were already in the house when he killed emma,the dad entered the house ,of course the dad would come in....sam couldn't just have said"they're at the movies right now Mr.Niederbrock,you can't come in"
....and I'm sorry but SKR IS just RAP,really bad rap at that....

He could have left one or two days before the father returned. Why didn't he try to leave? Why didn't he clean up or dispose of the bodies? Why was the house in such a condition that police officers that viewed it were shaken and it took days and a large dumpster to clean it up? He could have been long gone by the time the father showed up, but he wasn't. He was in the house waiting.

What I am saying is he created a fictional character that he imagined himself to be called Syko Sam. We all do this on the Internet...we create a persona and project it and we select an avatar to represent it. Syko Sam was Sam MCroskey's avatar. And in all of the pictures of Syko Sam which he created, he is wearing the black sweatshirt, WIR shirt, and a bandanna. The same outfit he was arrested in sans bandanna.

Then, possibly for the reasons you suggest, we may never know really, he acted out the role of his character in reality. Syko Sam was supposed to be a scary axe murderer, and Sam McCroskey became one.

As far as insanity...I don't think he is insane in the legal sense.

[dangrsmind]

Just like people have a safety blanket or something else they lean on when they're uncomfortable or out of sorts, perhaps this persona was his. We all know Sam was nothing to write home about, so maybe Syko Sam was his way of escaping his reality. Some switch flipped at Emma's and the only way he knew how to deal with it was to let Syko handle it.

Many serial killers are also fetishists and they collect items from their victims (for example) as a form of protection or an obsessive act. Possibly the wearing of these clothes was part of his fetish, just as people that have specific sexual fetishes dress up in outfits (Nazi, policeman, nurse, etc.) that they find stimulating.

[tapu]

Minor points, but...

A bandanna might have been removed from him by the time we see the custody walk, as a dangerous (to himself) item, like a belt. It might also have been entered into evidence by then. Can we tell in the airport photos if it's gone?

Regarding clothinng as evidence, though... he is still wearing the jacket in that custody walk.... So that would make it seem that his clothing was not blood-covered, or that they were about to strip him and put it into evidence.

Damn, we need some news. I think the top of my head is going to pop off if I keep mulling over all these same details!

[dangrsmind]

Minor points, but...

A bandanna might have been removed from him by the time we see the custody walk, as a dangerous (to himself) item, like a belt. It might also have been entered into evidence by then. Can we tell in the airport photos if it's gone?

Regarding clothinng as evidence, though... he is still wearing the jacket in that custody walk.... So that would make it seem that his clothing was not blood-covered, or that they were about to strip him and put it into evidence.

Damn, we need some news. I think the top of my head is going to pop off if I keep mulling over all these same details!

Well, they usually take your clothes when you are arrested even if the clothes aren't evidence. The bandanna could be anywhere. In the house, in the car, in his pocket, out on Poorhouse Road somewhere, in Kroger's trash, etc.

I am just suggesting that he probably wore it during the murders.

[peace_gurl]

He could have left one or two days before the father returned. Why didn't he try to leave? Why didn't he clean up or dispose of the bodies? Why was the house in such a condition that police officers that viewed it were shaken and it took days and a large dumpster to clean it up? He could have been long gone by the time the father showed up, but he wasn't. He was in the house waiting.

What I am saying is he created a fictional character that he imagined himself to be called Syko Sam. We all do this on the Internet...we create a persona and project it and we select an avatar to represent it. Syko Sam was Sam MCroskey's avatar. And in all of the pictures of Syko Sam which he created, he is wearing the black sweatshirt, WIR shirt, and a bandanna. The same outfit he was arrested in sans bandanna.

Then, possibly for the reasons you suggest, we may never know really, he acted out the role of his character in reality. Syko Sam was supposed to be a scary axe murderer, and Sam McCroskey became one.

As far as insanity...I don't think he is insane in the legal sense.
I really believe you are on the right track dangrsmind

[ziggy]

...i am trying to understand,do you think he is insane?.....because I don't think he is.I think the crime was emotionally motivated not to live out a sick fantasy because that would make him insane and then anything could be possible,he could have heard voices that made him do it....or do you think he consciously wanted to do this and planned it even before he went on that trip?....i just can't see that knowing what we know of sam.

Having a depraved heart can result in what happened here and that does not make a person insane. Living out a sick fantasy does not make one insane, believe it or not, but it does make one sick and depraved.

There are plenty of serial killers who did exactly this and were not legally insane.

What do you know of Sam that could lead you to conclude this? We all know very little about him really.

[boygenius]

Having a depraved heart can result in what happened here and that does not make a person insane. Living out a sick fantasy does not make one insane, believe it or not, but it does make one sick and depraved.

There are plenty of serial killers who did exactly this and were not legally insane.

What do you know of Sam that could lead you to conclude this? We all know very little about him really.

I think she relates to him; maybe not liked as a kid and misunderstood, but that's jmo. Sam was a weird kid that just went off.....I think his lifestyle, he and Emma "breaking up," and be very immature all lead to the deaths. As far as the rest, I don't think any of us have killed anyone, so it's really hard to say what we'd do afterwards. Not insane, just a sicko kid.

[Kano]

Every single picture i have seen of the guy he wears the same clothes... I think its just what he wore and that "character" a big part of him.. The same as you chose an avatar you can identify with.

[dangrsmind]

Every single picture i have seen of the guy he wears the same clothes... I think its just what he wore and that "character" a big part of him.. The same as you chose an avatar you can identify with.

A few pictures from before he created the Syko Sam character. He's wearing different clothes and the face isn't covered.

http://www4.pictures.zimbio.com/mp/ErSs7Yak-VGl.jpg
http://www1.pictures.zimbio.com/mp/wWxxAA3x7fRl.jpg
http://www2.pictures.zimbio.com/mp/y20W-BAzJJAl.jpg

[Kano]

A couple from before he created the Syko Sam character...

http://www4.pictures.zimbio.com/mp/ErSs7Yak-VGl.jpg
http://www1.pictures.zimbio.com/mp/wWxxAA3x7fRl.jpg
http://www2.pictures.zimbio.com/mp/y20W-BAzJJAl.jpg

So he took off his jacket? Wow.. And all head shots there... You have no idea what he has on or if they before the "syko sam character" do you? And i highly doubt he wore this mask everytime he attempted to rap..

[Kano]

http://c3.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/69/l_3100fcc2a1184d8fbfefdc25fe3f03a2.png
http://s2.buzzfeed.com/static/campaign_images/terminal01/2009/10/6/23/syko-sam-18761-1254887300-1.jpghttp://http://i35.tinypic.com/w1g3t5.jpgAlso i have seen him wear the same thing hanging with SKR as syko sam.. Beanie and all... Still seems to be psycho sam to me..

[maunsapt]

i just watched part of a video from the SKR. the images varied with demonic symbols, to graphic of real and fake gore. to watch those things day in and day out, and become-- or live like it -- no wonder a person might want to add to the enhancement or take away some of the gruesomeness by intaking drugs and/or alcohol. To be so brutal and uncaring in that sense of destruction has got to take a toll on a person. Some vulnerable people are or can be quite influenced by whatever they delve into. IMO...

[dangrsmind]

i just watched part of a video from the SKR. the images varied with demonic symbols, to graphic of real and fake gore. to watch those things day in and day out, and become-- or live like it -- no wonder a person might want to add to the enhancement or take away some of the gruesomeness by intaking drugs and/or alcohol. To be so brutal and uncaring in that sense of destruction has got to take a toll on a person. Some vulnerable people are or can be quite influenced by whatever they delve into. IMO...

Which video did you watch?

In terms of gore and violence, SKR's video stuff is pretty tame when compared to your average horror movie.

And as far as conveying an occult ritual in a video, IMO Kenneth Anger's Invocation of my Demon Brother (with a very strange Mick Jagger vocal track) is far more effective.

YouTube - Invocation Of My Demon Brother - Kenneth Anger - ft Rolling Stones

[wadahoot]

I'm guessing because he ran out of cash and the cost for a cab from Farmville to Richmond was probably more expensive than he realized. Just a guess.

Remember, he wasn't planning on taking a cab ... presumably, he was going to take the family's car and only had to change to the cab once he got the car stuck out on Poorhouse Road. Also, someone commented that he could have just gotten more money out for the plane ticket change charge and incur the over-draft penality. Not all banks let a person do that, especially if they are a new customer. So, perhaps he literally couldn't get more money out.

[wadahoot]

I know that Emma was an only child. Does anyone know if Mel had any siblings? I just wonder if being an only child had anything to do with Emma's parents' apparent willingness to indulge her in her horrorcore obsession. I'm not necessarily saying she was spoiled, although a lot of kids are these days and for that reason find it difficult to look beyond themselves and their own needs and wants, but perhaps being the sole recipient of what was probably a lot of attention by her parents made her more likely to push the envelope, so to speak. That said, I'm not saying ALL only children are overindulged, only that many are.

This goes back to the comments made by one of Mark's church members. Check out this post I made back on one of the earlier threads http://websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4260287&postcount=79

[dangrsmind]

Remember, he wasn't planning on taking a cab ... presumably, he was going to take the family's car and only had to change to the cab once he got the car stuck out on Poorhouse Road. Also, someone commented that he could have just gotten more money out for the plane ticket change charge and incur the over-draft penality. Not all banks let a person do that, especially if they are a new customer. So, perhaps he literally couldn't get more money out.

Take the car where, that's my question.

The thing is, once he had the car, he could have driven right to the airport and used the money he had in his account to change his flight. If he didn't have enough, he could have flown stand by. But this is not what he did.

Instead of trying to leave town he drove out to Poorhouse Road. Why? And it seems to me that he wasn't in any hurry to leave town until after the Poorhouse Road incident. Even then he stopped to have breakfast first.

[Heroine]

Take the car where, that's my question.

The thing is, once he had the car, he could have driven right to the airport and used the money he had in his account to change his flight. If he didn't have enough, he could have flown stand by. But this is not what he did.

Instead of trying to leave town he drove out to Poorhouse Road. Why? And it seems to me that he wasn't in any hurry to leave town until after the Poorhouse Road incident. Even then he stopped to have breakfast first.

I think he was trying to buy time and if he could have gotten the bodies out of the house he thought he would have even more time.
Maybe he was trying to get on LE good side because he thought that maybe he could make up a good lie and tell them they left and went out of town leaving him to tend to the house until they returned. Maybe that was the reason behind the phone call to the police? If there was noone else there (bodies) then they couldn't prove he was lying. I mean he only had what 2 more days to wait? Maybe he was going to tell them if they came back for mel again that emmas parents took her home?

[claudicici]

...yes ,boygenius you're pretty much right on,I can relate to Emma even more then Sam though,however the part of what we know of sam ,I was talking about how his sister and people that know him describe him,his lovey dovey photo bucket ,stuff like that...but I think I'm starting to understand what you are saying.
I know in an earlier thread you guys were discussing the other girl Sam was seen with at the concert and I think it was the "xxkinkysuicidexx" girl,is that correct?
Did you guys discuss the comment she left on his youtube channel? " )': i dont know what to think... i thought u loved her... u said u loved me 2.. u would of killed to too wouldent you?! you had the chance u had the oppertunitys Why them? i dont understand!? this isnt like u! " ....what did you all think about that? I'm trying to figure that one out...The "why them?" part really bothers me....as if she knew he was going to kill....just not someone she thought he loved.....